I think by now the average Joe is onto the MSM...

the MSM is just digging its own grave.

1st :)

Charles

In every conversation I’ve made sure to point out that I’ve voted Democratic my whole life, but that I now support President Bush. Not one of these papers thought this was noteworthy enough to print, and with the publication of this LA Times smear job we see why: it doesn’t fit their program.

...and that's why the MSM will be dumbfounded in Nov. when W wins re-election...they've ignored what "doesn't fit their program".

Charles,

Not one of these papers thought this was noteworthy enough to print, and with the publication of this LA Times smear job we see why: it doesn’t fit their program.

The media are the enemy.

And of course Yahoo News is linking to the LA Times non-story.

Charles, you will be a far happier person if you remain unavailable when the press comes a-callin' to put their words in your mouth and then "quote you". They like to hang fiction on people like crape paper on Holloween.

OT
My pc has been giving me fits so I've missed a lot of posts, but I have to share this. Sorry if it's a repost.
Fox on Kerry's Meetings with North Vietnamese

Charles,

I’ve voted Democratic my whole life, but that I now support President Bush.

I think you will find that a great many lifelong Democrats will join you this time around.

128.255.244.60...] target="_blank">

I can't believe the slant!

Yes, sadly, I actually can.

OT to Charles - just sent you a link to a recruiting poster

The U.N. Security Council approved a resolution Saturday threatening sanctions against Sudan unless it acts to rein in Arab militias accused of violence in Darfur that the United States has called genocide.

So they're all in agreement that they should threaten to threaten Sudan with sanctions.

Shucks, why not just link it here:

A recruiting poster

Just sayin'

Charles:

Well done! The credibility of the MSM is now really dead, thanks to you and the other bloggers.

It would appear that the bloggers' influence, and their ability to find info in what is a nano-second in comparison to the pathetic MSM, whose agenda is so far LLL that they really have lost their moral compass, if they ever had one...this is from an Australian newspaper: Dubious affair leaves egg on media's face

Back in March, US journalists celebrated a special anniversary: exactly 50 years before, CBS broadcaster and TV news pioneer Edward R. Murrow took to the airwaves with a blistering indictment of Red-baiting drunk and Cold War smear artist Senator Joe McCarthy.

Murrow's broadcast coolly and methodically exposed McCarthy's distortions and moral corruption.

It was the end of "Tailgunner Joe", and the start of something else - the national media's monopoly on defining stories and determining the who, what and how of America's national conversation.

Last week, like McCarthy, that trust crashed and burned. The catalyst was a sheaf of undoubtedly forged documents purporting to confirm what had long been rumoured about President George Bush's service in the Texas Air National Guard - that he was a ne'er-do-well whose family pulled strings to keep him from Vietnam. Since challenger John Kerry was off earning medals in Vietnam at the time, the comparison between playboy and patriot was not flattering.

The allegations were aired 10 days ago on CBS' 60 Minutes in a segment introduced by Murrow's heir, veteran anchorman Dan Rather. The big difference between then and now is that the TV networks and national newspapers had little to do with exposing the dirty tricks behind this assault on Bush.

The credit goes to US "citizen journalists", the internet's amateur sleuths and "bloggers" who reject having their news by the establishment media.

No sooner had Rather broadcast the documents than a poster at a right-wing bulletin board, Free Republic, noted that they were written on a personal computer, not a '70s-era typewriter. Other posters piled on, bringing their own expertise: the memos were not in standard US Air Force format; one of the commanding officers supposedly critical of Bush's performance had retired from the service 18 months earlier. And other documents, official ones, were available online that further eroded the forgeries' credibility.

Who manufactured the damning documents and why? Tapping into the internet's wealth of public records and old news stories, the bloggers established a network of connections leading straight back to Rather.

His daughter, Robin, is a Democrat activist in Texas where a local powerbroker, Ben Barnes, had thrown her a fund-raising party at which her famous father was the guest speaker. Barnes' connection? In Rather's 60 Minutes report, the former deputy governor was the key witness for the prosecution, confessing that he had been approached by friends of the Bush family to secure a safe, non-combat berth for the future president.

Rather had described Barnes as merely "a Kerry supporter". The bloggers checked records for political contributions and found he was rather more - the third-largest contributor to the Kerry campaign, responsible for $500,000 worth of cheques.

By late last week, the internet horde was closing in on the forger's identity, with the establishment press bringing up the rear.

Instead of being couched in air force lingo, the bogus documents were peppered with army jargon, the bloggers noted. Well, guess what? A 20-minute drive from the Abilene copy shop where they were faxed to CBS, there lives a retired Army National Guard officer, Bill Burkett, who has a history of discredited allegations against the Bush family.....

see rest of article...

#12 NY Nana

In reference to the thread last night. Is there any way that you know of to be certain about which charities to give to? There's nothing I can do about UNRWA and their horrid track record because that comes out of my tax money.

Is there a web site out there listing charities that I would want to avoid?

Thanks!

I had a telephone conversation with the author of the LA Times hit piece (Peter Wallsten) last week, and he asked me several times if I knew who “Buckhead” was (no), or if I had been in contact with anyone from the RNC (no), or if I knew of any other bloggers who had been in contact with the RNC (no). His agenda was clear even then.

The assumption of Rather and this MSM tool is that, if you're interested in a bogus memo being used to smear the President close to an election, you must be a republican operative. These major journalists are so utterly corrupt that they simply cannot fathom that there are many, many intelligent and independent-minded people out there who are simply interested in getting to the truth of things.

You know, people who would actually appreciate real journalism, and have now shouldered the burden of producing it.

"I’ve voted Democratic my whole life, but that I now support President Bush. Not one of these papers thought this was noteworthy enough to print, and with the publication of this LA Times smear job we see why: it doesn’t fit their program."

It's because their neural software is coded from the 60s when all the average schmuk knew about computers was from TV..."That does not compute...that does not compute...Danger, Will Robinson..."

I swear they're acting like one of Asimov's robots running around in circles, because everything they sense violates their "prime directive." The LLLs are programmed in BASIC:

IF Republican THEN evil; GOTO 10.

Bloggers have their own voice and their own audience. Selective quoting and distortion can be left to the MSM. Consumers will flock to more honesty and more accountability when given a choice.

Poor misguided do-gooder liberals, one day they'll look in the mirror and realize they have become the establishment. An establishment that demonizes those that think differently and fears Christians more that it fears Islam.

Yech.. time for a beer... belay that.. time for many beers.

Blogosphere to MSM: keep digging.

I hear you. I voted Democrat all my life and am now voting for Bush as well.

Listening to the mainstream media. You would think we never existed.

Well, FOX is keeping on top of this story. Today, they've got this up on most of their shows.
From 6:00pm till midnight they're covering it on all of their programs.
Here's their schedule of coverage for today
[Link: www.foxnews.com...]

OMG, some of these bloggers and people posting on Free Republic might actually turn out to be...Republicans. Can you believe it? And Swiftee John O'Neill met with Nixon once in 1971. So much for his credibility. Better to stick with unimpeachable sources untainted by partisanship. Like Ben Barnes. Bill Burkett. Or 86-year-old Mrs. Selected-Not-Elected. That's the ticket.

Charles,

And you're not alone in being the only person who runs a blog or posts online who's seen the Democratic party go blindly off the rails with the insane clown posse running the show.

I used to be a good Democrat. Voted the line in every election I was eligible to vote in. No longer. For me, as with many others who post here, national security is the issue of the day, and whichever candidate is best on that issue is the one who gets my votes.

And that means I may vote R instead of D. And that has everything to do with the platform the DNC cobbled together, the inept candidacy of Kerry, and completely disregarding the biggest threat to this nation - terrorism and the way state sponsors hide their deadly agenda through murky relationships that are anything but cut and dried contracts.

The world is truly a dangerous place, but it didn't become so overnight. It didn't become anti-American since Bush went into Iraq. There have been anti-American sentiments since America was created. Fear, loathing, hatred, hypocricy. You name the feeling and reaction, national leaders around the world have felt it about the US.

Now, we have a President who appears to recognize that there are threats that must be dealt with before they become too difficult to manage (see North Korea for how a threat becomes too big to manage). And you cannot hope for things to happen in a linear fashion either. Events will happen at once, and the US response must be swift, unequivocal, and definite. Only one party seems to recognize this.

And that's the biggest shame of all.

But the media's complicity in hiding these issues or downplaying their role in how this site works, how people came to know of this site, and how bloggers work in general shows their complete and utter apathy in recognizing the changing face of media and how people learn about the world around them.

burkett himself is now saying that he contacted max cleland.

AUSTIN, Texas - A retired Texas National Guard official mentioned as a possible source for disputed documents about President Bush (news - web sites)'s service in the Guard said he passed along information to a former senator working with John Kerry 's campaign.

In an Aug. 21 e-mail to a list of Texas Democrats, Bill Burkett said after getting through "seven layers of bureaucratic kids" in the Democrat's campaign, he talked with former Georgia senator Max Cleland about information that would counter criticism of Kerry's Vietnam War service. The Associated Press obtained a copy of the e-mail Saturday.

"I asked if they wanted to counterattack or ride this to ground and outlast it, not spending any money. (Cleland) said counterattack. So I gave them the information to do it with," Burkett wrote.

Burkett, who lives just outside of Abilene, wrote that no one at the Kerry campaign called him back.

The e-mail was distributed to a Yahoo list of Texas Democrats. The site, which had about 570 members Saturday, is not affiliated with the state party.

from

[Link: story.news.yahoo.com...]

and yet, they still try to deflect and say that the president is living in a "fantasy world of spin".

unbelievable!

# 21 lawhawk:

For me, as with many others who post here, national security is the issue of the day, and whichever candidate is best on that issue is the one who gets my votes.

You wouldn't be from Chicago, by any chance?

It's "projection" straight out of Psychology 101. They can't believe that anything outside the leftist orthodoxy can be grass roots. I guess the years of repurposing DNC press releases into "stories" has taken its toll. In the end it may be for the best, the more urgently they follow Dan Rather's lead, the sooner they will be discredited totally - and that can only be good for America.

Here’s another interesting fact. I’ve now spoken to at least a dozen newspapers, and had my words quoted many times. In every conversation I’ve made sure to point out that I’ve voted Democratic my whole life, but that I now support President Bush. Not one of these papers thought this was noteworthy enough to print, and with the publication of this LA Times smear job we see why: it doesn’t fit their program.

Remember how some news organization -- was it ABC? -- recently said that they were incapable of finding even a single person who had votged for Gore in 2000 who was voting for Bush in 2004? I'm sure they were looking really hard. I face the same bias all the time -- people absolutely cannot grok the concept of voting for Bush because you're a liberal. At a recent gathering I said (to a group of fellow lifelong Dems and libs) "Bush is the greatest defender of liberal values since Roosevelt!" Silence. Nervous laughter. Changing the subject. When people like us say that we're Liberals for Bush, people either think we're joking, or lying, or they simply turn off their listening capability and ignore us. In the gathering mentioned above, it was especially awkward because they knew for a fact that I share their political values.

I've considered starting a site called LiberalsforBush.com, but at this stage the election's going to be a landslide anyway so I decided it wasn't needed anymore. But keep banging the idea into their heads, Charles -- the one thing ultra-lefties really hate is being outflanked in the realm of counter-intuitive hipness. They think it's a cool intellectual switcheroo to say "Bush caused 9/11." When you come back with "Bush supports liberalism; Kerry supports totalitarianism," they're knocked back on their heels.

Keep at it.

Is Burkett being set up to take the fall for this?

This is an interesting post on PowerLine

A reader writes that his son is flying on American this morning from New York to Dallas. The flight was delayed by weather but has loaded for departure. The reader reports courtesy of his son that Dan Rather is sitting up in first class. I assume Rather is heading down to Dallas to keep digging -- deeeper into the hole he is in.

[Link: www.powerlineblog.com...]
Wonder what he's planning on doing while he's in Texas.

#18 Cog

I hear you. I voted Democrat all my life and am now voting for Bush as well.

Ditto, I am a lifelong democrat voting republican for the first time in my life.

This whole thing is really just the death throes of communism, now commonly called tenured socialism. There are so many elitists that realise now that so many years of their life has been lost to a theory that makes Marx puke. We must have sympathy for these people that cant bring themselves to ask for your forgiveness. I myself
say, f*ckem tho!

Also, with WaPO's Dobbs and others within MSM going after Rather and CBS full bore, the rest of them, having been left behind, have to find something to do, some way to pretend they're still usefull, get on some new story. And the new story for them is the same old story: Republican scam, Democrats screwed by operatives, all a setup, yadda yadda.

And the whole thing is stillborn anyway. The identity of Buckhead was revealed by Powerline days ago. By now, most everybody in the blogosphere knows who he is. As usual, MSM is late, tired, cliche, and biased.

baybuny (#22)

In an Aug. 21 e-mail to a list of Texas Democrats, Bill Burkett said after getting through "seven layers of bureaucratic kids" in the Democrat's campaign, he talked with former Georgia senator Max Cleland about information that would counter criticism of Kerry's Vietnam War service. The Associated Press obtained a copy of the e-mail Saturday.

I'd be interested in seeing that e-mail.

I just composed the following letter to the idiots at Editor and Publisher

Oh for heaven's sake. How old is your reporter? Indeed, how many people on your staff have ever worked extensively on both typewriters and word processors?

I was away from my computer that day (and I just don't care to watch 60 minutes anymore...I have better things to do and better resources to follow). But when I followed the first links to the .pdf files CBS themselves had posted, it was obvious there was something wrong with these "memos."

I'm 50 years old. That translates into someone who learned in the late 1960's to touch type on a manual typewriter. I was a secretary for many years (and I'm a clerk now with a District Attorney's office). In the mid-1970's I was an executive secretary (American Savings and Loan, Whittier, California) who worked on both an IBM selectric and IBM Executive typewriters (I was the only person in the department with the Exec). I'm very familiar with documents that are typed. My suspicions about the memos were immediate and when I compared them with known and vetted documents available, it became even clearer.

CBS has been caught trying to peddle forged documents their own experts warned them repeatedly about. They have compounded their own folly by acting as if their word alone should suffice to the great unwashed masses rather than treating their audience as peers to be convinced of the evidence.

There is nothing suspicious to the rapidity of how this fell apart since there are enough people alive today that have both personal experience in both mediums enough to catch the attention of experts in the field like Dr. Joseph Newcomer, Ph.D.,

[Link: www.flounder.com...]

Quote: I do not even dignify this statement with the traditional weasel-word “alleged”, because it takes approximately 30 seconds for anyone who is knowledgeable in the history of electronic document production to recognize this whole collection is certainly a forgery, and approximately five minutes to prove to anyone technically competent that the documents are a forgery. I was able to replicate two of the documents within a few minutes. At time I a writing this, CBS is stonewalling. They were hoaxed, pure and simple. CBS failed to exercise anything even approximately like due diligence. I am not sure what sort of "expert" they called in to authenticate the document, but anything I say about his qualifications to judge digital typography is likely to be considered libelous (no matter how true they are) and I would not say them in print in a public forum."
---------

Sirs, you have tens of thousands of people who can exchange information in seconds, and who are not afraid to exchange, challenge, pool and research in what is a real-time environment. Buckhead may have been the first to post his suspicions after seeing the documents on CBS's site, but any number of others, may have also seen them and not voiced their suspicions. Buckhead did, and in a forum where the number of the curious to take a look for themselves exponentially grew as the word sped along, across county, in nana-seconds.

If there is a collusion allegation to be made, try explaining how the DNC was immediately ready with their "Fortunate Son" TV ad containing footage of the Dan Rather hoax piece for immediate release. Just how fast do TV ads get produced, eh?

I do have some sympathy for your position, here. Citizen-journalists of the internet are challenging the gatekeeper role that traditional Old Media has played. To chalk it up to some nether-world Vast Rightwing Conspiracy orchestrated by Sauron Rove may soothe your nerves. However, Old Media has taken their role and their audience for granted. Indeed, treated them with an arrogance and dismissive attitude that has driven many to seek alternative information sources.

You can either embrace the reality and work with the vast and immediate resources and talents of the internet, or you can fade into history.

Your choice.

I'm surprised the "reporter" didn't ask you to spell a word like turncoat, and then when you say "...R-N-C" he could go "Aha! There's the connection I'm looking for."

Other 'headlines'

>Memo flap further muddied by role of activist
>GOP activist first to question Bush National Guard docs
>"Buckhead," who said CBS memos were forged, is a GOP-linked ...

There were more earlier in the day. Apparently Google ranks stories and allows them to be grouped.
You can run the query by inserting a url like below:

[Link: www.mercurynews.com...]

and find related news stories

This isn't a surprise, all they can do is smear after they get a kick in the chops. Instead of looking at "why" they are at the point that they are at, and why their viewership is tanking, along with other things.

I know people in Indiana that were die-hard Democrats in 2000, they've had their change like others here. When they've talked with Newspapers in the city...and their political change came to face...their comments sure didn't show up. "it doesn’t fit their program" seems to be all too familiar these days.

#12 NY Nana: Very intresting article to say the least. All the little extra bits of info tossed in will help the non-informed atleast.

#26 zulubaby: It's a possibility, but with the odd connection to the DNC and their 'fortunate son' ad...he might end up being the original source or only the middle man. I can't quite puzzle it out yet...I need to think on it a bit more.

#18 #28

ditto..

Democrat by birth, but reconsidered after September the 11th. Voted Republican in the 2002 midterm election and plan to keep voting Republican until the Democrats respect what Zell Miller said at the RNC.

The left get so pissy and jealous when they are backed into a corner, and their lying way of life is questioned in anyway - especially by a lowly serf.

For all the blogophiles who post in HTML forms:

To get the Dan Ra^ther look, just type Dan Ra^ther from now until he retires or resigns.

He he.

Side by side comparison of memos via Wash Post.

The MSM is now shifting gears. They can no longer argue that the bloggers were lying or mistaken, it's now an accepted (except at the DU) that the memos were forged. So now they have to attack the messengers--Ohmigod! These bloggers may be pro-Bush! They have an agenda!

I've already seen this line being pushed on some of the leftist blogs.

MORPHEUS-"Do you want to know what it is?"

"The matrix is every where, it is all around us, even in this very room. You can see it when you look out your window, when you turn on your television. You can feel it when you go to work, when you go to church, when you pay your taxes."

"It is the world that has been pulled over your eyes to blind you to the truth."

NEO-"What truth?"

MORPHEUS-"That you are a slave, Neo. Like every one else, you were born into bondage. Into a prison that you cannot see or taste or touch. A prison for your mind."

"This is your last chance. You take the blue pill, story ends. You wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe."

"Take the red pill, you stay in wonderland, and I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes."

The left, as a collective whole, are devoid of truth, logic and plausable arguments.

The left do however, own the most market share of good smear.

#25 zombie

Word.

I've had these two REd Queen exchanges with "liberal" friends. One, a newspaper editor, was actually snarling as she said "Bush can't go around installing democratic governments where he feels like it!"

I said, "You mean, we should leave those dictators and warlords alone?"

She answered defensively, "We don't have the right to overthrow sovereign governments!"

Wow. First I've heard THAT one. Every evil regime on the planet would love this argument. She wouldn't meet my eyes after that one.

Second incident: another LLL friend, speaking of the burka/shroud Muslim men force women to wear, said, "Those women should be allowed to wear the burka. It's their culture." This one calls herself a feminist. I say bollocks. (I didn't ask her what she thinks of Muslims' female genital mutilation. Couldn't bear to hear her defend even THAT.)

IOW, "liberal" values are lost in the dust of "multiculturalism." I think that underneath it all is a kind of effete moral vanity--"let someone else do the dirty work of fighting and protecting; not moi"--and a profound cowardice.

Or, as Rhett Butler once remarked mockingly to Scarlett O'Hara, "You don't care if the whole world goes to pot, so long as you're safe and comfortable."

#21 lawhawk

Great post, and I totally agree.

However, I wouldn't vote for Kerry, even if 9/11 hadn't happened.

I have many family members who are/were vietnam vets, and I have dated quite a few vets also. Most vets came home and got on with their lives as best they could in a hostile environment. My brother didn't talk about it too much, but he did tell me that after two tours in Vietnam, everything else was gravy. My cousin doesn't talk about it too much either.....though he related some things to me just prior to trying to commit suicide.

My brother never "got over" Vietnam really. He lived a unique life, and I miss him dearly...but he certainly wasn't mainstream :) When he got sick I had to practically kidnap him to get him to go to the VA Hospital. He didn't want anything to do with them.

I attribute the many difficulties I have seen vets go through (most of the time silently) to the hostile atmosphere created in this country by John Kerry and his ilk. I believe that many vets would have sought out help, had Kerry not turned Vietnam into something shameful. Kerry, with total disregard for his fellow soldiers, lied to sensationalize Vietnam...for his own profit. The damage he did to the morale of the soldiers in Vietnam is criminal. The damage he did to the soldiers returning home and to their lives is even more so.

He will NEVER get my vote. He is a traitor.

Charles,

Like you, I have always voted for the Democratic candidate, even Jimmah, way back when. NO MORE.

And, the MSM will deny to their last breath that they are in any way biased. Since the only people that they even speak or socialize with are liberal, they believe that they are in the mainstream and cannot conceive of how anyone could think differently than they do unless they are evil oppressors (Republicans).

BTW: I am retiring from the Navy at the end of January and have received letters from Former Presidents Ford, Carter, and Bush (41). Still waiting for Mr. Clinton's.

+Photi

#39,

Notice how, on a typewriter, you can type on the same page and not get dates to align. Notice that 5 Sep 73 is slightly off to the right of 6 Sep 73 because the page was removed from the typewriter Bush used and put into another typewriter Killian (or a typist) used.

Yet every date, heading, and signature region in the CBS documents aligns with sub-millimeter precision.

#12 NY NANA

The real significance of this post is that the Australian newspaper which published this biting article is 'The Age', generally regarded in Oz as standing several klicks to the Left of Lenin and his former mob. When the 'Age' starts straddling the fence it's a pretty good indicator that things are looking real baaaaad! for the Democrats.

#46
The memo on the left looks like a typewriter document.

The focus on "who was first" is inherently wrongheaded. No, I'm not surprised that a GOP supporter was the first to take a close, skeptical look at the documents. As a Kerry supporter, I'd be a lot quicker to look skeptically at documents damaging to Kerry than at documents damaging to Bush. But it doesn't take special expertise to be skeptical of these documents; you just have to be old enough to remember how typewritten documents used to look. The first time I saw the documents, I knew that they were suspicious. Unlike some, I did know that there were proportional spacing capable typewriters back in the '70's, but also I knew that they were uncommon. I still had a slight hope that they might turn out to be genuine, but Charles's overlay experiment clinched it for me.

#32 Darleen, that was excellent. I'm 48, worked on the IBM Selectric Composer in 1973, as a matter of fact (for a little local paper called the Tri-County News.)

We have to keep whacking away at them. I disagree that they've taken a fatal blow. The old dragon still has teeth, and is wounded and snarling and snapping, counterattacking without the least regard for the truth. It will take many more such incidents for most of our fellow citizens to see how biased they are (tho many have their suspicions already, thank the Lord). But Big Media are still plenty dangerous.

Charles:

In every conversation I’ve made sure to point out that I’ve voted Democratic my whole life, but that I now support President Bush. Not one of these papers thought this was noteworthy enough to print, and with the publication of this LA Times smear job we see why: it doesn’t fit their program.

Charles - you are on the money. The old-school Democrats have become Social (perhaps even Soviet, if you really want to get to brass tacks) Democrats, who have taken the teachings of Marx and Lenin to heart and threaten our very existence. The LA Times, not happy with trying to get their guy in, want nice high circ numbers for their base, i.e. the rich white guilty folks who believe that mean ol' nasty Bush should never have been elected, and should not be re-elected again. It's BDS (Bush Derangement Syndrome) all throughout the media, and just like the quiz show scandals of the 1950s, you can bet there will be plenty of changes ahead.

#17 Ghost of a flea

I agree. The more the MSM backs the faked documents, the more disgusted the (thinking) public is going to get. Let them dig.
After my initial disgust at the LATimes over their backing of those forgeries (by attacking bloggers), I've changed my mind. Good.
CBS is a sinking ship. Let the LATimes and whoever else wants to jump on board go ahead and sink with them. Luckily, there is still time left for other "news" organizations to join the Sinkfest.

#39 memos

You know, they didn't even bloody bother to match signatures!! Assholes.

Charles, excellent topic. Amazing to see how many democrats have lizardized.

Does anybody have a list of prominent Dems who have gone on the record stating they will be voting for Bush?

I can think of 2 off the top of my head:

Zell Miller
Ed Koch

I know there are more, help me out here.

Sarah D. #44

Well put.

Thank you.

+Photi

I’ve voted Democratic my whole life, but that I now support President Bush.

Me three. I'm also in recovery.

Charles,

You're becoming an un-person to the Left. Something is obviously wrong with your thinking if you don't think Bush is the Second Coming of Hitler^TM.

It is much easier to dismiss someone's input and expertise if you feel they are crazy or some kind of traitor to a cause. Who would vote for Bushitler? Evil, crazy, blood thirsty, rich white people...maybe even, gasp, proud Christian people. Horror of horrors.

hey Charles, as long as you are going to talk with reporters, you'd might as well yank their chains a little:

Grunge speak was a hoax created by Meagan Jasper of Sub Pop Records. In an interview with The New York Times, Jasper told the interviewer that there was a slang language associated with the Seattle grunge scene that was used in the late 1980s and early 1990s. The information given by Jasper would appear in a November 15 feature article of the Times.

Grunge speak words
During the interview, Jasper made up the following terms and their definitions:
bloated, big bag of blotation: drunk
bound-and-hagged: staying home on friday or saturday night
cob nobbler: loser
dish: desirable guy
fuzz: heavy wool sweaters
harsh realm: bummer
kickers: heavy boots
lamestain: uncool person
plats: platform shoes
rock on: a happy goodbye
score: great
swingin' on the flippety-flop: hanging out
tom-tom club: uncool outsiders
wack slacks: old ripped jeans

These old-line MSM "journalists" are cornered rats. They will fight with all the viciousness they can muster.

They can sense, if they don't fully realize, that their days as the dictators of agendae are over.

"What's even more laughable is those in the press (like the amazingly pompous and inane New York Times) who are now tut-tutting about how awful it is that these independently funded groups are allowed to be heard. Oh, what is it you're afraid of, Mr. News Editor Man? That you don't get to be the gatekeeper of what people are allowed to hear about anymore? ... The Internet has detected the mainstream media as a form of censorship and simply routed around them." -- Dean Esmay

"The Internet interprets censorship as damage and routes around it." -- John Gilmore

"It is kind of ironic when you think about it. I mean the internet was begat by the old Arpanet which was created to keep the flow of important data moving through alternative nodes when one or more them became disabled or nonfunctional. ... Not just ironic. Delicious."
-- Jessica's Well

"I would not be fooled by the old myth that reporting is about objectivity. Deciding what is news is the most subjective of acts and it is probably the most important thing that we do." -- Carl Bernstein

In every conversation I’ve made sure to point out that I’ve voted Democratic my whole life, but that I now support President Bush. Not one of these papers thought this was noteworthy enough to print, and with the publication of this LA Times smear job we see why: it doesn’t fit their program.

Reminds me of the SwiftVets. Many of them are Democrats or have supported Democratic candidates numerous times, even donating money. Paul O'Neill has in fact contributed to several Democratic campaigns.

Now, however, they are always mentioned as tools of the Republican party. According to the media elites, not one, not ten, but 250 vets who served in the same capacity as Kerry have no integrity or political legitimacy.

Bush is the Second Coming of HitlerTM

Well, given that he was born on July 6, 1946, he could be a reincarnation of someone from that period... :)

I've voted Republican almost exclusively since 1973, so ..welcome to all the switchover ex-Dems. I've voted Democrat twice, both times for Frank Rizzo for Mayor of Philadelphia, and would do it again in a heartbeat. Unfortunately, he's not with us any longer.

re 66
not that it's newsworthy, just my 2 cents.

Last...

#66 mac

I've been a registered Republican since 1972 (except for a few heady years when Buchanan was just too prominent a fixture in the Rep. Party, I registered Libertarian). However, I've not only voted for Democrats in local elections, but stumped for 'em two.

Locally, one gets to know people personally and many times the good guy might not be with the same party you've registered with.

Course, this was many years ago when "Conservative Democrat" wasn't a nasty word.

tgibbs, thanks for your rational (wowever rueful) acceptance of reality. It is reassuring to know that there can be reasonable opposition with integrity and class. Keep it up!

I am a recovering Democrat. My granddad was a Democrat, my parents were Democrats. But after voting (once) for Jimmah Carter, I am now an Independent who will be voting for Bush.

My husband served in Viet Nam and he, too, came home to be treated like a pariah, thanks to the likes of Hanoi Jane and JOhn KErry. I wouldn't vote for Kerry no matter if he was the only person on the ballot (heaven forbid).

is anyone really voting for Bush or are they just voting along party lines? The only person I've ever really heard say anything good about Bush himself is Dennis Prager. Personally, I like the guy, but I really don't think he'd have accomplished alot of what he's done without the family name. Much less become president.

Charles, you're somewhat in the position of Alice talking to the Red Queen (and who would that be?).

'Everything was happening so oddly that she didn't feel a bit surprised at finding the Red Queen and the White Queen sitting close to her, one on each side: she would have liked very much to ask them how they came there, but she feared it would not be quite civil. However, there would be no harm, she thought, in asking if the game was over. "Please, would you tell me---" she began, looking timidly at the Red Queen.

"Speak when you're spoken to!" the Red Queen sharply interrupted her.

"But if everybody obeyed that rule," said Alice, who was always ready for a little argument, "and if you only spoke when you were spoken to, and the other person always waited for you to begin, you see nobody would ever say anything, so that---"

"Ridiculous!" cried the Queen. "Why, don't you see, child---" here she broke off with a frown, and after thinking for a minute, suddenly changed the subject of the conversation. "What do you mean by 'If you really are a Queen'? What right have you to call yourself so? You can't be a Queen, you know, till you've passed the proper examination.[!] And the sooner we begin it, the better."

"I only said `if'!" poor Alice pleaded in a piteous tone.

The two Queens looked at each other, and the Red Queen remarked, with a little shudder, "She says she only said 'if'---"

"But she said a great deal more than that!" the White Queen moaned, wringing her hands. "Oh, ever so much more than that!"

"So you did, you know," the Red Queen said to Alice. "Always speak the truth--think before you speak--and write it down afterwards."

"I'm sure I didn't mean---" Alice was beginning, but the Red Queen interrupted.

"That's just what I complain of! You should have meant! What do you suppose is the use of a child without any meaning? Even a joke should have some meaning--and a chiId's more important than a joke, I hope. You couldn't deny that, even if you tried with both hands."

"I don't deny things with my hands," Alice objected.

"Nobody said you did," said the Red Queen, "I said you couldn't if you tried."

"She's in that state of mind," said the White Queen, "that she wants to deny something--only she doesn't know what to deny!"

"A nasty, vicious temper," the Red Queen remarked; and then there was an uncomfortable silence for a minute or two.'

--Sound familiar?

is anyone really voting for Bush or are they just voting along party lines?

I guess lester has trouble with reading comprehension--or he simply skipped over Charles's initial post plus most of the subsequent comments.

Sad, really.

Me too. I was a Democrat and would still be one if they hadn't marginalized pro-lifers like me, sold out to the trial lawyers and teacher's unions and french kissed every terrorist they laid could lay their hands on.

Wouldn't it be nice if there was a party that would really look out for the average wager earner and not spend all our money on pork and perks? I can dream - but I'll never see it.

Ellen, I understand, I voted for Reagan once but other than that I've voted democratic. Now, I'll vote Bush. Any party that would celebrate a bigot and a rabble rousing phony reverend like Al Sharpton and the rest of the Afro-mafia has lost my vote for good!

lester1/2jr 9/18/2004 04:09PM PST
is anyone really voting for Bush or are they just voting along party lines?

Yea, I like Pres. Bush plenty...a good wartime leader, just what we need now. You can believe what he says, which is very important to me. I'd consider voting for a Dem. but they won't run one with any credibility, or vision.

cba- reagan didn't get where he was on his name. neither did Clinton and those are like the two biggest presidents of my lifetime, love them or hate them. It's no coincidence they were so influential and also self made. Again, I generally like Bush. But I kind of like him for what's NOT there. what IS there? LIke everyone says Kerry needs to run on his record. What was Bushes record pre-2000? I don't remember him being told to talk about being governor of Texas.

Lester -- As I recall -- Bush's record as governor of Texas was precisely what he did run on in 2000.

[Link: www.allahpundit.com...]

18 Sept. 6:37 PM entry. Per LA Times, turns out CBS didn't have the documents for six weeks; they had them about five days before going to air. this is AFTER Max Cleland advised Burkett to give his info to the Kerry campaign, and after Burkett posted online that he had done so.

Allah has a lot more detail but the timeline works like this: On 8/13 Burkett posts that he has no documentation on Bush. In "mid-August" (per WaPo) he contacts Cleland -- and Cleland must have known who he was, since he took the call -- and Cleland steers Burkett directly to the Kerry campaign. Burkett himself asserts he had given the information to the Kerry campaign by 8/21, per the NYTimes. CBS gets the forged memos on 9/3. [NOT "six weeks earlier," as previously reported.] CBS rush-consults doc experts, asking them if they'll work over Labor Day weekend. They do, but as you already know, do not give CBS the answer they want. Nevertheless, they rush to air.

Does this prove the Kerry campaign gave CBS the documents? Not directly. But it certainly explains CBS's willingness to fall on its sword. Do you think CBS would hesitate a nanosecond to burn a crazy old coot to protect Dan Rather and the Black Rock? Neither do I. But they would to hide their political perfidity.

Wish I could say I put it together, but credit where it's due: All Praise to Allah, the all-knowing.

#80 song_and_dance_man

Hey! When you're headed down the 91 and hit the green river exit, watch for the billboard with the giant 2 on it. Wink and say hi! That's me! ;O)
Too bad I can't plaster a big W on it for a a couple of weeks, but I would lose business because it would make no sense :oP

is anyone really voting for Bush or are they just voting along party lines?

Your vacuousness is mind-numbing.

#84 zulubaby:
As is his total inability to read. I was going to count how many "I'm a registered Democrat" and "I've always voted Democrat until now" posts there were (and that's not counting Charles's intro) but I decided he wasn't worth the time I would waste.

cba, like all trolls, lester^1/2wit is not here for debate or information.

song_and_dance_man, maybe my soul went numb there for a minute.

#87 zulubaby:
They're usually here to try to prove how much smarter and better informed they are than the rest of us slobs.

What they actually prove is the complete reverse.

If anyone thought that the MSM wasn't biased, this example is a wake up call. The liberal assumption is that conservatives and those "rascally Republicans" are up to their dirty tricks. It's a conspiracy to get Dan Rather.

Never mind that Dan Rather presented fake documents and ignored his so-called "experts" in order to do a hatchet job on President Bush. It's all the fault of Buckethead, who must be an Republican operative. It's a conspiracy.

Any facts that don't meet with the MSM's liberal bias are omitted. Liberal reporters believe that they are being fair when they misrepresent or slant their reporting, for it conforms to their foundational presuppositions. It's true because I think it's true. The MSM is simply incapable of presenting the truth when it contradictions their core liberal beliefs. It's who they are.

The only viable solution, which many have discovered, is to abandon the MSM as the primary source for news. Talk radio, cable news, and the internet are "God-sends" for a democracy.

#78 lester1/2jr 9/18/2004 04:25PM PST

What was Bushes record pre-2000? I don't remember him being told to talk about being governor of Texas.

Yea, they had already covered it in the 2000 election. He was elected governor of Texas during the Republican sweep. The majority opinion here was that Clinton was slime. Ann Richards (tough lady) sealed her doom by supporting Clinton. As a side note, in Arkansas, the state removed all the highway signs that said, "Birthplace of Clinton".

Bush was endorsed by Bob Bullock (a real famous Democrat in Texas), and that was very unheard of at the time. Bush crossed party lines and worked with both parties while governor. It is a whole new ball of wax with party politics in DC since not all the Democrats are as conservative compared to those found back thn in Texas.

I do not agree with everything Bush states, but I agree with most of his strategy. I know that he does what he says. He admits mistakes. He goes out of his way to rally people in bad situations. He does not get wishy-washy on his opinion. He makes tough decisions and stands by them. He is not afraid to express an idea that not everyone will agree with. He also pushes for individual choice and more control of issues at the local level.

#73 Lady of Shalott (ylreveb)
Yes, Yes that is it!! I've been trying for weeks to figure out what this election reminded me of and you are spot on! It is Through the Looking Glass all the way.
Thanks for the clarity. I believe I shall lie down now as I think I may prick my finger in a moment.

#83 song_and_dance_man:

Is opposed to the radical individualists attempt to silence only voice of the Christian.

I consider myself an individualist. I would NEVER apply the term "individualist" to ANY kind of control freaks, "radical" or otherwise, who attempt to silence ANY others or violate ANY of their rights. ALL such critters are various flavors of collectivists.

My daddy was a "Buckhead Boy" back in the Forties. Mother said his mother would march into the poolroom and come out again, towing Dad by his ear. They'd smoke Camel nons, rolled up in their T-shirt sleeves, and drink beer and play pool.

Now Buckhead has become too fancy-pants. Unrecognizable from what I remember of it in the Sixties.

LaLa Times, yoo-hoo! Proof is proof and facts are facts! end of sermon.

Here's a toy for Lester Lackwit.

Linky!

If you Google 'Buckhead' and read 'definition' you get:
buckhead, GA (town, FIPS 11672)
Location: 33.56824 N, 83.36373 W
Population (1990): 176 (73 housing units)
Area: 2.1 sq km (land), 0.0 sq km (water)
Zip code(s): 30625

Could this be a GA connection or just an unexplained coincidence?

So...ummm...Charles, now that you are supporting Bush does that mean you've come over to the light and away from the darkness called 'the Democrats"?

1/ evidence

I know something about computers too.
When I looked at the CBS story I said this reminds me of my computer programming classes in high school, where I learned how to program on punch cards.

What few facts they had ( if any) would fit on a very small piece of paper. Plus there were holes punched all through the story.

2/ Conspiracy:

Next I considered Marcel Matley, the CBS expert.
Marcel-- what the hell does that mean??

Did some research at dictionary.com

Seems that the original Marcel was some French hairdresser that invented some kind of poofy hairdo.

Now check out the hairdos on Johnie K. and Johnie E.

Whose behind the whole thing?

Did they think we were stupid??

French hairdressers and girlie-men.

3/ As for me--

Voted straight Democratic ticket in every election since Mc Govern- right up until the 2002 election.
You think Zell Miller was angry?? Try talkin' to me.

song and dance

what does all that mean in #99 and #100. maybe I,m dense right now, but really don't get your point.

What the major news media don't get is that the blogosphere displays the power of aggregate knowledge. Jonathan Last's column illustrated that brilliantly. The national press corps is still an ingrown club that thinks it's the whole world.

While I was gone, I must have missed the coining of a new acronym. I confess ignorance and ask any kind person here: What does MSM stand for? Thanks.

I’ve now spoken to at least a dozen newspapers, and had my words quoted many times. In every conversation I’ve made sure to point out that I’ve voted Democratic my whole life, but that I now support President Bush. Not one of these papers thought this was noteworthy enough to print

Not only that, they keep referring to you as a "conservative." Even a "musician-turned-conservative." (Just think about the number of unexamined assumptions behind that 3-word phrase . . . )

Glenn wrote a post a while back where he noted that he keeps getting called a conservative too, even though he's a mildly libertarian socially liberal.

"Bush is the greatest defender of liberal values since Roosevelt!"

I must confess that this is the first time that I have heard this statement, which I find strange for two reasons, and the first is that I never considered Roosevelt to be much of a defendant for liberal values.

But I have an open mind, so please explain why you think that Bush is a defender of liberal values? I don't want to get ahead of myself, but don't you think requiring "loyalty oaths" at his campaign appearances is somewhat illiberal?

But I have an open mind ...

That's for sure. Lots of room in there.

The Main Stream Media is practically begging for a meltdown.

So be it.

#108 girlieman: This is about foreign policy. Imagine the United Nations being handed over responsibility for post-WWII Germany. Probably I would have been born in some refugee camp.

BTW - Can you explain the difference between "don't be a chickenhawk" and "don't be economic girlieman"?

Possible grounds for FCC involvement?

1. Use of forged documents.

2. Using forged documents to influence a presidential election.

3. Gross and uncorrected misrepresentation of statements and/or qualifications of individual "experts" that formed basis of story.

4. Promulgation of negative attacks by CBS on a presidential candidate during the 2 months (which started 9/2) when such attacks were to be banned.

5. Becoming a co-conspirator with a political campaign in promulgating a fraud.

IMHO, if the FCC states that they will get involved in any way to investigate before the election, it'll be a black eye for CBS and by association, the Kerry campaign. Even if the FCC states before the election that there is no case to bring fraud charges, or that a preliminary investigation is inconclusive, the odor of scandal will cling to CBS and Kerry.

song and dance man -

gay marriage? I'm also opposed to it. I believe in civil unions because basically, I feel if people buy into the system then they should be a part of it. It's their money. But Kerry and Edwards AND Cheney believe the states should decide. I think most states will probably vote against it.

abortion- do you think Bush is going to overturn Roe v Wade? If not why would you use that in your decision? never understood that.

trial lawyers- Abe Lincoln was a trail lawyer. You want to know why malpractice insurance is so high? Because there's a lot of malpractice! It's totally knee jerk to hate lawyers, politicians, used car salesman, etc. Besides, I think what Cheney did with Haliburton circujventing Sanctions to work with scum lile Iran and Libya is far more offensive than John Edwards, who incidentally wrote a book about his experiences as a lawyer, highlighting 4 cases and what he learned from them, But I'm sure you've all read it (I haven't yet)

93 fondu- that's interesting. thanks for the Texan perspective though I'm not sure if "admitting mistakes" is really attributable to Bush particularly via the security and reconstruction of Iraq.

98- lady shalott whatever- so it's okay for Bush to land on a ship in his little outfit but not okay for Kerry to bring up Vietnam. got it