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Threatening Dr. Sanity

Fri, Nov 30, 2007 at 8:34:52 am PST

It’s a complete meltdown. Gates of Vienna are threatening Dr. Sanity, and also claiming that Vlaams Belang leader Filip DeWinter should sue me for defamation—“or worse:” Dr. Sanity: MY RESPONSE TO BLACKMAIL THREATS.

Please note that contrary to their claims, “Dymphna” and “Baron Bodissey” were never banned from LGF. In her email to Dr. Sanity, Dymphna is also incorrect about the “SF Chronicle sneaky comment trick” at LGF; she claims it is still operative at LGF, but in truth it was simply a proof of concept, was disabled after one day of testing, and I announced every step with front page posts.

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584 comments

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1 swampscott  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:38:15am

Oh Paleeese! You go Charles!

2 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:38:30am
It was clearly a private conversation and was not meant to be public. But there was nothing said in that conversation that I am ashamed of or embarassed by.

Nor should you be, Doctor! Stand strong!

3 coquimbojoe  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:39:21am

White people should sue DeWinter for defamation. Maybe Charles should sue.... Hell, maybe I will sue....

4 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:41:12am
And now they seem to be set on completely alienating both me and Siggy if we do not fall into line and agree with, as well as apologize....or else.

How sad. But with blackmail, caving in means the bully wins twice. They get you to back down for one, and know they can do it again and again for two. Stand strong, Doctor.

5 WriterMom  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:42:14am

Charles, please note that you are also being accused of maintaining-and not just testing-the sneaky SF Chronicle comment deletion trick.

6 funkyfantom  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:42:24am

Each side gets a mousepad and keyboard, a second, and two posts
at twenty paces.

7 JammieWearingFool  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:42:50am

These folks need to quit while they're behind.

8 lawhawk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:43:20am

Truth and facts are a defense to defamation. They have no case.

You're right Charles, they are in a meltdown mode over there. I really don't get it.

9 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:44:22am

GTFOH~

10 mayor of imaginationland  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:44:48am

Charles is a tool of the belgians. Thats a new one

11 Killgore Trout  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:45:18am

I had seen the idea of suing Charles for defamation brought up in the comments sections at GoV a few weeks ago. I never thought they'd take it seriously and get litigious about this. I was wrong.

12 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:45:27am

I am now filing this entire matter under mockery.

13 mean Gene  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:45:52am

Reading comprehension can actually be affected by hatred.
I've seen it before.
Just keep telling the truth, Charles, someday they may read it with a cooler frame of mind.

14 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:46:16am

Now is Dewinter of their discontent!

15 pat  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:46:19am

Dr Sanity is one of my favorites. An intelligent response would have gone over much better than CAIR antics.

16 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:46:31am

Meldown elsewhere too...these people have lost thier minds.

17 pat  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:47:16am

Babba,
Hope this doesn't Rune their day.

18 29Victor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:47:32am

OT and probably reported elsewhere, but realclearpolitics.com has Obama ahead of Hillary by .4 in Iowa.

19 BenZacharia  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:47:37am

VB & GoV-"Making White Europe safe, one cause & one race at time. Hail Wotan!."

DD & AS-"Hmm, sounds like a good moto."

20 ParanoidPyro  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:47:40am

I have done my best to stay out of this entire situation (my first comment here on the GOV vs. LGF over VB issue), but this is ridiculous. Threatening people? Really? Telling someone in Europe to sue an American over a blog?

Desperation is not a pretty color on anyone, and the hint of it always makes your side of an argument seem weak. Just my two cents

/Contacting a lawyer just in case...

21 Spiny Norman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:47:40am

re: #5 WriterMom

Charles, please note that you are also being accused of maintaining-and not just testing-the sneaky SF Chronicle comment deletion trick.

That would be easy enough for them to prove, if it were true.

But they won't, because it's not.

How is it "defamation" to accuse someone of being a "White Power!" racist when they demonstrate themselves to be so in full view of the public?

22 cookielady  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:47:43am

Already wwaaaaayyy sick of the blog wars. Those who are attacking are anti-truth when it is irritating or embarassing.

Truth is. Facts are. Reality is reality.

Deal with it.

buncha dopes...

23 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:47:46am

"dymphna" says:

Ironically, they hold the same political principles you do: smaller government,lower taxes, local rule, and a requirement for assimilation for immigrants so that they learn the language and the culture of their new country and become citizens.

Somehow, "dymphna", I don't think the Doctor believes in a "white America".

24 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:48:00am

I really should preview.

25 insanity police  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:48:08am

I get it. Vienna is not the country, its an insane asylum. Close the gates, and keep the inmates inside.

26 Dirk Diggler  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:48:27am

Babbazee,

Now is Dewinter of their discontent!

(Groans) Get out.

27 Killgore Trout  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:48:32am
This is who Charles Johnson is attacking. It’s shameful. If Dewinter cared, he would be within his rights to sue Charles for defamation...at the very least.


At the very least? What stronger action would be within his rights? That's a very spooky statement.

28 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:48:52am
WHAT THE FUCK?!
29 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:48:54am

ooga chakka chakka chakka ooga chakka chakka chakka

it's all about feelings
And Swedes singing phonetically!

30 Venezuela lover  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:49:43am

Send them to D.C. We have over 115 pages of attorneys listed in the phone book. They are all looking for targets to sue. It's a secret defense strategy to protect against dangers to the American way of life.

Charles, count on me to chip in if you need a legal defense fund.

31 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:49:59am

re: #17 pat

lol
They can sue me...
I have exactly $3.98, four Romanian stamps, a peso and two old subway tokens.

32 BenZacharia  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:50:10am

re: #25 insanity police

I get it. Vienna is not the country, its an insane asylum. Close the gates, and keep the inmates inside.

Quite. 70-80% of SS officers were Austrians, as well as a certain corporal.

33 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:50:31am

re: #26 Dirk Diggler

NO!
lol

34 mayor of imaginationland  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:50:35am

re: #31 BabbaZee

I call subway tokens

35 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:50:51am

I get it. They've been exposed. First, they tried to hide it - deny it - and now they are just nuttin up cause they know there's nothing they can do since CJ's light has shinned upon them.

36 Poitiers-Lepanto  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:51:16am

wow
There are some really nasty sentences in those emails.

These guys have really lost their minds.
I wonder HOW BIG was the plan, how deep.

37 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:51:30am

re: #34 mayor of imaginationland

you got 'em lol

38 kulthur  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:51:48am

Defamation? That requires that what you said/published was untrue. I'd love to watch the post-discovery client-lawyer conference in which the plaintiff's lawyer advises, "Um... well you are in bed with what could reasonably be construed as fascist, white power groups. I'm not sure that I can continue this case and avoid sanctions for bringing a suit without merit, folks. And besides - why the hell are you associating with these people anyway?"

39 Peacekeeper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:51:49am

BIG JOHNSON IS RIPPING US OFF!

40 mayor of imaginationland  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:51:50am

re: #35 Owl

The question remains, is it nuttin up or just a display of their true colors?

41 BenZacharia  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:52:10am

re: #31 BabbaZee

re: #17 pat

lol
They can sue me...
I have exactly $3.98, four Romanian stamps, a peso and two old subway tokens.

Rich bitch. Can I bum a quarter? Make that the peso, Mexican lint is worth more than US lint.

42 Killgore Trout  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:52:13am
Do you realize how Charles endangered Bat Y’eor by permitting her real name to be revealed on his site? The New York Times beat him to it, but that’s the company he keeps.


Charles is a tool of CAIR and NYT!

43 Iron Fist  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:52:35am

As I have said before, I think it is very telling that they would throw away established friendships and alliances in the name of dubious new ones.

44 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:53:19am
I also spoke to Siggy about Dymphna's emotional state during the podcast. I believe I said that her voice "quivered" --with anger or outrage or some other intense emotion. I wondered if she was afraid of something.

I remember this part of the conversation, and I'd have to say yes- she' afraid. She's afraid that everything her and "baron" worked for is going to be lost. And it's a well founded fear, because they screwed up. They are not able to withstand the truth. Instead, they continue clinging to their meme- which only propagates the insanity, fear and loss of influence I'm sure they're beginning to feel. They've made quite a hole for themselves, and I think panic might be setting in as they're realize just how deep they've dug themselves.

45 Spiny Norman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:53:36am

re: #27 Killgore Trout

This is who Charles Johnson is attacking. It’s shameful. If Dewinter cared, he would be within his rights to sue Charles for defamation...at the very least.
At the very least? What stronger action would be within his rights? That's a very spooky statement.

Funny thing is, David Irving's supporters urged him to sue Deborah Lipstadt, so he did... and lost in humiliating fashion.

Dewinter would be a colossal fool if he went that route.

46 loppyd  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:54:00am

The lady doth protest too much....

47 Killgore Trout  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:54:13am
Andrew Bostom is disgusted. He was the one who sent me the hat tip on the American Thinker essay suggesting that Charles had been taken in by Belgian intel psyops. He probably was: he had information up and ready to go instantly. Charles was prepped and prepared.

....and Belgian psyops!

48 mayor of imaginationland  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:54:24am

re: #44 Sharmuta

Mein Fuhrer, zey have found us! To the cyanide!

49 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:54:44am

re: #40 mayor of imaginationland

re: #35 Owl

The question remains, is it nuttin up or just a display of their true colors?


From readin' up on 'em, I thought nuttin' up WAS their true colors. :)

50 Peacekeeper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:54:50am

It's not goodbye. Heil be seeing you in all the familiar places...

51 Spiny Norman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:54:51am

re: #26 Dirk Diggler

Babbazee,
Now is Dewinter of their discontent!
(Groans) Get out.

Hey! Charles himself used that as a headline.

=^D

52 loppyd  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:55:29am

...

53 mayor of imaginationland  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:55:30am

re: #49 Owl

You do have a point.

54 loppyd  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:56:14am

re: #52 loppyd

Sorry about that.

Phone rang.

55 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:56:16am
I was wrong. Apparently it is not possible to be a friend to Dymphna if you disagree with her.
56 insanity police  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:56:16am

re: #32 BenZacharia

That does explain a lot.

57 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:56:26am
58 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:56:38am

re: #31 BabbaZee

re: #17 pat

lol
They can sue me...
I have exactly $3.98, four Romanian stamps, a peso and two old subway tokens.

I'll take the $3.98. :-D

They can have my debt, if they want to sue.

59 tfc3rid  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:56:39am

This is just way too out of hand...

Any threats like that are just way too much...

60 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:56:53am

yeah! me! ;)


OT - hey norman, i've often wondered - why are you "spiney" ?

61 Killgore Trout  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:57:05am

re: #44 Sharmuta

They've made quite a hole for themselves, and I think panic might be setting in as they're realize just how deep they've dug themselves.


I agree. They've been panicked for a few weeks now. It only seems to be getting worse.

62 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:57:07am

re: #50 Peacekeeper

lol

63 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:57:08am

re: #31 BabbaZee

re: #17 pat

lol
They can sue me...
I have exactly $3.98, four Romanian stamps, a peso and two old subway tokens.

Have you fully disclosed this to the IRS?

Hillary says you have too much, and she wants it now.

64 coquimbojoe  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:57:10am

re: #7 JammieWearingFool

These folks need to quit while they're behind.

Zactly. I have stopped reading them because when you associate with Nazi's everything you do becomes tainted. I would hate to bring up a point and have someone say "didn't that come from someone who sides with Naxis". Apologies to BabbZee, but Nazis ruin everything.

(Loved the Movie Babba)

65 Spiny Norman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:57:19am

re: #47 Killgore Trout

Andrew Bostom is disgusted. He was the one who sent me the hat tip on the American Thinker essay suggesting that Charles had been taken in by Belgian intel psyops. He probably was: he had information up and ready to go instantly. Charles was prepped and prepared.
....and Belgian psyops!

Of course, we ALL know who's REALLY behind this...

66 Poitiers-Lepanto  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:57:44am

I am sorry but I have to post this from the crazy emails:

Charles had been taken in by Belgian intel psyops. He probably was: he had information up and ready to go instantly. Charles was prepped and prepared

This is a heck of a thing to WRITE.

Talk about libel...

67 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:57:48am

re: #55 storagemanager

I was wrong. Apparently it is not possible to be a friend to Dymphna if you disagree with her.

there's lots of that going around.

68 Peacekeeper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:57:50am
69 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:58:17am

re: #64 coquimbojoe

thanks

70 Dirk Diggler  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:58:24am

loppyd,

...

An incredibly profound observation, lopps.

71 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:58:32am

re: #67 BabbaZee

re: #55 storagemanager

I was wrong. Apparently it is not possible to be a friend to Dymphna if you disagree with her.

there's lots of that going around.

yup

72 mayor of imaginationland  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:58:47am

re: #65 Spiny Norman

re: #47 Killgore Trout


Andrew Bostom is disgusted. He was the one who sent me the hat tip on the American Thinker essay suggesting that Charles had been taken in by Belgian intel psyops. He probably was: he had information up and ready to go instantly. Charles was prepped and prepared.
....and Belgian psyops!

Of course, we ALL know who's REALLY behind this...

KARL ROVE and the Bushitler Cabal!
(goes off in corner mumbling about beans)

73 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:59:07am
Robert Spencer is carefully silent about all this because...well, because he hasgood reason to be careful. We all have to make a living.

He made his case.

74 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:59:12am

re: #63 mama winger

Hiya mama, how's it hangin'?

75 Peacekeeper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:59:19am

Babba! Always Sig Heiling right in Der Fuhrer's Face.

76 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:59:20am

re: #61 Killgore Trout

I read at gov how despite the LGF hate threads being full of comments, their traffic has not increased significantly. That's very telling if you ask me. They are panicked- they're feeling the blowback.

77 loppyd  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:59:44am

re: #70 Dirk Diggler

loppyd,

...

An incredibly profound observation, lopps.

Hey! I resemble that remark. See my #54.

78 justnobody  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:59:48am

Do they really think the Jewish-Freemasonic European courts will rule in favor of Dewinter?

/

79 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:59:52am

re: #44 Sharmuta

I also spoke to Siggy about Dymphna's emotional state during the podcast. I believe I said that her voice "quivered" --with anger or outrage or some other intense emotion. I wondered if she was afraid of something.

I remember this part of the conversation, and I'd have to say yes- she' afraid. She's afraid that everything her and "baron" worked for is going to be lost. And it's a well founded fear, because they screwed up. They are not able to withstand the truth. Instead, they continue clinging to their meme- which only propagates the insanity, fear and loss of influence I'm sure they're beginning to feel. They've made quite a hole for themselves, and I think panic might be setting in as they're realize just how deep they've dug themselves.

They've dug in really deep. Any deeper, and I'm afraid Dymphna and the Baron will have themselves a new volcano in their backyard as they will have entered the mantle.

80 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:00:29am

I think maybe they are worried that we'll post all that other stuff we have on them. You know, the stuff we know that we're holding; locked away in the Lizard Archives Room. I thought I saw Atlas walkin' outta there the other day with something stuffed in her socks, but then, turns out it was just Berger in drag.


...and it was toilet paper.


oh well.

/wink wink

81 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:00:44am

re: #79 Honorary Yooper

Next stop- China.

82 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:01:08am

re: #76 Sharmuta

re: #61 Killgore Trout

I read at gov how despite the LGF hate threads being full of comments, their traffic has not increased significantly. That's very telling if you ask me. They are panicked- they're feeling the blowback.

And they have the nerve to call us an echo chamber.

83 insanity police  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:01:20am

O/T
Disgraced Former Professor Ward Churchill Attempts to Connect Nazism, Zionism In Visit To UC Davis

Ward also laughs when someone blamed Bush and Cheney for 9/11

84 Spiny Norman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:01:27am

re: #60 Owl

yeah! me! ;)

OT - hey norman, i've often wondered - why are you "spiney" ?

Cool! I get to post this link again: The Piranha Brothers, Part 2.

(Part 1.)

85 Killgore Trout  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:01:33am
Charles has dropped some of his allegations and has been forced by our insistence to retract online his comments accusing us — CVF — of attempting to mount a DOS attack on him (a denial of service). CVF did no such thing.


Did Charles ever accuse them of this? If he did I missed it. A blog as small as GoV could never pull off a DOS attack big enough to bring down even a small blog much less LGF.

86 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:01:48am

re: #75 Peacekeeper

Ya VOL!

Hooplewanky Von Gruppenrippershtwakken
reporting for duty~

87 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:01:48am

So, you're saying that these people have a problem with Sanity? Go figure. Will they be fighting with Dr. Reality next?

88 Dirk Diggler  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:01:52am

loppyd,

Hey! I resemble that remark. See my #54.

I was just kidding.

89 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:01:58am

re: #82 Honorary Yooper

And they have the nerve to call us an echo chamber! ;)

90 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:02:05am

Good grief, they certainly are hauling the old water buckets for DeWinter, aren't they? I really am beginning to wonder if Dymphna's contempt for Hirsi Ali might have been based on matters other than her atheism. . . certainly GoV didn't want to give Hirsi a second chance, or admit that she held some of the same beliefs that they did or even the time of day!

91 pat  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:02:12am

At least one Euro Blog has taken a different tack in spite of many entreaties to get involved.
Islam In Europe remains basically uninvolved in the debate and continues to do excellent reporting. Here is a summation of a Norwegian Lawyer's arguement to the government that Muslims who engage in Honoe killing, and presumably Jihad, be given lighter sentences because such is part of their culture. Jaw dropping. The arrogant ass ignores the effect on women in his attempt to prove that he is a superior being.
[Link: islamineurope.blogspot.com...]

92 Lateral  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:02:16am

Wow. I guess its time to remove the bookmark for GOV. Sounds like they are in fact hatemongers.
Dymphna sounds like she needs to get out and take a vacation from the blogging, or get some new meds.
The race and/or religion cards make me go from caring, to want you 'to go jump off a pier' so fast, and are so often used as trump (becasuse they have nothing else) by islamists and leftists. GOV has joined them in my opinion.

93 Poitiers-Lepanto  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:02:35am

If I had (and I had NOT) any doubt about all this being a GIANT provocation, now it's absolutely clear that it was indeed an attempt to destroy everything that Charles has built in so many years of hard work.

Their rage speaks volumes...

94 Ma Sands  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:02:38am

re: #74 BabbaZee

re: #63 mama winger

Hiya mama, how's it hangin'?


Am I correct in thinking that mama now also has a sock puppet? :)

95 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:02:38am

re: #85 Killgore Trout

Charles has dropped some of his allegations and has been forced by our insistence to retract online his comments accusing us — CVF — of attempting to mount a DOS attack on him (a denial of service). CVF did no such thing.

Did Charles ever accuse them of this? If he did I missed it. A blog as small as GoV could never pull off a DOS attack big enough to bring down even a small blog much less LGF.

Oh for f*ck's sake, they use Blogger, not even their own freaking server, unlike Charles.

96 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:02:42am

Belgian intel psyops

OMG. Bwaahahahahahaa.....


these must be the same folks that post on TB2k.

unreal. and stupid.

97 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:02:44am

re: #87 JamesTKirk

So, you're saying that these people have a problem with Sanity? Go figure. Will they be fighting with Dr. Reality next?

LMAO!

98 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:03:08am

re: #87 JamesTKirk

lol

99 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:03:12am
You see, I have nothing left to lose here. You have made me look bad — “scared,” “angry”, “protesting too much”, etc. But if it goes public, then I will at least have company — to wit, you and Siggy. Your lack of due diligence will be apparent from the first moment off the unofficial podcast , when you ask “is Vlaams Belang a person?” It goes downhill from there

Pride...this is about pride...and nothing to do...with fighting jihad.

100 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:03:16am

re: #84 Spiny Norman

"Dinsdale..."

101 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:04:07am

re: #94 Ma Sands

huh?

No that would not be correct.

102 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:04:07am

Mlada Fronta Dnes – neo-Nazis infiltrating Czech Armed Forces

Remember all the fuss a few weeks ago when a neo-Nazi group tried to march through the Jewish quarter on the anniversary of Kristallnacht? That march was prevented, but led to much discussion about the size and seriousness of the neo-Nazi threat in the Czech Republic. Now a leading Czech newspaper has claimed that neo-Nazis have managed to infiltrate the Czech Armed Forces, and has the evidence to prove it.

103 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:04:17am

re: #95 Honorary Yooper

It wasn't gov it was cvf- and there was a few comments made about it.

104 Charles  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:04:28am

re: #42 Killgore Trout

Do you realize how Charles endangered Bat Y’eor by permitting her real name to be revealed on his site? The New York Times beat him to it, but that’s the company he keeps.

Charles is a tool of CAIR and NYT!

This is such crap. I "endangered" Bat Ye'or now, by trying to publicize an article about her in the New York Times? These people have become self-mocking jokes.

By the way, I was contacted by an associate of Ye'or after that NYT article appeared at LGF, and I offered to delete my post. I was told it didn't matter because it had already appeared in the New York Times. But now, after all this time, it pops up here as another smear attack on me, in a private email to another blogger. Dymphna also lied about other things in her email.

There's a deliberate, dishonest campaign of character assassination going on.

105 insanity police  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:04:37am

re: #83 insanity police

O/T
Disgraced Former Professor Ward Churchill Attempts to Connect Nazism, Zionism In Visit To UC Davis

Ward also laughs when someone blamed Bush and Cheney for 9/11

Correction: He didn't laugh, he "smiled and shrugged." Not much better.

106 so.cal.swede  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:04:43am

Ignore them, Charles... Don't get sucked into their drama.

107 loppyd  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:04:46am

re: #88 Dirk Diggler

loppyd,

Hey! I resemble that remark. See my #54.

I was just kidding.

So was I!

Off to get food to stop spastic posting.

108 Poitiers-Lepanto  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:04:53am

re: #96 Owl

Belgian intel psyops

We are getting a SECOND monthly check ! YAY !

/it took time to understand the shekel thing, now I will have to study the Belgian currency...

109 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:05:09am
Let me reiterate what I said earlier. I have no intention of deleting the podcast, despite the fact that my side of a private conversation was also recorded. I am not ashamed of or embarrassed by any of the opinions I expressed after the podcast. I'm sorry Dymphna's feelings were hurt, but if she can't stand someone disagreeing with her, or suggesting that she felt "'scared', 'angy' or 'protesting too much'" -- then maybe she shouldn't be blogging.

I can't help thinking that for someone who "hates" to be a victim, she's playing it for all its worth.

Lot of that going around...on at least three blogs.

110 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:05:16am

re: #84 Spiny Norman


I'll watch when i get home. thanks! :)

111 Spiny Norman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:05:25am

re: #85 Killgore Trout

Charles has dropped some of his allegations and has been forced by our insistence to retract online his comments accusing us — CVF — of attempting to mount a DOS attack on him (a denial of service). CVF did no such thing.
Did Charles ever accuse them of this? If he did I missed it. A blog as small as GoV could never pull off a DOS attack big enough to bring down even a small blog much less LGF.

Of course, they posted a link to that, right?

Right?

112 BenZacharia  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:05:34am

re: #102 NJDhockeyfan

Same thang happening here, throw in the gang bangers too. reduced enlistment standards.

113 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:05:48am

re: #93 Poitiers-Lepanto

it was indeed an attempt to destroy everything that Charles has built in so many years of hard work.

And it blew up in their faces- that explains the rage as well as the fear.

114 Charles  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:05:56am

re: #85 Killgore Trout

Charles has dropped some of his allegations and has been forced by our insistence to retract online his comments accusing us — CVF — of attempting to mount a DOS attack on him (a denial of service). CVF did no such thing.

Did Charles ever accuse them of this? If he did I missed it. A blog as small as GoV could never pull off a DOS attack big enough to bring down even a small blog much less LGF.

I never accused them of "mounting a DOS attack," either. I reported that a bot from vigilantfreedom.org was hitting our site a lot, and it was completely true. I never used the words "DOS attack."

115 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:06:41am

re: #108 Poitiers-Lepanto

re: #96 Owl
Belgian intel psyops

We are getting a SECOND monthly check ! YAY !

/it took time to understand the shekel thing, now I will have to study the Belgian currency...

I forget - do they use Euros? Because I really don't want to paid in Euros.

(The conversion rate from Euros to Latinum is horrible.)

116 pat  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:06:51am

Mama Winger and others a great roundup of Hillary Moonbat quotes. Including the one where she will raise taxes for the greater good.
[Link: deathby1000papercuts.blogspot.com...]

117 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:06:55am

re: #104 Charles

Ain't the first time this happened to you and it wont be the last.

As always, their tongues will dig their own graves.

118 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:07:12am

Ok.
It's after 9am, it's gonna rain, and I don't feel like doin' diddly, so...
Here's to startin' up the FNDT.
Drink idiotic!

119 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:07:46am

re: #108 Poitiers-Lepanto

re: #96 Owl


Belgian intel psyops

We are getting a SECOND monthly check ! YAY !

/it took time to understand the shekel thing, now I will have to study the Belgian currency...


I can't get too excited about it..........the government gets half of everything i make. (almost...)

120 bp sf  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:07:49am

OT:

Roger Smith just croaked.

Who? He propelled the fat fvck to a career with "Roger & Me".

They can both rot.

121 Cognito  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:07:50am

Seems to me we've moved beyond any actual issue, now, and have tumbled into a tempest-stirred bloggy teapot.

As Lawrence told Ali, "so long as the Arabs fight tribe against tribe, so long will they be a little people, a silly people, greedy, barbarous, and cruel, as you are."

122 Poitiers-Lepanto  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:07:51am

re: #104 Charles


There's a deliberate, dishonest campaign of character assassination going on.

Of course...the good guys are the ones who take flowers to the tombs of the VOLUNTEER SS...

/in the upside down world...

123 mayor of imaginationland  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:08:03am

re: #114 Charles

It would seem that them knowing exactly what sort of attack they mounted, however futilely, when you did not discuss it kind of incriminates them

124 Ma Sands  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:08:16am

re: #101 BabbaZee

Okay......maybe I mis-read.....thanks.

125 BenZacharia  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:08:30am

re: #118 Capitalist Tool

Might as well, can't work today, 'sitting' the wifffeee.

126 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:08:38am

re: #114 Charles

I never accused them of "mounting a DOS attack," either. I reported that a bot from vigilantfreedom.org was hitting our site a lot, and it was completely true. I never used the words "DOS attack."

That's how I remember it as well. As someone else said, they're far too small to mount a serious DOS attack anyway; it takes a Fark.com link to knock the hamsters off of their wheels...

127 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:08:39am
I find it sad that people who I liked and respected seem to be on a campaign to deliberately sabotage relationships with friends and allies.

I wonder what other friends they will attack next?

You just never know.

128 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:08:51am

re: #124 Ma Sands

Okeedokee then

129 Spiny Norman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:09:11am

re: #110 Owl

re: #84 Spiny Norman

I'll watch when i get home. thanks! :)

The source of the nickname is in Part 2, but it'll make more sense if you watch Part 1 first.

;^)

130 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:09:13am

re: #104 Charles

Charles, Dymphna's gonna keep up this smear campaign until this happens:

1. She gets tired of it (which I doubt)
2. Someone finally reins her in (again, I don't see that happening in the GoV echo chamber)
3. She loses her Blogger account (which I hope not, unless the attacks become too virlent)

So, she's going to keep up this smear campaign as long as she can, and I see little end to it. Anyone who gets in her way will also be fodder for her smear campaign, as Dr. Sanity just found out.

131 Poitiers-Lepanto  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:09:16am

re: #115 JamesTKirk

re: #108 Poitiers-Lepanto

re: #96 Owl

Belgian intel psyops

We are getting a SECOND monthly check ! YAY !

/it took time to understand the shekel thing, now I will have to study the Belgian currency...

I forget - do they use Euros? Because I really don't want to paid in Euros.

(The conversion rate from Euros to Latinum is horrible.)

EUROS are good !

/chavez says so...

132 Poitiers-Lepanto  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:10:06am

re: #113 Sharmuta

re: #93 Poitiers-Lepanto

it was indeed an attempt to destroy everything that Charles has built in so many years of hard work.

And it blew up in their faces- that explains the rage as well as the fear.

I think that this is exactly what is happening.

133 SecretInternetDoucheBag  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:10:07am

Charles I would really love to read some of the death threats or hate mail you recieve. Is there anyway you could post a thread or link of some of the more vile/idiotic ones that you get?

134 Muadib  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:10:16am

re: #62 BabbaZee

re: #50 Peacekeeper

lol

A perfectly fitting theme song for this insanity!

135 BenZacharia  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:11:01am

re: #133 SecretInternetDoucheBag

First things first. A page of blocked users.

136 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:11:08am

re: #114 Charles

re: #85 Killgore Trout


Charles has dropped some of his allegations and has been forced by our insistence to retract online his comments accusing us — CVF — of attempting to mount a DOS attack on him (a denial of service). CVF did no such thing.

Did Charles ever accuse them of this? If he did I missed it. A blog as small as GoV could never pull off a DOS attack big enough to bring down even a small blog much less LGF.

I never accused them of "mounting a DOS attack," either. I reported that a bot from vigilantfreedom.org was hitting our site a lot, and it was completely true. I never used the words "DOS attack."

I can't believe how liberal they all sound( in a bad way).....

I've had discussions with liberals online and in person for more than two decades now( yea, i started early) and the tactic of getting someone to argue over WHAT they said, so you don't have to argue about the actual issue is something I''ve faced over and over again. And it's especially annoying when it's online and you spend your time UN-twisting your words, only to find that once they've twisted them, it's uber-hard to get back to arguing/discussing the actual topic you were there to discuss.

play # 345 democratic handbook. 1982

137 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:11:53am

re: #120 bp sf

OT:

Roger Smith just croaked.

Who? He propelled the fat fvck to a career with "Roger & Me".

They can both rot.

Here's a quick link to the Free Press story.

138 BenZacharia  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:11:55am

TTFN™, dooty calls

139 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:12:05am

re: #131 Poitiers-Lepanto

re: #115 JamesTKirk
...I really don't want to paid in Euros. (The conversion rate from Euros to Latinum is horrible.)

EUROS are good!

/chavez says so...

So does Iran.

It's just a [colorful metaphor] good thing that when we switched from petrol to dilithium, that the crystals weren't also found primarily in the territory of savages and fascists.

140 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:12:32am

re: #104 Charles

Dymphna also lied about other things in her email.

Honestly, Charles, I'm not sure it amounts to 'lies'. I think the woman is unhinged. When I saw their initial complaint about Infidel Bloggers Alliance, my jaw just dropped.

(For those of you who missed it, Baron and Dymphna cross-posted sometimes on IBA. They felt slighted that one of their posts was not immediately posted at the top of the page. They accused IBA of 'changing procedures w/o informing' or deliberately insulting them. )

They manner in which they have perpetuated this is also ver disturbing. The thread yesterday about the 'Fascist Salute' made me feel as tho I was looking at the intro to a Lovecraft horror novel.

141 Eowyn2  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:13:26am

re: #32 BenZacharia

re: #25 insanity police


I get it. Vienna is not the country, its an insane asylum. Close the gates, and keep the inmates inside.

Quite. 70-80% of SS officers were Austrians, as well as a certain corporal.

there were also austrians who bugged out of austria at that time. The sound of music was based on a true story prior to 'this has been overly dramatized in our effort to get you to believe that black is white and white is blue'

142 LANMaster  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:13:45am

LOL
When they start ignoring you, Charles, that's when you need to worry that something is askew.

We're right behind you, Charles.

143 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:13:59am

re: #101 BabbaZee

re: #94 Ma Sands

huh?

No that would not be correct.

YES! I do have a sock puppet! :)

Last night during open reg I played the role of

PeaceDuckSoup.

/ I love groucho. And hate the giant Duck of Peace :)

144 lawhawk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:14:12am

OT:
The Middle East Muddle. Israel is surrounded by wolves, and Olmert is wholly intent upon feeding 'em red meat.

145 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:14:29am

re: #132 Poitiers-Lepanto

They bought into their own propaganda so much, they are now panicked looking at the bill. It's easier to blame Charles for the bill than take responsibility for it themselves- so that's what we're seeing.

You know you're over the target when you start receiving flack. Way to hit the target, Charles.

146 J.S.  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:14:43am

In a word -- bizarre. Contradictory. What I don't understand is this -- Dymphna doesn't like the podcast's last 23 minutes or so, so she wants it to be removed/deleted. Next she claims that if it's not deleted, she'll get a transcript of it and make it public...Oooh, the horror...(as I laugh). Maybe she's actually anxious for publicity? -- just wants more "notice"...(?) If she really wants "privacy" -- this ain't the way to go about it. just sayin'

147 so.cal.swede  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:14:57am

bah.. oddcast has removed the thing where you can create a talking character... i wanted to make one saying "congratulations on a job well done. the checks from the israeli government and the belgian psyops departement are in the mail. all hail xenu"

148 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:15:10am

re: #140 wahabicorridor

re: #104 Charles


Dymphna also lied about other things in her email.

Honestly, Charles, I'm not sure it amounts to 'lies'. I think the woman is unhinged. When I saw their initial complaint about Infidel Bloggers Alliance, my jaw just dropped.

(For those of you who missed it, Baron and Dymphna cross-posted sometimes on IBA. They felt slighted that one of their posts was not immediately posted at the top of the page. They accused IBA of 'changing procedures w/o informing' or deliberately insulting them. )

They manner in which they have perpetuated this is also ver disturbing. The thread yesterday about the 'Fascist Salute' made me feel as tho I was looking at the intro to a Lovecraft horror novel.


That one disturbed me also.

149 yavanna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:15:25am

That Dymphna really needs to give up the coffee or whatever the heck it is she is doing...

andre: #66 Poitiers-Lepanto

I am sorry but I have to post this from the crazy emails:

Charles had been taken in by Belgian intel psyops. He probably was: he had information up and ready to go instantly. Charles was prepped and prepared

This is a heck of a thing to WRITE.

Talk about libel...

Libel yes, but considering the source I think just passing out complimentary tin foil hats to them will make them go away happy!

~yav~

150 Jimmy The Clam  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:15:58am

Holy CRAP Charles!
These people are nuts.

I now announce that I stand corrected in originally believing that your position was fueled by more emotion than fact.
I was willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and you were not; yours seems to have been the correct call.

151 coquimbojoe  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:16:46am

re: #104 Charles

I had heard of Bat Y'eor BEFORE you posted that linky thing, amazingly enough.

It seems as though people who are willing to associate with Nazis are willing do do or say anything. What ever they through at you, it seems a proper response could be "...but then again, you side with Nazis".

152 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:16:51am

OT:
ILLINOIS MAN PLEADS GUILTY IN FOILED PLAN TO SET OFF GRENADES IN SHOPPING MALL

CHICAGO – A Rockford, Il., man, admitted today in Federal Court that he planned to set off several grenades in garbage cans at a shopping mall in Rockford last December. The defendant, Derrick Shareef, 23, pleaded guilty to one count of attempting to use a weapon of mass destruction. Shareef was arrested on Dec. 6, 2006, by agents of the FBI-led Chicago Joint Terrorism Task Force ( JTTF ) when he met with an undercover agent at a store parking lot in Rockford to trade a set of stereo speakers for four hand grenades and a hand gun. He has remained in federal custody since he was arrested. Shareef was scheduled to stand trial beginning December 10, 2007.

153 Killgore Trout  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:17:08am

re: #114 Charles

I never accused them of "mounting a DOS attack," either. I reported that a bot from vigilantfreedom.org was hitting our site a lot, and it was completely true. I never used the words "DOS attack."


Ah, I remember the bot discussion too. I never interpreted it as a dos attack, nor was it ever mentioned. It makes her statement even more dishonest....

Charles has dropped some of his allegations and has been forced by our insistence to retract online his comments accusing us — CVF — of attempting to mount a DOS attack on him (a denial of service). CVF did no such thing.


You never made the allegation so I also assume you were never "forced" to retract it by their insistence to retract it.
They've really lost their marbles.

154 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:17:18am

re: #150 Jimmy The Clam

Holy CRAP Charles!
These people are nuts.

I now announce that I stand corrected in originally believing that your position was fueled by more emotion than fact.
I was willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and you were not; yours seems to have been the correct call.


Takes a big person to say that. Comin' from me, that doesn't mean anything, but I'm just sayin. +1 to you.

155 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:18:23am

re: #141 Eowyn2

The sound of music was based on a true story prior to 'this has been overly dramatized in our effort to get you to believe that black is white and white is blue'

A lot of the changes were to fit it into the proper musical/movie formula; for one thing, you had to have a dramatic climax, which is why they had the Von Trapps escape on foot over the mountains when, in reality, they simply took a train out of Austria.

There's actually a Japanese animated version of the story which is much more faithful to the reality.

156 Eowyn2  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:18:36am

re: #108 Poitiers-Lepanto

re: #96 Owl


Belgian intel psyops

We are getting a SECOND monthly check ! YAY !

/it took time to understand the shekel thing, now I will have to study the Belgian currency...

i hope the 2nd one is bigger than the first one. my zionist overlords are so tight they squeek, either that or one of you is skimming.

157 Peacekeeper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:18:42am

BIG BELGIAN INTELLIGENCE PYS-OPS IS RIPPING US OFF!

158 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:18:57am

It would seem they are the same kind of people...as those ATS.

159 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:19:00am

re: #146 J.S.

In a word -- bizarre. Contradictory. What I don't understand is this -- Dymphna doesn't like the podcast's last 23 minutes or so, so she wants it to be removed/deleted. Next she claims that if it's not deleted, she'll get a transcript of it and make it public...Oooh, the horror...(as I laugh). Maybe she's actually anxious for publicity? -- just wants more "notice"...(?) If she really wants "privacy" -- this ain't the way to go about it. just sayin'

That is bizzare. A podcast by its very nature is already public.

160 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:19:05am

Preemptive smear job on myself, lol :

BabbaZee has three heads, half a brain, and no spleen, among other missing parts! She knows shit from Shineola about Europe!
She is rumored to be preternaturally pixilated,
and beyond that, she is notoriously Bee Eye Gee, so we have heard through peachable sources!
OOOM blabla and ummm bwebwe too, so there!
Many tribesmen of the clans that keep track say she is fortiscuitous and von remnantshtiened! Not to mention obtuse, abstruse and hung like a moose!
Sue her immediately because those Romanian stamps are worth millions.
She is an unidentified flying bible thumping threat to world peace.
Stone the unfaithful monkey!

161 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:19:07am

re: #154 Owl

I plussed him up too. He knows I gave him quite a hard time about this one day, but I'm glad to see this post today. Thanks, Jimmy.

162 Slumbering Behemoth  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:19:21am

OT: Thanks a lot, Imus!*

*No, I don't actually blame him, it just sounded funnier to me that way.

163 itellu3times  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:19:21am

I'm confused. I'm going to get a hotdog.

164 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:19:40am

RON FREAKIN' PAUL 11!1!11!11!11!11!


/heh.

:)

165 mayor of imaginationland  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:19:59am

OT

Here is an interesting development

I personally advocate safe sex, but abstinance is an important link in the chain of stopping the spread of AIDS especially with the number cases down, and I don't know what removing it would do. Some people will only respond to an absolute decree

166 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:20:03am

re: #124 Ma Sands

re: #101 BabbaZee

Okay......maybe I mis-read.....thanks.

Hi MA! So glad to see you back! MWAH!

(see my #143 - it explains all)

:)

167 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:20:11am

re: #143 mama winger

LOL!

168 Josephine  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:20:26am

re: #104 Charles

re: #42 Killgore Trout

Do you realize how Charles endangered Bat Y’eor by permitting her real name to be revealed on his site? The New York Times beat him to it, but that’s the company he keeps.


Charles is a tool of CAIR and NYT!

This is such crap. I "endangered" Bat Ye'or now, by trying to publicize an article about her in the New York Times? These people have become self-mocking jokes.

By the way, I was contacted by an associate of Ye'or after that NYT article appeared at LGF, and I offered to delete my post. I was told it didn't matter because it had already appeared in the New York Times. But now, after all this time, it pops up here as another smear attack on me, in a private email to another blogger. Dymphna also lied about other things in her email.

There's a deliberate, dishonest campaign of character assassination going on.

I'm sure I read her real name in a Toronto paper. I suppose you're responsible for that, too?

/

169 coquimbojoe  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:20:27am

re: #163 itellu3times

I'm confused. I'm going to get a hotdog.

Get me one, with Kraut and hot mustard.... I'll get you back next week.

170 mayor of imaginationland  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:20:53am

stupid link didn't work
[Link: www.cnn.com...]

171 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:21:06am
Dear Mr. Brown:

I watched on a breaking cable TV news cast , here in the US, as tens of thousands of crazed Sudanese crowded into Khartoum today, demanding the summary execution of your hapless citizen, Ms. Gillian Gibbons for defamation of Islam. Yesterday, Ms. Gibbons was sentenced to 15 days in gaol and deportation to England.

This Muhammad teddy bear incident has been conflated into an international event akin to the Danish cartoon incident of early 2006 that caused the deaths of hundreds and considerable property damage and international controversy perpetrated by extremist Muslim Imams.

The safety and security of the doughty Ms. Gibbons is paramount as a signal that this form of barbarous incitement to hate over a frivolous matter such as the naming of a teddy bear by Ms. Gibbons students has gone far enough.

We, at American Congress for Truth (ACT), urge you to instruct your Foreign Minister to gain Ms. Gibbons immediate release and safe transport back to England.

To do anything less at this critical moment would be the height of folly and appeasement of Islamist xenophobia, not only in the Sudan, but around the world.

I, for one, would not want to see Ms. Gibbons dragged out of jail and beheaded like the famed valiant General Sir Charles “Chinese” Gordon, who was felled by Mahdist fanatics in Khartoum in 1885, whilst combating slavery in the Sudan. As one who bears his nickname, proudly, I urge you to act with resolve and alacrity. A life of a British citizen hangs in the balance.

Sincerely,

Jerome B. “Chinese” Gordon
Member of the Board
American Congress for Truth

[Link: blog.americancongressfortruth.com...]

172 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:21:13am

re: #150 Jimmy The Clam

Go Jimmy. Good man.

173 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:21:48am

re: #160 BabbaZee

She is an unidentified flying bible thumping threat to world peace

Well that part is probably true .......

LOL


{babba}

174 Eowyn2  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:22:09am

re: #152 NJDhockeyfan

OT:
ILLINOIS MAN PLEADS GUILTY IN FOILED PLAN TO SET OFF GRENADES IN SHOPPING MALL


CHICAGO – A Rockford, Il., man, admitted today in Federal Court that he planned to set off several grenades in garbage cans at a shopping mall in Rockford last December. The defendant, Derrick Shareef, 23, pleaded guilty to one count of attempting to use a weapon of mass destruction. Shareef was arrested on Dec. 6, 2006, by agents of the FBI-led Chicago Joint Terrorism Task Force ( JTTF ) when he met with an undercover agent at a store parking lot in Rockford to trade a set of stereo speakers for four hand grenades and a hand gun. He has remained in federal custody since he was arrested. Shareef was scheduled to stand trial beginning December 10, 2007.

Shareef? Just another misunderstood yute.

175 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:22:24am

re: #165 mayor of imaginationland

I personally advocate safe sex...

Check this story out - in China, police assume that any woman carrying condoms is a prostitute. There have been women sent to labor camps on prostitution changes solely because they were caught with a condom in their possession. Great way to fights AIDS there, China.

176 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:22:45am

re: #167 BabbaZee

re: #143 mama winger

LOL!

I thought you'd like that. We Marx Brothers fans need to stick together.

177 Killgore Trout  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:22:52am

re: #140 wahabicorridor

Honestly, Charles, I'm not sure it amounts to 'lies'. I think the woman is unhinged.


I think there are a few outright lies in her ramblings. The DoS attack thing is complete fiction and not a matter of nuance. It's also worth noting that they came off looking bad in the podcast so they're trying to get stuffed down the memory hole. They did the same thing with Dewinter's interview on the Shire podcast. Not only are they lying they're trying to get people to suppress information that makes them look bad.

178 Peacekeeper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:23:27am

You fools! "Charles Johnson" is just a front for the puppet masters in Brussels who seek to steal our precious bodily fluids. WAKE UP!

179 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:23:28am
re: #160 BabbaZee

Thump it.

180 coquimbojoe  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:23:51am

re: #170 mayor of imaginationland

stupid link didn't work
[Link: www.cnn.com...]

You would think she would be all for abstinence, or at least putting a 24 hour watch on her husband, that would probably, in and of itself, cut back on extra-marital sex happening in the US by a good 5%.....

181 experiencedtraveller  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:24:19am
It’s Kafkaesque — you should have seen what a scare it threw into his followers... and he enjoyed the game.

Dear Daffy Dymphna,

I am a free American. I am not a 'follower'. CJ and LGF succeed because of hard work and dedication. Get it straight.

Regards,
traveller.

182 Eowyn2  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:24:20am

re: #160 BabbaZee

strange, you dont look fortiscuitous

183 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:24:23am

re: #173 mama winger

lol lol lol

so is the spleen / partless part

There is always a grain of truth in all good shmears mah dears

184 Iron Fist  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:24:24am

re: #175 JamesTKirk,

But remember fundamentalist Christians are the greatest threat since, well, since the Mongol Hoard!

185 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:25:12am

re: #160 BabbaZee

BabbaZee has three heads, half a brain, and no spleen, among other missing parts!

First time I saw that, I read it as you were missing pants. I thought we had something in common there.

186 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:25:21am
Have you ever sat for ten minutes and listened to a live broadcast of a person dissecting you, while you knew they were so far off base they might as well have been talking from Mars? It’s an interesting experience

Gee- have you ever sat and thought about what caused you to have to listen to ten minutes of "dissection"? Golly- maybe it's because you launched personal attacks against a person who wasn't going to just lie down and take it and had the Truth on his side. You poor thing- it's called "karma".

187 Former Belgian  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:25:41am

re: #32 BenZacharia

re: #25 insanity police

I get it. Vienna is not the country, its an insane asylum. Close the gates, and keep the inmates inside.

Quite. 70-80% of SS officers were Austrians, as well as a certain corporal.

Catholics and ex-Catholics may remember that St. Dymphna is the patron saint of the mentally ill.

Seriously: until this episode with Dr. Pat Santy, I was still willing to consider that we were dealing with a principled disagreement that got completely out of hand. After this one, I've concluded that the people at GoV (especially Dymphna) have taken complete leave of their senses, or are on a bad LSD trip.

And having some experience with emotional blackmail in closed chapters of my personal life (besides it being the #1 propaganda tool of the 'Palestinian' cause), I recognize it when I see it. That "St. Dymphna" is insane enough to try this trick on a professional psychiatrist like Dr. Santy, of all things, speaks volumes.

188 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:25:41am

re: #174 Eowyn2

Shareef? Just another misunderstood yute.

Rock the Casbah, rock the Casbah.

189 segesta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:25:51am

I read this stuff from GOV, Dr. Sanity, etc. and can only think: Get over yourselves, nerds. It's the internet.

190 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:26:42am

re: #177 Killgore Trout

Would you shoot me an email please. nic is blue'd.

191 coquimbojoe  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:26:47am

re: #174 Eowyn2

re: #152 NJDhockeyfan

OT:
ILLINOIS MAN PLEADS GUILTY IN FOILED PLAN TO SET OFF GRENADES IN SHOPPING MALL


CHICAGO – A Rockford, Il., man, admitted today in Federal Court that he planned to set off several grenades in garbage cans at a shopping mall in Rockford last December. The defendant, Derrick Shareef, 23, pleaded guilty to one count of attempting to use a weapon of mass destruction. Shareef was arrested on Dec. 6, 2006, by agents of the FBI-led Chicago Joint Terrorism Task Force ( JTTF ) when he met with an undercover agent at a store parking lot in Rockford to trade a set of stereo speakers for four hand grenades and a hand gun. He has remained in federal custody since he was arrested. Shareef was scheduled to stand trial beginning December 10, 2007.

Shareef? Just another misunderstood yute.

They got the name wrong. It was Shareefson, he was Swedish see and unhappy with the treatment of Yoopers on the upper penninsula.....

192 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:27:15am

re: #178 Peacekeeper

You fools! "Charles Johnson" is just a front for the puppet masters in Brussels who seek to steal our precious bodily fluids. WAKE UP!

Anyone who wants to steal my precious fluids is going to have to get past my wife.

193 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:27:28am

re: #187 Former Belgian

Catholics and ex-Catholics may remember that St. Dymphna is the patron saint of the mentally ill.

How apropos can you get?

194 Charles  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:27:30am

re: #153 Killgore Trout

re: #114 Charles

I never accused them of "mounting a DOS attack," either. I reported that a bot from vigilantfreedom.org was hitting our site a lot, and it was completely true. I never used the words "DOS attack."

Ah, I remember the bot discussion too. I never interpreted it as a dos attack, nor was it ever mentioned. It makes her statement even more dishonest....


Charles has dropped some of his allegations and has been forced by our insistence to retract online his comments accusing us — CVF — of attempting to mount a DOS attack on him (a denial of service). CVF did no such thing.

You never made the allegation so I also assume you were never "forced" to retract it by their insistence to retract it.
They've really lost their marbles.

To be completely clear, what was happening was that their Word Press blog system was sending multiple trackback hits, because vigilantfreedom was obsessively posting links to every comment I made on the issue, so many that it resulted in thousands of hits.

So I did withdraw my inference that there was something sinister going on, but my observation of the automated hits coming from vigilantfreedom was correct.

195 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:27:46am

re: #182 Eowyn2

;~}

LOL

I should go put that one in my dictionary
I don't think it is there...

Fortiscuity /Fortiscuitous:

1) Fortitude developed via safely traversing dangerous circuitous paths

See : Excrusion (an excruciating excursion)

196 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:28:10am

re: #185 JamesTKirk

rotff

197 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:28:33am

re: #191 coquimbojoe

They got the name wrong. It was Shareefson, he was Swedish see and unhappy with the treatment of Yoopers on the upper penninsula.....


There ARE a lot of Swedes in Rockford LOL! On a personal note, my nephew was working there in that mall on the day in question.

198 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:28:47am

Speaking of which, ( Iron Fist's post), if your kids say they want " Assassin's Creed " for Christmas this year, you should think about getting it for them for Rahhhhhaaammmadannnnn instead.

Contrary to popular online statements; it is - so far - a story about poor muslims being attacked by evil Templars. Oh, and all the other pro-muslim, anti-Christian garbage they could think of to throw in there. The ironic thing? The game has a screen in the beginning that says it was made by people of all religious faiths. Which doesn't mean crap when it's still an anti-Christian game. Surprise.

Oh, and on top of all that - it's just a passable game with so-so graphics and repetitave gameplay. Next gen gaming my a$$.

199 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:29:06am

re: #187 Former Belgian

I've concluded that the people at GoV (especially Dymphna) have taken complete leave of their senses, or are on a bad LSD trip.

A little too much LDS never made me want to ally myself with nazis.

200 yavanna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:29:37am

The folks at GOV are not defending themselves like people that have been simply mis-understood. Their reactions shriek 'GUILTY'. When people are misunderstood - especially friends, the simply show where the misunderstanding occured, things get cleared up and everyone moves on, sometimes agreeing to disagree. GOV's constant hammering on this issue and their leap to aggressively defend themselves, and resorting to wild conspiracy as explanation and using character attacks exposes them for the idiots & liars that they are. THATS why they are shrieking.

201 razorbacker  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:29:41am

[Link: icanhascheezburger.com...]

The best laid plans of mice and men...

202 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:29:48am

Mentally ill people need a patron saint too. Probably more than one. :)

203 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:30:17am

re: #187 Former Belgian


Catholics and ex-Catholics may remember that St. Dymphna is the patron saint of the mentally ill.

laughing hysterically now.


A TREASURE you are.
You and Buzzsawmonkey.

LGF Treasures.

204 bulwrk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:30:33am

I never did like their sausages

205 myself  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:30:41am

it would be nice if the people in this multi-week argument would restrict their comments to the integrity of the European parties rather than the integrity of the people arguing. A bit of Buddhism would help each and every infidel.

206 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:30:53am

I really am beginning to wonder why Dymphna and the Baron are so emotionally invested in Dewinter and crew. Are they close, personal friends? Did Dewinter donate a kidney to one of them? Threaten to protect them from the vast, BelgianLizardoid Conspiracy? What?

I hate to keep harping on the Hirsi Ali thing, but it provides such a contrast to their current championing Dewinter and Vlaams Belang. When the controversy about Ali remaining in the United States, and getting protection, was going on, Dymphna claimed that Ali was underserving of any special security because, after all, she had made a movie insulting Islam, and those who go looking for trouble shouldn't be surprised when it comes. She also pretty much stated outright that Ali was unworthy of support because she wasn't Christian, and had secular ideas (which makes one kind've wonder about what Dymphna's idea of a good society is; an Irish/Catholic theocracy, no unbelievers allowed?)

The Baron then weighed in, claiming that, since our government can't protect everybody, it's really unfair to protect individuals with security services, since it can't guarantee protection for everyone.

Go figure.

207 SecretInternetDoucheBag  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:30:57am

re: #198 Owl

I rented it for my Xbox last night. It is a repetitive and stupid version of Prince of Persia, and lacks any sort of believability at all. I mean you can kill someone in broad daylight in a crowd and noone sees you.

208 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:31:17am

re: #191 coquimbojoe

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

LOL!
:-D

209 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:31:24am

Don't take the brown acid!

one hit and BLAMMO!

Ilsa She wolf of the SS!

210 Eowyn2  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:31:25am

re: #188 JamesTKirk

heck, my boys were misunderstood yutes too. Thats what one of them claimed when he got grounded for doing 105 down the interstate.

211 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:32:13am

re: #202 mama winger

Saint Sybil

212 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:32:25am

shes ten saints in one

213 Pullus Iulius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:32:31am

If the threat of a defamation suit is the worst they can do, then the volk have grown limp indeed.

214 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:32:46am

re: #205 myself

it would be nice if the people in this multi-week argument would restrict their comments to the integrity of the European parties rather than the integrity of the people arguing. A bit of Buddhism would help each and every infidel.


I love buddiasm. egg rolls and fried rice and stuff - and those little cookies.


what? what do you mean? But I thought that...oh, ok.

i still like eggrolls though.

215 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:33:02am

re: #211 BabbaZee

re: #202 mama winger

Saint Sybil

I need multiple saints. All the help I can get - I'll gladly welcome it :)

216 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:33:33am

re: #197 mama winger

re: #191 coquimbojoe


They got the name wrong. It was Shareefson, he was Swedish see and unhappy with the treatment of Yoopers on the upper penninsula.....

There ARE a lot of Swedes in Rockford LOL! On a personal note, my nephew was working there in that mall on the day in question.

I've been to that mall. It's pretty nice - biggest thing between Madison and Elgin.

217 yavanna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:33:53am

re: #196 BabbaZee

re: #185 JamesTKirk

rotff

alright, now i am curious! rolling on the floor..... uh... farting? :-D

218 jcm  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:33:53am

re: #206 TalkinKamel

I really am beginning to wonder why Dymphna and the Baron are so emotionally invested in Dewinter and crew. Are they close, personal friends? Did Dewinter donate a kidney to one of them? Threaten to protect them from the vast, BelgianLizardoid Conspiracy? What?

I hate to keep harping on the Hirsi Ali thing, but it provides such a contrast to their current championing Dewinter and Vlaams Belang. When the controversy about Ali remaining in the United States, and getting protection, was going on, Dymphna claimed that Ali was underserving of any special security because, after all, she had made a movie insulting Islam, and those who go looking for trouble shouldn't be surprised when it comes. She also pretty much stated outright that Ali was unworthy of support because she wasn't Christian, and had secular ideas (which makes one kind've wonder about what Dymphna's idea of a good society is; an Irish/Catholic theocracy, no unbelievers allowed?)

The Baron then weighed in, claiming that, since our government can't protect everybody, it's really unfair to protect individuals with security services, since it can't guarantee protection for everyone.

Go figure.

I am beginning to wonder if it has anything to do with melanin.

219 ContraJihadi  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:33:57am

Sigh, I do believe that the Baron and Dymphna are letting their narrative become their reality.

Lizards can be a tad cold-blooded at times in showing their disdain, but I have been following these threads, here and on GoV, and know that on the latter there have been some outright falsehoods spread about who has banned whom and under what circumstances. Better document everything, Charles, so the misrepresentations of fact don't bite you.

I must say that Dymphna's comments to Dr. Sanity--and I heard the whole podcast--are far too extreme. I believe it was a good Democrat who said, "If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen." And yes, although Dr. Sanity is right in saying that the facts about VB are not conclusive, methinks VB and their supporters at GoV protest too much.

If I remember correctly, Charles never said definitively that VB was neo-Nazi, just that its use of the Odin's Cross and the presence of its top members at the funeral smelled bad. And in response GoV points to a highly conjectural post on American Thinker to suggest strongly that Charles has been the victim of leftist psy-ops. Somehow this doesn't smell very kosher either. It's rather clear that Charles's "bump of skepticism" vibrates intensely when leftist propaganda comes along.

All together a bad bit of business, this falling out. I suppose one can find fault on both sides, but I have to say that Charles has been less vehement and fanciful than his opponents.

221 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:34:00am

re: #213 Pullus Iulius

If the threat of a defamation suit is the worst they can do, then the volk have grown limp indeed.

"He huffed and he puffed... and he signed an eviction notice." -Little Pig, Shrek

222 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:34:12am

re: #207 SecretInternetDoucheBag

re: #198 Owl

I rented it for my Xbox last night. It is a repetitive and stupid version of Prince of Persia, and lacks any sort of believability at all. I mean you can kill someone in broad daylight in a crowd and noone sees you.


exactly. and I don't know about the xbox version, but in the ps3 version his feet vanish alot, and he seems to be floating more than walking.

To me, it's a rip off of Oblivion, Prince of Persia, and Thief( GREAT PC game, if you've never played it)

223 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:34:14am

Ok, everyone, about the mental illness bit. You might be hitting a bit close to home and inflicting cruelty you don't intend.

Back off a bit ok?

Babba, check yer mail.

224 segesta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:34:33am

re: #199 JamesTKirk

What does Mitt Romney have to do with this? :-)

(I know, I know, it was a typo)

225 coquimbojoe  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:35:23am

re: #197 mama winger

On a personal note, my nephew was working there in that mall on the day in question.

Thats not funny. By the grace of G-d this thing didn't happen. It brings home the dangers that idiots like Shareef pose (and their apologists). I am now more glad that this was stopped.

226 zombie  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:35:24am

Charles said:

In her email to Dr. Sanity, Dymphna also lied about the “SF Chronicle sneaky comment trick” at LGF; she claims it is still operative at LGF, but in truth it was simply a proof of concept and was disabled after one day of testing.

On a related note, Charles, it would be absolutely foolish of you (or anyone) to leave that comment crypto-deletion trick in place after you've announced it, because anyone could quite easily prove you were doing it by visiting LGF using different browsers or by deleting cookies and unlogging in. How do I know this?...

Because I've just put up a new post at Investigate the Media in which I discuss an interview given by the Webmaster in response to our exposé, where she admits to the "graylisting" and crypto-deletion of comments, but then claims that, due to the outrage from readers, they have now stopped the practice. HOWEVER (and this is the whole point), I tested out her claim by making an innocuous comment, then viewing it logged in and logged out on different browsers, and it was visible on one and not visible on the other -- proving that (even two days after she claims to have stopped the practice), the Chronicle was still doing it.

The scandal continues!

227 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:35:43am

re: #224 segesta

re: #199 JamesTKirk

What does Mitt Romney have to do with this? :-)

(I know, I know, it was a typo)

It wasn't a typo, it was a reference to Star Trek IV.

228 Anthony (Los Angeles)  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:35:44am

So, Charles. What's it feel like to learn your a victim of psy-ops? The dread Belgian Secret Service strikes again! (Did they at least ply you with some great Belgian beer?)

This is really sad. I liked GoV, but they're going off a deep end.

229 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:35:48am

re: #200 yavanna

resorting to wild conspiracy as explanation and using character attacks exposes them for the idiots & liars that they are

It smacks of desperation. Or worse. Paranoia could be a sign of mental illness. At this point, however, I do feel that the driving motivation is desperation. They are seeing all their hard work go buh-bye. They are like parents desperate to save their baby that they will try any crazy thing that cmes down the pike. If it continues much longer- they should seek help, and I mean that in a decent, humanistic way.

230 J.S.  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:36:10am

About Bat Ye'or's real name...Apparently her real name was revealed in a book review by Sidney H. Griffith in 1998. Griffith wrote a review of Bat Ye'or's work "The Decline of Eastern Christianity under Islam" -- the book review was published in International Journal of Middle East Studies (Volume 30, no. 4 -- Nov. 1998), p 619-621.

231 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:36:46am
I suppose one can find fault on both sides,


Yes, I can. Charles has been getting the first post up very late this week.


and i think you're ful of it.

232 Slumbering Behemoth  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:37:06am

re: #198 Owl

I was sort of looking forward to getting that one until I read more about the game's plot. Funny, though, I perceived it as being pro-islam rather than anti-christian. Hmm, half a dozen in one...

No matter, I've gotten quite used to not buying games that suck (and that's most of them), so I'll have no problem passing over this one as well.

Guess I'll just reinstall my old copy of Fallout.

233 saltmarsh  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:37:12am

This is just so sad.

234 coquimbojoe  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:37:17am

re: #208 Honorary Yooper

It is because of you I know what a Yooper is. And, I am better for it.

235 Anthony (Los Angeles)  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:37:37am
your a victim of psy-ops

Note to self: proofread before posting.

236 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:38:10am

OT to mama winger and jcm

Just heard from my sister. They've got the baby back safe and sound. And guess what? The bio father everyone was told (by bio mom) was dead? He showed up last nite - with DNA tests.

237 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:38:18am
238 Eowyn2  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:38:19am

re: #191 coquimbojoe

well that explains it.

239 coquimbojoe  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:39:05am

re: #235 Anthony (Los Angeles)

your a victim of psy-ops

Note to self: proofread before posting.

Thanksgiving made me a victim of pie-ops, interestingly enough.....

/Thank you! Try the fish!

240 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:39:13am

re: #227 JamesTKirk

re: #224 segesta

re: #199 JamesTKirk
What does Mitt Romney have to do with this? :-)

(I know, I know, it was a typo)


It wasn't a typo, it was a reference to Star Trek IV.

Which contained a malapropism.

241 Crusader Rabbit  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:39:17am

Dymphna lied!

Lizards were snide!

:)

242 Eowyn2  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:39:22am

re: #211 BabbaZee

re: #202 mama winger

Saint Sybil

lol

243 Jimmy The Clam  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:39:39am

re: #172 BabbaZee

re: #150 Jimmy The Clam

Go Jimmy. Good man.

Thanks!
One thing I have learned is to never get emotionally attached to an argument or a position.
Just go where facts and reason lead you.
But sometimes you do take the wrong off-ramp on the freeway of ideas but as soon as you realize you are headed the wrong way, you need to flip a "U-ey" and get back on that freeway.

When you get emotionally wrapped up in a position, or personalize an argument, it keeps you from realizing your mistakes or correcting your actions.

244 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:39:39am

re: #236 wahabicorridor

OT to mama winger and jcm

Just heard from my sister. They've got the baby back safe and sound. And guess what? The bio father everyone was told (by bio mom) was dead? He showed up last nite - with DNA tests.

PRAISE GOD! Oh I am so glad! I was up in the night and not able to sleep and I was praying for the wee one! God is good!

And there is a father? Wow! Does he seem like he could be a good custodial parent?

245 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:39:57am

re: #219 ContraJihadi

I suppose one can find fault on both sides

If being cautious is a fault, then I suppose you're right.

246 SecretInternetDoucheBag  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:39:59am

re: #232 Slumbering Behemoth

They are coming out with a new version of Fallout for the Xbox. Made by the same people that made Oblivion.

247 coquimbojoe  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:40:53am

re: #199 JamesTKirk

re: #187 Former Belgian

I've concluded that the people at GoV (especially Dymphna) have taken complete leave of their senses, or are on a bad LSD trip.

A little too much LDS never made me want to ally myself with nazis.

But it gives me a strange desire for casserole and alchohol free beer (all the belly, none of the fun!)

248 rightymouse  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:40:59am

Man.....

I thought I understood the definition of hubris until I read Dympha's screed. Wow!

249 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:41:07am
250 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:41:16am

re: #240 Honorary Yooper

re: #227 JamesTKirk
It wasn't a typo, it was a reference to Star Trek IV.

Which contained a malapropism.

In any case, I've never tried any LDS, because Mormon women don't come in a lovely shade of green.

/As for the other stuff...

251 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:41:46am

re: #244 mama winger

Does he seem like he could be a good custodial parent?

no clue yet - too soon to tell I think - they're in shock but happy.

252 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:41:56am

re: #223 wahabicorridor

okeedokee

253 Former Belgian  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:42:04am

re: #156 Eowyn2

re: #108 Poitiers-Lepanto

re: #96 Owl


Belgian intel psyops


We are getting a SECOND monthly check ! YAY !/it took time to understand the shekel thing, now I will have to study the Belgian currency...

i hope the 2nd one is bigger than the first one. my zionist overlords are so tight they squeek, either that or one of you is skimming.

The Belgian currency is the Euro. Tell'em to convert to dollars before paying, since I think the Euro/US$ exchange rate is topping out.

Then again, considering how incompetent Belgian paymasters tend to be, I wouldn't be surprised if they tried to "please you" with one billion Zaire banknotes from the last days of the Mobutu regime..

254 coquimbojoe  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:42:20am

re: #250 JamesTKirk

re: #240 Honorary Yooper

re: #227 JamesTKirk

It wasn't a typo, it was a reference to Star Trek IV.

Which contained a malapropism.

In any case, I've never tried any LDS, because Mormon women don't come in a lovely shade of green.

/As for the other stuff...

I could tell you stories......

255 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:42:24am

re: #243 Jimmy The Clam

When you get emotionally wrapped up in a position, or personalize an argument, it keeps you from realizing your mistakes or correcting your actions.

And it's sometimes really hard to step back, be humble, and say I'm sorry.

256 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:43:14am

re: #254 coquimbojoe

re: #250 JamesTKirk
In any case, I've never tried any LDS, because Mormon women don't come in a lovely shade of green.

/As for the other stuff...

I could tell you stories......

And I you, no doubt.

257 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:43:33am

re: #232 Slumbering Behemoth

re: #198 Owl

I was sort of looking forward to getting that one until I read more about the game's plot. Funny, though, I perceived it as being pro-islam rather than anti-christian. Hmm, half a dozen in one...

No matter, I've gotten quite used to not buying games that suck (and that's most of them), so I'll have no problem passing over this one as well.

Guess I'll just reinstall my old copy of Fallout.


Well, I mean my opinion isn't gospel. Rent it for yourself or whatever - find some way to play a bit of it. It has it's novel moments, but all the hype on the gaming boards about it was just near total hogwash. And last night as "I" stood in front of the cleric and was told about the " brotherhood" and blah, blah,blah - i just couldn't see having to listen to much more of it to play a game that isn't cutting edge.

supposedly, you're killing folks so that there can be peace....but in reality there's alot of dialog that paints the muslims to be oh-so-innocent in the whole thing.

it's subtle, and most won't catch it.....and i know it's " just a game" - but it's one more step toward the new world order. a little brainwashing here, a little there and BOOM. you got sharia.

all that, plus i just wanted to be able to walk up to every bhurka clad woman and tell them to take off that crap and wise up.

258 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:43:44am

re: #251 wahabicorridor

re: #244 mama winger

Does he seem like he could be a good custodial parent?

no clue yet - too soon to tell I think - they're in shock but happy.

So the baby is well? You said there was a medical condition, right?

259 Poitiers-Lepanto  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:44:01am

Question:

how can we work for the intel psyops when our IQ is famously in the low teens ?

Maybe we work for the "IDIOT need-a-shrink-ops"...

/send the check anyway, thanks

260 Claire  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:44:15am

Secret Belgian Jewish Cabal. Okey Dokey.

This is such a soap opera. I really think that some people get a following and start to believe they shit rose petals.

261 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:44:18am

Feminist author rewrites novel after death threats from Muslim extremists

A feminist author is to rewrite her autobiography after she was forced to flee from Muslim extremists who placed a bounty on her head.

Taslima Nasreen, 45, a former doctor, said today that she hoped that the move would appease fundamentalist groups and end a controversy that forced her to leave Calcutta last week.

Ms Nasreen had claimed that the religious references in Dwikhandito, which means Divided, are sourced from “universally accepted” books on Islamic history.

Today she relented under pressure and said that “controversial lines” relating to Islam from the autobiographical novel would be removed.

“The book was written in 2002, based on my memories of Bangladesh in the 1980s, during which time secularism was removed from the Bangladesh constitution. I wrote the book in support of the people who defended secular values. I had no intention to hurt anybody’s sentiment,” she said today from a secret location.

I have done what I have never done in my life. I have compromised even in a secular India.” She added that she hoped she would now be able to “live peacefully” in India.

Don't count on it.

262 talon_262  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:44:46am

To those at GoV and other bastions of the VB/WN lovefest, I have one simple thing to say:

No fascists in my foxhole!

[M*A*S*H P.A. Speaker]That is all...[/M*A*S*H P.A. Speaker]

263 Pullus Iulius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:44:52am

re: #220 GNIDAthe#seCond

I recall that shortly after 9/11 there was a NYU Fine Arts "student" who left little black boxes labeled "FEAR" around the New York subway system as a performance piece, causing quite a bit of uproar. So, this stain in Canada, on top of being tackytackytacky, is also being derivative. That's the mark of Cain for these effete artiste types. No latte for you, tacky little man!

264 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:45:03am

re: #243 Jimmy The Clam

Amen Jimmy.
Salute, Paisan.

265 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:45:10am
And if you look at his falling numbers, you can see a possible reason for his need to create another Rathergate.

And she links alexa. Someone's been reading gcp. LOL

266 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:45:22am

re: #258 mama winger


The baby is well - she's not allowed to tell me details of the med condition, just that Destiny is A-ok.....

267 Eowyn2  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:45:33am

re: #237 buzzsawmonkey

re: #220 GNIDAthe#seCond


OT: Moonbat Artist Shuts Down Midtown Toronto With Fake Bomb, Sympathizes With Terrorists, Calls It Art, Going To Court

This artist is from the Ontario College of Art and Design, where this teacher, who did this work of art, is one of the faculty.

I dont know if he'll have much support on the left. He wound up closing down an AIDS fundraiser. So the sacred cows of the left are now jockeying for position?

268 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:46:42am

re: #266 wahabicorridor

re: #258 mama winger


The baby is well - she's not allowed to tell me details of the med condition, just that Destiny is A-ok.....

Thanks be to God.
I am so happy for your family. Please convey my very best wishes to them. Destiny is home for the holidays ! YAY!

269 Poitiers-Lepanto  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:46:53am

re: #206 TalkinKamel

I really am beginning to wonder why Dymphna and the Baron are so emotionally invested in Dewinter and crew. Are they close, personal friends? Did Dewinter donate a kidney to one of them? Threaten to protect them from the vast, BelgianLizardoid Conspiracy? What?

I hate to keep harping on the Hirsi Ali thing, but it provides such a contrast to their current championing Dewinter and Vlaams Belang. When the controversy about Ali remaining in the United States, and getting protection, was going on, Dymphna claimed that Ali was underserving of any special security because, after all, she had made a movie insulting Islam, and those who go looking for trouble shouldn't be surprised when it comes. She also pretty much stated outright that Ali was unworthy of support because she wasn't Christian, and had secular ideas (which makes one kind've wonder about what Dymphna's idea of a good society is; an Irish/Catholic theocracy, no unbelievers allowed?)

The Baron then weighed in, claiming that, since our government can't protect everybody, it's really unfair to protect individuals with security services, since it can't guarantee protection for everyone.

Go figure.

Yes, she's not white.

270 edr  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:47:10am

Hmmmm.

GoV has gone plaid!

271 guftafs  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:47:14am

re: re: #104 Charles

There's a deliberate, dishonest campaign of character assassination going on.

#104 Charles

Out of arguments, exposed as useful idiots at best, likely something worse: *ka-ching!* intellectual bankrupcty.

Almost feel sorry for them. Almost.

272 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:47:21am

re: #267 Eowyn2

I dont know if he'll have much support on the left. He wound up closing down an AIDS fundraiser. So the sacred cows of the left are now jockeying for position?

Wouldn't be the first time lefties found themselves in conflict. People who want a cure found for AIDS are not in agreement with people against all animal testing.

273 J.S.  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:47:29am

re: #206 TalkinKamel

I really am beginning to wonder why Dymphna and the Baron are so emotionally invested in Dewinter and crew.

I've been wondering about this myself. I suspect it might have something to do with money -- the financing of their political party, their pet hobby horse, called Vlaams Belang is solely from the Belgium government. They require government aid monies to keep afloat. If support slips, they're losing bucks...

274 yavanna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:47:42am

re: #229 Sharmuta

I agree that it is desperate and likely a sign of mental illness. But the blatent lying throws them into the same category as the islamofacist liars that they are against. Once your resort to wild, deliberate lies in any argument, credibility evaporates (and is generally gone for good).

275 jcm  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:48:21am

re: #236 wahabicorridor

OT to mama winger and jcm

Just heard from my sister. They've got the baby back safe and sound. And guess what? The bio father everyone was told (by bio mom) was dead? He showed up last nite - with DNA tests.

Good new on the baby. We'll pray that everything else gets sorted out.

Got our new foster placement last night, 4 mo old with a broken leg, came from the hospital with a prescription oxycontin. Settled in pretty well, and was comfortable with Tylenol for the pain, going to try to avoid the oxycontin except when she really in pain. These kids are shell shocked when we get them, yanked out of what ever environment they are used to, a whirlwind of hospital doctors, nurses, social workers, then dropped in a strange place with strange people, strange smells. So far so good!

276 lawhawk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:48:46am

Also OT:

You folks remember the media reports that NATO airstrikes killed Afghan civilian workers? Well, seems that the airstrikes didn't happen as those reports claimed.

No civilians were killed.

Only Taliban.

Again.

277 Slumbering Behemoth  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:50:19am

re: #246 SecretInternetDoucheBag

Thanks, I am aware. I passed on Oblivious, I'll be passing on Fallout 3 as well. I could go on and on about FO3 not sticking to the Fallout canon, it being dumbed-down and not a true successor to the franchise, blah blah blah, yakity smakity, but it's all very boring and no one really gives a crap.

278 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:50:30am

re: #275 jcm

Got our new foster placement last night, 4 mo old with a broken leg, came from the hospital with a prescription oxycontin.

You must have a strong and brave heart, jcm. Oh my gosh. Such a tiny baby. I'm assuming the broken leg was from abuse? Can you give me the address of these people so I can go beat them with a pipe?

279 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:50:35am

re: #276 lawhawk

Also OT:

You folks remember the media reports that NATO airstrikes killed Afghan civilian workers? Well, seems that the airstrikes didn't happen as those reports claimed.

No civilians were killed.

Only Taliban.

Again.

Those are still "innocent bystanders" and "victims" as far as the MSM are concerned.

280 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:51:04am
281 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:51:19am

re: #217 yavanna

rolling on the -effin' floor

I have deep love for a smattering of profanity.

282 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:51:51am

re: #276 lawhawk

You folks remember the media reports that NATO airstrikes killed Afghan civilian workers? Well, seems that the airstrikes didn't happen as those reports claimed.

Color me shocked.

283 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:52:17am

re: #246 SecretInternetDoucheBag

Fallout 3. It's gonna be on ps3 too, i believe.

Right now, I'm knee-deep in COD4.

284 mama winger  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:52:38am

I am being kicked off the computer.

bbl :)

285 Pawn of the Oppressor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:52:39am

re: #47 Killgore Trout

Andrew Bostom is disgusted. He was the one who sent me the hat tip on the American Thinker essay suggesting that Charles had been taken in by Belgian intel psyops. He probably was: he had information up and ready to go instantly. Charles was prepped and prepared.

....and Belgian psyops!

Who knew that Belgium had psy-ops?

Operation Flemish Condor?

286 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:52:47am

re: #281 BabbaZee

The deeper the love, the louder the profanity.

287 yavanna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:53:54am

re: #281 BabbaZee

LOL! you go Babba!

288 rappmandu  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:54:23am

Personally, I don't see much value in engaging dishonest opponents and rewarding their acting out with unwarranted attention. I don't enjoy troll feeding. Anyway...

289 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:54:26am

re: #226 zombie

OOOOoooOOOooOO!

290 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:54:32am

re: #261 NJDhockeyfan

Feminist author rewrites novel after death threats from Muslim extremists


A feminist author is to rewrite her autobiography after she was forced to flee from Muslim extremists who placed a bounty on her head.

Taslima Nasreen, 45, a former doctor, said today that she hoped that the move would appease fundamentalist groups and end a controversy that forced her to leave Calcutta last week.

Ms Nasreen had claimed that the religious references in Dwikhandito, which means Divided, are sourced from “universally accepted” books on Islamic history.

Today she relented under pressure and said that “controversial lines” relating to Islam from the autobiographical novel would be removed.

“The book was written in 2002, based on my memories of Bangladesh in the 1980s, during which time secularism was removed from the Bangladesh constitution. I wrote the book in support of the people who defended secular values. I had no intention to hurt anybody’s sentiment,” she said today from a secret location.

I have done what I have never done in my life. I have compromised even in a secular India.” She added that she hoped she would now be able to “live peacefully” in India.


Don't count on it.

A microcosmic example of the biggest mistake in history.

291 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:54:45am

re: #265 Sharmuta

And if you look at his falling numbers, you can see a possible reason for his need to create another Rathergate.

And she links alexa. Someone's been reading gcp. LOL

Ya think? GCP is only "LGF Stalker Blog #2".

I find this a little disturbing from GoV, especially the comments. Did I mention I don't like Sodra "Cracker" Djavul. They are trying desperately to justify their support of the VB and others.

292 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:54:56am

re: #286 JamesTKirk

It is good to be wise and profane!

293 debutaunt  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:56:27am

re: #243 Jimmy The Clam

re: #172 BabbaZee


re: #150 Jimmy The Clam

Go Jimmy. Good man.


Thanks!
One thing I have learned is to never get emotionally attached to an argument or a position.
Just go where facts and reason lead you.
But sometimes you do take the wrong off-ramp on the freeway of ideas but as soon as you realize you are headed the wrong way, you need to flip a "U-ey" and get back on that freeway.

When you get emotionally wrapped up in a position, or personalize an argument, it keeps you from realizing your mistakes or correcting your actions.


I could never understand why people would have any difficulty in trying to discover what reality is. It is such a joy to find it amongst all the BS!

294 Ma Sands  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:56:34am

re: #143 mama winger

re: #101 BabbaZee

re: #94 Ma Sands

huh?

No that would not be correct.

YES! I do have a sock puppet! :)

Last night during open reg I played the role of

PeaceDuckSoup.

/ I love groucho. And hate the giant Duck of Peace :)


There! I knew it! I was wondering, when Babba didn't know of it, if I were going batty --or, battier.... :)

295 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:58:27am

re: #294 Ma Sands

I had no clue, LOL, it ain't you, maw

296 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:58:37am
297 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:58:43am

re: #291 Honorary Yooper

Honey- stalker blog #2 loves me like Loungers hate me. sodra's over there now, you know. And you and I might even make an appearance due to these couple posts. Wave to the "fan" club, Yoop.

298 Josephine  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:58:50am

The Dr. Sanity post confirms my earlier impression of Dymphna: she doesn't respond well to real or imagined criticism of herself or her husband.

I hope someone will send a link to Dr. Sanity proving that Dymphna and Baron were not banned from LGF. I could be behind the times (I don't read every thread) but the last time I saw it mentioned, I'm pretty sure Pamela/Atlas hadn't been banned here, either.

I find it odd that the founder of the 910 Group (Vicktorya Stone) is involved in websites that publish, among other things, anti-Semitic writing and astrological charts of prominent Nazis. The 910 Group, CVF and GoV are all linked. That doesn't mean they all think the same way but it makes me wonder about underlying belief systems.

299 Ma Sands  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:58:54am

re: #166 mama winger

Awwww.....so fuzzy-warm, to be welcomed..... gee.... :)

300 eastvillageinfidel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:59:07am

In their desperation, these people have thrown in with some really bad sorts. Our refusal to blindly embrace a bunch of nazis highlights their desperation and they are embarassed by it. All this bizarre hostility is an attempt to hide their fear and embarassment. These people have sold their souls. They are now angry at those of us who haven't. Fuck'em.

301 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:59:15am

re: #291 Honorary Yooper

Sodra Djavul

means White Devil btw

302 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:59:34am

re: #291 Honorary Yooper

I find this a little disturbing from GoV...

"Historians have tentatively identified at least two current political leaders in the above photos. In the top photo, the boy who is second from the left (in the back) appears to be Sen. Carl Levin (D-MI). In the bottom photo, the seventh child in the fifth row back is thought to be none other than Sen. Edward Kennedy (D-MA). Citizens should demand that the leadership of our country be cleansed of former proto-Nazis. There is no place in public office for anyone with this kind of stain on his or her record."

Well, I can't say that I argue with Carl and Teddy being kicked out of public office; but other than that, this is deranged.

303 Ma Sands  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:00:15am

re: #179 storagemanager

Amen. :)

304 Slumbering Behemoth  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:00:47am

re: #257 Owl

Oh, don't worry, I take no one's opinion as gospel (except for mine, of course).

But as you said:

supposedly, you're killing folks so that there can be peace....but in reality there's alot of dialog that paints the muslims to be oh-so-innocent in the whole thing.

which is pretty much in line with some of the reviews/previews I've read. Of course I am old enough to distinguish reality from bogus revisionist history, so a game like this (or any other) would not influence me in the slightest. Still, no money from me on this one.

305 Crusader Rabbit  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:01:28am

re: #301 BabbaZee

re: #291 Honorary Yooper

Sodra Djavul

means White Devil btw

"södra" means "sothern"

"white" would be "vit"

306 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:01:49am

re: #301 BabbaZee

re: #291 Honorary Yooper

Sodra Djavul

means White Devil btw

And it fits well. He (it) was quite the little devil when I first encountered him in the Lounge. That one earned his banning.

307 Dar ul Harb  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:01:50am

re: #226 zombie

The scandal continues!

Oh, when has it ever stopped?

308 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:02:33am

re: #306 Honorary Yooper

Rabbit has it right.

/Hiya Rabbit!

309 Crusader Rabbit  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:02:35am

bleh, the system muches o with an umlaut.

310 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:02:36am

re: #297 Sharmuta

re: #291 Honorary Yooper

Honey- stalker blog #2 loves me like Loungers hate me. sodra's over there now, you know. And you and I might even make an appearance due to these couple posts. Wave to the "fan" club, Yoop.

I think I shall, with my little bridie. :-)

311 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:03:44am

re: #309 Crusader Rabbit

bleh, the system muches o with an umlaut.

Try this:
ö = ö

312 Crusader Rabbit  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:04:09am

re: #308 Sharmuta

re: #306 Honorary Yooper

Rabbit has it right.

/Hiya Rabbit!

Heya Shar.

I never thought I'd be using Swedish for anything 27 years later.

313 Ma Sands  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:04:42am

re: #236 wahabicorridor

Omigoodness! (I've heard nothing of your story until this....but, my word! ): --it sounds scary!)

314 Orde  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:04:42am

Dymphna sounds whacked, crazily insecure, a bit loca...to which I say:
Por que no te calles!

315 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:05:18am

re: #305 Crusader Rabbit

Oh well
my source was mistaken I guess

316 Crusader Rabbit  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:05:34am

re: #311 JamesTKirk

re: #309 Crusader Rabbit

bleh, the system muches o with an umlaut.

Try this:
ö = ö

awesome, thanks

317 armytramp  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:05:37am

My Zionist membership came with a secret decoder ring.

With Belgian Psyops, you get a toaster.

318 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:05:54am

re: #306 Honorary Yooper

see the rabbit's post my source is wrong

319 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:06:33am

re: #315 BabbaZee

re: #305 Crusader Rabbit

Oh well
my source was mistaken I guess

Hey, the words still fit. It was quite the racist little demon in the Lounge. Wouldn't shock me if it were a Klan member.

320 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:07:01am

re: #297 Sharmuta

They are going after quit a few of us...even realwest....wow.

321 guftafs  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:07:19am

re: #291 Honorary Yooper

re: #265 Sharmuta

And if you look at his falling numbers, you can see a possible reason for his need to create another Rathergate.


And she links alexa. Someone's been reading gcp. LOL

Ya think? GCP is only "LGF Stalker Blog #2".

I find this a little disturbing from GoV, especially the comments. Did I mention I don't like Sodra "Cracker" Djavul. They are trying desperately to justify their support of the VB and others.

Someone in the comments made clear what being an officer in the Waffen SS meant, to which dymphna replied

People honor their dead, especially their military dead. In the South, Confederate graves are still tended. Confederate battles are still discussed -- even re-enacted.

What have you proven besides the fact that you abysmally fail to understand human nature, symbols, and the rituals which bind a people into a more cohesive culture. That includes living with dead mistakes.

She should ask the Fjordman what the Norwegians think about their own pet collaborator, Quisling. Safe bet he is not particularly honoured.

322 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:08:08am

re: #297 Sharmuta

Why do " loungers hate you..." if i may ask?

323 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:08:34am

My .01 USD on this.

It sounds to me from reading Dr Sanity's notes on all this that the GoV people have sort of "gone native" on the Flemish issue. Flemish separatism is one of many such movements (Quebec and the current Western Canada movement springs to mind) that is more or less constant and tends to be used as a way of getting political leverage for a particular region that feels -- often justly -- that it's political and economic interests are being compromised because the politics of the country are dominated by another region. In some cases (Flanders, Quebec, Catalonia) there is an underlying linguistic/"ethnic" difference; in other places (such as Western Canada or most of the US outside of the major cities -- remember the county-level Blue-Red map?) there are no such distinctions -- the differences are primarily political and economic with some cultural aspects thrown in as well.

There is nothing wrong with analyzing and discussing the connection between regional dissidence and opposition to Islam; there may well be reason to assume that the failure of the Belgian government to deal with Islam has to do with the limitations of the current party system; it may be that the limits of the party system are connected with regional conflict and the hegemony of one region (Wallonia) over another (Flanders); it may well be that only certain radical parties are willing to take up the task of opposing creeping (or rampaging) islamification. In other words, it may well be the case that VB and other related parties are the only ones seriously attempting to prevent the rise of Islam in Belgium. (NB: I'm not saying this is true -- I don't know -- but all of this can seem plausible).

That said, there are good reasons beyond the question of the neo-nazi past to make one suspicions of VB and other related groups. And the principle one of these is that their primary purpose is as a regional separatist party. They are not interested in Belgium, only in Flanders. That in and of itself made me suspicious from the beginning about their motivation -- is anti-islamification merely a strategy for drawing more people into the separatist camp? I wonder.

Dymphna's comments were revealing -- she clearly sides with VD on the separatist question. She has, as I've said, gone native and completely, so far as I can see, embraced the idea that Flanders needs to be liberated from Belgium. In other words, from her comments to Dr. Sanity, it would appear that opposition to Islam is secondary -- support for the oppressed people of Flanders is number one; that VB also appears (at the moment) as an ally against Islam is a secondary concern. Or at least that's the sense one gets from reading her emails.

Once one becomes an unabashed partisan in a struggle in which one is not directly involved, it become extremely difficult to remain an objective observer. Dymphna believes in the Flemish "cause," and it would appear that it is her partisanship for that cause that prevents reasonable analysis of aspects of the movement that might be less than savory.

One additional cent: Dr. Sanity should issue a correction on the banning/tricky deletion misinformation.

324 Ma Sands  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:09:07am

re: #275 jcm

You are a foster parent? Oh, I love you! And you know what? --God can do, even in the midst of all that......prayin' for you all....

325 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:09:18am

re: #319 Honorary Yooper

I cant find the email on it and I may not even have saved it
but if I remember right it said it the name was some sort of known folk name for "white devil" or south white devil or something in some oldtimey local folk tales

like we would know who the grinch is, like that....

326 talon_262  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:09:22am

re: #302 JamesTKirk

re: #291 Honorary Yooper

I find this a little disturbing from GoV...

"Historians have tentatively identified at least two current political leaders in the above photos. In the top photo, the boy who is second from the left (in the back) appears to be Sen. Carl Levin (D-MI). In the bottom photo, the seventh child in the fifth row back is thought to be none other than Sen. Edward Kennedy (D-MA). Citizens should demand that the leadership of our country be cleansed of former proto-Nazis. There is no place in public office for anyone with this kind of stain on his or her record."

Well, I can't say that I argue with Carl and Teddy being kicked out of public office; but other than that, this is deranged.

Man, GoV's really are grasping at straws on that morally relativistic harangue, aren't they?

327 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:09:30am

re: #320 storagemanager

re: #297 Sharmuta

They are going after quit a few of us...even realwest....wow.

Yeah, Storagemanager, I believe we are all targets. To which I say, go ahead, dipsticks, do your worst.

328 Charles  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:09:32am

Dymphna: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Baron Bodissey: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Pamela: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

329 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:09:41am

re: #290 Owl

re: #261 NJDhockeyfan

Feminist author rewrites novel after death threats from Muslim extremists


A feminist author is to rewrite her autobiography after she was forced to flee from Muslim extremists who placed a bounty on her head. Taslima Nasreen, 45, a former doctor, said today that she hoped that the move would appease fundamentalist groups and end a controversy that forced her to leave Calcutta last week.

Ms Nasreen had claimed that the religious references in Dwikhandito, which means Divided, are sourced from “universally accepted” books on Islamic history.

Today she relented under pressure and said that “controversial lines” relating to Islam from the autobiographical novel would be removed.

“The book was written in 2002, based on my memories of Bangladesh in the 1980s, during which time secularism was removed from the Bangladesh constitution. I wrote the book in support of the people who defended secular values. I had no intention to hurt anybody’s sentiment,” she said today from a secret location.

I have done what I have never done in my life. I have compromised even in a secular India.” She added that she hoped she would now be able to “live peacefully” in India.


Don't count on it.

A microcosmic example of the biggest mistake in history.

And disappointing. She lost some of my respect for this.

330 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:10:20am

re: #321 guftafs

re: #291 Honorary Yooper


re: #265 Sharmuta

And if you look at his falling numbers, you can see a possible reason for his need to create another Rathergate.

And she links alexa. Someone's been reading gcp. LOL

Ya think? GCP is only "LGF Stalker Blog #2".

I find this a little disturbing from GoV, especially the comments. Did I mention I don't like Sodra "Cracker" Djavul. They are trying desperately to justify their support of the VB and others.


Someone in the comments made clear what being an officer in the Waffen SS meant, to which dymphna replied

People honor their dead, especially their military dead. In the South, Confederate graves are still tended. Confederate battles are still discussed -- even re-enacted.

What have you proven besides the fact that you abysmally fail to understand human nature, symbols, and the rituals which bind a people into a more cohesive culture. That includes living with dead mistakes.


She should ask the Fjordman what the Norwegians think about their own pet collaborator, Quisling. Safe bet he is not particularly honoured.

She can go straight to hell. Confederates might not have been on the right side of all things historical, but they were not Nazis........

Damn why do we always get dragged into every little hate-filled infested groups arguments for their own vile existance.

331 Josephine  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:10:36am

re: #249 BabbaZee

My favourite psalm... after the 23rd, of course.

332 Crusader Rabbit  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:10:37am

re: #318 BabbaZee

re: #306 Honorary Yooper

see the rabbit's post my source is wrong

Could be an idiom I don't know. It's not impossible to believe that "southern" is supposed to connote "white".

I just know the literal meaning from 2 months of going back and forth through Stockholm Södra station.

333 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:11:26am

For the sake of expediency, a lot of alliances are made in the anti-jihad front. It's not very hard to sound (semi) reasonable when exposing Islam's true ideological face, it's not rocket-science! One must look much further beyond this into their motives before eagerly embracing these people as true friends.

Rational Dread of Islam (as opposed to Islamophobia, which implies an irrational fear) is being exploited by some very ugly interest groups in Europe. The BNP, and Vlaams Belang are the most visible ones because they originate from Western Europe. I can tell you from first-hand experience about another fascist sect exploiting the increasingly-recognizable degeneracy of Islam for their own chauvinistic purposes: The ultra-nationalistic Serbs.

I was born and raised in Albania so I know a thing or two about the history and situation of Kosovo. My family also hosted war refugees in our home during the "exodus" in 1999.

Serbs want their ethnic strife to sound like a religious conflict so they can generate sympathy from Christians everywhere. Their government has slaughtered thousands of Catholics (Croatians, Slovenians), Greek Orthodox, Muslims, and Atheists through the 1990s. Now they are making excuses for their last unfinished business, Kosovo, claiming it is all about Muslims extremists trying to rebel and break off of Serbia proper to institute Shariah or whatever in that land.

Here is a video illustrating what I'm talking about, and my comment to it.

Trust me, I am not at all an Albanian nationalist. I don't care who gets that land, as long as it is governed according to the closest thing possible to the American Constitution: in other words, as long as individual rights of life, liberty, and property are respected. But I know of the unspeakable atrocities Serbs have gotten away with, some of which I describe in gory detail in my comment. The Orthodox Church has been a great enabler and supporter of the ethnic cleansing that occurred. Just because that man says he is Christian, is a "priest", and has a comfortable grip of the anti-jihadi rhetoric, do not take his motives for granted.

It is just an example which you might find interesting because it's not widely publicized. I'm sure there are plenty more if look.

334 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:11:49am

re: #327 Honorary Yooper

re: #320 storagemanager

re: #297 Sharmuta

They are going after quit a few of us...even realwest....wow.

Yeah, Storagemanager, I believe we are all targets. To which I say, go ahead, dipsticks, do your worst.

I feel left out.

335 Catttt  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:13:24am

re: #47 Killgore Trout

Andrew Bostom is disgusted. He was the one who sent me the hat tip on the American Thinker essay suggesting that Charles had been taken in by Belgian intel psyops. He probably was: he had information up and ready to go instantly. Charles was prepped and prepared.

....and Belgian psyops!

Shame on Charles for being prepared! /sarc

And this is really kind of funny. I realize the people in the area now known as Belgium are proud of their country, but it is - very very small and weak. Frankly, my state, which is approximately the same size, has better intel and psyops and all that than Belgium (Fort Meade? NSA?, etc.). So there. Not that we would attack Belgium.....

336 Crusader Rabbit  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:13:37am

re: #334 JamesTKirk

re: #327 Honorary Yooper


re: #320 storagemanager

re: #297 Sharmuta

They are going after quit a few of us...even realwest....wow.


Yeah, Storagemanager, I believe we are all targets. To which I say, go ahead, dipsticks, do your worst.

I feel left out.

It's a yawner. They can't possible call me anything worse than I've already been called.

337 cookielady  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:13:51am

re: #199 JamesTKirk

Captain, it was Spock that had a little too much LDS.

Time travel messes with your memory, sir. ;-)

338 Crusader Rabbit  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:14:16am

possible = possibly

PIMF

339 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:14:20am

re: #320 storagemanager

They're even calling us gcp watch.

340 Charles  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:14:58am

re: #333 medaura18586

Good post, thanks. And by the way, '1389' is a code word for the ultra-nationalist Serb movement.

341 Sharmuta  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:15:56am

re: #322 Owl

It's an inside joke. There's no hate.

342 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:16:10am

re: #339 Sharmuta

re: #320 storagemanager

They're even calling us gcp watch.

That's funny...they post entire threads and make fun of people..like children...Charles doesn't do that crap.

343 JamesTKirk  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:16:38am

re: #337 cookielady

re: #199 JamesTKirk

Captain, it was Spock that had a little too much LDS.

Time travel messes with your memory, sir. ;-)

I've taken more than one "trip" through time. It saves nine.

344 BrianA  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:16:47am

re: #323 Lucius Septimius

It seems that I recall Fjordman posting that one of the keys to European antijihad success was to break up the EU and that key to breaking up the EU was the succession Flanders from Belgium. If that is their thinking then the Flanders nationalism and the antijihad are one in the same.

345 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:17:12am

Charles, et al - can someone please nutshell the whole Seerb/kosovo thing for me? I have a Bosnian that works for me, and he's a nice guy - but very quiet. Like many, he was forced to serve and left as soon as he could for America. thing is, I'm ignorant on who the good guys are and who the bad guys are?

or are there good guys and bad guys in that conflict?

thanks.

346 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:17:32am

re: #341 Sharmuta


ooops. okie dokie.

347 guftafs  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:17:59am

re: #330 Owl

re: #321 guftafs

re: #291 Honorary Yooper


re: #265 Sharmuta


She can go straight to hell. Confederates might not have been on the right side of all things historical, but they were not Nazis........

Damn why do we always get dragged into every little hate-filled infested groups arguments for their own vile existance.

re: #330 Owl

That's one reason I think there's more to the fury and flailing over at GoV than just the lost prestige of backing a losing cause in the blogosphere. I suspect they have definite leanings in that direction. Exactly, you just can't equivocate with a straight face between civil war South and murderous totalitarians, unless you are a moron or a sympathizer, and if nothing else, the guys at GoV are literate.

348 Catttt  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:17:59am

re: #291 Honorary Yooper

re: #265 Sharmuta


And if you look at his falling numbers, you can see a possible reason for his need to create another Rathergate.

And she links alexa. Someone's been reading gcp. LOL

Ya think? GCP is only "LGF Stalker Blog #2".

I find this a little disturbing from GoV, especially the comments. Did I mention I don't like Sodra "Cracker" Djavul. They are trying desperately to justify their support of the VB and others.

Geez. Pinch me - I think I've fallen into an alternate universe. I agree with something SadlyNo posted.

349 fhilliard  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:18:58am

As long as I'm still not banned here, I'll say this: Gates of Vienna, Dymphna, Fjordman and Baron Bodissey have my full support. Their outstanding contribution to the anti-Jihadist cause are beyond reproach. Europe is in the actual first stages of civil war; barracking from the sidelines about ideological purity is counter productive.

What would be helpful, on the other hand, is contributing in the real world by joining right-wing political parties, taking part in anti-Jihadist conferences and going public with anti Islamic protests.

350 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:20:19am

re: #349 fhilliard

As long as I'm still not banned here, I'll say this: Gates of Vienna, Dymphna, Fjordman and Baron Bodissey have my full support. Their outstanding contribution to the anti-Jihadist cause are beyond reproach. Europe is in the actual first stages of civil war; barracking from the sidelines about ideological purity is counter productive.

What would be helpful, on the other hand, is contributing in the real world by joining right-wing political parties, taking part in anti-Jihadist conferences and going public with anti Islamic protests.


Do we need a brown shirt?

351 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:20:27am

right-wing political parties


I'm guessing this is where the problem is gonna be. Sounds like your def. of "right wing" and mine aren't compatible.....i'm guessing.....

352 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:20:49am

re: #339 Sharmuta

re: #320 storagemanager

They're even calling us gcp watch.

That's a chuckle. How many threads/forums do we have dedicated to GCP? How many there are dedicated to LGF?

I rest my case.

353 Crusader Rabbit  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:21:00am

re: #345 Owl

Charles, et al - can someone please nutshell the whole Seerb/kosovo thing for me? I have a Bosnian that works for me, and he's a nice guy - but very quiet. Like many, he was forced to serve and left as soon as he could for America. thing is, I'm ignorant on who the good guys are and who the bad guys are?

or are there good guys and bad guys in that conflict?

thanks.


I can give you the short form:
There were no muslims in the Balkans until the Ottomans commenced to rape the area in the 15th century.

354 guftafs  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:21:00am

re: #349 fhilliard

re: #349 fhilliard

As long as I'm still not banned here, I'll say this: Gates of Vienna, Dymphna, Fjordman and Baron Bodissey have my full support. Their outstanding contribution to the anti-Jihadist cause are beyond reproach. Europe is in the actual first stages of civil war; barracking from the sidelines about ideological purity is counter productive.

What would be helpful, on the other hand, is contributing in the real world by joining right-wing political parties, taking part in anti-Jihadist conferences and going public with anti Islamic protests.

Does anyone know what was really discussed and decided at the conference. All I know is they at kosher food.

355 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:21:29am

#218 jcm & #269 Poitiers-Lepanto-Mt. Gisors

Yes, I am beginning to wonder if---ahem!---melanin isn't the real issue here, and not religious belief or fairness in policing or whatever.

Certainly, when posters at GoV tried to defend Ali, using much the same arguments that the Baron and Dymphna are using to defend Vlaams Belang, i.e., she is on our side, we can't be that picky about who we ally ourselves with, she does share many of the same values we do, she's at least brave enough to speak out against the jihadis when a lot of others aren't---Baron & Dymphna just weren't having any. Nope, nope, nope, we gotta stand on our principles here! And yet they criticize Charles for having reservations about Vlaams Belang; doesn't he have the right to stand on his principles, and ask questions? And they are willing to extend all sorts of Vlaams Belang, BNP, et al, which they weren't about to give Ali----and with far less reason, that I can see. Whether you agree with everything she says or not, Ali's has been pretty upfront about her opinions, and what she stands for and what she doesn't. And, to my knowledge, she's never been part of a racist organization with questionable ties to a totalitarian past.

jcm, I do think it might be money, too---could be Dymphna and the baron are worried that their beloved Belang is going to lose funding, and have to disband. (A question: if the government is supporting these guys, how effective are they really going to be in combating pro-Moslem, pro-immigrant policies? We keep hearing that these groups are the only ones brave enough to speak up against the government; now it seems they're being supported by the government! And why can't they support themselves, if they're supposedly so popular, and speaking for so many disenfranchised whites? Why can't they cough up their own funding?)

Congrats, and good luck, with the new foster child!

356 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:21:41am

re: #340 Charles

re: #333 medaura18586

Good post, thanks. And by the way, '1389' is a code word for the ultra-nationalist Serb movement.

That explains the position of former commentor "1389" and his rather racial anti-Condi crappola.

357 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:22:56am

re: #353 Crusader Rabbit

re: #345 Owl


Charles, et al - can someone please nutshell the whole Seerb/kosovo thing for me? I have a Bosnian that works for me, and he's a nice guy - but very quiet. Like many, he was forced to serve and left as soon as he could for America. thing is, I'm ignorant on who the good guys are and who the bad guys are?

or are there good guys and bad guys in that conflict?

thanks.


I can give you the short form:
There were no muslims in the Balkans until the Ottomans commenced to rape the area in the 15th century.


Ok, but I'm so ignorant I don't know who is who. Are teh " Serbs" the non-muslims? God I feel stupid.

358 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:23:48am

Wow. I read the post and listened to the podcast. I don't understand Dymphna's reactions at all.

And what's this slander about Charles having "revealed" Bat Ye'or's real name and keeping company with the NYTimes? What's this nonsense about Charles being prepped and primed by Belgian psyops? Good heavens, what is up with Dymphna?

359 cookielady  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:24:03am

re: #278 mama winger

re: #275 jcm


Got our new foster placement last night, 4 mo old with a broken leg, came from the hospital with a prescription oxycontin.

You must have a strong and brave heart, jcm. Oh my gosh. Such a tiny baby. I'm assuming the broken leg was from abuse? Can you give me the address of these people so I can go beat them with a pipe?

Mama, can I come, too? I'm sure I can scare up a baseball bat...
(mama bear mode)

360 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:25:41am

re: #333 medaura18586

re: #344 BrianA

It seems like the real source of radical politics in Europe is regional separatism -- VB is the Serbian Nationalists without guns and ETA without bombs. And both groups have been stirring up trouble since the middle of the nineteenth century, at least. Opposition to Islam is a new way of giving such groups greater credibility in the eyes of foreign observers. But their main goals have nothing to do with Islam, and nothing to do with "Europe" except to dismantle the EU and the current state structure.

The irony, of course, is that if Europe were to break up into myriad regional entities (Flanders, Wallonia, Holland, Zeeland, Luxemburg, Artois, Brabant, Ile-de-France, Normande, Bretagne, Alsace, Lorraine, Swabia, Franconia, Bavaria, Saxony, Thuringia, etc. etc. etc.) these petty states would need an over-arching European political structure for defense, economic policy, and foreign relations. In other words, far from constituting a reasonable opposition to the EU, regional separatism is a consequence of European union, since only under the umbrella of the EU could such petty states survive.

In other words, VB and co. are merely reinventing the Holy Roman Empire.

361 Josephine  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:26:35am

re: #328 Charles

Dymphna: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Baron Bodissey: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Pamela: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Thank you. I've sent her an email with a link. I've never emailed her before so it might go into junk mail.

362 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:28:48am

re: #360 Lucius Septimius

In other words, VB and co. are merely reinventing the Holy Roman Empire.

And it will be neither "Holy", nor "Roman", nor an "Empire".

363 Crusader Rabbit  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:29:07am

re: #357 Owl

re: #353 Crusader Rabbit


re: #345 Owl

Charles, et al - can someone please nutshell the whole Seerb/kosovo thing for me? I have a Bosnian that works for me, and he's a nice guy - but very quiet. Like many, he was forced to serve and left as soon as he could for America. thing is, I'm ignorant on who the good guys are and who the bad guys are?
or are there good guys and bad guys in that conflict?

thanks.


I can give you the short form:
There were no muslims in the Balkans until the Ottomans commenced to rape the area in the 15th century.

Ok, but I'm so ignorant I don't know who is who. Are teh " Serbs" the non-muslims? God I feel stupid.

While "Serb" is a nationality, today it is used with the implication that Serb = Eastern Orthodox. Likewise, not all Bosnians are muslim, but in modern parlance "Bosian" is used as a synonym for "muslim". Likewise "Kossovar" is used as a synonym for "muslim".

364 Crusader Rabbit  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:29:30am

Bosian = Bosnian

PIMF

gotta run

365 talon_262  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:29:34am

re: #349 fhilliard

As long as I'm still not banned here, I'll say this: Gates of Vienna, Dymphna, Fjordman and Baron Bodissey have my full support. Their outstanding contribution to the anti-Jihadist cause are beyond reproach. Europe is in the actual first stages of civil war; barracking from the sidelines about ideological purity is counter productive.

What would be helpful, on the other hand, is contributing in the real world by joining right-wing political parties, taking part in anti-Jihadist conferences and going public with anti Islamic protests.

I will not get in bed politically with those who side with racial purists of any stripe...liberty, freedom and equality should be for everyone, not just for the "right people". While I detest Islamism, I will never capitulate and scour the intellectual gutter for allies, even if I and those who feel like I do about this subject are outmanned and outgunned. What use is fighting the approach of a Islamist caliphate along with WN bums if you sell your soul to do it?

No fascists in my foxhole, damnit!

366 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:29:38am

re: #362 Honorary Yooper

re: #360 Lucius Septimius

In other words, VB and co. are merely reinventing the Holy Roman Empire.

And it will be neither "Holy", nor "Roman", nor an "Empire".

As Voltaire said ...

367 realwest  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:29:39am

Um Charles - as you know, I'm a retired lawyer and Professor of Law but I'd gladly come out of retirement and represent you, pro bono, against these mofo's should they ever try to sue you.
Just letting you know you've got free legal help here if you should need it.

368 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:29:47am

#291 Honorary Yooper

I find it extremely disturbing, Yoop! Though I did get a good laugh out of the comments accusing LGF of supporting Ron Paul. . . (snort, snicker, chortle).

Sodra Djavul certainly is a. . . piece of work, isn't he/she? I'm afraid Sodra, and those like him/her, are going to become even more disturbing, as time goes on, and they feel more and more free to express how they truly feel. (Gawd, the Baron and Dymphna do love to go on and on about their Irishness, don't they? I mean a lot of us Irish Americans do, but those two seem to take it a bit too seriously. . . )

369 Cap'n DOC  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:31:16am

re: #260 Claire

Where do you get rose petals from? Rose Hips?

370 cookielady  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:31:32am

re: #330 Owl

She can go straight to hell. Confederates might not have been on the right side of all things historical, but they were not Nazis........

Damn why do we always get dragged into every little hate-filled infested groups arguments for their own vile existance.

Oh, dear. Surely you don't mean by this that you consider yourself a Confederate? Or do you equate Confederate with Southern U.S. citizen?

371 doriangrey  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:31:37am

re: #206 TalkinKamel

I really am beginning to wonder why Dymphna and the Baron are so emotionally invested in Dewinter and crew. Are they close, personal friends? Did Dewinter donate a kidney to one of them? Threaten to protect them from the vast, BelgianLizardoid Conspiracy? What?

I hate to keep harping on the Hirsi Ali thing, but it provides such a contrast to their current championing Dewinter and Vlaams Belang. When the controversy about Ali remaining in the United States, and getting protection, was going on, Dymphna claimed that Ali was underserving of any special security because, after all, she had made a movie insulting Islam, and those who go looking for trouble shouldn't be surprised when it comes. She also pretty much stated outright that Ali was unworthy of support because she wasn't Christian, and had secular ideas (which makes one kind've wonder about what Dymphna's idea of a good society is; an Irish/Catholic theocracy, no unbelievers allowed?)

The Baron then weighed in, claiming that, since our government can't protect everybody, it's really unfair to protect individuals with security services, since it can't guarantee protection for everyone.

Go figure.

I find this extremely disturbing myself, on the most baseless and crass of observations one might conjecture...

1) Hirsi Ali is NOT WHITE...
2) Hirsi Ali is NOT CHRISTIAN...
3) Dymphna scorns taking sides with a Non-White, Non-Christian against Islamic extremists...
4) VB, DeWinter and Swedish Democrats are White Nationalists...
5) Dymphna has no problem accepting assistance from White Nationalists against Islamic extremists...

While on it's face this may present a pro hock emptor logic fallacy, recent activity by Dymphna makes it extremely difficult to not draw the obvious inferences from the above data set.

372 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:32:01am

thanks so much.

re: #364 Crusader Rabbit

373 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:32:02am

re: #340 Charles

re: #333 medaura18586

Good post, thanks. And by the way, '1389' is a code word for the ultra-nationalist Serb movement.

WHAT?!

(I'm saying that alot, recently).

Is that why '1389' was banned?

374 storagemanager  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:32:21am

You are a great guy real.

375 cookielady  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:35:37am

Gotta go. Love to lizards far and near.

Keep your frills up.

376 Dead Sea Squirrel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:35:51am

re: #302 JamesTKirk

re: #291 Honorary Yooper

I find this a little disturbing from GoV...

"Historians have tentatively identified at least two current political leaders in the above photos. In the top photo, the boy who is second from the left (in the back) appears to be Sen. Carl Levin (D-MI). In the bottom photo, the seventh child in the fifth row back is thought to be none other than Sen. Edward Kennedy (D-MA). Citizens should demand that the leadership of our country be cleansed of former proto-Nazis. There is no place in public office for anyone with this kind of stain on his or her record."

Well, I can't say that I argue with Carl and Teddy being kicked out of public office; but other than that, this is deranged.



Just to keep the record straight, the Baron intended that as satire.
It fell flat with a number of his posters too, and he's had to explain that it's a spoof.

377 jcm  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:36:04am

re: #359 cookielady

re: #278 mama winger

re: #275 jcm


Got our new foster placement last night, 4 mo old with a broken leg, came from the hospital with a prescription oxycontin.


You must have a strong and brave heart, jcm. Oh my gosh. Such a tiny baby. I'm assuming the broken leg was from abuse? Can you give me the address of these people so I can go beat them with a pipe?

Mama, can I come, too? I'm sure I can scare up a baseball bat...
(mama bear mode)

Me too.
Fortunately just caring for them consumes time and energy enough that I don't think too much about the abusers, just focus on the kid.

Most of my ire is saved for the absolutely dysfunctional bureaucracy in WA state that is responsible for watching out for kids.

378 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:37:27am

#349 fhilliard

Fhil, as long as I'm drawing breath, I'm going to ask questions, and I'm not going to regard any group or person as "beyond reproach", no, not even the illustrious Lizard King Charles IV himself!

When you start seeing your leaders as being "beyond reproach", or having some sort of absolute moral authority, that's when you start getting in trouble. No human being rates that sort of blind obedience.

And why is it right-wing groups we're supposed to join? What's so helpful about them? Why not freedom loving groups, or democratic groups or Jewish groups or those who oppose Islam on religious grounds, or atheists, or secular humanists? Why do you guys keep talking as if the right, and ONLY the right, are our only saviors in this conflict? Why do you keep arguing as if there are only two sides to this question?

If the choice is between either the jihadists, or Vlaams Belang, I'm checking "None of the above."

379 marwan's daughter  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:37:56am

re: #328 Charles

Dymphna: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Baron Bodissey: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Pamela: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Now I think you have a good excuse to ban Dymphna and Bodissey, just like you did with Mr. F-bomb.

380 marwan's daughter  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:41:39am

re: #368 TalkinKamel

#291 Honorary Yooper

I find it extremely disturbing, Yoop! Though I did get a good laugh out of the comments accusing LGF of supporting Ron Paul. . . (snort, snicker, chortle).

Sodra Djavul certainly is a. . . piece of work, isn't he/she? I'm afraid Sodra, and those like him/her, are going to become even more disturbing, as time goes on, and they feel more and more free to express how they truly feel. (Gawd, the Baron and Dymphna do love to go on and on about their Irishness, don't they? I mean a lot of us Irish Americans do, but those two seem to take it a bit too seriously. . . )

He/she once said in the Lounge that his/her hero was Vlad the Impaler. That kind of raised the hairs on the back of my neck.

381 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:41:48am

re: #333 medaura18586

Thank you for that perspective, particularly since you're there.

382 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:42:49am

#371 doriangrey

Yes, I'm sorry to say it, but I have to agree with you. Recent activity does indicate that Dymphna has no problem at all with nominally Christian white nationalists, but doesn't approve of Black feminist atheists, and that shse's really mad at Charles, and a lot of other people, because they just aren't going along with her agenda.

383 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:43:41am

re: #378 TalkinKamel

Holy Roman Emperor Charles IV -- one of my personal heroes. (but I don't think he ever owned a Schwinn Fastback).

384 talon_262  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:45:59am

re: #376 Dead Sea Squirrel

re: #302 JamesTKirk

re: #291 Honorary Yooper

I find this a little disturbing from GoV...

"Historians have tentatively identified at least two current political leaders in the above photos. In the top photo, the boy who is second from the left (in the back) appears to be Sen. Carl Levin (D-MI). In the bottom photo, the seventh child in the fifth row back is thought to be none other than Sen. Edward Kennedy (D-MA). Citizens should demand that the leadership of our country be cleansed of former proto-Nazis. There is no place in public office for anyone with this kind of stain on his or her record."

Well, I can't say that I argue with Carl and Teddy being kicked out of public office; but other than that, this is deranged.



Just to keep the record straight, the Baron intended that as satire.
It fell flat with a number of his posters too, and he's had to explain that it's a spoof.

Something was hinkey about the Baron's post to me, but he played it so straight, it was a little hard to tell whether it was satire or not. If it was, then I retract my earlier comment on the subject, but it still doesn't make them any less a bunch of blockheads for supporting VB/SD and other like minded fools.

385 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:46:00am

#380 marwan's daughter

Haw! My hero, Baldwin IV, the Leper King will impale his silly ol' Vlad any day of the week! (And twice on Sundays!)

(Seriously, yes; truly creepy. And we must get used to this, because, I'm telling you guys, as they begin to feel safe, they're going to be more and more confident about exposing their true selves. It ain't gonna be pretty.)

marwan's daughter, really like your nic, by the way.

386 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:46:06am

re: #345 Owl

Charles, et al - can someone please nutshell the whole Seerb/kosovo thing for me? I have a Bosnian that works for me, and he's a nice guy - but very quiet. Like many, he was forced to serve and left as soon as he could for America. thing is, I'm ignorant on who the good guys are and who the bad guys are?

or are there good guys and bad guys in that conflict?

thanks.

There are no great guys in that conflict. The last post on my blog talks about just how devoid of ideology Europe is in general. All the players in all European conflicts are ethnic-nation-states, each founded on supremacist ethno-centrism, sublimated to various degrees into more backward or less backward forms. But in the end it's all about one's Britishness/Germannes/Frenchness/Serbness/Albanian ness,... whatever each of those mean. They don't mean much....

The problem is that while all European states define their cultural identities in more-or-less nationalistic terms, some countries take that to the extreme. Slavic countries have been notorious for this: Russians are starving still today, but all they care about is not falling from their Cold-War-Era position of world relevance. And they see relevance/self-esteem in tribalistic terms of being the alpha-country bringing down the house (continent) and putting the other inferior little farts in their place (Russia historically loves bullying the Czech, Polish ect).

Serbia is Russia's mini-me and protege. Its playground is the Balkans.

Serbs came to the Balkans around the 6th-7th century A.D and they were nothing but primitive hordes from the East-Asia. They fought and repelled the indigenous Christian Albanian and Greek populations, whose territories shrunk quite considerably as a result of the Slavic invasion.

They adopted the religion and most of the customs of the locals, but the very tribalistic undertones of their culture are still dominant to this day. They were not touched by the Enlightenment or Aristotelian Philosophy: just primitive tribes that adopted Christianity at face value, and prevailed through the use of brutality and sheer numbers.

They are obsessed with bullying their neighboring nations, or ethnically cleansing them, or otherwise make them their subordinated vassals. The creation of the artificial country of Yugoslavia served many of their purposes: basically they stripped the locals (non Serbs) of most of their civil rights, made it hard next to impossible for them to attend universities (through quotas), start their own businesses (through permits), or be civil servants (through sheer discrimination in public hiring policies). They imposed greater taxes on them, didn't let them speak their own language or teach it to their children in school (schools were state controlled), and basically just acted like modern feudal lords.

Once in a while, when the indigenous populations (Croats, Bosnians, Slovens, Albanians) would protest, they would go on insane ethnic-cleansing sprees.

The Serbs were the bad guys, or worst guys at least, because they were the ones in a position of dominance and they got off on terrorizing everyone else. They are taught ethnic hatred and Slav supremacy early as kids, so their entire society is largely indocrtinated.

As far as the Muslim thing goes, about Albania/Kosovo, it is true that the Albanians are at least nominally, of Muslim majority. However, the conversion to Islam happened largely for symbolic purposes: The Greeks and the Serbs had always harbored territorial ambitions toward ethnic Albania, and throughout centuries, it became clear that the fate of the nation might depend on convincing the then Great Powers (UK, France, Germany, Italy, Spain, Russia) to basically not tear us up into little pieces to throw to their regional vassals/proteges (Greece, Serbia, Bulgaria).

387 J.S.  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:47:21am

re: #357 Owl

Many Serbs are Orthodox Christians and they passionately despise Islam/Muslims. (Most times, you'd not want to bring up the topic of Islam when speaking with a Serb).

In the Balkans, originally, you had a group of Christians (but they were heretical -- they called themselves the Bogomils). For centuries the Bogomils were persecuted by Christians. Then the Ottoman Turks came. In the fifteenth century the Bogomils converted to Islam. The first time you get a major Islamic group within the heart of Christian Europe...(Bosnia was the stronghold of the Bogomils.)

388 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:48:35am

#383 Lucius Septimius

Well, even if he never owned a Schwin Fastback, I'll bet he would have loved having one if they made them back them!

(And Charles IV would make short work of Vlad too!)

389 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:48:41am

re: #373 wahabicorridor

re: #340 Charles


re: #333 medaura18586

Good post, thanks. And by the way, '1389' is a code word for the ultra-nationalist Serb movement.


WHAT?!

(I'm saying that alot, recently).

Is that why '1389' was banned?

It had a little more to do with certain racial slurs he was calling Condi Rice. A little while after his banning, I took a look at his blog, and he had a very ugly, rather racist, rather sexist cartoon of Condi on it.

390 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:49:16am

re: #353 Crusader Rabbit

But during the 90's, in case you didn't notice, the Serbs were the aggressors.

391 Charles  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:51:14am

re: #389 Honorary Yooper

I think you're confusing '1389' with 'sheik yer'mami'.

392 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:51:31am

re: #370 cookielady

re: #330 Owl


She can go straight to hell. Confederates might not have been on the right side of all things historical, but they were not Nazis........

Damn why do we always get dragged into every little hate-filled infested groups arguments for their own vile existance.


Oh, dear. Surely you don't mean by this that you consider yourself a Confederate? Or do you equate Confederate with Southern U.S. citizen?

Let me first tell you what I'm not....

I am not racist.
I am not a skinhead.
I am not a white supremacist.
I am not a Nazi.


There are people in the north and south that don't know a damn thing about Confederate values, principles and issues. We're Southern Confederates right about slavery? Of course not. No way in hell. There is NO EXCUSE for what people did to other human beings for the sake of free labor. It makes me sick to my stomach thinking about it. Were they right on States' Rights'. I believe so. Were they justified in their move away from the Union of the " united states?" I believe so.

Am I a "Confederate?" That's like asking someone if they're a dinosaur.

Would I have sided with my State or the Federal government in a war for the right of my State to govern itself as it sees fit?

Without a doubt.


Slavery was the most horrible things involved in the reasons behind teh Civil War, but it was not the only thing. And I do not believe that it was the only reason they were fighting for the right to govern themselves.

If there was a war today, wherein the federal government marched into my state and tried to take away the citizens' rights, force people to conform to laws and policies that they did not believe in, and force the State to follow along as the Federal government ran roughshod over Liberty and Justice, you can have no doubt for which entity I would shoulder arms.

I'm not anti-American, but Liberty cannot bear a tyranical federal government without a cost, and I believe we are paying that cost today in so many, many ways.


Let the flaming begin.

393 Charles  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:53:30am

'1389' refers to the Battle of Kosovo in which the Serbs were defeated by the Ottomans. It's a kind of battle cry for modern Serbian nationalists.

394 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:53:40am

re: #345 Owl

No one cared to know of Albania, its history, its ethnic origins and whatnot, so the best way to stand out was to adopt Islam, especially since in those times ethnicity and religion were largely interchangeable in the eyes of the self-important Great Powers who wouldn't be bothered learning the details and subtleties of these small Balkan's nations' histories and identities.

That's all there is to it. Albanians have never ever taken Islam any more seriously than the political foreign-policy scheme it was. And actually, after communism, more than an entire generation had been raised under strict secularism. That was enough to break the chain of passing on Islam, even in the watered-down version it was being practiced to begin with.

Islamic sentiment had nothing to do with the Kosovo crisis, although that's how it was portrayed by the media during the 1999 crisis. I see many more veiled women in Canada than in Albania.

But the Serbs want to use the overall lack of information about Albania, this small obscure country held in isolation for over 50 years, to try to paint it with Jihadist colors. The country has serious problems, those are cronyism, corruption, lack of understanding of how Capitalism works and how to embrace it properly, but most Albanians are the worst Western-wanna-be people you'd ever meet, especially the youth, a lot of them are actually ashamed of their Islamic past, and they adore America.

....don't know if you remember the way they greeted W Bush

395 Fish-Man  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:54:17am

Someone made a great point above, which is that we are talking far too much about everything but the issue, which is, I believe, 'Is VB a racist organization?' And I think, of late, conservatives, in desiring limits to immigration and proper assimilation of new peoples, have been more than a few times accused of racism unfairly. As for the racism of VB, it is hard to prove, but the circumstantial case here looks damning.

I'd like it if we didn't post any more on this, unless it was more evidence one way or the other that directly bears upon the racism argument. I don't see this as a family squabble, because it is an important issue for global conservatives. But what is going on in the blogosphere does have some elements of a squabble. People are operating on hearsay and things are getting blown out of proportion. The 'threats' seem pretty mild (She'll post something? Call her lawyer? Please.) A Bot is not DOS. People are talking about what they don't understand, technologically, politically, and in many other areas. ...Paranoia need not rule the day. Let's all take a deep breath, and try and ignore the next five outrageous accusations.

p.s. Charles, the spellcheck toy is great. I continue to be impressed by this blog, and the intelligence of the code you engineer into it.

396 gman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:55:05am
Andrew Bostom is disgusted. He was the one who sent me the hat tip on the American Thinker essay suggesting that Charles had been taken in by Belgian intel psyops. He probably was: he had information up and ready to go instantly. Charles was prepped and prepared. I was blindsided by his hostility and refusal to discuss any of it. It was Charles’ way or the highway.

The Flemish don’t know who Charles Johnson is and they don’t care. He can neither hurt them or help them and they are trying to free their country. He’s simply another American who doesn’t know what he’s talking about. The Walloons and the rest of the socialists in the Belgian Parliament can harm them and that is the center of their concern. The Walloons don’t want to surrender their welfare assistance, which is largely supplied by the more industrious and creative Flemish. They will hang onto the golden goose even if they have to wring its neck to do so...


Dymphna's comments are very revealing. Her paranoia about Belgian black psyops (Belblops?) and the "Flemish are more industrious and creative"- stereotyping speak volumes about her irrational chain of reasoning.

I am not an expert on the Walloons, but is she saying they are a non- industrious and non- creative people? What a bunch of bullshit!

397 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:56:39am

re: #381 Dianna

I was there until I was 17, which is 4 and a half years ago... I've been living in the US and Canada since, but I visit every year, and my memories are very fresh

398 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:58:47am

re: #396 gman

As I said up above, she's clearly "gone native" and completely embrace the cause of Flemish separatism.

399 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:59:02am

Lunchtime:

Beer-battered Moby filets, with a side of Troll chips and Kos-slaw.

And for desert? GoV White Chocolate Mousse.

400 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 10:59:05am

re: #391 Charles

re: #389 Honorary Yooper

I think you're confusing '1389' with 'sheik yer'mami'.

Shoot. Yeah, you're right. Oops, my bad.

(scurries away to hide under a rock for a moment out of embarrassment.)

401 neocon hippie  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:01:04am

All I can say is wow, just wow!

Major meltdown in progress. Dymphna is not well, and she's like the last ally...well, maybe after the VBers...one would want in the counterjihad.

OTOH, Dr. Patricia Santy is one sharp lady.

402 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:01:54am

re: #386 medaura18586


thanks so much.

403 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:01:58am

re: #397 medaura18586


You've got one kick-ass blog, sweetie - and you're not even 22 years old?

Wow. Just. Wow.

404 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:02:20am
In her email to Dr. Sanity, Dymphna also lied about the “SF Chronicle sneaky comment trick” at LGF; she claims it is still operative at LGF, but in truth it was simply a proof of concept and was disabled after one day of testing.

Plus, Charles didn't make it as sneaky as TP when he was testing the concept. On LGF, comments were still posted as 'deleted' unlike TP where there is no sign of a comment at all. So if LGF was still using the sneaky comment trick, we would be seeing "deleted" comments everywhere.

Also, Dymphna should easily be able to prove her point, if it were true, by merely taking screen shots like JimJams and myself. If we hadn't had the evidence, we wouldn't have had a case.

405 Owl  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:03:36am

re: #392 Owl


PIMF - we're = were
bear = bare

406 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:03:57am

Kind of cowardly that someone who doesn't even post under his/her real name, incites others to sue for defamation someone who is expressing his honest opinion openly, under his real name.

How can I sue Dymphna for something frivolous, if I don't even know who she is?

Coward!

407 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:04:11am

re: #403 wahabicorridor

re: #397 medaura18586


You've got one kick-ass blog, sweetie - and you're not even 22 years old?

Wow. Just. Wow.


Jeffrey Sachs Sucks!

bwahahaha!

like the dog too..............

408 gman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:05:43am

re: #398 Lucius Septimius

re: #396 gman

As I said up above, she's clearly "gone native" and completely embrace the cause of Flemish separatism.

I should have read more carefully. I think you're right about what's going on here. The VB is using the anti-Islam message to get converts while in reality their main push is for separation.

409 realwest  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:06:13am

re: #374 storagemanager Why thank you, storagemanager. That's nice of you to say.
Charles of course knows of my position as I've offered to help him in any legal actions pro bono before, but I just sorta felt like reminding him.

410 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:07:21am

re: #403 wahabicorridor

re: #397 medaura18586


You've got one kick-ass blog, sweetie - and you're not even 22 years old?

Wow. Just. Wow.

Ditto. Good explanation.

411 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:08:14am

OT

There is a hostage situation at Hillary Clinton's HQ in Hew Hampshire?!

Fox News..........

[ron paul, I just know it]

412 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:10:05am

re: #411 wahabicorridor

OT

There is a hostage situation at Hillary Clinton's HQ in Hew Hampshire?!

Fox News..........

[ron paul, I just know it]

On Kos, this is almost certainly already a Republican operative. And I sure some commentators will be saying "Fundamentalist Christian -- you know they're worse than the so-called Muslim terrorist." yada yada.

They're so effing predictable.

413 doriangrey  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:11:07am

re: #382 TalkinKamel

#371 doriangrey

Yes, I'm sorry to say it, but I have to agree with you. Recent activity does indicate that Dymphna has no problem at all with nominally Christian white nationalists, but doesn't approve of Black feminist atheists, and that shse's really mad at Charles, and a lot of other people, because they just aren't going along with her agenda.

Sadly perhaps the obvious inference is obvious for a very good reason. I hate the idea of labeling anyone that I really do not know as a racist, but when on associates freely and willing with known racists and acts in a manner consistent with racism one must wonder if the obvious connotations are not real.

414 jcm  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:11:09am

Local talk show host Byran Suits told a story of his time when his National Guard unit got sent to the Balkans.

His driver was from Kosovo who had been one of those rounded up place in a a mass grave and shot. He survived his wounds, the Americans end up sending him to Chicago for medical treatment. He applied for asylum, getting shot in the head is a pretty good reference for asylum. This fellow was so grateful to the US that when he recovered he joined the US Army. Due to his language skills he ended up in Kosovo as Suits driver.

At one point they stopped in a village and went to the local bar / restaurant. The driver went to talk with the proprietor, during the conversation the proprietor got very nervous and white as a sheet.

Back in the hummer Suits asked is drive what that was all about. The driver told him that was the guy who shot me, I told him I was a US ARMY solider now.

415 realwest  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:11:30am

Well, gotta go get some lunch - hope to BBL!
Hang in there Charles - you're right and they're wrong. Period.
And as you can tell from this thread, you've got a LOT of support.

416 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:12:06am

I want to address this issue of VB, the breakup of Belgium, anti-jihadi, etc.

Much of this comes from anti-EU sentiment. The EU is seen, rightly in my opinion, has forcing immigration - especially Muslim immigration - down peoples' throats - and destroying the nation-state - which to many people is the vessel of their very culture.

So, the separation impulse, in my view, has a good deal of validity.

417 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:14:43am
Apparently it is not possible to be a friend to Dymphna if you disagree with her.
- Dr. Sanity

Yup. That seems to be the case.

418 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:16:21am

The hostage taker in Clintons office has a bomb strapped to his body.

419 marwan's daughter  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:17:30am

re: #416 wahabicorridor

I want to address this issue of VB, the breakup of Belgium, anti-jihadi, etc.

Much of this comes from anti-EU sentiment. The EU is seen, rightly in my opinion, has forcing immigration - especially Muslim immigration - down peoples' throats - and destroying the nation-state - which to many people is the vessel of their very culture.

So, the separation impulse, in my view, has a good deal of validity.

Yes, ordinary Belgians, as well as ordinary Frenchmen, Britons, Germans, Dutch etc. are sick of the EU. And this is the same feeling tha was prevalent in Weimar-era Germany. People were desperate for a savior party, and I think you know the rest of the deal from there. The neo-fascist parties capitalizing on this will use this issue to get into power, and then their real agendas will come out. Why do we bother learning history, when it all ends up repeating anyway?

420 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:18:01am

re: #416 wahabicorridor

I want to address this issue of VB, the breakup of Belgium, anti-jihadi, etc.

Much of this comes from anti-EU sentiment. The EU is seen, rightly in my opinion, has forcing immigration - especially Muslim immigration - down peoples' throats - and destroying the nation-state - which to many people is the vessel of their very culture.

So, the separation impulse, in my view, has a good deal of validity.

The problems with the EU have nothing to do with VB questionable past, and I don't think I've ever read an argument against VB that focused on their opposition to the EU.

In other words, this is not, and was never, about the EU.

421 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:19:03am

Ok, I guess I'm up to five cents on this one.

Reading Dymphna's post, and, more importantly, listening to the quiver, I suspect that she's fallen into the standard manifestation of the Old Seditious Argument.

The Flemings are oppressed, as are many Europeans, by the bureaucratic tyranny of the EU and it's Belgian "province." The socialist bureaucracy combined with a socialist party system that is elitist and anti-democratic, has robbed them of any voice in government. Now all of this may be true, but I suspect that, as many of a basically liberal point of view would think, she has moved from this to the assertion that they are right because they are oppressed: the fact of their oppression demonstrates the justice of their cause.

That isn't true -- the just maybe oppressed, but being oppressed doesn't ipso facto make one just. But I suspect that over at GoV it is precisely that logic that is being followed: Dymphna's statements, as well as Fjordman's comments about the EU support that claim.

If one accepts that proposition, all sort of nastiness follow. If they are fundamentally just, then one can excuse all sorts of unfortunate examples of untoward behavior. They are driven to extremism by their oppression; they are forced to make alliances with undesirables on account of their isolation and alienation; the abjection of their oppression gives them no choice when it comes to seeking allies; in short, if they behave in ways that are not always praiseworthy, it is a mark of the desperation of their situation, not a reflection on the justice of their claims or their character. Circumstances, not their essential identity, made them into undesirables.

And, if you view them as undesirables, perhaps that is because you, secretly, unconsciously, unwillingly, identify with the oppressor. (nice employment of the "non-falsifiable hypothesis).

I'm no psychologist, but I know a thing or two about radical politics: this is how it looks to me.

And I'm sure everyone's gone too. Why is it I only have inspiration when the thread dies?

422 fhilliard  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:21:29am

re: #378 TalkinKamel

#349 fhilliard

And why is it right-wing groups we're supposed to join? What's so helpful about them? Why not freedom loving groups, or democratic groups or Jewish groups or those who oppose Islam on religious grounds, or atheists, or secular humanists? Why do you guys keep talking as if the right, and ONLY the right, are our only saviors in this conflict? Why do you keep arguing as if there are only two sides to this question?

If the choice is between either the jihadists, or Vlaams Belang, I'm checking "None of the above."

My point was that you have to decide what political vehicle is worthy of support. I know it isn't easy, but we all have to weigh where our efforts are best directed. This means deciding on which candidate, which party, which pressure group to support. Dithering about this doesn't help. These decisions are based on a 'best compromise' calculation as are most democratic decisions.

You could start by joining the Vigilant Freedom/910 group and getting involved in real social action, for example.

423 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:21:36am

If the EU was a reaction to extreme Nationalism and fascism, then it will do no good to embrace extreme Nationalism and fascism in a reaction against the EU. Europe needs to break the cycle.

424 Dead Sea Squirrel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:21:58am

re: #416 wahabicorridor

I want to address this issue of VB, the breakup of Belgium, anti-jihadi, etc.

Much of this comes from anti-EU sentiment. The EU is seen, rightly in my opinion, has forcing immigration - especially Muslim immigration - down peoples' throats - and destroying the nation-state - which to many people is the vessel of their very culture.

So, the separation impulse, in my view, has a good deal of validity.

The problem is that too many Euros have reached within themselves to find the spiritual resources necessary to resist the lefty EU multiculti crap on the one side and Islamist aggression on the other. Once upon a time they could have found this strength in their faith, their beliefs. But they have long abandoned religion. The only fire they can find burning, the only thing they can find deep inside is exactly the same thing Hitler found there so many decades ago: a Blood and Soil ethnic pride. Instead of Creed, we have Race.

And there's a huge difference between a people bound by a common moral vision and a people bound by common skin pigment.

425 marwan's daughter  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:22:40am

re: #421 Lucius Septimius

And I'm sure everyone's gone too. Why is it I only have inspiration when the thread dies?

I guess some of the new hatchlings will wait before they show their true colors. Because these threads do have a way of revealing people.

Oh, and great post. I agree with it. Dymphna could easily rationalize Palestinian terrorism that way too.

426 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:22:57am

re: #416 wahabicorridor

I want to address this issue of VB, the breakup of Belgium, anti-jihadi, etc.

Much of this comes from anti-EU sentiment. The EU is seen, rightly in my opinion, has forcing immigration - especially Muslim immigration - down peoples' throats - and destroying the nation-state - which to many people is the vessel of their very culture.

So, the separation impulse, in my view, has a good deal of validity.

It has validity, but as I said above, regional separatism won't help if the problem is the EU. In fact, a Europe of multitudes of tiny autonomous provinces would only strengthen the EU, in part by watering down the strength of any one party, in part by increasing the need for a strong central regime.

Now it could end up like Switzerland, but that's unlikely -- all modern European regimes are the heirs of Absolutism. Regardless of their rhetoric they worship the concept of the state; for that reason they will not turn Swiss. Separatism is not the antidote to the bureaucratic tyranny of the EU.

427 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:23:15am

re: #420 konservo

In other words, this is not, and was never, about the EU.

Do you have a reading comprehension problem? Opposition to what many perceive is the fault of the EU leads people to support the separatist parties like VB.

428 kuchuklambat  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:23:36am

re: #354 guftafs
You can find country reports and other presentations from the Counterjihad Brussels 2007 at [Link: www.vigilantfreedom.org...] -- search for "Counterjihad Brussels 2007" on the page. The conference brought organizations and experts together to network and develop strategies.
As far as I can see, Charles' reporting on VB is right on and the GoV ought not have attacked those who attack VB and deWinters. Rather, given the intensity of the jihad pressure, especially in Europe, I would argue that while the enemy of my enemy is not necessarily my friend, I may be able to use the enemy of my enemy to put a dent in my enemy.
We would have to go into any such affiliations (with distasteful enemies of our enemies) with eyes wide open, with full disclosre of what we disagree with in their platform, and manage the risks of them infiltrating our ranks (we didnt manage that too well with USSR as an ally during WWII) and of their propaganda marring our cause in public eyes.
And to the grandstanders and gloaters one is tempted to say --

you run your mouth and I'll run my (counterjihad) business, brother.

429 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:24:15am

re: #425 marwan's daughter

re: #421 Lucius Septimius

And I'm sure everyone's gone too. Why is it I only have inspiration when the thread dies?

I guess some of the new hatchlings will wait before they show their true colors. Because these threads do have a way of revealing people.

Oh, and great post. I agree with it. Dymphna could easily rationalize Palestinian terrorism that way too.

BINGO! Not saying she would, but it's essentially the same argument, isn't it?

430 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:25:37am

re: #403 wahabicorridor

Thanks! I am very proud of my last post. It was actually inspired by the Vlaams Belang controversy. I thought that a lot of Americans just couldn't believe the real motives of those people because they are simply not familiar with European mentality and its historical/philosophical roots.

Being a European myself, especially an Eastern-European, having felt first hand the rancor and supremacist garbage of my "superior" Western neighbors, I can see into their heads a bit deeper, and I don't like what I see.

431 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:26:07am

re: #419 marwan's daughter

The neo-fascist parties capitalizing on this will use this issue to get into power, and then their real agendas will come out. Why do we bother learning history, when it all ends up repeating anyway?

I've been corresponding w/someone in the Netherlands. They are so frightened there - and I don't blame them - and we have gone round and round on this.

He tells me the fascists are not the imminent threat (true) and they will deal with them when the jihadis are dealt with, if it comes to that. When I ask "If you cannot rid yourselves of them when they are weak, why do you think you will be able to do so when they have power you helped them attain?"

No answer.

432 J.S.  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:27:36am

re: #421 Lucius Septimius

I agree with your analysis -- very, very perspicacious...(then there's all the resentment against the alleged "traitors" and "We'll get even!")

433 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:29:28am

re: #421 Lucius Septimius


It's not dead! It's not dead!

I'm listening to the Hillary hostage brouhaha AND trying to read this thread.............

434 marjoriemoon  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:29:40am

re: #358 Dianna

Wow. I read the post and listened to the podcast. I don't understand Dymphna's reactions at all.

And what's this slander about Charles having "revealed" Bat Ye'or's real name and keeping company with the NYTimes? What's this nonsense about Charles being prepped and primed by Belgian psyops? Good heavens, what is up with Dymphna?

Just my observation.... seems to me that Dymphna is upset not so much about the topic, but because she overheard her friend talking about her behind her back. That's what got her going. Human nature... it would probably have riled my feathers, too.

The sensible thing would have been to 1) take a breath; 2) spend a day or two to cool down; 3) call her and privately work it out on the phone, NOT in e-mail. Then Dr. Sanity would probably have apologized for hurting Dymphna's feelings (which she did anyway, multiple times) and probably would have been more amiable to withdraw the podcast entirely. Instead Dymphna *blackmails* her (but doesn't actually say what the final blackmail will be, if I remember reading it) and now the friendship is irrevocably broken.

--Dr. Moon is in $.5----

435 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:31:18am

re: #425 marwan's daughter

re: #421 Lucius Septimius


And I'm sure everyone's gone too. Why is it I only have inspiration when the thread dies?

I guess some of the new hatchlings will wait before they show their true colors. Because these threads do have a way of revealing people.

Oh, and great post. I agree with it. Dymphna could easily rationalize Palestinian terrorism that way too.

Yes, a couple of posts like this will weed out the hatchlings after all the open registration that Charles had recently. Some stealth ones seem to show up too on threads like this.

And, yes, Lucius, it was a very good post.

436 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:35:53am

re: #421 Lucius Septimius

And, if you view them as undesirables, perhaps that is because you, secretly, unconsciously, unwillingly, identify with the oppressor. (nice employment of the "non-falsifiable hypothesis).

Exactly. Hence Fjordman's sniveling accusation that we are 'anti-Europeans'.

437 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:37:29am

re: #435 Honorary Yooper

Thanks --- it means a lot. No, really.re: #436 wahabicorridor

re: #421 Lucius Septimius

And, if you view them as undesirables, perhaps that is because you, secretly, unconsciously, unwillingly, identify with the oppressor. (nice employment of the "non-falsifiable hypothesis).

Exactly. Hence Fjordman's sniveling accusation that we are 'anti-Europeans'.

Amazing, isn't it? For all of his anti-socialist rantings, his arguments are right out of the Mickey-Maoist Club playbook.

438 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:43:36am

re: #427 wahabicorridor


re: #420 konservo

In other words, this is not, and was never, about the EU.

Do you have a reading comprehension problem?


Possibly, but I doubt it.


Opposition to what many perceive is the fault of the EU leads people to support the separatist parties like VB.


So? We've known that Vlaams Belang is opportunist and manipulative, that's one of the reasons that their involvement in the counter-jihad conference was called in to question in the first place.
As you know, many comments have tried to obfuscate the concerns that LGF has raised by claiming that Charles (and LGF in general) needs to "take a deeper look" at the issue. This is nonsense. LGF is not oblivious to the situation in Europe, the reason that the 'EU' aspect has not been specifically mentioned in Charles' posts is that it does not pertain to the target of his criticisms.

439 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:43:46am

re: #437 Lucius Septimius

Mickey-Maoist Club

HA HA
excellent
I love that

440 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:46:23am

re: #437 Lucius Septimius

Pffff. what's an "anti-European"?

Can Fjordman give a sensible definition of what European means, in terms other than white-supremacism in general, or British, Aryan, Flemish supremacism in particular? What are these "European" values, this "European" ideology, to which we are so "anti"?

...dead silence

441 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:48:44am

re: #438 konservo

This is nonsense. LGF is not oblivious to the situation in Europe, the reason that the 'EU' aspect has not been specifically mentioned in Charles' posts is that it does not pertain to the target of his criticisms.

And the reason the EU has been mentioned in many of MY posts is because I think it IS pertinent.

(why does LGF keep logging me off? I always have to fire up a new session.)

442 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:49:47am

#422 fhilliard

I make decisions about politics, and which politicians I'm going to support, all the time, with little to no dithering. I think what you don't like is the fact that, and a lot of other people, just aren't supporting the politics you want us to support.

I have decided, based on the available evidence, that Vlaams Belang and the BNP are not worth my support. Why do you find that position such a hard one to accept?

I've researched Vigilant Freedom, by the way, find it contradictory and too closely connected with Gates of Vienna, and won't be giving it my support either. I will give my support to other things---but not to any racist, crypto-Nazi group, because I believe such a compromise would be ultimately suicidal, for a number of reasons, and won't help the anti-jihad movement at all.

443 Anthony (Los Angeles)  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:50:30am

re: #291 Honorary Yooper


Ya think? GCP is only "LGF Stalker Blog #2".

What's "GCP?"

444 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:51:34am

In short, fhilliard, I have weighed it---and I've rejected it. If you can't accept that, I'm sorry.

445 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:52:07am

re: #440 medaura18586

re: #437 Lucius Septimius

Pffff. what's an "anti-European"?

Can Fjordman give a sensible definition of what European means, in terms other than white-supremacism in general, or British, Aryan, Flemish supremacism in particular? What are these "European" values, this "European" ideology, to which we are so "anti"?

The more interesting question to ask Fjordman would be "How could we be anti-European without also being anti-American?".

I would really like to know how he thinks European values and American values diverge.

...dead silence

446 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:55:30am

#413 doriangrey

Yes, I hate labeling people too, but that's exactly the feeling I get from Dymphna's recent comments, and support of Vlaams Belang. To be honest, it was after her Hirsi Ali rant that I stopped reading Gates of Vienna, the whole thing just made me extremely uncomfortable. . .

Whatever their reasons, I do believe that a lot of the anger fueling this on-going scandal is that those like Dymphna are furious that we dare question them, and just aren't falling meekly into line.

447 Salamantis  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:56:07am

re: #440 medaura18586

My guess is that they are the same values that have caused most of their problems so far: the creeds of Blood and Soil.

The US, as a nation of immigrants, has of necessity found - or created - better principles than race or location with which to unite its various and sundry strains: the creeds of Tolerance for Each Other's Differences, Equality of Rights and Opportunities, and Freedom and Justice for All.

I know that the US is, in very many ways, the cultural child of Europe, but sometimes, the child has something to teach the parent that it would well behoove the parent to learn.

448 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:56:31am

re: #397 medaura18586

Again, thanks.

I know a bit about the region, since I was in Soviet studies. I am very much aware, though, that it doesn't make me an expert.

449 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:56:37am

SWAT team is moving in.

That can't be good. They only do that to save lives in imminent danger.

450 Pastorius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:56:40am

It has been my experience that Baron, Dymphna, Chritine, and other Center for Vigilant Freedom people I have been affiliated with have all reacted in an over-the-top and bizarre manner when any criticism is directed at them.

I have been wondering what gives for weeks now. Are they afraid of something? Are they hiding something?

I do think Christine needs to be removed from her leadership role over at CVF. But, a fat lotta good that will do if the other people in charge are of the same mindset.

I had a lot of hope for CVF. I interviewed Christine, Baron and Dymphna on my radio show. I had actually planned to dedicate my radio show and most of my posting at IBA to CVF issues.

And then all this came down.

451 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:57:51am

re: #443 Anthony (Los Angeles)

re: #291 Honorary Yooper


Ya think? GCP is only "LGF Stalker Blog #2".

What's "GCP?"

Gulf Coast Pundit. It's where some banned commentors went and congregate. The level of venom there for Charles is off the meter some days.

452 JHW  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:58:36am

After all this time ,they`re still confusing the Celtic cross and the Odin cross (the on on DeWinter`s bookshelf). They mention the Celtic cross`s historic usage in Ireland and elsewhere, how inoffensive it is, etc, but this is a dead horse they`re beating because Charles never described the cross on DeWinter`s bookshelf as a Celtic cross, but correctly as an Odin`s cross which has a quite different history and symbology.

They still obfuscate the issue of laying wreaths on SS graves, by finding an SS man whose history is marginally less offensive than the others and claiming this guy and only this guy was the one they were honoring. There were many SS mens graves in that cemetery and they didn`t go there just to honor a single "good Nazi". The European volunteers in the SS weren`t draftees, they weren`t forced to join such an odious organization, they were volunteers, willing and able to align themselves with fascism.

They`ve ignored, as in failed to even acknowledge, VB`s connections with the notorious Nazi, Leon DeGrelle.

They`ve ignored the little tourist jaunts by VB members to Braunau-am_Inn . Hitler`s birthplace as a tourist pilgrimage.

No mention of questionable symbology in the VB youth magazine, Does a modern sqeecky clean group need to use modified forms of the
Wolfsangel or the Odin`s cross in its literature? The arguments to be wary of VB have not been addressed in any substantial manner, but a lot of smoke has been blown on how we cannot possibly defeat the jihadis unless we ally with any and all comers and that anyone who disagrees or calls for caution in the matter must be a leftist or a jihadi sympathizer. This panic stricken mode of being so terrified of radical Islam that is willing to ally with unsavory groups is a bit too terror stricken to be of any real use in a fight that calls for patience , nerve, steely determination and a strong reliance on real , universal values of right and wrong.

453 Anthony (Los Angeles)  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:58:53am

re: #349 fhilliard

What would be helpful, on the other hand, is contributing in the real world by joining right-wing political parties, taking part in anti-Jihadist conferences and going public with anti Islamic protests.

European right-wing and US right-wing are very different things. I'll take the red, white, and blue t-shirt (XL, please) over the brown shirt, thank you.

454 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 11:59:49am

re: #450 Pastorius

It has been my experience that Baron, Dymphna, Chritine, and other Center for Vigilant Freedom people I have been affiliated with have all reacted in an over-the-top and bizarre manner when any criticism is directed at them.

I have been wondering what gives for weeks now. Are they afraid of something? Are they hiding something?

I do think Christine needs to be removed from her leadership role over at CVF. But, a fat lotta good that will do if the other people in charge are of the same mindset.

I had a lot of hope for CVF. I interviewed Christine, Baron and Dymphna on my radio show. I had actually planned to dedicate my radio show and most of my posting at IBA to CVF issues.

And then all this came down.


It had to have been a shock to you when Dymphna went batshit about you guys. I was stunned. It just seemed so trivial.

455 WriterMom  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:01:07pm

I gotta run...but I want to say GO CHARLES GO CHARLES

I would like to add:

-JCM you are a wonderful person, bless your soul for taking care of such wounded little souls
-HI KAMEL
-Long live lizardia

YADA YADA YADA

Gotta go. Shabbat early. Gaaaa. Bye.

456 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:01:38pm

re: #412 Lucius Septimius

It's clearly a sick individual. Let's just hope it resolves peacefully - or has already.

457 WriterMom  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:01:51pm

re: #440 medaura18586

European = White.

That's all.

458 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:03:11pm

Sorry. Reports of SWAT team moving in were inaccurate.

459 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:04:18pm

Shabbat WriterMom

460 neocon hippie  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:05:19pm

re: #301 BabbaZee

re: #291 Honorary Yooper

Sodra Djavul

means White Devil btw

In what language?

461 Pastorius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:08:09pm

Wahabicorridor #454

This is all a shock to me.

Baron and Dymphna are not the only friends I have lost as a result of all this.

462 Render  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:10:07pm

re: #460 neocon hippie

It's actually "Southern Devil" in Swedish.

The "Southern Devil" is also a rare type of scorpion commonly found in the US Southeastern region.

[Link: www.forestryimages.org...]

DISCOVERY,
R

463 Steffan  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:10:20pm

What do you figure the odds are that "Triumph of the Will" will be shown at the Flanders Film Festival?

Last I heard, that film was still banned over there. It wouldn't greatly surprise me, though, if the VB leaders were trying to get the ban lifted.

464 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:11:02pm

On the EU: If LFG is less concerned with the EU than other blogs, perhaps it's because the primary concern here is the US. That's not to say that there are not other voices here speaking of other parts of the world (South Asia, Southeast Asia, Israel, Canada, Australia, and, of course Europe) but this is, by virtue of location and membership, primarily and American blog.

I often find it striking (as an American student of European history) the extent to which Europeans roundly condemn Americans for their ignorance of European history, when Europeans feel little need to learn anything about America. It's all current events, and it's not like America has contributed anything to the world, you know, except Coca Cola and Levis. And Elvis, don't forget Elvis. I recall a comment from Goebbels's diaries where he said that American POW's were practically retarded because they couldn't provide the right answers to trivia questions about Bavarian geography.

The issue, in the larger sense, is the defense of western civilization, the package of free-market economics, limited constitutional government, scientific rationalism, religious toleration, and the shared moral and cultural legacy provided by our common Judeo-Christian heritage, that is at stake, and America is as much an heir to that as is Europe.

But Europeans don't see it that way. In fact, the whole EU project was founded on a variety of Western Continental European bigotry, that viewed America (and Great Britain in the bargain) and Russia as defective cultures that had fallen away from the original post-Enlightenment vision of nineteenth-century Liberalism. Those who claim to be "liberals" (i.e. conservatives in the European context) still carry with them that set of assumptions, even while they condemn the EU from having also fallen away from the original vision. Both are elitist, Euro-centric (in a bad way), and myopic when it comes to anything east of the Oder-Niesse line and west of, well, Paris.

I care about the EU, but not as much as about America. And I take the time to study the history and culture of Europe; do they do the same?

465 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:13:08pm

re: #456 Dianna

re: #412 Lucius Septimius

It's clearly a sick individual. Let's just hope it resolves peacefully - or has already.

Agreed. Oh, and good for you nailing me on Linus Paulding a while back. I always thought of him as a chemist and forgot about the "bio" part. You were right, I was wrong, though I still think he was a crackpot about the vitamin C thing.

466 doriangrey  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:16:53pm

re: #441 wahabicorridor

re: #438 konservo

This is nonsense. LGF is not oblivious to the situation in Europe, the reason that the 'EU' aspect has not been specifically mentioned in Charles' posts is that it does not pertain to the target of his criticisms.

And the reason the EU has been mentioned in many of MY posts is because I think it IS pertinent.

(why does LGF keep logging me off? I always have to fire up a new session.)

It is perhaps pertinent to you, but from our American perspective the issue is more of racism and fascism. With the sole exception of Texas, none of the States within the United States was ever a nation of it's own before entering the Union. So while we are in many respects similar to the EU we are also profoundly different.

What for those within the EU present serious and difficult issues of nationality are for us idea's not even to be considered, hence not pertinent. Because each of our states were not nations before entering the Union our approach to immigration legal or illegal has always been one seen as a federal level issue.

It is the United States that dictates each states immigration policy and once entry to the United States has been legally granted there are no intra-state restrictions on where a person may or may not choose to live.

Race creed and color have no determining factor regarding each states population. Thus our difficulty with European nationalism. There is no State in our Union that has a significant political party advocating California is only for Californians or only for white Americans. We find such a notion reprehensible.

Dont expect us to support a Flanders only policy either. Also don't be surprised when we don't take into consideration European nationalism when discussing white European nationalism or a reemergences of fascism in Europe.

467 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:19:27pm

re: #441 wahabicorridor

re: #438 konservo


This is nonsense. LGF is not oblivious to the situation in Europe, the reason that the 'EU' aspect has not been specifically mentioned in Charles' posts is that it does not pertain to the target of his criticisms.

And the reason the EU has been mentioned in many of MY posts is because I think it IS pertinent.

It's pertinent insofar as it is one of the reasons why these groups are becoming popular. However, I fail to see why you think this is sufficient for an LGF endorsement. Remember, this started because Charles questioned whether or the presence of VB and SD at the C-J conference was wise. That is why he was attacked, and that is why he and other LGFers did so much research. It was not to support CAIR or the EU or Euro-Leftists, and it was not because Charles 'hates Europeans even more than he hates jihadists,' it's because his friends insulted him for having the audacity to question participants in the counter-jihad movement.

Criticisms of VB and SD were made in that context, not an 'anti-EU' context, so while anti-EU sentiment is certainly relevant to VB's overall platform, it is not pertinent to the criticisms made here and elsewhere.

468 guftafs  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:19:47pm

re: #464 Lucius Septimius
re: #464 Lucius Septimius

But Europeans don't see it that way. In fact, the whole EU project was founded on a variety of Western Continental European bigotry, that viewed America (and Great Britain in the bargain) and Russia as defective cultures that had fallen away from the original post-Enlightenment vision of nineteenth-century Liberalism. Those who claim to be "liberals" (i.e. conservatives in the European context) still carry with them that set of assumptions, even while they condemn the EU from having also fallen away from the original vision. Both are elitist, Euro-centric (in a bad way), and myopic when it comes to anything east of the Oder-Niesse line and west of, well, Paris.

I care about the EU, but not as much as about America. And I take the time to study the history and culture of Europe; do they do the same?

Fact is, Europe is no longer the heartland of Western civilization. The US is, but you'd wouldn't get that past the lips of the vast majority of people living in Europe, intellectual or 'commoner'. Freedom, individualism and reason are still here in Europe, but not nearly as strong as in the US. And I'm afraid a much weaker wind than the storm brewing over Islam is enough to blow away the remnants of those away from the surface of Europe.

469 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:21:58pm

re: #464 Lucius Septimius

do they do the same?

No. What a ridiculous question, rhetorical as it may be.

Funny story. I had an American friend, S., who lived in Germany for a few years. After work, she and some of her German colleagues went out for a beer. They ran into some friends of her colleagues who said they were leaving for a one week trip to the U.S. - their first. They were arriving in Miami and driving to California.

S. didn't say anything.

A few weeks later, she ran into them and asked how their U.S. trip had been.

They never got out of Florida.

Back to my correspondent in the Netherlands. I tried to explain why the configuration of the racial conversation in the U.S. is so different from that in Europe. I had to explain that for many of U.S., the Civil War history was related by grandparents who fought at Gettysburg, and for many more of us the Civil Rights movement and the assassination of Martin Luther King happened yesterday.

I think this also pertains to Fjordman's misapprehension that the U.S. is going to go the way of Atlantis by virtue of uncontrolled immigration (citing an article in the Guardian about gangs in Los Angeles, no less). The sheer SIZE of the U.S. - not just geography but cultural content - is so beyond the scale of anything most Europeans can imagine, they have no mental model to evaluate it with.

470 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:24:14pm

re: #462 Render

re: #460 neocon hippie

It's actually "Southern Devil" in Swedish.

The "Southern Devil" is also a rare type of scorpion commonly found in the US Southeastern region.

[Link: www.forestryimages.org...]

DISCOVERY,
R

Again, a very apt name for what Sodra was, and continues to be over at GoV.

471 Anthony (Los Angeles)  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:25:06pm

re: #466 doriangrey

With the sole exception of Texas, none of the States within the United States was ever a nation of it's own before entering the Union.

Actually, Vermont was an independent state from 1777 through 1791, when it became the 14th state.

Just being picky....

472 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:26:01pm

re: #466 doriangrey


You have totally misread everything I've written - altho' obviously you've read very little of it.

I am American, born in Pennsylvania.

Simply put, I've studied the EU for about 5 years. I've conversed with literally hundreds of Europeans about this and believe me - we use the same words and mean completely different things. The mindsets are radically different and I think if we have any hope of communicating, it's a good thing to recognize where those differences occur.

473 doriangrey  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:26:11pm

re: #446 TalkinKamel

#413 doriangrey

Yes, I hate labeling people too, but that's exactly the feeling I get from Dymphna's recent comments, and support of Vlaams Belang. To be honest, it was after her Hirsi Ali rant that I stopped reading Gates of Vienna, the whole thing just made me extremely uncomfortable. . .

Whatever their reasons, I do believe that a lot of the anger fueling this on-going scandal is that those like Dymphna are furious that we dare question them, and just aren't falling meekly into line.

I hope that I am wrong and that it is nothing more than a convergence of coincidences, however being an American of Irish decent and having had a brother (he passed away last year) who was for a time a Sinn Fein member I am all to aware of white nationalism influence with the Irish community. As I said I hope my concerns are mistaken and unfounded, by Dymphna is currently doing nothing to suspend those suspicions, and only adding fire to them.

474 lucius septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:26:25pm

re: #469 wahabicorridor

they have no mental model to evaluate it with.

Nor do they think they need one.

I've had many similar experiences during the times I've lived in Europe.

475 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:26:33pm

re: #458 wahabicorridor

That's a relief.

Is it confirmed that he's wearing a bomb? And where are you getting your info? My boss and I would like to know; we're in a bit of a radio hole, so it's helpful if it's an on-line source.

476 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:28:34pm

re: #467 konservo

However, I fail to see why you think this is sufficient for an LGF endorsement.

You do have a reading comprehension problem. I never said any such thing, just the opposite, actually. Go back thru any of my posts - go find my post (LGF) when I replied to Rober Spencer.

477 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:28:57pm

re: #465 Lucius Septimius

I thought he was cracked, too. A friend's grandparents started getting his newsletters, and did things like freezing their butter and so on; lots of odd food ideas. To me, that's always a bad sign.

Though perhaps I ought to be careful with that...since I am a South Beach Dieter.

478 doriangrey  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:29:08pm

re: #472 wahabicorridor

re: #466 doriangrey


You have totally misread everything I've written - altho' obviously you've read very little of it.

I am American, born in Pennsylvania.

Simply put, I've studied the EU for about 5 years. I've conversed with literally hundreds of Europeans about this and believe me - we use the same words and mean completely different things. The mindsets are radically different and I think if we have any hope of communicating, it's a good thing to recognize where those differences occur.

My apologies than...

479 neocon hippie  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:30:11pm

re: #422 fhilliard

re: #378 TalkinKamel

#349 fhilliard

And why is it right-wing groups we're supposed to join? What's so helpful about them? Why not freedom loving groups, or democratic groups or Jewish groups or those who oppose Islam on religious grounds, or atheists, or secular humanists? Why do you guys keep talking as if the right, and ONLY the right, are our only saviors in this conflict? Why do you keep arguing as if there are only two sides to this question?

If the choice is between either the jihadists, or Vlaams Belang, I'm checking "None of the above."

My point was that you have to decide what political vehicle is worthy of support. I know it isn't easy, but we all have to weigh where our efforts are best directed. This means deciding on which candidate, which party, which pressure group to support. Dithering about this doesn't help. These decisions are based on a 'best compromise' calculation as are most democratic decisions.

You could start by joining the Vigilant Freedom/910 group and getting involved in real social action, for example.

Vicktorya of the 910 group is involved with a website full of astrological charts of Nazi leaders and a bizarre anti-Semitism based on whacko theosophical concepts of root races, seven rays, etc. I was once joined up there but withdrew before any of this came up. Now there is no way I would ally myself with the 910 group.

480 Josephine  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:31:07pm

re: #450 Pastorius

Have you seen some of the websites that Vicktorya Stone is affiliated with?

481 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:32:07pm

re: #475 Dianna

re: #458 wahabicorridor

That's a relief.

Is it confirmed that he's wearing a bomb? And where are you getting your info? My boss and I would like to know; we're in a bit of a radio hole, so it's helpful if it's an on-line source.


I'm sitting in our home office listening to the TV. Here's what we know. This is in Rochester New Hampshire. A man walked into Hillary's campaign office and displayed what appears to be an explosive device strapped to his chest. He let one woman with an infant go, holding onto 2 more people. Eventually, he let one of those two go. That person was escorted by police escort, which got quite close to the building, hence the inaccurate report that the SWAT team was moving in.

In wait mode now.........

482 gtiness  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:33:48pm

Yeah, I used to get a kick out of the GoV posts. A couple of months ago (roughly) I just lost interest (or the content changed)...don't know which...but I unsubscribed from the RSS feed.

483 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:33:54pm

re: #466 doriangrey

It is perhaps pertinent to you, but from our American perspective the issue is more of racism and fascism. With the sole exception of Texas, none of the States within the United States was ever a nation of it's own before entering the Union. So while we are in many respects similar to the EU we are also profoundly different.

Just a minor nitpick, but there is also Hawai'i. Hawai'i was independent up until the 1890s, and then became a territory in 1898.

484 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:35:26pm

re: #478 doriangrey

My apologies than...

Accepted, thank you (please see my #431 on this thread to clarify a bit more)

485 gman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:38:31pm

re: #464 Lucius Septimius


I often find it striking (as an American student of European history) the extent to which Europeans roundly condemn Americans for their ignorance of European history, when Europeans feel little need to learn anything about America. It's all current events, and it's not like America has contributed anything to the world, you know, except Coca Cola and Levis. And Elvis, don't forget Elvis.

Whenever I am in Europe, which is nearly every year, I see the same old crap on TV over there. They constantly bombard their viewers with negative images of America or Americans. One day you might watch a documentary about poor kids living in a trailer park in Florida, and the next day you're watching analysts dissect the lack of federal funding for Katrina victims. The one constant through all of it is the "liberal spin" put on the message.

My own theory about the media in Europe is that since many of the news organizations are state funded, they put out messages supportive of the state. They brainwash the citizens of the country into not wanting to find out more about America because it is a "materialistic and self-indulgent country" as indicated by the programs on their televisions. This way the citizens are happy to give half of their check to the government to support the welfare state.

486 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:40:37pm

re: #473 doriangrey

Just a side note to your comment: the only Holocaust denier I have ever met face-to-face was an Irishman who described himself as a "revolutionary", very definitely a Provo.

487 Josephine  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:41:06pm

Dr. Sanity has an update on her blog: [Link: drsanity.blogspot.com...]

488 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:42:04pm

re: #465 Lucius Septimius

though I still think he was a crackpot about the vitamin C thing.

I used to date a guy whose great uncle won the Nobel for

discovering

vitamin C (in paprika no less)- name of Szent Gyiorgi. Hungarian. Brilliant guy. Also, according to my friend, had some of the most hare brained ideas you would ever want to hear. He told me it's quite a common trait among the brilliant.

489 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:42:44pm

re: #476 wahabicorridor

re: #467 konservo


However, I fail to see why you think this is sufficient for an LGF endorsement.

You do have a reading comprehension problem. I never said any such thing, just the opposite, actually. Go back thru any of my posts - go find my post (LGF) when I replied to Rober Spencer.

Again, it's possible, but I doubt it. ;)

The reason I made that comment is because you're concerned with a problem that doesn't pertain to the situation at hand. You claim it does, however. So unless you're trying to argue in the manner of buzzroid (or whatever it's name was), you ought to begin your posts about the EU by indicating that, in fact, you're making an off-topic comment. This can be done with a simple "O/T" or "OT" at the top of your posts.

490 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:43:44pm

re: #447 Salamantis

You are EXACTLY right. Europeans dress similarly to us, we share many conventions with them, religion, and so on. So sometimes we take their moral convictions for granted. They have no rooted belief that all men were created equal, with inalienable rights to life, liberty and property. The UK doesn't even have a constitution! European countries reinvent their political identities almost from scratch with every election! No spine... the only sentiment that prevails is their feeling of superiority in being white in general, and then whatever their ethnicity is in particular. Xenophobia is rampant in Europe: The English hate the French, the Greeks hate the Albanians, secondary differences in language and some customs are enough for Europeans to strip foreigners of their humanity, even among White Europe, let alone different races. Their culture is collectivist/tribalistic/chauvinistic, not based on INDIVIDUAL negative human rights.

Here's some passages from my essay about it:

So what do Europeans have to say to burqa wearers, or to female circumcisers for that matter? “That’s not how we dress/do things over here”? Europeans have no firm conceptions of why some of their traditions and practices are objectively superior to the new influx from the savage world. That’s because the moral foundation of their civilization has been a mix of Christian theology (now increasingly irrelevant) and pure ethnocentricity (Cultural Relativism has rendered ethnocentric supremacism impotent.) So I do not feel as strongly about defiant burqa-girls in Western Europe. I think it would be in their best interest to renounce their backward ways and embrace the less backward European tradition, but there is no guarantee that they will be fully accepted by the nationalistic establishment even if they do so. Furthermore, because Europe advertises its culture as a nationalistic dogma instead of a cogent moral argument, of course there will be poor penetration within the Muslims: they’ve already got their own big fat dogma! It also makes European culture less appealing to defend, thus I am less outraged when I spot burqa-girls flagrantly defacing it.

By contrast, the former British colonies are not ethnic nation-states. They are essentially membership clubs, the belonging to which is based on clear ideological commitments. For example, the national identity of the US is nothing but a moral profile outlining American values. That’s all there is to it. If you don’t like freedom, then why do you come to the US? If you don’t value self-realization, then what are you doing here? The burqa/headscarf and the subjugation they imply, of women to men, flies in the face of the American tradition of freedom and equal moral entitlement of genders. It is an uncompromising culture of freedom that is supposed to make Americans “American”. A lot of Americans themselves skimp on the “all men created equal” statement here and there but at least pay it due lip service.

After failed efforts to conceive a new society within sterile Europe, the United States of America was Western Thought’s first love child: a country conceived in liberty, self-determination, and natural law.

Whereas Europe’s kinky flirts with freedom revolved around the whim of kings, queens, political coalitions, or angry mobs, America’s political heart was always in the right place. While Europe was still consumed by its ethnic wars well into the 20th century, America was busy getting prosperous through commerce. While Europe was preparing to butcher millions of its own, America was becoming a new home to thousands every year, affording them opportunities never dreamt of in their old caste-based societies.

491 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:46:41pm

re: #487 Josephine

Dr. Sanity has an update on her blog: [Link: drsanity.blogspot.com...]


Make sure Charles knows about it.........

Dianna

It appears all hostages have been released...........

492 Pastorius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:48:58pm

480 Josephine,

Yes, I've seen them.

You've seen my criticism of Christine. I think she ought to be removed as the head of CVF.

However, let me be clear, my personal experience with the Chrisitne does not lead me to believe that she is anything like Viktorya. Viktorya seems to be a nutcase. I don't think anyone could have anticipated that. After all, we met on the net. Viktorya was removed for a reason.

I could be wrong about Christine. She might be worse than I think she is, but my personal opinion is she is not a racist. She is simply too hyper-focused on a narrow range of issues, and that causes her to become irrational.

The one thing that has stunned me more than anything is that some of my friends are willing to ally themselves with Ethnic Nationalists. They are willing to stand with "anyone" who is willing to stand with them against the Islamists.

Great. Meanwhile, my family is not white. So, where does that leave us?

I guess I ought to just sit on my hands while my friends befriend people who want to put limits on how many non-white citizens ought to be allowed in certain parts of the world.

493 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:49:08pm

re: #445 wahabicorridor

That IS the most interesting question indeed. There is nothing besides American values that make Europe "Western". Racist supremacism can be observed in any other cultures, usually in the more backward ones.

America took the best of Europe, the ideas too radical to be fully and unapologetically implemented in the continent of ethnic strife, and kings and queens.

And that's the part Europe still hates about America, and its through backward ethnocentrism that they choose to define themselves even today, not through humanistic values.

Stupid terms like "Judeo-Christian values" obfuscate the very important difference between Europe and America, and insinuate that we share the values of the white-supremacists pigs.

494 lucius septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:49:22pm

re: #485 gman

Absolutely -- state-funded media (dominated by left-socialists) puts out anti-American propaganda on a regular basis. Just part of the program.

495 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:50:51pm

re: #488 wahabicorridor

Also, according to my friend, had some of the most hare brained ideas you would ever want to hear. He told me it's quite a common trait among the brilliant.

From observation, that does tend to be true. Possibly because brilliant people have a hard time figuring out that they can be wrong, along the lines of: "Well, I thought of it, didn't I? And I'm a genius, aren't I? So, then, there you are!"

At least I only say things like that jokingly. Of course, I'm not a genius, either.

496 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:51:39pm

re: #489 konservo

re: #476 wahabicorridor


re: #467 konservo

However, I fail to see why you think this is sufficient for an LGF endorsement.

You do have a reading comprehension problem. I never said any such thing, just the opposite, actually. Go back thru any of my posts - go find my post (LGF) when I replied to Rober Spencer.

Again, it's possible, but I doubt it. ;)

The reason I made that comment is because you're concerned with a problem that doesn't pertain to the situation at hand. You claim it does, however. So unless you're trying to argue in the manner of buzzroid (or whatever it's name was), you ought to begin your posts about the EU by indicating that, in fact, you're making an off-topic comment. This can be done with a simple "O/T" or "OT" at the top of your posts.


Kiss my ass in Macy's window, sweetcakes.

You stated in #467

However, I fail to see why you think this is sufficient for an LGF endorsement.

I never made a case for any such endorsement. EVER. I expect a retraction of what, right about now, I'm about to construe a flat-out lie.

497 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:54:54pm

re: #491 wahabicorridor

Whew! Good news, that!

Now, let's hope he surrenders peacefully.

498 zuckerlilly  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:55:30pm

re: #32 BenZacharia

re: #25 insanity police


I get it. Vienna is not the country, its an insane asylum. Close the gates, and keep the inmates inside.

Quite. 70-80% of SS officers were Austrians, as well as a certain corporal.


Sorry but this is completely wrong. Although Austria had only 8 per cent of the population of Germany she had 14 per cent of portion in the SS but - much worse - 40 per cent of the guardians in the concentration camps were Austrians.

499 littleoldlady  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:58:35pm

re: #488 wahabicorridor

Of all the hilarious things I have been privileged to read on this site over the years. This has to be up there in the Top Ten:

Also, according to my friend, had some of the most hare brained ideas you would ever want to hear. He told me it's quite a common trait among the brilliant.

Oh yes, quite true. We're all like that!

/since I have TONS of hare brained ideas I must be REALLY brilliant...! ROTFL!

500 BabbaZee  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:59:24pm

medaura18586

has an excellent blog
and is a very young and beautiful person~

Mazel Tov
and
Shabbat Shalom
to you

glad you are here

Later Lizardia

501 gman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 12:59:36pm

re: #494 lucius septimius

re: #485 gman

Absolutely -- state-funded media (dominated by left-socialists) puts out anti-American propaganda on a regular basis. Just part of the program.

They're so brainwashed by years and years of this propaganda that it must be difficult for Europeans to see us as we really are. We are not all Pavlovian dogs drueling in line to get our "Supersize Me" burgers as the European media would tell you. We are a nation where individual freedom is cherished. In absolute terms, we enjoy more "freedom" than any country I know.

502 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:01:12pm

re: #493 medaura18586

America took the best of Europe, the ideas too radical to be fully and unapologetically implemented in the continent of ethnic strife, and kings and queens.

This would require a long essay to explain just how far wrong the bolded part of your comment is, so let me point out that bits of Europe have constantly implemented far more sweeping, radical and unapologetically solutions than the United States would ever accept. I refer you to Calvin; Malacthone (I apologize for the spelling); Munster; the Puritan Revolution; the French Revolution; and finally, the history of 20th Century Europe.

In comparison, the United States is remarkable in its moderation, and the care with which it adopts new concepts.

503 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:01:15pm

Babba please check yer mail! puh-leeze.

Dianna, I got those books on the Roma - haven't started them yet, but I got 'em.

504 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:03:39pm

re: #498 zuckerlilly

Are we now indulging in attainder of the blood?!

505 EmeraldLakeEyes  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:05:40pm

re: #397 medaura18586

Wow. You are 21. I am very impressed by your writing. Calm, knowledgeable and on point.

506 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:07:06pm

re: #503 wahabicorridor

Good for you.

As I said, it's not a central interest of mine, but it's interesting stuff.

507 Josephine  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:10:22pm

re: #492 Pastorius

480 Josephine,

Yes, I've seen them.

You've seen my criticism of Christine. I think she ought to be removed as the head of CVF.

However, let me be clear, my personal experience with the Chrisitne does not lead me to believe that she is anything like Viktorya. Viktorya seems to be a nutcase. I don't think anyone could have anticipated that. After all, we met on the net. Viktorya was removed for a reason.

I could be wrong about Christine. She might be worse than I think she is, but my personal opinion is she is not a racist. She is simply too hyper-focused on a narrow range of issues, and that causes her to become irrational.

The one thing that has stunned me more than anything is that some of my friends are willing to ally themselves with Ethnic Nationalists. They are willing to stand with "anyone" who is willing to stand with them against the Islamists.

Great. Meanwhile, my family is not white. So, where does that leave us?

I guess I ought to just sit on my hands while my friends befriend people who want to put limits on how many non-white citizens ought to be allowed in certain parts of the world.

I didn't know that Vicktorya had been removed from 910 and/or CVF. Recently, after I posted a link to the Makara site that she is involved with, and suggested that people click on the "Jews" link, someone else posted that the link had been deleted. Someone read my comment and hit the delete key pretty quickly.

There was a post on Jihad Watch recently in which the BNP was criticized. The pro-BNP supporters dominated the comments thread. In a previous thread on JW, I had asked about my Jewish ancestry and was reassured (by a commenter) that I would qualify as a Canadian of British descent (the last fully Jewish ancestor in my line was born 200 years ago but other lines in the family stayed Jewish). Apparently, if your ethnicity contains the word "Celtic", you're in. If you're not of "Celtic" descent, you're not ethnically British. In the BNP thread, I mentioned my Jewish cousins and asked if, after 200+ years in England, they were not fully British according to the BNP and its supporters. Well, apparently they're not. (spit)

I don't associate with people who base their value judgments on skin colour or ethnicity. Those things are irrelevant to a person's character.

508 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:10:42pm

re: #496 wahabicorridor


I never made a case for any such endorsement. EVER. I expect a retraction of what, right about now, I'm about to construe a flat-out lie.

You have defended euro-trolls who argue that LGF needs to take a more 'nuanced' look at the situation which has facilitated groups like VB gaining power. Have you not?

You also claimed that the EU problem pertains to criticisms that Charles has made* of VB (in this thread):

re: #441 wahabicorridor

re: #438 konservo

This is nonsense. LGF is not oblivious to the situation in Europe, the reason that the 'EU' aspect has not been specifically mentioned in Charles' posts is that it does not pertain to the target of his criticisms.

And the reason the EU has been mentioned in many of MY posts is because I think it IS pertinent.

(why does LGF keep logging me off? I always have to fire up a new session.)

In what way does it pertain to Charles' point.*

*Charles' point is that it is not wise to endorse groups like the VB, by the way.

509 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:11:09pm

Gotta run: Have a great weekend all.

Great discussion this has turned out to be. Lots here to think about.

510 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:12:35pm

re: #492 Pastorius

Great. Meanwhile, my family is not white. So, where does that leave us?

As I've noted on this thread, I have a correspondent in the Netherlands. His children are Indonesian/Jewish. Yet even HE thinks in terms of 'the lesser of 2 evils" GAH! I can't imagine what kind of fear he lives with.

They've accused us on this side of the pond of being allowed to stand on principle by virtue of 'the luxury of our freedom', i.e., no imminent threat of cultural sublimation by jihadis (I don't where where Sept 11 2001 fits on that spectrum, but that's another rant).

To which I respond with this from Joachim Fest's book "Others Will Betray You: Not I"

Fest's father, Johannes, is out of a job as a school principal because he will not sign a statement of allegiance to the Nazis. His little girls are celebrating a birthday in the backyard. Herr Henschel, their vicious neighbor, is standing on his balcony in his black SS uniform, "fists balled on his fat hips, screaming that he forbids the Fest girls" to bring disorder to a garden that is not his own.

As Fest makes clear, nobody in Berlin in 1940 was listening to radio call-in shows debating whether the invasions of France and Poland were morally acceptable.

Rather: One night, Fest overheard his mother asking his father, the Roman Catholic, Prussian nationalist, and friend of Jews, can't you join the Nazi Party? We won't really be changing, she said, and lying is how little people have always dealt with the powerful.

"We are not little people," Fest's father shot back. "Not on this subject!"

I don't think Johannes Fest was acting out of any 'luxury of freedom' - but that's just me.

511 Josephine  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:13:58pm

re: #491 wahabicorridor

Okay, I reported my comment.

512 Render  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:14:26pm

re: #493 medaura18586

Very nice blog - Welcome aboard.

One quick point...

Your Feb 27th posting, The US did not support the Taliban in the '80's. Because the Taliban did not exist in the '80's.

OTHER
WISE,
R

513 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:16:02pm

re: #502 Dianna

I didn't mean radical for the sake of being radical. Islam today is more radical than anything the US has ever experienced. The French Revolution was radical in how many heads were rolled, and how it turned France's political system upside down. Calvinism was religiously radical given the status quo. But those developments all represented a push in the same direction. What was the outcome of the French Revolution? Napoleon?

The most radical thing about the US was its own creation! When the Declaration of Independence was first spread in Europe, it met scorn and ridicule, because the arguments of natural law and inalienable rights under which it was framed, seemed naive or simply stupid to the positivist might-makes-right European establishment.

John Locke was British, but Britian didn't adopt the libertarian state he suggested. America did, with a few augmentations. That's what was so qualitatively radical, the transition from collectivist supremacist rule by king/queens over a racially pure collective, to a robust political formation based on ideology.

From then on, the US was smart to be prudent of further radical reforms. The Leftits are today's radicals, wanting to "reform" (read: overhaul) this time tested system, and the conservatives are right to conserve, to enshrine, to cherish our way of life, as long as they understand that the essence of America, the greatest thing worth conserving, is its Liberalism.

Liberalism meaning libertarianism, not of the wacky quasi-anarchist Ron Paul type, but freedom, liberty, individual rights. The most radical political ideals the world has ever seen

514 Yashmak  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:16:44pm

Having myself had (a year or two ago) the displeasure of being bashed in the comments section by Dymphna simply for disagreeing with her opinion, I can sympathize with those who she has alienated. I haven't visited GOV in months for that very reason.

She makes much of assumptions made by Charles, Dr. Sanity, and others. . .but fails to recognize that many of her own positions are based on assumptions as well.

515 Highrise  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:18:46pm
These were just some of the speakers at the conference, all happy to be there. I won’t tell you what word Bat Y’eor used to describe what Charles Johnson has done — only because I don’t have her permission. Let’s just say it’s a body part and leave it at that. And if a 75 year old petite little woman who happens to be the world’s expert on Eurabia thinks this of Charles, then might it be a more accurate appraisal than yours?

Classy dymphna..classy. How can you even be believed when you have lied a lot in your emails to Dr. Sanity?

Good job Dr. Sanity for standing up to this type of stuff. If one thing I've learned here at LGF is the more a light is shined on what is going on, reasonable thinking people see through it. Those who like the darkness, stay there regardless of what light is offered.

This comment was kinda funny:

I did nothing of a deliberate or malicious nature that could possibly be construed as "attacking" you--if anything, your exaggerated emotional response to the entire affair only gives more credence to my judgement of your emotional state.

You, on the other hand, have crossed a line with your threats of blackmail and "exposure", simply because I don't happen to agree with you on this one issue

Yes it's rather interesting to see those paranoid schizophrenic types pop off and go beyond reason. These types are very obvious..and those that support them either have no clue or are having the same problem themselves.

516 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:21:20pm

re: #508 konservo

You have defended euro-trolls who argue that LGF needs to take a more 'nuanced' look at the situation which has facilitated groups like VB gaining power. Have you not?

I have absolutely defended them against the charges that they are individually 'fascists' (if we are thinking about the same posters - just to be sure, I'm referring to buzzroid and bottehond). I have outlined my arguments about their stance all along this thread and many others and about how it is fear, not ideology that is driving them. They are NOT fascists - they are terrified.

517 Former Belgian  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:24:02pm

re: #396 gman


I am not an expert on the Walloons, but is she saying they are a non- industrious and non- creative people? What a bunch of bullshit!

Basically, much of Wallonia is Belgium's "rust belt". The First Industrial Revolution in Belgium took place in Wallonia because of an accident of geology --- coal deposits not far below the surface. So that's were Belgium's steel mills were.

Early industrialization affected Wallonia culturally to some degree --- notably Wallonia has always been much more secular than Flanders.

By contrast, Flanders was much more agrarian until post-WW II, although there has always been a very active textile industry in the Western region (going back to medieval weaver's guilds). And the area around Antwerp (always one of Europe's gateways by water) was quite industrialized.

Wallonia got hit hard by the same hammer that hit the Rust Belt cities in the USA. Without Belgium's elaborate nanny state, there might on the one hand have been more damage, or a greater incentive to "reinvent themselves". As it is now, there are cities in Wallonia with an appallingly large percentage of people on the dole, and little incentive to get themselves jobs as the dole plus "fringe benefits" (council housing, reductions on this, that, and the other) may easily add up to more than salary at an entry-level job.

Flemish industry, to some degree, is not as obsolete because it started later, and/or it developed immediately in a way that could cope with a globalized economy. For example, the textile industry now only works at the top segment of the market --- as in none of the other segments competition against low-wage countries is possible. (I remember textile factories being outsourced to North Africa as far back as the 1970s.)

One other thing: the many international companies that make their headquarters in Belgium. (This phenomenon was intensified by the EU, but is older than that, for geographic reasons.) Like the French, the Walloons --- until recently --- lived in a linguistic fool's paradise where French was the only language that mattered. By contrast, it is not uncommon for Flemish people (like the Dutch) to speak three or four languages (Dutch, French, English, the fourth being German) at some level of fluency. As a result, the non-expat staff at international companies tends to be disproportionately Flemish.

Whether the Walloons have "less initiative" or are "less creative" than the Flemish is not clear to me. By American or Israeli standards, both societies are exceedingly risk-averse (not to mention smugly and pettily materialistic), exacerbated perhaps by the fact that people who cannot stand these traits tend to emigrate. (Proportionally speaking, Belgian academia has one of the largest "diasporas" in the world --- many promising young scientists simply look for postings in the USA, Switzerland,... and stay there. This is true of Flemings and Walloons alike, except perhaps that Flemings are somewhat more likely to move to English-speaking countries because there is less of a language barrier.)

518 Dianna  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:24:51pm

re: #513 medaura18586

You make your argument with enthusiasm, certainly.

I have, unfortunately, a new stack of work falling on my desk, so I'll have to leave it for now. However, I will be around Sunday (Saturday is housekeeping day), and if you are as well, I would enjoy continuing this discussion.

519 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:25:42pm

re: #513 medaura18586

Here is something you might be interested in.

A genealogy of anti-Americanism

This article is a precis of his book "Reconstructing America: The Symbol of America in Modern Thought".

Great reading.

520 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:28:56pm

gotta run an errand

bbl

521 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:29:16pm

re: #512 Render

hmmm... No Talibans? Maybe they had a different name, but it was the same radicals, they certainly existed, and the CIA did train them against the USSR. You can create/embolden many long-term enemies for the sake of short-term expediency.

Although there are many arguments I respect, in favor of their employment. However, I CAN sympathize to a degree with frustrated Afgans who might blame the US for ever bringing those animals into power. Ultimately, however, it is the Afgani nation itself that is responsible for its sovereignty. It is sad to see fearless radicals ready to die for their filthy degenerate delusions, but very few normal men and women willing to stand up to tyranny in the Middle East, to take control of their countries which are going to shit. So I only sympathize with such Afgans up to a point.

522 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:31:23pm

re: #518 Dianna

I can certainly make an appearance Sunday! talk to you then, it's been great posting so far. Remember I have watched you guys' discussions with my fingers tied for 2 years now!

523 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:31:45pm

re: #516 wahabicorridor

Fascist can be scared too, you know.

Here's buzzdroid on alliances with fascists (make sure to read my original comment).

Whenever you feel ready to answer my question about how the EU pertains to Charles' criticism of VB, please feel free to do so.

524 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:37:04pm

re: #519 wahabicorridor

Thanks for the link

I read some of it... I will read the rest later when I am more focused. It seems like a lot of those rationalizations for anti-Americanism stem from communist principles. That explains a lot.

525 gman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:38:32pm

re: #517 Former Belgian

re: #396 gman


I am not an expert on the Walloons, but is she saying they are a non- industrious and non- creative people? What a bunch of bullshit!

Basically, much of Wallonia is Belgium's "rust belt". The First Industrial Revolution in Belgium took place in Wallonia because of an accident of geology --- coal deposits not far below the surface. So that's were Belgium's steel mills were.

Early industrialization affected Wallonia culturally to some degree --- notably Wallonia has always been much more secular than Flanders.

By contrast, Flanders was much more agrarian until post-WW II, although there has always been a very active textile industry in the Western region (going back to medieval weaver's guilds). And the area around Antwerp (always one of Europe's gateways by water) was quite industrialized.

Wallonia got hit hard by the same hammer that hit the Rust Belt cities in the USA. Without Belgium's elaborate nanny state, there might on the one hand have been more damage, or a greater incentive to "reinvent themselves". As it is now, there are cities in Wallonia with an appallingly large percentage of people on the dole, and little incentive to get themselves jobs as the dole plus "fringe benefits" (council housing, reductions on this, that, and the other) may easily add up to more than salary at an entry-level job.

Flemish industry, to some degree, is not as obsolete because it started later, and/or it developed immediately in a way that could cope with a globalized economy. For example, the textile industry now only works at the top segment of the market --- as in none of the other segments competition against low-wage countries is possible. (I remember textile factories being outsourced to North Africa as far back as the 1970s.)

One other thing: the many international companies that make their headquarters in Belgium. (This phenomenon was intensified by the EU, but is older than that, for geographic reasons.) Like the French, the Walloons --- until recently --- lived in a linguistic fool's paradise where French was the only language that mattered. By contrast, it is not uncommon for Flemish people (like the Dutch) to speak three or four languages (Dutch, French, English, the fourth being German) at some level of fluency. As a result, the non-expat staff at international companies tends to be disproportionately Flemish.

Whether the Walloons have "less initiative" or are "less creative" than the Flemish is not clear to me. By American or Israeli standards, both societies are exceedingly risk-averse (not to mention smugly and pettily materialistic), exacerbated perhaps by the fact that people who cannot stand these traits tend to emigrate. (Proportionally speaking, Belgian academia has one of the largest "diasporas" in the world --- many promising young scientists simply look for postings in the USA, Switzerland,... and stay there. This is true of Flemings and Walloons alike, except perhaps that Flemings are somewhat more likely to move to English-speaking countries because there is less of a language barrier.)


Thanks for the information. I thought it was crude of Dymphna to suggestively stereotype the Walloons. In every society there are good apples and bad apples.

526 zuckerlilly  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:38:37pm

re: #355 TalkinKamel


And

why can't they support themselves, if they're supposedly so popular, and speaking for so many disenfranchised whites? Why can't they cough up their own funding?

Although they win at the ballot they have only less more than 10,000 party members.

527 Pastorius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:41:12pm

#507 Joesphine,

I agree with you. There is no reason to bring skin color into this.

By the way, you ought to see some of the rows I've gotten into with the BNP over at IBA. I'm really good at getting those guys stirred up. Once they are angry the truth comes out.

Who needs waterboarding?

528 zuckerlilly  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:49:44pm

re: #504 Dianna

re: #498 zuckerlilly

Are we now indulging in attainder of the blood?!

Do you have a problem with facts?

529 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 1:53:35pm

re: #523 konservo

re: #516 wahabicorridor

Fascist can be scared too, you know.

Here's buzzdroid on alliances with fascists (make sure to read my original comment).

Whenever you feel ready to answer my question about how the EU pertains to Charles' criticism of VB, please feel free to do so.

I'm back - I remember the thread - can you give me some idea of where to look for your original comment? The thread is almost 700 posts.............

530 Josephine  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 2:03:09pm

re: #527 Pastorius

LOL. I will have to check out the archives at IBA. I've only just started to read it.

When they talk about ethnic nationalism, I wonder to which country my daughter should have the "right of return": England, Ireland, Scotland, France, Germany or Switzerland? And which of her ancestors' religions should claim my atheist child: several branches of Protestantism, Catholicism, Judaism?

It's so ridiculous.

A while ago, I was standing in a line-up at the bank and chatted with the woman next to me. She said she had applied to work in a bank in Germany during the Nazi regime and had to get documents from the church proving that her parents and grandparents were 1) German and 2) not Jewish. It wasn't that long ago.

531 Render  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 2:07:04pm

re: #521 medaura18586

Nope, no Taliban in the 1980's.

The people that the CIA and private groups trained and armed, became, for the most part, the Northern Alliance, and consisted of various clan militias and private warlord groups.

Osama Bin Ladens little group of foreign Mujahadin in Afghanistan absolutely refused any US support or contact.

The Taliban were created much later by Pakistani intelligence, and fought only against the Northern Alliance.

The day before 9/11/01, the Taliban/al Qaeda assassinated the leader of the Northern Alliance.

REAL
HISTORY,
R

532 Pastorius  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 2:11:57pm

#530 Josephine,

No, it wasn't that long ago. And, from the looks of things it would seem many in Europe are more than willing to go back in history.

533 Render  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 2:23:55pm

re: #531 Render

Self-correction, the assassination took place several days prior to 9/11.

R

534 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 2:29:26pm

re: #533 Render

re: #531 Render

Self-correction, the assassination took place several days prior to 9/11.

R

September 9, 2001, to be exact. Just two days prior, and the report of it was on September 10, 2001, in most newspapers.

535 Yank in the EU  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 2:29:37pm

Interesting thread, though I don't have time at the moment to discuss my views, as someone living in Flanders.

However, one point of factual concern: about the movement for Flemish independence, it would be a mistake to assume that it is a radical position or is limited to the VB. I've had friends or acquaintances in Flanders on the center-right and simply in the political center who refuse to associate with the VB, given their recent history (e.g., things like the VP of the party denying the Holocaust in 2001, their not-so-secret white nationalist ideology, historical sympathy for the Flemish Nazi collaborators, or their willingness to make alliances with neo-Nazis such as the NPD or other more flagrant white nationalists such as the BNP), and yet view separating Flanders from the francophone Walloons as a matter of civil right and practical necessity. There are a variety of compelling reasons for this and their hope is that the VB does not entirely taint this cause. In short, the point is that separating from Belgium for the Flemings is not an extremist or per se ethnic nationalist position. Many of these people rightly reject nationalism that asserts a 'racial' or a homogeneous ethnic identity, but they rather envision a state that is self-determined by the Flemish people, the Flemish culture, and that will probably lean toward a more classically liberal and socially conservative stance on various issues including immigration.

536 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 2:29:59pm

re: #523 konservo

re: #516 wahabicorridor

Fascist can be scared too, you know.

Here's buzzdroid on alliances with fascists (make sure to read my original comment).

Whenever you feel ready to answer my question about how the EU pertains to Charles' criticism of VB, please feel free to do so.

konservo, this is the first post of yours I can find on that thread (#352)

re: #338 bottehond

To those who want to turn their backs on Europe...

The reason that this is even being discussed is because people are not turning their backs on Europe. On the contrary, the political situation in Europe is being given much needed attention, however, folks at the bj/GoV/fj etc. seem to want people to turn a blind eye.

Read my response to buzzroid's post where he states:

I

say this as a Libertarian European, who does not support Vlaams Belang - but i sure as hell am angry as hell that it's gotten to this. LGF should be angry at the people that allowed VB to develop in the first place - dig deeper folks. VB is a reaction against something.


buzzroid is not the first person living in Europe to make the very clear case that resentment against the EU is ADDING to support of the parties such as VB. There's a difference between making excuses for a bad thing and giving reasons for the bad thing happening.

I refer back to my #496 this thread:

You stated in #467

However, I fail to see why you think this is sufficient for an LGF endorsement.

I never made a case for any such endorsement. EVER. I expect a retraction of what, right about now, I'm about to construe a flat-out lie.

I'm still waiting for the retraction. Oh - and Fascist can be scared too, you know. is not an argument for anything.

537 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 2:37:23pm

off to dinner, bbl

hi ya Yank!

538 gman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 2:37:57pm

re: #530 Josephine

re: #527 Pastorius

LOL. I will have to check out the archives at IBA. I've only just started to read it.

When they talk about ethnic nationalism, I wonder to which country my daughter should have the "right of return": England, Ireland, Scotland, France, Germany or Switzerland? And which of her ancestors' religions should claim my atheist child: several branches of Protestantism, Catholicism, Judaism?

It's so ridiculous.

A while ago, I was standing in a line-up at the bank and chatted with the woman next to me. She said she had applied to work in a bank in Germany during the Nazi regime and had to get documents from the church proving that her parents and grandparents were 1) German and 2) not Jewish. It wasn't that long ago.

If you even had Jewish grandparents, you could be labeled a Jew in Nazi Germany. Look up "Nuremberg Laws" at Wikipedia. Also, read the book A Moral Reckoning by Daniel Goldhagen to find out how churches helped the Nazis with geneaology records.

539 Yank in the EU  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 2:40:18pm

re: #537 wahabicorridor

Heya wahabi, hope you are keeping well!

540 Josephine  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 2:49:33pm

re: #532 Pastorius

Agreed.

I would like to add something to one of my previous comments.

According to some BNP supporters, I qualify as fully British, although my great-grandparents left England 100 years ago, another set of great-grandparents left Scotland 90 years ago, and my Irish ancestors came to Canada closer to 200 years ago.

However, according to these BNP supporters, my cousins, whose families stayed in England all this time, do not qualify as British solely because they are Jewish.

541 Josephine  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 2:58:48pm

re: #538 gman

"If you even had Jewish grandparents, you could be labeled a Jew in Nazi Germany. Look up "Nuremberg Laws" at Wikipedia. Also, read the book A Moral Reckoning by Daniel Goldhagen to find out how churches helped the Nazis with geneaology records."

Yes, I remember reading about the Nuremberg Laws.

Thank you for the book recommendation; I haven't read that one.

542 abc123  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 3:00:47pm

All sides need to stop. All sides need to shut up, take a few days off.

There are no nazi's with power in America or in EUnuchstan. Not even close.

The big power block is left and they have enormous power. There should not be a public, stupid, so called problem, between Charles, GV and Sanity.

The current pissing fight worries me FAR MORE than the Israeli defeat last year in Lebanon.

Who would prefer to split the baby so each has an equal part?

Very, very bothered......

543 kuchuklambat  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 3:17:53pm

re: #507 Josephine

Vicktorya Stone left the 910 Group /CVF on her own volition some months ago.
The Group is a rather loose piece of networking infrastructure for counterjihad-minded individuals and organizations to find each other, exchange experience and, sometimes, coordinate actions.
No single person or even a committee exercises "leadership" over the group.
Some groups incubated there and moved off, some regional chapters (e.g NY, Great Britain) are active but hardly fall under any concerted policy.
Some members focus on reaching out and networking with kindred groups -- UAC, MinuteMen, College Republicans, etc etc.
Hence --
re: #442 TalkinKamel
contradictory? you mean self-contradictory? I am sure of it -- as you will find in most "large-umbrella" type organizations. As long as we don't contradict the goal of defeating jihad.
/yes i am affiliated with the Group, and no, I had nothing to do with nor had any prior knowledge of the counterjihad Brussels

/kuffirs of the world, unite!

544 Former Belgian  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 3:32:16pm

re: #538 gman

If you even had Jewish grandparents, you could be labeled a Jew in Nazi Germany. Look up "Nuremberg Laws" at Wikipedia. Also, read the book A Moral Reckoning by Daniel Goldhagen to find out how churches helped the Nazis with geneaology records.

Correction: you would be called a "Mischling" (half-caste), not a Jew. See:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

A simple "lookup table":
3 or 4 Jewish grandparents: Jewish
2 Jewish grandparents, and practicing the Jewish religion or married to a Jew: Jewish
2 Jewish grandparents, other: 1st degree Mischling
1 Jewish grandparent: 2nd degree Mischling
Jewish ancestry further back: "Aryan".

The Mischlinge were in some sort of legal limbo that reflected itself in some truly bizarre situations (e.g., w.r.t. conscription).

Lesser degrees of Jewish blood were relevant for those seeking to join the Nazi party, and especially those seeking to join the SS. (Officer candidates had to furnish proof of no identifiable Jewish ancestor since 1750.)

People could apply to have their status upgraded from 1st to 2nd degree, and from 2nd degree to Aryan. Such applications were personally reviewed by the Fuehrer (y"sh).

The State of Israel grants accelerated citizenship (under the "Law of Return") to anyone who would have qualified as a Jew or Mischling under the Nuerenberg/Nuremberg Laws.

545 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 3:39:56pm

re: #529 wahabicorridor

re: #523 konservo
I'm back - I remember the thread - can you give me some idea of where to look for your original comment? The thread is almost 700 posts.............

It is, of course, linked to in buzzdroid's reply. As are all comments that are 'repied' to (as opposed to 'quoted')... that's what the 'repy' feature does.

546 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 3:44:30pm

re: #536 wahabicorridor

buzzroid is not the first person living in Europe to make the very clear case that resentment against the EU is ADDING to support of the parties such as VB. There's a difference between making excuses for a bad thing and giving reasons for the bad thing happening.

No kidding.

And what exactly do you think buzzroid was doing?

Hint: He agreed with the premise that we need to side with fascists to defeat the Communists.

Hint 2: He was making excuses for siding with fascists.

547 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 4:04:14pm

re: #546 konservo

Hint: He agreed with the premise that we need to side with fascists to defeat the Communists.

Hint 2: He was making excuses for siding with fascists.

Then you and I are going to have to agree to disagree on this, because I certainly did not take that reading from it.

I return to my #496 this thread

You stated in #467

However, I fail to see why you think this is sufficient for an LGF endorsement.

I never made a case for any such endorsement. EVER. I expect a retraction of what, right about now, I'm about to construe a flat-out lie.

I say again, I never made a case for any such endorsement, nor would I. Everything I have written on the subject is - including numerous posts on this thread - state the justification for the opposite.

Now retract the slur, sir, or I shall know you as a liar.

548 Fencesitter  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 4:17:40pm

A fanatic is someone who will not change his opinion or the topic.

Fanatics are not necessarily bad, just annoying at parties and social events. But they can be damn useful in foxholes.

GoV may or may not qualify on these counts, but to argue the point would be splitting hairs.

If Dr. Sanity raises this issue again, he qualifies as a fanatic.

Charles has not chang.... oh never mind.

I feel a Rodney King moment here - "Can't we all get along?"

Charles, perhaps you should issue a final declarative statement that you consider the VB to be "on probation" and will periodically monitor their activities (not their past) for signs of agreeable behavior. Then drop it.

Multiple blog fanatics arguing minutiae emboldens the Islamists and annoys the unwashed masses, who will tune out the entire conversation. Right or wrong, this issue is bad. Let it pass.

549 Josephine  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 4:26:27pm

re: #543 kuchuklambat

Okay, thanks.

550 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 4:28:35pm

#543 Kuchuklamba

Of course I meant self-contradictory---also things that didn't add up, and/or didn't make a whole lot of sense and just a sort of bad feeling in general. Umbrella group or not, I just didn't like it. I used to get e-mailed news, and updates from them, but that's stopped and, if they were to start it up again, I'd ask to be taken off their list. As I told Ffhilliard, this is one of those groups I have checked out, and I've decided they're not worth supporting.

551 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 4:34:02pm

re: #547 wahabicorridor

I'll restate the remark thusly:

When you, wahabicorridor, bring up the EU to defend Euro-trolls who support fascism, you aren't on point. In fact, you use some of the same arguments against the EU that the fascist enthusiasts use to endorse fascism.

Oh, here's what your boy 'buzzdroid' said about making alliances with groups like VB to defeat the EU, starting with a comment I made (for context):

#571 konservo 11/18/2007 7:31:45 pm

re: #567 buzzdroid
remember - the EU is very pro-islam and has passed motions to "condemn" the term "islamic terrorist". Gordon Brown, for example, has told his ministers to no longer use the term "muslim terrorist".


That does it!
We must support the neo-Nazis to defeat these neo-Stalinists!~
/

And buzzdroid's reply:

#583 buzzdroid 11/18/07 7:43:12

re: #571 konservo

thats more or less what we did (in reverse) in WW2. war is ugly and sometimes we need to make friends with people we dont like.

like Saudi Arabia. or Kuwait. both utter fascist dictatorships.

like you , i would rather it wasnt that way. but the world isnt perfect.
i'm kind of hoping we'll sort out Saudi someday.

Let's be clear about what he said about joining with neo-Nazis to defeat neo-Stalinists:

thats more or less what we did (in reverse) in WW2. war is ugly and sometimes we need to make friends with people we dont like.

You disagreed with my assertion that this is an excuse for an alliance with fascists.

I shall know you, madame, as either a liar, an apologist, someone who is too lazy to follow links, or all of the above.

Good day.

552 TalkinKamel  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 4:36:02pm

#548 fencesitter

Sadly, no, there are times we really can't "All just get along", as Rodney King himself has proved, by his ongoing troubles with the law after the L.A. riots.

As for Charles monitoring VB----what do you think he has been doing, these past several weeks? He's had all sorts of posts about what they've been doing, trips to honor ex-Nazis, the VB youth magazine----he's provided a wealth of information! Please check out his earlier posts on this subject. And if he announces he's going to be monitoring them periodically for agreeable behavior----what is this going to accomplish? They can always clean up their act while the spotlight's on them. The value of what Charles revealed was that he caught them pretty much with their pants down, before they could put a spin on their actions.

And why is this subject a bad one, and who are all the "unwashed masses" Charles is supposedly alienating?

553 medaura18586  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 4:37:21pm

re: #531 Render

Well that's interesting! I'd love some sources/links so I can do some more reading on it myself. I suppose then it's a pretty widely held misconception that the Taliban were funded and trained by the CIA in the 1980s.

So I guess that's one less thing I have to feel rotten about! :)

554 hazzyday  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 4:55:51pm

re: #546 konservo

Who is there to side with then?

555 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 5:04:33pm

re: #551 konservo

Good day.

For me perhaps. Not so for you.

When you, wahabicorridor, bring up the EU to defend Euro-trolls who support fascism, you aren't on point. In fact, you use some of the same arguments against the EU that the fascist enthusiasts use to endorse fascism.

I did not "bring up the EU to defend Euro-trolls who support fascism,'.
Specifically I wrote:

I want to address this issue of VB, the breakup of Belgium, anti-jihadi, etc.

Much of this comes from anti-EU sentiment. The EU is seen, rightly in my opinion, has forcing immigration - especially Muslim immigration - down peoples' throats - and destroying the nation-state - which to many people is the vessel of their very culture.

So, the separation impulse, in my view, has a good deal of validity.

Noting THE FACT that resentment of EU immigration policies is driving people to racial supremacist power structures is a defense of nothing - except the dissolution of the EU, which I have long touted here and elsewhere as a totalitarian political construct, full stop.
----------------------

re: #567 buzzdroid
remember - the EU is very pro-islam and has passed motions to "condemn" the term "islamic terrorist". Gordon Brown, for example, has told his ministers to no longer use the term "muslim terrorist".

This is factually correct.
-----------------------

Let's be clear about what he said about joining with neo-Nazis to defeat neo-Stalinists:

thats more or less what we did (in reverse) in WW2. war is ugly and sometimes we need to make friends with people we dont like.
You disagreed with my assertion that this is an excuse for an alliance with fascists.

--------------------------
You cite buzzdroid's post #583, while ignoring the context it was made in in #503.

Again, from his #503

say this as a Libertarian European, who does not support Vlaams Belang - but i sure as hell am angry as hell that it's gotten to this. LGF should be angry at the people that allowed VB to develop in the first place - dig deeper folks. VB is a reaction against something.


------------------------

What you have done, konservo, is try to assert that the the EU has nothing to do with Charles' posts on VB, then accused me of using the EU as an excuse to support fascists - using as examples posters that are not fascists but clearly exhibit how the EU plays into driving support to fascist power structures. These are facts. They make me an apologist for nothing. And I note that in trying to defend your assertion that I have ever advanced LGF endorsement of aligning w/fascists, you cite other people's comments - when it is remarkably easy to do a search on my nic and find EVERY POST THAT I WROTE INCLUDING THIS THREAD on the subject disputes your slur.

As I said earlier: kiss my ass in Macy's window.

556 hazzyday  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 5:09:06pm

I still read Gov. I must admit though that this latest episode is disturbing. I think as long as the heat is on there can be more of them. I think dymphna feels threatened to an extreme and has let her fears get ahold of her in a way she can't let them go. Time for a blogging break.

Their site is littered with strawmen articles and comments in their attempt to battle back to re gain their standard. They complain we don't understand Europe but in reply present some idiotic reasoning. Any kid with a lighter can set them aflame.

If there was strength there they would lay out the items Charles asked to be addressed and respond to them one by one.

However at this late stage it is doubtful.

Fjordman's mistake was personalizing his argument and insisting people move to his view point.

As a small government person, I would love to see a separate Wales, Scotland, England, Flander, Walloon, no EU as I would also love to see less Federal Government in the US and more states rights.

As a kid I was fascinated by the Iron Cross and the Swastika and other emblems of the Third Reich and WWI. I had no conception of the holocaust til a decade late. Curse you Red Baron. However Nazi regalia didn't carry over into adulthood in any way shape or form. Concerns about genocide in Cambodia and totalitarianism in the US have.

557 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 5:10:47pm

re: #548 Fencesitter


Multiple blog fanatics arguing minutiae emboldens the Islamists and annoys the unwashed masses, who will tune out the entire conversation. Right or wrong, this issue is bad. Let it pass.

Well, as long as I'm already pissed off...

We aren't arguing minutiae. We're arguing fundamental right and wrong and there are no issues worth that argument except the 'bad ones' that make people really uncomfortable. And frankly, your snide reference to the 'unwashed masses' is demeaning and arrogant.

No, I won't let it pass. Unless it's into my crosshairs.

558 gman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 5:11:25pm
A simple "lookup table":
3 or 4 Jewish grandparents: Jewish
2 Jewish grandparents, and practicing the Jewish religion or married to a Jew: Jewish
2 Jewish grandparents, other: 1st degree Mischling
1 Jewish grandparent: 2nd degree Mischling
Jewish ancestry further back:"Aryan".

The Nazi recipe book for what makes a Jew. You can be a good Nazi if you have a pinch of this but not a tablespoon of that and so on. If you look back far enough in history, it turns out we're all mongrels. All of these ethno-maniacs need to go back to their history books.

559 ContraJihadi  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 5:34:46pm

re: #379 marwan's daughter

re: #328 Charles

Dymphna: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Baron Bodissey: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Pamela: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Now I think you have a good excuse to ban Dymphna and Bodissey, just like you did with Mr. F-bomb.

I don't know. Unless they become outrageously abusive and start volcanically spouting off all sorts of bad craziness , it might be better to keep their accounts active just so they can never truly say that they have been banned. Of course, the myriads of red dings might prove an embarrassment, but that's another story.

560 ContraJihadi  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 5:53:33pm

re: #439 BabbaZee

re: #437 Lucius Septimius

Mickey-Maoist Club

HA HA
excellent
I love that

Yes, that's a good one. Hadn't heard it before.

561 Pim's Ghost  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 6:29:43pm

I wasn't going to post here at the request of certain posters, but I figured, well, this is Baron & Dymphna after all and someone might find her email pseudo-threat to me interesting amusing completely insane:

As long as you plop into the comments on my blog -- the answer to your demand
is, no, I am *not* going to delink you.

There is a way out though: if you want to go through the trouble of creating
yet another sock puppet, one that links to some other false profile, then I
might consider it. But only as a favor, not as an obligation. IOW you would not
show up at GoV in one of your usual disguises. You'd need a new one.

So you decide which you want more: to comment here letting us know who you are
and thereby keeping your blog in place on our sidebar, or going through the
trouble of making up yet another identity and profile. You're an interesting
person and I think you could do a good job of fooling us with a new sock puppet.

Then you can comment to your heart's content, run back to home base and lob
attacks and we can still get the traffic...which, of course, drives up our
revenues.

Glad to see you again...
Dymphna

That was just the excerpt I posted at my blog. They knew I changed my Blogger name from "Pim's Ghost" to my actual name (well, nickname), Lex. Same account, listing the same blogs, I am hiding in plain sight. Yet she persisted with the mails until I finally sent her a reply filled with "the f bomb" and told her if she couldn't manage to @�% off then she could have her CVF lackey Christine do it.

I'm almost 100% sure that Dr. Sanity and myself are not alone in being the recipients of these weird emails. It's a real meltdown.

562 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 6:35:45pm

re: #555 wahabicorridor

wahabicorridor,

I guess I'm more of a cynic than you, but when I read a comment such as buzzdroid's, which begins with a disclaimer:

as a Libertarian European, who does not support Vlaams Belang -


I get suspiscious. But look at what buzzdroid goes on to say

LGF should be angry at the people that allowed VB to develop in the first place


Aren't VB's actions their own responsibility!
buzzdroid is not done, then he suggests that LGF needs to

dig deeper


If you ask me, buzzdroid's first comment was nothing but patronization.

As for his comment #583, it is clearly a reply to my comment #571. This is not even a matter of dispute since anyone can follow the link and see for his or herself.

Personally, I think that your heart is in the right place, wahabicorridor; I have read your comments here, at the Brussels Journal, and elsewhere.

I still think that you are missing the point when you bring up the EU on these threads, unlike the motives of the Euro-trolls, however, I don't believe you are intentionally trying to obfuscate the legitimate concerns that Charles and LGF has raised. I apologize if I offended you.

563 Highrise  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 6:53:45pm

re: #562 konservo

konservo, you weren't alone in how you viewed buzzdroid. I also had the same reservations as you and if I'm not mistaken, rereading that thread, a number of people did also.

564 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 7:09:17pm

re: #562 konservo

I still think that you are missing the point when you bring up the EU on these threads, unlike the motives of the Euro-trolls, however, I don't believe you are intentionally trying to obfuscate the legitimate concerns that Charles and LGF has raised. I apologize if I offended you.

That's a start. We shall, I hope, continue in other threads, without the assumption of bad intent. My nic is blue'd if you would like to continue the discussion in a civil manner that won't make everyone here dive under the nearest table and abuse Charles' bandwidth.

re: #563 Highrise

re: #562 konservo

konservo, you weren't alone in how you viewed buzzdroid. I also had the same reservations as you and if I'm not mistaken, rereading that thread, a number of people did also.

And you are proof positive why konservo is mistaken in his/her assertion that I am off point when pointing out the role of the EU in these threads. On that subject, I'm here to educate. Not to defend. To educate.

565 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 7:51:44pm

re: #564 wahabicorridor

I tried using the LGF mail, but it opened some Microsoft E-mail editor program that I didn't know I even had and don't use.

Anyway, I don't mean to say that there aren't any real problems with the EU, my point is that those problems (while they may a factor which fuels extremist groups like VB) can be handled in a variety of ways, but it's not our (America's) place to take the initiative. In other words,
1) I recognize that the EU has problems and
2) Groups like VB pander to those who are affected by the EU but
3) That is not relevant to the points on which VB is being criticized.

566 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 7:58:46pm

re: #563 Highrise

Yeah, I was definately getting that troll vibe from him/her. And you're right, I just reviewed the thread, others did too.

567 wahabicorridor  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:01:04pm

konservo:
alder6354 at yahoo dot com

not to worry. It's not my 'real' email.

568 konservo  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:29:45pm

re: #567 wahabicorridor

Got it, I just sent you an email. I'll check my inbox tomorrow, since it's getting kind of late.

569 Syrah  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:30:06pm

re: #494 lucius septimius

re: #485 gman

Absolutely -- state-funded media (dominated by left-socialists) puts out anti-American propaganda on a regular basis. Just part of the program.

Sounds like PBS to me.

570 gman  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 8:47:20pm

re: #569 Syrah

re: #494 lucius septimius

re: #485 gman

Absolutely -- state-funded media (dominated by left-socialists) puts out anti-American propaganda on a regular basis. Just part of the program.

Sounds like PBS to me.

PBS (Piles of Bull Shit)

571 Highrise  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:23:09pm

re: #564 wahabicorridor


And you are proof positive why konservo is mistaken in his/her assertion that I am off point when pointing out the role of the EU in these threads. On that subject, I'm here to educate. Not to defend. To educate.

I was discussing how a poster was perceived here, nothing about the EU. So I fail to see how I'm proof positive that konservo is mistaken any assertion. I'll let him speak for himself on that.

572 Highrise  Fri, Nov 30, 2007 9:24:38pm

re: #566 konservo

re: #563 Highrise

Yeah, I was definately getting that troll vibe from him/her. And you're right, I just reviewed the thread, others did too.


I'm still not convinced those two aren't but I know time will tell.

573 Fencesitter  Sat, Dec 1, 2007 6:50:59am

re: #557 wahabicorridor

re: #548 Fencesitter

Multiple blog fanatics arguing minutiae emboldens the Islamists and annoys the unwashed masses, who will tune out the entire conversation. Right or wrong, this issue is bad. Let it pass.
Well, as long as I'm already pissed off...

We aren't arguing minutiae. We're arguing fundamental right and wrong and there are no issues worth that argument except the 'bad ones' that make people really uncomfortable. And frankly, your snide reference to the 'unwashed masses' is demeaning and arrogant.

No, I won't let it pass. Unless it's into my crosshairs.

I guess that makes you a fanatic per my definition, which means you might be useful in my foxhole.

If you're in my foxhole and Dymphna approaches from the west and UBL from the east, which of the four of us do you shoot? Keep in mind that no matter what answer you give, someone will consider it wrong. That's the problem here.

"Unwashed masses" is Rush Limbaugh's phrase, I believe, and refers to those people that don't really pay attention to world events and "politics" (and certainly not to internecine conflicts such as this), while simultaneously enjoying the Blessings of Liberty. I meant nothing demeaning at all.

Regarding "fundamental right and wrong," I find it interesting that that attitude is so vilified by the "pro-choice" crowd. I don't know your position on the abortion issue, but it might be worth contemplating for awhile.

Finally, consider this. The way I see it, there are only 3 scenarios for Europe in this century: 1) domination by Islam, 2) a war that kills millions (winner TBD), or 3) Jesus returns. Do you, or anyone, see a 4th option? That makes this whole issue "minutiae" in that context.

574 TalkinKamel  Sat, Dec 1, 2007 8:35:36am

#574 Fencesitter

Well, I see a 4th option.

Europeans start having more children, and begin dismantling their welfare state, which has offered too much of a cosy haven for young, able-bodied would-be terrorists with too much time on their hands, and mad mullahs who've been able to preach jihad and hate for infidels while sucking up the infidels' dole. They support, and strengthen, their police and armies, support crack-downs and arrests for rioters instead of trying to cover them up. They kick out their corrupt politicians, who will do anything for Arab oil money, and put honest men in their place. They reclaim their old Christian, Western culture and start affirming it, instead of slinking around feeliing guilty about their colonial past. They stop supporting Eurabia and romanticizing groups such as the PLO and Hezbollah. They even---gasp, shudder, AIEEEE!---start supporting Israel and the USA!

Honest to G-d, I really am getting sick of the either/or arguments: "IT'S EITHER ISLAM, OR CRYPTO-NAZI NATIONALIST GROUPS! THERE'S NO OTHER WAY OUT!" There always is, sometimes people just don't want to see it. (For instance, I know it's going to be hard, and many Euros won't like it, but their welfare states have got to go. Doesn't matter if it's socialists or facists running them. And they have got to strengthen their families, and start having children, or there will be a 5th scenario: Europeans die out, so the jihadists---or the Chinese---or black Africans---or Americans end up getting all their real estate in the end, because there aren't any Europeans left to claim it.)

We're not in foxholes yet, so I'm really not interested in the question of who'd would you shoot, Osama or Dymphna? Speaking of foxholes, though, I would like to point out, yet again, Dymphna's reaction to Hirsi Ali; certainly Dymphna didn't like the idea of Hiris in her foxhole, even though she's definitely an ally; we aren't going to win the WoT if we reject potential allies such as black Christians, Hindus, Oriental Christians, Jews, athiests, etc. because they aren't white enough, European enough or we don't like their religious views. Fanatics aren't really usfeful, in foxholes or anywhere else. They have their own agendas to push, they don't make good allies. Alas, I think BV and BNP do fall into this category.

By the way, I've never heard Rush use the "Unwashed masses" phrase, and, even if he did, it's still elitist.

575 Salamantis  Sat, Dec 1, 2007 8:43:49am

It would depend upon whether or not you and Dymphna had completely morphed into racist goose-steppers, in which case I would pray for three bullets.

I can also see Europe limping along like Festus for a while...with periodic banlieu bonfires but otherwise the same or a similar dynamic...or wising up and learning from the US how to unite around principles rather than blood and soil; it all depends upon how Europe's population demography and political evolution proceeds in the future. I do know that if the indigenous Europeans reach their tipping point, the violence they will perpetrate will be brutal, sudden, and spread like wildfire - and the US will once again be stuck with cleaning up the mess.

Unfortunately, if a misguided Europe defensively embraces racist neofascism, rather than the principles of liberty, equality, and tolerance, in order to counter a burgeoning Islamofascism, that might mean that we'd have to go over there and kick violent, oppressive and intolerant ass, whoever wins.

576 ggt  Sat, Dec 1, 2007 9:05:02am

In light of the very long notes to Dr. Sanity from Dymphna, I have to agree with the podcast title: "family squabble."

My goodness, she is upset.

577 ggt  Sat, Dec 1, 2007 9:09:29am

"and Belgian psyops"

Is this the new revolving title?

There are too many jokes in this one. The first image I had included a borg/cyclops hybrid. . . .

578 Sharmuta  Sat, Dec 1, 2007 9:36:06am

re: #566 konservo

re: #563 Highrise

Yeah, I was definately getting that troll vibe from him/her. And you're right, I just reviewed the thread, others did too.

You have a fine weave on your BS filter, and I don't see cynicism on the internet as a bad thing. These euro-trolls are using nuanced arguments that you are not alone in seeing. Personally- I don't care what their motivations are- in the end- they are making excuses for fascists.

579 Fencesitter  Sat, Dec 1, 2007 11:08:36am

re: #574 TalkinKamel

#574 Fencesitter

Honest to G-d, I really am getting sick of the either/or arguments: "IT'S EITHER ISLAM, OR CRYPTO-NAZI NATIONALIST GROUPS! THERE'S NO OTHER WAY OUT!"

That's not what I said. Not at all.

As to your 4th option, that would be fabulous. I just don't think it's going to happen. I really, really, really hope that I am wrong and your option 4 comes to pass, however.

Your option 5 is my option 1.

I'm sorry if you felt the "unwashed" phrase was elitist. I did not mean it that way, but rather meant it in the sense that, to win this war, we will need (and welcome) them.

Do you realize your political agenda, as outlined in your post, is almost verbatim from VB?

580 TalkinKamel  Sat, Dec 1, 2007 11:54:39am

#579 fencesitter

No, I didn't and don't realize that my political agenda is verbatim from VB, because:

A. It isn't.

B. I suspect VB, in actuality, would disagree with a great deal of my politics, and. . .

C. That's BS.

Why don't you think opition 4 is going to happen and, instead of just hoping it's going to happen, why don't you try actively striving for it? Honest to G-d, many of the VB supporters who post here sound as if eager to support the more extreme, crypto-Nazi groups; oh yeah, they make noises about how they really, really hope for Democracy, and peaceful resolutions, but democracy, rule of law and actually re-structuring their current societies just won't do any good, it's just not gonna happen, oh, we un-nuanced Americans just don't understand, only VB can help Europe at this point! (Despite the fact it really hasn't accomplished much to date.)

They sound a bit too eager to embrace extreme solutions, and facist parties---kinda like they're just reaching for excuse to fall back into the old "Blood and Soil" outlook.

The first scenario you mention is "Domination by Islam", not "Europeans support families, and start having more children."

581 TalkinKamel  Sat, Dec 1, 2007 11:56:35am

#578 Sharmuta

As I point out in my above post to fencesitter, I'm really getting the impression that, basically, they're just making excuses for their descent back into WWII "Blood and Soil", eugenics-as-politics thinking.

It didn't work in WWII, and it's not going to work now.

582 Sharmuta  Sat, Dec 1, 2007 12:31:29pm

re: #581 TalkinKamel

They are making excuses. They don't really veer off the list much. They might try a new spin, but once you've unwound said spin, it still comes back to the list. A & D are particularly popular, although I have seen an E from someone.

583 TalkinKamel  Sat, Dec 1, 2007 5:40:40pm

#582 Sharmuta

I think you're right.

584 Fearless Fred  Sun, Dec 2, 2007 7:23:33am
"So for you to say he has the “principled” position is not only wrong, it’s damaging to your own credibility. Given his drastic changes in behavior, I think he’s quite fragile."

"If you will agree to delete the podcast and put out a one line comment of apology, I’m willing to drop the whole thing. If not, I can only presume you are operating by MSM standards and I will address that publicly, using the cyberjournalism code of ethics to demonstrate my points."

That sounds desperate and fragile.


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