Pajamas TV has posted the video of their hearing on the impact of the stimulus bill on health care (this video is free): Pajamas TV - Specials - DC Stimulus Bill Hearing - Video.
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vagabond trader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:35:33pm |
Watch your back, especially if you are of a certain age. I trust the gov with my health as much as I trust them with, um, uh, er, oh yeah….ANYTHING!
| 4 |
Killian Bundy Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:36:41pm |
Your electronic health records will be shared with and compiled by the Federal government.
/what could possibly go wrong with that?
| 5 |
Right mind left Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:37:34pm |
Will we need to have independent news networks dig into the REAL news from here on out? Until the Fairness Doctrine, I guess…
| 6 |
Golem Akbar Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:37:46pm |
Has anyone heard from the AMA? Are they in favor of this bill?
| 7 |
ArmyWife Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:38:37pm |
re: #6 Golem Akbar
I read an article at work about physicians being very, very concerned with this. Let me see if I can find a link to it…
| 8 |
Soona' Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:39:28pm |
re: #6 Golem Akbar
Has anyone heard from the AMA? Are they in favor of this bill?
The members that’ll profit the most from this probably will be.
| 9 |
vagabond trader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:39:31pm |
re: #7 ArmyWife
I would certainly hope they are concerned. Nurses and other support staff should be bellowing about it.
| 11 |
Last Mohican Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:41:30pm |
re: #6 Golem Akbar
Has anyone heard from the AMA? Are they in favor of this bill?
AMA applauds senate for investing in health care through stimulus
| 12 |
Golem Akbar Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:42:28pm |
re: #8 Soona’
The members that’ll profit the most from this probably will be.
I read somewhere that doctors are afraid the new health legislation will kill med school applications, that doctors will no longer be able to make a good living in medicine. Until now, foreign doctors have flocked to the US because they had a chance to earn some serious bucks. The fear is that those times may be over. I’d be curious to read what the AMA thinks.
| 13 |
LGoPs Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:42:51pm |
The same bunch of geniuses that run the DMV are now going to be making your health care decisions……..
Heaven help us.
| 14 |
Soona' Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:44:09pm |
re: #13 LGoPs
The same bunch of geniuses that run the DMV are now going to be making your health care decisions……..
Heaven help us.
They already are in many cases.
| 15 |
sngnsgt Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:44:18pm |
re: #4 Killian Bundy
I thought they stopped using punch cards years ago..?
| 16 |
KingKenrod Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:44:38pm |
Of course the AMA supports it, it has billions in research and health care grants.
| 17 |
formercorpsman Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:44:49pm |
Pelosi, Kucinich, Paul, etc.
Hopefully none of the will have a say in pushing the potassium.
| 19 |
Soona' Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:47:06pm |
re: #17 formercorpsman
Pelosi, Kucinich, Paul, etc.
Hopefully none of the will have a say in pushing the potassium.
Don’t be surprised at anything. My feelings are that if this happens, Pelosi will be slathering to write the first national euthanasia laws.
| 20 |
Silhouette Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:47:49pm |
re: #5 Right mind left
Will we need to have independent news networks dig into the REAL news from here on out? Until the Fairness Doctrine, I guess…
Pajamas TV has a subscription program which you can join in you’d like to make sure they are successful and stay around.
The cheapest is $15/month but a little birdie told me they are thinking about offering $5/month plan.
| 21 |
ArmyWife Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:49:06pm |
From the AMA site
Incentive payment structures for health information technology (HIT) adoption differ. In particular, the imposition of Medicare payment reductions for those providers who are not “meaningful users” of HIT would begin in 2015 in the Senate bill, one year earlier than in the House bill.There were widespread reports and commentaries this week that mischaracterize some provisions of the package pertaining to HIT and to comparative effectiveness research. To clarify, neither version of the bill would create a federal system for electronically tracking patients’ medical treatments or for monitoring compliance with federal treatment standards. While the legislation would impose financial penalties for those who do not adopt HIT in the next 6-7 years, those penalties bear no relation to individual treatment decisions made by physicians. Further, neither bill would create a single new bureaucracy to determine whether treatments are appropriate or cost effective. In fact, both versions of the bill incorporate by reference provisions in current law that prohibit the Secretary of Health and Human Services from including mandates establishing national clinical guidelines or national coverage decisions in clinical comparative effectiveness research.
[Link: www.ama-assn.org…]
| 23 |
Silhouette Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:50:04pm |
The lefties think we’ll all get the Mayo Clinic.
But they need to recall what the free clinic is like.
| 24 |
Silhouette Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:50:57pm |
You can have world class health care that some cannot afford, or you can have crappy health care for everyone.
| 25 |
vagabond trader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:51:59pm |
re: #23 Silhouette
Oh, the chosen lefties will get top notch care. The little folks who pay taxes, not so hot.
| 26 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:53:47pm |
re: #23 Silhouette
The lefties think we’ll all get the Mayo Clinic.
But they need to recall what the free clinic is like.
Mao clinic me thinks.
| 27 |
Empire1 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:54:14pm |
I’m rather glad my parents were able to die in comfort, unworried about health care, when the military retiree health care promises were still being honored. That no longer applies, and this just makes things worse for retirees and their dependents.
Tricare sucks.
| 29 |
fish Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:55:29pm |
My youngest was born 4 months premature. She was given a very poor prognosis and was not expected to survive the first night. A team of 13 doctors and nurses worked on her for 17 hours to get her stabilized enough to be transferred to the NICU at the Children’s hospital a few blocks away. She spent the next 4 months there, during which time she was never considered likely to ever leave.
It is my understanding that under the new rule, the doctors would have had to justify the effort to the Efficiency Department as being likely to succeed and that she would be likely to live a productive life.
Since at no point were the doctors convinced of this likelihood I doubt they would have been able to convince a bureaucrat of it. Treatment would most likely have been denied.
She will be 6 next month and has no significant health or neurological problems. She is a normal little girl. The thought that some other child like my daughter may be denied a chance because of this sickens me. I realize that little can be done at this point to stop this, but maybe we can spread the word and start working to overturn it.
| 30 |
fish Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:58:07pm |
re: #21 ArmyWife
From the AMA site
[Link: www.ama-assn.org…]
If this is true and I have been upset by mis-characterization I will be very pleased.
| 31 |
jwb7605 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 2:58:29pm |
Semi OT, part of an e-mail I just got:
Dan Seals is in the midst of a medical crises in his treatment for cancer at the Bethesda hospital, and is in intense pain at this moment. He is faced with a major surgery to cope with this emergency, and the prospects are unknown at this time.
| 32 |
Boolz Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:00:31pm |
you would think the proponents of socialized health care would be singing the praises of all the socialized health care we already have…medicare for the old, medicaid for the poor, VA for veterans. They should be pointing out about how everybody on these systems always get the care they need when they need it, about how cheap these programs are, and about how wonderful it would be if just the rest of us were on them too. But for some strange reason, they never do.
| 33 |
ArmyWife Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:07:30pm |
re: #27 Empire1
there wasn’t a promise for that, though I know that myth runs rampant. Tricare does suck - but not for those reasons.
[Link: www.law.umaryland.edu…]
| 34 |
schnapp Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:07:47pm |
re: #12 Golem Akbar
rubbish. in every country with universal health care doctors are given huge pay.
| 35 |
ArmyWife Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:08:21pm |
re: #30 fish
It seems weird to me if the AMA interpretation is correct and the rest of the nation is wrong. I guess I should go read it for myself!
| 36 |
kcladderman Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:10:13pm |
re: #31 jwb7605
Semi OT, part of an e-mail I just got:
Dan Seals is in the midst of a medical crises in his treatment for cancer at the Bethesda hospital, and is in intense pain at this moment. He is faced with a major surgery to cope with this emergency, and the prospects are unknown at this time.
The pain from cancer can be horrible. I watched my mother suffer for hours because of a mistake on her charts that stop her morphine. She had been on very large doses for days and some how her medication got switched to Tylenol 3. It was hours before they got the pain under control and she dies just a few hours later. Her last day on earth was filled with horrible pain all because of a paperwork error.
I pray they can help Dan with his pain. I have been a fan for years both England Dan and the country star.
| 37 |
Empire1 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:14:57pm |
re: #33 ArmyWife
there wasn’t a promise for that, though I know that myth runs rampant. Tricare does suck - but not for those reasons.
[Link: www.law.umaryland.edu…]
Not a legal promise, perhaps, but one my parents were able to make use of until their deaths, and Mr. Empire and I were able to use until ten years after he retired. So don’t tell me it was a myth!
| 38 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:16:00pm |
re: #34 schnapp
rubbish. in every country with universal health care doctors are given huge pay.
so that’s why so many of them come here huh?
| 39 |
schnapp Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:20:54pm |
| 40 |
Cymbaline Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:20:57pm |
From Thomas Sowell’s column this week:
Do you want to have to jump through bureaucratic hoops when you are sick? If not, why would you be in favor of government-run medical care?
| 41 |
Cymbaline Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:24:39pm |
re: #36 kcladderman
The pain from cancer can be horrible. I watched my mother suffer for hours because of a mistake on her charts that stop her morphine. She had been on very large doses for days and some how her medication got switched to Tylenol 3. It was hours before they got the pain under control and she dies just a few hours later. Her last day on earth was filled with horrible pain all because of a paperwork error.
I pray they can help Dan with his pain. I have been a fan for years both England Dan and the country star.
That’s awful! My sincere condolences to your family.
| 42 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:25:59pm |
re: #39 schnapp
here are the base salary rates for doctors in australia
tell me that they are low paid here? i don’t know of any doctors that have moved to the US just because they are chasing money. doctors become doctors because they want to help people.
that’s true… hard to help people when the care is rationed. i guess it’s not the money after all.
| 43 |
ArmyWife Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:28:41pm |
re: #37 Empire1
I come from a long line of Military (Army specifically, both my Grandfathers, my father and now, of course, I am married to it). My dad retired - he never thought he had “free for life”, he does pay for the retiree Tricare plan. My husband never thought that would be a benefit (but he is a medic, so perhaps he was closer to the health care system and that’s why). I would guess because the thought was so rampant (and I know it was) that people really and truly believed it to be true.
| 44 |
schnapp Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:32:32pm |
re: #40 Cymbaline
i don’t know where you get this false information from about public health care. i haven’t ever experienced “bureaucratic hoops” and the government has never taken away choice from me. i have the choice of my own phycisian and although if i use the public system i don’t get my own doctor (i still have the option of private health care) i actually do get treated. and when the ambulance takes some one away here who has been in a car crash, the person hanging on to life doesn’t have to give insurance details or sign any piece of paper. you get treated. simple.
so in fact i have more choice than in the US. i can go to a private hospital and get treated when i want by who i want. but if i lost my job i cuold still actually get treated, even if i have “less choice”. that is unlike tens of millions of americans.
| 45 |
schnapp Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:34:12pm |
re: #42 brookly red
ha. at least i have never been in a position to sell my own home because i can’t afford health care costs. real efficient system (that costs the US double what it costs australia)
| 46 |
snowcrash Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:38:16pm |
re: #44 schnapp
Do you have any data on avg. wait time for CABG or hip replacements in patients over 70 years old?
| 47 |
Dan G. Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:40:40pm |
re: #27 Empire1
Universal Health Care… Tricare for everyone! That should be enough to scare the shit out of anyone.
| 48 |
schnapp Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:42:11pm |
nope. but i know its quicker in the private system here. you can get treated immediately. but. at least you are not denied care because you don’t have the right insurance or none at all. i am sure that the 40 something million people in the US without insurance would love a private system. they would have to wait, but they would get care.
| 49 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:42:24pm |
re: #45 schnapp
ha. at least i have never been in a position to sell my own home because i can’t afford health care costs. real efficient system (that costs the US double what it costs australia)
OK, glad you like yours… now just stay away from mine. Fair enough?
| 50 |
vagabond trader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:43:27pm |
re: #48 schnapp
You are misinformed. No one in the USA can be denied treatment at a public hospital.
| 51 |
Gray Skies Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:44:38pm |
My two bits’ worth… one of the common complaints I hear from those favoring a national health care system is that the insurance companies should not be making health care decisions - those decisions should be between the doctor and patient. So how is a government board making those decisions any different?
Secondly, my son-in-law is a physician in a field of medicine that is experiencing a huge shortage of expertise right now. He absolutely refuses to continue in practice if national health care is implemented. The quality of care will deteriorate, in his opinion, and he does NOT want to deal with government bureaucracy. Dealing with Medicare right now is a nightmare as it is. He says that many doctors will voluntarily cease to be doctors anymore, and the government will have to hire from overseas.
Finally, the government is getting intrusive enough without having ready access to people’s personal medical information. This all has a very bad feel to it, and there is more behind it than meets the eye, in my humble opinion.
| 52 |
schnapp Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:46:23pm |
re: #49 brookly red
nope. i will to continue to critisize your inefficient, costly and unfair system because i believe that everybody deserves health care regardless if they can pay for it.
| 53 |
ArmyWife Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:50:18pm |
re: #48 schnapp
Firstly, we have health care subsidized by state governments for those who are poor and uncovered, as well as some federal programs. Sadly, Ms. Pelosi and her Merry Band of Thieves have expanded S-chip to cover people earning up to $65,000/yr - which, surprisingly, is only $5,000 less then the Dems new definition of “rich” which is $70,000. Secondly, for those that are able, McDonald’s offers health care benefits for it’s employees.
I’m not up on Australian health care, luckily I have a really good friend who immigrated from Australia to here. I’ll ask him if he feels the same as you, just as a counter check. I do know we get a lot of people in from Canada and the UK for our care here. I don’t think that’s a coincidence. I don’t believe our current system is perfect - I do believe it is the best system currently in existence.
| 55 |
vagabond trader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:51:07pm |
re: #51 Gray Skies
So true. Yes, the system does need an overhaul, but not by this commie & Co. in the WH.The thought of these slimeballs controlling our access to healthcare should concern all Americans.
| 56 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:53:01pm |
re: #52 schnapp
nope. i will to continue to critisize your inefficient, costly and unfair system because i believe that everybody deserves health care regardless if they can pay for it.
critisize all you want, but just remember that it IS our system, not yours.
got it? not yours, not yours, not yours… so get over it.
| 58 |
acwgusa Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:53:46pm |
re: #52 schnapp
Despite what the Democrats/Socialists/United Nations HRC say, Health Care in the United States is NOT a right. No one is entitled to anything in this county (US), besides life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. No one deserves anything in the US. You want something here? You work for it! Being handed something because you can claim your victim card is bigger then the next guy is completely against what the US stood for before President Barack Ohandout.
| 59 |
schnapp Thu, Feb 12, 2009 3:59:04pm |
re: #54 Dan G.
because health care is a matter of life and death. you don’t get treated - you die. the only other universal service should be education because access to basic health care and education give people equal opportunity.
| 60 |
vagabond trader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:01:29pm |
re: #59 schnapp
Yeah, we know, it’s for the children.
| 61 |
debutaunt Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:03:09pm |
re: #59 schnapp
because health care is a matter of life and death. you don’t get treated - you die. the only other universal service should be education because access to basic health care and education give people equal opportunity.
You seem to be very concerned about this topic. Are you in the health care industry?
| 62 |
acwgusa Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:07:09pm |
re: #59 schnapp
because health care is a matter of life and death. you don’t get treated - you die. the only other universal service should be education because access to basic health care and education give people equal opportunity.
Here’s a nasty little hint for your pie in the blue sky world. People DIE. Even if they get treated.
Oh, and Equal Opportunity isn’t a right either.
| 63 |
schnapp Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:12:24pm |
re: #61 debutaunt
i am a very open and big supporter of america and wish it the best. there are however a few things in america that i don’t like. for example i don’t like guns. i also don’t like the health care system. no where in the world has a good health care system though. i believe that health care should be private and public. australia’s is good, but should be more privatized.
| 64 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:14:02pm |
re: #62 acwgusa
Oh, and Equal Opportunity isn’t a right either.
actually I think it is… but equal results are not guaranteed
| 65 |
debutaunt Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:14:28pm |
re: #63 schnapp
i am a very open and big supporter of america and wish it the best. there are however a few things in america that i don’t like. for example i don’t like guns. i also don’t like the health care system. no where in the world has a good health care system though. i believe that health care should be private and public. australia’s is good, but should be more privatized.
Where do you live?
| 67 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:17:58pm |
re: #63 schnapp
i am a very open and big supporter of america and wish it the best. there are however a few things in america that i don’t like. for example i don’t like guns. i also don’t like the health care system. no where in the world has a good health care system though. i believe that health care should be private and public. australia’s is good, but should be more privatized.
back pedaling… it’s a right or it’s not
| 68 |
vagabond trader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:18:37pm |
re: #63 schnapp
Oooo, you would really hate where I live. My entire neighborhood owns guns legally, we have virtually no crime, and it’s not a coincidence.
| 69 |
schnapp Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:22:00pm |
re: #67 brookly red
it is a right.
there are many things i like about the US system. what i don’t like is that it is inefficient and costly and the government should have better infrastructure and services for a public system alongside a private system.
| 70 |
Gray Skies Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:24:28pm |
re: #55 vagabond trader
Another thing…I managed benefit appeals for a local HMO until 6 months ago. I did this for 20 years. I am well familiar with the health care benefit package for Federal employees. It is soooo rich in benefits compared to those offered by the individual and other small employer group plans we marketed. Almost everything was/is covered for the Feds. Second in line was the benefit package for State employees. Yet it was enrollees on these two plans that complained the most when small copays were added to the plans a few years ago. I believe that the Fed standard option plan now also has a coinsurance provision, and there was a huge outcry from enrollees against even this. They do not want to pay for anything, even though their fellow citizens in the private sector, if they even have insurance, are paying huge premiums and significant cost shares.
If there is a mandated national health care system, it needs to apply equally across the board to ALL Americans. And those formerly enrolled under the above-mentioned plans will fall over in shock at their new benefit package and the government-established clinical protocol in place to determine who gets what. There is absolutely NO WAY that a national system can provide (for everyone) the level of benefits that is currently allowed for government workers.
| 71 |
debutaunt Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:27:02pm |
re: #66 schnapp
australia.
I don’t understand the point of griping about guns and healthcare in the US? How does it affect you?
| 72 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:28:49pm |
re: #69 schnapp
it is a right.
there are many things i like about the US system. what i don’t like is that it is inefficient and costly and the government should have better infrastructure and services for a public system alongside a private system.
i am taxed heavily enough for the health care of others thank you…
now if you don’t mind, i don’t put my nose in your affairs, maybe you should attend to matters at home.
| 74 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:30:25pm |
| 75 |
vagabond trader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:31:21pm |
re: #70 Gray Skies
We live in Ct where the state is the biggest employer, and they are exactly as you describe, sacred cows. My late mother in law worked for them and she was dumbfounded to learn that her son did not have unlimited 100% paid for health care forever. It’s the entitlement mentality on steroids.
| 76 |
snowcrash Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:31:46pm |
Hey schnapp, I’d make food a right before I made medicine one. What do you think is a more basic need. lol
| 77 |
Gray Skies Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:33:59pm |
re: #66 schnapp
One of the managers at the HMO I worked at was a woman from Australia. We were having a discussion around the cost of benefits and coverage, and she told me that the elderly in Australia in fact are denied certain treatments. She said that there are places run by the government (at no charge to the resident) where these people can go until they pass, and they are treated “royally” until that time comes.
To your knowledge, is this true?
| 78 |
vagabond trader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:34:10pm |
re: #76 snowcrash
In Australia, I’d be wailing on the government to allow people to clear the fcking brush off and adjacent to their property.
| 79 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:34:42pm |
re: #76 snowcrash
Hey schnapp, I’d make food a right before I made medicine one. What do you think is a more basic need. lol
we have programs for that too…
| 80 |
Gray Skies Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:37:16pm |
re: #75 vagabond trader
We at one time had to cover Viagra for the Feds (for its most commonly known diagnosis). You should have heard the Fed enrollees scream when that was taken away.
| 82 |
vagabond trader Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:42:57pm |
re: #80 Gray Skies
lol, poor dears, bet their wives are glad.
| 83 |
Gray Skies Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:43:53pm |
re: #81 schnapp
Thanks - I was just wondering if someone else from Australia might know this.
| 84 |
Gray Skies Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:44:53pm |
re: #82 vagabond trader
Yep, it was always the man that complained.
| 85 |
acwgusa Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:47:53pm |
re: #64 brookly red
Oh, and Equal Opportunity isn’t a right either.
actually I think it is… but equal results are not guaranteed
You’re correct, I was thinking of equal outcome.
| 86 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 12, 2009 4:50:39pm |
| 87 |
jorline Thu, Feb 12, 2009 5:38:38pm |
Obama said they were going to go through the budget line by line.
Appears Obama got tired of reading the budget and said fuck-it, there are to many lines.
| 88 |
the1sgjohns Thu, Feb 12, 2009 6:16:54pm |
Gregg withdraws as commerce secretary nominee
Whoa! another one bites the dust. But is it not 4 who have bit the dust, not 3 as stated in this article? Let’s count kids; One for Richardson, One for Daschle, One for the new cabinet position as accountability czar, I for get the woman’s name, and One for Gregg. That’s 4. Hmmm what other fuzzy math is out there now.
| 90 |
Code Red 21 Thu, Feb 12, 2009 7:12:11pm |
re: #59 schnapp
because health care is a matter of life and death. you don’t get treated - you die. the only other universal service should be education because access to basic health care and education give people equal opportunity.
I work in health care and have done so for 23 years. In all of the years that I have worked in the health care field I have yet to see one patient turned away or denied treatment. Where are you getting your info?
The uninsured in this country are people that I personally know who don’t want to fork over the money, and they can afford it, because they would rather spend their money on something more important to them like alcohol, drugs and cigarettes. There is no way in hell I want a government employee deciding what is best for me. We hear constantly about staying out of a woman’s uterus when it comes to abortion well I want them to stay totally out of any decisions about my body. They can f off and as far as I’m concerned, so can you.
| 91 |
dapperdave Thu, Feb 12, 2009 7:37:27pm |
Sounds like trickle down government to me, I’m running as far away from this crap has I possibly can.
| 92 |
kynna Thu, Feb 12, 2009 7:51:25pm |
re: #88 the1sgjohns
Gregg withdraws as commerce secretary nominee
Whoa! another one bites the dust. But is it not 4 who have bit the dust, not 3 as stated in this article? Let’s count kids; One for Richardson, One for Daschle, One for the new cabinet position as accountability czar, I for get the woman’s name, and One for Gregg. That’s 4. Hmmm what other fuzzy math is out there now.
Gregg has paid his taxes. His job was being gutted (unconstitutionally, IMO) so he did the first smart thing he’s done in this whole fiasco. Did he actually resign his seat? Arrogant politicians. I have no patience for them.
| 93 |
GGMac Thu, Feb 12, 2009 7:52:55pm |
re: #31 jwb7605
Semi OT, part of an e-mail I just got:
Dan Seals is in the midst of a medical crises in his treatment for cancer at the Bethesda hospital, and is in intense pain at this moment. He is faced with a major surgery to cope with this emergency, and the prospects are unknown at this time.
Is this about Dan Seals the singer - or Dan Seals the Chicago politician?
| 94 |
kynna Thu, Feb 12, 2009 7:55:47pm |
re: #59 schnapp
because health care is a matter of life and death. you don’t get treated - you die. the only other universal service should be education because access to basic health care and education give people equal opportunity.
There was a Canadian Lizard on here recently detailing how his mother’s diagnostic procedures and treatment were put off so long that they (government-run health care ‘they’) have decided there’s nothing they can do and she will just have to die with dignity.
Had she lived in the US, even without health insurance, she’d have been treated. Would she die from her cancer? Probably. Everybody dies, after all. But she would not have been dismissed.
You are tragically ill-informed for someone who claims to ‘care about these issues.’
| 95 |
schnapp Thu, Feb 12, 2009 7:55:54pm |
re: #90 Code Red 21
no need to snap at me. is open debate something you can’t handle? maybe you don’t want open debate because you don’t actually know anything about universal health care. i live in a country where anyone can get health care through the public or private system and people with mental illnesses such as drug and alcohol addiction are given the chance to get their lives on track.
i don’t know where you get it from that a government employee decides anything for you. it works the same way in a public system. you and the doctors decide what is the best treatment and the govt pays most or all of the bill. and yes the public system is slow and overcrowded, but it doesn’t cost 16% of GDP like it does in america. those who don’t want the hassle of public health care use the private system, where the quality of care is on par with the US. those who can’t afford treatment at the private system settle with the public.
| 96 |
schnapp Thu, Feb 12, 2009 8:01:00pm |
re: #94 kynna
i have said countless times that public systems are inefficient. in australia you can get private care (which from memory accounts for about 40% of health care expenditure). but if you have private alongside public, with a little more private than we have here, the public system is under less stress.
a for-profit hospital is more likely however to turn you back if it is not profitable to operate. then what? basically without a another place that will actually do the treatment, you’re fucked.
| 97 |
Sloppy Thu, Feb 12, 2009 8:09:15pm |
It’s sort of standard to cite the DMV as an example of governmental inefficiency. As a matter of fairness I’d like to note that the DMV branch in my neighborhood is fast, efficient, accurate and friendly. I wouldn’t hesitate to put those good folks in charge of health care.
| 98 |
kynna Thu, Feb 12, 2009 8:12:49pm |
re: #97 Sloppy
It’s sort of standard to cite the DMV as an example of governmental inefficiency. As a matter of fairness I’d like to note that the DMV branch in my neighborhood is fast, efficient, accurate and friendly. I wouldn’t hesitate to put those good folks in charge of health care.
And they’d do a great job, right. The DMV in NJ where I used to live was slow, rude, negligent, incompetent, and corrupt (the very office where I got my DL was found to be providing fake DLs left and right). They are more the norm for a DMV.
You’re lucky. But I don’t want to trust my nation’s health care to luck.
| 99 |
kynna Thu, Feb 12, 2009 8:16:36pm |
re: #96 schnapp
i have said countless times that public systems are inefficient. in australia you can get private care (which from memory accounts for about 40% of health care expenditure). but if you have private alongside public, with a little more private than we have here, the public system is under less stress.
a for-profit hospital is more likely however to turn you back if it is not profitable to operate. then what? basically without a another place that will actually do the treatment, you’re fucked.
You still don’t get it. A private hospital won’t turn people away if there’s not a public hospital to send them to. They will be sued up the gazoo.
“For profit” = “responsibility”
“Government run” = “no recourse”
(BTW — sue a gov’t run institution and you pay the reward yourself along with all the other tax payers — nothing is free)
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