Dope

Duped

I don't get it. Don't these guys assume they will get caught? Or are most of them able to get a cocktail of drugs that masks the doping?

Maybe doping should be required of Tour de France cyclists? That might be the only way of keeping things fair.

huh?

My condolences that you ever found it enjoyable to start with...

:-)

Duping the dopes who dope the dupes.

How low has once-mighty Spain fallen.

No shortage of dopes there.

These are not the Conquistadores of yesteryear.

El Cid weeps. Charlton Heston would not recognize the country he filmed in with Sofia Loren.

Wahhabis laugh at their easy dopey prey.

Quick start a congressional investigation to act like we are doing something and divert the publics attention away from oil prices, inflation, the housing crises, etc......Oh wait it is in France, sorry I confused it with baseball. My bad.

Pathetic

Miguel Indurain weeps. These are not men, they're druggies.

re: #11 alegrias

These are not men, they're druggies.

I thought they were Devo

I'm sure the Olympic anti doping asses assoc will be all over this one.

Now empty your pockets.....& bladders.

i'M sure Owbama would *persuade* everyone to stop using drugs, and nukes, too.

re: #8 alegrias

How low has once-mighty Spain fallen.
No shortage of dopes there
These are not the Conquistadores of yesteryear.
El Cid weeps. Charlton Heston would not recognize the country he filmed in with Sofia Loren.
Wahhabis laugh at their easy dopey prey.

Spain was indeed a great country once. That was, unfortunately, a long time ago. It's greatness was tied to a certain time period, and a faith they used to champion..........

It's been the TOUR DE FARCE since the cry baby french got there nickers in a bunch when Americans kept winning it.

this place always dies, comment-wise, at this exact time every weekeday. it's fascinating. :)

I've heard from a trusted source (an MD) that pretty much EVERYONE in the game is "doping" by manipulating hemoglobin levels, and its an open secret within professional cycling.

The testing is more to create an illusion of non-doping and to eliminate the absolutely worst offenders than anything else.

So when are we gonna talk about some REAL biking?

re: #18 looking closely

I've heard from a trusted source (an MD) that pretty much EVERYONE in the game is "doping" by manipulating hemoglobin levels, and its an open secret within professional cycling.

The testing is more to create an illusion of non-doping and to eliminate the absolutely worst offenders than anything else.

Hell, let them all dope. Then maybe we can get it done in a week rather than sit around for a month.

Tight butts drive me nuts but, not when they're attached to dopers.

I do not in any way condone what these idiots are doing. That said I think maybe the Tour has done this to themselves for better TV, by making these stages almost impossible to complete as a normal human. I know it makes for better TV having a 30 km run up a 10% grade to finish the stage, but after a 160 km run over 4 other mountains?

re: #3 karmic_inquisitor

I don't get it. Don't these guys assume they will get caught? Or are most of them able to get a cocktail of drugs that masks the doping?

There are a wide variety of agents used, and they have varying windows of detection.

Steroids (to increase muscle mass and speed recovery) are one thing.

But lots of the cyclists are boosting their blood oxygen carrying capacity by either using erythropoeitin analogs (like this guy), or simply by transfusing in self-donated (and stored) blood. The latter can be next to impossible to detect.

Ultimately, they do it because
a. It works.
b. Chance of getting caught can be low (depends on what is done)
c. Winning is worth it to them.
d. The "I can't be competitive unless I do it too" syndrome.

re: #16 yochanan

It's been the TOUR DE FARCE since the cry baby french got there nickers in a bunch when Americans kept winning it.

Yeah, we weren't exactly thrilled when the Aussies came and won the America's Cup, ending our 3 billion year winning streak. But they won it fair and square, and we respected them for that.

So sad, so bad, tragic.

re: #17 Vergeltung

this place always dies, comment-wise, at this exact time every weekeday. it's fascinating. :)

Because, uh, all the east coast Americans work SECOND shift. Yeah, that's it, SECOND shift. And we're all leaving for work now and cannot comment.

/sticking with that story

re: #12 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I thought they were Devo

* * *
These are Il Divo!
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

re: #22 Libs are Mental

I do not in any way condone what these idiots are doing. That said I think maybe the Tour has done this to themselves for better TV, by making these stages almost impossible to complete as a normal human. I know it makes for better TV having a 30 km run up a 10% grade to finish the stage, but after a 160 km run over 4 other mountains?

Yeah, watching someone ride a bike, thats some exciting TV viewing there. TV is dead to me.

re: #20 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Hell, let them all dope. Then maybe we can get it done in a week rather than sit around for a month.

Snark aside, the problem is that if you allow unlimited pharmaceutical aids, it utterly ruins the sport.

When someone wins under those circumstances, the perception is that their cocktail or doctors are the best, not that they are the best rider.

Also, its just damn dangerous. Pro athletes have had strokes from boosting their hematocrits too high by transfusions and such, and we all know about the risks of steroid abuse.

Once you go "no drugs barred" then every competitor feels obligated to do it, and it trickles down from the top competitive leagues to lower ones, to college, to high school.

re: #17 Vergeltung

this place always dies, comment-wise, at this exact time every weekeday. it's fascinating. :)

It's nearly 5:00, which means most folks - like me - are stepping away from the computer & heading home.

Bush adopts the Obama doctrine....
U.S. reverses course, will send envoy to talks with Iran

The Bush administration has decided to break with previous policy by sending one of its most senior diplomats to engage Iran's top nuclear official, the White House announced Wednesday.

The move could dramatically alter the three-decade stand-off between the U.S. and Iran. Some western nations and Israel suspect Iran is intent on developing nuclear weapons and want Tehran to suspend uranium enrichment. Iran says it wants to develop nuclear power to produce electricity.

The Iranians have a history of taking diplomats as hostages. Why Make it easier for them?

re: #31 Killgore Trout

Bush adopts the Obama doctrine....
U.S. reverses course, will send envoy to talks with Iran

The Iranians have a history of taking diplomats as hostages. Why Make it easier for them?

Well, depending on who you send, it makes perfect sense. Can we send Pelosi and Reid?

Charles did you happen to see this article about doping in Scientific American?

The Doping Dilemma

re: #32 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Well, depending on who you send, it makes perfect sense. Can we send Pelosi and Reid?

can my wife go too ?

Anyone watching the Tour can see that although there are obviously some dopers still around, the bulk of the riders are performing under their own steam as it were. The failure of most breakaways would seem to point to that.

Hey Charles, do you think that Floyd Landis truly tested positive, or do you think he was framed up by the French? I think he was framed - they were always trying to bust Lance.

The move could dramatically alter the three-decade stand-off between the U.S. and Iran.

And I could find a 20 carat diamond in my box of crackerjacks, but I doubt it.

You can't negociate with "Death to America." What'll we ask for, only maiming for America?

re: #37 Silhouette

And I could find a 20 carat diamond in my box of crackerjacks, but I doubt it.

You can't negociate with "Death to America." What'll we ask for, only maiming for America?

OK, you can only attempt to kill me on Mondays, Wednesdays and alternate Fridays.

re: #37 Silhouette

And I could find a 20 carat diamond in my box of crackerjacks, but I doubt it.

You can't negociate with "Death to America." What'll we ask for, only maiming for America?

* * *
What is it about their 30-year motto we don't understand?

re: #32 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Well, depending on who you send, it makes perfect sense. Can we send Pelosi and Reid?

Good idea. "Ransom of Red Chief" moment!

Obama's been acting dopey. Somebody check his urine.

re: #43 HelloDare

Obama's been acting dopey. Somebody check his urine.

Matthews and Olberman say it tastes fine to them

It's sad to see the sport evolve like this.

re: #43 HelloDare

Obama's been acting dopey. Somebody check his urine.

there's a difference in how he normally acts?

How to ruin what SHOULD be one of the premier sporting events on the planet. Maybe it would be easier if they just identified those riders who AREN'T doped up!

re: #43 HelloDare

Obama's been acting dopey. Somebody check his urine.

We're gonna' look like dopes with him in the WH.

re: #43 HelloDare

Obama's been acting dopey. Somebody check his urine.

Dopey.

re: #49 HelloDare

Dopey.

well ,, the EARS are similar,,,,

re: #43 HelloDare

Obama's been acting dopey. Somebody check his urine.

* * *
Yeah, well so is half the country then, all swooney & dopey.

It's a shame our country consumes the most recreational pharmaceuticals on the planet.

Creepy picture alert; Nasrallah climbs out of his hole and the guy on the left looks like he's dead (we could only wish)

My default position is that all professional athletes are doping. They will have to convince me that they are NOT doping before I spend any money supporting them.

re: #50 sattv4u2

well ,, the EARS are similar,,,,

Barack has five fingers.

re: #54 HelloDare

Barack has five fingers.

3 on one hand and 2 on the other ?

re: #52 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Creepy picture alert; Nasrallah climbs out of his hole and the guy on the left looks like he's dead (we could only wish)

They all look so undernourished!
/Fat disgusting pigs

re: #55 taxfreekiller

Taxfreekiller will have to ride 2 hrs this afternoon training for the HHH 100 bicycle ride Aug. 30 Wichita Falls Tx, and all the dope I will bet is hearing Obama clips on the Michael Savage show when
I get off the bike all sore and worn out.

* * *
You're a patriot & hero & still fighting fit!

re: #57 VegasRick

They all look so undernourished!
/Fat disgusting pigs

Yeah, doesnt look like they missed many meals.

re: #57 VegasRick

They all look so undernourished!
/Fat disgusting pigs

* * *
They eat at the UN World Food Court, on your tax dollar.

I, too, have to admit that my enjoyment of the Tour de France has been pretty much destroyed by the continuing drug scandal.
It's becoming unwatchable as one never knows who will be exposed for doping next.

re: #60 alegrias

* * *
They eat at the UN World Food Court, on your tax dollar.

Teacher told me Lebanon used to be a country.

/

re: #57 VegasRick

re: #59 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Yeah, doesnt look like they missed many meals.

Proving once again the "west" (Israel included) treats our 'prisoners' way better than the Arab world does

re: #36 tedzilla99

Hey Charles, do you think that Floyd Landis truly tested positive, or do you think he was framed up by the French? I think he was framed - they were always trying to bust Lance.

I can't answer for Charles, but his behavior over the past 2 years in this matter has raised suspicions (and caused me to lose respect for him), regardless of the tainted evidence from the French testing lab.

I saw Floyd Landis last week, FWIW. I'd rather not say where or how, and I didn't say anything to him, but it was an interesting, out-of-the blue sort of thing.

re: #62 OldLineTexan

Teacher told me Lebanon used to be a country.

/

* * *
Lebanon was the place Uncle Sam sent US military dependents when war broke out in crazy Pakistan versus India circa 1965!

Yes, US dependents were put up at nice hotels on Lebanon's beaches!

re: #55 taxfreekiller

Why do they call it HHH when it is the "Hotter n Hell" race? Good luck,
It is going to be HOT!

Floyd Landis' behavior, that is, not Charles'.

Sorry if anyone got that impression...

=^0

I would like to see a graph of the epo and sugar levels of all the riders from the 1st sample of urine. Wonder what percentage was high but just under the allowable max. The cheaters have really has given the sport a bad name. I hope Slipstream/Garmin-Chipotle's anti-drug stance will change some opinions about the sport.

re: #64 Spiny Norman

I can't answer for Charles, but his behavior over the past 2 years in this matter has raised suspicions (and caused me to lose respect for him), regardless of the tainted evidence from the French testing lab.

I saw Floyd Landis last week, FWIW. I'd rather not say where or how, and I didn't say anything to him, but it was an interesting, out-of-the blue sort of thing.

* * *
Were you in Lebanon, Pennsylvania --Amish Country? That was Landis' home, was it not? When he was clean?

re: #64 Spiny Norman

Positive test or not, I have a doctor friend that would bet Lance Armstrong doped as soon as he heard Lance had testicular cancer

re: #65 alegrias

* * *
Lebanon was the place Uncle Sam sent US military dependents when war broke out in crazy Pakistan versus India circa 1965!

Yes, US dependents were put up at nice hotels on Lebanon's beaches!

Note the sarc tag. My maternal uncle spent his leaves from Viet Nam in Lebanon during his first two tours.

re: #69 alegrias

* * *
Were you in Lebanon, Pennsylvania --Amish Country? That was Landis' home, was it not? When he was clean?

No, I'm not in PA. Landis lives in Southern California now (and has for some time).

The unrelenting pressure from the Tour de France has forced the riders to go to underground veterinarian clinics for their performance boosting drugs. This has caused unforeseen side effects...

re: #71 OldLineTexan

Note the sarc tag. My maternal uncle spent his leaves from Viet Nam in Lebanon during his first two tours.

* * *
No sarc tags needed! The whole world's got the jihadi bug.

I know a Vietnam Vet who took R&R in cheery Australia--which now also has agitatin' LEBANESE imams and gangs on the beaches harassing Aussies, as our aussiemagpie has documented.

Nowhere to run, nowhere to hide, might as well stay & fight.

re: #67 Spiny Norman

Floyd Landis' behavior, that is, not Charles'.

Sorry if anyone got that impression...

=^0

Where's that LOL button....

re: #62 OldLineTexan

Hey, I tried to email you today and it bounced. Turn your nic blue, please?

re: #70 sattv4u2

Positive test or not, I have a doctor friend that would bet Lance Armstrong doped as soon as he heard Lance had testicular cancer

I've heard speculation that performance enhancing substances could have caused his cancer, but he was a phenomenal athlete even as a teenager - in 1988, he set a course record in the Big Bear Triathlon that still stands. I was in that race and he beat me by 27 minutes... by only 4 on the bike split, though ;^).

Some of the medications he used in chemotherapy are indeed banned from international sporting authorities, (where his supposed "admission" came from, I believe) and I think he got an official exemption for an anti-cancer drug he continued to take.

re: #76 vxbush

Hey, I tried to email you today and it bounced. Turn your nic blue, please?

don't hold your breath !

HEHEHE ,,, I crack me up !

re: #78 sattv4u2

don't hold your breath !

HEHEHE ,,, I crack me up !

Heh. Well, is there a better way to say it?

Forget the stupid drug and doping tests. Hand out swords, whips and little rotating blades for their wheel hubs like in Ben-Hur, and let them have at it.

It will make for much more excitement.

What are the French going to do for something to seethe about? After all, they no longer have Lance Armstrong to show them how it's done anymore.

Thats right, an over the hill cancer survivor Kicked the pompous ass of an entire nation 7 times! Kinda sticks in yer snail eating craw don't it?

/Nyuk, nyuk, nyuk

re: #33 drogheda

Charles did you happen to see this article about doping in Scientific American?

The Doping Dilemma

Doping in Scientific American?
I am aghast at the use of performance enhancing drugs by America's science writers! If America cannot produce high performance popular science articles without resorting to steroids or any of these other drugs so popular with these so-called journalists, than we have no right to even compete!
I really think we need an investigation into this, no-doubt widespread, phenomena.This is only going to tarnish the image of America abroad.
...
What? No, I don't need to read articles before commenting on them!

Tour de Drugs. I'm afraid that I no longer trust any athletics. At least if we win big in the Olympics, we can say that "our drugs are better and more concealable than your drugs".

mmmm.. steroids have destroyed cred for many world class athletes..
Does anyone think that Barry Bonds really earned the home run record? anyone?
My doctor put me on steroids after an injury in '91. It worked wonders..So there is a purpose for the drugs..But performance enhancement is out-of-bounds.
/BTW.. some die hard fans believe using steroids for injury recovery is still cheating.. Well when the pressure of a bed sheet on your knee is too painful to bear..then give me painkillers and steroids..so sc*w you armchair athletes..There is a time and place for drugs.
/are you guys going to down ding me for that?

re: #84 HoosierHoops

/are you guys going to down ding me for that?

No, because I agree with you.

re: #18 looking closely

I've heard from a trusted source (an MD) that pretty much EVERYONE in the game is "doping" by manipulating hemoglobin levels, and its an open secret within professional cycling.

The testing is more to create an illusion of non-doping and to eliminate the absolutely worst offenders than anything else.

True -- but putting yourself in an altitude tent is far less like "doping" than taking steroids, don't you think? After all, people DO live at 10,000 feet. Not many, but some.

What gets me is they're wasting all these drugs for increased endurance and stamina on fricking athletes to win a damn bicycle race. I'd rather see them used so our troops can more efficiently kill the enemy. Mountain warfare aint no joke.

re: #73 stevieray

The unrelenting pressure from the Tour de France has forced the riders to go to underground veterinarian clinics for their performance boosting drugs. This has caused unforeseen side effects...

What was that supposed to be? I get a "Monoscope" logo.

re: #84 HoosierHoops

No. I'm gonna down ding 'cause of your nic. :)

re: #55 taxfreekiller

Taxfreekiller will have to ride 2 hrs this afternoon training for the HHH 100 bicycle ride Aug. 30 Wichita Falls Tx, and all the dope I will bet is hearing Obama clips on the Michael Savage show when
I get off the bike all sore and worn out.

Hey, I wish you all the best, TFK. Don't forget to shave your legs, etc!

"Science is meaningless because it gives no answer to our question, the only question important to us, ‘What shall we do and how shall we live’"

--Leo Tolstoy

Speaking of Lance and the TdF. He is hawking an energy drink called FRS on the Internet.

re: #82 nikis-knight

Doping in Scientific American?
I am aghast at the use of performance enhancing drugs by America's science writers! If America cannot produce high performance popular science articles without resorting to steroids or any of these other drugs so popular with these so-called journalists, than we have no right to even compete!
I really think we need an investigation into this, no-doubt widespread, phenomena.This is only going to tarnish the image of America abroad.
...
What? No, I don't need to read articles before commenting on them!

Kids taking final exams in college also routinely "dope" for increased concentration/retention. I suppose academic or intellectual doping should be banned in colleges as well?

We've got a drug culture, folks. We drug/vitamin/herb ourselves to cheat mortality, feel younger or perform better. It has become an entitlement.

re: #93 hermeneutics

Kids taking final exams in college also routinely "dope" for increased concentration/retention

So you think that a 19 year old student taking an occasional "upper" to stay awake while cramming for an exam is equivilent to a professional athelet doping for months if not longer to gain competitive advantages over his opponents?

re: #89 BignJames

No. I'm gonna down ding 'cause of your nic. :)

hehehe
coach K is a genius...high five tar heels fan!
thanks for your humor and being a bball fan.

re: #94 sattv4u2

Kids taking final exams in college also routinely "dope" for increased concentration/retention

So you think that a 19 year old student taking an occasional "upper" to stay awake while cramming for an exam is equivilent to a professional athelet doping for months if not longer to gain competitive advantages over his opponents?

And you think it is only occasional? Many students take prescription drugs several times a day. Some add non-prescribed (read: illegal) drugs for extra oomph before exams.

Yes, I think it is wrong. For both.

re: #93 hermeneutics

We've got a drug culture, folks. We drug/vitamin/herb ourselves to cheat mortality, feel younger or perform better. It has become an entitlement.

And those drugs allow me to keep breathing and keep working despite a large number of allergies. I see your point, but some of us desparately need those drugs to actually function at all. Not what you're talking about, but something to consider.

re: #96 hermeneutics

And you think it is only occasional? Many students take prescription drugs several times a day. Some add non-prescribed (read: illegal) drugs for extra oomph before exams.

Yes, I think it is wrong. For both.

I didn't ask if you thought it was wrong (which it clearly is, hence the term ILLEGAL DRUGS). I asked you if you thought it was EQUIVALENT? And your answer is ,, ?

re: #84 HoosierHoops
I dinged you up, I agree with you

A drive-by post from me, I have been biking in Northern Coastal California up around Jenner. Weather has been cool and cloudy, in other words, perfect.
The New Yorker cover was wild. Enjoyed reading about that.
Nice to catch up with you all. Later, Lizards.

"Science is meaningless because it gives no answer to our question, the only question important to us, ‘What shall we do and how shall we live’"

--Leo Tolstoy

Without internet access, I guess.

re: #101 Slumbering Behemoth

Without internet access, I guess.

Thank God Al Gore invented it !

re: #98 sattv4u2

I didn't ask if you thought it was wrong (which it clearly is, hence the term ILLEGAL DRUGS). I asked you if you thought it was EQUIVALENT? And your answer is ,, ?

I'm not willing to accept the premise that students are less morally culpable for doping than athletes ... nor will I accept as a premise the greater moral responsibility of professionals than amateurs.

Both are responsible. Equally.

re: #102 sattv4u2

Thank God Al Gore invented it !

I think you meant "Thank Gaia".
/

re: #100 rawmuse

A drive-by post from me, I have been biking in Northern Coastal California up around Jenner. Weather has been cool and cloudy, in other words, perfect.
The New Yorker cover was wild. Enjoyed reading about that.
Nice to catch up with you all. Later, Lizards.

hey rawmuse..if you are biking around Jenner then you know about goats rock.. Have you climbed it? I love that area..
/have a great ride my friend

re: #97 vxbush

And those drugs allow me to keep breathing and keep working despite a large number of allergies. I see your point, but some of us desparately need those drugs to actually function at all. Not what you're talking about, but something to consider.

I hear you, VX. I'm kept alive with two pills every morning. Those pills, however, do not enhance me in any way. They merely replace what my body cannot make.

However, our predicament is far different than that of athletes looking for a super-human boost or students needing to cram reams of info into their heads prior to an exam.

re: #100 rawmuse

A drive-by post from me, I have been biking in Northern Coastal California up around Jenner. Weather has been cool and cloudy, in other words, perfect.
The New Yorker cover was wild. Enjoyed reading about that.
Nice to catch up with you all. Later, Lizards.

Enjoy yourself, Raw. Sounds heavenly.

re: #36 tedzilla99

Hey Charles, do you think that Floyd Landis truly tested positive, or do you think he was framed up by the French?

Yes, I do think he's guilty of doping.

re: #103 hermeneutics

I'm not willing to accept the premise that students are less morally culpable for doping than athletes ... nor will I accept as a premise the greater moral responsibility of professionals than amateurs.

Both are responsible. Equally.

I see. So there is no difference in crimes then? All should have the same punishment? A college student found with a dime bag of pot and a handful of greenies he occasionally sells to his roommate for a couple of bucks should be dealt with the same as a street dealer selling pounds of grass and viles of crack daily?

re: #108 Charles

Yes, I do think he's guilty of doping.

Yes. Agreed.

re: #109 sattv4u2

I see. So there is no difference in crimes then? All should have the same punishment? A college student found with a dime bag of pot and a handful of greenies he occasionally sells to his roommate for a couple of bucks should be dealt with the same as a street dealer selling pounds of grass and viles of crack daily?

To be honest with you, as a libertarian I don't believe drugs should be illegal at all. They should be regulated, like liquor, until the age of maturity. I frankly don't care if adults smoke or sell pot/etc.

But if the laws are written so that drugs are illegal, then we should enforce them. The culture of law breaks down when laws are selectively enforced. Furthermore, drug use is not layered with intentionality like murder, for instance.

re: #102 sattv4u2

The Goracle is wearing out his welcome in D.C.

Gore’s activism less welcome when gas costs 4 bucks

The former vice president-turned-elder statesman has achieved rock-star status within his party, not to mention a Nobel Prize, for his environmental activism. But Democrats’ political troubles over the issue of gas prices and domestic drilling prompt some lawmakers to wonder about Gore’s timing.

re: #88 Spiny Norman

What was that supposed to be? I get a "Monoscope" logo.

Really? Its was a chimp on a bicycle... the link is working fine for me, I don't know why it doesn't work for you.

/confounded intratubes!

Much more of this, and we'll have to consult Major League Baseball about what to do!

re: #111 hermeneutics

I asked a straight forward question. Could you please give me a straight forward yes or no answer. A college student is found with a dime bag of grass and sold a few uppers to his roommate. Should he get the same sentence in a court of law as a street dealer who daily sells pounds of weed and vilas of crack? Yes or no.?

re: #115 sattv4u2

No. He should be publicly flogged with a cane instead.

VILES (not vilas) PIMF

I want to blood dope just to feel better throughout the day or maybe if I need to recover from a nasty hangover.

re: #116 quickjustice

No. He should be publicly flogged with a cane instead.

now you're getting kinky !

Is that Hellboy I see, wearing the yellow shirt?

re: #119 sattv4u2

O.K., O.K. To avoid kinky, bring out the electric cattle prod instead!

Here is an example of "unfair" but legal advantaging in the sport. My son is shooting for a slot on the team, by the way.

The top kid-athletes sleep in altitude tents. Rather than sleep in a tent, I chose to take my kids up to the top of mountains and camp. To me, it seemed more "moral" than sucking the air out of tent while he sleeps. But in reality, it is no different.

But I heard that they're sucking so much oxygen out of their tent that they are acclimated to about 20 thousand feet. Or so they say. Now THIS isn't natural, for an American. It may be natural to train at 10-13 thousand feet, but 20 thousand feet? Why not 30 thousand feet?

I'm not sure what I think of this, but I refused to let my son sleep in a tent. Still do. He'll have to make it on his own ability.

To be honest with you, as a libertarian I don't believe drugs should be illegal at all. They should be regulated, like liquor, until the age of maturity. I frankly don't care if adults smoke or sell pot/etc.

really?
is that what you libertarian's think? drugs should be legal for adults?
have you ever watched the show 'cops'? you want those adults doing legal doing crank, coke, pot, crack?
no wonder you folks never win an election....

re: #115 sattv4u2

I asked a straight forward question. Could you please give me a straight forward yes or no answer. A college student is found with a dime bag of grass and sold a few uppers to his roommate. Should he get the same sentence in a court of law as a street dealer who daily sells pounds of weed and vilas of crack? Yes or no.?

Yes. But I say YES regretfully. The only reason that the student's crime is considered less than the dealer's is our reticence to enforce the law. Deep inside we know that regulating personal behavior isn't the purpose of a law-based government.

The law is wrong, Satt. Drugs should be legal.

Sorry if I was oblique.

re: #123 HoosierHoops

Yes, that is what SOME libertarians think. At least this one. I choose not to drink or use drugs. My choice. I'm an adult and I can make that choice. if other chooses differently, they reap the consequences of their behavior.

The same arguments existed at the time of prohibition. Exactly.

I sell some socks that say Dopers Suck on the cuff. They are always popular during the Tour de France.

re: #124 hermeneutics

Yes. But I say YES regretfully. The only reason that the student's crime is considered less than the dealer's is our reticence to enforce the law. Deep inside we know that regulating personal behavior isn't the purpose of a law-based government.

The law is wrong, Satt. Drugs should be legal.

Sorry if I was oblique.

You weren't. But I strongly disagree. There are degrees of the "same" crime, and the punishment should be reflective if it. There are many grays in-between black and white

re: #124 hermeneutics

"The only reason that the student's crime is considered less than the dealer's is our reticence to enforce the law"

No,, the only reason why the students crime is considered less than the dealers is because it's LESS of a crime!

re: #127 sattv4u2

You weren't. But I strongly disagree. There are degrees of the "same" crime, and the punishment should be reflective if it. There are many grays in-between black and white

Yes, but unless the law is written in such a way that it is modulated with shades of grey, it should be enforced as written.

One either breaks the law or doesn't. There are few mitigating circumstances, but very few. Being young and stupid doesn't cut it.

Again, I don't like the law. As long as it exists, however, it should be enforced. If you think drug users should be punished differently than drug pushers, write that into the law!

Change the law, Satt. That's the solution.

re: #112 Bubblehead II

The Goracle is wearing out his welcome in D.C.

Gore’s activism less welcome when gas costs 4 bucks

LMAO!

=^D

OT - Although only a tiny minority of Islam embraces terrorism, someone forgot to tell the thousands that came out to cheer a man who bashed in the head of a 4-yr-old girl.

Thousands cheer 5 released Lebanese militants
BEIRUT, Lebanon - Five Lebanese militants got a hero's welcome from tens of thousands of cheering Hezbollah supporters and kisses from the U.S.-backed prime minister

I'm glad AP told me that George Bush was to blame. I was about to hold a death culture that celebrates terrorists to blame.

The only undisputed winner was the German team who swept the 1940 Tour de France...although they later faltered badly during the Tour de Stalingrad in '43.

re: #115 sattv4u2

I asked a straight forward question. Could you please give me a straight forward yes or no answer. A college student is found with a dime bag of grass and sold a few uppers to his roommate. Should he get the same sentence in a court of law as a street dealer who daily sells pounds of weed and vilas of crack? Yes or no.?

well first of all.. you never sell uppers to your roomate in college..
and this is a silly question..
This is why we have judges..love em..hate em..but judges make this call all day long..
/ I deleted everything after this point.

Well this is a dead thread.. the hoopster is drenched in sweat..this has been a long day with charles posting like a thousand stories..
By noon i was exhausted.haha
Love you lizards and be safe..
Talk to you early birds same time same time..good night..
/ charles.. there is still time before open thread to post 72 mores stories..
hahaha / you're a good dude..kind regards..

re: #125 hermeneutics

Yes, that is what SOME libertarians think. At least this one. I choose not to drink or use drugs. My choice. I'm an adult and I can make that choice. if other chooses differently, they reap the consequences of their behavior.

The same arguments existed at the time of prohibition. Exactly.

i went back and reread my reply to you..
I didn't like the tone and i am very sorry to you..
i could blame it on the 1/2 bottle of 05 BV merlot..but that would be a cop out..

re: #135 HoosierHoops

i went back and reread my reply to you..
I didn't like the tone and i am very sorry to you..
i could blame it on the 1/2 bottle of 05 BV merlot..but that would be a cop out..

All is well, Hoosier. I've seen your text on this site and know you're a good guy.

Oh, is it time for the annual Tour de Drugs bile race again"

Sorry, Charles, but that particular event deserves a big, fat "So the hell what"...just like the Olympics.

G'day from Down Under to {everyone}

I've been very slack with posting here lately, still lurking most days of course to keep up with all the news

However I had to post about how proud we are of Cadel Evans, the 5th Aussie rider to wear yellow in the Tour de France

Cadel came second last year, the first Aussie to stand on the podium in Paris - it was wonderful to see him riding around after the presentation with the Aussie flag!

Go Cadel!

BTW anyone watching the 2006 Tour de France would suspect Landis of doping after his highly suss comeback stage win right after an underwhelming performance the stage before!

No conspiracy theory needed there

Two riders out of 180 have tested positive after probably hundreds of tests. If the same standards were applied to other professional or elite amateur sports, how many positive results would you expect.

Barry Bonds, Maguire, Sosa, Clemons, Palmiero, Petite, Giambi, Marion Jones, Tim Montgomery, the list goes on.

Yes, cycling has had its drug problems but it appears they are sincerely trying to eliminate the cheats. One big incentive for cycling is the fact it's sponsorship driven and sponsors have either left or are about to quit (T-Mobile, Liberty Mutual, Phonak-I-Shares, CSC, Skoda). That's one hell of an incentive to try and clean up the sport.

36 Tedzilla:

Positive. How else do you explain the synthetic testosterone. BTW - I recommend the book "From Lance to Landis"
[Link: www.amazon.com...]
[Link: sports.espn.go.com...]

re: #12 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I thought they were Devo

I'm glad they're not. Those bastards.

Didn't anybody think it strange that Amgen (maker of Epogen) has been the primary sponsor of Tour of California the last three years? Floyd Landis won it in 2006 a few months before he won TdF (later disqualified). Maybe we can call it Tour de Dope next year.

Breaking news - another rider caught.

Ricardo Ricco has tested positive for EPO and has been tossed out. His entire Saunier Duval team has withdrawn also. Ricco (a two stage winner) tested positive after the time trial. The team withdrew voluntarily.

I say ban the bastards for life from all three grand tours. Show no mercy.
[Link: tour-de-france.velonews.com...]

Why do they think they can get away with using EPO? It's relatively easy to detect.

Someone must have been hawking a bogus masking agent.

Spiny:

Velonews has the dope (sorry, couldn't help it) on the drug. It's a new form of EPO developed by Hoffman-La Roche and called CERA (Continuous Erythropoiesis Receptor Activator).

It's a longer acting drug needing only one or two injections per month as opposed to three times per week for rEPO.

Apparently Hoffman-La Roche supplied WADA with information and samples of CERA ahead of time and WADA was able to devise a test for it.

“In the case of Mircera ─ CERA ─ thanks to the cooperation of the manufacturer of this substance (Roche) and of WADA-accredited laboratories, WADA received the molecule well in advance and was able to develop ways to detect it,” he said. “This case shows the significant work that WADA conducts in anticipating doping trends, including by closely cooperating with pharmaceutical companies at very early stages of the development of molecules or substances for therapeutic purposes to develop detection methods for anti-doping purposes.”
[Link: tour-de-france.velonews.com...]

I used to compete on bicycles from 1987 to 1998, I was a ranked amateur, USCF cat. 2. It took me 5 years of consistent, obsessive training to achieve category 2 status and that was as far as I would ever be able to go. I had to ride 450 - 600 miles a week to be able to compete against cat. 1's and professionals. And I didn't really offer much competition, I was field fodder to those guys. My best result as a cat. 2 was a couple of top 20 finishes. (out of fields of 120 -160 riders). I used to see the same faces at different events and we all got to pretty much know each other's abilities. I got disgusted with competitve cycling when guys I knew, all of a sudden, could drill it unrelentingly all race long. Their "magical" ability to up their average speed 3 - 4 mph over what they used to do was mystifying. I don't compete anymore, but I still ride to work out and prevent myself from turning into a tub of goo. I love it when some spandex-clad snob rides up and assumes they're going to blow by me and I latch on and draft until they tire from trying to drop me and I accelerate past them and ride them off my wheel.
Charles, why are you not posting your rides anymore?