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Friday Early Morning Open

Fri, Jun 6, 2008 at 3:17:22 am PDT

When neither their property nor their honor is touched, the majority of men live content.

Niccolo Machiavelli

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851 comments

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1 BignJames  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:20:45am

Don't forget the remote.

2 redc1c4  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:22:34am

open *this*!

3 littleoldlady  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:23:02am

And the beer...

Good day, ALL!™

4 redc1c4  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:25:29am

re: #3 littleoldlady

And the beer...

Good day, ALL!™

good day, bad day, it's all the same day man.....

5 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:28:43am

You know, RR was The Great Communicator.

We'll end up calling Obama The Great Clarifier.

Morning kiddie poos!

6 LeftJustAintRight  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:28:57am

Obama Carter 08 !

7 Killian Bundy  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:31:17am
Khalid Sheikh Mohammed said Thursday that he would welcome the death penalty

/death by freefall, give him a few minutes to think about it

8 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:31:42am

I'm quite content.

hi!

9 BignJames  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:32:21am

re: #7 Killian Bundy

Push him off......say the Sears Tower.

10 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:33:08am

re: #9 BignJames

Push him off......say the Sears Tower.

Nah, how about the new "Islam tallest building in world"
aka Burj Dubai.

push him off that.

11 Neo Con since 9-11  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:33:27am

night all. My cat, Bob, insists I get a couple hours sleep so I can safely drive my bobcat tomorrow so I can bring home tuna.

12 redc1c4  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:33:35am

re: #5 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

You know, RR was The Great Communicator.

We'll end up calling Obama The Great Clarifier.

Morning kiddie poos!

i'm thinking "Lying POS" will roll of the tongue easier and with less retching.... %-)

/and be more accurate too!

13 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:34:19am

re: #11 Neo Con since 9-11

night all. My cat, Bob, insists I get a couple hours sleep so I can safely drive my bobcat tomorrow so I can bring home tuna.

Yet Teach a cat to fish.....


/snicker @ the thought of teaching a cat anything....

14 redc1c4  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:36:07am

re: #7 Killian Bundy

/death by freefall, give him a few minutes to think about it

i like my idea from a few threads back: death by nursing home.....

/massive organ failure, caused by sepsis, induced by MRSA from untreated bed sores and an indwelling catheter.

15 redc1c4  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:36:48am

re: #13 Hengineer

Yet Teach a cat to fish.....


/snicker @ the thought of teaching a cat anything....

they teach us.

/but we never learn %-)

16 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:36:50am

Mornin' all. Another hot day in store -- low 90s.

Watched "Tora, Tora, Tora" with the boys last night. I'd forgotten how good it is.

17 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:37:39am

re: #16 Lucius Septimius

Mornin' all. Another hot day in store -- low 90s.

Watched "Tora, Tora, Tora" with the boys last night. I'd forgotten how good it is.

I'm afraid we've woken a sleeping giant.


/nuff said

18 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:37:48am

re: #10 Hengineer

Nah, how about the new "Islam tallest building in world"
aka Burj Dubai.

push him off that.

Hell no.
Push him off a twelve foot wall; then march him back up to the top of the wall.
Push him off again. "Oh he sprained an ankle".
March him back up; push him off again, "Oh, he broke a wrist."
March him back up, etc.

Tonight we're gonna party like its 799.

19 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:38:35am

re: #18 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Hell no.
Push him off a twelve foot wall; then march him back up to the top of the wall.
Push him off again. "Oh he sprained an ankle".
March him back up; push him off again, "Oh, he broke a wrist."
March him back up, etc.

Tonight we're gonna party like its 799.

We going to do that, might as well have an old-fashioned stoning...

20 redc1c4  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:43:14am

re: #19 Hengineer

We going to do that, might as well have an old-fashioned stoning...

feed him nothing but MRE's and 2 canteens of water a day.

/he'll explode

21 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:43:40am

re: #19 Hengineer

We going to do that, might as well have an old-fashioned stoning...

"I got a rock."
Charlie Brown (Trick or Treating with friends on Halloween special)

22 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:44:38am

re: #19 Hengineer

Too cruel? To barbaric? Too Muslim?

23 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:45:43am

re: #22 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Too cruel? To barbaric? Too Muslim?

Nah, feed him a soup, then later tell him that it was made from pork gravy...

24 mikeinmd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:46:02am

re: #7 Killian Bundy

/death by freefall, give him a few minutes to think about it

Could use him for target practice while he's falling. We can hit satellites, and there not much bigger than a womp rat.

25 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:46:08am

re: #17 Hengineer

/nuff said

I think the giant needs to wake up again. It's been snoozing for way too long.

26 redc1c4  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:48:22am

re: #21 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

"I got a rock."
Charlie Brown (Trick or Treating with friends on Halloween special)

how about we keelhaul the bastiges?

/get some w*rk out of Henniger %-)

27 redc1c4  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:49:14am

gotta go to bed..... 2H6 will be getting up soon.

/whoops! %-)

28 Dar ul Harbarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:49:41am

LOL
Thinking about the future

CHICAGO—As the 2008 presidential election draws closer, Democrat Barack Obama has reportedly been working tirelessly with his top political strategists to perfect his looking-off-into-the-future pose, which many believe is vital to the success of the Illinois senator's campaign.

When performed correctly, the pose involves Obama standing upright with his back arched and his chest thrust out, his shoulders positioned 1.3 feet apart and opened slightly at a 14-degree angle, and his eyes transfixed on a predetermined point between 500 and 600 yards away. Advisers say this creates the illusion that Obama is looking forward to a bright future, while the downturned corners of his lips indicate that he acknowledges the problems of the present.

29 Buster Bunny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:50:26am

Poor ol Machievelli

Nice guy .. pissed off some Italian stooge called Medici and he's had the reputation of a badass ever since.

Shows you .. good intentions and politics have been blurred for an awful long time.

/Bongiorno Bunny

30 eon  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:52:30am

re: #22 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Too cruel? To barbaric? Too Muslim?

Morning, Lizards.

I'm sort of a traditionalist, here. If he wants to be "martyred", fine. I say we do it the traditional Islamic way, as depicted in Tom Clancy's The Sum Of All Fears. Namely, behead him in the town square, at noon, with a single stroke of a very sharp sword.

Then cremate the remains and scatter them to the winds.

As I understand it, this would mean that at best, he would arrive in Paradise looking rather like the Headless Horseman. More likely, he would arrive there looking more like something you would compost your flowers with. Either way, he will have no use for any virgins.

As for "martyrdom", again quoting from Clancy:



"Martyrs all have the same thing in common. They're dead."

- Jack Ryan


cheers

eon

31 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:52:48am

re: #29 Buster Bunny

"Wicked Nick" is how he's referred to in our house; my Lovely Bride is a Machiavelli scholar, which means dinner time is always an adventure.

32 yochanan  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:53:11am

[Link: www.suntimes.com...]

this is a puff piece but even it has info that is harmful to obama

33 mikeinmd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:54:00am

BTW, Google found time out of their busy schedule to celebrate Diego Velazquez...

34 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:54:17am

re: #28 Dar ul Harbarian

LOL
Thinking about the future

It warms my heart to know Obama is concentrating on " National Security" issues.

35 offendi  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:54:45am

The trial of that fat slob Sheik-ie is just what we need to remind the country that the election is not just about the price of gas.

36 Render  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:56:01am

I'd prefer to keep the bastard locked away in solitary Supermax obscurity for the rest of his life with no possibility of parole.

NO
SUNLIGHT,
R

37 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:56:04am

re: #32 yochanan

[Link: www.suntimes.com...]

this is a puff piece but even it has info that is harmful to obama

Your in Chicago right? Can't sleep? I'd be sleeping like a rock if my team were playing like the Cubs.

38 offendi  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:56:39am

Grant his wish, but rub him down with pig fat before he goes.

39 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:56:39am

re: #35 offendi

How much weight did he gain in "Club Gitmo"?

40 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:57:37am

re: #26 redc1c4

how about we keelhaul the bastiges?

/get some w*rk out of Henniger %-)

haven't seen that yet, but we could start it back up again.

we could hang him from a yardarm

41 offendi  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:58:08am

re: #39 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

How much weight did he gain in "Club Gitmo"?

Just some water weight from the "boarding". Hopefully.

42 LeftJustAintRight  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:59:03am

Listening to Quinn & Rose this morning
Quinn seems to think Hillary is not finished Hussein Obama
Because she only suspended her campaign and still controlls her delegates
Hmmmmmm ?

43 Fredlike  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:59:07am

Morning all, Hot Today, Hotter this weekend. Well at least I got my AC in the van fixed.

Been reading Liberal Fascism by Jonah.Goldberg (got it along with Moment of Truth by Michael Yon, also a good book). He really presents a good case for the existence of the Fascist left, I have not finished it yet so I don't think Barry is in it but lots of the things he says really fits the model. The amount of government control Wilson and Roosevelt put in place makes Bush seem like the good fairy. Roosevelt had a heavy thumb on the population well before WWII. One story was very informative, after they imposed price controls they convicted a tailor of pressing a suit for 35 cents instead of the required 40 cents, he got 7 months.

44 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 3:59:43am

re: #32 yochanan

[Link: www.suntimes.com...]

this is a puff piece but even it has info that is harmful to obama

Unfortunately the people caught up in the aura won't care. The average Obama supporter is so enamored of the image that they will not look to see the man behind it.

45 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:00:24am

re: #43 Fredlike

Morning all, Hot Today, Hotter this weekend. Well at least I got my AC in the van fixed.

Been reading Liberal Fascism by Jonah.Goldberg (got it along with Moment of Truth by Michael Yon, also a good book). He really presents a good case for the existence of the Fascist left, I have not finished it yet so I don't think Barry is in it but lots of the things he says really fits the model. The amount of government control Wilson and Roosevelt put in place makes Bush seem like the good fairy. Roosevelt had a heavy thumb on the population well before WWII. One story was very informative, after they imposed price controls they convicted a tailor of pressing a suit for 35 cents instead of the required 40 cents, he got 7 months.

There is just as much of a fascist right as a fascist left.

Granted we haven't had one in power here as much as say, Afghanistan, but the Taliban was VERY much a fascist right, as theocracies are.

46 goddessoftheclassroom  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:00:50am

re: #29 Buster Bunny

Poor ol Machievelli

Nice guy .. pissed off some Italian stooge called Medici and he's had the reputation of a badass ever since.

Shows you .. good intentions and politics have been blurred for an awful long time.

/Bongiorno Bunny

The Teacher:
A Riff on Machiavelli's The Prince,
Replacing Prince with Teacher, His with Her, State with Classroom, and Men with Students
By goddessoftheclassroom

I say that every Teacher should desire to be accounted merciful and not cruel. Nevertheless, she should be on her guard against the abuse of this quality of mercy. Cesare Borgia was reputed cruel, yet his cruelty restored Romagna, united it, and brought it to order and obedience; so that if we look at things in their true light, it will be seen that he was in reality far more merciful than the people of Florence, who, to avoid the imputation of cruelty, suffered Pistoja to be torn to pieces by factions.

A Teacher should therefore disregard the reproach of being thought cruel where it enables her to keep her students united and obedient. For she who quells disorder by a very few signal examples will in the end be more merciful than she who from too great leniency permits things to take their course and so to result in rapine and bloodshed; for these hurt the whole Classroom, whereas the severities of the Teacher injure individuals only.

And for a new Teacher, of all others, it is impossible to escape a name for cruelty, since new Classrooms are full of dangers. Wherefore Virgil, by the mouth of Dido, excuses the harshness of her reign on the plea that it was new, saying: A fate unkind, and newness in my reign Compel me this to guard a wide domain Nevertheless, the new Teacher should not be too ready of belief, nor too easily set in motion; not should she herself be the first to raise alarms; but should so temper prudence with kindliness that too great confidence in others shall not throw her off her guard, nor groundless distrust render her insupportable.

And here comes the question whether it is better to be loved rather than feared, or feared rather than loved. It might perhaps be answered that we should wish to be both; but since love and fear can hardly exist together, if we must choose between them, it is far safer to be feared than loved. For of students it may generally be affirmed that they are thankless, fickle, false, studious to avoid danger, greedy of gain, devoted to you while you are able to confer benefits upon them, and ready, as I said before, while danger is distant, to shed their blood, and sacrifice their property, their lives, and their children for you; but in the hour of need they turn against you.

The Teacher, therefore, who without otherwise securing herself builds wholly on their professions is undone. For the friendships which we buy with a price, and do not gain by greatness and nobility of character, though they may be fairly earned are not made good, but fail us when we have occasion to use them

47 godfrey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:00:53am

Ah, a Friday morning. Good morning, lizards. Speaking of being contented with untouched property, it looks like Ireland might vote "no" on the Lisbon Treaty EU Constitution. "More taxes, less power" is the anti-EU message. Funny: they sound like the main planks of Obama's platform.

48 yochanan  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:00:54am

re: #37 Nevergiveup

Your in Chicago right? Can't sleep? I'd be sleeping like a rock if my team were playing like the Cubs.

i want the cubs to make it to the w.s. and then get beaten by the CHICAGO WHITE SOXS.

49 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:01:42am

re: #48 yochanan

i want the cubs to make it to the w.s. and then get beaten by the CHICAGO WHITE SOXS.

Could have guessed that if you're a SunTimes reader.

50 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:02:05am

re: #47 godfrey

Ah, a Friday morning. Good morning, lizards. Speaking of being contented with untouched property, it looks like Ireland might vote "no" on the Lisbon Treaty EU Constitution. "More taxes, less power" is the anti-EU message. Funny: they sound like the main planks of Obama's platform.

Everybody seems to want the benefits of taxation without having to pay for it.

51 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:02:22am

re: #46 goddessoftheclassroom

Mornin' Goddess.

I've always thought I'd like to rewrite the Prince as a parenting manual. "Machiavellian Mommy" or some such.

52 000G  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:02:49am

honor shmonor

53 yochanan  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:03:02am

[Link: www.chicagotribune.com...]

BLAGO will be tossed under the bus to help obama other wise some will go after obama for tony rezko

54 Killian Bundy  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:04:26am

re: #36 Render

I'd prefer to keep the bastard locked away in solitary Supermax obscurity for the rest of his life with no possibility of parole.

NO
SUNLIGHT,
R

/give him a roommate

55 eon  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:04:49am

re: #28 Dar ul Harbarian

We're working on the squinting

Gee, Clint Eastwood had that down cold forty years ago.

He could at least go for a Jimmy Stewart "stern but resolute" look, like in Mr. Smith Goes To Washington.

Of course, the main danger is that at some point, he'll lapse into the "upthrust arm and arched back while screaming about 'Czechoslovakia Israel is part of Minehead Gaza, already!'" look, sort of like Mr. Hilter.

/old Monty Python routines never die- they just look less and less fanciful

The problem with the Onion is, how do you parody people who, in real life, insist on being strange and expect you to pretend not to notice?

/oh, and make them President, too

cheers

eon

56 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:05:13am

re: #54 Killian Bundy

/give him a roommate

/good ol' boy from Texas who is in for hate crimes (preferably of the KKK variety)

57 yochanan  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:05:21am

re: #54 Killian Bundy

a big horny roommate.

58 abolitionist  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:05:29am

re: #43 Fredlike

... Roosevelt had a heavy thumb on the population well before WWII. One story was very informative, after they imposed price controls they convicted a tailor of pressing a suit for 35 cents instead of the required 40 cents, he got 7 months.

Somehow I had the notion price controls involved upper limits on prices. I can only imagine some prison warden put in a request for a taylor, and the requisition was fulfilled.

59 godfrey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:06:22am

re: #51 Lucius Septimius

I always thought that if the Prince did all that Machiavelli says he should do, he would surely soon be found out and murdered. Was Machiavelli goading this on? His Discourses are all about republics and civic virtues ... was he really anti- Prince?

60 goddessoftheclassroom  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:06:34am

re: #51 Lucius Septimius

Mornin' Goddess.

I've always thought I'd like to rewrite the Prince as a parenting manual. "Machiavellian Mommy" or some such.

{Lucius Septimius}

When I was a new teacher, I'll admit that I wanted to be loved, and I was sometimes too "nice" rather than "just."

61 eon  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:10:24am

re: #42 LeftJustAintRight

Listening to Quinn & Rose this morning
Quinn seems to think Hillary is not finished Hussein Obama
Because she only suspended her campaign and still controlls her delegates
Hmmmmmm ?

She's already got her fallback plan ready, namely for the convention.

Best guess- she'll hold onto enough delegates to prevent a first-ballot nomination. Then, when delegates are released for the second, offer a "compromise", like (Eugene) McCarthy in Chicago in '68. That "compromise" being herself with the Obameister as her running mate.

Meanwhile, in the streets outside, every kook and zany to the left of Ned Lamont will be busy trying to turn Denver into Woodstock- with extra Molotov Cocktails for everybody.

Call it "Days of Rage- The Next Generation".

/anybody else making popcorn?


cheers

eon

62 Fredlike  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:16:11am

re: #45 Hengineer

The main theme of the book is that all Fascists are in fact left wing. Hitler, Mussolini, FDR, Wilson were all very much lefties. The Fascists were called right wing by the communist because even though they were both socialist, national versus internationalist, they may have been slightly to the right.

Most Islamic regimes are very much modeled on either the national socialist or communists model. The exceptions are the theocracies like the Taliban and Iran, but even there they are not typical of the US right which stands for personnel freedom and smaller government. In practice they follow the left wing ideal of government control of everything (this assumes they are in power of course)

I'm not going to be able to rewrite the whole book here and I haven't finished it yet. One thing to remember though is that after WWII Fascism become identified with anti-semitism and other evils. Prior to the war it was seen as a different model of government not evil. Goldberg calls the US version nice fascism in that there was very little brutality involve, and not the total rejection of christianity that was seen in Europe.

The collective, the nanny state, it takes a village, all very good fascist themes.

Off to work now, have fun all.

63 Fredlike  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:17:56am

re: #58 abolitionist

They were fighting deflation so the price controls were for minimum prices.

Didn't work any better than the Nixon upper bound price controls as you might expect.

64 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:18:24am

re: #60 goddessoftheclassroom

{Lucius Septimius}

When I was a new teacher, I'll admit that I wanted to be loved, and I was sometimes too "nice" rather than "just."

Me too -- actually what I wanted was for them to share my passion. I had to learn that not everyone will, and that you have to pitch things differently to different people; you can't present an idea once or in only one way, but multiple ways. I also learned to draw on my background in theater and stand-up -- I can work a crowd pretty well and am a good story teller.

Sometimes you have to trick people into thinking.

65 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:19:52am

Morning Lizards!

66 eon  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:20:52am

Well, like Fredlike, I have to run, too.

Have a great day, Lizards.

cheers

eon

67 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:22:10am

re: #62 Fredlike

The main theme of the book is that all Fascists are in fact left wing. Hitler, Mussolini, FDR, Wilson were all very much lefties. The Fascists were called right wing by the communist because even though they were both socialist, national versus internationalist, they may have been slightly to the right.

Most Islamic regimes are very much modeled on either the national socialist or communists model. The exceptions are the theocracies like the Taliban and Iran, but even there they are not typical of the US right which stands for personnel freedom and smaller government. In practice they follow the left wing ideal of government control of everything (this assumes they are in power of course)

I'm not going to be able to rewrite the whole book here and I haven't finished it yet. One thing to remember though is that after WWII Fascism become identified with anti-semitism and other evils. Prior to the war it was seen as a different model of government not evil. Goldberg calls the US version nice fascism in that there was very little brutality involve, and not the total rejection of christianity that was seen in Europe.

The collective, the nanny state, it takes a village, all very good fascist themes.

Off to work now, have fun all.

My point is that there are multiple kinds of "rights". There is the Religious Right, which is actually almost fascist, in that it does wish to control more, to "nanny-state" people from doing "bad things" and then the rest of the "Right" which IS for smaller government.

I do concede that most of the most famous fascists of modern era who've come to power HAVE been of the left-wing variety, that doesn't mean that there are no such thing as right-wing fascists.

Think of politics as a 2-d instead of 1-d scale. Left-Right is liberal-conservative, and Up-Down is Fascist-Anarchist.

One can be Right wing, and still want MORE government (cough)....Huckabee ....(cough)

68 abolitionist  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:22:57am

re: #63 Fredlike

Thanks.

In other news, the times they are a changing, and you don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows.

Guess who's endorsing Obama

69 mikeinmd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:23:59am

Anti-crime `street teams' to mobilize in St. Louis

Plans also call for partnering with other groups to mentor young people, and regular neighborhood summits.

How long before CAIR inserts their Ameriphobic probiscus into this program ?

70 Render  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:24:19am

re: #54 Killian Bundy

Terrible Tommy Silverstein comes to mind.

NON
CONTACT,
R

71 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:24:43am

re: #59 godfrey

I always thought that if the Prince did all that Machiavelli says he should do, he would surely soon be found out and murdered. Was Machiavelli goading this on? His Discourses are all about republics and civic virtues ... was he really anti- Prince?

Yes and no.

Machiavelli's idea is a Prince who establishes a Republic -- the four "founders" he discusses (Moses, Cyrus, Theseus, and Romulus) all did that to an extent. But you need an initial lawgiver, someone to create and initially enforce the new modes and orders (i.e., laws, customs, social structures, governing institutions) around which the state and society is organized. A prince -- like Moses -- who can create particularly effective modes and orders can create a state which will endure in spite of whatever is thrown against it. His comments about the Church, an institution he both admires and abhors, are instructive -- they have orders grown old with religion; they do not enforce them yet people obey, they do not govern and yet people remain under them. The modes and orders of Christianity may not provide the best foundation for a state, but they are amazingly effective.

As for the persona of the Prince, I would suggest that for Machiavelli, the republican citizen must have the virtues of the prince; in a polity where power -- executive and legislative -- is shared out among the citizens, the citizens must be able and willing to take that burden seriously, which means that they must become princes themselves lest they lose their liberty.

72 goddessoftheclassroom  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:25:21am

re: #64 Lucius Septimius

Me too -- actually what I wanted was for them to share my passion. I had to learn that not everyone will, and that you have to pitch things differently to different people; you can't present an idea once or in only one way, but multiple ways. I also learned to draw on my background in theater and stand-up -- I can work a crowd pretty well and am a good story teller.

Sometimes you have to trick people into thinking.

Absolutely. I love throwing out statements contrary to the conventional wisdom and seeing their looks of shock at my blasphemy. For instance, one student said something along the lines of "everything is relative"; I shot back with, "No, it isn't. There is right and wrong, good and evil, and actions fall into one of those two categories. You can rationalize an action, you can explain mitigating circumstances, but it doesn't change the nature of the action itself."

A terrific discussion followed...

With junior high kids, I try to make my class something they look forward to; if I can create a positive atmosphere, it helps break down some of the resistance.

A few years ago, a kid told me, "I really hate English, but I love your class."

73 Killian Bundy  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:25:51am

Military shoots down missile in test off Hawaii

The U.S. military intercepted a ballistic missile Thursday in the first such sea-based test since a Navy cruiser shot down an errant satellite earlier this year.

The military fired the target, a Scud-like missile with a range of a few hundred miles, from a decommissioned amphibious assault ship near Hawaii's island of Kauai.

The USS Lake Erie, based at Pearl Harbor, fired two interceptor missiles that shot down the target in its final seconds of flight about 12 miles above the Pacific Ocean.

/kiss this technology goodbye

74 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:26:46am

re: #68 abolitionist

I remember back when all of the folk singers, rock and rollers, and Hollywood types were shillin' for the Bushes, Dole, Nixon, Ford, Eisenhower, etc. When did that change?

75 Killian Bundy  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:28:06am

re: #70 Render

Terrible Tommy Silverstein comes to mind.

NON
CONTACT,
R

Ooh, Aryan Brotherhood.

/nice touch

76 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:28:12am

re: #72 goddessoftheclassroom

You are going to be a helluva a Drama Teacher.

77 goddessoftheclassroom  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:28:22am

re: #65 rightside

Morning Lizards!

{rightside}

Good morning!

78 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:28:45am

Interesting Political Quiz that looks at various DIFFERENT ways you can view things.
[Link: politicalquiz.net...]


The following are your scores. They are based on a gradual range of 0 to 12. For instance, a Conservative/Progressive score of 3 and 0 will both yield a result of social conservative, yet 0 would be an extreme conservative and 3 a moderate conservative

Conservative/Progressive score: 5
You are a social moderate. You think the progressive movement is overall well meaning, but sometimes it goes too far. On issues like abortion and affirmative action, you see the negatives of both extremes on the issue. You probably value religion, but at the same time you think it should still stay separate from the government

Capitalist Purist/Social Capitalist score: 0
You're a Capitalist Purist. You believe that the market should be completely free, and that the invisible hand of the market will make sure that the people get what they want and will do it in the most efficient way possible. You believe in small government, less taxes, and more privatization.

Libertarian/Authoritarian score: 7
You're a Moderate. You think that we all have certain inalienable rights that must be protected, but that sometimes laws need to be made to protect the majority's lives or quality of lives. You might think that the 2nd amendment isn't necessary anymore because letting everyone a gun is extremely dangerous to the community. You might also be against illegal drug use or public pornography because of its possible harmful effects to society.

Pacifist/Militarist score: 9
You're a Militarist. You believe that since the United States has so much power in the world, it has a responsibility to keep the world safe. You think that if the US does not exert its power in the world, it may eventually lose its power, and that we can not look weak in the face of terrorists, and must take them out where they live.

Overall, you would most likely fit into the category of Republican

79 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:29:06am
80 laZardo  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:30:35am

re: #74 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

When the Cold War ended and now that we were the only superpower, we should only use our powers for good.

/"good" being very narrowly defined in this case.

//Such as GOOD EVENING Y'ALL.

81 mikeinmd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:31:10am

For GOTC :

Can you spell 'education?' This school can't ...

WESTLAKE, Ohio (AP) -- A Cleveland-area principal says he's embarrassed his students got proof of their "educaiton" on their high school diplomas.

82 goddessoftheclassroom  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:31:15am

re: #76 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

You are going to be a helluva a Drama Teacher.

(blushing) Why, thank you!

I've got to run, Lizards--inservice workshops to write new curriculum...

83 zionista  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:31:40am

I Chose Against University of California Irvine Because of Hate Speech
I Chose Against University of California Irvine Because of Hate Speech
Spencer Morgan June 2nd 2008

Poughkeepsie, NY
I am a student in college and have been hearing many stories about Israel and America on the campus that make my skin crawl.
I was accepted to University California Irvine, but decided against it. I heard Allyson Rowen Taylor speak at a Chabad event and she discussed the issues on the campus to a room filled with parents who had no idea what was going on in the public arena. After reading about UCI online, and speaking with others who have seen the campus antics, I decided to go elsewhere, not only for reasons of the intense hatred of Jews at UCI, but because I wanted to be free of the "apartheid walls" and the vitriol of speakers who create hate with my fellow students. I searched for a campus with high academics where study was a priority, and the influence of the MSU was minimal if not absent. While there are issues at my campus, they are tiny compared to the issues of the UCI campus.
Thank you for opening the eyes of others who have no idea what is happening to our universities.
Spencer Morgan is a member of the Vassar Class of 2011.
[Link: www.thecuttingedgenews.com...]

[Link: shariahfinancewatch.wordpress.com...]

84 yochanan  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:31:45am

re: #49 Lucius Septimius

the sun times is a bird cage liner now was a decent paper when Black ran it.

the tribune is tinged with anti semitism sometimes right in the open

85 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:33:00am

re: #77 goddessoftheclassroom

{goddess}

86 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:34:30am

Mr. Rightside!

hullo the house!

87 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:35:46am

re: #79 buzzsawmonkey

Here, here.

Obama is frightening; it is only the shortest of steps from "identity politics" to the worst excesses of Totalitarianism.

88 JamesTKirk  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:36:39am

re: #10 Hengineer

Nah, how about the new "Islam tallest building in world"
aka Burj Dubai.

push him off that.

Imagine the car swarm around whatever vehicle he impacts.

89 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:36:57am

re: #84 yochanan

the sun times is a bird cage liner now was a decent paper when Black ran it.

the tribune is tinged with anti semitism sometimes right in the open

A shame too; I used to like the Tribune, but can't read it any more.

The SunTimes was perfect for reading on the train.

90 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:37:40am

re: #88 JamesTKirk

Imagine the car swarm around whatever vehicle he impacts.

It would be all over the news as "proof" of an Israeli missile attack.

91 JamesTKirk  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:38:31am

re: #14 redc1c4

Let's not get too ghoulish. You'll just let the HuffPos try to draw a flase moral equivalence between us and the way they pray for the painful death of Americans.

Lethal injection is fine. Anything more will just increase his martyr cachet.

92 JamesTKirk  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:39:04am

"flase" is morally equivalent to "false". PIMF.

93 yochanan  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:39:15am

re: #89 Lucius Septimius

the trib has always had a problem with anti semitism in the past i used to be a consative paper now they are trying to be the chicago version of the new york times.

94 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:39:33am

re: #90 Lucius Septimius

It would be all over the news as "proof" of an Israeli missile attack.

Complete with photoshopped pictures with extra darkened smoke after the car crashes subside.

95 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:39:43am
96 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:41:25am

[Link: www.quiz2d.com...]

Another 2-d political quiz calls me a "small government centrist"

Your views call roughly the same amount of government with just a bit more liberty than we currently have in the United States today. Your views are probably best served by a nearly equal mix of Democrats and Republicans in the legislatures, as long as you choose the correct Democrats and Republicans.

Or, if you want to make sure government shrinks a bit, you could throw a few Libertarians into the mix. But just a few. The Libertarian Party calls for radical cuts in government far beyond what you want. Think of a tub of cold bathwater. To get it warm enough to be comfortable, you can add scalding hot water to bring the temperature up to ideal.

Approximately 10% of the takers of this quiz scored in this area, 36% for all within the centrist circle.

97 laZardo  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:41:45am

re: #90 Lucius Septimius

Or a secret Mossad operation trying to destabilize the whole region.

98 laZardo  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:42:56am

re: #91 JamesTKirk

Ironic how this guy wants to be a martyr and will probably get a subdued, painless death.

/splodey-dope he won't be.

99 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:42:57am

re: #97 laZardo

Or a secret Mossad operation trying to destabilize the whole region.

Well everything is run by the Mossad anyway, remember J00s run the world.

100 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:44:27am

re: #91 JamesTKirk

Let's not get too ghoulish. You'll just let the HuffPos try to draw a flase moral equivalence between us and the way they pray for the painful death of Americans.

Lethal injection is fine. Anything more will just increase his martyr cachet.

Do it quietly, privately, with no fanfare. The Luca Brasi treatment.

101 abolitionist  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:44:59am

re: #74 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I remember back when all of the folk singers, rock and rollers, and Hollywood types were shillin' for the Bushes, Dole, Nixon, Ford, Eisenhower, etc. When did that change?

Yuri Bezmenov's words are sounding rather phophetic. Scary phophetic.
Bezmenov on demoralization in America

More here.

102 littleoldlady  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:45:39am

re: #79 buzzsawmonkey

he is a supporter of Israel was couched almost entirely in personal, domestic, and racial terms.

Which is why my snarky comment after listening to that speech was, "Obama's next church is going to be a synagogue."

A most excellent post, buzz!

103 abolitionist  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:45:51am

PIMF: phophetic prophetic

104 laZardo  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:57:21am

THREAD WAKE-UP!

/brb, dinnar

105 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:57:21am

No way. 11 minutes since last comment? Is my pooter broken?

106 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 4:59:01am

re: #86 Hengineer

Hengineer! 4 burning, 2 turning?

107 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:00:50am
108 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:00:53am

re: #105 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

No way. 11 minutes since last comment? Is my pooter broken?

I suspect everyone's coffee kicked in at the same time, forcing them to retire momentarily.

109 mikeinmd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:03:14am

Another Halo

Bow to your Lord, Reuters. Bow to him.

They are embarrasing themselves with this human worship. And don't care.

110 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:03:16am

re: #108 Lucius Septimius

BTW Lucius, welcome to summer. Time to re-tool? Or staying busy?

111 Hengineer  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:04:35am

re: #106 rightside

Hengineer! 4 burning, 2 turning?

Negatory, in port, Jebel Ali

112 JamesTKirk  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:05:34am

re: #108 Lucius Septimius

I suspect everyone's coffee kicked in at the same time, forcing them to retire momentarily.

I was checking out the HULC exoskeleton video on one of the spinoff links.

113 doriangrey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:05:57am

Good morning Lizards...........

114 JamesTKirk  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:06:17am

re: #109 mikeinmd

They are embarrasing themselves with this human worship.

No, they're not. They have no sense of shame.

115 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:06:19am

re: #107 buzzsawmonkey

a wistful nostalgia calculated to play well with his audience--and that he showed clearly that he views the issue in terms of racial politics and group identities.

Precisely -- he plays on sentiment, on emotions, on vague images but appears to have no principles at all. And I don't even think "race" for him is a concrete category; given his own background it really can't be. It is yet another arbitrary category which can be defined and redefined as is politically expedient.

116 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:06:21am

re: #108 Lucius Septimius

I suspect everyone's coffee kicked in at the same time, forcing them to retire momentarily.


Comedian said (can't remember his name)...

"The definition of fear? Fear is being stuck in a tunnel in traffic and realizing that you had a bran muffin and a cup of coffee 45 minutes ago."

117 granitebill  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:07:02am

ROP has been busy after 'prayers'
[Link: www.jpost.com...]

BTW,
Hey Jammiewearingfool... nice piece on Jack Lucas and thanks for the Hat Tip on your barry piece ;)
- Your a staple of my morning read... (despite a giants fan- ha)

-granite

118 Tigger2005  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:07:38am

Once the general election campaign starts, the media will visit Obama's church and find it filled with whites, blacks, Asians, and hispanics and even Jews and Muslims, all holding hands and singing this song, and they'll broadcast it ad nauseum:

Je t'aime
Te amo
Ya ti-bya lyu blyu
Ani o hev ot cha
I love you

The sounds are all as different
As the lands from which they came
And though the words are all unique
Our hearts are still the same

Love in any language
Straight from the heart
Pulls us all together
Never apart
And once we learn to speak it
All the world will hear
Love in any language
Fluently spoken here

We teach the young our differences
Yet look how we're the same
We love to laugh, to dream our dreams
We know the sting of pain

From Leningrad to Lexington
The farmer loves his land
And daddies all get misty-eyed
To give their daughter's hand

Oh maybe when we realize
How much there is to share
We'll find too much in common
To pretend it isn't there

Love in any language
Straight from the heart
Pulls us all together
Never apart
And once we learn to speak it
All the world will hear
Love in any language
Fluently spoken here

Tho' the rehtoric of government
May keep us worlds apart
There's no misinterpreting
The language of the heart

Love in any language
Straight from the heart
Pulls us all together
Never apart
And once we learn to speak it
All the world will hear
Love in any language
Fluently spoken here

119 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:07:56am

re: #110 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Little of both -- got a lot of reading to do and want to get out and do some work in the garden. But no fixed hours, which will be nice.

120 doriangrey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:09:18am

re: #119 Lucius Septimius

Little of both -- got a lot of reading to do and want to get out and do some work in the garden. But no fixed hours, which will be nice.

In other words you got some industrial grade slacking planned......SLACKER.............

121 Macker  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:10:29am

F.I.I.F.
Good morning, Lizards!

122 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:10:48am

re: #120 doriangrey

In other words you got some industrial grade slacking planned......SLACKER.............

And durn proud of it!

Actually, my hope is to get at least two book chapters and an article churned out this summer, so I'll be writing like a mad man. But I get to set the schedule.

123 doriangrey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:14:31am

re: #122 Lucius Septimius

And durn proud of it!

Actually, my hope is to get at least two book chapters and an article churned out this summer, so I'll be writing like a mad man. But I get to set the schedule.

ROTFLMAO.................You go Lucius..............

124 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:16:05am

re: #122 Lucius Septimius

Good on you then!

125 JamesTKirk  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:18:40am

re: #118 Tigger2005

Or this song?

126 Pullus Iulius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:20:37am

re: #109 mikeinmd

Paging the Almighty: We have a First Commandment cleanup on aisle (D).

127 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:20:58am

re: #119 Lucius Septimius

Little of both -- got a lot of reading to do and want to get out and do some work in the garden. But no fixed hours, which will be nice.

You might be surprised at how much pressure that gardening can apply to your "no fixed schedule." :)

128 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:22:26am

re: #127 galloping granny

You might be surprised at how much pressure that gardening can apply to your "no fixed schedule." :)

Oh, it'll apply pressure -- mainly because I'll need to do all that work early in the morning. That said, I take a fairly Darwinian approach to plants -- they have to prove themselves worthy by surviving despite the abuse and neglect.

129 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:23:54am

re: #128 Lucius Septimius

Thanks a lot. So much for the gardening book I was going to write, named, "Plant 'em and Watch 'em Die".

130 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:25:47am

re: #107 buzzsawmonkey

Thank you. One could point out legitimately that the personal commitment which Obama was trying to sell is itself suspect, given his personal associations with Rashid Khalidi, the late Edward Said, Zbigniew Brzenzski, Jeremiah Wright, etc., and the support he has garnered from such flagrantly anti-Israel figures as Carter and Galloway--but many people will attempt to dismiss these on the grounds that he is not responsible for who decides to support him, or that the mere fact that his associates and acquaintances show a disturbing trend is not proof positive that he shares their opinions.

Consequently, I think it is vital to emphasize that, when given the chance to make his own case in his own words, he chose to do so not only in a shallow and pallid manner which made reference to no actions or stances that he himself had taken and little to nothing he himself had experienced, but instead merely referenced a wistful nostalgia calculated to play well with his audience--and that he showed clearly that he views the issue in terms of racial politics and group identities.

Buzz, zip over to [Link: www.votesmart.org...] and take a look at Obama's Senate voting record. He makes reference to no personal actions or stances because he deliberately avoids having any. He has an unbelievable number of NOVOTES - over 100 times in just a few short years that he has either missed a vote or refused to cast a vote other than present. In some categories that loom very large - abortion & health care among them - he has never cast a vote.

131 Pullus Iulius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:29:11am

re: #129 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Reminds me of the great gardener (and human, for that matter) Henry Mitchell, who, when contemplating his garden and his own fate wrote
There are no green thumbs or black thumbs. There are only gardeners and non-gardeners. Gardeners are the ones who ruin after ruin get on with the high defiance of nature herself, creating, in the very face of her chaos and tornado, the bower of roses and the pride of irises. . . . Defiance . . . is what makes gardeners.

132 doriangrey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:29:33am

OK so a poster over at The Jawa Report has posted a very disturbing cartoon. It was published in an Iraqi news paper on June 24th 2000. It shows Saddam kicking down the World Trade Center buildings. Make of this what you will, the cartoon is genuinely authentic.

133 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:30:03am

re: #128 Lucius Septimius

Oh, it'll apply pressure -- mainly because I'll need to do all that work early in the morning. That said, I take a fairly Darwinian approach to plants -- they have to prove themselves worthy by surviving despite the abuse and neglect.

Me too, but I do weed - don't like ticks and it makes it easier to get the good stuff. Now and then I have to water. And once harvest season starts it can take quite some chunk of the day to haul it all down the hill and do something with it.

I can't wait! Despite the cold and rain I've got two kinds of melons, zucchini, cukes and beans all up as of yesterday. And we'll be eating baby bok choy next week.

134 gop_patriot  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:34:06am

Good morning, y'all! :)

/a funny video, it might have been posted already but it's good enough to post twice... Weezer - Pork and Beans (an homage to all the YouTube 'stars' and well known videos LOL)

135 gop_patriot  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:38:10am

re: #130 galloping granny

He's a coward, afraid to do anything that could let people know what he's really about- because then he can't shift with the wind every time it blows from a different direction. Waffler. Ugh.

136 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:41:07am

re: #135 gop_patriot

He's a coward, afraid to do anything that could let people know what he's really about- because then he can't shift with the wind every time it blows from a different direction. Waffler. Ugh.

I think I would call him a con artist writ large. All those NOVOTES about some pretty important subjects can't be anything other than deliberate.

137 gop_patriot  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:41:17am

re: #132 doriangrey

Wow, that's creepy. 2000, huh. I wonder if this is the first time this has been seen?

/now that I've killed the thread, I'm off to take the kids to VBS. Have a good morning, y'all. :)

138 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:42:05am

re: #135 gop_patriot

He's a coward, afraid to do anything that could let people know what he's really about- because then he can't shift with the wind every time it blows from a different direction. Waffler. Ugh.

Oh, but he will provide "leadership" and "hope" and bring about "change."

It says something about how desperate some people are to be led that they would make themselves believe that someone as vacuous and cyncial as Obama is a principled leader.

139 ec marm  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:42:05am

re: #132 doriangrey

OK so a poster over at The Jawa Report has posted a very disturbing cartoon. It was published in an Iraqi news paper on June 24th 2000. It shows Saddam kicking down the World Trade Center buildings. Make of this what you will, the cartoon is genuinely authentic.


A graphic artist and web developer gave me a CD of images in the year 2000. At the end of the school year I gave it back to her but one image, that seemed incongruous, stuck in my brain. It was an image of the U.S. Capitol building, with a huge crack in the dome, smoke pouring out, with a black flag flying over it. It was a fairly large, high resolution image. It wasn't until September 11, 2001 that I thought of it again. I always thought that Flight 93 was headed for the Capitol building.

140 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:42:16am

What a surprise to hear Obama back-peddling from his AIPAC speech... surprise if you haven't heard anything else he has said for the past 20 years. And now we have his standard, "That's not the (fill-in-the-blank) I know" excuse he uses every time he throws somebody under the bus. Actually, I was expecting he would wait till after the election to stop pretending to support Israel. The sooner people see the real Obama, the better.

141 Lucius Septimius  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:44:03am

Oh well, it's been fun, but I've got stuff to do.

Have a great day, ya'll.

142 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:45:19am

Barack Hussein Obama...

Change You Can Believe In

And

An Agreement They Both Can Live With

Obama in a nutshell... Everything to everyone all of the time...

143 perkypauly  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:45:35am

Does anyone remember, D Day 64 years ago today. Take a moment to remember and give thanks.

144 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:45:56am

re: #139 ec marm

A graphic artist and web developer gave me a CD of images in the year 2000. At the end of the school year I gave it back to her but one image, that seemed incongruous, stuck in my brain. It was an image of the U.S. Capitol building, with a huge crack in the dome, smoke pouring out, with a black flag flying over it. It was a fairly large, high resolution image. It wasn't until September 11, 2001 that I thought of it again. I always thought that Flight 93 was headed for the Capitol building.

In one of the Tom Clancy novels just exactly that happens, while the State of the Union address is being given. Jack Ryan (very low man on the totem pole) becomes POTUS and there is literally no one else left. Sounds pretty familiar, doesn't it?

145 songbird  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:47:29am

Goddessoftheclassroom,

That piece is brilliant, and, if I may, I would like to copy it and share it with some of my teacher colleagues.


re: #46 goddessoftheclassroom

The Teacher:
A Riff on Machiavelli's The Prince,
Replacing Prince with Teacher, His with Her, State with Classroom, and Men with Students
By goddessoftheclassroom

I say that every Teacher should desire to be accounted merciful and not cruel. Nevertheless, she should be on her guard against the abuse of this quality of mercy. Cesare Borgia was reputed cruel, yet his cruelty restored Romagna, united it, and brought it to order and obedience; so that if we look at things in their true light, it will be seen that he was in reality far more merciful than the people of Florence, who, to avoid the imputation of cruelty, suffered Pistoja to be torn to pieces by factions.

A Teacher should therefore disregard the reproach of being thought cruel where it enables her to keep her students united and obedient. For she who quells disorder by a very few signal examples will in the end be more merciful than she who from too great leniency permits things to take their course and so to result in rapine and bloodshed; for these hurt the whole Classroom, whereas the severities of the Teacher injure individuals only.

And for a new Teacher, of all others, it is impossible to escape a name for cruelty, since new Classrooms are full of dangers. Wherefore Virgil, by the mouth of Dido, excuses the harshness of her reign on the plea that it was new, saying: A fate unkind, and newness in my reign Compel me this to guard a wide domain Nevertheless, the new Teacher should not be too ready of belief, nor too easily set in motion; not should she herself be the first to raise alarms; but should so temper prudence with kindliness that too great confidence in others shall not throw her off her guard, nor groundless distrust render her insupportable.

And here comes the question whether it is better to be loved rather than feared, or feared rather than loved. It might perhaps be answered that we should wish to be both; but since love and fear can hardly exist together, if we must choose between them, it is far safer to be feared than loved. For of students it may generally be affirmed that they are thankless, fickle, false, studious to avoid danger, greedy of gain, devoted to you while you are able to confer benefits upon them, and ready, as I said before, while danger is distant, to shed their blood, and sacrifice their property, their lives, and their children for you; but in the hour of need they turn against you.

The Teacher, therefore, who without otherwise securing herself builds wholly on their professions is undone. For the friendships which we buy with a price, and do not gain by greatness and nobility of character, though they may be fairly earned are not made good, but fail us when we have occasion to use them

146 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:52:31am

re: #143 perkypauly

Thank you for reminding us.

June 6, 1944

147 doriangrey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:52:45am

re: #137 gop_patriot

Wow, that's creepy. 2000, huh. I wonder if this is the first time this has been seen?

/now that I've killed the thread, I'm off to take the kids to VBS. Have a good morning, y'all. :)


re: #139 ec marm

A graphic artist and web developer gave me a CD of images in the year 2000. At the end of the school year I gave it back to her but one image, that seemed incongruous, stuck in my brain. It was an image of the U.S. Capitol building, with a huge crack in the dome, smoke pouring out, with a black flag flying over it. It was a fairly large, high resolution image. It wasn't until September 11, 2001 that I thought of it again. I always thought that Flight 93 was headed for the Capitol building.

Just what ever you think, remember that the glorious MSM has proven beyond question that Saddam had zero connection to 9/11. Connections to Osama Bin Laden yes, to other terrorist organizations yes, but none what so ever to 9/11.

148 razorbacker  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:54:03am

I saw it. I stole it. It's mine now, fair and square.

I can see that the Dems already miss the steady hand of Lt. John Kerry at the helm of their windsurfer.

149 imtoast  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:54:15am

re: #109 mikeinmd

Another Halo

Bow to your Lord, Reuters. Bow to him.

They are embarrasing themselves with this human worship. And don't care.

Yuck, he has some really ugly ears.

150 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:55:15am

re: #78 Hengineer

Interesting Political Quiz that looks at various DIFFERENT ways you can view things.
[Link: politicalquiz.net...]

I fell into the category of NeoCon Republican... Wow... I'm not even Jewish, as the progressives would have you believe the NeoCons are...

151 Eric Cartman's Conscience  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:55:51am

CLINT EASTWOOD STILL THE MIZZAHF*CKIN' MAN!

About Spike Lee's recent criticism:

yes, there was a small detachment of black troops on Iwo Jima as a part of a munitions company, "but they didn't raise the flag. The story is Flags of Our Fathers, the famous flag-raising picture, and they didn't do that. If I go ahead and put an African-American actor in there, people'd go, 'This guy's lost his mind.' I mean, it's not accurate."

Changeling is set in Los Angeles during the Depression, before the city's make-up was changed by the large black influx. "What are you going to do, you gonna tell a fuckin' story about that?" he growls. "Make it look like a commercial for an equal opportunity player? I'm not in that game."

There's more! :)

Even if Clint gets fed up with Republicans and votes Dem this year I'll always love the guy

152 ec marm  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:56:02am

Mandy Manners pointed out to me something interesting. First look at the flag of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan. Then, the logo used by the "Relay for Life" of the American Cancer Society. Not a little bit of visual plagiarism involved?

153 laZardo  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:57:26am

re: #152 ec marm

Don't see much of a resemblance, but using white and blue for it makes it look a tad ominous...

154 jcbunga  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:57:45am

Today is D-Day. Let's remember. If you haven't been to the WW2 Memorial in DC yet, try to go. There's always a vet there with family, and a crowd surrounding them shaking hands.

Here's FDR's prayer broadcast to the nation that day, and a link to the original recording (Amazing how leaders and Democrats have changed):
[Link: www.historyplace.com...]

My Fellow Americans:

Last night, when I spoke with you about the fall of Rome, I knew at that moment that troops of the United States and our Allies were crossing the Channel in another and greater operation. It has come to pass with success thus far.

And so, in this poignant hour, I ask you to join with me in prayer:

Almighty God: Our sons, pride of our nation, this day have set upon a mighty endeavor, a struggle to preserve our Republic, our religion, and our civilization, and to set free a suffering humanity.

Lead them straight and true; give strength to their arms, stoutness to their hearts, steadfastness in their faith.

They will need Thy blessings. Their road will be long and hard. For the enemy is strong. He may hurl back our forces. Success may not come with rushing speed, but we shall return again and again; and we know that by Thy grace, and by the righteousness of our cause, our sons will triumph.

They will be sore tried, by night and by day, without rest -- until the victory is won. The darkness will be rent by noise and flame. Men's souls will be shaken with the violences of war.

For these men are lately drawn from the ways of peace. They fight not for the lust of conquest. They fight to end conquest. They fight to liberate. They fight to let justice arise, and tolerance and goodwill among all Thy people. They yearn but for the end of battle, for their return to the haven of home.

Some will never return. Embrace these, Father, and receive them, Thy heroic servants, into Thy kingdom.

And for us at home -- fathers, mothers, children, wives, sisters, and brothers of brave men overseas, whose thoughts and prayers are ever with them -- help us, Almighty God, to rededicate ourselves in renewed faith in Thee in this hour of great sacrifice.

Many people have urged that I call the nation into a single day of special prayer. But because the road is long and the desire is great, I ask that our people devote themselves in a continuance of prayer. As we rise to each new day, and again when each day is spent, let words of prayer be on our lips, invoking Thy help to our efforts.

Give us strength, too -- strength in our daily tasks, to redouble the contributions we make in the physical and the material support of our armed forces.

And let our hearts be stout, to wait out the long travail, to bear sorrows that may come, to impart our courage unto our sons wheresoever they may be.

And, O Lord, give us faith. Give us faith in Thee; faith in our sons; faith in each other; faith in our united crusade. Let not the keeness of our spirit ever be dulled. Let not the impacts of temporary events, of temporal matters of but fleeting moment -- let not these deter us in our unconquerable purpose.

With Thy blessing, we shall prevail over the unholy forces of our enemy. Help us to conquer the apostles of greed and racial arrogances. Lead us to the saving of our country, and with our sister nations into a world unity that will spell a sure peace -- a peace invulnerable to the schemings of unworthy men. And a peace that will let all of men live in freedom, reaping the just rewards of their honest toil.

Thy will be done, Almighty God.

Amen.

Franklin D. Roosevelt - June 6, 1944

155 abolitionist  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:57:55am

Geert Wilders visits Copenhagen (video)
Description:

1. June 2008

Geert Wilders holding a speech in the Danish parliament building about his resent film "Fitna".
Mr. Wilders also gave his opinion on Islam in general, with some following words about the Islamisation process of Europe. ("The Eurabia project") Geert was invited to Denmark by the Danish Free press society.

156 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 5:59:22am

re: #152 ec marm

Mandy Manners pointed out to me something interesting. First look at the flag of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan. Then, the logo used by the "Relay for Life" of the American Cancer Society. Not a little bit of visual plagiarism involved?

Why the heck does the American Cancer Society have a star and crescent as part of the Relay for Life logo? That is the most jarring "logo" I've seen in some while. Looks like a two year old threw it together. No unity at all.

157 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:00:57am

re: #150 tfc3rid

I fell into the category of NeoCon Republican... Wow... I'm not even Jewish, as the progressives would have you believe the NeoCons are...

I came out a little to the right of Ganges Khan. I think it might have underestimated how conservative I am.

158 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:01:12am

re: #154 jcbunga

Today is D-Day. Let's remember. If you haven't been to the WW2 Memorial in DC yet, try to go. There's always a vet there with family, and a crowd surrounding them shaking hands.

Here's FDR's prayer broadcast to the nation that day, and a link to the original recording (Amazing how leaders and Democrats have changed):
[Link: www.historyplace.com...]

My Fellow Americans:

Last night, when I spoke with you about the fall of Rome, I knew at that moment that troops of the United States and our Allies were crossing the Channel in another and greater operation. It has come to pass with success thus far.

And so, in this poignant hour, I ask you to join with me in prayer:

Almighty God: SNIP

These days they would impeach him - violation of "separation of church and state."

159 madisonsfriend  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:03:54am

re: #99 Hengineer

Well everything is run by the Mossad anyway, remember J00s run the world.


This is true and yet, i still need to keep this day job. Running the world as part of ZOG doesn't pay the bills!

160 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:04:02am

General Dwight David Eisenhower: June 6th 1944
[Link: www.kansasheritage.org...]

Soldiers, Sailors and Airmen of the Allied Expeditionary Force!

You are about to embark upon the Great Crusade, toward which we have
striven these many months. The eyes of the world are upon you. The
hopes and prayers of liberty-loving people everywhere march with you.
In company with our brave Allies and brothers-in-arms on
other Fronts, you will bring about the destruction of the German war
machine, the elimination of Nazi tyranny over the oppressed peoples of
Europe, and security for ourselves in a free world.

Your task will not be an easy one. Your enemy is well trained, well
equipped and battle hardened. He will fight savagely.

But this is the year 1944! Much has happened since the Nazi triumphs of
1940-41. The United Nations have inflicted upon the Germans great defeats,
in open battle, man-to-man. Our air offensive has seriously reduced their
strength in the air and their capacity to wage war on the ground. Our Home
Fronts have given us an overwhelming superiority in weapons and munitions
of war, and placed at our disposal great reserves of trained fighting men.
The tide has turned! The free men of the world are marching together to
Victory!

I have full confidence in your courage and devotion to duty and skill in
battle. We will accept nothing less than full Victory!

Good luck! And let us beseech the blessing of Almighty God upon this great
and noble undertaking.


SIGNED: Dwight D. Eisenhower

161 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:05:18am

re: #152 ec marm

See also, the Turkish flag. The crescent embracing a star is a significant symbol in Islam. The cancer society relay is different, in that the star is outside the crescent.

And of course, here's one more crescent symbol

162 Ojoe  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:06:06am

re: #13 Hengineer

"A cat is more intelligent than people believe, and can be taught any crime."

— Mark Twain.

163 ec marm  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:06:15am

re: #156 galloping granny

Why the heck does the American Cancer Society have a star and crescent as part of the Relay for Life logo? That is the most jarring "logo" I've seen in some while. Looks like a two year old threw it together. No unity at all.


I'm only pointing it out so that any teachers or "art purchasers" out there that are unfamiliar with the number of islamic nations* that use the crescent and star as part of their flags, don't think that this is some original design they are being presented with.

*First row: Algeria, Azerbaijani Republic, Malaysia, Maldives

Middle row: Republic of Singapore,Tunisia, Turkey,Turkmenistan

Bottom row: Islamic Republic of Pakistan, Comoros, Islamic Republic of Mauritania, Uzbekistan

164 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:06:46am

re: #158 galloping granny

These days they would impeach him - violation of "separation of church and state."

He would have been Lieberman-ed from the Democrat Party...

Speaking of Joe Lieberman, read in the NY Post this mornign that Obama cornered Lieberman in the Senate yesterday and was quite intimidating towards him...

165 jcbunga  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:06:48am

re: #158 galloping granny

These days they would impeach him - violation of "separation of church and state."

sadly, no doubt.

You only have to go back to JFK and LBJ speaches to see how far the Libs have fallen.

It seems the "conservatives" are now the libs, and the "libs" are now marixists/socialists. Gotta be a righty out there someplace.

166 madisonsfriend  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:07:09am

re: #150 tfc3rid

I fell into the category of NeoCon Republican... Wow... I'm not even Jewish, as the progressives would have you believe the NeoCons are...

You can be an honorary Jew. I will allow it as a member of the all powerful Office of Jewish Global Domination.

167 Who Watches the Watchmen?  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:07:35am

Good morning Lizardia!

Now what?

168 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:07:50am
169 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:08:11am

re: #166 madisonsfriend

You can be an honorary Jew. I will allow it as a member of the all powerful Office of Jewish Global Domination.

Well, this Irish-German Catholic appreciates it!

170 laZardo  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:08:39am

re: #163 ec marm

I'm only pointing it out so that any teachers or "art purchasers" out there that are unfamiliar with the number of islamic nations* that use the crescent and star as part of their flags, don't think that this is some original design they are being presented with.

*First row: Algeria, Azerbaijani Republic, Malaysia, Maldives

Middle row: Republic of Singapore,Tunisia, Turkey,Turkmenistan

Bottom row: Islamic Republic of Pakistan, Comoros, Islamic Republic of Mauritania, Uzbekistan

I don't recall Singapore being a Muslim country...

171 madisonsfriend  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:09:16am

re: #168 Kenneth

Did you ever hear that it was a Zionist plot because you can rearrange the symbols to look like the word Zion? We are truly everywhere.

172 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:09:56am

re: #164 tfc3rid

He would have been Lieberman-ed from the Democrat Party...

Speaking of Joe Lieberman, read in the NY Post this mornign that Obama cornered Lieberman in the Senate yesterday and was quite intimidating towards him...

Really? That seems to be throwing a lot of weight around for a junior first-term Senator, even one who thinks he might like to be POTUS. Got linky?

173 GreenDroll  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:10:00am

Happy D-Day you all!

174 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:10:25am

June 4th 1944 : If the Invasion had failed. If America had not fulfilled it's G-D given destiny.
[Link: doinghistoryproject.tripod.com...]

Our landings have failed and I have withdrawn the troops. My decision to attack at this time and place was based on the best information available. The troops, the air and the Navy did all that bravery could do. If any blame or fault attaches to the attempt it is mine alone.”

175 madisonsfriend  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:10:34am

re: #173 GreenDroll

Happy D-Day you all!

God Bless America and the men and women who fought for our freedom.

176 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:10:39am

re: #168 Kenneth

that one is pretty horrific...

Here is another bad one... Looks like Domino's Pizza...

Citi Field Logo

177 laZardo  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:10:47am

re: #168 Kenneth

There was someone who photoshopped that to look like the 0-2 on the right was going Gomorrah on the 2-1 on the left.

178 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:11:11am

re: #171 madisonsfriend

I hadn't heard that, but it makes sense...(adjusting tin-foil hat)

179 Ojoe  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:11:15am

re: #154 jcbunga

The Paths of Liberty.

This is a tribute to the soldiers of D Day.

It is by a Frenchman, and at least one Frenchman who gets it.

Actually many do.

180 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:11:43am

Good morning y'all from a hot (77 degrees, going up to 99 degrees) but brilliantly sunny Charlotte!

BTW, I hope all y'all remember this date: June 6th.
In 1944 an awful lot of extremely brave young Americans, Canadians, British, Polish and Free French forces landed on Nazi Occupied French beaches, enduring a hail of bullets and artillery to begin the liberation of Europe and the end to Adolph Hitler. God Bless each and every one of them.

181 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:12:02am

re: #172 galloping granny

Really? That seems to be throwing a lot of weight around for a junior first-term Senator, even one who thinks he might like to be POTUS. Got linky?

Here you go Granny...

Lieberman Baracked Into a Corner

182 ec marm  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:12:25am

re: #168 Kenneth

Worst logo ever.


Zionist conspiracy, didn't you know? Can you see the word "ZION"?

The smaller logo here, if you click on it, shows what some other people see in that logo.

183 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:14:02am

Good Morning Lizard Nation!

Wild night in the Boston sports world.

Brawl
Sucker punch

Oh and the Celtics took game 1 against the Lakers. LOL

184 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:14:11am

re: #181 tfc3rid

Here you go Granny...

Lieberman Baracked Into a Corner

I suspect Lieberman might pay Obama back at the RNC Convention.

185 songbird  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:14:13am

Happy Day to all Lizards!

Greetings from sunny Las Cruces, New Mexico, where it is cooler and more comfortable now than in Washington, DC and a good part of the eastern seaboard. Highs today in the lower 90s with a lovely dry heat! Don't worry. Our payback comes in July and August with very high heat, monsoons and humidity in August.

Tomorrow I take a German Exam to add a German teaching certification onto my teaching license.

The presidential campaign has fizzled to a disappointing end with candidates now 'chosen'. Can't we just vote for "none of the above"?

186 LittleRed1  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:14:19am

A good friend of mine jumped Normandy, Market Garden and was at the Bastogne. I've spent hours listening to him and his friends talk about The War, at least what they are willing to tell me. (Battle of the Bulge is not discussed, for various reasons.)

187 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:14:20am

re: #183 loppyd

Not bad loppy... Not bad at all....

188 Ojoe  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:14:32am

Some of our European friends do remember.

The people who see and make a difference are not the majority.

But the remnant, so to speak, will carry the day in the future too.

189 sparrowlake  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:14:35am

re: #158 galloping granny

These days they would impeach him - violation of "separation of church and state."

Every President has regularly invoked the name of God in speeches to the nation, and none have been impeached for it.

190 irongrampa  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:14:37am

And in the course of the day, y'all might take a moment to reflect on this day, 64 years ago, and say thanks.

191 abolitionist  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:15:20am

re: #147 doriangrey

Just what ever you think, remember that the glorious MSM has proven beyond question that Saddam had zero connection to 9/11. Connections to Osama Bin Laden yes, to other terrorist organizations yes, but none what so ever to 9/11.

This is not proof that Saddam was behind 911. [Link: www.factsofisrael.com...]
However, Saddam's own criterion for executing his enemies was a simple one - intent.

192 ec marm  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:15:54am

re: #170 laZardo

I don't recall Singapore being a Muslim country...


Opps, you're right:

Buddhist 42.5%, Muslim 14.9%, Taoist 8.5%, Hindu 4%, Catholic 4.8%, other Christian 9.8%, other 0.7%, none 14.8% (2000 census) [Link: www.cia.gov...]


Strange that they would use such a symbol in their flag.

193 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:16:03am

re: #184 Nevergiveup

I suspect Lieberman might pay Obama back at the RNC Convention.

Lieberman will give the Zell Miller speech...

194 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:16:39am

Good Morning and Happy Friday, {all y'all}.
Let's all get on our desks and do the happy dance!

195 Who Watches the Watchmen?  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:17:10am
196 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:17:18am

re: #194 redstateredneck

Good Morning and Happy Friday, {all y'all}.
Let's all get on our desks and do the happy dance!

If I did the happy dance on my desk the desk would collapse and I would be in dual casts for the entire summer.

197 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:17:54am

re: #196 galloping granny

You may dance whilst seated, granny.
;-)

198 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:17:54am

Soldiers, Sailors and Airmen of the Allied Expeditionary Force!

You are about to embark upon the Great Crusade, toward which we have
striven these many months. The eyes of the world are upon you. The
hopes and prayers of liberty-loving people everywhere march with you.
In company with our brave Allies and brothers-in-arms on
other Fronts, you will bring about the destruction of the German war
machine, the elimination of Nazi tyranny over the oppressed peoples of
Europe, and security for ourselves in a free world.

Your task will not be an easy one. Your enemy is well trained, well
equipped and battle hardened. He will fight savagely.

But this is the year 1944! Much has happened since the Nazi triumphs of
1940-41. The United Nations have inflicted upon the Germans great defeats,
in open battle, man-to-man. Our air offensive has seriously reduced their
strength in the air and their capacity to wage war on the ground. Our Home
Fronts have given us an overwhelming superiority in weapons and munitions
of war, and placed at our disposal great reserves of trained fighting men.
The tide has turned! The free men of the world are marching together to
Victory!

I have full confidence in your courage and devotion to duty and skill in
battle. We will accept nothing less than full Victory!

Good luck! And let us beseech the blessing of Almighty God upon this great
and noble undertaking.


SIGNED: Dwight D. Eisenhower

199 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:17:56am

re: #183 loppyd

Good Morning Lizard Nation!

Wild night in the Boston sports world.

Brawl
Sucker punch

Oh and the Celtics took game 1 against the Lakers. LOL

What was it between Manny and Youkles?

200 CIA Reject  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:18:00am

re: #193 tfc3rid

Lieberman will give the Zell Miller speech...

Before or after accepting the VP nomination?

/Just a thought...

201 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:18:04am

Well, I for one and thankful and recall what our incredibly brave men did on June 6, 1944...

It was an incredible assault and one that worked... The beginning of the Allied assault on Europe... Incredible...

One has to stop and think if such an endeavor will ever be seen again...

202 laZardo  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:18:43am

re: #192 ec marm

They used to be a province of Malaysia, before they were kicked out for some reason. Funny how that turned out.

203 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:18:52am

re: #200 CIA Reject

Before or after accepting the VP nomination?

/Just a thought...

I've actually had that thought as well off and on... I don't think that would be a very good idea...

204 Dolphin  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:19:01am

re: #193 tfc3rid

I don't think ANYONE (in polictics today) can give another speach like that. It is one of those speaches, at least in my life, that will alway stand out. I really made an impression on me.

205 sparrowlake  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:19:10am

re: #168 Kenneth

Worst logo ever.

I like it because it spells ZION.

206 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:19:14am

re: #192 ec marm

Singapore broke away from Muslim majority Malaysia. The inclusion of the vaguely Islamic symbolism in the flag was a kind of "inclusiveness" gesture to the minority population. The 5 stars represent each of the major ethnic/religious groups.

207 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:19:40am

Another Kossack jumps ship...

You've convinced me..

For over twenty years, I have identified myself as a Democrat.

For over twenty years, I don't think I've ever voted for anyone who wasn't a Democrat except in primaries after the Dem nominee was selected OR in races where there were no Dems running.

Thank you DailyKos.. you've convinced me that this Democrat... this former Democrat... is an Independent now.

I have called the DNC and asked them to remove my name from their fundraising lists and email lists.

Why?

We have selected as our nominee a man with only three years of experience at the Federal level; much of which he spent campaigning for President. In fact, according to govtrack.com (which btw ranks him to the right of Clinton)
he's missed 21% of the votes taken in the Senate since he joined it.

Obama tells us lies about not taking money from lobbyists.

Obama's campaign has been extremely sexist and has used his male privilege to benefit from sexism in the media.

They took half of my vote from me and took delegates won from a candidate and gave them to another.

I am also leaving DailyKos.

This site has devolved into little more than venomous comments and hate towards anyone who disagrees with the pack. I don't want to participate in a site that thinks that making comments about Clinton's breasts, PResident Clinton's dick or McCain's teeth is valid political commentary.

I don't think you are what you think you are.

Heh.

Good morning lizards!

208 yesandno  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:19:40am

re: #170 laZardo

re: #163 ec marm

I'm only pointing it out so that any teachers or "art purchasers" out there that are unfamiliar with the number of islamic nations* that use the crescent and star as part of their flags, don't think that this is some original design they are being presented with.

*First row: Algeria, Azerbaijani Republic, Malaysia, Maldives

Middle row: Republic of Singapore,Tunisia, Turkey,Turkmenistan

Bottom row: Islamic Republic of Pakistan, Comoros, Islamic Republic of Mauritania, Uzbekistan

I don't recall Singapore being a Muslim country...


Why does the IR of Mauritania look like someone shot the Cheshire Cat right between the eyes?

209 CIA Reject  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:20:37am

re: #203 tfc3rid

I've actually had that thought as well off and on... I don't think that would be a very good idea...

Yeah, but watching all the resultant cranial detonations would be fun!

210 lawhawk  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:22:55am

Greets and saluts from the NYC metro area. Things are once again quite busy in the ME, with Israel firing on Hamas and other terrorists as the terrorists' rocket war against Israel continues to inflict casualties.

Meanwhile, the US is considering lifting the ban on selling Israel the F-22 Raptor. That wont do anything with respect to the Palestinian issue, but is directed solely at the Iranian nuclear situation. Right now, it's just talk, but if the Iranians continue to show that they have no intention of giving up their nuclear program, watch for the US to sell the Israelis the weapons systems needed to take out existential threat to Israel's security.

211 sparrowlake  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:22:56am

re: #209 CIA Reject

Yeah, but watching all the resultant cranial detonations would be fun!

Are those like brain farts?

212 Killian Bundy  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:23:03am

Vote Obama!

/take a principled stand, so he doesn't have to

213 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:24:07am

Also on 6 June, the Battle of Belleau Wood, in 1918.

Sempre Fi, Devil Dogs.

214 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:24:08am

On this historic day June 4th 1944, google chooses to honor the brave soldiers of...er...Diego Velázquez---what the f-uck?

215 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:24:25am

re: #207 NJDhockeyfan

I love it when the scales fall from their eyes and they see the light.
Hallelujah!

216 Killian Bundy  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:24:46am

Vote Obama!

/don't you want a free unicorn?

217 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:25:20am

re: #210 lawhawk

Greets and saluts from the NYC metro area. Things are once again quite busy in the ME, with Israel firing on Hamas and other terrorists as the terrorists' rocket war against Israel continues to inflict casualties.

Meanwhile, the US is considering lifting the ban on selling Israel the F-22 Raptor. That wont do anything with respect to the Palestinian issue, but is directed solely at the Iranian nuclear situation. Right now, it's just talk, but if the Iranians continue to show that they have no intention of giving up their nuclear program, watch for the US to sell the Israelis the weapons systems needed to take out existential threat to Israel's security.

Better get a move on if they're going to do that. Unless McCain wins in November, all bets are off and I would expect anything in the pipeline to come to a screeching halt. Obama would change US Israel policy (already not all that great) markedly - and not for the better.

218 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:25:29am

re: #187 tfc3rid

Not bad loppy... Not bad at all....

I was up way past my bedtime watching all the excitement!

219 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:25:31am

re: #214 Nevergiveup

On this historic day June 4th 1944, google chooses to honor the brave soldiers of...er...Diego Velázquez---what the f-uck?

Surprised?

220 Ojoe  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:25:56am
221 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:26:35am

re: #199 Nevergiveup

What was it between Manny and Youkles?

Yes!

Nobody's talking, though.

222 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:26:41am

re: #183 loppyd Hey {loppyd}! Good morning goodlooking! Say, how long has ole Manny been doing them 'roids again? Or has he moved on to crystal Meth?! LOL!
I have no idea why he "bitch slapped" (not the term I'd use but.....) Youkilis but you just don't do that to a teamate in the middle of a game, and in full public view.

223 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:26:55am

re: #214 Nevergiveup

This surprises you how?

F*ck google

224 Sheldon  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:27:00am

Peter Schweitzer on C-Span
"Makers and Takers"

225 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:27:17am

When I listened to Obama's speech to AIPAC and heard him vow to defend Israel, with an undivided capital in Jerusalem, I was shocked, I tell you, because,

"That's not the Obama I know!"

226 songbird  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:27:46am

re: #220 Ojoe

Obama's cornflakes unsweetened! (ungesuessed)

227 sparrowlake  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:27:55am

re: #207 NJDhockeyfan

"I don't want to participate in a site that thinks that making comments about Clinton's breasts, PResident Clinton's dick or McCain's teeth is valid political commentary."

This Ex-Koss is confused.
Hillary should not be referred to as "President Clinton".

228 Killian Bundy  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:28:25am

Vote Obama!

/stop worrying whether or not you make enough money

229 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:28:53am

re: #222 {realwest}

Hey {loppyd}! Good morning goodlooking! Say, how long has ole Manny been doing them 'roids again? Or has he moved on to crystal Meth?! LOL!
I have no idea why he "bitch slapped" (not the term I'd use but.....) Youkilis but you just don't do that to a teamate in the middle of a game, and in full public view.

Good Morning Handsome!

I have no clue what started it....and you're right it was uncalled for.

Terry Francona was mum on the subject last night, but the Boston sports media will probably dig it up.

230 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:29:06am

re: #218 loppyd

I was up way past my bedtime watching all the excitement!

As was I but I was watching the Mets lose and a $#%^% hit by pitch in the bottom of the ninth in San Diego...

231 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:29:06am

re: #195 Who Watches the Watchmen? Huh, watch out for falling bowlers or something?!? LOL!

232 BFSkinner  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:29:28am

Hello all from Metro Chicago.

233 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:29:35am

re: #228 Killian Bundy

Vote Obama!

/stop worrying whether or not you make enough money

Won't need money in the re-education camps.

234 Killian Bundy  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:29:54am

re: #225 Kenneth

When I listened to Obama's speech to AIPAC and heard him vow to defend Israel, with an undivided capital in Jerusalem, I was shocked, I tell you, because,

"That's not the Obama I know!"

/did you catch the part where he promised to end weapons smuggling into Gaza?

235 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:30:23am

re: #198 loppyd Thanks for that {loppyd}!

236 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:30:27am

re: #230 tfc3rid

As was I but I was watching the Mets lose and a $#%^% hit by pitch in the bottom of the ninth in San Diego...

And of course, all night long there was this douche sitting behind home plate wearing the Obama 'O' t-shirt...

237 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:30:32am

re: #232 BFSkinner

Hello all from Metro Chicago.


Pronounced Chicargo by 9 out of 10 southerners.

238 Dirk Diggler  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:31:07am

Realwest,

Say, how long has ole Manny been doing them 'roids again? Or has he moved on to crystal Meth?! LOL!
I have no idea why he "bitch slapped" (not the term I'd use but.....) Youkilis but you just don't do that to a teamate in the middle of a game, and in full public view.


"That's not the Manny I know..."

239 BFSkinner  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:31:42am

re: #237 redstateredneck

Pronounced Chicargo by 9 out of 10 southerners.

Trust me... I'd rather hear a Southern accent than a Chicago accent anyday. I am from MI ... swore I'd never live back up north... and here I am. Blech.

240 cygnus  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:31:54am

re: #7 Killian Bundy

/death by freefall, give him a few minutes to think about it

From the top of a very tall skyscraper, just so he'll know how some of the 9/11 victims felt.

241 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:32:08am

June 6 in history:

1508 - Maximilian I, Holy Roman Emperor, is defeated in Friulia by Venetian forces; he is forced to sign a three-year truce and cede several territories to Venice.

1513 - Italian Wars: Battle of Novara. Swiss troops defeat the French under Louis de la Tremoille, forcing the French to abandon Milan. Duke Massimiliano Sforza is restored.

1644 - the Qing Dynasty Manchu forces led by the Shunzhi Emperor capture Beijing during the collapse of the Ming Dynasty. The Manchus would rule China until 1912 when the Republic of China was established.

1813 - War of 1812: Battle of Stoney Creek - A British force of 700 under John Vincent defeat an American force three times its size under William Winder and John Chandler.

1862 - American Civil War: Battle of Memphis - Union forces capture Memphis, Tennessee, from the Confederates.

1882 - The Shewan forces of Menelik defeat the Gojjame army in the Battle of Embabo. The Shewans capture Negus Tekle Haymanot of Gojjam, and their victory leads to a Shewan hegemony over the territories south of the Abay River.

1982 - 1982 Lebanon War begins: Forces under Israeli Defense Minister Ariel Sharon invade southern Lebanon in their "Operation Peace for the Galilee," eventually reaching as far north as the capital Beirut.

242 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:32:20am

re: #234 Killian Bundy

/did you catch the part where he promised to end weapons smuggling into Gaza?

There will be no need to smuggle weapons into Gaza. Weapons will be openly purchased. And besides, once Israel has been turned over to the "rightful owners" there will be no need for weapons. Other than an occasional knife to murder a new bride with on her wedding night because you think she might not be a virgin. . . .

243 Who Watches the Watchmen?  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:32:24am

re: #207 NJDhockeyfan

Obama's campaign has been extremely sexist and has used his male privilege to benefit from sexism in the media.

This ex-Kossack still needs some reeducation if he's going on about privilege, but he or she will learn.

BTW, President Clinton himself made his dick a topic of valid political commentary, but that is old, old news.

244 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:32:38am

Omaha Beach Normandy
[Link: www.normandy.worldweb.com...]

245 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:32:44am

Bravo to Juan Williams!

It's Time for Another Obama Race Speech


To deal with this controversy effectively, Mr. Obama needs to give another speech. This time he has to admit to sins of using race for political expediency – by knowingly buying into divisive, mean messages being delivered from the pulpit. He has to say that, as a biracial young man with no community roots, attaching himself to Rev. Wright and the Trinity congregation was a shortcut to move up the ladder in the Chicago political scene. He has to call race-baiting what it is, whether it comes from a pulpit or calls itself progressive politics. And he has to challenge his supporters, especially his black base, to be honest about real problems at the heart of today's racial divide – including out-of-wedlock births, crime, drugs and a culture that devalues education while glorifying the gangster life.
246 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:33:03am

re: #207 NJDhockeyfan
Good morning - what do you mean "another" one jumps ship?!

247 ec marm  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:33:23am

re: #228 Killian Bundy

Vote Obama!

/stop worrying whether or not you make enough money


Don't you know that prosperity for all is possible through legislation and taxation? It's just that simple.

248 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:34:38am

re: #207 NJDhockeyfan

5%....that's all it takes.

BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

249 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:35:04am

re: #210 lawhawk Morning lawhawk - don't think the potential sale of the Raptor has much to do with Iran, as the Raptor is "just" an air superiority fighter - albeit the best one in the entire world. Don't see how it would help Israel with attacking Iran (but would clear the skies of any Migs that Iran somehow gets to Israel).

250 madisonsfriend  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:35:11am

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

Why doesn't AP just give in and put "freedom" in front of "fighter"? You know they want to- because recognizing these killers as terrorists would be wrong- and keep them from their lovefest meetings with Hamas

251 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:36:43am

re: #234 Killian Bundy

Well, he didn't say he would end weapons smuggling, he said he would call on Egypt to end the weapons smuggling. There is a big difference. "Calling on Egypt to end smuggling" is an easy thing to do -hell even Rice, Olmert & bush have done that. Let's do it again right now, shall we? "Hey Egypt! End that weapons smuggling, ok?" See, job done.

Actually ending weapon smuggling is another matter entirely.

Perhaps under Amir Obama, it won't be considered smuggling anymore, it will be legitimate aid.

252 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:37:15am

re: #245 loppyd


Didn't you know Juan Williams is an uncle Tom?

253 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:37:16am

re: #245 loppyd

Only a black commentator can get away with that. Obama can't call him 'racist'. Juan seemed to be genuinely shocked by the anti-white rhetoric going on at Trinity Church. Obama's lame speech announcing leaving the church without denouncing any of it did not fly with him.

254 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:37:36am

Remarks at the U.S. Ranger Monument
Pointe du Hoc, France
June 6, 1984

One of two speeches commemorating the 40th Anniversary of the D-Day Invasion, this speech was delivered at the site of the U.S. Ranger Monument at Pointe du Hoc, France, where veterans of the Normandy Invasion, and others, had assembled for the ceremony. Later during the day, President Reagan spoke at Omaha Beach, France.
1,988 words.

[Link: www.reaganlibrary.com...]

255 ec marm  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:38:17am

re: #249 realwest

Morning lawhawk - don't think the potential sale of the Raptor has much to do with Iran, as the Raptor is "just" an air superiority fighter - albeit the best one in the entire world. Don't see how it would help Israel with attacking Iran (but would clear the skies of any Migs that Iran somehow gets to Israel).


I think there are "range" issues with the current Israeli air force. Especially if they had to fly around Iraq to get to Iran.
Maybe the IAF just needs a refueling air tanker?

256 phil flavin  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:38:21am

Call me naive, but I can not for the life me understand why Google can't honor the day of days!

257 vxbush  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:38:40am

Morning, everyone, from mid-state Illinois. I'll be lurking a lot today. I've got some weirdish work to do and I'm expecting a shipment of new toys today.

By the way, go over to Hot Air and read what Bolton says about Obama's naivety. Just wonderful.

258 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:38:48am

re: #245 loppyd

Obama has already addressed that issue. He said the Trinity United Church isn't worth denouncing. Move on. Forget about it. That's old politics. Time for change. Hey look a squirrel!

259 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:39:13am

re: #246 realwest

Good morning - what do you mean "another" one jumps ship?!

It seems like I see diaries like this every few weeks. This is one of the better ones. :)

260 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:40:29am

re: #252 rightside

Didn't you know Juan Williams is an uncle Tom?

And he appears on *gasp* Fox News.

261 galloping granny  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:40:30am

re: #253 redstateredneck

Only a black commentator can get away with that. Obama can't call him 'racist'. Juan seemed to be genuinely shocked by the anti-white rhetoric going on at Trinity Church. Obama's lame speech announcing leaving the church without denouncing any of it did not fly with him.

Obama's "leaving the church" was so too little-too late as to be a joke. He could not really have expected anyone with two functioning brain cells to actually consider that a sincerely move on his part. He really seems very typical of many other chronic liars I've known over the years.

262 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:40:46am

re: #255 ec marm

I think there are "range" issues with the current Israeli air force. Especially if they had to fly around Iraq to get to Iran.
Maybe the IAF just needs a refueling air tanker?

They have

263 Killian Bundy  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:40:55am

re: #240 cygnus

From the top of a very tall skyscraper, just so he'll know how some of the 9/11 victims felt.

[Expletive deleted] that!

/handcuff him behind his back, fit him with an oxygen mask, and drop him from 50,000 feet, give him enough time to really think about it

264 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:41:10am

re: #220 Ojoe Hey Ojoe, thanks again for the MT Wilson photo!

265 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:41:56am

re: #223 rightside Good morning to ya rightside - how are you doing today?

266 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:42:02am
267 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:42:23am

re: #256 phil flavin

In the liberal/leftist mindset, all wars are bad, all sides are bad, anybody who fought in a war is either bad or a victim and certainly not something we should "honor", because honoring the fallen is bad too. Bad, bad, bad.

268 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:42:56am

Seems the global warming bill in the senate is dead- gee to bad.

269 vxbush  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:43:23am

re: #268 Nevergiveup

Seems the global warming bill in the senate is dead- gee to bad.

See, now that's worth partying about!

270 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:43:27am

re: #232 BFSkinner
Good morning to you! How are you this fine morning?

271 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:43:30am

re: #253 redstateredneck

Only a black commentator can get away with that. Obama can't call him 'racist'. Juan seemed to be genuinely shocked by the anti-white rhetoric going on at Trinity Church. Obama's lame speech announcing leaving the church without denouncing any of it did not fly with him.

and it did not fly with independents....a group he has lost anywhere from 9% to 11%* since the Rev. Wright controversy made headlines.

*depending on which poll you look at

272 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:44:15am

re: #239 BFSkinner

Trust me... I'd rather hear a Southern accent than a Chicago accent anyday. I am from MI ... swore I'd never live back up north... and here I am. Blech.

Heh. I'd rather be on the other side of the Lake. Truth be told, I'd rather have taken the day off and be in Hart Plaza or somewhere on Woodward. :-)

It's going to be another hot day today with a chance of severe weather this afternoon/evening - what fun, oh joy.

273 alegrias  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:44:28am

re: #185 songbird

Happy Day to all Lizards!

Greetings from sunny Las Cruces, New Mexico, where it is cooler and more comfortable now than in Washington, DC and a good part of the eastern seaboard. Highs today in the lower 90s with a lovely dry heat! Don't worry. Our payback comes in July and August with very high heat, monsoons and humidity in August.

Tomorrow I take a German Exam to add a German teaching certification onto my teaching license.

The presidential campaign has fizzled to a disappointing end with candidates now 'chosen'. Can't we just vote for "none of the above"?

* * *
"....The presidential campaign has fizzled to a disappointing end with candidates now 'chosen'. Can't we just vote for "none of the above"..."

OSTRICH Head in the Sand Bird, was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Voting "None of the above" is distinctly cowardly and not helpful IF you care about our country.

274 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:45:17am

re: #268 Nevergiveup

Seems the global warming bill in the senate is dead- gee to bad.

Buh-bye.

275 mudpuppy  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:45:52am

#20

feed him nothing but MRE's and 2 canteens of water a day.

/he'll explode

Dude, make that MRE pork patties or ham slices and you got a winner!

276 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:46:30am

re: #258 Kenneth

Obama has already addressed that issue. He said the Trinity United Church isn't worth denouncing. Move on. Forget about it. That's old politics. Time for change. Hey look a squirrel!

Newslfash to Barry-Oh.

It's. Not. Going. Away.

277 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:46:33am
278 alegrias  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:46:54am

re: #193 tfc3rid

Lieberman will give the Zell Miller speech...

* * *
Lieberman may give a good speech, and is a better speech giver than McCain, BUT Zell Miller was a Marine and a former governor and has a tough guy persona to match his pro-military toughness.

279 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:47:02am

re: #261 galloping granny

Obama's "leaving the church" was so too little-too late as to be a joke. He could not really have expected anyone with two functioning brain cells to actually consider that a sincerely move on his part. He really seems very typical of many other chronic liars I've known over the years.

Obama never really left his church for good either. If you look at the speech, he said he was unable to be a memeber during the campagin.

It really borders on pathological, but that's par for the course for our politicians here. Daley lies, Blagojevich lies, etc, etc. Shoot, we still can't get George Ryan to admit he had a part in the Licenses for Bribes scandal.

280 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:47:40am

re: #265 realwest

Doing ok, hoping son will get out of the hospital today. Last day of school for him today, so we have to make arrangements for him to take his final exams next week we hope.

How are you?

281 razorbacker  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:47:49am

I'm changing my mind. I'm all for universal health care. It's great!

Evidence...

The AP reported:

Last month her lung cancer, in remission for about two years, was back. After her oncologist prescribed a cancer drug that could slow the cancer growth and extend her life, Wagner was notified that the Oregon Health Plan wouldn’t cover it.

It would cover comfort and care, including, if she chose, doctor-assisted suicide.

See. Those pesky drugs aren't covered, and logically why should they be since you'll only come back time and again for more.

But the treatment that solves the problem forevermore...covered.

from Surber's joint.

(I haven't used the 'tag'. If you can't tell the difference either I'm not smart enough to do it well, or you're not smart enough to get it.)

282 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:48:22am

re: #239 BFSkinner

Trust me... I'd rather hear a Southern accent than a Chicago accent anyday. I am from MI ... swore I'd never live back up north... and here I am. Blech.

Yeah those Chicago accents are wicked annoying.

Da Bears.

LOL

/ducking

283 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:49:02am

re: #267 Kenneth

In
the liberal/leftist mindset, all wars are bad, all sides are bad,
anybody who fought in a war is either bad or a victim and certainly not
something we should "honor", because honoring the fallen is bad too.
Bad, bad, bad.


Not quite. Wars involving non-Western actors are ignored (unless a Western power can be tarred) & the Communist side is always right (see support/opposition to Germany in WWII).

284 vxbush  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:49:16am

re: #279 Honorary Yooper

Obama never really left his church for good either. If you look at the speech, he said he was unable to be a memeber during the campagin.

It really borders on pathological, but that's par for the course for our politicians here. Daley lies, Blagojevich lies, etc, etc. Shoot, we still can't get George Ryan to admit he had a part in the Licenses for Bribes scandal.

Yes, and to think we once had Edgar, who wasn't that bad for a governor.

285 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:49:45am

re: #276 loppyd

Hey, what are you, some kind of racist?
/sarc

286 cygnus  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:50:10am

OT: Some of the taxes we pay yearly:
Accounts Receivable Tax
Building Permit Tax
CDL License Tax
Cigarette Tax
Corporate Income Tax
Dog License Tax
Federal Income T ax & lt; BR>Federal Unemployment Tax (FUTA)
Fishing License Tax
Food License Tax
Fuel Permit Tax
Gasoline Tax
Hunting License Tax
Inheritance Tax
Inventory Tax
IRS Interest Charges (tax on top of tax),
IRS Penalties (tax on top of tax),
Liquor Tax,
Luxury Tax,
Marriage License Tax,
Medicare Tax,
Property Tax,
Real Estate Tax,
Service charge taxes,
Social Security Tax,
Road Usage Tax (Truckers),
Sales Taxes,
Recreational Vehicle Tax,
School Tax,
State Income Tax,
State Unemployment Tax (SUTA),
Telephone Federal Excise Tax,
Telephone Federal Universal Service Fe e Tax,
Telephone Federal, State and Local Surcharge Tax,
Telephone Minimum Usage Surcharge Tax,
Telephone Recurring and Non-recurring Charges Tax,
Telephone State and Local Tax,
Telephone Usage Charge Tax,
Utility Tax,
Vehicle License Registration Tax,
Vehicle Sales Tax,
Watercraft Registration Tax,
Well Permit Tax,
Workers Compensation Tax.

Scary.

287 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:50:45am

re: #284 vxbush

Yes, and to think we once had Edgar, who wasn't that bad for a governor.

Yeah. He was the most decent one of the past 30 years. I lost my respect for Big Jim Thompson when he decided to try to get George Ryan off.

288 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:51:14am

re: #285 Kenneth

Hey, what are you, some kind of racist?
/sarc

No, just a Typical White Person.

289 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:51:37am
290 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:51:59am

re: #283 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey

Very true. Any war fought against any Western power by any 'oppressed' third world guerrilla army, or terrorist group, no matter how violent, corrupt and ruthless, is always just. I forgot that nuance.

291 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:52:12am

re: #287 Honorary Yooper

Yeah.
He was the most decent one of the past 30 years. I lost my respect for
Big Jim Thompson when he decided to try to get George Ryan off.

Knowing what we know about Ryan's personal life, one could take that the wrong way.

292 alegrias  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:52:51am

re: #225 Kenneth

When I listened to Obama's speech to AIPAC and heard him vow to defend Israel, with an undivided capital in Jerusalem, I was shocked, I tell you, because,

"That's not the Obama I know!"

* * *
A poster earlier on this thread explains he's only showing 'personal' commitment or friendship, like he said about his grandmother before throwing her under the bus when convenient.

NOT real.

(someone translate for me please)

293 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:52:57am

Good Friday morning all.

Wow, lots of good threads last night. Talk about some Air Force screw-ups!

294 Killian Bundy  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:53:06am

re: #263 Killian Bundy

[Expletive deleted] that!

/handcuff him behind his back, fit him with an oxygen mask, and drop him from 50,000 feet, give him enough time to really think about it

Kind of like the HALO jumps our SEALS do for a living only different.

/this would be a HANO jump, High Altitude No Opening

295 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:53:07am

re: #288 loppyd

Eat your bitter arugula waffles!

296 razorbacker  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:53:10am

Dayum. Wish I'd said it firstand, by this time next week, I will have;)...

Question: What’s the latest substantive attack from the left on Republican Sen. John McCain?

Answer: His teeth are yellow. Better his teeth than his spine.

Suber, again.

297 ploome hineni[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:53:24am
298 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:53:40am

re: #286 cygnus
And a bureaucracy to collect and manage each one.

299 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:53:50am

re: #291 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey

You're thinking of the other Ryan, the one that was running for Senate in '04 (Jeri Ryan's husband).

300 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:53:59am

re: #293 Ward Cleaver

Good Friday morning all.

Wow, lots of good threads last night. Talk about some Air Force screw-ups!

You try getting everything right with only 9 hours sleep a day!
/I kid, I kid.

301 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:54:57am
302 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:55:02am

re: #282 loppyd

Yeah those Chicago accents are wicked annoying.

Da Bears.

LOL

/ducking

I like Chicago accents. Chi-CAAA-go.

303 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:55:04am

re: #299 Ward Cleaver

Whoops! My apologies to Mr. Ryan.

304 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:55:35am

re: #276 loppyd

Not for us, but the LLL will eat up his patented "Obamanswers"

1. "I'm shocked, shocked I tell you! That's not the [fill in the blank] I knew"

2. "You can't ask me about middle name/associates/grandmother/etc., you're a racist!"

3. "How does that help my children?"

4. "That's just a distraction"

5. "Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?"

Feel free to add others...

305 alegrias  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:55:45am

re: #234 Killian Bundy

/did you catch the part where he promised to end weapons smuggling into Gaza?

* * *
'Cause he'll supply them above-board! The notion folks should have to tunnel when they can drive on through, with Uncle Sam's blessing, has to change, and it will.

306 madisonsfriend  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:55:52am

re: #286 cygnus

You pay a marriage license tax every year? Now that is scary!

307 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:56:14am

re: #300 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey

You try getting everything right with only 9 hours sleep a day!
/I kid, I kid.

My brother was in the Army, and he never misses an opportunity to crack on the AF, and their lack of discipline.

308 ploome hineni[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:56:22am
309 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:56:26am

re: #304 rightside

Why can't I just eat my waffle?

310 opnion  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:56:35am

Obama's idea of fighting the War on Teerror is to signal the enemy in Iraq that we will retreat.
You know, so that he can concentrate on Afghanistan.
Obama will not fight Muslims.
He will apologize to and accpomodate them
:

311 Occasional Reader  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:57:05am

re: #288 loppyd

No, just a Typical White Person.

I *so* hope that during the debates, someone - either McCain, or a moderator - will ask Obama to define what a "typical white person" is. Perhaps then ask him if there are "typical" blacks, asians, latinos, and what their respective attributes are.

Good morning.

312 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:57:10am

re: #280 rightside I'm doing ok, thanks - why was your son in the hospital and do you anticipate any flak over make-up exams?

313 ploome hineni[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:57:39am
314 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:57:45am

re: #311 Occasional Reader

I *so* hope that during the debates, someone - either McCain, or a moderator - will ask Obama to define what a "typical white person" is. Perhaps then ask him if there are "typical" blacks, asians, latinos, and what their respective attributes are.

Good morning.

Ooh, good question. He'd never answer it, but good question.

315 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:58:06am

re: #252 rightside

Didn't you know Juan Williams is an uncle Tom?

Been reading DKos?

316 lawhawk  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:58:17am

re: #249 realwest

The Raptor isn't just an air superiority fighter. It can pound the mud just as surely as any other front line fighter can these days.

It's designed to take the JDAM and SDBs, which means that it can go wherever it wants, whenever it wants, and attack targets undetected. In that respect, it's like the F117, except it can go faster and can defend itself from air targets.

317 madisonsfriend  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:58:23am

re: #256 phil flavin

You mean honor D-Day instead of the birthday of a Spanish painter of the 1600s? I don't understand the problem

318 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:58:48am

re: #282 loppyd Well at least they don't have to "Pak the Cahr" to watch Da Bears! LOL!

319 Tigger2005  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:58:50am

re: #245 loppyd

Bravo to Juan Williams!

It's Time for Another Obama Race Speech

And if Obama says any of these things, so what? Why support someone based on what he says, when he has done nothing to show that he believes any of it, and in any case has changed his stories so many times his head is spinning like Linda Blair's?

Boy.
Wolf.

320 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 6:59:23am

re: #315 NJDhockeyfan

Been reading DKos?

I love how those genius posters can't spell!

321 songbird  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:00:25am

re: #273 alegrias

* * *
"....The presidential campaign has fizzled to a disappointing end with candidates now 'chosen'. Can't we just vote for "none of the above"..."

OSTRICH Head in the Sand Bird, was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Voting "None of the above" is distinctly cowardly and not helpful IF you care about our country.

I believe our nominating process failed us......

I'll still vote, and we are actively involved in the process - my husband is a local candidate, but we are both very disappointed in the choices this time around. How weak and poor our choices were! I'll probably write in my personal choice.

322 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:01:15am

re: #281 razorbacker
Morning! Is the Oregon Health Plan a State Run version of what Obamerama has in plan for us, or is it a private plan that uses that name (down here in NC, Aetna Health Care called it The North Carolina Health Care Plan)?

323 Occasional Reader  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:02:15am

re: #316 lawhawk

In that respect, it's like the F117, except it can go faster and can defend itself from air targets.

Actually, it's significantly stealthier than the F-117 (and more agile than the F-16).

Very heartening that they're considering selling it to Israel. The Israelis, unfortunately, are gonna need 'em.

324 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:02:34am

re: #312 realwest

Spent all day in the ER to find he had appendicits, and they cut on him that night late. His recovery was complicated...seems something they were giving him made him vomit constantly. They stopped giving him everything, he's eating now, and seems completely normal except for high blood pressure.

I have emailed his guidance counselor and teachers, they just need to know when he will be out, so they can know when to administer the tests for him. They said no problem.

325 razorbacker  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:02:46am

Yes, please. I would like a bed near the window.

During a visit to the mental asylum, a visitor asked the Director how he determines whether a patient should be institutionalized.

'Well,' said the Director, 'we fill up a bathtub, then we offer a teaspoon, a teacup and a bucket to the patient and ask him or her to empty the bathtub.'

'Oh, I understand,' said the visitor. 'A normal person would use the bucket because it's bigger than the spoon or the teacup.'

'No.' said the Director, 'A normal person would pull the plug. Do you want a bed near the window?'

326 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:02:49am

re: #294 Killian Bundy
"HANO jump" ROFL! Good morning Killian!

327 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:03:03am
328 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:03:18am

re: #321 songbird

I'll probably write in my personal choice.


It may make you feel better, but you might as well vote for Obama.

329 Occasional Reader  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:03:36am

re: #321 songbird

I'll probably write in my personal choice.

I am not trying to offend, but... I think that's childish, to be perfectly frank. I mean, why not write in Ronald Reagan, while you're at it? Or Abraham Lincoln? We have the choices that we have. Choose as best you can.

330 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:03:45am

re: #323 Occasional Reader

Actually, it's significantly stealthier than the F-117 (and more agile than the F-16).

Very heartening that they're considering selling it to Israel. The Israelis, unfortunately, are gonna need 'em.

I'm going to the Hampton Roads Air Show on the 21st. They're going to have an F-22 demonstration - can't wait to see that!

331 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:04:06am

re: #315 NJDhockeyfan


OMG! I swear I don't go to that place! I just know the mentality of the kostards.

332 razorbacker  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:04:14am

re: #322 realwest

The former, as I understand it. But I'm open to correction as required.

333 guzziguy  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:04:17am

re: #317 madisonsfriend

You mean honor D-Day instead of the birthday of a Spanish painter of the 1600s? I don't understand the problem

Google is no longer my default search engine.

/tiny little voice of one

334 Occasional Reader  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:04:56am

re: #319 Tigger2005

And if Obama says any of these things, so what?

Exactly. He sat in that church for 20 years; nothing he can say now can change that.

335 hydrocarbon hank  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:05:06am

Will BIG BROWN take the Triple Crown?

336 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:05:20am

re: #292 alegrias

We have a whole series of Obama back flips on various issues now. Unlike Kerry's famous flip-flopping, which was the usual garden variety political opportunism and lack of principles, Obama's is different. Obama is a classic narcissist.

Obama really believes it, every lie is true to him while he is saying it, because it is useful to him. It is useful to him that you believe it. In other words, if you believe his lies, you are useful to him. You are the change you believe in. People who are no longer useful to him are disposable. His grandmother, his Muslim childhood, William Ayers, Louis Farrakhan, Rev. Wright & his Church, Jerusalem, Tony Rezko. All of them served Obama's needs for a while. When they became "a distraction" from the one true purpose (serving Obama) they became disposable. They don't exist anymore to Obama.

I can't wait till the Michelle 'Whitey tape' comes out. I'm especially looking forward to his "this isn't the Michelle I knew" speech.

337 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:05:25am
338 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:05:59am

re: #311 Occasional Reader Good morning O.R.! I hope they have debates where the moderators only function is to keep track of the time each candidate speaks - LOVE to hear McCain ask Obama two questions no one could have expected and let the American People see what an empty suit and empty head he really is.

339 songbird  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:06:22am

re: #328 redstateredneck

It may make you feel better, but you might as well vote for Obama.

re: #329 Occasional Reader

I am not trying to offend, but... I think that's childish, to be perfectly frank. I mean, why not write in Ronald Reagan, while you're at it? Or Abraham Lincoln? We have the choices that we have. Choose as best you can.

With as weak as the Republican party is now, 4 years of Obama may be what we need to shake the party back to it's true principals. I'm disappointed that we've drifted so far from the "contract for America" principals and the acceptance of fiscal irresponsibility.

340 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:06:25am

re: #311 Occasional Reader

I *so* hope that during the debates, someone - either McCain, or a moderator - will ask Obama to define what a "typical white person" is. Perhaps then ask him if there are "typical" blacks, asians, latinos, and what their respective attributes are.

Good morning.

Don't hold your breath.

341 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:06:40am

re: #333 guzziguy

Whom do you use now? Any other inputs from Lizardia?

342 alegrias  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:06:52am

re: #256 phil flavin

Call me naive, but I can not for the life me understand why Google can't honor the day of days!

* * *
To internationalists, it's just another day.

They've rewritten history, so D-Day is probably just another unneccesary intervention.

Wasn't that Spielberg movie's point of view dedicated to just finding one Private Ryan, not necessarily liberating a continent from an evil empire of totalitarians?

/words like evil empire, totalitarian are so judgmental of others' motives--all we need is change without preconditions and we'll get along.

343 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:07:10am

re: #327 buzzsawmonkey

re: #267 Kenneth

re: #283 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey

But the Communists were on our side in WWII--after the Soviet Union was invaded.

That's my point. Up to the German invasion of Russia in June 1941, the international left was opposed to entry into WWII. The offical propaganda line from Moscow after the Non-Aggression Pact was that the Nazis were fighting Western Imperialism. Once the Soviets were attacked, then the left saw the Nazis as the enemy.

344 cygnus  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:07:10am

re: #154 jcbunga

Today is D-Day. Let's remember. If you haven't been to the WW2 Memorial in DC yet, try to go. There's always a vet there with family, and a crowd surrounding them shaking hands.

Here's FDR's prayer broadcast to the nation that day, and a link to the original recording (Amazing how leaders and Democrats have changed):
[Link: www.historyplace.com...]

My Fellow Americans:

Last night, when I spoke with you about the fall of Rome, I knew at that moment that troops of the United States and our Allies were crossing the Channel in another and greater operation. It has come to pass with success thus far.

And so, in this poignant hour, I ask you to join with me in prayer:

Almighty God: Our sons, pride of our nation, this day have set upon a mighty endeavor, a struggle to preserve our Republic, our religion, and our civilization, and to set free a suffering humanity.

Lead them straight and true; give strength to their arms, stoutness to their hearts, steadfastness in their faith.

They will need Thy blessings. Their road will be long and hard. For the enemy is strong. He may hurl back our forces. Success may not come with rushing speed, but we shall return again and again; and we know that by Thy grace, and by the righteousness of our cause, our sons will triumph.

They will be sore tried, by night and by day, without rest -- until the victory is won. The darkness will be rent by noise and flame. Men's souls will be shaken with the violences of war.

For these men are lately drawn from the ways of peace. They fight not for the lust of conquest. They fight to end conquest. They fight to liberate. They fight to let justice arise, and tolerance and goodwill among all Thy people. They yearn but for the end of battle, for their return to the haven of home.

Some will never return. Embrace these, Father, and receive them, Thy heroic servants, into Thy kingdom.

And for us at home -- fathers, mothers, children, wives, sisters, and brothers of brave men overseas, whose thoughts and prayers are ever with them -- help us, Almighty God, to rededicate ourselves in renewed faith in Thee in this hour of great sacrifice.

Many people have urged that I call the nation into a single day of special prayer. But because the road is long and the desire is great, I ask that our people devote themselves in a continuance of prayer. As we rise to each new day, and again when each day is spent, let words of prayer be on our lips, invoking Thy help to our efforts.

Give us strength, too -- strength in our daily tasks, to redouble the contributions we make in the physical and the material support of our armed forces.

And let our hearts be stout, to wait out the long travail, to bear sorrows that may come, to impart our courage unto our sons wheresoever they may be.

And, O Lord, give us faith. Give us faith in Thee; faith in our sons; faith in each other; faith in our united crusade. Let not the keenness of our spirit ever be dulled. Let not the impacts of temporary events, of temporal matters of but fleeting moment -- let not these deter us in our unconquerable purpose.

With Thy blessing, we shall prevail over the unholy forces of our enemy. Help us to conquer the apostles of greed and racial arrogances. Lead us to the saving of our country, and with our sister nations into a world unity that will spell a sure peace -- a peace invulnerable to the schemings of unworthy men. And a peace that will let all of men live in freedom, reaping the just rewards of their honest toil.

Thy will be done, Almighty God.

Amen.

Franklin D. Roosevelt - June 6, 1944

Wow, the ACLU would have kittens if the President said something like this. Along with most of the Democrap party.

345 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:07:22am

re: #335 hydrocarbon hank

Will BIG BROWN take the Triple Crown?

I say no... He has a cracked hoof and it's going to be 95 degrees tomorrow afternoon AND of course, it's a mile and a half...

346 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:07:23am

re: #324 rightside

How frightening.

Thanking God that he is ok!

347 ploome hineni[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:07:26am
348 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:07:26am

re: #335 hydrocarbon hank

Will BIG BROWN take the Triple Crown?


I hope. I heard he had a hoof problem. I certainly hope he's fit to race and doesn't get injured.

349 newsjunkie_ky  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:07:55am

re: #335 hydrocarbon hank

Will BIG BROWN take the Triple Crown?


Yes.

350 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:08:13am

re: #335 hydrocarbon hank

Will BIG BROWN take the Triple Crown?

Maybe, but I don't want to see any comparions to Secretariat unless Big Brown is 32 lengths ahead of the 2nd place finisher.

351 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:08:29am

re: #339 songbird

In a pre 9/11 world, I may have gone along with that, but too much is at stake now.

352 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:08:49am

re: #341 rightside

Whom do you use now? Any other inputs from Lizardia?

I use AltaVista. It's the first search engine, started in 1995, which is when I started using it.

353 Occasional Reader  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:09:08am

re: #338 realwest

Good morning O.R.! I hope they have debates where the moderators only function is to keep track of the time each candidate speaks

I have seen some of the "moderator asks questions" formats that went off pretty well. The advantage is that the moderator is "neutral", so can deliver the question without being seen as simply picking a fight. I recall Charlene Hunter-Something in the 2004 VP debates asking John Edwards, "if you and Senator Kerry had been in office since 2000, is it the case that Saddam Hussein would still be in power today?" Heh.

354 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:09:46am

re: #342 alegrias

* * *
To internationalists, it's just another day.

They've rewritten history, so D-Day is probably just another unneccesary intervention.

Wasn't
that Spielberg movie's point of view dedicated to just finding one
Private Ryan, not necessarily liberating a continent from an evil
empire of totalitarians?

/words like evil empire, totalitarian are so judgmental of others' motives--all we need is change without preconditions and we'll get along.

"Saving Private Ryan was the only good thing to come out of the war" (quoting from memory)

How I hate that movie - and everyone I know thinks I should love it!

355 Occasional Reader  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:10:03am

re: #339 songbird

In that case, please feel free to write in Ronald Reagan, or stay home.

356 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:10:12am

re: #324 rightside Whoa, glad to hear your son is ok and that there's no problem with the make-up exams.
I wonder if they gave your son too much anesthesia? (iirc it's the most common cause of post surgery throwing up).
Did they do the operation the old fashioned way or laproscopically? If started as lapro and then had to go old fashioned, too much anesthesia is the likely cause of the nausea.
In any event I'm glad he's gonna be ok.
BTW, how old is he?

357 JammieWearingFool  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:10:38am

re: #347 ploome hineni
I believe Charles had a post on that a couple weeks ago.

358 razorbacker  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:11:17am

re: #339 songbird

With as weak as the Republican party is now, 4 years of Obama may be what we need to shake the party back to it's true principals. I'm disappointed that we've drifted so far from the "contract for America" principals and the acceptance of fiscal irresponsibility.

Frankly, I agree that the Republican party is 'drowning'.

I'm just not so sure that America can hold it's collective breath for 4 years whilst waiting for the lifeguard.

359 songbird  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:11:19am

re: #351 redstateredneck

In a pre 9/11 world, I may have gone along with that, but too much is at stake now.

I totally understand. It would be good to know who McCain will choose for his VP. That would make a difference for me.

360 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:11:47am

re: #346 loppyd

They were able to do it laparoscopically, but the appendix burst as it was being pulled through the tiny incision, so mass doses of antibiotics were administered to fend off sepsis. It was more scary for his recovery than the surgery. It took 45 mins for the actual surgery, and 5 days before he stopped vomiting.

Thank you for your thoughts. :^)

361 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:12:12am

re: #359 songbird

Who do you like for VP?

362 ploome hineni[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:12:29am
363 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:12:54am

re: #360 rightside

How awful! Prayers for a full and quick recovery.

364 songbird  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:12:57am

re: #361 redstateredneck

Who do you like for VP?

I'd prefer Huckabee (there, I've just told the world how conservative I am)

365 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:13:02am

re: #350 Honorary Yooper

Maybe, but I don't want to see any comparions to Secretariat unless Big Brown is 32 lengths ahead of the 2nd place finisher.

366 ciaospirit  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:13:09am

June 6, 1944. Let us never forget.

D-Day Fact Sheet
6 June 1944 Normandy, France

367 Occasional Reader  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:13:27am

re: #354 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey

"Saving Private Ryan was the only good thing to come out of the war" (quoting from memory)

How I hate that movie - and everyone I know thinks I should love it!

I agree that was a lousy line, but I like the movie, and give Spielberg something of a pass on that line. Given Speilberg's work in documenting the stories of Shoah survivors, I do not believe in any way he fails to understand the righteousness of defeating fascism.

And the LAST dramatic line in the movie conveys a rather conservative message: "Earn this." That message is of course, to us.

368 Honorary Yooper  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:13:38am

re: #339 songbird

With as weak as the Republican party is now, 4 years of Obama may be what we need to shake the party back to it's true principals. I'm disappointed that we've drifted so far from the "contract for America" principals and the acceptance of fiscal irresponsibility.

Then saddle yourself with what an Obama presidency will bring. As for me, I cannot stomach even the thought of a Chicago Machine HACK in White House letting the Illinois Combine control not just the city, not just the county, not just the state, but also the Federal government.

A vote for John McCain for me is a vote against the Illinois Combine and their insidious brand of corruption.

369 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:13:39am

re: #359 songbird

I totally understand. It would be good to know who McCain will choose for his VP. That would make a difference for me.

In a month or so you will know... There is a lot of time...

370 hydrocarbon hank  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:13:44am

re: #345 tfc3rid

I say no... He has a cracked hoof and it's going to be 95 degrees tomorrow afternoon AND of course, it's a mile and a half...

I'm worried about the cracked hoof - it's an interesting injury, I had a mare with a crack near the same location and she never missed a beat. I am concerned, his trainer seems to be somewhat of a nut.

In good health, the distance won't be a problem. If he runs a nice relaxed race like he did at the Belmont, there isn't a horse that can touch him.

....but horses are just like people, they have good and bad days - I hope he has a good one!

371 kulhwch  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:13:48am

re: #31 Lucius Septimius

"Wicked Nick" is how he's referred to in our house; my Lovely Bride is a Machiavelli scholar, which means dinner time is always an adventure.

Could be worse worse ... she could be into Lucretia Borgia ...

}:)     ["Honey, what kind of soup is this?"  "Just shut up & eat it!"]

372 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:14:05am
373 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:14:11am

re: #364 songbird

I'd prefer Huckabee (there, I've just told the world how conservative I am)

I'm hoping Romney.

374 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:14:27am

re: #364 songbird

I'd prefer Huckabee (there, I've just told the world how conservative I am)

That's not THAT Conservative...

375 CoCo  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:14:40am

As a two-time cancer survivor, I have to refute some of the earlier comments here in regard to the Relay for Life Logo...

For those of you who have not heard of the American Cancer Society Relay For Life , it is an overnight event in which team members take turns walking, strolling or even running around the track. People often ask why Relay For Life is held through the night. The event is held overnight to signify the fact that cancer never sleeps. If you look at the Relay For Life logo, you will see a symbol of a moon and a sun. This represents a day in the life of a cancer survivor, but not just one day. It represents the journey of a cancer survivor from the time of diagnosis until the time of recovery. The overnight event has the same symbolization. The sun is up at the start of the event, it goes down for a dark period, representing the diagnosis and fight, and then rises again in the morning, providing hope and the promise of recovery.

Some times a moon is just a moon.

376 Iron Fist  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:14:46am

re: #347 ploome hineni,

But we're expected to believe that Hussein Obama isn't a Mohammedan or extraordinarily favorably disposed towards Mohammedans.

Hope!

Change!

377 Occasional Reader  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:15:16am

re: #324 rightside


Sorry to hear about your son's travails; glad he is okay now.

378 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:15:38am
379 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:15:39am

re: #372 buzzsawmonkey

Excellent analysis...

380 ploome hineni[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:16:21am
381 Nevergiveup  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:17:01am

re: #367 Occasional Reader

I agree that was a lousy line, but I like the movie, and give Spielberg something of a pass on that line. Given Speilberg's work in documenting the stories of Shoah survivors, I do not believe in any way he fails to understand the righteousness of defeating fascism.

And the LAST dramatic line in the movie conveys a rather conservative message: "Earn this." That message is of course, to us.

To bad he has gone over to the dark side

382 songbird  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:18:26am

re: #374 tfc3rid

That's not THAT Conservative...

I'm pretty conservative, but I like the preventative healthcare idea. And both my husband and I have a lot of compassion for the poor.

There was an article in the Reader Arcticles about Huckabee that was pretty reasonable......here is the link.

383 alegrias  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:18:50am

re: #310 opnion

Obama's idea of fighting the War on Teerror is to signal the enemy in Iraq that we will retreat.
You know, so that he can concentrate on Afghanistan.
Obama will not fight Muslims.
He will apologize to and accpomodate them
:

* * *
As Hillary Clinton helpfully pointed out, the junior senator from Illinois has not held a meeting on Afghanistan though it is his responsibility as chair of some Senate committee to DO SOMETHING about Afghanistan.

384 redstateredneck  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:19:31am

re: #375 CoCo

As a two-time cancer survivor, I have to refute some of the earlier comments here in regard to the Relay for Life Logo...


Some times a moon is just a moon.

Yep.

385 cygnus  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:19:51am

re: #168 Kenneth

Worst logo ever.

They spend 400,000 pounds on that? Yuck.

386 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:20:05am

re: #383 alegrias

* * *
As
Hillary Clinton helpfully pointed out, the junior senator from Illinois
has not held a meeting on Afghanistan though it is his responsibility as chair of some Senate committee to DO SOMETHING about Afghanistan.

As soon as he gets some Arab speakers on his staff, he will!

387 aboo-Hoo-Hoo  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:20:17am

re: #347 ploome hineni

WHAT IS GOING ON HERE

We're beginning a very unfavorable transition from the 'end of the beginning' of this War, to the 'beginning of the end.'

388 Kenneth  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:21:26am

re: #372 buzzsawmonkey

Very incisive posts. Everything is personal to Obama, his policies are merely reflections of his personal qualities. He promises to negotiate with Iran, Syria & North Korea, without preconditions, because he is convinced in his own personal ability to convince people.

It's another sign of his Narcissistic Personality Disorder. I keep harping on about this because such a man can do a huge amount of damage to the country & the world.

Obama is mentally unfit for office.

389 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:22:01am

re: #356 realwest

Just received word from 3 of his 4 teachers now, he's been exempted from taking his finals.

He was "lapped" completely, so only under anesthesia for 45 minutes give or take.

Not sure we will ever know, but once they stopped everything, his vomiting stopped and he was able to eat solid food and keep it down. he is 1000% better than he has been doing. We're all champing at the bit to get him home. He turned 17 in April.

Thanks to all the other Lizards for their prayers and wishes, truly appreciated!

390 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:22:11am
391 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:22:19am

re: #380 ploome hineni

Ploome... I agree... In reading all about it today in depth, I am apalled that he actually received this type of 'treatment'...

This is all because of the media... If the government was not so damn scared of the media propaganda, they would have already had this ass wipte tried and well tortured already...

392 alegrias  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:22:28am

re: #321 songbird

I believe our nominating process failed us......

I'll still vote, and we are actively involved in the process - my husband is a local candidate, but we are both very disappointed in the choices this time around. How weak and poor our choices were! I'll probably write in my personal choice.

* * *
That nominating process horse is out of the barn.

Yes by all means, vote your "personal" choice for someone less "weak & poor" than the only person standing between our country and one inexperienced dangerous empty vessel.

GAZE, my "personal" choice

393 Occasional Reader  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:22:28am

re: #385 cygnus

They spend 400,000 pounds on that? Yuck.

It would make a wonderful logo for "London during the Blitz".

394 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:22:29am

re: #385 cygnus

They spend 400,000 pounds on that? Yuck.

"A modern take on the Olympic colours" WTF? It's red & gold - them's the colors of Communist China, not the Olympics! FFS, Homer Simpson's "Springy" mascot is better than that!

395 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:23:19am

re: #382 songbird

Huckeabee may be socially conservative to some degree but he is most definitely not economically conservative...

396 lawhawk  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:23:24am
397 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:23:29am

re: #352 Ward Cleaver

Thanks for that. I'll give it a whirl.

"visualize whirled peas"

398 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:23:38am

re: #360 rightside

Yikes. Happy to hear he's feeling better now and come home
and get spoiled. :~)

399 cygnus  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:23:39am

re: #188 Ojoe

Some of our European friends do remember.

The people who see and make a difference are not the majority.

But the remnant, so to speak, will carry the day in the future too.

Merci beaucoup.

400 razorbacker  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:23:57am

re: #382 songbird

I'm pretty conservative, but I like the preventative healthcare idea. And both my husband and I have a lot of compassion for the poor.

There was an article in the Reader Arcticles about Huckabee that was pretty reasonable......here is the link.

'Twas Huckabee that insisted that illegal aliens be covered under Arkansas' taxpayer funded plan for women and children (men need not apply).

'Twas Huckabee that insisted that illegal aliens be granted resident Arkansan status (and the lower tuition rates) for admission to Arkansas' colleges.

'Twas Huckabee that pardoned the murderer who went to MO and murdered again.

I'm not complaining. I'm just saying.

401 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:24:10am

re: #344 cygnus I briefly mentioned that today was the 64th anniversary of D-Day when I first came on board this morning.
But I don't think any of US can really appreciate what those brave men went through for all of us.
None of us - not me, not TFK, not any other combat veteran of any other war - none of us, even if they've seen The Longest Day or Private Ryan.
So many troops were killed in the water and so many more died on the beaches (and that's not including those who were "just" wounded) so that we and Europe could enjoy the fruits of Freedom.
And I'm fucking PISSED OFF again at Google. And at everyone else who won't take the crappy one minute of their lives today, to pause and remember that day and those incredible sacrifices those brave men made.
And it's funny - I recently saw a discovery channel or one of those (maybe National Geographic) do a special on some of the few oldtimers left who went back to Omaha Beach and how well they were treated by the French people from the villages and towns around that area and those schoolkids, who spend two entire days studying the history of D-Day, and then I see Google, again, and I just get pissed off again.
Those who did and those who directly benefited, like those French school children haven't and will never forget that day.
And neither should any of us.

402 GreenBear  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:24:11am

I don't who said it but it was always one of my favorite sayings, "Evil Prevails When Good Men Do Nothing".

I always figured that's driving force beneath LGF, is that we are all here doing what little we can to fight back the tide of evil and to support those who do far more in some very inhospitable places like Afghanistan and Iraq. Some here have done more in the past and some will do more in the future. I'm sure some with us here now will evenually even sacrifice all to combat evil in the world.

Some seem to think that a small effort isn't worth making. If all you do is discuss fighting evil, then do it and support those actually fight it physically. If you don't have the ability, through age, mental or physical condition, or even simply the courage, to volunteer for the good fight, support those who have taken up the banner. Welcome troops at the airport, serve in the USO, donate care packages. No effort is too small but don't expect brass bands.

Make your views widely and unashamedly known. Too many people don't want to upset anybody, so they keep quiet. Well, sometimes it takes a little shaking up for some people to begin to think about what's true and good. I have found that many younger men and women absorb the MSM position as "the Truth" without question, perhaps on a subconscious level. Every once in a while, it's good for them to have some old fart challenge the perfect "Obama World" that has everybody getting along if they would only have a cookie and talk. They need to be told that there are many people in this world that don't want, or even like, your cookies and they'll kill you so can't give cookies to anybody else.

It is nice to get along with people and be pleasant. But I have also found that the quality of my life is often measured by how pissed-off my enemies are at any particular time. I figure if they are upset, maybe I've done something right.

That's my Friday two cents. I feel much better.

Have a good weekend and don't forget to fight the forces of evil.

GreenBear

403 Tigger2005  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:24:48am

re: #334 Occasional Reader

Exactly. He sat in that church for 20 years; nothing he can say now can change that.

He's just so pathetically transparent, so empty, so lightweight, such a human pretzel, an unprincipled, cheap, slick, manipulative liar with a smarmy grin. He puts Jim Bob the local used-car salesman to shame. Hell, he puts politicians to shame. I have never quite seen his like. Anyone who believes he means any conservative-sounding thing he says is a naive fool, when they are so clearly belied by his actions and associations throughout his entire post-scholastic social, religious, and political life. He disgusts me.

404 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:24:56am
405 songbird  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:25:23am

re: #395 tfc3rid

But he does have successful governing experience and would provide balance to a McCain ticket.

406 Tigger2005  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:26:47am

re: #339 songbird

With as weak as the Republican party is now, 4 years of Obama may be what we need to shake the party back to it's true principals. I'm disappointed that we've drifted so far from the "contract for America" principals and the acceptance of fiscal irresponsibility.

I'd suggest reading Thomas Sowell's latest. If Iran gets the bomb on Obama's watch, everything changes.

Everything.

407 loppyd  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:26:50am

re: #395 tfc3rid

Huckeabee may be socially conservative to some degree but he is most definitely not economically conservative...

He raised taxes while Gov. of Arkansas.

Mitt vetoed every tax increase that came across his desk while Gov. of Mass.

408 hydrocarbon hank  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:27:31am

6/5/2008 - 9:17 AM

NYMEX Crude Future - $133.95/bbl
NYMEX Henry Hub Natural Gas - $12.77/MMBtu

/A special thanks to all of the 2008 candidates - their hack energy policies will push the prices to new records.

Prices will SOAR! In infuriates me to hear John McCain speak about his "energy policy". Our poiticians are foolish if they believe cap-and-trade, etc. will do anything but drive prices higher.

Call your Senator and Rep. today!

409 realwest  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:27:40am

re: #366 ciaospirit Thank you for that.

410 Iron Fist  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:27:44am

re: #380 ploome hineni,

See no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil. There are no terrorists in Gitmo. Khalid Sheik Mohammed was in Gitmo. Therefore KSM isn't a terrorist.

You have to love what passes for logic on the L³eft. Of course, not even they really believe it. The L³eft support the enemies of America. It wouldn't surprise me if Obama has "Al Qaeda Forever" tattooed on his ass. So it is certainly no surprise that Yee is getting a speaking role at the Convention. The Bad Mean Old USA is being harsh with the non-Terrorists at Gitmo will probably be a major theme for the Democrats.

411 rightside  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:27:58am

re: #398 loppyd

LOL, I am rolling out the riding lawn mower onto the grass so he sees that when we roll up the driveway!

412 alegrias  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:28:41am

re: #372 buzzsawmonkey

re: #292 alegrias

re: #319 Tigger2005

re: #336 Kenneth

Forgive, please, my post-pimping, but I invite you all to look at ##79 and 107 above, and follow the link in #79 to #635 in the prior thread, for a discussion of Obama substitution of personalized (not personal) and racial platitudes for anything remotely resembling policy.


* * *
Thanks BUZZ, your posts were EXCELLENT pointing out the narcissicism of "personalized" feelings & emotions versus America's strategic POLICY INTERESTs.

Some of us are so wrapped around personal pet peeves, our favorite single issues, we will IGNORE our country's critical needs.

Voting is a civic duty to lead our country, not dreaming up personalized fictitious companion--but that's just my idea.

It's for commander in chief, not our personal "Saviour" and friend.

413 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:29:22am

re: #410 Iron Fist

,

See
no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil. There are no terrorists in Gitmo.
Khalid Sheik Mohammed was in Gitmo. Therefore KSM isn't a terrorist.

You have to love what passes for logic on the L³eft. Of course, not even they really believe
it. The L³eft support the enemies of America. It wouldn't surprise me
if Obama has "Al Qaeda Forever" tattooed on his ass. So it is certainly
no surprise that Yee is getting a speaking role at the Convention. The Bad Mean Old USA is being harsh with the non-Terrorists at Gitmo will probably be a major theme for the Democrats.

Unfortunately, even McCain wants to close down Gitmo.

414 cygnus  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:29:52am

re: #252 rightside

Didn't you know Juan Williams is an uncle Tom?

Along with Bill Cosby. Horrible.

415 songbird  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:30:18am

re: #407 loppyd

re: #407 loppyd

He raised taxes while Gov. of Arkansas.

Mitt vetoed every tax increase that came across his desk while Gov. of Mass.

Mitt sure raised a lot of Fees, though!

Face it, they both raised taxes. Huckabee raised taxes for a purpose and the goal - roads and infrastructure - vastly improved the economy of the state of Arkansas.

416 tfc3rid  Fri, Jun 6, 2008 7:30:28am