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And Now for Some iPhone News

Science | Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 6:54:36 pm PDT

Two very cool pieces of news for iPhone geeks:

1) Google Earth for iPhone. Need I say more?

2) Free Wi-Fi for iPhone owners at thousands of AT&T hotspots, including Starbucks and McDonalds.

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700 comments

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1 Noam Sayin'  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 6:56:55pm

Should really upgrade the PalmPilot one of these days...

2 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 6:57:09pm

I want a Me-phone!

3 HelloDare  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 6:57:13pm

I'm waiting for the mePhone.

4 vxbush  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 6:57:24pm

Sigh. Two more reasons to drool.

5 HelloDare  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 6:57:51pm

d'oh

6 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 6:58:18pm

Is there anything an iphone can't do?

7 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 6:59:15pm

PHILLIES!

8 LoFlyer  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 6:59:44pm

Charles, I know the site is being hit hard due to interest as the election approaches, but it is all this traffic legitimate? It would be in the Socialists favor to down this site in hopes of obtaining an Obama victory....

9 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 6:59:53pm

re: #3 HelloDare

I'm waiting for the mePhone.

Beat you by '' that much!

10 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:00:10pm

The lady on Deal or No Seal just won a million dollars.

Lady- 0bama's coming for you.

11 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:01:36pm

re: #10 Sharmuta

The lady on Deal or No Seal just won a million dollars.

Lady- 0bama's coming for you.

Is the Seal PETA-approved? : )

12 HelloDare  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:03:28pm

I'm going to wait a few months till they iron out the kinks. The GPS on my iWaffleIron is giving me problems.

13 Jamie Irons  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:03:40pm

Yeah, these two are cool, but I'm waiting for the LGF Lizard-Reader app...


Jamie Irons

14 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:03:43pm

I am very happy with my communication network, thank you very much.

15 HelloDare  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:06:27pm

re: #6 Sharmuta

Is there anything an iphone can't do?

It vibrates, so I guess the answer is, "No."

16 gop_patriot  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:08:56pm

re: #15 HelloDare

It vibrates, so I guess the answer is, "No."

LOL!

17 saberry0530  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:09:16pm

re: #15 HelloDare

It vibrates, so I guess the answer is, "No."

Gives the old Ad slogan "Reach out and touch someone" a whole new meaning.

18 stevieray  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:11:01pm

Soon we'll all have an oPhone -- implanted!

/i hope...

19 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:11:42pm

Perfect timing.

I need a new cell phone ( currently using a motorola razor)

I'd say I'd use the internet once ot twice per week from my phone. Not a priority for me, but nice to have. I don't feel like spending a fortune for a phone since half the time I can't find it


Would it be worth it to get an iPhone, or are there better options?

I love my iPod and shuffle

20 Charles  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:11:46pm

Sure enough, even the "journalists" on Fox News are now closing ranks to defend the Los Angeles Times.

The entire media establishment is corrupt.

21 Karridine  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:12:25pm

Almost enough to persuade me to return to CONUS...

/depending on the outcome of 4-11-2008

22 gop_patriot  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:13:08pm

re: #20 Charles

I don't have Fox, what are they saying?

23 guzziguy  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:13:20pm

re: #6 Sharmuta

Is there anything an iphone can't do?

Yes. I work out in the boonies. The iPhone network doesn't reach there. If it did, I'd own one.

24 Cognito  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:13:27pm

Did you say 'free'?

Neato.

25 jorline  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:13:32pm

Best function of an iPhone.

27 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:18:04pm

More cowbell.

28 HelloDare  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:18:44pm

If there were some national secrets on that Khalidi video, it would have been on YouTube in April.

29 Karridine  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:19:30pm

"journalists 'close ranks'"?

Citizens make a bigger stink, a bigger noise! Indignation rampant!

RELEASE the VIDEO!

30 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:19:42pm

re: #27 rawmuse

More cowbell.

Enough to drown out The One.

31 Charles  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:20:03pm

Bernie Goldberg is the only one I've seen who's even raised the issue of whether the LA Times is telling the truth when they say they promised their source not to release the tape.

I'm not going to mince words. I think they're lying. It took them 3 days to come up with that excuse, and they floated several other excuses before it.

If you had a personal acquaintance who told contradictory stories like this about an incident they were involved in, would you believe them?

32 mattm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:20:08pm

Anyone notice The American Flag now appears with The One much more often. The camera will get is, even if they shoot form a odd angle.

33 yah  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:20:25pm

re: #20 Charles
They see the writing on the wall. Government run TV. Courtesy of Obama and friends.

34 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:20:49pm

The media is rigorously partisan.

But we've had this 'veil of neutrality' sold to us.

35 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:21:45pm

re: #31 Charles

Lies are just tools. Any means to an end, got to break some eggs to make and omelette, all in service of the "greater good", blah, blah, blah.

36 HelloDare  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:21:47pm

re: #28 HelloDare

If there were some national secrets on that Khalidi video, it would have been on YouTube in April.

No. You'd get a free copy with every subscription.

37 HelloDare  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:23:50pm

re: #31 Charles

Reminds me of Christmas in Cambodia.

38 HelloDare  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:24:44pm

Hey, I'm spamming myself here.

39 WriterMom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:25:06pm

Can you imagine what the contents are? I keep thinking of damning dialogue over and over again...

40 godfrey  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:26:33pm

If the tape is totally innocuous, they'd have no problem releasing it.

They have a problem releasing it because it's "sensitive" and could hurt Obama and/or the leaker.

It has nothing to do with promises or integrity. It has everything to do with cost/benefit.

41 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:27:10pm

re: #31 Charles

Bernie Goldberg is the only one I've seen who's even raised the issue of whether the LA Times is telling the truth when they say they promised their source not to release the tape.

I'm not going to mince words. I think they're lying. It took them 3 days to come up with that excuse, and they floated several other excuses before it.

If you had a personal acquaintance who told contradictory stories like this about an incident they were involved in, would you believe them?

That about nails it, I'm afraid.

42 Dar ul Harb  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:27:36pm

iPhone News?

Does this mean that long LGF threads won't crash Safari anymore?

43 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:27:41pm

re: #31 Charles

Bernie Goldberg is the only one I've seen who's even raised the issue of whether the LA Times is telling the truth when they say they promised their source not to release the tape.

I'm not going to mince words. I think they're lying. It took them 3 days to come up with that excuse, and they floated several other excuses before it.

If you had a personal acquaintance who told contradictory stories like this about an incident they were involved in, would you believe them?

Think of the implications of this vis a vis Israel:

The individual who "leaked" this to the LAT but did so conditionally now has a major stick that he can hold over Obama.

If Obama makes the "wrong" moves regarding what the PLO wants, the video can be published with or without the LA Times - other copies must exist.

Think about it - Obama is now black mailed by the PLO.

44 godfrey  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:28:06pm

re: #39 WriterMom

I'm betting there's footage of anti-Israel speeches with Obama there, nodding, smiling, smoking, and drinking.

45 WriterMom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:28:27pm

re: #31 Charles

Charles, the National Post has picked up the story here in Canada.

46 WriterMom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:29:26pm

re: #44 godfrey

I picture them smoking a hookah, wearing keffiyahs and ululating to chants of 'death to Israel'. LOL.

47 bosforus  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:29:39pm
Obama's 'Civilian National Security Force'

Gotta have someone to enforce all the new 'hate crime' laws to come.

48 Killgore Trout  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:29:50pm

Is this thing on?

49 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:30:25pm

re: #34 experiencedtraveller

The media is rigorously partisan.

But we've had this 'veil of neutrality' sold to us.

It would be nice if they would just admit what they are so the American people can decide if that's what they want to support with their time and money.

But then again- with readership and ratings down, it looks like the American people have already decided.

50 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:30:29pm

re: #48 Killgore Trout

Is this thing on?

No.

51 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:30:43pm

re: #48 Killgore Trout

Is this thing on?

No.

52 Killgore Trout  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:31:04pm

re: #44 godfrey

I'm guessing it's footage of Obama and Ayers yucking it up together.

53 Killgore Trout  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:31:18pm

Heh.

54 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:32:07pm

re: #50 karmic_inquisitor

GMTA!

55 godfrey  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:32:42pm

The blackmail angle is interesting and stands to reason. Once you're in with that crowd, it must be like being pwned by the mafia.

An apostate Muslim being blackmailed by PLO types. There's a good situation for the POTUS to be in...

WM, nah, Obama will be there looking "thoughtful and grave" while the crazies give themselves leg tingles. Not that he's not tingling, himself. He's just good at presenting a front, as we know.

56 Mich-again  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:33:21pm

Something to ponder..

If Obama wasn't a politician, he couldn't get a security clearance from the FBI.

57 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:33:24pm

re: #52 Killgore Trout

He congratulates Khalidi for his work saying “Israel has no God-given right to occupy Palestine” plus there’s been “genocide against the Palestinian people by Israelis.”

This is the rumor, and it's damning.

58 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:34:26pm

This taxcutfacts.org commercial Nobama is running is complete bullshit- It claims the conservative Heritage Foudation supports the asshole's bullshit "tax cut" plan and they do not. They sent his campaign a letter asking them to remove the reference to Heritage and the asshole's campaign refused to.

60 bosforus  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:35:22pm

What industry in its right mind would report its own corruption? It's against its own nature. We must become the new truth reporters and expose the lies and failings of the current "journalists" that are entrenched in the current media industry. It must be total revolt against what currently exists able to broadcast to the largest population possible. "CNN", "NBC", "ABC", "AP", etc must be removed from our minds and the minds of the common American as traditional and acceptable sources of reliable information. Their tentacles are deep and well-funded but exposing them will prove to be their end.

61 godfrey  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:35:31pm

re: #52 Killgore Trout

lol

Ayers: Barack, dude, you are the bomb!
Obama: No ha ha ha, Bill, YOU are the bomb!
Ayers: (looking around nervously) Hey, easy there...
Obama: Oh. Right. Sorry.
(pause)
Obama: But you are the bomb, you know.
Ayers: No, you the bomb!
(they laugh)

62 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:36:34pm

I read this comment at another site:

Alexander Sozhenitsyn is an expert.

In his Gulag Archipelago, he explains that even "while they are dragging you away, you will tell yourself it is a mistake. I am innocent. They will let me go. " At what point, then, should one resist? When one's belt is taken away? When one is ordered to face into a corner? When one crosses the threshold of one's home?....

In a famous footnote on page 13 of my addition, he writes: "And how we burned in those camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive....Or if, during periods of mass arrests...people had not simple sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang of the downstairs door...and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand?

"If...If...We didn't love freedom enough... We submitted with pleasure! We purely and simply deserved everything that happened afterward."

Solzhenitsyn says, "Resistance should have begun right there, at that moment of the arrest itself. But it did not begin."

Of course, he is talking about Russia. Here the same thing would have a different style. For instance, in in the Soviet Union you were simply arrested. Here, if you ask one of the super patriot zombies whether you are being arrested, he will say you are not, but you must go along to the camp.

63 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:36:43pm

re: #58 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

That is nervy, no? I belong to Heritage. No way in hell they would endorse anything Obama said. They might even disagree that tomorrow is Thursday.

64 wolfie  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:37:08pm

re: #58 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Can they sue?

65 Mich-again  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:37:14pm

I would like to hear someone ask Obama if he were President would he ever invite his "neighbors" Bill Ayers and Bernadine Dohrn into the White House.

66 WriterMom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:37:34pm

re: #61 godfrey

HAHAHAHAHA

funny

67 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:38:02pm

Maybe Ayers and Obama did a comedy act.(Last time ayers tried that he really bombed )
'How do you get a one armed Judge out of a tree? With a bazooka"

/rimshot


and Khalidi was there dressed as the unknown comic, except he was wearing a balaclava

68 godfrey  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:38:02pm

Rev. Wright will be invited to the Lincoln Bedroom.

On the q.t.

69 WriterMom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:38:56pm

re: #55 godfrey

godfrey, if you want me to stick around, you are gonna have to stop putting The One, tingle and self-tingle in the same post.

70 Mich-again  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:40:12pm

If Obama were to be investigated by the FBI for a security clearance there would be more red flags than a May Day parade in Moscow.

71 Charles  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:41:00pm

re: #42 Dar ul Harb

iPhone News?

Does this mean that long LGF threads won't crash Safari anymore?

The only way to prevent iPhone Safari from crashing on long comment threads would be to install some kind of pagination system. It's a memory issue. The iPhone has limited memory and it gets unhappy when you exceed the limits.

Every time I raise the pagination issue, though, LGF readers get unhappy.

There's no doubt that paginating comments would make it more difficult to follow conversations, and introduce other kinds of continuity problems too. People would respond to something they saw on the first page, only to find out that it was a non-issue by the third page.

I'm still trying to imagine a pagination system that gets around the continuity issue, but it's a real conundrum.

72 HelloDare  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:41:45pm

re: #65 Mich-again

I would like to hear someone ask Obama if he were President would he ever invite his "neighbors" Bill Ayers and Bernadine Dohrn into the White House.

"Hey, Billy, come over Thursday night. Have a blast."

73 MandyManners  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:41:46pm
74 godfrey  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:42:46pm

re: #69 WriterMom

lol

I'm glad I didn't see The One's infomercial. It sounded like a major snooze. What a putz, to blow that kind of cash that way. At least come out and fire things up! For that kind of money, he should've been breathing fire and stomping out every hostile meme in the universe.

He didn't, so it's money wasted.

Which, of course, makes me really happy. Now if he would just go away, permanently.

/off to bed

75 Killgore Trout  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:43:35pm

From Instapundit...
What It Will Take to Build a Rightroots Movement

What will it take to turn this around? If you're a conservative blogger, the question you need to ask yourself is this. Is the main purpose of your blog to express your personal opinion? Or is its primary purpose to build political power for a cause? If you cannot answer yes to the latter, you're probably not going to be comfortable with making the changes necessary to make online conservatism a political force to be reckoned with.

This is not a criticism, but an observation. Most conservative blogs are still stuck in 2003....


Shall we become shills? What say you?

76 godfrey  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:44:01pm

re: #71 Charles

Or, Apple could pump up the iPhone with LGF-ready RAM.

77 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:44:33pm

re: #76 godfrey

Or, Apple could pump up the iPhone with LGF-ready RAM.

iLizard

78 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:44:56pm
79 sharp_discernment  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:45:46pm

Leader dude of Puma is on Fox with Greta....

80 Mich-again  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:46:20pm

Greta interviewing a very excited PUMA. Dude is beaming.

81 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:46:27pm

re: #64 wolfie

Can they sue?

/I'm not a lawyer, nor did I stay at a Holiday Express last night, so I do not know. : )

82 sharp_discernment  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:46:37pm

re: #80 Mich-again

Greta interviewing a very excited PUMA. Dude is beaming.

YAR!

83 godfrey  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:46:41pm

re: #70 Mich-again

Every military guy I talk to is worried and furious about the security clearance issue.

84 MandyManners  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:46:51pm

Check out the role of copper in South America in the 70s.

The demand for that lowly metal changed the face of a hemisphere.

85 Killgore Trout  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:47:19pm

re: #71 Charles

Have you thought about a bare bones version of LGF until after the election? Baybe temporarily ditching avatars and unnecessary graphics might help ease the load.

86 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:47:30pm

re: #71 Charles


I'm still trying to imagine a pagination system that gets around the continuity issue, but it's a real conundrum.

On the other hand, I don't think there's that much continuity in a thread of 800-1000 posts. No one goes back and forth that far.

87 bosforus  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:47:37pm

re: #71 Charles

As one who has commented against pagination whenever it's been brought up I should probably tell you I've compromised a bit on that. Pages of 100-200 comments sits well with me. My biggest objection to pagination is based on the ease of scrolling through comments to follow other posters' conversations. But since the comment number is included in replies, a 100-comment pagination wouldn't be very inconvenient to deal with. Just my two cents.

88 WriterMom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:47:42pm

What is a PUMA?

89 Mich-again  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:47:51pm

re: #83 godfrey


I hadn't really thought of that before. Is it being talked about much?

90 quickredfox  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:47:51pm

I've been using clusty.com as a search engine, typed in Khalidi just now, and the very first thing listed at the top of the page is:

"Sponsored Results
1. Obama and Khalidi Myth - Khalidi Doesn't Advise Barack Obama Barack Obama Fully Supports Israel. - Khalidi.FightTheSmears.com"

It not yet being 8:00 p.m. here in Calif., I suppose I can still catch the Obamamercial, but plan on avoiding it like the proverbial plague. My appreciation to those lizards with tough scales, who have watched it so I don't have to.

That "civilian national security force" is creeping me out. Just what is that supposed to be?

91 lazardo  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:47:52pm

re: #77 Shug

LiZard.

8D

92 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:47:56pm

re: #81 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

/I'm not a lawyer, nor did I stay at a Holiday Express last night, so I do not know. : )

PIMF- Holiday Inn Express

93 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:48:40pm

re: #82 sharp_discernment

YAR!

Pirate talk is verboten.
/

94 MandyManners  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:48:41pm

Dita Beard?

95 Charles  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:48:50pm

re: #75 Killgore Trout

From Instapundit...
What It Will Take to Build a Rightroots Movement


Shall we become shills? What say you?

The question is really: "what is the purpose of blogs?"

I've never believed that my purpose is to shill for one party or another, and that isn't going to change. Patrick Ruffini is a dyed-in-the-wool Republican, so of course he thinks the purpose of blogs is to shill for the party.

I think the only way blogs will ever continue to be credible is if they stay above this crap, and criticize all sides as needed. Left-wing blogs stink because they're nothing more than mouthpieces for the Democratic party.

And I'll shut LGF down before I turn it into a right-wing clone of the Daily Kos.

Sorry, not interested in being that.

96 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:48:54pm

re: #20 Charles

Sure enough, even the "journalists" on Fox News are now closing ranks to defend the Los Angeles Times.

The entire media establishment is corrupt.

It is why I cancelled cable - I hesitated for a moment when I considered that I wouldn't be able to watch FOX - that moment passed when I considered that they gave a show to Huckabee the clown who engaged in class warfare to belittle Romney- and now the cable is gone.

97 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:49:12pm

re: #80 Mich-again

Greta interviewing a very excited PUMA. Dude is beaming.

Might have something to do with this.

98 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:49:35pm

re: #88 WriterMom

What is a PUMA?

Party Unity My Ass- Hillary supporters for McCain.

99 WriterMom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:49:56pm

re: #85 Killgore Trout

Ooh-a little faster would be great. Things are still very slow and I keep getting the dreaded spinning ball all the time...

100 earthwirm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:50:01pm

Lizards. I got an email from Matthew Mosky and I have sent him screen caps and evidence of Obama's loose standards. Here is his email to me. I also copied charles@littlegreenfootballs.com (I hope this is his email).

---


Thanks for your note, Mr. Hall. I would be interested in seeing evidence of the contribution you're describing.


-----James Hall wrote: -----

To: moskm@washpost.com
From: James Hall
Date: 10/29/2008 11:41AM
Subject: Message via washingtonpost.com: Obama credit fraud

James Hall sent the following message:

Obama's team is not scrutinizing contributions made after the fact either. My $5 donation to his campaign as Osama Bin Laden who resided in a cave in Waziristan, occupation Terrorist Leader was processed and applied to my account even though the address I supplied was completely wrong.

I have screen captures of this process and of my bank statement if you would like. Obama is accepting illicit funds for his campaign and if GOP candidate was involved in fraud like this, he would be arrested and thrown into jail. Please update your article, I can provide supporting evidence if you need.

101 guzziguy  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:50:17pm

Party Unity My Ass = Hillary Democrats

102 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:50:53pm

re: #75 Killgore Trout

From Instapundit...
What It Will Take to Build a Rightroots Movement


Shall we become shills? What say you?

I've thought about taking one for the team and getting my teacher's cert to start countering the agitprop spewed in the classroom. Even my nephew gets a load of it at his private Catholic school - real moonbat stuff.

But the thought of spending 15K and a year in those stupid classes with the lowest SAT and GPA bunch of leftards

103 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:51:18pm

Remember signing up back in my day. My mom was born in Liberia. Recruiting sargeant thought I said Libya. Got really strange when he asked me her nationality and I said Canadian. "Immigrated?" said he. Nope, always been a Canadian. "Dual Citizenship?" Eventually got him straightened out.

/Liberia had it in their constitution that Caucasians couldn't be citizens. Naturally devolved back on the parents nationality.

//Still caused a longer then normal security background check though.

104 ciaospirit  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:51:52pm

Audio of Obama saying that the Founding Fathers had "blind spots" and the Constitution reflects the "fundamental flaw of this country that continues to this day."

105 WriterMom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:52:25pm

re: #100 earthwirm

Did you want your name out here...maybe flag that.

106 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:52:38pm

re: #75 Killgore Trout

From Instapundit...
What It Will Take to Build a Rightroots Movement


Shall we become shills? What say you?

I think the approach is all wrong. The movement starts at the real grassroots level- the actual party in local areas, not on the net. If people are displeased with what they see from the party, change must come from boots on the ground. Republicans must get involved with the party- there is no shifting this onto blogs.

107 Mich-again  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:52:50pm

re: #97 Sharmuta

I visited a factory today where I used to work and even some of the rank and file I know were talking up McCain. And like a good salesman knows, once the customer decides to buy, stop talking. So I just nodded and kept quiet.

108 WriterMom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:52:56pm

re: #98 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

thanks

109 Karridine  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:53:22pm

re: #61 godfrey

lol

Ayers: Barack, dude, you are the bomb!
Obama: No ha ha ha, Bill, YOU are the bomb!
Ayers: (looking around nervously) Hey, easy there...
Obama: Oh. Right. Sorry.
(pause)
Obama: But you are the bomb, you know.
Ayers: No, you the bomb!
(they laugh)
Obama: I think about you, Bill...
Ayers: Yeah?
Obama: Yes... (softly) each time I start the car...

110 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:53:57pm

Obama and Ayers are Political Predators. They prey on the vulnerabilities of the ignorant masses who they themselves have enfeebled and demoralized.

Sick, disgusting Political Predators.

111 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:54:08pm

re: #108 WriterMom

thanks

No problem. That's why I get paid the big bucks! : )

112 lazardo  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:54:15pm

re: #106 Sharmuta

I think the approach is all wrong. The movement starts at the real grassroots level- the actual party in local areas, not on the net. If people are displeased with what they see from the party, change must come from boots on the ground. Republicans must get involved with the party- there is no shifting this onto blogs.

I guess the progressive types have something to teach us after all.

113 Mich-again  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:54:57pm

re: #110 DistantThunder

They prey on the vulnerabilities of the ignorant masses

Thats pretty much the definition of demagogue.

114 WriterMom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:55:05pm

re: #111 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

I'll make sure to mention it to my friend at the ZOG payroll department.

115 Killgore Trout  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:55:11pm

re: #95 Charles

I think the only way blogs will ever continue to be credible is if they stay above this crap, and criticize all sides as needed. Left-wing blogs stink because they're nothing more than mouthpieces for the Democratic party.

And I'll shut LGF down before I turn it into a right-wing clone of the Daily Kos.

Sorry, not interested in being that.

You're probably right. Although the polls are tightening, I'm still anticipating an Obama win and there's no telling how the Republicans are gong to react. Future Republican politics may not be some I'm interested in, I assume others might feel the same. It just doesn't make sense to ttry to turn "right wing" blogs into fundraising machines. Readership would evaporate pretty quickly.

116 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:55:35pm

re: #107 Mich-again

I met a young Joe the Plumber the other morning. There are more of us then we've been led to believe, and the same is true of the PUMAs.

117 MandyManners  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:55:37pm

re: #95 Charles

I LOVE YOU, CHARLES!

118 WriterMom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:56:44pm

re: #117 MandyManners

What am I? Chopped LIVAH?

119 ciaospirit  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:56:55pm

re: #103 BlueCanuck

Liberia had it in their constitution that Caucasians couldn't be citizens. Naturally devolved back on the parents nationality.

I never knew that.

120 Charles  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:57:41pm

If Obama wins, there's going to be a big push to get bloggers to sign onto becoming the Daily Right-Wing Kos. And there's going to be an even bigger push to get the GOP to become even more socially conservative, in the misguided belief that "lack of purity" is the reason for the loss.

And they're going to lose me if that happens, just like the Democrats lost me after 9/11.

121 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:57:49pm

re: #106 Sharmuta

I think the approach is all wrong. The movement starts at the real grassroots level- the actual party in local areas, not on the net. If people are displeased with what they see from the party, change must come from boots on the ground. Republicans must get involved with the party- there is no shifting this onto blogs.

It has to be information and education based not just opinion. Each individual has to become conversant in economic theories, and educational theories, and foreign policy theories and their strengths and weaknesses.

We need to read more of the political classics so we are literally on the same page. Most of us have been miseducated by the education system - and so a foundation of essential facts is paramount.

I think Charles is exactly right - forget the allegience to party - it has to be an allegiance to principle based on concrete evidence.

122 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:57:51pm

re: #114 WriterMom

I'll make sure to mention it to my friend at the ZOG payroll department.

What is ZOG?

123 MandyManners  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:57:58pm

re: #104 ciaospirit

Audio of Obama saying that the Founding Fathers had "blind spots" and the Constitution reflects the "fundamental flaw of this country that continues to this day."

WHAT?

124 Mich-again  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:58:51pm

re: #95 Charles

I think the only way blogs will ever continue to be credible is if they stay above this crap, and criticize all sides as needed.

Agreed wholeheartedly. To me the best strategy is keep spreading information and increase the knowledge base of the masses. KIP.

125 SteveC  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 7:59:01pm

I was walking home alone last night, when behind me I heard " BUMP...
BUMP...BUMP..."

So I started walking faster. Looking over my shoulder, I saw this *CASKET* coming down the street after me! It was up on its edge and "walking" like a person would!

It got closer and closer, and the lid started clapping open and closed like it was trying to grab me! So I was *RUNNING* by now, and the thing was keeping up with me!

I got home, ran inside, and locked the door. The casket crashed through the wall! All the time that BUMP BUMP sound, and the occasional SNAP as the lid tried to bite me!

So I ran down the hall into the bathroom, closed and locked that door... and the casket CRASHED THROUGH THE DOOR!

Ok, I was praying to God, Jehovah, Buddah, Pharoh, Isis, EVERYBODY by that time. No where else to go, the casket between me and the door, and only a painted shut window behind me.

I was grabbing things and tossing them. A box of kleenex and rolls of toilet paper didn't hurt a bit. I finally grabbed this bottle of Cough Syrup, wound up like a baseball pitcher, and threw that. The bottle hit the casket and shattered! Cough syrup went everywhere!

And that is when the coffin stopped....

*HAPPY HALLOWEEN, LIZARDS!*

126 TheMatrix31  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:00:08pm

re: #123 MandyManners

WHAT?

There you have it. A major presidential nominee DIRECTLY TRASHING our beloved Constitution.

Someone give me a fucking barf bag.

127 poopeedoo  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:00:30pm

re: #85 Killgore Trout

Have you thought about a bare bones version of LGF until after the election? Baybe temporarily ditching avatars and unnecessary graphics might help ease the load.

What, ditch our avatars? We take pride in our avatars. ;)

128 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:00:49pm

re: #121 DistantThunder

It has to be information and education based not just opinion. Each individual has to become conversant in economic theories, and educational theories, and foreign policy theories and their strengths and weaknesses.

We need to read more of the political classics so we are literally on the same page. Most of us have been miseducated by the education system - and so a foundation of essential facts is paramount.

I think Charles is exactly right - forget the allegience to party - it has to be an allegiance to principle based on concrete evidence.

But the way to bring this to other republicans where it matters is involvement in the party. We don't change the party and bring it back to principles by walking away from it.

129 MandyManners  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:01:03pm

re: #120 Charles

If Obama wins, there's going to be a big push to get bloggers to sign onto becoming the Daily Right-Wing Kos. And there's going to be an even bigger push to get the GOP to become even more socially conservative, in the misguided belief that "lack of purity" is the reason for the loss.

And they're going to lose me if that happens, just like the Democrats lost me after 9/11.

No.

130 Charles  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:01:40pm

And by the way, I'll probably get into trouble for saying this, but this is why I've had zero interest in appearing at CPAC or any of the other Republican events.

I don't trust any politicians, right or left. People who put their trust in politicians will get exactly what they deserve.

132 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:02:51pm

re: #128 Sharmuta

But the way to bring this to other republicans where it matters is involvement in the party. We don't change the party and bring it back to principles by walking away from it.

Will the party let us in...will it seek us out...or will it try to dictate to us. Our collective IQ is greater than that of the party leaders. If John McCain wins, he will be the party leader - and then we've got serious challenges.

133 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:03:29pm

re: #130 Charles

And by the way, I'll probably get into trouble for saying this, but this is why I've had zero interest in appearing at CPAC or any of the other Republican events.

I don't trust any politicians, right or left. People who put their trust in politicians will get exactly what they deserve.


Amen!

134 lazardo  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:04:25pm

re: #123 MandyManners

re: #104 ciaospirit

The full quote, as posted by an Obamaton.

/meaning, no editing but avoid the author's personal commentary if possible.

135 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:05:04pm

re: #130 Charles

And by the way, I'll probably get into trouble for saying this, but this is why I've had zero interest in appearing at CPAC or any of the other Republican events.

I don't trust any politicians, right or left. People who put their trust in politicians will get exactly what they deserve.

Exactly.

136 WrathofG-d  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:05:17pm

re: #120 Charles

If it isn't the Republicans attempt to be Democrats, while the Democrats run to be socialists, that would lose the election for McCain, what say you IS the problem?

137 WriterMom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:05:18pm

re: #122 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

'zionist occupational government', what antisemites think runs the world..running joke here...

138 Cognito  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:05:45pm

re: #130 Charles

And by the way, I'll probably get into trouble for saying this, but this is why I've had zero interest in appearing at CPAC or any of the other Republican events.

I don't trust any politicians, right or left. People who put their trust in politicians will get exactly what they deserve.

Yes indeed. I'd expand that to include the government at large. We certainly need a strong national government, for many reasons -- but there's no need for 'trust.'

139 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:05:58pm

Obama's narcissistic epic is on broadcast TV on the West coast.

30 minutes of this hurl fest?

ARRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!

140 Mich-again  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:06:11pm

re: #120 Charles

To me, anti-idiotarianism is about being loyal to facts, and logic, not to any particular Party.

141 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:06:35pm

re: #120 Charles

If Obama wins, there's going to be a big push to get bloggers to sign onto becoming the Daily Right-Wing Kos. And there's going to be an even bigger push to get the GOP to become even more socially conservative, in the misguided belief that "lack of purity" is the reason for the loss.

I really doubt that this will happen.

If Obama wins, I think the main feeling out there is going to be to make sure that we don't all go down with the socialist ship.

It's mostly America that will be in trouble - NOT the Republican party.

I think this is the main difference between liberals and conservatives. The liberals want to win even if it means losing America in the process. They hate losing and they would rather side with enemies and see America go down the tubes than to see their competition win.

Conservatives want America and Americans to be safe.

It's a huge, huge difference between liberals and conservatives.

I think the main concern if Obama wins will be how to save America and Israel (i.e., Americans and Israelis.) Obama will put us all in danger if he wins.

Also, I think Americans will start hoarding money and/or sending it elsewhere to protect it (depending on how much money individuals have.)

I already know people who plan to hold off on buying things (like new cars and new houses) until they see if the socialist is elected. They want to save themselves from ruin in case he's the one who wins.

Saving the Republican party will be way down on the list, but I think Republicans will end up holding onto each other (as well as faith and guns.)

142 sharp_discernment  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:06:46pm

re: #97 Sharmuta

Might have something to do with this.

And it might also have something to do with this...
[Link: hillbuzz.wordpress.com...]

All speculation of course, but I'll be crossing my fingers - hell, who am I kidding, I'm barely getting any SLEEP these days!

143 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:07:05pm

He's talking about companies spending workers pensions.

WTF about social security?

144 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:07:16pm

I do trust John McCain in one thing - he doesn't have to do what he does as a politician - he's married to a beer heiress. But out of devotion to his country, I believe, he wants to make a positive contribution to help America. I think Mitt Romney felt the same way: He was running because he thought he could be of service to his country.

But when you look at most politicians I realize that they are doing it for ego.

Obama = EGO Biden = EGO Obama's ego demands that he shape the country to fit his image of Utopia.

145 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:08:10pm

Republicans and Democrats suckle on the taxpayers tit.
Both franchises are basically corrupt.

They do what they can to get reelected.

What a disappointment if was for me to see Bush and a republican majority in both houses and yet the government became massively larger, bloated, more liberal, and they did it while preaching conservatism.

they sold out each and every conservative.

I'm not talking about their social agenda. They can stuff that.

I want a government that functions effeciently. That kills my enemy, and otherwise leaves me the Hell alone.


But with the politicians we have, forget it. Not gonna happen

146 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:08:11pm

re: #132 DistantThunder

Will the party let us in...will it seek us out...or will it try to dictate to us. Our collective IQ is greater than that of the party leaders. If John McCain wins, he will be the party leader - and then we've got serious challenges.

Excuse me- I've been working with local republican parties for almost 10 years now. I met with them over the weekend, and I've been speaking with "average" republicans for months now. There are more of us, people who agree with Charles' positions, then you may realize. We are not a force in the party because we're not involved. Those who are involved end up dictating to the rest of us and end up being the voice of the party that the msm and left trash. We don't have to take this. We can get involved and change it from within.

And yes- we can walk right in and don't have to be "allowed" in. Because intelligent, principled republicans don't bother getting involved, I have 2 former BPOUs infested with paulbots and creationists. I can't do this alone- I can't rid the local party of these people by myself. Gee- maybe I should just stay home and let them have their way and wonder why the party is infested with these people?

147 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:08:16pm

Correction:

I think the main concern if Obama wins will be how to save America and Israel (and also Americans and Israelis.) Obama will put us all in danger if he wins.

148 Dar ul Harb  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:08:34pm

re: #71 Charles

A special mobile-only version of LGF perhaps, that is even more highly AJAXified?

Load only part of the thread, and then hit a button in the page to load the next segment. To non-mobile platforms, the thread isn't paginated, and the threads' not really "paginated" on mobile platforms either, just sort of windowed.

I'm imagining something like the spinning reel interface that iCal on the iPhone uses. Flick the thread up and down, and the content is fetched as needed for just the part you're currently looking at.

(I realize this is probably not possible without a dedicated app.)

149 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:08:57pm

re: #139 jcm

Obama's narcissistic epic is on broadcast TV on the West coast.

30 minutes of this hurl fest?

ARRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!


Don't look into this eyes - and Happy Halloween! Welcome to our collective Nightmare.

150 Promethea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:09:56pm

re: #95 Charles

The question is really: "what is the purpose of blogs?"

I've never believed that my purpose is to shill for one party or another, and that isn't going to change. Patrick Ruffini is a dyed-in-the-wool Republican, so of course he thinks the purpose of blogs is to shill for the party.

I think the only way blogs will ever continue to be credible is if they stay above this crap, and criticize all sides as needed. Left-wing blogs stink because they're nothing more than mouthpieces for the Democratic party.

And I'll shut LGF down before I turn it into a right-wing clone of the Daily Kos.

Sorry, not interested in being that.

Charles....I like your blog the way it is. I find your subject choices very interesting, and I learn a lot here. I also read a lot of other blogs with other subject choices. I would hate to see your blog become a political party blog.

151 lazardo  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:10:04pm

re: #71 Charles

The only way to prevent iPhone Safari from crashing on long comment threads would be to install some kind of pagination system. It's a memory issue. The iPhone has limited memory and it gets unhappy when you exceed the limits.

Every time I raise the pagination issue, though, LGF readers get unhappy.

There's no doubt that paginating comments would make it more difficult to follow conversations, and introduce other kinds of continuity problems too. People would respond to something they saw on the first page, only to find out that it was a non-issue by the third page.

I'm still trying to imagine a pagination system that gets around the continuity issue, but it's a real conundrum.

Have you tried browser-type detection? I think the iPhone's version of Safari will have a different "signature" than the desktop versions...

152 WrathofG-d  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:10:14pm

hmmm. guess not. Ok, well me out!

153 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:10:29pm

re: #120 Charles

If Obama wins, there's going to be a big push to get bloggers to sign onto becoming the Daily Right-Wing Kos. And there's going to be an even bigger push to get the GOP to become even more socially conservative, in the misguided belief that "lack of purity" is the reason for the loss.
And they're going to lose me if that happens, just like the Democrats lost me after 9/11.

If the GOP loses, they will need to move to the center, not farther to the right. That will be the way for them to enlarge their tent enough to win. The right wing of the party will have to face up to that reality.
You stick to your guns and let them come to you.

154 sharp_discernment  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:10:54pm

re: #144 DistantThunder

I think he's got a major bone to pick too, like he wants to get revenge on the country he thinks wronged him in some way. I think he hates America as she stands, hence the desire to create his OWN version of it (as you so succinctly pointed out - his own "Utopia").

155 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:11:58pm

Anti-idiotarian transcends political party and it offers an opportunity for moral and intellectual argument from both sides of the divide.

/It could probably use a better name...

156 J.S.  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:12:00pm

re: #120 Charles

An independent stance is always preferable...if you're "in the tank" for any political party, you've sold out...you're "owned."

157 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:12:05pm

re: #120 Charles

If Obama wins, there's going to be a big push to get bloggers to sign onto becoming the Daily Right-Wing Kos. And there's going to be an even bigger push to get the GOP to become even more socially conservative, in the misguided belief that "lack of purity" is the reason for the loss.

And they're going to lose me if that happens, just like the Democrats lost me after 9/11.

I'm one of those "lack of purity" guys, but the offenses were '92 - '96 when the opportunity to beat back the expansion of federal power was wasted. But then I'd be a Paulistinian if he were sane.

socially conservative not socially conservative.... not the fed's purview. should be something democrats and republicans could rally around - everybody go forth and fuck up your own damn state.

158 poopeedoo  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:12:30pm

re: #150 Promethea

Charles....I like your blog the way it is. I find your subject choices very interesting, and I learn a lot here. I also read a lot of other blogs with other subject choices. I would hate to see your blog become a political party blog.

I enjoy reading different points of view (as long as those points are intelligent and not too crass). I believe most of us don't want to hang out in an echo chamber. ;)

159 Charles  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:13:50pm

re: #153 Spare O'Lake

If the GOP loses, they will need to move to the center, not farther to the right.

I agree -- but unfortunately, I'm almost willing to guarantee that's not how it's going to go. There are powerful forces with lots of money who will do their best to push the GOP further to the right. They're already warming up for the effort.

160 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:14:07pm

Testing

161 Cognito  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:14:10pm

re: #153 Spare O'Lake

If the GOP loses, they will need to move to the center, not farther to the right. That will be the way for them to enlarge their tent enough to win. The right wing of the party will have to face up to that reality.
You stick to your guns and let them come to you.

I think you may be right. But Charles may be right as well -- there may be a schism coming for the Republican party. One side pushing for a harder line, one side pushing for more centrism.

I think what the GOP needs is:

1) Failure on the part of the Democrats, as you cannot argue with, or defeat, success. And,

2) A big personality to rise up an take the reigns. Look back on the players the Red Team sent onto the field, back during the primaries -- there wasn't a clear winner, even then.

162 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:14:54pm

Whoa, I'm actually in! Hey all y'all what's going on tonight?

163 Dar ul Harb  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:15:24pm

re: #151 lazardo

Have you tried browser-type detection? I think the iPhone's version of Safari will have a different "signature" than the desktop versions...

I'll just have to note that a guy who can code this entire site and the backend for it probably has some familiarity with the concept of a browser sniff...

/

164 Irene NYC  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:15:38pm

Went to a lecture tonight and spoke with two big name attorneys, both of whom were Columbia grads. So I asked them if they didn't think it strange that Obama was the only recent presidential candidate who had not released his university records.

I wish I had had a tape recorder on me because when they responded I thought I hadn't heard them properly. Attorney #1 said that he had never even considered this - was it even an issue? He went on to say that there was no need for Obama to release his university records because it was obvious to Ivy Leaguers such as himself that Obama was brilliant otherwise he never would have graduated from Columbia and been head of the Harvard Law Review. Attorney #2 concurred with his colleague. So, what've we got here? Two big shot attorneys and both believe that hearsay is better than evidence and both believe that if an Ivy Leaguer says something is true that it is true.

When I responded that it wasn't so obvious to non-Ivy Leaguers such as myself that Obama had stellar academic credentials they responded that I shouldn't worry because everything was going to be fine come next week and that they were really looking forward to finally having a supreme court that would overturn Scalia's opinion on an individual's right to bear arms (and then I got an earful about militias) and how that opinion was really payback for Roe v. Wade because the right was saying to the left, "If you can find the right to abortion in the constitution, well we can then find the right for individuals to bear arms in the constitution."

And here I thought I was going to get away from Obama brain washing by leaving the house and not watching his infomercial.
*sigh*

165 ciaospirit  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:15:47pm

re: #153 Spare O'Lake

If the GOP loses, they will need to move to the center, not farther to the right. That will be the way for them to enlarge their tent enough to win. The right wing of the party will have to face up to that reality.

How will we be able to tell the difference between the two parties?

166 Cognito  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:17:07pm

re: #164 Irene NYC

There's only one solution, Irene: baseball.

167 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:17:52pm

I am a fiscal conservative first and foremost - and that is a rare breed to find in office. I'd like to see us be know as the Most honest, most open, cleanest, most accountable party. I know by comparisons to the Democrats we already beat them in those areas - but I would like to see the brand become even more brazenly ethical.

168 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:17:54pm

re: #159 Charles "There are powerful forces with lots of money who will do their best to push the GOP further to the right."
Well you could certainly be right, but where the hell were those poweful forces with lots of money during this campaign?Were they simply pulling another '06 - teaching the Republican Party a lesson?
And what will they do when McCain wins?

169 J.D.  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:18:34pm

re: #164 Irene NYC

Did Hillary ever produce her thesis? I don't recall seeing it.

170 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:18:49pm

Here's some software you don't need a computer for!

171 Cognito  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:18:59pm

Oh, ha, in No. 161, that should be 'reins,' not 'reigns.'

I've got Obama's looming kingship on the brain.

172 IslandLibertarian  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:19:04pm

re: #154 sharp_discernment

It's not about equality. It's about payback.

173 TheMatrix31  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:19:15pm

LOL Bill Clinton's four points.

Hey Bill, that's EXACTLY why we're scared!

174 lazardo  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:19:41pm

re: #162 realwest

Check #104. I still insist the Founding Fathers weren't so much "blind" as they weren't visionaries of THE FUTURE.

175 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:19:54pm

re: #164 Irene NYC

Wow. Those two idiots sound like they're qualified to be on barry's short list for Appeals court, or SCOTUS

176 itellu3times  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:20:02pm

So what about this TV obamanation tonight? Has it already aired on the east coast? Just seeing it on the west coast. What kind of disgusting, depressing, bilge is this? What nation does this moron live in? Will middle-class voters take it seriously, or be disgusted by it?

If you're not watching, it's like the 50's show, "Queen for a day", in which everyone lined up to tell sob stories, and the worst of the lot got a refrigerator and some luggage. It was finally cancelled in an overwhelming wave of national naseau.

177 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:20:20pm

re: #159 Charles

I agree -- but unfortunately, I'm almost willing to guarantee that's not how it's going to go. There are powerful forces with lots of money who will do their best to push the GOP further to the right. They're already warming up for the effort.

On that one we disagree. The GOP is at the center, the (D)'s left and moving farther.

What we need is a return to classic liberalism, in modern terms a conservative / libertarian model.

Not just right....

Down and to the right.

I agree with you, many of the forces on the right I am uncomfortable with myself. But those are forces to the up and right.

Down and right, that's the direction.

178 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:20:42pm

So does anyone know if this means littleoldlady's gonna be buying celebratory Philly cheesesteaks for us in honor of the Phillies clinching the WS title?

179 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:20:47pm

re: #175 Shug

Wow. Those two idiots sound like they're qualified to be on barry's short list for Appeals court, or SCOTUS

The question is what is he afraid of?

180 Killgore Trout  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:21:08pm

re: #167 DistantThunder

There are very easy and simple ways to make "conservatism" a marketable and appealing philosophy again. I'm saying this as an admitted liberal. It can be done but I'm not sure if conservatives are ready yet.

181 J.D.  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:21:32pm

re: #176 itellu3times

I only saw the last 2 minutes of Obamafest. It was plenty enough for me.

182 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:21:38pm

re: #159 Charles

There are powerful forces with lots of money who will do their best to push the GOP further to the right. They're already warming up for the effort.

If they had the money ready to confront Obama's massive funds and unfair media advantage in this election, I think they would have spent it to keep a socialist from winning.

183 TheMatrix31  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:22:08pm

re: #178 Fenway_Nation

So does anyone know if this means littleoldlady's gonna be buying celebratory Philly cheesesteaks for us in honor of the Phillies clinching the WS title?

A cheesecake-cup, perhaps?

184 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:22:16pm

re: #182 Adina in Judea

If they had the money ready to confront Obama's massive funds and unfair media advantage in this election, I think they would have spent it to keep a socialist from winning.

They don't have that big of a picture, self interest only.

185 Opilio  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:22:26pm

re: #134 lazardo

re: #104 ciaospirit

The full quote, as posted by an Obamaton.

/meaning, no editing but avoid the author's personal commentary if possible.

I listened to both of them, but I'm still missing his point with regards to the fundamental flaw that continues to this day. Maybe I'm just dense. What's he complaining about?

186 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:22:45pm

re: #176 itellu3times

So what about this TV obamanation tonight? Has it already aired on the east coast? Just seeing it on the west coast. What kind of disgusting, depressing, bilge is this? What nation does this moron live in? Will middle-class voters take it seriously, or be disgusted by it?

If you're not watching, it's like the 50's show, "Queen for a day", in which everyone lined up to tell sob stories, and the worst of the lot got a refrigerator and some luggage. It was finally cancelled in an overwhelming wave of national naseau.

It's what all demagogues engage in: Castro would go on for 5 or 6 hours - Hugo goes on for hours at a time. He's "in your face."

187 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:23:05pm

re: #182 Adina in Judea

If they had the money ready to confront Obama's massive funds and unfair media advantage in this election, I think they would have spent it to keep a socialist from winning.

It's hard when only one party agrees to accepting legitimate donations from only US citizens.

188 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:23:15pm

re: #159 Charles

I agree -- but unfortunately, I'm almost willing to guarantee that's not how it's going to go. There are powerful forces with lots of money who will do their best to push the GOP further to the right. They're already warming up for the effort.

The mainstream of the party will probably want to regain power and defeat the Dems badly enough to resist the fringe's desire to veer to the right. At least they always have in the past.

189 Florida Lady  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:23:19pm

re: #169 J.D.

Did Hillary ever produce her thesis? I don't recall seeing it.

Actually, her senior thesis at Wellesley was about Saul Alinsky.

190 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:24:05pm

re: #168 realwest

I wouldn't put it past them.

191 J.D.  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:24:25pm

Are there hundreds of thousands on here or something? I'm growin' old...

192 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:24:37pm

re: #184 jcm

re: #182 Adina in Judea

If they had the money ready to confront Obama's massive funds and unfair media advantage in this election, I think they would have spent it to keep a socialist from winning.

They don't have that big of a picture, self interest only.

Socialism isn't just a big picture. It will affect every single one of us.

Who are these mysterious people who have all this money that could have confronted Obama's massive funding but are waiting to use the money against fellow Republicans to make us more conservative instead?

Do they have names?

193 x-wing  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:25:34pm

re: #178 Fenway_Nation

So does anyone know if this means littleoldlady's gonna be buying celebratory Philly cheesesteaks for us in honor of the Phillies clinching the WS title?

If there's anything left of Philly till morning.

///

194 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:25:43pm

re: #188 Spare O'Lake

The mainstream of the party will probably want to regain power and defeat the Dems badly enough to resist the fringe's desire to veer to the right. At least they always have in the past.

When the party becomes too centrist the far right sits home and pouts.

195 seekeroftruth  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:25:56pm

Charles, this blog and lots of other blogs out there did not start because of politics and I don't see that changing in the future. You have brought issues that are important to you to the forefront, and they are usually issues the MSM ignores, covers up, or out right lies about. You've also tapped into topics and issues that are important to a lot of people, or all of us would not spend way too much time here. : - )
As the MSM falls off the cliff in an effort to answer to the DNC, instead of their customers, they continue leave a big role for the bloggers as the fact checkers, investigators, and even the news reporters. I think you should continue to be true to yourself and cover what you want. It's obviously a very successful choice.

196 J.D.  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:26:27pm

re: #189 Florida Lady

Actually, her senior thesis at Wellesley was about Saul Alinsky.

I'm thinking there's another...

197 itellu3times  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:26:58pm

re: #186 DistantThunder

It's what all demagogues engage in: Castro would go on for 5 or 6 hours - Hugo goes on for hours at a time. He's "in your face."

Don't Americans know better?

Rove was on Hannity today, saying exactly the wrong people would even watch this thing tonight, mostly moonbats and politically interested conservatives, neither of whom would change their opinions. The "undecided" won't turn it on. Dang. I wish everyone would see this crap and act accordingly.

198 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:27:07pm

re: #159 Charles

I agree -- but unfortunately, I'm almost willing to guarantee that's not how it's going to go. There are powerful forces with lots of money who will do their best to push the GOP further to the right. They're already warming up for the effort.

Cannot agree, I think anyway. How much father left can the Dems go?
I'd think the GOP needs a very hard right turn, but I am talking about staying within its constitutional authority. We're at a point where we're arguing over what form of federal subsidy we're going to give for health care - direct transfers or tax credits. Direct transfers shouldn't be on the table. McCain should be arguing for the left against a Ron Paul type.
But then maybe you are talking further to the right socially....again, shouldn't even be discussed at the federal level. not their damn business.

199 Archimedes  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:27:23pm

A point about tax cuts "for the wealthy" versus the middle class.

When you cut taxes for companies (the wealthy), they are much more able to create new products, and thus create new jobs. The new jobs help the "middle class" much more than any tax cut would. Iows, tax cuts on the rich help everyone, especially the middle class. I mean, if you're unemployed what is the point of tax cuts for you?

This point completely crushes Obama's argument.

Also, when men are freer, they are much more able to move out of poverty, or out of the middle class and to higher and higher income levels. Freedom brings prosperity because it unleashes the brain power of the citizenry, each motivated by his own ideas and dreams, whether it be music, or a cure for cancer.

Now, I would like to say that the biggest point over and above that one is that taxation is wrong. A man has the right to his money because he has earned it. This is the vital point, the practical points logically follow from this, because when a man is secure in his life and property he is much better able to survive. This is why rights exist in the first place.

200 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:27:23pm

re: #193 x-wing

I'm surprised there's anything left of Boston after 2004 and last year. Then again, everyone there had some practise with the Patriots....

201 J.D.  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:27:47pm

OK, so now "new comments" doesn't work. Whassup w/that?

202 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:28:03pm

re: #153 Spare O'Lake

If the GOP loses, they will need to move to the center, not farther to the right. That will be the way for them to enlarge their tent enough to win. The right wing of the party will have to face up to that reality.
You stick to your guns and let them come to you.

Yep. Where the hell else are they going to go? Even if McCain wins, there's a swing of the ideological pendulum going on and the GOP will have to catch that swing or wander in the wilderness.

203 J.S.  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:28:11pm

re: #165 ciaospirit

I suspect that if The Zero ever enacts 1/2 of what he's so far proposed, there will be no problem creating a party dedicated to "the center"....(another scenario could be that the Democrats turn sharply Leftist; the Republicans turn hard right (as in a Pat Buchanan -- Paleo-conservative way); then leaving it open to a Third party, of the Center....or The Independents' Party...which would denounce both right and left extremes...)

204 Dasher  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:28:25pm

re: #71 Charles

The only way to prevent iPhone Safari from crashing on long comment threads would be to install some kind of pagination system. It's a memory issue. The iPhone has limited memory and it gets unhappy when you exceed the limits.

Every time I raise the pagination issue, though, LGF readers get unhappy.

There's no doubt that paginating comments would make it more difficult to follow conversations, and introduce other kinds of continuity problems too. People would respond to something they saw on the first page, only to find out that it was a non-issue by the third page.

I'm still trying to imagine a pagination system that gets around the continuity issue, but it's a real conundrum.

Maybe you could add a number of comments per page feature; 50, 100, 200, 500, ALL

205 wright1  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:29:07pm

I watched Hannity & Colmes tonight and Greta because I cannot bear to watch the other stations. I know there are criticizers of Sean Hannity but if we win this election he deserves credit. While some of us find him didactic etc, etc. he is relentless in his pursuit for media fairness. Nobody like him has been as adamant. He is on in NYC on radio and his radio show is certainly more partisan than H & C, but he is fighting the good fight night after night and let me tell you something, Obama hates him. That should tell you something. But the other compliment I give him is this: he believes in what he is saying. He actually calls BHO a liar. That is so, so refreshing. People who think it is all about him have it wrong. I think he is a patriot.

As for Greta, Bill Salmon and Juan Williams were on and while in the past I have liked Salmon, tonight he was absolutely feckless. He sounded like an ivory tower ideologue. Complimenting this BHO infomercial - please. And he is missing the fact how important the Khalidi tape is. Greta also is too soft. If Fox is as rabid as they are alleged to be they should be excoriating every frigging media outlet for bias. But they really have been soft on the subject. This LA Times story is so over the top it is beyond absurd...

For me, Rush, Hannity and Levin are the only ones making any sense. I know I am partisan but even a partisan can see corruption and not call it politics as usual. By the way, there is a reason why Hannity is didactic - because the media refuses to do their job.

206 itellu3times  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:29:13pm

re: #199 Archimedes

A point about tax cuts "for the wealthy" versus the middle class.

When you cut taxes for companies (the wealthy), they are much more able to create new products, and thus create new jobs. The new jobs help the "middle class" much more than any tax cut would. Iows, tax cuts on the rich help everyone, especially the middle class. I mean, if you're unemployed what is the point of tax cuts for you?

Sorry, I don't believe a word of that.

There is a much simpler reason why tax cuts for the rich are a good idea - they are the only ones paying much tax anymore. There's simply nowhere else to cut, and in general, cutting is still a good idea.

207 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:29:28pm

re: #186 DistantThunder

It's what all demagogues engage in: Castro would go on for 5 or 6 hours - Hugo goes on for hours at a time. He's "in your face."

I've seen excerpts from some of Obama's rallies. They aren't rallies where he says something inspiring and everyone cheers.

He's up there talking on and on and on and on while the people behind him on the stage hold their little signs and frozen smiles as if they are sitting in Freshman orientation and being told that one out of three of them will not be at the school a year from now.

Obama likes to hear himself speak and he subjects his audiences to it.

208 TheWasteLand  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:31:14pm

re: #153 Spare O'Lake

If the GOP loses, they will need to move to the center, not farther to the right. That will be the way for them to enlarge their tent enough to win. The right wing of the party will have to face up to that reality.
You stick to your guns and let them come to you.

With respect, when in modern history has the GOP had any electoral success moving to the center? There is a reason the GOP once had a party civil war about "a choice not an echo". It is something conservatives would do well to remember when taking electoral advice.

/ Just my opinion

209 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:31:25pm

re: #195 seekeroftruth

Charles, this blog and lots of other blogs out there did not start because of politics and I don't see that changing in the future. You have brought issues that are important to you to the forefront, and they are usually issues the MSM ignores, covers up, or out right lies about. You've also tapped into topics and issues that are important to a lot of people, or all of us would not spend way too much time here. : - )
As the MSM falls off the cliff in an effort to answer to the DNC, instead of their customers, they continue leave a big role for the bloggers as the fact checkers, investigators, and even the news reporters. I think you should continue to be true to yourself and cover what you want. It's obviously a very successful choice.

I agree. Integrity matters.

210 Intrepid  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:32:39pm

Some interesting news at Wizbang about Florida early voting:

Exit polls show more democrats have voted early, yet McCain is up 49-45 over Obama

211 Cognito  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:32:42pm

re: #207 Adina in Judea


Obama likes to hear himself speak and he subjects his audiences to it.

Whaaat? Have you seen these people praising him like invented the cheeseburger?

He's not subjecting them to anything. They're doing that themselves.

212 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:32:59pm

I think the party needs to remain fiscally conservative, socially- we need to be moderates.

213 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:33:53pm

re: #210 Intrepid

Some interesting news at Wizbang about Florida early voting:

Exit polls show more democrats have voted early, yet McCain is up 49-45 over Obama

GO, PUMAs, GO!

214 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:34:23pm

re: #164 Irene NYC
Hi {Irene } - as the grad of an Ivy League Law school, let me tell you that you were talking to two of Obama's "elitites"; only a true fool would think that there was nothing unusual about Obama being editor-in-Chief of the Harvard Law Review and NEVER having written an article himself or even having edited (with approporiately footnoted "notes") another Scholars's submission to the Law Review.
When I went to my Ivy League law school I was 6 days out of Vietnam and not quite - how to put this - uh, re-socialized to the civilised world - and those two are typical of the types I would run into in the Student Lounge who talked openly about how "socially upwardly mobile" (and use that exact phrase) they were. I'm afraid Elitism isn't created at the Ivies, although they do reinforce it, but it's sort of part and parcel of the folks who go there (I only went cause I got an "early out" from the Army of almost 90 days to attend law school and the one I went to offered me scholarship, and full loan guaranties and was the first law school I applied to and accepted me first, as well).

215 lazardo  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:34:30pm

Off-topic for a bit, gotta love Grand Theft Auto's parody talk radio, equal-opportunity skewerings for all!

Left: "The only thing liberals run in this country is the TV networks!"

Right: Rush Limbaugh much?

216 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:35:07pm

re: #208 TheWasteLand

With respect, when in modern history has the GOP had any electoral success moving to the center? There is a reason the GOP once had a party civil war about "a choice not an echo". It is something conservatives would do well to remember when taking electoral advice.

/ Just my opinion

I agree. I'd rather take my lumps pushing conservatism and booting out the RINO's, than look to rebound by widening the goalposts by watering down the meaning of it.

217 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:36:06pm

The social stuff crosses over into the fiscal stuff - like abortion, (who funds it) like vouchers, like immigration. What else....

218 CapeCoddah  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:36:44pm

Take a look at what Governor Deval Patrick just signed into law in Massachusetts, for this election only..
[Link: www.capecodonline.com...]

219 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:36:54pm

re: #165 ciaospirit

How will we be able to tell the difference between the two parties?

The differences are and will continue to be defined by the right and left wings of the respective parties. The centre of the political spectrum is still a very big place.

220 de La Valette  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:36:59pm

re: #43 karmic_inquisitor

I'm not worried about indivduals blackmailing Obama, but rogue States and other organizations.

Along with the Indonesians, Pakistanis, Cubans, Kenyans, Venezuelans, Syrians, Iraqis, the Chicago Outfit, Soros, FARC, WUO, and any other group with which he has had interactions that he has been less then forthcoming about.

Any of these guys may have damning evidence of something he said or did in his enigmatic past that could ruin his Presidency if released.

221 Karridine  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:37:36pm

re: #199 Archimedes

Now, I would like to say that the biggest point over and above that one is that taxation is wrong. A man has the right to his money because he has earned it. This is the vital point, the practical points logically follow from this, because when a man is secure in his life and property he is much better able to survive. This is why rights exist in the first place.

I see you've spotted 'the fundamental flaw' in the Constitution, Archimedes!

Government can use every individual's money MUCH BETTER than the citizen can. Obama will have government control ALL your our earnings, so EVERYONE BENEFITS by redistributing YOUR wealth to US, THEM, they...

222 maddogg  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:37:46pm

Drudge: Huffington Post writer stabs her lover 222 times with a phillips screwdriver.

223 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:38:09pm

re: #210 Intrepid

Some interesting news at Wizbang about Florida early voting:

Exit polls show more democrats have voted early, yet McCain is up 49-45 over Obama


The're illiterate. Thought they were voting for The One but picked McCain since he's number One on the ballot

Whatever it takes

224 HelloDare  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:38:24pm

re: #213 Sharmuta

GO, PUMAs, GO!

As Austin Powers would say, "MEOW."

225 wright1  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:38:45pm

re: #216 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

I agree. I'd rather take my lumps pushing conservatism and booting out the RINO's, than look to rebound by widening the goalposts by watering down the meaning of it.

As to both comments, Republicans win elections being true to core conservative principles such as what Reagan stood for and even GWB in the beginning before he went off half-cocked behaving like a democrat. Most Americans are conservative. But the heck with that, it is the correct philosophical approach to life and government in my humble opinion.

226 Killgore Trout  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:38:47pm

re: #215 lazardo

GTA iv is out for PC soon. I'm very much looking forward to it.
/Lazlo rules!

227 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:39:06pm

re: #222 maddogg

Drudge: Huffington Post writer stabs her lover 222 times with a phillips screwdriver.

Mental illness defense. "I am a liberal therefore, by my very nature I am unstable, and irrational."

228 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:39:51pm

re: #218 CapeCoddah

Take a look at what Governor Deval Patrick just signed into law in Massachusetts, for this election only..
[Link: www.capecodonline.com...]

McCain, nor anyone else with an "R" after their name, has any chance in MA these days for national offices.

229 Charles  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:40:21pm

If the GOP doesn't move to the center socially, they're going to be out of office for a long long time. It's a violation of the core principles of conservatism to attempt to dictate to other people how they should live.

230 CapeCoddah  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:40:45pm

re: #222 maddogg

Drudge: Huffington Post writer stabs her lover 222 times with a phillips screwdriver.

But...they are such nice people over there, who among them would harbor such rage? I'm shocked!

231 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:40:49pm

re: #227 DistantThunder

Mental illness defense. "I am a liberal therefore, by my very nature I am unstable, and irrational."

She shot herself.

So I predict an acquittal

232 Dasher  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:41:02pm

Charles: Any way to add a timer to the client end of the 'new comments' button? When the endless spin occurs it would be nice to have a graceful exit.

233 maddogg  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:41:17pm

re: #227 DistantThunder

Mental illness defense. "I am a liberal therefore, by my very nature I am unstable, and irrational."

And don't forget, she didn't contribute to gun violence:)

234 Cognito  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:41:27pm

re: #222 maddogg

Drudge: Huffington Post writer stabs her lover 222 times with a phillips screwdriver.

I'm so naive. It took me a second or two, looking at their photos, to say, "Hey... wait a minute..."

235 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:41:37pm

re: #210 Intrepid

Some interesting news at Wizbang about Florida early voting:

Exit polls show more democrats have voted early, yet McCain is up 49-45 over Obama

Palm Beach county democrats will probably elect Pat Buchanan President again.
/

236 sharp_discernment  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:41:50pm

re: #172 IslandLibertarian

It's not about equality. It's about payback.

Right, I mean wrong, I mean RIGHT! :)

ps. I don't know if this comment will post but I'm getting dizzy watching the thingy spin round and round. I'm ready for hypnosis. :|

237 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:41:55pm

LGF is greatest for taking stands on issues without being confined within a particular political party, which I think is wonderful.

Most often the interests of Republicans coincide, but the stands on issues come first (which is indeed, as someone else pointed out, a matter of LGF's integrity.)

238 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:42:03pm

re: #222 maddogg

Drudge: Huffington Post writer stabs her lover 222 times with a phillips screwdriver.

Must have been in a cross mood.

239 CheDub  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:42:05pm

re: #6 Sharmuta

Is there anything an iphone can't do?

It doesn't play Adobe Flash. Well...it could...if Apple would approve the Adobe app to do so.

240 maddogg  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:43:45pm

222 times with a phillips screwdriver, now thats love.

242 itellu3times  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:44:08pm

re: #222 maddogg

Drudge: Huffington Post writer stabs her lover 222 times with a phillips screwdriver.

Lesbian lover, not that there's anything wrong with that.

243 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:44:24pm

re: #217 DistantThunder

The social stuff crosses over into the fiscal stuff - like abortion, (who funds it) like vouchers, like immigration. What else....

I guess I'm talking about things like ID. Things like Joe Gibbs turning the convention into a religious revival. It's harmful to the party when the head of a BPOU turns up at a political meeting asking people if they've been introduced to Jesus. (Yes- this happened.) Things like this make us easy targets for the left and their shills in the msm, and turn people off, even if they really have more conservative leanings then they realize because they don't look at us as viable when we've allowed ourselves to be demonized by the other side.

244 Killgore Trout  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:44:33pm

I know I'm not popular among these lizards these days. Just wait until after the election: those who hate me now will despise me later. Believe it or not, I'm holding back.
Peace, G'nite, namaste

245 Dasher  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:45:03pm

re: #229 Charles

If the GOP doesn't move to the center socially, they're going to be out of office for a long long time. It's a violation of the core principles of conservatism to attempt to dictate to other people how they should live.

Name an attempt conservatives do on how one should live?

How does the left differ. The left tells you what light bulb, what size toilet, what gas mileage your car should get. It wants to allow thuggery to be the norm for union elections.

246 formercorpsman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:45:04pm

I will digress.

I think the Republican party has gone too far left, and has forgotten the base that is actually loyal to them.

My preference would be to go back to Reagan.

Republicans once stood for conservatism. They have decided to move away from some of the very core principles which made this country great.

Some don't like this, my aim is not confrontation. If you lean left, there are plenty of Democrats who have not gone totally socialist, and perhaps might be the future of that party.

I just don't buy the whole notion of the Republican party becoming the Democrat party in order to be successful.

247 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:45:13pm

The route to fiscal conservatism is simple -

Break up congress.

What I mean is to have Representatives and Senators telecommute for most of the 2 year session, with periodic "conclaves" held in different cities.

The problem with Washington is Washington - the place feels powerful and it is very expensive and people get in their pecking orders quickly and try to climb, spending your money to do it.

Decentralize the congress and the way to climb is through good old populism with folks in the district/state and dealing. And it would cost a lot less to run congress.

248 Opilio  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:45:23pm

re: #227 DistantThunder

Mental illness defense. "I am a liberal therefore, by my very nature I am unstable, and irrational."

No defense necessary. The doer shot herself.

249 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:45:45pm

re: #174 lazardo When I let a community organizer lecture ME about the Constitution and the Founding Fathers, I hope one of you will have the decency to shoot me and put me out of my obvious dementia.
Obama's ignorance of the US Constituion and of the Founding Fathers would, PERHAPS, be understandable if he didn't pretend to be a constitutional scholar - Our Founding Fathers KNEW that times and people would change, that's why the made it possible for the PEOPLE to amend the Constitution but so valued it's basic principles, that they deliberately made it HARD to amend the Constitution.
Obama's no more a constitutional scholar than I'm a quarterback in the NFL.

250 wright1  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:45:52pm

Conservatism does not tell people how to live, rather it empowers the individual to achieve all that they are capable of by getting gov't out of their way. Lower taxes, smaller gov't, strong military defense and defense of the constitution as an original static document. No judicial oligarchy. Traditional Family values over secular-progressivism. That means a culture of life. The expansion of capitalism vs. Socialist-progressive policies. These are values of the right not the center.

251 Age Of Freedom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:45:57pm

I have an aversion to Google Earth, even though it's a fantastic product. The map of Israel is entirely spammed by Palestinian zealots (maybe just a couple of guys at best) and converted into that "lost Palestine" they love to mass murder for, based on sources from parallel universes. Google only needs to remove the name "Israel" now that they've managed to secure a status quo of ignoring American memorial and 9/11 days.

Unless they enforce the user based data efficiently, which they don't, I will passionately skip Google Earth.

252 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:46:57pm

Dumb question : Why count 222 holes in somebody who's been murdered?

I mean after 80 or 90, wouldn't you just say " Ok, this person was killed by a crazy person with some rage issues. No need to count every single hole. They're dead whether I count every hole or not"

253 itellu3times  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:47:05pm

re: #250 wright1

Conservatism does not tell people how to live, rather it empowers the individual to achieve all that they are capable of by getting gov't out of their way.

Y'know, back in the day, that was actually called liberalism.

Wonder what happened.

254 Cognito  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:48:24pm

re: #252 Shug

Dumb question : Why count 222 holes in somebody who's been murdered?

I mean after 80 or 90, wouldn't you just say " Ok, this person was killed by a crazy person with some rage issues. No need to count every single hole. They're dead whether I count every hole or not"

It's the medical examiner's job to, well... examine. Maybe someone made all those stab marks to hide some other feature on, or damage to, the victim's body. And so forth.

255 CapeCoddah  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:48:30pm

re: #252 Shug

Dumb question : Why count 222 holes in somebody who's been murdered?

I mean after 80 or 90, wouldn't you just say " Ok, this person was killed by a crazy person with some rage issues. No need to count every single hole. They're dead whether I count every hole or not"

Overtime.

256 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:48:39pm

re: #217 DistantThunder

The social stuff crosses over into the fiscal stuff - like abortion, (who funds it) like vouchers, like immigration. What else....

It shouldn't. They should be arguing about foreign policy, rail width standards, the price of postage, and whether or not Dale Earnhardt is going to be on the 3 dollar bill. We shouldn't be arguing about the fed funding abortion unless you are talking about DC.

Section 8. The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States; but all duties, imposts and excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

To borrow money on the credit of the United States;

To regulate commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states, and with the Indian tribes;

To establish a uniform rule of naturalization, and uniform laws on the subject of bankruptcies throughout the United States;

To coin money, regulate the value thereof, and of foreign coin, and fix the standard of weights and measures;

To provide for the punishment of counterfeiting the securities and current coin of the United States;

To establish post offices and post roads;

To promote the progress of science and useful arts, by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries;

To constitute tribunals inferior to the Supreme Court;

To define and punish piracies and felonies committed on the high seas, and offenses against the law of nations;

To declare war, grant letters of marque and reprisal, and make rules concerning captures on land and water;

To raise and support armies, but no appropriation of money to that use shall be for a longer term than two years;

To provide and maintain a navy;

To make rules for the government and regulation of the land and naval forces;

To provide for calling forth the militia to execute the laws of the union, suppress insurrections and repel invasions;

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the militia, and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States, reserving to the states respectively, the appointment of the officers, and the authority of training the militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

To exercise exclusive legislation in all cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten miles square) as may, by cession of particular states, and the acceptance of Congress, become the seat of the government of the United States, and to exercise like authority over all places purchased by the consent of the legislature of the state in which the same shall be, for the erection of forts, magazines, arsenals, dockyards, and other needful buildings;--And

To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States, or in any department or officer thereof.

257 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:49:02pm

re: #223 Shug

The're illiterate. Thought they were voting for The One but picked McCain since he's number One on the ballot

Whatever it takes

Most states' ballots are arranged alphabetically by last name, which (depending on your state) would put Chuck Baldwin or Bob Barr first.

258 wright1  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:49:10pm

re: #253 itellu3times

Y'know, back in the day, that was actually called liberalism.

Wonder what happened.

Liberalism has always been about subjugating the individual to be a ward of the State in some shape or manner. It is an ideology of dependency - not self-reliance.

259 formercorpsman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:50:02pm

re: #229 Charles

Charles, can I ask a serious question?

In what way is the Republican party dictating how people should live?

Please don't take my question as confrontation, because I am not trying to be. But this could apply to many different aspects of our society, and some arguments on the surface actually have many layers beyond in my opinion.

260 Opilio  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:50:46pm

re: #252 Shug

Dumb question : Why count 222 holes in somebody who's been murdered?

I mean after 80 or 90, wouldn't you just say " Ok, this person was killed by a crazy person with some rage issues. No need to count every single hole. They're dead whether I count every hole or not"

And though the holes were rather small, They had to count them all; Now they know how many holes it takes to fill the Albert Hall.

261 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:52:04pm

re: #220 de La Valette

Any of these guys may have damning evidence of something he said or did in his enigmatic past that could ruin his Presidency if released.

What I wonder is how long it will take for the first ones to turn.

They will all want their spoils, but there is only so much the guy can do before he gets a stink on him that Blue Dog Democrats won't want to touch.

That said, he will have the entire Executive Branch at his disposal with plenty of acolytes at all levels willing to do deeds for the POTUS and advance his interests by playing unfairly, so some of these would be blackmailers may find pulling the trigger hazardous.

I am sure there is a manual in Chicago somewhere that tells a politician how to deal with such situations.

262 Charles  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:52:19pm

re: #245 Dasher

Name an attempt conservatives do on how one should live?

If you haven't noticed that there are factions on the right that want to dictate lifestyles and ideologies, I won't be able to convince you.

263 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:52:33pm

re: #254 Cognito

It's the medical examiner's job to, well... examine. Maybe someone made all those stab marks to hide some other feature on, or damage to, the victim's body. And so forth.


If the body would have been found in Ft Marcy park, clutching a screwdriver, would it have been labeled a suicide ?

264 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:52:47pm

re: #229 Charles

If the GOP doesn't move to the center socially, they're going to be out of office for a long long time. It's a violation of the core principles of conservatism to attempt to dictate to other people how they should live.

Yet abortion matters. Beyond the morality, the way it was legalized by Supreme Court fiat matters.

265 a marine mom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:53:04pm

I thought this was an iPhone thread.

I have had my iPhone since Chanukah 2007. It goes well with all of my outfits and it's just down right cute.

266 Opilio  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:53:04pm

re: #257 gmsc

Most states' ballots are arranged alphabetically by last name, which (depending on your state) would put Chuck Baldwin or Bob Barr first.

Here in McCain's adopted home state of AZ, the ballot order is:

Obama
McCain
Barr
McKinney
Nader

267 Irene NYC  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:53:22pm

re: #258 wright1

Liberalism has always been about subjugating the individual to be a ward of the State in some shape or manner. It is an ideology of dependency - not self-reliance.

That's the direct opposite of classical liberalism. One of the smartest things the left did was preempt our language and terms. And we were too nice to stop them. Talk about stupid.

268 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:53:45pm

Many issues that will have to be addressed in reinventing conservatism, including role of private versus public sector in various spheres of activity, when to regulate or not regulate, what America's role in the world ought to be, and so on.

269 Intrepid  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:53:56pm

re: #257 gmsc

Most states' ballots are arranged alphabetically by last name, which (depending on your state) would put Chuck Baldwin or Bob Barr first.

On the screen when I voted last week, Obama/Biden was first, McCain/Palin was second, and I didn't notice the order after that.

Wonder why they had Obama first?

270 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:54:23pm

re: #247 karmic_inquisitor

The route to fiscal conservatism is simple -

Break up congress.

What I mean is to have Representatives and Senators telecommute for most of the 2 year session, with periodic "conclaves" held in different cities.

The problem with Washington is Washington - the place feels powerful and it is very expensive and people get in their pecking orders quickly and try to climb, spending your money to do it.

Decentralize the congress and the way to climb is through good old populism with folks in the district/state and dealing. And it would cost a lot less to run congress.

I like that idea - keeping them separated and more in touch with the people - instead of forming these unholy alliances.

271 Dasher  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:54:48pm

re: #262 Charles

If you haven't noticed that there are factions on the right that want to dictate lifestyles and ideologies, I won't be able to convince you.

Try this then. Which tries to regulation your life more the right or the left. That should be an easy one.

272 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:54:52pm

re: #266 Opilio

Here in McCain's adopted home state of AZ, the ballot order is:

Obama
McCain
Barr
McKinney
Nader

What's the order they're using? I can see major parties first, then third-parties, but beyond that, I can figure out how that order was determined.

273 x-wing  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:54:53pm

re: #257 gmsc

Most states' ballots are arranged alphabetically by last name, which (depending on your state) would put Chuck Baldwin or Bob Barr first.

Florida does it like Pa., whatever party the Gov. is,is the party at the top. Incumbent or not.

274 lazardo  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:54:54pm

re: #249 realwest

I'm sure they did, but I don't know if they foresaw the interpretations of the Constitution also changing with the times, sometimes limiting or expanding freedom as it did.

275 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:55:01pm

re: #266 Opilio

Here in McCain's adopted home state of AZ, the ballot order is:

Obama
McCain
Barr
McKinney
Nader


here in n Michigan McCain is on top.

(at least until they count the votes)

276 nigella  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:55:12pm

Charles, but the common thought now ,unfortunately, is that Obama is going to win. Is Obama in the center socially?Obama wants to dictate every thing about how we should live. I always say if you're in the middle of the road you're going to get hit.

277 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:55:30pm

I am Republican, I live in San Francisco. So, if I really gave a darn about how other people live, it would stand to reason that I would live somewhere else. I have always been a live and let live type. I have no idea where this perception that Republicans are trying to force others in to some sort of mind set comes from, but I think it is pure BS. To my powers of observation it was always the fucking Democrats that are out to create the Mommy-state. They are the ones telling to wear your motorcycle helmet, buckle your seat belt, stop smoking, wear your condoms, ban the trans fats, ban guns, ban and tax, ban and tax, tax and ban.

For the love of Pete, that is all the Democrats do!

Give me a major league break here.

278 Dasher  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:55:30pm

Oops ' Regulate '

279 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:55:38pm

re: #252 Shug

Dumb question : Why count 222 holes in somebody who's been murdered?

I mean after 80 or 90, wouldn't you just say " Ok, this person was killed by a crazy person with some rage issues. No need to count every single hole. They're dead whether I count every hole or not"

That's easy...because it feels good to keep doing it..and she was on a roll.

If it feels good ...do it.

280 maddogg  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:55:45pm

Personally, as far as the House and Senate are concerned, I would just as soon clean house and toss ALL the bums out, start over with a clean slate. Put in term limits to keep moss from growing on their asses and brains.

281 RememberSekhmet?  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:56:26pm

I've been waiting to get an iPod Touch---a lot of the same cool stuff and people can't cal you on it. Besides, I name my iPods, and have always wanted one named "I Touch Myself."

282 Charles  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:58:18pm

re: #276 nigella

Charles, but the common thought now ,unfortunately, is that Obama is going to win. Is Obama in the center socially?Obama wants to dictate every thing about how we should live. I always say if you're in the middle of the road you're going to get hit.

I'm not defending Obama or the Democrats. I'm saying that both sides are way too invested in forcing their social issues down people's throats.

283 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:58:31pm

re: #277 rawmuse

I am Republican, I live in San Francisco. So, if I really gave a darn about how other people live, it would stand to reason that I would live somewhere else. I have always been a live and let live type. I have no idea where this perception that Republicans are trying to force others in to some sort of mind set comes from, but I think it is pure BS. To my powers of observation it was always the fucking Democrats that are out to create the Mommy-state. They are the ones telling to wear your motorcycle helmet, buckle your seat belt, stop smoking, wear your condoms, ban the trans fats, ban guns, ban and tax, ban and tax, tax and ban.

For the love of Pete, that is all the Democrats do!

Give me a major league break here.

Whatever happened to that SF garbage idea that was getting so much press a while back? I understand they wanted to implement a law requiring you to sort your garbage in a particular way, and if you didn't, you could be fined, with the strongest punishment being cessation of garbage pick-up (not a smart idea in a city where almost everyone lives on a hill).

284 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:58:40pm

re: #262 Charles

If you haven't noticed that there are factions on the right that want to dictate lifestyles and ideologies, I won't be able to convince you.

That's very true, and I agree with on that point. The authoritarians on the conservative pollute conservatism.

285 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:59:10pm

re: #280 maddogg

Personally, as far as the House and Senate are concerned, I would just as soon clean house and toss ALL the bums out, start over with a clean slate. Put in term limits to keep moss from growing on their asses and brains.

I think that could be very dangerous given your unusual form of democracy in the US, with its division of executive and legislative branches. Experienced members of Congress are the glue and the continuity that keeps your system on target, IMHO.

286 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:59:10pm

re: #229 Charles

If the GOP doesn't move to the center socially, they're going to be out of office for a long long time. It's a violation of the core principles of conservatism to attempt to dictate to other people how they should live.

Correct. but the Dems need to move way way to the right and stop dictating how we live as well. Roe v Wade is just the biggest example of them inflicting their principles in arena where they have no business - federally.
They need to stay out of my education, health care, car, guns, booze, smokes, trans-fat, bong, implants, wages, profits, losses, investments, retirement, mortgage, ....*breathe*...... my lawn, my building codes, my land use, yadda yadda yadda

287 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:59:18pm

re: #283 gmsc

Whatever happened to that SF garbage idea that was getting so much press a while back? I understand they wanted to implement a law requiring you to sort your garbage in a particular way, and if you didn't, you could be fined, with the strongest punishment being cessation of garbage pick-up (not a smart idea in a city where almost everyone lives on a hill).


but they keep the human garbage

288 Dasher  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:59:32pm

re: #280 maddogg

Personally, as far as the House and Senate are concerned, I would just as soon clean house and toss ALL the bums out, start over with a clean slate. Put in term limits to keep moss from growing on their asses and brains.

Way back in 1993-1994 when Republicans were trying to gain control of the house, I was at a meeting where term limits were being discussed. I made a comment that as soon as the Republicans gain the majority they would be against term limits. I was severely chastised, but, in the end that is what happened except for a very few who self limited there terms.

289 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:59:54pm

re: #281 RememberSekhmet?

I've been waiting to get an iPod Touch---a lot of the same cool stuff and people can't cal you on it. Besides, I name my iPods, and have always wanted one named "I Touch Myself."

Why would you ever name something "I Touch Myself"?
;)

290 lazardo  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 8:59:57pm

Lunch time...then heading off to college. BBL.

291 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:00:17pm

Youtube of Obama on "National Civilian Security Force".

Seems he has brought this one up more than once.

292 M. Bensson-Levi  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:01:17pm

re: #252 Shug

They don't actually count the holes, per se. They count the straws

293 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:01:25pm

re: #283 gmsc

Yeah, well they lost that one. Once you put your garbage out on the street, you have no control over what the other sacred cows (aka homeless) do with it.
I personally sued them over that nonsense. That is the problem, until they get a letter from an attorney, it never gets on the radar screen.

And BTW, I have no problem with CONSERVATION. I recycle, reuse, buy thoughtfully. Why? Because I am CHEAP!

And landfills aren't.

294 Promethea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:01:26pm

re: #237 Adina in Judea

LGF is greatest for taking stands on issues without being confined within a particular political party, which I think is wonderful.

Most often the interests of Republicans coincide, but the stands on issues come first (which is indeed, as someone else pointed out, a matter of LGF's integrity.)

Plus, I don't always know what I should think about certain issues, and reading all the comments gives me lots of ideas....which, unfortunately, I don't get in my real life, since I am surrounded by moonbats who don't have any ideas, just ritualistic mantras. :-(

295 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:01:52pm

We need to be a party of individual rights, fiscal responsibility and transparency on the part of the government.

296 maddogg  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:02:17pm

re: #285 Moe Katz

I think that could be very dangerous given your unusual form of democracy in the US, with its division of executive and legislative branches. Experienced members of Congress are the glue and the continuity that keeps your system on target, IMHO.

The constitution is the glue that holds the system on target, or should be. Those SOBs get to Washington and start going to parties and feeling like "important people" and forget all about the rubes who sent them there and why they were sent there. Term limits would give them focus.

297 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:02:26pm

re: #277 rawmuse

I am Republican, I live in San Francisco. So, if I really gave a darn about how other people live, it would stand to reason that I would live somewhere else. I have always been a live and let live type. I have no idea where this perception that Republicans are trying to force others in to some sort of mind set comes from, but I think it is pure BS. To my powers of observation it was always the fucking Democrats that are out to create the Mommy-state. They are the ones telling to wear your motorcycle helmet, buckle your seat belt, stop smoking, wear your condoms, ban the trans fats, ban guns, ban and tax, ban and tax, tax and ban.

For the love of Pete, that is all the Democrats do!

Give me a major league break here.

I think this gay marriage ammendment might have something to do with this perception, but it is really a defensive moves that preserves free association, instead of doctors being forced to inseminate lesbians against their principles, or adoption agencies forced to adopt to same sex couples against their beliefs and better judgment.

You'll notice that there are no movements to ban S&M or things that people do in the privacy of their own homes by the right - but once it is injected into the public sphere, like the Up Your Alley street fair - then I think it becomes legitimate issue.

298 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:02:47pm

re: #208 TheWasteLand

With respect, when in modern history has the GOP had any electoral success moving to the center? There is a reason the GOP once had a party civil war about "a choice not an echo". It is something conservatives would do well to remember when taking electoral advice.
/ Just my opinion

I am not an expert in modern history.
But hasn't the history of American politics been the struggle by each of the mainstream parties to occupy enough of the centre-right and centre-left, respectively, to win - while still keeping their respective identities?

299 CheDub  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:02:50pm

re: #271 Dasher

Try this then. Which tries to regulation your life more the right or the left. That should be an easy one.


Well you're both right. There are factions on the right that want to dictate the lives of others, but for the most part they're ignored. And admittedly, to a certain degree I don't mind the Christian who wants to keep "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance as opposed to the leftist who wants to control my thoughts through PC speak.

300 itellu3times  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:03:27pm

re: #258 wright1

Liberalism has always been about subjugating the individual to be a ward of the State in some shape or manner. It is an ideology of dependency - not self-reliance.

The founding fathers were "liberal" in that they wanted everyone left alone, following the model of the 13 (different) colonies. Somewhere in the early nineteenth century, the usage started to change.

Before that time, coercive regimes were NOT called liberal!

301 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:03:31pm

re: #282 Charles

I'm not defending Obama or the Democrats. I'm saying that both sides are way too invested in forcing their social issues down people's throats.

We will see how the aftermath goes, but I may just start calling myself a Libertarian after this election. I have never agreed with a party completely, and the Ls are nuts on some things, but the heart is in the right place in my book. I used to wonder why someone would go Libertarian when there is a perfectly good Republican Party.

302 Syrah  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:04:59pm

re: #295 Sharmuta

We need to be a party of individual rights, fiscal responsibility and transparency on the part of the government.

!

303 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:05:22pm

re: #262 Charles

If you haven't noticed that there are factions on the right that want to dictate lifestyles and ideologies, I won't be able to convince you.

You're talking about ID, right?

It's not the entire Republican party.

As far as trying to dictate lifestyles, I don't see conservatives asking for people to be kept from living in any legal way they want to live.

I do see some Americans (and not just Republicans) objecting to the idea that we're all supposed to be forced to see homosexuality as no more different from heterosexuality than being left handed is differnt from being right handed.

I think this is something people have to be allowed to decide for themselves (as to whether or not they think homosexuality is like being left handed.) Trying to force acceptance of this on the nation isn't really fair.

304 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:05:42pm

re: #297 DistantThunder

You are talking about Prop. 8? And is it possible that you think Democrats did not help get that one on the ballot? Since when is this a Republican issue?

I voted no. But if it passes, it will pass with a hell of a lot of Democrat votes. You know why? Because there just aren't that many Republicans left in CA. to have that much influence.

305 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:05:48pm

re: #95 Charles

"The question is really: 'what is the purpose of blogs?' "

I would hope the purpose of blogs would be to proclaim liberty and promote freedom.

"Shill" sounds so cold, especially as winter approaches.

306 itellu3times  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:06:11pm

re: #208 TheWasteLand

With respect, when in modern history has the GOP had any electoral success moving to the center?

Eisenhower?

But even Nixon moved to the center for the general election.

One might argue about Bush41.

Or even Bush43's "compassionate conservatism", remember that?

We were so much younger then, ...

307 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:06:18pm

re: #246 formercorpsman
Hey there my friend. You know, back in 1964 there was a HUGE split in the Republican party between the Nelson Rockefeller/Jacob Javits Republican (and more liberal) wing of the party and the Barry Goldwater wing of the party. Goldwater won out and got CREAMED in the general election (though to his credit, I will say that I think Barry Goldwater was one of those rare - VERY RARE - politicians who didn't lie - he campaigned in St. Petersburgh Florida and told retirees why he was against social secuirty; he campaigned in Tennessee and other places and preached against the Tennessee Valley Authority and one incredulous reporter asked him why he didn't switch that around - complain about social security to the folks in Tenn and complain about the TVA to folks in St. Petersburg and - remember this was on live TV - Barry said "That would be dishonest. What I'm proposing about social security directly affects those retirees and that's why I talk to them about it). Privatizing (that wasn't the word he used, but it's what he meant) the TVA affects the folks in Tenn and those other areas and that's why I talk to them about it." And he actually looked at the reporter as if the reporter was crazy - why should he be dishonest!
That schism between the Goldwater or Conservative wing of the Republican Party and the Rockefeller wing wasn't really healed over until Reagan won - and - as is obvious - it was a thin bandaid indeed.

308 nigella  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:06:22pm

Charles, I understand where you're coming from. We as humans all have our own idea of what is "correct". I try to go by what I feel are some good guidelines. Being older,59, I'm probably a little less "hip" then some of you younger folks.I never try to dictate how someone else should live their lives. I just feel sometimes that political correctness has us being forced to accept things we feel are not particularly in the best interests of our Country.I don't care how you live your life, just don't expect me toagree with it.

309 a marine mom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:06:43pm

re: #275 Shug

here in n Michigan McCain is on top.

(at least until they count the votes)

I hear that the state of Michigan has run out of money for unemployment recipients. Is that true?

310 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:07:08pm

re: #296 maddogg

The constitution is the glue that holds the system on target, or should be.

The constitution really says nothing about policy, it's only a set of ground rules. There's nothing wrong with experienced legislators who can guide the system with their experience and knowledge. Without them the system could so easily founder.

311 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:07:17pm

re: #302 Syrah

So simple, it's crazy, huh?

312 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:08:26pm

re: #295 Sharmuta

We need to be a party of individual rights, fiscal responsibility and transparency on the part of the government.

Updinged for being a great ideal.

Any party should, but the problem for all political parties comes when a stance on a particular pet issue overrules the general ideals. At that point, they've done little more than admit they're willing to abandon ideals for political gain.

314 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:09:08pm

Women worry about the damnest things.

My wife's knee surgery went very poorly, leaving her unable to take more that a half-dozen steps at a time. She is, for all practical purposes now, bedridden. (We've another procedure scheduled as soon as she heals up some that we've higher hopes for. All is not lost.)

So I get her into the shower, get her clean, put her back into bed and go to get her some hot chocolate before sleep. I come back in with the chocolate and there are tears in her eyes again. I thought that I'd hurt her in the process, and asked what was wrong, what could I do?

She was crying because she thought that she wouldn't be able to get to the polls to vote. I told her, "Bullsh*t, you'll get there if I have to carry you on my back."

Lord love a duck. With all the things she could be crying over, what a damnfool thing to worry about.

But, at least she's still involved in the outside world.

315 gman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:09:09pm

The rabid religious right (not the centrist) wants to dictate people's lives to keep the "devil" from encroaching on their turf. It's just as bad as any mommy-state lefty as far as I'm concerned.

316 nigella  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:09:15pm

Just read what I wrote. I didn't mean Charles specifically, just people in general. (Did that sound like I was kissing up?)

317 Griffon  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:09:22pm
On the screen when I voted last week, Obama/Biden was first, McCain/Palin was second, and I didn't notice the order after that.

Wonder why they had Obama first?

Alphabetized by first names?

318 maddogg  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:09:54pm

I say the country would be a Hellova lot better off if we rounded up all those damn Californians immigrating and fucking up perfectly good states like Colorado and Texas and sent them back to Californication. Build a wall along the state line and quaranteen the place to prevent their stupidity from infecting the rest of the country. Then look northeast...

319 Promethea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:10:09pm

re: #251 Age Of Freedom

I have an aversion to Google Earth, even though it's a fantastic product. The map of Israel is entirely spammed by Palestinian zealots (maybe just a couple of guys at best) and converted into that "lost Palestine" they love to mass murder for, based on sources from parallel universes. Google only needs to remove the name "Israel" now that they've managed to secure a status quo of ignoring American memorial and 9/11 days.

Unless they enforce the user based data efficiently, which they don't, I will passionately skip Google Earth.

Google Earth re Israel is a joke. In fact, I keep my toothbrush in a cup made in recent times as a tourist gimcrack in one of the few older Arab sites from the earlier times in Israel (Hisham Palace). But it's fun to use for other places, so don't avoid it just yet.

320 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:10:14pm

re: #315 gman

The rabid religious right (not the centrist) wants to dictate people's lives to keep the "devil" from encroaching on their turf. It's just as bad as any mommy-state lefty as far as I'm concerned.

For example? I'll settle for one. One example. Out with it.

321 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:10:22pm

re: #269 Intrepid
I think they list candidates in order of which political party has the most registered voters - but that's just a guess on my part.

322 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:10:40pm

re: #309 a marine mom

I hear that the state of Michigan has run out of money for unemployment recipients. Is that true?


I hadn't heard one way or the other.
I 've been too busy watching wall to wall Kwame Kilpatrick

323 Dasher  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:11:07pm

re: #301 karmic_inquisitor

... I used to wonder why someone would go Libertarian when there is a perfectly good Republican Party.

I consider my self a pro-life libertarian, I have only voted once for a libertarian though. And that was way back in 1996. Most real libertarians are to far out there (drugs) for me.

The Democrats or the left, basically want to regulate the life out of any thing that moves.

If I were king I would eliminate the most of the cabinet positions, and the bureaucracies that go with them. End US involvement in the UN, Kill the Dept of Education for starters.

324 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:11:07pm

re: #312 gmsc

Updinged for being a great ideal.

Any party should, but the problem for all political parties comes when a stance on a particular pet issue overrules the general ideals. At that point, they've done little more than admit they're willing to abandon ideals for political gain.

And do you know how the platforms are shaped/altered?

By involvement from party members.

I know- I managed to alter my state party's platform from the floor of the state convention. Of course- that would not have happened without my being involved.

325 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:11:17pm

In Presidential elections, the Democrats always try to help their chances by pretending to be more on the right than they actually are.

This is because roughly 60% of the country identifies as being conservative (no matter which party they have joined.)

Republicans don't need to move to the left. That road would go nowhere.

McCain is closing the gap in this election in spite of the vast funding and incredible campaigning of the MSM in Obama's favor.

This situation isn't a problem for conservatism.

Obama used these tactics against his own party, too.

326 CheDub  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:11:31pm

re: #301 karmic_inquisitor

We will see how the aftermath goes, but I may just start calling myself a Libertarian after this election. I have never agreed with a party completely, and the Ls are nuts on some things, but the heart is in the right place in my book. I used to wonder why someone would go Libertarian when there is a perfectly good Republican Party.

I've usually considered myself a libertarian and agree that the party does attract some, well, let's say interesting characters. But yes, overall they're message coincides with my ideas: Provide national defense to protect us from outside threats, make judgments when it comes to inter-state issues, then leave most items to the state level and leave me the f**k alone. Something along the lines of Reagan's 9 scariest words in the english language.

On a ride rant, I've never understood why we put so much weight on the President when it comes to domestic issues. That should be the job of Congress and the states. It doesn't seem realistic to expect 1 person to know how to solve the problems of 300million people. It's only when we talk to the rest of the world that we need to have a single, unifying voice. And I simply don't see 0bama having the balls to do that.

327 Griffon  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:11:32pm

re: #280 maddogg

Personally, as far as the House and Senate are concerned, I would just as soon clean house and toss ALL the bums out, start over with a clean slate. Put in term limits to keep moss from growing on their asses and brains.

And limit those huge pensions they get. Who else gets a huge pension for working 2 years.

328 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:11:41pm

re: #303 Adina in Judea

There are plenty in the Evangelical Christian movement (full disclosure, I consider myself evangelical) who would like to legislate their vision of Biblical morality.

Where I diverge with them is that it's not a legislative matter, it's a matter of spiritually conversion, done one on one. Those who sign on to my view of morality do so willing, not through coercion of government.

329 gman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:11:46pm

re: #320 rawmuse

For example? I'll settle for one. One example. Out with it.

banning same- sex marriage

330 ggt  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:11:53pm

Hello Night Lizards! It wasn't too bad today in Near Iowa.

So, since Lizards are (usually) cold-blooded, what do you do to keep warm at night?

How are you-all and what, as if I have to ask, are we talking about?

331 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:12:00pm

re: #314 razorbacker

God Bless her !

332 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:12:15pm

re: #285 Moe Katz

I think that could be very dangerous given your unusual form of democracy in the US, with its division of executive and legislative branches. Experienced members of Congress are the glue and the continuity that keeps your system on target, IMHO.

You Sir, are incorrect. That is what the Senate is supposed to be for. That's why they serve 6 years instead of only two.

But our system was intended to be one where individuals came to the seat of power for a limited time, then returned home to resume making a living.

It's not worked out that way, admittedly.

333 formercorpsman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:12:40pm

re: #307 realwest

I understand that history RW, and some of it makes sense.

Others have actually opined in defense of the socially conservative structure of the party, and quite well in my opinion.

It would appear to me, numerous social positions could be alluded to, but there are obviously some that take precedent over others.

Again, I think this could discussed in an adult manner, with differing points of view, but it always seems to devolve into arguments.

It is getting late, and I'm about to head out.

334 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:13:34pm

Uhhh ... If folks want an example of the right imposing itself on others, Terry Schaivo comes to mind.

Here we are, a group of people who say that no one is better to make tough decisions about family matters but the family itslef. We also talk about rule of law.

Well there was a case where the rule of law (family law) dealt with conflict within a family, and the ultimate decision was a family member who had the best position to know Terry Schaivo's intent.

So what happened? A freaking circus around "sanctity of life".

Well no shit - life is precious, but life is never black and white. Should we, a mass of remotely interested parties, make that decision for the rightful family member?

If the answer is "yes" then don't ever lecture people on the evils of big government.

I know Schaivo is a third rail issue, but people asked for an example, and that one is clear as day.

335 ggt  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:13:43pm

re: #323 Dasher

The drug thing get's me with the Liberatarians also.

336 maddogg  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:13:50pm

re: #310 Moe Katz

The constitution really says nothing about policy, it's only a set of ground rules. There's nothing wrong with experienced legislators who can guide the system with their experience and knowledge. Without them the system could so easily founder.

The guys who wrote the Constitution and set up the government had not spent 30 years in office collecting graft and barnacles on their asses. And I think they did a pretty fair job. Do you think the current crop of miscreants could do as well?

337 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:14:10pm

re: #329 gman

banning same- sex marriage

Prop. 8 in CA. was put on the ballot by BOTH parties. You had to collect signatures to put in on the ballot. There is no way in hell all those signatures were from nothing but Republicans.

I call bullshit.

338 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:14:20pm

ACORN Update! I just got the call- we found over 200 fraudulent registrations!

339 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:14:22pm

re: #332 razorbacker

You Sir, are incorrect. That is what the Senate is supposed to be for. That's why they serve 6 years instead of only two.

But our system was intended to be one where individuals came to the seat of power for a limited time, then returned home to resume making a living.

It's not worked out that way, admittedly.

I meant Congress in the sense of both houses Senate and House of Representatives, not just the House. Sorry for the ambiguity. Not so sure about your assertion that professional politicians were not envisioned in the original framing of your system of government.

340 opinionated  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:14:52pm

re: #120 Charles

If Obama wins, there's going to be a big push to get bloggers to sign onto becoming the Daily Right-Wing Kos. And there's going to be an even bigger push to get the GOP to become even more socially conservative, in the misguided belief that "lack of purity" is the reason for the loss.

And they're going to lose me if that happens, just like the Democrats lost me after 9/11.

As a confessed bitter Giuliani supporter, as we get ever closer to an Obama Presidency, if I wasn't crying I would laugh at how they savaged Giulaini because he wasn't pure on those most crucial of issues, guns, gays and abortion.

Issues totally irrelevant in this general election.

They cheered when Giuliani was gone. Someone look, are they still cheering?

Iowa is less then just four years away, my bet is they learned nothing.

341 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:15:12pm

re: #331 Shug

God Bless her !

Thank you. She'll a fiesty little thing. We'll be okay eventually.

342 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:15:14pm

re: #325 Adina in Judea

In Presidential elections, the Democrats always try to help their chances by pretending to be more on the right than they actually are.

This is because roughly 60% of the country identifies as being conservative (no matter which party they have joined.)

Republicans don't need to move to the left. That road would go nowhere.

McCain is closing the gap in this election in spite of the vast funding and incredible campaigning of the MSM in Obama's favor.

This situation isn't a problem for conservatism.

Obama used these tactics against his own party, too.

Hate to nit-pick, but nit-pick I must- 60% consider themselves conservative or somewhat conservative. This is why America is a center-right country.

343 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:15:29pm

re: #315 gman

The rabid religious right (not the centrist) wants to dictate people's lives to keep the "devil" from encroaching on their turf. It's just as bad as any mommy-state lefty as far as I'm concerned.

There are a few (only a few) social issues that the far religious right considers worthy issues that invade thier politics (abortion, creationsim in schools, certain aspects of sex education).

But a leftist mentality wants to control almost all aspects of lift, from habits (smoking, drinking, eating fatty foods) to how you spend your money (the government will share it for you).

I don't see the the similarity. Please expound on you position.

344 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:15:42pm

re: #314 razorbacker

Wheelchairs can be rented for a fairly small price.

Please get your wife a wheelchair (even if it's only for outside use.)

I've had family members laid up with broken bones.

An outside wheelchair for a few months does wonders.

Best wishes to you and your wife!

P.S. As for indoors - you can get a narrow office chair on wheels for not much money at Office Max or one of those places. If you don't put the arms on a small version of this chair, it can fit through almost any door (if you get the really small office chairs.)

I saw this on a TV show about a paraplegic. It works in small spaces.

345 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:16:15pm

re: #308 nigella

Charles, I understand where you're coming from. We as humans all have our own idea of what is "correct". I try to go by what I feel are some good guidelines. Being older,59, I'm probably a little less "hip" then some of you younger folks.I never try to dictate how someone else should live their lives. I just feel sometimes that political correctness has us being forced to accept things we feel are not particularly in the best interests of our Country.I don't care how you live your life, just don't expect me toagree with it.

And that's the point of Prop 8. In Massachusettes a case came before the court in which a family wanted the choice of opt-ing out of the family life module that dealt with same sex families presented to their kindergartener. They were told that because gay marriage was legal - they had no opt-out option. So they fought it and lost. But it is that kind of socio-political imposition against the will of the parents that is so disturbing. No one I know gives a second thought as to whether Ellen marries Portia de Rossi - but then there is major blowback directly into our families through the schools - and through businesses and churches that are forced to deal with things that they would rather not.

One of the suits that was brought by a lesbian couple was against a counselor who did not have the expertise to deal with gay relationships. She referred them to someone - as she was ethically required to do - to someone who did have that expertise - and she was sued successfully for discrimination.

346 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:16:30pm

re: #332 razorbacker

You Sir, are incorrect. That is what the Senate is supposed to be for. That's why they serve 6 years instead of only two.

But our system was intended to be one where individuals came to the seat of power for a limited time, then returned home to resume making a living.

It's not worked out that way, admittedly.

should be a requirement that elected officials have at least started and kept the doors open on a business as small as a coffee cart for at least 3 years before taking office.

347 gman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:16:35pm

re: #337 rawmuse

Prop. 8 in CA. was put on the ballot by BOTH parties. You had to collect signatures to put in on the ballot. There is no way in hell all those signatures were from nothing but Republicans.

I call bullshit.

You're right, the rabid religious right could care less about gay marriage.

/

348 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:17:44pm

I got a robocall from Sen. John Coryn (R-TX) earlier today asking me to vote for him. I live in Missouri.

349 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:17:44pm

re: #335 ggt

The drug thing get's me with the Liberatarians also.

They lose me there too.
I've had too many foster kids who's sole reason for being in the system was the parents drug use.

350 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:18:21pm

re: #336 maddogg

The guys who wrote the Constitution and set up the government had not spent 30 years in office collecting graft and barnacles on their asses. And I think they did a pretty fair job. Do you think the current crop of miscreants could do as well?

Well that's a cynical view of politicians that I've heard in the US and Canada ad nauseam and I don't buy it. At least experienced politicians are competent. Newbies have to learn from someone. And as far as corruption is concerned, I'd rather be led by someone that knew she was doing and was sticking a few bucks in her bra than by a saintly schoolteacher or minister that was above temptation but had never managed anything more advanced than a church rummage sale.

351 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:18:42pm

re: #347 gman

You're right, the rabid religious right could care less about gay marriage.

/

Just ask Larry Craig

352 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:18:48pm

re: #328 jcm

There are plenty in the Evangelical Christian movement (full disclosure, I consider myself evangelical) who would like to legislate their vision of Biblical morality.

Well, it's not going to happen.

I'm sure they realize this.

The Republican party doesn't need to stop doing something it's not doing.

353 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:18:55pm

re: #347 gman

You're right, the rabid religious right could care less about gay marriage.

/

My point is that the "rabid religious right" are not confined to the Republicans.
You have no idea of the type of Democrats that I grew up with in South, who were truly right-wing (think Gov. Wallace).

Those people did not go away.

354 Dasher  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:19:34pm

I would be in favor of term limits of them for both the house and the senate, no more than 12 years for either one. 6 terms for house, 2 for senate.

I used to be against them because I really liked my Senator, and current congresswoman, but over the years, I have found that new ones, just as good come along pretty regularly.

355 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:19:45pm

re: #330 ggt


So, since Lizards are (usually) cold-blooded, what do you do to keep warm at night?

How are you-all and what, as if I have to ask, are we talking about?

Night shift checking in here as well. ggt, on those cold, cold nights in Canuckistan I usually use extra blankets, polar fleece, and hot fluids. Soups, teas, hot chocolate, grog, you know, the good stuff.

/I only go outside for essentials and work. :)

356 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:20:15pm

Is Murtha gonna lose?

357 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:20:36pm

re: #324 Sharmuta

And do you know how the platforms are shaped/altered?

By involvement from party members.

I know- I managed to alter my state party's platform from the floor of the state convention. Of course- that would not have happened without my being involved.

So, it's OK to be a party concerned for individual rights/fiscal responsibility and transparency, and also OK if enough members vote to take a particular stance that overrides individual rights or fiscal responsibility in one area?

(Of course I know you don't mean that. I'm trying to clarify what I said in my earlier message.)

All I'm saying is that conflicts like those are at the heart of the drift of just about any political party from their ideals.

358 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:20:42pm

re: #320 rawmuse
Um, well, let's see: the "Rabid Religious Right" wants to dictate gay marriage or if you prefer civil unions. Oh, and of course Abortion. And, uh, teaching Intelligent Design in science classes in taxpayer funded schools.

359 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:20:54pm

re: #347 gman

You're right, the rabid religious right could care less about gay marriage. /

Big fucking deal. So, if something gets on a state ballot, and it passes, then guess what? It's becuase a majority of people wants it.

But a leftist mentality wants to control almost all aspects of life, from habits (smoking, drinking, eating fatty foods) to how you spend your money (the government will share it for you).

I bet you could find 10 times as many nanny propositions that the left wants to be made law than ANY religiously influenced agenda.

360 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:21:12pm

re: #337 rawmuse

Prop. 8 in CA. was put on the ballot by BOTH parties. You had to collect signatures to put in on the ballot. There is no way in hell all those signatures were from nothing but Republicans.

I call bullshit.

At least prop 8 is in the proper venue at the individual state level. the fed only has a role when it comes to the full faith and credit issue so when I can carry in all 50 states with my OR or FL CHL, I'll care.

361 Opilio  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:21:58pm

re: #272 gmsc

What's the order they're using? I can see major parties first, then third-parties, but beyond that, I can figure out how that order was determined.

I looked it up, and discovered Arizona Revised Statutes § 16-502 (E)

E. The lists of the candidates of the several parties shall be arranged with the names of the parties in descending order according to the votes cast for governor for that county in the most recent general election for the office of governor, commencing with the left-hand column. In the case of political parties which did not have candidates on the ballot in the last general election, such parties shall be listed in alphabetical order below the parties which did have candidates on the ballot in the last general election.
362 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:22:07pm

re: #328 jcm

Absolutely right. It has to be willingly of the individual.
Otherwise it isn't real, isn't owned of the individual.
Otherwise it is mere legalism, the very opposite of a true Christian faith.

363 gman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:22:09pm

re: #343 Walter L. Newton

There are a few (only a few) social issues that the far religious right considers worthy issues that invade thier politics (abortion, creationsim in schools, certain aspects of sex education).

But a leftist mentality wants to control almost all aspects of lift, from habits (smoking, drinking, eating fatty foods) to how you spend your money (the government will share it for you).

I don't see the the similarity. Please expound on you position.

I grew up under the umbrella of the rabid religious right. I know perfectly well how they want adherence to their group paradigm. If you don't toe the line you are not part of the circle. Questioning group thinking is not permitted and is considered blasphemous. It's the "church" versus the "materialistic" world which is seen as being under the control of the devil.

364 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:22:35pm

re: #344 Adina in Judea

We live in the country, hill country. No sidewalks, no pavement. We'd need an all terrain wheelchair. I know they make them, but they're frightfully expensive.

And the designers of our home put in 26" doorways to the baths. I'll change them, but it's going to take some time. Can't even get a walker through them right now.

Trust me, these things have become a concern far faster than we thought they would.

365 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:22:46pm

re: #340 opinionated

As a confessed bitter Giuliani supporter, as we get ever closer to an Obama Presidency, if I wasn't crying I would laugh at how they savaged Giulaini because he wasn't pure on those most crucial of issues, guns, gays and abortion.

Issues totally irrelevant in this general election.

They cheered when Giuliani was gone. Someone look, are they still cheering?

Iowa is less then just four years away, my bet is they learned nothing.

The main thing was to get the Republican base excited.

Sarah Palin did this.

Support from the base was absolutely necessary in this election.

Obama has had gazillions of dollars and almost full MSM co-campaigning complicity, but the Republican base had to be connected to the Republican ticket to get as far as the ticket has gotten up to this point. Nothing else would have worked.

366 formercorpsman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:22:47pm

re: #347 gman

gman, you did see the vice presidential debate when both were asked about supporting gay marriage?

Both sides were against it.

Both were also amenable to something in principle, which allowed for nearly all of the privileges allowed to married couples, minus calling it marriage.

What would be your reasoning to label only the right wing on this?

367 maddogg  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:23:21pm

re: #350 Moe Katz

Well that's a cynical view of politicians that I've heard in the US and Canada ad nauseam and I don't buy it. At least experienced politicians are competent. Newbies have to learn from someone. And as far as corruption is concerned, I'd rather be led by someone that knew she was doing and was sticking a few bucks in her bra than by a saintly schoolteacher or minister that was above temptation but had never managed anything more advanced than a church rummage sale.


Well we will just have to disagree. I prefer an inexperienced person of intelligence and character over a competent crook. The job isn't that difficult if morons like Harry Reid and Murtha can do it.

368 Intrepid  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:23:29pm

Government computer checks on Joe the Plumber more intensive than was first reported

They started running these checks the day after the last debate and were sanctioned by Helen Jones-Kelley, director of the Ohio Department of Job and Family Services.

The checks were run after the news media reported that Wurzelbacher was considering buying a plumbing business with more than $250,000 in annual income, Jones-Kelley wrote.

"Given our understanding that Mr. Wurzelbacher had publicly indicated that he had the means to purchase a substantial business enterprise, ODJFS, consistent with past departmental practice, checked confidential databases ," she wrote.

"Not surprisingly, when a person behind in child support payments or receiving public assistance is receiving significant media attention which suggests that the person appears to have available financial resources, the Department risks justifiable criticism if it fails to take note and respond," Jones-Kelley wrote.

Wow. Just...wow.

369 jeremy0114  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:23:51pm

Politicians raise social issues on both sides to stir up emotion in people, and stirred up people get out their checkbook.

Abortion, Creationism, Affirm Action, Gun rights, all cash cows for politicians trying to fleece money out of people.

That is why those issues will never be solved. Too much cash at stake.

Personally, I don't care about any of them, save for gun rights. That is actually in the constitution, unlike the rest of the aforementioned gobbitleygook.

370 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:24:20pm

re: #356 Shug

Is Murtha gonna lose?

He's already lost.

Now the election, I don't know about that.

371 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:24:23pm

re: #358 realwest

Um, well, let's see: the "Rabid Religious Right" wants to dictate gay marriage or if you prefer civil unions. Oh, and of course Abortion. And, uh, teaching Intelligent Design in science classes in taxpayer funded schools.

But, RW, are those issues official planks of the Republican Party?
That is what I am trying to clarify.
Abortion, yes. I personally think each one is a tragedy, and I don't wish to be party to it, as a taxpayer. It is one thing to object to something, another to COMPEL you to be party to it via the State.

372 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:24:38pm

re: #368 Intrepid

Government computer checks on Joe the Plumber more intensive than was first reported

They started running these checks the day after the last debate and were sanctioned by Helen Jones-Kelley, director of the Ohio Department of Job and Family Services.

Wow. Just...wow.

Big Brother.

373 gman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:24:59pm

re: #359 Walter L. Newton

Big fucking deal. So, if something gets on a state ballot, and it passes, then guess what? It's becuase a majority of people wants it.

But a leftist mentality wants to control almost all aspects of life, from habits (smoking, drinking, eating fatty foods) to how you spend your money (the government will share it for you).

I bet you could find 10 times as many nanny propositions that the left wants to be made law than ANY religiously influenced agenda.

When you go to extremes a funny thing happens- convergence

374 CheDub  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:25:15pm

re: #349 jcm

They lose me there too.
I've had too many foster kids who's sole reason for being in the system was the parents drug use.

Agreed. The "I do it in my house, so it doesn't affect anyone else" argument is BS. Either other people (children) in the house suffer or the person decides to leave the house and cause trouble because the hallucinations told them to.

375 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:25:24pm

re: #333 formercorpsman
Well heck, I hope you don't head out on my account, I ENJOY discussing matters in an adult fashion.
I think both major political parties basic precept can be summarized these days as "what do we have to do or say to get elected?" That is, what do the MAJORITY of Americans want out of our government. That's not exactly a philosophical basis for a political party, but it's actually worked pretty well MOST of the time, ya know?

376 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:25:32pm

re: #371 rawmuse

But, RW, are those issues official planks of the Republican Party?
That is what I am trying to clarify.
Abortion, yes. I personally think each one is a tragedy, and I don't wish to be party to it, as a taxpayer. It is one thing to object to something, another to COMPEL you to be party to it via the State.

Exactly. It becomes an issue for me when I have to fund it.

377 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:25:55pm

re: #334 karmic_inquisitor

A freaking circus around "sanctity of life".

You should not conflate a court issue in the republic to the morality of the culture of life.

378 Alberta Oil Peon  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:25:59pm

re: #238 Moe Katz

Must have been in a cross mood.

Obviously wasn't really torqued, though.

379 stevieray  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:26:05pm

re: #338 Sharmuta

ACORN Update! I just got the call- we found over 200 fraudulent registrations!

Great job! Give us details!

380 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:26:26pm

re: #367 maddogg

Well we will just have to disagree. I prefer an inexperienced person of intelligence and character over a competent crook. The job isn't that difficult if morons like Harry Reid and Murtha can do it.


That's a Canadian Conservative (Tory) tradition. A little patronage here, a little graft there, but just judge us on the economic health of the country.

381 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:26:29pm

re: #368 Intrepid

The lie to her statement is in the implications of that last paragraph--because Joe has custody of his son! How can he be suspected of being behind in child support payments when he's the one who has custody? This doesn't wash.

382 gman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:26:45pm

re: #366 formercorpsman

gman, you did see the vice presidential debate when both were asked about supporting gay marriage?

Both sides were against it.

Both were also amenable to something in principle, which allowed for nearly all of the privileges allowed to married couples, minus calling it marriage.

What would be your reasoning to label only the right wing on this?

not the right wing, the rabid religious right wing

383 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:26:51pm

re: #361 Opilio

Now there's a heckuva weird way to order them!

I guess if it works for Arizona, though, and it hasn't caused any problems, there's probably no need to change.

384 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:26:54pm

Two things:

About my work on outing ACORN fraud in my Congressional district- this opportunity would not have been possible for me without having worked with the republicans I worked with on this for years. They knew they could count on me to help.

About changing my state party platform- I proposed this change at my BPOU convention- it was voted on by the people there and was passed on to the CD convention. At the CD convention, it was voted on and passed on to the state convention. At state- it was killed in committee. When I learned of this, my only option was to raise the issue from the floor. When the section of the platform my proposal was involved with came up, I went to the microphone and told the entire state delegation what I thought we should do. The chair asked me "why", so I stated I didn't think it was incumbent upon the taxpayers to provide this and the party should stand for making it the law. I received thunderous applause for a proposal the state platform committee tried to kill. It was put to a floor vote and passed without a single "nay".

Both of these came about because of involvement in the party.

385 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:26:56pm

re: #378 Alberta Oil Peon

Obviously wasn't really torqued, though.

THANK GOD SOMEONE GOT IT!

386 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:27:05pm

re: #364 razorbacker

We live in the country, hill country. No sidewalks, no pavement. We'd need an all terrain wheelchair. I know they make them, but they're frightfully expensive.

And the designers of our home put in 26" doorways to the baths. I'll change them, but it's going to take some time. Can't even get a walker through them right now.

Trust me, these things have become a concern far faster than we thought they would.

Do you guys have a car?

I was thinking more about using a wheelchair to get to a car so that you could go to places like stores and election polling centers.

As for the 26 inch doorways - there are small office chairs that are less than 26 inches wide (especially if you leave off the arms.)

Using a very small office chair on wheels does work for getting into bathrooms.

Best wishes!

387 x-wing  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:27:23pm

re: #356 Shug

Is Murtha gonna lose?

Hope so. Hot Air has an article that Pelosi is sending buckets of money to help him.

/crossing fingers, cause I can't vote for Russell

388 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:27:35pm

re: #363 gman

I grew up under the umbrella of the rabid religious right. I know perfectly well how they want adherence to their group paradigm. If you don't toe the line you are not part of the circle. Questioning group thinking is not permitted and is considered blasphemous. It's the "church" versus the "materialistic" world which is seen as being under the control of the devil.

So what. That's with in the church community. Show me some law that the rabid religious right has put into effect nationwide.

Are you suggesting that these sort of religious communities should be outlawed?

Sure, there are some really radical religious sects. And you may have been part of that, but you sound like you are equating all evengelicals with the type of people you had the displeasure of growing up with.

And I don't have a dog in this fight, I'm an atheist. But you are being unreasonable, actually a bit dishonest. The way you feel does not mean your opinions are actual reality.

389 formercorpsman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:27:55pm

re: #375 realwest

True, but some of these issues also raise conflict within the Constitutionality of implementation.

Whether or not we want something out of our government sometimes runs contrary to established law, and legal precedent.

390 opinionated  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:28:11pm

re: #365 Adina in Judea

The main thing was to get the Republican base excited.

Sarah Palin did this.

Support from the base was absolutely necessary in this election.

Obama has had gazillions of dollars and almost full MSM co-campaigning complicity, but the Republican base had to be connected to the Republican ticket to get as far as the ticket has gotten up to this point. Nothing else would have worked.

I disagree. I predicted before McCain choose a VP that if his choice excites the SoCons, he would lose the election.

Notwithstanding her unexpected genuinely exciting convention speech which caused a post mortem reflex of support, I believe her pick was the beginning of the end.

Palin does not get McCain a single vote he wouldn't otherwise have and not a single electoral vote.

391 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:28:20pm

re: #368 Intrepid

Some one asked me if I ever wanted to be a politician. Due to my vocal views, and opinions. I not only said no, I said HELL no. I could not put myself under that kind of microscope.

392 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:29:13pm

re: #387 x-wing

Hope so. Hot Air has an article that Pelosi is sending buckets of money to help him.

/crossing fingers, cause I can't vote for Russell

I can't wait to see ex congressman Murtha fighting the marine lawsuits.

How quickly his friends in powerful places will drop him like 3rd period French

393 Syrah  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:29:19pm

re: #311 Sharmuta

So simple, it's crazy, huh?

I went to the Lucy Exhibit at the Seattle Pacific Science Center today.

Fascinating stuff. Worth the ticket price.

The exhibit was split pretty evenly between the the Paleontological artifacts concerning Lucy and the history of Ethiopia.

It was an exercise in perspective.

The history of Ethiopia Spanning several thousand years and the bones of a creature that was nearly 4 million years old.

So much is in reality, very ephemeral, existing for but a fleeting moment in a vast expanse of time and history.

394 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:29:43pm

re: #384 Sharmuta

About changing my state party platform- I proposed this change at my BPOU convention- it was voted on by the people there and was passed on to the CD convention. At the CD convention, it was voted on and passed on to the state convention. At state- it was killed in committee. When I learned of this, my only option was to raise the issue from the floor. When the section of the platform my proposal was involved with came up, I went to the microphone and told the entire state delegation what I thought we should do. The chair asked me "why", so I stated I didn't think it was incumbent upon the taxpayers to provide this and the party should stand for making it the law. I received thunderous applause for a proposal the state platform committee tried to kill. It was put to a floor vote and passed without a single "nay".

You're not only a fireball online, you're a fireball offline, too! YGG!

395 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:29:46pm

Who is it banning guns? Democrats
Who bans trans fats? Democrats
Who wants you stop smoking and will ban you from doing so, even in your own home or your own car? Democrats
Who wants to shut down talk radio? Democrats
Who wants to force you to drive little match box cars? Democrats
Who is it that put all the "hate crime" laws on the books? (btw, the same ones I predict that they will try to enforce on this site) Democrats
Who is that wants to tax you for driving during rush hours? Democrats

Need I go on, here?

396 solomonpanting  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:29:51pm

How did this AP article get published?


By CALVIN WOODWARD, Associated Press Writer
Obama's prime-time ad skips over budget realities

Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama was less than upfront in his half-hour commercial Wednesday night about the costs of his programs and the crushing budget pressures he would face in office.
Obama's assertion that "I've offered spending cuts above and beyond" the expense of his promises is accepted only by his partisans. His vow to save money by "eliminating programs that don't work" masks his failure throughout the campaign to specify what those programs are — beyond the withdrawal of troops from Iraq.


Looks like Calvin Woodward will be out of a job soon.

397 formercorpsman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:30:04pm

re: #382 gman

I'm sorry, I don't understand your answer.

Don't take it as me defending the rabid religious right, (because I can relate with what you said earlier, I have a couple of real religious idiots in my extended family as well)

398 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:30:06pm

Love to listen to late night AM talk shows.

Jerry Doyle is on right now making some good sense:
He asks When do you take risk? In a good economy. In a bad economy you get very conservative. You don't take chances. You go with McCain. You don't take the risk of an unknown. You don't vote for the 0.

I like that line of argument.

399 ggt  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:30:48pm

I found this interesting. (Yes, it's a shameless spin-off plug)

Romes Greatest Gift to the Modern World.

Not one reference to health care.

I've been ruminating on the concept of "Legal Realism". As I understand it, the latest version or ruling on an issue, is the one that get's applied. Earlier versions are considered outdated.

What scares me is that Sharia law works on this basis --the most recent interpretation is the one that is law. (I can't remember the reference in which I learned this, so I can't link it. It was a C-SPAN book interview. )

Our ancestors died to give us and protect the Constitution for us. I think we owe it to them to pass it on, intact to our children.

400 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:31:34pm

re: #374 CheDub

No such animal as a victimless crime. There's always a victim even if it's the one commiting the crime.

401 Promethea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:31:39pm

re: #277 rawmuse

I am Republican, I live in San Francisco. So, if I really gave a darn about how other people live, it would stand to reason that I would live somewhere else. I have always been a live and let live type. I have no idea where this perception that Republicans are trying to force others in to some sort of mind set comes from, but I think it is pure BS. To my powers of observation it was always the fucking Democrats that are out to create the Mommy-state. They are the ones telling to wear your motorcycle helmet, buckle your seat belt, stop smoking, wear your condoms, ban the trans fats, ban guns, ban and tax, ban and tax, tax and ban.

For the love of Pete, that is all the Democrats do!

Give me a major league break here.

Republicans always gave me the impression (via the MSM) that they were for "traditional moral values" like male supremacy and wearing a tie. (Just joking here, but that was my impression.) What turned my views was the Democrat traitorous behavior during the war in Iraq. There is NO EXCUSE for promoting defeat against Islamofascism and terrorism.

I also noted that the abortion issue has taken over political thought. Why is that? As a person who has always supported abortion, one might think that I would be a Democrat. But I see clearly how the Democrats have used this issue to foster the idea of "judicial review," i.e. circumventing Congress (the will of the people) for a dictatorship of nine old people.

Sorry, the abortion issue is about number #112 on my list of important issues. Therefore, I've become a non-Democrat just over this simple issue of judicial review and responding to the Islam cult and to terrorism.

I'm not explaining myself clearly, cuz it's late. But it turns out that I'm more a libertarian and a states' righter than I ever dreamed possible. The federal government needs to be reined in NOW. They've just wasted $700 billion because they were so busy lining their nests. They need to be smacked down ASAP. That makes me a "Republican" like you.

402 Dasher  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:32:01pm

re: #364 razorbacker

They have a medical device kind of like a scooter, with a platform on it that is adjustable in height. One rests there calf on the platform to remove weight from the knee. The scooter has a handles like a regular one to navigate with. The guy I leased a car from had one, He was recovering from foot surgery, but I think it would work as well for knees.

403 gman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:32:08pm

re: #388 Walter L. Newton

So what. That's with in the church community. Show me some law that the rabid religious right has put into effect nationwide.

Are you suggesting that these sort of religious communities should be outlawed?

Sure, there are some really radical religious sects. And you may have been part of that, but you sound like you are equating all evengelicals with the type of people you had the displeasure of growing up with.

And I don't have a dog in this fight, I'm an atheist. But you are being unreasonable, actually a bit dishonest. The way you feel does not mean your opinions are actual reality.

What about the intelligent design movement?

404 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:32:33pm

Anyone catch Comedy Central tonight? Radio news says the 0 is continuing to slough off the charge of being a socialist by talking about how he shared toys in kindergarten. Very weak.

405 maddogg  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:32:47pm

re: #395 rawmuse

Who is it banning guns? Democrats
Who bans trans fats? Democrats
Who wants you stop smoking and will ban you from doing so, even in your own home or your own car? Democrats
Who wants to shut down talk radio? Democrats
Who wants to force you to drive little match box cars? Democrats
Who is it that put all the "hate crime" laws on the books? (btw, the same ones I predict that they will try to enforce on this site) Democrats
Who is that wants to tax you for driving during rush hours? Democrats

Need I go on, here?

No, you pretty well covered it. Don't forget 55 mph speed limits and seat belt laws (I never wear them, because the government should not be in the business of protecting me from myself)

406 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:33:01pm

re: #350 Moe Katz
Uh,

I'd rather be led by someone that knew she was doing and was sticking a few bucks in her bra than by a saintly schoolteacher or minister that was above temptation but had never managed anything more advanced than a church rummage sale.


Ya mean - gender to one side here - like Barry Obama?!

407 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:33:32pm

re: #390 opinionated

I disagree. I predicted before McCain choose a VP that if his choice excites the SoCons, he would lose the election.

Are you talking about the current election?

Do you really think that if McCain had chosen Romney or Huckabee that the entire election would have been different (with Obama NOT getting gazillions of questionable campaign contributions with the MSM almost entirely on his campaign staff?)

Do you think that this has had nothing to do with how the election has gone?

Notwithstanding her unexpected genuinely exciting convention speech which caused a post mortem reflex of support, I believe her pick was the beginning of the end.

Ok, you're NOT talking about this election, obviously.

I guess there is a parallel universe out there somewhere with a different election.

Palin does not get McCain a single vote he wouldn't otherwise have and not a single electoral vote.

Say hi to your parallel universe for me.

408 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:33:38pm

re: #386 Adina in Judea

Best wishes!

Thank you. Presently I simply drive up to the back door and manually load her up. Convention wheelchairs simply cannot navigate the terrain. Most all larger stores have those little electrically powered chairs for shopping.

When they're not all in use by 400+ pound folks too heavy to walk, that is.

Again, we are going to be okay. Don't worry about us. I'm kind of sorry that I mentioned it, now.

409 sharp_discernment  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:33:40pm

OT
I'm passing this on from Hillbuzz. Man, they are some INDUSTRIOUS people! I always find inspiration there. I wish I lived in Cali, I'd be all over it going hoarse and waving signs old school style. Pass it on if you can. It looks like the LAT isn't budging. Embarrassing them publicly is the next logical step. BTW....those dudes in W. Hollywood took the Palin effigy down...[Link: elections.foxnews.com...]

Our voices were heard.


PROTEST TOMORROW!
10 AM LOS ANGELES TIMES!
202 WEST 1ST STREET
LOS ANGELES, CA 90012

RELEASE THE TAPE RALLY!

[Link: www.poorrichardsalmanac.biz...]

Good night All :)

410 Opilio  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:34:03pm

re: #390 opinionated

Palin does not get McCain a single vote he wouldn't otherwise have and not a single electoral vote.

BZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzttttt.

No, I'm sorry, incorrect, but thanks for playing...

411 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:34:41pm

#395 rawmuse

Who bans trans fats? Democrats

Head & Shoulders' Marketing Dept. has more effectively ridiculed trans fat bans than any political ad I've ever seen.

412 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:34:50pm

re: #406 realwest

Uh,


Ya mean - gender to one side here - like Barry Obama?!

I was thinking of some Canadian examples of my own experience, but the shoe does seem to fit, doesn't it? :)

413 nigella  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:34:54pm

Adina in Judea, if I could I would give you two pluses! Amen

414 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:35:29pm

The ID movement should be bitch slapped back in to the dark ages where it belongs. I oppose any effort to make that idiocy identified with the Republican party. I write letters, I do what I can.

But, ultimately, people are free to decide whatever the heck they want, and why is that? Because they are FREE people.

415 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:35:29pm

re: #394 gmsc

Yeah- the chairman was a little flabbergasted.

And not only did I receive no "nay" vote, I was the ONLY amendment to the platform to pass from the floor.

416 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:35:42pm

re: #404 The Archivist

Anyone catch Comedy Central tonight? Radio news says the 0 is continuing to slough off the charge of being a socialist by talking about how he shared toys in kindergarten. Very weak.


Of course he'd share them. It's not like he worked to earn the money to buy the toys.

He's been willing to share the fruits of somebody else's labor for over 40 years.

417 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:36:49pm

re: #408 razorbacker

Again, we are going to be okay. Don't worry about us. I'm kind of sorry that I mentioned it, now.

Oh, sorry - I didn't mean to make you feel uncomfortable.

I've had family members improvise when someone is laid up, that's all.

It's helpful!

The neatest thing is that you're there for her, though!

418 Racer X  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:37:03pm

re: #364 razorbacker

We live in the country, hill country. No sidewalks, no pavement. We'd need an all terrain wheelchair. I know they make them, but they're frightfully expensive.

And the designers of our home put in 26" doorways to the baths. I'll change them, but it's going to take some time. Can't even get a walker through them right now.

Trust me, these things have become a concern far faster than we thought they would.

Check into electric scooters. There a few available that will fit through a narrow doorway when a walker will not.

Good luck!

419 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:37:32pm

I think the tu quoque is not going to further our cause.

420 opinionated  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:37:32pm

re: #407 Adina in Judea

Say hi to your parallel universe for me.

I believe McCain's chances would be better with Romney, and much better with Giuliani .

Palin killed McCain's most potent argument against Obama- an argument the media could not easily dismiss or ridicule- that he was too inexperienced to be President.

421 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:37:50pm

re: #404 The Archivist

Anyone catch Comedy Central tonight? Radio news says the 0 is continuing to slough off the charge of being a socialist by talking about how he shared toys in kindergarten. Very weak.

Whose toys did he share?

422 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:37:52pm

re: #413 nigella

Thanks! :)

423 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:38:05pm

re: #403 gman

What about the intelligent design movement?

Big whoop. It's not a federal law, is it? The are only a few states that include it in it's state educational programs.

But waht about seat belts? What about all kind of standards on automobiles? What about smoking being outlawed in just about every public venue in this country.

Look, I'm sorry you got smacked by the minister a few too many times when you were growing up, but equating the radical religious right with the obscene nannyism of the left is as dishonest as saying Christiananity is a dangerous as radical Islam.

Can you say Rosie McDonald?

424 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:38:29pm

re: #415 Sharmuta

Hmmm, I think I will put on the my list right under Mandy of people not to piss off. ;)

/how's the eeyore hunting tonight?

425 ggt  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:38:32pm

re: #349 jcm

Drugs make you stupid. It's insane to spend billions on education, just to allow the brain to rot over time do to drug-use. A drugged brain is also an "easy-to-lead" brain. Makes no sense if a person is truly a liberatarian to want legal drug use.

Anarchist, maybe.

426 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:38:40pm

re: #417 Adina in Judea

The neatest thing is that you're there for her, though!

I made her a promise a long time ago.

I keep my promises. That's why I don't make many.

427 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:38:49pm

re: #384 Sharmuta

Two things:

About my work on outing ACORN fraud in my Congressional district- this opportunity would not have been possible for me without having worked with the republicans I worked with on this for years. They knew they could count on me to help.

About changing my state party platform- I proposed this change at my BPOU convention- it was voted on by the people there and was passed on to the CD convention. At the CD convention, it was voted on and passed on to the state convention. At state- it was killed in committee. When I learned of this, my only option was to raise the issue from the floor. When the section of the platform my proposal was involved with came up, I went to the microphone and told the entire state delegation what I thought we should do. The chair asked me "why", so I stated I didn't think it was incumbent upon the taxpayers to provide this and the party should stand for making it the law. I received thunderous applause for a proposal the state platform committee tried to kill. It was put to a floor vote and passed without a single "nay".

Both of these came about because of involvement in the party.

Bravo.

428 x-wing  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:39:01pm

re: #392 Shug

I can't wait to see ex congressman Murtha fighting the marine lawsuits.

How quickly his friends in powerful places will drop him like 3rd period French

You and me both. I know the accused and cleared Marine in his district sued him, I hope the others follow suit.

/that damn ex-Marine deserves everything he gets.

429 opinionated  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:39:14pm

re: #410 Opilio

BZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzttttt.

No, I'm sorry, incorrect, but thanks for playing...

Cool. With what Palin brings, I guess it's an easy win for McCain.

I couldn't be happier.

430 a marine mom  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:39:41pm

re: #322 Shug

I hadn't heard one way or the other.
I 've been too busy watching wall to wall Kwame Kilpatrick

I saw a picture of his new home at Wayne County Jail. Gotta tell ya, it couldn't happen to a nicer guy.

I also heard that the democrat party sent out a piece with a picture of Obama and Levin trying to get people to sign up for absentee ballots. If they had questions they could call the number on the piece. The problem was that the number was for a sex line.

Gotta love the politics in Michigan.

431 M. Bensson-Levi  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:40:04pm

re: #364 razorbacker

G-d be with you and your wife.

432 ggt  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:40:14pm

re: #355 BlueCanuck

Hey Canuck!

433 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:40:19pm

re: #395 rawmuse

Who is it banning guns? Democrats
Who bans trans fats? Democrats
Who wants you stop smoking and will ban you from doing so, even in your own home or your own car? Democrats
Who wants to shut down talk radio? Democrats
Who wants to force you to drive little match box cars? Democrats
Who is it that put all the "hate crime" laws on the books? (btw, the same ones I predict that they will try to enforce on this site) Democrats
Who is that wants to tax you for driving during rush hours? Democrats

Need I go on, here?

I have restrictions on the type of grass I can plant in my lawn.
Gotta get a permit to plant a tree and the only reasonable way to do it is to go through the government subsidized tree planting program.
government monopoly on alcohol in Oregon.
cell phone tracking.
size of my happy meal.
what school my kids can go to.

how much time we got for reasonable lefty restrictions?

434 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:40:19pm

re: #424 BlueCanuck

Hmmm, I think I will put on the my list right under Mandy of people not to piss off. ;)

/how's the eeyore hunting tonight?

No eeyore sightings since I've been around.

435 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:40:37pm

re: #404 The Archivist

the 0 is continuing to slough off the charge of being a socialist by talking about how he shared toys in kindergarten.


My first and probably last biblical quote here
When I was a child, I used to speak like a child, think like a child, reason like a child; when I became a man, I did away with childish things.


Barry, give up Childish things

436 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:40:41pm

re: #420 opinionated

re: #407 Adina in Judea

Say hi to your parallel universe for me.

I believe McCain's chances would be better with Romney, and much better with Giuliani .

Palin killed McCain's most potent argument against Obama- an argument the media could not easily dismiss or ridicule- that he was too inexperienced to be President.

Sarah Palin got the Republican base to leap out of their chairs.

No one else could have done this.

The Republican base is wide awake right now and they think for themselves about Sarah Palin without taking orders from you about what they ought to think.

437 Spiny Norman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:40:58pm

re: #390 opinionated

What are you smoking? There's a hell of a lot of people (the GOP base, the "social cons", whatever you want to call them) who will be voting this election who otherwise would not be voting at all.

438 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:41:06pm

re: #420 opinionated

Aren't you just a ray of sunshine. Palin has far more experience than the Zero™ at managing and running anything. She even has more relevant experience then Plugs. So just chill and do your civic duty on the 4th like everyone else and things will be okay.

439 mattm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:41:16pm

The One Dear Leader's adinfomercial was not exactly truthful:

[Link: apnews.myway.com...]

440 Sylvester_T_Cat  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:41:20pm

re: #257 gmsc

Most states' ballots are arranged alphabetically by last name, which (depending on your state) would put Chuck Baldwin or Bob Barr first.

Far as I know, practically all states use some method of randomizing the order of names for any particular office. They may keep the names in alphabetical sequence, but the person who appears first should be rotated equally among the spots for that office. In other words, say it's a 3-way for prez with Barr, McCain, Obama-- 1/3 of the ballots should be Barr, McCain, Obama-- another 1/3 would be Obama, Barr, McCain-- the last 1/3 would be McCain, Barr, Obama.

Has to be done this way, so that each candidate has an "equal chance" of being the first on the list. Statistically there's a many-percent advantage to being the "first" on a list like this. Not everybody who's voting is fully literate or takes enough time to spot where their candidate is on the ballot, for instance. (These days they may not even be English-speaking, it seems...)

441 hermit  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:41:53pm

Let me try this here.....I can't get this scenario out of my mind

My Dearest Johnny,
I hope your foster parents let you read this. Your father and I love you and miss you every day. You are old enough now to know what really happened.

When you were seven years old, the Federal Health Care worker assigned to your school diagnosed you with ADHD and recommended that you be placed in a "special needs" class. I wanted to argue, but thought they knew best how to get you the education you needed.

When the Federal Health Care worker assigned to your school insisted you be place on medication, I did argue, with all my heart. Your father spoke to the principal and the district superintendent, but they insisted. In fact, we were told if we continued to fight, we would be charged with child abuse.

You were nine when your father and I decided on home schooling. Although my college degree was in Industrial Engineering and your father's in Accounting, I was confident in our ability, with the support of homeschooling resources across the country, to find the right curricula and offer you the best education. That was just before our state required certification for homeschooling parents. I was told you would be considered truant until my certification was complete. Given the refresher courses and tests required, the best I could hope for was to bring you back home the following school year.

The government takeover of the banks caused your father's job to be "downsized" and I could no longer afford to go to school. We both had to work to support the family. With the increased taxes on businesses, it was difficult to find work that matched our educations, so we took what we could find.

We received a letter from the Federal Health Care Worker at your school that your home situation did not offer you enough supervision since your father and I were working opposite shifts. Two days later, the Civilian Security Officers came to our home to collect your things. While you were at school, you had been placed in a "Ward of the Government" status and assigned temporary housing.

If you think these NEW federal programs won't first be applied to public schools, you're not looking far enough ahead....

442 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:42:08pm

And another thing,
Who is it that has successfully blocked every single attempt to create and distribute any new energy sources in the USA for the last 30 years? Democrats!

That one singular issue has more influence over how each and every one of us lives our lives, how much money we have in our pockets, the quality of our every day lives, the cost of food, commodities, you name it.

443 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:42:17pm

re: #401 Promethea

there you go!
The proper term for many of us is South Park Republican

444 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:42:28pm

re: #379 stevieray

Great job! Give us details!

Well- I don't want to get into too much detail, but we cross referenced a couple of databases. These are definitely fraudulent registrations based on property records.

445 opinionated  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:42:33pm

re: #436 Adina in Judea

Sarah Palin got the Republican base to leap out of their chairs.

No one else could have done this.

The Republican base is wide awake right now and they think for themselves about Sarah Palin without taking orders from you about what they ought to think.

The leaping Republican base can leap their hearts out, McCain is behind.

446 Der Hirn Fanger  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:42:34pm

Why do you keep flogging Apple products on here? Far left company, it's the computer that libs use because they like the "lifestyle" and the "identity" of a apple follower.

Big money to the No on 8 people in California? Al Gore on the board? None of this matters to you?

Obamabots are very likely to be Mac users.

447 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:43:09pm

re: #426 razorbacker

You're a good guy, razorbacker!

448 formercorpsman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:43:50pm

re: #420 opinionated

I honestly think, with the media has shown itself over the last year, hell, the last 20 years, he could have picked anyone that would passed all of their qualifications, and it won't matter.

The media has tossed objectivity out the door.

The want to make this election. It's not even like there was a possibility of this election getting a fair shake when it comes to them.

449 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:43:58pm

re: #371 rawmuse
Hey, I DO know how you feel - but the unfortunate (or maybe not) fact of life is we the taxpayers don't get to choose what the government pays for and doesn't pay for - sorta like the Vietnam War and the Iraq war - during the Vietnam war I heard a LOT of folks saying that they didn't want THEIR tax dollars supporting an illegal, immoral war. And to think that elections are our (the taxpayers) way of saying yes or no is just not correct: each party in one form or another, bundles a whole bunch of stuff onto their party platforms (or not on their party platforms) for no really philosophical reason. I think the Dem's wound up in favor of "a woman's right to choose" because the Uber Libs in the coastal Cities, mostly, were where NOW (remember them) and Gloria Steinham and the like were based.

450 Racer X  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:44:12pm

re: #420 opinionated

I believe McCain's chances would be better with Romney, and much better with Giuliani .


I have a three letter word for you:

PUMA

Palin killed McCain's most potent argument against Obama- an argument the media could not easily dismiss or ridicule- that he was too inexperienced to be President.

Really?

Because I think she brought that argument right out front and center and made people think.

I honestly think McCain would be dead in the water without Palin. Romney, Rudy, whoever, no one would have energized the right like she has.

IMO

451 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:44:35pm

re: #433 spidly

I have restrictions on the type of grass I can plant in my lawn.
Gotta get a permit to plant a tree and the only reasonable way to do it is to go through the government subsidized tree planting program.
government monopoly on alcohol in Oregon.
cell phone tracking.
size of my happy meal.
what school my kids can go to.

how much time we got for reasonable lefty restrictions?

Would make a great commercial.

452 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:44:48pm

re: #433 spidly

Here in the Great Metropolis of Toronto, the leftist city council passed a law making it illegal to cut down any trees on your property. Also herbicide and pesticide use was severely curtailed for the private home owner. Only "natural" and "safe" products could be used. We had a bumper crop of dandelions in the city this year. Waiting for the plague of wind blown trees in the next couple of years to come up.

453 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:45:01pm

SHOCKER: Team Hillary believes McCain will win New Hampshire, Iowa, and MAINE

(1) In both states, they have never seen an enthusiasm deficit for Democrats like this. Hillary Democrats there say there are more “closet McCain supporters” than anyone can count. Despite what the media says, people are not enthused and fired up to go out and vote for Obama — quite the contrary: people are scare of Obama’s policies and will be voting McCain. The enthusiasm deficit in both New Hampshire and Maine is “as clear as day” according to those we spoke to tonight. They say they do not see anywhere near the level of Obama signs, stickers, buttons, etc. out this year, as they did Kerry, Gore, Clinton, and even Dukakis gear in years past. They say this is actually shocking, because it should be everywhere, but no one cares enough to put those signs out. No one can use the excuse that there’s not enough money for signs and stickers: Obama’s campaign is supposedly rolling in dough, so why aren’t New Hampshire and Maine blanketed in Obama signs? Because people don’t want them in their yards and won’t be voting for him.

(2) We asked why people in these states are not voting for Obama and were told that in Maine, especially, a lot of it has to do with Joe the Plumber and redistributing the wealth. Much of Maine makes its living off the sea: fishermen pull in $200,000 or more a year in family businesses. Joe Biden’s slip that Obama really intends to define “wealthy” as $150,000 a year or above sent terror through Maine’s fishing community and other small business industries. We were told tonight that Maine and New Hampshire have more small family businesses that would be affected by Obama’s redistribution of wealth than we could imagine. Joe the Plumber resonated with these people — especially the fishermen. Todd Palin was recently dispatched to Maine in what the media claimed was an attempt to score one electoral college vote for Maine: tonight we were told it looks like McCain will win the whole state, not just that one congessional district.

(3) Sarah Palin was the smartest move John McCain could ever have made — she is playing incredibly well in Maine and New Hampshire, two states made up of mostly small towns, all of whom are outdoorsy and have traditions of female mayors, council members, and other high elected officials. Maine has two female United States Senators. That honestly never occured to us until now, but it does make a lot of sense. We knew Hillary Clinton would never win Iowa in the primaries because Iowa’s never elected a woman to high office — Maine has. Many, many times. People relate to Palin and trust John McCain. They like these candidates — while Obama in an unknown whose relationships and judgment make people uneasy. Add the socialism business to the top of this, and we’re told it moves New Hampshire and Maine into the red column.

As always, RTWT (Read the whole thing)

454 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:45:07pm

re: #425 ggt

Drugs make you stupid. It's insane to spend billions on education, just to allow the brain to rot over time do to drug-use. A drugged brain is also an "easy-to-lead" brain. Makes no sense if a person is truly a liberatarian to want legal drug use.

Anarchist, maybe.

True, but I've argued the point with many a libertarian.

455 maddogg  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:45:09pm

re: #444 Sharmuta

Well- I don't want to get into too much detail, but we cross referenced a couple of databases. These are definitely fraudulent registrations based on property records.

Is a park bench considered "property"?

456 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:45:11pm

re: #374 CheDub
How about booze? I mean compared to, say, marijuana?

457 gman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:45:38pm

re: #423 Walter L. Newton

Big whoop. It's not a federal law, is it? The are only a few states that include it in it's state educational programs.

But waht about seat belts? What about all kind of standards on automobiles? What about smoking being outlawed in just about every public venue in this country.

Look, I'm sorry you got smacked by the minister a few too many times when you were growing up, but equating the radical religious right with the obscene nannyism of the left is as dishonest as saying Christiananity is a dangerous as radical Islam.

Can you say Rosie McDonald?

The minister guided the congregation as we smacked each other into compliance.

458 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:45:55pm

re: #445 opinionated

The leaping Republican base can leap their hearts out, McCain is behind.

and without Palin he's waaaay behind.

I went to a McCain-Palin rally. It was electric.
I have never before, nor would I have have gone this time if not for sarah palin.
and I saw lots of people not considered " the base" there

459 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:46:16pm

re: #445 opinionated

The leaping Republican base can leap their hearts out, McCain is behind.

McCain would still be standing at the starting gate without the Republican base.

Meanwhile, Obama and his gazillions with most of the MSM in tow have put Obama only 3 points ahead according to Gallup likely voters today.

That's astounding considering how Obama has been playing this election and what he did against his own party in the primaries.

460 Moe Katz  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:46:23pm

re: #446 Der Hirn Fanger

Obamabots are very likely to be Mac users.

But lefties are more PC than conservatives!

461 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:46:58pm

Even the laws that forbade you to marry outside your race were written by Democrats.

Ask Ward Connerly about those sometimes. Or Justice Thomas.

462 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:47:07pm

re: #356 Shug

Is Murtha gonna lose?

Last I saw, William Russell was down 2, so it was statistically a dead heat.

463 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:47:37pm

re: #457 gman

The minister guided the congregation as we smacked each other into compliance.

I don't care. You made a proposition, and you have not answered any of our comments. Rawmuse, JCM, and myself have laid out a few idea here and all you keep coming back with is the sob story.

464 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:47:59pm

re: #421 gmsc

Whose toys did he share?

Granny made so little as a Bank prez they could not afford toys per se unless they came inside of the cracker jack box they got with food stamps. he speaks of the gun shaped sticks and bunny shaped rocks he found outside his Hawaii hut with the other tennesee drawlin' haolie kids

465 bosforus  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:48:03pm

re: #460 Moe Katz

But lefties are more PC than conservatives!

Nice.

466 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:48:07pm

Arguing from tu quoque is not going to get us anywhere. Step back, and argue from individual rights.

And yes- embracing the position of individual rights means we'll have to look at ourselves, but this is the grown-up thing to do. If we want to believe we're the party of grown-ups, then we should be willing to do this.

467 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:48:11pm

re: #450 Racer X

I honestly think McCain would be dead in the water without Palin. Romney, Rudy, whoever, no one would have energized the right like she has.

Agreed!

At the point where McCain was about to announce his VP pick, I couldn't imagine a choice on his short list doing anything that could get the right to stand on our feet and cheer.

He blew all of us away when Sarah Palin was announced.

It was the best thing he could have done.

468 opinionated  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:48:18pm

re: #448 formercorpsman

I honestly think, with the media has shown itself over the last year, hell, the last 20 years, he could have picked anyone that would passed all of their qualifications, and it won't matter.

The media has tossed objectivity out the door.

The want to make this election. It's not even like there was a possibility of this election getting a fair shake when it comes to them.

Maybe not. But then even more we didn't have to go to battle with self inflicted handicaps.

The bottom line of my argument- and I'll be happy to read any evidence that shows I'm wrong- is that the issues crucial to the SoCons, the issues which were used to filter out and eliminate the best candidates - are issues that are absolutely meaningless in this election.

469 ggt  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:48:20pm

re: #454 jcm

I don't bother.

470 Karridine  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:48:28pm

re: #368 Intrepid

Government computer checks on Joe the Plumber more intensive than was first reported
...

Wow. Just...wow.

Now you understand why some people opt OUT of the credit-card, record your every move network, Intrepid!

471 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:48:28pm

re: #445 opinionated

The leaping Republican base can leap their hearts out, McCain is behind.

I see someone has drank the MSM koolaid again. Here have a littleoldlady fruitcup with redc1c4 additives.

/much more relaxing

472 Racer X  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:49:05pm

re: #446 Der Hirn Fanger

Obamabots are very likely to be Mac users.

Thats funny.

I have 4 Macs and one Windoze PC.

Macs rock!

473 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:49:29pm

For every instance of a perceived Republican attempt to control your life, I have named at least half a dozen actual, damaging restrictions passed by Democrats.
I rest my case.

474 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:50:06pm

re: #467 Adina in Judea

Agreed!

At the point where McCain was about to announce his VP pick, I couldn't imagine a choice on his short list doing anything that could get the right to stand on our feet and cheer.

He blew all of us away when Sarah Palin was announced.

It was the best thing he could have done.


She even Got Rush Limbaugh on McCain's side

475 DistantThunder  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:50:12pm

However, Mitt looks and technically is a financial genius compared to the morons in congress - and could have had a healthy impact on this financial catastrophe.

476 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:50:28pm

re: #472 Racer X

Thats funny.

I have 4 Macs and one Windoze PC.

Macs rock!

Racer OS X?

477 opinionated  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:50:45pm

re: #450 Racer X

Really?

Because I think she brought that argument right out front and center and made people think.

I honestly think McCain would be dead in the water without Palin. Romney, Rudy, whoever, no one would have energized the right like she has.

IMO

An energized Right - without an energized middle/independents- will give you President Obama.

478 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:50:51pm

re: #474 Shug

She even Got Rush Limbaugh on McCain's side

Anne Coulter, too!

479 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:51:10pm

re: #473 rawmuse

For every instance of a perceived Republican attempt to control your life, I have named at least half a dozen actual, damaging restrictions passed by Democrats.
I rest my case.

I love ya, raw- but that's not the point. The point is we should not accept it from either party.

480 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:52:08pm

re: #389 formercorpsman
Yep, you're right about that. Look, for example, at the Jim Crow Laws down South here - written and implemented by Demcorats who controlled Southern Politics - the majority of voters - well, of White voters, were in favor of 'em; then comes the Supreme Court in Brown v. Board of Education and says separate but equal ALWAYS means NOT equal. Same with literacy tests for being able to vote.
That the majority of people want a particular law passed doesn't make that law "right" but it is something which political parties will put in their platforms and run on during elections.

481 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:52:21pm

re: #477 opinionated

An energized Right - without an energized middle/independents- will give you President Obama.

We have even better than that- we have energized PUMAs. You know- democrats.

482 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:52:36pm

re: #467 Adina in Judea

Agreed!

At the point where McCain was about to announce his VP pick, I couldn't imagine a choice on his short list doing anything that could get the right to stand on our feet and cheer.

He blew all of us away when Sarah Palin was announced.

It was the best thing he could have done.

The timing was smart, too. Don't forget that McCain announced his choice on the same day as 0bama was giving his "Greek Temple" acceptance speech. The following day, more people were talking about the choice of Sarah Palin than 0bama's speech.

483 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:52:46pm

re: #478 Adina in Judea

Anne Coulter, too!

lots of people here too.
remember, it wasn't too long ago during primary season that there was a lot of McCain hatred here. Not of the man, but of his politics.

palin made a lot of people forget that.

In the end, if McCain loses he was destined to lose anyway, no matter who he picked.
But if he wins, It's all down to sarah Palin

484 opinionated  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:53:14pm

re: #471 BlueCanuck

I see someone has drank the MSM koolaid again. Here have a littleoldlady fruitcup with redc1c4 additives.

/much more relaxing

You people are funny.

I would be ecstatic if McCain wins. And he should because Obama is a disaster.

But to ignore all the evidence that Obama is the favorite flying away is plain insane.

485 x-wing  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:53:26pm

re: #439 mattm

The One Dear Leader's adinfomercial was not exactly truthful:

[Link: apnews.myway.com...]

I don't know why he spent money on that. I listened to the first 10 minutes,and it was just a compilation of his commercials and debate answers. I heard nothing new.

/Stupid move,if you ask me

486 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:53:45pm

re: #479 Sharmuta

I love ya, raw- but that's not the point. The point is we should not accept it from either party.

Which is exactly my credo. The perception was posited, even by our gracious host, that these life style restrictions were the province of the R party, which I have hopefully debunked.

487 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:53:47pm

re: #477 opinionated

An energized Right - without an energized middle/independents- will give you President Obama.

An energize middle/independents without an energized right couldn't win.

You're forgetting Obama's gazillions and his personally owned MSM.

Don't act as if this is a different election.

Obama knocked the Clintons out with his tactics.

If you want to blame Sarah Palin for what's going on, you're insane.

This election wouldn't be as close as it is right now without her.

488 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:53:50pm

re: #446 Der Hirn Fanger

Why do you keep flogging Apple products on here? Far left company, it's the computer that libs use because they like the "lifestyle" and the "identity" of a apple follower.

Big money to the No on 8 people in California? Al Gore on the board? None of this matters to you?

Obamabots are very likely to be Mac users.

It is a superior product. sure you got that lefty stigma but then I do believe Gates is more of a leftard.
ANYWAY:
Steve Jobs, Proud to Be Nonunion

how d'ya like them apples!
BIG poke in the eye of the heart of his lefty base. Getting wiser with age maybe.

489 opinionated  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:53:54pm

re: #481 Sharmuta

We have even better than that- we have energized PUMAs. You know- democrats.

490 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:53:55pm

re: #473 rawmuse

For every instance of a perceived Republican attempt to control your life, I have named at least half a dozen actual, damaging restrictions passed by Democrats.
I rest my case.

Gman is not answering our points, he's just complaining about being hit in church.

491 formercorpsman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:54:39pm

re: #468 opinionated

I understand the point you are trying to make.

My disagreement there, is recall during the primary, pretty much anyone registered to vote in the Republican primary, not really feeling any enthusiasm for any of the candidates in the running.

With the exception of Luap Nor, I think most (R)epublicans felt as much of a divide with McCain as well. I think his comments about people being bigots because the illegal immigration issue was such a hot button, or the gang of 12, (or 14, I don't recall the exact number) created such a divide with the base that his candidacy would have just gone through the motions of a loss.

That being said, there was no energy going into this election. Picking one of the other guys in the primary, IMO, would have done nothing to affect this either.

Just the way I see it.

492 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:54:44pm

re: #470 Karridine

Now you understand why some people opt OUT of the credit-card, record your every move network, Intrepid!

there's a life-lock ad coming up here, right?

493 Racer X  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:54:46pm

re: #477 opinionated

An energized Right - without an energized middle/independents- will give you President Obama.

McCain has throughout his career been a middle of the road guy. Heck the media loved him until about 6 months ago. It is Obama who is way out there to the extreme left.

Can you say PUMA?

494 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:54:51pm

re: #456 realwest

How about booze? I mean compared to, say, marijuana?

Booze and tobacco, the most damaging to a developing fetus. Booze will cause FAS (Fetal Alcohol Syndrome), which is permanent higher function brain damage. Smoking deprives the fetus of oxygen, with all sorts of problems.

Interesting enough, the other other drugs can be overcome if the children is raised in a stable environment. It's the need for drugs that overriding parental responsibility that creates the problems.

495 opinionated  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:54:59pm

re: #481 Sharmuta

We have even better than that- we have energized PUMAs. You know- democrats.

I wish? They are a fading mirage.

496 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:55:10pm

re: #482 gmsc

The timing was smart, too. Don't forget that McCain announced his choice on the same day as 0bama was giving his "Greek Temple" acceptance speech. The following day, more people were talking about the choice of Sarah Palin than 0bama's speech.

It was the next morning, actually.

The network nightly news teams acted as if Obama hadn't even spoken!

They were all about Sarah Palin on the evening after Obama's big speech.

It was awesome - I agree with you!

497 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:55:21pm

re: #477 opinionated

An energized Right - without an energized middle/independents- will give you President Obama.

And as someone retorted earlier: PUMA - "We're the ones you weren't expecting!" With a vengeance. Literally.

Nor are they the only ones.

McCain by 5% overall.

498 Alberta Oil Peon  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:55:35pm

re: #346 spidly

should be a requirement that elected officials have at least started and kept the doors open on a business as small as a coffee cart for at least 3 years before taking office.

Well, that's a non-starter, for sure. Agreed, a track record of success in some sort of business enterprise can be an indicator of competence, but why exclude people who have demonstrated competence in some other field of endeavor? Your "rule" would exclude John McCain, right off the bat. It certainly would exclude all military, all teachers, many lawyers (not that that's a bad thing), and anybody else who worked solely as an employee, competence notwithstanding.

The voters are capable of doing that sort of vetting, if they get off their lazy butts and do the research. The voters that post in comments here certainly know the relative competency of the two teams in the race.

499 gman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:55:47pm

re: #463 Walter L. Newton

I don't care. You made a proposition, and you have not answered any of our comments. Rawmuse, JCM, and myself have laid out a few idea here and all you keep coming back with is the sob story.

You don't see that the religious right wing wants influence in America?
I bring up banning same sex marriage and intelligent design as examples and you say "Big Whoop."
It's not a sob story. It's the facts staring you in the face.

500 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:55:47pm

re: #469 ggt

I don't bother.

I enjoy the verbal combat too much.
;-)

501 formercorpsman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:56:09pm

re: #480 realwest

True.

And that train runs down both sides of the track.

502 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:56:15pm

Has everyone seen the "Dictator Meeting" ad? This needs much wider exposure!

503 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:57:04pm

re: #486 rawmuse

Which is exactly my credo. The perception was posited, even by our gracious host, that these life style restrictions were the province of the R party, which I have hopefully debunked.

Except there are people on our side who advocate these positions, and they get us all tarred by the left and their msm shills who don't report on who the left does this, nor that these republicans don't speak for the entire party.

But then- if reasonable republicans don't get involved in the party, then they do end up speaking for us.

504 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:57:04pm

re: #499 gman

You don't see that the religious right wing wants influence in America?
I bring up banning same sex marriage and intelligent design as examples and you say "Big Whoop."
It's not a sob story. It's the facts staring you in the face.

And there you are, so hasty to lump as all in with them.
OK, I got it. The Collective is All.

505 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:57:31pm

re: #495 opinionated

I wish? They are a fading mirage.

LMAO! No- they're not.

506 twincitiesgirl  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:57:47pm

George Will is a pissant.
Call Him John the Careless

507 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:57:53pm

re: #484 opinionated

I would be ecstatic if McCain wins. And he should because Obama is a disaster.

But to ignore all the evidence that Obama is the favorite flying away is plain insane.

Being ahead by a few points isn't the same thing as being 20 or 30 points ahead.

With all his advantages, Obama can barely crack above 50 in the polls.

He's not a vast favorite. He's only slightly ahead.

508 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:58:04pm

re: #445 opinionated

Opinionated- Opinions are like noses. Everyone has one, and they all smell, numbnuts. Get lost, loser.

509 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:58:29pm

Some may recall that I was a Palin supporter before McCain chose her. I even pointed out to Realwest that she wouldn't be the first VP from a state with very few electorial votes (Cheney).

Some part-time Alaskans pointed her out to me, whilst they were back home relaxing. I checked her out via the Intraweb tubes and was impressed.

There is a solid base of Americans who are partial to out-side-the-beltway types. People who actually live life down with the common types.

They aren't perfect. But some of us feel a bit more comfortable with people who have actually done things, rather than just say, "That ain't the way I'd have done it."

510 Karridine  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:58:55pm

re: #492 spidly

I confess, you've got me at a disadvantage, Spidly.... I know nothing of this 'Life-Lock' of which you speak...

?

511 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:59:14pm

re: #499 gman

You don't see that the religious right wing wants influence in America? I bring up banning same sex marriage and intelligent design as examples and you say "Big Whoop."
It's not a sob story. It's the facts staring you in the face.

Look, you go back and read my posts (and Rawmuse) and answer our poinit, then we will continue with this. Other wise, I'm not interested in talking to a parrot who keeps repaeting the same phrase over and over.

Address what we have commented on.

512 Intrepid  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:59:28pm

re: #446 Der Hirn Fanger

Mac user here since 1994. Never voted democrat except for a couple of local ones. Not a lib.

And I can name 10 of my friends right off the top of my head who are the same.

513 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:59:43pm

re: #420 opinionated

I believe McCain's chances would be better with Romney, and much better with Giuliani .

Palin killed McCain's most potent argument against Obama- an argument the media could not easily dismiss or ridicule- that he was too inexperienced to be President.

Honestly, are you that stupid? Who will be the President you idiot?

514 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:59:47pm

re: #504 rawmuse

And there you are, so hasty to lump as all in with them.
OK, I got it. The Collective is All.

I don't think it's gman doing the lumping- it's the left and msm. And everyday we don't work to get these folks to STFU and STFD- the left and msm will continue to have this easy target.

515 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 9:59:55pm

re: #506 twincitiesgirl

George Will is a pissant.
Call Him John the Careless.

Call Him Will the Pissant.

I agree - he's a total jerk.

516 pat  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:00:16pm

This Obama civilian military thing is the creepiest idea I ever heard.

517 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:00:28pm

re: #507 Adina in Judea

Being ahead by a few points isn't the same thing as being 20 or 30 points ahead.

With all his advantages, Obama can barely crack above 50 in the polls.

He's not a vast favorite. He's only slightly ahead.


and if Nader had the following he had 4 and 8 years ago, Obama would lose

518 gman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:00:37pm

re: #504 rawmuse

And there you are, so hasty to lump as all in with them.
OK, I got it. The Collective is All.

and you're so hasty to say that you "won" an argument that I think you miss my point entirely.

519 bosforus  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:01:23pm

re: #516 pat

This Obama civilian military thing is the creepiest idea I ever heard.

Two words: General Ayers.
Off to bed...assuming I can sleep with that thought.

520 opinionated  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:02:14pm

re: #497 The Archivist

And as someone retorted earlier: PUMA - "We're the ones you weren't expecting!" With a vengeance. Literally.

Nor are they the only ones.

McCain by 5% overall.

Ok. I'll have what some of you are having. But what are we all going to be taking on Nov 5th to continue on our magic fantasy ride?

Don't get me wrong, I too wish for a miracle. I dread and fear a President Obama and pray the public wakes up in the next few days and everything turns out alright with President McCain.

But I can differentiate between a wish and hope and an ever darkening reality.

Good night

521 formercorpsman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:02:15pm

re: #499 gman

Gman, that was my response to you earlier.

You are laying the banning of gay marriage at the feet of the "rabid religious right" when there are plenty of folks not in that description who are also not in favor of gay marriage, hence my reference to the debate.

This is exactly what the Democrats do. They ride this for political points. It is like blaming the sub-prime catastrophe on greedy Wall Street types.

The Democrats know, there are more than enough people in the middle who disagree with mandating the acceptance of gay marriage, that if they actually went to bat for it, their support would evaporate.

522 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:02:33pm

re: #517 Shug

and if Nader had the following he had 4 and 8 years ago, Obama would lose

Nadar can't compete with Obama when it comes to being a radical leftist.

Scary, isn't it.

523 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:02:40pm

re: #499 gman

You don't see that the religious right wing wants influence in America? I bring up banning same sex marriage and intelligent design as examples and you say "Big Whoop." It's not a sob story. It's the facts staring you in the face.

Actually, I believe you spent too much time in an abusive dogmatic church, because you argue just like the staunch religious right. You just keep flapping your mouth and repeating yourself, over and over, without using any critical thinking skills and debating my points.

Don't waste my time unless you want to debate, discuss and examine the issues.

524 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:02:43pm

re: #495 opinionated

So did you tag team with JMV or what? Obviously you have your blinders on so tight that they are obstructing your view of the road. The stories we all are hearing from friends and family about yellow dog democrats switching parties and votes, of signs that aren't there that were in past elections, and many other anecdotes. As much as the MSM tries to push Zero™ into the White House, there are facts and fallacies that are slipping out. Zero™ has such a murky past that they can't hide it. Cheer up, the fight isn't lost. If you want throw down your shield and run. But I shall return with mine or on it as tradition dictates.

/and it's a finer tradition to follow then Grima Wormtounges.

525 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:02:45pm

re: #519 bosforus

Two words: General Ayers.
Off to bed...assuming I can sleep with that thought.

We'll counter with General Realwest.

526 Racer X  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:02:58pm

re: #507 Adina in Judea

He's not a vast favorite. He's only slightly ahead.

Yep.

McCain / Palin are following one of the most despised presidents in history (by the left), and yet Obama, with all the campaign money (lots of it illegal), and with the media up his ass, with 6 days left is only up by 2-3 points?

Are you freaking kidding me! This guy should be up by 20 points by now easy. If the left cannot get it done now they are doomed.

DOOMED I tells ya!

527 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:03:11pm

re: #503 Sharmuta

I know that, thank you.
Let's be precise about what is going on here, some of us are trying to talk others of us OUT of being Republican, they want us to roll over to the Democrats.

Well, here is news for you. You can't oppose a something with a nothing.
You need an opposition party to keep from having to eat the turd sandwich that is being prepared for us by the Dems. That takes strength, and strength comes from numbers. The Dems know that. Meanwhile we argue about who we are going to kick out of our party, or would, to listen to some of you.

Right now, ESPECIALLY right now, we need all we can get.

528 solomonpanting  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:03:17pm

This Election Campaign has illustrated at least one shocking point.
It is not necessary to live in a totalitarian society in order to have a media so thoroughly slanted toward one point of view. Hopefully, the spread of the internet will loosen MSM's grip on what is reported, and I can envision more and more people thinking "we still have a free press, but who believes what they say?" And, sadly, I fear that.

529 x-wing  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:03:25pm

re: #478 Adina in Judea

Anne Coulter, too!


Even alot of my Dem. Union buddies.

/oppinionated's ass is out, as we say 'round here.

530 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:03:44pm

re: #420 opinionated
Um,

Palin killed McCain's most potent argument against Obama- an argument the media could not easily dismiss or ridicule- that he was too inexperienced to be President.

what?! Govenor Palin (formally Mayor Palin has had to, you know, actually GOVERN and ADMINISTER a governmental entity. That means she has had to come up with an itemization of community needs (either in the village or in the State of Alaska) figure out what it'll cost (i.e., create a budge) figure out where to get the money to fund the budget and then supervise the funding of that budget. And - iirc - she's had to do that twice as Govenor of Alaska, with a 25 billion dollar budget and over 25,000 State Employees. She has more executive and administrative experience than Obama, Biden or for that matter McCain.
And Yes, I was for Rudy too, but for whatever reason Rudy didn't bother to try to campagin - anywhere except maybe Florida and he got his butt kicked there by...............John McCain.
I happen to think - even though it may have simply been fortuitous, that Palin turned out to be the precisely best possible pick for McCain AND for the GOP - no longer can the Republicans be accuarately accused of gender discrimination. But the Dem's can.

531 Intrepid  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:03:52pm

re: #450 Racer X

Really?

Because I think she brought that argument right out front and center and made people think.

I honestly think McCain would be dead in the water without Palin. Romney, Rudy, whoever, no one would have energized the right like she has.

IMO

Can't see how either Mitt or Rudy would have gotten crowds of 25,000 waiting in line for hours for a chance to hear them speak in person. Never would they have drawn the estimated 60,000 like Palin did in the Villages in Florida last month.

Nor would either of them have so energized the Hillary voters (PUMAs) like Sarah Palin has.

532 twincitiesgirl  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:04:25pm

re: #506 twincitiesgirl

George Will is a pissant.
Call Him John the Careless


Currently featured on the front page of Googe News
SNIP

From the invasion of Iraq to the selection of Sarah Palin, carelessness has characterized recent episodes of faux conservatism. Tuesday's probable repudiation of the Republican Party will punish characteristics displayed in the campaign's closing days.

Did McCain, who seems to think that Palin's never having attended a "Georgetown cocktail party" is sufficient qualification for the vice presidency, lift an eyebrow when she said that vice presidents "are in charge of the United States Senate"?

Perhaps Palin's confusion about the office for which she is auditioning comes from listening to its current occupant. Dick Cheney, the foremost practitioner of this administration's constitutional carelessness in aggrandizing executive power, regularly attends the Senate Republicans' Tuesday luncheons

Palin may be an inveterate simplifier; McCain has a history of reducing controversies to cartoons. A Republican financial expert recalls attending a dinner with McCain for the purpose of discussing with him domestic and international financial complexities that clearly did not fascinate the senator. As the dinner ended, McCain's question for his briefer was: "So, who is the villain?"

McCain revived a familiar villain -- "huge amounts" of political money -- when Barack Obama announced that he had received contributions of $150 million in September. "The dam is broken," said McCain, whose constitutional carelessness involves wanting to multiply impediments to people who want to participate in politics by contributing to candidates -- people such as the 632,000 first-time givers to Obama in September.
533 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:04:28pm

re: #520 opinionated

But I can differentiate between a wish and hope and an ever darkening reality.

You're having trouble seeing reality, though.

1. This wasn't McCain's election to lose.

2. Sarah Palin has helped John McCain.

534 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:04:28pm

re: #517 Shug

and if Nader had the following he had 4 and 8 years ago, Obama would lose

Nader never got above 2% of the vote. And now another moonbat, Cynthia McCommie, is the Green party candidate. Between the two of them they will not get 2% combined.

535 Outrider  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:04:50pm

re: #507 Adina in Judea

Being ahead by a few points isn't the same thing as being 20 or 30 points ahead.

With all his advantages, Obama can barely crack above 50 in the polls.

He's not a vast favorite. He's only slightly ahead.

How true. With all the hype, free publicity from a biased media, propaganda that one is a racist if they are not an Obama supporter, being outspent 3 to 1, and dirty campaign tactics the Oama camp just can't seem to get them numbers pegged. With all he had going he should easily be 15-25 points ahead and he isn't.

Watch them numbers fall even further come election day and the Obamites wonder what in the ell happened.

536 Racer X  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:04:59pm

re: #513 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Honestly, are you that stupid? Who will be the President you idiot?

Ease up big guy. We're trying to talk him down off the ledge, not make him jump.

537 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:05:31pm

re: #510 Karridine

I confess, you've got me at a disadvantage, Spidly.... I know nothing of this 'Life-Lock' of which you speak...

?

LifeLock
Anyone who's listened to Rush for about 30 minutes should get the joke

538 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:05:42pm

re: #534 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

sometimes 2% is enough

539 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:06:26pm

re: #538 Shug

sometimes 2% is enough

2000 Florida was decided by just a few hundred votes.

otherwise we'd have had president Gore.

Thank you Nader!

540 maddogg  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:06:33pm

Sarah Palin is one of the toughest people who ever ran for public office. She has taken more crap, more smears, more lies, more investigantion since the convention than Zero and Plugs have had to endure in their lifetimes. And still she is beautiful, smiling and out there hitting them where it hurts. She has more leader in her little toe than Zero and his botox fool have in their whole bodies combined. She is a priceless asset to the Republican Party.

541 formercorpsman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:06:33pm

Goodnight, I am up way past what I originally intended to be.

542 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:07:21pm

re: #526 Racer X

Yep.

McCain / Palin are following one of the most despised presidents in history (by the left), and yet Obama, with all the campaign money (lots of it illegal), and with the media up his ass, with 6 days left is only up by 2-3 points?

Are you freaking kidding me! This guy should be up by 20 points by now easy. If the left cannot get it done now they are doomed.

DOOMED I tells ya!

Yep, it's like AlGore in 2000. He should have cleaned Bush's clock. And if he would have won his home state of Tennessee, he'd be President.

543 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:07:32pm

re: #528 solomonpanting

This Election Campaign has illustrated at least one shocking point. It is not necessary to live in a totalitarian society in order to have a media so thoroughly slanted toward one point of view. Hopefully, the spread of the internet will loosen MSM's grip on what is reported, and I can envision more and more people thinking "we still have a free press, but who believes what they say?" And, sadly, I fear that.

And I fear that the internet will become the next place the left tries to exert control over. It's certainly possible. And remember, there are already many stop gap points in place.

Think Google for one example. We see them twiddling with search results, and we know them to be pretty open with peoples privacy.

Google would be a good example a internet control without any laws or special government intervention.

An internet companies political bent is all that's needed.

544 Outrider  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:07:52pm

re: #520 opinionated

Ok. I'll have what some of you are having. But what are we all going to be taking on Nov 5th to continue on our magic fantasy ride?

Don't get me wrong, I too wish for a miracle. I dread and fear a President Obama and pray the public wakes up in the next few days and everything turns out alright with President McCain.

But I can differentiate between a wish and hope and an ever darkening reality.

Good night

Why do you feel it takes a miracle? Where do you see gloom and doom in the numbers? Go have another lemon.

545 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:08:26pm

re: #538 Shug

sometimes 2% is enough

WA 04

Christine Gregoire(D) 1,373,361 48.8730%
Dino Rossi(R) 1,373,232 48.8685%
Ruth Bennett(L) 63,465 2.2585%

How about 0.01%

546 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:08:32pm

re: #540 maddogg

Sarah Palin is one of the toughest people who ever ran for public office. She has taken more crap, more smears, more lies, more investigantion since the convention than Zero and Plugs have had to endure in their lifetimes. And still she is beautiful, smiling and out there hitting them where it hurts. She has more leader in her little toe than Zero and his botox fool have in their whole bodies combined. She is a priceless asset to the Republican Party.

Absolutely!

As the moose in my favorite Palin political cartoon said as he looked grimly to the political cartoon audience:

"Be afraid. Be very afraid." :)

547 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:08:58pm

re: #536 Racer X

Ah heck, if he won't come down I am pushing him. :)

548 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:09:15pm

re: #445 opinionated Why do you think McCain is behind - at least in the polls?
Do you really think it's because of Palin, or because of the BILLION bucks Obama raised, the complete tanking of the MSM for Obama and the fear of some folks for being called a racist if they get polled and say "McCain"?

549 neocon hippie  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:09:34pm

We have an Eeyore in our midst.

You should read HillBuzz regularly in the next few days.

550 captwfcall  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:09:51pm

re: #531 Intrepid

Can't see how either Mitt or Rudy would have gotten crowds of 25,000 waiting in line for hours for a chance to hear them speak in person. Never would they have drawn the estimated 60,000 like Palin did in the Villages in Florida last month.

Nor would either of them have so energized the Hillary voters (PUMAs) like Sarah Palin has.

and the good thing about the Palin excitement is that it's the right kind of excitement. it's not the kind that Lord O draws. when you see people crying when a politician is saying nothing, that is scary. that's the kind of politician everyone should fear.

when Lord O spoke in Denver, they panned into the crowd many times and there were both women AND men crying. and they were doing it before he even said anything. again, we should all fear that level of idolatry.

551 Sharmuta  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:10:15pm

re: #527 rawmuse

I know that, thank you.
Let's be precise about what is going on here, some of us are trying to talk others of us OUT of being Republican, they want us to roll over to the Democrats.

Well, here is news for you. You can't oppose a something with a nothing.
You need an opposition party to keep from having to eat the turd sandwich that is being prepared for us by the Dems. That takes strength, and strength comes from numbers. The Dems know that. Meanwhile we argue about who we are going to kick out of our party, or would, to listen to some of you.

Right now, ESPECIALLY right now, we need all we can get.

I'm not interested in kicking anyone out of the party except bigots. I believe the religious fundamentalists need to be brought more to our line of thinking through conversations such as this. They are free to worship and think as they see fit, but they must leave their religion at the door of the party. There is separation of Church and State in our government- I don't see why the political parties should be any different.

You said earlier you're "live and let live". I'm like that too. I think many democrats and independents would be surprised to learn republicans think like you and I. The ones that don't think like us are the ones hurting our party, hurting our side. They don't need to leave- they just need to realize that as a party standing for individual rights, it will mean some people will make decisions for themselves that they might not agree with. If they don't want to accept this- maybe they're not republicans.

If the religious right wants to convert people- they can do so on their time. I prefer they didn't do it on republican time.

552 gman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:10:23pm

re: #521 formercorpsman

Gman, that was my response to you earlier.

You are laying the banning of gay marriage at the feet of the "rabid religious right" when there are plenty of folks not in that description who are also not in favor of gay marriage, hence my reference to the debate.

This is exactly what the Democrats do. They ride this for political points. It is like blaming the sub-prime catastrophe on greedy Wall Street types.

The Democrats know, there are more than enough people in the middle who disagree with mandating the acceptance of gay marriage, that if they actually went to bat for it, their support would evaporate.

I didn't intend to lay any blame on the more moderate wing of the Republican Party.
My point was simply that the far right and far left have "control" issues.
We need to be wary of both of them.
Have a good one. I'm off to bed.

553 RememberSekhmet?  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:10:28pm

re: #356 Shug

Is Murtha gonna lose?

Gods, that would be great!

554 nightlight  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:10:50pm

"Zero and Plugs" ROFL. Great name for a comic strip.

555 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:10:50pm

re: #499 gman

"You don't see that the religious right wing wants influence in America?"

Then there you have a problem, don't you? Are they citizens? Then they have a right to lobby for their views to be heard and even to acquire legislation. To deny them that right as citizens puts you in the posture of a tyrant, where I'm sure you don't want to be, because tyranny is the very thing you are reacting against. By your testimony, you were subjected to a program of legalism. I deeply regret that. I've seen that sort of thing myself. But there is such a thing as a grace-centered Christian faith, the very opposite of what you so sadly experienced.

All law is ultimately based on some form of religion. Just a question of whose. And how it is managed. We've got to get back to the wisdom of our American founding fathers. Read English history of the 16-18th centuries to understand the whole motivation behind the American system and why it strikes such a genius of balance, preserving individual liberties while protecting the overall structure.

556 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:11:06pm

re: #549 neocon hippie

We have an Eeyore in our midst.

You should read HillBuzz regularly in the next few days.

In a padded room, preferably. :)

557 pat  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:11:12pm

Obama thinks that The Black Muslims are roll models. Get your heads around that.

558 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:12:03pm

re: #550 captwfcall

and the good thing about the Palin excitement is that it's the right kind of excitement. it's not the kind that Lord O draws. when you see people crying when a politician is saying nothing, that is scary. that's the kind of politician everyone should fear.

when Lord O spoke in Denver, they panned into the crowd many times and there were both women AND men crying. and they were doing it before he even said anything. again, we should all fear that level of idolatry.

Oprah cried her eyelashes off.

That was worse than Chris Matthews' tingle up his leg.

559 Outrider  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:12:21pm

re: #534 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Nader never got above 2% of the vote. And now another moonbat, Cynthia McCommie, is the Green party candidate. Between the two of them they will not get 2% combined.

I hope McKinney gets a lot more. She sure won't be taking the votes from the Republicans. Same with Nader. lol

560 solomonpanting  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:12:24pm

re: #543 Walter L. Newton

Yeah, freedom is fragile.

561 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:12:49pm

re: #545 jcm

WA 04

Christine Gregoire(D) 1,373,361 48.8730%
Dino Rossi(R) 1,373,232 48.8685%
Ruth Bennett(L) 63,465 2.2585%

How about 0.01%

And how many voted who claimed they lived at some King county building? 600?

562 Karridine  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:12:51pm

re: #537 spidly

Thanks, Spidly!

/I get excerpted transcripts of Rush almost daily, but don't listen to him live!

563 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:13:04pm

re: #550 captwfcall


when Lord O spoke in Denver, they panned into the crowd many times and there were both women AND men crying. and they were doing it before he even said anything. again, we should all fear that level of idolatry.

When you stand for nothing, you'll fall for anything.

564 gman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:13:13pm

re: #523 Walter L. Newton

Actually, I believe you spent too much time in an abusive dogmatic church, because you argue just like the staunch religious right. You just keep flapping your mouth and repeating yourself, over and over, without using any critical thinking skills and debating my points.

Don't waste my time unless you want to debate, discuss and examine the issues.

I don't know you and yet it seems like you already know everything there is to know about me.

Have a good one. I'm off to sleep.

565 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:13:19pm

If the democrats had their way, just wearing a McCain-Palin hat would be considered a hate crime since it's offensive to African Americans.

I swear it's true.
Man do I get some vicious looks wearing my hat. DEATH STARES.

I live in very liberal royal Oak.

and I wear my hat everywhere, and little shug has a McCain-Palin "onesie"

but boy do we get the dirty looks. I might as well be wearing a Confederate Flag and a white hood. It's a shame they've done this. I never had these looks when I wore my 'W" hat 4 years ago.


bastards

566 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:13:21pm

I just saw the greatest pro-McCain ad I've ever seen here in Nevada! I haven't found it online yet, but here's the gist of it:

(People are settling down in an airplane)

Pilot: "This is your captain speaking. Now, I've never actually flown a jumbo jet plane before, but I have been hanging around the airport for 143 days."

(Cut jumps to a woman dropping off her kid at a daycare center)

Mother: "Do you have a lot of experience in daycare?"

Daycare worker: "This is actually our first day, but I have been present in many other day care centers for 143 days!"

(Cut jumps to a man on an operating table)

Patient: "I guess you've done a lot of surgeries like this before, right?"

Surgeon: "Actually, I've never performed any sort of surgery before, but I have been present in this hopital for 143 days."

(Fade to black)

Announcer: "Would you trust your life or your children's life to an airline pilot, a daycare worker, or a surgeon who had only been present for 143 days before taking on these major tasks? No?"

(Image of Obama comes on, with graphic stating "130 'Present' votes in 143 days")

Announcer: "Then why would you trust your country to a man who voted 'present' 130 times in only 143 days he spent as a senator before running for president?"

567 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:13:33pm

re: #515 Adina in Judea

"Some polls"

Typical tailoring of the available evidence, to suit the agenda.

"Experts agree."

Who?

"Uh, these two guys I hired."

568 Outrider  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:14:03pm

re: #540 maddogg

Sarah Palin is one of the toughest people who ever ran for public office. She has taken more crap, more smears, more lies, more investigantion since the convention than Zero and Plugs have had to endure in their lifetimes. And still she is beautiful, smiling and out there hitting them where it hurts. She has more leader in her little toe than Zero and his botox fool have in their whole bodies combined. She is a priceless asset to the Republican Party.

And our next President on Jan 2013.

569 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:14:32pm

re: #551 Sharmuta

Yeah, the Religious Right. The ones who work, have large families, never fail to vote, and by a big majority, fill the ranks of our military.
Try getting a Republican President elected without them.
Just sayin'

570 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:14:54pm

re: #566 gmsc

WOW! I love it!

It's right on target!

571 Intrepid  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:14:54pm

re: #492 spidly

there's a life-lock ad coming up here, right?

Wasn't that LifeLock CEO a victim of identity theft about six months ago?

Oh the irony.

572 Outrider  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:15:03pm

re: #542 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Yep, it's like AlGore in 2000. He should have cleaned Bush's clock. And if he would have won his home state of Tennessee, he'd be President.

If a guy can't pull his own state, he is in trouble. McGovern for example.

573 Karridine  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:15:15pm

re: #537 spidly

They seem to offer a relevant, VALUABLE service, Spidly! But I got the joke, too! :D "LiveLock! When you absolutely, positively HAVE TO USE YOUR CREDIT-CARD today!"

574 maddogg  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:15:26pm

re: #566 gmsc

Yeah, but Zero stayed at a Holiday Inn Express one night......

575 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:15:38pm

re: #527 rawmuse

I know that, thank you.
Let's be precise about what is going on here, some of us are trying to talk others of us OUT of being Republican, they want us to roll over to the Democrats.

Well, here is news for you. You can't oppose a something with a nothing.
You need an opposition party to keep from having to eat the turd sandwich that is being prepared for us by the Dems. That takes strength, and strength comes from numbers. The Dems know that. Meanwhile we argue about who we are going to kick out of our party, or would, to listen to some of you.

Right now, ESPECIALLY right now, we need all we can get.

Or as Ann Althouse put it: "If Obama is so far ahead, why isn't he that far ahead?"

576 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:16:06pm

re: #568 Outrider

And our next President on Jan 2013.

Great motivation to go vote on Tuesday--to insure the freedom to vote in November of 2012.

577 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:16:17pm

re: #569 rawmuse

Yeah, the Religious Right. The ones who work, have large families, never fail to vote, and by a big majority, fill the ranks of our military.
Try getting a Republican President elected without them.
Just sayin'


In 2000 I believe Bush lost every demographic. Even the catholic vote.

but he got something like 90% of the evengelical vote and that was enough

578 x-wing  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:16:41pm

re: #557 pat

Obama thinks that The Black Muslims are roll models. Get your heads around that.

///what kind of rolls do they model

579 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:16:56pm

re: #561 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

And how many voted who claimed they lived at some King county building? 600?

Oh, hell. There where those. The 2000 more ballots counted than voters who voted. Unsecured ballots found 9 times, funny thingis they were found after Rossi posted leads in the daily counts. My favorite, ballot 96 a write in for Christine Rossi, which was counted for Gregoire by the canvass board.

580 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:17:11pm

re: #574 maddogg

Yeah, but Zero stayed at a Holiday Inn Express one night......

Updinged, because that occurred to me as I was typing out my post, too.

581 Intrepid  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:17:25pm

re: #495 opinionated

I wish? They are a fading mirage.

Do you not follow any of the links posted here to PUMA sites? Good gravy, man (or woman)! There are millions of them, estimated in the 5-7 million range, who are voting McCain/Palin instead of for the One.

582 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:17:33pm

re: #494 jcm

It's the need for drugs that overriding parental responsibility that creates the problems.

Precisely so.

583 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:17:53pm

Hmmm, found this while prowling LiveJournal. Set up for a RPG world, but pretty dark and something along the lines of what could happen in a Zero™ world I think.

/glad it won't be happening.

584 ggt  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:18:10pm

night lizards

weet dreams

585 Outrider  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:18:51pm

re: #566 gmsc

I just saw the greatest pro-McCain ad I've ever seen here in Nevada! I haven't found it online yet, but here's the gist of it:

(People are settling down in an airplane)

Pilot: "This is your captain speaking. Now, I've never actually flown a jumbo jet plane before, but I have been hanging around the airport for 143 days."

(Cut jumps to a woman dropping off her kid at a daycare center)

Mother: "Do you have a lot of experience in daycare?"

Daycare worker: "This is actually our first day, but I have been present in many other day care centers for 143 days!"

(Cut jumps to a man on an operating table)

Patient: "I guess you've done a lot of surgeries like this before, right?"

Surgeon: "Actually, I've never performed any sort of surgery before, but I have been present in this hopital for 143 days."

(Fade to black)

Announcer: "Would you trust your life or your children's life to an airline pilot, a daycare worker, or a surgeon who had only been present for 143 days before taking on these major tasks? No?"

(Image of Obama comes on, with graphic stating "130 'Present' votes in 143 days")

Announcer: "Then why would you trust your country to a man who voted 'present' 130 times in only 143 days he spent as a senator before running for president?"

Does staying in a Holiday Inn Express count for anything? ;-)>

586 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:18:52pm

re: #560 solomonpanting

Yeah, freedom is fragile.

It is, and I can see how the left already has themselves placed into the infastructure of the internet. It is evident from what we have seen, read and heard, that Google is a very leftist corporation.

And look at what data they control. Your browsing habits, pictures you post on servers, they collect satellite images of the earth, pictures of your house on your street, medical records are stored on their servers, all sorts of personal documents, journals, schedules and financial data. And this list goes on and on.

Why are they collecting and archiving all this information? Just to please their advertizers. Yes, partly, but look how much of our personal lives we volunteer to them, free of charge.

Scary, and this is only one internet company with this sort of power and leftist agenda.

587 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:19:01pm

re: #566 gmsc

I just saw the greatest pro-McCain ad I've ever seen here in Nevada! I haven't found it online yet, but here's the gist of it:

(People are settling down in an airplane)

Pilot: "This is your captain speaking. Now, I've never actually flown a jumbo jet plane before, but I have been hanging around the airport for 143 days."

(Cut jumps to a woman dropping off her kid at a daycare center)

Mother: "Do you have a lot of experience in daycare?"

Daycare worker: "This is actually our first day, but I have been present in many other day care centers for 143 days!"

(Cut jumps to a man on an operating table)

Patient: "I guess you've done a lot of surgeries like this before, right?"

Surgeon: "Actually, I've never performed any sort of surgery before, but I have been present in this hopital for 143 days."

(Fade to black)

Announcer: "Would you trust your life or your children's life to an airline pilot, a daycare worker, or a surgeon who had only been present for 143 days before taking on these major tasks? No?"

(Image of Obama comes on, with graphic stating "130 'Present' votes in 143 days")

Announcer: "Then why would you trust your country to a man who voted 'present' 130 times in only 143 days he spent as a senator before running for president?"

Misleading ad. Nobama's voting present 138 times was as an Illinois state senator. He served 143 days as a United States senator from Illinois.

588 x-wing  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:19:03pm

re: #561 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

And how many voted who claimed they lived at some King county building? 600?


They just kept finding more and more ballot boxes after every re-count.

/grrr. not my state,but I was flipping out.

589 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:19:08pm

re: #582 realwest

Precisely so.

Sadly so.

590 RememberSekhmet?  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:19:39pm

I think that prohibiting any form of legalizing gay relationships is in many ways the state trying to tell religious groups that do believe in gay marriage how to run their affairs, and that is a no-no IMHO.

But by the same token, telling religious groups that don't believe in recognizing homosexual relationships that they face anti-discrimination nonsense is also the state telling religious groups how to run their affairs.

As long as religious groups refrain from incitements to violence or other truly criminal activity, who they choose to recognize or not is none of the state's business.

591 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:19:43pm

re: #578 x-wing

///what kind of rolls do they model

Head rolls, after the Hassam Chop™.

592 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:20:05pm

re: #501 formercorpsman
It most assuredly does run down both sides of the track.
It may be my upbringing, my own delvelopement and learning or good fortune, but I have NEVER trusted politicians and never will. I will ROOT for some of them to be right - correct - but I don't trust 'em at all.

593 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:20:41pm

Night ggt, weet dreams to yah.

594 wolfie  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:20:58pm

re: #499 gman

The issue of same sex/monogamous marriage is not one in which you can say that the opponents are imposing values on people anymore than the proponents are. One group would like for California to define marriage in the way that has been traditional in the West for 2500+ years; the other group would like to define it differently. A definition will be imposed, and the only decision is which one.

My own preference is that these things be decided in the legislature rather than by a handful of judges receiving the gnosis from on high and shoving it down the people's throats. People are much more accepting of changes like this if they are democratically enacted.

595 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:21:02pm

re: #569 rawmuse

Yeah, the Religious Right. The ones who work, have large families, never fail to vote, and by a big majority, fill the ranks of our military. Try getting a Republican President elected without them. Just sayin'

Yea, the scary religious right. Got to watch out for those folks. They may do something moral when we are not looking.
/

596 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:21:33pm

re: #567 The Archivist

"Some polls"

Typical tailoring of the available evidence, to suit the agenda.

"Experts agree."

Who?

"Uh, these two guys I hired."

Expert:
Pronounciation - "x-spurt"
Origin - "X" is often used to mean "the unknown", as in algebra. "Spurt" refers to a drip of water under pressure.
Meaning - "An unknown drip under pressure."

597 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:22:53pm

re: #574 maddogg

Yeah, but Zero stayed at a Holiday Inn Express one night......

re: #585 Outrider

Does staying in a Holiday Inn Express count for anything? ;-)>

It was worth an upding to maddogg's post when he beat you to the joke.
;)

598 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:22:54pm

This just showed up on silobreaker -

Obama gets slammed by AP for his infomercial.

599 Outrider  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:23:17pm

re: #586 Walter L. Newton

It is, and I can see how the left already has themselves placed into the infastructure of the internet. It is evident from what we have seen, read and heard, that Google is a very leftist corporation.

And look at what data they control. Your browsing habits, pictures you post on servers, they collect satellite images of the earth, pictures of your house on your street, medical records are stored on their servers, all sorts of personal documents, journals, schedules and financial data. And this list goes on and on.

Why are they collecting and archiving all this information? Just to please their advertizers. Yes, partly, but look how much of our personal lives we volunteer to them, free of charge.

Scary, and this is only one internet company with this sort of power and leftist agenda.

Yeah, I used their maps the other day and they had photos of the route! Starting with my front yard. i could actually narrow down the date the photo was shot by the things and cars around the area. They had to have used a vehicle and GPS to get those photos as a satellite couldn't have got the angle. Spooky.

600 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:23:26pm

so there's socially conservative, and then there's socially retarded

601 Racer X  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:23:31pm

Facts via email:

George Bush has been in office for 7 1/2 years.
During the first six, the economy was fine.

A little over one year ago:
1) Consumer confidence stood at a 2 1/2 year high;
2) Regular gasoline sold for $2.19 a gallon;
3) the unemployment rate was 4.5%.
4) the DOW JONES hit a record high--14,000 +
5) American's were buying new cars,taking cruises, vacations overseas, living large!...

But American's wanted 'CHANGE'! So, in 2006 they voted in a Democratic Congress and yes--we got 'CHANGE' all right.

In the PAST YEAR:
1) Consumer confidence has plummeted ;
2) Gasoline went to over $4 a gallon & climbing!;
3) Unemployment is up to 5.5% (a 10% increase);
4) Americans have seen their home equity drop by $12 TRILLION DOLLARS and prices still dropping;
5) 1% of American homes are in foreclosure.
6) as I write, THE DOW is probing another low~~
$2.5 TRILLION DOLLARS HAS EVAPORATED FROM THEIR STOCKS, BONDS & MUTUAL FUNDS INVESTMENT PORTFOLIOS!

YES, IN 2006 AMERICA VOTED FOR CHANGE - AND GOT IT!

THE PRESIDENT HAS NO CONTROL OVER ANY OF THESE ISSUES, ONLY CONGRESS DOES.

AND WHAT HAS THE DEMOCRATIC-CONTROLLED CONGRESS DONE IN THE LAST TWO YEARS? ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.

NOT TO MENTION THAT IT WAS A DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENT, BILL CLINTON, WHO INSTRUCTED FANNIE MAE AND FREDDIE MAC TO GIVE HALF OF THEIR MORTGAGES TO PEOPLE WHO COULDN'T AFFORD THEM.

NOW THE DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATE FOR PRESIDENT CLAIMS HE IS GOING TO REALLY GIVE US CHANGE ALONG WITH A DEMOCRATIC CONGRESS!

MY FELLOW AMERICANS, JUST HOW MUCH MORE 'CHANGE' DO YOU THINK YOU CAN STAND?

602 Gus 802  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:23:41pm

A couple of months ago the news was that Google was thinking about putting some data operations in international waters outside the jurisdiction of the US and other countries.

/Troubling

603 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:23:49pm

re: #596 gmsc

Expert:
Pronounciation - "x-spurt"
Origin - "X" is often used to mean "the unknown", as in algebra. "Spurt" refers to a drip of water under pressure.
Meaning - "An unknown drip under pressure."

I like that. Though I've always referred to the ex as a has-been.

But yours has the advantage of sounding sorta sciencey and edumacated.

604 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:24:09pm

re: #587 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Misleading ad. Nobama's voting present 138 times was as an Illinois state senator. He served 143 days as a United States senator from Illinois.

Have you been President before?

NO, but I stayed in a Holiday Inn Express last night!

605 Karridine  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:24:28pm

re: #596 gmsc

I learned it, "x means 'has been'", so
an ex-spurt is an unknown has-been under pressure!

606 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:24:33pm

re: #587 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Misleading ad. Nobama's voting present 138 times was as an Illinois state senator. He served 143 days as a United States senator from Illinois.

Keep in mind I was typing from memory, so it's not an exact transcript. If I see the ad again, I'll double check that part.

607 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:24:43pm

re: #597 gmsc

It was worth an upding to maddogg's post when he beat you to the joke.
;)

Damn, guess that I should hit the refresh button more often. :(

608 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:24:46pm

re: #583 BlueCanuck

Drop that link back in tomorrow when everyone's awake, early in a thread.

609 rawmuse  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:24:50pm

re: #595 Walter L. Newton

Yea, the scary religious right. Got to watch out for those folks. They may do something moral when we are not looking.
/

There is such a thing as the Religious Left, too, you know, and they are not small in number.
Michael Moore considers himself a righteous Catholic.
There are the Sojourners, the Unitarians, even a lot of Methodists and Presbyterian churches I have visited.
Then there is Rev. Wright's church.

610 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:25:22pm

re: #587 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Misleading ad. Nobama's voting present 138 times was as an Illinois state senator. He served 143 days as a United States senator from Illinois.

This guy has done a wonderful job of turning himself into a tabula rasa.

His voting record, in both his state senate and in the federal senate, doesn't speak much for his point of views.

He has managed to seal most of his college papers, transcripts and other paperwork.

While some stuff has come out, it is evident that there are tons of suspect connections that he has through out his life, but they have been kept well hidden.

I don't know. I am not a big conspirsy person, but it almost seems like this guy has been handle for the last 25 years of his life. Handle by a radical element here in our country.

611 Outrider  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:25:26pm

re: #597 gmsc

It was worth an upding to maddogg's post when he beat you to the joke.
;)

Yeah. (sigh) happens when I read every post and respond to a bunch. Falling behind. ;-)>

612 solomonpanting  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:25:28pm

I'll leave you with this telling tale from China:

Officials and China's state-controlled press reported on Wednesday that eggs from other suppliers had also been found to be contaminated with melamine, which can give food the appearance of higher protein levels.
Against this backdrop, some supermarkets in Beijing, Shanghai and other cities announced they were recalling various brands of eggs, although others appeared unsure what to do with the central government yet to give directives.

613 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:25:57pm

re: #606 gmsc

Keep in mind I was typing from memory, so it's not an exact transcript. If I see the ad again, I'll double check that part.

I doubt obama was even present for that many US senate votes to vote present

614 Edouard  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:27:08pm

You know, if I were a Saudi who had just gone to the trouble of donating $100 grand to Obama, $2300 at a time using various fake names, watching his infomercial I'd be rather pleased.

I'd see that Obama is essentially preoccupied with criticizing his own country and is of no threat at all to the global jihad.

615 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:27:12pm

re: #587 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Then you haven't seen the other video, where he repeatedly says, "I'm sorry I'm late".

Each of his late appearances is dated at the bottom of the screen, and I know they run up through 2007.

But don't expect me to relocate the video. Too late and bed calls. Someone else can do that.

616 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:27:22pm

Would there be any sort of legal recourse for anybody if it turns out that, post -4 November, he's ineligible for the Presidency?

/Yes, I know we're not supposed to talk about the "paperwork" but I'm not directly.

617 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:27:41pm

re: #604 Badge of Kaffir Pride

Have you been President before?

NO, but I stayed in a Holiday Inn Express last night!

I'm just saying we all know the libturds are liars, but I do not want to go where they have gone to win elections. It's called morality. Libturds have no morals because morals are based upon the ten commandments.

618 wolfie  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:27:49pm

re: #566 gmsc

Oh, that sounds like a good one!

619 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:27:58pm

re: #608 The Archivist

Ah crap, that means I have to stay up late then. ;)

/or get up real early, choices choices.

620 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:29:02pm

re: #615 The Archivist

Where did you see it?

/helps narrow down search parameters.

621 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:29:07pm

re: #610 Walter L. Newton

I have some German ancestry. Now I don't start marching around the beerhaus and heading for France whenever I drink, but I do enjoy a dose of that 's' word, the one meaning taking joy in the misfortue of others.

So, after the election when Obadin is just another answer to a trivia question, I'm going to enjoy the after-the-fact media examination of the little O's record.

Should be fun, in a hateful kind of way.

622 Karridine  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:29:30pm

re: #598 karmic_inquisitor

Wow, Karmic! The AP, of all sources, slamming Dear Comrade Leader Obama!

623 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:29:33pm

re: #599 Outrider

Yeah, I used their maps the other day and they had photos of the route! Starting with my front yard. i could actually narrow down the date the photo was shot by the things and cars around the area. They had to have used a vehicle and GPS to get those photos as a satellite couldn't have got the angle. Spooky.

They do use vehicles. They pay people in major cities to take sequential photos of streets, upload them to Google and then Google arranges them into the street views.

re: #602 Gus 802

A couple of months ago the news was that Google was thinking about putting some data operations in international waters outside the jurisdiction of the US and other countries. /Troubling

Yes, they are thinking of building server farms on off shore tankers. Thier reason, security. Which does make sense, but of course, that arrangement may enable them to also circumvent a lot of laws.

624 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:29:33pm

re: #603 razorbacker

I like that. Though I've always referred to the ex as a has-been.

But yours has the advantage of sounding sorta sciencey and edumacated.

re: #605 Karridine

I learned it, "x means 'has been'", so
an ex-spurt is an unknown has-been under pressure!

Interesting. I've never heard the "has been" version before.

While we're talking about it, don't forget the one about politics:

Politics:
Pronounciation - "poly-tics"
Origin - "Poly" refers to "many", as in a "polygon", which is a many-sided shape. "Tics" refer to blood-sucking insects.
Meaning - "Many blood-sucking insects."

625 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:29:36pm

Here we go again.....

Woman suing Starbucks for $250K over hot coffee burn.

Simple words.....
Coffee.
Hot.
Spill.
Owee.

My two year old knows this.

626 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:29:46pm

re: #617 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

I'm just saying we all know the libturds are liars, but I do not want to go where they have gone to win elections. It's called morality. Libturds have no morals because morals are based upon the ten commandments.

No, morals are based on humanity. You can have morality without God. Trust me, I do and there's no God in my life. You can see morality in the world without it.

627 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:30:11pm

re: #606 gmsc

Keep in mind I was typing from memory, so it's not an exact transcript. If I see the ad again, I'll double check that part.

That's ok, I understand. I was just pointing out that we should not follow the deranged thinking of the left where the only thing that matters is winning. If we did, that makes us no better than those losers.

628 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:30:46pm

re: #625 jcm

Here we go again.....

Woman suing Starbucks for $250K over hot coffee burn.

Simple words.....
Coffee.
Hot.
Spill.
Owee.

My two year old knows this.

Spread Starbucks' wealth! Hope! Change!

//

629 TheMatrix31  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:31:05pm

re: #610 Walter L. Newton

This guy has done a wonderful job of turning himself into a tabula rasa.

His voting record, in both his state senate and in the federal senate, doesn't speak much for his point of views.

He has managed to seal most of his college papers, transcripts and other paperwork.

While some stuff has come out, it is evident that there are tons of suspect connections that he has through out his life, but they have been kept well hidden.

I don't know. I am not a big conspirsy person, but it almost seems like this guy has been handle for the last 25 years of his life. Handle by a radical element here in our country.

I feel the same way. I'm not a conspiracy minded person either. In fact, I hate people who peddle that conspiracy garbage. It makes me worry THAT MUCH more when I start to have feelings like that in my mind brewing.

630 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:31:26pm

Okay, so I went and found itre: #587 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Misleading ad. Nobama's voting present 138 times was as an Illinois state senator. He served 143 days as a United States senator from Illinois.

Okay, I couldn't go to bed without locating it myself.

Covers the period from 2005-2007

631 TheMatrix31  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:31:31pm

re: #625 jcm

Here we go again.....

Woman suing Starbucks for $250K over hot coffee burn.

Simple words.....
Coffee.
Hot.
Spill.
Owee.

My two year old knows this.

Did someone say 250k?!?!

632 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:32:02pm

Grace Jones Possessed by Her WWI Grandfather
Breitbart.com
October 29, 2008

Jamaican-born disco diva Grace Jones said she was sorry Hillary Clinton had failed to make the cut in the US election and that she "can't stand" folksy vice-presidential candidate Sarah Palin.

The 1980s style icon, now 60, told German magazine TV Spielfilm Wednesday that Palin stood for a backward vision of America laden with government restrictions of sexuality and social behaviour.

"I would have loved it if Hillary Clinton had pulled it off," Jones said, in an interview published in German marking the release of her new album.

"I can't stand Sarah Palin. I bet a woman like that has no sense of humour."

The androgynous Jones, who conquered dancefloors and runways from New York to Paris in the 1980s and had star turns in blockbusters alongside Arnold Schwarzenegger and Roger Moore, said she believed in her own form of sexual liberation.

She said she had fallen afoul of feminists for stunts such as "appearing naked in a cage" but insisted she had the right to determine what was artistic or simply exploitative.

"I believe a woman can present herself as a sex object if she has fun doing it," she said.

The statuesque Jones attributed her own dominant image to the influence of her grandfather, who served in World War I.

"He was strict, even frightening," she said. "Sometimes I think I am possessed by him."

Ok, so I corrected the title for Breitbart.

Grace Jones says she 'can't stand' Palin

633 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:32:06pm

re: #615 The Archivist

Ask and ye shall receive.

634 Spirit93  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:32:07pm

re: #601 Racer X

So much ammunition McCain refuses to use.

If he wins he will deserve the credit for the win.

If he loses, well.........

635 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:32:17pm

re: #625 jcm

By craig davey on October 29, 2008 2:22 PM
Shes the dumbass who tried to hold a coffee on her lap while she was driving! stupid people need the injuries they get so they can learn not to do something stupid again

.


heh

636 Irene NYC  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:32:37pm

re: #587 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Misleading ad. Nobama's voting present 138 times was as an Illinois state senator. He served 143 days as a United States senator from Illinois.


Not misleading.

Here. That's Obama's voting record in the US Senate. There are one helluva lot of NV (Not Voting). The 143 days refers to the number of days he spent in the US Senate before he started his presidential bid.

637 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:32:38pm

re: #620 BlueCanuck

Just suggesting you promote it. I found it effective.

638 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:33:10pm

re: #625 jcm

Here we go again.....

Woman suing Starbucks for $250K over hot coffee burn.


.


Calling Johnny Chiles !

639 Bobibutu  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:33:44pm

re: #571 Intrepid

Wasn't that LifeLock CEO a victim of identity theft about six months ago?

Oh the irony.

And there are six separate class action suits filed against them. These suits have been filed in New Jersey, Maryland,West Virginia, Florida, Texas and California for false advertising.

640 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:33:50pm

re: #630 The Archivist

Sorry. I kinda botched my entry there.

641 TheMatrix31  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:34:59pm

re: #638 Shug

Calling Johnny Chiles !

Jackie*

642 Gus 802  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:35:03pm

re: #625 jcm

Yeah, "not affixed" properly. Maybe she should have thought of affixing the cup of coffee to a standard run of the mill cup holder in her car instead of balancing it on her leg.

More fun in lawsuit land.

643 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:35:21pm

re: #625 jcm

one more quote from your link

By Joe on October 29, 2008 6:36 PM
She has severe blisters in the vaginal area. A doctor later classified the injuries as HERPES!

644 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:35:29pm

re: #635 Shug

.


heh

I'll admit I've spilled coffee on my lap while driving.

It is followed by a colorful outburst questioning my intelligence, parentage and general ineptitude.

Followed by the hope no notices spilled coffee on my pants, marking me as a dumbass.

Suing never crossed my brain cells.

645 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:35:35pm

*sigh*

My poor, deluded Aunt just sent me another darned e-mail claiming Obama is a Mussellman, and saying there's no way she'll vote for him.

In the interest of facts, I'm going to have to send her the truth. He ain't one.

I should be able to get around to it by November 5, at the latest.

646 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:36:22pm

re: #643 Shug

one more quote from your link

*spew* beer on keyboard, missed that one.
ROFL.

647 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:36:24pm

re: #625 jcm

Here we go again.....

Woman suing Starbucks for $250K over hot coffee burn.

Simple words.....
Coffee.
Hot.
Spill.
Owee.

My two year old knows this.

From the article: "Her complaint to Starbucks resulted in a gift certificate instead of restitution for her medical bills, says the suit."

Good for them! I hope she doesn't get much farther, although the precedent set by the Liebeck v. McDonald's Restaurants case isn't promising.

648 wolfie  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:36:33pm

re: #569 rawmuse

Heh. For one thing, there is a huge overlap between the so-called religious right and small-government, fiscal conservatives. If any party were to purge itself of the former, they'd find the ranks of the latter severely decimated.

649 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:36:36pm

re: #645 razorbacker

I should be able to get around to it by November 5, at the latest.

Send it by Pony Express. On November 5th. ;)

650 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:37:06pm

re: #629 TheMatrix31

I feel the same way. I'm not a conspiracy minded person either. In fact, I hate people who peddle that conspiracy garbage. It makes me worry THAT MUCH more when I start to have feelings like that in my mind brewing.

I do believe he has been groomed by a lot of people who have similar designs on our country. Not a conspirisy as in Ayers and Soros and Etal. sat down and worked out a master plan, but it is becoming evident that everyone that Obama has had in his past has seen the possiblities available.

651 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:37:35pm

re: #626 Badge of Kaffir Pride

No, morals are based on humanity. You can have morality without God. Trust me, I do and there's no God in my life. You can see morality in the world without it.

Look up the origin of the word.re: #626 Badge of Kaffir Pride

No, morals are based on humanity. You can have morality without God. Trust me, I do and there's no God in my life. You can see morality in the world without it.

Okay. I consider morality doing what is right when "no one" is watching. Of course, this could also include honesty. It's just my opinion.

652 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:37:41pm

re: #644 jcm

I'll admit I've spilled coffee on my lap while driving.

It is followed by a colorful outburst questioning my intelligence, parentage and general ineptitude.

Followed by the hope no notices spilled coffee on my pants, marking me as a dumbass.

Suing never crossed my brain cells.

In college I ironed a shirt while I was wearing it. Didn't have an iron. I put a pot on the stove and heated it up, then used it as an iron.

and I have a little scar as a reminder that you shouldn't do it ( my shirt was still wrinkled BTW )

nowadays, I'd sue the maker of the pot for a lack of a warning label

DO NOT USE AS AN IRON WHILE WEARING THE GARMENT YOU ARE IRONING

653 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:37:47pm

Goodnight, and I leave you with this to wonder on:

This is apparently an AP article, of all things!:

"Obama's prime-time ad skips over budget realities"
[Link: apnews.myway.com...]

covering 0's spin earlier this evening.

654 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:37:47pm

re: #625 jcm

Here we go again.....

Woman suing Starbucks for $250K over hot coffee burn.

Simple words.....
Coffee.
Hot.
Spill.
Owee.

My two year old knows this.

I either giggle, or shake my head about stuff like that.

655 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:38:12pm

re: #647 gmsc

From the article: "Her complaint to Starbucks resulted in a gift certificate instead of restitution for her medical bills, says the suit."

Good for them! I hope she doesn't get much farther, although the precedent set by the Liebeck v. McDonald's Restaurants case isn't promising.

Should have result in a life time ban from Starbucks, extortion not allowed.

656 The Archivist  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:39:29pm

re: #645 razorbacker

Plus, he was only 8 when he ate that applesauce.

[Mussellman]

heh.

657 Zimriel  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:39:50pm

OMG, the Associated Press is hammering The One's informercial. Yes, the AP.

Shall we unlock Piggy's hangar? I hear flapping and squealing.

658 captwfcall  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:40:00pm

sick of the MSM telling everyone what 'the American people want to see'. it's funny how what 'the American people want to see' is always something beneficial for Obama. When it's harmful to him, 'the American people' don't want to see it.

659 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:40:20pm

re: #652 Shug

In college I ironed a shirt while I was wearing it. Didn't have an iron. I put a pot on the stove and heated it up, then used it as an iron.

and I have a little scar as a reminder that you shouldn't do it ( my shirt was still wrinkled BTW )

nowadays, I'd sue the maker of the pot for a lack of a warning label

DO NOT USE AS AN IRON WHILE WEARING THE GARMENT YOU ARE IRONING

ROFLMAO!

If I had a nickel for every time I've done something while thinking "this may not be a good idea" I'd be rich.

660 WrathofG-d  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:40:33pm

re: #655 jcm

If she uses the gift certificate Starbucks can argue that she accepted it as restitution of her claim.

661 x-wing  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:40:53pm

re: #632 Adina in Judea

I served in the military,but I am not an historian. I didn't know Jamaica was involved in WWI.
Or what whos' Military did he serve in?

662 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:41:00pm

re: #630 The Archivist

Okay, so I went and found it

Okay, I couldn't go to bed without locating it myself.

[Link: www.youtube.com...]

Covers the period from 2005-2007

And he was a U.S. Senator from 2005-2007. The voting "present" 138 times was from his time in the Illinois state Senate before being elected to the U.S. Senate.

663 Gus 802  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:41:16pm

re: #652 Shug

I wash and dry my clothes in a similar fashion.

/Doh

664 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:41:44pm

re: #660 WrathofG-d

If she uses the gift certificate Starbucks can argue that she accepted it as restitution of her claim.

While working through an automotive insurance claim, I got weekly checks of varying amounts.

I was very careful to return them registered mail.

665 razorbacker  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:42:09pm

re: #661 x-wing

I served in the military,but I am not an historian. I didn't know Jamaica was involved in WWI.
Or what whos' Military did he serve in?

I'd guess British. Weren't they a colony then? *too lazy to look*

666 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:42:26pm

re: #651 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Okay. I consider morality doing what is right when "no one" is watching. Of course, this could also include honesty. It's just my opinion.

I thought that that was called "character".

667 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:42:30pm

re: #657 Zimriel

OMG, the Associated Press is hammering The One's Infomercial. Yes, the AP.

Shall we unlock Piggy's hangar? I hear flapping and squealing.

Not to mention rocket engines firing up.

They may have to go supersonic for this one.

668 Shug  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:42:38pm

The Messiah !

currently on drudge

669 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:42:50pm

re: #586 Walter L. Newton
Hey Walter - Google is nothing compared to Microsoft!
When I, on rare occasions, use IE 7, and come here to LGF I get a big yellow than red banner across the front saying something like "Warning This May Be a Spam Page!"

670 middlecon  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:42:55pm

re: #653 The Archivist

Goodnight, and I leave you with this to wonder on:

This is apparently an AP article, of all things!:

"Obama's prime-time ad skips over budget realities"
[Link: apnews.myway.com...]

covering 0's spin earlier this evening.

I just saw this AP Article...I imagine that guy won't be invited to too many Christmas parties from here out lol

Why doesn't McCain talk more about how Bush's tax cubs INCREASED revenue? Obama wants to raise taxes to be punitive, that pure and simple, its not to increase revenue.

671 WrathofG-d  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:43:09pm

re: #664 jcm

Yes, insurance companies are deceitful, dishonest, tricky suckers. You pay them 10 to 1 what you want back but they still nickle and dime.

672 BlueCanuck  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:43:48pm

re: #665 razorbacker

Yes they were. Up to about the 60's even Britain was making policy decision for them as well. Finally the Jamacian government told them to piss off, we're grown ups here.

/boss is Jamacian.

673 RememberSekhmet?  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:44:07pm

I'm off to bed. Weet Dreams!

674 Badge of Kaffir Pride  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:44:21pm

re: #665 razorbacker

I'd guess British. Weren't they a colony then? *too lazy to look*

I believe so. It's how Canada was dragged into it right off of the start. India would have been, etc.

675 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:44:53pm

re: #666 Badge of Kaffir Pride

I thought that that was called "character".

That reminds me of the difference between character and reputation: Reputation is what other people think you are. Character is what you know you are.

676 woodsman  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:45:24pm

Howday all...
I've seen a few mentions of this AP "Flying Pig" article - worth a look before it vanishes...
It starts... "Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama was less than upfront in his half-hour commercial Wednesday night..."

Then it (amazingly) goes on to compare SPIN to Facts!

THE SPIN: "That's why my health care plan includes improving information technology, requires coverage for preventive care and pre-existing conditions and lowers health care costs for the typical family by $2,500 a year."

THE FACTS: His plan does not lower premiums by $2,500, or any set amount.

If author CALVIN WOODWARD didn't get his pinkslip already today he'd better look for it tomorrow...

677 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:45:37pm

re: #671 WrathofG-d

Yes, insurance companies are deceitful, dishonest, tricky suckers. You pay them 10 to 1 what you want back but they still nickle and dime.

It's a long story, but in the end I won. Took 9 months, but I got want I wanted.

What pissed me off most was $7.98. Because it was so cheap. The wanted to pro-rate the license on the car, state law clearly states they pay the full licensing. That took 6 weeks to resolve.

678 Adina in Judea  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:45:50pm

re: #661 x-wing

re: #632 Adina in Judea

I served in the military,but I am not an historian. I didn't know Jamaica was involved in WWI.
Or what whos' Military did he serve in?

Maybe he was in the Bobsled Army.

They don't fire weapons much, but they get to the battle quickly (if it's snowing.)

679 Alberta Oil Peon  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:46:23pm

re: #661 x-wing

I served in the military,but I am not an historian. I didn't know Jamaica was involved in WWI.
Or what whos' Military did he serve in?

Well, Jamaica was a British colony at that time, so I expect he was fighting for Britain.

680 Last Mohican  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:46:31pm

re: #634 Spirit93

So much ammunition McCain refuses to use.

I think it would be a very poor idea for McCain to try to make an argument that he is closer to President Bush, who is a successful president, than he is to the Democratic congress, which has botched things up since 2006. Very few people are going to be sold by an "I'm like Bush!" message. Anyway, it would be inaccurate. McCain is not like Bush.

On the other hand, there's a lot of other ammunition that McCain is failing to use. For example, Barack Obama has been a member of a racist hate group for his entire adult life, and given money to pro-terrorist groups, and his main political mentor, a man whom Obama defends TO THIS DAY, is a mass-murdering terrorist who sought to violently overthrow the U.S. government and kill 25 million of its citizens.

The media isn't going to say any of that, but it's absolutely true. If it weren't, and 0 had been just another run of the mill Democrat, then I'd put his victory in the "oh well, can't win 'em all" category, rather than the "oh my God, holy shit, what the hell twisted alternate universe can I possibly be living in where something like this can happen?" category.

681 Zimriel  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:46:58pm

re: #393 Syrah

I went to the Lucy Exhibit at the Seattle Pacific Science Center today.

Fascinating stuff. Worth the ticket price.

The exhibit was split pretty evenly between the the Paleontological artifacts concerning Lucy and the history of Ethiopia.

Yay! They brought that exhibit to Houston last year, it was great stuff.

682 Outrider  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:47:08pm

re: #643 Shug

one more quote from your link

big assed difference between taking a woman to bed with coffee burns and herpes. Not that she would be much in the mood with coffee burns anyway. ;-)> Oh hell-this all sounded better in my head. never mind. lol

683 spidly  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:47:15pm

re: #617 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

I'm just saying we all know the libturds are liars, but I do not want to go where they have gone to win elections. It's called morality. Libturds have no morals because morals are based upon the ten commandments.


the got their own:

You shall have no other gods before the state

You shall not make for yourself any carved image, or any likeness ....you shall not bow down to them nor serve them unless it serves to hand 'Gaia' over to the state

You shall take the name of the State in vain, for the State is built on false promises

Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor for the State but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the State un. In it you shall do no work unless your son, your daughter, your manservant, your maidservant, your cattle, your stranger who is within your gates cannot be forced to do it for you. Someone's gotta get the State its due

Do not honor your father and your mother, the State is your only parent.

You shall not murder unless it serves the State

You shall not commit adultery.... aw nevermind, go ahead

You shall not steal unless the State gets its cut

You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor unless he opposes the State.

You shall covet your neighbor’s house; you shall covet your neighbor’s wife, his manservant, his maidservant, his ox, his donkey, anything that is your neighbor’s and the State promises to get it all for you if you prove your fidelity to the State

684 Karridine  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:47:50pm

re: #655 jcm

Should have result in a life time ban from Starbucks, extortion not allowed.

I can see it IF the Starbuck's employee was wired to the rafters, snootful of snow or amped on amphetamines, and he waltzed her HOT coffee over an flamboyantly SPLASHED IT ALL OVER HER, but how can a company serving HOT DRINKS protect themselves from extrotional stuff like this?

/serve only tepid drinks?
/serve hot, but require a controlled cool-down?
/refuse service to morons?
/post huge posters explaining "Coffee is hot. You spill? You PAY!"
/requiring signed, notarized personal responsibility waivers EVERY CUP, EVERY TIME?

685 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:48:08pm

re: #669 realwest

Hey Walter - Google is nothing compared to Microsoft! When I, on rare occasions, use IE 7, and come here to LGF I get a big yellow than red banner across the front saying something like "Warning This May Be a Spam Page!"

Go to "tools" and then go to "Phishing filter." Turn it off.
Microsoft keeps a list of possible sights that may (or are) phony sights, otherwise know as phishing sites.

These are sites that look like the REAL thing, but if you sign on or enter personal info, it doesn't go to where you think it goes, they are collecting personal info.

Example, a paypal phishing page, which looks like a real paypal sign on page. You enter your name and password, bingo they have your info, and they then can use it to raid your paypal account.

But, Microsoft can also put sites in their list that don't belong. Possibly they put LGF into thier phishing site list as a way to try to keep people off the site.

It's the same way companies have put sites into their lists to keep employees off of certain sites. This ability has been misused in the past.

I would pass this on to Charles.

686 WrathofG-d  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:48:22pm

re: #677 jcm

Yea I believe it....oh...going over to the open thread =======>

687 Outrider  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:49:44pm

re: #659 jcm

ROFLMAO!

If I had a nickel for every time I've done something while thinking "this may not be a good idea" I'd be rich.

Or doing something on a dare. After consuming a sixpack or three.

688 jcm  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:50:15pm

re: #684 Karridine

I can see it IF the Starbuck's employee was wired to the rafters, snootful of snow or amped on amphetamines, and he waltzed her HOT coffee over an flamboyantly SPLASHED IT ALL OVER HER, but how can a company serving HOT DRINKS protect themselves from extrotional stuff like this?

/serve only tepid drinks?
/serve hot, but require a controlled cool-down?
/refuse service to morons?
/post huge posters explaining "Coffee is hot. You spill? You PAY!"
/requiring signed, notarized personal responsibility waivers EVERY CUP, EVERY TIME?

I like my coffee scalding.....
I drink it at my own risk.....

Coming soon government mandated drink temperatures.

============> Movin' on up.

689 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:50:21pm

re: #631 TheMatrix31

re: #625 jcm

Here we go again.....

Woman suing Starbucks for $250K over hot coffee burn.

Simple words.....
Coffee.
Hot.
Spill.
Owee.

My two year old knows this.

Did someone say 250k?!?!


Did somebody say McDonalds?!

690 gmsc  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:51:15pm

re: #668 Shug

The Messiah !

currently on drudge

(Sung to the tune of "Hosanna" from "Jesus Christ Superstar")

O-bama
Hey bama bama bama O-bama
Hey bama O-bama
Hey BO, BO, please don't go
bama O-bama
Hey Superstar

OBAMA:
Why waste your breath moaning at the crowd?
Nothing can be done to stop the voting.
If every tongue were stilled
The noise would still continue.
The dead and cartoons themselves would start to vote!

691 stevieray  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:51:31pm

re: #650 Walter L. Newton

I do believe he has been groomed by a lot of people who have similar designs on our country. Not a conspirisy as in Ayers and Soros and Etal. sat down and worked out a master plan, but it is becoming evident that everyone that Obama has had in his past has seen the possiblities available.

Its not "What does Obama see in Ayers et al".... the question is "What do all of these Marxists see in Obama?" that keeps me up at night.

692 realwest  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:54:57pm

re: #685 Walter L. Newton
Actually, I don't think Charles pays much attention to me anymore - perhaps you could report it?!

And on that note, I'm outta here folks - gotta sleep!

I hope you all have a GREAT EVENING/EARLY MORNING and that I get the chance to see you all down the road!


Good night, all.

693 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 10:55:26pm

re: #636 Irene NYC

That's NOT what I said. He specifically said that the ad said said Obama voted present 130 times while serving in the U.S. Senate for 143 days., IT IS misleading. Go up and re-read #566-

I just saw the greatest pro-McCain ad I've ever seen here in Nevada! I haven't found it online yet, but here's the gist of it:

(People are settling down in an airplane)

Pilot: "This is your captain speaking. Now, I've never actually flown a jumbo jet plane before, but I have been hanging around the airport for 143 days."

(Cut jumps to a woman dropping off her kid at a daycare center)

Mother: "Do you have a lot of experience in daycare?"

Daycare worker: "This is actually our first day, but I have been present in many other day care centers for 143 days!"

(Cut jumps to a man on an operating table)

Patient: "I guess you've done a lot of surgeries like this before, right?"

Surgeon: "Actually, I've never performed any sort of surgery before, but I have been present in this hopital for 143 days."

(Fade to black)

Announcer: "Would you trust your life or your children's life to an airline pilot, a daycare worker, or a surgeon who had only been present for 143 days before taking on these major tasks? No?"

(Image of Obama comes on, with graphic stating "130 'Present' votes in 143 days")

Announcer: "Then why would you trust your country to a man who voted 'present' 130 times in only 143 days he spent as a senator before running for president?"

694 SummerSong  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 11:00:51pm

re: #558 Adina in Judea

Oprah cried her eyelashes of.

I hope she does it again, when her bud loses.

695 Zimriel  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 11:13:53pm

As far as those speculating as to the GOP "turning to the right" / "returning to the centre":

To me, the "centre" is the administrative state and its philosopher-kings. The Democrats are the party of this "centre". The "left" is the party of permanent revolution: Mao, Pol Pot, Nader. Then there's the one-foot-in, one-foot-out folks, the good-cop to the Naderite bad-cop: that would be the New Party and Obama.

For anyone opposed to the administrative state, going "to the centre" is selling out; but one can made coalitions with the centre. This is what Obama did.

696 Zimriel  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 11:35:23pm

Other groups opposed to the administrative (Democrat) consensus would include: caste-followers, who want the nation to discriminate on behalf of a given race; libertarians, who want the nation to trim its budget and scope; timarchists, who read a lot of Heinlein (veteran franchise); monarchists; theocrats; oligarch / plutocrats. Any of these might be considered "right wing" ... but, I suspect that except for the libertarians and (most) plutocrats they'd all share a liking for government largesse and fancy parades.

So, when I hear about forces pulling the GOP "to the right" and demanding "purity", I'm always interested in who's pulling and what purity they want. Lots of us libertarians would like the GOP to be more "pure" fiscally and to take an actual stand against Roe v Wade (for legal reasons, not moral).

Somehow I'm getting the feeling that Charles isn't thinking of the morons at Ace of Spades HQ. Given his battles here, more likely he's thinking of the Jindal theocratic wing. All those plutocrats on Wall Street who gave money to GOPers? (1) they give to Dems now and (2) they're now broke anyway. Who's got the money to throw at creationists?

697 Edouard  Wed, Oct 29, 2008 11:53:47pm
698 harry catbox  Thu, Oct 30, 2008 12:51:28am

I find myself angry at the Democratic Party for nominating such a horribly dangerous candidate, and bewildered the American People would be so deceived...

or are they?

699 SteveC  Thu, Oct 30, 2008 4:37:12am

re: #693 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Patient: "I guess you've done a lot of surgeries like this before, right?"

Surgeon: "Actually, I've never performed any sort of surgery before, but I have been present in this hospital for 143 days."

Announcer: "Would you trust your life or your children's life to an airline pilot, a daycare worker, or a surgeon who had only been present for 143 days before taking on these major tasks? No?"

Holy --! Experience? Dr. Albert Pacifico performed two of my heart surgeries - one in 1977 and another one in 1988. He averaged 1200 operations a year. The "average" heart surgeon averages 150.

He's been around the block a few times, I think!

700 Dr. Shalit  Thu, Oct 30, 2008 5:20:26am

re: #19 Shug

14 - jcm - Your system reminds me of the ORIGINAL AT&T Wireless, pre-Cingular. My company still has an account from that era - ATT to Cingular to ATT. We were able to throw away the string with the first merger.

19. Shug - Depends somewhat on your carrier, and most have the Motorola Q and the Samsung Blackjack II. Either one would probably work for you. There are other good ones from LG, Nokia, Pantech and HTC, and of course the iPhone, all of which are more or less "carrier specific." For the record, I have a Motorola Q (from pre-iPhone days), carrier is ATT, and am satisfied with it.

-S-


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