Overnight Open Thread

Charles Johnsonfollow me on twitter
Open • Fri Nov 7, 2008 at 11:10 pm PST • Views: 231

Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.

William Butler Yeats

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1383 comments

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1 gmsc  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:10:40pm

¡llǝɯs pɐǝɹɥʇ ʍǝu ˙ ˙ ˙ ɯɯɯɯ

2 gmsc  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:11:01pm

I mean . . Mmmm . . . New thread smell!

3 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:11:37pm

Translation?

4 Maximu§  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:12:58pm

WooHoo...Its Friday Night!

5 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:13:13pm

"Truly, you have a dizzying intellect."

"Just wait till I get going!"

6 itellu3times  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:13:26pm

... and mome raths outgrabe.

7 gop_patriot  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:13:40pm

re: #5 logboy

Is that from Princess Bride?

8 laZardo  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:13:49pm

Uh...um..."nevermore?"

9 Killgore Trout  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:14:13pm

re: #3 logboy

The Second Coming
2nd verse...

Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.
The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
When a vast image out of Spiritus Mundi
Troubles my sight: somewhere in sands of the desert
A shape with lion body and the head of a man,
A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun,
Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
Reel shadows of the indignant desert birds.
The darkness drops again; but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?
10 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:14:18pm

re: #7 gop_patriot

Is that from Princess Bride?

Inconceivable!

11 tradewind  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:15:12pm

Whenever I hear anyone talk of falconers nowdays, all I can see is a Saudi in a keffiyah with a hooded hunting bird on his arm.

12 gop_patriot  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:15:12pm

re: #10 logboy

Inconceivable!

I do not think that word means what you think it means...

13 [deleted]  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:15:29pm
14 Slumbering Behemoth  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:15:49pm

re: #5 logboy

Here you go.

15 gulfloafer  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:15:54pm

Outstanding!

16 laZardo  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:15:58pm

re: #13 Iron Fist

Cheers.

17 CyanSnowHawk  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:16:00pm

re: #13 Iron Fist

Night Guys and Dolls. I'm barely ambulatory. See ya tomorrow.

Iron feet?

18 Maximu§  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:16:11pm

Take care Iron Fist

19 BlueCanuck  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:16:47pm

re: #12 gop_patriot

I do not think that word means what you think it means...

My name is Inigo Montoya, you killed my father now prepare to die.

20 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:16:54pm

Hello. My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die.

21 CyanSnowHawk  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:16:57pm

I'm out too. Have to work tomorrow.

22 stevieray  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:17:12pm

One day I'm gonna memorize that poem.

[Ooo. There's that feeling again... in the pit of my stomach.
Cold.
Empty.
Dread.]

23 BlueCanuck  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:17:31pm

re: #20 logboy

GMTA. :)

/but you got the word I missed.

24 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:17:51pm

damn! you beat me!

25 Maximu§  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:18:19pm

Hey I heard Gears of War II came out today.

26 KingKenrod  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:19:31pm

Obama the Job Killer. Unless you want to work for the government.

McCain could have won the election with a theme like that...

27 LemonJoose  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:20:02pm

Can I be wantonly boorish in this new thread?

28 Killgore Trout  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:20:26pm

re: #14 Slumbering Behemoth

Brilliant movie.

29 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:20:56pm

"With all dead, well, with all dead there's usually only one thing you can do."

"What's that?"

"Go through his clothes and look for loose change. "

30 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:22:23pm

I hate it when I post something brilliant right as a new thread is up and running.
///
Here they come, and I'm ducking.

31 gop_patriot  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:22:50pm

re: #23 BlueCanuck

re: #24 logboy

LOL

/You fool! You fell for one of the classic blunders! The most famous is, "Never get involved in a land war in Asia"! But only slightly less well known is this... "Never go in against a Sicilian, when death is on the line!"

//had to look that one up to double check. lol

32 BlueCanuck  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:22:59pm

"Key? what key?"

"Okay Fezig, rip his arms off."

"Oh, you mean this key."

33 laZardo  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:23:44pm

re: #25 Maximu§

Perhaps fittingly for the times, I seem to want this game a bit more...

34 hermit  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:23:49pm

anyone else immune to iocane powder?

35 gop_patriot  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:24:22pm

re: #25 Maximu§

Hey I heard Gears of War II came out today.

My son stood in line for it last night, and is playing XBox Live with his friends right now. Apparently they like it.

36 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:25:04pm

"I just work for Vizzini to pay the bills. There's not a lot of money in revenge. "

37 gop_patriot  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:25:51pm

re: #14 Slumbering Behemoth

So, what music are you listening to tonight?

38 hermit  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:25:55pm

anybody want a peanut?

39 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:26:48pm

re: #37 gop_patriot

So, what music are you listening to tonight?

I had the AC/DC channel on XM Radio playing for a while.

40 gop_patriot  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:26:49pm

Is this a kissing book?

41 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:27:14pm

"Surrender!"

"You mean you wish to surrender to me? Very well, I accept. "

42 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:27:51pm

What rough beast tap dances towards Jerusalem?

43 gop_patriot  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:28:18pm

re: #39 logboy

I had the AC/DC channel on XM Radio playing for a while.

They have their own channel? Nice. I don't have satellite radio, but my best friend does. I'll have to set her radio to that channel the next time I'm at her house. She's not an AC/DC fan. lol

44 Slumbering Behemoth  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:28:21pm

re: #28 Killgore Trout

No question. There are those who speculate that the mom & pop video rental era of the '80s led to this box office flop becoming a cult classic. I am inclined to believe that.

45 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:28:26pm

re: #28 Killgore Trout

Brilliant movie.

A Rob Reiner film? The only one he did that was brilliant was "This Is Spinal Tap". And maybe "Stand By Me".

46 gmsc  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:28:35pm

re: #38 hermit

anybody want a peanut?

"Kindly do not offer my god a peanut! Please PAY FOR YOUR PURCHASES AND GET OUT! ...and come again!"
-Apu Nahasapeemapetilon

47 spidly  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:28:44pm

re: #9 Killgore Trout

The Second Coming
2nd verse...


on that topic
my wife watched the messiah's acceptance speech and the crowd frightened her. They put visions of the "left behind" series in her head.
Yeah, I don't know why she read the books but then I haven't so,

48 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:29:03pm

re: #38 hermit

Can you say anaphylactic shock?

49 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:29:32pm

"I can't compete with you physically, and you're no match for my brains."

" You're that smart?"

"Let me put it this way. Have you ever heard of Plato, Aristotle, Socrates?"

"Yes."

"Morons. "

50 BlueCanuck  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:29:57pm

re: #44 Slumbering Behemoth

No question. There are those who speculate that the mom & pop video rental era of the '80s led to this box office flop becoming a cult classic. I am inclined to believe that.

Ever see the trailer on the special edition DVD? When I saw that I knew why it flopped at the box office. Poor marketing department didn't know how to approach the movie. Even my mom loves the movie.

51 hermit  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:30:04pm

re: #46 gmsc

"The dates are off." Salla

52 ClosetConservative  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:30:24pm

urff yoo knoww withhh thhe humannn kunditonnn...

I'm out of energy. Good night, all!

53 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:30:53pm

re: #49 logboy

"I can't compete with you physically, and you're no match for my brains."

" You're that smart?"

"Let me put it this way. Have you ever heard of Plato, Aristotle, Socrates?"

"Yes."

"Morons. "

Inconceivable! (It's a new OTC birth control pill!)

54 hermit  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:30:55pm

re: #48 calcajun

right now? um,...no.
/slurp

55 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:31:10pm

"Rodents Of Unusual Size? I don't think they exist. "

56 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:31:15pm

re: #45 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

A Rob Reiner film? The only one he did that was brilliant was "This Is Spinal Tap". And maybe "Stand By Me".

I should have added IMO...

57 UncleSam  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:31:19pm

re: #27 LemonJoose

Can I be wantonly boorish in this new thread?

You can be wanton, but not boorish.

58 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:31:29pm

re: #51 hermit

"The dates are off." Salla

No, the line is a more pithy, "Bad dates."

59 tradewind  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:31:32pm

Brewer and Shipley never could have made this one up:
Best example of ' cognitive dissonance ' ever...

60 LemonJoose  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:31:43pm

re: #35 gop_patriot

I bought it before I went out tonight. However it's too late fore me to fire it up tonight. It will have to wait until tomorrow. It got great reviews, though.

61 hermit  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:31:52pm

re: #55 logboy

"Rodents Of Unusual Size? I don't think they exist. "

check the white house in late January...

62 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:32:12pm

re: #55 logboy

"Rodents Of Unusual Size? I don't think they exist. "

You didn't watch BHO's press conference?

63 hermit  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:32:18pm

re: #58 calcajun

thank you... i knew it was better

64 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:32:35pm

re: #53 calcajun

Inconceivable! (It's a new OTC birth control pill!)

"You mock my pain!"

"Life is pain, Highness. Anyone who says differently is selling something. "

65 Scion9  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:33:09pm

Yeats was an interesting figure. He was deep into mysticism, seances, channeling, automatic writing and was involved with the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn. That poem heavily references his own mystical beliefs. More than just a bit batty.

66 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:33:58pm

re: #64 logboy

"You mock my pain!"

"Life is pain, Highness. Anyone who says differently is selling something. "

HUMPERDINK! HUMPERDINK!

67 gop_patriot  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:34:26pm

re: #55 logboy

"Rodents Of Unusual Size? I don't think they exist. "

Every time we're at the zoo, my kids have to see the R.O.U.S.-es, aka the capybara. They actually call it that, and it's fun when everyone around you knows exactly what you're talking about. LOL

68 Inquisitive  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:35:23pm

re: #25 Maximu§

Hey I heard Gears of War II came out today.


Oh yes...my son got his at midnight...came home and the internet was off..LOL/LOL/LOL...he has been playing since he woke up this morn...it is now 1:30 a.m. and he just came through..again saying how great it is and that I should come and watch...

69 gmsc  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:35:30pm
70 Amy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:35:39pm

Charles,

I'm a huge W.B. Yeats fan, and this is one of my favorite Yeats poems. It's very appropriate for this dark time.

71 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:35:42pm

"We'll never survive."

"Nonsense. You're only saying that because no one ever has. "

72 hermit  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:35:49pm

re: #64 logboy

"Life is pain, Highness. Anyone who says differently is selling something. "

like change

73 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:36:21pm

Whats sad is that I know all these quotes from memory.

74 Slumbering Behemoth  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:37:02pm

re: #37 gop_patriot

Hey, what a strange question. Okay, not all that strange, but it catches me off guard that anyone would ask. Earlier, some Slayer. Later, something from a band called Lacuna Coil. Then some Twisted Sister, thanks to another Lizard's post. Now, some Monkey3.

What are you listening to tonight?

75 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:38:24pm

OK, last one.

"You seem a decent fellow. I hate to kill you."

"You seem a decent fellow. I hate to die. "

76 RTLM  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:38:33pm

Led Zeppelin

77 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:40:00pm

re: #69 gmsc

Star Trek: Time Warp

;)

Dammit, Jim. I'm a doctor; not a quantum mechanic!

78 gmsc  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:40:31pm

re: #77 calcajun

Dammit, Jim. I'm a doctor; not a quantum mechanic!

"Bones, it's Pirate Roberts!"

"He Dread, Jim".

79 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:42:17pm

re: #78 gmsc

"Bones, it's Pirate Roberts!"

"He Dread, Jim".

That's rotten even by my pitiful standards

80 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:42:36pm

re: #71 logboy

"We'll never survive."

"Nonsense. You're only saying that because no one ever has. "

Westley: [as he is unsuccessfully fighting Fezzik] Look, are you just fiddling around with me or what?
Fezzik: I just want you to feel you're doing well. I hate for people to die embarrassed.

81 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:43:39pm

Oh come on. Wakey wakey!

82 NomadOfNorad  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:44:11pm

Does anyone know why loading an LGF thread page, like this one, would cause FireFox's pop-up blocker to react? I just got "Firefox prevented this site from opening a pop-up window." on this thread, and the previous thread I was on.

Charles? Did you implement some kind of mechanism to inform users of private messages to them, or something? Or is this something where one of the banner ads is sneaking pop-up ads in under the radar?

83 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:44:26pm

I think everyone is pooped out from the election. I know I am.

84 garycooper  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:44:26pm

Speaking of dreadful feelings and movies, I just got done watching this brilliant Swedish vampire flick, "Let The Right One In." Damn, it was good!

Vampire books and movies are all the rage once again, though they never totally go out of style. They're the Undead, after all. But this movie adds a little something to the genre I guarantee you haven't seen before. Maybe a few little somethings.

85 redc1c4  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:44:37pm

re: #4 Maximu§

WooHoo...Its Friday Night!

you mean it isn't *always* fryday night?

/white smoke

86 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:44:54pm

re: #82 NomadOfNorad

Does anyone know why loading an LGF thread page, like this one, would cause FireFox's pop-up blocker to react? I just got "Firefox prevented this site from opening a pop-up window." on this thread, and the previous thread I was on.

Charles? Did you implement some kind of mechanism to inform users of private messages to them, or something? Or is this something where one of the banner ads is sneaking pop-up ads in under the radar?

Could be all the copyrighted material we're posting. ;)

87 gop_patriot  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:45:37pm

re: #74 Slumbering Behemoth

Heh. I asked because you've posted some music in the past on overnight threads. :p I'm listening to Avenged Sevenfold, earlier it was Stevie Ray Vaughan.

Then there's this one song that's country of all things- but it reminds me summer down here in the South- so even though I'm a city girl, I just love it. :)

88 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:45:46pm

re: #81 calcajun

Oh come on. Wakey wakey!

"Wakey wakey eggs and bakey!"

89 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:45:57pm

re: #84 garycooper

Speaking of dreadful feelings and movies, I just got done watching this brilliant Swedish vampire flick, "Let The Right One In." Damn, it was good!

Vampire books and movies are all the rage once again, though they never totally go out of style. They're the Undead, after all. But this movie adds a little something to the genre I guarantee you haven't seen before. Maybe a few little somethings.

Wrote an unpublished one a few years back. Thinking of re-tooling it now

90 gmsc  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:46:08pm

Trivia Question: In English, what is the only day of the week that is a perfect anagram of another English word?

91 redc1c4  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:46:43pm

re: #26 KingKenrod

Obama the Job Killer. Unless you want to work for the government.

McCain could have won the election with a theme like that...

too bad it's obvious he never wanted to win.

92 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:47:06pm

re: #90 gmsc

Trivia Question: In English, what is the only day of the week that is a perfect anagram of another English word?

How dare you make my Merlot marinated brain work at this hour!

93 lostlakehiker  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:47:21pm

Decades ago, I ran across the segment of Princess Bride in which the man in black climbs the cliff and fences to victory, in a sci-fi anthology. The host of the anthology insisted that the whole book was an unsung classic, and I enjoyed the segment, but thought no more of it and didn't hunt down the book. Silly me.

It's not just a cult classic. It really is a classic.

94 Scion9  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:47:36pm

re: #84 garycooper

Hmmm. I'll have to check that one out.
[Link: www.imdb.com...]

95 gmsc  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:48:07pm

re: #88 logboy

"Wakey wakey eggs and bakey!"

Sounds great! You can't beat Bacon!

96 Slumbering Behemoth  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:48:19pm

re: #50 BlueCanuck

I have that DVD, but I've never watched any of the "extras". The marketing team must have done a horrible job because I never heard about the film until I saw it on BetaMax. Than again I was a teen at the time of it's release, I was focused on other things.

97 laZardo  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:48:25pm

Okay...for some reason I thought you were all quoting either Kill Bill, Grindhouse or Pulp Fiction...

98 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:48:51pm

re: #93 lostlakehiker

Decades ago, I ran across the segment of Princess Bride in which the man in black climbs the cliff and fences to victory, in a sci-fi anthology. The host of the anthology insisted that the whole book was an unsung classic, and I enjoyed the segment, but thought no more of it and didn't hunt down the book. Silly me.

It's not just a cult classic. It really is a classic.

Hat tip to Mark Knopfler for his soundtrack, too. He did a bang-up job on "Local Hero" (another quiet classic)

99 NomadOfNorad  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:49:50pm

So, anyone else has been having pop-up blocker warnings? Hello?

100 gop_patriot  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:50:30pm

re: #99 NomadOfNorad

So, anyone else has been having pop-up blocker warnings? Hello?

Nope, sorry. :/

101 redc1c4  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:50:30pm

re: #39 logboy

I had the AC/DC channel on XM Radio playing for a while.

only problem with that is that it's supposed to be the Punk channel...

don't get me wrong, i likes me some AC/DC, but fuck oh dear, i can only stand to hear the same songs so many times...

bring back the punk!

102 wordwarp  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:50:46pm

Charles -

I've been reading this site daily since probably 12/01 -- and this is the first time you've unleashed the Yeats.

Do you really think it's going to be that bad?

Does having Rahmbo in the White House make it any less likely that the center will not hold?

103 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:51:04pm

re: #97 laZardo

Okay...for some reason I thought you were all quoting either Kill Bill, Grindhouse or Pulp Fiction...

I dare you to find a pawnshop scene in Princess Bride. And no one talks about "dead n***r storage" in Humperdink's castle.

104 BlueCanuck  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:51:05pm

re: #64 logboy

"You mock my pain!"

"Life is pain, Highness. Anyone who says differently is selling something. "

That actually is a Bhudda quote, paraphrased: "Life is suffering."re: #97 laZardo

Welcome to the "Princess Bride" Thread.

105 redc1c4  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:52:22pm

re: #27 LemonJoose

Can I be wantonly boorish in this new thread?

depends: what are you wearing and how much booze did you bring?

106 BlueCanuck  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:52:23pm

Oops, forgot to post one comment and got the other one mixed up.

/PIMF.

107 laZardo  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:52:54pm

re: #104 BlueCanuck

Does this Bride still count?

108 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:53:01pm

re: #97 laZardo

Okay...for some reason I thought you were all quoting either Kill Bill, Grindhouse or Pulp Fiction...

"I want you to go in that bag, and find my wallet."

"Which one is it?"

"It's the one that says Bad Motherf-cker "

109 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:53:19pm

re: #99 NomadOfNorad

So, anyone else has been having pop-up blocker warnings? Hello?

Not here, never.

110 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:54:10pm

re: #102 wordwarp

Charles -

I've been reading this site daily since probably 12/01 -- and this is the first time you've unleashed the Yeats.

Do you really think it's going to be that bad?

Does having Rahmbo in the White House make it any less likely that the center will not hold?

May a venture an observation. Rham Emanuel served in the IDF during Gulf War I. That tells me he is in some sense pro-Israel. He is also a political partisan of the first order. If BHO makes any moves to sell-out Israel, or give amazin concessions to Iran, it will be Rham that finds a way to push BHO under the bus and not the other way around.

111 redc1c4  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:54:20pm

re: #48 calcajun

Can you say anaphylactic shock?

been there, done that... not real fun.

112 middlecon  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:54:21pm

re: #102 wordwarp

Charles -

I've been reading this site daily since probably 12/01 -- and this is the first time you've unleashed the Yeats.

Do you really think it's going to be that bad?

Does having Rahmbo in the White House make it any less likely that the center will not hold?

I think this is a reference to other blogs going with the birth certificate story ad nauseum. Charles made a great 'Country first' statement a few threads ago, he's the farthest thing from a doom and gloomer and I respect him completely for that.

113 gop_patriot  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:54:50pm

So am I the only girl here?

114 logboy  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:55:15pm

re: #99 NomadOfNorad

So, anyone else has been having pop-up blocker warnings? Hello?

Check your puter for spyware.

115 Outrider  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:55:24pm

re: #105 redc1c4

Dude. I put that toon you posted up on my site via the code. It was excellent!

116 laZardo  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:55:40pm

re: #108 logboy

"...what!?"

/really wants to watch that...but can't find it

117 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:56:07pm

re: #111 redc1c4

Me too--at age 12. 10 cc of adrenaline and puking up breakfast and lunch sideways on an x-ray table. Not fun.

118 tradewind  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:56:10pm
Three hours of canvassing for Obama got you a thirty dollar prepaid Visa card


Let's just hope this isn't representative of BHO's core constituency:
Note that the site had to disable comments. Wonder why.../sarc/
[Link: www.wthr.com...]

119 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:56:28pm

re: #101 redc1c4

only problem with that is that it's supposed to be the Punk channel...

don't get me wrong, i likes me some AC/DC, but fuck oh dear, i can only stand to hear the same songs so many times...

bring back the punk!

The whole idea of "Punk Music" was that it was different. Anti-establishment. It was. And 99.9% of it it sucked. Which is why the genre lasted about 3 years.

120 gmsc  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:57:07pm

re: #90 gmsc

Trivia Question: In English, what is the only day of the week that is a perfect anagram of another English word?

re: #92 calcajun

How dare you make my Merlot marinated brain work at this hour!

To relieve the Merlot-marinated brains out there, the day of the week is MONDAY, which is a perfect anagram of DYNAMO.

121 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:57:38pm

re: #119 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

The whole idea of "Punk Music" was that it was different. Anti-establishment. It was. And 99.9% of it it sucked. Which is why the genre lasted about 3 years.

PIMF- not it it...

122 Outrider  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:57:55pm

re: #119 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

The whole idea of "Punk Music" was that it was different. Anti-establishment. It was. And 99.9% of it it sucked. Which is why the genre lasted about 3 years.

but if it didn't suck, then it would be establishment worthy, in which case it couldn't be called punk. ;-)>

123 stevieray  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:58:09pm

re: #99 NomadOfNorad

So, anyone else has been having pop-up blocker warnings? Hello?

Someone was on an earlier thread. I'm running firefox now, and I got nuttin'.

Are you using an add-on ad blocker?

124 Macker  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:58:18pm

re: #9 Killgore Trout

Dang it, I thought you meant this Second Coming. Frak! My bad.

125 middlecon  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:58:33pm

re: #113 gop_patriot

So am I the only girl here?

*crickets*

sounds like it lol

126 NomadOfNorad  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:58:48pm

Well, I broke down, went into the pop-up-blocker and set littlegreenfootballs.com to Allow, loaded this page again, and got...
nothing, no pop-up. WTF?!?

I wonder what triggered off the pop-up-blocker warning? :-%P%

127 calcajun  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:59:15pm

Nite all. This rough beast must slouch off to its slumber chambers.

128 laZardo  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:59:19pm

re: #101 redc1c4

If my bros weren't Obamatons you'd definitely enjoy hanging out with them...

129 tradewind  Fri, Nov 7, 2008 11:59:56pm

re: #113 gop_patriot

Nope.
But the site does seem a little testosterone-heavy tonight, comparatively speaking...

130 Slumbering Behemoth  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:00:21am

re: #87 gop_patriot

She's kinda cute (well, lotta cute). Not particularly into C&W, but there is one tune that has been a favorite of mine since I was a kid. A classic from '81.

131 logboy  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:01:17am

weird. The reply and quote buttons disappeared. Now they're back.

132 NomadOfNorad  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:01:18am

re: #123 stevieray

Someone was on an earlier thread. I'm running firefox now, and I got nuttin'.

Are you using an add-on ad blocker?

That might have been me there, too. Posted about it a coupla threads back or so.

No, I'm not using an add-on ad blocker, I'm using the one that comes built into FireFox. At least I think it's built in, since I don't remember installing one on it. :D

133 gmsc  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:01:24am

re: #124 Macker

Dang it, I thought you meant this Second Coming. Frak! My bad.

Some of the Battlestar Galactica music is just classic and haunting.

134 gop_patriot  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:01:51am

re: #125 middlecon

Uh oh. ;)

re: #129 tradewind

Oh good, and yes it does. LOL

135 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:01:57am

re: #122 Outrider

but if it didn't suck, then it would be establishment worthy, in which case it couldn't be called punk. ;-)>

Right! I think... ; )

136 calcajun  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:02:10am

re: #129 tradewind

Nope.
But the site does seem a little testosterone-heavy tonight, comparatively speaking...

Cannot resist this one. Testosterone heavy? We're all quoting "The Princess Bride". Shit. That's almost as bad as doing show tunes and Judy Garland standards.

137 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:02:46am

re: #113 gop_patriot

So am I the only girl here?

Are you looking for a date? : )))

138 calcajun  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:04:11am

re: #137 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Are you looking for a date? : )))

Not to mention the "Star Trek" riffs. Who out there is living in Mom and Dad's basement?

139 tradewind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:04:30am

re: #130 Slumbering Behemoth

Yeah, that song came up when we talked about possible election night scenarios...
'we can always leave and go to the farm for the duration'...

140 stevieray  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:05:32am

re: #132 NomadOfNorad

Do you have a little red stopsign in the upper right corner of your browser?

141 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:05:56am

re: #110 calcajun

May a venture an observation. Rham Emanuel served in the IDF during Gulf War I. That tells me he is in some sense pro-Israel. He is also a political partisan of the first order. If BHO makes any moves to sell-out Israel, or give amazin concessions to Iran, it will be Rham that finds a way to push BHO under the bus and not the other way around.

he was allegedly in the IDF for the duration of Gulf War II, which is not the same thing as serving in the IDF... this story smells bad, if only for the fact that from start to finish, you'd barely have time to complete training, let alone actually serve in the time period involved.

/not cyunical, just experienced. %-)

142 tradewind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:06:16am

re: #136 calcajun

Anecdotally, I've always noticed that guys seemed to love TPB more than girls.

143 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:06:22am

re: #138 calcajun

Not to mention the "Star Trek" riffs. Who out there is living in Mom and Dad's basement?

Shit, my Mom is living in my basement.

144 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:06:41am

re: #126 NomadOfNorad

Well, I broke down, went into the pop-up-blocker and set littlegreenfootballs.com to Allow, loaded this page again, and got...
nothing, no pop-up. WTF?!?

I wonder what triggered off the pop-up-blocker warning? :-%P%

at your age, medication is the most likely suspect. %-)

/white smoke

145 Outrider  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:07:16am

re: #141 redc1c4

he was allegedly in the IDF for the duration of Gulf War II, which is not the same thing as serving in the IDF... this story smells bad, if only for the fact that from start to finish, you'd barely have time to complete training, let alone actually serve in the time period involved.

/not cyunical, just experienced. %-)

Thought he served as a volunteer civilian, which in itself is a good thing.

146 calcajun  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:07:18am

re: #142 tradewind

Anecdotally, I've always noticed that guys seemed to love TPB more than girls.

We're the ones who like dialogue.

147 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:07:39am

i wondered when someone was going to quote "the center cannot hold" from Billy Yeats, thanks for that -- never remembered how apposite the last two lines are, however. Now for another Irishman -- everybody on three now, one, two... all that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

148 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:08:25am

re: #115 Outrider

Dude. I put that toon you posted up on my site via the code. It was excellent!

danke... i'm w*rking on some ideas, and i still have to rew*rk my "we fucked" screed from tuesday night.

WOLVERINES!

149 NomadOfNorad  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:08:26am

re: #140 stevieray

Do you have a little red stopsign in the upper right corner of your browser?

Nope.

150 calcajun  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:08:36am

re: #143 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Shit, my Mom is living in my basement.

Sir, you have my pity. Have you considered Poe's "Cask of Amontillado"? It might be instructive on dealing with Mom. ///

151 middlecon  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:08:38am

Personally I don't think serving in the IDF makes it a lock that you would be a hawk for Isreal. I have no idea what Emanuel is in regards to Isreali policy. But there are plenty of peaceniks in Isreal who still serve in the IDF.

152 talon_262  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:09:08am

re: #136 calcajun

Cannot resist this one. Testosterone heavy? We're all quoting "The Princess Bride". Shit. That's almost as bad as doing show tunes and Judy Garland standards.

Ain't nothing wrong with guys liking The Princess Bride...it's got something for everyone and a damn good cast to boot. As a matter of fact, the fact that's it's a clean, funny movie that we can let kids watch over and over again while there are lots of injokes and quotable bits for the adults is a testament to the movie's staying power. It really is a classic...and a helluva lot better than most of that rotgut they market to kids nowadays.

/young old man mode off ;-P

153 NomadOfNorad  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:09:23am

re: #138 calcajun

Not to mention the "Star Trek" riffs. Who out there is living in Mom and Dad's basement?

I'm in northeastern Florida. This house doesn't HAVE a basement.

154 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:09:36am

re: #150 calcajun

Sir, you have my pity. Have you considered Poe's "Cask of Amontillado"? It might be instructive on dealing with Mom. ///

I was kidding.

155 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:09:49am

re: #145 Outrider

Thought he served as a volunteer civilian, which in itself is a good thing.

not saying it isn't, but that's not the same thing as being in the IDF, at least in my mind. IDF=Soldier, Sailor, Airman, not sillvillian tag along.

156 gop_patriot  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:10:08am

re: #130 Slumbering Behemoth

She's kinda cute (well, lotta cute). Not particularly into C&W, but there is one tune that has been a favorite of mine since I was a kid. A classic from '81.

I love the way she sings "Cause there ain't nothin like the sound of a cooler slushin, on the bed of yo truck". LOL

And Bocephus! I love Hank Jr.
I guess I listen to more country than I thought. I'm picky though, don't like the pop stuff much at all; if I'm going country it's either bluegrass or seriously country. I remember Dixieland Delight by Alabama, that's a good one, and I like Alison Krauss and Charlie Daniels.

157 calcajun  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:10:24am

re: #152 talon_262

Ain't nothing wrong with guys liking The Princess Bride...it's got something for everyone and a damn good cast to boot. As a matter of fact, the fact that's it's a clean, funny movie that we can let kids watch over and over again while there are lots of injokes and quotable bits for the adults is a testament to the movie's staying power. It really is a classic...and a helluva lot better than most of that rotgut they market to kids nowadays.

/young old man mode off ;-P

I know. It's just the title. "Inigo's Revenge" sounds so much more butch.

158 gop_patriot  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:10:42am

re: #136 calcajun

Cannot resist this one. Testosterone heavy? We're all quoting "The Princess Bride". Shit. That's almost as bad as doing show tunes and Judy Garland standards.

ROFLMAO

159 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:10:51am

re: #150 calcajun

Sir, you have my pity. Have you considered Poe's "Cask of Amontillado"? It might be instructive on dealing with Mom. ///

You mean the movie "Psycho" wouldn't work?
/

160 stevieray  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:11:15am

re: #149 NomadOfNorad

Well, then you don't have AdBlock Plus. That's the only one I know anything about, so I'm completely out of advice. Sorry!

161 calcajun  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:11:22am

re: #153 NomadOfNorad

I'm in northeastern Florida. This house doesn't HAVE a basement.

OK, garage then.///

162 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:11:33am

re: #101 redc1c4

I say this as a fan of re: #90 gmsc

fraidy (cat)?

163 calcajun  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:12:21am

re: #159 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

You mean the movie "Psycho" wouldn't work?
/

Oh, go take a shower.///

164 talon_262  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:12:38am

re: #145 Outrider

Thought he served as a volunteer civilian, which in itself is a good thing.

Although I don't care for Rahm's political doings since his Clinton days, I do give him respect for volunteering for duty with the IDF (even as a civilian) during GWI.

165 NomadOfNorad  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:12:44am

re: #150 calcajun

Sir, you have my pity. Have you considered Poe's "Cask of Amontillado"? It might be instructive on dealing with Mom. ///

Uhhhmmm... do pay attention to Poe's short story involving the black cat, too...
///

166 calcajun  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:13:00am

re: #158 gop_patriot

Thanks. Nice to see someone got the humor.///

167 Sylvester_T_Cat  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:13:02am

re: #99 NomadOfNorad

So, anyone else has been having pop-up blocker warnings? Hello?

With IE7/WinXP I run a couple of cookie-checkers that sometimes block cookies from one or another of the Pajamas Medias ads. Couldn't say just which one, but it's nothing serious. Just some advertiser that uses cookies that are maybe a bit too enthusiastic about tracking your web-surfing, perhaps. I never pay much attention to the pop-up blocker icon. That's lit half the time I'm browsing anyway ;-). Long as they're blocked I'm happy.

Just now experimenting with the Safari browser that Charles suggested the other day. It does seem to speed up LGF nicely ;-). Now if it would just speed up my reading speed, chuckle.

168 tradewind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:13:03am

re: #141 redc1c4

Rahm Emmanuel (how ironic that his last name means God With Us) has always seemed one of the most rabidly partisan, mean-spirited, Dem pols around. He and Ira Magaziner were major sources of palace intrigue/mischief makers for Billary. Change? Not so much...

169 middlecon  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:13:11am

Ok in doing a little research Emanuel's appointment by Obama pissed off some Palestenians so thats a good thing:

Palestinians were angry over Obama’s appointment of Emanuel as Chief of Staff, especially after his father Benjamin Emanuel was interviewed by the Hebrew daily Maariv in an article entitled “Our Man in the White House.” He stated: "Obviously, he will influence the President to be pro-Israel. Why shouldn't he do it? What is he, an Arab? He's not going to clean the floor of the White House." Subhi Abu Ishira on the Palestinian NGO network responded "With the appointment of this Zionist, Barack Obama is proving that he is more Zionist than the Zionists." The Window into Palestine blog referred to Emanuel as "the son of a terrorist, a real living terrorist."[41][42][43] He referred to Benjamin Emanuel’s participation in the Irgun, which the Anglo–American Committee of Inquiry and the New York Times labeled a terrorist group for its bombings of Arab and British civilian and government targets.[44][45][46] According to the New York Times Benjamin Emanuel "passed secret codes" for Irgun leader Menachem Begin.[47]

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

170 Outrider  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:13:22am

re: #153 NomadOfNorad

I'm in northeastern Florida. This house doesn't HAVE a basement.

Same here. If I go into the basement I'd be pulling a Jimmy Hoffa impersonation.

171 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:13:34am

re: #164 talon_262

For some curious reason the mention of him "getting so mad he jabbed a knife into a dinner table" and "sending his opponent a dead fish" made me grin evilly.

172 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:13:39am

re: #119 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Wasn't punk the same song for three years?

Hey, new trivia question: Who was the first rock artist to be labeled "punk?"

173 calcajun  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:13:40am

re: #165 NomadOfNorad

Uhhhmmm... do pay attention to Poe's short story involving the black cat, too...
///

Yeah. That one floored me. :)

174 gmsc  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:13:40am

re: #162 LynnfromNZ

I say this as a fan of re: #90 gmsc

fraidy (cat)?

Wait - how did my trivia question get into a punk thread?!?

175 BlueCanuck  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:13:52am

re: #142 tradewind

Anecdotally, I've always noticed that guys seemed to love TPB more than girls.

Wouldn't know about that, but I have had a couple of girl friends that would go on a TPB riff with me at the drop of a hat.

/then again I run in a different crowd.

176 NomadOfNorad  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:14:15am

re: #161 calcajun

OK, garage then.///

No garage here, either. We used to have a carport, but enclosed it to expand the size of the living room, which is now quite big.

177 gop_patriot  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:14:32am

re: #137 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Are you looking for a date? : )))

LOL!

178 calcajun  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:14:56am

re: #176 NomadOfNorad

No garage here, either. We used to have a carport, but enclosed it to expand the size of the living room, which is now quite big.

At least it ain't a double-wide.

179 LemonJoose  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:14:57am

In a sincere effort to avoid being boorish, I must warn you all in advance that the link below leads to a Youtube music video in which talented female marching band members wantonly parade their skills and assets for all the world to witness. Do not click if you object to wanton-ness! Hopefully my advance warning will preclude me from being accused of boorishness! :)

Destination Unknown - Alex Gaudino:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuLjTlSNbGg

180 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:14:58am

re: #169 middlecon

Ok in doing a little research Emanuel's appointment by Obama pissed off some Palestenians so thats a good thing:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

what doesn't piss off a Pali?

181 Outrider  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:15:03am

re: #172 LynnfromNZ

Wasn't punk the same song for three years?

Hey, new trivia question: Who was the first rock artist to be labeled "punk?"

Lou Reed

182 gmsc  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:15:07am

re: #173 calcajun

Yeah. That one floored me. :)

Speaking of which, enjoy The Tell Tale Heart (1953, animated - with a style Poe would enjoy!).

183 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:15:14am

re: #163 calcajun

Oh, go take a shower.///

Only if Jamie Lee Curtis is in there. Her mom Janet Leigh is wee bit too old.

184 stevieray  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:15:26am

re: #172 LynnfromNZ

Iggy?

185 calcajun  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:15:26am

OK..Bed time now.

C Ya

186 talon_262  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:15:30am

re: #166 calcajun

Thanks. Nice to see someone got the humor.///

Sorry...when I originally read you post, my humor button was broke./

;-P

187 calcajun  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:16:22am

re: #183 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Only if Jamie Lee Curtis is in there. Her mom Janet Leigh is wee bit too old.

and dead. Unless you like that sort of thing. BTW, Jamie Lee is in her mid-fifties now.

188 middlecon  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:16:37am

re: #172 LynnfromNZ

Wasn't punk the same song for three years?

Hey, new trivia question: Who was the first rock artist to be labeled "punk?"

Lets see first to be labed 'punk' hmmm...MC5?

189 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:17:33am

re: #122 Outrider

I will say The Clash's "Complete Control" is one of the most deeply thrilling three minutes and change I've ever heard committed to tape. If that and The Sex Pistols' "Bodies" was all punk had to offer, well, it was worth it.

190 IslandLibertarian  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:17:34am

"The Trip" with Peter Fonda, Bruce Dern, Dennis Hopper and some psychedelic babes is on Turner Underground...fits well with the thread poem...wow man, it's like I can hear your aura...don't bum my trip...

/what's a barack?

191 NomadOfNorad  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:18:38am

re: #173 calcajun

Yeah. That one floored me. :)

ROFL! Yeah, talk about a twist ending! Almost an M Night Shyamalan sorta thing. Muahahahahahaha!

192 LemonJoose  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:18:42am

re: #105 redc1c4

A lampshade, and enough for everybody.

193 talon_262  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:19:02am

re: #183 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Only if Jamie Lee Curtis is in there. Her mom Janet Leigh is wee bit too old.

You seen JLC in the Activia commercials lately? She looks pretty good for her age, but she's nowhere near the prime she was in Trading Places...when she was undressing in front of Dan Ackroyd, she was looking hot!

Then: DAMN!...just DAMN!
Now: Not so much...time catches up with everyone, I suppose.

194 rsbelax  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:19:07am

WOW... what a crazy roller coaster of a week, and it seems like all of this has only begun, haha. It's amazing how quickly things happen anymore and how big of an impact even the smallest events have on us and our economical and political surroundings. Im in my late 20's and I've gotta say this has been a humbling 2 months or so. Wonder if it's just me? I doubt it...

195 Outrider  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:19:57am

re: #190 IslandLibertarian

"The Trip" with Peter Fonda, Bruce Dern, Dennis Hopper and some psychedelic babes is on Turner Underground...fits well with the thread poem...wow man, it's like I can hear your aura...don't bum my trip...

/what's a barack?

the sound made when you chug a beer too quick

196 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:19:58am

re: #168 tradewind

Rahm Emmanuel (how ironic that his last name means God With Us) has always seemed one of the most rabidly partisan, mean-spirited, Dem pols around. He and Ira Magaziner were major sources of palace intrigue/mischief makers for Billary. Change? Not so much...

I'm Catholic, and I detest liberal Jews. But then again I detest all liberals, regardless of race and/or religion.
But Mark Levin is my hero. I absolutely love the guy. And no, I'm not gay.
What am I?

197 stevieray  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:20:00am

re: #190 IslandLibertarian

Got that on in the other room... I wander over and check it out from time to time. Roger Corman directed, Dennis Hopper and Peter Fonda star, written by Nicholson.

198 middlecon  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:20:19am

re: #179 LemonJoose

In a sincere effort to avoid being boorish, I must warn you all in advance that the link below leads to a Youtube music video in which talented female marching band members wantonly parade their skills and assets for all the world to witness. Do not click if you object to wanton-ness! Hopefully my advance warning will preclude me from being accused of boorishness! :)

Destination Unknown - Alex Gaudino:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuLjTlSNb Gg

3+ million views for this thing? People on youtube are desperate for some skin lol...but I approve lol

199 Scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:20:26am

I've heard conflicting stories about Rahm Emmanuel's being in the IDF. According to Rolling Stone, he wasn't. According to wikipedia he was. Sadly, Rolling Stone isn't really a more reliable of a source than wikipedia, so who knows.

200 AmeriDan  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:20:42am

re: #180 spidly

what doesn't piss off a Pali?

*raises hand*

Uh, dead Jews?

201 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:21:10am

re: #119 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

The whole idea of "Punk Music" was that it was different. Anti-establishment. It was. And 99.9% of it it sucked. Which is why the genre lasted about 3 years.

that's okay... i don't care about you.

punk lives still!
(it just smells funny...%-)

202 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:21:17am

re: #187 calcajun

and dead. Unless you like that sort of thing. BTW, Jamie Lee is in her mid-fifties now.

She's still hot, IMO. : )

203 tradewind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:22:28am

re: #179 LemonJoose

Seriously...
Three words:
Iron
Fist
Rule...

204 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:22:30am

re: #181 Outrider

that was retroactive. the first rock artist to have his style called punk in real time was Bruce Springsteen.

205 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:24:02am

re: #117 calcajun

Me too--at age 12. 10 cc of adrenaline and puking up breakfast and lunch sideways on an x-ray table. Not fun.

x3 for me: 1 full on shock, and 2 just really bad reactions that could have gone there.

1cc epi SQ, 50mg benadryl IM, 125mg methylprednisolone SIVP, and a medrol does pack, plus benadryl caps...

206 Slumbering Behemoth  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:24:42am

re: #156 gop_patriot

I've been a die-hard metal-head since I was ten, so take my opinion with the appropriate amount of salt: pop-country is crap. Nothing more than Brittany Spears with a twang. Meh.

I was shocked to find I like bluegrass, though I must admit I know nothing about it.

Some bluegrass/metal for ya.

207 AmeriDan  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:25:02am

re: #204 LynnfromNZ

that was retroactive. the first rock artist to have his style called punk in real time was Bruce Springsteen.

For spewing his political beliefs at me for years and years... I would agree that he is a punk.

208 tradewind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:25:15am

re: #196 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

I love Levin too. Just wish he'd limit the really high-decibel yelling to a few minutes per show.
It cracks me up when he says ' Get Off The Phone Ya Big Dope'...

209 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:25:19am

re: #196 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

I'm Catholic, and I detest liberal Jews. But then again I detest all liberals, regardless of race and/or religion.
But Mark Levin is my hero. I absolutely love the guy. And no, I'm not gay.
What am I?

hey there. do not detest the typical liberal Jew. they are insufferable, dead wrong and vote in a way that puts this country in peril, BUT they actually spend time and money practicing what they preach. at least at my Shul.

210 Outrider  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:25:22am

Dang. Now I'm in the mood for some Lou Reed.

211 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:25:34am

When the Ramones hit, and for those in New York it was the Dolls, everbody looked back to Reed, the Velvet Underground, Iggy, the Stooges, MC5 and the like for their antecedents -- I've seen them trace it out to Eddie Cochran -- and that's when the term "punk" became solidified to mean what we take it to mean today, but it was introduced for Springsteen's Greetings From Asbury Park, N.J.

212 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:26:06am

Taxing the intellectual estates of Yeats (the riposte of repost):

Sailing to Obamadom

That is no country for wise men. The hopeful
Awash in another's promises, hand-out elites
- Those tax'ed generations - at their hymn,
The gavel-falls, judicial-crowded seats,
County, State, or Supreme, amend articles dim
Constitution inked, re-inked, and dries.
Fraught with radical agenda all erect
Battlement against unageing intellect.

A self-made man is but a withered ass,
A tapped mind upon a stick, unless
Law clamps the hands and grasps, stronger grasps
For every pocket in its fiscal dress,
Nor is there educated school but studying
Monuments of its own magnificence;
And therefore I have sailed the sleaze and come
To the holy city of Obamadom.

Sages prostrate in The One's holy fire
As in golden rubric of a urinal stall,
Come from the holy fire, submit desire,
And be the credit-masters of my soul.
Consume my wealth away; to not retire
And mounted by a braying animal
It knows not what it taxes; and gather me
Into the artifice of prosperity.

Once out of nature I shall never take
My corporate form from any natural thing,
But such a form as Socialist goldsmiths make
Of stolen gold and gold pick-pocketing
To commit an sordid National rape;
Or set upon a golden cow to slay
To lords and ladies of Obamadom
Of what is past, or passing, or to come.

213 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:26:33am

re: #210 Outrider

Amen, my friend. Great video.

214 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:26:51am

re: #201 redc1c4

that's okay... i don't care about you.

punk lives still!
(it just smells funny...%-)

I'll save it- I'm listening to Elton John now.

215 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:27:06am

re: #200 AmeriDan

re: #180 spidly

what doesn't piss off a Pali?

*raises hand*

Uh, dead Jews?

"They didn't ALL die! damn them!"

nope, that pisses 'em off too.

216 BignJames  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:27:24am

re: #211 LynnfromNZ

Eddie Cochran?...that's pure rockabilly.

217 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:27:34am

re: #128 laZardo

If my bros weren't Obamatons you'd definitely enjoy hanging out with them...

suboptimal did an Obama rewrite to California Uber Alles the other night... i gave it to my friend, and his band may cover it...

i'll link here if they do.

218 talon_262  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:28:20am

re: #206 Slumbering Behemoth

Loves me some Hayseed Dixie...got hooked on them after hearing them do "Poop in a Jar" on Bob & Tom.

219 Outrider  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:29:43am
220 gmsc  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:30:54am

re: #219 Outrider

Need a heart of gold?

Or a heart of glass?

221 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:31:13am

re: #212 blackpajamas

... wow... can you do "Howl?"

222 Spiritualized  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:31:17am

Reuters is tackling the tough issues already:

Interest high in what kind of dog Obamas will get

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Many Americans are eager to hear President-elect Barack Obama's views on the financial crisis and foreign policy, but they appear just as anxious to know what kind of dog he will get his daughters.

As a "world citizen" I'd just like to say that I'm on the edge of my seat too.

223 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:32:12am

re: #216 BignJames

Punk is half speeded-up amplified rockabilly -- cf. The Clash's "Brand New Cadillac."

224 AmeriDan  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:32:21am

re: #215 spidly

"They didn't ALL die! damn them!"

nope, that pisses 'em off too.

Very true, the Jews will to live is very infuriating to Palis, Muslims, Arabs, etc. But they do have a "the more the merrier" type approach to their final solution of ridding the earth of Jews.

225 gmsc  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:32:44am

re: #222 Spiritualized

Reuters is tackling the tough issues already:

Interest high in what kind of dog Obamas will get

As a "world citizen" I'd just like to say that I'm on the edge of my seat too.

I understand it's important that it be hypoallergenic.

226 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:33:30am

re: #164 talon_262

Although I don't care for Rahm's political doings since his Clinton days, I do give him respect for volunteering for duty with the IDF (even as a civilian) during GWI.

has that been verified with Zahal?

227 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:33:54am

re: #217 redc1c4

One of my bros, who dwells in the room across from mine is also on LJ, as it happens. You could pass it to him...especially since he has an upside-down American flag sticker with "Hello, USA!" written on it in Sharpie posted on his door...

228 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:34:07am

re: #214 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

229 Outrider  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:34:55am

Here is an artist not many heard of, but I enjoy

230 NomadOfNorad  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:35:02am

Well, I'm heading to bed now...

231 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:35:54am

re: #172 LynnfromNZ

Wasn't punk the same song for three years?

Hey, new trivia question: Who was the first rock artist to be labeled "punk?"

Ramones... Spruce Bringsteen is a piker.

/even if i *did* see him at Winterland %-)

232 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:35:55am

re: #221 LynnfromNZ

... wow... can you do "Howl?"

Ginsberg's Howl? That's a bit longer of a piece (eek!).

233 gop_patriot  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:36:52am

re: #206 Slumbering Behemoth

Pretty good! I love the banjo.

/I think I saw those guys at our local Walmart last Christmas. No kidding, there are people who come into our little city once a year, it's a huge event for them. They look just like that. :X

234 gmsc  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:39:21am

Internet Killed The Video Star (by the Broad Band)

235 Sylvester_T_Cat  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:40:46am

re: #199 Scion9

I've heard conflicting stories about Rahm Emmanuel's being in the IDF. According to Rolling Stone, he wasn't. According to wikipedia he was. Sadly, Rolling Stone isn't really a more reliable of a source than wikipedia, so who knows.

Debbie Schlussel beats wikipedia and Rolling Stone hands-down for accuracy. She has two articles already on Rahm Emmanuel: Emmanuel's Michael Moore Connection and More Emmanuel Connections

Emmanuel was a Clinton White House staffer; that's enough already to have me looking for my sadly-depleted collection of souvenired airline barf bags.

236 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:41:06am

re: #209 spidly

hey there. do not detest the typical liberal Jew. they are insufferable, dead wrong and vote in a way that puts this country in peril, BUT they actually spend time and money practicing what they preach. at least at my Shul.

Okay, what's a shul?

237 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:41:23am

re: #222 Spiritualized

Reuters is tackling the tough issues already:

Interest high in what kind of dog Obamas will get

As a "world citizen" I'd just like to say that I'm on the edge of my seat too.

whatever dog they get, i predict it won't hunt.

(yes, i went there... %-)

/white smoke

238 BignJames  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:41:24am

re: #229 Outrider

Here is an artist not many heard of, but I enjoy

You're kidding, right?

239 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:42:12am

re: #234 gmsc

I remember that from back when they launched that Shockwave promo site.

240 AmeriDan  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:42:26am

Diss the new country music all you want, I'l just be sitting here...


Watching Airplanes

241 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:42:37am

Yowl
For
S.P.

I saw the best hope of my generation destroyed by media, raving hysterical fools,
Throwing herself at negro heroes in prime-time looking for an honest hearing,
Beehive-hairdoed Alaskan burning with the ancient heavenly connection to the unstarry dynamo of the machinery of America,
Who gibson and couric and cold-eyed and idiotarian sat up splicing in the unnatural darkness of ABC News scheming across the relay towers contemplating obamessiah,
Who bared her convictions to People under the Flyover Moon and saw MSMedina demons scuttling like a pair of ragged claws, unilluminated manuscripts trailing behind…

242 gmsc  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:43:12am

re: #239 laZardo

I remember that from back when they launched that Shockwave promo site.

That's where I remember it from, too. It brought back memories, so I figured I'd post it.

243 UncleSam  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:43:20am

From the Deep

The envious masses scrape at humanity's door,
Moaning their perpetual cry,
"Give me more, give me more."

The Beast has risen from the deep
No need its thirst for it to keep
From the eyes of men
For now they sleep.

The spinning world stops in it's track,
As continents slide
And can't go back,
While the Thing Which Devours
Reaches for a snack.

And now I'd like to say,
Dear friends,
Love those you hold dear,
Every day, as much as you can.

And you'll thank God,
Thank God
Thank God
Dear friends,
That this is where
This stupid poem ends.

244 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:43:45am

Here, can you believe this: Pelosi says voters misunderstood Prop. 8

Nancy Pelosi thinks that Pro 8 (Ban Gay Marriage) passed in California because voters were too dumb to understand what their vote meant:

Unfortunately, I think people thought they were making a statement about what their view of same-sex marriage was," the San Francisco Democrat said. "I don't know if it was clear that this meant that we are amending the Constitution to diminish freedom in our state."

245 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:45:08am

re: #229 Outrider

sinnerjee -- isn't that ol' Allen Ginsberg herself giving the intro?

Love taj -- of the millions of Stagger Lees out there his is the best.

246 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:45:16am

re: #209 spidly

My whole point was that I love the Jewish religion and I hate to see those who also claim to love it vote for someone who has an animosity towards it, especially liberal Jews.

247 BlueCanuck  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:46:05am

re: #234 gmsc

Loved it, and it's so true. I haven't turned my t.v. on in months. :)

248 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:48:09am

re: #246 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

PIMF-

My whole point was that I love the Jewish religion and I hate to see those who also claim to love it vote for someone who has an animosity towards it, specifically liberal Jews.
249 tradewind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:48:12am

re: #225 gmsc

Just another thing that BHO has wrong. There just is no such thing as a ' hypoallergenic' dog... only some breeds that are less likely to elicit reactions because they have less tendency to release dander.
Somehow I can't see a Mexican Hairless in the WH. And I hope the animal protection leagues lobby to make sure that the dog is rescued... I mean redistributed...

250 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:48:47am

Gonna snack. BBL.

251 gmsc  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:49:48am

re: #249 tradewind

Just another thing that BHO has wrong. There just is no such thing as a ' hypoallergenic' dog... only some breeds that are less likely to elicit reactions because they have less tendency to release dander.
Somehow I can't see a Mexican Hairless in the WH. And I hope the animal protection leagues lobby to make sure that the dog is rescued... I mean redistributed...

Actually, you can make a dog hypoallergenic. It's just that the ASPCA gets so mad when you seal them in airtight plastic.

252 AmeriDan  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:50:02am

re: #244 blackpajamas

Unfortunately, I think people thought they were making a statement about what their view of same-sex marriage was," the San Francisco Democrat said.

Unfortunately for her gay friends, she is exactly right. They were making a statement of their view on same sex marriage.

253 Steffan  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:50:08am

A possible answer to voter fraud: the Mexican voter ID. (warning, .pdf file)

Mexico’s voter ID card is now widely regarded as one of the most secure, reliable voter identification systems in the world. So trusted is the integrity of Mexico’s voter ID credential that amid all the controversy surrounding the close presidential election on July 2, 2006, no one questioned the security, reliability, or authenticity of Mexico’s voter identification itself.

Indeed, Mexico’s voter ID has become the country’s de facto identification document and is readily accepted as positive proof-of-identity by merchants, banks, government officials, and citizens nationwide.

Hey, if the Mexicans do it, how can the Democrats oppose it?

/

254 tradewind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:51:23am

re: #229 Outrider

Ummm, not really obscure. They played the song Jenna Bush and W danced to first at her wedding, (Lovin in my Baby's Eyes)


and their version of Mockingbird is one of my all time faves...
255 UncleSam  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:51:38am

In post #243, meant "in its track" not "in it's track."
Dumb grammatical error.

256 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:51:47am

Nancy Pelosi also wants us all to bail out the auto industry:

Pelosi talked about her closed-door meeting Thursday with executives and union officials from the struggling U.S. auto industry, who are seeking at least $25 billion in low-cost government loans on top of $25 billion Congress has already approved. Pelosi said she is open to the idea of more aid - with the caveat that Detroit would have to agree to produce more fuel-efficient vehicles.

Basically, you the taxpayer get to foot the bill for the next set of hybrid vehicles -- whether or not you choose to buy them; and if you do buy them, any savings you realize are effectively just re-payments from the government back to you, exactly from your subsidy/bail-out of the industry.

257 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:52:36am
258 tradewind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:53:24am

re: #251 gmsc

LMAO...
He mentioned several breeds, somehow the the shih-tsu sounds right...

259 Steffan  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:53:43am

re: #244 blackpajamas

Here, can you believe this: Pelosi says voters misunderstood Prop. 8

Nancy Pelosi thinks that Pro 8 (Ban Gay Marriage) passed in California because voters were too dumb to understand what their vote meant:

Unfortunately, I think people thought they were making a statement about what their view of same-sex marriage was," the San Francisco Democrat said. "I don't know if it was clear that this meant that we are amending the Constitution to diminish freedom in our state."

I think the voters understood it very well.

They also understand the Prop. 8 opponents who are threatening to burn down churches.

I hope Pelosi's gay constituents are just venting, but it's hard to tell, sometimes -- especially when they take such delight in scaring the horses.

260 middlecon  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:57:22am

re: #253 Steffan

A possible answer to voter fraud: the Mexican voter ID. (warning, .pdf file)


Hey, if the Mexicans do it, how can the Democrats oppose it?

/

I live in Indiana and the Dems here but up a HUGE fight for voter ID laws, of cousre lo and behold in 2008 WITH the voter ID laws passed, not only was their a record turnout, Obama won Indiana.

So much for the poor and oppressed not being able to make it to the BMV for a free voter ID card.

261 Scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:58:27am

re: #253 Steffan

Such a thing has already been suggested. A National ID system that is tied to voter registration is 'voter suppression'. Somehow. I don't know.

262 tradewind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:58:29am

re: #259 Steffan

Did you see the commercial they( the gay marriage advocates) produced to scare CA voters... showing two Mormon missionaries coming in and going storm-trooper on their house, stripping them of their wedding rings and tearing up their marriage license...
It was really heinous.

263 MajorPribluda  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:59:14am

re: #244 blackpajamas

Here, can you believe this: Pelosi says voters misunderstood Prop. 8

Nancy Pelosi thinks that Pro 8 (Ban Gay Marriage) passed in California because voters were too dumb to understand what their vote meant:

Unfortunately, I think people thought they were making a statement about what their view of same-sex marriage was," the San Francisco Democrat said. "I don't know if it was clear that this meant that we are amending the Constitution to diminish freedom in our state."

Typical condescending crap from Speaker Pelosi. Notice that conservatives didn't assume that the California Supreme Court had "misunderstood the clear intent of the voters and the legislature, and not known that they were legislating from the bench."

Prop. 8 has a sordid history, and the MSM can't be bothered to cover it.

264 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:59:34am

Pelosi said Democrats will make reviving a weak economy their singular focus for the next several months. (ibid)

Great, now that the idiot ego has ante'd up, and the world is watching, we all get to see the world's most expensive train wreck in action.

Democrats are pushing a package of between $61 billion and $100 billion, which would be spent on infrastructure projects, an extension of jobless benefits, an increase in food stamps and aid to cash-strapped states. The Bush White House and Republicans in Congress are cool to the idea.

Dang, I knew I should have declared myself an illegal alien ...

265 logboy  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:00:48am

re: #261 Scion9

Such a thing has already been suggested. A National ID system that is tied to voter registration is 'voter suppression'. Somehow. I don't know.

It deals with the ACLU and privacy laws.

266 Slumbering Behemoth  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:01:41am

re: #233 gop_patriot

Comedian Banjo. (Not comedy, just a comedian with a banjo)
Record Banjo. (Not metal, but that's hardcore)

267 middlecon  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:02:07am

Gay marriage doesn't really bother me, I'm a Libertarian type but I do find it deliciously ironic that it was black voters who pretty much voted down Prop 8.

268 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:04:09am

well, *that* sucked... quick power spike: just enough to reboot the box.

bit the end of the world in and of itself, but it cost me the game of Asteroids i had paused, where i was in the high 600Ks, with boocoo ships to go.

damn the DWP.

269 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:04:30am

"Whether it succeeds or fails, Democrats and Obama are planning, after he takes office in January, a stimulus plan that could be even bigger" (ibid).

WTF?!

"Pelosi said the details are still being debated, but she is pushing for a tax cut for the middle class."

The middle class will bail out the auto industry, then get back some change.

"We did the stimulus package with rebates (in February). ... It had a good effect, I think," she said.

They were passing out brains, Nancy thought they said trains, and she missed it.

270 BlueCanuck  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:04:42am

re: #266 Slumbering Behemoth

Wow, that's got to be the most serious that I have seen Steve Martin look. Good playing too.

271 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:05:45am

re: #267 middlecon

Gay marriage doesn't really bother me, I'm a Libertarian type but I do find it deliciously ironic that it was black voters who pretty much voted down Prop 8.

and the Hicspanics.

272 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:06:11am

re: #267 middlecon

Gay marriage doesn't really bother me, I'm a Libertarian type but I do find it deliciously ironic that it was black voters who pretty much voted down Prop 8.

Yeah, but it's getting ugly.

It was like being at a klan rally except the klansmen were wearing Abercrombie polos and Birkenstocks. YOU [N-word], one man shouted at men. If your people want to call me a FAGGOT, I will call you a n-word. Someone else said same thing to me on the next block near the temple...me and my friend were walking, he is also gay but Korean, and a young WeHo clone said after last night the n*****s better not come to West Hollywood if they knew what was BEST for them.

jeez

273 logboy  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:06:15am

re: #266 Slumbering Behemoth

Comedian Banjo. (Not comedy, just a comedian with a banjo)
Record Banjo. (Not metal, but that's hardcore)

Steve Martin loves playing the banjo. When I was on the set of Cheaper By the Dozen 2 he made his assistant run and grab his banjo so he could jam with a string quartet hired to play as lunchtime entertainment.

274 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:06:45am

re: #269 blackpajamas

"Whether it succeeds or fails, Democrats and Obama are planning, after he takes office in January, a stimulus plan that could be even bigger" (ibid).

WTF?!

"Pelosi said the details are still being debated, but she is pushing for a tax cut for the middle class."

The middle class will bail out the auto industry, then get back some change.

"We did the stimulus package with rebates (in February). ... It had a good effect, I think," she said.

They were passing out brains, Nancy thought they said trains, and she missed it.

either that or she pulled it... %-)

/white smoke

275 middlecon  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:07:00am

re: #269 blackpajamas

"Whether it succeeds or fails, Democrats and Obama are planning, after he takes office in January, a stimulus plan that could be even bigger" (ibid).

WTF?!

"Pelosi said the details are still being debated, but she is pushing for a tax cut for the middle class."

The middle class will bail out the auto industry, then get back some change.

"We did the stimulus package with rebates (in February). ... It had a good effect, I think," she said.

They were passing out brains, Nancy thought they said trains, and she missed it.

It will be funny to hear the Libs talk about these stimulus packages when Obama/Pelosi sponser them. When Bush put them out they always said it was 'too little' or 'vote buying'.

Should be interesting to hear them change their tune.

276 tradewind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:07:22am

Has anyone seen Joe the Senator Vice- President elect? He's conspicuously missing in action...

277 Slumbering Behemoth  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:07:48am

re: #218 talon_262

Loves me some Hayseed Dixie...got hooked on them after hearing them do "Poop in a Jar" on Bob & Tom.

This Bob & Tom?

278 middlecon  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:09:17am

re: #276 tradewind


He was at the press conference today.

279 UncleSam  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:09:50am

I voted against Prop 8 because last Saturday I met a really nice lesbian couple who were very, very happy that they had been able to get married.
Why ruin their happiness?

Also, on a more cynical note, why shouldn't gays and lesbians have the opportunity to be as miserable as everyone else?

280 tradewind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:10:37am

re: #278 middlecon

Is he thinking he'll be the nominee in '12?

281 tradewind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:11:13am

PIMF, '16...

282 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:11:21am

re: #276 tradewind

Has anyone seen Joe the Senator Vice- President elect? He's conspicuously missing in action...

They haven't yet unlocked him from one of Ted Kennedy's secure undisclosed liquor cabinets.

283 gop_patriot  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:11:28am

re: #266 Slumbering Behemoth

First one, amazing!
Second one, holy crap! LOL

284 BignJames  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:13:32am

re: #279 UncleSam

Why should they be afforded special rights?

285 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:14:52am

From the Too Cute For Words Dept.

The Bunny and the Rhino

286 JustMyView  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:14:54am

re: #276 tradewind

Has anyone seen Joe the Senator Vice- President elect? He's conspicuously missing in action...

He was onstage at today's press conference.

287 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:15:17am

re: #279 UncleSam

I voted against Prop 8 because last Saturday I met a really nice lesbian couple who were very, very happy that they had been able to get married.
Why ruin their happiness?

Also, on a more cynical note, why shouldn't gays and lesbians have the opportunity to be as miserable as everyone else?

what i can't figure out is how marriage can be a constitutional issue, since it's clear on the Federal level that the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution guarantee "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness", and, as any married person will tell you if their spouse is not present, marriage kills all 3.

/white smoke

288 UncleSam  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:16:14am

re: #284 BignJames

Why should they be afforded special rights?

What special rights?
They would just have the same rights as everyone else.

289 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:18:28am

re: #284 BignJames

Why should they be afforded special rights?

why should the government be in the "marriage" business to begin with, since that's a religious institution. who can and can't get married is a theological debate for each church/religion...

the government should have nothing to do with the institution...

IMHO, of course. %-)

290 Fenway_Nation  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:18:43am

re: #288 UncleSam

What special rights?
They would just have the same rights as everyone else.

It's two women getting married- How is that the same?

Would polygamy be the same, too?

291 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:19:18am

The Student of Karl wonders how to create new jobs:

"My priority is going to be, how do we grow the economy? How do we create more jobs?"

He also wants to make the same mistake as Kennedy, rushing off to meet head-on with our enemies as soon as possible:

"Mr. Obama said Friday he would respond to a letter of congratulations from the president of Iran, the first such letter since the Iranian Revolution. It seemed to be consistent with his campaign pledge to deepen diplomatic engagement with the Islamic Republic."

292 BignJames  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:20:45am

re: #288 UncleSam

They have the same rights I have.

293 middlecon  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:21:16am

re: #291 blackpajamas

The Student of Karl wonders how to create new jobs:

"My priority is going to be, how do we grow the economy? How do we create more jobs?"

He also wants to make the same mistake as Kennedy, rushing off to meet head-on with our enemies as soon as possible:

"Mr. Obama said Friday he would respond to a letter of congratulations from the president of Iran, the first such letter since the Iranian Revolution. It seemed to be consistent with his campaign pledge to deepen diplomatic engagement with the Islamic Republic."

I'm not sure if Obama did say he would respond to the letter, he said he would 'review' it. Still a pretty tepid response he should of told him to shove it lol

294 Slumbering Behemoth  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:21:20am

re: #270 BlueCanuck

Steve ain't no joke.

295 logboy  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:23:00am

re: #266 Slumbering Behemoth

Comedian Banjo. (Not comedy, just a comedian with a banjo)
Record Banjo. (Not metal, but that's hardcore)

Smothers Brothers, Boil that Cabbage Down. Music and comedy.

296 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:25:09am

re: #293 middlecon

I'm not sure if Obama did say he would respond to the letter, he said he would 'review' it. Still a pretty tepid response he should of told him to shove it lol

Yep, I agree. If I had the opportunity to respond to them, I'd consult a bunch of Iranian Americans and let them publicly shame the Iranian regime at a full session of the U.N. general assembly.

297 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:26:45am

re: #290 Fenway_Nation

It's two women getting married- How is that the same?

Would polygamy be the same, too?

if it were up to me, than any group of consenting adults would enter into a legally binding contract, witnessed/attested to in front of a judge, who would ensure that each & every one had entered into it under advice of sound legal counsel. since all contracts would include mediation, rights & responsibilities, child care provisions, etc ad infinitum, and have out clauses.

298 middlecon  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:30:42am

My views on gay marriage: Any 2 people over 18, male/male, female/female, male/female should be able to get the rights and responsibilities of marriage.

Now that doesn't mean that churches should have to sanction them, but when it comes down to things like health care and probate its the right thing to do.

299 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:33:44am

I don't understand the problem with gay marriage. What exactly is it supposed to threaten? The marriage my husband and I have? If that were the case, we wouldn't have much of a marriage.

I remember - years ago - when Ireland was debating whether to allow divorce. Some woman said allowing divorce would threaten her marriage. WTF.

I'm sorry, I don't get it.

300 MajorPribluda  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:35:44am

re: #297 redc1c4

if it were up to me, than any group of consenting adults would enter into a legally binding contract, witnessed/attested to in front of a judge, who would ensure that each & every one had entered into it under advice of sound legal counsel. since all contracts would include mediation, rights & responsibilities, child care provisions, etc ad infinitum, and have out clauses.

You can write up any contract that you want. But don't call it marriage.

I saw somebody on a news show complaining about rights for gay parents. First off, there are no gay parents properly. Adoption for straight couples can be a remedy for a medical condition, but not a moral one.

I am willng to be convinced that homosexuality is an inborn condition, but so far, I am definitaly *not* convinced. There is better evidence that some crimes are the result of inborn conditions than homosexuality, and thieves and rapists go to prison. The only evidence that a person is gay is behavioral, as opposed to race and gender, which protections are natural and good. Behavioral aspects are protected, but do not rise to the same level as race & gender. No matter what the Universities & media want us to think.

301 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:35:53am

well, having killed the thread, i think i'll go off and spike the fruit cup and hit the rack... HRH has a busy schedule for me today, and the weather is nice & warm (Santa Anas again) so i'm gonna hit the pool a couple more times this weekend before i give up for the year & pull the cover...

November in LA... I LOVE IT!

302 logboy  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:36:29am

re: #294 Slumbering Behemoth

Steve ain't no joke.

Steve Martin is good on the banjo, but he can't log roll.

303 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:37:09am

Karl's start pupil:

“It is not going to be easy for us to dig ourselves out of the hole that we are in,” Obama said yesterday in Chicago. “We are going to have to focus on jobs because the hemorrhaging of jobs has an impact on consumer confidence and the ability of people to purchase goods and services.”

Well, in this case, even The One's intellectual wet-blanket statement is true.

It is indeed the case that the loss of jobs has an impact on the ability of people to purchase goods and services.

Dropping prices in stores increases my ability to purchase both goods and services!

With "Confidence!"

304 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:39:21am

re: #290 Fenway_Nation

Sure. Once you redefine marriage away from one man and one woman, there's no reason to have any workable definition. Two men, two women, three men, six women and two men, one man and one sheep, honestly, there's no drawing any lines.

and it's not just personal preference, as the hard-core libertarians would have you think. they make the same mistake hard-core liberals do, they assume the world they know just popped into existence one day, and they can't explain how it evolved over time, what the forces are that gave rise to everything they enjoy and take for granted, and one of them is a society based on the fundamental concept of the traditional family unit.

305 Slumbering Behemoth  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:41:04am

re: #300 MajorPribluda

Um, what?

306 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:41:05am

re: #300 MajorPribluda

You can write up any contract that you want. But don't call it marriage.

i never said it would be marriage, since i specifically stated that marriage is a religious institution, and each and every church/sect/belief could define it as they wished. i just said the government should *not* be in the religion business.

i also feel that society is better off when everyone is encouraged to participate in long term stable relationships with legal rights & responsibilities, regardless of orientation.

if it doesn't involve children, animals or permanent bodily harm, and you're not out in the middle of the street, i really don't care what trips your trigger, as long as all parties involved are fully consenting.

307 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:41:25am

re: #299 wahabicorridor

There's no problem with gay marriage per se, the problem comes with the fact that American society is predicated on the traditional family structure. Lose that and in a generation or two you're recreating a society from scratch.

308 gop_patriot  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:42:08am

re: #302 logboy

Steve Martin is good on the banjo, but he can't log roll.

Is that you on the left?

309 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:42:25am

re: #300 MajorPribluda

I have come down on the side of 'inborn condition' simply because the stigma of being gay has been so severe that I can't imagine anyone actually choosing it.

310 Moe Katz  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:42:49am

re: #279 UncleSam


Also, on a more cynical note, why shouldn't gays and lesbians have the opportunity to be as miserable as everyone else?

Thank you, Kinky.

311 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:42:58am

re: #304 LynnfromNZ

Sure. Once you redefine marriage away from one man and one woman, there's no reason to have any workable definition. Two men, two women, three men, six women and two men, one man and one sheep, honestly, there's no drawing any lines.

and it's not just personal preference, as the hard-core libertarians would have you think. they make the same mistake hard-core liberals do, they assume the world they know just popped into existence one day, and they can't explain how it evolved over time, what the forces are that gave rise to everything they enjoy and take for granted, and one of them is a society based on the fundamental concept of the traditional family unit.

and that's why marriage is best seen as a religious institution, since they are the forces that gave rise to it.

312 UncleSam  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:42:58am

re: #290 Fenway_Nation

It's two women getting married- How is that the same?

Would polygamy be the same, too?

No, polygamy is illegal for everyone, marriage between two people is not.

When I was a kid, from about 9 through 15, we had two wonderful neighbors, Harold and Paul, who were gay.
They had us over for dinner on Sundays once a month for years, and we had a great time. That is one of my fondest childhood memories. Harold was a great cook. We vacationed with them at their cabin in the Santa Cruz area, and went to Mass with them on Christmas eves several times. (They were both Catholic.)
Eventually, Paul got engaged to and married a woman, and my dad, who was a strong Republican, said, when he heard about the engagement, said, " Paul's marrying a woman? That's just not right. He should be marrying Harold." And he was serious.
We went to the wedding, which was very nice, but I have always thought about that.
Paul should have married Harold.

313 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:44:27am

Dropping prices in stores increases ability to purchase goods n' services!

Speak Proof to Power: Mervyns to start liquidation sales Friday (from Oct 31).

314 middlecon  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:44:52am

re: #307 LynnfromNZ

There's no problem with gay marriage per se, the problem comes with the fact that American society is predicated on the traditional family structure. Lose that and in a generation or two you're recreating a society from scratch.

People are in gay relationships now, yet people still keep getting married and having children. Why would suddenly those 2 gay people having a peice of paper drastically change society?

315 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:45:40am

re: #306 redc1c4

So you're saying gay couples couldn't adopt children, since they'd be involved? Let's see how far that flies.

Once you define marriage away from one man and one woman you have no logical stopping point anywhere. Animals? What sort of outmoded discriminatory standards do you base that on, the devil's advocate asks? One man and six sheep is a legally defensible defintion of "marriage" at that point, since the first time you say okay, there is no one defintion of marriage, you have instantly lost any and all standards for setting any definitions or boundaries at all.

316 Fenway_Nation  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:45:50am

re: #304 LynnfromNZ

Personally I didn't have a problem with it until the gay-marrige proponents were comparing themselves to the Japanese being interned during WWII or the blacks during Jim Crow and the onset of the civil rights movement because they were basically being inconvenienced.

I also figured it would only be a matter of time before some attention-seeking couple would stage some judicial theater by showing up in a Catholic parrish or Mormon Temple asking to be married on the spot, and when refused, take the matter to court and claim discrimination in attempt to get the state to compel the religious institution to recognize homosexual marrige.

Too far fetched? Lotsa libs/ACLU types with waaay too much time on their hands.

317 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:46:29am

re: #311 redc1c4

But society has adopted the institution of marriage to set a goodly amount of social policy and laws.

318 Slumbering Behemoth  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:47:33am

re: #307 LynnfromNZ

Here. Not presented as a refutation, but as something that might make you laugh. Or think. Or whatever.

Later.

319 Shug  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:47:55am

74 million dollars spent on California Proposition 8.

Think about that.
What a tremendous f-ing waste of money, on both sides.

and we haven't even had teh legal battles, the lawsuits.

100 million when it's all said and done, so what a few hundred gays a year can't have their marriage ceremony? It's madness


I hope that it doesn't keep coming up over and over and over on each and every ballot, but I suspect that it will.

320 logboy  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:48:03am

re: #308 gop_patriot

Is that you on the left?

Yup. I was Eugene Levy's stunt double. He couldn't figure out how to dangle from the crane and roll so they made me fill in and roll for real against Steve.

321 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:48:28am

re: #314 middlecon

Because society is built with the family structure as its foundational principle. Societies that don't base themselves on the family have no basis for basic societal structure save government-dictated socialism.

322 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:48:35am

re: #307 LynnfromNZ

There's no problem with gay marriage per se, the problem comes with the fact that American society is predicated on the traditional family structure. Lose that and in a generation or two you're recreating a society from scratch.

Part of me understands that and part of me doesn't. We know gay couples that have been together for decades. The commitment they have to one another is no different than that between my husband and me.

But there is one niggling problem I can't get past - children. For some reason that I am unable to articulate, children raised by a homosexual couple strikes me as a dubious proposition.

See? This is why I don't get it. We know people who truly are committed to each other and are married in every sense but the legal - and yet I think that situation is not fit for children.

I'm very ambiguous on the whole thing.

323 gop_patriot  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:50:38am

re: #320 logboy

Yup. I was Eugene Levy's stunt double. He couldn't figure out how to dangle from the crane and roll so they made me fill in and roll for real against Steve.

So were you dangling from a crane, or doing it for real, and was Steve dangling from a crane? lol

I can imagine it was frustrating trying to log roll with someone who had no idea how to do it. Like me, for instance. LOL I've always thought it would be fun to try; but then again, I've become attached to my teeth. ;)

324 redc1c4  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:50:43am

re: #315 LynnfromNZ

So you're saying gay couples couldn't adopt children, since they'd be involved? Let's see how far that flies.

Once you define marriage away from one man and one woman you have no logical stopping point anywhere. Animals? What sort of outmoded discriminatory standards do you base that on, the devil's advocate asks? One man and six sheep is a legally defensible defintion of "marriage" at that point, since the first time you say okay, there is no one defintion of marriage, you have instantly lost any and all standards for setting any definitions or boundaries at all.

you are being needlessly and deliberately obtuse... you know damn well what i meant. you're just afraid that by banning sheep, most marriages in New Zealand would become null and void.

325 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:51:38am

Somebody told me there was a TV show called Divorce Court.

Which network will be the first to air "Alternate-lifestyle Divorce Court"?

326 middlecon  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:53:21am

re: #321 LynnfromNZ

Because society is built with the family structure as its foundational principle. Societies that don't base themselves on the family have no basis for basic societal structure save government-dictated socialism.

Well of course society is bult with a family structure, but I don't agree that gay people having relationships and recognized relationships is going to suddenly bring down society.

I think we'll just have to disagree on this one, gay marriage as an issue for me is way, way down the list and I'm not one for debating it.

327 Shug  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:54:59am

re: #324 redc1c4

you're just afraid that by banning sheep, most marriages in New Zealand would become null and void.

now that's funny

328 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:55:07am

re: #322 wahabicorridor

understandably. the libertarian part of me thinks ah what the hell, what difference does it make? then I think wait a second, if you define marriage away, all of society becomes personal preference. You lose the basis for pretty much any objectivity, don't you?

If gays want to be together their whole lives fine, if heterosexual couples want to live together for fifty years and never marry fine. Marriage is different. It's not just a piece of paper.

329 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:55:25am

re: #326 middlecon

Understood.

330 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:56:51am

re: #327 Shug

These days it's mostly cows. Switching over to dairy in a big way -- we're the #1 dairy-producing nation in the world, it's far more profitable than the woolies. Naturally this causes for many a tearful parting when the farmer sells off the sheep stock...

331 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:59:39am

re: #311 redc1c4

religion is also the force that gave rise to most of society. me I see a connection, although honestly I don't care what religion anybody is, it seems to me the best societies are th emost religiously tolerant, it's the one thing everybody agrees on, one man and one woman. Muslims don't, but Islam, well, there's a huge disconnect between theory and practice there.

332 Fenway_Nation  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:59:46am

I feel a tearful reunion with fruitcup coming on...

333 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:00:01am

Good morning, afternoon, evening *everyone*!™

Fruitcup is on the buffet --->
Help yourselves!

334 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:01:38am

Fenway! :-)

Don't cry.

335 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:01:59am

re: #328 LynnfromNZ

Marriage is different. It's not just a piece of paper.

You're absolutely right about that. It is different. It's not just shacking up - by a long shot.

I'm just very conflicted - I could never look our gay, committed friends in the face and tell them they can't have what my husband and I have - no way no how. They DO have every right to it as far as I can tell.

But when I get past that - what Thomas Sowell calls 'Stage One' thinking, i.e., you had better look at what comes next - I'm not comfortable.

heh. The conflict between the flesh and blood people you love and theory...

336 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:03:07am

re: #333 littleoldlady

Good morning, afternoon, evening *everyone*!™

Fruitcup is on the buffet --->
Help yourselves!


good morning! Is Fenway Nation your sock puppet?

337 BlueCanuck  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:03:12am

re: #333 littleoldlady

Morning littleoldlady, thanks for the fruit cup. Glad to see your old avatar is back. :)

338 Fenway_Nation  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:03:28am

re: #334 littleoldlady


The crying usually comes after having one of Red's fruitcups.

339 BlueCanuck  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:04:53am

re: #338 Fenway_Nation

The crying usually comes after having one of Red's fruitcups.

One more week of sorrow, and then the games begin again.

/red spiking the stores, and me trying to stop him.

//thank goodness I have a back of supplies.

340 gop_patriot  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:05:12am

re: #333 littleoldlady

littleoldlady! Fruitcup!

/notice which is first, I have my priorities in the proper order ;)

341 logboy  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:05:26am

re: #323 gop_patriot

So were you dangling from a crane, or doing it for real, and was Steve dangling from a crane? lol

I can imagine it was frustrating trying to log roll with someone who had no idea how to do it. Like me, for instance. LOL I've always thought it would be fun to try; but then again, I've become attached to my teeth. ;)

I was rolling, Steve was dangling. If you want to see the scene from the movie its right here.

342 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:07:23am

Whew! Patti stunk. Let's try Elaine.

343 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:07:30am

re: #335 wahabicorridor

You're absolutely right about that. It is different. It's not just shacking up - by a long shot.

I'm just very conflicted - I could never look our gay, committed friends in the face and tell them they can't have what my husband and I have - no way no how. They DO have every right to it as far as I can tell.

But when I get past that - what Thomas Sowell calls 'Stage One' thinking, i.e., you had better look at what comes next - I'm not comfortable.

heh. The conflict between the flesh and blood people you love and theory...

Why? Marriage is essentially a social and financial contract in which the male agrees to provide financial support and protection and the female agrees to provide sexual favors and heirs. Virtually all of our family law is based on that and much of the rest of our laws. Like Social Security regulations. Women are entitled to 75% of whatever their husband of more than 10 years is entitled to even if they have never worked a day, specifically because of this traditional understanding of the marital contract.

344 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:08:53am

re: #336 wahabicorridor

wahabi! :-)

Nah. He's a Boston fan.

BlueCanuck! :-)

gop! :-)

Thanks! ;-)

345 Fenway_Nation  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:10:02am

re: #336 wahabicorridor

good morning! Is Fenway Nation your sock puppet?


I resemble resent that!

346 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:10:04am

re: #343 galloping granny

Ok, I can't tell if you have a grin on your face...

But you are correct in terms of history - but that's hardly the way we have grown up - marriage as a financial contract...

347 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:10:34am

re: #261 Scion9

Such a thing has already been suggested. A National ID system that is tied to voter registration is 'voter suppression'. Somehow. I don't know.

That's true - it absolutely suppresses illegal voters!

348 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:10:39am

Hey, granny! :-)

Long time no type to!

349 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:12:12am

re: #343 galloping granny

Oh. Shit. Wait.

Intentionally or not - you have just provided much needed clarity to my thinking.

350 gop_patriot  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:12:23am

re: #341 logboy

I was rolling, Steve was dangling. If you want to see the scene from the movie its right here.

Awesome. Great legs, btw. ;)

Seriously, that's very cool. I was showing my son your website tonight, telling him your story. He is in awe of you, and what you've overcome. We both think you're a true American hero. (((logboy)))

351 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:13:43am

re: #345 Fenway_Nation

I resemble resent that!

heh. Hey, did you see Barry O's press conference yesterday? I'm worried - it hasn't even been a week and already he looks like hell.

Poor thing (no sarc tag intended - I'm serious)

352 Macker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:14:06am

re: #279 UncleSam

I voted against Prop 8 because last Saturday I met a really nice lesbian couple who were very, very happy that they had been able to get married.
Why ruin their happiness?

Also, on a more cynical note, why shouldn't gays and lesbians have the opportunity to be as miserable as everyone else?

Where was it that I read that "why should heterosexual couples be the only ones who can make their lawyers able to buy Italian sports cars?"

353 little blessing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:14:40am

re: #351 wahabicorridor

Well as they say...It catches up with you!

/

{lgf}

354 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:15:43am

re: #346 wahabicorridor

Ok, I can't tell if you have a grin on your face...

But you are correct in terms of history - but that's hardly the way we have grown up - marriage as a financial contract...

That IS the way that my generation grew up - we just covered it up with all of that "true love" business. What do you think the going to college to find a husband bit of the 50s and early 60s was all about? Or the fact that until well into the 70s married women in the United States of America had to list their husband's name. address, employer & social security number on an employment application? Lost credit in their own name on the day that they signed the marriage license? Were still legally defined as property in Louisiana until after the ERA failed?

"History" in this case isn't all that long ago. Your generation has simply been fed a con job in the name of "equality" that makes you think that you have some requirement to bring home the bacon along with the frying up, the putting out and the ironing of shirts at 11 pm.

355 alien_mind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:17:40am

re: #220 gmsc
i love that one.

356 BlueCanuck  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:17:53am

Well I am out of here. Have yourselves a good day lizards, and stay scaly.

357 logboy  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:18:06am

re: #350 gop_patriot

Awesome. Great legs, btw. ;)

Seriously, that's very cool. I was showing my son your website tonight, telling him your story. He is in awe of you, and what you've overcome. We both think you're a true American hero. (((logboy)))

TY. Its bed time. Night.

358 little blessing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:19:30am

Typical.

I show up and everyone leaves.


/looks for a mirror to check if any chocolate left on face

359 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:20:22am

re: #335 wahabicorridor

that's the most difficult conflict we face on earth, i'm convinced.

360 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:20:23am

re: #351 wahabicorridor

I saw a very disappointed talking head on Fox complain, "Where's the beef?". No plan, no appointees to make the public feel better...

/there was supposed to be a PLAN?!

Last line of the movie: "Now what?"

361 Salem  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:20:47am

There's something about #44

362 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:21:11am

little blessing! :-)

I AM STANDING UP! ;-)

'Night, Blue!

363 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:21:36am

re: #354 galloping granny

That IS the way that my generation grew up - we just covered it up with all of that "true love" business. What do you think the going to college to find a husband bit of the 50s and early 60s was all about? Or the fact that until well into the 70s married women in the United States of America had to list their husband's name. address, employer & social security number on an employment application? Lost credit in their own name on the day that they signed the marriage license? Were still legally defined as property in Louisiana until after the ERA failed?

"History" in this case isn't all that long ago. Your generation has simply been fed a con job in the name of "equality" that makes you think that you have some requirement to bring home the bacon along with the frying up, the putting out and the ironing of shirts at 11 pm.

I don't think you and I are that far apart in age (I'm 56) - but you definitely have it all over me when it comes to the history dept. My mother was born and raised in New Orleans (Mardi Gras queen - the whole nine yards). She passed in 2003. I would love to be able to ask her about the property issue. What I know of southern women - she would have collapsed in gales of giggles.

364 Fenway_Nation  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:21:47am

re: #351 wahabicorridor

Right now I have my money tied up in gold, silver, savings bonds and a certificate of deposit. I was lamenting the fact that I had hardly any spare cash to snap up some of the stocks of some of the better-run, high-dividend-paying companies who's value took a beating in last month's frenzied selloff when lo and behold, the president-elect held his press conference and the market basically plummeted 100 points as soon as he opened his yap.

/something tells me there's no rush, since I might be in for four years of 'bargains'.

365 gop_patriot  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:22:08am

Darn, it's after 4AM and I need to get some sleep. Going to get my hair done in the morning, one of my favorite things in the world; right up there with buying shoes. lol

Hope everyone has a great day, and I'll talk to y'all later!

Goodnight... :)

366 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:23:08am

'Night, gop! :-)

367 little blessing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:23:57am

re: #362 littleoldlady

Glad I can count on you!

Little One is on my lap refusing to go to sleep.

368 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:24:08am

re: #363 wahabicorridor

I don't think you and I are that far apart in age (I'm 56) - but you definitely have it all over me when it comes to the history dept. My mother was born and raised in New Orleans (Mardi Gras queen - the whole nine yards). She passed in 2003. I would love to be able to ask her about the property issue. What I know of southern women - she would have collapsed in gales of giggles.

Except in court. She would not have laughed there. I am dead serious about that property issue. That is one of the things I fought very hard against back in the days when I was a "feminist" and a supporter of the ERA. Comes from the fact that Louisiana law is based on the French model rather than the English the rest of us use.

369 Picayune  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:24:20am

Ah, William Butler Yeats. "The falcon cannot hear...
the center cannot hold" and yet the three wise men followed a star - and now, here we are!

And now, just who are the Hollow Men?

370 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:24:45am

re: #360 littleoldlady

I saw a very disappointed talking head on Fox complain, "Where's the beef?". No plan, no appointees to make the public feel better...

/there was supposed to be a PLAN?!

Last line of the movie: "Now what?"


Yeah. I think poor Barry is in way over his head. I could do a whole South Park episode with Barry and Michelle.

Barry: What was I THINKING?

Michelle: You don't think until I TELL you to think.

And I have never once in my entire life watched South Park.

371 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:25:31am

re: #351 wahabicorridor

As i heard one commentator say, what happens when the dog catches the car he's been chasing and has absolutely no idea what to do now?

pray for the poor man. He has No. Fricking. Clue. What he's gotten himself into.

372 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:25:49am

re: #364 Fenway_Nation


That's basically the tack we're taking - buy cheap.

373 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:26:00am

re: #346 wahabicorridor

Sounds cynical on its face, but i don't think you are.

374 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:26:39am

re: #369 Picayune

headpieces filled with straw.

indeed.

375 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:27:19am

Karl's star pupil continues to be correct: “... hemorrhaging of jobs has an impact on consumer confidence and the ability of people to purchase goods and services."

Designer Discounts: "the Conference Board's Consumer Confidence Index hit an all-time low, plunging to 38 in October from 61.4 in September and 95.2 for October of last year ... As a result, high-end retailers, such as Saks and Henri Bendel, are gearing up for a gloomy holiday season with deeper discounts and promotions."

376 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:27:30am

re: #367 little blessing

Glad I can count on you!

Little One is on my lap refusing to go to sleep.

How old is she (she, right?) now?

377 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:28:07am

re: #370 wahabicorridor

The Clinton retreads are not exactly confidence building, either...

378 scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:28:34am

I wouldn't mind seeing the government getting out of the 'marriage' business altogether and just offer the ability to file for the tax/inheritance/medical benefits under the law. Essentially civil unions for anyone who wants one, and the actual matrimony can be something entirely up to the religious institutions.

Laws that surround marriage is leaning on the establishment clause awfully hard. You have the government in the business of defining what marriage is, and you have religious institutions filing as 501c3's, even though technically they shouldn't have to because of their 1st amendment rights. The Christian religious community is playing with fire in compelling government to get involved in the situation in the way that they are. They should be compelling Caesar to loosen his grip on cultural institutions instead, if they value their continued freedom to practice their religion without government intervention.

379 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:28:43am

re: #371 LynnfromNZ


Oh good, you're still here. Wanted to tell you - hubby was born and raised on a dairy farm and shoved cows for a few years himself. Now he is a lobbyist and some of his clients are - dairy farmers.

Anyway, I wanted to tell you that there is great admiration here for how New Zealand had managed it's transition to free-market dairy. That took some guts. We're still beholden (unless it's California) to the Federal Milk Marketing Orders.

380 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:28:55am

re: #363 wahabicorridor

Ever read Florence King's Confessions of a failed southern lady? Wonderful book.

381 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:29:09am

re: #375 blackpajamas

Karl's star pupil continues to be correct: “... hemorrhaging of jobs has an impact on consumer confidence and the ability of people to purchase goods and services."

Designer Discounts: "the Conference Board's Consumer Confidence Index hit an all-time low, plunging to 38 in October from 61.4 in September and 95.2 for October of last year ... As a result, high-end retailers, such as Saks and Henri Bendel, are gearing up for a gloomy holiday season with deeper discounts and promotions."

Oh goodie! Better Christmas for less this year!

382 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:31:04am

re: #378 scion9

dinged you up

383 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:31:16am

re: #379 wahabicorridor

Oh good, you're still here. Wanted to tell you - hubby was born and raised on a dairy farm and shoved cows for a few years himself. Now he is a lobbyist and some of his clients are - dairy farmers.

Anyway, I wanted to tell you that there is great admiration here for how New Zealand had managed it's transition to free-market dairy. That took some guts. We're still beholden (unless it's California) to the Federal Milk Marketing Orders.

What is this deal all of the sudden with the "California cheese" and "happy cows?" Who ever heard of cheese from California?

384 Fenway_Nation  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:31:27am

Wonder how this news will affect the earnings reports of these two companies over the next few quarters...

Sturm-Ruger [NYSE: RGR]
Smith & Wesson [NASDAQ: SWHC]

/throw in some Bible publishers and you have the Bitter-Clingy Portfolio

385 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:31:47am

re: #380 LynnfromNZ

Ever read Florence King's Confessions of a failed southern lady? Wonderful book.

Nope. I shall launch amazon forthwith.

386 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:32:13am

re: #377 littleoldlady

The Clinton retreads are not exactly confidence building, either...

Yep, it's funny how Boot-ROM Manual is said to have "sharp elbows".

Just what the Russians fear!

387 little blessing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:32:42am

re: #376 littleoldlady

Yup, a sheila!

17 months, going on 17.

388 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:33:05am

If God - or nature - intended that the roles of man and woman are interchangeable, then why aren't we all equiped with both sets of sex organs? Nope, it's 'insert tab A into slot B' to procreate. This implies to me that both the male and the female each have a unique function in the offspring's life. Yes, we have grown past the absolute need for male strength necessary to provide for and protect, women to bear and care for children, but studies still show that children do best in a traditional family unit. This is what I can't get past. Men and women each have a particular role. I refuse to buy into the bullshit notion that a child doesn't need both a father and a mother equally. And of course, children can do well without one or the other, but that doesn't mean they don't need both.

And I have to make one observation in general about the gay marriage issue. The libs that fight so hard to get gays to be able to marry are the same libs who trashed the very concept of marriage starting back in the late 60's. It was an 'antiquated man-made institution, designed to enslave women'. Why, no self respecting woman should ever allow herself to be placed in such bondage! And now, they are calling it a civil rights issue, every bit as important as the black civil rights struggle. What delicious irony!

389 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:33:30am

re: #379 wahabicorridor

appreciate that.

lately fonterra's gotten quite a bad rap (from the WSJ for one) for not increasing production. like we want to retool -- americans dont understand the main highway between Auckland and Wellington is a two-lane country road where cars stop for a sheep muster. imagine that between ny and washington.

Americans need to stop indexing all commodity prices to 1911 standards.

390 little blessing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:34:02am

Hey LynnfromNZ.

How is the election shaping up?

Is it true that Helen Clark is going to be voted out?

/that is what the papers across the Tasman are saying

391 little blessing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:34:41am

bbl

392 Picayune  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:35:32am

re: #374 LynnfromNZ


Is history really repeating itself these days for those then cannot perceive?

393 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:36:02am

re: #385 wahabicorridor

you will not be disappointed. She wrote for buckley's NR for a long time. One of the best books I've read in years.

394 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:36:09am

re: #387 little blessing

Yup, a sheila!

17 months, going on 17.

And she is sitting on your lap as you compute? You're going to turn her into a geek you know? She'll be making that computer function by 3 and putting one together by 10 or so. . . . we have one of those here. A couple of weeks ago she took her money down to Radio Shack and came back with a rather expensive set of screwdrivers especially for working on computers. (She's trying to repair a Mac laptop.) When I told her mother (the daughter I turned into a geek) she about turned cartwheels - "My baby is a geek!" She was so excited. In a good way. We cherish female technical competence here.

395 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:36:19am

re: #387 little blessing

Yup, a sheila!

17 months, going on 17.

You've got a couple more years of "great", a few of "good"...and then you'll have to switch to red's fruitcup.

/it gets better after 20 ;-)

396 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:36:35am

re: #390 little blessing

we can only hope. Me I'd vote ACT. My money's on the Nats, though.

397 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:36:56am

re: #383 galloping granny

What is this deal all of the sudden with the "California cheese" and "happy cows?" Who ever heard of cheese from California?

heh. I could use all of Charles' bandwidth explaining that one. Every five years we do a farm bill and every five years dairy wants its subsidies. California opted out of the Federal Milk Marketing Orders - which are arcane - and so can price the products according to market.

But not really. Because everyone else is under FMMO. They're going after the cheese market (milk from CA ain't getting shipped to Florida). Cabot cheese - out of Vermont - has consistently been rated some of the best in the world (it is - I love it). They also have excellent butter - if you can find it.

398 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:38:06am

re: #388 I heart the USA

it's hard to get past that, yes.

399 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:38:53am

re: #386 blackpajamas

Yep, it's funny how Boot-ROM Manual is said to have "sharp elbows".

Just what the Russians fear!

Maybe he'll mail them some dead fish?

400 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:39:18am

re: #397 wahabicorridor

America's ag subsidy laws are, apart from its institutionalized racism, as a class the stupidest laws on its books. Honey, hazel nuts, dairy, rice, all inane.

401 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:40:12am

re: #383 galloping granny

What is this deal all of the sudden with the "California cheese" and "happy cows?" Who ever heard of cheese from California?

Don't they have Monterey Jack cheese in your neck of the woods, Granny?

402 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:40:19am

re: #397 wahabicorridor

heh. I could use all of Charles' bandwidth explaining that one. Every five years we do a farm bill and every five years dairy wants its subsidies. California opted out of the Federal Milk Marketing Orders - which are arcane - and so can price the products according to market.

But not really. Because everyone else is under FMMO. They're going after the cheese market (milk from CA ain't getting shipped to Florida). Cabot cheese - out of Vermont - has consistently been rated some of the best in the world (it is - I love it). They also have excellent butter - if you can find it.

I live in Vermont. I have no problem finding Cabot cheese and butter at all. Including a couple of special types of cheese and butter that you can only buy in Vermont. One variety of butter you can specifically get only at the factory even. The kiddo goes to camp about 6 miles or so from the main factory, so we load up a couple times a year. If they ever release it, try the chile and lime cheddar. To die for!

403 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:40:38am

re: #401 I heart the USA

Don't they have Monterey Jack cheese in your neck of the woods, Granny?

Sure. Made in Cabot, Vermont. :)

404 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:42:13am

re: #392 Picayune

Here we go round the prickly pear -- again and again and again.

405 The Other Les  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:43:29am

I wouldn't say that I lack conviction.

But then I've been called all sorts of nasty names by folks on the left.

406 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:45:22am

re: #397 wahabicorridor

heh. I could use all of Charles' bandwidth explaining that one. Every five years we do a farm bill and every five years dairy wants its subsidies. California opted out of the Federal Milk Marketing Orders - which are arcane - and so can price the products according to market.

But not really. Because everyone else is under FMMO. They're going after the cheese market (milk from CA ain't getting shipped to Florida). Cabot cheese - out of Vermont - has consistently been rated some of the best in the world (it is - I love it). They also have excellent butter - if you can find it.

This place, though, has much better cheddar in general than Cabot does these days, if you like old fashioned really sharp cheddar. [Link: www.sugarbushfarm.com...]

Cabot has drastically reduced the length of time they age their cheddars.

407 scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:46:27am

re: #388 I heart the USA

Well, as a straight man, I certainly don't feel that I have chosen to be so. I can't imagine that a gay man sat down and looked at both sexes and made a concious decision to like the same sex.

I also am skeptical that studies would show that a child raised in an orphanage, or shuffled from foster home to foster home is better off than one who was raised by a gay couple. Even if every gay couple in America got married and adopted two children there would still be millions of children waiting to be adopted. It isn't between straight parents and gay parents, but no parents and gay parents.

As for the 'counter culture' movement, I do agree with that. I also disagree that marriage should be defined as a civil right at all. Marriage, in so much as it is part of one's religious or cultural tradition are protected by the 1st amendment. The benefits that the government extends to married couples are entitlements, not rights.

408 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:47:17am

re: #399 littleoldlady

Maybe he'll mail them some dead fish?

Stock market "gurus" often talk of a dead-cat bounce, with the new "stimulus" suppositories we might see a fatal fish flop.

Which is then devoured promptly by the subsequent bouncing dead cat.

409 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:47:22am

re: #403 galloping granny

Sure. Made in Cabot, Vermont. :)

LOL! OK, yours is made in Vermont, but it originated in California. So there's our claim to cheese fame. But I hope to heaven we are also not responsible for that crap called 'American' cheese! What an abomination, second only to Velveeta!

410 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:49:11am

re: #400 LynnfromNZ

America's ag subsidy laws are, apart from its institutionalized racism, as a class the stupidest laws on its books. Honey, hazel nuts, dairy, rice, all inane.

Absolutely. Fortunately there is the EU's Common Ag Policy (over 40% of the EU budget) that I can use for target practice. BTW, just ordered 4 - count 'em - Florence King books. Doing my part for the economy and all that.

re: #402 galloping granny

If they ever release it, try the chile and lime cheddar. To die for!

Indeed. We get it from my husband's clients. And for those of you who can shop at Trader Joe's - I think they carry Cabot's butter - sometimes anyway - and it is to die for.

411 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:50:37am

re: #406 galloping granny

Cabot has drastically reduced the length of time they age their cheddars.

I hope you understand that I cannot speak to that in a public forum. But I will pass this up the line.

412 Picayune  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:51:19am

re: #399 littleoldlady

The Russians are in a league way above Chicago pols these days, they sneer at his "sharp elbows" as Medvedev taunts while opening the door to the richest, most powerful man on the Continent to ascend his throne - and we got that pretense of a presidential candidate - who is now pres elect, with his very own pres elect office and podium sign. Ain't life great? Maybe our guy will invite Putin over for tea and intoduce his new pooch.

413 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:53:15am

re: #409 I heart the USA


I happen to like Velveeta - no, actually, I LOVE Velveeta

/and you can keep that 'smelly socks' gorgonzola

414 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:54:10am

re: #409 I heart the USA

LOL! OK, yours is made in Vermont, but it originated in California. So there's our claim to cheese fame. But I hope to heaven we are also not responsible for that crap called 'American' cheese! What an abomination, second only to Velveeta!

I know that Monterey Jack originated in California. I just can't quite understand why California is bothering to run a California Cheese - Happy Cows ad in Vermont of all places.

I actually prefer Velveeta to "American" cheese. You don't have to refrigerate Velveeta, so it is good for camping and emergency food stashes. Even my dog does not like "American" - which is invariably "processed cheese food" rather than cheese.

415 Picayune  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:54:14am

re: #404 LynnfromNZ

Yep, 'til Palin field dresses her newest moose.

416 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:57:00am

re: #410 wahabicorridor

Indeed. We get it from my husband's clients. And for those of you who can shop at Trader Joe's - I think they carry Cabot's butter - sometimes anyway - and it is to die for.

Walmart around here carries Cabot butter - the "run of the mill" Cabot butter anyway. I think they do in Florida too. I used to have to send Dad a care package of cheese and butter a couple of times a year, but several years ago he told me he could now buy it himself.

417 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:58:46am

re: #416 galloping granny

Florida? Sending priority email to my sister...

418 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:58:49am

re: #411 wahabicorridor

I hope you understand that I cannot speak to that in a public forum. But I will pass this up the line.

Cabot lost a big chunk of my cheddar buying dollar (big part of the food budget it is too) on the day that they did away with the Hunter's Extra Sharp that had been aged something like five years and had become almost flinty. Luckily, that can be had at Sugarbush.

419 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 2:59:48am

re: #412 Picayune

Swimming with sharks...

My Obama-voting family members just had a few hours of gloating before I started emailing links about Russia, with the subject line:

Ya know, there are other reasons for voting for President other than, "Wouldn't be cool to have a black one?"

420 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:01:09am

re: #418 galloping granny


This will be passed up.

421 The Other Les  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:01:31am

Love Velveeta when I can afford it. Hate pepper jack, makes me ill. Havarti (from Wisconsin I presume) is now being sold presliced in local stores.

422 Picayune  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:02:15am

re: #414 galloping granny

Velveeta is a great cheese to cook with veggies as a sub for a real white wine sauce, but for a real zesty nose toke - it's French Roquefort blue. Hmmm.

423 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:02:26am

re: #420 wahabicorridor

This will be passed up.

I'm now dying to know who you work for :) BTW, I see on the Cabot website that you can buy the chile-lime and the Tuscan flavored cheddars (Tuscan is also spectacular) online now. No butter though.

424 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:03:38am

re: #423 galloping granny

nic is blue

425 scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:04:46am

re: #419 littleoldlady

We are going for Cold War 2. We are switching jerseys though. This time we get to be the Communists.

426 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:06:54am

re: #425 scion9

We are going for Cold War 2. We are switching jerseys though. This time we get to be the Communists.

Not funny. I can picture BHO telling the Poles, "I don't get what you're complaining about..."

427 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:06:57am

re: #407 scion9

I didn't mean to imply that I believe homosexuality is a matter of choice; I don't, and for the very reasons you cite. On the other hand, my son is gay, and he is seeing someone who is an identical twin. And the twin brother is straight. If it is all biological, how does that happen? I sure don't have the answer, just speculation.

In any case, there is no biological imperative for homosexuality. Sex is for the express purpose of procreation. It is made desirable and pleasurable so that we will do it. Homosexuality may be some sort of biological aberration, and I do not mean to imply any inferiority by that whatsoever. We know that colorblindness is genetically linked, but no one considers that colorblind person to be less than equal to everyone else. We simply don't know if it is nature, nurture, or a combination of both.

I don't know of studies regarding how children fare in foster homes vs. same-sex 2-parent homes. My own feeling is that a stable, permanent home must be better, without question. I admit I am conflicted on the issue but tend to favor the best interests of the childrem.

428 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:07:10am

re: #421 The Other Les

Love Velveeta when I can afford it. Hate pepper jack, makes me ill. Havarti (from Wisconsin I presume) is now being sold presliced in local stores.

I will do almost anything to avoid pre-sliced cheese. We eat a lot of cheese, so I've taken to buying in bulk quantities at BJ's. Huge blocks of feta (6 inch cubes), 8 inch wheels of brie, good chevre in 2 pound packages, great big wedges of stuff from Italy etc. that I cannot otherwise lay hands on for love nor money locally. And I've taken to making our cream cheese, yogurt cheese and mozarella. It's getting to the point I need an entire refrigerator just for cheese.

429 Picayune  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:07:51am

re: #425 scion9

And the Russians are wearing home colors!

430 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:09:35am

re: #413 wahabicorridor

I happen to like Velveeta - no, actually, I LOVE Velveeta

/and you can keep that 'smelly socks' gorgonzola

Good gawd, please don't tell me California is responsible for Gorgonzola?! Yech.

431 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:12:23am

re: #427 I heart the USA

I saw your post - yesterday I think? - about your vote on Prop 8 and your gay son.

Please tell your son from me that I don't consider him 'less than' - but that as an adult citizen who takes the responsibility for taking care of this society very seriously - I am very conflicted. And that I wish him the very best and much love.

432 coquimbojoe  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:13:08am

Good morning and goodnight!

433 notutopia  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:13:36am

W.B.Yeats...
We will NOT be the falcons prey! Because WE did not unleash Obama.
He is still tethered by his arrogance and fear of public opinion.
Lo, it would not be in his BEST interest to eat the hand that feeds him!
The Prey will become those that disallow the consideration of dissent.
Never, Never, Never, give in or give up!

434 The Other Les  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:14:20am

re: #425 scion9

We are going for Cold War 2. We are switching jerseys though. This time we get to be the Communists.

Actually we're not Communists but we have the red jerseys anyway.

435 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:14:56am

re: #410 wahabicorridor

I am impressed. Let me know what you think of confessions -- it's like monty python's holy grail for me, I can still recite passages.

436 The Other Les  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:14:58am

re: #426 littleoldlady

Not funny. I can picture BHO telling the Poles, "I don't get what you're complaining about..."

Lefties tend to be appallingly dense.

437 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:15:05am

re: #429 Picayune

And the Russians are wearing home colors!

I almost died when I ever watched the Democrat convention from Denver this year and saw the outside of the convention center all decorated up with banners sporting the Red Star of Communism at the top! I cannot believe that so many people have forgotten what that symbol means. Even here.

So, last night I sat down to watch Doctor Zhivago, which I am considering showing to the kiddo - at least parts of it anyway. (We're studying 20th century this year). No, I was not losing my mind. There it is, everywhere. The Red Star. Symbol of Communism.

I know this for sure, because way back when I did my thesis for Asian History on The Red Star of China (Edgar Snow.) [Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

438 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:15:18am

re: #432 coquimbojoe

There he goes!

439 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:16:36am

re: #421 The Other Les

Love Velveeta when I can afford it. Hate pepper jack, makes me ill. Havarti (from Wisconsin I presume) is now being sold presliced in local stores.

To paraphrase the late, great Chuck Heston :"Velveeta is people!"

[Do you really know what's in it?] -jk :)

440 The Other Les  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:16:38am

re: #428 galloping granny

I will do almost anything to avoid pre-sliced cheese. We eat a lot of cheese, so I've taken to buying in bulk quantities at BJ's. Huge blocks of feta (6 inch cubes), 8 inch wheels of brie, good chevre in 2 pound packages, great big wedges of stuff from Italy etc. that I cannot otherwise lay hands on for love nor money locally. And I've taken to making our cream cheese, yogurt cheese and mozarella. It's getting to the point I need an entire refrigerator just for cheese.

Still prefer the non sliced. When I can afford it.

441 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:17:19am

re: #433 notutopia

Lo, it would not be in his BEST interest to eat the hand that feeds him!

Since he promised everybody everything I'll need a map to find that feeding hand...

/got GPS?

442 The Other Les  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:18:02am

re: #439 I heart the USA

To paraphrase the late, great Chuck Heston :"Velveeta is people!"

[Do you really know what's in it?] -jk :)

Um...what?

443 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:18:27am

re: #427 I heart the USA

Not sure i agree with that. nothing else we do that is necessary is a fraction as desirable and pleasurable as sex. Chocaholics to the contrary.

444 The Other Les  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:18:57am

re: #441 littleoldlady

Since he promised everybody everything I'll need a map to find that feeding hand...

/got GPS?

I still have a FAA sectional chart from 2001.

445 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:20:02am

re: #440 The Other Les

Still prefer the non sliced. When I can afford it.

Check out BJ's or Sam's Club if you have one near you. I pay about $7 for a block of feta 6 inches square - it would make a half dozen or more of those little packages. Same kind of savings for other cheeses too.

446 scottishbuzzsaw  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:20:33am

re: #437 galloping granny

Good morning, granny...it's been a long time! How have you been? How goes the home schooling?

(Still buying Cabot butter in Missouri!)

447 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:20:38am

re: #444 The Other Les

I still have a FAA sectional chart from 2001.

Hand it over, Les. ;-)

448 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:21:06am

re: #431 wahabicorridor

I saw your post - yesterday I think? - about your vote on Prop 8 and your gay son.

Please tell your son from me that I don't consider him 'less than' - but that as an adult citizen who takes the responsibility for taking care of this society very seriously - I am very conflicted. And that I wish him the very best and much love.

Thank you very much. I really appreciate that, and he will, too. :)

It is a difficult issue for a lot of us. Unfortunately, I have found way too many on the left feel that anyone who opposes gay marriage is anti-gay. I am duking it out with a person on another forum on just that issue. Typical liberal tolerance. :/

449 notutopia  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:21:52am

re: #429 Picayune

Good Morning Picayune!
I am wondering, what is NOLA's opinion of B. Jindal? Has he been good for the city? And is Catholicism still the mainstay in the city or has it diversified since the 90's?

450 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:22:13am

re: #424 wahabicorridor

nic is blue

Emailing you isn't so easy. Is the spam form a feature provided by your ISP?

451 blackpajamas  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:22:32am

Would you trust your money to a man who eats at McDonald's every day?

"Fund Manager Has Obama's Ear, Rogers Trades Ideas, Shots With President-Elect; Firm's Returns Lag"

"Tuesday's election transformed John Rogers from an obscure money manager who eats at McDonald's every day into a confidant of the world's most-powerful man, come January."

... and his firm was 10% behind the S&P500's total return.

//g'nite!

452 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:23:06am

re: #448 I heart the USA

I personally think that if this is a "rights" thing, then they should allow for equal marital rights through domestic partnerships/civil unions. I'm not sure what it is that causes the line to blur between the definitions of "marriage" and "Union" other than religious affiliation.

453 notutopia  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:23:19am

re: #441 littleoldlady

Center it in Chicago!

454 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:23:33am

re: #443 LynnfromNZ

Not sure i agree with that. nothing else we do that is necessary is a fraction as desirable and pleasurable as sex. Chocaholics to the contrary.

Nothing else we do is as vital to the survival of the species as sex, although the desire to eat is probably just as necessary. And that is why food is tasty!

455 LynnfromNZ  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:24:08am

g'night all, half past midnight here.

456 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:25:14am

re: #446 scottishbuzzsaw

Good morning, granny...it's been a long time! How have you been? How goes the home schooling?

(Still buying Cabot butter in Missouri!)

Good morning! Not that long. I just got to the point with the election that I could not take one more minute of it. Haven't even turned on the TV in a month now.

I've been good. We're having fun with the homeschooling this year. Studying science fiction for literature and the decades of the 20th for history/social studies, so the kiddo has been pretty enthusiastic. That always makes it nice.

How're things with you?

457 Ledger1  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:26:55am

Legal Question:

[Background]

Charles mentioned that Obama may have been feeling ill after his first National Security Briefings (NSB). But, when does he actually become President Elect?

Q: Is Obama the President Elect? And, does he get the NSB?

Q: Is Obama the President-designate?

[More Background]

"Doesn't Obama only become President-elect after the Electoral College votes?" -- Yes, that is technically true. Until then he could be more accurately called the President-designate. However, the long-time and widespread usage of President-elect for the winner on election day is too ingrained in the public's mind to worry about changing at this point..."

"The President-elect will also start receiving same national security briefings just like the President gets. The president and his staff will work with the new president to ensure a smooth transition."

See: president elect

458 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:27:00am

re: #442 The Other Les

Um...what?

Sorry, Les, that was a lame (I plead the lateness of the hour!) reference to Soylent Green. I just don't know what all is in Velveeta, and know of no other cheese that has the unrefridgerated shelf life of a Twinkie!

459 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:28:09am

re: #428 galloping granny

check your email. I had to get you thru my spam filter...

460 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:29:41am

re: #452 laZardo

I personally think that if this is a "rights" thing, then they should allow for equal marital rights through domestic partnerships/civil unions. I'm not sure what it is that causes the line to blur between the definitions of "marriage" and "Union" other than religious affiliation.

I can give you one reason. The feds and most of the states have specific rights written into all kinds of laws for married women - things like collecting social security & pensions on a husband's account. Do away with the traditional definition of marriage and you do away with any basis for those rights. And they do matter. Traditionally, women make less than men and do not spend as many years in the work force in order to stay home to raise a family.

461 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:30:29am

good morning all! Well it's 6:30 here and i just loaded the pork shoulder into the smoker. the beef and pork ribs will go on at 10, the chicken at noon, and kielbasa at about 2. We're gonna eat like kings today!

462 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:32:40am

re: #456 galloping granny

Good morning! Not that long. I just got to the point with the election that I could not take one more minute of it. Haven't even turned on the TV in a month now.

I've been good. We're having fun with the homeschooling this year. Studying science fiction for literature and the decades of the 20th for history/social studies, so the kiddo has been pretty enthusiastic. That always makes it nice.

How're things with you?

what sci-fi are you teaching? I'm a huge fan of Asimov.

463 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:34:03am

re: #452 laZardo

I personally think that if this is a "rights" thing, then they should allow for equal marital rights through domestic partnerships/civil unions. I'm not sure what it is that causes the line to blur between the definitions of "marriage" and "Union" other than religious affiliation.

California has domestic partner laws, but I am not sure exactly what they are titled. The right to marry would have conferred no additional rights to them, if I understand correctly.

464 The Other Les  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:34:08am

re: #447 littleoldlady

Hand it over, Les. ;-)

It's not that detailed.

465 notutopia  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:35:21am

re: #458 I heart the USA

other than color and some solid whey included, it really is more like a soy product.
Did you know you can purchase ANY hard cheese in whole wheels or blocks or partial wedges when you find it on sale or in bulk and brine it yourself and then seal it with wax to preserve it for long term storage.
I make my own cheeses here on the farm.

466 The Other Les  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:36:01am

re: #458 I heart the USA

Sorry, Les, that was a lame (I plead the lateness of the hour!) reference to Soylent Green. I just don't know what all is in Velveeta, and know of no other cheese that has the unrefridgerated shelf life of a Twinkie!

A good part of that is effective sterilization at the packaging phase.

467 scottishbuzzsaw  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:36:47am

re: #456 galloping granny

Good morning! Not that long. I just got to the point with the election that I could not take one more minute of it. Haven't even turned on the TV in a month now.

I've been good. We're having fun with the homeschooling this year. Studying science fiction for literature and the decades of the 20th for history/social studies, so the kiddo has been pretty enthusiastic. That always makes it nice.

How're things with you?

Things are fine here. I reached my limit for election coverage several weeks ago, too, and the TV has been used for DVDs only...I'm not a political animal by nature and I think I need to disappear to some isolated retreat for a couple of years to truly recover!

Glad to here the kiddo is enthusiastic. My husband and I always said that homeschooling our son was a joy simply because he loved to learn, and had that insatiable curiosity that spurred him on to tackle most subjects with gusto. He made us look very good as his teachers...

468 notutopia  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:37:30am

re: #461 beblebrox

YUM! I can smell all the way here. I'll bring the potatoe salad! What times dinner?

469 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:39:15am

re: #466 The Other Les

A good part of that is effective sterilization at the packaging phase.

Waaay back in HS I kept a McDonalds cheeseburger in the under seat box of my Jeep for 6 months and the only thing tjat happened is the bun got hard, which goes to show that is is not food. It may not even be organic in origin, at least not of Earth organic, at least.

470 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:40:37am

re: #468 notutopia

YUM! I can smell all the way here. I'll bring the potatoe salad! What times dinner?

approx 7. there's plenty for all. Plus there are about 5 kinds of British and Belgian Ales!

471 BignJames  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:40:50am

re: #463 I heart the USA

I have no problem w/domestic partnership/civil union laws. Marriage is between a man and a woman...to allow otherwise is conferring "special rights" for gays. Call it semantics if you like...a male homosexual can't "marry" another male...and neither can I

472 notutopia  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:41:21am

BBL
time to feed the barnyard gang and the poultry want OUT of the coop!

473 scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:41:35am

re: #427 I heart the USA

Regardless of what 'causes' homosexuality, I'm sure sex is pleasurable for gay people. There is also the issue of living in a culture that is on one hand very sexualized and promiscuous, and on the other very religious and conservative. Expecting a segment of the population to essentially live in privation from enjoying the fruits of our culture isn't really realistic.

For the record though, if I lived in CA I would have voted Yes on Prop 8, just for the fact that I don't believe courts she be able to 'review' the law to say what ever they want it to. If Californians want gay marriage they need to change the laws on the books and in the constitution rather than letting courts divorce the wording of the law from its original intent.

As much as it pains me to praise it, under Sharia, the construction of a ruling is strenuously based on the historicity of prior Fiqh, Haditha and Sira as to never seperate the wording of a particular precedent or law from its original reasons for implementation.

Ironically of course, you can't actually change the laws on the books in Sharia, so a system of jurisprudence that is more flexible and progressive in its review process would seem pretty logical. For us, there really isn't any excuse to not strictly evaluate a law based in historical context and leave changing laws up to the legislature.

474 wahabicorridor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:42:02am

Off to start the caffeine IV drip and read the rags...

475 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:42:26am

So, I'm up, dressed, and with my wife's last affectionate words ("Turn that damn light off, asshole!) still in my ears I'm almost ready to enter the woods.

I need another cup of coffee.

476 The Other Les  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:42:36am

re: #469 beblebrox

Waaay back in HS I kept a McDonalds cheeseburger in the under seat box of my Jeep for 6 months and the only thing tjat happened is the bun got hard, which goes to show that is is not food. It may not even be organic in origin, at least not of Earth organic, at least.

When I was at Pizza Hut the district manager told me that all of the stuff they use for toppings can be consumed uncooked.

477 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:42:57am

re: #459 wahabicorridor

check your email. I had to get you thru my spam filter...

Replied.

478 The Other Les  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:43:03am

Gotta go. Try to get some temp work today.

479 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:43:53am

re: #474 wahabicorridor

Off to start the caffeine IV drip and read the rags...

Just because it's Saturday doesn't excuse you from the salt mines!

480 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:45:35am

re: #476 The Other Les

When I was at Pizza Hut the district manager told me that all of the stuff they use for toppings can be consumed uncooked.

see that? I always maintained that no household is complete without a small supply of Cesium 137 on hand for food preservation purposes.

481 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:45:52am

re: #462 beblebrox

what sci-fi are you teaching? I'm a huge fan of Asimov.

We started out with Jurrasic Park - that one is very easy to demonstrate the cutting edge science behind the story. Now we are working on 20K Leagues Under the Sea - also cutting edge "science" (development of the submarine by the Confederates - Henley) and one of if not the first in the genre. Haven't decided on the next one yet. I'll probably try to pick things out from this point by decades - we're just finishing up 1900-10 and starting WWI.

482 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:47:12am

Charleton heston actor did a ton of Dystopia movies in the 70"s(perfect world thatsanything but) including one called Soylent Green which was made from Old people after they were sent to a retirement camp Euthanized and processed into food. the 3 main types of food in the movie were Soylent(name derived from SOY beans and LENTiles) green blue and red.

483 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:47:55am

re: #460 galloping granny

I can give you one reason. The feds and most of the states have specific rights written into all kinds of laws for married women - things like collecting social security & pensions on a husband's account. Do away with the traditional definition of marriage and you do away with any basis for those rights. And they do matter. Traditionally, women make less than men and do not spend as many years in the work force in order to stay home to raise a family.

I don't see how that would change under DP/CU laws...especially with regards to lesbian unions.

484 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:48:28am

At the end of the movie after discovering the movie he runs out and over dramatically states Soylent green is people it's people.

485 scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:48:40am

re: #452 laZardo

I personally think that if this is a "rights" thing, then they should allow for equal marital rights through domestic partnerships/civil unions. I'm not sure what it is that causes the line to blur between the definitions of "marriage" and "Union" other than religious affiliation.

It isn't about 'rights'. It is theatrics, and activism. It is about government mandated respect and tolerance, where none actually exists in reality. The 'right' for gay couples to marry would not have conveyed any addition benefits to them under the law that they don't already enjoy in a civil union (in California anyway). It is pretty much a fight over a word, if you look at the brass tacks though.

According to PEW, if we took a national popular vote to allow gay civil unions, that would pass. Gay marriage would be shot down. Civil unions are not enough though. The activists want the 'right' to be extended the same respect that the institution of traditional marriage enjoys. The law will never accomplish this. Continuously ranting and raving and protesting about it though, and challenging it in court, etc, will.

486 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:49:06am

re: #475 razorbacker

So, I'm up, dressed, and with my wife's last affectionate words ("Turn that damn light off, asshole!) still in my ears I'm almost ready to enter the woods.

I need another cup of coffee.

What sweet, innocent furry animals are you gonna' murder are you hunting today?

487 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:49:24am

re: #461 beblebrox

good morning all! Well it's 6:30 here and i just loaded the pork shoulder into the smoker. the beef and pork ribs will go on at 10, the chicken at noon, and kielbasa at about 2. We're gonna eat like kings today!

What can I bring? Got directions?

488 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:50:11am

re: #465 notutopia

other than color and some solid whey included, it really is more like a soy product.
Did you know you can purchase ANY hard cheese in whole wheels or blocks or partial wedges when you find it on sale or in bulk and brine it yourself and then seal it with wax to preserve it for long term storage.
I make my own cheeses here on the farm.

Actually, I didn't know that. I plead ignorance due to having lived almost my entire life in suburban Southern California.

And to all the Velveeta fans, I meant no disrespect! If you feel the need for payback, feel free to whip out one of the many 'loony Californians' put-downs we've all heard and beat me with them. I promise I won't mind - I'll probably agree with them! :)

But for now, I must get some sleep. It has been lively - 'night all!

489 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:50:40am

re: #481 galloping granny

We started out with Jurrasic Park - that one is very easy to demonstrate the cutting edge science behind the story. Now we are working on 20K Leagues Under the Sea - also cutting edge "science" (development of the submarine by the Confederates - Henley) and one of if not the first in the genre. Haven't decided on the next one yet. I'll probably try to pick things out from this point by decades - we're just finishing up 1900-10 and starting WWI.

I'd strongly recomend the Foundation Series from Asimov. It can be tied into a lot of history lessons. Basically the entire series is a metaphor for the fall of the Roman Empire, the Rise of the Church, and the eventual Renaissance and Reformation. He really managed to catch the feel of society collapsing around them, by showing how various knowledge is lost and people slide back into mysticism and legend.

490 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:52:12am

re: #486 MandyManners

What sweet, innocent furry animals are you gonna' murder are you hunting today?

I'm looking for whitetails.

If I can't find those, I may shoot a deer.

491 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:53:11am

re: #488 I heart the USA

Actually, I didn't know that. I plead ignorance due to having lived almost my entire life in suburban Southern California.

And to all the Velveeta fans, I meant no disrespect! If you feel the need for payback, feel free to whip out one of the many 'loony Californians' put-downs we've all heard and beat me with them. I promise I won't mind - I'll probably agree with them! :)

But for now, I must get some sleep. It has been lively - 'night all!

middle of nowhere, near Pittsburgh. Follow the smell of Hickory! :)

492 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:53:59am

And speaking of dystopic societies how long will it be before the US ends up like in Idiocracy. That movie tho nothing more than a comedy has some severe relevance in todays society. Everyone is a millionare, the top viewed movie was called Ass and was just 1.5 hours of a bare naked one with no plot dialogue etc.

493 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:54:01am

re: #490 razorbacker

I'm looking for whitetails.

If I can't find those, I may shoot a deer.

My back yard. Herd of whitetails. Well fed. (TRUST ME.) Some wid, some widout antlers.

/I thought whitetail season was after Thanksgiving...

494 BignJames  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:54:25am

re: #486 MandyManners

If it's deer, I can save him the trouble of going in the woods before daybreak. I could prolly tag 3 or 4 w/my car on the way home this a.m.

495 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:55:34am

re: #483 laZardo

I don't see how that would change under DP/CU laws...especially with regards to lesbian unions.

It works like this: I was married for more than 10 years and 1 day, so under our current Social Security laws I am entitled to collect my social security benefit as 75% of my ex-husband's benefit rather than my own. My choice - I can take whichever happens to be more. If I had never "worked" a day I would get 75% of his benefit as compensation for the benefits I provided to him and our children under our marriage contract during the many years that I was raising children.

This is not the case for my ex-husband. He gets what he has earned - even if I had made much more money than he did.

The sole basis for this "discrepancy" lies in the traditional understanding of roles in marriage. Allow gay marriage and you then either have to do away with any benefit allowed to women in compensation for remaining out of the work force or you have to allow all partners to collect on whoever made the most. Option number one would disenfranchise millions of women, option number two would completely and entirely bankrupt the system.

496 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:56:23am

re: #490 razorbacker

I'm looking for whitetails.

If I can't find those, I may shoot a deer.

Aren't white-tails deer?

497 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:56:39am

re: #493 littleoldlady

My back yard. Herd of whitetails. Well fed. (TRUST ME.) Some wid, some widout antlers.

/I thought whitetail season was after Thanksgiving...

You know, it used to be. Now, though season runs from Oct. 1 through to end of Feb. If you aren't particular how you take them. (bow, muzzleloader, or modern gun. Technically, automobile season is year-round, but the buy-in is a bugger.)

498 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:56:40am

re: #493 littleoldlady

My back yard. Herd of whitetails. Well fed. (TRUST ME.) Some wid, some widout antlers.

/I thought whitetail season was after Thanksgiving...

for me, it turkeys. those things are so numerous in my yard every day, they are like vermin.

499 scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:57:07am

re: #489 beblebrox

The overly literal, mistranslated title of The Foundation into Arabic was Al Qaida, in its first prints. Think OBL was a fan? It was a great series though.

Dune, written in the '60s is also a classic, and delves more into geopolitics, and religion than science. Maybe the genre should be Social-sciences fiction.

500 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:58:43am

re: #498 beblebrox

We get turkey vultures.

/are they edible?
//city girl ;-)

re: #497 razorbacker

You know, it used to be. Now, though season runs from Oct. 1 through to end of Feb. If you aren't particular how you take them. (bow, muzzleloader, or modern gun. Technically, automobile season is year-round, but the buy-in is a bugger.)

In what state?

501 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:59:30am

re: #495 galloping granny

Given that gay marriages in those states that allowed it have slowed pretty much to barely a drip despite their legalization, it does not seem that it would "bankrupt the system."

I can understand the "marriage for convenience" point though.

502 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 3:59:37am

re: #496 MandyManners

Aren't white-tails deer?

Joke.

At a pig-roast one evening. Way out in the boonies. Just after dark this son of Nimrod wanders up all cammoed out. We ask any luck. He says, "I say plenty of whitetails" then points to several of the ladies who have been out to heed nature's call, "Hers, hers, and hers."

503 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:00:18am

re: #500 littleoldlady

We get turkey vultures.

/are they edible?
//city girl ;-)

re: #497 razorbacker

In what state?

Peoples Republic of Arkansas.

504 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:00:39am

re: #499 scion9

The overly literal, mistranslated title of The Foundation into Arabic was Al Qaida, in its first prints. Think OBL was a fan? It was a great series though.

Dune, written in the '60s is also a classic, and delves more into geopolitics, and religion than science. Maybe the genre should be Social-sciences fiction.

Interesting, i never knew that. I always liked the scene in the book where one of the early trader/merchants visit that one planet early in the book and note that they had forgotten how to run the nuclear reactors. "back to coal and oil are they?"

505 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:01:59am

re: #493 littleoldlady

My back yard. Herd of whitetails. Well fed. (TRUST ME.) Some wid, some widout antlers.

/I thought whitetail season was after Thanksgiving...

And I have to climb the hill before shooting. Then swear upon my honor that of course that isn't one of the deer we've been watching in the yard.

506 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:02:38am

Saw some headline on Yahoo that said its been confirmed there's been a partisan shift. In other words, the Democrats have gained in numbers of voters registered Democrat. But I don't really feel like reading it or linking to it. Just to say, we have our work cut out for us.

507 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:03:16am

re: #503 razorbacker

We have WAY too many rules in PA.

My favorite is if you are disabled you can use a vehicle to get antlerless deer.

/did I read that right?!

508 Dar ul Harb  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:03:29am

re: #437 galloping granny

I almost died when I ever watched the Democrat convention from Denver this year and saw the outside of the convention center all decorated up with banners sporting the Red Star of Communism at the top! I cannot believe that so many people have forgotten what that symbol means. Even here.

No kidding. The McCain graphic design people were using red stars on some of his stuff, too! And, to top it off, they had a whole set of merchandise on the store with the theme "Vote Red"!

I wrote them about it.

Dear Sir or Madam,

Obama really ought to be the one using the red star graphics and "Vote Red" slogan on his campaign materials.
Not the guy that was held prisoner and tortured by the Communist North Vietnamese.

Just a clue.

509 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:04:24am

re: #501 laZardo

Given that gay marriages in those states that allowed it have slowed pretty much to barely a drip despite their legalization, it does not seem that it would "bankrupt the system."

I can understand the "marriage for convenience" point though.

I did not say that the rate of gay marriage would bankrupt the system LaZardo. I said specifically that allowing gay marriage - and thus total equality - would mean that either millions of women who have been promised entitlements in return for remaining outside of the workforce in order to provide the benefit to society of rearing children must be disenfranchised OR that all individuals everywhere of any persuasion must be allowed to choose whose account they would collect social security under. That would require at least a doubling of paper work & administrative staff and would mean that we paid out billions more in benefits, bankrupting the system entirely.

510 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:04:39am

re: #485 scion9

It isn't about 'rights'. It is theatrics, and activism. It is about government mandated respect and tolerance, where none actually exists in reality. The 'right' for gay couples to marry would not have conveyed any addition benefits to them under the law that they don't already enjoy in a civil union (in California anyway). It is pretty much a fight over a word, if you look at the brass tacks though.

According to PEW, if we took a national popular vote to allow gay civil unions, that would pass. Gay marriage would be shot down. Civil unions are not enough though. The activists want the 'right' to be extended the same respect that the institution of traditional marriage enjoys. The law will never accomplish this. Continuously ranting and raving and protesting about it though, and challenging it in court, etc, will.

Hence the continuous likening to the Civil Rights Movement.

511 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:05:38am

re: #505 razorbacker

And I have to climb the hill before shooting. Then swear upon my honor that of course that isn't one of the deer we've been watching in the yard.

talloldman used to go to the Poconos for a week during deer season. He'd call me after the first day and say, "I haven't seen ONE deer yet!"

While speaking with him I'd be looking out the kitchen window at a family of 5 or 6.

/you can't tell me they're dumb animals...

512 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:06:29am

re: #499 scion9

The overly literal, mistranslated title of The Foundation into Arabic was Al Qaida, in its first prints. Think OBL was a fan? It was a great series though.

Dune, written in the '60s is also a classic, and delves more into geopolitics, and religion than science. Maybe the genre should be Social-sciences fiction.

so, do you think we are at a Seldon Crisis?

513 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:07:10am

re: #508 Dar ul Harb

I think I saw that red star on McCain's stuff for an hour or two. Glad you wrote to them. And I'm surprised that McCain of all people missed it. But then I am still a little dumbfounded that Macy's logo these days is a big red star - just like used to preside over the front of the big GUM across from the Kremlin in Moscow.

514 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:08:08am

re: #502 razorbacker

What do does eat?

Hat-tip: NY Nana.

515 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:08:18am

re: #507 littleoldlady

We have WAY too many rules in PA.

My favorite is if you are disabled you can use a vehicle to get antlerless deer.

/did I read that right?!

But y'all did have that neato rule regarding muzzleloaders (only flintlocks, no percussion caps allowed).

And I don't doubt the disabled rule. I understand. Walking takes a lot of older hunters out of the equation, if you can't use vehicles (classifying 4-wheelers as vehicles)

516 scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:08:58am

re: #492 Rancher

Brave New World, from 1932 is a lot more prophetic than Idiocracy. It is the Dystopian novel to read for modern America.

The Giver is entertaining as well as an alegorical tale that ties together themes from several Dystopian novels and short stories into a whole that is a page turner suited to young adults.

517 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:09:33am

re: #511 littleoldlady

talloldman used to go to the Poconos for a week during deer season. He'd call me after the first day and say, "I haven't seen ONE deer yet!"

While speaking with him I'd be looking out the kitchen window at a family of 5 or 6.

/you can't tell me they're dumb animals...

We used to live not far from the MA/NY border years back. Let me tell you, deer are not stupid. Those suckers can read and tell time even. It so happens that the NY and MA deer seasons are offset just enough that one finishes just as the other begins. The day that hunting begins in NY all of the deer (and there were huge herds when we lived there) would pick themselves up and march across the border into MA. And the day that hunting began in MA they would all hightail it right straight back to NY.

518 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:09:37am

re: #514 MandyManners

What do does eat?

Hat-tip: NY Nana.

Without looking, I can tell you they eat the same as mares.

519 Long Nics are Looonnng  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:09:41am

re: #1 gmsc

¡llǝɯs pɐǝɹɥ&#x0287 ; ʍǝu ˙ ˙ ˙ ɯɯɯɯ

That was pretty cool.

520 Dar ul Harb  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:09:48am

re: #513 galloping granny

I think I saw that red star on McCain's stuff for an hour or two. Glad you wrote to them. And I'm surprised that McCain of all people missed it. But then I am still a little dumbfounded that Macy's logo these days is a big red star - just like used to preside over the front of the big GUM across from the Kremlin in Moscow.

Acclimation, granny?

521 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:09:57am

re: #515 razorbacker

But y'all did have that neato rule regarding muzzleloaders (only flintlocks, no percussion caps allowed).

And I don't doubt the disabled rule. I understand. Walking takes a lot of older hunters out of the equation, if you can't use vehicles (classifying 4-wheelers as vehicles)

Every year on the 1st day of buck season the news is full of stories of older people found dead of heart attacks in the woods trying to drag deer back out.

522 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:10:15am

re: #515 razorbacker

Yeah but the way it's written it sounds like a vehicle is what you use to kill it.

/I'm sure I saw a movie with a scene like that...

523 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:11:08am

re: #516 scion9

Brave New World, from 1932 is a lot more prophetic than Idiocracy. It is the Dystopian novel to read for modern America.

The Giver is entertaining as well as an alegorical tale that ties together themes from several Dystopian novels and short stories into a whole that is a page turner suited to young adults.

The Giver is on the list. And perhaps Animal Farm. Definitely War of the Worlds, for which I have obtained a CD of the original broadcast.

524 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:11:14am

re: #505 razorbacker

And I have to climb the hill before shooting. Then swear upon my honor that of course that isn't one of the deer we've been watching in the yard.

We get deer in our yard, too. One of my biggest delights last winter was seeing deer in a yard next to The Kid's school in the city.

525 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:11:45am

re: #511 littleoldlady

talloldman used to go to the Poconos for a week during deer season. He'd call me after the first day and say, "I haven't seen ONE deer yet!"

While speaking with him I'd be looking out the kitchen window at a family of 5 or 6.

/you can't tell me they're dumb animals...

One Thanksgiving, I got lazy and shot one that was standing by the car bumpers in the drive. Didn't see another deer that year.

They're dumb animals, but not exactly stupid.

526 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:11:48am

re: #513 galloping granny

re: #508 Dar ul Harb

That's one thing that's puzzled me...if Red generally signifies leftism, how is it that the conservative party historically used the color?

527 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:12:42am

re: #516 scion9

I recommend Fahrenheit 451. IIRC the society they lived in came about mainly because nobody wanted to be "offended," at least that's what Beatty mentioned in his monologue.

528 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:12:45am

re: #520 Dar ul Harb

Acclimation, granny?

That would be my first guess. And it is quite apparent that the red scares of the 50's and the huge blacklisting of writers and actors was not without basis in fact - a basis that obviously still exists.

529 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:13:33am

re: #526 laZardo

re: #508 Dar ul Harb

That's one thing that's puzzled me...if Red generally signifies leftism, how is it that the conservative party historically used the color?

It isn't the Red, it is the Red Star - the international symbol of communism for 100 years or so.

530 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:14:44am

re: #524 MandyManners

We get deer in our yard, too. One of my biggest delights last winter was seeing deer in a yard next to The Kid's school in the city.

I, too, delight in watching deer at play. If the good Lord, in its wisdom, hadn't seen fit to absolutely stuff the hides with venison, I'd not shoot one either.

531 Long Nics are Looonnng  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:15:02am

I am full of passionate intensity.

Does that make me the worst?

532 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:15:54am

re: #518 razorbacker

Without looking, I can tell you they eat the same as mares.

My granny used to sing me this wonderful nonsense song about doesidoes and maresidoes that delighted me as a child. And then I found out that the words are actually does eat oats and mares eat oats and little lambs eat ivy.

533 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:16:19am

re: #513 galloping granny

I think I saw that red star on McCain's stuff for an hour or two. Glad you wrote to them. And I'm surprised that McCain of all people missed it. But then I am still a little dumbfounded that Macy's logo these days is a big red star - just like used to preside over the front of the big GUM across from the Kremlin in Moscow.

IIRC, Macy's founder had a red star tattooed on one of his hands back in the early-mid 1800s.

534 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:16:25am

re: #530 razorbacker

I, too, delight in watching deer at play. If the good Lord, in its wisdom, hadn't seen fit to absolutely stuff the hides with venison, I'd not shoot one either.

one of my favorite T-shirts i saw a few years back: "vegetables aren't food. vegetables are what food eats"

535 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:17:50am

re: #517 galloping granny

Yeah, and god forbid you should ask them not to eat your vegetable garden...

536 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:18:07am

re: #518 razorbacker

Without looking, I can tell you they eat the same as mares.

Oh, c'mon. Look! It's an entertaining bit.

537 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:18:28am

re: #534 beblebrox

one of my favorite T-shirts i saw a few years back: "vegetables aren't food. vegetables are what food eats"

Driving down the road with one of the neighbor kids. Passed a herd of cattle. Kid says, straight faced, "Look at all the hamburgers."

538 Dar ul Harb  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:19:26am

re: #526 laZardo

re: #508 Dar ul Harb

That's one thing that's puzzled me...if Red generally signifies leftism, how is it that the conservative party historically used the color?

That's an interesting question. Initially, the television electoral maps used blue for Republicans and red for Democrats, but they switched.

Or as Wikipedia put it, [by 2000] "...there was no coordinated effort in the media to code Democratic states blue and Republican states red; the association gradually emerged."

(Just like there was no coordinated effort to be in the tank for 0bama, it's just I suspect that lefty media types were a little uncomfortable having the Democrats identified with red, because it was too close to the truth...)

539 scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:19:26am

re: #527 laZardo

Yeah. I've read it. I couldn't sleep one night while I was in high school and grabbed my brother's copy that he was supposed to do a book report on and wound up reading the whole thing in one sitting.

It is a great story, but I don't think it paints a particularly realistic picture of what a society could actually devolve into. It does give a poignant indictment of the political caste/nomenklatura in the inexplicably erudite, Shakespeare-quoting Chief Beatty though.

540 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:20:46am

#532 granny

Does eats oats and goats eat oats and little lambs eat ivy -- a kid'l eat ivy, too, wouldn't you?

Oh, yeah, I remember that. And I'm not old enough to be YOUR granny!

I'll bet I can find the rest of the lyrics on the web. That's one of those "novelty" songs from maybe as far back as the 20's that people like the Andrew Sisters recorded in the 40's.

Good morning. (I'll go get my coffee, excuse me.)

541 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:21:00am

I think i'll be going thru googles list of any dystopian films so i have a list of movies to watch for the next 4 years. I love brave new world just recommended Idiocracy because i love the names and the way the starbuck's on every corner survive. Plus it reminds me so much of modern society that we are on the verge of living in an Idiocracy(obamocracy). Modern youths wanting lots of money for nothing etc.

542 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:21:15am

re: #530 razorbacker

I, too, delight in watching deer at play. If the good Lord, in its wisdom, hadn't seen fit to absolutely stuff the hides with venison, I'd not shoot one either.

I've never had deer but, I had friends in the mountains of Colorado that always had some good antelope--the leanest, cleanest-tasting meat I've ever had.

543 tappin52  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:21:17am

My son went hunting this morning. He is going to be extremely annoyed with himself for leaving his hunting knife on my kitchen table.

544 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:23:07am

Another one was about "three little fishies."

"Thwim, thaid the momma fithie."

545 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:23:55am

re: #535 littleoldlady

Yeah, and god forbid you should ask them not to eat your vegetable garden...

ROFLMAO! Though they could have had my vegetable garden this year. I don't think I have ever been quite so disappointed. We had nearly a week of 100 degree temps mid May that killed off all the early stuff - no lettuce, peas, etc. Some bug I have never seen before - very oval and ash gray - invaded the zucchini, cukes and melon, eating through one variety after another. I went up one day and had beautiful healthy cuke plants, 4 days later the plants were gone as if they never existed. And then it rained every single day from July 4 until nearly September. All of the tomatoes got some sort of wilt from being too wet all the time, so I did not get so much as a single tomato sandwich out of all that time and work.

I do have winter beans up there (the kind you dry and cook for soup) - or at least I did. But I've been so depressed over the garden I haven't even been up to check on them in six weeks or so.

546 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:24:12am

re: #539 scion9

Hmm. The excessive use of high technology ("seashells" similar to iPods, wall-to-wall televisions and sentient robotics) made it seem more realistic than Brave New World IMO.

547 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:24:22am

ok, I'm being incredibly stupid this morning. almost just injected myself with the wrong insulin.

/time to turn the brain on

548 Dar ul Harb  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:24:36am

re: #528 galloping granny

That would be my first guess. And it is quite apparent that the red scares of the 50's and the huge blacklisting of writers and actors was not without basis in fact - a basis that obviously still exists.

Just as students aren't taught about the evils of Communism, they're also largely ignorant of the post-Cold War release of the Venona decrypts, which show just how pervasive Soviet infiltration was.

549 scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:24:51am

re: #541 Rancher

Heh. It's not just Starbucks. The mall in my neck of the woods has a Gamestop across the hall from a Gamestop. I think there used to be an Electronics Boutique there, but apparently they are no more. The first time I noticed it I walked out of the store, looked up and got real confused. Had to look behind me just to double check.

550 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:24:52am

re: #540 nonic

#532 granny

Does eats oats and goats eat oats and little lambs eat ivy -- a kid'l eat ivy, too, wouldn't you?

Oh, yeah, I remember that. And I'm not old enough to be YOUR granny!

I'll bet I can find the rest of the lyrics on the web. That's one of those "novelty" songs from maybe as far back as the 20's that people like the Andrew Sisters recorded in the 40's.

Good morning. (I'll go get my coffee, excuse me.)

Krep. Now I've got Shall We Walk or Take a Dog from Freddie and the Fleas running through my head. Thanks.

551 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:25:27am

Mairzy doats.
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Three little fishies.
[Link: www.songsforteaching.com...]

552 goddessoftheclassroom  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:25:58am

Good morning, Lizards.

553 tappin52  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:26:07am

He took a hunting trip to Canada a few years back and shot a gigantic elk. that was very good meat. But the elk head that he had mounted is too big to put anywhere. Right now it is sitting in an extra room at his brother's house. My poor daughter-in-law is so creeped out by it that she had to cover it with a sheet.

554 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:26:13am

re: #540 nonic

#532 granny

Does eats oats and goats eat oats and little lambs eat ivy -- a kid'l eat ivy, too, wouldn't you?

Oh, yeah, I remember that. And I'm not old enough to be YOUR granny!

I'll bet I can find the rest of the lyrics on the web. That's one of those "novelty" songs from maybe as far back as the 20's that people like the Andrew Sisters recorded in the 40's.

Good morning. (I'll go get my coffee, excuse me.)

My kids always loved that song too. And I used to sing it to the kiddo when she was little. It has never been quite so wondrous since realizing that Does eat oats though.

555 goddessoftheclassroom  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:27:05am

re: #549 scion9

Heh. It's not just Starbucks. The mall in my neck of the woods has a Gamestop across the hall from a Gamestop. I think there used to be an Electronics Boutique there, but apparently they are no more. The first time I noticed it I walked out of the store, looked up and got real confused. Had to look behind me just to double check.

Electronics Boutique became Gamestop.

556 I heart the USA  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:27:10am

re: #473 scion9

Regardless of what 'causes' homosexuality, I'm sure sex is pleasurable for gay people. There is also the issue of living in a culture that is on one hand very sexualized and promiscuous, and on the other very religious and conservative. Expecting a segment of the population to essentially live in privation from enjoying the fruits of our culture isn't really realistic.

I'm sure sex is pleasurable for gay people, too, nor do I care if people are straight or gay. What I am saying is that procreation is necessary for the species to survive, and to survive that procreation must be between a man and woman, and to ensure that it is done we have been given sexual desire and pleasure. Again my point was that there is no biological imperative for homosexuality.

And I'm not sure what you mean by expecting gays to 'live in privation from enjoying the fruits of our culture', but if you mean gay marriage, CA has a civil union law. I object to changing the definition of marriage which would actually mean rendering it meaningless. I mean, shall we expand the definition of 'thin' to include 'fat'? I know a lot of people who would like that, but it wouldn't make them thin, it would just make the word 'thin' meaningless.

Now I really am outta here - 'night/morning to all!

557 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:27:16am

re: #549 scion9

Gamestop bought EBGames IIRC. So now, all game stores are Gamestop!

/Demolition Man reference

558 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:28:14am

re: #545 galloping granny

We usually have a decent season for growing here. Not long, but long enough for gorgeous tomatoes, beans, peppers, etc. But I need to enclose the garden in some kind of tall fence structure with a roof, or I get nothing.

I planted everything in pots on the deck this year and didn't get very much of anything. :-/

559 Aussie Stinger  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:28:33am

.

We may have lost the big election in America folks.

But tonight, Conservatives can say that we've at least picked up a couple of consolation prizes:

- New Zealand
[Link: www.nzherald.co.nz...]
(running on a platform of, would you believe, "change")

... plus ...

- Canada
[Link: www.cbc.ca...]

Big Brother USA goes Left, while Canada goes Right.

Big Brother Australia goes Left, while New Zealand goes Right.

It's a topsy turvy world.

560 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:28:40am

We could send this one to The One

[Link: kids.niehs.nih.gov...]

I don't want a bunny or a kitty
I don't want a parrot that talks
I don't want a bowl of little fishies
He can't take a goldfish for a walk

How much is that doggie in the window? (arf! arf!)
The one with the waggley tail
How much is that doggie in the window? (arf! arf!)
I do hope that doggie's for sale

561 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:28:46am

re: #547 beblebrox

ok, I'm being incredibly stupid this morning. almost just injected myself with the wrong insulin.

/time to turn the brain on

SHOULD YOU BE CALLING SOMEONE ABOUT THAT?!

562 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:29:34am

Well, that was fun. A lot better way of starting the day than I thought I was facing. :-)

563 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:30:51am

re: #559 Aussie Stinger

Some European artists on my art site's forums have said that America's political system is calibrated more toward the right by default (and theirs is calibrated more to the left from the American view). Therefore the global spectrum should be moving toward the norm...

564 tappin52  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:30:54am

re: #561 littleoldlady

He said ALMOST. I hope he got it right.

565 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:31:04am

re: #561 littleoldlady

SHOULD YOU BE CALLING SOMEONE ABOUT THAT?!

No, I'm fine. was just on autopilot for a sec. I'd have been walikg around in a coma all day long. Kinda like an Obama voter. ;)

/seriously just trying to do too much all at once, and I've only been doing this for 2 weeks. it's not habit yet.

566 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:31:07am

re: #558 littleoldlady

We usually have a decent season for growing here. Not long, but long enough for gorgeous tomatoes, beans, peppers, etc. But I need to enclose the garden in some kind of tall fence structure with a roof, or I get nothing.

I planted everything in pots on the deck this year and didn't get very much of anything. :-/

We usually do too. Last year I had bushels of tomatoes and lovely lettuces. Bags and bags of green beans. This year even the big truck farmer lost his first cuke crop to that heatwave, so I only managed to acquire a half-bushel of picklers. I'm rationing out the bread and butters (I have a daughter that can inhale an entire pint at a go without blinking an eyelash) but no dills this year.

567 Dar ul Harb  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:31:08am

re: #561 littleoldlady

Almost, lol. bebleborx said "almost".

568 razorbacker  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:31:33am

BBL. Y'all hold the noise down, 'Kay?


And nonic. Stop whistling. Distracting.

569 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:32:28am

re: #565 beblebrox

No, I'm fine. was just on autopilot for a sec. I'd have been walikg around in a coma all day long. Kinda like an Obama voter. ;)

/seriously just trying to do too much all at once, and I've only been doing this for 2 weeks. it's not habit yet.

NEVER let it be habit. That is when mistakes happen.

570 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:32:32am

Speaking of which...

You know, looking at these videos that were posted in the link viewer thingie...
On Oprah, William I Am sings “It’s a New Day” for Obama’s victory.
[Link: [Link: www.youtube.com...]...]
Kenyans name babies Barack, Obama, and Michelle.
[Link: news.nationalgeographic.com...]
...it occurs to me that this wasn't really an election "of the people, by the people, for the people" of an American president. This was something else. Some kind of MOVEMENT. This election was HIJACKED by a movement for ... I don't know, minority self-esteem or something like that. WORLD WIDE.

571 Dar ul Harb  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:32:57am

I hear the little Harbs waking up.

BBL.

572 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:32:59am

re: #564 tappin52

re: #565 beblebrox

WHEW!

573 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:33:39am

re: #567 Dar ul Harb

Okay, so I'm a little coffee bereft... ;-)

574 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:33:39am

re: #551 nonic

Mairzy doats.
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Three little fishies.
[Link: www.songsforteaching.com...]

575 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:33:51am

I think these are better links...

On Oprah, William I Am sings “It’s a New Day” for Obama’s victory.

Kenyans name babies Barack, Obama, and Michelle.
[Link: news.nationalgeographic.com...]

576 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:34:44am

re: #570 nonic

What happens when he disappoints them?

577 tappin52  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:34:46am

re: #563 laZardo

What kind of art do you do?

578 goddessoftheclassroom  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:35:21am

re: #576 littleoldlady

What happens when he disappoints them?

Anyone who looks to someone else to bring him or her success and happiness is going to be disappointed.

579 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:36:02am

re: #577 tappin52

Click the nic for my "leisure" art. Lots of Pokemon, because I am a nerd like that. 8D

I also have a separate "portfolio" account of the stuff I make in college...though I've hardly updated that in a while.

580 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:36:20am

re: #573 littleoldlady

Okay, so I'm a little coffee bereft... ;-)

You know, it was the strangest thing. About 2.5 months ago I realized one morning that I hadn't bothered to make a pot of coffee in a couple of weeks. I used to drink so much coffee that it really should have come in an IV drip. These days I might remember to make a pot of coffee once a week and then only drink part of a mug full.

581 beblebrox  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:36:22am

re: #569 galloping granny

NEVER let it be habit. That is when mistakes happen.

you're right. I left the basal pen next to the bolus; something i never do. I'll be sure not to do that again. i had the needle screwed on. once i looked at it to dial in the dosage, i realized i had the wrong one in my hand. not that 8 units of Lantus would have killed me, but i would have been drinking coke for the rest of the day to fend off hypoglycemia.

582 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:37:10am

re: #576 littleoldlady

What happens when he disappoints them?

They blame whitey.

583 Geepers  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:38:23am

laZardo (#526),

That's one thing that's puzzled me...if Red generally signifies leftism, how is it that the conservative party historically used the color?

The "red state" "blue state" is a product of television networks. They used to show the majority party as red states (or blue, I can't remember) and it would change election to election depending on who was in power, which people found confusing. So at some point they stopped switching them and kept whatever it happened to be from the last election.

584 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:38:28am

re: #578 goddessoftheclassroom

Anyone who looks to someone else to bring him or her success and happiness is going to be disappointed.

goddess! :-)

Not to mention the fact that he's a POLITICIAN.

585 tappin52  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:38:32am

re: #578 goddessoftheclassroom

Anyone who looks to someone else to bring him or her success and happiness is going to be disappointed.

That is so true. We all get to define success and happiness for ourselves. Hence, the empty vessel, to be filled with each individual definition.

586 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:39:06am

I've been watching a series on WWI. The First World War based on the book by Hew Strachan, produced by Jonathan Lewis. About 10 hours on 4 discs.

It's very depressing, but also very illuminating. And the episode entitled Revolution 1917 on disc three is RIVETING.

The Russian Revolution, of course, but also the Irish Rebellion (aided by the Germans), the Arab Revolt (aided by the British), and mass munities in the French and Italian armies.

And the Socialists were behind pretty much all of it.

587 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:40:20am

re: #580 galloping granny

HOW? Caffeine is an incredibly addictive drug. I get a huge migraine if I don't have at least one cup.

/makes Yom Kippur an extra special treat every year.

588 scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:40:52am

re: #546 laZardo

Yeah, but it also had kids running over people as a hobby with no legal reprecussions, and people so deluded that they thought that the people on TV were their literal family. Everyone was seemingly illiterate, and apparently few people actually worked.

There would have to have been some kind of outside society that provided, engineered and manufactured all of this tech. Apparently for no real benefit though, as those who made use of it offered nothing to society in return.

The social engineering projects in BNW actually had purpose, and the stratified class system had a purpose. Guy Montag in Farenheit was an insider to society and didn't seem to be subjected to any kind of 'brainwashing', and obviously it didn't work on Beatty either, and it was enough of a problem to warrant a highly active unit of 'firemen' that had to constantly burn books. In BNW, you see a lot of the story through the eyes of John the Savage, and how Marx and Lenina react to him that shows how much of a sham the whole 'enlightened' culture is. The narrative is just a lot more complex.

Farenheit takes a similar view to BNW, in that man will oppress himself for the sake of comfort, but doesn't explain how this arrangement would be beneficial to anyone on top, or who is even on top. There are no 'Alphas', or Big Brother, and the fact that the society in the story is engaged in a nuclear war without its citizens knowledge is doubly inexplicable. 1984 had the war with Oceania, but Big Brother was directing society towards some kind of war effort. The people in Farenheit didn't seem to do anything but consume. The whole culture exists to push the story forward and take some cheap shot critiques rather than be a cohesive indictment of what the future could be.

A lot of it just wasn't well thought out, and a lot was deliberately left out in my opinion. As far as the tech goes, Farenheit was written a couple of decades after BNW. Huxley pegs the drug culture though, and the use of education, and the ultimate effect of Class Struggle Theory in creating a caste system rather than abolishing social classes, and even had the audacity to name the fictional architect of this social system Marx to boot. Bradburry was a good writer, but I don't think he was even attempting to make the kind of social commentary that Huxley was.

589 tappin52  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:41:01am

re: #579 laZardo

My grandson would love it. Pokemon, Bakugon, Yu-Gi-Oh, all of it. When he comes over today I will show him.

590 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:41:03am

Geepers! :-)

591 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:41:42am

re: #559 Aussie Stinger

.

We may have lost the big election in America folks.

But tonight, Conservatives can say that we've at least picked up a couple of consolation prizes:

- New Zealand
[Link: www.nzherald.co.nz...]
(running on a platform of, would you believe, "change")

... plus ...

- Canada
[Link: www.cbc.ca...]

Big Brother USA goes Left, while Canada goes Right.

Big Brother Australia goes Left, while New Zealand goes Right.

It's a topsy turvy world.

Hi there! I'm in Sydney - where are you? Good to see fellow Aussies around here :-)

And I've been reading up on NZ voting - their system is very complicated and I thought our proportional system of counting votes was hard to understand!

They also don't have compulsory voting

Still it was a comprehensive victory for the Nats, congrats to the NZ voters who showed more sense than ours did last November

And

G'day from Down Under to {everyone}

592 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:42:53am

re: #578 goddessoftheclassroom

Anyone who looks to someone else to bring him or her success and happiness is going to be disappointed.

Absolutely. It is not going to be his fault. It's going to be ours, for opposing his agenda at every turn. And even if we don't oppose his agenda, but let him do whatever he wants, and he fails even MORE spectacularly (we'd actually be making him look good by keeping him from doing what he wants), it STILL won't be his fault. You cannot expect reason from these folks. It's foreign to them.

593 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:42:56am

aussie! :-)
and
Aussie! :-)

/thanks for making it easy on this coffee challenged WalMart greeter... ;-)

594 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:43:16am

re: #586 nonic

I've been watching a series on WWI. The First World War based on the book by Hew Strachan, produced by Jonathan Lewis. About 10 hours on 4 discs.

It's very depressing, but also very illuminating. And the episode entitled Revolution 1917 on disc three is RIVETING.

The Russian Revolution, of course, but also the Irish Rebellion (aided by the Germans), the Arab Revolt (aided by the British), and mass munities in the French and Italian armies.

And the Socialists were behind pretty much all of it.

Got the name of that so my Amazon finger can order it up? I just finished a book I got for the kiddo about WWI called The Yanks Are Coming (Marrin). Intended for the middle & high school crowd but a couple hundred pages and the single best, most interesting and accurate without being a scholarly tome thing I've read on WWI. Just finished ordering the two he wrote about Hitler and Stalin.

595 christheprofessor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:44:01am

Good morning (or whatever time of day or night it is wherever a particular lizard lives), all...

596 Geepers  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:44:34am

Morning littleoldfruitcup.

;-)

You should consider getting a pet tiger. They don't eat vegetables and would definitely keep the deer away.

597 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:45:14am

"The First World War" at amazon
[Link: www.amazon.com...]

And General Petain of the Vichy Government fame (or infamy) was at Verdun and later had to put down the French mutiny and reorganize the army. For me, anyway, knowing that put a different light on his history.

598 christheprofessor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:46:00am

I just bought (well, a couple of weeks ago) the Ken Burns series The War (with companion CD and book) from Costco for $110. Haven't seen it yet but am looking forward to it.

I also got from my father the announcements of Germany and Japan surrendering that were put on the bulleting board of his ship during WW2. I'm going to have them framed for him.

599 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:46:25am

Equilibrium is another Dystopian movie along the lines of BNW and Farenheit. Its a society where in feelings are banned as being the cause of evil so everyone gets a daily dose of a drugs which renders them unemotional robots. The sense offense laws are enforced by a group of clerics(gamatron) until eventually one of the clerics loses his "faith". Great movie plus has fairly nice special effects and such. BTW this is Rustler rancher is sleeping im sure.

600 christheprofessor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:46:47am

Doh! bulleting = bulletin

601 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:47:35am

Bulleting sounds better coming from a warship tho : P

602 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:47:39am

re: #586 nonic

I've been watching a series on WWI. The First World War based on the book by Hew Strachan, produced by Jonathan Lewis. About 10 hours on 4 discs.

It's very depressing, but also very illuminating. And the episode entitled Revolution 1917 on disc three is RIVETING.

The Russian Revolution, of course, but also the Irish Rebellion (aided by the Germans), the Arab Revolt (aided by the British), and mass munities in the French and Italian armies.

And the Socialists were behind pretty much all of it.

Hello nonic, and thanks for this - I'll look for this series here as I would also very interested in watching it

603 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:47:58am

re: #587 littleoldlady

HOW? Caffeine is an incredibly addictive drug. I get a huge migraine if I don't have at least one cup.

/makes Yom Kippur an extra special treat every year.

I don't know little. No clue. I just realized one morning that I hadn't had coffee in a long time. Went in to make a pot since it had come to mind and it had been so long the grounds had molded. Yuk!

604 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:48:52am

re: #599 Rancher

Good morning, cheeky one.

605 tappin52  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:49:52am

I have no avatar because I am a computer dope. Are there instructions somewhere that I can read?

606 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:50:41am

#558 littleoldlady

"I planted everything in pots on the deck this year and didn't get very much of anything."

We had 3 tubs on the deck, and I could have sent you and everybody else here basil. We had PLENTY of cherry tomatoes and enough green beans.

Were your tubs big enough? Not those pretty little pots at the garden center? We bought plastic garbage cans at Walmart ($8 ea) and cut the top rim off just below the handles. They looked good enough and worked great.

607 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:52:13am

re: #593 littleoldlady

aussie! :-)
and
Aussie! :-)

/thanks for making it easy on this coffee challenged WalMart greeter... ;-)

LOL! Hello {littleoldlady} There seem to be a few Aussies around these days!

608 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:52:54am

Should have kept the handles make dragging the tubs easier

609 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:53:36am

re: #588 scion9

The thing about Fahrenheit is that they generally do not care who exactly is on "top," perhaps reflecting the increasingly superficial yet cynical nature of young voters who came of age since the book was written. If/when, say, this liberal administration fails in the way the previous conservative one did, then they could become double-jaded and then create an bigger, more apathetic "gap" in their middle age that could spread to the bottom.

The 'outside society' that would manufacture the technology would probably either receive their payment through the materialism shown by the characters (Montag's wife does mention sending in box tops for interactive TV) or from the government but that might be unknown. Children running over people with no consequence might be reminiscent of the current 'violent video game era' though probably because their parents are too 'consumed' to care.

It is perhaps trying to say that "if you cater to everyone all the time...you'll end up catering to nobody, none of the time."

/or maybe, admittedly, because a lot of words in BNW were too advanced for even my own command of the language. D:

610 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:53:55am

#574 granny

LOL! I'm gonna drive my kids crazy with that today. Ha!

611 Geepers  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:54:23am
612 tappin52  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:54:40am

My garden was terrible this year, too. About the only success I had was with sweet corn and basil. Something got to my parsley. I went out to harvest some and it looked like someone took a weed whacker to it. It was in a fenced garden with the basil, which was untouched.

613 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:55:15am

re: #595 christheprofessor

Good morning (or whatever time of day or night it is wherever a particular lizard lives), all...

Hi CTP, and it's just before midnight on Saturday night here :-)

And I'm watching our V8 Supercars race around in Bahrein - they race there once a year for oodles of money

614 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:55:32am

re: #596 Geepers

Sure. My luck.

615 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:55:34am

re: #589 tappin52

Just tell him to tread carefully...I do 'mature tag' some of my pieces so they won't be available unless he registers on the site as legal age, but some of them are fairly...unusual.

616 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:55:49am

re: #597 nonic

"The First World War" at amazon
[Link: www.amazon.com...]

And General Petain of the Vichy Government fame (or infamy) was at Verdun and later had to put down the French mutiny and reorganize the army. For me, anyway, knowing that put a different light on his history.

It'll be here Monday. The Yanks Are Coming shed a whole new light on more than a few things of a similar nature for me.

617 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:56:01am

It's interesting ... the only reason New Zealand and Canada have had the opportunity to "try socialism" and (dimly) see the light is because America has kept the light burning. Now, I guess, they have to keep the light burning for us. The problem is, their lights are tiny flickering candles compared to the warm fiery sun that was America.

618 tappin52  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:56:26am

re: #611 Geepers

Thanks.

619 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:57:13am

#608 Rancher

"Should have kept the handles make dragging the tubs easier"

But then they'd have looked like garbage cans, and my kids objected. Also we bought the dirt in bags so it would have cost a fortune to get the surface close to the top if we left them whole. They dragged easy enough as it was. We used the sharp end of a claw hammer to make drain holes in the bottoms.

620 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:57:18am

Killian Bundy said yesterday that Henry Rivera likely would be the head of the FCC. This is not good news for the First Amendment.

[Link: www.wileyrein.com...]

[Link: vwt.d2g.com:8081...]

621 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:57:38am

re: #617 Tigger2005

Don't forget London (Labour won in Parliament again though.) And Rudd's internet law isn't going down so well...at least not with the Anonymous* crowd.

/*most, I could guess, are probably computer nerds and "camwhores" looking for cheap internet-humor laughs and a place to vent.

622 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:57:39am

re: #598 christheprofessor

I just bought (well, a couple of weeks ago) the Ken Burns series The War (with companion CD and book) from Costco for $110. Haven't seen it yet but am looking forward to it.

I also got from my father the announcements of Germany and Japan surrendering that were put on the bulleting board of his ship during WW2. I'm going to have them framed for him.

And might I beg photocopies? Luckily I have the announcement of my father's death from his local paper and all his photos - had he had it with his things it would have been lost when the house burned a couple of months back.

623 christheprofessor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 4:58:39am

This is the announcement of Germany surrendering (note the unabashed mentioning of churches and thanksgiving):

LST 770
LATEST FLASHES 8 MAY 1945

GERMANY SURRENDERS TO THE ALLIES -(OFFICIAL NEWS FROM LONDON)

PRIME MINISTER WINSTON CHURCHILL WILL BROADCAST TODAY ON THE UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER OF THE GERMAN FORCES IN EUROPE. THE BROADCAST WILL BE 1000/I.

THE NEWS OF THE SURRENDER OF THE GERMAN FORCES CAME TO THE UNITED STATES AT ALITTLE (sic) LATER THAN 8:41 E.W.T. WHEN THE INCIDENT OCCURRED.

PRESIDENT TRUMAN SAID TO THE PRESS THAT HE WOULD MAKE NO ANNOUNCEMENT UNTIL THE THREE GREAT ALLIED LEADERS WERE OFFICIALLY READY TO DO SO.

AFTER FIVE YEARS EIGHT MONTHS AND SIX DAYS OF GREAT STRUGGLE IN EUROPE THE WAR FINALLY COMES TO AN END. CHURCH BELLS THROUGH THE CAPITOLS OF DIFFERENT COUNTRIES TOLLED AND PEOPLE REJOICED.

AT THE GREAT NEWS TIMES SQUARE BECME CROWEDED WITH REJOICING PEOPLE. WALL STREET WAS A PLACE WHERE CONFETTI WAS FLYING ALL OVER. ST. PATRICK (sic) CATHEDRAL WAS JAMMED WITH PEOPLE IN PRAYER OF THANKSGIVING. THESE WILL BE HELD ALL OVER THE NATION THE 8TH AND THE 9TH OF MAY. THESE DAYS WILL BE MADE LEGAL HOLIDAYS IN THE UNITED STATES, GREAT BRITAIN AND CANADA. THE 8TH WILL BE CELEBRATED AS V-E DAY IN THESE COUNTRIES AND RUSSIA.

IT IS REPORTED THAT GOBBELS (sic) AND HIS FAMILY WERE FOUND DEAD IN BERLIN. THEY HAD TAKEN POISON.

(MORE NEWS OF THE GREAT VICTORY WILL BE IN TO-NIGHT'S PAPER)

"RAD-SHACK"

624 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:00:13am

#576 littleoldlady

"What happens when he disappoints them?"

Oh, yeah, I know. I've thought of that, too. And if you watch the video of the Kenyans, it's heartbreaking to think of them disappointed.

But he's gonna HAVE TO disappoint nearly everyone. He CAN'T be what he was advertised as.

What WILL happen? I don't know. Things may not go well.

625 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:00:17am

Maybe the prof can send scanned copies to charles for posting on the site so other lizards might obtain copies of the surrender notices without him needing to add 500 plus to the send list.

626 nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:00:19am

re: #620 MandyManners

Killian Bundy said yesterday that Henry Rivera likely would be the head of the FCC. This is not good news for the First Amendment.

[Link: www.wileyrein.com...]

[Link: vwt.d2g.com:8081...]

And the hits just keep on coming.

627 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:00:31am

Caribbean Lamb Curry (serves 4-6)

2 pounds boned leg of lamb
4 tablespoons of curry powder
3 garlic cloves, crushed
1 large onion, chopped
4 thyme springs or 3 teaspoon dried thyme
3 bay leaves
1 teaspoon ground allspice
2 tablespoons vegetable oil
4 tablespoons butter or margarine
3.5 cups of stock or water
1 fresh hot chili pepper, chopped
cooked rice, to serve
cilantro springs, to garnish

Step 1: cut the meat into 2-inch cubes, discarding excess fat and gristle

Step 2: place the lamb, curry powder, garlic, onion, thyme, bay leaves, allspice, and oil into a large bowl and mix. Marinate in the fridge for 3 hours or overnight.

Step 3: melt the butter or margarine in a large heavy saucepan, add the seasoned lamb and fry over a moderate heat for about 10 minutes, turning meat frequently.

Step 4: stir in the stock and chili pepper and bring to a boil. Reduce the heat, cover the pan, and simmer for 1.5 hours, or until meat is tender. Serve with rice, garnish with Cilantro.

628 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:00:40am

re: #623 christheprofessor

This is the announcement of Germany surrendering (note the unabashed mentioning of churches and thanksgiving):

Thanks!

629 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:01:24am

Balti Potatoes:

Serves 4

3 table spoons corn oil
½ teaspoon white cumin seeds
3 curry leaves
1 teaspoon dried crushed read chilies
½ teaspoon mixed onion, mustard and fenugreek seeds
½ teaspoon fennel seeds
3 garlic cloves
½ teaspoon shredded ginger
2 onions, sliced
6 new potatoes, sliced thinly
1 tablespoon chopped fresh cilantro
1 fresh red chili, seeded and sliced
1 fresh green chili, seeded and sliced

Step 1: heat the oil in a deep round-bottomed frying pan or Karaki. Low the heat slightly and add the cumin seeds, curry leaves, dried red chilies, mixed onion, mustard & fenugreek seeds, fennel seeds, garlic cloves and ginger. Fry for 1 minute, then add the onions, and fry for 5 more minutes, or until onions are a golden brown

Step 2: Add the potatoes, cilantro, and fresh red and green chilies and mix well. Cover the pan tightly with a lid or foil, making sure that foil does not touch the food. Cook over low heat for 7 minutes, or until the potatoes are tender.

Step 3: remove the pan from the heat, take off the foil and serve hot.

630 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:01:51am

re: #627 Jewels (AKA Julian)

You're BACK! I've missed your recipes!

631 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:02:07am

But the excess fat and gristle is all the flavor no discarding it.

632 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:02:18am

re: #606 nonic

I think my major problem is not enough sun - anywhere - except for smack in the middle of the back yard. :-/

633 christheprofessor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:02:19am

#613 aussie

Howdy. I guess racing is a dirty job, but somebody's got to do it! (I never understood the fascination with watching cars go around a loop -- of course, not all races are on a track -- others would be more interesting, I suppose).

634 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:02:33am

re: #617 Tigger2005

It's interesting ... the only reason New Zealand and Canada have had the opportunity to "try socialism" and (dimly) see the light is because America has kept the light burning. Now, I guess, they have to keep the light burning for us. The problem is, their lights are tiny flickering candles compared to the warm fiery sun that was America.

Hi, there are more people living in Sydney than there are in all of NZ!

Great place to visit and only 3 hours flight across the ditch, as we call the Tasman Sea

635 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:03:25am

Manhattan Red Chowder

Serves 6-8

8 lbs small quahogs or large cherry clams
4 oz slab (unsliced) bacon, rind removed and cut into .5in dice
2 tablespoons olive oil
3 cloves garlic, chopped
2 stalks Celery, dice into .5in cubes
1 large onion (10 oz), cut into .5in dice
1 medium green bell pepper (6 oz), cut into .5in dice
2 medium carrots (4 oz), cut into .5in dice
2 dried bay leaves
.25 cup fresh Italian parsley
2 teaspoons dried oregano
.5 teaspoon crushed red pepper flakes
1.5 potatoes, peeled and cut into half inch dice. Yukon Gold, PEI, or Maine Potatoes for those in the states.
1 cup clam broth, or bottle clam juice, or fish stock, or chicken stock
1 can (28 oz) whole peeled tomatoes in juice, cut into half inch dice
freshly ground black pepper.
Kosher or Sea Salt.

Step 1: scrub the clams and rinse clean. Steam them open. Strain the broth (should be about 4 cups or thereabouts) and have left about 1 lb of clams. Cover the clams with plastic wrap and keep refrigerated. After they have cooled somewhat, dice into .5 inch cubes. Cover again and keep refrigerated until needed.

Step 2: heat a 4-6 quart heavy pot over low heat (I use cast iron) and add the bacon. Once it has rendered a few tablespoons of fat, increase the heat to medium and cook the bacon until crispy golden brown. Drain off all but one table spoon of fat, leaving the bacon in the pot.

Step 3: add the olive oil and the garlic and cook for 30 seconds,, then add the onion, celery, bell pepper, carrots, bay leaves, oregano, and crashed red pepper. Saute, stirring occasionally with a wooden spoon, for 10-12 minutes, until the vegetables are softened but not browned.

Step 4: place the potatoes, the reserved clam broth, and the additional 1 cup of broth. The broth should barely cover the potatoes. If it doesn’t, add water to barely cover turn up the heat, bring to a boil, cover and cook the potatoes for about 10 minutes until soft on the outside, but still firm in the center. If the broth isn’t thickened, smash a few potatoes against the side of the pot to release their starch.

Step 5: add the tomatoes and simmer for 5 minutes. Remove the pot from the heat, stir in the diced clams and parsley , and season to taste with the pepper.

Step 6: When serving the chowder, reheat over a low heat, do not boil.

636 tappin52  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:03:27am

re: #629 Jewels (AKA Julian)

What are curry leaves? I've always thought that curry was a mixture of spices.

637 christheprofessor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:03:43am

#622 galloping granny

But of course. He used to have the annoucement of the A-bomb being dropped as well, but it's not there and we have no idea what happened to it.

He's also got the notice about the very last mission of the war (a B-29 raid).

638 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:04:02am

All of a sudden...I'm starving!

Jewels! ;-)

639 reine.de.tout  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:04:18am

re: #630 galloping granny

You're BACK! I've missed your recipes!

Somebody found some in the archives and sent them to me for the LGF cookbook, which I hope will be ready soon!

So you will have some to keep . . .

640 christheprofessor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:04:38am

#625 rancher

That's a great idea! I'll see what I can do...

641 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:04:50am

#578 goddess

"Anyone who looks to someone else to bring him or her success and happiness is going to be disappointed."

I was thinking of that this morning. Obama is like the latest man a lonely woman hopes will "change" everything.

Hmm. Anybody remember Looking for Mr. Goodbar? [Link: www.imdb.com...]

Well, maybe it won't be THAT bad.

642 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:05:03am

re: #620 MandyManners

Killian Bundy said yesterday that Henry Rivera likely would be the head of the FCC. This is not good news for the First Amendment.

[Link: www.wileyrein.com...]

[Link: vwt.d2g.com:8081...]

Rivera's firm on Countrywide and Dodd.

Wiley Rein’s Election Law & Government Ethics chair Jan Witold Baran was quoted in the Roll Call regarding the application of the Senate gift rules to allegedly preferential mortgages issued by Countrywide mortgage company by Senators Kent Conrad (D-ND) and Chris Dodd (D-CT). According to the article, Countrywide officials made available special mortgages for a select group including both Senators. Both Conrad and Dodd said they were unaware of the discount until the news reports became public.

Since [Dodd] had no knowledge of any potential gift, even if it were a gift, there would not have been a knowing acceptance of such a gift. There’s a good argument to be made he would not have violated the rules of the Senate,” said Mr. Baran. He added: “Having this information now does place a burden on the Senator to verify whether it is a gift under the Senate rules. If it is, he certainly will have to renegotiate this mortgage.”

A weasel's weasel.

643 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:05:18am

re: #632 littleoldlady

I think my major problem is not enough sun - anywhere - except for smack in the middle of the back yard. :-/

So plow it up! They are predicting that food prices are going up 7% or more this year - and that is not taking the price of gas into account.

644 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:05:35am

Lamb Vindaloo

Yield: 4-6 Servings
Ingredients:
Paste
½ ounce garlic
1 ounce ginger
8 red chiles
10 (1-inch) cinnamon sticks
½ ounce cumin
½ ounce coriander seeds
½ ounce turmeric powder
3 ½ ounces malt vinegar

Marinade
½ ounce black peppercorns
3 green chiles
4 ounces malt vinegar
½ ounce sugar
8 green cardamom pods
8 whole cloves
Salt, to taste

Vindaloo
1 ½ pounds leg of lamb
2 ounces onions
7 ounces potatoes
3 ½ ounces groundnut oil
Oil, for frying
Salt, to taste
½ ounce coriander
Method:
For Paste:
Peel and roughly chop garlic. Peel and roughly chop ginger. Combine garlic and ginger with rest of ingredients in blender or food processor. Add 2 ounces water to make a fine paste.
For Marinade:
Crush peppercorns with mortar & pestle. Wash, stem & deseed chiles. Combine crushed peppercorns and chiles with rest of ingredients.

For Vindaloo:

Trim leg of lamb, removing excess fat. Debone and cut into 1-inch cubes. Combine lamb cubes with marinade and let sit 1 hour.
Peel and finely chop onions. Set aside. Wash, peel and cut potatoes into cubes. Deep fry potatoes in oil over medium heat until golden brown. Clean, wash and chop coriander.

Heat oil in large sauté pan over medium heat. Add onions and cook until golden brown. Add paste and cook until fat is melted. At this time, add marinated lamb, along with marinade, stirring 2 minutes. Add approximately 1 quart water, bring to boil, then cover and simmer until lamb is tender. Now add the potatoes and cook until potatoes are soft.

645 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:05:46am

Thanks Prof hopefully charles will be able to post it on the site would be interesting to have a copy hanging on the wall near my desk.

646 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:05:49am

re: #627 Jewels (AKA Julian)

Jewels! Hello, and posting one of my favourite recipes again too!

Good to see you :-)

647 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:06:32am

re: #639 reine.de.tout

Somebody found some in the archives and sent them to me for the LGF cookbook, which I hope will be ready soon!

So you will have some to keep . . .

That was me :) Can't wait to see the cookbook.

648 christheprofessor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:06:54am

#628 galloping granny

Quite welcome. I'll transcribe the other as well, but it will take more time, as it is quite a bit longer...

649 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:06:56am

these are some of the more complex recipies I've come up with. I've been working on easy ones...currently hammering those into the recipie book

650 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:07:13am

re: #626 nevergiveup

And the hits just keep on coming.

Wiley Rein is an insider firm. Rivera quit the FCC during Reagan's term. Reagan lifted the Fairness Doctrine.

651 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:07:42am

What is this? The "perfect storm" of old-time LGF-ers?

(Nobody let you-know-who back in, did they?)

652 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:08:09am

re: #636 tappin52

What are curry leaves? I've always thought that curry was a mixture of spices.

Curry leaves are literally leaves from a tree. You should be able to find them at any Thai grocery and many other Asian groceries. We have a produce store that carries lots of Asian ingredients and they have them. They look expensive but weight nothing, so buy a big handful and dry them.

653 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:08:21am

morning all

654 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:08:30am

re: #641 nonic

Well, maybe it won't be THAT bad.

GAH!

655 christheprofessor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:08:45am

#629 reine

Please pop me an e-mail and I'll send you some recipes... My nic is blued

656 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:08:53am

Fairness doctrine= spreading the wealth of listeners to those who dont have the facts or wherewithal to get there own.

657 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:09:24am

re: #633 christheprofessor

#613 aussie

Howdy. I guess racing is a dirty job, but somebody's got to do it! (I never understood the fascination with watching cars go around a loop -- of course, not all races are on a track -- others would be more interesting, I suppose).

I've been to one qualifying event and one race (NASCAR) at Kansas Speedway. I'm a Jeff Gordon & Jimmie Johnson fan, but I haven't watched any races or followed them at all this year. I think a lot of people like the atmosphere of the race even more than the race itself. I actually liked the qualifying more. You can almost predict who had the better runs without watching the clock, just following the car around the track. The tighter the turns and the more smoothly they come out of them, the better the time. Taking a turn too wide or wobbling when coming out of it adds fractions of a second to the total time.

658 The Hoopster  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:09:38am

good morning lizards!
How is everyone today?

659 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:09:39am

Yakitori Chicken
6 tsp shoyu (Japanese soy sauce)
6 tsp mirin
4 tbsp sake
2 tbsp ultrafine sugar
4 skinless boneless chicken thighs or 2 chicken breasts (14 oz/400g or thereabouts, cut into 24 chunks)
4 scallions, cut into 18 short lengths

Step 1. Soak 6 wooden skewers in water for at least 20 minutes to prevent burning.

Step 2. put the Shoyu, mirin, sake, and sugar in a small pan and bring to a boil. Reduce the heat and let simmer for 1 minute, then remove from the heat and let cool. Separate out a little of the mixture to dribble over the skewers

Step: Bring the broiler to high. Thread 4 pieces of chicken and 4 pieces of scallions on each skewer, then brush the skewers with the Sauce mix. Cook under the broiler for 4 minutes, then turn over and brush with more mix. Cook additional 4 minutes, or until chicken is tend and cooked through. Serve the skewers after drizzling the remains of the reserved sauce

660 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:09:51am
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.

Now that's some profound sh*t.

661 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:10:10am

"It's not dead yet" Hot Salsa
Serving Size : 1 Preparation Time :0:00
5 whole Habaneros -- seeded
10 whole tomatillos -- husked and rinsed
2 whole Vidalia onions -- skinned
6 whole sweet red peppers -- seeded
2 whole smoked Habaneros
3 whole chipolte peppers
1 Tablespoon cumin
2 ounces balsamic vinegar

Process ingredients in a blender individually in order listed until you reach the dried peppers and place in a non-reactive container. Place smoked habs and chipotles in blender and drain juice from mixture in bowl into the blender and process. Add to the mixture in the bowl. Add cumin and stir well.
Drizzle Balsamic vinegar over the top. Let marinate overnight. Best served warm

662 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:10:16am

re: #643 galloping granny

So plow it up! They are predicting that food prices are going up 7% or more this year - and that is not taking the price of gas into account.

I was actually thinking of starting a hosta farm. The deer ate ALL OF THEM this year, but if I can keep them out of the garden I might be able to make a few bucks.

/deer...bucks...MORE COFFEE!

663 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:10:56am

re: #658 HoosierHoops

good morning lizards!
How is everyone today?

Is that a trick question?

664 scion9  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:11:08am

The local morning show I sometimes listen to was talking about Rivera on friday. They say he is a freak. He apparently doesn't actually watch TV, or listen to the radio at all and never has, yet will be responsible for deciding what is and is not appropriate. That all he sees and hears is what people are complaining about to him, and that is the extent of his knowledge of popular entertainment.

665 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:11:09am

Interesting. I was tardy, but the fruitcup was still there. Thanks, lol.

666 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:11:24am

Good morning, Lizards

667 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:11:30am

Salsa Borracha
Makes about 3 cups

3 oz dried pasilla chilies, seeded and stemmed
4 Tablespoons diced White Onion
1.5 teaspoons extra virgin olive oil
1.25 cups (1 bottle) dark beer, such as Boc
2 cloves of roasted Garlic
3 Roma Tomatoes, blackened
.5 teaspoon toasted ground cumin
.5 teaspoon toasted ground oregano
.75 teaspoon salt
4 oz feta or dry-aged goat cheese

Toast the chilies and rehydrate them in 2 cups warm water. Drain the chilies, reserving .5 cup of the water. Devin the chilies and transfer to a blender. If it is not bitter, add the reserved chili water ; otherwise, ad .5 cup water. Sauté the onions in the oil for about 5 min over a medium heat, then add to the chilies. Add the garlic, tomatoes, cumin, oregano, salt, and beer. Blend until pureed , transfer to serving bowl and sprinkle the cheese over the top

668 lifeofthemind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:11:50am

Just looking in this morning. Saw the last thread was on National Service. My take, the last year of HS is a waste so instead take everyone after their 17th birthday and send them for 6 months of basic training. Longer than that would be another wasteful tax but 6 months would be sufficient to give every person who will be qualified to vote and sit on a jury basic skills and information. The curricullum should include:
Fitness
Discipline
Basic Civics
Teamwork
Basic Combat skills
Information about opportunities in the Active, Guard or Reserve forces.

No one should be eligible for any government scholarship or benefit who has not completed this program. The strongest opposition to this idea will come from Regular Officers who despise amateurs and hate the idea of every year having to teach two million children how to wake up on time.

669 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:11:51am

re: #651 nonic

What is this? The "perfect storm" of old-time LGF-ers?

(Nobody let you-know-who back in, did they?)

Which you-know-who? :-p

Sharmuta! :-)

Hoosier! :-)

670 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:12:32am

re: #662 littleoldlady

LOL- you changed your avatar back to fruitcup, but you need to change your profile too. I changed mine yesterday.

671 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:12:57am

re: #650 MandyManners

Wiley Rein is an insider firm. Rivera quit the FCC during Reagan's term. Reagan lifted the Fairness Doctrine.

Talk about twists.

The 2008 edition of Chambers USA: America’s Leading Lawyers for Business recognizes Wiley Rein’s Election Law & Government Ethics Practice and its chair, Jan Witold Baran as being among the country’s best, placing both in their top tier rankings—recognition they have received each year since the directory’s inception.

As Chambers reports, “In addition to its enviable GOP ties, this widely admired eight-partner team advises corporations seeking to participate politically without falling foul of the increasingly strict regulatory environment.

672 Aussie Stinger  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:13:06am

re: #591 aussiemagpie

Hi there! I'm in Sydney - where are you? Good to see fellow Aussies around here :-)

And I've been reading up on NZ voting - their system is very complicated and I thought our proportional system of counting votes was hard to understand!

They also don't have compulsory voting

Still it was a comprehensive victory for the Nats, congrats to the NZ voters who showed more sense than ours did last November

And

G'day from Down Under to {everyone}

___

G'Day!

How's Sydney? I'm in Melbourne!

Wow, after this week's disappointment in America, it's truly great to watch the New Zealand election and hear a Conservative leader giving an election night victory speech!

I forgot how good it sounds!

[Link: tvnz.co.nz...]

I love it when the crowd roars!

And did you hear Helen Clarke's concession speech. What a bad loser. She should have learned from John McCain how to be gracious in defeat.

Goodness, Helen Clarke is just the worst.

673 The Hoopster  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:13:27am

re: #663 Tigger2005

Is that a trick question?

LOL
Well there is no wrong answer.plus you get graded on a curve.

674 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:13:49am

re: #633 christheprofessor

#613 aussie

Howdy. I guess racing is a dirty job, but somebody's got to do it! (I never understood the fascination with watching cars go around a loop -- of course, not all races are on a track -- others would be more interesting, I suppose).

CTP, many years ago, my soon to be hubby introduced me to car racing, footy and cricket - I'd never watched any of these delights coming from a European family who had no interest in sport

So I became a dedicated car racing fan, avid cricket fanatic and obsessed footy follower !

675 The Hoopster  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:14:12am

re: #666 Sharmuta

Good morning, Lizards

Good Morning Sharm

676 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:14:35am

re: #658 HoosierHoops

Movin' on soon, feeling a bit anxious about that.

677 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:14:36am

re: #658 HoosierHoops

good morning lizards!
How is everyone today?

I'm up and down. I'm not sure my sanity can take the next four years ... I'm already on the ragged edge. The stiffness in my neck keeps coming back and my brain just doesn't know how to process what's going on because it's not good at understanding the actions of irrational people.

678 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:14:57am

re: #668 lifeofthemind

Just looking in this morning. Saw the last thread was on National Service. My take, the last year of HS is a waste so instead take everyone after their 17th birthday and send them for 6 months of basic training. Longer than that would be another wasteful tax but 6 months would be sufficient to give every person who will be qualified to vote and sit on a jury basic skills and information. The curricullum should include:
Fitness
Discipline
Basic Civics
Teamwork
Basic Combat skills
Information about opportunities in the Active, Guard or Reserve forces.

No one should be eligible for any government scholarship or benefit who has not completed this program. The strongest opposition to this idea will come from Regular Officers who despise amateurs and hate the idea of every year having to teach two million children how to wake up on time.

What about disabled folks? Should they be disqualified from voting and jury duty?

679 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:15:46am

Oh dear. I'm reading an article someone posted in the links - Calm, down. He's not president of the world! - and over in the margin is an ad that says "What's your biggest hope for Obama?" - to be answered in eight words or less. Bet they don't want to hear mine!

680 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:15:52am

re: #670 Sharmuta

LOL- you changed your avatar back to fruitcup, but you need to change your profile too. I changed mine yesterday.

Oy. I always mess up those little details. ;-)

Thanks.

681 yma o hyd  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:16:08am

Hi, Lizrad Nation!

Good thing I've had me lunch already - seeing all these recipes would've made me dash to the fridge, otherwise.

Just a quick drive-by, a most important rugby game is fast approaching - gotta take Miss Dog out before kick off ...

682 The Hoopster  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:16:36am

re: #669 littleoldlady

Which you-know-who? :-p

Sharmuta! :-)

Hoosier! :-)

Good morning little old lady..I hope today fnds you well..
/also you know who..

683 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:17:24am

#616 granny

I just ordered the Marrin book, too.

Boy, we're good for amazon's business, huh? :-)

684 yma o hyd  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:17:26am

re: #679 galloping granny

Oh dear. I'm reading an article someone posted in the links - Calm, down. He's not president of the world! - and over in the margin is an ad that says "What's your biggest hope for Obama?" - to be answered in eight words or less. Bet they don't want to hear mine!

Why not? Go on - tell them! That person who put this eight-word-challenge up was in the tank for Bo, as were most others here in the Brit msm.

685 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:17:59am

re: #680 littleoldlady

I'm not from the government, but I'm here to help.

I just changed the link in my nic too. Back to being just a girl. *sigh*

686 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:18:11am

re: #651 nonic

What is this? The "perfect storm" of old-time LGF-ers?

(Nobody let you-know-who back in, did they?)

LOL! Just like old times without *ahem* though

687 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:19:14am

Jewel's Lazy Turkey Curry (also works with chicken)
Makes 4 servings
¼ cup chopped onion
1 can cream of mushroom soup
¼ cup milk.
1 cup sour cream
½ teaspoon curry powder
1 tbspn butter
1 cup cubed turkey
Step 1: cook the onion in the butter.
Step 2: add the cream of mushroom soup and milk. Stir until smooth
Step 3: add the sour cream and curry powder.
Step 4: add turkey and heat. Serve over rice
note: keep stirring the mix as this can burn to the bottom of your pots rather easily

688 The Hoopster  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:19:46am

re: #686 aussiemagpie

LOL! Just like old times without *ahem* though

The poster formerly known as *ahem*
Hiya Aussie!

689 lifeofthemind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:20:30am

re: #678 MandyManners

What about disabled folks? Should they be disqualified from voting and jury duty?

Certainly not. I see no reason why anyone who meets the minimal standard of being qualified to vote, not being batshit crazy, could not participate in a program tailored to their needs. The idea would be to have a common program to the absolute maximum extent possible. But yes I would in conjunction with physicians, push them to exert themselves.

BTW, add Homeland Security training to the curriculum.

690 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:20:43am

re: #683 nonic

#616 granny

I just ordered the Marrin book, too.

Boy, we're good for amazon's business, huh? :-)

Yup. Hardly a day goes by the UPS guy doesn't stop at my door. They even made me an early reviewer. But then I live about 40 miles from even a modest book store that sells new books and there is only one video rental place in town. Not to mention things like Naughty Monkey shoes - 100 miles minimum for a pair of those. We bought a Prime membership and the entire family shares it. Much cheaper than gas to run all over.

691 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:20:44am

I-don't-know-who *ahem* is!

/waaa!

692 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:21:38am

re: #684 yma o hyd

Why not? Go on - tell them! That person who put this eight-word-challenge up was in the tank for Bo, as were most others here in the Brit msm.

I wouldn't want a visit from the Secret Service or to be thought a nutjob. This is one time I'll keep my eight allotted words to myself.

693 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:22:19am

re: #689 lifeofthemind

Certainly not. I see no reason why anyone who meets the minimal standard of being qualified to vote, not being batshit crazy, could not participate in a program tailored to their needs. The idea would be to have a common program to the absolute maximum extent possible. But yes I would in conjunction with physicians, push them to exert themselves.

BTW, add Homeland Security training to the curriculum.

BS. This is the United States of America, not the Gulag.

694 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:22:22am

re: #689 lifeofthemind

Certainly not. I see no reason why anyone who meets the minimal standard of being qualified to vote, not being batshit crazy, could not participate in a program tailored to their needs. The idea would be to have a common program to the absolute maximum extent possible. But yes I would in conjunction with physicians, push them to exert themselves.

BTW, add Homeland Security training to the curriculum.

How can someone in a wheelchair exert herself? What about quads?

It wouldn't pass Constitutional muster.

695 freetoken  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:22:34am

On IR satellite, Paloma is looking pretty darn impressive for a hurricane so late in the season. Forecast calls for a rapid weakening though...

696 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:22:53am

Ranbutan?

697 The Hoopster  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:23:20am

re: #677 Tigger2005

I'm up and down. I'm not sure my sanity can take the next four years ... I'm already on the ragged edge. The stiffness in my neck keeps coming back and my brain just doesn't know how to process what's going on because it's not good at understanding the actions of irrational people.

How about a big ole root beer float?
would that be something you would be interested in?
Look at all the free shit we're going to get for 4 years..

698 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:24:08am

There is a term called social engineering - basically, a social engineer uses specific skills to manipulate people - but not for their own benefit. You could argue that salesmen are social engineers - but sales are designed to be a win-win. Social engineering is designed to be a win-lose:

What you are seeing with Obama, is the social engineer at work.

Kevin Metnick a convicted hacker wrote a book, called the Art of Deception, which teaches how to get people to drop their defenses so they can be manipulated.

Obama believes himself to be a master social engineer - - figuring out ways to get us indebted to him so that we owe him.

There is very little difference between sexual predators and political predators.

699 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:24:10am

re: #677 Tigger2005

I'm up and down. I'm not sure my sanity can take the next four years ... I'm already on the ragged edge. The stiffness in my neck keeps coming back and my brain just doesn't know how to process what's going on because it's not good at understanding the actions of irrational people.

It's like, I'll think, "Hey, I'll write a letter to Obama explaining rationally why "share the wealth" is such a bad idea. I'll write a letter to Oprah explaining rationally why it makes no sense for her, a self-made black woman in this land of opportunity, to so blindly and religiously support a man who plays the race card and wants to punish success. I'll write a letter to Maya Angelou explaining rationally why she should be proud of this country that from its very beginning has given blood and treasure in the defense of liberty." But then I realize that even if they read these letters, to them it will be like reading something in a foreign language. They just don't understand the language of rationality, their brains don't register it, their thought processes, such as they are, don't support it. They are not rational people. They only appear to be rational in the way a stopped clock appears to be right twice a day.

700 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:24:15am

re: #679 galloping granny

"He Probably Will Continue Subsidizing Your Sorry Asses."

/props to Mandy for the original answer on the America In Six Words challenge way back when...

701 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:25:41am

re: #696 Jewels (AKA Julian)

Ranbutan?

Too far back for most folks.

/and not a Dead Threader...

702 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:26:09am

re: #668 lifeofthemind

Just looking in this morning. Saw the last thread was on National Service. My take, the last year of HS is a waste so instead take everyone after their 17th birthday and send them for 6 months of basic training. Longer than that would be another wasteful tax but 6 months would be sufficient to give every person who will be qualified to vote and sit on a jury basic skills and information. The curricullum should include:
Fitness
Discipline
Basic Civics
Teamwork
Basic Combat skills
Information about opportunities in the Active, Guard or Reserve forces.

No one should be eligible for any government scholarship or benefit who has not completed this program. The strongest opposition to this idea will come from Regular Officers who despise amateurs and hate the idea of every year having to teach two million children how to wake up on time.

But with obama in charge it will include liberal doses of socialist propaganda - it's how he will create a social monopoly.

703 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:26:17am

re: #699 Tigger2005

I would save the letter writing. What we need is for intelligent, pro-science, fiscal conservatives to get more involved in the party. You have already done a lot of work for the party in KC. Stay involved! Go to the monthly meetings and work to improve our base, because we're going to need it in two years and again in four. This will help you- trust me.

704 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:26:23am

re: #679 galloping granny

Oh dear. I'm reading an article someone posted in the links - Calm, down. He's not president of the world! - and over in the margin is an ad that says "What's your biggest hope for Obama?" - to be answered in eight words or less. Bet they don't want to hear mine!

I hope he doesn't destroy America.

705 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:28:17am

#669 littleoldlady

LOL! Actually, I don't remember his nic. Some son of a bitch with his own fervent following who was incredibly insulting to whoever didn't agree with him.

Isn't it nice how life improves when the real a$$ pains betake themselves somewhere else -- to "punish" YOU?!

Gee, that's the second time I've thought of my ex-husband this week.

706 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:28:43am

I think states should compete to be the "free-est state in the US."

707 rightwinger3  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:28:46am

The falcon cannot hear the Falconer?

708 Dar ul Harb  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:29:41am

re: #679 galloping granny

...over in the margin is an ad that says "What's your biggest hope for Obama?" - to be answered in eight words or less.

8 words? Hmm...

Hope you've got an exit strategy after Marxism.

Hope you'll do better than Jimmy Carter did.

Hope the tin-pot dictator act is inexperience.

Remember you only run one branch of government.

709 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:30:21am

re: #705 nonic

Gotcha. Took his crayons and his fervent following (nicely put! ;-) elsewhere...

710 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:30:47am

Aussie,

hope that little curry recipie tides you over. currently getting my others entered

711 nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:30:49am

re: #708 Dar ul Harb

8 words? Hmm...

Hope you've got an exit strategy after Marxism.

Hope you'll do better than Jimmy Carter did.

Hope the tin-pot dictator act is inexperience.

Remember you only run one branch of government.

Well actually the moonbats appear to be in charge of 2 out of 3 of the branches of the government? Just saying.

712 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:30:52am

re: #708 Dar ul Harb

Hope To Change Hope Into Change We Need.

/wordplay ftw.

713 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:30:59am

re: #708 Dar ul Harb

8 words? Hmm...

Hope you've got an exit strategy after Marxism.

Hope you'll do better than Jimmy Carter did.

Hope the tin-pot dictator act is inexperience.

Remember you only run one branch of government.

Ya'll are being much, much nicer than anything I've considered.

714 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:31:33am

re: #711 nevergiveup

Well actually the moonbats appear to be in charge of 2 out of 3 of the branches of the government? Just saying.

And have a fair foothold in the remaining.

715 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:31:34am

re: #672 Aussie Stinger

___ ___

G'Day!

How's Sydney? I'm in Melbourne!

Wow, after this week's disappointment in America, it's truly great to watch the New Zealand election and hear a Conservative leader giving an election night victory speech!

I forgot how good it sounds!

[Link: tvnz.co.nz...]

I love it when the crowd roars!

And did you hear Helen Clarke's concession speech. What a bad loser. She should have learned from John McCain how to be gracious in defeat.

Goodness, Helen Clarke is just the worst.

I missed the concession speech, but I read that she's keeping on with politics

The new PM John Key sounds pretty impressive doesn't he?

We were watching the cricket so missed watching any news

Love Melbourne! My ex FIL lives in Chelsea, so we visit at least once a year

716 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:31:38am

aussiemagpie

You still here? Tom's running this morning.

People, my son who ran the NYC marathon last weekend is running what he called a "dirt run." 10K (6 miles) through a military obstacle course, apparently actually AT a military installation. Mud, rope walls to climb, blah, blah.

I think no jumping through flaming hoops, though.

717 lifeofthemind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:31:50am

re: #693 galloping granny

re: #694 MandyManners

Do not presume to decide a priori that people can do nothing. Professionals can evaluate the abilities of people with conditions that preclude the regular program. That would be maybe 5% of the population would need some modification and only a tiny fraction would need significant adjustment. For most of them a planned activity program would have long term health benefits. The affiliation of people with Reserve/Guard units could cover basic health care needs. Real useful work appropriate to their abilities would be required to qualify for benefits. This would pass constitutional muster. We have seen the result of ignoring people and allowing citizenship to be treated like a prize on a TV show. If you want to fix what caused this disaster stop retreating into a shell and engage with next generation of voters. This is the best way to do it.

718 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:32:04am

Can't wait until door hits him on butt.

719 christheprofessor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:32:11am

Here's the annoucement of the Japanese surrender (note that the following is all on one 63-year old, yellowing sheet of paper):

TIME: 0830 THE FOURTH REPEATER.. 15 AUGUST 1045
... ... ... ... ... ...

PRESIDENT TRUMAN MADE THE OFFICIAL SURRENDER ANNOUNCEMENT THAT JAPAN HAS ACCEPTED TERMS FOR UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER. PRESIDENT TRUMAN MADE THE ANNOUNCMENT AT 0800 MANILA TIME AND 0700 TUESDAY AUGUST 14 IN WASHINGTON. THE EMPEROR OF JAPAN STATED HIS ACCEPTANCE OF UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER AND ORDERED ALL JAPANESE AREMED FORCES TO CEASE OPERATIONS. THE PRESIDENT HAS ALSO NAMED GENERAL OF THE ARMY DOUGLAS MAC ARTHUR (sic) AS ALLIED SUPREME COMMANDER OF JAPAN.

THE ANNOUNCEMENT OF THE JAPANESE ACCEPTANCE OF ALLIED UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER WAS ANNOUNCED SIMANTANEOUSLY (sic) IN WASHINGTON, LONDON, MOSKOW (sic) AND CHUNK KING. JAPANESE NOTE TO THE ALLIED POWERS STATED THE ACCEPTANCE OF BOTH THE POTSDAM DECLARATION AND THE ALLIED NOTE OF AUGUST 11TH WHICH DEFINED THE POWERS OF THE ALLIED SUPREME COMMANDER OVER THE EMPEROR. JAPANESE IMPERIAL HEADQUARTERS HAS BEEN ORDERED BY THE EMPEROR TO EFFECTUATE (how's that for a word - ctp) THE SURRENDER BY ALL JAPANESE ARMED FORCES. ALTHOUGH THE JAPANESE HAVE ACCEPTED AND BOTH SIDES HAVE ORDERED THE SESSIATION (sic) OF MILITARY OPERATIONS. IT WILL NOT BE V-J DAY OFFICIALLY UNTIL THE SURRENDER DOCUMENT IS OFFICIAL. EARLIER STATEMENTS BY PRESIDENTIAL SECRETARY ROSS XXX (this appears to be crossing out a type - ctp) STATED THAT THE JAPANESE FORMAL SIG NING (sic) OF THE SURRENDER MIGHT TAKE SEVERAL DAYS. THE JAPANESE SURRENDER OFFER WAS HANDED TO SECRETARY OF STATE BYRNES AT 0706 MANILA TIME. HE IMMEDIATELY BROUGHT IT OVER TO PRESIDENT TRUMAN WHO ACCEPTED IT AND MADE THE ANNOUNCEMENT 54 MINUTES LATER THAT THE WAR WAS OVER. HERE IS A WASHINGTON BULLETIN FROM THE UNITED PRESS. FOLLOWING IS THE TEXT OF THE JAPANESE REPLY TO THE ALLIED PROPOSAL "WITH REFERENCE TO THE ANNOUNCEMENT OF AUGUST 10TH REGARDING THE EXCEPTANCE (sic) OF THE PROVISION OF THE POTSDAM DECLARATION AND A REPLY OF THE GOVERNMENT OF THE UNITED STATES, GREAT BRITAIN, SOVIET UNION AND CHINA SET BY SECRETARY BYRNES ON AUGUST 11TH, THE JAPANESE GOVERNMENT HAD THE HONOR TO REPLY TO THE GOVERNMENT OF THE FOUR POWERS AS FOLLOWS:
1. HIS MAJESTY THE EMPOROR HAS ISSUED THE RESCRIPT REGARDING JAPANESE ACCEPTANCE OF THE PROVISION OF THE POTSDAM DECLARATION.
2. THE EMPOROR IS PREPARED TO AUTHORIZE AND INSURE (sic) BY AND TO HIS GOVERNMENT AND THE IMPERIAL HEADQUARTERS THE NECESSARY TERMS FOR CARRYING OUT THE PROVISIONS OF THE POTSDAM DECLARATION.
3. HIS MAJESTY IS ALSO PREPARED TO ISSUE THIS COMMUNIQUE TO ALL MILITARY NAVAL AND AIR FORCES TO ISSUE ALL FORCES UNDER THEIR CONTROL WHERE EVER LOCATED TO CEASE ACTIVE RESISTANCE AND SURRENDER THEIR ARMS.

LAST OPERATION (underlined)
ON THE LAST DAY OF MILITARY OPERATION AGAINST JAPAN MORE THAN 800 B-29S DISTRIBUTED 6,000 TONS OF FIRE AND DEMOLITION BOMBS ON THE JAPANESE HOME ISLAND. TARGETS WERE WAR INDUSTRIES AT IFUGOKI AND KUMAGUYA THE NIPPONESE OIL REFINERY AT AKITA IMPORTANT RAIL YARDS A MARIFU AND THE GIANT ARMY ARSENAL AT OSAKA. ALSO STRUCK BY SUPER FORTS WAS THE HUGE HUCARI NAVAL ARSENAL. 180 FIGHTERS FROM IWO ESCORTED THE BOMBERS. XXX (this also seems to be covering a typo -- ctp).

THE FIFTH AND SEVENTH AIR FORCES ALSO CONTRIBUTED TO THE ONSLAUGHT.

720 The Hoopster  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:32:26am

re: #712 laZardo

Hope To Change Hope Into Change We Need.

/wordplay ftw.

Where is my free gas and mortgage payment?

721 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:32:38am

re: #706 DistantThunder

I think states should compete to be the "free-est state in the US."

While the rest of the country was swinging wildly left, Tennessee, for the first time since Reconstruction, has a Republican majority in the state house.
We are hoping to weather Obama.

722 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:33:21am

re: #717 lifeofthemind

re: #694 MandyManners

Do not presume to decide a priori that people can do nothing. Professionals can evaluate the abilities of people with conditions that preclude the regular program. That would be maybe 5% of the population would need some modification and only a tiny fraction would need significant adjustment. For most of them a planned activity program would have long term health benefits. The affiliation of people with Reserve/Guard units could cover basic health care needs. Real useful work appropriate to their abilities would be required to qualify for benefits. This would pass constitutional muster. We have seen the result of ignoring people and allowing citizenship to be treated like a prize on a TV show. If you want to fix what caused this disaster stop retreating into a shell and engage with next generation of voters. This is the best way to do it.

I am not deciding that people CAN do nothing. I am baldly stating that our government has no right to REQUIRE people to do anything. This is the United States of America - home of the FREE, land of LIBERTY - not the fucking Gulag.

723 nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:33:56am

re: #720 HoosierHoops

Where is my free gas and mortgage payment?

I have it on good authority that if you wait outside at your mail box today, you just might get committed?

724 Dar ul Harb  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:34:06am

re: #700 laZardo

"He Probably Will Continue Subsidizing Your Sorry Asses."

/props to Mandy for the original answer on the America In Six Words challenge way back when...

I loved that challenge. And I'm still proud of my entry.

Electric lights. Airplanes. Internet. You're welcome.
725 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:34:07am

re: #717 lifeofthemind

re: #694 MandyManners

Do not presume to decide a priori that people can do nothing. Professionals can evaluate the abilities of people with conditions that preclude the regular program. That would be maybe 5% of the population would need some modification and only a tiny fraction would need significant adjustment. For most of them a planned activity program would have long term health benefits. The affiliation of people with Reserve/Guard units could cover basic health care needs. Real useful work appropriate to their abilities would be required to qualify for benefits. This would pass constitutional muster. We have seen the result of ignoring people and allowing citizenship to be treated like a prize on a TV show. If you want to fix what caused this disaster stop retreating into a shell and engage with next generation of voters. This is the best way to do it.

Unless people are paid the prevailing wage, it's servitude. Even if they weren't paid a dime, it'd be a humongous drain on the economy in the form of higher taxes to pay for it as well as depriving the private sector of employees. And, these would be minors--not adults.

726 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:34:27am

re: #715 aussiemagpie
We were watching the cricket so missed watching any news.

Please tell us about your fascination with insects?

727 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:34:35am

re: #721 Wishing

While the rest of the country was swinging wildly left, Tennessee, for the first time since Reconstruction, has a Republican majority in the state house.
We are hoping to weather Obama.

Nice state to live in too. If things get to bad up north I'll be down. I could use some good barbecue and I miss holly at Christmas.

728 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:34:38am

Probably soon to be 3 of 3 branches depending on when or if a couple currently sitting judges vacate their seats.

729 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:35:07am

re: #719 christheprofessor

That's right MFers, MANILA TIME.

/wishes he could select that instead of Taipei, Kuala Lumpur or Singapore time on his comp...

730 nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:35:30am

"Iran slams Obama’s rejection of its nuclear program"

Welcome to the party Obama!

731 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:36:13am

re: #725 MandyManners

Unless people are paid the prevailing wage, it's servitude. Even if they weren't paid a dime, it'd be a humongous drain on the economy in the form of higher taxes to pay for it as well as depriving the private sector of employees. And, these would be minors--not adults.

Even if people are paid the prevailing wage it is still forced servitude and unconstitutional. The government gets away with the military draft in time of war because of the Constitutional authority to raise an army.

732 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:36:40am

re: #730 nevergiveup

"Iran slams Obama’s rejection of its nuclear program"

But...but...but!

733 littleoldlady  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:37:19am

That's it for me (for now) folks...

Good day, ALL!™

734 goddessoftheclassroom  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:37:26am

Got to get moving, Lizards. Have a great day!

735 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:37:32am

#674 aussigmagpie

"my soon to be hubby"

You gettin' married?! Did Craig know? He didn't say anything.

CONGRATULATIONS! When?

736 Aussie Stinger  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:38:02am

re: #715 aussiemagpie

I missed the concession speech, but I read that she's keeping on with politics

The new PM John Key sounds pretty impressive doesn't he?

We were watching the cricket so missed watching any news

Love Melbourne! My ex FIL lives in Chelsea, so we visit at least once a year

___


Very nice.

Yeah John Key sounds okay.

Actually, did u know that as of tonight NZ also has a Jewish PM?
(his mother fled Europe)

Seriously, I hope that his defence policy reverses the catastrophe that Helen Clarke did. The NZ air force had all its offensive fighters scrapped in 2001, when they were on the verge of signing a F-16 deal.

Instead, Clarke scrapped that deal, and then went further by selling all of their A-4 jets, leaving NZ with not a single fighter jet in its inventory.

What an idiot. She relied on the Aussie Defence Force to do all the heavy lifting. Bastards.

So, we'll see if NZ goes ahead and buys some fighter jets. Gosh, I can't believe Clarke did what she did.

Anyhoo, sorry 4 the rant. It's gettin' late, heading off to bed.

G'nite!

737 lifeofthemind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:38:06am

re: #725 MandyManners

Unless people are paid the prevailing wage, it's servitude. Even if they weren't paid a dime, it'd be a humongous drain on the economy in the form of higher taxes to pay for it as well as depriving the private sector of employees. And, these would be minors--not adults.

Which is why I keep it at 6 months and not two years. Since they will mostlybe minors, some will be immigrants, the cost to the economy will be reduced and the long term benefits of their revieving these skills will accrue.

738 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:38:29am

chinese Barbecued Pork

Serves 4 to 6

1.5 lbs pork tenderloin (2-3 tenderloins)
1 medium rib celery, finely chopped
1 medium carrot, finely chopped
1 medium onion, finely chopped
1 tablespoon minced fresh ginger
5 strips fresh tangerine or orange zest (each 2 x .3 inches; removed with a vegetable peeler)
.67 cup rice wine or dry sherry
.33 cup soy sauce
.33 cup pure maple syrup
2 tablespoons Asian (dark) sesame oil

1.trim the tenderloins of excess fat or sinew. Mix the celery, carror, onion, ginger, zest, sherry, soy sauce, maple syrup, and 1 tablespoon of sesame oil in a baking dish and mix. Ad the tenderloins, coating them. Cover and let marinate in the refrigerator 24-48 hrs, turning occasionally.
2.preheat over or grill to medium high.
3.Remove tenderloins from the marinade and dry with paper towels. Strain marinade into a small saucepan and bring to a boil over a medium-high heat. Boil until thick and syrupy (5-8 minutes).
4.Brush tenderloins with remaining 1 tablespoon of soy sauce. Arrange tenderloins on hot grate and grill, turning with tongs until pork is brown and cooked through (16 minutes or so). Brush with heated marinade after about 10 minutes.
5.transfer tenderloins to cutting board and let coil for 5 minutes. Cut as needed.

739 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:38:51am

aussiemagpie

Oh, I'm sorry. I just reread your post. You said "many years ago."

I'm a klutz. Sorry.

Me dumb. :-(

740 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:38:57am

re: #721 Wishing

"They're sliding back into conservative repression as a natural reaction to the tide of progress!"

/they'll say that soon...

741 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:38:58am

I hope America doesn't desend into Arwellian nightmares.

742 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:39:17am

re: #733 littleoldlady

re: #734 goddessoftheclassroom

Cheers to the both-a-ye.

743 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:39:22am

Orwellian sorry

744 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:39:44am

re: #738 Jewels (AKA Julian)
5.transfer tenderloins to cutting board and let coil for 5 minutes. Cut as needed.

After the coil...comes the...?

745 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:39:55am

Jamaican Jerk Marinade

1/2 c. whole Jamaican pimento berries
3 Scotch Bonnet chiles, seeds and stems
removed, chopped
10 scallions, chopped
1/2 c. chopped onion
4 cloves garlic, chopped
4 bay leaves, crushed
1 3-inch piece of ginger, peeled and chopped
1/3 c. fresh thyme
1 t. nutmeg
1 t. ground cinnamon
1 t. salt
1 T. black pepper
1/4 c. vegetable oil
1/4 c. lime juice

Roast berries in dry skillet until aromatic, about 2 minutes. Remove
and crush into powder.
Put powder and all ingredients into blender. Remove and store in a
jar in refrigerator.


Jamaican Jerk Barbecued Ribs

1 cup Jerk Marinade (1)
1 tablespoon Sugar
2 tablespoons Basalmic Vinegar
4 pounds Pork Spareribs
Commercial BBQ Sauce

Combine marinade, sugar and vinegar. Marinate ribs for 4+ hours. The
longer the hotter. Set drip pan in grill to provide for indirect
heat. Use a low fire. Cook for 1 1/2 hours turning and brushing
frequently with the marinade. Brush ribs with BBQ sauce during the
last 15 minutes of cooking.

746 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:39:55am

re: #721 Wishing

While the rest of the country was swinging wildly left, Tennessee, for the first time since Reconstruction, has a Republican majority in the state house.
We are hoping to weather Obama.

Isn't Bredesen term-limited out in 2010? Who's the favorite Republican to run against him?

747 lifeofthemind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:40:20am

re: #743 Rancher

Orwellian sorry

Ayersian?

748 The Hoopster  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:40:44am

re: #729 laZardo

That's right MFers, MANILA TIME.

/wishes he could select that instead of Taipei, Kuala Lumpur or Singapore time on his comp...

Hey Lazardo!
My friend played golf in Kuala Lumpur this year..Says you can't play alone cause if you get out of your cart the monkeys come out of the trees and steal your clubs..Also you have to keep an eye out for Cobras in the morning.
/gee kindof makes NASCAR look like a sissy sport.

749 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:40:57am

Wishing

erm...that should be Coil = Cool

750 right Brain  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:41:23am

I woke up this morning realizing that India will get to the moon before the Europeans.

That is a startling thought: a once backward colony of the Europeans beats them in a major scientific achievement, landing on a moon in the solar system; I use "beat" as pejorative term inasmuch as the Euro's don't even have a program in place to attempt it.

Can one imagine how awful it must be to be a European these days? They are being marginalized, not only by the Americans, but also by their former dark-skinned colonies, the wogs.

751 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:41:31am

re: #746 MandyManners

Isn't Bredesen term-limited out in 2010? Who's the favorite Republican to run against him?

To be very honest, Mandy, I have ignored state politics, in fact, all politics, until this year, so I haven't a clue.

752 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:41:31am

re: #737 lifeofthemind

Which is why I keep it at 6 months and not two years. Since they will mostlybe minors, some will be immigrants, the cost to the economy will be reduced and the long term benefits of their revieving these skills will accrue.

You are out of your mind? Have you the first fraction of a clue just how much it would cost to house, feed, clothe and educate our entire population of 17 year olds for 6 months. We certainly don't have the military facilities that we once did in which to house them. We can't even provide teachers to teach reading and math for godsake. You are talking trillions of dollars just to get such a program off the ground. Before you talk about civil disobedience, mass arrests, and law suits.

753 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:41:36am

re: #681 yma o hyd

Hi, Lizrad Nation!

Good thing I've had me lunch already - seeing all these recipes would've made me dash to the fridge, otherwise.

Just a quick drive-by, a most important rugby game is fast approaching - gotta take Miss Dog out before kick off ...

Hi and I'm waiting for the 1am kick off - Wallabies v Italy

Being the only rugby fan still awake - lots of snoring from the couch so I'll wake him up soon I suppose

Go Wales! :-)

754 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:41:58am

re: #731 galloping granny

Even if people are paid the prevailing wage it is still forced servitude and unconstitutional. The government gets away with the military draft in time of war because of the Constitutional authority to raise an army.

I just wish that every public school was required to teach civics from elementary school. Maybe it doesn't need a separate class but, more than lip service should be paid to it in social studies.

755 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:42:06am

re: #749 Jewels (AKA Julian)

=) gotta love dem typos!

756 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:42:45am

re: #741 Rancher

I hope America doesn't desend into Arwellian nightmares.

Seems that some even here wouldn't recognize an Orwellian nightmare if it bit them on the ass.

/Don't worry about the spelling - we know what you meant.

757 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:42:52am

Still you can't deny Americans their right to vote based on the their attendance at a mandatory Work Camp. Hell with Obama in office these new Senior classes will likely turn into Socialist Indoctrination camps. And probably be led by suck notable Aquaintances of the one as Rev Wrong, Bill Ayers, Mrs Dorne, and the honorable Father Phleger.

758 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:43:07am

on Obama

759 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:43:10am

re: #737 lifeofthemind

Which is why I keep it at 6 months and not two years. Since they will mostlybe minors, some will be immigrants, the cost to the economy will be reduced and the long term benefits of their revieving these skills will accrue.

As GG noted, it's still unconstitutional.

Besides, no way in hell would I turn my minor child over to the state for six minutes, let alone six months.

760 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:44:12am

re: #754 MandyManners

I just wish that every public school was required to teach civics from elementary school. Maybe it doesn't need a separate class but, more than lip service should be paid to it in social studies.

Many of them do. Like that teacher down in Asheville NC in the video.

Vermont does require that all children are taught US and VT history and Constitution annually.

761 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:44:23am

re: #751 Wishing

To be very honest, Mandy, I have ignored state politics, in fact, all politics, until this year, so I haven't a clue.

Bredesen endorsed CBBHO so, if CBBHO really screws the pooch, I don't see it looking good for the Democrats.

762 lawhawk  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:44:24am

Greets and saluts from the NYC metro area. I see that the Palestinians are still busy firing kassams at Israel, and the useful idiots have shown up in their "blockade busting" boat.

Memo to the useful idiots. There's a reason why Israel has shut the border with Gaza - the terrorists in charge are terrorists and cannot be trusted. They're busy working on plots to kill and maim and kidnap Israelis.

763 yma o hyd  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:45:18am

re: #753 aussiemagpie

Hi and I'm waiting for the 1am kick off - Wallabies v Italy

Being the only rugby fan still awake - lots of snoring from the couch so I'll wake him up soon I suppose

Go Wales! :-)

Hi Aussiemagpie - just slinked in again before kick off ...
Thanks - we need all the good luck we can get!

It looks seriously hard for us - we lost our best center, Gav Henson, to injury yesterday. Its dreadful - two rookies, one in the center, and one on the wing! Against Habana ... and ours is only 19, its his first ever game in the scarlet shirt ...

I'm effen nervous.

764 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:45:19am

I find worry to be an unproductive emotion. I was worried, but I got over it quickly because I would rather focus on something more productive. I figured out a plan for myself, and I'm going to work on that, because worry does nothing but cause heartburn, grey hairs and other unhappiness. While I'm still concerned about the next four years, after thinking about my plans, I think it's the other side that should worry- about the American people waking up to their bullshit and lies.

765 akak  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:45:27am
Mashaal calls for dialogue?
Hamas politiburo chief calls on US President-Elect Obama to engage in 'open-minded' dialogue, stressing that American administration must deal with organization if it wants to deal with the region

I guess Rashidi & Abuminah getting the president elect's ear wasn't good enough, full submission would suffice I guess?

766 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:45:36am

re: #757 Rancher

Still you can't deny Americans their right to vote based on the their attendance at a mandatory Work Camp. Hell with Obama in office these new Senior classes will likely turn into Socialist Indoctrination camps. And probably be led by suck notable Aquaintances of the one as Rev Wrong, Bill Ayers, Mrs Dorne, and the honorable Father Phleger.

Denying Americans the right to vote on virtually any basis - even the ability to read and write - has long since been overturned by SCOTUS as unconstitutional. All Americans are created equal and there is no "more equal than others so entitled to vote" clause.

767 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:45:45am

re: #752 galloping granny

You are out of your mind? Have you the first fraction of a clue just how much it would cost to house, feed, clothe and educate our entire population of 17 year olds for 6 months. We certainly don't have the military facilities that we once did in which to house them. We can't even provide teachers to teach reading and math for godsake. You are talking trillions of dollars just to get such a program off the ground. Before you talk about civil disobedience, mass arrests, and law suits.

If milk is around $4.00, and there are 1,000,000 teens, think of the daily outlay for just that.

768 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:45:47am

She was from Fayetteville GG right outside Fort Bragg where that little girls daddy was stationed who was gonna have to be in the Army 100 years cause of McCain.

769 christheprofessor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:46:11am

#729 LoZardo

Heh. Minila gets not respect...

770 legalpad  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:46:59am

re: #751 Wishing

To be very honest, Mandy, I have ignored state politics, in fact, all politics, until this year -

So what accounts for that?

771 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:47:10am

Great for turkey left-overs...

Hot Baked Chicken Salad

cubed cooked chicken (or turkey)
thickish slices of fresh celery
mayonaise with (sweet) curry powder mixed in to your taste and some dried chives

combine and spread in baking dish

sprinkle top with some sliced almonds

heat in oven till hot through

772 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:47:17am

re: #761 MandyManners

Bredesen endorsed CBBHO so, if CBBHO really screws the pooch, I don't see it looking good for the Democrats.

Republicans are really speaking what the people of this state like to hear. It is a great place to live, for sure.

773 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:47:54am

re: #688 HoosierHoops

The poster formerly known as *ahem*
Hiya Aussie!

G'day HH! Hope your weekend is a good one!

774 yma o hyd  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:48:00am

re: #762 lawhawk

Greets and saluts from the NYC metro area. I see that the Palestinians are still busy firing kassams at Israel, and the useful idiots have shown up in their "blockade busting" boat.

Memo to the useful idiots. There's a reason why Israel has shut the border with Gaza - the terrorists in charge are terrorists and cannot be trusted. They're busy working on plots to kill and maim and kidnap Israelis.

Hi - but see, being idiots, they just cannot see any reason why israel wouldn't just ... go away ...

There are times when I just despair, seeing what quality our' betters' are made of.

775 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:48:05am

Pork With Moorish Seasonings

Serves 8 for appetizers, 4 as entrée

2 lbs boneless pork loin or tenderlion
1 medium onion, finely diced
3 garlic cloves, minced
3 tablespoons, minced fresh flat-leaf (Italian) parsley
1 tablespoon Spanish Paprika
.5 teaspoon hot pepper flakes
.5 teaspoon ground cumin
.5 teaspoon ground coriander
.5 teaspoon dried oregano
.25 teaspoon saffron threads, ground
4 tablespoons extra-virgin olive oil
2 tablespoons red wine vinegar
2 tablespoons dry sherry or white wine
1 teaspoon salt
.5 teaspoon fresh ground black pepper

Step 1: cut the pork into .75 inch cubes. Combine remaining ingredients except 2 tablespoons oil into large non-reactive baking dish. Ad meat and toss ingredients to coat, then marinate, covered in the refrigerator for 4-6 hours, or overnight if needed (the longer the soak, the spicier)

Step 2: Preheat your grill (or oven) to high.

Step 3: when ready to cook, put the cubes onto skewers. Oil the grill (or oven grill mate), the arrange the kebabs on the hot grate. Cook the pork until it is browned on all sides (2-3 minutes) and cooked through, 8-12 minutes in all, brushing now and again with the 2 tablespoons oil. Serve hot

776 The Hoopster  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:48:11am

re: #767 MandyManners

If milk is around $4.00, and there are 1,000,000 teens, think of the daily outlay for just that.


The outlay for the Xboxs, video games, Mountain dew and chips could destroy the economy.
/

777 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:48:17am

re: #760 galloping granny

Many of them do. Like that teacher down in Asheville NC in the video.

Vermont does require that all children are taught US and VT history and Constitution annually.

Every year the students are taught that?

I remember that both American and state history classes were taught by utterly bored coaches. One just read from the book. No mention of the civil rights years. No mention of Viet Nam.

778 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:48:41am

Mole Poblano De Guajolote

Serves 6-8

6-8 lbs turkey, cut into serving sized pieces
1 onion, chopped
1 garlic clove, chopped
salt
6 tablespoons lard or corn oil
fresh cilantro and 2 tablespoons toasted sesame seeds to garnish

Sauce
6 dried ancho chilies
4 dried pastille chilies
4 dried mulatto chilies
1 drained canned chipotle chili, seeded and chopped (optional)
2 onions, chopped
2 garlic cloves, chopped
1 lb tomatoes, peeled and chopped
1 stale tortilla, shredded
.33 cup raisins
1 cup almonds, ground
3 tablespoons sesame seeds, ground
.5 tsp coriander seeds, ground
1 teaspoon ground cinnamon
.5 teaspoon anise
.25 ground black peppercorns
4 tablespoons lard or corn oil
1.5 oz unsweetened chocolate, broken into cooking squares
1 teaspoon sugar
salt and fresh ground pepper

cooking tip: roasting the dried chilies lightly, taking care not to burn them, brings out the flavour and is worth the extra effort

Step 1: place the turkey peices into a saucepan or flameproof casserole large enough to hold them in one layer comfortably. Add the onion and garlic, and add enough cold water to cover. Season with salt, cover and cook for about an hour or until turkey is tender.

Step 2: meanwhile, put the ancho, pastille and mulatto chilies ina dry frying pan over a low heat and roast them for a few minutes, shaking the pan frequently. Remove the stems and shake out the seeds. Tear the pods into small bits and put these in a bowl. Ad sufficient water to cover and soak, turning from time to time, for 30 minutes or until soft.

Step 3: lift out the turkey pieces and pat dry with paper towels. Reserve the stock in a measuring jug. Heat the lard in a large heavy frying pan and sauté the turkey until lightly brown all over. Transfer to a plate and set aside. Reserve any oil left in the frying pan.

Step 4: transfer the chilies, along with the water in which they have been soaked, intoa food processor, at the chipotle chilie with the onions, garlic, tomatoes, tortilla, raisins, ground almonds and spices. Process until puree. If necessary do this in batches.

Step 5: Add the lard to the fat remaining in the frying pan used for sautéing the turkey. Heat the mix, then add the chili and spice paste. Cook, stirring, for about 5 minutes.

Step 6: transfer the mixture to the pan or casserole in which the turkey was originally cooked. Stir in two cups of the turkey stock (make up the difference with water of necessary). Add the chocolate and season with salt and pepper. Cook over a low heat until the chocolate is melted. Stir in the sugar. Ad the turkey and more stock if needed. Cover the pan and simmer gently for 30 minutes. Serve garnished with fresh cilantro and sprinkled with the sesame seeds.

779 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:49:06am

re: #770 legalpad

So what accounts for that?

Other interests.

780 Rancher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:49:06am

Aye any denial of voting rights for anything outside being a convicted felon is unconstitutional. Was just trying to limit the arguement to the convo at hand

781 Dar ul Harb  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:49:06am

re: #746 MandyManners

Isn't Bredesen term-limited out in 2010? Who's the favorite Republican to run against him?

I'd love to see Gov. Fred Thompson!

782 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:50:14am

re: #771 nonic

Great for turkey left-overs...

Hot Baked Chicken Salad

cubed cooked chicken (or turkey)
thickish slices of fresh celery
mayonaise with (sweet) curry powder mixed in to your taste and some dried chives

combine and spread in baking dish

sprinkle top with some sliced almonds

heat in oven till hot through

My personal favorite for turkey leftovers -

Smash the leftover stuffing into a casserole dish to form a crust about an inch thick. Pile leftover turkey in the middle. Top with spoonfuls of leftover gravy (cold is fine - it melts.) Frost with the leftover mashed potatoes. If you're short on potatoes, mix them with the turnips or squash first. Bake at 350 until bubbly and golden - 45 minutes or so.

My kids have actually made me cook a turkey dinner just to have leftover pie!

783 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:50:20am

#690 granny

You sound (maybe) worse than me! LOL

784 aboo-Hoo-Hoo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:50:24am

re: #732 littleoldlady

But...but...but!

Yea...but...Obummer said that yesterday, or was it the day before? At any rate, Obummer will change his tune upon learning he's upset them.

Gotta be a uniter; get everyone singing Kumbaya, roasting marshmallows around a nuclear mushroom.

Mornin folks.

785 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:50:25am

Cajun ‘Popcorn’ shrimp

2 lbs raw crayfish tails, peeled, or small shrimp, shell and deveined
2 eggs
1 cup white wine (very dry)
.5 cup fine cornmeal (or all purpose flour, if not available)
.5 cup all purpose flour
1 tablespoon snipped fresh chives
1 garlic clove, crushed
.5 teaspoon fresh thyme leaves
.25 teaspoon salt
.25 teaspoon cayenne pepper
.25 teaspoon ground black pepper
oil, for deep frying

For the mayonnaise
1 egg yolk
2 teaspoons Dijon mustard
1 tablespoon white vinegar
1 cup olive or vegetable oil
.5 cup fresh basil leaves, chopped
salt and ground black pepper

Step 1: rinse the crayfish or shrimp in cold water. Drain well and set aside in a cool place

Step 2: mix together the eggs and wine in a small bowl

Step 3: in a mixing bowl, combine the cornmeal and/or flour, chives, garlic, thyme, salt cayenne, and pepper. Gradually whisk in the egg mixture, blending well. Cover the batter and let stand for one hour at room temperature.

Step 4: For the mayonnaise, combine the egg yolk, mustard, vinegar in a mixing bowl and add salt and pepper to taste. Add the oil ina thin stream, beating vigiously with a wire whisk. When the mixture is thick and smooth, stir in the basil. Cover and chill until ready to serve.

Step 5: heat 3 inches of oil in a large skillet or deep fryer to a temp of 350 F. dip the seafood into the batter and fry in small batches for 2-3 minutes until golden brown. Turn as necessary for even coloring. Remove with a slotted spoon and drain on paper towels. Serve hot with the mayo

786 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:50:53am

Good morning all y'all - from a pleasant (56 degrees, going up to 68 degrees) bright and sunny Charlotte!
How is everyone this morning?

787 lifeofthemind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:51:22am

re: #752 galloping granny

You are out of your mind? Have you the first fraction of a clue just how much it would cost to house, feed, clothe and educate our entire population of 17 year olds for 6 months. We certainly don't have the military facilities that we once did in which to house them. We can't even provide teachers to teach reading and math for godsake. You are talking trillions of dollars just to get such a program off the ground. Before you talk about civil disobedience, mass arrests, and law suits.

Seeing that you have descended to personal abuse I can take it as a given that the argument on its merits is conceded by you. Have a day.

788 Aussie Stinger  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:51:25am

re: #726 Wishing

We were watching the cricket so missed watching any news.

Please tell us about your fascination with insects?

___

Haha, smart-ass!

Nothin' better than lying on the couch on a Saturday arvo watching the cricket, enjoying a cool one and a beautiful summer's breeze to cool down the temp.

Great game.

aussie magpie, remember this match:

Who can forget.

100,000 fans on their feet going crazy.

789 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:52:08am

re: #764 Sharmuta

I find worry to be an unproductive emotion. I was worried, but I got over it quickly because I would rather focus on something more productive. I figured out a plan for myself, and I'm going to work on that, because worry does nothing but cause heartburn, grey hairs and other unhappiness. While I'm still concerned about the next four years, after thinking about my plans, I think it's the other side that should worry- about the American people waking up to their bullshit and lies.

As I've mentioned before, a personal reason I wanted CBBHO to lose was that I would be able to delete over 100 bookmarks. In the months leading up to the election, they multiplied like dust bunnies.

Every plan I formulated to organize them fell through. The last one--to e-mail the links to an alternate e-addy--seemed promising. Thing is, I went on a deletion spree of other links and that rearranged the CBBHO links. So, I'm gonna' wipe clean my e-box on my alternate e-addy and start over.

790 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:53:09am

re: #777 MandyManners

Every year the students are taught that?

I remember that both American and state history classes were taught by utterly bored coaches. One just read from the book. No mention of the civil rights years. No mention of Viet Nam.

In Vermont every child of any age must be taught some aspect of those four things annually. Obviously not all of US history every year. Say what you will about Vermont, we were an independent nation before the USA existed and our Constitution predates the US Constitution. Folks here are pretty proud of that. The Secretary of State even puts out some great educational materials to assist in the effort and the kids are welcome at the Statehouse most any time. We also have a special holiday here - Town Meeting Day. All the schoolchildren have the day off so that they can attend Town Meeting with their folks.

791 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:53:12am

re: #710 Jewels (AKA Julian)

Aussie,

hope that little curry recipie tides you over. currently getting my others entered

Thanks Jewels - and isn't it time for a kitty moment? :-)

792 legalpad  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:53:40am

re: #779 Wishing

Other interests.

Me too, only it was about around 1998-2000 when my interest in politics was - rekindled. Before, you would have to say I was "neutral."

793 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:53:49am

re: #748 HoosierHoops

And I thought golfers had it made with their country clubs and their caddies to haul their stuff around for them... [=

Also...the outlay for those young-adult conveniences could be offset by putting more donation buttons to government-affiliated sites on major blog sites. It's a win either way...they donate and the economy stays afloat, or they protest that there is too much government "interference" and the seeds of conservatism could as well be planted for their adulthood.

794 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:54:12am

Good morning folks. It's a beautiful day in the Peoples Republic of America.

President-elect Obama has announced that Henry Rivera will the in charge of the transition at the FCC. Who is Henry Rivera? Get a load of this:

MEET TALK'S EXECUTIONER

Obama's 'Fairness Doctrine' Czar Chosen, AAR Expects Benefit

Ahead of a widely-expected crackdown on free speech and political dissent by the incoming Obama administration, our Dear Leader has appointed a new FCC transition czar to oversee the process.

Henry Rivera, a longtime radical leftist, lawyer and former FCC commissioner, is expected to lead the push to dismantle commercial talk radio that is favored by a number of Democratic Party senators. Rivera will play a pivotal role in preventing critics from having a public voice during Obama's tenure in office.

Rivera, who resigned from the FCC nearly a quarter-century ago during the Reagan years, believes in a doctrine of "communications policy as a civil rights issue".

So what is going to happen, is any speech that the lefties do not like is going to be classified as a civil right violation.

Rivera also believes in appointing lefty overlords to coporate Board of Directors to weed out the conservatives.

In particular, Rivera is known for his push for more minority broadcasting ownership, but this issue has largely been rendered obsolete as former commercial broadcasting empires teeter on the brink of bankruptcy.

Translation: The Dem's will give handouts to their chosen broadcasting sycophants in exchange for a purge of all conservatives. But one bright spot, it will create lots of jobs for them:

The FCC's staff might have to be increased substantially to accommodate listeners looking to censor radio programming in their area.

I think that was once called "The Gestapo".

Do you feel the love, the unity, the hope yet folks?

Believe me, the Chicago Machine has just gotten started.

795 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:54:19am

re: #768 Rancher

She was from Fayetteville GG right outside Fort Bragg where that little girls daddy was stationed who was gonna have to be in the Army 100 years cause of McCain.

I thought it was Asheville.

796 godfrey  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:54:37am

Good morning lizards

How goes the loyal opposition? I see His Majesty has already shown his compulsion to take cheap shots as a way of "organizing" his "community."

What, the market reaction to his election didn't cheer him up enough?

797 christheprofessor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:54:37am

#786 realwest

Good morning. Scan up above and you will find where I transcribe the Germany and Japan surrender annoucements from my father's ship in WW2 (I have them here and am going to have them framed for him).

Off to the dog park, you all have a great day/night!

798 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:54:52am

re: #772 Wishing

Republicans are really speaking what the people of this state like to hear. It is a great place to live, for sure.

I bet the mountains are gorgeous.

799 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:54:53am

re: #790 galloping granny

And Vermont is still deep blue?

800 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:54:57am

re: #788 Aussie Stinger

___ ___

Haha, smart-ass!

Nothin' better than lying on the couch on a Saturday arvo watching the cricket, enjoying a cool one and a beautiful summer's breeze to cool down the temp.

Great game.

aussie magpie, remember this match:

[Link: au.youtube.com...]

Who can forget.

100,000 fans on their feet going crazy.

Heh...it reminds of people saying they are *going to the Walmart*. The definite article implies importance, perhaps. I prefer to watch the football, but the sentiment is the same: IT ROCKS! (same cant be said about the Walmart tho)
Do you have the Walmart down under?

801 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:55:32am

re: #783 nonic

#690 granny

You sound (maybe) worse than me! LOL

Do remember that I have three daughters, a grandchild and a son in law helping in the effort. Not to mention the significant other who resides in the UK and uses us as a way station for all of his US purchases between visits.

802 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:55:40am

Theme for the Obama Administration?

Living Colour - Cult of Personality

Look into my eyes, what do you see?
Cult of personality
I know your anger, I know your dreams
Ive been everything you want to be
Im the cult of personality
Like mussolini and kennedy
Im the cult of personality
Cult of personality
Cult of personality

Neon lights, a nobel prize
The mirror speaks, the reflection lies
You dont have to follow me
Only you can set me free
I sell the things you need to be
Im the smiling face on your t.v.
Im the cult of personality
I exploit you still you love me

I tell you one and one makes three
Im the cult of personality
Like joseph stalin and gandi
Im the cult of personality
Cult of personality
Cult of personality

Neon lights a nobel prize
A leader speaks, that leader dies
You dont have to follow me
Only you can set you free

You gave me fortune
You gave me fame
You me power in your gods name
Im every person you need to be
Im the cult of personality
Look into my eyes, what do you see?
Cult of personality
I know your anger, I know your dreams
Ive been everything you want to be
Im the cult of personality
Like mussolini and kennedy
Im the cult of personality
Cult of personality
Cult of personality

Neon lights, a nobel prize
The mirror speaks, the reflection lies
You dont have to follow me
Only you can set me free
I sell the things you need to be
Im the smiling face on your t.v.
Im the cult of personality
I exploit you still you love me

I tell you one and one makes three
Im the cult of personality
Like joseph stalin and gandi
Im the cult of personality
Cult of personality
Cult of personality

Neon lights a nobel prize
A leader speaks, that leader dies
You dont have to follow me
Only you can set you free

You gave me fortune
You gave me fame
You me power in your gods name
Im every person you need to be
Im the cult of personality

803 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:55:41am

re: #776 HoosierHoops

The outlay for the Xboxs, video games, Mountain dew and chips could destroy the economy.
/

Hadn't thought of that. Perhaps they'd get to attend lectures every evening, instead.

804 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:56:00am

re: #794 3 wood

"Only conservatives censor speech! He's just challenging all the hate speech floating around our supposedly free airwaves!"

/ watch for that.

805 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:56:09am

re: #764 Sharmuta

I find worry to be an unproductive emotion. I was worried, but I got over it quickly because I would rather focus on something more productive. I figured out a plan for myself, and I'm going to work on that, because worry does nothing but cause heartburn, grey hairs and other unhappiness. While I'm still concerned about the next four years, after thinking about my plans, I think it's the other side that should worry- about the American people waking up to their bullshit and lies.

I up dinged you Sharm...you're exactly correcto. Socialisim has rarely encountered a truely free people - and with the internet - we have ways to organize and fight back like never before.

Victims of Big Obama Government will be everywhere for the world to see.

806 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:56:36am

re: #781 Dar ul Harb

I'd love to see Gov. Fred Thompson!

I've the notion that's he not interested. If he were, though, he'd be a sure-deal.

807 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:57:11am

re: #716 nonic

Yes still here - next you'll tell us he's running from one side of the US to the other!

808 godfrey  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:57:50am

re: #794 3 wood

To borrow Charles's phrase, "ugh."

It would be nice to have some intrepid reporter follow Rivera's slime trail.

809 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:58:02am

re: #792 legalpad

Me too, only it was about around 1998-2000 when my interest in politics was - rekindled. Before, you would have to say I was "neutral."

Rekindled is putting it mildly: when i saw the potential disaster with the Zero, it was like i was set on fire. LOLOL

810 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:58:17am

re: #764 Sharmuta

I find worry to be an unproductive emotion. I was worried, but I got over it quickly because I would rather focus on something more productive. I figured out a plan for myself, and I'm going to work on that, because worry does nothing but cause heartburn, grey hairs and other unhappiness. While I'm still concerned about the next four years, after thinking about my plans, I think it's the other side that should worry- about the American people waking up to their bullshit and lies.

Call me crazy but I still plan to "cooperate." This way if all else fails I can pass it off as "youthful naivete."

/we were young...and very angry.

811 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:58:21am

re: #787 lifeofthemind

Seeing that you have descended to personal abuse I can take it as a given that the argument on its merits is conceded by you. Have a day.

Asking you if you have lost your mind is hardly personal abuse - just a clear and valid question. If I called you an asshole, now that would be personal abuse. Get your definitions straight.

I concede nothing. Your argument has no merits.

812 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:58:35am

re: #790 galloping granny

In Vermont every child of any age must be taught some aspect of those four things annually. Obviously not all of US history every year. Say what you will about Vermont, we were an independent nation before the USA existed and our Constitution predates the US Constitution. Folks here are pretty proud of that. The Secretary of State even puts out some great educational materials to assist in the effort and the kids are welcome at the Statehouse most any time. We also have a special holiday here - Town Meeting Day. All the schoolchildren have the day off so that they can attend Town Meeting with their folks.

Sounds awesome!

813 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:59:33am

re: #798 MandyManners

I bet the mountains are gorgeous.

We are just past the really pretty stage, about to plunge into the real yuck of brown everywhere. But it was a glorious, colorful fall here. I am sad to see it go. =(

814 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 5:59:36am

kitten break!
[Link: dailykitten.com...]

815 jemima  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:00:33am

Good morning all. Random thoughts.

Who are these professionals who are now going to start making all these decisions about what people are capable of? Are they anything like the professionals at Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac?

He may be *the* president but he's not *my* president. I have respect for the office but not when he's in it. Mark Levin was on a major rant yesterday.
Maybe...I expect Galloping Granny will chime in here...it has something to do with the way Christians operate in the world and the way Jews do. I'm not so willing to be generous and wait till he slaps my cheek. I have a clear idea about BHO already and he's an enemy of the ideals this country was founded upon. We have him on tape saying the Constitution is flawed. It hasn't been flawed in over 200 years. Now it's flawed and up for change.
Let him prove he's good for America. Let him win me over. Then, and only then, he can be my president. (not holding my breath)

816 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:00:35am

Obama Gestapo Radio - OGR "ogre"

817 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:01:28am

re: #794 3 wood

Good morning folks. It's a beautiful day in the Peoples Republic of America.

President-elect Obama has announced that Henry Rivera will the in charge of the transition at the FCC. Who is Henry Rivera? Get a load of this:

MEET TALK'S EXECUTIONER

Obama's 'Fairness Doctrine' Czar Chosen, AAR Expects Benefit


I think that was once called "The Gestapo".

Do you feel the love, the unity, the hope yet folks?

Believe me, the Chicago Machine has just gotten started.

I've a link to Wiley Rein above, Rivera's firm.

It's a fucking nightmare. I wouldn't be surprised if his nomination is on the front burner for January.

818 legalpad  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:02:05am

re: #809 Wishing

Rekindled is putting it mildly: when i saw the potential disaster with the Zero, it was like i was set on fire. LOLOL

So - after he beat Hillary you got concerned?

819 Aussie Stinger  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:02:07am

re: #800 Wishing

Heh...it reminds of people saying they are *going to the Walmart*. The definite article implies importance, perhaps. I prefer to watch the football, but the sentiment is the same: IT ROCKS! (same cant be said about the Walmart tho)
Do you have the Walmart down under?

___

We don't have Walmart in Aussie actually, unless it's trading another a different name.

But got a few other US chains over here, including Borders bookshops, which I really like. Such a good range.

820 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:02:16am

re: #799 laZardo

And Vermont is still deep blue?

Vermont is a very divided state. There are old time New Englanders - mostly Republican or Independent - and a whole bunch of flat landers who moved north for "vacation homes." (I did the census years ago and at that time knew of at least one family who voted in two states.) I was actually pretty dumbfounded that VT went to Obama. So much so that I wonder how much he paid for it. I have seen only one Obama sign in the entire state - and not a single bumper sticker. Makes me wonder about those voting machines. . . .

821 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:02:23am

re: #726 Wishing

We were watching the cricket so missed watching any news.

Please tell us about your fascination with insects?

LOL!

Now I'll have to explain the finer points of this wonderful game again for all those who missed my previous lessons last summer and the summer before...:-)

One day, as citizens of the world, you will have to embrace cricket!

822 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:02:43am

re: #802 Jewels (AKA Julian)

823 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:03:54am

re: #813 Wishing

We are just past the really pretty stage, about to plunge into the real yuck of brown everywhere. But it was a glorious, colorful fall here. I am sad to see it go. =(

Don't worry! Spring is coming in a few months, and I always found that to be just as pretty.

824 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:05:40am

re: #805 DistantThunder

I up dinged you Sharm...you're exactly correcto. Socialisim has rarely encountered a truely free people - and with the internet - we have ways to organize and fight back like never before.

Victims of Big Obama Government will be everywhere for the world to see.

One of the things zombie said to us before the election was we were all just as capable as s/he to dig around and research stuff for ourselves. I took up zombie's challenge and I found Osawatomie. With zombie's help- that weather underground magazine got a lot of notice. I wish others would take up zombie's challenge- s/he can't do all of it for us.

But we can all figure out what we can do for the next four years and move on it. I've asked Lizards to get involved in their local political parties because i've been there and I know for a fact one person can make a difference. We can no longer sit back and allow others to carry the water- look what a great job they've done! These republican water carriers have lost us Congress and the White House. Time to get in there and show them how Lizards get it done.

825 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:05:47am

re: #820 galloping granny

The Kid had a few choice words for Vermont, New Hampshire and Maine Tuesday night.

826 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:05:55am

re: #814 Jewels (AKA Julian)

kitten break!
[Link: dailykitten.com...]

Awww!

827 vapig  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:06:04am

Good Morning and Happy Saturday, Lizards!

828 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:06:08am

re: #794 3 wood
Hey good morning my friend - so it starts even before Obama takes the oath of office?
Idjits. The "Fairness Doctrine" now, unless it's limited to radio only, would work in convervatives' favor - think of all the HOURS and HOURS of conservative TV News there would have to be just to get within hailing distance of "fairness"!

829 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:07:24am

re: #815 jemima

Good morning all. Random thoughts.

Who are these professionals who are now going to start making all these decisions about what people are capable of? Are they anything like the professionals at Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac?

He may be *the* president but he's not *my* president. I have respect for the office but not when he's in it. Mark Levin was on a major rant yesterday.
Maybe...I expect Galloping Granny will chime in here...it has something to do with the way Christians operate in the world and the way Jews do. I'm not so willing to be generous and wait till he slaps my cheek. I have a clear idea about BHO already and he's an enemy of the ideals this country was founded upon. We have him on tape saying the Constitution is flawed. It hasn't been flawed in over 200 years. Now it's flawed and up for change.
Let him prove he's good for America. Let him win me over. Then, and only then, he can be my president. (not holding my breath)

He will NEVER be my President Jemima. Not until the day he dies and not when he has been dead a thousand years. I do not recognize him as legitimate and have no plans to do anything to "co-operate" in the slightest. As a matter of fact, I have every intention of undermining, disobeying, disavowing and working against OBama and every single thing he stands for until my dying breath.

Christianity says to render unto Caesar his due. Communism is not Caesar's due. To go along to get along with Obama would require me to completely betray my entire moral code. Never in a million years.

830 yesandno  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:07:25am

re: #750 right Brain

I woke up this morning realizing that India will get to the moon before the Europeans.

That is a startling thought: a once backward colony of the Europeans beats them in a major scientific achievement, landing on a moon in the solar system; I use "beat" as pejorative term inasmuch as the Euro's don't even have a program in place to attempt it.

Can one imagine how awful it must be to be a European these days? They are being marginalized, not only by the Americans, but also by their former dark-skinned colonies, the wogs.

Do you think that India would be where it is without the influence of the English to begin with?

831 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:07:58am

re: #828 realwest

Hey good morning my friend - so it starts even before Obama takes the oath of office?
Idjits. The "Fairness Doctrine" now, unless it's limited to radio only, would work in convervatives' favor - think of all the HOURS and HOURS of conservative TV News there would have to be just to get within hailing distance of "fairness"!

Television is a far more expensive medium than radio, and it is not nearly as portable as radio.

832 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:08:00am

re: #696 Jewels (AKA Julian)

Ranbutan?

nooo! where?

833 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:08:28am

re: #735 nonic

#674 aussigmagpie

"my soon to be hubby"

You gettin' married?! Did Craig know? He didn't say anything.

CONGRATULATIONS! When?

Oh no! Not this one now - Craig's Dad - way back in the olden days when I was an innocent young thing!

BTW he's getting married (the ex) to one of my friends - it's all very nice and we're going to the wedding


Mr Aussiemagpie did the legal work for their house purchase and their wills too

834 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:08:37am

re: #829 galloping granny

He will NEVER be my President Jemima. Not until the day he dies and not when he has been dead a thousand years. I do not recognize him as legitimate and have no plans to do anything to "co-operate" in the slightest. As a matter of fact, I have every intention of undermining, disobeying, disavowing and working against OBama and every single thing he stands for until my dying breath.

Christianity says to render unto Caesar his due. Communism is not Caesar's due. To go along to get along with Obama would require me to completely betray my entire moral code. Never in a million years.

w00t

835 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:08:48am

Obamas connections to the Black panthers remind me of hitler's Sturmabteilung justa bit too much

836 godfrey  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:08:57am

re: #828 realwest

'Morning, real. Good point!

But then, once things have been made "fair," then the usual market forces will be brought to bear -- unless CNN et al simply want to ignore the prospect of increased ad revenue if they run more GOP-friendly content.

Maybe Ted Turner will ignore market forces "for the good of the USSA."

837 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:09:06am

re: #828 realwest

Hey good morning my friend - so it starts even before Obama takes the oath of office?
Idjits. The "Fairness Doctrine" now, unless it's limited to radio only, would work in convervatives' favor - think of all the HOURS and HOURS of conservative TV News there would have to be just to get within hailing distance of "fairness"!

I've been suspecting that. There'd be more "liberal" meat for "conservatives" to gorge upon and vice versa.

838 legalpad  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:09:25am

re: #828 realwest

think of all the HOURS and HOURS of conservative TV News there would have to be just to get within hailing distance of "fairness"!


Oh nooo- rw! Why don't you know they are all centrists!
/

839 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:09:37am

Need less blood in my caffeine supply. bbiab

840 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:10:14am

Hey all y'all - you may recall that there was a bit of discussion (!) about how it was the Urban Blues vs. the Suburban/Rural Reds in this election. Well here's a really interesting map about that:
[Link: www.washingtonpost.com...]
(h/t ec marm)

841 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:10:41am

re: #750 right Brain

Can one imagine how awful it must be to be a European these days? They are being marginalized, not only by the Americans, but also by their former dark-skinned colonies, the wogs.

Well, unless we decisively repudiate socialism, we're doomed to join them.

842 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:10:46am

re: #820 galloping granny

Hmm. I'd suspect that it was always so deep blue (save for Reagan) like the general Northeast that little campaigning/proselytizing would be needed at all.

843 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:11:01am

President -elect Obama is also seriously considering Robert F. Kennedy Jr. to be the head of the EPA. Here's is some background on mr. Kennedy, besides the obvious family connections:

Criminal record

1983

In 1983, he was arrested in a Rapid City South Dakota Airport for heroin possession. A search of his carry-on bag uncovered 183 milligrams of the drug.[3] Upon entering a plea of guilty, Kennedy, then 30 years old, was sentenced to two years probation, periodic tests for drug use, treatment by joining Narcotics Anonymous, and 1,500 hours of community service by Presiding Judge Marshall P. Young.[4]

2001

In April 2001, Kennedy was arrested for trespassing at Camp Garcia, the United States Navy training facility on the island of Vieques, Puerto Rico. Kennedy and others were protesting the use of a small section of the island for training. The trespassing incident forced the suspension of live-fire exercises for almost 3 hours. Despite the best efforts of his counsel, former NY Governor Mario Cuomo, on 18 July 2001 Kennedy was sentenced to 30 days in jail by Judge Hector Laffitte.[5][6]


Here's a a recent rave out by Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Kennedy is also a frequent contributor at Huff Po.

Are you feeling the love from the President-elect yet? Feeling that unity?

844 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:11:07am

re: #818 legalpad

So - after he beat Hillary you got concerned?

Yep...once i realized that people actually took this joker seriously, I about freaked out. I had to do SOMETHING to stop him. So I started with the emails, the phone calls and etc. Lifelong Republican here, dad was a vet, brother a vet. And Palin joining the ticket really got me fired up in a positive way: I supported McCain AGAINST Obama, but did it holding my nose. Palin made it interesting. LGF really helped to educate me. Thank you Charles and all lizards!

845 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:11:49am

re: #836 godfrey

'Morning, real. Good point!

But then, once things have been made "fair," then the usual market forces will be brought to bear -- unless CNN et al simply want to ignore the prospect of increased ad revenue if they run more GOP-friendly content.

Maybe Ted Turner will ignore market forces "for the good of the USSA."

satellite radio, internet, technology we haven't thought of. we'll probably all be streaming on our iPhones soon enough.

846 godfrey  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:12:31am

re: #829 galloping granny

GG, one of the silver threads (not enough to be a "lining") I see in an Obama presidency is that he and Michelle have an intact, integrated family and a stable marriage. Perhaps that will be seen as a positive, but I'm not holding my breath.

847 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:12:43am

re: #736 Aussie Stinger

Good night Aussie! And see you again here - and having a rant amongst friends is good therapy!

848 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:12:49am

re: #842 laZardo

Hmm. I'd suspect that it was always so deep blue (save for Reagan) like the general Northeast that little campaigning/proselytizing would be needed at all.

Except that if you go out and actually talk to the people who live here - most of whom live in very rural areas and want nothing more than for government to get the hell out of the way - you would find it hard to believe in much blue at all other than perhaps in the single urban area of the state. Same goes for NH. My friends over there are just flabbergasted.

849 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:13:10am

re: #823 MandyManners

Don't worry! Spring is coming in a few months, and I always found that to be just as pretty.

Oh for sure. IMO, spring in Tennessee is way nice than fall because it is WARMER!
By Nov 1st every year I am praying for spring to HURRY UP!

850 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:13:11am

re: #839 MandyManners
LOL!

851 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:14:35am

re: #804 laZardo

/ watch for that.

Conservative thought will be classified as hate speech and a civil rights violation.

Chuck Schummer has already compared conservative thought to pornography.

852 godfrey  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:14:56am

re: #845 spidly

Yep, further decentralized, individualized on-demand stuff. The genie is out of the bottle. The days of networks and central thought control are over.

Cheers!

853 [deleted]  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:14:57am
854 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:15:04am

re: #739 nonic

aussiemagpie

Oh, I'm sorry. I just reread your post. You said "many years ago."

I'm a klutz. Sorry.

Me dumb. :-(

LOL! And I just replied as I hadn't got to this post!

Gawd how slow am I? This thread is bouncing along and I'm having a {realwest} moment - stop, wait for me to catch up!

855 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:15:13am

re: #848 galloping granny

Except that if you go out and actually talk to the people who live here - most of whom live in very rural areas and want nothing more than for government to get the hell out of the way - you would find it hard to believe in much blue at all other than perhaps in the single urban area of the state. Same goes for NH. My friends over there are just flabbergasted.

VT if you can legally purchase a firearm you can carry concealed. Gotta be someone on the right there

856 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:15:55am

re: #851 3 wood

So they reinstitute the Fairness Doctrine, and then how long before *filters* hit the internet?

857 godfrey  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:16:15am

re: #853 galloping granny

Integrated in the sense of mom and dad and kids all live in the same house. I wanted to avoid "nuclear."

/yes, I know all about the problems with his extended family

858 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:16:29am

and now...a blast from the past

859 jemima  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:16:37am
Christianity says to render unto Caesar his due. Communism is not Caesar's due. To go along to get along with Obama would require me to completely betray my entire moral code. Never in a million years.

I agree with you completely and I'm glad I could count on you for the specific.

There are people who are going to bend over backwards for this guy, give him a chance, out of respect for the office, let's not be like Kos etc.

We're not like Kos to begin with. He had a chance for his entire life of running for this office to prove exactly where he stands, he's not changing now. We didn't like him on Monday, here it is Saturday and we've already been treated to Rahm Emanuel, the threat of mandatory service, Jennifer Granholm and Riviera. He's trying to get something shoved thru the lame duck Congress even before he's sworn in.

I did learn something from the Holocaust. "Oh we're Germans..." I would rather over-react and be a part of the resistance now, than to think I gave him a chance to do what he's so plainly stated he was going to do.
All the wishful thinking in the world isn't going to change his lifelong (and Ayers') intentions. Govern from the center? Please!

860 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:17:12am

re: #852 godfrey

Yep, further decentralized, individualized on-demand stuff. The genie is out of the bottle. The days of networks and central thought control are over.

Cheers!

tech moving faster than the government can regulate it. I hope we can all get off the energy grid one of theses days.
Mr. Fusion

861 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:17:37am

re: #857 godfrey

Integrated in the sense of mom and dad and kids all live in the same house. I wanted to avoid "nuclear."

/yes, I know all about the problems with his extended family

You mean because they aren't divorced? That is hardly a silver thread from someone who does not want his daughters cursed with a child.

862 jemima  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:17:52am

#846

Hi Godfrey.

Stable marriage? Two words. Vera Baker.

863 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:17:58am

re: #808 godfrey

It would be nice to have some intrepid reporter follow Rivera's slime trail.

Won't happen. The MSM will be part of their Gestapo. We will have to do it as best we can from the blogosphere, until they shut us down.

Believe me folks, I grew up in Chicago, I watched the Democratic Machine here operate my whole life. I know how these people think.

They are not fooling around.

The Republicans in this State tried being magnanimous and bipartisan, and they got obliterated.

864 Dasher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:18:42am

re: #856 Wishing

So they reinstitute the Fairness Doctrine, and then how long before *filters* hit the internet?

Who determines what is fair, and what is an opposing view?

865 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:18:59am

re: #848 galloping granny

Single urban area? That county map Realwest posted shows the whole state blue, and by a lot as well.

866 doriangrey  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:19:01am

Good morning Lizards...

867 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:19:16am

re: #856 Wishing

So they reinstitute the Fairness Doctrine, and then how long before *filters* hit the internet?

They will classify and speech they do not like as a civil rights violation.
I'm sure there will be monitors watching the blogosphere like a hawk.

868 godfrey  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:19:17am

re: #860 spidly

You and me both, spidly.

869 jemima  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:19:30am

#864

Who determines what is fair, and what is an opposing view?

The professionals.

870 lawhawk  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:19:42am

re: #802 Jewels (AKA Julian)

Indeed.

871 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:19:49am

re: #864 Dasher

Who determines what is fair, and what is an opposing view?

The same people who determine what is a politcally correct statement in a classroom and what is "incorrect" and therefor subject to NO TOLERANCE as "hate speech."

872 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:20:24am

re: #867 3 wood

Given all the bureaucracy involved, it would probably be as effective as prosecuting people for downloading MP3s.

/and look how many people they've lined up so far... q;

873 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:20:27am

re: #851 3 wood
Well, given that Chuckie IS pornography, I reckon he'd have the inside track on that kind of insight!

874 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:20:27am

re: #763 yma o hyd

Hi Aussiemagpie - just slinked in again before kick off ...
Thanks - we need all the good luck we can get!

It looks seriously hard for us - we lost our best center, Gav Henson, to injury yesterday. Its dreadful - two rookies, one in the center, and one on the wing! Against Habana ... and ours is only 19, its his first ever game in the scarlet shirt ...

I'm effen nervous.

Good luck , the score right now for us

Wallabies 11 Italy 6 - after 15 minutes

Sometimes these rookies shine in their first game and Habana might just have jetlag :-)

875 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:20:31am

re: #864 Dasher

Who determines what is fair, and what is an opposing view?

The Messiah, of course.

876 Dasher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:20:39am

re: #869 jemima

#864

The professionals.

As in whores?

877 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:20:48am

re: #843 3 wood

President -elect Obama is also seriously considering Robert F. Kennedy Jr. to be the head of the EPA. Here's is some background on mr. Kennedy, besides the obvious family connections:

Criminal record


Here's a a recent rave out by Mr. Kennedy. Mr. Kennedy is also a frequent contributor at Huff Po.

Are you feeling the love from the President-elect yet? Feeling that unity?

Unholy alliance?

No, the alliance between environmentalism and Marxism is the unholy alliance.

878 jemima  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:21:23am

#876

The whores of the State, you betcha!

879 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:21:30am

Ray Kinsella: So what do you want?

Terrence Mann: I want them to leave me alone. I want them to stop looking to me for answers, to stop trying to make me speak again, write again, be a leader. I want them to start thinking for themselves. And I want my privacy!

Ray Kinsella: No ... what do you WANT? (Points to concession stand menu)

Terrence Mann: Oh ... (chuckles) a dog and a beer.

/Field of Dreams


re: #824 Sharmuta

One of the things zombie said to us before the election was we were all just as capable as s/he to dig around and research stuff for ourselves. I took up zombie's challenge and I found Osawatomie. With zombie's help- that weather underground magazine got a lot of notice. I wish others would take up zombie's challenge- s/he can't do all of it for us.

But we can all figure out what we can do for the next four years and move on it. I've asked Lizards to get involved in their local political parties because i've been there and I know for a fact one person can make a difference. We can no longer sit back and allow others to carry the water- look what a great job they've done! These republican water carriers have lost us Congress and the White House. Time to get in there and show them how Lizards get it done.

880 godfrey  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:21:37am

re: #862 jemima

I don't know about Baker. Notice I said silver "thread."

3 wood

You're right, as usual. Those guys are not playing around, and we shouldn't either.

881 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:21:54am

re: #828 realwest

Hi real, it's just beginning with these people.

I've been hearing form them for years, some of the very same people now going to Washington, that #1 on their agenda is shutting down conservative thought. They hope to criminalize it.

Just look at the Chicago media if anyone does not believe me. Other than a few smaller radio shows, no conservatives anywhere.

882 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:22:06am

re: #877 MandyManners

Eco-marxists are like watermelons.

Green on the outside, red and seedy on the inside, though their rhetoric is sweet and juicy.

/also calling RACSIT! on myself due to "watermelon" reference.

883 olivia  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:22:09am

watching and listening these past few days- senobama elected, they all know who/waht they are- press conf had been scheduled for wed, they changed it- they control the news- what news is sure to be big, drive opposition crazy- attacking govP- plan works smoothly, unteleprompted senobama has his conf- he could have said anything but the expectattions so low due to infantile stories about govP, senobama gets thru it, kinda sorta- - never ever drop suspicions about the newly elected ones- they are the ONES- they are cunning, manipulative, coldycalculating,agenda driven,sly not to be trusted- they did not learn their Sunday School lessons - we need to set good examples and call them on everything- they can't be allowed to keep getting away w/all they do -

884 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:22:24am

re: #865 laZardo

Single urban area? That county map Realwest posted shows the whole state blue, and by a lot as well.

Perhaps so, but if you come up here on the ground LaZardo, we have one big urban area - Burlington. We have a half dozen or so towns of modest size - only one of which is big enough to have a WalMart. Everything else is rural of the sort where people either farm or drive 50 miles each way to work. I don't care what some imaginary map shows. I'm telling you that if you drive up and down the streets of my town every other lawn and virtually all businesses had a McCain sign in the yard. I find it impossible to believe that the people of this town actually voted en masse for Obama.

885 yesandno  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:22:25am

re: #829 galloping granny

He will NEVER be my President Jemima. Not until the day he dies and not when he has been dead a thousand years. I do not recognize him as legitimate and have no plans to do anything to "co-operate" in the slightest. As a matter of fact, I have every intention of undermining, disobeying, disavowing and working against OBama and every single thing he stands for until my dying breath.

Christianity says to render unto Caesar his due. Communism is not Caesar's due. To go along to get along with Obama would require me to completely betray my entire moral code. Never in a million years.

You are so hesitant, it is hard to know where you stand. Why doen't you just give it to us straight, with some feeling?

/is it necessary? Keep up the great work!

886 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:23:57am

re: #786 realwest

Good morning all y'all - from a pleasant (56 degrees, going up to 68 degrees) bright and sunny Charlotte!
How is everyone this morning?

G'day darls! Hope you're OK today (sorry, yesterday) :-)

887 bombay311  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:24:24am

Now that the useful idiots have brought home a victory, its time to warm up the bus.

[Link: blog.cleveland.com...]

888 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:24:25am

re: #879 Tigger2005

OUr party will continue to be in the minority until they learn to think like conservatives again. It's not going to happen if we leave them alone.

889 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:25:17am

And fjordy has another essay up- being promoted by spencer again. Nice.

890 alien_mind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:25:39am

sorry, but they can take all these big brother service corps and stick 'em where the sun don't shine. especially the ones targeted at kids in schools.
I realize they changed it yesterday to say its a goal rather than a requirement, but I don't trust that. You know they will set it up in such a way that any kids that don't go along will be made to feel ostracized.

The plan says,
"develop national guidelines for service- learning and will give schools better tools both to develop programs and to document student experience"

document student experience. what does that mean? probably that they'll be keeping an eye on little Bobby and Suzy's service or lack thereof.

891 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:25:45am

re: #887 bombay311

The bus was always running, they just had to clean it up and fix the suspension while the celebrations were going on.

892 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:26:08am

re: #856 Wishing

So they reinstitute the Fairness Doctrine, and then how long before *filters* hit the internet?

AT&T already is trying to limit users.

NEW YORK – AT&T Inc., the country's largest Internet service provider, is testing the idea of limiting the amount of data that subscribers can use each month.

AT&T will initially apply the limits in Reno, Nev., and see about extending the practice elsewhere.

Increasingly, Internet providers across the country are placing such limits on the amount of data users can upload and download each month, as a way to curb a small number of "bandwidth hogs" who use a lot of the network capacity. For instance, 5 percent of AT&T's subscribers take up 50 percent of the capacity, spokesman Michael Coe said Tuesday.

But the restrictions that Internet providers are setting are tentative. And the companies differ on what limits to set and whether to charge users for going beyond the caps.

Starting in November, AT&T will limit downloads to 20 gigabytes per month for users of their slowest DSL service, at 768 kilobits per second. The limit increases with the speed of the plan, up to 150 gigabytes per month at the 10 megabits-per-second level.

To exceed the limits, subscribers would need to download constantly at maximum speeds for more than 42 hours, depending on the tier. In practice, use of e-mail and the Web wouldn't take a subscriber anywhere near the limit, but streaming video services like the one Netflix Inc. offers could. For example, subscribers who get downloads of 3 megabits per second have a monthly cap of 60 gigabytes, which allows for the download of about 30 DVD-quality movies.

SNIP

Maybe there are technical reasons for this. I don't know.

893 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:26:22am

re: #859 jemima

There are people who are going to bend over backwards for this guy, give him a chance, out of respect for the office, let's not be like Kos etc.

I for one, am not going to stand idly by and watch this guy turn my beloved country into Red China.

I am not going to rant and rave, but I will do everything I can to get the truth out, until they shut me off.

894 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:26:43am

re: #890 alien_mind

sorry, but they can take all these big brother service corps and stick 'em where the sun don't shine. especially the ones targeted at kids in schools.
I realize they changed it yesterday to say its a goal rather than a requirement, but I don't trust that. You know they will set it up in such a way that any kids that don't go along will be made to feel ostracized.

The plan says,
"develop national guidelines for service- learning and will give schools better tools both to develop programs and to document student experience"

document student experience. what does that mean? probably that they'll be keeping an eye on little Bobby and Suzy's service or lack thereof.

It has already started with the Girl Scouts and their new "leadership training" goals. Our kiddo refused flat out.

895 godfrey  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:26:55am

re: #889 Sharmuta

Have they commented on the mocking song Charles posted? How can anyone defend that? Seems clear enough to me.

896 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:27:11am

re: #859 jemima

I agree with you completely and I'm glad I could count on you for the specific.

There are people who are going to bend over backwards for this guy, give him a chance, out of respect for the office, let's not be like Kos etc.

We're not like Kos to begin with. He had a chance for his entire life of running for this office to prove exactly where he stands, he's not changing now. We didn't like him on Monday, here it is Saturday and we've already been treated to Rahm Emanuel, the threat of mandatory service, Jennifer Granholm and Riviera. He's trying to get something shoved thru the lame duck Congress even before he's sworn in.

I did learn something from the Holocaust. "Oh we're Germans..." I would rather over-react and be a part of the resistance now, than to think I gave him a chance to do what he's so plainly stated he was going to do.
All the wishful thinking in the world isn't going to change his lifelong (and Ayers') intentions. Govern from the center? Please!

Don't forget his swipe at Nancy Reagan, the fucking clod.

897 Spare O'Lake  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:27:31am

Good Morning LGF.
I read an opinion piece which pointed out that the election of Obama was actually the final battle in the American Civil War!
It must be just so dandy to finally be living in a post-racial country./

898 jemima  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:27:55am

I don't want to hang this all on McCain. Conservatives were screwed over from the beginning of this process. But to think that about 6 weeks ago we were talking about dragging McCain over the finish line, there's something really wrong about that.

899 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:27:58am

#782 granny

Thanks! We might try that this year -- if there are enough leftovers. :-)

900 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:28:24am

re: #895 godfrey

Have they commented on the mocking song Charles posted? How can anyone defend that? Seems clear enough to me.

Apparently, the response to the song is to post another fjordy essay. That should speak clearly enough.

901 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:28:34am

re: #892 MandyManners

SNIP

Maybe there are technical reasons for this. I don't know.

They've tried this in the past back when most people were on dial-up. I suspect that this will go over like lead balloons for ATT. It is still easy enough to change service providers and there is nowhere that any one provider has a lock on things.

902 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:29:16am

re: #884 galloping granny

Probably not one town. But the county overall, more likely.

903 Miss Trixie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:29:18am

&#9834 &#9836 Good morning {lizards!} &#9836 &#9834

Rainy and damp in the valley today and everyone KNOWS what always follows 2 days of rain.

Monday. :D

904 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:30:00am

re: #894 galloping granny

It has already started with the Girl Scouts and their new "leadership training" goals. Our kiddo refused flat out.

What is that?

905 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:30:04am

re: #899 nonic

#782 granny

Thanks! We might try that this year -- if there are enough leftovers. :-)

Like I said, I've had to make turkey dinners solely and entirely for the production of Leftover Pie. Most years I just cook two turkeys while they're cheap.

906 bombay311  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:30:06am

re: #901 galloping granny

It is still easy enough to change service providers and there is nowhere that any one provider has a lock on things.

...yet

907 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:30:37am

re: #890 alien_mind

"You want those kids to grow up fat and lazy like a soon-to-be-majority of Americans are becoming?!"

/

//but srsly, community service was mandatory in my high school along with many others here...I don't see how bad, or rather, how much more different it would be over there from over here where the general standard of living isn't as high.

908 jemima  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:30:46am

#892 Mandy

My friend is in Orlando with an AT&T connection and he's already limited. He's on a dialup with about 24k which gives him crawl speed. He has to go to the library with WIFI for extra downloading. (In Finland by the Arctic Circle they have 10X broadband speed.)

909 godfrey  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:30:54am

re: #896 MandyManners

That one, and the middle finger business, convinces me that Obama is simply immature, even adolescent. During his first briefing by the Joint Chiefs, I expect he'll damn near soil his pants and then make some idiotic joke to alleviate his own tension. And then everyone in the room will look at each other in horror and disbelief, and we will all be in very serious trouble.

He's a weak king, at the mercy of his advisors.

910 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:31:16am

re: #901 galloping granny

They've tried this in the past back when most people were on dial-up. I suspect that this will go over like lead balloons for ATT. It is still easy enough to change service providers and there is nowhere that any one provider has a lock on things.

Let's hear it for busting up the telephone trust!

911 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:31:28am

re: #892 MandyManners

SNIP

Maybe there are technical reasons for this. I don't know.

I think this comes as a result of things like BitTorrent, where people are downloading scads of movies, using up huge amounts of bandwidth. I think it was Comcast that began to hunt down the big users and to limit their download times, etc. Greed has caused this country a ton of trouble, this is just one more case. The ISP's provided the service, the people paid for it and now the same companies are punishing those that use the service they paid for.

912 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:32:27am

re: #893 3 wood

I am not going to rant and rave, but I will do everything I can to get the truth out, until they shut me off.

We can't let it get to that point. And if we're not willing to do whatever is necessary to keep it from reaching that point, we don't deserve liberty.

"Where then is the road to peace? You and I having the courage to say to our enemies there is a line they may not cross, there is a point beyond which they may not advance."

913 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:32:40am

re: #881 3 wood
Well I'm not going to argue that if they could the Dems would shut down conservative thought because they are not really Dems anymore - they are leftists.
Period.
But, OTOH, we conservatives* would never consider having the government shut down Air America for example.
I hope all the conservatives who stayed home THIS election (rather than vote for McCain) are pleased with their efforts.
*the terms conservative and liberal have - I would suggest - lost most if any meaning they had left.
Charles, for example has said he was a liberal before 9/11. And of course the Left villify him (as do the nazis, neo and old style) today.
Still and all I do wish the MSM would stop using terms like liberal and conservative: I consider myself conservative, but I don't want the government enforcing any sort of "religious" ideas or behavior on me, so that puts me perpetually on the outs with the so-called Religious Right politically
and Obama is to Democrats what I am to Repubicans in that regard. We just need new terms and from that new alliances/foes.

914 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:32:47am

re: #908 jemima

#892 Mandy

My friend is in Orlando with an AT&T connection and he's already limited. He's on a dialup with about 24k which gives him crawl speed. He has to go to the library with WIFI for extra downloading. (In Finland by the Arctic Circle they have 10X broadband speed.)

I've heard that other nations are far superior to us in this area. WHY?

915 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:33:07am

re: #892 MandyManners

That's not going to be good for gamers by the sound of things...with multiplayer games becoming bigger and more complex (a recently released PS3 game promises 60-player action!) they'll not only need a fast connection but to play it on full capacity in order to prevent excess 'lag' or 'ping.'

916 shanec99  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:33:34am

re: #892 MandyManners
If the Fairness doctrine gets instituted it might not be such a bad idea... can you imagine NBC, ABC, CBS, MSNBC, CNN etc being forced to give conservative commentatoros equal time.

I cannot imagine there being a down side to that. What we would have to push for in the fairness doctrine is equal time over the entire electronic "information space."

Someone please tell me where the down side would be.

917 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:34:13am

re: #909 godfrey

That one, and the middle finger business, convinces me that Obama is simply immature, even adolescent. During his first briefing by the Joint Chiefs, I expect he'll damn near soil his pants and then make some idiotic joke to alleviate his own tension. And then everyone in the room will look at each other in horror and disbelief, and we will all be in very serious trouble.

He's a weak king, at the mercy of his advisors.

I get this image of a marionette.

Where's Soros lately? Will he be seated in the first two rows at the inauguration? First guest in the Lincoln Bedroom?

918 jemima  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:34:22am

#909

He's like Edward VI.

He cannot be an emotionally stable person with his family history. There's nothing that can be said to convince me otherwise. No father, no mother and white grandparents he inherently disliked raising him. Mentored by a drug taking pervert (Frank Marshall Davis).

I think the reason we don't have his full medical records is that he has been treated for depression or something in the past. In high school and college, he was self-medicating.

919 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:34:22am

Byt he way, for anybody who had not heard this story before, here's a little tidbit on the new Chief of Staff, Rahm Emanuel, and his bipartisanship:

Emanuel is said to have "mailed a rotten fish to a former coworker after the two parted ways."[7] On the night after the 1996 election, "Emanuel was so angry at the president's enemies that he stood up at a celebratory dinner with colleagues from the campaign, grabbed a steak knife and began rattling off a list of betrayers, shouting 'Dead! ... Dead! ... Dead!' and plunging the knife into the table after every name."[6

Also, Emanuel likes to point to a point to a missing middle finger on his right hand and claim it happened during his services with the IDS. But this is how he actually hurt his finger:

At some point during his high school years, while working at an Arby's restaurant, Emanuel severely injured his right middle finger. Rather than seek medical treatment, he went swimming in Lake Michigan. He sought medical attention only after suffering severe infection as a result of the wound, resulting in the amputation of the finger.

Also, Mr. Emanuel is in favor of compulsory public service.

In his book, Emanuel advocated a 3 month compulsory universal service program for Americans between the ages of 18 and 25. [29]

Are you feeling the love from Obama yet folks?

920 godfrey  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:34:33am

One more thing and I've got to run: the idea of Obama getting any kind of security clearance is deeply unsettling. That he, whom Bill Ayers and Rash Khalidi consider a friend, is going to get the absolute highest US security clearance is terrifying.

921 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:34:49am

re: #904 MandyManners

What is that?

I would have to go out to the car and rummage around to see if the flier is still out there to explain it thoroughly. A year or so ago we were notified that the Vermont Girl Scout Council was being forced by national to combine with the New Hampshire Council. New Hampshire is centered on the coast and has a very different philosophy. We had already noticed that things you and I would recognize as "Girl Scouts" have simply disappeared - no motto, the law has changed, the Promise has changed. Drastically. All of the badges (and there are nowhere near as many) now demand a volunteer/public service component that is specified with exactitude. So, when we got the new brochure for the fall/winter programs it came with a list of "leadership goals" and each activity was specified as to which goal it fulfilled, much like an ed plan for a special needs child. The kiddo took one look and pitched it to the four winds. Says she wants nothing to do with Girl Scouts anymore.

922 Edgar  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:34:51am

re: #893 3 wood

I for one, am not going to stand idly by and watch this guy turn my beloved country into Red China.

I am not going to rant and rave, but I will do everything I can to get the truth out, until they shut me off.

Nobody is going to shut you off.

923 vxbush  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:35:02am

Quick hello. This shot from Michelle Malkin says everything you need to know about Obama's coming administration, methinks. It's a page from Obama's change.gov website.

924 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:35:05am

re: #897 Spare O'Lake

Good Morning LGF.
I read an opinion piece which pointed out that the election of Obama was actually the final battle in the American Civil War!

And the beginning of the next one!

925 Miss Trixie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:35:29am

re: #769 christheprofessor

#729 LoZardo

Heh. Minila gets not respect...

First day with your new fingers? :P

I see Lightning is as loverly as ever - check out my new avatar ... :D

926 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:35:32am

re: #915 laZardo

That's not going to be good for gamers by the sound of things...with multiplayer games becoming bigger and more complex (a recently released PS3 game promises 60-player action!) they'll not only need a fast connection but to play it on full capacity in order to prevent excess 'lag' or 'ping.'

Well, I hadn't thought about the gamer-angle. Maybe THAT will get some up off the couch and into the streets.

927 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:35:39am

re: #886 aussiemagpie
Hey there {aussie} - yeah, I'm doing ok yesterday - how'm I gonna be doing tomorrow?!? LOL!
How's things with you whatever day it is for ya?!

928 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:35:58am

re: #923 vxbush

NATIONAL SERVICE PLAN FAIL.

929 Edgar  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:36:20am

re: #919 3 wood

Maybe he had an unpaid debt?

930 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:36:31am

re: #916 shanec99

If the Fairness doctrine gets instituted it might not be such a bad idea... can you imagine NBC, ABC, CBS, MSNBC, CNN etc being forced to give conservative commentatoros equal time.

I cannot imagine there being a down side to that. What we would have to push for in the fairness doctrine is equal time over the entire electronic "information space."

Someone please tell me where the down side would be.

The complete elimination of talk radio.

931 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:36:40am

re: #907 laZardo

"You want those kids to grow up fat and lazy like a soon-to-be-majority of Americans are becoming?!"

/

//but srsly, community service was mandatory in my high school along with many others here...I don't see how bad, or rather, how much more different it would be over there from over here where the general standard of living isn't as high.

It isn't a matter of whether or not it would be "BAD." Mandatory "volunteering" is UNAMERICAN. Following American ideals is not a consideration in your nation.

932 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:37:47am

re: #919 3 wood

Byt he way, for anybody who had not heard this story before, here's a little tidbit on the new Chief of Staff, Rahm Emanuel, and his bipartisanship:


Are you feeling the love from Obama yet folks?

Color me juvenile but, I like the fish thing.

933 bombay311  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:38:06am

I have no problem with mandatory community service for children,
children of people receiving public assistance money and tax credits that is

934 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:38:23am

re: #914 MandyManners

I've heard that other nations are far superior to us in this area. WHY?

they were late comers to the whole thing so got in when the technology was better. many of the early markets in the US need to be re-done. remember that cable was going in the US in the late 70's. we had ours in a small Oregon town in 1978. Into the 90's in Denmark for example you had 3 broadcast TV stations DK1 DK2 and the swedish station.also much higher population densities cuts costs there

935 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:38:32am

So long, gang. Everybody have good day.

Keep your sense of humor.

Remember, this too shall pass.

936 vxbush  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:38:35am

re: #928 laZardo

NATIONAL SERVICE PLAN FAIL.

Yes, but the continued lack of control over parts of the website speaks very poorly for Obama's PR folks. It's a slip like this on something a bit more important that could cause a serious international incident.

937 Right Brain  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:38:39am

re: #830 yesandno

Not sure exactly your point: the Chinese launched two manned space vehicles and English is not much spoken there. The Japanese have always been on the forefront of science, although not space, and there is no English spoken there (half my family lives there, I go frequently).

English is certainly useful to the Indians for travel and commerce, but the Europeans in general speak English, and what good has it done them.

No, there is some lack of bravado, a lack of futurity, that afflicts the Europeans; all they have is there private belief that they are smart and the Americans are stupid. But now that they are being left behind by third world countries, it has to be strange living there, and mountingly difficult to maintain their belief system.

938 mitthrawnurdo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:38:41am

re: #916 shanec99

Because the "Fairness Doctrine" (lets call it by it's real name, the "Hush Rush" law) wouldn't be applied equally to TV and radio. Look who the new FEC person is... You're assuming that an unbiased arbitrator would be administering this law.

939 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:38:42am

"U.S. reassures Poland anti-missile shield program will continue (Reuters)"

Hum, that would be the U.S. that is in power 3 more months I gather?

940 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:39:07am

re: #921 galloping granny

I would have to go out to the car and rummage around to see if the flier is still out there to explain it thoroughly. A year or so ago we were notified that the Vermont Girl Scout Council was being forced by national to combine with the New Hampshire Council. New Hampshire is centered on the coast and has a very different philosophy. We had already noticed that things you and I would recognize as "Girl Scouts" have simply disappeared - no motto, the law has changed, the Promise has changed. Drastically. All of the badges (and there are nowhere near as many) now demand a volunteer/public service component that is specified with exactitude. So, when we got the new brochure for the fall/winter programs it came with a list of "leadership goals" and each activity was specified as to which goal it fulfilled, much like an ed plan for a special needs child. The kiddo took one look and pitched it to the four winds. Says she wants nothing to do with Girl Scouts anymore.

Whose idea was this? Are the Clintonistas now in charge?

941 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:39:16am

re: #931 galloping granny

Even though the Americans did rule us for 40-odd years. q; But then again, we are poor over here and we need the mobilization/help we can get.

942 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:39:33am

re: #916 shanec99

What we would have to push for in the fairness doctrine is equal time over the entire electronic "information space."

Someone please tell me where the down side would be.

Ok...so Charles would be required to ALSO sponsor another blog called, Bright Pink Softballs? Give me a break! To REQUIRE equal time removes us from the Land of the Free to the gulag.

943 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:39:35am

re: #788 Aussie Stinger

___ ___

Haha, smart-ass!

Nothin' better than lying on the couch on a Saturday arvo watching the cricket, enjoying a cool one and a beautiful summer's breeze to cool down the temp.

Great game.

aussie magpie, remember this match:

[Link: au.youtube.com...]

Who can forget.

100,000 fans on their feet going crazy.

Thanks for posting that video!

We were THERE! I t was just a wonderful experience - it was a really hot day and I spent a little time inside the concourse in the shade, near the bar and the beer being splashed over my feet by happy drinkers was actually welcome - mm icy cold beer all over my feet!

Met some lovely Poms that day, who had come here for the Ashes

944 Right Brain  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:39:37am

re: #841 Tigger2005

My take is Obama has such a big ego that we will be on Mars before the end of his first term.

945 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:39:52am

re: #907 laZardo

"You want those kids to grow up fat and lazy like a soon-to-be-majority of Americans are becoming?!"

/

//but srsly, community service was mandatory in my high school along with many others here...I don't see how bad, or rather, how much more different it would be over there from over here where the general standard of living isn't as high.

Because that is usually decided on a community basis - and so the school board is still accountable to the parents. Once a large federal bureaucracy is created to administer all of this where does it end? Will scouting hours be counted? If so, scouts are chartered by churches - churches will be enmeshed with the government even more so.

And then imagine all the make-work necessary for 100 million kids. Won't this be tasking jobs away from legitimate workers? Small scale this will work - but not on this massive scale - with government bureacrats in charge of the children and their minds. It's harder than you think to find work for kids that is safe and productive - and doesn't infringe on legitimate workers.

946 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:40:35am

re: #931 galloping granny

It isn't a matter of whether or not it would be "BAD." Mandatory "volunteering" is UNAMERICAN. Following American ideals is not a consideration in your nation.

It's not voluntary at that point. It's VOLUNTOLD.

947 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:40:54am

re: #914 MandyManners

I've heard that other nations are far superior to us in this area. WHY?

A couple of reasons.

1. We limit the speed things can travel over dial up by law - 53K, no matter how fast your modem is.

2. We had universal phone service before most of the rest of the world had phones. As an example, when I lived in Germany - West - there were two phones in the entire town. My landlord's business phone and the pay phone on the corner. Thus, much of our telephone infrastructure is decades old and the phone companies don't want to replace it.

948 reine.de.tout  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:41:00am

re: #916 shanec99

If the Fairness doctrine gets instituted it might not be such a bad idea... can you imagine NBC, ABC, CBS, MSNBC, CNN etc being forced to give conservative commentatoros equal time.

I cannot imagine there being a down side to that. What we would have to push for in the fairness doctrine is equal time over the entire electronic "information space."

Someone please tell me where the down side would be.

Downside to this - The "Fairness Doctrine" would not be used for the purpose of forcing ABC NBC CBS MSNBC CNN etc. to include MORE conservative voices, as those institutions do not believe they are biased in the first place.

The only "bias" they believe exists is with Rush, Hannity, etc., and the "Fairness Doctrine" would be used to limit those voices.

949 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:41:16am

re: #933 bombay311

I have no problem with mandatory community service for children,
children of people receiving public assistance money and tax credits that is

WTF?

950 QueenOfCups  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:41:19am

The schools here require it, too.

I think the good or bad of it depends on what their choices are to serve those hours. Will kids get credit for hours volunteered for service to their own churches, or will it all have to be ACORN approved service?

951 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:41:28am

re: #933 bombay311

I have no problem with mandatory community service for children,
children of people receiving public assistance money and tax credits that is

I do. People receiving public assistance are every bit as much entitled to the protections of the Constitution as you are.

952 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:41:29am

re: #916 shanec99

If the Fairness doctrine gets instituted it might not be such a bad idea... can you imagine NBC, ABC, CBS, MSNBC, CNN etc being forced to give conservative commentatoros equal time.

I cannot imagine there being a down side to that. What we would have to push for in the fairness doctrine is equal time over the entire electronic "information space."

Someone please tell me where the down side would be.

Because you would haver ACORN-THUG types as the administrators - making arbitrasry decisions

953 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:41:37am

re: #936 vxbush

My guess is that at worst it'll end up on failblog.org.

954 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:41:43am

re: #933 bombay311

I have no problem with mandatory community service for children,
children of people receiving public assistance money and tax credits that is

That's forcing MINORS to pay for their parents' debts.

955 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:42:00am

re: #900 Sharmuta

OT: Joined the GOP Sharm.

re: #797 christheprofessor

Howdy CTP.

Is everyone's post-election hangover over? Ready to get back to the battle?

956 vxbush  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:42:05am

re: #953 laZardo

My guess is that at worst it'll end up on failblog.org.

HA! Nice.

957 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:42:18am

re: #800 Wishing

Heh...it reminds of people saying they are *going to the Walmart*. The definite article implies importance, perhaps. I prefer to watch the football, but the sentiment is the same: IT ROCKS! (same cant be said about the Walmart tho)
Do you have the Walmart down under?

No Walmart Down Under! Yet...

958 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:42:19am

re: #934 spidly

they were late comers to the whole thing so got in when the technology was better. many of the early markets in the US need to be re-done. remember that cable was going in the US in the late 70's. we had ours in a small Oregon town in 1978. Into the 90's in Denmark for example you had 3 broadcast TV stations DK1 DK2 and the swedish station.also much higher population densities cuts costs there

That makes sense.

959 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:42:26am

re: #932 MandyManners

Color me juvenile but, I like the fish thing.

hahahahha

960 shanec99  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:42:34am

re: #930 MandyManners

The complete elimination of talk radio.

Could not happen.

The financial implications (advertisers etc) would be too great (along with something about free speech and the bill of rights).

The only thing the government can do constitutionally regarding free speech is increase opportunities for citizens to exercise their right to free speech, it can do nothing to restrict free speech. It would be unconstitutional.

Then they would have a bruising fight on their hand they would ultimately loose if they did anything to infringe on press or free speech freedom.

961 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:42:41am

re: #916 shanec99

If the Fairness doctrine gets instituted it might not be such a bad idea... can you imagine NBC, ABC, CBS, MSNBC, CNN etc being forced to give conservative commentatoros equal time.

I cannot imagine there being a down side to that. What we would have to push for in the fairness doctrine is equal time over the entire electronic "information space."

Someone please tell me where the down side would be.

Your mistake, I think, is in assuming that they mean to be even handed.

They mean to obliterate opposition.

They will define hard left thought as "fair". Anything conservative will be labeled hate speech and a civil rights violation.

962 bombay311  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:42:57am

re: #949 MandyManners

what Im saying is if you're going to force community service on people, it should be forced on those who are getting the money from the govt for sitting on their ass

963 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:42:57am

re: #940 MandyManners

I'm starting to get why Hillary seemed to go down without a fight.

964 Crusty  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:43:01am

So my scorecard says that, in less than 3 days of becoming elected, Obama has:

-Hijacked power via inventing an "Office of the President-Elect" and taking over a .gov domain
-Proposed reinstating slavery via his unconstitutional "required" community service program
-Insulted the widow of a deceased president in a karma-tempting statement

I'm gonna need a bigger scorecard...

965 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:43:12am

re: #956 vxbush

Half-sarc, of course, but thanks.

966 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:43:13am

re: #955 unclassifiable

OT: Joined the GOP Sharm.

Awesome!

967 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:43:20am

re: #950 QueenOfCups

The schools here require it, too.

I think the good or bad of it depends on what their choices are to serve those hours. Will kids get credit for hours volunteered for service to their own churches, or will it all have to be ACORN approved service?

People who insist on universal community service for their children are certainly welcome to move to anywhere in the world where that is legal. It isn't here.

Americans already donate more time - both collectively and individually - more money and more expertise than any other nation on earth. Sometimes more than all other nations on earth combined. WE DO ENOUGH - and we do it because we want to.

968 mitthrawnurdo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:43:22am

re: #955 unclassifiable

The battle never ends.

969 reine.de.tout  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:43:33am

re: #951 galloping granny

I do. People receiving public assistance are every bit as much entitled to the protections of the Constitution as you are.

I'm with you Granny.

"Community service" should not be mandatory. It exists at my daughter's school, and I don't like it one bit. The "service" that they "count" is limited. For instance, when my daughter goes and mows my 85-year-old neighbor's 3 acres of land, that does not count. It should.

970 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:43:40am

The GOP needs a Lizardlanche

971 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:43:56am

re: #947 galloping granny

A couple of reasons.

1. We limit the speed things can travel over dial up by law - 53K, no matter how fast your modem is.

2. We had universal phone service before most of the rest of the world had phones. As an example, when I lived in Germany - West - there were two phones in the entire town. My landlord's business phone and the pay phone on the corner. Thus, much of our telephone infrastructure is decades old and the phone companies don't want to replace it.

What could be an incentive for them to replace it?

972 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:44:31am

re: #903 {Miss Trixie}
ROFL! Good morning gorgeous! *Smoochies* to you!
Listen you know if they predict rain there's every chance you'll have sunshine, doncha?
Heck they predicted rain for this morning down here and you couldn't ask for more beautiful, sunny skies.
I do hear, however, that the ENTIRE state of Texas is gonna get nothing but rain forever! LOL!

973 reine.de.tout  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:45:25am

re: #960 shanec99

Could not happen.

The financial implications (advertisers etc) would be too great (along with something about free speech and the bill of rights).

The only thing the government can do constitutionally regarding free speech is increase opportunities for citizens to exercise their right to free speech, it can do nothing to restrict free speech. It would be unconstitutional.

Then they would have a bruising fight on their hand they would ultimately loose if they did anything to infringe on press or free speech freedom.

The "Fairness Doctrine" is limitation of speech dressed up in pretty language with a pretty name.

Its intention is to limit speech that the enforcers have deemed to be "unfair".

974 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:45:33am

re: #969 reine.de.tout

I'm with you Granny.

"Community service" should not be mandatory. It exists at my daughter's school, and I don't like it one bit. The "service" that they "count" is limited. For instance, when my daughter goes and mows my 85-year-old neighbor's 3 acres of land, that does not count. It should.

Absolutely that should count. Which is one of the reasons that I am dead set against it.

975 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:45:36am

re: #954 MandyManners

That's forcing MINORS to pay for their parents' debts.

The children are NOT debtors to the state - They owe the state NOTHING! They are children. They should not be trained to look to government to tell them what to do and how high to jump. The worst aspect that is part of their designs is to create opportunites for these older kids to be alone - away from parents - so that they can encourage them to be de-moralized. The soviet ex-KGB guy said this is part of the process so that they will slowly lose the ability to know right from wrong.

976 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:46:06am

re: #960 shanec99

Could not happen.

The financial implications (advertisers etc) would be too great (along with something about free speech and the bill of rights).

The only thing the government can do constitutionally regarding free speech is increase opportunities for citizens to exercise their right to free speech, it can do nothing to restrict free speech. It would be unconstitutional.

Then they would have a bruising fight on their hand they would ultimately loose if they did anything to infringe on press or free speech freedom.

It is their avowed determination to shut it down. When someone tells me what he intends to do, I am inclined to believe him.

977 shanec99  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:46:24am

re: #938 mitthrawnurdo

Because the "Fairness Doctrine" (lets call it by it's real name, the "Hush Rush" law) wouldn't be applied equally to TV and radio. Look who the new FEC person is... You're assuming that an unbiased arbitrator would be administering this law.

It would have to apply... it would ultimately be a free speech issue... government has not right to restrict speech (that is why the left wingers can burn flags). It can facilitate speech by increasing the opportunities, not decrease citizens rights to free expression or infringe on the freedom of the press.

It could be an expensive fight, but with our current Supreme Court they would lose.

978 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:46:39am

re: #933 bombay311

I have no problem with mandatory community service for children,
children of people receiving public assistance money and tax credits that is

Yeh that is an American idea...make the children pay for the lifestyles of their parents.
Or did you forget the /sarc tag, I hope?

979 reine.de.tout  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:46:54am

re: #950 QueenOfCups

The schools here require it, too.

I think the good or bad of it depends on what their choices are to serve those hours. Will kids get credit for hours volunteered for service to their own churches, or will it all have to be ACORN approved service?

My guess: It will have to be ACORN approved service.
As it is now, some things don't count. See:
re: #969 reine.de.tout

. . . The "service" that they "count" is limited. For instance, when my daughter goes and mows my 85-year-old neighbor's 3 acres of land, that does not count. It should.

980 Miss Trixie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:46:56am

{realwest} Good morning, sweets *smooochie* Glad to see you today - how are you?

981 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:47:20am

re: #922 Edgar

Nobody is going to shut you off.

I hope you are correct, but after living in Chicago for many years, I have my doubts.

982 Ojoe  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:47:34am

re: #964 Crusty

All we citizens need to pray to keep him on the straight and narrow, also send him Emails and letters when, or before he screws up.

This would be part of what Obama meant by bringing us together, I think.

Well here is the morning light on —
The San Gabriel Mountains of California. (The Towercam). Pacific time zone.

Good morning all.

983 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:47:48am

re: #962 bombay311

what Im saying is if you're going to force community service on people, it should be forced on those who are getting the money from the govt for sitting on their ass

Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime where of the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
Section 2. Congress shall have the power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

I don't see such a caveat there.

984 mitthrawnurdo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:47:59am

re: #960 shanec99

No. Radio station owners, upon reinstitution of the Fairness Doctrine (Hush Rush law), will simply stop running those "controversal" right-leaning shows so they doesn't have to deal with the FEC.

Wonder why there were only about 120 radio station shows (according to Rush) before the Fairness Doctrine was stopped, while there are over 2000 today?

985 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:48:06am

re: #971 MandyManners

What could be an incentive for them to replace it?

It isn't that they need an incentive exactly. It is a huge undertaking. I don't know the exact figures but I would guess that there are literally billions of miles of old telephone wire to be replaced - particularly in older urban areas. We waited 5 years+ for DSL a few years back. Finally moved to a newish condo where we could get it. Here we got DSL only by paying the phone company to install a dedicated line.

986 lawhawk  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:48:10am

re: #892 MandyManners

They're trying to find ways to maximize price and profit, and figure that they might be able to charge people more for usage, rather than by time. Heavy users get a benefit when price is based strictly on time. Some of the companies may be concerned that they lack the capacity to handle all the traffic as more people shift to high speed service and the number of heavy users increase.

It's a real tricky issue.

987 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:48:12am

So let me get this straight Obama is ready to sit down with some of the worst scum of the earth but he is afraid to let FOX news ask a question?

988 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:48:24am

re: #912 Tigger2005
Good morning Tigger

"Where then is the road to peace? You and I having the courage to say to our enemies there is a line they may not cross, there is a point beyond which they may not advance."

sounds nice but doesn't mean ANYTHING unless you (we) are prepared to do SOMETHING if they cross that particular point or line.
And what is that something we are prepared to do?

989 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:48:29am

re: #963 laZardo

I'm starting to get why Hillary seemed to go down without a fight.

I still think it was economic.

990 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:48:41am

re: #929 Edgar

Maybe he had an unpaid debt?

They break your knees for that. I know guys that happened to. We had to hide out a college buddy for 6 months until he could pay off his debt to the bookie.

991 mitthrawnurdo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:49:15am

re: #977 shanec99

People assumed that the Supreme Court would stop McCain-Feingold from being made into law. They were wrong.

992 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:49:21am

re: #988 realwest

Good morning Tigger

sounds nice but doesn't mean ANYTHING unless you (we) are prepared to do SOMETHING if they cross that particular point or line.
And what is that something we are prepared to do?

We are prepared to move the line?

993 bombay311  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:50:00am

re: #975 DistantThunder

I are: #978 Wishing

Yes, I was half joking, but every time I read what the One wants to try to do, I start to not think so straight.

994 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:50:01am

re: #982 Ojoe

All we citizens need to pray to keep him on the straight and narrow, also send him Emails and letters when, or before he screws up.

This would be part of what Obama meant by bringing us together, I think.

Well here is the morning light on —
The San Gabriel Mountains of California. (The Towercam). Pacific time zone.

Good morning all.

My prayers for Obama do not include keeping him on the straight and narrow. I doubt he could locate the straight and narrow with a map and a flashlight.

995 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:50:09am

re: #969 reine.de.tout

I'm with you Granny.

"Community service" should not be mandatory. It exists at my daughter's school, and I don't like it one bit. The "service" that they "count" is limited. For instance, when my daughter goes and mows my 85-year-old neighbor's 3 acres of land, that does not count. It should.

Nooo. It must be performed to the greater glory of the community, not to pesky individuals.

996 vxbush  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:50:12am

People, the fairness doctrine used to be in place. It used to be one of the rules. I believe buzzsawmonkey had a great explanation for why it made sense before and doesn't now, but that won't matter. I could easily see the rule being extended to cover blogs. Should it? Heavens, no. But I would expect an argument to come out for it in a few weeks.

997 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:50:20am

re: #922 Edgar
So do we have your personal guaranty that nobody is going to shut 3 wood (or any of the rest of us) off?

998 Miss Trixie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:50:30am

re: #972 realwest

ROFL! Good morning gorgeous! *Smoochies* to you!
Listen you know if they predict rain there's every chance you'll have sunshine, doncha?
Heck they predicted rain for this morning down here and you couldn't ask for more beautiful, sunny skies.
I do hear, however, that the ENTIRE state of Texas is gonna get nothing but rain forever! LOL!

SUCH a smartypants! LOLOLOL! :D

999 shanec99  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:50:43am

re: #942 Wishing

Ok...so Charles would be required to ALSO sponsor another blog called, Bright Pink Softballs? Give me a break! To REQUIRE equal time removes us from the Land of the Free to the gulag.

No the ISP would be forced to provide internet access to a Liberal spot by the name of Bright Pink Softballs, (p.s. there is no restriction for blogs, Liberals can do it anytime now)... and no one would go there.

1000 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:51:01am

re: #975 DistantThunder

The children are NOT debtors to the state - They owe the state NOTHING! They are children. They should not be trained to look to government to tell them what to do and how high to jump. The worst aspect that is part of their designs is to create opportunites for these older kids to be alone - away from parents - so that they can encourage them to be de-moralized. The soviet ex-KGB guy said this is part of the process so that they will slowly lose the ability to know right from wrong.

Exactly. And, it would be a sexual predator's dream.

1001 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:51:52am

re: #977 shanec99

It would have to apply... it would ultimately be a free speech issue... government has not right to restrict speech (that is why the left wingers can burn flags). It can facilitate speech by increasing the opportunities, not decrease citizens rights to free expression or infringe on the freedom of the press.

It could be an expensive fight, but with our current Supreme Court they would lose.

To my knowledge, the bandwidth of radio is limited.

1002 Crusty  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:52:09am

re: #982 Ojoe

All we citizens need to pray to keep him on the straight and narrow, also send him Emails and letters when, or before he screws up.

This would be part of what Obama meant by bringing us together, I think.

Well here is the morning light on —
The San Gabriel Mountains of California. (The Towercam). Pacific time zone.

Good morning all.

It's nice thought but dictators are not influenced by e-mails and letters. If he does not hold himself accountable to the Constitution or the law, what would make him think he's accountable to Americans?

1003 akak  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:52:11am

Yesterday I figured it would take a day or two for the McCain aides to be named and innocent people would start being blamed. Now that innocent people are being blamed - it is a matter of time before the names come out. Hopefully their political careers are over - even before the tars & feathers.

1004 Ojoe  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:52:27am

re: #973 reine.de.tout

re: #916 shanec99

The fairness doctrine is fabulously unconstitutional.

1005 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:52:46am

re: #986 lawhawk

They're trying to find ways to maximize price and profit, and figure that they might be able to charge people more for usage, rather than by time. Heavy users get a benefit when price is based strictly on time. Some of the companies may be concerned that they lack the capacity to handle all the traffic as more people shift to high speed service and the number of heavy users increase.

It's a real tricky issue.

Agree lawhawk and I am not ready to condemn the ISP's at this point.

1006 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:53:08am

Just listened to President-Elect Obama's speech on YouTube -- I was in Mexico and the news there is dominated by the disintegrating security situation.

Mr. Obama does not have a plan of his own other than an outline of what he wants from Congress. In that sense that "seems" executive but lacks leadership.

I'm afraid the leadership will come from the likes of Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid. That to me seems even more disturbing.

1007 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:53:12am

re: #985 galloping granny

It isn't that they need an incentive exactly. It is a huge undertaking. I don't know the exact figures but I would guess that there are literally billions of miles of old telephone wire to be replaced - particularly in older urban areas. We waited 5 years+ for DSL a few years back. Finally moved to a newish condo where we could get it. Here we got DSL only by paying the phone company to install a dedicated line.

Remember Chile and the need for copper mines to produce the wire?

1008 jemima  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:53:16am

In a Free Market, viable companies continue, weak or ineffective companies fail. That is capitalism.

In socialism non- viable entities like Air America are propped up unnaturally, forced upon a populace that obviously does not support what they offer.

The very notion of the Fairness Doctrine is unAmerican. It will be used to control the citizenry and quiet the enemies of the State.

1009 Ojoe  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:53:32am

re: #1002 Crusty

The carrot of the 2nd term, and "his place in history".

1010 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:53:34am

re: #989 MandyManners

I still think it was economic.

I think her price was to be the next Supreme Court Justice.

Then see what happens with the Fairness Doctrine.

1011 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:53:43am

re: #927 realwest

Hey there {aussie} - yeah, I'm doing ok yesterday - how'm I gonna be doing tomorrow?!? LOL!
How's things with you whatever day it is for ya?!

Hi, I'm watching the rugby being played in Italy - Ymr is also watching Wales play South Africa - it's a big rugby comp

Score: Wallabies 14 Italy 14 at halftime

Nailbiting stuff :-) Chomp chomp

Ask me on my Monday how you'll be tomorrow! :-)

1012 thedude  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:53:51am

this link will bring tears to your eyes...
[Link: jalopnik.com...]

1013 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:53:59am

re: #986 lawhawk

They're trying to find ways to maximize price and profit, and figure that they might be able to charge people more for usage, rather than by time. Heavy users get a benefit when price is based strictly on time. Some of the companies may be concerned that they lack the capacity to handle all the traffic as more people shift to high speed service and the number of heavy users increase.

It's a real tricky issue.

It's way above my pay-grade.

1014 mitthrawnurdo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:54:18am

re: #1010 3 wood

Souls (and principles) are cheap these days, no?

1015 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:54:51am

re: #969 reine.de.tout

I'm with you Granny.

"Community service" should not be mandatory. It exists at my daughter's school, and I don't like it one bit. The "service" that they "count" is limited. For instance, when my daughter goes and mows my 85-year-old neighbor's 3 acres of land, that does not count. It should.

Absolutely, it should count - and it is the best type of service because it is an obvious immediate need - and the child can build a relationship with the neighbor. Maybe they think the soup lines will be so long - they'll have to build more kitchens and our students can work for those.

Unfortunately they've found a virulent strain of TB in soup kitchens due to the homeless pop7ulations - see what I mean? Not safe for kids.

1016 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:54:51am

re: #955 unclassifiable

OT: Joined the GOP Sharm.

re: #797 christheprofessor

Howdy CTP.

Is everyone's post-election hangover over? Ready to get back to the battle?

Some folks are taking longer than others. I go back and forth. The landscape is daunting. Obama's only gotten started-- if the battle to turn back socialism was already tough, it has now increased by several orders of magnitude. If I look too far ahead I get discouraged. But we must look ahead and envision worse case scenarios in order to formulate strategy. Still, I think I'm primarily a foot soldier, but we'll see. I'm going to start attending meetings of the Jackson County MO GOP every third Tuesday. I'm going to keep copies of Reagan's 1964 RNC speech and his 1975 speech to CPAC on hand at all times. These spell out the principles of conservatism (or just plain common sense American classical liberalism). And as a pro-science conservative I intend to stress at every opportunity the decline of rational thinking in this country and the fact that the Intelligent Design movement exacerbates this process, and that we cannot effectively communicate conservative ideas, which are fundamentally rational rather than emotionally based, to a population that is steeped in irrational thinking.

1017 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:55:05am

re: #999 shanec99

No the ISP would be forced to provide internet access to a Liberal spot by the name of Bright Pink Softballs, (p.s. there is no restriction for blogs, Liberals can do it anytime now)... and no one would go there.

So the ISP would have to pay for the opposing view to have a soapbox? That is crazy. And it would surely put the internet out of business, politically.

1018 Ojoe  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:55:10am

re: #1006 unclassifiable

Mr. Obama does not have a plan of his own other than an outline of what he wants from Congress.

Thus he is amenable to pressure from the public, let's apply that vigorously.

BBL

1019 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:55:10am

re: #971 MandyManners

What could be an incentive for them to replace it?

people like me going to having no land line. Once I got the cable modem I cut phone altogether. cable speeds are limited and someone will want to take that market. cable will have to put fewer people per hub or someone out there will string a new system and pass them by.
I don't know, but it seems possible we could start going wifi for all communications. that'd probably cut the cost for providers.

1020 Crusty  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:55:51am

re: #969 reine.de.tout

I'm with you Granny.

"Community service" should not be mandatory. It exists at my daughter's school, and I don't like it one bit. The "service" that they "count" is limited. For instance, when my daughter goes and mows my 85-year-old neighbor's 3 acres of land, that does not count. It should.

This ties into Obama's whole view that you are his property. You don't spend your volunteer efforts or your wealth on the charities or causes you want, he will determine that for you for he is The One.

Next time an Obama supporter comes to you for a handout, a donation or a volunteer pledge, refer them to Obama since he controls everyone's wealth and charity work now.

1021 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:55:57am

re: #996 vxbush

People, the fairness doctrine used to be in place. It used to be one of the rules. I believe buzzsawmonkey had a great explanation for why it made sense before and doesn't now, but that won't matter. I could easily see the rule being extended to cover blogs. Should it? Heavens, no. But I would expect an argument to come out for it in a few weeks.

IIRC, Pres. Reagan eliminated it. Rivera left afterward--perhaps because of its elimination. Its elimination led to the horrific concentration of ownership.

1022 shanec99  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:56:40am

re: #984 mitthrawnurdo

No. Radio station owners, upon reinstitution of the Fairness Doctrine (Hush Rush law), will simply stop running those "controversal" right-leaning shows so they doesn't have to deal with the FEC.

Wonder why there were only about 120 radio station shows (according to Rush) before the Fairness Doctrine was stopped, while there are over 2000 today?

If they shut down the Right Leaning shows, they would lose revenue... those are among the best money earners. This would be a matter of money... they would not stand for it.
And right after the fairness doctrine was passed... CNN would have to provide Rush a spot. MSNBC would have to provide Sean Hannity a spot right next to Olberman.

It would be great. Think of the possibilities.

1023 Spare O'Lake  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:56:46am

re: #932 MandyManners

Color me juvenile but, I like the fish thing.

Me too. And the stabbing of the knives in the table was apparently a harmless take-off on an old 70's John Belushi SNL routine.

1024 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:57:07am

re: #961 3 wood
Well

Your mistake, I think, is in assuming that they mean to be even handed.

They mean to obliterate opposition.

They will define hard left thought as "fair". Anything conservative will be labeled hate speech and a civil rights violation.

is just spot on - there never has been "fairness" in the Fairness Doctrine, nor was there ever really intended to be fairness there.

1025 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:57:31am

re: #1003 akak

I got an email from Mike Duncan (GOP Chair) thanking me for my contributions. I gave him a piece of my mind on that very topic. It will go into the electronic circular file but I had to get it off my chest since all I got out of the effort was a McCain/Palin pin.

The new attitude came from Charles and the Lizard Nation.

Thanks folks.

1026 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:57:36am

re: #1010 3 wood

I think her price was to be the next Supreme Court Justice.

Then see what happens with the Fairness Doctrine.

Will one of the conservative justices retire by the time that a challenge to the F.D. has made its way up through the courts?

1027 alien_mind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:58:06am

re: #907 laZardo

"You want those kids to grow up fat and lazy like a soon-to-be-majority of Americans are becoming?!"

/

//but srsly, community service was mandatory in my high school along with many others here...I don't see how bad, or rather, how much more different it would be over there from over here where the general standard of living isn't as high.


the question is what level of government is the correct one to handle COMMUNITY service. in my opinion it should be the community level, cities, local school boards, etc. community service carried out at the community level I have no problem with. I would still not want it to be mandatory.

my issue is when they become federally conceived and mandated service-learning plans, that talk about service to the country for children. do communities need some Washington elitist education guru's to mandate their community service programs? I don't think so.

i don't know about what is done in other countries, all I know is I am going to do everything in my power to resist turning this country into a socialist haven. i will fight every encroachment. we can't give an inch.

1028 bombay311  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:59:07am

Is it true that the fairness doctrine will not be voted on by the legisature. Rather the FCC instiuites it on their own?

1029 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:59:14am

re: #1016 Tigger2005

I'm going to start attending meetings of the Jackson County MO GOP every third Tuesday.

THAT'S what I'm talking about Bay-by! That's where it all starts, Tigger. You go, Big Guy! And don't be quite.

1030 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:59:23am

re: #1017 Wishing

So the ISP would have to pay for the opposing view to have a soapbox? That is crazy. And it would surely put the internet out of business, politically.

you'd end up with blind ISP's in the netherlands taking care of all your needs - unless they want to go full China on us, I don't see much threat in attempts at censoring the internet. I think they would pay a heavy political price for trying to do any of this.

1031 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:59:23am

re: #1021 MandyManners

IIRC, Pres. Reagan eliminated it. Rivera left afterward--perhaps because of its elimination. Its elimination led to the horrific concentration of ownership.

But how has that concentration hurt us? What am i not hearing that would be viable without the concentration?

1032 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 6:59:31am

re: #1022 shanec99

If they shut down the Right Leaning shows, they would lose revenue... those are among the best money earners. This would be a matter of money... they would not stand for it.
And right after the fairness doctrine was passed... CNN would have to provide Rush a spot. MSNBC would have to provide Sean Hannity a spot right next to Olberman.

It would be great. Think of the possibilities.

I am afraid you are not thinking at all.

1033 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:00:45am

re: #1019 spidly

people like me going to having no land line. Once I got the cable modem I cut phone altogether. cable speeds are limited and someone will want to take that market. cable will have to put fewer people per hub or someone out there will string a new system and pass them by.
I don't know, but it seems possible we could start going wifi for all communications. that'd probably cut the cost for providers.

As I said a few minutes ago, that's way above my pay-grade. My dad's a retired telecom executive who came up from the ITT labs so maybe I'll ask him. Of course, I'll get that glazed look in my eyes.

1034 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:00:46am

Gonna head to bed. Cheers.

1035 Ojoe  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:00:52am

Here's how the fairness doctrine would work, thought would cancel out and we would become as stones:

The fairness dcotrine sucks-is-good.

Obama is a rotten-great president.

We should defeat-kiss our enemies.

I am full-hungry.

Like that (quoting tfk)

1036 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:00:59am

re: #967 galloping granny
Good morning galloping granny! Yep you're absolutely spot on with that post. In the tsunami of several years back, where Indonesia, the SINGLE LARGEST MUSLIM nation in the world was devasted, private American Citizens gave more money for aid and more direct aid than did all of the Muslim Nations' citizens and governments combined.
And we didn't do it to curry favor with Indonesia, we did it because it's who we are. Someone should perhaps enlighten Obama as to that fact.

1037 jemima  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:01:02am

#1026

I suspect there are a couple justices who will "see the light" and retire early. By the sound of him, Rahm Emanuel is very persuasive. It will be a done deal by the end of his 1st term.

1038 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:01:07am

We are gonna see some of the most liberal, radical, and way out far left appointments of all time in the next 3 months. Ever bill and mandate is gonna have to be carefully scrutinized to try and prevent the socialization of America. It's going to be a long and trying 4 years.

1039 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:01:08am

re: #1022 shanec99

If they shut down the Right Leaning shows, they would lose revenue... those are among the best money earners. This would be a matter of money... they would not stand for it.
And right after the fairness doctrine was passed... CNN would have to provide Rush a spot. MSNBC would have to provide Sean Hannity a spot right next to Olberman.

It would be great. Think of the possibilities.

cable was and would remain exempt from the fairness doctrine. only radio was ever effected because of the limited bandwidth argument.

1040 mitthrawnurdo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:01:18am

re: #1022 shanec99

Not if they went exclusively after radio. Please don't assume such benevolence from our new "masters".

1041 Crusty  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:01:22am

re: #1009 Ojoe

The carrot of the 2nd term, and "his place in history".

He doesn't need it. He's got the news media and hundreds of millions of illegal campaign donations ensuring his election.

He has, however, flip-flopped when he thought it was demographically wise, ie gay rights, gun rights, missile defense programs, the surge, etc. But that's already got him into office. Now that he's in he'll be more concerned with turning America into Bill Ayer's communist paradise than pandering to the polls.

1042 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:01:38am

Come on, Lizards! The GOP needs a Lizardlanche. Let's show them how Lizards get things done. Get involved!

1043 laZardo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:02:00am

re: #1038 Nevergiveup

Two years? Don't forget midterms...

1044 aggieann  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:02:07am

Yesterday, a lizard had a great idea for a bumper sticker: Question Othority.

I just want to report that I have ordered a few from an online bumper sticker maker, and I can't wait to proudly display one. I will give full credit to my fellow lizard when my family and friends demand to know where they can get one of their own.

1045 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:02:11am

Good morning members of the New World Order. FNC had Huckabee on earlier & He got an email question about bail outs from 'Just a Grunt"
Got to be the Lizard

1046 mitthrawnurdo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:03:23am

re: #1045 opnion

Hopefully not an astroturfer posing as Just a Grunt.

1047 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:03:27am

re: #980 Miss Trixie
Hey {Miss Trixie} I'm waiting for aussiemagpie to tell me how I'm doing! LOL!
How's about yourself, not including the rainy weather you've been having?
Any more yellow roses lately?

1048 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:03:47am

re: #1022 shanec99

If they shut down the Right Leaning shows, they would lose revenue... those are among the best money earners. This would be a matter of money... they would not stand for it.
And right after the fairness doctrine was passed... CNN would have to provide Rush a spot. MSNBC would have to provide Sean Hannity a spot right next to Olberman.

It would be great. Think of the possibilities.

As I said above, television is a far more expensive medium than radio and, it's not portable. Shutting down one medium in exchange for the possibility that another medium will take up the slack is a no-go.

Also, no one can force CNN/MSNBC to hire anyone. What if they determine that Buchanan is the right hire? That would be allowing CNN/MSNBC to determine which ideological slant to propogate with government protection.

1049 Spare O'Lake  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:04:04am

re: #1004 Ojoe

re: #916 shanec99

The fairness doctrine is fabulously unconstitutional.

Perhaps not - after the composition of the SCOTUS has been appropriately adjusted./

1050 Ojoe  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:04:45am

BBL

1051 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:05:01am

Morning All -

Here is something that I hope gets in Charles' peripheral vision this morning.

The place is Congo.

The UN is once again screwing up and people are dying as a result. All of the Obama formula has been tried - talks with despicable people, condemnations of violence, multilateral peacekeepers (who end up making things worse by failing to protect civilians).

Same thing we have known for years - different day. The result this morning is a widening war as Angola joins in.

Yet Obama sees the UN as having magical powers to solve the world's problems, and that all is needed are talks with thugs.

Hope!

1052 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:05:11am

re: #1028 bombay311

Is it true that the fairness doctrine will not be voted on by the legisature. Rather the FCC instiuites it on their own?

I'm not sure but, doesn't Congress have to approve the nomination?

Egads. Time to go back to school on the roles of the branches. Maybe The Kid can explain it to me.

1053 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:05:30am

re: #1046 mitthrawnurdo

Hopefully not an astroturfer posing as Just a Grunt.


The email was very anti-bailout, so I think it was the Lizard.

1054 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:05:32am

re: #1016 Tigger2005

Well Sharmuta kept me on track because I really did not think this thing could be fixed within the party but we got to join and invoke OODA towards the ends that you have laid out.

The basic principals must be invoked. A Muslim shopkeeper who is worried about the Obama's tax plan, and economic philosophy should have a welcomed place in the GOP.

At the same time that guy has to be convinced that supporting the existence of Israel and supporting the general spread of democracy in the Middle East is also in his best interest in the long run.

This is just one small facet of a very tall order that will only be fulfilled if we get started.

1055 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:06:15am

re: #987 Nevergiveup
Good morning! Yep, isn't it good to know he's gonna be president of all the people?!

Mark my words, his childness and churlish ways will come back and take a huge ole bite outta his ass one of these days.

1056 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:06:33am

re: #1031 DistantThunder

But how has that concentration hurt us? What am i not hearing that would be viable without the concentration?

It's been a long time but, IIRC, a media company is not motivated to provide alternative POV's if it has no competition.

1057 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:06:38am

BBIAM

1058 [deleted]  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:06:53am
1059 mitthrawnurdo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:07:51am

re: #1048 MandyManners

Beautiful explaination!

1060 bombay311  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:08:02am

re: #1052 MandyManners

I'm not sure but, doesn't Congress have to approve the nomination?

Egads. Time to go back to school on the roles of the branches. Maybe The Kid can explain it to me.

I swear I saw some guy on Cavuto yesterday saying that the FCC board of 5 (3 or ruling part and 2 of minority) would just have to vote. Therefore it wouldnt even go through congress. It would only need a 3-2 vote after The 0 appoints his people.
Ill have to check it out

1061 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:08:27am

re: #1031 DistantThunder

But how has that concentration hurt us? What am i not hearing that would be viable without the concentration?

One way that concentration of ownership has hurt us is that just two media giants control literally everything that you see, hear or read in the United States. Two. The same one parent company that owns the New York Times owns the Boston Globe, St. Petersburg Times and virtually every newspaper in New England except for the New Hampshire UnionLeader. The same company that owns AOL also owns NBC, Time Warner, most magazines and Disney.

You only think you are getting "variety."

1062 mitthrawnurdo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:09:22am

re: #1058 ploome hineni

Fox News is what liberal parents talk about to scare their children before bed.

/It used to be the "industrial military complex".

1063 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:09:50am

re: #1038 Nevergiveup

We are gonna see some of the most liberal, radical, and way out far left appointments of all time in the next 3 months. Ever bill and mandate is gonna have to be carefully scrutinized to try and prevent the socialization of America. It's going to be a long and trying 4 years.

I'm dying to see what Bill Ayers is going to get. Department of Education is my bet.

1064 Lynn B.  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:10:16am

Heh.

1065 [deleted]  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:10:36am
1066 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:11:12am

re: #1059 mitthrawnurdo

Beautiful explaination!

Thank you! I was hoping I was making sense now that I have less blood in my caffeine stream.

1067 shanec99  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:11:33am

re: #1032 Wishing

I am afraid you are not thinking at all.


No I am thinking out of the box... its something about finding advantages in the face of adversity.

If things are unfair, don't whine, find out how you can take advantage of the situation and let the other side regret making the decisions.

1068 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:11:33am

re: #1018 Ojoe

Well yes and no.

I think he is actually more amenable to pressure from Congress. That is where WE need to apply the pressure.

He strikes me as singularly tone deaf to public criticism falling back on the old racism and right-wing radical canards. I draw those criticisms from watching the man during the election campaign.

We had to chance to apply the pressure at the voting booth and we failed. Now we will have to choose a new battleground -- hopefully one in our favor.

So yes, lets apply the pressure. Let's apply it to people he will listen to.

1069 [deleted]  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:11:38am
1070 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:11:39am

re: #1055 realwest

Good morning! Yep, isn't it good to know he's gonna be president of all the people?!

Mark my words, his childness and churlish ways will come back and take a huge ole bite outta his ass one of these days.

The media will keep on supporting Obama for the foreseeable future, but they can't be fawning all of the time. At some point they will have to be critical. That is when he will start having 'Can't I just eat my waffle?" moments

1071 mitthrawnurdo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:11:58am

re: #1063 galloping granny

Or Dept of Interior. Pipe-bombs are a lovely addition to the American landscape, no?

1072 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:12:19am

re: #1060 bombay311

I swear I saw some guy on Cavuto yesterday saying that the FCC board of 5 (3 or ruling part and 2 of minority) would just have to vote. Therefore it wouldnt even go through congress. It would only need a 3-2 vote after The 0 appoints his people.
Ill have to check it out

Aren't regulatory agencies part of the executive branch, therefore independen of Congress?

1073 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:12:44am

The Vichy press.

1074 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:13:34am

re: #1063 galloping granny

I'm dying to see what Bill Ayers is going to get. Department of Education is my bet.

Not even CBBHO is that fucking stupid. It would put an unbelievable amount of light on his relationship with Ayers.

1075 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:13:43am

re: #1061 galloping granny

One way that concentration of ownership has hurt us is that just two media giants control literally everything that you see, hear or read in the United States. Two. The same one parent company that owns the New York Times owns the Boston Globe, St. Petersburg Times and virtually every newspaper in New England except for the New Hampshire UnionLeader. The same company that owns AOL also owns NBC, Time Warner, most magazines and Disney.

You only think you are getting "variety."

There is a local cable channel called Mind that has belly dancing.

1076 bombay311  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:13:48am

re: #1072 MandyManners

I think so, and this would be a regulation, not a law

1077 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:14:02am

re: #1072 MandyManners

Aren't regulatory agencies part of the executive branch, therefore independen of Congress?

Yes, they are each under the authority of some Department or other. FCC is part of Commerce.

1078 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:14:08am

re: #1063 galloping granny

I'm dying to see what Bill Ayers is going to get. Department of Education is my bet.


I was thinking that the bullying, semi-literate teacher in North Carolina for Education.

1079 shanec99  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:15:11am

re: #1048 MandyManners

And just as they determine that Buchanan is the right hire then Rush could push WABC to hire some left wing dummy who would be subject to ridicule.

Guys, it cuts both ways... let them guarantee equal access... can you imagine of Ann Coulter had to have a one hour program on CNN right after Olberman. Can you imagine Hannity after Chris Matthews.

It would be great. The possibilities.

1080 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:15:54am

re: #1076 bombay311

I think so, and this would be a regulation, not a law

It is regulatory law, with the same effect as statutory law.

1081 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:16:22am

re: #1077 galloping granny

Yes, they are each under the authority of some Department or other. FCC is part of Commerce.

I wonder whom he'll appoint to rule over Commerce.

1082 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:16:22am

re: #1054 unclassifiable

I'm glad I could help. Thanks for getting involved.

1083 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:16:24am

Most of the population has forgotten how to fight communism - so now is the perfect time to teach them. Remember, we can't fight them only to leave a vaccuum - we have to enlighten them with conservatism.

Fighting Apex political predators won't be easy. Time to re-read the Lord of the Rings trilogy.

1084 alien_mind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:17:04am

re: #1063 galloping granny

I'm dying to see what Bill Ayers is going to get. Department of Education is my bet.


maybe homeland security. he does have extensive experience in that area.
/

1085 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:17:28am

re: #1079 shanec99

And just as they determine that Buchanan is the right hire then Rush could push WABC to hire some left wing dummy who would be subject to ridicule.

Guys, it cuts both ways... let them guarantee equal access... can you imagine of Ann Coulter had to have a one hour program on CNN right after Olberman. Can you imagine Hannity after Chris Matthews.

It would be great. The possibilities.

as mentioned before. the fairness doctrine only applies to broadcast. cable news would not fall under the rules

1086 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:17:29am

re: #988 realwest

Good morning Tigger

sounds nice but doesn't mean ANYTHING unless you (we) are prepared to do SOMETHING if they cross that particular point or line.
And what is that something we are prepared to do?

They are going to attack us separately, trying to destroy lives and livelihoods, force people into expensive legal battles, throw people in jail. Therefore the moment anyone comes under attack, they MUST know, immediately, that they have enormous resources and support at their disposal, including free legal assistance, to encourage them to not back down. And we, too, must commit ourselves as individuals to being willing to risk EVERYTHING if we come under attack. Financial ruin. Character assassination. Jail. Think it's too high a price to pay? If too many of us do then we're really and truly lost. Our forefathers pledged "their lives, their fortunes, and their sacred honor." Our fathers and grandfathers and great-grandfathers and on back through our history left their families, their homes, their farms, their businesses, and fought and died for liberty. Young men today are coming home from Iraq and Afghanistan with shattered spines, their dreams of children destroyed, but with their spirits unbroken and their love of country undimmed.

We are at war for the survival of America as the land of the free. Something monumental, historic, happened in this country Tuesday, and it wasn't that we elected a black President. It must stop beginning right now or "the last best hope of man on Earth" will cease to exist. There can be no more business as usual, no more, "I'll do what I can when I can find the time," no more trying to live like everything's still the same as it ever was--and yes, even more so than was the case after 9/11. We must all do more than we think we can, more than we think we're capable of. A couple of times during the campaign I didn't go door to door when I could have. Missouri barely went Republican, no thanks to me.

1087 mitthrawnurdo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:17:32am

re: #1084 alien_mind

Snark, snark.

1088 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:17:58am

re: #1079 shanec99

And just as they determine that Buchanan is the right hire then Rush could push WABC to hire some left wing dummy who would be subject to ridicule.

Guys, it cuts both ways... let them guarantee equal access... can you imagine of Ann Coulter had to have a one hour program on CNN right after Olberman. Can you imagine Hannity after Chris Matthews.

It would be great. The possibilities.

How could Rush push anyone if he's no longer a voice?

I'm growing weary of debating this. I'm to the point of wanting to bang my head on my desk.

1089 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:18:00am

re: #1063 galloping granny

I believe Ayers would never accept any high-visibility public position because it show his acquiescence to "The Man" and ruin his radical chic credentials, soil his stealth candidate even more by association, and (egad) subject him to public criticism which his narcissistic mind cannot handle.

This guy operates in the shadows and corners -- just like a weasel.

1090 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:18:22am

re: #1083 DistantThunder

Most of the population has forgotten how to fight communism - so now is the perfect time to teach them. Remember, we can't fight them only to leave a vaccuum - we have to enlighten them with conservatism.

Fighting Apex political predators won't be easy. Time to re-read the Lord of the Rings trilogy.

Most of the population has forgotten even what communism is - if they ever knew. To the point that the Democrats can actually display the Red Star of international communism at their national convention without a single peep being uttered.

You cannot fight that which you do not even recognize.

1091 bombay311  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:19:31am

re: #1080 MandyManners

It is regulatory law, with the same effect as statutory law.

Same effect, but without all that pesky voting

1092 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:19:33am

re: #1067 shanec99

No I am thinking out of the box... its something about finding advantages in the face of adversity.

If things are unfair, don't whine, find out how you can take advantage of the situation and let the other side regret making the decisions.

Shane with the fairness doctrine in play, there were approx 200 talk radio shows. Today, without that government-imposed-truth, there are over 2000. (stats per Rush).

1093 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:19:37am

Oh, and I'm no fan of Rush. He lost me with all that shit about "feminazis". But, I deeply appreciate the impact he's had on the overall debate in America. Without him and other talk radio people, we'd be in really deep shit now.

1094 shanec99  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:20:04am

re: #1085 spidly

as mentioned before. the fairness doctrine only applies to broadcast. cable news would not fall under the rules

NBC, CBS and ABC is broadcast... it is also carried by cable networks... but they are broadcast.

They would have to provide equal time... haven't we been screaming about media bias for a long time... well here we would have a shot at leveling the playing field.

1095 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:20:22am

re: #1086 Tigger2005

They are going to attack us separately, trying to destroy lives and livelihoods, force people into expensive legal battles, throw people in jail. Therefore the moment anyone comes under attack, they MUST know, immediately, that they have enormous resources and support at their disposal, including free legal assistance, to encourage them to not back down. And we, too, must commit ourselves as individuals to being willing to risk EVERYTHING if we come under attack. Financial ruin. Character assassination. Jail. Think it's too high a price to pay? If too many of us do then we're really and truly lost. Our forefathers pledged "their lives, their fortunes, and their sacred honor." Our fathers and grandfathers and great-grandfathers and on back through our history left their families, their homes, their farms, their businesses, and fought and died for liberty. Young men today are coming home from Iraq and Afghanistan with shattered spines, their dreams of children destroyed, but with their spirits unbroken and their love of country undimmed.

We are at war for the survival of America as the land of the free. Something monumental, historic, happened in this country Tuesday, and it wasn't that we elected a black President. It must stop beginning right now or "the last best hope of man on Earth" will cease to exist. There can be no more business as usual, no more, "I'll do what I can when I can find the time," no more trying to live like everything's still the same as it ever was--and yes, even more so than was the case after 9/11. We must all do more than we think we can, more than we think we're capable of. A couple of times during the campaign I didn't go door to door when I could have. Missouri barely went Republican, no thanks to me.

I agree with you, except that one statement I've highlighted. Where will that come from? Not Legal Aid - they are part of the lunatic left. Surely not the ACLU.

1096 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:22:04am

re: #1089 unclassifiable

I believe Ayers would never accept any high-visibility public position because it show his acquiescence to "The Man" and ruin his radical chic credentials, soil his stealth candidate even more by association, and (egad) subject him to public criticism which his narcissistic mind cannot handle.

This guy operates in the shadows and corners -- just like a weasel.

Oh you watch. We all saw how any criticism of Obama and his minions was ignored or brushed under the rug during the campaign. It won't even be allowed during his dicatorship.

1097 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:22:11am

re: #1091 bombay311

Same effect, but without all that pesky voting

Which makes it even more insidious.

1098 reine.de.tout  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:22:20am

re: #995 MandyManners

Nooo. It must be performed to the greater glory of the community, not to pesky individuals.

Heh.
This particular individual, who is a good neighbor (makes me chicken soup when I'm sick!), lives on a small SS check in a 1000-sq-foot cinder-block house she and her husband built and raised 4 kids in, and said house sits on a cool $1 million worth of land at current pricing - she has been offered that much - and refuses to sell it. She loves her space. Unfortunately, her daughter and son who live in town never come by to help her, and so it's up to us.

It's not a problem for us. Plus, we get to have the run of her property for walking our dog, etc, and the place is just beautiful.

But you'd think that helping out this little old lady would count as community service.

That's the problem with mandatory community service "plans". Somebody else has defined how you must spend your volunteer hours. And it's just not right.

1099 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:24:17am

re: #1094 shanec99

NBC, CBS and ABC is broadcast... it is also carried by cable networks... but they are broadcast.

They would have to provide equal time... haven't we been screaming about media bias for a long time... well here we would have a shot at leveling the playing field.

they do not acknowledge bias. they are but the bias is in content not viewpoint. it is what they cover not how they cover it. do you see news about William Jefferson, Tim Mahoney, Charlie Wrangle, Dodd/Frank/Freddie/Fannie, yadda yadda yadda? Nope.

1100 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:24:22am

re: #990 3 wood
Hey my friend - I know you have experience with the "Chicago Mob" but you really ought to remember -actually the Chicago Mob ought to remember that when it was at it's strongest - Scarface Al Capone in charge - it was still a piker compared to the Five Families of NYC headed up by Lucky Luciano - and they formed an organization called "Murder, Inc." headed by one Albert Anastasia, to handle all of the "enforcing" that needed to be done in NYC and environs. Hell the Detroit Purple Gang hired Murder, Inc. on more than one occasion. But one day, Murder, Inc. got to start believing it's own press clippings and started pushing folks around and - one day in a barbershop in the beautiful Park Sheraton Hotel, the head of Murder Inc, Albert Anastasia, was shot dead by about 20 bullets delivered from less than five feet away. Albert never had time to even clear his pair of .45 caliber pistols to defend himself.
The moral is this: when a "gang" starts to think they are above everyone else, including the rule of law (here, of course that being Mob law) they suddenly find themselves in serious, DEEP trouble. I expect the Chicago Mob to go the same way cause I can't IMAGINE Mayor Richard Daley playing second fiddle to Obama or anyone else from Chicago.

1101 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:24:27am

re: #1090 galloping granny

Most of the population has forgotten even what communism is - if they ever knew. To the point that the Democrats can actually display the Red Star of international communism at their national convention without a single peep being uttered.

You cannot fight that which you do not even recognize.

They will learn again soon enough. You can point to their misery and say, "This is communism."

1102 thedude  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:24:51am

another example of the One uniting mankind within a harmonious cocoon...

Unable to Come to Grips With Defeat, Angry Militant Gays Lash Out at Blacks

[Link: jammiewearingfool.blogspot.com...]

1103 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:24:57am

re: #1083 DistantThunder

Most of the population has forgotten how to fight communism - so now is the perfect time to teach them. Remember, we can't fight them only to leave a vaccuum - we have to enlighten them with conservatism.

Fighting Apex political predators won't be easy. Time to re-read the Lord of the Rings trilogy.

Part of the problem is our side does not know how to effectively communicate our ideas and ideals. We don't even know how to debate a point. We have our work cut out for us.

1104 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:24:58am

re: #1098 reine.de.tout

Heh.
This particular individual, who is a good neighbor (makes me chicken soup when I'm sick!), lives on a small SS check in a 1000-sq-foot cinder-block house she and her husband built and raised 4 kids in, and said house sits on a cool $1 million worth of land at current pricing - she has been offered that much - and refuses to sell it. She loves her space. Unfortunately, her daughter and son who live in town never come by to help her, and so it's up to us.

It's not a problem for us. Plus, we get to have the run of her property for walking our dog, etc, and the place is just beautiful.

But you'd think that helping out this little old lady would count as community service.

That's the problem with mandatory community service "plans". Somebody else has defined how you must spend your volunteer hours. And it's just not right.

Shame on her kids! They don't help her but I guarantee you that they'll be the first to stick out their hands to grab her estate when she's dead.

1105 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:25:48am

re: #1098 reine.de.tout
That's the problem with mandatory community service "plans". Somebody else has defined how you must spend your volunteer hours. And it's just not right American.

Fixt.

1106 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:25:59am

Bulls & Bears on FNC now has on that grinning fool, Marc Lamont Hill from Temple U. He is trying to defend BHO give aways. I do not know what his discipline is, but it doesn't sound like economics.

1107 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:26:17am
1108 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:26:39am

re: #1095 galloping granny

I agree with you, except that one statement I've highlighted. Where will that come from? Not Legal Aid - they are part of the lunatic left. Surely not the ACLU.

Us.

1109 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:26:46am

re: #1102 thedude

another example of the One uniting mankind within a harmonious cocoon...

Unable to Come to Grips With Defeat, Angry Militant Gays Lash Out at Blacks

[Link: jammiewearingfool.blogspot.com...]

Hoo boy! This is gonna' get interesting.

1110 Pete-billy  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:27:03am

hi all !

1111 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:27:06am

#960 shanec99
Re #930 Mandy Manners
The complete elimination of talk radio.
Could not happen.
The financial implications (advertisers etc) would be too great (along with something about free speech and the bill of rights).

What they can do, and what I think the plan is, would be to require a media outlet to provide time to opposing views. So. If they have a 1-hour conservative talk program, they would also have to have a 1-hour liberal talk program.

Now, say the conservative program is popular and has lots of advertisers. But the liberal program draws no or few willing advertisers.

The station cannot afford to run a program that is not supported by advertisers. So they give up on the liberal program. Then they MUST withdraw the conservative program.

The government would not be restricting the conservative speech. It would be the radio station choosing not to sell time to the conservative program producers.

1112 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:27:13am

re: #996 vxbush Nah. The problem with the Fairness Doctrine and the Internet is that NO ONE owns the internet and the top 6 or 7 political blogs on the internet by visitor count, are already leftists (e.g., Kos, Huffpoo, DU).

1113 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:28:51am

re: #1106 opnion

Bulls & Bears on FNC now has on that grinning fool, Marc Lamont Hill from Temple U. He is trying to defend BHO give aways. I do not know what his discipline is, but it doesn't sound like economics.

Thanks for the heads up. I'll stay away.

1114 aussiemagpie  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:29:02am

re: #1095 galloping granny

I agree with you, except that one statement I've highlighted. Where will that come from? Not Legal Aid - they are part of the lunatic left. Surely not the ACLU.

hat's where lawyers - conservatives ones, should offer pro bono services

There are plenty of lizard lawyers to start with...

1115 republic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:29:11am

re: #1089 unclassifiable

I believe Ayers would never accept any high-visibility public position because it show his acquiescence to "The Man" and ruin his radical chic credentials, soil his stealth candidate even more by association, and (egad) subject him to public criticism which his narcissistic mind cannot handle.

This guy operates in the shadows and corners -- just like a weasel.

My goodness, Ayers was made a Professor at the University of Chicago, after he murdered and bombed Federal and State buildings and said, "we didn't do enough."

Ayers will be in up to his eyeballs in this next administration, with regards to Americas education system.

He already has been for decades.

1116 alien_mind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:29:13am

re: #1087 mitthrawnurdo

Snark, snark.


actually Ayers has a lock on the most coveted role of all;
Consiglieri to Don Obama.

1117 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:29:42am

re: #1102 thedude

another example of the One uniting mankind within a harmonious cocoon...

Unable to Come to Grips With Defeat, Angry Militant Gays Lash Out at Blacks

[Link: jammiewearingfool.blogspot.com...]

Anyone taking odds on who comes out on top in the gay - black riots?

1118 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:29:58am

re: #1096 galloping granny

Granny if that happens then we know that this administration will truly be the pinnacle of arrogance, ignorance, and an enduring hatred for liberty.

1119 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:30:16am

I have to say- it broke my heart yesterday to learn Newt Gingrich wants creationism taught in public schools.

We have a serious problem in the GOP, folks, and it's not going away unless we get involved and deal with the issues at their source.

I spoke with the chair of one of my former BPOUs, and had to practically yell at him to get him to listen to me on intelligent design. It's not going to be easy, it might not be fun, either, but if we don't get involved and start correcting these issues at the source, we are going to continue to have these problems, and it will matter come election day.

1120 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:30:32am

re: #1093 MandyManners

Oh, and I'm no fan of Rush. He lost me with all that shit about "feminazis". But, I deeply appreciate the impact he's had on the overall debate in America. Without him and other talk radio people, we'd be in really deep shit now.

I wouldn't have apprecated it if I had not had a a Femi-nazi teacher in a familiy studies class at San Jose State. Long hair grey hair past her waist - wore big moo-moos and talked about the oppression of women as mothers and wives. I just had to sigh and shake my head. I did some push back - but she was completely indoctrinated - hopeless.

1121 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:30:38am

re: #1106 opnion

Bulls & Bears on FNC now has on that grinning fool, Marc Lamont Hill from Temple U. He is trying to defend BHO give aways. I do not know what his discipline is, but it doesn't sound like economics.

According to his website, his academic discipline is "hip hop culture" - whatever that might be. Surely has nothing to do with medicine, chemistry, physics, engineering or law. Not much to do with economics either -

Dr. Marc Lamont Hill is one of the youngest members of the growing body of “Hip-Hop Intellectuals” in the country. His work, which covers topics such as hip-hop culture, politics, sexuality, and education, and religion, has appeared in numerous journals, magazines, books, and anthologies.

I guess he is an "expert" because of his color.

1122 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:30:45am

re: #1103 Sharmuta

Sharmuta, how do i go about *getting involved*? I wouldn't even know who to call.
Americans against Socialism? Is there such a thing? lolol

1123 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:31:01am

re: #1106 opnion

Bulls & Bears on FNC now has on that grinning fool, Marc Lamont Hill from Temple U. He is trying to defend BHO give aways. I do not know what his discipline is, but it doesn't sound like economics.

His website.

[Link: www.marclamonthill.com...]

1124 LoFlyer  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:31:48am

Mates, this is what I see is our future. More of the same kind of legislation as the illegal immigrant amnesty bill as championed by our fallen hero, John McCain. We beat that one and will beat the next because talk radio slid into "all hands" mode and mobilized the base, and rallied to the cause. Obama will attempt to silence talk radio, then us mates. We must fight these jerks every inch of the way. This will be a very personal fight mates, be prepared to get down and dirty! One for all and all for one!

1125 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:31:51am

Michelle: Why isn’t McCain defending Palin from the leakers?

[Link: hotair.com...]

I, for one, am very disappointed in McCain. Honor was always his best attribute.

1126 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:32:18am

re: #1122 Wishing

Call the state party. They should have contact information for your local party chair who should be able to tell you when and where the local meetings take place.

1127 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:32:26am

re: #1111 nonic

The government would not be restricting the conservative speech. It would be the radio station choosing not to sell time to the conservative program producers.

Isn't that the same thing as the government forcing the market to stop speech?

1128 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:33:01am

re: #1111 nonic


Now, say the conservative program is popular and has lots of advertisers. But the liberal program draws no audience so no or few willing advertisers.


there.

1129 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:33:15am

The state party should also have information about any other questions anyone has about getting involved at congressional level party meetings and state party meetings.

1130 republic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:35:28am

re: #1107 spidly

Criminals for Gun Control

I Can't Believe It's Not Socialism

The Obama transition team already has crafted gun control measures, and they want the "assault weapons" ban to become Permanent.

"Assault weapons" are used in only 0.7% of all gun crimes, criminals don't obey any laws to begin with, so one can see that the Democrats idea of gun control has nothing to do with actual safety, and only has to do with eventually trying to ban all private ownership of firearms.

1131 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:35:38am

re: #1113 Nevergiveup

Thanks for the heads up. I'll stay away.

It's safe now, it's over.

1132 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:35:43am

And for those folks who are not sure party involvement is right for them- take the zombie approach and dig around for scoops. Become a citizen journalist and shine a light.

1133 alien_mind  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:35:43am

re: #1106 opnion

Bulls & Bears on FNC now has on that grinning fool, Marc Lamont Hill from Temple U. He is trying to defend BHO give aways. I do not know what his discipline is, but it doesn't sound like economics.


that guy has actually said that Obama is not nearly left enough for him!

1134 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:35:54am

re: #1115 republic

Yeah he will be but Democrats have a history of having non-public advisers and using the cabinet positions as fronts. Besides with the modern "advice and consent" position that the Senate has taken, no politician is going to go on record that they support this guy.

There is no amount of P.R. that can reform this asshole. And colleges and universities -- no matter how public they might be -- still remain fairly insular institutions.

1135 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:35:54am

re: #1119 Sharmuta

I have to say- it broke my heart yesterday to learn Newt Gingrich wants creationism taught in public schools.

WTF? Is he trying to court the social conservatives at the expense of the fiscal conservatives?

Numbnuts.

1136 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:36:54am

re: #1120 DistantThunder

I wouldn't have apprecated it if I had not had a a Femi-nazi teacher in a familiy studies class at San Jose State. Long hair grey hair past her waist - wore big moo-moos and talked about the oppression of women as mothers and wives. I just had to sigh and shake my head. I did some push back - but she was completely indoctrinated - hopeless.

It was too villifying and pissed me off as a moderate feminist, i.e., one who was not willing to put women ahead of men.

1137 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:37:19am

re: #1026 MandyManners
Well

Will one of the conservative justices retire by the time that a challenge to the F.D. has made its way up through the courts?

I think it unlikely; the next two SCOTUS Justices to retire - at least based on age and expressed "thoughts" would be Ruth Bader Ginsberg and probably Stevens. Neither one a loss for conservatives.

1138 shanec99  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:37:19am

re: #1099 spidly

they do not acknowledge bias. they are but the bias is in content not viewpoint. it is what they cover not how they cover it. do you see news about William Jefferson, Tim Mahoney, Charlie Wrangle, Dodd/Frank/Freddie/Fannie, yadda yadda yadda? Nope.


They do not acknowledge bias, but all objective study of the media demonstrate bias, look it up.

The fact that they do not acknowledge it would be immaterial, the facts speak for themselves, they would have to give our side (albeit reluctantly) equal access. We would just have to be prepared to spend the money in court to enforce it, and sue thier butts whenever they did not adhere to it.

It would be a fight, but we would have to be willing to open our wallets for that one.

1139 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:37:30am

re: #1135 MandyManners

Why did Buckley have to go when we needed him most?! Where will we find our new Goldwater?

1140 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:37:58am

re: #1121 galloping granny

Good grief another grievance doctorate idiot given a platform.

1141 LoFlyer  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:38:55am

Atlanta lizards click on 'me avatar to receive the secret to 'me identity tomorrow! (Just the meet mates, I don't do this all the time!)

1142 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:39:19am

re: #1129 Sharmuta

The state party should also have information about any other questions anyone has about getting involved at congressional level party meetings and state party meetings.

Ok thanks, will do that.

1143 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:39:24am

re: #1139 Sharmuta

He or she might be here.

1144 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:39:35am

re: #1135 MandyManners

WTF? Is he trying to court the social conservatives at the expense of the fiscal conservatives?

Numbnuts.

Time is approaching for fiscons to do something different. When the big tent is turned into a revival tent with people barred for lacking purity credentials, it is time to put up a new tent.

1145 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:39:38am

re: #1139 Sharmuta

Why did Buckley have to go when we needed him most?! Where will we find our new Goldwater?

Let me remind you that Goldwater lost. Perhaps what we need is actually another Richard Nixon - one who doesn't get caught.

1146 JCM  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:39:40am

Morning all.

Seattle's mayor is a certifiable brain dead ignoramus.

Mayor moves forward on gun ban plan

Not so fast you imbecile.

An unequivocal "no" from the state Attorney General's Office is often enough to shoot down a city proposal.

F'in retread can't understand state law and the State AG say NO!

1147 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:39:40am

re: #1121 galloping granny

I guess he is an "expert" because of his color.

A link from his page is to the Worker's World site.

[Link: www.workers.org...]

A ruling by the three-judge panel of the Third Circuit Court of Appeals rejecting Mumia Abu-Jamal’s appeals has left supporters outraged and convinced that, for this internationally known political prisoner, there is no chance for a “fair trial” within the U.S. injustice system.

On March 27, the long-awaited decision by the Third Circuit Court judges followed a pattern that’s become all too obvious in Abu-Jamal’s hearings before Pennsylvania courts: ignore their own legal precedents and make exceptions to the rules when it comes to decisions regarding Mumia.

This practice of creating new court standards applied only to Abu-Jamal has been dubbed “the Mumia exception” and was criticized in an Amnesty International report of the Abu-Jamal case controversy released in 2001.

SNIP

1148 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:39:48am

The more people pull their kids out of public schools, the more money is denied to the government educational fortress.

Simultaneously, those who are not in a position to homeschool should get on the school board - and do the PTA thing.

1149 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:40:05am

re: #1123 MandyManners

His website.

[Link: www.marclamonthill.com...]

Hmmm, isn't he special? A hip hop intellectual?

1150 jorline  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:40:06am

present

/ new sign-in and out for the next four years in honor of our 44th Potus.

1151 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:40:31am

For those interested in becoming involved on the local/state level:
STATE GOP websites

1152 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:40:42am

re: #1145 galloping granny

Richard Nixon.

Hell no!

1153 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:41:01am

re: #1137 realwest

Well


I think it unlikely; the next two SCOTUS Justices to retire - at least based on age and expressed "thoughts" would be Ruth Bader Ginsberg and probably Stevens. Neither one a loss for conservatives.

It still would be an enormous drag of the court to the left. And, who's to say that a conservative justice or two doesn't come down with a delibitating illness or die in an accident?

1154 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:41:18am

re: #1140 unclassifiable

Good grief another grievance doctorate idiot given a platform.

Yup. Might as well be an honorary doctorate. I'm kind of surprised at Neil Cavuto. One would think he could drum up somebody who actually had some sort of chops in the field of economics.

1155 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:42:02am

re: #1139 Sharmuta

Why did Buckley have to go when we needed him most?! Where will we find our new Goldwater?

Not in the usual places.

What about Palin? She was not well known nationally. I'm sure there are others like her.

1156 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:42:05am

re: #1121 galloping granny

I guess he is an "expert" because of his color.

Why they have him on a prgram about the economy is a mystery.

1157 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:42:26am

re: #1145 galloping granny

Let me remind you that Goldwater lost. Perhaps what we need is actually another Richard Nixon - one who doesn't get caught.

Tricky Dick was a big government guy. Loved creating more of it. EPA was one of his gifts to the American people.

1158 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:42:31am

re: #1080 MandyManners
Actually regulatory agencies have been slapped down by the Federal Courts for "creating law" in lieu of what they are supposed to do: create rules to help people comply with written by Congress laws.

1159 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:42:35am

re: #1147 MandyManners

A link from his page is to the Worker's World site.

[Link: www.workers.org...]

A ruling by the three-judge panel of the Third Circuit Court of Appeals rejecting Mumia Abu-Jamal’s appeals has left supporters outraged and convinced that, for this internationally known political prisoner, there is no chance for a “fair trial” within the U.S. injustice system.

On March 27, the long-awaited decision by the Third Circuit Court judges followed a pattern that’s become all too obvious in Abu-Jamal’s hearings before Pennsylvania courts: ignore their own legal precedents and make exceptions to the rules when it comes to decisions regarding Mumia.

This practice of creating new court standards applied only to Abu-Jamal has been dubbed “the Mumia exception” and was criticized in an Amnesty International report of the Abu-Jamal case controversy released in 2001.

SNIP

my understand is that Mumia shot a police officer at close range and then walked away a few yards - at which point he was arrested. There are eye-witnesses who saw him continuously from the moment of the shooting until the moment of arrest - yet he said - it wasn't him.(he?)

1160 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:42:36am

re: #1144 karmic_inquisitor

Time is approaching for fiscons to do something different. When the big tent is turned into a revival tent with people barred for lacking purity credentials, it is time to put up a new tent.


A complete splinter?

1161 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:43:22am

re: #1155 MandyManners

I have seen Michelle Malkin talking up Mike Pence -- congressman from Indiana I believe.

1162 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:43:28am

re: #1148 DistantThunder

The more people pull their kids out of public schools, the more money is denied to the government educational fortress.

Simultaneously, those who are not in a position to homeschool should get on the school board - and do the PTA thing.

Private/home-school folks STILL must pay their taxes toward public education.

1163 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:43:29am

re: #1144 karmic_inquisitor

Time is approaching for fiscons to do something different. When the big tent is turned into a revival tent with people barred for lacking purity credentials, it is time to put up a new tent.

No- we need to fight for this tent. A third party will not be viable ever and will only guarantee democrat victories. Look what Ross Perot wrought.

1164 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:43:47am

re: #1149 opnion

Hmmm, isn't he special? A hip hop intellectual?

See my No. 1147.

1165 Irene NYC  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:44:03am

re: #922 Edgar

Nobody is going to shut you off.


It doesn't sound like you know how the media works. As for the internet? It is still in its infancy and governments haven't even started to figur out yet how they can benefit the most from it. Trust me, Obama's minions are already exploring that even as we speak. And it ain't gonna be pretty. Freedom of speech for me but not for thee, e.g., they could just tax it out of existence in any number of ways (although that would be pretty crude and obvious, but so what, it would work).

Any of you minions old enough to remember when the government was floating the idea of registering ALL computers in the event of a national emergency? No? That was nothing compared to what I expect coming down the pike.

Hope and Change - yeah!

/

1166 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:44:26am

re: #1154 galloping granny

Yup. Might as well be an honorary doctorate. I'm kind of surprised at Neil Cavuto. One would think he could drum up somebody who actually had some sort of chops in the field of economics.

Did Cavuto even vet this guy?

1167 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:44:29am

Goldwater paved the way for Reagan. We have no Goldwater and will get no Reagan.

1168 DistantThunder  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:44:46am

re: #1162 MandyManners

Private/home-school folks STILL must pay their taxes toward public education.

But the local school only gets the money if the child is in the seat. If those costs go down, then they can't agitate for a higher property tax - credibly.

1169 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:44:50am

re: #1135 MandyManners

He better have numbnuts because we are going to kick them.

1170 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:45:04am

re: #1086 Tigger2005
I don't disagree with anything you said, but the question still stands: where is that line going to be drawn? The Fairness Doctrine? Taxation? Civilian Defense Corps?

1171 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:45:15am

bbiab

1172 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:45:17am

re: #1137 realwest

Hey Real.

In other stuff, here is the tune I'm currently working up an arrangement on dulcimer

Starry Starry Night

I'm about 50% done working up the arrangement.

I doubt that I can get the rights to commercially record it, but in any event I'll record a private CD of it and mail it to you.

1173 hydrocarbon hank  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:45:50am

We're heading up to Lubbock Texas to watch my alma mater quash OSU...any Red Raider fans awake this morning?

1174 jorline  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:46:29am

Saturday morning music to sooth the savage beast in us all.

A great rendition of Elton John's Mona Lisas & Mad Hatters...skip the intro talking and start at the 40 second mark.

1175 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:46:36am

re: #1162 MandyManners

Private/home-school folks STILL must pay their taxes toward public education.

True, but the kids not there do not get counted for their federal grant purposes.

And the NEA is starting to notice.

1176 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:47:05am

re: #1157 karmic_inquisitor

Tricky Dick was a big government guy. Loved creating more of it. EPA was one of his gifts to the American people.

I'm not going to slam him for the EPA. I've lived most of my life next to or near the largest river in New England - largest east of the Mississippi I think. For a couple of centuries it has provided water power for generators and innumerable mills. When this area was first settled it was known for huge salmon runs, so large that one of the natural waterfalls was known as Salmon Fishing Falls by natives and settlers alike. By the time the EPA went into effect the river was so polluted that the only fish left were carp - and it would have killed you to eat one. For that matter, simply falling into the river might very well have killed you.

Today, thanks to the EPA, the river is clear. Not only are the salmon back, but other even rarer fish. There are fresh water clams and mussels for the first time in nearly two centuries. If you go out in a kayak you'll come across otters and osprey and great blue heron and eagles.

I'll not be yelling too much about the EPA.

1177 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:48:01am

re: #1166 MandyManners

Did Cavuto even vet this guy?

It looks like Mgt at FNC is really pushing to have Hill on it's programs.
They roll hiim out in areas that he can't even pretend to have knowledge.
Mandy, posted a link to his web site. My, my he is a self-satisfied guy.

1178 ArmyWife  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:48:07am

re: #1103 Sharmuta

We do know how to debate. Quite effectively. Its those running our party that don't get it. They think we need to be more center - apparently not as McCain is quite (very) moderate. Who got us excited finally? Sarah Palin. Of all the debates, which was the best to watch? Palin/Biden. Wonder why that was. Were their points she could have and should have pounced on? Yep. Interestingly enough, people right on this board could INSTANTLY come back with points and counterpoints.

The talent our party needs is available. We have to stop looking in the same tired places for it, though.

1179 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:48:22am

re: #1160 MandyManners

A complete splinter?

I have spent a lot of money and time supporting the party. Here in CA the socons took over and drove out the "impure" folks who were pro choice and whatnot. guys like Pete Wilson are no longer welcome - RINOs.

I am tired of it. I supported these folks in the name of party unity, and we get smaller and smaller and smaller and more irrelevant. Creationism in the schools was one of the wedges in the early 90s that killed us here.

This was once a big Red state. 25 years of a Democratic legislature because the only places a Republican can win is in rural areas (and we are starting to lose those).

I have seen the pure and glorious future that Newt and Rush seem to want. It won't include me. I am out if it happens. And my money, time and contacts will go with me.

1180 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:50:24am

re: #1159 DistantThunder

my understand is that Mumia shot a police officer at close range and then walked away a few yards - at which point he was arrested. There are eye-witnesses who saw him continuously from the moment of the shooting until the moment of arrest - yet he said - it wasn't him.(he?)

It wasn't OJ either. How his blood was all over the place I'll never know?

1181 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:50:45am

re: #1176 galloping granny

Well I was not yelldown-dinging about the EPA but Watergate did some damage to the party and the national psyche.

Long road folks but we will find or become leaders. This thing we call the United States of America is too good to throw on the ash heap of history.

1182 ArmyWife  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:51:37am

re: #1180 Nevergiveup

Mark Furman planted blood for Mumia, too? Wow.

//

1183 Ward Cleaver  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:52:55am

re: #1121 galloping granny

I guess he is an "expert" because of his color.

His expertise is about as weighty as underwater basketweaving. Temple is where Bill Cosby went to school. That place has really declined.

1184 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:53:10am

re: #1110 Pete-billy Hi Pete-billy! How are you this morning? And how'd you come to pick that nicname?!

1185 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:53:19am

Saudi king musn't shake Peres' hand at interfaith meet, pan-Arab newspaper editor says

[Link: www.haaretz.com...]

Obama's election is spreading Tolerance all thru out the Middle East. Well it's spreading something anyhow?

1186 Irene NYC  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:53:35am

re: #983 MandyManners

re: #962 bombay311

what Im saying is if you're going to force community service on people, it should be forced on those who are getting the money from the govt for sitting on their ass

Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime where of the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
Section 2. Congress shall have the power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

I don't see such a caveat there.


Let me spell it out. There will be NO involuntary servitude because we are out of the middle ages. Instead, people will be BOUGHT off. They'll WANT their servitude. That is how this age works.

It's very simple. Obama is gonna tax people who played by the rules and REDISTRIBUTE the gains of their labor to his supporters and cronies. There will be lots of "creative destruction" of language. There will also be a lot of creative destruction of the dollar - but it will take a while for people to catch onto that.

In other words, our society and our economy are going to be bankrupted in order to pay out reparations to those groups whom lefties consider it due. That is their number 2 priority. Number 1 is staying in power and permanently destroying their enemies. (Okay, maybe the other way around.)

1187 Ward Cleaver  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:54:20am

re: #1173 hydrocarbon hank

We're heading up to Lubbock Texas to watch my alma mater quash OSU...any Red Raider fans awake this morning?

If they handled Texas, they can handle OSU.

1188 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:54:36am

re: #1178 ArmyWife

I disagree- when I see people coming here for advice on how to counter claims being handed to them about McCain and Palin because they allow the person they're speaking to to deflect the issue of 0bama, then we don't know how to debate. You can't allow the opposition to deflect and then argue about the deflection point- you'll lose every time, and so we did.

And I think the discussion concerning the issue of moderation is being spun to the detriment of our party. We must first and foremost stand on our principles of fiscal conservatism, because it's something we all agree on, or so I thought, anyways.

1189 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:54:50am

re: #1181 unclassifiable

Well I was not yelldown-dinging about the EPA but Watergate did some damage to the party and the national psyche.

Long road folks but we will find or become leaders. This thing we call the United States of America is too good to throw on the ash heap of history.

Yes, Watergate did do some damage. But, having watched the shenanigans that went on in this election - including some of the same people as were involved in Watergate BTW - I'm not so all fired sure that all the blame should be laid at the feet of Nixon. For that matter, I'm not so sure that most of the blame doesn't rightly belong to the Democrats.l

1190 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:55:39am

re: #1163 Sharmuta

No- we need to fight for this tent. A third party will not be viable ever and will only guarantee democrat victories. Look what Ross Perot wrought.

I am not talking about third party nonsense.

I am talking about switching teams.

I can have more effect on policy needed for these country over there than over here if we become the party of moral purity.

1191 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:56:46am

OK i emailed my local GOP (Women Republicans). I just hate office work though. Hope there is something else I can do that will make a small difference.

1192 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:57:00am

re: #1179 karmic_inquisitor

I just think the opposite approach needs to be taken. It's time we push back. I'm not surrendering the tent without a fight. I'm trying to get more people to help join you in that fight, karmic- don't quit yet. Get reinforcements.

1193 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:57:36am

#1127 Mandy

"Isn't that the same thing as the government forcing the market to stop speech?"

No. The government doesn't stop the speech at any point. What it does is require MORE speech.

The station decides AS AN ECONOMIC ISSUE what they will broadcast. The government's not forcing them. They can choose to broadcast a program that loses them money. Or they can choose not to.

1194 unclassifiable  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:58:12am

Time to start the chores and whatnot.

Take care lizards and have a nice weekend!

And keep your chins up. Even in the old USSR the forces of freedom still were able to spread the word difficult as it may have been.

Aloha

1195 Oldasdirt  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:58:21am

Already Representative Nancy Pelosi (D-CA), the House Minority Leader, is calling for investigations of key Republican leaders since Abramoff is known to favor Republican candidates in elections. However, according to journalist Sher Zieve writing in The Conservative Voice, there are known links between Abramoff and Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV), Pelosi's counterpart.
Despite urging from Republicans, Mrs. Pelosi continues to refuse to call for any investigations of her Democratic colleagues. They also point to her own ethics problems involving $21,000.00.Lets not forget Hairy Reid either."The Republicans are yet again attempting to muddy the waters to divert attention from their pattern of abusing of power," Pelosi spokesperson Jennifer Crider said.
However, Republicans see the old double-standard in Washington politics and in the news media. If a Republican is accused, it becomes a media frenzy. If a Democrat is suspected, it's a mistake. Even Pelosi was forced to pay back $21,000.00 in her own ethics case."What is a 'technicality' for her requires a full-scale investigation for others," said National Republican Congressional Committee spokesman Carl Forti.
Tom DeLay resigned as House Republican Majority Leader, because he was indicted and Republican Rules (not House rules) require that.Nancy Pelosi has not resigned, even though she was found guilty of having a "fund-raising committee. . .improperly accept[] donations over federal limits" and fined $21,000.
This is why we dont win elections,NO CONSERVATIVE BACKBONE.
Raise hell about this and all the other Dems breaking the rules.Use you voice,and make it loud.If we ever want to win another election or have a voice on what goes on in our country we better get just as mean and nasty as the Dems.This PC crap needs to stop.

1196 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 7:59:30am

re: #1190 karmic_inquisitor

Whoa! Let's hold off on cutting off our nose to spite our face a little while longer. I am doing what I can to get you the needed reinforcements. Look around this thread- I've been calling for party involvement for weeks, ad I finally have Lizards taking up the call. Get some other like minded people to join you and let's get to work.

1197 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:02:24am

re: #1119 Sharmuta
Re-post from that NC Teacher thread:
"re: #359 Charles
With all due respect Charles, those are Newt's words
supposedly made in 1995 to a reporter for an on-line magazine that says

The American Prospect was founded in 1990 as an authoritative magazine of liberal ideas, committed to a just society, an enriched democracy, and effective liberal politics. Robert Kuttner, Robert Reich, and Paul Starr launched the magazine initially as a quarterly.
Since then, the Prospect has grown into a magazine with a paid circulation of more than 37,000, a special in-depth report in most issues, and a daily Web magazine with more than 1 million unique monthly visitors.

Our mission, simply put, is to rise to the momentous occasion that confronts all Americans who seek a just society built on our greatest traditions. Contemporary conservatism stands to thwart those traditions; it advances its agenda by way of stealth, fear-mongering, and a massive propaganda apparatus. It is our mission to expose that agenda and the lies that support it.


[emphasis realwest]
Mind you, I'm not a "Newt for President" fan or anything of the type, but it would seem to me that the American Prospect might have an axe to grind, no?
Not to mention that this was from 2007 (the article I mean) and I don't know if Newt really believes this or not - he is every bit the political animal that John Podesta and Emanuel are.
Anyone know where to reach Mr. Gingrich so I can ask him point blank if these are his words and if he still believes in them?"

Unless you've got more recent information about Newt's stand on Creationism, I view it highly doubtful (the 2007 article was about how excited Newt was to have discovered a dinosaur bone while on a bona-fide archeological dig). As I say, I don't think Newt's a particularly good man because of the way he treated two sick wives among other things, but I don't know that putting him on the Creationist side of things is necessarily correct.

1198 JCM  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:04:23am

re: #1196 Sharmuta

Whoa! Let's hold off on cutting off our nose to spite our face a little while longer. I am doing what I can to get you the needed reinforcements. Look around this thread- I've been calling for party involvement for weeks, ad I finally have Lizards taking up the call. Get some other like minded people to join you and let's get to work.

That's the correct tack. For better or worse, that's what has to be done.

1199 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:04:32am

re: #1193 nonic

#1127 Mandy

"Isn't that the same thing as the government forcing the market to stop speech?"

No. The government doesn't stop the speech at any point. What it does is require MORE speech.

The station decides AS AN ECONOMIC ISSUE what they will broadcast. The government's not forcing them. They can choose to broadcast a program that loses them money. Or they can choose not to.

I see it as the government using (forcing was the wrong word) the market to ensure that the right will not have a voice.

Whatever, the effect is the same.

1200 rightside  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:04:50am

Morning Lizards, on my way to buy a nice new pump shotgun. Sales are brisk throughout the country, and I need to get what I can, while I still can!

1201 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:05:31am

Mandy Manners

And another thing, about "community service"...

They don't have to FORCE anybody to do anything. As it reads now, a college student who does 100 hours of service will receive a refundable credit (in other words, a check in the mail) for $4,000.

Students who do not do the service do not get the check.

No forcing involved.

The Supreme Court has already approved this kind of system regarding federal money to states for roads and bridges and so forth.

Incidentally, $4,000 for 100 hours is $40 an hour.

Do you make $40 an hour? Who does?

Why would a kid work for minimum wage bagging groceries all summer long and weekends when he can get $40 an hour for 5 weeks, 20 hours a week, in the summer -- and then have twice as much money as he would have had working to go play the rest of the summer?

1202 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:06:02am

re: #1200 rightside

Morning Lizards, on my way to buy a nice new pump shotgun. Sales are brisk throughout the country, and I need to get what I can, while I still can!

Mossberg?
We got a 20 gauge about 3 months ago. I am too small to handle the 12 gauge.

1203 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:06:11am

re: #1191 Wishing

OK i emailed my local GOP (Women Republicans). I just hate office work though. Hope there is something else I can do that will make a small difference.

Awesome! I'm not going to lie to you- a lot of it is boring as hell, but your voice will be heard better from within than from without.

I will tell you another little story on how this works. I had a chance to work on debate prep for a local candidate. When I suggested he change his rhetoric from "cutting spending" to "prioritize spending" the entire group agreed. This young man was also busy door knocking, having a hard time explaining to his potential constituents that he was a modern republican. I asked him to try telling folks he was a "classical liberal" and tell me how that went. He told me the next day, it went over incredibly. People really responded to it. These are literally small things that add up to making a difference, but would have not happened without my just getting involved.

1204 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:07:14am

re: #1201 nonic

Mandy Manners

And another thing, about "community service"...

They don't have to FORCE anybody to do anything. As it reads now, a college student who does 100 hours of service will receive a refundable credit (in other words, a check in the mail) for $4,000.

Students who do not do the service do not get the check.

No forcing involved.

The Supreme Court has already approved this kind of system regarding federal money to states for roads and bridges and so forth.

Incidentally, $4,000 for 100 hours is $40 an hour.

Do you make $40 an hour? Who does?

Why would a kid work for minimum wage bagging groceries all summer long and weekends when he can get $40 an hour for 5 weeks, 20 hours a week, in the summer -- and then have twice as much money as he would have had working to go play the rest of the summer?

I don't think this one is going to fly. We already have a program for kids that age to do community service in return for a stipend and a big chunk of college change at the end. Americorps. They don't make anywhere near $40 an hour.

1205 Maximu§  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:07:33am

Firend of mine who is Mormon asked that I volinteer to help their Church in Santa Monica defend against Gay street thugs who will try and start a riot today. So, Ill put on my steeltoed boots, heavy levi's and long sleeve shirt, because I have a feeling it will get ugly. This is the 3rd day of "protests" and thats the day they usually lose their marbles and scream for blood.

He says they need big guys, who are ugly and look mean, so after a cup of coffie Im off. I wish I could take my son and a company of his friends with me.

1206 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:07:37am

re: #1190 karmic_inquisitor

I am not talking about third party nonsense.

I am talking about switching teams.

I can have more effect on policy needed for these country over there than over here if we become the party of moral purity.

How? The socons have more in common philosophically with the fiscons than the Marxists in ascendancy in the DNC.

1207 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:08:29am

re: #1201 nonic

Beats me.

What will be the impact on the taxpayers?

1208 jim in virginia  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:08:30am

Reader response to WaPo election coverage
The writer lives in my neighborhood. Heck of a nice guy, I think he posts here too.

1209 ArmyWife  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:08:39am

This is what I think -

1. Environment - we need to be good stewards. It has nothing to do with global warming, cooling, climate change, climate regression, whatever whatever. Its common sense, no reason at all to get crazy. The Eco whack jobs are killing manufacturing in the US, forcing it to other Countries that have little to no regulation and the unintended consequence is more harm done. The EPA has detrimental effects on our economy. Does that mean we don't have any regulations? Of course not. We just don't go crazy.

2. Religion - We simply protect the right TO be religious, not insist on BEING religious. We do point out Islam doesn't count as religion, though.

3. Economy - Capitalism. Its what's for the Country.

4. Education - Back to the core principles, vouchers for private school, accountability, no patience at all for socialist indoctrination or junk science. Do teach analytical thinking and logic.

In summary, small government, large military, strong belief the Constitution says what it says, advocate responsibility, accountability and encourage self sufficiency.

1210 rightside  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:08:48am

re: #1202 Wishing

Either a Mossberg 500, or maybe a Remington tactical. Either one I will replace the standard stock with a foldable one, and a pistol grip. 20 is good too, much better to have something you can accurately wield, then something you can't control.

1211 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:08:49am

re: #1203 Sharmuta

Awesome! I'm not going to lie to you- a lot of it is boring as hell, but your voice will be heard better from within than from without.

I will tell you another little story on how this works. I had a chance to work on debate prep for a local candidate. When I suggested he change his rhetoric from "cutting spending" to "prioritize spending" the entire group agreed. This young man was also busy door knocking, having a hard time explaining to his potential constituents that he was a modern republican. I asked him to try telling folks he was a "classical liberal" and tell me how that went. He told me the next day, it went over incredibly. People really responded to it. These are literally small things that add up to making a difference, but would have not happened without my just getting involved.

I have never been involved in politics (except in high school, president of my class, two terms lol), so I am a bit nervous. But I would far rather do debate prep than envelope stuffing, any day.

1212 JCM  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:09:08am

re: #1205 Maximu§

Firend of mine who is Mormon asked that I volinteer to help their Church in Santa Monica defend against Gay street thugs who will try and start a riot today. So, Ill put on my steeltoed boots, heavy levi's and long sleeve shirt, because I have a feeling it will get ugly. This is the 3rd day of "protests" and thats the day they usually lose their marbles and scream for blood.

He says they need big guys, who are ugly and look mean, so after a cup of coffie Im off. I wish I could take my son and a company of his friends with me.

Just so I get this straight, those asking, no demanding tolerance are threatening violence if they don't get want they want?

How tolerant!

Would love to join you.

1213 fish  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:09:23am

re: #516 scion9

Brave New World, from 1932 is a lot more prophetic than Idiocracy. It is the Dystopian novel to read for modern America.

The Giver is entertaining as well as an alegorical tale that ties together themes from several Dystopian novels and short stories into a whole that is a page turner suited to young adults.

Just wanted to mention that I enjoyed both of those books quite a bit.

1214 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:09:29am

re: #1172 3 wood
Hey my friend, that'd be great - that's one of two good songs I know of that Don McClean wrote! LOL!
I bet it'll sound really good on Dulcimer, too!

1215 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:09:37am

re: #1197 realwest

I have yet to see anything that suggests Newt understands the importance of science education in this country. He's a great history professor, and has a lot of great ideas, but unless I see he's gotten a clue about science, I can't support him anymore. Believe me- it breaks my heart.

1216 wrenchwench  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:09:45am

re: #1205 Maximu§

He says they need big guys, who are ugly and look mean, so after a cup of coffie Im off.

Coffee makes me ugly and mean too.

/took me 3 years to quit, a long time ago...

1217 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:09:58am

#1199 Mandy

You are ABSOLUTELY RIGHT. It is exactly the same thing.

The CRUCIAL difference, however, is that brute force would be illegal. Requiring "fairness" would not be.

1218 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:10:07am

re: #1205 Maximu§

Firend of mine who is Mormon asked that I volinteer to help their Church in Santa Monica defend against Gay street thugs who will try and start a riot today. So, Ill put on my steeltoed boots, heavy levi's and long sleeve shirt, because I have a feeling it will get ugly. This is the 3rd day of "protests" and thats the day they usually lose their marbles and scream for blood.

He says they need big guys, who are ugly and look mean, so after a cup of coffie Im off. I wish I could take my son and a company of his friends with me.

Where are the police?

1219 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:10:18am

re: #1205 Maximu§

Firend of mine who is Mormon asked that I volinteer to help their Church in Santa Monica defend against Gay street thugs who will try and start a riot today. So, Ill put on my steeltoed boots, heavy levi's and long sleeve shirt, because I have a feeling it will get ugly. This is the 3rd day of "protests" and thats the day they usually lose their marbles and scream for blood.

He says they need big guys, who are ugly and look mean, so after a cup of coffie Im off. I wish I could take my son and a company of his friends with me.

Gosh! Be careful! Can you imagine? This kind of thing going on in the USofA!

1220 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:10:40am

re: #1174 jorline
Good morning jorline! I'm doing ok today, how are you feeling? Still got that "cold" weather down in Texas?!

1221 rightside  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:10:58am

re: #1208 jim in virginia

LOL, nice job. I wonder who that Jim guy is?

1222 JCM  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:11:00am

re: #1209 ArmyWife

This is what I think -

1. Environment - we need to be good stewards. It has nothing to do with global warming, cooling, climate change, climate regression, whatever whatever. Its common sense, no reason at all to get crazy. The Eco whack jobs are killing manufacturing in the US, forcing it to other Countries that have little to no regulation and the unintended consequence is more harm done. The EPA has detrimental effects on our economy. Does that mean we don't have any regulations? Of course not. We just don't go crazy.

2. Religion - We simply protect the right TO be religious, not insist on BEING religious. We do point out Islam doesn't count as religion, though.

3. Economy - Capitalism. Its what's for the Country.

4. Education - Back to the core principles, vouchers for private school, accountability, no patience at all for socialist indoctrination or junk science. Do teach analytical thinking and logic.

In summary, small government, large military, strong belief the Constitution says what it says, advocate responsibility, accountability and encourage self sufficiency.

I would correct one thing, Islam gets the same consideration as all religions, but it must extend that consideration as well as receive it. They choose how their religion gets treated.

1223 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:11:31am

re: #1217 nonic

#1199 Mandy

You are ABSOLUTELY RIGHT. It is exactly the same thing.

The CRUCIAL difference, however, is that brute force would be illegal. Requiring "fairness" would not be.

Force is still force, no matter how silky the glove covering the steel fist.

1224 Maximu§  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:11:33am

re: #1212 JCM

Just so I get this straight, those asking, no demanding tolerance are threatening violence if they don't get want they want?

How tolerant!

Would love to join you.

Here I am a Catholic going over to help the Mormon's...pretty funny huh?

1225 ArmyWife  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:11:42am

re: #1201 nonic
$40/hr is ~$83,000/yr. A lot of people make that or more.

1226 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:11:43am

re: #1212 JCM

Just so I get this straight, those asking, no demanding tolerance are threatening violence if they don't get want they want?

How tolerant!

Would love to join you.

It is always downright mind-boggling to me how those that scream the very loudest for tolerance, respect and their "rights" are simultaneously the very first to have no tolerance or respect for those who disagree with them. They don't really want tolerance and respect. What they want is "my way or the highway."

1227 Irene NYC  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:12:16am

re: #1225 ArmyWife

$40/hr is ~$83,000/yr. A lot of people make that or more.

Not many college students do, though.

1228 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:12:36am

Ya know, I don't buy that stuff that Obama is a closet Muslim.
He converted to Christianity so ok.
I will tell you though, that if after his Inauguration speech, he screams 'Allah Akbar" I will be suspicious.

1229 ArmyWife  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:13:24am

re: #1222 JCM

We can agree to disagree on this one. I have trouble with a group claiming to be a religion when its core tenants require my head be removed from my body. Sorry.

1230 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:13:44am

re: #1227 Irene NYC

Not many college students do, though.

Not many new college grads make that. No one in our military makes even close to that. Restaurant managers for the most part don't come close. Frankly, that is an obscene amount of money for 100 hours of community service.

1231 JCM  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:14:32am

re: #1224 Maximu§

Here I am a Catholic going over to help the Mormon's...pretty funny huh?

I'm Evangelical, I'd be there with you if I could.

I spent a lot of time here early in the campaign defending Romney against some Mormon bashing.

We get the big picture, we they start coming for one of us, we all are on the list.

1232 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:14:50am

re: #1225 ArmyWife

$40/hr is ~$83,000/yr. A lot of people make that or more.

The zero will it.

1233 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:14:59am

re: #1186 Irene NYC

It's very simple. Obama is gonna tax people who played by the rules and REDISTRIBUTE the gains of their labor to his supporters and cronies. There will be lots of "creative destruction" of language. There will also be a lot of creative destruction of the dollar - but it will take a while for people to catch onto that.

They also have plans to confiscate your 401k's. So then, when you want your monthly draw down to pay your bills with, you have to go through them, and they will demand you do certain "work".


Just repeat the new mantra: From each according to their ability, to each according to their need (and willingness to comply).

1234 Maximu§  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:15:07am

re: #1218 MandyManners

Where are the police?

The LAPD will be there, but so will we. I'm not gonna stand there and let these Nazi's start burning down churches.

1235 ArmyWife  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:15:35am

re: #1227 Irene NYC

Agreed, but that wasn't the point in the post. On the other hand, my 17 year old earns $45/hr for riding lessons. She doesn't give them 40/hrs a week though!

1236 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:15:50am

re: #1211 Wishing

My advice is to be patient. It takes awhile in a lot of cases.

But one of the other things that happened that night was we all had some drinks after we were done with debate prep.

(I have never forgotten the look of my former BPOU chair's face during my first meeting. He asked what was the opinion of the newbie and looked at me. So I asked, "What is the goal here? To get more republicans elected?" Everyone at the table picked up their pens and started writing notes while his jaw hit the table.)

So after a few drinks, the new chair of that BPOU and I were talking and turned to Capt. Bob (the former head) and I asked him what his thoughts were of me after that first meeting. He said, "that you were a go-getter". Be a go-getter- Lord knows we need them in this party.

1237 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:16:02am

re: #1223 MandyManners

Force is still force, no matter how silky the glove covering the steel fist.

Iron?

1238 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:16:26am

^tax it.

1239 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:16:58am

re: #1103 Sharmuta

Part of the problem is our side does not know how to effectively communicate our ideas and ideals. We don't even know how to debate a point. We have our work cut out for us.

It's a challenge for sure. Socialism appeals to the emotions and to a short-sighted, childlike view of "fairness." And socialism has strong natural appeal because it's tribal, and we evolved in tribal societies. Of course we can never entirely eliminate socialism ... government itself is a concession to socialism. Finally, the nature of many socialists is that they cannot be reasoned out of their position, because they didn't reason themselves into it. It's emotional. It's "being fair." That it doesn't work and that it's contrary to the principle of individual liberty is beside the point. It doesn't really matter. All that matters is the endless struggle for elusive "social justice." (Note how we see churches supporting candidates who promise to help "the poor," as if it's the job of the government and not the church itself to show compassion and charity to the poor.)

And finally there are those thugs and elites who crave power over the lives of others, the power to engineer society, who recognize socialism as the perfect tool for instituting tyranny.

The Founding Fathers rejected most of those things that lead to tyranny, no matter what "good" they might be intended to accomplish. What they had to keep they carefully restrained with checks and balances. They did not so much organize a new society as they sought to maximize individual liberty (including the freedom to succeed or fail) within the framework of the rule of law, thus avoiding chaos while maximizing creativity and productivity. In the end, this system lifts more people out of poverty than socialism ever can ... even though it was not devised to accomplish that goal.

Even though it seems like this should be obvious to anyone who just looks around, it takes some thought and some awareness of history that lots of people just don't seem to have time for. And remember, many of these people are not interested in rational debate, they're not going to listen to the most eloquently constructed argument, they do not have the attitude that they are willing even theoretically to be persuaded and change their views if someone presents facts and arguments to demonstrate those views are wrong. Their belief in Obama and what he's selling is a religion, it's a global worldview, it's a political Age of Aquarius. Thus, even when Obama's policies hit many of them directly, they will not be capable of admitting the policies are wrong. That would be repudiating their faith, the worldview upon which they base all their hope and identity. They will instead blame the "other," embrace their poverty and commit themselves ever more strongly to the 'cause' and the 'struggle' for social justice.

These fanatics we can't hope to persuade, but I suspect the vast majority of those who voted for Obama aren't like that and, of those, a significant percentage are teachable and persuadable.

1240 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:17:00am

re: #1234 Maximu§

The LAPD will be there, but so will we. I'm not gonna stand there and let these Nazi's start burning down churches.

Bless your heart!

1241 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:17:07am

re: #1228 opnion

Ya know, I don't buy that stuff that Obama is a closet Muslim.
He converted to Christianity so ok.
I will tell you though, that if after his Inauguration speech, he screams 'Allah Akbar" I will be suspicious.

Yeah, but 52% of the electorate will not be?

1242 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:17:44am

re: #1225 ArmyWife

$40/hr is ~$83,000/yr. A lot of people make that or more.

that's up there on the individual income scale. I'd bet that if you are fresh out of high school, in the university or fresh out of it, and making that; you are dealing drugs.

1243 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:17:50am

re: #1209 ArmyWife

This is what I think -

1. Environment - we need to be good stewards. It has nothing to do with global warming, cooling, climate change, climate regression, whatever whatever. Its common sense, no reason at all to get crazy. The Eco whack jobs are killing manufacturing in the US, forcing it to other Countries that have little to no regulation and the unintended consequence is more harm done. The EPA has detrimental effects on our economy. Does that mean we don't have any regulations? Of course not. We just don't go crazy.

2. Religion - We simply protect the right TO be religious, not insist on BEING religious. We do point out Islam doesn't count as religion, though.

3. Economy - Capitalism. Its what's for the Country.

4. Education - Back to the core principles, vouchers for private school, accountability, no patience at all for socialist indoctrination or junk science. Do teach analytical thinking and logic.

In summary, small government, large military, strong belief the Constitution says what it says, advocate responsibility, accountability and encourage self sufficiency.

Watch out- the soc-cons will tell you you are trying to moderate the party, you flaming RINO!

1244 Taqyia2Me  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:18:19am

re: #1153 MandyManners

It still would be an enormous drag of the court to the left. And, who's to say that a conservative justice or two doesn't come down with a delibitating illness or die in an accident?

"accident"

1245 JCM  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:18:37am

re: #1229 ArmyWife

We can agree to disagree on this one. I have trouble with a group claiming to be a religion when its core tenants require my head be removed from my body. Sorry.

If they insist on that point yes, I agree. But there are Muslims who live with us peacefully. We have to give them the opportunity to join in modern tolerant society, if we don't leave them an out we just radicalize all of them.

1246 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:18:40am

re: #1225 ArmyWife

$40/hr is ~$83,000/yr. A lot of people make that or more.

To put this into perspective, the median family income in the US in 2007 was $50,233.00. For those who do not remember their statistics, "median" is the point where half of all households earn above that figure and half earn below that figure.

$83,000 for a single college kid seems pretty over the top.

1247 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:19:24am

re: #1179 karmic_inquisitor
Gee ya know, I thought it was all those illegal immigrants and the expansion of the San Francisco mindset that doomed the Republican Party in California.
Indeed, Obama BOUGHT this election. Period.
And in fact if you check out this map: [Link: www.washingtonpost.com...] it would appear that it was the urban areas - particularly LA and SF that put Obama waay over the top.
I've never considered Rush my voice and have already indicated that I'm not a fan of Newt's, but I don't see any ideological purges going on anywhere.
I think the Republican part has to make up it's mind whether it's going back to the idea of smaller, less intrusive government, more fiscally responsible government and remain strong on National Defense (which would include securing our own damn borders) or whether it intends to be a pale imitation of the "Big Tent" Leftist party.
If you have some constructive ideas as to what Republicans should do, I'd surely like to hear them.

1248 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:19:46am

re: #1236 Sharmuta
Be a go-getter- Lord knows we need them in this party.

Well I wont have a problem with enthusiasm. I just dont want it to be dampened by the mind-numbing stuff. That will be a total turn-off for me.
I love the role of underdog: nationally, we will have to fight and scrape for every inch.

1249 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:20:07am

re: #1226 galloping granny

It is always downright mind-boggling to me how those that scream the very loudest for tolerance, respect and their "rights" are simultaneously the very first to have no tolerance or respect for those who disagree with them. They don't really want tolerance and respect. What they want is "my way or the highway."

"Tolerance" is defined as moonbats get whatever they want just as "fair speech" is going to be defined as hard lefties get to say whatever they want.

1250 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:20:07am

Report: Plans for Auschwitz found in Berlin apartment
Head of Germany's federal archives calls copies of some of 28 plans for construction of Nazi extermination camp 'authentic proof of systematically planned genocide of Jews of Europe'

[Link: www.ynetnews.com...]

When asked for a response Arafat said: " But I bet they didn't find the plans for that fake Jewish Temple in Jerusalem?

1251 Joan  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:20:27am

re: #1196 Sharmuta

Whoa! Let's hold off on cutting off our nose to spite our face a little while longer. I am doing what I can to get you the needed reinforcements. Look around this thread- I've been calling for party involvement for weeks, ad I finally have Lizards taking up the call. Get some other like minded people to join you and let's get to work.

Your most effective post pointed out that we are a political party, not a religious party. Nothing precludes acting on particular pet religious convictions as part of separate or ancillary networks. Example: the Democratic political party does not officially place pacifism as a central goal and moral tenet. But pacifism is one current, a strong one, in the "great river" of Democratic base supporters. Okay, I'm not a political type, but can you get my drift?

The model and the "party culture" we need to examine and adapt to this task really is, however, the Democrats. The entire spectacle of the slime Palin phenomenon is a prime example. Of course many Republican activists and staffers did not like her, or the horse she rode in on. But it is a Pyhrric victory to diminish her by the means used. Our enemies lapped it up and were sneering and farting in our general direction for days after the collapse.

1) How do they deal with their zealots?
2) How do they keep discipline?
3) How do they instill solidarity?

1252 jorline  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:20:47am

re: #1220 realwest

Good morning jorline! I'm doing ok today, how are you feeling? Still got that "cold" weather down in Texas?!

Hey, RW. We were in the high 50's this morning, but headed toward the low 80's this afternoon.
Sorry for the delay, had to take the deposits to the bank.

1253 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:21:35am

Huckabee was on FNC this morning. They were doing a post morteum on the election. Huck got agitated & said that it was time to thank McCain for a vigorous campaign & move on.
That's nonsense, lessons need to be learned. Don't nominate a weak candidate based on some kind of seniority. Make the Open primary states Closed. If the MSM loves a Republican, that is probably a bad sign.
Nominate a reasonable Republican, but above all a Republican who did not get popular with the other team by supporting them.

1254 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:22:29am

re: #1253 opnion

Huckabee was on FNC this morning. They were doing a post morteum on the election. Huck got agitated & said that it was time to thank McCain for a vigorous campaign & move on.
That's nonsense, lessons need to be learned. Don't nominate a weak candidate based on some kind of seniority. Make the Open primary states Closed. If the MSM loves a Republican, that is probably a bad sign.
Nominate a reasonable Republican, but above all a Republican who did not get popular with the other team by supporting them.

The ones who smeared Palin need to be named and shamed.

1255 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:22:34am

re: #1242 spidly

that's up there on the individual income scale. I'd bet that if you are fresh out of high school, in the university or fresh out of it, and making that; you are dealing drugs.

2007 Census data shows median real earnings for men who worked full time as $45,113 and for women who worked full time as $35,102. The median income per household member in 2006 was $26,036, counting all persons age 14+ as household members.

That $83K is WAY up there.

1256 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:24:14am

Sources: MTA To Toll All East River Bridges

[Link: wcbstv.com...]

Oh yeah, that's gonna do wonders for the traffic?

1257 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:24:20am

re: #1241 Nevergiveup

Yeah, but 52% of the electorate will not be?

True, the One transcends all!

1258 3 wood  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:26:29am

re: #1247 realwest

I tend to boil things down to their most simple denominator. Can lead to over generalizing I know, but that's how i analyze things.

To me the choice boils down to this.

To join with the Marxists taking over Washington, or not.

I'll rot in Hell first.

1259 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:26:36am

re: #1254 MandyManners

The ones who smeared Palin need to be named and shamed.

The conventional wisdom seems to be that McCain aide Wallace is one of the perps. She is all over the tube lately & it does look like damage control.

1260 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:27:02am

#1223 Mandy

Again, you're right. But they can get away with what amounts to force, as long as they do it legally.

As for how would the current plan for "community service" affect the taxpayer, well, for one thing it would be expensive.

But I also wonder about its coincidental and unintended consequences.

---What would be the effect on employers who can't hire kids to do low-wage jobs?

---What would be the effect on illegals and other immigrants who can't get jobs doing work that has suddenly become "community service"?

---And what kind of work actually would be "community service"?

---And since $40 a hour is a lot of money to pass up, if kids don't take jobs that pay less but give them real-world experience, how will that effect their budding careers?

--- Will this turn into an entitlement program that will be next to impossible to get rid of?

---How easy will it be to "game" and defraud the system? Will people be able to register for college and get their checks but not actually be college students?

---And a biggie... will the colleges see this an another golden opportunity to RAISE TUITION again?, like they have done all along with the availability of student loan money?

1261 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:27:09am

re: #1251 Joan

They are the party of collectivists, while we are the party that values individualism. They don't have a hard time controlling their people because everyone stays within the borg collective. Those who do not, are shunned. Joe Lieberman, anyone? The shunning is two-fold. It removes the individual, obviously, but it's also Pavlovian conditioning to show the rest of the collective what NOT to do.

The problem is, now we're trying to be like them in shunning anyone who disagrees with certain so-called conservative tenets by calling them a RINO and calls for purges. I don't want to purge the soc-cons. I just want them to keep their religion out of the political agenda. They should shift their religious energy towards their church and do that good work there.

1262 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:27:44am

re: #1255 galloping granny

2007 Census data shows median real earnings for men who worked full time as $45,113 and for women who worked full time as $35,102. The median income per household member in 2006 was $26,036, counting all persons age 14+ as household members.

That $83K is WAY up there.

My base pay is right there at the median but due to OT I'm quite a bit above that. And I've been doing my job for a good while and I'm very good at what I do if I must say. Now that there's no OT I'm looking fro side work or a part time gig. the thought that I'm going to be paying for some little snot...

1263 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:28:18am

re: #1259 opnion

The conventional wisdom seems to be that McCain aide Wallace is one of the perps. She is all over the tube lately & it does look like damage control.

Has anyone actually SAID it was Nicole?

1264 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:28:32am

re: #1253 opnion

Huckabee was on FNC this morning. They were doing a post morteum on the election. Huck got agitated & said that it was time to thank McCain for a vigorous campaign & move on.
That's nonsense, lessons need to be learned. Don't nominate a weak candidate based on some kind of seniority. Make the Open primary states Closed. If the MSM loves a Republican, that is probably a bad sign.
Nominate a reasonable Republican, but above all a Republican who did not get popular with the other team by supporting them.

I think he wants to move on so we don't sit and figure out what the problem is. He knows what the problem is... he's part of it. So hurry up and move on and don't look at that man behind the curtain!

1265 nyc redneck  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:28:44am

i have ODS this morning.

1266 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:29:06am

re: #1254 MandyManners

The ones who smeared Palin need to be named and shamed.

Palin is GOOD for our party. I am praying she stays active on the national level, and wrote her a note expressing that.
We need people who saw what Palin went through in the MSM (never mind the Rep Party!) and are STILL willing to stand up and fight.
Small government, common-sense budgets, encouragement for entrepreneurs, all of this MUST be part of what we decide to do, going forward.
Sadly, everyone is spying and prying into people's backgrounds, as we did for the Zero; most of us have skeletons we would rather keep in the closet. It does make the memoryhole more appealing when we consider candidates who have to do the public fighting in 2 years.

1267 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:29:26am

#1225 Army Wife

"$40/hr is ~$83,000/yr. A lot of people make that or more."

Sure. But not for unskilled labor from a college age kid.

1268 Irene NYC  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:29:36am

Frankly, I think the Republican party and conservatives need a makeover big time. It's very hard to buck the general zeitgeist of our age. Since the 60s, "revolution" is what this society has been enthralled with. (Name me one product that isn't referred to as revolutionary.) "Conservative" as a moniker just says you're a has been.

Why make life any harder for ourselves? We need to rebrand conservatism - like Sharmuta noted above, take back "classical liberal." That also has the intrigue factor - "What's a classical liberal?"

And the RNC needs to start a big campaign along the lines of, "This ain't your daddy's Republican party anymore."

1269 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:29:37am

re: #1265 nyc redneck

i have ODS this morning.

does pamprin help that?

1270 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:29:58am

re: #1260 nonic

#1223 Mandy

Again, you're right. But they can get away with what amounts to force, as long as they do it legally.

As for how would the current plan for "community service" affect the taxpayer, well, for one thing it would be expensive.

But I also wonder about its coincidental and unintended consequences.

---What would be the effect on employers who can't hire kids to do low-wage jobs?

---What would be the effect on illegals and other immigrants who can't get jobs doing work that has suddenly become "community service"?

---And what kind of work actually would be "community service"?

---And since $40 a hour is a lot of money to pass up, if kids don't take jobs that pay less but give them real-world experience, how will that effect their budding careers?

--- Will this turn into an entitlement program that will be next to impossible to get rid of?

---How easy will it be to "game" and defraud the system? Will people be able to register for college and get their checks but not actually be college students?

---And a biggie... will the colleges see this an another golden opportunity to RAISE TUITION again?, like they have done all along with the availability of student loan money?

Maybe this is a chance for them to create another Cloward-Piven situation but, in a more rapid manner than the mortgage crisis.

1271 jorline  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:30:01am

In the immortal words of Rodney King.

1272 fish  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:30:15am

I just want to go on the record, seeing as the whole creationist thing seems to be a litmus test around here.

1) I believe in God.
2) I believe God created the universe.
3) I believe that the earth is approximately 4.5 billion years old
4) I believe Dinosaurs were real and once roamed the Earth.
5) I believe in the "Big Bang" and feel that a "Creator" is the only logical explanation for its existence.
6) I believe the Hand of God is the most logical explanation for the sudden leap in Intelligence from "Neanderthal Man" to "Modern Human" Which most paleontologists believe co-existed.
7) I went to a public high school which discussed "ID" in a limited way in both science and Social Sciences Classes. In science stating simply that there are certain gaps in what science is currently able to explain and that some people believe this to be proof of a creator. In social Science class it was discussed as a way many people combine Scientific fact with religious belief.
8) I do not believe any of this disqualifies me from public service.
9) I further believe that evolution is real and not just a theory.

If any of this makes my opinions less valid in any ones minds then I can easily go back to not posting at all.

1273 ArmyWife  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:30:45am

re: #1230 galloping granny

Not true. My husband, a 1SG makes $75,019.20 when not receiving flight pay. This is base pay and BAH. This, to me, is not a lot of money considering what he does and that he has been in 18 years. I've been in the workforce 9 years doing something much less dangerous and honorable earning quite a bit more. There is something fundamentally wrong with that picture. Even more wrong is people in the military paying federal taxes to pay their own salaries. Even more MORE wrong is our combined income under the proposed Obama Tax Fiasco results in me being ridden hard and put away wet!

That being said, please don't mistake my counterpoint as agreement with this program, I was only replying to "$40/hour, who makes that?"

1274 nyc redneck  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:31:02am

re: #1269 spidly

does pamprin help that?

i doubt it. maybe some hard work.
i think i'll go out and put chicken wire around the small blueberry bushes.

1275 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:31:29am

re: #1267 nonic

#1225 Army Wife

"$40/hr is ~$83,000/yr. A lot of people make that or more."

Sure. But not for unskilled labor from a college age kid.

Doing "community service" no less. Around here that means picking up garbage beside the road, mowing the courthouse lawn. handing out stuff at the local food pantry or manning the recycling center. Maybe collecting stuff for the local animal shelter. Nothing anyone ever gets $40 an hour for.

1276 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:31:32am

re: #1268 Irene NYC

And "classical liberal" was well received when used by a young man running for office. Sadly, he was introduced to that term way to late in his campaign, but he's running again in two years, and he'll be using it.

1277 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:31:38am

re: #1263 MandyManners

Has anyone actually SAID it was Nicole?

Yeah a couple of people on the radio. It was local programming in Chicago.
Add to that a couple of people on FNC (pundits) have said they suspect a 'Female" in the McCain campaign. I wish I could recall who said it, but I do not.

1278 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:31:54am

re: #1266 Wishing

Palin is GOOD for our party. I am praying she stays active on the national level, and wrote her a note expressing that.
We need people who saw what Palin went through in the MSM (never mind the Rep Party!) and are STILL willing to stand up and fight.
Small government, common-sense budgets, encouragement for entrepreneurs, all of this MUST be part of what we decide to do, going forward.
Sadly, everyone is spying and prying into people's backgrounds, as we did for the Zero; most of us have skeletons we would rather keep in the closet. It does make the memoryhole more appealing when we consider candidates who have to do the public fighting in 2 years.

Unless someone is a pedophile or serial adulterer or is into goats, I don't care much about her/his sex life. What matters to me is integrity.

1279 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:32:50am

re: #1268 Irene NYC


And the RNC needs to start a big campaign along the lines of, "This ain't your daddy's Republican party anymore."

It should be "This ain't your daddy's Republican party anymore, but with your help, it will again"

1280 ArmyWife  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:32:59am

re: #1243 Sharmuta

Oh dammit. Do I have to go to confession now with our RNC?

1281 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:33:17am

re: #1272 fish

You are not alone fish. And more than a few that I know who agree with you are themselves scientists. Several of whom post here - though not often on the ID threads.

1282 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:33:20am

re: #1264 Sharmuta

I think he wants to move on so we don't sit and figure out what the problem is. He knows what the problem is... he's part of it. So hurry up and move on and don't look at that man behind the curtain!

Exactly, Huckabee joine McCain in ganging up on Romney.
Huckabee wnts to slide in like McCain did. That would be another disaster.

1283 MajorPribluda  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:33:33am

re: #309 wahabicorridor

I have come down on the side of 'inborn condition' simply because the stigma of being gay has been so severe that I can't imagine anyone actually choosing it.

What a silly argument. As if the stigma of murder or child molestation accomplishes that. You are rationalizing.

1284 MrC_5150  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:33:34am

Is anyone experiencing a problem with Free Republic?

1285 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:33:47am

re: #1277 opnion

Yeah a couple of people on the radio. It was local programming in Chicago.
Add to that a couple of people on FNC (pundits) have said they suspect a 'Female" in the McCain campaign. I wish I could recall who said it, but I do not.

I wonder if she envied Palin.

1286 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:34:37am

re: #1278 MandyManners

Unless someone is a pedophile or serial adulterer or is into goats, I don't care much about her/his sex life. What matters to me is integrity.

lol sexual misconduct was NOT uppermost in my mind

1287 lawhawk  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:35:09am

re: #1256 Nevergiveup

Sources: MTA To Toll All East River Bridges

[Link: wcbstv.com...]

Oh yeah, that's gonna do wonders for the traffic?

It's not just tolls that are on the table, but the congestion pricing tax too.

Far from raising revenue like Bloomberg says, it will kill city businesses in one fell swoop.

1288 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:35:11am

re: #1283 MajorPribluda

What a silly argument. As if the stigma of murder or child molestation accomplishes that. You are rationalizing.

Please explain that.

1289 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:35:38am

re: #1286 Wishing

lol sexual misconduct was NOT uppermost in my mind

It is in a lot of socons' minds.

1290 JCM  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:35:53am

re: #1272 fish

I'm an evangelical who believes in the Creator and His creation. The "litmus" test around here if there is one is the ability to distinguish between what is faith and what is science.

Charles has no beef with those of us who believe God created the universe.

The trouble starts if I call that science, and attempt to over throw establish science to teach non-science. Further complicating matters is those pushing that agenda do so for political reasons.

The last point is that those pushing this agenda from their own words and own documents are not doing it in anyway based on scripture. They goal is to use political mechanism for religious indoctrination.

1291 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:36:14am

re: #1287 lawhawk

It's not just tolls that are on the table, but the congestion pricing tax too.

Far from raising revenue like Bloomberg says, it will kill city businesses in one fell swoop.

City of London, here we come!

1292 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:36:23am

re: #1261 Sharmuta

They are the party of collectivists, while we are the party that values individualism. They don't have a hard time controlling their people because everyone stays within the borg collective. Those who do not, are shunned. Joe Lieberman, anyone? The shunning is two-fold. It removes the individual, obviously, but it's also Pavlovian conditioning to show the rest of the collective what NOT to do.

The problem is, now we're trying to be like them in shunning anyone who disagrees with certain so-called conservative tenets by calling them a RINO and calls for purges. I don't want to purge the soc-cons. I just want them to keep their religion out of the political agenda. They should shift their religious energy towards their church and do that good work there.

What do you mean 'collectivists'! I voted Obama to be different..just like...uh...everyone else..?

/moonbat off...

1293 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:36:27am

re: #1273 ArmyWife

Not true. My husband, a 1SG makes $75,019.20 when not receiving flight pay. This is base pay and BAH. This, to me, is not a lot of money considering what he does and that he has been in 18 years. I've been in the workforce 9 years doing something much less dangerous and honorable earning quite a bit more. There is something fundamentally wrong with that picture. Even more wrong is people in the military paying federal taxes to pay their own salaries. Even more MORE wrong is our combined income under the proposed Obama Tax Fiasco results in me being ridden hard and put away wet!

That being said, please don't mistake my counterpoint as agreement with this program, I was only replying to "$40/hour, who makes that?"

When my husband was an E6 he made something on the order of $300 a month. At any rate - your husband has EIGHTEEN years in the service. He is virtually at retirement age. You have a 17 year old child. That is nowhere close to the same thing as a high school aged kid earning the equivalent of $83K for volunteering. What do those kids the same age who work under your husband laying their entire lives on the line make these days? Surely kids picking up garbage beside the road deserve much less for their volunteerism.

1294 nyc redneck  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:36:43am

i woke up thinking that even tho pres. bush may have gaffed w/ making up and mispronounciating words, he would never be so gratuitously rude and hateful to an elderly lady.
i'm thinking we have a classless buffoon coming in, who will continue to try everyone's patience w/ his lack of basic decency and manners.
and we haven't even gotten to the dangerous stuff yet.

1295 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:37:07am

re: #1272 fish

I'm not sure what seems to make you think LGFers are hostile to people who believe in both God and the validity of evolution. Nothing could be further from the truth.

1296 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:37:13am

re: #1287 lawhawk

It's not just tolls that are on the table, but the congestion pricing tax too.

Far from raising revenue like Bloomberg says, it will kill city businesses in one fell swoop.

Well if you want to give him a third term, you get what you deserve.

1297 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:37:23am

re: #1289 MandyManners

It is in a lot of socons' minds.

For sure, but we have candidates running who may have pulled an Obama-like dalliance with radicals...stuff that they would just as soon forget, is all I mean.

1298 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:38:16am

re: #1290 JCM

I'm an evangelical who believes in the Creator and His creation. The "litmus" test around here if there is one is the ability to distinguish between what is faith and what is science.

Charles has no beef with those of us who believe God created the universe.

The trouble starts if I call that science, and attempt to over throw establish science to teach non-science. Further complicating matters is those pushing that agenda do so for political reasons.

The last point is that those pushing this agenda from their own words and own documents are not doing it in anyway based on scripture. They goal is to use political mechanism for religious indoctrination.

Well said, my friend!

1299 wrenchwench  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:38:19am

re: #1272 fish
As long as you don't think that religion should be taught in science class, I don't think you need to fear that the validity of your opinions will be challenged here on the basis of your religious beliefs.

1300 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:38:39am

re: #1215 Sharmuta
Well, as I said, I'm not a fan of Newt's for a lot of reasons, some of them political, but I haven't seen or heard him say anything at all about teaching creationism in science classes. I'd sure like to see some Republican or conservative leaders step up to the plate and say "we support a strong national defense and that includes securing our own borders, we support a small, fiscally conservative, government that does NOT intrude on people's personal lives - whether or not they are religious or atheistis or whatever [caveat here: I consider Islam to be a cult, not a religion] and what two (or more) consenting adults do in the privacy of their own homes from a sexual point of view is ENTIRELY their business, we believe in campagin finance reform as has every presidential candidate over the last 24 years except for Barack Hussein Obama, and we believe in Free Speech and Freedom of the Press.

1301 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:38:41am

re: #1294 nyc redneck

i woke up thinking that even tho pres. bush may have gaffed w/ making up and mispronounciating words, he would never be so gratuitously rude and hateful to an elderly lady.
i'm thinking we have a classless buffoon coming in, who will continue to try everyone's patience w/ his lack of basic decency and manners.
and we haven't even gotten to the dangerous stuff yet.

But President Bush is a gentleman. Always was always will be.

1302 Occasional Reader  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:38:49am

re: #1272 fish

I believe in the "Big Bang" and feel that a "Creator" is the only logical explanation for its existence.

No, that's faith, not logic.

I believe the Hand of God is the most logical explanation for the sudden leap in Intelligence from "Neanderthal Man" to "Modern Human"

Actually, the Neadnerthals had slightly larger brainpans, on average, than do modern humans. Nobody is really sure how intelligent they were.
And I reiterate my point about "logic".

1303 Irene NYC  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:39:11am

re: #1293 galloping granny

Hi granny,

Surely kids picking up garbage beside the road deserve much less for their volunteerism.


Just a note: picking up garbage and being paid for it is not didn't used to be known as "volunteerism."
/silly me, Obama's already redefined the word!
;)

1304 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:39:28am

re: #1285 MandyManners

I wonder if she envied Palin.

It would make some sense. Sarah Palin arrives to the campaign & makes a huge splash after Wallace had been doing a lot of heavy lifting. That could promote jealousy. Further one of the terms used was "Diva"
To me it sounds like a pejorative of one female to another.
A big complaint is that Palin did not value prep by Wallace enough before the Katie Couric interview.

1305 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:39:44am

re: #1297 Wishing

For sure, but we have candidates running who may have pulled an Obama-like dalliance with radicals...stuff that they would just as soon forget, is all I mean.

Pardon my density but, what does that mean?

1306 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:40:14am

re: #1300 realwest

Toss in a good word for the 2nd Amendment while your at it, please.

1307 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:40:23am

And this notion that soc-cons were a driving force of this election due to the vote in California on gay marriage is not holding weight with me. If that were true, how do they explain the vote in South Dakota on the ballot initiative on abortion?

1308 nonic  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:40:28am

#1245 JCM
#1229 Army Wife

I think what's at the core of your differences is the idea that islam should be respected as a RELIGION, i.e., a private way of worshipping God. But not tolerated as a political, legal, and financial system to be imposed on everyone else.

I don't care whether or how people worship God. Or who they think God is or the gods are. Couldn't care less.

As long as they keep that to themselves, we'll get along fine. Just don't expect me and mine to submit to shariah.

THAT'S the difference.

1309 galloping granny  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:40:40am

re: #1303 Irene NYC

Hi granny,

Just a note: picking up garbage and being paid for it is not didn't used to be known as "volunteerism."
/silly me, Obama's already redefined the word!
;)

True - I forgot the quotes. "volunteerism." But then I don't think anything that one is forced to do - or coerced to do through some reward or lack thereof - can rightly be defined as "volunteering."

1310 MandyManners  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:41:00am

re: #1304 opnion

It would make some sense. Sarah Palin arrives to the campaign & makes a huge splash after Wallace had been doing a lot of heavy lifting. That could promote jealousy. Further one of the terms used was "Diva"
To me it sounds like a pejorative of one female to another.
A big complaint is that Palin did not value prep by Wallace enough before the Katie Couric interview.

Women must put their claws away.

1311 aboo-Hoo-Hoo  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:41:25am

Lesson's in taking the world from a deep recession into a full-blown economic depression:

OPEC's next meeting must confirm that members have made all the oil output reductions they promised before taking any more action on output levels to prop up sagging prices...
[...]
"There will be a consensus in Oran, and this consensus will depend on the application of the reduction," Khelil said.

"If everyone has applied (the cuts) and everything in terms of prices stays at the levels we have today, it's of course clear that we will probably go towards a decision to reduce,"

Obummer better start producing miracles on an hourly basis.

1312 nyc redneck  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:41:33am

re: #1301 Nevergiveup

But President Bush is a gentleman. Always was always will be.

that is important for our society. we can't underestimate it. civility.
now, we have a self described "mutt" coming in.
we will see what he means by mutt.

1313 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:41:51am

re: #1307 Sharmuta

And this notion that soc-cons were a driving force of this election due to the vote in California on gay marriage is not holding weight with me. If that were true, how do they explain the vote in South Dakota on the ballot initiative on abortion?

South Dakota! A red state! Would a soc-con please care to explain it to me?

1314 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:42:05am

re: #1307 Sharmuta

And this notion that soc-cons were a driving force of this election due to the vote in California on gay marriage is not holding weight with me. If that were true, how do they explain the vote in South Dakota on the ballot initiative on abortion?

Or the fact that many who supported Obama also supported the Yes to Prop 8. (unless a boat load of 'soc-cons' want 'gumbint cheese', which they might.)

1315 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:42:14am

Mayor Bloomberg wants to nickel and dime you at the grocery store - taxing you an extra 5 cents for every plastic bag you take home.

[Link: www.nydailynews.com...]

Personally I never understood why anyone would want to live in either NYC or NY State? Not that Jersey is a paradise.

1316 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:42:18am

wonder if I could classify what I do 8 to 10 hours a day as volunteering and exempt myself from taxes.

1317 MajorPribluda  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:42:29am

re: #326 middlecon

Well of course society is bult with a family structure, but I don't agree that gay people having relationships and recognized relationships is going to suddenly bring down society.

I think we'll just have to disagree on this one, gay marriage as an issue for me is way, way down the list and I'm not one for debating it.

You keep saying "suddenly", but you're the only one who does. It's a strawman. Nothing destroys society "suddenly". A society is destroyed one innocent-sounding, "who could it possibly hurt" proposition at a time.

1318 MrC_5150  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:43:09am

re: #1294 nyc redneck

we haven't even gotten to the dangerous stuff yet.

Jose the caller

Anyone know who *Jose* is? Website?

1319 spidly  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:43:26am

re: #1311 aboo-Hoo-Hoo

Lesson's in taking the world from a deep recession into a full-blown economic depression:

Obummer better start producing miracles on an hourly basis.

didn't see that post election cut in production coming
/

1320 Nevergiveup  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:43:46am

re: #1312 nyc redneck

that is important for our society. we can't underestimate it. civility.
now, we have a self described "mutt" coming in.
we will see what he means by mutt.

I think he means he's gonna take a chunk - taxes- outta your ass!

1321 Wishing  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:44:00am

re: #1305 MandyManners

Pardon my density but, what does that mean?

For instance, in college they are swayed by a particularly articulate and passionate
communist and decide to travel to USSR for further study. Seeing the error of that system, they return and become involved in stopping the intrusion of communism here.

1322 opnion  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:44:26am

re: #1310 MandyManners

Women must put their claws away.

I think that it has more to do with shifting the blame.
They just ran a poor campaign.

1323 Irene NYC  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:44:59am

re: #1309 galloping granny

But then I don't think anything that one is forced to do - or coerced to do through some reward or lack thereof - can rightly be defined as "volunteering."


Forced to do something clearly is involuntary. The waters start muddying up right quickly when "coerced through reward" rears up. That used to be known as being bought off. But I suspect that will change as more and more families will be forced to go along with Obama's system as the economy slides into ruin and more and more families become dependent on government for jobs or subsidies or welfare as we used to know it. It's going to be sad watching this play out.

1324 nyc redneck  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:45:51am

re: #1320 Nevergiveup

I think he means he's gonna take a chunk - taxes- outta your ass!

i want me my bailout.
and my gas money, my walking around money and my rent paid.
saddle up my unicorn.

1325 [deleted]  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:47:13am
1326 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:48:01am

re: #1254 MandyManners
ABSOLUTELY SPOT ON!

1327 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:50:43am

re: #1196 Sharmuta

Whoa! Let's hold off on cutting off our nose to spite our face a little while longer. I am doing what I can to get you the needed reinforcements. Look around this thread- I've been calling for party involvement for weeks, ad I finally have Lizards taking up the call. Get some other like minded people to join you and let's get to work.

I am tired of being told "If you don't like it then leave. This is our party."

Many have left. And, wouldn't you know, they decided that they would rather not be completely powerless and slavishly vote for the people who expelled them.

Yet the socons are shocked and appalled when it happens. What choice do they think they are actually offering people with their absolutism?

And what I have to show for my loyalty is a national debt that almost doubled in the last 8 years, and only a fraction of it is the War. The War has been expensive. It is hard to fathom that we have spent so multiple times more on other stuff - what do we have to show for it but a larger government payroll?

So, no. I won't go along this time. They already "cut my nose off" and handed it to my kids in the form of a national debt that is 70% of the GDP.

1328 Long Nics are Looonnng  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:51:27am

re: #1295 Sharmuta

Hey Shar...saw a car today with a "SMURFY" license plate. Was that you?

1329 pbird  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:52:31am

re: #1324 nyc redneck

i want me my bailout.
and my gas money, my walking around money and my rent paid.
saddle up my unicorn.

saddle up my unicorn.!
Truer words were never spoken.

1330 ArmyWife  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:55:16am

re: #1293 galloping granny

I agree with you. I am just not effectively communicating this, however. I was just noting that yes, people really do earn $40/hour. I didn't say "high school people earn $40/hr as the norm" or "right out of college kids earn $40/hr as the norm", or "Join the Army, from day one you earn $75,000!" When my husband enlisted in 1990, he made $750/mo. He turned 18 in boot camp (he left right after HS graduation). I had just turned 19. Shortly thereafter, we had a baby on the way. I stayed home during those lean years and it was hard. Lots of mac and cheese! My Mom would secretly send me money and care packages during this time, I know what it means to not have money.

Again, let me claify:

1. This program stinks and I don't want my tax dollars to support it. Get a job or a scholarship if your parents are unable to help with college. It isn't my job to send the world to school - its my job to send my children.

2. I don't think everyone and their brother earns $40/hr or more. I do think there are people who do make this. I am one of those that happens to make more. But I didn't the minute I graduated from school, even with a grad degree. I did, however, start to make decent money 5 years in, but it wasn't because I look good. I work my tail off and my career supports this type of income. Doesn't make me better than, or worse than, anyone.

3. I have a 17 year old. How did that happen?

1331 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:55:20am

re: #1206 MandyManners

How? The socons have more in common philosophically with the fiscons than the Marxists in ascendancy in the DNC.

That is a false binary choice. If the New Left actually manages to dictate their morality explicitly, the Democrats will collapse. Americans don't go for extremist moralizing, which is why our party is shrinking.

1332 CapeCoddah  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:55:26am

re: #1322 opnion

I think that it has more to do with shifting the blame.
They just ran a poor campaign.

Good morning everyone! Hope you all are well! Hubby and I have not watched/ listened to any form of media communication since Tues, we needed a break. That said, The Boston Herald seems to think Romney is responsible for the Palin attacks, to clear the way for '12. What do you all think? I really hope not, as I like the guy. He was a wonderful governor.

[Link: www.bostonherald.com...]

1333 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:55:56am

re: #1284 MrC_5150
Nope, but I'm experiencing all sorts of problems with LGF - having to log in several times already this morning.
Course, my 'puter is FUBAR too, so that might account for it!

1334 ArmyWife  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 8:56:26am

re: #1293 galloping granny

Just one more little thing - he will be 37 when he retires. He WILL go get another job. Please send him an email informing him of this as he has a delusion of becoming a kept man. ;)

1335 Throbert McGee  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:01:39am

re: #1117 spidly

Anyone taking odds on who comes out on top in the gay - black riots?

"I haven't seen anything like this since the Anita Bryant concert!"

1336 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:04:06am

re: #1331 karmic_inquisitor
Um, when you get a chance I'd appreciate an answer to my #1247 directed to you.
Thank you.

1337 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:04:23am

It's like "Because we have these beliefs and we're patriotic, if we ban gay marriage and abortion and teach creationism and post the Ten Commandments in public schools, then that will make everyone else patriotic too."

Or

"We just lost to Socialists, so we need to focus on abortion and gays and creationism and religion, not on fiscal restraint and individual liberty."

Or

"If we legislate morality, then people will understand the Constitution and why capitalism works and socialism doesn't."

Newt's response to this loss is a sign of panicky, incoherent thinking. Teaching creationism will bring more people over to the GOP?

DAMMIT why can't these people pull out a copy of Reagan's 1964 "A Time for Choosing" speech or his 1975 CPAC speech before they go shooting off their damn pieholes! The 1975 speech was 2 years after Roe vs. Wade ... does he mention abortion anywhere in there? Creationism? Gays? Even in his 1964 speech his only religious reference is when he refers to Moses and the Israelis and to Jesus and the cross, both in reference to people being willing to die for a cause. He doesn't even say "God bless America," as he ended his speeches as President. I think he began to put more religious references due to the growing power of the religious right. Too bad he didn't follow his own advice from the end of his 1975 speech there ... if the religious right will ONLY support the GOP platform of fiscal restraint and individual liberty and strict Constitutionalism if the GOP also promotes the moral/religious platform of the religious right, then "let them go their own way." The fiscal health and security of this country, the freedom to practice and preach their own beliefs ... THAT is what they should be fighting for ... not to force everyone ELSE to learn and practice their beliefs as well.

The creationism/I.D. thing is the worst. What an absolute waste of time and resources, all to promote a bogus "science" and an ignorant, anti-science, anti-reason, anti-knowledge, anti-Constitutional agenda. Republicans compromise their commitment to our nation's founding ideals and principles, and indeed the founding principles of the Enlightenment and modern Western civilization, when they promote this claptrap, supposedly in the name of making us a more moral nation.

I don't put the anti-abortion and the anti-gay marriage issues in the same category. Those ARE important moral issues. They have important implications for our society. But not making them central to the party platform does not reduce their importance, nor does it prevent individuals, churches, and other organizations from fighting against abortion and gay marriage through other avenues. Nor does it prevent individual legislators from voting against pro-abortion and pro-gay marriage policies based on their own consciences and the wishes of their constituents.

re: #1179 karmic_inquisitor

I have spent a lot of money and time supporting the party. Here in CA the socons took over and drove out the "impure" folks who were pro choice and whatnot. guys like Pete Wilson are no longer welcome - RINOs.

I am tired of it. I supported these folks in the name of party unity, and we get smaller and smaller and smaller and more irrelevant. Creationism in the schools was one of the wedges in the early 90s that killed us here.

This was once a big Red state. 25 years of a Democratic legislature because the only places a Republican can win is in rural areas (and we are starting to lose those).

I have seen the pure and glorious future that Newt and Rush seem to want. It won't include me. I am out if it happens. And my money, time and contacts will go with me.

1338 MajorPribluda  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:07:10am

re: #378 scion9

I wouldn't mind seeing the government getting out of the 'marriage' business altogether and just offer the ability to file for the tax/inheritance/medical benefits under the law. Essentially civil unions for anyone who wants one, and the actual matrimony can be something entirely up to the religious institutions.

Laws that surround marriage is leaning on the establishment clause awfully hard. You have the government in the business of defining what marriage is, and you have religious institutions filing as 501c3's, even though technically they shouldn't have to because of their 1st amendment rights. The Christian religious community is playing with fire in compelling government to get involved in the situation in the way that they are. They should be compelling Caesar to loosen his grip on cultural institutions instead, if they value their continued freedom to practice their religion without government intervention.

We institute governments among ourselves to provide for common defense, to promote common good, and to suppress the common scoundrel. Other than making reasonable efforts toward those ends, conservatives eschew government. Government is the arm of society acting to promote that which builds society and to retard that which hinders society.
The problem with governmental recognition of homosexual "marriage" is that unlike any proper civil rights matter, it protects and rewards *behavior* which is not inborn like race or gender, and which is not at all a part of our moral/societal framework. At the same time, it denies parents the opportunity to raise their own children with a firm moral grounding in right and wrong as they see fit, and has been seen fit in a continuing mainstream way for thousands of years. We are breaking a model of success, for the dubious proposition that abnormal behavior is not at all a moral decision. This is a dangerous path for society.
Making homosexuality sound like a civil rights issue has the effect of equating people for whom this is a moral issue with bigots and other rightfully suppressed scoundrels.
And I resent it.

1339 Gang of One  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:07:12am

Good morning all! Getting ready to go to kick-boxing and weapons training this ugly, wet North Joisey afternoon.
I saw in the spin offs several references to the SCOTUS having the task of perhaps denying Obama his presidency due to his inability to produce a valid US birth certificate. Is this more of the same garbage that Charles has been refusing to entertain, or is this a legitimate problem for Obama and the SCOTUS?
I have not read through all the thread to see if anyone else has addressed this, and I do not want to belabor a point that Charles may have given his final say about discussing here.

Just asking ...

1340 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:08:10am

re: #1337 Tigger2005
Uh,

Newt's response to this loss is a sign of panicky, incoherent thinking. Teaching creationism will bring more people over to the GOP?

where did you get that idea from?

1341 MrC_5150  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:09:57am

re: #1333 realwest

Nope, but I'm experiencing all sorts of problems with LGF - having to log in several times already this morning.
Course, my 'puter is FUBAR too, so that might account for it!

Hmmm, 2 hours of "Page load error" here. Not a single page I click on works.

1342 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:10:28am

re: #1340 realwest
ADDENDUM: Please read my #1197.

1343 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:10:34am

re: #1337 Tigger2005

Some of the biggest reasons I would have voted 'Yes to Prop 8' is that it would have forced religions to choose:
1. Do I change my 'theology' to keep my tax exempt status to include the homosexual lifestyle?
2. I will lose my tax exempt status and now be free to be a truly private entity.

Sad 'money' is such a big influence on religion.

1344 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:12:02am

re: #1339 Gang of One
Yep, that birth certificate thing is bullshit, although Charles posted a more refined way of saying it!

1345 Dasher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:13:25am

re: #1008 jemima

In a Free Market, viable companies continue, weak or ineffective companies fail. That is capitalism.

In socialism non- viable entities like Air America are propped up unnaturally, forced upon a populace that obviously does not support what they offer.

The very notion of the Fairness Doctrine is unAmerican. It will be used to control the citizenry and quiet the enemies of the State.

NPR fits in the socialistic entity list too.

One thing about the titles of federal legislation, they often mean or result in the exact opposite of the title.

Then there is the law of unintended consequences which the lawmakers never think about.

1346 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:13:28am

re: #1341 MrC_5150
Is your problem only with LGF or do you have problems reaching and navigating around other websites?

1347 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:14:32am

Karmic- I understand you're pissed. Others are too. It's time to turn this around, and I don't think infiltrating the other camp will work, and I know leaving our tent won't work either.

But then- I'm a fighter, and I'm going to fight them. They had their chance to lead the party, and it's been disastrous. Time's up. Now it's our turn. I'm taking back this party and I'm asking for others to join me. Please help.

1348 Gang of One  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:15:43am

re: #1344 realwest

Yep, that birth certificate thing is bullshit, although Charles posted a more refined way of saying it!

That's what I thought. Thanks.

1349 realwest  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:17:36am

re: #1348 Gang of One
You're more than welcome!

1350 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:20:50am

re: #1338 MajorPribluda

We institute governments among ourselves to provide for common defense, to promote common good, and to suppress the common scoundrel. Other than making reasonable efforts toward those ends, conservatives eschew government. Government is the arm of society acting to promote that which builds society and to retard that which hinders society.
The problem with governmental recognition of homosexual "marriage" is that unlike any proper civil rights matter, it protects and rewards *behavior* which is not inborn like race or gender, and which is not at all a part of our moral/societal framework. At the same time, it denies parents the opportunity to raise their own children with a firm moral grounding in right and wrong as they see fit, and has been seen fit in a continuing mainstream way for thousands of years. We are breaking a model of success, for the dubious proposition that abnormal behavior is not at all a moral decision. This is a dangerous path for society.
Making homosexuality sound like a civil rights issue has the effect of equating people for whom this is a moral issue with bigots and other rightfully suppressed scoundrels.
And I resent it.

I am out to jury still on the 'inborn' or not on the homosexual topic. If it were however, me, being a wanna-be 'alpha' male, being intellectually honest, know how males are 'hardwired'. I am conservative in all things, except for when it comes to the topic of 'sex'. I may be speaking for some, or just for myself. If the 'hard wiring' is such that I know I want it / seek it, whose opinion is right that others shouldn't be able to want their version of 'it'? Objectively, we have no right to deny others what they desire in the extant it doesn't harm the participants and is legal. It is 'tradition' only the makes it 'illegal'. I do hate the idea of all the latent negative ramifications fiscally that will ensue, but even then, I will give up the money to equal the playing field.

Parents have the choice to teach the children anything they want in their own home. Homeschooling is still an option also.

1351 MrC_5150  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:21:17am

re: #1346 realwest

Is your problem only with LGF or do you have problems reaching and navigating around other websites?

My problem is with Free Republic

1352 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:24:32am

re: #1247 realwest
RW -

It should be obvious that I am very frustrated.

I am in a state where we used to elect Republican Senators (half the time) and Republican Governors. We had a state legislature that was balanced and the state was recognized world wide as a leader in good government.

That has been destroyed. Destroyed by the Democrats because they have had a run on the place for years on end.

Question is - how did they get that power? How did they evict Reagan Republicans from Ronald Reagan's own house? Think on that - they completely destroyed Republicanism in Reagan's own state.

They were helped. They were helped by a Republican party that was powerful and ran the show (except Willie Brown's legislature).

I will tell you how - social issues.

California has a lot of refugees from other states that come here to live what they think will be a freer life. Most Californians have a libertarian bent, which means they are "socially liberal" in socon vocabulary.

When the Republicans were on top, we had social conservatives start asserting themselves by trying to get on school boards throughout the state and force the state to teach creationism. That was happening 1988 - 1996. In 1996, the "litmus test" was adopted in the Party that party candidates HAD to adopt pro life / creation science positions or get no party support. Good candidates like Matt Fong (who should be Governor) got starved of funds and lost state elections so that purity could be preserved. People started leaving the party.

As for illegal aliens, that was what put Republicans away for good. Prop 187 was a popular proposition and won. Republicans spearheaded it. The proposition said the state could not provide services (except emergency/compassionate aid) to people who are not here legally. Like the recently passed Prop 8, it had broad cross over support. So you would think that it would have put Republicans back on track here. It didn't. Democrats looked at the demographics and the failure of the federal government to stem the tide and realized that these were all potential voters, and that Republican Latinos could be peeled off of the party (they had loved Reagan for amnesty). So Dems went to the courts and also passed laws to basically gut enforcement of the proposition. So 187 is law with absolutely no means of enforcing it without violating someone's civil rights. In the meantime, you get a new identity politics club for the Democrats to use - Republicans hate people of color. It has stuck. Republicans cannot win at this point in major metropolitan areas except San Diego (military) and Orange County (although that is drifting away). Even the central valley is up for grabs. And conservative Tom McClintock is in a statistical tie for a congressional race in the far rural reaches in the state.

But prior to 187, we had already lost the Senate seats to Boxer and Feinstein, and the legislature had gerrymandered a majority Democrat congressional delegation. And the business owners/entrepreneurs had already joined the Democrats with Clinton (partly because John Sununu Sr. had basically said "F the Californians" when Cal Republicans were purged from the GHW Bush White House after Reagan left - almost all or Reagan's bench were Californians).

But the decline started with folks like the group at this address who wanted to see their version of "science" imposed on California clas

1353 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:25:04am

re: #1336 realwest

Um, when you get a chance I'd appreciate an answer to my #1247 directed to you.
Thank you.

It was long. Sorry.

1354 Dasher  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:29:22am

re: #1247 realwest

And in fact if you check out this map: [Link: www.washingtonpost.com...] it would appear that it was the urban areas - particularly LA and SF that put Obama waay over the top.

The red-blue county map was very similar in 2000 and 2004. However it is a little more blue this year. The urban problem has been around for some time. Large cities have lots of people on the dole. In addition they have government workers, who vote to keep their jobs.

I haven't seen a 3D map yet of 2008, but this is a 3D map of 2004 by county Image: results_2004_lg.jpg Pretty scary if you think about it.

1355 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:36:07am

I don't have a problem with most of this, but I do not believe the term "intelligent design" should be used in any school discussion. You see, I.D. is not some honest, open, innocent idea or proposal, and it's not some kind of philosophy. It's a fake science that was created for a specific purpose--its a stealth weapon, if you will--to get around the Establishment Clause. When creation science was rejected by the courts in the 80's, the creationists went back to the drawing board to come up with a more scientific sounding theory. I.D. is just a more complicated, smokescreen filled version of creation science, with no explicit references to God or Genesis and talk about cell structure and bacterial flagellum and "irreducible complexity" and "information" and such so people look a it and say "Oh yeah, that sounds like real science all right ..." I.D. has been rejected in court as well, but gullible and/or sympathetic school boards continue to buy into it.

As for the stuff about there being "gaps" in science, things that science currently can't explain, and saying that some people consider this evidence of a creator, fine ... but several other things should also be pointed out:

1. At one time there were very large gaps in scientific knowledge. Since then science has filled in more and more of the gaps. The remaining gaps are growing ever smaller. This would seem to make a "God of the gaps" correspondingly smaller and smaller. Do believers really want to base their belief on ever-shrinking gaps in scientific knowledge? Pointing to gaps in scientific knowledge as evidence of God's existence would seem to belittle the importance of faith, as well.
2. If we ascribe everything in nature we can't explain to the undetectable work of an invisible creator, then why should we continue to try to figure things out? Why should we have ever started? "God makes the lightning. Lightning makes fire. Man can no make fire."
3. In saying this, we're not arguing against faith or belief. But perhaps we should stop arguing that there are some things in nature that science will NEVER explain, and that this is evidence of God. Instead, allow that science may very well explain almost everything eventually, but this still does not prove it is not by God's intention or design. Is love a chemical reaction? Is there an evolutionary explanation for how we feel when we see a sunset? Perhaps, but does that render these feelings meaningless? Does that mean God had nothing to do with us having them? Of course not. Why is it so important to think that God created some stuff "magically" and intervened at certain points, rather than suggest that God "caused" the whole thing came about through natural processes?

re: #1272 fish

I just want to go on the record, seeing as the whole creationist thing seems to be a litmus test around here.

1) I believe in God.
2) I believe God created the universe.
3) I believe that the earth is approximately 4.5 billion years old
4) I believe Dinosaurs were real and once roamed the Earth.
5) I believe in the "Big Bang" and feel that a "Creator" is the only logical explanation for its existence.
6) I believe the Hand of God is the most logical explanation for the sudden leap in Intelligence from "Neanderthal Man" to "Modern Human" Which most paleontologists believe co-existed.
7) I went to a public high school which discussed "ID" in a limited way in both science and Social Sciences Classes. In science stating simply that there are certain gaps in what science is currently able to explain and that some people believe this to be proof of a creator. In social Science class it was discussed as a way many people combine Scientific fact with religious belief.
8) I do not believe any of this disqualifies me from public service.
9) I further believe that evolution is real and not just a theory.

If any of this makes my opinions less valid in any ones minds then I can easily go back to not posting at all.

1356 karmic_inquisitor  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:39:45am

I guess the point that I am making is that if the socons are going to (once again) insist that we follow them or leave, we'll leave. But we won't be politically powerless. We will have an easier time changing minds among Democrats than among puritan Republicans.

We are heading into a new era for America - the era of few choices.

Demographically, our entitlements crisis will dwarf the economic problems we are currently dealing with. The choices forced on us will be big cuts AND tax increases unless we can cut sooner rather than later.

Tom Delay and George Bush only pushed us further and faster toward that demographic wall with the $4 Trillion spending spree. We now have a shiny, big new dept called Homeland Security and a bunch of other departments who could not be left out on the hiring and spending binges. new offices. New computers. New phone systems. New desks. Newer, bigger and more cars. Bigger salaries. More benefits.

Oh - and we get to pay for prescription medicines regardless of the state of the economy (BTW - invest in pharmaceuticals - they can't lose money anymore).

Compassionate Conservatism in action. Compassionate to everyone but the taxpayer. Oh - and how many Democrats did that compassion win over to our cause? What was that? What? Oh - NONE!

We should DUMP all talk of abortion, creationism, school prayer, illegal aliens (yup - cause they are leaving because of the economy) and any and all socially divisive issues and focus on the wall we are about to hit and how Obama has his lead foot on the accelerator.

If that doesn't pass the purity test, then fuck the socons.

1357 MajorPribluda  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:42:13am

re: #427 I heart the USA
[SNIP]

...If it is all biological, how does that happen? I sure don't have the answer, just speculation.
In any case, there is no biological imperative for homosexuality...


[SNIP]

I agree whole-heartedly. I don't claim to know what "causes" it. I'm saying that the left is so damned sure that it's all inborn, and they are simply rationalizing. They want it to be inborn, so that it would rightfully be protected. Same as the global warming horse manure, which requires government to grow and de-industrialize capitalist countries, while shovelling money to un-regulated semi-industrial socialist ones. It's bad policy masquesrading as bad science.

And if they wanted to make biological imperatives the be-all end-all basis for how we build our society, then virile men of means (those most motivated and able to provide security to females) would be forever hooking up with nubile women in their teens. That's how we evolved.

Obviously, we have decided as a society (and statistically, as a species) that simply because we can or did do something, we are not therefore obligated or even permitted in some examples to go ahead and do it (as a society). Biologically, middle-aged men would pair up (or harem up) with teen-aged girls, but it's awful for a society, and at any rate, produces an excess of angry young males, also bad for society. So using this somewhat disturbing argument as a tie-breaker, even if gay behavior is hard-wired, societal stability is already something we choose over biological design, where those two seem to clash.

And I don't think that they clash in this case.

On the other hand, I don't have to re-order society to wish you and your son well, or to treat every person I meet as another person to be judged on their own merits, not group merits. Cheers!

1358 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:44:57am

re: #1356 karmic_inquisitor

I just think it's high time they're told to sit down, shut up, or THEY can leave if they' think they're such a brilliant driving force of the party. They're wrong- they are only part of this coalition and if they don't believe that, there are a couple of election results you can shove in their faces. They can either agree to be part of a coalition or they can agree to continue losing.

1359 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:46:16am

re: #1356 karmic_inquisitor

I'm with you karmic! I'm willing to fight them. Please don't abandon me and millions of other republicans who agree with us both.

1360 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:46:35am

re: #1356 karmic_inquisitor

Video games. Don't forget the video games! re: #1358 Sharmuta

You take 'money' out of religion...(which is how it should be...) and I guarantee the 'soc-con' well of influence would dry up exponentially, IMHO.

1361 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:48:39am

re: #1338 MajorPribluda

The problem with governmental recognition of homosexual "marriage" is that unlike any proper civil rights matter, it protects and rewards *behavior* which is not inborn like race or gender

But there is very strong evidence that homosexuality has a biological basis. People do not "choose" to be gay. Children from strongly moral and religious households, children who have never been exposed to gay couples or homosexual literature or imagery of any kind, reach puberty and often to their great shame, terror, and confusion, find themselves attracted to those of their own sex. Homosexuals have existed throughout human history. (Homosexuality is also found in the animal kingdom, through it is not known if it has the same causes.) I cannot agree with those who say people "choose" to be homosexuals. Therefore, even though I allow for those who consider homosexual marriage a moral issue (I do have some doubts about whether it's a wise course of action myself), I can't agree that "being homosexual" is itself immoral. If it involved violating someone unable to give informed consent, as pedophilia does, then yes, homosexuality would be immoral (or at the very least acting on the desire would be).

1362 Joan  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:50:19am

re: #1261 Sharmuta

They are the party of collectivists, while we are the party that values individualism. They don't have a hard time controlling their people because everyone stays within the borg collective. Those who do not, are shunned. Joe Lieberman, anyone? The shunning is two-fold. It removes the individual, obviously, but it's also Pavlovian conditioning to show the rest of the collective what NOT to do.

The problem is, now we're trying to be like them in shunning anyone who disagrees with certain so-called conservative tenets by calling them a RINO and calls for purges. I don't want to purge the soc-cons. I just want them to keep their religion out of the political agenda. They should shift their religious energy towards their church and do that good work there.


I understand. How can we be a more effective Republican Party? After all, why should anyone be a Republican at all? RINOs certainly need not affiliate as Republicans, there is a Blue Dog Democrat faction that in theory would suit them very well. What is it in Republicanism that causes them to self-select as Republican? Within our political spectrum, can we identify the kernel of value that defines us, and address these challenges within our frame of reference:

1) How do they wedeal with their our zealots?
2) How do theywe keep discipline?
3) How do they we instill solidarity?

1363 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 9:59:45am

re: #1362 Joan

1) How do they wedeal with their our zealots?
2) How do theywe keep discipline?
3) How do they we instill solidarity?

I think we deal with all three with the same thing- we re-establish small government, fiscal conservatism. We stand on that foundation without giving an inch- that is our line in the sand. That's our discipline, that is where we can find solidarity, and that's where the line is shown to the zealots.

1364 MajorPribluda  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:01:00am

re: #1288 MandyManners

Please explain that.

No sweat. The original poster said that he was convinced that homosexuality was a not a choice, because the stigma attached must be preventative. I disagreed, as even things that we see as exclusively or to some degree the results of free choice, and which carry a far greater social stigma, to put it lightly, are not deterred.

1365 lonnye  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:04:06am

re: #1210 rightside

Either a Mossberg 500, or maybe a Remington tactical. Either one I will replace the standard stock with a foldable one, and a pistol grip. 20 is good too, much better to have something you can accurately wield, then something you can't control.

I have a Remington 870 and a Star 9mm. I need to do some bulk purchases of ammo.

I have not bought ammo in years. Where do you guys like doing bulk purchases? Does Cabelas have good prices?

Time to rejoin NRA also...

1366 MajorPribluda  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:12:05am

re: #1350 Oh no...Sand People!

Parents have the choice to teach the children anything they want in their own home. Homeschooling is still an option also.


We won't have the right if it becomes a "civil rights" issue. I would not want to be lumped in with the kooks who teach racist crap to their kids, just because the left succeeded in turning their bad science into a political reality.
People make the specious argument that "100 years ago, blacks and women were discriminated against, and now we see how wrong that was, so we should not condemn homosexual bahvior as somehow wrong." The problem is that race and gender are obviously inborn, and nobody ever argued that they were not. This is obviously a whole different category, having more in common with kleptomania than with race or gender. Why? The only evidence of it is behavioral.

1367 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:12:54am

re: #1357 MajorPribluda

[SNIP]

[SNIP]

I agree whole-heartedly. I don't claim to know what "causes" it. I'm saying that the left is so damned sure that it's all inborn, and they are simply rationalizing. They want it to be inborn, so that it would rightfully be protected. Same as the global warming horse manure, which requires government to grow and de-industrialize capitalist countries, while shovelling money to un-regulated semi-industrial socialist ones. It's bad policy masquesrading as bad science.

I'm sorry, I disagree. It's not the same. The evidence that homosexuality is inborn is pretty damn strong. Come on. When children are aware that they're "different" from their peers almost before they hit puberty, something is going on. You think these children CHOOSE to have these feelings? You think it's some mistake their parents made raising them? Those poor parents, tearing their hair and rending their clothes and wailing, "Oh where did we go wrong?".

I think before people make claims like this, saying the scientists studying homosexuality and saying it's biological are just making things up, they really need to do their own scientific research and demonstrate otherwise. Let's see your studies and your data. Show us the common elements in the upbringing of gays and lesbians and show how these cause them to "choose" to be gay around the time they hit puberty. Or demonstrate that gays and lesbians who claim they realized they were gay around the time of puberty are not being truthful and they actually decided this at a later date.

Also, make a study of the massive failure rate of "ex-gay" ministries and organizations. Why do these devout Christians find it so difficult to choose not to be gay, to shake those feelings of attraction to the same sex, despite accepting Jesus into their lives, despite prayer, despite support and counseling? Leaders of "ex-gay" ministries have quit. I read about a member of one group who was so desperate to stop having homosexual feelings he slashed his penis with a razor. Just a choice?

1368 Throbert McGee  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:24:18am

re: #509 galloping granny

I did not say that the rate of gay marriage would bankrupt the system LaZardo. I said specifically that allowing gay marriage - and thus total equality - would mean that either millions of women who have been promised entitlements in return for remaining outside of the workforce in order to provide the benefit to society of rearing children must be disenfranchised .

Ermmm... by this reasoning, aren't these women already "disenfranchised" by the existence of heterosexual households in which both the husband and the wife work outside the home?

1369 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:25:16am

re: #1364 MajorPribluda

No sweat. The original poster said that he was convinced that homosexuality was a not a choice, because the stigma attached must be preventative. I disagreed, as even things that we see as exclusively or to some degree the results of free choice, and which carry a far greater social stigma, to put it lightly, are not deterred.

Again, why would children "choose" to be gay around the age of puberty, any more than other children "choose" to be straight?

1370 lonnye  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:27:47am

re: #1247 realwest

If you have some constructive ideas as to what Republicans should do, I'd surely like to hear them.

If you want smaller government, "Rinos" and "Social Conservatives" need one another.

One of two things is needed.
1) A great party leader must emerge.
2) Social issues are pursued via referendums. For that to have any chance of working, "Rinos" must be *fully* supportive of getting referendums onto ballots. Everyone can then vote their conscious. In return, social conservatives would need to soften the party platform.

I will take 70% of what I want to see over 10-20% any day.

1371 Tigger2005  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:29:13am

re: #1366 MajorPribluda

We won't have the right if it becomes a "civil rights" issue. I would not want to be lumped in with the kooks who teach racist crap to their kids, just because the left succeeded in turning their bad science into a political reality.
People make the specious argument that "100 years ago, blacks and women were discriminated against, and now we see how wrong that was, so we should not condemn homosexual bahvior as somehow wrong." The problem is that race and gender are obviously inborn, and nobody ever argued that they were not. This is obviously a whole different category, having more in common with kleptomania than with race or gender. Why? The only evidence of it is behavioral.

Again, I really wish you'd provide evidence that the science purporting to show a biological basis for homosexuality is bad, and/or conduct your own scientific studies to demonstrate that it is in fact a choice.

1372 MajorPribluda  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:39:23am

re: #1367 Tigger2005

I'm sorry, I disagree. It's not the same. The evidence that homosexuality is inborn is pretty damn strong. Come on. When children are aware that they're "different" from their peers almost before they hit puberty, something is going on. You think these children CHOOSE to have these feelings? You think it's some mistake their parents made raising them? Those poor parents, tearing their hair and rending their clothes and wailing, "Oh where did we go wrong?".

I think before people make claims like this, saying the scientists studying homosexuality and saying it's biological are just making things up, they really need to do their own scientific research and demonstrate otherwise. Let's see your studies and your data. Show us the common elements in the upbringing of gays and lesbians and show how these cause them to "choose" to be gay around the time they hit puberty...

I think we can agree that the only evidence of homosexuality is observed or professed behavior. So the onus is on those who claim to know that it is not a matter of choice, but is instead a hard-wired condition. Anecdotal arguments about the rearing of children and some kinds of animals do not further the case, when what is required is proof. At least firm evidence. For every anecdote on your side, I have one to match. A man upthread has a gay son who isdating another gay youth. That other youth is a twin, and his twin brother is straight. See? If we shall argue anecdotes, then my case is finished.

But it's not finished. I believe that it is a choice. But I will not say that I absolutely know that. I am willing to be convinced, but not by the specious arguments mustered so far by the left, which always seem to coincide with the destruction of traditional institutions.

As for what I think causes it, I see that youo have offered plenty of suggestions as to what I think. But I simply don't know. And I'm not the one trying to re-write the laws.

Leftists proposed a gay marriage law. Californians voted and shot it down. Then their Supreme Court made one up out of thin air. Then Californains voted again to do the only thing which could curb that power grab--they amended their constitution. Watch for their Supreme Court to rule against the people and the constitution in short order.

Who's in charge, anyway?

1373 MajorPribluda  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:40:53am

re: #1369 Tigger2005

Again, why would children "choose" to be gay around the age of puberty, any more than other children "choose" to be straight?

Again, I have no idea. Never claimed to. Don't need a justification in order to support not changing our society.

1374 Wyatt Earp  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:45:55am

Cheerleaders. Can they be any dumber?

1375 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:47:09am

re: #1370 lonnye

I don't appreciate the RINO label anymore. I'm a fiscal conservative. I have no issue with social conservatives holding to fiscal conservatism- it's when they start holding up some bar like abortion or creationism that becomes a problem. If they can't hold to smaller government as the basis of conservatism, then perhaps it is THEY who are the RINOs!

1376 MajorPribluda  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 10:50:54am

re: #1371 Tigger2005

Again, I really wish you'd provide evidence that the science purporting to show a biological basis for homosexuality is bad, and/or conduct your own scientific studies to demonstrate that it is in fact a choice.

And how should we test for proof that behavior is based on choices?

You claim that you are aware of scientific studies which indicate that homosexuality is hard-wired. I have heard some contrived ones, but you say you have some good stuff. Fine. What is the mechanism for producing homosexuality in humans? You need not cite statistics, nor learned papers, nor even conduct your own studies. Just explain it in a way that passes the giggle test. I have maintained that I am willing to be convinced. Convince me.

Unconvinced, I won't be voting for changing the definition of marriage. Even the Greeks of a certain period, and any other example you might wish to bring up where homosexuality featured prominently in society, never re-defined marriage to include it. It's patently silly.

1377 talon_262  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 11:01:43am

re: #277 Slumbering Behemoth

This Bob & Tom?

That was a Tom Mabe bit on The Bob & Tom Show (not the same Tom, BTW).

1378 Sharmuta  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 11:15:56am

OK craiginm- please tell me how abortion or creationism has helped the republican party win elections.

1379 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 11:21:59am

re: #1372 MajorPribluda

I think we can agree that the only evidence of homosexuality is observed or professed behavior. So the onus is on those who claim to know that it is not a matter of choice, but is instead a hard-wired condition. Anecdotal arguments about the rearing of children and some kinds of animals do not further the case, when what is required is proof. At least firm evidence. For every anecdote on your side, I have one to match. A man upthread has a gay son who isdating another gay youth. That other youth is a twin, and his twin brother is straight. See? If we shall argue anecdotes, then my case is finished.

But it's not finished. I believe that it is a choice. But I will not say that I absolutely know that. I am willing to be convinced, but not by the specious arguments mustered so far by the left, which always seem to coincide with the destruction of traditional institutions.

As for what I think causes it, I see that youo have offered plenty of suggestions as to what I think. But I simply don't know. And I'm not the one trying to re-write the laws.

Leftists proposed a gay marriage law. Californians voted and shot it down. Then their Supreme Court made one up out of thin air. Then Californains voted again to do the only thing which could curb that power grab--they amended their constitution. Watch for their Supreme Court to rule against the people and the constitution in short order.

Who's in charge, anyway?

Is it hardwired? We don't know in the short / long run. That said, even if being 'born' that way is correct, to act on that impulse / urge / longing / desire / whatever word of your choice here, it is still a choice to act on it. Just as the case that some people may have a predisposition to being an alcoholic is potentially in the DNA (perhaps the father or mother was an alcoholic etc.) it does still become the ultimate 'choice' for one to actually 'crack open a cold one' and drink it no one is holding a beer to their mouth and forcing them to drink it. Just like for someone who is predisposed to a 'cheerful' disposition still has the 'choice' to smile or frown. etc.

100% agree that the people's 'voice' against marriage being redefined was 'heard' and should remain in tact. I disagree with the fundamentals of objective 'equality' in the case, but it is what it is.

1380 marge45b  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 12:09:40pm

re: #1148 DistantThunder

I've been on both PTA and School Site council. I'm now a Room parent for my daughters class. I want to home school but both daughter's have learning disabilities and need the services the public school provides. If Vouchers were available I would enroll both in a home school that is for children with learning disabilities.

1381 Zimriel  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:22:48pm

re: #1356 karmic_inquisitor

I guess the point that I am making is that if the socons are going to (once again) insist that we follow them or leave, we'll leave. ...We should DUMP all talk of abortion, creationism, school prayer, illegal aliens (yup - cause they are leaving because of the economy) and any and all socially divisive issues and focus on the wall we are about to hit and how Obama has his lead foot on the accelerator.

If that doesn't pass the purity test, then fuck the socons.

Illegal aliens employed in construction and Nevada will run back. But in a faltering economy, with pension plans bankrupting employers of citizens, there will be a big push to hire illegals instead.

Also, there are many "socons" on this site who are anti-Roe (justified as a constitutional issue) and also anti-school-prayer and anti-school-creationism (for the same reason). Outside lizarddom, social conservatism is the only thing Republicans have to offer to minorities, who otherwise vote Dem out of racial solidarity and the need for public assistance.

Homework project for you and the other socon-haters: Go to your nearest black church. Try explaining to them the Laffer curve and your principled opposition to affirmative action (as a bonus, exhort them to be compassionate to undocumented workers). Then, go to another one. Try explaining to them how abortion and easy divorce hurts them, how a firm state-sponsored definition of marriage helps them, and how reduced competition for laborers' wages also helps them. I predict you will get a rather better hearing at the second church.

1382 Zimriel  Sat, Nov 8, 2008 1:33:57pm

re: #1376 MajorPribluda

And how should we test for proof that behavior is based on choices?

You claim that you are aware of scientific studies which indicate that homosexuality is hard-wired. I have heard some contrived ones, but you say you have some good stuff. Fine. What is the mechanism for producing homosexuality in humans? You need not cite statistics, nor learned papers, nor even conduct your own studies. Just explain it in a way that passes the giggle test. I have maintained that I am willing to be convinced. Convince me.

From William Saletan, "The theory is called "sexually antagonistic selection." It holds that a gene can be reproductively harmful to one sex as long as it's helpful to the other. The gene for male homosexuality persists because it promotes—and is passed down through—high rates of procreation among gay men's mothers, sisters, and aunts."

If you are genuinely interested and have a background in genetic psychology, you might try this one. I dug that up by googling "homosexuality genetic" and following a link from Saletan. That took me about three or four seconds.

Unconvinced, I won't be voting for changing the definition of marriage. Even the Greeks of a certain period, and any other example you might wish to bring up where homosexuality featured prominently in society, never re-defined marriage to include it. It's patently silly.

I call bullshit: even if you were convinced that (male) homosexuality was innate, you STILL would not vote for changing the definition of marriage.

(I wouldn't either. But unlike you, I am honest about it.)

Anyway there has been male-male marriage in society. A few Roman emperors tried it personally, starting with Nero. It didn't catch on outside elite circles, but if a Roman emperor does it then it is, by definition, legal.

1383 mama winger  Sun, Nov 9, 2008 7:52:37pm

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 Frank says:

For some real personal satisfaction, try yelling out your own names. -- At a concert in Boston, Massachusetts to some fans (my friends) who kept yelling out Frank's name.