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Palestinian Child Abuse

Thu, Sep 9, 2004 at 8:45:38 am PDT

Fun for the whole family! And educational too!

A Palestinian militant of Hamas wires a makeshift explosive device as children stand near him, in a narrow alleyway of the refugee camp of Jebaliya, outside Gaza City, Thursday Sept. 9, 2004. (AP Photo/Hatem Moussa)

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103 comments

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1 Zakistan  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 6:49:02am

"Now we're going to do some arts and crafts children. Watch what I do and pay attention!"

2 Praxeus  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 6:50:15am

Typical palistenian bravado............hiding behind children............ hafta use this on him I suppose.

3 Thom  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 6:50:33am

A responsible terrorist would shoo the children away given how often these dopes manage to detonate "prematurely" ...

4 Zakistan  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 6:50:41am

The "Noble Savage" at work. Rachel Corrie's dream man.

Well, savage, but certainly not noble.

5 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 6:50:46am

And if the bomb went off and killed the "militant," along with the children? We'd never hear the end of it...

"The dirty, filthy Joooooz did it! They remotely detonated that bomb, killing this brave martyr and these innocent children in broad daylight!"

6 Jax  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 6:51:21am

Is it superfluous to mention that if the Isrealis had blown up this terrorist with a hellfire, then they would have been universally condemned as baby killers?

Who needs kevlar when children are so plentiful?

7 Zakistan  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 6:53:07am

# 5: And if the bomb went off and killed the "militant," along with the children? We'd never hear the end of it...

They'd no doubt be included in the Palestinian death count, which is always bandied about in order to show how "brutal" Israel is.

8 davic  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 6:54:47am

c'mon, don't you always let your children play near terrorists planting bombs.

The big question is where are the parents, these are toddlers. Do the parents say: "Shoo, stop watching TV and go outside; its a beautiful day, and look our local Hamas boys are planting some bombs, why dont you go outside and watch them and tell me what you see."

Yep, a different world. I used to think that the parents that let their kids spend the night with Michael Jackson are the lowest, now I must rethink that.

9 PDM  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:04:21am

This is why Israel will win this war.
The "Palestinians" are determined to create losers.
The kid on the steps is probably only about 3 years old.
It's sad to see young lives ruined before they even begin.

10 Geepers  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:07:06am

Charles,

Is LGF getting a denial of service attack?

I watched the online now counter jump from 1200 to 1800 to 2300 to 2800 to 3800 in just a few minutes.

11 V the K  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:07:09am

1. "Okay, the next one of you rug monkeys to say 'Be vewy vewy quiet, I'm hunting wabbits' is gonna get camel-whipped."

2. "Would you brats just leave me alone for two minutes so I can take a crap in this alley?"

3. Once again, jungle camouflage worn in a place where there isn't a stinkin' tree for 400 miles. Guys, if you're going to hide among children, why don't you just wear Sesame Street pajamas? You'll blend in much better.

4. Little Rahim's last words were, "Is it true you were masks because you're all a bunch of ugly, candy-assed mother_f**kers?"

5. "You children should not be here! You should be at home raping your sisters!"

6. "I enjoy squatting on so many levels," Ahmed gushed.

7. The paradigm of the Palestinian experience: Endangering children with explosives while squatting on land they do not own.

8. "Why am I squatting in a zionist alleyway? Two words kids: Lactose. Intolerant."

9. Two photos in as many days with openings for a 'Mapplethorpe' reference. My cup runneth over.

10. "Do you really think the Zionist Roadrunner will eat your gunpowder matzahs, Mr. Coyote?"

12 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:08:49am
13 Victoria (VA girl)  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:10:21am
makeshift explosive

What the heck is a "makeshift explosive"? How does the photographer know it's fake?

14 tonecluster  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:15:09am

So, what we have here is a documented violation of the Geneva Convention.

Ah, but of course Hamas et. al. are not signatories to said convention. So the UN is under no obligation to scream, cry, stomp and shout... I guess it isn't immoral if you didn't sign.

15 Smitty  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:15:46am

Another excellent candid look into Palestinian life provided by AP Photographer Mr. "Hatem" Moussa.

16 rockman  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:15:56am

When I was a kid my role models and heroes included Mickey Mantle, Neil Armstrong, JFK, my Dad, and other good men. I turned out OK. These kids look up to filthy murderous anti-semitic extremists and they don't have a chance in hell of becoming anything else. Depressing....

17 Smitty  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:18:28am

#13 Victoria

I don't think the implication is that the device is fake. It's likely very real. An IED. Improvised explosive device.

18 Son of a Pig and a Monkey  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:21:55am

O/T at Al reuters

"The U.S. President makes a respectable first appearance in one of the world's most famous reference books with his notorious "Axis of Evil" speech about Iran, Iraq (news - web sites) and North Korea (news - web sites). Bush, long renowned for his malapropisms, has in the past offered such gems as misunderestimate, embetter and resignate."


Notorious, indeed.

19 Mentat  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:23:33am

One of the simplest ways of coping (not a solution) with the Islamic threat is to stop importing fossil fuels from any Islamic country. The current Jihad is solely the result of oil money. If Saudi Arabia did not have oil, it would look exactly like Afghanistan. Once the oil money stops flowing, a few simple follow up procedures would be necessary but they would not be so hard. We would have to ban immigration from all Muslim countries and regulate and police the heck out of the Muslims that are still here. Then the Muslims would be stuck in their hellholes, with no chance of getting out and no money to buy arms and equipment or fund mosques and madrassas all over the world. The current Jihad would quickly fade away.

And for the many on this thread who would immediately say, well, that is impossible, there is no fuel that is economically viable at this time for us turn to. Well, that is a mistaken view. The whole western world could immediately, I would say within the space of 15 years if sufficient effort and money were devoted to the issue (a kind of Manhattan project), move to fueling all our vehicles with ethanol, the kind of alcohol that you can drink, which is easily fermented from corn and other crops. The only downside with ethanol is that it has less energy per litre than gasoline so you would have to refuel more often. Linky.

[Link: www.greenfuels.org...]

At the same time, we should move to fund research projects which will bioengineer organisms to produce hydrogen or methanol or the ultimate for me, which would be artificial photosynthesis.

Why haven't we moved to alternative fuels? One reason is that there is an unholy cabal between the big oil companies and the Muslim oil producing nations. If you don't believe me, look at some of the sponsors of the 13th annual Arab/US Policymakers Conference, Aramco, Shell, ExxonMobil (a lot of the others are prominent arms manufacturers - nuff said!). Then, look at who is speaking at this conference, Mr. Nihad Awad of CAIR for one!

[Link: www.arabialink.com...]

A lot of vested interests are combining, not in some ogranized conspiratorial way imo, but simply out of self-interest to thwart taking one of the best routes for ending the current Jihad - getting those oil ticks off us!

We need sufficient political will to deal with these vested interests but I fear that will not be generated until a disaster of great magnitude occurs.

So there you go. No need to resort to the currently politically impossible expedients of internment and deportation. Just simply stop sending the Muslims our money! Oh, and one more thing - we have to make sure that the Muslims who are here do not use their charitable Zakat donations to fund the Jihad. A careful eye must be kept on all Muslim charities and money transfers. Why do you think the Jihad in Chechnya is going so merrily? Where do you think they are getting the money - it is from women all over Saudi Arabia and elsewhere who get together, as they have nothing else to do, to organize charitable giving to fund jihadis in Chechnya and all over the world. Sort of like the Salvation Army except that it funds real soldiers and real armies!

People are so ignorant. Here is the Sharia law:

THE OBLIGATORY CHARACTER OF JIHAD

09.1 Jihad is a communal obligation. When enough people perform it to successfully accomplish it, it is no longer obligatory upon others (O: the evidence for which is the Prophet’s saying (Allah bless him and give him peace),

“He who provides the equipment for a soldier in jihad has himself performed jihad,”

Oh, what fun, eh? And meanwhile our news media cluck contentedly that "our" Muslims are nice. It just those ones overseas that are causing a problem. What a joke.

And if you guys think that I am just being a wingnut in thinking that big oil is part of the problem, think about it, follow the money - who benefits from selling that Muslim oil?

20 ajaxlikid  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:24:37am

OT
***

Really funny.


18:16 09Sep2004 RSF-Israel explodes bomb hidden in tomb, Muslims angry

By Cynthia Johnston
BETHLEHEM, West Bank, Sept 9 (Reuters) - Israeli soldiers blew up a bomb hidden by militants in a Muslim cemetery in Bethlehem on Thursday, prompting an outcry by Palestinians who said the graveyard had been desecrated.
Israel said the militants were to blame for the damage when troops detonated the bomb concealed in an empty grave. The location is especially sensitive as it is near Rachel's Tomb, a flashpoint West Bank shrine that is Judaism's holiest site.
"We didn't desecrate a cemetery. We neutralised a bomb," said army spokesman Jacob Dallal.
But the explosion also destroyed the nearby grave of a 60-year-old Palestinian and rankled the nerves of local people who said the soldiers had violated the sanctity of Bethlehem's only Muslim cemetery.
The head of Bethlehem's Islamic Waqf, which oversees the cemetery, said even the presence of a bomb would not justify the army's actions and it should have coordinated with Muslim religious authorities.
"This is the first time we see the remains of the dead strewn into the open air. It is a violation of Islamic law, a very serious violation," said Waqf chief Nasr Nawfal.
"Even the entry of an Israeli soldier to the cemetery is forbidden."
Witnesses said soldiers had found the bomb hidden inside an empty tomb above ground.
The army said it was too dangerous to remove the bomb to detonate elsewhere. But the explosion destroyed the grave of Mohammed Khalil, who died in 2001 of natural causes. A relative said his family had moved his remains to a new grave far away.
"It was very painful to see that shameful and appalling scene," said Mustafa Ma'ali, 70.
The cemetery abuts Rachel's Tomb, which Jews regard as the final resting place of the biblical matriach.
Muslims say the real Rachel's Tomb is elsewhere and the compound in question contains a revered old mosque, Bilal al-Rabah, from which they have been barred since Israel captured the West Bank in the 1967 Middle East war.
Bethlehem is also holy to Christians, who revere it as the birthplace of Jesus.
(Additional reporting by Said Ayyad)

21 alegrias  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:25:04am

Palestinian sympathizer & promoter Spanish Socialist President Zapatero today urges our coalition allies to do a Spain & remove their troops from Iraq to "give peace a chance"--let terror reign. (www.elmundo.es)

Mullahs ueber alles, say the LLL. With half the planet supporting these creative self-bomb artistes, who needs enemies.

Faster, please.

22 XanaX  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:26:09am

#13 Victoria

He knows because the photographer's name is Hatem Moussa and he probably helped the insurgent-rebel-gunman-militant build the damn thing.

23 zulubaby  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:26:18am

Is LGF crashing or is it my computer?

24 Jefe  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:29:10am

#23 zulubaby

It's really slow for me. It could have something to do with over 6000 users?!?

25 Iron Fist  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:29:15am

#23 zulubabe,

I think it is a DOS attack. There's no way we have over 6000 readers online right now.

26 EW1(SG)  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:29:15am

Damn. Speechless. The sheer disregard for innocent life among his own people is utterly mindblowing.

OT: DC LGFers: I've started a mailing list so that we can keep each other apprised of lizardoid events (so far always involving some quantity of alcohol.) You can suscribe to the DClgf list here.

Some of you who's email addys I already had have received an invite to join the list, but as Occasional Reader pointed out, there is nothing in the invite that identifies me as the sender (unless you compulsively check email header like I do.)

27 ajaxlikid  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:30:26am

#23
same thing on mine

28 Poitiers-Lepanto  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:30:37am

6000 users

I can't post (3rd attempt in some hrs)

29 gumble  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:31:13am

John Kerry's new campaign message

Hearing John Kerry's speech in Ohio yesterday about the costs of liberating Iraq from Saddam, I was reminded of a sign from the protest warriors that sums of John Kerry's whining.

30 Smit  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:33:00am

Last post was linked at FARK

31 Poitiers-Lepanto  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:33:15am

This is work of the redfascists.
Sobs as usual (no offence to the professionals).

32 V the K  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:34:13am
"Bush, long renowned for his malapropisms, has in the past offered such gems as misunderestimate, embetter and resignate."

What's wrong with that? Those are all perfectly cromulent words. Bush should feel embiggened.

33 EW1(SG)  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:40:12am

#32 V the K: LOL! As an aside, President Bush's mispronouncements are not malapropisms. It amuses me that the writer has such a high opinion of himself that he uses a vocabulary he doesn't understand.

34 Jefe  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:41:10am

#26 EW1(SG)

Done! Thanks for the effort. Though, living in Baltimore, those late weeknight outings only work when I'm off the next day!

35 TalkinKamel  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:41:17am

#32 V the K

I feel fark, totalitarianly fark, from reading such droplets of figumentarian dropelmine-doppelganger and kimjor!

36 Dayenu  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:42:41am

Here's something from the Israel national news:

Left wing Israeli peaceniks were encouraging to Hamas:

[Link: israelnationalnews.com...]

37 amyc  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:50:13am

OK, not that it would do him much good, but is that bastard wearing a flak jacket?

#19, yes I agree with you wholeheartedly. I've repeatedly said that with only half of Egypt's 2 billion annual "foreign aid" we could slap solar panels on most of the large buildings here in the west/southwest. Goodbye to the need to burn oil to generate electricity, at least for this half of the country. I know solar's not as efficient, but with a billion annual subsidy, I'd guess it would be quite, er, competitive with oil.

38 Miggie  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:56:27am

It all goes together... Hamas terrorist wiring a bomb surrounded by poverty stricken barefoot children. He was one of them a few years ago.

I had trouble posting too.

39 Carridine  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:57:08am

Seeing the children, their innocent faces beaming with pleasure and delight, leads to the thought of how the survivors would only remember smiling and then, soundlessly because of the instantaneity of it all, being suddenly in vile, screaming pain, shock, handless or faceless or legless, with pieces of splodeydope all over them...

Ugly. Atrocious. Thuggish.

Par for the course.

40 Michoel  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 7:57:15am

#36 Dayenu,
I was just looking at that. It should be required reading for everyone that cares about Israel. Written by fairly left wing journalists also. Even with all the Jew-hating in Europe, if the Israeli left would show a bit of self-respect, it would go along away toward discouraging the barbarians.

41 bovious  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 8:00:21am

"makeshift?"

What doughty, clever victim/heroes!

42 Cam  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 8:02:09am

#32 V the K:

Thank you Edna Krebappel.

;-)

43 Toonman  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 8:06:25am

# 3 Thom

"A responsible terrorist" ?? They have those?

44 rabid fanatic  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 8:07:38am

I think Charles' servatator's turnbankle is totally flammigized, but I could be wrong. Hey EW1(SG), I signed up, but I don't live in DC, but I make frequent TDY trips out there to visit the big house, I'm hoping my schedule and yours meet up some day.

45 simsg  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 8:08:15am

O/T
Naomi Klein has gone nuts:
The Likudization of the world

She is so morally blind its amazing she can even write. This is an example of the new "The Protocols of Zion" for the world.

47 freedomsound  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 8:09:14am

Can you imagine what the reaction would be if the Beslan school terrorists were casually photographed building their bombs prior to the terrorist attack, and the press photographer didn't warn the Russians? There would be hell to pay.

Yet this happens every day in the Palestinian terrortories.

48 papijoe  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 8:16:12am
49 Thom  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 8:17:03am

#43 Toonman

It was a joke, son, a joke!

50 papijoe  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 8:19:23am

#36 Dayenu
#48 papijoe

Oops, you beat me to it.

If it was only posted once, it would have been enough (dayenu)

51 piglet  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 8:25:05am

All these weapons buried in graveyards shouldnot be a surprise. A big show funeral is a perfect time to bring a casket full of weapons accross town without worrying about a stop and search.

52 alegrias  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 8:34:41am

I'm hallucinating over this image. Something about the guy's long face mask reminds me of mournful Kerry's face.

But Kerry at this man's age would never have encouraged communists or islamofascists to keep fighting and "resisting" Israelis or Americans who daily cut off ears, tied cables to body parts, mutilated, committed atrocities, etc...

Kerry was busy doing jihad unto his fellow Americans.

53 Dagenham  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 8:49:06am

Alley-ways are no place for children to learn how to assemble bombs. Couldn't these kids' parents afford to send them to Hamas Summer Camp?

/sarcasm off

Truly depressing.

54 Renna  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 9:16:08am

Dagenham #53

Couldn't these kids' parents afford to send them to Hamas Summer Camp?

It's done been blowed up. :-)

55 David 'Parisian Insider'  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 9:55:01am

#46 stefania
Not surprising, really.

56 Patrizio  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 9:56:54am

Relatively on-topic:

French journalist Stéphanie Le Bars pens a surprisingly truthful and denouncing piece on the rampant, vicious circle of incestual rape and honor killings taking place in the Palestinian territories.

57 Jakester  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 10:10:09am

If Children See Bomb Planting Terrorists at Work
Children Grow up to be Bomb Planting Terrorists

58 zulubaby  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 10:13:27am

Bits of the article at JPost: Palestinians: 5 killed in clashes with IDF

The army said forces fired on a group of six Palestinian combatants who were shooting, attempting to launch an anti-tank rocket, and laying roadside bombs against advancing IDF forces. As is usual in these cases, the army's version of events was challenged by Palestinian reports, which claimed that IDF forces shot at a group of young men who were throwing stones at the troops.
It is not possible at this stage to confirm either report, as all the Palestinian wounded were evacuated by Palestinian ambulances to Gaza hospitals. According to Palestinian reports, one of those killed in Jabalyia was a 13-year-old boy.

Actually, according to the propagandists, the boy was anywhere from 9 to 13 years old, depending on which article you read.

In several instances, in order to distance the demonstrators, troops fired warning shots in the air and in some instances towards walls of abandoned structures. Moreover, troops deployed had received strict instruction to refrain from shooting at the demonstrators despite the fact that armed Palestinian gunmen had mingled among the demonstrators in order to coax soldiers into shooting at them.

I can’t stand it, it’s pure evil!

Then see By IBRAHIM BARZAK, Associated Press Writer 's version.

Later Thursday, soldiers fired from a tank-mounted machine gun toward a group of Palestinians, including gunmen, stone throwers and bystanders, in the adjacent town of Beit Lahia, witnesses said. Three Palestinians were killed by large-caliber bullets in the area, including a 9-year-old boy, doctors said.
An eighth Palestinian was killed near the Israeli settlement bloc of Gush Katif early Thursday. The army said unarmed men had walked into a "no-go zone" near the settlements and that soldiers opened fire, killing one.
(UPDATES throughout with new casualty figures, hard-liners calling on security forces to resist Gaza pullback, more gunman killed; SUBS graf 21 to correct age of boy killed by jeep from 19 to 17)

WTF is going on, this is out of control!

59 zulubaby  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 10:17:22am

Father of 9/11 ringleader: Attacks were Jewish conspiracy

The attacks were a Jewish conspiracy carried out by the Israeli intelligence service, not a plot by Islamic extremists including his son, the elder Atta declared in an interview with The Associated Press. Moreover, he added, the United States deserved the devastating result because of its anti-Arab policies.

My head is spinning.

60 Jakester  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 10:23:21am

#59 Zulubaby
If his demented father is right, then the Paleos and their Muslim buddies were real stupid to go dancing!

61 David 'Parisian Insider'  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 10:26:23am

#56 patrizio
Yup, but she also hints that the Israeli are responsible for it, whilst illogically explaining that it's even worse in Jordan and other Middle Eastern countries.
S Le Bars is a rabid anti Israeli, you know, like all the journalist in the French press.

#59 zulubaby
It should come as no surprise. These people are the archetypal victims. They wage a defensive war, or so they believe. Like the Nazis...

62 Dagenham  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 10:39:56am

#54 Renna

Right. I'm off to join the ISM. Another example of the imperialist Zionist entity destroying Palestinian educational resources. :P

63 may05  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 11:03:28am

Abuse???!!!

You mean like this one??!

Hypocrates!

64 zulubaby  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 11:09:15am

Who let the Nazi back in?

65 may05  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 11:10:56am

#61 David 'Parisian Insider'

It should come as no surprise. These people are the archetypal victims. They wage a defensive war, or so they believe. Like the Nazis...

You mean US "pre-emptive" wars...?!

66 Joshua (not a hamster) Scholar  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 11:11:04am

Your all so insensitive. It's Palestine's official "Bring your human shields to work" day.

#5 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Actually they're HOPING that the children get offed. Why do you think they use them? "Today my son, you will die to make propaganda"

All for the noble purpose of making ethnic cleansing of the Jews possible one day.

These must be the ugliest people on the planet - their hearts I mean.

67 may05  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 11:19:28am

#64 zulubaby

If I am a nazi, I don't need anyone's permission to get in!

Anyway, why a nazist?! Hilter is dead... lets say a zionist... ain't zionism a form of neo-nazism??

68 Cam  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 11:23:26am

#67 may05:

... lets say a zionist... ain't zionism a form of neo-nazism??

No. Next question?

69 Rayra[deleted]  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 11:26:48am
70 Patrizio  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 11:27:27am

David Parisian Insider

Fuck, that sure is a let-down. She did blame the Jews indirectly, by stating that the reason men molested their women was because they had nothing to do all day because of the TZAHAL.

Also, I wouldn't know about these savage practices being worse in one Muslim country or the other, what do you know about that?

71 AW  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 11:44:51am

#65 may 05

Hypocrates!


Hippocrates|Hypocrates|Hypocrites|

72 zulubaby  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 12:03:21pm
ain't zionism a form of neo-nazism??

Yeah, to idiots like you.

By the way, are you Irish?

73 Jayce  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 12:16:26pm

OT, but still about Gaza, et al

Just released: Prominant Israelis call: Don't carry out illegal orders!

A statement signed by over 150 public figures calls upon IDF soldiers and police officers to refuse to carry out orders to expel Jews from their homes. ...such orders are patently illegal and effectively negate the right of Jews to live anywhere in Israel.

Among the signatures are those of Finance Minister Binyamin Netanyahu's father, Professor Ben-Tzion Netanyahu; the minister's brother Ido Netanyahu; Education Minister Limor Livnat's brother Noam Livnat; and Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's legendary comrade-in-arms from the 1950s-era Commando Unit 101, Meir Har-Tzion...

The statement reads, in part, as follows: "We declare that expulsion and uprooting are national crimes and crimes against humanity, as well as manifestations of despotism and capricious evil aimed at negating the right of Jews - just because they are Jews - to live in their land.

"We call upon the officials that were commanded to prepare the infrastructure for the ethnic cleansing of Jews from their homeland, and to all the officers, soldiers and police as well, to listen to the voice of their national and personal conscience and not participate in actions which will sully it and for which they will feel sorry for the rest of their lives.

74 Charles  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 12:25:53pm

"may05" isn't Irish -- he's posting from Lebanon.

75 zulubaby  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 12:40:28pm

Oh, thanks Charles. No wonder ...

76 RC neo-Jew  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 12:48:35pm

#74 Charles

"may05" isn't Irish -- he's posting from Lebanon.

It could be a she... she could have converted to Islam, married a Hezbollah terrorist militant, and, wrapped from head to toe in cloth, be communicating with us once more...

77 Athos  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 12:53:12pm

OT - but a reason to celebrate -

Richard G. Butler, Founder of the Aryan Nation, started burning in Hell yesterday.

There are rare times to celebrate a death. We should reserve them for when some of the true monsters in the world gain entry into Hell - and this wanker deserves a collective SPIT.

78 amyc  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 1:12:33pm

thanks rayra for the response--seriously :-). I'm not sure why you seem so upset...but I'd still rather start the process of using solar. some of our electricity is generated by hydroelectric, some by nuclear, a tiny fraction by wind turbines (but NOT off Nantucket, noooo way), and quite a bit by coal. So I honestly believe that if we used a billion a year to slap solar panels on government buildings in the southwest, it would be a nice start and would show seriousness in efforts to reduce importing middle east oil. There are a few groups doing research on improved solar panels, and if we started using them in a big way, that research would only accelerate. In addition to drilling in ANWAR and using the ethanol more in our domestic vehicles. We would still import some oil for jets and diesel trucks (my father is in trucking). Really, why do we send so much money into the rat hole of Egypt? And sinking $$ into alternative energy (yes, yes I know it's already happening) would appeal to some of the mythical "swing voters" and take away a democrat talking point.

79 Jayce  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 1:28:53pm

zulubaby and Dayenu ((Left wing Israeli peaceniks were encouraging to Hamas)

I think most people (?are beginning to) understand that the terrorists are just lying, whining, mass murderers and the LLL, EU, UN, MSM, State Dept. etc. are their enablers.
I just hope we can stand up to and overcome them.


zulubaby, also funny: When 14 terrorists were 'outed' by the IDF at a Hamas training base the other day, Arabs claimed they were 'Boy Scouts!"
Expect to see LameSM add that to their 'militants', freedom fighters, activists, protestors... repetoire.

80 Smit  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 2:57:06pm

May05, what are your views on the occupation? (The Syrian occupation of Lebanon, that is)

81 alkmyst  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 3:04:59pm

The Temple Mount is in our hands

And on a personal note, today I walked by the site of the WTC, and spoke with a guy there was saying to people as they passed "History not Mystery", informing me of the more extensive damage that is rarely talked about, about 7 other buildings in the vicinity demolished. He told me, Israel, to be able to put up with the kind of abuse we have been for 30+ years of PLO, (and not nuke those punk little bitches, I might add) is LOVE. For all of G-d's creations.

Love makes the world go round, and the tables are turning. The golden zit is going to be squeezed, and These child-murdering barely-human scum will find themself without a seat at that table.

82 piglet  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 3:17:39pm
Sorry, but you'll have to check your feelgood Math.
Solar Energy panels are roughly ~$3000 / sq meter, generating only ~1 kiloWatthour / day.
Your posited 1 billion dollars would buy only the capability to generate ~333,000 kWh / day.

No. Wrong assumptions. How many of your household electronics use a ac to dc transformer plug that gets really hot after use. Wasted energy. And for large scale elecricyt you do't use solid state solar panels, you use something like this:

[Link: www.wemweb.com...]


Located a few hundred yards north of Route 66, this phenomenon is visible for miles and is a local landmark. Solar II is undergoing final testing and is designed to generate 10 megawatts of electricity, enough to power 10,000 homes.

How It Works

Surrounding the base of the tower are located some 2000 large, motorized mirrors called heliostats. Each heliostat is computer controlled to track the sun and focus reflected energy onto a receiver atop the tower. There are 24 receivers each 24 feet tall surrounding the top of the tower in a cylindrical arrangement. Piping in each of these sections of the receiver carries molten salt, which acts as a heat collector to store the sun's energy. The molten salt is heated to 1050 degrees fahrenheit and pumped to a storage tank where it is further pumped to a
system that produces super heated steam used to drive a turbine generator thus transforming solar energy to electrical energy.

Molten salt, consisting of 60% sodium nitrate and 40% potassium nitrate, is used because its thermal properties allow energy to be stored for long periods of time. Thus the facility continues to generate electricity when the sun is behind clouds and even at night. A disadvantage to the use of molten salt is that all pipes, and of course the storage tank, must be highly insulated. If the temperature of the salt falls below approximately 450 degrees fahrenheit it crystallizes to form a solid.

83 pablito  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 3:56:41pm

somewhat OT:

The New York Times uses the word 'Arab' instead of 'Palestinian' in a headline. I don't think I've ever seen so-called Palestinians referred to as Arabs in a major US paper.

Israeli Forces Attack in Gaza, Killing 7 Arabs

The body of the article, however, uses 'Palestinian'.

Is honesty slowly creeping in to the reporting process at the newspaper of record?

84 Jakester  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 3:57:11pm

#79 Jayce
If the Paleos start calling their terrorists "Boy Scouts" maybe that will help turn the MSM and the L³s against them cause those twits see the Boy Scouts as a bigger menace than the Arab terrorists!

85 Meir  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 4:00:25pm

Happy end to thestory

86 Jakester  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 4:03:43pm

#85 Meir
Poor paleos, pathetic scum using their kids as shields

87 Jakester  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 4:17:58pm

To #69 Rayra and amyc
If we invested the 2 billion in modern screw in flourescent bulbs to replace enery wasting/heat producing incandescents bulbs we could save 2,000,000,000 x .2 KWH/day saved x 365 14 billion KWH/year, plus it would save on A/C bills in hot places by reducing the heat load.

88 zulubaby  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 4:21:43pm

From the caption of the photo that Meir linked to:

In the single deadliest incident soldiers opened fire from a tank-mounted machine gun at Palestinians, killing at least three, including a 13-year-old boy, and wounding nine, Palestinian hospital officials said. (AP Photo/Muhammed Muheisen)

Right next to the picture:

Related Story:
Israel Kills 5, Including 9-Year-Old, in Gaza
Reuters - Thu Sep 9,11:29 AM ET

Disgusting liars.

89 Jakester  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 4:24:27pm

Zulubabe,
they have variable spaced years there, give them a break!

90 zulubaby  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 4:27:54pm

Jakester, depending on which liar's report you're reading, the boy is either 9, 11, or 13 years old. Give them a couple hours and he'll be a strangely hairy toddler.

91 Jakester  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 4:40:37pm

Arabs lie? Perish the thought!

92 Meir  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 4:40:52pm

What can you expect from savage humanoids (Pereh Adam according to the description of the Bible). They do not respect nor value the lives of their own children.
Attacks (rape, murder or both) perpetrated against children and young adults are not new to these barbarians.

93 alkmyst  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 4:41:16pm

#82 piglet

That looks like what Ben Gurion U. is doing in the Negev, I forget the actual figures off the top of my head, but they are supposed to be significant...

There are, of course, other ways to cut down on electrical power usage and waste heat energy...
For example using a simple passive solar water heating system. For the physics-ly impaired, picture this:

A pipe, winding back and forth on itself over a flat surface, with a nozzle in and nozzle out, so that the water inside circulates through a storage tank. Place another panel over it, and paint that panel black, so that it will get very hot in sunlight.

Presto! (Almost) instant hot water! It works VERY efficiently, but ya wanna make sure that the line has enough water. I got a nasty steam burn from one when I was standing near one of the nozzles, and the water got so hot it turned to steam and built enough pressure to blow the tube off, spraying steam and boiling water on my arm. (Ahhh, memories - I think I demanded my professor give me an automatic "A" for hazard duty)

On other Non-petroleum ways that can be developed, well, any real environmentalist should be conservative, by definition. And anybody who wants a clean burning engine would do well to study where they come from.
For example: Rudolph Diesel invented his engine in 1894 (or 1892 can't be bothered to look it up right now) for the World's Fair Exposition, and he ran it on Peanut Oil, which still works in Diesels that are made for developing countries - marvelous machines that run constantly for 25-30+ years without servicing, on just about anything you throw into into, like margarine, even.
Now, a standard automotive diesel can be very easily tweaked to run on a mixture that anybody can do in their own kitchen, with materials availiable at the local automotive parts store and/or supermarket.

Information about this, termed BIODIESEL, is way too plentiful to start posting links all over, so a good one to start with is Jouney to Forever, which should gecha off on the good foot. HAH. Good G-d! Jump back!
Ya better get ready - for the big payback - revenge!

And the best way to get revenge on terrorists IS to stop trading our blood for oil. The U.S. didn't et wise enough in the 70's with the saudi oil crisis, and now here we are. What the U.S. (and others) need to do is to start developing a renewable energy program the same way we did NASA.

Yes - I am an environmentalist, and I still think that Bush's energy policy is horrendous, and I still think that oilmen ("big oil" or otherwise) are counterproductive towards evolving as inhabitants of this Earth, which is one thing that I actually respected Kerry for before his implosion.

Come to think of it, maybe we should all vote for Kerry, let him in the White House long enough to get some environmental initiatives going, and then, when the shit hits the fan, and the U.S. gets attacked again, impeach the shmuck and hold new elections, and put in McCain and Giuliani!!! With Jesse Ventura as Sec. of Defense.

/end rant

94 piglet  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 4:48:11pm

I hope to someday own a wood fired hottub:

[Link: www.snorkel.com...]


How did you come up with the idea for...?
The Snorkel® Stove was originally developed in a physics laboratory at the University of Alaska. The purpose was to create an efficient wood burning water heater that would provide the luxury of hot tubbing in areas without electricity (most of Alaska) and require minimum maintenance. Several designs were tested and the best, named Snorkel® Stove because most of it except the feed door and the air intake are under water, was installed in a cabin just outside Fairbanks.

95 alkmyst  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 5:15:25pm

#94 piglet

A hot tub is always a great idea, problem for me is, most of Israel isn't exactly overabundant with wood for burning...

but there was a nice find of natural gas off the coast of Ashkelon...

Are you near Seattle? Beautiful out that way - spent some quality time in the Pacific northwest - almost wound up going to that hippy school there... what was it... Evergreen.

Those were the good 'ol days.. to be young and leftist

96 LOVEtheIDF  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 5:19:24pm

Weeeeeeeeeeee
Thisa toy looks cool
What does this button do?

97 ibu guru  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 5:50:52pm

#19 mentat --

...and regulate and police the heck out of the Muslims that are still here.

If we banned "change of status" applications from all those who are "out of status" (i.e. illegal aliens), and forced them to depart or be deported, we could cut the current Muslim population by about half. Like the 9/11 terrorists, the majority of Muslim immigrants are immigration-law violators, including visa fraud, visa overstays, marriage fraud, clandestine entrants, etc.

The first step in protecting us against criminals and terrorists is strict enforcement of immigration laws. Reduce the problem's quantity substantially, then we can tackle the issues of what's left.

98 ibu guru  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 6:01:04pm

#19 mentat --

A lot of people think home/office energy has to come from the grid, thinking in terms of power plants, distribution, etc. And energy companies certainly encourage that dependent thinking.

Go off the grid: use solar, wind, etc. Incorporate energy independence into homes as they are being built. We certainly have to get off fuel oil here in New England.

BTW, zakat, as I had it explained to me when I lived in Indonesia, is for "propagation of the faith," not food for the poor, etc. as we think of "charity." The IRS needs to investigate every muslim-run "charity." It should probably disallow tax-exempt status fro every one of them -- tax the hell out of them!

99 ibu guru  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 6:19:15pm

#58 zulubaby --

Since they begin terrorist training & bombmaking demonstrations by age three, they shouldn't whine about an experienced 13-yr-old terrorist getting blown up. It's their own bloody fault, but it would seem islam forbids taking responsibility for one's actions.

Do they have a fatwa on that? A "thou shalt not accept responsibility for one's own actions, but shall blame infidels for any adverse consequences under any circumstances" fatwa?

A "good muslim" is supposed to sire quantities of kids, but I have never found any "instructions" mandating parents feed, house or care for those children. Certainly nothing about "loving" them. Where are the parents in this picture? The men are lounging at the cafe or beating their wives, the women are forbidden to leave the house, so of course no one's minding the kiddies. They have no heart whatsoever, not even for infants & toddlers.

Disgusting (every other word I could think of was too scatological for public consumption).

100 newsonterr  Thu, Sep 9, 2004 6:46:49pm

How can such beastly acts be justified in the name of god; and how are young, educated and well-to-do folks lured on to this bait to become killers of defenseless innocents and traitors to humanity?

Let's find out how.

Human beings all over the globe are different. Some are white, some are black, some brown and some yellow. Some have long noses, some have stub noses, some have golden hair, some have brown and some black. This list of differences is not too long. On the contrary, there are many similarities too that are common to all human beings. All humans (as also animals) have feelings of fear, love, hatred, and so on, all tempered by the instinct of survival. But the only difference between Man and the lower animals is the level of articulation in Man is much higher.

A fish can hardly express its love or hate, a dog can express its love or hate better than a fish and a Man can express his love or hatred in a much more articulate manner. This articulation comes from the man's capacity of forming an independent personal judgement as to whom and what to love and whom and what to hate. This faculty of forming a judgement works fine as long as every human being has to freedom to exercise this judgement.

But when any belief system tries to regulate this freedom of judgement, the results could be disastrous, if the nature of that regulation is socially harmful. What would happen if Man's faculty of judgement is conditioned by say the following regulations:

What the - Holy Qur'an says "When you meet the unbelievers in the Jihad strike off their heads and, when you have laid them low, bind your captives firmly"

Quran 47:4 When you meet the unbelievers in the Jihad strike off their heads and, when you have laid them low, bind your captives firmly. Then grant them their freedom or take ransom from them, until War shall lay down her burdens.

Quran 5:33-34 The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet and alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land.

Quran 5:51 Believers, take neither Jews nor Christians for your friends. They are friends with one another. Whoever of you seeks their friendship shall become one of their number.

I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers, Smite ye above their necks - Holy Qur'an

Quran 8:12 "Remember Thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): "I am with you: give firmness to the believers, I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers, Smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger tips of them."

The effect of such tampering of the independence of the human faculty of forming a judgement (as to whom and what to love or hate) is obvious. One shudders to imagine the kind of effects such a manual has on the impressionable mind of a young Moslem child. Is it any wonder that so many of them grow up into hardened criminals who possess a distorted, sadistic and perverted psyche. Repeated exposure to and encouragement of the thoughts expressed in this verse would surely inculcate violence in the very core of a child's being.

Any deluded Non-Moslem who thinks that Islam is the religion of peace and that it is only misguided Moslems who commit terrorism and atrocities, can pick up an English translation of the Quran

The above verses are only the tip of the iceberg. Any deluded Non-Moslem who thinks that Islam is the religion of peace and that it is only misguided Moslems who commit terrorism and atrocities, can pick up an English translation of the Quran from any bookstore and refer to these Verses (Surahs). Is it any surprise that an average Moslem who lives up the life recommended by the Quran, behaves like a beast. And a beast can only be hunted down.

[Link: www.newsonterror.com...]

101 Carridine  Fri, Sep 10, 2004 2:29:13am

Piglet,
Many of us want to see your dreams come true, but we have been studying reality with the help of Steven den Beste.

[Link: www.denbeste.nu...]

Start there, read his engineering-grounded essays on why alternate energy is good, WITHIN CERTAIN LIMITS, and after you've defeated ALL of his well-reasoned, scientifically based explanations for why your electric panels won't allow America to get off of fossil-fuels in the next decade, THEN come back and share with us your ways, means and the good news it will really entail.

All the best,
Carridine and Others

102 FabioC.  Fri, Sep 10, 2004 4:26:53am

There is also a timescale problem: to have any significative influence on the war, oil consumption should be cut by something like 50% in the next 5 years.

And then there are Europe, China, India who already use and will use huge amounts of oil, not only the USA.

I think renewable/alternative energy sources are a good idea, but they cannot be big enough, soon enough to make any real difference for the ongoing war.

103 alegrias  Fri, Sep 10, 2004 4:52:38am

Mark Helprin in today's WSJ "Three Years On" says we are "courting failure" in the War on Terror unless we admit we're in a clash of civilizations (with global militant Islam) and gear up for it.

Faster, harder, better, NOW! Enough sensitivity towards these mutant muslim death cultists.


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