Presidential Debate Thread 5, the Wrap-Up
Politics | Tue, Oct 7, 2008 at 7:37:14 pm PDT
John McCain needed to hit a home run tonight. Did he?
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Politics | Tue, Oct 7, 2008 at 7:37:14 pm PDT
John McCain needed to hit a home run tonight. Did he?
350 comments
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Shug 10/07/08 7:38:47 pm reply quote |
boring debate.
like watching the detroit lions vs the st louis rams
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Sharmuta 10/07/08 7:39:12 pm reply quote |
The msm will spin this as a tie.
I think it was fairly clear from the Pakistan answers that 0bama is woefully unprepared for this job.
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Jetpilot1101 10/07/08 7:39:17 pm reply quote |
He didn't hit a home run but he certainly didn't strike out.
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Cognito 10/07/08 7:39:18 pm reply quote |
Not a home run, from what I saw. A solid base hit. But that's not what he needed.
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Racer X 10/07/08 7:39:26 pm reply quote |
Mac Knocked it out of the park!
Anyone who says otherwise simply wasn't paying attention.
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Who Watches the Watchmen? 10/07/08 7:39:33 pm reply quote |
No knockout punch, but Obama revealed himself (again) to be a babbling bullshitter.
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Outrider 10/07/08 7:39:34 pm reply quote |
At least he got on base. The big O bunted and tripped on the way to first.
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Sharmuta 10/07/08 7:40:13 pm reply quote |
He should have pounded the Fannie/Freddy thing more, but I'm glad he at least got a shot in, and 0bama didn't even refute he took the money.
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Dark_Falcon 10/07/08 7:40:19 pm reply quote |
Still haven't seen the end of it (TIVO). McCain's did better than Obama. Not a knockout but a good victory.
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badtemper 10/07/08 7:40:25 pm reply quote |
I have to agree with Mort/Fox. Mac was stronger, but he won't get a bump out of this.
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Walter L. Newton 10/07/08 7:40:43 pm reply quote |
NBC radio says BO won. He is more concerned with the private citizen, as per the talking head. Bo has the advantage in confidence and clarity.
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Palandine 10/07/08 7:40:45 pm reply quote |
Australia, Japan, and Hong Kong markets down 3% to 4%.
/meh
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Racer X 10/07/08 7:41:00 pm reply quote |
The only blunder that Mac made was the buying up of the loans thing - what the hell was that?
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tigerwoman 10/07/08 7:41:02 pm reply quote |
I love how McCain pointed out he didn't have a deadbeat dad! I can't believe BO said he got food stamps!
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Dark_Falcon 10/07/08 7:41:08 pm reply quote |
re: #6 Cognito
Not a home run, from what I saw. A solid base hit. But that's not what he needed.
He got at least a double. He can get home in the final debate.
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Shug 10/07/08 7:41:10 pm reply quote |
Obama is an unqualified boob.
but what's so depressing is that the reactions of the idiots at that CSPAN coffee shop.
Lots of cheers for the moron !
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Bobibutu 10/07/08 7:41:15 pm reply quote |
re: #7 Racer X
Mac Knocked it out of the park!
Anyone who says otherwise simply wasn't paying attention.
I agree but there was such little emotion in his delivery - I fear it will be reported otherwise.
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doppelganglander 10/07/08 7:41:25 pm reply quote |
Basically, I'd give it to McCain on substance. Obama has no concept of either economics or foreign relations. However, McCain did not take the opportunity to get in Bambi's face, which I would have given a major organ to see. The questions were utterly moronic.
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Brigman 10/07/08 7:41:28 pm reply quote |
no home run, but no errors. I think those who actually listen to the words will think John won, and those that simply like hearing Obama speak will think he won
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Lee Coller 10/07/08 7:41:31 pm reply quote |
re: #8 Who Watches the Watchmen?
No knockout punch, but Obama revealed himself (again) to be a babbling bullshitter.
True, but most will buy it.
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bnichols10 10/07/08 7:41:41 pm reply quote |
Fox News is hammering McCain on his comments on buying up bad mortgages. I can't disagree with them...
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Occasional Reader 10/07/08 7:41:45 pm reply quote |
I don't think he hit a home run, but he did get the field goal.
/okay, I don't watch sports much
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Cognito 10/07/08 7:41:49 pm reply quote |
McCain's bit about subsidizing mortgages was crap. There's no incentive for the rest of us to scrimp and save and put down a decent down payment and live within our means and make our payments.
The party is happening over at the big expensive house paid for by... well, the rest of us.
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shibumi 10/07/08 7:41:53 pm reply quote |
No home run for McCain.
But he did seem likable. And he did answer questions.
Obama didn't stumble as much as expected. He didn't answer questions. But no one will care. :(
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marge45b 10/07/08 7:42:14 pm reply quote |
McCain won. It wasn't a KO but McCain shows he is the master and Obama is just Grasshopper again.
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eon 10/07/08 7:42:14 pm reply quote |
The scary part is, The one's fans, both in the MSM and out, swoon when he opens his mouth, no matter what comes out of it.
/He's like Sun Myung Moon in a lot of ways. Worrisome ways.
cheers
eon
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Sharmuta 10/07/08 7:42:25 pm reply quote |
re: #16 Walter L. Newton
And NBC is in the tank for 0bama anyways so anything they say is BS.
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doppelganglander 10/07/08 7:42:31 pm reply quote |
re: #16 Walter L. Newton
NBC radio says BO won. He is more concerned with the private citizen, as per the talking head. Bo has the advantage in confidence and clarity.
That comment was written about 3 hours before the debate. Pay no attention. Obie is about as clear as mud.
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Palandine 10/07/08 7:42:34 pm reply quote |
A double.
I'm incapable of being objective considering Obama's horrific litany of flaws.
But I empty my brain and try to think like an undecided voter.
I'd say 55 McCain, 45 Obama.
/Which isn't enough to make a difference
//so come on, 527s. Let's bring it.
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StarOfDavid 10/07/08 7:42:36 pm reply quote |
I think he hit the ball 550 ft. out of the park.
He was amazing.
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Bobibutu 10/07/08 7:42:37 pm reply quote |
re: #24 Brigman
no home run, but no errors. I think those who actually listen to the words will think John won, and those that simply like hearing Obama speak will think he won
well stated.
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doriangrey 10/07/08 7:42:42 pm reply quote |
re: #20 Dark_Falcon
He got at least a double. He can get home in the final debate.
ROTFLMAO.............cognito is Dan Rather.... What were you expecting him to say?
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Semper Gumbi 10/07/08 7:42:44 pm reply quote |
Personally, I think it was a tie. Both strayed from the questions to get in talking points and both went over time. Unfortunately, I think the MSM and the general viewing public will claim Obama won. The MSM because they are in the tank and the public because they haven't been following politics closely and don't know what a waffling, lying fuck Obama was tonight.
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Racer X 10/07/08 7:42:50 pm reply quote |
I was very apprehensive at first - Mac looked out of breath and old. From the middle on he just destroyed Obama.
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PETN Sandwich 10/07/08 7:42:57 pm reply quote |
Lame!
Need to get the debaters to pick their own topics like in a real debate.
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JacksonTn 10/07/08 7:43:01 pm reply quote |
The election will be won by Palin and blogs and shit coming out about The One and people just not trusting him enough to pull the lever for The One because I know it is not a nice thing to say but .............. he just does not seem to be FOR AMERICA or like most Americans
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jcm 10/07/08 7:43:05 pm reply quote |
re: #6 Cognito
Not a home run, from what I saw. A solid base hit. But that's not what he needed.
I think so also.
He needed to hammer Obama into the ground. He had several opportunities to do it.
Did Brokejaw squelch the Ayers, Wright, Resko questions?
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Walter L. Newton 10/07/08 7:43:08 pm reply quote |
re: #24 Brigman
no home run, but no errors. I think those who actually listen to the words will think John won, and those that simply like hearing Obama speak will think he won
Well, NBC radio talking head is going down a list of mistakes McCain made. It sounded like hair-splitting, but it's evident that NBC is SO in the tank for BO.
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doppelganglander 10/07/08 7:43:09 pm reply quote |
re: #19 tigerwoman
I love how McCain pointed out he didn't have a deadbeat dad! I can't believe BO said he got food stamps!
Yeah, I wouldn't be too proud of that, either. Oh, geez, that dope Frank Luntz is on again.
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Alouette 10/07/08 7:43:10 pm reply quote |
I was disappointed with McCain. Obama was thoroughly disgusting, unfortunately McCain did not give him the beatdown that he deserved.
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Dar ul Harb 10/07/08 7:43:21 pm reply quote |
A home run? Not that I saw.
But I only caught the last 10-15 minutes.
Hopey Changiness is still in the air, I'm afraid.
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Shug 10/07/08 7:43:24 pm reply quote |
McCain hit the fairway with a 3 wood. Hit the green. Two putted. Nothing fancy.
Obama made a bogey, but he gets a stroke from the MSM so they gave him a par
/ another sports analogy
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jcm 10/07/08 7:43:55 pm reply quote |
re: #24 Brigman
no home run, but no errors. I think those who actually listen to the words will think John won, and those that simply like hearing Obama speak will think he won
Some hippie prof on with the perky one just said that, he like the way Obama presented.
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ArmyWife 10/07/08 7:43:57 pm reply quote |
If you read the transcripts, I bet Mac looks great. His answers were, well, answers. They had substance. Obama came across as smooth...but what the heck did he say?
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Outrider 10/07/08 7:44:23 pm reply quote |
Idiots. Where do they find these clowns and did they listen to the same debate I did?
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NomadOfNorad 10/07/08 7:44:25 pm reply quote |
re: #7 Racer X
Mac Knocked it out of the park!
Anyone who says otherwise simply wasn't paying attention.
Knocked what out of the park? Be specific, now!
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soccerdad 10/07/08 7:44:39 pm reply quote |
John McCain needed to hit a home run tonight. Did he?
No -- not a chance did he hit a homer. I think that he did a good job and got in some good jibes. BHO is just spouting BS -- we need to have a G--Damn fact checker on site!
No one's mind was changed tonight. We need to have another Sarah vs. Joe. She effing KILLED
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Sharmuta 10/07/08 7:45:11 pm reply quote |
0bama screwed up big time on Pakistan and openly saying we'd talk with our enemies.
I just don't think that's what the American public wants- sitting down with Iran.
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Dark_Falcon 10/07/08 7:45:22 pm reply quote |
re: #40 doriangrey
ROTFLMAO.............cognito is Dan Rather.... What were you expecting him to say?
That's not really true. Cognito is sane, and he can admit when he is wrong.
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Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret) 10/07/08 7:45:40 pm reply quote |
Luntz's focus group sucks. Major league.
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Lee Coller 10/07/08 7:46:00 pm reply quote |
I don't get these swing voters. McCain and Obama are so far apart, a swing voter is someone who is completely uninformed.
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unclassifiable 10/07/08 7:46:00 pm reply quote |
John McCain needed to hit a home run tonight. Did he?
No
But I can handle that.
If Barry is going to be president his first foreign policy crisis might be Texas.
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lobo91 10/07/08 7:46:05 pm reply quote |
re: #45 jcm
Did Brokejaw squelch the Ayers, Wright, Resko questions?
Well, since he picked the questions, I guess you could say so.
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soccerdad 10/07/08 7:46:08 pm reply quote |
re: #7 Racer X
Mac Knocked it out of the park!
Anyone who says otherwise simply wasn't paying attention.
do tell.... I was on the edge of my seat all friggin night. what did i miss?
Please be specific.
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Charles 10/07/08 7:46:09 pm reply quote |
I don't even want to say what I thought.
This was not John McCain's best moment. And he really needed a best moment.
I don't think he came off well.
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DisturbedEma 10/07/08 7:46:09 pm reply quote |
I have never been so repulsed by a pol before. . .Obama is a snake! The smarm factor was sooooo distinctive, but I suppose that passes for charm some places. . .he did not answer a single question clearly, and he prefaced every answer with an attack. . .sheesh!
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Cognito 10/07/08 7:46:13 pm reply quote |
re: #60 Dark_Falcon
I do appreciate that, but don't bother. He seems to have a bit of a fixation.
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Tigger2005 10/07/08 7:46:16 pm reply quote |
Objectively, I'd say it wasn't a blowout. It was more of a tie. McCain did not hit Obama as hard in person on the financial crisis as he should have, and I wish he'd brought in Obama's friends and associates. It was a great opportunity to truly expose Obama for the complete fraud he is, to his face, and that didn't happen.
There is too much pretending by everyone that Obama is in ANY way, shape, or form fit to lead this nation! It must be shown that the would-be Emperor has no clothes!
But I disagree that McCain "needed" to hit a home run. This debate will not decide the election.
Believe me, when it comes time to punch that ballot, in these scary times, people are NOT going to want to turn things over to the "kid." All the hopey changey and "green" stuff sounded good when people didn't feel like they were looking into the abyss. They are going to be thinking much more practically now.
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Sharmuta 10/07/08 7:46:33 pm reply quote |
I want an ad from McCain tomorrow hammering on 0bama's money from Fannie & Freddy.
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doriangrey 10/07/08 7:46:50 pm reply quote |
re: #60 Dark_Falcon
That's not really true. Cognito is sane, and he can admit when he is wrong.
Put the crack pipe down and back slowly away from it....
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Racer X 10/07/08 7:46:56 pm reply quote |
re: #56 NomadOfNorad
Knocked what out of the park? Be specific, now!
He made Obama look like an amateur on foreign policy.
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doppelganglander 10/07/08 7:47:04 pm reply quote |
re: #55 Outrider
Idiots. Where do they find these clowns and did they listen to the same debate I did?
1. They find them in unemployment lines and Wal-Mart.
2. Clearly not.
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NomadOfNorad 10/07/08 7:47:07 pm reply quote |
re: #51 Attaboid
Actually McCain looked like a looser.
As apposed to a tighter? I think you meant "loser" here, not "looser." Unfortunately, if Obama looks like the winner here, we ALL might be the losers! Big time!
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Walter L. Newton 10/07/08 7:47:14 pm reply quote |
re: #35 Sharmuta
And NBC is in the tank for 0bama anyways so anything they say is BS.
Oh, I know, I'm just reporting the bias. It's really gone so far out of control. SHit, this makes William Randolf Hearst look like a PTA newsletter publisher.
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Siberian Khatru 10/07/08 7:47:16 pm reply quote |
re: #47 doppelganglander
Oh, geez, that dope Frank Luntz is on again.
With his roomful of "undecided" fools who, of course, consistently pick the Obamessiah as the winner. (And as I recall, even when the room seemed to be favoring Palin in the VP debate, he kept asking the opinions of the ones who didn't prefer her...)
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The Shadow Do 10/07/08 7:47:23 pm reply quote |
A waste. No change one way or another. Static format. Damn shame. Don't think anyone learned one single new thing from viewing this.
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Shug 10/07/08 7:47:28 pm reply quote |
re: #61 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)
Luntz's focus group sucks. Major league.
I look forward to the day when I won't have to hear the name Frank Luntz. When I won't have to see his fat gut on my TV, and when I won't have to see or hear the idiots in his focus groups
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Palandine 10/07/08 7:47:34 pm reply quote |
Holy cats, McGovern is taking on the unions?
It's the Apocalypse!
How are the Cubs doing?
/Oh, wait ;)
*Hides from Mama Winger*
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jwb7605 10/07/08 7:47:40 pm reply quote |
re: #24 Brigman
no home run, but no errors. I think those who actually listen to the words will think John won, and those that simply like hearing Obama speak will think he won
Frank Luntz' group of moonbats seem to disagree. Sort of.
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Dar ul Harb 10/07/08 7:47:48 pm reply quote |
re: #44 JacksonTn
The election will be won by Palin and blogs and shit coming out about The One and people just not trusting him enough to pull the lever for The One because I know it is not a nice thing to say but .............. he just does not seem to be FOR AMERICA or like most Americans
Like McCain said at the end, what I don't know is what everyone doesn't know ...what's going to happen in the future.
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lawhawk 10/07/08 7:47:49 pm reply quote |
Sadly, I missed this debate. Had more pressing matters. But the instareaction appears that I didn't exactly miss much. I'm sure that the media will fill me in on all that I need to know - and who won...
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lobo91 10/07/08 7:47:51 pm reply quote |
Wow...George McGovern is doing ads for some group that opposes the "card check" deal for union elections.
I'm shocked.
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doppelganglander 10/07/08 7:47:58 pm reply quote |
Dude, did you just see the McGovern commercial on Fox? He just came out against the card check law. I can't believe I agree with George McGovern.
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LEGION 10/07/08 7:48:22 pm reply quote |
McCain hit a ground rule double with the bases loaded for me. FINALLY he got the point in about Obama getting all that money from Fannie and Freddie and that they started this fire.
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Magalaga Ding Dong 10/07/08 7:48:41 pm reply quote |
Whilst I ponder this question, I can't help but think what an awful shame it is that McCain would be required to hit it out of the park on this, considering the undeniable hideousness of his opponent.
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spidly 10/07/08 7:48:52 pm reply quote |
re: #89 lawhawk
Sadly, I missed this debate. Had more pressing matters. But the instareaction appears that I didn't exactly miss much. I'm sure that the media will fill me in on all that I need to know - and who won...
you saw the first debate, then you saw this one
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newsjunkie_ky 10/07/08 7:48:56 pm reply quote |
re: #83 Shug
4 years ago the 'independents' all thought kerry won the debates.
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buzzsawmonkey 10/07/08 7:48:57 pm reply quote |
re: #89 lawhawk
Sadly, I missed this debate. Had more pressing matters. But the instareaction appears that I didn't exactly miss much. I'm sure that the media will fill me in on all that I need to know - and who won...
Big yawnfest. McCain landed a few blows, but nothing like a knockout punch.
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rudi 10/07/08 7:49:09 pm reply quote |
McCain didn't need to hit a homerun tonight.
Both candidates spouted talking points and campaign stump speeches although McCain showed a willingness to mix it up.
This debate won't change anything. McCain and Palin need to get back to ripping the hide off this anti-American radical pretending to be a moderate. It will work!
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rw in san diego 10/07/08 7:49:12 pm reply quote |
I learned nothing new in this debate. Brokaw stunk as a moderator and I wasted 90 minutes.
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Walter L. Newton 10/07/08 7:49:33 pm reply quote |
re: #67 Charles
I don't even want to say what I thought. This was not John McCain's best moment. And he really needed a best moment. I don't think he came off well.
I agree. I listened, didn't watch. McCain sounded nervous, at times he sounded like he was straining, like he wanted to get mad but was holding back. I don't know what the visuals were like.
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ReneeJoy 10/07/08 7:49:40 pm reply quote |
I don't think this was McCain's best moment. But I had more than a few laughs from Obama so that's gotta help McCain.
The thinking man can't help but vote for McCain. Let's hope that more thinking men go to the polls in November than non-thinking men.
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pat 10/07/08 7:49:41 pm reply quote |
Horrid. Dreadful. McCain is not only unaware of Obama's history of suing Citibank claiming that the failure to loan to unqualified mortgage applicants was racist, he seems unaware that Obama had the opportunity, while on the banking subcommittee, to vote to reestablish loan credentials and failed to do so.
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Semper Gumbi 10/07/08 7:49:49 pm reply quote |
McCain was able to get Obama riled up. Unfortunately, he didn't push hard enough to make Obama explode on-stage.
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Siberian Khatru 10/07/08 7:49:54 pm reply quote |
re: #51 Attaboid
Actually McCain looked like a looser.
Who's the bigger loser -- the loser, or the one who can't even spell "loser" properly? :D
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Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret) 10/07/08 7:50:02 pm reply quote |
Great. Time to gird up the loins to help save the Republic.
And all w/o the help of the top of the ticket.
Is it too late to put Palin on top of that team?
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rawmuse 10/07/08 7:50:16 pm reply quote |
What is this economic crisis we are in, for the love of Pete? I was on the freeway today, it was so full of cars that I had to slow down to 55mph. Then I stopped at my bank, it was open. I got my cash and went to my well stocked grocery store and bought dinner. The food was cheap and abundant. I came home, the lights worked, and I had a place to pard.
Where are these horrible conditions that BHO spoke of?
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Dark_Falcon 10/07/08 7:50:19 pm reply quote |
re: #74 doriangrey
Put the crack pipe down and back slowly away from it....
What?! I did not insult you, sir. Why did you just insult me?
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soccerdad 10/07/08 7:50:27 pm reply quote |
re: #26 bnichols10
Fox News is hammering McCain on his comments on buying up bad mortgages. I can't disagree with them...
Can't disagree with them? THAT position is EXACTLY the one that would make me vote Obama. Just to spite my fucking nose. How's THAT program going to work John? How does THAT fit into free enterprise?
Ugh.! Do i really HAVE to vote for this guy.
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jwb7605 10/07/08 7:50:38 pm reply quote |
re: #92 LEGION
McCain hit a ground rule double with the bases loaded for me. FINALLY he got the point in about Obama getting all that money from Fannie and Freddie and that they started this fire.
At which point, I noticed, the focus of the "random" questions changed.
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Sharmuta 10/07/08 7:50:43 pm reply quote |
McCain brought up 0bama's connection to Fannie & Freddy- barry didn't even refute the money he's been given.
Unfortunately, it happened at the beginning of the debate and not many people will remember it, but to me, it signals the next salvo on barry's character. I expect ads to follow up.
I still think 0bama screwed the pooch on the Pakistan question, and I do think Americans will notice.
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doppelganglander 10/07/08 7:51:04 pm reply quote |
My man Mitt is on! This man should be Treasury secretary.
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Pullus Iulius 10/07/08 7:51:07 pm reply quote |
I'm just really concerned that somebody'd better have a picture of 0 with a goat.
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NomadOfNorad 10/07/08 7:51:09 pm reply quote |
re: #87 jetprop
No homerun for McCain, however, he hit an RBI
"RBI"? I'm not familiar with that TLA.
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rp1138 10/07/08 7:51:10 pm reply quote |
Frank Luntz just pissed me off. He asked his group of dumbasses who won the debate with a show of hands. 13 for Obama, at least 11 for McCain, but maybe more, couldn't tell, because Luntz was blocking the left third of the screen when he asked for McCain.
He called it for Obama. That looks more like a tie to me. Then he only asked questions from the Obama people.
Not saying he's biased, just saying he f'ed up.
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hepcat 10/07/08 7:51:12 pm reply quote |
McCain has aged alot lately and it shows. He rambles rather than speaks. He sounded like a broken record. Ugh.
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AceR 10/07/08 7:51:13 pm reply quote |
Frank Luntz focus group says they liked that Obama says healthcare is a right?!
Give me a break...
Maybe McCain/Palin needs to educate Americans on what "rights" we are guaranteed in the Constitution.
Rights are not something that the gov't doles out...oops...sorry...forgot who was making that point.
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buzzsawmonkey 10/07/08 7:51:14 pm reply quote |
McCain needs to learn how to get off a punchy line.
He should have said that Obama will meet with Ahmedinejad with fewer preconditions than he laid down for that debate.
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tronix 10/07/08 7:51:19 pm reply quote |
i cant stand mcpain....but barry is marxist filth.....so...mcpain gets my vote
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Tigger2005 10/07/08 7:51:22 pm reply quote |
re: #67 Charles
I don't even want to say what I thought.
This was not John McCain's best moment. And he really needed a best moment.
I don't think he came off well.
Charles, you can't torment yourself over this. I know the polls aren't awesome right now and I know this debate was more of a tie. But the fact of the matter is in scary times like this the majority of the people are not going to punch that ballot for Obama. They're going to go for the known, not the unknown.
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shibumi 10/07/08 7:51:58 pm reply quote |
re: #68 DisturbedEma
I have never been so repulsed by a pol before. . .Obama is a snake! The smarm factor was sooooo distinctive, but I suppose that passes for charm some places. . .he did not answer a single question clearly, and he prefaced every answer with an attack. . .sheesh!
I only listened to the debate; I can't watch him, because I want to thrust my fist through the television.
Plus I grit my teeth whenever I hear "Pockeyston," "Tolleybahn" and my favorite, "tuh." Not "to," "tuh." I guess an Ivy League education doesn't buy you the ability to speak clearly.
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Ward Cleaver 10/07/08 7:52:08 pm reply quote |
AIG Draws Fire for Executives' $440,000 Post-Bailout Retreat at Posh California Resort
Put them in the stocks.
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devil in baggy pants 10/07/08 7:52:09 pm reply quote |
The Israel question is the only one where Mc Cain really hit a home run.
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Cast Iron Magnolia 10/07/08 7:52:20 pm reply quote |
Phew! I got lost and couldn't get back on......and when I finally made it and tried to log back in, I got a blank page with the following message:
"eh?"
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doppelganglander 10/07/08 7:52:25 pm reply quote |
re: #102 Semper Gumbi
McCain was able to get Obama riled up. Unfortunately, he didn't push hard enough to make Obama explode on-stage.
I wanted that so badly! He could have done it effortlessly, without looking like a meanie, and Obama would have dropped to about 2% in the polls immediately. Mac is too damned nice and it's going to cost him the race if he doesn't get over it.
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profitsbeard 10/07/08 7:52:42 pm reply quote |
McCain fouled out.
Obama stole first, second, third and home.
Then lied that he hit a homer. Scumbag.
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Sponge 10/07/08 7:52:51 pm reply quote |
Fox News had some group question hand raise at the end and some douchebag said that 0bama answered more questions.......the debate I watched, 0bama didn't answer SEVERAL questions, where McCain didn't answer all, but more questions.....
Once a dolt, always a dolt.
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Archimedes 10/07/08 7:52:52 pm reply quote |
re: #67 Charles
I don't even want to say what I thought.
This was not John McCain's best moment. And he really needed a best moment.
I don't think he came off well.
He doesn't have underlying principles in harmony with his emotions. He's your typical pragmatist, with a hodge-podge of unintegrated ideas. Palin, otoh, is in sync. She believes what she says.
Now, I think Obama is the same as McCain in that way. He's not emotionally invested in his rhetoric and it sounds mechanical, and a babbles a lot. He creates word salads.
In terms of ideas, McCain wasn't that great either. He was better than Obama, but that's not saying much.
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Biff 10/07/08 7:52:56 pm reply quote |
Yeah, but the GOP didn't nominate Rudy or Mitt, and many of you here opposed them too for your variouis parochial reasons. Rudy or Mitt would have been all over O. They would have thrashed him.Why doen't McCain know how to attack a Democrat. It just doesn't sound natural.
Just cut Sarah loose, let her set the tone, and Obama may still lose.
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dentate 10/07/08 7:52:57 pm reply quote |
re: #67 Charles
I don't even want to say what I thought.
This was not John McCain's best moment. And he really needed a best moment.
I don't think he came off well.
He looked out of breath and desperate. His hand gestures--palms up, moving his hand up and down--looked like begging. "My friends, my friends..." just kept sounding like someone begging to be heard. BO was the usual all style, no substance; he just mesmerizes the audience, so they don't listen to the words.
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Walter L. Newton 10/07/08 7:53:24 pm reply quote |
Ok, NBC is interviewing people (over the phone) in key states. One from Colorado and one from Virginia. Both supporting Obama. The dude from Colorado siad he was independent, but after this debate, he is leaning to Obama.
First off this Colorado guy sounded drunk. He said he can't get medical becuase of a pre-existing condition. Then he said he couldn't get a job. Talking head said that's "too bad" and went on to the woman in Virginia.
Well, gee, let's not ask the Colorado dude any probing questions. What can't you get a job? Hhy do you sound drunk (ok, maybe not)? Geeeessshhh... it sounded so set up.
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Attaboid 10/07/08 7:53:43 pm reply quote |
re: #79 NomadOfNorad
Loser rhymes with hoser.
/it should you louser/mouser.
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jcm 10/07/08 7:54:02 pm reply quote |
re: #122 Ward Cleaver
AIG Draws Fire for Executives' $440,000 Post-Bailout Retreat at Posh California Resort
Put them in the stocks.
Work it off......
Cool Hand Luke style.
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GGMac 10/07/08 7:54:12 pm reply quote |
First 3/4: boring repetition of stump speeches...
Pakistan question - to McCain
Russia question - to McCain
Israel question - to McCain
Answers to the last question showed the true measure of each man:
Obama - it's all about Me, Me, Me; always has been - always will be.
McCain - it's all about my country; always has been - always will be.
In my little corner of the USA - no contest: country first.
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Dar ul Harb 10/07/08 7:54:21 pm reply quote |
re: #105 rawmuse
I happened across a 17-year-old grocery receipt the other day. Food prices really haven't changed much since 1991.
Which means they must have actually declined in real terms, due to inflation.
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tronix 10/07/08 7:54:28 pm reply quote |
barry is so smooth...he's like dope....you feel good while its happening..but after a while...you realize you're still living your parents basement
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Meremortal 10/07/08 7:54:54 pm reply quote |
"Good evening everyone, I'm glad you could make our SA meeting. Who would like to go first this evening?"
"Hello, my name is Barack and I am a socialist."
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NY Nana 10/07/08 7:55:10 pm reply quote |
re: #34 Ward Cleaver
Only 30 minutes? I was ready to kill my computer.
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lawhawk 10/07/08 7:55:11 pm reply quote |
re: #96 buzzsawmonkey
Big yawnfest. McCain landed a few blows, but nothing like a knockout punch.
So, that means that the NYT, CNN and other media outlets will crow that Obama crushed McCain again. Thanks. That's all I needed to know. /heh
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Syrah 10/07/08 7:55:12 pm reply quote |
re: #93 Magalaga Ding Dong
Whilst I ponder this question, I can't help but think what an awful shame it is that McCain would be required to hit it out of the park on this, considering the undeniable hideousness of his opponent.
Republicans are running against the MSM as well as the Democrats. Republicans always have to hit it out of the park.
That we win as often as we do with the scale of the opposition we face is a testament to how winnable our position is, if we but believe in it enough to stand up and fight for it.
Reagan's genius was in understanding that he did not need to run to the middle, but that he needed to make the middle run to him.
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Walter L. Newton 10/07/08 7:55:14 pm reply quote |
re: #100 ReneeJoy
I don't think this was McCain's best moment. But I had more than a few laughs from Obama so that's gotta help McCain.
I really don't think anyone is going to be deciding on their vote becuase one candidate was funnier than the other. Is that all you got out of the debate?
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Cartman 10/07/08 7:55:16 pm reply quote |
I'll try this again. A new thread comes up every time I post.
On a my 1-10 scale: JM - 7.5 BHO - 5.5
John didn't do what I was hoping he would do. He was better tonight, and certainly better than Barry, but I feel he came up short. Maybe the format didn't end up lending itself to the delivery of a knockout blow, but the reality here is that the punch just wasn't thrown. I will continue to support and help campaign for JM all the way to the election, but I sure wish he had taken on the socialist pretender full in the face. Sigh.
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Dianna 10/07/08 7:55:24 pm reply quote |
re: #69 Cognito
I asked you - two threads back - if I was reading you right, that you really dislike Obama?
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blame canada 10/07/08 7:55:45 pm reply quote |
mccain sounded kinda lame. i cant help but wonder if huckabee would have destroyed BHO
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Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret) 10/07/08 7:55:48 pm reply quote |
Clair McCaskel (sp?)
Cripes... she shouldn't even be in the senate. Her husbund won that race, she wasn't on the ticket.
*spit*
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tronix 10/07/08 7:55:49 pm reply quote |
re: #137 tronix
barry is so smooth...he's like dope....you feel good while its happening..but after a while...you realize you're still living your parents basement
...and your only asset is your beer can collection
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nigella 10/07/08 7:56:21 pm reply quote |
McCain didn't do his best but I still think he won. It really irks me that they expected he had to hit a "home Run." Obama is an empty suit who can only win by cheating in the battleground states. Something is wrong here.
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Baelzar 10/07/08 7:56:25 pm reply quote |
It's over.
Hopefully Obama, Pelosi and Reid don't destroy us completely.
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Dar ul Harb 10/07/08 7:56:31 pm reply quote |
re: #136 Dar ul Harb
I should say, despite inflation.
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Palandine 10/07/08 7:56:41 pm reply quote |
Oh, how I despise my Senator, Claire McCaskill.
For those of you not from the Show-Me State, she ran as a bitter clinger, pro-life, pro-gun conservative Dem in 06. Snowed a lot of people, and beat an honorable conservative, Jim Talent.
Then she became an Obamaton.
Don't trust "conservative" Dems. Except for Liebermann, they've been hunted to extinction.
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soccerdad 10/07/08 7:56:45 pm reply quote |
re: #108 jwb7605
At which point, I noticed, the focus of the "random" questions changed.
You know, I was watching Fox just prior and the guy being interviewed was telling us how the ONLY person who know what was going to be asked was Brokow. The rest of the people who submitted questions didn't even know if they were going to be called upon. Well, honestly, i was pleasantly surprised that there were NO sniper shots by Brokow. If anything, I would argue that this was actually a fair playing field.
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rboa 10/07/08 7:57:13 pm reply quote |
I wish this would be settled by ideas and plans instead of grasping for the 4 sec sound bite.
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doppelganglander 10/07/08 7:57:20 pm reply quote |
Claire McCaskill? Why is it that every woman in the House and Senate has a room-temperature IQ? Surely Sarah Palin isn't the only intelligent woman in American politics.
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really grumpy big dog Johnson 10/07/08 7:57:35 pm reply quote |
Tom Brokaw asked garbarge quetions. This was not a town hall. Half the invitees should have been GOP and half dem, and they should have been randomly drawn. Each should have been assigned a random number and a fair lottery held as to who would ask the questions. Those who were selected should have been given at least six weeks to develop a list of 5 questions, in case others had already been asked.
And everyone should have been asked to develop questions that don't mirror the campaign speeches on the trail.
Oh, and every other question should have been asked by a person who affiliates with each party.
Brokaw was less effective than if he hadn't been there.
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Billy Hank 10/07/08 7:58:15 pm reply quote |
I gave the night to McCain on points, no KO. He did get around to mentioning Fannie/Freddie, but not enough repitition to drive the point home.
Buying up mortgages sounded a bit dumb. I can see how it might help, but if everyone decides to get their's negotiated down; talk about government intervention. What is it going to be, mortgages acquired w/in the last 10 years?, ARMs?, what?
Obama sounded more American tonight than I've ever heard him. Notice his multiple references to "last century" thinking as a way to play the age issue. He stumbled and stuttered less than usual but his answers were almost always pulled from inventory.
You know, I'm starting to feel like Ensign Pulver with Captain McCain keeping a muzzle and chain around the potted palm, Jeremiah Wright. I'm ready to march up to the bridge and throw it overboard. The MSM has already branded you and Sarah as racists. Not talking about Wright won't change their mind.
You had better have some dynamite stuff on Ayers, like proving he ghost wrote "Dreams of My Father", to provoke doubts about Obama. Right now, you haven't.
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alexknyc 10/07/08 7:58:22 pm reply quote |
To continue with the sports metaphors, someone needs to inform the McCain campaign that trying to run out the clock when you're behind is not a winning strategy.
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Attaboid 10/07/08 7:58:27 pm reply quote |
Looser,loser,louser.
McCain lost this one. Blew it big time. Didn't come out on the offensive.
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doriangrey 10/07/08 7:58:46 pm reply quote |
re: #106 Dark_Falcon
What?! I did not insult you, sir. Why did you just insult me?
If you think cognito is any more capable of admitting when he is wrong then you haven't read enough of his posts. cognito is Dan Rather is a metaphorical statement, both cognito and Dan rather sold their souls to the MSM, they are as the saying goes cut from the exact same cloth. They are, if you will, the Boy's from Brazil.
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Gallatin 10/07/08 7:59:12 pm reply quote |
Charles wrote:
I don't even want to say what I thought.This was not John McCain's best moment. And he really needed a best moment.
I don't think he came off well.
I think he came off slightly better than Obama's and his content free answers but McCain needed to be aggressive and hammer that lying socialist jackass and he just didn't seem up for it. I wish Palin could have stood in for him - " Say it ain't so, O".
-Gallatin
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Cartman 10/07/08 7:59:26 pm reply quote |
Fuck it. Another thread up above, already. I give up.
/throws up hands, walks away
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DisturbedEma 10/07/08 7:59:32 pm reply quote |
re: #121 shibumi
I only listened to the debate; I can't watch him, because I want to thrust my fist through the television.
Plus I grit my teeth whenever I hear "Pockeyston," "Tolleybahn" and my favorite, "tuh." Not "to," "tuh." I guess an Ivy League education doesn't buy you the ability to speak clearly.
I was really freaked out by the baby powder in his hair. . .weird like Gore's make up on 2000
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Killian Bundy 10/07/08 7:59:37 pm reply quote |
John McCain needed to hit a home run tonight. Did he?
No, I'm sorry, will someone please publicly call Lord Obama a socialist? Americans, for the most part, understand that word and don't like it. Publicly calling Lord Obama a socialist would create a media frenzy, shake the race up.
/and it has the added benefit of being the hard core truth, otherwise, welcome to Europe
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solomonpanting 10/07/08 7:59:51 pm reply quote |
re: #157 really grumpy big dog Johnson
Brokaw was less effective than if he hadn't been there.
You mean like Congressmen?
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iceman1960 10/07/08 8:00:13 pm reply quote |
Obama has the bigger hurdle to jump and I know that from talking to average people here in Illinois a state that Obama will take for sure.
People just don't trust him and know enough about him and tonight did nothing to change that.
Who says McCain had to hit it out of the park? I think Obama needed to and didn't.
When you have to fly through a storm who do you want for a pilot? The guy that just got his pilot license or the guy that's been flying for years?
It will boil down to that when people pull the lever.
Don't trust the polls.
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DM Glampers 10/07/08 8:00:30 pm reply quote |
Simply, no.
2 things:
1. 'Health care is a right'-0bama
This should frighten people, but it won't. Luntz's focus group is anecdotal proof of that.
2. I give McCain some credit for trying to nail him on a couple issues, perhaps the campaign trail will bear fruit in the next couple weeks. I hope next week's debate will not be the yawner this one was.
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Palandine 10/07/08 8:00:46 pm reply quote |
re: #146 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)
Clair McCaskel (sp?)
Cripes... she shouldn't even be in the senate. Her husbund won that race, she wasn't on the ticket.
*spit*
No, that was Carnahan who died, and his widow was named to the ticket, defeating Ashcroft. Talent defeated her after 2 years...then THIS horrible thing happened.
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paperbeatsrock 10/07/08 8:01:08 pm reply quote |
FUCK!
What was that? I thought the gloves were coming off?
I am so disappointed. It feels EXACTLY like it's 1996 and we have Dole being too goddamned nice. Another old outta touch Republican is what the sheep will see.
Barry needs a pop in the mouth! This is the most dangerous and unqualified person to ever run for POTUS and we have McCain just playing softball.
"no, don't wanna sound mean, don't wanna bring up the hard stuff."
We get it John. You have served this country. You have experience...no one, not even your detractors can deny that.
Rezko! Ayers! Wright!
over and over and over until the word gets out to thru the MSM filters.
Jesus I am so pissed off right now. That was 90 minutes of soft shit.
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Ward Cleaver 10/07/08 8:01:15 pm reply quote |
re: #67 Charles
I don't even want to say what I thought.
This was not John McCain's best moment. And he really needed a best moment.
I don't think he came off well.
Charles, some of us just pray about it and put it in God's hands.
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Siberian Khatru 10/07/08 8:01:46 pm reply quote |
re: #136 Dar ul Harb
I happened across a 17-year-old grocery receipt the other day. Food prices really haven't changed much since 1991.
Which means they must have actually declined in real terms, due to inflation.
Same here; I've noticed a small increase in a few staples (like milk) whose costs are directly tied to the spike in corn prices thanks to the ethanol boondoggle, and certain high-end "luxury" foods (imports and gourmet brands) have gone up, but most of the "standard" stuff I buy seems to have not changed that much.
I think a lot of the people who are whinging about their grocery bills are the type who are accustomed to shopping at places like Whole Foods Market or buying only the politically-correct "gourmet" brands.
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Archimedes 10/07/08 8:01:48 pm reply quote |
re: #159 sngnsgt
Obama was weak on foreign policy.
Speaking from the stand point of ideas, he's weak on everything. This is what is disappointing. He's very easy to nail.
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J.S. 10/07/08 8:01:52 pm reply quote |
I couldn't get on to Lgf...(and I didn't watch the debate -- I can't stand obama -- i despise this person...) I listened to Glenn Beck instead...On Beck's program tonight was a feature about ACORN and how they round up fraudulent voters...and how Obama was ACORN's Lawyer -- giving ACORN people the pep talks and how to defraud elections...yeah, what else is new? And, it was noted that in a speech given to ACORN people, Obama stated how they were marching "arm in arm" together...I still cannot get over how this utter scumbag has a chance at becoming the POTUS...A liar, a fraud, a supporter of terrorists...
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sparrowlake 10/07/08 8:02:13 pm reply quote |
McCain came across as a dottering old fart and Obama as a slick inexperienced liar.
Neither was impressive on the economic crisis, but on balance McCain was a bit better because he articulated more of a plan.
To my horror McCain came across as weak on Israel, in that he said that China and Russia would prevent the US from striking Iran if Iran attacks Israel. Obama was actually stronger in his professed support, and it is only because I don't believe or trust him that I didn't give the debate to Obama right then and there.
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scratch 10/07/08 8:02:29 pm reply quote |
I think McCain said everything he could and should say, but I don't think it had the desired effect.
I'll tell you one thing that drives me absolutely up the wall, is after these debates the inevitable "undecided" voter who says, "Well, I just felt like [name of Democratic candidate here] cares more about common people."
It also burns me up when the "undecided" voter says why they think the Democratic candidate did better, and the reasons happen to coincide with the current Democratic talking points.
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hepcat 10/07/08 8:02:29 pm reply quote |
re: #128 Archimedes
Obama seemed to have picked up on Palin's debate style and is using it on McCain.
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MJBrutus 10/07/08 8:02:41 pm reply quote |
re: #1 Jetpilot1101
I can't stand Mort the Dork. The man thinks that being right in the center of any argument is a virtue.
Anyhoo, McCain did well, but it was no home run. And Sheena was right, WTF is with putting homes that irresponsible buyers can't afford on OUR backs?
Obambi showed once again how he is entirely unqualified to lead a troop of girl scouts. But from what I can tell from Luntz, etc, his endlessly repetitive "the middle class is hurting" BS made the undecided fools think that he feels their pain.
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Athos 10/07/08 8:03:44 pm reply quote |
re: #169 DM Glampers
This should frighten people, but it won't. Luntz's focus group is anecdotal proof of that.
That's the problem around populist statements - particularly when they are not aggressively countered by facts. Facts counter populist drivel.
This is starting to look more and more like 1976..........
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really grumpy big dog Johnson 10/07/08 8:04:32 pm reply quote |
The idiot quotient on this topic is appalling. We have the MCain looked like a looser crowd, and the McCain looked tired and old crowd.
The one person who looked uncertain and fragile was McCain's opponent.
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Meremortal 10/07/08 8:04:47 pm reply quote |
I only really watched the last 15 minutes or so, which McCain won easily on substance, even though he was too laid back. The first 45 minutes were a total bore and I couldn't even pay close attention. I don't think many minds will get changed by this "discussion" tonight. My wife and I howled every time Barack said we must cut our oil consumption. We also howled when Barack answered the stupid "What don't you know?" question by saying, "Here's what I do know." Putz.
End result: No change in the dynamic.
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Ruthless 10/07/08 8:04:53 pm reply quote |
I have to agree with Charles. I was disappointed, almost frightened to see Obama, the smooth but empty suit babbling what he thinks people want to hear, and 95 percent plus of the American people have no idea WHO that man is. McCain seemed almost incoherent at times, and he did look old and tired. This was not a good night for him.
I was also disappointed to learn that what was supposed to be a Town Hall meeting turned out instead to be just more of the same media-moderated garbage. The questioners might as well have been robots, and the questions were picked by an MSM talking head, not the participants. That made the whole thing, IMHO, meaningless and unfair to McCain since it let Obama stroll around looking cool and collected.
I don't think this "debate" will really have that much effect. The groundswell of criticism of Obama that was started by Sarah and picked up by McCain will only grow, and we have four weeks for the story of the "real" Obama to get out to voters, most of whom are only now beginning to pay attention.
One more note: I went to the Albuquerque West Side McCain office today to see what I could do. They had a phonebank setup with about 25 phones -- and not a single volunteer working. I spent a while talking with the campaign field manager, and she was frustrated that she is not getting volunteers. She told me that at the nearby Obama center the place is always filled with college students manning the phones. It was disturbing, but again I don't think phone calls from college kids are going to make the difference.
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Biff 10/07/08 8:04:58 pm reply quote |
Biggest problem is that McCain won't support W where W has been right. 2003 W and SOT went to the Hill over Fannie and Freddie. McCain doesn't want to bring that up, and will only go back 2 years, which was probably already too late.
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hepcat 10/07/08 8:05:08 pm reply quote |
Ya know, if they can't come up with something new or hard hitting, then the debate defaults to style over substance.
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Archimedes 10/07/08 8:05:10 pm reply quote |
re: #180 hepcat
Obama seemed to have picked up on Palin's debate style and is using it on McCain.
No. Obama doesn't at all come across with the fire and directness of Palin. Palin also has much more confidence, because she believes in her self.
Obama has the smooth voice and style, but he creates word salads that often don't have much meaning.
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Florida Lady 10/07/08 8:05:40 pm reply quote |
I think on substance McCain won big and acted presidential.
I was nervous in the beginning because HE was looking and sounding nervous. Luckily, though, 0bama sounded like crap for the most part.
McCain deserves kudos for socking it to The One on Fannie & Freddie. It amazed me Obama didn't refute it, as he loves to lie. Sadly, McCain didn't hit him as hard as we all would have liked.
Not a home run by any means, but a good solid double.
McCain & Palin have been firing their shots across the bow and it's resonating with people. "Drip, drip, drip" can work as well as a dramatic hammering. The key for them is to keep it up.
What's the story about the tortoise and the hare? Slow & steady wins the race . . .
/my 2 cents
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Siberian Khatru 10/07/08 8:06:02 pm reply quote |
re: #158 Billy Hank
Buying up mortgages sounded a bit dumb. I can see how it might help, but if everyone decides to get their's negotiated down; talk about government intervention. What is it going to be, mortgages acquired w/in the last 10 years?, ARMs?, what?
Whatever it is, if we're going to do it, IMO it should be limited only to those mortages which were taken out for a primary residence, and for which the mortgage holders can show continuous residency in the property from no longer than 30 days after the paperwork closed up to the present day. The "house flippers" can go hang.
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scratch 10/07/08 8:06:55 pm reply quote |
re: #51 Attaboid
Actually McCain looked like a looser.
I'm amazed at the number of people who mis-spell the word "loser," as you did. I think that may be irony, but I'm unsure of the actual definition of that word.
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desertbrat 10/07/08 8:07:33 pm reply quote |
I thought this was a lame debate.McCain allows Obama to lie about him with no rebuttal..."Bush's and Republicans fault for the economy" nothing from McCain about Frank Raines /Barney Franks/Chris Dodd/etc.
LAME Questions,except for Israel/Iran. McCain was just ok except for his closing statement. WISH SARAH COULD DEBATE OBAMA!
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Orangutan 10/07/08 8:07:51 pm reply quote |
THe fat lady isn't singing.
Thankfully, Palin's in shape....and hopefully McCain can get there soon. Obama hasn't run away with this because he isn't what people really want.
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lazydaisy 10/07/08 8:08:32 pm reply quote |
What the EFF is a green job? I'm not uneducated, but I have never heard of a green job.
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So? 10/07/08 8:09:34 pm reply quote |
Health care is a right. In a nation as rich as the US, no one should be without health care.
McCain was a disappointment.
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scratch 10/07/08 8:09:56 pm reply quote |
re: #178 sparrowlake
...To my horror McCain came across as weak on Israel, in that he said that China and Russia would prevent the US from striking Iran if Iran attacks Israel. Obama was actually stronger in his professed support, and it is only because I don't believe or trust him that I didn't give the debate to Obama right then and there.
Huh? I heard him say that we would step in to help Israel, without waiting for approval from anyone. Did I mis-hear?
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Biff 10/07/08 8:10:04 pm reply quote |
re: #186 Ruthless
Your right, it was like the interviews they show on the nightly news, made to look random and on the street, but hand picked by the producer to say exactly what the network wants you to hear.
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Archimedes 10/07/08 8:10:43 pm reply quote |
re: #194 Orangutan
THe fat lady isn't singing.
Thankfully, Palin's in shape....and hopefully McCain can get there soon. Obama hasn't run away with this because he isn't what people really want.
Palin is the x factor. How often is a vice presidential candidate so much more effective than the presidential candidate. That could be the ace in the hole for republicans.
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Yankee Sojourner 10/07/08 8:11:26 pm reply quote |
I hope there's an October Surprise still coming that will bring Obama down. I saw tonight missed opportunities for the fighter pilot in McCain to rear its spirit, to have boomerang back to Obama his many lies and shifty past. For example, why didn't McCain bring up Obama's support for PLO operatives when the subject of Israel was raised? Or that he spent 20 years in an Israel bashing cult church? Or when speaking of the troops, why didn't McCain recall Obama's negative remarks about US soldiers -- how soldiers attacked civilians and raided villages? McCain needed to come out swinging like a prize fighter. What I saw was a couple good hits but mostly limp-wristed jabs. At no time did I throw a "yes!" fist in the air. And Obama still remains unexposed for the liar he is.
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Cold Rage 10/07/08 8:11:50 pm reply quote |
McCain was far too laid back. And I'm glad I wasn't playing the "my friends..." drinking game or I'd be in an ambulance right now.
He did a good job of pointing out the problems with Obama's policies, but he sounded like he was talking to a 8 year old. Policy wonks will nitpick it, but seems like a draw to Joe Six-Pack.
Palin probably ruined her motel room with a hockey stick yelling "Hit him already!"
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Colonel Panik 10/07/08 8:11:53 pm reply quote |
re: #115 hepcat
McCain has aged alot lately and it shows. He rambles rather than speaks. He sounded like a broken record. Ugh.
He sounded tired and distracted at the beginning.... repeated himself too much. But i think somebody must have slipped him a RedBull about 1/3-1/2 way through because he tightned up and finished up strong.
I listened to it on the radio so YMMV.
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Palandine 10/07/08 8:12:15 pm reply quote |
Hey 3 wood, or any smart lizard:
How low can the market actually go, numbers wise? It can't go down to zero, because tens of millions of us have 401ks that "buy" shares for us every payday, and we're not getting out.
What's the worst "bottom" there could be?
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J.S. 10/07/08 8:12:24 pm reply quote |
Glenn Beck (or one of his guests) noted that there's a "tipping point" -- in that if you get enough people in a nation "hooked" on Socialist style handouts -- get enough of the people "on the dole" -- then you'll forever be getting more Socialists into power. Also, one of the reasons that ACORN is feeling so enpowered right now, is because they figure that Obama is going to become Prez, and once Obama is Prez, they'll be on easy street -- there will be no more prosecutions of ACORN fraud artists who are scamming up voters for Democrats...Obama will close his eyes..."What, ya mean ta say a single voter can't cast the multiple votes for the same candidate?! just what kind of a democracy is this in the Amerikka?!"
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Archimedes 10/07/08 8:12:30 pm reply quote |
re: #195 lazydaisy
What the EFF is a green job? I'm not uneducated, but I have never heard of a green job.
An environmental wacko job. In this case it's a make work program, because it'd be paid for by the government, which means more taxes, less productivity and less jobs in the private sector.
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looking closely 10/07/08 8:12:35 pm reply quote |
McCain had the better and more substantive arguments, as well as the sharper attacks, but no, sadly, he didn't knock it out of the park.
I actually though Obama did better this time than last time, though he still lost this one handily.
Game changer? I don't think so, but I can't see this one having hurt McCain.
On Ayers, I just don't see how McCain could have worked that in without seeming like a total a-hole given the time constrained format.
He did make an allusion to (Biden's) hair transplants, and Obama even seemed to get it, but it probably went over the head of 99% of the audience.
McCain might have shoehorned Rezko in there when talking about housing, so that was a potentially missed opportunity.
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poopeedoo 10/07/08 8:12:36 pm reply quote |
re: #173 Ward Cleaver
Charles, some of us just pray about it and put it in God's hands.
AMEN back atcha... and an upding! :-)
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healem 10/07/08 8:12:58 pm reply quote |
re: #197 scratch
No, you got it right. And Obama never answered if he would support Israel without waiting for UN support.
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LSD 10/07/08 8:13:08 pm reply quote |
I'm amazed people were looking for McCain to "hit a home run"
Seriously? That's what would change the hyperventilating over these polls in swing states? This debate went exactly like everyone KNEW it would, but wished it wouldn't.
The fight is out on the streets ... the lines have been drawn. This will be decided on the campaign trail.
You either want an dangerous moronic embarrassment like Barak Obama for a President, or you don't.
I sure as hell do not.
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iceman1960 10/07/08 8:13:28 pm reply quote |
Lord help us if we get a Obama, Pelosi, Reid trifecta.
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nightintheruts 10/07/08 8:15:30 pm reply quote |
OT - before the debate my wife and I went out to eat - Japanese...
Two liberal couples were there and just started railing on Republicans, loud and obnoxious.
my wife kept me settled - through how NPR was the best news source, McCain crashed every plane he was in and how stupid he was, just on and on....and one son of a bitch just kept getting louder and louder.
Finally he said that Palin appealed only to stupid uneducated housewives and his abused looking wife tried to laugh.
that was enough, and I called him out. He bowed up in his chair and started rambling about his first amendment rights.
I walked over and said the only problem with first amendment rights is when conceited liberal assholes think it gives them the right to get in everyone's personal space. They make the 1st amendment bigger and bigger and bigger into a bullshit bubble until it hits the 2nd amendment. And when that happens, the 2nd amendment pops the 1st amendment loud and quickly.
I opened my jacket and let him catch a glimpse of my .38.
He and his friends then left quickly. My wife and I enjoyed our dinner as others came by and shook my hand.
sorry, but I'm tired of those assholes.
back to the debate stuff...
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Osama Bin Porkchop 10/07/08 8:15:53 pm reply quote |
re: #210 iceman1960
Lord help us if we get a Obama, Pelosi, Reid trifecta.
Talk about Hell on Earth....
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kansas 10/07/08 8:16:47 pm reply quote |
re: #146 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)
Clair McCaskel (sp?)
Cripes... she shouldn't even be in the senate. Her husbund won that race, she wasn't on the ticket.
*spit*
You are thinking about Jean Carnahan a few years ago. Jim Talent beat her and McCaskill beat him last cycle. Interesting how these people can turn into such liars when they get to Washington.
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MJBrutus 10/07/08 8:16:58 pm reply quote |
re: #210 iceman1960
Exactly right! I've been screaming that McCain / Palin need to remind people of just who the fuck would be running this country if the elect O'bambi. Pelosi and Reid are even deeper in the public approval shitter than Bush and they will have carte blanche. Where is the mention of little details like the union card check law they want to pass? And the unfairness doctrine? And a million other ways that they will screw this country beyond anything a full scale nuke attack by Putin could ever do?
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jaybird 10/07/08 8:17:06 pm reply quote |
I disagree with the premise that McCain needed a home run. It would have been nice, but it isn't necessary. Just keep Palin pounding Obama and produce a few could spots, and he'll get momentum back.
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pepper 10/07/08 8:18:00 pm reply quote |
re: #102 Semper Gumbi
McCain had a similar opportunity in the first debate to push OB over the edge, but he missed that as well. Senatorial debating is collegial, meaning PC.
We live in an age of the glossy, superficial rock stars. Undecided people are vastly overrated, but in a close election, we follow that "manifest destiny".
Hope it rains on election day.
One caveat, McCain spoke nothing of Ayers, but the media sure picked it up.
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spynverzyon 10/07/08 8:18:39 pm reply quote |
Fellow Lizards - nobody is more nauseated and horrified at the prospect of an Obama presidency than I am, and I will try to be cheered by those of you who think McCain did well in this debate. In truth, though, I can't pretend that tonight was anything but a disaster. To me, even though McCain was right most of the time, he sounded bumbling and unfocused in much of what he was trying to say - and was breathing hard and looking so nervous at some points that I feared he might be about to have a heart attack.
The problem is that when it comes to many genuine conservative principles - taxes, regulation, environment, monetary policy, even social programs - McCain is not a true believer, and never has been. That's why he couldn't counter Obama's lying idiocy about deregulation as the cause of the financial crisis; couldn't plainly make the case that nuclear and petroleum are vastly superior sources of energy to the "alternative fuels" pipe dream; couldn't effectively dent Obama's bogus promise of a tax cut for 95% of working Americans; and still couldn't get it straight that Reagan's mistake in Beirut was not going there in the first place, but turning tail and running after the Marine barracks bombing.
The scenario for the coming weeks is rapidly moving from unpleasant to infuriating to downright terrifying: Economic crisis, big Democrat presidential mandate, potentially filibuster-proof Democrat majority in Congress, instability overseas. Get ready for the Second New Deal.
And nuclear war with Iran.
I've always been a huge optimist about this country, and I think if we survived Carter during some very difficult years for conservatives, we can survive anything. But I'm about to the point where I just want to move to Alaska and cling to my gun.
Wise counsel, anyone?
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poopeedoo 10/07/08 8:18:42 pm reply quote |
re: #184 really grumpy big dog Johnson
The idiot quotient on this topic is appalling. We have the MCain looked like a looser crowd, and the McCain looked tired and old crowd.
The one person who looked uncertain and fragile was McCain's opponent.
Que?
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scratch 10/07/08 8:21:36 pm reply quote |
McCain does get major style points for his little mic-drop after each answer.
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jaybird 10/07/08 8:21:57 pm reply quote |
#211
In some states what you say you did is a crime. It's called brandishing. Be careful.
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fish 10/07/08 8:22:10 pm reply quote |
Hopefully no one will think I am trolling here, but I have to agree with much of what has already been said. McCain blew a great chance to point out the flaws in the Ones carefully created veneer and really show who is behind the curtain. He failed to deliver.
McCain wins on points but he needed a blowout to shift the momentum.
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Spar Kling 10/07/08 8:23:55 pm reply quote |
McCain a triple, Obama a double.
Obama is so smooth that he can say one thing, contradict it in the next sentence and make it sound good. McCain had him on the ropes but didn't go for the knockout.
For example, the part when Obama interrupted and started a speech, McCain should not have said anything. He should have let Brokaw *have* to restore order. Then McCain could have pointed out that this was a good example of how the President of the United States must be able to operate within the rules.
When Obama talked about invading Pakistan, McCain should have pointed out that "invading or threatening to invade a country who is our ally is not the way to make friends in the world. I think a lot of people at home who are your supporters Senator Obama would be pretty angry with you. I don't think widening the war will bring the troops home faster."
But then, I'm not running for anything and I'd do a pretty bad job against a smooth lawyer like Obama.
- sk
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tronix 10/07/08 8:24:37 pm reply quote |
re: #217 spynverzyon
wise counsel?...TAKE ANOTHER HIT, BROTHER....you seem to be in need
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Colonel Panik 10/07/08 8:24:42 pm reply quote |
re: #195 lazydaisy
What the EFF is a green job? I'm not uneducated, but I have never heard of a green job.
Imaginary employment in an imaginary "environmentally friendly" industry.
Either that or somebody who mixes green paint at Home Depot.
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kansas 10/07/08 8:25:21 pm reply quote |
re: #196 So?
Health care is a right. In a nation as rich as the US, no one should be without health care.
McCain was a disappointment.
I'm sure every medical student will be thrilled to hear that it is your right to their services.
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Colonel Panik 10/07/08 8:25:46 pm reply quote |
re: #201 Cold Rage
Palin probably ruined her motel room with a hockey stick yelling "Hit him already!"
ROFLMAO!
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Opinionator 10/07/08 8:26:14 pm reply quote |
I think McCain did very well and I disagree with the premise of needing to hit a home run. Following Palin's debate,we are seeing closing in the polls, at least the ones that are not 50/39 dem/repub ratios. He needed to resonate with the voters and reassure them that in a dangerous time, he is the experienced leader. His close was especially strong in that respect and he handed Obama his head on foreign policy.
You are not going to knock out a smooth talker. You have to remind them of his lack of experience and chip away at him.
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bofh 10/07/08 8:27:08 pm reply quote |
re: #178 sparrowlake...To my horror McCain came across as weak on Israel, in that he said that China and Russia would prevent the US from striking Iran if Iran attacks Israel. Obama was actually stronger in his professed support, and it is only because I don't believe or trust him that I didn't give the debate to Obama right then and there.
Huh? I heard him say that we would step in to help Israel, without waiting for approval from anyone. Did I mis-hear?
McCain said that he would act without waiting for the UN, and I think his final statement was meant to say that there would be little point in waiting for the UN because Russia and China would veto any action. It was a bit garbled, but at least I think that's what he was saying...
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Lynn B. 10/07/08 8:31:08 pm reply quote |
Wish I could hang out here a while and read the comments but I can't tonight. I thought Obama bumbled and lied and obfuscated but McCain bumbled worse and the fact that he didn't lie will be lost on the vast majority of viewers and voters.
BUT
It's not over until the last vote is counted. A lot can happen in four weeks.
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NY Nana 10/07/08 8:31:58 pm reply quote |
re: #177 J.S.
I couldn't get onto LGF, but also watched Glenn Beck, and feel the same way you do. I have yet to watch a Presidential debate since what I think was the first on TV..President Kennedy vs. Richard Nixon.
I already know who I am voting for, and the debates have turned into 'he said, he said', and in the case of Gov Polin and the idiot savant, Biden, 'she said, he said'.
I feel that Obama is a clear and present danger to our country, and will never, ever understand how he was selected by the Demonrats...they had 2 terrible choices, and I never thought I would live to say that Shrillary would have been less of a danger than the Manchurian candidate...but yes, I just said it.
She would have lost, but that is neither here nor there. I am not happy with Sen. McCain, but would vote for him in a nano second..actually I did today, absentee.
Now? All I can do is sit and pray that Obama really mucks up, and that in addition information that has been verified irrefutably will be revealed, and make his election impossible.
Where is the pressure to reveal his health records, and also his records from Columbia? He is pulling a Hillary on the university records, and getting away with it.
The only thing that makes me laugh now is my 3 little grandkids, but there are also tears involved, when I think of what a President Obamination will mean to their lives and to my kids.
It is 4 weeks until the election, and I have never in my life been this worried.
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hacker 10/07/08 8:32:40 pm reply quote |
The wart-mole was not even visible tonight.
Usually it grows during the day, and shrinks back in the morning.
Pinocchio would be so lucky.
Makeup, makeup, stat.
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Chris in Toronto 10/07/08 8:33:16 pm reply quote |
This debate was a tactic in McCain's campaign strategy. It's a "long war" strategy, and what matters is how it ends. As you all might recall, Obama doesn't know the difference between strategy and tactics.
As I see it, this phase of the campaign is about making Obama play defense. That's what I saw tonight. It worked out great. Obama was having to defend himself all night. Well, when he wasn't agreeing with McCain, that is.
McCain, I thought, mostly answered questions. Mostly. Obama skirted 'em.
I also noted his dropping of the "g"'s all the time, pandering to the southern audience. McCain sounded like he always does.
Commodity healthcare? WTF? A commodity is like, say, wheat or natural gas: everything is the same. Do you want the same healthcare from every doctor? Really? America is where the wealthy from the world over go to to ESCAPE commodity healthcare! Sheesh. Healthcare as a RIGHT? Ask yourself who provides the service. If it's a right, then it should obtain from nature just as, say, an apple falls from the ground for the animals to pick up. (This gets in my craw, not the apple, the idea, being a Canadian notwithstanding!) I wish Ayn Rand were still around to teach these goobers about rights and from where they arise. John Galt's speech should be required reading every year from the 7th grade until graduation from university.
And, clearly, Brokaw knows nothing of "Zen".
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Catttt 10/07/08 8:33:59 pm reply quote |
re: #196 So?
Health care is a right. In a nation as rich as the US, no one should be without health care.
McCain was a disappointment.
Move to the UK or Canada and enjoy their appalling "right."
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fat.elvis 10/07/08 8:34:04 pm reply quote |
#196
Bullshit sir. You have no understanding what constitutes a right.
Defect to Canada.
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sngnsgt 10/07/08 8:35:34 pm reply quote |
I sure am glad all we have to do is get that Bin Laden guy and the war is over. If we find his rotting corpse is it still Bushs' fault we are still at war?
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bofh 10/07/08 8:36:47 pm reply quote |
The wart-mole was not even visible tonight.
Usually it grows during the day, and shrinks back in the morning.
Pinocchio would be so lucky.Makeup, makeup, stat.
My wife thinks that Obie had less of the fake grey-hair thing around the temples going on than he has had lately.
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hacker 10/07/08 8:36:48 pm reply quote |
Scuse me, Barry, Americans pronounce it "Pakistan". Phonics be your friend.
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LeonidasOfSparta 10/07/08 8:38:25 pm reply quote |
[Link: blogs.abcnews.com...]
I found the URL -- Shelly Mandel, LA Pres of NOW, has glowing words for Palin.
Thank you Ms. Mandel.
"Shelly Mandell, the president of the Los Angeles chapter of the National Organization for Women introduced Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin over the weekend in California, speaking not on behalf of NOW but "as an individual, as a woman's rights activist for 30 years who has worked for all those years to see this day."
Going through her feminist bona fides -- the International Women's Year, the Equal Rights Amendment, Geraldine Ferraro -- Mandell said she is "proud to support Sarah Palin, a woman who will fight for women's rights ... a woman who will, Lord knows, shake things up."
"Make no mistake," Mandell said. "I'm a life-long Democrat ... I don't agree with Gov. Palin on several issues." And yet, she said, "I know Sarah Palin cares about women’s rights, she cares about equality, she cares about equal pay, and as Vice President she will fight for it. She cares about our children and she cares about women's lives. She's an athlete and she knows what Title Nine did for girls like her."
"It is an honor to call her sister," Mandell said as she handed the microphone over to Palin, who would accuse Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., of "palling around with terrorists."
“America," Mandell said, "this is what a feminist looks like."
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Catttt 10/07/08 8:38:33 pm reply quote |
If I hear one more Democrat talk about mom and dad sitting at the kitchen table, wondering how they are going to pay for John's knee and Mary's college, I am going to puke.
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profitsbeard 10/07/08 8:39:50 pm reply quote |
Obama now must go into the hospital for nose reduction surgery before the next debate.
McCain just needs a transfusion of Palin's type.
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Catttt 10/07/08 8:40:36 pm reply quote |
Hey, Barry, introduce Mom and Dad and fricking John and Mary to your money pal, Tony Rezko - he got you a deal on your house and bought that yard for you - maybe he can help them. Or redirect some of those millions you helped Bill Ayers give away to socialist groups in Chicago.
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Adina in Judea 10/07/08 8:42:50 pm reply quote |
re: #234 Chris in Toronto
This debate was a tactic in McCain's campaign strategy. It's a "long war" strategy, and what matters is how it ends. As you all might recall, Obama doesn't know the difference between strategy and tactics.
As I see it, this phase of the campaign is about making Obama play defense. That's what I saw tonight. It worked out great. Obama was having to defend himself all night. Well, when he wasn't agreeing with McCain, that is.
I agree.
Obama is a target rich environment all by himself for a million jabs/shots at him.
If they're all delivered at once, he could recover from them.
I think it's better to draw the agony out (which is happening daily now.)
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DCMacHead 10/07/08 8:43:41 pm reply quote |
I'm voting for McCain, but he really did suck bad. I'm starting to think he's pro-life because this was certainly an abortion of a performance.
What the hell was he thinking with another $300 bln program to bail out people who bit off more than they could chew? Didn't they just pass a $800 bln bailout last week? Didn't we just bail out FNM/FRE to the tune of $200 bln? Didn't we just bailout AIG for $85 bln?
We're going MUCH MUCH lower on the market tomorrow. This was McCain's chance and he f*cked it up.
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Adrenalyn 10/07/08 8:43:48 pm reply quote |
all we saw was Obama use buzzwords
he seemed very ill at ease
and if you put a psy-op in front of the video
you'd be told how uncomfortable he was
and how he felt inside that everything he himself said was a lie
McCain did not hit a home run
but he scored points on almost every question/rebuttal
Obama simply was overmatched
but McCain missed some good points
for instance, and why the fuck am I the ONLY PERSON to say this:
ok, say we used all our resources to get Bin Laden
then we let Saddam have Kuwait and then Saudi Arabia (remember kids, he had hundreds of tanks on the border if we did not move against him in 1991 and would have again) and control what, 40% of the oil in the world ?
one goat fucker
40% of the worlds oil
how fucking easy is that John McCain ?
say it goddam it
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Adrenalyn 10/07/08 8:45:07 pm reply quote |
and if we got Bin Laden
how much terrorism is gonna stop ?
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Who Watches the Watchmen? 10/07/08 8:45:54 pm reply quote |
re: #189 Archimedes
No. Obama doesn't at all come across with the fire and directness of Palin. Palin also has much more confidence, because she believes in her self.
Obama has the smooth voice and style, but he creates word salads that often don't have much meaning.
That's perfect for a public that's captivated by crap.
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xnar 10/07/08 8:46:24 pm reply quote |
Obama makes it up as he goes with foreign policy. A few canned lines and some fill-in patter.
McCain speaks from knowledge and experience on foreign policy and has a lot of depth and wisdom.
Keep both of them away from my wallet.
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Meremortal 10/07/08 8:46:28 pm reply quote |
re: #235 Catttt
Move to the UK or Canada and enjoy their appalling "right."
Agree with you, Catttt.
Also, "So?", health care is already a right in today's America. Access to health care is already a right. Free health care for some, paid for by others, is not yet a right.
"If you think health care is expensive, just wait until it's free."
-P.J. O'Rourke
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Adina in Judea 10/07/08 8:48:27 pm reply quote |
re: #241 Catttt
If I hear one more Democrat talk about mom and dad sitting at the kitchen table, wondering how they are going to pay for John's knee and Mary's college, I am going to puke.
Democrats live and breathe anecdotes (usually about families with two parents working 20 jobs each and no health care.)
Obama has even derided McCain for not living and breathing anecdotes himself. These anecdotes are emotional whining and say nothing about a country of 300 million people.
They got the idea of anecdotes from inspiring stories of people who have worked hard and done something special, but it's turned into "Here's another family that thinks America sucks."
It's not meant to inspire. It's meant to turn people against America.
It makes me want to puke, too.
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grandma 10/07/08 8:49:45 pm reply quote |
One of these fine days, I’ll refine my essay on “Health Care in America from a Personal Perspective”, but tonight is not the night. I’ve been too blown over with the debate and choking on having sunshine blown up my a$$ to even get into that. I watched the entire debate, and think because I did I must be one of those masochists that enjoy sticking toothpicks in their eyes. McCain came out ahead, but neither candidate gives me that “warm and fuzzy”.
Enjoying, anyhow, a lovely cool Carolina evening. Thanks for listening to Grandma.
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legalpad 10/07/08 8:50:07 pm reply quote |
re: #217 spynverzyon
I just want to move to Alaska and cling to my gun.
Make that guns! Sounds like fun.
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Daddio 10/07/08 8:50:17 pm reply quote |
I actually thought Brokaw's add-ons were pretty good.
I think that if people were paying attention, McCain made headway with them. If they weren't but were looking for entertainment instead, it was a tie.
I think it would be tough to go for the jugular in a town hall type format.
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Gorgonzola 10/07/08 8:50:28 pm reply quote |
Obama 'won'.
Meaning his answers were practised, sure and focus-grouped to be on-message.
John McCain 'lost', meaning his presentation was not as sick-making and his answers were those of a man with nearly forty years of experience who knows exactly what the fuck he's talking about.
Irritating.
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Archimedes 10/07/08 8:51:40 pm reply quote |
re: #196 So?
Health care is a right. In a nation as rich as the US, no one should be without health care.
McCain was a disappointment.
No, health care is not a right. If you believe that, then you believe you own the time and effort of others. Nobody does. Individual Rights mean that each man is left free to pursue his life and happiness. When you *force* others, you are violating those rights.
And, to be sure, in a free country, with a truly free market you'd get truly universal health care of the highest quality and at reasonable cost (and it'd continually improve as free markets do). Whereas under socialized medicine people get cut off, quality is bad, and it doesn't get better. So, from both a moral and a practical standpoint the idea "health care is a right" incorrect.
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FlakMusic 10/07/08 8:51:53 pm reply quote |
re: #196 So?
Health care is a right. In a nation as rich as the US, no one should be without health care.
Healthcare is not a right.
Grow up.
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stuBdoc 10/07/08 8:52:07 pm reply quote |
I thought McCain look shakey and tired tonight. He tried to hammer Obama at the beginning but to me, it looked contrived, like he knew he had to score some points against Obama but wandered away from the questions while doing so. I'm a McCain supporter but I think the average undecided voter would not be impressed with him tonight. Obama, despite obfuscating as usual, seemed confident and in control. Damn, John, do better next time.
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scratch 10/07/08 8:55:08 pm reply quote |
Allow me to propose a tag-team format, in which the Presidential and Vice Presidential candidates all appear together to duke it out.
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Archimedes 10/07/08 8:55:26 pm reply quote |
re: #248 Who Watches the Watchmen?
That's perfect for a public that's captivated by crap.
Tell me about it.
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Adina in Judea 10/07/08 8:56:15 pm reply quote |
re: #246 Adrenalyn
ok, say we used all our resources to get Bin Laden
then we let Saddam have Kuwait and then Saudi Arabia (remember kids, he had hundreds of tanks on the border if we did not move against him in 1991 and would have again) and control what, 40% of the oil in the world ?
John Kerry used to say in 2004 that everything would be solved if only the U.S. found Osama bin Laden, too.
The idea is to stop America from defending herself by giving America other things that to do first. It amounts to this attitude: "Before we go after terrorists, we should spend the next 50 years hunting down Osama bin Laden and/or his grave so that we can prove we got him while the entire world goes to hell around us."
They want the U.S. to refuse to do anything until this one task is done because they don't want the U.S. to go to war AT ALL. The left always, always, always wants the U.S. to appear to lose wars so that the U.S. won't be tempted to fight in them anymore.
If Osama bin Laden knew that the U.S. was going to invest absolutely everything into finding him until the end of time, he would kill himself and have his body cremated so that America could never be able to win at this one sole task (which would suit the Democrats just fine.)
It's an awful thing to understand how the left thinks (and I think it's a difficult thing to try to explain in a debate.)
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avspatti 10/07/08 8:57:08 pm reply quote |
re: #87 jetprop
No homerun for McCain, however, he hit an RBI
Would it be too much to ask for a little fire from McCain? Good grief. Borrriiiiing.
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Grandma 10/07/08 8:57:29 pm reply quote |
re: #257 legalpad
That would be "South". I'm a recently, recovering, relocated, transplant from NJ.
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flaggman 10/07/08 8:58:26 pm reply quote |
If McCain wins this election, it will be in spite of himself. He blew his opportunity tonight to demonstrate how Canadian/European/Venezuelan Obama's ideas are, and how proudly, uniquely American his ideas are. He's a communications failure because he's too nice a guy. And to let the Ayers connection slip by without comment, buying the "guilt by association" nonsense argument, is simply dereliction of duty and political suicide.
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spynverzyon 10/07/08 8:59:16 pm reply quote |
re: #229 nightintheruts
It gives me hope that there's still a state where you can brandish a firearm in public (and shut up an obnoxious lib!) without attracting a plague of lawyers.
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Adrenalyn 10/07/08 8:59:28 pm reply quote |
ok, the Adrenalyn take on health care being a right
if health care is a "right"
then how about a car, I mean you need fucking transportation to get to the goddam doctor
how about food ?
we all gotta eat, feed me dammit, evil whitey
how about housing
FUCK !
they just got me on that one
ok, I quit, we're all fucked
well, I got 2 out of three at least
that's 66%
almost a failing grade
but it still is passing
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legalpad 10/07/08 8:59:33 pm reply quote |
re: #262 Adina in Judea
I have heard of no evidence that Bin Laden is alive.
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PatrioticNaturalizedAmerican 10/07/08 9:00:22 pm reply quote |
After this debate I guess I better start preparing for the Palin '12 campaign and hope Barry and his friends don't screw us over. Sadly my only hope now is the Bradley effect. And if the questions were handpicked by Brokaw and Friends, what did you expect?
PS. I almost puked when the "green jobs" question was asked. My answer to that would be "What the hell is a green job?"
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Adrenalyn 10/07/08 9:01:01 pm reply quote |
re: #269 legalpad
I have heard of no evidence that Bin Laden is alive.
he sure as hell is
he has the original Guard Doc's that Dan Rather used
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legalpad 10/07/08 9:01:31 pm reply quote |
re: #264 Grandma
Just drove through there on my way from North Carolina. Been to New Jersey too. Congrats on the move!
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hacker 10/07/08 9:03:51 pm reply quote |
This time, it's not about being "for" a candidate. Being against is sufficient.
re: #270 PatrioticNaturalizedAmerican
PS. I almost puked when the "green jobs" question was asked. My answer to that would be "What the hell is a green job?"
Someone has to shrink-wrap the soylent green. That's a green job.
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Adina in Judea 10/07/08 9:04:03 pm reply quote |
re: #269 legalpad
re: #262 Adina in Judea
I have heard of no evidence that Bin Laden is alive.
The Democrats would want to put everything America's got into finding him anyway (as a way to keep America from doing anything else militarily for a long time.)
Sick, eh?
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pbird 10/07/08 9:05:44 pm reply quote |
re: #58 Occasional Reader
A looser, eh?
What is it with people being unable to spell "loser"? Drives me nuts.
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jimboster 10/07/08 9:07:06 pm reply quote |
The "that one" comment may actually help McCain.
I gotta believe that even undecided independents are getting tired of hearing how everything Palin and McCain isay s either outright racism or some kind of code. I hope the MSM really pushes the "that one" comment. I hope they ask McCain about it. And I hope McCain gets good and angry (albeit calmly).
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scratch 10/07/08 9:08:16 pm reply quote |
re: #277 jimboster
The "that one" comment may actually help McCain.
I gotta believe that even undecided independents are getting tired of hearing how everything Palin and McCain isay s either outright racism or some kind of code. I hope the MSM really pushes the "that one" comment. I hope they ask McCain about it. And I hope McCain gets good and angry (albeit calmly).
I missed something...what are you talking about?
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legalpad 10/07/08 9:09:20 pm reply quote |
re: #275 Adina in Judea
I think either Hanson or Krauthammer said "Who rules in Baghdad is more important than who's living in a cave somewhere." The focus on Bin laden is a partial acquiescence to the "law enforcement" response to terrorism, as if each act of terrorism is a separate and unrelated crime, and all we should do is get the individual perpetrators.
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Adrenalyn 10/07/08 9:09:25 pm reply quote |
re: #276 pbird
What is it with people being unable to spell "loser"? Drives me nuts.
I remember a "looser" being a girl with questionable morals
aka Skippy (spreads easy)
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arizona9 10/07/08 9:10:06 pm reply quote |
re: #34 Ward Cleaver
Same for me. Pages wouldn't load at all. But, once the vid was taken out it was fine.
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Grandma 10/07/08 9:10:12 pm reply quote |
re: #272 legalpad
I love South Carolina. Now that I’m retired, I’m on vacation all the time in a place that I really like being in. New Jersey is nice because two of my kids, grandchildren, and friends are there, but I’ve been there, done that and winters can be ugly and last too long.
In South Carolina I’m watching and following Sen. Jim DeMint. He’s new to the scene, but I like his ideas. And he’s really down on the type of socialism that our Dem friends would have us buy into.
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leftover54 10/07/08 9:10:36 pm reply quote |
re: #67 Charles
Charles, I saw/heard what you did. I started to wince even. Did youu feel McCain didn't pull off the "smack down" thats sorely needed ?
But, in retrospect, I think this really was the wrong setting for what he needed/still needs to do. I work with a LOT of woman. And have done so for years. One thing I know is that 90% of them feel threatened if the air becomes hostile. As a man, if you come off in a way that reminds them of their first husband - that feeling of "he's angry, is he going to explode ?" is one that would not have made this a good night for McCain. "Kid, tonight's not your night". He needs to take O'Bama to the shed - but not in a cozy,intimate environment. Tonight was a night to give off the vibe of "strong but controlled", or "I will protect you" - whether that be through stormy economic times or the/a war. There was one brief moment when it sounded much like a typical escalation to fisty cuffs between 2 men - maybe like the time Uncle John had a few too many at the 4th of July picnic and started to get into it with a brother in law. Just an air of testosterone overload - woman can feel/sense it and it makes most of them very uncomfortable. Most guys have been in a dating situation where some a**hole has to start some sh*t.
The guy feels he has to show said date that he's tough and will protect the lady. The lady usually has the common sense to say "just ignore it, the guys a drunken a**hole, why don't we just leave". A defining moment that is a very good indicator for woman of what life might be like with you. Ladies, not trying to be a stereotyping macho Neanderthal here - but I think I'm right and to me its just a difference between the sexes that has to do with the subconscious - who woman pick to pro create with ? No woman wants a wimp but no woman wants a man with a short fuse ( I said FUSE !)
am I correct? And if in this intimate setting either one really went for the jugular I think the one perceived the most aggressive would have lost BIG time - maybe not even a conscious decision. Of course they are playing to the larger viewing audiance but "the set" transcends the speration - just like on "Jerry Springer" or Geraldo's old TV show. Watching these shows really makes one feel that they are "there" because of the intimate setting - proximity of the war-ing "trailor trash" as it were and the tension is felt right there in the Barco-Lounger. McCain though still needs his moment to go for the jugular - hopefully in the last debate he can pull it off !
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legalpad 10/07/08 9:10:50 pm reply quote |
re: #276 pbird
What is it with people being unable to spell "loser"? Drives me nuts.
Me too. I see that everywhere - or "loose" for lose.
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dmays 10/07/08 9:10:58 pm reply quote |
This was the second of three debates. In the bigger scheme of things, I don't thing it matters much. Next week's debate will be the last debate and will be more important, IMO.
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Adrenalyn 10/07/08 9:11:53 pm reply quote |
re: #283 leftover54
huzzah !
spot on and well said
clear thoughts
and a good explanation of the situation
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avspatti 10/07/08 9:12:49 pm reply quote |
re: #217 spynverzyon
Alaska sounds good, but I first have to buy a gun.
Ever thought about Hawaii? I was only there once, but due to the time difference, I really didn't care what was happening on the mainland. Nice place to be isolated. And, you don't need heat or a/c!
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w_h_b 10/07/08 9:13:50 pm reply quote |
Did McCain hit a home run? Meaningless question. When its the 9th inning, and you're down 5 points, and there is no one on base, a home run isn't that big of a deal.
But I'd say he got a man on first in this debate.
So .....now its the 9th inning, he's down 5 points, he's got one man on first, and no outs.
Go McCain!
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J.S. 10/07/08 9:14:48 pm reply quote |
re: #232 NY Nana
hmm...It is, indeed, troubling (anxiety producing to say the least) to consider an Obama presidency. but there are still a few weeks left, and there are still so many unknowns about obama -- the Columbia time (where's that thesis of obama's?), the time in Pakistan (what was Obama up to there?), the Kenya time (what was Obama up to there?), and then there are over a dozen questions still unanswered about "Who is Obama?" (some are saying that we don't even know his real, true last name...) These are all potential (metaphorical) bomb shells waiting to go off...any one of them could sink Obama's campaign...(or, at least, i would hope...) (I also sent in my absentee ballot, yesterday...I just hope McCain wins...)
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Adina in Judea 10/07/08 9:15:30 pm reply quote |
re: #279 legalpad
I think either Hanson or Krauthammer said "Who rules in Baghdad is more important than who's living in a cave somewhere." The focus on Bin laden is a partial acquiescence to the "law enforcement" response to terrorism, as if each act of terrorism is a separate and unrelated crime, and all we should do is get the individual perpetrators.
Yes, I think this mentality is a big part of the problem.
The left wants America to sit around to see who else hits America so that law enforcers can go after those individuals, too, without addressing the global dangers.
Asymmetrical warfare against us absolutely COUNTS on our left wingers working against us every step of the way (and our western left wingers never let them down.)
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scratch 10/07/08 9:16:56 pm reply quote |
re: #288 avspatti
Alaska sounds good, but I first have to buy a gun.
Ever thought about Hawaii? I was only there once, but due to the time difference, I really didn't care what was happening on the mainland. Nice place to be isolated. And, you don't need heat or a/c!
I was born in Hawaii, and let me tell you, all they do is cling to their idols and their spear guns out there.
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Zimriel 10/07/08 9:17:05 pm reply quote |
John McCain didn't hit a home run, but he did win overall. (Which I could not say about Palin against Biden.)
Not convinced that McCain needed a "home run". The real energy right now is circling around Palin. Is the spirit of this country worth fighting for? or is it a cover for racism and world oppression?
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leftover54 10/07/08 9:17:47 pm reply quote |
re: #201 Cold Rage
Yes, Sarah can play that "role". I really do not think it would have worked in McCain's favor tonight in this "Town Hall" forum. Sarah can go off anytime as she will not be perceived as a physical threat to O'bama (although I'm sure she'd kick his a**).
I'm reminded now of the debate between Rick Lazio (?) and Shrillery - remember he crossed into her "personal space" and it was curtains for him ! Its all some deep subconscious thing that goes on between the sexes - depending on the pairing IMHO.
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legalpad 10/07/08 9:19:09 pm reply quote |
re: #283 leftover54
Good point. I think the main "smack down" that McCain needs to make involves educating the public about the recent economic issues. That involves a great deal of repetition, in a very simple form. He couldn't have really done that in that format.
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Optimizer 10/07/08 9:19:50 pm reply quote |
re: #112 Pullus Iulius
I'm just really concerned that somebody'd better have a picture of 0 with a goat.
There must be all kinds of pictures of him with Biden, and he's an old goat...
But I would think the picture of him in African garb (in Africa) should do. In times of crisis, people are looking for something, well, "normal". Supposedly, that's why they like Palin so much (being a POW for years isn't so "normal", either, but it's not as unusual as dressing up like an African without a gun being held to your head).
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Martel-Sobieski 10/07/08 9:21:02 pm reply quote |
Brokaw saw to it that the questions were lame. He's in the tank for Obama just like the rest of NBC. No questions that could potentially embarass the (half) Black Messiah.
I listened on radio. McCain sounded tentative and whiny in terms of delivery, and he jumbled up words a lot. Obama, bloviated inane talking points, but he did so in a "authoritative tone" which made his BS sound as if it were substantive.
McCain is stuck in the past with his "new tone" and his "bipartisanship" vibe. He's to married to that meme to really "bring it" to Obama.
McCain took over the debate at around the halfway point, but too little too late. The MSM will spin this as a win for Barack Milhouse Obama.
I'm gonna be sick.
Wait for it, they'll have to re-name Bradley "The Obama Effect."
It will be a McCain landslide. I know this because the press is flat-out lying like never before, therefore the outcome will be the opposite of what they intend.
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legalpad 10/07/08 9:21:41 pm reply quote |
re: #291 Adina in Judea
Yes and I think the most neglected part of the war on violent Islam involves the propaganda war. The enemie(s) need to be repeatedly discredited.
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Adina in Judea 10/07/08 9:24:26 pm reply quote |
re: #283 leftover54
And if in this intimate setting either one really went for the jugular I think the one perceived the most aggressive would have lost BIG time - maybe not even a conscious decision.
You have a good point.
McCain has right on his side. He's up against a guy who got into politics because domestic terrorists introduced him to their political circle in Chicago. Obama's ideology is Marxist and he adjusts his policy positions on a dime so that everyone can hear what they want to hear. Obama wants a brown shirts civilian army to roam around America with as much funding as America's regular military while claiming (on and off) that every person has the right to be given a college education, a mortgage, health care and everything else.
Obama is dangerous and wrong in too many directions to count.
A knockout punch in a debate isn't necessarily the best way to show this.
Obama needs to be attacked on all this daily (and it's happening now.)
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chakal 10/07/08 9:25:13 pm reply quote |
McCain didn't hit a home run, he doesn't need to. Obama is a luxury item for good times. He's too much of an unknown, too much of a risk at a time of war and economic dislocation. The center will go for McCain.
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Adina in Judea 10/07/08 9:32:57 pm reply quote |
re: #299 legalpad
re: #291 Adina in Judea
Yes and I think the most neglected part of the war on violent Islam involves the propaganda war. The enemie(s) need to be repeatedly discredited.
Absolutely.
The left wing is defending Islam (even violent Islam) with everything they've got.
Naomi Wolf (progressive feminist) is arguing these days that burqas are liberating for women.
Once the left gets into their "everything we don't like is racism" mode, there's no stopping their mouths. It makes asymmetrical warfare against us incredibly difficult to fight.
After the election and a McCain/Palin victory (G-d willing), America's conservatives need to take on the left wing about this (even if it must be blunt.)
It's something that America has to do in an asymmetrical war (or else!)
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leftover54 10/07/08 9:34:56 pm reply quote |
re: #292 scratch
A neighbor of mind moved to Alaska back in the 60's.
He had a plumbing business. Nice guy. Went to collect on a dead beats bill and was shot dead. One day you wish the guy "good luck, don't forget to write" and before you get the first post card ya hear the guys already dead (murdered) and buried. That formed my opinion on Alaska early on ! I made the mental note "if you ever go to Alaska, make sure you're packing". I got very close during the 70's recession - apparently there was big bucks to be made on some project (pipeline ?). A few of us debated it but the story of our neighbor made the $ seem not worth it.
It seemed very "wild west" to us back then (I was young).
We let one story sum up the entire state ! Silly, I know. But I'd still take a gun along if I ever needed to go there !
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committed 10/07/08 9:41:21 pm reply quote |
I'm hoping now wtih all might heart that McCain is saving his real surprise attack for the final debate. Palin is doing a bang up job out there right now and already has her gloves off! McCain/Palin 08
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pbird 10/07/08 9:41:53 pm reply quote |
re: #280 Adrenalyn
I remember a "looser" being a girl with questionable morals
aka Skippy (spreads easy)
Goodness! Never heard that one and I'm old.
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RedVoter 10/07/08 9:43:40 pm reply quote |
just finished watching the debate on DVR (had to finish some work first). I am disappointed in McCain. Very disappointed. I thought he blew it. Palin set him up real well with her aggressive words blasting Obama for accusing our troops of air raiding civilians in Afghanistan, his relationship with Ayers and his willingness to meet with dictators who hate America without preconditions. McCain was also gaining some steam it seemed with his palin-esque speech the other day where he laid into Obama and the Democrats over Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and seemed to effectively tap into the anger many felt over the Bailout. He had new and promising theme, "who is the real obama" he could have worked with...but he ignored it completely. this debate was dull, boring and a repeat of the first. He did not go after Obama, let alot of attacks against his record go unanswered, did not link Obama to the unpopular Democratic congress and the bailout debacle effectively, ignored the Ayers connection, did not defend the Free Market and our capitalist system and worst of all, dropped some insane bombshell about having the Feds (The Taxpayers) buy out all of the bad mortgages. What the hell was that? Nationalization? Tom Brokaw should retire as well, that was no Town Hall meeting, it was the same old structured crap we always see, but with an audience. tom Brokaw's ego wouldn't allow him to sit the hell out and just let regular people ask regular questions, instead it sounded like another boring network news interview. I have not bothered watching or reading the debate impressions yet, but my guess is everyone is saying the debate was dull, nobody scored any knockout punches and as a result, Obama won. I was excited for this debate, I thought Mac was going to let him have it, instead he proposes nationalizing bad mortgages and endorsed Warren Buffet as a potential Treasury Secretary and ignored Mitt Romney. Nice Job.
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Mosse 10/07/08 9:44:16 pm reply quote |
re: #232 NY Nana
Hi, Nana. I couldn't get in to LGF, either, but I'm heartened seeing the responses on this thread. If the economy can straighten out enough that it isn't front and center, day and night, McCain can win. Dick Morris is really pushing the information from the Annenberg Challenge papers -- finally examined -- and Obama's neo-Stalinist associations are breaking through the veil imposed by the MSM. And that's DESPITE the NYT puff-piece on Ayers and Obama.
We can't give up, nor should we be tempted to, after tonight. Obama bumbled, too; McCain's commitment and knowledgeability were clearly in evidence. Assuming the vote-count has any bearing on reality on election day, John can still win it. THAT, by the way, is something the whole Lizard community can work on after the election -- GET A RECEIPT FOR OUR VOTES! ATMs do it, but not the voting machines?
I'm really worried, too, but I'm so angry that these leftist creeps who are my age contemporaries, and who I, no doubt, protested alongside of, many years ago, have gained the power they have and, in their condescending pseudo-superiority, believe they are suited to rule us all -- that the anger itself keeps me going. These people ARE goofs from the neighborhood. They're nothing, and we have to face them down.
Enjoy those lovely kiddees, Nana! Thx. to you and all the Lizards for this community. We will defeat these people. We will.
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Adrenalyn 10/07/08 9:48:26 pm reply quote |
re: #295 leftover54
Why thank you !
you're very welcome
if I ever run for anything I'll hire you on my team
/though sadly, I am prevented from this as I do not exist
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committed 10/07/08 9:50:12 pm reply quote |
IMHO, there are two phrases McCain and Palin need to drop - most people get tired of hearing them repeated over and over.
Mr friends & maverick
Obama just needs to more truthful about how he plans to get the money to fund his programs. Why can't he just admit the source of those funds - "pull out of Iraq immediately" and "tax the crap out of the people actually paying taxes"?
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jpd158 10/07/08 9:50:47 pm reply quote |
No... a single, maybe a double. Certainly not a home run...
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medaura18586 10/07/08 9:55:36 pm reply quote |
John McCain needed to hit a home run tonight. Did he?
That he did not do. The entire debate was like a reheated leftover of the first one. Nothing new, nothing exciting. McCain is, despite his rhetoric, just as bad on the economy as Obama. If McCain only knew how to tell his dick from his thumb, he could have DESTROYED Obama. But he is, at his core, too sympathetic to his collectivist policies and too clueless to tear them down. They both just came across as bad copies of one another.
Obama is going to take the election by a landslide... what a disaster!
I can't believe after 2 years of prepping up for this presidential race, all we get are 3 shitty debates. Talk about anti-climax! Not nearly enough time and space for the public to get to know the candidates. Then again, judging by how silly the questions were, and how safe, stale, and boring the answers, I don't think I'd want to watch more than 3 of these things in total. I could barely get myself to sit through this one.
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galvani 10/07/08 9:58:37 pm reply quote |
Remember that statistic about more people voting for American Idol than the last POTUS election? This election, it seems as if that's 0bama's entire campaign strategy. Get many of the mouth breathers who are impressed with style to go for his act. I'm hoping the zero will dispel this crafted messiah image in one big moment after constant assaults on the most important thing to him, HIMSELF.
And I'm very glad there is no phone-in vote for this election.
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Adrenalyn 10/07/08 10:02:24 pm reply quote |
all Palin has to tell Americans is:
we will look as bad having a President who's middle name is Hussein
as Israel would with one named Hitler
but I agree with COMMITTED
drop the maverick and my friends
we all know that
go for the jugular on character
24/7
everything, selective service, where he was born, his brother, his father, his racist grandma, Ayers, Rezko, etc.....
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SaneinMN 10/07/08 10:07:12 pm reply quote |
This wasn't a debate. It was simply a Q&A forum, chock full of lack-luster questions and boring, talking point answers. Brokaw nailed each candidate.....on time allotments. Pointed clarifications during rebuttal? Not so much. Obama is all too easy of target, whether its economic or foreign policy. Our current "sub-prime financial crisis" could not set up any better for attacking Obama. ACORN strong-arming institutions and and the govt. into giving credit to bums, $100,000+ in campaign contributions from Freddie/Fannie in Obama's coffers, a Democratic scandal from top to bottom, and McCain fumbled the ball. Actually, McCain didn't fumble the ball, because you have to carry the ball first in order to be capable of committing a fumble. Simply mentioning that Freddie and Fannie are at the heart of the "crisis" without naming names (i.e. Obama!) does not constitute "carrying the ball".
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freeus 10/07/08 10:08:30 pm reply quote |
This in one sense is not McCain's race to lose, but ours to lose. No matter what he does, or does not do in regards to the debates, or slamming Obama with Ayers, Wright, Khalidi, Odinga, Alinsky, Farrakhan, and Rezko; we are the ones that have to fill in the gaps. We have to step up to the plate like never before in any election. We have for the past ten years or so been very disappointed with McCain on many issues. We have been frustrated with President Bush for the very same reasons. We just want someone to express our frustrations, and point out the guys who we know are committing the crimes. We just want for once, someone to step forward and blast the enemy.
If he is not going to go after all those listed above, or if he is not going after Obama on the issues, then we are going to need to spread the word to our neighbors, fellow church goers, co-workers, etc. This is our country, not just McCain's and Obama's to fight over. At each election I think this is the most defining election of our time, and then the next election comes and I think for sure this election cycle we are going down the proverbial toilet because the Democrats have given us the most radical opponent. I never thought there was such a thing as more radical than Hillary Clinton, but she looks like my Grandmother compared to Obama. I think we could come back from Hillary, but not Obama. And that sounds so defeatist doesn't it? Yuck, I hate saying that. I think we live in the greatest country ever, but as El Rushbo says we pay the highest price for ignorance or lack of education. Mega dittos to that and this debate was the highest example of sheer stupidity. We are trapped in the black hole of stupidity in this election and the only way out is for ALL of us to fight like hell even when our nominee is not exactly Rocky Balboa.
However, tonight was a winner for McCain in that Obama said healthcare was a "right", and did not dispute fines for those who did not opt into his program. We may have some ignorant Americans by the bushel barrel loads out there, but most people DO NOT like being told things like healthcare is a "right". Obama then went on to not disagree with McCain's assessment of Fannie Mae contributing to him, and his meeting with Iran with no preconditions. This mantra on "my record" is going to play with the public. They may actually go out there and look stuff up. Nevertheless, Obama does not have a record that plays.
Here is a little tidbit to pass along that McCain did not deploy on THE ONE, and that is Obama has not held a subcommittee meeting on Afghanistan, nor been to Afghanistan, nor met with Patraeus on Afghanistan, and so one wonders if he cannot take up Afghanistan, then how in the name of Hallelujah could he know what to do with Pakistan? Just wondering. As McCain said check out THE ONE'S record and see how THE ONE handled his responsibility on Afghanistan, and then remember this above all and spread the word- THE MAN CLAIMED OUR SOLDIERS WERE RAIDING VILLAGES AND KILLING WOMEN AND CHILDREN, HE SAID THE EXACT SAME CRAP AS MURTHA ABOUT OUR MILITARY IN AFGHANISTAN! He should not be elected dog catcher! You can jump up and down about Ayers and the lot, but the man has slimed our military and this nation many, many times. Look at his comments after 9-11, Obama's comments, look at those. Revolting!
We must not give up no matter what McCain does. This time our future really does hang in the balance. WE THE PEOPLE must rise up and with one mighty voice say, "NO!" This time not one person can sit back and say someone else is going to do the heavy work. We all need to be like the Lizard that ripped the Dems in the Japanese restaurant. LOL! Loved that!
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pummy 10/07/08 10:10:09 pm reply quote |
no fire from the "OLD" man. saddly McCain sounded more like an apologist than the POTUS. and NObama can sell anyone a 1980 Chrysler Reliant K, 4 cylinder with all tires fully inflated, dont you doubt it!
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pummy 10/07/08 10:14:03 pm reply quote |
Crap.. swap the ticket upside down Palin/McCain and we have a better shot. Ler her have a crack at the last debate with BHO, full force attack. What do we have to lose since we are already looking at the water swirling around the toilet bowl with our lackluster support going down the drain.
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thebronze 10/07/08 10:15:44 pm reply quote |
McCain needed a home-run. He hit a line-drive. Not enough.
This election is all but over and McCain is going to be the loser. It almost seems like the old man doesn't even want to be President any more.
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lostlakehiker 10/07/08 10:20:52 pm reply quote |
re: #26 bnichols10
Fox News is hammering McCain on his comments on buying up bad mortgages. I can't disagree with them...
Actually, that's a good idea. It's been done before, for that matter.
Any time you have homeowners seriously upside down in a mortgage they can walk away from, and rationally speaking, ought to walk away from, there's a problem and an opportunity.
Suppose they do walk away. You have to evict them. You have to find a new buyer. You get a depressed price for the house. The new buyer didn't exactly want that place anyhow. You have to practically bribe him to take it off your hands. The old owner, and the new one, both have to pay moving costs, and papers have to be drawn up and that's expensive.
That's wasteful compared to the possible alternative of renegotiating with the current owner. What if he's willing to pay more than you'd get if you threw him out and resold it, but not willing to be a martyr and pay the previous insanely inflated market price? You do better to renegotiate. He does better than to have to move and buy some other distressed property that's not really what he wants.
If he accepts your offer, it should come with some strings that aren't normally attached. This debt is not dischargeable by walking away from it. Maybe it's not dischargeable through bankruptcy, but more like student loans. The buyer has to pay, and the federal government is the collection agency.
If the buyer takes the deal, you can pretty much figure he'll pay or die trying. The upside for the buyer is that he gets to keep a property he wants and is already in, and at a heavy discount from the price he originally agreed to pay. The federal government pays the mortgage holder the price they would get for this very questionable asset at auction. Or something like that. The details would have to be worked out by finance and real estate professionals.
It could be a win, win. Every win-win situation should be exploited. Our financial institutions should sniff them out and systematically ensure that they're used.
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RedVoter 10/07/08 10:27:34 pm reply quote |
# 320 Pummy -
What a wonderful bombshell it would be if Palin directly challenged Obama to a one on the one debate with Obama. Now that would get attention and would fascinate both the media and the people. Or maybe a tag team, both tickets up there going at it. Something new, something fresh, something other than McCain letting Obama slither away.
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talk sick alaskan 10/07/08 10:32:03 pm reply quote |
I haven't posted on LGF for a long time. Just too busy.
We are all wishing McCain would come up with a Reagan-like zinger and blow this thing wide open. It still might happen in the 3rd debate, but it hasn't yet. I'm biased because I live in Alaska. I think Palin will continue to play the attack dog (pit bull) as a good VP candidate should. Obama will have to defend himself and it will have to be vetted in the MSM...albeit begrudgingly. Maybe like the Ayers story in NYT (I know. It wasn't really vetted, but it got discussed). I just heard on FNC that the "authorities" are investigating ACORN in NV. Surprisingly good news. This thing ain't over yet. I also heard Obama is outspending McCain, by a lot. I'm going to donate some $ to McCain's campaign.
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useless 10/07/08 10:38:22 pm reply quote |
Obama was like one of those slick guys that goes to the club and talks up the girls and says anything it takes to get them in bed just so he can screw them in the ass and not call them the next day.
McCain was like that guy who's pushing 40 at the club where the 23 year olds hangs out, trying to dressed "Hip", asking young girls "Buy you a drink?"
I miss Regan.
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captkirk35 10/07/08 11:11:46 pm reply quote |
More than anything else, the Left gets mileage with with its class warfare rhetoric. When Obama says he's only going to raise taxes on those making "more than 250,000 dollars", his words are usually left unchallenged. Middle America is left thinking, "well, that's seems fair to me. I don't mind if those rich guys are taxed. They can afford it." But it's estimated that over 70% of the people in this category are small business owners. Taking into account the Top Line only, they may seem wealthy. Taking into account the Bottom Line, after expenses, salaries, and yes.. TAXES are included, and suddenly, they don't look so rich, and most certainly, additional tax burdens will be felt. McCain must never let it go unsaid when Obama goes after this group. He must replace "wealthy" with "small business person", at each and every opportunity, because this is exactly what many of these "rich" are.. hard working business men and women who are the driving force behind our economy.
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Steffan 10/07/08 11:26:16 pm reply quote |
frankly, the kind of frog-marching I woould likd to see is Obama, his wife, Mr and Mrs. Reid and Mr. And Mrs. Resko frogmarched to incarceration off to the same Unuiual train.
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Wendya 10/08/08 12:19:49 am reply quote |
re: #122 Ward Cleaver
AIG Draws Fire for Executives' $440,000 Post-Bailout Retreat at Posh California Resort
Put them in the stocks.
Right after we put Barney Frank, Maxine Waters, Nancy Pelosi, Chris Dodd and every other politician that propped up Freddie and Fannie in the stocks.
It's easy to express outrage towards AIG but I'd rather direct my ire at the jackasses in Congress who made this financial melt down possible.
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Wendya 10/08/08 12:24:30 am reply quote |
re: #326 captkirk35
More than anything else, the Left gets mileage with with its class warfare rhetoric. When Obama says he's only going to raise taxes on those making "more than 250,000 dollars", his words are usually left unchallenged. Middle America is left thinking, "well, that's seems fair to me. I don't mind if those rich guys are taxed. They can afford it." But it's estimated that over 70% of the people in this category are small business owners. Taking into account the Top Line only, they may seem wealthy. Taking into account the Bottom Line, after expenses, salaries, and yes.. TAXES are included, and suddenly, they don't look so rich, and most certainly, additional tax burdens will be felt. McCain must never let it go unsaid when Obama goes after this group. He must replace "wealthy" with "small business person", at each and every opportunity, because this is exactly what many of these "rich" are.. hard working business men and women who are the driving force behind our economy.
I'm a small business owner who has worked at least 80 hours a week for several years now. Not to sound snotty about it but what in the hell do I owe someone who puts in their 35-40 a week and then bitches about what they don't have? I am seriously considering my options under an Obama Presidency and those options do not include expanding my business or hiring any new employees.
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Edgerrr 10/08/08 12:53:44 am reply quote |
I admire John for his tenacity but he’s been anemic in both debates. I foolishly hoped he’d “bring it” after the speech he gave yesterday.
If he doesn’t hit a grand-slam soon, he can start his next book “Worth the Fighting For 2008-Why I Wimped Out”.
/Dear heavenly Father, please give John his vigor back. Help him to destroy Osama and Obama. Amen.
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fsjeffrey 10/08/08 1:02:10 am reply quote |
I'd like to see the debate questions that Tom Brokaw chose not to use.
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akak 10/08/08 3:15:57 am reply quote |
re: #11 Sharmuta
He should have pounded the Fannie/Freddy thing more, but I'm glad he at least got a shot in, and 0bama didn't even refute he took the money.
lol frigin McCain got money from them too!
just because McCain got more is hardly a gripe.
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Twenglish 10/08/08 4:04:20 am reply quote |
Let's paraphrase this question differently ," Obama needed to sell a lie tonight, did he ?"
Well almost .
I think Obama had lots of help from Tom Brokaw , While McCain was given a broken Bat , and McCain still managed to "hang one" up in the Bleachers with it .
Was it luck? ,. or just bad timing on MSM's Obama Pitch ?
I think it was luck given the inescapable bias of the moderator.(Pitcher Tom Brokaw)
McCain has another Debate against Obama coming up and another chance to show America that he's no pinch hitter.
When the next debate moderator can listen to the umpire, and stop throwing underhanded grease ball pitches meant to prop up the Obama lies , we'll witness McCain hitting one Texas leaguer after another, and Johnny Mac will take that damn pennant .
Only this ain't baseball Folks , it's our beloved country at stake, and the MSM is the enemy !
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Blue Eyed Music Lover 10/08/08 4:27:41 am reply quote |
Charles, I couldn't get onto lgf during the entire debate. Not on IE, not on mozilla. Was it just traffic, or the videos that were causing that?
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FrogMarch 10/08/08 5:09:57 am reply quote |
McCain's problem is he doesn't now how to be direct when simple direct answers are all that's needed.
on health care for instance--
McCain needs to say this:
"Obama wants the government in charge of your health care.
I don't. I want to keep it private."
-or- an even stronger message from McCain:
"Obama, Nancy Pelosi, Barney Frank, and Harry Reid will all be in charge of your health care. The same people who brought down Frannie and Freddie will be in charge of your health care. Is that what you want my friends?"
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TheHardHat 10/08/08 5:14:58 am reply quote |
McCain = Dole
No nuts.
No guts.
With all the issues to hit Obama with McCain is playing pattycake.
I really hate wimpy Republicans. Then again, who really thinks McCain is a Republican?
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Death from Above 10/08/08 5:25:21 am reply quote |
#196 So?
Health care is available to anyone who wants it. You can purchase insurance on your own, chose to work for an employer that provides coverage as a part of the benefits package, or pay for it as you need it.
I get so tired trying to explain that concept to my students that always want a "free lunch".
Is it because we are dealing w/ life and death issues that somehow we think we deserve the best of the best medical service regardless of our ability to pay for it?
I have a driver's license which means I have to the right to drive, why can't I drive a Cadilac then? Answer, because I don't have the money to purchase it.
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rolus 10/08/08 5:30:59 am reply quote |
I am afraid that McCain looked like a doddering old fart. "My Friends". Stop it. McCain is a lame duck candidate, he couldn't get voted mayor of Phoenix at this point. It is very disapointing, I am wishing for Romney, he at least has a heart-beat. It's over the election will be close, but McCain will lose. We will need to hunker down during the coming depression, gather forxes and try agian in 8 years.
Sad day for America, and the World.
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gonecamping 10/08/08 5:48:54 am reply quote |
Obama's handlers prepared him well, he didn't stumble much over the expected questions culled from the field by one of O's press agents. (Now tell me the questions picked were not carefully evaluated by the unbiased moderator..snort).
Overall, McCain told a better story if you listened to the message. O was smooth talking, but talked a bunch of bull, and skated several questions.
I feel the question about Pakistan should not have been introduced, but McCain is right...the President should not be telling the enemy that he is coming in to kick his butt when Special Ops can slip in and get the job done without 'embarrassing' allies in power.
The statement that O made about " we honor your service" (may not be exact quote) to the Chief was very telling. O did not say 'I honor" , he hid behind the all encompassing "WE" because he does not respect or honor the military. The military is probably the only budget O would cut.
Overall, I give the debate to McCain, but wish he would look at Obama more during these type of events....it may appear that he is fearful of Obama (not that I'm a body language expert). Perhaps he avoids looking at O because he is disgusted by him, but it comes across as a sign of weakness to many watchers.
Heads up Senator McCain, take a look at your opponent once in a while during the next debate.
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Nancy 10/08/08 6:01:25 am reply quote |
Unfortunately, I don't think he hit a home run either.
He isn't a "dynamic" speaker and someone like myself is more interested in substance than style but alas, the smooth talking Obama --even if BS --will likely come across as more "presidential" in image.
The good news is: it didn't sway the public with John Kerry so all is not necessarily hinged on the debates. Historically MOST are pretty boring.
Both Republicans and Democrats have had their share of candidates who simply were not dynamite.
I don't think it all hinges on debates --but on substance of what they say or sometimes what they do NOT say or do.
Obama interrupting and constantly taking more time than allocated SHOULD be something that people noticed. It should also have been noticed that he mentioned going over the bills line by line and eliminating unncessary spending when in fact the president does NOT have a line item veto. That was an extremely naive comment and I was surprised that he wasn't called on it.
Personally I think McCain would have been better as more of his "hot tempered" self than appearing grandfatherly.
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Nancy 10/08/08 6:24:59 am reply quote |
I totally disagree that health INSURANCE is a right.
It's having access to affordable medical CARE. The costs of medical care have skyrocketed SINCE health insurance, since malpractice insurance and since medicaid-medicare. When hospitals can charge $5 for an aspirin or a bandaid something is wrong.
Basic preventative health care should be affordable enough with or without insurance. McCain actually mentioned more walk in clinics. But there are other alternatives as well to make it less costly for basic care.
It doesn't necessarily require mandated INSURANCE coverage for everyone to provide people with quality health care. What people need is access to affordable health care --not necessarily insurance for health care.
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mjwsatx 10/08/08 7:10:34 am reply quote |
McCain lost the election due to style. He looked old and confused at times. I could have done a better job against Obama than he did. Sadly, he is no better at communication than George Bush.
McCain should have had facts, figures, and other data at his fingertips to refute Obama. Why didn't McCain do a better job of explaining the Fannie-Freddie mess? He should have said that republicans are generally against government regulating the free markets, but this mess isn't about that. It's about government intrusion into the markets. He should have listed the times, dates, and bills that republicans proposed to stop this disaster.
This was a horrible debate for McCain. It was the nail in his coffin. I'm afraid that we need to prepare ourselves for the first Marxist President of the United States. G-d help us all.
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woodsman 10/08/08 7:25:02 am reply quote |
The un-asked follow-up
Browkaw: Sen. Obama, if health care is a right, should that right not be added to the Constitution by amendment, and if so, what other rights do you believe Americans do not have that should be enumerated in the Constitution?
The reply I believe the "O"mighty would give if he was being honest:
Well, uh, Tom, when I am president, we will uh, amend the Constitution to uh, first, add Amendment Number 28 - the Right to Health Care. And there are a few others that we can add at the same time. Those would include, uh, Amendment Number 29 - The Right to have an Abortion, Amendment Number 30 - would abolish Amendment Number 2 (The Right to Bear Arms) and most importantly Tom, I would offer Amendment Number 31 - The Right to Nationalize Industry and confiscate wealth on behalf of the "middle class" in America Tom, because that's only fair.
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Carolina Kathy 10/08/08 7:34:16 am reply quote |
I couldn't log onto LGF last night either.
JM did not lose last night - but the questions 'selected' by Brokaw were not townhall questions. They were the same old LSM questions designed to make Obama shine.
Michele Malkin asked who the Obama plant was in the townhall questioning last night, and an exceptionally brilliant observer discovered him: Tom Brokaw.
The debate was so boring that it won't help either of them, nor will it hurt. The issue being discussed today is JM's proposal about the mortgage buyout. That they are talking about JM is a win in itself.
Unfortunately JM managed to offend his base with the proposal. Conservatives have no voice in this election and that demoralizes the volunteers. But somehow perspective needs to be interjected, that JM may not be the best man, but like Rumsfeld says, you go to war with the army you've got.
Obama will be a disaster for our country.
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wltzacrsstxs 10/08/08 8:29:04 am reply quote |
#326, #329 ---
I couldn't agree more. I went to my 20 year high school reunion 2 years back. The "cool" kids who partied rather than studied or learned a useful skill are losers who can't or won't pay their mortgages. They are still at the bar every evening hanging out with their friends, instead of applying themselves and taking care of their families.
The kids who had a sense of responsibility turned out fine. The kids who didn't have an interest in college are successful plumbers, electricians, one guy even owns a little paving company (does driveways and the like). The kids who wanted to go to college - but didn't have parents that would save for it - figured out how to go. Some went to community college for a couple of years and lived at home, then transferred to State U (or a branch thereof) and worked and borrowed their way through.
Obama's class warfare crap assumes that those who don't have "stuff" don't have it through no fault of their own. That's just absolute bullshit. Get off your ass and hustle if you want stuff.
I was sick that McCain didn't call Obama out. His sob story about his mother and the pre-existing condition crap. THAT'S WHAT HIPAA FIXED, OBAMA. Doesn't he know (doesn't McCain know?) that for JOB PROVIDED health insurance, only very minimal pre-existing condition exclusions are allowed? And there's a very VALID reason for pre-existing condition limitations - otherwise, people would get insurance until they got sick. The only reason insurance works is because it spreads the outrageous cost of the very few who get really sick around a big pot of people who don't get so sick. If everybody in the pot is using all the health dollars in the pot, then, like musical chairs, the pot is empty when the music stops.
I've got a fix for the whole "insurance companies are so evil" that neither Obama nor McCain seems to know exist. (1) if you have a private health insurance policy, not from your job, you can sue under every single states insurance act. (2) if you have a job-related health policy, it's governed by ERISA. All private actions against insurers are barred by ERISA, except for a claim that you didn't get all that you were entitled to under the policy. Get rid of the litigation bar, and insurance companies who were dinking around with people would straighten up and fly right TOMORROW.
All of this leads to the biggest insight into the candidates last night. Obama thinks health care is a right. No matter what bad choices you've made about taking care of yourself, the rest of us have to pay for it. I call bullshit on that. I'm not interested in paying some slacker who won't works medical bills. He can pay his own damn bills. McCain hit it on the nose -- it is your RESPONSIBILITY to live your life in a way that you can pay your bills and take care of your family. Didn't anybody in the media see what a fundamentally un-American stance Obama took?
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eaglewingz08 10/08/08 8:33:25 am reply quote |
I agree that McCain needs to be more forceful on health care. When Obama says he doesn't want insurance companies to make decisions on your getting health care and brings up dear old commie mom, McCain should have hammered him by saying, he doesn't want the same government bureaucrats who mucked up the financial system to destroy the US healthcare system. He doesn't want a bureaucrat from the gov't who leaves office at 3:30 p.m. to be the one you have to go to for life and death decisions. He should say why Barry has more faith in the gov't's ability to run health care, after the financial disaster caused by Congress, Clinton and Fannie and Freddi, than in the private sector's proven track record on providing the best health care the world has ever known.
This wasn't a home run for McCain, but maybe a single with a stolen base.
He did not hammer Obama when he brought up states that have minimal standards like Delaware. Gee who is on someone's VP ticket who hails from Delaware and is up to his eyeballs in financial institution lobbyist money? That would be the appropriate place for the Biden reference (and not McCain's hair plug joke fwhich fell very flat).
Obama made numerous gaffes but the media won't cover them. We didn't do anything about the Holocaust in WWII? News to the millions who served in our armed forces. Guess DDAY was undertaken by some other country, not by the US? Guess we don't have any troops in Germany?
Must be some other country also with the initials USA. Of course you could make the argument that the USA under DEMOCRAT president FDR could have done MORE than merely battling Nazis and fascists in war battles, by bombing concentration camps and/or rail lines there, but to say we didn't do anything is preposterous.
Moreover, the Obama doctrine is gossamer. We're supposed to invade countries like the Congo, Rwanda, Somalia and Sudan where we don't have strategic interests, but solely for humanitarian objectives, but Iraq where mass killings, humanitarian interests, AND strategic interests all intersected, doesn't get any support from Obama. McCain should have nailed Obama on that, but hopefully will in last debate. Time is running out.
Obama's health care right also needs explaining. If it's a right not a privilege, then shouldn't it be free. We can freely speak and assemble, if health care is so important, it should also be subject to such freedom.
If it's a right, then the only way to limit it would be by a compelling interest, and would any court (liberal Obama justices) hold that costs/benefits analysis for withholding treatment was a COMPELLING interest? The system would go bankrupt in no time (faster than the democrap besieged mortgage sector) if it were a right.
Do patients want to have to wait months for routine or even life saving procedures as they do in Canada and Britain?
Next, How as it an Iraqi distraction that allowed Osama to escape to his rat hole, when he escaped in October 2001, and we didn't go to war with Iraq until March 2003. Even if we started placing troops for the war in March 2002, that was still months after the chief terrorist was safely encounced in Pakistan. Would a nuclear war with Pakistan be a 'distraction' from the WoT? Inquiring minds want Obama to state this clearly.
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AZDave 10/08/08 11:56:07 am reply quote |
re: #4 Sharmuta
The msm will spin this as a tie.
I think it was fairly clear from the Pakistan answers that 0bama is woefully unprepared for this job.
More than likely, the MSM will give it to Obama as a hands down win. Obama wins whether he shows up or not.
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AZDave 10/08/08 12:01:46 pm reply quote |
re: #44 JacksonTn
The election will be won by Palin and blogs and shit coming out about The One and people just not trusting him enough to pull the lever for The One because I know it is not a nice thing to say but .............. he just does not seem to be FOR AMERICA or like most Americans
Well, he's not. He's a citizen of the world! Ask him. He'll tell ya.
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AZDave 10/08/08 12:11:25 pm reply quote |
I predict that for the third debate, Obama won't even need to participate. He'll just be a the local diner eating his waffles and say "If you need me, just give me a call."
NBC et al. will declare Obama the winner. It's so frickin easy when integrity is meaningless.
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leftover54 10/08/08 6:29:54 pm reply quote |
Moreover, the Obama doctrine is gossamer. We're supposed to invade countries like the Congo, Rwanda, Somalia and Sudan where we don't have strategic interests...
But O'Bama just might have some interests in people
Islamofascisti) that do have interests in that part of the world...
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