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Phillips: Is America Really Going To Do This?

Politics | Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 8:39:26 am PDT

Melanie Phillips cries out: Is America Really Going To Do This?

There are, alas, many in the west for whom all this is music to their ears. Whether through wickedness, ideology, stupidity or derangement, they firmly believe that the ultimate source of conflict in the world derives at root from America and Israel, whose societies, culture and values they want to see emasculated or destroyed altogether. They are drooling at the prospect that an Obama presidency will bring that about. The rest of us can’t sleep at night.

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406 comments

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1 Sharmuta  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:40:34am

Short answer, Melanie- no.

2 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:42:40am

And Why do people drink and drive?

3 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:42:40am

I keep remembering Reagan's words -


“My optimism comes not just from my strong faith in God, but from my strong and enduring faith in man.”
4 Dave_Da_Kid  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:43:00am

re: #1 Sharmuta

Man, I hope you're right about that.

5 yesandno  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:43:06am

Have faith Melanie.............have faith

6 Shug  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:43:26am

Great mighty buffalo were killed by simply being herded off a cliff.

I will cast my vote for McCain-Palin and convince all I can to join me. I will not be herded willingly off a cliff

7 jamie  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:43:33am

I often like Melanie Phillips, but she sounds like a friggin' nut case in this article. I guess this is the Obama yin to the yang of BDS. It's pathetic.

8 yah  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:43:51am

That's because so many people sleep all day. WAKE UP AMERICA!

9 Ringo the Gringo  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:43:59am

re: #1 Sharmuta

Short answer, Melanie- no.

I wish I had your optimism.

10 Dave_Da_Kid  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:44:44am

re: #3 karmic_inquisitor

We could use a little of Reagan's optimism right about now. Remember "It's morning in America"? I do and I could stand to believe it again. Problem is, with MSM and the ONE, working together I fear it's nearing midnight.

11 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:44:57am

Well, our media certainly does. Right now, on the front page of the Denver Post (website) are these two blurbs...

"Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton says President Bush "has been practicing what John McCain preached," addressing a crowd of about 1,800 in Aurora Friday in support of Democrat Barack Obama"

"John McCain continued his criticism of rival Barack Obama's tax plan in front of a raucous crowd of 4,000 at Denver's National Western Arena"

Notice McCain's crowd is called "raucous." Assholes.

[Link: www.denverpost.com...]

12 van helsing  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:45:16am

From the article:
"Obama thinks world conflicts are basically the west’s fault, and so it must right the injustices it has inflicted. That’s why he believes in ‘soft power’ — diplomacy, aid, rectifying ‘grievances’ (thus legitimising them, encouraging terror and promoting injustice) and resolving conflict by talking. As a result, he will take an axe to America’s defences at the very time when they need to be built up."

Rewarding bad behavior gets you more bad behavior.

13 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:45:27am

BTW - I already voted absentee in California. Straight Republican ballot and "no" to every bond initiative. First time I have done that. I see it as an act of defiance and negation. I hope others have joined me.

14 newsjunkie_ky  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:45:42am

I am staying positive and upbeat. I believe that when in the voting booth, with no one there to see them, people will vote the Right way. We can not survive The Zero as potus.

15 Bobibutu  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:45:53am

re: #9 Ringo the Gringo

I wish I had your optimism.

What's in your way from having it?

16 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:46:11am

re: #12 van helsing

"Rewarding bad behavior gets you more bad behavior." Or gets you dead!

17 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:46:28am
18 Shug  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:46:32am

If Obama wins, it's Mourning in America

19 newsjunkie_ky  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:46:46am

frank luntz, in the tank for The Zero.

20 FrogMarch  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:46:47am
...McCain believes in protecting and defending America as it is. Obama tells the world he is ashamed of America and wants to change it into something McCain stands for American exceptionalism, the belief that American values are superior to tyrannies. Obama stands for the expiation of America’s original sin in oppressing black people, the third world and the poor.

Obama thinks world conflicts are basically the west’s fault, and so it must right the injustices it has inflicted. That’s why he believes in ‘soft power’ — diplomacy, aid, rectifying ‘grievances’ (thus legitimising them, encouraging terror and promoting injustice) and resolving conflict by talking. As a result, he will take an axe to America’s defences at the very time when they need to be built up. He has said he will ‘cut investments in unproven missile defense systems’; he will ‘not weaponize space’; he will ‘slow our development of future combat systems’; and he will also ‘not develop nuclear weapons,’ pledging to seek ‘deep cuts’ in America’s arsenal, thus unilaterally disabling its nuclear deterrent as Russia and China engage in massive military buildups.

21 pink freud  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:47:06am

re: #7 jamie

I often like Melanie Phillips, but she sounds like a friggin' nut case in this article. I guess this is the Obama yin to the yang of BDS. It's pathetic.

Her analysis seems quite astute to me.

22 kynna  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:47:17am

I have had many sleepless nights over this. Nothing anyone can say will convince Obama won't be a tragic disaster. And not just for America, but for the entire world.

23 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:47:36am

Every limitation you see is a limitation you impose on yourself.

This election will not end anything.

24 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:48:08am

Wow...a European journalist who doesn't want an Obama presidency! When McCain wins, he should offer her honorary citizenship.

25 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:48:30am

Even if we do, there will be some who will continue to fight. Oppose The One every step of the way.

What we have is too dear, too valuable, bought at such a high price to let a red diaper doper baby and his brain dead minions steal away without a struggle.

26 jemima  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:48:38am

This is not directed at Melanie.
But since Europe has done everything possible to diminish America, to stab us in the back, to make deals with our enemies as well as theirs, I want to give them a hearty FU this morning. You did NOTHING to support us, you've mocked us mercilessly, you courted the weak-minded in America with your criticisms for years, nay, decades, now they are on your side. You will reap the nasty seeds you have sown if this commie wins the election. Don't cry now. Revel in what you've achieved, you socialist nitwits.

27 rokbassist  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:49:05am

Is it just me or is linky no worky?

28 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:49:06am

re: #23 karmic_inquisitor

Every limitation you see is a limitation you impose on yourself.

This election will not end anything.

No, but it might very well increase the price we ultimately are going to have to pay for Freedom, Liberty, and the American Way!

29 Ringo the Gringo  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:49:26am

re: #15 Bobibutu

What's in your way from having it?

This for starters.

30 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:49:46am

re: #17 Charles

Ugh.

There is a higher correlation between the expansion of toddler television watching and incidents of autism than any other environmental factor. Yet I don't hear about it.

31 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:50:27am

re: #26 jemima

Perhaps the next time they're under threat from a crazed dictator, we should do just as they want us to do and stay on our side of the pond.

32 FrogMarch  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:50:29am

re: #26 jemima

Exactly. If Europe thinks they will have an easy time of things while America drowns - they are sadly mistaken.
It needed to be said.

33 realwest  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:51:43am

re: #14 newsjunkie_ky
Hey {newsjunkie} I share your optimism but do think we can survive Obama - what the hell will ALL the nations of the world (except possibly China and Russia) do when they realize that there is NO US military to aid them in a crisis? No US ability to help alleviate human suffering from Tsunami's and the like?
And NO US MARKET TO PURCHASE THE GOODS THEY MAKE?
Oh yeah, they'll just LOVE Obama if he (shudder) becomes POTUS - for all of about a year - max.

34 itellu3times  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:51:58am

re: #13 karmic_inquisitor

BTW - I already voted absentee in California. Straight Republican ballot and "no" to every bond initiative. First time I have done that. I see it as an act of defiance and negation. I hope others have joined me.

You voted no on 8?

35 Dave_Da_Kid  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:52:01am

re: #25 jcm

There's an afternoon radio host on in Boston saying just that. If we can't stop him from being elected we can raise holy hell and work to prevent him from governing. All leading up to his removal from office at the first opportunity. Either by election or impeachment. And, by the way, those are the only two methods of removing Obama from office ANYONE should support. None of that grassy knoll nonsense please.

36 yesandno  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:52:20am

re: #7 jamie

I often like Melanie Phillips, but she sounds like a friggin' nut case in this article. I guess this is the Obama yin to the yang of BDS. It's pathetic.

.................? Guess you disagree....sad to be you.

37 Bobibutu  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:52:34am

re: #29 Ringo the Gringo

This for starters.

I call BS and propaganda. It ain't over till the fat lady sings.

Pay attention to your intention - all else is background noise.

I gotta run. Back late this afternoon.

38 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:53:07am

re: #31 arethusa

Perhaps the next time they're under threat from a crazed dictator, we should do just as they want us to do and stay on our side of the pond.

Part of our National Character is to oppose oppression everywhere.

39 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:53:08am

re: #28 Nevergiveup

No, but it might very well increase the price we ultimately are going to have to pay for Freedom, Liberty, and the American Way!

Blood has always been the price of liberty. We will bleed again, that is for sure.

Insofar as increasing prices is concerned, everyone should be prepared with a hyper inflation strategy for the coming years. If you are prepared you can come out ahead, especially if you have a fixed mortgage because your debt gets virtually eliminated.

40 FrogMarch  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:53:12am

Obama - the anti-Ronald Reagan.

btw- when Obama was younger he openly HATED Ronald Reagan. People should know this...

Obama thinks world conflicts are basically the west’s fault, and so it must right the injustices it has inflicted. That’s why he believes in ‘soft power’ — diplomacy, aid, rectifying ‘grievances’ (thus legitimising them, encouraging terror and promoting injustice) and resolving conflict by talking. As a result, he will take an axe to America’s defences at the very time when they need to be built up. He has said he will ‘cut investments in unproven missile defense systems’; he will ‘not weaponize space’; he will ‘slow our development of future combat systems’; and he will also ‘not develop nuclear weapons,’ pledging to seek ‘deep cuts’ in America’s arsenal, thus unilaterally disabling its nuclear deterrent as Russia and China engage in massive military buildups.

41 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:53:52am

re: #34 itellu3times

You voted no on 8?

Not a bond initiative. I was careful to write that.

42 kahn_mann  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:54:13am

I keep remembering the last two election cycles, when Gore and Kerry were declared the winners even when election day rolled around; even the exit polls were saying the Democrat was going to win. W won both times. I'm hoping the msm has it wrong again.

43 kynna  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:54:36am

re: #30 karmic_inquisitor

There is a higher correlation between the expansion of toddler television watching and incidents of autism than any other environmental factor. Yet I don't hear about it.

As a mother of a child diagnosed with autism I can say without reservation that the 'autism lobby' is big, powerful and ruthless. I don't take anything they say at face value.

Fruit fly research has helped autism? Pardon my skepticism, but I've seen it all at this point.

44 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:54:55am

re: #35 Dave_Da_Kid

There's an afternoon radio host on in Boston saying just that. If we can't stop him from being elected we can raise holy hell and work to prevent him from governing. All leading up to his removal from office at the first opportunity. Either by election or impeachment. And, by the way, those are the only two methods of removing Obama from office ANYONE should support. None of that grassy knoll nonsense please.

Should The One win, with a (D) congress, I plan on making my voice heard loud and clear with the WA delegation.

As long as the 1st Amend holds, we speak, often loudly, and with purpose.

45 razorbacker  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:54:56am

It is, after all, a represenative republic. If a large enough share of the citizen voters decide that being an informed electorate is too much trouble, so be it.

Kinda wish that I was calm in my mind that they're all citizen voters, though.

I take some small solace in the knowledge that it's taken the enemies of freedom this long to dumb down the electorate. It takes the best indoctrinated group of voters in history to bring down this rough beast called America.

Hope and Change.

Phooey.

46 realwest  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:55:13am

re: #17 Charles
Um, "UGH" to what? Palin's speech or fruit fly research?

47 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:55:35am

re: #33 realwest

Hey {newsjunkie} I share your optimism but do think we can survive Obama - what the hell will ALL the nations of the world (except possibly China and Russia) do when they realize that there is NO US military to aid them in a crisis? No US ability to help alleviate human suffering from Tsunami's and the like?
And NO US MARKET TO PURCHASE THE GOODS THEY MAKE?
Oh yeah, they'll just LOVE Obama if he (shudder) becomes POTUS - for all of about a year - max.

That is precisly what China and Russia will wait for, and then run in and take up the slack, beholding nations to them. They are already jockeying themselves to be economic power houses in the future scheme of things.

We can't let that happen.

48 kynna  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:55:41am

re: #42 kahn_mann

I keep remembering the last two election cycles, when Gore and Kerry were declared the winners even when election day rolled around; even the exit polls were saying the Democrat was going to win. W won both times. I'm hoping the msm has it wrong again.

Only this time might cause riots with their shoddy reporting.

49 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:56:30am

re: #38 jcm

Part of our National Character is to oppose oppression everywhere.

True.

50 rumcrook  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:56:42am

ive registered to vote for the first time in years and im gonna get out the door and vote for mcain..... ....im not gonna give this to ¢bama he's gonna have to steal it.

that said I think the dems with thier complicit media whores and the 40 years of socialist indoctrination in the schools have finnally realized a tipping point in thier efforts to legitimize bringing socialism as the controling way of doing bussiness to the US and they have enough thiefs out there working to steal this that between stupidity and thievery they have it in the bag

51 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:56:58am

re: #43 kynna

Fruit fly research has helped autism?

Yes, it really has.

52 musicman  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:57:17am

re: #44 jcm

Should The One win, with a (D) congress, I plan on making my voice heard loud and clear with the WA delegation.

As long as the 1st Amend holds, we speak, often loudly, and with purpose.

And hope you don't get treated like "Joe the Plumber".

53 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:57:24am

re: #10 Dave_Da_Kid

We could use a little of Reagan's optimism right about now. Remember "It's morning in America"? I do and I could stand to believe it again. Problem is, with MSM and the ONE, working together I fear it's nearing midnight.

"It had no effect upon the cries; no pendulum could be more regular."
- Dickens

They have been delivering a reckoning and will get theirs.

54 van helsing  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:57:38am

Can anyone give an example where 'soft power' has worked well? Maybe I'm blinded by my expectations but I can't seem to come up with any.

Since it's usually directed at tyrants, and the tyrants are certainly not going to be suffering (Saddam's new palaces come to mind) and they don't seem to care much what happens to their citizens, where's the leverage?

55 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:57:40am

re: #46 realwest

Um, "UGH" to what? Palin's speech or fruit fly research?

The comment about fruit fly research was disturbingly ignorant.

56 itellu3times  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:58:14am

re: #41 karmic_inquisitor

Not a bond initiative. I was careful to write that.

Quite, pardon me, read "ballot" for "bond", still early.

57 FrogMarch  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:58:24am

Obama vs. Obama on Ronald Reagan.

Obama desires Reagan's voters - but he hated Reagan and he fought against everything Reagan stood for; Namely - the defense of American and the idea of American exceptionalism.

58 FrogMarch  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:58:58am

Obama: "I spent a lifetime fighting against Ronald Reagan's policies."

59 leboaz  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:59:08am

Well, like most of us, I have already voted. Sent a million emails, and tried to explain our point ad nauseum. Still, more than half of my Jewish friends are going to vote for Obama, some of my NamVet friends are voting for Obama, and my (ex) banker is voting for Obama. They're just blind, I guess. No- I'm not giving up. Where's the Govt. computer that can look into Vera Baker?

60 Sharmuta  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:59:13am

re: #55 Charles

I agree, but I think if she was made aware, she probably wouldn't have said that.

61 realwest  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 8:59:46am

re: #29 Ringo the Gringo
Ah well then, according to RealClearPolitics there's no real reason to actually, you know, have an election then, is there?

62 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:00:55am
63 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:01:10am

re: #60 Sharmuta

She has a nephew with autism, too - so if she did know that, it's hard to imagine her criticizing fruit fly research.

64 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:01:46am

re: #49 arethusa

True.

I sway between isolationism, and interventionism.

I look at the dogs breakfast of Africa, and say they made there bed, let 'em lie in it.

The human part says if can help do we have a moral obligation to do so.

It comes down to pragmatic real politick decisions. Which I dislike immensely, because I prefer doing the right thing.

65 DistantThunder  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:02:13am

Fellow Passengers, our US elections are being hijacked via voter fraud, fundraising fraud, "truth squads," a corrupt media, and by a lying, secretive Obama.

I say to you: "Let's Roll!"

66 angrywhitedad  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:03:08am

Just keep the faith my 87 year old grandfather is voting for a republican for the first time in his life. I just hope that there's more people like him and I believe that there are. Just do yourself a favor, watch cartoons with the kids or movies at night and turn off the radio during top and bottom of the hour news breaks on Rush. You'll feel 100% better.

67 Sharmuta  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:03:26am

re: #62 taxfreekiller

Speak it, Brother!

Republicans have got to get involved in the party, down to the local level, if anything is going to change. I keep trying to get the point across, but maybe they'll listen to you.

68 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:03:44am

re: #59 leboaz

Well, like most of us, I have already voted. Sent a million emails, and tried to explain our point ad nauseum. Still, more than half of my Jewish friends are going to vote for Obama, some of my NamVet friends are voting for Obama, and my (ex) banker is voting for Obama. They're just blind, I guess. No- I'm not giving up. Where's the Govt. computer that can look into Vera Baker?

Considering the state of the economy right now, as long as Obama is talking about "sharing the wealth," there are a whole lot of Americans that are interested in NOTHING more than that.

Most folks in this country are not going to fight for their supper anymore.

They expect it, it's an entitlement, a right and Obama is promising them that the government will supply it.

Socialism, Marxism, Communism doesn't mean anything to them, they have no historical content in wish to compare it to. Our schools don't teach it, our popular media doesn't show it for what it really is and most folks have lost touch with what this country has had to sacrifice to get to where we are.

Where as I don't like Nationalism that becomes an "ism," in the sense of us against everyone else, but maybe a little dose of Nationalism would do us some good.

In a sense, we don't need a Reichstag fire. The MSM is a virtual Reichstag fire, being about to say this and that, knight jump from one lie to the other, at the speed of light.

In the 30's, the Reichstag fire was a way to reach a multitude of people with a large demonstration that would be covered on the front page of every paper with in days.

Now, we don't need that kind of event in order to have the same impact. A simple 2 paragraph lie, transmitted instantly to media outlets all around the planet, and the ability to appear on air or on a web site in under a minute, that's a virtual Reichstag fire.

It's a done deal.

69 Shug  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:03:50am

re: #62 taxfreekiller

F-in' A Bubba

70 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:04:04am

re: #52 musicman

And hope you don't get treated like "Joe the Plumber".

In a way I hope those who speak up do get treated that way. Early enough to wake people up, before the midnight knocks on the door start.

71 yesandno  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:04:23am

re: #17 Charles

Ugh.

Can't fault her for this. The fundamental problem with all of these earmarks is that they often are supported before the general budget items. No thought is gone into them more then I scratch your back and you scratch mine.

It would be impossible for anyone to know the underlying reasoning behind every grant of money on the part of the US government...and that is because a lot of these are specialized and advocated by only those affected rather then the general populace as a whole.

Maybe earmarks need to be placed in an accessory budget line and when there is extra money, go through the line and evaluate each on its merit, not on who proposed the money for their district.

72 Rancher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:04:37am

Those who want America to fail are the biggest losers should that happen. The world will realize that their prosperity is strongly tied to ours, if we go down they go down harder.

73 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:04:40am

Whether through wickedness, ideology, stupidity or derangement, they firmly believe that the ultimate source of conflict in the world derives at root from America and Israel

I actually think it's a much easier explanation than any of those theories.
Simply put, those 'west" nations know they cannot attain the greatness that America has achieved through it's hard work, so they hope to have us brought down to their level instead of them raising to ours

74 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:05:36am

...

75 FrogMarch  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:06:27am

Yahoo headline: Sarah Palin injures a hockey player.


oooo - left-wing media are salivating over this one.

76 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:06:45am

re: #64 jcm

We should intervene when there is wrong, but we don't always do so on a consistent basis. We have to preserve our own interests as well as others'. It's hard even for a superpower to fight all the oppression in the world. I wish we could, but if we fall or are diminished, who will take our place in helping the weak and the wronged around the world?

77 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:06:59am

Uh-oh. I down-dinged Charles, and tried to respond to his comment about Palin, and now my comments are coming up blank!

78 Desert Dog  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:07:37am

It is a sad fact that in today's America, there is a giant group of people that are woefully ignorant of world affairs, economics and government, in general. Add to that fact, a slick, well spoken con-man and a willing accomplice in the MSM, and you get to where we are today....on the verge of electing a man that just a few short years ago would have never been considered for the highest office in the land.

79 Dustyvet  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:07:46am

re: #62 taxfreekiller

Its not that America is going to do any thing,

ITS THAT 70% OF AMERICANS DO NOT DO ONE F'N THING ABOUT IT
JUST SIT ON THEIR ASS'S AND EXPECT REALWEST TO SPEND HIS LIFE
LOOKING OUT FOR THEM.

RIGHT NOW MEN AND WOMEN GIVE THEIR LIVES IN IRAQ AND AFGHANISTAN AND A GOOD 40% OF AMERICA DO NOT EVEN KNOW IT
ANOTHER 20% ARE WILLIAM AYERS AND JOHN F. KERRY'S FAN CLUB.

We have to get the RINO's out of the Republican party, and get good
men and women to get off their ass's and fight for America.

like that,
12 years
[Link: www.blowoutcongress.com...]

John F. Kerry belongs in a Federal Prison cell with a bunk mate named Bubba...

80 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:07:53am
81 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:07:58am

re: #77 Cast Iron Magnolia

Uh-oh. I down-dinged Charles, and tried to respond to his comment about Palin, and now my comments are coming up blank!

Young upstart! You'd better go back and upding him.

82 Desert Dog  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:08:03am

re: #77 Cast Iron Magnolia

Uh-oh. I down-dinged Charles, and tried to respond to his comment about Palin, and now my comments are coming up blank!

I see ya

83 Josephine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:08:23am

re: #77 Cast Iron Magnolia

Uh-oh. I down-dinged Charles, and tried to respond to his comment about Palin, and now my comments are coming up blank!

You can reverse your down-ding. Recently added feature.

84 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:08:32am

Was Palin's sarcasm directed at fruit fly research in general (it's possible, and yes, that would be ignorance) or at the funding of a specific program IN PARIS, FRANCE?

WTF are we doing funding European research projects? I understand that scientific research is intertwined across national boundaries, but it's not like we haven't a lot of fruit fly research projects of our own.

My guess is that some academic is laying sideways in the trough, lapping up that grant like there's no tomorrow.

85 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:08:34am

re: #77 Cast Iron Magnolia

Uh-oh. I down-dinged Charles, and tried to respond to his comment about Palin, and now my comments are coming up blank!

I know you down-dinged my comment, but Palin's statement about fruit fly research WAS ignorant and wrong, whether you like me saying it or not.

86 newsjunkie_ky  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:08:42am

Research in the past has given us:
eggs good for you
eggs bad for you
eggs good for you
eggs bad for you
eggs good for you
eggs bad for you

Not sure where it stands today.
I take most research with a grain of salt just like I take my eggs.

87 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:08:49am

re: #81 arethusa

Young upstart! You'd better go back and upding him.

I just knew everyone was looking to see how long I'd been on here, and betting on how long I'd last!

88 opinionated  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:09:06am

Caroline Glick has a similar theme.

She also has a warning some of us recognize.

With this election, I have a sense of deja vu. I remember some of us warning what would happen if Israelis ignored the obvious and choose Olmert.

Among what has happened is that Israel would go on to lose a war to terrorists.

It will be worse for America if it votes in our own very own Olmert type.

In 2006 Olmert's electoral platform included a naïve and defeatist pledge to unilaterally withdraw Israeli civilians and military forces from Judea and Samaria. As for Iran, Olmert's policy was to abdicate Israel's responsibility to prevent its own destruction by relying on the Americans and the Europeans to prevent Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons.

Olmert was tested and found wanting when in July 2006 Iran's Hizbullah proxy went to war against Israel. Just as Olmert's political opponents warned, and Israel's enemies expected, Olmert's naïve perception of international affairs, his strategic incompetence and his exaggerated view of his own importance caused him to fail abjectly when his country needed him.

[Link: www.jpost.com...]

If the polls are correct, we're all impotent Cassandras now.

89 rightwinger3  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:09:43am

re: #75 FrogMarch

Yahoo headline: Sarah Palin injures a hockey player.


oooo - left-wing media are salivating over this one.

Legace is a dipshit anyway, the Blues are better off without him.

90 Rancher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:10:07am

re: #77 Cast Iron Magnolia

Uh-oh. I down-dinged Charles, ... and now my comments are coming up blank!

That will teach you!

No comments for you!

91 realwest  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:10:16am

re: #51 Charles
Hmm, don't want to get into a dispute with you over anything as serious as fruit flies and autism, but I note two quotes from your link:

Autism is a hot topic for scientists engaged in brain research. If you can link your research to autism it may help you to access additional funding that is available in the USA.


and

Neurexin is a basic prerequisite for neuronal connectivity. Without it the fruit flies barely survived. Movement was severely impaired. These are primitive creatures compared to us. I would anticipate that a similar lack in humans would have far more devastating results. Autism would be the least of our worries. Never mind. The putative autism connection cannot have done any harm in obtaining funding from

the National Institute of General Medical Sciences,
National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke
the National Institute of Mental Health
the state of North Carolina.


That would seem to indicate while additonal funding may be available for autism research, fruit fly research hasn't really yielded anything worth while as of yet.
However, as I am sorely lacking in scientific knowledge, I will bow to your judgement but don't really see how that YouTube clip has much to do with McCain's chances of winning this election.

92 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:10:18am

re: #76 arethusa

We should intervene when there is wrong, but we don't always do so on a consistent basis. We have to preserve our own interests as well as others'. It's hard even for a superpower to fight all the oppression in the world. I wish we could, but if we fall or are diminished, who will take our place in helping the weak and the wronged around the world?

All true. Despite all that, we are still the greatest force for good in the world.

93 musicman  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:10:27am

re: #86 newsjunkie_ky

Research in the past has given us:
eggs good for you
eggs bad for you
eggs good for you
eggs bad for you
eggs good for you
eggs bad for you

Not sure where it stands today.
I take most research with a grain of salt just like I take my eggs.

And let's not even go near the coffee issue!

94 lawhawk  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:10:50am

re: #86 newsjunkie_ky

Hold the salt. Salt bad. Salt evil. Salt? Salt necessary. Pass the salt.

95 vxbush  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:10:54am

re: #60 Sharmuta

I agree, but I think if she was made aware, she probably wouldn't have said that.

I would have to concur. She may have no clue about this area, as autism may have not been a high concern for her before. It may take her a while to get up to speed if she does want to help the disabled.

96 heretic  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:11:10am

I think they're just drooling ... period.

97 docremulac  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:11:17am

I'm afraid the coming chapter of American history is going to read a little like "Lord of the Flies" when these guys get in charge.

98 Conservative in Liberal Hands  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:11:29am

I want everyone to pray for freezing rain on Nov 4th. I want to see BHO in Grant Park with all the fair-haired liberals (maybe a hundred) standing there when he is forced to announce that he's conceding that he lost the presidency to McCain!

And after that, I can't wait for the indictments on Vote Fraud and Campaign Finance violations to begin.

One thing that's becoming increasingly clear is that BHO is betting his personal freedom and liberty on winning. He stands to lose EVERYTHING of he does not win on Nov 4. Perhaps that's why his campaign is running a pretty concentrated TV and radio ad campaign in Illinois? Illinois, his home state!

No matter what the outcome of the Presidential election, BHO travails are just beginning! Remember the adage - "Be careful what you wish for, it may come true!"

99 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:11:36am

re: #85 Charles

I know you down-dinged my comment, but Palin's statement about fruit fly research WAS ignorant and wrong, whether you like me saying it or not.

I am not worthy!
I down-dinged you because I'm especially sensitve today about anti-Palin comments. I am not challenging your knowledge, just think there's been so much negative stuff written about Palin, that I was disappointed to see someone (who's opinion I value) doing it.

100 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:11:36am

re: #51 Charles

Yes, it really has.

It is not the research, but the method the money was appropriated. If Congress wants to fund that let it be properly appropriated instead of by earmarks.

101 leboaz  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:11:36am

re: #70 jcm

Amen. Like most people, I have a few marks on my report card. I don;t give a damn who knows about them either. It shouldn't stop anyone from trying. But I have done a little public service, and I'm too old to fight the crap anymore. What's scary is fewer young people any more have the benefit of knowing the truth. And even fewer have the inclination to fight for it.

102 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:11:38am

re: #92 jcm

All true. Despite all that, we are still the greatest force for good in the world.

We are the only force for good with the ability to project power far beyond our borders.

103 musicman  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:11:56am

re: #90 Rancher

That will teach you!

No comments for you!

He said with a soup nazi accent.

104 hermeneutics  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:12:05am

re: #88 opinionated

The polls are NOT correct. Go back and reweigh them for a +2 D or +3 D and McCain actually win.

This is a reasonable prediction based on historical party ID.

Democrats have convinced themselves that Obama has so altered the political landscape that Dems now have anywhere from a +5 to a +14 advantage in Party ID.

No way.

105 lawhawk  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:12:05am

re: #93 musicman

I'll stick with the wine issue (resvesterol is good for you). Pass the bottle.

106 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:12:29am

re: #83 Josephine

You can reverse your down-ding. Recently added feature.

Nah, I'm already in trouble, I'll just stand by my down-dinger.

107 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:12:30am
108 kynna  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:12:47am

re: #51 Charles

Yes, it really has.

I like this comment from your link:

Animal models are incredibly useful but because of the apparent genetic complexity of autism, the real power of an organism like drosophila cannot be realized when studying autism. Scientists can either induce a plethora of mutations and challenge the population somehow thus screening for a phenotype and backsolving for the genotype (identifying the gene of interest). Or a specific gene can be knocked down or knocked out and a behavior can be observed (mating rituals in flies or eye blinking in mice as examples). The latter method is especially useful when testing drugs.

I find it troublesome that the diagnostic criteria for autism is so broad yet many researchers jump at the chance to explain autism with their favorite gene. It would be cool if these guys are right but my money is that they’re only be focusing on 1/100th of the genetic system.

There are other comments of interest by people more learned than myself.

I am always skeptical about how much the government puts into certain projects and the focus they place on fund recipients. From my own experience I'm also disgusted with the huge umbrella of the diagnosis and the extreme pressure to explore government programs rather than similar private venues.

I do know the people who work with my son are not 'excited' by these kinds of conclusions and I've also learned not to jump at every 'good news!' report about research that demands 'good news!' to get more $$.

Maybe it's personal, but I can't blame her for questioning government funded research.

109 vxbush  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:12:50am

re: #105 lawhawk

I'll stick with the wine issue (resvesterol is good for you). Pass the bottle.

And I'll take the chocolate for the endorphins. :D

110 Desert Dog  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:13:22am

re: #93 musicman

And let's not even go near the coffee issue!

I just finished my eggs and I am on my 3rd cup O coffee...am I doomed today, or am I in good shape?

111 hermeneutics  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:14:42am

re: #110 Desert Dog

I just finished my eggs and I am on my 3rd cup O coffee...am I doomed today, or am I in good shape?

You're in great shape. Now stop drinking coffee and get outside with your wife and kids (if you have any). Gorgeous day. Its a great day to hike!

112 irongrampa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:14:47am

I call bullshit.

America has shown the knack for having the right person for the right time, in any given situation. Even a cursory look back through our history will bear this out. The stumbles (Carter) merely point out the correct path to take. I see no reason for this election to defy that tradition.

McCain will prevail.

113 HoosierHoops  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:14:54am

re: #106 Cast Iron Magnolia

Nah, I'm already in trouble, I'll just stand by my down-dinger.

Courage
LOL

114 Shug  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:14:57am

Fruit flies are good.

When I see them in a restaurant, I eat somewhere else

115 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:15:03am

re: #100 Dasher

It is not the research, but the method the money was appropriated. If Congress wants to fund that let it be properly appropriated instead of by earmarks.

Bingo, and hadn't thought about that. Research grants are vetted. Earmarks aren't. Why did someone toss in an earmark for fruit fly research, wherever it was to take place? Was it a program that couldn't be justified through scientific channels?

116 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:15:53am

re: #107 Charles

Fruit fly research and autism: Specific Brain Protein Required For Nerve Cell Connections To Form And Function.

Why can't private industry finance this research. The profit motive is what drives innovation.

117 Sharmuta  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:16:06am

re: #95 vxbush

Trig is still very young. I'm sure she'll be learning more as time goes by. I think it was an ignorant comment, but it's more problematic if she doesn't learn about the incredible advancements made in genetic research mainly due to fruit flies. I wouldn't have been able to tell you about this a year ago, but I took the time to learn. I hope Sarah does too.

118 razorbacker  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:16:15am

re: #94 lawhawk

Hold the salt. Salt bad. Salt evil. Salt? Salt necessary. Pass the salt.

A former Arkansas pol who lost well over 100 pounds made the comment that if your great-grandparents didn't recognize it as food, you probably shouldn't either.

119 kynna  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:16:28am

re: #100 Dasher

It is not the research, but the method the money was appropriated. If Congress wants to fund that let it be properly appropriated instead of by earmarks.

This is a very good point.

120 Desert Dog  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:16:31am

Why is it that so many people can see right through the BS that is BHO and so many others cannot? I know part of it is the way people look at the world. There are many nimrods on the left that are lapping up everything BHO says, because they believe in the same crap. But, what is scary is the sheer number of people that are taking the bait - hook, line and sinker without even knowing (or caring) what BHO stands for. All they hear is HOPE and CHANGE, and that is enough for them.....UGH....heaven help us.

121 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:16:51am

re: #114 Shug

Fruit flies are good.

When I see them in a restaurant, I eat somewhere else

Right on

122 shibumi  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:16:53am

I work in frothing, raving, moonbat central. Yesterday I was cornered and basically told that anyone who doesn't vote for The One is an idiot.

Why, you might ask?
1. He is the most popular man in the WORLD
2. He is giving us all MONEY
3. If our enemies like him, they will no longer be our enemies.
4. BHO is not a socialist, in fact, Palin is the socialist because residents in Alaska already get checks from the government

BTW, statements two and three were said by a NRA member.

123 yma o hyd  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:16:54am

re: #110 Desert Dog

I just finished my eggs and I am on my 3rd cup O coffee...am I doomed today, or am I in good shape?

Have a glass of red wine to top it off, and today you'll be in good shape.
Who knows if tomorrow you'll be doomed ... just to be in good shape again on Monday ...

Its not the scientists who are blameworthy - its the half-educated journalists who use every bit of new research findings to ring the doom/all is well- bells.

124 Ringo the Gringo  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:17:01am

re: #61 realwest

Ah well then, according to RealClearPolitics there's no real reason to actually, you know, have an election then, is there?

Don't worry, I'll vote.

I'm just not optimistic, that's all.

125 musicman  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:17:21am

re: #110 Desert Dog

I just finished my eggs and I am on my 3rd cup O coffee...am I doomed today, or am I in good shape?

Depends on the latest research....

126 FrogMarch  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:17:25am

I think most folks were expecting a Hillary vs. Rudy presidential fight.
I know I was. Instead we got McCain and Obama.
McCain and Obama. WFT?

127 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:17:34am

re: #107 Charles

Fruit fly research and autism: Specific Brain Protein Required For Nerve Cell Connections To Form And Function.

This speech was most certainly written for her by her handlers to some extend. And she has to rely on them for accuracy alot since she is always out campaigning. She has only had to come to grips with her own special needs child for about a year now. Yes perhaps in a perfect world, she should have know that Fruit Fly research has many important genetic uses since the little buggers multiply so fast. But I think we might cut her a break here.

128 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:17:48am

re: #93 musicman

And let's not even go near the coffee issue!

All things in moderation......

129 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:17:56am

re: #95 vxbush

Palin has an autistic nephew.

She seems to know quite a bit about the disabled (at least under the law) and she certainly has plans to help them. I don't know if she has drawn her own conclusions about fruit-fly research, or whether she just doesn't know about it.

Frankly, speaking from my own family experiences with disability, she's the strongest politician to advocate for the disabled that I can remember.

130 Shug  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:17:58am

re: #126 FrogMarch

I think most folks were expecting a Hillary vs. Rudy presidential fight.
I know I was. Instead we got McCain and Obama.
McCain and Obama. WFT?


Kind of like Expecting Dodgers- Red Sox and getting Philly and Tampa Bay

131 rightwinger3  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:18:09am

re: #122 shibumi

I work in frothing, raving, moonbat central. Yesterday I was cornered and basically told that anyone who doesn't vote for The One is an idiot.

Why, you might ask?
1. He is the most popular man in the WORLD
2. He is giving us all MONEY
3. If our enemies like him, they will no longer be our enemies.
4. BHO is not a socialist, in fact, Palin is the socialist because residents in Alaska already get checks from the government

BTW, statements two and three were said by a NRA member.

I'm an idiot.

132 SurferDoc  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:18:33am

re: #86 newsjunkie_ky

Research in the past has given us:
eggs good for you
eggs bad for you
eggs good for you
eggs bad for you
eggs good for you
eggs bad for you

Not sure where it stands today.
I take most research with a grain of salt just like I take my eggs.

My father-in-law is in charge of keeping track of "what will kill you this week"--I'll give you his phone number. ;)

133 Rage - Goddess,  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:18:36am

You could argue that we shouldn't be earmarking money to fund Drosophila research in France - rather funding American research through standard channels like NIH - but that's kind of beside the point.

Yes, her statement was ignorant. But one difference, to me, between Palin and Obama is that I trust Palin to choose reasonable advisors and listen to them on issues like this. "What? You mean the fruit fly is one of the single most important models in genetic research? I had no idea!" I see Obama as wedded to his ideology. During one of the debates with Hillary, after proposing to raise capital gains taxes, he was confronted by the moderator (Charlie Gibson?) with the fact that reductions in capital gains taxes consistently results in an increase in revenues. Obama's response: "That may be true, BUT..." followed by some spread-the-wealth-around/fairness schtick. The facts didn't matter, it was the ideology that drove everything. How do you trust THAT?

134 jaunte  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:19:15am

re: #17 Charles

Glass half full dept.:
That kind of ignorance about the value of research is curable where there is a motive to learn. It's preferable to the cock-sure economic wrongheadedness of the other side.

135 Josephine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:19:23am

I believe Americans won't be bullied into voting for the wrong man just to prove they aren't racists.

I believe Americans know that giving a man the Presidency just because he is black won't do anything to "heal the nation's wounds": all it will do is create the post of affirmative-action-Commander-in-Chief.

I believe Americans who care the most about their country and their world will be informed about the real issues facing us and will vote accordingly.

I believe the number of white people who will vote against Obama because of his skin colour is small.

I believe the number of people of any skin colour who will vote against Obama because of his politics and associates is large.

I believe there will be a backlash: many people won't vote for Obama because they've been called ignorant, Bible-toting, gun-wielding bigots for having honest questions about the man's politics. How insulting is that?

I believe in America: the greatest country on earth. That means I believe in Americans.

Get out there and vote, Americans!

136 hermeneutics  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:20:12am

As a pre-teen, I experimented with fruit flies (Drosophilidae) for months ... perhaps more than a year. My goal was a "pure" apricot eyes and short wings. With a life span of a couple of weeks, my short attention span was satisfied.

Until I left my twenty or more big test tubes in my locker and the CA sun cooked my lil' bables. I shouldn't have brought them to school!

137 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:20:45am

re: #128 jcm

All things in moderation......

*whack*

/stalking off to pour another cup

138 vxbush  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:20:53am

re: #129 arethusa

Palin has an autistic nephew.

She seems to know quite a bit about the disabled (at least under the law) and she certainly has plans to help them. I don't know if she has drawn her own conclusions about fruit-fly research, or whether she just doesn't know about it.

Frankly, speaking from my own family experiences with disability, she's the strongest politician to advocate for the disabled that I can remember.

Ah, thank you. I did not know about the nephew. At this point, I would err on the side of assuming she just doesn't know about the research. And I agree, she seems like she would be a good person to advocate for the disabled.

139 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:21:33am

re: #122 shibumi

I work in frothing, raving, moonbat central. Yesterday I was cornered and basically told that anyone who doesn't vote for The One is an idiot.

Why, you might ask?
1. He is the most popular man in the WORLD
2. He is giving us all MONEY
3. If our enemies like him, they will no longer be our enemies.
4. BHO is not a socialist, in fact, Palin is the socialist because residents in Alaska already get checks from the government

My responses:
1. Are we in high school?
2. Are we that susceptible to bribery?
3. That's not even logical.
4. I've heard this one - the people of Alaska OWN their oil. Palin's checks are in effect giving the people profit from the resources they OWN. They are not taxing the rich to give to the poor.

140 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:21:39am

re:

141 musicman  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:21:41am

re: #120 Desert Dog

Why is it that so many people can see right through the BS that is BHO and so many others cannot? I know part of it is the way people look at the world. There are many nimrods on the left that are lapping up everything BHO says, because they believe in the same crap. But, what is scary is the sheer number of people that are taking the bait - hook, line and sinker without even knowing (or caring) what BHO stands for. All they hear is HOPE and CHANGE, and that is enough for them.....UGH....heaven help us.


Which is how you get poeple like these Harlem voters.

142 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:22:11am

re: #137 pre-Boomer Marine brat

*whack*

/stalking off to pour another cup

Bring me one while your at it!

*rubs lump on head*

143 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:22:40am

re: #140 Dasher

That was weird where did my message go.

144 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:22:54am
145 newsjunkie_ky  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:23:10am

re: #118 razorbacker

A former Arkansas pol who lost well over 100 pounds made the comment that if your great-grandparents didn't recognize it as food, you probably shouldn't either.


And, if it comes through your car window, it isn't food.
My friend and I were talking about this yesterday. How groceries have become so high and realizing it is the KIND of groceries we buy as well. Pre-packaged food 'products'.
I'm going back to the old way.

146 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:23:54am

re: #142 jcm

Bring me one while your at it!

*rubs lump on head*

Are y' ready?
I'm pouring it into my modem nBZZRRKKT!

147 kansas  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:24:00am

re: #55 Charles

The comment about fruit fly research was disturbingly ignorant.


Charles,
What were Obama and Biden's position on this?

148 Shug  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:24:14am

Interesting that we are talking about drosophila melanogaster on a thread about Obama.

Most of his supporters have fly sized brains

149 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:24:32am

re: #145 newsjunkie_ky

And, if it comes through your car window, it isn't food.
My friend and I were talking about this yesterday. How groceries have become so high and realizing it is the KIND of groceries we buy as well. Pre-packaged food 'products'.
I'm going back to the old way.

Been that way for a while, we've got food sensitivities and allergies around my house. To control what goes in, everything from scratch.

150 ciaospirit  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:24:51am
151 kansas  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:25:29am

re: #150 ciaospirit

Shug

Here's the link. Take a look. Think it's legit?

Pretty sure I saw that was a fake.

152 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:25:50am
153 Opinionated  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:25:54am

re: #135 Josephine

I believe Americans won't be bullied into voting for the wrong man just to prove they aren't racists.

I believe Americans know that giving a man the Presidency just because he is black won't do anything to "heal the nation's wounds": all it will do is create the post of affirmative-action-Commander-in-Chief.

I believe Americans who care the most about their country and their world will be informed about the real issues facing us and will vote accordingly.

I believe the number of white people who will vote against Obama because of his skin colour is small.

I believe the number of people of any skin colour who will vote against Obama because of his politics and associates is large.

I believe there will be a backlash: many people won't vote for Obama because they've been called ignorant, Bible-toting, gun-wielding bigots for having honest questions about the man's politics. How insulting is that?

I believe in America: the greatest country on earth. That means I believe in Americans.

Get out there and vote, Americans!

But will Americans out of some ill thought out sophomoric peeve decide that because the entire World economy is in temporary dire straights they should throw out those who support the system that has made America great and turn to the Socialist and appeasing systems that have decayed and weakened Europe?

154 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:25:59am

In re: my (perhaps) over-sensitivity to Palin comments

I received the November issue of "MORE" magazine yesterday. Cover was JANE FONDA (for God's sake), Sharon Stone, Tea Leoni. Last month it was Michelle Obamanator.

Inside, an unrelated political article "Sex, Lies and Trousergate" about public's expectations of political figures. Example: John Edwards, Bill Clinton, David Vitter, Larry Craig, et al.

Near the very end of the article, Section entitled "Of Moose and Men", the author Katha Pollitt brings up Sarah Palin! Why? She has nothing to do with "Sex, Lies and Trousergate"! But, in a negative manner the author drug Gov. Palin into the middle of it.

I immediately went on the website and criticized them loudly. Am calling Monday and cancelling my subscription!

155 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:25:59am

re: #133 Rage - Goddess,

μῆνιν, ἀείδε, θεά, Πηληιαδέ&o mega; Ἀχιλῆος ...

Like your nic!

156 yma o hyd  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:26:08am

I'm wondering if B0 has made comparable remarks about research fundings. I'd guess he has - but the chances of them being published on youtube are infinitesimal!
Thus its again Palin, whose every utterance is put under the microscope, with gasps of disbelief and heavy criticism by experts, while B0's teflon coat remains unscratched.

Lets also not forget that she is not addressing a conference of genetic scientists here, she is speaking to a crowd of Joe-the-plumbers, who want to know what happens to their hard-earned money, once the government has it in its claws.

157 rightymouse  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:26:31am

I'd rather vote for Palin than for anyone who thinks that fruit flies are probably more important than human beings.

158 jaunte  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:26:43am

re: #150 ciaospirit

The Post retracted that story:
[Link: www.nypost.com...]

159 Josephine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:27:12am

re: #106 Cast Iron Magnolia

Yes, I thought you had down-dinged in error, but your subsequent comments explained why you did it.

By the way, I'm not sure if I'm reading you correctly, but we are allowed to disagree with Charles.

Although I dislike baseless criticism of Sarah Palin, I do not consider her to be above criticism or disagreement.

160 Killer Tomato  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:27:29am

re: #145 newsjunkie_ky

And, if it comes through your car window, it isn't food.
My friend and I were talking about this yesterday. How groceries have become so high and realizing it is the KIND of groceries we buy as well. Pre-packaged food 'products'.
I'm going back to the old way.

I did that. No fast food, no processed food. Fresh produce grown in the U.S. - preferably locally. I have no land and can't grow my own but my sister had a good sized garden and we lived well off of that. Can't raise and slaughter my own chickens and no longer have easy ability to catch my own fish, but did the best I could in that department.
Lost 25 pounds.
:)

161 rightwinger3  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:27:42am

re: #141 musicman


Which is how you get poeple like these Harlem voters.

That's great. Unreal and funny too.

162 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:27:50am

re: #143 Dasher

That was weird where did my message go.

Did you down-ding Charles?

163 ciaospirit  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:28:05am

re: #151 kansas

Pretty sure I saw that was a fake.

Thanks. Never can be sure if email info is legit even if it's from someone you know (many times they don't check).

164 shanec99  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:28:10am

re: #58 FrogMarch

Obama: "I spent a lifetime fighting against Ronald Reagan's policies."


I hope he doesn't mean the ones that led to the eventual destruction of the Soviet Empire. But then again, he just may be honest for once.

165 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:28:18am

re: #134 jaunte

Some of the endorsements of Obama - like Powell - talk about teachable he is. Why do the Democrats assume their Presidential candidate is teachable but not our Vice-Presidential candidate? Drives me nuts.

167 rawmuse  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:28:40am

Good morning, Lizards! Hope to see some of you at Bobitu's Lizard meet up, today.
Later!

168 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:28:51am

re: #159 Josephine

Yes, I thought you had down-dinged in error, but your subsequent comments explained why you did it.

By the way, I'm not sure if I'm reading you correctly, but we are allowed to disagree with Charles.

Although I dislike baseless criticism of Sarah Palin, I do not consider her to be above criticism or disagreement.

Your dam right you can disagree with Charles, the banned list is full of them!
Credit for the above quote to Ed Norton.

169 Rage - Goddess,  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:29:00am

re: #155 arethusa

Thanks! Sadly, I only read in translation. Given the chance to do it over, maybe I'd have done Classics instead of science!

170 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:29:00am

Michelle Obama was not even staying at the Waldorf.

I don't believe how much of this disinformation is being pushed out there.

171 Colin Nelson  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:29:17am

Forget fruit flies please - this thread is on the Phillips article that hits top dead center.

Taken as a whole the positions/relationships/prospective policies (anti-military) and the overarching world view of Barry Hussein is exactly as Phillips reports: America is evil, America is wrong and I am going to change it with my plan called Hope.

America really is suffering from what began as a cute take on the dislike of Bush - BDS - but has now morphed into a serious and dangerous ignorance.

Just look at the answers from Biden to the interviewer in the link viewer. When asked what he meant by the statement that Americans might not like the responses from an Obama presidency to the expected international crisis "Test" he simply ignored the question and diverted the listener/viewers attention to the (incorrect) historical analysis that all new presidents are tested early.

BHO supporters will get exactly what they deserve.

172 kansas  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:29:17am

re: #159 Josephine

Yes, I thought you had down-dinged in error, but your subsequent comments explained why you did it.

By the way, I'm not sure if I'm reading you correctly, but we are allowed to disagree with Charles.

Although I dislike baseless criticism of Sarah Palin, I do not consider her to be above criticism or disagreement.

Just more of the same piling on, IMO.

173 Shug  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:29:18am

re: #150 ciaospirit

Shug

Here's the link. Take a look. Think it's legit?


I think it's a fake. But I will qualify my statement that Ihave no training in document ananalysis.

The receipt is too perfect. Usually mine are faded and there is a non-uniform quality to the ink.
Also a receipt is usually wrinkled somewhat. If somebody took that and scanned it, I would expect some wrinkles, or a mark where it was folded.
Dunno if that's her signature or not. Who signs their name in two places? I don't . I would have just signed it and printed my name if I thought I needed to

somebody needs to check the prices at the hotel and see if they really have a bottle of Bollinger for 44 dollars.
I would expect it to be more than that.

Just my thoughts.
Doesn't change the fact that I agree with everything the flyer says though!

174 realwest  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:29:35am

re: #162 Cast Iron Magnolia HEY - Charles does allow us to disagree with him - if you do it politely and don't violate the rules set forth above each comments section.

175 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:29:43am

Uh, your comments don't disappear because you disagree with me. They disappear because you mess up the HTML tags.

176 kynna  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:30:05am

re: #135 Josephine


I believe the number of white people who will vote against Obama because of his skin colour is small.

I believe the number of people of any skin colour who will vote against Obama because of his politics and associates is large.

I do think the 'Bradley Effect' will be biggest amongst voters 'of color'. The pressure on them to unconditionally support Obama is huge. I wouldn't give a straight answer to a pollster either.

177 jaunte  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:30:38am

re: #165 arethusa

Part of the overall slant pattern. Still I'd rather have the job of teaching science to someone who didn't know science, than economics to someone who was convinced they were here to bring economic 'change.'

178 shibumi  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:30:48am

re: #139 arethusa

My responses:
1. Are we in high school?
2. Are we that susceptible to bribery?
3. That's not even logical.
4. I've heard this one - the people of Alaska OWN their oil. Palin's checks are in effect giving the people profit from the resources they OWN. They are not taxing the rich to give to the poor.

Wow, you're good. I was only involved directly in questions two and three- and they came from a very loud, very large, very angry co-worker. As for the other questions, they came from individuals who both make well over $250,000. If I wasn't afraid of getting fired (management is also pro-Obama) I would have told both of them that I looked forward to the day that Obama redistributed the wealth and gave me their income.

179 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:31:02am

re: #159 Josephine

Although I dislike baseless criticism of Sarah Palin, I do not consider her to be above criticism or disagreement.

I have no intention of being such a blind partisan that I can't see when our own side is doing or saying the wrong things.

180 shanec99  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:31:09am

re: #170 Charles

Michelle Obama was not even staying at the Waldorf.

I don't believe how much of this disinformation is being pushed out there.

It is annoying when our side engages in this stupidity. Leave the lies to the Liberals.
Reagan never needed to lie and he changed the world and left the nation much more prosperous than it was when he came into office.

181 kansas  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:31:16am

re: #163 ciaospirit

Thanks. Never can be sure if email info is legit even if it's from someone you know (many times they don't check).

My brother in law, who hates Obama, sent me that to make me upset about her, then didn't read the actual article which debunked it. Anytime you see anything with a picture of a candidate that makes them look scary its probably crap. Both sides do that, and I mute the sound when that starts.

182 gawntrail  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:31:19am

re: #30 karmic_inquisitor

There is a higher correlation between the expansion of toddler television watching and incidents of autism than any other environmental factor. Yet I don't hear about it.

I teach Special Ed. And, I wouldn't doubt for a moment you are correct. Also seems to be a correlation between early TV watching and ADD/ADHD. Tons of stimulation absorbed through the eyes and ears and no outlet.

----------

And for the thread topic.........

Very sobering assessment of the big picture. McCain may not be Reagan, but he's light years closer than Barry.

M. Gipson

183 Josephine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:31:27am

re: #153 Opinionated

But will Americans out of some ill thought out sophomoric peeve decide that because the entire World economy is in temporary dire straights they should throw out those who support the system that has made America great and turn to the Socialist and appeasing systems that have decayed and weakened Europe?

Hmmm, not hard-working, tax-paying Americans, surely.

184 SurferDoc  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:31:49am

re: #176 kynna

I do think the 'Bradley Effect' will be biggest amongst voters 'of color'. The pressure on them to unconditionally support Obama is huge. I wouldn't give a straight answer to a pollster either.

I read that the effect will be greatest among older Democrats--who have learned to keep their mouths shut about some things but in the privacy of the voting booth won't pull for Obama.

185 Shug  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:32:25am

re: #179 Charles

I have no intention of being such a blind partisan that I can't see when our own side is doing or saying the wrong things.

Couldn't agree more.
Disagreeing with your own candidate and or party gives one credibility.

I have to say I see too much blind allegiance on both sides, but more on the democrat side.

186 rightymouse  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:32:32am
The rest of us can’t sleep at night.

I'm taking November 5 off as a vacation day. Am sleepless already and anticipate being up all night on November 4.

We MUST WIN FOLKS!

187 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:32:33am

re: #159 Josephine

Yes, I thought you had down-dinged in error, but your subsequent comments explained why you did it.

By the way, I'm not sure if I'm reading you correctly, but we are allowed to disagree with Charles.

Although I dislike baseless criticism of Sarah Palin, I do not consider her to be above criticism or disagreement.

Of course, I know that we can disagree with Charles, he's made that abundantly clear! (Unless we start spouting ignorant stuff, of course.)
And, I did it respectfully and cheerfully. I don't think Charles would develope a dislike for someone because they disagree with him.

As for Palin being above criticism - no, she's not. But, right now, there's been enough criticism from the other side!

188 alegrias  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:32:59am

Spain's America Hater is counting on Obama to Invite Him...SPain Has a Lot it Wants to Say to Big Bad Bush's Policies...It's time for WORLD Policies!

Spain's Obama, liberal Pres. Zapatero isn't invited to the Big Boys' Financial Summit on Nov. 15 (yet), nonetheless says come Nov. 15, Spain will be in Washington "making change" to world's financial situation, not just voting "present."

Remember during the Veep debate Joe Biden smarmily harped on John McCain's refusal to make nice with Chavez bud Zapatero; I'll bet anything Obama's folks have promised America-hating Zapatero a seat at the table.

Not unrelatedly, Zapatero's going to Cuba next year to make nice with Fidel Castro, and yesterday the EU forgave Cuba it's debts and promised their foreign minister Pedro Roque more money to deal with Bush-sent Katrina hurricanes.


[Link: www.larazon.es...]

(Today's [Link: www.larazon.es)...]

189 kansas  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:33:09am

Gonna go home now. Bye all.
Don't care what Sarah Palin knows about fruit flies, its more than Joe Biden. And if Michelle Obama had an expensive snack at a hotel, good. I hope she enjoyed, cause I would have joined her had she asked.

190 freeus  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:33:10am

At one time we all believed with all our hearts in Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny. As we grew up, (no offense to those not of this belief), we believed in God. Some of us have children, and we promoted the same childish beliefs that Santa would come along with Rudolph and deliver goodies for good little boys and girls. We took our children to Church and taught them about God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit. In these cases we have gone to great lengths, and been very active in promoting these ideas and beliefs. We have spent small fortunes on pictures with Santa, made Rudolph prints in the ground, and for my kids, (who were particularly bad one year), were out at midnight clipping branches and placed switches in their stockings! We have spent small fortunes on Sunday clothes and shoes, tithing, building funds, and missionary needs. Why oh why do we not invest the same energies in our nation?

We live in America every day and drive down her roads, and not very often do we stop to think of the roads in Russia or Bangladesh. We have elections, and I wonder if it was not for some reminding us of the purple fingers in Iraq; would we pause to think of those fingers? We have history books galore to remind us of nations utterly destroyed by socialism, and yet we have at least 45% of each state planning on casting their votes for Obama. Are they ignorant or just lazy these Obama voters? Do they hate America, or is it they do not KNOW and BELIEVE in her?

America is more than a country, 50 states, (not 57), and more than an idea. She is a living breathing entity that I believe goes largely ignored by far too many of us. As you cast your votes on November 4th please remember there are many a man and woman that not only believed in Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny and God. They believed in America with all they had, and they died for her in the jungles of Vietnam, the beaches of Normandy, Korea, Beirut, Oklahoma City, New York City, a field in PA, the Pentagon, and in the beginning all over America. Believe we will win with the same belief in whatever you cherish. Believe we will be champions for America and win on November 4th! BELIEVE!

191 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:33:56am

re: #178 shibumi

With dedicated Obama supporters I have learned it is best to just shut up and pretend to agree, without being vocal about it. They won't change their minds. Only with waverers from either side or undecided voters do I actually try to engage in a dialogue.

192 newsjunkie_ky  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:34:05am

re: #149 jcm

Been that way for a while, we've got food sensitivities and allergies around my house. To control what goes in, everything from scratch.

Here I go, Back when I was a kid, everything was from scratch, at least at my house. We ate tons and nobody was overweight. Well, we also played outside.
A friend is a literacy specialist with Head Start. One thing she has told me is that the reason there are so many kids with speech impediments today is the amount of TV they watch. According to my friend, you do not hear the last sound of words. Like instead of word, you hear wor. But we do not notice this because we learned to speak talking directly to someone and watched the way our mouths formed words. (seeing my 4 month old granddaughter doing this now). Kids that do not have enough face to face interaction do not learn to pronounce the ends of words. She also told me that about 90% of the kids that come to Head Start have no concept of sitting at at table and using eating utensils. The McDonald's generation.

193 shibumi  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:34:20am

re: #165 arethusa

Some of the endorsements of Obama - like Powell - talk about teachable he is. Why do the Democrats assume their Presidential candidate is teachable but not our Vice-Presidential candidate? Drives me nuts.

Oh, that one is easy. Because being a person of color trumps being a woman, or even being a gay. I've seen it in my workplace.

194 kynna  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:34:25am

re: #181 kansas

My brother in law, who hates Obama, sent me that to make me upset about her, then didn't read the actual article which debunked it. Anytime you see anything with a picture of a candidate that makes them look scary its probably crap. Both sides do that, and I mute the sound when that starts.

I keep telling my mom that. I tell her, 'if you read something that sounds crazy, learn more about it'. She still jumps at every one of those e-mails. There are so many fakes out there I just delete them without even looking at them anymore. I'm probably missing something true, but I figure I'll find out about it here or on instapundit.

195 ciaospirit  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:34:31am

re: #170 Charles

Michelle Obama was not even staying at the Waldorf.

I don't believe how much of this disinformation is being pushed out there.

Yep. I get a bit angry when someone I know sends this stuff before they check it out. I know the person who sent this and I have already sent an email to him asking if he checked it out (obviously didn't) and what was the source. I went to that PUMA website and didn't see anything about it there.

196 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:35:09am

re: #175 Charles

Uh, your comments don't disappear because you disagree with me. They disappear because you mess up the HTML tags.

Oh, pooh! Charles, I was starting a legend....you know, disagree with Charles and "Poof" your messages are writ in invisible type!

197 Josephine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:35:25am

re: #162 Cast Iron Magnolia

Did you down-ding Charles?

Without a sarc tag, I can't tell if you're joking.

198 Opinionated  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:35:40am

re: #183 Josephine

Hmmm, not hard-working, tax-paying Americans, surely.

If I were McCain my theme for the final week would be a simple question.

You're mad, you're upset, your portfolio is down, you may lose your job, you're frightened: America has suffered before. Do you believe in America or do you want to risk it all on false hope and mirage promises of Socialist change?

199 alegrias  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:35:58am

re: #148 Shug

Interesting that we are talking about drosophila melanogaster on a thread about Obama.

Most of his supporters have fly sized brains

* * *
NOT TRUE. Many supposed "intelligentsia" are taught what Obama preaches. So our Harvard Trained lawyers are signing up to do "Election Protection" for Obama, so their will will be done.

Let's not misunderestimate anyone--these folks are intelligent and run our media and our government agencies, colleges & think tanks.

200 shibumi  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:37:03am

re: #191 arethusa

With dedicated Obama supporters I have learned it is best to just shut up and pretend to agree, without being vocal about it. They won't change their minds. Only with waverers from either side or undecided voters do I actually try to engage in a dialogue.

You are 100% correct.

I actually think I converted a Hillary supported though!

201 newsjunkie_ky  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:37:06am

re: #160 Killer Tomato

I did that. No fast food, no processed food. Fresh produce grown in the U.S. - preferably locally. I have no land and can't grow my own but my sister had a good sized garden and we lived well off of that. Can't raise and slaughter my own chickens and no longer have easy ability to catch my own fish, but did the best I could in that department.
Lost 25 pounds.
:)

Good for you, you've inspired me.
In the last 4 weeks I've eaten more junk than I want to even think about. Been in a major depression. I'm breaking that cycle NOW. The junk just adds to the depression which then makes me want more junk (chocolate).

202 Sharmuta  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:37:18am

re: #187 Cast Iron Magnolia

As for Palin being above criticism - no, she's not. But, right now, there's been enough criticism from the other side!

That's no reason to withhold legitimate criticism- especially on an issue that involves research that helps children Sarah is now championing.

203 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:37:21am

re: #179 Charles

re: #185 Shug

Couldn't agree more.
Disagreeing with your own candidate and or party gives one credibility.

I have to say I see too much blind allegiance on both sides, but more on the democrat side.

Thats why i'm amazed at the 'conservatives" that say they are sitting this one out, because McCain doesn't agree with them on 100% of the issues
My response, ,,, "So you're willing to have someone in office that you are 100% diametrically opposed to instead of someone you disagree with, what, 20%,,, 30% ?!?!?!?"

204 Josephine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:37:32am

re: #168 Nevergiveup

Your dam right you can disagree with Charles, the banned list is full of them!
Credit for the above quote to Ed Norton.

Huh?

205 Colonel Panik  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:37:58am

re: #122 shibumi

I work in frothing, raving, moonbat central. Yesterday I was cornered and basically told that anyone who doesn't vote for The One is an idiot.

Why, you might ask?
1. He is the most popular man in the WORLD
2. He is giving us all MONEY
3. If our enemies like him, they will no longer be our enemies.
4. BHO is not a socialist, in fact, Palin is the socialist because residents in Alaska already get checks from the government

BTW, statements two and three were said by a NRA member.

You need to refer that NRA member to www.gunbanobama.com

206 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:38:02am

re: #196 Cast Iron Magnolia

Oh, pooh! Charles, I was starting a legend....you know, disagree with Charles and "Poof" your messages are writ in invisible type!

If you've learned anything from this election, CIM, it should be that you can start a legend about anyone - like the mayor of Wasilla banning books - and no matter how often it gets rebutted by the facts, it lives on.

207 Sharmuta  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:38:05am

re: #195 ciaospirit

I know Hillbuzz had it briefly, then yanked it.

208 Josephine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:38:40am

re: #172 kansas

Just more of the same piling on, IMO.

Who is piling on and how?

209 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:38:42am

re: #197 Josephine

Without a sarc tag, I can't tell if you're joking.

/////////////////

210 Shug  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:39:29am

re: #199 alegrias

* * *
NOT TRUE. Many supposed "intelligentsia" are taught what Obama preaches. So our Harvard Trained lawyers are signing up to do "Election Protection" for Obama, so their will will be done.

Let's not misunderestimate anyone--these folks are intelligent and run our media and our government agencies, colleges & think tanks.


A fruit fly has the complex brain power to avoid my flying fist. A fruit fly can navigate and flap his wings hundreds of times a second.


I don't misunderestimate the fly I am trying to swat.
But he still gets splattered. Make no mistake about that

211 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:40:45am

re: #200 shibumi

You are 100% correct.

I actually think I converted a Hillary supported though!

Great! Actually, my mom just told me her best friend - for whom she named me - is a PUMA who just early-voted for McCain. I'm very proud.

212 legalpad  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:40:52am

re: #93 musicman

And let's not even go near the coffee issue!

Thou shalt not speak against coffee -

213 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:41:07am

re: #209 Cast Iron Magnolia

/////////////////

Did you just sarc tag a sarc tag?/

214 Josephine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:41:07am

re: #176 kynna

I do think the 'Bradley Effect' will be biggest amongst voters 'of color'. The pressure on them to unconditionally support Obama is huge. I wouldn't give a straight answer to a pollster either.

Good point.

Someone recently told me that I shouldn't have told campaigners that I wasn't voting for their candidate because then, if elected, that candidate wouldn't help me out if I ever needed his/her assistance for anything. (I'm in Canada.) Sad to say, this type of thing does go on here.

215 Rancher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:41:18am

They tell us exactly what we are in for.

After the November election, Democrats will push for a second economic stimulus package that includes money for the states' stalled infrastructure projects, along with help paying for healthcare expenses, food stamps and extended unemployment benefits, U.S. Rep. Barney Frank said Thursday.

In a meeting with the editorial board of The Standard-Times, Rep. Frank, D-Mass., also called for a 25 percent cut in military spending, saying the Pentagon has to start choosing from its many weapons programs, and that upper-income taxpayers are going to see an increase in what they are asked to pay.

The military cuts also mean getting out of Iraq sooner, he said.


I pray for the Iraqi Kurds. Should we pull out early and cut funding the region will go the way of Southeast Asia after Nam.

"The people of Iraq want us out, and we want to stay over their objection," he said. "It's extraordinary."


Isn't it only Sadr's thugs that want us out?

216 alegrias  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:41:28am

re: #186 rightymouse

I'm taking November 5 off as a vacation day. Am sleepless already and anticipate being up all night on November 4.

We MUST WIN FOLKS!

* * *
Liberal black lawyers I know who are managing partners & lawschool classmates of Fannie Mae's crooked CEO Franklin Raines will take company time to assist Obama before & on election day as part of their "Election Protection" racket.

217 Racer X  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:41:43am

I understand the need for some people to make note of Sarah Pailin's, and John McCain's, deficiencies. Fair and balanced. I get that.

But do us all a favor - save that for after the election. Unless you are REALLY trying to get people to consider not voting for McCain.

Because those on the left do not even consider acknowledging Obama's deficiencies. They want him elected at all costs and have openly admitted they are willing to lie, cheat and steal to get it done.

The stakes are high.

218 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:42:17am

re: #204 Josephine

Huh?

In a episode of the Honeymooners, Ralph kramden forgot to sign his IRS form and he thinks he is going to be audited. Ed Norton tells him not to worry alot of people get letters from the IRS, The jail is full of them!

219 shanec99  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:42:48am

re: #186 rightymouse

I'm taking November 5 off as a vacation day. Am sleepless already and anticipate being up all night on November 4.

We MUST WIN FOLKS!


I am preparing for the worst (the calamity of an Obama administration), I expect that they will attempt to undermine the Constitution by introducing foreign social policies. I plan to fight them with my voice, my pen and by supporting legislators who will stand against them and their efforts to change our nation into a weak apologetic shadow of the Shining City on the Hill that President Reagan talked about so eloquently.

220 shibumi  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:43:00am

re: #205 Colonel Panik

You need to refer that NRA member to www.gunbanobama.com

It's already been done. Doesn't matter. He wants Obama money.

And an aside- the "discussion" diverted into what has Bush ever done that's good- I mentioned no terror attacks, the response was (get ready for this) 'they haven't even tried.' I mentioned several terror plots, and that was immediately discounted and then morphed into 'nothing was as good as when Clinton was President.'

Short story? I am an idiot for engaging this particular co-worker.

221 jwpaine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:43:09am

Don't think anybody else has mentioned this:

BAM STAFFERS PULL THEIR BOGUS OHIO BALLOTS.

222 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:43:22am

re: #213 arethusa

Did you just sarc tag a sarc tag?/

I don't know....LOL

I was trying for emphasis. I didn't realize my humor was so bad, until others began questioning whether I was serious when I said my message had come up blank after I down-dinged Charles.

223 JSK1121  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:43:38am

re: #203 sattv4u2

re: #185 Shug

Thats why i'm amazed at the 'conservatives" that say they are sitting this one out, because McCain doesn't agree with them on 100% of the issues
My response, ,,, "So you're willing to have someone in office that you are 100% diametrically opposed to instead of someone you disagree with, what, 20%,,, 30% ?!?!?!?"

I don't agree with McCain on probably 25% of issues, most notably the pro-choice/life debate. But here's the thing, I know he's not going to overturn Roe V. Wade, no one EVER would, and I disagree even more with Obama's extremely lax and reprehensible views on almost encouraging abortions.

I know McCain will defend America and our allies, most importantly Israel, as long as there's a breath in his body. Obama will sell all of us out in the interests of 'reconciliation' and 'addressing grievances' with our enemies.

Even Joe Biden knows our enemies will test Obama's weakness in the first 6 months. Can we really afford that right now, what with our current economic dire straits? Best case is that the international incident occurs outside the homeland or Israel, but what if it doesn't? Another 9-11, a massive attack on Israel from Iran, Syria, Hamas and Hezbollah? There's no way we can afford something like that with a pansy commander in chief that is not guaranteed to respond in the correct manner.

No, no, I disagree with McCain on certain issues, but when it comes to the safety and security of us and our allies, the choice is a no-brainer.

224 FrogMarch  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:43:45am

WuzzaDem is back up and running.

225 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:44:56am

re: #217 Racer X

Are you suggesting relevant information about the candidates should be hidden if it doesn't advance the Republican agenda?

226 lawhawk  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:45:03am

re: #215 Rancher

The Democrats aren't hiding their contempt for our current political and economic system and our national security and foreign policy positions. They want wholesale changes, and this is not merely some minor small portion of the party's presence in Congress. It's a significant portion of the party, and should the Democrats win, they will get a chance to push that agenda, much to the detriment of the nation.

227 shibumi  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:45:07am

re: #212 legalpad

Thou shalt not speak against coffee -

I heard a story the other day that three cups of coffee a day can reduce a women's breast size.

228 irongrampa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:45:15am

re: #217 Racer X

Freakin' BINGO.

229 Meremortal  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:45:34am

re: #217 Racer X

I wouldn't worry about it, RacerX. Anyone who is undecided at this point will not be choosing sides over fruit flies. They will be looking at the big issues, like hair styles and stuff.

230 rightymouse  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:45:37am

re: #216 alegrias

* * *
Liberal black lawyers I know who are managing partners & lawschool classmates of Fannie Mae's crooked CEO Franklin Raines will take company time to assist Obama before & on election day as part of their "Election Protection" racket.

Really? Is that legal?

231 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:45:46am

A New (Fighter) Jet for Google’s Founders?

[Link: bits.blogs.nytimes.com...]

Another liberal going green?

232 newsjunkie_ky  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:45:57am

re: #211 arethusa

Great! Actually, my mom just told me her best friend - for whom she named me - is a PUMA who just early-voted for McCain. I'm very proud.


I know about 5 PUMAs. First time they will ever vote Republican. They didn't even vote for Reagan.

233 alegrias  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:46:36am

re: #225 Killgore Trout

Are you suggesting relevant information about the candidates should be hidden if it doesn't advance the Republican agenda?

* * *
IS there any relevant "negative" information about McCain/Palin that hasn't already been vetted & regurgitated 300% times more often than anything about Obama/Biden?

234 realwest  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:46:37am

re: #171 Colin Nelson
"BHO supporters will get exactly what they deserve."
Indeed, but if Obama should win POTUS, so will the rest of us who DON'T get what we deserve.
It's awfully hard to try to reach voters in the first place, which is why I've always opposed the stupid birth certificate story, the story about what WAB did or didn't order for lunch wherever the hell she stayed (iirc, HER salary is over $325,000 a year alone) and the like.
McCain and we who support him have to try to stay on message: the economy is much more the fault of the Dems and the CRA (which created the stupid Sub-Prime mortgage MARKET in the first place); that by letting the Bush Tax Cuts lapse, then indeed Americans with income above $45,000 WILL be paying higher taxes (even if Obama doesn't accomplish this from a "new tax hike" POV) and raising taxes in a down economy is STUPID. Moreover, folks will lose their jobs under Obama's STATED tax plan - there are thousands of small businesses that make over $250,000 who will lay off some employee's.
And in World Affairs, we've let the Dems promote the lie that we went into Iraq "unilaterally" because of that "cowboy" Bush, when the reality is that Bush had a congressional vote and UN approval to enforce UN Sanctions. And as I said in #33 above "what the hell will ALL the nations of the world (except possibly China and Russia) do when they realize that there is NO US military to aid them in a crisis? No US ability to help alleviate human suffering from Tsunami's and the like?
And NO US MARKET TO PURCHASE THE GOODS THEY MAKE? "
We have to hammer away at the fact that Obama has tried to BUY this election by reneging on a written promise to accept Public Funding, by taking probably fraudulent credit card donations and by enabling ACORN to fraudulently register non-voters.
We have to STAY ON MESSAGE and stop tying Ayers and Obama together and all of the rest of the issues that bother those of us out here and on other blogs, because, like it or not, the American Voters don't seem to care about those issues as passionately as we do.

235 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:46:37am

re: #229 Meremortal

I wouldn't worry about it, RacerX. Anyone who is undecided at this point will not be choosing sides over fruit flies. They will be looking at the big issues, like hair styles and stuff.

LOL. One up-ding for you!

236 Josephine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:46:39am

re: #218 Nevergiveup

In a episode of the Honeymooners, Ralph kramden forgot to sign his IRS form and he thinks he is going to be audited. Ed Norton tells him not to worry alot of people get letters from the IRS, The jail is full of them!

Oh, thanks. ; )

I didn't know if you were quoting The Honeymooners or The Fight Club.

237 Meremortal  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:47:08am

re: #227 shibumi

I heard a story the other day that three cups of coffee a day can reduce a women's breast size.

That does it. I'm for banning coffee...for women.

238 lawhawk  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:47:14am

re: #224 FrogMarch

The Colin Powell bit from the future is great.

239 pat  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:47:29am

re: #192 newsjunkie_ky

Here I go, Back when I was a kid, everything was from scratch, at least at my house. We ate tons and nobody was overweight. Well, we also played outside.
A friend is a literacy specialist with Head Start. One thing she has told me is that the reason there are so many kids with speech impediments today is the amount of TV they watch. According to my friend, you do not hear the last sound of words. Like instead of word, you hear wor. But we do not notice this because we learned to speak talking directly to someone and watched the way our mouths formed words. (seeing my 4 month old granddaughter doing this now). Kids that do not have enough face to face interaction do not learn to pronounce the ends of words. She also told me that about 90% of the kids that come to Head Start have no concept of sitting at at table and using eating utensils. The McDonald's generation.

But that only partially explains Barney Frank

240 razorbacker  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:47:32am

re: #227 shibumi

I heard a story the other day that three cups of coffee a day can reduce a women's breast size.

How long do you have to soak them?

241 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:47:50am

re: #227 shibumi

I heard a story the other day that three cups of coffee a day can reduce a women's breast size.

On days off, I stand outside of Starbucks and tell well endowed ladies " Sorry ,, they're closed"

242 rightymouse  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:48:11am

re: #221 jwpaine

Don't think anybody else has mentioned this:

BAM STAFFERS PULL THEIR BOGUS OHIO BALLOTS.


Good! Ohio is in deep doo-doo right now as it is with voter registration fraud let alone actual voting.

243 FrogMarch  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:48:30am

re: #231 Nevergiveup

A New (Fighter) Jet for Google’s Founders?

[Link: bits.blogs.nytimes.com...]

Another liberal going green?

ok - that creeps me out. Rich powerful left-wingers with capitalist military machinery.

244 jwpaine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:48:35am

re: #13 karmic_inquisitor

BTW - I already voted absentee in California. Straight Republican ballot and "no" to every bond initiative. First time I have done that. I see it as an act of defiance and negation. I hope others have joined me.

Did the same here in Colorado. Two days ago.

245 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:48:39am

re: #233 alegrias

I hadn't hear the fruit fly thing before. She came out in favor of constitutional bans on gay marriage and abortions recently. That was new.

246 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:49:00am

re: #241 sattv4u2

On days off, I stand outside of Starbucks and tell well endowed ladies " Sorry ,, they're closed"

And those with less G-D given assets? What do you tell them?

247 godfrey  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:49:03am

re: #159 Josephine

Although I dislike baseless criticism of Sarah Palin, I do not consider her to be above criticism or disagreement.

I agree. She strikes me as the type who will look at evidence fairly and make a good call. Imagine the sheer volume of issues she's being briefed on these days. She'll be fine.

She'll be a whole lot better than Biden once she gets hooked into bigger sources of information than her campaign staff.

248 irongrampa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:49:14am

Point to ponder, re early voters--Democrats seem to have the numerical edge here. The only question I have is, are they all voting Obama?

249 shanec99  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:49:20am

re: #237 Meremortal

That does it. I'm for banning coffee...for women.

Ever seen the bags from code pink? Yes I agree, ban coffee for liberal women who bare their saggy bags in public.

250 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:49:30am

re: #246 Nevergiveup

And those with less G-D given assets? What do you tell them?

I'm buying

251 Meremortal  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:49:46am

re: #235 Cast Iron Magnolia

LOL. One up-ding for you!


Thank yew, thank yew, I'll be here all week.

252 legalpad  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:49:47am

re: #227 shibumi

I heard a story the other day that three cups of coffee a day can reduce a women's breast size.

By a strange coincidence, none of the women I know drink much coffee.
Coffee, does however- seriously - dramatically cut the incidence of liver cancer. Lot's of good anti-oxidants in the coffee bean.

253 FrogMarch  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:49:50am

re: #238 lawhawk

The Colin Powell bit from the future is great.

Yes! I read that the other day. I like wuzzadem's perspective.

254 Racer X  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:50:27am

re: #225 Killgore Trout

Are you suggesting relevant information about the candidates should be hidden if it doesn't advance the Republican agenda?

I'm saying keep the focus on that lying asshole who intends to convert America into a Communist country. Discussing an off-hand comment about fruit flies, or dodging a loaded question on one freaking abortion clinic bomber is counter-productive. Put things in perspective.

Unless you're secretly in love with The One™.

255 rightymouse  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:50:48am

re: #219 shanec99

I am preparing for the worst (the calamity of an Obama administration), I expect that they will attempt to undermine the Constitution by introducing foreign social policies. I plan to fight them with my voice, my pen and by supporting legislators who will stand against them and their efforts to change our nation into a weak apologetic shadow of the Shining City on the Hill that President Reagan talked about so eloquently.

Look forward to your freedom to use your voice and pen to be severely curtailed if not eliminated under an Obama administration.

256 eclectic infidel  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:50:52am

I feel the same way about the McCain/Palin ticket. Not so much about McCain though, as he's just another member of the boys club. My concern is with Palin, should something happen to befall McCain, health-wise. I've watched the interviews, read numerous articles and even if she's what Bush should have been but isn't (self-made, staunchly opinionated despite how loony she sounds, etc.), it's as if the GOP has settled for mediocrity with its support for Sarah Palin. I view her as the new and improved Dan Quayle for the upcoming election and to be honest, I'm rather stunned at how some rather intelligent and astute lizards hold her so high. President Bush was a poor choice for president but this new GOP ticket sinks to a new low. Yet there's part of me that cringes to think that Obama wants to build a larger bureaucracy and sap more of our hard-earned $ out of us. Just wanted to share, FWIW.

257 razorbacker  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:51:06am

re: #247 godfrey


She'll be a whole lot better than Biden once she gets hooked into bigger sources of information than her campaign staff.

I nominate that sentence for the definition of 'damning with faint praise'.

258 yma o hyd  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:51:30am

re: #237 Meremortal

That does it. I'm for banning coffee...for women.

Gah.
Don't be so credulous - I'm the living proof that three cups of coffee a day do not reduce a woman's breast size!

259 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:51:54am

re: #248 irongrampa

Point to ponder, re early voters--Democrats seem to have the numerical edge here. The only question I have is, are they all voting Obama?



Gallup says early voters about evenly split.

If you watch the networks, though, Obama already has a huge lead./

260 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:52:05am

re: #258 yma o hyd

Gah.
Don't be so credulous - I'm the living proof that three cups of coffee a day do not reduce a woman's breast size!

Proof. I want proof!

261 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:52:11am

re: #231 Nevergiveup

A New (Fighter) Jet for Google’s Founders?

[Link: bits.blogs.nytimes.com...]

Another liberal going green?

My dream is have enough money to buy me one of theses....

262 Meremortal  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:52:30am

re: #258 yma o hyd

Gah.
Don't be so credulous - I'm the living proof that three cups of coffee a day do not reduce a woman's breast size!

OK, photos pleeze. Purely in the interest of science, of course.

263 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:52:33am

re: #259 arethusa


Gallup says early voters about evenly split.

If you watch the networks, though, Obama already has a huge lead./

That's just so much bullshit, there is no way they can know that!

264 godfrey  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:52:44am

re: #257 razorbacker

Politicians are there to be pushed around by us. I would rather work with McCain and Palin than Obama and Biden. To say the least.

265 JSK1121  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:52:48am

re: #259 arethusa


Gallup says early voters about evenly split.

If you watch the networks, though, Obama already has a huge lead./

Isn't that good news?

I seem to remember hearing somewhere that Kerry had like 2/3 of the early voters last time.

266 FrogMarch  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:53:01am

re: #229 Meremortal

I wouldn't worry about it, RacerX. Anyone who is undecided at this point will not be choosing sides over fruit flies. They will be looking at the big issues, like hair styles and stuff.

Yes - and how much money the candidates are spending on make-up. The girl is the worst offender.
Joe Biden says we “We kicked Hezbollah out of Lebanon.” - but how orange was his face at the time?

267 Cast Iron Magnolia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:53:06am

re: #261 jcm

WOW! Can I go up with you?

268 insane_kufr  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:53:09am

God I know what Melanie means, I kept waking up last night and I swear I heard a faint rumbling in the distance, something low and steady, obama, obama, obama, obama, obama....like the beat of drums signaling the destruction of our Nation.
I swear to God I don't understand why one Jew would vote for this clown.
He will throw Israel under the bus so fast it'll make your yarmulke spin!

269 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:53:20am

re: #263 Nevergiveup

That's just so much bullshit, there is no way they can know that!

I know...they're trying to demoralize us.

270 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:53:33am

re: #258 yma o hyd

Gah.
Don't be so credulous - I'm the living proof that three cups of coffee a day do not reduce a woman's breast size!

Not knowing for sure of your gender, that tells me you eithre HAVE or ARE a big boob!

/duckin

271 Meremortal  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:53:39am

Charles, how about a poll on how many here have already voted?

272 godfrey  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:53:45am

One Party Rule.

No thanks.

273 Josephine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:53:53am

It's been at least two hours since I submitted a comment to the Toronto Star for their article about white racists not voting for Obama. Many other comments have been approved by the moderator but mine has not.

I wonder if that's because I mentioned some real reasons why people won't vote for Obama? Sheesh, I didn't even mention Israel.

274 JSK1121  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:53:55am

re: #271 Meremortal

Charles, how about a poll on how many here have already voted?

I haven't, that's one!

275 a marine mom  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:53:57am

I thank G-D that our forefathers had the insight to institutionalize the Electoral College. McCain/Palin would not have a snowball's chance in you-know-where of winning this election without it.

276 shanec99  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:53:59am

re: #255 rightymouse

Look forward to your freedom to use your voice and pen to be severely curtailed if not eliminated under an Obama administration.

277 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:54:12am

re: #268 insane_kufr

God I know what Melanie means, I kept waking up last night and I swear I heard a faint rumbling in the distance, something low and steady, obama, obama, obama, obama, obama....like the beat of drums signaling the destruction of our Nation.
I swear to God I don't understand why one Jew would vote for this clown.
He will throw Israel under the bus so fast it'll make your yarmulke spin!

hate to break the news to ya, but alot of Jews couldn't find Israel on a map even with Obama's help?

278 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:54:14am

re: #274 JSK1121

I haven't, that's one!

two

279 el matamoros  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:54:31am

Look, I know people don't want to hear this but there is an old saying "Sometimes in order to take one step forward you first must take one step backwards."

The thing is Bushs invasion of Iraq (like it or not) has basically "Spent" all the political capital that the US gained from 9-11. Now, BDS is a rampant disease. Troofers are everywhere. And no one thinks that Radical Islam is a threat anymore. They think its about "root causes", I.E. Israel and the US.
At this point one can only throw up ones hands and say "Go ahead, keep it up, see what happens."
IOW- from this point on it going to have to get worse before it gets better. WEre gonna need more insanity in Pakistan, more "Cartoon riots", More "youth riots", more etc. etc. etc. Its the only way that the "Mainstream" can realise the truth again. Of course there are some who are beyond redemption but they are either Muslims or Radical Leftists. No, it is the Middle that must be reached again.

280 arethusa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:54:46am

re: #270 sattv4u2

Not knowing for sure of your gender, that tells me you eithre HAVE or ARE a big boob!

/duckin

Um, is this actually the long-promised/-threatened boob thread? I thought it was all talk!

281 vxbush  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:55:09am

re: #261 jcm

My dream is have enough money to buy me one of theses....

Best last line in that article:

No attacks on Microsoft are planned at this time.

282 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:55:21am

re: #192 newsjunkie_ky

Here I go, Back when I was a kid, everything was from scratch, at least at my house. We ate tons and nobody was overweight. Well, we also played outside.
A friend is a literacy specialist with Head Start. One thing she has told me is that the reason there are so many kids with speech impediments today is the amount of TV they watch. According to my friend, you do not hear the last sound of words. Like instead of word, you hear wor. But we do not notice this because we learned to speak talking directly to someone and watched the way our mouths formed words. (seeing my 4 month old granddaughter doing this now). Kids that do not have enough face to face interaction do not learn to pronounce the ends of words. She also told me that about 90% of the kids that come to Head Start have no concept of sitting at at table and using eating utensils. The McDonald's generation.

My college physics prof thinks that the lack of play, interaction with the world and seeing how things work contributes to the difficulty many kids have in science. Throwing a ball, climbing, building tinkertoys and lego builds in intuitive sense of how things work. When they get to physics they lack that intuitive feel for the world to help them understand the equations.

283 Glackinspeil  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:55:38am

Vote now:
PBS Poll
Is Palin Qualified?

284 yma o hyd  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:55:45am

re: #260 Nevergiveup

Proof. I want proof!

Sorry - I don't have a webcam ...

:-)))

285 Meremortal  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:56:20am

re: #274 JSK1121

I haven't, that's one!

I have, so you are cancelled out!

Rats, duty calls. Company coming, and I have carpet stain removal duty. Later, lizards and lizzies. Easy on the coffee, lizzies, better safe than sorry.

286 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:56:26am

re: #283 Glackinspeil

Vote now:
PBS Poll
Is Palin Qualified?

Were is the: Is Obama qualified poll?

287 irongrampa  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:56:42am

re: #259 arethusa

Don't watch the networks, I prefer my information to be reasonably correct.

288 Nevergiveup  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:57:00am

re: #284 yma o hyd

Sorry - I don't have a webcam ...

:-)))

That's ok I'm blind, I was thinking about....
/

289 yma o hyd  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:57:01am

re: #262 Meremortal

OK, photos pleeze. Purely in the interest of science, of course.

What - don't you take the word of a fellow Lizard?

:-)))

290 Pullus Iulius  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:57:17am

It is like some horribly dream, where we're going over a cliff and can't stop. But remember: the reason they're called dreams is because they aren't real. Wake up.

291 ciaospirit  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:57:28am

re: #207 Sharmuta

I know Hillbuzz had it briefly, then yanked it.

I should have posed the is it legit question in my first comment (even if the info came from someone I knew) until I got lizard feedback. The part that was true is that MO did make the pie comments (linked in previous thread).

292 jcm  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:57:34am

re: #267 Cast Iron Magnolia

WOW! Can I go up with you?

If I every get there? Sure thing!

293 taxfreekiller[deleted]  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:57:44am
294 rightymouse  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:57:46am

re: #286 Nevergiveup

Were is the: Is Obama qualified poll?

Silly wabbit. We're only concerned whether Palin is qualified to be VP.

/

295 Meremortal  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:58:09am

re: #289 yma o hyd

What - don't you take the word of a fellow Lizard?

:-)))

Perhaps you just haven't noticed yet...that's it I'm outta here...

296 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:58:10am

re: #202 Sharmuta

That's no reason to withhold legitimate criticism- especially on an issue that involves research that helps children Sarah is now championing.

Again the problem is not the research but the method of getting the funding. Earmarks are not vetted. I don't care what it is for, it should not be done that way. Also private companies can also fund there own research.

297 Colin Nelson  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:58:29am

#234 RW
re: #171 Colin Nelson
"BHO supporters will get exactly what they deserve."

You are right - those of us who do not support him will suffer as well. Guess that is one of the tougher parts of Democracy to deal with.

Agree with all of your following points and that McCain needs to keep hammering away. Do I think the points will get traction just days before the vote? No.

To overcome eight years of the most illogical inane downright stupid criticism of Bush by the MSM with facts and truthful information is an impossible job - a bridge too far.

However, like Reagan, I too believe in the ultimate common sense of the voter inside the sanctity of the voting booth.

There, nothing is impossible.

298 yma o hyd  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:58:33am

re: #270 sattv4u2

Not knowing for sure of your gender, that tells me you eithre HAVE or ARE a big boob!

/duckin

Count yourself lucky that I have no intention of infringing on Mandy's whack-prerogative!

:-)))

299 pat  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:58:42am

Exit polls show landslide for Kerry. the humiliation when he lost in 2000 was blamed on Bush illegalities of an unexplained nature and AP screwing up the polling. But the explanation never fully publicized showed something else. AP purposely skewed the poll Democrat to push the story by positioning the pollsters in districts that would favor the Democrats . Likely for voter suppression. Expect the same.

300 lawhawk  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:59:04am

re: #256 eclectic infidel

The problem is that you're not reflecting the alternatives. Kerry was an abject disaster as an alternative in 2004. You could make an argument in 2000 that Gore was the better candidate, and if you felt that way in 2000, you could have chosen to vote against Bush in 2004. Now, your choices couldn't be more starkly clear.

McCain/Palin.
v
Obama/Biden.

Obama is the most inexperienced nominee in perhaps the last 100 years, if not more. No foreign policy experience, poor judgment, poor character, and his vision for the American polity is socialism v. Take 401(k).

There's absolutely no reason to vote for Obama on the substantive issues of the day. If you're worried about Palin's experience or lack thereof, how can you possibly vote for Obama, who's the head of the ticket. He's the one who will be tested from day one and whose own running mate has repeatedly called out his inexperience and that our nation's enemies will test his mettle.

301 lawhawk  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:59:29am

re: #299 pat

Kerry ran in 2004. Not 2000.

302 newsjunkie_ky  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 9:59:39am

re: #282 jcm

My college physics prof thinks that the lack of play, interaction with the world and seeing how things work contributes to the difficulty many kids have in science. Throwing a ball, climbing, building tinkertoys and lego builds in intuitive sense of how things work. When they get to physics they lack that intuitive feel for the world to help them understand the equations.


I totally agree. And now, almost all the toys for kids are not interactive but visual stimulants. They all seem to require batteries.
I've found this 'Back to Basics' toy cataloger and like it a lot. I look for the old toys.

303 rightymouse  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:00:49am

re: #258 yma o hyd

Gah.
Don't be so credulous - I'm the living proof that three cups of coffee a day do not reduce a woman's breast size!


Am right there with ya!

304 Josephine  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:00:55am

re: #256 eclectic infidel

Yet there's part of me that cringes to think that Obama wants to build a larger bureaucracy and sap more of our hard-earned $ out of us.

Only part of you?

Use that part to vote for McCain and then use the other part to move to Canada. Higher taxes, no real property rights, socialist agendas in education beginning at the elementary level, the religion of multiculti, waiting 6-12 months to see a medical specialist and the criminalization of non-P.C. speech. For added effect, work for the government.

Then move back to the States in four years and vote Republican with all of your parts.

305 SurferDoc  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:01:35am

re: #293 taxfreekiller

At this moment, consider that you are in the "peoples woods",
they do not want you and your re-con team in the "peoples woods",
it being they are cooking crystal meth to feed your family back in
the U.S.A. . Any one on the team who is not 100% focused on avoiding
an ambush and the teams destruction just could be the one who is
thinking of a card game back at the "enlisted club" and a cold one,
or some other bull shit, just as the eyes wander, the trip wire, jingles.

One thing, one thing only , the mission, get McCain/Palin elected.

It is not a normal mission.

Upding. Complete the mission. Nothing else matters right now.

306 pat  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:02:03am

re: #301 lawhawk

right. I meant 2004. But I didn't say it. It seems so long ago.

307 FrogMarch  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:02:07am

re: #296 Dasher

Again the problem is not the research but the method of getting the funding. Earmarks are not vetted. I don't care what it is for, it should not be done that way. Also private companies can also fund there own research.

Why not have tax breaks and other incentives to promote the research we need in this nation to stay on top of R & D and medical innovation. Government intervention usually ends up screwing it up with unintended consequences.

308 spidly  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:02:21am

gather weapons and ammo.

309 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:02:52am

re: #308 spidly

gather weapons and ammo.

and non coffee drinking women!

310 Pullus Iulius  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:04:09am

re: #308 spidly

gather weapons and ammo.

Always good advice.

311 ciaospirit  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:04:22am

re: #242 rightymouse

Good! Ohio is in deep doo-doo right now as it is with voter registration fraud let alone actual voting.

They should have been charged. They got off because they "tossed out" their ballots. No, it wasn't their decision. The Election Board tossed them. Charge them so others will think twice before committing fraud.

On Thursday, O'Brien cut a deal with 13 out-of-staters, including four from New York, who tossed out their already-cast ballots and admitted they didn't meet residency requirements.

312 musicman  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:04:45am

re: #221 jwpaine

Don't think anybody else has mentioned this:

BAM STAFFERS PULL THEIR BOGUS OHIO BALLOTS.



*SCREAM*

313 gman  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:07:21am

re: #60 Sharmuta

I agree, but I think if she was made aware, she probably wouldn't have said that.

Notice how she also says American tax dollars are going to "Paris, France."
but that gets little play even though it's completely relevant.

just another reason not to...
buy into the carefully constructed MSM meme of using a 500x magnification setting for McCain/Palin and a 0x magnification setting for Obama/Biden

314 Dr. Shalit  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:07:21am

re: #107 Charles

Fruit fly research and autism: Specific Brain Protein Required For Nerve Cell Connections To Form And Function.

Charles -

Just a thought here, with a little historic perspective. Prior to 2001 the US Government appropriated $0 for EMBRYONIC Stem Cell Research. The Clinton Administration, with good political reasons, kicked that "can" down the road.
What GWB did was to OPEN Federal Research Funding on already existing lines of cells - not what the research community wanted - and an "improvement" nonetheless - for which he is "blamed," no Good Deed going unpunished. Non-Federal funding was NOT BANNED or for that matter limited in any way.
Point being - can or SHOULD the Federal Government fund EVERY medical research project? Discussion?

-S-

315 rightymouse  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:08:14am

re: #311 ciaospirit


They should have been charged. They got off because they "tossed out" their ballots. No, it wasn't their decision. The Election Board tossed them. Charge them so others will think twice before committing fraud.

I agree. How many people are out there who have temporary residence here and voting in two states or maybe more? It's insane!

316 hermeneutics  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:09:44am

re: #258 yma o hyd

Gah.
Don't be so credulous - I'm the living proof that three cups of coffee a day do not reduce a woman's breast size!

And I'm the living proof that not drinking coffee does not enlarge breast size! (Double negative, sorry)/

317 realwest  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:09:57am

re: #256 eclectic infidel
Wow

it's as if the GOP has settled for mediocrity with its support for Sarah Palin. I view her as the new and improved Dan Quayle for the upcoming election and to be honest, I'm rather stunned at how some rather intelligent and astute lizards hold her so high. President Bush was a poor choice for president but this new GOP ticket sinks to a new low.


I know you're serious and that's what bothers me the most. Aside from the fact that you think Bush was a poor choice for president, you really have drunk deeply of the Kool-aid regarding your stance re: Sarah Palin.
Do I agree with all of what she says? No. Did I agree with everything Bush said when he was first running in 2000, no.
But PLEASE look at the opposition. Please. Palin's wrong about fruit flies and maybe wants a constitutional amendment re: gay marriage or whatever. There will never be a consitutional amendment on that - never. But in 365 days, Obama can and probably will dismantle a significant part of the Armed Forces (and I'd think you'd at least give Bush some credit for their being no more 9/11's - there's a reason for that: he has kept Al-! Q on the run - chasing them down and killing them by the truckloads in both Afghanistan and Iraq )- let's see if Obama can match Bush's record on keeping US safe.
Moreover, Palin isn't some airhead just because she espouses some positions with which you disagree. She has more effin' experience at actually, you know, GOVERNING - developing budgets, finding the funding for those budgets, overseeing the spending of government money than does Obama, Biden OR McCain.
And btw, if you really think so little of Sarah Palin as VP, who would you rather the GOP run as VP for McCain?

318 sarabeara  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:10:43am

Remember when people used to say moving to Alaska was a bad thing? If BHO wins...hmmm...

319 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:11:58am

re: #318 sarabeara

Remember when people used to say moving to Alaska Siberia was a bad thing? If BHO wins...hmmm...

320 gregg  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:12:18am

The Minneapolis StarTribune endorses Norm Coleman, not Al Fraken. The StarTribune is one of most liberal rags out there. I suspect this has more to do with word coming out of Washingtion DC that the Democrats don't want Franken in the senate.

321 legalpad  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:12:36am

Watching a history channel 911 conspiracy theory debunking. Fairly good. It seems to reveal how many are honestly incapable of rational thought. 911 troofers, BDS,PDS, Obamistus, and all that. One past example that sticks in my mind is the decision about DDT, years ago, and how it affected the Malaria rate. It's all like the medievalists who blamed everything on witches. Like Jimmy Carter seeing the UFO. It may be the 21st Century, but we still have a Demon-Haunted World.

322 Old Hippie Vet  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:13:28am

re: #258 yma o hyd

Gah.
Don't be so credulous - I'm the living proof that three cups of coffee a day do not reduce a woman's breast size!


Pictures please.

323 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:13:28am

re: #316 hermeneutics

And I'm the living proof that not drinking coffee does not enlarge breast size! (Double negative, sorry)/

Gee, you sure do say things flat out.

/*ducking, running like hell*

324 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:14:11am

I updinged eclectic infidel, not because I agree with everything he (or she) said, but because I really don't like this reflexive "stone the unfaithful monkey" thing that goes on when someone expresses doubt.

325 SurferDoc  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:16:05am

BTW, the problem with Quayle was not his brains, it was his lack of balls. They hit him and he went down and stayed down. They hit Palin, she hits back and talks past the press to the People.

326 realwest  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:16:15am

re: #259 arethusa
With all due respect, no one knows who the "early voters" are actually voting for. Even Gallup doesn't say that.
At best, the only truly accurate thing that might be said about that Gallup poll is that those who say they have voted for McCain or for Obama are about evenly split.
I view this as something less accurate than the "exit" polls in elections gone by.

327 Rose Parade  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:16:29am

re: #42 kahn_mann

I keep remembering the last two election cycles, when Gore and Kerry were declared the winners even when election day rolled around; even the exit polls were saying the Democrat was going to win. W won both times. I'm hoping the msm has it wrong again.

I'm counting on this.

328 big L  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:16:32am

OT Time mag has Obama on the cover as half white.half black...Gasoline meet fire.
/maybe it is apporpriate to give the Dewars liquor ad on the back a little time facing out.

329 alegrias  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:16:40am

re: #256 eclectic infidel

I feel the same way about the McCain/Palin ticket. Not so much about McCain though, as he's just another member of the boys club. My concern is with Palin, should something happen to befall McCain, health-wise. I've watched the interviews, read numerous articles and even if she's what Bush should have been but isn't (self-made, staunchly opinionated despite how loony she sounds, etc.), it's as if the GOP has settled for mediocrity with its support for Sarah Palin. I view her as the new and improved Dan Quayle for the upcoming election and to be honest, I'm rather stunned at how some rather intelligent and astute lizards hold her so high. President Bush was a poor choice for president but this new GOP ticket sinks to a new low. Yet there's part of me that cringes to think that Obama wants to build a larger bureaucracy and sap more of our hard-earned $ out of us. Just wanted to share, FWIW.

* * *
Thanks but no thanks for sharing. Harry Truman didn't have a college education and is considered a great president in retrospect. Truman's instincts were excellent. Likewise Palin, who is an EXECUTIVE unlike any of the 3 other candidates of either ticket.

Sarah Palin fought the toughest most corrupt people in her own party, and puts America first.

I do not want you in my foxhole, you fragging weakwilled snide ass.

330 Dammits Dad  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:17:30am

I had a very nice conversation with a lady who called me from upstate NY on Thursday. She was attempting to convince me that obama was the answer to all of the world's problems. I may be old and crippled up, but there is nothing wrong with my thought process.
At the end of a thirty minute conversation, she promised to look at some of the links to information I had given her, one to LGF and one to Newsbusters among others. She stated that she would have to do it at home for fear of losing her job.
Some of these people ARE reasonable, they just have been fed pablum for so very long.
If you can get them to look at the truth, as Mark Levin says, some of it may sink in.
Nobama ever

331 sleepyone  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:17:41am

re: #227 shibumi

I heard a story the other day that three cups of coffee a day can reduce a women's breast size.

My wife never drinks coffee. :)

332 Joan Not of Arc  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:17:54am

If the leftist media and bloggers are to be believed, Americans are a stupid people who have jumped into bed with a man who would appease tyrants, tax the working-class, thinks babies are a punishment and would let them die in a closet rather than save them, associates with criminals and those who hate the country he claims to represent, has little if no experience, would stack the courts with "like-minded" individuals, aggrandises himself at every opportunity and apparently spends $1500 per business suit.
I don't believe what CNN or Daily Kos say. I hope the American people don't, either.
Whenever I think of Obama, I think of the song, "Eve of Destruction". Is that wrong of me?

333 LGoPs  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:18:55am

I believe there will be a backlash: many people won't vote for Obama because they've been called ignorant, Bible-toting, gun-wielding bigots for having honest questions about the man's politics. How insulting is that?

I believe in America: the greatest country on earth. That means I believe in Americans.

Get out there and vote, Americans!

Paraphrasing Nathan Hale "I regret I have but one vote to give for McCain"

Of course if I were a Democrat, I wouldn't be restrained.......
/

334 realwest  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:20:18am

re: #324 Charles Charles I didn't even know you'd updinged Electric Infidel, but respectfully, Electric Infidel was not expressing "doubt" about a candidate, Electric Infidel was making some fairly strong charges about Palin - not doubts about the wisdom of her being the VP nominee, but real reasons which Electric Infidel said she should never have been the VP.
Doubts fine, opposition fine. But they are not the same thing at all.

335 Colonel Panik  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:21:50am

re: #325 SurferDoc

BTW, the problem with Quayle was not his brains, it was his lack of balls. They hit him and he went down and stayed down. They hit Palin, she hits back and talks past the press to the People.


Just like Ronaldus Maximus. This is why the left fears Palin. She connects with ordinary folks. George W. Bush, unfortunately did not have that gift.

336 Basho  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:24:17am

re: #256 eclectic infidel

...it's as if the GOP has settled for mediocrity with its support for Sarah Palin.

I like Palin for several reasons, but I still find it a shame the GOP rejected Romney and Rudy for absurdly stupid reasons... Still, McCain is the leader this country needs.

337 Iron Fist  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:24:29am

re: #300 lawhawk

It is really incorrect to even refer to Obama as a "sitting Senator". All he's done, for the entire time he's been in the Senate, is run for President. I guess he feels that actually doing the job of a Senator is beneath his pay grade.

338 Iron Fist  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:28:45am

re: #336 Basho

Rudy didn't really run for President. He simply let it be known that if we'd coronate him, he would deign to be king. When it wasn't handed to him on a silver platter, he decided he didn't really want it anyway. Which is fine by me.

We've already got a candidate who believes himself to be a god in Obama. We don't need that kind of attitude in our nominee.

339 alegrias  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:31:40am

re: #334 realwest

Charles I didn't even know you'd updinged Electric Infidel, but respectfully, Electric Infidel was not expressing "doubt" about a candidate, Electric Infidel was making some fairly strong charges about Palin - not doubts about the wisdom of her being the VP nominee, but real reasons which Electric Infidel said she should never have been the VP.
Doubts fine, opposition fine. But they are not the same thing at all.

* * * *
Hello Dear RealWest. Thank you, Sir.

Eclectic "Infidel" ignores conveniently ignores crooked dem Veep candidate Joe Biden's credentials & character. Biden was kicked out of law school for plagiarism, yet begged his way back in. He's a party man and windbag who brags about his IQ, yet cheated while in college and as a grown man, stealing British Labor leader Neal Kinnock's speeches.

340 RememberSekhmet?  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:32:15am

re: #43 kynna

As a mother of a child diagnosed with autism I can say without reservation that the 'autism lobby' is big, powerful and ruthless. I don't take anything they say at face value.

Fruit fly research has helped autism? Pardon my skepticism, but I've seen it all at this point.

Autism diagnoses have risen as other previous diagnoses have fallen, and at the same rate. Other cognitive, behvioral, and learning disabilities are simply being re-classified as autism or in the autism spectrum.

341 Killer Tomato  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:32:21am

re: #319 sattv4u2

Remember when people used to say moving to Alaska Siberia was a bad thing? If BHO wins...hmmm...

In Obama's America, you don't go to Siberia, Siberia comes to you!

342 alegrias  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:36:11am

re: #336 Basho

I like Palin for several reasons, but I still find it a shame the GOP rejected Romney and Rudy for absurdly stupid reasons... Still, McCain is the leader this country needs.

* * *
Romney & Giuliani can still serve our country in important capacities, in a McCain/Palin administration.

343 rexatosis  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:37:18am

The problem with Obama and his foreign policy team is that they reject reality for a policy based on fuzzy platitudes like having a "department of peace" and the idea if we all adopted the stance of the Dali Lama the world would magically become peaceful. That has worked out real well for the Tibetans. Of course this problem of Team Obama rejecting reality is not limited just to Foreign Policy, they also reject economic reality, the reality of human nature, etc.

John McCain may be an awful candidate but atleast he is tethered to the real world instead of a utopian fantasyland that has never existed, does not exist, and never will exist outside the fevered smoke-filled imaginations of the "True Believer."

344 Killer Tomato  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:37:43am

re: #336 Basho

I like Palin for several reasons, but I still find it a shame the GOP rejected Romney and Rudy for absurdly stupid reasons... Still, McCain is the leader this country needs.

I had this discussion with someone the other day. His feeling was that Palin was chosen just because of the Hillary Factor. My response was, "OK - suppose that's true. You going to hand the country over to one party rule (and the Marxist Party at that) because you don't like this ticket? We have to ride the horse we have, not the one we may have wanted and don't have."

345 Racer X  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:39:04am

Without Palin on the ticket McCain would be history. Like her or hate her - she has revitalized the right.

And yes, I do think much of the criticism leveled against her is unfair, and in most cases downright insulting. But by all means - continue to point out her flaws.

Criticizing Obama's failed policies next year will be fun!

346 gman  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:47:05am

re: #345 Racer X

Without Palin on the ticket McCain would be history. Like her or hate her - she has revitalized the right.

And yes, I do think much of the criticism leveled against her is unfair, and in most cases downright insulting. But by all means - continue to point out her flaws.

Criticizing Obama's failed policies next year will be fun!

I totally agree with you. If Palin were such a bad choice, then why would the MSM be attacking her wardrobe and accent.

347 Basho  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:48:26am

re: #345 Racer X

But by all means - continue to point out her flaws.

The more the flaws of our number 2 are pointed out, the more absurd their number 1 looks in comparison.

My main reason for supporting Palin though: I can't imagine fighting under Obama or Biden, but I can imagine fighting under Palin. She has natural commander in chief qualities that the other two don't.

348 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:51:12am

re: #345 Racer X

Without Palin on the ticket McCain would be history. Like her or hate her - she has revitalized the right.

And yes, I do think much of the criticism leveled against her is unfair, and in most cases downright insulting. But by all means - continue to point out her flaws.

Criticizing Obama's failed policies next year will be fun!

The election does not hinge on whether Sarah Palin is criticized in the comments at LGF. You may have noticed that I have not posted front page articles on either her ignorant statement on scientific research, or her refusal to clearly denounce abortion clinic bombers.

But I don't like those statements one bit, I won't be bulllied into stifling my opinions, and I'm still planning to vote for John McCain.

349 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:57:00am

re: #336 Basho

I like Palin for several reasons, but I still find it a shame the GOP rejected Romney and Rudy for absurdly stupid reasons... Still, McCain is the leader this country needs.

Rudy lost out because of a poor strategy, and the fact that he was not pro-life which makes it an up hill battle with Republicans in general. Romney lost because of religious bigotry by the press. It just drove him out of the contest. Huckabee didn't help either. He messed up a number of potential candidates. I was a Fred head, and contributed twice to his campaign, I still think he would have been the best choice Thompson/Palin would have been impressive.

350 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:03:13am

re: #348 Charles

The election does not hinge on whether Sarah Palin is criticized in the comments at LGF. You may have noticed that I have not posted front page articles on either her ignorant statement on scientific research, or her refusal to clearly denounce abortion clinic bombers.

But I don't like those statements one bit, I won't be bulllied into stifling my opinions, and I'm still planning to vote for John McCain.

The abortion clinic question of course is a red herring. When was the last abortion clinic bombing? Her view on terrorist activities centered on whether the purpose of the attack was to disrupt the government or create a major crisis. And that is a distinct difference which you are free to disagree with.

Again on the scientific research.. it is not a government function to supply funding to every research grant presented to congress. Much of the research is funded by political pressure and not common sense anyway.

351 Old Hippie Vet  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:06:08am

re: #349 Dasher

Rudy lost out because of a poor strategy.......................................... .................................................. .................................................. .Thompson/Palin would have been impressive.


You got that right!

I think I just popped a chubby.

352 Who Watches the Watchmen?  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:07:23am

re: #203 sattv4u2

re: #185 Shug

Thats why i'm amazed at the 'conservatives" that say they are sitting this one out, because McCain doesn't agree with them on 100% of the issues
My response, ,,, "So you're willing to have someone in office that you are 100% diametrically opposed to instead of someone you disagree with, what, 20%,,, 30% ?!?!?!?"

This is one election where "the best is the enemy of the good."

353 Killian Bundy  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:07:56am
Is America Really Going To Do This?

/well, if you take a look at the early voting . . .

354 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:09:00am

re: #350 Dasher

The abortion clinic question of course is a red herring. When was the last abortion clinic bombing?

Who cares when the last abortion clinic bombing was? When someone asks you if bombing an abortion clinic is terrorism, the answer is "Yes."

Again on the scientific research.. it is not a government function to supply funding to every research grant presented to congress. Much of the research is funded by political pressure and not common sense anyway.

So you're saying that the government shouldn't fund research into a cure for autism?

355 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:10:02am

re: #354 Charles

So you're saying that the government shouldn't fund research into a cure for autism?

I am saying that government shouldn't fund research by the use of earmarks.

356 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:11:45am

re: #348 Charles

The election does not hinge on whether Sarah Palin is criticized in the comments at LGF. You may have noticed that I have not posted front page articles on either her ignorant statement on scientific research, or her refusal to clearly denounce abortion clinic bombers.

But I don't like those statements one bit, I won't be bulllied into stifling my opinions, and I'm still planning to vote for John McCain.

In the coming months that which is "The Right" in this country is going to have to sort a lot of things out and it will be a brutal process akin to fratricide. I am hoping that no one at LGF who wants to opine on doubts or rethink assumptions out loud will be crushed by crowd think. Your comments lend comfort to brave individuals willing to re-examine past assumptions and question assertions and decisions of national leaders with R's after their names.

I am not bought into the web 2.0 "wisdom of crowds" thing. Nothing wrong with seeking the wisdom of the wise. I expect to find it here.

Thank you, Charles.

357 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:16:32am

re: #355 Dasher

I am saying that government shouldn't fund research by the use of earmarks.

To add a note: The context of Palin's comments were the $18 Billion spent by earmarks which are not vetted in any way. It doesn't matter what the cause is.

358 FlakMusic  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:17:42am

re: #7 jamie

I often like Melanie Phillips, but she sounds like a friggin' nut case in this article. I guess this is the Obama yin to the yang of BDS. It's pathetic.

Strange. I found it to be a rather straightforward, clear-eyed, and rational analysis.

I think you're yang's out of whack. And pathetic.

359 Killian Bundy  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:17:58am
the most important reason why the prospect of an Obama presidency is giving so many people nightmares. This is the fear that, if he wins, US defences will be emasculated at a time of unprecedented international peril and the enemies of America and the free world will seize their opportunity to destroy the west

/bingo, nail on the head

360 Wm T Sherman  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:18:50am

re: #55 Charles

The comment about fruit fly research was disturbingly ignorant.

Yes, it was.

However, how knowledgeable about it are the other three people in this race?

361 Charles the Hammer  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:19:47am

re: #354 Charles

So you're saying that the government shouldn't fund research into a cure for autism?

No, it shouldn't. That is, if it doesn't fund any other kind of "cure" research, either. But if it is going to fund research for any kind of medical advance, it should fund them all. No more picking out different "maladies" that are more important than others. Just a thought.

As far as the article itself is concerned: yes, Ms. Phillips, we will. It was inevitable. The West's long, slow march into this situation was an inevitability. Tage Lindbom and Father Seraphim Rose were right. And, I think, so was Jonah Goldberg. Since Wilson, we have been doing the Joseph Stalin two-step, always remaining one step closer to severe state interference (by always moving one step closer to totalitarianism than we ever moved back toward a "free society"). Of course we should fight it, but our direction is unavoidable.

the sinner,

Charles

362 FlakMusic  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:19:55am

re: #349 Dasher

I was a Fred head, and contributed twice to his campaign, I still think he would have been the best choice Thompson/Palin would have been impressive.

Ditto...Thompson/Palin...tag teaming OBiden...if only...

363 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:20:42am

The fact is that government-funded scientific research in the United States has been on a serious decline for years. Far from being a huge money sink, it's now in a terrible, shabby state, and America's lead in science and technology has disappeared. Countries like India and China are going to the moon, and we're being left behind with the creationists.

Did you know that the Bell Labs building, where modern telecommunications was invented from scratch, and which used to be a center of Nobel-prize winning research, has been closed because of the lack of federal funding? It's a tragedy and a national disgrace.

364 Colin Nelson  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:24:32am

re: #324 Charles

I updinged eclectic infidel, not because I agree with everything he (or she) said, but because I really don't like this reflexive "stone the unfaithful monkey" thing that goes on when someone expresses doubt.

With respect, please do not impugn all those who down-ding a comment as being motivated by your stone the monkey cliche.

My down-ding is every bit as valid and nuanced as your up-ding.

365 skree  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:30:08am

re: #13 karmic_inquisitor

BTW - I already voted absentee in California. Straight Republican ballot and "no" to every bond initiative. First time I have done that. I see it as an act of defiance and negation. I hope others have joined me.

Me too!

366 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:34:17am

re: #363 Charles

Did you know that the Bell Labs building, where modern telecommunications was invented from scratch, and which used to be a center of Nobel-prize winning research, has been closed because of the lack of federal funding? It's a tragedy and a national disgrace.

It is sad, but maybe the political pressures to fund other research was misplaced. Eaxmple: AID's while a tragedy, is one of the most preventable disease, accomplished by not putting your private parts where they don't belong.

367 razorbacker  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:35:13am

re: #279 el matamoros

Look, I know people don't want to hear this but there is an old saying "Sometimes in order to take one step forward you first must take one step backwards."

The thing is Bushs invasion of Iraq (like it or not) has basically "Spent" all the political capital that the US gained from 9-11. Now, BDS is a rampant disease. Troofers are everywhere. And no one thinks that Radical Islam is a threat anymore. They think its about "root causes", I.E. Israel and the US.
At this point one can only throw up ones hands and say "Go ahead, keep it up, see what happens."
IOW- from this point on it going to have to get worse before it gets better. WEre gonna need more insanity in Pakistan, more "Cartoon riots", More "youth riots", more etc. etc. etc. Its the only way that the "Mainstream" can realise the truth again. Of course there are some who are beyond redemption but they are either Muslims or Radical Leftists. No, it is the Middle that must be reached again.

The idea that the United States gained political capital by being attacked is so very wrong that I simply do not know where to begin.

Other than to note that we were hated before 9/11 and hated after 9/11.

368 Throbert McGee  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:38:43am

re: #55 Charles

The comment about fruit fly research was disturbingly ignorant.

I downdinged this because I think Charles should've said "the comment was embarrassingly ignorant," or something like that. What I mean is, we shouldn't be disturbed to find out that Palin or ANY of the other three candidates in this election is ignorant of the importance of fruit flies, because MOST people who aren't biology geeks are probably unaware of how incredibly important fruit flies have been in genetics research. And being a biology geek is not part of the job description for VP or POTUS.

It is, however, embarrassing, since Palin's detractors will jump all over this as proof of how stupid she is.

369 Spiny Norman  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:39:08am

re: #256 eclectic infidel

I feel the same way about the McCain/Palin ticket. Not so much about McCain though, as he's just another member of the boys club. My concern is with Palin, should something happen to befall McCain, health-wise. I've watched the interviews, read numerous articles and even if she's what Bush should have been but isn't (self-made, staunchly opinionated despite how loony she sounds, etc.), it's as if the GOP has settled for mediocrity with its support for Sarah Palin. I view her as the new and improved Dan Quayle for the upcoming election and to be honest, I'm rather stunned at how some rather intelligent and astute lizards hold her so high. President Bush was a poor choice for president but this new GOP ticket sinks to a new low. Yet there's part of me that cringes to think that Obama wants to build a larger bureaucracy and sap more of our hard-earned $ out of us. Just wanted to share, FWIW.

So you've bought into the Democrat media narrative. Congratulations.

Palin is campaigning far better than McCain is, and is better qualified than either of the Democrats. Take off your blinders, sir.

370 Killian Bundy  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:42:01am

Yeah, America, still the greatest country on Earth, is in decline in many areas. It's difficult to stay on top, decade after decade.

/Lord President For Life Obama is just us stomping down on the accelerator

371 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:42:21am

re: #369 Spiny Norman

So you've bought into the Democrat media narrative. Congratulations.

Palin is campaigning far better than McCain is, and is better qualified than either of the Democrats. Take off your blinders, sir.

I agree, Sarah Palin is an outstanding campaigner, and has done a magnificent job. McCain would be down and out without her.

372 Charles  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:46:38am

re: #368 Throbert McGee

I downdinged this because I think Charles should've said "the comment was embarrassingly ignorant," or something like that. What I mean is, we shouldn't be disturbed to find out that Palin or ANY of the other three candidates in this election is ignorant of the importance of fruit flies, because MOST people who aren't biology geeks are probably unaware of how incredibly important fruit flies have been in genetics research. And being a biology geek is not part of the job description for VP or POTUS.

It is, however, embarrassing, since Palin's detractors will jump all over this as proof of how stupid she is.

It's disturbing because she bashed scientific research just to score some populist points. "Fruit flies in France!" Yuk yuk.

373 bungie  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:49:51am

re: #120 Desert Dog

Why is it that so many people can see right through the BS that is BHO and so many others cannot? I know part of it is the way people look at the world. There are many nimrods on the left that are lapping up everything BHO says, because they believe in the same crap. But, what is scary is the sheer number of people that are taking the bait - hook, line and sinker without even knowing (or caring) what BHO stands for. All they hear is HOPE and CHANGE, and that is enough for them.....UGH....heaven help us.

I've been struggling to figure this out. I think its a coalition of people 1) who have no Judeo-Christian background and are not schooled in the one God theology and therefore do not have a prohibition against idol worship, and 2) victims who see themselves as oppressed and want to worship the golden calf and get gold in reward.

I realize there are Christians and Jews voting for Obama but in my experience they are the more secular whose theology is shallow.

374 Dasher  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:53:01am

re: #372 Charles

It's disturbing because she bashed scientific research just to score some populist points. "Fruit flies in France!" Yuk yuk.

Never mind! Your mind is made up. -- But you are still out of context.

375 Throbert McGee  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:54:19am

re: #366 Dasher

It is sad, but maybe the political pressures to fund other research was misplaced. Eaxmple: AID's while a tragedy, is one of the most preventable disease, accomplished by not putting your private parts where they don't belong.

While you're correct that AIDS/HIV is very easy to avoid, and that the government dollars spent on "AIDS prevention" are arguably being wasted, the virological research on HIV itself is worth every penny, in that it has dramatically increased our scientific understanding of viruses in general.

376 Throbert McGee  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:56:53am

re: #372 Charles

It's disturbing because she bashed scientific research just to score some populist points. "Fruit flies in France!" Yuk yuk.

Well, ya got me there.

377 Killian Bundy  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 11:58:09am

Someone, eventually, is going to have to wake up to the reality that is and put a muzzle on the Federal budget. $10 trillion in national debt, with about $30-40 trillion in unfunded social entitlement mandates looming large, should be a very loud alarm clock.

/Lord President For Life Obama, along with an unbridled Pelosi and Reid, will be much worse than just hitting the snooze button

378 Spiny Norman  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 12:07:58pm

re: #363 Charles

The fact is that government-funded scientific research in the United States has been on a serious decline for years. Far from being a huge money sink, it's now in a terrible, shabby state, and America's lead in science and technology has disappeared. Countries like India and China are going to the moon, and we're being left behind with the creationists.

Did you know that the Bell Labs building, where modern telecommunications was invented from scratch, and which used to be a center of Nobel-prize winning research, has been closed because of the lack of federal funding? It's a tragedy and a national disgrace.

Then again, in an Obama Administration, social engineering will take a much higher priority than genetic engineering. Don't expect an increase in scientific research funding from Barry and Friends.

379 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 12:09:47pm
380 notutopia  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 12:22:38pm

re: #368 Throbert McGee

It is, however, embarrassing, since Palin's detractors will jump all over this as proof of how stupid she is.

She had not bothered to become informed on her argument before using this as a bad example of government funding on research. This when she is proposing a multibillion dollar expense of our budget on HER autism platform.
She is not stupid, or ignorant. She was ill prepared to use this as an example. and ignorant on the facts supporting her own proposals.
Same thing that Biden did with saying O would be tested, guaranteed. His backfired. I think he was actually inflating HIS abilities of foreign policy in importance over O.
She used her example of spending on research as a political embarrassment of frivolous spending on the WRONG PROJECT.
I hope she doesn't repeat this again in future speeches.

381 profitsbeard  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 12:25:18pm

About one quarter of America (half of the voting population) is going to "do this" (pull Obama's lever) for a mixture of the 7 worst reasons to vote for anybody:

1) smug anger (Bush Dementia Syndrome); 2) gnawing liberal white guilt ("I haven't been as nice as I should have to them, so I'll vote for their leader to make amends. " ); 3) uber-affirmative action ("The black guy deserves it for once."); 4) the ultimate in Reparations ("Now they can't say we're a racist country") ; 5) kowtowing to the Media's image of the U.S. as "no longer respected in the World" (which Barack will magically cure); 6) a delusional belief that the Democrats did not cause the current economic meltdown by forcing banking firms to write bad mortgages to promote feel-good socialism ("Republican deregulation did it!"); 7) trusting a politician without examining his credentials ("He says he's for CHANGE, and that's good enough for me.")

Hopefully the counterbalancing 25%, plus one person, will vote to stop this smarmy unqualified crypto-Marxist from insinuating himself into power.

382 Killian Bundy  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 12:28:23pm

re: #379 ploome hineni

an oddly enough, it may very well be, that the scientific research into AIDS, and medication that allow people with AIDS to live better and longer, is actually contributing to the AIDS epidemic

/ice cold!

383 Hawaiian cocoNUT  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 12:31:56pm

“They are drooling at the prospect that an Obama presidency will bring that about. The rest of us can’t sleep at night.”

I can sleep but I have nightmares.

384 Killian Bundy  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 12:34:47pm

re: #382 Killian Bundy

ice cold!

/ice cold

385 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 12:54:23pm
386 Throbert McGee  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 1:07:50pm

re: #384 Killian Bundy

ice cold!

/ice cold

Dude, that was so fucking cool, and worth about 3.6 quintillion updings!

Hot damn but I love our men and women in the military! (Especially the men... WOOF!)

387 uptight  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 1:11:58pm

re: #26 jemima

re: #26 jemima

This is not directed at Melanie.
But since Europe has done everything possible to diminish America, to stab us in the back, to make deals with our enemies as well as theirs, I want to give them a hearty FU this morning. You did NOTHING to support us, you've mocked us mercilessly, you courted the weak-minded in America with your criticisms for years, nay, decades, now they are on your side. You will reap the nasty seeds you have sown if this commie wins the election. Don't cry now. Revel in what you've achieved, you socialist nitwits.

I do wish people would lump all European countries in together. The Danes put up a courageous stance against Islamofascism. Even France has banned hijab. Britain fights side-by-side with America in Afghanistan & Iraq. We aren't the "US of E".

388 uptight  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 1:12:59pm

re: #26 jemima

This is not directed at Melanie.
But since Europe has done everything possible to diminish America, to stab us in the back, to make deals with our enemies as well as theirs, I want to give them a hearty FU this morning. You did NOTHING to support us, you've mocked us mercilessly, you courted the weak-minded in America with your criticisms for years, nay, decades, now they are on your side. You will reap the nasty seeds you have sown if this commie wins the election. Don't cry now. Revel in what you've achieved, you socialist nitwits.

I do wish people wouldn't lump all European countries in together. We aren't the "US of E". The Danes put up a courageous stance against Islamofascism. Even France has banned hijab. Britain fights side-by-side with America in Afghanistan & Iraq.

389 tuesday  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 1:13:18pm

re: #50 rumcrook
' I think the dems with thier complicit media whores and the 40 years of socialist indoctrination in the schools have finnally realized a tipping point in thier efforts to legitimize bringing socialism as the controling way of doing bussiness to the US "

The socialist indoctrination in the schools is one of the main supporting arms for their success. I've witnessed my own kids who were carefully taught at home about communism and democracy and how they've played out in the last century arrive in college classes where socialism in rammed down their throats in every single class. Ethics is now about the 'horrors' of the Bush administration and the power of socialism to remedy that. English lit is about the beauty of homosexual love. Political science is just one long left-wing hysterical rant. After a year or so my kids are using the same techniques to win arguments, contempt, hate, mockery. This is what they teach in ethics ? My kids became emotional thinkers and as close minded as you could possibly imagine. After only a year. And ten-20 years post college there has been no change. All voting Obama.

390 SouthAmericanWay  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 1:14:48pm

re: #1 Sharmuta

I hope you're right. Why are you so sure?

391 Jamie  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 1:19:43pm

re: #358 FlakMusic

Strange. I found it to be a rather straightforward, clear-eyed, and rational analysis.

I think you're yang's out of whack. And pathetic.

I'll just have to learn to live with your disapproval.

392 Dirk Diggler  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 1:19:48pm
The fact is that government-funded scientific research in the United States has been on a serious decline for years. Far from being a huge money sink, it's now in a terrible, shabby state, and America's lead in science and technology has disappeared. Countries like India and China are going to the moon, and we're being left behind with the creationists.

That's a bit of a stretch. The Europeans aren't in any hurry to go to the moon. Are they in bed with the creationists too?

The reason the space race has been largely abandoned by Western countries is because Western countires have become parochially self-absorbed and ennervated to the point that they shy away from great challenges. The U.S. and Europe have become more concerned expanding access substandard health care systems, setting up unsustainable retirement ponzi schemes, and creating federally funded bike paths than epoch making scientific achievements.

393 uptight  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 1:20:52pm

Notice how many endorsements are pouring in, now the race looks won.

And it means nothing other than that the endorser is claiming some reflected glory or self-validation from the coat tails of the endorsee.

Colon Bowel should be a model of the "brave man". He showed himself up as a cowardly douche. It's not that he endorsed O'Bambi, it's that he waited until he thought it was a safe bet to do so.

Me - I've just put a large bet on John McCain. I've gotta have some reason to want him to win (other than the joy of seeing Barry Dunham losing)

394 Killian Bundy  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 1:29:49pm

re: #386 Throbert McGee

Dude, that was so fucking cool, and worth about 3.6 quintillion updings!

Hot damn but I love our men and women in the military! (Especially the men... WOOF!)

/Move Along sailor

395 Spiny Norman  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 1:44:05pm

re: #392 Dirk Diggler

That's a bit of a stretch. The Europeans aren't in any hurry to go to the moon. Are they in bed with the creationists too?

The reason the space race has been largely abandoned by Western countries is because Western countires have become parochially self-absorbed and ennervated to the point that they shy away from great challenges. The U.S. and Europe have become more concerned expanding access substandard health care systems, setting up unsustainable retirement ponzi schemes, and creating federally funded bike paths than epoch making scientific achievements.

Yep, more elaborate than my #378, but we agree...

396 Aussie Infidel  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 2:11:41pm

re: #7 jamie

I often like Melanie Phillips, but she sounds like a friggin' nut case in this article. I guess this is the Obama yin to the yang of BDS. It's pathetic.

Jamie. Rather than killing the messenger because you don't like the message. Please tell everyone exactly what you find 'nutty' in what Phillips has said!


Waiting waiting ... waiting


Crickets..... crickets

397 debutaunt  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 2:31:18pm

re: #363 Charles

I wonder how much government funding has been diverted to global 'warming'.

398 avspatti  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 3:55:56pm

re: #68 Walter L. Newton

Socialism, Marxism, Communism doesn't mean anything to them, they have no historical content in wish to compare it to. Our schools don't teach it, our popular media doesn't show it for what it really is and most folks have lost touch with what this country has had to sacrifice to get to where we are.
.................................................. ....................

That is the problem in a nutshell. As a teacher, I know what you say about the schools is absolutely true. The people teaching 'social studies' and history are systematically blaming everything on America. They are systematically bringing our dear nation down. The left has been in charge of education for decades, and we are about to reap the whirlwind.

399 avspatti  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 4:03:38pm

re: #75 FrogMarch

Yahoo headline: Sarah Palin injures a hockey player.


oooo - left-wing media are salivating over this one.

This is totally ridiculous! I have been to many. many hockey games. Whenever there is a special occasion or presentation involving 'civilians', there is ALWAYS a carpet strip put down for them to walk on. The other night at the Avalanche game, the four new inductees for the U.S. Hockey Hall of Fame were introduced. These are HOCKEY players but not on skates. Even they had the carpet. Legace got hurt because he wasn't paying attention.

400 avspatti  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 5:06:24pm

Anyone else see the big headline this morning for the Rocky Mountain News?

Obama up by 12 points

according to their poll and that of CBS4? I just threw the paper down. Where do they get this stuff? And no, I did NOT read the article.

401 swami  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 5:22:16pm

re: #19 newsjunkie_ky

frank luntz, in the tank for The Zero.

Frank Luntz is in the tank for whoever he thinks is gonna win.
He redefines the term "frontrunner."

Wish I could share the optimism of some of you guys(and gals), but I really don't.

402 avspatti  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 5:27:35pm

re: #333 LGoPs

Nathan Hale: my ancestor!

403 avspatti  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 5:30:46pm

re: #336 Basho

Sarah Palin is in no way mediocre.

404 Basho  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 5:34:23pm

re: #403 avspatti

I know... I said in that post I support her...

405 RedVoter  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 6:01:09pm

Brilliantly written article. She may sound panicky, but she gives sound reasons for being so. It is not just his inexperience, as others argue, but his flawed and self destructive world view which could lead to a disastrous four years, especially with a super majority in the Senate. Her writing emboldened me instead of filling me with fear and dread as it may some and should remind us all to stay vigilante if Obama is in fact elected.

but with the shadey "truth squads" Axelrod sends after anyone who questions The One, I slightly worry about having to wear an arm band with the letter "R" on it.

406 UncleSam  Sat, Oct 25, 2008 10:31:25pm

Everyone I know, except for one guy at work, is a slavering, mindless and hypnotized Obamaton.
I fear for our nation.


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