I could care less about my liberal neighbors, but I'm disturbed as all get-out about Jindal's falling for this hoax.

And out the left side of the tour bus you will see the tragic sight of the conservatives eating their own young...

Bad horse! *SMACKKO!*

re: #2 Sifty

How do you get that?

Sooo...am I understanding right that the official positon of this website is to openly mock intelligent design?

Is it really on par with snake handling? Maybe I'm reading this post wrong (and others)...but a lot of very well known, educated, and highly intelligent scientists back the intelligent design theory.

It's a coalition. Think big tent John. Plenty of room for the "snake handlers".

And the thing is, Jindal is Catholic, and the Catholic Church has no problem with evolution.

At least according to Wikipedia (and my grade school nuns).

re: #5 orbital

You're over a month late to spout that line.

If you're fat and conservative, does that mean you have both love- and snake handles?

re: #5 orbital

Sooo...am I understanding right that the official positon of this website is to openly mock intelligent design?

Is it really on par with snake handling? Maybe I'm reading this post wrong (and others)...but a lot of very well known, educated, and highly intelligent scientists back the intelligent design theory.

Have a cup of coffee before you go.

re: #7 Pelkabo

Your grade school nuns are correct. The Catholic Church gets some things right.

The GOP, the snake handling party. That's rich.

As opposed to the DNC - the snake oil party.

If you don't handle the snakes how do find and cut their heads off?

Does anyone remember what religion Nixon belonged too?

re: #14 Racer X

Quaker.

re: #6 Reno911

I've never met an actual snake handler, so I have no idea what they think of ID.

re: #14 Racer X

Does anyone remember what religion Nixon belonged too?

Society of Friends (aka "Quakers")

re: #1 Dianna

I could care less about my liberal neighbors, but I'm disturbed as all get-out about Jindal's falling for this hoax.

I am too. I was impressed with Jindal before I learned about this.

re: #14 Racer X

Quaker.

re: #14 Racer X

Quaker.

re: #5 orbital

Sooo...am I understanding right that the official positon of this website is to openly mock intelligent design?

but a lot of very well known, educated, and highly intelligent scientists back the intelligent design theory.

Not true but feel free to say so before you quit.

Slightly OT, but there already is a lot of clutter in science education. I know Michigan's standards include discussion of "people of diversity" who have contributed to science. Anyone else?

Awful. I can see starting a discussion of evolution by touching on different "beliefs" and problems with NS, but really folks. Just because you learn the ideas doesn't mean you have to believe in NS, but know what you don't "believe" in.

Irrespective of what you believe, ID does not belong in the political arena.

Conservatives are no more tied to ID than liberals are tied to abortion.

There are plenty of conservatives who do not buy into ID and there are plenty of liberals who are anti abortion.

re: #20 Dianna

Quaker.

Goose! Oh, wait I missread you folks posts.

re: #14 Racer X

Quaker is correct. His parents were very strict and devout Quakers, according to his bio on the Nixon Presidential Library site.

Re: '...a lot of very well known, educated, and highly intelligent scientists back the intelligent design theory.'

Serious question, not a debating ploy: Could you name some? (Should be biologists / related, extra chops for specialists in evolutionary biology.)

re: #18 Charles

I've been worried by some other things I've read that indicate he's a micro-manager, too.

Maybe with a little bit of seasoning, we'll feel a little better about him.

I have no intention of shaping my religious beliefs around the opinions of 'liberal neighbors'. I also have no intention of being regarded on the same level as a snake handler. I also have no intention of leaving the Republican Party.

Deal with it.

re: #18 Charles

I am too. I was impressed with Jindal before I learned about this.

Can you say Sarah Palin?
[Link: gov.state.ak.us...]

re: #16 Dianna

I've never met an actual snake handler, so I have no idea what they think of ID.

I remember THe Snake Handlers O'Shea on SNL.

re: #5 orbital

Sooo...am I understanding right that the official positon of this website is to openly mock intelligent design?

Is it really on par with snake handling? Maybe I'm reading this post wrong (and others)...but a lot of very well known, educated, and highly intelligent scientists back the intelligent design theory.

I don't know about the "official position of this website," but I am pleased to openly mock it unofficially.

I don't know what "very well known, educated, and highly intelligent" folks back intelligent design, but I can tell you that

a) it is not a theory, and

b) if they back it, they are not scientists.

re: #29 Nevergiveup

Can you say Sarah Palin?

Plus, she's a bit of a hottie, too!

My point is this: Nixon was perceived as a very bad president. His religious beliefs were largely ignored by the public.

re: #30 madisonsfriend

I never watched SNL much, so I don't know that bit.

“the snake-handling party.”

Snake charming does have a long history in India, perhaps it's a family tradition.

re: #1 Dianna
I followed the links. Looks like Jindal is a Catholic who follows some of the the right wing Evangelical methods. This is all real in the Church. I cannot explain or defend. I am less than thrilled with his political career right now. I will wait to see how he performs as a Governor.

re: #4 Dianna

It's just frustrating that we don't have any shining lights like a Reagan or a Teddy Roosevelt or a Fred Thompson (friggin tease) that we don't have to worry about.
Someone we can agree on and back to the maximum.

More than usual, all of the conservative / Republican / or just-not-a-damn-loony candidates have at least one giant flaw that makes us feel not-so-fresh about them.

They are real issues and have to be discussed, but it makes me sad sometimes.

Guess I'm pining for clarity.

By the way, Jindal has other problems. Apparently he wrote about demons, exorcisms and so on, from a first person perspective.

See this.

Ah yes, the fatal flaw has been uncovered.

re: #33 Racer X

It's not much of a point, I'm afraid, and I'm not sure how it applies.

re: #33 Racer X

My point is this: Nixon was perceived as a very bad president. His religious beliefs were largely ignored by the public.

I remember Mad Magazine mocking him as a Quaker.

re: #38 researchok

By the way, Jindal has other problems. Apparently he wrote about demons, exorcisms and so on, from a first person perspective.

See this.

So? what's your point?

re: #33 Racer X

My point is this: Nixon was perceived as a very bad president. His religious beliefs were largely ignored by the public.

I's give my left testicle for a Nixon now! Maybe?

re: #5 orbital

Sooo...am I understanding right that the official positon of this website is to openly mock intelligent design?

Is it really on par with snake handling? Maybe I'm reading this post wrong (and others)...but a lot of very well known, educated, and highly intelligent scientists back the intelligent design theory.

Please cite one well-known scientist who supports "intelligent design" ... who is NOT connected to the Discovery Institute.

re: #38 researchok

By the way, Jindal has other problems. Apparently he wrote about demons, exorcisms and so on, from a first person perspective.

Hey, it's important to get plenty of exorcise.

I like Bobby Jindal, but this is kinda weird. Praise the lord and pass me that copperhead...

re: #37 Sifty

You might want to read more about Teddy before you cite him - he had some remarkably bad ideas and subscribed to some notions that don't feel terribly conservative to me.

However, I'd take him in a heart-beat over Woodrow Wilson, or either of the two major party candidates this time around.

If items of faith can be scientifically proved, they are no
longer faith. So, I do not judge others faith based beliefs.
But what I do know is my God and scientific truth cannot be
be incompatible. So, if it is proved that the earth is 6 billion years
old, I believe God could create it in 6 billion years as easily as 6
days.

re: #42 mama winger

So? what's your point?

Do we want Benny Hinn in Blair House?

re: #14 Racer X

Does anyone remember what religion Nixon belonged too?

He was a Quaker.

Charles,

Is it now the policy of this blog to mock and ridicule snake handlin' ?

re: #5 orbital

Sooo...am I understanding right that the official positon of this website is to openly mock intelligent design?

Mock openly? As opposed to what?

You get to openly promote religious indoctrination in school, your fellow humans are free to openly mock it. At least at LGF. Am I understanding right that you have an issue with that? Do you need someone to call Whine-1-1?

re: #9 buzzsawmonkey

If you're fat and conservative, does that mean you have both love- and snake handles?

I resemble that remark.

re: #38 researchok

If you have time, look for a book called American Excorcism. It's quite interesting on the number of people who believe in literal demonic possession, and in excorcism.

re: #47 Dianna

I like Teddy. Even though he got a little weird at times. And he was pretty big-government at times too.

It's been a while since the perfect human was up and walking about.

But mostly I like the movie The Wind and the Lion with Brian Keith and Sean Connery.

/If the libs can base their policy on children's books I can use movies.

So, let's make sure that instead of discussing it intelligently, we start name calling.

Like saying things like "hoax".

That lends lots of credibility to those arguing the "science".

If you're prepared to call ID a hoax, let's back it up intelligent argument, discussion, and reason.

Yeah, because I care so much about Liberal snears.

re: #7 Pelkabo

And the thing is, Jindal is Catholic, and the Catholic Church has no problem with evolution.

At least according to Wikipedia (and my grade school nuns).

And the Pope.

Regarding Guillermo Gonzalez, the prominent astronomer denied tenure for holding the wrong views on ID, does anyone know whether he was associated with the Discovery Institute before he was let go or only after?

re: #49 researchok

And what is with the Nehru jacket?

re: #50 Colonel Panik

He was a Quaker.

Personally I also thought of Nixon as an Anti-Communist.

re: #16 Dianna

I've had snakes draped on my shoulders in foreign countries. Hopefully the folks doing the draping were qualified snake handlers. I doubt that they cared much about Evolution and/or ID except as it impacted their ability to feed their families. Which brings me to my next point; the entire Evolution/ID strikes me as very boutique. Does it really matter what people think of ID and/or Evolution, as long as we are Free?

re: #51 Ringo the Gringo

I actually have seen film of snake handling. I don't feel like mocking those who do it. Medicating them, maybe, but not mocking.

re: #49 researchok

The Governor of Louisiana is a devout Catholic. Teachings regarding demons and excorcisms are included in the teachings of the Catholic Church. Last time I checked, it was a free country and people can believe what they wish.

Now, as to whether people would vote for someone ascribing to those beliefs, that is a question for the voters. However, I will not mock the man for believing what his Church teaches.

re: #40 Dianna

It's not much of a point, I'm afraid, and I'm not sure how it applies.

Religion should not be an issue for an elected government official. If it is, we have a problem.

re: #29 Nevergiveup

Can you say Sarah Palin?

I would be amazed if Ms Palin were NOT a creationist and/or ID proponent (like myself).

We're everywhere! We're everywhere!

Before this thread proceeds any further, let's all join hands and sing.

re: #55 Sifty

/If the libs can base their policy on children's books I can use movies.

If you have to base policy on movies, that's a good one!

re: #64 mama winger
Exactly right mama.

re: #14 Racer X

Does anyone remember what religion Nixon belonged too?

Racer -

And Patricia Ryan Nixon was...?

-S-

I sure hope this guy doesn't get picked as JM's running-mate. Not so much because of his ID views, but due to the fact he lacks experience, and moreso because it is sure to sour some folks for whom this is a majorly important issue. Perhaps a deal breaker.

I think we all know who I'm talking about. ;)

re: #56 Poopshoot

You're over a month late.

re: #63 Dianna

I saw one too, I would love to get my hands on it, but never could find it.

re: #49 researchok

Do we want Benny Hinn in Blair House?

Absolutely. It'd be hilarious to watch him chasing big-busted women around the White House while that silly music plays.

(oh, "Hinn", sorry)

(Plus JFK and Bubba did that already)

re: #70 Dr. Shalit

Racer -

And Patricia Ryan Nixon was...?

-S-

Ya know, nobody said we were getting a test today?

I know how to properly pronounce Derbyshire (DARB-ish-er), but how do you pronounce Jindal?

re: #59 jc59

Go look at Expelled: Exposed.

re: #74 Occasional Reader

LOL!

If you lose your job as a scientist because of your ID views and end up making a living with the Discovery Institute, does this make you a hack?

re: #76 Dar ul Harb

I know how to properly pronounce Derbyshire (DARB-ish-er), but how do you pronounce Jindal?

Finished.

re: #51 Ringo the Gringo

Charles,

Is it now the policy of this blog to mock and ridicule snake handlin' ?

Only if you can't find someone to "handle yer snake" for you.

I say we give school-children a choice to handle snakes as an alternative to studying ID.

re: #77 Dianna

Go look at Expelled: Exposed.

The movie is unclear on this point.

re: #62 Reno911

Well, since I think reason is very important, and that ID is an attempt to short-cut reason and obfuscate the scientific method, it matters a lot.

Freedom requires reason, and reason requires good information. It's hard to think clearly when you don't have the tools.

re: #82 Salem

I say we give school-children a choice to handle snakes as an alternative to studying ID.

I used to play with my snake all the time as a little kid?

There are a million stories in the snaked city.

re: #75 Nevergiveup

Ya know, nobody said we were getting a test today?

Perhaps the reason why Former Pres. Nixon opened up as much as he did to MONICA CROWLEY - a Patricia, Jr. in his controlled orbit.

-S-

re: #65 Racer X

If ID is religion, then what's it doing in a science classroom?

No, I'm sorry, this isn't something we can shrug at.

re: #64 mama winger

Teachings regarding demons and excorcisms are included in the teachings of the Catholic Church

Ah, they've tended to de-emphasize that stuff for the last century or so.

I mean is it:

DJINN-dull?

GIN-doll?

Jindle?

Does it rhyme with spindle or Ken doll?

Just don't cling to your snakes.

re: #85 Nevergiveup

I used to play with my snake all the time as a little kid?

Then you can advance straight to English Lit.

re: #64 mama winger

The Governor of Louisiana is a devout Catholic. Teachings regarding demons and excorcisms are included in the teachings of the Catholic Church. Last time I checked, it was a free country and people can believe what they wish.

Now, as to whether people would vote for someone ascribing to those beliefs, that is a question for the voters. However, I will not mock the man for believing what his Church teaches.

I don't care about his religious beliefs. They are his beliefs- and they are private beliefs. If those beliefs reinforce his ethics and morality, all the better.

How would you feel about a candidate who had a vision and claimed that God hated the Catholic Church, or Jews, or Mormons or Presbyterians and then wrote about it?

re: #63 Dianna

re: #73 jones

snake handlin' an' strychnine drinkin'

re: #83 jc59

Not the movie, the website. Here.

re: #87 Dr. Shalit

Perhaps the reason why Former Pres. Nixon opened up as much as he did to MONICA CROWLEY - a Patricia, Jr. in his controlled orbit.

-S-

They were both Christian Scientists?

re: #80 Nevergiveup

Finished.

NGU -

"GHINN - DAHL" - That is all.

-S-

re: #73 jones

And so, you shall!

re: #96 Nevergiveup

NGU -

Don't Think So.

-S-

BIG HERPETOMANIPULATORS ARE RIPPING US OFF!

One of the rotating titles at LGF is, "You know you're over the target when you're taking flak."

But I've learned that another important lesson is, "You know you're over the target when people demand that you stop posting about it."

I am not going to get killed because he believes in ID.
But I might get killed because the man who would be president
believes we can reason with unreasonable people. So he believes in
ID, yawn.

re: #88 Dianna

If ID is religion, then what's it doing in a science classroom?

No, I'm sorry, this isn't something we can shrug at.

Sorry - I am not making my point very well. If Jindal is making his religion an issue (by promoting ID), then voters should in fact be concerned.

re: #89 Occasional Reader

Ah, they've tended to de-emphasize that stuff for the last century or so.

The more liberal wing of the church, yes. The more conservative or evangelical wing, not so much. It is for instance quite present in the Catholic Charismatic movement. Gov. Jindal as I understand it leans more this way. Don't quote me on that last part - it's an impression more than anything else.

I hate to whine but can we talk about the podophages on the Left?

I agree that Bobby Jindal is a non-starter for the next presidential election. He's not what the Republicans need.

re: #69 snowcrash

Exactly right mama.

Seconded!

re: #94 BignJames

A start, not the one I saw, but they are good.

Thanks.

re: #93 researchok

How would you feel about a candidate who had a vision and claimed that God hated the Catholic Church, or Jews, or Mormons or Presbyterians and then wrote about it?

Has that happened?

re: #94 BignJames

That's one!

re: #64 mama winger

Amen Mama Winger. It is amazing how faith is now mocked diligently by some posters on LGF.

re: #102 NonNativeTexan

I am not going to get killed because he believes in ID.
But I might get killed because the man who would be president
believes we can reason with unreasonable people. So he believes in
ID, yawn.

Huh? If Obama gets elected because Jindal believes in ID, then you could get killed.

We don't need a faith healer running for president.

re: #106 Killgore Trout

I agree that Bobby Jindal is a non-starter for the next presidential election. He's not what the Republicans need.

By all means lets tear the man to shreds before he's even out of the gate.

Ouija Board?

I don't have a problem with Catholic's believing in doctrine promulgated by the head of their Church. They have a tradition that is polar. For a young lay person to participate in an exorcism I would think is more of a function of youthful imagination. Who can tell what heals a person? Love does affect people. His questions at the time appear to be unguided with an attempt to understand. I would assume he is smarter now. Let's hope he is not Pat Buchanan smart.

Smelling sulfur? How does he know it's not just his imagination? Or smell memory being excited by the emotions of the event? Or some clever participant providing the odor. Ever been around angry people and physically felt the anger move into you? The opposite also happens.

The mind is a vast ocean of unknowns. A young person is likely not to know it well until experience and failures make them recognize what is viable and what is not.

For the unexpecting spiritual soul we can expect them to feel and interpet their spiritual trappings as part of a growth process.

ID -- it's a bad idea. Anyone incorporating it into their reasoning will eventually smell like a skunk. It's exactly the same reasoning process as global warming supporters and troofers find appealing.

There do seem to be systems of thought on the conservative side of life that are just plain bad thinking. The people who cling to them intellectually then hide their real attachment to the idea which is some underlying unpopular religous condition.

If these scientists became affiliated with the Discovery Institute after committing professional suicide by coming out of the closet, then the argument that only Discovery Institute hacks promote intelligent design is weak.

If that is the case, then only Discovery Institute scientists promote ID because that's the only place they'll ever find work. It's like being sent to Siberia.

re: #113 Killgore Trout

We don't need a faith healer running for president.

Is he a faith healer?

re: #101 Charles

But I've learned that another important lesson is, "You know you're over the target when people demand that you stop posting about it."

Too broad a rule, IMHO.

re: #103 Racer X

He and the entire Louisiana legislature!

re: #98 mikalm

Thanks to you too.

re: #114 mama winger

By all means lets tear the man to shreds before he's even out of the gate.

He's not going anywhere. It's best we acknowledge this now and move on.

re: #118 Occasional Reader

Too broad a rule, IMHO.

No rule. Just an observation.

re: #109 mama winger

Not yet, but with Obama, who knows?

re: #117 mama winger

....Jindal narrated a bizarre story of a personal encounter with a demon, in which he participated in an exorcism with a group of college friends. And not only did they cast out the supernatural spirit that had possessed his friend, Jindal wrote that he believes that their ritual may well have cured her cancer.