Soothing music. Now this.

Not allowing debate over untested and unproven theories "seems out of place in a free society” and is reminiscent of book-burning in Nazi Germany, he said.

Good gravy! Why do they always go with a nazi comparison?

re: #1 HelloDare

Soothing music. Now this.

The velvet glove treatment?

Not allowing debate over untested and unproven theories "seems out of place in a free society” and is reminiscent of book-burning in Nazi Germany, he said.

Ha!

Godwin'ed hisself right out, there.

re: #4 Killgore Trout

You have to love this part:

untested and unproven theories

It's like he doesn't know what he's talking about. Oh wait- he doesn't!

I still don't get what the problem is... if someone could spell it out for me I would quite appreciate it.

NOW they rename the Tribourough bridge in NY City the RFK bridge- 40 years after his demise? Stop with all this renaming stuff already. Give- me- a- break. Name something once and leave it alone. Name something else after him, yesh.

re: #7 cowbellallen

I still don't get what the problem is... if someone could spell it out for me I would quite appreciate it.

Well, the problem is, you have some guys from Seattle, creationists, looking to push a certain anti-evolution schoolbook they've written (titled Explore Evolution) into Texas public school science classes. This gives them legitimacy and helps them get the book accepted in other states, because Texas schoolbook purchases are so large they influence the whole country.

And someone just stacked the board's science review committee with two of the authors of the very book in question. That's why all these people turned out to protest.

Doesn't it smell a little funny to you? Does to me.

Where've I heard this evolution = nazi before...?

/

re: #7 cowbellallen

I still don't get what the problem is... if someone could spell it out for me I would quite appreciate it.

The problem is evolution has been tested- it's science. ID is not. ID is creationism in a new shade of lipstick.

Read the Wedge Strategy

re: #8 buzzsawmonkey

They are asking for socialism in the free marketplace of ideas.

re: #9 LEGION

NOW they rename the Tribourough bridge in NY City the RFK bridge- 40 years after his demise? Stop with all this renaming stuff already. Give- me- a- break. Name something once and leave it alone. Name something else after him, yesh.

Any comment from Sirhan Sirhan, or maybe his pal Ayers?

OT: Lionheart?

Four arrests in race-hate leaflets probe

FOUR people have been arrested this morning in connection with an investigation into the distribution of leaflets in Lancashire which claim Muslims are responsible for the heroin trade.

A 41-year-old man from Burnley, a 43-year-old man from Blackburn, a 53-year-old man from Preston and a 57-year-old man from Nelson have been arrested on suspicion of the publication and distribution of written material intended to stir up racial hatred and the possession of racially inflammatory material.

re: #14 Nevergiveup

Any comment from Sirhan Sirhan, or maybe his pal Ayers?

Mary Jo Kopechne was unavailable for comment as well.

Pretty shady how that article allows the last 2 phrases to go unchallenged (i.e. unproven and nazi).

"One of the few voices from the other side came from Paul Kramer, a Carrollton engineer, who said that more than 700 eminent scientists welcome the teaching of pros and cons about evolution. Not allowing debate over untested and unproven theories "seems out of place in a free society” and is reminiscent of book-burning in Nazi Germany, he said."

"Untested and unproven theories"...? Those would be "Creation Science" and "Intelligent Design".

Oh, wait. They can't be tested because...well, because!.

re: #7 cowbellallen

The Creationists (literal believers in the Bible's 'creation' timeline) want their BELIEFS taught in school AS IF those beliefs are FACT.

If it is FACT, there's no need for belief.
If it is BELIEF, there's no need to teach it as fact.

Further, when once that door is opened to Creationists, in America it must then remain open to Islamic Creato-Fascists, Flying Spaghetti-Monsterists, LRonHubbard Alien-Creationists, and even far out weirdos...

Beginning to see The Problem, Allen? :D

re: #15 Killgore Trout

What makes you think that? The location?

re: #15 Killgore Trout

Wasn't Lionheart from Luton?

re: #20 Charles

That was one of his main themes; that Muslims were responsible for the drug trade. I think he was from Manchester, but I can't recall.

re: #10 Charles

Well, the problem is, you have some guys from Seattle, creationists, looking to push a certain schoolbook they've written (titled Explore Evolution) into Texas public school science classes. This gives them legitimacy and helps them get the book accepted in other states, because Texas schoolbook purchases are so large they influence the whole country.

And someone just stacked the board's science review committee with two of the authors of the very book in question. That's why all these people turned out to protest.

Doesn't it smell a little funny to you? Does to me.

Ahhh, gotcha. I haven't really been paying attention to this stuff I suppose.

I'm actually a high school student in a Dallas suburb and my dad turned me on to your site a couple years ago. Some of the biology teachers in my school have been talking about how people want to teach creationism in schools... I'm just ignorant on the whole issue and don't really understand why it is such a big deal. I'm not advocating any side, I just flat out don't know anything about the subject, so sorry if my question seemed a little stupid.

re: #15 Killgore Trout

racially inflammatory material.

WHAT? Do tell, what "race" are Muslims?

/duhhh

Interesting comment from the article...

"Board Chairman Don McLeroy said the lopsided turnout was part of an orchestrated campaign and flatly dismissed the notion that the board is intent on sabotaging the teaching of evolution in public schools, which would defy the U.S. Supreme Court."

I guess it's not possible that the turnout was due to the fact that the scientist and such had a leg to stand on, considering rulings of the Supreme Court, years of research and just plan fact.

One of the few voices from the other side came from Paul Kramer, a Carrollton engineer, who said that more than 700 eminent scientists welcome the teaching of pros and cons about evolution. Not allowing debate over untested and unproven theories "seems out of place in a free society” and is reminiscent of book-burning in Nazi Germany, he said.

And this leaves the door open to ID because...why, exactly?

What is wrong with public school education is that children are not being taught how to read, write, calculate, and reason.

re: #10 Charles

Well, the problem is, you have some guys from Seattle, creationists, looking to push a certain anti-evolution schoolbook they've written (titled Explore Evolution) into Texas public school science classes. /blockquote>

Man... Seattle just can't do anything right. I love the city, I just clash with (most of) the people.

One of the few voices from the other side came from Paul Kramer, a Carrollton engineer, who said that more than 700 eminent scientists welcome the teaching of pros and cons about evolution. Not allowing debate over untested and unproven theories "seems out of place in a free society” and is reminiscent of book-burning in Nazi Germany, he said.

I wonder if Mr. Carrollton thinks schools should teach the "pros and cons" of geocentrism too so the kids can make up their own minds.

re: #10 Charles

Well, the problem is, you have some guys from Seattle, creationists, looking to push a certain anti-evolution schoolbook they've written (titled Explore Evolution) into Texas public school science classes. This gives them legitimacy and helps them get the book accepted in other states, because Texas schoolbook purchases are so large they influence the whole country.

And someone just stacked the board's science review committee with two of the authors of the very book in question. That's why all these people turned out to protest.

Doesn't it smell a little funny to you? Does to me.

It seems funny to me as well. Evolution is a theory, but it is the one that best fits the facts. We should teach the truth as best we know it.

re: #26 Walter L. Newton

The article is a bit lopsided itself... one the one hand you have evolution proponents performing lopsided turnouts to support a mainstream supported idea and on the other you have an engineer asking for proof (unchallenged). Sounds like the author is reaching out to those who don't know much about the topic and is trying to make the creationsists sound like they're just looking for proof...

re: #24 cowbellallen

Ahhh, gotcha. I haven't really been paying attention to this stuff I suppose.

I'm actually a high school student in a Dallas suburb and my dad turned me on to your site a couple years ago. Some of the biology teachers in my school have been talking about how people want to teach creationism in schools... I'm just ignorant on the whole issue and don't really understand why it is such a big deal. I'm not advocating any side, I just flat out don't know anything about the subject, so sorry if my question seemed a little stupid.

Not stupid at all, we don't expect everyone to know all the background on everything. Keep asking. (Although, if you keep asking the same thing over and over again hoping for a different answer, then we may get around to the stupid label.)

re: #22 Killgore Trout

That was one of his main themes; that Muslims were responsible for the drug trade. I think he was from Manchester, but I can't recall.

Who is Lionheart again?

re: #34 Dark_Falcon

A bigot who was shown the door.

re: #20 Charles

and there's also this...

CONTROVERSIAL British National Party leader Nick Griffin visited Burnley as thousands of BNP members panicked over a leaked membership list.
Mr Griffin joined protesters outside Burnley Police Station the day after the leaked list exposed teachers, prison officers and police officers as members of the party, along with 74 residents in the Burnley area.

He was in town to support four men arrested in connection with an investigation into the distribution of alleged racially inflammatory leaflets, but faced a barrage of questions from the media relating to the list.

I think the source is here but the article won't display for me.

re: #28 Alouette

What is wrong with public school education is that children are not being taught how to read, write, calculate, and reason.

Ahhh... the three R's...

re: #24 cowbellallen

Wow- you're still in high school? I didn't realize we had Lizards that young here. Cool!

And you should listen to your teachers on this issue. Intelligent Design is more of a philosophy, and isn't science in any way.

“Are you willing to play dice with our children’s education as our nation’s science lead deteriorates?”

That's just what we're doing by letting freshmen choose their own tax-paid majors. If we're going to pay for it, shouldn't we tell them what we're willing to pay for (hard sciences, engineering, etc.). This country should plan for its future - let the social science majors pay their own way.

Or maybe I just read too much Jerry Pournelle.

re: #39 buzzsawmonkey

Yes. To which I would add, "memorize."

I recall being required to learn poetry by heart in gradeschool English classes. It acquainted me with certain classics, and classic turns of phrase; it taught grammar, language rhythm, vocabulary, an appreciation for the spoken tongue; it increased memory capacity, which stood me in good stead when I was required to learn vocabulary in foreign-language classes. All of which are virtues that have now gone by the board.

I second THAT!

Punching keys on a solar-powered calculator is no substitute for 9x7=63
MEMORIZED... and learning how to master the memorization process, the techniques of memorization... THESE and the ability to REASON are far more important tnan "Here, Johnny, click this to get Excel... and click THIS for Word..."

NO! Not science!
/

Sorry for the early OT but some good news for the lizards.

Hajji Hammadi, the al-Qaida in Iraq leader blamed in the 2004 abduction and killing of Staff Sgt. Matt Maupin and other deadly attacks over several years, was killed in a Nov. 11 raid by U.S. forces in Baghdad, the military said Thursday.

Much celebrating tonight.

re: #40 Tom on the rez

Or maybe I just read too much Jerry Pournelle.

I dunno if that's possible.

re: #10 Charles

Well, the problem is, you have some guys from Seattle, creationists, looking to push a certain anti-evolution schoolbook they've written (titled Explore Evolution) into Texas public school science classes. This gives them legitimacy and helps them get the book accepted in other states, because Texas schoolbook purchases are so large they influence the whole country.

And someone just stacked the board's science review committee with two of the authors of the very book in question.

As Gollum would say, "tricksy bastardsss".

re: #40 Tom on the rez

“Are you willing to play dice with our children’s education as our nation’s science lead deteriorates?”

That's just what we're doing by letting freshmen choose their own tax-paid majors. If we're going to pay for it, shouldn't we tell them what we're willing to pay for (hard sciences, engineering, etc.). This country should plan for its future - let the social science majors pay their own way.

Or maybe I just read too much Jerry Pournelle.

Hard to read too much of him. His "Prince of Sparta" series has been a starting point for my understanding of counter-insurgency.

re: #43 Neo Con since 9-11

Sorry for the early OT but some good news for the lizards.

Much celebrating tonight.

That's Spinoff worthy.

re: #24 cowbellallen

Ahhh, gotcha. I haven't really been paying attention to this stuff I suppose.

I'm actually a high school student in a Dallas suburb and my dad turned me on to your site a couple years ago. Some of the biology teachers in my school have been talking about how people want to teach creationism in schools... I'm just ignorant on the whole issue and don't really understand why it is such a big deal. I'm not advocating any side, I just flat out don't know anything about the subject, so sorry if my question seemed a little stupid.

As far as I know, we don't mind questions here. It's certain other kinds of comments that get annoying. Personally, I'm glad that you want to know more about the subject.

When is the election for school board happening again? This occurred in Kansas a few years back right? My memory is not serving me well tonight...

Test.

re: #15 Killgore Trout

Who else?

re: #39 buzzsawmonkey

Yes. To which I would add, "memorize."

I recall being required to learn poetry by heart in gradeschool English classes. It acquainted me with certain classics, and classic turns of phrase; it taught grammar, language rhythm, vocabulary, an appreciation for the spoken tongue; it increased memory capacity, which stood me in good stead when I was required to learn vocabulary in foreign-language classes. All of which are virtues that have now gone by the board.

I still remember "Stopping by the Woods on a Snowy Evening" by Frost which I had to memorize in the third grade and Lady MacBeth's soliloquy that I had to memorize in high school.

I've tried teaching The Kid the multiplication tables but, he adds it up more quickly in his head than I can flash the sequential cards. When I mix the cards up, he still adds the numbers up quickly.

re: #47 buzzsawmonkey

Wow.

I didn't hit that 'New Math' crap, memorized my times tables only to 12, thinking myself much maligned, but finding others who memorized to 20!

Logical fallacies, IF--THEN, compared to WHAT?, WHO says? ...

Without these mental strengths, people could fall victim to smooth-talking charlatans with no executive experi-

Woops.

re: #37 psyop

Ahhh... the three R's...

The four R's

IMO, about all that needs to be taught of evolution before college is that the theory exists and what it basically states. Despite the centrality of evolution to explaining the "why" of biology, there's plenty of biology to teach that's of much more practical application to non-scientists.

The civic purpose of educating the electorate could probably even be met without getting into evolution at all. It's not like we're going to be voting on policy issues related to evolution, anymore than we're going to be voting on policy issues related to cosmology or plate tectonics.

re: #43 Neo Con since 9-11

Remember when the moonbats said that if the US killed one leader he would be replaced by 100 others who were worse? Then whenever we kill one of those bastards, violence drops like a rock...

Kudos to the army for killing that scum. If I could ding up their karma, I would.

re: #52 Guanxi88

It might be a common theme with the BNP but I do remember there being some speculation that Lionheart was being investigated over leaflets he was distributing or harassing Muslims in his neighborhood. I also saw him over at Spencer's blog talking about the urgent need for him to move to Ireland. I'm just guessing, really it could be anybody.

UN vote shows growing support of death penalty ban

[Link: www.jpost.com...]

So let me get this right. The UN is against the death penalty but have no problem with terrorists killing innocents? Kinda like being against the death penalty but pro-abortion?

Evolution proponents descend on state education panel

The descent of man!

re: #27 solomonpanting

And this leaves the door open to ID because...why, exactly?

Well, it might be that the only theory that the ID and CS folks want to debate is Evolution which has been proven in the lab, the field and everywhere else beyond a reasonable doubt. To continue such a debate is pointless to the point of being silly and scientists have every right to tell the ID and CS crowd to either come up with some serious proof or sit down and shut up.

re: #40 Tom on the rez

“Are you willing to play dice with our children’s education as our nation’s science lead deteriorates?”

That's just what we're doing by letting freshmen choose their own tax-paid majors. If we're going to pay for it, shouldn't we tell them what we're willing to pay for (hard sciences, engineering, etc.). This country should plan for its future - let the social science majors pay their own way.

Or maybe I just read too much Jerry Pournelle.

Ummm...the only tax-payers who paid for my major were my parents.

Uh oh! This is going to bring them out of the wood work. 5, 4, 3, 2...

re: #25 Karridine

WHAT? Do tell, what "race" are Muslims?

/duhhh

Well, they are a different race then the Baptists and Mormons. They are a pretty pure race though. It can get tough when the races start mixing. I knew a racially mixed couple, Dutch Reform and Lutheran. Oh - the kids were really picked on in school.

/sarc

Stuff like this makes me wonder: On the one hand, we've got the folks who want the curriculum packed solid with indoctrination in leftist orthodoxies and the worst refuse from our academic world. On the other, we've got otherwise decent folk who, for reasons that simply mystify me, absolutely insist that certain fundamental principles of modern science are untrue because they appear to contradict certain truths contained in revealed scripture.

Not to sound like the RamBam on this one, but if what we know by the power of reason to be true appears to contradict what we know by revelation to be true, then we must attempt to understand the origin of the conflict. In every case, the source of the problem is in our inadequate understanding of the revealed truth. The language of prophecy is not the language of science; the former speaks in metaphors and images, the latter in concrete, clear expression.

I love these threads...

re: #47 buzzsawmonkey

Yes. The only time in my life I was ever a "math whiz" was the year after I returned to the US from living overseas. I had learned the times-tables by rote in the foreign classroom; I came back to a class in the throes of the "new math"--and for two years I was the only person in my class who knew how to multiply.

I had a junior high math teacher who would engage the class in mental calculations thusly:
"What is two times ten plus five plus ten divided by seven times nine plus five divided by ten times three."
She'd say this as fast as one can read this and expected answers immediatley.

re: #39 buzzsawmonkey

Yes. To which I would add, "memorize."

I recall being required to learn poetry by heart in gradeschool English classes. It acquainted me with certain classics, and classic turns of phrase; it taught grammar, language rhythm, vocabulary, an appreciation for the spoken tongue; it increased memory capacity, which stood me in good stead when I was required to learn vocabulary in foreign-language classes. All of which are virtues that have now gone by the board.

Drama and theater classes, which may seem frivolous and "gay" to some, are great incentives for memorization, particularly if the classics (Shakespeare, Euripides) are performed.

Eugene O'Neill, however, sucks. So does Arthur Miller, except for "The Crucible."

re: #21 stevieray

I think you're right. I just checked his blog and he does appear to be from Luton.

re: #58 Killgore Trout

It might be a common theme with the BNP but I do remember there being some speculation that Lionheart was being investigated over leaflets he was distributing or harassing Muslims in his neighborhood. I also saw him over at Spencer's blog talking about the urgent need for him to move to Ireland. I'm just guessing, really it could be anybody.

Well, I tell you the truth, the guy just seems made to order for it.

re: #66 bryantms

I love these threads...

Agreed! Just sit back with a beer and a bag of popcorn and watch the show.

re: #59 Nevergiveup

UN vote shows growing support of death penalty ban

[Link: www.jpost.com...]

So let me get this right. The UN is against the death penalty but have no problem with terrorists killing innocents? Kinda like being against the death penalty but pro-abortion?

They only support killing those who can't fight back. Cowards is what they are.

re: #41 Karridine

I second THAT!

Punching keys on a solar-powered calculator is no substitute for 9x7=63
MEMORIZED... and learning how to master the memorization process, the techniques of memorization... THESE and the ability to REASON are far more important tnan "Here, Johnny, click this to get Excel... and click THIS for Word..."

I was lousy at math. It was my worst subject. But I once dazzled (inadvertently) a bunch of twenty-somethings by working out in my head a good rough estimate for the speed of light in miles per hour, based on knowing it in miles per second. Now... it's really not that hard to do.

re: #73 Dark_Falcon

They only support killing those who can't fight back. Cowards is what they are.

If you start out being benevolent to the evil, you end up being evil to the innocent.

re: #38 Sharmuta

Wow- you're still in high school? I didn't realize we had Lizards that young here. Cool!

And you should listen to your teachers on this issue. Intelligent Design is more of a philosophy, and isn't science in any way.

Better if they did some research now that they have been exposed to the subject. Taking their teachers as the sole authority could be just as bad as letting some authority figure push ID as science.

re: #59 Nevergiveup

There is a big debate in Jamaica about repealing the death penalty.

[Link: www.jamaica-gleaner.com...]

re: #40 Tom on the rez

“Are you willing to play dice with our children’s education as our nation’s science lead deteriorates?”

That's just what we're doing by letting freshmen choose their own tax-paid majors. If we're going to pay for it, shouldn't we tell them what we're willing to pay for (hard sciences, engineering, etc.). This country should plan for its future - let the social science majors pay their own way.

Or maybe I just read too much Jerry Pournelle.

The blacksmith, the engineer, the artist and the ploughman: It takes all kinds.

re: #69 buzzsawmonkey

the teacher started us off with the first line of Casabianca ("The boy stood on the burning deck") and went from student to student; each had to supply one line on the spot, in proper rhyme and meter--not the actual lines of the poem, but something we made up.

Teacher: "The boy stood on the burning deck..."

buzzsaw:¨"...and exclaimed, 'it was already on fire when I got here, I swear!'

Here comes the ISS

Left coast Lizards: in about 15 minutes poke your head outside and look up. No need to stick out your thumb - the Vogons will not willingly pick up hitchhikers.

NorCal Lizards should get the best view.

re: #41 Karridine

A classic education disappeared from our schools during the 50's onward. As a victim of the 'new math' of the 60's, it forever messed me up in regards to mathematics. The ability to do math in your head pretty much went away with slide rules. So to figure a 15% tip now requires a calculator. IMHO students should be kept away from calculators until they hit algebra, at which point they get to use a four banger calculator. Word processors? They make formatting a document a little easier, but the writing is still the same. Spread sheets? You've got to use some basic programming skills for them to function. The educational foundations of yore are now built on shifting sands of 'new' and often unproven educational theories. Stop experimenting on our children.

re: #71 Guanxi88

Well, I tell you the truth, the guy just seems made to order for it.

Agreed. He is the same kind of assclown, even if he isn't a BNP member.

re: #80 Racer X

Here comes the ISS

Left coast Lizards: in about 15 minutes poke your head outside and look up. No need to stick out your thumb - the Vogons will not willingly pick up hitchhikers.

NorCal Lizards should get the best view.

Too much wind and clouds for me. :(

re: #74 Occasional Reader

I was lousy at math. It was my worst subject. But I once dazzled (inadvertently) a bunch of twenty-somethings by working out in my head a good rough estimate for the speed of light in miles per hour, based on knowing it in miles per second. Now... it's really not that hard to do.

I was lousy in English OR..

re: #75 Guanxi88

If you start out being benevolent to the evil, you end up being evil to the innocent.

Who said that? (just asking)

re: #67 solomonpanting

15?

re: #65 Guanxi88

Stuff like this makes me wonder: On the one hand, we've got the folks who want the curriculum packed solid with indoctrination in leftist orthodoxies and the worst refuse from our academic world. On the other, we've got otherwise decent folk who, for reasons that simply mystify me, absolutely insist that certain fundamental principles of modern science are untrue because they appear to contradict certain truths contained in revealed scripture.

Those two mighty broad brushes with which you're painting your picture.

re: #70 Killgore Trout

Now what are the 'police' going to do IF, as the pamphlets claim, the local Muslims ARE, IN FACT, steering and masterminding the local heroin problem?

re: #69 buzzsawmonkey

Good for him. Good for you.

I know we had to memorize the Gettysburg Address; The Midnight Ride of Paul Revere; Hamlet's soliloquy; Ozymandias--oh, a host of stuff.

I suppose that I was slated as a lyric parodist at an early age, when in a class at 3rd-grade level the teacher started us off with the first line of Casabianca ("The boy stood on the burning deck") and went from student to student; each had to supply one line on the spot, in proper rhyme and meter--not the actual lines of the poem, but something we made up.

All she did was help you hone the talent that God gave you.

re: #85 Dark_Falcon

Who said that? (just asking)

Sages, in the Talmud.

re: #87 Racer X

15?

You get extra recess!

If someones religion has a problem with the proven science of evolution then they need to teach it in Sunday school and not in public school. If it is that important to the parents why don't they get off their bum bum and 1. teach the kids themselves 2. take them to sunday school. I don't want everyone to get free time to teach kids their own personal religious belief in school. I hate to think of what the Scientologists would cook up. Good grief.

I am in agreement that creation, i.e. religion shouldn't be taught in public schools. Not because I'm against religion but because so much power rests in the hands of those who teach. They can influence what "flavor" of religion is taught.
Likewise, my concern with the teaching of evolution is the ability of the teacher to move it from science into the realm of faith (or the lack thereof).
If a creationist teacher comes in with an agenda to persuade students to believe a particular religion, I would think that to be detrimental. Also, if a teacher begins to teach evolution to the exclusion of a deity, that would be equally as bad.

re: #91 Guanxi88

Sages, in the Talmud.

Thank you.

[Link: www.floppingaces.net...]

I ♥ sarah palin

re: #79 Occasional Reader

Teacher: "The boy stood on the burning deck..."

buzzsaw:¨"...and exclaimed, 'it was already on fire when I got here, I swear!'

LOL!

re: #86 buzzsawmonkey

Nope. Not proper rhyme; not proper meter.

There was a young man named Dave...

re: #92 solomonpanting

You get extra recess!

Yesss!

*fist pump*

re: #72 logboy

Break out the heavy stuff when you can tell people are screaming the words while writing them.

re: #88 MandyManners

Those two mighty broad brushes with which you're painting your picture.

Maybe if we talk about it in terms of Kali, where we have a few more hands available for examples.

re: #24 cowbellallen
My son is a Junior in (a suburb of Dallas) public High School and isn't aware of any behind the scenes attempts to dumb down science ed. Parents find out what is in the text and on the syllabus for the upcomming year during curriculum night and then can deal with the principal and the school board if needed. It's not a problem in my ISD.
BTW, I'm impressed you post here.

re: #84 HoosierHoops

I was lousy in English OR..

Stuffy English tutor: Now, there are two words one must never use. One is ¨swell¨, and the other is ¨lousy¨.

[Lucy, Ricky, Fred and Ethel nod in agreement, smiling earnestly]

[long pause]

Fred Mertz: Tell us the lousy one first.

(I don´t know why I remember these things, I swear...)

Good Evening Lizards! It's still cold in Near Iowa.

I have a Karma rating--how cool is that. Of course, I don't know what to do with it.

How are you-all and what are we talking about?

Teaching the background for evolution, such as the conservation of the genetic code, the concepts of mutation, morphogenesis, allelic variation, Mendelian dominance and recessivity, and some population level/ecological concepts like habitat, competition, extinction, should give the teachers plenty to talk about in the limited time available in science class, and form the foundation for higher level theories like evolution in college.

re: #88 MandyManners

Those two mighty broad brushes with which you're painting your picture.

Well, sometimes, you just gotta paint in broad strokes. It's like sign-painting: if you go for too much detail, it's hard to see. You use the big brushes for the big points.

And, strictly speaking, there's no getting around it: these two extremes I presented are a vanishingly small minority within the spectrum, but hey are there, and are useful to illustrate, by their own extremism, the sort of problem we face. There really are folks who want the education system to do nothing but prepare people for a lifetime of adherence to leftist orthodoxy and lifestyle politics, and there really are folks who object to the teaching of evolutionary theory on purely (and thinly-veiled) religious grounds.

re: #74 Occasional Reader

I was lousy at math. It was my worst subject. But I once dazzled (inadvertently) a bunch of twenty-somethings by working out in my head a good rough estimate for the speed of light in miles per hour, based on knowing it in miles per second. Now... it's really not that hard to do.

I found that trying to program in BASIC on one of the school district's main-frame computer terminals made it easy to understand a lot of calculus. Was especially fun when learning about Non-Euclidean Geometry. Created one "universe" that was shaped like a Pringles potato chip.

re: #81 Perplexed

My father, born in 1920 and high-schooled in the early '30s, went for another 30 years thinking himself deprived by not having a college education, but then in the 1970s researchers published research papers stating that HIS education was the functional equivalent of a full 4-year collegiate program current at that time (1970's)!

Cheered him for decades, because it validated something his experience had already shown him, Perplexed!

re: #102 CyanSnowHawk

Maybe if we talk about it in terms of Kali, where we have a few more hands available for examples.

Ok, if Kali is in the picture, which secretive Obama supporter is Mola Ram?

re: #89 Karridine

My guess is that this is a situation like the thread from last night where a VB member was accusing Muslims of vandalizing a cemetery.

re: #102 CyanSnowHawk

Maybe if we talk about it in terms of Kali, where we have a few more hands available for examples.

Kill for the love of killing!
Kill for the love of Kali!
Kill!
Kill!
KILL!

-Gunga Din (the movie, that is)

Did someone equate evolution with nazis ?

You DID hear it before as nazi scientists equated what the Reich was doing , with "survival of the fittest ", not really evolution but an offshoot like Natural Adaption . But it all boiled down to nihilism and superiority of a particular strain of the white race .
Hey wait a minute !

Isn't Texas a Republican State .

I'll bet that entourage of creationists hitting the Texas school system are all Republicans .

It makes for an interesting fight , but parents should know , their kids have well working bullshit detectors .
What everyone here is worrying about , has already happened , via Mom & Dad ...much more influential than a school book . LOL...one need only look at the State of Utah ! Who are we kidding ?

Besides , the muslims got one leg up on everyone , the Saudis pay for schools books AND DISTRIBUTED TO MUSLIM SCHOOL IN THIS COUNTRY ...THE USA .

They dont fight court battles , and they by-pass all the riga-morole, they simply sneak them in , use them , and when they get busted , they promise to revise them , and guess what ? They dont .

I would be more concerned regarding the teaching of hatred of all that is NON-MUSLIM , giving religious license to JIHAD , rationalizing and thereby justifying the ultimate end of the teaching of hatred ...VIOLENCE .
Such books are already in use , not widely but certainly across this country , Virginia , New York and D.C. to name a few . And in Virginia of all places right in Jerry Falwells backyard .

When I see creationists blowing up airliners , pirating ships , killing innocents , and trying to rule the world by their own narrow standards , then I'll consider worrying about them .

But take heart , it seems many forget , we have a Supreme Court , and we all are entitled to Due Process...so if the good people of Texas are willing to fight what is being foisted on them ...then The Supreme Court will have the final word , and any "book " they attempt to float , will remain on ice , until the court decides .

However , keep in mind at all times , the Saudi Books and the schools that use them , disrespect , even despise with contempt- American Law when it comes to the tenets of their ideology , and simply ignore .
And believe it , because it's happening right now .

re: #99 buzzsawmonkey

I would say, rather, that she sparked, or helped spark, a love of wordplay which has been a real pleasure for the rest of my life.

On the other hand, I still haven't learned Photoshop.

If you want to learn photoshop, this guy has an entire series of tutorials. They're pretty insightful.

You Suck at Photoshop

re: #110 Karridine

My father, born in 1920 and high-schooled in the early '30s, went for another 30 years thinking himself deprived by not having a college education, but then in the 1970s researchers published research papers stating that HIS education was the functional equivalent of a full 4-year collegiate program current at that time (1970's)!

Cheered him for decades, because it validated something his experience had already shown him, Perplexed!

Ever seen a graduation test for a 6th grader in the late 1800's? Passing that would be equivalent to a high school diploma. Our educators have gone wobbly on us.

re: #101 SWPaul

Break out the heavy stuff when you can tell people are screaming the words while writing them.

Nah, i just wait and laugh when they get booted.

"HOW DARE YOU INSINUATE I AM NOT THE DIRECT DESCENDANT OF THE PTERODACTYL!"

It gets better by the minute!

re: #24 cowbellallen

Ahhh, gotcha. I haven't really been paying attention to this stuff I suppose.

I'm actually a high school student in a Dallas suburb and my dad turned me on to your site a couple years ago. Some of the biology teachers in my school have been talking about how people want to teach creationism in schools... I'm just ignorant on the whole issue and don't really understand why it is such a big deal. I'm not advocating any side, I just flat out don't know anything about the subject, so sorry if my question seemed a little stupid.

Play your cards right, you could get voted into office on a decent platform.

re: #99 buzzsawmonkey

I would say, rather, that she sparked, or helped spark, a love of wordplay which has been a real pleasure for the rest of my life.

On the other hand, I still haven't learned Photoshop.

Your modesty humbles me.

re: #114 Cutty Sark

Did someone equate evolution with nazis ?

You DID hear it before as nazi scientists equated what the Reich was doing , with "survival of the fittest ", not really evolution but an offshoot like Natural Adaption . But it all boiled down to nihilism and superiority of a particular strain of the white race .
Hey wait a minute !

Isn't Texas a Republican State .

I'll bet that entourage of creationists hitting the Texas school system are all Republicans .

It makes for an interesting fight , but parents should know , their kids have well working bullshit detectors .
What everyone here is worrying about , has already happened , via Mom & Dad ...much more influential than a school book . LOL...one need only look at the State of Utah ! Who are we kidding ?

Besides , the muslims got one leg up on everyone , the Saudis pay for schools books AND DISTRIBUTED TO MUSLIM SCHOOL IN THIS COUNTRY ...THE USA .

They dont fight court battles , and they by-pass all the riga-morole, they simply sneak them in , use them , and when they get busted , they promise to revise them , and guess what ? They dont .

I would be more concerned regarding the teaching of hatred of all that is NON-MUSLIM , giving religious license to JIHAD , rationalizing and thereby justifying the ultimate end of the teaching of hatred ...VIOLENCE .
Such books are already in use , not widely but certainly across this country , Virginia , New York and D.C. to name a few . And in Virginia of all places right in Jerry Falwells backyard .

When I see creationists blowing up airliners , pirating ships , killing innocents , and trying to rule the world by their own narrow standards , then I'll consider worrying about them .

But take heart , it seems many forget , we have a Supreme Court , and we all are entitled to Due Process...so if the good people of Texas are willing to fight what is being foisted on them ...then The Supreme Court will have the final word , and any "book " they attempt to float , will remain on ice , until the court decides .

However , keep in mind at all times , the Saudi Books and the schools that use them , disrespect , even despise with contempt- American Law when it comes to the tenets of their ideology , and simply ignore .
And believe it , because it's happening right now .

Fair point, but, speaking for myself, I don't think a theocratic state is a likely result of sneaking this creationsit/I.D. stuff into the curriculum. Rather, I think the risk is further dilution of the value of a public education.

re: #117 Perplexed

Ever seen a graduation test for a 6th grader in the late 1800's? Passing that would be equivalent to a high school diploma.

Somebody linked to one recently. It was really tough.

re: #116 buzzsawmonkey

Hell, no. Get 10% by dropping the last digit of the number, halve it and add the two. Easy.

Now how about using your knuckles to remember which month has 30 or 31 months.

re: #104 Occasional Reader

Stuffy English tutor: Now, there are two words one must never use. One is ¨swell¨, and the other is ¨lousy¨.

[Lucy, Ricky, Fred and Ethel nod in agreement, smiling earnestly]

[long pause]

Fred Mertz: Tell us the lousy one first.

(I don´t know why I remember these things, I swear...)

Rippity-pippity A.

re: #116 buzzsawmonkey

Hell, no. Get 10% by dropping the last digit of the number, halve it and add the two. Easy.

You know that and I know that. How many 18 yr olds can do that in their head?

re: #112 Killgore Trout

"Ehhh... could be, Doc!"

Texas became the latest stage for the debate about evolution and creationism Wednesday, as more than 80 witnesses trooped before the State Board of Education to weigh in on proposed changes in the public school science curriculum.

With few exceptions, the speakers — scientists, teachers, clergy and grassroots activists — took the side of evolution, saying they feared that the proposed changes will open the door to the teaching of creationism or intelligent design.

Game on!

/so, what's the score, who's winning?

re: #99 buzzsawmonkey

I would say, rather, that she sparked, or helped spark, a love of swordplay which has been a real pleasure for the rest of my life.

Isn't that kind of dangerous?

(I learned this technique from Peacekeeper; the fake typo)

re: #118 logboy

Nah, i just wait and laugh when they get booted.

"HOW DARE YOU INSINUATE I AM NOT THE DIRECT DESCENDANT OF THE PTERODACTYL!"

It gets better by the minute!

It's always fun to watch the troll get the hook.

re: #81 Perplexed

So to figure a 15% tip now requires a calculator.

So that's why servers now expect to receive 20%

re: #124 MandyManners

Rippity-pippity A.

Kewpie doll for you! Or, in its absence, and upding.

and meaning an, of course

re: #125 Perplexed

You know that and I know that. How many 18 yr olds can do that in their head?

I doubt many 18 yr olds could pick their nose without video instructions.

re: #108 Guanxi88

Well, sometimes, you just gotta paint in broad strokes. It's like sign-painting: if you go for too much detail, it's hard to see. You use the big brushes for the big points.

And, strictly speaking, there's no getting around it: these two extremes I presented are a vanishingly small minority within the spectrum, but hey are there, and are useful to illustrate, by their own extremism, the sort of problem we face. There really are folks who want the education system to do nothing but prepare people for a lifetime of adherence to leftist orthodoxy and lifestyle politics, and there really are folks who object to the teaching of evolutionary theory on purely (and thinly-veiled) religious grounds.

In the meantime, the great middle just wants its kids reared, educated and to be productive members of society. That's why I chose a private school for The Kid.

re: #115 DesertSage

If you want to learn photoshop, this guy has an entire series of tutorials. They're pretty insightful.

You Suck at Photoshop

ROFLMAO!

re: #133 FurryOldGuyJeans

I doubt many 18 yr olds could pick their nose without video instructions.

That's on YouTube, right? I think I saw the tutorial over at instructables.

re: #117 Perplexed

Ever seen a graduation test for a 6th grader in the late 1800's? Passing that would be equivalent to a high school diploma. Our educators have gone wobbly on us.

And, so have many parents.

re: #116 buzzsawmonkey

Hell, no. Get 10% by dropping the last digit of the number, halve it and add the two. Easy.

Way too complicated. I just don't leave tips.

re: #135 MandyManners

In the meantime, the great middle just wants its kids reared, educated and to be productive members of society. That's why I chose a private school for The Kid.

Me, too. A religious school, yet, and they teach evolution in science class, and creation in scripture. This way, the kids get to have their dinosaurs and the word of the Lord, both.

Seems to me a minor atrocity, to take dinosaurs away from the kids.

re: #114 Cutty Sark

Dude.

re: #122 Killgore Trout

Somebody linked to one recently. It was really tough.

My point exactly. You had students who had pencils, paper, ink and pens and little else. They worked and worked hard at their studies. Our educational system has failed the taxpayers and deprived students of a decent education. That's why home schoolers often run circles around the public schooled.

re: #117 Perplexed

Yes, Perp, I HAVE seen one of those 6th grade tests!

It appears arcane and difficult to me, now, with its furlongs and yards and other measures, but those were the measures OF THE DAY, in common use for the agrarian community of that time, and as such VERY PERTINENT to an honest, successful life in 1880's America...

And there were other aspects, social questions, Constitutional concepts, just as tough! GOOD STUFF, Kiddo!

re: #131 Occasional Reader

Kewpie doll for you! Or, in its absence, and upding.

Awesome! No. 19,578!

*smooch*

re: #136 Racer X

ROFLMAO!

You should watch the rest of them. The guy is funnier than shit.

re: #2 Sharmuta

Good gravy! Why do they always go with a nazi comparison?

Because they can't win the argument.

K.

re: #129 Dark_Falcon

It's always fun to watch the troll get the hook.

And that is why I like these threads!

re: #140 Guanxi88

Me, too. A religious school, yet, and they teach evolution in science class, and creation in scripture. This way, the kids get to have their dinosaurs and the word of the Lord, both.

Seems to me a minor atrocity, to take dinosaurs away from the kids.

For some reason, The Kid never got into dinosaurs. He was too busy stomping butt with Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

re: #144 MandyManners

Awesome! No. 19,578!

*smooch*

But I'm closing in.

¨Don't look back, something might be gaining on you.¨

-Satchel Paige

re: #118 logboy

Give it ten minutes, go to LGF2, read what their new member has to say and have lolz for hours.

I smell a jwoby.

re: #43 Neo Con since 9-11

Great news! thanks for posting that.

re: #142 Perplexed

My point exactly. You had students who had pencils, paper, ink and pens and little else. They worked and worked hard at their studies. Our educational system has failed the taxpayers and deprived students of a decent education. That's why home schoolers often run circles around the public schooled.

What are you talkin about? I can't wait to see how high of marks my boy will receive in putting 'Condom on Banana' day.

/

re: #151 SWPaul

Give it ten minutes, go to LGF2, read what their new member has to say and have lolz for hours.

I'd rather go swimming in a full cesspool, thank you very much.

OT - What a dope, (Iowa) talk

[Link: blogs2.startribune.com...]

re: #121 Guanxi88

A theocratic state may NOT be the proximal outcome of a pro-ID decision, but that DECISION becomes Thin-Entering Wedge allowing the entry of other belief-systems disguised as 'science', Guan

re: #147 buzzsawmonkey

The Feral Parents of Park Slope, Brooklyn let their little demons run wild, without discipline of any kind. If the children are extra-destructive they will try to "reason" with them. Nobody "reasons" with a 3-year-old.

I've heard of that neighborhood before, and I have a vague recollection of the problem with their progeny.

re: #114 Cutty Sark

Lolz. I grew up in a Republican state and I learned evolution! My board of supervisors were probably Republican, so then evolutionists must be Republicans.

OH MY GOD! REPUBLICANS ARE BOTH EVOLUTIONISTS AND CREATIONISTS!

Did anyone know we were actually living in a one-party system where the theory of evolution was the only issue that one based his/her party preference on?!

re: #149 MandyManners

For some reason, The Kid never got into dinosaurs. He was too busy stomping butt with Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

When my youngest son (who was just married last week) was 5 years old, someone asked him, which was his favorite Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle. He said, "I don't speak Russian."

re: #150 Occasional Reader

But I'm closing in.

¨Don't look back, something might be gaining on you.¨

-Satchel Paige

Yeah, yeah. 1,542. I'm skeeerrred.

re: #143 Karridine

Yes, Perp, I HAVE seen one of those 6th grade tests!

It appears arcane and difficult to me, now, with its furlongs and yards and other measures, but those were the measures OF THE DAY, in common use for the agrarian community of that time, and as such VERY PERTINENT to an honest, successful life in 1880's America...

And there were other aspects, social questions, Constitutional concepts, just as tough! GOOD STUFF, Kiddo!

So why aren't teachers teaching the way they taught 100 years ago? I believe it is due to mission creep. Teach a person like they did 100 years ago and college would be pretty much unnecessary for most people. Colleges would see a drop in enrollments and that hurts the pocketbook.

re: #155 FurryOldGuyJeans

Well if you went over there, then technically...

re: #141 Charles

Wow. Negative karma closely approaching number of comments.

re: #151 SWPaul

Give it ten minutes, go to LGF2, read what their new member has to say and have lolz for hours.

Funny as it is, those guys are way farther off the "beaten path" than I like to venture. At least here we have some common ground rules. Over there? Not so much. When I start reading that stuff I can actually feel myself getting loony.

Hi Lizards..
So I got a new dog a couple of weeks ago..cuter than hell..was living for a year in a polebarn..poor thing.
So yesterday i took Winston to the Vet..
Well after a thousand shots and stuff being poked up his ass and liquid stuff being poured down his nose..boy is he pissed off at me.. He is really sore and cries when you touch him..
But when i walk in the room i see that look in his eyes..Look hoopster..you stay the hell away from me..I walk towards him to pet him he cowers like i was going to abuse him..
Even now i can see him eying me across the room..
Stay away from me you bastard!..
He is pitiful..but i am laughing my ass of.

re: #160 Alouette

When my youngest son (who was just married last week) was 5 years old, someone asked him, which was his favorite Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle. He said, "I don't speak Russian."

TMNT is a Commie plot?! Pizza and lounging around are Revolutionary Measures? Doood. I didn't know.

(The Kid and I useta' fight over Mikey.)

re: #159 SWPaul

Did anyone know we were actually living in a one-party system where the theory of evolution was the only issue that one based his/her party preference on?!

It isn't.

re: #151 SWPaul

Give it ten minutes, go to LGF2, read what their new member has to say and have lolz for hours.

re: #155 FurryOldGuyJeans

I'd rather go swimming in a full cesspool, thank you very much.

I'd call such a stalker site the cesspool. I've got no desire to see something like that. The only things there are the turds Charles has flushed.

re: #163 SWPaul

Well if you went over there, then technically...

Ok, I would prefer to do a pre-frontal lobotomy on myself by shoving candy corn up my nose, thank you very much. ;)

re: #149 MandyManners

For some reason, The Kid never got into dinosaurs. He was too busy stomping butt with Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

That works, too. My oldest, the girl, is just nuts for reptiles, and the look of pure joy and wonder on her face when she saw her first dinosaur exhibit at a REAL MUSEUM (yes, Creation Museum, I'm looking at you!) and realized that these wondrous beasts once lived on the same planet that we do, was indescribable.

I can't imagine denying children that, even as I can't imagine trying to make them believe that these things co-existed with humans, and, indeed, with all other modern animals.

I smell Sarah Palin.

/she's a religious zealot psychopath committed to the concept of imposing a Christian theocracy, you betcha, don't ya know

Gotta' go beat The Kid. brb

Religion of pedophiles...
The way you Mecca me feel

MICHAEL JACKSON has become a Muslim — and changed his name to MIKAEEL.

The skint superstar, 50, donned Islamic garb to pledge allegiance to the Koran in a ceremony at a pal’s mansion in Los Angeles, The Sun can reveal.
...
Brit singer Yousef Islam, 60 — who was called Cat Stevens until he famously converted — turned up to help Jacko celebrate.

Heh.

re: #154 Oh no...Sand People!

What are you talkin about? I can't wait to see how high of marks my boy will receive in putting 'Condom on Banana' day.

/

I up dinged you for a funny post. Sadly, it is what some of our schools have descended to for current curriculum. How does that make a child ready for the world?

re: #157 Karridine

A theocratic state may NOT be the proximal outcome of a pro-ID decision, but that DECISION becomes Thin-Entering Wedge allowing the entry of other belief-systems disguised as 'science', Guan

All right, it's a good point you've got there. Hadn't thought of it like that, but you're right.

re: #165 logboy

log

/sorry, had to get that out of my system

re: #173 MandyManners

Gotta' go beat The Kid. brb

Fascist!

re: #174 Killgore Trout

Religion of pedophiles...
The way you Mecca me feel

Heh.

They are just doing as The Prophet did.

re: #174 Killgore Trout

Religion of pedophiles...
The way you Mecca me feel

Heh.

Hey. Now he can target those 6 to 9 year olds and feel good about it.
Mo approved!

re: #172 Killian Bundy

I think you have Sarah confused with Bobby? :P

re: #174 Killgore Trout

Religion of pedophiles...
The way you Mecca me feel

Heh.

Can we mail them both to Mecca in a box labeled "Mixed Nuts"?

re: #166 HoosierHoops

Hi Lizards..
So I got a new dog a couple of weeks ago..cuter than hell..was living for a year in a polebarn..poor thing.
So yesterday i took Winston to the Vet..
Well after a thousand shots and stuff being poked up his ass and liquid stuff being poured down his nose..boy is he pissed off at me.. He is really sore and cries when you touch him..
But when i walk in the room i see that look in his eyes..Look hoopster..you stay the hell away from me..I walk towards him to pet him he cowers like i was going to abuse him..
Even now i can see him eying me across the room..
Stay away from me you bastard!..
He is pitiful..but i am laughing my ass of.

Haar, 'me dogs(mates) get really nervous when they recognize we are at the vet, but I always take 'em in together, it just works better that way...

re: #167 MandyManners

TMNT is a Commie plot?! Pizza and lounging around are Revolutionary Measures? Doood. I didn't know.

(The Kid and I useta' fight over Mikey.)

He didn't know what a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle was. He thought it was some phrase in Russian. (He speaks fluent Russian now)

re: #166 HoosierHoops

The dog will crap somewhere in your house as revenge. Get him some of those green chlorophyll doggie treats. Dog's fight over them.

re: #175 Perplexed

I up dinged you for a funny post. Sadly, it is what some of our schools have descended to for current curriculum. How does that make a child ready for the world?

Exactly.

/High School Musical 3 isn't true life? (sorry...I had to throw that in there...I was forced to watch it...)

re: #182 Dark_Falcon

Another interesting tid bit...

Jackson is due to give evidence in court next week after being sued by Sheikh Abdulla bin Hamad Al Khalifa, second son of the King of Bahrain.

Sheikh Abdulla, who is seeking $US7 million ($10.7 million), claims he helped support the cash-strapped Jackson in the aftermath of his child molestation trial.

Sheikh Abdulla claims Jackson promised to pay back the money, while Jackson says he thought it was a gift.

re: #181 Thanos

I think you have Sarah confused with Bobby? :P

/Bobby?

re: #177 Killian Bundy

log

/sorry, had to get that out of my system

By Blamo!

Its fine, but if anyone starts singing "I'm a lumberjack and I'm ok..." I'll be forced to kick your ass.

re: #168 Charles

Darn! Oh well, one can dream...

Just kidding.

re: #187 buzzsawmonkey

Teachers, and parents, have been subjected to Theories of Pedagogy which have dumbed down most aspects of curriculum.

And yes, college marketing would suffer.

Sad to say, but you're right. By all measures, I'd be a freakin' moron measured against the standards of a College graduate from even 50 years ago. Today, I'm generally considered above average. It's not that I'm that smart or hard-working (I'm not) it's just that so many folks are dumber and lazier.

re: #181 Thanos

I think you have Sarah confused with Bobby? :P

/Bobby?

re: #174 Killgore Trout

Religion of pedophiles...
The way you Mecca me feel

Heh.

Shmuley Boteach is deeply disappointed, but will attempt to convince everybody that he is not really pissed.

I think these posts are running 3 to 1 off topic.

re: #188 Killgore Trout

Did the gloved one pay taxes on that gift? Inquiring minds want to know.

re: #195 theparson

I think these posts are running 3 to 1 off topic.

3 to 1? I like those odds.

re: #166 HoosierHoops
Lure him to you with a treat and then do something fun with him like "tug rope" or go for a walk. He will soon forget the bad association.

re: #185 Perplexed

The dog will crap somewhere in your house as revenge. Get him some of those green chlorophyll doggie treats. Dog's fight over them.

Winston is playing the Victim card quite nicely..he won't won't eat any of his favorite treats and has the most pitiful cute look in his eyes...
I've never had a dog or pet before..so he maybe spoiled..

re: #200 HoosierHoops

Winston is playing the Victim card quite nicely..he won't won't eat any of his favorite treats and has the most pitiful cute look in his eyes...
I've never had a dog or pet before..so he maybe spoiled..

Your dog is name after...?

re: #199 buzzsawmonkey

I'd rather have Michael Jackson convert to Islam than pretend to convert to Judaism.

Oh, that whole Kabbalah thing. His "conversion" would be about all that would be required to officially make it the single most tiresome cult since the EST.

re: #200 HoosierHoops

Yep. You are in for either a pile of crap or a chewed up article of clothing. A pissed dog does get his revenge.

re: #200 HoosierHoops

Winston is playing the Victim card quite nicely..he won't won't eat any of his favorite treats and has the most pitiful cute look in his eyes...
I've never had a dog or pet before..so he maybe spoiled..

Spoiled, you got that right. Plus he is trying to see if you are an easy mark for sympathy.

re: #205 buzzsawmonkey

You've never had a dog before? They are a pain in the ass, and absolutely wonderful.

Good practice if you're ever thinking of getting married and having kids.

Not allowing debate over untested and unproven theories “seems out of place in a free society” and is reminiscent of book-burning in Nazi Germany, he said.

Bullshit.
Evolution is neither an untested nor an unproven theory.
And Nazi bookburnings were part of an anti-scientific, anti-Semitic and anti-intellectual movement. These Nazi tactics have more in common with the dogmatic ultra-religious creationist movement than the efforts to keep religion out of the science class.

re: #174 Killgore Trout

MICHAEL JACKSON has become a Muslim — and changed his name to MIKAEEL.

Will he need to be escorted if he leaves his home?

re: #199 buzzsawmonkey

I'd rather have Michael Jackson convert to Islam than pretend to convert to Judaism.

I'm just hoping that maybe now Shmuley will stop making excuses for him(it?)

re: #208 buzzsawmonkey

It is, however, my understanding that neither wives nor children shed as much.

True, they don't lose hair, but the male's hairloss compensates.

re: #190 logboy

By Blamo!

Its fine, but if anyone starts singing "I'm a lumberjack and I'm ok..." I'll be forced to kick your ass.

Wot?

re: #208 buzzsawmonkey

It is, however, my understanding that neither wives nor children shed as much.

You never met my ex ;)

Mocking the Religious beliefs of people who differ from the "mainstream" should be beneath all of us.
Creationist activists should be treated much like the GBLT activists are treated. Politely ignored.

re: #208 buzzsawmonkey

It is, however, my understanding that neither wives nor children shed as much.

Yes, and remember that dogs do not like you running a vacuum cleaner nozzle over them in and effort to get the shed hairs at the source.

re: #214 Lincolntf

Mocking the Religious beliefs of people who differ from the "mainstream" should be beneath all of us.
Creationist activists should be treated much like the GBLT activists are treated. Politely ignored.

Now, that's some sound advice right there. Very good.

re: #215 Perplexed

Yes, and remember that dogs do not like you running a vacuum cleaner nozzle over them in and effort to get the shed hairs at the source.

But some kids don't mind at all.

re: #209 solomonpanting

Will he need to be escorted if he leaves his home?

No, but he just condemned his daughter to needing one. [spits]

re: #174 Killgore Trout

Religion of pedophiles...
The way you Mecca me feel

Heh.

Well, I remember when he was disfellowshipped from the Organization (Jehovah's Witnesses). I was a member at the time and it was a shock since Brooklyn kept his membership a secret to start with.

re: #123 FurryOldGuyJeans
I had to memorize:
30 days has Sept., April, June, and Nov, All the rest have 31,
except leap year, Feb has 29.
God bless those Nuns!

re: #217 Guanxi88

Little boys would enjoy it.

re: #201 Walter L. Newton

Your dog is name after...?

Hi Walter..Winston was living for a year in a barn in Indiana..A close friend rescued him...
Maybe they named him after their favorite cigarette..
But I tend to think he was named after one of the bravest leaders of the 20th Century..maybe a cigar...
/

re: #200 HoosierHoops

Winston is playing the Victim card quite nicely..he won't won't eat any of his favorite treats and has the most pitiful cute look in his eyes...
I've never had a dog or pet before..so he maybe spoiled..

My 2-year-old granddaughter is visiting right now. I said I would spoil her rotten but this afternoon she had a full meltdown in Walmart.

re: #207 Spare O'Lake

Bullshit.
Evolution is neither an untested nor an unproven theory.
And Nazi bookburnings were part of an anti-scientific, anti-Semitic and anti-intellectual movement. These Nazi tactics have more in common with the dogmatic ultra-religious creationist movement than the efforts to keep religion out of the science class.

Reckless hyperbole or provable fact?

re: #214 Lincolntf

Mocking the Religious beliefs of people who differ from the "mainstream" should be beneath all of us.
Creationist activists should be treated much like the GBLT activists are treated. Politely ignored.

Not if public educational materials are being corrupted.

re: #225 solomonpanting

Not if public educational materials are being corrupted.

Well, obviously, if folks start mucking about with the intellectual infrastructure, then you have to intervene. But otherwise, maybe just ignore them.

re: #162 Perplexed

So why aren't teachers teaching the way they taught 100 years ago? I believe it is due to mission creep. Teach a person like they did 100 years ago and college would be pretty much unnecessary for most people. Colleges would see a drop in enrollments and that hurts the pocketbook.

Mission creep, and the pernicious effect of Political Correctness and Leftism and More...

Look, Jesus of Nazareth voiced 3 promises in response to direct questions about the Coming of one like unto the Son of Man, and those 3 promises CAN BE SEEN (don't have to be, but CAN be seen) to have all come to completion in the year we now call 1844 or 1260, depending on calendar used.

But the LEADERS, our spiritual-social guides who'd served us so long and so faithfully for the previous 6,000 years of written history, did NOT recognize the One Who came May 23, 1844... instead choosing to martyr Him July 9, 1850, in order to 'prove' He was not the al-Qaim, the Point round which ALL the Prophets of the past revolve...

If, for the sake of discussion, He IS the One promised by Jesus, Ezekiel, Muhammad, Buddha, Habbakuk and others, IF (big if) He is the definition of what is relevant to THIS Day and THIS age, then those ecclesiastics and ecclesiastical organizations that refuse to acknowledge and align themselves with what He brings (the Oneness of Humankind, independent investigation of reality, rational soul, individual responsibility, the equality of men & women...) RELEGATE THEMSELVES to ever more marginalization of their thought, beliefs and attitudes.

If He is NOT Who He says He is, He is of no consequence and will quickly fade into oblivion, rather than have His resting-place pictured on France's recent air-postage stamp commemorating the inaugural service between France and Israel...

Teachers have 'gone wobbly' on us BECAUSE it takes courage and insight to teach reality today, especially when so many (leftists, Democrats, Marxists) have hidden agendas bolstered by obfuscation, dissembling, lying and falsehood.

re: #223 Alouette

*Shudder*

People wonder why I don't have kids; it's because of moments like that.

At least my mom could hiss, "Don't make a scene!" and I'd shut up.

First they called it "Creationism." Then that changed the term to "Creation Science." Then that changed that to "Intelligent Design." Then they try not to mention that, but instead use the phrase, "Teach the controversy" (even though there is no controversy in the scientific community).

Dare I say it...

The name of their claim keeps on...evolving!

re: #220 notutopia

I had to memorize:
30 days has Sept., April, June, and Nov, All the rest have 31,
except leap year, Feb has 29.
God bless those Nuns!

Stick your hands together and make a fist with each. Counting from Left to right on each knuckle and "valley" between the knuckles:

A knuckle has 31 days, a "valley" is 30 or less (February).

I found it easier to remember that all I needed to know how many days a month had was to make a fist with each hand. ;)

re: #213 FurryOldGuyJeans

re: #208 buzzsawmonkey
It is, however, my understanding that neither wives nor children shed as much.

You never met my ex ;)

Did she get the vacuum cleaner?

re: #214 Lincolntf

Mocking the Religious beliefs of people who differ from the "mainstream" should be beneath all of us.
Creationist activists should be treated much like the GBLT activists are treated. Politely ignored.

When they are kept in the confines of their own spheres (home / private associations etc) I would agree, but both groups have a problem with just keeping them there. They tend to spill out intentionally... and then people who just want to get on with life are forced to make decisions on what they normally wouldn't even think are questions.

re: #228 taxfreekiller

mandy manners

62,229 post

19580 + karma

31.4% postive karma feed back

forget about it tfk..
She's already got an agent..and a manager
/

re: #233 Spare O'Lake

Did she get the vacuum cleaner?

I barely was able to keep the clothes I was wearing.

re: #227 Karridine

Bahai?

re: #225 solomonpanting

Despite all my searching, I've yet to find one single public school system that teaches Creationism. Find one for me and I'll agree it should be stopped. But, using the artificial shibboleth of crazy dino-denying Christian right-wingers to justify muzzling a particular Religious denomination just doesn't pass my smell test.
I am truly concerned about the horrid state of public education, but "Creationism" is pretty close to the bottom of the list of REAL problems.

re: #21 stevieray

Doesn't Luton already have enough trouble? ;)

re: #239 Lincolntf

Bingo.

re: #237 Guanxi88

Respectfully, not here.

Part of power and control comes from disinformation and control of knowledge.

The world is flat was a theory that caused the dissenters to be in mortal danger, or shunned at best.

We have an essential responsibility to ensure the quality of curriculum that is being taught provides the sparks of interest to fuel bright minds into research and development for future technology. This is put at risk when these kinds of movements get any ground. The beginning of a brain drain as has been seen throughout history...

Keep up the fight - disseminate the evidence, maintain the integrity of what is taught. The teachers have become more and more liberal, more and more open to demanding less of the students and thus we are having a significant erosion in the capabilities of our young graduates.

One of the most exciting things in the world to see is the light bulb going off in someone who has an epiphany - and wants more. It leads to greatness. This can't be stifled!

re: #227 Karridine

Teachers have 'gone wobbly' on us BECAUSE it takes courage and insight to teach reality today, especially when so many (leftists, Democrats, Marxists) have hidden agendas bolstered by obfuscation, dissembling, lying and falsehood.

NEA Teachers Have Become Re-Educators

/that's the clear and present danger to education in this country

re: #239 Lincolntf

Despite all my searching, I've yet to find one single public school system that teaches Creationism. Find one for me and I'll agree it should be stopped. But, using the artificial shibboleth of crazy dino-denying Christian right-wingers to justify muzzling a particular Religious denomination just doesn't pass my smell test.
I am truly concerned about the horrid state of public education, but "Creationism" is pretty close to the bottom of the list of REAL problems.

Which denomination? I thought we were talking about the effort to diminish the Almighty by having people who claim to follow Him run around saying demonstrably false things about geology, biology, genetics, history, and then to have these slurs against the Almighty inserted into the curriculum of public schools.

re: #227 Karridine

Um, skip a bit, brother.

re: #239 Lincolntf

Islamic terrorism was not considered a major problem until 9/11/01 either.

re: #242 Karridine

Not a problem, just asking.

re: #238 taxfreekiller

tfk

24,096 post
8,394 + karmas
34.8% positive karma feed bag

/pretty amazing if you think about it

re: #239 Lincolntf

muzzling a particular Religious denomination

Are you impling they're being muzzled everywhere, or only in the science class?

re: #239 Lincolntf

Despite all my searching, I've yet to find one single public school system that teaches Creationism. Find one for me and I'll agree it should be stopped. But, using the artificial shibboleth of crazy dino-denying Christian right-wingers to justify muzzling a particular Religious denomination just doesn't pass my smell test.
I am truly concerned about the horrid state of public education, but "Creationism" is pretty close to the bottom of the list of REAL problems.

So, you are not concerned with this issue unless it starts happening in a school?

re: #237 Guanxi88

The concept of relevance was what I sought to develop.

IF 'equality of men and women' IS a viable, required attitudinal reality in THIS Day, then people and organizations who ignore it or work to subjugate women are doomed to marginalization and irrelevancy.

re: #222 HoosierHoops

Hi Walter..Winston was living for a year in a barn in Indiana..A close friend rescued him...
Maybe they named him after their favorite cigarette..
But I tend to think he was named after one of the bravest leaders of the 20th Century..maybe a cigar...
/

I have a nephew named Winston. knowing his father, I can guarantee he is named after the cigarette. I doubt his father was even aware England existed, much less Winston Churchill.

re: #239 Lincolntf

What particular denomination is being muzzled?

re: #238 taxfreekiller

tfk

24,096 post
8,394 + karmas
34.8% positive karma feed bag

If this is how we're doing it, here's mine:

2,671 posts
2,219 karma points
83.08% positive karma feed back

Evolution vs creationism...the least of your problems

Obama gives you Eric Holder as your new AG.

(did I hear the toilet flush, yet again?)

I'm not seeing the karma percentages (karma/comments) when clicking the football - just the count.

Do we have to do the math ourselves?

re: #251 Walter L. Newton

So, you are not concerned with this issue unless it starts happening in a school?

Worked for Clinton regarding Islamic Terrorism and attack on American interests worldwide.

re: #247 FurryOldGuyJeans

Islamic terrorism was not considered a major problem until 9/11/01 either.

Even now... most people have taken Lincolntf's advice he gives about the 'creationists' and they apply it to Islams terrorist spawn...and 'politely ignore' them...

/Hey, it didn't happen to anyone in my family...

Thank you, MandyManners, for that Rush fix. Maybe it's time for a few Rush CDs. My kids always steal my good ones. Plus, my eight-tracks are starting to squeak.

re: #252 Karridine

The concept of relevance was what I sought to develop.

IF 'equality of men and women' IS a viable, required attitudinal reality in THIS Day, then people and organizations who ignore it or work to subjugate women are doomed to marginalization and irrelevancy.

True enough, as we see every day with our own eyes.

Islam is not a religion.

It is a cult that desires total domination of a society by taking over the government. Preying on spirituality is a means to that end.