The updates you've been doing over that last few months are terrific, keep them coming!

STOP ALL CHANGE OR WE:

1. Declare a fatwa
2. Burn your Peugeot
3. Issue veiled threats

... your choice.....

I like the new approach to the newsfeeds. Maybe I can avoid seeing the constant bodycount update AP is so fond of lately.

Ajax is better than Clorox.

...yes, I find pages reloading by themselves an annoyance...
(especially when inline media slows things down)

I have a coupon for Ajax. And on Wednesdays they double it at the Pick N Save.

This is as far as my technical skills extend. Sorry.

Upon reviewing some of the topics, I see it offers a wider array of biased news and opinion.

Nice, there's even a scince section. Too bad it's mostly global warming stories.

Charles, how about one more option for the drop-down menu: "None" or "Off". Every extra TCP connection slows down page loading. Pipelining helps some, but un-cooperative proxies can really muck it up.

I once had a cat named Ajax.

victor_yugo: that's the nice thing about Ajax -- it doesn't slow down the page load. It's an asynchronous data exchange, and has no effect on the loading of the rest of the page.

Praise the Lord, it's "Evolution Sunday"....
Christian faith in the other good book

Flocks of the Christian faithful in the US will this Sunday hold special services celebrating Charles Darwin's theory of evolution. The idea is to stand up to creationism, which claims the biblical account of creation is literally true, and which is increasingly being promoted under the guise of "intelligent design". Proponents of ID say the universe is so complex it must have been created by some unnamed designer.

Support for "Evolution Sunday" has grown 13 per cent to 530 congregations this year, from the 467 that celebrated the inaugural event last year.

Anyone here attend an evolution surmon this morning?

#10 Mandy

I once had a cat named Ajax.

Mandy and I are in the slow class. We like it here. Sometimes we get candy.

Ajax cleans like a white tornado!

It's an asynchronous data exchange,..
Really makes me feel stupid, this does. But I'm aware this is the finest site on the web/net-thing.

Ajax is--what? A scripting language like php?

/inquiring minds want to know

#6 mama winger:

AJAX is an abbreviation for "Asynchronous JavaScript And XML". In brief, it's specialized code sent in his web pages to change only what needs to be changed in a page, rather than re-loading the entire page.

For you, the benefit is seeing something new in the page, faster. For Charles, the benefit is a slightly lower load on his web server, by sending only the new stuff you want.

Request #2 for Charles: Any chance on reloading the comments area by itself, in a similar manner? If not that, the posting/comments area together?

The idea behind Ajax is to make web pages behave a bit more like desktop computer applications; i.e., change only the parts of the page that need to be changed, and do away with constant page reloading. Google Maps and Gmail are two highly visible examples of the new approach.

Exactly what LGF needs for the deep threads.

#6 mama winger

Pick N Save is pretty good. I'm a Sendik's person myself. Ever heard of them?

#11 Charles

So it opens up another TCP port, and just channels the live data?

#17 victor_yugo
That's a good idea, I bet it would save lots of bandwidth.

#12 Killgore

Flocks of the Christian faithful in the US will this Sunday hold special services celebrating Charles Darwin's theory of evolution.

Well that's just silliness. The point of Church services is to worship God. Why would they have services celebrating a book by Darwin? Why not "Little Women" for feminist month, or "Huck Finn" for Missouri History week?

Sheesh. What some people won't do to promote a personal agenda.

#19 freakagriep

Pick N Save is pretty good. I'm a Sendik's person myself. Ever heard of them?

Nope. But they sound Swedish. Which means their meat probably sucks. :)

E2M: Yep, it might be very useful in comment threads too. I'm thinking about other applications for Ajax.

#20 earth2moonbat:

Actually, without pipelining, that's happening anyway for every image, crapplet, and Flash. Pipelining allows the browser to request (some arbitrary number of) pieces of a web page from the same server, through the same TCP connection. No new handshake required.

#16 vxbush

Ajax = Asynchronous JavaScript and XML

Asynchronous - means the entire page doesn't have to load just to see some new information. (It would be great for the whole threads here).

JavaScript - The programming language used to control what goes in inside your browser.

XML - a technical format for representing data

Charles said it best: a way of gettig a browser to behave more like a "normal" desktop application (such as a spreadsheet, where there is no concept of "reload" or "refresh" as with a browser. Once it's loaded, it stays loaded).

#22 mama winger
I suspect they're mostly liberal churches, the article doesn't say which denominations were participating.

#25 victor_yugo

That was introduced in HTTP 1.1. I hacked away in the days of 1.0 and it was pretty painful having to set up and tear down a socket for every page element!

#23 mama winger

Judge for yourself!
[Link: www.sendiks.cc...]

Well, it says my browser is not Ajax compatible, so it is the business as usual for me.

#30 windybon

Which browser, out of curiosity?

#25 victor_yugo

Sometimes you can choke a port, though. I remember when the last Drudge blast made the blog essentially inaccessible, and the lounge was working just fine (if you could get in), because it was on another port.

Mandy and mama

From Nigel Ajax, the love kitty:

#22 mama winger
Ah, here we go....
Evolution Sunday
Looks like moslty Methodists and Episcopalians.

#29 freak

OH! They're Italian! and they are in Brookfield! Well then, that explains why the meat and bakery pages are driving me crazy! WOW - I have to take a trip there! Thanks for the tip.

31 PBC - IE 6

Ajax: [Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

#33 Bobblehead

Ding Dong! LOL!

#34 Killgore

Damn those Episcopalians.

#36 windybon

IE6 works with Ajax. Where did you see that message? On LGF?

E2M: the lounge is actually hosted on a completely different system; it's a Java applet that loads from parachat.com.

So even if the rest of LGF gets swamped with traffic, if you manage to load that page the lounge will keep functioning.

#39 PBC -

Yes, on LGF. On the right side, right under the Pajamas Media ad. There's a drop-down for Top Stories, a button for Reload, and below that the message about incompatibility.

#34 Killgore Trout

I see by the list of churches that the Episcopal Church here in my town participated. It's a shame I didn't know beforehand. I could have caused a scene. :)

windybon: yes, it should work with IE6. Anyone else with IE6 having a problem?

As with many other tech types here, I was using "Ajax" long before they started calling it that. Even before Microsoft added the XMLHttpRequest ActiveX object to IE, we used to use hidden frames to load content behind the scenes, then use JavaScript to manipualte the Document Object Model to display it. That was almost 10 years ago.

#40 Charles

So the eensy weensy bit of traffic (the messages) goes through their server, then?

That message appears if the code is unable to create the ActiveX Object. Do you have ActiveX disabled?

Nice, and convenient. Looking forward to cool stuff in the future.

Even before Microsoft added the XMLHttpRequest ActiveX object to IE, we used to use hidden frames to load content behind the scenes, then use JavaScript to manipualte the Document Object Model to display it.

Me too. Then I went and played on the swings.

#32 Earth2moonbat:

From what I can tell, Charles isn't hosting the chatroom (applet or chat server) himself.

That ActiveX object (XMLHttpRequest) is such a POS. FireFox (and virtually all others) do async requests natively. When dealing with IE you have no choice, as Charles (gritting teeth) could tell you.

#35 mama winger

Good idea! You won't be disappointed.

E2M: yes, the messages go through parachat, but more importantly the Java applet itself is running on their server. That's why it keeps working if LGF is swamped.

#42 mama winger
I think it's a great idea. Be careful if you protest, I hear Episcopalians have some pretty mean bouncers.

Very nice, Charles, but I was hoping for the Mr. Clean application.

/joke! I actually have no idea what you're talking about, but that's ok.

13 mama winger

I didn't get my candy this week. Can I have some of yours?

Now, off to Wally World for the second day in a row. The kid needs a Valentine Day's box and the paper-lace doilies of my day just won't do for a boy.

And, yes. I realize that I just posted "box." But, it's about my boy and I just can't go there.

Finally, I get to ask this burning question!

In the drop down menu it has a catagory "Most Emailed". Most emailed to whom (or where)?

I think an Ajaxified LGF thread would be interesting, but I wonder how it would be laid out...

Right now you go to the bottom of the page. If posts were being added dynamically at the bottom it might be confusing if you were trying to enter one. You'd also run the risk of turning the threads into a chat board if they could be posted and read as quickly as in the Lounge.

It would be a good experiment.

33 Bobblehead

*Smoochies* from me!

46 Charles -

That message appears if the code is unable to create the ActiveX Object. Do you have ActiveX disabled?

Probably.

Of other interest, my scam blocker thinks this site could be a scam. Sometimes there's a yellow warning at the top of the page, sometimes there a red warning. Don't know why it doesn't like it.

#38 mama winger

Hey, not ALL Episcopalians are moonbats! We orthodox/conservative ones are okay!

Our priest's sermon today had nothing to do with evolution, and we certainly wouldn't belittle intelligent design.

OT
new poem in time for Valentine's Day
[Link: www.cruxy.com...]

hmmm... maybe Charles could sell the most blasphemous comments here to whomever wingnut moonbat wanted to buy them for "proof" of whatever they want to proove about this marvelous site
now that wd be a technical update!

#57 littleoldlady:

You know those little links you see sometimes that say "Email this story"? When someone clicks those, the web site (Yahoo or some such) makes note of it.

And the more people click that link, the more "emailed" the story is.

#58 Pro-Bush Canuck

Believe it or not, when we had that thread that went over 5000, CtP, Geepers, and I (and a few others, IIRC) were discussing that. It would have to be reversed. It would have to be most recent comment on top. I think that would be a good thing, given how Firefox keeps returning to the top as it loads right now. Unless Ajax would fix that.

#60 windybon

I think your scam blocker is a scam.

:-)

victor_hugo,

OH! Duh.

I never use those. (I email stories by opening a blank email and dragging the link in.) I forgot about those links!

Thanks! :-)

windybon: those "scam blockers" are a major pain. They identify lots of sites incorrectly as possible scams. And it's nearly impossible to get the companies who foist these things on ISPs to be responsible about their crummy software.

Ironically, I think it's one of the measures I use to thwart spambots that confuses the scam blocker and makes it issue that wrong warning.

#58 Pro-Bush Canuck

And I don't think chattiness would be a problem. You quickly end up limited by your ability to think of something to say. If it became a problem, a 2 or 3 second delay would fix that.

#64 Earth2moonbat

given how Firefox keeps returning to the top as it loads right now

That's one of the reasons I've actually reverted from Firefox back to IE7. IE7 is smoother and faster than Firefox for most stuff, and it includes most of the FF features I cared about (except incremental page search).

IE7 is the perfect browser for LGF.

#65 PBC - it came with earthlink. I just turned it off. Actually, I've never seen any use for it. The only time it ever did anything was when I was on LGF.

E2m,

It would have to be most recent comment on top.

NOOOOOOOOO!

/old dog
//no new tricks. fuggetaboutit!

I love all the changes, especially the Amazon sidebar. Just purchased SIX FRIGATES.

#68 Earth2moonbat

Well we'd soon find out. Another issue: you're reading a long post so it has to be stationary. Where are the new ones added? If at the top they push yours down, if at the bottom then we're back to the bottom of the page issue...

Mozilla Firefox 1.5.0.9 on Mac OS X 10.4.8 works nicely.

On the other hand, IE 7.0.5730.11 on Win XP SP2+ behavior is not consistent, and function is not what you would like.

I've enabled script debugging, but no joy.

First time through the newsfeed loaded, but would not change, not when selecting a new category from the pulldown, and not when clicking the reload button.

Second time through I got the cat. pulldown and the reload button, but no news. Then, when I selected a new cat. the news appeared.

#55 MandyManners
Little boys are fun. Mine is all grown up now. No more school projects. Sniff, sniff.

#73 Pro-Bush Canuck

Either you'd have to autoscroll like the lounge, or you'd do a manual refresh that happens a lot faster than refresh now.

Another possible model is to have a fixed apeture of say, 100 comments, and if you want to see anything more than 100 comments ago, you have to open up a seperate window that works conventially.

Lots of ways to do it.

#68 Earth2moonbat

You quickly end up limited by your ability to think of something to say.

Gee, thanks. You have verbalized my (in)abilities. LOL

I gave up on Firefox because it doesn't refresh to where I stopped reading. On the short threads it was okay; I could fairly easily find my place. But on longer threads I had to remember the post number, and after a few refreshes my head was swimming with numbers.

/confuses easily

Plus, back when Charles changed the fonts they got extra crispy in IE, and extra fuzzy in Firefox.

The obvious solution is for Charles to fix Firefox. You can do that, right Charles?

:-)

aaron: reload the page and try again...

One of the very cool things that AJAX could do is allow a user to follow multiple threads at once, and be apprised of new comments in each one. From the front page, the user would click on a button that shows the comments for that thread in a user-resizable iframe with its own scrollbar, without having to reload a whole new page. As new messages were added, the browser would not have to reload an entire page, but could just send a request for something like

.../weblog/?entry=24397&start=49

and get the new comments (in this case starting with comment #49) to append to the existing content in the document. Then it's a short step to a control that tells the browser to hide all comments prior to a certain number (since the user has already read them).

The Janitorial Service could even include a way for the returned stream of comments to include a directive to delete or sanitize a comment that had already been transmitted to the browser. I won't go into too much detail here (for obvious reasons) but I would be happy to share in private with Charles ideas on how that could be done.

Bottom line is that a well-written AJAX system would be able to reduce the number of bytes the LGF server has to send to a browser, which means more $ left in Charles' pocket. And we're all in favor of that.

Someone told me about this when I first downloaded Firefox. Just right click the last comment number and open in new tab. When new tab comes up, it starts at that comment number with all the new additions.

Just my .02 cents

Hi Lolady
I have returned from the conference. Like you, I have no clue what Ajax is all about in computing.

I am delighted for Charles. :)

Dumped browser cache...

Reloaded...

Initial feed loaded, but it took awhile...

Now things work as expected.

Selecting a new feed loads that feed, no need to click 'reload'.

Where's the 'launch minaret' button?

St. P!

How was the conference?

You wouldn't happen to be teaching AP Gov this year (?) We've got problems...

Lol, no, but a friend of mine does. I am sorry about MeanNastyTeenager having a problem. What issue is she having anyway?
Much reading is what I can tell you. No slacking when it comes to AP.

I had fun staying in the Omni Hotel. Nice time meeting new bodies, and reaquainting myself with some old folks.

TimeQuake,

Do you open a new tab every time you refresh? About how many tabs do you have going on a 300 post thread?

LoLady
If complicated, have her email me with questions.

St. Pancake,

I was amazed that she wanted to take this course. (I suggested Econ instead, but god forbid she should listen to me.) She said she wanted to take it because "I love the Supreme Court!"

/weirod child, I have.

But the teacher is All Politics, All The Time. She's not happy.

#86 littleoldlady

I simply close the old one. The one draw back is when you post. You could keep one open and post on the other (I'm on dial up, so a lot happens in between typing and having it post) and then you would still know where you were at, if into reading all the posts.

On a feeling of intuition, I closed my browser and opened it back up again. When I came into LGF, the new Ajax news feed works.

But, while the Ajax feed now works, LGF is very slow for me. Refreshing seems to take forever.

LoLady

But the teacher is All Politics, All The Time. She's not happy.

Is the teacher NOT teaching the material? Huh? Does she have the textbook?
Has she used this site?
historyteacher.net

Outstanding site! I linked you to the government page.

Ruh roh.

I really shouldn't complain here about her teacher. He told meannastyteenager he was going to sign up at LGF next time there was open registration.
There was open registration yesterday...

She loves her history class! ADORES the teacher!

/just a little more Supreme Court and she'd be ecstatic!

;-)

LoLady
I would also google AP Government teacher sites for additional help. There are several.

St. Pancake,

I'm positive he's following the proscribed subject matter closely. It's just that his special interest is politics, and hers...isn't.

She says she's not doing well (only a fair grade last report card), and is considering not taking the AP test.

Now, I'm not happy. :-(

windybon,

LGF got slow for me, too.

aaron and windybon: can you verify that it still works? I made some changes to the IE code...

I wish she would take the test. The most recent research says that even those people to score low still perform better in college. There is something about preparing for the test which teaches self-discipline.

Charles,

It didn't work at all before. Now it works perfectly!

/is this thread rogered, or is it just me?

It works perfectly for me too. No problems.

St. P.,

Next time I talk to you f2f I will tell you our sad tale of my kid and standardized tests. After the SAT fiasco (big bucks for tutoring - she got scores of 1300-1400 when I or the tutors tested her - then bombed on the actual test! :-( ) I have come to the conclusion she has some kind of metal block or a sneaky manifestation of a learning disability.

I would bet a lot of money that she knew the material on last year's AP test better than any kid in the class. But she only got a "3".

Charles,

IE 6 in Virtual PC utilized the newsfeeds w/ AJAX w/o a hitch (only slowly in Virtual PC). The layout takes a couple of hits, though.

Firefox in OS X Tiger looks fine.

Opera 9.10 in OS X—check.

Safari 2 in OS X—check.

AJAX is pretty damned all right technology.

I dig what you’re doing with this site, very cool…. Keep up the good work.

A three is still passing. Nothing to be ashamed of at all.

I would also purchase a good AP exam review book.

Last year, a week before the AP AH test, she had a study session with a friend. (That kid is going to Yale next year.) On the way out the door the friend says to me, "Ohmigosh! MNT knows so much more than I do. She knows everything!" I told her, "That's okay. YOU will get a 5. SHE will be lucky to get a 3".

I called it. :-(

I'm not complaining. (Yes, I am. ;-) It's just that I think she gave up on history (and a career in law) because she is petrified and demoralized by the tests.

Life isn't fair sometimes...

Durn, LoLady.
Three, though, is still good. I saw an overall report on the US tests, and they were NOT good. Essays are still a gripe. The US course is going to be overhauled from what I heard. Most difficult AP course in Social Studies actually.

LoLady
Here is a good article from Jay Mathews who is a good supporter of the AP program.

Studies Find Benefits to Advanced Placement Courses

Yes, 3 is good. And last year's teacher was thrilled for her, and even asked to be able write her recommendations.

MNT is worried about what she'll get this year because she's not as good at the subject as she was last year.

But I have a plan...

/evil cackle

...I think I'll send her into the test with 1/2 a Valium!

;-)

Oops, LoLady
Lol! Hey, why not? Hehe, bring her a snake too between the sections. Three hours, if I remember.

snack, not snake!

St. Pancake,

Interesting and encouraging!

Taking honors and AP classes was her choice. I had nothing to say about it either way. Her reason was that she wanted to be in classes with "the smart kids", because in the regular classes the teachers spend too much time yelling and trying to keep order, and they're a waste of time.

Sad, isn't it?

Snacks are a must, of course. I even sent her into one of the SAT sessions with a set of earplugs and instructions to sit in the first row.

I've tried everything (but drugs).
/and snakes...

Sad, isn't it?

Yes, very sad. Terrible. This is the price of inclusion. "No Child Left Behind" mentality. "Sigh"
What happened to technical training for those who should not be in school?

Lol on snakes.

I mean it with the mentality of modern education. There are so many who should NOT be wasting teacher time. I want all the trade(car repair, air conditioning repair etc) that we used to have. This is where we were all screwed with civil rights changes.

We have a VoTech in our county - a very good one, too! - but the kids still go to regular high school for their required academics. Even so, the classes that MNT takes that aren't honors or AP are supposedly "college prep". And there are kids in those classes who will not be going to college.

Go figure.

Once upon a time this township had an award-winning advanced curiculum for "the smart kids". They had to ditch it because the parents of "not as smart kids" complained.

the parents of "not as smart kids" complained.

Not surprised. You will hate this, but I still feel parents have too much power in the districts. I know this is not a popular statement, but nevertheless, it must be said. Parents, like educators, do not always know what is best, imho.

115 St. Pancake

And then in the next breath, you're going to start saying how they're not involved enough?

Nope, where I teach, this is a big issue. :)

Sometimes "parental power" is the only thing that saves a kid from arbitrary meaness.

Last year's English teacher hated her, hated her writing, and was an all 'round sch*uck. "I'm not recommending her for AP English." he told me. "Bully for you." I told him. "She doesn't want to take AP English." So he didn't recommend her for honors English either. I wrote a note, got her in, and this year she has a teacher who loves her and loves her writing. (97 on the last report card! :-)

However, I agree that parents should not determine academic programs.

Anyone else with IE6 having a problem?

By definition, yes.

Yup. And let's leave journalism to the journalists, too.......

However, I agree that parents should not determine academic programs.

What I am griping about this year are the large numbers of Special Ed classes in my hallway. I hate to say it, but it can be a nuisance. Emotionally disturbed kids leave the room, and raise a ruckus. Very annoying when I am testing in my room especially.

On more than one occassion, the police came and handcuffed emotionally disturbed kids who were out of control. This is the law of inclusion though, and there is not a blasted thing I can do about it. We cannot segregate those kids anymore.

#109, St. Pancake

Speaking of snacks, I'm baking some Valentines Day sugar cookies. They've got red sugar hearts stenciled on top...

Get 'em while they're hot ----->

The Special Ed classes at our school are in the basement.

/ a/k/a dungeon

Separate entrance, separate lunchroom, separate everything! Talk about your stigma!