LGF

more options

  

Advertisement

The Candidates on Evolution

Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 6:16:55 pm PDT

At Physics Today, here are the stated opinions of the presidential candidates on six important science-related issues: Where do they stand on science? Six questions for the candidates.

On evolution:

John McCain on teaching evolution

From his 2005 book “Character is Destiny”:

“Darwin helped explain nature’s laws. He did not speculate, in his published theories at least, on the origin of life. He did not exclude God, for Whom the immensity of time is but a moment, from our presence. The only undeniable challenge the theory of evolution poses to Christian beliefs is its obvious contradiction of the idea that God created the world as it is in less than a week. But our faith is certainly not so weak that it can be shaken to learn that a biblical metaphor is not literal history. Nature doesn’t threaten our faith. On the contrary, when we contemplate its beauty and mysteries we cannot quiet in our heart an insistent impulse of belief that for all its variations and inevitable change, before its creation, in a time before time, God let it be so, and, thus, its many splendors and purposes abide in His purpose.”

More from CBN News.

CNN: “I believe in evolution,” Sen. John McCain said. “But I also believe, when I hike the Grand Canyon and see it at sunset, that the hand of God is there also.”

[...]

Barack Obama on teaching evolution

Media Bistro: “It’s not ‘faith’ if you are absolutely certain,” Obama said, noting that he didn’t believe his lack of “faith” would hurt him in a national election. “Evolution is more grounded in my experience than angels.”

UPDATE at 7/30/08 6:36:10 pm:

Another quote from Barack Obama on evolution:

Q: York County was recently in the news for a lawsuit involving the teaching of intelligent design. What’s your attitude regarding the teaching of evolution in public schools?

A: “I’m a Christian, and I believe in parents being able to provide children with religious instruction without interference from the state. But I also believe our schools are there to teach worldly knowledge and science. I believe in evolution, and I believe there’s a difference between science and faith. That doesn’t make faith any less important than science. It just means they’re two different things. And I think it’s a mistake to try to cloud the teaching of science with theories that frankly don’t hold up to scientific inquiry.”

Advertisement

578 comments

  • Comments are open and unmoderated, and do not necessarily reflect the views of Little Green Footballs.
  • Obscene, abusive, silly, or annoying remarks may be deleted, but the fact that particular comments remain on the site in no way constitutes an endorsement of their views by Little Green Footballs.
  • Posts that contain phone numbers, street addresses, email addresses or other personal information will also be deleted, as will posts that consist only of a variation on the word, "First!"
  • Comments that advocate violence will be cause for immediate banning with no appeal.
  • Disagreement and debate are welcome, but insults and abuse are not, and may cause your account to be blocked.
  • REMEMBER: posting comments at LGF is a privilege, not a right. Abuse that privilege, and your account will be blocked.

Hide comments | Jump to bottom

1 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:19:15pm

Liked both comments actually. That make me a nutjob?

2 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:19:26pm

To answer McCain:

Indeed.

3 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:20:38pm
But our faith is certainly not so weak that it can be shaken to learn that a biblical metaphor is not literal history

McCain 08!

4 CyanSnowHawk  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:21:16pm

So, McCain puts forth his believe in a straightforward and easy to understand manner, while Obama goes the "politi-speak" you can believe you heard what you wanted route.

I know who I am voting for.

5 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:21:23pm

re: #3 experiencedtraveller

McCain 08!

Oh, of course.

6 winston06  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:22:51pm

McCain 2008. No to Obama

7 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:23:43pm
But our faith is certainly not so weak that it can be shaken to learn that a biblical metaphor is not literal history. Nature doesn’t threaten our faith.

Well said, Senator.

The question now becomes will certain groups stay home and not vote for him because of this position, or will they claim it was his VP selection of Romney that made them stay home?

8 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:23:49pm

So evolution won't be a campaign issue, eh?

9 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:24:21pm

re: #5 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Oh, of course.

Unless you have a better choice. I'm all ears! (Easy now....)

10 Jim in Virginia  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:24:58pm

So, they're both godless infidels!
/sarc off

11 Pvt Bin Jammin  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:25:14pm

McCain's statement is well thought out. WTF is Obama really saying here.

12 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:25:30pm
Nature doesn’t threaten our faith. On the contrary, when we contemplate its beauty and mysteries we cannot quiet in our heart an insistent impulse of belief that for all its variations and inevitable change, before its creation, in a time before time, God let it be so, and, thus, its many splendors and purposes abide in His purpose.


Who knew McCain was so eloquent?

13 Dekar  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:25:30pm

That was a beautifully written excerpt by McCain

14 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:26:20pm

McCain speaks from the heart. Obama reads from a prepared speech on a teleprompter.

15 Pshawalaw  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:26:49pm

“Evolution is more grounded in my experience than angels.” -BHO

I've noticed that his stances are evolving, even if he hasn't been hanging with any angels.

16 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:26:50pm

re: #14 FurryOldGuyJeans

Nice avatar.

17 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:26:52pm
18 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:27:01pm

MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN!
MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN!
MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN!
MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN!
MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN!
MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN!
MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN!
MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN!
MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN!
MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN!
MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN!
MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN! MCCAIN!

19 geata  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:27:22pm

Can someone interpret Obama's comments?

(preferably in Spanish)

20 Tarkus289  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:27:24pm

re: #18 MandyManners

Its been a while.

21 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:27:38pm

re: #16 Killgore Trout

Nice avatar.

A picture of me in the morning before I have had my coffee.

///

22 americankestrel  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:27:42pm

... Obama said, noting that he didn’t believe his lack of “faith” would hurt him a national election. ...

Kinda interesting for a man who attended the same church for 20 years.

23 Tarkus289  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:27:42pm

re: #19 geata

loco

24 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:27:44pm

re: #11 Pvt Bin Jammin

McCain's statement is well thought out. WTF is Obama really saying here.

That he's a gravy-sucking pig.

25 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:28:03pm

re: #11 Pvt Bin Jammin

I'm not sure, but there are pro-evolution groups supporting Obama.

Acutually, I think this might be a clearer statement by Obama on evolution:

Q: York County was recently in the news for a lawsuit involving the teaching of intelligent design. What’s your attitude regarding the teaching of evolution in public schools?

A: “I’m a Christian, and I believe in parents being able to provide children with religious instruction without interference from the state.

But I also believe our schools are there to teach worldly knowledge and science. I believe in evolution, and I believe there’s a difference between science and faith. That doesn’t make faith any less important than science. It just means they’re two different things. And I think it’s a mistake to try to cloud the teaching of science with theories that frankly don’t hold up to scientific inquiry.“

26 Pshawalaw  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:28:14pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

Who knew McCain was so eloquent?

That really is eloquent. Almost Lincolnesque.

27 CynicalConservative  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:28:16pm

re: #18 MandyManners

I second that!

28 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:28:20pm
29 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:28:31pm

re: #7 Sharmuta

I'll definitely vote for him if Romney is the Veep! Or Tom Tancredo!

30 Jim in Virginia  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:29:16pm

OT, NRO notes that Tim Kaine has cancelled an appearance tomorrow night-speculating he may win the veepstakes.
Tim Kaine- because he's done such a good job solving Virginia's transportation crisis.
Tim Kaine-as much foreign policy experiecen as Obama. (He's been to Honduras.)

31 CynicalConservative  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:29:17pm

re: #28 buzzsawmonkey

Great band or an obscure first baseman?

32 Pshawalaw  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:29:23pm

re: #22 americankestrel

... Obama said, noting that he didn’t believe his lack of “faith” would hurt him a national election. ...

Kinda interesting for a man who attended the same church for 20 years.

Yes, but it was a church where angels do not tread.

33 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:29:38pm

BTW, if you aren't boycotting Youtube...go to it, type in Eva Cassidy and listen to any effing thing she sings.

Amazing vocalist. She's died a few years back. Way to early, but, it is what it is.

34 Pvt Bin Jammin  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:30:07pm

re: #17 buzzsawmonkey

LOL The entire Obama campaign indeed.
McCAIN '08!

35 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:30:27pm
“Evolution is more grounded in my experience than angels.”

What a flaming narcissist. obama- evolution is not more grounded because of your experience. It is grounded because it holds up under scientific scrutiny. Get over yourself.

36 Jim in Virginia  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:30:46pm

re: #18 MandyManners
What happened to Rudy?

37 Pvt Bin Jammin  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:30:59pm

re: #19 geata

No comprende?

38 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:31:27pm
39 Tarkus289  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:31:52pm

re: #38 buzzsawmonkey

Great band.

40 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:32:03pm

re: #36 Jim in Virginia

A effing G MFer! Whoo Hoo!

And "Clean Up Our Citys Czar"!

41 NemoParticularis  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:32:30pm

Terrific. Evolution AND politics. As the sides line up, the usual fusillade begins in 5...4...3...2...

42 Jim in Virginia  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:34:00pm

For those who don't like Obana but aren't yet sold on McCain: recall 1992 when folks mad at Bush 1 voted for Perot, and got eight years of Clinton.
OK, off the soapbox.

43 Pshawalaw  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:34:20pm

re: #38 buzzsawmonkey

Yes.


Yes never played first base.

44 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:34:24pm

re: #36 Jim in Virginia

Sorry Jim. Got a little excited there.

45 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:34:34pm

re: #27 CynicalConservative

I second that!

8-)

46 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:34:51pm

re: #28 buzzsawmonkey

Who?

John Sidney McCain III.

47 Tarkus289  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:35:12pm

re: #43 Pshawalaw

No, but they played Madison Sq. Garden, and I was there....many times.

48 freetoken  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:35:40pm

McCain though has waffled a bit on the teaching of ID:

On Tuesday, though, he sided with the president on two issues that have made headlines recently: teaching intelligent design in schools and Cindy Sheehan, the grieving mother who has come to personify the anti-war movement.

McCain told the Star that, like Bush, he believes "all points of view" should be available to students studying the origins of mankind.

You can search and find various links like this from the 2005 era.

49 Pshawalaw  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:35:52pm

re: #47 Tarkus289

I am envious, I bet those were great shows.

50 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:35:54pm

re: #35 Sharmuta

What a flaming narcissist. obama- evolution is not more grounded because of your experience. It is grounded because it holds up under scientific scrutiny. Get over yourself.

Spot on, Sharmuta!

51 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:35:55pm

Ahhh, the Grand Canyon is a major pain in the a** hole in the ground delaying travel from here to there per the early settlers of this country. Phhttt. And the Alaska Wasteland where ANWAR is located is a frozen vacant useless hellhole where we should be drilling the heck out of it! There is a pipeline only 75 miles away from the drill site in ANWAR!

52 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:36:13pm

re: #36 Jim in Virginia

*runs sobbing into the night*

53 Jim in Virginia  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:36:16pm

re: #40 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

G MFer? Wha?
(I'm dense tonight)

54 Tarkus289  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:37:06pm

re: #49 Pshawalaw

Yea, saw them in most of the incarnations, a few times on the rotating stage.

55 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:37:21pm
56 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:37:34pm

re: #25 lawhawk

And I think it’s a mistake to try to cloud the teaching of science with theories that frankly don’t hold up to scientific inquiry.“

That might be the first rational thing I've heard him say.

57 cutestguy[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:38:10pm
58 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:38:16pm

re: #51 LEGION

Can you imagine being the first settler types who showed up at the Grand Canyon. Still surprised there isn't a pretty good size city there from the wagon trains who got there and just said, "Screw it." and stayed.

59 Jim in Virginia  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:38:35pm

re: #52 MandyManners

Oh no, I'm so sorry to bring up painful memories. Please forgive me.
He was my first choice too.

60 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:38:40pm

re: #53 Jim in Virginia

attorney effing general.

61 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:38:44pm
62 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:38:46pm

re: #55 buzzsawmonkey

But the caribou! The caribou!

Mmmmmmm Caribou!

63 rightymouse  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:39:00pm
Barack Obama on teaching evolution

Media Bistro: “It’s not ‘faith’ if you are absolutely certain,” Obama said, noting that he didn’t believe his lack of “faith” would hurt him in a national election. “Evolution is more grounded in my experience than angels.”

My head hurts.

64 Pshawalaw  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:39:02pm

re: #48 freetoken

I expect that he is not supporting ID as much as supporting the expression that God can still be mentioned in public.

65 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:39:10pm

Gov. Haley Barbour- R La- B-slapped left wing psycho blonde smartass subbing for Colmes on Hannity & Colmes. Lying Obama shill on the oil questions she is.

66 died of a theory  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:39:14pm

If MandyManners supports McCain, that is enough for me!

67 CynicalConservative  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:39:19pm

re: #62 jcm

Mmmmmmm Caribou!

Are you sharing?

68 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:39:21pm

re: #55 buzzsawmonkey

But the caribou! The caribou!

Please let me say this...

Screw the caribou.

69 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:39:43pm

re: #62 jcm

Mmmmmmm Caribou!

Ok. Ick.

70 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:40:09pm
71 Tarkus289  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:40:14pm

re: #58 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I believe Tom Tancredo's grandfather was traveling across the country looking for Utah, and when he saw the Rocky Mountains he said, F*ck that, we are staying right here.

72 died of a theory  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:40:16pm

re: #65 LEGION

And Karl Rove (magnificent Bastard!) cleaned the bitch's clock too!

73 cutestguy[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:40:19pm
74 rightymouse  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:40:23pm

re: #69 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Ok. Ick.

Steady there, big fellah...

75 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:41:11pm

re: #71 Tarkus289

Dig it.

76 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:41:11pm

re: #69 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Ok. Ick.

Just for you!

77 Jim in Virginia  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:41:52pm

re: #58 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Story I heard, when Coronado found el gran canon, he figured he could cross it in a day; seeing it from the rim he estimated the river was 20 feet across. (Off by a factor of 10)
A few days later, less than halfway down, he gave up and went around.

78 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:41:54pm

re: #51 LEGION

That will only happen when the Dinosaurs in Congress die off. Time for another Laramide Revolution.

79 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:42:19pm

re: #76 jcm

Just for you!

Aren'tcha kind. Now I'm hungry.

BBL

80 Pshawalaw  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:42:26pm

re: #68 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Please let me say this...

Screw the caribou.

I'd rather bar b que them.

81 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:42:53pm

re: #62 jcm

Where's the Caribou (beef)?!

82 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:43:07pm

re: #77 Jim in Virginia

Like I said, "Screw it. Let's stay here."

83 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:43:12pm

re: #48 freetoken

Perhaps McCain has been duped by the DI into thinking there is some sort of controversy to teach. He wouldn't be alone in that regard.

84 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:43:34pm

re: #77 Jim in Virginia

Story I heard, when Coronado found el gran canon, he figured he could cross it in a day; seeing it from the rim he estimated the river was 20 feet across. (Off by a factor of 10)
A few days later, less than halfway down, he gave up and went around.

When Lewis and Clark climbed the first range of the Rockies, thinking from the top they'd see the ocean.....

85 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:43:34pm

re: #69 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Well with your name- 0f COURSE You don't like it. HA haaaa

86 Purple Prose  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:43:47pm

Obama's answer, like the person himself, is a bunch of elusive words that could be interpreted in different ways and signifies nothing. McCain's answer is thoughtful, detailed and eloquently sets forth the idea that evolution is not incompatible with a belief in God.

Obama is not dangerous because he is a McGovern-style liberal, since then everyone would know where he stands as a candidate and - if it should come to pass - a president, in which case he could be engaged by the opposition constructively. Obama is not dangerous because of his background, regardless of whether the Muslim world views him either as of their own or as an apostate.

Obama is dangerous because he stands for nothing, will say anything and is completely opaque when it comes to what his core beliefs are and what his real policies would be. His hubris makes me think he believes that he actually be believes his empty speeches are full of substance. He is a kind of religious icon to many - an article of faith, ironically - and the evidence from his words and actions suggests that he may actually believe he is a kind of savior. Now that is scary. Power and a messiah complex tends to be a pretty ugly mix.

87 JSK1121  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:44:15pm

Obama can't reveal his true faith on this, for that would sound something like this;

"The black God created men in Africa on the sixth day, then made a gigantic mistake and created Whitey in Europe. Whitey has been oppressing Africans since the beginning of time, but now, with the arrival of Elijah Muhammad and Jeremiah Wright, that comes to an end. The black God's very own Obamessiah will arrive and divert all of Whitey's money to the UN! God damn America, and Amen!"

88 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:44:22pm

re: #62 jcm

Mmmmmmm Caribou!

Dunno if it'd stack up to moosemeat mincemeat pie

89 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:44:23pm

re: #48 freetoken

Well, there is a fair amount of pandering that has to happen on this issue. The majority of Republicans don't believe in evolution, and that's a serious problem.

90 freetoken  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:44:43pm

re: #64 Pshawalaw

He was answering a question about "intelligent design".

He was criticized at the time for trying to appeal to the more religious conservatives on various issues.... remember that McCain had run in 2000 against Bush, who had locked up a good share of the evangelical Christian market. So, he was the non-Bush-type Republican. After 2000 McCain wandered in the desert a bit... pissed off lots of Republicans with McCain-Feingold, and then of course the immigration bill disaster. Anyway, the suspicion has been that in trying to warm up to the evangelicals post-2004 McCain started to look for issues on which he could build support. Was the intelligent design position part of a political calculation to with the conservative religious vote?

91 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:45:10pm

re: #15 Pshawalaw

“Evolution is more grounded in my experience than angels.” -BHO

I've noticed that his stances are evolving, even if he hasn't been hanging with any angels.

I think the entities he hangs with come from the other place, the one of fire and brimstone.

92 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:45:18pm

re: #78 FurryOldGuyJeans

Hmmm- getting there- with Kennedy and the brain cancer. Too bad they just don't retire and Conservatives get voted in.

93 Charles  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:45:22pm

Bay Buchanan on Sean Hannity's show again. Blecch.

94 lifeofthemind  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:46:06pm

re: #86 Purple Prose

Nicely said.
Any mail for me while I was out?

95 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:46:30pm

So, I'm watching something on Showtime Extra called "3 Days in September", about the Beslan massacre. Pleasantly surprised at the lack of moral equivalence (so far). The terrorists are called "terrorists". Of course, I'd rather these scumbags who shot children in the back be called... really, i don't know if the word has been invented.

96 cutestguy[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:46:39pm
97 transient  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:46:57pm

Can someone please 'splain?

...he didn’t believe his lack of “faith” would hurt him in a national election.

I’m a Christian...

Personally I don't care which it is, but could he please pick one?

98 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:47:13pm

re: #83 Sharmuta

Never said McCain was perfect, and he just keeps on proving me right. Still, even with the disagreements he is a damn sight better than the alternative.

99 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:47:23pm

re: #93 Charles

Bay Buchanan on Sean Hannity's show again. Blecch.

Sometimes I am very happy that I don't have a TV.

100 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:48:16pm

Good Evening Lizards! It was hot and humid in the Very Far Western Suburbs of Chicagoland today.

My allergy symptoms have morphed into a sore throat and fever.

How are you-all and what are we talking about?

101 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:48:28pm
102 Tarkus289  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:48:28pm

re: #98 FurryOldGuyJeans

A duck billed platypus is better than the alternative.

103 Jim in Virginia  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:48:34pm

re: #84 jcm

When Lewis and Clark climbed the first range of the Rockies, thinking from the top they'd see the ocean.....


And Barry is already measuring the drapes for the Oval Office.
Heh.

104 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:48:37pm

But where do they stand on the important question!

TURTLES!

105 transient  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:48:38pm

Mmm...caribou steak, with a nice lingonberry sauce, and some fresh, sweet brussels sprouts, just like they do it in Norway.

106 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:49:07pm

re: #93 Charles

Wonder how many of us are watching that and conversing here?

107 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:49:10pm

re: #95 Occasional Reader

Monsters

108 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:49:14pm

re: #42 Jim in Virginia

For those who don't like Obana but aren't yet sold on McCain: recall 1992 when folks mad at Bush 1 voted for Perot, and got eight years of Clinton.
OK, off the soapbox.

1,000,000,000,000,000,000 updings!

(I forgive you for No. 36.)

109 big steve  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:49:30pm

re: #14 FurryOldGuyJeans

McCain speaks from the heart. Obama reads from a prepared speech on a teleprompter.

Unfortunately, this evening I saw a clip of our guy McCain giving a speech to auto workers I believe. He had nice words but he literally could not get through three words without looking down at his notes. This worries me. I have this hope, that after all the hoopla about Obama's speaking skills that when the debates happened, McCain would actually trounce him. However, at least in prepared speeches, McCain still looks fairly wooden. I hope the team is seriously working with him on this.

110 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:49:42pm

re: #104 jcm

But where do they stand on the important question!

TURTLES!

It's Turtles all the way down!

111 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:49:55pm

re: #103 Jim in Virginia

And Barry is already measuring the drapes for the Oval Office.
Heh.

Barry is still at Fort Mandan.

112 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:50:13pm

re: #99 Syrah

Sometimes I am very happy that I don't have a TV.

I'm happy I quit paying for cable.

113 buzzsawmonkey[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:50:15pm
114 NemoParticularis  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:50:31pm

re: #89 Killgore Trout

Well, there is a fair amount of pandering that has to happen on this issue. The majority of Republicans don't believe in evolution, and that's a serious problem.

Indeed it is. Unfortunately, a great many of them perceive - rightly or wrongly - that proponents of evolution go a step further and extrapolate that there is no God and that their religion is all hokum.

115 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:50:42pm

I suppose they made similar points.

But I think McCain made his point much more eloquently and, it seems to me (I may be prejudiced), just a tad more sincerely.

116 Tarkus289  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:50:46pm

I tape 8-10 pm on Fox, I watch it later and fast forward past the B.S. and sometimes Colmes. (redundant)

117 freetoken  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:50:52pm

re: #89 Killgore Trout

Well, yes, that is the problem... as again evidenced by today's earlier thread on Romney. I guess the big question for McCain is how to get at least majority of all the various (and sometimes conflicting) Republican-leaning electorate to vote for him. Shall we call this "pandering"? Politicians are the business of assembling the masses of the electorate into some sort of cohesive whole, if only for one day (election day.)

118 JSK1121  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:51:19pm

re: #102 Tarkus289

A duck billed platypus is better than the alternative.

A bull dicked platypus?

119 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:51:20pm

re: #103 Jim in Virginia

Whats up with Senator Jim Webb of Virginia's aide found shot dead? Hmmm.
[Link: www.foxnews.com...]

That Senator is a whacko- strange books he wrote. Too bad macacca got him in.

120 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:51:50pm

So I turned on the TV (you know it's like a roulette {sp?} spin). Anyway, I hit the jackpot. A rerun of The Cosby Show with Lena Horne singing.

121 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:52:07pm

re: #113 buzzsawmonkey

Pixies are good too.

Pixies are good. They are mashed into a paste and used as a mortar to glue all the turtles together.

122 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:52:38pm

re: #109 big steve

McCain sure ain't "My Guy." I am one of those dreaded "Conservative Independents."

123 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:52:48pm

re: #89 Killgore Trout

Well, there is a fair amount of pandering that has to happen on this issue. The majority of Republicans don't believe in evolution, and that's a serious problem.

You like that guy's website, I take it.

124 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:53:10pm

re: #118 JSK1121

You can prick you finger- but donnnnnn't finger your prick! (hat tip: George Carlin)

125 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:53:19pm

re: #115 reine.de.tout

I suppose they made similar points.

But I think McCain made his point much more eloquently and, it seems to me (I may be prejudiced), just a tad more sincerely.

But Barry solved the energy crises today.
Tire inflation!

126 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:53:51pm

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles!

127 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:54:13pm

re: #125 jcm

But Barry solved the energy crises today.
Tire inflation!

I have complete faith that under a Barry administration, we'd get all KINDS of inflation.

128 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:54:22pm

re: #126 LEGION

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles!

The move to much to hold up the world.

129 lifeofthemind  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:54:30pm

Can a legal beagle among the lizards answer this?
Instapundit quotes some Hollywood greasy eminence named Jeffrey Wells calling for an effective boycott of Jon Voight. Can Mr Wells be prosecuted under the anti-Trust acts for attempting to organize a secondary boycott? In addition I would think that learned counsels could find something in the Human Rights jurisprudence that could be used to bring an action against such coercion.

130 JSK1121  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:54:41pm

My #1 source on evolution;

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

131 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:54:46pm

re: #59 Jim in Virginia

Oh no, I'm so sorry to bring up painful memories. Please forgive me.
He was my first choice too.

The day he resigned ripped a tear in my mind that I'm still healing.

132 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:54:48pm

re: #127 Occasional Reader

I have complete faith that under a Barry administration, we'd get all KINDS of inflation.

His model is Mugabe.

133 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:54:55pm

re: #112 Sharmuta

I'm happy I quit paying for cable.

That is what did it for me.

I moved out to the hinterlands. When I found out that I would have to pay money to watch the dreck that they put on the boob-tube, I decided to just give up on it all together.

134 big steve  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:55:32pm

re: #122 FurryOldGuyJeans

McCain sure ain't "My Guy." I am one of those dreaded "Conservative Independents."

Me too....I actually voted for Clinton once. I treat each election as a match between two individuals not parties. So Obama vs McCain. In this case it is a no brainer.

135 HoosierHoops  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:55:32pm

re: #95 Occasional Reader

So, I'm watching something on Showtime Extra called "3 Days in September", about the Beslan massacre. Pleasantly surprised at the lack of moral equivalence (so far). The terrorists are called "terrorists". Of course, I'd rather these scumbags who shot children in the back be called... really, i don't know if the word has been invented.

re: #112 Sharmuta

I'm happy I quit paying for cable.


/so you don't have kids right?..no TV? hahahahahaha

136 Jim in Virginia  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:55:51pm

re: #119 LEGION
I haven't seen cause of death but I guess suicide.
(He was 26, sounds liek he was pretty tightly wound.) OTOH, where was Mrs. Clinton at that time?

137 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:55:56pm

re: #129 lifeofthemind

Why would anyone want to boycott Jon Voight?

138 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:56:17pm

re: #132 jcm

His model is Mugabe.

We'll all be trillionaires! VOTE OBAMA!

139 rawmuse  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:56:24pm

I appreciate what our host is doing to further the anti-idiotarian cause, but frankly, where the candidates stand on Evo vs. ID places pretty far down on my personal check-off list. Like, maybe about 30th.

140 Jim in Virginia  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:56:45pm

re: #125 jcm
Don't forget regular tuneups!

141 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:56:49pm

re: #129 lifeofthemind

Can a legal beagle among the lizards answer this?
Instapundit quotes some Hollywood greasy eminence named Jeffrey Wells calling for an effective boycott of Jon Voight. Can Mr Wells be prosecuted under the anti-Trust acts for attempting to organize a secondary boycott? In addition I would think that learned counsels could find something in the Human Rights jurisprudence that could be used to bring an action against such coercion.

I'm not a legal beagle. But gee, that sounds a lot like blacklisting to me .

142 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:57:03pm

re: #137 ggt

Why would anyone want to boycott Jon Voight?

He ripped Barry a new one.

143 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:57:32pm

re: #140 Jim in Virginia

Don't forget regular tuneups!

I spent all day looking for the spark plugs on my diesel van..........
/

144 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:57:52pm

re: #86 Purple Prose

Obama's speeches may seem as nothing more than absurdities wrapped in platitudes, but they provide a candle to peer through that opacity as inevitably Jeremiah and Michelle and Karl and Bernardine all speak through his lips, for those who care to listen and can hear.

We saw the heroic cult figures standing as messianic leaders before their own people last century.
How fortunate for us that they also pretended to be generals.
How unfortunate for us that Obama believes in his own mastery of military strategy and tactic and may soon get his chance to move those little tanks around the board.

145 Pshawalaw  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:57:54pm

re: #90 freetoken

Yes, from the way the article was written it would appear that he was:

He was answering a question about "intelligent design".

But, the only quote they give is an out of context:

all points of view

And then they provide the context along with a suspect definition of ID:

The theory of intelligent design says life is too complex to have developed through evolution, and that a higher power must have had a hand in guiding it.

I extrapolate from that that McCain said something supporting the expression that God may have had a hand in the creation of the universe, and not an endorsement of ID. And, yes, you are right he was pandering for votes with either your interpretation or mine.

146 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:58:02pm

re: #133 Syrah

I just didn't want to pay for 60 stations I wouldn't watch. I still watch some TV from time to time, but I keep the TV mostly to watch movies when the mood strikes me.

147 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:58:03pm

March 18, 2005, 7:58 a.m.
Ugh, Wilderness!
The horror of “ANWR,” the American elite’s favorite hellhole.

By Jonah Goldberg
After years of contentious debate, on Wednesday, the U.S. Senate voted 51-49 to allow oil drilling in Arctic National Wildlife Refuge. Jonah Goldberg took a trip to ANWR in 2001; the NR cover story that followed is republished below. (To see some of the photos Goldberg took while at ANWR, see this column.)

[Link: article.nationalreview.com...]

Deadhorse, Alaska — As I stand here looking at what must be the largest selection of porn magazines above the Arctic Circle (and an impressive display by any standards), I can't help thinking of a line from the 1973 film classic Papillon: "Abandon all hope and masturbate as little as possible." In a sense, that should be the motto of Deadhorse. This "town" has one store and no restaurants. Worse, with the exception of some inaccessible Indian and Eskimo villages, the nearest alcohol is on the other side of a vast mountain range hundreds of miles to the south. Indeed, this fact alone may explain why the general store has every conceivable publication for the man who enjoys drinking a beer and wooing a lady, but can't-because he's in Deadhorse.

148 rawmuse  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:58:21pm

Today is the first day I have put my McCain bumper on my SUV. I am hoping that its placement next to my NRA sticker will dissuade vandals. But, probably not.

149 FrogMarch  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:58:30pm

McBama!

150 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:58:56pm

re: #132 jcm

Mugabe has rewritten the rules on hyperinflation.

The official rate is 2.2 million percent.

The actual rate is probably closer to 12.5 million percent.

151 Pshawalaw  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:59:06pm

re: #104 jcm

But where do they stand on the important question!

TURTLES!

Post turtles?

152 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 6:59:19pm

re: #66 died of a theory

If MandyManners supports McCain, that is enough for me!

Yes. I am a magnificent bastard.

153 devil in baggy pants  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:00:01pm
But I also believe our schools are there to teach worldly knowledge and science. I believe in evolution, and I believe there’s a difference between science and faith. That doesn’t make faith any less important than science. It just means they’re two different things. And I think it’s a mistake to try to cloud the teaching of science with theories that frankly don’t hold up to scientific inquiry.“

I guess I'm slow (jungle rot of the brain, maybe), but doesn't this quotation show that Obama thinks like Lizards on this issue?

Is that a GOOD thing?

154 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:00:22pm

re: #105 transient

Mmm...caribou steak, with a nice lingonberry sauce, and some fresh, sweet brussels sprouts, just like they do it in Norway.

"Trans" -

I am LIVE and Let LIVE with the Caribou - UNTIL it comes down to Me, and my family freezing. At that point, the CARIBOU GOES - Except - seems that Caribou seem to love leaning on a warm Oil Pipe during Cold Weather. Paraphrasing Rodney King - Seems Like WE ALL CAN GET ALONG, as long as we let it happen.


-S-

155 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:00:24pm

re: #123 reine.de.tout

It's ok but I'm not a huge fan (his politics stink but his science is good). There are other links to that survey but his is the one I have bookmarked.

156 big steve  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:00:44pm

re: #152 MandyManners

re: #152 MandyManners

Yes. I am a magnificent bastard.

Is "Bastard" masculine of feminine?

157 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:01:51pm

re: #153 devil in baggy pants

I guess I'm slow (jungle rot of the brain, maybe), but doesn't this quotation show that Obama thinks like Lizards on this issue?

Is that a GOOD thing?

Even a blind squirrel can find a nut now and then. For all of Obama's affectation of faith it is just gloss to hide the dry-rot within.

158 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:02:03pm

re: #142 jcm

ah! His daughter has something to say about guns as well.

How successfull will they be at blacklisting her?

159 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:02:07pm

re: #152 MandyManners

Patton/ George C. Scott- one of my fav movies! Dut do da Dut do da Dooot do daaa!

160 lifeofthemind  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:02:11pm

re: #109 big steve

Unfortunately, this evening I saw a clip of our guy McCain giving a speech to auto workers I believe. He had nice words but he literally could not get through three words without looking down at his notes. This worries me. I have this hope, that after all the hoopla about Obama's speaking skills that when the debates happened, McCain would actually trounce him. However, at least in prepared speeches, McCain still looks fairly wooden. I hope the team is seriously working with him on this.

McCain has earned the right to refer to his notes. Think of another leader who served us well and faithfully.

By late morning of March 15, a rectangular building 40 feet wide by 70 feet long with a small dais at one end, known as the Public Building or New Building , was jammed with officers. Gen. Gates, acting as chairman in Washington's absence, opened the meeting. Suddenly, a small door off the stage swung open and in strode Gen. Washington. He asked to speak to the assembled officers, and the stunned Gates had no recourse but to comply with the request. As Washington surveyed the sea of faces before him, he no longer saw respect or deference as in times past, but suspicion, irritation, and even unconcealed anger. To such a hostile crowd, Washington was about to present the most crucial speech of his career.

Following his address Washington studied the faces of his audience. He could see that they were still confused, uncertain, not quite appreciating or comprehending what he had tried to impart in his speech. With a sigh, he removed from his pocket a letter and announced it was from a member of Congress, and that he now wished to read it to them. He produced the letter, gazed upon it, manipulated it without speaking. What was wrong, some of the men wondered. Why did he delay? Washington now reached into a pocket and brought out a pair of new reading glasses. Only those nearest to him knew he lately required them, and he had never worn them in public. Then he spoke: "Gentlemen, you will permit me to put on my spectacles, for I have not only grown gray but almost blind in the service of my country." This simple act and statement by their venerated commander, coupled with remembrances of battles and privations shared together with him, and their sense of shame at their present approach to the threshold of treason, was more effective than the most eloquent oratory. As he read the letter to their unlistening ears, many were in tears from the recollections and emotions which flooded their memories. As Maj. Samuel Shaw, who was present, put it in his journal, " There was something so natural, so unaffected in this appeal as rendered it superior to the most studied oratory. It forced its way to the heart, and you might see sensibility moisten every eye."


From: [Link: www.earlyamerica.com...]

161 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:02:18pm

re: #150 lawhawk

Mugabe has rewritten the rules on hyperinflation.

The official rate is 2.2 million percent.

The actual rate is probably closer to 12.5 million percent.

My mind can't wrap itself around that kind of number.

162 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:02:34pm

re: #156 big steve

re: #152 MandyManners

Is "Bastard" masculine of feminine?

"big s"-

In ENGLISH - NEUTRAL.

-S-

163 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:02:34pm

re: #154 Dr. Shalit

"Trans" -

I am LIVE and Let LIVE with the Caribou - UNTIL it comes down to Me, and my family freezing. At that point, the CARIBOU GOES - Except - seems that Caribou seem to love leaning on a warm Oil Pipe during Cold Weather. Paraphrasing Rodney King - Seems Like WE ALL CAN GET ALONG, as long as we let it happen.


-S-


depleted wildlife at Prudhoe

164 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:03:06pm
“It’s not ‘faith’ if you are absolutely certain,” Obama said, noting that he didn’t believe his lack of “faith” would hurt him in a national election.

Uh- so does obama have faith or not? Is that why he managed to sit in wright's church for 20 years? Because it's all just a act since he doesn't have faith anyways?

And- I believe he's confused about the term "faith" in the scientific sense. You can be 100% certain, but without evidence, your 100% certainty is still considered faith.

165 HoosierHoops  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:03:19pm

re: #148 rawmuse

Today is the first day I have put my McCain bumper on my SUV. I am hoping that its placement next to my NRA sticker will dissuade vandals. But, probably not.

i guess it depends on where you live raw..
out in the cornfield here..you would probably just get an invite to a party on your windshield.. :)
/how's it going?

167 Da_Beerfreak  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:03:52pm

re: #104 jcm

But where do they stand on the important question!

TURTLES!

On the post, of course!
Where else could they be?
// {;-)™

168 Big Steve  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:04:39pm

re: #160 lifeofthemind

Some think this episode, where Washington effectively ended a military mutiny, as one the key turning points in American history. Hope you are right regarding McCain.

169 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:05:38pm

re: #95 Occasional Reader

So, I'm watching something on Showtime Extra called "3 Days in September", about the Beslan massacre. Pleasantly surprised at the lack of moral equivalence (so far). The terrorists are called "terrorists". Of course, I'd rather these scumbags who shot children in the back be called... really, i don't know if the word has been invented.

Putin is an asshole but Beslan is one place where you can't help but root for the Russian armed forces.

170 rawmuse  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:05:53pm

re: #165 HoosierHoops

Hey, man, life is good. The phone is ringing and people are waiting in line to hire me. I have even put a career change on hold, which is OK, since I was going nowhere with all that anyway. Thanks for asking.

Just a periodic reminder, I am hosting a Lizard get together on this coming Friday, 5 to 7pm at a fine San Francisco eating and drinking establishement. So far I have 8 respondents. Would like that number to grow to a dozen or so.

171 Big Steve  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:05:57pm

re: #162 Dr. Shalit

"big s"-

In ENGLISH - NEUTRAL.

-S-

/You aren't calling Mandy neutral are ya!

172 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:06:00pm

re: #164 Sharmuta

Uh- so does obama have faith or not? Is that why he managed to sit in wright's church for 20 years? Because it's all just a act since he doesn't have faith anyways?

And- I believe he's confused about the term "faith" in the scientific sense. You can be 100% certain, but without evidence, your 100% certainty is still considered faith.

That sentence makes no sense whatsoever. I think CyanSnowHawk got it:

re: #4 CyanSnowHawk

So, McCain puts forth his believe in a straightforward and easy to understand manner, while Obama goes the "politi-speak" you can believe you heard what you wanted route.

I know who I am voting for.

173 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:06:03pm

re: #104 jcm

Turtle stack

174 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:06:04pm

re: #143 jcm

Shoot- since I bought a Chevy Corsica in 1994 to my 2003 Saturn Vue and 2005 Ion's- they have spark plugs (with platinum tips?) that never have to be changed- well up to 100,000 miles- and with new electronics - tuneups consist of oil changes and tire rotations.

175 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:06:34pm

So, now there is some reality show featuring the George Foremans. Actually, I liked the opening. He said he's been married to the same women for 20 something years.

176 Palandine  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:06:41pm

re: #55 buzzsawmonkey

But the caribou! The caribou!

Heh.

Caribou love the Alaska pipeline

It's warm under there--they have to heat the crude so it will flow through the pipeline.

177 lifeofthemind  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:07:11pm

re: #166 Killgore Trout

ABC: McCain “now seriously considering” Lieberman for VP
I like it.

My chief concern is what happens to the Senate? Is it a good thing if he resigns or is it a bad thing? Who replaces Joe?

178 Tarkus289  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:07:13pm

re: #169 Colonel Panik

That was an atrocity matched few times in all history. I still have not gotten completely over it, never will.

179 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:07:42pm

re: #166 Killgore Trout

oooooh! me too!

180 USBeast  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:07:48pm

Let's see. We've got our military overstretched in the most God-forsaken areas on the planet. Our economy is tanking because we refuse to increase our own energy resources, curb immigration and tell the pork barrel politicians on both sides of the aisle that the party is over, and we're worried about who thinks what about how this all got started?

Excuse me!

I do not give a rat's rump what either candidate thinks about Creation, Evolution or the likelihood of the return of avocado refrigerators.
What if do care about is whether they are willing to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies foreign or domestic. That is my bottom line.

181 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:08:32pm

re: #166 Killgore Trout

ABC: McCain “now seriously considering” Lieberman for VP
I like it.

Expect to hear the following headlines in the next few weeks:

McCain expecting to test drive Rudy
McCain meets Jindal, as speculation mounts.
Palin Coy Over McCain VP Nod
The Dark Horse VP Candidate: Carly Fiorina

Etc...

These stories are all designed with one thing in mind - keeping McCain's name out there at minimal cost. Get people buzzing about McCain and who he might put in as VP, and it also helps his team gauge response, bounce, etc.

As for Lieberman, he's a liberal Democrat who found himself to the far right within his own party, especially on the issue of the war in Iraq.

What he brings to McCain's chances of winning in November? I don't see it, especially since he wasn't exactly the most exciting VP nominee in 2000 alongside Gore.

182 lifeofthemind  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:08:49pm

re: #173 Killgore Trout

Turtle stack

That didn't work. Forbidden

183 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:08:58pm

re: #177 lifeofthemind

Good question but I'm not sure if it makes a difference. He was always a wilcard and I think a Dem majority will rule with or without him. I'd guess it's a push.

184 IslandLibertarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:09:23pm

re: #148 rawmuse

Today is the first day I have put my McCain bumper on my SUV.

I'm tempted to put BUSH/CHENEY'08 but I can't afford the risk.

185 HoosierHoops  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:09:25pm

re: #170 rawmuse

Hey, man, life is good. The phone is ringing and people are waiting in line to hire me. I have even put a career change on hold, which is OK, since I was going nowhere with all that anyway. Thanks for asking.

Just a periodic reminder, I am hosting a Lizard get together on this coming Friday, 5 to 7pm at a fine San Francisco eating and drinking establishement. So far I have 8 respondents. Would like that number to grow to a dozen or so.

That's great news raw..
I work remotely but my main office is on central express freeway in Santa Clara..Silly cone Valley shit..
I'm in town about once a month..I like Tommy's joint in the City..But hey a lizard party works for me..

186 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:09:57pm

re: #182 lifeofthemind

Forbidden


How dare they oppress the turtle stack!

187 Purple Prose  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:10:22pm

Our lizard brain...

Because it was a kluge. Evolution doesn't, in fact, tend to perfection: it goes with what works and tinkers with it later. That's why the retinas of vertebrates seem to be installed backwards, giving us all blind spots in the middle of our visual fields. Eyes like that do the job well enough, and there's no way of flipping the retina while preserving decent vision across intermediate generations. So we're stuck with them.

Likewise the mind: our meagre reasoning capacity is an afterthought, spatchcocked on to the ancestral systems that have the reins where practical decision-making is concerned. If only our higher mental functions could dominate; alas, the lizard- brain parts have seniority.

[Link: www.telegraph.co.uk...]

188 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:10:30pm

re: #160 lifeofthemind

McCain is supposed to be superb in speaking off the cuff without a teleprompter, whilst Obama is a stuttering duh ahh umm gulp dolt- see his European Magical Mystery Tour not behind the podium talks.

189 faraway  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:10:46pm

Most commentors here seem to be more in line with Lord Obama's response.

190 HelloDare  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:11:00pm

They should have asked Obama if he believed in his own divinity.

191 rawmuse  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:11:26pm

re: #185 HoosierHoops

Come on bro'! Heck, I thought you were in Indiana. The place I have reserved is several stars above Tommy's, and I have a tab running. Email me for the location.

192 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:11:45pm

re: #105 transient

Mmm...caribou steak, with a nice lingonberry sauce, and some fresh, sweet brussels sprouts, just like they do it in Norway.

Børk børk børk!

Møøse bytes kån be veri nästi.

193 Pshawalaw  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:11:48pm

re: #189 faraway

Most commentors here seem to be more in line with Lord Obama's response.

I can't imagine why you would say that; I impression is just the opposite.

194 Outrider  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:11:49pm
"... I believe in evolution, and I believe there’s a difference between science and faith. That doesn’t make faith any less important than science. It just means they’re two different things..."


Just means they are two different things? Brilliant. He has a mind like a steel trap. He must not have had his teleprompter working, eh?

195 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:11:56pm

re: #186 Killgore Trout

How dare they oppress the turtle stack!

Behead those who oppress the turtle stack!

196 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:12:05pm

re: #177 lifeofthemind

I don't- I live in CT- and while I voted for him because the dope he ran against was worse and Lieb is pro USA security/troops--- he is a true blue liberal welfare socialist commie doofus in all other matters.

197 itellu3times  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:12:51pm

holy moly, I'm mostly offline today, but just saw this at Powerline, don't know if it's been shown here:
[Link: www.powerlineblog.com...]

Barack Obama is a lot like Sean Penn or George Clooney. If you give him a script, he can deliver it pretty well. But if he tries to talk without a script that has been written for him by others, he quickly reveals that he is poorly-informed if not downright ignorant. Today he delivered another classic, by claiming that if only we would all properly inflate our tires, we could save as much gasoline as "all the oil that they're talking about getting off drilling." Seriously:
198 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:12:58pm

re: #180 USBeast

Let's see. We've got our military overstretched in the most God-forsaken areas on the planet. Our economy is tanking because we refuse to increase our own energy resources, curb immigration and tell the pork barrel politicians on both sides of the aisle that the party is over, and we're worried about who thinks what about how this all got started?

Excuse me!

I do not give a rat's rump what either candidate thinks about Creation, Evolution or the likelihood of the return of avocado refrigerators.
What if do care about is whether they are willing to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies foreign or domestic. That is my bottom line.

Well, I think top priority for most of us is exactly what you say in your last 2 sentences.

But I also think that a candidate's "take" on creationism/ID is important, and I'm glad to be informed about it.

I think Bobby Jindal was elected here in Louisiana, without anyone giving much thought to his religious beliefs. And now there is a law which would allow creationism/ID to be taught in Louisiana public schools under the guise of "science".

If it's one thing the public schools in Louisiana do not need, it's a lower standard of instruction in any subject, but particularly science. The state wants to attract industry here, but time after time, businesses locate elsewhere because they cannot find educated knowlegeable employees, and they do not wish to subject their own employee who transfer here to the Louisiana school system.

Just a small way that this issue, which may not appear important on the surface, can end up being important.

199 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:13:06pm

re: #163 reine.de.tout

Queenie -

Exactly !

-S-

200 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:13:08pm

OT: genocidal Serbs riot: Raw video of confrontation between police and Serbian protesters
/We picked the right side in this conflict.
Viva Kosovo!

201 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:13:36pm

re: #8 FurryOldGuyJeans

So evolution won't be a campaign issue, eh?

Nor should it ever be....

202 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:13:46pm

re: #192 Colonel Panik

Børk børk børk!

Møøse bytes kån be veri nästi.

Those who have used ä have been sacked. /

/those responsible for the sacking have themselves been sacked.

203 laZardo  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:14:49pm

Even though I believe evolution directly contradicts scripture despite also explaining in a sense how "religious" behavior came to be, I respect McCain's opinion on the subject.

/and that's all I got to say about that.

204 jaunte  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:15:03pm

re: #187 Purple Prose

"Spatchcocked!"
There's a collector word.

205 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:15:09pm

re: #184 IslandLibertarian

I did that the day after the last election in '07- I put up a modified '04 to '08 Bush/Cheney sign! Nobody touched it for 2 weeks! It was on a major thoroughfare too! ( I did put it up at 2 am).

206 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:15:17pm

re: #198 reine.de.tout


Just a small way that this issue, which may not appear important on the surface, can end up being important.


Agreed. It's also going to cost the state millions in legal fees to defend the Disco institute. The money could be put to much better use.

207 HoosierHoops  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:16:10pm

re: #191 rawmuse

Come on bro'! Heck, I thought you were in Indiana. The place I have reserved is several stars above Tommy's, and I have a tab running. Email me for the location.

ah raw..I am in indiana most of the time.. My main office is in SC.
I remotely admin one of the largest networks in the world..My new passion is this charity i just am starting [Link: www.food4humanity.org...]
It's rolling it out soon and i'll tip one to ya lad when i'm in the hood there..
/ high class heh? I'm ordering the lobster..hahaha

208 HelloDare  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:16:10pm

re: #190 HelloDare

They should have asked Obama if he believed in his own divinity.

Barack The Father

Barack The Son

Barack The Holy Spirit

The wife, the kids, basketball...

209 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:16:21pm

re: #196 LEGION

I don't- I live in CT- and while I voted for him because the dope he ran against was worse and Lieb is pro USA security/troops--- he is a true blue liberal welfare socialist commie doofus in all other matters.

He's got a particularly bad record on 2nd Amendment issues. As I've said before, he really needs to have a Come to Jesus Moses moment on that one.

210 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:16:51pm

I've decided I like George Foreman.

211 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:17:05pm

re: #189 faraway

Most commentors here seem to be more in line with Lord Obama's response.

No- most people here agree with John McCain- that we accept evolution and God both. Most LGFers just don't want ID in science class.

212 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:17:13pm

re: #119 LEGION

That Senator is a whacko- strange books he wrote.

I thought Fields of Fire was an outstanding book.

213 rawmuse  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:18:01pm

re: #207 HoosierHoops

Bookmarked your site. Charity is good. I hope to die broke. So far, so good.

214 devil in baggy pants  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:18:40pm

re: #211 Sharmuta


But isn't that the point that Obama is making? I haven't been around a lot, but the paragraph from his response that I quoted above could have been taken straight from any number of posters here.

215 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:18:42pm

re: #189 faraway

Most commentors here seem to be more in line with Lord Obama's response.

I don't think that's true, and I know I, for one, much prefer McCain's response.

Obama has that weird sentence where you he says he doesn't think his "lack of faith" would hurt him in a national election. No clue what that means, but it can't be good . . .

216 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:18:48pm

re: #72 died of a theory

Yeah, she tried to blow by with a comment but he would'nt let her- hee hee- she never got off her main point.

217 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:20:21pm

re: #216 LEGION

Are you talking about the lady with the Carol Channing voice?


ewuuuukkk

218 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:20:27pm
219 Aussie Infidel  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:21:05pm

Damnit! Obama's tele-prompter was obviously on the fritz ... again!
Can't this talking head string his own words together just once in a while and have them at least make sense even if they don't result in soaring oratory?

220 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:21:12pm

re: #218 FurryOldGuyJeans

Oooh, oil found on Titan!

DRILL!

221 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:21:14pm

re: #200 Killgore Trout

OT: genocidal Serbs riot: Raw video of confrontation between police and Serbian protesters
/We picked the right side in this conflict.
Viva Kosovo!

"K-T" -

See/GoTo Michael Totten's Blog. Read some. He is NOT a moonbat and in fact now writes for COMMENTARY (Podohertz).

-s-

222 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:21:34pm

re: #218 FurryOldGuyJeans

Oooh, oil found on Titan!

Lets go!

223 Purple Prose  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:21:37pm

Obama's second quote is reasonable, but it reeks of insincerity and is pretty clumsy. Not a sensitive and more clearly thought-out yet more emotional and less robotic response like McCain's. Also, the "famous" Obama way with words falls flat:

"But I also believe our schools are there to teach worldly knowledge and science."

Worldly knowledge? Is that the adjective you wanted, Barry? Worldly has certain connotations that may not appeal to people of faith. And "worldly knowledge" is not a phrase people tend to use to describe science. Maybe knowledge about the observable world, verifiable knowledge, but "worldly knowledge?" This guy is not quite as articulate as the media would have us believe. And he is not quite as savvy as his myth would suggest.

224 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:22:26pm

re: #214 devil in baggy pants

But isn't that the point that Obama is making? I haven't been around a lot, but the paragraph from his response that I quoted above could have been taken straight from any number of posters here.

There have been many comments here, over the course of many threads, from us non-scientists particularly, that are much more in line with what McCain said than what Obama said.

For those of us with faith, the complexities of this world can only be explained a Creator. And we believe that same Creator would consider it a major sin if we did not use the intelligence he gave us to fully explore the world He made, using everything available to us, including scientific discovery and process.

225 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:23:20pm

re: #109 big steve

Where'd ya see it? On CNN or CBS? The left wing channels would bollox up the tape and put him in a bad light. Fox News ONLY.

226 HelloDare  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:23:22pm

re: #218 FurryOldGuyJeans

Oooh, oil found on Titan!

It's all those decomposed dinosaurs and tree ferns.

227 lifeofthemind  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:23:23pm

re: #168 Big Steve

Some think this episode, where Washington effectively ended a military mutiny, as one the key turning points in American history. Hope you are right regarding McCain.

So do I, hope helps. McCain has an orneriness about him, he plays politics, is no plaster saint, frustrates the hell out of people and is sometimes just wrong but he does have a pair. He started in politics by warning the guys on his In Laws beer warehouse loading dock that if he didn't get elected he'd come work there and he'd be an "asshole." They went out and got him elected. If some bastard like Soros tried to shake him down McCain might toss him out a window. Obama would look to a handler for help. The world would probably be more peaceful with the thugs knowing McCain is in the Oval Office.

When I make a mistake, it's a beaut.
Fiorello LaGuardia

228 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:23:52pm

Internet addiction may be one click away

They can have my internet when they pry it from my cold, dead fingers.

229 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:24:05pm

Hydrocarbons found on Titan?

Does this mean dinosaurs roamed there?

After all, they are fossil fuels.... /snark set to stun

230 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:24:14pm

re: #220 Syrah

DRILL!

"Syrah" -

The HYDROCARBONS are free, AND The Pipeline costs...?

-S-

231 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:24:41pm

re: #228 FurryOldGuyJeans

I am powerless over the internet and my life has become unmanageable.

/not

232 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:25:08pm

Earth First!

We'll Mine Titan Later

233 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:25:19pm

re: #221 Dr. Shalit

Totten Rules! I think he lives a few block away from me (when he's in the States)

234 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:25:22pm

re: #231 ggt

now, Spider Soliataire? --well, maybe.

235 rawmuse  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:25:33pm

re: #222 experiencedtraveller

I was recently privileged to hear Dr. Charles Elachi (one of the directors) speak about that mission. It is a work spanning 22 years. Simply astonishing. He spoke of that and the Phoenix lander on Mars.

236 jcw46  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:26:08pm

And these two could use a good "Drilling"

Trouble and Strife

237 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:27:03pm

re: #236 jcw46

And these two could use a good "Drilling"

Trouble and Strife

AUGH! I'm BLIND!

Bad, jcw! :spank:

238 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:27:10pm

re: #229 lawhawk

Hydrocarbons found on Titan?

Does this mean dinosaurs roamed there?

After all, they are fossil fuels.... /snark set to stun

Speaking of dinosaurs

239 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:27:45pm

re: #214 devil in baggy pants

Even a blind squirrel will find a nut. I'm not going to change my position on ID just because obama made that comment.

And- why wouldn't he? One- he happens to be correct. Two- I'm sure he doesn't want his kids exposed to the DI's version of Christianity. Might conflict with the black liberation theology they'd been learning.

240 HoosierHoops  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:27:58pm

re: #213 rawmuse

Bookmarked your site. Charity is good. I hope to die broke. So far, so good.

look forward to meeting you..
It's funny..when i wrote the web site i put my home phone number on it.. And Tell everything about me..people go..why aren't you hiding yourself? It's on the Net for gods sake!
I don't hid from anyone..this is me..I'm having people calling me going.. i have this grant money..whadda got?
My goal is that in 3-5 years my charity will be respected world wide and really make a difference..
I don't ever really talk about it on LGF but when i do.. I'm not bashful..I pray to god to make a difference..things are looking good muse..

241 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:28:09pm

re: #235 rawmuse

I was recently privileged to hear Dr. Charles Elachi (one of the directors) speak about that mission. It is a work spanning 22 years. Simply astonishing. He spoke of that and the Phoenix lander on Mars.

Simply astonishing. Well said.

242 mossley  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:28:09pm

It's nice to hear McCain so clear on a subject. He really boiled it down to its essence - science is science, and religion is religion. There is no need for the two to conflict, nor does belief in one negate one's belief in the other.

243 jcw46  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:28:11pm

re: #236 jcw46

Oops, was off thread.

A couple of dinosaurs.

244 Alouette  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:29:06pm

re: #84 jcm

When Lewis and Clark climbed the first range of the Rockies, thinking from the top they'd see the ocean.....

Reminds me of some Israelis who visited the U.S. for the first time. "We are staying in New York, but we thought we would take a day to visit the Grand Canyon and Disneyland."

245 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:29:33pm

re: #230 Dr. Shalit

"Syrah" -

The HYDROCARBONS are free, AND The Pipeline costs...?

-S-

A whole planetoid with no polar bears or caribou to get in the way of some gloriously rapacious exploitation.

Time to build the rockets.

246 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:29:36pm

Besides- for all we know, obama will toss evolution under the bus.

247 lifeofthemind  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:29:56pm

re: #210 ggt

I've decided I like George Foreman.

You better sucker or else.

248 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:30:20pm

re: #242 mossley

It's nice to hear McCain so clear on a subject. He really boiled it down to its essence - science is science, and religion is religion. There is no need for the two to conflict, nor does belief in one negate one's belief in the other.

It's not as concise as Lao Stinky.

249 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:30:31pm

re: #246 Sharmuta

Besides- for all we know, obama will toss evolution under the bus.

Only when it becomes inconvenient or proves to be an obstacle to his getting anointed for his Messiahship.

250 rawmuse  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:30:48pm

re: #241 experiencedtraveller

Simply astonishing. Well said.

In his words, (IIRC) "It is as if you are teeing off from Los Angeles to a cup at St. Andrews (in Scotland) and make a hole in one.
Only, the cup is moving at 16 thousand miles per hour."

251 unclassifiable  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:30:59pm

OT.

While the evolution question is interesting I think that the Dems are trying to manufacture an issue that detracts from the real big issues.

252 jcw46  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:32:14pm

re: #244 Alouette

Heh.

It's easy even for us to forget how large the U.S.A. really is. Especially when people talk about "how things are done in France" (or Germany or Great Britain).

What, France could fit in Texas and has 1/6th the population?

What works in Ye Olde Country don't hack it here!

253 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:32:17pm

re: #251 unclassifiable

OT.

While the evolution question is interesting I think that the Dems are trying to manufacture an issue that detracts from the real big issues.

Oh, that would NEVER happen, now would it?

(Hello, paging Dan Rather!)

254 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:32:27pm

re: #250 rawmuse

In his words, (IIRC) "It is as if you are teeing off from Los Angeles to a cup at St. Andrews (in Scotland) and make a hole in one.
Only, the cup is moving at 16 thousand miles per hour."

Its math. Or some crap like that...

255 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:32:40pm

re: #244 Alouette

Reminds me of some Israelis who visited the U.S. for the first time. "We are staying in New York, but we thought we would take a day to visit the Grand Canyon and Disneyland."

LOL!

I read something once where a couple visited the U.S. from England. They were going to drive to Colorado from, I think, Wisconsin or Michigan, and made hotel reservations.

The first night - they called the hotel, saying they wouldn't be there until the next day.
The second night - they again called the hotel, and said, "I think we've seriously underestimated the size of your country"

I got a huge kick out of that.

256 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:33:01pm

re: #253 FurryOldGuyJeans

I don't think there's any chance it will pass. Just the Dems pandering before elections.

257 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:33:37pm

re: #177 lifeofthemind

Well, that is a minor good thing- We have a Republican Governor and she'd pick the new Senator who would/should also be a Republican. I sat next to Jodi Rell when she was a Lt. Gov. and gave a speech at our Lions club when I was Prex. Wow- what a ride she has had! Who knew!

258 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:34:10pm

It seems we're done with the dramatic exits over this issue.

259 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:34:21pm

re: #256 Killgore Trout

I don't think there's any chance it will pass. Just the Dems pandering before elections.

Looks like it has as much chance of passing as the Bush Impeachment Bill.

260 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:35:03pm

re: #258 Killgore Trout

It seems we're done with the dramatic exits over this issue.

You realize, now that you've said this, Murphy's Law will kick in. ;)

261 jcw46  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:35:05pm

re: #251 unclassifiable

OT.

While the evolution question is interesting I think that the Dems are trying to manufacture an issue that detracts from the real big issues.

Wow man, like that would be really groovey you know?


Everybody Must Get Stoned

262 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:35:21pm

re: #218 FurryOldGuyJeans

Oooh, oil found on Titan!

Now there's a pipeline to be proud of.

263 rawmuse  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:35:54pm

re: #258 Killgore Trout

It seems we're done with the dramatic exits over this issue.

dramatic exits!

264 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:35:55pm

re: #258 Killgore Trout

It seems we're done with the dramatic exits over this issue.

Seems so. But not necessarily with the waves of ID'ers who seem to be registering just for the sheer joy of being able to jump into this.

265 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:36:09pm

re: #258 Killgore Trout

It seems we're done with the dramatic exits over this issue.

I've HAD IT!

*Stomp*
*Stomp*
*Stomp*
*Stomp*
*Stomp*
*Stomp*
*Stomp*
*SLAM*

266 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:36:22pm

re: #258 Killgore Trout

It seems we're done with the dramatic exits over this issue.

"Go! And never darken my towels again!"

267 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:36:44pm

Ok, very good little faith and reason speech by McCain but truth be told this is not a life and death issue for our country.

I'm with US Beast on this one. It's all about defeating the enemies of the Republic, both foreign and domestic, and insuring prosperity.

268 patrickafir  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:36:47pm

Well, I can respect Senator Obama on this issue.

269 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:37:02pm

Seems to me they're both pretty reasonable, on the issue.

270 HoosierHoops  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:37:18pm

re: #262 jcm

Now there's a pipeline to be proud of.

even if we drill for oil on Titan, we will not see the results for 10 to 15 years..so forget about it!

271 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:37:35pm

re: #181 lawhawk

Yeah, what is it with these Dems who run for the highest office but don't let go of their other office till they find out if they've won? (Lieberman, Kerry) But the Republicans go for broke and if they lose they retire (Dole).

272 Rkrocket[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:37:53pm
273 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:38:33pm

So, both candidates talk a good game on ID and evolution in the classroom.

Which one of them will choose judges who are most likely to keep it that way?

274 unclassifiable  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:39:10pm

re: #253 FurryOldGuyJeans

It's such a non-issue. No one is having any trouble getting dope.

275 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:39:20pm

re: #258 Killgore Trout

It seems we're done with the dramatic exits over this issue.

You know, I get on here and I sometimes get crabby and aggravated, but truly - what people say here, and whether or not they are agreeable to me, well - in the grand scheme of my life, it's just not all that important.

Seems if you're going to make comments on a public site, accessible to all, then you sort of have to put things in perspective as far as how upset you want to get when people don't agree with you.

276 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:39:35pm

re: #270 HoosierHoops

even if we drill for oil on Titan, we will not see the results for 10 to 15 years..so forget about it!

750 million miles at an average pipe laying speed of.........

277 texasjihad  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:39:53pm

It is not surprising that these two who both clearly have a humanist-naturalist world view -- yet do not want to say that they are atheists for political reasons-- would have about this view on the subject. It is not the layman or the lower science --biology and geology-- where the views of Darwin are being increasingly rejected. It is the higher levels of science -- and those who do not have to put their job or research money on the line to say where the more recent dating techniques and the better understanding of genetics is leading. When did the USA get so full of conservatives who just hate freedom of thought and are so afraid that they may discover that the God of the Bible is the God of creation and the God that they will answer to.
And what is this pure nonsense about two kinds of truth. Truth is truth and any Christian worth a plug nickel does not want to be patronized some kind of truth that is pretend truth. Be man enough to say that you think the God of the Bible is a myth --- if that is what you think.

278 UberInfidel67  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:40:13pm

Can we all just start calling Obama "WingDings"? His words...when trying to make a sentence sound like WingDings from the Font Conference video the other day. "Mailbox scissors....errr...um....umbrella schoolbus."

279 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:40:24pm

re: #272 Rkrocket

And Charles probably has a few more great videos of classical guitar picking up his sleeve.

Who do you think is posting these threads?

280 jcw46  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:41:33pm

re: #271 LEGION

Yeah, what is it with these Dems who run for the highest office but don't let go of their other office till they find out if they've won? (Lieberman, Kerry) But the Republicans go for broke and if they lose they retire (Dole).

Yeah, I was just thinking today; there should be a law that you have to give up any gov. pos. you may currently hold BEFORE you run for any other. Otherwise these guys got nothing to lose. "Oh well back to sitting on my ass 2/3's of a year in the Senate".

Can you say "term limits". That worked out well didn't it.

281 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:42:15pm

re: #277 texasjihad

Be man enough to say that you think the God of the Bible is a myth --- if that is what you think.

Okey doke. I confirm.

But of course, that's not the issue here.

282 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:42:38pm

re: #274 unclassifiable

It's such a non-issue. No one is having any trouble getting dope.

I wouldn't know, I don't use the stuff myself. I only use the stuff the V.A. prescribes for my degenerative spine and hip.

283 patrickafir  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:42:58pm

re: #272 Rkrocket

You could always start your own blog if you'd like to see a certain kind and amount of content posted.

284 Purple Prose  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:43:15pm

The RealClearPolitics general election polls average has Obama only 3 points ahead of McCain. That's close to being statistically insignificant.

Despite what you hear about this being the Year of the Democrats, because of Bush and "his war" being so unpopular, people being weary and wanting change, etc., Obama is not feeling much buoyancy. At this point in time, Dukakis was well ahead of Bush, Sr., and we all know how that one turned out.

This is going to be a very close election. McCain is very much in the running, and Obamessiah is very much not a sure thing.

[Link: www.realclearpolitics.com...]

285 HoosierHoops  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:43:27pm

re: #279 Sharmuta

Who do you think is posting these threads?


next time you post..give notice ahead of time..
LMAO!
/ is this multiple guess?

286 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:43:34pm

re: #279 Sharmuta

Who do you think is posting these threads?

Shhhh, you might make him(?) actually have to think. That might cause complications.

287 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:43:34pm

re: #260 Sharmuta

Heh, looks like you were right. Nice prediction.

288 rawmuse  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:43:41pm

Getting dope, no problem. Getting money for dope, problem.
Not that I would have any experience with that...

289 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:43:53pm

re: #14 FurryOldGuyJeans

McCain speaks from the heart. Obama reads from a prepared speech on a teleprompter.

Do you really believe this?

290 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:44:31pm

re: #284 Purple Prose

The RealClearPolitics general election polls average has Obama only 3 points ahead of McCain. That's close to being statistically insignificant.

Despite what you hear about this being the Year of the Democrats, because of Bush and "his war" being so unpopular, people being weary and wanting change, etc., Obama is not feeling much buoyancy. At this point in time, Dukakis was well ahead of Bush, Sr., and we all know how that one turned out.

This is going to be a very close election. McCain is very much in the running, and Obamessiah is very much not a sure thing.

[Link: www.realclearpolitics.com...]

His Lordship's Hubris is wearing thin.

291 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:45:28pm

re: #287 Killgore Trout

Murphy- gets 'em every time.

292 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:45:55pm

re: #289 Cognito

Do you really believe this?

Yes, as a matter of fact I do. Were you just trying to troll, or what?

293 jaunte  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:46:31pm

re: #291 Sharmuta

I don't know why they wait so late to come onto the threads.

294 lifeofthemind  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:46:50pm

re: #14 FurryOldGuyJeans

McCain speaks from the heart. Obama reads from a prepared speech on a teleprompter.

"These are my Principles and if you don't like them I have others."

295 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:47:35pm

re: #292 FurryOldGuyJeans

Yes, as a matter of fact I do. Were you just trying to troll, or what?

No, I'm just curious. Do you really believe that Obama "reads from a prepared speech on a teleprompter" and McCain doesn't?

I'll be voting for McCain. But I'll be doing it with full knowledge that he is, indeed, a politician, and that he often does indeed use a teleprompter.

296 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:48:46pm

re: #295 Cognito

I'll be voting for McCain.

Well said Cognito.

297 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:49:00pm

re: #273 lawhawk

So, both candidates talk a good game on ID and evolution in the classroom.

Which one of them will choose judges who are most likely to keep it that way?

I'm more concerned with which one will choose judges who will keep the ATF out of my gun safe and the jihadis locked up in Gitmo.

298 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:49:08pm

re: #293 jaunte

I don't know why they wait so late to come onto the threads.

Perhaps they think we won't notice.

299 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:49:29pm

re: #295 Cognito

No, I'm just curious. Do you really believe that Obama "reads from a prepared speech on a teleprompter" and McCain doesn't?

I'll be voting for McCain. But I'll be doing it with full knowledge that he is, indeed, a politician, and that he often does indeed use a teleprompter.

Man, you really are one dense person. I said that only in regard to the remarks by both McCain and Obama contained in the article Charles posted.

Time for you to stop eating those paint chips, you are beginning to give off something that is affecting the ozone layer.

300 unclassifiable  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:49:38pm

re: #282 FurryOldGuyJeans

It was actually a paraphrase that a comedian had a long time ago on the subject.

No matter where you stand on the subject, I think that the security of the country now and in the future is an infinitely bigger issue. The Dems are cynically trying to get talking points for their guy so he won't have to face McCain on the tough questions. It will be BS like why McCain picked on Brittany and Paris in his campaign ad or why he's for limited government but still wants to tell people what to smoke or a million other things except for the real question -- how are you planning to use the 2 million or so employees of the Executive branch to administer this country to preserve its security, prosperity, and peace?

301 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:50:18pm

re: #218 FurryOldGuyJeans

Oooh, oil found on Titan!

Of course, if we could get it cheaply, we could use that power source instead.

BIG ALIEN OIL IS RIPPING US OFF!

302 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:50:19pm

re: #280 jcw46

Great minds think alike- mutual admiration society motto.

303 jaunte  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:50:24pm

re: #298 Sharmuta

Someone put up a link to that dino-man footprint story last night, way back in an earlier thread, but never came out to discuss it. I wonder what good they think it does.

304 rlevitin  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:50:33pm

re: #295 Cognito

No, I'm just curious. Do you really believe that Obama "reads from a prepared speech on a teleprompter" and McCain doesn't?

I'll be voting for McCain. But I'll be doing it with full knowledge that he is, indeed, a politician, and that he often does indeed use a teleprompter.

I don't think the commenting Lizards mean 100% time.

But it is clear from what I have seen, that Obama is usually making speeches in front of large crowds that are prepared well beforehand, and McCain does smaller meetings which are more personal.

Not to say Obama doesn't do those smaller gatherings as well -- it's where we get most of his gaffe's from -- and McCain certainly makes prepared speeches.

The difference is what each candidate seems to prefer.

305 code red 21  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:50:42pm

I don't give a rat's ass what the candidates think about evolution all I want my president to do is reduce the size of government, cut taxes, protect the borders, kill our enemies, and just leave me alone.

306 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:50:48pm

re: #273 lawhawk

So, both candidates talk a good game on ID and evolution in the classroom.

Which one of them will choose judges who are most likely to keep it that way?

Well... actually, both, I'd say.

It's on other issues that we would have to worry about Obama's judges.

307 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:51:55pm

re: #295 Cognito

It is not that neither/or both read from a teleprompter. It's that when ODrama speaks off the cuff, he sounds like a brand new "Toastmaster" giving his first "Table Topics" talk.

McCain at least sounds like his has thought it out before-hand. ODrama says, "Uh, I dunno, uh...I, uh, never, uh, thought of that before. What do you want to, uh, hear? Uh."

308 lifeofthemind  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:52:07pm

Good night ladies.

309 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:52:16pm

re: #299 FurryOldGuyJeans

Man, you really are one dense person. I said that only in regard to the remarks by both McCain and Obama contained in the article Charles posted.

Time for you to stop eating those paint chips, you are beginning to give off something that is affecting the ozone layer.

Whaaaat? In that case you're exactly wrong. In those quotes McCain was writing a book, and Obama was speaking extemporaneously during an interview.

310 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:52:17pm

re: #306 Occasional Reader

It's on other issues that we would have to worry about Obama's judges.

Obama's we'd just worry about the 1st Amend, the 2nd.... the....

311 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:52:20pm
312 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:52:52pm

re: #297 Colonel Panik

Actually, they're the same kind of judges - originalists who understand the role of the government and that the Constitution is about the limits of government. It is about judges who understand that they are not supposed to set policy - that's the forum of the Legislature and the Executive. Etc.

313 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:53:36pm

re: #309 Cognito

Whaaaat? In that case you're exactly wrong. In those quotes McCain was writing a book, and Obama was speaking extemporaneously during an interview.

You calling me wrong is just such delicious irony.

314 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:53:55pm

re: #309 Cognito

Hey, Cognito, I, uh...dinged you up there.

315 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:54:24pm

I think the idea that one candidate speaks better than the other isn't just a distraction, it's damaging.

We don't want to see McCain and Obama in a beauty-and-grace contest, no matter what some folks here think.

Better to focus on the content of their statements. That's what matters anyway.

316 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:54:41pm

re: #218 FurryOldGuyJeans

Oooh, oil found on Titan!

The anime series Cowboy Bebop, which is set in a not too distant future where humans have colonized and terraformed Venus, Mars and the Jovian and Saturnian moons had a war on Titan as part of its backstory...


Mars off Titan now! No war for oil!

317 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:55:44pm

re: #304 rlevitin

Which is why obama cancelled a slew of town hall meetings with Mclame because Johnny boy woulda whupped his butt in a freestyle match like that. Can you say- chicken? ( Michael.J. Fox- Back to the future- reference- chicken!)

318 HelloDare  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:55:50pm

BREAKING NEWS:
Pelosi introduces a bill that would force Saturn to divest itself of Titan.

319 patrickafir  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:55:55pm

re: #316 Colonel Panik

That's pretty much the only anime I genuinely love. I like Trigun too.

320 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:56:16pm

re: #315 Cognito

And yet when I commented on the content you said I was wrong. Boy, you really are a tool and a troll.

321 rlevitin  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:56:27pm

re: #315 Cognito

I think the idea that one candidate speaks better than the other isn't just a distraction, it's damaging.

We don't want to see McCain and Obama in a beauty-and-grace contest, no matter what some folks here think.

Better to focus on the content of their statements. That's what matters anyway.

It's a reactionary thing to two issues:

1) The non-stop assault by the left on "Bushisms" for the last 8 years

and

2) The meme of Obama as a great orator.

I agree with you; all the candidates are human, under a lot of pressure, and under intense scrutiny. The presidential election should not come down to counting who makes more gaffes or who speaks better.

322 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:56:30pm

I understand that a President has to be an uplifting speaker. But, really...how much of a Presidents job happens in front of a teleprompter.

I kind of imagine (I could be wrong) that some of the stuff they do happens behind the scenes. Hence, I'll take JSM over BHO any freaking day.

323 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:56:53pm

re: #316 Colonel Panik

Cowboy Bebop is da bomb.

;)

324 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:57:25pm

oh geez, it seems we've gone a nice long time without someone getting into it with Cog.

don't do it, it just derails the thread.

325 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:58:23pm

re: #324 ggt

oh geez, it seems we've gone a nice long time without someone getting into it with Cog.

don't do it, it just derails the thread.

I just put him on symbolic iggy. ;)

326 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:59:33pm

re: #245 Syrah

A whole planetoid with no polar bears or caribou to get in the way of some gloriously rapacious exploitation.

Time to build the rockets.

The 2025 equivalent of Ice Road Truckers: Asteroid Belt Tankers.

327 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 7:59:36pm

A.N.W.A.R.
They work in the North Slope, an 89,000-square-mile tract of land roughly the size of Minnesota. If Alaska were Don King, the North Slope would be his afro. More specifically they work in the much smaller area around the coastal plain near Prudhoe Bay, the starting point of the trans-Alaska pipeline and the home of the richest oilfields in North America. And within that space, they work on a comparatively tiny archipelago of parking-lot-sized islands of human activity in a boundless ocean of tundra.
Indeed, before you can appreciate what a small presence human beings have up here, you need to understand how mind-bogglingly huge — and devoid of people — Alaska really is. Alaska has a population not much greater than that of the nation's capital, but you could fit the District of Columbia into it more than 9,000 times. You could squeeze California into it almost four times; New York State, more than eleven times. A former Army Ranger who now works in Prudhoe Bay as a doctor put it to me this way: "We don't even bother trying to put out Connecticut-sized forest fires up here. Maybe we start to worry when they get to be the size of Virginia."
DRILL DRILL DRILL DRILL DRILL DRILL DRILL DRILL DRILL DRILL DRILL

328 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:00:14pm

re: #319 patrickafir

That's pretty much the only anime I genuinely love. I like Trigun too.

You need to check out Ghost In The Shell: Stand Alone Complex

329 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:00:33pm

re: #320 FurryOldGuyJeans

And yet when I commented on the content you said I was wrong. Boy, you really are a tool and a troll.

Sorry, no. You're mistaken. I've not questioned the content, I've questioned the idea that McCain simply "speaks from the heart" while Obama "reads from a prepared speech on a teleprompter."

They're both politicians, both use teleprompters, et cetera.

330 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:01:09pm

re: #321 rlevitin

Well said.

331 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:01:42pm

The Arctic National Wildlife Refuge is way over on the other side of Alaska, past several mountain ranges. ANWR is 19.6 million acres, about the size of South Carolina. And it's beautiful. Well, most of it is. But more about that in a moment. On the very northern cusp of ANWR is what is commonly called the coastal plain, a tract of flat tundra largely indistinguishable from other spots along the coast and throughout the region. This comprises about 8 percent of the refuge-but an even smaller fraction of its pretty scenery. Some of this area is already off-limits to oil exploration, permanently. Nonetheless, the U.S. Geological Survey — seconded by industry experts-believes there could be untold billions of barrels of oil in the swath still legally available. The oil industry says it would need to use only 2,000 acres-an area no bigger than Dulles Airport, outside D.C.-to get that oil. This footprint would be 50 times smaller than the Montana ranch owned by Ted Turner, who helps bankroll efforts to keep ANWR off-limits.
Why do affluent Ted Turner types oppose exploration? Well, there's a simple explanation and a complicated one. The simple one is that it could be bad for the Porcupine River caribou herd, the second smallest of the four major caribou herds that sometimes use the area to calve their young; in turn, a tribe of Indians called the Gwich'in claim this would destroy their way of life because they live off the Porcupine caribou (but nowhere near where the drilling would be). The more complicated explanation is that this is all a convenient and bogus cover for the simple fact that Americans generally — and environmentalists like Turner specifically — are more than a little daft when it comes to ANWR.

332 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:02:01pm

ohhh, Sanford and Son is on now.

I haven't seen this show in years!

333 patrickafir  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:02:06pm

re: #328 Colonel Panik

You need to check out Ghost In The Shell: Stand Alone Complex

I've always blown that one off on Adult Swim, but I'll check it out; thanks!

334 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:02:18pm

re: #315 Cognito

I think the idea that one candidate speaks better than the other isn't just a distraction, it's damaging.

We don't want to see McCain and Obama in a beauty-and-grace contest, no matter what some folks here think.

Better to focus on the content of their statements. That's what matters anyway.

This is an amazing speech.

I think that he believes every word of what he is saying.

It is not an empty speech.

It is really kind of scary.

335 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:02:37pm

re: #332 ggt

ohhh, Sanford and Son is on now.

I haven't seen this show in years!

Bwa bwada BWAda. Bwa bwada BWADA BWADA bwa.

336 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:02:50pm

re: #326 Colonel Panik

The 2025 equivalent of Ice Road Truckers: Asteroid Belt Tankers.

Sounds like a blast.

Where do I sign up?

337 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:02:58pm

There's little doubt that for much of human history most reasonable people would have considered this spot the definition of the word "godforsaken." You need not look back, for evidence, to the ancient pilgrims who died on the frozen tundra. You could simply read an old copy of the Washington Post from 14 years ago: "[T]hat part of the [ANWR] is one of the bleakest, most remote places on this continent, and there is hardly any other where drilling would have less impact on the surrounding life."
Two decades have intervened, and an environmental fatwa has been issued declaring that the word "pristine" is synonymous with "beautiful" or "sacred." Of course, anyone who has seen a mint-condition AMC Gremlin knows that pristineness and aesthetic appeal have only a coincidental relationship. Even ANWR fetishists concede that in the winter, with its complete darkness and 70-below-zero temperatures-not counting wind chill-this is no paradise.

338 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:03:52pm

re: #332 ggt

ohhh, Sanford and Son is on now.

I haven't seen this show in years!

That's cause you're a dummy.

339 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:04:06pm

re: #334 Syrah

What's the gist of it, if you don't mind?

(It's a half hour long, and that's a half hour I could spend here spouting nonsense.)

340 jcw46  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:04:15pm

Sorry to go ot but I tried to comment and got a message saying that "you are not logged in". Header of account says i'm logged in and was able to log in so Charles didn't ban me (phew!)

so Whah Hoppen?

341 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:04:25pm

re: #332 ggt
Sanford and Son-
Used to like it- Louise- I'm having the big one, I'm coming honey! But not after I read what a racist he is- makes Rev. Wright look normal.

342 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:04:36pm

I have seen where Cog has made statements and people assumed he was being a prick. It is not always the case. I totally agree with him on the teleprompter thing. They both use them. Neither speaks as fluidly or "waxes poetically" without them.

I just think JSM is better than Odrama on issues because he has thought this stuff through before 12 months ago.

343 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:04:53pm

re: #298 Sharmuta

Perhaps they think we won't notice.

Or, they're busy spreading the word to their buddies. . .

344 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:04:53pm

re: #321 rlevitin

The presidential election should not come down to counting who makes more gaffes or who speaks better.

You're right- it shouldn't come down to factors like these, but the sad reality is that it does. Just like court cases where juries are more persuaded by technological presentations, it's sadly all about the packaging.

While I agree it should be about content, do not dismiss the presentation, because it does have an impact whether we think it should or not.

345 joecitizen  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:05:04pm

re: #277 texasjihad

It is not surprising that these two who both clearly have a humanist-naturalist world view -- yet do not want to say that they are atheists for political reasons-- would have about this view on the subject. It is not the layman or the lower science --biology and geology-- where the views of Darwin are being increasingly rejected. It is the higher levels of science -- and those who do not have to put their job or research money on the line to say where the more recent dating techniques and the better understanding of genetics is leading. When did the USA get so full of conservatives who just hate freedom of thought and are so afraid that they may discover that the God of the Bible is the God of creation and the God that they will answer to.
And what is this pure nonsense about two kinds of truth. Truth is truth and any Christian worth a plug nickel does not want to be patronized some kind of truth that is pretend truth. Be man enough to say that you think the God of the Bible is a myth --- if that is what you think.

I believe that the god of the bible is a myth.

346 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:05:24pm
347 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:05:31pm

re: #333 patrickafir

I've always blown that one off on Adult Swim, but I'll check it out; thanks!

That one I can't do. Trigun was fun; Inuyasha is intriguing, too. But the rest of it...eh, I'm waiting for The Venture Brothers or I'll get out the Home Movies DVDs.

348 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:05:38pm

But then, it's no paradise in the summertime either. During the winter, the entire coastal plain is covered by a vast tarp of ice; when the sun comes back, the resulting thaw creates, well, lots of puddles. These patches of freestanding water pock the flat tundra for as far as the eye can see; that's why this barren region is the only place the U.S. government recognizes as both a desert and a wetland. The water in an old tire can breed thousands of mosquitoes; a puddle in a junkyard, millions. ANWR is the Great Kingdom of the Mosquitoes.
In preparation for my trip, I contacted several Prudhoe veterans. They all said the same thing: Beware the mosquitoes. "They're about the size of blue jays," one man warned. Another explained how they pluck the lighter roughnecks off the catwalks to devour them more slowly in their vast, hidden mosquito caves.

349 devil in baggy pants  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:06:08pm

re: #341 LEGION


It's actually "Elizabeth! I'm coming to see ya, honey!"

350 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:06:09pm

re: #333 patrickafir

I've always blown that one off on Adult Swim, but I'll check it out; thanks!

There are two seasons. 2nd Gig is the 2nd season ('natch). You need to watch them in order as there is a story arc to both.

351 Carridine  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:06:36pm

re: #315 Cognito

I think the idea that one candidate speaks better than the other isn't just a distraction, it's damaging.

We don't want to see McCain and Obama in a beauty-and-grace contest, no matter what some folks here think.

Better to focus on the content of their statements. That's what matters anyway.

Actually, Cognito, you've got the gist of these criticisms, there in black.

It takes a short time to learn to deliver a clear statement, from your heart, in accord with your principles and approved by your logical mind...

IF (Big IF!) IF YOU HAVE PRINCIPLES, or
IF YOU ARE NOT SAYING SOMETHING that VIOLATES WHAT YOU BELIEVE. (all caps for emphasis, not for shouting you down)

Therefore many commenters here and elsewhere believe that when Oblama goes into major stu-stu-stutter mode, hmming and hawing, uhming and y'know-ing, he's PREVARICATING!

The public displays of Obama's gobble-talk is public proof that he either is attempting to mask ignorance (and hasn't the guts or integrity to say 'I don't know') OR he's lying, misleading from what he REALLY intends to do about the subject in question.

352 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:07:03pm

re: #342 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Yes. I think McCain has decades of service to fall back on, and Obama has more natural eloquence.

That means Obama is better with a script -- cadence, crescendo, general delivery -- and McCain is better when put to task. I expect the debates will be very interesting....

353 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:07:08pm

re: #334 Syrah

re: #334 Syrah

This is an amazing speech.

Oh Man that is one painful Obama speech...

354 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:07:31pm

re: #332 ggt

ohhh, Sanford and Son is on now.

I haven't seen this show in years!

Think about it. Seriously. Go back. Before the show ever aired. Doesn't the theme song sound like pr0n music?

355 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:08:00pm

All right, it may not be great shakes for people, but this is Eden for the caribou, right? Well, that's what you might think from reading the purple prose found in, for example, the New York Times.(NY Slimes SUCKS- don't buy don't read) Perhaps because of the politics involved, a seemingly limitless number of journalists from the Lower 48 put on their "nature lover" hats when writing about the spring thaw along the coastal plain. They write about the "majestic" and "glorious" return of the "majestic" and "glorious" caribou herds to their ancestral and, yes, "majestic" and "glorious" calving grounds. From these dispatches it's a wonder teenage girls ever bothered with unicorn posters when they could have pinned serene Arctic caribou to their bedroom walls.
The roughnecks in Prudhoe Bay have a saying: "Life begins at forty." This is not a self-help mantra, but a statement of fact. Once the temperature rises above 40 degrees, torrents of insects-the mosquitoes among the least nettlesome — emerge to dash through the winged portion of their life cycle before the winter returns. Perhaps because they are in such a hurry, they don't take much time to be kind to the caribou; the swarms can kill calves and even adults.
Well how about that- betcha ya didn't know that liberals- didja?

356 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:08:04pm

re: #340 jcw46

Sorry to go ot but I tried to comment and got a message saying that "you are not logged in". Header of account says i'm logged in and was able to log in so Charles didn't ban me (phew!)

so Whah Hoppen?

happens to me sometimes. Just reload, or log out, log back in.

357 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:08:06pm

re: #348 LEGION

this barren region is the only place the U.S. government recognizes as both a desert and a wetland.

A desland? A wesert?

358 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:08:42pm

re: #341 LEGION

Sanford and Son-
Used to like it- Louise- I'm having the big one, I'm coming honey! But not after I read what a racist he is- makes Rev. Wright look normal.

ELIZABETH. What? Are you illiterate?

/

359 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:08:47pm

Man, this guy can TYPE!

/

360 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:09:31pm

re: #349 devil in baggy pants

Oppsss- Ehhh, I was sorta close!?

361 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:09:41pm

re: #341 LEGION

Louise-

You're thinking there of "The Jeffersons".

362 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:09:51pm

The Obama candidacy has mutated and evolved .

363 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:10:06pm

re: #357 Colonel Panik

That's our government!

364 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:10:14pm

re: #361 Occasional Reader

You're thinking there of "The Jeffersons".

In all fairness. He said it had been years.

365 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:10:52pm

re: #340 jcw46

There's a six hour time frame. After six hours, you get logged out.

366 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:10:56pm

re: #357 Colonel Panik

That made me happy. Thanks.

367 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:10:58pm

re: #361 Occasional Reader

Yeah yeah, thats the ticket. Wheezzy- moving on up- J.J.- Dyyyy-noo- mite!

368 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:11:06pm

"Through service I discovered..."

/OK. Lets compare service...

369 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:11:27pm

re: #338 Occasional Reader

I'm waiting for Red to call Elizabeth.

370 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:11:34pm

re: #346 jcm

COG!

That's actually a favorite of mine. It was super expensive, if I remember, and done without CGI.

371 Aussie Infidel  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:11:57pm

I have to share this with you guys!


From Lyal and 'RebeccaH of the IntraWebs':-

Barack Obama Preaches
The Gospel of Himself:

I am a symbol, and what’s more,
I am what I’ve been waiting for,
A hopey change, a changey hope,
An inspiration to the Pope;
Together, friends, we will achieve
A monument to make-believe.

lyle (Reply)
Thu 31 Jul 08 (04:03am)
RebeccaH replied to lyle
Thu 31 Jul 08 (08:30am)

Lyle, your observations are always spot on, and then you go do it in rhyme and meter that tracks. Show off!

It is clear that you dumbkopps have not gotten the word. Hussein is already President of the USA, if not the world. Before Hussein’s outdoor speech at Adolph’s Victory Column, his senior foreign policy adviser told the group of assembled (so-called) reporters.
“It is not going to be a political speech. When the president of the United States goes and gives a speech, it is not a political speech or a political rally.”
And in accordance with his announcement on Face the Nation, he will serve 8 to 10 years over all 57 states (and more over the rest of the world). His modesty knows no bounds, for has he not assured us in his speech accepting the Democrat nomination to run for president:
“Generations from now, we will be able to look back and tell our children that this was the moment when we began to provide care for the sick and good jobs to the jobless; the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal ...”
He mentioned in the same speech his feelings of “profound humility” as he prepares for the contest.
And is all not possible for him, this humble god? And has he not already done wonders, such as raising the dead. In his Memorial Day speech in New Mexico, he said,
“On this Memorial Day, as our nation honors its unbroken line of fallen heroes, and I see many of them in the audience today, our sense of patriotism is particularly strong.”
And these fallen heroes will return again on Election Day (at least in Chicago and Gary, Indiana) to repay, with their votes the living death that he offers all of us.
So he is more than the symbol he claims to be. He is the Great God of Con, He is the Messiah without Father, He is the Pied Piper of the DemoRats, He is the Maestro of Gorebal Whining, He will force the White and Yellow and Brown Devils to pay reparations to Red and Black, He will make the Jew lie down before the Muslim, HE IS THE ONE HE HAS BEEN WAITING FOR!

sarc off/

372 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:12:41pm

re: #358 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

ELIZABETH. What? Are you illiterate?

/

Redd Foxx was freakin' amazing. My parents had some of his albums, but I was sure not allowed to listen to them. ;) Or Moms Mabley.

373 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:12:52pm

re: #370 Cognito

Was Rube Goldburg Jewish?

374 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:13:06pm

re: #347 OldLineTexan

That one I can't do. Trigun was fun; Inuyasha is intriguing, too. But the rest of it...eh, I'm waiting for The Venture Brothers or I'll get out the Home Movies DVDs.

If you liked Wiliam Gibson's early cyberpunk novels you'll like Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex.

375 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:13:11pm

re: #362 Mich-again

The Obama candidacy has mutated and evolved .

Due to exposure to light, competition, or ?

376 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:13:17pm
"I'm calling you ugly, I could stick your face in some dough and make some gorilla cookies."

Fred G Sanford to Aunt Esther.

377 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:13:39pm
378 jcw46  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:13:59pm

re: #351 Carridine

Yep, exactly. He ums and ahs cause he knows he can't say what he really feels so he self-censors himself and is gauging what would be the best thing to say in whatever situation the answer is required for.
That he is so bad at it is because of his inexperience and perhaps he is aware that he's selling his soul to get elected.

Most everybody in this nation instinctively knows he's lying through his teeth, that he's dishonest with his supporters and with himself.

379 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:13:59pm

re: #354 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I don't think I can remember back that far.

380 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:14:07pm

re: #354 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Doesn't the theme song sound like pr0n music?

That's what I've always said about "The Brady Bunch".

381 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:14:21pm

re: #339 Cognito

It is a call to service. Service to the state.

I think that Politicians give speeches that, even if it they are written for them, are an expression of what they believe.

It is worth listening to. Not just quickly in passing, but several times, like an academic would listen to the speeches of a historical figure.

If read too quickly, or listened to with distractions, much will be missed.

382 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:14:52pm

re: #375 OldLineTexan

Due to exposure to light, competition, or ?

Intelligent Design of course. Clearly the work of the creator.

383 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:15:06pm

re: #373 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Was Rube Goldburg Jewish?

Yes, I believe. (Although did he actually go by 'Rube' or was that just a character?)

384 Noam Sayin'  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:15:08pm

re: #335 Cognito

Bwa bwada BWAda. Bwa bwada BWADA BWADA bwa.

You sure that's not, "Mad About You"?

385 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:15:08pm

re: #361 Occasional Reader

Weezie!

386 kevinmumaw  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:15:11pm

OT: Who's "we", Mojombo?

John Bolton takes Obama to task for claiming world stood as one against Soviet Union in the Cold war. I didn't catch the Berlin coronary speech, but Obama is lying about history, for sure. With his mindset, I assume he'll be taking credit for the surge and offshore drilling this time next year.

387 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:15:25pm

Consider the warble fly, a vicious bumblebee-like insect that is so mean it can cause a whole herd to go berserk, stomping the ground in a panic and eventually stampeding; not even wolf packs can make them do that. The warble fly lays its eggs on the caribou's leg hairs. When the larvae hatch, they march like Germans through Paris-which is to say, unopposed — through the caribou's flesh to its back, where they feed off its skin and fat from the end of summer until the following spring. Starting in late May, the creatures burst out of the caribou's skin and fall to the ground. A biologist's text asserts: "Every caribou hide I've ever examined has had anywhere from 20-350 warbles along its back."
And then there's the nostril fly, or nosebot, which reproduces by harassing the caribou's ample nostrils. In the process of trying to rid themselves of these agonizing pests, the animals lick at their muzzles or press their snouts into the soil, which delights the nosebots because it pushes the larvae into the caribou's nose. The grubs hatch in the nostrils and inch their way back to the base of the throat, where they feed and grow into a larval mass so large that the caribou's breathing can become difficult. The following spring, the caribou do get to sneeze the fly larvae onto the ground-but the expelled critters only hatch and start the process all over again.
And all the while, the caribou are hunted by the omnipresent mosquitoes as well as bears, wolves, various native tribes on three-wheelers or in boats, and (of course) the occasional mukluk-wearing well-to-do orthodontist from New Rochelle who fancies himself a big-game hunter. The caribou essentially race to the coastal plain in a cloven-hoofed Arctic death march in pursuit of cooler pastures and, perhaps-if they are lucky-someplace with the tiniest breeze to spare them from the pestilence.
JEEZ LOUISE- IT WOULD BE A MERCY KILLING TO WIPE OUT THE POOR CARIBOU! OMG! DRILL DAMN IT! PASS THIS ON TO YOUR LIB FRIENDS! Although lately- I find myself drifting away from those ignoramus's!

388 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:16:01pm

re: #372 OldLineTexan

No one was dirtier than Redd Foxx, Buddy Hacket and Bob Saget. People who don't know are always shocked when they hear them with out writers and censors.

389 devil in baggy pants  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:16:05pm

I always thought the theme to "Barney Miller" was serious PrOn music myself.

390 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:16:07pm

re: #377 MandyManners

Let's dance.

Speaking of rap, anybody else hear the Ludacris rap all over reich-wing radio today?

/

391 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:16:09pm

re: #381 Syrah

It is a call to service. Service to the state.

I think that Politicians give speeches that, even if it they are written for them, are an expression of what they believe.

It is worth listening to. Not just quickly in passing, but several times, like an academic would listen to the speeches of a historical figure.

If read too quickly, or listened to with distractions, much will be missed.

Service to the state in a creepy, Stalinist way?

Or, "...what you can do for your country"?

392 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:16:51pm

re: #370 Cognito

That's actually a favorite of mine. It was super expensive, if I remember, and done without CGI.

Filmed in one continuous take, no effects, it took a bunch of tries.

393 jcw46  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:17:16pm

re: #356 reine.de.tout

re: #365 Sharmuta

Ahh. I was hoping that that was what happened.

Thanks for letting me know. (i did log in again and i could comment but why did the box at top left say i was logged in but i wasn't? No update? No big deal just curious.

394 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:17:21pm

re: #382 Mich-again

Intelligent Design of course. Clearly the work of the creator.

Ooooookaaaay, but you shouldn't mention it in school, then.

/

395 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:17:37pm

re: #387 LEGION

Life sucks and then you die...

396 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:17:39pm

re: #353 experiencedtraveller

re: #334 Syrah

Oh Man that is one painful Obama speech...

It is.

Aspirin and antacids are required.

397 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:18:09pm

re: #392 jcm

I can imagine.

398 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:18:15pm

Why the question about Rube, by the way? Did I miss something?

399 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:18:23pm

re: #377 MandyManners

Is that Brad Sherwood?

400 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:19:00pm

re: #391 Cognito

Service to the state in a creepy, Stalinist way?

Or, "...what you can do for your country"?

In a devotional way.

He is a believer in the state.

401 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:19:05pm

re: #398 Cognito

The commercial was basically a Rube Goldburg device.

402 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:19:06pm

re: #394 OldLineTexan

but you shouldn't mention it in school, then.

Not in a political science class anyway!

403 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:19:22pm

re: #390 OldLineTexan

Speaking of rap, anybody else hear the Ludacris rap all over reich-wing radio today?

/

What?

404 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:19:42pm

re: #398 Cognito

Why the question about Rube, by the way? Did I miss something?

The cog commercial is a bit Goldberg-ish.

405 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:19:46pm

re: #401 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

The commercial was basically a Rube Goldburg device.

Ah, indeed. The question of Jewishness sort of threw me into a whole other line of thought.

406 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:19:55pm

re: #395 Mich-again

Purty horrible life I say- but we are not drilling there because the environmental wacko feel goodie two shoes libs don't want us to hurt them. Duhhhh.

407 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:20:11pm

Interesting......

Iran has carried out missile tests for what could be a plan for a nuclear strike on the United States, the head of a national security panel has warned.
In testimony before the House Armed Services Committee and in remarks to a private conference on missile defense over the weekend hosted by the Claremont Institute, Dr. William Graham warned that the U.S. intelligence community doesn’t have a story to explain the recent Iranian tests.
One group of tests that troubled Graham, the former White House science adviser under President Ronald Reagan, were successful efforts to launch a Scud missile from a platform in the Caspian Sea.

That would fit with the sea launched EMP attack scenario.

408 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:20:15pm

re: #342 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I have seen where Cog has made statements and people assumed he was being a prick. It is not always the case. I totally agree with him on the teleprompter thing. They both use them. Neither speaks as fluidly or "waxes poetically" without them.

I just think JSM is better than Odrama on issues because he has thought this stuff through before 12 months ago.

Since I was the one that made the teleprompter comment in the first place I will clarify for you:

What I read of McCain's comments made me think I was reading truly what he believed, and so spoke directly from his heart about what he believed.

What I read of Obama's comment made me think as if he was trying to find the quickest way out of not making yet another statement that he would later have to clarify and amend, so he sounded like he was reading a prepared speech off of a teleprompter.

Whether either candidate uses a teleprompter or not has absolutely no bearing on what I derived from their words in this instance.

409 rlevitin  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:20:22pm

re: #391 Cognito

Service to the state in a creepy, Stalinist way?

Or, "...what you can do for your country"?

Cog, watch the speech from about 9:00.... he talks about how horrible the US is. (if you want).

He makes the key comments about service starting at 11:00.

410 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:20:22pm

re: #405 Cognito

Ah, indeed. The question of Jewishness sort of threw me into a whole other line of thought.

My work here is done. G'night Cog! G'night John-Boy!

411 freetoken  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:20:25pm

re: #258 Killgore Trout

It seems we're done with the dramatic exits over this issue.

Don't tell me... we've run out of martyrs? !

412 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:20:55pm

re: #408 FurryOldGuyJeans

That's cool. We're cool. Peace.

413 Thanos  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:21:20pm

re: #327 LEGION

It's "ANWR" Arctic National Wildlife Refuge.

414 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:21:32pm

re: #403 MandyManners

What?


Ludacris did a rap for his man Obama....hoo boy, momma gonna wash his mouth out...

415 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:22:08pm

re: #398 Cognito

Rube Goldberg was the first to use hamster wheels to power his site.

416 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:22:41pm

re: #408 FurryOldGuyJeans

Please tell me the story of how you came up with that nic. Please?

417 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:22:47pm

re: #399 Sharmuta

Is that Brad Sherwood?

Who?
What?

418 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:22:54pm

re: #415 Mich-again

Rube Goldberg was the first to use hamster wheels to power his site.

Ha, yes. Back when the Internet actually was a net.

419 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:22:55pm

re: #337 LEGION

Even ANWR fetishists concede that in the winter, with its complete darkness and 70-below-zero temperatures-not counting wind chill-this is no paradise.

Practice for Titan!

420 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:23:22pm

re: #412 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I just had problems with another member trying to read more into my comments than was warranted. With you, PEACE! :)

421 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:24:44pm

re: #417 MandyManners

Brad Sherwood

422 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:24:45pm

re: #420 FurryOldGuyJeans

Still say Cog has a point. You have a valid point also. Just don't want to over-beautify McCain because Odrama is such a tool.

423 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:25:13pm

re: #401 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

The commercial was basically a Rube Goldburg device.

It's "Goldberg", I believe.

424 freetoken  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:25:18pm

re: #305 code red 21

I don't give a rat's ass what the candidates think about evolution all I want my president to do is reduce the size of government,

Not going to happen.

cut taxes,

Not going to happen.

protect the borders,

Probably not going to happen.

kill our enemies,

Occasionally happens.

and just leave me alone.

Definitely not going to happen...

425 devil in baggy pants  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:25:49pm

re: #414 OldLineTexan

"The world is ready for change because Obama is here"


Damn, that's creative, son.

Disappointing because I've always thought Luda could spit a meant lyric, but that just sucks... and I'm not just talking content.

426 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:26:01pm

re: #423 Occasional Reader

It's "Goldberg", I believe.

k

427 devil in baggy pants  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:26:23pm

OOPS

"mean" lyric

428 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:26:31pm

re: #426 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

k

thxbai

429 unclassifiable  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:26:35pm

re: #388 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Buddy Hacket was an absolute riot. I do not think Carson could finish a sentence without busting a gut when he was on his show. The show on HBO still has lines my friends and I say to each other every once in a while.

430 rlevitin  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:26:46pm

re: #409 rlevitin

Cog, watch the speech from about 9:00.... he talks about how horrible the US is. (if you want).

He makes the key comments about service starting at 11:00.

It takes him about 3-4 minutes to get to the point though. You can stop watching at re: #409 rlevitin

Cog, watch the speech from about 9:00.... he talks about how horrible the US is. (if you want).

He makes the key comments about service starting at 11:00.


Scratch that, the whole speech is really all about service....16:45 he talks about a civilian security force as powerful as the military.

Syrah is right, it is a speech you hear yourself.

431 Carridine  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:26:53pm

re: #378 jcw46
You've GOT it, JCW!

People CAN see it, although some of us rationalize it away in accordance with our hopes for Obama-change!

The rest of us see through it to the dissembling, prevaricating and unprincipled lying that Obama displays.

432 Thanos  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:27:27pm

Time for me to get some sleeps, g'nite all


Energy Flow

433 rlevitin  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:28:03pm

PIMF

434 rlevitin  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:28:18pm

Alright, I'm sleeping. Good night!

435 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:28:23pm

Iceberg, Goldberg...

436 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:28:32pm

re: #428 OldLineTexan

f'ing love phonetics...

Hooked on phonics worked for me!

437 Carridine  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:28:58pm

re: #435 Occasional Reader

Rubin (Rube) Goldberg, at that

438 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:29:11pm

re: #435 Occasional Reader

I've heard that joke! Wow!

439 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:29:27pm

OT:

Ice Not Melting at North Pole - in many areas, more than normal. Pictures and links.

Meanwhile panic advocates remain unmoved and unwilling to retract dire warnings of total Arctic Ocean melt.

440 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:29:35pm

re: #429 unclassifiable

Buddy Hacket was an absolute riot.

Oh no doubt there. One of the funniest people ever. And the joke about the duck hunter and the farmer on Johnny Carson's 25th anniversary show just about gave my dad a cardiac arrest he was laughing so hard.

441 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:29:35pm

re: #427 devil in baggy pants

OOPS

"mean" lyric

First rap "song" I ever heard was at a stop light.

I shittest thou not, this was the lyric, accompanied by trunk-rattling distorted bass:

"I'm the m*f'in n* that yor mama tole you 'bout"

Since then, I have been a rapt student of the power of the spoken song. However, Ludacris does not match Busta Rhymes IMO, who in turn is overshadowed (again, IMO) by The Shat.

/

442 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:29:50pm

Hey all y'all - late, again! I preferred McCain's comment to Obama's comment, but doesn't Obama's more "recent" quote (on the York County school situation ) come pretty close to what McCain said?
Both apparently don't think a belief in evolution requires a suspension of belief in faith; of course not really knowing what Obama's faith WAS or IS (remember Jeremiah Wright?) does make Obama's statement more problematic?

443 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:30:01pm

re: #438 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I've heard that joke! Wow!

same here. Some jokes travel.

444 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:30:24pm

Almost the last of the A.N.W.A.R. rant-
This is the miracle of directional drilling, a relatively new technology that environmentalist ideologues are loath to admit even exists, because it runs completely counter to the earth-gouging stereotypes of yesteryear. Directional drilling makes it possible to drill in virtually any direction for miles. Indeed, the drilling can go down hundreds of feet, then sideways, then upwards again, like a fishhook. Don't think of an oil well as a straw, but as an octopus, with tentacles stretching out in all directions.
Today, crews aren't allowed on the tundra. "If I took a leak out there, I'd get fired," an engineer tells me. "In the winter, if you spill some coffee into the snow, you'd better go get a shovel and dig it up."
. I expected the oil workers to feel more than a little put out by all of the environmental hoops they are forced to jump through. But I can't find anyone to say so. In fact, everyone brags about how they run a "zero discharge" facility. "What comes on the slope, comes off the slope," is a mantra. Alongside the runway are huge piles of garbage slated to be flown back to civilization.
Regardless, the media coverage of North Slope oil extraction is a constant source of exasperation to the engineers and roughnecks. For example, the biggest topic of conversation during my stay here is a recent issue of Field & Stream that asserted that bored Prudhoe workers were shooting endangered animals for fun in their off hours. It is the source of constant eye-rolling, jokes, and sighs among the allegedly bored and dangerous workers.
"I knew a guy who got fired for throwing a rock at a fox," the former ranger tells me, with great exasperation. He wasn't throwing rocks for sport, mind you; apparently almost all of the Arctic foxes are rabid. If you get bitten by a rabid fox with inactive rabies, you get those infamous shots. If you get bitten by a fox with active rabies, the company pays for your funeral. "Every single fox head I've sent to Anchorage for testing has come up positive," he explains. I make a mental note to thank God that I don't have a job that requires the harvesting of rabid fox heads.

445 Carridine  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:30:38pm

re: #437 Carridine

REUBEN (mea culpa) Garret Lucius Goldberg

446 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:31:04pm

re: #413 Thanos

Uh, I know- I'm copying an article- they got it wrong- just go with the flow.

447 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:31:07pm

re: #436 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

f'ing love phonetics...

Hooked on phonics worked for me!


I learned to read with these little phonics elves. Couple good gin and tonics and they come read with me still!

448 StinkHammer  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:31:16pm

re: #354 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Doesn't the theme song sound like pr0n music?

The title song is actually titled "The Streetbeater," written by Quincy Jones.

When I was in college, a local funk band used to perform it at their shows, and nailed it.

449 Thanos  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:31:31pm

re: #446 LEGION

Uh, I know- I'm copying an article- they got it wrong- just go with the flow.

OK np friend.

450 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:31:48pm

re: #351 Carridine

Actually, Cognito, you've got the gist of these criticisms, there in black.

It takes a short time to learn to deliver a clear statement, from your heart, in accord with your principles and approved by your logical mind...

IF (Big IF!) IF YOU HAVE PRINCIPLES, or
IF YOU ARE NOT SAYING SOMETHING that VIOLATES WHAT YOU BELIEVE. (all caps for emphasis, not for shouting you down)

Therefore many commenters here and elsewhere believe that when Oblama goes into major stu-stu-stutter mode, hmming and hawing, uhming and y'know-ing, he's PREVARICATING!

The public displays of Obama's gobble-talk is public proof that he either is attempting to mask ignorance (and hasn't the guts or integrity to say 'I don't know') OR he's lying, misleading from what he REALLY intends to do about the subject in question.

That sounds good.
Not that you are wrong, and you may even be right in the case of Obama. I think you're reading too much into his speech patterns.

To me, Obama just has a peculiar way of speaking; no different or worse than a speech impediment.
2 points-
I've a lifelong and trusted friend with a similar pattern of speech as Obama.
He uhhs and ehhs and umms around and then comes up with whatever it is he's trying to say, which I trust to be true and respect for his frequent insight.
2nd- I had a teacher who was the worst word- butcher I've ever seen.
Made Dubya Seem like Abe Lincoln at Gettysburg.
He was also the most profoundly wise and real person I've ever met. I have recordings of some of his lectures which I will listen to now and then, even though he's been dead for 20+ years.

I am not suggesting that Obama rises to the level of my two friends in veracity or wisdom. I believe the worst of him, in fact.

451 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:32:44pm

re: #430 rlevitin

Scratch that, the whole speech is really all about service....16:45 he talks about a civilian security force as powerful as the military.

Syrah is right, it is a speech you hear yourself.

That line about the security force is interesting. He really believes in the riotousness of service to the state. In the clip, he puts more energy in that line then he does in any other part of the speech.

452 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:32:46pm

re: #450 Capitalist Tool

All true.

453 Salamantis  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:32:56pm

re: #277 texasjihad

It is not surprising that these two who both clearly have a humanist-naturalist world view -- yet do not want to say that they are atheists for political reasons-- would have about this view on the subject. It is not the layman or the lower science --biology and geology-- where the views of Darwin are being increasingly rejected. It is the higher levels of science -- and those who do not have to put their job or research money on the line to say where the more recent dating techniques and the better understanding of genetics is leading. When did the USA get so full of conservatives who just hate freedom of thought and are so afraid that they may discover that the God of the Bible is the God of creation and the God that they will answer to.
And what is this pure nonsense about two kinds of truth. Truth is truth and any Christian worth a plug nickel does not want to be patronized some kind of truth that is pretend truth. Be man enough to say that you think the God of the Bible is a myth --- if that is what you think.

Oh Puh-LEEEZE! Why don't you list some of these higher-level scientists? And no, Disco Dewdes and Creation-Museum-associated ICRers don't qualify...and when you're finished listing them, you can list the CREDIBLE EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE they have for holding such positions.

And no, I won't hold my breath.

454 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:33:14pm

re: #442 realwest

Hey all y'all - late, again! I preferred McCain's comment to Obama's comment, but doesn't Obama's more "recent" quote (on the York County school situation ) come pretty close to what McCain said?
Both apparently don't think a belief in evolution requires a suspension of belief in faith; of course not really knowing what Obama's faith WAS or IS (remember Jeremiah Wright?) does make Obama's statement more problematic?

I agree with your take. I don't feel the need to beat up Obama on this - there are so many more character and policy issues to hit the guy with that trying to flesh out differences on this particular topic seems relatively unproductive to me.

455 Ojoe  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:33:30pm

McCain's statement is way more elegant than Obama's which just klunks along, probably like his administration would, if he were elected.

klunk
bang
ow
mommy!

456 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:34:07pm

re: #442 realwest

Hey Realwest How you been?

I think both those answers were essentially the same but McCain did a little better job by invoking the image of the Grand Canyon. Obama's was somewhat Wikipedia-ish, not much flair.

457 HoosierHoops  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:34:22pm

hey realwest..
I'll have your coffee ready in the morning..
good nite

458 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:34:48pm

re: #381 Syrah

It is a call to service. Service to the state.

I think that Politicians give speeches that, even if it they are written for them, are an expression of what they believe.

It is worth listening to. Not just quickly in passing, but several times, like an academic would listen to the speeches of a historical figure.

If read too quickly, or listened to with distractions, much will be missed.

Yes! And in the listening, the real Obama can be found.
He's such a great orator (from teleprompter) that it seems all sweetness and light, but stop and listen, really listen, and sure enough, there's Jeremiah Wright and Bill Ayers and worse.

459 Metal Man  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:35:28pm

The argument about great orators is interesting. The best orators generally get the job. The more important part is the oration. Take these examples from history and weigh the direction the orator is taking you.

And that's about all I have to say tonight. Except for one thng. The past few days when I've been at that window upstairs, I've thought a bit of the "shining city upon a hill." The phrase comes from John Winthrop

The slaughter is only a small fraction, but the consequences to the belligerents have been even more deadly. We have seen great countries with powerful armies dashed out of coherent existence in a few weeks.


Again I took the opportunity of that meeting to appeal to the world for peace. I did not permit any doubts that my hopes in this direction could only be slight, in view of my experiences. For the men who had wanted the war do not act out of some kind of ideal conviction

I cannot say with absolute certainty that among the candidates (I beg their pardon, of course) and among our public figures there are no people who resemble political philistines more than anything else, who in character and make up resemble people of the type referred to in the popular saying: "Neither a candle for god nor a poker for the devil.

Oration is a gift, morals are acquired.


460 jcm  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:35:44pm

re: #442 realwest

Hey all y'all - late, again! I preferred McCain's comment to Obama's comment, but doesn't Obama's more "recent" quote (on the York County school situation ) come pretty close to what McCain said?
Both apparently don't think a belief in evolution requires a suspension of belief in faith; of course not really knowing what Obama's faith WAS or IS (remember Jeremiah Wright?) does make Obama's statement more problematic?

RW!
Top of the evening!

Obama's religion is one of connivence, based on who could help him organize.

McCain's saw him through 5 and a half years of hell.

461 songbird  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:36:02pm

re: #119 LEGION

Whats up with Senator Jim Webb of Virginia's aide found shot dead? Hmmm.
[Link: www.foxnews.com...]

That Senator is a whacko- strange books he wrote. Too bad macacca got him in.

Wrong Guy. Macacca got George Allen.

462 StinkHammer  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:36:12pm

re: #429 unclassifiable

Buddy Hacket was an absolute riot. I do not think Carson could finish a sentence without busting a gut when he was on his show.

Here's a clean Buddy Hackett joke (one of the few in his arsenal) I always remember:

A woman is sitting in the dentist's chair getting an examination, when he informs her, "Ma'am, it looks like those wisdom teeth will have to come out."

"Oooh," she winces at the thought. "I'd rather have a baby!"

"Make up your mind," the doctor replies. "I gotta adjust the chair."

463 Carridine  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:36:25pm

re: #450 Capitalist Tool

Thanks for sharing.

Obviously, one size (speech patterns in public) does NOT fit all, Cap!

There IS, however, a strong enough correlation between um-ah speech AT TIMES and flowing, heartfelt speech AT OTHER TIMES (as evidenced by the vid-linkies posted above) that I strongly concur your observation: ACCURATE OBSERVATION in Obama's case!

464 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:36:32pm

re: #459 Metal Man

Oration is a gift, morals are acquired.

Fine statement.

465 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:36:33pm

re: #456 Mich-again

I'm not sure that's a fair comparison... McCain was writing a book, and Obama was providing the A's for a Q-and-A.

They seem similar on this issue, regardless, I'd say.

466 Occasional Reader  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:37:32pm

DRAMATIC EXIT!

Good night.

467 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:38:12pm

re: #454 karmic_inquisitor

I agree with your take. I don't feel the need to beat up Obama on this - there are so many more character and policy issues to hit the guy with that trying to flesh out differences on this particular topic seems relatively unproductive to me.

Funny, I almost used your exact quote the other day. I met someone who wasn't voting for Odrama because he was black. I said what you said, in a much less cohesive and salient way...I said basically the same thing. Let me see if I can paraphrase what I told him.

I said, "What? Are you a bleeping moron? There are so many reasons to not want to vote for this bleep, why would you pick the one reason that is morally and ethicall wrong. You are a bleeping bleep!"

Or, something like that.

468 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:39:12pm

When Francisco Vasquez de Coronado's expedition stumbled upon the Grand Canyon in 1540, it did not occur to him or his party that it was a thing of beauty. Rather, it was a huge hole in the ground, and an even bigger hassle. Over the next three centuries, the Spanish and countless others encountered the natural wonder and considered it little more than a big obstacle. It wasn't until the 1870s that non-indigenous North Americans looked upon the Canyon as "beautiful."
So if it took hundreds of years for Americans to recognize that a giant gash in the ground was actually a marvel, perhaps I can be forgiven for failing to see the beauty in the coastal plain — if that beauty is actually there. But I suspect that the majority of Americans who oppose oil exploration in ANWR would agree with me if they saw it firsthand. Indeed, they would probably agree that if America had to be struck by an asteroid, this would be the ideal impact point. Of course, I am not talking about ANWR's beautiful mountain vistas, the ones cooed over by cable-news hostesses. Not only is that stuff legally protected from oil exploration, it is far, far away from anywhere the oil companies want to drill-i.e., the thousands of football fields' worth of bog and marsh.
Moreover, the Inupiat Eskimos who actually live on the coastal plain are not Rousseauian noble savages living the life Ted Kaczynski wanted us to live. They are very poor people living in ramshackle housing, and they overwhelmingly support oil development on the coastal plain-because they will get a cut. Environmentalists don't mention these indigenous people because they muddle the story line. They do, however, mention the Gwich'in people very frequently. The "capital" of the Gwich'in nation is Arctic Village (pop. 150), which just happens to be hundreds of miles away from the coastal plain on the other side of the Brooks mountain range. The Gwich'in are regularly trotted out at congressional hearings in Washington, wearing native garb they only occasionally put on back home. The Gwich'in insist that even looking for oil on the coastal plain — with non-intrusive seismic imaging — would be unacceptable.
We are constantly told that the Gwich'in, with their premodern attachment to nature, put a human face on the fight against "corporate greed." But before you write your check to "Save the Gwich'in" (use an Internet search engine, and you'll see how easy that is), you might be interested to know that the Gwich'in invited those same evil oil companies to look for oil on their own lands more than a decade ago. Indeed, ask an Inupiat Eskimo why the Gwich'in are blocking exploration and he won't tell you about the Gwich'in's rejection of postindustrial bourgeois consumerism; he'll tell you the Gwich'in are furious because they don't have any oil of their own, and playing the noble savage for guilty liberals is the most lucrative revenge available.
--Well how about that- Libs using lies for guilt- but why? Why are they sabotaging our country? Only thing I come up with are they are traitors who want to destroy us! Useful idiots to our enemies! They must be voted out of office.

469 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:40:10pm

re: #467 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Funny, I almost used your exact quote the other day. I met someone who wasn't voting for Odrama because he was black. I said what you said, in a much less cohesive and salient way...I said basically the same thing. Let me see if I can paraphrase what I told him.

I said, "What? Are you a bleeping moron? There are so many reasons to not want to vote for this bleep, why would you pick the one reason that is morally and ethicall wrong. You are a bleeping bleep!"

Or, something like that.

virtual verbatim-ness

470 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:40:25pm

re: #448 StinkHammer

When I was in college, a local funk band used to perform it at their shows, and nailed it.

Now that would be cool to see. I bet they rocked that song. And I can just see the band sitting around watching the show thinking, man we could do that song. Eeeer.

471 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:40:59pm

re: #440 Mich-again
Hey Mich! Did you and/or your Dad catch Buddy on Carson's show, telling the joke about getting a call in the middle of the night from his wife who was "stranded" somewhere down a road and was scared - and of course (according to Hackett) it was a dark and stormy night, and although he sleept in the nude, he put on a rain slicker and, wearing his slippers, jumped into his car, started it up and realized that the rain slicker just came down to cover his, uh, private parts when he was standing, but not when seated. Anyway, Buddy goes speeding into the night, gets caught by a cop and the cop comes up to the car and tells Buddy to get out of the car - which Buddy does, very reluctantly.
At which point the cop, seeing Buddy dressed as he was (and not recognizing him) says "Put Up Your Hands" and Hackett says "are you SURE you want me to do that (and then stands up in front of Carson) and the cop says yes, so Buddy sloooowly puts his hands up over his head?!? I think it was funnier to watch than to tell, but I gotta tell ya I almost fell off my couch laughing my ass off as Buddy slowly puts his hands over his head, eyes rolling up and whistling! LOL!

472 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:41:20pm

re: #461 songbird

Yeah, the Maccaca knocked George Allen out and Webb in. Too bad, he would have been a good Prex candidate. But that's what they wanted to do (Clinton campaign). Assassins!

473 Throbert McGee  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:41:24pm

re: #320 FurryOldGuyJeans

And yet when I commented on the content you said I was wrong.

Well, you were wrong, FOGJ, in that you compared a more-or-less unrehearsed spoken remark by Barack Obama to an edited paragraph in a book by John McCain.

Er, make that "by John McCain with Mark Salter," as is printed on the dustcover of Character is Destiny, from which came the McCain quote that Charles used. What that "with" means is that if you found the book to be eloquent, a significant portion of the credit is likely due to Mr. Salter.

Thus, you were comparing an unrehearsed remark by Obama to an edited paragraph that may have been substantially re-written and polished by someone other than McCain.

In any case, +1 point to Cognito, -1 to you.

474 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:41:42pm

re: #470 Mich-again

I understand Eeeer.

475 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:42:22pm

re: #465 Cognito

McCain was writing a book, and Obama was providing the A's for a Q-and-A.

Was it a take home test? If it was, the answer was most likely written by Michelle, not Barrack.

476 Syrah  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:42:43pm

re: #458 Capitalist Tool

Yes! And in the listening, the real Obama can be found.
He's such a great orator (from teleprompter) that it seems all sweetness and light, but stop and listen, really listen, and sure enough, there's Jeremiah Wright and Bill Ayers and worse.

. . . and Alinsky, we can't leave out Alinsky.

I think the speech reveals a great deal.

For Obama, service to the (god)state is a sacrament.

477 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:42:44pm

re: #422 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

A point that was irrelevant to my comments IMO. But 'nuff said about it.

-------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------

re: #416 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Oh, lordy, are you a glutton for punishment, or what?

Ok, in a nutshell:

1) I was in the U.S Navy

2) I spend considerable time in Japan, and so got to make a few Japanese friends.

3) My Japanese friends thought I looked like an American Mafia type guy.

4) So behind my back (with lots of giggles and laughter) they started calling me Furyo Gaijin (roughly translated as Foreign Barbarian Master Criminal Lord)

5) Furyogaijin was my first nickname I used during the early days of the internet

6) I kept getting asked repeatedly what it meant and where I got it

7) One day I got tired of the endless questioning I decided I needed a new nickname

8) But not one that I would not have troubles remembering or "living in."

9) So I split the nick down into components that describe me and yet still retain a slight flavor of my oldest and most favored nickname. (Say "Furyo Gaijin" out loud a few times and then my current nickname and you will see the connection.)

10) By describing me I mean:

a) Furry - because I am one hirsute person. I mean LOTS and LOTS of hair, all over.

b) Old - because I ain't a spring chicken any more.

c) Guy - I hope I don't have to show proof of that. (I do have proof, but I don't think you want to see it.)

d) Jeans - My "Uniform of the Day", so to speak. I wear jeans all the time. I even have a tightly creased pair and a tuxedo t-shirt for those times I need to go formal.

In other words it was just lucky happenstance that I could mutate one nickname into another and have it be remarkably similar.

Do I need to get another nickname so I won't keep getting "bugged" about where it came from? ;)

478 StinkHammer  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:43:29pm

re: #470 Mich-again

Now that would be cool to see. I bet they rocked that song. And I can just see the band sitting around watching the show thinking, man we could do that song. Eeeer.

It was VERY cool -- of course, half the young folk didn't understand the reference is was making...

There was also a college alterna-band (is there any other thing?) who did the Sesame Street counting song, rocked up:

"One - two - three - FOOURRR - five six!"

Heavy irony involved.

479 BGOH  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:43:37pm

Just found this, and I haven't been around in a while (started working on a Congressional campaign this week), and I have to say that the double-speak that Obama is engaged in during this election is absolutely startling. It is getting to the point where the Dem pundits on cable news shows are having a very hard time not looking like scum-sucking patsies anymore.

I can't remember who it was in the past couple of days who said that Obama may have reached his "ceiling" of support right now, and I am beginning to agree with that assessment more and more as time rolls on. Specifically, I don't think that most rational Americans like anyone who so consistently speaks out of both sides of his mouth. It killed Kerry in '04, and Obama is making him look like a rank amateur in this regard.

Watch the oil issue, folks. As Americans continue to pay $3.50+ per gallon from here to November, people are going to vote for the candidate that has the most rational, realistic stance on energy. McCain has proven himself to be open to expanding domestic capacity, but Obama has completely painted himself into a corner via his vilification of anything related to fossil fuels, and his pie-in-the-sky belief in supposed "alternative" energies that will have little to no impact upon how the average American consumes energy for decades. If he flips on this issue (which he is going to have to do, no matter what), that may be the final nail in the HOPE! coffin.

For once, I find myself in agreement with Obama. This really is our time! LOL

480 Metal Man  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:43:39pm

re: #459 Metal Man

PIMF
I had thought I linked each speech, didn't stick though.

Reagan
Churchill
Hitler
Stalin

481 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:43:47pm

hey rw! How you doin' tonite?

482 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:43:58pm

Good evening, Lizards,

OT -

I will only be posting occasionally (unlike OR), for a while, although I will be reading as avidly as ever. Lost my job this week - completely expected and after a brief but rather nasty battle, I received an equitable severance. Company tried to give me radically different terms from what was offered to me three months ago! I fought, they caved, yay me. But now I need to focus on a 20 hr/day job search.

Go McCain! Our one and ONLY option.

483 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:44:09pm

re: #475 Mich-again

Was it a take home test? If it was, the answer was most likely written by Michelle, not Barrack.

No, no, no. You can tell she didn't say it because it's not angry.

484 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:44:40pm

re: #469 Capitalist Tool

He's not black- he's bi-racial. White American mother & a black foreigner father.
(And Tiger Woods is tri-racial- white black asian).
More importantly- he is a lib!

485 ploome hineni[deleted]  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:44:49pm
486 songbird  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:44:58pm

re: #472 LEGION

Yeah, the Maccaca knocked George Allen out and Webb in. Too bad, he would have been a good Prex candidate. But that's what they wanted to do (Clinton campaign). Assassins!

I agree. Allen was lost by the slip of the tongue. How many slips of the tongue has Obama had?

Too Numerous to count.

487 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:45:23pm

re: #477 FurryOldGuyJeans

Coolest reason for a nic ever! Thanks!

My nic is Fat Bastard Vegetarian because I am a fat bastard, and I am a vegetarian.

You win.

488 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:46:19pm

re: #465 Cognito

I'm not sure that's a fair comparison... McCain was writing a book, and Obama was providing the A's for a Q-and-A.

And we all know how scintillating Obam-Uh is when he has to articulate an opinion!

489 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:46:22pm

re: #460 jcm
Amen to that one brother!

490 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:46:28pm

re: #487 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Coolest reason for a nic ever! Thanks!

My nic is Fat Bastard Vegetarian because I am a fat bastard, and I am a vegetarian.

You win.

I just don't see how you can be a Fat Bastard unless you are trying to eat the baby.

/

491 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:47:35pm

re: #482 Russkilitlover

Good luck, bro.

492 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:47:52pm

re: #490 OldLineTexan

I just don't see how you can be a Fat Bastard unless you are trying to eat the baby.

/

Ate it and shat it.

Now really. Goodnight.

and furry jeans...sorry if our curiosity about your nic bugs you. :)

493 StinkHammer  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:47:57pm

re: #472 LEGION

Yeah, the Maccaca knocked George Allen out and Webb in. Too bad, he would have been a good Prez candidate.

George Allen was kicking Primary ass at the time -- looked to be the Repub. front-runner. He was scaring some Dems.

494 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:48:23pm

re: #491 Killgore Trout

Good luck, bro.

Sis, actually, but thanks! I need all the Karma I can get.

495 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:48:33pm

re: #477 FurryOldGuyJeans

Quick Kimiko!
More Wasabi!

496 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:49:21pm

re: #471 realwest

Ha! I don't remember that one, but I can imagine the exact scene. Johnny ROFL and Ed just being Ed. And dad waking up the neighbors laughing.

There has never been another Johnny. Not even close. I don't know if I would have thought Buddy Hacket was as funny if his jokes weren't accompanied by Johnny trying in vain not to laugh so hard.

I would probably put Johnny Carson in the list of the top 10 people that influenced me as a kid.

497 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:49:27pm

re: #482 Russkilitlover

More power to ya baby! Happened to me two years ago...best thing for me and mine!

498 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:50:04pm

re: #485 ploome hineni

cool

When ya got it, flaunt it?

499 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:50:09pm

Holy Cow! It's almost midnight here! It's been a blast tonite- See ya all!

500 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:50:37pm

re: #468 LEGION

Are you familiar with sourcing and quotations? Using them would add weight to your arguments.

501 BGOH  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:50:39pm

re: #468 LEGION

Legion, I agree with everything that you have written here, but I must point out that, shockingly so, I have heard numerous environmentalists cite those Eskimos as a reason that we can not drill in ANWR. It just goes to show you how stupid, naive, and idiotically emotional most environmentalists are. They know nothing of which they speak, but they all feel that they are the smartest, most well-intentioned people in the room, and nothing can disabuse them of this belief.

I loathe anyone who considers themselves an "environmentalist." The term alone is as useless as "anti-war" is. No one is "pro-war" (no matter what moonbats think of neocons), and no one is an "anti-environmentalist." Both terms only serve to make simpletons feel better about their meaningless existences upon this planet.

502 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:50:49pm

re: #461 songbird

Wrong Guy. Macacca got George Allen.


Respectfully, I know Jimmy Webb - met him when he was in the Reagan administration and although I can't say I "know him" I can say that any thoughts that Webb had anything to do with that shooting is just so much BS.
Webb has turned out to be a BIG disappointment to me politically - almost 189 degrees from when I knew him (we did have dinner and drinks just before he was appointed Reagan's Secretary of the Navy and a more staunch conservative it is hard to imagine, but there's just no way he had anything to do with this.

503 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:50:52pm

re: #490 OldLineTexan

I just don't see how you can be a Fat Bastard unless you are trying to eat the baby.

/


GET IN MAH BELLAY!

504 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:51:09pm

re: #498 Capitalist Tool

Dang! How many months ago did Charles stop the quote-stacking and I still screw it up.

505 StinkHammer  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:51:10pm

re: #496 Mich-again

I don't know if I would have thought Buddy Hacket was as funny if his jokes weren't accompanied by Johnny trying in vain not to laugh so hard.

Another cat who rocked on Carson was Don Rickles. Watched some of that old stuff on YouTube a while back, and it had me rolling -- stuff that had gone over my head as a kid.

506 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:51:16pm

re: #483 Cognito

No, no, no. You can tell she didn't say it because it's not angry.

She is only angry when she isn't in control.

507 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:51:53pm

re: #502 realwest
PIMF 180 degrees.

508 songbird  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:52:03pm

re: #482 Russkilitlover

Good evening, Lizards,

OT -

I will only be posting occasionally (unlike OR), for a while, although I will be reading as avidly as ever. Lost my job this week - completely expected and after a brief but rather nasty battle, I received an equitable severance. Company tried to give me radically different terms from what was offered to me three months ago! I fought, they caved, yay me. But now I need to focus on a 20 hr/day job search.

Go McCain! Our one and ONLY option.

Good Luck on the Job search. Mr. Songbird is anticipating similar circumstances. - Not so lucky us! Good thing I have a job.

509 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:52:24pm

re: #505 StinkHammer

You're a hockey puck!

510 songbird  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:53:44pm

re: #502 realwest

Respectfully, I know Jimmy Webb - met him when he was in the Reagan administration and although I can't say I "know him" I can say that any thoughts that Webb had anything to do with that shooting is just so much BS.
Webb has turned out to be a BIG disappointment to me politically - almost 189 degrees from when I knew him (we did have dinner and drinks just before he was appointed Reagan's Secretary of the Navy and a more staunch conservative it is hard to imagine, but there's just no way he had anything to do with this.

It's too bad. Allen would have done a good job for us. My Virginia Gentleman husband was really disappointed when Webb got in.

511 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:53:46pm

re: #473 Throbert McGee

And I was making a comment on how McCain's and Obama's comments "came across", whether they reflected what the candidate truly believed, or was more political fluff. I stand behind what I said and how I said it. I am not an eloquent man, but I am one that is passionate in what I believe to be correct.

I was not debating, just expressing my feeling on the subject at hand, so I find you doing a +/- 1 totally irrelevant, and frankly has a mighty whiff of arrogance wafting from it. Ding me all you want.

512 Colonel Panik  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:54:18pm

re: #505 StinkHammer

Another cat who rocked on Carson was Don Rickles. Watched some of that old stuff on YouTube a while back, and it had me rolling -- stuff that had gone over my head as a kid.

And Orson Bean, and Rich Little, and Tim Conway, and Carol Burnett and...

513 Carridine  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:54:52pm

re: #501 BGOH

"Yeah? Well I'll bet you're a SURGERY-ist, aren't you? Promoting surgery as if it is the greatest thing ever, just because it sometimes saves lives! Hah! I know, because I'm an ENVIRONMENT-ist..."

/I hear you, BGOH

514 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:55:36pm

re: #495 Capitalist Tool

Quick Kimiko!
More Wasabi!

Oh ugh! No thanks, I am not into heart burn.

515 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:56:16pm

re: #511 FurryOldGuyJeans

Ding me all you want.

Watch it. This is a family website.

516 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:57:11pm

re: #515 Mich-again

Ooops! ;)

517 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:57:16pm

re: #505 StinkHammer

Another cat who rocked on Carson was Don Rickles. Watched some of that old stuff on YouTube a while back, and it had me rolling -- stuff that had gone over my head as a kid.

One of the best finds I got after clearing out the home I grew up in, was my dad's collection of LP's (Lizards under 35, that means records played on a turntable). Part of this collection included comedy records by Bob Newhart and Bill Cosby. If you have not heard Cosby's Noah's Ark piece, it's worth finding! Awsome stuff and still sets me off laughing. The Newhart stuff is the original ROFLMAO.

518 Carridine  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:58:10pm

re: #514 FurryOldGuyJeans

Quick Kimiko!
More Wasabi!
Oh ugh! No thanks, I am not into heart burn.

The origin of Kimo-wasabi... and his faithful Indian compendium, Toronto!

/had a bit part in "Apache of Blue!"

519 LEGION  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:58:21pm

re: #500 experiencedtraveller
I did-See post #147- the weight of the arguments was like an elephant sitting on a donkey- CRUSHING. See the comment of the BGOH #501 below yours- he's da man. Now brush your teeth and go to bed. I am.

520 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:58:43pm

re: #517 Russkilitlover

Noah Build An ARK!

521 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:58:51pm

re: #517 Russkilitlover

Part of this collection included comedy records by Bob Newhart and Bill Cosby.

Newhart's Driving Instructor skit was a classic.

"Shoot the tires out guys!" LMAO.

522 OldLineTexan  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:59:16pm

re: #517 Russkilitlover

One of the best finds I got after clearing out the home I grew up in, was my dad's collection of LP's (Lizards under 35, that means records played on a turntable). Part of this collection included comedy records by Bob Newhart and Bill Cosby. If you have not heard Cosby's Noah's Ark piece, it's worth finding! Awsome stuff and still sets me off laughing. The Newhart stuff is the original ROFLMAO.

Bob Newhart and the sub captain routine, or Bill Cosby and the night the bed got broken!

523 StinkHammer  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:59:20pm

re: #509 Mich-again

You're a hockey puck!

You're a hockey puck!

Rickles (to Dean Martin): Our host, that talented man from . . . what's that place in Ohio -- Youngstown?

Martin: Stubenville!

Rickles: Oh, like that's better . . .

524 Carridine  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 8:59:27pm

re: #517 Russkilitlover
And NEVER a foul word! NEVER, Russ!

525 Throbert McGee  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:01:14pm

re: #423 Occasional Reader

It's "Rube Goldb-e-rg", I believe.

Except in the UK, where it's spelled "Robinson."

On the other hand, if YouTube tags are any indicator, people outside the English-speaking world are more likely than not to call such contraptions by the name "Pythagoras Switch" -- from the title of a Japanese TV show, Pitagora Suiichi, that often features video clips of outlandishly complicated marble-machines.

(Warning: Very catchy, very annoying musical theme.)

526 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:01:27pm

re: #481 ggt Hey ggt!
Well sorta ok. My crack team of Dental Specialists (aka the Three Stooges) trying to decide which tooth to pull decided that BOTH teeth should be pulled.
That would mean I would no longer be able to eat on the right side of my mouth. I spoke at lenght to both my Oral Surgeon and my Dentist and "we" agreed we'd do one of the teeth and if the other starts giving me trouble, then that one. I is hoping and praying it doesn't wind up being the bad tooth!

How are you doing tonight?

527 StinkHammer  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:02:04pm

re: #517 Russkilitlover

One of the best finds I got after clearing out the home I grew up in, was my dad's collection of LP's (Lizards under 35, that means records played on a turntable). Part of this collection included comedy records by Bob Newhart and Bill Cosby. If you have not heard Cosby's Noah's Ark piece, it's worth finding! Awsome stuff and still sets me off laughing. The Newhart stuff is the original ROFLMAO.

I was practically weened on Cosby -- used to have all that shit memorized. Him and Carlin both (despite the stylistic difference). Didn't discover Newhart until later -- he's brilliant.

528 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:02:38pm

re: #523 StinkHammer

The Celebrity Roasts with Dean Martin, Foster Brooks, Nipsy Russel, Orson Welles, Ruth Buzzi, Rich Little, Sammy Davis Jr., et al... Some of the best TV ever.

529 songbird  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:02:39pm

re: #526 realwest

Hey ggt!
Well sorta ok. My crack team of Dental Specialists (aka the Three Stooges) trying to decide which tooth to pull decided that BOTH teeth should be pulled.
That would mean I would no longer be able to eat on the right side of my mouth. I spoke at lenght to both my Oral Surgeon and my Dentist and "we" agreed we'd do one of the teeth and if the other starts giving me trouble, then that one. I is hoping and praying it doesn't wind up being the bad tooth!

How are you doing tonight?

When is the extraction?
I'm so sorry the prognosis was so bad.

530 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:05:31pm

We went to watch a Mud Hens game in Toledo tonight. Very cool place. I like it better than Comerica Park actually.

531 StinkHammer  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:05:47pm

re: #528 Mich-again

The Celebrity Roasts with Dean Martin, Foster Brooks, Nipsy Russel, Orson Welles, Ruth Buzzi, Rich Little, Sammy Davis Jr., et al... Some of the best TV ever.

I was too young, sadly, to appreciate that stuff when it was originally aired (even though I'd watch it with my folks). But watching some of it on YouTube, I was crying at how funny those cats were. Rickles, especially -- just unbelievable. And Foster Brooks' drunk routine had me crying...

Ah, the good ole days...

532 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:05:57pm

re: #465 Cognito

I'm not sure that's a fair comparison... McCain was writing a book, and Obama was providing the A's for a Q-and-A.
That's an excellent point. Although I think you'd also have to concede that Obama referred to Jeremiah "GodDamn America" Wright as his "spiritual advisor" in a book "he" wrote, as well.

533 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:07:28pm

re: #531 StinkHammer


And Foster Brooks' drunk routine had me crying...

My wife is from Buhhhfff...Buhhhfff...Buffhhhh..Upstate New York...

534 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:07:43pm

re: #482 Russkilitlover
Hey, best of luck to you! What field of endeavor are you in and what would you like to get into (ya know we lizards can turn up some modestly amazing job leads!)?

535 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:08:57pm

re: #496 Mich-again
"I would probably put Johnny Carson in the list of the top 10 people that influenced me as a kid."

I did not know that!

536 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:09:22pm

re: #532 realwest

Although I think you'd also have to concede that Obama referred to Jeremiah "GodDamn America" Wright as his "spiritual advisor" in a book "he" wrote, as well.

Ouch. Great point. If its so much easier to frame an argument in a book than in a Q and A, what is Obama's excuse for writing such stupid things in his book? Ha.

537 StinkHammer  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:09:52pm

re: #533 Mich-again

My wife is from Buhhhfff...Buhhhfff...Buffhhhh..Upstate New York...

Yah, I'm tempted to order the DVDs of those old Roasts for the laughs and nostalgia...

OKay! I'm outtie -- ya'll be good tonight.

538 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:10:23pm

re: #526 realwest

Hangin' in there rw. Allergies have morphed into sore throat and low-grade fever. Just enough sickness to feel sh!tty, but still able to function.

thanks for asking, anyway.

Still sounds like I am doing better than you. So sorry about the teef.

539 solomonpanting  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:10:39pm

Well, has everyone inflated his/her tires?

540 Mich-again  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:10:42pm

re: #537 StinkHammer

ya'll be good tonight.

Hells no.

541 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:11:39pm

re: #520 Killgore Trout

OMG! I should have known it would be on YouTube. Thank you, thank you, thank you! I have a mile-wide smile!

542 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:12:10pm

re: #517 Russkilitlover
" uh, Lord, what's a cubit?"!

543 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:12:56pm

re: #542 realwest

"who are you really?"
/;)

544 Throbert McGee  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:13:29pm

re: #511 FurryOldGuyJeans

so I find you doing a +/- 1 totally irrelevant, and frankly has a mighty whiff of arrogance wafting from it. Ding me all you want.

Well, I wish you wouldn't take it in that spirit -- I mean the "whiff of arrogance" part, because I strongly approve of the "ding and be damned!" sentiment. But in any case, I didn't mean to say that I think Cognito is a better LGF poster than you are, let alone that Cognito is a finer person; only that on this specific matter, Cognito was more correct and you were less correct.

545 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:14:23pm

re: #534 realwest

Hey, best of luck to you! What field of endeavor are you in and what would you like to get into (ya know we lizards can turn up some modestly amazing job leads!)?

I was the Director for Homeowner Service and Quality for a home builder. I'm thinking of hooking up with some banks that may have foreclosed properties on their hands and need to bring them up to saleable condition.

546 ggt  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:16:19pm

nytol!

weet dreams

547 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:16:19pm

re: #529 songbird
Thanks, haven't set a date yet (for some bizzare reason, on each of the other two extractions this O.S. did on me ( months apart) I was in AGONY for 14 consecutive days - no gradual abatement of pain, then on the 15th day I woke up with NO PAIN. So I'm kinda, sorta, let my natural dislike for physical AGONY slow me down, but I'm gonna try to get it done early next week!

548 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:18:45pm

re: #543 Killgore Trout
LOL! Absolutely one of the funniest bits EVER in the history of comedy.
And as someone here correctly pointed out, not one foul word.

549 songbird  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:19:18pm

re: #547 realwest

Thanks, haven't set a date yet (for some bizzare reason, on each of the other two extractions this O.S. did on me ( months apart) I was in AGONY for 14 consecutive days - no gradual abatement of pain, then on the 15th day I woke up with NO PAIN. So I'm kinda, sorta, let my natural dislike for physical AGONY slow me down, but I'm gonna try to get it done early next week!

I hate it when the teeth do that. I'm on a crown watch on several of my back molars, and they twinge occasionally, but most of the time I'm skating by with no problems.

550 Carridine  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:20:31pm

re: #525 Throbert McGee
I'm reminded of The Guardian's admonition against 'trivial and often misdirected pleasures', McGee

551 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:20:44pm

re: #545 Russkilitlover
EXCELLENT IDEA! Especially cause it looks as if the Feds have given new life to some first time buyers who aren't gonna cut it anyway. Have you also thought about offering your services to homeowners to get their homes in more salable shape?

552 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:21:21pm

re: #549 songbird

I hate it when the teeth do that. I'm on a crown watch on several of my back molars, and they twinge occasionally, but most of the time I'm skating by with no problems.

re: #549 songbird

I hate it when the teeth do that. I'm on a crown watch on several of my back molars, and they twinge occasionally, but most of the time I'm skating by with no problems.

Chekhov (the Russian author, not the Star Trek character) once said that our teeth are a problem from the cradle to the grave. Boy, was he right. A clear argument against "Intelligent" design, if you ask me. And evolution hasn't worked out the kinks yet!

553 realwest  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:22:08pm

Going upstairs y'all!

554 Palandine  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:22:50pm

re: #388 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

No one was dirtier than Redd Foxx, Buddy Hacket and Bob Saget. People who don't know are always shocked when they hear them with out writers and censors.

Saget is astonishingly filthy, if you've ever seen the documentary "The Aristocrats." I think it's the more fascinating because he's generally known as that America's Funniest Home Videos guy. :)

555 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:22:58pm

re: #551 realwest

EXCELLENT IDEA! Especially cause it looks as if the Feds have given new life to some first time buyers who aren't gonna cut it anyway. Have you also thought about offering your services to homeowners to get their homes in more salable shape?

I'll let you know if anything develops. However, you are fighting real battles, mine are just blips. Best of luck to you in all your challenges.

556 rawmuse  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:25:05pm

re: #482 Russkilitlover

Good luck there!

557 DeeAitch  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:31:12pm

McCain=lucid.
Obama=elusive.

558 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:32:11pm

re: #544 Throbert McGee

only that on this specific matter, Cognito was more correct and you were less correct.

It's a rare occurrence that anyone finds cog to be more correct on anything.

559 Cognito  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:36:28pm

re: #532 realwest

re: #465 Cognito


That's an excellent point. Although I think you'd also have to concede that Obama referred to Jeremiah "GodDamn America" Wright as his "spiritual advisor" in a book "he" wrote, as well.

Oh, of course. That's why I said it's better to focus on the content of their statements than on the way they're delivered.

560 Throbert McGee  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:38:18pm

re: #524 Carridine

And NEVER a foul word! NEVER, Russ!

That's why it always ticked me off when people would say Ellen DeGenerate -- not so much because it was "homophobic," but because Ellen (to the best of my knowledge) has never ever "worked blue" in her career as a stand-up comic.

And although I greatly admire creative profanity and enjoy a well-told dirty joke, I also respect comics (like DeGeneres) who manage to go against the current and keep things clean even when they're performing for an adult audience. So to call her a name like that was a display of contempt for her professionalism as a comic, without even getting into the issue of her sexuality.

Now if we're talking about Margaret Cho, on the other hand...

561 Pawn of the Oppressor  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:55:25pm
“I believe in evolution,” Sen. John McCain said. “But I also believe, when I hike the Grand Canyon and see it at sunset, that the hand of God is there also.”

Damn Straight. Preach it, Brother McCain! Can I git a Ay-men?

562 Throbert McGee  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 9:59:21pm

re: #558 Sharmuta

It's a rare occurrence that anyone finds cog to be more correct on anything.

Yes, I think I understand what you're saying. But still, I believe in giving credit where it's due, and on this little point, cognito made a better case than FOGJ. (And truth be told, Mini-Throbert tends to favor furry old guys in jeans, if you catch my drift. And if you don't catch my drift, here's Dogma-director Kevin Smith to elaborate.)

563 Fried Spam  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 10:20:33pm

re: #42 Jim in Virginia

For those who don't like Obana but aren't yet sold on McCain: recall 1992 when folks mad at Bush 1 voted for Perot, and got eight years of Clinton.
OK, off the soapbox.

Sadly, that was me. I was young and foolish.

No BHO.

564 Ojoe  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 10:26:32pm

re: #467 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

As O is only 1/2 black, that is a .5 ass reason to vote for him.

565 Slumbering Behemoth  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 10:44:02pm

re: #477 FurryOldGuyJeans

Best back-story for a (seemingly) nonsensical nic EVAR!

/I picked mine while drunkenly stumbling upon an open registration while listening to this. Not nearly as interesting.

566 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 30, 2008 11:15:59pm

re: #562 Throbert McGee

LOL! I get ya, Throbert. ;)

And for what it's worth, I've been known once or twice to agree with cog. But the point remains that it's a rare occasion when it happens. Also- I've learned my lesson in giving him any sort of defense. Even if I might be sitting on my end thinking he's right, I'll keep it to myself, since it's not as if he appreciates it anyways.

567 Forever  Thu, Jul 31, 2008 12:22:38am

re: #7 Sharmuta

Well said, Senator.

The question now becomes will certain groups stay home and not vote for him because of this position, or will they claim it was his VP selection of Romney that made them stay home?

Either way the narrow minded have enough reasons to pick for staying home. Hee Hee

568 elrushbuni  Thu, Jul 31, 2008 2:18:30am

Obama: I believe in parents being able to provide children with religious instruction without interference from the state.

What this means is that he would sponsor state run Sharia education as is being proposed in England. In other words, the Muslims will have a "right" to faith based education sponsored by the state when they decide to whine for it.

AS THEY NOW HAVE IN ENGLAND ---- BELOW:
" Hell will freeze over before Muslim schools give children a liberal education", teachers were told today.

Faith schools threaten to cause religious segregation and must not be expanded, said Wesley Paxton from teachers' union Voice.

He suggested divisions like those seen in Northern Ireland between Protestant and Catholic communities could arise in England if more Islamic groups take over schools.

His remarks follow government moves to give religious groups a greater role in education through an expansion of academies and an offer of state funding for private Muslim schools.

569 mad doc  Thu, Jul 31, 2008 3:10:55am

Evolution is not even a theory. It is a hypothesis. You people believe in it like the Gospel.

Evolution is like the belief in a flat earth, or the belief that the sun goes around the earth, by that I mean you people are closed minded. You are like the church that opposed Gallileo. Anyone that dares question you , you abuse. I have experienced this on this blog, and I have never abused anyone here.

Why is the idea that we were created, not evolved so repugnant to you?

The simplest bacterial protein contains an informational power of 10 to the power 120. This is greater that the number of atoms in the universe multiplied by its age in seconds.

Goodbye.

570 Salamantis  Thu, Jul 31, 2008 4:08:39am

re: #569 mad doc

Evolution is not even a theory. It is a hypothesis. You people believe in it like the Gospel.

You just don't give up, do ya kid? Ya hafta stick this refuted and discredited crapola on the tail end of each and every thread, and lie yer ass of for yer version of Jeebus.

You very well know that evolution is not only a theory, but one of the most empirical-evidence-supported theories in the history of science, and that what ove can know via perusing evidence, one has no need to believe. You're been told this before. But like the good little zombic memebot you are, you keep playing yer broken tape recorder.

Evolution is like the belief in a flat earth, or the belief that the sun goes around the earth, by that I mean you people are closed minded. You are like the church that opposed Gallileo. Anyone that dares question you , you abuse. I have experienced this on this blog, and I have never abused anyone here.

Now talk about turnspeak projection; this one takes the cake and the creampie, too! The people who are closed minded are the people who refuse to acknowledge overwhelming tsunamis of evidence even when they're inundated with them. People like yourself.

Why is the idea that we were created, not evolved so repugnant to you?

Why is scientifically supported empirical evidence, and the conclusions that are so predominantly drawn from is that it's like a deluge of confirmation so repugnant to you that you would ostrich your head in the sand dune of willfull ignorance rather than acknowledge it?

The simplest bacterial protein contains an informational power of 10 to the power 120. This is greater that the number of atoms in the universe multiplied by its age in seconds.

Goodbye.

Another one of those long-debunked-by-talkorigins.com Disco Dewde talking points. You have nothing better to offer than false assertions. All you've got is lies. Hava ball breaking the 9th commandment, yahear?

571 Yashmak  Thu, Jul 31, 2008 7:18:21am

Well, it's nice to know that I don't need to worry about either candidate's stance on evolution/creation related issues. . .

Evolution is not even a theory. It is a hypothesis. You people believe in it like the Gospel.

- mad doc

That's a really strange statement. If not for the rest of your comment, I'd probably have interpreted it as satire; "believe in it like the Gospel".

There's a difference between the believing Gospel and evolutionary theory though. One has to be taken on faith in the absence of evidence, and the other is supported by mountains of scientific evidence generated by thousands upon thousands of scientific studies conducted over the years. It's baffling to me how anyone can fail to understand that.

572 Cognito  Thu, Jul 31, 2008 8:40:26am

re: #566 Sharmuta

I'm not sure why you think I don't appreciate supportive comments, Sharmuta. Because I certainly do.

What lesson did you learn about piping up? I'm curious because this happens a lot -- I get little emails saying, "Yeah, you're right!" and "Right behind you!" and so forth, from people who are apparently afraid to speak up in the comments section themselves.

573 Sharmuta  Thu, Jul 31, 2008 8:46:23am

re: #572 Cognito

I'm not sure why you think I don't appreciate supportive comments, Sharmuta. Because I certainly do.

What lesson did you learn about piping up? I'm curious because this happens a lot -- I get little emails saying, "Yeah, you're right!" and "Right behind you!" and so forth, from people who are apparently afraid to speak up in the comments section themselves.

Maybe it's because you never say thank you- or ever return the favor to anyone. Not that it's a quid pro quo, but I don't recall the last time you were supportive of another poster's position on a thread with either comments or dings when you either agree with them or they're agreeing with you and offering support. Basically- you don't show any gratitude, so why would I assume you have any?

574 Excaliber  Thu, Jul 31, 2008 1:13:00pm

oh who in the hell cares what anyone thinks on evolution ......that aint gonna get us outta this bloody mess .


-maybe this election people will vote with their brains rather than their emotions .

Anyone can see where THAT got us .

575 starboardhelm  Thu, Jul 31, 2008 2:38:14pm

Obama: "And I think it’s a mistake to try to cloud the teaching of science with theories that frankly don’t hold up to scientific inquiry."

Sooo . . . no more Global Warming brain washing, either?

576 Cognito  Thu, Jul 31, 2008 3:47:36pm

re: #573 Sharmuta

Maybe it's because you never say thank you- or ever return the favor to anyone. Not that it's a quid pro quo, but I don't recall the last time you were supportive of another poster's position on a thread with either comments or dings when you either agree with them or they're agreeing with you and offering support. Basically- you don't show any gratitude, so why would I assume you have any?

Oh, come on now. I'm the first to stand up for someone, regardless of how unpopular the opinion may be.

And let's face it: A high-five from me won't help anyone make friends, here. So when someone's in agreement with me, I don't make a big fuss about it.

And let's face it again: It's exceedingly rare that someone pipes up in my defense. So we're not talking about a huge trend, here.

577 annefrance  Thu, Jul 31, 2008 8:26:22pm

My goodness, what is it with you Americans? Do you really aspire to be a democratic secular state? Or are y'all resigned to the theocracy that is taking over, and that condemns you to morally bankrupt leaders like Jimmy Carter and George W. Bush?
Why do your two current candidates feel the need to equivocate and tango around the issue of evolution, and pay lip service to the Christian God? What is wrong with saying that matters of spirituality and faith have no place in the political sphere? Have we forgotten that it is the separation of Church and State that is the best guarantor of religious freedoms? Moreover, what does religious belief have to do with objective reality? Belief systems, like any fantasy, have no connection with reality.
Do you Americans really believe that when a young woman is at the wheel of her car, with little children in the back seat, she should indeed abdicate responsibility and control in a moment of emergency, and exhort Jesus to take the wheel (as the popular, but revolting, song commands)? To me, this is a recipe for extinction, not exaltation of life.
You all sound no more intellectually sophisticated than the Latinos who see Jesus' or Mary's face in cat hair or shrubbery: long on rapture, short on rationality. Your collective failure to affirm rationality in the face of such simple challenges leads me to believe you merit facing the "clash of civilizations" which will invariably pit you against those other proponents of a universal world religious order. This is a clash that could otherwise be avoided were you to demonstrate the strength of your secular convictions and the willingness to proselytize the Enlightenment to the more primitive cultures, and show them the path to rid themselves of the shackles of dogmatic religious beliefs that enslave peoples and inhibit the advance of civilization.
Your real courage to adhere to your godhead will manifest itself if any of you as individuals is afflicted with antibiotic-resistant bacteria or antiretroviral-resistant HIV (amongst other evolving ailments and emerging diseases), and whether you will then have the "faith" to rely on drugs that were effective to treat such diseases prior to their evolution to new forms.

578 Cognito  Thu, Jul 31, 2008 9:01:49pm

re: #577 annefrance

My goodness, what is it with you Americans? Do you really aspire to be a democratic secular state? Or are y'all resigned to the theocracy that is taking over, and that condemns you to morally bankrupt leaders like Jimmy Carter and George W. Bush?
Why do your two current candidates feel the need to equivocate and tango around the issue of evolution, and pay lip service to the Christian God? What is wrong with saying that matters of spirituality and faith have no place in the political sphere? Have we forgotten that it is the separation of Church and State that is the best guarantor of religious freedoms? Moreover, what does religious belief have to do with objective reality? Belief systems, like any fantasy, have no connection with reality.
Do you Americans really believe that when a young woman is at the wheel of her car, with little children in the back seat, she should indeed abdicate responsibility and control in a moment of emergency, and exhort Jesus to take the wheel (as the popular, but revolting, song commands)? To me, this is a recipe for extinction, not exaltation of life.
You all sound no more intellectually sophisticated than the Latinos who see Jesus' or Mary's face in cat hair or shrubbery: long on rapture, short on rationality. Your collective failure to affirm rationality in the face of such simple challenges leads me to believe you merit facing the "clash of civilizations" which will invariably pit you against those other proponents of a universal world religious order. This is a clash that could otherwise be avoided were you to demonstrate the strength of your secular convictions and the willingness to proselytize the Enlightenment to the more primitive cultures, and show them the path to rid themselves of the shackles of dogmatic religious beliefs that enslave peoples and inhibit the advance of civilization.
Your real courage to adhere to your godhead will manifest itself if any of you as individuals is afflicted with antibiotic-resistant bacteria or antiretroviral-resistant HIV (amongst other evolving ailments and emerging diseases), and whether you will then have the "faith" to rely on drugs that were effective to treat such diseases prior to their evolution to new forms.

Relax.


This entry has been archived.
Comments are closed.

^ back to top ^

log in
Name:
Pass:

Register Forgot Your Password? My Account Re-send Confirmation (To log in, cookies must be enabled in your browser!)

► LGF Headlines

► Top 10 Comments

► Bottom Comments

► Recent Comments

► Tools/Info

► LGF Hits

► Slideshows

► Resources

► Never Forget

► Statistics

► Tag Cloud

► Contact

You must have Javascript enabled to use the contact form.
Your email:

Subject:

Message:


Messages may be published in our weblog, unless you request otherwise.
Tech Note:
Using the Contact Form

► News/Opinion

More Partners

Compare Electricity Prices in your area. Texas Electricity is deregulated; you have the right to choose Texas Electric Rates from among many Texas Electric Companies.

Lair of the Secular Torquemada.


Holiday Gift Guide - Save up to 45% on the seasons best!