So we're using voluntary enlistment as a threat now?

}:)     [Too early on a Sunday morning to try to make sense of this ... ]

I could do some very nasty things to the the kkkozkids using ideas from Loius L'Amor westerns.

I'll enlist if the koslings move to China.

Apparently, some people still think Kerry's botched joke was actually a true statement.

What utter filth, puke and garbage. Man, how did it get this polarized? I cannot WAIT to see how badly BHO gets his ass kicked.

In a way I could not agree more. Those who can , should enlist. I should have served a long time ago, but this February I was sworn in as a Lt. Commander in the USN. I have never been happier.

re: #1 Kulhwch

And right before Memorial Day! Such a classy, non-offensive, and progressive "story" from Kos and his Kidz.

These peaceful folks do spend some effort on lovingly detailed descriptions of carnage affecting those who disagree with them.

Voluntary enlistment and an obligation to protect and defend the nation - something that these yahoos have tried to avoid at every opportunity by undermining and attacking those very institutions by calling those who enlist baby killers, mass murderers, and worse, and they're calling for enlistment?

What color is the sky on their planet?

Why don't they suggest Senator O try the chickenhawk strawman on Senator McCain in a debate? /

I'm a little confused. What does KOS want to happen to our military?
/

re: #3 Sharmuta

China's too "capitalist" for them. They'd much rather prefer North Korea. After all, that's the model nation for those wanting to live under a "cult of personality".

Ok for all you KosKooks:

I have enlisted, I have served, I am disabled. You'll find that a large number of conservatives have honorably served their country, in the same way that a large number of liberals (not democrats, liberals) have betrayed their country and spit on everything it stands for. You will never know what it is to serve your country. You will never know what it is to help people in a way that can cost you your life and health. You will never understand true sacrifice. But, you will claim to stand up for those who do, while spitting upon what they stand for. Go. To. Hell. You equivocating, ignorant, pieces of wormslime.

Kerry's joke. Some joke--it's viral with the Koskys.

Memorial Day. Let us remember that change is not always for the better. However, I wonder how quickly these orcs will turn around if Clinton, for whatever reason, becomes the nominee? That would be fun to watch.

The Kosacks can enlist, as long as the services are still operating under the "don't ask, don't tell" policy.

re: #2 pingjockey

I could do some very nasty things to the the kkkozkids using ideas from Loius L'Amor westerns.

Ya can't make em any dumber.

Geez, talk about yer false choices.

re: #9 lawhawk

Red, as with everything in their "progressive" world.

that is one very sick creature.

[Link: drift.ijji.com...]

Check out how they modified the logo for Memorial Day...

I will not be voting for Obama and I will not be enlisting. Neener Neener! I will be exposing the kiddies every chance I get instead. What an Ass.

re: #9 lawhawk

Voluntary enlistment and an obligation to protect and defend the nation - something that these yahoos have tried to avoid at every opportunity by undermining and attacking those very institutions by calling those who enlist baby killers, mass murderers, and worse, and they're calling for enlistment?

What color is the sky on their planet?

Red.

Question (only semi-OT)...

This is from Obama's website under "foreign policy":

Expand the Military: We have learned from Iraq that our military needs more men and women in uniform to reduce the strain on our active force. Obama will increase the size of ground forces, adding 65,000 soldiers to the Army and 27,000 Marines.

How do we "expand the military"?

/other than instituting a draft, that is?

I thought Rangel & Conyers were going to sponsor a draft bill?

re: #5 soccerdad

What utter filth, puke and garbage. Man, how did it get this polarized? I cannot WAIT to see how badly BHO gets his ass kicked.

I am beginning to believe that with but a few strategic knockout lines at the debate by McCain, this election landslide will top the world record held by Ronald Wilson Reagan over Mondale.

Hasn't Charlie Rangel D NY been saying since 06 he would like to bring back the draft? Not to increase military strength but to make Vietnam like conditions of dissatisfaction. Nice talking point./

re: #1 Kulhwch

[Too early on a Sunday morning to try to make sense of this ... ]

Don't even try, they never make sense.

I'll see you your sanctimonious screed and raise you my DD214, KosKiddieK*cksucker....

Charles, a thread idea (if you're not already planning it); I'm sure that between today and tomorrow, there will be a whole, putrid cornucopia of "progressive" sites marking Memorial Day with pieces about how much they hate America and/or America's Armed Forces. Might make for a good "roundup" thread.

re: #23 littleoldlady

Sen Kerry had the same idea when he was running for President.

But, yeah, how do you do that without instituting some sort of draft?

re: #23 littleoldlady

Question (only semi-OT)...

This is from Obama's website under "foreign policy":

How do we "expand the military"?

/other than instituting a draft, that is?

Well raising the pay levels might help. However, in the interests of full disclosure, since I serve, I would benefit. Having said that, no one I know, serves because of the money. Although tax free pay sounds good.

That's the mess I left behind.

I have rarely read anything so stupid and sophomoric as that particular KOS piece. Thanks for posting it so that I did not have to defile and dirty myself by going to KOS to read it.

Methinks they don't know the meaning of "hope".

re: #21 kahall

I will not be voting for Obama and I will not be enlisting. Neener Neener! I will be exposing the kiddies every chance I get instead. What an Ass.

The Kosack's sophomoric rant is deserving of a titty-twister.

I'm out for a bit, I'm sorting through 12 gig of photos trying to put them in chronological order....

re: #16 JeremyR
I won't make the dumber, I'll make them howl!

Just for giggles I would love to see how many of these kids would be denied an enlistment in the first place.

re: #28 Fenway_Nation

I'll see you your sanctimonious screed and raise you my DD214, KosKiddieK*cksucker....

Lacquer a copy of mine to a cluebat.
That'll larn 'em.

re: #29 Occasional Reader

Charles, a thread idea (if you're not already planning it); I'm sure that between today and tomorrow, there will be a whole, putrid cornucopia of "progressive" sites marking Memorial Day with pieces about how much they hate America and/or America's Armed Forces. Might make for a good "roundup" thread.

I too support this idea. Let's show everyone who stumbles here more of the true face of these bastards. I know they won't be able to resist spitting on the memory of American Veterans. If only the press would report this instead of non-existent hate directed at Senator Kennedy.

Just can't wait for the KOS Memorial Day Post telling us how all of our Veterans are war criminals. I think some of them hate our military because when they see our Troops take a stand against terrorists,it hurts their pride because they know it is something most of them would never dream of doing.

Some Marxist piece of excrement posted this on an Alternate History forum:

With a [point of departure] between 1400 and 1900, cause a scenario where the rich and the powerful feast (literally) on the poor in a show of dominance. Cannibalism is a pursuit of the leisure class, like golf, polo, or African safaris....

re: #23 littleoldlady

Question (only semi-OT)...

This is from Obama's website under "foreign policy":

How do we "expand the military"?

/other than instituting a draft, that is?

It can be expanded without a draft.

But that is just more O'Bambi BS. He has no intention of expanding the military. Pure BS to get the confused in the middle to vote for him.

I'll bet you my year's salary if he's elected the military will decrease in size.

re: #38 Seadogs

Just for giggles I would love to see how many of these kids would be denied an enlistment in the first place.

There is a drug test isn't there?

If you’re going to help Obama get elected, you need to take responsibility for your actions. This election is bigger than you. It’s bigger than John McCain. It’s bigger than Hillary Clinton. Lives will be saved or lost depending on who is elected in November, and if you’re going to willfully help end the war, it’s time to do the honorable thing and vote for Obama

If Obama wins, the jihadi in the world will celebrate, and at some point, may trigger terrorist cells in the U.S; you’ll be able to “sit this one out” in your own home, under the comfort of a mortar attack. And yes, I’m sure hearing about an McCain defeat will seem all the more sweet when you’re laying in the choking aftermath on another 9/11 attack in your workplace, this time with a a piece of half-melted plastic burning a hole into your intestines. I’m sure you’ll be comforted by the knowledge that history had no place for President McCain when you've stepped on an IED on your way to the grocery store and you’re staring at the empty space where your leg used to be. And I’m sure the crippling terror of post-traumatic stress disorder from sleeper cell attacks in the U.S. will be nowhere as severe as the disingenuous “concern” you’ll suffer over debunked Republican Attack Machine conspiracy theories and the excited ramblings of a Marxist theologian.

re: #4 laZardo

Apparently, some people still think Kerry's botched joke was actually a true statement.

"You know, education -- if you make the most of it -- you study hard, you do your homework and you make an effort to be smart, you can do well. If you don't, you get stuck blogging on Daily Kos."

re: #29 Occasional Reader

Better yet - compare and contrast between those and those bloggers who are thanking those who served, and who made the supreme sacrifice.

re: #30 mitthrawnurdo

re: #23 littleoldlady

Easy. Make the Peace Corps technically part of the "Armed Forces." They'll now be America's official "military" emissaries abroad!

/the left adore mobilization...

re: #44 unrealizedviewpoint

There is a drug test isn't there?

Readin' Rightin' an Rythmatic too!

re: #42 The Other Les

Some Marxist piece of excrement posted this on an Alternate History forum:

Alternate reality is more like it. That goofball's in another dimension.

re: #42 The Other Les

Some Marxist piece of excrement posted this on an Alternate History forum:

Actually Masters of Horror already did this crap from what I heard. I won't watch since that's about the 10th liberal spin in the horror series.

re: #44 unrealizedviewpoint

There is a drug test isn't there?

Weekly.

re: #46 JeremyR

"You know, education -- if you make the most of it -- you study hard, you do your homework and you make an effort to be smart, you can do well. If you don't, you get stuck blogging on Daily Kos."

Oh, you get an upding for that, you imperialist warmongering pig. (;

Is that demented Jew-hating diary still up at Kos?

re: #43 MarkX

Bingo!

/how many people would not reenlist or get early retirement if Messiah (God forbid!) gets elected?

Sounds like Kos is relying on ensuring the votes from overseas don't get counted in November.

re: #52 Nevergiveup

Weekly.

Is that anything like the FNDT?
/

re: #29 Occasional Reader

Yup, that's what I was looking for. There have been a few good ones but no winners yet. Just wait.

re: #55 mitthrawnurdo

Bingo!

/how many people would not reenlist or get early retirement if Messiah (God forbid!) gets elected?

That is a worry. I have heard rumblings about just that!

What does this mean for the Marines, Sailors, Soldiers and Airman who plan on voting for McCain? Re-enlist? I mean, immediately, or should we just wait til our next re-enlistment date.

Also, what if McCain voters have already served their time and chose not to return? Should they just go ahead and suck it up and go back? How about those McCain supporters who have suffered injuries that make it impossible to return to duty in the kind of capacity this Kostly Idiot wants?

re: #45 shibumi

If you’re going to help Obama get elected, you need to take responsibility for your actions. This election is bigger than you. It’s bigger than John McCain. It’s bigger than Hillary Clinton. Lives will be saved or lost depending on who is elected in November, and if you’re going to willfully help end the war, it’s time to do the honorable thing and vote for Obama

If Obama wins, the jihadi in the world will celebrate, and at some point, may trigger terrorist cells in the U.S; you’ll be able to “sit this one out” in your own home, under the comfort of a mortar attack. And yes, I’m sure hearing about an McCain defeat will seem all the more sweet when you’re laying in the choking aftermath on another 9/11 attack in your workplace, this time with a a piece of half-melted plastic burning a hole into your intestines. I’m sure you’ll be comforted by the knowledge that history had no place for President McCain when you've stepped on an IED on your way to the grocery store and you’re staring at the empty space where your leg used to be. And I’m sure the crippling terror of post-traumatic stress disorder from sleeper cell attacks in the U.S. will be nowhere as severe as the disingenuous “concern” you’ll suffer over debunked Republican Attack Machine conspiracy theories and the excited ramblings of a Marxist theologian.

Actually in their view of Amerikkka that is actually a desired effect.

We are now well into that stage of the game where many Clinton supporters are stating, some sincerely and some not, that they will not vote for Obama in November. Some cite the sexism of our sensationalist media as justification (ignoring, of course, the media's historically illiterate race-baiting campaign against Obama)

OMG! The citation for this "race-baiting campaign against Obama" is the newsweak poll we dissected last night! LMAO. Idiots.

Speaking of moonbats....

Jessica Lange bashes Iraq war in graduation speech

"We are living in an America that, in the last seven and a half years, has waged an unnecessary war, established prison camps, condoned torture, employed corporate armies, eliminated the right of habeas corpus, practiced extraordinary rendition, and believe me, this is only a partial list," Lange said.

re: #53 laZardo

Oh, you get an upding for that, you imperialist warmongering pig. (;

Well, I mamaged to get one of my four into the military.

re: #11 rwmofo

I'm a little confused. What does KOS want to happen to our military?
/

From observation, they want to be protected so they can slam their protectors*.  Translation: a bunch of feebs w/no clear sense of direction and all day in the basement between bouts of Guitar Hero to muse about it.  And all having an infantile dependence on bifurcated thinking if any thinking at all is engaged in.  Thought doesn't appear to be their natural element ...

}:)     [* Makes perfect sense, I suppose, in a BDSM way ... ]

re: #15 Roentgen

The Kosacks can enlist, as long as the services are still operating under the "don't ask, don't tell" policy.

More like "don't ask, haven't a clue".

President Bush is on the White House lawn wit the Vets from Rolling Thunder--Everyone looks so happy. Great scene.

Let's take a trip down memory lane on who reduced the military's size:

1992:
Army: 610,450
Navy: 541,883
Marines: 184,529
Air Force: 470,315

2000:
Army: 481,669
Navy: 373,692
Marines: 173,371
Air Force: 354,321

As of December 2007:
Army: 502,466
Navy: 345,566
Marines: 178,477
Air Force: 345,024

So in 2001, thanks to President Clinton et al, we were smaller by about 25 Army Brigades and eight Marine Battalions.

[Link: www.infoplease.com...] (stats)

Somebody hep me out. Doesn't the Left constantly scream about Bush diverting us from our mission in Afgahnastan and capturing Bin Laden by going into Iraq.
Is it safe to assume that this guy enlisted after 9/11 to go fight Al Queda? Kidding.

re: #63 jcm

Speaking of moonbats....

Jessica Lange bashes Iraq war in graduation speech

Another bunch of movies I'll never see.

re: #61 Mars Needs Neocons

Actually in their view of Amerikkka that is actually a desired effect.

You're exactly right.

However, that' exactly the opposite of what I want!

re: #6 Nevergiveup

In a way I could not agree more. Those who can , should enlist. I should have served a long time ago, but this February I was sworn in as a Lt. Commander in the USN. I have never been happier.

I served 4 1/2 years in the USN. Just wondering: How do you get "sworn in" as an LCDR?

re: #63 jcm

Well....what would be a graduation ceremony without a self-righteous moonbat diatribe from an actor or member of the media?

Actually I'm voting for McCain so I won't have to shoot Reds and Islam-Droids from my bedroom window.

re: #63 jcm

Jessica Lange bashes Iraq war in graduation speech

What's more clueless, an (excellent!) actress who doesn't get out much, or a school inviting her to give a graduation speech?

re: #68 CattttThat was Clintoons "peace dividend" strategy. Look the commies are gone, lets whack the military and put all that money into undying entitelment programs.

re: #73 Fenway_Nation

Well....what would be a graduation ceremony without a self-righteous moonbat diatribe from an actor or member of the media?

A rite of passage anymore.
/

re: #74 The Other Les

Actually I'm voting for McCain so I won't have to shoot Reds and Islam-Droids from my bedroom window.

And I'm supporting McCain so people like these Kossacks will remain annoyances and not have to be upgraded to enemy combatants. Just finished reading Caliphate and it has shortened my tolerance for these future aiders and abettors.

re: #72 Bob in Breckenridge

I served 4 1/2 years in the USN. Just wondering: How do you get "sworn in" as an LCDR?

Well they need Doctors. I kinda feel ashamed sometimes that I jumped right in as LCDR, but I have been learning that Rank does have it's advantages. I am kinda learning on the fly so to speak. But I have never met a finer group of people.

I can't find my local recruiter in Sunshine, Florida, and I tried all 57 states.

re: #78 Mars Needs Neocons
I haven't read Caliphate yet.

Something tells me that its going to be as much fun as reading 1984.

My uncle, who is almost at retirement age and is a stark raving moonbat who came of age in the 60's and now routinely sends me emails alternatively "showing" GWB as evil and cunning and then as a total moron is an intelligent man, has taught me much about life and I have a great deal of respect for him. He has raised some great kids that went to Harvard and as a employee of the World Bank I have seen him contribute to some great projects that have benefitted many many people.

I just don't understand how such a person can completely ignore logic when it comes to politics and society in general. Altough he wouldn't go so far as this KKKos poster he will routinely make comments that in any other context you would be horrorized to hear coming from his mouth. I just don't get it.

re: #74 The Other Les

Actually I'm voting for McCain so I won't have to shoot Reds and Islam-Droids from my bedroom window.

You won't have to do that with BHussein either. You will be unarmed when they come if Barry has his way.

re: #68 Catttt

Let's take a trip down memory lane on who reduced the military's size:

1992:
Army: 610,450
Navy: 541,883
Marines: 184,529
Air Force: 470,315

2000:
Army: 481,669
Navy: 373,692
Marines: 173,371
Air Force: 354,321

As of December 2007:
Army: 502,466
Navy: 345,566
Marines: 178,477
Air Force: 345,024

So in 2001, thanks to President Clinton et al, we were smaller by about 25 Army Brigades and eight Marine Battalions.

[Link: www.infoplease.com...] (stats)

It's the PEACE DIVIDEND silly! Don't you remember back in the 90's? We had permanent peace, unmatched economic prosperity and a warm and fuzzy feeling throughout, all thanks to the wonderful and magnificent leadership of the greatest President of the past 50 years, Slick Willie Clinton!....then, GWB and the agents of darkness took over....8 years of torture....but soon, the good times will return when the Obamessiah takes over...the sun will shine, the birds will sing and all will be right in the world once more......

I think many of them there Moonbats really believe that

Congratulations, Ms. Lange. You probably encouraged a few more Jihadis in Iraq to fight on with that ignorant little speech.

I’m sure the crippling terror of post-traumatic stress disorder will be nowhere as severe as the disingenuous “concern” you’ll suffer

Anyone else hear the unmistakable roar of moonbat-incontinence-inducing Thunder this morning in DC? It's a glorious sound in our nation's capital today.

re: #80 Nevergiveup

Well they need Doctors. I kinda feel ashamed sometimes that I jumped right in as LCDR, but I have been learning that Rank does have it's advantages. I am kinda learning on the fly so to speak. But I have never met a finer group of people.

Your learning Medicine on the fly OMG! I guess thats why the call it medical practice.

Oh, and thank you for your service.

re: #81 ccrnyc

I can't find my local recruiter in Sunshine, Florida, and I tried all 57 states.

Actually Barry believes that there are 59 states. He has been in only the continental 57, because his handlers will not schedule Alaska or Hawaii.
Should the bitter white crackers deny him the presidency he has a carrer waitng for him as a Travel Writer.

Military threads at DKos are full of moonbats wanting to reinstate the draft. They think people would get smarter about the military if they were forced to serve. Of course, the ones who scream the loudest for the draft have never served themselves and wouldn't be eligible even if it were reinstated. As long as it's not them, it's good for everyone else.

re: #90 gman

Military threads at DKos are full of moonbats wanting to reinstate the draft. They think people would get smarter about the military if they were forced to serve. Of course, the ones who scream the loudest for the draft have never served themselves and wouldn't be eligible even if it were reinstated. As long as it's not them, it's good for everyone else.

That's actually the Liberal way. Socialism for you, not for me. Military for you, not for me. Free speech for me, not for you. Dictatorship for you, with me in charge.

re: #27 MarkX

See what caffiene deprivation does to you?

}:)     [What was I thinking?  <slurping sound>  Ah, better now ... ]

Anyone who thinks that they can dictate to me who I wull be voting for will be swiftly met with the knife edge of my hand to the neck.

re: #69 opnion

Somebody hep me out. Doesn't the Left constantly scream about Bush diverting us from our mission in Afgahnastan and capturing Bin Laden by going into Iraq.

That's an effort to divert the WOT into police work: if we ever capture Bin Laden the same leftisits will scream that the war is over.

re: #90 gman

Military threads at DKos are full of moonbats wanting to reinstate the draft. They think people would get smarter about the military if they were forced to serve. Of course, the ones who scream the loudest for the draft have never served themselves and wouldn't be eligible even if it were reinstated. As long as it's not them, it's good for everyone else.

The anti-Vietnam protest were largely anti-draft protests. When the draft ended before the Vietnam war ended the protest size and frequency dramatically dropped.

The left wants to relive it's glory days.

Do those twits at Kos really want a country where only those who have served in the nation's military should have voting rights?

re: #90 gman

Military threads at DKos are full of moonbats wanting to reinstate the draft. They think people would get smarter about the military if they were forced to serve. Of course, the ones who scream the loudest for the draft have never served themselves and wouldn't be eligible even if it were reinstated. As long as it's not them, it's good for everyone else.

Do as I say - not as I do.

Filipino marines are fighting Abu Sayyaf today:
[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

Will President Obama beg the Iranians to stop killing US troops while we surrender, turn our tails and run? Perhaps, when he meets them face to face without preconditions, he can ask them to stop funding, training and equipping the scum bag Shia militias that are causing all the troubles over there long enough for us to run away? I sure hope so, because that will really be supporting the troops! Make their mission meaningless, make the efforts and suffering for naught.....create a vacuum that AQ and the Iranians will surely fill....YEP, that is the proper stance...the "right" thing to do.

NOT

I keep forgetting in which branch of the military Obama served...

re: #82 The Other Les

I haven't read Caliphate yet.

Something tells me that its going to be as much fun as reading 1984.

Don't miss it. The conservative side doesn't come out looking perfect, but at least their behavior makes sense. The left doesn't even make sense when the bombs go off.

re: #73 Fenway_Nation

Well....what would be a graduation ceremony without a self-righteous moonbat diatribe from an actor or member of the media?

I am headed off to a graduation party today. Lots of family Obama supporters and a very strong Republican Wing.
Should be interesting. I have not heard one cogent reason to vote for Obama from any of them

Iran 'paid Iraq insurgents to kill UK soldiers'

re: #96 Syrah

Do those twits at Kos really want a country where only those who have served in the nation's military should have voting rights?

No.

They want a country where those who oppose them have no voice in government. Non-service in the armed forces is simply an excuse to silence the opposition.

re: #100 J.D.

I keep forgetting in which branch of the military Obama served...

The Ayers' Weather Underground Auxiliary.

re: #94 jaunte

That's an effort to divert the WOT into police work: if we ever capture Bin Laden the same leftisits will scream that he was framed by Bush and Rove.

Fixed it for ya ;-)

re: #105 Syrah

The Ayers' Weather Underground Auxiliary.

Ouch! That'll leave a mark!
;-)

Well shit! What do those of us who've already served in the military, in combat, but are now too old to serve, do now?
Why, I reckon we'll just have to stay home and wage a guerrilla war (non-shooting type) at the Obama Administration, Dem Congress and of course, Markos Zunigas Kos - the soldier who served his country honorably in Germany, until it became more convenient for him to forget that fact.

Does anyone know if McCain's wife has a hot, millionaire sister who also owns a beer distributorship? I'm, like, available.

re: #94 jaunte

That's an effort to divert the WOT into police work: if we ever capture Bin Laden the same leftisits will scream that the war is over.

What I recall is that Libs were not really giggy with Afghanastan at the time. As I remember they got big on it only after we went to Iraq.

They're forgetting that anyone who votes for Obama should volunteer to invade pakistan.

re: #108 realwest

Well shit! What do those of us who've already served in the military, in combat, but are now too old to serve, do now?
Why, I reckon we'll just have to stay home and wage a guerrilla war (non-shooting type) at the Obama Administration, Dem Congress and of course, Markos Zunigas Kos - the soldier who served his country honorably in Germany, until it became more convenient for him to forget that fact.

Well for those Dr. out there. The Military does give age waivers. Just saying.

re: #6 Nevergiveup

In a way I could not agree more. Those who can , should enlist. I should have served a long time ago, but this February I was sworn in as a Lt. Commander in the USN. I have never been happier.

Hmmm, that reminds me of a point I wanted clarified.

Are the non-military who are backing McCain this year restricted to enlistment or can they go officer as well?

Considering that officers in all branches are as likely to tour in Iraq and Afghanistan as enlisted, and most of the time are subjected to the same exact hostilities on the ground as enlisted (obviously you're not going to see a General or an Admiral kicking sand with bullets whizzing) do they count, to the Kos kids, as those serving their country? Or are they just better-paid, pseuodo-educated mercenaries now?

I wonder what they think about officers...if they even know what officers do, or even if they know what enlisted-men and women do.

re: #86 Tigger2005

Congratulations, Ms. Lange. You probably encouraged a few more Jihadis in Iraq to fight on with that ignorant little speech.

Add her to the list of actors I will no longer see in a movie....Sean Pean, Susan Surrender and her husband Timmy, Rosie O'Justshutup, etc, etc...

The more I hear from these spoiled, pampered and clueless dolts, the more I hate them. They have 1st amendment rights same as me so they can say anything they want. Just be ready for the consequences though. I am certain there is a growing resentment of these "politically active" celebrities......

re: #102 opnion

. I have not heard one cogent reason to vote for Obama from any of them

Change, or something. maybe hope and change or just a little hope, a lot of change.

re: #6 Nevergiveup Congratulations and thank you for your service!

re: #109 rwmofo

Does anyone know if McCain's wife has a hot, millionaire sister who also owns a beer distributorship? I'm, like, available.

Imagine that....she is beautiful, rich and her Dad owns a beer distribution company.......McCain is a lucky duck for sure

re: #109 rwmofo

Does anyone know if McCain's wife has a hot, millionaire sister who also owns a beer distributorship? I'm, like, available.

I am married, but my wife says if I can corral a multi-millionaire, she will step aside if I will support her in the style she is not yet accustom to!

re: #110 opnion

Here's a Wa-post article on the subject:

"Consider MoveOn.org, which the online journal Salon has called "the most important political advocacy group in Democratic circles." MoveOn was founded in the late 1990s to oppose Bill Clinton's impeachment. But it responded to Sept. 11 by opposing the war against the Taliban. In 2002 it incorporated 9-11peace.org, which also opposed the Afghan war, and questioned the need for greater CIA funding. In the years since, MoveOn has depicted the war on terrorism in overwhelmingly negative terms -- as a menace to civil liberties and a distraction from domestic concerns. Like Michael Moore, it has minimized the al Qaeda threat."

[Link: www.washingtonpost.com...]

re: #15 Roentgen

The Kosacks can enlist, as long as the services are still operating under the "don't ask, don't tell" policy.

Even the marines have a minimum ASVAB score. So your point is moot.

re: #104 The Other Les

No.

They want a country where those who oppose them have no voice in government. Non-service in the armed forces is simply an excuse to silence the opposition.

Hmmm. . . That would result in the compulsory arming and training in the art of war everyone who they oppose ideologically.

seems. . . stupid.

Some cite the sexism of our sensationalist media as justification (ignoring, of course, the media's historically illiterate race-baiting campaign against Obama)

The kosling is citing this newsweak poll as proof there is a media campaign against obama. I question these people's reading comprehension ability.

re: #117 Desert Dog

Imagine that....she is beautiful, rich and her Dad owns a beer distribution company.......McCain is a lucky duck for sure

"She's beautiful! She's rich! She's got huge... barrels of beer!"

re: #13 Mars Needs Neocons Thank you for your service to our Nation - those who haven't served and have the "nanny state" mindset will never understand what you did or the sacrifices you made.
But we will and do.

Below are some assembled some facts most readers will find interesting. It isn't a long read, but it will....I guarantee...teach you some things you did not know about the Vietnam War and those who served, fought, or died there. Please share it with those with whom you communicate.

Vietnam War Facts: Facts, Statistics, Fake Warrior Numbers, and Myths Dispelled

9,087,000 military personnel served on active duty during the official Vietnam era from August 5, 1964 to May 7, 1975.
2,709,918 Americans served in uniform in Vietnam Vietnam Veterans represented 9.7% of their generation.
240 men were awarded the Medal of Honor during the Vietnam War The first man to die in Vietnam was James Davis, in 1958. He was with the 509th Radio Research Station. Davis Station in Saigon was named for him.
58,148 were killed in Vietnam
75,000 were severely disabled
23,214 were 100% disabled
5,283 lost limbs
1,081 sustained multiple amputations Of those killed, 61% were younger than 21
11,465 of those killed were younger than 20 years old Of those killed, 17,539 were married Average age of men killed: 23.1 years Five men killed in Vietnam were only 16 years old. The oldest man killed was 62 years old. As of January 15, 2 004, there are 1,875 Americans still unaccounted for from the Vietnam War
97% of Vietnam Veterans were honorably discharged
91% of Vietnam Veterans say they are glad they served
74% say they would serve again, even knowing the outcome Vietnam veterans have a lower unemployment rate than the same non-vet age groups. Vietnam veterans' personal income exceeds that of our non-veteran age group by more than 18 percent.
87% of Americans hold Vietnam Veterans in high esteem. There is no difference in drug usage between Vietnam Veterans and non-Vietnam Veterans of the same age group (Source: Veterans Administration Study) Vietnam Veterans are less likely to be in prison - only one-half of one percent of Vietnam Veterans have been jailed for crimes.
85% of Vietnam Veterans made successful transitions to civilian life. Interesting Census Stats and "Been There" Wanabees:
1,713,823 of those who served in Vietnam were still alive as of August, 1995 (census figures). ~ During that same Census count, the number of Americans falsely claiming to have served in-country was: 9,492,958. ~ As of the current Census taken during August, 2000, the surviving U.S. Vietnam Veteran population estimate is: 1,002,511. This is hard to believe, losing nearly 711,000 between '95 and '00. That's 390 per day. During this Census count, the number of Americans falsely claiming to have served in-country is: 13,853,027. By this census, FOUR OUT OF FIVE WHO CLAIM TO BE Vietnam vets are not.

The Department of Defense Vietnam War Service Index officially provided by The War Library originally reported with errors that 2,709,918 U.S. military personnel as having served in-country. Corrections and confirmations to this errored index resulted in the addition of 358 U.S. military personnel confirmed to have served in Vietnam but not originally listed by the Department of Defense. (All names are currently on file and accessible 24/7/365).

Isolated atrocities committed by American Soldiers produced torrents of outrage from anti-war critics and the news media while Communist atrocities were so common that they received hardly any media mention at all. The United States sought to minimize and prevent attacks on civilians while North Vietnam made attacks on civilians a centerpiece of its strategy. Americans who deliberately killed civilians received prison sentences while Communists who did so received commendations. From 1957 to 1973, the National Liberation Front assassinated 36,725 Vietnamese and abducted another 58,499. The death squads focused on leaders at the village level and on anyone who improved the lives of the peasants such as medical personnel, social workers, and school teachers. - Nixon Presidential Papers

re: #23 littleoldlady

Just relax weight standards then start serving super-high-calorie meals. Then, when everyone weighs about twice as much as they used to you can claim that you have doubled the manpower of the military.

re: #113 DeathtotheSwiss

I doubt they would recognize a rank from a stop sigh.

re: #121 Syrah

Hmmm. . . That would result in the compulsory arming and training in the art of war everyone who they oppose ideologically.

seems. . . stupid.

One has to really work hard to be dumber than a Kossack.

Common Myths Dispelled:

Myth: Common Belief is that most Vietnam veterans were drafted. Fact: 2/3 of the men who served in Vietnam were volunteers. 2/3 of the men who served in World War II were drafted. Approximately 70% of those killed in Vietnam were volunteers.

Myth: The media have reported that suicides among Vietnam veterans range from 50,000 to 100,000 - 6 to 11 times the non-Vietnam veteran population. Fact: Mortality studies show that 9,000 is a better estimate. "The CDC Vietnam Experience Study Mortality Assessment showed that during the first 5 years after discharge, deaths from suicide were 1.7 times more likely among Vietnam veterans than non-Vietnam veterans. After that initial post-service period, Vietnam veterans were no more likely to die from suicide than non-Vietnam veterans. In fact, after the 5-year post-service period, the rate of suicides is less in the Vietnam veterans' group.

Myth: Common belief is that a disproportionate number of blacks were killed in the Vietnam War. Fact: 86% of the men who died in Vietnam were Caucasians, 12.5% were black, 1.2% were other races. Sociologists Charles C. Moskos and John Sibley Butler, in their recently published book "All That We Can Be," said they analyzed the claim that blacks were used like cannon fodder during Vietnam "and can report definitely that this charge is untrue. Black fatalities amounted to 12 percent of all Americans killed in Southeast Asia, a figure proportional to the number of blacks in the U.S. population at the time and slightly lower than the proportion of blacks in the Army at the close of the war."

Myth: Common belief is that the war was fought largely by the poor and uneducated. Fact: Servicemen who went to Vietnam from well-to-do areas had a slightly elevated risk of dying because they were more likely to be pilots or infantry officers. Vietnam Veterans were the best educated forces our nation had ever sent into combat. 79% had a high school education or better. Here are statistics from the Combat Area Casualty File (CACF) as of November 1993. The CACF is the basis for the Vietnam Veterans Memorial
(The Wall): Average age of 58,148 killed in Vietnam was 23.11 years.
(Although 58,169 names are in the Nov. 93 database, only 58,148 have both event date and birth date. Event date is used instead of declared dead date for some of those who were listed as missing in action) Deaths Average Age Total: 58,148, 23.11 years Enlisted: 50,274, 22.37 years Officers: 6,598, 28.43 years Warrants: 1,276, 24.73 years E1 525, 20.34 years
11B MOS: 18,465, 22.55 years

Myth: The common belief is the average age of an infantryman fighting in Vietnam was 19. Fact:: Assuming KIAs accurately represented age groups serving in Vietnam, the average age of an infantryman (MOS 11B) serving in Vietnam to be 19 years old is a myth, it is actually 22. None of the enlisted grades have an average age of less than 20. The average man who fought in World War II was 26 years of age.

Myth: The Common belief is that the domino theory was proved false. Fact: The domino theory was accurate. The ASEAN (Association of Southeast Asian Nations) countries, Philippines, Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore and Thailand stayed free of Communism because of the U.S. commitment to Vietnam. The Indonesians threw the Soviets out in 1966 because of America's commitment in Vietnam. Without that commitment, Communism would have swept all the way to the Malacca Straits that is south of Singapore and of great strategic importance to the free world. If you ask people who live in these countries that won the war in Vietnam, they have a different opinion from the American news media. The Vietnam War was the turning point for Communism.

re: #80 Nevergiveup

Well they need Doctors. I kinda feel ashamed sometimes that I jumped right in as LCDR, but I have been learning that Rank does have it's advantages. I am kinda learning on the fly so to speak. But I have never met a finer group of people.

Medical Corps doesn't count as real Navy. J/K! :)

re: #119 jaunte
THANK'S

Myth: The common belief is that the fighting in Vietnam was not as intense as in World War II. Fact: The average infantryman in the South Pacific during World War II saw about 40 days of combat in four years. The average infantryman in Vietnam saw about 240 days of combat in one year thanks to the mobility of the helicopter. One out of every 10 Americans who served in Vietnam was a casualty. 58,148 were killed and 304,000 wounded out of 2.7 million who served. Although the percent that died is similar to other wars, amputations or crippling wounds were 300 percent higher than in World War II ....75,000 Vietnam veterans are severely disabled. MEDEVAC helicopters flew nearly 500,000 missions. Over 900,000 patients were airlifted (nearly half were American). The average time lapse between wounding to hospitalization was less than one hour. As a result, less than one percent of all Americans wounded, who survived the first 24 hours, died. The helicopter provided unprecedented mobility. Without the helicopter it would have taken three times as many troops to secure the 800 mile border with Cambodia and Laos (the politicians thought the Geneva Conventions of 1954 and the Geneva Accords or 1962 would secure the border).

Myth: Kim Phuc, the little nine year old Vietnamese girl running naked from the napalm strike near Trang Bang on 8 June 1972.....shown a million times on American television....was burned by Americans bombing Trang Bang. Fact: No American had involvement in this incident near Trang Bang that burned Phan Thi Kim Phuc. The planes doing the bombing near the village were VNAF (Vietnam Air Force) and were being flown by Vietnamese pilots in support of South Vietnamese troops on the ground. The Vietnamese pilot who dropped the napalm in error is currently living in the United States. Even the AP photographer, Nick Ut, who took the picture, was Vietnamese. The incident in the photo took place on the second day of a three day battle between the North Vietnamese Army (NVA) who occupied the village of Trang Bang and the ARVN (Army of the Republic of Vietnam) who were trying to force the NVA out of the village. Recent reports in the news media that an American commander ordered the air strike that burned Kim Phuc are incorrect. There were no Americans involved in any capacity. "We (Americans) had nothing to do with controlling VNAF," according to Lieutenant General (Ret) James F. Hollingsworth, the Commanding General of TRAC at that time. Also, it has been incorrectly reported that two of Kim Phuc's brothers were killed in this incident. They were Kim's cousins not her brothers.

Myth: The United States lost the war in Vietnam. Fact: The American military was not defeated in Vietnam. The American military did not lose a battle of any consequence. From a military standpoint, it was almost an unprecedented performance. General Westmoreland quoting Douglas Pike, a professor at the University of California, Berkley a major military defeat for the VC and NVA.

THE UNITED STATES DID NOT LOSE THE WAR IN VIETNAM, THE SOUTH VIETNAMESE DID. Read on........

The fall of Saigon happened 30 April 1975, two years AFTER the American military left Vietnam. The last American troops departed in their entirety 29 March 1973.

How could we lose a war we had already stopped fighting? We fought to an agreed stalemate. The peace settlement was signed in Paris on 27 January 1973. It called for release of all U.S. prisoners, withdrawal of US. forces, limitation of both sides' forces inside South Vietnam and a commitment to peaceful reunification. The 140,000 evacuees in April 1975 during the fall of Saigon consisted almost entirely of civilians and Vietnamese military, NOT American military running for their lives. There were almost twice as many casualties in Southeast Asia (primarily Cambodia) the first two years after the fall of Saigon in 1975 then there were during the ten years the U.S. was involved in Vietnam. Thanks for the perceived loss and the countless assassinations and torture visited upon Vietnamese, Laotians, and Cambodians goes mainly to the American media and their undying support-by-misrepresentation of the anti-War movement in the United States.

As with much of the Vietnam War, the news media misreported and misinterpreted the 1968 Tet Offensive. It was reported as an overwhelming success for the Communist forces and a decided defeat for the U.S. forces. Nothing could be further from the truth. Despite initial victories by the Communists forces, the Tet Offensive resulted in a major defeat of those forces. General Vo Nguyen Giap, the designer of the Tet Offensive, is considered by some as ranking with Wellington, Grant, Lee and MacArthur as a great commander. Still, militarily, the Tet Offensive was a total defeat of the Communist forces on all fronts. It resulted in the death of some 45,000 NVA troops and the complete, if not total destruction of the Viet Cong elements in South Vietnam. The Organization of the Viet Cong Units in the South never recovered. The Tet Offensive succeeded on only one front and that was the News front and the political arena. This was another example in the Vietnam War of an inaccuracy becoming the perceived truth.

re: #119 jaunte

Here's a Wa-post article on the subject:

[Link: www.washingtonpost.com...]

But, I thought going into Iraq took us away from the "real" war in Afghanistan? That's what Obama is spouting off these days. Let's face it, the left does not want any war, with anybody and at anytime, no matter what is going on. "War is never the answer" is there mantra...

Nobody wants war, nobody wishes for it....sometimes though, there are evil men wishing to do evil things. To sit there and do bong hits, hoping they will just go away is not a good way to deal with them....sorry, KOS kiddies....

re: #14 katemaclaren

Kerry's joke. Some joke--it's viral with the Koskys.

Memorial Day. Let us remember that change is not always for the better. However, I wonder how quickly these orcs will turn around if Clinton, for whatever reason, becomes the nominee? That would be fun to watch.

The left is used to making quick 180's to follow whatever is the policy of the moment. They went from "Defend Spain against the fascist invaders" in 1938 to "Stop the Western warmongers" in 1939 when the Molotov/Von Ribbentrop pact was signed and then back to "Stop the fascist invaders" again when the Nazis invaded the Soviet Union in June 1941.

Nothing new under the sun.

re: #105 Syrah

The Ayers' Weather Underground Auxiliary.

Heh

Hattip to DanS a regular commenter at Grouchyoldcripple.com

re: #123 The Other Les

LOL.....Monty Python allusion, I love it!

re: #126 DeathtotheSwiss

Just relax weight standards then start serving super-high-calorie meals. Then, when everyone weighs about twice as much as they used to you can claim that you have doubled the manpower of the military.

Cthuhoo Approves!

[Link: www.macguff.fr...]

re: #80 Nevergiveup

Well they need Doctors. I kinda feel ashamed sometimes that I jumped right in as LCDR, but I have been learning that Rank does have it's advantages. I am kinda learning on the fly so to speak. But I have never met a finer group of people.

Seriously, when I was in I think Doctors started as Lieutenants, and lawyers as LT j.g.'s. Did they change it recently?

re: #131 Bob in Breckenridge

Medical Corps doesn't count as real Navy. J/K! :)

Well by that I assume you mean us Docs. The naval medics who serve with the marines sure do. But I get your point. Anyway I signed up to help those who do the real heavy lifting any way I can.

re: #130 JeremyR

A million up dings!

re: #125 JeremyR WOW! What a great post! And, iirc, in addition to the numbers you gave, some 350,000 of the men who served in country were wounded by enemy fire.
GREAT POST - THANK YOU FOR THAT.

re: #142 Bob in Breckenridge

Seriously, when I was in I think Doctors started as Lieutenants, and lawyers as LT j.g.'s. Did they change it recently?

I have a lot of experience. They count that as time served.

re: #145 realwest

RW,

A reply to your post one back.
BHO said McCain is running for Bush's third.

re: #46 JeremyR

Did you mean to say you get our country stuck blogging on Daily Kos?

Wow.. how very tolerant and progressive thinking...

re: #133 JeremyR

Follow to JR's excellent post.

Stolen Valor.
Excellent Book.

I would love to enlist. Unfortunately, I am 60, so I won't have the chance. Another problem is that if I were to enlist now, I would be to late. The Iraq war is ending with a victory for the United States and the people of Iraq. This will be obvious by September, and by the time anyone who volunteers today would get out of basic training.

re: #145 realwest

WOW! What a great post! And, iirc, in addition to the numbers you gave, some 350,000 of the men who served in country were wounded by enemy fire.
GREAT POST - THANK YOU FOR THAT.

You, my goodfriend are most welcome. DanS, the man who compiled it was a vietnam vet and works for the VA. He also does some history instruction.

re: #111 shifty

They're forgetting that anyone who votes for Obama should volunteer to invade pakistan pockyston.

fixed it for ya.

re: #139 Desert Dog

LOL.....Monty Python allusion, I love it!

Should have said Kegs of Beer.

re: #130 JeremyR

re: #133 JeremyR

re: #134 JeremyR
Please add these to my #145 - just GREAT POSTS and thank you - from a Vietnam Veteran!

re: #151 Robert Schwartz

I would love to enlist. Unfortunately, I am 60, so I won't have the chance. Another problem is that if I were to enlist now, I would be to late. The Iraq war is ending with a victory for the United States and the people of Iraq. This will be obvious by September, and by the time anyone who volunteers today would get out of basic training.

Unfortunately, I gotta feeling there are gonna be plenty of wars to fight going forward.

re: #96 Syrah

Do those twits at Kos really want a country where only those who have served in the nation's military should have voting rights?

Don't try to use logic with those morons.

re: #63 jcm

Speaking of moonbats....

Jessica Lange bashes Iraq war in graduation speech

If I spent $40K for an "education" and the best they could do for a commencement speaker was a washed-up "has been" actress/drug addict who is most famous for playing second fiddle to an oversized ape in a very bad movie from around 30 years ago, I'd be pissed.

/But that's just me.

re: #150 jcm It is indeed an excellent book - although - and I mean no harm to Burkett and Whitley (the authors) - there are a few errors in their otherwise superbly researched and written book, Stolen Valor.

re: #135 Desert Dog

Here are some more details:

Karl Rove: "In the wake of 9/11, conservatives believed it was time to unleash the might and power of the United States military against the Taliban; in the wake of 9/11 liberals believed it was time to submit a petition." Rove continued: "I am not joking. Submitting a petition is precisely what MoveOn.org did. It was a petition imploring the powers that be to 'use moderation and restraint in responding to the terrorist attacks against the United States.' "

[Link: www.nationalreview.com...]

Huffington Post perpetuates MoveOn lie about Afghan war
[Link: polnotes.typepad.com...]

OT
I'm watching my children watching Little Einsteins. I hate seeing a conspiracy in everything, but this bugs me. The "villain" in this episode is a jet, shaped like a f-15, (or on a non-conspiracy mig-29) but the paint job uses USAF colors.

re: #134 JeremyR
Tet was a crushing defeat for the North Vietnamese.
The Marine defense of Hue/Phu bai is considered a military masterpiece.
It was a political defeat for the U.S because Walter Cronkite showed up after all was secured and declared it a U.S defeat on CBS.
General Giap, in his papers claimed that they were ready to sue for peace, their defeat was so total. But Uncle Walter handed the enemy the victory.

re: #155 realwest

re: #133 JeremyR

re: #134 JeremyR
Please add these to my #145 - just GREAT POSTS and thank you - from a Vietnam Veteran!

IMHO JR's Vietnam mythbusting belongs along side Nekama's Troll Hammer.

JeremyR's Vietnam MythBuster!

Well all y'all it's been grand - even better than usual cause I got to be out here longer than I usually am, but I gotta go eat some lunch!
I hope you all have a GREAT DAY and that I get the chance to see you all down the road!

re: #161 Mars Needs Neocons

Make sure they read "Animal Farm."

re: #164 jcm

Seconded!

re: #161 Mars Needs Neocons
It's the villain in all the episodes that I've seen. Leave it to disney to frack up a nice little video series.

They're living in a September 10, 1968 world, man.

OK, I'm officially questioning Obama's intelligence AND

patriotism.

re: #135 Desert Dog

Let's face it, the left does not want any war, with anybody and at anytime, no matter what is going on. "War is never the answer" is there mantra...

Nailed it.

Imagine Obama going to war with a country and the moonbats yelling "we're going to kick their asses."

Won't ever happen.

re: #160 jaunte

Yes, I am guessing a petition would have been more effective than going over there and blowing them up. The same with Iraq, if we could have just send Bill Richardson over to give Saddam a big hug and a kiss, we could have avoided this entire Iraq mess too! Geez, the right is soooo stupid and/or evil.

Well, if you do not really believe in anything or hold anything dear, it is easy to change your stance on any issue and see nothing wrong with doing so......

re: #159 realwest

It is indeed an excellent book - although - and I mean no harm to Burkett and Whitley (the authors) - there are a few errors in their otherwise superbly researched and written book, Stolen Valor.

I'm not surprised. I appreciate it for it's place for setting the record straight.

The troops of Vietnam were also a Greatest Generation, and Vietnam was a valiant and noble cause.

I've let my kids watch dozens of times, guess I have to pay a little more attention to what they are pushing.

Thank god shows like Handy Manny aren't pushing some multicultural initiative.
/as if you didn't know.

The individual who wrote this diary is not a thinker, he is a specimen.

Here's one for you "alternative history" buffs:

I wonder how differently the Vietnam war might have turned out if there had been a blogosphere then to counter the lies of the media and the campus left.

re: #152 JeremyR

You, my goodfriend are most welcome. DanS, the man who compiled it was a vietnam vet and works for the VA. He also does some history instruction.

/When his meds are adjusted properly, you should have added. : )

My daughter graduated this May from Southern Virginia University- and her University President stoop up and said - "Due to some changes the presidential race - our original speaker is not available," instead they got the founder of the school - it was OK

but it was supposed to be MITT ROMNEY.

My health problems almost all go back to Vietnam and the Johnson administration. Kos can off himself.

re: #177 Wm T Sherman

The individual who wrote this diary is not a thinker, he is a specimen.

This kind of specimen?

re: #177 Wm T Sherman

The individual who wrote this diary is not a thinker, he is a specimen.

Ouch!

re: #173 Desert Dog

It's odd that the same people who would say they "Question Authority" have such an orientation to worship authority that they believe a Petition to someone is going to have a more powerful effect than military action.
They're obviously hoping some Authority will reward them.

re: #173 Desert Dog

Yes, I am guessing a petition would have been more effective than going over there and blowing them up. The same with Iraq, if we could have just send Bill Richardson over to give Saddam a big hug and a kiss, we could have avoided this entire Iraq mess too! Geez, the right is soooo stupid and/or evil.

Well, if you do not really believe in anything or hold anything dear, it is easy to change your stance on any issue and see nothing wrong with doing so......

And ask Saddam to stop creating those mass graves, and burying children alive in the graves - 98 children in one grave were buried ALIVE.

And Saddam the Monster Genocidal Butcher would say what? Okey dokey?

re: #23 littleoldlady

Question (only semi-OT)...

This is from Obama's website under "foreign policy":

Expand the Military: We have learned from Iraq that our military needs more men and women in uniform to reduce the strain on our active force. Obama will increase the size of ground forces, adding 65,000 soldiers to the Army and 27,000 Marines.

How do we "expand the military"?

/other than instituting a draft, that is?

I think a better question would be "Why does Obama want to expand the military if he's elected, since he plans to immediately withdraw all our troops from Iraq?"

Is he seriously planning to send an additional 100,000 troops to Afghanistan or something? If not, what's the point of his expansion?

re: #162 opnion

Tet was a crushing defeat for the North Vietnamese.
The Marine defense of Hue/Phu bai is considered a military masterpiece.
It was a political defeat for the U.S because Walter Cronkite showed up after all was secured and declared it a U.S defeat on CBS.
General Giap, in his papers claimed that they were ready to sue for peace, their defeat was so total. But Uncle Walter handed the enemy the victory.

Go tell that to that lunatic Walter Cronkite. He alone is mostly responsible for us losing in Nam. That fuckin' POS should have been hanged along side of Jane Fonda.

re: #184 jaunte

It's odd that the same people who would say they "Question Authority" have such an orientation to worship authority that they believe a Petition to someone is going to have a more powerful effect than military action.
They're obviously hoping some Authority will reward them.

Great point. During the great cultural revolution of th 60's & early 70's the non conformists showed a lot of conformity. They not only thought alike, but dressed alike. military apparel & long hair etc.
The "Revolution" got co opted by Madison Ave.

In regards to MoveOn and the Afghan war, Gateway Pundit has the goods:
[Link: gatewaypundit.blogspot.com...]
Here's the original petition:
[Link: bp0.blogger.com...]

re: #163 savage_nation

I felt sorry for old Kong. It's hard to watch that remake, being it was on the top of the Twin Towers.

How are ya, Bob?

Great savage! How about you? Are you home for the holiday?

Aren't the Kos kids cuddly little things?
/delusion mode off

re: #188 Bob in Breckenridge

Go tell that to that lunatic Walter Cronkite. He alone is mostly responsible for us losing in Nam. That fuckin' POS should have been hanged along side of Jane Fonda.

Well if it's any consolation if CBS created a show to honor Old Walter, nobody would see it now a days anyway.

re: #185 DistantThunder

And ask Saddam to stop creating those mass graves, and burying children alive in the graves - 98 children in one grave were buried ALIVE.

And Saddam the Monster Genocidal Butcher would say what? Okey dokey?

Well, if we showed him a........ PETITION....he would have stopped all of that nonsense.....GWB just likes killing people and making his oil buddies rich.....

re: #188 Bob in Breckenridge

Go tell that to that lunatic Walter Cronkite. He alone is mostly responsible for us losing in Nam. That fuckin' POS should have been hanged along side of Jane Fonda.

Cannot disagree with that. Cronkite for some reason was considered the most trusted man in America.
LBJ lamented, "If we have lost Cronkite we have lost the War."
It was only after Cronkite retired, that it became clear that he is a raging , leftie, loon.

re: #173 Desert Dog

Yes, I am guessing a petition would have been more effective than going over there and blowing them up. The same with Iraq, if we could have just send Bill Richardson over to give Saddam a big hug and a kiss, we could have avoided this entire Iraq mess too! Geez, the right is soooo stupid and/or evil.

Well, if you do not really believe in anything or hold anything dear, it is easy to change your stance on any issue and see nothing wrong with doing so......

Is the the Dreaded Petition before or after the Strongly Worded letter? I can never keep track.

re: #187 savage_nation

Alive? HUH?

Oh my God.....

Toddler with toys with bullet holes to the backs of their heads - and one grave had 98 children with no bullet wounds - the investigators surmise they were buried alive

Babies found in mass graves

US-led investigators have located nine trenches in Hatra containing hundreds of bodies believed to be Kurds killed during the repression of the 1980s.

The skeletons of unborn babies and toddlers clutching toys are being unearthed, the investigators said.

They are seeking evidence to try Saddam Hussein for crimes against humanity.

Tiny bones, femurs - thighbones the size of a matchstick
P Willey
US investigating anthropologist
It is believed to be the first time investigators working for the Iraqi Special Tribunal (IST) have conducted a full scientific exhumation of a mass grave.

"It is my personal opinion that this is a killing field," Greg Kehoe, an American working with the IST, told reporters in Hatra, south of the city of Mosul.

"Someone used this field on significant occasions over time to take bodies up there, and to take people up there and execute them."

When Kos Kids call this an "unnecessary war" I can sort of understand it, since almost all wars can be considered needless at some point of historical analysis ("if only Hitler had not invaded Poland", etc). But when they call it an "illegal war" that defies rational thought, because all war is, by definition, a replacement of one legality with another, by means other than the normal civil machinations.

re: #164 jcm

IMHO JR's Vietnam mythbusting belongs along side Nekama's Troll Hammer.

JeremyR's Vietnam MythBuster!

Please, the credit goes to DanS a Vietnam vet. The work was all his, I merely saved it to repost when ever needed.

If you’re going to help McCain get elected, you need to take responsibility for your actions.

Where as this circus clown believes that if you are going to help Obama get elected you will not have to take responsibility for anything.

Saddam was executing pregnant women

re: #179 Bob in Breckenridge

/When his meds are adjusted properly, you should have added. : )

Some one else who knows Dan I see. I try to be respectful of him even when off his meds.

re: #198 rawmuse

When Kos Kids call this an "unnecessary war" I can sort of understand it, since almost all wars can be considered needless at some point of historical analysis ("if only Hitler had not invaded Poland", etc). But when they call it an "illegal war" that defies rational thought, because all war is, by definition, a replacement of one legality with another, by means other than the normal civil machinations.

In hindsight we can almost always point out an inflection point at which the application of a show of force or small amount of violence would have altered the path.

It is seldom however that words would have bent the course of history.

re: #135 Desert Dog

"War is never the answer" is there mantra...

Except in Bosnia (Clinton), Vietnam (Kennedy), Korea (Truman), WW2, (FDR) WW1 (Wilson) etc.

I'm gonna go out and mow lawn for a little while.

One trench contains only women and children while another contains only men.

The body of one woman was found still clutching a baby. The infant had been shot in the back of the head and the woman in the face.

"The youngest foetus we have was 18 to 20 foetal weeks," said US investigating anthropologist P Willey.

"Tiny bones, femurs - thighbones the size of a matchstick."

Mr Kehoe investigated mass graves in the Balkans for five years but those burials mainly involved men of fighting age and the Iraqi finds were quite different, he said.

"I've been doing grave sites for a long time, but I've never seen anything like this, women and children executed for no apparent reason," he said.

re: #197 DistantThunder

This from your link:

Mr Kehoe said that work to uncover graves around Iraq, where about 300,000 people are thought to have been killed during Saddam Hussein's regime, was slow as experienced European investigators were not taking part.

The Europeans, he said, were staying away as the evidence might be used eventually to put Saddam Hussein to death.

Leftists must keep their hands clean.
/////

re: #201 DistantThunder

Saddam was executing pregnant women

That is the next step in Planned Parenthoods business model.

/ sarc...I think.

re: #207 DistantThunder

Wait till investigators get to the graves of NorKo.

The Koz Kiddies don't deserve to be called kids - they deserve to be called

GE's - Genocide Enablers

Somehow I have never been able to get beyond the impression that the people at Kos not only write trash but also induldge in large quantities of drugs. I wonder how much brain damage has been done and when will a sufficient amount of brain damage occur till they can no longer keep writing trash of any sort.

re: #43 MarkX

But that is just more O'Bambi BS. He has no intention of expanding the military. Pure BS to get the confused in the middle to vote for him.

I agree.  I'm sure that he's read Machiavelli's reasoning about why an idle free-standing army is a bad idea ...

}:)     [As well, he's promising them jobs by increasing the army ...]

re: #212 DistantThunder

The Koz Kiddies don't deserve to be called kids - they deserve to be called

GE's - Genocide Enablers

If it has an (R) in front of the name, most of those people would gladly be the first to buy the weapon and use it. They have made mental contortions that allow them to justify anything in their diseased minds.

re: #181 Son of the Black Dog

My health problems almost all go back to Vietnam and the Johnson administration. Kos can off himself.

* * *
Thank you for your service under ANY administration. Liberals can try to rewrite history but it remains a fact:

Democrat Pres. Kennedy sent advisors to Vietnam.
Democrat Pres. Johnson sent millions of Americans to Vietnam
Democrat Roosevelt sent millions of Americans to World War II.

Democrat President Truman sent US troops to die in Korea, under UN auspices so maybe that's a better, less bitter pill for liberals to swallow.

Democrat Pres. Clinton sent troops to Bosnia for that one year "war" that is now going on more than a decade.

It's rather surreal to read all the panicky from people who are not being asked or told to go anywhere or fight anything. Dudes! You don't want to go to fight 'cause it scares the crap out of you, what else is it? Be all noble and claim "illegal war?" Illegal by what standards? Congress authorized it. Yell at them, the Democrats who voted for it are worming around trying to blame Bush for their votes, "He lied to us." Really? Dont' they have very expensive and huge staffs to make sure they are properly informed? Isn't that really dodging responsibility? Why haven't they changed their vote then?
But the bottom line is you're terrified of dying by any means, and since life in the USA is so secure, the only dying looming would be on a battlefield or maybe "avian flu," and okay, a hypothetical scenario of Global Warming, which is like dying from falling out of your hammock strung between two palms trees flourishing in Wisconsin, and not having to ship in coconuts or bananas any more 'cause you can grow them locally. All very remote and far away from today's reality. But you focus obsessively and hysterically on those.
So, idiotically, to avoid going to a war run, and well managed and contained by a VOLUNTEER Army, vote for DEMOCRATS who want to reinstate the UNIVERSAL DRAFT, a far more comprehensive and oppressive DRAFT than EVER EVER seen outside of Communist nations. Obama and Hillary BOTH want a Universal DRAFT which includes MANDATORY VOLUNTEER for "ANY OTHER PURPOSE." The DEMOCRATS pull out their UNIVERSAL DRAFT BILL every now and then to see if they can make a vote stick on it. They are trying to make it a reality. To avoid fighting a foreign war, withdraw to Main Street USA and fight there.
Insanity as a concept really doesn't capture the grosteque essence of this.

re: #209 savage_nation

I'm printing that article out and the next scumbag I hear bitching about Iraq will get it in his/her fucking piehole!

Here's the article that talks about the 98 children - the New York Times of all places

The principal forensic witness was Michael K. Trimble, a 53-year-old forensic archaeologist from St. Louis temporarily assigned to the court from his career as a civilian employee of the Army Corps of Engineers. He told of finding tangled piles of victims, many with eyes blindfolded, wrists bound, and roped together chain-gang style; of one mother lying in death with her right hand clutching a baby in a padded blanket, who like the mother had been killed with a single pistol shot to the head; and of another mother with the bones of an unborn child that remained folded in her dress as her body decomposed.

Mr. Trimble, director of an international mass graves team, described other features of the killings: how men were separated from women and children before being herded in groups into the wedge-shaped pits; how some victims were forced to squat beside the graves while awaiting pistol shots to the backs of their heads; how others, standing in the pits, including girls as young as 5, were raked with automatic fire that had some raising arms and hands defensively, then “twisting and turning and trying to get away.”

Mr. Trimble gave figures indicating that at one mass grave, south of Samawa in Iraq’s southern desert, more than 600 automatic rifle rounds had been used to kill the 114 victims, 85 of them children, and that 12 of the dead had been struck by between 13 and 22 bullets each.

At two mass graves near Hatra, southwest of the northern city of Mosul, he said, a quarter of the 25 women killed and a similar proportion of the 98 children who died suffered no gunshot wounds, suggesting, though Mr. Trimble did not say so, that some may have been buried alive.

Among both adults and children at the Samawa site, he said, the largest number of bullets struck the victims’ legs, along with other strikes that shattered their skulls, spines, ribs, arms and hands. Mr. Trimble said the ballistic evidence conformed with something seen at mass grave sites elsewhere in the world, that the killers often squat and fire first at the victims’ legs. “And there’s a reason,” he said. “When you shoot people in the legs, and bring them down, it’s much easier to dispatch them.”

re: #161 Mars Needs Neocons

OT
I'm watching my children watching Little Einsteins. I hate seeing a conspiracy in everything, but this bugs me. The "villain" in this episode is a jet, shaped like a f-15, (or on a non-conspiracy mig-29) but the paint job uses USAF colors.

Big Jet is a recurring villain in that series, and I had exactly the same reaction that you did.

re: #214 savage_nation

No problem...deserves to be dinged. I hate Planned Parenthood as well as any group that abuses children in any form or fashion...RoP, etc.

re: #215 Kulhwch

he's promising them jobs by increasing the army

The average DKos poster would be rejected for enlistment.

Contrary to popular belief, only about 30% of today's 18-25 year olds would even meet the basic enlistment criteria.

I believe that after Saddam tried to assassinate Pres. Bush, Sr - set 700 oil wells on fire - and executed 300,000 innocent civilians - Pres. Bush decided that EVIL had to be crushed, and he was the man to do it. And had been told by all the surrounding countries that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction.

Pres. Bush was right.

I think that it is helpful to frame the discussion in terms of the current campaign.
It is constantly pointed out by Obama and his advocates that State Senator Barack Hussein Obama couragousy opposed the Iraq War from the beginning from Sprinfield, IL.
It was his brave and principaled stand, that changed Illinois Foreign policy.

I'm still trying to wrap my mind around how feces can use a keyboard.

re: #212 DistantThunder

The Koz Kiddies don't deserve to be called kids - they deserve to be called

GE's - Genocide Enablers

Some how GEs just don't have the same ring as Kos Kids!

re: #219 DistantThunder

Among both adults and children at the Samawa site, he said, the largest number of bullets struck the victims’ legs, along with other strikes that shattered their skulls, spines, ribs, arms and hands. Mr. Trimble said the ballistic evidence conformed with something seen at mass grave sites elsewhere in the world, that the killers often squat and fire first at the victims’ legs. “And there’s a reason,” he said. “When you shoot people in the legs, and bring them down, it’s much easier to dispatch them.”

Lovely people, these scum the Koslings keep trying to defend.

re: #214 savage_nation

No offence, but I dinged ya down that one.

/very very sensitive about anything to do with kids.

I think his intent was to be pro-child/ anti-Planned Parenthood...

re: #229 Spiny Norman

Confronting peaceniks with facts like these mass graves doesn't make them pause and think, it makes them angry because they don't want you upsetting their worldview. Their response for pictures of dead children is to say that "our military kills children too" or that "global corporate interests" lead to this kind of thing.

But it's ok to invade Burma and Dafur for humanitarian reasons, right?

I like the concept that voting comes along with certain consequences. If the man or woman you vote for ends up allowing genocide or enables our enemies to become super-powers then we too will be guilty.

I think a whole lot less people would vote.

My guess is many more will die if Obama is elected and those kooks get their wishes. Look how many died when John Forbes Kerry's dream came true...

re: #231 savage_nation

Yeah, I noticed that. Sorry if I jumped the gun...

what amazes me is how moonbats let that organization exist with it's racist underpinnings. But hey! it's OK if your founder was a bigot and you have an agenda as long as you let us rid the world of those wiley and dangerous unborn fetuses!

/hypocracy..thy name is liberal!

re: #233 wahabicorridor

But it's ok to invade Burma and Dafur for humanitarian reasons, right?

They only seem to support the military when the mission is humanitarin.
They only go mental when the military is used for its true intent.

re: #234 savage_nation

I see that sort of thinking on comment threads all over the place. It's idiotic, but popular.

re: #234 savage_nation

If someone said that to my face, he/she would be writhing in agony on the ground. Thats something I can never tolerate.

There is killed and there is executed. Our military does one on accident - while Saddam was ethnically cleansing. Liberals really can't tell the difference I know.

re: #241 savage_nation

I'm wondering why Planned Parenthood hasn't been shuttered by the government.

They make hundreds of millions a year - I think there are taxes involved - the government craves taxes regardless of the source.

The military overwhelmingly votes Republican (60-70%?). Almost daily the koskids' wish is granted; A soldier who won't vote for Obama is killed or maimed by an IED.

re: #244 buzzsawmonkey

Translation: they support the death of soldiers on the condition that the US derives no benefit.

Like Code Pink Nutjobs yelling for the "Marines," when they were having a problem with a car getting towed.
Heh.

obama is a democrat.
democrat's want to bring back the draft.
kkkids better realize this before their asses are drafted.

re: #249 savage_nation

Did they really? hahaha

They really did!

re: #249 savage_nation

Did they really? hahaha

Code Pink yells for help

While we were at the protest in Berkeley from 12 to 4 p.m., a white Volvo drove by and a man spat upon Code Pink. They chased him down the street and got into a verbal altercation. The police were NOWHERE in sight. That’s not the best part, ready for this? Medea Benjamin [co-founder of Code Pink] yelled, and I quote, “Marines!” She actually yelled for our help because this man had stepped out of his car. I even asked her if she was yelling Police and she told me, “I said Marines” then put her arm around my friend Allen (the Marine Vet). Ironic?

I thought it was a towing issue - it was an AGGRESSION issue.

Don’t worry, you’ll still be able to get election results from Baghdad,

But you won't be able to vote. Somehow or other, the bureaucrats have managed to tangle the mechanics of voting to the point that most of our men and women in the field cannot cast a ballot that will be delivered in time to count.

They can cast the ballot weeks early. Still, it is likely to not be delivered in time.

This really, really needs to be fixed, and time is running short.

re: #245 Killgore Trout

The military overwhelmingly votes Republican (60-70%?). Almost daily the koskids' wish is granted; A soldier who won't vote for Obama is killed or maimed by an IED.

which leads me to wonder how many military ballots won't be counted, or arrive "late" in November....

re: #241 savage_nation

/I'm wondering why Planned Parenthood hasn't been sued for false advertising since their name implies that they'll help you plan to be a parent.

We had that in MT last election. Almost all absentee ballots were disallowed due to arrival time.

I bet if LGF had a softball team, we could beat a KOS softball team.

re: #238 opnion

They only seem to support the military when the mission is humanitarin.
They only go mental when the military is used for its true intent.

Actually, they only like to call for such things when they know we won't do them.

If we were to actually use military force in Darfur or Burma, they'd protest that, too.

Hmmmmm.

I actually have been greatly enjoying the whole "chickenhawk" meme lately.

When I discuss events with liberal and they start in on how bad Darfur is or the merits of killing off the military junta of Burma, I point out their rationale in calling conservatives and Republicans "chickenhawks". If you advocate a military solution to an existing situation, then you're obliged to sign on up and personally take the risks associated with it.

So when my liberal friends start talking up Obama and how tough he's going to be on Iran and North Korea, I point out that I'll personally escort them to the local US Marines or US Army recruiting station so they can sign up as riflemen or infantry, whichever they prefer.

Boy that shuts their stinking pie holes like you wouldn't believe!

re: #257 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I bet if LGF had a softball team, we could beat a KOS softball team.

Yes, I'd like an aluminum bat please.

re: #257 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I bet if LGF had a softball team, we could beat a KOS softball team.

No doubt about that, FVB. Ever see the videos of lib girly-men who attempt to "throw" pies at Ann Coulter, Bill Kristol, etc? What sissies...

#257 Fat Bastard Vegetarian,

1st we would have to get the FD to hose their nasty a$$es down, and then the benches would prolly clear for a beat down by us before the 1st inning was over. HAHAHA!

re: #259 edr

Hmmmmm.

I actually have been greatly enjoying the whole "chickenhawk" meme lately.

When I discuss events with liberal and they start in on how bad Darfur is or the merits of killing off the military junta of Burma, I point out their rationale in calling conservatives and Republicans "chickenhawks". If you advocate a military solution to an existing situation, then you're obliged to sign on up and personally take the risks associated with it.

So when my liberal friends start talking up Obama and how tough he's going to be on Iran and North Korea, I point out that I'll personally escort them to the local US Marines or US Army recruiting station so they can sign up as riflemen or infantry, whichever they prefer.

Boy that shuts their stinking pie holes like you wouldn't believe!

I don't have any lib friends. I'm picky about the company I keep.

If any of you lizards are just starting at the end of this thread,be sure to go back to post #125 and read Jeremy R's series on the Vietnam War...Facts and Myths.
MUST READING, especially this weekend.

That's all tempting, but I intend to celebrate Big Ears defeat in my own living room, knocking back some beers and making fun of psychologically depleted leftards as they scramble around like an upset antfarm - not knowing whether to blame Hillary, McCain or Bush for the cave-in their meaningless lives have become.

re: #258 lobo91

Actually, they only like to call for such things when they know we won't do them.

If we were to actually use military force in Darfur or Burma, they'd protest that, too.

What i'm thinking of is the way our military was used after the Tsunami.
You know delivering supplies & basiically acting like the Peace Corps.
I am reminde of one of our troops handing a package to a guy with a Bin Laden T shirt on
I believe that it was Indonesia, that made the Marines return to the ships at night, so that infidels would not defile Muslim land.
Liberals saw no problem.

re: #257 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I bet if LGF had a softball team, we could beat a KOS softball team.

Paint ball might be more satisfying.

Ok, this is your Miracle Marine story of the day.

re: #268 jcm

Paint ball might be more satisfying.

But if they all bowl like Obama ...

re: #257 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I bet if LGF had a softball team, we could beat a KOS softball team.

Ewe got thet wright. Eye think eye kan spel more better two.

re: #268 jcm

Paint ball might be more satisfying.

Or MMA.