Totally apostate

disgusting.

disgusting!

Just as bad as Hybells sharing his pulpit with an imman after the 9/11 trying to convince us that islam is the religion of peace.

I have a question for Khatami: "Who is John Galt?"

Iranian "tolerance" means imprisoning you before raping and beating you to death for free expression, btw.

And that's what they do to Canadians.

If this doesn't illustrate the unconquerable divide between Individualists and Communists in this country and what each stands for, then nothing will.

Filthy, stinking, cowardly Communists in the DNC.

Yeah, lots of blah blah American foreign policy...blah blah support for Jews...blah blah blah...UN...blah blah...its all America's fault...

Harvard deadheads will love it.

Friggin idiots. His presence on American soil offends me. I call for a fatwa (sp?) against this pig of a man.

/FT

AAArghhh!

We can cooperate by not struggling so much as they saw through our necks. It makes their job so much harder...

Can I put a bounty on a man's head?

/FT

Episcopal no more. Jew hating bunch of elitist. Barfff. Let them keep that fat turbaned bastard as one of their own, he fits right in.

National Cathedral?
Maybe he'll get splashed with holy water and wither up like Dracula, or the Wicked Witch of the West.

JWM

Maybe God will strike him down in a good ole display of Old Testament hands on teachin'.

That would be poetic.

This is an April Fool's prank, right? Please tell me I've been asleep since September 2006.

Who dreamed this one up?

In one of the most disgraceful displays ever on American soil, the Ayatollah Mohammad Khatami will be speaking at the Washington National Cathedral in a little less than one hour

So far Charles you right...But America can sink lower...

Diplomats at the United Nations were sent into disarray yesterday when President Ahmadinejad of Iran declared that he intended to attend the General Assembly of the world body on September 19 and to debate his country's nuclear program with President Bush, who is due to address the Assembly that day.

I really hate thought that I had gone as far into the Twilight Zone as one could without losing ones mind...But I was wrong.

There'd better be protesters.

You just know the Secert Service guys are thinking, "I wish I could" but displine will rule the day.

How the F*ck did this piece of debris get a visa? That should have never happen, Foggy Bottom strikes again.

We do not presume to come to this thy Table, O merciful Lord,
trusting in our own righteouness,
but in they manifold and great mercies.
We are not worthy so much as to gather up the crumbs under thy Table.

But thou art the same Lord, whose property is always to have mercy;...

The episcopal church dropped the prayer of Humble Access in 1982. That was a mistake.

storagemanager 9/7/2006 03:58PM PDT

In one of the most disgraceful displays ever on American soil, the Ayatollah Mohammad Khatami will be speaking at the Washington National Cathedral in a little less than one hour
So far Charles your right...But America can sink lower...
Diplomats at the United Nations were sent into disarray yesterday when President Ahmadinejad of Iran declared that he intended to attend the General Assembly of the world body on September 19 and to debate his country's nuclear program with President Bush, who is due to address the Assembly that day.
I really hatehad thought that I had gone as far into the Twilight Zone as one could without losing ones mind...But I was wrong ...Darn.

#12 flyover_templar

Can I put a bounty on a man's head?

You could, but unfortunately we are NOT a lawless nor bloodthirsty nation and all that the result would be is to get *you* in trouble. I'm sure we'll have Security pretty tight around this worthless mouth-breather. Pity. We can dream, can't we?

Guess we can't go down that road without anarchy taking over...

JAFLW

#20 DRAT!

but in

thy

manifold and great mercies..

PIMF

The faux moderate, Islamic supremacist mullah will be talking about how Islam can cooperate with Christianity and Judaism in “the peace dhimmitude process.”

Fixed it for you.

WASHINGTON—Felice D. Gaer, chair of the U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom (USCIRF), an independent, bipartisan federal agency, today called on the National Cathedral to ensure that former Iranian President Mohammad Khatami is questioned about his own record on human rights and religious freedom when he speaks at the National Cathedral Sept. 7.

In a letter to Reverend Canon John Peterson of the National Cathedral’s Center for Global Justice and Reconciliation (full text below), Gaer pointed out the irony of inviting Mr. Khatami to speak on the role of the Abrahamic faiths in the peace process when, in his own country, Mr. Khatami presided as President while religious minorities—including Jews, Christians, Sunni and Sufi Muslims, Baha’is, dissident Shia Muslims, and others—faced systematic harassment, discrimination, imprisonment, torture, and even execution based on their religious beliefs.

Commissioner Gaer called for Mr. Khatami to be questioned openly and asked whether the Cathedral forum will ensure that Mr. Khatami is asked pressing questions about cultural tolerance, dialogue, and respect for human rights in his own country.

Mr. Khatami is the highest-ranking Iranian official to be granted a visa to the United States since the 1979 Iranian Revolution.

The full text of the letter follows:
[Link: www.uscirf.gov...]

Ladies and Gentlemen, God has left the building.

Why are our Enemys allowed on American soil?...Right is Wrong...Left is Right...The world is upside down.

As angry as I am over this, remember that we hosted Nikita Krushchev at the height of the Cold War. I can still remember footage of him banging his shoe at the UN.

JWM

The Washington National Cathedral bills itself as “a national house of prayer for all people”. I wonder how long before it’s turned into a mosque?

No really, Canadians. Doctor: Canadian reporter beaten, raped in Iran. Khatami did suggest appointing some Iranian bureaucrats to whitewash the murder though. So he's got that going for him, which isn't much.

TORONTO (AP) — A Canadian photojournalist was beaten, tortured and raped before she died two years ago while in custody in Iran, a former Iranian army doctor who examined her said Thursday.
Shahram Azam said he examined Zahra Kazemi, a 54-year-old Canadian freelance journalist of Iranian origin, in a military hospital in Tehran on June 26, 2003, and noticed horrific injuries to her entire body that could only have been caused by torture and rape. It was just days after she was arrested for taking photographs outside a Tehran prison during student-led protests against the ruling theocracy.

Khatami Speaks at Washington National Cathedral Tonight

Dear President Bush...No Disrepect...But this is proof...FREEDOM IS NOT ON THE MARCH...AND THE EVIL ONES ARE NOT ON THE RUN.

Washington National Cathedral. Now Islam's 5th holiest place.

Well, it's not like Episcopalians are Christians or anything (although the 1928 BCP hints they once were). There are, however, a few Anglicans left with a conscience and in fairness, 3 current Episcopal bishops fought this bitterly.

Booga Booga! to you, Charles.

I hope no living being was in your presence as you typed this post. There's probably spittle flying everywhere.

Khatama isn't Ahminajehid. Never has been, never will be. And all of your fulminations won't make it so.

#33 Fine Mess: Episcopalians are much truer to the word of Christ than Chistianist talibaptists like you. The three dioceses you mention aren't in revolt about the gays, they're in revolt about women being ordained. I say go join the Catholics if you want to be that un-Christian as to claim women can't administer sacraments or preach the word of God.

#14 jwm 9/7/2006 03:56PM PDT
National Cathedral?
Maybe he'll get splashed with holy water and wither up like Dracula, or the Wicked Witch of the West.

JWM

Wont work because;

#26 Jauhara al Kafirah 9/7/2006 04:02PM PDT
Ladies and Gentlemen, God has left the building.

I think we are getting the right idea, here.

nodroG,

So... let me get this straight:

You are saying that Khatami and Ahminajehid are two different people.

Hmmm...

LGF history was made today. nodroG's actually right. All those people who said they were actually the same person were wrong. (Don't recall who said that, but they are wrong).

They're both lunatics bent on destroying us, but they are two different people.

Khatama isn't Ahminajehid. Never has been, never will be. And all of your fulminations won't make it so.

That doesn't undo the fact that he's an Islamic-fascist piece of shit though, does it? He represents our sworn enemy, period. I'd strike him in a NY DC minute were the opportunity available to me. We're at war, and he paints himself to his people as a warrior. Unlike you, I'm more than willing to take him at his word and treat him as he imagines himself to be.

#34 Gordo

I hope no living being was in your presence as you typed this post. There's probably spittle flying everywhere.

How childishly apropos that you should make a comment like that! Ironically, I've always pictured you hunched over your mom's computer, drooling uncontrollably all over the Saran-wrapped keyboard, pecking at the keys with the top of your pointy head!

An abomination that may cause Desolation.

Actually, the TRUE ABOMINATION will take place when Ahmadi-Nejad lands in NYC next week. Just in time for the 5 year 9/11 Anniversary.

Anyone ever read: Tea with Terrorists? Perhaps Ahmadi-Nejad takes the place of Arafart at the UN when Arafart blows himself up with a suicide belt, killing 3/4 of the American political leaders, during a speech.

/islam sucks, ya know?

Khatami, a terrorist , in a our National Cathedral. Hard to take. Harvard sure, hell he's among friends there. Harvard's Islamist, their totalitarian de jour. Hell Harvard would love for bin Laden to show.

Ahmadinejad's coming soon, to speak with his UN collaborators in NYC. Shit he'll probably spit in sacred hole in the ground FKA World Trade Center.

These two are bound and determined to have a reenactment of the Nagasaki and Hiroshima clouds. The time and places have yet to be determined.

But rumor has it, Tel Aviv and/or Washington D.C. OR Tehran and/or Bandar Abbas, whichever combination comes first...and I'm betting their mouths will overload their asses and 'they' pull the trigger, first.

Boycott, anyone?

Events like this are designed to create an illusion among religious folks that 'we are all the same, deep-down.' Unfortunately, some will be deceived by these types of motions, because most true Christians, indeed almost all Americans, are good people who tend to believe the best about others. They have been taught not to judge, not to be disrespectful of another's religion, and to see the good in people. We are an optimistic group, and sometimes cannot see the evil in front of us until we are knifed in the back. Our generous nature may be contributing to our own downfall.

Any chance he's going to be converted? Maybe they'll corner him in the Resserection Chapel and do the deed.

#44 mama winger

Our generous nature may be contributing to our own downfall.

When you're generous to the enemy, it's a cinch.

nodrog: I was baptized EPISCOPALIAN in 1952. Confirmed EPISCOPALIAN in 1963. My EPISCOPALIAN parents died in unbelief and wouldn't have known the Holy Spirit if He kicked their asses because they were NEVER Christians, just EPISCOPALIANS. And I know more about being EPISCOPALIAN than you'll ever know.

The three dioceses I spoke of are NOT network dioceses, REPEAT, they are NOT Network dioceses (even revisionist bishops are capable of determining right from wrong although few of them do) but I wouldn't expect a know-it-all troll like you to know what the hell you're talking about.

After he speaks at the National Cathedral Mosque, it will become the 24838th holiest site in Islam.

But the democratically elected leader of an ally can't set foot on US soil (not even Guam!). Something is very wrong in this administration:

Press reports from Taiwan also stated that the Bush administration has rejected a request from Taipei to allow Taiwanese leader Chen Shui-bian to make a transit stop on the U.S. territory of Guam during an upcoming South Pacific visit.

Well, it's not like Episcopalians are Christians or anything

Fine Mess, you took the words right out of my mouth. This is the same denomination which spawned the odious former Bishop John Shelby Spong who made a career out of denying every doctrine of the Christian faith. This didn't stop him from being the darling of the apostate Episcopal/Anglican church. These 'christians' are preparing the way for a future one-world religion. This used to be written off as the stuff of conspiracy nuts, but we can see it happening before our eyes.

The only reason to hate Khatami as much as you hate Ahminajehid is if you think all of Islam is a bunch of evil scum, indistinguishable from each other, and the whole religion must be eradicated and its adherents killed or converted.

I know many LGF irregulars think that. Now I know that Charles does too.

Khatami sets 'em up, Ammadiniwhatever knocks'em down. Moderate mouthpiece.

Gee, I shouldn't expect much but appeasement and self hate from any place that has a center for Global Justice and Reconciliation.

The two terms above were invented by liberal idiots that were traumatized by all the starving kids shown on TV by Sally Struthers. They absolutely can't stand the guilt of being successful and having money (it truly is a crime).

The bounty call is a reference to Slapshot, and only a jest [relaaax FBI guys]. Besides, a much better target will be presenting itself to the UN, no?

Umm anyone see that movie with George Clooney a few years back about the UN diplomat smuggling in a nuke to blow up the UN? How about dirty bomb material for jihadis?

Tonight I shall dream of the IDF destroying the UN headquarters during Amadinejad's visit.

/FT

35 Gordon 9/7/2006 04:15PM PDT

#33 Fine Mess: Episcopalians are much truer to the word of Christ than Chistianist talibaptists like you. The three dioceses you mention aren't in revolt about the gays, they're in revolt about women being ordained. I say go join the Catholics if you want to be that un-Christian as to claim women can't administer sacraments or preach the word of God.

Since you seem to be a fine New Testament scholar, please give me the NT basis, not some BS committee re-write, for gays and women in the clergy.

.

#50 deja vu: You can take your Christianist Talibaptist slandering of the Episcopal Church and stick it where the Sun never shines.

Dear Gordo:

I will retract any statements about Mr. Khatami if fully denounces Islamic terror. He'll also have to bend over, kisse his own ass, then crawl back to the airport on his hands and knees begging the Western world for forgiveness for the crimes Islam has perpetuated against it.

I will also eat my shoes.

-shouldnt you be trying to pay reparations or helping illegals across the border or something?

Toodles--FT

#53 BenZazharia: No, YOU are the one who has to prove that your misognynistic, homophobic ravings are justified by the New Testament.

And stick to the words of Jesus himself, not Paul. Paul's condemnation of homosexuality had to do with the Greek practice of homosexual pedophilia, not a blanket condemnation.

Fuck you, Gordon. Why don't you go to DC and kiss that piece of shit's ass? You and he are on the same side--the anti-American, anti-democracy, anti-peace side. You have no understanding of history, no understanding of the horrific abuses that take place EVERY SINGLE place on the globe where Islam holds sway, and no ability to grasp the war between world views that is taking place during our very lifetime. Ignorant fucks like you are every bit as dangerous as the Islamofascists that seek to kill us because you keep getting your ignorant asses in the way of the work that needs to be done to defend our very way of life.

Fine Mess

Don't even speak/type to that little prick/prickette/eunuch. How he/she/it has managed to be here this long, is beyond me...I have a couple of theory's but...

He/she/it isn't worth your time typing.

He/she/it is the kind of person whose parents would show at my parents door, telling MY parents I had beaten the shit out of he/she/it.

Gordon

Can't wait for you to call me a Baptist.

.

It is pointless to discuss anything with Gordon. You only encourage him. As to the issue at hand, Khatama has already spoken, so we do not need Gordon's take on what the man believes. Khatama made it clear that Christians should be respectful of Muslims. That Islam is a tolerant religion. That Bush is a terrorist.That America has alienated the entire world. That Israel has no right to exist. That resistance to Islam is futile.That is it in a nutshell.(pun intentional)

No this is fun to watch, Gordo is upset.

/FT

I wonder what he will talk about.

Historical parallel: Rudolph Hess flew to Great Britain to offer "peace terms" in 1941.

the whole religion must be eradicated and its adherents killed or converted

islam is making the call. Every head that rolls and every pizza hut or plane that explodes is pushing the world to do what has to be done--eradicate it. We can eradicate islam without killing peaceful people.

2 cents

#51 Gordon

The only reason to hate Khatami as much as you hate Ahminajehid is if you think all of Islam is a bunch of evil scum, indistinguishable from each other, and the whole religion must be eradicated and its adherents killed or converted.

No, moron. The only reason to hate Khatami is because he IS part of the same regime as Ahmadinejad--that of the radical Islamist Iranian Ayatollahs who command a brutal, theocratic regime that stifles opponents and murders innocents. And that being a relative "moderate" while still being part of such a regime STILL makes you "evil scum". And if Charles thinks that, he's quite correct.

'Paul's condemnation of homosexuality had to do with the Greek practice of homosexual pedophilia, not a blanket condemnation.'

There is no basis to that conclusory statement. Most serious historians view the homosexualized view of Greek history as nonsense. Pure homosexual propaganda.

Gordon

#50 deja vu: You can take your Christianist Talibaptist slandering of the Episcopal Church and stick it where the Sun never shines.

Is that what passes for debate in your estimation? How about some facts to refute what I stated about John Shelby Spong?

You might also like to discuss why you consider the Bible to be dispensable; mainstream Episcopalians seem to be ignoring/flouting the teachings of Jesus whereas the Baptists do not. How is this a problem?

44 mama winger 9/7/2006 04:29PM PDT
Events like this are designed to create an illusion among religious folks that 'we are all the same, deep-down.' Unfortunately, some will be deceived by these types of motions, because most true Christians, indeed almost all Americans, are good people who tend to believe the best about others. They have been taught not to judge, not to be disrespectful of another's religion, and to see the good in people. We are an optimistic group, and sometimes cannot see the evil in front of us until we are knifed in the back. Our generous nature may be contributing to our own downfall

I am not sure whether I am agreeing or disagreeing with you, Mamma, so I will just say the following and invite your comments.

Romans Chapter 3 vs 9-18 What shall we conclude then? Are we any better? Not at all! We have already made the charge that Jews and Gentiles alike are all under sin. As it is written:
"There is no one righteous, not even one;
11there is no one who understands,
no one who seeks God.
All have turned away,
they have together become worthless;
there is no one who does good,
not even one."
"Their throats are open graves;
their tongues practice deceit."
"The poison of vipers is on their lips."
"Their mouths are full of cursing and bitterness."
"Their feet are swift to shed blood;
ruin and misery mark their ways,
and the way of peace they do not know."
"There is no fear of God before their eyes."

Mankinds problem is that we stand as judge and jury over our own fallen condition, and conclude, when we compare ourselves the person who is "worse" than us that we are "good".

Before the Creator we are nothing, we have been condemned, yet He loves us enough to send His only Son to take the rap for us, and put us right before Him that we may be saved to Glory.

We have to look at sinful man for what he is and not try to whitewash him with views of tolerance and love. Yes, we should grieve for the lost and, even, those whom we are called to judge as evil (Matt 7:1-6)but we should not tolerate it in our own house especially in the Lord's house.

Q: Who allowed this terrorist/muslim in the country?

A: Bush/State dept.

Why?

67 The flying Kiwi ...We have to look at sinful man for what he is and not try to whitewash him with views of tolerance and love. Yes, we should grieve for the lost and, even, those whom we are called to judge as evil (Matt 7:1-6)but we should not tolerate it in our own house especially in the Lord's house. Amen

#56 ordong

2 Tim 3:16 "all scripture is GOD breathed.."NIV

If you were a christian , you would know that.

Let me repeat from the other thread:

There is no drog but nodroG, And Gordon is his messenger.

/Spoof on Saudi national motto.

#51 Gordon

The only reason to hate Khatami...

Glaring error there.

How about being the president of a totalitarian theocracy? The notion that he is a reformer is totally false; I even thought he was somewhat 'moderate' not long ago. While he may not be as raging as Bin Laden or Ahmadinejad, he supports the fundamental (supremecist) doctrines of Islamism or Islamic fascism and he has stated his views on these matters enough times. As Ledeen summarized it:

Khatami is very much a member of the clerical fascist regime. He was the empty vessel into which the Iranian people poured their dreams of freedom when they elected him; now he couldn’t win an election for dog catcher. He presided over brutal repression, including the grisly murders of the Forouhars in 1978 and the mass murders and arrests of student demonstrators a year later.

[Link: article.nationalreview.com...]

And by the way, have you noticed that the GOP has turned away from Katherine Harris and her idiotic comments? It's your fantasy that she is representive of the right, unlike the case of tremendous support the super-nutter Lamont received from the DNC and the left. Her opinions about "secular laws" are absurd and most on the right easily acknowledge that.

I agree: Pres. Bush must have OK'd this. Don't play poker with the man...I'm just sayin'.

Well, since I have been beavering away at my last post I see Gordon has come with some different slants on the New Testament, which is, in fact, a continuation of the Old Testament. There is a wonderful saying which goes, "In the Old concealed, in the New revealed"

Gordon, get a sound version of the Bible, an LXX translation New American or New KJ, and study and meditate on it. Please. Homosexuality in any form whether between man and man or woman and woman, is an abomination before The Lord. You had better believe it!

#70 Missouri Boy 9/7/2006 04:50PM PDT
#56 ordong

2 Tim 3:16 "all scripture is GOD breathed.."NIV

If you were a christian , you would know that

If I might add...Matthew 4:1-4...1Then Jesus was led by the Spirit into the desert to be tempted by the devil. 2After fasting forty days and forty nights, he was hungry. 3The tempter came to him and said, "If you are the Son of God, tell these stones to become bread."
4Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.'[a]"

At the time Jesus said that...There was no new testament...every word of God.

The Flying Kiwi and Missouri Boy

Well said!

56 Gordon

To start, I was cordial and you were not.

Next

Mat 5:17-20

"Do not think that I came to abolish the Torah or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish, but to fulfill.

"Truly I say to you, until Heaven and Earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass away from the Torah, until all is accomplished.
All has not been accomplished, that takes care of if it is still in force.

"Whoever then shall break one of these commandments, the least, and shall teach others to do so, he shall be called least in the Kingdom of Heaven. But whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the Kingdom of Heaven.

"For I say to you, that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the scribes and Pharisees, you shall by no means enter into the Kingdom of Heaven.

He just endorsed Torah and the Prophets, under which all the things you endorse, or at least are sympathetic to, are prohibited.

.
Hardly got the post up before he called me a Baptist. LOL,LOL

How very sad...

I was honored to sing in the National Cathedral this past June, and the setting was so lovely and serene.

I'm deeply disturbed and disappointed that a man who harbors such hate in his heart for his fellow (non mulim) man will be permitted to speak in one of our precious cathedrals.

#77 BenZacharia

Well, now we know where you stand. You support to the letter all of the minute details of Deuteronomy, Numbers, and Leviticus - the books that Mohammed borrowed from to come up with some of his more ridiculous and cruel passages in the Koran.

Thanks for clarifying things.

#51 Guess who?

The only reason to hate Khatami as much as you hate Ahminajehid

Is that both were hand-picked by the theocratic, medieval, and sociopathic mullahs on the Guardian Council?

Let's look at the board.

That's up there!

#35 Gordon

I say go join the Catholics if you want to be that un-Christian...

The hilarious part is that you try to tell other people they are bigots. ROFL.

Khatami's speech is just a Kumbaya minute for the Episcopalian elite. Khatami will then go to Harvard for another Kumbaya moment with the Wasp elite. Lots of meaningless talk about dialogue, mutual repsect, the commonality of the Abrahamic faiths (and some cocktail hour anti-semitism, I know Episcopalians).

The only reason to hate Khatami as much as you hate Ahminajehid

Is that he pushed the Iranian nuclear bomb program while he was in office?

The only reason to hate Khatami as much as you hate Ahminajehid

Is due to the fact a smooth salesman for poison is actually more dangerous than an honest broker like Ahmadinejad?

The only reason to hate Khatami as much as you hate Ahminajehid

Is the fact he caused reformers to come forward, blow their covers, and they were never heard from again?

I'm having trouble with "only." Someone is lacking imagination, and it's not me.

I am worse than a Baptist, I am an evangelical Christian...so kiss it, Gordon. We are of mainly Scots-Irish mountaineer blood and not particularily peace-loving in that we will fight for our beliefs. Check out our all-time favorites, Pres. Andrew Jackson and Stonewall Jackson and you will see what I mean. That is my heritage. None of that pissy-pants, feel-good, touch-feely crap for us. Nosiree Bob!

What in the hell is wrong with our "State Department"?

I am so pissed they let this terrorist piece of crap into our country. They kept my wife (then fiancée), out of the US for 2 months as she was (legally) immigrating, waiting for her fingerprints to go through the system. I drove home with our daughter from the US embassy in Ciudad Juarez to San Diego, while I had to put her on a midnight bus to Tijuana. The State Department didn’t ever care we had a 2 year old daughter together.

If it wasn’t for my Congressman, she would have been there for 4 months; he negotiated 2 months after pulling some strings. Needless to say…… even though he’s a Demonrat, I vote for him.

79 Gordon 9/7/2006 05:00PM PDT

#77 BenZacharia

Well, now we know where you stand. You support to the letter all of the minute details of Deuteronomy, Numbers, and Leviticus - the books that Mohammed borrowed from to come up with some of his more ridiculous and cruel passages in the Koran.

Thanks for clarifying things.

Well you disingenuous piece of sh1t, you said you wanted quotes from Jesus only, I gave them to you now you attribute them to me. So much for give and take.

And yes all the laws, commandments, decress, statutes and precepts that can be performed are to be performed.

As a koran scholar please post all the things taken in context and without distortion in the koran lifted from, or attributed to, the TENACH.

.

#67 The Flying Kiwi

Mankinds problem is that we stand as judge and jury over our own fallen condition, and conclude, when we compare ourselves the person who is "worse" than us that we are "good".

To sit in judgement of others as "evil" and ourselves as "good" is not the only way to describe the situation we find ourselves in.

Drug addiction (to take an easy and extreme example) may not make a person "evil", but it certainly is an indicator of a life that is likely to be less succesful by every measure we can come up with. It is not even a good escape from pain.

Islamic culture is less severe than many "pre-technological" cultures ( or whatever the currently PC term is), but it has not shown itself to be capable of progress (see itjahid).

Unlike the Yanomamo or some other tribe, the Muslims have found themselves atop the world's supply of oil (to the extent it can be said to be "the world's"). The wealth that has brought them has resuscitated an otherwise limited culture of the sword that was met and defeated centuries ago.

It is not a matter of evil. They do not give us the choice of co-existence. By their doctrine it is them or us. For a lot of reasons, both personal and rational, I choose "us".

Nodrog: You are an (_*_)

You always have been and always will be. You are also a flamer. So, you must enjoy the flaming you are getting right now. Our own resident 'shaheed'. How speshul.

/and Allah knows best.

Gordon

BTW you ignorant ass, 'minute details', there are only 613 laws. Better check affirmative action laws if you want detail.

.

Still no answer to my post #66, Gordon? Why? Nothing to back up your claims?

#90 Deja Vu:

Shhh ... Nodrog is busy making his wudu so that he can make the evening prayer.

muhahahahahahaa

It's high time we start calling a terrorist spade a terrorist spade.

More reasons to hate Khatami as much as you hate Ahmadinejad. This stuff writes itself.

I have no tolerance for Khatami or HARVARD.
The can both BITE ME.

I am completely outraged! My head feels like it's going to explode. I need to know all the folks involved in letting this piece of dung into my Country and then I need the administration to give me ONE good reason, (I mean real good) why this was allowed. And I want to know right now! Oh, and by the way, Gordon, your stupidity is showing. Man, I can't stand stupid people.

#91 Allah al fubar
LOL! Insensitive of me to distract him like that ...

"We also note that the Cathedral’s press release mentions Mr. Khatami’s call for a “dialogue of civilizations.”

So what's he doing talking?

Appalling is correct.

#67 The flying Kiwi:

What a crock. You might as well be a Muslim.

buzzsawmonkey

That is why I stated, 'in context and without distortion'. Every righteous knowledgable person is able to formulate halacha consistant with TENACH. I lean towards Karaite thinking, mostly, concerning Talmud and tradition, TENACH first then usefull insight from other scholars. IMO Mishna and Gemara is not closed.

.

Gordon

I responded promptly and with what you asked for. You have had plenty of time to post a response, therefore I declare myself the winner by default.

.

Re; My previous post

Mod.

I declare myself winner in-fact.

Wow, as Charles noted, on the eve of 9/11, a leader from the leading sponsor of Islamic Terrorism speaking on US soil.

I firmly believe that the media, Bush haters, Conservative haters - "progressives" are guilty of conspiring with the enemy. Whether or not they are fools, or are aiding the enemy on purpose matters not.

Now we have the Democrats, the alleged "liberals", protectors of the media, Hollywood, art etc., applying pressure on ABC TV as well.

The world is upside down.

Has anyone ever taken all of nodrog's posts and done a composite to see if we can come up with just what the heck this psycho is made of?

From this thread alone - from the absolute rage - I'd think he was a gay Episcopal.

?

after this much seething from nodrog, I suggest we return to the days when the most he got was a blank stare and not an actual acknowledgement of his whacky, offensive, irrational, insane pots.

therefore...

gaze

posts. PIMF.

and the NFL is on. whooo hooo

Before the Creator we are nothing

That's a paradox wrapped in a riddle inside an enigmatic reflection of a tesseract if there ever was one.

#103 Who knows...this might be a golden opportunity, too, take him into custody.

What will the islamo-fascists do? Probably Ululate real loud for a while and shoot their guns in the air while threatening to behead us.

It gets old.

#102 Ben Z.

And I'll second that :)

Wondering if the National Cathedral is planning to have Charlie Manson give a sermon any time soon? Words of Wisdom from cold blooded killers anyone?

Pretend nothing is bolded. Too late, I know. If we're nothing to a creator then why were we created? Anyway, I've learned my lesson about trying to bring logic into relgious discussions. I don't practice my knowledge, but I've learned.

#110 Beagle

The question is, who made you screw up the font?

/Twilight zone music...

OWL

Always willing to TRY for give and take and honest dialogue, shoot I TRY it all the time with j*drool.

One chance per thread.

Among the Islamists in Iran I'd say Khatami is among the more intellectually sophisticated. I was interested to learn that he wrote a book in 1999 dealing with the synthesis of Platonic themes with Islam in the medieval Moslem political philosophers like al-Farabi. He also holds a degree in Western political philosophy. Thus he has more interest in the West and is able to communicate better than most.

None of this is to say that he doesen't believe in the Iranian revolution and its theocratic ideology - he most certainly does. Under his leadership his critics rightly point out that there was no decline of support for terrorist groups like Hezbollah, no recognition of Israel's right to exist, no end of internal repression, no slowing of Iran's nuclear program.

The conclusion one must draw is that either Khatami believed in all that and his talk of a "dialogue of civilizations" was two faced, or that he was too weak and politically irrelevant to alter the system in any fundamental way. I suppose the answer to that question is rnow rather academic.

TTFN

This is a good reminder of our loss of moral idealism. An excerpt from a recent article from the Objective Standard

Why We Are Losing Hearts and Minds
by Keith Lockitch
Posted by ARI Media at 7:35 PM

Our leaders have failed to answer the evil moral ideal of Islamic totalitarianism with a rational ideal of our own.

Five years into our "war on terror," the Iraqi insurgency is raging, with no apparent end to the new recruits eager to wage jihad against the West. Support for offensive action has faded among a disheartened American public, while the terrorists are growing in number and in boldness.

Where have our leaders gone wrong? What kind of leadership failure can demoralize a whole nation of honest, productive citizens, while leaving suicide murderers stirred to righteous action?

The power that inspires righteous action—and which, by its absence, breeds discouragement—is the power of moral idealism. What has brought us to our present state is our leaders' moral weakness in response to the jihadists' moral zeal.

99 Cato the Elder 9/7/2006 05:27PM PDT
#67 The flying Kiwi:

What a crock. You might as well be a Muslim.

Ya reckon?

You'll find out one day, oh yea who is wise in his/her on conceits.

SO, the Iranian/DNC "stick our collective finger in Bush's eye" tour is chugging thru the US. Inconveniently, the AL-Queda press corps needed more to promote Bin Ladin as a success than hew to the Liberal Left line that he had nothing to do with 9/11. How many lefties are whining privately, "WHat's their problem, don't they see we're trying to help them?"
University of Virginia is a public university and therefore, state taxpayer monies were indeed involved in inviting/hosting a major figure from an enemy state. What does the Iranian mullah think of speaking at a univeristy that is primarily (uncovered) female? Or maybe he doesn't know that.

Beagle

If we're nothing to a creator then why were we created?

I think you misunderstand the meaning. Look at what Flying Kiwi said in context:

Before the Creator we are nothing, we have been condemned, yet He loves us enough to send His only Son to take the rap for us, and put us right before Him that we may be saved to Glory.

I think he/she was meaning that in God's sight we are helpless sinners and spiritually without light. We don't care for that assessment of us so we rationalize that we're okay really, maybe have a few faults, but who doesn't? It's only when we acknowledge that God is omniscient and sees us very differently that we start to get a glimmer of understanding as to why we need a Saviour at all.

I meant "in his/her own conceits"

Must remember, preview button is my friend

And another point Cato.

Taken from later thread;

DUBAI (Reuters) - Al Qaeda’s new leader in Iraq said the country’s Sunni politicians were treacherous and warned of more attacks against U.S.-led forces there, according to an Internet audio tape posted on Thursday.

“The fire has not and will not be put out and our swords, which have been colored with your blood are thirsty for more of your rotting heads,” said the speaker, identified in the recording as Abu Hamza al-Muhajir.

You wont ever that kind of rhetoric spewing from my mouth.

OT, more or less.

Go to YouTube.com, search for "zionist" & "islam" videos. Compare & contrast. ROP, not.

The flying Kiwi:

You wont ever that kind of rhetoric spewing from my mouth.

Doubtless I won't. You seem instead to specialize in veiled threats on behalf of your god: "You'll find out one day, oh yea who is wise in his/her on conceits."

So like a Muslim. I find nothing to choose between your deity and theirs.

/and by "yea" I believe you mean "ye", you golden-tongued charmer

#122 Cato the Elder

I find nothing to choose between your deity and theirs.

For a comparison take a look at this link

Cato,

Response coming, degree yet to be ascertained.

#33 Fine Mess: Episcopalians are much truer to the word of Christ than Chistianist talibaptists like you. The three dioceses you mention aren't in revolt about the gays, they're in revolt about women being ordained. I say go join the Catholics if you want to be that un-Christian as to claim women can't administer sacraments or preach the word of God.

Gordon, this is where you and your ilk don't recognize the disconnect.

I would assume your only acquaintance with this poster is through the blog. Yet you find a way to ascerbicly opine about this person's christianity, and moral code.

People like myself who have the memory of 911, the USS Cole, Lieutenant Colonel W. Higgins, Achille Lauro, October 23, 1983, Somalia, we could go on for a long time here, find you bravery in standing up to fellow Americans neutered when a real evil sits in front of us.

Why is it, that I never hear at the least the same amount of effort that goes in this practice aimed at folks like the one discussed in this thread? Are you just as mad at the Islamic adherents in this country who have just gone to prison for slavery? Do you find it worse, that sharia declares that a rape victim must produce four witnesses for a trial? If you feel this way about the Catholics, which you have opined, where is your anger at this man being hosted, when his faith produces no females in leadership?

Name one female imam.

Not 1, not 2, not 3, but 4 witnesses. Way to really stick up women's rights globally Gordon.

You sabre rattle against people who would wear the uniform of this country while giving their life to protect your freedom of speech, while they may only have a difference of opinion?

I never, never, hear an equal amount of disdain from folks like you when Leon Klinghoffer is pushed overboard to his death. The State Department has Iran listed as the number one state sponsoring terrorism.

When will I hear the same amount rhetoric?

When Gordon?

I have no problem with your right to disagree. I have a problem when folks like you contradict yourself, and have nothing to say against the likes who wish to see the both of us dead, yet I am the only sounding the alarm.

As for that, you are a piece of shit.

You are heavy, but don't worry, we'll carry the load.

What I want to know is if he prayed there. If he prayed there, that is dangerous. He believes that where any Muslim prayers, that is now Islamic land.

No worries. Islam is a religion of peace.

Muslims like Khatami want nothing more than to be able to live side by side with their Christian and Jewish brothers and sisters.

All those guys sawing off the heads of civilians; the relentless speeches about exterminating the Jews and infidels; Medieval slaughter in the name of their satanic, barbaric, delusional religion...

All because of a yearning for peace.

You see, peace, prosperity, and co-existence are Islam's heritage.

K?

125 formercorpsman

Most excellent post. Keep in mind, Gordon is the worst form of racist: He expresses the racism of lowered expectations. He doesn't criticize the radical Islamists because he doesn't even think they are genuine human beings. This is a common feature of the leftist apologists.

To Gordon and his liberal ilk, expressing anger at Islamic terrorists would be as pointless as scolding a chimpanzee at the zoo for flinging poo at the patrons. He responds by scolding the patrons. It was all their fault.

When the war on terror finally starts to subside, and I do think it will in a decade or so, the apologist leftists will meet the same fate as Uncle Scar in the Lion King. For so long, the hyenas thought he was a friend, but they eventually figured out that he was a self-serving, condescending coward.

Everyone at State who had anything whatsoever to do with approving this stinking pile of excrement's visa ough to be fired and banned from government service for life (Any on the Whitehouse staff as well). That son of a whore is a terrorist scum-sucking maggot out of hell. I don't believe in political assassination (Root word comes from some hash-eating Persian murders, by the way), but it would be impossible for me to stifle a grin if someone managed to off that bastard while he was here.

Are they going to fumigate after he leaves the Cathedral?

Makes me see red.

/rant - deeep breaths, cleansing breaths

I am so disgusted that last week I wrote the Very Reverend Samuel T. Lloyd III informing him I will never donate another dime to the Cathedral. Sadly I had just sent in a contribution. Never again! Besides I don't like the Episcopals much any more anyway. They are almost as bad as the World Council of Churches always blamming Israel for defending themselves and that is not very Christian.

129 Hucbald

That son of a whore is a terrorist scum-sucking maggot out of hell.

Don't hold back now. Tell us how you really feel!

As for me, the biggest crime in all of this is not formatting the event as a debate. The "speech" format is way lame. And seeing as the speech is taking place in a Church, I'm sure 1/2 the people there will, by habit, be fully asleep by the end of his diatribe.

I'd rather see him debate someone like, oh how about VDH. And if VDH was busy, I would pay my own way to take that gig as would a million others. Khatami is playing the part of a door-to-door vaccuum cleaner salesman. His product sucks and costs way too much but sure enough, a few dumbass fools will buy the sales pitch.

It would a shame if he got in a horrible car accident.

#118 deja vu

I think you misunderstand the meaning.

I'm not sure what you mean.

/da-dum-ching

#51 Gordon:

The only reason to hate Khatami as much as you hate Ahminajehid is if you think all of Islam is a bunch of evil scum,

No, here are a couple more reasons: Khatami presided over the creation of Hezbollah in the first place, and he been effusive in his praise of Hezbollah. Hezbollah is a terrorist organization that seeks the destruction of Israel--and America.

Hezbollah murdered 241 U.S. Marines (plus French troops too) in Lebanon in 1983. That was the deadliest terrorist attack against Americans until 9-11.

How are THOSE reasons?

2,000 lb JDAM - middle of the Square. It would send a msg.

32 Pat

Washington National Cathedral. Now Islam's 5th holiest place.

Mohammed's horse went through a time warp and pooped as flying over it. It's The Holy Poop Sura.

mama winger 44

most true Christians... are good people who tend to believe the best about others

Most true Christians consider Mohammed a false prophet and Islam a false, demonically inspired religion.

#50 Deja vu:

What do you call a clown on a pogo stick?

Spong! Spong! Spong! Spong!

Now that khatami has spoken at the National Cathedral, will the muslims claim it as the 2147th most holy site is islam?

The ECUSA should be shamed for having this murderer in thier house of God.

The faux moderate, Islamic supremacist mullah will be talking about how Islam can cooperate with Christianity and Judaism in “the peace process.”

should i cry or laugh?
is it a tragedy or joke?

everything seems to be a bubble to misguide dhimis from real light of truth