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New York Times Rejects McCain Op-Ed

Mon, Jul 21, 2008 at 9:09:00 am PDT

Another title for this one might be “Jawdropper of the Day.” At Drudge:

NYT REJECTS MCCAIN’S EDITORIAL; SHOULD ‘MIRROR’ OBAMA
Mon Jul 21 2008 12:00:25 ET

An editorial written by Republican presidential hopeful McCain has been rejected by the NEW YORK TIMES — less than a week after the paper published an essay written by Obama, the DRUDGE REPORT has learned.

The paper’s decision to refuse McCain’s direct rebuttal to Obama’s ‘My Plan for Iraq’ has ignited explosive charges of media bias in top Republican circles.

‘It would be terrific to have an article from Senator McCain that mirrors Senator Obama’s piece,’ NYT Op-Ed editor David Shipley explained in an email late Friday to McCain’s staff. ‘I’m not going to be able to accept this piece as currently written.’

In McCain’s submission to the TIMES, he writes of Obama: ‘I am dismayed that he never talks about winning the war—only of ending it... if we don’t win the war, our enemies will. A triumph for the terrorists would be a disaster for us. That is something I will not allow to happen as president.’

NYT’s Shipley advised McCain to try again: ‘I’d be pleased, though, to look at another draft.’

[Shipley served in the Clinton Administration from 1995 until 1997 as Special Assistant to the President and Senior Presidential Speechwriter.]

UPDATE at 7/21/08 9:35:16 am:

Previous op-ed contributors to the New York Times have included Yasser Arafat and various spokesmen for Hamas: What Hamas Wants.

UPDATE at 7/21/08 10:05:34 am:

And for some extra-crunchy irony, here’s New York Times empty suit “readers’ representative” Clark Hoyt, defending publishing that Hamas op-ed: The Danger of the One-Sided Debate - New York Times.

(Hat tip: LawHawk.)

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593 comments

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1 mossley  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:10:31am

And what are their current circulation numbers? How long will they pretend there is no correlation?

2 6pat6  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:10:43am

The NYT rejects truth.

3 6pat6  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:11:19am

Don't they have a circulation of about sixteen? Wait, that's the mental age of their editorial staff.

4 newsjunkie_ky  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:11:21am

Get this info out to all of your email friends.

Rush is discussing this now.

5 Honorary Yooper  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:12:05am

If there were any doubt about the NYT's bias, this should blow it away.

6 Limitbreak22  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:12:15am

Bias in the NYT?!?! Shocker! An obivious reason why newspapers are in steady decline all across the country. Pinkos run the bulk majority or them.

7 cardiacmont  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:12:17am

Apparently it didn't fit the imprint.

8 M. Bensson-Levi  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:12:20am

Media bias from the Times? Is that possible?

9 Occasional Reader  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:12:32am
NYT’s Shipley advised McCain to try again: ‘I’d be pleased, though, to look at another draft.’

"For instance, we'd be happy to run with something titled, say, 'Obama was right all along, and you should vote for him, not me'".

10 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:12:32am

The Obama piece should be considered a campaign contribution from the NYT to the Obama campaign. With a nice, big, fat fine to the NYT, because such contributions are illegal. In addition, they should give full-page ads to ALL the other national candidates as compensation.

11 kynna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:12:42am

Blatant. At least they're not pretending to be a news organization anymore. Gotta give them that.

12 ROPMA  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:12:50am

current media conduct

And the race is on.

13 THX-42  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:12:52am

No surprise. The NYT welcomes only those opinion pieces that they agree with. If McCain would just "change" his so it supported Obama's views, it would meet the NYT's high standards.

14 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:13:09am

OH FOR FUCK'S SAKE! And the NYT really expects anyone to take them seriously anymore?

15 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:13:13am

On the bright side, Drudge's circulation dwarfs that of the Times, so more people get to read McCain's editorial.

16 joncelli  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:13:21am

Let's give the NYT the benefit of a doubt. Let's say the opinion piece by McCain doesn't meet their editorial standards. Let's give them that excuse once. Let McCain's people rewrite the piece according to the NYT's critique. Then if they reject it again, the NYT has no more excuses, and we can go medieval on them.

17 Shr_Nfr  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:13:43am

I'd be pleased to look at another draft too. Draft Shipley and send him to Iraq for a couple of tours. I dare say his viewpoint might change.

18 jones  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:14:10am

I wonder if McCain knew, in his heart, how fast the MSM would turn on him.

A lesson for Conservatives.

19 Syrah  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:14:26am

Lizard corduroy O'johnson posted this in the links.

The belief that reporters are trying to help Barack Obama win the fall campaign has grown by five percentage points over the past month. The latest Rasmussen Reports telephone survey found that 49% of voters believe most reporters will try to help Obama with their coverage, up from 44% a month ago.

Just 14% believe most reporters will try to help John McCain win, little changed from 13% a month ago. Just one voter in four (24%) believes that most reporters will try to offer unbiased coverage.

20 harrylook  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:14:34am

So, that's what they mean by All the News That's Fit to Print.

21 mossley  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:14:39am

The self-delusional antics of today's media are amazing. They continue to pursue a path that is killing their sales, and they refuse to acknowledge the problem, let alone take any corrective steps. They'd rather destroy themselves than give honesty a chance. It's the only industry that I know of that is so hell-bent on self-destruction, with the possible exception of Hollywood.

22 Ojoe  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:14:50am

How.

Very.

Sad.

23 opnion  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:14:58am

What a surprise. (.Forehead slap)
When the NYT shilled for McCain during the primaries, that should have been a heads up.
They saw him as someone that the Dems could beat & now will do everything to help that along.

24 The Other Les  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:15:00am

re: #2 6pat6

The NYT rejects truth.

The NYT did correctly report that the Titanic sank when virtually all other newspapers were reporting otherwise.

25 Crusader Rabbit  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:15:06am

Appalling but in no way surprising.

NYT = pravda

26 turn  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:15:16am

[Shipley served in the Clinton Administration from 1995 until 1997 as Special Assistant to the President and Senior Presidential Speechwriter.]

Shipley probably rejected the piece because it sounded TOO presidential.

27 6pat6  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:15:22am

The NYT deserves no special treatment, only disdain. Plus, I think even bird and hamster cages have standards - the NYT is dirty before it ever hits the cage!

28 BBev  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:15:24am

re: #3 6pat6

Don't they have a circulation of about sixteen? Wait, that's the mental age of their editorial staff.

I think there circulation is down to family members and staff.

29 Charles  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:15:46am

I've never heard of a major newspaper rejecting an op-ed by a Presidential candidate. I believe this is unprecedented.

30 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:15:46am

We are so screwed.

31 cblesz  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:15:52am

re: #15 JammieWearingFool

On the bright side, Drudge's circulation dwarfs that of the Times, so more people get to read McCain's editorial.

I have given up on Drudge...he is just as blatant as the rest of the media..in the tank for Obama...it is quite disgusting.

32 newsjunkie_ky  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:16:03am

Where's cognito?

33 6pat6  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:16:05am

re: #24 The Other Les

Of course that was a different world, 96 years ago.

34 toadbelly  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:16:16am

thank God the NY times is there to protect us from independent thought. What would we do without them telling us what to think?

35 ModerateWolverine  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:16:23am

I want to say unbelievable...but that's just not the right phrase.

This is absolutely disgusting.

36 vagabond trader  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:16:26am

So we are to understand that Obama sets the tone of editorial commentary and the presumed Republican candidate must follow? Unbelievable, esp given the NYTs sliming of McCain not so long ago.

37 iceman1960  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:16:38am

I'm shocked...NOT!

38 NoSubmission  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:16:42am

How see-through and cheap. Like a hooker's Sunday dress.

39 mossley  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:16:51am

re: #16 joncelli

Let's give the NYT the benefit of a doubt. Let's say the opinion piece by McCain doesn't meet their editorial standards. Let's give them that excuse once. Let McCain's people rewrite the piece according to the NYT's critique. Then if they reject it again, the NYT has no more excuses, and we can go medieval on them.

The problem with this approach is the NYT will never, ever admit what caused the article to be rejected. Obviously, it's the position it takes, not the grammar or spelling.

40 Captain Hate  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:17:00am

NYT’s Shipley advised McCain to try again: ‘I’d be pleased, though, to look at another draft.

Draft 2: Suck my nads, tool.

41 newsjunkie_ky  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:17:11am

re: #31 cblesz

I have given up on Drudge...he is just as blatant as the rest of the media..in the tank for Obama...it is quite disgusting.

I'm seeing this as well. Just his headlines alone say a lot.

42 6pat6  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:17:16am

Anyone have a giant metal bar that we can jam the NYT presses with?

43 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:17:32am

They'll print editorials from terrorists but not Republicans.

44 DisturbedEma  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:17:40am

re: #14 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

OH FOR FUCK'S SAKE! And the NYT really expects anyone to take them seriously anymore?

:)

45 Ojoe  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:17:50am

re: #29 Charles

The regular media will continue to abuse their unmerited position of power until they lose it.

Then they will babble on the street at night to no one.

46 iceman1960  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:17:52am

‘It would be terrific to have an article from Senator McCain that mirrors agreed with Senator Obama’s piece,’ NYT Op-Ed editor David Shipley explained

47 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:18:14am

re: #31 cblesz

If Drudge is in the tank for Obama, why is he running McCain's editorial?

48 cblesz  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:18:26am

re: #41 newsjunkie_ky

I'm seeing this as well. Just his headlines alone say a lot.


Every day he has pictures of Obama all over the place and headlines as well...he is just as bad...

49 6pat6  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:18:31am

Drudge is a place I rarely visit anymore - he is so obviously in Obama's pocket, pants, somewhere getting tingly with Chrissy Matthews.

50 LindaMarie  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:18:34am

re: #24 The Other Les

The NYT did correctly report that the Titanic sank when virtually all other newspapers were reporting otherwise.

Makes them 1 for 10,000.
//ducks

51 DisturbedEma  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:18:53am

re: #43 Killgore Trout

They'll print editorials from terrorists but not Republicans.


Ummm, the NYT accepted term is "freedom fighter"

52 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:18:53am

I am Shocked, shocked to learn that there is bias at the NY Slimes.

53 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:18:55am

re: #29 Charles

Do we have a list of cretins who have had editorials published in the NYT?

54 Syrah  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:19:07am

re: #29 Charles

I've never heard of a major newspaper rejecting an op-ed by a Presidential candidate. I believe this is unprecedented.

Would you consider letting McCain post it here?

55 zmdavid  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:19:14am

re: #23 opnion

What a surprise. (.Forehead slap)
When the NYT shilled for McCain during the primaries, that should have been a heads up.
They saw him as someone that the Dems could beat & now will do everything to help that along.

It is interesting. They did endorse McCain, didn't they? So they are refusing a piece from a candidate they endorsed. (Not that it was a sham endorsement or anything)

56 opnion  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:19:28am

re: #43 Killgore Trout

They'll print editorials from terrorists but not Republicans.

And with good reason. They consider it criminal to be a Republican.
Terrorist? Please, they see them as freedom fighters.
Time for the 527's to fire up & take the fight to Obama.

57 cblesz  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:19:35am

re: #47 JammieWearingFool

If Drudge is in the tank for Obama, why is he running McCain's editorial?


Puhlease...Drudge is all over Obama...every day. So, he once and a while throws McCain a bone, but it is obvious who he is rooting for.

58 DisturbedEma  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:19:36am

re: #47 JammieWearingFool

If Drudge is in the tank for Obama, why is he running McCain's editorial?


Because OTHERWISE he would have to report what is (not) going on with the triumphant world tour. . . NOT

59 DisturbedEma  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:20:18am

re: #49 6pat6

Drudge is a place I rarely visit anymore - he is so obviously in Obama's pocket, pants, somewhere getting tingly with Chrissy Matthews.

Nads Be friends?

60 CIA Reject  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:20:38am

re: #39 mossley

The problem with this approach is the NYT will never, ever admit what caused the article to be rejected. Obviously, it's the position it takes, not the grammar or spelling.

I think the cause for rejection is not so much the position the piece takes as it is the fact that the piece makes BO look like a fool.

Can't have any of THAT now can we...

61 VegasRick  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:20:49am

re: #32 newsjunkie_ky

Where's cognito?

Conspiring with justmyignorantview.

62 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:20:51am

I'm sorry - I minused when I meant to plus the article!

Could someone upding in compensation?

I apologize for my lack of coordination!

63 Pullus Iulius  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:20:59am

An embarrassment to trees everywhere.

64 NoSubmission  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:21:04am

Didn't an Hamas 'official' have an Op-Ed published recently at the NYTimes?

65 Occasional Reader  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:21:09am

re: #53 Killgore Trout

Do we have a list of cretins who have had editorials published in the NYT?

Good point. Hamas shill? Print it! Republican presidential candidate? Oops, sorry, we found a dangling participle, no can do.

66 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:21:13am
67 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:21:13am

re: #16 joncelli

Let's give the NYT the benefit of a doubt. Let's say the opinion piece by McCain doesn't meet their editorial standards. Let's give them that excuse once. Let McCain's people rewrite the piece according to the NYT's critique. Then if they reject it again, the NYT has no more excuses, and we can go medieval on them.

"jon" -

Doesn't matter if Sen. McCain wrote it on the back of a paper bag with a crayon. So long as there is nothing obviously inflammatory, run it and let the readers/voters decide.

-S-

68 jcbunga  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:21:34am

Janine Melnitz: You're very handy, I can tell. I bet you like to read a lot, too.
Dr. Egon Spengler: Print is dead.

Wisdom from the Ghost Busters

69 harrylook  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:21:37am

I'm surprised the NYT op-ed editor was even there to reject the McCain article. Isn't he following BHO on his trip like every other "journalist"?

70 Alouette  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:21:48am
NYT’s Shipley advised McCain to try again: ‘I’d be pleased, though, to look at another draft.’

That's the typical form-letter response editors send out in all their rejection letters.

71 bosforus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:21:48am

I seem to remember predicting that a McCain editorial wouldn't make it into the NYT. Not that it's a terribly difficult prediction.

72 Honorary Yooper  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:21:52am

re: #58 DisturbedEma

Because OTHERWISE he would have to report what is (not) going on with the triumphant world tour. . . NOT

They needed room to publish glowing reports about Obama's Rainbow Tour.

73 DisturbedEma  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:21:53am

re: #46 iceman1960

‘It would be terrific is mandatory to have an article from Senator McCain that mirrors agreed with Senator Obama’s piece,’ NYT Op-Ed editor David Shipley explained


better

74 The Other Les  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:22:00am

re: #52 pingjockey

I am Shocked, shocked to learn that there is bias at the NY Slimes.

"I am shocked! Shocked! To find that propaganda is being printed here!"
"Your Newspeak dictionary, comrade."
"Oh, thank you."

75 doppelganglander  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:22:10am

re: #49 6pat6

Drudge is a place I rarely visit anymore - he is so obviously in Obama's pocket, pants, somewhere getting tingly with Chrissy Matthews.

But he doesn't mind taking advertising dollars to put a banner ad for "Hype: The Obama Effect" across the top of his page.

76 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:22:20am

McCain should commission massive billboards across the country "The New York Times refuses to print John McCain." Keep the message clear and simple. Major problem is in getting the message out, billboards are owned by Viacom, that is CBS, also a left wing shop.

77 mossley  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:22:27am

re: #55 zmdavid

It is interesting. They did endorse McCain, didn't they? So they are refusing a piece from a candidate they endorsed. (Not that it was a sham endorsement or anything)

I was going to say the same thing. It says a lot about their editorial processes that they endorse a candidate from whom they refuse editorials. The endorsement was a sham.

Wonder what McCain feels about his buddies in the press now. He sucked up to them for the past 8 years, but he honestly expect them to treat him fairly if he got the nomination?

78 M. Bensson-Levi  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:22:46am

This is really just fine. This sort of blatant unfair bias doesn't sit well with the American people. This going to blow up in their faces.

79 bosforus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:22:59am
Posted in: Overnight Open Thread
#560 bosforus 7/15/2008 7:49:22 am PDT

[Link: [Link: www.nytimes.com...]...]
Obama's Op Ed in the NYTrash. What are the chances of a McCain op ed showing up in the NYT?


OK, now I'm just bragging.

80 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:23:05am

After stupidity like this, these turds have the chutzpah to wonder why their revenues are tanking faster than David Caruso's career.

81 Anthony (Los Angeles)  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:23:16am

"Mirrors?"
What the heck is that supposed to mean? "Only if it agrees with Our Chosen One?"

Is there any confirmation for this besides Drudge?

82 The Other Les  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:23:17am

re: #63 Pullus Iulius

An embarrassment hazard to trees everywhere.


Fixed it.

83 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:23:18am

re: #16 joncelli

Under no circumstances! McCain shouldn't "mirror" Obama - that's conceding the definition of terms and premises, and then McCain's lost.

84 Charles  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:23:22am

I've had a lot of email about a post at Atlas Shrugs on the Obama birth certificate story, and I don't want to post about it so I'll just comment here: it's silly.

I've already said my piece and there's nothing in that post that changes my mind. In fact, I'm not even going to bother looking at any further posts about this phony story. It's embarrassing. Please drop it.

85 Nevergiveup  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:23:47am

re: #80 victor_yugo

After stupidity like this, these turds have the chutzpah to wonder why their revenues are tanking faster than David Caruso's career.

Who's David Caruso?

86 Adrenalyn  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:23:50am

it's all Bush's fault

seriously


he should have had the FCC close down CBS after the fake guard docs story

ditto for ABC when Ted Koppel went to Vietnam on a Kerry story

both within 90 days of an election when such "reporting" is illegal

that Bush let CBS (at the very least) get away is the reason this will continue to happen, if not get worse

you'll see

87 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:24:02am

re: #57 cblesz

Puhlease...Drudge is all over Obama...every day. So, he once and a while throws McCain a bone, but it is obvious who he is rooting for.

That's your opinion.

88 NYC_Mike  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:24:25am

it's to the point where the media is not even trying to hide their bias anymore. They seem to feel it's their DUTY to help get Obama elected.
I fear that this is only the beginning - wait until we get into Sept.Oct!

89 DisturbedEma  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:24:32am

re: #68 jcbunga

Janine Melnitz: You're very handy, I can tell. I bet you like to read a lot, too.
Dr. Egon Spengler: Print is dead.

Wisdom from the Ghost Busters

Yeah, for people who collect spores, molds and fungus (fungui)?

90 mossley  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:24:37am

re: #60 CIA Reject

I think the cause for rejection is not so much the position the piece takes as it is the fact that the piece makes BO look like a fool.

Can't have any of THAT now can we...

Yeah, well, Obama does that all by himself all the time...

91 opnion  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:24:43am

re: #55 zmdavid

It is interesting. They did endorse McCain, didn't they? So they are refusing a piece from a candidate they endorsed. (Not that it was a sham endorsement or anything)

The duplicity shoud not be surprising. They acted like they just loved the aisle crossing "Maverick" Now they will not even publish a McCain rebuttal to an Obama editorial.
Tells you all you really need to know about their praise for McCain during the primaries'.

92 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:24:46am

re: #79 bosforus

OK, now I'm just bragging.

You scooped Drudge?!?

I am very impress.

93 DisturbedEma  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:25:42am

re: #80 victor_yugo

After stupidity like this, these turds have the chutzpah to wonder why their revenues are tanking faster than David Caruso's career.


Ohhhhhhh, that was GOOD!

94 LindaMarie  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:26:15am

re: #70 Alouette

That's the typical form-letter response editors send out in all their rejection letters.


And in this case not acceptable. That is even more insulting.

Now I am pissed. If I was stupid enough to actually have a subscription ---- I would --- cancel it!
Take that NYT,

///opps no subscription so it is a fantasy rage

95 Honorary Yooper  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:26:21am

re: #92 victor_yugo

You scooped Drudge?!?

I am very impress.

Drudge has gotten slow and lazy in the past few years. I find things posted to the LGF Spinoff Links before I see it on The Drudge Report, if at all.

96 nikis-knight  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:26:28am

re: #29 Charles

I've never heard of a major newspaper rejecting an op-ed by a Presidential candidate. I believe this is unprecedented.

Well, of course the Times editorial board is smarter than John McCain. He's a Republican, and was stupid enough to join the military, after all.

/

97 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:26:53am

re: #85 Nevergiveup

Who's David Caruso the New York Times?

Someday, our children and our children's children will say that.

98 BGOH  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:26:59am

The nation's "paper of record," indeed.

/

99 DisturbedEma  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:27:00am

re: #87 JammieWearingFool

That's your opinion .

SORRY, but you have to have that word approved. . .

100 Honorary Yooper  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:27:03am

re: #80 victor_yugo

After stupidity like this, these turds have the chutzpah to wonder why their revenues are tanking faster than David Caruso's career.

Where's Ike to do his imitation of David Caruso's career?

101 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:27:04am

How's the NYT stock faring lately?

102 doppelganglander  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:27:23am

Rush is on this story right now.

/waves to Rush's research assistant

103 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:27:31am

re: #84 Charles

I've had a lot of email about a post at Atlas Shrugs on the Obama birth certificate story, and I don't want to post about it so I'll just comment here: it's silly.

I've already said my piece and there's nothing in that post that changes my mind. In fact, I'm not even going to bother looking at any further posts about this phony story. It's embarrassing. Please drop it.

I figured that issue was dead after AJ Strata demolished the conspiracies a couple weeks ago.

104 bosforus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:27:36am

re: #92 victor_yugo

re: #95 Honorary Yooper

Very true. Hard to compete with the vigilance of the lizard army.

105 Cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:27:38am

re: #24 The Other Les

The NYT did correctly report that the Titanic sank when virtually all other newspapers were reporting otherwise.

And if they could, they'd blame Bush for that, too.

106 LindaMarie  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:27:41am

re: #76 lifeofthemind


too over the top

Never mud wrestle with a pig, you both get dirty, but the pig likes it

107 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:27:50am

re: #95 Honorary Yooper

Drudge has gotten slow and lazy in the past few years. I find things posted to the LGF Spinoff Links before I see it on The Drudge Report, if at all.

Don't expect any major updates on Drudge Report in the overnight. LGF is staffed 24/7.

108 6pat6  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:27:53am

B-HO is an ass, and he is appropriate representation of his Party of Jackasses. His ass-kissers at the NYT, and everywhere else in the MSM, are all just ridin' the ass to their final destination - Hell.

109 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:28:01am

Bring back the Fairness Doctrine /sarc

The NYT is the self proclaimed paper of record.

That record is self imposed one-sided. And with good reason. They don't like it when their favorite matinee idol gets skewered over his position on Iraq, and McCain's editorial gets to that point.

Of course, that this op-ed got rejected by the Times editorial staff may actually work in McCain's favor - gets the GOP fired up, likely gets it published elsewhere, and provides plenty more media coverage than if it made the paper without any fanfare or criticism by the Times' Shipley.

110 Cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:28:16am

re: #101 MandyManners

How's the NYT stock faring lately?

Dropping like a paralyzed falcon, I hear.

111 vestalmiss  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:28:30am

In away this could be a great gift. I think that it will show the American people just how bias the msm really is. People do not like to be told which candidate they need to vote for.

112 Adrenalyn  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:28:37am

Rush, quote my #86
I am correct, after all

this could have been prevented by a post-emptive strike on CBS

113 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:28:50am

re: #89 DisturbedEma

Yeah, for people who collect spores, molds and fungus (fungui)?

Fungi

114 ec marm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:28:52am

re: #84 Charles
The rabbit died.

115 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:29:04am

re: #98 BGOH

The nation's "paper of record," indeed.

Record what? Asininity? Bias? Communist sympathies?

116 The Other Les  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:29:19am

re: #105 Cygnus

And if they could, they'd blame Bush for that, too.

There was a Republican (Taft) administration in office at the time.

117 DisturbedEma  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:29:32am

re: #77 mossley

I was going to say the same thing. It says a lot about their editorial processes that they endorse a candidate from whom they refuse editorials. The endorsement was a sham.

Wonder what McCain feels about his buddies in the press now. He sucked up to them for the past 8 years, but he honestly expect them to treat him fairly if he got the nomination?


Are you saying they waffled? Pass the freaking syrup. . .

118 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:29:37am

Hamas NYT editorial gets published....
What Hamas Wants

By AHMED YOUSEF

119 mossley  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:29:38am

re: #101 MandyManners

How's the NYT stock faring lately?

Let's see if this works.

120 abolitionist  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:30:22am

From Drudge,

Shipley, who is on vacation this week, explained his decision not to run the editorial.

'The Obama piece worked for me because it offered new information (it appeared before his speech); while Senator Obama discussed Senator McCain, he also went into detail about his own plans.'

Shipley continues: 'It would be terrific to have an article from Senator McCain that mirrors Senator Obama's piece. To that end, the article would have to articulate, in concrete terms, how Senator McCain defines victory in Iraq.'

The Times is demanding editorial control, with respect to content, over McCain's rebuttal of Obama's previously published opinion piece.

121 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:30:30am

re: #109 lawhawk

McCain should shop around for another paper to run his essay. It would be a beautiful middle finger right in the face of the NYT.

122 6pat6  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:30:41am

re: #111 vestalmiss

People do not like to be told which candidate they need to vote for.

On the contrary - you have a substantial percentage of the electorate who (I believe) are actually WAITING and WANTING to be told who to vote for! They are too "busy" with their lives to bother with those little "details", such as actually being knowledgeable on the facts!

123 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:30:48am

THe White House should let the NYT keep a press pass, making it clear that they are in the same category as the representative of the Lower Slobovian Feed and Drainage Courier. No government funds should be spent on subscribing to or supporting the NYT. Bush can do that right now by Executive Order.

124 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:30:51am

re: #118 Killgore Trout
I don't even have to read that. hamas want all Jews dead and Israel erased.

125 akak  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:30:55am

I guess McCain won't get that last minute endorsement from the slimes.

:

126 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:30:55am

re: #86 Adrenalyn

I can't imagine a United States where that is a legitimate action.

Now, if CBS and the NYT were denied credentials for the White House and the Pentagon and every other Executive Branch building and department...that would be just.

127 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:31:02am

re: #15 JammieWearingFool Hey Jammie! How are you doing my friend?

128 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:31:13am

re: #118 Killgore Trout

Hamas NYT editorial gets published....
What Hamas Wants

By AHMED YOUSEF

Well, its just because they mirror Obama's position.

129 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:31:30am

Morning all!

McCain should revoke all NYT press passes for his campaign.
Lock 'em out.

130 vxbush  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:31:31am

re: #118 Killgore Trout

Hamas NYT editorial gets published....
What Hamas Wants

By AHMED YOUSEF

Brother. They're willing to post op-eds from known terrorist organizations, but they cannot accept an op-ed from a presidential candidate of their own country.

Wait, I should rephrase that. The US isn't their own counry; they just live here.

131 Ringo the Gringo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:31:32am

How can you expect the NY Times to find the space needed to print an article by the Republican Presidential nominee when there are so many opinion pieces by Paul Krugman still waiting to be published.

A newspaper must have priorities.

132 ModerateWolverine  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:31:35am

re: #47 JammieWearingFool

If Drudge is in the tank for Obama, why is he running McCain's editorial?

Hot Air, or at least allah pundit, had been pushing that hard for a while. But as soon as Hillary had dropped out he seemed to have been back on the weird/normal/right wingish drudge we know.

133 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:31:50am

@Charles,

#118 above is worthy of an update to the main posting.

134 Miss Trixie  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:31:54am

Al the news that's sh*t to print.

135 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:32:08am

re: #127 realwest

Hey Jammie! How are you doing my friend?

Ditto JWF! Good to see you back up!

136 Morganfrost  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:32:26am
It would be terrific to have an article from Senator McCain that mirrors Senator Obama’s piece,’ NYT Op-Ed editor David Shipley explained in an email late Friday to McCain’s staff. ‘I’m not going to be able to accept this piece as currently written.’

Indeed, this editorial piece might possibly leave people with the impression that it would be acceptable to vote for McCain, or that there were flaws in Obama's positions on some of the issues facing this country. The New York Times simply cannot be a party to that.

137 BGOH  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:32:30am

re: #115 victor_yugo

Record what? Asininity? Bias? Communist sympathies?

You're on the right track. It is sad how far some of these media institutions have fallen. Is it any surprise that MSNBC and the NYT have a partnership now? They have both been ruined by left-wing partisans, and neither respects journalistic integrity any longer. It's sad.

138 w b h  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:32:36am

You know, this is another time I wish I still had a subscription to the Times so that I could cancel it.

I'm expecting Mr. Murdoch to start hiring the Times' best journalists for the WSJ.

139 mossley  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:33:13am

re: #84 Charles

I've had a lot of email about a post at Atlas Shrugs on the Obama birth certificate story, and I don't want to post about it so I'll just comment here: it's silly.

I've already said my piece and there's nothing in that post that changes my mind. In fact, I'm not even going to bother looking at any further posts about this phony story. It's embarrassing. Please drop it.

Sorry to go OT, but can someone explain to me how this ever became a story? His mother is an American citizen, so OB is American by birth. What difference does it make if he shows his birth certificate or not? People are going nuts over this story, and it's nothing. There are so many real issues with OB, why waste time on something that makes people look like idiots?

140 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:33:28am

re: #138 w b h
Which DDG is that?

141 GGMac  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:33:36am

re: #62 Dianna

I'm sorry - I minused when I meant to plus the article!

Could someone upding in compensation?

I apologize for my lack of coordination!

Done. :)

142 ec marm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:33:37am

When McCain wins I hope he requires the New York Times to submit an essay to him for approval before they are issued a press pass to attend White House briefings.

143 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:33:37am

re: #128 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Well, its just because they mirror Obama's position.

* * *
Bingo! Our defeat is the NYT's objective, and why they publish Hamas editorials but not editorials FOR victory over terrorists.

144 The Other Les  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:33:59am

re: #123 lifeofthemind

THe White House should let the NYT keep a press pass, making it clear that they are in the same category as the representative of the Lower Slobovian Feed and Drainage Courier. No government funds should be spent on subscribing to or supporting the NYT. Bush can do that right now by Executive Order.

Please refrain from insulting the Lower Slobovian Feed and Drainage Courier.

145 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:34:38am

re: #106 LindaMarie

too over the top

Never mud wrestle with a pig, you both get dirty, but the pig likes it

Obama is the NYT's and Soros' sock puppet. Since he has no record to run against they think he can coast through on vapor. Hitting the people who are behind him, the Times and Soros, will draw them out and make this a campaign the public can rally behind.

146 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:34:38am

re: #139 mossley

His mother is an American citizen, so OB is American by birth.

Uh, nope. Check the Constitution.

147 LindaMarie  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:34:49am

re: #129 jcm


No, it would not help. He needs to take the high road. They get passes but no one on one interviews etc.

148 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:34:55am

Today.


Six months.

Five years.

Ten years.

149 Cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:34:57am

re: #101 MandyManners

Hello Mandy! How are you doing?
You mentioned a couple of Seattle-area shopping malls Friday. Are you from around here?

150 ec marm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:35:06am

re: #138 w b h

You know, this is another time I wish I still had a subscription to the Times so that I could cancel it.


Why should that stop you from writing a letter requesting that they cancel your subscription?

151 Adrenalyn  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:35:19am

re: #126 Dianna

I can't imagine a United States where that is a legitimate action.

Now, if CBS and the NYT were denied credentials for the White House and the Pentagon and every other Executive Branch building and department...that would be just.

I can, under a complete democrat Washington
you put B. Hussein Obama in the White House
and let the left keep both Houses of Congress
and the "fairness doctrine" will be used ruthlessly
this is why this election, and every one since 2000
has been so important, let the left get absolute power
and they WILL NOT relinquish it


but, CBS and ABC did violate the law
and some punishment should have been meted out
regardless of whether someone thinks shutting them down is "American"
after all, there are plenty of other broadcast and cable channels to pick up where they left off
it would not be as if Bush just, swooosh - eliminated all media that did not agree with him

152 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:35:28am

re: #129 jcm

Morning all!

McCain should revoke all NYT press passes for his campaign.
Lock 'em out.

* * *
He owes them, because thanks to the NYT's endorsement, McCain beat Romney out for the GOP presidential nomination in the Northeast.

153 The Other Les  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:35:29am

re: #130 vxbush

Brother. They're willing to post op-eds from known terrorist organizations, but they cannot accept an op-ed from a presidential candidate of their own country.

Wait, I should rephrase that. The US isn't their own counry; they just live here.

They've been without a country since the Soviet Union went belly up in 1991.

154 abolitionist  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:35:40am

A question for NYT: Has BHO ever articulated, in concrete terms, how he defines victory in Iraq?

155 IgofAntioch  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:35:57am

The old "grey lady" had dementia!

156 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:35:58am

re: #137 BGOH

You're on the right track. It is sad how far some of these media institutions have fallen. Is it any surprise that MSNBC and the NYT have a partnership now? They have both been ruined by left-wing partisans, and neither respects journalistic integrity any longer. It's sad.

I have one name for you:

Walter Duranty.

157 NoSubmission  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:35:59am

I'm sure Dinnerjacket will have no problem getting a piece in the NYT.

158 akak  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:36:04am

re: #118 Killgore Trout

Hamas NYT editorial gets published....
What Hamas Wants

By AHMED YOUSEF


BHO's legacy will be making Hezbashitah & Hamas everyday non - terrorist groups I bet.


/and then throw them under the bus when something really bad (ie. 9-11 or 7-7) happens.

159 Honorary Yooper  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:36:09am

re: #121 victor_yugo

McCain should shop around for another paper to run his essay. It would be a beautiful middle finger right in the face of the NYT.

Fortunately, there are other papers that do publish his op-eds.

160 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:36:11am

re: #129 jcm

Morning all!

McCain should revoke all NYT press passes for his campaign.
Lock 'em out.

Do so when they're in Bumfucked, Idaho, too.

161 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:36:46am

re: #147 LindaMarie

No, it would not help. He needs to take the high road. They get passes but no one on one interviews etc.

LOL! Probably true, I'd just like to see 'em escorted out, the the huge headlines whining about it.

162 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:36:55am

re: #141 GGMac

Thank you!

163 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:37:15am

Even better; The Iraqi Insurgency.....

Op-Ed: Know Thine Enemy

In a video Op-Ed by documentary filmmakers Molly Bingham and Steve Connors, Iraqis explain the roots of the insurgency.

164 FrogMarch  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:37:23am

The NY Times is a joke.

165 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:38:06am

re: #146 victor_yugo

His point that this issue makes people pushing it look silly is dead on, though.

166 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:38:10am

re: #160 MandyManners

Hey I thought were all Mandy now. Do I have to go back to being me again?

167 mossley  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:38:12am

re: #47 JammieWearingFool

If Drudge is in the tank for Obama, why is he running McCain's editorial?

My opinion: follow the money. He knows there is a big moonbat audience for OB, so he posts stuff about him. It drives more views to his site, he can charge more for ads, he gets more money.

168 BBev  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:38:21am

re: #53 Killgore Trout

Do we have a list of cretins who have had editorials published in the NYT?

I'm signed into them and have done a search for a list of Op-Ed contributers but I can not find list.

169 FrogMarch  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:38:31am

Who needs State Run Media? We have the NY Times.

170 karmic_inquisitor  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:38:51am

This is such a blatant case of bias, yet the cult of Obama cannot see it.

I don't want a cult running the country.

171 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:38:53am

re: #156 victor_yugo

As an add-on, I should point out that I'm Eastern Orthodox, and Duranty's role in aiding and abetting Stalin's Holodomor will be something he answers for on Judgment Day.

172 The Other Les  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:39:25am

re: #166 lifeofthemind

Hey I thought were all Mandy now. Do I have to go back to being me again?

I've always been me. I just support Mandy.

173 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:39:46am

Morgan Tsvangirai couldn't get his editorials published in Zimbabwe either because Mugabe's thugs run the marxist media.

Hmmmm, insurgent presidential candidates Morgan Tsvangirai and John McCain ought to compare notes.

174 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:39:48am

I recommend The New York Sun.

175 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:39:59am

re: #160 MandyManners

Do so when they're in Bumfucked, Idaho, too.

Way over the line MM! No such place in ID, I was born there.....
//
Maybe the town I was born in would do, a real 1 horse town even today.
The kind of town where The Kid could take off on his bike and be gone all morning, and you wouldn't worry in the least. Maybe not, the town folks couldn't find it in them to be impolite.

176 LindaMarie  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:40:14am

re: #150 ec marm

Why should that stop you from writing a letter requesting that they cancel your subscription?

Now that is worth doing!
They have to have someone open it and read it and check the records.
Then figure out after about the first 40 letters that they are being taken and wasting their time.
I would hate to have a real subscription about then and try to cancel it.

177 Honorary Yooper  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:40:22am

re: #170 karmic_inquisitor

This is such a blatant case of bias, yet the cult of Obama cannot see it.

I don't want a cult running the country.

No, they can see it perfectly well and like that it is to their advantage.

178 lhc996rider  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:40:34am

Will everyone that is shocked, please raise your hand....

179 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:41:12am

re: #156 victor_yugo

Victor, Duranty was being blackmailed, with his lover's safety under threat.

I don't approve and I'm not excusing Duranty's behavior, but he didn't conceal the famine for political reasons.

180 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:41:15am

re: #53 Killgore Trout

Do we have a list of cretins who have had editorials published in the NYT?

You would need a bigger computer.

181 ec marm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:41:16am

re: #176 LindaMarie
Devious, isn't it? :~)

182 abolitionist  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:41:16am

re: #168 BBev

Hint: search for a list of Op-Ed contributors

183 CAD Daddy  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:41:37am

Unbelievable. Off-the-scale arrogance.

184 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:41:59am

re: #178 lhc996rider

Will everyone that is shocked, please raise your hand....

[crickets]

185 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:42:16am

re: #173 alegrias

Don'tcha know, they've got a deal in the works in Zimbabwe. NYT claims it's a big deal - but in reality, it's a deal to talk further about talks on power sharing.

186 The Other Les  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:42:32am

re: #176 LindaMarie

Now that is worth doing!
They have to have someone open it and read it and check the records.
Then figure out after about the first 40 letters that they are being taken and wasting their time.
I would hate to have a real subscription about then and try to cancel it.

I have to disagree. That only messes with entry level and temp clerical staff.

187 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:43:04am

re: #176 LindaMarie

Now that is worth doing!
They have to have someone open it and read it and check the records.
Then figure out after about the first 40 letters that they are being taken and wasting their time.
I would hate to have a real subscription about then and try to cancel it.

* * *
Hi Linda, did you get a chance to play basketball with Obama in Afghanistant? Or swoon for the Leni Riefenstahls' camera crews accompanying him?

188 w b h  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:43:20am

re: #140 pingjockey

Which DDG is that?

USS Barney, DDG-6. (Now probably razor blades though the Barney Association [Link: www.uss-barney-ddg6.org...] tried to save her. There's one of the class left in the United States, the USS Adams, DDG-2, and the Adams Class Vets Association [Link: www.adamsclassddgvets.org...] is working to establish her as a museum ship in Jacksonville.)

I served on board Barney from January 1970 to September 1974, the last two years as FTM1, taking care of the AN/SPS-39 radar set, the 3-D air search radar for the surface to air missile system. Crossed the Atlantic ten times. And we did some of the preliminary testing of shooting down submarine-launched missiles with our Standard missiles back in the early 1970s.

Thanks for asking, pingjockey.

189 BBev  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:43:23am

re: #182 abolitionist

Hint: search for a list of Op-Ed contributors

I did and several variations of it.

190 nyc redneck  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:43:26am

the nyt so arrogant. it is laughable, that they want mccain to write an op ed that makes b.o. look good.
i bet mccain is somewhere thinking abt. that.
i hope he's cussing.

191 docremulac  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:43:59am

The liberal world's two power bases are the liberal universities and the liberal media. Remove their strangle hold on the education and communication industries and they'll collapse.

The New York Times tossing it's credibility out the window like this is going to go a long way towards helping the decent of one of the most famous pillars of the liberal's media base so I'm pretty excited about it. This is really going to speed up the sinking of the New York Times.

192 Ziggy  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:44:06am

What media bias? This makes perfect sense to the fascist left.

193 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:44:12am

re: #127 realwest

Hey Jammie! How are you doing my friend?

I'm fine, thanks.

Thanks for the flowers last week. Much appreciated.

On vacation now; just waiting for the storm clouds to blow over then I'm heading to the beach.

194 jorline  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:44:19am

When it comes to editorial significance and substance the NYT's is a pair of 32A BOOBS in a 38DD bra.

Boob thread?

195 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:44:25am

Huh, is it me or is it just a strange time for David Shipley to go on vacation?
I reckon he figures that since his obvious choice for POTUS is in Europe, and the NYTimes can't afford to pay for him to go along, he might as well go on vacation.
This situation isn't absurd, it isn't foolhardy, it isn't even unseemly - this borders on the totally fascistic way to run the "Paper of Record".

Oh and to all of you who are suggesting that another NYC paper run McCain's response to Obama's NYT piece, just please remember two things: a) NYC is going for Obama, regardless of anything he says or does or doesn't say or do and
b) The New York Daily News, The New York Post and the New York Sun have probably less than
100,000 readers in all of America outside of NYC.

Now if the Wasnington Post were to run McCain's article that might have some nationwide effect.
Might.

196 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:45:12am
197 reggie  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:45:20am

I just read McCain's editorial and must concur with the objections to its publication. The piece includes entirely too many facts to be appropriate for the NYT.

198 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:45:42am

re: #193 JammieWearingFool No sweat - the flowers were the very least I could do. I'm glad to see you back and hope you enjoy your time off.

199 Ziggy  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:45:47am

re: #194 jorline

When it comes to editorial significance and substance the NYT's is a pair of 32A BOOBS in a 38DD bra.

Boob thread?

What did one boob say to the other? If we don't get some support soon, people will think we're nuts

200 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:46:01am

re: #185 lawhawk

Don'tcha know, they've got a deal in the works in Zimbabwe. NYT claims it's a big deal - but in reality, it's a deal to talk further about talks on power sharing.

* * *
Saw that, thank you.

As you know, Mr. Tsvangirai won the election against Mugabe. Then in order reverse election results they didn't like, Mugabe's thugs wouldn't publish or run ads or editorials that weren't for Mugabe, during the second run- off"campaign".

201 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:46:06am

re: #185 lawhawk

Don'tcha know, they've got a deal in the works in Zimbabwe. NYT claims it's a big deal - but in reality, it's a deal to talk further about talks on power sharing.

The gift of prophecy. I predict a conference, at a 5 star hotel, with massive press coverage, and 12 course meals, full employment for prostitutes, further study needed, parties "seized by the seriousness of the situation" and "fully determined to stay closely follow developments."

202 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:46:13am

re: #193 JammieWearingFool

On vacation now; just waiting for the storm clouds to blow over then I'm heading to the beach.

That's it, rub it....
*sitting in a cube*
;-) Have a great day.

203 Kenneth  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:46:59am
NYT Op-Ed editor David Shipley continues: 'It would be terrific to have an article from Senator McCain that mirrors Senator Obama's piece. To that end, the article would have to articulate, in concrete terms, how Senator McCain defines victory in Iraq.'

So, did Obama's NYT Op-ed "define victory in Iraq"? No. Not a word, either concrete or vague to define "victory, only that the US should withdraw as soon as possible, and that this withdrawal would somehow, inexplicably force the Iraqis to solve their own problems.

Meanwhile, McCain defined both failure & victory in his rejected op-ed:

I am also dismayed that he never talks about winning the war—only of ending it. But if we don’t win the war, our enemies will. A triumph for the terrorists would be a disaster for us. That is something I will not allow to happen as president. Instead I will continue implementing a proven counterinsurgency strategy not only in Iraq but also in Afghanistan with the goal of creating stable, secure, self-sustaining democratic allies. -John McCain

...thus proving that Shipley is a hypocrite.

204 karmic_inquisitor  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:47:48am

re: #177 Honorary Yooper

No, they can see it perfectly well and like that it is to their advantage.

I would like to agree with you but I have a friend who has fallen under the spell. He is an otherwise intelligent trial lawyer who can be even handed in assessing political matters even though he is a liberal.

he absolutely denies outright that there is a media bias in favor of Obama. He simply repeats the "historic candidacy" mantra that has been taught to all inductees of the cult. I asked him if McCain is historic given that he is the first POW/torture victim to run, whereas Obama's "historic" dimensions revolve around his skin color. At that point he just got angry and muttered something about me being a racist.

205 experiencedtraveller  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:48:00am

NYT reports earning 7/23.
Dividend date 8/28.
P/E trailing 12 months over 20 (waaay too high for me... but it's giving sweet, predictable little bounces all the way down...)

/capitalists making money off of socialists...

206 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:48:13am

re: #198 realwest

No sweat - the flowers were the very least I could do. I'm glad to see you back and hope you enjoy your time off.

So far, so good. Came up here early Friday and am finally getting some decent sleep.

Incredibly sticky and humid on Cape Cod, so the beach is the place to be. Except for midday Sunday when it was a virtual sandstorm.

207 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:48:18am

re: #179 Dianna Who was blackmailing him? And why was his lover's life in danger?
Seriously, this is the first I've ever heard of this.

208 FinallyHere  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:48:26am

Great for McCain! Who reads NYT anyway, but now more people would read this op-ed, than if it were published by NYT.

If you needed another proof that "progressives" are idiots, you have it. Another one after that great cartoon in The New-Yorker.

209 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:48:36am

re: #32 newsjunkie_ky

Where's cognito?

Rat cheer.

210 ec marm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:48:38am

re: #195 realwest

a) NYC is going for Obama, regardless of anything he says or does or doesn't say or do


Is it just me or does the election seem to be boiling down to 'city folk' against everyone else?
Here in Pennsylvania it will be Philadelphia and Pittsburgh for Obama, the rest of the state for McCain. Though I think Obama's 'bitter' comment is going to fire up the McCain crowd and the state should go for him.

211 Dad O' Blondes  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:48:59am

re: #43 Killgore Trout

They'll print editorials from terrorists but not Republicans.

That's exactly right.

The NYT is unpatriotic and frequently acts, institutionally, in a manner that is opposed to American values.

.

212 crash72  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:49:11am

re: #31 cblesz

I have given up on Drudge...he is just as blatant as the rest of the media..in the tank for Obama...it is quite disgusting.

Agree. Haven't been to Drudge's rag in months. He's in Obama limo.

213 LindaMarie  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:49:15am

re: #187 alegrias


No, but one of our friends at the Embassy shook his hand.
If he was not such a good friend, genuinely good person and I did not like him so much I would ask him to wash his hand before he ever takes mine again and gives me a kiss on the cheek.

214 formercorpsman  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:49:29am

re: #43 Killgore Trout

Killgore, that pretty much sums our state of affairs relating to politics in the here and now.

So far off the beaten path we have gone, where engaging the political opponent is seen as more of a disgrace to half of the base, than actually carrying the water for people who rape, murder, and maim.

It has surpassed what should have been non-negotiable.

The Constitution.

We have gone from a society who actually was aware of world events, (Berlin Wall, Missile Crisis, etc) to a country that is knee jerk Pavlovian from commercial sound bites.

It is distressing, despite what differences anyone may have politically, to see them descend into black hole of rabid absurdity.

You nailed it.

215 SummerSong  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:49:35am

re: #128 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Well, its just because they mirror Obama's position.

Funny, I read that name to be-

BY - ASHAMED YOUSELF

216 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:49:55am

re: #188 w b h

Nice. The Adams class looked like fun, an old fashioned warship, with guns and missiles. Spent time driving the USS England, no guns!

217 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:50:04am

re: #188 w b hRet. STG here. The USS Edson DD946 was still in commision when I was in Newport RI. They were a lot better looking back then. The cruiser and DD i was on had all the aesthetic value of a floating brick. Say what you will, the Sovs did build good looking, if not too functional ships.

218 Aylios  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:50:06am

I'd say "f-ing unbelievable", if it wasn't the NYT. But what else does one expect from the leftist propaganda rag. Either the Republican candidate says what they want him to say or he gets silenced. An omen of things to come if Obama is elected.

219 SummerSong  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:50:30am

Ugh - I quoted the wrong part.........

PIMF

220 Captain Hate  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:50:56am

re: #178 lhc996rider

Will everyone that is shocked, please raise your hand....

I am because I think this crosses a line in the sand that they didn't want to in order to continue the sham of their "objectivity". It's hard to tell what will come out of this, because obviously this fishwrap is poorly run by Pinch Shitburg and his quislings, but at the very minimum Shipley should get canned. I'll be anxious to see how the WaPo et. al. respond to this because if they have any desire to be seen as objective (and the WaPo has criticized the Dali-bama recently) they have to come down hard on this.

Remember, these are the same people that want a national shield law.

221 lurking faith  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:51:59am

re: #31 cblesz

I have given up on Drudge...he is just as blatant as the rest of the media..in the tank for Obama...it is quite disgusting.


At least he was honest enough to report this, though.

222 pat  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:52:07am

So he approved of the content of the Muslim terrorist he has let editorialize twice before? And what are those details in the Obama piece. I missed them. All I read was:Withdraw a few immediately, more later. Send to Afghanistan in 3,000 words. With the Joint Chiefs giving the orders. Insanity.

223 newsjunkie_ky  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:52:46am

re: #209 Cognito
Took you long enough.

224 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:52:50am

re: #86 Adrenalyn I don't know if you're correct about that illegality bit, but I am seriously suggesting that you find supporting legal precedent or law and forward it and your comment to McCain's Campaign HQ.
Seriously.

225 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:53:12am

I almost picked up a copy of the paper on Sunday--it's been ages since I've done the puzzles in the magazine. But, I restrained myself.

226 Aylios  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:53:26am

re: #24 The Other Les

The NYT did correctly report that the Titanic sank when virtually all other newspapers were reporting otherwise.


How 'Times' change.

227 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:53:28am

re: #209 Cognito
Hey Cog - what do you think about this story?

228 Opinionated  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:53:36am

"Major league assholes"

"Yeah, big time,"

229 mingjaiyo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:53:49am

I just heard this on Fox,with Mike Gallagher talkng about it. I am beyond infuriated. I haven't read any of the thread yet,so probably everything I could possibly say negatively concerning the NYT's has already been said. Regardless,if I owned a large bird,I would from this point forward refuse to even use the NYT's for shitpan liner. I fervently wish and hope for the defeat of Obamessiah in Novemeber followed by a shareholder revolt at the Times leading to it's being placed in receivership and sold off in portions. At this moment in time even winning the Powerball would not compare in sweetness to the NYT's utter demise.

230 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:53:50am

re: #207 realwest

Stalin's NKVD.

Duranty was gay. He was set up - a young man was trailed before him, and Duranty fell for it. The NKVD then showed him the pictures, and threatened (first) to reveal that Duranty was gay and (second) to arrest the young man for "deviancy".

Duranty could have stood the revelation of his being gay; but he was frightened for his young man. He shouldn't have been; the man was an agent.

231 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:54:00am

re: #225 MandyManners
We get the NYT Sunday crossword in our local papers tv guide.

232 Sir Napsalot  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:54:07am

Hey, that is no way to treat a potential POTUS. [It could happen, you know.]

Just think, with this one instance, how many other editorial piece need 'another draft' until the opinion is deemed acceptable.

233 pat  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:54:11am

We are seeing the application of The Fairness Doctrine.

234 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:54:22am

re: #227 realwest

Hey Cog - what do you think about this story?

I think it's an absurd mistake by the Times.

235 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:54:58am

re: #193 JammieWearingFool

I'm glad to hear you're doing all right.

I sent a mass card; did it arrive?

236 cardiacmont  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:54:58am

I don't want to force the Slimes to print anything, they can print anything it wants.

But when the libtards want to enforce some kind of fairness doctrine for radio broadcasts, I'll be remembering this.

237 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:54:59am

re: #223 newsjunkie_ky

Took you long enough.

Sorry, I didn't realize there was an obligation.

238 ec marm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:55:04am

re: #225 MandyManners

I almost picked up a copy of the paper on Sunday--it's been ages since I've done the puzzles in the magazine. But, I restrained myself.


Here, save yourself some money.
/ There's probably 10,000 more links through Giggle...

240 lurking faith  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:55:41am

re: #53 Killgore Trout

Do we have a list of cretins who have had editorials published in the NYT?


The bandwidth required might kill our faithful hamsters.

241 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:55:44am

re: #213 LindaMarie

No, but one of our friends at the Embassy shook his hand.
If he was not such a good friend, genuinely good person and I did not like him so much I would ask him to wash his hand before he ever takes mine again and gives me a kiss on the cheek.

* * *
Speaking about hand shaking, Rep. Joe Sestak of Pennsylvania, former Navy admiral, democrat & the highest ranking veteran in Congress, today said it was important to be able to touch your president.

(this morning on Fox & Friends, on Fox Cable)

242 newsjunkie_ky  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:56:05am

re: #237 Cognito

There is.

243 quickjustice  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:56:19am

I'm shocked, shocked that the N.Y. Times is being "unfair" to John McCain. Come on, guys! They endorsed him in the GOP primary figuring he'd be the easiest GOP candidate to beat in the general election. They may yet be proven right.

The N.Y. Times owes McCain nothing. After the bogus "sex scandal" they contrived about him, what does McCain expect? Fairness?

If McCain and his staff still haven't figured this out, their odds of winning this election are dropping rapidly.

244 Russkilitlover  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:56:24am

Blatent discrimination against Republicans by NYT. This appalling behavior comes from exactly those that want to impose the "Fairness" Doctrine on conservative outlets. There is certainly a bias, unmasked and naked. It's disgusting.

245 cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:56:24am

re: #184 victor_yugo

[crickets]

GMTA!

246 Wendya  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:56:34am

re: #16 joncelli

Let's give the NYT the benefit of a doubt. Let's say the opinion piece by McCain doesn't meet their editorial standards. Let's give them that excuse once. Let McCain's people rewrite the piece according to the NYT's critique. Then if they reject it again, the NYT has no more excuses, and we can go medieval on them.

There is no benefit of the doubt here. This says it all:

‘It would be terrific to have an article from Senator McCain that mirrors Senator Obama’s piece,’ NYT Op-Ed editor David Shipley explained in an email late Friday to McCain’s staff. ‘I’m not going to be able to accept this piece as currently written.’

247 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:56:36am

re: #242 newsjunkie_ky

There is.

Which is?

248 BBev  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:56:48am

re: #206 JammieWearingFool

So far, so good. Came up here early Friday and am finally getting some decent sleep.

Incredibly sticky and humid on Cape Cod, so the beach is the place to be. Except for midday Sunday when it was a virtual sandstorm.

I'm just north of you and it is going to rain all day here.

249 WayDownSouthInBama  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:57:20am

Let's see if I have the NYT obvious bias figured out. If McCain wants to run an article,it must mirror Obama. If Obama wants to run an article,it doesn't make a damn bit of difference if it mirrors a McCain article or not. Obama gets printed without a McCain "mirror",while a McCain article is rejected without an Obama "mirror".

Is that what everyone else is seeing?

250 dolfan  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:57:36am

How many drafts did Obama submit before the NYT deemed it acceptable to print?

251 Cicero05  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:57:40am

Pinch Sulzberger's destruction of NYT's credibility and circulation numbers is just about complete.

BTW, I'll bet McCain's really surprised at this. He's worked so hard to curry the favor of the NYT editorial staff. Must be a splash of cold water to find that the New York Times only likes McCain when he's trashing conservatives.

252 newsjunkie_ky  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:57:56am

re: #247 Cognito
You know.

253 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:58:03am

re: #231 pingjockey

We get the NYT Sunday crossword in our local papers tv guide.

It's not just the crossword. It's the accrostics and other puzzles.

254 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:58:13am

re: #241 alegrias

* * *
Speaking about hand shaking, Rep. Joe Sestak of Pennsylvania, former Navy admiral, democrat & the highest ranking veteran in Congress, today said it was important to be able to touch your president.

(this morning on Fox & Friends, on Fox Cable)

The best senior officers I met made it quietly clear that they disapproved of retired senior officers going into politics.

255 cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:58:19am

re: #193 JammieWearingFool

I'm fine, thanks.

Thanks for the flowers last week. Much appreciated.

On vacation now; just waiting for the storm clouds to blow over then I'm heading to the beach.

We all hate you now, you know.
*grin*

256 mossley  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:58:23am

re: #146 victor_yugo

Uh, nope. Check the Constitution.

I have. Immigration law has changed considerably over the years. My understanding is that a child of an American mother gets citizenship as long as the mother lived in the US for five years before the birth. For American fathers, a paternity test is also needed. Is there some other requirement I'm missing?

257 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:58:43am

re: #252 newsjunkie_ky

You know.

Eh? I've got no idea what your point is. So far it's just been cryptic little asides.

258 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:59:08am

re: #238 ec marm

Here, save yourself some money.
/ There's probably 10,000 more links through Giggle...

*smooch*

259 ec marm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:59:13am

If McCains' Op-Ed has to 'mirror' Obama's does that mean he'll have to use the same color crayons?

260 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:59:46am

re: #235 Dianna

I'm glad to hear you're doing all right.

I sent a mass card; did it arrive?

I hadn't had the opportunity to check the cards (there were a lot of them) and I believe the funeral home piled them all together and gave them to my mother. I'll have to find out when I get back.

Thanks for sending it.

261 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 9:59:51am

So much for tolerance;

Obama camp denies New Yorker writer plane seat

New Yorker writer Ryan Lizza, whose long, long article on Barack Obama's early political days in Chicago's ward politics was the reason for the magazine's controversial cover by Barry Blitt depicting Obama as a Muslim, has been barred from traveling with Obama on his foreign field trip this week.

262 reine.de.tout  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:00:01am

re: #9 Occasional Reader

"For instance, we'd be happy to run with something titled, say, 'Obama was right all along, and you should vote for him, not me'".

I think you're right. Here's another quote from the same article:


‘It would be terrific to have an article from Senator McCain that mirrors Senator Obama’s piece,’ NYT Op-Ed editor David Shipley explained in an email late Friday to McCain’s staff.

263 Pyrocles  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:00:23am

According to NPR, the NYT's readership isn't actually decreasing at all; it's just that people are reading their on-line offerings rather than their printed paper. Overall, it's still just as popular.

Of course, NPR basically = NYT.

264 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:00:34am

re: #253 MandyManners
I swear the Sunday NYT is the biggest pile of paper I have ever seen. Take 2 of the Sunday Seattle paper to make one of it.

265 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:00:49am

re: #250 dolfan

How many drafts did Obama submit before the NYT deemed it acceptable to print?

They told him to submit whatever he liked, they'd clear space for him.

266 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:01:04am

*spit* *spit* *spit*

Lawmakers Could Consider Gas Tax Hike, After Gas Tax Holiday Fails

WASHINGTON — The political vision of a summer gas tax holiday died a quick death in Congress, losing to a view that federal excise taxes on gasoline and diesel fuel will have to go up if they go anywhere.
267 Cartman  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:01:30am

The MSM is dropping the gloves. There's no pretense whatsoever left as to their intentions. They want/need Barry elected in the worst kind of way. Don't expect to see a shred of impartiality or objectivity from here on out through election night. They've gone full-bore from reporting on a presidential race, to actively promoting and endorsing a candidate and stifling his opponents views. Welcome to a brave, new world folks.

268 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:01:35am

re: #254 lifeofthemind

The best senior officers I met made it quietly clear that they disapproved of retired senior officers going into politics.

* * *
Former rear admiral pennsylvania democrat Rep. Joe Sestak said, roughly, that Obama has better military judgment than John McCain.

269 pat  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:01:41am

re: #261 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

If the GOP shared that view, they could fly around in a Lear jet.

270 JammieWearingFool  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:01:54am

re: #248 BBev

I'm just north of you and it is going to rain all day here.

We missed those nasty storms yesterday, got a slight bit of rain overnight and that's been it.

Well, I'm off.

Nice day, all!

271 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:02:02am

re: #246 Wendya

’‘It would be terrific to have an article from Senator McCain that mirrors Senator Obama’s piece

Maybe McCain's mistake was in sending it to the Times instead of sending it directly to Obama to edit? No that can't be right. Editing is work and Obama doesn't do "work."

272 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:02:15am

Charles, I've got one better for you. It is the NYT defense of the publication of that op-ed by Yousef.

273 Tigger2005  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:02:31am

Probably only a matter of time before Sami Kuntar gets an op-ed in the Slimes.

He'll probably get one in the Washington Posts' "spirituality" section, too.

274 cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:03:10am

re: #264 pingjockey

I swear the Sunday NYT is the biggest pile of paper I have ever seen. Take 2 of the Sunday Seattle paper to make one of it.

Including all the advertising inserts. I have to go through and toss all that stuff just to get to the actual paper (Seattle Times and Everett Herald).

275 Occasional Reader  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:03:32am

re: #266 jcm

The "gas tax holiday" was a lousy idea anyway, IMHO. (Don't know about a tax hike, though.)

276 karmic_inquisitor  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:03:39am

re: #261 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

So much for tolerance;

Obama camp denies New Yorker writer plane seat

This is the sort of thing that will get Drudge to turn on Obama.

Politicians are all ego-maniacal. Obama brings it to a new level by barring reporters in this manner. One wonders what will happen in the White House - will critical reporters be barred from press conferences?

277 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:03:51am

re: #266 jcm

*spit* *spit* *spit*

Lawmakers Could Consider Gas Tax Hike, After Gas Tax Holiday Fails

Drill now, drill deep, drill often.

Boxer, Feinstein and Pelosi piss me the hell off every time they open their mouths saying Californians don't want to drill. I want drilling rigs, refineries and nuke plants now.

278 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:03:53am

re: #264 pingjockey

I swear the Sunday NYT is the biggest pile of paper I have ever seen. Take 2 of the Sunday Seattle paper to make one of it.

The NYT is a pale shadow of what it used to be.

279 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:03:54am

re: #261 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

So much for tolerance;

Obama camp denies New Yorker writer plane seat

That didn't take too long.

280 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:03:58am

re: #268 alegrias
Why do I get the idea Sestak(i keep wanting to write sleestak) was a Klintoon admiral like Weasley was a Klintoon general. All politics, no substance. Read pc flag officer.

281 cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:04:30am

re: #274 cygnus

Including all the advertising inserts. I have to go through and toss all that stuff just to get to the actual paper (Seattle Times and Everett Herald).

re: #274 cygnus

Including all the advertising inserts? I have to go through and toss all that stuff just to get to the actual paper (Seattle Times and Everett Herald).

PIMF

282 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:04:44am

re: #264 pingjockey

I swear the Sunday NYT is the biggest pile of paper I have ever seen. Take 2 of the Sunday Seattle paper to make one of it.

It may be thick but, it's shrunk in width fairly recently.

283 MarineMomSue  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:05:12am

re: #16 joncelli

Let's give the NYT the benefit of a doubt. Let's say the opinion piece by McCain doesn't meet their editorial standards. Let's give them that excuse once. Let McCain's people rewrite the piece according to the NYT's critique. Then if they reject it again, the NYT has no more excuses, and we can go medieval on them.

Surely, you can't be serious?

I am curious, however. I'd like to know if obama was asked to 'rewrite' his piece to meet the 'standards' of the nyt, before they happily published every word of it?

My gut feeling is that obama's op piece fit perfectly with the nyt 'standards'.
*spit*

284 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:05:14am

re: #266 jcm

*spit* *spit* *spit*

Lawmakers Could Consider Gas Tax Hike, After Gas Tax Holiday Fails

Either they are so completely stupid that they think raising the gas tax will lower gas prices, or they want the economy to tank before November so people will vote for "change".
While they're dumb, I don't quite think most are as dumb to think that raising the gas tax will help oil prices.

285 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:05:27am

re: #260 JammieWearingFool

You're more than welcome; I was a bit worried.

286 Kenneth  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:05:28am

When is a mirror not a mirror?

NYT Op-Ed editor David Shipley: 'It would be terrific to have an article from Senator McCain that mirrors Senator Obama's piece. To that end, the article would have to articulate, in concrete terms, how Senator McCain defines victory in Iraq.'

BUT! Obama's NYT op-ed did not define victory.

While McCain's rejected op-ed DOES define victory:

I will continue implementing a proven counterinsurgency strategy not only in Iraq but also in Afghanistan with the goal of creating stable, secure, self-sustaining democratic allies.

287 LindaMarie  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:05:45am

re: #276 karmic_inquisitor

Stick to the high road McCain,
let them on the plane, just make then (NYT) sit in the jump seat the whole time buckled up and uncomfortable.

288 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:05:54am

re: #274 cygnus
I'm over here on the eastside of the Cascades and actually got a phone call from the NYT about a subscription last year. Laughed my ass off at the poor fool on the other end of the phone.

289 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:06:00am

re: #261 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

So much for tolerance;

Obama camp denies New Yorker writer plane seat

* * *
How can his partisan campaign bar someone from a Congressional Delegation, federally funded air plane trip they say this is?

290 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:06:00am

re: #276 karmic_inquisitor

This is the sort of thing that will get Drudge to turn on Obama.

Politicians are all ego-maniacal. Obama brings it to a new level by barring reporters in this manner. One wonders what will happen in the White House - will critical reporters be barred from press conferences?

They won't get the chance to go to the press conferences; they'll be in the re-education camps with the rest of us.
/slightly sarc

291 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:06:21am

re: #275 Occasional Reader

The "gas tax holiday" was a lousy idea anyway, IMHO. (Don't know about a tax hike, though.)

Yep they buy us (collectively) off with the rebate and talk of a holiday. While increase the hidden taxes of user fees etc... and never touch real tax reform.

292 Wendya  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:06:27am

re: #284 Kosh's Shadow

they are so completely stupid

That about sums it up.

293 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:06:40am

re: #214 formercorpsman

We are in serious trouble if the entire MSM continues like this. They don't have to cover McCain if they don't want to. They don't have to acknowledge him or print his editorials. It looks like there's only one candidate running and there's not much McCain can do about it.

294 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:07:26am
295 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:07:38am

re: #284 Kosh's Shadow

Either they are so completely stupid that they think raising the gas tax will lower gas prices, or they want the economy to tank before November so people will vote for "change".
While they're dumb, I don't quite think most are as dumb to think that raising the gas tax will help oil prices.

They are so locked into solutions to problems involve taxing it they can't think of anything else.

296 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:07:47am

We have a 'state' media. It is in the tank for obambi.

297 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:08:00am

re: #277 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Drill now, drill deep, drill often.

Boxer, Feinstein and Pelosi piss me the hell off every time they open their mouths saying Californians don't want to drill. I want drilling rigs, refineries and nuke plants now.

Me, too! Me, too!

298 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:08:14am

After reading Eric Raymond's article about setting off his "Never Again!" radar, and thinking about the crowds' reactions at BO's appearances...

and now seeing the major press is going full-bore as well...

I think the time has arrived for me to start calling him The Fascist Tool Barack Obama.

299 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:08:27am
300 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:09:03am

re: #295 jcm
Rush talking about this nonsense now.

301 pat  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:09:48am

There is also the subliminal message that McCain is a simpleton.

302 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:09:56am

re: #295 jcm

They are so locked into solutions to problems involve taxing it they can't think of anything else.

We need a stupidity tax for politicians. We already have one for everyone else (the lottery)

303 CIA Reject  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:10:52am

re: #284 Kosh's Shadow

Either they are so completely stupid that they think raising the gas tax will lower gas prices, or they want the economy to tank before November so people will vote for "change".
While they're dumb, I don't quite think most are as dumb to think that raising the gas tax will help oil prices.

They are sh*tting pickles that the free market is working and the oil bubble may, if not burst completely, at lease seriously deflate before the election. Can't have that, doesn't fit the message. So they jack the tax....

CHANGE!

304 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:10:53am

re: #280 pingjockey

Why do I get the idea Sestak(i keep wanting to write sleestak) was a Klintoon admiral like Weasley was a Klintoon general. All politics, no substance. Read pc flag officer.

* * *
You said it! From wikipedia, Obama's fawning admiral was a Clinton guy...a director on our white house National Security Council....

"...In July 1993 , Sestak became the head of the Strategy and Concepts Branch in the office of the Chief of Naval Operations. From November 1994 to March 1997, he was the Director for Defense Policy on the National Security Council staff at the White House, where he was responsible for national security and defense strategy, policies, programs, inter-agency and congressional coordination and regional political-military advice. In May 1997, he became the commander of Destroyer Squadron 14.[2]


Vice Admiral SestakSestak then directed the CNO's Strategy and Policy Division (N51), and led the Navy's efforts toward the 2000 Quadrennial Defense Review, for which he analyzed the economic value of U.S. defense spending. After September 11th, he became the first director of the Navy Operations Group (Deep Blue), which sought to redefine strategic, operational and budgetary policies in the Global War on Terrorism. He reported directly to chief of naval operations Vern Clark as policy adviser and administrator. Sestak told The Hill that as the designated policy adviser and administrator to Clark, it was his job to revamp the Navy, a process that necessarily ruffled feathers. “Change is very challenging,” Sestak said. “It did not sit well with a lot of people...I worked hard, and I did not ask anyone to work harder than me."[4]

In the summer of 2005, Sestak was administratively reassigned from his position as DCNO. His removal was one of the first changes made by Adm. Michael Mullen when he took over as Chief of Naval Operations (CNO) in July, according to Navy Times...."

305 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:10:56am

re: #210 ec marm
Hi EC! Well in some ways it is a "fight" between Urban/Suburban America and Suburban/Rural America. But not for what I would consider nefarious reasons.
First , I believe that the OVERWHELMING majority of Black American's live in urban/suburban settings and their passion for Obama - as evidenced by his carrying more than 90% of the vote in ALL the Dem primaries - gives Obama a big boost in Urban America.
Secondly, While Urban America doesn't think the price of a gallon of gas is going to adversely affect them; they have public transportation - subways, busses and the like but they know that EVERYTHING anyone in Urban America eats or drinks (except tap water) has to be delivered to their stores by Trucks.
Third, ecomomicially, the job losses in Detroit and in the financial sector DO hit Urban America more than in Rural America, because Urban/suburban workers are the ones who will lose their jobs in this economy far more than folks in Rural America.
Lastly, while more Latino voters are apt to vote Republican, most of those who aren't hiding out in Sanctuary cities, do work in the agricultural and construction fields in Rural/Suburban America and they do live where they work (e.g., North Carolina has the fourth largest population of illegals in the US). So they sort of fit in the Republican/Rural area.

The foregoing is an obviously facile attempt by me to comprehend what EC does see: this IS shaping up to be an Urban vs. Suburban/Rural election and I'm sure I've overlooked a few things (gun owners/hunters tending towards Suburban/Rural and the like) and of course the pitch isn't even - there are Republicans in Urban America and Democrats in Rural America.

306 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:10:57am

re: #300 pingjockey

Rush talking about this nonsense now.

Listening now....
Congress are such utter tools.

307 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:10:59am

Eric Raymond's article

308 Russkilitlover  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:11:39am

re: #247 Cognito

Which is?

Well, you DO have a reputation around here as a defender of the media and especially media bias. So this topic should be right up your alley - En Garde!

309 Captain Hate  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:12:03am

If the Slimes wanted this to be read by nobody, all they had to do was publish it. Now it's headline news on the evil innerwebbzz being read by everybody.

310 J.S.  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:12:29am

re: #296 pingjockey

Although, i think it has "gone global" -- i don't know of any media, anywhere, that doesn't bow down to the Obamanation.

311 ec marm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:12:30am

re: #275 Occasional Reader

The "gas tax holiday" was a lousy idea anyway, IMHO. (Don't know about a tax hike, though.)


The only thing I can figure is that the Dems in Congress think that approval ratings are like golf scores, the lower the better.

312 Aylios  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:13:15am

Just finished reading the McCain ed on Drudge.

All I can say is 'f-ing A USA!' for creating a modern country where before there was a vicious cesspit, because that's what seems increasingly certain (unless Obama gets the presidency, in which case all bets are off).

And boy am I getting sick of me fellow european dipsticks, who have all been brainwashed into thinking Obama's some kind of messiah and that McCain is "just like Bush". Anyone have a green card they don't need?

313 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:13:20am

re: #304 alegrias
"Administratively reassigned=kicked to the curb for being an incompetent tool.

314 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:13:58am

Checklist for Green peace "Anti-Diesel" protest; TV Cameras, protestors, Soviet-Era Diesel boat, Diesel Fuel

The 72-metre ship will arrive off Airlie Beach tomorrow as Greenpeace ramps up its protest over the proposed mine near wetlands and national parks adjacent to the Great Barrier Reef.

But QER director of corporate affairs Simon Eldridge today said it was hypocritical that Greenpeace was powering its "Soviet-era ship" that relies on diesel, to come to an area to protest against the production of diesel.

"They will be emitting CO2 as they go, but somehow they don't acknowledge the irony or hypocrisy of their actions," Mr Eldridge said.

"If Greenpeace is so strongly opposed to the production and use of diesel fuels, then it should at the very least change its entire fleet to be powered solely by solar, wind or hydrogen.

"It is very unlikely Greenpeace would elect to do that because the reality is that, for at least the foreseeable future, there are no viable alternative fuels for use in long-distance heavy transport vehicles."

315 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:14:00am

re: #310 J.S.
Damn scary.

316 Wendya  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:14:21am

re: #301 pat

There is also the subliminal message that McCain is a simpleton.

The left always characterizes Republicans as drooling idiots (they're playing the Alzheimer's card on leftists sites). They honestly believe they are far more intelligent than the rest of us and must be put into office so they can protect us from our own stupidity.

Of course, there are morons on the right but they are outnumbered by those on the left by a very, very wide margin. The difference is, we don't want to pass laws to save them from their own ignorance.

317 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:14:41am

re: #308 Russkilitlover

Well, you DO have a reputation around here as a defender of the media and especially media bias. So this topic should be right up your alley - En Garde!

Except, inconveniently, I don't defend media bias. I've always said it's there and it's outrageous.

So. You know. Coup deja lance, I suppose.

318 pat  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:15:28am

re: #316 Wendya

The left always characterizes Republicans as drooling idiots (they're playing the Alzheimer's card on leftists sites). They honestly believe they are far more intelligent than the rest of us and must be put into office so they can protect us from our own stupidity.

Of course, there are morons on the right but they are outnumbered by those on the left by a very, very wide margin. The difference is, we don't want to pass laws to save them from their own ignorance.

Very true.

319 Blastforth  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:15:35am

re: #286 Kenneth

A definition of victory acceptable to the NYT would be something impossible to attain, i.e. "A free, stable Iraq that is guaranteed never to falter."

They must have defeat because a victory would vindicate Bush's policy, and that they cannot have.

320 Spiny Norman  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:16:32am

re: #203 Kenneth

...thus proving that Shipley is a hypocrite.

Hypocrite? No, Shipley is a lying shill.

321 wiffersnapper  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:16:44am

Liberal tolerance on parade

322 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:17:03am

re: #314 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Don't you realize, you little peon you, it is intentions, not results! Like manbearpig flying around in his private jet. They are better than us little people. I don't need a tag do I?

323 quickjustice  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:18:01am

re: #263 Pyrocles

But they make money off their print edition. Whether the electronic readership is the same or not, the revenues aren't there.

324 Iron Fist  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:18:05am

re: #266 jcm,

Because gas is too cheap if plebians like yourself can still afford it. Gas should only be for the wealthy. Just ask Al Gore.

325 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:18:40am

re: #319 Blastforth

A definition of victory acceptable to the NYT would be something impossible to attain, i.e. "A free, stable Iraq that is guaranteed never to falter."

They must have defeat because a victory would vindicate Bush's policy, and that they cannot have.

They are more slippery than that. The Times now defines victory under Obama as getting out with minimal casualties and victory under anybody else as an ongoing demilitarized love fest.

326 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:18:43am

re: #322 pingjockey

Don't you realize, you little peon you, it is intentions, not results! Like manbearpig flying around in his private jet. They are better than us little people. I don't need a tag do I?

If it truly is intentions, not results, then I've had more sex than Ron Jeremy.

327 Captain Hate  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:19:16am

re: #312 Aylios

Anyone have a green card they don't need?

I know some people I'd love to kick out and let you take their place. A current whole plane-load of them in fact.

328 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:19:19am

re: #326 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Mwahahahaha!

329 HoosierHoops  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:20:54am

re: #166 lifeofthemind

Hey I thought were all Mandy now. Do I have to go back to being me again?

/I'm staying Mandy all week..I need the break.

330 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:21:27am

re: #327 Captain Hate
Wouldn't it be a hoot if some sort of exotic bug got loose on the plane and they all had to be quarantined?!

331 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:21:36am

re: #291 jcm

Yep they buy us (collectively) off with the rebate and talk of a holiday. While increase the hidden taxes of user fees etc... and never touch real tax reform.

* * *
Any tax holiday is always a good idea, it reinforces that taxes are IMPOSED by democrats, and lowered by antitax republicans.

Tax holidays are win win for consumers.

Voters need reminding who IMPOSED taxes on them, and who removes taxes.

332 Blastforth  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:22:02am

Re update:

"Op-ed pages are for debate, but if you get only one side, that’s not debate. And that’s not healthy."

NYT, The Public Editor, CLARK HOYT, June 24, 2007

333 gearhead  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:22:25am

What are they afraid of? Increasing their readership?

334 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:22:28am

re: #284 Kosh's Shadow
No, they think of gasoline the way they think of cigarettes - hike the taxes, make it more expensive, consumers will use less of it.
Stupid, but I fear, true.

335 songbird  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:22:59am

re: #329 HoosierHoops

Greetings and Salutations

336 Captain Hate  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:23:22am

re: #330 pingjockey

Wouldn't it be a hoot if some sort of exotic bug got loose on the plane and they all had to be quarantined?!

I think the market would hit 20000 for starters.

337 JohnnyReb  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:23:52am

re: #272 lawhawk

Charles, I've got one better for you. It is the NYT defense of the publication of that op-ed by Yousef.

Well they got the first paragraph completely wrong, didn't they? They are no longer important.

"THE op-ed page of The New York Times is perhaps the nation’s most important forum for airing opinions on the most contentious issues of the day — the war in Iraq, abortion, global warming and more."

338 Occasional Reader  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:26:16am

re: #272 lawhawk

Charles, I've got one better for you. It is the NYT defense of the publication of that op-ed by Yousef.

"The danger of the one-sided debate"... great find, lawhawk.

339 jordash1212  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:26:23am

This is exactly what is wrong with the press. They have such an easy time building up Obama, but when you listen to what he has to say it's not really anything substantial. The media needs to play a bigger role in this election by starting to debate between candidates and their respective parties.

340 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:26:26am
341 Pyrocles  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:26:35am

That's what I figured. Do they have a paid subscription option on their Web site? I really don't want to check myself... Would pollute my browser :(

re: #323 quickjustice

But they make money off their print edition. Whether the electronic readership is the same or not, the revenues aren't there.

342 HoosierHoops  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:27:18am

re: #335 songbird

Greetings and Salutations


{Songbird}
How is life treating you?

343 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:27:27am

re: #324 Iron Fist

,

Because gas is too cheap if plebians like yourself can still afford it. Gas should only be for the wealthy. Just ask Al Gore.

Let Algore take the kids to daycare, appointments etc... then. Won't even get into what it takes for a foster kid, we get medically fragile ones with our medical backgrounds, lots of running around with those kids.

Seattle's mayor took this chauffeur driven caddy to make an announcement about making Seattle car free, transit only. I wrote that tool an nice letter asking how I'm took take 3 kids under 4, one a medically fragile infant around Seattle to 4 different appointments on a 34° day with wind and rain and if I'm supposed to wait at bus stops.

The fucking elitists come up with this crap while a nanny takes care of the kids, a chauffeur driven car is on standby, and a the cook is fixing dinner.

Let they take damn near 40% of my income in taxes, think I'm rich and tell me how to live.

The break point is near for a lot of folks. Let's hope the revolution is at the ballot box.

344 nyc redneck  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:27:35am

re: #267 Cartman

The MSM is dropping the gloves. There's no pretense whatsoever left as to their intentions. They want/need Barry elected in the worst kind of way. Don't expect to see a shred of impartiality or objectivity from here on out through election night. They've gone full-bore from reporting on a presidential race, to actively promoting and endorsing a candidate and stifling his opponents views. Welcome to a brave, new world folks.

that is exactly what is happening.
i'm hoping it gets so blatant and obvious that people will notice it.
that kind of shilling is ugly. a lot of people won't like it.

345 Son of the Black Dog  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:28:02am

re: #229 mingjaiyo

... a shareholder revolt at the Times ...

Problem is that the Times has two classes of stock. The family controls the voting stock, so the majority of the shareowners have no effective way of influencing corporate decisions - even less than in most corporations. The family members don't realy care what happens to the publicly traded stock. They can take their money out as salaries and expense accounts, and leave the ordinary shareowners up a creek.

346 ec marm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:28:17am

Damn - guess I gotta reboot my computer, somethings obviously not working right. I went to check on Cognito's comments and the big red minus number next to them is missing.

347 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:28:18am

re: #339 jordash1212

This is exactly what is wrong with the press. They have such an easy time building up MARKETING Obama, but when you listen to what he has to say it's not really anything substantial. The media needs to play a bigger role in this election by starting to debate between candidates and their respective parties.

* * *
Fixed that for you. Media is MARKETING Obama, not consumer reporting on him.

348 songbird  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:28:27am

re: #342 HoosierHoops

{Songbird}
How is life treating you?

Reasonably. Two weeks left before I start Teaching again. Honestly, I'm looking forward to it!

349 Russkilitlover  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:28:59am

re: #317 Cognito

Except, inconveniently, I don't defend media bias. I've always said it's there and it's outrageous.
blockquote>

Nice channeling of Obama.

350 Jinx  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:29:02am

The so-called "Fairness Doctrine" come to mind? For libs, it's a one way street.

As someone else pointed out. This should be counted as a direct contribution to the Obama campaign and the NYT should be fined accordingly.

351 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:29:25am

re: #331 alegrias

* * *
Any tax holiday is always a good idea, it reinforces that taxes are IMPOSED by democrats, and lowered by antitax republicans.

Tax holidays are win win for consumers.

Voters need reminding who IMPOSED taxes on them, and who removes taxes.

I have to disagree, a tax holiday is bribe, something to buy us off instead of Congress doing they damn jobs. Revocation of the gas tax I'd go for, a tax holiday is putting a bandaid on a gunshot wound to the chest.

352 Arbalest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:29:47am

The crux from the second update to this thread (the written words of Clark Hoyt):

“The point of the op-ed page is advocacy. And, Rosenthal said, “we do not feel the obligation to provide the kind of balance you find in news coverage, because it is opinion.””

Does this also mean, Mr. Rosenthal, that, when you offer others the opportunity to write a rebuttal, you “feel no obligation” to print their rebuttal opinion if you don’t like it?

353 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:30:16am

re: #339 jordash1212

This is exactly what is wrong with the press. They have such an easy time building up Obama, but when you listen to what he has to say it's not really anything substantial. The media WOMENS LEAGUE OF VOTERS needs to play a bigger role in this election by starting to debate between candidates and their respective parties.

* * *
Fixed that for you. Anyone else remember when bluehaired ladies of the Womens League of Voters ran the presidential "Debates" and they were serious debates?

Or am I dreaming?

354 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:30:26am

re: #349 Russkilitlover

Be like McCain, then. Cite examples of my defense of bias.

355 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:31:55am

re: #346 ec marm

Hey EC - I did my best to answer your question and yet still post it in time for it to be read by anyone (that is, I was afraid Charles would put up another thread while I was laboring over that one) at #305.

356 Nevergiveup  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:32:03am

re: #350 Jinx

The so-called "Fairness Doctrine" come to mind? For libs, it's a one way street.

As someone else pointed out. This should be counted as a direct contribution to the Obama campaign and the NYT should be fined accordingly.

re: #350 Jinx

Didn't the NYT do something similar or that was tantamount to a campaign contibution a few months ago?

357 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:32:09am

re: #346 ec marm

Damn - guess I gotta reboot my computer, somethings obviously not working right. I went to check on Cognito's comments and the big red minus number next to them is missing.

LOL!

358 Occasional Reader  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:32:11am

re: #286 Kenneth

BUT! Obama's NYT op-ed did not define victory.

Gah! Totally missing the point! You are completely ignoring Obama's innovative "defeat, no matter what" strategy.

359 Jinx  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:32:11am

re: #16 joncelli

Let's give the NYT the benefit of a doubt. Let's say the opinion piece by McCain doesn't meet their editorial standards. Let's give them that excuse once. Let McCain's people rewrite the piece according to the NYT's critique. Then if they reject it again, the NYT has no more excuses, and we can go medieval on them.

No, we're not going to give them the benefit of a doubt. You can go to the Drudge Report and click on the red hyperlink and read McCain's submitted op-ed in its entirety. Then you can point out where it didn't meet editorial standards.

360 Russkilitlover  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:32:46am

re: #354 Cognito

Be like McCain, then. Cite examples of my defense of bias.

It's not your defense of bias, it's your defense of media and your refusal to SEE bias. But you can have your opinion and fare well. You can call the sky green all you want - I know it's blue and arguing you out of green is a waste of my time.

361 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:32:56am

re: #356 Nevergiveup

That was the publication of the Betray-Us ads by Moveon.org for below market rate prices.

362 JohnnyReb  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:33:18am

re: #343 jcm

Let Algore take the kids to daycare, appointments etc... then. Won't even get into what it takes for a foster kid, we get medically fragile ones with our medical backgrounds, lots of running around with those kids.

Seattle's mayor took this chauffeur driven caddy to make an announcement about making Seattle car free, transit only. I wrote that tool an nice letter asking how I'm took take 3 kids under 4, one a medically fragile infant around Seattle to 4 different appointments on a 34° day with wind and rain and if I'm supposed to wait at bus stops.

The fucking elitists come up with this crap while a nanny takes care of the kids, a chauffeur driven car is on standby, and a the cook is fixing dinner.

Let they take damn near 40% of my income in taxes, think I'm rich and tell me how to live.

The break point is near for a lot of folks. Let's hope the revolution is at the ballot box.


Here in New England, this winter will be the breakpoint if heating oil doesn't come down from over $5 a gallon. About $1250 to fill a tank with 250 gallons and the average house uses about 750 gallons a season for a grand total of $3750 to heat a house. People are already saying they can't afford both a mortgage payment and a heating bill at the same time come this winter.

363 mattm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:33:29am

re: #11 kynna

Blatant. At least they're not pretending to be a news organization anymore. Gotta give them that.

They haven't been a news organization for years. Since Bush took office. "All the news that we want you to read, in out PC form"

364 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:33:37am

re: #359 Jinx

No, we're not going to give them the benefit of a doubt. You can go to the Drudge Report and click on the red hyperlink and read McCain's submitted op-ed in its entirety. Then you can point out where it didn't meet editorial standards.

It doesn't meet editorial standards.....
It contains some conservative ideas, strictly verboten at NYT.

365 Nevergiveup  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:33:49am

re: #361 lawhawk

That was the publication of the Betray-Us ads by Moveon.org for below market rate prices.

Right--thanks.

366 ec marm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:33:59am

re: #355 realwest
I read it, dinged you up. Couldn't disagree with one point. You must have been clickin' away like a fiend.

367 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:34:01am

re: #360 Russkilitlover

All righty.

368 HoosierHoops  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:34:03am

re: #348 songbird

Reasonably. Two weeks left before I start Teaching again. Honestly, I'm looking forward to it!

Teaching music? what's not to like?
/ I'll bet you wake up and go..oh boy..for work today i think we'll just play music..
So Jealous..

369 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:34:48am
370 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:35:04am

re: #351 jcm

I have to disagree, a tax holiday is bribe, something to buy us off instead of Congress doing they damn jobs. Revocation of the gas tax I'd go for, a tax holiday is putting a bandaid on a gunshot wound to the chest.

* * *
Agreed, reprieving taxes is best.

However, just the talk of removing taxes is progress.

Reminding people their taxes are decided and imposed arbitrarily by (usually democrat) politicians is also good.

Republicans and conservatives want you to keep more of your money, is a good message to convey in these times.

371 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:35:29am

re: #345 Son of the Black Dog

Problem is that the Times has two classes of stock. The family controls the voting stock, so the majority of the shareowners have no effective way of influencing corporate decisions - even less than in most corporations. The family members don't realy care what happens to the publicly traded stock. They can take their money out as salaries and expense accounts, and leave the ordinary shareowners up a creek.

What else does Sulzberger own that we could wreck?

372 Killian Bundy  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:35:51am

NBC News Refers to Obama's Trip as 'Tour of Duty'

It's bad enough that Barack Obama's trip to the Middle East is getting an insane amount of MSM coverage (the three big network news anchors? Whoa!); now, NBC News believes it apt to compare Obama's sojourn to ... an actual military tour of duty. Yes indeed. Check out at right how anchor Lester Holt introduces last evening's Nightly News.

/media outlets fighting over who gets to lick Obama's ass crack

373 itellu3times  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:36:22am

re: #20 harrylook

So, that's what they mean by All the News That's Fit to Print.

All the news that fits, they print.

374 Nevergiveup  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:36:26am

re: #371 MandyManners

What else does Sulzberger own that we could wreck?

Don't worry, he is doing a pretty good job wrecking the NYTs himself.

375 Barking Pumpkin  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:36:42am

The Times new slogan should be:
"All The News That Fits (Our Agenda), We Print."

376 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:36:45am

re: #362 JohnnyReb

Here in New England, this winter will be the breakpoint if heating oil doesn't come down from over $5 a gallon. About $1250 to fill a tank with 250 gallons and the average house uses about 750 gallons a season for a grand total of $3750 to heat a house. People are already saying they can't afford both a mortgage payment and a heating bill at the same time come this winter.

I was listening to some oil industry analysts recently, they said some of the know offshore oil fields could be online in as little as 12 months. The fields where we know there is oil but where shut down. Just the announcement we are going to do it would drop the price of oil substantially.

377 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:36:45am

re: #372 Killian Bundy
That is obscene.

378 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:36:52am
379 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:37:08am

re: #356 Nevergiveup

re: #350 Jinx

Didn't the NYT do something similar or that was tantamount to a campaign contibution a few months ago?

Moveon.org's attack on Gen. Petraues (sp?) in an ad.

380 lobo91  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:37:14am

re: #352 Arbalest

Does this also mean, Mr. Rosenthal, that, when you offer others the opportunity to write a rebuttal, you “feel no obligation” to print their rebuttal opinion if you don’t like it?

Yes, that's exactly what it means.

381 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:37:15am
382 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:37:42am

re: #324 Iron Fist Hey bro', I really liked my answer in #334 better. And, as I said in my #305, to the extent this IS a war between Urban/Rural America, American's who live in Urban areas with public transportation are MUCH less affected (not really, but they think they are) by rising gasoline prices.
That's the bad news.
The good news is any increase in gas taxes will have to be proposed by Democrats and that fact should not be lost on Suburban voters - who not infrequently HAVE to drive a car to work, to shop, etc.
So maybe this shapes up as Urban vs. Suburban and Rural voters.

383 Killian Bundy  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:38:15am

re: #345 Son of the Black Dog

The family members don't realy care what happens to the publicly traded stock.

They report earnings this week. I bet they'll miss on earnings big time.

/bought me some OCT 15 puts this morning

384 Spider Mensch  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:38:22am

re: #372 Killian Bundy

NBC News Refers to Obama's Trip as 'Tour of Duty'

It's bad enough that Barack Obama's trip to the Middle East is getting an insane amount of MSM coverage (the three big network news anchors? Whoa!); now, NBC News believes it apt to compare Obama's sojourn to ... an actual military tour of duty. Yes indeed. Check out at right how anchor Lester Holt introduces last evening's Nightly News.

/media outlets fighting over who gets to lick Obama's ass crack

yup and after he loses all they'll have is a funny colored tongue and a bad taste in their mouth....like always!

385 Meremortal  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:38:24am

I take it this means McCain's op-ed takes Obama apart pretty well.

386 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:38:53am

re: #381 buzzsawmonkey
I meant comparing the camp trip to a tour of duty, not that the media want to lick his ass. That is accurate for sure.

387 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:39:03am

re: #372 Killian Bundy

When The Fascist Tool Barack Obama can prove that he saw front-line action in a combat zone, then I'll believe he's done a "tour of duty."

388 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:39:07am
389 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:39:21am

re: #379 MandyManners

Moveon.org's attack on Gen. Petraues (sp?) in an ad.

* * *
NYT gave Moveon.org the discounted, preferred opinion rate, to attack General Petraeus in September while he testified in Congress.

Willkommen, bienvenue, welcome,
To NYTimes
Where we do slimes
4-U

390 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:39:30am

re: #374 Nevergiveup

Don't worry, he is doing a pretty good job wrecking the NYTs himself.

As long as he and his family keep on sucking money out of it, he doesn't care.

391 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:39:32am

Caption of the day: Yahoo pic

Palestinians stand in a warehouse full of food supplies supplied by the UN Relief and Works Agency, (UNRWA), at a distribution station in the Shati refugee camp, in Gaza City, Monday, July, 21, 2008. Israel imposed a partial blockade on Gaza in response to rocket fire from the territory on southern Israel. A cease-fire currently in effect has decreased the rocket fire and has led Israel to increase the trickle of goods entering Gaza.


A cease fire leads to reduced rocket attacks? Go figure.

392 quickjustice  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:39:59am

The N.Y. Times already is in a death spiral. Murdoch is positioning the Wall Street Journal to take them on head-to-head.

At this point, only elite liberal opinion in New York cares about the N.Y. Times. And it is that audience only of which McCain is being deprived.

McCain's people really should figure this out, and make the case that they don't need N.Y. elite liberal opinion to win the election. They're wasting their time fighting this battle except to the extent they prove to conservatives that the N.Y. Times doesn't like McCain despite its prior endorsement of him.

393 Jinx  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:40:14am

re: #160 MandyManners

Do so when they're in Bumfucked, Idaho, too.

That place is actually called Ogden, Utah.

But I disagree with locking them out. That would seem like he's throwing a tantrum--and McCain has a history with his temper. No need to give Obama more ammo.

394 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:40:22am
395 songbird  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:40:37am

re: #368 HoosierHoops

Teaching music? what's not to like?
/ I'll bet you wake up and go..oh boy..for work today i think we'll just play music..
So Jealous..

Seriously, I get to sing and play piano all day!

But.....there are some kids I'd like to string up! I have an amazing 8th grade choir coming up, and a VERY lively 7th grade group. The 6th graders are the unknown factor.

396 pat  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:40:40am

re: #376 jcm

I was listening to some oil industry analysts recently, they said some of the know offshore oil fields could be online in as little as 12 months. The fields where we know there is oil but where shut down. Just the announcement we are going to do it would drop the price of oil substantially.

We could put about 100,000 barrels in play just by opening the closed wells in Santa Barbara. SB has 20 active wells now. That could double in a few months.

397 Spider Mensch  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:40:49am

re: #388 buzzsawmonkey

Read it at Drudge. McCain fillets Obama like a brook trout.


speaking of drudge..anyone seen this yet...
[Link: hypemovie.com...]

it is linked off of drudge.

398 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:41:07am

re: #389 alegrias

Willkommen, bienvenue, welcome,
To NYTimes
Where we do slimes
4-U

Is it time to start singing "The Future Belongs to Me" yet?

399 Nevergiveup  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:41:07am

re: #390 MandyManners

As long as he and his family keep on sucking money out of it, he doesn't care.

Well it ain't no bottomless pit. Their gonna hit a hard floor one of these days.

400 Josephine  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:41:14am

McCain's piece is very good.

This is excellent:

"Senator Obama has said that he would consult our commanders on the ground and Iraqi leaders, but he did no such thing before releasing his 'plan for Iraq.' Perhaps that’s because he doesn’t want to hear what they have to say. During the course of eight visits to Iraq, I have heard many times from our troops what Major General Jeffrey Hammond, commander of coalition forces in Baghdad, recently said: that leaving based on a timetable would be 'very dangerous.'”

401 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:42:20am

re: #393 Jinx

That place is actually called Ogden, Utah.

But I disagree with locking them out. That would seem like he's throwing a tantrum--and McCain has a history with his temper. No need to give Obama more ammo.

Revoke their current White House press corps passes.

402 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:42:44am

re: #344 nyc redneck I agree with you and with Cartman, but as someone pointed out (sorry, can't remember who or where) out here on LGF, some 49% of poll respondent's said they thought the Media was too pro-Obama.
The NYT - as is it's habit these days - probably boosted that to well over half with this stupidity of theirs.
I don't have the link to the Washington Post handy, but I'll bet that today or tomorrow they will weigh in on this bullshit and come down against the NYT position.

403 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:42:52am

re: #398 victor_yugo

Is it time to start singing "The Future Belongs to Me" yet?

* * *
He will speak in Berlin at the Seigessaeule Hall...

Ja, est ist Zeit.
Der Kampaign wahr sehr Gross.
Ich bin der President.

404 Kenneth  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:42:54am

re: #372 Killian Bundy

Tour of Duty?

I guess Obama is a decorated veteran now...

405 A.W.  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:43:13am

Ah, come on. Are we really surprised?

Nope, not here, but its nice to see them exposed badly enough that even my libs friends can understand it.

406 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:43:13am

re: #378 taxfreekiller

Cognito

So, now that you did all that work and its done, take a moment and
let us know what you think of John F. Kerry's life and what you think of his awards and citations.

I think he's a Great American Hero. I have petitioned Hasbro to reconfigure its G.I. Joe line of figurines to reflect the stages of Senator Kerry's heroism: I call the four figures Lt. Yale, Agent Amphibious, Winter Soldier, and Colonel Catch-up.

Should I add your name to the petition?

407 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:43:17am
408 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:44:15am
409 Eric Cartman's Conscience  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:44:18am

As a business I have no problem with the NYT choosing not to run the editorial. I'd prefer they started admitting publicly that they are a left-wing organ (who really doesn't already know that), but they still can choose their content. Conservative complaints about these douchers running this and not running that smacks of the fairness doctrine. It's the POS New York Times! Why should we be surprised or care!?

410 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:44:39am

re: #404 Kenneth

Tour of Duty?

I guess Obama is a decorated veteran now...

* * *
Democrat Purple Hearts can't be too far behind...

411 kansas  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:44:56am

re: #119 mossley

Now that's bad. Along with gas prices going up, and the Dow Jones dropping the Times stock has tanked since the Democrats took over.

412 zombie  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:45:07am

re: #369 buzzsawmonkey

I think what we're seeing in the media is this:

The New York Times and the MSM are playing for the endgame. They're so convinced of Obama's unstoppable victory in November, that they feel they don't need to puff him up in every single article. They have room for play. So what they're doing is this: They're training Obama to be their poodle once he's already in office. On one day they'll push his candidacy like a professional PR firm. And then without warning, they'll unleash a brief but painful torrent of criticism.

It's the way a dominant "top" treats a submissive "bottom" in a sado-masochistic relationship. And it's been proven to be an effective way to make the submissive partner live in fear, and to essentially make him your dog. He'll jump to your tune, just to avoid those painful outbursts.

The NY Times and their high-level MSM cohorts want control over Obama once he's in the White House. This is their way of doing it. And it's based on their absolute conviction that he's going to win anyway, so they aren't required to be his cheerleader all the time.

413 rlevitin  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:45:20am

re: #411 kansas

Now that's bad. Along with gas prices going up, and the Dow Jones dropping the Times stock has tanked since the Democrats took over.

It's up today though, about 3 points.

414 Russkilitlover  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:45:35am

re: #406 Cognito

Now THAT's funny! LOL! Kerry action doll figures! Only if it comes with a set of stick pins.

415 rlevitin  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:45:47am

re: #413 rlevitin

4%, 0.5 points.

416 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:46:01am

re: #397 Spider Mensch

Hmmmm, These "documentaries" usually have very little effect. This one looks a little low on substance and is just accusations.

417 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:46:19am

re: #362 JohnnyReb
But the real question is, JohnnyReb, who are they going to blame for this state of affairs - the Republicans or the Dems.
I'm afraid Repubs cause Bush is President; the fact that he ok'd offshore drilling and Congress smacked it down is gonna be lost on most presidential voters, I'm afraid.

418 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:46:59am
419 kansas  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:47:18am

re: #413 rlevitin

It's up today though, about 3 points.

What's up 3 points?

420 HoosierHoops  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:47:36am

re: #395 songbird

Seriously, I get to sing and play piano all day!

But.....there are some kids I'd like to string up! I have an amazing 8th grade choir coming up, and a VERY lively 7th grade group. The 6th graders are the unknown factor.

Let me have you're choir for a day and they'd be singing Black Dog by led zep..
I'm terrible like that...
/kind regards songbird
BBL

421 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:47:52am

re: #407 taxfreekiller
Jon Halp uz Kary is a lying peice of shit, an aider and abettor of the enemy, a slanderer of his comrades and an all around low life bastard.
His awards include the Duranty award for lying above and beyond the call of duty; The Weasley Clark ribbon for stretching the truth, and the Jane Fonda medal for aiding Americas enemies.

422 yesandno  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:47:56am

Next thing you will find out is that the NYT rejected the Obama piece until he re-wrote it and followed their guidelines! See, rejection is fair

/from Obamassiah's hand to all the little people.

423 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:48:00am

re: #412 zombie

The flip side is that they've done the same exact thing to McCain...

424 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:48:12am

re: #409 Eric Cartman's Conscience

As a business I have no problem with the NYT choosing not to run the editorial. I'd prefer they started admitting publicly that they are a left-wing organ (who really doesn't already know that), but they still can choose their content. Conservative complaints about these douchers running this and not running that smacks of the fairness doctrine. It's the POS New York Times! Why should we be surprised or care!?

* * *
You're right. There are many other venues for McCain's opinion piece.

This is great for any fence sitters to see proof of the NYT exposed, on the record, refusing to publish their former favorite Maverick and the candidate THEY recently endorsed.

425 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:48:14am

re: #406 Cognito

I think he's a Great American Hero. I have petitioned Hasbro to reconfigure its G.I. Joe line of figurines to reflect the stages of Senator Kerry's heroism: I call the four figures Lt. Yale, Agent Amphibious, Winter Soldier, and Colonel Catch-up.

Should I add your name to the petition?

Don't for the Purple Heart Kerry, comes with rice in his butt.

426 Ceemack  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:48:18am

re: #29 Charles

I've never heard of a major newspaper rejecting an op-ed by a Presidential candidate. I believe this is unprecedented.


Every time you think "A major newspaper could never sink that low," the NYT proves you wrong.

427 Big Steve  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:48:41am

re: #20 harrylook

So, that's what they mean by All the News That's Fit to Print.


Or as Mad Magazine parodied may years ago "All the news that fits we print"

428 Kenneth  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:48:43am

Obama Youth: HOPE! CHANGE! SNAPPY UNIFORMS!

429 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:48:57am

re: #366 ec marm
Thanks ec - I was trying to think about the very serious and probably very significant issue you raised, while typing at the same time!
*shakes fist at Ajax* LOL.
But I do think this is a serious subject for a longer, much more well thought out comment than what I could come up with on no notice at all!

430 songbird  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:49:17am

re: #420 HoosierHoops

Let me have you're choir for a day and they'd be singing Black Dog by led zep..
I'm terrible like that...
/kind regards songbird
BBL

How about "More Human than Human" by White Zombie!

431 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:49:28am
432 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:49:53am

re: #414 Russkilitlover

Now THAT's funny! LOL! Kerry action doll figures! Only if it comes with a set of stick pins.


* * *
And spitballs, and 4 rice kernels and the 4 bandaids to cover his wounds from the rice kernels.

433 itellu3times  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:49:55am

OK, the Obama editorial is also linked off Drudge. I see the stylistic point, no doubt they argue that Obama's is about the war, while McCain's is more about Obama.

So what?

I think McCain gets more mileage out of the Times' picayune complaints and non-publication, than he would out of their printing it. Times' snot-nosed, arrogant, self-destructive "rejection" of it. Pfaw.

434 rlevitin  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:50:05am

re: #419 kansas

What's up 3 points?

That was just a bad random number coming out of my head... brain fart i suppose.

The NYT stock is up today 0.53 points, or 4.19%, but its MAJORLY down on longterm trends.

[Link: finance.aol.com...]

435 Nevergiveup  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:50:21am

re: #431 buzzsawmonkey

But at least he spent some time in uniform for his tour of duty. Obama just has to do the Unicorn Tour and scarf an MRE, and it's being equated.

Affirmative action rears its ugly head again.

Maybe that MRE will back him up?

436 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:50:57am
437 kansas  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:51:08am

re: #434 rlevitin

That was just a bad random number coming out of my head... brain fart i suppose.

The NYT stock is up today 0.53 points, or 4.19%, but its MAJORLY down on longterm trends.

[Link: finance.aol.com...]


I had a major brain fart earlier today. Makes you feel better though.

438 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:51:13am

re: #435 Nevergiveup

Maybe that MRE will back him up?

"You're going to want to chew that gum, Mr. Obama."

439 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:51:14am

re: #431 buzzsawmonkey
I know. tfk hit one of my sore spots, jon f'n kary. that pos still sets me off. lying bastard he is.

440 Nevergiveup  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:51:32am

re: #436 buzzsawmonkey

You talking political support, or blockage?

Blockage. Been known to do that.

441 melinwy  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:51:34am

re: #150 ec marm

Why should that stop you from writing a letter requesting that they cancel your subscription?

great idea!

442 Jinx  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:51:48am

re: #364 jcm

It doesn't meet editorial standards.....
It contains some conservative ideas, strictly verboten at NYT.

What was I thinking?

443 victor_yugo  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:51:52am

re: #438 Cognito

"You're going to want to chew that gum, Mr. Obama."

It's scary that I actually get that.

444 Cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:52:22am

re: #373 itellu3times

All the news that fits, they print.

All the 'news' that gives you fits, they print.

445 RickZ  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:52:30am

I find it ironic that Shipley uses the word 'mirrors' in his explanation for not accepting a presidential candidate's OpEd. I bet there are no mirrors anywhere in the NYTimes' building at all. Why would blood-sucking vampires need mirrors?

446 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:52:30am
447 newsjunkie_ky  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:52:45am

re: #414 Russkilitlover

Now THAT's funny! LOL! Kerry action doll figures! Only if it comes with a set of stick pins.


And a windsurfer and bunny ears.

448 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:53:43am

re: #392 quickjustice
Respectfully, the "elite liberal opinion in New York" isn't limited to New York. Check out Chicago, San Francisco, Washington D.C., Detroit etc. etc.; that opinion, elite though it is, is in far more places than NYC - in fact I'm almost willing to bet money that the NYT sells almost as many copies outside of NYC than in NYC.

449 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:53:48am

re: #438 Cognito

"You're going to want to chew that gum, Mr. Obama."

Swap you the peaches for the brownie?

450 newsjunkie_ky  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:54:13am

Rush is calling obama a 'jerk' a 'jerk Messiah'.

I love it.

451 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:54:21am

re: #439 pingjockey

I know. tfk hit one of my sore spots, jon f'n kary. that pos still sets me off. lying bastard he is.

* * *
Kerry is now fragging McCain--McCain, the guy Kerry wanted to be his VEEP in 2004, before Kerry settled for ambulance chaser Edwards.

Kerry is again doing to McCain what Kerry accused his own swiftboat officers of doing in a previous war.

452 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:54:43am

re: #449 jcm

Swap you the peaches for the brownie?

My Charms for your peanut butter.

453 JohnnyReb  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:54:58am

re: #417 realwest

But the real question is, JohnnyReb, who are they going to blame for this state of affairs - the Republicans or the Dems.
I'm afraid Repubs cause Bush is President; the fact that he ok'd offshore drilling and Congress smacked it down is gonna be lost on most presidential voters, I'm afraid.

Actually they blame President Bush and the oil companies for their troubles. I have a few friends that actually believe that President Bush picks up the phone and calls the oil companies to set the price and whatever he needs to make more profits. They are a bit unhinged and truthfully only read the local LLL money losing newspaper and they believe every thing they read.

454 Spiny Norman  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:55:07am

re: #427 Big Steve

Or as Mad Magazine parodied may years ago "All the news that fits we print"

The local weekly I used to work for has used that slogan since at least 1960, perhaps earlier. I think it was a old joke even then.

455 Cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:55:16am

re: #395 songbird

Seriously, I get to sing and play piano all day!

But.....there are some kids I'd like to string up! I have an amazing 8th grade choir coming up, and a VERY lively 7th grade group. The 6th graders are the unknown factor.

Eighth grade choir? Wow. Do you get hazardous duty pay for that?

456 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:55:34am
457 American Jewess In Jerusalem  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:55:49am

Oy, I'm confused again. Can someone help me to understand what is meant by "mirror Obama's piece"?

I mean, seriously, he can't really mean that he will only publish McCain's op ed if it expresses the SAME sentiments as Obama's, right?

Right?

/help

458 Big Steve  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:55:55am

re: #454 Spiny Norman

The local weekly I used to work for has used that slogan since at least 1960, perhaps earlier. I think it was a old joke even then.

Well I was reading Mad in the 60's

459 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:55:58am

re: #451 alegrias
"cept for one thing, swiftboat guys told the truth. The left has turned that 180 degrees out.

460 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:56:12am
461 Nevergiveup  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:56:19am

re: #451 alegrias

* * *
Kerry is now fragging McCain--McCain, the guy Kerry wanted to be his VEEP in 2004, before Kerry settled for ambulance chaser Edwards.

Kerry is again doing to McCain what Kerry accused his own swiftboat officers of doing in a previous war.

Now there's the guy you want in the "proverbial" fox hole with ya? Somebody you can trust?

462 songbird  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:56:24am

re: #455 Cygnus

Eighth grade choir? Wow. Do you get hazardous duty pay for that?

I wish I did. I do get what is called an 'increment' for teaching a specialty class.......and all the therapy I want with the school counselors! HAHA

463 songbird  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:56:48am

re: #460 buzzsawmonkey

Is a jerk Messiah anything like jerk chicken?

Depends on how it's seasoned.

464 right_on_target  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:56:56am

re: #122 6pat6

On the contrary - you have a substantial percentage of the electorate who (I believe) are actually WAITING and WANTING to be told who to vote for! They are too "busy" with their lives to bother with those little "details", such as actually being knowledgeable on the facts!

That's exactly what my neighbor said. She wanted to know what her party (Democrat) will tell her to vote for. She has NO idea what Obama stands for.

465 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:57:04am

re: #457 American Jewess In Jerusalem

Oy, I'm confused again. Can someone help me to understand what is meant by "mirror Obama's piece"?

I mean, seriously, he can't really mean that he will only publish McCain's op ed if it expresses the SAME sentiments as Obama's, right?

Right?

/help

Ahem. Well.

For what it's worth, what they're saying is that Obama laid out a specific goal for finishing the war in Iraq. While McCain, according to the editor, only addressed Obama, rather than laying out his own end game.

466 Nevergiveup  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:57:04am

re: #454 Spiny Norman

The local weekly I used to work for has used that slogan since at least 1960, perhaps earlier. I think it was a old joke even then.

Old jokes are the best jokes.

467 Killian Bundy  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:57:28am

NYT Poll: Obama "Not Likely" to Be Effective Commander-in-Chief

On the night of January 20, 2009, a new commander-in-chief will leave the inaugural podium, parade, and festivities for the Oval Office. A national security staff ready with the latest “threat briefing” will join him there. On his desk, they will place a thick binder of reports, each focusing on real or emerging threats to our national security. In the quiet of the Oval Office -- in the presence of these stern-faced, deadly serious briefers and advisers -- Barack H. Obama, should he be the next president, will come face-to-face with reality.

Americans are afraid of this scenario, Barack H. Obama as commander-in-chief. The New York Times and CBS News released a poll this week; in it, Americans answered detailed questions about this possibility.

The poll’s answers shocked the strategists at the Obama campaign headquarters in Chicago. An intensive international travel schedule for Obama and a refocus of the campaign’s message on defense and foreign policy speaks to this fear.

The poll says Americans consider him lacking in the abilities necessary to run the armed services. Conversely, the polls show John McCain blows Obama out of the water as a good commander-in-chief. Forty-six percent of respondents thought McCain would very likely “be effective” as commander-in-chief, as opposed to only 24 percent saying the same of Obama. In fact, 36 percent think it is “not likely” Obama will be effective in the position.

/but, but, Obama's almost halfway through his week long "tour of duty"

468 Cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:57:35am

re: #414 Russkilitlover

Now THAT's funny! LOL! Kerry action doll figures! Only if it comes with a set of stick pins.

And little tiny ribbons for him to throw over the White House fence.

469 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:57:37am

re: #452 Cognito

My Charms for your peanut butter.

Touch my peanut butter again and you draw back a stump.

I think I threw out about 40 packets when I got out

470 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:57:43am

re: #453 JohnnyReb

Actually they blame President Bush and the oil companies for their troubles. I have a few friends that actually believe that President Bush picks up the phone and calls the oil companies to set the price and whatever he needs to make more profits. They are a bit unhinged and truthfully only read the local LLL money losing newspaper and they believe every thing they read.

* * *
Haven't your friends heard of OPEC the OIL PRoducers Exporting Cartel run by NON-Texans?

Give your friends a loving clue, please.

Didn't your friends see the Saudis and others recently reject President Bush's request for lower prices?

471 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:57:55am
472 faraway  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:58:39am

McCain Submits Revised OpEd

Complete contents follow:

Nuts!

473 Lively  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:58:41am

But is Obama working out in Europe?

474 BenZacharia  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:59:03am

Just a drive by.

I'm still out here hope to be online in a coula days.

475 Meremortal  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:59:05am

re: #388 buzzsawmonkey

Read it at Drudge. McCain fillets Obama like a brook trout.


---
Thank you. Brookies do fillet quite easily if big enough, nice reference.

476 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:59:16am
477 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:59:18am

re: #467 Killian Bundy

Way to note the obvious!

478 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 10:59:59am

re: #467 Killian Bundy
Hell, I've got more foreign policy experience than obambi. 5 tours o'seas on navy warships. Trying to hook up with the local talent in each port is a lot more negotiating than obambi has ever done!

479 Vergeltung  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:00:39am

re: #174 lifeofthemind

I recommend The New York Sun.

I get it delivered to my house everyday! wonderful paper. the folks here at LGF would approve for sure! :)

480 alegrias  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:00:49am

re: #459 pingjockey

"cept for one thing, swiftboat guys told the truth. The left has turned that 180 degrees out.

* * *
Of course the swift boat officers told the truth. Who you going to believe, America's finest or the Kerry French looking guy who contacted the enemy's leaders, the Viet Cong, in Paris WITHOUT PRECONDITIONS while supposedly on his honeymoon?

481 Rednek  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:01:26am

The disrespect and arrogance displayed by the NYT is astonishing.

It will be a happy day whent Rupert buys out that cage liner.

482 Nevergiveup  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:01:37am

re: #478 pingjockey

Hell, I've got more foreign policy experience than obambi. 5 tours o'seas on navy warships. Trying to hook up with the local talent in each port is a lot more negotiating than obambi has ever done!

Yeah but lets give Obama a break here. In your day, the dollar bought so much more! Romance is alot more expensive now a days.

483 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:01:41am
484 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:02:04am

re: #480 alegrias
Well since I have a functioning brain and was in the navy with some of those guys, I'll take their word.

485 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:02:38am

re: #456 buzzsawmonkey Yeah, and what's funny is that Chicago is no longer the second largest city- it's third.
My gosh, think of all the cost for reprinting of logos, letterheads, tee shirts and all! LOL!

486 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:02:43am

re: #482 Nevergiveup
Yes, but the dance is still the same!

487 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:02:46am

This election will be a referendum on the media-industrial complex.

The public has already voted with its wallets, however, as seen in the catastrophic decline of the alphabet news audience (20% in barely a year) and the continuing cycle of layoffs and cutbacks in the dead tree branch.

Obama could pull it out for them, but it is not the foregone conclusion his media shills claim it to be. In any case, an Obama win would only slow, not arrest, the decline. If he loses, if the most media-favored candidate in history cannot defeat the enfeebled GOP and its 72 year old candidate, it will be a blazing asteroid in the media heavens and the harbinger of imminent extinction. In 10 years, they will have nothing left but pornography and even that will be on the internet.

488 BenZacharia  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:04:45am

TFK,
Your punctuation has improved.

TTFN

489 Spirit93  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:04:58am

re: #457 American Jewess In Jerusalem

It means McCain only gets to respond to Obama's ed. Obama gets to set the agenda.
And if it still makes Obama look stupid, the NYT will find some other reason to reject it.

490 Son of the Black Dog  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:05:25am

re: #353 alegrias

* * *
Fixed that for you. Anyone else remember when bluehaired ladies of the Womens League of Voters ran the presidential "Debates" and they were serious debates?

Or am I dreaming?

You may be misremembering. The League of Women Voters is composed primarily of liberal activists. When they ran presidential debates the audience was usually loaded in favor of the Dem candidate.

491 Silhouette  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:05:36am

re: #470 alegrias

Haven't your friends heard of OPEC the OIL PRoducers Exporting Cartel run by NON-Texans?

Asking folks what the acronym OPEC stands for always makes a good bar bet, because almost everyone says "Oil" first. ;-)

492 Pyrocles  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:06:04am

I know people who think like this, too. They believe Bush controls OPEC. Since OPEC consists mainly of "poor" nations of "dark-skinned" people, they are naturally subservient to Bush; the all-powerful oil-man. The whole "OPEC" thing is just an oil industry scam to place blame out of the U.S..

re: #470 alegrias

* * *
Haven't your friends heard of OPEC the OIL PRoducers Exporting Cartel run by NON-Texans?

Give your friends a loving clue, please.

Didn't your friends see the Saudis and others recently reject President Bush's request for lower prices?

493 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:06:34am
494 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:06:39am

re: #489 Spirit93

He shouldn't agree. He should set his own agenda, not respond to someone else's!

495 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:06:41am

re: #467 Killian Bundy
Hey Killian! Good to see you again and THANK YOU for finding that - sorta made my day!
Do you have any idea when that poll was taken?

496 Iron Fist  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:07:27am

re: #492 Pyrocles,

Do they realize how racist that mindset is, or are they totally ignorant of their blatent bias?

497 newsjunkie_ky  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:07:30am

re: #460 buzzsawmonkey

498 Silhouette  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:07:40am

re: #489 Spirit93

It means McCain only gets to respond to Obama's ed. Obama gets to set the agenda.

I've had this discussion before. Two way communication does not mean you ask the questions and I answer yes or no. In court, the attorney for one side may control what the witness says this way, but then the other attorney is supposed to be allowed a go.

NYT: supporting one-sided "debate" not-so-cleverly-disguised as two-sided.

499 gennyk  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:07:45am

It's time that 'piece of crap' paper went out of business. It serves no socially redeeming purpose.

500 Quintus_Arius  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:08:02am

Some other things to remember about the NYT:

-It outed secret Terrorist Surveillance email and phone project.

-It quickly published MoveOn's 'General Betray Us'

I'm sure many here could add to this list all day

501 lurking faith  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:08:07am

re: #325 lifeofthemind

They are more slippery than that. The Times now defines victory under Obama as getting out with minimal casualties and victory under anybody else as an ongoing demilitarized love fest.

Minimal American casualties, that is.

They don't care one bit if the whole region devolves into chaos and lasting violence or tyranny after we leave.

So much for being the party of true compassion and support for the downtrodden.

502 Right Brain  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:08:38am

"The latest Rasmussen Reports telephone survey found that 49% of voters believe most reporters will try to help Obama with their coverage, up from 44% a month ago."

No, ya think?


[Link: rasmussenreports.com...]

503 Son of the Black Dog  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:09:03am

re: #371 MandyManners

What else does Sulzberger own that we could wreck?

A home in the Hamptons? You could throw a party.

504 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:09:19am

re: #494 Dianna

He shouldn't agree. He should set his own agenda, not respond to someone else's!

For what it's worth, that's what they're asking him to do. They're saying he merely responded to Obama's agenda, instead of setting forth his own plan for finishing the war.

Again, for what it's worth.

505 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:09:19am

re: #493 taxfreekiller
I think you, me and Lt. J F'n Kary could have a real nice discussion. Using a blanket and some socks with bars of soap in them.

506 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:10:20am

re: #409 Eric Cartman's Conscience

As a business I have no problem with the NYT choosing not to run the editorial. I'd prefer they started admitting publicly that they are a left-wing organ (who really doesn't already know that), but they still can choose their content. Conservative complaints about these douchers running this and not running that smacks of the fairness doctrine. It's the POS New York Times! Why should we be surprised or care!?

Bias is not really the problem with the media-industrial complex, the ridiculous pretense of objectivity and "fairness" is the problem. Nobody faults the Daily Worker for not running McCain pieces, or Rush Limbaugh for not slobbering on Obama, but somehow there is an expectation that really big media will be different. This only means that the dinosaurs can support their agenda by deceit rather than by open discourse.

507 looking closely  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:10:22am

re: #55 zmdavid

It is interesting. They did endorse McCain, didn't they? So they are refusing a piece from a candidate they endorsed. (Not that it was a sham endorsement or anything)

First they endorsed him.

Then they published an article claiming that McCain has been engaged in an inappropriate relationship with an aide (insinuating a romantic or sexual relationship).

Now they're refusing to publish an op-ed by Obama.

I hope when McCain is POTUS he singles them out, explicitly denying them all access. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

508 Silhouette  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:10:56am

re: #496 Iron Fist

,

Do they realize how racist that mindset is, or are they totally ignorant of their blatent bias?

Most of their ideas about race (soft racism of lower expectations, the belief that an extra boost is always needed, the belief that there is such a thing as a minority point-of-view [as if they all think alike], etc) are racist.

509 realwest  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:11:32am

Well all y'all it's been a grand - if stomach churning -day, but I gotta go mush some lunch.
I hope you all have a GREAT DAY and that I get the chance to see you down the road!

510 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:11:50am
511 Silhouette  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:11:54am

re: #501 lurking faith

They don't care one bit if the whole region devolves into chaos and lasting violence or tyranny after we leave.

Or they do care, as in they want to chaos, so they can blame the deaths on Bush and the GOP.

512 MandyManners  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:12:18am

re: #503 Son of the Black Dog

A home in the Hamptons? You could throw a party.

Weekend at Pinchie's?

513 ploome hineni[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:12:26am
514 kansas  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:12:41am

re: #451 alegrias

Kerry is again doing to McCain what Kerry accused his own swiftboat officers of doing in a previous war.

The Swifties told what they thought about that arrogant shit. Kerry is lying about McCain.

515 LEGION  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:12:43am

Don't buy, don't advertise, don't even READ the NY Slimes. Ignore them, and they will wither away! Duh! Drudge is a joke also.

516 Silhouette  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:12:43am

re: #502 Right Brain

"The latest Rasmussen Reports telephone survey found that 49% of voters believe most reporters will try to help Obama with their coverage, up from 44% a month ago."

So 51% are blind, or lying.

517 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:12:45am

re: #504 Cognito

That's a bullshit excuse. McCain's article had just as much substance as Obama's. They just objected to McCain's criticism of Obama and pointing out that the surge (which Obama opposed) is responsible for the Iraq we have today. They rejected it because of the content not because the lack of content.

518 Pyrocles  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:13:12am

Probably ignorant. I believe the true "racists" are the Leftists who see race everywhere they look. "Race" is an extremely important identifier for a leftist. For most Conservatives, it's just not a big deal.

When it comes to who controls the oil prices, for the Liberals that I know, it's ALWAYS Bush and the oil companies. OPEC is totally unimportant, and mentioning it is seen as a "cop-out"; an excuse to get pressure off the oil companies. Even by my father, who is becoming more of a moonbat every day... /sigh.

re: #496 Iron Fist

,

Do they realize how racist that mindset is, or are they totally ignorant of their blatent bias?

519 Cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:13:27am

re: #460 buzzsawmonkey

Is a jerk Messiah anything like jerk chicken?

Jerk chicken stays dead after it's been killed.

520 Dianna  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:13:30am

re: #504 Cognito

I'm pretty sure that's not true, no matter what they say.

521 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:13:33am

re: #517 Killgore Trout

Like I said, 'for what it's worth.'

522 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:13:38am
523 JohnnyReb  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:13:44am

re: #470 alegrias

Sorry, I have run out of my supply of clue bats, I have broken them all.

524 karmic_inquisitor  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:13:54am

Robert Novak has an interesting column today that discusses why Republicans see the need to make the election about Obama and not McCain.

With the NYT showing such blatant bias toward Obama, they and the rest of the MSM are doing exactly what the Republicans want.

Oh - and Obama has only a 1 point lead in today's Rasmussen report.

525 American Jewess In Jerusalem  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:14:29am

I mean . . . I am wondering if he meant that he wanted McCain's piece to be a point-by-point rebuttal to Obama's piece. Could that be it?

Oy. I'm going to be sick.

526 daughter of patriots  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:15:18am

Here's a recommendation to Mr. McCain. Hire Jason Blair (who probably could use a job these days). He's just the type to write in the more acceptable literati-style appreciated by the elites of the NYT.

527 Cognito  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:15:26am

re: #525 American Jewess In Jerusalem

I mean . . . I am wondering if he meant that he wanted McCain's piece to be a point-by-point rebuttal to Obama's piece. Could that be it?

Oy. I'm going to be sick.

No, the opposite.

What it's worth, etc.

528 kansas  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:15:38am

re: #524 karmic_inquisitor

Robert Novak has an interesting column today that discusses why Republicans see the need to make the election about Obama and not McCain.

With the NYT showing such blatant bias toward Obama, they and the rest of the MSM are doing exactly what the Republicans want.

Oh - and Obama has only a 1 point lead in today's Rasmussen report.

Gallup has Bummer up by 6. I can't remember from the last time, is Rasmussen more accurate?

529 faraway  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:16:07am

Thanks NYT for riling up the base (ours).

530 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:16:32am

re: #528 kansas
All polls taken now about an election in November are pure bs.

531 valentine81  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:16:40am

man, as i scrolled down i seriously half expected one of charles's updates to read that this was actually a misunderstanding/joke/etc.

this is so outrageous! it may be the nyt, but i'm still utterly shocked/horrified/at a loss for strong enough adjectives...

532 ec marm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:16:42am

re: #467 Killian Bundy
Very interesting. Especially since most of those polled probably don't remember preparing bomb shelters, buying a months supply of groceries, and other preparations for a nuclear exchange with the USSR, the last time we elected someone with so little experience. I'll never forget.

533 jcm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:17:05am

Consensus on AGW!
*not*

By Christopher Monckton of Brenchley

Abstract

The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC, 2007) concluded that anthropogenic CO2 emissions probably caused more than half of the “global warming” of the past 50 years and would cause further rapid warming. However, global mean surface temperature has not risen since 1998 and may have fallen since late 2001. The present analysis suggests that the failure of the IPCC’s models to predict this and many other climatic phenomena arises from defects in its evaluation of the three factors whose product is climate sensitivity:

1. Radiative forcing ΔF;
2. The no-feedbacks climate sensitivity parameter κ; and
3. The feedback multiplier ƒ.

Some reasons why the IPCC’s estimates may be excessive and unsafe are explained. More importantly, the conclusion is that, perhaps, there is no “climate crisis”, and that currently-fashionable efforts by governments to reduce anthropogenic CO2 emissions are pointless, may be ill-conceived, and could even be harmful.

APS inculdes a disclaimer...

The following article has not undergone any scientific peer review, since that is not normal procedure for American Physical Society newsletters. The American Physical Society reaffirms the following position on climate change, adopted by its governing body, the APS Council, on November 18, 2007: "Emissions of greenhouse gases from human activities are changing the atmosphere in ways that affect the Earth's climate."
534 EE  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:17:50am

The New York Times is willing to publish stuff from Hamas, which has been designated by the US State Department as a foreign terrorist organization.

On the other hand, they will only permit an article by McCain that says what The New York Times wants McCain to say -- that is, only if it does not explain to voters why they should prefer McCain over Obama.

It's a mystery why advertisers continue to place ads in such an obviously biased news outlet, which seeks to control the outcome of the election by shutting out the most important analysis and views that informed readers need to be aware of.

535 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:18:41am

re: #532 ec marm
I was 2 years old in '61. I do remember dad getting a recall to duty notice that was very near to being carried out. That would've been at the begining of VN. '64 or so.

536 Cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:19:28am

re: #523 JohnnyReb

Sorry, I have run out of my supply of clue bats, I have broken them all.

You need to get some aluminum cluebats.

537 pingjockey  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:20:02am

FNC running the rejected op-ed story now.

538 looking closely  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:20:07am

re: #507 looking closely

Obviously I meant refusing to publish McCain's piece (PIMF).

I didn't read McCain's piece, but if *all* it is is a hit-piece on Obama, then perhaps they have a point. (I suspect this isn't the case, though).

If the NYT wants McCain to lay out a specific policy proposal, I don't think he'd have a problem with it. He's already done it many times, and unlike Obama, he's actually been consistent about it the entire time: Let the US military clean out the place, then mind the shop until the Iraqis can do it for themselves. Its probably implicit in this editorial, if not explicit.

The problem with details, is that you can't schedule or plan a war exit in advance. McCain doesn't know what's coming down the pike that the US might need to respond to, and being too specific about details that are at best tentative doesn't really help and can be counterproductive.

539 Quintus_Arius  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:20:25am

re: #500 Quintus_Arius

In fairness: To illustrate the concept. I believe it was USA Today that published 'General Betray Us'. Is that correct?

540 Edouard  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:22:00am
‘It would be terrific to have an article from Senator McCain that mirrors Senator Obama’s piece,’ NYT Op-Ed editor David Shipley explained in an email late Friday to McCain’s staff.

Why the hell should McCain be obliged to let Obama establish the terms of discussion for him?

An outrage, plain and simple!

541 RickZ  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:22:10am

re: #539 Quintus_Arius

In fairness: To illustrate the concept. I believe it was USA Today that published 'General Betray Us'. Is that correct?

Nope. It was the NYSlimes.

542 Seaberry  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:22:18am

I hope Murdoch buys them at the upcoming ‘yard sale’...

543 Kenneth  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:22:22am

re: #518 Pyrocles

Last week I posted a comment to an MSM website about the Khadr affair. The common moonbat response to anybody critical or unsympathetic to Khadr was "You're such a racist!" Nobody had even mentioned Khadr's race.

544 Age Of Freedom  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:22:28am

re: #4 newsjunkie_ky

Get this info out to all of your email friends.

Rush is discussing this now.

That's the problem, if I ever point out at (the tremendous) liberal bias to all my rabid liberal 'buddies' just one more time, they may spill the beans and throw the Z word a me, as if it means evil.

I once emailed them one of the posts here from MEMRI about the 'jay-walking' in Saudia, where they asked "Would you shake the hand of a Jew?", and all of my 'buddies', if didn't reply back, replied saying it's hard to tell if it's real or if it's official.

It's hopeless. Changless.

545 ec marm  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:23:19am

re: #528 kansas

Gallup has Bummer up by 6. I can't remember from the last time, is Rasmussen more accurate?


IIRC, in past elections Zogby has usually been the most accurate. But he's even showing the most high and exalted one +7. It's still too early to believe any of them. This time of year people like to lie on the beach, and if they can't make it to the beach, at least lie to pollsters.

546 Zevy  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:23:27am

CNN is reporting this story:
CNN story online

547 Cato  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:25:11am

I live in a town in New Jersey populated by writers for the NYT. It is a very convenient bus trip into NYC and the NYTimes building is right in front of Port Authority where the bus stops.

Even some of the writers -- all of whom are left-wing Obama supporters -- have begun to question the wisdom of the editorial policy. Some have Times stock in their 401ks and they realize that the paper's fall is not solely due to internet competition. While they all claim their pieces are objective, they recognize that the Times editorial policies may be losing them readers.

548 karmic_inquisitor  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:26:53am

re: #538 looking closely

If the NYT wants McCain to lay out a specific policy proposal, I don't think he'd have a problem with it. He's already done it many times, and unlike Obama, he's actually been consistent about it the entire time

Which is the crux of the falacy in the NYT response - they have said they want something "new" as well. Wars are a contest of wills, and when you are winning "new" isn't something you pursue.

549 American Jewess In Jerusalem  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:26:56am

re: #527 Cognito

Thanks Cognito, I think I understand now. They should have said "Of course, we will print it as is, but it would be nice if . . . " and given McCain the OPTION of doing what they "prefer" rather than mandating it.

Schmucks.

550 Kenneth  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:29:51am

Europe's governments immune to Obama-fever

BERLIN (Reuters) - European fans will cheer on U.S. presidential candidate Barack Obama as he visits Berlin, Paris and London this week, but governments wary of his inexperience and evolving policies fear the euphoria is overdone.

..."There is a sort of Obama-mania in Germany right now, but I think a lot of people will have their illusions shattered if he does become president," an official in Chancellor Angela Merkel's office told Reuters, requesting anonymity.

...a survey released by the Pew Research Center last week showed Germans vastly prefer Obama over John McCain, his Republican challenger for the presidency, by a 49 point margin. In France it is an even wider 51 point margin and in Britain 30.

"One reason Obama is so popular here is that people expect him to break radically with the politics of Bush, without any understanding of what this would involve," said Eckart von Klaeden, a German parliamentarian and foreign policy expert in Merkel's Christian Democratic Union

551 Cygnus  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:30:53am

re: #539 Quintus_Arius

Great nic. I love Ben Hur!

552 Quintus_Arius  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:31:06am

re: #549 American Jewess In Jerusalem

NYT, schmucks? That's a compliment

553 Hard Right  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:31:41am

Moonbat mode:
Bias from thee, not from me.

554 looking closely  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:36:28am

re: #532 ec marm

Very interesting. Especially since most of those polled probably don't remember preparing bomb shelters, buying a months supply of groceries, and other preparations for a nuclear exchange with the USSR, the last time we elected someone with so little experience. I'll never forget.

I believe there has never been a US President as inexperienced at Obama. Carter ran a US state before being elected. Obama has no executive experience (whatever), and hasn't even served out one term as US Senator, most of that time spent running for POTUS.

Even when JFK was running for President, lots of people (including Eleanor Roosevelt, and supposedly even Kennedy himself) thought he was too inexperienced to hold the office.

Good take on inexperience here:
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

555 offsetview  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:37:24am

I can tell you from where I sit, that the industry as a whole is falling quickly. It's sad we can't just print just the opinions from both sides and let us make up our own minds. A lot of good hard working people will suffer when the print portion of the newspaper ceased to exist.

556 Spirit93  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:47:03am

re: #538 looking closely

"I didn't read McCain's piece"


Lazy and stupid is no way to go through life, son.

557 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:48:51am

re: #372 Killian Bundy

NBC News Refers to Obama's Trip as 'Tour of Duty'

It's bad enough that Barack Obama's trip to the Middle East is getting an insane amount of MSM coverage (the three big network news anchors? Whoa!); now, NBC News believes it apt to compare Obama's sojourn to ... an actual military tour of duty. Yes indeed. Check out at right how anchor Lester Holt introduces last evening's Nightly News.

/media outlets fighting over who gets to lick Obama's ass crack

"K-B" -

Of course "Tour of Duty," otherwise they would have to call it, "ON THE JOB TRAINING!"

-S-

558 Quintus_Arius  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:50:54am

Whether you subscribe or not to a print newspaper, you can still send a letter to the editor via their email address. Let's start a campaign to cut and paste McCain's editorial and sent it to your local paper.

Simply, 'The New York Times accepted Barack Obams's opinion editorial but rejected John McCain's. Perhaps you might find a way to print John McCain's in your Opinion section.

559 norm204  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 11:51:43am

Apparently Mr. Shipley learned some valuable lessons in journalism from
his stint as Moscow bureau chief.

560 looking closely  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 12:06:55pm

re: #556 Spirit93

Lazy and stupid is no way to go through life, son.

While the former might apply here, I'm not sure the latter does.

I've just read McCain's rejected Op-Ed (as published in the Drudge Report), and McCain concludes by making it perfectly clear what his Iraq policy is:

. . .I will continue implementing a proven counterinsurgency strategy not only in Iraq but also in Afghanistan with the goal of creating stable, secure, self-sustaining democratic allies.

And its clear why the NYT refuses to print it. Not simply because its an attack on Obama, but because its a devastating attack on Obama.

561 EE  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 12:13:22pm

I am sorry to see this sort of behavior coming from David Shipley. As far as I can recall, he was the only reporter on The New York Times staff to often use the word "terrorist" or "terrorism" to report on the terrorist assaults that were carried out against Israelis. Shipley isn't Jewish, and he had no hangups about reporting terrorist acts as being acts of terrorism, including terrorist acts against Israelis.

At the other extreme, for example, I recall the self-hating NYT columnist Anthony Lewis, who once accused Israel's Yitzhak Rabin of being a racist for including the words "Palestinian" and "terrorist" in the same sentence. To Anthony Lewis, these were mutually exclusive words, that could never appear in the same thought. But less than a year later, Lewis wrote a column where he used the phrase "Jewish terrorists".

David Shipley: Where is the sense of fairness that you once had? I am very disappointed.

562 winston06  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 12:13:36pm

I hate Commies

563 Name The Enemy  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 12:21:54pm

If Shipley is on vacation, then why'd he leave the Times? The whole freakin' bureau is Fantasyland.

564 littleO  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 12:26:15pm

So the NY times rejects a op-ed from a Presidential candidate while printing the other Pres. candidates piece.

565 littleO  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 12:28:16pm

Conspiracy, CONSPIRACY!

566 boatguyjim  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 12:34:32pm

Well thank you NYT! you are truly Craptastic. Unfortunately many folks still consider the NYT the paper of record for the US and that too is craptastic

567 DaChew  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 12:38:06pm

The NYT is getting scared. Now they're starting to make mistakes.

568 Donbmcd  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 1:02:26pm

Why is anyone surprised?

569 Annar  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 1:11:40pm

A good move would be for the New York State GOP to start a boycott campaign aimed and the NTY advertisers the idea being to help speed up the death of that rag.

570 grumpy old codger  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 1:26:25pm

re: #535 pingjockey
Bay of Pigs and Cuba more likely as the reason for the call up.

571 Clocktower05  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 1:41:51pm

The NY Times is a joke. He should run it in the Wall Street Journal or the Washington Post. It only hurts Obama that the Times rejected McCain's piece, because it makes their bias all the more salient.

572 mossley  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 1:43:01pm

re: #411 kansas

Now that's bad. Along with gas prices going up, and the Dow Jones dropping the Times stock has tanked since the Democrats took over.


July, 2002 - 51.88 a share.
July, 2008 - 12.33 a share.

It's a good thing Sulzberger isn't a ship captain; he'd make the Titantic look like a pleasure cruise.

573 runrabbitrun  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 1:45:02pm

re: #472 faraway

McCain Submits Revised OpEd

Complete contents follow:

Nuts!

Pretty close to my own feelings.

McCain should now submit an Iraq War editorial which concludes with comments remarking on the critical legacy of a free press and the media institutions that support democratic elections in the U.S.

"By printing this editorial, a newsworthy press proves their support of those vital institutions. Rejecting it would flout recognition of the key rights that keep our nation great."

Not that the NYT particularly supports the First Amendment as applying to the right, but for irony, let them dump that on the slush-pile - heheh.

574 lifeofthemind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 1:47:30pm

re: #501 lurking faith

Minimal American casualties, that is.

They don't care one bit if the whole region devolves into chaos and lasting violence or tyranny after we leave.

So much for being the party of true compassion and support for the downtrodden.

They prefer it. For the Times set it is all Vietnam all the Time. They'd see boat people as validating their perception.

575 SecondComing  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 2:04:36pm

re: #208 FinallyHere


If you needed another proof that "progressives" are idiots,

this reminds me, I sure could use another funny "diary" from Kos. The blogs about them always cheer me up.

576 SagamoreGal  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 2:29:42pm

I wonder if the anyone on the NY Times staff realizes how many Americans would be dancing in the streets if the next terrorist attack brought down that huge, ugly tower of steel near the Port Authority?

577 unclassifiable  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 2:38:44pm

Was McCain's response a little too nuanced for the Times.

/swoon, faint...

578 unclassifiable  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 2:40:25pm

re: #577 unclassifiable

I reserve the right to amend my remarks:

Was McCain's response a little too nuanced for the Times?

/swoon, faint...

579 Bill Dalasio  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 3:37:56pm

This case is just another example of technology and communications giving lie to the era a centralized, "objective", "unbiased" news source. But, rather than pine for a bygone era that never existed (think Walter Duranty) of a standard that media itself created from whole cloth (objectivity only became a journalistic standard in the era of "Yellow Journalism"), wouldn't we be better off rejecting the standard itself? That is to say, I would personally be less bothered by the Times' obvious bias if it stopped the pretense of being "all the news that's fit to print" and acknowledged itself for what it is, the house organ for the American center-left. This would free up the national discourse from the ridiculous exercise of continually calling the major media out for their biases and waiting for the next round. If the NYT, CBS, etc. stopped claiming to be "the truth" and admitted to being "our view", large swaths of the country would likely read them more regularly as a given viewpoint. Likewise, it would allow for the growth of other media that represent differing viewpoints. Rather than looking at the public's attention as a fixed pie to be hoarded, this model would focus, instead, on enlarging the media pie.

580 Radboss  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 3:54:51pm

Check out this link from The Weekly Standard:

[Link: weeklystandard.com...]

Apparently, it was OK for the NYT to publish astrology editorials during the last presidential election cycle.

The standards are amazingly high over there at the Grey Lady.

Radboss out!

581 RobCon  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 3:59:01pm

The smug talking heads follow Obama around the world but McCain does not meet the standards of the NY Slimes like that "Sex in the City" wannabe Maureen Dowd does.
Hint to McCain. The next time you want to post an article in the Times, mark it Top Secret and they will plaster on that front page.

582 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 5:05:07pm
583 neverquit  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 5:17:06pm

Amazing. Some old lady get's escorted away from a McCain Fund-Raising event for protesting - and it's national news with the 1st Amendment Twist and Shout - but not when the NYT's stiff arms the Rep Pres. Nominee?

584 avspatti  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 5:49:30pm

The tone of the Times reasoning sounded like a sanctimonious professor dealing with an inept graduate student. Really disrespectful in my opinion. When I read it, I translated it thus, " Well, if you can possibly bring your writing up to MY standards (I'm not holding my breath.), I will deign to consider it." Really demeaning.

I am truly beginning to worry about our dear country. People are just . . . really, words fail me.

585 Joan  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 7:32:48pm

re: #26 turn

[Shipley served in the Clinton Administration from 1995 until 1997 as Special Assistant to the President and Senior Presidential Speechwriter.]

Shipley probably rejected the piece because it sounded TOO presidential.

He rejected the piece because he's a partisan hack. Smiling bastard.
Hey, John: here's the best advise from a dearly missed masculine voice:

"....and you to whom adversity has dealt the final blow, with smiling bastards lying to you everywhere you go--turn to, and give out all your strength of arm and heart and brain. Like the Mary Ellen Carter Rise Again! " (Stan Rogers)

586 nadadhimmi  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 7:40:31pm

The Old York Times equates very nicely with Der Deutsche Beobachter.

587 nnw59  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 7:48:28pm

What's next: asking Bill Kristol to "mirror" Bob Herbert?

588 thebeasle  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 8:08:44pm
THE op-ed page of The New York Times is perhaps the nation’s most important forum for airing opinions

lol.

on the most contentious issues of the day — the war in Iraq, abortion, global warming and more.

lol again.

589 tradewind  Mon, Jul 21, 2008 8:29:43pm

re: #29 Charles

They're just living down to their motto:
"All the News That Fits, We Print"

590 Ledger1  Tue, Jul 22, 2008 2:34:55am

I was having coffee at B&N.

A lot of people were using their laptops. Clean up hostess pick up two newspapers from an empty table. One was The Wall Street Journal and the other was the NYT. She threw one is garbage can and put the other on back on the rack – I don’t know why.

I think she trashed the NYT.

Retail outlets disgusted with the NYT or just poor sales?

591 Ledger1  Tue, Jul 22, 2008 3:28:30am

The Future For Iraq
Senator John McCain

Part 1, the wizard repost of McCain oped


In January 2007, when General David Petraeus took command in Iraq, he called the situation “hard” but not “hopeless.” Today, 18 months later, violence has fallen by up to 80% to the lowest levels in four years, and Sunni and Shiite terrorists are reeling from a string of defeats. The situation now is full of hope, but considerable hard work remains to consolidate our fragile gains.
Progress has been due primarily to an increase in the number of troops and a change in their strategy. I was an early advocate of the surge at a time when it had few supporters in Washington. Senator Barack Obama was an equally vocal opponent. "I am not persuaded that 20,000 additional troops in Iraq is going to solve the sectarian violence there,” he said on January 10, 2007. “In fact, I think it will do the reverse."
Now Senator Obama has been forced to acknowledge that “our troops have performed brilliantly in lowering the level of violence.” But he still denies that any political progress has resulted.

Perhaps he is unaware that the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad has recently certified that, as one news article put it, “Iraq has met all but three of 18 original benchmarks set by Congress last year to measure security, political and economic progress.” Even more heartening has been progress that’s not measured by the benchmarks. More than 90,000 Iraqis, many of them Sunnis who once fought against the government, have signed up as Sons of Iraq to fight against the terrorists. Nor do they measure Prime Minister Nouri al Maliki’s new-found willingness to crack down on Shiite extremists in Basra and Sadr City—actions that have done much to dispel suspicions of sectarianism.

The success of the surge has not changed Senator Obama’s determination to pull out all of our combat troops. All that has changed is his rationale. In a New York Times op-ed and a speech this week, he offered his “plan for Iraq” in advance of his first “fact finding” trip to that country in more than three years. It consisted of the same old proposal to pull all of our troops out within 16 months. In 2007 he wanted to withdraw because he thought the war was lost. If we had taken his advice, it would have been. Now he wants to withdraw because he thinks Iraqis no longer need our assistance.

592 Ledger1  Tue, Jul 22, 2008 3:30:17am

Part 2, the wizard repost of McCain oped

To make this point, he mangles the evidence. He makes it sound as if Prime Minister Maliki has endorsed the Obama timetable, when all he has said is that he would like a plan for the eventual withdrawal of U.S. troops at some unspecified point in the future.

Senator Obama is also misleading on the Iraqi military's readiness. The Iraqi Army will be equipped and trained by the middle of next year, but this does not, as Senator Obama suggests, mean that they will then be ready to secure their country without a good deal of help. The Iraqi Air Force, for one, still lags behind, and no modern army can operate without air cover. The Iraqis are also still learning how to conduct planning, logistics, command and control, communications, and other complicated functions needed to support frontline troops.

No one favors a permanent U.S. presence, as Senator Obama charges. A partial withdrawal has already occurred with the departure of five “surge” brigades, and more withdrawals can take place as the security situation improves. As we draw down in Iraq, we can beef up our presence on other battlefields, such as Afghanistan, without fear of leaving a failed state behind. I have said that I expect to welcome home most of our troops from Iraq by the end of my first term in office, in 2013.

But I have also said that any draw-downs must be based on a realistic assessment of conditions on the ground, not on an artificial timetable crafted for domestic political reasons. This is the crux of my disagreement with Senator Obama.

Senator Obama has said that he would consult our commanders on the ground and Iraqi leaders, but he did no such thing before releasing his “plan for Iraq.” Perhaps that’s because he doesn’t want to hear what they have to say. During the course of eight visits to Iraq, I have heard many times from our troops what Major General Jeffrey Hammond, commander of coalition forces in Baghdad, recently said: that leaving based on a timetable would be “very dangerous.”

The danger is that extremists supported by Al Qaeda and Iran could stage a comeback, as they have in the past when we’ve had too few troops in Iraq. Senator Obama seems to have learned nothing from recent history. I find it ironic that he is emulating the worst mistake of the Bush administration by waving the “Mission Accomplished” banner prematurely.

I am also dismayed that he never talks about winning the war—only of ending it. But if we don’t win the war, our enemies will. A triumph for the terrorists would be a disaster for us. That is something I will not allow to happen as president. Instead I will continue implementing a proven counterinsurgency strategy not only in Iraq but also in Afghanistan with the goal of creating stable, secure, self-sustaining democratic allies.

See: wizard's repost

593 mossley  Thu, Jul 24, 2008 1:38:34pm

A bit late, but apropos: NYT ad sales rate drops 16.4% How long will it take before they acknowledge their bias is killing the paper?


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