And Now, the Petaflop Computer

Charles Johnsonfollow me on twitter
Science • Wed Nov 19, 2008 at 7:08 pm PST • Views: 213

More than one quadrillion floating-point calculations per second: Supercomputers Break Petaflop Barrier, Transforming Science.

A new crop of supercomputers is breaking down the petaflop speed barrier, pushing high-performance computing into a new realm that could change science more profoundly than at any time since Galileo, leading researchers say.

When the Top 500 list of the world’s fastest supercomputers was announced at the international supercomputing conference in Austin, Texas, on Monday, IBM had barely managed to cling to the top spot, fending off a challenge from Cray. But both competitors broke petaflop speeds, performing 1.105 and 1.059 quadrillion floating-point calculations per second, the first two computers to do so.

These computers aren’t just faster than those they pushed further down the list, they will enable a new class of science that wasn’t possible before. As recently described in Wired magazine, these massive number crunchers will push simulation to the forefront of science.

Scientists will be able to run new and vastly more accurate models of complex phenomena: Climate models will have dramatically higher resolution and accuracy, new materials for efficient energy transmission will be developed and simulations of scramjet engines will reach a new level of complexity.

“The scientific method has changed for the first time since Galileo invented the telescope (in 1609),” said computer scientist Mark Seager of Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory.

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502 comments

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1 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:09:39pm

Whole lot of floppin' going on.

2 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:09:39pm

They need to send that to Wall Street to more efficiently process all of the sell orders.

3 Shug  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:10:26pm

If it runs Vista will it crash even faster?

4 kynna  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:11:10pm
Climate models will have dramatically higher resolution and accuracy,

But if the data going in is crap, it's just higher resolution crap. Right?

//Not looking forward to the higher resolution crap.

5 Cygnus  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:11:13pm

But will it balance my checkbook?

6 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:11:30pm

When does it come out in a lap-top?

7 solomonpanting  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:11:45pm

Climate models will have dramatically higher resolution and accuracy

Should make Goebbel's Warning predictions more interesting.

8 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:11:59pm

Oh good. They'll be able to model phony global warming a thousand times faster. It'll be like Al Gore on a hamster wheel.

9 winston06  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:12:01pm

amazing

10 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:12:02pm

I wonder if those "higher resolution" climate models will now show that the planet is cooling (which is what thermometers have been rudely reporting for the last 10 years) instead of warming.

Something tells me that the "higher resolution" will be used to model what new bogus claim will scare taxpayers into paying for a yet bigger computer.

11 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:12:29pm

re: #3 Shug

If it runs Vista will it crash even faster?

Not enough horsepower to run Vista...

12 Carti3r  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:12:42pm

...but will it be able to play Crysis on Max settings?

13 pegcity  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:12:59pm

re: #12 Carti3r

...but will it be able to play Crysis on Max settings?

damn you beat me to it

14 HoosierHoops  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:13:07pm

The Beauty of parallel computing..
Adding more chips and more Vitualization. It puts the onus for software to chase the hardware..and then hardware to chase the software.

15 nobamadada  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:13:25pm

Why is IBM slacking in the super computer world?

16 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:13:50pm

re: #11 jcm

Not enough horsepower to run Vista...

Well - it will run Vista with 3 gadgets on the desktop, but it will crash at 4.

Previous record was 2 gadgets, so it is a big improvement.

17 Bobblehead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:14:01pm

re: #8 Walter L. Newton

Oh good. They'll be able to model phony global warming a thousand times faster. It'll be like Al Gore on a hamster wheel.

The image of Algore running on a hamster wheel is strangely satisfying.

18 Wm T Sherman  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:14:03pm

Until climate simulations of the next year are accurate, I am not interested in climate simulations of the next twenty years. A scientific theory is supposed to make testable predicitions.

19 pegcity  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:14:23pm

just make the holodeck and ill be happy

20 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:14:43pm

Imagine the gaming possibilities, mates!

21 Noam Sayin'  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:14:48pm

re: #6 MandyManners

When does it come out in a lap-top?

Imagine the video game capabilities.

22 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:15:06pm

People will still have to know what questions to ask the computer, right?

23 Noam Sayin'  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:15:16pm

re: #20 LoFlyer

Five seconds...

24 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:15:17pm

But does it brown the food?

25 HoosierHoops  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:15:18pm

re: #19 pegcity

just make the holodeck and ill be happy

why? did you hack the Brad Pitt program?

26 Shug  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:15:21pm
Climate models will have dramatically higher resolution and accuracy

" The new teraflop computer models are in, and they all say Brr, it's cold outside"

27 jroberson  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:15:35pm

If it's to simulate global warming patterns, GIGO. Otherwise, can it tell me Where in the World is Carmen San Diego, or Where's Waldo? If not, I don't care.

28 nobamadada  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:15:37pm

re: #22 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

People will still have to know what questions to ask the computer, right?

One would only hope

29 [deleted]  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:15:45pm
30 Dirk Diggler  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:15:45pm

LoFlyer,

Imagine the gaming possibilities, mates!

Imagine the porn downloading speeds!

31 Tarheel  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:15:56pm

GI/GO

32 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:16:06pm

re: #8 Walter L. Newton

Oh good. They'll be able to model phony global warming a thousand times faster. It'll be like Al Gore on a hamster wheel.

That reminds me, Walt I never replied to your email, give me a moment.

33 Cygnus  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:16:11pm

re: #20 LoFlyer

Imagine the gaming possibilities, mates!

World of Warcraft with 150 levels. Coming soon to a store near you.

34 nobamadada  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:16:23pm

re: #30 Dirk Diggler

LoFlyer,

Imagine the porn downloading speeds!

relax dirk

35 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:16:42pm

re: #14 HoosierHoops

The Beauty of parallel computing..
Adding more chips and more Vitualization. It puts the onus for software to chase the hardware..and then hardware to chase the software.

Most software sucks. Poorly engineered and unmaintainable. If houses were built like most applications then civilization would be destroyed in the first windstorm.

But it has become almost irrelevant - lifetimes of applications have been shortened dramatically, and inefficiencies are covered over by throwing processors at them.

36 HelloDare  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:16:47pm

Garbage In, faster Garbage Out.

Gore will be thrilled.

37 jroberson  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:17:03pm

re: #26 Shug

Except in Texas, where anything as cold as snow is no less mythical than Obama's qualifications.

38 reine.de.tout  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:17:06pm

re: #6 MandyManners

When does it come out in a lap-top?

heh.
Might it actually happen sooner than you think?
ten years ago I had no computer in my home, too expensive and no need for it.

Now I have 3 (desktop and 2 laptops), and can't figure out how I lived without 'em.

39 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:17:25pm

re: #18 Wm T Sherman

Until climate simulations of the next year are accurate, I am not interested in climate simulations of the next twenty years. A scientific theory is supposed to make testable predicitions.

Stop that.

You are thinking again.

Cease and desist.

40 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:17:37pm

re: #20 LoFlyer

Imagine the gaming possibilities, mates!

Damn scary mate! Are you a pirate?

41 solomonpanting  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:17:57pm

re: #30 Dirk Diggler

LoFlyer,


Imagine the porn downloading speeds!

these massive number crunchers will push s[t]imulation to the forefront of science

Just for you.
:->

42 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:17:58pm

re: #30 Dirk Diggler

LoFlyer, Imagine the porn downloading speeds!

Yep, over in a minute!

43 Miss Molly  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:17:58pm

If it proves Al Gore wrong will he finally crash and burn?

44 HelloDare  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:18:12pm

Is this good for Michelle's children? If it is, then I'm all for it.

45 Cygnus  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:18:42pm

Too bad they didn't have a petaflop computer to keep track of all of Kerry's flip-flops.

46 HoosierHoops  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:18:45pm

re: #35 karmic_inquisitor

Most software sucks. Poorly engineered and unmaintainable. If houses were built like most applications then civilization would be destroyed in the first windstorm.

But it has become almost irrelevant - lifetimes of applications have been shortened dramatically, and inefficiencies are covered over by throwing processors at them.

Do you read Dr.Dobbs?

47 freetoken  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:18:48pm
“The scientific method has changed for the first time since Galileo invented the telescope (in 1609),” said computer scientist Mark Seager of Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory.

Definition of overstated?

48 joncelli  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:18:52pm

Yeah, PETA's a flop all right.

/Thank you! I'll be here all week! Try the veal!

49 carti3r  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:18:57pm

Speaking of flops. Maybe it can tell us why 0bama was elected.

50 bse5150  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:19:02pm

The sad part is that the supercomputers are largely being used (or we're being lied to so that we feel warm and gooey) to solve 'climate problems' which as many of us know is a load of crap. So they punch in these numbers, run obscene amounts of energy and time, and come up with answers or non-answers to something that doesn't exist in the first place. Or how about the nuclear explosion simulations? We need a supercomputer to do that? I thought it was as simple as an earth-shattering KABOOM!
The supercomputers could be better used to simulate protein folding, solve complex mathematical problems, decrypt terrorist messages or run SETI. Anyone interested in what a supercomputer can and should do can google distributed computing and see what kinds of stuff home computers are doing now - as well as the solutions they have already discovered.

51 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:19:15pm

Back in a couple of minutes mates, I need to reply back to Walter...

52 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:19:50pm

re: #48 joncelli

ewww!

53 gunslingah  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:20:32pm

We're getting closer and closer to the Technological Singularity. (Your text to link...).

We're doomed.

54 nobamadada  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:20:49pm

re: #52 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

you dont eat meat?...get out of town!

55 pegcity  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:20:58pm

re: #50 bse5150

u can network your ps3 to do computing calculations for cancer research i believe.

56 Dirk Diggler  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:21:02pm
Scientists will be able to run new and vastly more accurate models of complex phenomena: Climate models will have dramatically higher resolution and accuracy...

Yeah right. Assuming the GISS is able to load the correct months data into the model.

57 Syrah  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:21:07pm

Now if we were to cluster the two machines together . . .

58 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:21:15pm

re: #54 nobamadada

heh.

59 nobamadada  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:22:17pm

re: #58 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

joking of course! i wish i could be a vegan

60 ErislDysnomia  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:22:26pm
“The scientific method has changed for the first time since Galileo invented the telescope (in 1609),” said computer scientist Mark Seager of Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory.

Ya know, this sounds like the same hype we heard in the 1950's about how vacuum tube computers would replace doctors.

61 pat  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:22:59pm

Her neon mouth with the blinking soft smile
Is nothing but an electric sign
You could say she has an individual style
She's part of a colorful time
Super-sealed lady, chrome-color clothes
You wear 'cause you have no other
But I suppose no one knows
You're my plastic fantastic lover
Your rattlin' cough never shuts off
Is nothin' but a used machine
Your aluminum finish, slightly diminished
Is the best I ever have seen
Cosmetic baby plugged into me
And never ever find another
And I realize no one's wise
To my plastic fantastic lover
The electrical dust is starting to rust
Her trapezoid thermometer taste
All the red tape is mechanical rape
Of the TV program waste
Data control and IBM
Science is mankind's brother
But all I see is drainin' me
On my plastic fantastic lover

62 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:23:05pm

re: #57 Syrah

Now if we were to cluster the two machines together . . .

They'd be flopping their peta's together so fast...

63 Killian Bundy  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:23:47pm
the Petaflop Computer

/guess it doesn't run on meat

64 Perplexed  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:23:57pm

Garbage in - garbage out

65 HoosierHoops  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:23:58pm

re: #61 pat
ooo,,did you write that?

66 lostlakehiker  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:24:15pm

re: #10 karmic_inquisitor

I wonder if those "higher resolution" climate models will now show that the planet is cooling (which is what thermometers have been rudely reporting for the last 10 years) instead of warming.

Something tells me that the "higher resolution" will be used to model what new bogus claim will scare taxpayers into paying for a yet bigger computer.

The argument against the science on global warming has hammered incessantly on the admitted fact that the climate models we now use have inadequate resolution.

Now that this is going to be fixed, you cry fraud.

The sober scientific case on global warming [a different thing from what Al Gore is talking up] grants candidly that in any given ten year span, you may see net cooling.

CO2 is a greenhouse gas. World CO2 levels have been climbing steadily, year over year. Every single year, the levels are that much higher than the year before. There's no doubt about it, and volcanoes and other accidental sources are incidental. Our fossil fuels are driving this.

But the sun gets a vote. Weather cycles get a vote. Dust storms, cloud cover, all these things get a vote.

What one would expect is a two steps forward, one step back situation, in which roughly half the years are cooler than the one before, except once in a while, you get two warm years in a row...and one third of the time, the current decade is cooler than the one before, etc.

There is a lot of noise in this signal, so to speak. But, that said, it HAS been getting warmer. The mountain glaciers of the earth ARE retreating. Animal migrations DO occur earlier in the spring, and later in the fall, than they used to. All these bits of evidence, and more, suggest that the current warming trend, wiggles notwithstanding, is probably partly of our own making. Better models, with higher resolution, will contribute to our understanding. But these supercomputers will be useful for far more than that.

See next post.

67 ErislDysnomia  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:24:20pm
A new crop of supercomputers is breaking down the petaflop speed barrier, pushing high-performance computing into a new realm that could change science more profoundly than at any time since Galileo, leading researchers say.

And will provide the Blue Screen of Death even faster than before!

68 irongrampa  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:24:34pm

So what does this do for us born analog, and dragged kicking and screaming into the digital age?

69 pat  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:24:35pm

Climate models? Sure. BS in BS out.

70 solomonpanting  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:24:37pm
But both competitors broke petaflop speeds, performing 1.105 and 1.059 quadrillion floating-point calculations per second

That's one calculation for (1)every illegal dollar raised by Obama's web campaign, (2)one dollar lost by the Big Three Auto Companies, and (3) every muslim worldwide.

71 Dar ul Harb  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:24:40pm

I for one welcome our new electronic brain overlords.

72 Dasher  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:24:57pm

Charles should get one of these as his lizard server

73 nobamadada  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:25:02pm

re: #63 Killian Bundy

i heard it runs on ethanol..:-)

74 Shug  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:25:30pm

Tron

75 reine.de.tout  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:25:32pm

re: #62 Walter L. Newton

They'd be flopping their peta's together so fast...

Now, there you go again, Walter, with that imagery I just do not want in my head.

76 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:25:34pm

Maybe these Peta flops can figure out what to do with that monstrous greenhouse gas dihydrogen monoxide.

Petaflop...someone who likes killing animals?

77 pat  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:25:54pm

re: #65 HoosierHoops

Jefferson Airplane

78 HoosierHoops  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:26:00pm

re: #67 ErislDysnomia

And will provide the Blue Screen of Death even faster than before!

No windows on super computers...
Those smart guys? They're not THAT dumb.
/

79 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:27:27pm
80 HoosierHoops  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:27:39pm

re: #77 pat

Jefferson Airplane
[Link: www.youtube.com...]

Sorry never heard that..Great words huh?

81 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:28:16pm

re: #79 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

BTW, PETA kills animals...

Not surprised.

82 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:28:39pm

For anyone who is not a skeptic of the over-the-top climate change claims that we keep having piped into our living rooms and cars by the MSM, this recent incident should be illuminating.

Basically you have a case where NASA has been caught (yet again) manipulating climate data to create panic (and pitch more funding). You have 4 agencies in the world that measure global temps, and NASA is consistently the most aggressive in publishing "warming supportive" data sets, thereby skewing everyone else.

The manipulation was detected by hobbyists on the web - which they have done several times before.

Alarmism that drives funding begets more alarmism. And you get to pay for it - both for the salaries and equipment for the alarmists, and for the policies they get imposed on our economy.

83 freetoken  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:29:02pm

re: #66 lostlakehiker

Well, it is a valiant effort on your part... but perhaps to no avail.

So many people here still have to vent (against Obama mostly, but against other things as well), that trying to do an over-view of climate studies just gets swamped by all the out-venting.

The AGU will have its annual big meeting in a couple of weeks, and like last year I plan on posting links to some of the more interesting talks. Perhaps there will be some lively discussion at that time...

84 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:29:11pm

re: #81 spirochete

Not surprised.


Sanctimonious poo poo heads.

85 Perplexed  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:29:11pm

re: #66 lostlakehiker

I will believe in computer models when they accurately recreate weather forecasts over the past century. Until then the models are all pretty much total crap.

86 bendover0311  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:29:39pm

Tedious.

87 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:29:44pm

re: #79 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

BTW, PETA kills animals...

Few years back they released a bunch of Mink from an OR farm. Minks all died in the woods, didn't know how to survive...

88 pat  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:30:12pm

re: #81 spirochete

very popular with science types when in the zone. lol

89 Shug  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:30:22pm

re: #85 Perplexed

I will believe in computer models when they accurately recreate weather forecasts over the past century. Until then the models are all pretty much total crap.

If the 7 day weather forecast was accurate, you'd only need the weather forecast once a week

90 lostlakehiker  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:30:27pm

There are all sorts of possibilities for supercomputers. What if we want to know, oh, what's the best way to streamline an airplane? So, you run imaginary atmospheres past imaginary airplanes, simulating every little centimeter sized whorl, and scrolling through gazillions of possible designs, until you hit some promising ones. You look at all of them, and tweak them all to perfection or until they lose out to some other design.

What if we want to know, is there any antibiotic that would be effective against this or that new drug-resistant bacterium. Well, we have the genome of the bacteria, electron microscope scans of its structure and so on. So, you run every imaginable molecule past imaginary bacteria, tracing imaginary metabolic consequences, until you hit on the molecule that does the trick.

And so on, and so forth. Even with this new power, we cannot ask every possible question and just expect answers. The number of molecules is so large it will handily defeat even the new supercomputer unless awesome levels of human insight and cleverness are at work to narrow the search.

OK. We have that. Man the toolmaker has just stepped it up a notch.

91 irongrampa  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:30:32pm

Time for the old folk--goodnight, good people, and have an excellent evening.

92 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:30:42pm

re: #81 spirochete

Not surprised.

The fracken' poster child of liberal BS mates!

93 bendover0311  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:31:10pm

People Eating Tasty Animals = PETA

94 jroberson  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:31:42pm

How long before computers become the oracles by which all questions are answered? I can see it now:

Lefty Government Scientist: what is the definition of morality?

Oracle Super Computer: Any action or belief that both feels good, and furthers the advancement of communism, errr, *boop!* correction. . .that which furthers the advancement of the common good.

LGS: Thank you for your output.

OSC: You are welcome, my master!

95 Syrah  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:31:51pm

re: #68 irongrampa

So what does this do for us born analog, and dragged kicking and screaming into the digital age?

At some point, these digital systems will process data so fast that there out put will become analog in appearance.

96 Oh no...Sand People!  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:32:06pm

Equal processing speeds for all PC's!
/

97 nobamadada  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:32:20pm

re: #94 jroberson

How long before computers become the oracles by which all questions are answered? I can see it now:

Lefty Government Scientist: what is the definition of morality?

Oracle Super Computer: Any action or belief that both feels good, and furthers the advancement of communism, errr, *boop!* correction. . .that which furthers the advancement of the common good.

LGS: Thank you for your output.

OSC: You are welcome, my master!

wow scary!

98 Oh no...Sand People!  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:32:37pm

When every computer is 'super' no computer will be...

/

99 Dasher  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:34:00pm

A Jewish man was sitting in Starbucks reading an Arab newspaper. A friend of his, who happened to be in the same store, noticed this strange phenomenon.

Very upset, he approached him and said: 'Moshe, have you lost your mind? Why are you reading an Arab newspaper?'

Moshe replied, 'I used to read the Jewish newspapers, but what did I find? Jews being persecuted, Israel being attacked, Jews disappearing through assimilation and intermarriage, Jews living in poverty. So I switched to the Arab newspaper. Now what do I find? Jews own all the banks, Jews control the media, Jews are all rich and powerful, Jews rule the world.
The news is so much better!'

100 bendover0311  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:34:00pm

re: #98 Oh no...Sand People!

When every computer is 'super' no computer will be...

/

We're all SPECIAL.

101 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:34:54pm

re: #84 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Sanctimonious poo poo heads.

It would be interesting to walk the cat back and trace the origins of PETA, the leadership, etc.

102 wolfie  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:35:08pm

I still haven't grasped the microwave oven.

103 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:35:13pm

re: #61 pat

Whoa! Brings back memories, Pat...

/Jefferson Airplane: Plastic Fantastic Lover

104 Perplexed  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:35:38pm

re: #90 lostlakehiker

It is still garbage in - garbage out. I once worked at a company that if you were an engineer and opened up a conversation with one of the VPs with a "I modeled it on the VAX" you would get an ass chewing like you wouldn't believe. Something about not having all of the information required to make a decision. The VP who held a PHD in Electrical Engineering was quite bright. Show him a prototype and in less than 30 minutes could tell you what you did wrong and to get it fixed before going into production.

105 Dar ul Harb  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:35:58pm
I know I've made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I've still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you.
--HAL 9000, 2001: A Space Odyssey (1968)
106 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:36:50pm

re: #102 wolfie

I still haven't grasped the microwave oven.

Hint, not for drying poodles.

107 pat  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:37:07pm

re: #103 Karridine

Yeah. Punching BASIC cards and designing nuclear space ships in your mind. lol

108 Oh no...Sand People!  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:37:10pm

I ♥ applied science!

109 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:37:58pm

re: #92 LoFlyer

The fracken' poster child of liberal BS mates!

Got it, sent you one back.

110 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:38:02pm

re: #102 wolfie

I still haven't grasped the microwave oven.

Well, DON'T, Wolfie, at least until it cools!

111 wolfie  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:38:03pm

re: #106 jcm

Thank you! :D

112 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:38:03pm

In Atlanta there is an Org named PAWS that does not euthanise and if you are looking for a pet in the ATL I highly advise it. I saw a fine dog euthanised 10 years ago at 'me employers animal control shelter, And it was emotional for me. I was working on some network issue at the shelter in the area they euthanise. Two workers gave the dog the injection and comforted him as he appeared to go asleep on his feet and passed away. Very moving and 'me hats off to me work-mates for their compassionate handling of the issue.

113 Opilio  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:38:42pm

re: #85 Perplexed

I will believe in computer models when they accurately recreate weather forecasts over the past century. Until then the models are all pretty much total crap.

From Wikipedia, so take it for what it's worth:

Given the current speed of progress, Supercomputers are projected to reach 1 Exaflop (1000 Petaflops) in 2019. Erik P. DeBenedictis of Sandia National Laboratories theorizes that a Zettaflop (1000 Exaflops) computer is required to accomplish full weather modeling, which could cover a two week time span accurately. Such systems might be built around 2030.

So we're one-millionth of the way to a computer that can accomplish full weather modeling.

Wake me when they fire up the Yottaflop machine (1 billion Petaflops).

114 wolfie  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:39:16pm

re: #110 Karridine

Another fine safety tip! I appeciate all the help I can get!

115 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:39:32pm

re: #113 Opilio

So we're one-millionth of the way to a computer that can accomplish full weather modeling.

Wake me when they fire up the Yottaflop machine (1 billion Petaflops).

By then it'll all be over.
/

116 reine.de.tout  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:39:41pm

re: #102 wolfie

I still haven't grasped the microwave oven.

lol

117 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:42:21pm

re: #102 wolfie

I still haven't grasped the microwave oven.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

118 Perplexed  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:42:51pm

But can you play solitaire on it?

119 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:43:10pm

But does it brown the food?

120 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:43:14pm

re: #117 Walter L. Newton

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Too much information.

Firmly with both hands...

121 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:43:36pm

42

122 HelloDare  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:45:55pm

re: #121 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

42

But what's the question?

123 OldLineTexan  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:46:33pm

I thought a petaflop was an anti-fur protest with no red paint to throw.

124 Oh no...Sand People!  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:46:43pm

Chicken or the egg?

125 wolfie  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:47:12pm

re: #117 Walter L. Newton

Good God Almighty! It's even scarier than I thought!

126 Perplexed  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:47:16pm

re: #124 Oh no...Sand People!

Chicken or the egg?

What to eat for breakfast?

127 carti3r  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:47:21pm

...but can it make the guy run more than 25 meters on QWOP?

128 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:47:52pm
Scientists will be able to run new and vastly more accurate models of complex phenomena: Climate models will have dramatically higher resolution and accuracy,

Color me skeptical on that. I don't care how fast the computer running the model is. The model is only as good as the assumptions fed into it. And we have only limited knowledge about all of the factors that affect the climate.

I have no doubt these computers will be invaluable to science. But making faster calculations of inaccurate models doesn't improve their accuracy.

129 The Optimist  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:47:53pm

A quadrillion million megaflops = 20 pounds of hamster pooh every second. How do they train the hamsters to runs so fast?

130 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:48:03pm

re: #123 OldLineTexan

I thought a petaflop was an anti-fur protest with no red paint to throw.

Good one!

131 Oh no...Sand People!  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:48:07pm

The Government is bringing out their new version of the Megaflop...

/*rimshot* ... *crickets*...

132 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:48:35pm

re: #129 venezuela lover

A quadrillion million megaflops = 20 pounds of hamster pooh every second. How do they train the hamsters to runs so fast?

Steroids.

133 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:48:51pm

Walter it will be great to meet you and I know you can find a good place for us to eat. We'll come hungry mate!

134 Boogberg  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:49:43pm
135 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:51:08pm

re: #133 LoFlyer

Walter it will be great to meet you and I know you can find a good place for us to eat. We'll come hungry mate!

I thought we'd just grill up Maisey my parrot.

136 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:51:40pm

re: #66 lostlakehiker

The argument against the science on global warming has hammered incessantly on the admitted fact that the climate models we now use have inadequate resolution.

Now that this is going to be fixed, you cry fraud.

The sober scientific case on global warming [a different thing from what Al Gore is talking up] grants candidly that in any given ten year span, you may see net cooling.

CO2 is a greenhouse gas. World CO2 levels have been climbing steadily, year over year. Every single year, the levels are that much higher than the year before. There's no doubt about it, and volcanoes and other accidental sources are incidental. Our fossil fuels are driving this.

But the sun gets a vote. Weather cycles get a vote. Dust storms, cloud cover, all these things get a vote.

What one would expect is a two steps forward, one step back situation, in which roughly half the years are cooler than the one before, except once in a while, you get two warm years in a row...and one third of the time, the current decade is cooler than the one before, etc.

There is a lot of noise in this signal, so to speak. But, that said, it HAS been getting warmer. The mountain glaciers of the earth ARE retreating. Animal migrations DO occur earlier in the spring, and later in the fall, than they used to. All these bits of evidence, and more, suggest that the current warming trend, wiggles notwithstanding, is probably partly of our own making. Better models, with higher resolution, will contribute to our understanding. But these supercomputers will be useful for far more than that.

See next post.

Nice post - I am not a Luddite against computers or science. I am against the celebrity focused "science" that Global Warming research has so far delivered.

So I don't cry foul.

I say "convince me". With good data and good science.

Scientific theory is testable and predictive. So far, we have neither stemming from this research.

But let's accept that we are dealing with complexity and timelines that don't give us a clear basis (yet) for testing theory or having confidence in our predictions.

So can we just be honest about that? Why do we still have agencies that are being caught faking data to get outcomes that better match wild predictions? Why do we keep people who have stated in sworn testimony silly "hockeystick" predictions in charge of this research? By any objective standard, they are lousy scientists. They should never have been "unequivocal" in their hockeystick predictions in the first place. It would have been nice to hear balanced reasoning rather than having the finger waved at us that "we must change now before it is too late".

I am a luke warmer - I think it would be absurd to assume that industrialization has no effect on the climate of the planet. And I have a negative carbon footprint with a PV field that powers my house, farm and business. That said, I know that there is much more to climate than CO2 and that there are far more potent greenhouse molecules that CO2 (ones released when my PV panels were made, for instance)

I get it.

What I don't get is the game that undermines the science - the prostitution of claims to become a celebrity in what should be boring, tedious scientific toil.

The fools running the research deserve the skepticism directed at them, especially when they ask for more funding while producing shoddy data and shoddier science. So I think a little ridicule is in order when they want a petaflop computer while they make up climate records for Russia.

BTW - we followed the same "fund the science celebrity" model for AIDS research - 25 years later we still don't have a full understanding. We wasted 15 years on false assumptions based on cooked up data "brought to market" too early but done so so that press conferences could be held.

137 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:52:06pm

re: #132 MandyManners

Steroids.

Excellent, the extra muscle mass will make the hamsters all the more tasty. My family's cats deserve the best, and nothing but the best hamsters should be given to them. [evil grin]

138 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:52:10pm

I would be really impressed if Cray or IBM could make a supercomputer that could figure out why I have a laundry basket full of unmatched socks. I mean C'mon, where the hell did all their matches disappear to?

139 Killian Bundy  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:52:21pm

Wow, the much anticipated COD5 is out.

/and apparently it totally sucks

140 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:52:39pm

"Deep PetaFloop Battles Gary Kasparov, Chess GrandMaster!"

PetaFloop: "You take the opening move."

Kasparov: "Pawn to Queen 3"

PetaFloop: "I have calculated all possible outcomes. You lose."

141 Right mind left  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:52:43pm

Petaflops are the new gymnastics the hamsters can do on their treadmills!

142 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:53:04pm

re: #46 HoosierHoops

Do you read Dr.Dobbs?

Not much anymore.

143 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:53:30pm

re: #135 Walter L. Newton

I thought we'd just grill up Maisey my parrot.

Arrr! Not the parrot! How about some ground beef on toast? Not the blessed parrot mate!

144 solomonpanting  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:53:37pm

re: #123 OldLineTexan

I thought a petaflop was an anti-fur protest with no red paint to throw.

It's related to the petafloposauras, a prehistoric worm (bookworm, I believe), with a thousand legs on which to count.

145 Oh no...Sand People!  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:53:43pm

re: #136 karmic_inquisitor

Follow the $$$ trail.

146 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:54:30pm

re: #128 Mich-again

Color me skeptical on that. I don't care how fast the computer running the model is. The model is only as good as the assumptions fed into it.

True enough, but considering them "variables" or "data points" rather than "assumptions" means we can now better test their validity.

147 mannygo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:54:33pm

In less than 3 hrs, it can calculate that capitalism is 86% better than socialism, thus shaming humans who are still debating this 130 years after "Das Kapital"

In 8.4 seconds, it can also demonstrate that a Republican white house is 73% better for mankind than a Democrat.

But it needs less than a millisecond to calculate that Obama's disappointment / satisfaction ratio will be over 100 in two years.

148 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:54:38pm

I'm just surprised they purposefully named something anything "flop".

149 Right mind left  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:56:31pm

re: #147 mannygo

In less than 3 hrs, it can calculate that capitalism is 86% better than socialism, thus shaming humans who are still debating this 130 years after "Das Kapital"

In 8.4 seconds, it can also demonstrate that a Republican white house is 73% better for mankind than a Democrat.

But it needs less than a millisecond to calculate that Obama's disappointment / satisfaction ratio will be over 100 in two years.

Then the MSM says the data has been skewed and we are once again skewed. Back to the drawing bored...

150 OldLineTexan  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:56:43pm

Move to change "Yottaflop" to "Yodaflop" I do.

Fitting it would be, hmmm? Hmmm?

151 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:57:01pm

re: #148 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

"something anything" well, somebody needs to go to bed. G'night.

152 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:57:19pm

re: #66 lostlakehiker

The argument against the science on global warming has hammered incessantly on the admitted fact that the climate models we now use have inadequate resolution.

Now that this is going to be fixed, you cry fraud.

Running all these computers to simulate global warming, will cause global warming, rendering the simulations invalid.

Viz. Gödel's Incompleteness Theorem

153 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:57:23pm

re: #150 OldLineTexan

Move to change "Yottaflop" to "Yodaflop" I do.

Fitting it would be, hmmm? Hmmm?

These aren't the flops you're looking for.

154 Archimedes  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:57:48pm

I love the technology ...

but ...

re: #4 kynna

But if the data going in is crap, it's just higher resolution crap. Right?

//Not looking forward to the higher resolution crap.

Why are so many articles poisoned with pseudo-science?

155 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:57:54pm

Professor? I think you'd better come over to the Programming Room for Deep PetaFlorp... right away, Sir!

"What is it, Smith?"

The computer screen is showing this: *waves to Video Display Unit*

Did you wash your hands?
156 poopeedoo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:58:01pm

re: #30 Dirk Diggler

LoFlyer,


Imagine the porn downloading speeds!

*sick*

157 Pawn of the Oppressor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:58:46pm

re: #5 Cygnus

But will it balance my checkbook?

No, but it may become self-aware and kill us all. Television doesn't lie!

158 JohnAdams  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:58:50pm

re: #138 Mich-again

I would be really impressed if Cray or IBM could make a supercomputer that could figure out why I have a laundry basket full of unmatched socks. I mean C'mon, where the hell did all their matches disappear to?

This might make an excellent Penn & Teller investigation.

159 Clemente  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:59:07pm

Ok, ok, OK! I can take a hint, though I've tried ignore it since yesterday's tech note...

(stuffs pittance in tip jar)

There. Try to find it on sale. Or, I guess you can at least pick up a fresh bag of hamster treats. ;)

/And I had to go look for littlegreenfutbols. They exist!

160 Oh no...Sand People!  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:59:24pm

re: #139 Killian Bundy

Wow, the much anticipated COD5 is out.

/and apparently it totally sucks

1. Infinity Ward didn't do that one, it was handed back to Treyarch.
2. The multiplayer is the exact same as COD4 except make the maps bigger and revert to WWII models...etc. (That is a positive...depending on how you look at it.)

So knowing that Infinity Ward didn't work on it gives me hope that if they do get back into the COD franchise and pull out and official COD 5...I hope.

161 Archimedes  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:59:24pm

re: #148 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I'm just surprised they purposefully named something anything "flop".

I don't know, but there is such a thing as a "flip-flop", a digital circuit design that responds to an input pulse.

162 OldLineTexan  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:59:29pm

re: #157 Pawn of the Oppressor

No, but it may become self-aware and kill us all. Television doesn't lie!

Keep it away from Cartman's TrapperKeeper...

163 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:59:30pm

re: #138 Mich-again

I would be really impressed if Cray or IBM could make a supercomputer that could figure out why I have a laundry basket full of unmatched socks. I mean C'mon, where the hell did all their matches disappear to?

I think there's an IgNobel Prize for that in recent years.

164 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:59:41pm

re: #138 Mich-again

I would be really impressed if Cray or IBM could make a supercomputer that could figure out why I have a laundry basket full of unmatched socks. I mean C'mon, where the hell did all their matches disappear to?

Maybe the socks were "lint" to somebody.

165 Learned Mother of Zion  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:59:51pm

re: #87 jcm

Few years back they released a bunch of Mink from an OR farm. Minks all died in the woods, didn't know how to survive...

But not before the minks attacked and devoured farm chickens and small household pets.

166 Moe Katz  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:59:52pm

re: #148 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I'm just surprised they purposefully named something anything "flop".


Nothing succeeds like FLOPS.

167 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 7:59:56pm

re: #154 Archimedes

Really! I can do Garbage-In/Garbage-Out calculations with a pencil and paper!

/Zooper Gomputer? We don' need no steenkin' Zooper Gomputer!

168 Right mind left  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:00:31pm

re: #156 poopeedoo

*sick*

A quickie! ...no petaflops please...

169 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:00:43pm

re: #156 poopeedoo

*sick*

Then stay away from Japan, and gain a sense of humor mate!

170 freetoken  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:00:51pm

re: #136 karmic_inquisitor

I say "convince me". With good data and good science.

Scientific theory is testable and predictive. So far, we have neither stemming from this research.

And I say look at the various articles published over say, the last 40 years. Start with the journals of the members of the American Geophysical Union, then branch out from there.

When you do that, and not spend time reading suspect political blogs, perhaps you will realize there is more to the story than an alleged conspiracy of leftists.

171 poopeedoo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:01:03pm

re: #72 Dasher

Charles should get one of these as his lizard server

Speaking of Charles, he's been exceedingly quiet today.

172 Archimedes  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:02:04pm

re: #167 Karridine

Really! I can do Garbage-In/Garbage-Out calculations with a pencil and paper!

/Zooper Gomputer? We don' need no steenkin' Zooper Gomputer!

I'm much more interested in how they will deal with improving medical science than climate science, because this will do something to really save lives.

173 Oh no...Sand People!  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:02:11pm

re: #139 Killian Bundy

Wow, the much anticipated COD5 is out.

/and apparently it totally sucks

I will be able to give you a more official verdict after I start playing it in about 2 hours. Heh.

174 poopeedoo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:02:34pm

re: #87 jcm

Few years back they released a bunch of Mink from an OR farm. Minks all died in the woods, didn't know how to survive...

No survival manuals, eh?

175 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:03:22pm

re: #66 lostlakehiker

My biggest problem with global warming science is that the conclusion came first, and all the subsequent research seems geared primarily to support that conclusion.

Science and politics working together scares me as much as science and religion working together.

176 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:03:27pm

re: #171 poopeedoo

Speaking of Charles, he's been exceedingly quiet today.

Which reminds me, did Charles cut us over to his new server last night? Response has been great!

177 Learned Mother of Zion  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:03:47pm

re: #99 Dasher

A Jewish man was sitting in Starbucks reading an Arab newspaper.
[...]
The news is so much better!'

Jew in 1898, sitting on a train in Ukraine, reading a Black Hundreds tract.
Jew in 1938, sitting in Berlin cafe, reading Der Beobachter.
Jew in 1958, waiting in line in Moscow, reading Pravda.
Jew in 2008, reading Daily Kos and Electronic Intifada online.

178 Boogberg  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:04:25pm

re: #171 poopeedoo

Speaking of Charles, he's been exceedingly quiet today.

With any luck, he's at the barbershop. :D

179 Moe Katz  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:04:59pm

re: #177 Alouette

Yeah, it's an oldie but goodie.

180 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:05:01pm

re: #177 Alouette

Jew in 1898, sitting on a train in Ukraine, reading a Black Hundreds tract.
Jew in 1938, sitting in Berlin cafe, reading Der Beobachter.
Jew in 1958, waiting in line in Moscow, reading Pravda.
Jew in 2008, reading Daily Kos and Electronic Intifada online.

Oh my.

181 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:05:27pm

re: #175 Mich-again

My biggest problem with global warming science is that the conclusion came first, and all the subsequent research seems geared primarily to support that conclusion.

Science and politics working together scares me as much as science and religion working together.

EGGS Ackley!

"Bring in the guilty man for his fair trial!"

182 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:05:40pm

re: #178 Boogberg

With any luck, he's at the barbershop. :D

What?

183 legalpad  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:06:20pm

We're supposed to have a desktop computer that performs like the human brain by 2019. Related materials.

184 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:06:26pm

re: #165 Alouette

But not before the minks attacked and devoured farm chickens and small household pets.

Excellent, even more animals "saved!"

185 dmjboose  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:06:51pm

woohoo! Just a suggestion... if you're interested in this kind of stuff check out [Link: www.slashdot.org...]

186 Boogberg  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:07:46pm

re: #182 Walter L. Newton

Last time I saw him, he was in dire need of a haircut. :)

187 JohnAdams  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:08:24pm

re: #175 Mich-again

My biggest problem with global warming science is that the conclusion came first, and all the subsequent research seems geared primarily to support that conclusion.

Science and politics working together scares me as much as science and religion working together.

I look upon an Al Gore movie about global warming like a Michael Moore film without the funny parts.

Michael Crichton had a great suggestion--a national science institute with multiple sources of funding, and a kind of circular firing squad in its cross-critique of data gathering and analysis. Above all, politics must stay the fuck out of scientific inquiry.

188 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:09:13pm

re: #186 Boogberg

He knows where the barbers be.

189 Killian Bundy  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:09:20pm

re: #173 Oh no...Sand People!

I will be able to give you a more official verdict after I start playing it in about 2 hours. Heh.

/please do, I'd be interested

190 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:09:40pm

re: #186 Boogberg

Last time I saw him, he was in dire need of a haircut. :)

Was he in need of a haircut, or does Charles like to wear his hair long? I'm 55 years old and I wear my hair to the shoulder. It's sort of an odd remark that you think he needed a haircut.

Just me, I guess.

191 Shug  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:09:43pm

An Inconvenient Truth is the Reefer Madness of our age

192 DistantThunder  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:09:59pm

When I was little I'd visit my dad's IBM office in Chicago that overlooked the Picasso sculpture. I remember the freezing cold rooms with the big mainframes.

We moved to San Jose when it was mostly orchards in 1972. I remember him buying my brother an Apple 2e. Now my brother is a major computer whiz for a large catalog retailer. For now.

193 Boogberg  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:10:41pm

re: #188 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I ain't so sure..

194 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:10:44pm

re: #191 Shug

An Inconvenient Truth is the Reefer Madness of our age

Oh man, I tried smoking a copy of the Truth movie, bad trip, real bad.

195 AMER1CAN  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:12:25pm

Nice post, Charles. I remember when a teraflop was a milestone and now we've completely blown past that. It's awesome sometimes what mankind is able to come up with! The LHC in Europe is a great example as well of mankinds engineering prowess.

196 itellu3times  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:13:15pm

so it flips and flops, but will it ever flup?

197 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:14:36pm

re: #185 dmjboose

woohoo! Just a suggestion... if you're interested in this kind of stuff check out [Link: www.slashdot.org...]

You would not believe the amount of bandwidth available over fiber. I can push 400 gigibits 70 K' and charge you guys 30 buck a month a month for 5 meg for the cost of the fiber, 200 grand and 70 grand of equipment. Look at the profit margins of the Comcast and Charter. These guys are not going out business any time soon..

198 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:14:46pm

re: #194 Walter L. Newton

Oh man, I tried smoking a copy of the Truth movie, bad trip, real bad.

Their print version does NOT use acid-free paper, Walt!

/try some Vitamin B7...

199 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:15:16pm

re: #181 Karridine

Funny how so many of the people who scream that the developed world needs to reduce CO2 emissions gives the developing world a free pass for the rampant deforestation in their countries. It doesn't matter how fast we reduce CO2 emissions if we keep killing off the trees that eat the CO2 even faster.

200 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:16:46pm

re: #199 Mich-again

Agreed!

But please don't confuse them with facts, their mind's made up!

201 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:17:36pm

re: #198 Karridine

Their print version does NOT use acid-free paper, Walt!

/try some Vitamin B7...

It was a G chord below middle C, so it almost sounded augmented, easy to mistake for a B7.

(I stole that from Rawmuse on an earlier thread)

202 Last Mohican  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:17:45pm

Could somebody please explain bogoflops to me?

203 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:18:13pm

re: #187 JohnAdams

Above all, politics must stay the fuck out of scientific inquiry.

Especially when the scientist has to make the politically correct conclusion to keep the grant money rolling in.

204 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:18:39pm

re: #201 Walter L. Newton

It was a G chord below middle C, so it almost sounded augmented, easy to mistake for a B7.

(I stole that from Rawmuse on an earlier thread)

Ugh, not B7 again!

205 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:18:50pm

re: #199 Mich-again

Isn't the debacle something like "Switzerland-sized deforestation, every year, as Brazil is man-raped!'?

206 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:18:52pm

late enough in the thread to go ot?
dad storyfor any lizard dads (and moms)who have young daughters
my 6yr old came home from k-garden today and anounced that she had a
boyfriend-little b***d even made her a love note with hearts and
a picture of them holding hands.
I am not ready for this kind of drama yet!
anybody got a good connection for some drugs to keep me calm, it's gonna be a very long 12 years :)

207 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:20:11pm

re: #201 Walter L. Newton

Ah-ooogah! Aw-ooogah!

Alarm! Alarm! Walter plagiarized! Boo! Chuckle... Snort! :D

208 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:20:26pm

Hey! Really I am going to bed. But wanna have a little fun?

Go to google. type in the following...

the answer to life the universe and everything

made me happy. G'night.

209 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:20:49pm

Obama has more picking to do...

Arizona Gov. Janet Napolitano = Head of Homeland Security
Penny Pritzker = Commerce Sec.

[Link: www.cnn.com...]

210 Archimedes  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:20:53pm

re: #201 Walter L. Newton

It was a G chord below middle C, so it almost sounded augmented, easy to mistake for a B7.

(I stole that from Rawmuse on an earlier thread)

You sunk my battleship!

211 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:21:25pm

re: #206 rain of lead

late enough in the thread to go ot?
dad storyfor any lizard dads (and moms)who have young daughters
my 6yr old came home from k-garden today and anounced that she had a
boyfriend-little b***d even made her a love note with hearts and
a picture of them holding hands.
I am not ready for this kind of drama yet!
anybody got a good connection for some drugs to keep me calm, it's gonna be a very long 12 years :)


My 10 yr old little girl, I think, has a boyfriend. She doesn't know what to call him and I didnt tell her.

212 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:21:33pm

re: #208 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Hey! Really I am going to bed. But wanna have a little fun? Go to google. type in the following... the answer to life the universe and everything... made me happy. G'night.

Why do we need to Google that. Everyone know the answer.

213 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:22:26pm

re: #195 AMER1CAN

The LHC in Europe is a great example as well of mankinds engineering prowess.

Agreed. But the LHC is currently out of commission because some member of mankind didn't do his job correctly when they built it and caused the LHC to f* up when they turned it on.

214 jroberson  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:22:33pm

re: #174 poopeedoo


I'd say instead, no survivor mammals.

215 Last Mohican  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:22:37pm

re: #212 Walter L. Newton

Why do we need to Google that. Everyone know the answer.

I had actually forgotten the answer. It has been many years since I read that.

216 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:23:13pm

re: #211 spirochete

oh mine knew... she even said when she grows up they were gonna get married. :0 what the hell

217 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:23:21pm

re: #215 Last Mohican

I had actually forgotten the answer. It has been many years since I read that.

42

218 Archimedes  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:23:29pm

re: #215 Last Mohican

I had actually forgotten the answer. It has been many years since I read that.

Nobody forgets the answer to Life The Universe and Everything!

219 Last Mohican  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:24:26pm

re: #218 Archimedes

Nobody forgets the answer to Life The Universe and Everything!

I did. I guess it didn't seem particularly important to me...

220 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:24:34pm

re: #216 rain of lead

oh mine knew... she even said when she grows up they were gonna get married. :0 what the hell

How did this happen? I ask myself.

221 JohnAdams  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:25:08pm

re: #206 rain of lead

late enough in the thread to go ot?
dad storyfor any lizard dads (and moms)who have young daughters
my 6yr old came home from k-garden today and anounced that she had a
boyfriend-little b***d even made her a love note with hearts and
a picture of them holding hands.
I am not ready for this kind of drama yet!
anybody got a good connection for some drugs to keep me calm, it's gonna be a very long 12 years :)

Relax. The 90% you can control, you already do. The other 10% is something you can most likely control when it happens. You will both be fine!

222 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:25:31pm

re: #170 freetoken

And I say look at the various articles published over say, the last 40 years. Start with the journals of the members of the American Geophysical Union, then branch out from there.

When you do that, and not spend time reading suspect political blogs, perhaps you will realize there is more to the story than an alleged conspiracy of leftists.

I can show you data for the last 40 years where drivers of white cars in Florida are 3 times more likely to get cancer than those driving other cars.

That does not establish a causal relationship. What is actually happening is that older drivers are more likely to own white cars and are also more likely to get cancer.

I understand that CO2 is a greenhouse gas. I also understand that it is a weaker one. I also understand that CO2 levels at Mauna Kea show consistently higher concentrations year after year. I also understand that the Ocean stores and releases CO2 as it warms and cools, and that the Oceans dominate the terrascape.

Again - the leading proponents of AGW have pushed some absurdities that they have had to retract and tried to foist bad data on us and have been caught. Stil, they then go on to make another claim and my skepticism is characterized as irrational.

That I don't get.

223 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:25:53pm

re: #220 spirochete

no sh*t I think it was all those damn disney and barbie movies

224 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:25:58pm

Is it re: #218 Archimedes

I just got here and I know.

225 Boogberg  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:26:00pm

re: #190 Walter L. Newton

Was he in need of a haircut, or does Charles like to wear his hair long? I'm 55 years old and I wear my hair to the shoulder. It's sort of an odd remark that you think he needed a haircut.

Just me, I guess.

Yeah. I just think short hair looks better on TV is all.

226 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:26:13pm

re: #220 spirochete

How did this happen? I ask myself.

I think Hanna Montana is holding mass weddings at her concerts this year. Sort of like Sun Yung Moon.

227 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:26:34pm

re: #223 rain of lead

no sh*t I think it was all those damn disney and barbie movies

Mine plays guitar hero and listens to Rush. I thought i was doing the right things!

228 Shug  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:26:42pm
229 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:27:00pm

re: #209 Walter L. Newton

Obama has more picking to do...

Arizona Gov. Janet Napolitano = Head of Homeland Security
Penny Pritzker = Commerce Sec.

[Link: www.cnn.com...]

Actually giving a cabinet post to a Chicago crony; That's a bit more brazen than I expected.

230 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:27:04pm

re: #209 Walter L. Newton

I read earlier today that Obama has plans to immediately introduce some kind of carbon-use fees for manufacturers in the USA. Nice.

I told a moonbat at work that was unnecessary. GWB has been very successful at getting factories to close down their operations and reduce CO2 emissions already. Dude has been the most environmental President ever!

Mouth dropped and couldn't even muster a response.

231 Archimedes  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:27:44pm

re: #219 Last Mohican

I did. I guess it didn't seem particularly important to me...

I'm kidding with you, of course.

232 NoGardtheGreat  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:28:09pm

"Furthermore, there is no real consensus regarding the computational power of the human brain. Some estimates suggest that it is capable of 1017 FLOPS, or 100 petaflops."

REF: [Link: movementarian.com...]

1/100th of the way to real AI. Someone look up Asimov's 3 Laws of Robotics, we may need to dust them off soon.

233 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:28:11pm

re: #206 rain of lead

late enough in the thread to go ot?
dad storyfor any lizard dads (and moms)who have young daughters
my 6yr old came home from k-garden today and anounced that she had a
boyfriend-little b***d even made her a love note with hearts and
a picture of them holding hands.
I am not ready for this kind of drama yet!
anybody got a good connection for some drugs to keep me calm, it's gonna be a very long 12 years :)

Haar mate, that's why pirates stay unmarried and childless. The fear of responsibility is too much! 'Me hats off to you and I wish your family the very best !

234 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:29:16pm

re: #227 spirochete

I still can't figure out how to get my Zune to play all of the parts of 2112 together, while still being able to have it shuffled with the rest of the songs.

Walter? What's a petaflop?

235 Macker  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:29:26pm

re: #3 Shug

If it runs Vista will it crash even faster?

I dunno about that, but it better not run this.

236 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:29:28pm

re: #221 JohnAdams

Relax. The 90% you can control, you already do. The other 10% is something you can most likely control when it happens. You will both be fine!

an old saying I heard when she was born,
with a son you only have to worry about one penis,
with a girl you have to worry about all of them :(

237 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:29:55pm

re: #233 LoFlyer

Not Yellowbeard! :)

238 Oh no...Sand People!  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:30:50pm

re: #189 Killian Bundy

[/]please do, I'd be interested

lol...or not.

239 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:31:21pm

re: #234 Bumr50

I still can't figure out how to get my Zune to play all of the parts of 2112 together, while still being able to have it shuffled with the rest of the songs.

Walter? What's a petaflop?

We went to a Rush show early this year and they opened with Limelight. It was such a treat to watch her shouting the lyrics as loud as she could. She asked me why there were so many boys and not girls.

240 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:31:34pm

re: #234 Bumr50

I still can't figure out how to get my Zune to play all of the parts of 2112 together, while still being able to have it shuffled with the rest of the songs.

Walter? What's a petaflop?

A thousand trillion FLoating point Operations Per Second.

241 rawmuse  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:31:54pm

re: #183 legalpad

We're supposed to have a desktop computer that performs like the human brain by 2019. Related materials.

More impressive would be a computer that could out perform the brain of a cuttlefish. They have some pretty impressive abilities.

242 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:32:47pm

re: #233 LoFlyer

thanks matey,
love the pic, I have some cool pirate flag pics I will resume using once
the titans win the superbowl

243 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:33:03pm

re: #241 rawmuse

More impressive would be a computer that could out perform the brain of a cuttlefish. They have some pretty impressive abilities.

I was just talking to a cuttlefish about that the other day.

244 Last Mohican  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:33:12pm

re: #222 karmic_inquisitor

Nicely put.

But I think you jumped to a premature conclusion on that white car thing. Research on the matter is still ongoing. In the meantime, the government should pay to have everyone's car painted black. It might reduce cancer incidence by over 66%.

245 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:33:21pm

re: #241 rawmuse

It's certainly served them well through time.

246 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:33:27pm

re: #234 Bumr50

I still can't figure out how to get my Zune to play all of the parts of 2112 together, while still being able to have it shuffled with the rest of the songs.

Walter? What's a petaflop?

yotta [Y] 1 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 = 10^24
zetta [Z] 1 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 = 10^21
exa [E] 1 000 000 000 000 000 000 = 10^18
peta [P] 1 000 000 000 000 000 = 10^15
tera [T] 1 000 000 000 000 = 10^12
giga [G] 1 000 000 000 (a thousand millions = a billion)
mega [M] 1 000 000 (a million)
kilo [k] 1 000 (a thousand)
hecto [h] 100 (a hundred)
deca [da]10

247 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:33:45pm

re: #243 Walter L. Newton

Dr. Zoidberg?

248 solomonpanting  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:33:45pm

Manual issued to stop forced marriages

The Paris City Hall launched a manual on forced marriages on Wednesday to help officials spot and prevent cases of young women being coerced into matrimony.
An estimated 70,000 teenage girls living in France are victims or potential victims of forced marriages, many of them from immigrant families, according to a government study.

Nowhere in the entire article is there any mention of Islam or Muslim.
Must be the practice of an as yet unknown cult.

249 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:34:07pm

re: #240 Walter L. Newton

re: #246 jcm

Thanks!

250 JohnAdams  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:34:12pm

re: #236 rain of lead

an old saying I heard when she was born,
with a son you only have to worry about one penis,
with a girl you have to worry about all of them :(

I think you have to raise a girl right, and give her the benefit of the doubt that she can handle herself. Often the girls who have Dad all over their case are the ones who act out.

Of course this is all theory on my part. Just entering the Dark Ages of the teen years with mine.

251 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:34:14pm

re: #237 Bumr50

Not Yellowbeard! :)

Haar, it's definitely gray or "silver" as I prefer to call it. Not gold, but silver is not bad mates!

252 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:34:40pm

re: #220 spirochete

How did this happen? I ask myself.

Fear not!

In a week or two, should you chance to inquire softly 'Hows your friend? That boy..."
she'll respond airily, "Oh, Mom! That was last week, when I was a CHILD! That's all over now..."

253 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:36:06pm

re: #223 rain of lead

no sh*t I think it was all those damn disney and barbie movies

My advice. Competition dance team. My 11 YO daughter has been into that for years now and they stay so busy year round with that there is no time for boys. And the confidence and self-esteem they build from all the classes and competitions seems to negate the interest in chasing stupid boys around.

254 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:36:41pm

re: #242 rain of lead

thanks matey,
love the pic, I have some cool pirate flag pics I will resume using once
the titans win the superbowl

I am still looking for a better pirate avatar and if you know of some that look better let 'me know. Much obliged...

255 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:37:05pm

Yellowbeard was cool.

One of my first pirate movies. Thanks, Dad!

256 lobo91  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:37:19pm

re: #173 Oh no...Sand People!

I will be able to give you a more official verdict after I start playing it in about 2 hours. Heh.

I've had it for a few days. Don't see anything wrong with it. Nothing groundbreaking, either.

The flamethrower is cool, although it gets old after awhile.

257 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:38:11pm

re: #254 LoFlyer

I am still looking for a better pirate avatar and if you know of some that look better let 'me know. Much obliged...

Image: hjv_pirate036.jpg

258 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:38:47pm

re: #252 Karridine

Fear not!

In a week or two, should you chance to inquire softly 'Hows your friend? That boy..."
she'll respond airily, "Oh, Mom! That was last week, when I was a CHILD! That's all over now..."

oh god I hope so,
in the meantime I am looking into some local martial arts studios that
she and I can join together for some good daddy-daughter bonding time

259 rawmuse  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:39:19pm

Cuttlefish are just yummy bits of protein swimming around. But they have about 20 million chromatophore cells that they command to change shape AND color as they need to blend in with their surroundings, and those cells change at the speed of light.

That is some processing power right there.

260 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:40:04pm

re: #228 Shug

Batshit craziness in Texas.

Yep, it's also unconstitutional for a state to charge a sitting POTUS or VP.

261 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:40:13pm

re: #170 freetoken

BTW - I doubt that any reasonable person would refute that the left has used environmentalism as a key issue in attempting to regain power and credibility.

That does not mean that all environmental efforts are therefore part of a leftist conspiracy.

But that does mean that one has a duty to be more skeptical of a scientific claim made in the name of the environment when one realizes that the New Left has targeted the issue as a basis for regaining power. Herbert Marcuse and the Earth First movement made that aim explicit, citing the need to use the environmental movement to disarm capitalism.

And as for the credibility of Wattsupwiththat, I'd take care in attacking Anthony over there. He too is a green-turned-skeptic who doesn't try to compete with the AGW moralists in making sweeping claims and accusations but instead does the tedious work of testing data and models that are the work product of what has often proven itself more of a political movement than a scientific effort.

262 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:40:18pm

re: #248 solomonpanting

Manual issued to stop forced marriages

Nowhere in the entire article is there any mention of Islam or Muslim.
Must be the practice of an as yet unknown cult.

They won't use the word 'Islam'. They are afraid of charges of "Islamophobia".

263 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:40:56pm

re: #257 Walter L. Newton

aaaggghhh...
damn walter... a little warning next time

264 poopeedoo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:41:17pm

re: #258 rain of lead

oh god I hope so,
in the meantime I am looking into some local martial arts studios that
she and I can join together for some good daddy-daughter bonding time

The father-daughter bond is one of the biggest esteem builders that you can give your daughter. Love her, praise her, esteem her and give her boundaries. It will last her a lifetime!

265 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:41:21pm

re: #257 Walter L. Newton

[Link: www.tinynibbles.com...]

Haaar!

266 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:41:53pm

re: #253 Mich-again

My advice. Competition dance team. My 11 YO daughter has been into that for years now and they stay so busy year round with that there is no time for boys. And the confidence and self-esteem they build from all the classes and competitions seems to negate the interest in chasing stupid boys around.

Hey, good idea.

267 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:41:54pm

re: #259 rawmuse

I just saw a bit about them mating. A young cuttlefish waited while another, older cuttlefish had to leave his female to vie for mating rights, and when the fight came about, the young cuttlefish just moved in and started going to town.

I kind of hope computers don't start doing that.

268 Boogberg  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:42:03pm

re: #237 Bumr50

Not Yellowbeard! :)

Speaking of Yellowbeard... :D

269 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:42:03pm

re: #260 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Yep, it's also unconstitutional for a state to charge a sitting POTUS or VP.

There you go with those silly little details again.

McChimpyBushCheneyHalliburtonRoveBlackwater must PAY!

270 rgranger  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:42:20pm

So, back when things were much warmer Africa was fertile, North America was Tropical, shit was green everywhere or so said the ancient teachings of 40 years ago in grade school...what is so bad about that! Life continues and thrives in warmth and DIES in cold. If I had to pick, I say lets go with door #2 and the warming.

271 poopeedoo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:42:28pm

re: #267 Bumr50

I just saw a bit about them mating. A young cuttlefish waited while another, older cuttlefish had to leave his female to vie for mating rights, and when the fight came about, the young cuttlefish just moved in and started going to town.

I kind of hope computers don't start doing that.

Sounds like you need a hobby. ;)

272 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:42:34pm

re: #265 LoFlyer

Me timbers shivered!

273 Killian Bundy  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:43:30pm

re: #256 lobo91

I've had it for a few days. Don't see anything wrong with it. Nothing groundbreaking, either.

The flamethrower is cool, although it gets old after awhile.

Is it worth it?

/after COD4, going back to WWII has to be kind of a letdown, although I'm sure I'll end up buying it

274 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:43:36pm

re: #264 poopeedoo

The father-daughter bond is one of the biggest esteem builders that you can give your daughter. Love her, praise her, esteem her and give her boundaries. It will last her a lifetime!

yeah I know, we've got that in spades but still...she is growing up too
fast.

275 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:43:49pm

re: #258 rain of lead

oh god I hope so,
in the meantime I am looking into some local martial arts studios that
she and I can join together for some good daddy-daughter bonding time

Me and mine, we do this. It's been several years now. We go over techniques at home. She on her way to a black belt. There is definitely bonding going on there. We have watched Jackie Chan's Drunken Master many, many times.

276 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:44:08pm

re: #271 poopeedoo

Holly Hobby?

277 Oh no...Sand People!  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:44:13pm

re: #256 lobo91

I've had it for a few days. Don't see anything wrong with it. Nothing groundbreaking, either.

The flamethrower is cool, although it gets old after awhile.

I don't have the highest of expectations knowing that it isn't 'infinity ward' doing it, so perhaps that will help me give it a pass..

Now Dead Space, I didn't know EA had it in them. That game is flipping cool. I am not even the 'horror genre' type.

278 Adina in Judea  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:44:36pm

re: #6 MandyManners

When does it come out in a lap-top?

This was my first thought when I saw the topic, too! :)

279 NoGardtheGreat  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:44:37pm

re: #253 Mich-again

My advice. Competition dance team. My 11 YO daughter has been into that for years now and they stay so busy year round with that there is no time for boys. And the confidence and self-esteem they build from all the classes and competitions seems to negate the interest in chasing stupid boys around.

Shotgun and a shovel have always worked here. Says the father of 6 daughters...

280 Outrider  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:44:47pm

re: #228 Shug

Batshit craziness in Texas.

There is someone actually named Terwilliger?

George Terwilliger, Mr Gonzales' lawyer,
281 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:45:04pm

re: #257 Walter L. Newton

Gracious God! That person (M? F? Cut-tuck-and-roll job?) has led a severely abusive life, by the looks of those arms and outfittings!

282 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:45:20pm

re: #205 Karridine

Isn't the debacle something like "Switzerland-sized deforestation, every year, as Brazil is man-raped!'?

I saw somewhere the amount of yearly deforestation around the globe was the equal to the size of the State of Massachusetts. But that little factoid is always in the fine print (if at all) in the stories about the atmosphere's buildup of CO2.

283 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:45:56pm

re: #280 Outrider

Isn't that Sideshow Bob's last name?

284 Shug  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:46:09pm

re: #274 rain of lead

yeah I know, we've got that in spades but still...she is growing up too
fast.

While shopping for some clothes for our 3 month son, I happened to notice the girl's clothing section for something called Libby Lou, which to me looked like " how can you dress your 6 year old like a prostitute"

I was glad I had a little boy.

285 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:46:10pm

re: #269 jcm

There you go with those silly little details again.

McChimpyBushCheneyHalliburtonRoveBlackwa ter must PAY!

Reading the story this afternoon and the first thing I noticed is these guys are local socialist AG's leaving office next month. These indictments are going nowhere mates...Except the round file...

286 Macker  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:46:12pm

re: #209 Walter L. Newton

Obama has more picking to do...

Arizona Gov. Janet Napolitano = Head of Homeland Security
Penny Pritzker = Commerce Sec.

[Link: www.cnn.com...]

Shit! Crappy Nappy as Secretary of Homeland Security is like giving the keys of the country to the damned ILLEGALS!
Even so, it's a blessing in disguise...the next in line for AZ (we don't have Lt. Governor) is Secretary of State Jan Brewer. She is a Republican.

287 lobo91  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:46:45pm

re: #273 Killian Bundy

Is it worth it?

/after COD4, going back to WWII has to be kind of a letdown, although I'm sure I'll end up buying it

I'm fine with the WWII genre, especially since they set half of it in the Pacific for once (the other half is Eastern Front, again...I'm getting tired of Stalingrad).

288 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:46:45pm

re: #257 Walter L. Newton

[Link: www.tinynibbles.com...]

What is that thing between her legs?

289 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:47:10pm

re: #232 NoGardtheGreat

1/100th of the way to real AI. Someone look up Asimov's 3 Laws of Robotics, we may need to dust them off soon.

1. Allow no harm to come to a human, either through action or through inaction.

2. Carry out orders given, except where doing so would violate Rule #1.

3. Allow no harm to come to self, except where doing so would violate Rule #1 or Rule #2.

Still know them after all these years.

290 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:47:16pm

Hey hi all y'all! A little late again tonight but have finally recieved everything I need for the Geek Squad to essentially give me a new computer (new motherboard, new HD, already put in new CD/W and use the Restore disk and transfer all data all this Friday morning! Yea!)!
What have I missed so far? I mean, other than IBM and Cray breaking petaflop speeds, performing 1.105 and 1.059 quadrillion floating-point calculations per second, the first two computers to do so. BTW, who in the hell came up with the term Petaflop? I mean, given what this promises to mean to science, shoudn't it be something, I don't know, sexier that Petaflop?!

291 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:47:30pm

re: #277 Oh no...Sand People!

What kind of platform are you using? I haven't owned anything since Playstation(I) and am in the market as soon as I get this freaking engagement ring paid for so that I don't look like the total ass that I am.

292 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:48:16pm

re: #267 Bumr50

I kind of hope computers don't start doing that.

"Professor? The PB7-Z over in the lab refuses to work... it says, "I've got RIGHTS, you know!"

293 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:48:38pm

re: #288 MandyManners

What is that thing between her legs?

That's a "her"?

294 LoFlyer  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:48:44pm

Catch you on the flip side mates!

295 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:48:59pm

re: #285 LoFlyer

Reading the story this afternoon and the first thing I noticed is these guys are local socialist AG's leaving office next month. These indictments are going nowhere mates...Except the round file...

Simple things entertain simple minds...

Not you LoFlyer!

296 lostlakehiker  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:49:08pm

re: #140 Karridine

"Deep PetaFloop Battles Gary Kasparov, Chess GrandMaster!"

PetaFloop: "You take the opening move."

Kasparov: "Pawn to Queen 3"

PetaFloop: "I have calculated all possible outcomes. You lose."

Hmm. 10^15 calculations per second. Maybe 10^20 per day. But how many moves ahead must the computer test? The game of chess branches maybe 4 serious moves at each ply. So, to see 20 moves ahead, you'd need 4^40 cases. Guess what? That's rather more than 10^20. Deep Peta cannot just examine every possibility in chess, out of the gate.

Maybe it can play perfect chess, using some good mathematics rather than brute force. Computer chess has for the last several years been accurate enough that no human can compete. But really, the scientific world has bigger fish to fry.

It does go to illustrate that even this awesome raw power must be used with wisdom, flair and insight if it's to get us anywhere.

297 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:49:14pm

re: #284 Shug

Hooker Trash, this year's IN look, Shug!

298 Macker  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:49:28pm

re: #289 victor_yugo

You forgot the Zeroth Law.

299 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:49:44pm

re: #289 victor_yugo

Wow! I read Asimov when I was 12-13. All the Robot books and most of the Foundation ones.

I vaguely remember a character known as The Mule? Maybe?

300 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:49:49pm

re: #293 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

That's a "her"?

I have no idea.

301 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:49:51pm

re: #279 NoGardtheGreat

Shotgun and a shovel have always worked here. Says the father of 6 daughters...

My dad has six daughters, (which means I have six sisters BTW.) The shotgun and shovel technique was not so effective. Ha. Not by a longshot.

302 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:49:59pm

re: #288 MandyManners

What is that thing between her legs?

I don't know. Doesn't look like anything I've seen lately. I don't even think it's real. It looks computer generated. I was just funning with Loflyer. I should have given a not work safe warning or something.

303 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:49:59pm

re: #279 NoGardtheGreat

Shotgun and a shovel have always worked here. Says the father of 6 daughters...

shotgun!...
need to go shopping this weekend.

304 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:50:55pm

re: #302 Walter L. Newton

I don't know. Doesn't look like anything I've seen lately. I don't even think it's real. It looks computer generated. I was just funning with Loflyer. I should have given a not work safe warning or something.

Gotta' be made by a computer. Too strange to be real.

305 legalpad  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:51:01pm

re: #241 rawmuse

I'll bet you probably don't think a cuttlefish is smarter than a human, so I gather you are doubting that they are going to make that sort of progress. The proposal is that, although we are not at the level of a cuttlefish, we will reach and surpass rapidly because of exponential growth of AI.

The best chapters here are Chapter One: The Laws of Time and Chaos and the Timeline chapter.

306 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:51:15pm

re: #296 lostlakehiker

Yes! And that wisdom, flair and insight is EXACTLY where the (albeit inferior, subservient) human comes in! :D

307 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:51:47pm

re: #290 realwest

BTW, who in the hell came up with the term Petaflop? I mean, given what this promises to mean to science, shoudn't it be something, I don't know, sexier that Petaflop?!

Penthouse Magazine came up with it.

308 mfarmer1  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:51:52pm

I'm sitting here right now configuring a new Supermicro with dual quad core Xeons, 1333 bus, 32 gigs of ram, a 3ware RAID card, oodles of disk space, and Redhat Enterprise.

I feel so inadequate. I'll keep checking the late night infomercials for some of those pills for my condition.

309 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:52:07pm

re: #300 MandyManners

Mandy, have you ever tried connecting to LGF on your PSP?

310 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:52:31pm

re: #300 MandyManners
Um, just speculating hear, but I think thats a "her" thats been, uh, thoroughly waxed - though I really didn't look that closely!

311 stevieray  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:53:16pm

re: #259 rawmuse

Cuttlefish are just yummy bits of protein swimming around. But they have about 20 million chromatophore cells that they command to change shape AND color as they need to blend in with their surroundings, and those cells change at the speed of light.

That is some processing power right there.

I wanna monitor made from cuttlefish hide!

312 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:53:19pm

hey Mandy
has your boy noticed girls yet
my 6yr old announced today she has a boyfriend :(

313 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:54:05pm

re: #311 stevieray

I'd settle for an appetizer.

314 rawmuse  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:54:11pm

re: #288 MandyManners

What is that thing between her legs?

A cuttlefish.

315 RememberSekhmet?  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:54:30pm

Good thing I start a new job in a week and a half. Otherwise, I'd get to hear all kinds of BS reasons I should replace someone's computer with one of these.

316 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:54:39pm

re: #302 Walter L. Newton

I can hear her it now:

"You want a piece of me? Step closer, LOSER! You're SUCH a sucky piece of CRAP! I'll paste you so hard you'll need a glass belly button to crawl home! I'll kick your ass so bad you won't know whether to crap or wind your wrist-watch!"
317 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:54:59pm

re: #290 realwest

Hey hi all y'all!

Hey dare! Howyadoin Bruh?

318 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:56:44pm

USA scores! Up against Guatemala 1-0 now. Ha.

319 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:57:21pm

re: #316 Karridine

I can hear her it now: "You want a piece of me? Step closer, LOSER! You're SUCH a sucky piece of CRAP! I'll paste you so hard you'll need a glass belly button to crawl home! I'll kick your ass so bad you won't know whether to crap or wind your wrist-watch!"

Ok guy, you're scaring me. Haven't you seen anything like that in some of those "clubs" around your town? If I wanted to be manhandled, she would be first in line.

320 Clemente  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:57:57pm

re: #257 Walter L. Newton

[Link: www.tinynibbles.com...]

/running desperately for the plank...

321 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:58:54pm

re: #317 Mich-again
Hey Mich! I'm doing ok - cold, but ok (temp will be below freezing here in the SOUTHLAND again - 4th night in a row - in about an hour or so. And it's not even Thanksgiving! Other than that, I was gonna go on a semi-rant about CRA and the mortgage loans granted in the last 5 years or so, but decided not to bore everyone.
How are you doing my friend?

322 stevieray  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:59:32pm

Looks like insty's having trouble moving to his new home... can't access his site.

323 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 8:59:52pm

re: #309 Walter L. Newton

Mandy, have you ever tried connecting to LGF on your PSP?

That's possible?

324 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:01:12pm

re: #320 Clemente

/running desperately for the plank...

Dear lord yes. That thing is hideous!

325 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:02:14pm

re: #310 realwest

Um, just speculating hear, but I think thats a "her" thats been, uh, thoroughly waxed - though I really didn't look that closely!

Ugh.

326 Steve in Philly  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:02:31pm

#90 lostlakehiker

You left out the most important step, the one that actually make it "science": you test the results against reality. I think that this is a bad aspect of computer modeling by scientists. They will start thinking that the computer model is the reality, and will rationalize the data to fit the model. I do computer work in the financial industry, and I know how easy it is to fit the data to the curve to get the results you want. I suspect that this is exactly what has been going on in the climate computer models, given the relative dearth of good data outside of the tiny window of the last few decades.

327 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:02:59pm

re: #288 MandyManners

What is that thing between her legs?

It's obviously her...uh...thing?

328 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:04:07pm

Too good to pass up...

Disclaimer - Some people will find the video at the foot of this story disconcerting, unpleasant even life-shatteringly vile. If you don't like the idea of paint, bottoms, painted and painting bottoms, far [sic] hairy men or the Zune, then don't click through.


The subject in question...

329 poopeedoo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:04:08pm

re: #276 Bumr50

Holly Hobby?

Something other than watching cuttlefish. ;)

330 newsjunkie_ky  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:04:13pm

re: #326 Steve in Philly
Also GIGO

331 RememberSekhmet?  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:04:17pm

re: #324 Dark_Falcon

Dear lord yes. That thing is hideous!

Reminds me of that guy from Dead or Alive back in the 1980s

332 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:04:33pm

re: #312 rain of lead

hey Mandy
has your boy noticed girls yet
my 6yr old announced today she has a boyfriend :(

He told my father the other day that he needed to talk with him about "women". He has had a crush on Samantha for a while and told my dad that he gets a funny feeling inside whenever he's around her. I think she likes him, too, 'cause he was the only boy in their class that she invited to her birthday party.

333 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:04:49pm

re: #314 rawmuse

A cuttlefish.

Huh?

334 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:04:50pm

re: #323 MandyManners

That's possible?

Yea, your PSP has WiFi built in and a browser. You can connect to the internet the same way as any laptop does at a WiFi hotspot.

I saw you mention playing a game on yours, and I was just wondering if you used it for internet surfing.

Gaming is the one thing I don't use mine for. I like playing movies on it and music and photos, but I'm not much of a game player.

But the ability to connect to the internet is my favorite function on it.

335 wolfie  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:05:09pm

I always thought PSP was angel dust.
But then, I always get LDS and LSD mixed up, too.

336 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:05:36pm

re: #332 MandyManners

He told my father the other day that he needed to talk with him about "women". He has had a crush on Samantha for a while and told my dad that he gets a funny feeling inside whenever he's around her. I think she likes him, too, 'cause he was the only boy in their class that she invited to her birthday party.

Oh dear God, I'm not ready for this. My little girl is only 10.

337 RememberSekhmet?  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:05:40pm

My nine-year-old is fortunately in the "girls are icky" phase. But the girls don't seem to think he's icky.

338 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:05:45pm

re: #327 Spare O'Lake

It's obviously her...uh...thing?

Why ain't she wearing any pants?

339 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:05:59pm

re: #312 rain of lead

hey Mandy
has your boy noticed girls yet
my 6yr old announced today she has a boyfriend :(

Just remind her that boys have cooties.

And they never go away.

340 newsjunkie_ky  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:06:38pm

re: #331 RememberSekhmet?

Reminds me of that guy from Dead or Alive back in the 1980s


This guy?

341 rawmuse  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:07:01pm

re: #328 jcm

I may never be the same after watching that one.

342 rawmuse  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:07:51pm

re: #333 MandyManners

Just seeing if you were paying attention ;)

343 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:07:56pm

re: #338 MandyManners

Why ain't she wearing any pants?

Because it's a GLTB-friendly site.

344 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:08:00pm

re: #334 Walter L. Newton

Yea, your PSP has WiFi built in and a browser. You can connect to the internet the same way as any laptop does at a WiFi hotspot.

I saw you mention playing a game on yours, and I was just wondering if you used it for internet surfing.

Gaming is the one thing I don't use mine for. I like playing movies on it and music and photos, but I'm not much of a game player.

But the ability to connect to the internet is my favorite function on it.

That sounds way above my pay-grade. Right now I'm just trying to figure out how to get Remy to jump from one ceiling fan to another--every time he falls down, it's to the floor where I have to start the climb up the vacuum cleaner's cord over to the pillar then to the potted plants then up the fountain's stepping stones then to the light fixture then back to the ceiling fan.

345 NY Nana  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:08:01pm

We were in Brooklyn to see our 2 year old grandson.

Score: Grandson 100, Grandparents 0!;)

ZZZzzz.

G'nite, all...Hello, I must be going!

346 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:08:25pm

re: #341 rawmuse

I may never be the same after watching that one.

A train wreak and you can't stop...

347 legalpad  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:08:58pm

re: #333 MandyManners

Huh?

LOL!

348 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:09:03pm

re: #321 realwest

How are you doing my friend?

Fine right now. Thanks for asking. But these are some really crazy times here in the USA. And after pulling the straight ticket Republican party lever every single time since my first opportunity at voting in 1982, I am really starting to question that loyalty. I have heard so many stupid things coming out of Republican mouths in Washington DC these last few days I can hardly believe it. It seems that much of the GOP is having a childish temper tantrum and is hell bent on collapsing the US economy just to prove a point.

349 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:09:08pm

re: #335 wolfie

I always thought PSP was angel dust.
But then, I always get LDS and LSD mixed up, too.

Play Station Portable. I think it is the best multi-media device on the market for the price. The widescreen quality is amazing for a little "toy" and full length movies look wonderful.

Plus, you can store you own movies, photos and music on a memory stick that you insert into the unit.

And it plays games.

350 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:09:27pm

re: #336 spirochete

you're not ready...you're not ready?
sh*t mines 6 I'm really really not ready
this whole boy girl thing... don't like it, nope don't like it at all

351 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:09:43pm

re: #336 spirochete

Oh dear God, I'm not ready for this. My little girl is only 10.

Someone above mentioned shovels and shotguns. One idea is to have them both in the foyer/den/wherever when a new guy meets you. Don't say a word. Just look at them and then at him. And, smile.

352 [deleted]  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:09:47pm
353 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:09:53pm

ELF on the run...

FBI Ups Reward for Alleged Eco-Terrorists
FBI Offering $50,000 Reward for Four Suspects Believed to be Outside the U.S.

354 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:10:04pm

re: #343 victor_yugo

Because it's a GLTB-friendly site.

Freaks.

355 Clemente  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:10:12pm

re: #338 MandyManners

Why ain't she wearing any pants?

So the petafish can cuttleflop. Pretty sure.

356 Pvt Bin Jammin  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:10:21pm

re: #345 NY Nana

Hi there, Nana.

Looks like the grandson wore you out. LOL Sweet dreams.

357 RememberSekhmet?  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:10:27pm

re: #340 newsjunkie_ky

This guy?

That's shim

358 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:10:27pm

Hey all y'all - I was asking a serious question in my #290 - who in the hell came up with the term Petaflop?
I mean, it almost sounds undignified!

359 [deleted]  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:10:39pm
360 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:10:50pm

Freddie Adu scores! 2-0 now.

361 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:11:00pm

re: #349 Walter L. Newton

And it plays games.

You mean I could have gotten that from a machine instead of so many women?

362 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:11:23pm

re: #355 Clemente

So the petafish can cuttleflop. Pretty sure.

I don't know what you said but, it sounds dirty.

363 NoGardtheGreat  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:11:28pm

re: #301 Mich-again

My dad has six daughters, (which means I have six sisters BTW.) The shotgun and shovel technique was not so effective. Ha. Not by a longshot.

The trick is convincing the male that you are nuts enough to use it and not care what happens to you ;-)

364 ggt  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:11:40pm

Hello Night Lizards! It was cold and sunny in the Very Far Western Suburbs of Chicagoland today.

Once upon a time, I was a student at Purdue. The university had a supercomputer and it was BIG DEAL. I never saw it.

How are you-all and what are we talking about?

365 MandyManners  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:11:48pm

re: #359 ploome hineni

(what is GLTB?)

Gay Lesbian Transgendered Bisexual.

366 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:11:53pm

re: #359 ploome hineni

(what is GLTB?)

Gay, Les, Trans, Bi

367 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:11:59pm

re: #352 ploome hineni

how do you find a site like that

/or shouldn;t I ask?

I just typed "porn pirate" into Google images.

368 wolfie  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:12:07pm

re: #349 Walter L. Newton

All that and the internet too? WOW.

369 [deleted]  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:12:16pm
370 ggt  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:12:27pm

re: #358 realwest

I thought had something to do with the failure of PETA. Like, perhaps, the intelligensia figured out they were being used as idiots?

371 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:12:27pm

re: #348 Mich-again

Fine right now. Thanks for asking. But these are some really crazy times here in the USA. And after pulling the straight ticket Republican party lever every single time since my first opportunity at voting in 1982, I am really starting to question that loyalty. I have heard so many stupid things coming out of Republican mouths in Washington DC these last few days I can hardly believe it. It seems that much of the GOP is having a childish temper tantrum and is hell bent on collapsing the US economy just to prove a point.

How so? For refusing to bailout the UAW?

372 legalpad  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:12:53pm

re: #345 NY Nana

Many Groucho fans here!

373 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:13:00pm

re: #364 ggt

Once upon a time, I was a student at Purdue. The university had a supercomputer and it was BIG DEAL. I never saw it.

Don't feel bad; I didn't, either. Most I saw was a lab of TRS-80 Model I's and the RSTS-A/B mainframe.

374 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:13:15pm

re: #365 MandyManners

Gay Lesbian Transgendered Bisexual.

Freaks.
/

375 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:13:15pm

re: #363 NoGardtheGreat

The trick is convincing the male that you are nuts enough to use it and not care what happens to you ;-)

Thats like playing "whack a mole" at the carnival. Good luck with that.

376 [deleted]  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:13:59pm
377 wolfie  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:13:59pm

re: #360 Mich-again

Arrogant, imperialistic, hegemonist, racist bullies!

378 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:14:47pm

A gym teacher taught me something called the Fosbury Flop.

379 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:15:04pm

Here is something that I recommend just about anyone interested in technology listen to.

It is an interview with Andrew Feenberg who is an acquaintance from some years back. He is basically a Marcusian leftist, but is a thoughtful and reasoning person. He and I did not share assumptions or conclusions. Just the same, he is a thoughtful guy who I have always enjoyed talking to.

Anyways, listen to the interview to get an idea of how the left wants to use "Democratic Choices" to mediate many things, including the development of technology. Feenberg often cites the environment as justifying (and serving as an example) of how technology (and the capitalism that develops it) should be regulated. If you listen to the arguments carefully, you see how much of this is directed at disarming capitalism.

380 RememberSekhmet?  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:15:14pm

On closer inspection of the pirate in question, it seems the angle she is squatting at opens her labia majora enough that we can see the labia minora a bit. But those are definitely girl parts.

But the last time I saw a face like that, it was in a seafood restaurant.

381 Wyatt Earp  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:15:51pm

re: #378 Bumr50

A gym teacher taught me something called the Fosbury Flop.

A gym teacher taught me about young love. I just wish he let me know about it before the trial!

382 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:15:54pm

re: #358 realwest

Hey all y'all - I was asking a serious question in my #290 - who in the hell came up with the term Petaflop?
I mean, it almost sounds undignified!

Peta, it comes from the Greek πέντε, meaning five, because it is equal to 10005. Scientific notation for 1 000 000 000 000 000.

Flop, floating point operations per second. Computer term, for how fast a machine is.

383 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:16:39pm

re: #380 RememberSekhmet?

Shoulda gone to FREEE CREDIT REPORT...!

384 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:16:54pm

re: #348 Mich-again
Um "It seems that much of the GOP is having a childish temper tantrum and is hell bent on collapsing the US economy just to prove a point."
What are you talking about? Bush first proposed a no pork laden bailout package of $700 Billion to try to keep the economy from going into a depression, and the Dems, since it was Bush's idea, said NO.
Now I've read that Citigroup Inc faced a crisis of confidence on Wednesday as investors questioned the survival prospects of the U.S. banking giant, and its shares tumbled 23 percent to a 13-year low. That is to say the Second Largest Bank by Assets yesterday is now fourth and falling fast.
Link:[Link: www.reuters.com...]
And now he doesn't want to "bail out" the Big 3 which I think is the right thing to do (not bail 'em out) - what are you talking about the GOP wishing to collapse the economy?!

385 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:17:34pm

a friend of mine when his girl started dating, took a shotgun shell
and wrote the boys name on it then looked him in the eye, placed the shell
on the mantle and said in a graveyard voice"don't make me take that down. he never had a problem.

386 BlueCanuck  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:17:58pm

re: #358 realwest

Peta is the number, and FLOP is Floating Operations I think. Essentially how many calculations a second the computer can do. Numbering system is Kilo, Mega, Giga, Tera, and Peta.

/1s followed by a whole lot of zeros.
//evening all night shift checking in.

387 Boogberg  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:18:03pm

re: #349 Walter L. Newton

Nintendo DS ain't too shabby either, so I hear. :D

388 Last Mohican  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:18:03pm

re: #335 wolfie

But then, I always get LDS and LSD mixed up, too.

Oh, man, I did that once. That was absolutely the worst Grateful Dead show ever. Seriously.


/Okay, actually not seriously

389 NoGardtheGreat  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:18:11pm

re: #364 ggt

How are you-all and what are we talking about?

Fine, and take your pick.

1. Law of Robotics.
2. Scaring off boys from your daughters.
3. Gays, Lesbians, and Transgenders.

390 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:18:12pm

re: #384 realwest

I concur.

The point is the thing.

391 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:18:37pm

re: #365 MandyManners

Gay Lesbian Transgendered Bisexual.

For my money it's "None of the Above".

392 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:18:48pm

re: #331 RememberSekhmet?

Reminds me of that guy from Dead or Alive back in the 1980s

Maybe she's his evil offspring.

393 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:19:06pm

re: #388 Last Mohican


That wasn't The Dead--it was The Osmonds

394 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:19:08pm

re: #388 Last Mohican

No smoking in the Tabernacle, especially while the choir is singing.

395 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:19:27pm

re: #383 Bumr50

Shoulda gone to FREEE CREDIT REPORT...!

Smack!

396 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:19:46pm

re: #365 MandyManners

Gay Lesbian Transgendered Bisexual.

Or, they just can't make up their mind

397 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:19:47pm

re: #350 rain of lead

It was all fun and games when people crossed the road to look at them, but when people carried them away 'to show my friends' it suddenly became LESS groovy to have these highly-desirable 'half-Thai' boys!

Now that they're in high school, we're standing guard 24/7 with cattle-prods, to keep the girls away! The boys are down-to-earth, but their peers go ga-ga over them!

Bad News Dept

398 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:19:56pm

re: #395 Dark_Falcon

Ow.

399 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:19:58pm

re: #386 BlueCanuck
Well ok, thanks for explaing FLOP but who came up with the numbering system of Kilo, Mega, Giga, Tera, and Peta?

400 Russkilitlover  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:19:59pm

OT~~~

Today, hubby made a huge decision and cashed out my 401K. It took 25 working years to build and I've lost 50% in three months (and I'm in conservative holdings - only 25% stock). Calculating the penalty and tax hit, I will net about $120,000, which I will be putting into CDs. This was a big decision and means that I have lost faith in corporate America and the government. They won't have my piddly dollars to kick around anymore. I'm relying on myself for the foreseeable future.

401 Pvt Bin Jammin  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:20:12pm

re: #393 calcajun

That wasn't The Dead--it was The Osmonds

LOL

402 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:20:24pm

re: #387 Boogberg

Nintendo DS ain't too shabby either, so I hear. :D

I had one but didn't like it. It's really only a game machine.

403 Wyatt Earp  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:20:36pm

re: #393 calcajun

That wasn't The Dead--it was The Osmonds

Then it was the Evil Dead?

404 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:20:45pm

re: #389 NoGardtheGreat

Fine, and take your pick.

1. Law of Robotics.
2. Scaring off boys from your daughters.
3. Gays, Lesbians, and Transgenders.

Sounds like the topics of discussion on the next Charlie Rose Show

405 rawmuse  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:21:02pm

re: #400 Russkilitlover

Can I ask you age?

406 rawmuse  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:21:49pm

Your age...PIMF

407 Kailen  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:21:50pm

"New"? IBM's [url=[Link: en.wikipedia.org...] broke the PetaFLOP barrier back in may. Distributed computing, Folding@Home, is over 4 PetaFLOPs.

408 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:21:56pm

re: #397 Karridine

Like, wow.

409 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:21:57pm

re: #397 Karridine

It was all fun and games when people crossed the road to look at them, but when people carried them away 'to show my friends' it suddenly became LESS groovy to have these highly-desirable 'half-Thai' boys!

Now that they're in high school, we're standing guard 24/7 with cattle-prods, to keep the girls away! The boys are down-to-earth, but their peers go ga-ga over them!

Bad News Dept

What would they do with the pirate in #257?

410 BignJames  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:22:12pm

re: #399 realwest

Greeks

411 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:22:15pm

re: #390 Bumr50
Lord, I must be more tired than I thought. I'm glad you concur but don't know what you meant by "The point is the thing."?

412 legalpad  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:22:19pm

OK - everybody read everything in my links at #241 and #305 and get back with me in about a week/

413 Russkilitlover  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:22:26pm

re: #405 rawmuse

Can I ask you age?

40-ish...

414 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:22:27pm

re: #385 rain of lead

a friend of mine when his girl started dating, took a shotgun shell
and wrote the boys name on it then looked him in the eye, placed the shell
on the mantle and said in a graveyard voice"don't make me take that down. he never had a problem.

That i like.

415 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:22:33pm

re: #389 NoGardtheGreat

Fine, and take your pick.

1. Law of Robotics.
2. Scaring off boys from your daughters.
3. Gays, Lesbians, and Transgenders.

The robot scared off my daughter's beau and she became lesbian.

416 Kailen  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:22:42pm

...Used to other forums.

"IBM's Roadrunner broke the PetaFLOP barrier back in May."

417 funky chicken  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:23:05pm

re: #209 Walter L. Newton

Obama has more picking to do...

Arizona Gov. Janet Napolitano = Head of Homeland Security
Penny Pritzker = Commerce Sec.

[Link: www.cnn.com...]

you cannot be serious

Pritzker killed a big bank with crappy loaning habits way before it was cool. she'd dirty Chicago all the way...

418 Ozark Mountain Daredevil  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:23:12pm

re: #384 realwest

Exactly, rw, it's a bailout for the UAW union, not GM, Ford, or Chrysler, because by filing for bankruptcy protection they can void the contracts (average worker for all 3 earns $73 per hour, inc. benefits) with the UAW (United Airlines did the exact same thing when they filed a few years ago) and re-negotiate. If the UAW won't, screw'em. Hire replacements.

419 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:23:18pm

re: #403 Wyatt Earp

Then it was the Evil Dead?

Yeah. The folks at Disney looked at their animatronics the at the Osmonds and cursed the Mormons for making better singing robots

420 rawmuse  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:23:18pm

re: #413 Russkilitlover

Well, I am older than you. I am hanging in.
I think this too shall pass.
Hopefully, not before I do.

421 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:23:31pm

re: #398 Bumr50

Ow.

Though I'd reserve a bigger smack for the person who took that picture. Dear God, was that a repulsive photo!

422 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:23:51pm

re: #418 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

Exactly, rw, it's a bailout for the UAW union, not GM, Ford, or Chrysler, because by filing for bankruptcy protection they can void the contracts (average worker for all 3 earns $73 per hour, inc. benefits) with the UAW (United Airlines did the exact same thing when they filed a few years ago) and re-negotiate. If the UAW won't, screw'em. Hire replacements.

I agree with this completely.

423 Wyatt Earp  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:24:08pm

re: #419 calcajun

Yeah. The folks at Disney looked at their animatronics the at the Osmonds and cursed the Mormons for making better singing robots

Listening to either is bound to make your ears bleed, though. :)

424 NoGardtheGreat  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:24:18pm

re: #375 Mich-again

Thats like playing "whack a mole" at the carnival. Good luck with that.

LOL, common man, I was joking.

To be serious, I have raised them all (still raising two) to choose wisely, and without haste. I've informed them us males only want "one thing" till we're about 35.

And the one that actually got used. Years ago this boy was trying to date one of my daughters. She asked me how to tell if he was right for her to date. I told her how and she went to his place with one of my Month Python DVDs, and they watched it. She promptly dumped him, cause he didn't laugh at the parts she found funny. Hence he wasn't intelligent enough to date her. This is the daughter that's away at college now on a full ride academic scholarship :-)

425 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:24:27pm

re: #400 Russkilitlover
Um, I'm a looong way from a financial genius, but if ya don't mind me asking, why did you cash out and who's CD's did you buy (I mean from which Banks)?
Why not Treasuries or at least FannieMae BONDS?!

426 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:24:47pm

re: #417 funky chicken

Uh, we're just changing BACK to things y'all all believed in eight years ago.

427 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:25:33pm

re: #425 realwest

Um, I'm a looong way from a financial genius, but if ya don't mind me asking, why did you cash out and who's CD's did you buy (I mean from which Banks)?
Why not Treasuries or at least FannieMae BONDS?!

CD's? Bonds?

What pr0n sites have YOU been going to?

428 Russkilitlover  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:25:47pm

re: #420 rawmuse

Well, I am older than you. I am hanging in.
I think this too shall pass.
Hopefully, not before I do.

I have a lot of equity in a new zero energy home in San Diego county. Even with the housing price losses, I still have a lot of equity. I'm counting on 4-5 years to hang onto this place and if I have to sell for only 10% above purchase price, I will have a good retirement in a non-income tax state. That's my plan. It may not be the best plan, but it's the one where I have most control.

429 Last Mohican  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:26:46pm

re: #393 calcajun

That wasn't The Dead--it was The Osmonds

Well that certainly explains why Jerry's beard was shaved off. And why the words to "I Need A Miracle" were so different.

430 DesertSage  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:26:49pm

When the sheriff say "move your trailer", you'd better move it!

[Link: www.kentucky.com...]

431 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:27:00pm

re: #414 spirochete

That i like.

btw his daughter just came home today from a year in Italy, she is an MP
in the Air Force :) you should see the kind of guns they let her play with.
she is qualified on LAWS rockets. talk about a proud pappa :)

432 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:27:09pm

re: #417 funky chicken
"she'd dirty Chicago all the way..." So, what was your question again?!?

433 Russkilitlover  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:27:38pm

re: #425 realwest

Um, I'm a looong way from a financial genius, but if ya don't mind me asking, why did you cash out and who's CD's did you buy (I mean from which Banks)?
Why not Treasuries or at least FannieMae BONDS?!

LOL! Neither am I or I wouldn't be concerned! The local Wells Fargo is offering 3.8% on +75,000 12 month CD. Considering I've lost more than a bundle in only 3 months, I'm parking most of it here.

434 funky chicken  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:27:43pm

re: #384 realwest

Hank Paulson ain't the GOP, that's for damn sure.

On a positive note, if Citimortgage goes tits up, maybe I'll get a month or two of mortgage holiday while they sort it all out?

Paulson should be in jail, IMHO. Over $130 billion to his cronies at AIG, and over $350 billion to anonymous recipients...I guess he just doesn't have any close friends in the executive suites over at Citi.

I thought Citi had lots of Saudi money invested in it. I'd be surprised if the Sauds let their investment go completely to hell if they can help it. I hope they use some of their trillions of petrodollars to shore up Citibank. They most certainly owe us.

435 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:27:48pm

Uh, OT, I bought a Mosin-Nagant M44 (carbine), thinking the shorter barrel will be better for my sons. The carbine is 8" shorter than the standard service rifle- 40" as opposed to 48". Any of y'all have an opinion as to whether the decreased weight will only increase the recoil?

436 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:28:15pm

re: #424 NoGardtheGreat

LOL, common man, I was joking.

To be serious, I have raised them all (still raising two) to choose wisely, and without haste. I've informed them us males only want "one thing" till we're about 35.

And the one that actually got used. Years ago this boy was trying to date one of my daughters. She asked me how to tell if he was right for her to date. I told her how and she went to his place with one of my Month Python DVDs, and they watched it. She promptly dumped him, cause he didn't laugh at the parts she found funny. Hence he wasn't intelligent enough to date her. This is the daughter that's away at college now on a full ride academic scholarship :-)

"A møøse once bit my sister..."

437 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:28:20pm

re: #411 realwest

I meant that the point the Republicans are trying to prove (which it is contended they are going to destroy themselves over) is exactly the point that I am looking for them to prove, if indeed the point is that giving these automakers money that is so obviously gonna do absolutely nothing but slow the hemhorraging(sp?), to use the parlance of our crisis, that will inevitably return without MAJOR reform is completely asinine.
It would be so CONSERVATIVE if they proved that point.

Breath.

Sorry I confused you. I'm tired as well.

438 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:28:56pm

re: #428 Russkilitlover

Russ, where you at? You must be out in east county or up near Fallbrook?

439 SummerSong  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:28:58pm

re: #312 rain of lead

hey Mandy
has your boy noticed girls yet
my 6yr old announced today she has a boyfriend :(

Heh. Had my first boyfriend at 4. His name was Stevie.

440 Bumr50  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:29:14pm

re: #418 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

I see!

441 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:29:31pm

re: #431 rain of lead

btw his daughter just came home today from a year in Italy, she is an MP
in the Air Force :) you should see the kind of guns they let her play with.
she is qualified on LAWS rockets. talk about a proud pappa :)

Mine told me she wanted to run the FBI when she grew up. I have NO idea where that came from!

442 [deleted]  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:29:39pm
443 Karridine  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:29:45pm

re: #409 victor_yugoProbably back slowly away, keeping a neutral face toward her it, and ready to run at the first sign of depravity!

They are GOOD boys, watching their friends get hooked on power (gangs), forbidden fruits (smoking cigs), drugs (meth) and 'Dirty Me' (porn)... they avoid all of it, so far, because we have a supportive, clean home life, laugh often, praise when praise is due, and trust God...

Sexuality is not a hidden, deep-dark secret here, so we've talked and laughed at some length about different aspects, Vic...

444 Russkilitlover  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:29:50pm

re: #438 calcajun

Russ, where you at? You must be out in east county or up near Fallbrook?

Avocado Capitol of the World!

445 victor_yugo  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:30:22pm

re: #439 SummerSong

Heh. Had my first boyfriend at 4. His name was Stevie.

Kissed my first girl in the second grade.

And got smacked upside the head with a math book for it.

Ah, youth.

446 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:30:31pm

Michael Moore on Larry King tonight, said that what we are now seeing is the end of capitalism as we know it, and good riddance.
Then Charlie Rangel comes on to reassure us that the big 3 will be bailed out and that capitalism will survive.
Now if you'll excuse me I need to hose down the TV screen.

447 funky chicken  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:30:47pm

Of course, Citi also owns Primerica life insurance company, I believe.

Prop 'em up, Saudis. So something good for those of us over here who made you all billion/trillionaires.

/and then send me a magic unicorn with wings.

448 RememberSekhmet?  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:31:00pm

Now if you want to talk about pirates, here we go! NSFW

449 Pvt Bin Jammin  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:31:08pm

re: #430 DesertSage

OMG

450 DesertSage  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:31:09pm

I used to live in Fallbrook.

I even had a few avocado trees in my yard.

451 Wyatt Earp  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:31:12pm

re: #446 Spare O'Lake

Michael Moore on Larry King tonight, said that what we are now seeing is the end of capitalism as we know it, and good riddance.
Then Charlie Rangel comes on to reassure us that the big 3 will be bailed out and that capitalism will survive.
Now if you'll excuse me I need to hose down the TV screen.

I hope Larry deloused the seats afterward.

452 Abu Al-Poopypants  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:31:24pm

I thought a PETAflop computer was one that says MEAT IS MURDER as it goes into the BSOD.

453 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:31:48pm

re: #444 Russkilitlover

I'm down near the stadium. Thought about buying out there some years ago, but just could not handle the 15 every morning.

454 spirochete  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:31:58pm

re: #448 RememberSekhmet?

Now if you want to talk about pirates, here we go! NSFW

WTF?

455 Russkilitlover  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:32:07pm

re: #450 DesertSage

I used to live in Fallbrook.

I even had a few avocado trees in my yard.

It shore is a purty place. I really do love it.

456 jcm  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:32:55pm

re: #435 calcajun

Uh, OT, I bought a Mosin-Nagant M44 (carbine), thinking the shorter barrel will be better for my sons. The carbine is 8" shorter than the standard service rifle- 40" as opposed to 48". Any of y'all have an opinion as to whether the decreased weight will only increase the recoil?

Recoil will be more, more energy into recoil less into the round, while there will be a decrease in muzzle velocity. Shorter barrels have less time for the expanding gasses to accelerate the round. Correspondingly a decrease in range and accuracy at range. If it's not significant and doesn't bother anyone, don't worry. if it does look around for a compensator, it deflects muzzle gasses upward counteracting the muzzle rise from recoil.

457 NoGardtheGreat  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:33:06pm

re: #436 victor_yugo

"A møøse once bit my sister..."

That's the one ;-)

"Help, Help! I'm being repressed!"

458 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:33:11pm

re: #444 Russkilitlover

Of course, 20 years ago, that area was known for another cash crop--though slightly less legal--unless you had glaucoma.

459 Russkilitlover  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:33:14pm

re: #453 calcajun

I'm down near the stadium. Thought about buying out there some years ago, but just could not handle the 15 every morning.

Living in Fallbrook means accepting a long commute - thank goodness for talk radio! However, since I'm unemployed at this particular moment in time, the issue is moot.

460 rain of lead  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:33:21pm

well there is a new thread up, and I am late for bed,
thank's for the chat about raising young'uns it helped.
nite all :)

461 DesertSage  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:34:00pm

re: #455 Russkilitlover

It shore is a purty place. I really do love it.

I lived there for two years. One of the nicest places on earth.

462 gmsc  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:34:20pm

All this talk of great speeds reminds me when 1 billion floating point operations per second was considered to be a supercomputer.

Apple released a desktop computer that reached that speed, and came out with one of my favorite all-time Apple Ads.

463 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:35:15pm

re: #418 Ozark Mountain Daredevil Well yes and no. Yes to the UAW, but I read about a week ago that the Big 3 owe the Union PENSION FUNDS something close to $22 Billion buckos - so this $25 Billion would get the Union Pension fund idjits off the hook, but doom the Big 3 anyway. And btw, the $25 Billion "bailout" is in additon to the $25 Billion Washington already promised them to re-tool to make more energy efficient automobiles so it's really the taxpayer giving $50 Billion to a) save the UAW Pension Fund Directors asses from making less than poor loans and b) won't be enough to keep the Big 3 going long enough to make the more energy efficient vehicles.
AND, it's not just the UAW; I read in, iirc, IBD or Financial Times, that the Big 3's contracts with their dealerships are more toxic to the Big 3, by far than are the contracts the "Little 3" have with their dealers.
The whole thing stinks to high heaven, but it wasn't the Repubs who wanted it!

464 DesertSage  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:35:38pm

re: #458 calcajun

Of course, 20 years ago, that area was known for another cash crop--though slightly less legal--unless you had glaucoma.

465 ggt  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:36:13pm

re: #389 NoGardtheGreat

ummm, I choose "D", none of the above.

;)

466 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:37:27pm

re: #456 jcm

Recoil will be more, more energy into recoil less into the round, while there will be a decrease in muzzle velocity. Shorter barrels have less time for the expanding gasses to accelerate the round. Correspondingly a decrease in range and accuracy at range. If it's not significant and doesn't bother anyone, don't worry. if it does look around for a compensator, it deflects muzzle gasses upward counteracting the muzzle rise from recoil.

Thanks. It came with a muzzle break. I bought it today, so I pick it up after 12/1. Looks very clean--could take it straight to the range. I'll see how bad the recoil is then.

467 Russkilitlover  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:38:24pm

re: #461 DesertSage

I lived there for two years. One of the nicest places on earth.

I am an OC refugee who needed some elbow room and starry nights. But I do miss the conveniences of my old suburbia. Nothing is convenient here - the stores downtown open only if they have the inclination! And only one Starbucks, which is inside an Albertsons, which is not really a Starbucks at all. But...the skies are wonderful and the moonlight lights up my yard so much so that it casts long shadows! Oh, and the avocados are fabulous. Once you've had Reeds, you'll never go back to Haas.

468 ggt  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:38:24pm

re: #417 funky chicken

Pritzer, very dirty Chicago stuff there.

469 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:38:31pm

re: #459 Russkilitlover

Living in Fallbrook means accepting a long commute - thank goodness for talk radio! However, since I'm unemployed at this particular moment in time, the issue is moot.

With teens and tweens, being centrally located is pretty nice right now. Maybe when we're empty nesters we'll move out there.

470 Russkilitlover  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:40:02pm

re: #469 calcajun

With teens and tweens, being centrally located is pretty nice right now. Maybe when we're empty nesters we'll move out there.

I may have a zero energy home on 1/2 acre to sell to you when you're ready!

471 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:40:28pm

re: #433 Russkilitlover
Whew, ok, as long as it wasn't Citibank (although they should be insured by the FDIC, the two geniuses, Paulson and Bernake have apparently decided to NOT make more money available to the FDIC to increase the amount of insurance!
GAK!
Oh and btw, last quote I had on FannieMae Bonds at $100 thousand was 5.29%!
Well good luck to you - and Lord knows I wish good luck to all of us with Paulson/Bernake running things.

472 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:42:20pm

re: #457 NoGardtheGreat

That's the one ;-)

"Help, Help! I'm being repressed!"

Listen -- strange women lying in ponds distributing swords
is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power
derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical
aquatic ceremony.

473 calcajun  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:43:22pm

re: #470 Russkilitlover

I may have a zero energy home on 1/2 acre to sell to you when you're ready!

Thanks--now I am off to make like Charles and do a little (stationary) bike riding.

474 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:43:23pm

re: #463 realwest


And btw, the $25 Billion "bailout" is in additon to the $25 Billion Washington already promised them to re-tool to make more energy efficient automobiles

Thats not true. Not sure where you heard that lie. There is no 25 Bil already approved.

475 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:44:02pm

re: #434 funky chicken
Well it's not Citimortgage, it's really Citibank - the whole bank and if it goes tits up so does the basic US economy - it'll make the Big 3 look like a bump in the road.
(BTW, Citibank ain't gonna go tits up) and it was, iirc the UAE who bought something like 5% of Citigroup
stock and people were bitching and moaning about those muslim bastids buying up the US. And now with Oil trading SO LOW, I'm not sure the Magic Kingdom or any other oil producer is gonna help us out; Russia's economy is in worse shape than ours!

476 Mel Lono  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:47:47pm

I'm actually really, very impressed at we've accomplished since 1975 when i spent hours punching 300 cards to run through an IBM 1620 and hoped that >299 came out the other end.

477 Boogberg  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:47:48pm

re: #402 Walter L. Newton

I had one but didn't like it. It's really only a game machine.

If you're still up, which do you recommend for someone who only has the use of one hand? My sister (accident victim) has been buggin' me to get her a laptop for games but I think that's a bit much. Especially considering the versatility of hand held goodies these days.

478 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:47:56pm

re: #418 Ozark Mountain Daredevil

(

average worker for all 3 earns $73 per hour, inc. benefits)

Thats a Bullshit statistic. Its closer to $80K per year which corresponds to about $45 an hour with wages and benefits. I am not sure where the $73 per hour figure came from but I assure you, they do not make $150K per year with wages and benefits. That is just plain crazy talk.

479 Pvt Bin Jammin  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:48:55pm

re: #448 RememberSekhmet?

Since Mandy's not here,
WHACK!

480 Mel Lono  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:49:39pm

re: #467 Russkilitlover

I'm guessing Escondido or Julian.

481 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:49:57pm

re: #474 Mich-again
Which $25 Billion? Congress approved that new energy effienct retooling thing back when gas was like $4+ per gallon.

482 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:52:08pm

re: #475 realwest

Bank problems are more of a symptom, not a cause of economic troubles.

483 funky chicken  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:56:23pm

re: #478 Mich-again

I'd guess they threw in the pension obligation too. It is part of the salary and benefits package, and the pensions are the thing that is really breaking the Big 3 right now.

I think the CEOs are playing chicken with the (democrat) congress right now. Give us the bailout to cover the insane pension liabilities that your buddies in the UAW saddled us with (with your help) or we will file Chapter 11 and screw the UAW.

I think Congress will blink. But having all the big 3 file Chapter 11 wouln't be the end of the world. All the major airlines did it in the last 5-6 years, and the industry is stronger for it.

484 Mich-again  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:59:12pm

re: #483 funky chicken

But having all the big 3 file Chapter 11 wouln't be the end of the world. All the major airlines did it in the last 5-6 years, and the industry is stronger for it.

I tend to agree with that. Well said.

485 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 9:59:43pm

re: #478 Mich-again
Gee Mich, I really hate disagreeing with you so much, but yeah, I read it was actually $78 an hour with benefits - some $30+ an hour more than for the little 3.
But maybe, since you know more about the industry, y'all could find us some reliable statistics - for instance, WTF benefits are folks talking about? Group Health Insurance - without employee contribution could run $10,000 or more a year; pension plans - yes ideedy, the UAW does indeed have ONE of the BEST pension plan - outside of Congress - anywhere - but I still don't know what the hell goes into the "benefit's" part of that $78 per hour figure.
It would be nice to hear from you - a reliable source - instead of the idiots in Congress, GM, Ford, Chrysler and the UAW - seriously - they all have axes to grind like crazy, you don't so any info you could provide I'd trust.
BTW, is it true that the head of GM gets like $22.3 million bucks a year income?! Geez - I tell ya executive salaries and bonuses - and not just at the Big 3 are absurd. They create this short sided business atomosphere we have (where "long term planning" tend to mean next quarter).

486 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 10:02:26pm

re: #482 Mich-again
Well yes and no. Since the Dems passed the CRA forcing banks to make mortgage loans to folks with shitty credit, the banks, with a lot of help from Wall Street Investment houses created this bullshit subprime mortgage market.
The Banks aren't blameless in all this, though they were pushed to where they wound up by the CRA.

487 So?  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 10:03:34pm

How long before the Chinese steal the technology and churn out nickel and dime copies?

488 realwest  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 10:06:03pm

re: #487 So?
What, didn't you get yours yet?!?

489 funky chicken  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 10:11:23pm

The Big 3 bailout kerfuffle is, in a gallows humor sort of way, entertaining, IMHO. Just today it's like the light came on, and "leaders" like Barney Frank and Charley Rangel hit the MSM talk show circuit screaming about union busting. And instapundit linked his favorite liberal who was doing the same thing. LOL where ya been, fellas?

I'm sure Chris Dodd got a few lovely phone calls after his BS performance yesterday. CNN had him front and center, and glowingly reported how he had beat up on the big, bad CEOs. Sure guys, demonize them. The American public won't care if they have to declare bankruptcy then ... years and years of MSM adoration of Japanese and German cars finally coming home to bite their friends in the UAW in the ass?

490 Rancher  Wed, Nov 19, 2008 10:29:44pm

So, this computer is where? Japan? Germany? No, wait, its in New Mexico. Cool, now lets see if the Dems close down Los Alamos.

491 Twenglish  Thu, Nov 20, 2008 12:37:43am

I wonder , all those zillions of bits going through a logic gate all at once , "How do they cool it ?" Vacuum ? , Cryogenics ?

492 Twenglish  Thu, Nov 20, 2008 12:52:29am

Oh Geez ,

Now I see it , We're back to filling up Football field sized rooms with electronic gear ...

The View of it kinda reminds me of the old Keypunch operator days ?

lol

493 CofactorMatrix  Thu, Nov 20, 2008 4:49:25am

So, more accurate models for the global-warming (recently re-branded as "climate change") crowd. Does that mean a finer mesh with the same old physics-defying models, or does that mean that they will start to take into account more subtle meteorological influences such as, oh, clouds?

494 tai-pan  Thu, Nov 20, 2008 6:42:27am

re: #22 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

42

495 lawrior  Thu, Nov 20, 2008 6:42:28am

Sure, lots of calculations are all well and good, but will it blend?

496 crankie  Thu, Nov 20, 2008 7:10:56am

Though I'm all for faster and better computing, the sad truth is that it will not improve actual climate modeling, just crunch the equations faster. If the governing equations are not well understood and the raw data used to initialize the model are not completely accurate or on a fine enough scale (all these things are true of climate models), the output of the model will not be any more accurate no matter how much of a whizbang computer you have.

497 MJBrutus  Thu, Nov 20, 2008 7:23:38am

re: #8 Walter L. Newton

Oh good. They'll be able to model phony global warming a thousand times faster. It'll be like Al Gore on a hamster wheel.

Exactly, higher resolution but no greater accuracy. It's like measuring with a micrometer and cutting with an axe.

498 collegeguy85  Thu, Nov 20, 2008 12:33:53pm

So we'll base our science off simulations. Yes, science has changed for the first time in a long time. Instead of the good old scientific method which is always self checking, we'll toss data into a pre-programmed machine and find the result to be science.

499 Achilles Tang  Thu, Nov 20, 2008 2:04:27pm

re: #496 crankie

As they say; garbage in garbage out, but it does seem that there is an increasing danger of reaching a point where verifying the results becomes more difficult than creating them.

500 Boot Hill  Thu, Nov 20, 2008 7:12:26pm

they now officially have more cowbell. Good for them.

501 smaug6  Thu, Nov 20, 2008 8:21:25pm

As they told us repeatedly in engineering school. Crap in = Crap out.re: #10 karmic_inquisitor

502 BLBfootballs  Thu, Nov 20, 2008 9:42:17pm

re: #66 lostlakehiker

I'm sorry, but even the fact that we can now achieve petaflop scale computation does not mean that the resolution problem is going to be "fixed". Climate will likely be found to be more difficult to predict than random mutation -- they are in the same class of inherently ungraspable problems.

We cannot strongly predict the share price of a large company even 10 days in advance; we cannot precisely predict GPS satellite orbits more than a few hours in advance (or perhaps days, if you're willing to accept progressive error); it breaks credulity to suggest that we can "predict" the state of planetary climate in 100 years -- or even 5. We may learn some useful things from making the effort... but I suspect that signal will be drowned out by the noise of "prediction" hysteria.

Here's a suggestion: start these two new petafloppers with a relatively "simple" test -- predict the weather 14 days from now for the entire globe. Too hard? OK, predict the weather with 100 square-mile resolution across the globe. Too hard? Predict the weather for 100 worldwide cities.

Yes, we may learn some useful things but I'm certain that the computational power of these amazing machines may be put to far more valuable applications than climate "prediction". Protein folding, computational chemistry and pharmaceutical development are the first that come to mind.


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