What's the problem Charles, these people sound like most of Europe and half of our society.

“They were not terrorists,” he said. “They were resistance fighters, defending themselves against the attacks of the U.S. troops.”

I feel some comfort in realizing that nut bags such as this, are not a completely American phenomenon.

This makes it sound more and more like the whole "kidnapping" was set up as a stunt to remove Japanese Troops from Iraq. No wonder the Japanese people weren't happy to see them...

I guess we'll never know how a real Japanese dies.

Oh jeez - Stockholm Syndrome LLL style!

Stockholm Syndrome? Or just derangement and displasia?

This should be filed in Wretchard's "Coincidences" post from a few weeks ago on the Belmont Club. This totally fits the pattern.

“They were not terrorists,” he said. “They were resistance fighters, defending themselves against the attacks of the U.S. troops.”

Oh that's cute.

Tokyo Syndrome?

Globular Custard = 10:07AM
RIP Ford = 10:07AM
FH = 10:07AM

Man, you have got to be quick, 'round here.

RIP Ford

How's your tooth?

#10 RIP Ford

You know what I say: There are only two types on the LGF board, the quick, and the dead...witted.

A ploy, a ploy, their kingdom for a ploy.

#10 RIP Ford: Total of six posts at 10:07, with two having practically the same response (ellen's and my own post).

It makes fights for hat tips seem trivial by comparison :)

They were never prisoners. They were always and remain collaborators.

An Israeli (Palestinian) Arab from east Jerusalem was also jeld captive for 18 days. He gave an interview to ynet.co.il (Hebrew) where he said (my translation):" The abduction changed my life. I was transferred from a quiet, serene and safe world to one of uncertainty, full of fear, unknown and tough world. I don't wish for any person in the world to go through what I went through."

He also said he was given two cups of dirty water a day to drink. Hadn't showered for 18 days and every day thought he was going to be executed.

Notice that living under zionist occupation is suddenly "quiet, serene and safe."

Darn those Japanese!
Guess I'll quit doing haiku
...wait a minute...d'oh!!

OT, but important:

memo on the decision indicates not only patriotism, but an honest perspective on why Koppel and ABC were so set on this presentation:

While Sinclair would support an honest effort to honor the memory of these brave soldiers, we do not believe that is what "Nightline" is doing. Rather, Mr. Koppel and "Nightline" are hiding behind this so-called tribute in an effort to highlight only one aspect of the war effort and in doing so to influence public opinion against the military action in Iraq.

I have written (in the absence of a better address) to the Investor Relations department to express my suppport for the move, and I strongly suggest that all readers here do the same:

Corporate Headquarters
Sinclair Broadcast Group, Inc.
10706 Beaver Dam Road
Hunt Valley, Maryland 21030
410-568-1500 (Main Telephone)
410-568-1533 (Main Fax)

Investor Relations Contact
Lucy A. Rutishauser
VP Corporate Finance and
Corporate Treasurer
investor@sbgi.net

We always complain that the media is engaged in a war against our efforts at home and abroad, and especially against President Bush. If we're to ever have a chance at turning the tide, we have to let broadcasters know that we support decisions such as these, and oppose the ones that lead to the broadcast of propaganda disguised as news.

I also went to the websites of the affiliate stations mentioned in the CNN article and forwarded a similar letter.

Please, ladies and gentlemen, do your part.

-BF

Weird, uber stockholm syndrome.
This raises the specter of westerners being taken captive on purpose to give the jihadis more leverage. Not a fun thing to think about.

Oh brother! I wish Arab terrorists took some of this eunuch medicine.

# RIP Ford -"nut bags such as this, are not a completely American phenomenon. "

LMAO!!!

but thanks for the reminder!!

#19 Josh

This might not be Stockhold syndrome. There were some rumors a while ago that the "hostages" might have arranged this to happen, so they could force the Japanese government to pull its troops out.

#11 andrew

I had the wisdom teeth pulled last night, I couldn't wait till Monday. I was not knocked out during the process, Argghhh. I'll survive. Thanks for asking.

As one of the "40 million" without insurance, they put me on a payment plan. It's not a bad system we have here.

#12 FH

And you guys can be proud of the fact that you are BOTH at once!

Now, a genuine question (don't strain yourselves):

Why do you so fervently believe that the people of Iraq cannot be freedom fighters?

Some possible answers gleaned from the writings of people on this site:

a) They are subhuman, thus cannot understand such a sophisticated concept,

b) We believe without question everything the current neocon government tells us, because they have been completely truthful up to this point (as opposed to the evil "liberals" who ran the government for the last 40 years),

c) They are Muslims, and all followers of Islam have been shown to be unscrupulous,

d) We believe that the common Iraqi in the street was directly responsible for 9/11,

e) We are sheep,

f) All of the above.

---

"We are all capable of believing things which we know to be untrue, and then, when we are finally proved wrong, impudently twisting the facts so as to show that we were right. Intellectually, it is possible to carry on this process for an indefinite time: the only check on it is that sooner or later a false belief bumps up against solid reality, usually on a battlefield."

George Orwell "In Front of Your Nose," 1946

#23 RIP Ford - You forgot the /sarcasm switch.

Just doing a little housekeeping, ya understand!!!

#24 DnaDan56

Not a very original post, but you did include all the typical "keywords" of most trolls. All in all, an average score of:

C+

Keep trying, I think you have potential.

#15   Stop Hillary

They were never prisoners. They were always and remain collaborators.

Not to be immodest or anything, but I along with a one-time LGF visitor called "A Japanese Reader" were the first people anywhere to declare this kidnapping a hoax. (I don't have time to find the orginal two threads with our comments on LGF). I knew from the get-go that the whole thing was a fraud, and that they were pretending and acting on the video (as they admit in this interview). Word on the "Japanese street" has always been that this abduction was phony, phony, phony, ever since it was reveled that the three victims had protested against the Iraq war, and then purposely went to Iraq as human shields. That, along with Miss Takato's infamous blog posting about "a big secret plan" she and the others had concocted while in Amman, Jordan, pretty much put the icing on the cake. And now this press conference.

What a sham.

"We are all capable of believing things which we know to be untrue, and then, when we are finally proved wrong, impudently twisting the facts so as to show that we were right. Intellectually, it is possible to carry on this process for an indefinite time: the only check on it is that sooner or later a false belief bumps up against solid reality, usually on a battlefield."

But isnt that the LLL daily mantra?
"impudently twisting the facts so as to show that we were right"
How ironical.

#25 realwest

You forgot the /sarcasm switch

I'm confused. How so? :P

The japaneese were not happy and billed them 20k for airfare.

They also had to see a shrink because everyone in japan hated them so much that they may off themselves..

What a bunch of turds.

#24

The answer to your question is simple.

They are not freedom fighters because they are not fighting for freedom.

The burden of proof is on you. Prove to me how kidnapping civilians is "freedom fighting"

These Japanese were not hostages but collaborators in a farce that was designed to confirm that the press is easily enlisted as unwhitting co-collaberators with the with the common sense of a skate board groupie.

#27 zombie - I think you meant what a "shame".

If I'm wrong, then add my comment to the others.

24

++ungood for you. We are all suppressed by ingsoc and can not think for ourselves here.

Thanks for the eye opening post, I'll go blow up a starbucks now.

I love dumbfucks who quote orwell. Wonder what his take on the [bigoted word]s would be, he really loved the communists...

Seriously, it's all right here:

[Link: belmontclub.blogspot.com...]

Why do you so fervently believe that the people of Iraq cannot be freedom fighters?

Because only a fucking idiot (perhaps like yourself) would believe that an Islamic theocracy, an Arab nationalist dictatorship or a Middle East style civil war is freedom. And if you had the decency to listen to what the Iraqi terrorists are saying, you'd know that's their goal.

So why don't you listen to the Iraqi terrorists?

a) Their statements don't fit your world view

b) They don't know what they want, but you do

c) They are subhuman, and thus not worth listening to

#31 amir

And many are from Syria and Iran. If people from a neighboring country spill across borders to wreck havoc, who's 'freedom' are they 'fighting' for??

#34 Realwest

Actually, I did mean "sham," but it's a "shame" too. But "sham" is more accurate.

DnaDan56

Why do you so fervently believe that the people of Iraq cannot be freedom fighters?

Why must you start with a strawman and work your way down through a list of cliched strawfolk?

#24 Dan

Why do you so fervently believe that the people of Iraq cannot be freedom fighters?

Because they are not fighting for freedom, they are fighting for revenge, or because they can't stand non-Muslims, or a combination of the two. Some of these "freedom fighters" are foreign agents (Iranians, Palestinians, Hezbollah from Lebanon). Most Iraqis have never experienced a day of real freedom in their lives.

p.s. Orwell was speaking about the Left.

#39 Beagle

I was about to post exactly that, but then decided not to respond to the troll. Right you are.

#29 RIP Ford - "As one of the "40 million" without insurance, they put me on a payment plan. It's not a bad system we have here. "

Sorry - thought you were being sarcastic. Oh what the heck!!.

Somehow or other I think we could have a better system.

DON'T expect me to have an answer! I'm much better at questions than answers!!!

#39 Beagle

Why must you start with a strawman and work your way down through a list of cliched strawfolk

LOL

#24,

We are all capable of believing things which we know to be untrue

Like the West can appease and aplogize for Islamic terrorists and they will eventually leave us alone

and then, when we are finally proved wrong,

North Korea broke their nuclear arms agreement, Gadafi ended up having more WMD than we thought, bin Laden will never back down, non-stop terrorism since Carter's administration, etc. etc.

impudently twisting the facts so as to show that we were right.

It's because of the root causes! These people are poor and oppressed and that's why they hate us!! It's our fault!

Intellectually, it is possible to carry on this process for an indefinite time: the only check on it is that sooner or later a false belief bumps up against solid reality, usually on a battlefield."

Like September 11, 2001.

Good points, but you're on the wrong side.

#42 realwest

No worries, I'm not about to open that can of worms. And yes, it could be better. But, I've seen the alternatives, hell, I've worked for the alternative in England. And boy, was I glad to be here last night.

Can anyone say...Patty Hearst?

Why do you so fervently believe that the people of Iraq cannot be freedom fighters?

I don't know who this question is referred to, but it is obvious that Iraqis can and are freedom fighters. Thousands of Iraqis are fighting side by side with American soldiers and the other coalition members for their freedom.

When the Soviet/Afghan war was done, did the 'freedom fighters' all shout "Hurrah! Jihad is over!" and go back to Saudi, Egypt, etc? No. They stayed and started killing Afghans who disagreed with them. THAT sounds like 'occupation' to me...

BTW when we liberated Kabul, the local populace was so 'grateful' for their foreign arab 'freedom fighters' that they began killing them en masse.

What these morons were trying to accomplish:
Japanese troops out of Iraq.
Lots of press for themselves where they could spout and wax political.

What these morons did accomplish:
Japanese troops are staying.
Lots of bad press and millions of their countymen who despise them and their whiny families.
A huuuge bill for the ignominious trip home.

Nelson says..."Haahhh haaahhh."

Weren't the Japanese "hostages" working for some kind of NGO's in Iraq? These self-righteous "do-gooding" NGO's are more dangerous than we often consider.

DnaDan 56 - Yeah Dan, if only the world were ruled by those brave "freedom fighters" instead of us warmongering neocon nitwits.

#45 RIP Ford -"And boy, was I glad to be here last night"

Me too!!!

I mean, glad you were out here, too!!!

shucks!

I wonder if they would be held accountable to the millions the Japanese gov't paid in kickback to get these fools back.

And no, this is no Stockholm syndrom.
They were missing a few marbles before they were kidnapped.

#42 realwest
Somehow or other I think we could have a better system.

Well we all know the healthcare system is not perfect. It is the VERY BEST in the world though, so until you come up with a better system, we are sticking with the one we got. Oh and by the way, Canada's healthcare system would not function without ours so don't even go there.

Excellent. More unbiased objectivity from the media.

What would the "freedom fighters" have had to do to earn condemnation? Slit a few throats? Boil somebody in hummus?

Textbook cases of "Stockholm syndrome" here. Or maybe it's just good old media "Shithead syndrome".

"Why do you so fervently believe that the people of Iraq cannot be freedom fighters?"

I believe the number of Iraqi troops who did not run when confronted by islamists was around 30%.

So my answer is, 30% of those Iraqis fighting in Iraq are "freedom fighters"

The answer you want / what you believe: is that only Iraqis who fight against the coalition troops are freedom fighters. This indicates that you are on the side of those who wish no freedom for Iraqis. So, dickwhistle, take your piss stained panties and spit stained bandana and go break a window somewhere, m'kay?

Haha, this 18 year Imai kid is such a fucking liar. He just graduated high school and he was going to Iraq as a "depleted uranium expert".

Imai left the news conference early because of stress, according to his legal representative.

Wah wah. He needs level III of the Stalinism training.

Imai said the abductors told them to act afraid and to cry during the taping, but added that they were rough with them while the cameras were on "and so it was really frightening."

Sounds like a Level II Stalinism Training response.

This little dipshit sounds like he was groomed and molded by the Japanese Workers World Party. No wonder the Japanese government says they're full of shit.

I'm not sure what to think, but I'm guessing Pokemon was involved.

#59 SoCalJustice

LOL

#59 SCJ

lol

Gotta catch 'em all!

#54 Outsider

The Japanese government issued all three captives an invoice for $7000 each. It was issued because the government warned all citizens from traveling to Iraq and these "investigative journalists" went anyway at their own risk. The ordeal likely cost the government way more than $21,000 though.

52 killthemall - you are SOOO wrong I can't begin to tell you. I haven't the time (or for that matter, the inclination) to try to tell you.

FOAD.

#36 Colt
LMAO-- Perfect Response! I need to write that down for the next time I encounter one of these twits.

Japanese "hostages" my ass. These nitwits where a Japan based Iraq assigned unit of the ISM.

Any Cat dozers in Iraq ? Hmmm...

#64 realwest

I'm hoping Chaarles will catch that hideous horseshit and delete it soon. Well cool, I just checked and its already gone.

All Hail the Lizard King !!!

(#64) realwest

When I read your post quickly, I thought you were talking to someone named "Kill The Mall" - but I saw that comment was deleted so I figured it was named something else.

(#60) Rip Ford / (#61) andrew

After a cursory reading of the article, I ruled out any Godzilla involvement. Not enough destruction.

I briefly pondered Karaoke as a factor. These guys have their video equipment, so they could have had a karaoke machine. But since karaoke generally leads to hate, not love, I ruled it out too.

So, after process of elimination, that leaves just Pokemon.

amir said

It is obvious that Iraqis can and are freedom fighters. Thousands of Iraqis are fighting side by side with American soldiers and the other coalition members for their freedom.

I would add that there are also vast numbers of Iraqis who are "fighting" for their freedom by just living their lives, going to work and school, and generally getting on with the process of being free.

#55 Giya -"until you come up with a better system"

Me? Personally? Geez. Ok, I'll work on it (but please, puhleeze) don't hold your breath, kay?)

#18

Yssterday I emailed Nightline and suggested that another group of individuals who in Leroy Sievers' (Nightline executive producer) words "paid the ultimate price" were the Iraqis murdered and buried in the many mass graves or those Iraqis who starved to dealth during the UN's humanitarian program Oil for Food and that perhaps Nightline would like to honor them too.

I will write to Sinclair today.

Charles, I find it adds greatly to my lgf experience if I can listen to the same thing you are playing, but you are flipping those platters far too speedily for me-- whass up? Do you also have a thousand ears to go with your thousand eyes?

#68 SCJ

Didn't you miss out Toyotas and sushi?

Got to love the importance of honor among the arabs

A father killed his 14 year old daughter who had been raped over a period of 6 days.

"I decided to kill her because our honor was dirtied," the newspaper Sabah quoted the father as saying. "I didn't listen to her pleas, I wrapped the wire around her neck and pulled at it until she died."

Honor is more important than love

#68 SoCalJustice

LOL

Thanks for the explanation.

(#73) Colt

In my haste, I may have overlooked some potential suspects.

I'm open to that possibility.

#66 justdanny -I've had some, um, problems with my ISP (Earthlink. aka thoe MF sonsabitches)but have also received a number of really thoughtful
comments from folks out here, asking about you.
PLEASE send me your e-mail addy. I'd like to "chat" with you, but also feel some responsility to pass those e-mails along.
And NO I don't mind all of the "hate" e-mails I've recevied since "joining" LGF.

Wow these fellows don't sound like "captors" at all! Why, they sound like they are just perfect gentlemen!

My dear gents, here's hoping you die a violent screaming death in a hail of machine gun fire!!

Love always,
JustTheFacts

twisterella wrote:

Charles, I find it adds greatly to my lgf experience if I can listen to the same thing you are playing, but you are flipping those platters far too speedily for me-- whass up? Do you also have a thousand ears to go with your thousand eyes?

I'm checking out the new iTunes "Party Shuffle" feature. Heh. Shuffles up your whole library and plays random selections.

“When they realized we weren’t spies, their attitude toward us changed,” Imai said. “A man who called himself `General’ said he was sorry many times.”

Wasn't it about 2 weeks ago or so (no time to search right now) when those two separate 'journalists' were abducted and taken to the mosque in Najaf? They both reported that they were threatened and were in fear of thier lives until thier abductors 'realized' they were not spies at all. At that point the apologies flowed and they assured that they were safe and would be released.

Of course they were also fed a major line of bullshit propaganda by the jihadis.

Looks like a pattern of good terrorist/bad terrorist to me. Scumbags.

Is Ed Moran in 'da house?
I'm in Dallas and "they" say we're in for stormy weather but I never believe "them".
Gotta take my Scout troop out to Texas Ranger's Boy Scout Night for a 7:05 game tommorow, and hope we don't get a rainout.

#68 SCJ

Have you considered Yu-Gi-Oh! ?

#81 sefton

Is Ed Moran in 'da house?

Ed's weather reports are in a couple of the previous threads.

Now, a genuine question (don't strain yourselves):

Why do you so fervently believe that the people of Iraq cannot be freedom fighters?

The belief, in my case at least, is not that they cannot be freedom fighters as much as it is simply that they are not freedom fighters; they're thugs, warlord-wannabes who see the power vacuum left by Saddam and want to be the ones to fill it. Freedom doesn't enter into the equation; if they were successful in driving out the U.S., Iraq would become just as "free" as it was before the U.S. got rid of Saddam.

Some possible answers gleaned from the writings of people on this site:

a) They are subhuman, thus cannot understand such a sophisticated concept,

There have been a few "Arabs can't handle democracy" comments, but a large percentage of them have been from leftists protesting the U.S. "forcing its ideals on people." Hmmm...

b) We believe without question everything the current neocon government tells us, because they have been completely truthful up to this point (as opposed to the evil "liberals" who ran the government for the last 40 years),

Reagan was a liberal? Now there's a shocker!

c) They are Muslims, and all followers of Islam have been shown to be unscrupulous,

Islam promotes unscrupulousness when dealing with kufr, straight out of the Koran. This doesn't have anything to do with your "freedom fighters" argument, however.

d) We believe that the common Iraqi in the street was directly responsible for 9/11,

e) We are sheep,

And I doubt you gleaned either of these options from this site. Tsk tsk, Dan.

Two words: Suicide Club

#24 DnaDan56

Why do you so fervently believe that the people of Iraq cannot be freedom fighters?

Ain't you a tolerant one? Well, lets look at your oh-so-tolerant-because-I'm-better-than-you "answers".

a) They are subhuman, thus cannot understand such a sophisticated concept,
If the average Iraqi were subhuman, and IF (big if there, bucko) we believed that, why would we bother in the first place, nu?

b) We believe without question everything the current neocon government tells us, because they have been completely truthful up to this point (as opposed to the evil "liberals" who ran the government for the last 40 years),
Sorry, but your use of "neocon" (while I tend to like the term) just runs through the Internet screaming "I'm an intolerant bigoted bastard and hate jooos! Especially those jooos that dare to not tow the DNC line." Whether or not you meant that, that is how it comes across, O Font of All Tolerance. I'll even go out on a limb here (metaphorically speaking) - Liberals are alright, it's leftists that are the problem. Nuanced enough for you?

c) They are Muslims, and all followers of Islam have been shown to be unscrupulous,
Unscrupulous, perhaps not, but I'm waiting for the (mythical) Moderate Muslim who decries all terrorism, not just infidel acts or terrorism agains Dar al'Islam.

d) We believe that the common Iraqi in the street was directly responsible for 9/11,
The common Iraqi? No, but the leadership, yes. Now, before you get your knickers in a knot over the "Where is the Al-Quaeda/Iraq link," which I know you are wont to do, the Iraqi government, in the Personage of Saddam Hussein was paying palisplodes to kill kids. If killing kids is bad - and it is - then why isn't it bad when the kids are Jewish, hmmm?

e) We are sheep,
No, he was shorn on this thread here.

f) All of the above.
Again, I ask: "You're a tolerant one, aren't you?"

Lysander

Where's Ed?

Magnitude 3.3

You didn't warn me!

“They were not terrorists,” he said. “They were resistance fighters, defending themselves against the attacks of the U.S. troops.”

Are you sure these Japanese hostages weren't Canadians (employed by the CBC)?

"It is again time for the rising sun to ship tall in the sky! One Japan! One society!"

/southpark

To : Delusional Moron Japanese Ex-Prisoners
Fr : JustTheFacts
Sj : Reality

cc : Gullible Terror-sympathizing Leftist News Reporters

THE ONLY GOOD TERRORIST SAVAGE IS A DEAD TERRORIST SAVAGE.

Yours truly,
JustTheFacts

#89 D-Berg

How did the 'Palestine' presentation from the P.O.V. of Jewish Hebron residents go?

Did they sing Kumbaya together? Pick daisies? Burn U.S. flags? Sounds like there was intercourse involved.

No wonder Japan is disgusted with these pigs.

And to think, I prayed for them.

Come to think of it, prayer is probably what saved them then, and it sounds like it's the only thing that will save them now.

I nominate these three for the Rachel Corrie/Aunt Jemima "Line Of Fire" Award.

#83 mickthemick
Thanks , I just saw that myself.
He gives more detail than the local weather yahoos.
Ain't the internet cool?

#87 zulubaby
He does earthquake prediction too?
Damn, he is good!

OT

Christopher Hutchins write about the "impossibility" of links between Al-Qaida and Saddam

Covering the "Quagmire" Are war correspondents betting on failure in Iraq?

Related:

Aging Viet Commie Crows About Iraq

Another member of the International John Kerry Fan Club.

sefton (#94)

He does earthquake prediction too?

I don't know if he does but he should!

#68 SoCalJustice 4/30/2004 11:08AM PST

(#64) realwest

Aw. SCJ, ya beat me to it--I *so* wanted to ask why somebody wants to slay malls! (That's okay, I'll survive--may not even get a syndrome over it! ;^D )

(#60) Rip Ford / (#61) andrew

So, after process of elimination, that leaves just Pokemon.

But what about *ANIME*???

*Think* of it! All those bug-eyed, poorly animated cartoon cyborgs--and that's the *human* characters. It's enough to drive someone mad, Mad, MAD!!! Bwah-ha-ha-ha-ha! {choke, gasp}

And corny, too...

the problem with these japo-punks is that the only [bigoted word]s in tokyo are the iranian drug dealers who hang out at uneo park--so they think islam is kewl--remember the red army types that did a massacre at lod airport in israel--these sushiheads are their spiritual children-- a three-way seppuku [hara-kiri] would be way appropriate here

OT: Call to prayer approved in Michigan.

#100 WriterMom

I'd be getting on a recall effort for those council members. Everyone should honk horns during prayer times. Turn up the boom boxes etc.

The entire Japanese psyche is way different from ours. There were articles right after the hostages were released and returned home about how the Japanese treated them like pariahs and made them feel more besieged than the terrorists had.

In fact, apparently, the Japanese government was going to charge the hostages the equivalent of $6000 each for their return flights and there was talk of making them contribute to the ransom that was paid for their release.

The idea is that the government had told people not to go to Iraq, these individuals chose to---one a young woman doing work with street kids, one a young journalist/photographer interested in plutonium, and the other I forget. So they are seen as acting on their own for their own interests, and---this is the big part---acting AGAINST the good of Japanese society. Causing trouble for Japanese society for their own "selfish" purposes.

It is no wonder that they would be toeing the "party" line at this point. They need to rehabilitate themselves into their culture.

Just remember that these are the same hostages that were compelled to apologize on national tv once they got home because the Japanese people were so pissed off at them. Their reception back home was NOT good. Hopefully, they're now twice as pissed off.

classic Stockholm syndrome IMHO

#96

Giap thanks Americans who opposed the war, because without them he was losing the war hands down.

I am myself of Japanese descent, and I am a student of that unique culture. Before I disparage it, I want to point out that Japanese culture and the Japanese who live it are a wonderful asset to global civilization.

However, Japanese society (unfortunately, there is some truth in stereotypes) imposes a broad conformity on its members. This trains a person well for existing in society, and poorly for living in it. All too often, being Japanese means finding the right master to be a slave to.

When I heard about this story, it was only too true to me. When faced with other people with a real, if warped, belief system, these people buckled. They didn't examine it critically, reject the violence out of hand. They just went along with their captors.

This was often noted during World War II. The same psycho robots who conducted the Nanking massacre and threw planes into American carriers, would often in captivity turn towards the side of their captors. Japanese soldiers in gulags would mouth praises to Stalin, or if captured by our marines, lead them to their former side's artillery and troop positions. Just recently, we had the Aum Shinrikyo situation, to date (thank god) the only instance of WMD used in a terror attack.

What I'd like to lead to is that those who say Western civilization is no different from say, Islamic or other non-Western civilization are dead wrong. There is a person in the West who doesn't exist elsewhere or exists poorly-the individual. The person capable of forming their own moral code, choosing their path through this mortal coil and deciding their own actions and beliefs. That person will ultimately win the terror war.

Hey, I guess they really are 'freedom fighters'. They are fighting AGAINST freedom.

#106 Sanchopanza

Thanks for saying that. I cherish my individuality.

#101 Postal Worker

Everyone should honk horns during prayer times. Turn up the boom boxes etc.

That would be seen as harrassment and undermine any effort to overturn the ordinance variance. The Hamtramck citizens (rightly) objecting to this favortism toward one religion have to be very circumspect and channel their efforts in a strictly unbiased legal way. Otherwise, THEY will be seen as the trouble makers trying to impose their "bigoted" views on a religious minority that has won a concession through legitimate means.

It's a crock of sh*t, but that's the way it works.

More evidence that Hello Kitty is about mind control and should be destroyed! Godzilla! UltraMan! Where are you?

To RepJ:

On Individuality.

I don't know what I did to deserve it, but thank god I'm
in a country that fosters it.

To 110:

Could they take out Pokemon too, while they're at it?

#74 Kelly,

Honor killings, particularly in those cases where the vicitm was raped, really chap my hide. From my point of view, shooting the monster that did that to my daughter would be a much better way of preserving the family honor. An extreme example is in the Old Testament, where the sons of Jacob level the whole town of Shechem because the prince of Shechem had raped their sister Dinah. Of course, he did marry her immediately after, oops. I guess Islamists would have rather killed Dinah, and let the prince of Shechem go on raping his brides before marrying them.

Yep. Just as originally predicted here at LGF, then followed up with an ill-advised bet I placed with my Japanese wife (which I LOST - thanks to the fake "hostages"), it has been concluded that the hostages were in on their own abduction.

And all of this has led to President Bush imposing strict tariffs on Japanese idiotarian imports.

As I'm sure has been mentioned here, the Japanese people as a whole don't like being jerked around by members of the Marxist-Islamist alliance, and the "hostages" were not well received. The Japanese government fined each of them for not leaving Iraq when they were told to, and the Japanese public thinks these people are garbage.

All of this is (predictably) being portrayed by the Marxist American media as the Japanese public being "hateful" and showing "hate" towards the hostages.

Now I have to go without beer because of these 'tards. That's what you get when you don't read LGF on a regular basis. If I would have seen the original post from Japanese Reader, I would never have made that bet.

:P

#109

I honk my horn at prayer time. It's my religion ...

Sanchopanza (#106)

It's funny you mentioned Aum Shinrikyo. When I saw the hostages and heard of their left-leaning lemming minds, I immediately thought that if they weren't in Iraq aiding the enemy, they would have probably been in Tokyo, setting off sarin gas in the subway to please old Shoko Asahara.

This just proves that there are idiots and traitors in every country (and living in the Pacific NW, I've seen far worse than these three).

THIS SHOULD HELP CLEAR UP THE SITUATION AS WELL IN JAPAn -

Freed From Captivity in Iraq, Japanese Return to More Pain
April 23
New York Times

April 22 — The young Japanese civilians taken hostage in Iraq returned home this week, not to the warmth of a yellow-ribbon embrace but to a disapproving nation's cold stare.

Three of them, including a woman who helped street children on the streets of Baghdad, appeared on television two weeks ago as their knife-brandishing kidnappers threatened to slit their throats. A few days after their release, they landed here on Sunday, in the eye of a peculiarly Japanese storm.

"You got what you deserve!" read one hand-written sign at the airport where they landed. "You are Japan's shame," another wrote on the Web site of one of the former hostages. They had "caused trouble" for everybody. The government, not to be outdone, announced it would bill the former hostages $6,000 for air fare.

Beneath the surface of Japan's ultra-sophisticated cities lie the hierarchical ties that have governed this island nation for centuries and that, at moments of crises, invariably reassert themselves. The former hostages' transgression was to ignore a government advisory against traveling to Iraq. But their sin, in a vertical society that likes to think of itself as classless, was to defy what people call here "okami," or, literally, "what is higher."

YOU BUY THAT? as much as the socialist/pacifist anti US pro UN atmosphere?

Treated like criminals, the three former hostages have gone into hiding, effectively becoming prisoners inside their own homes. The kidnapped woman, Nahoko Takato, was last seen arriving at her parents' house, looking defeated and dazed from tranquilizers, flanked by relatives who helped her walk and bow deeply before reporters, as a final apology to the nation.

Dr. Satoru Saito, a psychiatrist who examined the three former hostages twice since their return, said the stress they were enduring now was "much heavier" than what they experienced during their captivity in Iraq. Asked to name their three most stressful moments, the former hostages told him, in ascending order: the moment when they were kidnapped on their way to Baghdad, the knife-wielding incident, and the moment they watched a television show the morning after their return here and realized Japan's anger with them.

"Let's say the knife incident, which lasted about 10 minutes, ranks 10 on a stress level," Dr. Saito said in an interview at his clinic on Thursday. "After they came back to Japan and saw the morning news show, their stress level ranked 12."

To the angry Japanese, the first three hostages — Nahoko Takato, 34, who started a nonprofit organization to help Iraqi street children; Soichiro Koriyama, 32, a freelance photographer; and Noriaki Imai, 18, a freelance writer interested in the issue of depleted uranium munitions — had acted selfishly. Two others kidnapped and released in a separate incident — Junpei Yasuda, 30, a freelance journalist, and Nobutaka Watanabe, 36, a member of an anti-war group — were equally guilty.

Pursuing individual goals by defying the government and causing trouble for Japan was simply unforgivable. But the freed hostages did get official praise from one government: the United States.

"Well, everybody should understand the risk they are taking by going into dangerous areas," said Secretary of State Colin L. Powell. "But if nobody was willing to take a risk, then we would never move forward. We would never move our world forward.

What my gut tells me:

From the Japanese perspective, when Mom tells you not to do something because it's abunai (risky/dangerous/likely to lead to trouble) and despite this you do it anyway, then you are a bad child.

The kids embarrased Mom, and now everyone is upset with them.

d) We believe that the common Iraqi in the street was directly responsible for 9/11,

e) We are sheep,

And I doubt you gleaned either of these options from this site. Tsk tsk, Dan.

Doubt all you want, they are taken directly from this site.

Good for the Japanese.

#119 DnaDan56

Where?

#115 Postal Worker

I honk my horn at prayer time. It's my religion

:-)

Actually, there's a Superme Court case that says that the government cannot discriminate against any religious belief, even if it is held by only one person without any community of co-believers.

That's really too bad. I remember noticing that a number of the early pictures out of Iraq were attributed to Koriyama. Although I consider myself 100% American, and don't really give a crap for my Japanese heritage, I admit that I felt the slightest twinge of pride that a Japanese photographer had the stones to get right in the middle of all that action.

I can't help but feel that his welcome in Japan was shameful. The fact is that he traveled to Iraq and managed to take some of the most poignant pictures of the war. To treat him as anything less than a hero in the absence of any evidence that his kidnapping was a hoax is truly despicable.

If he was involved in an abduction scam, then that shame is his to share in as well, but that doesn't excuse the cold reception he received upon returning home.

#119 DnaDan56

d) We believe that the common Iraqi in the street was directly responsible for 9/11,

e) We are sheep,

And I doubt you gleaned either of these options from this site. Tsk tsk, Dan.

Doubt all you want, they are taken directly from this site.

Taken, yes, from your own post, Dhimmi. Or did you think it wouldn't be noticed?

So, O Tolerant and All-Knowing One, since you must have missed it earlier, will you deign to add anything new to the debate, or should we consider you to simply repeat various untruths about how the Jews, er, neoCons rule this country, and that Haliburton is at the root of everything?

You have made assertions. Now back them up. Should you chose to not to, then your inaction proves your fallacy. Time to perform, Dhimmi.

Lysander

I wouldn't say that anime's a bad influence on most Japanese minds, but then I'm biased--I think anime can be entertaining. [Then again, I like animation in general.]

Having said that, I think our "hostages" have been watching too much AU Gundam. If they'd watched UC Gundam(helmed by Yoshiyuki "Kill 'Em All" Tomino), they'd have avoided angering the folks at home.

Honestly, what part of "war is hell" don't they understand?

762,650=Y=? (my effort at the yen symbol) Wowsers.

#119, DnaDan:

Doubt all you want, they are taken directly from this site.

Interpretive dance doesn't count as proof, DD. Come back when you're ready to deal in cold, hard facts.

Until then, GAZE.

-dg

Patty Hearst was a good example of the Stockholm Syndrome. She was raped, kept in a closet, then joined the SLA in robbing a bank. I can understand reactions like the Japanese- except for calling the terrorists the "resistance." That might have been pre-captivity lunacy.

Stockholm syndrom could be rationalized after months of isolation and confinement. These geeks were held less than a week. It shows some real flaws in the Japanese psyche, which I'll add is a lot better than it was in 1945. Worship of power and authority. They were ostracized by their own people for disobeying the government so they loss their sense of any moral bearing.

to #24 DnaDan56
I agree with you, some of us have a hard time imagining that our foes could have honest nationalistic sentiments. A lot of Viet Cong had honest nationalistic sentiments, as well as kamikaze pilots of the Japanese Air Force and the armored columns of the Inmun Gun in 1950. They had tons of honest nationalistic sentiment. But they were still wrong and our enemies. What has Arab and Iraqi nationalism brought the average Joe Camel in the Arab streets?: oppression, poverty, backwardness, religious intolerance, strife, while nurtured on a steady diet of Jew and American hatred and foreign aid. They might be sincere and authentic but they will create the same old fascism!