Bloggers must be doing something right to have the msm running so scared.

I'm not sure.... would some aspect of the Sherman Anti-Trust Act apply in this case?

Great. Now we have to start making our own video and news reports, and bypass the slimestream altogether. Luckily all the technology we need is already here.

Fox is lame. Most of the stuff they use is straight off the AP which I have personally witnessed changing a local story to create a favorable impression of Sadaam. NBC is even worse than Fox.

"We are very disappointed we can't continue making money on work someone else actually created," said Redlasso Chief Executive Ken Hayward in a statement.

Luddites...

Charles, what's the effect and/or implication of this? Before this linked article, I hadn't the foggiest what ... well ... ur ... duh!

/ignorant in these matters

I hate the MSM.

re: #7 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Charles, what's the effect and/or implication of this? Before this linked article, I hadn't the foggiest what ... well ... ur ... duh!

/ignorant in these matters

The upshot is that people who foot the bill to create content deserve the authorship of it. Two things will never change:

1) Nobody wants to do hard work for free, and

2) People will always want something for nothing.

Hence the conflict.

Sounds like it benefits KOS and Huffpo...they can spout their BS and never have to back it up with supporting links.

These media outlets want to protect their copyright, which is something that authors and creators want since they don't want to see their works distributed without any compensation in return.

However, that runs into the not insignificant issue of fair use. Many bloggers post pieces under fair use, and bloggers do have a good argument that video or audio clips of same do not violate the owner's copyright.

Wiki's piece on fair use does cover the subject generally and fairly.

re: #1 Sharmuta

Yes. They reveal the truth....unless it is kos...who now is, IIRC, affiliated with NBC.

I guess the MSM thinks we are too dumb to figure out their propaganda slant to the left.

/Could they have forgotten that they are tanking, both on the newsstand and in their ratings?

Dinner time.....

So, at this stage,would CBS have put up a stink over your use of the Bush memo, seeing as they seemed to have the one and only "copy" of it?

re: #11 lawhawk

These media outlets want to protect their copyright, which is something that authors and creators want since they don't want to see their works distributed without any compensation in return.

However, that runs into the not insignificant issue of fair use. Many bloggers post pieces under fair use, and bloggers do have a good argument that video or audio clips of same do not violate the owner's copyright.

Wiki's piece on fair use does cover the subject generally and fairly.

The "fair-use doctrine" was gutted by congress at the behest of Hollywood trying to up their profits. You can't even sing "happy birthday" in a fracken' restaurant without paying royalties. Hollywood thinks highly of its garbage!

OT: Fail

re: #14 LoFlyer

The "fair-use doctrine" was gutted by congress at the behest of Hollywood trying to up their profits. You can't even sing "happy birthday" in a fracken' restaurant without paying royalties. Hollywood thinks highly of its garbage!

"gutted" by congress?

Got a link for that?

re: #9 Cognito

re: #11 lawhawk

Thanks to both of you. This is a vital aspect.

And thanks for the recommendation re the Wiki article, lawhawk. I'll still read it with a salt-shaker handy.

re: #15 Killgore Trout

OT: Fail

Classic! Too bad it was for orphans.

re: #15 Killgore Trout

OT: Fail

I wonder what the hell that was about. 20 years ago I used to do firework shows. The company we contracted with was getting into the balloon release business, and they wanted us to do balloon releases for them. We told 'em "No way, we are here for the excitement". Nothing can beat the excitement of firing a fire works show.

re: #17 pre-Boomer Marine brat

The Library of Congress' Copyright Office has a FAQ on the subject.

They're in charge of copyright in the US.

re: #16 LeePro

"gutted" by congress?

Got a link for that?

Nope, check into the "Digital rights act". pertaining to recording music and video for personal use. Really burns me up....

re: #11 lawhawk

These media outlets want to protect their copyright, which is something that authors and creators want since they don't want to see their works distributed without any compensation in return.

However, that runs into the not insignificant issue of fair use. Many bloggers post pieces under fair use, and bloggers do have a good argument that video or audio clips of same do not violate the owner's copyright.

Wiki's piece on fair use does cover the subject generally and fairly.

Of course, the authors usually see very little of the royalties; the media companies have honed their skills at getting all the money.

And if the main point were the creators getting their money, there would be a very good case for ending copyright after the death of the artists plus some time for the publisher to make some reasonable profit.

OT:

Istanbul update - Zaman

Istanbul update - BBC

In related news.
The National Dinosaur Marketing Board gave a presentation before a Congressional Committee on "The Problem of Mice." Spokesman Archy Veloceraptor stated that his organizations members were the finest examples of America's power and influence and that they demanded protection from "pesky vermin."

re: #11 lawhawk

These media outlets want to protect their copyright, which is something that authors and creators want since they don't want to see their works distributed without any compensation in return.

However, that runs into the not insignificant issue of fair use. Many bloggers post pieces under fair use, and bloggers do have a good argument that video or audio clips of same do not violate the owner's copyright.

Wiki's piece on fair use does cover the subject generally and fairly.

One of the reasons I don't run ads at my site is so I'm covered a couple of ways.

re: #14 LoFlyer

There are two recent laws that I think you're referring to - the DMCA and the Sonny Bono copyright extension act.

Of the two, the Sonny Bono act extends the duration of copyright - protecting older copyrights set to expire, including some early Disney work, which gave that law the moniker the Mickey Mouse law.

The DMCA implemented WIPO treaty provisions - harmonizing US law with the rest of the world. Title 2 of the DMCA enacted provisions relating to online copyright infringement, and I assume this is what you're referring to.

re: #15 Killgore Trout

OT: Fail

Scare the orphans!

re: #26 lawhawk

There are two recent laws that I think you're referring to - the DMCA and the Sonny Bono copyright extension act.

Of the two, the Sonny Bono act extends the duration of copyright - protecting older copyrights set to expire, including some early Disney work, which gave that law the moniker the Mickey Mouse law.

The DMCA implemented WIPO treaty provisions - harmonizing US law with the rest of the world. Title 2 of the DMCA enacted provisions relating to online copyright infringement, and I assume this is what you're referring to.

It used to be that if you owned a recording that had been legally purchased, you could then copy it for your private use. Hence the rise of recordable "cassettes" and VCR's. I guess I am referring to the DCMA which severely limits private digital reproduction of legally purchased materials. You may own the material, but you can no longer record it without permission of the distributor, which is what all the fancy encoding is about. That is total BS and and has "gutted" the "fair-use doctrine".....PS, I might not be entirely correct about this, but that is my understanding of the law. If Lawhawk and others have more current and correct info, then I will stand corrected....

The entire world wants to shove this empty suit loser down our throat...

The MSM is a dying animal in its current form...so it's gonna thrash around and try to take a few others with it while it goes down.

Prices for storage hardware will continue to fall. Fair use of content will mean control of information will slip out of their grasp even more swiftly.

Poor Dinosaur Media.

well the race party has left..
The general consensus is it was a lousy race today...
And all the beer in the world doesn't change that..
The brickyard was very disappointing this year because of tire wear..

re: #32 HoosierHoops

I caught the end of it and yes, it was quite a yawner : (

They just need to work out a revenue share for advertising that redlasso had planned on rolling out anyway.

re: #34 neocon nony

They just need to work out a revenue share for advertising that redlasso had planned on rolling out anyway.

This would be done by a central committee of some sort, presumably.

re: #32 HoosierHoops

well the race party has left..
The general consensus is it was a lousy race today...
And all the beer in the world doesn't change that..
The brickyard was very disappointing this year because of tire wear..

I was listening to the radio running errands yesterday, and they were talking about the tires and that not enough track testing was being done.....I take it that the Indy had a "bad tire" day with lots of yellow flags?

re: #26 lawhawk

At what point does something like this become public domain? (or is that too broad a question)

I hadn't seen this...kinda cool, i think.

Daughters of Iraq graduate in Diyala Province

“The four-day course the Iraqi women attended focused mainly on searching vehicles and personnel for weapons and explosives,” said Capt. Charles Knoll, commander, Charlie Battery, Fires Squadron, 2nd Stryker Cavalry Regiment. “There’s a critical need to have Iraqi females who can help search other Iraqi females. This will help us better detect and deter female suicide bombers in the future.”

Link...

I couldn't care less if all the MSM goes broke and everyone gets fired and thrown out in the street. Maybe then we could get some honest and unbiased (well, I hope it's biased in favor of civilization) news for a change.

This reminds me of how Hollywood treated the new medium of television in the 40's.

At first they ignored it. Then they fought it. Then they were swallowed by it...

I suggest we are at the beginnings of stage 2, right now.....

re: #37 sattv4u2

At what point does something like this become public domain? (or is that too broad a question)

It used to be something like 75 years for a copyrighted book or program. Apparently the Bono extension act extended that to something like perpetuity to provide income to the copyright holders, even after the original authors or actors have been long dead. Nothing is to good for the big companies owning the intellectual property.
/Our lobbyists at work, looking out for the good of the people....

re: #41 LoFlyer

It used to be something like 75 years for a copyrighted book or program. Apparently the Bono extension act extended that to something like perpetuity to provide income to the copyright holders, even after the original authors or actors have been long dead. Nothing is to good for the big companies owning the intellectual property.
/Our lobbyists at work, looking out for the good of the people....

Thanks,

re: #30 Summer

The MSM is a dying animal in its current form...so it's gonna thrash around and try to take a few others with it while it goes down.

More like a drowning animal; seizing any floating object to keep itself above water. Thus we have the music ind. suing their consumers and putting off potential buyers even more. The movie folks have done better because it wasn't until recently that movies could be downloaded (you physically had to have a copy of the movie to make more copies). The file size and thus the equipment necessary has kept most users from bothering to make copies. The movie industry also has a better business model than the music industry which has allowed them to adapt to the changing technology and viewing habits. So we come to the print and tv "news" (actually packaged as entertainment). As mentioned by others, they're sinking fast partly due to the leftist bias and also the blatant liberal arrogance that really gets folks in 'fly-over' country ticked off.

Ok so who's going to finance the cyber equivalent of AP? Actual on the ground journalists and photographers. Hmmm?
I would envision a setup that would allow anyone with news to get it put on the "air". Some central repository that allows access for minimal fee. Yeah if the "newsies" were smart, they're in the best position to be that repository but they're clinging too tightly to their out-dated way of thinking and won't realize they have to change.

The MSM isn't doing itself any favors going after popular purveyors of news and opinion.

It is like an angry master bitter about being supplanted by his student, and seeking revenge....

re: #43 jcw46

I like your thinking here....

re: #1 Sharmuta

Bloggers must be doing something right to have the msm running so scared.

I believe it's called telling the truth.

re: #43 jcw46

Switching over to a 'content-provider' role would mean giving up a lot of that sweet editorial control.

re: #43 jcw46

I would envision a setup that would allow anyone with news to get it put on the "air". Some central repository that allows access for minimal fee. Yeah if the "newsies" were smart, they're in the best position to be that repository but they're clinging too tightly to their out-dated way of thinking and won't realize they have to change.

History has always shown (unless someone can come up with an example otherwise) that industries that refuse to change to adapt to current circumstances will fail.

Innovation is heartless to those who try to resist it.

re: #46 Fat Jolly Penguin

I believe it's called telling the truth.

Yeah- there's something about that that makes some people very nervous.

Is this not defending capitalism?

I'm not familiar with Redlasso or Redlasso's possible fee structuring for downloaded clips.
It seems to me that the top bloggers in cyberspace could get together and form an association ... you know like AP (ASSOCIATED PRESS) orginally did to become itself.
Form a website/company to act as the repostitory and sell subscriptions or a download fee to those who want to download clips. From that money pay a fee to news items and photos the more popular or "hit" items would make more money and thus finance further reporting/photos.

Someday our children will go to a museum and see a copy of the New York Times displayed next to a buggy whip.

re: #52 The Other Les

Someday our children will go to a museum and see a copy of the New York Times displayed next to a buggy whip.

Hopefully, in the NYT's case, in about 5 years...

A couple attending an art exhibition at the National Gallery was staring at a portrait that had them completely confused. The painting depicted three very black and totally naked men sitting on a park bench. Two of the figures had black weenies, but the one in the middle had a pink weenie.

The curator of the gallery realized that they were having trouble interpreting the painting and offered his assessment.

He went on for nearly half an hour explaining how it depicted the sexual emasculation of African-Americans in a predominately white, patriarchal society. 'In fact,' he pointed out, 'some serious critics believe that the pink weenie also reflects the cultural and sociological oppression experienced by gay men in contemporary society.'

After the curator left, a young man in a Kentucky T-shirt approached the couple and said, “Would you like to know what the painting is really about?''

“Now why would you claim to be more of an expert than the curator of the gallery?” asked the couple.” Because I 'm the guy who painted it,” he replied.” In fact, there are no African-Americans depicted at all. They're just three Kentucky coal miners, and the guy in the middle went home for lunch.”

OT: Antiwar Hypocrites

Good short piece by Ralph Peters.

re: #53 psyop

Hopefully, in the NYT's case, in about 5 years...

The sooner, the better.

re: #48 psyop

History has always shown (unless someone can come up with an example otherwise) that industries that refuse to change to adapt to current circumstances will fail.

Innovation is heartless to those who try to resist it.

I have been noting the slow demise of the local rag, the Atlanta Journal and Communists. They have publicly admitted that the technology of the Internet has brought a great decrease in the papers being purchased by the public. They refuse to admit that their liberal bias and poor journalistic standards has anything to do with the sharp decrease in sales. They have upped their price 50 percent (That's really going to help sales) and reduced the size and content of the rag. The Internet advertising revenue is lower than print advertising, so these guys are slowly dying. My sister and I had a short sharp argument about the coming demise of the AJC, she was bemoaning the loss of jobs, I told her "Great! Its a lousy paper anyway!" She stormed out, too mad to argue with me....

The NASCAR race, The Brickyard 400 in Indianapolis sucked. They would run 10 laps and NASCAR would throw a competition yellow to allow everybody onto pit road to cahnge tires. In addition they would close pit road in between to prevent anybody form pitting early. Way to go NASCAR you got what ya wanted.
The last half of the Arena Bowl championship on the other hand was exciting with Jon Bon Jovi's Philadelphia team barley holding on to win the title over San Jose. San Jose scored 2 touchdowns in 11 seconds to make it close but wound up on the short end.

re: #32 HoosierHoops

I'm a new 'convert' to NASCAR, and at 68+ yrs, it's hard to learn the 'race-speak', and know what to watch for.
But todays caution filled tire stops wore me out.

(I'm a Rowdy fan!btw)

re: #59 Just_A_Grunt

Yeah I watched the Nascar race. Would have been better if they had let the teams decide on when to pit. There would have been a lot more accidents though.

re: #57 buzzsawmonkey

Thanks for the info. One question:

leftwing academics who have been trying to gut the copyright law for the last decade plus

What's their motivation? Merely anti-establishment?

OT, but very important.
If the Red Sox don't beat the Yankees tonight, I'm taking a hostage (preferably female,,,,,, perhaps latino of asian,,,, 36 D,,,,, )

re: #50 Racer X

Is this not defending capitalism?

Heh. Well one of the problems with "free" markets and capitalism is the tendency for those participating entities to attempt to gain a monopoly to maximize their control and the profits from any source of potential revenue. "Pure" capitalism can be deadly and "free" markets become closed very quickly without some outside force or entity acting as referee/umpire keeping things level and competitive.

The U.S. has done well so far but the last few years of allowing so many mergers has put us at the mercy of singular forces/entities (many from foreign/unfriendly states) that don't have the country's best interests at heart. The News media is one of the areas where this has occurred and so we had a degradation in the quality and objectivity or reporting going on thus was created;
The Blogosphere and the free-wheeling exchange of information and the "networking" (in so many ways) of like-minded people and organizations. This has become a threat to the monopolists and so the attempts to stifle the internet is gaining strength.

of = or

re: #61 Racer X

Yeah I watched the Nascar race. Would have been better if they had let the teams decide on when to pit. There would have been a lot more accidents though.

and your point is? ...hehehe just kidd'n
boring race..

re: #62 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Immunity from plagerism laws probably!

re: #60 Dizzy26

I'm a new 'convert' to NASCAR, and at 68+ yrs, it's hard to learn the 'race-speak', and know what to watch for.
But todays caution filled tire stops wore me out.

(I'm a Rowdy fan!btw)

/are you related to dizzy dean?
/
regards

re: #68 HoosierHoops

Nope, not even close!

Long-------long story..

thanks for asking anyway.

Another bridge problem in Minnesota.

Authorites say a six foot section of concrete fell from the Maryland Avenue bridge onto 35E below. It either hit a car directly or a car ran into it. Nobody in that vehicle was injured.

The Minnesota Department of Transportation called in inspectors to check the underside of the bridge and knock off any other loose debris.

This is what happens when taxpayer's money is spent on toy trains for Socialists instead of highway maintenance.

re: #50 Racer X

Is this not defending capitalism?

The "fair use doctrine" stated that after a specific amount of time, anything published was considered public domain, something like 75 years. This allowed the creators of the "intellectual property" to earn revenue during their life-times, and when they passed on, the property became public domain. The new laws allow the companies holding the copyrights to maintain the their "intellectual property rights" for perpetuity and charge for using the property for-ever. The original artists are long dead, this is a set up for the big guys to continue making money with nothing being given to the long dead artists families or estates. To place this in perspective, the US patent is for seven years, then the process is public domain. Why should Hollywood be given intellectual rights forever?

re: #66 HoosierHoops

Yes it was a boring race. They should call this one the pit crew 400.

re: #57 buzzsawmonkey

The orphan works bill is going to be a nightmare for working artist, musician, etc. I hope someone in Congress is paying attention to what is in that bill.

re: #66 HoosierHoops

and your point is? ...hehehe just kidd'n
boring race..

Can someone tell me something? when did they reshape the tracks?
I happened to watch some of some race and noticed that the track really has only 2 turns! Not the 4 of the old style oval. what's up with that? Why don't they just buy some abandoned railroad right of way and make a straight track 400 miles long? What's the skill in making 2 turns and 1 sweeper turn? I loved dirt track racing that's where the skill is.

wonder why anyone would have a bike race during the hottest couple of weeks in chicago? when may would have been much nicer weather for it.

re: #52 The Other Les

Someday our children will go to a museum and see a copy of the New York Times displayed next to a buggy whip.

Jason Blair will write a lovely article comparing the two.

re: #72 Racer X

yep, boooring, and they sure messed with Toyota and the 'better' mousetrap they came up with!
(or is that only the Nationwide cars?]
(I'm not very mechanechual, actually)

re: #74 jcw46

Can someone tell me something? when did they reshape the tracks?
I happened to watch some of some race and noticed that the track really has only 2 turns! Not the 4 of the old style oval. what's up with that? Why don't they just buy some abandoned railroad right of way and make a straight track 400 miles long? What's the skill in making 2 turns and 1 sweeper turn? I loved dirt track racing that's where the skill is.

They need to keep the cash flowing at the IMS. Which is also why a road race course was incorporated into the speedway.

re: #62 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Thanks for the info. One question:

What's their motivation? Merely anti-establishment?

They want free stuff.

re: #73 seekeroftruth

The orphan works bill is going to be a nightmare for working artist, musician, etc. I hope someone in Congress is paying attention to what is in that bill.

I have no sympathy for the "artists" that have been milking the public for decades with artificially high prices. Why should I pay the same price for a CD first published 20 years ago, as I do for a CD published last month. Time does degrade the physical and intellectual object value to the consumer. Hollywood seems to feel that Intellectual property never degrades. Congress agrees.

re: #76 debutaunt

Jason Blair will write a lovely article comparing the two.

From the nice coffer shop just around the corner from his house.

re: #74 jcw46

Can someone tell me something? when did they reshape the tracks?
I happened to watch some of some race and noticed that the track really has only 2 turns! Not the 4 of the old style oval. what's up with that? Why don't they just buy some abandoned railroad right of way and make a straight track 400 miles long? What's the skill in making 2 turns and 1 sweeper turn? I loved dirt track racing that's where the skill is.

Well my friend..there are alot of different shapes of tracks..And a champion needs to drive big ovals, little ovals, roadtracks. short tracks. It is a true test of an all around driver..
I don't think a track exists with only 2 turns..

re: #79 debutaunt

They want free stuff.

They want to use it, then claim it as theirs!... and then avoid getting called on it.

Just my opinion of the left

re: #82 buzzsawmonkey

While I long ago learned to stop asking "why?" when queried about other people's motivations, I will hazard a guess or two:

1) To make a name for yourself in academia, you have to come up with a new territory to stake out. That is one reason for revisionist history; if everything else about the Civil War has been covered and you need something new for your PhD thesis, why then, you write about George McClellan's homosexual jealousy of President Lincoln. By the same token, if you want to make a name for yourself in copyright law, stake out an area in the new internet technology and start discussing the reasons that it changes everything. You get a bad-boy reputation, the kiddies will love you, and you are assured of a spot on all the talk shows and at all the committee hearings as a main spokesperson of "the other side."

2) Copyright, as it is enshrined in the Constitution, has a "public good" aspect. This is meat and drink to the leftist academic, as a leftist never saw a piece of property he didn't want to give to somebody other than the owner for the benefit of the public. Since there is a public good aspect to copyright law--and, of course, everyone is for the public good--worthless ideas easily gain traction.

3) Many copyrights are held by--gasp!--large corporations, such as film companies or record companies. Lots of people love to hate large corporations--even the commercial artists who depend on them for livelihood. The fact that the artists and the large corporations they reflexively hate have similar interests in protecting their work is something that individual artists have been often persuaded to forget--in other words, they allow their reflexive hatred of the big boys to forget that they and the big boys have the same interests in this area. By the same token, lots of file-sharers justified their thefts of music on the grounds that the nasty ol' music companies were charging too much for CDs--the same argument which a teenager uses to justify his shoplifting at the five and dime. The fact that a $15 CD is in fact cheaper (in actual dollars) than an album which sold for $5 thirty years ago got lost in the shuffle during those discussions.

I respectfully disagree with you on this one....(I know, this is a minority opinion...)

Mark Twain argued for granting copyrights in perpetuity and that they should be treated the same as real estate or ownership of other property. I agree with him in regards to certain works: i.e. fiction, historical commentary, biography, etc.

I do not agree that news services should have the same rights. They are reporting, not creating. News is, or ought to be, the reporting of events as they actually occur; who, what, where, when and maybe how. The "why" is commentary and, in my view, may be protected if the author is credited. If authors of such commentaries choose to sell their rights to news services, that's their business.

Bloggers who link to news services are doing them a service by expanding their audience and have every right to profit by that service.

If you wish to argue this point, I am at your service.

re: #48 psyop

History has always shown (unless someone can come up with an example otherwise) that industries that refuse to change to adapt to current circumstances will fail.

Innovation is heartless to those who try to resist it.

it's an evolutionary process.......

/white smoke

re: #43 jcw46

More like a drowning animal; seizing any floating object to keep itself above water. Thus we have the music ind. suing their consumers and putting off potential buyers even more. The movie folks have done better because it wasn't until recently that movies could be downloaded (you physically had to have a copy of the movie to make more copies). The file size and thus the equipment necessary has kept most users from bothering to make copies. The movie industry also has a better business model than the music industry which has allowed them to adapt to the changing technology and viewing habits. So we come to the print and tv "news" (actually packaged as entertainment). As mentioned by others, they're sinking fast partly due to the leftist bias and also the blatant liberal arrogance that really gets folks in 'fly-over' country ticked off.

Ok so who's going to finance the cyber equivalent of AP? Actual on the ground journalists and photographers. Hmmm?
I would envision a setup that would allow anyone with news to get it put on the "air". Some central repository that allows access for minimal fee. Yeah if the "newsies" were smart, they're in the best position to be that repository but they're clinging too tightly to their out-dated way of thinking and won't realize they have to change.

"jcw" -

"PAJAMAS MEDIA?" writ large!

-S-

There's nothing wrong with content producers trying to keep control over their intellectual property! Bloggers and "services" who are leeching off mainstream media content suck. Quoting from copyrighted content, fair use, has always been allowed. Beyond that there's nothing to whine about.

Despite Red Lasso being sued. Bloggers have more than enough capability and opportunity to present video clips for embedding in their own sites. The real trouble comes when they start suing Bloggers directly like the RIAA does with MP3 files.

re: #82 buzzsawmonkey

Thanks again. Must be too late in the day. #1 (and some of #2) hadn't occured to me.

re: #80 LoFlyer

My thoughts were on art work, not music when I was writing my post. I was thinking of the lesser know painters, sculptors, who could be at the mercy of a less than honest person who could say that they could not locate the copyright holder after a "good faith search." So many crafters and artists have had their artwork stolen by foreign companies - mostly China owned. This orphan bill will open that problem up even more.

However, watching what is happening to bloggers, fair use, Hollywood, etc, I do agree with your viewpoint.

re: #83 HoosierHoops

Well my friend..there are alot of different shapes of tracks..And a champion needs to drive big ovals, little ovals, roadtracks. short tracks. It is a true test of an all around driver..
I don't think a track exists with only 2 turns..

any drag strip, for one.....

re: #79 debutaunt

They want free stuff.

Then when are they going to start suing the drug cartels?

re: #87 USBeast

Mark Twain argued for granting copyrights in perpetuity and that they should be treated the same as real estate or ownership of other property. I agree with him in regards to certain works: i.e. fiction, historical commentary, biography, etc.

I do not agree that news services should have the same rights. They are reporting, not creating. News is, or ought to be, the reporting of events as they actually occur; who, what, where, when and maybe how. The "why" is commentary and, in my view, may be protected if the author is credited. If authors of such commentaries choose to sell their rights to news services, that's their business.

Bloggers who link to news services are doing them a service by expanding their audience and have every right to profit by that service.

If you wish to argue this point, I am at your service.

At some point the knowledge, process or intellectual idea must be passed into public domain to ensure to allow the public (and civilization) to make best use of the intellectual property. Example: the printing press. If the patent for the intellectual rights for the printing press had been for perpetuity, we would still be barefoot and pregnant in the the feudal middle ages. I know this sounds like socialism, but its not....

re: #85 buzzsawmonkey

The orphan works bill is not going to be as bad as the artists are being told it is; the stories about works being orphaned wholesale are nonsense. But the bill is going to be bad because it expands fair use and structurally weakens copyright as a whole. The sad thing is that the artists were asleep at the switch five or so years ago when they could have nipped it in the bud, and are now opposing the bill based on a dizzying assemblage of wrong information.

Thank you for your clarification! I've been trying to understand this . It is really hard to get information that the basic unwashed masses can understand. There is a lot of conflicting information out there as well.

re: #83 HoosierHoops

re: #94 redc1c4

If NASCAR or Indy really wants to find out who the best driver is, have half the cars go around the track one way, the other half go around the other way!

re: #88 redc1c4

it's an evolutionary process.......

/white smoke

LOL!

*wipes beer off of keyboard*

re: #91 Egfrow

Despite Red Lasso being sued. Bloggers have more than enough capability and opportunity to present video clips for embedding in their own sites. The real trouble comes when they start suing Bloggers directly like the RIAA does with MP3 files.

"Eg" -

As an old "alleged pirate" from pre- Phonogram days (1972 for all 'y'all in Rio Linda), I have studiously avoided stuff like Morpheus for that reason. RedLasso is a different deal - sounds more like "Fair Usage" to me.

-S-

re: #94 redc1c4

any drag strip, for one.....

LOL
dragstrips have turns?
/

re: #100 Dr. Shalit

Reply to Self -

AND - I bet if RedLasso was bought by GOOGLE, the POOP would stop instantaneously.

-S-

re: #102 buzzsawmonkey

That makes sense. Thanks for explanation.

re: #102 buzzsawmonkey

There is such a thing as a market. If the price is too high, people don't buy the product. If you get a catalog of DVDs in the mail, you'll note that the obscure films--which some people value far more than the Big Name films--are much cheaper, because, being obscure, fewer people want to buy them. I can get "Dick Tracey Versus Pruneface" for far less than "Casablanca" because "Casablanca" is in more demand, and therefore can command a higher price. The fact that I may be a Dick Tracey obsessive and value "Pruneface" more than "Casablanca" is my good luck.

Well when I walk into a "record store" (what do they call them nowadays) and purchase a 30 year old "Steely Dan" CD for the same price as "Icecubes" latest rap CD then we have a problem. IceCube is selling 1,000,000 a year, Steely Dan is selling at 35,000 a year. Supply and demand do not enter into the business model. I am being ripped off.

re: #102 buzzsawmonkey

There is such a thing as a market. If the price is too high, people don't buy the product. If you get a catalog of DVDs in the mail, you'll note that the obscure films--which some people value far more than the Big Name films--are much cheaper, because, being obscure, fewer people want to buy them. I can get "Dick Tracey Versus Pruneface" for far less than "Casablanca" because "Casablanca" is in more demand, and therefore can command a higher price. The fact that I may be a Dick Tracey obsessive and value "Pruneface" more than "Casablanca" is my good luck.

"Buzz" -

You are right on this one. Let us just say some DVD's have been cut on my Daewoo Model 06 of old movies that I like. As a cable subscriber, I assume I have the same right to burn a DVD as I would have to "download" to my Cable Company's DVR.

-S-

Got to run guys, I might BBL. Thanks for the debate and information. I love civilized talk and debate......

re: #105 LoFlyer

Well when I walk into a "record store" (what do they call them nowadays) and purchase a 30 year old "Steely Dan" CD for the same price as "Icecubes" latest rap CD then we have a problem. IceCube is selling 1,000,000 a year, Steely Dan is selling at 35,000 a year. Supply and demand do not enter into the business model. I am being ripped off.

"Lo" -

If it were valuable enough for you to buy it, and you did, effectively, "the Market" worked. I might just pay +/- $10 for an old "recording" I might not have. For "ICECUBES" latest "RAP(e)" CD - I wouldn't pay 2 cents.

-S-

re: #107 LoFlyer

Got to run guys, I might BBL. Thanks for the debate and information. I love civilized talk and debate......

yet you still come here !

(kidding)

The MSM sources pay the expense of maintaining news gathering organizations around the world. I get that they don't want others to use their material for profit. But in a way the MSM brought all this on themselves. If they reported the news in a thoughtful and balanced manner more people might actually listen to their analysis as well. But they don't. The MSM paints every story they cover to promote their preconceived notions about why things are like they are. Which is what starts all the jaws a flapping on the internets.

re: #74 jcw46

Can someone tell me something? when did they reshape the tracks?
I happened to watch some of some race and noticed that the track really has only 2 turns! Not the 4 of the old style oval. what's up with that? Why don't they just buy some abandoned railroad right of way and make a straight track 400 miles long? What's the skill in making 2 turns and 1 sweeper turn? I loved dirt track racing that's where the skill is.

Several problems with that idea.
1. The fans would only get to see a few moments of the race.
2. Filming would have to be done using several choppers.
3. The track would be too narrow.

Better solution would be to stick the cars on individual dinos.
1. They would remain stationary so filming would be easier.
2. Nodanger of wrecks or slamming the wall.
3. Obstacals could be built into the course such as a 40% slope hill.
4. Fans could walk down, talk to the drivers and even get autographs without any disruption to the race.

FWIW, they could just use any of the interactive programs out there and do it all from the comfort of home.

re: #112 JeremyR

Several problems with that idea.
1. The fans would only get to see a few moments of the race.
2. Filming would have to be done using several choppers.
3. The track would be too narrow.

Better solution would be to stick the cars on individual dinos.
1. They would remain stationary so filming would be easier.
2. Nodanger of wrecks or slamming the wall.
3. Obstacals could be built into the course such as a 40% slope hill.
4. Fans could walk down, talk to the drivers and even get autographs without any disruption to the race.

FWIW, they could just use any of the interactive programs out there and do it all from the comfort of home.

/don't give NASCAR any ideas...

Thank you so much for the explanation. It's much appreciated.
This is really confusing. It seems that not only the little guy, but the bigger companies are going to get hit with this Orphan law if it gets passed. But at the same time, this law seems to be the opposite of the AP/MSM versus the bloggers lawsuits. In those, the lawsuits are looking for greater, not lesser, copyright laws.

re: #84 Dizzy26

They want to use it, then claim it as theirs!... and then avoid getting called on it.

Just my opinion of the left

As a member of the academic RIGHT, I disagree with your blanket libel. I am not a cheat, I work my ass off, getting my facts straight, before I write a single word. . .while the stereotypes may apply to some, not to me, or many of my coworkers. . .

re: #111 Mich-again

The MSM sources pay the expense of maintaining news gathering organizations around the world. I get that they don't want others to use their material for profit. But in a way the MSM brought all this on themselves. If they reported the news in a thoughtful and balanced manner more people might actually listen to their analysis as well. But they don't. The MSM paints every story they cover to promote their preconceived notions about why things are like they are. Which is what starts all the jaws a flapping on the internets.

Right, the photoshopped images, the closing of offices in places like th Middle East. . .and Asia are a result of these cost cutting measures, and mean that they are not using professionals as sources anymore. . .hmmm

re: #115 DisturbedEma

They have a word for it. . .

And it is REALLY bad

re: #113 HoosierHoops

/don't give NASCAR any ideas...

IIRC, NASCAR = Non Athletic Sport Centered Arround Rednecks. I think I'm the only red neck on right now.

re: #108 Dr. Shalit

Reply to Self -

LoFlyer actually HAS a point - depreciation - works well for physical assets, like cars, tv's, cameras, computers and peripherals. When I look up the "Wholesale Trade In" prices of "STUFF" I have bought - I often wonder whether I should laugh or cry. Intellectual Property is more "Open Market,"
than Physical Stuff. In fact, the first time I came up against depreciation/market was when i wanted to buy a 35mm f 2.8 Minolta MC Celtic lens (used). The price was the same as it was about 20 years earlier as a new lens, with warranty. There was "no negotiation" - in response, I bought an Olympus Stylus with a 35mm lens (Film Camera) for a few dollars more and had two camera systems. The "market" worked - AND - I had two GOOD (film) camera systems.

-S-

re: #113 HoosierHoops

"H-H" -

Seems to me the only "new Idea" NASCAR has had lately is "TOYOTA!"

-S-

re: #117 DisturbedEma

And Publicity may not save you

re: #118 JeremyR

IIRC, NASCAR = Non Athletic Sport Centered Arround Rednecks. I think I'm the only red neck on right now.

you guys..and i mean you too doc. are cracking me up...
My dad worked in racing for 40 years.. I've been around it all my life..but seriously..have interest every so sunday..just mostly Indy..

re: #115 DisturbedEma

Well, you're certainly not the left then.

The ones I refer to, do exactly what I said. And then they skate. with
the 'professional help of professors, media reporters and owners, and
the rest of the moonbat medias' complicity!

No offense to hard working, original, hardworking types intended.

re: #96 LoFlyer

At some point the knowledge, process or intellectual idea must be passed into public domain to ensure to allow the public (and civilization) to make best use of the intellectual property. Example: the printing press. If the patent for the intellectual rights for the printing press had been for perpetuity, we would still be barefoot and pregnant in the the feudal middle ages. I know this sounds like socialism, but its not....

Patent and copyright are two entirely different things. You can invent and patent a new device for producing a printed page. You cannot recreate "The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn".

The rules for when a copyrighted work passes into public domain are idiotic and arbitrary. Most works are forgotten long before the copyrights expire. The few (like Twain's) that last deserve to be protected and treated as property of the creators with full rights to their heirs and assigns...in perpetuity.

re: #105 LoFlyer

Well when I walk into a "record store" (what do they call them nowadays) and purchase a 30 year old "Steely Dan" CD for the same price as "Icecubes" latest rap CD then we have a problem. IceCube is selling 1,000,000 a year, Steely Dan is selling at 35,000 a year. Supply and demand do not enter into the business model. I am being ripped off.

Music does not have an expiration date, nor does it degrade over time, and it is your choice to pay for the CD. Besides, to even compare those two artists is futile, Steely Dan is great music, the other product is crap.

re: #125 buzzsawmonkey

Neither idiotic nor arbitrary: life of the author plus 70 years for works generally; 95 years in the case of works made for hire, as these are usually held by corporations which potentially have perpetual "life."

What is hilarious is the suggestion that the people interested in gutting the copyright term are in any way concerned with the public domain. Placing something into the public domain is the surest way to guarantee it will vanish from sight, as without a potential financial interest nobody has the slightest interest in preserving it.

Twain died in 1910. Are you saying that rights to his intellectual property should be denied to his heirs (or theirs) because an arbitrary period of time has elapsed?

If you create it, it's yours...forever. If you choose to sell it, license reproduction of it or throw it in the street, that's your business. If you choose to pass your ownership to your children or anyone else, that too is your business.

To be denied your right to ownership of your creation by arbitrary legislation is theft, pure and simple.

re: #125 buzzsawmonkey

Neither idiotic nor arbitrary: life of the author plus 70 years for works generally; 95 years in the case of works made for hire, as these are usually held by corporations which potentially have perpetual "life."

What is hilarious is the suggestion that the people interested in gutting the copyright term are in any way concerned with the public domain. Placing something into the public domain is the surest way to guarantee it will vanish from sight, as without a potential financial interest nobody has the slightest interest in preserving it.

So, if works in the public domain vanish from sight, I might have trouble finding the works of Shakespeare, Poe, and many others, whose works have had the copyright long since lapse.
Yet I can go into any semi-decent bookstore and find several printings of these.
I can also buy the scores for Beethoven, Bach, Vivaldi, works, and others. Obviously the recordings of performances are separately covered.
Great works don't disappear; there are many publishers happy to get the steady income for them. Not the millions of a best-seller, but they still do well.

When the NYT publishes stolen classified documents wouldn’t they be in violation of both the Fair use/Copy write laws and National Security laws?

So of those classified documents read like a PhD’s thesis.

re: #129 buzzsawmonkey

Go looking for the works of E. Phillips Oppenheim sometime, or Edgar Wallace, or the works of Saxe Rohmer that are less well known than his "Fu Manchu" books, if you are looking to do some research into the origins of the conventions of the adventure story.

You won't find them in print. You won't find them in libraries, because the libraries that are supposed to be the repositories of public domain works pulp those works in favor of getting in extra copies of the new Danielle Steele novel.

Try and find the books of Surtees.

Try and find the actual books published by Rudyard Kipling--a Nobel Prize winner, only 70 years dead--except for the Jungle Books, Kim, and the "Just So Stories." You won't find them; you will maybe find a few "greatest hits" excerpts.

When was the last time you saw a copy of William Bolitho's Murder for Profit in print? In a library?

The essays of Hakluyt?

The public domain has a lot of stuff that is free to all comers--if you can find it. Most of it, you can't. Yes, you can get the Greatest Hits of Western Culture, but you can't get much beyond that unless you are not only willing to dig but very, very lucky.

It's bed time so I won't go into all the other authors but you mentioned Kipling.

Redlasso had more buffering-action than a CostCo sized bottle of pain reliever. Good riddance.