the West should trust Arab states to develop such technology for peaceful purposes or risk a war of civilizations.

Little does he know- there's actually no difference.

Sarkozy said preventing Arab states from developing nuclear power risked stoking a “war of civilizations.”

Note to Sarcrazy; breathing the same air as them stokes the “war of civilizations” in their book.

[self~deleted]
Mon Dieu!

At least we know who we can/can't count on.

I think I would rather risk a war of civilizations, thank you.

With the direction Europe is going, we're gonna have to.

I have long feared that Sarkozy, far from being the new Charles Martel as some seemed to believe, is actually a passionate Eurabian.

French President Nicolas Sarkozy said the West should trust Arab states to develop such technology for peaceful purposes or risk a war of civilizations.

Trust our peaceful intent or zer vill be var!

Yeah. Let's try war before nukes for $200.

Pssst! Mr. Sarkozy- the War of Civilizations is here.

France agreed on Wednesday to help Libya develop a nuclear reactor to supply drinking water from desalinated sea water.

Uhhh...what?

Israeli companies have been building those water plants around the world without Nuke plants.

French President Nicolas Sarkozy said the West should trust Arab states

so does this mean that France is no longer a part of the West? i hope so.
seriously, what the f is he thinking?

Sarkozy said preventing Arab states from developing nuclear power risked stoking a “war of civilizations.”

and what does giving them nuclear power do? bring us all together?

It's one thing to be a cheese-eating surrender monkey, but even a regular monkey has more sense than this.

Sarkozy said preventing Arab states from developing nuclear power risked stoking a “war of civilizations.”

We already have one of those, Frenchie! Giving them nukes just proves that we want to lose.

If you Google ‘French military victories’ and hit the ‘I’m feeling lucky’ button, it says, ‘No standard web pages containing all your search terms were found.’ It also says, ‘Did you mean French military defeats?’

Shall we this fond pageant see? Lord, what fools these mortals be!

sure! why not? wonder if we can get russia to design the plants?
can you spell chernobyl?

re: #12 Kreuzueber Halbmond

It's one thing to be a cheese-eating surrender monkey, but even a regular monkey has more sense than this.

I'd say he's more of a cheese-eating surrender skunk...

In 2006, Spencer Abraham was named director of Areva Inc., the US subsidiary of the French nuclear energy company [1].

And if they don’t develop, how will we fight terrorism and fanaticism?”

Well with better weapons and training, obviously. But if we let them arm themselves with nukes the advantages of having well-trained marines and soldiers come to naught since the war will come to North America in a suitcase.

French President Nicolas Sarkozy said the West should trust Arab states to develop such technology for peaceful purposes or risk a war of civilizations.

There are so many things wrong with that sentence that it's hard to know where to begin.

...and I was just starting to enjoy French Bordeaux again.

In what universe does it make sense to say, “We need to trust their peaceful intentions, or they’ll declare war on us?”

This is France dude. What did you expect?

-ron

The Frog, Sarkozy, has just hopped into a pot of hot water that should rapidly come to a boil. Hope he enjoys the swim.

Memo to Sarkozy: This isn't a "war of civilizations," because that would mean that Islam would have to be a civilization in he first place, which it isn't. This is a war for civilizations. It's already started, and France is currently losing.

correct me if i am wrong, but they dont seem to have developed themselves with the fuel of today

“If we don’t give the energy of the future to the countries of the southern Mediterranean, how will they develop themselves? And if they don’t develop, how will we fight terrorism and fanaticism?”And if that doesn't work, how will we know?

FRANCE

Total population: 62.3 million

Muslim population: Five to six million (8-9.6%)

Background: The French Muslim population is the largest in western Europe. About 70% have their heritage in former north African colonies of Algeria, Morocco and Tunisia. France favours integration and many Muslims are citizens. Nevertheless, the growth of the community has challenged the French ideal of strict separation of religion and public life. There has been criticism that Muslims face high unemployment and often live in poor suburbs. A ban on religious symbols in public schools provoked a major national row as it was widely regarded as being a ban on the Islamic headscarf. Late 2005 saw widespread and prolonged rioting among mainly immigrant communities across France.

Too many contradictory terms in that statement. Makes me laugh.

The article mentions the deal would include having the French nuclear firm Avena controlling the entire nuclear fuel cycle. They would produce the reactor fuel, manage it's use, and then take the spent fuel for disposal. If an Arab state is going to have nuclear power stations, this would certainly be the preferable scenario.

The big problem with this particular deal is Qaddafi!

re: #25 Fjordman

Amen to that.

The French wouldn't have any problem working for the leader of any future world caliphate and declaring France a province of a muslim empire. Just like they had no problem being good little productive nazis after they got the sh*t kicked out of them by Hitler.

These are guys you really don't want on your side.

In what universe does it make sense to say, “We need to trust their peaceful intentions, or they’ll declare war on us?”

Maybe in Bizzaro universe, and maybe not even there.

Thanks for posting this Charles... Kaddafi has more jizya to collect. Just wait and see.

As I wrote earlier, fjordman could not have been more prescient;

...France is now held hostage by the very forces she herself set in motion. The Jihad riots by Muslim immigrants in France in 2005 demonstrated that Eurabia is no longer a matter of French foreign policy, it is now French domestic policy. France will burn unless she continues to appease Arabs and agree to their agenda.

/dhimmitude on stilts

Since we're on the subject of leaders who are deluded by diplomacy, I give you Olmert's gambit.

The Death of France?

The reports that France helped Iraqi officials escape to Europe were not surprising, because France is now the European leader of the Arab world and of Arab interests.

re: #14 Lizard by the Bay

We already have one of those, Frenchie! Giving them nukes just proves that we want to lose.

Let's keep our facts straight here: the deal is about providing a nuclear power station, not about providing nuclear weapons.

TRUST ARABS WITH NUKES? I THOUGHT RUSSIANS, NOT THE FRENCH, WERE SUPPOSED TO BE THE WORLD'S BIG DRINKERS.

Never forget that we gave nuclear technology to France lock stock and barrel after WWII, presuming without question that France would forever be a loyal ally and never ever ever ever even dream of giving that technology to our enemies.

Amazing what can happen in a few short decades.

This only confirms my belief that the US should NEVER give key technology or weapon systems to ANY foreign government -- EVEN OUR ALLIES. Because one never knows if those allies may one day turn on us.

It's happened so many times in the past, we should have learned by now.

The reactor might be supplied by French atomic energy firm Areva - short for arevaderci arrivederci

#30, Kenneth. Would you trust the French with the security of yourself and your family? Please answer.

Let's not jump the cheval, here. The French love nuke power, they want to sell some reactors, and some of the safer designs with hi-tech fuel pellets, are pretty safe to operate even by savages. This could be just a bit of business and nothing more.

#32: The French were the original inventors of the Eurabia policy, and they are now trying to drag the rest of Europe down with them.

re: #36 BabbaZee

The Death of France?

The reports that France helped Iraqi officials escape to
Europe were not surprising, because France is now the European leader
of the Arab world and of Arab interests.

They did love all things Arafat.

MUSLIM POPULATION WORLDWIDE

re: #39 zombie

This only confirms my belief that the US should NEVER give key technology or weapon systems to ANY foreign government -- EVEN OUR ALLIES. Because one never knows if those allies may one day turn on us.

I'm not sure who said, and I paraphrase, Nations don't have friends, they have interests.

re: #19 loppyd

Ah yes, Pepe LeNuke.

How many ways can France figure out how to say , "I Surrender!"?

I gave the asshole nextdoor my gun because I was afraid he would beat me up.

/numb

re: #47 Kreuzueber Halbmond

re: #19 loppyd

Ah yes, Pepe LeNuke.

ROFL!

Sarkozy told reporters in Libya that to consider the Arab world “is not sensible enough to use civilian nuclear power” would, in the long run, risk a “war of civilizations”.

If we offend them, they'll try to kill us. So best not offend them by implying we're concerned they want to kill us.

re: #51 Silhouette

If we offend them?

They are perpetually offended.

[Self Deleted]

Later Lizardia

Verrry Strange, perhaps Sarko has gone off the rails. One thing though, would he were offering Nuclear Power Plants to us, we could use them and MAINTAIN THEM.

-S-

No surprise- he's a member of the nation that gave the world the Euro-Arab Dialogue and the EU. And he recognizes france's restive, youthful, unassimilated Muslim population and those 751 shari'a-ruled "no-go" zones throughout france.

If you can trust Israel with nukes........

MUST SEE TV
Video: French-bashing made easy

re: #30 Kenneth

The article mentions the deal would include having the French nuclear firm Avena controlling the entire nuclear fuel cycle. They would produce the reactor fuel, manage it's use, and then take the spent fuel for disposal. If an Arab state is going to have nuclear power stations, this would certainly be the preferable scenario.

The big problem with this particular deal is Qaddafi!

Yes, but one never knows what could happen in the future when Qaddafi dies and/or is overthrown and Islamists seize control of the country. They'll kill or kick out the unarmed Avena employees and start cranking out the weapons-grade uranium on their own.

Remember all those jet fighters we gave to our strong ally the Shah in the '60s and '70s? Who's flying those planes now?

Let's see, where did Ayatollah Khomeini hideout for years before 1979?

TRIPOLI, Libya (Reuters) — After agreeing to nuclear cooperation with Libya, French President Nicolas Sarkozy said the West should trust Arab states to develop such technology for peaceful purposes or risk a war of civilizations

.

Oh man...

Another fine example of Fwench exceptionalism.

re: #12 Kreuzueber Halbmond

new expanded version - cheese eating co-dependant enabling surrender monkey.

Yes, give them nukes.

Oh, goody. Another excuse to bomb Libya!

The Fwench must support their lazy, free-loading society somehow. Being the world leader in industrial espionage alone won't pay the bills.

Will France have a hand in the future "pie" of supplying the technology?
Is this money related?

#34: Which is why we will have to kill the EU. Maybe we can't save France, but we should try to prevent the French from dragging the rest of Europe down with them.

The EU is to European civilization what Lord Voldemort is to Harry Potter: One of them has to die if the other is to live.

re: #39 zombie

Never forget that we gave nuclear technology to France lock stock and barrel after WWII, presuming without question that France would forever be a loyal ally

And maybe because we were sick of having to go over there every thirty years and pull their butts out of the fire. "Here. Hold this, and point it at the enemy if anyone else tries to invade. Now stop bothering me; I'm busy."

why don't we just drop a few nukes on 'em and see how good they are at reverse engineering

re: #56 Ben Hur

huh?

sarcasm?

israel has had nukes for almost, if not over, 30 years...

how many times has israel expressed it's unwavering desire to destroy its neighbors a la iran etc.?

re: #49 Grok the Fullness

How many ways can France figure out how to say , "I Surrender!"?

I gave the asshole nextdoor my gun because I was afraid he would beat me up.

/numb

Seriously... is this over fear or over making money?

re: #59 Grok the Fullness

Let's see, where did Ayatollah Khomeini hideout for years before 1979?

...And write huge tomes on bestiality and misogyny. Currently the Brown Standard of Muslim sex.

re: #71 Ginn

re: #49 Grok the Fullness

How many ways can France figure out how to say , "I Surrender!"?

I gave the asshole nextdoor my gun because I was afraid he would beat me up.

/numb

Seriously... is this over fear or over making money?

The latter. They do not fear surrender; it's a way of life for them.

Off to get some lunch.

Guess I'll have to rethink getting fwench fries.

Later, Lizards!

All I can say is "Holy Shit"! This guy must be Sarkozy.

[Link: www.foxnews.com...]

It looks like Sarkozy believes all the enemy propaganda that the Arab Muslim countries are poor and hostile because we have kept them down. What evidence is there that poverty leads people to become terrorists? History teaches me that unchecked preaching of hatred + appeasement leads to people becoming terrorists.

re: #57 cbinflux

On the Israeli version they stopped with the Audience Help, because the audience would purposely mislead the contestant.

BTW, the Fwench are the leader in breeder reactors.

re: #57 cbinflux

Incredibly funny,and sad.

re: #70 dr. akim ullsheetbay

Welcome.

re: #62 dr. akim ullsheetbay

Maybe they should just stick to exporting champagne and cheese instead.

Speaking of bestiality... the news from Norway and Denmark is frightening.

re: #30 Kenneth

There's quite a lot of 'ifs' in that:

This might be a good idea if the nuclear materials can be secured.
This might be a good idea if there is no way that weapons grade materials can end up in the hands of the regimes.
This might be a good idea if there is no way terrorists can get their hands on the stuff - weapons grade or otherwise.
This might be a good idea if the French can be trusted with securing such a facility.
This might be a good idea if it was someone other than Khadafi we're talking about.

Add to that list if you see fit :)

It's all part of the grand Western plan, isn't it? You know, like when we fooled the Germans into thinking we'd attack Pas De Calais. These nuke plants will be built with remote detonators so they can be set off when things get out of hand.

That's it, isn't it?

Right ... ?

?

It is not their ethnicity. It is not their religion.

It is the trustworthiness of their despotic leaders.

A fully attended meeting of the Arab League is a world-class collection of lunatics, losers, halfwits and brutal murderers. Not one these leaders reflects the interests of their people, only the interests of the leaders.

If there was some reason that the Arab world need fear nuclear annihilation, one might be sympathetic to their need to defend themselves. But the fact is they can not effectively govern themselves, pray why would anyone want to put the most dangerous weapons in their hands- but as bad as any current Arab leaders is- every single one of them had shadow Islamist governments in waiting (who we most definitely never want to see have nukes, because, they like, Saddam or Bin Laden, would use them or hand them to terrorists). As bad as these leaders are, only worse ones are in the immediate wings of their Islamic world's political stage.

The Arab world needs to focus solely on their biggest problem- human development and not waste any more money on palaces and weapons they don't need.

Meanwhile the raped, tortured, blackmailed ungrateful EU nurses just won't move on;

Libya protests pardons for nurses

...The medical workers are seeking legal action against the people they say tortured them while they were held in prison in Libya.

"We can forgive, but we cannot forget what has happened to us," Nasya Nenova, one of the workers, said Wednesday at the first news conference since arriving home.

Nenova, Kristiana Valcheva and Ashraf al Hazouz said they were ready to testify in an investigation of 11 Libyan police officers, which Bulgaria started in January for alleged torture of the medics.

Recalling the first months in prison, Nenova said, "it was horrifying."

"They tortured us, they did not allow us to have a lawyer. It was only after 13 months that we could meet with our lawyer and try to whisper what they were doing to us," she said.

The Libyans will be investigated for allegedly using coercion, torture and threats -- between February and May 1999 -- to extract false confessions from the medical workers, which subsequently led to their death sentences, prosecutor Nikolai Kokinov said.

However, there has been no indication Libya will let the officers go to Bulgaria for any trial.

There's no indication Libya would ever pay up either.

Sarkozy's new name is Stircrazy.

re: #73 cbinflux

re: #71 Ginn

re: #49 Grok the Fullness

How many ways can France figure out how to say , "I Surrender!"?I gave the asshole nextdoor my gun because I was afraid he would beat me up.

/numb

Seriously... is this over fear or over making money?

The latter. They do not fear surrender; it's a way of life for them.

Excellent point.

Sarkozy told reporters in Libya that to consider the Arab world “is not sensible enough to use civilian nuclear power” would, in the long run, risk a “war of civilizations”.

Sounds like the usual arab/muslim "thinly veiled threat" at work here. Kinda reminds me of the Danish cartoon thing - don't call our religion violent or we will be forced to kill you.

This is exactly why you can't give in to hostage takers. Yes, the consequences would be awful for the doctors and nurses, but their freedom now threatens the entire world.

re: #37 Kenneth

Let's keep our facts straight here: the deal is about providing a nuclear power station, not about providing nuclear weapons.

Kenneth,

Part of having nuclear power is the means to produce nuclear fuel. That fuel doesn't have to be used in a peaceful reactor once made. Are you getting the concept yet?

In what universe does it make sense to say, “We need to trust their peaceful intentions, or they’ll declare war on us?”

It makes no sense. But I challenge anyone on this board to show me any leader in the free world anymore whose intentions do make much sense.

If you're so gutless you won't even challenge the patsies at the U.N. with the truth, what makes you think you've got the rocks to challenge ruthless dictatorships?

I say for the record again France should never be considered an ally. If my memory serves, it was France that sold Saddam a nuclear reactor. Thank God the Israelis had the good sense to do the world a favor and get rid of that one. Apparently, all it did was postpone the inevitable. How pathetic we have become...

Some things never change...maybe Libya will name their first Atomic Bomb "Lil' Sudatenland."

#90 Lizard by the Bay

Also Nicolas Sarkozy claims the Muslims need to be trusted; otherwise war of civilizations. Yet he would not trust them with the know how? If not, why not, Nicolas Sarkozy?

Not all of Europe is sleeping;

Times (UK): Don’ t play Gaddafi’s little game — it stinks

Naturally, the last thread comment reads;

The only solution to save the nurses and the doctor was unfortunately to yield to him as there was no other alternative for the moment.
pelletier, paris, france

/quod cowardice demonstrandum

Pick apart this logic:

“Nuclear power is the energy of the future,” he said. “If we don’t give the energy of the future to the countries of the southern Mediterranean, how will they develop themselves? And if they don’t develop, how will we fight terrorism and fanaticism?”

Nuclear power = energy of the future. Without Energy of the Future, no country can be expected to Develop. Without Development, no country can be expected to fight Terrorism, which strives to use Nuclear weapons. So lets give them Nuclear energy and Nuclear Material in the hopes that the convoluted process mentioned above happens in less time than the terrorists need to obtain the very thing we're giving them.

Here's what will happen when other oil-rich Muslim states get nuclear power:

The price of oil will go through the roof but the standard of living will stay the same or continue to deteriorate for the majority of the population.

So even if you swallow the poverty breeds terrorism myth, giving despots nuclear power will not benefit the average Muslim on the street.

Sarkozy said preventing Arab states from developing nuclear power risked stoking a “war of civilizations.”

He didn't really say that, did he?

re: #58 zombie

That is indeed a significant problem. But so is the problem of another country offering to sell Arab states nuclear technology without Western controls of any kind, say, Russia, China, North Korea, Pakistan or Iran.

Sarkozy's argument is that if France doesn't help them develop well controlled nuclear power plants, they will go get it from uncontrolled sources.

Please don't misunderstand my point here. I'm not at all happy with this news. But I wasn't happy before either. Sooner or later the Arab world will have lots of nuclear power stations. What happens between now & then will greatly effect where that technology was obtained and what it will be used for.

Hearing that Qaddafi will be getting French nuclear power stations doesn't make me sleep easily at night. The fact is the Arabs states were already trying to get nuclear technology, both power stations & weapons from non-Western sources. The French are discussing selling a nuclear power plant to Algeria. The Russians are trying to sell one to the Moroccans. The Egyptians, Jordanians and several Gulf states are also shopping for nukes. The Turks are already building a nuclear station -and they just elected a pro-Islamist government. And there are rumours that the Saudis bought a few Pakistani nuclear weapons several years ago.

None of which helps me sleep at night.

re: #94 Terp Mole

quod cowardice demonstrandum

Yes, it is. It absolutely is...

re: #71 Ginn

Money first. Domestic political issues second. Geopolitical concerns come third.

France is engaged in pre-emptive surrender ... why am I not surprised.

It is not their ethnicity. It is not their religion.

It is the trustworthiness of their despotic leaders.

A fully attended meeting of the Arab League is a world-class collection of lunatics, losers, halfwits and brutal murderers. Not one these leaders reflects the interests of their people, only the interests of the leaders.

If there was some reason that the Arab world need fear nuclear annihilation, one might be sympathetic to their need to defend themselves. But the fact is they can not effectively govern themselves, pray why would anyone want to put the most dangerous weapons in their hands- but as bad as any current Arab leaders is- every single one of them had shadow Islamist governments in waiting (who we most definitely never want to see have nukes, because, they like, Saddam or Bin Laden, would use them or hand them to terrorists). As bad as these leaders are, only worse ones are in the immediate wings of their Islamic world's political stage.

The Arab world needs to focus solely on their biggest problem- human development and not waste any more money on palaces and weapons they don't need.

any chance we can have the old french government back?

“Nuclear power is the energy of the future,” he said. “If we don’t give the energy of the future to the countries of the southern Mediterranean, how will they develop themselves? And if they don’t develop, how will we fight terrorism and fanaticism?”

Baloney. It's all about $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

re: #30 Kenneth

The article mentions the deal would include having the French nuclear firm Avena controlling the entire nuclear fuel cycle. They would produce the reactor fuel, manage it's use, and then take the spent fuel for disposal. If an Arab state is going to have nuclear power stations, this would certainly be the preferable scenario.

Not really. If it's on Libyan soil, the Libyan military will confiscate it, just like the Saudi military confiscated western oil faciliities.

Speak of the devil... I work in the rare book field & we just now got in a document dating from Napoleon's invasion of Egypt, from the Sheiks of Cairo to the Sheiks of Mecca, assuring them that the French are friends of islam.

re: #102 Ayatollah Ghilmeini

As always, an excellent analysis on a dire situation. Kudos.

Ho-kay...Charles, the article says "The reactor might be supplied by French atomic energy firm Areva".

I came across that name - Areva - just this morning, while hunting info on Spencer Abraham. The Spencer Abraham whom Fred Thompson has just named to be his campaign manager. Seems that in 2006 Mr. Abraham was named a director of Areva. His main gig since leaving (2/05) the Bush administration appointment as ENERGY secretary has been as head of The Abraham Group ([Link: abrahamgroupllc.com)...] - an "international strategic consulting firm". One of his partners is one Majida Mourad, "former Senior Advisor at the U.S. Department of Energy and MIDDLE EAST specialist"..."Prior to joining the Dept. of ENERGY, Ms. Mourad served as a member of President Bush's Transition Team Staff, assisting Spencer Abraham during his confirmation process as Secretary of ENERGY".

Spencer Abraham also has an interesting backgroung relative to IMMIGRATION. When running for re-election to the Senate in 2000 (from Michigan, and the only Arab-American in the Senate) the ..."Federation for American Immigration Reform ran ads asking: "Why is Senator Spencer Abraham trying to make it easier for terrorists like Osama bin Laden to export their war of terror to any city street in America?" "Abraham was a consistant advocate of large-scale immigration and worked relentlessly to lessen controls and regulations. In 1997 he received the 'Defender of the Melting Pot' award from the NATIONAL COUNCIL OF LA RAZA." This is from Wiki, so it can be discounted if distrusted, though these things are referenced in the article. (emphasis mine)

Whatever - seems possible Spencer Abraham could be involved, at least as having inside knowledge, since he's a director at Arvada, which is the US subsidiary of the French nuclear energy company.

All I know for sure now is that Fred Thompson taking on Spencer Abraham as his campaign manager means Rudy looks better and better - today, at least - and it's "BYE BYE, FRED"...or perhaps that should be an Abrahamaic "Adios".

*SPIT, DOUBLE-SPIT, and SPIT SOME MORE*

#102 Ayatollah Ghilmeini

It is not their religion.

You state this as fact. Twice.

And to think that just a short while back, we were celebrating Sarkozy's election.

/*spit*

re: #90 Lizard by the Bay

Part of having nuclear power is the means to produce nuclear fuel.

Not necessarily.

That fuel doesn't have to be used in a peaceful reactor once made.

The fuel rods would have to be re-processed to upgrade the uranium to weapons grade.

Are you getting the concept yet?

Yes I do get the concept. Are you getting this: the deal the French are proposing involves Avera controlling the entire nuclear fuel cycle from start to finish, hence the presumption of safeguards. Avera would produce the fuel rods and dispose of the spent fuel in France. The valid point Zombie makes is that at any point down the road, the Libyan gov't could break the deal and take over the technology (at least those operations which are on Libyan territory).

While this plan is worrisome, it is at least considerably less dangerous than the alternative plan -let the Russians build them the nuclear plants.

re: #83 lawhawk

I'm not saying it's a good idea at all! It's just not as bad as the other idea which is to let the Russians or the Pakistanis build the plants.

re: #108 GGMac drooled:Whatever - seems possible Spencer Abraham could be involved

What's this 7 degrees of Kevin Bacon Fred Thompson?

Yeh, Fred Thompson is in cahoots w/ Spencer Abraham and Nicolas Sarkozy to give Kaddafi nukes.

Take your Haldol, dude.

re: #105 jenv

Yes, if the fuel production and disposal facilities are in Libya, but the plan is for Areva to use their French facilties for those operations. Incidentally, this is the same deal the French offered the Iranians, which the mullahs refused.

#114 Kenneth

That's the plan this month.

“Nuclear power is the energy of the future,” he said. “If we don’t give the energy of the future to the countries of the southern Mediterranean, how will they develop themselves? And if they don’t develop, how will we fight terrorism and fanaticism?”

The intellectual 'Maginot Line'

Sarkozy, putain.
Allez vous faire enculer chez les Libiens.

One of the points made in the book "Eurabia" is that France has ambitions of global supremacy and that the easiest way for them to achieve that is through deals with the Arab world. It seems that the French are still living in the days of Napoleon and don't realize that the metaphorical ship of world domination has sailed without them.

Well Kenneth, here's my problem with the whole "the Arab world needs nuclear power" assumption that leads to this nonsense: It's just not true.

Iran sits on perhaps the worlds largest natural gas supply. With modern, efficient natural gas power plants, they could fill the electricity needs of the entire Middle East for 100 years, and cleanly. There is no need for nuclear power in the most oil and gas-rich region in the world.

On the other hand, there is a dire need for more nuclear power in this country, but the powers that be who think that every third-world shit-hole needs their own breeders and reactors won't let another nuclear power plant be built here.

And people thought Sarkozy would be different from the other guy Chirac. Perhaps he got bad advice from his cabinet and his wife. But this is just disappointing.

I agree with you on virtually every issue. This is the exception. First, the international agreement on nukes signed by the US and Libya (and virtually every nation on earth) permits the peaceful development of nuclear power. You can build a nuclear power plant that does not produce fissile material. Any state signed on to the international nuclear agreement gets the right to obtain assistance from other signatories to develop nuclear power.

Second, by helping ME nations exploit nuclear power for peaceful means, we are showing to all nations that we only oppose the use of nukes for warfare. That justifies our actions in N. Korea and Iran, especially among Arab states.

Third, there is no question that our dependence on oil will come to an end in a few decades as the oil reserves become depleted. We need to develop alternative energy sources, and the sooner the better. Nuclear power is one of the most efficient and the safest for the environment.

Fourth, France has the most experience in the world in developin nuclear power plants. They have the technology and their scientists are very familiar with designs and safety (we have not built a plant in over 30 years). The latest designs are for "pelletized" fuel which cannot be reproccessed into material for nuclear weapons.

re: #115 Roger

France is trying to compete with rival bids from Russia, Germany, Canada? Who knows were else. At this point it's a proposal, not a deal.

#119 Lizard by the Bay

Agreed, 100%. Nuclear energy will not improve the lives of the average Arab any more than oil has.

All we are doing now is picking the color of the handbasket that we are all going to hell in. One by one they give in, feeling threatened that others have. We will one day have to land on the shores of Normandy to free France again from another surrender.

Venezuelan-Iranian Car Company Releases First Models....with a little help from the French.

Defense Minister Raul Isaias Baduel, together with Iranian Ambassador Abdolah Zifan, handed over the first 227 vehicles to recent graduates of the Military Academy in the Caracas military base Fuerte Tiuna. These vehicles were among the first to be assembled in the Venirauto factory that was inaugurated last November.

"This accomplishment is a tangible example of what cooperation between brother nations, like Venezuela and Iran, can achieve," said Minister Baduel at the event yesterday.

The company Venirauto, which is 51% Iranian and 49% Venezuelan, is producing two different models. The first model, the Turpial at a price of Bs. 17 million (US$7,906), is a 4-door sedan based on the old Kia Pride model. The second is the Centauro, at a price of Bs. 23 million (US$11,069), and is based on the Peugeot 405 given that the French firm is the main supplier of engines and technology to the Iranian company. Both models are exempt from Venezuela's sales tax IVA (Value-added tax), due to a government program to subsidize cars that include Venezuelan production

re: #57 cbinflux

MUST SEE TV
Video: French-bashing made easy

And the Sun comes up in the .......?
Tooo funny! I'll be sending this one to a few of my amateur astronomer friends.

NYTimes reports Fwance sweetened Kaddafi's extortion deal;

Libya’s Release of 6 Prisoners Raises Criticism

Freeing the medical workers was one of Mr. Sarkozy’s campaign promises. After his election as president of France in May, Mr. Sarkozy, who had visited Libya when he was interior minister, promised Colonel Qaddafi in telephone conversations that he would go back as soon as the medical workers were freed. It was then that Colonel Qaddafi invited Mrs. Sarkozy.

Mrs. Sarkozy apparently charmed the colonel during a first encounter in Libya earlier this month, conducted without the presence of aides.

Oh my! Would you leave your trophy wife alone w/ this nurse raping rogue?

LGF Flashback: Dictator on the Make
These photos from the Libyan beauty pageant mentioned below are such surreal jaw-droppers I had to make copies, because who knows how long they’ll be available on the Miss Net World 2002 site? I’ve included the original captions. This is true comedy gold.

#113 Terp Mole

Soon as I wipe the drool from my chin, I'll refer you to the top thread - and the links therein.

You're an "elder" here - so I'll simply suggest you re-read my comment. and then re-read yours.

No offense taken; none intended.

Have a nice day.

Take Libya's money, spy like hell, and if they get out of line, bomb the reactor to smithereens.

OT, but maybe not. Silky Pony may have been partially right about the WOT as a bumper sticker thing - he just got it wrong when it comes to who owns the cars sporting the bumper stickers.
Detecting a hint of moderation in this MEMRI article.....

[Link: memri.org...]

From the article cited:
"Some claim that while the June 1967 war was a military loss, the spirit of armed resistance endured. They believe that resistance is still the strategic choice of Arabs. We have seen the results of the strategic choice of violent resistance by Hamas: an ugly Israeli barrier depriving Palestinians of ever more land that has made their lives even grimmer. The slogans of resistance may incite support, but the consequences of these very slogans cannot be accepted by the Arab public. No one in the Arab world today would accept that Hamas' actions were a large part responsible for the Israeli barrier. There has not been and nor will there be independent assessment of Hamas' strategy. Slogans continue to trump the actual results of actions."

Harumph. . .

Lets not forget that France gave nuclear technology earlier to Saddam Hussein. . .and earlier than that to Israel.

The way I look at this, its just another potential targetdown the road. It takes a heck of a lot less sophistication and expense to bomb a nuclear reactor into dust than create one in the first place.

The time to worry is when Libya starts burrowing its nuclear reactors into the earth or sticking them in highly populated areas, a la Iran.

Let's see, the French helped Saddam build his nuke reactor, they helped Iran, now they want to help Libya.

Isn't it time we bombed france?

The French are certainly unique in their happiness to spread nuclear secrets across the globe.

France knew that the Mossad was tracking their atomic scientists that were assisting Iraq. When the scientists ended up dead, the French didn't even complain about it even though it was obvious that the Mossad had taken them out. And the killings happened on French soil.

While Sarkozy made silly statements, it is also obvious that Lybia managed to nest itself among the "friendly arab states" group by surrendering Saddams chemical and biological weapons. in 2003and 2004.
That coziness is a western making with complicity from the USA, UK and all others involved. Libya was rewarded for making nice statements and "surrendering" its WMD program which was later traced back to Saddam who had them dispersed before the invasion.
Kaddafi betrayed his Arab brother and acted out of simple self interest.
He will betray anybody for survival. This comforts western leaders in the hope that whenever push comes to shove, Gaddafi will choose sides as long as it serves his interest.
He has been behaving relatively nicely since Reagan dropped a 500 pounder in his bedroom and realized where the line is when provoking great powers for personal bluster.

There are reactors which can never produce nuclear fuel for bombs. They exists and those were the ones France originally sold to Iraq under Saddam while Chirac was minister of trade.
Later Iraq ordered over 100 Mirage fighter jets, state of the art and being the large order it was, requiring additional factories to be built for their assembly.
Once the order was in and the fanfare of "new jobs" and great exports was credited to Chirac and his negotiating skills, Saddam demanded a new reactor, one that could enrich weapons grade fuel.
France refused as did the Soviet Union before them, being the original reason for Saddam going French in the first place.
Once Saddam realized that France would not export the "good reactor" technology, he went back to Chirac and threatened to cancel the Mirage orders which were already under assembly. This blackmail forced France to sell the reactor. Though it is known that France also provided intel to Israel in the wake of this problem and Israel acted in 1982 in Dimona.
Of course there were about 18 or so Mirages delivered to Iraq on a test trial basis before completion of the deal and those units were kept by Iraq even they were never paid for. This forced France in 1991 to join the coalition action with helicopters on their carrier as the Mirages were already in Iraq.
I hope the French learned from this lesson as Gaddafi is no more than a pirate and thug of the first order even if he made conciliatory statements fearing action after the quick collapse of Saddam. He isn't however a suicidal fanatic like the Iranians or an expansionist like the Baathist in Iraq were.
The ransom paid for those medics and doctors were more about the money Libya had to pay for the Lockerby Pan Am attack, which according to many sources was an Iranian act though at the time Iran enjoyed protection from some high places as the investigation focused solely on Libya.

It was too good to be true to believe that a Frenchman would demonstrate common sense but Sarkozy-with-Arabs is some kind of Manchurian candidate creature who campaigned on what passes for the right in France and has swung further left than his socialist rivals.

Here's his "reasoning": a primitive culture enriched by Western technology with unearned oil wealth funds the most barbaric version of their religion across the globe killing citizens in and spreading hate toward every Western country as well as fellow Muslims who don't make the grade.

Let's make a profit and goodwill for France by selling nuclear technology into these blood dripping hands so the War of Civilizations which they have already started and have been waging for thirty years can be escalated and the Western world made hostage and dhimmi to barbaric disciples of a crazed madman from the seventh century.

Sarkozy must be a secret Muslim or the dumbest leftwinger on earth who thinks gratitude will be the result of arming the wolves at the Western door.

Oh, you can trust Arabs with nukes. Just don't get your hopes up for keeping the background radiation level where it is.

In what universe does it make sense to say, “We need to trust their peaceful intentions, or they’ll declare war on us?”

France hasn't changed much in the last 250 years or so. This attitude helped them get along with the Algonquin tribes of the north, but it led to their eventual downfall and loss of vast tracts of territory to the English and their allies the Iroquois.

This attitude also led to the heartwringing loss of Acadia (present day Nova Scotia) and brought about what we know today as "Cajuns" of French descent living in southern states like Louisiana.

It is an attitude that buys peace for the present but not for the future and it is sad to see that France has STILL not learned this lesson.

re: #42 itellu3times
'Let's not jump the cheval, here. The French love nuke power'...

Let's not. But who was it who designed and built Saddam Hussein's nuclear reactor at Osirak?

There are two issues here, one of which has already been highlighted -

i) France's large Muslim population (and rising)
ii) France's view of itself as a world power, and its promotion of its own interests in its dealings with the Arab world.

So really, we shouldn't be at all surprised - regardless of how Sarko has chosen to sell this.

well, this surprises me zero

I've said for quite some time now that the only reason their fucking planes don't blow up over the Atlantic on the way over here is because we have people inspecting them AFTER the goddam frogs and krauts and all other wussified countries in Eurotrashia have done precious little themselves in their "inspection" processes

in spite of how bad Bush does the WOT (P.R. wise)
some good people are working to keep John and Jane Doe safe
because their relatives, friends, countrymen and hateful turd worlders sit on those planes (and why I won't fly there any more)

and because our Navy patrols the oceans to keep the tankers afloat for everyone's benefit

I (still) say pull our Navy away from ships not destined for America and let them be sunk
time for a wake-up call
but sadly, that day is coming no matter what

So what is Sarko's plan? Let Iran obtain nuclear weapons, and then feed the hyper-proliferation that will result in the Arab countries of the region? Let 'em all have nukes, and that assures everyone that there will be no wars, right? In the Middle East? In the Muslim world? Because the possibility of being harmed will stop the death-cultists from using the nukes? Don't bet your life on that, and don't bet the lives of millions of people, and tens of millions of people, on that.

So that's what he and his sleazy wife were doing in Tripoli, with the grandstanding return of the Bulgarian nurses to Sofia (whose release France had nothing to do with) as cover. Nice one, Nikolas :sigh:

Sarkozy says that " ... to consider the Arab world “is not sensible enough to use civilian nuclear power” would, in the long run, risk a “war of civilizations”. "
- - - -

Well, in case Sarkozy hasn't noticed, we ALREADY DO have a "war of civilizations" going on. Islam declared war on the West, specifically America, on 9/11/2001; they've attacked Britain, Spain, and Bali/Indonesia since then. And no, the Arab world is NOT sensible enough to handle nuclear power responsibly. (From my point of view they're not sensible enough to handle AK-47's responsibly.) One of the toxic elements in nuclear waste --Plutonium-239-- has a half-life of 24,000 years, and is considered unsafe for 240,000 years. Which Arab or Islamic country would YOU trust to keep this waste out of the environment for a quarter-of-a-million years?

Wow, Sack-cozy is showing his true color(s), er, white?

re: #6 Ben Hur

With the direction Europe is going, we're gonna have to.

From the BBC

Halim Ibrahim and his family are among the half of all Iraqis who choose Sweden as their destination when they flee to Europe from their war-torn homeland.

“We wanted to get as far away from Iraq as possible,” said 50-year-old Halim, standing outside his ground floor flat in southern Sweden.

So Moslems want to get as far away from a Moslem country as possible. Well I want to get as far away from Muslims possible. Where the hell do I go?

Then comes this lament from a Swedish politician.

This year the Swedish government estimates they will receive 20,000 asylum applications from Iraqis, more than 50 a day.

“It’s therefore vital that the EU will get a harmonised asylum policy by 2010 as promised,” says Tobias Billstroem.

“We don’t want any quotas for how many refugees Europe should accept, on the contrary we want the common EU rules to be more similar to the Swedish, because it is vital to ensure the right to asylum is not infringed.”

[Link: news.bbc.co.uk...]

In plain words, he wishes that what is destroying Sweden, should be adopted by the rest of Europe. Actually he does not have to wait till 2010. If the EU constitution is smuggled into law, that is what will happen before 2010.

Poor Sweden. It is so brainwashed by the liberal agenda of tolerance of all, that it cannot even defend itself. It would rather die; it would rather extinguish itself then give up its belief in liberalism. This is what happens when liberalism, or any ideology is carried to its extreme. Liberalism is suicidal to a nation and its identity, as it kills off the immune system of a nation. It is like AIDS.

Whenever Sweden comes up in the news, all that pops in to my mind is the image of a beautiful girl being gang raped. The gang will slit her throat when they are done. Fjordman's articles on his site on the rapes in Scandinavia, will make the blood boil. How Swedish men manage to restrain themselves beats me, as the natural response of any self respecting male is to protect women.

The tragedy is that the rest of Europe, are not far behind. It is just Sweden, that is at the precipice.

#121

Fourth, France has the most experience in the world in developin nuclear power plants. They have the technology and their scientists are very familiar with designs and safety (we have not built a plant in over 30 years). The latest designs are for "pelletized" fuel which cannot be reproccessed into material for nuclear weapons.

I admit I am no nuclear expert but my understanding of how a reactor works is that the waste product is plutonium. Are you saying that this is not fissile?

This is typical French behaviour. They are a bunch of self serving turd twisters as we have seen from the sales of arms to Iraq et al. They would sell their own grandmothers if they thought there was a euro to be had.

I don't agree with the arguement that giving a reactor means giving nukes. There are reactor technologies that do not produce by-products that can be used for weapons. Giving Libya one of those would actually be wise. The reliance of the Arab world on fossil fuels for electricity isn't a good thing. If the reactor is properly built and managed, it would be a positive thing all around.

Oh segolena royal with cheese - please save us from this "right wing monster"

#122 Kenneth

If you see this: you're missing the point. They never do say they are going into a crap country to give it nuclear weapons. They say good stuff to get their companies in. After they're in you have no good way to really know what they are doing in all the secret buildings etc. But first they get the world community ok with them building the facilities needed in the first place.

The whole thing seems fishy to me. Libya has plenty of natural gas which it could use to power lots of desalination plants. More importantly, they already have the Great Man Made River which taps deep underground aquifers in their country and provides them with 6.5 million cubic meters of fresh water per day, for a country with 4 million people. (there are 264 US gallons in a cubic meter). Seems to me that they already have plenty of water.

Nuclear energy is the ersatz religion of France, and Sarkozy is just proselytising.

He´s dead wrong - nuclear power is not the energy of the future - there is only so much uranium ore. Hemp is the energy of the future.

Any chance that here, in 2007 now, after years of seeing the same thing over and over and over and over and ov....any chance we can just go ahead and ......

*siiiiiiiiigh.

I know, i know. But I just want to so bad.

I'm almost to the point that I don't care how it ends, just that someone ends it. all of it if need be.

Liberty or Death has NEVER held more truth for me.

And now, back to your regularly scheduled non-reading-between-the-lines posts from more rational members....