LGF

more options

  

Advertisement

  

Link address:
Link title:
Description: 
Remaining:

Hitchens: To Hell With the Archbishop of Canterbury

Mon, Feb 11, 2008 at 3:36:52 pm PST

Christopher Hitchens has a good piece on the Archbishop’s sharia idiocy: The archbishop of Canterbury’s dangerous embrace of sharia.

Picture the life of a young Urdu-speaking woman brought to Yorkshire from Pakistan to marry a man—quite possibly a close cousin—whom she has never met. He takes her dowry, beats her, and abuses the children he forces her to bear. She is not allowed to leave the house unless in the company of a male relative and unless she is submissively covered from head to toe. Suppose that she is able to contact one of the few support groups that now exist for the many women in Britain who share her plight. What she ought to be able to say is, “I need the police, and I need the law to be enforced.” But what she will often be told is, “Your problem is better handled within the community.” And those words, almost a death sentence, have now been endorsed and underwritten—and even advocated—by the country’s official spiritual authority.

You might argue that I am describing an extreme case (though, alas, now not an uncommon one), but it is the principle of equality before the law that really counts. And just look at how casually this sheep-faced English cleric throws away the work of centuries of civilization:

[A]n approach to law which simply said “there’s one law for everybody and that’s all there is to be said, and anything else that commands your loyalty or allegiance is completely irrelevant in the processes of the courts”—I think that’s a bit of a danger.
In the midst of this dismal verbiage and euphemism, the plain statement—“There’s one law for everybody and that’s all there is to be said”—still stands out like a diamond in a dunghill. It stands out precisely because it is said simply, and because its essential grandeur is intelligible to everybody.

194 comments

  • Comments are open and unmoderated, and do not necessarily reflect the views of Little Green Footballs.
  • Obscene, abusive, silly, or annoying remarks may be deleted, but the fact that particular comments remain on the site in no way constitutes an endorsement of their views by Little Green Footballs.
  • Posts that contain phone numbers, street addresses, email addresses or other personal information will also be deleted, as will posts that consist only of a variation on the word, "First!"
  • Comments that advocate violence will be cause for immediate banning with no appeal.
  • REMEMBER: posting comments at LGF is a privilege, not a right. Abuse that privilege, and your account will be blocked.

Hide comments | Jump to bottom

1 Carridine  2/11/08 3:37:55 pm reply quote

And THIS is why Hitchens is my FAVORITE leftist! :D

2 WrathofG-d  2/11/08 3:38:09 pm reply quote

Who are we to judge?

Shouldn't these people have the choice to live under Sharia?

;)

3 Ojoe  2/11/08 3:40:38 pm reply quote

You might write to the Queen and ask her to dismiss her Bishop. I believe she could, after all one of her titles is "Defender of the Faith".


The Royal Family's official website with contact information.

4 Carridine  2/11/08 3:40:46 pm reply quote

re:

5 RadicalRon  2/11/08 3:41:12 pm reply quote

A debate between Hitchens and the archbishop would be a treat.

6 saberry0530  2/11/08 3:41:38 pm reply quote

re: #1 Carridine

And THIS is why Hitchens is my FAVORITE leftist! :D

Think that Hitchens is more Hitchens than a lefty.

7 Killgore Trout  2/11/08 3:41:55 pm reply quote

Despite popular belief I'm not the biggest Hitch fan but he nails this one.

8 Ma Sands  2/11/08 3:42:48 pm reply quote
“There’s one law for everybody and that’s all there is to be said”


The utter antidote to "racism". :)

9 Fasternu426  2/11/08 3:43:18 pm reply quote

The crocodile will eat him last....

10 Sifty  2/11/08 3:44:18 pm reply quote

Mr. Archbishop, your pineapple is waiting.

11 Ojoe  2/11/08 3:45:22 pm reply quote

re:

12 WrathofG-d  2/11/08 3:45:48 pm reply quote

I never understood a religious figure that advocated the following of another religion.

If the believes the Jesus' was is the correct one....wouldn't every other way be a sin?

What is it with you Jesus followers? 1st the Pope, then this guy?

13 DesertSage  2/11/08 3:47:27 pm reply quote

God loves Christopher Hitchens and Killgore Trout!

14 doppelganglander  2/11/08 3:47:33 pm reply quote
There is one law for everybody.

Yes, yes, and yes.

16 WrathofG-d  2/11/08 3:48:31 pm reply quote

re: #12 WrathofG-d

I never understood a religious figure that advocated the following of another religion.

If the believes the Jesus' was is the correct one....wouldn't every other way be a sin?

What is it with you Jesus followers? 1st the Pope, then this guy?

Ok that came off a bit harsher then I meant it. It was supposed to be snark, but it sort of came off rude...sorry about that.

17 EC Marm  2/11/08 3:48:31 pm reply quote

When I was young I couldn't understand my ancestors tossin' the tea in the harbor thing. Or why the French were on our side. It takes more than a few years to figure it out.

18 Sifty  2/11/08 3:48:49 pm reply quote

re:

19 Ojoe  2/11/08 3:49:11 pm reply quote

re:

20 mbruce  2/11/08 3:49:52 pm reply quote

Yup, with sharia in place, honor killings, attacking police and firemen, bombing things, all covered and okeedokee by the foul archbish.
Nail him Hitch.
Oh, maybe a bad way of putting it......

21 yesandno  2/11/08 3:50:07 pm reply quote

You cannot let others prevail and then fail to grasp you are no longer in charge.


The law is the law is the law.

22 David IV of Georgia  2/11/08 3:50:48 pm reply quote

Silly Rowan gave up before the fight started. Hope, man person, hope. Despair is a sin.

As the angel said to St. Polycarp as he was being led to execution, " Ανδριζ&#959&upsil on;" "Be a man."

23 zombie  2/11/08 3:51:19 pm reply quote

re: #5 RadicalRon

A debate between Hitchens and the archbishop would be a treat.

No, it would be a massacre.

Which is better than a treat!

24 Killgore Trout  2/11/08 3:51:42 pm reply quote

re:

25 song_and_dance_man[deleted]  2/11/08 3:52:20 pm
26 Ma Sands  2/11/08 3:52:50 pm reply quote

re:

27 Fenway_Nation  2/11/08 3:52:58 pm reply quote

I'm not sure if this has come up before, but has anyone noticed the divergent paths Pope Benedict and the Archbishop of Canterbury have taken vis a vis sharia and militant Islam?

28 mama winger  2/11/08 3:53:06 pm reply quote

In related news, Laity Leaps off the Episcopal Titanic

another gospel .....

29 snowcrash  2/11/08 3:53:09 pm reply quote

Always impressed with his writing skills whatever the topic.

30 Ojoe  2/11/08 3:53:18 pm reply quote

re:

31 Dar ul Harb  2/11/08 3:53:25 pm reply quote
re: #5 RadicalRon

A debate between Hitchens and the archbishop would be a treat.

No, it would be a massacre.

Which is better than a treat!

Hitchens would delight in matching wits with an unarmed cleric.

32 Jack Reacher  2/11/08 3:53:57 pm reply quote
...there’s one law for everybody and that’s all there is to be said...I think that’s a bit of a danger.


I still can't quite wrap my mind around why he thinks applying the law equally to everyone is "a danger."
Truly, some of the animals are more equal than others.

33 Ojoe  2/11/08 3:53:58 pm reply quote

re:

34 vapig  2/11/08 3:54:44 pm reply quote

Most of the time this fellow annoys me - but twice in the last couple of weeks he and I are in complete agreement.

Has something frozen over?

35 J.S.  2/11/08 3:54:59 pm reply quote

I don't bother with this liar and antisemite...And, how this lying antisemite refuses to denounce Islam without, of course, denouncing Judaism. It's part and parcel of this Hitchens-the-liar's agenda. Thus, I do not bother with the moron...He's as demented as any Islamist -- he just has a different "religion."

36 Lizard by the Bay  2/11/08 3:55:12 pm reply quote

re: #24 Killgore Trout

re: #12 WrathofG-d

I suspect he sees a common cause with Muslims against secularism and atheists.

Lay down with dogs, wake up with fleas. Simply because Muslims are people of faith doesn't mean that their faith looks anything like ours.

37 mama winger  2/11/08 3:55:16 pm reply quote

The Archbishop has a website.

38 Ma Sands  2/11/08 3:56:24 pm reply quote

re:

39 pegcity  2/11/08 3:58:36 pm reply quote

re: #20 mbruce

Yup, with sharia in place, honor killings, attacking police and firemen, bombing things, all covered and okeedokee by the foul archbish.
Nail him Hitch.
Oh, maybe a bad way of putting it......

clockwork orange society

They are screwd

40 sbvft contributor  2/11/08 3:59:19 pm reply quote

"And just look at how casually this sheep-faced English cleric throws away the work of centuries of civilization"

Beautimous.

41 abolitionist  2/11/08 4:00:00 pm reply quote

Sharia law applies one way to believers, and another way to the unfaithful kuffar, sons of pigs and monkeys, abominable enemies of allah, and any who make mischief in the land.

Among believers, sharia law applies one way to females, and another way to real people.

See? One law for everyone!
/

42 Da_Beerfreak  2/11/08 4:00:06 pm reply quote

Now folks we shouldn't be picking on this doddering old man. It’s obvious that being The Ayatollah Canterbury is a very difficult job now days.

43 Killgore Trout  2/11/08 4:00:11 pm reply quote

re:

44 NJDhockeyfan  2/11/08 4:00:33 pm reply quote

re: #37 mama winger

The Archbishop has a website.

Maybe he wants to practice both religions. It's been tried before.

45 mama winger  2/11/08 4:00:47 pm reply quote

This may shed some light into the mind of the Archbishop. Apparently he is a patron of this organization:

PEACE MALA

46 vapig  2/11/08 4:00:52 pm reply quote

#38 Ma Sands


Aaahhhhh! I hadn't thought of that!

Do you perhaps think that as he gets closer to the end he thinks (even secretly) that perhaps there is something over the rainbow?

47 Jimmah  2/11/08 4:01:15 pm reply quote

Great piece by Hitchens.

48 BulgarWheat  2/11/08 4:01:17 pm reply quote

re:

49 mama winger  2/11/08 4:01:30 pm reply quote

re:

50 buzzsawmonkey  2/11/08 4:03:00 pm reply quote

"Ye cannot in one place rule and in another bear service. Either ye must everywhere rule or everywhere obey. God does not make the nations ringstraked. True—true—true!"

--Rudyard Kipling, "A Sahib's War"

51 ploome hineni  2/11/08 4:03:27 pm reply quote

..this 'archbishop' should be force out to save any shred of relevance that remains attached to the Church of England

not resign, but fired..tossed out

52 mama winger  2/11/08 4:03:29 pm reply quote

re: #43 Killgore Trout

re: #30 Ojoe

Society is moving faster than churches these days. IIRC, the American Episcopal franchise is splitting due to acceptance of homosexuals. Church attendance in the UK and Europe is declining because the churches aren't offering a religion the people want. Many are wandering away from spirituality in general. I think the archbishop sees this as way to get religion and religious values back into mainstream society.

Except in actuality it works out just the opposite. The churches that hold to strong core values are growing, and the mealy mouth liberal churches are in steep decline. Becoming more liberal does not help a church - it hurts it. The statistics are clear.

53 DesertSage  2/11/08 4:04:09 pm reply quote

It's just too damn hot, I've been sweating my ass off all day.

54 macduff  2/11/08 4:04:24 pm reply quote

“There’s one law for everybody and that’s all there is to be said”—still stands out like a diamond in a dunghill. It stands out precisely because it is said simply, and because its essential grandeur is intelligible to everybody.

It's like something that should be engraved in marble. It just says all that need be said in an economy of words.

55 mama winger  2/11/08 4:04:39 pm reply quote

re: #53 DesertSage

It's just too damn hot, I've been sweating my ass off all day.

Oh cry me a river.

56 Atweber  2/11/08 4:04:54 pm reply quote

Sometimes hitchens gets it right sometimes he's got his head up his ass ---what is that all about?
Disagreement is the crucible of knowledge---Bill Whittle

57 EC Marm  2/11/08 4:05:26 pm reply quote

Since someone *cough* WofG *cough* mentioned the Pope, I'd like to mention this. He has decided to respond to the letter from the "138 muslim scholars" and conduct an "interfaith meeting." Personally I think it is a waste of time, but it is interesting to notice some details about the folks that will be attending:

The Muslim delegation is composed of several scholars. Foremost among them is Aref Ali Nayed, a member of the Interfaith Program of the Faculty of Divinity at the University of Cambridge and a former teacher at the Pontifical Institute of Arab and Islamic Studies in Rome. Another representative is Yahya Sergio Yahe Pallavicini, a prominent Italian Muslim who is the head of the al-Wahid mosque in Milan and vice-president of the Islamic Religious Community of Italy. Other delegates include Ibrahim Kalin, a professor from Turkey who teaches at Georgetown University, and Sohail Nakhooda, originally from Jordan, who is director of “Islamica Magazine,” which is edited in the United States.

Aref Ali Nayed is one of the leading Muslim experts in Western philosophy and Christian theology, having studied at the Gregorian in Rome as well as universities in the United States and Canada. One of the major architects of the 138 Muslim scholars’ letter, he has also personally replied to Cardinal Tauran’s message to Muslims addressed during the last Ramadan.

According to Sandro Magister, Yahya Pallavicini is the son of Abd al-Wahid Pallavicini, a European convert to Sufi Islam who participated in the 1986 interreligious prayer meeting in Assisi organized by Pope John Paul II. Yahya Pallavicini, 43, has been a consultant on Islam for the Italian interior ministry since 2006. A devout Muslim critic of violent tendencies of Muslim thought and practice, he has said that "acts of violence find no legitimization in the teachings of the prophet Mohammed or of the wise men." He has also opposed separatist uses of Sharia law and what he called “the culture of hatred” found in many Italian mosques, whose imams he calls “political instigators with nothing authentically Islamic about them." source


The phrases "lip service" and "going through the motions" come to mind, but perhaps some change can come about in the Islamic mindset because of this meeting.

58 buzzsawmonkey  2/11/08 4:05:27 pm reply quote

re: #55 mama winger

re: #53 DesertSage

It's just too damn hot, I've been sweating my ass off all day.

Oh cry me a river.

Where you are now, it would just freeze.

59 mama winger  2/11/08 4:06:12 pm reply quote

re: #58 buzzsawmonkey

re: #55 mama winger

re: #53 DesertSage

It's just too damn hot, I've been sweating my ass off all day.

Oh cry me a river.

Where you are now, it would just freeze.

I can't even go to the mailbox.

60 mean Gene  2/11/08 4:06:20 pm reply quote

In a weird way this archbishop has started an examination of islamic law and culture in the UK and elsewhere.
It sort of reminds me of how Zawahiri and Zarqawi carped back and forth about the idea of stopping with the murdering of fellow (albeit "apostate") muslims until the infidel US force was routed in Iraq and Afghanistan.
I'd wager the islamists of UK wish he'd have kept his big mouth shut, too.

61 Ma Sands  2/11/08 4:06:21 pm reply quote

re:

62 vapig  2/11/08 4:06:46 pm reply quote

#52 mama winger

You are absolutley correct! We see that happening in our town right before our eyes.

Our church is growing nicely - and Pastor is rigid, TOUGH, and spot on!

63 DesertSage  2/11/08 4:07:12 pm reply quote

re: #55 mama winger

re: #53 DesertSage

It's just too damn hot, I've been sweating my ass off all day.

Oh cry me a river.

People were just not meant to sweat in February!

64 mama winger  2/11/08 4:07:19 pm reply quote

re:

65 Da_Beerfreak  2/11/08 4:07:40 pm reply quote
re: #34 vapig

Most of the time this fellow annoys me - but twice in the last couple of weeks he and I are in complete agreement.

Has something frozen over?

It was -39°F in International Falls MN this morning. (And that was air temp, not wind chill.)

66 mama winger  2/11/08 4:07:41 pm reply quote

re: #63 DesertSage

re: #55 mama winger

re: #53 DesertSage

It's just too damn hot, I've been sweating my ass off all day.

Oh cry me a river.

People were just not meant to sweat in February!

I haven't sweat since Labor Day.

67 Ma Sands  2/11/08 4:07:44 pm reply quote

re:

68 ploome hineni  2/11/08 4:08:06 pm reply quote

re: #43 Killgore Trout

re:

69 rcris5  2/11/08 4:08:25 pm reply quote

#5

A debate would be fun and we may find that the good bishop is as much and atheist as Hitchens is.

70 mama winger  2/11/08 4:08:35 pm reply quote

re:

71 vapig  2/11/08 4:08:48 pm reply quote
#55 mama winger 2/11/08 4:04:39 pm reply quote report 0

re: #53 DesertSage

It's just too damn hot, I've been sweating my ass off all day.

Oh cry me a river.

We woke up to 9 degress - so I will echo you!

72 pegcity  2/11/08 4:09:05 pm reply quote

re: #55 mama winger

re: #53 DesertSage


It's just too damn hot, I've been sweating my ass off all day.

Oh cry me a river.

its -25 here send some heat our way

73 mama winger  2/11/08 4:09:19 pm reply quote

re:

74 Jimmah  2/11/08 4:09:29 pm reply quote
[A]n approach to law which simply said "there's one law for everybody and that's all there is to be said, and anything else that commands your loyalty or allegiance is completely irrelevant in the processes of the courts"—I think that's a bit of a danger.

I think the archbishop is actually allergic to moral and logical clarity.

75 Killgore Trout  2/11/08 4:10:24 pm reply quote

re:

76 vapig  2/11/08 4:10:26 pm reply quote

#65 Da_Beerfreak

LOL! I think you know that's not what I was referring to!

77 ploome hineni  2/11/08 4:10:28 pm reply quote

re:

78 mean Gene  2/11/08 4:10:58 pm reply quote

re: #64 mama winger

re: #60 mean Gene

In a weird way this archbishop has started an examination of islamic law and culture in the UK and elsewhere.

mysterious ways indeed

In the UK, if a muslim comes there with his four wives and umpteen children they get large amounts of welfare.
If a native Brit tries the same, he goes to jail.
So, it's worse than sharia.
In islamic countries a man must support all his own, himself.
In gateway sharia appeasement states, like the UK, socialism tries to appease even the weakest muslim.

79 buzzsawmonkey  2/11/08 4:11:22 pm reply quote

re:

80 J.S.  2/11/08 4:11:31 pm reply quote

re:

81 gymnast  2/11/08 4:12:03 pm reply quote

Seems that the Arch Bishop has a did of confusion about which Prophet he serves. Not to mention some cognative disonence when comparing the Koran to the Rights of Man. Perhaps the Arch Bishop wishes that he were the Abd Bishop?

82 flyingcloud  2/11/08 4:12:10 pm reply quote

The ArchiB should resign. He is the equivalent of Sauroman in reality.

83 mama winger  2/11/08 4:12:36 pm reply quote

From the BBC

10 things you didn't know about Rowan Williams

* Rowan Williams is unable to drive. His chaplain used to drive him everywhere, so the chauffeur-driven world of Lambeth must have come naturally
* He is hard of hearing in one of his ears
* He was a keen actor at Oxford, starring as Thomas More in A Man for All Seasons
* He learnt Russian in six months. He speaks seven languages, including Welsh
* He has had curious fashion tastes with a particular fondness for black berets
* He insists on always travelling second-class
* He is married to the daughter of the the Rt Rev Geoffrey Paul. Jane Williams' father is the former Bishop of Bradford and a highly respected evangelical leader
* Although he taught at a number of theological colleges, he is the only bishop never to have gone through training for ordination
* At school, he had a permanent note excusing him from sports
* He is very fond of classical music, particularly Renaissance Baroque and Bach

84 Lizard by the Bay  2/11/08 4:12:46 pm reply quote

re:

85 Killgore Trout  2/11/08 4:12:54 pm reply quote

re:

86 buzzsawmonkey  2/11/08 4:13:38 pm reply quote

re:

87 Ma Sands  2/11/08 4:13:43 pm reply quote

re:

88 mama winger  2/11/08 4:14:05 pm reply quote
* At school, he had a permanent note excusing him from sports

ahhhh - there ya go

89 mama winger  2/11/08 4:14:57 pm reply quote

re:

90 mama winger  2/11/08 4:15:25 pm reply quote

re: #85 Killgore Trout

re: #52 mama winger

I'm not sure if that's true. I wonder if there are reliable statistics on that somewhere.

It's way true.

Let me dig.

91 sbvft contributor  2/11/08 4:16:42 pm reply quote

re: #84 Lizard by the Bay

re:

92 nyc redneck  2/11/08 4:16:48 pm reply quote

re: #88 mama winger

* At school, he had a permanent note excusing him from sports

ahhhh - there ya go

he's a weakling. of course he's going to do preemptive capitulation. that's his sport.

93 EC Marm  2/11/08 4:16:54 pm reply quote

re: #77 ploome hineni

re: #57 EC Marm

he needs to meet with muslims from the 'vatican' of islam
from Egypt and Saudi

not from the takkilopes who have the lies down pat, from their western Christian educations


I see your point. But 1.5 billion Catholics are represented by this one man, while 1.6 billion muslims are represented by 1.6 billion points of view. Which is one of many reasons why I am so skeptical that any progress will be made.
But I've been wrong before, and any progress towards freedom of religion in islamic countries could be a very good thing.

94 vapig  2/11/08 4:18:37 pm reply quote
#85 Killgore Trout 2/11/08 4:12:54 pm reply quote report 0

re: #52 mama winger

I'm not sure if that's true. I wonder if there are reliable statistics on that somewhere.

I'm sure there are statistics out there to prove mama winger correct.

I can tell you that several churches have closed down in our town due to low attendance - most of these are methodist (the church that declared the bible hate speech and accepts other doctrines not welcome by most churches) other churches here are thriving and we are actually having problems finding Pastors to fill them all.

95 realwest  2/11/08 4:18:42 pm reply quote

Hit and Run post boys and girls but apparently Black Berry smart phones have lost service across the United States, wireless carriers said Monday.

In a statement, AT&T spokesman Fletcher Cook said the disruption is affecting all wireless carriers. Cook said the company first learned about the problem from BlackBerry maker Research in Motion about 3:30 p.m. EST (2030 GMT).
There was no word on the cause or how widespread the outage was.

Link is in spinoff links above.

96 Da_Beerfreak  2/11/08 4:19:08 pm reply quote
re: #76 vapig

#65 Da_Beerfreak

LOL! I think you know that's not what I was referring to!

LOL,
I know, but its been one hell of a cold weekend in Minnesota!
// {;-)™

97 ploome hineni  2/11/08 4:20:06 pm reply quote

re:

98 Kohenan the Barbarian  2/11/08 4:20:10 pm reply quote

Yet again the Archbishop of irrelevance and naval gazing opens his mouth and disgorges convoluted drivel and baffle gab--a devout Antisemite camouflaged in multicultural bilge water --what a useless insidious Shmuck!

99 tiburon  2/11/08 4:20:20 pm reply quote

Well well. I certainly hope that someone has pointed out that The Law that applies to EVERYONE is quite clearly spelled out in the core Scripture of our dear Archbishop's faith. To wit(less): - Noahide Nations.

Unbelievable. "and they shall be led by children" "the rulers of that day will have the face of a dog" - Refering days leading up to Messiah.

100 A Kiwi Infidel  2/11/08 4:22:37 pm reply quote

time for a new Archbishop of Canturbury

101 vapig  2/11/08 4:22:44 pm reply quote
#96 Da_Beerfreak 2/11/08 4:19:08 pm reply quote report 0

re: #76 vapig
#65 Da_Beerfreak

LOL! I think you know that's not what I was referring to!

LOL,
I know, but its been one hell of a cold weekend in Minnesota!
// {;-)™

I hear you, friend, and feel your pain!

This global warming is going freeze us all to death! Or at least cost some of us our toes to frostbite! Weeellll - at least it FEELS that way!

102 yesandno  2/11/08 4:22:55 pm reply quote

re: #83 mama winger

From the BBC

10 things you didn't know about Rowan Williams

* Rowan Williams is unable to drive. His chaplain used to drive him everywhere, so the chauffeur-driven world of Lambeth must have come naturally
* He is hard of hearing in one of his ears
* He was a keen actor at Oxford, starring as Thomas More in A Man for All Seasons
* He learnt Russian in six months. He speaks seven languages, including Welsh
* He has had curious fashion tastes with a particular fondness for black berets
* He insists on always travelling second-class
* He is married to the daughter of the the Rt Rev Geoffrey Paul. Jane Williams' father is the former Bishop of Bradford and a highly respected evangelical leader
* Although he taught at a number of theological colleges, he is the only bishop never to have gone through training for ordination
* At school, he had a permanent note excusing him from sports
* He is very fond of classical music, particularly Renaissance Baroque and Bach

And #11--It has been 35+ years since he trimmed his eyebrows!

103 rwmofo  2/11/08 4:23:30 pm reply quote

Hitchens is one of my favorite debaters. I've never seen him lose a fight.

104 EC Marm  2/11/08 4:27:54 pm reply quote

re: #97 ploome hineni

re: #93 EC Marm

the jihadis get their inspiration forn the old country, these western trained muslims should go to Pakistan, Arabia, Egypt and Indonesia

not Rome

these western trained muslims need to educate the wackos in the ME


IMHO, one of two things is going to happen, a smackdown to some islamic country of biblical proportions, or some movement to reform and unify islam. Unfortunately, I see the first as more likely before the second. But PB VXI can give the second option a try.

105 akak  2/11/08 4:29:01 pm reply quote

Russian bomber aircraft approached a US Aircraft carrier in the Pacific on Saturday and were intercepted by American fighter jets, a US Defense official said on Monday.

106 akak  2/11/08 4:30:03 pm reply quote
The bombers, flying south of Japan, were detected turning toward the USS Nimitz aircraft carrier and its accompanying ships. Four US F/A-18 fighters were launched to intercept the Russian aircraft, the official said. (Reuters)
107 BulgarWheat  2/11/08 4:30:42 pm reply quote

re:

108 debutaunt  2/11/08 4:33:08 pm reply quote

re: #51 ploome hineni

..this 'archbishop' should be force out to save any shred of relevance that remains attached to the Church of England

not resign, but fired..tossed out

A visible bootprint?

109 macduff  2/11/08 4:33:50 pm reply quote

re: #83 mama winger

From the BBC

10 things you didn't know about Rowan Williams

* Rowan Williams is unable to drive. His chaplain used to drive him everywhere, so the chauffeur-driven world of Lambeth must have come naturally
* He is hard of hearing in one of his ears
* He was a keen actor at Oxford, starring as Thomas More in A Man for All Seasons
* He learnt Russian in six months. He speaks seven languages, including Welsh
* He has had curious fashion tastes with a particular fondness for black berets
* He insists on always travelling second-class
* He is married to the daughter of the the Rt Rev Geoffrey Paul. Jane Williams' father is the former Bishop of Bradford and a highly respected evangelical leader
* Although he taught at a number of theological colleges, he is the only bishop never to have gone through training for ordination
* At school, he had a permanent note excusing him from sports
* He is very fond of classical music, particularly Renaissance Baroque and Bach

So, he can be summed up as something of an "intellectual oddball"?

110 debutaunt  2/11/08 4:34:07 pm reply quote

re: #53 DesertSage

It's just too damn hot, I've been sweating my ass off all day.

Working in a foundry?

111 mama winger  2/11/08 4:34:32 pm reply quote

Killgore - sorry - I got interrupted......

Here is one study - I have to run off but you can google Denominational growth decline data if you'd like more info.

112 Geepers  2/11/08 4:35:10 pm reply quote

Rowan is indicative of Britain's huge problems.

113 buzzsawmonkey  2/11/08 4:35:46 pm reply quote

Interesting that Williams managed to play Thomas More in A Man For All Seasons in college without any aspects of More's character rubbing off on him.

Now that's acting.

114 A Kiwi Infidel  2/11/08 4:35:46 pm reply q