Lots of support for book-banning in the comments at Hot Air, following Allahpundit’s citing my post on Geert Wilders: Geert Wilders: The British government proved they’re “the biggest cowards in Europe today”.
(Also lots of hatred directed at little old me. I’m crushed. OK, now I’m over it.)
1 |
Nevergiveup Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:11:53pm |
The British government proved they’re “the biggest cowards in Europe today”
That’s something to be the biggest cowards in Europe.
2 |
The False God Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:13:39pm |
It’s hard to walk the principled path, Charles. People expect you to either be with them or you’re the enemy. Reasons don’t matter, just allegiance.
3 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:14:17pm |
Phew, I’m glad you’re over it quickly.
But I still have a man-hug for ya if ya need one. ;)
/I appreciate your efforts. I raise in virtual mug in your virtual direction. May your detractors develop limps, pimples, and pimply limps.
4 |
logboy Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:14:27pm |
I nominate Of Pandas and People for the first banned book.
5 |
capitalist piglet Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:14:27pm |
(Also lots of hatred directed at little old me. I’m crushed. OK, now I’m over it.)
You’d never make it at FreeRepublic, Charles.
/snort
7 |
Big Steve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:14:42pm |
People think LGF is a hate site but actually what attracts me here is the goal is NOT to expel, kill, or subjugate Islam….not the goal of this site is to protect ourselves from Islam killing us.
| 8 |
logboy Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:15:00pm |
re: #4 logboy
I nominate Of Pandas and People for the first banned book.
Oops, forgot the sarc tag
////////////
| 9 |
Big Steve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:15:44pm |
re: #8 logboy
Oops, forgot the sarc tag
////////////
no it won’t burn because you can’t reduce it’s complexity to ashes.
10 |
DisturbedEma Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:16:35pm |
Adara is ready to chew through her bassinette to get to me…better go feed my baby lizards…
Peace out all:)
11 |
Bubblehead II Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:16:49pm |
From the Hot Air Comments section.
I wouldn’t rely upon Charles Johnson as a sole source of infomration these days, since he has been severing ties with former allies and accusing them of fascism or supporting fascism for several months now.
Strange, I thought you ( and a few other Lizards) had not only proven they were fascist, but that by associating with them (vb et al), they were legitimizing them much to their own detriment.
12 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:16:51pm |
the cult-driven LGF and its Hubbard-like Johnson
I’ve never been insulted before by being told I have a “Hubbard-like Johnson”. That’s a new one.
| 13 |
The False God Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:17:02pm |
What if it was something like the compiled IRS income tax code, laws, and procedures?
What if it combusted under its own mass? Is that being anti-free speech?
14 |
godfrey Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:17:35pm |
“Cult-driven”? That’s rich, coming from “Aryan Nation” types.
15 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:17:53pm |
If being conservative means practicing fascism, then count me out.
16 |
joncelli Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:17:59pm |
Banning only makes people want something more than otherwise. Let the Koran be read; people of good conscience will find it horrifying and want nothing to do with it.
| 17 |
Code Red 21 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:18:03pm |
OT
Sean Hannity is reporting that Senator Gregg has withdrawn his nomination as Commerce Secretary. Wonder why?
| 18 |
TimC Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:18:04pm |
Speaking of banning books (tangentially) - THIS is real, these idiots actually passed the thing. overlawyered.com
From post on vintage books: “I just came back from my local thrift store with tears in my eyes! I watched as boxes and boxes of children’s books were thrown into the garbage!”
Particularly galling is the youth motorcycle/ATV provision. WTF.
19 |
Killian Bundy Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:18:10pm |
Judd Gregg just withdrew his name for Commerce Secretary.
/now he can vote against Porkapalooza!
| 20 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:18:14pm |
I’ve been told my Johnson is Hubble-like, but that’s different.
21 |
LGoPs Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:18:16pm |
(Also lots of hatred directed at little old me. I’m crushed. OK, now I’m over it.)
I’m worried Charles. By my estimation, you were crushed for 2.3 nanoseconds. That’s way too long, by about 2.2 nanoseconds………
| 22 |
leww37334 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:18:24pm |
I’m trying to figure this out, the title was about conservatives who want to ban books. Maybe a little more accurate would be this guy wants to ban the Koran. But it appears we are no longer looking for accuracy.
| 23 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:18:40pm |
re: #12 Occasional Reader
I’ve never been insulted before by being told I have a “Hubbard-like Johnson”. That’s a new one.
Does this mean Charles gets a big yacht, and we are but lowly cabin boys?
If so, I’m sorry, but I have a sudden root-canal that needs doing and can’t make it.
/
| 24 |
joncelli Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:19:02pm |
re: #17 Code Red 21
He probably got word that the Democrats were going to renege on their deal to put a Republican in his place.
| 25 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:19:33pm |
| 26 |
Code Red 21 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:20:38pm |
re: #24 joncelli
Could be. Why anyone would trust those SOB’s is beyond my comprehension.
27 |
Stuck-in-CA Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:20:41pm |
O/T-
Hannity just announced that Judd Gregg withdrew his name for the cabinet seat. I haven’t seen anything on Drudge. Anyone know anything?
| 30 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:21:07pm |
re: #25 OldLineTexan
Over-priced, somewhat myopic, and in need of modification?
No. Heavenly.
thbbbbbt
| 31 |
Nevergiveup Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:21:08pm |
re: #19 Killian Bundy
Judd Gregg just withdrew his name for Commerce Secretary.
/now he can vote against Porkapalooza!
That is quit the kick in the teeth to Obama. I guess Gregg realized he was just window dressing. I wonder when that is gonna occur to Hilliary?
32 |
BBEV Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:21:32pm |
Sorry OT just in on Drudge
Gregg withdraws nomination for Commerce Secretary
I’m so happy about this
34 |
loppyd Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:21:49pm |
re: #19 Killian Bundy
Judd Gregg just withdrew his name for Commerce Secretary.
/now he can vote against Porkapalooza!
BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHA
| 35 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:21:49pm |
Supporting Free Speech by banning any that one doesn’t like. Why do the Fascists sound so much like Progressives?
36 |
seekeroftruth Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:21:50pm |
re: #27 Stuck-in-CA
O/T-
Hannity just announced that Judd Gregg withdrew his name for the cabinet seat. I haven’t seen anything on Drudge. Anyone know anything?
Drudge has the siren now.
37 |
Taqyia2Me Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:21:50pm |
re: #23 OldLineTexan
Does this mean Charles gets a big yacht, and we are but lowly cabin boys?
If so, I’m sorry, but I have a sudden root-canal that needs doing and can’t make it.
/
Apparently, some used private jets are about to be on the market if the yacht thing doesn’t work out. By private jets, I do not mean Nancy Pelosi’s personal use jumbo jet, compliments of our tax dollars. That one is NOT on the market.
38 |
BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:21:57pm |
| 40 |
Nevergiveup Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:22:35pm |
I guess nominating a guy for Commerce and then dissing him by taking the census away from him ain’t the smartest thing to do?
41 |
Killer Tomato Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:22:41pm |
Excuse me, but Gregg didn’t vote on the porkfest bill, did he?
| 42 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:23:08pm |
If Wilders were merely making that point that “under the same stupid ‘hate speech’ laws you use to ban criticism of Islamism, you should be banning the Koran for hate speech”, I could agree with him. But no, it appears that he really, truly wants to ban the Koran. He’s not just making a point.
43 |
Shiplord Kirel Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:23:12pm |
re: #23 OldLineTexan
Does this mean Charles gets a big yacht, and we are but lowly cabin boys?
If so, I’m sorry, but I have a sudden root-canal that needs doing and can’t make it.
/
Now you know what “Shiplord” really means. Buwaaahaaahaaa!
| 44 |
loppyd Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:23:12pm |
Gregg statement on his withdrawal:
Sen. Gregg stated, “I want to thank the President for nominating me to serve in his Cabinet as Secretary of Commerce. This was a great honor, and I had felt that I could bring some views and ideas that would assist him in governing during this difficult time. I especially admire his willingness to reach across the aisle.
“However, it has become apparent during this process that this will not work for me as I have found that on issues such as the stimulus package and the Census there are irresolvable conflicts for me. Prior to accepting this post, we had discussed these and other potential differences, but unfortunately we did not adequately focus on these concerns. We are functioning from a different set of views on many critical items of policy.
“Obviously the President requires a team that is fully supportive of all his initiatives.
“I greatly admire President Obama and know our country will benefit from his leadership, but at this time I must withdraw my name from consideration for this position.
“As we move forward, I expect there will be many issues and initiatives where I can and will work to assure the success of the President’s proposals. This will certainly be a goal of mine.
“Kathy and I also want to specifically thank Governor Lynch and Bonnie Newman for their friendship and assistance during this period. In addition we wish to thank all the people, especially in New Hampshire, who have been so kind and generous in their supportive comments.
“As a further matter of clarification, nothing about the vetting process played any role in this decision. I will continue to represent the people of New Hampshire in the United States Senate.”
| 45 |
loppyd Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:23:35pm |
re: #41 Killer Tomato
Excuse me, but Gregg didn’t vote on the porkfest bill, did he?
no - but he can now!
| 46 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:23:35pm |
re: #32 BBEV
Sorry OT just in on Drudge
Gregg withdraws nomination for Commerce SecretaryI’m so happy about this
Any reason given yet?
I won’t be surprised if non-payment of taxes gets bandied about.
47 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:23:40pm |
re: #22 leww37334
I’m trying to figure this out, the title was about conservatives who want to ban books. Maybe a little more accurate would be this guy wants to ban the Koran. But it appears we are no longer looking for accuracy.
Hey, let’s keep it accurate. I wrote ‘conservatives’, with the quotes.
So you’re only in favor of banning ONE book, is that it? Just one little book. What could go wrong with that?
| 48 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:23:43pm |
re: #38 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey
There’s a Milky Way joke there somewhere.
Let’s leave poor Ms. Hayek out of this, shall we? I think we’ve abused her enough.
49 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:24:19pm |
re: #32 BBEV
Sorry OT just in on Drudge
Gregg withdraws nomination for Commerce SecretaryI’m so happy about this
I wonder if he has a ‘taxing’ problem to solve?
| 50 |
loppyd Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:24:27pm |
re: #46 FurryOldGuyJeans
Any reason given yet?
I won’t be surprised if non-payment of taxes gets bandied about.
See my 44 -
51 |
Killgore Trout Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:24:28pm |
AllahPundit sure takes a lot of shit on his own site. It’s odd that so many of his readers hate him.
52 |
NY Nana Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:24:30pm |
Bulletin on my newsradio station, from CBS news…not an article yet:
‘Commerce Secretary nominee Judd Gregg(R) withdraws over philosophical differences with President Obama’…stimulus crap was his reason.
That makes 2…Richardson and Gregg…
I love this! ;)
| 53 |
BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:24:41pm |
re: #48 Occasional Reader
Let’s leave poor Ms. Hayek out of this, shall we? I think we’ve abused her enough.
Well, she does have a heavenly body.
54 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:24:44pm |
| 56 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:25:20pm |
re: #22 leww37334
So you get the Koran banned. What’s to stop someone getting the Bible banned one day? NOTHING.
| 57 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:25:51pm |
Here are the teo books that are banned from my house
| 59 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:25:52pm |
re: #44 loppyd
as I have found that on issues such as the stimulus package and the Census there are irresolvable conflicts for me
WOW!
That’s a swift kick in the Hubbard-like Johnson of Obama! Especially the mention of the Census issue, which the MSM has been quiet about. Good for him!
60 |
lawhawk Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:26:11pm |
Perhaps people would be better served by reading books instead of banning them. /prof. jones sr.
| 62 |
Killian Bundy Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:26:29pm |
re: #41 Killer Tomato
Excuse me, but Gregg didn’t vote on the porkfest bill, did he?
/nope, he reused himself
| 63 |
joncelli Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:26:29pm |
re: #52 NY Nana
‘Commerce Secretary nominee Judd Gregg(R) withdraws over philosophical differences with President Obama’…stimulus crap was his reason.
Uh, he just now figured that out?
64 |
Kailen Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:26:33pm |
I don’t see any reason why books shouldn’t be banned.
I mean, wasn’t giving everyone in America a Kindle 2 part of the new stimulus bill anyway? We can read everything digitally now, who needs books?
| 66 |
Last Mohican Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:26:49pm |
re: #57 DeafDog
Here are the teo books that are banned from my house
Eew. Those were really disturbing.
| 67 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:26:58pm |
re: #50 loppyd
See my 44 -
You expect me to actually read?!? PUH-LEEZE! Just tell me again why! ;)
The statement he gave is just vague enough to support he got caught being another tax dodger.
68 |
MrSilverDragon Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:27:07pm |
re: #22 leww37334
It’s a slippery slope. Ban one book, set presidence to ban another, and so on. And who gets to chose? Bad idea all around.
| 69 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:27:10pm |
“Standing still is the surest way of falling behind.” - Genius Obama
| 70 |
james37211 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:27:13pm |
re: #12 Occasional Reader
Maybe it´s a typo. Howsabout,¨Hubble-like Johnson¨ Happy now?
| 71 |
loppyd Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:27:19pm |
re: #59 Occasional Reader
WOW!
That’s a swift kick in the Hubbard-like Johnson of Obama! Especially the mention of the Census issue, which the MSM has been quiet about. Good for him!
Maybe he was going to hold his nose over the stimulus, but the census being handed to Rham Emanuel was too much?
I am pleasantly surprised. This is so bad for Barry.
| 72 |
Maine's Michael Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:27:26pm |
I think if Wilders had to start this thing over again, he’d say something like:
“The Koran contains some pretty nasty stuff, just like the bible does. The bible has been discussed and reinterpreted for more than a thousand years, and the religions which draw upon the bible have evolved into humane movements.
The Koran, on the other hand, is held out as an immutable text that must be taken literally, and for hundreds of millions of people, even talking about reinterpretations is anathema, worthy of death.
Well, if they won’t let you talk about it and try and reinterpet it, the book is so toxic you may as well ban it.
It is as if Mein Kampf could only be referred to as the true word of God.
No one cares that Mein kampf is available, because everyone is free to debunk it at will, and it has been ridiculed and debunked, and so disempowered.
Not so the Koran. Open it to discussion or criticism, or ban it from our sight.
Do not impose it upon us as the word of God, for it is a hateful screed that taken literally, leads to violence and genocide.’
Or maybe he would say something shorter and more to the point …
| 73 |
seekeroftruth Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:27:35pm |
Pence: Remove Gregg or give him Census
House Republican Conference Chairman Mike Pence (Ind.) said Thursday that President Obama should pull his nomination of GOP Sen. Judd Gregg (N.H.) as Commerce secretary or give Gregg oversight of the Census Bureau.
| 74 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:27:39pm |
| 75 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:27:44pm |
| 76 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:27:48pm |
| 77 |
lawhawk Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:28:15pm |
re: #59 Occasional Reader
Yes, but he had to know that he was going to have to bend over and contort himself into a pretzel to follow Obama’s directives. I guess he realized just how much of a contortionist he would have to be? Heck, it would probably kill a professional.
| 78 |
loppyd Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:28:30pm |
re: #67 FurryOldGuyJeans
You expect me to actually read?!? PUH-LEEZE! Just tell me again why! ;)
The statement he gave is just vague enough to support he got caught being another tax dodger.
Here:
“As a further matter of clarification, nothing about the vetting process played any role in this decision. I will continue to represent the people of New Hampshire in the United States Senate.”
79 |
Basho Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:28:34pm |
lol
Poor Allahpundit. He’s one of the most entertaining and fun conservative commentators on the internet, but his website’s own members are some of the most creepy, hateful, and just plain stupid people the internet has to offer. I hope AP is having fun in the process, I don’t know how I would react if I was in his shoes.
| 80 |
Opinionated Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:28:53pm |
re: #32 BBEV
Sorry OT just in on Drudge
Gregg withdraws nomination for Commerce Secretary
Obama can’t fill a Cabinet properly but, hey, trust him on the economy, on foreign affairs, with our security- what could go wrong.
| 81 |
Shiplord Kirel Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:29:00pm |
Any decent cult needs a system of ranks. Here are my suggestions for the revised LGF double-secret rank system:
Hatchling
Apprentice
Regular
Lizardoid
Lizardoid First Class
Honco, Junior Grade
Lieutenant Honco
Vice-Honco
Shiplord
Exalted Shiplord
82 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:29:05pm |
re: #47 Charles
Hey, let’s keep it accurate. I wrote ‘conservatives’, with the quotes.
So you’re only in favor of banning ONE book, is that it? Just one little book. What could go wrong with that?
If “Dreams of My Father” had been banned….
83 |
mean Gene Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:29:07pm |
re: #11 Bubblehead II
From the Hot Air Comments section.
I wouldn’t rely upon Charles Johnson as a sole source of infomration these days, since he has been severing ties with former allies and accusing them of fascism or supporting fascism for several months now.
Strange, I thought you ( and a few other Lizards) had not only proven they were fascist, but that by associating with them (vb et al), they were legitimizing them much to their own detriment.
IF they were already ”fascists” they wouldn’t NEED to associate with anyone else in particular to be fascists.
IF, on the other hand, they became ”fascists” BY merely associating with someone else who is termed a fascist we will all have to move into mountain top monasteries.
Jesus said we must be NO PART of THIS WORLD.
Charles has made a great case for such a high level of purity-in-association that either we all will soon have to leave this world altogether!
OK, actually, Jesus didn’t even demand that.
He said keep yourself clean and be loving and kind to even your enemies…..otherwise you would have to get out of this world altogether.
He also said, as far as it is in your own control, be peaceable with ALL men.
Maybe if LGF cuts off enough impure bloggers, Anti-Islamist sites and news sites we will never have to be bothered by having to be exposed to such awful thinkers and can just sit back and congratulate one another on our purity in our computer room hideouts until the Jihad reaches us each individually and we are taken out and (you know what Islamist mobs do when they find a weakling Infidel, Jew or Christian amongst themselves, right?)
| 84 |
MrSilverDragon Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:29:08pm |
re: #57 DeafDog
Here are the teo books that are banned from my house
Just think of them as manuals to teach you NOT what to do.
| 86 |
BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:29:15pm |
re: #57 DeafDog
Here are the teo books that are banned from my house
I just threw up a little in my mouth.
| 87 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:29:15pm |
re: #71 loppyd
I am pleasantly surprised. This is so bad for Barry.
Nothing is bad for Barry! Why, just this morning NPR described the Porkulus vote as a “decisive political triumph” for Obama. Yep, it’s well-nigh a miracle that he managed to get a Congress dominated by his own party to pass a law he favored!
| 89 |
mean Gene Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:29:48pm |
re: #19 Killian Bundy
Judd Gregg just withdrew his name for Commerce Secretary.
/now he can vote against Porkapalooza!
whew!
That’s big news!
Did the MSM bury it or spin it?
| 91 |
BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:30:02pm |
re: #81 shiplord kirel
Any decent cult needs a system of ranks. Here are my suggestions for the revised LGF double-secret rank system:
Hatchling
Apprentice
Regular
Lizardoid
Lizardoid First Class
Honco, Junior Grade
Lieutenant Honco
Vice-Honco
Shiplord
Exalted Shiplord
What about Chief Petty Honco?
| 92 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:30:03pm |
re: #69 DistantThunder
“Standing still is the surest way of falling behind.” - Genius Obama
So instead, he intends to take us backwards?!
93 |
freedombilly Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:30:09pm |
Charles, you should be honored by these morons spewing hatred in your direction.
| 94 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:30:23pm |
re: #80 Opinionated
Obama can’t fill a Cabinet properly but, hey, trust him on the economy, on foreign affairs, with our security- what could go wrong.
What does this say about his leadership abilities? Obama’s back in campaign mode - the crowd is very quiet.
| 95 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:31:01pm |
| 96 |
lawhawk Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:31:04pm |
re: #87 Occasional Reader
Nothing is bad for Barry! Why, just this morning NPR described the Porkulus vote as a “decisive political triumph” for Obama. Yep, it’s well-nigh a miracle that he managed to get a Congress dominated by his own party to pass a law he favored!
And which doesn’t need a single GOP vote to pass (cloture notwithstanding).
| 97 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:31:04pm |
re: #54 DistantThunder
Another one bites the dust.
[Video]Turn it WAY up.
I did…I always liked those guys….Freddies cool with me
| 98 |
mockery jones Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:31:06pm |
re: #35 FurryOldGuyJeans
Supporting Free Speech by banning any that one doesn’t like. Why do the Fascists sound so much like Progressives?
At this point there the only difference between the progressives and the fascists is the content of their messages.
proponents of either viewpoint demand that you surrender the ability to think for yourself.
proponents of both viewpoints vilify anyone who chooses not to accept their invitation to do their thinking for them.
| 100 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:31:14pm |
re: #89 mean Gene
whew!
That’s big news!
Did the MSM bury it or spin it?
Headline Drudge with siren….another black eye for the president.
| 101 |
loppyd Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:31:20pm |
re: #87 Occasional Reader
Nothing is bad for Barry! Why, just this morning NPR described the Porkulus vote as a “decisive political triumph” for Obama. Yep, it’s well-nigh a miracle that he managed to get a Congress dominated by his own party to pass a law he favored!
I guess they didn’t mention the 3 repubs and one dying dem wheeled in off of his death bed to pass it, huh?
Did you see that the VP of NPR wants Juan Williams to stop using his NPR affiliation when on Fox?
I’ll look for the link.
102 |
Creeping Eruption Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:31:26pm |
| 104 |
NY Nana Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:31:40pm |
| 105 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:31:46pm |
re: #65 buzzsawmonkey
What is this reading of which you speak?
Something people used to do before they got all their information about reality before we had the modern media.
Take rectangular and flattened amounts of dried woodpulp, affix blobs of suspended coloring agents onto the pulp in certain patterns, bundle more and more scraps of pulp together, and let people view the patterned blobs to visualize actual words and concepts.
106 |
Empire1 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:31:56pm |
re: #81 shiplord kirel
I rather like it … well, as long as I at least make Regular! How do you propose awarding these ranks?
Any decent cult needs a system of ranks. Here are my suggestions for the revised LGF double-secret rank system:
Hatchling
Apprentice
Regular
Lizardoid
Lizardoid First Class
Honco, Junior Grade
Lieutenant Honco
Vice-Honco
Shiplord
Exalted Shiplord
| 107 |
debutaunt Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:31:58pm |
re: #49 DeafDog
I wonder if he has a ‘taxing’ problem to solve?
I hope he’s stunned by the porkulus and the plans for the census, which appear to be a giant Obamandering to divvy states up into nice portions.
| 109 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:32:19pm |
re: #94 DistantThunder
What does this say about his leadership abilities? Obama’s back in campaign mode - the crowd is very quiet.
“And Catepiller will be the one providing the equipment to build those bridges” Pause for applause. Dead quiet.
“politics has to stop.”
Now he tells us.
| 110 |
Jr Ewing Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:32:20pm |
Geert Wilders was all over the Spanish news :o
| 111 |
midwestgak Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:32:28pm |
| 112 |
Killgore Trout Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:32:29pm |
re: #72 Maine’s Michael
Instead of trying to utilize unfair and oppressive laws for his own purposes he should have proposed free speech for everybody. The problem happens when people push these unfair laws in pursuit of their own private agenda. It’s the wrong approach and only makes the problem worse.
| 114 |
Opinionated Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:33:13pm |
re: #94 DistantThunder
What does this say about his leadership abilities?
Did anyone ever claim that he had leadership abilities?
It was sufficient that he could read a teleprompter and send a tingle up some legs.
| 116 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:33:20pm |
re: #78 loppyd
I still think he saw the handwriting on the wall and withdrew before any indiscretion became public.
Not that being another Dem bloc voter is all that bad, anyway.
117 |
Silhouette Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:33:25pm |
| 118 |
loppyd Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:33:25pm |
The screaming Drudge headline:
OBAMA BURNED: GREGG WITHDRAWS AFTER POLICIES TOO MUCH TO STOMACH
| 119 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:33:38pm |
re: #81 shiplord kirel
Any decent cult needs a system of ranks. Here are my suggestions for the revised LGF double-secret rank system:
Hatchling
Apprentice
Regular
Lizardoid
Lizardoid First Class
Honco, Junior Grade
Lieutenant Honco
Vice-Honco
Shiplord
Exalted Shiplord
OK, but does our cult uniform have to be a snuggie?
| 120 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:33:47pm |
Senator Gregg just earned a tremendous amount of respect from me. I’m sure he cares, but, he did.
| 121 |
Kailen Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:34:01pm |
re: #64 Kailen
Obviously this joke failed. Or people read the first sentence and freak. *shrug*
| 122 |
BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:34:14pm |
re: #113 Ringo the Gringo
What!…LGF isn’t a cult?
You mean I shaved my head for nothing?
Your head? Man, that’s not what I had to shave!
| 123 |
Silhouette Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:34:20pm |
re: #113 Ringo the Gringo
What!…LGF isn’t a cult?
You mean I shaved my head for nothing?
Do snuggies have hoods?
| 124 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:34:30pm |
re: #118 loppyd
The screaming Drudge headline:
OBAMA BURNED: GREGG WITHDRAWS AFTER POLICIES TOO MUCH TO STOMACH
Awesome! Obama stood up for the prom.
| 125 |
loppyd Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:34:34pm |
re: #116 FurryOldGuyJeans
I still think he saw the handwriting on the wall and withdrew before any indiscretion became public.
Not that being another Dem bloc voter is all that bad, anyway.
We shall see, but I think he’s telling the truth. He’s a sitting senator and has had to provide income disclosure forms regularly.
126 |
bulwrk Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:34:34pm |
re: #31 Nevergiveup
“However, it has become apparent during this process that this will not work for me as I have found that on issues such as the stimulus package and the Census there are irresolvable conflicts for me.
Sounds like he did not agree with the zeros plans to manipulate the census.
| 127 |
Killgore Trout Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:34:36pm |
re: #91 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey
Haw about Assistant to the Assistant Regional Lizardoid?
129 |
Dianna Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:34:40pm |
I don’t believe anything should be banned.
If Lovecraft’s Necronomicon existed, I’d want to be able to access it.
| 131 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:35:17pm |
There is almost no cheering nor applause in Peoria - it is dead quiet. i’ve never heard a speech like this for him. He’s talking faster and faster.
| 132 |
loppyd Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:35:23pm |
re: #124 DistantThunder
Awesome! Obama stood up for the prom.
Keith Olberdink’s massive head might explode tonight.
Andrea Mitchell might just cry.
I F*CKING LOVE IT!
| 133 |
Nevergiveup Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:35:42pm |
re: #126 bulwrk
“However, it has become apparent during this process that this will not work for me as I have found that on issues such as the stimulus package and the Census there are irresolvable conflicts for me.
Sounds like he did not agree with the zeros plans to manipulate the census.
Yup
| 136 |
BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:36:07pm |
re: #124 DistantThunder
Awesome! Obama stood up for the prom.
That’s good news - Michelle would have been his date.
| 137 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:36:12pm |
re: #115 buzzsawmonkey
Cool. I love vintage technology.
I guess the woodpulp comes from that “analog” I’ve been hearing about.
Something like that. ;)
| 138 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:36:17pm |
re: #113 Ringo the Gringo
What!…LGF isn’t a cult?
You mean I shaved my head for nothing?
maybe this green lizard tat on my forehead was not a good idea after all
| 139 |
Opinionated Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:36:28pm |
re: #118 loppyd
The screaming Drudge headline:
OBAMA BURNED: GREGG WITHDRAWS AFTER POLICIES TOO MUCH TO STOMACH
Maybe - among other such policies- he did not believe we should support a proud member of the Axis of Evil.
News emerged this week that the U.S. Department of Commerce has just approved a license allowing Boeing (nyse: BA - news - people ) to go ahead with major overhauls of two 747 jetliners belonging to Syria’s state-owned Syrian Arab Airlines. The administration itself has been coy on the subject. In response to my query, a Commerce spokesman e-mailed a statement that such license requests are granted on a case-by-case basis, and Commerce cannot comment on specific instances.
More eagerly, Syria’s state news agency hustled out an announcement on Tuesday, Feb. 10, saying that the “U.S. Trade Department agrees to provide spare parts for rehabilitating Syrian Airlines.”
| 140 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:36:30pm |
re: #81 shiplord kirel
I hereby appoint myself “Vice-Honco”.
A list of approved vices will follow shortly.
| 141 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:36:44pm |
re: #30 Occasional Reader
No. Heavenly.
thbbbbbt
You forgot to seal the air-valve properly. Again.
/
| 142 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:36:55pm |
Gregg finds the President corrupt! - DT headline
| 143 |
BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:36:58pm |
re: #135 Ringo the Gringo
So if LGF isn’t a cult, does that mean I’m free to go home now?
Go home? You already are home. Now shut up & eat your gruel.
144 |
Dustyvet Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:37:18pm |
re: #47 Charles
Hey, let’s keep it accurate. I wrote ‘conservatives’, with the quotes.
So you’re only in favor of banning ONE book, is that it? Just one little book. What could go wrong with that?
Book Banning…bet you can’t just do one…
with apology’s to an old Lay’s ad
| 146 |
lawhawk Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:37:31pm |
Hmmm.. what would have been the outcry if Bush did something like this? Preselecting questioners at the presser?
Of course, the WH Press Corps went along with this and didn’t even make mention of that very policy in their own reporting.
[deleted]
| 147 |
BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:37:35pm |
re: #131 DistantThunder
There is almost no cheering nor applause in Peoria - it is dead quiet. i’ve never heard a speech like this for him. He’s talking faster and faster.
Countdown to him dropping an f-bomb…
| 148 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:37:37pm |
re: #125 loppyd
We shall see, but I think he’s telling the truth. He’s a sitting senator and has had to provide income disclosure forms regularly.
And that worked with Daschele’s nomination how?
| 149 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:37:38pm |
re: #113 Ringo the Gringo
What!…LGF isn’t a cult?
You mean I shaved my head for nothing?
Ask the castrati to weep for you. Those guys ex-guys really went all-in on the cult.
/
| 150 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:37:42pm |
| 152 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:37:44pm |
Judge Nepolitano said that the President didn’t want to count heads but use computer models that would increase dem totals.
| 153 |
LGoPs Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:37:47pm |
re: #87 Occasional Reader
Nothing is bad for Barry! Why, just this morning NPR described the Porkulus vote as a “decisive political triumph” for Obama. Yep, it’s well-nigh a miracle that he managed to get a Congress dominated by his own party to pass a law he favored!
In my world NPR would be a prime candidate for the Fairness Doctrine since it uses public money.
But in the Alice in Wonderland world we live in, nobody even notices the hypocrisy…..
| 154 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:37:53pm |
re: #132 loppyd
Keith Olberdink’s massive head might explode tonight.
Andrea Mitchell might just cry.
I F*CKING LOVE IT!
a real shitstorm that would be
| 155 |
Killer Tomato Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:38:13pm |
re: #126 bulwrk
“However, it has become apparent during this process that this will not work for me as I have found that on issues such as the stimulus package and the Census there are irresolvable conflicts for me.
Sounds like he did not agree with the zeros plans to manipulate the census.
He’s my Senator - sometimes he’s a little too “reach across the aisle” for me, but I’ve never been greatly disappointed until he agreed to the Cabinet position.
Right now, I’m happy.
| 156 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:38:19pm |
re: #148 FurryOldGuyJeans
And that worked with Daschele’s nomination how?
Daschle’s not a sitting Senator. He cashed in.
157 |
Randall Gross Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:38:25pm |
It’s a sad state of affairs when the extremists here lend credence to the worries expressed in POS movies like Michael Moore’s Fahrenheit 911. Pretty soon we won’t be able to call that fatass mendacity mogul a moonbat anymore.
| 159 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:38:30pm |
re: #107 debutaunt
post 44 gave the real reason…..a pretty stinking rebuke of BHO in political speak.
161 |
turn Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:38:43pm |
and this:
“Wilders is in full-on social/political warfare mode, ready to fight at the level of his enemies if necessary (e.g. make alliances with those whose immediate strategic usefulness outweighs their moral/political incompatibility). Charles at LGF is still in a peace-time mode of threading the ethical/moral needle.
The only sure thing about the way things stand is that Wilders will eventually prove the most prepared, if Charles’s worst enemies (the Jihadists) continue to succeed and prosper. Charles is certainly currently the moral superior, but that won’t amount to much if he’s forced to give it all up anyway (and behind the strategic eight-ball, to boot).”
social/political warfare vs ethical/moral peace-time modes, heh
| 162 |
midwestgak Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:38:43pm |
re: #131 DistantThunder
There is almost no cheering nor applause in Peoria - it is dead quiet. i’ve never heard a speech like this for him. He’s talking faster and faster.
Where are you watching/listening to this?
| 163 |
BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:38:43pm |
re: #148 FurryOldGuyJeans
And that worked with Daschele’s nomination how?
Puff Dash isn’t a sitting Senator.
| 164 |
loppyd Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:38:46pm |
| 165 |
NY Nana Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:38:47pm |
re: #108 mean Gene
What?
Me Worry?
Wouldn’t he be a better choice that even Hussein, when we look at the schmucks we have to deal with? Bet not one of his sycophants will be in office at the end of The One’s first term, which I hope will be this week.
166 |
Eowyn2 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:38:54pm |
re: #81 shiplord kirel
Any decent cult needs a system of ranks. Here are my suggestions for the revised LGF double-secret rank system:
Hatchling
Apprentice
Regular
Lizardoid
Lizardoid First Class
Honco, Junior Grade
Lieutenant Honco
Vice-Honco
Shiplord
Exalted Shiplord
I was told there wouldnt be a test.
Honco is a vice?
| 167 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:38:56pm |
re: #129 Dianna
I don’t believe anything should be banned.
If Lovecraft’s Necronomicon existed, I’d want to be able to access it.
Well, fine. But when your dabblings awaken Cthulhu from his aeons-long slumber, we’re directing him to your house first.
| 168 |
loppyd Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:39:11pm |
re: #148 FurryOldGuyJeans
And that worked with Daschele’s nomination how?
Daschel hasn’t been a senator since 2004
| 169 |
Eagle Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:39:12pm |
re: #57 DeafDog
I’ve seen those before. How awful to think there are parents who actually make a concerted effort to limit the thinking ability of their children.
| 170 |
Silhouette Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:39:14pm |
re: #152 DistantThunder
Judge Nepolitano said that the President didn’t want to count heads but use computer models that would increase dem totals.
Get Lancet to do the study!
| 171 |
Killian Bundy Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:39:15pm |
re: #89 mean Gene
whew!
That’s big news!
Did the MSM bury it or spin it?
/unfortunately, by my math, we’d still need to flip two out of the three RINOs renegades to stop Porkapalooza
| 172 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:39:51pm |
re: #146 lawhawk
Hmmm.. what would have been the outcry if Bush did something like this? Preselecting questioners at the presser?
Of course, the WH Press Corps went along with this and didn’t even make mention of that very policy in their own reporting.
[deleted]
Obama fears. He is a coward. He is spoiled. He is arrogant.
| 173 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:40:09pm |
re: #135 Ringo the Gringo
So if LGF isn’t a cult, does that mean I’m free to go home now?
Yes, just give me all your money first.
| 174 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:40:10pm |
re: #149 OldLineTexan
Ask the castrati to weep for you. Those
guysex-guys really went all-in on the cult.
/
And it was such a tragic misunderstanding. We asked them to go out for some pastrami.
| 175 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:40:20pm |
re: #112 Killgore Trout
That you nailed it was not surprising, but to do so in one paragraph, sweet.
| 176 |
Bubblehead II Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:40:30pm |
re: #83 mean Gene
“Maybe if LGF cuts off enough impure bloggers, Anti-Islamist sites and news sites we will never have to be bothered by having to be exposed to such awful thinkers and can just sit back and congratulate one another on our purity in our computer room hideouts until the Jihad reaches us each individually and we are taken out and (you know what Islamist mobs do when they find a weakling Infidel, Jew or Christian amongst themselves, right?)”
Nowhere in my post did I advocate “cutting ourselves off” from these sites. I still visit AS/GoV/JH. Not to post but to keep myself informed on what they are saying. I don’t want to be associated with fascist or those who support them, but I sure as heck am going to keep an eye on them.
| 177 |
Eowyn2 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:40:31pm |
re: #88 buzzsawmonkey
Where do the Blue Oysters fit in?
Lizardoid First Class
Cool Unlit Lizard Tones?
Honco, Junior Grade
| 178 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:40:34pm |
re: #156 OldLineTexan
Daschle’s not a sitting Senator. He cashed in.
He still was a tax cheat while being a sitting Senator IIRC.
But the idea that someone prominent is finding O’s policies hard to stomach is welcome news, and it took less than 100 days for it to happen.
179 |
Kragar Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:40:35pm |
re: #69 DistantThunder
“Standing still is the surest way of falling behind.” - Genius Obama
Works for the lemmings
| 180 |
BBEV Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:41:00pm |
re: #49 DeafDog
I wonder if he has a ‘taxing’ problem to solve?
I don’t think so, he’s a good guy and we need him here in New Hampshire.
| 181 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:41:02pm |
re: #158 Iron Fist
We’re a gang, not a cult. The Democrats are the cult…
“Eet’s not a gang, eet’s a club!”
-SNL skit, circa 1979
| 182 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:41:08pm |
re: #157 Thanos
It’s a sad state of affairs when the extremists here lend credence to the worries expressed in POS movies like Michael Moore’s Fahrenheit 911. Pretty soon we won’t be able to call that fatass mendacity mogul a moonbat anymore.
My high school junior had to watch this Piece of crap in her government class AND my college freshman has to write a paper on it.
| 183 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:41:43pm |
re: #174 Occasional Reader
And it was such a tragic misunderstanding. We asked them to go out for some pastrami.
I had a meatball sub … oh.
Do we have a Medic-Honco rating? MEDIC! NURSE! SELMAAAAAAA!
| 184 |
BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:41:48pm |
re: #177 Eowyn2
Lizardoid First Class
Cool Unlit Lizard Tones?
Honco, Junior Grade
Don’t forget the Dreaded Rear Admiral.
| 185 |
Killgore Trout Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:42:05pm |
re: #161 turn
That’s a very common sentiment in some circles. There are a lot of people out there who are eager to shelve their morality and get down and dirty. They whip themselves into hysterics and convince themselves it’s urgent and necessary.
| 186 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:42:30pm |
re: #182 DistantThunder
My high school junior had to watch this Piece of crap in her government class AND my college freshman has to write a paper on it.
Did you complain to your local school board about the indoctrination?
| 187 |
Kailen Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:42:54pm |
Let’s see, 3 up dings for a comment promoting banning of books (in a limited since), 2 down dings for a comment making a joke about the stimulus pork etc. Yea, that makes perfect since.
| 188 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:43:11pm |
re: #184 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey
Don’t forget the Dreaded Rear Admiral.
Or the Dread Pirate Roberts
| 190 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:43:19pm |
re: #69 DistantThunder
“Standing still is the surest way of falling behind.” - Genius Obama
Or Yogi Bera? You make the call!
| 191 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:43:27pm |
re: #184 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey
Don’t forget the Dreaded Rear Admiral.
Or the Society of Lowly and Obstreperous Bastards (SLOBS).
| 193 |
formercorpsman Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:43:31pm |
re: #135 Ringo the Gringo
Check your purple sneakers at the door.
| 194 |
Randall Gross Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:44:06pm |
re: #182 DistantThunder
My high school junior had to watch this Piece of crap in her government class AND my college freshman has to write a paper on it.
You should have him examine Ray Bradbury’s complaint on Moore over it.
Seriously though calling for banning of books just allows shitheads like Moore to point and say “See? I was right.”
| 195 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:44:34pm |
re: #192 buzzsawmonkey
I can’t grow dreads.
I can, but then my combover looks like the braided rug under your Grandma’s rocker.
| 196 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:44:36pm |
| 197 |
Eowyn2 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:44:53pm |
re: #135 Ringo the Gringo
So if LGF isn’t a cult, does that mean I’m free to go home now?
heh heh, sure you are, follow this ‘hallway’ down the stairs, when you get to the ‘wall’ turn left, shut the metal doors behind you. heh heh
| 198 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:45:01pm |
re: #182 DistantThunder
My high school junior had to watch this Piece of crap in her government class AND my college freshman has to write a paper on it.
should have refused…you gotta take a stand…
are you listening?….you have to draw the line somewhere
| 199 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:45:03pm |
| 201 |
debutaunt Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:45:18pm |
re: #195 OldLineTexan
I can, but then my combover looks like the braided rug under your Grandma’s rocker.
hahahahaahahahahaaaa
| 202 |
Dianna Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:45:32pm |
re: #167 Occasional Reader
Well, fine. But when your dabblings awaken Cthulhu from his aeons-long slumber, we’re directing him to your house first.
I’ll already be insane, so I won’t care.
| 203 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:45:36pm |
| 205 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:45:59pm |
| 206 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:45:59pm |
re: #186 FurryOldGuyJeans
Did you complain to your local school board about the indoctrination?
She had to just research the controversy - of course they didn’t have the option of watching FehrenHYPE 911 with Dick Morris and Ann Coulter.
| 208 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:46:27pm |
Buzz, how about an afro? Or a jewfro? Can you manage one of those?
| 209 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:46:31pm |
re: #187 Kailen
Let’s see, 3 up dings for a comment promoting banning of books (in a limited since), 2 down dings for a comment making a joke about the stimulus pork etc. Yea, that makes perfect since.
You might consider Lasik eye surgery since you see -3 as +3 and 0 as +2.
| 210 |
Kragar Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:46:51pm |
Do we have to grow the dreads using the hair on our head?
| 211 |
NY Nana Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:46:55pm |
Here is the statement on Drudge:
Senator Gregg Statement on His Withdrawal for Consideration of U.S. Commerce Secretary
Sen. Gregg stated, “I want to thank the President for nominating me to serve in his Cabinet as Secretary of Commerce. This was a great honor, and I had felt that I could bring some views and ideas that would assist him in governing during this difficult time. I especially admire his willingness to reach across the aisle.
“However, it has become apparent during this process that this will not work for me as I have found that on issues such as the stimulus package and the Census there are irresolvable conflicts for me. Prior to accepting this post, we had discussed these and other potential differences, but unfortunately we did not adequately focus on these concerns. We are functioning from a different set of views on many critical items of policy.
“Obviously the President requires a team that is fully supportive of all his initiatives.
***“I greatly admire President Obama and know our country will benefit from his leadership, but at this time I must withdraw my name from consideration for this position.
“As we move forward, I expect there will be many issues and initiatives where I can and will work to assure the success of the President’s proposals. This will certainly be a goal of mine.
“Kathy and I also want to specifically thank Governor Lynch and Bonnie Newman for their friendship and assistance during this period. In addition we wish to thank all the people, especially in New Hampshire, who have been so kind and generous in their supportive comments.
“As a further matter of clarification, nothing about the vetting process played any role in this decision. I will continue to represent the people of New Hampshire in the United States Senate.”
***He lost my respect, at the very least, for that statement.
| 212 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:46:55pm |
re: #198 albusteve
should have refused…you gotta take a stand…
are you listening?….you have to draw the line somewhere
She told me about it after the fact. My oldest daughter happened to catch SICKO on tv and she was appalled - said it was completely unbelievable.
213 |
Boxy_brown Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:47:16pm |
re: #47 Charles
Thank you for putting “conservative” in quotes. It isn’t a conservative attribute to ban books or otherwise cut your own throat in a display of self-indulgence by loudly proclaiming how pure of principle you are while you effectively enable the opposition to trash every principle you supposedly have advocated. It isn’t particularly “conservative” to shoot yourself in the foot through constant demands for purges until no one but shrill, mentally masturbatory chest thumpers are left in the “big tent” because everyone else has been branded a “RINO”.
Conservatives don’t shoot themselves in the foot by electing Obama just because McCain was a dud. Conservatives don’t run to the next “only man who can save America” because the wheels came off the GOP, they work to fix it. If “self-defeating, pig-headed moron” is becoming the new definition of “Conservative” then I guess I need to call myself something else. Wondering through some of their online echo-chambers one realizes that many are simply the obverse of Kos; Followers trying to out do each other in adherence to a self-contradictory standard without a nod to reason.
| 215 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:47:40pm |
re: #207 ploome hineni
I want to ban anything written by Karen Armstrong
she is the worst writer ever
And lets ban the music of Karen Carpenter, too. It is worse tourcher than anything they play at Gitmo.
| 216 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:47:41pm |
re: #210 Kragar (proud to be kafir)
Do we have to grow the dreads using the hair on our head?
ENOUGH HAIR FOR ONE, NO, TWO PERSIAN RUGS!
/
| 217 |
MrSilverDragon Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:47:54pm |
re: #192 buzzsawmonkey
I can’t grow dreads.
With the mane I have, I could have some serious dreads. However, I don’t want to look like a pot-smoking college kid. Wait, I guess I kinda do with all this hair. I FOILED MYSELF!
| 218 |
Dianna Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:47:54pm |
re: #185 Killgore Trout
That’s a very common sentiment in some circles. There are a lot of people out there who are eager to shelve their morality and get down and dirty. They whip themselves into hysterics and convince themselves it’s urgent and necessary.
Because they don’t like the constraints of morality and are looking for an excuse.
| 219 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:48:01pm |
| 220 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:48:13pm |
re: #215 DeafDog
And lets ban the music of Karen Carpenter, too. It is worse tourcher than anything they play at Gitmo.
INFIDEL! I KEEEEEL YOU!
/Karen was a GODDESS!
| 221 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:48:16pm |
re: #212 DistantThunder
She told me about it after the fact. My oldest daughter happened to catch SICKO on tv and she was appalled - said it was completely unbelievable.
well just poop…keep an eye out tho
222 |
SummerSong Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:48:29pm |
“The Dow industrials ended flat as stocks recovered from deep losses on a report of a possible plan to subsidize mortgage payments.” -WSJ
The market is desperate for anything resembling good news.
| 223 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:48:44pm |
re: #207 ploome hineni
I want to ban anything written by Karen Armstrong
she is the worst writer ever
Another banning nominee, while we’re at it: Time and Again. Interesting concept, turned into an excruciatingly boring novel.
| 224 |
BBEV Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:48:53pm |
re: #135 Ringo the Gringo
So if LGF isn’t a cult, does that mean I’m free to go home now?
Ya sure you can but first move a little more to to right, ya on the plastic sheet, good now close your eyes we have something for you before you go.
| 225 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:49:05pm |
re: #206 DistantThunder
She had to just research the controversy - of course they didn’t have the option of watching FehrenHYPE 911 with Dick Morris and Ann Coulter.
I’ll ask it again, did you complain to your school board about the blatant overt indoctrination?
Being told to “research the controversy” and then not letting students see but one side is not learning.
| 226 |
jroberson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:49:15pm |
re: #22 leww37334
I’m trying to figure this out, the title was about conservatives who want to ban books. Maybe a little more accurate would be this guy wants to ban the Koran. But it appears we are no longer looking for accuracy.
Bingo. Accuracy has a price when you’re really looking to sell an agenda.
They banned Mein Kampf in German, didn’t they? At look at Germany now. Book burnings, state ordered murders, facism. Oh wait, all that occured BECAUSE of Mein Kampf, not because it was banned.
But you know, Johnson believes in the slippery slope: ban the Koran today, and you’re banning Edith Wharton tomorrow.
And I thought the slippery slope was just for leftists with BDS.
| 227 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:49:41pm |
I’m so thrilled about my $13 a week. It’s all I can think about.
| 228 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:49:48pm |
re: #214 ploome hineni
he saw what Nobama did to Hillary
it wouldnt surprise me to see him locked up sometime in the near future
| 229 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:50:31pm |
re: #211 NY Nana
Here is the statement on Drudge:
***He lost my respect, at the very least, for that statement.
I’m ok with that, because it’s a nice-nice kind of statement for a new prez. This is the key paragraph
“However, it has become apparent during this process that this will not work for me as I have found that on issues such as the stimulus package and the Census there are irresolvable conflicts for me. Prior to accepting this post, we had discussed these and other potential differences, but unfortunately we did not adequately focus on these concerns. We are functioning from a different set of views on many critical items of policy.
| 230 |
mean Gene Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:50:43pm |
re: #176 Bubblehead II
“Maybe if LGF cuts off enough impure bloggers, Anti-Islamist sites and news sites we will never have to be bothered by having to be exposed to such awful thinkers and can just sit back and congratulate one another on our purity in our computer room hideouts until the Jihad reaches us each individually and we are taken out and (you know what Islamist mobs do when they find a weakling Infidel, Jew or Christian amongst themselves, right?)”
Nowhere in my post did I advocate “cutting ourselves off” from these sites. I still visit AS/GoV/JH. Not to post but to keep myself informed on what they are saying. I don’t want to be associated with fascist or those who support them, but I sure as heck am going to keep an eye on them.
I later added that this post was tongue in cheek.
And I, too check most of the pages Charles has come down against.
Even though a certian one of them is awfully wordy.
But, when I post here I go to the original source instead of any secondary one.
I was taught that in school, way back in the Dark Ages when CA had the best public school system in the nation.
| 231 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:50:49pm |
re: #222 SummerSong
a possible plan to subsidize mortgage payments
Oh good f***ng grief. What are we becoming.
Can I get my .45ACP ammo purchases subsidized? Hey, I’ve leaving for vacation tomorrow… can I get my trip subsidized?
Bleh.
| 232 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:50:51pm |
re: #225 FurryOldGuyJeans
I’ll ask it again, did you complain to your school board about the blatant overt indoctrination?
Being told to “research the controversy” and then not letting students see but one side is not learning.
I will now.
| 233 |
debutaunt Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:51:07pm |
re: #227 DistantThunder
I’m so thrilled about my $13 a week. It’s all I can think about.
A week? Whoa, I see grand and posh meals at your house.
| 234 |
Bubblehead II Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:51:08pm |
re: #129 Dianna
It does exist. Published by Avon Books.
| 235 |
Last Mohican Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:51:15pm |
re: #81 shiplord kirel
Any decent cult needs a system of ranks. Here are my suggestions for the revised LGF double-secret rank system:…
I propose that most of the ranks in the middle be replaced with different kinds of honco. For example:
Honco, Junior Grade
Assistant Night Honco
Senior Honco
Gunnery Honco
Rear Honco
Vice Prohonco for Lizard Affairs
Master Chief Honco of the Lizard Corps
Battle Honco of the Republic
etc.
| 236 |
BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:51:32pm |
re: #195 OldLineTexan
I can, but then my combover looks like the braided rug under your Grandma’s rocker.
Maybe we shouldn’t ban books, but we really should ban white people from wearing dreds.
| 237 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:51:40pm |
| 238 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:51:43pm |
re: #226 jroberson
And I thought the slippery slope was just for leftists with BDS.
No, I saw it in action with the Clintonista anti-rights enthusiasts and guns all during the ‘90’s.
| 239 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:51:46pm |
Book banning? Sunlight is a disinfectant.
| 240 |
formercorpsman Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:52:22pm |
I have followed this in the periphery, but I have a question.
Did they prevent him from coming into Britain directly due to his position on banning the Koran?
| 241 |
DistantThunder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:52:24pm |
re: #233 debutaunt
A week? Whoa, I see grand and posh meals at your house.
I’m getting my own plane - like Nancy. And that’s only the beginning.
| 242 |
debutaunt Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:52:30pm |
| 243 |
mean Gene Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:52:30pm |
re: #220 OldLineTexan
INFIDEL! I KEEEEEL YOU!
/Karen was a GODDESS!
Yeah, but she was a Hungry Goddess, who demanded human sacrifice.
(PS, I sang with her in college, in choir.)
| 244 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:52:42pm |
re: #236 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey
Maybe we shouldn’t ban books, but we really should ban white people from wearing dreds.
The way things are going it might be just plain ban white people, a reverse Jim Crow laws and all.
| 245 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:53:02pm |
re: #236 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey
Maybe we shouldn’t ban books, but we really should ban white people from wearing dreds.
Good taste SHALL BE ENFORCED.
/maybe not, huh?
;)
| 246 |
formercorpsman Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:53:11pm |
re: #236 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey
I’ll co-sponsor that bill with you.
| 247 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:53:40pm |
re: #236 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey
Maybe we shouldn’t ban books, but we really should ban white people from wearing dreds.
AIR BALL!
| 248 |
Dianna Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:53:53pm |
re: #226 jroberson
Bingo. Accuracy has a price when you’re really looking to sell an agenda.
They banned Mein Kampf in German, didn’t they? At look at Germany now. Book burnings, state ordered murders, facism. Oh wait, all that occured BECAUSE of Mein Kampf, not because it was banned.
But you know, Johnson believes in the slippery slope: ban the Koran today, and you’re banning Edith Wharton tomorrow.
And I thought the slippery slope was just for leftists with BDS.
You can still walk into your local Barnes & Noble and buy a copy of Mein Kampf. It’s actually instructive to read it.
I don’t believe in banning books.
250 |
avanti Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:54:06pm |
re: #118 loppyd
The screaming Drudge headline:
OBAMA BURNED: GREGG WITHDRAWS AFTER POLICIES TOO MUCH TO STOMACH
Obama actually bought his own hype about reaching across the right/left divide. By putting a Republican in charge of commerce and the census, the left’s knee jerk reaction was to not trust Gregg. Obama then tried to make them happy by looking over Gregg’s shoulder, a move that backfired. He’s learning he can’t make everyone happy.
Gregg really wanted the job, but it was just to big a hope and change move to make. Now, both the left and right are happy that it’s politics as usual. Obama made a mistake by not defending Gregg against the attacks from the left and giving Gregg the same trust and respect he would give a Dem.
I give him a E for effort, but a fail on execution.
| 251 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:54:28pm |
re: #243 mean Gene
Yeah, but she was a Hungry Goddess, who demanded human sacrifice.
(PS, I sang with her in college, in choir.)
You’re a better man than I am.
First, I cannot (or should not) sing.
Second, I would have been kneeling at her feet. I can only assume this would have caused certain issues.
254 |
Kenneth Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:54:55pm |
OT:
Obama’s pick for Ambassador to Iraq, arguably the most important post in the foreign service, is Christopher Hill. Now Hill is an experienced diplomat and has been described as brilliant and fearless. Fine. His specialty was East Asia, especially Korea. But Hill has zero experience in the Middle East.
Now Obama was about to appoint Gen. Zinni as Ambassador to Iraq, in fact he had offered Zinni the job and Zinni had accepted. Zinni has tons of experience in the Middle East. Then suddenly, Zinni is dropped and Hill is appointed. Why? It can’t be because of his expertise in Arab politics history & culture.
What’s up?
255 |
wrenchwench Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:54:55pm |
re: #240 formercorpsman
I have followed this in the periphery, but I have a question.
Did they prevent him from coming into Britain directly due to his position on banning the Koran?
I think it was for the content of his film, Fitna.
| 256 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:55:08pm |
re: #236 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey
Maybe we shouldn’t ban books, but we really should ban white people from wearing dreds.
I’ll make one exception for the dreadlocked white guy who plays guitar and sings outside my Metro stop most mornings. His favorite is “The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down”. It’s a nicely surreal way to start the day.
| 257 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:55:08pm |
re: #220 OldLineTexan
INFIDEL! I KEEEEEL YOU!
/Karen was a GODDESS!
We’re building a BIIIIG bonfire of 70’s era sap music….(including, but not limited to):
Karen Carpenter
Captain and Tennile
Abba
Donnie & Marie
……it will be a great day
| 258 |
Dianna Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:55:15pm |
re: #234 Bubblehead II
It does exist. Published by Avon Books.
Neal Stephenson’s novel? It’s not the volume by the Mad Arab.
| 259 |
Last Mohican Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:55:16pm |
re: #240 formercorpsman
I have followed this in the periphery, but I have a question.
Did they prevent him from coming into Britain directly due to his position on banning the Koran?
You mean Wilders, right?
The British parliament invited him. Then one Muslim MP issued a threat, saying he would mobilize 10,000 Muslims to swarm the streets and physically prevent him from coming. So Britain surrendered to the threat of force, and uninvited him.
| 260 |
NY Nana Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:55:27pm |
re: #219 DistantThunder
Do you think a Democrat would have said this about Pres. Bush? ha.
Said this? A Demonrat would never have even thought that…and President Bush would have had the common sense not to appoint the crap that The One did.
I have a feeling that there are Demonrats that are starting to wish President Bush was still President.
There were a number of things I was not pleased with, but I would still have voted for him if he were able to run for a third term. And seeing the bitch Condi replaced by the bitch of bitches, Shrillary? Feh. 2 enemies of Israel in a row. John Bolton, please come home!
| 261 |
Soona' Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:55:33pm |
re: #215 DeafDog
And lets ban the music of Karen Carpenter, too. It is worse tourcher than anything they play at Gitmo.
And Kenny G.
//
| 262 |
Bluecold Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:55:47pm |
re: #72 Maine’s Michael
You’re missing the fact that Mein Kampf is banned in Holland.
Ahwell, the media here had a fun time composing lists with Brits that we should ban from Holland (Beckhams topped every list).
And re: #161 turn
The “war being fought” is precisely about moral superiority. Your point is ridiculous. And there is no war. War is with tanks and guns and airplanes. Lots and lots of ‘em.
| 263 |
formercorpsman Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:55:56pm |
re: #255 wrenchwench
Thanks, like I said, I am really catching this on the margin.
| 264 |
Dustyvet Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:55:58pm |
re: #251 OldLineTexan
You’re a better man than I am.
First, I cannot (or should not) sing.
Second, I would have been kneeling at her feet. I can only assume this would have caused certain issues.
I can sing tenor, 10 or 15 miles away.
| 265 |
OldLineTexan Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:56:17pm |
re: #257 DeafDog
We’re building a BIIIIG bonfire of 70’s era sap music….(including, but not limited to):
Karen Carpenter
Captain and Tennile
Abba
Donnie & Marie……it will be a great day
I will keeel you so bad, your ancestors will all die!
/
| 266 |
mean Gene Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:56:38pm |
re: #251 OldLineTexan
You’re a better man than I am.
First, I cannot (or should not) sing.
Second, I would have been kneeling at her feet. I can only assume this would have caused certain issues.
First, I’m a woman.
And I can’t sing for sour pickles anymore.
Second, she was using the bathroom stall to ”purge” even before she ”made it.”
It was an open secret that cost her her life.
| 267 |
Dustyvet Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:56:55pm |
re: #264 Dustyvet
I can sing tenor, 10 or 15 miles away.
I sing solo as well, solo you can’t hear me
| 268 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:57:00pm |
re: #258 Dianna
Neal Stephenson’s novel? It’s not the volume by the Mad Arab.
You need to understand the root causes of the Mad Arab’s rage and frustration.
| 269 |
Kenneth Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:57:05pm |
re: #195 OldLineTexan
The Japanese slang for a comb-over translates as “a barcode”.
| 270 |
Last Mohican Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:57:14pm |
re: #256 Occasional Reader
I’ll make one exception for the dreadlocked white guy who plays guitar and sings outside my Metro stop most mornings. His favorite is “The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down”. It’s a nicely surreal way to start the day.
Okay, mandatory white-guy-dreadlock licenses then.
They could be issued by the same department that issues the guy-with-short-hair-but-nevertheless-wears-a-frisbee-helmet licenses.
| 271 |
Dianna Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:57:24pm |
| 272 |
Bubblehead II Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:57:26pm |
re: #230 mean Gene
Ya, I caught the post were you said you forgot the sarc tag. And I to try to get to the original source if I can.
| 273 |
MrSilverDragon Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:57:29pm |
re: #261 Soona’
And Kenny G.
//
I was working in a music store when one of his albums came out. I had to play it on our system for the customers to listen, and I don’t think I could ever listen to Kenny G. ever again. That, and Janet Jackson’s “Janet”. Ooof, 30 times a day, that was painful.
| 274 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:57:29pm |
re: #265 OldLineTexan
I will keeel you so bad, your ancestors will all die!
/
“I’ll hit you so hard, I’ll kill your whole family”… that was from Diner, I think?
| 275 |
avanti Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:57:35pm |
re: #146 lawhawk
Hmmm.. what would have been the outcry if Bush did something like this? Preselecting questioners at the presser?
Of course, the WH Press Corps went along with this and didn’t even make mention of that very policy in their own reporting.
[deleted]
Well, I recall the flack he got for not calling on Fox for example. I don’t see a issue with making sure the various factions of the media get a shot.
| 276 |
SummerSong Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:57:58pm |
re: #231 Occasional Reader
Oh good f***ng grief. What are we becoming.
Can I get my .45ACP ammo purchases subsidized? Hey, I’ve leaving for vacation tomorrow… can I get my trip subsidized?
Bleh.
You? No. People like you, people like me…we “get” to pay, that’s what we get.
Bleh, indeed.
| 277 |
formercorpsman Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:58:15pm |
re: #259 Last Mohican
Thank you sir.
So many subjects, so little time.
In between posts, I am completing FMLA’s for a bunch of ankle sprains, and carbuncle equivalents..
| 279 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:58:42pm |
re: #259 Last Mohican
You mean Wilders, right?
The British parliament invited him. Then one Muslim MP issued a threat, saying he would mobilize 10,000 Muslims to swarm the streets and physically prevent him from coming. So Britain surrendered to the threat of force, and uninvited him.
we should try that when BO comes to town….who’s WITH me!
| 280 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:58:49pm |
re: #267 Dustyvet
I sing solo as well, solo you can’t hear me
These days, we’re all supposed to be singing Barry-tone. Didn’t you get the memo?
| 281 |
capitalist piglet Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:59:18pm |
re: #250 avanti
Obama actually bought his own hype about reaching across the right/left divide. By putting a Republican in charge of commerce and the census, the left’s knee jerk reaction was to not trust Gregg. Obama then tried to make them happy by looking over Gregg’s shoulder, a move that backfired. He’s learning he can’t make everyone happy.
Gregg really wanted the job, but it was just to big a hope and change move to make. Now, both the left and right are happy that it’s politics as usual. Obama made a mistake by not defending Gregg against the attacks from the left and giving Gregg the same trust and respect he would give a Dem.
I give him a E for effort, but a fail on execution.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but it’s not really unusual for a president to choose one or two people from the opposing party to be part of his cabinet. It’s kind of a token thing, and there is also political strategy involved.
So I wouldn’t break my arm patting Obama on the back for his attempt at bipartisanship. He’s actually made some pretty divisive remarks.
| 282 |
Soona' Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:59:21pm |
re: #244 FurryOldGuyJeans
The way things are going it might be just plain ban white people, a reverse Jim Crow laws and all.
Yes. Ban all white people to the Carribean islands.
/
| 283 |
Eowyn2 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:59:29pm |
re: #158 Iron Fist
We’re a gang, not a cult. The Democrats are the cult…
we are not a gang, we are a lounge of lizards.
| 284 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 1:59:29pm |
re: #255 wrenchwench
I think it was for the content of his film, Fitna.
I heard it was going to viewed with or without him… do you know if that happened?
| 285 |
Dustyvet Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:00:05pm |
re: #280 Occasional Reader
These days, we’re all supposed to be singing Barry-tone. Didn’t you get the memo?
Yeah but I fiddled it away
| 286 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:00:13pm |
re: #271 Dianna
Mine’s still in last night’s braid.
first they came for the dreds….
then they came for the braids…
fucking Hair Nazis
| 287 |
jroberson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:00:14pm |
In the US, the law bans people under a certain age from pornography and pornographic material. We have ratings on movies, music and games to keep explicit material out of the hands of children. We do it for the good of society.
But when some guy suggests banning the Koran, a book that explicitly calls on followers to kill nonbelievers, in Europe, a place full of ‘nonbelievers’, a place that already restricts the disemmination of specific truly facist literature, this ‘some guy’ is denounced as a book burning fascist fanatic. And all for the ‘good’ of society, no less.
| 288 |
nonic Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:00:27pm |
Geert Wilders BBC audio recording at 3:50 –
| 290 |
Bubblehead II Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:00:43pm |
re: #258 Dianna
Neal Stephenson’s novel? It’s not the volume by the Mad Arab.
My bad. Didn’t realize there was another book with the same title.
| 291 |
turn Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:00:48pm |
re: #185 Killgore Trout
That’s a very common sentiment in some circles. There are a lot of people out there who are eager to shelve their morality and get down and dirty. They whip themselves into hysterics and convince themselves it’s urgent and necessary.
Thanks, as you can tell I don’t run around in those circles. Concluding that banning books and annihilation of entire races or religions is what’s needed to make things right in the world is delusional.
| 292 |
nonic Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:01:08pm |
Geert Wilders BBC audio recording at 3:50 –
“You have to see it in the Dutch context as well, because in the Netherlands we outlawed, for instance, Mein Kampf as well because it was incitement to violence, so in the Dutch context it’s really logical if you have outlawed Mein Kampf, to really also propose outlawing the Koran.”
| 293 |
DeafDog Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:01:44pm |
re: #265 OldLineTexan
I will keeel you so bad, your ancestors will all die!
/
Mr. Meloconcoly and Dr. Blind Rage
| 294 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:01:56pm |
re: #287 jroberson
In the US, the law bans people under a certain age from pornography and pornographic material. We have ratings on movies, music and games to keep explicit material out of the hands of children. We do it for the good of society.
But when some guy suggests banning the Koran, a book that explicitly calls on followers to kill nonbelievers, in Europe, a place full of ‘nonbelievers’, a place that already restricts the disemmination of specific truly facist literature, this ‘some guy’ is denounced as a book burning fascist fanatic. And all for the ‘good’ of society, no less.
life is funny like that sometimes….
| 295 |
derek Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:01:56pm |
Way to miss the fucking point.
If you’re going to ban Mein Kampf, then ban all hate speech.
296 |
Arbalest Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:02:20pm |
Honco?
Should this actually be “honcho”?
Do any of the positions involve beer? Cult or no, some issues are important and must be clarified.
| 297 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:03:13pm |
298 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:03:35pm |
Mein Kampf should not be banned. It should be required reading for high schoolers—right after they watch a newsreel of concentration camp liberations. Then, just in case someone missed it, the teacher should explain how the two are related.
| 300 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:04:25pm |
re: #275 avanti
Well, I recall the flack he got for not calling on Fox for example. I don’t see a issue with making sure the various factions of the media get a shot.
So you want to see the policy of preselecting the questions that are allowed to be asked to continue? That is called CENSORSHIP OF THE MEDIA.
| 301 |
turn Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:04:38pm |
re: #227 DistantThunder
I’m so thrilled about my $13 a week. It’s all I can think about.
3 wood advises spend it before it becomes worthless. BTW Keystone light is $12.95 for a 30 pack at Longs.
| 302 |
formercorpsman Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:06:45pm |
This is truly one of the reasons why Europe is on such a terrible path.
Society should not be banning books. Some good rebuttal can be made, as it was, with different materials being off limits because of age, etc.
I want to purchase a copy of Alms for Jihad. By proxy, this was banned in Britain, via the courts.
What I find even worse, is that Britain denied him passage. This due to a threat from someone sworn to uphold British law, vowing to break the law.
I don’t think this one is over.
| 303 |
BBEV Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:07:03pm |
Well the Daily kos has a thread on Judd Gregg up. Not good comments,
| 304 |
turn Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:07:03pm |
re: #262 Bluecold
Hey Blue, if you are still out there I agree. That was a comment at Allahpundit. That is all …
| 305 |
Basho Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:07:23pm |
re: #275 avanti
Well, I recall the flack he got for not calling on Fox for example. I don’t see a issue with making sure the various factions of the media get a shot.
Avanti… you were in the military… you should know it is flak, not flack.
| 306 |
Arbalest Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:10:49pm |
re: #297 Occasional Reader
Sorry. I haven’t been here that long.
But my beer question still stands. Some things transcend all.
| 307 |
Silhouette Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:13:43pm |
re: #240 formercorpsman
Did they prevent him from coming into Britain directly due to his position on banning the Koran?
If so, doesn’t Britain allow Sauds to enter?
They don’t just talk about banning; they do it.
308 |
abolitionist Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:14:35pm |
Widespread banning of books is horrible as social policy, especially on the scale of governments and nation states. Saudi Arabia comes to mind.
I take issue with the notion that the koran deserves special protections because it’s a religious or holy book. No. A genuine religious book would not forbid it’s followers to carry it with them to distant and foreign lands. But the koran does.
It cautions sojourning servants of allah to keep secret from infidels in their own homelands —called Dar ul Harb (House of War, big clue there) —the details of their fates, according to the written words of allah. What faithful mohammedans are required to do to infidels as soon as practical is downplayed and explained away. It helps that it is also too awful to be believed. Whatever else it is, this book qualifies as a war manual —a holy war manual.
I’m sure the koran has been banned, at various times and places. Just not so much in this post-Gutenberg electronic networking era. I’m against banning books in general, but banning the koran would be wrong, in part, because doing so would be complicit with one of it’s own directives.
The secrecy thing is now dead, sort of. It has been replaced by widespread ignorance, apathy, wishful thinking, decades of leftist-socialist propaganda, multiculturalism, rabid PC-ism, human right councils, UN resolutions, and anti-hate speech laws. Oh, and widespread unfettered new-wave Jew-hatred. The combination appears to be as effective as secrecy. Perhaps more so.
If anyone doubts that such secrecy ever existed, please riddle me this: Why does traditional islamic education put so much emphasis on memorizing and reciting the whole book in Arabic, even when Arabic is not understood at all by the student or his peers?
Of course all this may be a little too nuanced, esp to those among us who would interpret Death to America as subtle diplo-speak for more economic aid, please.
| 309 |
avanti Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:15:22pm |
re: #300 FurryOldGuyJeans
So you want to see the policy of preselecting the questions that are allowed to be asked to continue? That is called CENSORSHIP OF THE MEDIA.
Not preselecting the questions, but many making sure all the reporters get a equal shot to ask their question. i.e., Fox may ask tougher questions and they should get the same shot that others do. If he knew what questioned would be asked, that’s a different issue.
310 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:19:38pm |
I have been giving a lot of thought to the fascist-antijihad alliance that has been forming.
Before I get into it, for the record, it is repulsive and evil and counter to principles I would fight and die for. If I say Jihadi, I mean one who espouses Jihad. I do not mean some normal person of a certain ethnic or religious group.
On the one hand, it was inevitable. The Islamofascists are a *perfect* tailor made group for Eurofascists to focus on. The *are* out to tear down Europe and they *are* not white, not Christian, vocal and frightening. The only reason the neo-nazi scum don’t go for it more and more quickly is that the Jihadis are so into killing Jews.
But the Jews of Europe, despite the rhetoric of the neo-Nazis are no particular threat to anyone. The Jihadis really are. I imagine that this creates some dissonance in the minds of the typical storm-trooper wannabe.
In the course of looking at people like Robert and Pamela, and feeling shocked and betrayed, I have had to ask myself, why would someone who was Jewish, or friends with Jews ever assosciate with such scum? All rationalizations about the greater threat of Jihad aside, dealing with Europeans who think Nazis are cool is a remarkable stretch.
The only answer that I can come up with is that they are hoping that two sets of monsters kill each other, and that somehow, in the aftermath, civilization stays civilized. This is a deeply flawed reasoning. For the Eurofascists to form a real threat to the Jihadis, they would have to gain real power and control in Europe. If they do… they will not relinquish that power and they will turn their love of racial holy war on everyone else ehile destroying all that we hold dear.
This is the nicest view of those in the counter-jihad movement going to such an alliance - the view that they have miscalculated an evil and Machievellian half baked scheme.
The other possibility is simply that they have cracked. Just simply gone insane.
In either case, we need to jettison them, but more importantly, we need to look to what we are doing. We need to focus on our real issues. I see it as follows:
1. The world is swinging towards a handwringing appeasement mode towards radical Islam.
2. Many of those who would scream the loudest that swinging this way is a very bad idea are also either crazy, reprehensible or both - making us seem ludicrious.
This means we must do the following:
1. Always, be a mensch. We jettison those who have “fallen” but we do it out of grim nescessity, not with rancor.
2. We distance ourselves from fascism as much as possible and endeavor when speaking to all sides at all times to know our facts and state them *calmly*
3. We never give up.
4. We focus strongly on keeping the truth out there.
5. We need to remember that we are not just in this to reinforce each others convictions. We need to convince those who do not see the problem that there is one. The fringe right that is going this way is not the issue. The dispirited center right that is fractured and the undecided center that wants to be “even handed” but, does not have the facts, is the issue. Reaching these people needs to be our main aim.
Taking the Religious Right aspect out (that honestly drives educated people away - if only on the principle that no one likes having religion forced on them) on our side, by pushing science, is in accordance with that.
Being honest about the problem from the fascists is in accordance with that.
Anyway, that is my two cents for what it is worth.
| 311 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:21:02pm |
re: #308 abolitionist
I take issue with the notion that the koran deserves special protections because it’s a religious or holy book.
No one said that, and especially not me. It deserves the same protection that should be given to EVERY book, no more and no less.
| 312 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:24:16pm |
The people who rant about banning the Koran are achieving only two things — making themselves look like fanatics and extremists, and wasting their time.
This country is never going to ban the Koran or ban Islam. Never. Not gonna happen, and if you think it will, you’re living in a dream world.
Advocating this is simply flat-out stupid. Those who do it are defeating themselves and by extension, discrediting everyone who tries to voice legitimate criticism of its contents.
| 313 |
formercorpsman Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:25:38pm |
re: #308 abolitionist
Banning the koran will not curb islamic militant-ism.
Banning western law, and civil structure in the face of such threats increases it.
He should be criticized for wanting the ban. But he should have been allowed into Britain as well.
| 314 |
Bluecold Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:26:07pm |
re: #304 turn
Hey Blue, if you are still out there I agree. That was a comment at Allahpundit. That is all …
Ah that way. I didn’t really get the quotation marks anyway so i figured i’d just react to the point being made. I would edit my post if i could.
| 315 |
BBEV Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:26:36pm |
re: #308 abolitionist
I have a Koran and it’s a very nice hard cover copy. I have read it a couple of times and Will always keep it, It’s good to know what others are thinking and where they come from when they speak.
317 |
billhedrick Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:30:32pm |
I disagree with Charles on several issues, but find him to be the most level headed person in the fascist discussion. I think he and I agree on this: Fascism is the wrong path whether it is done by islamists or by white nationalists. If someone cannot see this point… well I will pray for them.
| 318 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:33:30pm |
re: #316 Charles
Great post.
Thanks, I really do believe I see what you are doing. You have my gratitude.
| 319 |
abolitionist Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:36:21pm |
re: #41 Charlesre: #313 formercorpsman
Agree.
re: #311 Charles
No one said that, and especially not me. It deserves the same protection that should be given to EVERY book, no more and no less.
Agree, and the severe prohibitions and penalties specified within this book against infidels reading it, or even touching it, such ideas deserve no respect either.
| 320 |
nonic Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:36:41pm |
re: #311 Charles
And Wilders seems to agree with you. Please see my #292 above. In the Netherlands, books inciting hatred and violence are banned. Wilders is saying ALL such books should be treated the same (in the Netherlands), no special treatment for the koran just because islamists threaten mayhem, death, and destruction.
| 321 |
billhedrick Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:38:50pm |
As I have heard somewhere, the answer to bad speech is more speech not less. Besides it makes the foolishness more foolish to show it, so every thinking person should have read in the Koran.
As well as Mein Kampf, banning either of them makes them more attractive, not less
| 322 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:45:26pm |
re: #320 nonic
And Wilders seems to agree with you. Please see my #292 above. In the Netherlands, books inciting hatred and violence are banned. Wilders is saying ALL such books should be treated the same (in the Netherlands), no special treatment for the koran just because islamists threaten mayhem, death, and destruction.
The Netherlands does not ban “books inciting hatred and violence.” They don’t even have an outright ban on Mein Kampf — sale is legal for historical and educational purposes.
And in any case, banning books is wrong, no matter who does it. You don’t cure someone of strychnine poisoning by feeding them more strychnine.
| 323 |
thgrant Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:54:05pm |
The problem with Charles position is that it doesn’t really address the problem of Islam as a violent and intolerant political movement. At some point we will have to stop tolerating the intolerant and considering the Muslim tendency towards violence how will we do this? Ask them to be nice?
Also, Charles is somewhat dishonest when he describes Wilder’s as a Book Burner. Many books are banned in the Netherlands, he merely suggests that the Koran be treated equally.
I don’t think banning books is the answer. But what is to be done when Muslims march in the street advocating violence towards others? The seem to do that very thing quite often. I would like to know.
324 |
infidel4ever Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:00:15pm |
re: #298 EmmmieG
Mein Kampf should not be banned. It should be required reading for high schoolers—right after they watch a newsreel of concentration camp liberations. Then, just in case someone missed it, the teacher should explain how the two are related.
And the Koran should not be banned, either. It should be required reading for high schoolers—right after they watch a newsreel of beheadings, stonings, honour killings and dead Jews being scraped of the street in Sderot. Then, just in case someone missed the point, the teacher should explain how the two are related.
Either you ban no books, or you ban all books that call for murder and mayhem and fall in certain categories like fascism. In the Netherlands the problem is that you can say anything you like under the guise of your religion. All Dutch are equal, don’t you dare dicriminate, but believers and (at the moment) especially muslims are more equal than others.
Mein Kampf is banned for sale in the Netherlands, however, the library in my little provincial town has a copy available. It can’t be taken out, but it can be read in the library, same as encyclopedia’s etc.
Not to mention the availability on the internet…
| 325 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:05:24pm |
It is important to note that Geert Wilders is being prosecuted under the Netherlands’ hate speech laws, and may even face imprisonment for his speech. As such, it is a fact that the Netherlands do have hate speech laws that in fact result in prison time. [citation]
I believe that it is important that the Netherlands have a consistent policy. Either ban all forms of hate speech or none of it. If you ban only some forms of hate speech, you allow politicians and judges to have far too much control over the discourse than I am comfortable with.
Wilders’ point - which is at least arguable - is that the Koran should be banned under the standards of the Netherlands hate speech laws. He however does not believe in the hate speech laws to begin with. He simply says that if these laws exist, they must be applied uniformly.
I see no message in this which is inherently ‘pro-censorship.’ This was the message that Alan Dershowitz spoke of in light of the Muhammad cartoons of 2005. He said that these cartoons are allowable, given what else (sheer Jew hatred) has been shown. It is discriminatory and unjust to only ban one kind of speech. He said - and I agree - ban all of it or none of it. Just not some of it.
Charles, it simply is a distortion of Wilders’ message to claim he is pro-censorship as a normative matter.
| 326 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:09:55pm |
re: #325 Quella
Charles, it simply is a distortion of Wilders’ message to claim he is pro-censorship as a normative matter.
No, it is not. This is what he said:
Ban that wretched book like Mein Kampf is banned!
In doing so send a signal to Jami’s attackers and other Islamist that the Koran never ever can be allowed to be used as an inspiration for violence.
If you read that whole speech, your argument from fairness is simply not to be found.
| 327 |
nonic Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:10:02pm |
re: #324 infidel4ever
And the Koran should not be banned, either. It should be required reading for high schoolers—right after they watch a newsreel of beheadings, stonings, honour killings and dead Jews being scraped of the street in Sderot.
Isn’t that the way terrorist groups recruit new members? Some people LIKE to watch and DO beheadings, stonings, and killings.
328 |
so.cal.swede Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:10:19pm |
re: #321 billhedrick
As I have heard somewhere, the answer to bad speech is more speech not less. Besides it makes the foolishness more foolish to show it, so every thinking person should have read in the Koran.
Well said
| 329 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:12:47pm |
re: #325 Quella
You don’t fight a fire by pouring gasoline on it, protesting a bad law by demanding its application is equally detrimental.
| 330 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:14:18pm |
Charles, please correct your post to note the following:
a) The Netherlands has hate speech laws which result in criminal imprisonment, which Wilders himself may face.
b) Wilders has overall preached against all hate speech laws. However, his opinion is that, should the laws still exist, the Koran should be banned as it is as hateful as anything out there which has been banned under the Dutch laws.
c) Wilders has called for 100% total freedom of speech, and did so quite openly. NO book bannings. He only wants FAIRNESS, should the current laws exist. [citation]
Wilders is arguing - in arguendo - that the Koran should be banned. It is quite obvious. Charles, you at least owe your readers the information that Wilders has sought 100% freedom of speech, and teh context of his statement of banning the Koran.
| 331 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:14:47pm |
re: #323 thgrant
Maybe the idea of banning books is wrong, no matter what they are.
| 332 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:15:48pm |
re: #330 Quella
You telling Charles what he HAS to post?!?
/ ducks from the Stinky nuke about to be lobbed.
| 333 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:16:45pm |
re: #329 FurryOldGuyJeans
You don’t fight a fire by pouring gasoline on it, protesting a bad law by demanding its application is equally detrimental.
It is very simple. Should a bad law exist, it needs to be applied equally. Otherwise, discrimination exists on top of the bad law.
I fail to see where Wilders is this book banning extremist. He isn’t, he just isn’t. He only argued for banning the Koran in arguendo.
334 |
J.S. Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:17:41pm |
re: #325 Quella
Why then does Wilders write that “the Koran incites hatred and killing and therefore has no place in our legal order”? (that’s from Wiki article, quoting from a letter Wilders wrote to a newspaper.) Wilders has also likened the prophet in Islam to “the devil.”
| 335 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:17:41pm |
re: #325 Quella
You are trying to defend the indefensible. Good luck, you sure will be needing it.
| 336 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:19:22pm |
re: #333 Quella
A bad law exists you get RID OF IT.
You insist on defending the indefensible. Just who’s sock puppet are you?
| 337 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:21:20pm |
re: #334 J.S.
Why then does Wilders write that “the Koran incites hatred and killing and therefore has no place in our legal order”? (that’s from Wiki article, quoting from a letter Wilders wrote to a newspaper.) Wilders has also likened the prophet in Islam to “the devil.”
Wilders has said numerous times that as the hate speech laws exist, he believes the Koran fulfills the requirements of the hate speech laws to be banned.
I personally am not one to judge whether the Koran fits hate speech requirements. I neither agree nor disagree with Wilders on his overall point and am not an Islamic scholar.
But given he has said in the past that he is in favor of 100% freedom of speech, it appears quite clear to me that he is arguing simply in arguendo that the Koran should be banned under the present hate speech laws. [citation again where he states he is in favor of 100% free speech laws]
| 338 |
infidel4ever Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:22:33pm |
re: #327 nonic
Isn’t that the way terrorist groups recruit new members? Some people LIKE to watch and DO beheadings, stonings, and killings.
Yeah, well, reading Mein Kampf might inspire people to do stuff as well. It did before.
| 339 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:24:22pm |
re: #330 Quella
Charles, please correct your post…
No. There is nothing to correct. And your citation does NOT show Wilders making an argument from fairness. There isn’t a single word in that article that supports what you say.
| 340 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:25:19pm |
re: #335 FurryOldGuyJeans
You are trying to defend the indefensible. Good luck, you sure will be needing it.
Ridiculous. I have been around for over two and a half years and some people on here know me quite well. (even Charles knows me)
How long have you been around?
I will give you an analogy to another bad law and my reaction to it.
Israel has a law against racist political parties, and under it they banned Kach (Kahane’s party). I am against this law as a normative matter. But given the law exists, I believe that Balad and Ta’al (Arab parties) must also be banned - otherwise there is the soft bigotry of low expectations against Arabs.
Should there be a bad law, it should be overturned. But if overturning it is impossible, then at least apply it uniformly, so as to not only benefit one group of people.
Very simple principle.
| 341 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:26:50pm |
By the way, Robert Spencer is now at Hot Air in the comments for their post, ranting away at me and at Allahpundit.
342 |
Achilles Tang Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:28:26pm |
re: #323 thgrant
…….
I don’t think banning books is the answer……..
You would have come across better if you knew when to shut up. The above is all you needed to say.
As to the rest, read a little more before you ask questions and everything will work out just hunky dory; you’ll see.
343 |
whatdafuq Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:28:40pm |
re: #326 Charles
Ban that wretched book like Mein Kampf is banned!
Exactly! The Netherlands already bans books. So someone in the
Netherlands is given the choice of:
1. arguing that books like Mein Kampf should not be banned and then
being labeled as a fascist because neo-Nazis want that too; or,
2. arguing that existing law on book banning should be applied uniformly
and then being labeled as a fascist book banner.
Sort of damned if he does, damned if he doesn’t. Not particularly fair.
Assuming for the moment that “move” is not an option, what would you
do if you lived in the Netherlands?
| 344 |
J.S. Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:28:48pm |
re: #337 Quella
hmmmm….I believe a rather easy case can be made which would argue that Wilders hates Islam and fears Muslims (the Wiki article is filled with Wilders’ statements — including ones about having immigrants paid to leave the country, etc.). So, when he says that Muslims should “tear out half of the Koran if they wished to stay in the Netherlands”, I don’t think he’s arguing for the immediate implementation of Free Speech. Free Speech hardly seems to be his objective…while having Muslims encouraged to leave the Netherlands and banning the Koran does appear to be his “message.”
| 345 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:29:45pm |
This is the exact quote from the citation I posted, and it does clearly support what I wrote:
only a week earlier, Wilders spoke up strongly in favour of widening freedom of speech laws in Europe, writing in the Danish newspaper Jyllands-Posten. He reacted to his possible participation in a Danish congress about islam and freedom of speech.He would if invited, he said, ‘plead for a nearly 100 percent total freedom of speech. Everything should be possible except to issue calls for violence. “All the EU laws against blasphemy should be scrapped as soon as possible,’ he said. Danish report here:
(the original is in Dutch)
I disagree with Wilders in his certainty about what the Koran says and does not say (as well as his general approach), but I would not characterize such a person as simply a book banner.
| 346 |
J.S. Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:32:13pm |
re: #345 Quella
Indeed. Wilders is not “simply a book banner”, he’s also a hater of Islam…
| 347 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:32:40pm |
re: #344 J.S.
hmmmm….I believe a rather easy case can be made which would argue that Wilders hates Islam and fears Muslims (the Wiki article is filled with Wilders’ statements — including ones about having immigrants paid to leave the country, etc.). So, when he says that Muslims should “tear out half of the Koran if they wished to stay in the Netherlands”, I don’t think he’s arguing for the immediate implementation of Free Speech. Free Speech hardly seems to be his objective…while having Muslims encouraged to leave the Netherlands and banning the Koran does appear to be his “message.”
I read that as saying that Wilders is saying that Muslims need to stop adhering to half of the Koran if they hope to remain civilized citizens of the Netherlands.
You cannot expect Wilders to mean that he expects Muslims to literally tear out pages of the Koran.
| 348 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:33:35pm |
re: #345 Quella
This is the exact quote from the citation I posted, and it does clearly support what I wrote…
No, it does not. He does not even mention the Koran in that quote, and he doesn’t say a word about “fairness.”
You may want to interpret it that way, but the link I posted shows very clearly that fairness is not even in the equation for him.
| 349 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:35:05pm |
re: #346 J.S.
Indeed. Wilders is not “simply a book banner”, he’s also a hater of Islam…
I agree he is a hater of Islam. But that does not mean he is someone who believes in banning even what he perceives as hate books as a normative matter.
350 |
UFO TOFU Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:35:08pm |
re: #341 Charles
By the way, Robert Spencer is now at Hot Air in the comments for their post, ranting away at me and at Allahpundit.
You certainly have been getting hammered by certain blogs lately. What I don’t understand is the claim that you quickly ban anyone not in lockstep with you. My experience is that you’ve been pretty even-handed, if not long-suffering before resorting to banning someone (Gordon comes to mind).
| 351 |
J.S. Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:35:28pm |
re: #347 Quella
O, I see, soooo, if Wilders were merely advocating for Muslims to metaphorically rip pages from their sacred texts, that’d be Ok?
| 352 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:36:28pm |
re: #340 Quella
Your time here gives you no special immunity from defending something that is patently wrong.
| 353 |
infidel4ever Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:38:03pm |
re: #346 J.S.
Indeed. Wilders is not “simply a book banner”, he’s also a hater of Islam…
How wrong and unreasonable of him. It is such a lovely, peaceful religion. we should all respect it…
Have you read the Koran? Looked at Islam’s history of the past 1400 years? Sheesh…
| 354 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:39:16pm |
re: #351 J.S.
O, I see, soooo, if Wilders were merely advocating for Muslims to metaphorically rip pages from their sacred texts, that’d be Ok?
It is a fact that large parts of the Koran include calls to violence and misogyny. Do you deny this? I read Wilders as simply saying that if he were in charge, Islamic citizens of the Netherlands would have to either not follow those verses, or leave the country.
I have no opinion either way on whether that is a good idea or would be an effective remedy for the problems in the Netherlands and beyond. But again - I do not read Wilders as saying literally the Koran has to be ripped up.
Wilders at least arguably also has a point about some of the more violent passages of the Koran. If you do not believe me, feel free to read the Koran yourself.
| 355 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:40:38pm |
re: #353 infidel4ever
How wrong and unreasonable of him. It is such a lovely, peaceful religion. we should all respect it…
Have you read the Koran? Looked at Islam’s history of the past 1400 years? Sheesh…
And that somehow is supposed to excuse doing what they have done in the past? Sorry, I don’t like even remotely the idea of trying to fight a gasoline fire by pouring more on it.
| 356 |
Achilles Tang Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:41:22pm |
re: #325 Quella
While it is understandable that Mein Kampf would have been banned after WWII, I am surprised to learn that it is still banned. Somehow I would have thought that they would have grown out of that 60+ years later and would have the courage to let people print it, just as one would wish that Muslims had enough self confidence and respect to shrug off cartoons.
Wilders wants to ban some books and Muslim will be sure to want to ban many more, and off we go to the races. Whatever Wilders set out to say, he seems to have garbled badly and now is just seen as someone foaming at the mouth.
He may have had courage to speak out when others did not, but he seems to have blown it by poor execution.
Where is Hirshi now that we need her?
| 357 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:43:04pm |
re: #348 Charles
No, it does not. He does not even mention the Koran in that quote, and he doesn’t say a word about “fairness.”
You may want to interpret it that way, but the link I posted shows very clearly that fairness is not even in the equation for him.
Wilders said he wants to have 100% freedom of speech, except for open calls to violence.
As such, it is very clear what he really is saying vis a vis the Koran. I completely disagree with your characterization of the man. I think at the very least you should post the link I posted where he said he is in favor of nearly total free speech.
Look, I hold not special place in my heart for Wilders and I am not sure if his movie Fitna was as even as effective as, for instance, Obsession. However, I believe it is important to accurately depict what the man stands for, especially given the fact that he may go to jail for his opinions about Islam.
| 358 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:43:14pm |
re: #354 Quella
Wilders at least arguably also has a point about some of the more violent passages of the Koran. If you do not believe me, feel free to read the Koran yourself.
I have, and all I see is the man is using a bad law to cover his fascist thinking instead of trying to have the bad law repealed.
| 359 |
nonic Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:43:46pm |
re: #338 infidel4ever
Yeah, well, reading Mein Kampf might inspire people to do stuff as well. It did before.
Exactly. Which is apparently why there are restrictions on its dissemination in Europe. But so far no restrictions on the koran, which seems at least anomalous.
I think the reason is that, in general in Europe, the Nazi party is small, weak, and discredited. So it’s fairly easy to restrict their seminal document. Whereas the islamists are powerful, growing, and greatly feared.
| 360 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:45:34pm |
re: #357 Quella
I hear the same call from Progressives and Democrats here in the US while at the same time they want to pass laws that tell us what we can consume, say, see, and eventually think.
| 361 |
J.S. Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:45:48pm |
re: #354 Quella
The Koran can be interpreted in many, many different ways. There are even (gasp!) interpretations that conflict! There is no “papal authority” with Islam. Obviously, some clerics have used passages of the Koran to endorse all sorts of things — from violence to misogyny. But the point is not “Have you read the Koran?” rather, it’s “how do the adherents behave?” If their conduct is such that it violates a law, then (obviously) in a democratic society there are remedies for that — namely, police charges, etc.
| 362 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:46:18pm |
re: #356 Naso Tang
While it is understandable that Mein Kampf would have been banned after WWII, I am surprised to learn that it is still banned. Somehow I would have thought that they would have grown out of that 60+ years later and would have the courage to let people print it, just as one would wish that Muslims had enough self confidence and respect to shrug off cartoons.
Wilders wants to ban some books and Muslim will be sure to want to ban many more, and off we go to the races. Whatever Wilders set out to say, he seems to have garbled badly and now is just seen as someone foaming at the mouth.
He may have had courage to speak out when others did not, but he seems to have blown it by poor execution.
Where is Hirshi now that we need her?
FINALLY a reply I agree with!
I completely agree that Wilders has badly garbled his message and Ayaan Hirsi Ali delivered a far more powerful and effective message. Sadly, this is probably why she had to leave the country.
But while I think Wilders has garbled his message, I believe that at least in honor for the 24/7 security guards he has it is important to get out the full story of the man - namely, that he did call for 100% free speech, and as such, it appears his call to ban the Koran was indeed an arguendo argument.
| 363 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:47:05pm |
re: #357 Quella
I think at the very least you should post the link I posted where he said he is in favor of nearly total free speech.
No.
| 364 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:47:09pm |
re: #362 Quella
So you just want a hive mind that is in total agreement with what YOU want. Try DKos or DU for that.
| 365 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:47:35pm |
re: #361 J.S.
The Koran can be interpreted in many, many different ways. There are even (gasp!) interpretations that conflict! There is no “papal authority” with Islam. Obviously, some clerics have used passages of the Koran to endorse all sorts of things — from violence to misogyny. But the point is not “Have you read the Koran?” rather, it’s “how do the adherents behave?” If their conduct is such that it violates a law, then (obviously) in a democratic society there are remedies for that — namely, police charges, etc.
There are interpretations and there are interpretations.
The clear text of the Koran does indeed call for murder of nonbelievers and second class status for women. There is even a wife beating sura. Again, please read the document yourself.
| 366 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:48:07pm |
re: #357 Quella
Why do you think you have any authority to tell Charles what he can and can’t post on HIS OWN BLOG?
| 367 |
Achilles Tang Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:49:20pm |
re: #362 Quella
Could be, and I don’t know the man’s mind except by impressions, but it does seem clear that he is building a following of the wrong sort, and not discouraging it.
That does make protestations against being misunderstood suspect.
| 368 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:49:43pm |
re: #365 Quella
I have and I find it reprehensible in a lot of what it says. I do not want it banned, though.
| 369 |
J.S. Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:50:05pm |
re: #365 Quella
O please. As if I couldn’t pull out a quote about X from any religious text — go read them! I dare you! Read them! So, what’s next banning the Talmud?
| 370 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:50:26pm |
re: #364 FurryOldGuyJeans
So you just want a hive mind that is in total agreement with what YOU want. Try DKos or DU for that.
What in tarnation is this supposed to mean? Where exactly did I imply I only wanted to surround myself with a comment I agreed with? What a ludicrous non-reply reply.
Charles,
I believe you devalue your site when you only give your opinion on a topic without giving the full story behind the topic. We will remain in disagreement about your posts concerning Mr. Wilders.
| 371 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:51:35pm |
re: #367 Naso Tang
Could be, and I don’t know the man’s mind except by impressions, but it does seem clear that he is building a following of the wrong sort, and not discouraging it.
That does make protestations against being misunderstood suspect.
Someone else is doing a good job lately of building a following of the wrong sort, and getting exposed for it here. Both men have a lot of defenders and socks spewing a lot of verbiage trying to disguise the stench.
| 372 |
Achilles Tang Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:52:35pm |
re: #370 Quella
You have been free to give your opinion. It would be smart to just take advantage of that and resist the temptation to tell others to state your opinion for you.
| 373 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:52:56pm |
re: #369 J.S.
O please. As if I couldn’t pull out a quote about X from any religious text — go read them! I dare you! Read them! So, what’s next banning the Talmud?
The difference is that the objectionable parts of the Torah have restrictions in their application. Namely, a Sanhedrin Council is necessary before putting anyone to death for violating Shabbat, and there has not been a Sanhedrin Council in 2,000 years. There furthermore is no call to arms against ANYONE except Amalek - a people who no longer exist.
The Koran is quite different. In contrast to the Torah, it is meant to be interpreted literally. And there are far fewer restrictions upon the call to arms. But do not take my word for this. Compare the documents yourself, as I did.
| 374 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:54:09pm |
re: #370 Quella
I believe you devalue your site when you only give your opinion on a topic without giving the full story behind the topic. We will remain in disagreement about your posts concerning Mr. Wilders.
I do not agree with your argument, and you haven’t backed it up at all. You’re really reaching for an interpretation that simply is not supported by Wilders’ statements.
| 376 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:55:13pm |
re: #367 Naso Tang
Could be, and I don’t know the man’s mind except by impressions, but it does seem clear that he is building a following of the wrong sort, and not discouraging it.
That does make protestations against being misunderstood suspect.
In any case, he is on trial for his speech about Islam and might be sent to jail. If nothing else, he should be supported, due to the ramifications of what could happen should he be convicted. You do not want to set a bad precedant.
| 377 |
J.S. Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:55:53pm |
re: #373 Quella
pffft! You are sooo naive. Go vist some neo-nazi site which lists all the “objectionable” bits and calls for the banning of Torah, Talmud, etc. As if your excuses would be listened to! Laughable.
| 378 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:56:26pm |
re: #370 Quella
I can see how using the man’s own words to condemn him would be unfair to you since you seem want a total whitewash and deification.
| 380 |
Achilles Tang Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:57:23pm |
re: #376 Quella
One can lobby for free speech without lobbying for the speaker, which seems to be what you are doing and catching flak.
| 381 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:59:02pm |
re: #377 J.S.
pffft! You are sooo naive. Go vist some neo-nazi site which lists all the “objectionable” bits and calls for the banning of Torah, Talmud, etc. As if your excuses would be listened to! Laughable.
There is a long history of Neonazis and antisemites putting forth false Talmudic quotes.
The Jewish faith does not support violence in the way the Islamic faith does. A mere examination of the competing foundational documents provides evidence of this.
And the Talmud is a series of arguments which go back and forth. The Talmud itself is over seven feet in length. It is not a “how to” manual on how to practice Judaism. There are numerous books which in fact interpret the Talmud. Modern Judaism is really based off the Shulchan Aruch and Maimonedes.
| 382 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:59:47pm |
re: #380 Naso Tang
One can lobby for free speech without lobbying for the speaker, which seems to be what you are doing and catching flak.
Defending someone that has made repeated calls for the suppression of same is not someone that needs support.
| 383 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:00:49pm |
re: #381 Quella
I see why you are so keen on defending Wilder. You want free speech only as you define it.
| 384 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:03:59pm |
re: #380 Naso Tang
One can lobby for free speech without lobbying for the speaker, which seems to be what you are doing and catching flak.
On my website I have not one post about Wilders, because I have mixed opinions about him.
However, I overall believe his case should be supported due to the terrible precedant it would set if he loses. I also believe some of his statements and positions have been misinterpreted by Charles, and remain convinced of that.
Regardless, even if his goal is to ban the Koran (which I do not support) I believe he has every right to call for the banning of the Koran, just as someone has the right to call for the banning of the Bible and Baghavad Gita. Someone should not be sent to jail for issuing such statements. They should only be sent to jail for open calls to violence.
“I may disagree with what you have to say, but I will defend your right to say it.”
| 385 |
J.S. Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:05:49pm |
re: #381 Quella
You really don’t get it, do you? Look, here’s the problem, the haters of religion X don’t give a rat’s ass about what the adherents of that religion claim. do you understand this? The haters are simply interested in getting the “bad bits” of a religion, “getting the quotes” (and, “no” it’s NOT just the “false quotes” — many use actual quotes, but taken totally out of context), then using it so as to scream, “Religion X opposes us and is a threat! A threat I tell you — look, just read these bits here! See? what did I tell you?” then, next thing you know, it “Ban the books” time. And Wilders is “Exhibit A.” (and, I might add, it’s what Christians did to the Talmud — burnt it — back in the Middle Ages.)
| 386 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:06:57pm |
re: #385 J.S.
You really don’t get it, do you? Look, here’s the problem, the haters of religion X don’t give a rat’s ass about what the adherents of that religion claim. do you understand this? The haters are simply interested in getting the “bad bits” of a religion, “getting the quotes” (and, “no” it’s NOT just the “false quotes” — many use actual quotes, but taken totally out of context), then using it so as to scream, “Religion X opposes us and is a threat! A threat I tell you — look, just read these bits here! See? what did I tell you?” then, next thing you know, it “Ban the books” time. And Wilders is “Exhibit A.” (and, I might add, it’s what Christians did to the Talmud — burnt it — back in the Middle Ages.)
Please read the Koran in its entirety and then come back with such statements.
I did exactly that and I can say it is not just “bits and pieces” of the Koran that trouble me.
| 387 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:08:05pm |
re: #384 Quella
No one has a right to call for banning a book, period. At least not in the United States of America. European countries created a mess by allowing it.
| 388 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:09:03pm |
re: #386 Quella
I have read it, and I do not want it banned. No IFs, ANDs, or BUTs.
| 389 |
J.S. Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:09:24pm |
re: #386 Quella
O really? So, now that you’ve read the Koran, you’re claiming to be a religious scholar to boot? and you know all how it’s interpreted? do you also consider yourself an Imam? (self-appointed?)
| 390 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:10:27pm |
re: #387 FurryOldGuyJeans
No one has a right to call for banning a book, period. At least not in the United States of America. European countries created a mess by allowing it.
Why don’t you get it?
No one should have the right to ban a book. But no one should go to jail for saying a book should be banned.
Should be pretty obvious.
| 391 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:11:46pm |
re: #390 Quella
Why don’t you get it?
No one should have the right to ban a book. But no one should go to jail for saying a book should be banned.
Should be pretty obvious.
Europe made this mess when they started banning books. You are the one missing the obvious and not “getting it”.
| 392 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:12:36pm |
re: #389 J.S.
O really? So, now that you’ve read the Koran, you’re claiming to be a religious scholar to boot? and you know all how it’s interpreted? do you also consider yourself an Imam? (self-appointed?)
I apparently have read the Koran and you apparently have not.
I do not claim to be a religious scholar, but all I said is that the facial interpretation of Islam is indeed worse than Judaism. (full disclosure: I did not study the New Testament - only Judaism and Islam)
If you would like to dispute such a statement, then feel free to read the relevant documents and provide evidence that I am wrong.
(for the record, even if the Koran was the worst document ever to exist in the history of mankind, I still would not advocate banning it; I am simply saying that there is reason to be concerned with what is in the Koran)
| 393 |
Achilles Tang Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:13:48pm |
re: #384 Quella
If I were in Holland I could write someone and set up a free speech movement, perhaps, and I strongly suspect many will.
LGF’s position on the matter has been made clear, and I think you agree with it in essence but you also seem prone to putting your foot in your mouth and sometimes sounding like you mean something different.
| 394 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:14:10pm |
re: #391 FurryOldGuyJeans
Europe made this mess when they started banning books. You are the one missing the obvious and not “getting it”.
Wilders did not ban any books. He suggested that a book be banned.
Do you believe he should go to jail for such a suggestion?
| 396 |
whatdafuq Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:16:31pm |
re: #385 J.S.
Do you have a notion of fairness? Let’s say there’s some authority that
has a rule. Should that authority enforce that rule uniformly or should it
discriminate and only enforce it on some people/ideas/books but not on
others?
If the former then that is exactly what Wilders is doing, it’s nothing about
“haters of religion X” versus “believers in religion X”.
If the latter then you are a very sad individual.
| 397 |
J.S. Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:18:04pm |
re: #392 Quella
I believe your position is switching here. Are you not then putting your claims into Wilders’ claims? (in other words, you’re acting like Wilders’ mouthpiece, but in reality, you’re not stating Wilders’ claims, it’s your claims on Wilders’ behalf) and, in the process you’re confusing the two?
| 398 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:18:17pm |
re: #394 Quella
Whether he goes or not isn’t up to MY opinion, its up to Dutch law and justice.
I don’t support him, period. I find his public views, no matter what the reasoning, to be reprehensible. Whether he is potentially jailed for those views is not up to me.
| 399 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:22:13pm |
re: #397 J.S.
I believe your position is switching here. Are you not then putting your claims into Wilders’ claims? (in other words, you’re acting like Wilders’ mouthpiece, but in reality, you’re not stating Wilders’ claims, it’s your claims on Wilders’ behalf) and, in the process you’re confusing the two?
I am against all laws which ban books and hate speech. However, should these laws exist, as they do in Europe, I can understand why some would think the Koran should be banned as hate speech.
I am not an Islamic scholar to make a determination that the Koran per se is hate speech, but I understand how someone else would come to such a conclusion.
And I believe that - given these hate speech laws exist - it is absurd to only apply them to certain hate ideologies and not others.
Regardless of what I believe, we are in for some tough times if Wilders is convicted for the crime of libelling Islam. We do NOT want to set a precedant wherein Islam (or any religion, for that matter) cannot be discussed and debated without fear of prosecution.
| 400 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:24:14pm |
re: #398 FurryOldGuyJeans
Whether he goes or not isn’t up to MY opinion, its up to Dutch law and justice.
I don’t support him, period. I find his public views, no matter what the reasoning, to be reprehensible. Whether he is potentially jailed for those views is not up to me.
So you would be fine with him going to jail because of his opinions about Islam?
And you call yourself someone who advocates freedom of speech? Do you even realize the terrible precedant that would set?
There is a reason that Alan Dershowitz has defended NeoNazis in the past. (not saying Wilders is a NeoNazi) It is because of the terrible precedant of jailing people for their speech, even NeoNazi speech.
| 401 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:25:19pm |
re: #399 Quella
And yet exonerating the man would only embolden the burgeoning Fascist movements growing throughout the world. No thanks.
| 402 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:27:06pm |
re: #401 FurryOldGuyJeans
And yet exonerating the man would only embolden the burgeoning Fascist movements growing throughout the world. No thanks.
This is your opinion and not fact. So you believe in increasing censorship as a “buttress” against the fascist movement?
Yet earlier you said you were against banning books and censorship.
Who is the hypocrite now?
| 403 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:27:17pm |
re: #400 Quella
So you would be fine with him going to jail because of his opinions about Islam?
And you call yourself someone who advocates freedom of speech? Do you even realize the terrible precedant that would set?
There is a reason that Alan Dershowitz has defended NeoNazis in the past. (not saying Wilders is a NeoNazi) It is because of the terrible precedant of jailing people for their speech, even NeoNazi speech.
Mr. Dershowitz deals with American Justice. Mr. Wilder is going to get a taste of Dutch Justice, which allows for suppression of free speech already by banning books. Strawman.
| 404 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:29:25pm |
re: #402 Quella
If Mr. Wilder were being tried here in the US that would be a different story. He is being tried by Dutch justice.
You want to compare apples and oranges here with your strawman arguments.
| 405 |
Quella Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:30:18pm |
re: #403 FurryOldGuyJeans
Mr. Dershowitz deals with American Justice. Mr. Wilder is going to get a taste of Dutch Justice, which allows for suppression of free speech already by banning books. Strawman.
It is not a strawman, because you apparently do not believe in uniformly applying the existing Dutch laws which ban hate speech. You earlier said that the answer to a bad law is to not seek itself enforcement - even if others were seeking its enforcement.
Anyway, I have actual life things to do. Good night.
| 406 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:32:59pm |
re: #405 Quella
The law by American standards is wrong, period.
He wants to use the law to ban speech he doesn’t approve of, as evidenced by his own public words, yet doesn’t want to be tried using the same law.
| 407 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:34:25pm |
re: #405 Quella
I said a bad law should be REPEALED, never applied or enforced, ever.
| 408 |
whatdafuq Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:49:51pm |
re: #407 FurryOldGuyJeans
Ah-ha!
So you want the law that prevents printing of Mein Kampf repealed?
That’s the same thing neo-nazis in Europe want.
So by the standard that get thrown about here quite a bit you are a fascist.
409 |
realwest Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:50:43pm |
Hey y’all - just had a window of time before dinner to drop in and say hi!
And I went over to Hot Air and virtually all of the comments that were negative about Charles were posted by Robert Spencer! What a surprise! I used to think - quite a while ago, now that I reflect on it, that Mr. Spencer was an intellectual who was helping to lead the charge against Islamo-fascism. Now it’s apparent to me that his technique for fighting Islamo-fascism is to join with European Fascists against Muslims, whether or not they are jihadists.
And his “the dog ate my homework” excuse for his facebook support of the group that wants to “liberate” Istanbul from the Turkish Muslims and give it back to White Christians ISN’T A NEW IDEA FOR HIM (although in fairness the genocide is) as Charles pointed out in the thread on this farce by Spencer, Spencer wrote the same damn thing on his own blog - Charles linked to it on that thread, so I won’t.
| 410 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:52:01pm |
re: #408 whatdafuq
So you want to call me a Fascist. Go right ahead, if that makes you happy.
Banning a book, no matter what it is, was a bad idea.
| 411 |
realwest Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:57:36pm |
re: #410 FurryOldGuyJeans
Ah hey, don’t sweat it:
Registered since: Apr 17, 2008 at 12:37 pm
(Logged in)
No. of comments posted: 42
No. of links posted: 0
Just another sleeper moby.
| 412 |
capitalist piglet Thu, Feb 12, 2009 5:00:25pm |
re: #409 realwest
Hey y’all - just had a window of time before dinner to drop in and say hi!
And I went over to Hot Air and virtually all of the comments that were negative about Charles were posted by Robert Spencer! What a surprise! I used to think - quite a while ago, now that I reflect on it, that Mr. Spencer was an intellectual who was helping to lead the charge against Islamo-fascism. Now it’s apparent to me that his technique for fighting Islamo-fascism is to join with European Fascists against Muslims, whether or not they are jihadists.
And his “the dog ate my homework” excuse for his facebook support of the group that wants to “liberate” Istanbul from the Turkish Muslims and give it back to White Christians ISN’T A NEW IDEA FOR HIM (although in fairness the genocide is) as Charles pointed out in the thread on this farce by Spencer, Spencer wrote the same damn thing on his own blog - Charles linked to it on that thread, so I won’t.
Oh believe me, r/w, a lot of the HotAir members are unhappy with Charles too, but they mostly appear to be banned former lizards carrying a grudge.
Mr. Spencer says that he is going to report “Cato the Elder” to Facebook for account abuse; I have asked him to elaborate on his reasoning for this (for what? Being made aware that Mr. Spencer joined a bad group?), and to offer evidence to support the continued implication that this was all a plot cooked up by Cato and Charles.
No answer yet.
413 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 5:02:41pm |
Over at Hot Air, Spencer says:
Clearly it was a setup. I was in a hurry and didn’t read the material about the group, but I am not at all sure that the group even said any of that when I joined it.
Right. Someone dreamed up the group, months ago, acquired 300+ members, lured Spencer into joining it yesterday, then changed what it said as soon as he did. Because we were waiting to pounce the minute he fell for it. Complete with a lengthy, misspelled screed as the “fake” statement-of-purpose for the group.
The man is either delusional or a liar on a grand scale. Take your pick.
Oh, and then he adds, “I am planning to report ‘Cato the Elder’ to Facebook for abuse of his account, for what it’s worth.”
Good luck with that. I’ve already reported the group itself, so getting me in trouble for exposing him as a member of that same group is really gonna fly. Pathetic.
Oh, and of course, in addition to changing the group’s self-proclaimed goals, we planted vile comments from members going back to last October! That’s how nefarious this plot was.
Like this, for example:
Gary Aronsson (Manchester) wrote
at 7:47pm on October 26th, 2008
Islam is the enemy of all mankind and has never lived in peace with other religions once it had even a large minority,never mind a majority!
Every land it now dominates was taken by force,we owe them NOTHING.They are nothing but the human equivalent of smallpox and should be destroyed without delay.
Just remember that Turkey was once ALL CHRISTIAN,ANKARA was once called CONSTANTINOPLE and the largest mosque in the world,HAGIA SOPHIA was once a CATHEDRAL!They will destroy us if they ever get the chance,no [bigoted word] is going to make me into a DHIMMI,if you want to be a slave to a muslim thats your choice but i’m not going to start treating some paedophile as a messenger from GOD!
ISLAM IS EVIL AND EVIL MUST BE DESTROYED!
Yes, that’s right, we made up a guy who doesn’t know the difference between Ankara and Istanbul, just to discredit Spencer three-and-a-half months later. Bwahaha.
| 414 |
realwest Thu, Feb 12, 2009 5:08:06pm |
re: #412 capitalist piglet
Hey! I saw you supporting Charles over there and thank you for that - I regrettably don’t have time to do it right, but the fact is that Spencer’s support seems to me to come from a) people who are convince of Spencer’s being an “intellectual” and b) disgruntled former LGFer’s. Neither, in either case, to be taken seriously. Spencer’s My dog ate my homework excuse just doesn’t fly. Period.
| 415 |
realwest Thu, Feb 12, 2009 5:12:27pm |
re: #413 Cato the Elder
Hey Cato my friend - Fuck Robert Spencer. Seriously.
The man just wouldn’t know the truth about his new(?) Neo-Nazi pals if it hit him in the face.
This bs excuse of his flies in the face of that which HE HIMSELF WROTE ON JIHADWATCH -to which Charles linked to in that thread out here in an update - minus the explicit genocide.
As I said last night, I’ve got your back my friend should you ever need it but Spencer is all hat, not cattle and I wouldn’t worry about it.
Indeed, it might be FUN if he does report you to Facebook - let’s see when he opened his account and FROM WHERE was it opened?!
| 416 |
realwest Thu, Feb 12, 2009 5:14:11pm |
Well it’s been grand but mom just called out dinner, so I’m outta here! Hope I get the chance to see you all down the road!
417 |
Sharmuta Thu, Feb 12, 2009 5:25:16pm |
re: #413 Cato the Elder
Yes- it’s a nefarious plot that was completely dependent on the mastermind’s abliity to pinpoint the exact moment in time to best take advantage of robert’s distracted mind, careless attention to detail, and reckless mouse clicking abandon.
| 418 |
whatdafuq Thu, Feb 12, 2009 5:27:35pm |
re: #410 FurryOldGuyJeans
I don’t want to call you a fascist. The word is thrown around so lightly it has
actually lost all meaning. But you’re missing the point.
People have been criticized here because they discuss associating with someone
who had, previously, had his picture taken next to a known racist. They’ve even
been attacked for joining a facebook group that also has members from the Aryan
Nations.
There is a palpable guilt-by-association going on (sometimes guilt twice removed).
I’m just pointing out how that knife can cut both ways. It’s stupid and ridiculous, isn’t
it? Yes, it is, even when applied to Geert Wilders or Robert Spencer.
| 419 |
kywrite Thu, Feb 12, 2009 5:28:18pm |
To Robert Spencer — Occam’s Razor, my friend. Now I have to question the accuracy of everything he ever wrote that I read — go back, read it all again, and redact things that I question now. Crap. I was really hoping that the facebook thing was somehow a mistake, that an assistant did it or a faker or something — but no. Every step he takes to kick over the trail makes it clearer that he really did do it.
I just downloaded Mein Kampf, Communist Manifesto, and a Quran Parallel a few days ago to read on my (now old-fashioned) PRS-500. Know thy enemy. If thou burnest thine enemy’s books, though, thou hast just slammed the door to knowledge.
My god. Crazies to both the left and right. The middle better start speaking up more. Hope I see you guys in a decade, after the next world war gets fought with the sensible people somewhere in the crossfire. Hell, I hope there are still books then too.
| 420 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 12, 2009 5:29:53pm |
We need to remember that we are not just in this to reinforce each others convictions. We need to convince those who do not see the problem that there is one. The fringe right that is going this way is not the issue. The dispirited center right that is fractured and the undecided center that wants to be “even handed” but, does not have the facts, is the issue. Reaching these people needs to be our main aim.
Indeed. And letting screaming banshees like PG and fascist enablers like RS do all the talking is not going to bring any reasonable person to see the true dangers of Islamo-Fascism. It drives people away, and for good reason.
| 421 |
dry_heavz_4_alla Thu, Feb 12, 2009 5:34:02pm |
re: #398 FurryOldGuyJeans
Whether he goes or not isn’t up to MY opinion, its up to Dutch law and justice.
I don’t support him, period. I find his public views, no matter what the reasoning, to be reprehensible. Whether he is potentially jailed for those views is not up to me.
Interesting that you’re fine with his going to jail being “up to Dutch law and justice,” but his suggestion that the Koran be treated like Mein Kampf in keeping with “Dutch law and justice” somehow warrants heeps of your scorn.
| 423 |
medaura18586 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 6:03:41pm |
re: #420 Cato the Elder
Indeed. And letting screaming banshees like PG and fascist enablers like RS do all the talking is not going to bring any reasonable person to see the true dangers of Islamo-Fascism. It drives people away, and for good reason.
This is the way I put it to Charles a few months ago when I first caught a whiff of Robert’s true colors regarding Kosovo: People like my parents, who would otherwise be open to sober warnings on the dangers of radical Islam, would completely discount everything written on JihadWatch (the good, the bad, and the ugly) and likely even third-party sources echoing JihadWatch material, as soon they’d ever come across his lies and sick revisionism about the Balkan conflicts and the history of the nations involved.
I myself had to question everything I thought I knew (I mean, info regarding the spread and effects of radical Islam in countries I have but second or third hand knowledge of) because I knew everything Robert was writing about Kosovo/Albania being a jihad state (and related fabrications and revisionisms) was a lie. I knew that because that’s my neck of the woods. What about what I read to be supposedly going on in Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, Egypt, etc?
Catching him flagrantly lying on one topic undermined my confidence on everything else, and I have since been in the habit of triple checking my sources on anything I learn regarding conflicts in lands far away. Especially when it comes to Islam, because sadly, I have learned that there are anti-Muslim haters out there. But I was convinced Islamofascism was a serious threat long before I ever heard Robert Spencer’s name.
What about someone who is on the edge, and who may have become aware of this reality, but his/her initiation to it is through RS, whose credibility is nil? Again, what would people like my parents (interested in reality but not very knowledgeable of the problem) take away from their first contact with the anti-Jihadi movement through RS?
Nothing good, nothing positive, nothing believable.
| 424 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 12, 2009 6:03:56pm |
Should’ve banned that one a long time ago.
| 425 |
Emery Calame Thu, Feb 12, 2009 6:09:45pm |
I’m a conservative, and so far the only books are want banned are those awful latter day Dune-spin off books written by Brian Herbert and Kevin J Anderson.
Some things are just way more important than mere liberty or integrity.
( Burt Larr voice : ” Rowr! Ffft. Puddem up! It’s Jolly sarcasm dontcha’ know! Huhuhuhuhhh! Fft! AHMA-LI-UN! HAH!-huhuhuhhh! ” )
| 426 |
Emery Calame Thu, Feb 12, 2009 6:11:11pm |
RE: #425….Change the first “are” to “I” and then PIMF on until morning.
| 427 |
Sharmuta Thu, Feb 12, 2009 6:15:02pm |
re: #423 medaura18586
Really well put, medaura. Thank you for your vigilance.
| 428 |
medaura18586 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 6:31:29pm |
re: #427 Sharmuta
Really well put, medaura. Thank you for your vigilance.
It’s an obligation to my conscience. I’ll be damned if I’ll allow my opinions and sentiments to be manipulated toward some sick cause I have no knowledge of. I have heard how deranged people sound when they’ve been made into useful idiots of one country’s/organization’s propaganda machine, railing off against people of my ancestry (both Albanian and Jewish). I will never let myself sound the same way against other people who have done me no harm. Carefully-crafted half-truths are easy to get carried away on. Vigilance is paramount: Robert Spencer has his books to sell, I have my integrity to preserve.
Anatolian reconquista… give me a break!
| 429 |
Tom on the rez Thu, Feb 12, 2009 6:43:07pm |
I’m a conservative, and so far the only books are want banned are those awful latter day Dune-spin off books written by Brian Herbert and Kevin J Anderson.
Some things are just way more important than mere liberty or integrity.
( Burt Larr voice : ” Rowr! Ffft. Puddem up! It’s Jolly sarcasm dontcha’ know! Huhuhuhuhhh! Fft! AHMA-LI-UN! HAH!-huhuhuhhh! ” ) Someone had to say it! Dig up your dad’s skeleton and make dance around!
And, uh, oh yeah, Spencer looks like an asshole, and Charles is too quick with the ban.
| 431 |
capitalist piglet Thu, Feb 12, 2009 7:15:22pm |
re: #414 realwest
Hey! I saw you supporting Charles over there and thank you for that - I regrettably don’t have time to do it right, but the fact is that Spencer’s support seems to me to come from a) people who are convince of Spencer’s being an “intellectual” and b) disgruntled former LGFer’s. Neither, in either case, to be taken seriously. Spencer’s My dog ate my homework excuse just doesn’t fly. Period.
They’re coming after me now, ‘cause apparently I asked the wrong question…which I suppose can now be defined as any question at all.
I’ve given the guy the benefit of the doubt on the “Oops! I joined a fascist newsgroup!” deal - I just want to know why he is trying to go after the people who happened to notice. It’s a simple question. No answer yet, incidentally.
432 |
Throbert McGee Thu, Feb 12, 2009 7:16:54pm |
re: #223 Occasional Reader
Another banning nominee, while we’re at it: Time and Again. Interesting concept, turned into an excruciatingly boring novel.
Oh, good — I thought it was just me.
| 433 |
Tom on the rez Thu, Feb 12, 2009 8:00:16pm |
New T-shirt: I accidently joined a fascist facebook group, and all I got was this human skin lampshade!
| 434 |
Miles Smit Thu, Feb 12, 2009 8:31:30pm |
I’m Canadian, and this story is just unbelievable to me. Thinking back on WWII, could we (North Americans) really be asked to rescue a suicidal Europe yet again?
| 435 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Fri, Feb 13, 2009 2:26:51am |
re: #434 Miles Smit
I’m Canadian, and this story is just unbelievable to me. Thinking back on WWII, could we (North Americans) really be asked to rescue a suicidal Europe yet again?
You betcha! And the French will hate us even more for it!
| 436 |
tatterdemalian Fri, Feb 13, 2009 6:13:54am |
I don’t know if unbanning all books is such a good idea. I’ve seen too many people instantly swayed by “The Protocols” and “Mein Kampf,” even copies with all the logical fallacies highlighted and debunked.
The sad fact is that people take action based on what they believe, even if they know it to be untrue. The books were written by liars, who knew exactly where and when they were lying, and took steps to convince the reader than anyone who points out the lies is part of the enemy conspiracy. It would be masterful if it wasn’t so dangerous to people unaware of advanced logical fallacies.
| 437 |
quella Fri, Feb 13, 2009 8:24:17am |
re: #421 dry_heavz_4_alla
Interesting that you’re fine with his going to jail being “up to Dutch law and justice,” but his suggestion that the Koran be treated like Mein Kampf in keeping with “Dutch law and justice” somehow warrants heeps of your scorn.
That was exactly my point. It is quite astonishing what I am seeing on this site.
“Don’t follow the law…except when I want the law followed.”
Terrible precedant that sets. It is often said that hard cases make bad law, and that is exactly what I saw being advocated on this thread: bad law.
| 438 |
whatdafuq Fri, Feb 13, 2009 10:01:14am |
Excellent article at National Review Online today by Andrew McCarthy basically
lamenting Britain’s refusal of entry to Geert Wilders. It includes a great quote
from none other than Winston Churchill who called Mein Kampf (remember,
this is the book that is already banned under Dutch law and it wasn’t Wilders
who got it banned):
“the new Koran of faith and war: turgid, verbose, shapeless, but
pregnant with its message.”
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