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Overnight Open Thread

Open | Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 9:44:17 pm PDT

Behold the hippopotamus!
We laugh at how he looks to us,
And yet in moments dank and grim,
I wonder how we look to him.

Ogden Nash

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1466 comments

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1 jaunte  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:45:13pm

skinny, dry, annoying...

2 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:45:18pm

Whew, thank goodness that last thread was getting long. Good evening all, night shift finally punching in.

3 Wyatt Earp  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:45:40pm
4 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:46:08pm

Do NOT give in to defeatism.

5 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:46:13pm

I'm drained! Honestly thought McCain won this one. The MSM disagrees. Shocked? No......

6 jacksontn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:47:03pm

Joe the Plumber can kick Senator Government's ass .......

7 Wyatt Earp  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:47:14pm

re: #5 nigella

I'm drained! Honestly thought McCain won this one. The MSM disagrees. Shocked? No......

Fear not, the MSM would disagree that Teddy Roosevelt was a great President.

8 Candyxman  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:47:14pm

I Sir Am Not President Bush

9 Cognito  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:47:19pm

re: #1 jaunte

skinny, dry, annoying...

What is, "Obama wrapped in a towel"?

10 CIA Reject  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:47:30pm

Over? Nothing is over...

11 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:48:43pm

I loved the part where McCain said I'm not Bush and if you wanted to run against him you should have run 4 years ago!

12 CIA Reject  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:49:01pm

re: #1 jaunte

skinny, dry, annoying...

And smug, I hate smug...

13 Griffon  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:49:38pm

I had company and didn't get to listen closely to the debate. I haven't figured out all these Senator Government comments. Did McCain call Obama Senator Government or vice versa?

14 Wyatt Earp  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:49:50pm

re: #12 CIA Reject

And smug, I hate smug...

Then I'll bet you just LOVE Michelle Obama!

15 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:49:54pm

re: #11 nigella

I loved the part where McCain said I'm not Bush and if you wanted to run against him you should have run 4 years ago!

That was awesome, and I thought I heard an audible gasp from the audience.

Anyone else hear that?

16 Syrah  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:49:59pm

re: #4 Sharmuta

Do NOT give in to defeatism.

Defeat Defeatism!

Send McCain & Palin a check Lizards!

How much is victory worth to you?

17 opnion  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:50:00pm

Oh this is good, an apologist for Obama, from the Chicago Sun Times on with Greta.
He says that Obama did not launch his career in Ayers living room.
No it was a Ramada Inn & the Ayers coffee was three days later.
Ok, isn't that a difference without meaning?

18 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:50:04pm

re: #7 Wyatt Earp

Fear not, the MSM would disagree that Teddy Roosevelt was a great President.

Didn't Joe Biden already do something like that .... oh, no, that was the tv and FDR ....... oh, well ...... hair plugs too deep ......

19 CIA Reject  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:50:30pm

re: #14 Wyatt Earp

Then I'll bet you just LOVE Michelle Obama!

Ah...... no.

20 jaunte  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:50:47pm

re: #15 Sharmuta

Yes, the audience broke the silence pledge for that one.

21 CheDub  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:50:56pm

Considering hippos are responsible for more attacks on humans that crocs in Africa, it appears we either look tasty (doubtful since they're vegetarians) or like a credible threat.

Oh, was that rhetorical?

22 Wyatt Earp  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:51:05pm

re: #19 CIA Reject

Ah...... no.

Forgot to add "/sarc"

23 RTLM  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:51:18pm

Barack Hussein Obama - Man from Four fathers.

(Obama,Wright,Ayers, Farrakhan,Pfleger)

And one crazy uncle.

(Jackson)

24 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:51:24pm

re: #13 Griffon

I had company and didn't get to listen closely to the debate. I haven't figured out all these Senator Government comments. Did McCain call Obama Senator Government or vice versa?

McCain had this great moment when his mouth didn't move as fast as his mind did and blurted out "Senator Government" whilst speaking of Obama.

/I think it's a tag line to take to the bank.

25 logboy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:51:34pm

Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?

26 freedomplow  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:51:37pm

The MSM is out of control.

Never seen such a disgusting display of partisanship.

Way worse than 4 years ago.

27 empills  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:51:54pm

Anyone here know the status of the federal lawsuit filed against Obama and the DNC?

28 jaunte  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:52:10pm

Goodnight all.

29 RTLM  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:52:15pm

pimf - five fathers

30 jorline  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:52:17pm

I posted this earlier in a fast moving thread.

Obama said he was for wind and geothermal energy.

All we need to do is hook a hose up to his mouth and ass and the energy problem is solved.

31 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:52:26pm

Yeah, he is skinny.... All the fat people of American unite! We don't want any skinny person running the USA!.... OK, but it was worth a try. We don't seem to get any of the "smart" elite people on our side. I'm sure there is a whole lot more fat " people.....

32 Wyatt Earp  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:52:34pm

re: #25 logboy

Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?

Had that movie been made in today's uber-liberal Hollywood, Bluto would have probably said, "Was it over when George Bush bombed the World Trade Center?"

33 krycek  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:52:40pm

The two best lines of the night are "Joe the plumber" and "Senator Government". Gotta love it! Those two lines will resonate. They are also perfect for t shirts and bumper stickers.

34 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:53:11pm

re: #27 empills

Are you talking about the ACORN/RICO investigation?

35 CIA Reject  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:53:25pm

re: #22 Wyatt Earp

Forgot to add "/sarc"

No need, no need at all my friend!

36 Griffon  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:53:32pm

re: #24 Badge of Kaffir Pride

McCain had this great moment when his mouth didn't move as fast as his mind did and blurted out "Senator Government" whilst speaking of Obama.

/I think it's a tag line to take to the bank.

Thanks, Badge. That is a good name for him. I hope he doesn't move up in rank to President Government.

37 CheDub  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:53:34pm

re: #32 Wyatt Earp

Had that movie been made in today's uber-liberal Hollywood, Bluto would have probably said, "Was it over when George Bush bombed the World Trade Center?"

Or the Jooooooos

38 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:53:39pm

re: #34 Sharmuta

Are you talking about the ACORN/RICO investigation?

I presume he means Berg v. Messiah.

39 Palandine  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:53:56pm
Behold the hippopotamus!
We laugh at how he looks to us,
And yet in moments dank and grim,
I wonder how we look to him.

— Ogden Nash

Crunchy, and good with ketchup? ;)

Went into the bedroom to set the alarm clock, and saw the following above the crawl on Fox: "Obama: 'Bitter' remark was boneheaded."

3 weeks before the election, he's bringing up the bitter clingers and Murtha (*spit*) is talking about how racist his Pennsylvania constituents are. Yeah, sure this is a party that's winning. They're already spinning their loss. Obama must have some really disturbing internal polls.

The media are lying.

McCain wins 11/4.

40 Wyatt Earp  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:54:05pm

re: #37 CheDub

Or the Jooooooos

Jesse Jackson presents, "Animal House."

41 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:54:09pm

re: #26 freedomplow

The MSM is out of control.

Never seen such a disgusting display of partisanship.

Way worse than 4 years ago.

They should be careful what they ask for. Obama may get in there and join the ranks of Jimmah as one of the weakest Presidents ever. I wonder how they will spin the slow and downward slide of the USA under BO? They are cannibals, they will turn on him and bring him down as hard and fast as they propped him up.

42 freedomplow  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:54:14pm

MSNBC and NBC should be classified as a 507.

43 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:54:39pm

Ah politicians. Even evil doers have some idea.

44 Griffon  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:54:39pm

re: #25 logboy

Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?


Huh? Is this a joke?

45 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:54:45pm

re: #31 nigella

Yeah, he is skinny.... All the fat people of American unite! We don't want any skinny person running the USA!.... OK, but it was worth a try. We don't seem to get any of the "smart" elite people on our side. I'm sure there is a whole lot more fat " people.....

I'm with you! But, can we stop at McDonalds first, I am starved!

46 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:54:48pm

re: #42 freedomplow

MSNBC and NBC should be classified as a 507.

Some of us aren't American. I think I know what a 527 is but what's a 507?

47 Oldasdirt  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:55:17pm

re: #27 empills

Anyone here know the status of the federal lawsuit filed against Obama and the DNC?

Birth certificate?

48 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:55:22pm

re: #23 RTLM

Barack Hussein Obama - Man from Four fathers.

(Obama,Wright,Ayers, Farrakhan,Pfleger)

And one crazy uncle.

(Jackson)

Hey ........ I ain't related to Senator Government ......

49 Wyatt Earp  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:55:23pm

re: #44 Griffon

Huh? Is this a joke?

Line from "Animal House."

50 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:55:33pm

re: #44 Griffon

Huh? Is this a joke?

See Animal House.

/My interpretation skills for LGF are $15/hr. ;)

51 empills  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:55:43pm

Berg vs Barry whats his name

52 opnion  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:56:07pm

Unbelieveable campaign! Rampant voter fraud, MSM partisanship, Obama Campaign attempts at prior restraint from criticism, vandalism against those with McCain bumper stickers & yard signs. What would an Obama presidency be like?

53 unclassifiable  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:56:29pm

re: #15 Sharmuta

That's nothing. Wait for the gasp on 11/4/2008.

54 CIA Reject  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:56:43pm

re: #44 Griffon

Huh? Is this a joke?

McCain may be on "double secret probation" right now, but I think come election day we'll see BO playing the part of dean Wormer.

55 SpartanWoman  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:56:48pm

re: #52 opnion

Unbelieveable campaign! Rampant voter fraud, MSM partisanship, Obama Campaign attempts at prior restraint from criticism, vandalism against those with McCain bumper stickers & yard signs. What would an Obama presidency be like?

Stepping barefoot in horse shit?

56 opnion  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:57:15pm

Goodnight!

57 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:57:16pm

re: #55 SpartanWoman

Stepping barefoot in FRESH horse shit?

58 freedomplow  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:57:17pm

re: #46 Badge of Kaffir Pride

Some of us aren't American. I think I know what a 527 is but what's a 507?

You are right.

527.

59 Oldasdirt  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:57:22pm

re: #51 empills

Berg vs Barry whats his name

I have been hoping to hear ,,but not a word,,YET.

60 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:57:25pm

re: #17 opnion

Oh this is good, an apologist for Obama, from the Chicago Sun Times on with Greta.
He says that Obama did not launch his career in Ayers living room.
No it was a Ramada Inn & the Ayers coffee was three days later.
Ok, isn't that a difference without meaning?

Would that be Lynn Sweet?

61 Syrah  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:57:32pm

And a goodnight to all the Lizards out there from me.

I am in serious violation of the Iron Fist rule at this moment. I am so smashed that if it were not for spell check I would not be able to post at all.

Send the McCain & Palin campaign some of your dough.

Ask yourself how much it is worth to you to have McCain as President instead of that zero.

Send them a check.

Some things must be done.

Do Them!

62 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:57:33pm

Griffon, yeah, fat drunk and stupid is no way to live..... Also animal house ..... Dean Wormer. One of the most telling movies of all time..... Toga, Toga Toga......

63 sifty  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:57:50pm
64 Hapster  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:58:05pm

re: #42 freedomplow

how about CNN, CBS and ABC..

65 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:58:10pm

re: #53 unclassifiable

That's nothing. Wait for the gasp on 11/4/2008.

Heh!

66 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:58:35pm

Go to Defendmyvote.com ....... help Ohio defend the votes ....

67 Griffon  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:58:44pm

re: #49 Wyatt Earp

Line from "Animal House."

Gosh, That's my 2nd favorite movie and I've seen it many times, but I don't remember that line. Good grief. Now I'll have to watch it again. It must have gone straight over my head!

68 unclassifiable  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:58:48pm

re: #25 logboy

Forget it, he's on a roll.

/I think that was what McCain's advisers said after the Senator Government "slip".

69 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:58:57pm

re: #58 freedomplow

You are right.

527.

I didn't mean to be right since I was just curious. 527s are.... groups acting for a candidate, yes? Ref'd by tax code number?

70 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:58:58pm
Now remember, things look bad and it looks like you're not gonna make it, then you gotta get mean. I mean plumb, mad-dog mean. 'Cause if you lose your head and you give up then you neither live nor win. That's just the way it is.

/Josey Wales

71 SpartanWoman  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:59:07pm

re: #53 unclassifiable

That's nothing. Wait for the gasp on 11/4/2008.

I wanna see Chris Matthews cry on the air

72 Shug  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:59:24pm

Hippo
Harpo
Oprah
Obama

Let's throw the whole bunch out

73 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:59:28pm

re: #55 SpartanWoman

Stepping barefoot in horse shit?

Nah, even the fresh stuff ain't that bad. Try cow meadow muffins. That's what it would be like.

/either fresh or a couple days old.

74 Griffon  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:59:50pm

re: #50 Badge of Kaffir Pride

See Animal House.

/My interpretation skills for LGF are $15/hr. ;)

ROFL, I must be a LOT slow tonight. I DO need an interpreter. Do you take Pay Pal?

75 Wyatt Earp  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 9:59:52pm

re: #71 SpartanWoman

I wanna see Chris Matthews cry on the air

There will be another chill going down his leg when he wets himself.

76 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:00:00pm

re: #70 Killian Bundy

My fav Clint movie of all time.....Dirty Harry a close second

77 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:00:12pm

I give the birth cert story a big GAZE. Anywho:

ACORN/RICO update

78 SpartanWoman  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:00:22pm

re: #73 BlueCanuck

Nah, even the fresh stuff ain't that bad. Try cow meadow muffins. That's what it would be like.

/either fresh or a couple days old.

I will concede that my experience with barnyard excrement is limited and yield to your experience

79 Shug  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:00:56pm

re: #44 Griffon

Huh? Is this a joke?


You mind if we dance wiff yo dates?

80 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:00:57pm

re: #74 Griffon

ROFL, I must be a LOT slow tonight. I DO need an interpreter. Do you take Pay Pal?

Only for eBay refunds. :)

You missed the best half hour of this campaign in the start of the debate. McC was on fire. Like Rudy G kinda fire.

81 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:01:23pm

re: #66 JacksonTn

Go to Defendmyvote.com ....... help Ohio defend the votes ....

Sign the petition ....... I heard of it from the ex Ohio Secretary of State ..... forget his name ....... black guy on fox

82 Hapster  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:01:29pm

re: #71 SpartanWoman

Man .. I wanna see mathews and olbershit with tingles up their ass. same with the CNN shills

83 Palandine  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:01:40pm

re: #75 Wyatt Earp

There will be another chill going down his leg when he wets himself.

I said it last night, and I'll say it again:

On election night, I'm going to drink a lot of Maker's Mark and pretend it's Keith Olberman's tears.

/They taste so sweet.

84 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:01:56pm

I noticed in the last thread some comments were about how the Republican party has come undone, blah, blah. Folks, when you are in party, you are in a diverse group of people that hopefully can get a political or economic objective accomplished. It is not necessary that you like or even approve of every single one of the people in the party. In fact, that is almost impossible. Don't even try.

Seriously, sometimes I think playing in bands all these years has helped me in this regard. I play music with people that I disagree with on almost every single issue, even with people with whom I have not spoken for years. But, to the listener, it all sounds like music and no one knows the difference.

85 CIA Reject  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:01:57pm

Well I have to bid all you good folks good night, but after tonight's debate I'm feeling much more confident that I'll wake up on November 5th to the MSM telling me that I'm a RACIST!

And that's a Good Thing...

Weet dreams all!

86 Oldasdirt  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:02:19pm

re: #70 Killian Bundy

/Josey Wales

My favorite western of all time.
"Looks like we whipped em agin Josey"

87 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:02:32pm

re: #78 SpartanWoman

I will concede that my experience with barnyard excrement is limited and yield to your experience

One man's poop, is another man's sport

88 CheDub  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:02:57pm

Well shortly after the debate I watched the classic Marx Brothers film "Duck Soup" and this scene jumped out as exactly how I would envision the 0bama administration.

And this is only Marx I would recommend being a fan of.

89 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:03:39pm

Griffon, just looked at your avatar. Do you have a wirehaired pointing griffon? We lost our german wirehaired pointer last Christmas We were considering a Pointing Griffon. My avatar is our English setter Nigel.

90 Griffon  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:03:53pm

re: #80 Badge of Kaffir Pride

Only for eBay refunds. :)

You missed the best half hour of this campaign in the start of the debate. McC was on fire. Like Rudy G kinda fire.

It's rerunning here now and I'm going to watch it again without company jabbering!

91 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:04:25pm

re: #86 Oldasdirt

My favorite western of all time.
"Looks like we whipped em agin Josey"

"Everytime I get to liking someone, they ain't around long"

"I noticed that every time to get to disliking someone, they ain't around very long either"

92 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:04:26pm

re: #86 Oldasdirt

My favorite western of all time.
"Looks like we whipped em agin Josey"

/Are you gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?

93 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:04:37pm

re: #90 Griffon

It's rerunning here now and I'm going to watch it again without company jabbering!

Getcha popcorn ready 'cause it's gooooooooood.

94 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:04:41pm

re: #78 SpartanWoman

heh, not that much. But I did work on a small farm for a summer. Highlights of the day? Shoveling out the pigs stalls, and cleaning up after cows when they were finished being milked.

95 OtisMyMan  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:05:27pm

We're so happy to be back here at the Dexter Lake Club. We'd like to perform for you a tune entitled Shama Lama Obama Ding Dong. So Hit It!

96 runrabbitrun  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:05:51pm

test

(okay, can't resist a p.s.: agree with Dick Morris that Mac did very well, and has prepared a clear message to deliver to voters in the final stretch :) )

97 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:06:05pm

re: #95 OtisMyMan

"Mind if we dance with your dates?"

98 CheDub  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:06:53pm

re: #95 OtisMyMan

Do you girls come here often?

99 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:06:54pm

re: #87 Desert Dog

One man's poop, is another man's sport

Ever hear of meadow muffin bingo? Feed a cow up than let it loose in a meadow that's been gridded off. Place your bets where the meadow muffin is going to end up first.

/popular in some country fairs.

100 Palandine  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:07:08pm

Wheeee!

/brother, can you spare a dime another trillion dollars?

I can't even begin to comprehend that figure, a trillion. Makes my head hurt.

101 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:07:12pm

otismyman..... otis my man..... shamalamading dong. Fawn was my fiancee she was killed in a tragic kiln accident.........

102 OtisMyMan  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:07:52pm

"Primitive Cultures"

103 Palandine  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:08:07pm

re: #95 OtisMyMan

We're so happy to be back here at the Dexter Lake Club. We'd like to perform for you a tune entitled Shama Lama Obama Ding Dong. So Hit It!

With your nic, looks like you've been waiting a long time for that quote. ;)

104 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:08:47pm

OtisMyMan don't you know in Obama "speak" that's racist!?

105 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:09:13pm

re: #70 Killian Bundy

/Josey Wales

Wow! I was just thinking "Are you gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?"

106 SpartanWoman  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:09:45pm
107 OtisMyMan  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:09:54pm

re: #103 Palandine

With your nic, looks like you've been waiting a long time for that quote. ;)

All things come to those who waits. Can't wait for Mac to rock the house!

108 Oldasdirt  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:10:22pm

Past mid-night.But what a great night,,Take good care everyone. Nite

109 logboy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:11:02pm

TOGA! TOGA!

110 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:11:37pm

So how did Ron Paul do in the polls?

111 OtisMyMan  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:12:06pm

re: #104 nigella

OtisMyMan don't you know in Obama "speak" that's racist!?

Ahm jes tryin to speaks fluid Obonics.

112 freedomplow  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:12:06pm

The biggest thing that liberals and Obama supporters are pissed off about...

A free Iraq...

28 Million people are now free in Iraq under GWB and that drives liberals insane.

Liberals wanted to see a lost uncontrollable Iraq.

It's the truth and it is dishonorable to infinity.

113 Palandine  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:12:11pm

re: #100 Palandine

From wikipedia:

10^12
(1 000 000 000 000; 10004; short scale: one trillion; long scale: one billion)

ISO: tera- (T)

BioMed — Bacteria on the human body: the surface of the human body houses roughly 1012 bacteria.[1]
Mathematics: 1.1×1012 - The approximate number of known non-trivial zeros of Riemann zeta function as of August 2005.[4]
Mathematics — Known digits of pi: As of 2002, the number of known digits of pi was 1 241 100 000 000.
Marine biology: 3,500,000,000,000 - estimated population of fish in the ocean.
BioMed — Cells in the human body: the human body consists of roughly 1014 cells, of which only 1013 are human.[2][3] The remainder of the cells are bacteria, which mostly reside in the gastrointestinal tract, although the skin is also covered in bacteria.
Computing - MAC-48: 281,474,976,710,656 (248) possible unique physical addresses.
Mathematics: 953,467,954,114,363 is the largest known Motzkin prime.
Computing — magnetic storage: 1TB largest 3.5inch hard disk as of 2007.

114 SpartanWoman  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:13:08pm

re: #110 Fenway_Nation

So how did Ron Paul do in the polls?

Speaking of RP, a house near me that has been sporting a RP sign now wears a McCain Palin one. A reassuring sign of sorts

115 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:13:10pm

re: #106 SpartanWoman

Politico gives indies to McCain

AA vote for Senator Government --- 88 - 10 ...... shocked

/

116 legalpad  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:13:37pm

re: #5 nigella

When you are not drained, read this. It's been posted before, but it helps in understand polls and what the left is trying to do with them. In short, they lie. They plan to lie in order to influence people who are more subject to peer-pressure.

117 CheDub  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:14:16pm

re: #113 Palandine

3,500,000,000,000? Really? You should probably go count em all to make sure that's accurate ;)

118 JeremiahRight  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:14:24pm

here's one for the history buffs:

History repeats itself, The Panic of 1819

The panic of 1819 followed a period of high foreign demand for American farm goods and thus of exceptionally high prices for American farmers. The rising prices for farm goods had stimulated a land boom in the western United States. Fueled by speculative investments, land prices soared.

The availability of easy credit to settlers and speculators, from the government (under the land acts of 1800 and 1804), from state banks and wildcat banks, even for a time from the rechartered Bank of the United States, fueled the land boom. Beginning in 1819, however, new management at the national bank began tightening credit, calling in loans, and foreclosing mortgages. This precipitated a series of failures by state banks, and the result was a financial panic. Six years of depression followed.

I came across this in a book I was reading tonight and the last part sounded eerily familiar

119 SpartanWoman  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:14:48pm

re: #115 JacksonTn

AA vote for Senator Government --- 88 - 10 ...... shocked

/

Me too actually I'd have expected 98% at least. 88% means Obama lost, imo

120 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:14:54pm

That claim Senator Government made about "kill him" in Scranton has been found to be ........... false ........... I don't have link ........ I will look for it

121 legalpad  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:15:05pm

re: #6 jacksontn

Joe the Plumber can kick Senator Government's ass .......

LOL!

122 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:15:08pm

re: #105 SurferDoc

Wow! I was just thinking "Are you gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?"

/ I didn't surrender, but they took my horse and made him surrender, they have him pulling a wagon up in Kansas I bet.

123 SpartanWoman  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:15:23pm

re: #120 JacksonTn

That claim Senator Government made about "kill him" in Scranton has been found to be ........... false ........... I don't have link ........ I will look for it

There's a link on HotAir

124 Archimedes  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:15:40pm

One Hippopotami

125 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:15:45pm

re: #118 JeremiahRight

Was there an inexperienced empty suit loaded up with nothing but pure ambition and hubris that came in to save the day?

126 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:15:49pm

re: #113 Palandine

From wikipedia:

10^12
(1 000 000 000 000; 10004; short scale: one trillion; long scale: one billion)

ISO: tera- (T)

BioMed — Bacteria on the human body: the surface of the human body houses roughly 1012 bacteria.[1]
Mathematics: 1.1×1012 - The approximate number of known non-trivial zeros of Riemann zeta function as of August 2005.[4]
Mathematics — Known digits of pi: As of 2002, the number of known digits of pi was 1 241 100 000 000.
Marine biology: 3,500,000,000,000 - estimated population of fish in the ocean.
BioMed — Cells in the human body: the human body consists of roughly 1014 cells, of which only 1013 are human.[2][3] The remainder of the cells are bacteria, which mostly reside in the gastrointestinal tract, although the skin is also covered in bacteria.
Computing - MAC-48: 281,474,976,710,656 (248) possible unique physical addresses.
Mathematics: 953,467,954,114,363 is the largest known Motzkin prime.
Computing — magnetic storage: 1TB largest 3.5inch hard disk as of 2007.

Elections: Amount of trees killed refuting Senator Government's ideas on government policy. Also, the number of times voting present.

127 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:16:01pm

re: #120 JacksonTn

That claim Senator Government made about "kill him" in Scranton has been found to be ........... false ........... I don't have link ........ I will look for it

Link ......[Link: www.weeklystandard.com...]

Another lie .........

128 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:16:07pm

Conceding to defeat before the battle is even waged is always going to put you in the losers column.

129 legalpad  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:16:15pm

re: #10 CIA Reject

Over? Nothing is over...

You like that movie, don't you ?

130 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:16:46pm

re: #115 JacksonTn

AA vote for Senator Government --- 88 - 10 ...... shocked

/

Here's to the brave ten!

131 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:17:24pm
Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining.

/Missouri Boat Ride

132 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:17:39pm

re: #122 Killian Bundy

/ I didn't surrender, but they took my horse and made him surrender, they have him pulling a wagon up in Kansas I bet.

"Your words of death have iron in them for all Comanches to see..."

133 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:17:46pm

re: #130 SurferDoc

Here's to the brave ten!

Let's pour out some of our forty in tribute!

///

134 JeremiahRight  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:17:50pm

re: #105 SurferDoc

Wow! I was just thinking "Are you gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?"

pull those pistols

135 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:18:00pm

Defend my vote Petition ...... please sign ......

[Link: defendmyvote.com...]

136 soccerdad  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:18:23pm

Missed the debate.....sounds like y'all think Johnny Mac won. Good thing.. he needed to show well.

GO PHILLIES!

137 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:18:32pm

legalpad, thanks for the positive take. I've read those and agree. Just tonight I thought at least fox would think McCain won. I'm being enirely honest in telling you that McCain was my bottom choice. I liked Guiliani and Thompson . That being said I decided to back McCain when he got the nomination.I guess I don't need the media to verify who I think is the better of the two candidates.

138 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:18:57pm

re: #134 JeremiahRight

pull those pistols

Great shirt! They look like 1917's.

139 JeremiahRight  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:19:04pm

re: #125 Desert Dog

Was there an inexperienced empty suit loaded up with nothing but pure ambition and hubris that came in to save the day?

well, next President was Andrew Jackson, so...

140 redc1c4  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:19:17pm

re: #70 Killian Bundy

/Josey Wales

the one hope of the doomed is not to hope for safety.

Virgil

141 Palandine  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:19:39pm

re: #128 Sharmuta

Conceding to defeat before the battle is even waged is always going to put you in the losers column.

To quote BabbaZee (and some other author ;) ):

"I bid you STAND, Men of the West!"

142 CheDub  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:20:55pm

re: #118 JeremiahRight

Would it be a book worth reading? If so, what's the title? If not (and it sounds like a dry academic history book), well... uhh...nevermind.

143 TheMatrix31  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:21:04pm

I bet the Senator Government thing is going to generate buzz like the "That One" garbage did.

144 unclassifiable  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:21:09pm

re: #100 Palandine

When was the last time you heard a broker whisper "Blue Horse Shoe Loves Norway"?

145 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:22:18pm

re: #132 SurferDoc

"Your words of death have iron in them for all Comanches to see..."

/that's true, I ain't promising you nothing extra. I'm just giving you life and you're giving me life . . .

146 least  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:22:39pm

Posted this on an earlier thread -- but everyone had moved on to the debate threads while I was composing ("It sure is quiet out there." "Yeah! Too quiet.") I wanted to get all y'alls take on what I observed. And to ask, have any of you folks noted similar stuff?

= = = = = = = = = =

Last night, I was to meet some associates @ Borders Books.
There was a shrine (disguised as a book display) to the Obamessiah right at the entryway -- it featured at least 10 different books about BO. In the tweaked view of Borders, these were "balanced" by 1 copy of the McCain autobiography.

My curiosity piqued, I went further into the store to look at a display titled "Know Before You Vote" -- it featured a plethora of moonbat screeds about how bad America is and how bad Republicans are and . . . well . . . it was if the Kossacks were in charge of displays at Borders. There was, however 1 title that featured Governor Palin -- from an author who'd fit right in at the HuffPo or DU.

So I looked around some more -- the leftward slant was all over the store.

147 Timbre  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:23:13pm

Come on, Americans, Stick It Out. Don't swallow the poison , your pride, your anger, or the lies of the Left. Spit it out!

148 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:23:22pm

re: #112 freedomplow

Back in the day, that would've made for some good movies.

Nowadays....well....when was the last time you heard 'good movie' and 'Iraq war' in the same sentence?

149 kansas  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:24:28pm

re: #27 empills

Anyone here know the status of the federal lawsuit filed against Obama and the DNC?

Yeah, they're gonna wait till he's inaugurated to look into that.////

150 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:25:03pm

re: #145 Killian Bundy

/that's true, I ain't promising you nothing extra. I'm just giving you life and you're giving me life . . .

In that scene, the Indian Chief's facial expression says' "This white man is a dangerous nut. I better not piss him off!"

151 JeremiahRight  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:25:09pm

re: #142 CheDub

definitely a dry academic history book, not worth reading. Makes me want to have my brains smashed out by a slice of lemon wrapped around a large gold brick :)

152 gman  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:25:27pm

Just started looking into the CNN/Opinion Research Corp. poll.

Opinion Research Corp. is ran by (InfoGroup) old friends of the Dems

Surprise

153 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:26:30pm

re: #151 JeremiahRight

definitely a dry academic history book, not worth reading. Makes me want to have my brains smashed out by a slice of lemon wrapped around a large gold brick :)

Just so long as you know the support groups for after. Or chase it with some Ol' Janx Spirit!

154 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:28:35pm

re: #148 Fenway_Nation

Nowadays....well....when was the last time you heard 'good movie' and 'Iraq war' in the same sentence?

Generation Kill is good, accurate to a fault, and disturbing.

/based on a true story with some of the participants even playing themselves

155 kansas  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:28:45pm

re: #54 CIA Reject

McCain may be on "double secret probation" right now, but I think come election day we'll see BO playing the part of dean Wormer.

So is Otter gonna bang Dean Wormer's wife?

156 JeremiahRight  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:28:48pm

you mean that sinful Old Janx Spirit?

157 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:28:57pm

re: #120 JacksonTn


Here's the exact link:
[Link: www.timesleader.com...]

158 CheDub  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:29:30pm

re: #151 JeremiahRight

Just as I feared. Just remember that reading through it is for a good cause. Well, unless Obama wins, then you're better off dropping out and letting the govmnt take care of you, but I digress...

159 HHC 2-2 SCR  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:29:50pm

I got up at 3am to watch the debate, I had to walk away after the mediator asked them to be specific on what spending they would cut. Obama was up first, he danced around it per usual. Then it was McCain's turn, the moderator interrupted him and told him to be specific, so Mac rattled off a bunch of things he would cut. Right then and there Obama lost the debate to me and Scheifer proved beyond any doubt that MSM is in the tank for Obama. Or maybe I was just groggy and didn't hear all the useless programs Obama said he would cut so he didn't need to be told to be specific.

On the upside my daughter just told me they're learning the song American Tears in music class and are trying to get approval to sing it at the welcome home ceremony. She also gets to share in the honor, that's how she describes it, of saying the Pledge of Allegiance over the school intercom.
After hearing MSM report on the debate I was disheartened, then my daughter gave me hope that all is not lost.

160 legalpad  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:30:13pm

re: #137 nigella

Guiliani and Thompson

Those were my first picks as well.

161 Odinga  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:30:17pm

Perhaps the best news for McCain is the rating he received from independent voters. Among respondents not identified with either major political party, McCain was judged tonight’s winner, 51-42 percent.

link

162 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:30:55pm

re: #156 JeremiahRight

you mean that sinful Old Janx Spirit?

"For my head will fly, my tongue will lie, my eyes will fry and I may die"

/Theme song from the Zero's campaign.

163 Killer Tomato  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:31:53pm

re: #128 Sharmuta

OK - got the sticker done.
Kind of cheated though.

I bought a package of 'magnet sheets' (from Staples) - they're 8 1/2 x 11 sheets of refrigerator magnet material.
Took my McCain bumper sticker, and stuck it on the sheet. Trimmed around the sticker, leaving a border.
I drive about 130 miles a day - a lot of people see my car.
I'll put the sticker on the car when I leave the house, and remove it once the car is parked - lessening the chance of it being keyed while sitting unattended somewhere, but still broadcasting the message "you're not alone" when I'm on the road.

164 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:32:10pm

Ya think ............

[Link: www.politico.com...]

165 Scion9  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:32:45pm

re: #114 SpartanWoman

Speaking of RP, a house near me that has been sporting a RP sign now wears a McCain Palin one. A reassuring sign of sorts

Yeah, I thought that Obama had a lock on the deranged and maniacal, but if McCain is starting to win even them over...

166 wolfie  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:33:20pm

re: #163 Killer Tomato

That's a great idea, Killer.
I think I'll steal it!

167 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:34:17pm

re: #159 HHC 2-2 SCR

You took the words right out of my mouth...I spend the debates screaming at my TV, the moderators are ALL so obviously giving Obama every advantage and bowing to his every word. Everytime McCain says something, even when Obama has already gone first, Obama has to jump in at the end with just "one last thing on that topic," so that he always gets the last word - it's not supposed to work that way, but the moderators have let it happen every time, so that McCain always gets called a liar and then told it's time to move on. I think McCain made some good points tonight, but he needs to scream so much louder about the Ayers/Wright issue and the socialism that Obama wants to impose, it's like these topics are just by-the-ways rather than the MAIN problems with Obama.

168 Killer Tomato  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:34:43pm

re: #166 wolfie

You're welcome to it - pass it around!

169 JeremiahRight  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:37:00pm

re: #137 nigella

re: #160 legalpad

quick un-scientific poll to late-night lizards:
who was your pick in the primaries?

mine was Romney
(in the CA primary, only days before he dropped out of the race during his spectacular speech at CPAC)

170 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:37:59pm

re: #169 JeremiahRight

Fred

171 Price_of_Peace  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:38:22pm

After hearing Obama talk so much about distributing the wealth so it will "fair" to everyone, my wife asked if he would distribute half of his campaign money and half of his votes to the McCain ticket. Not holding my breath.

172 unclassifiable  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:39:11pm

Good night lizards.

Truly I feel better than the last debate.

The revolution will not be televised.

It will be live-blogged.

173 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:39:16pm

JOE THE PLUMBER VIDEO FROM CAVUTO:

You have to watch .......... this may take Senator Government down ...

174 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:39:28pm

re: #169 JeremiahRight

re: #160 legalpad

quick un-scientific poll to late-night lizards:
who was your pick in the primaries?

mine was Romney
(in the CA primary, only days before he dropped out of the race during his spectacular speech at CPAC)

Fred--but he disappointed me so fast with his lack of drive!

175 CheDub  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:41:27pm

re: #169 JeremiahRight

Mine was McCain. I was a supporter of his in 2000 as well. I didn't think he had a snowball's chance in hell of winning the primary and I was obviously (yet, happily) wrong. It'll be nice to see him come from behind again to win one in a few weeks.

176 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:41:29pm

Charles ...... can you do a thread on Joe the Plumber tomorrow ......

177 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:41:59pm

re: #171 Price_of_Peace


Yeah, considering how little he gives to charity - and Biden gives less than 1% of his income! - it never fails to amaze me how quick he is to offer to give everyone else's money away. And the fact that no one sees this for the flat out socialism that it is just frightens me - are Americans really this misinformed? Or just this gullible? I mean, are his wealth reallocation policies even constitutional?

178 legalpad  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:43:35pm

Last thought on optimism:

I hear some talk that Obama won the debate, Obama is going to win, etc., but here's the thing: Practical optimism is more fun. Practical, meaning that it does allow you to drop your guard, but you think you are going to win. In combat, it has been recommended "Do not anticipate the outcome of a fight." Why? Because you are too busy getting ready to flinch, or the equivalent. It distracts you from your productivity, your focus, your perception, it drains your energy. That is why "defeatism" in any form, is self-fulfilling. Focus on winning, and only winning. That includes defense. If you do lose, it will not be your fault, and then you can focus on your new mode of fighting in the Resistance. And you will be as focused in that fight as you were in the previous one, because that is your habit. You are not like the interpreter on the stairs in Band of Brothers.

179 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:44:18pm

re: #173 JacksonTn

JOE THE PLUMBER VIDEO FROM CAVUTO:

[Link: www.youtube.com...]

You have to watch .......... this may take Senator Government down ...

Now I understand why McC was all over this guy this week.

180 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:44:31pm

PIMF: during the debate.

181 krycek  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:45:08pm

Tell the gift shop to stock "Senator Government Sucks" bumper stickers

182 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:45:26pm

re: #148 Fenway_Nation

Nowadays....well....when was the last time you heard 'good movie' and 'Iraq war' in the same sentence?

You also need to watch Bravo Two Zero

/a very famous true story from GWI

183 JeremiahRight  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:45:31pm

re: #169 JeremiahRight

it's not that I don't support McCain, because I do 100%, I was just trying to plumb the depths of nocturnal lizard ideology. So far I have 3 responses from 212 logged in...

184 CheDub  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:45:35pm

Tis time to say goodnight as I depart to the land of slumber. Good night fellow Lizards!

185 wolfie  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:45:37pm

re: #178 legalpad

Wonderfully said!

186 lostlakehiker  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:45:46pm

Just a thought...any living creature is in some way not ridiculous. It is, after all, a survivor. Most species that ever existed are long since extinct. Now, consider the hippo. It sits there in the mud, eyes above the water and maybe nostrils. Crocodiles swim and slither in the vicinity. Why do they leave the hippo be?

Because it's fat like a weight lifter is fat. Because its funny pairs of peg teeth are plenty sturdy enough to paper-punch right through a croc's hide, and they're driven by massive jaw muscles. Because you don't want to make a hippo mad, in short.

187 Scion9  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:46:03pm

re: #146 least

The leftist slant isn't at Borders, it is at the publishing companies. Regnery is really the only publisher that will do 'right-wing' books, which is just a trickle in comparison to the vastness of the rest of the industry. There are books published as counter-points to the leftist flood, but only a few from notable authors and pundits make their way up the bestseller lists, while authors like Naomi Klein are actually mandatory reading on college campuses.

188 Gus 802  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:46:16pm

re: #163 Killer Tomato

Sad that it comes to that. I live in Ground Zero, Obamaland. I would put the sticker on but I just don't trust the "Party of Peace" Democrats around here. I know how anarchists, krunchies, and old demented hippies can get especially with their history of violence.

189 capitalist piglet  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:46:25pm

I was just watching this again, and when McCain brings up ACORN and is quite seriously talking about it tearing at the "fabric" of society (not sure what his exact words were), Obama broadly smiles, then actually starts laughing. There is an audible chuckle.

I guess it's just me, but I think that's a big mistake on Obama's part. He looks like a punk, laughing off the concerns of a statesman.

I hope they use it in an ad about ACORN. (I half wish McCain would have asked him what was so damned funny about voter fraud.)

190 TheMatrix31  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:46:52pm

Joe the Plumber is my hero.

191 realwest  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:47:35pm

re: #15 Sharmuta
I don't think I heard a gasp, but Mom and I both heard a moderate smattering of clapping hands!

192 rancher  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:47:39pm

re: #169 JeremiahRight
Fred.

193 wolfie  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:47:44pm

re: #183 JeremiahRight

I supported Ronald Reagan.
I figure he would cut heavily into the Democrats' traditional lock on the dead vote.

194 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:47:58pm

re: #183 JeremiahRight

I really wanted Rudy....but he was already gone when AZ voted. So, I went with McCain.

195 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:48:23pm

re: #190 TheMatrix31

Joe is the one we have been waiting for

196 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:49:16pm

re: #195 Desert Dog

Joe is the one we have been waiting for

Isn't it always the regular guy ...... that is what Senator Government does not understand .....

197 legalpad  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:49:34pm

re: #178 legalpad

Last thought on optimism:

I hear some talk that Obama won the debate, Obama is going to win, etc., but here's the thing: Practical optimism is more fun. Practical, meaning that it does not allow you to drop your guard, but you think you are going to win. In combat, it has been recommended "Do not anticipate the outcome of a fight." Why? Because you are too busy getting ready to flinch, or the equivalent. It distracts you from your productivity, your focus, your perception, it drains your energy. That is why "defeatism" in any form, is self-fulfilling. Focus on winning, and only winning. That includes defense. If you do lose, it will not be your fault, and then you can focus on your new mode of fighting in the Resistance. And you will be as focused in that fight as you were in the previous one, because that is your habit. You are not like the interpreter on the stairs in Band of Brothers.

Damn late night proofreading.

198 realwest  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:49:51pm

re: #17 opnion
From the Chicago Sun Times? Oh yeah, that's believable, but either way you're right - it don't mean diddly - Obama started in Ayers' living room. He did that for a reason: Obama belongs in Ayers (and his ever so charming wife Bernadine Dhorn's) living room.

199 Killer Tomato  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:50:45pm

re: #188 Gus 802

I don't know if I'd call it sad, but I know what you mean. Pathetic, disgusting, frightening...
Anyway, I drive through The People's Republic of Massachusetts every day. There are still cars with Kerry/Edwards stickers on them, but surprising few Obama ones - they're conspicuous because they're almost rare. Not sure what's up, but it's certainly strange.

200 rancher  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:51:12pm

re: #177 Lorenska

...And the fact that no one sees this for the flat out socialism that it is just frightens me - are Americans really this misinformed? Or just this gullible? I mean, are his wealth reallocation policies even constitutional?

Yes, yes, and sadly, yes.

201 Price_of_Peace  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:51:32pm

re: #183 JeremiahRight

I too was for Fred and felt the same lack of resolve, so looked at Romney. I think Palin made McCain's ticket acceptable.

202 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:51:52pm

re: #154 Killian Bundy

I've heard good things about earlier (but more obscure) documentaries like Occupation: Dreamland or Gunner Palace. Apparently neither one is really agenda driven, more of a Rorschach test for the individual viewer.

203 realwest  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:51:56pm

re: #41 Desert Dog Nah, they'll just blame Bush and it'll work for about two years and then that's it, they'll eat him alive.

204 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:52:13pm

all your Joes they belong to us.... Obama campaign sarc/

205 Price_of_Peace  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:52:29pm

re: #193 wolfie

I supported Ronald Reagan.
I figure he would cut heavily into the Democrats' traditional lock on the dead vote.

lol....Good one.

206 empills  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:52:42pm

AHHH i am outnumbered at work everyone thinks Obama won and that McCain is a moron. I wish the clock would move faster befor my head explodes.

207 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:53:27pm

re: #196 JacksonTn

Isn't it always the regular guy ...... that is what Senator Government does not understand .....

/you know, between Plumber Joe and Senator Government and Lord President For Life Obama's absolute pathological inability to not prevaricate, we might just have enough time left to squeak out the needed headway

208 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:54:06pm

re: #197 legalpad

Damn late night proofreading.

No problem. I read typonese.

209 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:54:24pm

re: #196 JacksonTn

Obama did not know how to handle the simple fact his policies have consequences. I am sure the ideas sound really great at cocktail parties with MoveOn.org and Mr. Soros, or when he and his 300 advisers are crowded around the "Round Table of Camelot" back at BOHQ. But, when someone who will actually be harmed by his policies puts him in a position he cannot wriggle out of or explain away.....that is priceless.....THANK YOU Joe, you may have turned this election.

210 gman  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:54:48pm

re: #190 TheMatrix31

Joe the Plumber is my hero.

Get em Joe!

211 empills  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:55:29pm

Joe the plumber will flush Obama's campaign down the crapper

212 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:55:55pm

One problem with Joe ..... he didn't say who he backs.... The highest bidder?

213 Gus 802  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:56:34pm

re: #199 Killer Tomato

That is kind of strange because here we have both: Kerry stickers and nauseating glut Obama stickers. We get some Mass people moving here. Lots of new LA people. When I first moved here it was Texas folks. Which is why we turned purple in Colorado.

I have an uncle, aunt, and cousin in Mass. The uncle is an old Westinghouse engineer (retired) that last I heard leaned right -- back to supporting Reagan.

But the Kerry stickers are very typical around here. Along with the "angelic figure" Obama stickers. Gives me ulcers.

214 stuiec  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:57:12pm

re: #4 Sharmuta

Do NOT give in to defeatism.

If you can't give in to defeatism, what CAN you give in to?

215 OtisMyMan  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:57:43pm

re: #199 Killer Tomato

I don't know if I'd call it sad, but I know what you mean. Pathetic, disgusting, frightening...
Anyway, I drive through The People's Republic of Massachusetts every day. There are still cars with Kerry/Edwards stickers on them, but surprising few Obama ones - they're conspicuous because they're almost rare. Not sure what's up, but it's certainly strange.

Spoke with some folks in Moonbat Minneapolis in August. They are hardcore Dems. Politics came up and they said: "We just can't get excited about this years election." My translation: They can't bring themselves to vote for Obama. This view may be more widespread than we can possibly know given the unbelievable bias in the deadstream media. I found it very interesting.

216 legalpad  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:57:44pm

Last comment tonight-

I love this "Senator Government" term we got from the debate!

good night folks-

217 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:58:36pm

Here in my neck of the woods in California, I still see old Kucinich stickers from 2004. The rest are all Obama... Every other car, Not surprised in this area.

218 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:58:48pm

re: #202 Fenway_Nation

I've heard good things about earlier (but more obscure) documentaries like Occupation: Dreamland or Gunner Palace. Apparently neither one is really agenda driven, more of a Rorschach test for the individual viewer.

/Gunner Palace is a straight up documentary, it's home movies on film, I'll have to look into the other one

219 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:59:17pm

re: #212 nigella

One problem with Joe ..... he didn't say who he backs.... The highest bidder?

Did you see the video?........ Joe the Plumber does not strike me as that kind of guy .......

220 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 10:59:38pm

re: #214 stuiec

If you can't give in to defeatism, what CAN you give in to?

Victory...or denial.

221 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:00:19pm

re: #217 nigella

Here in my neck of the woods in California, I still see old Kucinich stickers from 2004. The rest are all Obama... Every other car, Not surprised in this area.

All Hybrids too, yes?

with a COEXIST, Imagine World Peace or a 01.20.09 bumper sticker?

222 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:00:39pm

Good Night Lizards ........... tomorrow the fight is on ........

223 stuiec  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:00:53pm

re: #17 opnion

Oh this is good, an apologist for Obama, from the Chicago Sun Times on with Greta.
He says that Obama did not launch his career in Ayers living room.
No it was a Ramada Inn & the Ayers coffee was three days later.
Ok, isn't that a difference without meaning?


It's actually confirmation of the point of McCain's criticism. It confirms that Obama was in Ayers's and Dohrn's living room, right at the outset of his political career. I wonder if the Ayers kaffeeklatsch was Obama's first-ever political fundraising event, or first-ever meet-and-greet? That is, something qualitatively different from the Ramada event.

224 wolfie  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:01:01pm

I am (slightly) encouraged that there are actually several McCain stickers on the cars parked at the campus where I teach. I'd say the ratio of Obama to McCain stickers is certainly no more than 2 to 1.
True, it's not exactly Berkeley, but.............

Oh. I am of course excepting the faculty parking lot from my informal study. No McCain stickers there.

225 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:01:02pm

Jackson Tn I did see it but why was he at an Obama rally? I read he hasn't made his mind up about who he backs.

226 TheMatrix31  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:01:39pm

First words on the debate story on My13 News ---

"John McCain gets feisty"

227 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:02:10pm

Desertdog, hybrids, old polluting Volvo's, and Subaru's..

228 realwest  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:02:17pm

re: #214 stuiec
NOTHING. You can't give in to anything or anyone where principles are concerned. Not even once. IF you do, you might wind up being a politician.

229 wolfie  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:03:02pm

re: #215 OtisMyMan

Very interesting.

230 realwest  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:03:18pm

Well all y'all it's been ah, interesting tonight as usual.
But I need my sleep so I'm off to bed.
I hope you all have a GREAT EVENING/EARLY MORNING and that I get the chance to see you all down the road.

Good night, all.

231 freedombilly  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:03:26pm

Go Phillies!

232 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:03:36pm

re: #228 realwest

NOTHING. You can't give in to anything or anyone where principles are concerned. Not even once. IF you do, you might wind up being a politician.

We shall go on to the end, we shall fight in France,
we shall fight on the seas and oceans,
we shall fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the air, we shall defend our Island, whatever the cost may be,
we shall fight on the beaches,
we shall fight on the landing grounds,
we shall fight in the fields and in the streets,
we shall fight in the hills;
we shall never surrender....

233 TheMatrix31  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:03:55pm

Did Obama really "exempt" small businesses? I can already see people pointing to that as "proof" of Obama clowning McCain.

234 RTLM  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:04:06pm

I'm trying to list all the Countries Obama has either lived in or visited.

In no particular order, Indonesia, Germany, Russia, Ukraine, and Azerbaijan, Iraq, Israel, Jordan, Kuwait, Kenya, and South Africa.

Am I missing any?

Has he ever been to the U.K., Japan, Mexico, South America?

235 JacksonTn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:04:08pm

re: #225 nigella

Jackson Tn I did see it but why was he at an Obama rally? I read he hasn't made his mind up about who he backs.

Okay ...... my last post ...... Obama was knocking on doors in Joe the Plumber neighborhold ....... you can see the houses in the background of the video ...... Joe the Plumber even references the houses in the video ........

We will win ........

236 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:05:14pm

Jackson Tn. Thanks for the info.... I too think we will win. Sweet dreams.

237 Gus 802  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:05:51pm

Drinking with Bob

No content warning.

238 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:06:05pm

re: #200 rancher

I knew it....I was just hoping that maybe I had missed an amendment or something that said, "Oh, and if, in 200+ years, some yahoo comes along and wants to change our basic, fundamental system of being rewarded for hard work, he must immediately be shipped to the nearest deserted island and left to redistribute the wealth there."

And #196, jacksontn, you're SOO right - it all sounds so rosy and warm and fuzzy, let's just all hold hands and SHARE, isn't that what we learn in kindergarten? Oh, but wait -if I have to share mine with him, then I have less for me, which means I have less for my family and my business, which means I fire people, which means they have less, which means they don't buy as much from the guy making pizzas down the street, which means he can't buy a new oven, so the guy who makes the doors for the ovens can't send his kid to college....hmmm, where, exactly, is the "good for everyone" part?

239 Palandine  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:07:32pm

re: #169 JeremiahRight

re: #160 legalpad

quick un-scientific poll to late-night lizards:
who was your pick in the primaries?

mine was Romney
(in the CA primary, only days before he dropped out of the race during his spectacular speech at CPAC)

Fred!
Then Rudy!
Then Romney.
McCain was #4

240 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:07:39pm

re: #217 nigella

Interesting, are you north or south CA? I'm south, but in a tiny sliver right by Edwards AFB, so I'm in a little pocket of sanity...but even here, 10 miles from a military base, someone put up a sign that says "Impeach the Idiot." Charming.

241 Throbert McGee  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:08:23pm

Speaking of Joes (such as the Plumber), the other evening I frittered away 20 minutes or so doing some Googling po-russki, just to see if "Joe Six Pack" and "Hockey Mom" had made into Russian-language coverage of elections -- whether on Russian-American sites, or .il sites aimed at Russian-speaking Jews, or in Russia proper.

Couldn't find any references trying to explain "Joe Six Pack" for rooskies, but "Hockey Mom" HAS been picked up by the Russian press... maybe because it's a lot simpler to translate. (It's хоккейн& #1072;я мамочка, hokkéinaya mámotchka)

242 pat  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:08:42pm
Behold the hippopotamus!
We laugh at how he looks to us,


I believe this beast may kill more people than any other in Africa. A telling metaphor for those who think they vote for reconciliation and get confrontation.

243 Spirit93  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:08:56pm

re: #206 empills

Zombie had a great essay up earlier (Zombie: The Left's Big Blunder) about among other things group think, and how some people will pretend to go along with things they don't believe, and some will actually change their beliefs because of group pressure. Regardless, congratulations on being one of the few true independent.

244 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:09:10pm

Lorenska North 50 miles north of san francisco in the most liberal bastion in California.

245 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:09:15pm

re: #240 Lorenska

Interesting, are you north or south CA? I'm south, but in a tiny sliver right by Edwards AFB, so I'm in a little pocket of sanity...but even here, 10 miles from a military base, someone put up a sign that says "Impeach the Idiot." Charming.

I drive by Edwa all the time. Next time I will wave!

246 rancher  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:09:32pm

re: #199 Killer Tomato
I heard someone on Rush commenting that last election there were Kerry stickers all over his blue collar neighborhood. This year hardly any.

247 JeremiahRight  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:09:35pm

re: #240 Lorenska

Interesting, are you north or south CA? I'm south, but in a tiny sliver right by Edwards AFB, so I'm in a little pocket of sanity...but even here, 10 miles from a military base, someone put up a sign that says "Impeach the Idiot." Charming.

so they want President Cheney? Dumb-ass impeach Bush crowd doesn't understand what that would mean

248 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:09:54pm

dang, my "rds" was abducted by Aliens.

249 Meremortal  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:09:59pm

Bin lurkin' around. Quick drive-by and off to bed.

As near as I can figure, Subaru wagons come from the factory with Kerry stickers.

250 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:10:22pm

re: #237 Gus 802

Drinking with Bob

No content warning.

/he should warm up Pailin for the next 19 days

251 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:11:23pm

re: #249 Meremortal

Bin lurkin' around. Quick drive-by and off to bed.

As near as I can figure, Subaru wagons come from the factory with Kerry stickers.

And usually pre-installed with smug asshole drivers too......but not always
(they are great snow cars though)

252 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:11:23pm

re: #250 Killian Bundy

/he should warm up Pailin for the next 19 days

Dude oughta try Decaf...

253 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:11:39pm

re: #233 TheMatrix31

Did Obama really "exempt" small businesses? I can already see people pointing to that as "proof" of Obama clowning McCain.

I was screaming at the TV for McCain to ask Obama if he was going to be the one to define 'small' vs. 'large' businesses, like he gets to define who's wealthy at $200K. And wishing he would say, "that's still a business that ends up passing their costs on to their customers or firing people because you're forcing them to add an expense, it doesn't matter how big the business is, we all pay for it in the end."

254 SummerSong  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:12:31pm

re: #234 RTLM

255 neocon hippie  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:12:43pm

Nothing but Obama stickers in Berkeley-Oakland-SF.

Saw one McCain sign in Albany, a small city just north of Berkeley.

I was for Rudy, voted for Mitt in CA primary after Rudy dropped out. McCain is #3.

Anybody But Obama.

256 Colonel Panik  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:13:22pm

Bitter Klingers, Unite!

You have nothing to loose but your summer dresses and your M-1 Garands!

257 Meremortal  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:13:36pm

re: #251 Desert Dog

And usually pre-installed with smug asshole drivers too......but not always
(they are great snow cars though)


+
Yeah, I'm thinking about getting one, the one with the hot motor. My future is going to involve an increase in winter-time mountain driving.

258 logboy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:14:25pm

re: #218 Killian Bundy

Search around and you'll find some Iraq documentaries. Gunner Palace, This is War, Alpha Company: Iraq Diary, Baghdad ER, etc.

If you're looking for Tom Clancy bravado BS, you can shove it up your a$$. Some of us actually went to Iraq. War is not a movie, no matter what light you cast it in.

259 Killer Tomato  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:14:45pm

re: #246 rancher

Something is definitely up.
There's a contractor that comes into our office frequently - basic L.O.S.T. guy (Left Over Sixties Type) - wears a baseball hat with 1.20.09 on the front. He's been strangely quiet since the convention.

260 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:14:45pm

re: #257 Meremortal

If you ski, you can't go wrong with one. I grew up in Denver and saw loads of them there. Here in AZ, not so many (gee, I wonder why?)

261 Archimedes  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:14:52pm

This Rush song really does fit our times:

262 wolfie  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:15:29pm

re: #249 Meremortal

Not my 1992 Legacy !

263 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:15:59pm

re: #247 JeremiahRight

so they want President Cheney? Dumb-ass impeach Bush crowd doesn't understand what that would mean

God, you're so right that they don't think through - can you imagine how they'd react to THAT scenario? What they really want is President Pelosi, which are 2 words that truly shouldn't even be allowed to be next to each other on the page. She scares me nearly as much as Obama - I'd take Cheney and his rifle over her any day.

264 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:16:03pm

re: #252 Surfer Doc

Dude ought try Decaf...

Sure.

/but everything he said was true

265 Pawn of the Oppressor  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:16:21pm

What interests me is how Barry Zero clearly showed his socialist side, and his classic "liberal" defeatism, if you paid attention to his ideas, instead of his delivery.

"Sacrifice"
"Fairness and Justice"
"We'll have to pay for it somehow"

He put a lot of verbal adornment on it, but his message was basically "America: BOHICA, because we can't do it, unless you give me your wallet."

His biggest mistake may have been in his closing remarks. "We all are going to have to sacrifice." This is something the elitist types never seem to understand: Never, EVER get up on the national stage and ask an American to Do Without. You might be right as rain, but we instinctively respond VERY BADLY to anybody in authority, especially a guy with an ivy league education and a cushy job, getting up there and telling us that WE THE PEOPLE are going to have to give up anything in service of your abstract social engineering plans.

266 Killer Tomato  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:16:23pm

re: #258 logboy

BTW - 'thank you' isn't near enough but Thank You.

267 Meremortal  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:17:48pm

re: #260 Desert Dog

If you ski, you can't go wrong with one. I grew up in Denver and saw loads of them there. Here in AZ, not so many (gee, I wonder why?)


+
You'll understand when I say "Bethoud Pass" then. My second home in Grand County is going to become my primary home.

268 Throbert McGee  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:17:51pm

re: #163 Killer Tomato

I bought a package of 'magnet sheets' (from Staples) - they're 8 1/2 x 11 sheets of refrigerator magnet material.

That's a very good idea! But did you know that you can also use refrigerator magnets with dental floss, two rinsed-out empty coffee cans, and discarded nylon pantyhose to make an improvised explosive device? Dig it, kill the pigs!

Hugs,
Hell-oise

269 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:17:59pm

re: #245 SurferDoc


Oh, do! I'm the one sobbing in my front yard, wondering how all the elected officials in this state got to where they are, and how it is that we haven't fallen into the ocean yet...I think it's only because of people like those at Edwards that California hasn't just completely fallen apart yet - but I think it's only a matter of time.

270 Meremortal  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:19:14pm

re: #262 wolfie

Not my 1992 Legacy !


+
They do last a while, don't they?

271 nigella  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:19:36pm

Logboy, thank you for your service, as Mark Levin would say. Thank you from the bottom of my heart also. A friend of mine lost her only child two years ago in Iraq. She is still a patriot to her Country despite her terrible loss. Thank you and God bless.

272 logboy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:20:16pm

re: #266 Killer Tomato

BTW - 'thank you' isn't near enough but Thank You.

If you want to thank me for my sacrifice, remember us on election day. That is thanks enough. Some of us will be living this war for the rest of our lives. Don't let it be for nothing.

273 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:20:42pm

re: #163 Killer Tomato

OK - got the sticker done.
Kind of cheated though.

I bought a package of 'magnet sheets' (from Staples) - they're 8 1/2 x 11 sheets of refrigerator magnet material.
Took my McCain bumper sticker, and stuck it on the sheet. Trimmed around the sticker, leaving a border.
I drive about 130 miles a day - a lot of people see my car.
I'll put the sticker on the car when I leave the house, and remove it once the car is parked - lessening the chance of it being keyed while sitting unattended somewhere, but still broadcasting the message "you're not alone" when I'm on the road.

Brilliant, Killer T!

274 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:20:48pm

re: #267 Meremortal

+
You'll understand when I say "Bethoud Pass" then. My second home in Grand County is going to become my primary home.

Berthoud Pass!....Winter Park (Mary Jane side) is my favorite area near Denver. I love Steamboat and Crested Butte as well. Hell, ANY ski slopes in COLO......

275 BigJohn  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:21:00pm

I don't know how many viewers tuned in for tonight's debate, but one of the things that sticks out to me is that 70 million viewers tuned in to the Palin vs Biden debate. It was significantly more than for the other Presidential debates. You know that they did not tune in to see Biden. I have to believe that is a big number that tuned in to see Sarah Palin.

276 Colonel Panik  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:21:08pm

re: #260 Desert Dog

If you ski, you can't go wrong with one. I grew up in Denver and saw loads of them there. Here in AZ, not so many (gee, I wonder why?)

The Aussies and Israelis sell kit that turn Foresters or Outbacks into semi-respectable desert off road vehicles. Rasta is the Israeli Mfr. Scorpion Capalaba the Aussie.

I've been looking at Subies for semi-offroad work as they don't suck gas like a Jeep or a small pickup.

277 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:21:53pm

re: #214 stuiec

If you can't give in to defeatism, what CAN you give in to?

Chocolate.

278 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:22:10pm

re: #269 Lorenska

Oh, do! I'm the one sobbing in my front yard, wondering how all the elected officials in this state got to where they are, and how it is that we haven't fallen into the ocean yet...I think it's only because of people like those at Edwards that California hasn't just completely fallen apart yet - but I think it's only a matter of time.

Look on the bright side. We live in the High Desert, where Democrat candidates call themselves human sacrifices.

279 boogberg  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:22:14pm

Has anyone gotten their sample ballots and seen the collection of kooks who qualified? McCain and Obama are fucking normal compared to most of them. Fuck! It's like a scene from The Postman. :D

280 SummerSong  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:22:18pm

re: #254 SummerSong

Sorry! My post should have read: Pockystan

281 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:23:39pm

re: #258 logboy

If you're looking for Tom Clancy bravado BS, you can shove it up your a$$. Some of us actually went to Iraq. War is not a movie, no matter what light you cast it in.

Go bitch at Andy McNab. both movies I recommended are first person soldier written, first person soldier approved. Have you actually seen either of them?

/what's next, are you going to bitch about To Hell and Back

282 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:24:18pm

re: #265 Pawn of the Oppressor

God bless you I hope you're right - it just seems like this time around, those who HAVE (the rich libs) are so busy patting themselves on the back for being so enlightened and generous that they're going to be in the majority on voting day - and then when it really comes time to be forced to give - which we will - it'll only be those of us that DON'T have who'll get hurt. Those who are so proud of this 'sharing' idea somehow never end up sharing THEIRS. they just find ways to make the rest of us give what little we have. And those of us who do have who'd like to actually keep what we've worked our asses off for will be criminalized and vilified.

It's late, I'm babbling, but I'm sure the lizards get what I'm saying, I'm preaching to the choir, I know.

283 Desert Dog  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:24:23pm

re: #272 logboy

Your sacrifice and the sacrifice of your brothers and sisters in arms was not in vain. No matter what crap comes out of Washington, you can rest assured there are millions of Americans who not only admire your courage and are in eternal gratitude for your service, but will also NEVER FORGET.

284 Killer Tomato  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:24:45pm

re: #272 logboy

Rest easy. I took that oath to protect and defend the Constitution - even though I'm now out, I never 'untook' it - it's still in effect.
As far as I'm concerned, Obama is a domestic enemy.

285 rancher  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:25:31pm

re: #238 Lorenska

I'm assuming it's constitutional since every other scheme since "The New Deal" and "The Great Society" have been.

286 JeremiahRight  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:25:59pm

for those who need a laugh

from The Onion:

Many elections have been altered by an "October surprise," or a sudden revelation that casts one candidate in a bad light. Here are some of the more memorable October surprises from years past:

1816: James Monroe (Democratic-Republican) vs. Rufus King (Federalist)—The Daily Pottstown Ledger intercepts a carrier pigeon carrying erotic poetry from Sen. King to an unidentified minor

1840: William Henry Harrison (Whig) vs. Martin Van Buren (Democrat)—In one of the earliest photographs ever taken in the United States, the incumbent Van Buren is revealed to be nothing more than a topcoat stuffed with leaves

1868: Ulysses S. Grant (Republican) vs. Horatio Seymour (Democrat)—Scandal erupts when it is discovered that Seymour secretly supports polio

1924: Calvin Coolidge (Republican) vs. John W. Davis (Democrat)—Publishing magnate William Randolph Hearst releases photos of Davis dressed as a flapper

1960: John F. Kennedy (Democrat) vs. Richard Nixon (Republican)—Chicago's powerful League of Deceased Voters rescinds its endorsement of Nixon

1984: Ronald Reagan (Republican) vs. Walter Mondale (Democrat)—Ronald Reagan finds Osama bin Laden and gives him $100 million to fight the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan

1988: George H. W. Bush (Republican) vs. Michael Dukakis (Democrat)—Voters are shocked when it is revealed that Dukakis previously slept with and impregnated his wife of many years

287 Quad Mocha Matti  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:26:43pm
Behold the hippopotamus!
We laugh at how he looks to us,
And yet in moments dank and grim,
I wonder how we look to him.

— Ogden Nash

Hippopotami Totally RAWK!

Okay, after catching the last bit of Gunga Din on TCM, I am finally officially out for a few hours. Don't mind all the Eeyores among us! G'nite, all!

288 wolfie  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:29:07pm

re: #272 logboy

Like Desert Dog said, we will NEVER FORGET.

289 RTLM  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:29:18pm

re: #280 SummerSong

Sorry! My post should have read: Pockystan

No - that's PAHKeestahn.

:)

290 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:30:27pm

re: #278 SurferDoc

Look on the bright side. We live in the High Desert, where Democrat candidates call themselves human sacrifices.

Wow, you're so right - it's not very often that I consider the High Desert a "bright side," but my little town is pretty conservative, so I guess when I look at the rest of California, I am rather fortunate. I think I'd take a running jump off the Golden Gate if I lived in SF - such a beautiful city, it's such a shame what the dems have done to it. I guess dust & heat down here aren't such a bad trade off for some political sanity.

291 Meremortal  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:30:32pm

re: #274 Desert Dog

They are all nice slopes. I'm more into the fishing now, saving the knees as best I can.

Good nite all...

292 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:32:37pm

re: #291 Meremortal

They are all nice slopes. I'm more into the fishing now,

What kind of grenades do you use?

293 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:34:35pm

For Joe the Plumber: Nobodies Hero.

/listen first then ding. trust me.

294 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:34:39pm

re: #290 Lorenska

Wow, you're so right - it's not very often that I consider the High Desert a "bright side," but my little town is pretty conservative, so I guess when I look at the rest of California, I am rather fortunate. I think I'd take a running jump off the Golden Gate if I lived in SF - such a beautiful city, it's such a shame what the dems have done to it. I guess dust & heat down here aren't such a bad trade off for some political sanity.

360 days of sunshine. Endless four-wheeling, ghost towns, history, archeology, photography--dust and heat? My Jeep has A/C for the four hot months.

295 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:35:01pm

Hey, I really like the "I Am Joe the Plumber" movement!

It helps McCain/Palin a lot!

Here's my new Obama poster:

Obama's just not all that cool anymore...

296 Gus 802  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:35:30pm
297 rancher  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:39:32pm

re: #296 Gus 802
I need a hunt'in license!

298 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:40:00pm

re: #294 SurferDoc

360 days of sunshine. Endless four-wheeling, ghost towns, history, archeology, photography--dust and heat? My Jeep has A/C for the four hot months.

I'm certainly not trying to whine, but 4 hot months? We either live further apart than I thought or I'm a true baby when it comes to weather....don't get me wrong, there's a lot of great stuff about this area, but I'm afraid I can't count the weather, I like a little rain sometimes (must be my originally-from-Texas side talking). :)

299 solomonpanting  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:41:27pm

re: #290 Lorenska

Wow, you're so right - it's not very often that I consider the High Desert a "bright side," but my little town is pretty conservative, so I guess when I look at the rest of California, I am rather fortunate. I think I'd take a running jump off the Golden Gate if I lived in SF - such a beautiful city, it's such a shame what the dems have done to it. I guess dust & heat down here aren't such a bad trade off for some political sanity.


Well, you had better hurry.

300 Pawn of the Oppressor  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:41:41pm

re: #296 Gus 802

Dukakis in a tank.

Obama on a bike.

Kerry with a gun.

Fighter Pilot McCain

I couldn't find one of Sarah with the M4.

301 Killer Tomato  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:42:29pm

re: #296 Gus 802

hmmmmm..... why does the word 'doofus' spring to mind?

Well crap. I have to get up in 2 1/2 hours.
'night all - catch you sometime tomorrow.

302 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:43:12pm

re: #298 Lorenska

I'm certainly not trying to whine, but 4 hot months? We either live further apart than I thought or I'm a true baby when it comes to weather....don't get me wrong, there's a lot of great stuff about this area, but I'm afraid I can't count the weather, I like a little rain sometimes (must be my originally-from-Texas side talking). :)

LOL! Hot is 95 or better for me!

Did I mention we average around 27% humidity?

303 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:44:43pm

re: #299 solomonpanting

Well, you had better hurry.

See, I knew it - everyone up there finally looked around and saw Pelosi and her family tree (Newsom). And up goes the net. That's handy - when it gets full, we can just gather them all up and haul them away, preferably before 11/4.

304 JeremiahRight  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:45:38pm

re: #299 solomonpanting

Well, you had better hurry.

that damned suicide net is the worst idea ever. So what if 15 or 20 people want to jump each year, I say let em. Dont mess with the bridge

305 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:47:44pm

re: #302 SurferDoc

LOL! Hot is 95 or better for me!

Did I mention we average around 27% humidity?

I KNOW, and I'm from Austin, where it gets to 98 with like 90% humidity, so go figure why I'm such a wimp - all I know is, anything over 85 makes me cranky, and these 110+ days that we had this summer had me downright homicidal at times....based on your name, I'da thought you were somewhere near the coast, which is where I'd be if I could afford it. Just down the hill, it's a lovely 72 most days, if only I were one of those rich liberals!

306 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:48:21pm

They oughta throw a net over all of SF.

307 JeremiahRight  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:48:48pm

during construction of the Golden Gate Bridge in 1933:

The Halfway to Hell Club
Joseph Strauss implemented safety innovations, including a safety net cantilevered out underneath the entire bridge during roadway construction. Nineteen men would fall into it, cheating death and proclaiming themselves the Halfway to Hell Club. The net boosted workers' morale and became an attraction for showboats and club wannabes, who had to be ordered not to jump into it on purpose.

308 Gus 802  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:48:58pm

re: #301 Killer Tomato

Right. It reminds me of a kitten photo with "Iz Haz" as a prefix. Not that there's anything wrong with kittens but those guys are just too much. They just alter their behavior for acceptance or votes.

Later.

309 logboy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:49:13pm

re: #281 Killian Bundy

Go bitch at Andy McNab. both movies I recommended are first person soldier written, first person soldier approved. Have you actually seen either of them?

My bitch is that people watch a lot of the war crap that comes out of Hollywood (or the BBC, before you correct me) and think thats what war is actually like. Guys with 6 pistols strapped to their legs, machine gun ammo belted across their chest, a sniper rifle on their back with a 500 pound ruck and an M240B under each arm. Men do amazing things in war. Unfortunately there are never any camera's around to capture them.

While I was in Iraq my wife actually had a stranger say to her, "Oh I've seen "Jar Head", so I know what you're going through."

And yes, I read B20. I banged it out between patrols in Iraq.

310 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:49:19pm

re: #304 JeremiahRight

I'm guessing the first time someone gets tangled in that thing like a bug on its back and creates a traffic jam - or accident where someone dies anyway - they'll take it down and realize what an idiotic idea it was.

311 solomonpanting  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:50:34pm

re: #304 JeremiahRight

that damned suicide net is the worst idea ever. So what if 15 or 20 people want to jump each year, I say let em. Dont mess with the bridge

I tend to agree with you. To what degree does society go in order to make a world with padded borders?

312 MrSnuggles  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:51:13pm

I actually think McCain did the right thing in bringing up Joe the plumber and attacking Obama for basically being a socialist instead of just pounding on Ayers all night long. Although I do appreciate the fact that he did mention him and I think got Obama pretty good on ACORN as well. How anyone can think Obama won this thing is beyond me.

313 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:51:18pm

re: #305 Lorenska

I KNOW, and I'm from Austin, where it gets to 98 with like 90% humidity, so go figure why I'm such a wimp - all I know is, anything over 85 makes me cranky, and these 110+ days that we had this summer had me downright homicidal at times....based on your name, I'da thought you were somewhere near the coast, which is where I'd be if I could afford it. Just down the hill, it's a lovely 72 most days, if only I were one of those rich liberals!

I lived at the beach or on the water for many years. My "name" has been with me on the internet for a long time. I don't wince until it gets over 105. But heck, I go from and air conditioned house to an air conditioned car to an air conditioned office. Now if I was out there digging ditches....

314 SurferDoc  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:53:01pm

G'night, All.

315 Killian Bundy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:53:32pm

re: #258 logboy

War is not a movie, no matter what light you cast it in.

I get that and I more than sincerely thank you for going there and sacrificing, if that's the right word, your arm for my old civilian ass and the tens of millions of moonbats in this country, and pray for your future prosperity. I hope you're doing well and recovering and rehabilitating successfully.

Thank God you made it home.

/still, in every war from now on, there will be cameras there and cameras after the fact, documentaries and movies, I was trying to flag the good ones, written and shaped by the soldiers that witnessed it, I meant no offense

316 RTLM  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:54:07pm

Pirate update:

Pirated Iranian Ship Meant as Dirty Bomb for Israel on Yom Kipper. And it been released to International waters.

[Link: patdollard.com...]


Allah AkBOOOOM (delay)

/Good bit of Coast Guarding there... errr, 'Pirate'.

317 TheMatrix31  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:54:09pm

A PUMA just emailed into My13.

318 Gus 802  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:55:12pm

re: #312 MrSnuggles

Right. Obama's defense of his relationship with ACORN was pathetic. But he's so slick I'm sure a good portion of the Perez Hilton minds bought it.

"But, uh, we were not associated with _______ ."

319 JeremiahRight  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:55:51pm

did anyone else watch the debate tonight on an HD channel? It looked like McCain's eyes were watery and he was blinking a lot. Did anyone else see that?

320 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:56:39pm

re: #309 logboy

Go bitch at Andy McNab. both movies I recommended are first person soldier written, first person soldier approved. Have you actually seen either of them?

My bitch is that people watch a lot of the war crap that comes out of Hollywood (or the BBC, before you correct me) and think thats what war is actually like. Guys with 6 pistols strapped to their legs, machine gun ammo belted across their chest, a sniper rifle on their back with a 500 pound ruck and an M240B under each arm. Men do amazing things in war. Unfortunately there are never any camera's around to capture them.

While I was in Iraq my wife actually had a stranger say to her, "Oh I've seen "Jar Head", so I know what you're going through."

And yes, I read B20. I banged it out between patrols in Iraq.

I don't mean to jump into your conversation, but I had to respond to what that idiot said to your wife....I have to assume no one can ever imagine what a soldier or family member goes through, especially during wartime. My fiance was in the Navy for 20 years - he had a cush job most of the time, but his main responsibility was documenting (videoing and photographing) the casualties after battles, which he did in Somalia and Beirut, and he said it was horrific. And even today, HE says, "I can't imagine what those guys in Iraq and Afghanistan are going through." Thank you for being a man of bravery and honor, and I pray with all my heart that this nation elects one of your kind rather than the liar that is the other choice. God bless you.

321 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:56:43pm

One of the best moments of the debate was when McCain said he wasn't Bush- here's video that the audience responded to that positively.

322 Mel Lono  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:57:10pm

re: #316 RTLM

Pirate update:

Pirated Iranian Ship Meant as Dirty Bomb for Israel on Yom Kipper. And it been released to International waters.

[Link: patdollard.com...]


Allah AkBOOOOM (delay)

/Good bit of Coast Guarding there... errr, 'Pirate'.

How much did the pirates pay to get rid of it?

323 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:57:33pm

Obama is on video telling ACORN that they will be forming his policies in the White House.

This is one of the more damning of the large collection of Obama's Damning Tapes.

324 logboy  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:57:45pm

Don't be so hard on the moonbats. They taste like chicken.

325 RTLM  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:58:27pm

Oh - and they the Pirates commandeered another hapless vessel.

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

Wednesday's hijacking pushed the number of attacks this year in the African waters to 73. A total of 29 ships have been hijacked. Choong says 11 remain in the hands of pirates along with more than 200 crew members.

326 Lorenska  Wed, Oct 15, 2008 11:59:33pm

re: #319 JeremiahRight

did anyone else watch the debate tonight on an HD channel? It looked like McCain's eyes were watery and he was blinking a lot. Did anyone else see that?

I DID, I actually wondered a couple of times if he was crying, I wonder what was up?

327 Gus 802  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:00:17am

re: #321 Sharmuta

Yep. And then he said something about "maybe you should have run in 2004." I thought that was poignant and funny.

328 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:01:07am

Joe the Plumber speaks!

[Link: www.politico.com...]

329 Gus 802  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:01:11am

Paul Volcker

330 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:02:29am

re: #328 Sharmuta

Joe the Plumber speaks!

[Link: www.politico.com...]

He's my hero.

331 JeremiahRight  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:02:53am

re: #326 Lorenska

I DID, I actually wondered a couple of times if he was crying, I wonder what was up?

I thought maybe the lights were too bright in his face or something like that. Bob Schieffer looked the same, maybe an age thing?

332 Lorenska  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:04:33am

re: #328 Sharmuta

Wow, the comments at that link are unreal. I mean, not if you're used to listening to hateful moonbats, but still. These people are what scare me, these are the voters.

333 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:04:58am

re: #309 logboy

While I was in Iraq my wife actually had a stranger say to her, "Oh I've seen "Jar Head", so I know what you're going through."

/Jarhead is just bizarre, Generation Kill seems to have more support from actual Marines for accuracy, but probably only you can decide which one or neither is realistic

334 really grumpy big dog Johnson  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:04:59am

re: #319 JeremiahRight

did anyone else watch the debate tonight on an HD channel? It looked like McCain's eyes were watery and he was blinking a lot. Did anyone else see that?

FU

335 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:05:17am

re: #331 JeremiahRight

I thought maybe the lights were too bright in his face or something like that. Bob Schieffer looked the same, maybe an age thing?

They were crying because of the bullshit Obama was spewing.

336 JeremiahRight  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:07:30am

re: #334 really grumpy big dog Johnson

FU

wow! really?

337 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:07:33am

re: #332 Lorenska

I didn't bother to look.

338 Gus 802  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:07:44am

"We'll look into it"

Barack Obama

Senator Government

339 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:09:03am

re: #332 Lorenska

Agreed! The comments are unbelievable!

Look at this moonbat comment:

"It's too bad Joe isn't a non-biased voter, he had a goal in ambushing Obama and now the media will treat him as if he's an honest representation of most people and will give a fair analysis of the candidates."

Obama went on a door-to-door photo op on Joe the Plumber's street!

It's something Obama is already living to regret (no doubt about it), but Joe wasn't a guy with a goal to ambush The Obambi.

Joe was tossing a football with his kid on the lawn.

340 really grumpy big dog Johnson  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:09:36am

re: #336 JeremiahRight

wow! really?

Apparently you didn't see the plasticine doll that is being touted as the saviour.

HD my ass.

341 Lorenska  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:10:38am

re: #337 Sharmuta

I'm a glutton for punishment, once I start reading the drivel, it's like a car wreck, I can't stop....and honestly, it's scary. The upshot is - he's a plant from the McCain camp, he should shut up because he's SOOOO rich anyway, he's a liar because plumbers don't make that much, and oh yeah, he's a racist (cause he said something about tap dancing, I guess?). It's amazing what the leftists can turn racist, it never ever fails to amaze me.

342 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:10:54am

My favorite Make Your Own Obama Poster entry:

Senator Government

343 Mr. Sandman  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:11:45am

I think the views of the general American population have shifted a good deal to the left over the last 4 years. People are sick especially of right-wing trickle down economics. I'm seeing that right wing websites like this one give vigorous opinions that McCain won this debate, and this is overwhelmingly indicated in self-selected polls for these kinds of websites. But where you think he was battering Obama did not apparently resonate that way with the general American population. They apparently saw a nasty, angry, desperate old man, not someone getting "good swipes" at Obama like you folks saw. Scientific polls from CNN and CBS show that Obama crushed McCain at this debate, even more so than in the other two debates. He won 58-31 among the general population of debate watchers (CNN poll), and 53-22 among the undecideds (CBS poll). Your world-view and way of seeing things seems considerably less in sinc with the general population than in the past. We may be witness to an election landslide, and the beginnings of a left-wing Ronald Reagan, a genuinely transformative president and era.

344 really grumpy big dog Johnson  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:12:59am

re: #341 Lorenska

I'm a glutton for punishment, once I start reading the drivel, it's like a car wreck, I can't stop....and honestly, it's scary. The upshot is - he's a plant from the McCain camp, he should shut up because he's SOOOO rich anyway, he's a liar because plumbers don't make that much, and oh yeah, he's a racist (cause he said something about tap dancing, I guess?). It's amazing what the leftists can turn racist, it never ever fails to amaze me.

You just wish you made what a plumbing contractor makes. Are you a racist?

345 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:13:03am

re: #341 Lorenska

The upshot is - he's a plant from the McCain camp...

This moonbat thinks McCain got Joe the Plumber to move to this street in case The Obambi would try to do a photo op in this election by going door to door?

Wow.

346 winston06  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:13:24am

good night every one

347 JeremiahRight  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:14:09am

I didn't mean it as a criticism, just an observation. McCain looked like he was crying, about to cry, etc. on every closeup shot. BHO looked smug and condescending, the usual for him. But McCain looked off a little

348 aboo-Hoo-Hoo  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:14:22am

re: #328 Sharmuta

Scan through the of that comment section in light of Poor Joe the Plumber:

It seems evident that the McCain campaign is going to go all Joe the Plumber, all the time. These insta-celebrities can get a very rough ride, especially if McCain’s use of him is effective. Liberal web sites will go for his jugular, and as we’ve seen with some monstrous bloggers and their willingness to say just about anything about Sarah Palin’s baby, Joe the Plumber may not have a prayer of surviving the next 20 days.
349 OtisMyMan  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:14:26am

re: #265 Pawn of the Oppressor

What interests me is how Barry Zero clearly showed his socialist side, and his classic "liberal" defeatism, if you paid attention to his ideas, instead of his delivery.

"Sacrifice"
"Fairness and Justice"
"We'll have to pay for it somehow"

He put a lot of verbal adornment on it, but his message was basically "America: BOHICA, because we can't do it, unless you give me your wallet."

His biggest mistake may have been in his closing remarks. "We all are going to have to sacrifice." This is something the elitist types never seem to understand: Never, EVER get up on the national stage and ask an American to Do Without. You might be right as rain, but we instinctively respond VERY BADLY to anybody in authority, especially a guy with an ivy league education and a cushy job, getting up there and telling us that WE THE PEOPLE are going to have to give up anything in service of your abstract social engineering plans.

Beside folks with family in the military, no one in this country has had to sacrifice anything since 1945! Next time you have a few minutes do some research on rationing, scrap metal drives, victory gardens, loose lips sink ships, keep it under your Stetson, V-mail, air raid wardens, and anything else to do with the home front here in America during WW2. And yes it was a home front because people realized that if we lost that war we would be conquered by an enemy that had no compunction about slaughtering millions of innocent people in prison camps and would have made all of the US and Europe into one big pool of slave labor to do their bidding.
They knew that to survive we had to win and to win took sacrifice on the part of every man, woman and child because losing was unthinkable.

During WW2 nazi infiltrators were rounded up, tried, found guilty and executed the following day! We are being infiltrated today by islamic nazis and we have let them literally walk across our borders unimpeded. The enemy within exists amongst our own native born populace as well. They are in our state houses and capitol buildings. They are the useful idiots that elect the enemy into office. Political correctness is their creed. They spread lies about the moral, the righteous through the main stream media, all the while covering up and obfuscating the lies and evil deeds of those on the left. Their double standards and unfairness grow more blatant and shocking every day. But the people of this country who are still willing to sacrifice grow ever more angry. The Rage Bubble continues to grow with each lie, with each insult to decency and goodness. The unrighteous arrogantly think they are safe, sheltered, cloistered and protected from harm. They think that there are enough bodyguards, police, military or private security to protect them. There isn't. I'm afraid of the consequences of their continued behavior. There are two possible outcomes, sadly, neither of which will result in the continuation of life in America as we have experienced it. Either they will win and the god fearing pro American patriot will be suppressed, or the rage bubble will burst and we will win, but pay an awful, damning price for victory. I really hope it doesn't happen. But every day, so much of what I see, hear and experience makes me think it will.

350 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:14:35am

re: #344 really grumpy big dog Johnson

You just wish you made what a plumbing contractor makes. Are you a racist?

Lorenska is describing the moonbat comments on that site.

351 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:14:42am

re: #343 Mr. Sandman

LMAO! Keep telling yourself that.

352 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:15:18am

re: #344 really grumpy big dog Johnson

Umm dude, are you actually comprehending what she's writing? Time to put the bottle down and log off for the night.

353 JeremiahRight  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:16:29am

re: #343 Mr. Sandman

what!? This country is center-right, my friend. Witness the last 2 presidential elections. Obama is toast, not a chance in Hell.

354 stonemason  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:16:51am

re: #343 Mr. Sandman

since you insist on using two biased examples as actual polls, try to remember that those same two organizations, as well as all of those 'more to the left' Americans had Kerry in the lead this same time 4 years ago.

You are wrong, the heart of America is to the right of center, and will always be.

355 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:17:51am

re: #343 Mr. Sandman

Scientific polls from CNN and CBS show that Obama crushed McCain at this debate

Hey, POS.

"Scientific polls" take more than a few minutes or hours to do.

One focus group said they thought Obama won the debate but that they still didn't trust him and wouldn't vote for him.

Put that in your bong and smoke it.

356 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:17:54am

re: #343 Mr. Sandman

Can I get your dealer's number? I want some of what you're smoking.

357 solomonpanting  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:18:02am

re: #343 Mr. Sandman

People are sick especially of right-wing trickle down economics.

Many are waiting for left-wing governmental redistribution handouts.

358 JeremiahRight  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:19:39am

re: #349 OtisMyMan

re: #349 OtisMyMan

keep it under your Stetson



don't worry, Obama's got it covered...

359 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:20:05am

Debate exclusive: Obama wins by a hair

Forty-nine percent of respondents said that Obama won the debate, compared to 46 who believed his opponent, Sen. John McCain, came out on top. The three-point gap separating the two candidates was equal to the poll’s margin of error.

Perhaps the best news for McCain is the rating he received from independent voters. Among respondents not identified with either major political party, McCain was judged tonight’s winner, 51-42 percent.

But you keep buying your brand of bullshit, Sandy.

360 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:20:21am

The country is so right of center that every single Democrat who runs for President tries like crazy to pretend that he's more to the right than he actually is.

Obama would be doing ads saying "YES, I'M PROUD TO BE PLANNING ON REDISTRIBUTING WEALTH" if the country was into it.

America doesn't want ultra-liberalism or socialism.

So Lord Barry pretends that he's not (unless someone catches him off guard.)

361 MrSnuggles  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:22:08am

re: #347 JeremiahRight

Maybe it had to do with Nancy? Reagan is his hero, after all.

362 aboo-Hoo-Hoo  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:22:34am

btw, PINMF this mornin.

363 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:22:44am

My dad came home from WWII and never talked about it. However, even as a small child, there was a large encyclopidia set of red bound books on the bookshelf. It was a photographic history of WWII, each page of each volume contained an official U.S. 8" x10" B&W photo of something absolutely historic or, more often, absolutely horrific. The only things missing were the color, smell, and sound. I was never discouraged from going through those volumes repeatedly.

/they were destroyed in a house fire when I was a teenager, I've always regretted never to be able to figure out the title of that series of volumes, everyone should have to look at it

364 pat  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:25:11am

A left wing Ronald Reagan? By an idiot who cannot even talk without a teleprompter? Too stupid to understand basic economics? A man who believes his crazy father was a hero? I agree McCain sounds like a bizarre caricature of a candidate. Frankly I find him disturbingly robotic and controlled. Whereas Obama seems to be an ignorant fool, equally controlled. But we know Bush does not control McCain. Who controls Obama?

365 Moe Katz  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:25:19am

A prolonged depression could shift things to the left a bit, I'm convinced of that. All the more reason to avoid a prolonged depression.

366 MrSnuggles  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:27:25am

Why would Americans choose to abandon freedom and embrace government control? It makes no sense, its so..... european!

367 pat  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:29:16am

re: #356 Sharmuta

Can I get your dealer's number? I want some of what you're smoking.


867-5309

368 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:30:14am

Joe the Plumber doesn't want tax increases. Joe is America, and if you can't convince a plumber to vote for you- good luck.

369 Lorenska  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:30:36am

re: #350 Adina in Judea


Thank you, Adina - I was wondering how the heck to respond to that question, I wasn't even sure what "big grumpy guy" whatever-his-name-is meant by that. As for your other comments, you're SO right on - so many of those comments said, "Oh, he's a shill for McCain, he's on the FoxNews payroll, he's a GOP pundit" - yeah, he probably bought that house years ago, knowing Obama would come a knockin, had his comments all rehearsed and everything - good heavens, the conspiracies these people think up, all because they can't think of a REAL response to this man and his real-life, "main street" issues. They talk so much about being 'for the middle class,' and then when they run into someone who actually represents us, they act like he's an alien - "well, he's not the REAL middle America, he can't be!"

370 zombie  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:31:34am

re: #343 Mr. Sandman

I think the views of the general American population have shifted a good deal to the left over the last 4 years. People are sick especially of right-wing trickle down economics. I'm seeing that right wing websites like this one give vigorous opinions that McCain won this debate, and this is overwhelmingly indicated in self-selected polls for these kinds of websites. But where you think he was battering Obama did not apparently resonate that way with the general American population. They apparently saw a nasty, angry, desperate old man, not someone getting "good swipes" at Obama like you folks saw. Scientific polls from CNN and CBS show that Obama crushed McCain at this debate, even more so than in the other two debates. He won 58-31 among the general population of debate watchers (CNN poll), and 53-22 among the undecideds (CBS poll). Your world-view and way of seeing things seems considerably less in sinc with the general population than in the past. We may be witness to an election landslide, and the beginnings of a left-wing Ronald Reagan, a genuinely transformative president and era.

Wow! Thank you. Never before have I seen someone who confirmed my theory so thoroughly and yet so unwittingly!

But I really am curious: Are you conscious of the goals of your attempted strategy, or are you just on autopilot? The main flaw in my essay is that I could never scry the motivations and thought-processes of the typical left-wing poll promoter. Yet here is my opportunity to hear it straight from the horse's mouth:

What do you think you are achieving by touting a poll-stuffed online opinion poll to a group of McCain supporters?

Seriously. I want to know.

Are you trying to convince us to vote for Obama? Due to our naivité and tendency for informational conformity?

Or are you trying to convince us to "surrender" and not vote on November 4th, because we feel we have no hope of winning?

Or have you never even stopped to consider the purpose and ramifications of your actions?

Or...what, exactly?

I can include your response in an update.

371 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:32:08am

re: #368 Sharmuta

Joe the Plumber doesn't want tax increases. Joe is America, and if you can't convince a plumber to vote for you- good luck.

Exactly!

372 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:32:25am

re: #343 Mr. Sandman

gamey buttocks anyone?

373 pat  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:33:07am

re: #368 Sharmuta

Joe the Plumber doesn't want tax increases. Joe is America, and if you can't convince a plumber to vote for you- good luck.

Put a quarter down the back of his pants. ;)

374 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:33:49am

re: #343 Mr. Sandman

/green smoke out!

375 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:34:39am

re: #370 zombie

Maybe he thinks that since we're a pro-science blog, adding "scientific" to "polling" will somehow convince us of.... something.

376 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:35:07am

re: #369 Lorenska

As for your other comments, you're SO right on - so many of those comments said, "Oh, he's a shill for McCain, he's on the FoxNews payroll, he's a GOP pundit" - yeah, he probably bought that house years ago, knowing Obama would come a knockin, had his comments all rehearsed and everything - good heavens, the conspiracies these people think up, all because they can't think of a REAL response to this man and his real-life, "main street" issues. They talk so much about being 'for the middle class,' and then when they run into someone who actually represents us, they act like he's an alien - "well, he's not the REAL middle America, he can't be!"

Yeah!

It's so perfect that Obama went to Joe's street as a photo op!

Obambi wanted to talk to real Americans to show that he's "in touch" and he found a real American who doesn't want Obama's tax raises.

Obambi is banging his head against the wall as we speak. :)

377 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:36:01am

re: #328 Sharmuta

Joe the Plumber speaks!

[Link: www.politico.com...]

Joe doesn't like Obama - he thinks Obama "tap dances". But Joe thinks John McCain shoots straight with America.

Joe's gonna vote for Mac/Sarah.

Go JOE!

378 pat  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:36:01am

re: #375 Sharmuta

Maybe he thinks that since we're a pro-science blog, adding "scientific" to "polling" will somehow convince us of.... something.

Hmmm. Intelligent Denial.

379 Inquisitive  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:36:36am

re: #374 redc1c4

/green smoke out!

I think he was just a drive by....did a hit and run....

380 JeremiahRight  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:36:42am

re: #373 pat

Put a quarter down the back of his pants. ;)

those plumbers could use some coin slot creme

381 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:37:49am

re: #375 Sharmuta

Polling isn't scientific, it's more mathematics. Statistics more likely. Never trust something that takes a small sample to infer an outcome on a large population. Hari Seldon hasn't been born yet.

382 pat  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:39:02am

re: #380 JeremiahRight

LOL. Cute. Very. I love it!

383 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:39:08am

re: #379 Inquisitive

Still logged in. Just waiting to drop his turd in the punch bowl I guess.

/firing up the BBQ

384 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:39:30am

re: #379 Inquisitive

I think he was just a drive by....did a hit and run....

naw.... look at his recent history. he's a sleeper that's just come to life.

all we need now is the stick to put him back under. %-)

/tosses a yellow smoke onto the sandman

385 pat  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:39:39am

Off to read. Nite all.

386 Fenway_Nation  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:40:22am

Mr. Sandstrawman is probably just doing a driveby tonight.

387 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:40:28am

re: #377 Intrepid

Joe is exactly the type of American that 0bama can't connect with, and there are millions of us.

388 Aisha  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:40:52am

Aisha does not know what to think, and will have to turn to the pages of the Noble Quaran for guidance.

In any event, Aisha thinks that Bend Over Barrack (don't tell Aisha that Obama and his sharmuta don't do this). might well end up Kufr in Chief.

An Apostate and a Kufr versus a Kufr with a shameless Vice President who flaunts her lady parts in public and in private and ignores the laws of hijab.

Aisha is so conflicted and confused; it is like the "elections" in the Zionist Entity - whatever friggin' happens there, a stinky ol' Jew wins.

389 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:41:04am

Geraldine Ferraro is stupid. If she's claiming the Fox Text Poll is being flooded with young voters, aren't young voters for Obama and his radicalism? If McCain is kicking ass in the Fox Text Poll and the Text Poll is "only young people" and not "undecideds" then that doesn't bode well for Obama.

Ferraro, you idiot.

390 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:41:33am

Well great, now the images of GIs using corn brooms to sweep the snow off the grotesquely contorted victims of Malmédy just popped into my head.

/the SS was depraved

391 Inquisitive  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:41:43am

Good night all......lots of good comments made regarding the debate tonight......and this unscientific poll....right here in this average American home.....says McCain won....
McCain 2
Obama 0

392 Lorenska  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:43:33am

re: #376 Adina in Judea

Oh, so true - you just KNOW he's ripping some poor campaign aide a new one..."how could you let that guy get near me, why didn't you stop me from talking, where was my teleprompter?". But what scares me most of all is, he's not really taking back what he said - he's just trying harder to sell the idea. He's not saying he misspoke, he MEANT he wants to redistribute Joe's income - he just thinks he can make everyone see what a wonderful idea it is, if only we'd listen to him. It's like I said earlier - sharing sounds so nice, until you realize that sharing means giving away what you have (involuntarily, in Obama's world). And if you have less, then you hire less, and you buy less, and you spend less, and that means the business down the street makes less, and they then hire less, and they buy less, and so on and so on until capitalism is GONE. And by the way, where is my incentive to work and succeed if my paycheck is going to Bob the moron down the block? And if I have no incentive, how do you get me to work and be a productive citizen? And if no one has any incentive to be productive, how does anything get done? Isn't there a word for that? I think it starts with an S, didn't we outlaw it around the time of Lincoln....?

393 BakaRanger  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:43:47am

re: #299 solomonpanting

Well, you had better hurry.

that damned suicide net is the worst idea ever. So what if 15 or 20 people want to jump each year, I say let em. Don't mess with the bridge


/ This whole anti leaping net is an affront to the suicide community.

394 Spirit93  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:43:52am

re: #383 BlueCanuck

Still logged in. Just waiting to drop his turd in the punch bowl I guess.

/firing up the BBQ

How can you tell?

BTW, I got your Seldon ref, I must have read that book at least 20yrs ago!

395 pat  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:45:08am

re: #388 Aisha

I live Aisha when she shaves.

396 Inquisitive  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:45:24am

re: #383 BlueCanuck

Still logged in. Just waiting to drop his turd in the punch bowl I guess.

/firing up the BBQ

Have fun and I am sure Charles will appreciate it if you would clean up the mess after your BBQ party is done.

397 Aisha  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:45:57am

You see, if we vote Obama because he is better than kufr-sharmuta, then we still may need to sentence him to death for sharee crime of apostasy. Then what is it Biden-Pelosi - well we then have to sentence Pelosi to death for sharee crimes related to hijab and homobuttfuckualism, so then who gets to be Biden's VP? Aisha is confused. Biden would probably convert to Islaaam because he doesn't really believe or think anything, but that is not the kind of Muslim that we want in the Ummah.

Oh Alllllaaaaah!

398 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:46:18am

re: #383 BlueCanuck

Still logged in. Just waiting to drop his turd in the punch bowl I guess.

/firing up the BBQ

is that anything like diarrhea ice cubes?

/hands out the brain bleach

399 Inquisitive  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:46:26am

re: #384 redc1c4

naw.... look at his recent history. he's a sleeper that's just come to life.

all we need now is the stick to put him back under. %-)

/tosses a yellow smoke onto the sandman

Hey.... is this the same one that you was going to let me throw the green smoke at the other eve?

400 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:46:38am

re: #394 Spirit93

If you click on a lizards (or in this case troll) icon it will give that persons details. Also near the top it will say if the person is logged in. Otherwise nothing.

401 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:47:47am

re: #396 Inquisitive

Don't worry about that. And if there's any left overs I will put it in the fridge.

402 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:47:47am

re: #387 Sharmuta

Joe is exactly the type of American that 0bama can't connect with, and there are millions of us.

Wait - you mean real Americans? The ones who work and pay taxes and do the purchasing and consuming here in this country?

Those Americans?

403 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:48:36am

I wonder whether Joe knows that his union endorsed Obama way back in January and, if so, what he thinks about that?

404 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:50:20am

re: #403 JustMyView

I wonder whether Joe knows that his union endorsed Obama way back in January and, if so, what he thinks about that?

I thought guilt by association wasn't valid?

405 Aisha  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:50:43am

Wasn't the Sandkufr a regular poster here years ago. Aisha seems to remember something in the deep dark past about that kufr. Aisha was only six at the time, so she was fit for marryin', not for postin.

406 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:50:49am

re: #387 Sharmuta

Joe is exactly the type of American that 0bama can't connect with, and there are millions of us.

Obama was expecting to find Obamabots on Joe's street.

He sure got a surprise.

You're right that Obama can't connect (and he has no idea why.)

407 Fenway_Nation  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:51:10am

re: #403 JustMyView

I wonder whether Joe knows that his union endorsed Obama way back in January and, if so, what he thinks about that?

Probably some 'buyer's remorse' on his union's part!

408 Outrider  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:51:11am

re: #358 JeremiahRight

re: #349 OtisMyMan



don't worry, Obama's got it covered...

That a cigarette in his right hand?

409 Pawn of the Oppressor  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:51:36am

T-shirts

"Obama don't know Joe"
"Plumbers for Smaller Government"
"Joe '08"

410 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:51:47am

re: #403 JustMyView

I wonder whether Joe knows that his union endorsed Obama way back in January and, if so, what he thinks about that?

I would wager a guess that Joe thinks he's capable of deciding for himself.

411 zombie  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:52:19am

re: #390 Killian Bundy

Well great, now the images of GIs using corn brooms to sweep the snow off the grotesquely contorted victims of Malmédy just popped into my head.

/the SS was depraved

I once long ago wrote an essay about the Malmedy Massacre. One of many atrocities by the Nazis that have mostly been forgotten.

Even if they had never committed the Holocaust, most of the Nazi leadership still deserved to be hanged for war crimes.

412 Inquisitive  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:52:49am

Hope to talk to you all tomorrow eve...really gotta go lay this head on a pillow for a little while.

413 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:52:53am

re: #397 Aisha

Aisha, it is a Muslim paradox, to be sure.

414 Walter L. Newton  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:53:26am

I'm on here 3-4 times a day almsot every day. When did Aisha start posting again. Or have I been missing her somehow.

Walter in Golden, Co.

415 JeremiahRight  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:53:51am

bedtime for me.

one for the road, did Engels predict the rise of BHO? :)

What is genuine is proved in the fire, what is false we shall not miss in our ranks. The opponents must grant us that youth has never before flocked to our colours in such numbers, ... in the end, one will be found among us who will prove that the sword of enthusiasm is just as good as the sword of genius. - Frederick Engels

416 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:53:52am

re: #399 Inquisitive

Hey.... is this the same one that you was going to let me throw the green smoke at the other eve?

could be.... that was a lot of beers ago, so i couldn't say for sure.

toss one anyway, just for S&G's. %-)

417 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:53:53am

re: #402 Intrepid

Wait - you mean real Americans? The ones who work and pay taxes and do the purchasing and consuming here in this country?

Those Americans?

Yes. People with real jobs, not bullshit jobs like "community organizer".

418 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:54:29am

re: #404 TheMatrix31

I thought guilt by association wasn't valid?

I don't understand what guilt by association has to do w/ the question I asked.

419 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:54:39am

re: #358 JeremiahRight

re: #349 OtisMyMan



don't worry, Obama's got it covered...

Brokebarack Mountain.

420 Aisha  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:55:12am

Zombie-kufr, probably because it would not help the Zionists disposess the Arabs and Muslims of Palestine. All the other "massacres" (if the history books are correct) are exaggerated by the Zionist kufr. Allahu-akhbar!

421 Spirit93  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:55:14am

re: #400 BlueCanuck

Thanks Blue, learn something new everyday on LGF.

422 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:55:19am

So... joining a union means I sign over my right to think for myself?

423 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:56:29am

re: #418 JustMyView

I don't understand what guilt by association has to do w/ the question I asked.

You're saying that the union he's a part of (is that even confirmed, btw?) supports Obama. What the hell does it matter who his union supports? And if you're somehow implying that he's a hypocrite or should be associated with his union's view just because he's "part of" that union, that's bullshit. Why is it bullshit? Because Barack's associations have been downplayed and deemed irrelevant by people like you, and the media.

424 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:56:53am

re: #384 redc1c4

tosses a yellow smoke onto the sandman

Why not just use your radio to call in (illegal, war criminal) white phosphorus artillery rounds?

/direct fire if possible, just like they did (bogus MSM hissy fit) in Fallujah?

425 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:57:00am

re: #422 Sharmuta

So... joining a union means I sign over my right to think for myself?

No one said that.

426 Aisha  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:57:04am

Yes. Muslim paradox. Do we praise Hitler for killing the Jews, or do we say that it never happened? Was 9/11 a triumphant act of jihaad, or a sneaky act by the Sharonist Zionist Jew? Aisha gets so confused sometimes!

427 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:58:21am

re: #403 JustMyView

His union might endorse Nobama, that dosen't mean he has to. My dads union sponsered the NDP up here, but he always voted Conservative.

428 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:58:36am

re: #392 Lorenska

Oh, so true - you just KNOW he's ripping some poor campaign aide a new one..."how could you let that guy get near me, why didn't you stop me from talking, where was my teleprompter?". But what scares me most of all is, he's not really taking back what he said - he's just trying harder to sell the idea. He's not saying he misspoke, he MEANT he wants to redistribute Joe's income - he just thinks he can make everyone see what a wonderful idea it is, if only we'd listen to him.

Agreed!

It's like I said earlier - sharing sounds so nice, until you realize that sharing means giving away what you have (involuntarily, in Obama's world). And if you have less, then you hire less, and you buy less, and you spend less, and that means the business down the street makes less, and they then hire less, and they buy less, and so on and so on until capitalism is GONE. And by the way, where is my incentive to work and succeed if my paycheck is going to Bob the moron down the block? And if I have no incentive, how do you get me to work and be a productive citizen? And if no one has any incentive to be productive, how does anything get done? Isn't there a word for that? I think it starts with an S, didn't we outlaw it around the time of Lincoln....?

Obama doesn't understand that incentive plays a huge role in all this.

He thinks he can level everything out without having an impact on the productivity that is driven by things like competition and success.

Obama sees the current productivity levels as unshakable no matter how badly he bleeds productive people (while rewarding unproductive people.)

429 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 12:58:41am

re: #425 JustMyView

Then why are you bringing up Joe's union endorsement?

430 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:01:20am

re: #423 TheMatrix31

You're saying that the union he's a part of (is that even confirmed, btw?) supports Obama. What the hell does it matter who his union supports? And if you're somehow implying that he's a hypocrite or should be associated with his union's view just because he's "part of" that union, that's bullshit. Why is it bullshit? Because Barack's associations have been downplayed and deemed irrelevant by people like you, and the media.

I have no idea whether he's a member of the union. Not sure how unions of independent tradesmen work. Perhaps you know. Are most plumbers members of a union?

431 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:01:35am

Aisha,

You are confusing me.

Please see my avatar.

/I think I understand, though. I am a smart Jewess. :)

432 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:01:40am

Everyone see the latest eeevil FoxNews cover up ?

PIC

/

433 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:02:17am

re: #403 JustMyView

I wonder whether Joe knows that his union endorsed Obama way back in January and, if so, what he thinks about that?

/just a guess, but he probably thinks the absolutely unAmerican concept of card check sucks big donkey dicks and I'm guessing if that turns out to be true you'll go away

434 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:03:13am

re: #420 Aisha

Aisha, MandyManners was calling for you a couple of days ago, yet you did not answer her.

Perhaps you could be persuaded to hang around tomorrow morning so that Mandy can converse with you?

/inshallah! dammit

435 Alberta Oil Peon  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:03:21am

re: #418 JustMyView

I don't understand what guilt by association has to do w/ the question I asked.

We will duly take note, and add that to the list of things you choose not to understand.

436 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:03:28am

re: #429 Sharmuta

Then why are you bringing up Joe's union endorsement?

Because, as my original post said, I'm curious about whether Joe knows about the endorsement and, if so, what he thinks about it. He's certainly not obligated to follow the union's endorsement, but it'd be interesting to hear his reasons for disagreeing w/ them.

437 Fenway_Nation  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:03:31am

My my...what's this? Looks like I may have stumbled upon one reason certain unions have endorsed 0bama.

/So glad you brought that up, JustMyView

438 solomonpanting  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:03:43am

re: #403 JustMyView

I wonder whether Joe knows that his union endorsed Obama way back in January and, if so, what he thinks about that?

re: #430 JustMyView

I have no idea whether he's a member of the union. Not sure how unions of independent tradesmen work. Perhaps you know. Are most plumbers members of a union?

Well, you've covered all the bases here.

439 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:04:41am

re: #418 JustMyView

I don't understand what guilt by association has to do w/ the question I asked.

fixed that for ya!

440 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:04:44am

re: #430 JustMyView

I have no idea whether he's a member of the union. Not sure how unions of independent tradesmen work. Perhaps you know. Are most plumbers members of a union?

Don't know. Don't care. If there's no concrete link to him and this Union, you bringing it up is even more irrelevant than it would otherwise be.

441 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:04:58am

re: #436 JustMyView

Because, as my original post said, I'm curious about whether Joe knows about the endorsement and, if so, what he thinks about it. He's certainly not obligated to follow the union's endorsement, but it'd be interesting to hear his reasons for disagreeing w/ them.

But then you admit you don't even know if he's a union member, so your entire premise is flawed.

442 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:05:40am

In honor of Joe the Plumber's comment that his encounter with Obama was a "tap dance...almost as good as Sammy Davis, Jr." I present this. Skip ahead to about seven minutes in for Obama's signature scene.

443 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:07:15am

re: #424 Killian Bundy

Why not just use your radio to call in (illegal, war criminal) white phosphorus artillery rounds?

/direct fire if possible, just like they did (bogus MSM hissy fit) in Fallujah?

as an old 11H10, i prefer to wait until he's inside my range fan then fly a TOW missile up his 4th point of contact.

/sure fire cure for hemorrhoids!

444 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:07:42am

re: #437 Fenway_Nation

I hope that abomination never gets passed. Personally I hate unions. Saw what they have done to my family, and others. Mind you there's good ones and bad ones. But overall the time of the union I believe is past. There is enough government legislation to protect the average worker that unions have become redundant. In fact most of them are bloated beauacracies that's only purpose is to further their self intrest. Not the workers.

445 Outrider  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:07:50am

re: #436 JustMyView

Because, as my original post said, I'm curious about whether Joe knows about the endorsement and, if so, what he thinks about it. He's certainly not obligated to follow the union's endorsement, but it'd be interesting to hear his reasons for disagreeing w/ them.

My guess is you would have to ask Joe the plumber

446 Fenway_Nation  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:08:25am

re: #430 JustMyView

I have no idea whether he's a member of the union. Not sure how unions of independent tradesmen work.

Yet you didn't hesitate to bring it up in order to imply that Joe was ignorant or being hypocritical.

447 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:08:42am

re: #443 redc1c4

Not to mention constipation as well.

448 Moe Katz  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:10:25am

re: #446 Fenway_Nation

Yet you didn't hesitate to bring it up in order to imply that Joe was ignorant or being hypocritical.

Maybe I missed the boat, but my impression was that if the union supported Obama it implied that Joe was less representative of the mindset of his occupational group---if not his class---than McCain would have it.

449 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:10:55am

Justmyview,

Joe Biden looks like a Klingon.

450 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:12:38am

re: #448 Moe Katz

Maybe I missed the boat, but my impression was that if the union supported Obama it implied that Joe was less representative of the mindset of his occupational group---if not his class---than McCain would have it.

When a union backs a candidate, isn't it the union bosses who do this?

In this case, Obama is promsing the unions that they would get non-secret ballots for union certifications if he becomes President.

I think this favors the union bosses rather than the union workers.

451 Outrider  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:12:46am

re: #441 Sharmuta

But then you admit you don't even know if he's a union member, so your entire premise is flawed.

He is self employed or business owner isn't he? Wasn't that the entire focus of Obamas remarks to him? Why would a manager or owner be union. (possibly for contracts maybe?)

452 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:13:17am

re: #449 RTLM

Justmyview,

Joe Biden looks like a Klingon.

That is quite unfair to Klingons. They know an enemy when they see one and they a sense of honor. Neither on these traits applies to Joe Biden.

453 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:13:20am

re: #449 RTLM

Justmyview,

Joe Biden looks like a Klingon.

/a singin' Klingon!

454 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:13:47am

re: #448 Moe Katz

Maybe I missed the boat, but my impression was that if the union supported Obama it implied that Joe was less representative of the mindset of his occupational group---if not his class---than McCain would have it.

No- if Joe belongs to that union, than all it means is that the union doesn't speak for Joe, and it might just be the union powers that be who are out of touch with the people they represent and not the other way around.

Might be why the unions are keen to to do away with secret ballots if they're aware that they and their own members are politically at odds.

455 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:14:03am

re: #446 Fenway_Nation

Yet you didn't hesitate to bring it up in order to imply that Joe was ignorant or being hypocritical.

No, you inferred that. I implied nothing of the sort. I'm just curious about what he'd have to say about the stance taken by the group that represents people in his trade.

456 Fenway_Nation  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:14:14am

re: #448 Moe Katz

Yet a couple of dozen MacBeth or Podesta's get together for Winter Soldier 2 and it's supposed to be representative of the whole U.S. Military....

457 Stonemason  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:14:24am

re: #436 JustMyView

I am a reluctant member of the SEIU, who support Obama with more than just money.

I do not support Obama in any way.

Union membership should not mean a darn thing politically

458 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:14:31am

re: #449 RTLM

Joe Biden looks like a Klingon.

It's the botox and the hair plugs.

The combination is really severe in his case.

459 Moe Katz  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:14:32am

re: #450 Adina in Judea

When a union backs a candidate, isn't it the union bosses who do this?

In this case, Obama is promsing the unions that they would get non-secret ballots for union certifications if he becomes President.

I think this favors the union bosses rather than the union workers.

No, it favors both, because it is difficult to organize a workplace without a secret ballot due to fear of management reprisals.

460 solomonpanting  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:15:02am

re: #449 RTLM

Justmyview,

Joe Biden looks like a Klingon.

Looks like Walter.

461 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:15:41am

It's amazing how many times in this debate Lord Prsident For Life Obama says people can afford more taxes.

/WTF?

462 Outrider  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:16:10am

re: #443 redc1c4

as an old 11H10, i prefer to wait until he's inside my range fan then fly a TOW missile up his 4th point of contact.

/sure fire cure for hemorrhoids!

11H? Yep. Yet another MOS that has disappeared. Them non-electric pop-up targets (11B) now do it all.

463 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:16:23am

Also- many trades offer you no choice. You have to join the union whether you want to or not. For example- I was a Teamster for awhile. I had no choice to join the Teamsters other than to not accept the job. The Teamsters never spoke for me and their opinion on who I should support with my vote meant nothing to me.

464 Stonemason  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:16:59am

re: #448 Moe Katz


No...union members do not necessarily support the candidates that the union elites support. Union elites are bought and paid members of the DNC, Dem politicians are bought and paid for members of the pro-union coalition...(I can get you proof of the bought and paid for stuff, but would have to then kill you).

We lowly union members just want to work.

465 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:18:23am

re: #464 Stonemason

No...union members do not necessarily support the candidates that the union elites support. Union elites are bought and paid members of the DNC, Dem politicians are bought and paid for members of the pro-union coalition...(I can get you proof of the bought and paid for stuff, but would have to then kill you).

We lowly union members just want to work.

Exactly- and if members were to desire a change in leadership, a non-secret ballot would be a good way to make them think twice about real change they could believe in.

466 Adina in Judea  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:18:27am

re: #461 Killian Bundy

It's amazing how many times in this debate Lord Prsident For Life Obama says people can afford more taxes.

/WTF?

Lord Barry thinks that raising taxes and spreading the wealth around via socialism would be "better for everybody."

The socialist cat is out of the bag completely (at last.)

467 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:18:58am

re: #463 Sharmuta

I hear you there. I work in security, never seen a union rep, never gone to a meeting, don't remember signing a join up paper. But once a month they take their dues off my check.

468 Fenway_Nation  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:19:28am

re: #455 JustMyView

I'm just curious about what he'd have to say about the stance taken by the group that represents people in his trade.

I imagine the Union higer-ups would have no problem with it. But like I said- between the proposed abolition of the secret ballot in union elections and 0bama's no-longer-veiled socialism starting to seep to the surface after being cuaght off-guard by a seemingly inevitable question, I'm thinking there's some 'buyer's endorsement remorse' from other parts......

469 Stonemason  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:19:35am

re: #459 Moe Katz

No, it favors both, because it is difficult to organize a workplace without a secret ballot due to fear of management reprisals.

BULLSHIT...I would be more intimidated by the people I work with everyday than the guys in suits. The rank and file are much more physically powerful, they know where I park, where I live.

secret ballots are safer for all.

470 Moe Katz  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:19:44am

re: #454 Sharmuta

No- if Joe belongs to that union, than all it means is that the union doesn't speak for Joe, and it might just be the union powers that be who are out of touch with the people they represent and not the other way around.


I gotta tell you, Sharmuta, my experience with unions in my socialist youth was that most of the rank-and-file think very similarly to their leaders, from whose ranks they are elected. There is a lot of social pressure there; think of zombie's essay and the bit about the Asch conformity experiments.

471 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:20:54am

re: #467 BlueCanuck

I hear you there. I work in security, never seen a union rep, never gone to a meeting, don't remember signing a join up paper. But once a month they take their dues off my check.

Ponzi scheme for nothing but the leadership, Hon.

472 Outrider  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:22:24am

re: #455 JustMyView

No, you inferred that. I implied nothing of the sort. I'm just curious about what he'd have to say about the stance taken by the group that represents people in his trade.

Or at least the union leaderships stance. I have never seen nor heard of any general vote taken of the membership as to which candidate they prefer. The leadership always assumes its members will vote for the Democrat candidate.

473 Stonemason  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:22:59am

re: #470 Moe Katz

I gotta tell you, Sharmuta, my experience with unions in my socialist youth was that most of the rank-and-file think very similarly to their leaders, from whose ranks they are elected. There is a lot of social pressure there; think of zombie's essay and the bit about the Asch conformity experiments.

I am not going to guess your age, but now the union leaders are college grads that have never worked in the trades (with a few notable exceptions such as the carpenters in Philly)

All the SEIU leaders never pushed a broom or turned a wrench.

474 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:23:14am

re: #470 Moe Katz

I gotta tell you, Sharmuta, my experience with unions in my socialist youth was that most of the rank-and-file think very similarly to their leaders, from whose ranks they are elected. There is a lot of social pressure there; think of zombie's essay and the bit about the Asch conformity experiments.

I'm sure there are plenty who still think like the union bosses want, but I think there is growing dissent from the ranks.

475 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:24:11am

re: #465 Sharmuta

Exactly- and if members were to desire a change in leadership, a non-secret ballot would be a good way to make them think twice about real change they could believe in.

/widespread card check is infinitely more dangerous in spreading nonessential unions like a cancer to shut down every grocery and retail store anywhere within 100 miles of where you currently live

476 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:24:25am
477 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:24:31am

re: #447 BlueCanuck

Not to mention constipation as well.

it's amazing what a little HEAT will do for ya.....

just ask Qusay & Uday!

478 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:24:48am

re: #472 Outrider

Or at least the union leaderships stance. I have never seen nor heard of any general vote taken of the membership as to which candidate they prefer. The leadership always assumes its members will vote for the Democrat candidate.

Right. I think there's usually some sort of committee or board that makes decisions about which candidates to endorse.

479 HelloDare  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:24:58am
480 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:26:00am

re: #457 Stonemason

I am a reluctant member of the SEIU, who support Obama with more than just money.

I do not support Obama in any way.

Union membership should not mean a darn thing politically

you can cut your dues so that your money isn't going to their PAC's......

481 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:26:20am

re: #472 Outrider

When's the last time a labor union endorsed a republican?

482 Outrider  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:26:44am

re: #478 JustMyView

Right. I think there's usually some sort of committee or board that makes decisions about which candidates to endorse.

Sounds democratic as hell don't it?

483 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:26:47am

pimf - Air Force 2

---> [Link: www.cloudster.com...]

484 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:27:11am

My dad was a Teamster - I remember reading the annual "prospectus" he got in the mail. I used to tease him about the "officers" having names like "Jimmy 'the rat' Scarpelli" and other unsavory sounding characters.

The teamsters were a great union, in their time.

485 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:27:39am

re: #462 Outrider

11H? Yep. Yet another MOS that has disappeared. Them non-electric pop-up targets (11B) now do it all.

well, i have the 11B MOS also.....

Harmony Church
Class of '83

486 Moe Katz  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:27:42am

re: #474 Sharmuta

I'm sure there are plenty who still think like the union bosses want, but I think there is growing dissent from the ranks.

I have no doubt you're right, and I imagine it varies a lot between different industries and geographical areas. I wouldn't want to overgeneralize.

487 Fenway_Nation  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:29:19am

re: #481 Sharmuta

Does the Fraternal Order of Police count?

488 Moe Katz  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:30:02am

re: #484 Intrepid

My dad was a Teamster - I remember reading the annual "prospectus" he got in the mail. I used to tease him about the "officers" having names like "Jimmy 'the rat' Scarpelli" and other unsavory sounding characters.

The teamsters were a great union, in their time.

Was Jimmy Hoffa the leader at the time?

489 Outrider  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:30:13am

re: #481 Sharmuta

When's the last time a labor union endorsed a republican?

Have they ever? Ask them why the union employees (secretaries, clerks, drivers, janitors, warehouse men) are not permitted to be union.

Guess they don't want their labor walking out on them in a sympathy strike perhaps? lol

490 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:30:28am

re: #482 Outrider

Sounds democratic as hell don't it?

Doesn't sound so bad. I imagine the board is elected, so it's a case of representative democracy. Not much different than the way corporations relate to their shareholders.

491 JimCap  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:31:48am

I'm worried. Actually, I'm more than worried at this point. Conservatives are realists. We face facts. We don't go on our "feelings".

So, given that, how do we deal with these facts?
[Link: www.electoral-vote.com...]

Obama is way up even in some Bush states.

And for those of us who say, "But Kerry was up at this point four years ago!", I suggest you take a look at this:
[Link: www.electoral-vote.com...]

Face reality, folks. We'd be laughing at the Obama people if they were this far down and insisting they were still going to win this thing.

492 Outrider  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:32:36am

re: #485 redc1c4

well, i have the 11B MOS also.....

Harmony Church
Class of '83

Same here. 11B4PF7 as a secondary and 98Z5MPK3 as primary.

493 Aisha  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:33:02am

re: #431 Adina in Judea

Aisha,

You are confusing me.

Please see my avatar.

/I think I understand, though. I am a smart Jewess. :)


Wassallam, kufr, just repeat after Aisha, Zionazi infidel, "Ani me'id she'ein el chutz mi-Allah ve'Muhammad navi Allah!".

Allah Ha'gadol! Hoshi'ah et Aisha me'ha-ashlayot v'ha-kefirot shel ha-Yehudim ve'ha-Tzionim!

494 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:33:16am

re: #488 Moe Katz

Was Jimmy Hoffa the leader at the time?

No, but the subsequent presidents all seemed to get some time in jail. Frank Fitzsimmons, Roy Williams...

Yikes.

495 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:33:39am

re: #487 Fenway_Nation

Does the Fraternal Order of Police count?

Not really, in my mind, no. Not so much labor as it is public service.

re: #489 Outrider

Have they ever? Ask them why the union employees (secretaries, clerks, drivers, janitors, warehouse men) are not permitted to be union.

Guess they don't want their labor walking out on them in a sympathy strike perhaps? lol

LOL- great point.

496 Moe Katz  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:35:04am

re: #494 Intrepid

No, but the subsequent presidents all seemed to get some time in jail. Frank Fitzsimmons, Roy Williams...

Yikes.

I guess they achieved things for their membership, though. Gangsters though they were...

497 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:35:50am

re: #478 JustMyView

Right. I think there's usually some sort of committee or board that makes decisions about which candidates to endorse.

Why do yo embarrass yourself by still commenting here? You're sole purpose is to lick up to Obama and you're not changing any minds. Your lickster is currently winning, so just get the [expletive deleted] out of here!

/you wouldn't know what a union was even after it duct taped and held your head to the ground, forcibly pulled out your lower intestinal tract, washed it's hands, and called it a day

498 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:36:18am

re: #495 Sharmuta

Not really, in my mind, no. Not so much labor as it is public service.

Police unions are still unions, with everything that implies. I'm not an expert, but my impression is that they're very powerful. Dealing w/ municipal unions is a big part of what mayors do.

499 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:36:53am

re: #491 JimCap

Look, Eeyore- I'm tired of this shit. Go play at malkin's or something.

Because conceding the election now is a 100% certain way to defeat, m'kay?

500 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:37:24am

re: #498 JustMyView

Uh- I asked about labor unions.

501 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:37:50am

re: #492 Outrider

Same here. 11B4PF7 as a secondary and 98Z5MPK3 as primary.

show off..... in all my 20 years i never got past being a -10 in anything, and didn't ever get an ASI either.

however, when i got out, i *was* the Specialist of the Army. %-)

502 Moe Katz  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:38:21am

re: #499 Sharmuta

Look, Eeyore- I'm tired of this shit. Go play at malkin's or something.

Because conceding the election now is a 100% certain way to defeat, m'kay?

You're right, Sharmuta, he's ba-a-a-ack

503 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:38:32am

re: #498 JustMyView

Police unions are still unions, with everything that implies. I'm not an expert

Do yourself a big favor.

/LEAVE NOW!

504 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:39:02am

re: #500 Sharmuta

Uh- I asked about labor unions.

But what's the conceptual or practical difference? Police officers are laborers, as are we all. What makes a union a union isn't the kind of work the members do. It's the kind of relationship they have to each other and to management.

505 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:39:21am

It is time for bologna and crackers. Yes, it has come to that, my friends.

brb

506 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:39:28am

re: #499 Sharmuta

Look, Eeyore- I'm tired of this shit. Go play at malkin's or something.

Because conceding the election now is a 100% certain way to defeat, m'kay?

I've only been a regular poster for a little while and I'm sick of them too. I'm very short tempered. While the reality is in my mind, this constant pessimistic agitator bullshit is really grinding my gears.

507 Outrider  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:40:44am

re: #501 redc1c4

show off..... in all my 20 years i never got past being a -10 in anything, and didn't ever get an ASI either.

however, when i got out, i *was* the Specialist of the Army. %-)

I was a sucker for volunteering. I got sent to a lot of schools and deployments that others didn't want. It all paid off in the end.

508 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:41:16am

Oh / BTW,

Barack Obama is not Robin Hood.

Robin Hood took BACK from the sheriff of Nottingham.

Not the other way.

509 alien_mind  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:41:34am

re: #403 JustMyView

I wonder whether Joe knows that his union endorsed Obama way back in January and, if so, what he thinks about that?

i'm sure he knows that and is quite pissed. you see Joe seems to think for himself. shocking revelation though, that a union would support BO.

510 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:42:31am

re: #504 JustMyView

What's the conceptual or practical difference between a democrat and a socialist?

511 Spirit93  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:42:45am

re: #491 JimCap

1. You are treading on thin ice.

2. The only poll that counts is the one on Nov 4.

3. Go read this: Zombie: The Left's Big Blunder

512 Moe Katz  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:43:43am

re: #511 Spirit93

Please Don't Feed the Trolls

513 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:43:51am

re: #507 Outrider

I was a sucker for volunteering. I got sent to a lot of schools and deployments that others didn't want. It all paid off in the end.

well, the NG rarely has the $ for that, and when they do, only the fair haired are chosen..... at least where i was.

btw: what is the F7 ASI and what's a 98Z?

514 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:44:20am

"Senator Government"! LOL!

/and that's the NICEST thing one could say about him! ;-)

GO PHILLIES!

515 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:44:50am

re: #474 Sharmuta

I'm sure there are plenty who still think like the union bosses want, but I think there is growing dissent from the ranks.

Expect it to continue growing as unions recruit more and more illegals.

516 Outrider  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:46:14am

re: #513 redc1c4

well, the NG rarely has the $ for that, and when they do, only the fair haired are chosen..... at least where i was.

btw: what is the F7 ASI and what's a 98Z?

F7 is Pathfinder. A 98Z is Senior Intelligence NCO. Some intell MOSs convert into 98Z when E8 is reached. In my case 05H (morse interceptor/electronic warfare).

517 Mr. Sandman  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:49:41am

re: #370 zombie

Well, first of all the CBS news poll I referenced took a random sample of uncommitted voters, so it's not an invalid, unscientific poll as you suggest. There is also non-scientific online poll that anyone who goes to their website can choose to participate in, but that's a separate operation than the poll I referenced.

I was just went back here one last time to check the responses to my post after doing some work before hitting the sack for tonight, and so I don't feel like reading through your essay right now. There's no real "grand motivation" for my posting here, I just want to see how some folks with some opposing world views will react to my arguments, if some will give coherent arguments against mine, and how virulent some may possibly get. I guess if there is some other motivation from what you list, it would be the "try to get you to surrender and give up hope and not bother vote" option, though realistically I realize I'm not going to dishearten enough people through these posts to have any impact. So my main point is not that, but simply to see how folks on websites like these would react to facts they may not be aware of, due to tunnel vision.

518 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:51:20am

re: #512 Moe Katz
I like feeding trolls, sharpens my wits for when I go after my lib family members. However one time posters are a waste of even my time.

519 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:51:49am
520 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:53:43am

Looks like Joe will not be voting this year.

521 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:54:05am

re: #514 littleoldlady

Morning littleoldlady. How's things in Philly?

/*snicker*
//don't ask why. :)

522 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:54:23am

re: #517 Mr. Sandman

Well, first of all the CBS news poll I referenced took a random sample of uncommitted voters, so it's not an invalid, unscientific poll as you suggest. There is also non-scientific online poll that anyone who goes to their website can choose to participate in, but that's a separate operation than the poll I referenced.

I was just went back here one last time to check the responses to my post after doing some work before hitting the sack for tonight, and so I don't feel like reading through your essay right now. There's no real "grand motivation" for my posting here, I just want to see how some folks with some opposing world views will react to my arguments, if some will give coherent arguments against mine, and how virulent some may possibly get. I guess if there is some other motivation from what you list, it would be the "try to get you to surrender and give up hope and not bother vote" option, though realistically I realize I'm not going to dishearten enough people through these posts to have any impact. So my main point is not that, but simply to see how folks on websites like these would react to facts they may not be aware of, due to tunnel vision.

and thus it admits it's a troll.

(and a lame one at that. %-)

i sense a swinging stick in 5, 4, 3...........

523 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:55:54am

re: #521 BlueCanuck

BlueCanuck! :-)

snicker?

Good thing I'm not living on the other side of the state. I'd hate to be a racist.

/in addition to bitterly clinging to my guns and bible...

GO PHILLIES!

524 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:56:12am

re: #522 redc1c4

and thus it admits it's a troll.

(and a lame one at that. %-)

i sense a swinging stick in 5, 4, 3...........

Not yet, I just got the coals down to a nice even glow.

525 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:56:14am

Bologna and crackers is yummy!

526 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:57:18am

re: #523 littleoldlady

Inside joke in the real world.

/all I am going to say.
//nothing to do with your precious Phillies.

527 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:57:25am

re: #525 Intrepid

You missed an Eeyore.

528 Spirit93  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:57:38am

re: #519 TheMatrix31

Bias? What bias?

Unfrikenbelievable.

That whole meme that all O has to do to win is sit there like a dummy. Man I hate the MSM.

529 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:57:56am

troll flavored fruitcup, anyone?

530 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:58:37am

Jesus Just Left Chicago

Do your union "employees" work 4-10 hours a week and then fly home to their condos in Florida? I'm still not sure that's been totally busted. It took tenacity to break that particular union where I was and it eventually worked out well for everyone. And I refused to go work in Chicago. State Street baby, did your district manager ever sport a machine gun?

/I pity the fools trying to get proper concrete in Boston, the Big Dig is already collapsing, New York/New Jersey garbage colection anyone?

531 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 1:59:06am

re: #528 Spirit93

That whole meme that all O has to do to win is sit there like a dummy

Why would this be different than the rest of his campaign? That's what's been happening all along. Obama just IS.

532 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:00:09am

Good morning, afternoon, evening *everyone*!™

Fruitcup is on the buffet ----------------->
Help yourselves!

GO PHILLIES!

533 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:00:30am

re: #527 Sharmuta

You missed an Eeyore.

No, I saw the eyeore - I just chose to ignore 'em. Tired of their crap.

I'm still gonna plug away with my Mac/Sarah schtick, and see who else is on the same page.

I'm looking forward to a Joe the Plumber ad for Mac/Sarah....

534 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:00:33am

re: #531 littleoldlady

Why would this be different than the rest of his campaign? That's what's been happening all along. Obama just IS.

kinda like fruitcup in a way......

535 Fenway_Nation  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:00:47am

Oh look....littleoldlady got some fruitcup shaped like the stylized 'P' in the Phillies logo.

/What's the occasion?

536 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:00:53am

Yummm fruitcup. Thanks little old lady.

537 Mr. Sandman  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:01:30am

re: #359 Sharmuta

Well, the best thing to do when you have conflicting polls, and no information that one or more of the conflicting polls is flawed, is to average (perhaps weighted by sample size) the poll numbers. I'm not going to bother doing that right now, for the separate groups, etc., but I'm confident that since Obama's win in the CBS and CNN polls were so substantial, that accurately doing the averages with the correct groups from the Politico poll and the other polls will still yield a solid win for Obama in this debate.

538 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:02:49am

re: #535 Fenway_Nation

Oh look....littleoldlady got some fruitcup shaped like the stylized 'P' in the Phillies logo.

/What's the occasion?

"p" is for psychedelic.....

(it's the peyote! %-)

539 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:03:10am

re: #532 littleoldlady

Good morning, afternoon, evening *everyone*!™

Fruitcup is on the buffet ----------------->
Help yourselves!

GO PHILLIES!

I'm a Braves fan, but thanks!

540 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:03:13am

Thanks for the fruit cup, Little old lady! You come through with the goods every time!

541 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:03:57am

red! :-)

Blue! :-)

/do I hear green? ;-)

Fenway! :-)

GO PHILLIES!

542 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:04:14am

re: #537 Mr. Sandman

Well, the best thing to do when you have conflicting polls, and no information that one or more of the conflicting polls is flawed, is to average (perhaps weighted by sample size) the poll numbers. I'm not going to bother doing that right now, for the separate groups, etc., but I'm confident that since Obama's win in the CBS and CNN polls were so substantial, that accurately doing the averages with the correct groups from the Politico poll and the other polls will still yield a solid win for Obama in this debate.

except that "winning" the debates is meaningless in the scheme of things.

(kinda like you posting your bullshit here. %-)

543 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:04:54am

re: #541 littleoldlady

red! :-)

Blue! :-)

/do I hear green? ;-)

Fenway! :-)

GO PHILLIES!

we've had some green smoke tossed out tonight, if that counts. %-)

544 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:04:59am

Matrix! :-)

Did you finish your homework?

Intrepid!

545 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:05:22am

re: #537 Mr. Sandman

But there is information that the polls are flawed. They are over sampling democrats when in the last 20 years party identification has only favored democrats by 3-4%. Suddenly party ID is is a 25% difference?! I don't think so. But continue on your merry little way thinking these polls are "scientific".

546 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:05:22am

How sad that Mr Sandman cannot acknowledge LOL and fruit cup, but insists on perpetuating some ridiculous theories he/she has.

547 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:06:02am

Hi littleoldlady. I am happy for you for your Phillies.

548 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:06:10am

re: #544 littleoldlady

Matrix! :-)

Did you finish your homework?

Intrepid!

Yep. Finished around 3:30am last night. The assignment due tomorrow (or, later today for you) got postponed til Tuesday.

549 redc1c4  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:07:19am

well hell..... once again it's after 0200, and i'm still awake.

"i'll only log in for a few minutes......." wtf was i thinking? %-)

hasta y'all.......

L8r!

550 Spirit93  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:09:13am

Past my bedtime. Nite all.

551 IslandLibertarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:09:14am

re: #547 Sharmuta

Sharm,
were you able to copy the NOeeyore image?

552 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:09:17am

Mr. Sandman... lives in a dream
Where party ID is more than it seems....

553 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:09:45am

Intrepid! :-)

/forgot your smiley ;-)
//need more coffee!

Sharmuta! :-)

Thankyew! :-)

554 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:09:53am

re: #551 IslandLibertarian

I did save it, but was unable to change my avatar to it. I think it must be too big, but click my nic!

555 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:10:18am

Can anyone tell me what "sukkhot" is? What kind of holiday is it? Am I even mentioning the right holiday?

556 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:10:28am

'Night red! :-)

'Night Spirit! :-)

557 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:10:58am

re: #549 redc1c4

re: #550 Spirit93

Night folks have yourselves a good rest and weet dreams.

558 IslandLibertarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:11:14am

cool..........you owe me........it was not as easy as I thought it would be

559 mountman  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:11:52am

re: #363 Killian Bundy

My dad came home from WWII and never talked about it. However, even
as a small child, there was a large encyclopidia set of red bound books
on the bookshelf. It was a photographic history of WWII, each page of
each volume contained an official U.S. 8" x10" B&W photo of
something absolutely historic or, more often, absolutely horrific. The
only things missing were the color, smell, and sound. I was never
discouraged from going through those volumes repeatedly.

/they
were destroyed in a house fire when I was a teenager, I've always
regretted never to be able to figure out the title of that series of
volumes, everyone should have to look at it

I grew up with that set, also. It consists of 11 volumes, entitled "Pictorial History of the Second World War," published by Wm. H. Wise & Co, starting in 1944. I have the entire set, still, and it is indeed horrific. My folks thought I ought to learn the reality of war, and I started looking at those photos when I was 5.

Re: Lorenska
Re: Surferdoc

I live 1 hr N of Edward AFB just outside the Naval Base at China Lake, CA. Worked there for 35 yrs as a civilian, conjuring up ways to beat the Russkies. Retired in '94. Maybe looking at all those WWII pics changed my whole life.

(Incidently, there are only really 3 hot mos here in the High Desert, from mid June to mid Sept. The rest of the year is perfect for 4x4ing, hiking, smog free living, skiing, star gazing,...; I am still fully engaged here after 48 years)

560 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:12:15am

re: #558 IslandLibertarian

You already have my undying gratitude. I will figure out some way to repay you.

561 akak  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:13:03am

re: #532 littleoldlady

Good morning, afternoon, evening *everyone*!™

Fruitcup is on the buffet ----------------->
Help yourselves!

GO PHILLIES!

Too bad your gonna lose Pat Gillick as GM of your Phillies. He always does this though, build a great team then leave.
Greatest GM in a long time I believe.

562 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:13:16am

Secret Service says "Kill him" allegation unfounded

SCRANTON – The agent in charge of the Secret Service field office in Scranton said allegations that someone yelled “kill him” when presidential hopeful Barack Obama’s name was mentioned during Tuesday’s Sarah Palin rally are unfounded.

563 IslandLibertarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:14:30am

re: #560 Sharmuta

ok.........but now I must sleep.....11:15 here.....work early tomorrow.....
'nite 'tiles

564 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:14:30am

re: #562 RTLM

Secret Service says "Kill him" allegation unfounded

Obama lie from tonight's debate #1.

565 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:15:02am

re: #555 Intrepid

Sukkot.

Jewish holidays in a nutshell: They tried to kill us. We won. Let's eat!

566 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:16:24am

re: #565 littleoldlady

Lousy link. Sorry! Click through to main page then click on "Sukkot".

567 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:17:52am

re: #565 littleoldlady

Sukkot.

Jewish holidays in a nutshell: They tried to kill us. We won. Let's eat!

WOOT! I knew I loved the Jews for a reason! What other G-d mandates so many celebrations?! Heh!

568 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:18:08am

re: #561 akak

akak! :-)

Listen, we are EARLY going to the Super Bowl World Series by my calculations. I didn't expect us to be there until 2010!

/we'll take it, any way we can...

569 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:19:13am

re: #564 Intrepid

Obama lie from tonight's debate #1.

And read further - [Link: www.timesleader.com...]

News organizations including ABC, The Associated Press, The Washington Monthly and MSNBC’s Countdown with Keith Olbermann reported the claim, with most attributing the allegations to the Times-Tribune story.

570 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:20:24am

When you dig down, nonessential unions equal organized crime, maybe you don't recognize it in terms of "mafia", but it's still organized crime, same gravy train on the public's back.

/you barely have to scratch the surface

571 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:22:15am

re: #510 Sharmuta

What's the conceptual or practical difference between a democrat and a socialist?

JMV- I'm really disappointed that you didn't take a crack at this.

572 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:22:56am

re: #567 Intrepid

Yes, Sukkot is one of the "festival" holidays. It celebrates the fall harvest, and observant Jews build a "sukkah" (open air room) on their property and at the very least have their meals in it, much like a family would live in the fields during the harvest in biblical times.

This time of year we've got non-stop holidays from Rosh Hashana to Simhat Torah.

573 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:23:34am

re: #559 mountman

I grew up with that set, also. It consists of 11 volumes, entitled "Pictorial History of the Second World War," published by Wm. H. Wise & Co, starting in 1944. I have the entire set, still, and it is indeed horrific. My folks thought I ought to learn the reality of war, and I started looking at those photos when I was 5.

I bookmarked that and I'll get back to you if it's the same.

/sounds about right though

574 Intrepid  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:26:09am

My eyeballs are begging to be covered over for an extended amount of time, and I'm sick and damned tired of the Rug Doctor infomercial. No Billy Mays there, sadly for Rug Doctor.

Good night, all! Remember - Mac and Sarah will win this thing because they are the right leaders for the right time.

575 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:27:09am

'Night Intrepid! :-)

576 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:30:53am

Saw this elsewhere - too good not to share.

Homo Stupiducus -

Society today is composed of two distinct species. The first, Homo sapiens...what we consider to be normal intelligent logical people who understand cause and effect, people that understand nothing is free and everthing costs something.
The second species is Homo Stupidicus. This species believes that they are entiteled to have all the wonderful things in life but that they should not have to work for it. The believe that they should not have to risk anything but still reap success. They believe that government can create money out of thin air and should give it to everyone that doesn’t have enough.
Homo Stupidicus has grown, prospered and bred to become a majority of the populace because Homo Sapiens had a minor brain fart and created welfare, social security and modern medicine. Prior to these inventions Homo Stupidicus rarely lived long enough to breed.
We have shortcircuited the filter in the gene pool....Homo Stupidicus is now breeding rampantly and has reached a critical mass where the members of this species outnumber Homo Sapiens. They continue to demand more and more from the productive species while becoming less and less capable of self control, self direction, self reliance and at times self awareness.
The two species are virtually indistinguishable physically. You cannot determine which species you are confronted with by simply looking at them. You have to listen to them to find out whether they are sapient...intelligent, or stupidicus. Homo Stupidicus will invariably make their presence know by the socialistic bleatings they utter.
Most Homo Sapiens are politically conservative or independent. Homo Stupidicus is almost exclusively liberal or apolitical....meaning they don’t care who is in charge as long as the food stamps and welfare check shows up every month.

I can tell.

577 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:31:24am

Night Intrepid, enjoy your eyelid inspection.

578 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:31:59am

re: #574 Intrepid

Bye, Darlin'!

579 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:32:34am

re: #571 Sharmuta

JMV- I'm really disappointed that you didn't take a crack at this.

I was similarly disappointed that you didn't take a crack at describing the difference between a union of police officers and any other kind of union. That was, in fact, the topic of the conversation we were having.

580 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:36:10am

re: #559 mountman

I grew up with that set, also. It consists of 11 volumes, entitled "Pictorial History of the Second World War," published by Wm. H. Wise & Co, starting in 1944. I have the entire set, still, and it is indeed horrific. My folks thought I ought to learn the reality of war, and I started looking at those photos when I was 5.

Oh, and thanks profusely.

/you may have solved a 35+ year mystery for me, I'm saving the research until I'm sober tomorrow

581 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:38:33am

re: #579 JustMyView

I was similarly disappointed that you didn't take a crack at describing the difference between a union of police officers and any other kind of union. That was, in fact, the topic of the conversation we were having.

It's degrees of extortion.

/are you still here?

582 Tamron  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:40:38am

re: #52 opnion

Unbelieveable campaign! Rampant voter fraud, MSM partisanship, Obama Campaign attempts at prior restraint from criticism, vandalism against those with McCain bumper stickers & yard signs. What would an Obama presidency be like?


"Back to the Future", Part II.
.

583 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:43:15am

re: #579 JustMyView

I didn't answer you because I don't believe you can't tell the difference between a labor union and a municipal employee's union. If you truly cannot tell the difference, then I don't think there is anything I could say that would help you.

584 Tamron  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:44:10am

re: #553 littleoldlady

Intrepid! :-)

/forgot your smiley ;-)
//need more coffee!

Sharmuta! :-)

Thankyew! :-)


LittleYoungGal! Heidi, y'all!
.

585 mountman  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:44:17am

re: #580 Killian Bundy

Oh, and thanks profusely.

/you may have solved a 35+ year mystery for me, I'm saving the research until I'm sober tomorrow

My pleasure Killian. Glad to help with any further info.

586 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:44:34am

re: #579 JustMyView

And- I didn't say anything to you about police officer's unions. You injected yourself into my reply to Fenway, who didn't seem to have a problem with my answer.

587 yma o hyd  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:46:34am

Hi Lizard Nation - I still have to read your comments on the debate, but think you'll like this poster ...

Its from hillbuzz - and you gotta thank Sharmuta for providing us all with links to that site!

(If its been posted already - forgive me!)

((Back to reading now ...))

588 Stonemason  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:47:26am

re: #517 Mr. Sandman

Tunnel vision? When one is confronted day after day, from source after source with the exact information you tend to bring up, how can you argue that our presenting an opposing view denotes tunnel vision?

Do you head into the swamps of kos or du and play the same game?

if not, why not?

589 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:47:38am

Tamron! :-)

590 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:48:01am

re: #583 Sharmuta

I didn't answer you because I don't believe you can't tell the difference between a labor union and a municipal employee's union. If you truly cannot tell the difference, then I don't think there is anything I could say that would help you.

They both look like labor unions to me. I'm pretty sure that's how mayors think of them. If you want to convince me there's a difference, you'll have to explain what it is. It's not fair to dismiss me by saying, "if you can't tell the difference," when you haven't made the slightest effort to explain.

591 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:48:56am

yma o hyd! :-)

More apropos - "I am not a crook!"

592 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:54:25am

Red Headed Moonbat Palin Protester caught on cell-cam
/

/

593 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 2:59:13am

Asian markets tumble; Nikkei falls 10 percent

This sucks.

/give it your best, I've still got at least three years to outwait your irrational fear out and depending who you like, tempt fate!

594 armaros  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:01:59am

"Kill Him" Yell a lie according to the Secret Service present at the Palin rally in question.

[Link: www.timesleader.com...]
Of course the MSN had it all over the presses. ...Shocked....Not.....

595 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:03:37am

re: #593 Killian Bundy

Killian,

What do you think of Huckabee's suggestion that there *may* be "economic terrorism" involved here?

596 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:04:47am

re: #587 yma o hyd

Actually- I think Hillbuzz stole it from LGF. That same poster appeared here right after the debate.

597 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:05:54am

re: #582 Tamron

"Back to the Future", Part II.
.

Marty: "It's like we're in hell or something."
Doc: "No no, it's Hill Valley although I can't imagine HELL being much worse!"

-----Back to the Future Trilogy are my favorite movies of all time.

598 rightside  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:08:10am

Morning Lizards!

599 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:08:54am

re: #595 littleoldlady

Killian,

What do you think of Huckabee's suggestion that there *may* be "economic terrorism" involved here?

/different concept, provide evidence, with 19 days to go, precision is the watchword

600 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:10:06am

re: #595 littleoldlady

Killian,

What do you think of Huckabee's suggestion that there *may* be "economic terrorism" involved here?

What do you mean "economic terrorism"?

601 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:13:13am

re: #600 TheMatrix31

Huckabee was on Fox a few days ago and said that according to somebody he knew (who was qualified to know what he was talking about) the fact that the stock market seemingly took a steep dive every day, late in the day was somehow purposely engineered.

602 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:13:46am

re: #593 Killian Bundy

Asian markets tumble; Nikkei falls 10 percent

This sucks.

/give it your best, I've still got at least three years to outwait your irrational fear out and depending who you like, tempt fate!

How effing ironic, all this.

603 Shug  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:14:27am
604 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:15:02am

re: #601 littleoldlady

Huckabee was on Fox a few days ago and said that according to somebody he knew (who was qualified to know what he was talking about) the fact that the stock market seemingly took a steep dive every day, late in the day was somehow purposely engineered.

**sigh**, I wouldn't be surprised.

605 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:15:35am

re: #590 JustMyView

You can't tell the difference between a union whose employees put their life on the line every time they punch in on the clock and a union whose members have more traditional jobs?

I suppose I could concede the point to you if I thought every person who collected a paycheck was a "laborer", but since I don't think every job is equal, I can't.

606 yma o hyd  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:16:02am

re: #596 Sharmuta

Actually- I think Hillbuzz stole it from LGF. That same poster appeared here right after the debate.

Sorree - I'm still whizzing through the debate threads (wow, Lizards rock!), and have to vanish now for a bit.

I'll leave you with this little gem from today's early morning 'BBC Breakfast' TV chat: after the usual biased crap from a BBC reporter (yep, B0 won, heh), the two chat hosts were looking at each other and looking around, asking, 'who is this Joe-the Plumber?'! On camera!

Gotta go - BBL!

607 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:17:08am

Well guys, I was planning on going into business after I get out of UCLA, but I guess I can't make more than $250,000!

$249,999 is okay, though.

608 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:17:56am

re: #600 TheMatrix31

What do you mean "economic terrorism"?

/for selling what's not legally allowed if the SEC was paying attention or you're not allowed to take your chances tomorrow

609 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:18:24am
610 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:19:52am

re: #603 Shug

Obama benefits from a stupid, ill-informed electorate

It feels a lot more like 1976 than 1938 to me.

611 Shug  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:20:09am

This ignorant fool says it all

From sharmuta's link in the spinoffs, the Joe the Plumber Interview

How can he not know where Obama stands? Obama kept having to repeat himself continually on what he intends to do. Democrats are for the working class. Republicans for BIG business. Also it wont matter who is voted in taxes will have be raised how can we lower our national debt. Obama wants the higher income to pay for it because they can afford to pay more then the middle class.

Idiot

612 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:20:19am

re: #607 TheMatrix31

I cannot tell you how many times I've heard from supposedly knowledgeable people, "But I don't make over $250,000, so I won't pay more taxes."

/idjots

613 NC State of Mind  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:21:02am

re: #607 TheMatrix31

Well guys, I was planning on going into business after I get out of UCLA, but I guess I can't make more than $250,000!

$249,999 is okay, though.

Good morning Lizards! Has anyone fact checked BO's sorry ass on this statement. I have checked Factcheck.org after the last two debates and-nothing. I call bullshit that only 2% of small businesses make over 250k.

614 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:21:03am

plooooooooooomie! :-)

615 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:21:19am

re: #612 littleoldlady

I cannot tell you how many times I've heard from supposedly knowledgeable people, "But I don't make over $250,000, so I won't pay more taxes."

/idjots

And what do you tell them? That these businesses will just transfer their extra tax onto consumers?

616 goddessoftheclassroom  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:23:22am

Good morning, Lizards!

617 rightside  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:23:45am

re: #613 NC State of Mind

Rush read the other day about this very thing. It was astounding how many types of businesses there are that would qualify as a small business only if they made X amount of dollars...most were in the 7 to 21 million range!

618 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:24:54am

re: #603 Shug

Obama benefits from a stupid, ill-informed electorate

This is what happens when people pay more attention to American Idol than American government.

619 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:25:58am
620 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:27:36am

Yes, 1976. The conclusion of an unpopular war. An grinning, idealistic Democrat candidate vs. a boring bald RINO.

With a bright light (Reagan) shining up toward a city on a hill (Palin).

Ah - parallels.

621 Shug  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:28:15am

re: #618 Sharmuta

This is what happens when people pay more attention to American Idol than American government.

yep.
I'll bet you that 90% of the people who flunked that quiz can name all 3 judges on American Idol.

And when asked what are their thoughts about the Fed cutting interest rates, they assume you are talking about K. Fed

622 goddessoftheclassroom  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:29:03am

If the the government giveth, the government can taketh away. Be able to support yourself and being resilient enough with a solid base of skills it how people succeed.

I've also thought that EVERY citizen should pay some nominal percentage of income since everyone enjoys the protection of the USA. If everyone paid 10% (like in Monopoly), the "rich" would still pay more.

623 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:29:44am

re: #621 Shug

yep.
I'll bet you that 90% of the people who flunked that quiz can name all 3 judges on American Idol.

And when asked what are their thoughts about the Fed cutting interest rates, they assume you are talking about K. Fed

Unfortunately, that douchebag went to my middle school.

624 Shug  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:30:39am

re: #623 TheMatrix31

Unfortunately, that douchebag went to my middle school.


Is that as far as he went?

625 rightside  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:31:56am

re: #622 goddessoftheclassroom

Exactly! If you make 10X more than someone you should pay 10 times more in taxes, not 30 times more!

626 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:32:31am

re: #603 Shug

Obama benefits from a stupid, ill-informed electorate

That's a very odd conclusion to draw from that news story. The story clearly says that levels of knowledge are similar among people across the ideological spectrum. These are bone-headed questions, but people who follow Hannity and Colmes are not, in general, more likely to know the answers than readers of The New Yorker.

The article has something to say about our collective ignorance, but I don't think it has anything to say about the knowledge levels of people who support different candidates.

627 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:32:38am

re: #615 TheMatrix31

I thank them in advance for supporting me in the next few years.

I tell them that this will negate any tax breaks they MAY see at the beginning of Obama's term.

Then, if all else fails, yes I do try to explain how capitalism works - how the Obama plan will cause a massive loss of jobs and a huge reduction of tax dollars into the government's coffers. Meanwhile, Obama has refused to concede he'll need to cut back on his multi-billion dollar programs, regardless of the current economic conditions.

628 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:32:50am

re: #622 goddessoftheclassroom

I know one gentleman here in Canada that pays the government around $50,000 a month in taxes. I don't know what his tax rate is but that's the facts.

/I want to be there someday too. :)

629 Shug  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:34:06am

I have a great Idea. Let's take Obama's plans to their logical end. Let's increase the top marginal tax rate to 100%.

Think of all the money the govt will make when the super wealthy work the last 11 months a year to pay taxes

/

630 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:34:25am

re: #613 NC State of Mind

Good morning Lizards! Has anyone fact checked BO's sorry ass on this statement. I have checked Factcheck.org after the last two debates and-nothing. I call bullshit that only 2% of small businesses make over 250k.

It is bullshit. I researched it myself.

According to the latest Internal Revenue Service data, $706 billion of pass-through business income was reported in 2006. Of this, two-thirds was earned in households making more than $250,000 -- households on which Obama has said he will raise taxes.

Source

631 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:34:26am

rightside! :-)

goddess! :-)

632 goddessoftheclassroom  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:35:11am

{littleoldlady}!

So glad to be able to say hi!

633 NC State of Mind  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:35:50am

re: #625 rightside

I would be willing to bet that a large portion of the populace would hear "The rich pay 17%, the poor pay 17%, the middle class pay 17%" and then not understand that the amount, in dollars, would be far greater for the rich. We lack critical thinking. All many people know of Obama is a one word platform: CHANGE!

634 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:36:01am

re: #632 goddessoftheclassroom

Like sheeps in the night...
© Archie Bunker

;-)

635 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:36:26am

re: #624 Shug

Is that as far as he went?

I wouldn't be surprised.

636 Scion9  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:37:00am

re: #436 JustMyView

Because, as my original post said, I'm curious about whether Joe knows about the endorsement and, if so, what he thinks about it. He's certainly not obligated to follow the union's endorsement, but it'd be interesting to hear his reasons for disagreeing w/ them.

Didn't the US Steelworker's union recently enter into some kind of deal with a Euro labor union with the stated goal of 'fighting international capitalism'?

637 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:38:03am

More on 0bama's business tax policies

[Link: money.cnn.com...]

638 Shug  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:38:18am

re: #626 JustMyView

That's a very odd conclusion to draw from that news story. The story clearly says that levels of knowledge are similar among people across the ideological spectrum. These are bone-headed questions, but people who follow Hannity and Colmes are not, in general, more likely to know the answers than readers of The New Yorker.


Colbert Report, CNN, Letterman/Leno viewers are the democratic base.

and they scored lower

639 rightside  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:40:26am

{lol}
{goddess}

640 NC State of Mind  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:40:34am

re: #630 Sharmuta

It absolutley kills me that he and Biden are not taken to task for these lies and that Troopergate is top of the fold news.

641 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:41:29am

re: #640 NC State of Mind

It absolutley kills me that he and Biden are not taken to task for these lies and that Troopergate is top of the fold news.

To be fair, I haven't heard anything about Troopergate since that night the report came out. After that, nothing.

642 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:41:41am
643 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:42:20am
644 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:42:21am

re: #638 Shug

Colbert Report, CNN, Letterman/Leno viewers are the democratic base.

and they scored lower

The publications at the top of the list are also favored by liberals. Obama is favored by college-educated voters. If I were you, I don't think I would go too far in making arguments about the relative intellectual achievements of McCain supporters vs. Obama supporters.

645 opnion  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:43:15am

Good Morning all! Could Obama have had anymore of a mocking smirik.

646 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:43:31am

re: #636 Scion9

Didn't the US Steelworker's union recently enter into some kind of deal with a Euro labor union with the stated goal of 'fighting international capitalism'?

Seems unlikely, but I have no idea.

647 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:44:32am
648 rightside  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:45:24am

re: #633 NC State of Mind

I would have to agree with that. It's a sad state of affairs that quite a portion of the electorate is ignorant when it comes to such things. The democrats, and to some extent republicans, rely on that fact. It's how they have power.

Over decades, trillions of dollars have been extracted from those who produce, and given to those who do not. Has there been an improvement in everyone's lives? No. Yet year after year, decade after decade, the ignorant choose the same people over, and over, and over again.

649 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:45:31am
650 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:46:12am
651 opnion  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:46:25am

Game Six of the World Series is sheduled for 10/29 & that is the same night as Barrys half hour media buy. Get this, MLB & Fox have a greeed to delay the start of the game up to a half hour to avoid conflict!

652 RTLM  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:46:27am

/Windows Update

[Link: castfire.cdn.fm...]

safe,

653 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:47:10am

re: #651 opnion

Phillies in 5, dearie.

654 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:47:16am

re: #651 opnion

Game Six of the World Series is sheduled for 10/29 & that is the same night as Barrys half hour media buy. Get this, MLB & Fox have a greeed to delay the start of the game up to a half hour to avoid conflict!

I've heard about this, I just don't get it.

What is a media buy? Does this mean he's going to have a half hour commercial running on the four major networks at the same time?

655 Scion9  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:47:24am

re: #646 JustMyView

Seems unlikely, but I have no idea.

Yes, they did. Gotta find the link. They also took a case to the supreme court challenging NAFTA, because they wanted industry specific Protectionism.

656 yesandno  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:47:40am

re: #644 JustMyView

The publications at the top of the list are also favored by liberals. Obama is favored by college-educated voters. If I were you, I don't think I would go too far in making arguments about the relative intellectual achievements of McCain supporters vs. Obama supporters.

College educated these days doesn't necessarily relate to "intellectual achievements".

For example, no doubt you have a college education?

657 Shug  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:48:21am

re: #644 JustMyView

The publications at the top of the list are also favored by liberals. Obama is favored by college-educated voters. If I were you, I don't think I would go too far in making arguments about the relative intellectual achievements of McCain supporters vs. Obama supporters.


It's a biased sample in terms of size.

A small number score high.

A large number score low

658 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:49:16am
659 opnion  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:49:43am

re: #654 TheMatrix31

I've heard about this, I just don't get it.

What is a media buy? Does this mean he's going to have a half hour commercial running on the four major networks at the same time?

I guess, something like that. I don't believe that it is all four major networks, but just two. I could be wrong about that.

660 NC State of Mind  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:49:50am

re: #644 JustMyView

The publications at the top of the list are also favored by liberals. Obama is favored by college-educated voters. If I were you, I don't think I would go too far in making arguments about the relative intellectual achievements of McCain supporters vs. Obama supporters.

Correlation does not imply causality.

661 Scion9  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:51:18am

re: #658 ploome hineni

Yes, the 'fighting internation capitalism' statement was made by a US Union official in regards to that deal. Gotta love how these unions are out to 'help' the worker.

662 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:52:32am

re: #640 NC State of Mind

Trust me- small business owners know what it is they're facing- that is, if they've watched the debates and have looked into 0bama's plan.

I know it's anecdotal, but a few weeks ago I told two of my bosses I didn't think 0bama would be good for businesses. One was nodding at me, and the other hardly looked at me and gave me the impression he was leaning 0bama. After debate #2 where 0bama said small businesses making under $250,000 would not get a tax increase, that same 0bama-aired boss started being real friendly to me. I think he saw exactly what it was I had warned about. I don't think he's alone.

663 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:52:55am
664 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:53:46am

re: #644 JustMyView

If I were you, I don't think I would go too far in making arguments about the relative intellectual achievements of McCain supporters vs. Obama supporters.

I think you are an asshole.

665 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:54:18am
666 goddessoftheclassroom  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:54:31am

Got to run...have a great day, Lizards!

667 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:55:01am

Later goddess. See around.

668 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:55:20am
If I were you, I don't think I would go too far in making arguments about the relative intellectual achievements of McCain supporters vs. Obama supporters.

You mean achievements like bombing the Capitol?

669 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:56:00am

re: #662 Sharmuta

Trust me- small business owners know what it is they're facing- that is, if they've watched the debates and have looked into 0bama's plan.

I know it's anecdotal, but a few weeks ago I told two of my bosses I didn't think 0bama would be good for businesses. One was nodding at me, and the other hardly looked at me and gave me the impression he was leaning 0bama. After debate #2 where 0bama said small businesses making under $250,000 would not get a tax increase, that same 0bama-aired boss started being real friendly to me. I think he saw exactly what it was I had warned about. I don't think he's alone.

But what exactly is it that they're facing? I just read the article you linked to @ 637, and it certainly did not convey the idea that Obama's policies would be more expensive for small businesses than McCain's.

670 TheMatrix31  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:56:04am

Gonna go to bed, guys. Cheers!

671 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:56:15am
672 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:56:37am

re: #668 Sharmuta

You mean achievements like bombing the Capitol?

Or hacking a candidates private e-mail account?

673 sparrowlake  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:57:07am

Good morning LGF.
HELP!

674 opnion  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:57:13am

re: #644 JustMyView

The publications at the top of the list are also favored by liberals. Obama is favored by college-educated voters. If I were you, I don't think I would go too far in making arguments about the relative intellectual achievements of McCain supporters vs. Obama supporters.


The polls that I have seen do show Barry with a lead among the college educated, but I seem to recall that graduate degree & above favor McCain. I do know that Obama supporters that I know personally seem to be really ignorant of the issues & in full denial about Obama's associations.

675 armaros  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:57:15am

Sharmutah:

" Obama benefits from a stupid, ill-informed electorate

This is what happens when people pay more attention to American Idol than American government."

Totally....

676 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:57:56am
677 jim in virginia  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:58:54am

Morning all. Couldn't get in here or to NRO last night. Like a morning without caffeine.
Asian markets having their worst day in five years. Hang on to your hats, it's going to be a bumpy ride today.

678 ibmkeyboard  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 3:58:55am

re: #662 Sharmuta

the impression he was leaning 0bama. After debate #2 where 0bama said small businesses making under $250,000 would not get a tax increase, that same 0bama-aired boss started being real friendly to me. I think he saw exactly what it was I had warned about. I don't think he's alone.


And small business owners try to communicate their feeling to their employees.
If we can overcome the millions of votes the democrats have forged,

McCain might win.

679 NC State of Mind  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:00:29am

I used to sorta-kinda see how the "other side" viewed the world and could almost in a way empathize with some of their positions. Now I don't see how they remember how to get their pants on in the morning.

Gotta run-have a great day all you intellectually superior McCain guys.

680 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:01:29am

re: #669 JustMyView

They're facing a tax increase and a mandate to provide health insurance. Go ask 0bama for specifics if you're so concerned. Lord knows he hasn't been asked by the msm, and hasn't provided any sort of real answer other than bullshit.

681 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:03:46am
You have to pinch yourself – a Marxisant radical who all his life has been mentored by, sat at the feet of, worshipped with, befriended, endorsed the philosophy of, funded and been in turn funded, politically promoted and supported by a nexus comprising black power anti-white racists, Jew-haters, revolutionary Marxists, unrepentant former terrorists and Chicago mobsters, is on the verge of becoming President of the United States. And apparently it’s considered impolite to say so.
682 opnion  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:04:33am

I found it ironic , but not surprising that Barry cast himself as a victim of negative campaigning.
Barrys ads & supporters have been really negative. His suurogates are attempting to steal the election through fraud& the obscene Palin T Shirts are a new low.

683 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:05:36am

re: #674 opnion

The polls that I have seen do show Barry with a lead among the college educated, but I seem to recall that graduate degree & above favor McCain. I do know that Obama supporters that I know personally seem to be really ignorant of the issues & in full denial about Obama's associations.

This is just one survey, but it does show that support for Obama rises with educational level, including postgraduate education.

684 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:05:41am

re: #678 ibmkeyboard

And small business owners try to communicate their feeling to their employees.
If we can overcome the millions of votes the democrats have forged,

McCain might win.

I don't know what you're talking about, frankly. ACORN has registered only 1.5 million "people". We have 5-7 million PUMAs. ACORN's registrations are being tossed across the country. PUMAs are real voters. I'm not that worried we're going to win, because we are.

685 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:06:21am

re: #683 JustMyView

Gallup?! LMAO!

686 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:07:33am

re: #680 Sharmuta

They're facing a tax increase and a mandate to provide health insurance. Go ask 0bama for specifics if you're so concerned. Lord knows he hasn't been asked by the msm, and hasn't provided any sort of real answer other than bullshit.

He clearly said in last night's debate that small businesses will not be required to provide health insurance for their employees. Try to keep your ideology from getting in the way of the facts.

687 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:07:55am

For those who helped me source the Barney Frank's Fannie Mae love connection last night here is the final product.

Thanks lizards.

So, give me a sec to catch up here. Any fruitcup left?

688 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:08:08am
689 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:08:42am

re: #686 JustMyView

The same 95% small businesses making under $250K a year? Riiiiiggggghhhhttt.

690 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:09:26am

re: #686 JustMyView

LMAO @ you, hypocrite.

691 opnion  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:10:53am

re: #683 JustMyView

This is just one survey, but it does show that support for Obama rises with educational level, including postgraduate education.

That survey does debunk what I thought that I saw. Besides, I can't cite it & this is more consistent.
However, as I said earlier, Obama supporters that I know are very unaware of the issues & seem to be into Group Think.
The othetr thing that I have found, when they have an opinion that does not agree with Barry, they swear that Obama agrees with them.

692 Salamantis  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:11:49am

Hey Sharm; check out my spinoff link. Now we know why they wrote Explore Evolution; with two of its authors advising Texas on textbooks, they can leverage an acceptance there to shoehorn it in around the nation.

693 x-wing  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:12:02am

re: #686 JustMyView

He clearly said in last night's debate that small businesses will not be required to provide health insurance for their employees. Try to keep your ideology from getting in the way of the facts.

What does he consider a small business, then?

694 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:13:20am

re: #691 opnion

What's the numbers on the breakdown of party ID of the participants of that survey? Did they ask more dems than republicans? Unless you can see the internals, don't buy shit from Gallup.

695 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:14:43am

re: #686 JustMyView
From his web page.

Employer Contribution: Employers that do not offer or make a meaningful contribution to the cost of quality health coverage for their employees will be required to contribute a percentage of payroll toward the costs of the national plan.

I don't see any caveats there. And he has yet to define a small business, unless he means one that nets less than $250,000? He also says he won't tax capital gains on the middle class which needs some explaining.

696 Salamantis  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:14:58am

I know that this is only anecdotal, but I have a postgraduate degree, and I wouldn't vote for Obama if Loreena Bobbitt held a knife to my dick.

697 sparrowlake  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:14:59am

re: #681 littleoldlady

And apparently it’s considered impolite to say so.

Please don't bother the Dems with facts.

698 Shug  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:15:53am

re: #683 JustMyView

This is just one survey, but it does show that support for Obama rises with educational level, including postgraduate education.


It appears that Obama has maintained the same lead in the much smaller group with Post graduate degree , and has made large strides in the larger sized uneducated group.

your own reference proves you don't know what you are talking about

699 opnion  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:16:02am

re: #686 JustMyView

He clearly said in last night's debate that small businesses will not be required to provide health insurance for their employees. Try to keep your ideology from getting in the way of the facts.

If you look at Obama's helth Plan, he mandates coverage for minors.
He intends to pay for it via employers. When you read his polan it seems that it need not be dependant children of their own employees.
That is confiscatory & goes to employers as if they are obligated to provide health coverage, which they are not.

700 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:17:06am

re: #698 Shug

Hon- unless you can see the internal numbers- the party ID of the participants, then the poll is crap. They are asking more dems than repubs.

701 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:17:44am

Hotel donuts stale
The coffee is way too strong
everything tastes bad.

702 x-wing  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:17:46am

re: #695 rancher

From his web page.


he won't tax capital gains on the middle class which needs some explaining.

Yiiippie, let's add another 1,000 pages to the tax code.

703 Shug  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:19:09am

re: #702 x-wing

Yiiippie, let's add another 1,000 pages to the tax code.


Due to his policies, the middle class won't have capital gains

704 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:19:16am

re: #694 Sharmuta

What's the numbers on the breakdown of party ID of the participants of that survey? Did they ask more dems than republicans? Unless you can see the internals, don't buy shit from Gallup.

Democrats - 2229 - 36.8%
Republicans - 1713 - 28.2%
Independents - 2113 - 34.8%
total polled - 6055

A huge +8 for the Dems -- UNLIKELY!

705 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:19:17am

re: #702 x-wing

Wait, if middle class has more than 250k in investments from growth, does that mean they are now rich?

706 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:20:50am

re: #702 x-wing

If it can be done at all.

707 x-wing  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:21:35am

re: #703 Shug

Due to his policies, the middle class won't have capital gains


If he gets elected,I may just quit my job and enjoy all his free goodies.

708 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:21:44am

re: #704 hermeneutics

Democrats - 2229 - 36.8%
Republicans - 1713 - 28.2%
Independents - 2113 - 34.8%
total polled - 6055

A huge +8 for the Dems -- UNLIKELY!

Exactly. Historically they have a 3-4% edge.

709 opnion  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:23:15am

Howard Wolfson now on FNC. He is claiming that McCains introduction of Acorn into the debate last night was ineffective, because he didn't explain what Acorn is. WTF? The great American electorate is not aware of ACORN? Those that are unaware should be required to have adult supervision when the venture outside.
Maybe Obama has an edge among the more educated, but his supporters do not seem to be overly intelligent.

710 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:23:40am

re: #708 Sharmuta

Exactly. Historically they have a 3-4% edge.

I'm to drugged to do the math -- sleepy pills -- but could you rejigger the numbers with a +4 R (worst case scenario) and tell me the new results?

I'd be so grateful.

711 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:23:52am

re: #707 x-wing

If he gets elected,I may just quit my job and enjoy all his free goodies.

I will do quite well until I loose my current cushy job and have to go back to prison.

712 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:24:15am

re: #696 Salamantis

I know that this is only anecdotal, but I have a postgraduate degree, and I wouldn't vote for Obama if Loreena Bobbitt held a knife to my dick.

And I am from the half of my high school graduating class the made the top half possible; I wouldn't vote of Obama if someone threatened to take away all forms of cake.

713 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:24:25am

re: #691 opnion

That survey does debunk what I thought that I saw. Besides, I can't cite it & this is more consistent.
However, as I said earlier, Obama supporters that I know are very unaware of the issues & seem to be into Group Think.
The othetr thing that I have found, when they have an opinion that does not agree with Barry, they swear that Obama agrees with them.

Your last statement seems to apply to both candidates. Apparently, for instance, many McCain supporters believe that he is pro-choice.

I certainly wouldn't challenge the idea that many Obama supporters are ill-informed. I just don't think that label is unique to them.

714 Salamantis  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:24:41am

Here's that link |I was talking about, Sharm:

[Link: www.dallasnews.com...]

715 ibmkeyboard  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:25:04am

re: #690 Sharmuta

LMAO @ you, hypocrite.


Justmyview.

He clearly said in last night's debate that small businesses will not be required to provide health insurance for their employees. Try to keep your ideology from getting in the way of the facts.


Obama has lied so much, If he stood on his frigging head and told the truth I wouldn't believe it.

If you believe his bullshit,
Let me sell you some AIG stock, I know it will go up..

716 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:25:57am

re: #713 JustMyView

for instance, many McCain supporters believe that he is pro-choice.

Link please?

717 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:27:24am

re: #704 hermeneutics

Democrats - 2229 - 36.8%
Republicans - 1713 - 28.2%
Independents - 2113 - 34.8%
total polled - 6055

I was thinking about this yesterday. I have voted Republican in every Presidential election of my lifetime. But, I refer to myself as an independent.

Wonder how many "Independents" (in either direction) get calls from pollsters.

718 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:28:22am

re: #713 JustMyView

You're one of the most ill informed people on this blog. How does that feel?

719 opnion  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:28:54am

re: #713 JustMyView

Your last statement seems to apply to both candidates. Apparently, for instance, many McCain supporters believe that he is pro-choice.

I certainly wouldn't challenge the idea that many Obama supporters are ill-informed. I just don't think that label is unique to them.


You know, I can only speak for myself observing Obama & McCain supporters. Barry's supporters seem less informed , but much more fanatical. They seem to think that they are on a crusade & the rules no longer apply, just a desire to elect Obama no matter how they can get him there.

720 x-wing  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:29:08am

re: #711 rancher

I will do quite well until I loose my current cushy job and have to go back to prison.

Prison? I'm almost afraid to ask :>}

721 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:30:17am

re: #709 opnion

The Democrats get the bottom and top of the educational demographic -- the most "decorated" educational sorts with PhDs and long exposure to academic bias; the most uneducated, less-than -high school crowd.

This may be correlated to their strength in inner cities, particularly the poorer areas, where education is shunned.

722 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:30:43am

Hello! tap, tap tap!

It doesn't matter how many small businesses are effected by Obama's tax hikes and health care mandates. There will be enough of them to cause more unemployment and less profits to cause our recession to slide into a depression.

It's bad policy. Period.

723 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:30:45am

You guys thought he was a plant? He doesn't even exist.
Secret Service says "Kill him" allegation unfounded

SCRANTON – The agent in charge of the Secret Service field office in Scranton said allegations that someone yelled “kill him” when presidential hopeful Barack Obama’s name was mentioned during Tuesday’s Sarah Palin rally are unfounded.
724 Scion9  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:31:20am

I've addressed the 'liberal' bias on campus before. If you shave off the top 2% of the wealthiest among both parties, registered Democrats are absurdley richer than Republicans, which is pretty much the way it has been for the past century. Even if you do include that top 2% you have to take into account that people like Pickens and other billionaires are registered Republicans while many 'independents' like Bill Gates overwhelmingly support Democrats and Left-orient PACs skew the statistics of which party has more money.

The vast majority of all people inherit the political and social views of their parents to some degree. My family has been consistently voting Democrat for over a hundred years (probably all the way back to Jefferson). The vast majority of people that go to college today have their way paid for them by their families. 'Poor' people rarely go to college. Scholarships are negligible. College is for rich people. College is run by, and caters to Democrats, and that is who attends.

Anyone who has been to college in the past several decades can attest to it. People aren't getting 'brainwashed' in entirety by their professors. They aren't becoming 'enlightened' as they attain higher degrees and become liberal as a result. There is an overwhelming liberal bias in most classrooms among the students on day one of your first class on freshmen year.

The number of people enrolled in college, and graduated from college that are Conservatives and even more so the ones that vote Republican are extremely limited. Of course, being college educated doesn't say anything about ones knowledge of politics or the economy unless one is specifically studying in those fields.

725 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:31:56am

re: #717 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Hi Chubby. What are you doing up at this hour, dear?

726 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:32:03am

re: #722 littleoldlady

I agree completely! That's why I told my 0bamabot family member to enjoy unemployment.

727 opnion  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:32:49am

re: #721 hermeneutics

The Democrats get the bottom and top of the educational demographic -- the most "decorated" educational sorts with PhDs and long exposure to academic bias; the most uneducated, less-than -high school crowd.

This may be correlated to their strength in inner cities, particularly the poorer areas, where education is shunned.


That sounds about right. I would say this, if there was a direct correlation between education & intellect, Harvard profs would all be wealthy. I don't see that.

728 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:32:55am

re: #720 x-wing
I spent five years as a correctional officer, (guard). The prison is the towns biggest employer and certianly won't be closing. It's just a really crappy job.

729 Shug  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:33:00am

Ask the Ship builders of New England how that luxury tax worked out.

Go ahead Barry, screw " the rich"

730 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:33:53am

re: #724 Scion9

So true.

Minor quibble -- I believe Jefferson was a Republican in the election of 1800.

731 ibmkeyboard  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:33:54am

re: #723 rancher

You guys thought he was a plant? He doesn't even exist.
Secret Service says "Kill him" allegation unfounded


More
MSM
bullshit

732 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:34:31am

re: #730 hermeneutics

So true.

Minor quibble -- I believe Jefferson was a Republican in the election of 1800.

Republican party didn't exist then.

733 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:34:49am

re: #731 ibmkeyboard

We were wondering where the secret service was on that.

734 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:35:14am

re: #713 JustMyView

Your last statement seems to apply to both candidates. Apparently, for instance, many McCain supporters believe that he is pro-choice.

I certainly wouldn't challenge the idea that many Obama supporters are ill-informed. I just don't think that label is unique to them.

/enjoy yesterday's song

735 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:35:59am

Sala- I recommended that to Charles.

736 jim in virginia  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:36:06am

re: #684 Sharmuta
Sharmuta, I don't know what I'm doing wrong but I tried to upding you and it downdinged. I blame Bil Gates and IE. My intent was pure.

737 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:36:09am

re: #732 Sharmuta

True, but he self-iDed that way.

The contemporary repub party started civil war era.

738 x-wing  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:36:10am

re: #719 opnion

You know, I can only speak for myself observing Obama & McCain supporters. Barry's supporters seem less informed , but much more fanatical. They seem to think that they are on a crusade & the rules no longer apply, just a desire to elect Obama no matter how they can get him there.

NBC interveiwed an independent after the debate, the guy said he's going with Obama because of his positions, character doesn't matter.

/my remote just about left my hand

739 reine.de.tout  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:36:47am

re: #736 jim in virginia

Sharmuta, I don't know what I'm doing wrong but I tried to upding you and it downdinged. I blame Bil Gates and IE. My intent was pure.

Jim, you can change it, just go back up and click the plus button.

740 x-wing  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:37:31am

re: #728 rancher

I spent five years as a correctional officer, (guard). The prison is the towns biggest employer and certianly won't be closing. It's just a really crappy job.

Wheew, yeah I wouldn't like that job.

741 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:37:53am

re: #736 jim in virginia

That's correctable now, Jim.

742 jim in virginia  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:37:54am

re: #730 hermeneutics

I believ there was a Democratic Republican party opposing the Federalsts. This was back before Whigs and Know Nothings.

743 JustMyView  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:38:17am

re: #695 rancher

From his web page.

I don't see any caveats there. And he has yet to define a small business, unless he means one that nets less than $250,000? He also says he won't tax capital gains on the middle class which needs some explaining.

I didn't have it quite right in what I said before. Here's what I found re small businesses: I didn't see a definition of a small business in that section of the plan, but perhaps there's one elsewhere. Or perhaps there's a standard definition that the IRS uses. I'm not an accountant.

(3) TAX CREDITS FOR FAMILIES AND SMALL BUSINESSES. Barack Obama and Joe Biden understand that too many families that do not qualify for public health programs like Medicaid and SCHIP have trouble finding affordable health insurance. They know from talking to small business owners across the nation that the skyrocketing cost of healthcare poses a serious competitive threat to America’s small businesses. The Obama-Biden health care plan will provide tax credits to all individuals who need it for their premiums. They will also create a new Small Business Health Tax Credit to provide small businesses with a refundable tax credit of up to 50 percent on premiums paid by small businesses on behalf of their employees. To be eligible for the credit, small businesses will have to offer a quality health plan to all of their employees and cover a meaningful share of the cost of employee health premiums.

4) EMPLOYER CONTRIBUTION. Large employers that do not offer meaningful coverage or make a meaningful contribution to the cost of quality health coverage for their employees will be required to contribute a percentage of payroll toward the costs of the national plan. Small businesses will be exempt from this
requirement.

744 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:38:38am

re: #737 hermeneutics

The contemporary repub party started civil war ....

Did not!

745 ibmkeyboard  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:38:42am

re: #728 rancher

I spent five years as a correctional officer, (guard). The prison is the towns biggest employer and certainly won't be closing. It's just a really crappy job.

/how does it feel having had a job the government pays more to keep the prisoners,
than they pay to guard them?

//sorry in advance.

746 BlueCanuck  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:39:04am

Well pushed my luck long enough today. Time to log off and go home. See you folks around in the coming week. Stay scaly.

/YAY vacation time is now.

747 reine.de.tout  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:39:07am

Verification that the "kill him" statement was a figment of somebody's imagination:

Secret Service says "Kill him" allegation unfounded

How many reports of this will we see now on TV?

748 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:39:14am

re: #742 jim in virginia

I believ there was a Democratic Republican party opposing the Federalsts. This was back before Whigs and Know Nothings.

Yes. True. Don't you' love the names of the parties back then?

749 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:39:21am

re: #743 JustMyView

Because 0bama's never flip-flopped before, right?

We'll just let you eat that waffle.

750 Scion9  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:39:40am

re: #730 hermeneutics

So true.

Minor quibble -- I believe Jefferson was a Republican in the election of 1800.

He was a Democratic-Republican, which a few election cycles later was truncated into just Democratic Party.

751 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:39:41am

re: #744 rancher

Did not!

It didn't? When did it start then? My memory is mid-1850s

752 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:39:55am

re: #746 BlueCanuck

Bye, Blue! Enjoy your vacay.

753 jim in virginia  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:40:04am

re: #701 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Business travel is glamorous!
At least that's what everyone tells me.

754 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:40:49am

Enjoy, BlueCanuck! :-)

755 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:40:59am

re: #725 hermeneutics

Choking down stale donuts, drinking bad hotel coffee, and wondering why JMV comes around here. But I know why. To argue. All JMV does is argue. Not play "devils advocate", just to argue. Probably goes to KOS and argues the conservative/anti-Obama side.

Just can't stand people like that. Farking misanthrope.

Of course, that's just my view.

756 reine.de.tout  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:42:31am

re: #755 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Choking down stale donuts, drinking bad hotel coffee, and wondering why JMV comes around here. But I know why. To argue. All JMV does is argue. Not play "devils advocate", just to argue. Probably goes to KOS and argues the conservative/anti-Obama side.

Just can't stand people like that. Farking misanthrope.

Of course, that's just my view.

FBV look at the positive side - arguments make the day interesting.

OH, and here are a few fresh donuts:

757 x-wing  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:43:14am

re: #743 JustMyView

I see readind comp. is not your strong point. Small Bus. is still going to pay for it one way or another.

758 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:43:19am

re: #743 JustMyView

They will also create a new Small Business Health Tax Credit to provide small businesses with a refundable tax credit of up to 50 percent on premiums paid by small businesses on behalf of their employees.

So he mandates coverage but will refund half of the cost? And that's a cut?

759 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:43:24am

re: #753 jim in virginia

Business travel is glamorous!
At least that's what everyone tells me.

Hey Jim! I'm in Fredericksburg! Holiday Inn (Woot!)

760 Cap'n DOC  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:44:17am
The other thing that I have found, when they have an opinion that does not agree with Barry, they swear that Obama agrees with them.

Your last statement seems to apply to both candidates. Apparently, for instance, many McCain supporters believe that he is pro-choice.

Do you think that Sen. Obama and Sen. McCain are both for change?

That's rhetorical of course, because what you are attempting to do is paint both of the candidates with the same brush, and their supporters as well.

And it ain't a single-issue problem. And what kind of glasses are you using to determine that many McCain supporters believe he is pro-choice?

761 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:44:17am

re: #755 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Poor dear. Put those donuts down, Chubby. You'll feel so sick tomorrow morning.

Are you working on a project this late at night ... or should you be? I sometimes wonder why people are on in the wee hours. I'm sleepless.

762 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:45:10am

re: #761 hermeneutics

What the heck...it's almost 8am here in the present.

763 jim in virginia  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:45:22am

re: #743 JustMyView
From a guy who by appeaars to obfuscate without thinking about it, and you want us to believe his campaign promises?
The top 10% of income producers in the US pay 70% of the taxes. Barry promises to lower taxes for 95% of Americans. Do the math.
Corporate taxes are simply passed onto shareholders or to consumers. Corporations are not evil monoliths. They are thousands of stockholders.
Barry is an idiot, a liar, or both.

764 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:45:22am

re: #745 ibmkeyboard

It was a private prison so we actually made less than our state officers.

But we did have less benefits!

765 yesandno  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:45:37am

re: #696 Salamantis

I know that this is only anecdotal, but I have a postgraduate degree, and I wouldn't vote for Obama if Loreena Bobbitt held a knife to my dick.

Almost had cereal on my screen!

LOL!

766 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:45:50am
4) EMPLOYER CONTRIBUTION. Large employers that do not offer meaningful coverage or make a meaningful contribution to the cost of quality health coverage for their employees will be required to contribute a percentage of payroll toward the costs of the national plan. Small businesses will be exempt from this requirement.

This does not mean that their own employees will get any better coverage. Am I reading this right?

Depending upon the costs, it may behoove an employer to start offering "meaningful" coverage to their employees, thereby NOT funding the national plan.

And wtf is "meaningful"?!
DID ANYBODY THINK THIS THROUGH?!

767 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:46:20am

re: #751 hermeneutics
Repubs didn't start the civil war, small joke.

Very small.

768 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:46:35am

re: #762 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

What the heck...it's almost 8am here in the present.

Oh, sorry. I thought you were in Colorado and have mixed your locale with that of someone else.

I'm in AZ -- it is 4:46am here.

769 reags  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:46:40am

re: #721 hermeneutics

I'm one of those " 'decorated' educational sorts" (PhD). Not all of us got brainwashed in our trip through academia...some of us managed to keep our common sense in the face of the giant vacuum trying to suck it out of us

770 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:46:44am

re: #764 rancher

That sounds like something a friend of mine said (peeing off the side of a boat), "Y'all don't look now. It ain't big around, but it's short!"

771 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:48:35am

re: #769 reags

I'm one of those " 'decorated' educational sorts" (PhD). Not all of us got brainwashed in our trip through academia...some of us managed to keep our common sense in the face of the giant vacuum trying to suck it out of us

I am too, Reags, and I struggled mightily to avoid brainwashing. I think it is harder for those in the humanities.

772 Cap'n DOC  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:49:30am

re: #735 Sharmuta

Ditto.

773 ibmkeyboard  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:50:26am

Later/
I have to go work a job,
pay taxes so Acorn deadbeats can register more voters and try to destroy my way of life.

/catch 22

774 ibmkeyboard  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:51:56am

re: #764 rancher

It was a private prison so we actually made less than our state officers.

But we did have less benefits!

LOL

sorry!

775 Sharmuta  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:52:07am

re: #766 littleoldlady

Think something through? When have the democrats ever done that?

776 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:52:14am

re: #773 ibmkeyboard

Have a great day! Have fun stormin' the castle!

777 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:53:43am
778 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:56:21am

re: #777 Killian Bundy

Nice.

779 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:57:01am

re: #777 Killian Bundy

OY. :-(

780 jim in virginia  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:58:36am

re: #759 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
If you get any time check out some of the Civil war sites.

781 reags  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:59:54am

re: #771 hermeneutics

I am too, Reags, and I struggled mightily to avoid brainwashing. I think it is harder for those in the humanities.

Agreed the struggle must be harder in some areas than others. Ironically I always thought a major practical goal of education should be to teach people to think (for themselves). Am I correct in assuming the practical experience is one of "educators" telling people how to think (i.e. brainwashing)..particularly in the humanities, etc. My guess would also be that this type of educational process gets started early (pre-college), which I'm going to blame on the unionization of teachers at that level.

782 christheprofessor  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 4:59:55am

Good morning, all...

This place is full of professors this morning...

783 jim in virginia  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:00:06am

re: #766 littleoldlady

meaningful contribution to the cost of quality health coverage

And what is the meaning of the word "is"?

784 eon  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:01:24am

re: #747 reine.de.tout

Verification that the "kill him" statement was a figment of somebody's imagination:

Secret Service says "Kill him" allegation unfounded

How many reports of this will we see now on TV?

Morning, Lizards.

(Good morning, littleoldlady.)

This is turning out about how I expected. I assumed it was an exaggeration, or outright fabrication, from the start, because no version of the story included the subhead, "Man Detained For Questioning".

I saw the Secret Service in action, up close and personal, back in the Seventies. If anyone had really yelled "kill (anybody)" at a campaign event, said loudmouth would have suddenly found himself surrounded by large men in three-piece suits with earplugs in one ear each. And then been hustled out and into a quiet room for a little chat.

The Service does not take threats lightly, no matter who they are ostensibly aimed at.

As for "reporter" David Singleton, his editor shouldn't be defending him. He should already have Singleton's resignation typed-up, and on his desk, waiting for the fantasist's signature.

Plus the name of a good psychiatrist, to help Singleton deal with the little voices in his head. Which may just be why no one but Singleton heard this supposed "outburst".

cheers

eon

785 reine.de.tout  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:01:25am

re: #777 Killian Bundy

[Link: www.ibdeditorial.com...]

Good grief!


The NEA wants additional (job-creating) services and programs — such as early childhood education — provided by public schools. NEA resolutions call for "programs in the public schools for children from birth through age 8" and for "mandatory kindergarten with compulsory attendance."

and


The NEA wants every child, regardless of age, to have "direct and confidential access, without notification to parents, to comprehensive health education. That would include things such as learning how to use condoms for premarital sex, as well as social, and psychological programs and services."

and


The NEA is strong for "multicultural education," which means "the process of incorporating the values" and influencing "behavior" toward the NEA's version of "the common good," such as "reducing homophobia."
786 3 wood  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:03:21am

Good Morning Folks.

Look for the market to recover a bit from yesterdays huge sell off. Apparently yesterday was due to several hedge funds and a large bank or two in Europe liquidating holdings. Again, a lot of stocks out there are amazingly cheap now, so some folks will be snapping up some bargains.

LIBOR is starting to ease up so there are some positive signs in that regard.

Look for this volatility to continue for weeks if not months.

787 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:03:59am

re: #781 reags

I'm convinced that the next generation of intellectual heft will emerge from home-schooled kids.

Regarding the humanities: A few colleges still exist that teach "classical" curriculum. St. John's College comes to mind. Actually immersing oneself in a proven text and struggling with its content is, to me, a rigorous education.

And that doesn't happen in schools. Or colleges.

788 littleoldlady  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:05:40am

re: #783 jim in virginia

{My Rove}!

In Obama's case, you have to define the word TAX.

/forget IS :-(

eon! :-)

789 reine.de.tout  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:06:04am

Well, I need to run, but for a laugh (maybe) and a reminder (as if we needed one) of the type of person to whom Obama would like to redistribute our wealth, I give you Sharon Jasper.

790 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:06:07am

Not getting re-elected is the least of Mahoney's worries.

FBI Reported to Begin Probe of Florida Congressman

791 christheprofessor  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:06:54am

re: #785 reine.de.tout

The NEA's goal is, and has always been, indoctrination, not education. Conscientious parents interfere with that, hence the desire to remove parents from the mix.

792 3 wood  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:07:25am

Here are two banks that were dumping a lot of stock yesterday.

Switzerland to take on $60 billion of UBS assets

LONDON (MarketWatch) -- The Swiss government on Thursday became the first to take troubled assets off a bank balance sheet, reaching a deal to absorb up to $60 billion in mostly mortgage-related assets from UBS.
In addition, the Swiss government is taking a 9% stake in UBS in return for a 6 billion franc ($5.25 billion) injection into the world's largest asset manager.
And rival Credit Suisse is being forced to raise billions as well to meet new adequacy standards, though it's been able to do so by turning to key shareholders, notably the government of Qatar.
The Swiss National Bank said the moves by the country's banking giants "will result in a sustainable reduction of strains in the Swiss financial system. The stabilization thus reached will be favorable for the development of the Swiss economy as a whole and is in the interest of the country."

793 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:08:14am

re: #786 3 wood

I love your posts! Even the bad news ones.

794 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:09:16am

9000 delegates in the American education driver's seat or three out of six people knocking on the doorre: #779 littleoldlady

OY. :-(

Three people out of six versus 9000 delegates. I'm just wondering who's really subverting the education of American children.

/knock all you want, you can't blow the teacher's union house down in another 2000 years, without much help

795 Beach Lover  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:09:24am

Good Morning, lizards. Well, I was really happy after the debate until I watched the pundits tell me what I saw. Am I gonna have to turn off FNC now, too?
The media is turning our electorial process into a reality show.
And we are gonna end up with nitwits running this country because of it.

796 3 wood  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:09:31am

re: #793 rancher

Thank you, that is very kind of you.

797 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:09:43am
798 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:09:56am

re: #792 3 wood

Three,

What do you think about the government taking shares/ownership of banks during this crisis?

799 eon  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:10:45am

re: #785 reine.de.tout

Whenever a politician (or any reasonable facsimile' thereof) uses any of these phrases;

"the common good"

"the greatest good for the greatest number"

"the needs of the many" and/or

"outweigh the needs of the few"

A smart person heads for the nearest exit. Because all of the above translate to

"We want power, and we mean to get it."

Which means that whatever is proposed or is about to be done will have the sole purpose of feeding the speaker's own ego, ambition, and lust for control over others.

/I'm in a sort of Heinlein/Rand mode this morning, I guess

cheers

eon

800 unreconstructed rebel  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:10:50am

Mornin', All.

Sorry, not feeeling very spritely today.

801 doriangrey  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:11:17am

Good morning Lizards..........

802 3 wood  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:11:28am

One interesting side note in all the market sell off is gold also dropped a bit. It's down to $839 which probably speaks to how much cash the tbill auctions are soaking up.

803 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:11:49am

re: #800 unreconstructed rebel

What's wrong, Rebel?

804 3 wood  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:13:49am

re: #798 hermeneutics

Three,

What do you think about the government taking shares/ownership of banks during this crisis?

Short term to get some stability back in I don't mind. I think it's needed to keep the banks from taking the injected capital and just sitting on it or using it to retire outstanding more expensive debt.

Long term I want to see the government sell their interest back to the banks after the markets settle down.

805 laZardo  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:13:53am

Good evening, Reptilia! I trust there is a reason for me to find difficulty in rebutting anything hopeful this evening...

806 eon  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:14:35am

re: #790 rancher

Not getting re-elected is the least of Mahoney's worries.

FBI Reported to Begin Probe of Florida Congressman

I love that photo of Mahoney. It practically screams,

I'm a Democrat, so you can't touch me. Up yours.

Does the DNC have classes for office-holders for this? "Looking Smug 101"?

cheers

eon

807 Beach Lover  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:14:36am

re: #786 3 wood
3 wood, I don't know much if anything about this economic mess, but can any of the timing of this have to do with the election?

808 3 wood  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:15:37am

Got to go get ready for my new job, first day today.

Later all.

809 unreconstructed rebel  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:15:40am

re: #803 hermeneutics

You really don't not want to listen to me whine about yesterday.

But thanks for the thought.

810 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:15:56am

Well, the "Kill Him" story still has legs. Someone just gave a bunch of Donk operatives an idea. They'll go to McCain rallies screaming the "n" word. That'll get some legs too, dontcha think?

811 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:16:23am

re: #804 3 wood

Long term I want to see the government sell their interest back to the banks after the markets settle down.

Governments tend to expand control, not relinquish it, or so it seems. It will be extremely difficult to get rid of the bureaucracy after it is entrenched in DC.

812 3 wood  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:16:43am

re: #807 Beach Lover

3 wood, I don't know much if anything about this economic mess, but can any of the timing of this have to do with the election?

I think Congress's dragging their feet had a lot to do with the timing of the election.

Got to go now.

813 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:17:15am

re: #808 3 wood

CONGRATS!

814 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:18:06am

re: #802 3 wood

I had gold as a hedge back in '87. I thought we were due for a correction and figured I'd sell the gold to buy into any drop. Gold dropped as far or further than stocks because everyone was selling to make margin calls.

815 x-wing  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:19:04am

re: #808 3 wood

Good Luck 3 wood. My 401k is depending on ya.

816 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:19:06am

re: #809 unreconstructed rebel

Thankfully today is a new day and yesterday is passe.

817 Scion9  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:19:10am

re: #785 reine.de.tout

Scary stuff, no?

Public education was in many ways a bad idea. The 1st Amendments clauses in regards to free press and freedom of religion were written to protect those two institutions that both greatly influence culture and flow of information (especially when most schools were being run by Churches) from being influenced by government. So that those with political power would be incapable of indoctrinating the public into a narrative that is either supportive or subversive. Public education is being used to circumvent the spirit of the 1st Amendment.

818 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:19:33am

re: #808 3 wood

Congrats! Knock 'em dead!

(hey, who are these guys in three piece suits and earpieces?)

819 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:20:13am

re: #811 hermeneutics

The stock we have in those banks is non voting prefered, more like a loan I think.

820 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:21:57am
So far, the Secret Service has not found anyone else who heard "kill him" Tuesday except for the Times-Tribune reporter.

Heh.

821 doriangrey  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:22:40am

re: #820 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Heh.

Morning FBV..... Hey.... these donuts are stale....... ;p

822 unreconstructed rebel  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:22:44am

re: #811 hermeneutics

Governments tend to expand control, not relinquish it, or so it seems. It will be extremely difficult to get rid of the bureaucracy after it is entrenched in DC.

Problem is, government policy for the last however has not been about industry, but about enjoying the good life without it. For years, the gov't has seen to it that we know no discomfort from our excesses. Now that the bill is really due, their answer is to start printing money like there's no tomorrow.

I told you I was depressed.

823 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:23:11am

re: #819 rancher

The stock we have in those banks is non voting prefered, more like a loan I think.

Interesting. Will/could they simply sell that stock, then, when the markets get higher? Or do you think they'll hold on to the stock so they can have some direct influence in the banking system?

824 Beach Lover  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:23:40am

If McCain manages to pull this one out of the dumpster, he can thank Joe the plumber and The Hockey Mom.

825 reags  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:24:19am

re: #787 hermeneutics

I'm convinced that the next generation of intellectual heft will emerge from home-schooled kids.

Interesting opinion.
Agree with your premise that "rigorous education" need not come from school/college. My most valuable education came at the hands (literally and metaphorically) of my father - first generation American, barely graduated from high school- ex-marine DI at Parris Island - worked his a** off in his own small business to provide us with opportunities and taught us the value of hard work and common sense along the way. I will always be grateful that I have an easier life because of him. Very smart man...

826 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:25:23am

re: #822 unreconstructed rebel

Back to the stagflation of the '70s. I intend to borrow allot! Pay back today's dollars with tomorrow's toilet paper.

827 doriangrey  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:25:59am

re: #825 reags

Interesting opinion.
Agree with your premise that "rigorous education" need not come from school/college. My most valuable education came at the hands (literally and metaphorically) of my father - first generation American, barely graduated from high school- ex-marine DI at Parris Island - worked his a** off in his own small business to provide us with opportunities and taught us the value of hard work and common sense along the way. I will always be grateful that I have an easier life because of him. Very smart man...

Yes, but by the Obama/democrat definition a very bad American.....

828 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:26:12am

re: #821 doriangrey

Dorian! What up yo?

829 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:27:07am

re: #823 hermeneutics

Interesting. Will/could they simply sell that stock, then, when the markets get higher? Or do you think they'll hold on to the stock so they can have some direct influence in the banking system?

Probably depends on who gets elected.

830 doriangrey  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:27:11am

re: #828 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Dorian! What up yo?

Your donuts are stale and your coffee is puppy piss weak.... You been sneaking the hotel stuff home again?

831 unreconstructed rebel  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:27:42am

re: #787 hermeneutics

I'm convinced that the next generation of intellectual heft will emerge from home-schooled kids.

Regarding the humanities: A few colleges still exist that teach "classical" curriculum. St. John's College comes to mind. Actually immersing oneself in a proven text and struggling with its content is, to me, a rigorous education.

And that doesn't happen in schools. Or colleges.

Ironic isn't it that the great thinkers who founded this country were all basically home-schooled?

832 reags  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:28:10am

re: #827 doriangrey

Yes, but by the Obama/democrat definition a very bad American.....

Yes, but would have been very taxable!
And, thanks for the compliment :)

833 doriangrey  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:29:01am

re: #831 unreconstructed rebel

Ironic isn't it that the great thinkers who founded this country were all basically home-schooled?

That's because he who controls the education spice, controls the US Universe....

834 krycek  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:29:18am

The Obama camp has probably already air dropped a team of lawyers and private investigators to dig up dirt and smear Joe the plumber.

835 Killian Bundy  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:29:26am

I guess I could understand better the imminent potential problem to American education, if the 800 pound NEA Gorilla already teaching the American children was acknowledged.

/the priorities and reasons escape me, but what do I know?

836 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:29:35am

Morning all!

Great... first thing this morning, Michelle's Chief of Staff spinning that Obama has nothing to do with ACORN and a replay of Luntz's focus group of morons.

I threw up a little in my mouth.

Who's got the coffee so I can wash this out.

837 Scion9  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:29:52am

re: #799 eon

The worst, and most dishonest thing about the current 'Greater Good' mantra of the Left is that in addition to being Collectivists, they are also Moral Relativists.

At least the early Christian socialists around the turn of the century of the last century that got some sway in government had an idea of a moral Collective built around some kind of objective doctrine that defined specifically what is good and what is not that everyone could research and read into for themselves. Not that I agree with their politics, but at least it was consistent.

Today, those trumpetting for the 'Greater Good', are also in the business of telling you that what they are touting as being 'Good' is subjective to change without notice. That is practically advertising their totalitarian ideology, but so few seem to notice.

838 rancher  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:30:08am

re: #831 unreconstructed rebel

Ironic isn't it that the great thinkers who founded this country were all basically home-schooled?

Wish we could still read for the law.

839 laZardo  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:30:43am

re: #817 Scion9

I would disagree on that point. Not many people can be counted on to homeschool their kids or afford to send them to private schools whose tuition rates are JACKED UP.

840 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:30:48am

re: #825 reags

Lovely! Your dad is the kind of American we should all be.

My most valuable education came from personal failure.

841 doriangrey  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:31:20am

re: #836 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)

Morning all!

Great... first thing this morning, Michelle's Chief of Staff spinning that Obama has nothing to do with ACORN and a replay of Luntz's focus group of morons.

I threw up a little in my mouth.

Who's got the coffee so I can wash this out.

Here, you can have some of mine, guaranteed to take the paint and the rust off a battleships hull..... /warning you might need to replace your fillings after the first cup.....

842 doriangrey  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:33:11am

re: #832 reags

Yes, but would have been very taxable!
And, thanks for the compliment :)

Your dad earned it the old fashioned way... Through hard work and determination...

843 1SG(ret)  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:33:28am

Am I the only one that is getting really tired of Frank Lutz and his focus groups? Although they all say they are not decided, it seems they start out a little on the liberal side.
If I hear the BHO is young, articulate, and smooth one more time!
That makes for a good politician, but not so much for a leader.

Top

844 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:33:39am

re: #841 doriangrey

Here, you can have some of mine, guaranteed to take the paint and the rust off a battleships hull..... /warning you might need to replace your fillings after the first cup.....

Fillings? Who needs fillings... that way repair work is easier, no hood to pull up.

Thanks. I needed that. A man that can make coffee the right way.

Crowd at the Coffee Shop in NC goes 100% McCain... I feel better now!

845 eon  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:34:00am

re: #825 reags

Interesting opinion.
Agree with your premise that "rigorous education" need not come from school/college. My most valuable education came at the hands (literally and metaphorically) of my father - first generation American, barely graduated from high school- ex-marine DI at Parris Island - worked his a** off in his own small business to provide us with opportunities and taught us the value of hard work and common sense along the way. I will always be grateful that I have an easier life because of him. Very smart man...

You were lucky to have a father like that.

Going back to Heinlein;

At the fundamental level, a school is nothing more than a log with a teacher sitting on one end and a student sitting on the other.

-Heinlein, Rocket Ship Galileo(1947)

It helps if the teacher is knowledgeable, and the student is able. (Of course, in Heinlein's stories, these were givens.) As for teacher "qualifications", I'll take practical experience over academic degrees any time. While useful on a resume', such degrees are increasingly suspect in terms of the actual imparted knowledge they are supposed to represent.

/The present Democratic candidate for President being a case in point

cheers

eon

846 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:34:43am

re: #811 hermeneutics

Governments tend to expand control, not relinquish it, or so it seems. It will be extremely difficult to get rid of the bureaucracy after it is entrenched in DC.

The Gubment is like the worst Meth/crack/heroin addict you've ever seen. Power/money is their drug. Once they get a bit, just have to keep adding to the amount to get their fix.

How many temporary taxes have become permanent?
How many temporary tolls (roads/bridges) were actually temporary?

Hell, my county for years has said we need decals on our windshields to prove we have paid taxes on our cars. This year, hooray! We don't need decals now! Oh, but we have to pay the decal fee.

IT IS MY TEAT THEY ARE SUCKING FROM AND MY TEATS ARE SORE!

847 Karridine  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:35:28am

re: #823 hermeneutics

I don't know... yr question is High Finance 303...

Just wanted to say I read yr comment at Zomboid's place... well done!

848 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:35:34am

re: #830 doriangrey

Your donuts are stale and your coffee is puppy piss weak.... You been sneaking the hotel stuff home again?

Donuts get stale because we don't eat them fast enough.

849 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:35:36am

re: #839 laZardo

I would disagree on that point. Not many people can be counted on to homeschool their kids or afford to send them to private schools whose tuition rates are JACKED UP.

Hi LaZardo,

The means of delivering education is debatable, not the need for some classroom-based institutions. If you had a voucher, or if all schools were privatized by fiat, there would be affordable, unique institutions. Those who wanted to homeschool could still opt out.

850 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:35:55am

re: #843 1SG(ret)

Am I the only one that is getting really tired of Frank Lutz and his focus groups? Although they all say they are not decided, it seems they start out a little on the liberal side.
If I hear the BHO is young, articulate, and smooth one more time!
That makes for a good politician, but not so much for a leader.

Top

One of the qualifying traits to be unsure of who to vote for at this stage, with these two... Mac the less than wonderful and Barry the closet marxist radical...

is to be a freaking moron.

851 doriangrey  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:36:56am

re: #844 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)

Fillings? Who needs fillings... that way repair work is easier, no hood to pull up.

Thanks. I needed that. A man that can make coffee the right way.

Crowd at the Coffee Shop in NC goes 100% McCain... I feel better now!

Sigh..... There are some (un-named) lizards who are afraid of my coffee... One is still trying to get me to replace their monitor stand because a little of it spilled and melted a hole through it.... Some people lizards just don't appreciate a good cup of coffee...

852 unreconstructed rebel  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:37:26am

re: #838 rancher

Wish we could still read for the law.

It's my understanding that is still possible in the Commonwealth of Virginia

853 HoosierHoops  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:38:01am

Good Morning Lizards!
How is everyone this fine day?
Coffee and yogurt this morning on the table..I'm pitching the day old donuts..

854 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:38:08am

re: #847 Karridine

I don't know... yr question is High Finance 303...

Just wanted to say I read yr comment at Zomboid's place... well done!

Good morning, karridine. I wish I could sleep.

855 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:38:31am

re: #851 doriangrey

Sigh..... There are some (un-named) lizards who are afraid of my coffee... One is still trying to get me to replace their monitor stand because a little of it spilled and melted a hole through it.... Some people lizards just don't appreciate a good cup of coffee...

As I've said before, if you can't stand a M60 Tank Track upright in it, it isn't coffee.

856 Scion9  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:38:54am

re: #839 laZardo

I would disagree on that point. Not many people can be counted on to homeschool their kids or afford to send them to private schools whose tuition rates are JACKED UP.

I didn't say I disagree with the idea of public education. That is to say I don't find it offensive to want to provide education to the public, by way of the government. My point was that Public education is being used to cercumvent the spirit of the Constitution. That public servants are now in the business of crafting a narrative of the 'truth' that is supportive of their political agenda.

The Church, and the Press being free from government meddling is mandated by the Constitution in order to directly prevent this kind of indoctrination.

Regardless, you pay more for public education than you would for private now, and you get less out of it. Private schools take in much less in tuition money and donations than public schools recieve in tax dollars.

857 x-wing  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:39:17am

re: #843 1SG(ret)

It would be nice if Frank would call them something other than undecideds. I'd really hate to go shopping with these people.

858 eon  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:39:35am

re: #837 Scion9

The worst, and most dishonest thing about the current 'Greater Good' mantra of the Left is that in addition to being Collectivists, they are also Moral Relativists.

At least the early Christian socialists around the turn of the century of the last century that got some sway in government had an idea of a moral Collective built around some kind of objective doctrine that defined specifically what is good and what is not that everyone could research and read into for themselves. Not that I agree with their politics, but at least it was consistent.

Today, those trumpetting for the 'Greater Good', are also in the business of telling you that what they are touting as being 'Good' is subjective to change without notice. That is practically advertising their totalitarian ideology, but so few seem to notice.

I might add that historically, the call to do something for "the greater good", and/or the mantra of "the needs of the many outweighing the needs of the few" have usually been followed by the oppression or even outright massacre of "the few" in the name of "the many".

/Dickens didn't invent that phrase for A Tale of Two Cities, he was actually quoting Talleyrand

cheers

eon

859 pingjockey  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:39:58am

Nornin' all. DG would probably like my coffee. A couple of ranchers use it to dehorn their cattle. Just pour it on the horns and they melt off!

860 Beach Lover  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:40:05am

re: #843 1SG(ret)

after last night, I won't believe him any longer. There is NO WAY those people were undecided. What a joke.

861 hermeneutics  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:40:10am

re: #856 Scion9

Your comments that tied the First Amendment to the education establishment has me thinking. Hard.

862 doriangrey  Thu, Oct 16, 2008 5:40:33am

re: #853 HoosierHoops

Good Morning Lizards!
How is everyone this fine day?
Coffee and yogurt this morning on the table..I'm pitching the day old donuts..

Hmmm, your day old donuts or FBV's 3 day old donuts.... decisions decisions decisions.... Oh and yes, I broke down and passed around some of my battery acid coffee. A few lizards needed to wash a very bad MSM talking head taste out of their mouths... wouldn't happen to be serving Kona this morning would ya?