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Saudi Arabia Hearts Barack Obama

Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 1:00:32 pm PDT

Our friends the Saudis are solidly behind Barack Obama for President, because they think he’ll bring the kind of “change” they’re looking for.

And if you don’t know what kind of “change” Saudi Arabia wants, you must not be paying attention.

In an editorial, the Saudi paper Al-Watan stated that U.S. Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama is more capable than anyone else of bringing about change in U.S. policy, particularly in all things connected to the Middle East.

The paper added that in light of Obama’s intent to conduct a dialogue with Iran, the Middle East countries should launch a dialogue with him and help him better understand what is going on.

Source: Al-Watan, Saudi Arabia, June 6, 2008

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490 comments

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1 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:01:54pm

There's no bus big enough.

2 Cap'n DOC  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:01:55pm

Yup. I'm sure I'm not the first to observe Obama is good at dialogue.

3 BGOH  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:02:30pm

Obama will make the world love us! What could go wrong?

/

4 Clemente  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:02:47pm

Pretty sure they see Jimmy Jr. between those remarkable ears. Plus, they gotta love his name...

5 bnichols10  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:03:33pm

We seem to be getting better and better all the time at doing what other countries think is best at the expense of what is good for the US. Why can't we get a President who vows to do what's best for the Unites States first?

6 sloggin420[deleted]  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:03:41pm
7 Gjergj Skënderbeu  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:04:03pm

Barry just keep on racking up some great endorsements!

8 Shug  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:04:17pm

And we all the affinity the Saudis have for black people

/

9 Golem Akbar  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:04:23pm

/Can't wait 'til Osama send his endorsement, via either the cave or the grave.

10 sloggin420[deleted]  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:04:51pm
11 Iron Fist  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:05:32pm

As if Bush didn't appease the Saudis enough! They must be salivating to get a true believer in Gorebull Warming at the helm. $7 a gallon gas, here we come.

12 PISSED  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:05:32pm

re: #10 sloggin420

You mean like maybe drill for oil, build nuclear power plants, enforce our boarders, support and celebrate capitalism?

NOW YOUR TALKIN"

13 BGOH  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:05:37pm

re: #10 sloggin420

You mean like maybe drill for oil, build nuclear power plants, enforce our boarders, support and celebrate capitalism?

THAT'S CRAZY TALK, YOU RACIST!

/

14 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:05:40pm

Good thing. Obama needs the Saudis to afford fuel for his bus.
Running over people is bad for mileage.

15 Sharmuta  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:05:42pm
the Middle East countries should launch a dialogue with him and help him better understand what is going on.

Did they just extend dawa'h to obama?

16 songbird  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:05:59pm

You can always tell a man by his friends.

17 Miss Molly  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:06:01pm

Talk about being know by the friends you keep!

18 Iron Fist  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:06:11pm

re: #6 sloggin420,

Think he'll go in and kiss the rock?

19 Roentgen  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:06:24pm

I wonder what Michelle thinks of life in Saudi Arabia? Would she be proud of it?

20 Shug  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:06:31pm
The Middle East countries should launch a dialogue with him and help him better understand what is going on.

That's not all they'd like to launch at America.

21 pegcity  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:06:36pm

re: #10 sloggin420

The problem with America as a nation is its too damn nice.

22 bulwrk  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:06:39pm

Middle East countries should launch a dialogue with him and help him better understand what is going on.


Translation

we can yank his strings like a puppet.

23 Intrepid  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:06:46pm

ME leaders are salivating at the possibility of this light-weight winning the US Presidential nod because they will finally get their wish: no one will stand beside Israel against their long-term goal of driving her into the sea.

24 Cap'n DOC  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:06:53pm

re: #18 Iron Fist

You beat me to it - I was gonna suggest a Pit Stop in Mecca.

25 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:07:05pm

re: #11 Iron Fist

As if Bush didn't appease the Saudis enough! They must be salivating to get a true believer in Gorebull Warming at the helm. $7 a gallon gas, here we come.

Bush only promised to sell the Saudis nuclear reactors.
Whereas Obama will have some spare nuclear weapons after he unilaterally disarms.

26 coquimbojoe  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:07:10pm

...the Middle East countries should launch a dialogue with him and help him better understand what is going on....

so, they acknowledge he doesn't understand the situation? Or they know he will believe the way the spin it?

Or both?

27 Gjergj Skënderbeu  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:07:59pm
Barack Obama is more capable than anyone else of bringing about change in U.S. policy, particularly in all things connected to the Middle East.

In other words, throwing Israel under the bus.

28 Da_Beerfreak  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:08:08pm

re: #1 unrealizedviewpoint

There's no bus big enough.

For all of us to fit under!
// {:-(™

29 see bs  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:08:12pm

That's because NObama will turn a blind eye to any thing the house of S(fr)aud will do.....

30 Just Another Four-letter Word  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:08:39pm

Anybody our foreign "friends" want for President should be automatically disqualified for the position. Of course it depends on the country, but since most of 'em either hate our guts or downright dislike us, we need to make note of whom they support...

JAFLW

/...or whom the moonbats support...

31 Shug  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:08:45pm

They must be nervous that nobody will be able to kiss their ass like Bush did

32 Cicero05  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:09:13pm

Hamas, Ahmadinejad and the Saudis all agree: Obama '08.

33 leprechaun  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:09:23pm

re: #14 Kosh's Shadow

yes, unless its a GREEN bus powered by self-righteousness of Obamaniacs ...then it will be a perpetual motion machine.

34 Spiritualized  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:09:48pm

Someone seriously needs to investigate where all the $200 donations are coming from.

35 FreakyBoy  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:09:57pm

I wonder what the netroots will say. They have always used Bush's friendship to the Saudi's as a slur.

36 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:10:05pm

re: #32 Cicero05

Hamas, Ahmadinejad and the Saudis all agree: Obama '08.

The Shi'ites and the Sunnis together. He really is a uniter!

37 jorline  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:10:05pm

I'm sold now...if the Saudi's think he's the golden boy...nuf said!

38 Just Another Four-letter Word  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:10:49pm

re: #19 Roentgen

I wonder what Michelle thinks of life in Saudi Arabia? Would she be proud of it?

She's frikkin' clueless. Willfully blind. Ignorant. LLL. Need I say more?

JAFLW

39 Ojoe  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:11:01pm

Man I get an image of Obama as that little pointy part on a virus as it approaches a cell.

40 BGOH  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:11:18pm

re: #33 leprechaun

yes, unless its a GREEN bus powered by self-righteousness of Obamaniacs ...then it will be a perpetual motion machine.

The smug cloud following that bus around is astounding in size. Let's just hope it doesn't run into the smug cloud from George Clooney's acceptance speech, or Utah may become an uninhabitable wasteland.

41 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:11:22pm

Charles, Thank you!

I posted about the Saudi's lobbyists in DC hiring Obama supporter Bill Richardson's former press secretary today on another thread.

Qorvis Communications which represents the Saudis in DC, just hired democrat Tom Reynolds to be a director.

42 gymnast  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:11:34pm

It will be interesting to see if the Umma Kahuna visits Saudi before he visits Iraq. $10 bucks say he goes to the Magic Kingdom first.

43 Kefirah  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:11:40pm

re: #23 Intrepid

that's what scares me - and actually makes me want to make aliyah more than ever.

obama will single-handedly do more to harm the situation in the middle east than ... well... anyone since or before carter.

obamanos - right into the sea. terrifying.

44 Ben Hur  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:12:05pm

Bush hates the Saudis.

45 Biff  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:12:17pm

McCain commercial:

Actor dressed to look like a Saudi prince/minister of info addressing the camera:

U.S. Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama is more capable than anyone else of bringing about change in U.S. policy, particularly in all things connected to the Middle East.

In light of Obama’s intent to conduct a dialogue with Iran, the Middle East countries should launch a dialogue with him and help him better understand what is going on.

Source: Al-Watan, Saudi Arabia, June 6, 2008.

46 Ojoe  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:12:18pm

"Dude ain't one of us"

which poster said that?

it's right.

47 Sharmuta  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:12:43pm

It's dawa'h- they've invited him to islam.

48 nigella  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:13:21pm

Yes, Saudi, by all means open a dialog with the"messiah" about what's happening in the middle east.Some body has to, as it is certainly obvious he doesn't have a clue. Oh, and don't forget the part about how the evil jooooooze are to blame for everything. Of course we all know Barry already thinks that.

49 Catttt  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:13:26pm

OT

Cavuto on Fox just slam dunked a Dem rep on resources exploration - cut him off when he wouldn't stop doing the blame game.

Now he's talking with Senator McConnell.

Mr. Cavuto talking sense about focusing on the issue instead of partisan fighting.

McConnell says he'd be open for a deal.

Cavuto ssays he will broker the deal in his spare time. I WISH they'd listen to him.

50 Just Another Four-letter Word  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:13:43pm

re: #39 Ojoe

Man I get an image of Obama as that little pointy part on a virus as it approaches a cell.

Cellular pr0n? Shame on you!

JAFLW

51 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:13:44pm
“We don’t mind–actually we like Mr. Obama. We hope he will (win) the election and I do believe he is like John Kennedy, great man with great principle, and he has a vision to change America to make it in a position to lead the world community but not with domination and arrogance,”


-Ahmed Yousef, ; political advisor to HAMAS

52 Ojoe  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:14:27pm

re: #50 Just Another Four-letter Word

one man sleeper cell

53 Ben Hur  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:14:35pm
In light of Obama’s intent to conduct a dialogue with Iran, the Middle East countries should launch a dialogue with him and help him better understand what is going on.

What? That Arabs are committing genocide against African Blacks?

Or the whole "Joo" thing?

54 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:14:38pm

re: #44 Ben Hur

Bush hates the Saudis.

tag seems to be missing.

55 Iron Fist  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:14:41pm

re: #47 Sharmuta,

It's taqiya that he claims not to have already accepted. I want to see his birth certificate. I want to know what he is hiding.

56 Biff  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:14:43pm

The Saudis have tired of blackmailing Bush and the US economy, and have now moved to place their own financed and controlled candidate in the WH.

57 Just Another Four-letter Word  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:14:43pm

re: #44 Ben Hur

Bush hates the Saudis.

Did you forget the /sarc tag again?

JAFLW

58 littleoldlady  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:15:04pm

re: #47 Sharmuta

It's dawa'h- they've invited him BACK to islam.

/fixed

59 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:15:28pm

re: #47 Sharmuta

It's dawa'h- they've invited him to islam.

* * *
He is the only candidate for US president who is on record as saying the Call to Prayer from the Minaret is the most beautiful sound on Earth! (learned in Indonesia)

60 Ben Hur  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:15:48pm

I don't tag when it's so blatantly obvious.

61 DistantThunder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:15:52pm

I just RSVP'd to go to the Townhall Meeting with John McCain being held in my backyard in Pemberton in South Jersey on Friday

I want to go with a list of provocative questions...maybe he'll

62 WriterMom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:16:00pm

re: #6 sloggin420

But sadly-potentially the second to do Dances With Saudi Swords.

63 Kefirah  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:16:21pm

re: #59 alegrias

you're joking. citation? did he REALLY say that?

64 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:16:42pm

re: #52 Ojoe

one man sleeper cell

creative.

65 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:16:51pm

re: #49 Catttt

OT

Cavuto on Fox just slam dunked a Dem rep on resources exploration - cut him off when he wouldn't stop doing the blame game.

Now he's talking with Senator McConnell.

Mr. Cavuto talking sense about focusing on the issue instead of partisan fighting.

McConnell says he'd be open for a deal.

Cavuto ssays he will broker the deal in his spare time. I WISH they'd listen to him.

* * *
Chuck Norris the actor is out there on tv talking about drilling for oil in the USA.

66 maddogg  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:16:53pm

OT
Looking at the Realclearpolitics electoral college map, Obama is not strong in the West, and South, and is in fact probably going to lose every state in the South, and most in the West. If McCain loses this election, he has no one to blame except himself.

67 Just Another Four-letter Word  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:16:58pm

re: #55 Iron Fist

,

It's taqiya that he claims not to have already accepted. I want to see his birth certificate. I want to know what he is hiding.

Why do I keep getting the nagging feeling it may show somehow that he's not born a Citizen of the US?

Can't shake the feeling. Weird...

JAFLW

68 DistantThunder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:17:01pm

re: #51 looking closely

-Ahmed Yousef, ; political advisor to HAMAS

Hearted that for my personal use later. Hamas knows he one of them.

69 Ben Hur  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:17:06pm

re: #62 WriterMom

Apparently, Oovda did quite the piece on Baruch and his Kenyan family.

The Israelis I spoke with were pretty un-nerved by it.

70 Sounder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:17:17pm

"..the Middle East countries should launch a dialogue with him and help him better understand what is going on."

Uh Ha. Well we already know. First, they want our money and then our country while blowing up a few people along the way to get it.

71 DistantThunder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:17:29pm

re: #66 maddogg

OT
Looking at the Realclearpolitics electoral college map, Obama is not strong in the West, and South, and is in fact probably going to lose every state in the South, and most in the West. If McCain loses this election, he has no one to blame except himself.

He'll blame republicans

72 Kefirah  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:17:58pm

re: #69 Ben Hur

is there a link to that available?

73 Just Another Four-letter Word  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:18:01pm

re: #60 Ben Hur

I don't tag when it's so blatantly obvious.

Well, try to be nice on the newly-hatched lizards, okay? They hardly know ye!

JAFLW

74 Biff  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:18:07pm

re: #53 Ben Hur

Did you see that Frontline piece on Darfur last night? I think the word Islam was mentioned once, and not in the same sentence as Janjawid. Somehow PBS decided that it is all China's fault, not that China wouldn't be in league with the Saudis and arab oil ticks.

75 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:18:26pm

re: #60 Ben Hur

I don't tag when it's so blatantly obvious.

Some lizards not speedy as other lizards.

76 WriterMom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:18:26pm

re: #27 Gjergj Skënderbeu

Despite that, I think there are enough Americans who-if Obama does try to throw Israel under the bus-would tip it over without a second thought and set Israel free. I hope my crappy metaphor makes sense.

/long day...

77 Peacekeeper  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:18:28pm

This is not the peaceful religion I thought I knew...

78 Kefirah  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:18:46pm

re: #76 WriterMom

how?

79 tfc3rid  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:19:10pm

re: #66 maddogg

OT
Looking at the Realclearpolitics electoral college map, Obama is not strong in the West, and South, and is in fact probably going to lose every state in the South, and most in the West. If McCain loses this election, he has no one to blame except himself.

Yes... BUT... If Ohio and Virginia go to Obama's side, it won't matter...

80 Just Another Four-letter Word  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:19:17pm

re: #71 DistantThunder

GMTA

JAFLW

81 WriterMom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:19:34pm

re: #69 Ben Hur

I saw it...the tall skinny dude went to Obama Grama's village and there was a sister (half sister?) translating...she said she doesn have a TV boo hoo...my husband and I watched it. It was FREAKY.

82 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:19:38pm

Damn! MEMRI doesn't give any more detail on the Al-Watan editoral.

In fairness -- to the Saudis of all people? what th' heck am I thinkin'! -- the editorial could have meant that they (the Saudis) trust the Shi'a Iranian theocracy like they trust a snake. They might want to tell BO to back off, or at least be careful what he promises.

83 Diamond Bullet  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:19:49pm

re: #63 Kefirah

you're joking. citation? did he REALLY say that?

[Link: select.nytimes.com...]

Mr. Obama recalled the opening lines of the Arabic call to prayer, reciting them with a first-rate accent. In a remark that seemed delightfully uncalculated (it’ll give Alabama voters heart attacks), Mr. Obama described the call to prayer as “one of the prettiest sounds on Earth at sunset.”

84 Iron Fist  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:19:57pm

re: #67 Just Another Four-letter Word,

There's something he's hiding. Even as ham-handed as he's been since he wrapped up the Donk nomination, he surely wouldn't be making this kind of mistake because of shere arrogance. Would he? I know he believes his own Cult, but some things are pretty simple.

Release the Documents.

85 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:20:08pm

re: #63 Kefirah

you're joking. citation? did he REALLY say that?

* * *
google "Obama, call to prayer", even the New York Times' Nicholas Kristof reported on this statement by the Illinois candidate.

86 WriterMom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:20:17pm

re: #78 Kefirah

Grassroots political activism, letter writing, demonstrations, public pressure.

87 Rednek  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:20:24pm

Hurry up, peak oil!

88 WriterMom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:20:34pm

re: #85 alegrias

I remember reading about that.

89 DistantThunder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:20:41pm

re: #74 Biff

Did you see that Frontline piece on Darfur last night? I think the word Islam was mentioned once, and not in the same sentence as Janjawid. Somehow PBS decided that it is all China's fault, not that China wouldn't be in league with the Saudis and arab oil ticks.

SAw it - tragic how the women and children were so excited to see the first UN vehicles show up - and started chanting Un, Un, UN, but it was a fact finding mission. The UN never planned to do anything.

Mia Farrow said that one point the women came to her and said: The UN isn't coming are they? No one's coming, are they?

Welcome to the New World Order - Liberal/Socialist style practicing the not so fine art of sElective caring.

90 nikis-knight  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:21:02pm

re: #25 Kosh's Shadow

Bush only promised to sell the Saudis nuclear reactors.
Whereas Obama will have some spare nuclear weapons after he unilaterally disarms.

And he can use the money for fighting real wars, like the war on poverty part 2, or the war on warm, or the war on wealth. And it's okay, because Israel has nukes already, so what's the big deal? All religions are equal, and only American weapons are bad.

91 Intrepid  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:21:12pm

re: #43 Kefirah

If he is elected, and if he does follow through on his plans to basically gut our military, then he won't even have the means to help protect Israel, even if he had the will to do so.

He plans to completely cut any space-based weaponry/defense systems, and I'm sure defensive systems like Patriot-type missiles will not be far behind.

Barack Obama is the "Delilah" to our armed forces' "Samson".

92 Kefirah  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:21:16pm

re: #83 Diamond Bullet

....

i'm left speechless. and i'm rarely speechless. why isn't THAT making the rounds? why isn't it the sound of a crowd of americans at a summer baseball game, singing the national anthem with their hats off and hands over their hearts?

not to be maudlin - but - seriously, folks.

93 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:21:16pm

It's gotta be tough to be a new hatchling. DataOverload and all.

94 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:21:21pm

re: #65 alegrias

* * *
Chuck Norris the actor is out there on tv talking about drilling for oil in the USA.

If you have five dollars and Chuck Norris has five dollars, Chuck Norris has more money than you.

There is no 'ctrl' button on Chuck Norris's computer. Chuck Norris is always in control.

Apple pays Chuck Norris 99 cents every time he listens to a song.

Chuck Norris can sneeze with his eyes open.

Chuck Norris can eat just one Lay's potato chip.

Chuck Norris is suing Myspace for taking the name of what he calls everything around you.

Chuck Norris destroyed the periodic table, because he only recognizes the element of surprise.

Chuck Norris can kill two stones with one bird.

95 Just Another Four-letter Word  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:21:30pm

re: #84 Iron Fist

,

There's something he's hiding. Even as ham-handed as he's been since he wrapped up the Donk nomination, he surely wouldn't be making this kind of mistake because of shere arrogance. Would he? I know he believes his own Cult, but some things are pretty simple.

Release the Documents. Hounds!

Fixed!

JAFLW

96 Peacekeeper  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:21:39pm

Barrack Obama in Sword Dance 2010!

Co-starring Michelle obama as lump under bag number 1.

97 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:21:58pm

re: #83 Diamond Bullet

* * *
Thank you, there were several references to Obama's call to prayer quote, saying the Clintons made this up, as if!

98 Kefirah  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:22:09pm

re: #91 Intrepid

what is his logical reasoning behind cutting space-based defense? does he HAVE any?

99 mean Gene  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:23:50pm

I wonder if Obama and Michelle were in Sudan would they be with the refugees in camps or with the Janjaweed, ethnically cleansing the darkest-skinned Africans out of the country?
Has Obama even addressed the Sudan issue?

100 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:24:09pm

re: #82 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Damn! MEMRI doesn't give any more detail on the Al-Watan editoral.

In fairness -- to the Saudis of all people? what th' heck am I thinkin'! -- the editorial could have meant that they (the Saudis) trust the Shi'a Iranian theocracy like they trust a snake. They might want to tell BO to back off, or at least be careful what he promises.

The Mullah's have absolutely no intent to move on Riyadh. They are adverse to fires.

/

101 Diamond Bullet  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:24:23pm

re: #92 Kefirah

....

i'm left speechless. and i'm rarely speechless. why isn't THAT making the rounds? why isn't it the sound of a crowd of americans at a summer baseball game, singing the national anthem with their hats off and hands over their hearts?

not to be maudlin - but - seriously, folks.

Exactly. Apparently the guy would like nothing more than, when he's sitting in the Oval Office with his feet up on a nice summer evening in D.C., to hear the melodic strains of the Islamic call to prayer on the breeze.

Also, the NY times article has some other truly mesmerizing feats of idiotic logic:

He once got in trouble for making faces during Koran study classes in his elementary school, but a president is less likely to stereotype Muslims as fanatics — and more likely to be aware of their nationalism — if he once studied the Koran with them.

That makes a lot of sense.

102 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:24:52pm

re: #98 Kefirah

what is his logical reasoning behind cutting space-based defense? does he HAVE any?

In the words of another generation, so the Pentagon will have to hold a bake sale to buy a bomber.

103 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:25:58pm

re: #99 mean Gene

I wonder if Obama and Michelle were in Sudan would they be with the refugees in camps or with the Janjaweed, ethnically cleansing the darkest-skinned Africans out of the country?
Has Obama even addressed the Sudan issue?

Of course he has. He's criticized Bush and called for more diplomacy and "action" (without specifying what action, or what sort of diplomacy he thinks is going to accomplish anything):

[Link: obama.senate.gov...]


WASHINGTON, DC – Today, U.S. Senator Barack Obama (D-IL) made the following statement on the announcement that the Sudan People's Liberation Movement withdrew from Sudan's government of national unity because of the ruling party's breaches of the Comprehensive Peace Agreement:

"Yesterday the Sudan People's Liberation Movement withdrew from Sudan's government of national unity in frustration with the ruling party's breaches of the Comprehensive Peace Agreement (CPA). Once again, the Bashir government's credibility and intent to honor its own commitments has been called into question. Unless the Sudanese government implements elements of the CPA relating to border demarcation, oil wealth sharing, troop redeployment, and ensuring that a census and elections will proceed as scheduled, the already tragic situation in Sudan will become even more unstable.

"As one of the principal guarantors of the Comprehensive Peace Accord that ended over twenty years of war between north and south Sudan, the Bush Administration needs to rededicate itself to saving this treaty. A focused and revitalized diplomatic effort that includes all parties that helped negotiate the CPA is the only way in which this process can be salvaged.

"Allowing the Bashir government to renege on its commitments would not only rob the people of Southern Sudan of their best opportunity to build a peaceful and more prosperous future, it would also have devastating consequences for all efforts to achieve peace in Darfur. Recent United Nations reports indicate that the Sudanese government is continuing to fuel violence in Darfur and is delaying the deployment of the joint UN-AU peacekeeping mission. The international community must reject these obstructionist tactics, insist that diplomatic breakthroughs and paper agreements are followed up with real action, and hold the regime in Khartoum accountable for its actions."

104 Rednek  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:26:02pm

re: #85 alegrias

* * *
google "Obama, call to prayer", even the New York Times' Nicholas Kristof reported on this statement by the Illinois candidate.

This isn't the Obama I knew!

105 tfc3rid  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:26:05pm

re: #101 Diamond Bullet

Hmmm... Koran study classes? Interesting...

106 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:26:30pm

re: #94 looking closely

(I can't help it. I love those jokes!)

Put in parentheses so no one will know I said that.

107 shibumi  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:26:38pm

re: #66 maddogg

OT
Looking at the Realclearpolitics electoral college map, Obama is not strong in the West, and South, and is in fact probably going to lose every state in the South, and most in the West. If McCain loses this election, he has no one to blame except himself.

Realclearpolitics also gives PA to Obama; I'm not so sure about that. As for the blue collar Midwest (I'm in Michigan), many (but not all) of the blue collar types I know are not voting for the Messiah.

108 songbird  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:27:03pm

re: #104 Rednek

This isn't the Obama I knew!

Like this?

109 Kefirah  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:27:07pm

re: #102 pre-Boomer Marine brat

yeah, well. i'm sure the marines can make a killer apple pie and all, but that's not really their JOB, is it?

i wonder how barack would enjoy being PotUS without airforce one or pens or paper or intelligence briefings - you know - things he would hypothetically need to do his job.

110 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:27:29pm

re: #106 wolfie

Said what?

111 find your violent jihadi on ebay!  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:27:39pm

I think it's time for AIPAC to use its magical powers on Obama and get him into line.

112 Cap'n DOC  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:27:41pm

re: #106 wolfie

You have to write it in invisible ink.

113 DistantThunder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:27:51pm

American Murder Mystery (spoiler: The Democrats did it - again.)

Why is crime rising in so many American cities? The answer implicates one of the most celebrated antipoverty programs of recent decades.

About five years ago, Janikowski embarked on a more ambitious project. He’d built up enough trust with the police to get them to send him daily crime and arrest reports, including addresses and types of crime. He began mapping all violent and property crimes, block by block, across the city. “These cops on the streets were saying that crime patterns are changing,” he said, so he wanted to look into it.

When his map was complete, a clear if strangely shaped pattern emerged: Wait a minute, he recalled thinking. I see this bunny rabbit coming up. People are going to accuse me of being on shrooms! The inner city, where crime used to be concentrated, was now clean. But everywhere else looked much worse: arrests had skyrocketed along two corridors north and west of the central city (the bunny rabbit’s ears) and along one in the southeast (the tail). Hot spots had proliferated since the mid-1990s, and little islands of crime had sprung up where none had existed before, dotting the map all around the city.

Janikowski might not have managed to pinpoint the cause of this pattern if he hadn’t been married to Phyllis Betts, a housing expert at the University of Memphis. Betts and Janikowski have two dogs, three cats, and no kids; they both tend to bring their work home with them. Betts had been evaluating the impact of one of the city government’s most ambitious initiatives: the demolition of the city’s public-housing projects, as part of a nationwide experiment to free the poor from the destructive effects of concentrated poverty. Memphis demolished its first project in 1997. The city gave former residents federal “Section8” rent-subsidy vouchers and encouraged them to move out to new neighborhoods. Two more waves of demolition followed over the next nine years, dispersing tens of thousands of poor people into the wider metro community.

.........

About six months ago, they decided to put a hunch to the test. Janikowski merged his computer map of crime patterns with Betts’s map of Section8 rentals. Where Janikowski saw a bunny rabbit, Betts saw a sideways horseshoe (“He has a better imagination,” she said). Otherwise, the match was near-perfect. On the merged map, dense violent-crime areas are shaded dark blue, and Section8 addresses are represented by little red dots. All of the dark-blue areas are covered in little red dots, like bursts of gunfire. The rest of the city has almost no dots.

Betts remembers her discomfort as she looked at the map. The couple had been musing about the connection for months, but they were amazed—and deflated—to see how perfectly the two data sets fit together. She knew right away that this would be a “hard thing to say or write.” Nobody in the antipoverty community and nobody in city leadership was going to welcome the news that the noble experiment that they’d been engaged in for the past decade had been bringing the city down, in ways they’d never expected. But the connection was too obvious to ignore, and Betts and Janikowski figured that the same thing must be happening all around the country. Eventually, they thought, they’d find other researchers who connected the dots the way they had, and then maybe they could get city leaders, and even national leaders, to listen.

114 Intrepid  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:27:53pm

re: #98 Kefirah

what is his logical reasoning behind cutting space-based defense? does he HAVE any?

My guess would be that it's the same reason he thinks NASA's budget should be cut - all those billions could be used for domestic programs...

...read "Universal Healthcare".

115 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:27:56pm

re: #100 unrealizedviewpoint

The Mullah's have absolutely no intent to move on Riyadh. They are adverse to fires.

/

I'm not so sure. There are a number of Twelvers among them, MA for one. A fire (chaos, to speed the return of the 12th Mahdi) may be just what they want.

116 Rednek  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:28:04pm

re: #108 songbird

Like this?

Very funny!

117 tfc3rid  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:28:05pm

re: #107 shibumi

Realclearpolitics also gives PA to Obama; I'm not so sure about that. As for the blue collar Midwest (I'm in Michigan), many (but not all) of the blue collar types I know are not voting for the Messiah.

I don't see PA either but I would never underestimate the impact of Philly and Pittsburgh on the overall numbers in PA...

118 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:28:25pm

re: #106 wolfie

Wolfie! Look for me. I'm going to the game also. Gonna be wearing my Reagan Revolucion T-shirt! (Green!)

I'd love to meet a lizard in person.

119 ethanxxx  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:29:04pm

A friend of mine sent me this quote. Has anyone read the book and know if the quote is accurate or not?

From Barack's book, Audacity of Hope:
"I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."

120 Just Another Four-letter Word  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:29:29pm

re: #98 Kefirah

what is his logical reasoning behind cutting space-based defense? does he HAVE any?

Have any what? Reasoning? No, and he's equally clueless as to How The World REALLY Works.

We're in for a terrible time if the loonaticks ever get control of the Presidency. The McCainiac is bad enough...

JAFLW

121 Kefirah  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:29:54pm

re: #114 Intrepid

and that's another question. is his plan for catastrophic coverage? preventative? has he SEEN what happened when mass. tried it? no one, NO ONE could get in to see a doctor. it was a two year waiting period to see a family practitioner. and gee - that doesn't seem conducive to promotion of health.

122 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:29:56pm

re: #112 Cap'n DOC

123 redstateredneck  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:30:09pm

re: #65 alegrias

* * *
Chuck Norris the actor is out there on tv talking about drilling for oil in the USA.

Sign the petition.

124 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:30:14pm

re: #119 ethanxxx

Out of context. He said (paraphrasing) "If Muslims are discriminated against and rounded up in America, then I will stand with the Muslims." It's a bullshit email.

125 DesertSage  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:30:18pm

re: #122 wolfie

126 mean Gene  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:30:51pm

re: #103 looking closely

I had also read that.
But it is so ambiguous.
He is ultimately FOR the government of Sudan being allowed to buy more time to commit more genocide.
Talk, talk, talk.
Meanwhile the darkest-skinned Sudanese are slaughtered and raped.

127 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:31:22pm

re: #115 pre-Boomer Marine brat

I'm not so sure. There are a number of Twelvers among them, MA for one. A fire (chaos, to speed the return of the 12th Mahdi) may be just what they want.

There was a tag below my comment.
It appears we both see the Mullah's for the danger they truly are. How to get American's to understand this though?

128 sloggin420[deleted]  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:31:22pm
129 Gjergj Skënderbeu  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:31:23pm
but a president is less likely to stereotype Muslims as fanatics — and more likely to be aware of their nationalism — if he once studied the Koran with them.

That makes a lot of sense

Yeah, that idiotic writer should have added at the end...

"because that's what I think"

And then that stupid article would have made sense.

130 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:31:34pm

re: #106 wolfie

(I can't help it. I love those jokes!)

Put in parentheses so no one will know I said that.

They're so silly. . .
I'm actually a little embarassed to have even posted them.

Oh crap. There I go again.

131 maddogg  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:31:49pm

re: #79 tfc3rid

Yes... BUT... If Ohio and Virginia go to Obama's side, it won't matter...

Oh, but is Does matter. He will be viewed the same way as a damn Yankee carpetbagger, and will be shown the same respect. And, thats exactly what he will be, and will deserve no respect. And his inevitable foundering around and piss poor choices for his cabinet will exacerbate the situation, further reducing his effectiveness. to the point of impotence.

132 JimInMN  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:32:14pm

Two Obompa is the antichrist calls in a row on the Medved show. People are loosing it.

133 ethanxxx  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:32:24pm

re: #124 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Thank you FBV. I knew the truth could be found here. I'll correct him ASAP.

134 Nevergiveup  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:32:41pm

re: #119 ethanxxx

A friend of mine sent me this quote. Has anyone read the book and know if the quote is accurate or not?

From Barack's book, Audacity of Hope:
"I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."

I pride myself on staying on top of the facts and reading alot, but for the life Of me I can't bing myself to read his book. Then again I must admit I never read Mein Kampf either.

135 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:32:46pm

re: #132 JimInMN

Meh.

136 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:32:47pm

re: #118 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Wolfie! Look for me. I'm going to the game also. Gonna be wearing my Reagan Revolucion T-shirt! (Green!)

I'd love to meet a lizard in person.

Yes indeed! I'll look for you!

137 songbird  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:33:14pm

re: #119 ethanxxx

A friend of mine sent me this quote. Has anyone read the book and know if the quote is accurate or not?

From Barack's book, Audacity of Hope:
"I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."



Page 261 from his book
.

138 JCM  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:33:21pm

re: #119 ethanxxx

A friend of mine sent me this quote. Has anyone read the book and know if the quote is accurate or not?

From Barack's book, Audacity of Hope:
"I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."

Here's what I find....

The actual quote from the book is from page 261 and is as follows:

"Of course, not all my conversations in immigrant communities follow this easy pattern. In the wake of 9/11, my meetings with Arab and Pakistani Americans, for example, have a more urgent quality, for the stories of detentions and FBI questioning and hard stares from neighbors have shaken their sense of security and belonging. They have been reminded that the history of immigration in this country has a dark underbelly; they need specific reassurances that their citizenship really means something, that America has learned the right lessons from the Japanese internments during World War II, and that I will stand with them should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."
139 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:33:24pm

re: #109 Kefirah

yeah, well. i'm sure the marines can make a killer apple pie and all, but that's not really their JOB, is it?

i wonder how barack would enjoy being PotUS without airforce one or pens or paper or intelligence briefings - you know - things he would hypothetically need to do his job.

No. Excuse me.

Barak's political ancestors (e.g., his buddy Wm. Ayers) are the Sixties Children. They are kneejerk against the military. BO follows the same pattern.

The "bake sale/bomber" quote is from the Sixties. It was meant as a metaphor.

140 tfc3rid  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:33:24pm

re: #131 maddogg

Oh, but is Does matter. He will be viewed the same way as a damn Yankee carpetbagger, and will be shown the same respect. And, thats exactly what he will be, and will deserve no respect. And his inevitable foundering around and piss poor choices for his cabinet will exacerbate the situation, further reducing his effectiveness. to the point of impotence.

Well, he would be effective with 58 maybe 60 Dems in Senate and a nice majority in the House...

That's the problem, he would be dangerously effective...

141 sloggin420[deleted]  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:33:45pm
142 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:33:47pm

re: #133 ethanxxx

Thank you FBV. I knew the truth could be found here. I'll correct him ASAP.

I am basing that on a discussion about his book I heard on John Gibson's radio show last night. Caller called and and John bitch-slapped him with some facts.

143 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:33:51pm

re: #123 redstateredneck

Sign the petition.

* * *
Drill Here. Drill Now. Pay Less.
A Real Change Campaign to Lower Your Gas Prices

I like this campaign motto for America.
Thanks for linking & sharing.

144 Just Another Four-letter Word  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:33:52pm

re: #113 DistantThunder

I bet I know the ending to thst story: Crickets!
(No, I haven't read ahead yet...)

JAFLW

145 maddogg  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:34:24pm

re: #107 shibumi

Realclearpolitics also gives PA to Obama; I'm not so sure about that. As for the blue collar Midwest (I'm in Michigan), many (but not all) of the blue collar types I know are not voting for the Messiah.

I think PA. will go to McCain, as there are a lot of hunters in PA. and Obama is 100% gun controller, and is considered by the NRA to be a grave threat to the 2nd. Amendment.

146 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:34:25pm

re: #130 looking closely

Bookmarked for when I need a giggle fix!

147 DistantThunder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:34:30pm

re: #138 JCM

NO, NO not the "hard staress from neighbors!" How would you know if you weren't staring at them back?

Whaaaaaa

148 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:34:34pm

re: #121 Kefirah

and that's another question. is his plan for catastrophic coverage? preventative? has he SEEN what happened when mass. tried it? no one, NO ONE could get in to see a doctor. it was a two year waiting period to see a family practitioner. and gee - that doesn't seem conducive to promotion of health.

Boortz had a little writeup this AM:


The Democrats must be extremely partial to fine dining ... because they were willing to take a page out of the Republican handbook to achieve it. That's right. The Senate Dining Room has lost more than $18 million since 1993 and has dropped about $2 million this year alone. In other words, the government service in the Senate Dining Room is so lousy that it took a Democrat to come up with a brilliant solution: privatize it. And you'll never guess who wants to privatize: Dianne Feinstein!

Now here's a real mind blower ... are you ready for this? Feinstein says, "Candidly, I don't think the taxpayers should be subsidizing something that doesn't need to be. There are parts of government that can be run like a business and should be run like businesses." Now we're getting somewhere!

Now .. here's another surprise. The restaurants on the House side of the Capital have been privately operated for years ... and making a tidy profit all the while. That's where the Senate staffers would go to eat.

Come on, folks. The Senate can't even run a restaurant ... but they want to run your health care.

[Link: boortz.com...]

149 Intrepid  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:34:37pm

re: #121 Kefirah

I haven't studied his healthcare plan in any great detail, so I can't answer that.

What I do know is that any type of Universal Healthcare plan is going to be catastrophic - for our economy, that is.

150 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:34:39pm

re: #114 Intrepid

Bingo

151 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:34:43pm
152 rwmofo  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:34:55pm

Ya see, you don't understand, but we'll gladly explain it for you.

First, cover that woman and be sure that she walks six paces behind you.

153 mj  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:35:27pm

The Saudis should be terrified of an Obama presidency. They even note the reason in this editorial:

The paper added that in light of Obama’s intent to conduct a dialogue with Iran, the Middle East countries should launch a dialogue with him and help him better understand what is going on.

The Saudis have every reason to fear Iran. And they know it. They also know that Israel does not threaten their hold on power. In fact, quite the contrary: Israel is the stabilizing force in the Middle East.

The Saudi have always paid lip service to the Palestinians. But with Hamas being in the hip pocket of Iran, even the Saudis know which way the wind is blowing.

I suspect that the key to understanding what the Saudis are saying is in this second paragraph. They're afraid Obama will not stand up to Iran and thus Iran will increase it's hegemonic designs over Islam...especially the 40% of Saudi Arabia which is Shia.

154 chinesearithmetic  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:35:40pm

Their behavior at the Annapolis peace farce was despicable. But we understood!

155 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:35:46pm

re: #137 songbird

ARRGGH! Beat me by 7 seconds!

156 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:36:15pm

re: #123 redstateredneck

Sign the petition.

* * *
done, & sent to family as well, thank you. Drill Now, Pay less!

157 Silhouette  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:36:19pm

re: #134 Nevergiveup

Then again I must admit I never read Mein Kampf either.

I actually have wanted to read it, but cannot bring myself buy it and give money to someone spreading that filth. I wonder if the library carries it. And would I hate them if they did?

Ditto the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

158 Iron Fist  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:36:21pm

re: #124 Fat Bastard Vegetarian,

It is still telling where his sympathies lie. Mohammedans killed 3000 Americans on 9-11. Obama's sympathy lies with the Mohammedans if we do anything about that.

[spit]

159 The Other Les  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:36:21pm

Just got back from grocery shopping.

The paper added that in light of Obama’s intent to conduct a dialogue with Iran, the Middle East countries should launch a dialogue with him and help him better understand what is going on.


for barbarians dialog means that we shut up and listen to them.

160 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:36:26pm

re: #140 tfc3rid

Well, he would be effective with 58 maybe 60 Dems in Senate and a nice majority in the House...

That's the problem, he would be dangerously effective...

Especially when you consider how far to the left the congressional Democrat leadership is.

161 songbird  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:36:36pm

re: #155 jcm

ARRGGH! Beat me by 7 seconds!

At least we're working on the same team!

162 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:36:57pm

Againre: #136 wolfie

Yes indeed! I'll look for you!

Cool! Wearing the green Reagan T-shirt and a Cleveland Indians ball cap.

WEET!

Just don't yell out my name, there are kids there! (HA). But I'll be listening for "Hey! FBV!"

163 bulwrk  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:36:59pm

re: #98 Kefirah

what is his logical reasoning behind cutting space-based defense? does he HAVE any?

Because China knocking out our satellites is just another Bush scare tactic that McCain plans on continuing.

164 Just Another Four-letter Word  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:37:01pm

re: #128 sloggin420

Vote Obama '08 or YOU are a racist!

Rotating title nomination, if it hasn't been nominated already...

JAFLW

165 bill-tb  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:37:04pm

I wonder what Comrade Obama's birth certificate really says?

As far as cuts to the defense budget, Comrade Obama wants to buy your vote with the money saved.

166 ethanxxx  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:37:16pm

re: #137 songbird

Thank You Songbird.

167 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:37:32pm

re: #127 unrealizedviewpoint

re: tag

Sorry, I'm new to posting on the web, and miss some of the nuances.

I know what "/sarc" or "/s" means. Does "/" by itself do the same thing?!?

168 redstateredneck  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:37:42pm

re: #143 alegrias

* * *
Drill Here. Drill Now. Pay Less.
A Real Change Campaign to Lower Your Gas Prices

I like this campaign motto for America.
Thanks for linking & sharing.


Newt Gingrich is Chairman of American Solutions. Time somebody got on congress' ass about energy. This back and forth bullshit has got to stop and something get done! Chuck Norris has been out there as a spokesperson for them. I saw him this morning on Fox & Friends.

169 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:37:47pm

re: #131 maddogg

Oh, but is Does matter. He will be viewed the same way as a damn Yankee carpetbagger, and will be shown the same respect. And, thats exactly what he will be, and will deserve no respect. And his inevitable foundering around and piss poor choices for his cabinet will exacerbate the situation, further reducing his effectiveness. to the point of impotence.

* * *
Yankee carpet bagger?

Buzzing prayer carpetbagger!

170 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:38:14pm

re: #126 mean Gene

I had also read that.
But it is so ambiguous.
He is ultimately FOR the government of Sudan being allowed to buy more time to commit more genocide.
Talk, talk, talk.
Meanwhile the darkest-skinned Sudanese are slaughtered and raped.

IMO, its not ambiguous, its simply empty political posturing, to wit:

a. Bush is bad.
b. We need more talk and action (what kind of talk and action, he doesn't say).

McCain, to his credit, has been considerably more substantive when it comes to Darfur:
[Link: www.time-blog.com...]

I don't know if McCain as President would spend his political capital on Darfur (probably not), but at least its clear he's given the matter thought and understands what is going on there.

171 maddogg  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:38:18pm

re: #140 tfc3rid

Well, he would be effective with 58 maybe 60 Dems in Senate and a nice majority in the House...

That's the problem, he would be dangerously effective...

They are all stinking politicians, and as soon as his approval numbers start to plummet, they will abandon him like the rats they are.

172 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:38:44pm

re: #145 maddogg

I think PA. will go to McCain, as there are a lot of hunters in PA. and Obama is 100% gun controller, and is considered by the NRA to be a grave threat to the 2nd. Amendment.

Two "special-interest" groups that need to get their act together and back McCain with all their might: the NRA and the pro-lifers. They can hurt Obama in PA, VA, and Ohio.

173 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:38:50pm

re: #158 Iron Fist

,

It is still telling where his sympathies lie. Mohammedans killed 3000 Americans on 9-11. Obama's sympathy lies with the Mohammedans if we do anything about that.

[spit]

Not gonna fight you on that one. The context was more (if I understand correctly) about Japanese Interment Camps. That kind of thing.

Still don't like the SOB. Please don't think I am defending him.

174 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:38:57pm

re: #89 DistantThunder

SAw it - tragic how the women and children were so excited to see the first UN vehicles show up - and started chanting Un, Un, UN, but it was a fact finding mission. The UN never planned to do anything.

Mia Farrow said that one point the women came to her and said: The UN isn't coming are they? No one's coming, are they?

Welcome to the New World Order - Liberal/Socialist style practicing the not so fine art of sElective caring.

What? The UN never planned to rape the women and molest the children?

175 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:39:21pm

re: #161 songbird

At least we're working on the same team!

LOL!

I wonder how many Koskiddies bother to quash a rumor about GWB!

Stupid question! It's all rumors over there.

176 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:39:43pm

re: #167 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Sorry, I'm new to posting on the web, and miss some of the nuances.

I know what "/sarc" or "/s" means. Does "/" by itself do the same thing?!?

Yep, extreme shorthand.

177 Nevergiveup  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:39:48pm

re: #172 wolfie

Two "special-interest" groups that need to get their act together and back McCain with all their might: the NRA and the pro-lifers. They can hurt Obama in PA, VA, and Ohio.

The truth is we all have to get our act together before it is to late!

178 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:40:18pm

re: #167 pre-Boomer Marine brat

yep. and when you see a bunch like this /////
it's really really sarcastic. LOL

179 DistantThunder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:40:19pm

More from American Murder Mystery article quoted above:

If replacing housing projects with vouchers had achieved its main goal—infusing the poor with middle-class habits—then higher crime rates might be a price worth paying. But today, social scientists looking back on the whole grand experiment are apt to use words like baffling and disappointing. A large federal-government study conducted over the past decade—a follow-up to the highly positive, highly publicized Gautreaux study of 1991—produced results that were “puzzling,” said Susan Popkin of the Urban Institute. In this study, volunteers were also moved into low-poverty neighborhoods, although they didn’t move nearly as far as the Gautreaux families. Women reported lower levels of obesity and depression. But they were no more likely to find jobs. The schools were not much better, and children were no more likely to stay in them. Girls were less likely to engage in risky behaviors, and they reported feeling more secure in their new neighborhoods. But boys were as likely to do drugs and act out, and more likely to get arrested for property crimes. The best Popkin can say is: “It has not lived up to its promise. It has not lifted people out of poverty, it has not made them self-sufficient, and it has left a lot of people behind.”

Baffled, confused, disappointed.

180 shibumi  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:40:32pm

re: #99 mean Gene

I wonder if Obama and Michelle were in Sudan would they be with the refugees in camps or with the Janjaweed, ethnically cleansing the darkest-skinned Africans out of the country?
Has Obama even addressed the Sudan issue?

I was curious.

Obama on Darfur

There is something in this speech that doesn't sound right to me:

"Already, 50,000 African Muslims have been killed and 1.2 million displaced by the Sudanese Government and by Arab Janjaweed militias armed and encouraged by Khartoum."

There have been scores of non-Muslim Africans killed in Darfur. Interesting he didn't mention that.

The Janjaweed are Muslim. Interesting he didn't mention that either.

181 WriterMom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:40:44pm

re: #157 Silhouette

The public library should have it-and I believe it should definitely be available for borrowing. It's an important historical document.

182 Biff  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:40:45pm

re: #89 DistantThunder
The UN and Kofi in Darfur were simply doing the arab islamist and slave trader decendant's bidding. Clear evidence of the UN aiding and abetting arab racial genocide of african blacks. Too bad Frontline somehow lost the lead.

183 Catttt  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:41:13pm

re: #134 Nevergiveup

Here is the quote, according to the below source (I don't have the book, but this sounds about right and puts the "I will stand" part in full context).


The actual quote from the book is from page 261 and is as follows: "Of course, not all my conversations in immigrant communities follow this easy pattern. In the wake of 9/11, my meetings with Arab and Pakistani Americans, for example, have a more urgent quality, for the stories of detentions and FBI questioning and hard stares from neighbors have shaken their sense of security and belonging. They have been reminded that the history of immigration in this country has a dark underbelly; they need specific reassurances that their citizenship really means something, that America has learned the right lessons from the Japanese internments during World War II, and that I will stand with them should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."

Source: [Link: righttruth.typepad.com...]

184 Just Another Four-letter Word  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:42:00pm

re: #151 buzzsawmonkey

Obamamaniacs

We're Obamamaniacs
And we're zany to the max
We'll just sit back and relax
And watch the US collapse
Obamamaniacs!

Come join Rashid Khalidi and the wacky Reverend Wright
We know that they haven't vanished even though they're thrust from sight
Obama will go visit Iran, to the mullahs' delight
He'll backtrack from Iraq because he knows it's bad to fight

Obamamaniacs!
Free health care and lots more tax!
We'll turn backs upon the facts
Because fantasy attracts
Obamamaniacs!

You can meet all his advisors who don't care for Israel
Forget Rezko and Soros, never mind the fetid smell
Just let him eat his waffle and try to ignore Michelle
While Lefty gets his free stuff and the national debt swells

Obamamaniacs!
You can watch your rights contract!
Your lifestyle will be attacked when we join the Kyoto pact
We're Obama-mani--totally insane-y--Obamamaniacs!

Those are the facts!

JAFLW

/Good filk - you are a true poet and may even know it...

185 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:42:59pm
186 Biff  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:43:07pm

re: #180 shibumi

Obama's cousin's party in Kenya is essentially Janjawid South.

187 shibumi  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:43:24pm

re: #117 tfc3rid

I don't see PA either but I would never underestimate the impact of Philly and Pittsburgh on the overall numbers in PA...

You have a point. Detroit, Ann Arbor and Flint turn Michigan bright blue during the elections.

188 songbird  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:44:01pm

re: #166 ethanxxx

Thank You Songbird.

Glad to help. Kudos to jcm who also searched hard.

189 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:44:05pm

WOLFIE...YOU STILL THERE?!

190 debutaunt  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:44:44pm

re: #18 Iron Fist

,

Think he'll go in and kiss the rock?

Blarney Stone?

191 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:44:46pm

re: #176 jcm

Hey, I'm wearing your avatar tonight!

192 maddogg  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:45:30pm

re: #172 wolfie

Two "special-interest" groups that need to get their act together and back McCain with all their might: the NRA and the pro-lifers. They can hurt Obama in PA, VA, and Ohio.

The NRA is already moving in his direction. McCain will get their endorsement.

193 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:45:37pm

I'm not voting for the change Wahhabism wants.

194 Nevergiveup  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:46:00pm

re: #187 shibumi

You have a point. Detroit, Ann Arbor and Flint turn Michigan bright blue during the elections.

If you have ever seen a red blue map of the country broken down by voting districts? The whole country is essentially red except or these real deep blue islands called big cities.

195 goddessoftheclassroom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:46:01pm

Good afternoon, Lizards.

196 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:46:02pm

re: #177 Nevergiveup

The truth is we all have to get our act together before it is to late!

Absolutely.
Funny.
Mr. Wolf and I have never contributed any money to a candidate before.
We could never have guessed that McCain of all people would be the first one we would write a check to.

We're in VA so we really need to find ways to help stop Obama here.

197 shibumi  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:46:07pm

re: #186 Biff

Obama's cousin's party in Kenya is essentially Janjawid South.

America's New First Family

scary.

198 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:46:18pm

re: #176 jcm

jcm and unrealizedviewpoint,

Thanks. Tutor me further.

I occasionally see words or phrases postscripted after a fwd-slash (wish I had an example handy) but the contexts don't seem to imply "/sarc".

What else is the "/" used for?

199 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:46:23pm

OK, Obama did try to fund African troops in Darfur:

[Link: obama.senate.gov...]

Obama/Reid Amendment
On Oct. 2, 2006, Sens. Obama (D-IL) and Reid (D-NV) offered a $20 million amendment to H.R. 5631, the Department of Defense Appropriations Act. The amendment allocated funds to support the African Union troops in Darfur.

Its not clear to me that Obama's approach would actually accomplish anything, but you can't say he didn't at least propose something.

200 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:46:47pm

re: #168 redstateredneck

Newt Gingrich is Chairman of American Solutions.

John McCain we'd like you to meet someone by the name of Newt Gingrich. He can help you understand how American's feel about this Anwar non-issue. Ya know this frozen place American's care nothing of when gasoline is $5 a gallon.

201 USASupport  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:46:56pm

Off Topic

For Muslim women in Europe, a medical road back to virginity
[Link: www.iht.com...]

If you're a Muslim woman growing up in more open societies in Europe, you can easily end up having sex before marriage," said Hicham Mouallem, a doctor in London who performs the surgery. "So if you're looking to marry a Muslim and don't want to have problems, you'll try to recapture your virginity."


What does "have problems" mean?

And why do these Muslim men think bleeding = virgin? This is Western society? When the woman appears to know what she's doing in bed, this doesn't concern them, but bleeding allays all that?

This whole thing is just sickening.

202 Biff  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:46:56pm

re: #177 Nevergiveup

The Republican party should be neutral on pro-life issues. It should not be a political issue.

203 Nevergiveup  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:47:10pm

re: #193 alegrias

I'm not voting for the change Wahhabism wants.

Neither are most of those morons voting for Obama but non the less that is what they will get.

204 tfc3rid  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:47:25pm

re: #194 Nevergiveup

If you have ever seen a red blue map of the country broken down by voting districts? The whole country is essentially red except or these real deep blue islands called big cities.

Also known as population centers... Where A LOT of votes are cast...

See NY State... NYC basically controls what happens statewide...

205 DesertSage  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:47:42pm

Desmond has his barrow in the market place...
Molly is the singer in a band...
Desmond says to Molly "Girl, I like your face"
And Molly says this as she takes him by the hand...
Ob-ba-mi, Ob-ba-ma, life goes on, bro!...
Lala how the life goes on...
Ob-ba-mi, Ob-ba-ma, life goes on, bro!...
Lala how the life goes on.

And if you want some fun, take Ob-ba-mi-ba-ma

206 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:47:45pm

re: #195 goddessoftheclassroom

Good afternoon, Lizards.

SLURP!

207 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:47:54pm

re: #198 pre-Boomer Marine brat

jcm and unrealizedviewpoint,

Thanks. Tutor me further.

I occasionally see words or phrases postscripted after a fwd-slash (wish I had an example handy) but the contexts don't seem to imply "/sarc".

What else is the "/" used for?

I think you're seeing the tag immediately following the comment. It means the same thing.

208 ccrnyc  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:47:58pm

re: #167 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Sorry, I'm new to posting on the web, and miss some of the nuances.

I know what "/sarc" or "/s" means. Does "/" by itself do the same thing?!?

'/' nah its just slashies.

/ like rain our your wedding day
/ a no smoking sign on your cigarette break
/ irony.

209 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:48:18pm

re: #189 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

WOLFIE...YOU STILL THERE?!

Yes! I just went to get a cookie before the little wolves ate them all!

210 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:48:25pm

re: #179 DistantThunder

I took a GIS (Geographical Information Systems) class in college we had access to all the databases like that. I did a bunch of overlays like that.

High lotto ticket sales -> low income.
Single parent families -> high crime, more of a correlation than income.

One of the more interesting things I discovered was crime and parks. Stats are all counted against population a given area. Parks always come out as very high crime areas. The only people counting as living in a park are those living directly across the street, parks have very low population so the crime rate is "high".

211 jorline  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:48:28pm

MYBO's new webmasters.

[Link: www.pritchettcartoons.com...]

212 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:49:05pm

re: #202 Biff

The Republican party should be neutral on pro-life issues. It should not be a political issue.

Republican's stand for life, all lives.

213 maddogg  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:49:11pm

re: #179 DistantThunder


If replacing housing projects with vouchers had achieved its main goal—infusing the poor with middle-class habits—then higher crime rates might be a price worth paying. But today, social scientists looking back on the whole grand experiment are apt to use words like baffling and disappointing.

Not so baffling. If you take a bottle of fine wine, and pour it into a bottle that is half full of piss, have you improved the piss, or ruined the wine?

214 goddessoftheclassroom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:49:44pm

re: #206 pre-Boomer Marine brat

SLURP!

Cats rule. Dogs drool.

215 Cap'n DOC  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:49:58pm

re: #122 wolfie

Yes?

216 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:50:09pm

re: #208 ccrnyc

Hmmm. Irony, too. Okay. Thanks!

217 Diamond Bullet  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:50:32pm

re: #201 USASupport

Off Topic

For Muslim women in Europe, a medical road back to virginity
[Link: www.iht.com...]
And why do these Muslim men think bleeding = virgin? This is Western society? When the woman appears to know what she's doing in bed, this doesn't concern them, but bleeding allays all that?

This whole thing is just sickening.

It's actually more grotesque than that. According to the original NY Times article that started the furor, many Muslim families don't believe the whole 'blood in the bed' thing anymore either. They actually require the woman to give them a Certificate of Virginity signed by a doctor! That's why these women have to go to such ridiculous lengths - they have to be able to fool a medical examiner employed by the family of their future husband!

Calling this someone's "culture" defames the concept of culture.

218 Behead Me Bob  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:50:35pm

Maybe Obama can CHANGE S.A. to let women:

1. Have the right to vote
2. Have the privilege of driving a car
3. Have the right to leave the house without requiring a man's permission
4. Have the right not to get beaten by their husbands
5. Have the basic human right of allowing women to marry who they please

Oh, wait a minute, numbers 4 and 5 applies to ALL Muslim women, not just those cursed to be born in S.A.

219 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:50:40pm

re: #145 maddogg

I think PA. will go to McCain, as there are a lot of hunters in PA. and Obama is 100% gun controller, and is considered by the NRA to be a grave threat to the 2nd. Amendment.

I'd look for Michigan to do likewise, inspite of the endorcement of Obama by the UAW leadership.

220 DistantThunder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:50:44pm

re: #113 DistantThunder

Earlier this year, Betts presented her findings to city leaders, including Robert Lipscomb, the head of the Memphis Housing Authority. From what Lipscomb said to me, he’s still not moved. “You’ve already marginalized people and told them they have to move out,” he told me irritably, just as he’s told Betts. “Now you’re saying they moved somewhere else and created all these problems? That’s a really, really unfair assessment. You’re putting a big burden on people who have been too burdened already, and to me that’s, quote-unquote, criminal.” To Lipscomb, what matters is sending people who lived in public housing the message that “they can be successful, they can go to work and have kids who go to school. They can be self-sufficient and reach for the middle class.”

But Betts doesn’t think this message, alone, will stick, and she gets frustrated when she sees sensitivity about race or class blocking debate. “You can’t begin to problem-solve until you lay it out,” she said. “Most of us are not living in these high-crime neighborhoods. And I’m out there listening to the people who are not committing the crimes, who expected something better.” The victims, she notes, are seldom white. “There are decent African American neighborhoods—neighborhoods of choice—that are going down,” she said.

221 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:50:51pm

re: #214 goddessoftheclassroom

Be quiet and wipe your face.

222 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:50:56pm

re: #202 Biff

The Republican party should be neutral on pro-life issues. It should not be a political issue.

It certainly should NOT be a federal issue.
It's a terrible shame judicial activism made it one.

223 Dianna  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:51:05pm

re: #180 shibumi

Over the last 22 years? I've lost count. I think over a million.

It will keep on.

To say nothing of the slave trade.

I hate Sudan.

224 VegasRick  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:51:18pm

re: #201 USASupport

Off Topic

For Muslim women in Europe, a medical road back to virginity
[Link: www.iht.com...]

If you're a Muslim woman growing up in more open societies in Europe, you can easily end up having sex before marriage," said Hicham Mouallem, a doctor in London who performs the surgery. "So if you're looking to marry a Muslim and don't want to have problems, you'll try to recapture your virginity."


What does "have problems" mean?

And why do these Muslim men think bleeding = virgin? This is Western society? When the woman appears to know what she's doing in bed, this doesn't concern them, but bleeding allays all that?

This whole thing is just sickening.

Bleeding = good
No bleeding = bad
muslim non - logic

225 DistantThunder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:52:10pm

re: #210 jcm

I took a GIS (Geographical Information Systems) class in college we had access to all the databases like that. I did a bunch of overlays like that.

High lotto ticket sales -> low income.
Single parent families -> high crime, more of a correlation than income.

One of the more interesting things I discovered was crime and parks. Stats are all counted against population a given area. Parks always come out as very high crime areas. The only people counting as living in a park are those living directly across the street, parks have very low population so the crime rate is "high".

Interesting

226 Biff  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:52:13pm

re: #117 tfc3rid

re: #107 shibumi
Realclearpolitics also gives PA to Obama; I'm not so sure about that. As for the blue collar Midwest (I'm in Michigan), many (but not all) of the blue collar types I know are not voting for the Messiah.


I don't see PA either but I would never underestimate the impact of Philly and Pittsburgh on the overall numbers in PA...

Don't write off Penna for McCain. Obama is very unpopular outside of the Southeast PA and the Harrisburg area. I key issue will be Mayor Mike Nutter in Philadelphia. He seems to be an incorruptible independant black democrat. The Democrat bosses may not be able to count on him to allow them to mess with the Philly vote counts (a la Mayor Daly in Chicago in 1960).

227 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:52:37pm

re: #198 pre-Boomer Marine brat

jcm and unrealizedviewpoint,

Thanks. Tutor me further.

I occasionally see words or phrases postscripted after a fwd-slash (wish I had an example handy) but the contexts don't seem to imply "/sarc".

What else is the "/" used for?


/moonbat

means moonbat mode off. The previous statement is my impression of what a moonbat would say.

Obama will save us from ChimpyMcBushitlerCheneyHaliburtonRove!
/moonbat

228 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:52:43pm

re: #215 Cap'n DOC

Yes?

You can't read invisible ink?!?

It was a Chuck Norris joke!
Too bad you missed it! :D

229 incanus  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:52:47pm

re: #15 Sharmuta

Did they just extend dawa'h to obama?

It's either that or a party on the beach.

230 Cap'n DOC  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:53:21pm

re: #219 Honorary Yooper

He came out here (MT) and spewed some crap about how he admired those of us who hunted, since you know, we like, it it. He said not one word about how the company he keeps are all gun-control advocates...

231 freetoken  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:53:31pm

re: #200 unrealizedviewpoint

John McCain we'd like you to meet someone by the name of Newt Gingrich. He can help you understand how American's feel about this Anwar non-issue. Ya know this frozen place American's care nothing of when gasoline is $5 a gallon.

Analysis of Crude Oil Production in the
Arctic National Wildlife Refuge
(PDF warning)

Additional oil production resulting from the opening of ANWR would be only a small portion of total world oil production, and would likely be offset in part by somewhat lower production outside the United States. The opening of ANWR is projected to have its largest oil price reduction impacts as follows: a reduction in low-sulfur, light crude oil prices of $0.41 per barrel (2006 dollars) in 2026 for the low oil resource case, $0.75 per barrel in 2025 for the mean oil resource case, and $1.44 per barrel in 2027 for the high oil resource case, relative to the reference case.

$1.44 per barrel is a bit over 3 cents per gallon. $.41 per barrel is less than a penny per gallon.

The "Drill here, drill now" stuff is just political theater concocted to feed off the pain of Americans.

232 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:54:03pm

re: #217 Diamond Bullet

It's actually more grotesque than that. According to the original NY Times article that started the furor, many Muslim families don't believe the whole 'blood in the bed' thing anymore either. They actually require the woman to give them a Certificate of Virginity signed by a doctor! That's why these women have to go to such ridiculous lengths - they have to be able to fool a medical examiner employed by the family of their future husband!


LOL. . .

Seems like an easy way for Doctors to earn some scratch.

"Sure, she's a virgin, that will be $150, please".

Its a win-win-win. Honor is preserved, marriage happens, Doctor gets paid.

233 Silhouette  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:54:08pm

re: #181 WriterMom

Just checked...four copies, one at the branch I use.

234 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:54:08pm

re: #227 jcm

"mode off" ... yeah, that makes sense

235 nikis-knight  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:55:00pm

re: #208 ccrnyc

'/' nah its just slashies.

/ like rain our your wedding day
/ a no smoking sign on your cigarette break
/ irony.

I think it means "off". As in,
[sarcasm]
That Obama, he's got all the answers!
[/sarcasm]
As used in bulletin board code and like sources. In casual posting at LGF, the "/sarcasm" has evolved down to just a /.

236 incanus  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:55:03pm

re: #47 Sharmuta

It's dawa'h- they've invited him to islam.

How can you go when you never left?

237 DistantThunder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:55:31pm

re: #231 freetoken

$1.44 per barrel is a bit over 3 cents per gallon. $.41 per barrel is less than a penny per gallon.

The "Drill here, drill now" stuff is just political theater concocted to feed off the pain of Americans.

Put if what is driving up the price is speculation on the fact that America will NOT drill at home for additional oil, the very acting of breaking the eggs on this will send a strong message to the commodity markets that we're willing to do what is necessary to find the oil.

238 Iron Fist  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:56:06pm

re: #190 debutaunt,

The Mohammedans worship a rock they keep in the Ka'aba. It is supposed to be a meteroite that Mo found in the desert. I'm not sure why the Mohammedans worship it, but it is what they are bowing to when they beat their head on the ground five times a day. They have a ritual where they walk around the Ka'aba (big black cube of stone in the desert) several times then enter the Ka'aba and kiss the rock.

Hey, at least they aren't sacrificing babies on it.

239 goddessoftheclassroom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:56:09pm

re: #212 unrealizedviewpoint

Republican's stand for life, all lives.

I just finished a (IMHO) brilliant post on the topic, but just as I was about to hit "post this comment" I remembered Charles's injunction against it.

240 gman  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:56:14pm

re: #25 Kosh's Shadow

Bush only promised to sell the Saudis nuclear reactors.
Whereas Obama will have some spare nuclear weapons after he unilaterally disarms.

That was my first thought too. Bush is giving the Saudis nuclear technology and yet they still want Obama. The know Obama is going to throw Israel under the bus.

241 bulwrk  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:56:41pm

re: #231 freetoken

Trotting out that old tired horse again? thats been debunked so many times its pathetic.

242 Cap'n DOC  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:56:44pm

re: #228 wolfie

You gotta dingyup for that one...

243 Silhouette  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:56:47pm

The forward slash does mean "mode off" but for some reason it has also morphed into sometimes meaning a post-script, add-on type of thing.

/and I don't know why.

244 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:56:49pm

re: #231 freetoken

The "Drill here, drill now" stuff is just political theater concocted to feed off the pain of Americans.

Bull. It's about creating supply. It's tough to create supply when Congress will not allow drilling in areas where we have supply, where there is known supply, where there is unknow supply, and will not let us create more supply by converting coal to gasoline with proven and well-tested technologies.

We can have gas back to $2 again. It is possible, people.

245 gman  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:56:54pm

Pimf
They

246 shibumi  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:56:59pm

re: #223 Dianna

Over the last 22 years? I've lost count. I think over a million.

It will keep on.

To say nothing of the slave trade.

I hate Sudan.

It's from an Obama speech. So actual numbers and facts are irrelevant.

247 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:57:08pm

re: #222 wolfie

It certainly should NOT be a federal issue.
It's a terrible shame judicial activism made it one.

Because it's been an issue during each election, it's been the cause for the needed exposure, therefore the change of attitude. Pro-abortionists no longer have the support they did just a few cycles ago. Right-to-Lifer's are gaining ground. Soon, we hope to see a reversal of Roe v Wade.

248 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:57:27pm

re: #209 wolfie

Yes! I just went to get a cookie before the little wolves ate them all!

Scratch the Cleveland Indians cap. No cap. (Avs are playing the Indians.) Don't wanna get beat up!

249 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:57:28pm
250 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:57:36pm
251 nikis-knight  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:57:37pm

re: #222 wolfie

It certainly should NOT be a federal issue.
It's a terrible shame judicial activism made it one.

The shame is that you have people supporting the whole scissors in the head thing.
I agree that it shouldn't be an issue, because in a decent society, the dems and the repubs would both be aghast at the thought. Ditto pulling out of Iraq, pleading with dictators, etc.

252 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:57:50pm

re: #210 jcm


One of the more interesting things I discovered was crime and parks. Stats are all counted against population a given area. Parks always come out as very high crime areas. The only people counting as living in a park are those living directly across the street, parks have very low population so the crime rate is "high".


The "low denominator" argument is undoubtedly correct, but I think parks actually *do* represent places where crime happens, if only because they represent some of the only open unguarded spaces in urban places.

Simply put, bad people go to parks at night to do questionable things.

253 goddessoftheclassroom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:57:57pm

re: #221 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Be quiet and wipe your face.

LOL!

254 Silhouette  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:58:08pm

re: #246 shibumi

It's from an Obama speech. So actual numbers and facts are irrelevant.

His uncle freed the people of Darfur.

255 mitthrawnurdo  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:58:33pm

re: #244 Honorary Yooper

Yes we can? lol

256 Golem Akbar  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:58:40pm

re: #240 gman

That was my first thought too. Bush is giving the Saudis nuclear technology and yet they still want Obama. The know Obama is going to throw Israel under the bus.


You know he already has. The day after he spoke so eloquently to AIPAC about keeping Jerusalem united, he gave an interview on CNN and said that the final disposition of Jerusalem is subject to negotiation. In other words, Jerusalem? eh!

257 incanus  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:58:52pm

re: #101 Diamond Bullet

Also, the NY times article has some other truly mesmerizing feats of idiotic logic:

He once got in trouble for making faces during Koran study classes in his elementary school, but a president is less likely to stereotype Muslims as fanatics — and more likely to be aware of their nationalism — if he once studied the Koran with them.


That makes a lot of sense.

What is Muslim nationalism?

258 Biff  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:58:57pm

re: #222 wolfie

I'll disagree with you there. I don't believe the states should individually legislate prohibitions on medical treatment. The question of when and how the Constitution may protect the unborn is a federal judicial issue.

259 nyc redneck  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:59:11pm

interesting that so many people and so many countries who don't like us, sure like him.
why wouldn't they after what he has said abt. america.

260 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:59:33pm

re: #243 Silhouette

The forward slash does mean "mode off" but for some reason it has also morphed into sometimes meaning a post-script, add-on type of thing.

/and I don't know why.

It does sometimes confuse.

/and I don't know why.

261 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:59:33pm

re: #237 DistantThunder

Put if what is driving up the price is speculation on the fact that America will NOT drill at home for additional oil, the very acting of breaking the eggs on this will send a strong message to the commodity markets that we're willing to do what is necessary to find the oil.

Right.

By simple supply/demand, oil should be much cheaper than it is now. A lot of the elevation is a speculation driven "bubble".

Commitment by the US to increase the supply. . .heck even credible TALK of such a commitment. . .could be enough to burst the bubble and drop oil prices signficantly.

262 shibumi  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:59:52pm

re: #231 freetoken

$1.44 per barrel is a bit over 3 cents per gallon. $.41 per barrel is less than a penny per gallon.

The "Drill here, drill now" stuff is just political theater concocted to feed off the pain of Americans.

Here's the thing: the media tends to like "political theater." It makes good copy in newspapers, and interesting sound bites on the tv news.

And if the media notices it, the politicians will notice it.

263 goddessoftheclassroom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 1:59:57pm

re: #250 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Nothing looks worse than a cat which has just been licked by a dog!

GMAT--I was just about to link that picture! Isn't the look on the cat's face PRICELESS?

264 Mars Needs Neocons  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:00:00pm

re: #8 Shug

And we all the affinity the Saudis have for black people

/

I'm not really sure what your point is here? In my time in Saudi I can tell you there are representatives of every race living in Saudi as Muslims. Racism is not their issue. They hate everyone equally who is not an Islamobot.

Please don't try to make this something it's not.

265 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:00:06pm

re: #259 nyc redneck

interesting that so many people and so many countries who don't like us, sure like him.
why wouldn't they after what he has said abt. america.

* * *
They agree the caliphate is the change they seek.

266 nikis-knight  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:00:23pm

re: #239 goddessoftheclassroom

I just finished a (IMHO) brilliant post on the topic, but just as I was about to hit "post this comment" I remembered Charles's injunction against it.

oh? Then everyone is free to ignore or just ding my previous, 251.

267 Ringo the Gringo  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:00:28pm

Hopefully President Obama can help us goofy Americans better understand the world.

For example, our failure to understand how Egyptians think and what they value:

CAIRO: Emad Refaat strode out of his workshop with purpose, his grease-covered hands pointing down the road even before he could see the road.

"Come here," he said, his voice strong with reassurance. "Go to the light, make the first right, that's Salah el-Din Street."

Sure?

"I am sure, totally sure."

But he was wrong, totally wrong..

"I wanted to help," said Refaat, 28, who was slightly embarrassed when he was asked why he gave the wrong directions with such conviction. "I was actually going to tell you to ask the flower vendor on the corner. He knows all the streets."

Navigating Egypt can be a challenge of understanding, not just the language, but its culture, values and norms. A pile of trash may look like litter to a foreigner, but it is a commodity to poor people who recycle and re-use almost everything. In Egypt, it is routine, absolutely routine, to get the wrong directions.

That is not because people are mischievous, but because if you ask for help, they feel obligated to try to help - even if they send you off in the wrong direction.

There is a lesson in this confusion that has more value than merely cautioning tourists to bring a map, sociologists, political scientists and intellectuals agreed.

The United States' relations with Egypt are strained - from the man on the street, to the president, rightly or wrongly, Egyptians are feeling disrespected by Washington.

It is not just about the invasion of Iraq, or the perennial feeling of favoritism for Israel, or the mild critiques coming from Washington about Egypt's lack of democracy. It is what people here see as the demonstrated failure to understand how they think, what they value - even when those values mean sending someone off mistakenly in the wrong direction.

Egyptian society values hospitality and personal honor over precision and directness. There is a kind of emotional camouflage that Egyptians wear to get through their days. Drivers act as if no one else is on the road, but almost always smile and wave after a near collision.

"Here, even if someone sends you in the wrong direction, he still feels that he did what he was supposed to do," said Hamdi Taha, head of a charity, Karam al-Islam, and a professor of communications at Al Azhar university. "He doesn't think he misguided you. He helped. Right and wrong is a relative thing."

268 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:00:47pm

re: #257 incanus

What is Muslim nationalism?

* * *
57 states!

269 Iron Fist  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:00:48pm

re: #257 incanus,

Islamic Fascism.

270 mitthrawnurdo  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:01:03pm

re: #257 incanus

Exactly..I thought that Muslims didn't believe in "nationalism", as Westerners understand it, rather, there is only Dar al-Islam and Allah as the Sovereign?

/They want to bring back the Caliphate, fools at the NYT.

271 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:01:20pm

re: #248 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Okay! Good thinking!
Mr. Wolf will probably wear his blue Cubs cap.
He'll be hanging around the sausage and I'll be at the dippin' dots!

272 CommonCents  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:01:35pm

re: #187 shibumi

You have a point. Detroit, Ann Arbor and Flint turn Michigan bright blue during the elections.

And that really burns me up because the county map makes us look like a red state.

273 Beobachter  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:01:40pm

re: #244 Honorary Yooper

Bull. It's about creating supply. It's tough to create supply when Congress will not allow drilling in areas where we have supply, where there is known supply, where there is unknow supply, and will not let us create more supply by converting coal to gasoline with proven and well-tested technologies.

We can have gas back to $2 again. It is possible, people.

Yes we can !

Drink

274 Colin Nelson  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:02:12pm

Somehow the concept of "... a dialogue with Iran..." rings the oxymoronic bell.

Course, after a briefing with those masters of dialogue the SAs, well everything will be, well, full of change and, HOPE!

275 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:02:23pm

re: #243 Silhouette

The forward slash does mean "mode off" but for some reason it has also morphed into sometimes meaning a post-script, add-on type of thing.

/and I don't know why.

THAT is what I've been seeing it used for. THANK you, Silhouette! It clears up my confusion.

/though I don't know how .. (-:

276 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:02:28pm

re: #257 incanus

What is Muslim nationalism?

* * *
Organization of Islamic Conferences 57 states...and growing, inshallah as they say under their breath.

277 eschew_obfuscation  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:03:39pm

re: #198 pre-Boomer Marine brat

jcm and unrealizedviewpoint,

Thanks. Tutor me further.

I occasionally see words or phrases postscripted after a fwd-slash (wish I had an example handy) but the contexts don't seem to imply "/sarc".

What else is the "/" used for?


My understanding is that everythiing others have said on this subject here is true.

I believe that the convention originated from the HTML syntax such as &ltstrong >This is bold text </strong&gt. In that context </strong> means the end of the emboldened text, so what we have in blog vernacular is a much shortened form such that anything that follows a '/' describes what has been ended......sarcasm, moonbat thought...etc.

278 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:03:39pm
279 Cognito  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:04:07pm
The paper added that in light of Obama's intent to conduct a dialogue with Iran, the Middle East countries should launch a dialogue with him and help him better understand what is going on.

This is interesting to me. It could be read a couple of ways.

The way most people seem to take it is, "Hey fellas, we may have a live one coming to power in America." So they can pull his strings, etc etc.

But in much of the Middle East -- including Saudi Arabia -- there's no love lost for Iran. At all. Matter of fact, I believe many people in the Middle East would (secretly) love to see Israel or America knock Ahmadinejad down a peg.

I tend to think that's what's going on here; the Saudis have gotten a good look at Obama and they're not comforted by what they see: a political lightweight who would rather be popular than be smart.

280 Biff  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:05:02pm

re: #273 Beobachter

You are right on. Even with the lag between opening our reserves and increasing supply, just the passage of legislation opening arctic and coastal fields will send the speculators running, and probably shatter the futures bubble.

281 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:05:09pm

re: #239 goddessoftheclassroom

I just finished a (IMHO) brilliant post on the topic, but just as I was about to hit "post this comment" I remembered Charles's injunction against it.

You're right. I'm done with the subject. He's eased up on some of the other taboo subjects. Maybe he'll provide direction on this, some slow Sunday.

282 goddessoftheclassroom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:05:11pm

re: #274 Colin Nelson

Somehow the concept of "... a dialogue with Iran..." rings the oxymoronic bell.

Course, after a briefing with those masters of dialogue the SAs, well everything will be, well, full of change and, HOPE!

Just as adults can't have a "dialogue" with a screaming toddler, America can't have a "dialogue" with a country whose interests and values are diametrically opposed to its own. If a grown-up gives the toddler the candy (or toy or whatever), the brat just learns that tantrums get it what it wants.

283 ploome hineni[deleted]  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:05:18pm
284 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:05:22pm

re: #271 wolfie

Okay! Good thinking!
Mr. Wolf will probably wear his blue Cubs cap.
He'll be hanging around the sausage and I'll be at the dippin' dots!

mmmm...dippin' dots.

285 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:05:38pm

re: #251 nikis-knight

I didn't mean to bring the subject itself up, because it's a no-no here.
I am just pointing out that Obama's ultra-extremist record on this issue should be (and will be) important in swing states.

286 Render  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:05:56pm

re: #250 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Looks kinda like Killian Bundys Bob.

SAY
WHAT,
R

287 debutaunt  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:06:12pm

re: #137 songbird


Page 261 from his book
.

We must find a way to make people stop "giving hard stares" at immigrants. We are horrible people.

288 freetoken  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:06:14pm

re: #237 DistantThunder

Put if what is driving up the price is speculation on the fact that America will NOT drill at home for additional oil,

Do you have any proof for that?

I have not seen any credible analysis that shows "speculation", as in traders using NYMEX (or any other exchange) to continually bid up oil futures contracts, is playing a lead or even a major role.

However, if you look at US consumption, such as todays TWIP we see how inelastic US demand is for liquid fuels (gasoline and distillates.) As long as the American consumer keeps on buying essentially the same volume (down trivially for gasoline, up for diesel) regardless of price, there will be little incentive for prices to come down.

Overall US oil consumption is down a bit this year compared to last year.... and sure enough this is accompanied by economic doldrums (whether or not we are technically in a recession.) That is a problem. What is the horse and what is the cart (i.e., oil consumption vs. economic activity) is a good question... regardless, we really do need to move our economy to energy sources that are more stable and long term.

Unfortunately for us we have exploited the great basins of oil in our country already, so now we need to move on. I remain a big proponent of nuclear, wind, and solar as the only long term solutions to making the US truly not susceptible to crises, economic or military, instigated by suppliers outside the US for whatever reasons.

289 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:06:18pm
290 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:07:03pm

re: #263 goddessoftheclassroom

GMAT--I was just about to link that picture! Isn't the look on the cat's face PRICELESS?

Yes! That's one unhappy camper!

Ur ... uh ... send the kids away from the monitor for a minute ....

I had a cat decades ago. She was my cat. Once I got up in the middle of the night to make a ... er ... call of nature. As I was standing there, the stupid cat jumped up on the rear of the bowl. The only problem was, she misjudged the distance.

In other words, I have seen a wet cat before.

291 Biff  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:07:25pm

Ever heard of Nasser's United Arab Republic?

re: #276 alegrias

re: #257 incanus
What is Muslim nationalism?
* * *
Organization of Islamic Conferences 57 states...and growing, inshallah as they say under their breath.
292 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:08:12pm

re: #289 jcm

Yesterday a couple of hikers were killed in a snowstorm on Mt. Hood, in Oregon.

293 jorline  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:08:13pm

OT

Just heard that Pakistan is pissed because the US military killed 12 Pakistani soldiers during the secret raid that reportedly killed an Al Qaeda big dog.

Shit happens when you play both sides of the fence.

294 Shiplord kirel  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:08:36pm

This is from a country that legally abolished slavery a year after Obama was born and which has yet to abolish it in fact.

Insanity and cognitive dissonance run rampant when political debate centers on identity and group grievance.

295 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:08:42pm

re: #292 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Yesterday a couple of hikers were killed in a snowstorm on Mt. Hood, in Oregon.

Three hikers got caught on Mt. Rainer yesterday, 1 dead.

296 goddessoftheclassroom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:09:00pm

re: #290 pre-Boomer Marine brat

OMG--I don't know whether I'm laughing more are the mental picture of the cat or of you!

297 snowcrash  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:09:01pm

re: #289 jcm
Thanks, have relatives in Pullman. Unbelievable.

298 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:09:40pm

re: #295 jcm

Maybe that was it.

299 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:09:47pm

re: #261 looking closely

Right.

By simple supply/demand, oil should be much cheaper than it is now. A lot of the elevation is a speculation driven "bubble".

Commitment by the US to increase the supply. . .heck even credible TALK of such a commitment. . .could be enough to burst the bubble and drop oil prices signficantly.

Yep. Between that and modifying the margin used to buy oil futures. Right now, you only need to lay out 7% of the total cost to buy them. Most stocks, IIRC, need a 50% margin. If the margin was increased to 25% even, that would, by itself knock some of the speculation out of the market. Combine that with a commitment to producing more oil and converting coal to gasoline, prices for gasoline and diesel will fall. You have more supply, and you need more money on hand to buy more oil futures. The latter will make it less of a good deal to make a quick buck, and should even out the price increases (and even the decreases), and make the price of a barrel of oil more stable.

300 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:10:21pm

re: #280 Biff

You are right on. Even with the lag between opening our reserves and increasing supply, just the passage of legislation opening arctic and coastal fields will send the speculators running, and probably shatter the futures bubble.

* * *
Imagine if America built enough refineries to handle what we need. Think how much cheaper it would be than having to pay to have it shipped to us from dangerous places.

Increasing supply would also increase jobs in the energy production & distribution sector. That would be great for our economy. Plus we could sell excess supply for profit.

Drill Now, Drill Here, Pay Less.
Great Kickstart to our Economy.

301 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:10:23pm

re: #289 jcm

Photos taken JUNE 10 in Pullman WA.

SNOW!

Flowers in bloom in a snowstorm! Love it!

302 nikis-knight  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:10:32pm

re: #292 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Yesterday a couple of hikers were killed in a snowstorm on Mt. Hood, in Oregon.

I was going to make a crack about Global warming, but for one it's obvious, and more important, poor taste to score political points off of random tragic deaths.

303 MJ  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:11:04pm

re: #279 Cognito

This is interesting to me. It could be read a couple of ways.

The way most people seem to take it is, "Hey fellas, we may have a live one coming to power in America." So they can pull his strings, etc etc.

But in much of the Middle East -- including Saudi Arabia -- there's no love lost for Iran. At all. Matter of fact, I believe many people in the Middle East would (secretly) love to see Israel or America knock Ahmadinejad down a peg.

I tend to think that's what's going on here; the Saudis have gotten a good look at Obama and they're not comforted by what they see: a political lightweight who would rather be popular than be smart.


See my post 153 above.

304 EC Marm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:11:06pm

re: #278 NJDhockeyfan

Obama: “Have a Credit Card? You’re A Dumb Victim”


I don't have time to read the whole thing and hate to think that I could possibly align with BHO on anything, but the credit card companies are [deleted] [deleted] [deleted] who have [deleted][deleted] with [deleted].
I have been [deleted] so many times by those [deleted] of [deleted] that I finally swore them off completely. It's painful but I refuse to bend over and let them [deleted] me in the [deleted] time after time.
Did you ever see the movie "Fight Club," where at the end, all of the credit card company buildings are blown up? Let's just say, I didn't shed a tear.

305 Pianobuff  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:11:11pm

re: #256 Golem Akbar

At least he's committed to completing the mission in Iraq....

[Link: hotair.com...]

306 debutaunt  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:12:00pm

re: #173 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Not gonna fight you on that one. The context was more (if I understand correctly) about Japanese Interment Camps. That kind of thing.

Still don't like the SOB. Please don't think I am defending him.

There will be legislation about 'hard staring.'

307 Josephine  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:12:16pm

re: #83 Diamond Bullet

Call to prayer (according to Wiki)

"God is The Greatest;
"I bear witness that there is no lord except God;
"I bear witness that Muhammad is the Messenger of God..."

My sincere question:
What's the difference between reciting that and saying the shahada "with a first-rate accent"?

Shahada (according to Wiki)

"I bear witness that there is no god except for God (Allah), and Muhammad is the messenger of God."

"A single honest recitation of the Shahadah in Arabic is all that is required for a person to become a Muslim according to most traditional schools."

308 lobo91  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:12:22pm

re: #299 Honorary Yooper

Of course, unless we build more refining capacity, increasing crude oil supply won't have much effect on the price of gas.

Cars don't run on crude oil.

309 freetoken  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:12:48pm

re: #241 bulwrk

That EIA report is only a couple of weeks old. If you don't like it (did you read it?) then fine... make up your own "analysis". However, at least be man enough to put it on the web somewhere for people to pick over it.

310 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:12:51pm

re: #302 nikis-knight

I was going to make a crack about Global warming, but for one it's obvious, and more important, poor taste to score political points off of random tragic deaths.

That's what exercise'll do to you. It'll kill ya!

Jim Fixx, died while jogging!

Couch Potatoes Unite!

311 maddogg  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:13:21pm

re: #289 jcm

Photos taken JUNE 10 in Pullman WA.

SNOW!

Global Warming! Algore, the premier jackass of our time......

312 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:13:32pm

re: #296 goddessoftheclassroom

OMG--I don't know whether I'm laughing more are the mental picture of the cat or of you!

I cursed that damned cat in a very loud voice. I think it woke my ex up.

The hardest part was catching the little #&$%@, to wash her off. Washing her off wasn't a problem. I made it clear, she'd suffer if she resisted.

313 Dustoff-507  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:13:57pm

Charles.

[Link: www.democracy-project.com...]

I think I need a strong drink. What is wrong with Bush?

314 Silhouette  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:14:05pm

re: #267 Ringo the Gringo

A pile of trash may look like litter to a foreigner, but it is a commodity to poor people who recycle and re-use almost everything.

From what I understand, it isn't the poor so much as it is the Coptic Christians of Egypt, who are indeed poor, who collect the trash of the city. The Christian families live with it and the rats, sorting and selling what they can, because very little employment opportunity is available for Christians. And because of the pigs and filth, the Muslims will not come into their area and they can live in relative safety from jihad.

315 bulwrk  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:14:07pm

re: #288 freetoken

Unfortunately for us we have exploited the great basins of oil in our country already,

we don't know that new exploration has been blocked in this country for decades

316 EC Marm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:14:39pm

re: #279 Cognito
I have to disagree with you. Not with what you said, just on general principles, out of habit.

317 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:15:48pm

re: #288 freetoken

Unfortunately for us we have exploited the great basins of oil in our country already, so now we need to move on. I remain a big proponent of nuclear, wind, and solar as the only long term solutions to making the US truly not susceptible to crises, economic or military, instigated by suppliers outside the US for whatever reasons.

Um, no, we have not exploited the greatest basins of them all yet. You have failed to take into account that the US has more oil locked up in the oil shales than the Magic Kingdom could ever have. You have also failed to take into account drilling in the Gulf (off Florida, Alabama, and Mississippi) and the Atlantic and the Pacific. Shoot, there's oil seeps in the LA area in the ocean.

Then there's the simple fact that the US is the Saudi Arabia of coal. Coal to gasoline is a tried, tested, and proven technology.

Then there's "green" crude. Called green because it is made from algae. This could be very big in the future. And, it'd be "carbon-neutral" as the algae would absorb carbon releases by burning the fuel made from it (fuck you, greenies!).

Solar, wind, and nuclear will only get us so far, but until you can get a car or a truck that will have extended battery life and charge quickly, you are stuck burning something.

318 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:15:57pm

re: #316 EC Marm

I find that humorous.

319 debutaunt  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:16:29pm

re: #208 ccrnyc

'/' nah its just slashies.

/ like rain our your wedding day
/ a no smoking sign on your cigarette break
/ irony.

Does /oo/ mean a hard stare?

320 The Other Les  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:17:06pm

Just ate a damned close to perfect cheeseburger. Nearly orgasmic.

(And now we watch the heads of the Vegans explode.)

321 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:17:07pm

re: #291 Biff

Ever heard of Nasser's United Arab Republic?

* * *
Yes!
Egypts' creepy Gamal Abdel Nasser was a socialist who helped found the PLO.

What a tool of the USSR.

"...As a result of Soviet influence and domestic factors, Nasser gradually began to move Egypt toward a socialist economic system, at least somewhat shaped by Marxism-Leninism. By 1962, this had led to a minimum 51% government ownership of virtually all Egyptian business.[29] During his official visit to Egypt on May 9-26, 1964, Nikita Khrushchev awarded Nasser the title of the Hero of the Soviet Union and the Order of Lenin.[30]

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

322 incanus  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:17:16pm

re: #291 Biff

Ever heard of Nasser's United Arab Republic?

Of course =)

Methinks Muslim nationalism refers to Dar al Islam, which isn't really a country at all unless the Caliphate is coming back.

323 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:18:18pm

re: #320 The Other Les

Hope it was good.

Beef. It's what's rotting in your colon!

(slink away)

324 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:18:19pm

re: #308 lobo91

Of course, unless we build more refining capacity, increasing crude oil supply won't have much effect on the price of gas.

Cars don't run on crude oil.

Very true. More refineries are needed in the worst way. We have two in our area. They pay well, and create a lot of jobs.

325 Nevergiveup  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:19:45pm

re: #313 Dustoff-507

Charles.

[Link: www.democracy-project.com...]

I think I need a strong drink. What is wrong with Bush?

All Presidents get this urge to go out of office by:

1) securing Middle East Peace--deep six that one
2) Being universally loved----yeah let's scratch that one also
3) Not looking old and grey---Actually I think Bush gets plenty of sleep

So that's why he is doing shit like this. G-D help us all.

326 Athos  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:20:08pm

re: #288 freetoken

Unfortunately for us we have exploited the great basins of oil in our country already, so now we need to move on.

You are mistaken. There are huge reserves of oil, onshore and offshore, as well as oil shale, and natural gas that cannot be developed and leveraged because of restrictions put in place by the Democrats. We cannot even leverage our coal reserves because of environmental restrictions put in place by the Democrats. Nuclear energy - which supplies >66% of the electricity in numerous countries like Japan, France, etc is prevented from development because of the Democrats. Even green energy solutions, solar and wind, are being limited because of restrictions put in place by primarily Democrats.

There is a party in this country that is focused on conservation as being the only viable process to be more energy efficient. They are forcing conservation by the limitation of supply and using high prices to moderate demand. The sad part is, the poor people most damaged by this clueless approach are the poor that is considered the bread and butter constituents of the Democrat Party.

327 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:20:59pm

re: #322 incanus

Of course =)

Methinks Muslim nationalism refers to Dar al Islam, which isn't really a country at all unless the Caliphate is coming back.

* * *
That, my friends, is the change they seek!

328 opnion  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:21:03pm

re: #322 incanus

Of course =)

Methinks Muslim nationalism refers to Dar al Islam, which isn't really a country at all unless the Caliphate is coming back.

Right, it is the world wide Umma of Muslims. They keep telling us how important the Islamic community is. Yet it is hateful to question whether Muslim loyalty is to the Western country in which they reside or to the broader Muslim community

329 debutaunt  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:21:06pm

re: #238 Iron Fist

Thanks. I was just doing an O'bama reference.

330 Colin Nelson  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:21:09pm

#153 MJ

Agree with your take on the Iran/SA divide. But it is not just Shia, Sunni based: we're talking Arabs vice Persians to say nothing about the good old fashioned issues of power and money.

331 incanus  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:21:10pm

re: #324 Honorary Yooper

Very true. More refineries are needed in the worst way. We have two in our area. They pay well, and create a lot of jobs.

Over the past 10 years, temporary and immediate spikes in gasoline prices at the pumps could be directly traced to lack of refining capacity and changes in formulation requirements. I'm thinking in particular of the major price hike in Chicago when a refinery making their formulation went offline.

332 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:21:19pm

re: #279 Cognito

But in much of the Middle East -- including Saudi Arabia -- there's no love lost for Iran. At all. Matter of fact, I believe many people in the Middle East would (secretly) love to see Israel or America knock Ahmadinejad down a peg.

Actually, The Saudis know that the real power in Iran is the Mullahs, and could care less about DinnerJacket. That said, the Mullahs are more closely in line with what the royals see as a good society.
They HATED Iraq, more specifically Saddam and were happy that we took him out. I don't beleive they would "love to see Israel" knock anyone in the region down a peg

333 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:21:20pm

re: #324 Honorary Yooper

Very true. More refineries are needed in the worst way. We have two in our area. They pay well, and create a lot of jobs.

I hear Iran is building 7 new refineries

How many have we got under construction?
In the planning stage?
In the approval process?
Being considered?
Passing thoughts?

334 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:21:23pm

re: #298 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Maybe that was it.

Turkeys went on a "day hike" above 10,000 feet and didn't look at the forecast. 1) No day hikes above 10,000 feet, you plan for shit to happen. 2) Always know the forecast.

335 nyc redneck  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:21:51pm

they like him because they think he will sell out israel and that really is the kind of change they are looking for.
it's disgusting how these 3rd world countries openly support terror and openly support b.o.

336 maddogg  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:22:02pm

re: #323 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Hope it was good.

Beef. It's what's rotting in your colon!

(slink away)

Your right, I have venison rotting in my Colon.

337 bulwrk  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:22:22pm

re: #309 freetoken

Its a new copy of an old report by an agency headed up by moonbats.Tell me why when the saudis so much as hint that they will cut production the price of a barrel of oil skyrockets, but some how the worlds third largest producer of oil shows the world its serious about increasing its oil production and the markets would just yawn.

338 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:22:36pm

re: #333 unrealizedviewpoint

I hear Iran is building 7 new refineries

How many have we got under construction?
In the planning stage?
In the approval process?
Being considered?
Passing thoughts?

Iran's gasoline production come out of one refinery. They import gasoline.

339 mean Gene  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:22:51pm

re: #264 Mars Needs Neocons

I'm not really sure what your point is here? In my time in Saudi I can tell you there are representatives of every race living in Saudi as Muslims. Racism is not their issue. They hate everyone equally who is not an Islamobot.

Please don't try to make this something it's not.

You're right, Muslims come to SA from all over the earth.

But have you ever been around African Americans who worked in SA and were called "abd," by little Saudi girls?
Abd is Arabic for ''slave.''
In some names it means ''servant," like in Abdullah (servant of allah).
But in SA calling a man that is the equivalent of using the "n" word here in the USA on him.
It is definitely a derogatory term.

It leads African American men to tout their white (mixed) heritage while in SA.
Can you imagine?
Only the Saudi's could make black Americans talk with reverence about their mixed background and white ancestors as being perceived as less-then-100%-black is the only way to get any respect whatsoever, there.

340 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:23:33pm

re: #330 Colin Nelson

#153 MJ

Agree with your take on the Iran/SA divide. But it is not just Shia, Sunni based: we're talking Arabs vice Persians to say nothing about the good old fashioned issues of power and money.

Many people over look the Arab / Persian issue.

341 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:23:44pm

re: #338 jcm

Iran's gasoline production come out of one refinery. They import gasoline.

Iran is actually building 7 new refineries.

342 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:23:56pm

re: #338 jcm

Iran's gasoline production come out of one refinery. They import gasoline.

But they're doing something to correct that problem.
Too bad WE aren't.

343 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:24:50pm

re: #338 jcm

Iran's gasoline production come out of one refinery. They import gasoline.

[Link: english.farsnews.com...]

344 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:24:55pm

re: #341 unrealizedviewpoint

Iran is actually building 7 new refineries.

Would making a "target practice" joke be inappropriate?

345 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:25:06pm

re: #341 unrealizedviewpoint

Iran is actually building 7 new refineries.

re: #342 wolfie

But they're doing something to correct that problem.
Too bad WE aren't.

I say put the first &%$#* refinery in Malibu, pump oil directly from the new offshore rigs!

346 Athos  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:25:44pm

re: #331 incanus

In addition to the impact of a shortage of refining capacity, there is another often forgotten major impact on the pricing of gasoline. The blends of gas used in this country are not the same. There are regional differences and requirements in place because of additive requirements which also differ from season to season.

This is very apparent in California. We cannot use any surplus gasoline from other parts of the country and generally have to depend on our local refineries for the California flavor blends and additives. With season changes from winter to summer blends, any problems or disruption in the refining capabilities will result in shortages and jumps in our prices.

347 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:26:01pm

re: #344 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Would making a "target practice" joke be inappropriate?

I was thinking it would be a shame if something happened, they do blow up all the time..... a little help from a JDAM couldn't hurt.

348 Beobachter  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:26:06pm

re: #326 Athos

I like the way you think. I just heard someone say that Bush sc...d up the economy, which is why he won't vote republican this year.

Since the dems took congress, the price of gas has gone up $1.50.

He's been relying on the MSM too much.

349 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:26:08pm

re: #331 incanus

Over the past 10 years, temporary and immediate spikes in gasoline prices at the pumps could be directly traced to lack of refining capacity and changes in formulation requirements. I'm thinking in particular of the major price hike in Chicago when a refinery making their formulation went offline.

Yep. The refineries we have are working at 94-99% capacity. If just one goes off-line, there is nothing to pick up the slack. Idealy, they should be in the mid to high 80s for capacity. That's enough to have other refineries pick up what an off-line refinery could produce.

Then there's all the silly boutique blends of gasoline. Why we just don't have one standard for winter and one standard for summer is beyond me. We could even share this standard with Canada and cut costs for making it even lower due to volume.

350 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:26:55pm

re: #344 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Would making a "target practice" joke be inappropriate?

I'll bet the Israeli air force has already ,,umm,,"mapquested" them !

351 opnion  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:27:35pm

re: #345 jcm

I say put the first &%$#* refinery in Malibu, pump oil directly from the new offshore rigs!


How about Anwar, the Gulf of Mexico & conversion of shale?
Lets do it & get some clean nuclear plants on line.
OPEC as it is now can screw with us anytime that they want.

352 VegasRick  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:27:41pm

re: #344 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Would making a "target practice" joke be inappropriate?

NOPE!

353 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:28:11pm

re: #344 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Would making a "target practice" joke be inappropriate?

We need be certain to only inflict damage upon their nuke capabilities only. And the Mullah's.

354 Silhouette  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:28:33pm

re: #325 Nevergiveup

All Presidents get this urge to go out of office by:

1) securing Middle East Peace--deep six that one.

Can't they just try to cure cancer or the common cold? You know, something easier?

Or create perpetual motion that produces energy? You know, something more likely?

355 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:28:50pm

re: #348 Beobachter

I like the way you think. I just heard someone say that Bush sc...d up the economy, which is why he won't vote republican this year.

Since the dems took congress, the price of gas has gone up $1.50.

He's been relying on the MSM too much.

* * *
The MSM would never point out democrat VEEP vetter Jim Johnson made gazillions at Fannie Mae off substandard mortgages, resulting in defaulted loans and lousy credit ratings & excess housing stock!

356 DistantThunder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:28:53pm

Hart Crane, poet

“O, brilliant kids, I was a fool just like you. I was in my mid-40s before I properly thanked my father for his decades of hard work — paying for me to laze around in the cars he bought me, to get drunk in the frat house whose dues he paid, to spend the afternoons with my girlfriends looking at trees and rivers while Pop worked and got so anxious that he took up smoking three packs of Kents a day.

“O, brilliant kids, you get to put on the garments of the morally righteous and upstanding while your parents work — because mothers work now and always have worked — and your parents must say, ‘Yes, sir,’ or ‘No, sir,’ to those who hire them. O, golden children, you get to talk about how you’ll never ‘sell out,’ and meanwhile your parents stay up late in torment, thinking of how they can pay your tuition. Because, brilliant kids, work (business) involves exhaustion and eating humble pie and going on even when you think you can’t. And you are the beneficiaries of it in your gilded youth.

“Be smarter than Ben Stein ever was. Be a better person than I ever was. Right now, today, thank your parents for working to support you. Don’t act as if it’s the divine right of students. Get right up in their faces and say, ‘Thank you for what you do so I can live like this.’ Say something. Say it, so that when they’re at O’Hare or Dallas-Fort Worth and they’ve just learned that their flight is canceled and they’ll have to stay overnight at the airport, they will know you appreciate them.

“Get it in your heads that if you throw away your moral duties to your parents, you are thieves. You were born on third base and your parents put you there, and you think you hit a triple. It’s not true. It’s time to give back.

“ `Attention must be paid,’ as Arthur Miller said. So start now, and make it a habit to be grateful to your parents. Say you’re grateful and mean it. Do it now, however young or old you are. Do it on Father’s Day, Mother’s Day, every day.”

357 nikis-knight  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:29:54pm

re: #319 debutaunt

Does /oo/ mean a hard stare?

Yes. Knock that off, there might be an immigrant around.

358 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:30:04pm

re: #350 sattv4u2

I'll bet the Israeli air force has already ,,umm,,"mapquested" them !

The target ain't the Iranian people and that's who's hurt by blowing up their refineries. I hope to go to Iran on vacation one day and I want to be able to buy gas.

359 Ojoe  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:31:22pm
360 opnion  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:31:53pm

re: #353 unrealizedviewpoint

We need be certain to only inflict damage upon their nuke capabilities only. And the Mullah's.


True. Whatever else peopls might say about the Shah, Iran was fairly Westernised under him.
Even in the Mullahocracy a lot of the young people still wish to be free of the crazy old men & favor Western culture. If we strike, we want to get the right people.
If Obama is elected I would not be surprised if Israel moves on the nukes before he takes office.

361 satan sidekick  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:32:07pm

How about the fact that China is drilling 60 miles off our coast?
Are we insane?
[Link: www.americanfreepress.net...]

re: #317 Honorary Yooper

362 Ward Cleaver  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:32:52pm

re: #349 Honorary Yooper

Yep. The refineries we have are working at 94-99% capacity. If just one goes off-line, there is nothing to pick up the slack. Idealy, they should be in the mid to high 80s for capacity. That's enough to have other refineries pick up what an off-line refinery could produce.

Then there's all the silly boutique blends of gasoline. Why we just don't have one standard for winter and one standard for summer is beyond me. We could even share this standard with Canada and cut costs for making it even lower due to volume.

You can thank the EPA for all the boutique blends, what with the ozone reduction requirements for cities like Dallas.

363 Nevergiveup  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:32:54pm

re: #361 satan sidekick

How about the fact that China is drilling 60 miles off our coast?
Are we insane?
[Link: www.americanfreepress.net...]

Yes.

364 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:33:00pm

re: #350 sattv4u2

I'll bet the Israeli air force has already ,,umm,,"mapquested" them !

Hell, it's pre-programmed into the computers of the planes of the 509th BW.

365 Athos  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:33:14pm

re: #342 wolfie

But they're doing something to correct that problem.
Too bad WE aren't.

3 Steps -

1. Build more refineries domestically.
2. Expand Domestic oil production.
3. Eliminate the Iranian refinery while we also cripple other major elements of their C&C, Infrastructure, Oil production, and Nuclear Development.

366 Bosch Fawstin  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:33:16pm

Like Bush rep for being 'the best friend Israel ever had [he's not, having pressrured Israel to absorb terrorism the way we never would], Obama would be the best friend our enemies ever had.

367 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:33:30pm

re: #348 Beobachter

I like the way you think. I just heard someone say that Bush sc...d up the economy, which is why he won't vote republican this year.

Since the dems took congress, the price of gas has gone up $1.50.

He's been relying on the MSM too much.

I keep a record of every tank of gas I have purchased for my car. Where, what town, how much, cost/gallon, total cost, and mileage. When the Dems took office in January of 2007, I paid $2.15/gallon. I just paid $4.14/gallon this morning. It's gone up just about $2/gallon since they took office in January of 2007.

For the record, when I got the car in November of 2001, I was paying a little over $1/gallon for gasoline. So, between then and January of 2007, gasoline went up $1/gallon over 5 years. It has since gone up $2/gallon over the last 18 months. That's $0.20/gallon/year versus $0.11/gallon/month (or $1.33/gallon/year) since the Dems took office.

368 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:33:31pm

re: #361 satan sidekick

How about the fact that China is drilling 60 miles off our coast?
Are we insane?
[Link: www.americanfreepress.net...]

* * *
China is drilling the oil we need!
What democrat or enviro is going to say NO to China?

369 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:33:51pm

re: #359 Ojoe

chills

370 Nevergiveup  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:34:00pm

re: #364 jcm

Hell, it's pre-programmed into the computers of the planes of the 509th BW.

[Link: www.whiteman.af.mil...]

371 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:34:17pm

re: #360 opnion

True. Whatever else peopls might say about the Shah, Iran was fairly Westernised under him.
Even in the Mullahocracy a lot of the young people still wish to be free of the crazy old men & favor Western culture. If we strike, we want to get the right people.
If Obama is elected I would not be surprised if Israel moves on the nukes before he takes office.

Agreed 1000 zillion %

If only it were possible to just target the Mullah's. The majority of Iranian's would gladly disarm when the smoke clears.

372 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:34:39pm

re: #361 satan sidekick

How about the fact that China is drilling 60 miles off our coast?
Are we insane?
[Link: www.americanfreepress.net...]

Yep, it's positively fucking insane.

373 satan sidekick  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:34:39pm

Well the idiot Governor of my state (NH) just signed us up for Global Warming initiatives.

Another scam that will hurt NH businesses and increase our electric bills. Control of a public utility has just been taken over by Gov Lynch.

[Link: hosted.ap.org...] ... TE=DEFAULT

374 A Kiwi Infidel  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:34:54pm
375 opnion  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:35:12pm

re: #361 satan sidekick

How about the fact that China is drilling 60 miles off our coast?
Are we insane?
[Link: www.americanfreepress.net...]

Uh huh.

376 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:35:29pm

re: #358 unrealizedviewpoint

The target ain't the Iranian people and that's who's hurt by blowing up their refineries. I hope to go to Iran on vacation one day and I want to be able to buy gas.

Sorry to wrewck your vacation plans, but the oil/ gas/ natural gas is state controlled (meaning source of $$$$$$, money that funds their military and nuclear research). Not to sound crass, but plan on getting a bike when you get there

377 incanus  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:35:33pm

re: #346 Athos

In addition to the impact of a shortage of refining capacity, there is another often forgotten major impact on the pricing of gasoline. The blends of gas used in this country are not the same. There are regional differences and requirements in place because of additive requirements which also differ from season to season.

This is very apparent in California. We cannot use any surplus gasoline from other parts of the country and generally have to depend on our local refineries for the California flavor blends and additives. With season changes from winter to summer blends, any problems or disruption in the refining capabilities will result in shortages and jumps in our prices.

Yeah I was trying to mention that when I spoke of formularies, but I wasn't very clear. Good point!

378 SagamoreGal  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:36:05pm

Bumper sticker:

"For those who wanted Americans to be more like Europeans, quit your bitchin' at the pump. $5 per gallon - just like Europeans."

379 Bosch Fawstin  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:36:35pm

Gotta repost, 4got to spell check:

Like Bush's rep for being 'the best friend Israel ever had [he's not, having pressured Israel to absorb terrorism the way we never would], Obama would be the best friend our enemies ever have.

380 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:36:58pm

re: #376 sattv4u2

Sorry to wrewck your vacation plans, but the oil/ gas/ natural gas is state controlled (meaning source of $$$$$$, money that funds their military and nuclear research). Not to sound crass, but plan on getting a bike when you get there

My vacation plans are post-war, post Mullah.

381 alegrias  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:37:10pm

re: #378 SagamoreGal

Bumper sticker:

"For those who wanted Americans to be more like Europeans, quit your bitchin' at the pump. $5 per gallon - just like Europeans."

* * *
Higher Taxes are the CHANGES they seek!

382 nikis-knight  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:37:13pm

re: #358 unrealizedviewpoint

The target ain't the Iranian people and that's who's hurt by blowing up their refineries. I hope to go to Iran on vacation one day and I want to be able to buy gas.

I'd guess that the time it takes to rebuild a refinary is much less than the time it'll take to make it welcoming to an American (assuming you are one.)

383 DistantThunder  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:37:39pm

re: #378 SagamoreGal

Bumper sticker:

"For those who wanted Americans to be more like Europeans, quit your bitchin' at the pump. $5 per gallon - just like Europeans."

Except now they are paying 7-10 dollars per gallon 50% of which is taxes.

384 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:37:50pm

re: #370 Nevergiveup

[Link: www.whiteman.af.mil...]

If a JDAM went off in their gasoline refinery would they even know?

'jus a work accident if you asked me.

385 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:38:15pm

re: #365 Athos

3 Steps -

1. Build more refineries domestically.
2. Expand Domestic oil production.
3. Eliminate the Iranian refinery while we also cripple other major elements of their C&C, Infrastructure, Oil production, and Nuclear Development.

Sounds like a plan!

386 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:38:18pm

re: #379 Bosch Fawstin

Gotta repost, 4got to spell check:

Like Bush's rep for being 'the best friend Israel ever had [he's not, having pressured Israel to absorb terrorism the way we never would], Obama would be the best friend our enemies ever have.

As long as Jimmy Carter is still taking in oxygen, Obama will have to settle for being #2

387 justacanuck  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:38:27pm

OT: What's up with HotAir & MM ?

Both sites - hosted at the same provider, IIRC, are down again today.

Anyone know what's up? Is it a DDos attack?

388 opnion  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:38:35pm

re: #376 sattv4u2

Sorry to wrewck your vacation plans, but the oil/ gas/ natural gas is state controlled (meaning source of $$$$$$, money that funds their military and nuclear research). Not to sound crass, but plan on getting a bike when you get there


The Mullahs are hurting the Iranian people. It is an Orwellian state wrapped around a crazy delusional religion.
Morality police WTF?
Whatever we do or do not do, Israel can not allow Iran to have nukes period.

389 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:38:36pm

re: #380 unrealizedviewpoint

You probably have a while to save for the trip.

390 A Kiwi Infidel  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:38:58pm

re: #378 SagamoreGal

Bumper sticker:

"For those who wanted Americans to be more like Europeans, quit your bitchin' at the pump. $5 per gallon $7.83 per gallon- just like Europeans.New Zealanders"

assumes one us gallon equals 3.7854 litres

391 Athos  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:39:17pm

re: #362 Ward Cleaver

Very true, but there's also no logical reason why, for example, California's standards aren't adopted as national standards.

That is, I believe a direct reflection of the democrat influence on the process. If one wants something to fail, and the failure of something cannot be attributable to something one directly did, then make that something very complex and watch it collapse because of the complexity.

The desired end result is obtained with plausible deniability of causing it.

392 debutaunt  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:39:41pm

re: #323 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Hope it was good.

Beef. It's what's rotting in your colon!

(slink away)

No - it's a hunk of cauliflower

393 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:39:44pm

re: #317 Honorary Yooper

Then there's the simple fact that the US is the Saudi Arabia of coal.

Excellent! This means I can pick out 4 more wives, right?

394 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:40:13pm

re: #390 A Kiwi Infidel

assumes one us gallon equals 3.7854 litres

You watch, that's next. Metric. We'll never figure out how much we're payin'. Oh crap!

395 goddessoftheclassroom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:40:14pm

re: #392 debutaunt

No - it's a hunk of cauliflower

He swallowed it WHOLE?

396 Beobachter  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:40:18pm

re: #387 justacanuck

OT: What's up with HotAir & MM ?

Both sites - hosted at the same provider, IIRC, are down again today.

Anyone know what's up? Is it a DDos attack?

Hotair works fine for me.

397 Charles[deleted]  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:41:05pm
398 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:41:08pm

re: #358 unrealizedviewpoint

The target ain't the Iranian people and that's who's hurt by blowing up their refineries. I hope to go to Iran on vacation one day and I want to be able to buy gas.

Constricting the gasoline supply would put pressure on the Mullahs. If we're smart about we support groups in Iran and let them make plays like that.

The Solidarity model if you will. We have a population that could be inclined toward us. Just have to be smart, lend 'em a hand, put pressure where we can. And let them throw the necktie party for the mullahs.

399 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:41:13pm

re: #393 Occasional Reader

Excellent! This means I can pick out 4 more wives, right?

MORE? How many do you have now?

400 A Kiwi Infidel  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:41:13pm

re: #393 Occasional Reader

Excellent! This means I can pick out 4 more wives, right?


Careful what you ask for, you might just get what you wish

401 justacanuck  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:41:26pm

re: #387 justacanuck

OT: What's up with HotAir & MM ?

Both sites - hosted at the same provider, IIRC, are down again today.

Anyone know what's up? Is it a DDos attack?

Nevermind. Looks like they're both back up now. And I just finished an unenlightening chat convo with the domain host on the topic. Imagine that.

402 Catttt  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:41:27pm

OT

I &hearts Michael Steele.

McCain Campaign - listen to Mr. Steele on resources exploration and development.

And Bob Beckel agrees with him that both parties are out to lunch on this subject.

403 Athos  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:41:39pm

re: #367 Honorary Yooper

The numbers aren't any different here in LALA land either.

We wouldn't be in as bad of a mess if Clinton did not veto the bill authorizing expanded oil production, in particular in ANWR, in 1995.

Now, when that same concept is brought up, the very first argument used is that it will take too long to bring those fields online to make any difference. The second is 1M bbls / day will not make a real difference on supply and prices.

404 opnion  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:41:44pm

re: #380 unrealizedviewpoint

My vacation plans are post-war, post Mullah.


Thats a great thought, but what is going to make the Mullahs go away?
They control all the means of coersion, the police, The Military & the special force that kills our troops in Iraq. I might start planning a nice trip to Hawaii. It is more realistic.

405 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:41:44pm

re: #397 Charles

Ominous music plays...

406 didache  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:41:48pm

This is way off topic but it's bugging me and I can't wait for the next open thread. You know the current Hitler (Downfall) meme on YouTube where people subtitle a scene from Downfall with whatever topic amuses them (Hillary dressing down her campaign managers, themes about soccer or ice hockey etc) well my problem is I'm technically illiterate so how do you do that? How do you get that clip from Downfall and put your own subtitles on it? I want to do it as a practical joke on a workmate. I have a mac with iMovie and iDVD. What do I do next?

407 sadhu  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:41:55pm

nere: #397 Charles

Testing something...

nerd alert!

408 Nevergiveup  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:41:56pm

re: #384 jcm

If a JDAM went off in their gasoline refinery would they even know?

'jus a work accident if you asked me.

Well multiple large "work accidents' might raise a few eye brows, but if everybody on our side were able to keep it zippered, we could get there and back without anyone even knowing.
[Link: www.whiteman.af.mil...]
boys and their toys

409 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:42:00pm

re: #382 nikis-knight

I'd guess that the time it takes to rebuild a refinary is much less than the time it'll take to make it welcoming to an American (assuming you are one.)

Just this past weekend I was sitting across a poker table, here in LA, musing with a Persian about vacationing in Iran after the war.

410 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:42:05pm

re: #397 Charles

Testing something...

Will we pass?

411 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:42:06pm

re: #323 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Hope it was good.

Beef. It's what's rotting in your colon!

(slink away)

Um, that's a myth, by the way.

412 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:42:43pm

re: #399 wolfie

MORE? How many do you have now?

I have one, I think we get five if we're Saudis, don't we?

413 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:42:46pm

re: #397 Charles

Testing something...

Grab something lizards this could get bumpy!
/
Charles only brings coolness, no bumps

414 Athos  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:42:59pm

re: #410 Honorary Yooper

Will we pass?

Congress already failed.

415 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:43:13pm

re: #411 Occasional Reader

Um, that's a myth, by the way.

But funny.

416 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:43:23pm

Okay, whose the one that reported Charles comment to Stinky?

417 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:43:37pm

re: #402 Catttt

OT

I ♥ Michael Steele.

McCain Campaign - listen to Mr. Steele on resources exploration and development.

And Bob Beckel agrees with him that both parties are out to lunch on this subject.

McCain / Steele '08

418 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:43:40pm

re: #388 opnion

The Mullahs are hurting the Iranian people. It is an Orwellian state wrapped around a crazy delusional religion.
Morality police WTF?
Whatever we do or do not do, Israel can not allow Iran to have nukes period.

That was the point I was trying to make to unrealizedviewpoint. His vacation be damned. We (USA, Israel, whoever) just may have to do what we HAD to do in Iraq. Break it (and Saddam) to fix it

419 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:43:42pm

re: #399 wolfie

MORE? How many do you have now?

Don't you need to get on the road?

420 opnion  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:43:54pm

re: #400 A Kiwi Infidel

Careful what you ask for, you might just get what you wish

Dibs on the cute one!

421 goddessoftheclassroom  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:43:55pm

re: #417 jcm

McCain / Steele '08

AMEN!

422 Nevergiveup  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:44:18pm

re: #384 jcm

If a JDAM went off in their gasoline refinery would they even know?

'jus a work accident if you asked me.

In all it's beauty:
[Link: www.boeing.com...]

423 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:44:35pm

re: #402 Catttt

OT

I &hearts Michael Steele.

McCain Campaign - listen to Mr. Steele on resources exploration and development.

And Bob Beckel agrees with him that both parties are out to lunch on this subject.

I love him too.
The terrible and ironic shame is that McCain can't pick him because the media would have a field day calling it tokenism, a gimmick, racism, etc.

424 Athos  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:44:36pm

OT - has auto update stopped on anyone else's spy?

425 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:44:39pm

re: #416 unrealizedviewpoint

Now I have to move quickly! Which comment?!

426 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:44:41pm

re: #389 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

You probably have a while to save for the trip.

OR ,, go to a library and take out a DVD re: Iran

427 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:44:50pm

re: #403 Athos

The numbers aren't any different here in LALA land either.

We wouldn't be in as bad of a mess if Clinton did not veto the bill authorizing expanded oil production, in particular in ANWR, in 1995.

Now, when that same concept is brought up, the very first argument used is that it will take too long to bring those fields online to make any difference. The second is 1M bbls / day will not make a real difference on supply and prices.

Yep, and both arguments are bunk. It doesn't take all that long to explore ANWR - it's not that big, and the 1M bbls of crude is very much needed. Plus, we got the North Slop working within ten years, a good part of which was building the pipeline. The same pipeline that currently exists a mere 60 miles from the exploration area in ANWR. Getting the oil out would be very easy.

428 A Kiwi Infidel  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:44:53pm

re: #420 opnion

They, sir, are all yours.

429 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:44:58pm

re: #404 opnion

Thats a great thought, but what is going to make the Mullahs go away?
They control all the means of coersion, the police, The Military & the special force that kills our troops in Iraq. I might start planning a nice trip to Hawaii. It is more realistic.

When I was a kid I used to dream about the fall of the Berlin Wall. And look how that turned out.

430 Athos  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:45:04pm

re: #424 Athos

Nevermind

/emily latella

431 satan sidekick  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:45:07pm

I agree. I like Steele too. Although my heart still belongs to Romney.

re: #417 jcm

432 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:45:21pm

re: #420 opnion

Dibs on the cute one!

she must be standing behind those 4

433 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:45:56pm

re: #425 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Now I have to move quickly! Which comment?!

#397

434 Nevergiveup  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:46:34pm

re: #431 satan sidekick

I agree. I like Steele too. Although my heart still belongs to Romney.

My heart belongs to Duncan Hunter and Meygn Kelly. For different reasons of course.

435 A Kiwi Infidel  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:46:57pm

re: #429 unrealizedviewpoint

When I was a kid I used to dream about the fall of the Berlin Wall. And look how that turned out.


This could be good news or bad news depending on what you dream about now.

436 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:47:29pm

re: #433 unrealizedviewpoint

#397

POOF!

437 rightwinger3  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:47:47pm

re: #432 sattv4u2

she must be standing behind those 4

Practically everyone could be standing behind those 4.

438 wolfie  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:48:02pm

re: #419 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Don't you need to get on the road?

Yup! I'm outa here!

439 opnion  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:48:25pm

re: #409 unrealizedviewpoint

Just this past weekend I was sitting across a poker table, here in LA, musing with a Persian about vacationing in Iran after the war.

Let me give you a similar story. My secretary has a Vietnamese friend.
Her friend told her that her parents claimed that Viet Nam was peaceful until the Americans got there.
Hmm, lets see , they fought the French , Had a Civil War, Fought the Japanese & fought the Chinese for centuries.
Your poker pal, might think that the Mullahs will just whither away, but that defies reason.

440 opnion  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:49:41pm

re: #428 A Kiwi Infidel

They, sir, are all yours.

Uh, I changed my mind.

441 offendi  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:50:07pm

This is quite interesting. On it's face what's not to like if you are from the House of Saud about an inexperienced junior Senator from Illinois who had a muslim father? Certainly he won't have the cojones to take you on over increasing your oil production to reduce prices.

On the other hand, being militarily inexperienced and internationally naive he would be reluctant to commit U.S. forces to save their corrupt arses if their good friend Iran was successful in destabilizing the shi'ite region of Saudi Arabia or by building a Saudi equivalent of Hezbollah of radical islamists. Iran wants hegemony over the region after all.

Since the Saudis are quite duplicitous, do you think they are actually supporting old John and giving him material to win populist votes by his campaign saying, " see the people who are giving you high gas prices support Obama"? Very interesting.

442 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:50:14pm

re: #422 Nevergiveup

In all it's beauty:
[Link: www.boeing.com...]

B-2 can carry and drop 80 JDAMS all precisely target on different targets.

443 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:50:33pm

re: #417 jcm

re: #431 satan sidekick

As much as I like Steele, he wouldn't sway any votes to McCain. WHY? No matter how qualified he is (immensely, btw) he would be seen by the MSM as a desperate attempt to just put a black on the ticket, and by most blacks as an uncle tom, which most already see him as ( al a Clarence Thomas, Condi Rice, etc etc)

444 LeftJustAintRight  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:50:59pm
And if you don’t know what kind of “change” Saudi Arabia wants, you must not be paying attention.


I still do not have a clue about what you are saying
The Saudis are our friends
I can't imagine they mean anything other than Hussein Obama is the best man for the job

445 LeftJustAintRight  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:51:21pm

re: #444 LeftJustAintRight

Oh yeah

/moonbat off

446 satan sidekick  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:51:33pm

re: #443 sattv4u2

What do other LGFers think about Romney on the ticket?

447 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:52:55pm

re: #443 sattv4u2

Which SUCKS! I have known Steele's name longer than Barry's. I'd stand in line to vote for Steele.

448 jcm  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:53:20pm

re: #443 sattv4u2

re: #431 satan sidekick

As much as I like Steele, he wouldn't sway any votes to McCain. WHY? No matter how qualified he is (immensely, btw) he would be seen by the MSM as a desperate attempt to just put a black on the ticket, and by most blacks as an uncle tom, which most already see him as ( al a Clarence Thomas, Condi Rice, etc etc)

OH FUCK THE MSM!
/rant off

You are correct. It pisses me off qualified and quality individuals like that are dismissed as tokens.

449 Athos  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:53:31pm

re: #447 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Which SUCKS! I have known Steele's name longer than Barry's. I'd stand in line to vote for Steele.

I'd stand in line to vote against Barry.

450 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:53:41pm

re: #446 satan sidekick

Dunno.

451 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:54:33pm

re: #439 opnion

Let me give you a similar story. My secretary has a Vietnamese friend.
Her friend told her that her parents claimed that Viet Nam was peaceful until the Americans got there.
Hmm, lets see , they fought the French , Had a Civil War, Fought the Japanese & fought the Chinese for centuries.
Your poker pal, might think that the Mullahs will just whither away, but that defies reason.

My Persian friend is under no such disillusion. He understands the Mullah's need be destroyed. the Persians who escaped after '79 think much like you and I.

452 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:56:28pm

re: #446 satan sidekick

What do other LGFers think about Romney on the ticket?

I've liked that from the start. He protects McCain on the economic issues (I would love to see a debate between him and ANY Dem VP candidate on taxes and world markets!) His "Mormon problem" wouldn't be as big an issue for him as it would have been had he been the nominee. I make him the odds on favorite, although I wouldn't be surprised if it was someone LGF'ers (and myself) will 100% NOT like (Bloomberg ! )

453 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:56:49pm

re: #447 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Which SUCKS! I have known Steele's name longer than Barry's. I'd stand in line to vote for Steele.

twice for me

454 satan sidekick  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:57:53pm

re: #452 sattv4u2

I cannot vote for moonbat Bloomberg. Although he'd make a great running mate for Kucinich. If McCain picks Bloomberg he will lose.

455 right_on_target  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 2:59:23pm

re: #59 alegrias

* * *
He is the only candidate for US president who is on record as saying the Call to Prayer from the Minaret is the most beautiful sound on Earth! (learned in Indonesia)

The call to prayer ........
Reminds me of the sirens in "Time Machine". The Eloi suddenly stopping everything, to march to the bunkers to be later devoured by the Morlocks.
The Eloi were mesmerized by the wailing of the sirens.

456 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:00:09pm

re: #447 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

re: #448 jcm

I hold Conservative blacks in the highest regard. Imagine what it's like knowing that over 90% of your own race is automatically against you, and most of the other 10% you have to convince you're okay!

Steele, Rice, J.C.Watts, Lynn Swann, Herman Cane,,,,,

457 Athos  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:00:44pm

re: #453 sattv4u2

twice for me

Chicago voter? No wait, you're alive.

458 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:01:38pm

re: #457 Athos

Chicago voter? No wait, you're alive.

former democrat,,, old tricks and habits die hard

459 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:02:08pm

re: #455 right_on_target

You mean these sirens?


re: #400 A Kiwi Infidel


Careful what you ask for, you might just get what you wish
460 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:03:19pm

re: #454 satan sidekick

I cannot vote for moonbat Bloomberg. Although he'd make a great running mate for Kucinich. If McCain picks Bloomberg he will lose.

I don't think folks know how anti-2nd Amendment Bloomberg is.

461 Kenneth  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:03:19pm

re: #452 sattv4u2

I'll take Romney's "Mormon problem" over Obama's "Muslim problem" any day...

462 jorline  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:05:19pm

re: #413 jcm

Grab something lizards this could get bumpy!
/
Charles only brings coolness, no bumps

bumpy...are we getting a ride on the Obama bus?

463 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:06:12pm

re: #462 jorline

bumpy...are we getting a ride on the Obama bus?

bumpy? did this turn into a boob thread?

464 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:06:40pm

and on that note,,,, off to the Wednesday Open thread for me !

465 debutaunt  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:07:21pm

re: #395 goddessoftheclassroom

He swallowed it WHOLE?

Just a flowerette.

466 Mars Needs Neocons  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:07:53pm

re: #339 mean Gene

You're right, Muslims come to SA from all over the earth.

But have you ever been around African Americans who worked in SA and were called "abd," by little Saudi girls?
Abd is Arabic for ''slave.''
In some names it means ''servant," like in Abdullah (servant of allah).
But in SA calling a man that is the equivalent of using the "n" word here in the USA on him.
It is definitely a derogatory term.

It leads African American men to tout their white (mixed) heritage while in SA.
Can you imagine?
Only the Saudi's could make black Americans talk with reverence about their mixed background and white ancestors as being perceived as less-then-100%-black is the only way to get any respect whatsoever, there.

Interesting. Unfortunately I was never around any African-Americans there that weren't servicemen and women, and even the Saudis didn't have the balls to insult them to their faces. The only people I saw regularly insulted and put into third (or less) place status, were the Philipinos and Koreans that they had running many of their shops. (Also Iraqi nationals were treated like crap.) (This was Gulf War 1)

467 debutaunt  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:09:22pm

re: #405 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Ominous music plays...

It made me a bit nervous, too.

468 GeeWiz  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:23:01pm

re: #326 Athos


My only wish is that I could give you a hundred up-dings for your post. One point that I see missing in this discussion is that by drilling and refining here, our money stays here instead of going to nations that wish us ill. Our imports decrease while our exports remain the same. Our economy improves with a growth of jobs and revenues all the while the trade deficit declines. The additional income tax revenues is a bonus to the Federal Treasury. The sandbox kings need our food and protection of their shipping lanes for their tankers. The capital flow could be reversed.

I do recognize that the drilling & refining processes would take 4-5 years but the mere fact we made the move would send a message to OPEC that their days are numbered. I have lived thru many critical moments in this nation's history including Carter's bumbling of the last oil crisis. OPEC learned from that period and priced their product high enough to maximize profits, but not high enough to force us to do anything about it. The commodity speculators have driven the price to a point that makes OPEC nervous about the future of the US as a customer. Carter dropped the ball and we now are paying the price. There is no time like the present to take action. I signed the petition, I urge you all to do the same.

re: #309 freetoken

Please read this post and tell me where I am wrong. Your avatar causes me to wonder about your ability to live in the world of reality. The circular logic, ie: democrats in Congress, you have posted pick on only one point rather than the other consequences of the US taking action of drilling here that I presented.

Your point....do nothing.....My point....DUMB!

469 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:25:47pm

re: #382 nikis-knight

I'd guess that the time it takes to rebuild a refinary is much less than the time it'll take to make it welcoming to an American (assuming you are one.)

Refineries are expensive and complicated to build. There would be no good reason to entirely destroy Iran's refinery (unless we wanted to cement anti-American sentiment there for decades among the Iranian public).

Presumeably, in the event that such coercion became necessary, we wouldn't have to destroy the Iranian refinery, but instead just take control of it or take it offline.

That could be accomplished by occupying it or blockading it. (The refinery isn't that helpful when no petroleum can go in, or gasoline out).

It might also be possible to knock out one small piece, leaving most intact for subsequent repair.

470 GeeWiz  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:40:02pm

Damn, I came late to thread and took too long to compose my post. It is now destined to the electron dustbin. Oh well, life goes on.

471 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:40:15pm

re: #441 offendi

I think you are overanalyzing this.

If the Saudis are supporting candidate "X", its because they believe candidate "X" is better for them. I think its that's simple.

Its not actually clear to me WHOM the Saudis are supporting. Per this recent article in Bloomberg news, they are supporting McCain behind closed doors, because they think he'll keep Iraq under control and Iran in check.

That seems more plausible to me than the editorial in the Saudi newspaper on Obama.

472 Charles  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:42:19pm

re: #471 looking closely

I think you are overanalyzing this.

If the Saudis are supporting candidate "X", its because they believe candidate "X" is better for them. I think its that's simple.

Its not actually clear to me WHOM the Saudis are supporting. Per this recent article in Bloomberg news, they are supporting McCain behind closed doors, because they think he'll keep Iraq under control and Iran in check.

That seems more plausible to me than the editorial in the Saudi newspaper on Obama.

On the other hand, I'm more willing to believe that the Saudis are telling the truth about their feelings in an Arabic article, than in some "analyst's" opinion at Bloomberg.

473 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:50:50pm

re: #472 Charles

On the other hand, I'm more willing to believe that the Saudis are telling the truth about their feelings in an Arabic article, than in some "analyst's" opinion at Bloomberg.

I am not so certain.
As you know, the Saudis are big on "face"; their appearance to the public.
They say and do things differently behind closed doors.
That editorial is extended for public consumption.
So for their own public, who are the Saudis going to be for?
"Hussein" Obama.
Besides being the "Muslim" candidate, he's also running against the party of Bush the Crusader.
But privately, its not at all clear why they would back him.
Yes, he'd be worse for Israel, but I think that's really not the top concern of the Saudis right now.

474 Charles  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:53:21pm

re: #473 looking closely

Yeah, you can argue either side. But the Saudis are, from my experience, much more likely to tell the truth when they're speaking (or writing) in Arabic. They seem incapable of realizing that infidels can translate.

475 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 3:53:22pm

Oh, by the way, I just used that LGF "spy" thing for the first time, and its awesome. . .though dizzying!

476 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 4:00:50pm

re: #474 Charles

One time I met a Saudi princess. . .but I have no special contacts within the House of Saud! Perhaps there is more to this than the superficial interpretation. From the Memri article you cite:

In an editorial, the Saudi paper Al-Watan stated that U.S. Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama is more capable than anyone else of bringing about change in U.S. policy, particularly in all things connected to the Middle East.

The paper added that in light of Obama's intent to conduct a dialogue with Iran, the Middle East countries should launch a dialogue with him and help him better understand what is going on.

To me this looks more like the Saudi paper calling Obama ignorant rather than giving him their support.

Remember, Obama's "change" can cut both ways.

I would really like to see the MEMRI translation of the entire article rather than this snippet.

477 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 4:04:42pm

re: #446 satan sidekick

What do other LGFers think about Romney on the ticket?

s/s -

Good choice from two standpoints:

1. He has the experience and competence to BE President at a moment's notice.
2. He can write a personal check and finance a McCain/Romney Ticket.

-S-

478 looking closely  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 4:14:01pm

re: #477 Dr. Shalit

I liked Romney as #1 on the ticket, I don't see why I would object to him as #2. Romney has already indicated that he would serve if selected.

Complicating this, I've heard that McCain has a personal dislike of the guy, though I have no idea if that's true.

Even if it were true, I think ultimately McCain would set that aside to pick the best VP candidate he could. As mentioned, Romney meets the basic criteria of being ready to be President.

Ultimately, it comes down to the numbers. Would Romney help deliver one or more swing states? Will he motivate the "base", particularly the ones who may be lukewarm (or less) about McCain? If Romney can do that, he'd be a good choice. If not, no.

479 anotherindyfilmguy  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 5:26:02pm

re: #145 maddogg

I think PA. will go to McCain, as there are a lot of hunters in PA. and Obama is 100% gun controller, and is considered by the NRA to be a grave threat to the 2nd. Amendment.

I think McCain will take every state shrillary beat Obama in. First, her supporters generally seem to hate/distrust/despise Obama/the way she was "railroaded" etc and will split the Dhimmi/dummy vote (or not vote). Second, not everyone can be that damn stupid for this long much less all the way to November.
Ok... Maybe the first one will be the one that matters but there it is...

480 anotherindyfilmguy  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 5:27:57pm

re: #474 Charles

And why should they get a reason to feel otherwise? Until the MSM starts reporting the MEMRI translations as the real deal instead of the press releases of thiers they are pretty well covered for most media output here.

481 anotherindyfilmguy  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 5:33:54pm

re: #443 sattv4u2

I'd feel a lot better voting for either a McCain/Steele or McCain/Romney ticket...

482 lukespapa  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 5:40:45pm

What is the title of this thread again?

483 Solomon2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 6:47:42pm

Last week the the world changed.

The Saudi-sponsored Islamic Preparatory Conference on Interfaith Dialogue implicitly re-legitimized mass terror as an acceptable weapon against non-Muslims and formally set Islam on a collision course with the West, on the principle that "all humans possess equal dignity", therefore attempts to blame Islam or Muslims must be prosecuted as crimes with the ideal that majority non-Muslim countries are to be ruled without Western freedoms or sexual liberties by a Muslim ruling class: The Proposed Islamic Conquest of Western Civilization.

484 offendi  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 7:10:38pm

re: #474 Charles

Yeah, you can argue either side. But the Saudis are, from my experience, much more likely to tell the truth when they're speaking (or writing) in Arabic. They seem incapable of realizing that infidels can translate.

Charles,
This may be true but the Saudis do realize today that arabic news articles are frequently translated, especially about terrorism, Israel, etc.. It could be for internal consumption but the thing with Obama being a muslim apostate, as a son of a Muslim father may not be helpful with the Saudi street, which is religious. Overall I think politics in the Arab world has more disinformation and treachery than the rest of the world. You might be right, but maybe the Saudis are giving McCain some sophisticated assistance, as I think they know they are widely disliked in this country.

485 cajunbelle  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 7:13:47pm

GADAFFI HEARTS OBAMA TOO!

He's worried Mossad will try to kill Obama.

486 Biff  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 7:19:49pm

re: #322 incanus

The UAR, United Arab Republic was a federation between Egypt, Syria, and Iraq, intended to encompass the entire middle-east in a new Caliphate. In part, it was a play by Nasser to gain control over oil rich territories. On the other hand, it was a clear precursor to the '67 war against Israel.

487 right_wing2  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 7:36:14pm

Yet another reason to vote for a small pile of lint over Obama.

488 Timbre  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 7:42:33pm
McLEAN, Va. — Textbooks at a private Islamic school in northern Virginia teach students that it is permissible for Muslims to kill adulterers and converts from Islam, according to a federal investigation released Wednesday.

Other passages in the school's textbooks state that "the Jews conspired against Islam and its people" and that Muslims are permitted to take the lives and property of those deemed "polytheists."

The passages were found in selected textbooks used during the 2007-08 school year by the Islamic Saudi Academy, which teaches 900 students in grades K-12 at two campuses in Alexandria and Fairfax and receives much of its funding from the Saudi government.

What has Charles and 99% of the LGF commentators been saying for many years? Exactly this! And it is happening in madrassas and "academies" all over the "Muslim world."

489 astronmr20  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 10:21:29pm

The strange thing about this is how good the Bush Administration has been to the Saudis.

Kissing their ass, smiling while we take it from their oil prices, supplying them with weapons, destroying their enemies, etc.


Honestly, this is really odd. I suppose they are going for some street cred in the neighborhood.

490 Ban Draoi  Wed, Jun 11, 2008 10:39:15pm

re: #39 Ojoe

Yea! Bacteriophages for Obama!

Seriously though, that is as good an image/idea as any.


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