AP: There’s No Use Fighting Them

Media • Views: 2,881

It doesn’t matter to the media how badly Hamas was smacked in Operation Cast Lead, or how many top officials they lost, or how many bomb-makers were killed, or how many smuggling tunnels were destroyed. Nope. To the Associated Press, Hamas is even stronger now: Hard-liners strengthened by Gaza war.

This is one of those ludicrous media memes that refuses to die: fighting against evil only makes evil stronger. You’ll see it in articles about every conflict; it’s a kind of nihilistic philosophical tic that is nearly universal, a counterintuitive observation that’s supposed to impress you with its depth.

Here’s the dirty little secret: it’s not deep, it’s stupid. The emperor really is naked.

The question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative? Giving up?

UPDATE at 2/1/09 9:34:19 am:

Some people are actually taking this argument even farther along the road to absurdity, and claiming that Hamas “won.”

There is something perverse in the notion that Hamas “won” by merely surviving. Robert Malley has said that “for Hamas, it was about showing that they could stay in place without giving way, and from this point of view it has achieved its main objective.” This was not its “main objective” by any stretch of the imagination. Rashid Khalidi has written that “like Hizbullah in Lebanon in 2006, all [Hamas] has to do in order to proclaim victory is remain standing.” But Hamas had a specific objective—lifting the “siege”—which was altogether different from the objective of Hezbollah. This objective Hamas manifestly failed to achieve. It also failed to achieve the secondary objective it shared with Hezbollah: inflicting Israeli military casualties. It defies logic to declare the mere survival of Hamas to be a triumph, given that Hamas openly declared a much larger objective, and Israel never made the military destruction of Hamas an objective.

War is only the pursuit of politics by other means, and anything could happen going forward. Israel could forfeit its war gains by inept diplomacy—something for which there is ample Israeli precedent. Hamas could parley its setback into a diplomatic gain—something for which there is ample Arab precedent. But I think there is little doubt that at the end of the war, Israel had achieved many of its stated objectives, and Hamas had not.

Jump to bottom

239 comments
1 karmic_inquisitor  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:10:37am

It’s the left’s Mongo theory.

From Blazing Saddles ….

“Don’t shoot Mongo, you’ll just make him angry’

The left makes Blazing Saddles look like a political documentary.

2 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:11:00am
a counterintuitive observation that’s supposed to impress you with its depth

I remember a lot of this when I was smoking dope at U.W..

3 esch  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:11:07am

Well then you can be first to offer your necks on the chopping block, fools.

4 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:12:01am

The media needs to go. Our educational system needs to be cleansed from liberal. This is the only way for survival.

5 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:12:55am

I guess we can safely rewrite history.

Napoleon strengthens his position after winter retreat from Moscow.
/AP

6 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:13:05am

re: #1 karmic_inquisitor

It’s the left’s Mongo theory.

From Blazing Saddles ….


The left makes Blazing Saddles look like a political documentary.

It’s twue! It’s twue!

7 karmic_inquisitor  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:14:02am

re: #6 MandyManners

It’s twue! It’s twue!

Baby! I am not from Havana!

8 rightwinger3  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:14:33am
The question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative? Giving up?

Charles, the AP have already given up. That’s why the rest of us have to read and listen to this bullshit.

9 Erik The Red  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:14:36am

re: #2 MandyManners

I remember a lot of this when I was smoking dope at U.W..

From last thread For you 2M

10 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:14:50am

re: #5 jcm

I guess we can safely rewrite history.

Napoleon strengthens his position after winter retreat from Moscow.
/AP

‘Tis but a scratch.

11 Pastorius  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:15:01am

Great question. Well put, Charles.

12 yma o hyd  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:15:23am

Question from above:
‘The question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative? Giving up?’
Answer, from Chumpsky (see thread below):
‘Defend yourself without using force.’

Moral: Moonbats of the World, unit - you have nothing to lose but your heads - literally and figuratively.

//////

13 Dadzilla  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:15:26am

AP? Who? Oh you mean those guys with less credibility than a crack whore. If I’m eating lunch with the AP and they tell me the sun is up I go outside and look for myself.

14 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:15:58am

BTW. Just under two weeks on the job and Obama is still awful.

15 jaunte  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:16:00am

Cheap simile alert:
“Like the scarce cooking gas for which Gazans are waiting in long lines, hope is running low.”

Satire, or just bad writing?

16 Killian Bundy  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:16:09am
The question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative? Giving up?

/given what Obama’s already done in the last 12 days, I think we’re about to find out

17 Sharmuta  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:16:18am

The msm is the enemy.

18 Pastorius  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:16:20am

And, I guess we should all thank the authors of this “journalism” from the AP; Steven Gutkin and Karin Laub.

For they know better than any of us.

///

19 laxmatt1984  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:16:59am

Terrorists are the incredible hulk.

20 karmic_inquisitor  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:17:19am

re: #15 jaunte

Cheap simile alert:
“Like the scarce cooking gas for which Gazans are waiting in long lines, hope is running low.”

Satire, or just bad writing?

Incapable of satire. They take themselves too seriously.

21 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:17:27am

Come back here and take what’s coming to you. I’ll bite your legs off!

22 jaunte  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:18:03am
“For now, Hamas rulers show no signs of readiness to compromise to open the borders. But they are hearing the first rumblings of recrimination from the homeless, and their top leaders have been in hiding for a month. Yet when one of them emerged from underground on Friday, it was to declare victory.”

Groundhog day.

23 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:19:03am

re: #18 Pastorius

And, I guess we should all thank the authors of this “journalism” from the AP; Steven Gutkin and Karin Laub.

For they know better than any of us.

///

Yes they know… what the insides of their own colons look like, since that’s where their eyes must be along with the rest of their heads. Bad, bad, sick.

24 Randall Gross  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:19:03am

Madeline Albright made the same paralell with drones in Pakistan just the other day.

25 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:19:08am

OT-

Bye - matinee today (2:00pm) instead of evening show, so we don’t compete with Super Bowl, so, off to work, BBL.

26 Killgore Trout  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:19:21am

Looks like Hamas is in for round 2 of the ass kicking if they keep firing rockets.

27 Erik The Red  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:19:26am

re: #9 Erik The Red

From last thread For you 2M

Mandy you are in this video WATCH

28 gclaghorn  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:19:36am

AP Reporters: No Use Thinking

29 AemJeff  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:20:17am

I think you’re making a category error. “Hamas hardliners” and Hamas don’t necessarily have identical interests. Hamas hardliners might benefit within the organization even if the organization, as a whole, has suffered a defeat. I don’t say that’s the case, just that the headline isn’t necessarily incoherent.

30 jwpaine  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:20:29am

“What’s the alternative? Giving up?”


Bingo!

31 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:20:44am

re: #22 jaunte

Groundhog day.

That’s tomorrow. Although if we’re dealing with groundhogs and gophers, maybe Jeff can help.

32 ornery elephant  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:20:48am

Charles, this is one of the best statements you have ever made here at LGF:

This is one of those ludicrous media memes that refuses to die: fighting against evil only makes evil stronger. You’ll see it in articles about every conflict; it’s a kind of nihilistic philosophical tic that is nearly universal, a counterintuitive observation that’s supposed to impress you with its depth.

Here’s the dirty little secret: it’s not deep, it’s stupid. The emperor really is naked.


That is nothing short of spot on and the more people like you, well hell, all of us call these surrenderists out on these ludicrous statements, the closer we can get to truly ridding the world of the radicals.

It’s like that chant the Leftists came up with in Iraq ….”Al Qaeda wasn’t in Iraq until the U.S. went there!” - I mean, these people will be chiming in with “gems” like this up until the point where the saber meets their neckbone.

33 Edge  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:21:07am

The AP is one part Orwellian propaganda mill and one part stupidity.

34 Nevergiveup  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:22:25am

re: #2 MandyManners

I remember a lot of this when I was smoking dope at U.W..

U.W.?

35 MJ  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:22:37am

Here’s a useful corrective to the meme that Israel lost from Martin Kramer:

Did Hamas really win in Gaza?

[Link: sandbox.blog-city.com…]

36 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:22:57am

re: #33 Edge

The AP is one part Orwellian propaganda mill and one part stupidity.

Hmmm, the stupidity is strong with this one!

37 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:22:59am

You know, when I punched that bully in the chin back in third grade, it didn’t create more bullies. He left me alone.

38 Killian Bundy  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:23:14am

re: #24 Thanos

Madeline Albright made the same paralell with drones in Pakistan just the other day.

Pakistan Warns Obama to Halt Attacks

Islamabad urged US President Barack Obama on Saturday to halt US missile strikes on its territory after civilians were killed in the first such attacks since his inauguration.

Remote-controlled US drones fired missiles into the village of Zharki in North Waziristan on Friday, killing 22.

/you’ll notice that there haven’t been any Predator strikes inside Pakistan since

39 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:23:41am

re: #34 Nevergiveup

U.W.?

M.M. and I have the same alma mater.

40 Steve Rogers  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:24:01am

Ever notice how the media never used this rational against the Timothy McVeigh style terrorists?

41 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:24:28am

re: #39 jcm

M.M. and I have the same alma mater.

I think thats where Chris Cornell started Soundgarden.

42 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:24:30am

This reminds me of the old myth of Hercules and Antaeus. Antaeus was an enemy of Hercules whose strength came from the earth (he was the son of Gaia). Every time he was knocked to the ground he gained more strength. Hercules defeated Antaeus by lifting him up so high that he could not touch the ground his source of strength left him.

43 Nevergiveup  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:24:44am

I’m going to watch the superbowl at friend’s house. One of the few I have left, but he is another right wing fascist like me. Well that’s what the rest of our former friend’s think anyway. It will be good to be amongst friends for once.

44 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:24:45am

re: #40 Steve Rogers

Ever notice how the media never used this rational against the Timothy McVeigh style terrorists?

Because he is white.

45 earth56  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:25:12am

As a professor said on the radio a few years back ( can’t remember his name )

The problem with society these days is that they stopped teaching
Critical Thinking ” many years ago.

Google it and you’ll find out what He’s talking about and the reason you have Troofers and the like

46 SurferDoc  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:25:48am

re: #37 NYCHardhat

You know, when I punched that bully in the chin back in third grade, it didn’t create more bullies. He left me alone.

I choked mine. He would razz me after that but me never got within arms’ reach of me again.

47 Randall Gross  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:25:54am

re: #42 Alouette

This reminds me of the old myth of Hercules and Antaeus. Antaeus was an enemy of Hercules whose strength came from the earth (he was the son of Gaia). Every time he was knocked to the ground he gained more strength. Hercules defeated Antaeus by lifting him up so high that he could not touch the ground his source of strength left him.

That’s a very astute analogy. What is Hamas’ earth?

48 karmic_inquisitor  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:25:57am

re: #36 jcm

Hmmm, the stupidity is strong with this one!

Something I have never understood.

Yoda is like a thousand years old. Everyone around him speaks unaccented English. You’d think the little green fart woulda picked up the language.

/

49 Macker  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:26:04am

Hey Realwest…regarding your question from the previous thread:

CPAP

50 Nevergiveup  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:26:19am

re: #39 jcm

M.M. and I have the same alma mater.

Sounds like it was a nice place to go to school. Have the libs taken it over?

51 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:26:20am

re: #46 SurferDoc

I choked mine. He would razz me after that but me never got within arms’ reach of me again.

Problem solved.

52 jaunte  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:26:44am

More from the article:
“The crippling international blockade imposed on Gaza’s borders…”

Crippling in what way, AP?

53 gclaghorn  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:26:55am

“How can I help it?” Winston blubbered. “How can I help see what is in front of my eyes? Two and two are four.”

“Sometimes, Winston,” said O’Brien. “Sometimes they are five.”

—1984, slightly edited

54 Randall Gross  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:27:01am

Is the international press part of Hamas’ strength?

55 Macker  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:27:08am

re: #43 Nevergiveup

I’m going to watch the superbowl at friend’s house. One of the few I have left, but he is another right wing fascist like me. Well that’s what the rest of our former friend’s think anyway. It will be good to be amongst friends for once.

And who will you root for? Not the Steelers I hope.

GO CARDINALS!

56 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:27:13am

re: #47 Thanos

That’s a very astute analogy. What is Hamas’ earth?

The media.

57 SurferDoc  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:27:21am

re: #48 karmic_inquisitor

Something I have never understood.

Yoda is like a thousand years old. Everyone around him speaks unaccented English. You’d think the little green fart woulda picked up the language.

/

Stubborn, he is.

58 earth56  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:27:23am

re: #52 jaunte

More from the article:
“The crippling international blockade imposed on Gaza’s borders…”

Crippling in what way, AP?

Can’t get those HDTVs through the tunnels like before

59 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:27:24am

re: #9 Erik The Red

From last thread For you 2M

Lotsa’ sillicone.

60 majic1  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:27:31am

War never solved anything.
Except tyranny, slavery, oppression, Fascism, Communism, Nazism.

61 yma o hyd  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:27:47am

re: #52 jaunte

More from the article:
“The crippling international blockade imposed on Gaza’s borders…”

Crippling in what way, AP?

And ‘international’ in what way?
I thought it was only Israel who blockaded Gaza …

///

62 Sharmuta  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:28:17am

Reading that gave me a headache.

63 Shiplord Kirel  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:28:23am
The question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative? Giving up?

That is precisely the inference they invite. Their moonbat allies are prepared with a long list of “alternatives” that essentially grant all terrorist demands while appearing palatable to the ignorant masses of the media audience: More concessions, a quantum increase in “foreign aid,” ever greater restrictions on anti-jihad activism; in short, slavery. The groundwork for this has been laid with the constant repetition of various fantasies about the terrorists and their alleged grievances and is similarly designed to exploit the average media-slave’s abysmal ignorance of history and geopolitics. “Bomb them with food,” as one pathetic moonbat recently declared here in Lubbock.

If nothing else, the ubiquity of this meme graphically illustrates the establishment media’s conscious affinity for terrorists. It is a smoking gun.

64 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:28:26am

re: #29 AemJeff

I think you’re making a category error. “Hamas hardliners” and Hamas don’t necessarily have identical interests. Hamas hardliners might benefit within the organization even if the organization, as a whole, has suffered a defeat. I don’t say that’s the case, just that the headline isn’t necessarily incoherent.

Pardon?

65 Macker  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:28:29am

Oh, and before I forget…this is the Associated (with Terrorists) Press we’re dealing with here.
Charles, do you feel sometimes like you’re preachin’ to the Choir here at LGF? (grins)

66 yma o hyd  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:28:31am

re: #54 Thanos

Is the international press part of Hamas’ strength?

Definitely - and the UN.

67 karmic_inquisitor  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:28:38am

re: #57 SurferDoc

Stubborn, he is.

Coffee on my keyboard there now is. Out through my nose it went.

68 Charles Johnson  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:28:39am

re: #29 AemJeff

I think you’re making a category error. “Hamas hardliners” and Hamas don’t necessarily have identical interests. Hamas hardliners might benefit within the organization even if the organization, as a whole, has suffered a defeat. I don’t say that’s the case, just that the headline isn’t necessarily incoherent.

Did you read the article?

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip – The biggest gains in the Gaza war have gone to the hard-liners on both sides. Hamas is declaring victory, while Israel’s leading hawk is the front-runner in elections just over a week away.

There’s no category error here. The Associated Press always uses this ridiculous line of argument, for every single conflict, and it’s extremely easy to find more examples.

69 Erik The Red  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:28:44am

re: #59 MandyManners

Lotsa’ sillicone.

Which one is you?

70 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:28:55am

re: #34 Nevergiveup

U.W.?

University of Washington.

71 Nevergiveup  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:28:57am

re: #55 Macker

And who will you root for? Not the Steelers I hope.

GO CARDINALS!

I’m afraid so. Just habit and my wife went to school in Pittsburgh. And the numbered boxes in my betting pool work out better if the Steelers win.

72 nbenhaim  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:29:01am

actually yes, the alternative is giving up. Don’t you remember what happens at the end of the academy award winning “No Country for Old Men” ?

Tommy Lee Jones’s character gives up on fighting the evil, because it is too hard to eliminate. Unless I understood the story wrong, I think it shows they really think fighting evil is a lost cause.

73 Prince of Dorkness  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:29:05am

I’ve heard of leftards.
I’ve heard of libtards.

So with muslims, would they be mustards?

74 AemJeff  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:29:47am

re: #64 MandyManners

What’s the question?

75 pat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:30:09am

AP Headline: Newspaper Sales Plunge, Papers Stronger Than Ever

76 Macker  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:30:13am

re: #73 Prince of Dorkness

I’ve heard of leftards.
I’ve heard of libtards.

So with muslims, would they be mustards?

Hey, that is offensive to all mustards!

77 karmic_inquisitor  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:30:38am

re: #73 Prince of Dorkness

I’ve heard of leftards.
I’ve heard of libtards.

So with muslims, would they be mustards?

Or plain old “Hamas” means the same thing.

78 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:30:40am

re: #50 Nevergiveup

Sounds like it was a nice place to go to school. Have the libs taken it over?

Yeah, I was in a class and the subject was Israel v. the Pali. I was arguing with a long hair dope smoking keffiyah wearing hippie freak. I basically laid out Nekema’s Troll hammer plus who controlled the territory and when for the last 3000 years.

When I was done with people, places, names, dates, facts and figures. His response?

“You’re just ignorant!”

I won over have the class based on his total dismissive comment.

79 FrogMarch  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:31:09am

The AP can ES& D.

80 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:31:31am

re: #69 Erik The Red

Which one is you?

*whack*

81 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:31:48am
82 karmic_inquisitor  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:31:51am

re: #75 pat

AP Headline: Newspaper Sales Plunge, Papers Stronger Than Ever

Let’s all boycott the Associated Press so they can become stronger!

83 Nevergiveup  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:31:57am

re: #78 jcm

Yeah, I was in a class and the subject was Israel v. the Pali. I was arguing with a long hair dope smoking keffiyah wearing hippie freak. I basically laid out Nekema’s Troll hammer plus who controlled the territory and when for the last 3000 years.

When I was done with people, places, names, dates, facts and figures. His response?

“You’re just ignorant!”

I won over have the class based on his total dismissive comment.

Kudos.

84 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:32:35am

re: #74 AemJeff

What’s the question?

I was asking you to explain the bolded sentence which was

“Hamas hardliners” and Hamas don’t necessarily have identical interests.
85 jaunte  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:32:40am

What difference is there between “Hamas hardliners” and Hamas? Are they not governed by the same charter? If so, how can there be such a thing as a moderate Hamas member?

86 Randall Gross  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:32:53am

With Obama as president and the Dems in control, then the press needs to cut the terrorists off from their strength or earth if they have any hopes of Obama succeeding against terror. Time they retired this meme for their guy’s benefit n’est ce pas?

87 Sharmuta  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:32:57am
Some areas of Gaza have been reduced to moonscapes of flattened buildings. The stench of rotting livestock killed in Israeli airstrikes fills the air, and thousands of Gazans live in rubble or in tents provided by relief agencies.

Where is the paragraph describing Israelis hunkering in bunkers to avoid hamas rockets, their homes damaged, their people wounded?

88 gatorbait  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:33:11am

the question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative?

Don’t just fight them, KILL THEM. How’s the concept of ANNIHILATION as an alternative?

89 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:33:30am

re: #87 Sharmuta

Where is the paragraph describing Israelis hunkering in bunkers to avoid hamas rockets, their homes damaged, their people wounded?

under the bus.

90 tokyobk  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:33:41am

The only reason Japan looks the way it does today is because of the complete annihilation of state sponsored Shinto and Emperor worship. Japan was destroyed with no hope of recovery in the same form.

The citizens of Tokyo suffered disproportionate horror like Gaza cannot imagine; a terrible price for supporting a brutal regime.

91 Erik The Red  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:34:06am

re: #80 MandyManners

*whack*

Ouch. First 10 seconds is your icon. Who did you think I was talking about?

92 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:34:16am

re: #87 Sharmuta

Where is the paragraph describing Israelis hunkering in bunkers to avoid hamas rockets, their homes damaged, their people wounded?

And, where’s the paragraph outlining what Hamas has done to clean up the dead animals, to take care of the basic needs of the Gazans?

93 Cathypop  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:34:22am

re: #81 NYCHardhat

I thought this would be useful.


That’s a page that is kept hidden from all AP employees

94 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:34:23am

re: #81 NYCHardhat

I thought this would be useful.

That means we abhor inaccuracies, carelessness, bias or distortions. It means we will not knowingly introduce false information into material intended for publication or broadcast; nor will we alter photo or image content. Quotations must be accurate, and precise.

It means we always strive to identify all the sources of our information, shielding them with anonymity only when they insist upon it and when they provide vital information – not opinion or speculation; when there is no other way to obtain that information; and when we know the source is knowledgeable and reliable.

It means we don’t plagiarize.

It means we avoid behavior or activities that create a conflict of interest and compromise our ability to report the news fairly and accurately, uninfluenced by any person or action.

It means we don’t misidentify or misrepresent ourselves to get a story. When we seek an interview, we identify ourselves as AP journalists.

It means we don’t pay newsmakers for interviews, to take their photographs or to film or record them.

It means we must be fair. Whenever we portray someone in a negative light, we must make a real effort to obtain a response from that person. When mistakes are made, they must be corrected – fully, quickly and ungrudgingly.

And ultimately, it means it is the responsibility of every one of us to ensure that these standards are upheld. Any time a question is raised about any aspect of our work, it should be taken seriously.

*snort* *choke*

95 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:34:32am

re: #92 MandyManners

And, where’s the paragraph outlining what Hamas has done to clean up the dead animals, to take care of the basic needs of the Gazans?

under the bus.

96 FrogMarch  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:34:35am

AP also pimping for the Steelers.

I have nothing against the Steelers- they are a very good team. But I’m rooting for the Cardinals. The true under-dogs!


AP headline: Dynasty Ready for Doormat—- Steelers, facing dysfunctional Cards, seek sixth Super Bowl Title.

AP knows Obama is rooting for the Steelers. I guarantee that if Obama were rooting for the Cards, the headline would be different.

97 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:34:38am

re: #91 Erik The Red

Ouch. First 10 seconds is your icon. Who did you think I was talking about?

I saw that. I was thinking about sillicone.

98 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:34:42am

re: #29 AemJeff

I think you’re making a category error. “Hamas hardliners” and Hamas don’t necessarily have identical interests. Hamas hardliners might benefit within the organization even if the organization, as a whole, has suffered a defeat. I don’t say that’s the case, just that the headline isn’t necessarily incoherent.

I agree with Charles. Your comment is naive hairsplitting at best, sir.

99 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:35:00am

re: #94 Alouette

*snort* *choke*

I know, right?

100 summergurl  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:35:05am

re: #88 gatorbait

the question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative?

Don’t just fight them, KILL THEM. How’s the concept of ANNIHILATION as an alternative?

And destroy the schools in which this vile ideology is taught

101 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:35:26am

re: #95 NYCHardhat

under the bus.

What bus? Hamas has converted useful shit into rockets.

102 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:35:32am

re: #93 Cathypop

That’s a page that is kept hidden from all AP employees

good one!

103 Erik The Red  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:35:41am

re: #97 MandyManners

I saw that. I was thinking about sillicone.

OK so am I now///

104 MJ  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:35:43am

More about how Israel “lost”:

‘Who Has Won Here?’

“…I used to support Hamas because they fought for our country, for Palestine,” says Sadala. Hamas stood for a new start, for an end of corruption, which had spread like cancer under the moderate Fatah. In the 2006 elections Hamas won the majority with their message of change, said Sadala, who earned a living in the building business. Gesticulating wildly, the 52-year-old surveyed the ruins of the bedroom: “That is the change that they brought about. We were blasted back 2,000 years.”

[Link: www.spiegel.de…]

105 Sharmuta  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:35:46am

re: #86 Thanos

At the diplomatic level, change may also be coming.

This line surprised me, because I thought that’s what the msm helped get elected: change! Now it’s reduced to a maybe?

106 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:35:49am

re: #101 MandyManners

What bus? Hamas has converted useful shit into rockets.

Obama’s big bus.

107 esch  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:35:57am

re: #94 Alouette

You’ve got to be FREAKING kidding me. It’s true, nobody believes they are a villain, especially when they are.

108 rawmuse  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:35:58am

To the AP, evil has street cred.

109 jaunte  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:36:08am

re: #93 Cathypop

“Under AP’s rules, material from anonymous sources may be used only if:

1. The material is information and not opinion or speculation, and is vital to the news report.
2. The information is not available except under the conditions of anonymity imposed by the source.
3. The source is reliable, and in a position to have accurate information.”

Ha.

110 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:36:41am

re: #83 Nevergiveup

Kudos.

I take perverse pleasure being contrarian in a very blue area.

111 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:36:46am

I’m thinking we’re about to get edumacated by a hatchling.

112 gclaghorn  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:37:20am

re: #81 NYCHardhat

I thought this would be useful.

If you thought that was hilarious, wait till you hear this: the New York Times has a stylebook.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

113 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:37:30am

re: #106 NYCHardhat

Obama’s big bus.

He better not park it in Gaza. It’ll disappear.

114 FrogMarch  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:37:39am

Hamas is a sick pack of death cult losers. No matter how you slice it.


“This is one of those ludicrous media memes that refuses to die: fighting against evil only makes evil stronger. You’ll see it in articles about every conflict; it’s a kind of nihilistic philosophical tic that is nearly universal, a counterintuitive observation that’s supposed to impress you with its depth.”
115 jones  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:37:46am

By the AP’s standards, Uday and Qusay have us right where they want us.

116 earth56  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:37:54am

Another fine read in case you missed it

jackEnglehard…

” Frankly, given a choice, I prefer the skinheads and other brutes who express their anti-Semitism openly. In such places, we know the enemy.

But please spare me the pieties and the righteous indignation of those “good people” protesting throughout Europe against Israel’s defensive operation in Gaza. True, thousands have taken up banners in support of Israel………………………………..

117 Nevergiveup  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:37:58am

re: #110 jcm

I take perverse pleasure being contrarian in a very blue area.

Me to when my wife will let me.

118 traderjoe9  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:38:02am
The question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative? Giving up?

That’s simply because liberals value terrorists more than they value their own people. I’ve never in my life imagined that such a large group of people could demand “humane” treatment for terrorists, yet at the same time try to convict our own government officials for some bullshit reasons.

Screw liberals.

119 Killian Bundy  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:38:06am

re: #88 gatorbait

Don’t just fight them, KILL THEM. How’s the concept of ANNIHILATION as an alternative?

/how many do you want to annihilate?

120 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:38:09am

re: #115 jones

By the AP’s standards, Uday and Qusay have us right where they want us.

LOL!

121 FrogMarch  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:38:09am
This is one of those ludicrous media memes that refuses to die: fighting against evil only makes evil stronger. You’ll see it in articles about every conflict; it’s a kind of nihilistic philosophical tic that is nearly universal, a counterintuitive observation that’s supposed to impress you with its depth.


for got to say —bingo.

122 jaunte  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:38:09am

So, where are the Hamas moderates that the headline suggests by describing ‘hardliners?’

123 FrogMarch  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:38:41am

forgot.

124 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:39:10am

re: #112 gclaghorn

If you thought that was hilarious, wait till you hear this: the New York Times has a stylebook.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Table Etiquette
By Jeffrey Dahmer

125 Erik The Red  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:39:24am

re: #111 MandyManners

I’m thinking we’re about to get edumacated by a hatchling.

Who is doing the emancipation 2M?

126 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:39:28am

re: #122 jaunte

So, where are the Hamas moderates that the headline suggests by describing ‘hardliners?’

They are the ones the hardliners gave flying lessons to.

127 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:39:28am

Bueller?

128 least  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:39:43am

To most of the MFM, it’s much more important to fit in with their peers than to get to real truth of matters.
Definitely a Borg-like collective hive mind.
I think the rise of the collective started with when Woodward and Bernstein inspired lots of clueless, directionles folks who wanted to be famous, too.

129 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:39:53am

re: #124 NYCHardhat

Table Etiquette
By Jeffrey Dahmer

Family Values.
Charles Manson

130 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:40:04am

re: #125 Erik The Red

Who is doing the emancipation 2M?

AemJeff.

131 Cathypop  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:40:39am

re: #130 MandyManners

AemJeff.

Bingo!

132 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:40:43am

re: #129 jcm

Family Values.
Charles Manson

Religion of Peace
Osama Bin Laden

133 gclaghorn  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:41:38am

re: #130 MandyManners

AemJeff.

Would this be the same AemJeff?

134 Ojoe  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:41:47am
The question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative? Giving up?

Give up may ass. Here is what Winston Churchill has to say:

135 jaunte  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:41:56am

re: #126 jcm

The story has a lot of built in assumptions.


“The world is being asked to cough up an estimated $2 billion to rebuild Gaza, and that gives it leverage to make Hamas cooperate with the rival Abbas government in rebuilding the territory. At the same time, the reconstruction task ahead makes the West’s blockade look increasingly unsustainable.”

And if the world doesn’t cough up, what then?

136 Prince of Dorkness  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:41:59am

re: #76 Macker

re: #73 Prince of Dorkness

I’ve heard of leftards.
I’ve heard of libtards.

So with muslims, would they be mustards?

Hey, that is offensive to all mustards!

My apologies to any and all mustards I may have offended

137 kcladderman  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:42:00am

re: #29 AemJeff

I think you’re making a category error. “Hamas hardliners” and Hamas don’t necessarily have identical interests. Hamas hardliners might benefit within the organization even if the organization, as a whole, has suffered a defeat. I don’t say that’s the case, just that the headline isn’t necessarily incoherent.

Great start there Jeff

138 Ojoe  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:42:09am
“If you will not fight for the right when you can easily win without bloodshed; if you will not fight when your victory will be sure and not too costly; you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all the odds against you and only a small chance of survival. There may even be a worse case: you may have to fight when there is no hope of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves.” -


Churchill.

139 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:42:25am

re: #132 NYCHardhat

Religion of Peace
Osama Bin Laden

Christian Love & Charity
Rev. Fred Phelps.

140 Sharmuta  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:42:41am
But Hamas had a specific objective—lifting the “siege”—which was altogether different from the objective of Hezbollah. This objective Hamas manifestly failed to achieve. It also failed to achieve the secondary objective it shared with Hezbollah: inflicting Israeli military casualties. It defies logic to declare the mere survival of Hamas to be a triumph, given that Hamas openly declared a much larger objective, and Israel never made the military destruction of Hamas an objective.

Martin Kramer nails it, but the msm isn’t intellectually honest enough to come to even this relatively simple-to-grasp conclusion. Shameful on their part.

141 summergurl  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:42:58am

re: #129 jcm

Family Values.
Charles Manson

Candle Making
Bill Ayers

142 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:42:58am

Equal Rights Amendment
The Taliban.

143 gclaghorn  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:44:08am

Patriotism for Dummies
Rev. Jeremiah Wright

144 realwest  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:44:12am

Well I for one certainly hopes Hamas wins EVEN BIGGER next time around!
/
Boy the way the MSM strains to get a Hamas “victory” out of Cast Lead is just almost incomprehensible.

145 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:44:36am

re: #133 gclaghorn

Would this be the same AemJeff?

Thats interesting.

146 SurferDoc  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:44:44am

Hamas Moderates only want to kill half of the Jews.

147 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:44:54am

re: #133 gclaghorn

Would this be the same AemJeff?

upding on the detective work

148 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:44:59am

re: #135 jaunte

The story has a lot of built in assumptions.

And if the world doesn’t cough up, what then?

I wonder how much of that $2 billion would be for previously existing conditions?

Lot of money goes, little gets done other than Thugs padding their pockets and rockets fired at Israel.

They are sitting on a cash cow resort property. Let them take out loans and earn their $2 billion.

Other than that they can go fish.

149 karmic_inquisitor  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:45:00am

Audacity of Hope
Barack Obama

150 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:45:54am

re: #138 Ojoe

Churchill.

Great and true words. Sadly, the AP does not understand them. They are unable to see that sometimes peace can’t be maintained until the other side has been brought low. They cannot except the reality of evil and thus will never be free unless they are kept so by better people than themselves. That last was an adaptation of John Stuart Mill.

151 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:46:08am

re: #141 summergurl

Candle Making
Bill Ayers

LMAO!

152 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:46:13am

Gonna’ have to collect the book list….

Lizards Recommend Reading List!
////////////////////////////////////////

153 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:46:24am

re: #149 karmic_inquisitor

Audacity of Hope
Barack Obama

Another home run!

154 jaunte  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:46:39am

re: #148 jcm

Right now the U.S. is paying about 31% of the fare for the Gazans, but the AP writers might have noticed that money’s getting tight.

155 Ojoe  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:46:52am

Boy the way the MSM strains to get a Hamas “victory” out of Cast Lead is just almost incomprehensible.

Fixed.

156 gclaghorn  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:46:58am

re: #147 NYCHardhat

upding on the detective work

Thank you.

157 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:47:11am

re: #150 Dark_Falcon

Great and true words. Sadly, the AP does not understand them. They are unable to see that sometimes peace can’t be maintained until the other side has been brought low. They cannot except the reality of evil and thus will never be free unless they are kept so by better people than themselves. That last was an adaptation of John Stuart Mill.

I think they cannot see evil because they’ve not been taught about it and, they want to believe we’re all good at heart.

158 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:47:30am

How to save money
Barney Frank

159 earth56  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:48:00am

Book writing for Dummies

Joe Biden

160 Sharmuta  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:48:04am

I thought “to victors go the spoils” so why do the gazans need to beg for anything if they were so victorious?

161 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:48:08am

re: #149 karmic_inquisitor

Audacity of Hope
Barack Obama

Actually, Rev. Wright’s speech came to fit Obama, because BHO molded himself to fit it. Wright was a key father figure for him.

162 summergurl  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:48:10am

re: #158 NYCHardhat

How to save money
Barney Frank

Mortgage 1 2 3
Chris Dodd

163 realwest  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:48:23am

re: #68 Charles
Good morning Charles!
I never realized that there was a diffence between “Hamas Hardliners” and “Hamas”. They are all murdering s.o.b.’s and they STILL provide in the Hamas Charter for the death of every Jew, every Israeli and the death and destruction of Israel itself.
The MSM just using another false construct.

164 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:48:52am

How I won the war,
Saved South East Asia,
and Got America out of a Quagmire.
John Kerry

165 kcladderman  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:48:57am
166 gman  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:49:02am

T

he question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative? Giving up?

May I humbly suggest that what is needed here is a nice cup of Tazo Calm Tea and some warm conversation.

/

167 Nevergiveup  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:49:16am

re: #162 summergurl

Mortgage 1 2 3
Chris Dodd

How to reheat leftovers
George Mitchell

168 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:49:17am

re: #162 summergurl

Mortgage 1 2 3
Chris Dodd

Real Estate Made Easy
Harry Reid

169 doppelganglander  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:49:20am

re: #157 MandyManners

I think they cannot see evil because they’ve not been taught about it and, they want to believe we’re all good at heart.

It’s that goddamn Jean-Jacques Rousseau. Noble savage my ass. One of the most destructive forces of the last 500 years.

170 summergurl  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:49:38am

re: #164 jcm

How I won the war,
Saved South East Asia,
and Got America out of a Quagmire,
All while sitting in my boat.
John Kerry

Added a line for you…

171 pianobuff  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:49:40am

Magic Tricks and Illusions Guaranteed to Fool Your Audience
Al Gore

172 Prince of Dorkness  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:49:44am

re: #146 SurferDoc

Hamas Moderates only want to kill half of the Jews.

No, I think they only want to kill all the juice, but only kill them a little.

173 vagabond trader  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:49:45am

Bury My Heart at U of C

Ward Churchill

174 Sharmuta  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:49:57am

re: #150 Dark_Falcon

To leftists Evil is the victim of Good. The msm does what it can to make sure Evil has a sympathetic appeal to others and that Good looks like a bully.

175 Jimmah  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:49:59am
There is something perverse in the notion that Hamas “won” by merely surviving. Robert Malley has said that “for Hamas, it was about showing that they could stay in place without giving way, and from this point of view it has achieved its main objective.” This was not its “main objective” by any stretch of the imagination

Their objective was to get bullshit like this into the mainstream press. And the only people who could achieve that “victory” for them was - the mainstream press.

176 Ojoe  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:50:03am

re: #169 doppelganglander

Noble savage is 180 degrees wrong.

177 doppelganglander  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:50:38am

re: #168 jcm

Real Estate Made Easy
Harry Reid

Tax Compliance
Tom Daschle and Timothy Geithner

178 esch  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:50:38am

re: #157 MandyManners

I think they cannot see evil because they’ve not been taught about it and, they want to believe we’re all good at heart.

I blame their fathers, largely. Part of a father’s job is to teach their kids life’s not fair, there often is injustice, and there are some really monstrous people out there that WILL NOT reform and WILL rape/kill/enslave them if given half a chance.

179 rwmofo  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:50:41am

HAMAS won?

This reminds me of the ex “winning” when she got the furniture - furniture that was used when I bought it when I was 22-23. I conceded defeat by buying myself new furniture. Man that new couch stuck with me throughout the “mourning” period. Heh.

180 unrealizedviewpoint  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:50:43am

re: #157 MandyManners

I think they cannot see evil because they’ve not been taught about it and, they want to believe we’re all good at heart.

Add to that that some within this MFM may be evil themselves.

181 realwest  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:50:44am

re: #78 jcm
Hey jcm! I just wish you’d won over the class with
people, places, names, dates, facts and figures.

182 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:50:48am

How to run a strong campaign
John McCain

183 karmic_inquisitor  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:50:51am

Tax Strategies of the Elite
Tom Daschle

184 pianobuff  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:50:55am

TurboTax for Dummies
Tim Geithner

185 earth56  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:51:05am

Summer resorts in Southeast Asia

Jane Fonda

186 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:51:18am

re: #157 MandyManners

I think they cannot see evil because they’ve not been taught about it and, they want to believe we’re all good at heart.

They have had ample opportunity to learn: George W. Bush tried to teach them, so have many soldiers and other citizens. They will not listen.

187 karmic_inquisitor  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:51:26am

re: #177 doppelganglander

Tax Compliance
Tom Daschle and Timothy Geithner

GMTA

188 Nevergiveup  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:51:41am

re: #185 earth56

Summer resorts in Southeast Asia

Jane Fonda

Tax Tips
Charlie Rangle

189 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:51:44am

How to Make Friends and Influence Enemies.
Jimmy Carter

190 Shiplord Kirel  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:51:49am

Among other factors:
The primitive and violent thought processes of the Muslim terrorist are a mirror image of the crude, linear, emotion-laden sound-bite style of the modern media.

While AP is a print medium, it functions in an industry, and a subculture, whose modes of expression are determined by television: short attention span, high drama, tight time constraints. The emotional and the simplistic have a decided advantage in gaining and maintaining the attention of the audience. This is especially true now, after 50 years or more of indoctrination and conditioning of that audience. The ultimate objective, of course, is to sell goods and services through less than rational appeals. Even, or perhaps especially, non-commercial media like PBS and BBC must adhere to the same formula, since it is necessary for them to compete for the same audience in order to justify their existence.

Beyond that, with cynicism and skepticism about the media growing by the hour in the west, the media lords must look with covetous eyes upon the gullible, naive, and increasingly wealthy masses of the Muslim world.

If war is an extension of diplomacy by other means, then terrorism is an extension of advertising by other means.

The media ARE the enemy.

191 Scannit  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:52:17am

So Hamas is Rocky, and the IDF is Apollo Crede.. Rocky ‘Won’ by going the distance.. Our new hero, Hamas… Let’s all cheer for them….

This just goes to show that the de-press’d is not living in reality…

192 debutaunt  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:52:33am

re: #15 jaunte

Cheap simile alert:
“Like the scarce cooking gas for which Gazans are waiting in long lines, hope is running low.”

Satire, or just bad writing?

That’s contest winning material!

193 pianobuff  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:52:36am

Fun Driving Tours in Cape Cod
Ted Kennedy

194 realwest  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:52:42am

re: #81 NYCHardhat
Whatever made you think that was useful? The folks at AP clearly have never seen it before!

195 earth56  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:52:57am

How to make friends with only peanuts

Jimmy Carter

196 MandyManners  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:53:01am

re: #178 esch

I blame their fathers, largely. Part of a father’s job is to teach their kids life’s not fair, there often is injustice, and there are some really monstrous people out there that WILL NOT reform and WILL rape/kill/enslave them if given half a chance.

Ummmm…you don’t need a penis to teach that lesson.

197 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:53:30am

re: #181 realwest

Hey jcm! I just wish you’d won over the class with
people, places, names, dates, facts and figures.

Really, but half where like my opponent the other half, had a light bulb moment.
“Wait a minute, one guys talks in platitudes the other has facts”

I think if he hadn’t been so dismissive most of them would have missed it.

Sad, very sad.

198 SurferDoc  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:53:42am

re: #172 Prince of Dorkness

Hamas Moderates only want to kill half of the Jews.

No, I think they only want to kill all the juice, but only kill them a little.

I had to rethink that after I posted. Hamas moderates want to kill them all. The hardliners want to kill them all more.

199 NYCHardhat  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:53:47am

re: #194 realwest

Whatever made you think that was useful? The folks at AP clearly have never seen it before!

Useful for making jokes. I know, I’m such a kid.

200 n in wi  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:53:49am

“The question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative? Giving up?”

The left’s mindset is to make no judgment, or have no discrimination. Even so far as to not judge or discriminate good from evil.
If nothing is neither good nor evil,then there is no need for conflict,and the Utopian world will be ushered in.
A mature adult view recognizes evil,and is willing to confront it. This is human nature,and because of political correctness and the like,the left will suppress their judgments,and it will be manifested in hatred for conservatism.

201 abolitionist  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:54:15am

Mohammedans’ concept of mercy is a sharp blade and maybe a few seconds allowed for conversion.

About that recent killing of a female grad student at Virginia Tech, initial reports were grossly inconsistent. Some said the murder occurred in a dorm, others said in a coffee shop area of the student union near the Drill Field, and that police arrived a mere 3 minutes or so after the “fatal stabbing” and arrested the killer at the scene.

A friend of the family informed me recently that the perp was holding the victim’s severed head when police arrived. Anyone here come across such details in media news sources?

I’m recalling that note pinned to Theo’s chest in Amsterdam. You know, that dodenlist, that Declaration of War on the Netherlands, Europe, the USA, the West, and all of Dar ul Harb.

202 FrogMarch  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:54:17am

Jimmy Carter is a walking apartheid state.

203 vagabond trader  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:55:15am

OT- Just returned from the local grocery. Some stinking leftist actually had the nerve to steal my reuseable shopping bag out of the cart. I am sure the low life hypocrite feels real good about saving the environment now.

204 pianobuff  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:55:36am

My Favorite Poems
Rod Blagojevich

205 realwest  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:56:16am

re: #97 MandyManners
You were thinking about sillicone? NO - Mandy from everything you’ve ever said out here about your looks, height, weight and the rest, you are a beautiful woman and you surely don’t need any sillic……..uh,
no wait a minute, that’s not what you were saying.
nevermind.

206 vagabond trader  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:56:59am

How to Impress and Pick Up Unattractive Women-International Version

BJ Clinton

207 FrogMarch  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:57:12am

re: #158 NYCHardhat

How to save money
Barney Frank

How to create a strong economy by lending money to people who cannot pay it back.
-or-

How to use government entities as personal piggy bank.

208 n in wi  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 9:57:56am

Salesmanship for dummies
Rod Blagovich

209 Ayatollah Ghilmeini  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:01:39am

A few more victories like this and there won’t be a single terrorist alive in Gaza.

There may be some rockets and mortars being fired but Hamas has announced it is not them. Of course they are responsible but they know as we know that Israel will come right back in if the firing does not stop. All the rockets, all the shooting. It is not Israel being spared, it is Hamas. The borders are not being thrown open. It is regrettable that Israel’s current leadership did not make Shalit’s return a condition of cease fire. That was the single major failing of their leadership in the war.

210 Jimmah  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:02:49am

Speaking of whackings, here’s my favourite whacking from the Sopranos.

ENJOY >:D

211 nyc redneck  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:11:29am

the left talks too much.

212 jcm  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:15:03am

re: #210 Jimmah

Speaking of whackings, here’s my favourite whacking from the Sopranos.

ENJOY >:D


[Video]

Pfft… phony. A head would stop an SUV rolling that slowly….

213 Randall Gross  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:15:36am

re: #178 esch

I blame their fathers, largely. Part of a father’s job is to teach their kids life’s not fair, there often is injustice, and there are some really monstrous people out there that WILL NOT reform and WILL rape/kill/enslave them if given half a chance.

besides that they’ll take their lunch money too.

214 Randall Gross  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:16:39am

Understanding Financial Derivatives and Leveraged Risk - Alan Greenspan

215 debutaunt  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:17:51am

re: #210 Jimmah

Speaking of whackings, here’s my favourite whacking from the Sopranos.

ENJOY >:D

Tony Soprano to long-winded story teller. Did I interrupt one of your impermeable stories? (I love some of the writing!)

216 guest77  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:18:01am

Fighting them will not make them stronger, but they will keep coming back like cockroaches. Unfortunately, since it refuses to re-take Gaza, Israel is destined to always be fighting these death loving fanatics for eternity I’m afraid.

217 anotherindyfilmguy  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:20:07am

Of course Hamas won… their big goal, besides wiping out Israel, is to not get wiped out by Israel until Israel is gone…

Of course Israel won because it stopped the rockets for a few days wile killing lots of Hamassholes as a sop to the electorate before elections… oh wait… there’s reports of more mortars and rockets being lobbed into Israel today…

Wonder if some more “disproportionate” half-measures will be taken about them?

218 Achilles Tang  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:22:24am

Saddam Hussain supposedly said that he had won in the first Gulf war, when he heard in amazement that we declared a stop, unilaterally. Fundamentally he was correct.

This of course is not a defense of the MSM for being the mouthpiece of terrorists and dictators.

219 Dwayne  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:25:27am

One thing I’ve found about many leftists is they seem to live in a delusional world where there is some sort of truth about life found in the arts, instead of just being the works of a mere human with some profound flaws.

That being said, I don’t find it at all surprising that this meme of ‘fighting an enemy makes it stronger’ is quite prevalent in literature and movies, and that leftist believe it whole heartedly.

220 Pianobuff  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:29:29am

Birdcalling Made Easy
Eleanor Clift

221 Shay4l  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:34:34am

Couple more wins like that, they’ll all have their virgins.

222 AemJeff  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:53:12am

re: #84 MandyManners

Assume that Hamas hardliners are cynical and care more about running the show in Gaza than they they care about the health and welfare of Gazans. Then even if their actions hurt Hamas in the short term, and assuming (and I see no reason not to make the assumption right now) that Hamas retains power in Gaza - so long as their power within the party is strengthened then their interests have been served. Regardless of the effect on everybody else.

223 Jimmah  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 10:59:04am

re: #212 jcm

To me, that’s like saying “Pffft. Sunflowers don’t really look like that”.

It’s ART.

224 uptight  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 11:11:17am

Charles said:

The question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative? Giving up?

Talking to them, of course. The UN should employ the diplomatic service of some wise “Elder” like Sting to just sit down with Hamas. Hamas love Sting, especially his 1985 Jazz-infused album “The Dream of the Blue Turtles”.

Hamas would surely listen to the opinions of wise celebrities like Richard Branson, Sean Penn, Bono and Jimmy Carter.

They could sit down with Hamas in an atmosphere of peace and mutual respect and persuade them to give up their religious quest to restore the caliphate. Heck, they’ll probably have Hamas chugging a few beers and recognising Israel’s right to exist by the end of the evening.

225 uncleFuzzy  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 11:17:00am

Having read in it’s entirety what Kramer wrote, I have to agree with him

226 solomonpanting  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 11:21:31am
There is something perverse in the notion that Hamas “won” by merely surviving.

Cockroaches survive.

227 DrCruel  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 11:48:58am

Unfortunately for Hamas, teh Palestinian people weren’t convinced. It was relatively easy for reporters to tfind people in Gaza that blamed the conflict on Hamas, and hated them for it - this despite the very real danger of what Hamas people do to those amongs their charges that dare to speak out against them.

Hamas was terribly weakened in this latest confrontation - fatally so, if Israel follows it up. That is why it is so critical, for those that support Hamas, to give their favorite terrorist faction a breather. Since some of these people are in teh press, and as counter-intuitive mantras have worked in the past, it is no surprise to hear them again.

228 wiffersnapper  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 11:50:46am

SCOREBOARD

229 Globular Cluster  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 12:02:43pm
The question they never ask: if fighting terrorists only makes more terrorists, and only makes hard-liners stronger in every case, what’s the alternative? Giving up?

More severe, I think, is that they never make the reverse statement:

“Blowing up more Americans only makes more Americans.”

230 Syrah  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 12:03:22pm

Jihad is a sacrament.

As long as there are people willing and able to carry out the sacramental obligation of Jihad, the war is not over. It can only end when Jihad is no longer a sacrament.

The blessing of the Paradise of eternal carnal delights that is promised to the shahid is given to those that die while engaged in Jihad, not necessarily to those that survive the battle. The ultimate victory for the Jihady is to die while engaged in Jihad, barring that, any battle that leaves him alive, gives him another chance to die while engaged in Jihad.

231 Render  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 1:38:57pm

The are no “softliners” in HAMAS.

Or Fatah, or any other Islamic terrorist organization.

TO
ME,
R

232 tsionguy  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 3:13:34pm

After years of playing human punching bags, in the run-up to the Israeli elections, Olmert, Livni and Barak found their mojo and finally fought back. Today, there were more rockets fired into Israel, and Livni replied:
“With the resumption of the rocket attacks, the response must be harsh and immediate.”
[Link: news.yahoo.com…]
The answer to this conflict is crystal clear: Israel should hold elections every month.

233 Steve_NO  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 4:46:03pm

a few more such victories and Hamas will be extinct…..Allah be praised.


I hope Bebe continues the process of purging these swine from the neighborhood. Not that Fatah is any bargain, but one hopes they will take a lesson from the number of their Hamas colleagues turned into body parts and liquids.

234 Steve_NO  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 4:52:08pm

re: #212 jcm

want to volunteer your head for the experiment? didn’t think so.

235 PayBackTime  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 6:56:20pm

Don’t fight the nazis, you’ll just make more nazis.

If the MSM of today existed in WW2 and reported sympathetically towards nazis and nazi “civilians”, SHITler would have won WW2.

236 PayBackTime  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 7:01:09pm

re: #193 pianobuff

Fun Driving Tours in Cape Cod
Ted Kennedy

“Autumn foliage drives with Leon Spinks”

237 missykrissy  Sun, Feb 1, 2009 11:25:33pm

Gee - and the deader they are the more in place they will stay.
I suggest we encourage such ‘victory’.

238 Ezekiel2517  Mon, Feb 2, 2009 6:54:40am

They’re not dead, they’re just resting!

/

239 Ron Shaw  Mon, Feb 2, 2009 9:19:28am

It is painfully true that in politics perception becomes reality…and with the perennial assistance of the MSM the reported message, ad nausea, is that terrorist thugs like Hamas ‘always win’ even when they lose. Thus, the oft reported and repeated twisted absurdity perception emerges as the ‘reality’ for some that Hamas always wins. Pure self-serving propaganda comes to mind here.

Liberals worldwide have mastered the black art of perception weaponry and their collective agendas are never driven by or contingent upon truth or facts. Lies become their reality and anything to the contrary simply does not exist or as Al Gore has said, ‘Debate over’, millions upon millions of innocent people were never murdered by Communist ‘leaders’, the Holocaust never happened, Fidel Castro is cool, Che even cooler, terrorists are groovy, etc….around and around it goes. ‘Freedom fighters’ more times than not are fighters against freedom which affectively explains why liberals embrace ‘freedom fighters’ and refuse to acknowledge ‘terrorists.’


This article has been archived.
Comments are closed.

Jump to top

Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT
LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds

Help support Little Green Footballs!

Subscribe now for ad-free access!Register and sign in to a free LGF account before subscribing, and your ad-free access will be automatically enabled.

Donate with
PayPal
Cash.app
Recent PagesClick to refresh
A Closer Look at the Eastman State Bar DecisionTaking a few minutes away from work things to read through the Eastman decision. As I'm sure many of you know, Eastman was my law school con law professor. I knew him pretty well because I was also running in ...
KGxvi
1 hour ago
Views: 67 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 1