My prediction; DOGS AND CATS, LIVING TOGETHER, MASS HYSTERIA!

Wow, great San Francisco legends live on.

They're used to picking up the pieces.

The Bank of America must be feeling bullish.

BIG MONEY IS RIPPING US OFF!

The end is near!

er

Better the private sector than the government.

Better the Bank of America than some saudi outfit.

re: #7 Dream

Better the private sector than the government.

That too.

I was gonna buy Merrill Lynch -- but no one could give me change for a $50 billion bill. So I just said "Screw it" and bought Luxembourg instead.

Lots of bad shit has been happening in the world's financial markets lately. Who has been profiting?

And what has Soros been up to?

Financial Services sector is so screwed up with people who have gone from the business of managing capital into the business of three card monty. With Lehman, it is about time one of the guys running the game was stuck with the bill. As for ML, this is a huge loss of ego for them. They used to dictate terms to anyone doing business with them. Hat in hand now.

I just hope wall street gets back into the business of capitalizing American industry after this and gets out of the business of leveraging the crap out of any deal that can turn a penny.

I just posted a paniced rant on the end of the last thread.

Unbelievable news.

Remember, Lehman is going down tomorrow, too.

Dow is opening down 300, so far.

No idea how this will work out, but it strikes me like Iowa sailing down the Mississippi and falling into the sea, not very promising.

Uh, not to be contrarian here* but

”Now Bank of America has one of the best and largest retail brokerages in the country, one of the top investment banks in the world, and a large stake in one of the best investment managers in the world," Ellman said.

then why the hell is Merrill looking to be bought out? I mean if they are one of the top investment banks in the world and one of the best investment managers in the world, why are they going under (but for BofA's action)?!

*Bank of America's headquarters is in Charlotte!

re: #2 rawmuse

Wow, great San Francisco legends live on.

Yeah, changing the name from "Bank of Italy" to "Bank of America" was perhaps the greatest marketing gimmick ever.

That is a relief. Wasn't China sniffing around this one?

Fortunately the street has had some time to prepare for the demise of Lehman and maybe the damage will be less. Some firms will make a killing picking the bones of Lehman.

As for Merrill, Thain did the right thing and not screw around like Fuld did.
I wonder how Fuld can justify his 71mil compensation package? (Fuld family are big O donors btw)

Scroll down to pic

re: #3 The Other Les

They're used to picking up the pieces.

Right you are. Mr. Giannini started business after the 1906 quake, writing loans from an ironing board set up in the very ruins of San Francisco, before the smoke even cleared.

Ask BofA how that Countrywide buyout is working for them...

re: #11 Racer X
"And what has Soros been up to?"
Making money off other peoples misery, as usual.

Beware the consolidation of power in a small number of financial institutions. The market is based on individual stockholders reacting to the conditions, not the control of our markets in the hands of megaliths.

Beware!

re: #14 realwest

then why the hell is Merrill looking to be bought out? I mean if they are one of the top investment banks in the world and one of the best investment managers in the world, why are they going under (but for BofA's action)?!

They are so f'ing brilliant they are like $50b under water, so BofA buys them at a $40b discount and tries to make good on what's left.

Truth is, there is no public data on just why this is happening, so assume the worst.

re: #20 beatcanvas

Ask BofA how that Countrywide buyout is working for them...

Nobody outside BofA knows, first report is due in about 50 days.

Merrill Lynch being bought is the good news. Lehman filing for bankruptcy is the bad. The questions now: what will happen to WaMu and AIG?

I blame McBush

or something.

OT and speaking of the word "McBush" -

A couple of days ago I linked to an artist's blog where people were commenting about how Maureen Dowd's column on Palin had been "devastating". Just now I found a link to that column on an unrelated site, read about two paragraphs out of morbid curiosity (and a real desire to see substantial criticism of Gov. Palin)... skipped the rest... What trash. Silly, frivolous, obnoxious stuff, about 90% of what we'd call "snark", and I'd call 90% a conservative estimate. Precious little substance in that "devastating" article. I guess making fun of how somebody blinks on television is what passes for "devastating"?

When we do it to Pelosi, we don't pretend that we're serious.

I just checked the coffee can under my bed. Still there. So my money's safe.

SHOW ME THE CAPITULATION!

/I smell bottom

Huh.

Honestly I haven't the faintest clue how to read this -- fingers crossed, hoping for a better marketplace. First clue comes tomorrow morning, I suppose.

re: #19 rawmuse

Right you are. Mr. Giannini started business after the 1906 quake, writing loans from an ironing board set up in the very ruins of San Francisco, before the smoke even cleared.

Wasn't Giannini a fan of Mussolini (not trying to rhyme here it just happened) in the 1920's and 30's?

I seem to remember reading that somewhere.

re: #18 lummox

Scroll down to pic

That is nice!

I love this comment from Bubba Thudd: I fucking love that photo of McCain - once again, the Left scores an own-goal!

That's the same bank that refused to take me off the X's account after he dropped me as a signatory and left me with

Oh, whatever.

Just bumped it to $125,000.00 that it took me to get rid of that twit.

re: #25 Dahveed

Merrill Lynch being bought is the good news. Lehman filing for bankruptcy is the bad. The questions now: what will happen to WaMu and AIG?

They will be torn apart by the end of the year, both piss-poor managed for a long time.

Then, Wachovia also on the line.

The "funny" thing is, I believe most of this is happening too late, that the underlying real estate market has already been purged, to all intents and purposes. Perhaps I'm mistaken, hey. Or just perhaps, the strong hands here, like BofA, are going to make a gigantic killing here.

But the risk, is unbelievable, like betting the federal budget double or nothing on red.

re: #22 Pepper
Ah hell, the overwhelming majority of stock in places like Merrill is held by Retirement Funds - it was a favorite of many IRA fund managers. That way, instead of just a few poor souls losing, a whole lot of poor souls are losing out.
I think AIG is a potentially MUCH bigger story, btw.

re: #11 Racer X

Lots of bad shit has been happening in the world's financial markets lately. Who has been profiting?

And what has Soros been up to?

A lot of this is simply due to people having taken an old standard, stable credit risk (American homeowners) and turned it into a scheme that Michael Milken would have been proud to take credit for.

Just like the "junk bonds" crisis in the late 80s, we have people skimming money out of the credit system by selling high risk debt and packaging it as lower risk debt. Thing is that most everyone in business borrows money, and most people who lend money are lending money they have borrowed. When you start screwing up that system with large scale misrepresentation of risk, you get collapse - first guy to go to cash wins. Everyone else loses. And that will continue to squeeze many people and businesses who had no idea they were tied into this.

re: #30 Colonel Panik

Seems to me that everyone loved Mussolini, up to a point.

re: #18 lummox

Scroll down to pic

From the site:

Lee suggested that the gay gossip site and antisemitic conspiracy newsletter The Atlantic had photographed McCain to look just like Lex Luthor...

That's just ignorant.

If the government subsidizes and bails out risky investment, we will just get more...let Lehman go. Once again Kudos to Thain. ML will now be subject to BoA accounting standards and scrutiny.

re: #32 MandyManners

Just bumped it to $125,000.00 that it took me to get rid of that twit.

Think of it as money well spent.

re: #26 Pawn of the Oppressor

The leftists seem to think "snark" is a stand in for intelligent thinking and substantive criticism. Witness the popularity of one John Stewart.

With regards to Sarah Palin the Mainstream Media and the left in general has jumped the snark.

re: #25 Dahveed

Merrill Lynch being bought is the good news. Lehman filing for bankruptcy is the bad. The questions now: what will happen to WaMu and AIG?

WaMu has plenty of cash, as long as people don't panic it'll be fine.

re: #35 karmic_inquisitor

Yeah, I'd like the top 100 or maybe 1000 officers of Merrill Lynch stripped of all assets and imprisoned for 20 years, for starters.

re: #25 Dahveed
I agree, but I think AIG is the more important story and probably the biggest risk here.

re: #29 Cognito

Honestly I haven't the faintest clue how to read this

The entire topic is completely beyond my ken. I'm just glad I don't need to know what it's all about.

Money these days is nothing but bits and bytes in a database somewhere -- a mutually agreed upon illusion of purchasing power. There is no actual "money" anymore. Just electrons arranged on a magnetic disk -- nothing more.

I have some investments with ML. They've done pretty well in the past two years, all things considered. Of course, I've kept a pretty sharp eye on them recently. I was considering pumping just a bit more ML's way, but I think I'll hold off for awhile, and see how this shakes out. Hell, everything could be gone tomorrow moring, anyway. ;)

re: #41 jcm

WaMu has plenty of cash, as long as people don't panic it'll be fine.

WaMu also already dumped it's mortgages on Wells Fargo.

re: #13 itellu3times

Dow is opening down 300, so far.

No idea how this will work out, but it strikes me like Iowa sailing down the Mississippi and falling into the sea, not very promising.

My guess is that it won't end up down that far. If it does, let's just tack on another 300 and clear the decks. When this hits the front page of the New York Times, which it probably do tomorrow, the bottom is in.

/then again, it's just a guess

re: #39 Racer X

Think of it as money well spent.

Just a penny!

re: #44 zombie

I've got a Mason Jar stuffed full of RAM and optic fiber, under my mattress.

Bring on the e-Dustbowl.

My grandma told me today that we are on the tipping edge of another great depression, and that no one is willing to admit it. FWIW, she's lived through one already.

Maybe she's right, maybe she's wrong, I don't know. I am no economist, and she's getting on in years.

I'm not worried. Worse comes to worst, I now know I can cook squirrel in a popcorn popper.
/

I expect that with credit tightening (less money available), massive institutional re-alignment (less trust in the marketplace), and people looking for safe harbor (less certainty), we'll see some very disruptive innovations in the financial markets in the next five years. Too much opportunity and technology.

And what if it came from some international outfit?

re: #50 Slumbering Behemoth

I'm not worried. Worse comes to worst, I now know I can cook squirrel in a popcorn popper.

LOL!

I can't wait until the story of all this is told, with numbers.

Hope I can still afford to buy the book, when it comes out.

re: #46 Sharmuta

WaMu also already dumped it's mortgages on Wells Fargo.

Washington Mutual has too many problems with Option ARMs that are resetting. The rates on those loans will squeeze a lot of people.

re: #44 zombie

Money these days is nothing but bits and bytes in a database somewhere -- a mutually agreed upon illusion of purchasing power. There is no actual "money" anymore. Just electrons arranged on a magnetic disk -- nothing more.

It is the Full Faith and Credit of the United States Government.
That is all, really.

Shouldn't this make the price of oil retreat further, if traders believe we're headed for a precipitous drop in demand due to a slowing economy?

/Not a dismal scientist

re: #51 beatcanvas

I expect that with credit tightening (less money available), massive institutional re-alignment (less trust in the marketplace), and people looking for safe harbor (less certainty), we'll see some very disruptive innovations in the financial markets in the next five years. Too much opportunity and technology.

Yeah, I think they might call it, "gold".

Or maybe we can follow the Saudis, and start bartering with camels and goats, we could be a net exporter there.

Glad up here in Canada we don't have the same sort of mortgage mess. Unfortunately our economy is too closely tied to the American economy. I just hope this blows over soon.

re: #41 jcm

WaMu has plenty of cash, as long as people don't panic it'll be fine.

Cash is not as big a problem as the capital issues. One analyst is thinking that they may take up to $32.5 billion in losses on their home loans. They don't have the capital to sustain those losses.

re: #39 Racer X

But, really. In my mid-30s, and I was paying out $10,000.00/mo. for about 15 months? Then, that cocksuckingmotherfuckingbastard stiffs his CS by about $80,000.00?

Me? Bitter? Whythefuck are you asking?

OT

I don't know what is so important about Golden, Co. but 3 weeks ago we got Al-Jazeera for two days and this week, on Monday, we get Palin at the fairgrounds and on Tues we get Obama at the School of Mines.

[Link: www.coloradodaily.com...]

Go away, leave us alone.

Walter in Golden, Co.

Sh_t. We have an IRA with AIG.

re: #58 BlueCanuck

I just hope this blows over soon.

/anything over a one day 400 point drop in the Dow ought to do it

If you think U.S. financials are in bad shape, don't look at China. They're desperate to grow their way out of their bad debt, but if we have a significant slowdown in the U.S., their major export market, the cash just isn't going to be there...

Just read this today on MSN:

5 Banks Safe From the Storm

re: #60 MandyManners

Ha!

Sounds like your are doing better in life now.

Wow, we will find out soon enough if this was a good idea or not when we see the shake out of the market tomorrow.

re: #42 itellu3times
At the very least - long story short - when I was still married to the most recent former Mrs. Realwest she had stock in Merrill and so we got the Shareholders reports.
In one year Merrill - very quietly - fired OVER 15,000 employees. So the next year I looked up "Personnel" under operating expenses, expecting to see a significant drop in Merrill's expenses and what do I see?
The President, CEO and Chairman of the Board (at the time three separate individuals) received BONUSES totaling something close to $400 MILLION! Bonuses for a year in which Merrill lost not just the 15,000 + employees, but about $650 MILLION dollars (back when a Million was really a million).
So we wrote to the Board and the President (well, I wrote the letter, she signed it) asking why did they get ANY bonuses when Merrill lost a lot of money and had to fire 15,000 people. The answer was - I'm not joking here - because without the tireless efforts of all three men, Merrill would have lost MORE MONEY THAN IT DID!
"We" wrote back a letter that really ripped them up and sent copies to the top 10 shareholders (all institutional investors).
A year later all three were "retired" and three more bozos were hired at a combined TRIPLE INCREASE IN PAY!
Fuck Merrill - sorry for any folks who lost money by investing in Merrill, but not sorry for Merrill at all.

re: #57 itellu3times

Yeah, I think they might call it, "gold".

Um, yeah. Nobody will see that one coming...

re: #40 Colonel Panik

The leftists seem to think "snark" is a stand in for intelligent thinking and substantive criticism. Witness the popularity of one John Stewart.

With regards to Sarah Palin the Mainstream Media and the left in general has jumped the snark.

The Snark didn't work very well.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

re: #65 twincitiesgirl

Just read this today on MSN:

5 Banks Safe From the Storm

They are maybe a little optimistic.

When Merrill Lynch speaks, people listen

I guess they're not talking now.

re: #71 itellu3times

What would be your picks?

Fascism......oy

re: #36 rawmuse

Seems to me that everyone loved Mussolini, up to a point.

Well, he was pretty good with the mass transit thing. Seems like he was really popular in a lot of circles that would surprise most people today, until he bombed and invaded Ethiopia and started hanging out with that Schickelgruber character.

re: #45 Cartman
Hey my friend - please see my #68; I wouldn't necessarily panic sell what you have invested (assuming you do have other - safer and stronger - investments) but I sure as HELL wouldn't put more money in it!

re: #63 Killian Bundy

Pardon my thickness, but are you saying that drop will precipitate the end of the bear market, or something else really ugly?

From previous thread, which died almost immediately after I posted it:
***************
CNBC is about wetting its pants. Usually this late at night they'd be running infomercials with that squinty guy pimping Sham-Wows. Instead, they're talking about how the foreign markets are doing now.

/Not good.

re: #72 solomonpanting

When Merrill Lynch speaks, people listen

I guess they're not talking now.

Maybe not, but I still think Thain took a better route than Fuld and maybe Merrill's work force will not taking the beating that Lehman's will.

re: #71 itellu3times

These 5 banks are all in liberal land, coincidence?

re: #75 Colonel Panik

I have that book. I have read it twice. Excellent scholarship therein.

Let the free market sort itself out! The more the government interferes the worse the pain will be.

re: #44 zombie

The entire topic is completely beyond my ken. I'm just glad I don't need to know what it's all about.

Money these days is nothing but bits and bytes in a database somewhere -- a mutually agreed upon illusion of purchasing power. There is no actual "money" anymore. Just electrons arranged on a magnetic disk -- nothing more.

Here is a sample type of "investment" that these guys like to make.

It is called a "carry trade". Say that you can borrow money in Japan at 4% interest, and you can buy a bond in Brazil at 6% interest. You borrow money and put it in the bond. Now you have a bond and an IOU. If the currencies between the two counties (Yen and Real) are stable, you sit back and skim 2%.

But wait - you have that bond. That bond could be used as collateral on another loan. So you do it again - this time borrowing dollars to buy a Euro denominated bond. Another 2%. Now you are getting 4%, and you have that Euro bond that you can still borrow against.

Do this on the scale of billions of dollars, and make some of those bonds be made up a bunch of sub-prime mortgages, and then see an unexpected currency shift. That +4% can go to -10% fast.

Now you start seeing what these players are are up against and when they try to get out of the deals they did by selling the bond and paying the note before it gets worse, they call it "unwinding the trade."

re: #74 Wishing

Fascism......oy

Huh?

re: #50 Slumbering Behemoth

I'm not worried. Worse comes to worst, I now know I can cook squirrel in a popcorn popper.
/

I think that after the collapse, .22LR rounds will take the place of currency as a medium of exchange.

re: #70 The Other Les

The Snark didn't work very well.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

And Bill Maher. He's even worse then Stewart. Called Palin a "Jesus freak" last week.

re: #44 zombie

The entire topic is completely beyond my ken. I'm just glad I don't need to know what it's all about.

Money these days is nothing but bits and bytes in a database somewhere -- a mutually agreed upon illusion of purchasing power. There is no actual "money" anymore. Just electrons arranged on a magnetic disk -- nothing more.

We were just discussing that very thing a work a couple weeks back. Most of our assets are numbers on paper, and magnetic patterns stored redundantly who knows where. If some cosmic EMP were to come along and corrupt all mass storage in one swell foop... then what? Talk about your mass hysteria...

re: #82 EIDE_Interface

Let the free market sort itself out! The more the government interferes the worse the pain will be.

Yep, subsidizing stupidity is never a good idea.

re: #73 twincitiesgirl

What would be your picks?

I'm not that smart, I'm just saying the sector is being hit so hard, I wouldn't talk of any safe havens.

re: #77 Cartman

Pardon my thickness, but are you saying that drop will precipitate the end of the bear market, or something else really ugly?

Sarah Palin is gonna shoot the g_d d_mned bear!

re: #68 realwest

Dang! So are you saying you favor BofA buying them out?

re: #51 beatcanvas
"And what if it came from some international outfit?"
Then that international outfit would be running the same risks as we are!
Wonder how the Magic Kingdom and especially the Arab Emirates are feeling about the BILLONS AND BILLONS of bucks they invested in US financial companies late last year?!

re: #91 Macker

Dang! So are you saying you favor BofA buying them out?

Don't know about rw, but I'd say they are scum, and BofA better be getting a super-good price and all sorts of goodies from the fed under the table.

re: #78 Palandine

From previous thread, which died almost immediately after I posted it:
***************
CNBC is about wetting its pants. Usually this late at night they'd be running infomercials with that squinty guy pimping Sham-Wows. Instead, they're talking about how the foreign markets are doing now.

/Not good.

Yeah - the left is having wet dreams over market collapse just so they can say "See! See! McCain will be bad for the economy! We need Obama to save us!"

This root cause of this is corruption. Same as Enron. McCain/Palin are the better ticket to work on it.

re: #92 realwest

"And what if it came from some international outfit?"
Then that international outfit would be running the same risks as we are!
Wonder how the Magic Kingdom and especially the Arab Emirates are feeling about the BILLONS AND BILLONS of bucks they invested in US financial companies late last year?!

Well, in theory, this is trying to save their bucks.

At the risk of sounding naive, I only recently learned what a short sale is.
The entire concept seemed wrong to me. How do you sell something that you do not own? It is a convoluted affair, and I only understand it enough to know that I never want to be involved with one.

Tomorrow is definitely going to be a busy work day.

re: #86 EIDE_Interface

And Bill Maher. He's even worse then Stewart. Called Palin a "Jesus freak" last week.

Some people seem to be under the impression that atheism is a holy cause.

re: #97 rawmuse

At the risk of sounding naive, I only recently learned what a short sale is.
The entire concept seemed wrong to me. How do you sell something that you do not own? It is a convoluted affair, and I only understand it enough to know that I never want to be involved with one.

Turns out there are short sales, and then there are naked shorts.

At some point, the values become ridiculously low and the cash levee will be overtopped.

/FCX is being unfairly punished like it was a bank

re: #84 Sharmuta

goverment bailouts....huge multinationals..who owns whom?

re: #91 Macker
I'm not saying that, Charles thread is saying it - and if there ever was a thread/link you should read, it's this one!

They are already saying the Asian Markets are way down today with all the bad news from the US economy.

re: #43 realwest

I agree, but I think AIG is the more important story and probably the biggest risk here.

Don't follow such matters as I used to, but on reading your comment I goog'ed AIG:

Like other insurers, AIG has been hit hard by deterioration in the credit markets amid concerns that complex, structured investments it insures will increasingly default. For the three quarters ended in June, AIG lost about $25 billion in the value of credit default swaps -- or default protection for bondholders -- and about $15 billion on other investments.

How complex a pyramid scheme are we to believe the senior partners built for themselves, anyway? Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the difficulties borne of recent mortgage lending practices will dwarf all the Enrons, Tycos, etc., from which we sought to recover.

re: #63 Killian Bundy

/anything over a one day 400 point drop in the Dow ought to do it

I agree. The big drops are followed by bull markets that last many more months.

re: #76 realwest

I agree, R-Dubs, but the million dollar (thousand, in my case) question is where do I put my money? I don't have much faith in any financial institution, at this point.

re: #97 rawmuse

At the risk of sounding naive, I only recently learned what a short sale is.
The entire concept seemed wrong to me. How do you sell something that you do not own? It is a convoluted affair, and I only understand it enough to know that I never want to be involved with one.

Are you talking stock options or real estate?

re: #108 Dar ul Harb

Are you talking stock options or real estate?

Stocks.

re: #83 karmic_inquisitor

I would then guess that collateral is not applicable in this market. Dangerous indeed.

re: #99 The Other Les

Bill Maher is angry from being unable to pick up cool chicks in bars. That is the whole method to him.

re: #77 Cartman

Pardon my thickness, but are you saying that drop will precipitate the end of the bear market, or something else really ugly?

/you need to run all the crack head cash out of the market before there will be a rebound

re: #92 realwest

Wonder how the Magic Kingdom and especially the Arab Emirates are feeling about the BILLONS AND BILLONS of bucks they invested in US financial companies late last year?!

I expect they feel like they want to find a way to wring out return on their investment. But Banking 2.0 most likely won't come from the institutional players we know today.

The left's big mistake in going after Palin on religion and abortion is that she doesn't thrust these issues down people's throats to begin with. It's more of a private thing to her, her personal values. So when the left calls her a "Jesus freak" or compares her to Pontius Pilate, they are basically telling all values-voters to f*ck off.

BTW - part of the dynamic here is that these companies have to report their assets as they change in value.

How do you do that when some of the assets are bundles of sub prime mortgages? You don't know who will pay and who won't. If you foreclose, you don't know what value to place the property at. So you are forced to reprice downward until you don't have enough assets to stay in the black.

So these reforms are actually adding to the problem and creating downward / panic momentum. Houses are worth something. Most people are paying their mortgages. Just the same, they are on the balance sheet at a discount.

Some of these reforms are proving unhelpful - "bad facts make for bad laws"

Global Financial System Reacts to Wall Street Meltdown
World stock markets sunk on Monday morning amid a tidal wave of disastrous news out of Wall Street that pointed towards rougher seas ahead.

Although markets in Tokyo, Shanghai, Seoul, and Hong Kong were closed for holiday, the Sydney All Ordinaries and the stock exchange in Taipei headed down as trading advanced early Monday morning. The BBC Global 30 was also down in early Monday trading. The Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) is expected to plunge 300 points or more at the opening bell signaling the start of trading on markets in New York that have been shaken by a series of barely imaginable economic events over the past weekend. ...

re: #107 Cartman

I agree, R-Dubs, but the million dollar (thousand, in my case) question is where do I put my money? I don't have much faith in any financial institution, at this point.

How about a nice credit union?

re: #85 Colonel Panik

I think that after the collapse, .22LR rounds will take the place of currency as a medium of exchange.

I'm outta luck, then. All my ammo is...uh...a little bigger. ;)

I let the shock of the implications of Sharia courts in G.B. push me a wee-bit to the edge, Lizards. I apologize.

Good night, and God bless.

Bloody hell, I don't understand all this financial gobbledegook, what the hell is everyone talking about the IRA for, are those bloody Fenians setting off car bombs again?

/

re: #107 Cartman

I agree, R-Dubs, but the million dollar (thousand, in my case) question is where do I put my money? I don't have much faith in any financial institution, at this point.

Your deposits are insured by the FDIC up to $100,000 for personal accounts and $250,000 in retirement accounts.

re: #112 Killian Bundy

So, the market needs an enema, so to speak?

New telephone on Day by Day.

re: #50 Slumbering BehemothWell,

My grandma told me today that we are on the tipping edge of another great depression, and that no one is willing to admit it. FWIW, she's lived through one already.

Maybe she's right, maybe she's wrong, I don't know. I am no economist, and she's getting on in years.

I'm not worried. Worse comes to worst, I now know I can cook squirrel in a popcorn popper.
/

I don't think the worst will come to pass (though don't put away that varmit rifle just yet) - your'e grandma is right; left to it's own devices the "free market forces" could very well lead us all down the path to doom and destruction. But the Fed won't allow that to happen. It CAN'T allow that to happen.
See what T-Bills are going for at the beginning of tomorrow's session and then again at the closing bell.

re: #121 Dahveed

that USED TO sound comforting....

re: #116 Abu Al-Poopypants

Well. That's sunny news.

re: #27 zombie

I just checked the coffee can under my bed. Still there. So my money's safe.

Good to hear it! By the way, what's your address again? I seem to have misplaced it. Thanks in advance.

Night Mandy, get yourself some good sleeping in and the morning will look at least a little better.

re: #111 hazzyday

Bill Maher is angry from being unable to pick up cool chicks in bars. That is the whole method to him.

Think of it as evolution in action.

Well, it's all Bush's fault!

Well, the Wall Street Journal seems to have a fairly clear take on things:

Crisis on Wall Street as Lehman Brothers Totters, Merrill Lynch Is Sold, AIG Seeks to Raise Cash

re: #118 Cartman

I'm outta luck, then. All my ammo is...uh...a little bigger. ;)

The reason I say that is, .22LR is the most efficient and quiet way of putting squirrels in the popcorn popper, so to speak, but unlike larger caliber rounds or shotgun shells it cannot be reloaded.

re: #121 Dahveed

Your deposits are insured by the FDIC up to $100,000 for personal accounts and $250,000 in retirement accounts.

Hell, I'm getting more and more partial to the idea of just stuffing it in my mattress.

re: #122 Cartman

So, the market needs an enema, so to speak?

/catharsis

re: #85 Colonel Panik

I think that after the collapse, .22LR rounds will take the place of currency as a medium of exchange.

Just slightly behind water, food, and (sorry ladies) vaginas.

Well ... good night.

re: #95 hazzyday

This root cause of this is corruption. Same as Enron. McCain/Palin are the better ticket to work on it.

The source of corruption: many get it wrong - "Money is the root of all evil" when actually it is - "The love of money is the root of all evil*".

* Islam is an exception being evil regardless.

re: #107 Cartman
Well my friend, I'm sure some folks would criticize this, but I think buying bonds in Fanniemae or Freddiemac would be wise at this point in time for three reasons:
a) the Fed bailed and will continue to pour in whatever cash the Fannie/Freddie's need - they HAVE to for the same reason they put them into receivership: More than 50% of ALL home mortgages are owned by them.
b) Most - probably 90+% of those loans haven't and won't go bad
c) Bond holders get paid before anyone else if something terrible happens - they get first dibs at the assests if for some STUPID reason the Feds don't keep pumping money in.
And, btw, I'd suggest buying Bank of America Bonds as well.

re: #130 Racer X

Well, it's all Bush's fault!

LOL, of course. Sadly Fuld will keep his hundreds of millions.

Night Les, btw. Always liked that "Think of if as evolution in action" line. :)

re: #133 Cartman

Hell, I'm getting more and more partial to the idea of just stuffing it in my mattress.

Well, if your mattress catches on fire, you have no insurance to cover the cash you lost. The FDIC has a good track record of covering deposit accounts.

re: #138 realwest

When Realwest speaks, people listen!

I'm buggin the F out.

Nite Lizards!

re: #142 Racer X

When Realwest speaks, people listen!

How many acquisition/mergers/takeovers ago did EF Hutton disappear?

re: #132 Colonel Panik

Well, if the SHTF, I doubt I'll be lugging a Dillon 1050 around with me. ;)

re: #143 Racer X

I'm buggin the F out.

Nite Lizards!

Yo! Keep it real!

re: #43 realwest

I agree, but I think AIG is the more important story and probably the biggest risk here.

I think that AIG will end up getting a bridge loan from the Federal Reserve.

Lehman Bros, had since the fall of Bear to come to some resolution. And they have been very stubborn about coming to terms with their situation. NY employees have been furious with "the Gorilla" for a while now and are packing up and hoping to be picked up by solvent firms. Today's mini session might help other firms cope with the loss.

re: #97 rawmuse

At the risk of sounding naive, I only recently learned what a short sale is.
The entire concept seemed wrong to me. How do you sell something that you do not own? It is a convoluted affair, and I only understand it enough to know that I never want to be involved with one.

Pretend you meet a fellow that wants to buy a '97 Ford Focus. You don't have one, but your neighbor does, and he doesn't use it. You're pretty sure this fellow will grow tired of the car as has your neighbor, and that he'll sell it back to you later at a lower price.

So you borrow the neighbor's car and pay him interest on him loaning it to you, then you sell the car to the fellow for $1,600 and you pocket the proceeds.

A while later, sure enough, the fellow sees '97 Ford Focii prices dropping so he gladly sells it to you for $1,200. That's a 25% profit ($1,600 - $1,200 = $400, which is 25% of $1,600.) You return the car to your neighbor and he stops charging you interest for the loan.

Merrill Lynch is a '97 Ford Focus.

re: #149 reggie

Pretend you meet a fellow that wants to buy a '97 Ford Focus. You don't have one, but your neighbor does, and he doesn't use it. You're pretty sure this fellow will grow tired of the car as has your neighbor, and that he'll sell it back to you later at a lower price.

So you borrow the neighbor's car and pay him interest on him loaning it to you, then you sell the car to the fellow for $1,600 and you pocket the proceeds.

A while later, sure enough, the fellow sees '97 Ford Focii prices dropping so he gladly sells it to you for $1,200. That's a 25% profit ($1,600 - $1,200 = $400, which is 25% of $1,600.) You return the car to your neighbor and he stops charging you interest for the loan.

Merrill Lynch is a '97 Ford Focus.

Very good example. My Series 7 teacher used a similar story about a car to illustrate short sales.

re: #147 Catttt

I think that AIG will end up getting a bridge loan from the Federal Reserve.

/door's been open for a while now

re: #138 realwest

You gonna try and sell me some swampland in Florida next, R-Dubs? ;0

re: #149 reggie

An excellent analogy. Thanks for that.

By the way, I sold Obama short on Rasmussen Markets. Made a nice little piece of virtual change there.

One thing I have noticed. I have seen the Andex chart here in Canada. Tracks the markets over a long term. It might look jagged but it does go up steadily. Since the Great Depression only certain sectors have been hit hard, usullaly after a bubble condition. Like the Internet sector and tech sectors at the start of the millenium. People that traded heavily in those areas lost their shirts. People that were a little more conservative lost a little at first, but have since made it back and in most cases at least doubled their money. As one of my financial mentors have said, not all markets are in a downturn at once. While one area of the world is bearish, another is bullish.

Just because our stock markets are going down a couple hundred points is no reason to panic.

re: #135 Slumbering Behemoth

Just slightly behind water, food, and (sorry ladies) vaginas.

You may overrate water and food there.

re: #137 Piglet-U93

The love of money is the root of all evil"

And thus, we are ever in this most human of predicaments...

re: #149 reggie

Favorited, might use it to help some of my associates when they are studying.

re: #135 Slumbering Behemoth

Just slightly behind water, food, and (sorry ladies) vaginas.

I keep thinking you are a lady. This is a reminder that you are not. Heh.

re: #135 Slumbering Behemoth

Just slightly behind water, food, and (sorry ladies) vaginas.

Only problem with vaginas, they're like chinese food, 1/2 an hour later you are hungry again.

re: #88 SpartanWoman
"Yep, subsidizing stupidity is never a good idea." I would generally tend to agree with you - and I do in the case of certain financial institutions, but some, like FannieMae and FreddieMac (and frankly Merrill Lynch and AIG) can't be allowed to fail for two simple reasons:
a. Fannie and Freddie own more that HALF of the home mortgages in the entire country and need cash to keep those mortgages from defaulting en masse.
b. Merrill and AIG are in a similar boat, but with different assets to protect: mostly retirement funds - BIG retirement funds are all heavily invested there.
If a. and b. "fail" I would certainly expect a depression MUCH larger and more dangerous to the USA than the "great depression" of the 1930's because not only would families be homeless, retirees would have literally NO MONEY with which to retire (and as one who was obliged to "retire" on Social Security Disability Income, I can tell you for sure that people can't retire on Social Security alone).
And the MUCH LARGER depression that would follow, would give rise and credibility to all sorts of communist and fascitst groups and thinking.

re: #160 realwest

And the MUCH LARGER depression that would follow, would give rise and credibility to all sorts of communist and fascitst groups and thinking.

"And then there came the Hard Times, and then there came the War."

-Dire Straits, "Telegraph Road'

re: #121 Dahveed
Uh, they are insured for that much IF THEY ARE IN A FEDERALLY connected BANK. Merrill Lynch and AIG aren't so protected.
And, regrettably, a LOT of people have virtually ALL of their retirement income invested in those uninsured investment houses cause they went for the significantly higher rates of return at the time the funds were invested.

re: #160 realwest

For as much as I hate government intervention in most cases and I think the government created several of the problems for many years before this whole thing got started, I agree with you. I think the "let them fail" mentality creates so many more problems for the economy than the pain of the government working this out. Bernanke and Paulson are pretty smart guys and I have confidence in their abilities.

re: #161 Colonel Panik
Y'all can't go wrong with Dire Straits my friend.

I don't think a new Depression is possible, but I always was a cockeyed optimist.

re: #162 realwest

I am about to puke over our AIG IRA. At least it is not huge but it would hurt if we lost it.

re: #161 Colonel Panik

"And then there came the Hard Times, and then there came the War."

-Dire Straits, "Telegraph Road"

And:

Then came the churches then came the schools
Then came the lawyers then came the rules

So much of Dire Straits is so very good.

re: #148 SpartanWoman

They were shown on the local news tonight coming out of the building with all their belingings. Limos for the execs trying to find a way out were lined up as far as the eye could see. They told the reporters they expected it.

Right now, on the radio: 'They are filing for Federal bankruptcy protection. '

re: #167 Clemente

So much of Dire Straits is so very good.

Shudders.

They may very well be my least favorite band of all time.

re: #162 realwest

Uh, they are insured for that much IF THEY ARE IN A FEDERALLY connected BANK. Merrill Lynch and AIG aren't so protected.
And, regrettably, a LOT of people have virtually ALL of their retirement income invested in those uninsured investment houses cause they went for the significantly higher rates of return at the time the funds were invested.

How does SIPC work? Do they protect investor accounts if brokerages fail? I know they don't protect from losses on the investments themselves, but don't they protect the customer from the troubled brokerage taking their money?

re: #65 twincitiesgirl
Yeah, but it was written over two months ago. Go see what they say about FannieMae and FreddieMac - it was before the Feds put them into receivership.
In todays markets, last weeks news is worthless, much less the news from two months ago.

re: #97 rawmuse

"He who sells what isn't his'n,
Pays his debts or goes to prison."

re: #168 NY Nana

Fuld's terms were too much to handle. From what I hear there was shouting and threats and finally Lehman ended up with a dead end. Merrill is in a better state than Lehman and BoA went that way. As for expecting the other houses to shore up Lehman, why fund the competition?

I suspect the Fulds still have plenty of cash for donk causes.

re: #124 realwest

I'll be the first to admit my ignorance of the market and economics. We could be in for an economic disaster, or not. I have no way of telling, other than reading the words of those are more knowledgeable than I.

Still, I got my squirrel plunker at the ready. Should probably buy more ammo, though.
/

Must...not...look...at...401K statement....for several weeks. Hang on, investors, hope we all can stomach the coming roller coaster ride.

re: #168 NY Nana

So the banks are "chipping in"?
"Ten banks - Bank of America, Barclays, Citibank, Credit Suisse, Deutsche Bank, Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan, Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley and UBS - each agreed to provide $7 billion "to help enhance liquidity and mitigate the unprecedented volatility and other challenges affecting global equity and debt markets."

The whole thing kind of scares me.

There was a time in US history when whiskey was a currency.

The landscape doesn't take a rocket scientist to see.

/if Lord Obama would just drop out there would be a huge bull rally

Never been a time like this, with piles of billion dollar chips flying in all directions. If one would just land in my lap, they'd never miss it, right?

re: #170 Dahveed
Well if you're asking if they protect from the company STEALING their money, yes they do protect that; losing their investments, I don't think so.

BUT- I KNOW A HELLUVA LOT MORE ABOUT FDIC than I do about SIPC.
The "beauty" of accounts at banks - and especially different CD's whch are also insured, is that if the institution goes under you are indeed protected up to $150,000 PER ACCOUNT.
Not sure, but don't think SPIC works quite the same.

A Boston area talk show host, Jay Severin, says that the root cause for the whole financial crisis we're in can be summed up in one phrase:
"equal opportunity lender".

re: #177 rawmuse

There was a time in US history when whiskey was a currency.

Whaddya mean "was"?

Well IndyMac failed and the world did not end. Enron failed and we have lived though the crisis. Drexel failed and we did not all have to eat squirrel meat...I would go the vegetarian brain shrink route befor eating rats with fluffy tails, thank you very much.

re: #174 Slumbering Behemoth Oh, yes, investing in ammo would be a good idea right now! Especially .22LR and SOME .40 or .45 to keep folks away from the stew pot!

re: #169 zombie

Shudders.

They may very well be my least favorite band of all time.

Oh, dear. Sorry, zom. But, I do like your stuff one helluva lot, and have lately spent considerably more time enjoying it!

re: #182 lummox

Whaddya mean "was"?

Meaning the tax collector would take it.

re: #181 Abu Al-Poopypants

A Boston area talk show host, Jay Severin, says that the root cause for the whole financial crisis we're in can be summed up in one phrase:
"equal opportunity lender".

It certainly didn't help and those who bought property to flip them were of no service either. They walked away too.

re: #177 rawmuse

There was a time in US history when whiskey was a currency.

LOL You always make me laugh! I am going to bury some booze in the back yard. LOL

re: #177 rawmuse

There was a time in US history when whiskey was a currency.

In the early '90s, in parts of Russia, pantyhose and vodka were used as currency in lieu of cash.

re: #177 rawmuse

There was a time in US history when whiskey was a currency.

I need to hoard all that unopened 25 year old whiskey? Was just gonna pour it out

re: #183 SpartanWoman
LOL! Yeah, I agree (if you're saying that things aren't as bad as they seem) but IndyMac and Enron combined don't equal the hit the economy would take if Fannie or Freddie went belly up (which of course they can't as long as the Fed can print money) but AIG and Merrill are potentially - and I emphasize potentially EACH as bad as IndyMac and Enron combined.

re: #156 Clemente

You may overrate water and food there.

Hardly. Spend an entire month eating and drinking three times a day, and having sex just once a week. For the next month, have sex three times a day and only eat and drink once a week. It's not hard to figure out which is more important.

re: #158 Catttt

I keep thinking you are a lady. This is a reminder that you are not. Heh.

I suspect I will regret asking this, but why do you keep thinking I'm a lady?

Them sneaky revenoors still poke around these parts from time to time.

Seems they be lookin' fer gardens instead of stills.

re: #189 zombie

I am saved! I have about 17 pairs of pantyhose.

...burying them in the back yard with the booze and my silver dimes.

re: #191 realwest

LOL! Yeah, I agree (if you're saying that things aren't as bad as they seem) but IndyMac and Enron combined don't equal the hit the economy would take if Fannie or Freddie went belly up (which of course they can't as long as the Fed can print money) but AIG and Merrill are potentially - and I emphasize potentially EACH as bad as IndyMac and Enron combined.

Well Merrill is now part of BoA, and I suspect that AIG will find the money.
As much as I believe in free markets, I think something has to be done about the leveraging mess and the mortgage industry.

And in some very GOOD news.....California came to a budget agreement today that pretty much shot down all of the Dems wish list of tax increases. $9.5 Billion (yes, BILLION) in tax increases was rejected by the Calif congress. And remember, folks, our congress is VERY Dem dominated. This is actually huge news.

re: #193 lummox

Yep, money to be made there too, and no small amounts either.

re: #193 lummox

Well if all my banks fail I might just have to become a farmer. LOL

re: #159 Colonel Panik

Oral fixation? Yeah, I haz one.

re: #185 Clemente

Oh, dear. Sorry, zom. But, I do like your stuff one helluva lot, and have lately spent considerably more time enjoying it!

No problem! Different musical tastes are par for the course. In fact, half of what Charles himself posts videos of or has on his "Now Playing" feature are totally, totally not my cup of tea. That's life.

re: #196 Russkilitlover

Yeah, I saw that. Something about "accelerated tax payments by people who pay estimates".

See there, I am saving California. You're welcome.

Well everyone is talking about supplies to hoard, may i recommend several feet of copper tubeing? Small diameter that can be easily coiled. Distilling anything would help create a supply of anything like clean water or raw alcohol which has many uses besides drinking.

re: #198 Pvt Bin Jammin

Well if all my banks fail I might just have to become a farmer. LOL

The return of the victory gardens is sort of appealing.

re: #166 Pvt Bin Jammin
WHOA - don't go puking just yet PBJ! No one has said that AIG is gonna go under. And what I don't know is this: do you mean so much of your "IRA" is invested in AIG stocks? Who manages your IRA?

re: #204 realwest

WHOA - don't go puking just yet PBJ! No one has said that AIG is gonna go under. And what I don't know is this: do you mean so much of your "IRA" is invested in AIG stocks? Who manages your IRA?

AIG will probably survive, I hate the management, but they are not stupid people

re: #203 SpartanWoman

I love the Victory Gardens.

re: #164 realwest

Y'all can't go wrong with Dire Straits my friend.

Ever hear Mark Knopfler's sound track to "Local Hero"?

One of my all time favorite movies.

"You can't eat scenery."

re: #173 SpartanWoman

Merrill is in a better state than Lehman and BoA went that way. As for expecting the other houses to shore up Lehman, why fund the competition?

I suspect the Fulds still have plenty of cash for donk causes.

Chapter 11 filing BTW. I agree with you. I did not know they are asses donks.

Sort of a very weird anachronism....

Got to go to sleep! NY Grampa's computer fried, and until he gets a new one, we have to share.

/All I have to do is threaten to hold my breath and turn blue to get back on line!

G'nite, all. Sweet dreams.

re: #204 realwest

It is straight with AIG. I don't have an agent. I think my cousin sold us that a long time ago. He is a reflexologist now, got out of the insurance/investment business. LOL Hope we are not scr_wed.

re: #195 SpartanWoman
You are absolutely correct about corrective action needs to be taken - and frankly I think a LOT of people are or should be prosecuted and required to refund huge amounts of money.
But the SINGLE biggest change in Mortgage Lending would be to eliminate the right of someone with poor or bad credit being able to successfully sue lenders who turn them down on their requests for home mortgages. THAT HAS TO BE DONE. NOW.

re: #205 SpartanWoman

AIG will probably survive, I hate the management, but they are not stupid people

It looks like AIG will get short-term financing from the Federal Reserve. So, they should work out some of their problems. They will be a different company in the end, but I think they will survive, too.

re: #184 realwest

I agree, but I am financially low right now. Worth thinking about, though.

I suppose I could sell my car.
/s

re: #209 Pvt Bin Jammin
Yeah, but do you own stock in AIG or did AIG invest stock in other companies for you or does your IRA include BONDS issued by AIG.
You can't hardly get safer than Bonds in a major corporation because Bondholders, by law, get paid everything they are owed, before other creditors (like stockholders) get anything.
But I think that somehow AIG will come out of this, though it may take some time.
Meanwhile, as I said, don't go puking your guts out just yet!

Lets sort things out a little. The real estate markets got into a bubble for a few reasons. Part was stupidity and greed with clever theoreticians creating excessively arcane instruments that concealed the real quality of the underlying assets from badly managed institutional investors. That produces a financial situation similar to my criticism the other day of political activity getting out of control (stupid waffle boxes) when adults fail to say "No." Another reason that there are so many bad real estate loans out there is that both Congress and the State Legislatures pressured the banks to relax their lending criteria. Remember the Community Reinvestment Act? Where do you think Tony Rezko got the money from for all that uninhabitable housing that Obama fronted for? A third reason ties into the second. Key regulatory functions were being filled by political hacks when this disaster started to inflate. The Republicans were trying to arrange a soft landing for the last few years but they did not dare to blow a whistle and risk causing an implosion. Without control of Congress they had a very narrow field of maneuver. Remember who was running Fannie Mae a few years ago? Jamie Goreleck's fingerprints are all over this disaster. She hadn't done enough for America by setting us up for 9-11. McCain and the Republican's should just say now wait a minute and refuse to accept this disaster. If they can not go convincingly on the attack then the election is over today when the markets open. The Democrats try to talk the economy down every year before an election. This time they have succeeded beyond their wildest nightmares.

I want to see if Soros has fingerprints on this.

re: #183 SpartanWoman

Well IndyMac failed and the world did not end. Enron failed and we have lived though the crisis. Drexel failed and we did not all have to eat squirrel meat...I would go the vegetarian brain shrink route befor eating rats with fluffy tails, thank you very much.

I don't think that ANY bank is too big to fail. If they were boneheads and got their balance sheets out of kilter, then, buh-bye. Our economy WILL recover. Banks and investment firms will consolidate (and homebuilding companies) and we will build from there to the next "bubble." Fortunes will be won and lost; and new industries will prosper.

We are seeing Capitalism at work....sometimes brutal, but also flush with opportunity. DON'T LET THE DEMS TELL YOU THAT GOVERNMENT IS THE ANSWER! THAT IS KEY, RIGHT NOW!

re: #208 NY Nana

Thain, however, is GOP...more realistic than Fuld

re: #185 Clemente

No need to apologize for your personal tastes in music. Dire Straits was a great band, with nicely innovative music. MK was a guitar virtuoso, in his own right.

Realwest-
We recently (within the last 6 mos) bought BofA bonds...do you think their value will hold?

re: #209 Pvt Bin Jammin

It is straight with AIG. I don't have an agent. I think my cousin sold us that a long time ago. He is a reflexologist now, got out of the insurance/investment business. LOL Hope we are not scr_wed.

I just don't think that if your account is in something like a money market mutual fund they can start withdrawing money to pay their bills. I think your account is protected from AIG doing whatever they want with it. If you have stock in AIG, then you still own the stock. But if the stock lost value, you are not protected from that.

Remember that the only toxic sector is the real estate bubble, huge as it is. The rest of Lehman, the Investment Bank, the old bond house and Neuberger are worth Billions.

re: #201 rawmuse

Yeah, I saw that. Something about "accelerated tax payments by people who pay estimates".

See there, I am saving California. You're welcome.

On behalf of California tax payers, I thank you. Although I'm not sure what your quote means, I'm looking forward to seeing how things work out. A resounding "NO" on tax increases is always good, as long as the Calif legislature learns that they can't borrow our way out of any mess and actually enacts discipline! That's a huge leap of faith, but so far, the signs are promising.

re: #210 realwest

But the SINGLE biggest change in Mortgage Lending would be to eliminate the right of someone with poor or bad credit being able to successfully sue lenders who turn them down on their requests for home mortgages. THAT HAS TO BE DONE. NOW.

Amen brother. Now apply that inability to sue to health care, small business hiring, etc... the economy gets a lot better all around.

The truth is, banks want to do as many loans as they can. Loans mean money. If you can perform and the secondary market will buy it, the bank will do the loan.

re: #214 lifeofthemind

I want to see if Soros has fingerprints on this.

Here is a good place to start. Ms. Fitts is a parallel of Gov. Palin ... except she got shot down when she started expressing concern and then started blowing the whistle back in the Clinton Admin. History has proven her correct and here we are!

re: #213 realwest

Thanks, Realwest. I don't keep up on how it's invested. I am a dummy, I suppose. I'll never forget my husband selling short on platinum and I had to make the margin call. I didn't know what the heck was going on but I was freaked! Real estate is the only thing that has really worked for me. I'm scared of the other stuff. LOL

/It's the land, Scarlett O'Hara. The dirt of Tara.

re: #221 Russkilitlover

I have not read anything yet, just heard the phrase on the 10 o'clock news. The plan includes "accelerated tax payments by businesses and individuals who pay estimates".

I think that means they want more of the money I make, before I make it.

re: #183 SpartanWoman

Well IndyMac failed and the world did not end. Enron failed and we have lived though the crisis. Drexel failed and we did not all have to eat squirrel meat...I would go the vegetarian brain shrink route befor eating rats with fluffy tails, thank you very much.

Squirrels are not rats. Rats eat garbage and live in urban filth. Squirrels live in trees and eat acorns and other nuts and seeds. A squirrels diet is actually pretty darn clean.

Huckabee's odd way of cooking them aside I can think of worse things to have to live off of than squirrel meat.

OT since I missed the last thread.
Paul McCartney has said some unwise things this last year about the President and Iraq but he came through for NY in 2001. As he reminded us then he comes from tough Liverpool firefighting Anglo-Irish stock. Not a man to push around.

re: #214 lifeofthemind

Dinged you up. I think you are on top of it.

re: #210 realwest

No argument from me on that. None at all. And people with poor training were helping do these sloppy deals, giddy with the thought that the market would go up forever.

But, I still maintain that heads have to roll and we cannot subsidize stupidity ad nauseum. And Boards of Directors have to have a splash of accountability, they have been weak and complicit

re: #223 Bobibutu

Here is a good place to start. Ms. Fitts is a parallel of Gov. Palin ... except she got shot down when she started expressing concern and then started blowing the whistle back in the Clinton Admin. History has proven her correct and here we are!

I have to get caught up, enlighten me please.

re: #226 Colonel Panik

Want me to link the squirrel melts? *evil grin*

re: #228 Russkilitlover

Dinged you up. I think you are on top of it.

Thank you

re: #220 lifeofthemind

Remember that the only toxic sector is the real estate bubble, huge as it is. The rest of Lehman, the Investment Bank, the old bond house and Neuberger are worth Billions.

And other firms will pick apart the carcass of Lehman and come up with some bargains and some great employees.

re: #223 Bobibutu

Here is a good place to start. Ms. Fitts is a parallel of Gov. Palin ... except she got shot down when she started expressing concern and then started blowing the whistle back in the Clinton Admin. History has proven her correct and here we are!

[Link: solari.com...]

re: #231 BlueCanuck

Want me to link the squirrel melts? *evil grin*

Is that the awful "young tender squirrel" video? ONCE is enough

re: #230 lifeofthemind

I have to get caught up, enlighten me please.

[Link: solari.com...]

sorry - I did not post the link ...

re: #225 rawmuse

Interesting times, for sure. We'll see how this plays out, but I believe in my heart-of-hearts that this is a line in the sand that we need to draw and go from here. Would like to hear our Governor make a statement and explain to the state.

re: #231 BlueCanuck

Want me to link the squirrel melts? *evil grin*

If I'm going to eat squirrel I prefer it in a good Brunswick Stew.

re: #237 Russkilitlover
Our new State motto:
"California, we at least don't suck as bad as New York!"

re: #235 SpartanWoman

That's why I just threatened. Of course the best way is stuffed then baked. Like muskrat.

/yummy.

re: #235 SpartanWoman

Heh I have pictures of my Tennessee kin with a rack of squirrels that they killed and here I am making friends with one in the back yard.

re: #222 beatcanvas

Amen brother. Now apply that inability to sue to health care, small business hiring, etc... the economy gets a lot better all around.

The truth is, banks want to do as many loans as they can. Loans mean money. If you can perform and the secondary market will buy it, the bank will do the loan.

Dan Quayle was right, it is the Tort Lawyers.
I gave my description of the Democrats as a seven legged horse last week.

Maybe Wall Street will invite The Grim Reaper to ring the bell tomorrow.

re: #243 Cartman

Maybe Wall Street will invite The Grim Reaper to ring the bell tomorrow.

I'm guessing that tomorrow will be ugly.

re: #237 Russkilitlover

Didn't the legislature make some kind of decision today? Wonder what Arnie will do?

re: #244 Russkilitlover

I'm guessing that tomorrow will be ugly.

That's why they did the mini-session today

re: #218 carefulnow
Sorry I didn't see this sooner, but yes, I think BoA Bonds will hold - not as strongly as Fannie or Freddie bonds will - they are now goverment bonds in financial shorthand, but yeah I do think Bank of America Bonds will hold; don't know about their short term stock prices/dividends though.

re: #247 realwest

BoA is putting a positive spin on this deal.

re: #234 Bobibutu

[Link: solari.com...]

Thanks, looks good. Wasn't Daley's idiot brother involved in this during the Clinton years?

re: #162 realwest

re: #166 Pvt Bin Jammin

I am about to puke over our AIG IRA. At least it is not huge but it would hurt if we lost it.

re: #170 Dahveed

The FDIC, which gets its funds from assessing banks, protects depositors up to $100,000 each.
The SIPC which gets its funds from stock brokerage firms, protects depositors up to $100,000 each and almost every one of them has private insurance protecting customers for up to $25 million, sometimes even more. You need to ask.
AIG is having a ratings agency problem. Their annuities are fine, so is any other transaction you have with them, except perhaps owning shares of their stock. AIG is not going under but might have to raise so much capital that shareholders are seriously diluted. It's because the ratings agencies are threatening a downgrade of AIG due to 3 quarters of losses and its low share price. The low share price makes the rating agencies think it will be difficult to raise capital for a fair price. AIG has many assets it can sell. It can sell its aircraft leasing company for $10 billion, it's 59% share of a publicly traded insurance co. for $2.4 billion, cut its dividend saving $2.4 billion a year, sell its auto division, sell the former Hartford Steam Boiler, sell its reinsurance division, etc etc. Don't worry about the health of AIG but worry about me, I own a lot of stock in it. Whoops.

Anyway, I used to work in the securities industry and we are witnessing events that might happen once in a lifetime, a major financial meltdown caused by allowing too much leverage to be used in our financial institutions.

Interesting. Troubling. Not as important as family and health.

re: #248 SpartanWoman
BuT of course! LOL!
No, seriously, I really think BoA will come out of this in a VERY STRONG position, but it's gonna take some time and there are a LOT of heads that are gonna roll at Merrill.

re: #251 realwest

BuT of course! LOL!
No, seriously, I really think BoA will come out of this in a VERY STRONG position, but it's gonna take some time and there are a LOT of heads that are gonna roll at Merrill.

Well I hope that they are at the top of the pecking order and not too many of the new kids get the ax.

Please read Instapundit on this, it even mentions La Gorelick!

Thank God for plug and play backup mice. Cat hair eventually gets everywhere no matter how you try and prevent it.

/need to order another one

Well, I got plenty of squirrels in my neighborhood, and I've got a Gamo pellet gun that cranks 'em out at around 1000 fps. It's pretty quiet, and definitely makes those critters do the dance of eternal repose. Guess I'd better start cullin' the heard, so to speak. ;)

The Dems are already conspiring to hang this particular burning tire around the neck of McCain.
And on that, I retire.

re: #249 lifeofthemind

Thanks, looks good. Wasn't Daley's idiot brother involved in this during the Clinton years?

She names names. Anyone wanting to know how this mess all came about would do well to spend a few minutes and read her account and insights. This is one hell of a smart and ethical woman.

[Link: solari.com...]

re: #252 SpartanWoman
"Well I hope that they are at the top of the pecking order and not too many of the new kids get the ax."
I think that's inevitable, barring, of course, outright fraud on the part of some of the new "kids" (and it has happened before that "new kids" played with OPM waaay more than was good for them.
But yeah, it's gonna be at the tippy top of the pecking order and work it's way down, though not all areas of Merrill should suffer the same way.

re: #250 kay1212

OMG be careful for yourself. Thanks for letting me sleep. :)

Glad to see that Neuberger will still continue as will the Asset Management division of Lehman. Seems the meetings all weekend paid off

re: #255 Cartman

Well, I got plenty of squirrels in my neighborhood, and I've got a Gamo pellet gun that cranks 'em out at around 1000 fps. It's pretty quiet, and definitely makes those critters do the dance of eternal repose. Guess I'd better start cullin' the heard, so to speak. ;)

/they're tasty

G'nite, y'all. Weet dreams.

re: #258 realwest

Hope so, I know some young people who have just started with Merrill (not with the problem areas) and I would be sad to see them suffer too much.

re: #262 Cartman

"wee dreams, Cartman.