this is bad 14 percent for obama already

Ron Paul!

Romney! Too bad he wasn't debating OB

I'm voting "Present."

(Even though I was mostly "Absent.")

McCain won. But not by enough

and I give Brokaw a thumbs up. Thought he was impartial. and even scolded Obama on more than one occasion

two thumbs down for the stupid format

and two thumbs down to the fools in the audience ( except for the retired navy chief and I give him 1 thumb down for wearing a pink shirt )

The idiots who got their faces on TV.

Don't let Michelle become the next Hillary.

re: #4 Dar ul Harb

I'm voting "Present."

(Even though I was mostly "Absent.")

Barry, is that you? (Kidding)

I was looking for tie. I chose McCain, but barely. McCain was able to get some points in that threw Obama off his game plan.

While you are at it, go vote in the stupid AOL poll too.

[Link: news.aol.com...]

I think the swing voters probably turned this off after 5 minutes

re: #7 George guy

Don't let Michelle become the next Hillary.

I just threw up a little bit in my mouth reading that. . .

I think it wasn't a clear win for McCain, but rather a subtle one.

Can we vote more than once in the LGF poll?

I voted for McCain because I don't believe much of what Obama says. And the possibility that Obama may well be our next president scares the hell out of me.

re: #13 Sharmuta

I think it wasn't a clear win for McCain, but rather a subtle one.

On a night when a clear win was really needed, unfortunately.

re: #13 Sharmuta

I think it wasn't a clear win for McCain, but rather a subtle one.

When it came to answers. . .McCain actually had some. . .

re: #14 Moe Katz

Can we vote more than once in the LGF poll?

Only when it goes MSM on ya:)

McCain and Obama could and should run as a ticket.

I think 'won' and 'lost' don't quite apply at this point.

It seems to have broken down into three parts:

1) Whose positions did you like better?

2) Who presented his ideas more effectively? And,

3) Who advanced his campaign?

I like McCain's positions, although he's freaking me out with talk of artificially re-inflating the housing market.

I don't think he presented his ideas as well as he could have.

And, yet, I think Obama probably advanced his campaign, because he stoppered McCain's ideas (perhaps by usurping them) and managed to come off as confident and not particularly socialistic.

McCain needs to call down thunder and lightening from here on out. Smash Obama on how is party -- the party of Barney Frank and Chuck Schumer and Fannie and Freddie -- got us into this mess.

re: #14 Moe Katz

Can we vote more than once in the LGF poll?

No, its not a Cook County poll.

re: #17 DisturbedEma

When it came to answers. . .McCain actually had some. . .

True.

Who was the child-bot in section A, third seat, front row? Old enough to vote?

We need a "Neither one won" option here.

coverage by all channels are SO predictable......

Fox had that rediculous group hand raise....someone actually said that 0bama answered questions.....I didn't see him answer him very many.......and McCain answered more, but neither answered all......

This is strange.

hatchlings registered and voted on the same day.

hmmmm

This just in:

Obama drops 24 points on intrade!

He didn't do as well as I had hoped.

But Obama really didn't answer any of the questions.

re: #5 Shug

McCain won. But not by enough

and I give Brokaw a thumbs up. Thought he was impartial. and even scolded Obama on more than one occasion

two thumbs down for the stupid format

and two thumbs down to the fools in the audience ( except for the retired navy chief and I give him 1 thumb down for wearing a pink shirt )

He appeared to be impartial. I give him a thumbs down.
Changed question focus when Obama faltered.
Several times.
I refuse to vote on "who won".

I don't think the debate mattered much either way. By and large, those for McCain, except for those sour-faced pundits on Fox, will say he did better. The MSM said Obama won before it even happened. I think McCain did better, and his closing statement was quite strong, but it wasn't the home run we were hoping for. At least he got the points in around Fannie/Freddie and Obama's place at the feeding trough.

re: #20 Cognito

I think McCain did rather better than that myself. That having been said, your last paragraph is spot on!

Er, "lightning."

I don't think the debate moved one voter from either side.

I think McCain, but not by much. And he certainly didn't get off a knock-out punch that he needed.

It may be up to us to push McCain over the top in votes.We all need to work togeather to see that people will vote McCain/Palin.So what can I do? Does anyone have a plan that my help will be of service to.
Im old,Im not dead yet.

re: #20 Cognito

Yeah, not much in the way of fireworks -- but McCain absorbed Obama's first punch and then came back swinging. Obama wasn't thrown off too badly at any point, but he did have to stay on defense.

re: #20 Cognito

I think 'won' and 'lost' don't quite apply at this point.

It seems to have broken down into three parts:

1) Whose positions did you like better?

2) Who presented his ideas more effectively? And,

3) Who advanced his campaign?

I like McCain's positions, although he's freaking me out with talk of artificially re-inflating the housing market.

I don't think he presented his ideas as well as he could have.

And, yet, I think Obama probably advanced his campaign, because he stoppered McCain's ideas (perhaps by usurping them) and managed to come off as confident and not particularly socialistic.

McCain needs to call down thunder and lightening from here on out. Smash Obama on how is party -- the party of Barney Frank and Chuck Schumer and Fannie and Freddie -- got us into this mess.

Mirrors my thoughts pretty closely. Those of who hang out her know who Obama is, the general public doesn't. McCain needs to out Obama, and make the red stick.

re: #26 Shug

This is strange.

hatchlings registered and voted on the same day.

hmmmm

Should we beat them soon?

re: #8 Dark_Falcon

Barry, is that you? (Kidding)

Now that was low, sir.

We'd better hope for all we're worth that the American people see McCain as the winner. Otherwise, it'll be his Waterloo, and our last chance to see America lose its status as the last Western state to vigorously stand against socialism in any form.

I thought Obama did a lot of hemming and hawing on the foreign policy questions.

Where was the neither vote category. Drudge had a vote with it, and that was the way I voted. Neither won the debate. I'm not sure if the polls will ever show McCain winning anything since you know who the media is in the tank for.

This proves that experience as a US Senator does not qualify one to be POTUS.

re: #38 MandyManners

Should we beat them soon?

I'll leave that to she who does it best

I think McCain won among those who have been paying attention to foreign policy issues. That isn't Obama's voter, though.

Curious. Drudge has McCain winning big. Again.

I doubt if the "debate" changed any minds.

re: #38 MandyManners

Should we beat them soon?

Pick a good one like Alderan, not like Dantooin, which is too remote for an effective demonstration.

There was a debate tonight?

Obama double talked, gave no specifics, and ducked a lot of questions. I'm still waiting for him to answer the "what don't you know question".

Barry's gum-flapping is to rhetoric as masturbation is to intercourse. IMHO.

Barry's gum-flapping is like Chinese food - an hour later, you're still confused by what he really thinks - if he does.

Fact is I thought most of these questions were irrelevant and inconsequential.

I have to go with many other posters-if there are people out there, at this late date, that really can not...just absolutely can not, figure out who they are voting for-then damn. Who thinks they will take the effort to analyze the debate to make up their minds? They just don't even need to be voting. They will in all likelihood get in the booth and flip a daggonned coin.

re: #34 RightMinded

I think McCain, but not by much. And he certainly didn't get off a knock-out punch that he needed.

I am not of the opinion that he needs a knockout punch. He needs to sow fear, uncertainty and doubt about Obama. It's much more difficult for Obama to use the FUD factor against McCain, as McCain has an extensive and fairly consistent record -- he's a known quantity.

Instead, Obama has to rely on enough ignorance to carry him to victory. I hope that the American electorate is just shy of the required number of ignorant voters....

0bama is the most unqualified person for this job the dems could have put up.

He actually thinks cutting out energy consumption would hurt Iran. Iran is selling their oil to China, not America. That was just a stupid answer.

Same with Russia's oil- it's going to China and europe, not America. WTF?!

He's incredibly ignorant on international issues and energy. Holy hell.

re: #39 Dar ul Harb

Now that was low, sir.

Only done in jest. No one on this thread is as low as Obama.

re: #15 rw in san diego

I voted for McCain because I don't believe much of what Obama says. And the possibility that Obama may well be our next president scares the hell out of me.

Fortunately, I think you're in the majority on that last point.

I needed a tie button... failing that, given what Mac had to do, I had to punch the Bambi button.

It's gonna take a long shower to get that stink off.

We're fucked.

re: #43 drmark

This proves that experience as a US Senator does not qualify one to be POTUS.

Especially when you're a first term senator who has spent most of that time running for President and not actually doing legislative work.

Neither one of them really answered any questions until McPain got rolling on foreign policy. Then Obama started to trip over his tongue when it came to the question of actually using FORCE to fix problems instead of words... All of a sudden that huggy-touchy stuff evaporated.

Obama will be percieved as having cleaned house on the economy, because he came pretty close to answering questions in terms of "how will this affect Joe X", instead of talking about broader abstractions. However, on substance, he admitted that he'll tax anybody making over 250K, which I believe is a bigger chunk of the economy than he seems to think... He always comes juuuuust to the edge of saying "We'll all have to pay, even you", but he only hints at it.

I'd say it's McPain by a nose, but it'll be passed off as a smashing Obama victory.

Which is funny, when you consider that Obama has basically adopted the rhetorical tactic of repeating McCain's answers in a populist framework, tossing in a couple of Bush references, and seasoning it all up with blatant lies about his own record.

re: #51 3 wood

Obama double talked, gave no specifics, and ducked a lot of questions. I'm still waiting for him to answer the "what don't you know question".

He answered it: everything.

I tell you all who won...

The fockin MSM and Tom fockin Brokaw!

He asked the same questions from the first debate, all that the messiah had to do is press the replay button and repeat himself...again...same BS..

Who the hell is picking up this IDIOT moderators?

I am so pissed off!

You know, by this time in the last debate, the McCain camp already had an ad out. They're slipping.

We need another poll:
Were you able to post during the debate?
Were you able to read LGF during the debate?
If not, how do you stand it?

I still think he screwed the pooch on the Pakistan question. Americans will not buy his spin- he wants to invade Pakistan- period.

Ron Paul!

}:/     [Oops, sorry, flashback ... ]

re: #46 lawhawk

Curious. Drudge has McCain winning big. Again.

(it is an easy poll to spam.)

re: #12 DisturbedEma

I just threw up a little bit in my mouth reading that. . .

But you know she would probably make a go at mirroring Hillary's political career given half a chance.

How much Iranian and Russian oil do we buy? Anyone know of a good pie-chart breakdown of our oil sources?

Did Claire McCaskill just say Obama will stimulate the economy by raising taxes? I thought you had to be smart to be in the congress. I stand corrected. What a complete puppet that woman is.

re: #27 gmsc

This just in:

Obama drops 24 points on intrade!

gotta be Ayers coverage.
bought on the rumor and are selling on the news

McCain needed a Palin-like performance to "win" the debate.

The MSM will have Obama winning this "debate" Joint Press conference by 9 to 1.

McCain was totally absent any fire in the belly and any perceptible desire to win this election.

The only thing that would have made this interesting is if it was strictly questions from the audience, half Dems and half Republicans, an equal number of questions from each, and Brokaw had no idea what was coming. I also would have liked more chances for the candidates to speak directly to each other, and McCain should have gotten in Obama's face and made him cry like a little girl.

re: #70 kevinmumaw

I thought you had to be smart to be in the congress.

Obama's in Congress.

...just sayin'

Barry on North Korea and nuclear power - used as an example that we should have spoken to them and used persuasion to get them to agree to be good.

Doesn't he know that Clinton GAVE them the tech on the understanding - wait for it - that they would be good and not use it for weapons? Of courses, Communists lie like a rug, always have, and always will.

Incredible ignorance.

Obama/Biden - Ignorant/Ignoranter '08

re: #48 buzzsawmonkey

I don't think there was a clear win. Obama lied blatantly, but with confidence--so his lies will be taken at face value (nothing new there). McCain bumbled a few times, did not press home when he could have; while he gave better answers a number of times (not always), they were not as well delivered, which in this kind of arena meant that he lost, since delivery is worth more than substance.

On material, McCain had the advantage. On delivery, Obama did--which means that Obama shaded McCain slightly. Not good.

I hate to disagree with you because you write decent poetry.
McCain had the advantage on both delivery and substance.
Obama appeared to know WTF was going on.
Tie.

re: #69 neocon hippie

How much Iranian and Russian oil do we buy? Anyone know of a good pie-chart breakdown of our oil sources?

Ask and receive (but no pie for you).

re: #69 neocon hippie

[Link: www.eia.doe.gov...]

re: #71 spidly

gotta be Ayers coverage.
bought on the rumor and are selling on the news

What are you talking about? He's still up at around 70%.

The dolts in the Obama campaign think that a tax increase counts as a spending cut. WTF?

this just in. intrade site swamped and not loading

re: #35 Oldasdirt

It may be up to us to push McCain over the top in votes.We all need to work togeather to see that people will vote McCain/Palin.So what can I do? Does anyone have a plan that my help will be of service to.
Im old,Im not dead yet.

You can participate in a virtual phone bank via your computer, which will let you call from your home to voters in swing states. You can get started right at http://www.johnmccain.com/

Yikes. Has anyone been reading about Iceland, by any chance?

The whole country has completely shut down. They asked us for help, and ended up going to Russia instead.

I think 0bama also came off as a bully and rule breaking trying to force follow up responses.

No- McCain didn't hit a homerun or deliver a KO, but barry looked like a child not ready for primetime.

re: #69 neocon hippie

No Iranian oil, not sure about Russian, not much though. Europeans are much more dependent on Russia than anyone.

re: #75 Catttt

Barry on North Korea and nuclear power - used as an example that we should have spoken to them and used persuasion to get them to agree to be good.

Doesn't he know that Clinton GAVE them the tech on the understanding - wait for it - that they would be good and not use it for weapons? Of courses, Communists lie like a rug, always have, and always will.

Incredible ignorance.

Obama/Biden - Ignorant/Ignoranter '08

Takes one to know one....

BHO thinks that the surge in Iraq was wrong, but that we need one in Afghanistan, to, among other things, kill a man that is probably already dead.

He thinks that intervention in Iraq was wrong, but wants to intervene in Darfur.

He wants to start new companies in the USA making energy efficient cars, and then tax the heck out those same companies.

He says we can't drill our way out of this mess, but seems to think that his jet plane can run on windmills or solar power.

He thinks it is the responsibility of the US government to provide free health care to all. I don't see anything in my constitution about that.

re: #69 neocon hippie

How much Iranian and Russian oil do we buy? Anyone know of a good pie-chart breakdown of our oil sources?

I'd love to see McCain lay out the truth that we here all know.

"Consensus diplomacy on Iran is a waste of time. Russia supports Iran. Russia also supplies Europe's gas. Connect the fuckin' dots, my friends."

Would love to hear more specifics about this Justice League that McCain is proposing... So many things that should be headline developments, really great new ideas, that get lost these days... He needs to come out and say that the U.N. is a waste of, well... Everything.

re: #69 neocon hippie

How much Iranian and Russian oil do we buy? Anyone know of a good pie-chart breakdown of our oil sources?

Oil is fungible. The oil field it comes from is not that important. The per barrel price is what really matters.

Of course, having a monopoly on the oil and gas pipelines can be a real advantage both economical and politically.

McCain won by a nose, but he came across as a dottering old fart and Obama as a slick inexperienced liar.

Neither was impressive on the economic crisis, but on balance McCain was a bit better because he articulated more of a plan.

To my horror McCain came across as weak on Israel, in that he said that China and Russia would prevent the US from striking Iran if Iran attacks Israel. Obama was actually stronger in his professed support, and it is only because I don't believe or trust him that I didn't give the debate to Obama right then and there.

re: #83 Cognito

Yikes. Has anyone been reading about Iceland, by any chance?

The whole country has completely shut down. They asked us for help, and ended up going to Russia instead.

Soros.

I guarantee this.

ONCE AGAIN CLAIRE BEING CLASSY:

[Link: www.politico.com...]

spits on earpiece before she gives it to Romney .......

re: #88 Pawn of the Oppressor

Please, no wonder twins!

Palin set McCain to beat the messiah tonight and McCain blew it..

Thanks to our LEFT MEDIA MODERATORS of course..

re: #72 RTLM

McCain needed a Palin-like performance to "win" the debate.

The MSM will have Obama winning this "debate" Joint Press conference by 9 to 1.

McCain was totally absent any fire in the belly and any perceptible desire to win this election.

Any fire in the belly beginning to show was extinguished by Brokaw changing the subject and tone of the questions. Advantage: Brokaw.

re: #83 Cognito

Yikes. Has anyone been reading about Iceland, by any chance?

The whole country has completely shut down. They asked us for help, and ended up going to Russia instead.

I have. It is a scary situation to watch.

If it comes down to their performance, I think it was a tie. On the issues, I think McCain won.

McCain looked tired at times. He lacked energy at times. But he was more believable. He picked up in the end.

Off camera, he looked tired. That might bother some people. I don't know why.
I'd vote McCain's brain floating in a beaker before I'd vote for Obama.

Obama looked mechanical, rehearsed -- at least to me.

I hope I'm wrong but I don't think this is going to help McCain.

re: #69 neocon hippie

It's not a chart, but: [Link: www.eia.doe.gov...]

You McCainiacs are voting with your hearts, rather than your heads. You know Obama won again, and by more than in the first debate. I repeat, if I can survivve the Reagan/Bushes, you will survive Obama's presidency.

WWOD? What would Orianna Do?

Fight like hell that's what. I know the principled people are on our side - more or less, but the unprincipled liars, charlatans, and socialists are on Obama's side, and I will be damned if I am going to sit still and let this happen without a big old cat fight on my behalf.

Senator indeed. This is why a senator is rarely a candidate for president - they are sonorous - the both of them.

Let' see more Palin Power - and Let's see the Both of them in more commericals. Where are the Palin McCain commercials? I'm sick as puke of seeing that racist Obama in my living room lying to my face. I didn't like it when BJ aws lying to me, and I sure as hell hate it now when Obama is lying to me.

This is it. The Vichy Democrats are in power - and only us partisan resistance fighters can save the country.

Fight with us! Make the sacrifice NOW! Volunteer! Donate! Fight!

That is all.

re: #87 rawmuse

The Dems have been trying to tell us for 5 years now that the GWOT is a man hunt for that 1 bastard. They just cannot grasp the fact that more is at stake than the killing of UBL.

Charles, I could not vote either way. I do not think anyone won, and the American people lost by this sham of a "Town Hall" "debate," organized and orchestrated by the MSM. Disgusting.

re: #58 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)

I needed a tie button... failing that, given what Mac had to do, I had to punch the Bambi button.

It's gonna take a long shower to get that stink off.

We're fucked.

I disagree.
The focus group thought McCain was better on the economy.
That has been his biggest stumbling block.
Continue on the stump about rezco/ayers etc.
It will be enough to put him over the top.

Again, the only polls that matter are the scientific ones, that estimate public opinion. We'll wait and see, but I have a feeling like the other two debates that these polls will show a win for the Obama ticket. In any event, no game-changers in this debate, so the current race dynamics should stay pretty much as they've been.

Also- I loved McCain's shot at barry about 0bama voting for a Bush-Cheney oil bill loaded with pork.

Hopefully- that sunk into a few skulls out there.

What about Ron Paul. I know it's a dead horse, but he still needs to be in there.

I REALLY DON'T THINK ONE WORD OBAMA SAID WAS HIS REAL BELIEFS IT WAS ALL FROM THE POLLS. MOVE TO THE CENTER B.S.

I think the whole "debate" concept (not anything even remotely like a debate, by the way) is for the birds, and should have been thrown out after 1960. Or maybe 1860. Lincoln and Douglas had a real, road-show series of debates going, and people showed up, listened and weighed the ideas. But people were harder up for entertainment back then, and sometimes I think they were smarter, too. The modern debates amount to nothing, change no minds, and produce nothing but tired analysis by biased analysts. Johnson and Nixon were right in telling the debate people to go get stuffed.

I have to admit a feeling of glee seeing somebody finally say "NO" to Obama, when Blowkaw shut down his request for a follow up.

"John, John, that's not true John-"
"Shut the fuck up, Barry. Next question."

re: #50 macintush

There was a debate tonight?

No, this is Charles' weekly hamster stress test. The debate is set up by the Secret HQ at the Denver Airport in order to make people think that the real purpose is selecting a president.

re: #99 Red Lion

We survived Carter's presidency, but the Middle East is having a hard time of it still.

[Link: www.msnbc.msn.com...]

Sinking lower. . .digging faster!

re: #43 drmark

This proves that experience as a US Senator does not qualify one to be POTUS.

Obviously you are talking about Obama.

re: #92 JacksonTn

ONCE AGAIN CLAIRE BEING CLASSY:

[Link: www.politico.com...]

spits on earpiece before she gives it to Romney .......

What a trailer-dwelling trash bag.

re: #10 Catttt

Just went a voted in aol,...the libs and leftist are smothering it as usual...

Please people, quit saying that McCain "needed" to hit a home run in this debate. Since it's pretty obvious he didn't, what you're saying is the election is over and he lost. So let's all just give up and stay home on election day, right?

We have to remember that WE are political wonks and we watch these debates with our expections set INCREDIBLY high, and we are bound to be disappointed. The majority of people do not watch with the same expectations.

re: #99 Red Lion

You McCainiacs are voting with your hearts, rather than your heads. You know Obama won again, and by more than in the first debate. I repeat, if I can survivve the Reagan/Bushes, you will survive Obama's presidency.

BS.

I paid my fee for life by enduring the freaking Clinton years. The 8 year kegger that gave us 9/11.

Yeah, what no idiot Reform party or 3rd party du jour this year?

It would have made it more interesting if Kucinich was there from the Peace party, or Ron Paul from the nazi party

OK, so most of the talking heads, plus that Luntz Fox focus group, I trust say McCain won on the economy, lost on foreign policy. If this is true, I have hope for the third debate, on the economy pure and simple.

PS: I don't think he lost on foreign policy. I could not understand a single Obama answer.

re: #112 DisturbedEma

[Link: www.msnbc.msn.com...]

Sinking lower. . .digging faster!

I refuse to click on an MSNBC link. Just tell us how far up the leg the tingle goes, and we'll leave it at that.

re: #80 rp1138

The dolts in the Obama campaign think that a tax increase counts as a spending cut. WTF?

I went to business school with these types of clowns. They didn't get it then, and changed majors to Wymen's Studies or whatever, but they still think they know economics. They are the static model believers in a dynamic model reality. In other words, they think if they raise tax rates, it will have no effect on the behavior of the taxed.

re: #51 3 wood

Obama double talked, gave no specifics, and ducked a lot of questions. I'm still waiting for him to answer the "what don't you know question".

Yes, as he always does, and once again, McCain didn't really call him on it as forcefully as he could and should have. Easy point McCain could have made but didn't: "Barack Obama just promised you a big tax cut and hundreds of billions of "investments" the government would make and didn't once tell you how he's going to pay for it".

Would that be too freakin hard for you to make that point, John?

As Mick said to Rock in Rocky 2....don't just lay down in front of him, FIGHT. Show them you aren't just some bum.

Time is running out "my friend". Better let Sarah get on with the hard stuff if you're not up to it....And I want you to win, John.

methinks i smell gamy buttocks...

re: #99 Red Lion

You McCainiacs are voting with your hearts, rather than your heads. You know Obama won again, and by more than in the first debate. I repeat, if I can survivve the Reagan/Bushes, you will survive Obama's presidency.

Irony Alert

I might survive Obama, but others may not, in places like Tel Aviv or NYC.

Obama on foreign policy is, to paraphrase Churchill, a cipher wrapped in a soft gooey nougat, inside a soap bubble.

What may appear clean and articulate on the surface is actually a mess full of holes.

re: #99 Red Lion

You McCainiacs are voting with your hearts, rather than your heads. You know Obama won again, and by more than in the first debate. I repeat, if I can survivve the Reagan/Bushes, you will survive Obama's presidency.

Red is a color that looks good on you ........... ass

That was not one of the best debates. I thought Tom B. did not have control of the debate. Barry looked like a deer in the headlights.

Is there a link to the transcript yet? I thought barry screwed up his numbers on small businesses and taxes too, but I need to see the transcript to confirm it.

re: #55 Sharmuta

0bama is the most unqualified person for this job the dems could have put up.

He actually thinks cutting out energy consumption would hurt Iran. Iran is selling their oil to China, not America. That was just a stupid answer.

Same with Russia's oil- it's going to China and europe, not America. WTF?!

He's incredibly ignorant on international issues and energy. Holy hell.

What are we going to do to change our nominating system?

re: #111 jaunte

Carter gave us the CRA and JP Stevens on the SCOTUS, in addition to the Iranian mullahs and Taliban. We haven't survived him yet!

re: #114 doppelganglander

What a trailer-dwelling trash bag.

Why is that woman everywhere these days? What are they grooming her for? I.can't.stand.her.

I've got one of those "Obama Moles" next to my nose too. Does that mean I get free stuff?

I watched the debate from my perspective. I am a Ph.D. Theoretical Quantum Chemist. I look for substance in thought, reason, ability to reference supporting ideas, base of knowledge and experience, and the ability to synthesize conclusions based upon the previously mentioned abilities and skills. In the last question, I saw the epitome of understanding of other cultures (in this case Eastern philosophy) when McCain correctly answered the question about "what do you not know..." by saying that he does not know the future.

Over all, however, I witnessed Yoda (as John McCain) schooling young Anakin Skywalker, saying, "Judge me by my age, do not!" At this point, he drops his cane, whips out his lightsaber, and removes all Anakin's weapons and clothes without even touching a hair on Anakin's hand.

re: #99 Red Lion

You McCainiacs are voting with your hearts, rather than your heads. You know Obama won again, and by more than in the first debate. I repeat, if I can survivve the Reagan/Bushes, you will survive Obama's presidency.

Reagan did not hate his country. . .Obama does

Reagan did not tax people to death. . .Obama will

Reagan did not run from a fight. . .Obama will

You are entitled to your opinion, but I challange you to quote me any CLEAR answer Obama gave tonight about anything, and also would like to hear you defend his associations with the banks that gutted the economy. . .

re: #96 gmsc

I have. It is a scary situation to watch.

Iceland may be having a economic meltdown, but scary doesn't begin to approach the situation in Pakistan.

The Pakistani government is nearly bankrupt (economically - though it's not far from that politically as well), the Islamists are running amok in the frontier provinces, and it's a nuclear armed country to boot.

Pakistan’s credit rating is nearing bankruptcy and its economy cannot afford sanctions by the world powers, Defence Secretary Kamran Rasool told the Senate standing committee on Defence in a briefing on Tuesday.

Pakistan’s financial position was very week, he said, and the country could not talk about taking on the US. He said Pakistan could not succeed against terrorists without co-operation and intelligence-sharing with the United States and that if Pakistan pulled out of the alliance, it would have to bow down after international powers imposed sanctions on it and declared it a terrorist state.

re: #125 Dar ul Harb

Obama on foreign policy is, to paraphrase Churchill, a cipher wrapped in a soft gooey nougat, inside a soap bubble.

What may appear clean and articulate on the surface is actually a mess full of holes.

Ward, or Winston?

re: #99 Red Lion

You McCainiacs are voting with your hearts, rather than your heads. You know Obama won again, and by more than in the first debate. I repeat, if I can survivve the Reagan/Bushes, you will survive Obama's presidency.

Hmmmmm......

Red Lion

Registered since: Aug 4, 2004 at 11:14 am
No. of comments posted: 54
No. of links posted: 0

Hmmmmmm......

Long-time lurking member of the opposition?

re: #116 Tigger2005

Please people, quit saying that McCain "needed" to hit a home run in this debate. Since it's pretty obvious he didn't, what you're saying is the election is over and he lost. So let's all just give up and stay home on election day, right?

We have to remember that WE are political wonks and we watch these debates with our expections set INCREDIBLY high, and we are bound to be disappointed. The majority of people do not watch with the same expectations.

I was just thinking about this- who has been spreading this meme? The msm? I'm not buying their bullshit.

re: #38 MandyManners

Should we beat them soon?

Is this Ohio?

re: #90 sparrowlake

McCain won by a nose, but he came across as a dottering old fart and Obama as a slick inexperienced liar.

Neither was impressive on the economic crisis, but on balance McCain was a bit better because he articulated more of a plan.

To my horror McCain came across as weak on Israel, in that he said that China and Russia would prevent the US from striking Iran if Iran attacks Israel. Obama was actually stronger in his professed support, and it is only because I don't believe or trust him that I didn't give the debate to Obama right then and there.

That isn't what he said.
He said they would veto it if it went to the UN
He also said that he would never allow another Holocaust.
That said it all.

re: #99 Red Lion

You McCainiacs are voting with your hearts, rather than your heads. You know Obama won again, and by more than in the first debate. I repeat, if I can survivve the Reagan/Bushes, you will survive Obama's presidency.

[deleted]

re: #54 stuiec

I am not of the opinion that he needs a knockout punch. He needs to sow fear, uncertainty and doubt about Obama. It's much more difficult for Obama to use the FUD factor against McCain, as McCain has an extensive and fairly consistent record -- he's a known quantity.

Instead, Obama has to rely on enough ignorance to carry him to victory. I hope that the American electorate is just shy of the required number of ignorant voters....

The problem is that Obama is such a smooth liar, making up facts on the fly, that folks that are not political junkies (unlike the people here) believe him and he comes off sounding totally rational. If McCain does not hit him hard and reveal Obama for what he is, it won't come out. The MSM certainly won't help.

This debate was B-O-R-I-N-G! Really nothing new from the first debate. McCain did NOT take the gloves off, didn't shake it up. He should stay home and send Sarah. McCain didn't lose the debate, but he did himself no favors.

re: #120 gmsc

I refuse to click on an MSNBC link. Just tell us how far up the leg the tingle goes, and we'll leave it at that.

Headline "NBC questioning McCain's POW claim of torture"

re: #133 SuperdaveTWC

...and then he hits him in the face with a pie?

re: #119 arethusa

OK, so most of the talking heads, plus that Luntz Fox focus group, I trust say McCain won on the economy, lost on foreign policy. If this is true, I have hope for the third debate, on the economy pure and simple.

PS: I don't think he lost on foreign policy. I could not understand a single Obama answer.

Which is why people think he won on that issue.
I still maintain that Brokaw steered things to Obama advantage.
What amazes me is that it was a draw, given the way Brokaw changed subjects while "appearing to be hard on Obama". He was hard on Obama when there was no chance Obama could recover.

re: #20 Cognito

McCain needs to call down thunder and lightening from here on out. Smash Obama on how is party -- the party of Barney Frank and Chuck Schumer and Fannie and Freddie -- got us into this mess.

AGREED!... Why have they not brought this out? why have they not talked about F.Rains being in Obama's campaign?

McCain better on substance, Obama better on tomfoolery.

Which means Obama won.

I hate it, but that's how I see it.

re: #137 NomadOfNorad

Hmmmmmm......

Long-time lurking member of the opposition?

Troll.

OT: Black Congressmen Declare Racism In Palin’s Rhetoric

re: #138 Sharmuta

I was just thinking about this- who has been spreading this meme? The msm? I'm not buying their bullshit.

So it's -- ahem -- 'bull' that John McCain needed to hit a home run tonight? A deception by the media?

Some people are meant to be president, and some aren't. In this case, we have two of them, who should never be anywhere near the White House. McCain has run such a lackluster campaign, that one has to question how badly he wants to be President. And the Audacity of Dope, Our Beloved Leader, strung out out on his nicotine patches and Marxism, is a disaster of Biblical proportions waiting to happen.

Good night, all.

Fight the good fight!

re: #99 Red Lion

You McCainiacs are voting with your hearts, rather than your heads. You know Obama won again, and by more than in the first debate. I repeat, if I can survivve the Reagan/Bushes, you will survive Obama's presidency.

Of course we can survive. But like the Carter administration, we have to figure how many years would it take to recover from an Obama administration. We have still not yet recovered from the Carter years.

If I were a Democrat, I would be more worried that Obama would win. If he won and completed his stated plans, I don't think we would see a Democrat in the Presidential office in the years 2012-2028. Minimum.

Posted on last thread, but it died:

OT

Hey 3 wood, or any smart lizard:

How low can the market actually go, numbers wise? It can't go down to zero, because tens of millions of us have 401ks that "buy" shares for us every payday, and we're not getting out.

What's the worst "bottom" there could be?

re: #120 gmsc

I was disappointed - they didn't show the John Kerry/Jane Fonda tribute wall in the museum.

If Obama wins, we'll all be getting visits from the secret service like this soccer mom in Lufkin, TX did.

Basically, an Obama supporter called her and the soccer mom told her she wasn't voting for someone who voted four times for babies to die in closets in hospitals. The Obama supporter then reports her to the Secret Service for making a threat against Obama. NOT A HOAX! It's in the local paper.

[Link: www.lufkindailynews.com...]

They will be hunting you down, Charles and Zombie. NO KIDDING.

The sleeper trolls are out, trying to demoralize us. Fuck that.

re: #130 MJBrutus

Carter gave us the CRA and JP Stevens on the SCOTUS, in addition to the Iranian mullahs and Taliban. We haven't survived him yet!

Um, Gerald Ford nominated Justice Stevens.

re: #128 Sharmuta

Is there a link to the transcript yet?

From CNN: Transcript of second McCain, Obama debate

re: #121 kevinmumaw

Their denial of the Laffer curve is crazy.

Its simple. If the tax rate is 0, no revenue will be collected. If the tax rate is 100%, no revenue will be collected. The revenue vs tax rate curve increases for a while, peaks out, and then decreases. That is as simple as pie. To me , anyone who denies that is just plain stupid.

The problem is, its not clear what the inversion point will be. But to moonbats, higher tax rates will always, always, always increase revenue.

Well damn, I've never lived under socialism before.

/all that money spent on winning the Cold War and here we are about to surrender anyway, go figure, welcome to Europe

spinning wheel of death

re: #162 Killian Bundy

Well damn, I've never lived under socialism before.

/all that money spent on winning the Cold War and here we are about to surrender anyway, go figure, welcome to Europe

Don't worry. Your house is valuable. The government says so.

re: #90 sparrowlake

I think McCain merely meant that the UN Security Council would not approve a strike, and that the USA would have to act without UNSC approval.

re: #151 Cognito

So it's -- ahem -- 'bull' that John McCain needed to hit a home run tonight? A deception by the media?

I would love to answer you on this, but I have to wait for my Senators to get back to me on their investigation.

re: #150 USCMSNE

OT: Black Congressmen Declare Racism In Palin’s Rhetoric

Whatever. I'm not a racist, so that slur won't work.

I don't care about the color of his skin, but the content of his character.

OBAMA got style points and poll reading points I DON'T WANT A FUCKING PRESIDENT WITH STILE OR POLL READING POINTS. John did better on the econ than i expected and top noch on being commander in chief.

re: #147 BODYGUARDEAGLE

McCain needs to call down thunder and lightening from here on out. Smash Obama on how is party -- the party of Barney Frank and Chuck Schumer and Fannie and Freddie -- got us into this mess.

AGREED!... Why have they not brought this out? why have they not talked about F.Rains being in Obama's campaign?

Actually, I think it might be more likely for Palin to do this. She has the fiestiness to pull that off. Repeatedly. But, you're right, McCain needs to do it, too.

re: #99 Red Lion

You McCainiacs are voting with your hearts, rather than your heads. You know Obama won again, and by more than in the first debate. I repeat, if I can survivve the Reagan/Bushes, you will survive Obama's presidency.

What's Bill Clinton, chopped liver?

Sheesh, no respect.

re: #166 Sharmuta

Right. Let me know when you're ready to answer.

Changing your mind?

re: #92 JacksonTn

ONCE AGAIN CLAIRE BEING CLASSY:

[Link: www.politico.com...]

spits on earpiece before she gives it to Romney .......

She strikes me as a bit stupid. Kind of like Cynthia McKinney, just looks at you with a blank stare and repeats memorized party lines.

Funny how Victor Davis Hanson predicted before Obie's nomination that he would take the Dems, lemming-like, over the precipice as soon as his skeletons tumbled out of the closet. Very naive about what the media would do to hide the bones.

re: #144 DisturbedEma

Headline "NBC questioning McCain's POW claim of torture"

Wow! They're posting the POW teaparty libel? Wow, McCain must have kicked Obama's erudite ass! Letting Obama ad lib was a bad move on the dems part.

re: #19 RTLM

McCain and Obama could and should run as a ticket.

AMEN!

update

re: #151 Cognito

So it's -- ahem -- 'bull' that John McCain needed to hit a home run tonight? A deception by the media?

They couldn't possibly be partial towards Obama and setting the tone for this whole election.

/

re: #99 Red Lion

You have to make it another three months to survive the Bushes. Don't count your chickens before they hatch.

Scientific polls are in (from CNN and CBS), showing a clear Obama win among the population of debate watchers in general, and among the population of undecided debate watchers.

re: #130 MJBrutus

Carter gave us the CRA and JP Stevens on the SCOTUS, in addition to the Iranian mullahs and Taliban. We haven't survived him yet!

Don't leave out the Department of Education and FEMA.

Gifts that keep on giving taking.

re: #99 Red Lion

You McCainiacs are voting with your hearts, rather than your heads. You know Obama won again, and by more than in the first debate. I repeat, if I can survivve the Reagan/Bushes, you will survive Obama's presidency.

We have questions about 0bama's eight years in the state senate.

What happened to his records?

You would think 0bamabots would crow about his senatorial experience, but they are virtually silent.

Must be hiding something.

Alan Colmes is an idiot!

The reason I thought The One, won - is because I think most people are just hearing the candidates and not listening to them. If they did, then McCain would be wiping Amading-dong's and Bill Ayres's arse with Obama by now.

re: #154 Outrider

And given the kind of people whom Obama is attracted to (radicals, criminals, frauds, etc.), I'm betting Obama wouldn't be in office for a full four years -- I'm figuring impeachment proceedings, etc.

re: #99 Red Lion

Fuckin' commie

re: #174 swamprat

Wow! They're posting the POW teaparty libel? Wow, McCain must have kicked Obama's erudite ass! Letting Obama ad lib was a bad move on the dems part.

Video link at Fox. . .on O' Really :)

When looking over my continued disconnection from the Democratic party, it is amazing to me that being a member of the Armed Forces is sooooo devalued. And, now, somehow, the msm is going to spin his time in prison at a POW? Gottenyu!

Once again, the only important issue that voters care about is the economy, and once again, McCain didn't hit hard enough. Never mentioned Howard Raines, Jim Johnson, Barney Frank, Maxin Waters, or Obama advisor Penny Pritzker. He didn't mention that these economic problems have very little to do with the Bush administration and go back to the abolishment of Glass/Steagall under Clinton and Clinton's own relaxation of lending standards, mandating to Fannie/Freddie.

Fuck.

re: #180 Mr. Sandman

Scientific polls are in (from CNN and CBS), showing a clear Obama win among the population of debate watchers in general, and among the population of undecided debate watchers.

We don't go to your sandbox dailyshitheads ........ why do you come here?

re: #160 justadot

Thank you.

Here it is:

Only a few percent of small businesses make more than $250,000 a year. So the vast majority of small businesses would get a tax cut under my plan.

This needs to be fact checked- I think it's bull.

re: #180 Mr. Sandman

Scientific polls are in (from CNN and CBS), showing a clear Obama win among the population of debate watchers in general, and among the population of undecided debate watchers.

There is no such animal as a scientific poll from CNN and CBS. You are living in la-la land.

re: #175 soccerdad

AMEN!

That would. . .I cannot even TYPE what I mean. . .ICK ICK

re: #130 MJBrutus

Carter gave us the CRA and JP Stevens on the SCOTUS, in addition to the Iranian mullahs and Taliban. We haven't survived him yet!

And he gave away the Panama Canal for nothing.

re: #20 Cognito

I think 'won' and 'lost' don't quite apply at this point.

It seems to have broken down into three parts:

1) Whose positions did you like better?

2) Who presented his ideas more effectively? And,

3) Who advanced his campaign?

I like McCain's positions, although he's freaking me out with talk of artificially re-inflating the housing market.

I don't think he presented his ideas as well as he could have.

And, yet, I think Obama probably advanced his campaign, because he stoppered McCain's ideas (perhaps by usurping them) and managed to come off as confident and not particularly socialistic.

McCain needs to call down thunder and lightening from here on out. Smash Obama on how is party -- the party of Barney Frank and Chuck Schumer and Fannie and Freddie -- got us into this mess.

Gee Cog ... Impressive. Really!

re: #192 really grumpy big dog Johnson

There is no such animal as a scientific poll from CNN and CBS. You are living in la-la land.

The disclaimer states it is not a scientific poll. . .

re: #180 Mr. Sandman

Scientific polls are in (from CNN and CBS), showing a clear Obama win among the population of debate watchers in general, and among the population of undecided debate watchers.

And we've seen how many times that those self-reported "undecideds" were campaign managers, leftist "activists" and others that are no more undecided than Todd Palin.

/I don't trust them

Obama took his best shots when he knew that Brokaw was going to change the question. However, when McCain took a shot, Obama insisted on getting in a response.

I'm very worried that the voters just won't picture McCain as being tough and confrontational enough as it looked like he couldn't go toe to toe with Obama tonight. It's not like Obama went toe to toe, either, but he didn't have to. McCain acted like he was on offense, but it looked like a white shirt scrimmage.

To McCain's detriment, the format was not as advertised, but John was pulling his punches, or worse, just didn't have it in him tonight. A brawler would have laid waste to Obama, and John has been Mr. Nice Guy in the Senate for too long. Rudi or Mitt would have destroyed Obama tonight. Even Huckabee would have done better.

What good is it for Sarah to be going with guns blazing, if John can barely get his gun out of the holster?

Put it this way.
Obama did not win. He lied.
He had no game and was outclassed just by McCAIN showing up.

McCAIN was low key and dull. He was Honest.

Not hard to pick a winner.

updating via comments

re: #155 Palandine

Posted on last thread, but it died:

OT

Hey 3 wood, or any smart lizard:

How low can the market actually go, numbers wise? It can't go down to zero, because tens of millions of us have 401ks that "buy" shares for us every payday, and we're not getting out.

What's the worst "bottom" there could be?

Just as the numbers can be inflated with a "bubble", they can be equally deflated with a "panic".

I don't think there is a specific number. After a while the fear and panic sort of feeds on itself, and that's what we are seeing. I think things could drop lower, absolutely. But sooner or later, things just become ridiculously cheap and those with steady nerves and cash start to buy in.

There are probably already stocks at or near that level (though no, I am not going to try and name examples).

re: #155 Palandine

7000 would be a 50% decline from the all time high. It would mean another 26% decline from where we are. I don't think we're in for that rough a patch. I think it's possible to see another 1,000 points come off the Dow, but then again, I don't think anyone knows where the bottom will be - or whether the bailout will make things worse or better...

McCain won; he had actual, realistic answers for most of the questions, in my opinion. Having said that, I don't believe this was a particularly insightful debate. And c'mon--did anyone actually think Brokaw was going to allow a question about Obrahmin's affiliations into the mix? No one in the MSM is about to serve up a hanging fastball down the middle like that for McCain to blast over the scoreboard.

As a town hall format, this debate sucked--not because of McCain, but because Brokaw seemed to steer the debate away from any semblance of a true town hall debate by interjecting remarks right and left.

In order to put the smack-down on E-I-E-I-O by uncovering associations with a cast of cowards, cads, bullies, thieves, and all-around ne'er-do-wells, Mac would've had to make a ham-fisted non sequitur that would have done little but to confuse a lot of folks, e.g., "Speaking of reaching across the aisle, do you know with whom Senator Obama has associated through the years?"

It doesn't matter. McCain will win the election handily because smoke and mirrors only goes so far with the vast majority of the American public.

re: #180 Mr. Sandman

Scientific polls are in (from CNN and CBS), showing a clear Obama win among the population of debate watchers in general, and among the population of undecided debate watchers.

Link?

re: #180 Mr. Sandman

I'm convinced. I know those things are impartial/.......right

re: #180 Mr. Sandman

You are the same dolt that declared Bill Ayers was a distinguished Professor of Education the other night and then left without defending that stupid comment. Ha.

Who is so stupid and uninformed as to not have already made up their minds?

I mean really.

These two candidates are completely different.

I'll bet these undecided jerkoffs even have a hard time ordering at McDonalds.

Let's see, a double quarter pounder with cheese or a plain side salad?

They both sound so good, I can't decide

re: #185 J.S.

And given the kind of people whom Obama is attracted to (radicals, criminals, frauds, etc.), I'm betting Obama wouldn't be in office for a full four years -- I'm figuring impeachment proceedings, etc.

Don't count on it.

Wasn't Clinton surrounded by criminal activity? But he didn't go down in flames during his first term, in fact he lasted a full 8 years... Hell, we impeached him and he STILL didn't go down!

re: #171 Cognito

GAZE

on the subject of political racism I DON'T GIVE A F''K. GOT MUGGED BY ..... TWICE FOR BEING A HONKIE. I AM SO OVER IT I COULD CARELESS. I DON'T GO WERE I AM NOT WANTED BUT DON'T HAVE ONE OUNCE OF LIBERAL GUILT.
i have so many reasons for not wanting obama that i don't care what he is.

re: #140 Typicalwhitey

That isn't what he said.
He said they would veto it if it went to the UN
He also said that he would never allow another Holocaust.
That said it all.

Agree TW, I thought Mccain was great on Israel...and basically blew off the UN...May we see MORE of that!

re: #194 Mich-again

And he gave away the Panama Canal for nothing.

Didn't we sell it for a buck? And, wasn't that part of a 100 year treaty? It's been a while and my central american history is rusty.

Well, hey, look at the bright side, it's cradle to grave, right?

/give me my Free Money!

Powerline has a pretty good assessment of tonight's performances, imo.
I'm comforted that many people are just now paying attention to the race, but discouraged that for many (most) of those newcomers, they will be unable to believe the criticisms aimed at 0bama though they're not exaggerations made by hyperpartisans. In other words, the thought process will be, "There's no way all those things could possibly be true about 0bama, if they were I'd have heard about it before", or "...he never would have made it this far", or some other phrase of incredulity.

re: #192 really grumpy big dog Johnson

Exactly. CNN conducting a "scientific" poll? -- as i laugh...Anyone who'd believe that (and so quickly after the debate) is a utter moron.

re: #142 RightMinded

It depends on who gets off the better series of post-debate ads. I think Obama gave the McCain campaign a lot more material to work with than the other way round. If Obama's worst accusation was that McCain joked about bombing Iran, he's not quite as sharp on the attack as everyone seems to believe.

Oh, and please keep up the Obama is a Muslim-commie-terrorist line. At this late date, that dog will not hunt. Did he look like a wild-eyed terrorist tonight? Who you gonna believe, Rush, Palin and McCain, or your lying eyes?

re: #206 Mich-again

You are the same dolt that declared Bill Ayers was a distinguished Professor of Education the other night and then left without defending that stupid comment. Ha.

Yeah, when we all knew you were talking about Ward Churchill. . .oh, wait. . .he isn't a professor of education. . .or even a professor anymore. . .

Anybody notice how with Obama, every problem in the history of this country originated within the last 8 years? In light of this, I really like that joke he tells about how he is not a typical politician. That cracks me up every time. It seems that Dukakis claimed that all of the country's problems initiated with in the last 8 years. I believe Mondale said all the problems of the nation started within the prior 4 years. Carter believed the country was a regular Shangra-la prior to 1972. Maybe all these guys should get together and hold a summit so they can determine the date when all the country's problems really started. Oddly enough, they all seem to originate with the president they oppose. How weird is that?

re: #217 Red Lion

Oh, and please keep up the Obama is a Muslim-commie-terrorist line. At this late date, that dog will not hunt. Did he look like a wild-eyed terrorist tonight? Who you gonna believe, Rush, Palin and McCain, or your lying eyes?

go piss up a rope

once again

re: #206 Mich-again

You are the same dolt that declared Bill Ayers was a distinguished Professor of Education the other night and then left without defending that stupid comment. Ha.

If Arafat can win a peace price, then an unrepentant murdering terrorist can be distinguished.

McCain missed an opportunity to nail Obama on the question of American intervention in cases of genocide. Obama is eager to help in Darfur, yet had we not gone to Iraq, Kurds would still be getting gassed and tortured by Saddam. It appeared that McCain missed a few other opportunities to nail the communist, but wasn't quick enough on his feet to drive the points home. Too many talking points and not enough substance to suit me, yet I think John came out on top in this one.

Rove on....like to listen to him....

re: #212 USCMSNE

OK I was off by $1. But we completely refurbished it at the cost of million$ in the years leading up to the giveaway.

[Link: www.drudgereport.com...]

Ok, go stack the meaningless polls, just like the communists from DK are.

re: #201 looking closely

There are probably already stocks at or near that level (though no, I am not going to try and name examples).

My dad said Research in Motion is really cheap.

/but for now I'm just staying in my TSP, keeping a decent stockpile of cash, and buying a little extra beans, rice, and ammo.

re: #191 Sharmuta

The $250,000 number? It's bull. Small businesses are generally defined in the US as those employing under 100 employees.

re: #217 Red Lion

Oh, and please keep up the Obama is a Muslim-commie-terrorist line. At this late date, that dog will not hunt. Did he look like a wild-eyed terrorist tonight? Who you gonna believe, Rush, Palin and McCain, or your lying eyes?

Good nic. Red, lyin'.

Fox News texting poll: McCain 86%, Obama 12%, undecided 1%.

I think a telling part of the debate was the question of whether health care is a right or responsibility or (I don't remember the third option). Obama chose right, McCain chose responsibility. That right there loses the Obama vote for me. I just worry how many of the chattering classes that vote believe Obama over McCain?

/not that I'd ever vote for Obama

re: #90 sparrowlake

McCain won by a nose, but he came across as a dottering old fart and Obama as a slick inexperienced liar.

Neither was impressive on the economic crisis, but on balance McCain was a bit better because he articulated more of a plan.

To my horror McCain came across as weak on Israel, in that he said that China and Russia would prevent the US from striking Iran if Iran attacks Israel. Obama was actually stronger in his professed support, and it is only because I don't believe or trust him that I didn't give the debate to Obama right then and there.

The ? was if Iran hit Israel would we hit back or wait on NATO(my understanding of ?)....McCain said...first words.....HIT BACK.....then from what I understood was that China and Russia would not let us do anything through NATO.....at least that is how I took it. Will have to listen again to that part. But when he said hit back.....I let out a OH YES!

re: #189 Globular Cluster

How could McCain let Obama get away with saying McCain's campaign manager was a lobbyist for Fannie, when Obama has Raines, a central villain, as his economic advisor? John was too busy remembering his next line to be effectively responsive.

Maybe McCain should just step aside, give the ball to Sarah, and let her pick Rudi or Mitt as her running mate. Now that would shake things up for sure. Let's have the first woman President NOW!

This talk about who "won" the debate is silly.

All campaigning is cumulative & the election is what counts.

If you want to be encouraged see all the crowds that Palin is bringing out.

The R's are going to get all the pro life votes, much much of the women's votes; all the thinking person's vote; the conservative vote; most of the military vote; almost all of the evangelical vote (huge); the NRA vote; the I like that hot chick vote and other votes I can't think of at the moment.

Obama gets the foolish and the resentful vote and the votes of passive people who want the government to solve their own problems.

0bama is toast.

re: #180 Mr. Sandman

CNN is polling their viewers -- and can you guess (or do you need some clues?) as to who watches CNN? Do you want me to tell you who CNN claims won the debate, eh? And, guess what? I don't need their "poll" (which is NOT scientific) to tell me who CNN will claim won the debate (based on their viewers).

re: #217 Red Lion

Oh, and please keep up the Obama is a Muslim-commie-terrorist line. At this late date, that dog will not hunt. Did he look like a wild-eyed terrorist tonight? Who you gonna believe, Rush, Palin and McCain, or your lying eyes?

Yes ........Pockeeeeeeeestan ....... go f*ck yourself at dailyshitheads .......

re: #220 kevinmumaw

Not only that, but as I pointed out in the previous thread, the Dems have us all in rags standing in soup lines.

re: #209 Sharmuta

Sounds good to me. I just wanted to confirm you meant what you said.

re: #217 Red Lion

Obama is a three-card monte dealer. You're the mark.

re: #199 LSD

Put it this way.
Obama did not win. He lied.
He had no game and was outclassed just by McCAIN showing up.

McCAIN was low key and dull. He was Honest.

Not hard to pick a winner.

Not hard for LGFers to pick a winner - we tend to discriminate more than the general voting mob. (I know ... we had the IQ gig a few months ago) ;-)

My dinger's not working!

Where's Dorothy?

I thought with that big strawman in the room next to the lion, there must be Dorothy and the TinMan around here somewhere.

re: #217 Red Lion

Fuckin' commie

re: #202 lawhawk

7000 would be a 50% decline from the all time high. It would mean another 26% decline from where we are. I don't think we're in for that rough a patch. I think it's possible to see another 1,000 points come off the Dow, but then again, I don't think anyone knows where the bottom will be - or whether the bailout will make things worse or better...

Thanks to everyone. Public high school economics taught me to balance a checkbook, nothing more, and I didn't take any economics in college.

re: #243 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My dinger's not working!

There are treatments for that.

re: #217 Red Lion

Oh, and please keep up the Obama is a Muslim-commie-terrorist line. At this late date, that dog will not hunt. Did he look like a wild-eyed terrorist tonight? Who you gonna believe, Rush, Palin and McCain, or your lying eyes?

Umm, he is being financed by terrorists who are proud enough to give interviews about it. . .most of the people here are much more concerned about his actual positions than the smears. . .

Oh, and DO keep telling Dailykos to KEEP posting those suggestions on stacking polls and such- some of the less committed people at work are starting to notice, and at least 4 of them have removed their Obama signs from their desks. . .so Keep attacking and by all means keep being so proud of the smears against Down Syndrome kids, working moms, oh and the whole HOCKEY mom thing. . .funeeeeeeee!

Rove thinks McCain did what he needed to do, setting up the themes of the next four weeks: Democratic responsibiity for a failed economy, Obama unreliable, Obama much too liberal.

People keep saying McCain was way better on the economy. This gives me hope for the third debate, totally on the economy.

re: #195 Bobibutu

Hey, thanks. I do what I can.

Broken clock, and all that.

Mark Levin tonight on his show mentioned that one of the leading NOW women has publicly endorsed McCain/Palin.

Have any of you heard this? He said that the woman introduced Sarah Palin at a rally yesterday?

re: #209 Sharmuta

Hey Sharm...I have missed most of this thread, couldnt get on...What is your take on the debate?

re: #192 really grumpy big dog Johnson

There is no such animal as a scientific poll from CNN and CBS. You are living in la-la land.

Nyet, Tovareesh. Scientific polls will not be available until several day from now. If polls are available now, they are most certainly not scientific.

re: #217 Red Lion

Oh, and please keep up the Obama is a Muslim-commie-terrorist line. At this late date, that dog will not hunt. Did he look like a wild-eyed terrorist tonight? Who you gonna believe, Rush, Palin and McCain, or your lying eyes?

i'm going with muslim- commie-terrorist sympathizer.

re: #180 Mr. Sandman

Scientific polls are in (from CNN and CBS), showing a clear Obama win among the population of debate watchers in general, and among the population of undecided debate watchers.

Fuck off, troll.

Having made up my mind long ago based on information that has been around (and ignored) for a long time I have not watched the debates. I have no desire to spend my precious time yelling: "You lying sack of s**t!" at whatever Democrat is defiling my TV screen, nor do I wish to spend that same time screaming: "You idiot!" when whatever Republican gets the facts wrong or misses a chance to skewer his or her opponent.

As a result of this, my blood pressure has remained steady and I have finished reading two excellent books.

re: #217 Red Lion

Oh, and please keep up the Obama is a Muslim-commie-terrorist line. At this late date, that dog will not hunt. Did he look like a wild-eyed terrorist tonight? Who you gonna believe, Rush, Palin and McCain, or your lying eyes?

He never looks "wild-eyed". He's been trained not to. That was Saul Alinsky's idea: have your radicals look normal.

If health care is a RIGHT, is a doctor OBLIGATED to provide it regardless of the price paid, or even, no price paid?

re: #233 Inquisitive

The ? was if Iran hit Israel would we hit back or wait on NATO(my understanding of ?)....McCain said...first words.....HIT BACK.....then from what I understood was that China and Russia would not let us do anything through NATO.....at least that is how I took it. Will have to listen again to that part. But when he said hit back.....I let out a OH YES!

China and Russia aren't in NATO. He was saying, IIRC, that they would try to prevent us through the UN, which is why we should ignore the UN.

re: #231 really grumpy big dog Johnson

Fox News texting poll: McCain 86%, Obama 12%, undecided 1%.

Yeah, that is the poll you have to pay for. . .

re: #243 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My dinger's not working!

Call Bob Dole!

/

re: #243 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My dinger's not working!

take a levitra and try it again in an hour

Gawd, I love Shawn Hannity!

re: #236 J.S.

CNN is polling their viewers -- and can you guess (or do you need some clues?) as to who watches CNN? Do you want me to tell you who CNN claims won the debate, eh? And, guess what? I don't need their "poll" (which is NOT scientific) to tell me who CNN will claim won the debate (based on their viewers).

Clearly a case of "I give you three guesses, and the first two don't count." :D :D :D :D :D

re: #257 Dark_Falcon

Yup, a wolf in sheep's clothing.

re: #229 jaunte

The $250,000 number? It's bull. Small businesses are generally defined in the US as those employing under 100 employees.

I know that- I just think it's a lie that most small business make less than $250,000 a year. I would think it's a minority of small business that make less than $250,000, and that most small business make more than that.

Perhaps if it's adjusted to exclude "small businesses" comprised of self-employed folks who employ only themselves, those numbers would really be shocking to most small business owners.

I think that might have been another big f*ck up for 0bama- most small business owners know what they're making, and know that 0bama just increased their taxes.

re: #192 really grumpy big dog Johnson

Well, I'm not a conspiracy theorist. I don't believe these news organizations are committing fraud.