Washington State Creationist Wants to Legalize the ‘Supreme Ruler of the Universe’

Weird • Views: 4,705

A textbook example of being unclear on the concept of “the separation of church and state.”

Kim Struiksma doesn’t think evolution should be taught in schools. So the 25-year-old Blaine resident, along with a group of friends from her church, have fashioned Initiative 1040, which “concerns a supreme ruler of the universe.”

The initiative would prohibit “state use of public money or lands for anything that denies or attempts to refute the existence of a supreme ruler of the universe, including textbooks, instruction or research,” according to paperwork filed on the Washington Secretary of State’s Web site.

Struiksma said during a telephone interview Wednesday, Feb. 18, that the initiative version online is being revamped and a second one would be offered to improve some of the language. “I think probably at least that more creation science is overlooked as not belonging in the public school system because of the religion (aspect),” she said.

Citing the state Constitution, the U.S. Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, the initiative states it “is about requiring our government to do its job, to protect our liberty, a liberty which has been endowed by our Creator, the one responsible for Blessing us, the Supreme Ruler of the Universe.” …

Struiksma got the idea to offer up the initiative after hearing a presentation at Grace Baptist Church in Bellingham by Tom Hoyle, who operates Bible and Sciences Ministries out of Tacoma. Hoyle has been “actively involved in creation science missions for over 20 years,” according to his Web site, hoyle.nwcreation.net.

Here’s the complete text of this insane bill.

UPDATE at 2/21/09 6:09:05 pm:

At the website mentioned above we find this illustration of the Land That Time (and Everyone Else) Forgot:

Jump to bottom

528 comments
1 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:55:21pm

are they referring to Obama?

/

2 Bob Dillon  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:55:23pm

Well ... this is a great thread to start off with.

3 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:55:49pm

or Ming the merciless?

4 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:56:08pm
Citing the state Constitution, the U.S. Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, the initiative states it “is about requiring our government to do its job, to protect our liberty, a liberty which has been endowed by our Creator, the one responsible for Blessing us, the Supreme Ruler of the Universe.

God isn't mentioned in the Constitution.

5 solomonpanting  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:56:12pm
supreme ruler of the universe

Didn't he just recently wrestle The Hulk on PayPerView?

6 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:56:38pm

It will now be illegal to not believe in Obama.

/what?

/oh, THAT supreme ruler of the universe.

Nevermind.

7 Bloodnok  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:56:44pm

Nothing ever happens in Blaine....

/Waiting For Guffman

8 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:56:46pm

re: #4 Sharmuta

God isn't mentioned in the Constitution.

nit picker

9 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:57:17pm

How many hatchlings are gonna' melt down?

10 Big Steve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:57:56pm

what is that quote about never interrupting one's enemy when they are making a mistake......lets all just let this guy flame out and watch merrily.

11 screaming_eagle  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:58:37pm

“concerns a supreme ruler of the universe.”


Is this the nirth certificate stuff again?

12 itellu3times  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:59:10pm

Murphy is the supreme ruler of the universe.

13 Jetpilot1101  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:59:19pm
“I think probably at least that more creation science is overlooked as not belonging in the public school system because of the religion (aspect),” she said.

It's because of the religion aspect that it SHOULD NOT be allowed in public schools. These people are dumber than I thought.

14 Last Mohican  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:59:37pm

re: #9 MandyManners

How many hatchlings are gonna' melt down?

I was thinking this might be coming. I made popcorn.

15 Big Steve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:59:42pm

my cat is the supreme leader of our house....does that qualify?

16 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 5:59:58pm

re: #10 Big Steve

That would be great unless you're a resident of Washington. The taxpayers are going to have to pay for the extended legal defense which will surely fail.

17 Wishing  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:00:34pm

“I think probably at least that more creation science is overlooked as not belonging in the public school system because of the religion (aspect),” she said.

If this is how she speaks, then the whole thing will go down in grammarian flames.

18 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:00:47pm
creation science

Science and Creation do not belong in the same sentence , dummy

19 jaunte  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:00:51pm

I hope the supreme ruler of the universe doesn't need the protection that Kim Struiksma and Initiative 1040 can provide. That would be less than supreme.

20 Bob Dillon  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:01:05pm

re: #12 itellu3times

Murphy is the supreme ruler of the universe.

I've heard gravity called the Master Force of the Universe. But yeah - Murphy has to be El Supremo.

21 ConservatismNow!  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:01:05pm

Skeletor should be happy if this passes.

22 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:01:07pm

Not going far.

www.leg.wa.gov...]>ARTICLE I
DECLARATION OF RIGHTS

23 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:01:10pm
The initiative would prohibit “state use of public money or lands for anything that denies or attempts to refute the existence of a supreme ruler of the universe, including textbooks, instruction or research,”

It's as though people don't appreciate what a special gift religious freedom is. They'd rather impose their will upon others than realize that the power that can stop people from "refuting God" could also stop them from worshiping God in the manner they've chosen for themselves. Unbelievable.

24 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:01:22pm

re: #22 jcm

Not going far.

ARTICLE I
DECLARATION OF RIGHTS

SECTION 11 RELIGIOUS FREEDOM. Absolute freedom of conscience in all matters of religious sentiment, belief and worship, shall be guaranteed to every individual, and no one shall be molested or disturbed in person or property on account of religion; but the liberty of conscience hereby secured shall not be so construed as to excuse acts of licentiousness or justify practices inconsistent with the peace and safety of the state. No public money or property shall be appropriated for or applied to any religious worship, exercise or instruction, or the support of any religious establishment: PROVIDED, HOWEVER, That this article shall not be so construed as to forbid the employment by the state of a chaplain for such of the state custodial, correctional, and mental institutions, or by a county's or public hospital district's hospital, health care facility, or hospice, as in the discretion of the legislature may seem justified. No religious qualification shall be required for any public office or employment, nor shall any person be incompetent as a witness or juror, in consequence of his opinion on matters of religion, nor be questioned in any court of justice touching his religious belief to affect the weight of his testimony.

25 Syrah  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:01:24pm

I predict a crushing and epic defeat for this initiative.

26 Big Steve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:01:48pm

I am hoping that someone will challenge the "I before E except after C" thing in court. Now that is something I could get behind repealing>.

27 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:02:12pm

The website mentioned in the last sentence:

[Link: hoyle.nwcreation.net...]

Wee-oo, wee-oo! Kook alert!

28 solomonpanting  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:02:32pm

re: #25 Syrah

I predict a crushing and epic defeat for this initiative.

G_d willing.

29 albusteve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:02:34pm

re: #16 Killgore Trout

That would be great unless you're a resident of Washington. The taxpayers are going to have to pay for the extended legal defense which will surely fail.

any reasonable judge would toss this immediately...problem solved

30 Haverwilde  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:02:37pm

I'm puzzled, how did these idiots come into being? They must have been created, nothing that dumb could possibly procreate.

31 KingKenrod  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:02:48pm

Does anyone think they can get 241,153 signatures before July 3? That's about 4% of the population.

32 JacksonTn  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:03:28pm

re: #31 KingKenrod

Does anyone think they can get 241,153 signatures before July 3? That's about 4% of the population.

Only if they ACORN on the job ...

33 Big Steve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:03:28pm

re: #27 Charles

The website mentioned in the last sentence:

[Link: hoyle.nwcreation.net...]

Wee-oo, wee-oo! Kook alert!

ah....now clear......cash register is ringing.

34 Last Mohican  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:03:39pm

I try to read all of these creationist bills when Charles posts links to them, just to see what people are trying to sneak past the Constitution. The last one was quite crafty. This one is really stupid. Very low on the literacy scale. It's interesting to see the spectrum that's out there.

35 Randall Gross  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:03:42pm

Let me guess, only they know what the "supreme ruler of the universe" really says, means, or wants...

Now where Have I seen that before ... oh yeah.

36 WindHorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:03:53pm

"Dr. Tom"..... that about says it all......

37 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:03:58pm

re: #27 Charles

The website mentioned in the last sentence:

[Link: hoyle.nwcreation.net...]

Wee-oo, wee-oo! Kook alert!

Is that why dinosaurs went extinct? Humans stopped feeding them?

38 Duane  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:04:05pm

But what will she think if her town were to become a mecca (pun intended) for a group of Muslim immigrants and turn into a little Dearborn. They would have belief in a "supreme ruler of the universe" that is FAR different than Kim's. Oy, once again these fundies make me glad to be Catholic.

39 Wishing  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:04:09pm

re: #27 Charles

The website mentioned in the last sentence:

[Link: hoyle.nwcreation.net...]

Wee-oo, wee-oo! Kook alert!

Awww, she's feeding Bronte..looks like green, leafy veggies, how sweet!

40 transient  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:04:12pm

re: #16 Killgore Trout

That would be great unless you're a resident of Washington. The taxpayers are going to have to pay for the extended legal defense which will surely fail.

I would think it's even questionable as to whether she can achieve the 241,153 valid voter signatures by July 3 to qualify.

41 screaming_eagle  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:04:24pm

This is so blantaly obivious it almost makes me think it is a distraction.

42 Bob Dillon  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:04:32pm

re: #27 Charles

The website mentioned in the last sentence:

[Link: hoyle.nwcreation.net...]

Wee-oo, wee-oo! Kook alert!

A Dr. From WA State. ... Hmmmmmmm

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

43 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:04:57pm

what's tonights over and under on the first creationist meltdown?

I am in at comment # 355

44 albusteve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:04:57pm

re: #33 Big Steve

ah....now clear......cash register is ringing.

I would like to see the 'display and colorful slide show'....sounds like fun

45 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:05:14pm

re: #9 MandyManners

How many hatchlings are gonna' melt down?

Are you going to reiterate your status as Empress of the Universe?

/now would be a good time

46 avanti  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:05:16pm

Nothing currently taught denies the existence of God, just defines how he may have done his work. `

47 eastvillageinfidel  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:05:26pm

"Supreme Ruler of the Universe" sounds like a villain in a comic book.

48 Randall Gross  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:05:31pm

re: #27 Charles

The website mentioned in the last sentence:

[Link: hoyle.nwcreation.net...]

Wee-oo, wee-oo! Kook alert!

Look they even have Kook Konferences.

49 Idle Drifter  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:05:40pm

Supreme Ruler of the Universe? Lord Xenu.

50 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:05:56pm

Spirituality and Science in the Bible.
Or how to be a Bible Believing Christian & Accept Evolutionary Evidence as Fat.

Part 1

Part 2

51 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:06:11pm

re: #27 Charles

The website mentioned in the last sentence:

[Link: hoyle.nwcreation.net...]

Wee-oo, wee-oo! Kook alert!


Regarding cost, there is no set fee. For the sake of his ministry Dr. Hoyle usually receives approximately $100-200 per presentation, or $400-800 per weekend, but the actual amount is up to each church or group.

Hiring Hoyle is actually cheaper than hiring chuckles the clawn

52 Idle Drifter  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:06:24pm

re: #50 jcm

Fat?

53 Big Steve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:06:29pm

re: #44 albusteve

I would like to see the 'display and colorful slide show'....sounds like fun

be very careful.....you might piss off the supreme ruler of the universe.

54 Bob Dillon  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:06:31pm

re: #43 Shug

what's tonights over and under on the first creationist meltdown?

I am in at comment # 355

C'mon Shug - first thread after an open reg.?

/

55 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:06:59pm

re: #31 KingKenrod

Does anyone think they can get 241,153 signatures before July 3? That's about 4% of the population.

It's a hard sell, I don't think so. It won't pass WA Constitutional muster, if it does get that far.

56 Jetpilot1101  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:07:07pm

re: #48 Thanos

This dude will tell you all about UFO's and the Bible.

57 USBeast  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:07:09pm

Sweet Georgia Brown!

It utterly astounds me that people like this have any influence on public policy. What does it take to convince them that facts are facts?

58 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:07:23pm

re: #50 jcm

Spirituality and Science in the Bible.
Or how to be a Bible Believing Christian & Accept Evolutionary Evidence as Fat.

Part 1

Part 2

PIMF FACT

D'oh!

59 Haverwilde  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:07:26pm

re: #31 KingKenrod

Does anyone think they can get 241,153 signatures before July 3? That's about 4% of the population.

I doubt it will get that far, I will bet you the initiative will not pass muster to be allowed to gather signatures, because it is obviously unconstitutional.

60 Killian Bundy  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:07:39pm

Oh boy, Glenn Beck and guests are fantasizing about the total collapse of the United States.

/what an ass

61 Wishing  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:07:47pm

re: #43 Shug

what's tonights over and under on the first creationist meltdown?

I am in at comment # 355

I'll call about 421.

62 WindHorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:07:56pm

re: #57 USBeast

You 're talking about Pelosi and Reid.... right?
wait a sec.....

huh?

63 screaming_eagle  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:08:28pm

re: #57 USBeast

Sweet Georgia Brown!

It utterly astounds me that people like this have any influence on public policy. What does it take to convince them that facts are facts?


You can lead a person to the truth;but you can't make them understand it.

64 Idle Drifter  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:08:30pm

re: #58 jcm

Just jerking your chain JCM I knew you meant fact.

65 Last Mohican  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:08:49pm

re: #32 JacksonTn

Only if they ACORN on the job ...

You left out a word there, but in the process, I think you inadvertently created a new verb:

ACORN (v): To attempt to accomplish a task by inventing large numbers of persons who do not actually exist, and listing their invented names as though they were supporters as a political referendum, political candidate, or other cause.

For example: "-How do you plan to get ten thousand people to sign your anti-okra petition in the next hour? -Well, if I can't get enough by going door-to-door, I guess I'll just ACORN the rest."

66 Randall Gross  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:09:27pm

Charles, is there a monkey in your family tree?
Warning*************kookvid at link ************

[Link: www.nwcreation.net...]

67 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:09:57pm

What did SpaceJesus's little snark-back at reine get up down to?

68 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:10:11pm

Who does not see that the same authority which can establish Christianity, in exclusion of all other Religions, may establish with the same ease any particular sect of Christians, in exclusion of all other Sects?

~James Madison

69 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:10:19pm

re: #23 Sharmuta

It's as though people don't appreciate what a special gift religious freedom is. They'd rather impose their will upon others than realize that the power that can stop people from "refuting God" could also stop them from worshiping God in the manner they've chosen for themselves. Unbelievable.

Simply incredible. It isn't ignorance. It's being so self-absorbed they are blind to any negatives outcomes. Such a hubris, believing they can make the rules while simultaneously being exempted from them. Overconfident stupidity, is what it is.

70 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:10:29pm

re: #64 Idle Drifter

Just jerking your chain JCM I knew you meant fact.

He might have meant fart.

71 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:10:37pm

re: #67 pre-Boomer Marine brat

What did SpaceJesus's little snark-back at reine get up down to?

Would you point me to it, please?

72 USBeast  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:11:05pm

re: #62 WindHorse

You 're talking about Pelosi and Reid.... right?
wait a sec.....

huh?

re: #63 screaming_eagle

You can lead a person to the truth;but you can't make them understand it.

Yeah and yeah.

73 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:11:28pm

re: #71 OldLineTexan

Would you point me to it, please?

Hang on. I'll do a user search and find it.

74 Idle Drifter  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:12:30pm

re: #70 pre-Boomer Marine brat

He might have meant fart.

ew.

75 Loren42  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:12:51pm

Duh! Everyone knows that the Supreme Ruler of the Universe is the Daleks.

76 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:12:55pm

I posted that ridiculous illustration above -- an interesting thing you might miss is that the cavewoman is offering the hungry brontosaurus some sort of leafy vegetable. This isn't an accident -- it's how these people answer the question: if Noah had dinosaurs on the Ark, why didn't they eat all the other animals? Answer: the dinosaurs were VEGETARIANS!

77 Last Mohican  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:13:03pm

You know, the funnest thing about creationism has got to be the brontosaurus rides.

78 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:13:06pm

Get your Human Body - Intelligent Design Set


This unique talk received a standing ovation at Creation 2003. Anatomist Dr. David Menton takes you on a journey into the marvelous intricacies of the human ear, which has the clear stamp of the Creator and leaves skeptics speechless

.


I might order it just to see how they explain my coccyx and vermiform appendix and why I had gill slits and a tail as an embryo

79 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:13:08pm

Preside Oil
is an anagram of Pelosi Reid,
as is
Spoiled Ire

Coinky-dink? I think not!

/

80 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:13:18pm

No, I'm not kidding.

81 pingjockey  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:13:36pm

Goddamn, sonsabitchin' asshat no good low lifes, get out of my state! My family homesteaded Wa. state and I guarentee that great, great grandpa wouldn't have put up with this lunacy.

82 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:13:54pm

re: #69 Basho

Simply incredible. It isn't ignorance. It's being so self-absorbed they are blind to any negatives outcomes. Such a hubris, believing they can make the rules while simultaneously being exempted from them. Overconfident stupidity, is what it is.

I think Thomas Sowell would say they were of the unconstrained mindset. They think they know better than others at how the world should be- that human nature can be perfected. That's very ignorant on their part, and beyond arrogant.

83 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:14:00pm

re: #77 Last Mohican

You know, the funnest thing about creationism has got to be the brontosaurus rides.

People whose education ended with Fred Flintstone.

Not good.

84 Bloodnok  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:14:09pm

re: #67 pre-Boomer Marine brat

What did SpaceJesus's little snark-back at reine get up down to?

Thanks for reminding me to go back and ding that down. (-33, btw)

85 WhiteRasta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:14:16pm

The Supreme Ruler of The Universe is none other than our Lizard Leader.....

86 Last Mohican  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:14:22pm

re: #80 Charles

No, I'm not kidding.

Are you sure?

Seriously?

87 Big Steve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:14:22pm

so naturally they are white people in the cartoon//

88 Randall Gross  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:14:28pm

Oh....my...

UFOs And The Bible
Dr. Fernandes discusses the UFO phenomenon and critiques it from a biblical perspective. He shows that, though the evidence seems to indicate that our planet is being visited, demonic decpetion appears to be at the root of these visitations.

89 ConservatismNow!  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:14:34pm

re: #63 screaming_eagle

You can lead a person to the truth;but you can't make them understand it.

I beg to differ

Where's Mandy? We need to get her this t-shirt

90 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:14:41pm

Wouldn't you know. It's another "scientist" with a degree in apologetics.

91 callahan23  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:14:55pm

re: #71 OldLineTexan

Would you point me to it, please?

The count is minus 33.

92 albusteve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:14:59pm

re: #68 Sharmuta

Who does not see that the same authority which can establish Christianity, in exclusion of all other Religions, may establish with the same ease any particular sect of Christians, in exclusion of all other Sects?

~James Madison

people have forgotten how profound these simple concepts are and their value to a free society...maybe we have gone too far down the road and the relevance turned to me-ism or whatever....J Mad still rocks

93 jaunte  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:15:02pm

re: #76 Charles

Large herbivores like elephants are known to eat a lot of plants. I wonder if anyone has calculated the tonnage of vegetation it would require to keep just two brontosauruses alive for 40 days.

94 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:15:04pm

re: #76 Charles

Answer: the dinosaurs were VEGETARIANS!

They were.

/except for the meat-eating ones

See? Easy!

95 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:15:21pm

re: #71 OldLineTexan

Would you point me to it, please?

On the "Gradual Change We Can Believe In" thread:

its first:

its second, a reply to reine:

96 solomonpanting  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:15:27pm

re: #76 Charles

the dinosaurs were VEGETARIANS!

I hope they were potty trained.

"And there's good ol' Noah waiting under the arc..."

Bill Cosby

97 pingjockey  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:15:31pm

Does Ming the Merciless know they're trying to steal his title?

98 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:15:37pm

re: #76 Charles

I don't think that tiny bit of salad is going to satisfy the hunger of something that size...

99 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:15:39pm

re: #84 Bloodnok

Thanks for reminding me to go back and ding that down. (-33, btw)

I wish I had been there for that.

100 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:15:49pm

re: #64 Idle Drifter

Just jerking your chain JCM I knew you meant fact.

I don't mind getting having stuff like that pointed out. A few yanks on the chain might get through....

101 nyc redneck  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:16:23pm

the problem is she could be talking abt. the 12th caliphate that is going to crawl out of a hole.
certainly someone will holler for that.
let's just leave it out of the class room and open to personal interpretation, as it is now.
but in no way associated w/ teaching real science.

102 pingjockey  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:16:29pm

Pizza is here! BBIAB!

103 Big Steve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:16:31pm

re: #93 jaunte

Large herbivores like elephants are known to eat a lot of plants. I wonder if anyone has calculated the tonnage of vegetation it would require to keep just two brontosauruses alive for 40 days.

not to mention dealing with the "other end" products.....

104 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:16:35pm

re: #95 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Thanks.

105 albusteve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:16:54pm

re: #93 jaunte

Large herbivores like elephants are known to eat a lot of plants. I wonder if anyone has calculated the tonnage of vegetation it would require to keep just two brontosauruses alive for 40 days.

no...that would require.....SCIENCE!

106 callahan23  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:17:00pm

re: #85 WhiteRasta

The Supreme Ruler of The Universe is none other than our Dear Lizard Leader.....

Amended.

107 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:17:05pm

re: #93 jaunte

Large herbivores like elephants are known to eat a lot of plants. I wonder if anyone has calculated the tonnage of vegetation it would require to keep just two brontosauruses alive for 40 days.

That's exactly what I was thinking...

108 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:17:08pm

re: #93 jaunte

Large herbivores like elephants are known to eat a lot of plants. I wonder if anyone has calculated the tonnage of vegetation it would require to keep just two brontosauruses alive for 40 days.

I wonder if they realize it was proven to be a local flood.

109 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:17:08pm

re: #86 Last Mohican

Are you sure?

Seriously?

Seriously.

[Link: www.remnantofgod.org...]

110 cronus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:17:13pm

Hmmm...I'm thinking this may not be the creationist's A Team. I don't think we'll need a concerted counter-campaign for this one. Simple misdirection will probably suffice.

111 Last Mohican  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:17:33pm

re: #76 Charles

But... but... Tyrannosaurus Rex is, like the most famously carnivorous carnivore in history! And what about Velociraptor? Didn't these people watch Jurassic Park?

112 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:17:45pm

an interesting "testimonial" from Hoyle's kookoo website

Dr. Madalyn Murray O'Hair (America's Best Known Atheist):
Keep your religion-but please keep it to yourself. (Her concluding remark to Tom Hoyle after an impromptu public debate with him in Springfield, Missouri, relating to this subject.)

how did that make it in?

113 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:18:15pm

Proof evolution is WRONG.

Were you aware that it has been proven by the Creation Evidence Museum that T-Rex was NOT a meat eater? That's right! They proved it in TWO WAYS...

The roots of T-Rex were only 2 inches deep. Had he bit into the hide of another dinosaur he would have lost teeth!

They cut a tooth in half og a unearthed T-Rex and found in deeply impureated with CHLOROPHYLL! That's right, Chlorophyll is the main substance found in PLANTS not meat!
By the way, this discovery validates the Bible once again! How so? See this passage...

Genesis 1:30, "And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so."

Now.. before proclaiming you MUST eat meat because the proteins in meat will help you to gain weight, look around on planet earth for a moment. Look at all the HUGE animals like cows... horses.. hippos.. elephants... rhinos... etc. What do THEY eat? That's right. PLANTS!

114 Wishing  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:18:38pm

re: #93 jaunte

Large herbivores like elephants are known to eat a lot of plants. I wonder if anyone has calculated the tonnage of vegetation it would require to keep just two brontosauruses alive for 40 days.

Was a whole lot longer than 40 days..they stayed on the ark for a year.

115 DEZes  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:19:39pm

"Kim Struiksma doesn’t think evolution should be taught in schools."

And the Lord said let there be idiots, and then he said ah crap.

116 Only The Lurker Knows  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:19:55pm

re: #9 MandyManners

Don't know. But I have a great link for a BBQ.

HT to an unknown Lizard.

And with this post I bid you all a good night as I engage the Ironfist rule.

The day is done.

Sleep well Lizard Nation.

117 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:20:03pm

re: #113 Charles

Proof evolution is WRONG.


I don't suppose they carbon dated that Chlorophyll?

heh

118 reine.de.tout  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:20:16pm

re: #4 Sharmuta

God isn't mentioned in the Constitution.

But what about a "supreme ruler of the universe"?

In their zeal to get religion into public life, these folks have just undermined and belittled everybody's faith.

119 Last Mohican  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:20:31pm

re: #113 Charles

Proof evolution is WRONG.

I shouldn't have read that. I think I just got a little stupider.

I'll be back in a minute. I think I see something shiny over there in the, um, place, over by the, um, thing. Gonna go check it out.

120 jaunte  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:20:31pm

re: #113 Charles

"impureated?"

121 Jetpilot1101  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:20:32pm

re: #113 Charles

Well they made a believer out of me. And to think I was blinded all these years by Darwin's bogus science. You hate Christians Charles and are inspired by the devil.

//////////////////////////////

122 notutopia  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:20:34pm

line 95 "Research project", means ANY form of studious inquiry, investigation, or experimentation.

line 97 "Scientific Endeavor", means any act, idea, theory, intervention, conference, organization, or individual having to do with science.

And finally,
line 100, "Textbook", means any book, or book substitute, limited to books.

?

Sounding like a ripe ole lead in to the same ole' ID concept of "bait and switcheroo" with a twist, that is add that this is neccessary, under the guise of the Articles of the Confederation, and the Declaration of Independence as a "higher power" and a Supreme Ruler of the Universe.

Any science or pseudoscience allowed, any textbook deemed sounding like science, and any pseudo research that is published by the Discovery Institute.

I swear this sounds like a script for a new cartoon.
"Masters of the Universe, Part Deux."

123 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:21:13pm

"And on the second day, God created Creationists to drive everyone else crazy. He also created Truthers, UFO chasers, Moon Landing Truthers and Jerry Lewis."

//

124 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:21:14pm

re: #111 Last Mohican

But... but... Tyrannosaurus Rex is, like the most famously carnivorous carnivore in history! And what about Velociraptor? Didn't these people watch Jurassic Park?

It's science that decided that T-Rex as a a vicious beast. Who you gonna' believe those atheist godless scientists. Or a God fearing artist?

/////

125 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:21:55pm

re: #117 Shug

I don't suppose they carbon dated that Chlorophyll?

heh

They don't believe in carbon dating.

You just have to go straight to carbon marriage.

126 Syrah  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:21:59pm

re: #42 Bobibutu

I checked the full list. No Hoyle.

127 Big Steve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:22:10pm

I wonder if there are more Kooks as a percent of the population today or the Internet just makes them more noticeable.

25 years ago I was working in an R&D lab. One of the PhD chemists, a brilliant guy in the lab, was going on and on about some crazy politics thing at the lunch table. We were all kind of looking down at our meals and wishing this would all go away. Finally one of the older women at the table looked up at this guy and said, "you may know your way around the lab but I am horrified that anyone allows you to vote!"

So I suspect there percentage of kooks is the same, they just have a wider megaphone today.

128 WhiteRasta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:23:39pm

re: #123 Gus 802

And Celine Dion......

129 mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:23:42pm

That picture is absolutely ridiculous. C'mon. Where the heck did the caveman get a turquoise colored outfit?

130 jaunte  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:23:43pm

re: #127 Big Steve

The internet also makes it easier for like-minded 'theorists' to find each other and feel empowered as a movement.

131 Scion9  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:24:01pm

re: #118 reine.de.tout

But what about a "supreme ruler of the universe"?

In their zeal to get religion into public life, these folks have just undermined and belittled everybody's faith.

Even the possible religion of our UFO friends. Assuming that they are not actually demonic visions that is.

132 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:24:11pm

re: #127 Big Steve

Yeah... People once thought that giving everybody a publishing avenue would bring about a new golden age for mankind. Boy, were they ever proven wrong.

133 Dr. Shalit  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:24:51pm

Charles -

Started d--king around with the updates and so on as a project. Now coming to all'y'all in LINUX. Perhaps I ave evolved as well.

-S-

134 nyc redneck  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:25:13pm

re: #113 Charles

Proof evolution is WRONG.

there isn't a shred of science here. it is forcing the facts into the bible narrative.
this pathetic, really.

135 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:25:28pm

Basho, IngisKhan and Jimmah, did you guys REALLY mean to up-ding SpaceJesus's snark?

Looks like you missed the button and hit + instead.

136 Brit in Japan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:25:33pm

This is a kind of a Borat joke, right? It's just to see how many people think they are seriously being this stupid.

I'm not betting on meltdowns this time. I always get it wrong. :(

BiJ

137 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:25:44pm

re: #127 Big Steve

Yes. In the old days the required set-up for this was a megaphone, two placards, and a magic marker. This has been replaced by the PC.

138 WhiteRasta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:25:44pm

re: #132 Basho

Wikipedia was supposed to be the sum total of all human knowledge....

139 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:26:06pm

re: #129 mich-again

That picture is absolutely ridiculous. C'mon. Where the heck did the caveman get a turquoise colored outfit?

maybe it was adam and steve after all

140 Idle Drifter  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:26:24pm

re: #117 Shug

I don't suppose they carbon dated that Chlorophyll?

heh

I used carbon dating point once while debating a creationist. He said it wasn't consistent therefore an inaccurate means of dating the age of bones. I started to laugh then I realized he was serious.

141 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:26:36pm

re: #128 WhiteRasta

And Celine Dion......

Oops, forgot Alex Jones.

142 mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:26:43pm

re: #127 Big Steve

So I suspect there percentage of kooks is the same, they just have a wider megaphone today.

There are many people who will fall for any kooky conspiracy theory they read or hear about. And for them the internet is a like candy store where everything is free.

143 Brit in Japan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:26:54pm

re: #115 DEZes

"Kim Struiksma doesn’t think evolution should be taught in schools."

And the Lord said let there be idiots, and then he said ah crap.

Haha.

"There goes the neighbourhood."

Bij.

144 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:26:58pm

Remember this silly cartoon above every time somebody tells you that Bobby Jindal is the future of the Republican party

145 Big Steve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:27:05pm

re: #138 WhiteRasta

Wikipedia was supposed to be the sum total of all human knowledge....

my teenage son proved to me the other day that Wikipedia is pretty darn good porno as well. Just look up bikini wax if you don't believe me.

146 Dr. Shalit  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:27:25pm

re: #138 WhiteRasta

Wikipedia was supposed to be the sum total of all human knowledge....

Rasta -

Sometimes "Human Knowledge for Dummies" - a subject for further discussion.

-S-

147 Jetpilot1101  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:27:37pm

re: #140 Idle Drifter

I used carbon dating point once while debating a creationist. He said it wasn't consistent therefore an inaccurate means of dating the age of bones. I started to laugh then I realized he was serious.

I must confess I'm ignorant on this one; how do they "prove" or explain that carbon dating doesn't work? Any good site I can visit to read up on that canard?

148 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:27:51pm

re: #142 mich-again

There are many people who will fall for any kooky conspiracy theory they read or hear about. And for them the internet is a like candy store where everything is free.

You ever notice how they're always selling gold coins and health supplements?

149 Last Mohican  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:28:25pm

re: #134 nyc redneck

there isn't a shred of science here.

No, but it's hilarious.

I'm still ashamed to admit it, but now I really want to visit the Creation Museum.

150 WhiteRasta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:28:29pm

re: #141 Gus 802

And Michael Bolton, Billy Joel, Elton John, Anne Murray. The list is endless...

151 screaming_eagle  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:28:34pm

By the way, this discovery validates the Bible once again! How so? See this passage...

Genesis 1:30, "And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so."

Now.. before proclaiming you MUST eat meat because the proteins in meat will help you to gain weight, look around on planet earth for a moment. Look at all the HUGE animals like cows... horses.. hippos.. elephants... rhinos... etc. What do THEY eat? That's right. PLANTS!


LIONS? I didn't realize lions started out as herbivores. No wonder Daniel was safe when he was thrown into the lions den.

152 ConservatismNow!  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:28:50pm

re: #145 Big Steve

...wow. I learned something new.

153 solomonpanting  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:28:55pm

re: #129 mich-again

That picture is absolutely ridiculous. C'mon. Where the heck did the caveman get a turquoise colored outfit?

It was a souvenir from the Hard Rock Cafe. Didja just fall off your ox?

154 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:28:58pm

Ooh. New version of jQuery just released today. Trying it out now. Reload the page if you want to see if it crashes your browser...

155 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:29:22pm

re: #140 Idle Drifter

I used carbon dating point once while debating a creationist. He said it wasn't consistent therefore an inaccurate means of dating the age of bones. I started to laugh then I realized he was serious.

I talked with one also, ragging on carbon dating. I asked him about other isotope dating methods. He basically said "What other methods?"

156 Randall Gross  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:29:49pm

re: #154 Charles

way to create a spike Charles... :)

157 Wishing  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:29:58pm

re: #142 mich-again

There are many people who will fall for any kooky conspiracy theory they read or hear about. And for them the internet is a like candy store where everything is free.

What is scary about these whacko conspiracy nuts is that as general rule, they seem to end up squarely in anti-semitism. Devolving, so to speak.

158 Big Steve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:29:59pm

re: #154 Charles

Ooh. New version of jQuery just released today. Trying it out now. Reload the page if you want to see if it crashes your browser...

Firefox is handling it just fine.

159 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:30:01pm

re: #154 Charles

Ooh. New version of jQuery just released today. Trying it out now. Reload the page if you want to see if it crashes your browser...

committing suicide in 5 ... 4 ... 3 ...

160 reine.de.tout  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:30:24pm

re: #135 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Basho, IngisKhan and Jimmah, did you guys REALLY mean to up-ding SpaceJesus's snark?

Looks like you missed the button and hit + instead.

I thought SpaceJesus' snark was sorta funny, myself!
But I did ding it down, too!

161 Jetpilot1101  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:30:31pm

re: #154 Charles

Ooh. New version of jQuery just released today. Trying it out now. Reload the page if you want to see if it crashes your browser...

Safari working without a glitch.

162 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:30:33pm

re: #154 Charles

Ooh. New version of jQuery just released today. Trying it out now. Reload the page if you want to see if it crashes your browser...

am I still here?

163 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:30:44pm

re: #154 Charles

Ooh. New version of jQuery just released today. Trying it out now. Reload the page if you want to see if it crashes your browser...

FF 3.0.6 no problem.

164 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:30:45pm

Here is the State of Washington's Constitution

In the preamble it says:

We, the people of the State of Washington, grateful to the Supreme Ruler of the Universe for our liberties, do ordain this constitution

I don't think these people realize this is common Deist code speak to invoke a creator in a non-denominational way. Regardless, Section 11 discusses the rights of Washingtonians concerning religion. Here is the opening:

Absolute freedom of conscience in all matters of religious sentiment, belief and worship, shall be guaranteed to every individual, and no one shall be molested or disturbed in person or property on account of religion

Not sure what part of this state's Constitution, the DoI or the US Constitution makes these people think they can push for such a law. Talk about "breathtaking inanity"!

165 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:30:46pm

re: #159 pre-Boomer Marine brat

re: #154 Charles

committing suicide in 5 ... 4 ... 3 ...

M'gawd!
I'm still ALIVE!

166 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:30:52pm

re: #154 Charles

Ooh. New version of jQuery just released today. Trying it out now. Reload the page if you want to see if it crashes your browser...

Reload checked.

167 Randall Gross  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:31:13pm

so far so good...
test
testtest

test


test

168 callahan23  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:31:13pm

re: #67 pre-Boomer Marine brat

What did SpaceJesus's little snark-back at reine get up down to?

re: #91 callahan23

The count is minus 33.

And now the count is already at 42.

169 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:31:27pm

re: #160 reine.de.tout

re: #135 pre-Boomer Marine brat

I thought SpaceJesus' snark was sorta funny, myself!
But I did ding it down, too!

I was actually hilarious!

170 avanti  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:32:02pm

re: #76 Charles

I posted that ridiculous illustration above -- an interesting thing you might miss is that the cavewoman is offering the hungry brontosaurus some sort of leafy vegetable. This isn't an accident -- it's how these people answer the question: if Noah had dinosaurs on the Ark, why didn't they eat all the other animals? Answer: the dinosaurs were VEGETARIANS!

Well, at least she is feeding a plant eater in the picture. (While wearing nice modern cloths BTW.)

171 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:32:13pm

re: #162 Shug

re: #154 Charles


am I still here?

Anybody seen Shug in the past minute or two?
He disappeared all of the sudden.

172 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:32:13pm

re: #157 Wishing

What is scary about these whacko conspiracy nuts is that as general rule, they seem to end up squarely in anti-semitism. Devolving, so to speak.

True. Most conspiracy theories seem to lead there.

173 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:32:17pm

re: #160 reine.de.tout

re: #135 pre-Boomer Marine brat


I thought SpaceJesus' snark was sorta funny, myself!
But I did ding it down, too!

He's a jackass, especially with females. I have witnessed it here more than once.

174 Idle Drifter  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:32:32pm

re: #147 Jetpilot1101

I must confess I'm ignorant on this one; how do they "prove" or explain that carbon dating doesn't work? Any good site I can visit to read up on that canard?

I asked him that same question never got an answer.

175 DEZes  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:32:37pm

re: #151 screaming_eagle

Kinda takes the fun out of the Jurassic movies, Now that I know Velociraptors were just just cute little family pets. ;)

176 callahan23  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:32:40pm

re: #135 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Basho, IngisKhan and Jimmah, did you guys REALLY mean to up-ding SpaceJesus's snark?

Looks like you missed the button and hit + instead.

Really baffles me.

177 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:33:16pm

re: #170 avanti

Well, at least she is feeding a plant eater in the picture. (While wearing nice modern cloths BTW.)

Everyone knows they killed the clothosauraus for fabric.

Yeesh.

////////

178 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:33:16pm

re: #172 Mich-again

True. Most conspiracy theories seem to lead there.

You can almost say that Anti-Semitism is the Original Conspiracy Theory.

179 notutopia  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:33:18pm

re: #154 Charles

Ooh. New version of jQuery just released today. Trying it out now. Reload the page if you want to see if it crashes your browser...

Livin Risky... I reloaded and no crash.
FF3, Vista

180 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:33:22pm

re: #76 Charles

I posted that ridiculous illustration above -- an interesting thing you might miss is that the cavewoman is offering the hungry brontosaurus some sort of leafy vegetable. This isn't an accident -- it's how these people answer the question: if Noah had dinosaurs on the Ark, why didn't they eat all the other animals? Answer: the dinosaurs were VEGETARIANS!

* * * *
Even my baby nephew knew there were meateater dinosaurs such as Tyranosaurus Rex! TRex would have made hash out of the animals aboard Noah's Ark!

181 reine.de.tout  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:33:46pm

re: #173 OldLineTexan

Ah. I had not noticed. thanks.
Well, he's at -44 now.

182 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:33:49pm

re: #138 WhiteRasta

Wikipedia was supposed to be the sum total of all human knowledge....

Wikipedia is great for popular culture and other material not typically discussed in traditional encyclopedias. I'd rather use an encyclopedia from the 19th century to learn about anything intellectually useful though...

183 screaming_eagle  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:33:59pm

re: #171 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Anybody seen Shug in the past minute or two?
He disappeared all of the sudden.

I think a T-Rex ate him.

184 USBeast  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:34:24pm

When those who attempt to refute Evolution can come up with one shred of evidence that refutes the research of those who have spent countless hours in the field and in the lab successfully proving it, I will listen. Until then I will regard their arguments as mindless ranting. Facts are facts.

185 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:34:28pm

re: #153 solomonpanting

It was a souvenir from the Hard Rock Cafe. Didja just fall off your ox?

None of the guys at the Water Buffalo Lodge ever wore anything like that.

186 reine.de.tout  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:34:33pm

re: #154 Charles

reload worked fine.
using google chrome.

187 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:34:34pm

re: #180 alegrias

* * * *
Even my baby nephew knew there were meateater dinosaurs such as Tyranosaurus Rex! TRex would have made hash out of the animals aboard Noah's Ark!

T-Rex cooked? I would've he'd just chomp and swallow and not take the time to make hash.....

;-P

188 Nevergiveup  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:34:34pm

I just got done watching the new HBO movie "Taking Chance". I highly recommend it. If your the emotional type, be prepared.

[Link: www.hbo.com...]

It replays tonight 12:00PM EST

189 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:34:47pm

Somewhere in a basement a pizza delivery boy is contemplating: what really brought building 7 down.

190 screaming_eagle  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:34:51pm

re: #175 DEZes

Kinda takes the fun out of the Jurassic movies, Now that I know Velociraptors were just just cute little family pets. ;)

Just overgrown hamsters.

191 Last Mohican  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:34:55pm

re: #183 screaming_eagle

I think a T-Rex ate him.

Nah, T-rexes only eat arugula. It's true, they proved it scientifically.

192 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:35:05pm

re: #181 reine.de.tout

re: #173 OldLineTexan

Ah. I had not noticed. thanks.
Well, he's at -44 now.

I watched* him go off on Mandy.

* I was out of popcorn, unfortunately

193 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:35:16pm

re: #149 Last Mohican

No, but it's hilarious.

I'm still ashamed to admit it, but now I really want to visit the Creation Museum.

* * *
Why not? Buy American! Spend your creation tourism dollars right here in the USA.

194 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:35:30pm

What I would like to know is how did know house the over 3 million varieties of butterfly? That's right- over 6 million butterflies on the Ark. Impressive.

195 DEZes  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:35:39pm

re: #190 screaming_eagle

Just overgrown hamsters.


HEH.

196 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:35:39pm

re: #183 screaming_eagle

re: #171 pre-Boomer Marine brat


I think a T-Rex ate him.

Proving that Shug is made of spinach, according to Creation Science.

/

197 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:35:39pm

re: #57 USBeast

Sweet Georgia Brown!

It utterly astounds me that people like this have any influence on public policy. What does it take to convince them that facts are facts?


Why? She's a resident of the State of Washington. If I'm not mistaken, as such, she has the absolute right to put forth any initiative she wants. Even nuts have the right to petition and put forth initiatives.

198 reine.de.tout  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:36:02pm

re: #192 OldLineTexan

I will keep an eye out, thanks for the warning!

199 jorline  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:36:24pm

re: #87 Big Steve

so naturally they are white people in the cartoon//

Look at it next week...CHANGE!

200 nyc redneck  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:36:30pm

re: #149 Last Mohican

No, but it's hilarious.

I'm still ashamed to admit it, but now I really want to visit the Creation Museum.

oh i want to go too. it will be surreal to see the place. it will be a fanatical art installation. an anthropologists dream.

201 notutopia  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:36:43pm

re: #194 Sharmuta

Eeww. Must have loaded up a lot of rotting fruit for them to eat...

202 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:36:47pm

re: #167 Thanos

so far so good...
test
testtest


test

Thanos,
... ... ... ... thank you

203 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:37:05pm

re: #197 MandyManners

Why? She's a resident of the State of Washington. If I'm not mistaken, as such, she has the absolute right to put forth any initiative she wants. Even nuts have the right to petition and put forth initiatives.

Yep, come up with a filing fee you to can file a petition.

204 Syrah  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:37:12pm

re: #194 Sharmuta

Stop asking the obvious!

205 LGoPs  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:37:14pm

re: #177 jcm

re: #170 avanti


Everyone knows they killed the clothosauraus for fabric.

Yeesh.

////////

And the Nauga......for it's hide....
/

206 ConservatismNow!  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:37:15pm

re: #113 Charles

There's so much wrong with this that I don't even know where to start. I can't decide if they are willfully rejecting fact or if they are just revelling in their ignorance.

207 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:37:32pm

re: #151 screaming_eagle

By the way, this discovery validates the Bible once again! How so? See this passage...

Genesis 1:30, "And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so."

Now.. before proclaiming you MUST eat meat because the proteins in meat will help you to gain weight, look around on planet earth for a moment. Look at all the HUGE animals like cows... horses.. hippos.. elephants... rhinos... etc. What do THEY eat? That's right. PLANTS!


LIONS? I didn't realize lions started out as herbivores. No wonder Daniel was safe when he was thrown into the lions den.

* * *
My dog eats grass, doesn't yours? Same with cats who eat grass--granted, as purgatives!

208 Randall Gross  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:37:37pm

re: #202 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Nope, not at all, thank them.

209 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:37:45pm

re: #201 notutopia

Eeww. Must have loaded up a lot of rotting fruit for them to eat...

We are dealing with a lot of food for all these animals....

210 Dr. Shalit  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:38:00pm

re: #154 Charles

Ooh. New version of jQuery just released today. Trying it out now. Reload the page if you want to see if it crashes your browser...

Charles -

As I indicated above, just got Ubuntu 8.10 working correctly, the "Intrepid Ibex" whispered in my ear to quit NOW for awhile, my being a semi-dummie at more involved computer stuff.

-S-

211 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:38:20pm

re: #205 LGoPs

re: #177 jcm


re: #170 avanti


Everyone knows they killed the clothosauraus for fabric.

Yeesh.

////////


And the Nauga......for it's hide....
/

LOL. How many Naugas died to make that couch you're sitting on?

/PETA fail

212 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:38:25pm

re: #205 LGoPs

And the Nauga......for it's hide....
/

Save the Naugas!

213 USBeast  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:38:29pm

re: #197 MandyManners

Why? She's a resident of the State of Washington. If I'm not mistaken, as such, she has the absolute right to put forth any initiative she wants. Even nuts have the right to petition and put forth initiatives.

Don't give me any ideas. ;)

214 jorline  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:38:29pm

re: #181 reine.de.tout

Ah. I had not noticed. thanks.
Well, he's at -44 now.

I missed it and would like to 45.

215 jaunte  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:38:44pm

re: #209 Sharmuta

Not much space on the ark for the human parasites, either.
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

216 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:38:55pm

re: #207 alegrias

re: #151 screaming_eagle


* * *
My dog eats grass, doesn't yours? Same with cats who eat grass--granted, as purgatives!

but wait, if God created Dogs and cats and made them vegetarians, and now they eat meat does that mean that they've evolved?

217 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:39:02pm

re: #113 Charles

Proof evolution is WRONG.

Were you aware that it has been proven by the Creation Evidence Museum that T-Rex was NOT a meat eater? That's right! They proved it in TWO WAYS...

The roots of T-Rex were only 2 inches deep. Had he bit into the hide of another dinosaur he would have lost teeth!

They cut a tooth in half og a unearthed T-Rex and found in deeply impureated with CHLOROPHYLL! That's right, Chlorophyll is the main substance found in PLANTS not meat!
By the way, this discovery validates the Bible once again! How so? See this passage...

Genesis 1:30, "And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so."

Now.. before proclaiming you MUST eat meat because the proteins in meat will help you to gain weight, look around on planet earth for a moment. Look at all the HUGE animals like cows... horses.. hippos.. elephants... rhinos... etc. What do THEY eat? That's right. PLANTS!

:sigh:

218 snowcrash  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:39:03pm

I like the idea of cowboys and dinosaurs but I know "Valley of the Gwangi" isn't a documentary. random musing

219 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:39:15pm

re: #209 Sharmuta

We are dealing with a lot of food for all these animals....

All those animals, all that food........

ALL THAT POOP!

And only 8 people to clean up!

220 Bloodnok  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:39:19pm

re: #209 Sharmuta

We are dealing with a lot of food for all these animals....

And one very sturdy shovel.

221 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:39:25pm

re: #208 Thanos

re: #202 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Nope, not at all, thank them.

well ... yes
but thank you for bringing it to my attention

222 DeathtotheSwiss  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:39:34pm

re: #5 solomonpanting

Didn't he just recently wrestle The HulkHulkster on PayPerView?

If mid-90s is recent for you...then yes, yes he did.

223 irongrampa  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:39:38pm

I mentioned the other day I wasn't gonna comment on this, but Holy Shit!

That's some weapons grade stupidity right there.

224 NukeAtomrod  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:39:49pm

It looks like this bill is designed to make the government legislate that God is real.

Any actual believer would find that idea horrifying. Since when does government that kind of power?

225 jaunte  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:40:05pm

re: #218 snowcrash

I like the idea of cowboys and dinosaurs but I know "Valley of the Gwangi" isn't a documentary. random musing

"4:10 to Pangaea"

226 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:40:13pm

re: #214 jorline

re: #181 reine.de.tout


I missed it and would like to 45.

44, 45 ... anything in that neighborhood would do just fine.

/

227 notutopia  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:40:35pm

re: #209 Sharmuta

Maybe it was another miracle, Manna falling from Heaven, that occurred over the ark, and just didn't make it into the final book.
/

228 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:40:39pm

re: #224 NukeAtomrod

It looks like this bill is designed to make the government legislate that God is real.

Any actual believer would find that idea horrifying. Since when does government that kind of power?

This is Washington. Unless the government declares it, it doesn't exist.

//

229 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:40:43pm

re: #204 Syrah

Or, it could just be local:

Youtube Video
230 NukeAtomrod  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:40:48pm

...have that kind of power.

231 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:40:50pm

re: #95 pre-Boomer Marine brat

re: #71 OldLineTexan


On the "Gradual Change We Can Believe In" thread:

its first:

its second, a reply to reine:

re: #214 jorline

See the 2nd link in mine above

232 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:40:52pm

re: #223 irongrampa

That's some weapons grade stupidity right there.

I'll be stealing that in the future, just so you know.

233 Idle Drifter  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:40:54pm

re: #155 jcm

I talked with one also, ragging on carbon dating. I asked him about other isotope dating methods. He basically said "What other methods?"

Potassium-40 has a half-life of 1.3 billion years...
beta decay of rubidium-87 to strontium-87, with a half-life of 50 billion years.....

I asked about uranium-lead dating got a blank stare.

234 solomonpanting  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:41:11pm

re: #222 DeathtotheSwiss

If mid-90s is recent for you...then yes, yes he did.

What year is this?

235 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:41:37pm

re: #218 snowcrash

I like the idea of cowboys and dinosaurs but I know "Valley of the Gwangi" isn't a documentary. random musing

Gwangi be primo stuff man! A whole VALLEY of it! DOOODE!
When do we leave?

236 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:41:48pm

re: #219 jcm

re: #209 Sharmuta


All those animals, all that food........

ALL THAT POOP!

And only 8 people to clean up!

It is a little-known fact that the GIANT DUNG BEETLE was indeed put aboard the Ark by Noah, but both died of exhaustion on the trip.

/

237 notutopia  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:42:02pm

re: #220 Bloodnok

re: #220 Bloodnok

And one very sturdy shovel.

That's where we got the term, "POOP Deck"

238 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:42:17pm

re: #178 Gus 802

You can almost say that Anti-Semitism is the Original Conspiracy Theory.

* * * *
And John Kerry is its prophet! Can you believe the newstories nervously captioned "Kerry did NOT meet with Hamasholes"?

239 ConservatismNow!  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:42:46pm

re: #222 DeathtotheSwiss

Actually he finally retired sometime around 06 I think.

240 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:42:59pm

re: #232 Slumbering Behemoth

I'll be stealing that in the future, just so you know.

Be on the look out for WMSs. Weapons of Mass Stupidity.

241 screaming_eagle  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:43:11pm

re: #216 Shug

but wait, if God created Dogs and cats and made them vegetarians, and now they eat meat does that mean that they've evolved?

Quit bringing facts into this. What the hell, next think your gonna tell me is that fire can melt steel.

//

242 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:43:19pm

re: #224 NukeAtomrod

Since when does government that kind of power?

They need some kind of authoritative body to declare their God is real because they're so insecure about their faith.

243 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:43:49pm

I watched all five parts of that BBC special and it's fantastic. It's what happens when real scientists and Biblical history meet. Of course, a massive local flood won't please the literalists.... Oh, well.

244 Dustyvet  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:44:00pm

There was a snake called Nate. His purpose in life was to stay in the desert and guard the lever. This lever was no ordinary lever. It was the lever that if moved would destroy the world. Nate took his job very seriously. He let nothing get close to the lever.

One day off in the distance he saw a cloud of dust. He kept his eye on it because he was guarding the lever. The dust cloud continued to move closer to the lever. Nate saw that it was a huge boulder and it was heading straight for the lever!

Nate thought about what he could do to save the world. He decided if he could get in front of the boulder he could deflect it and it would miss the lever. Nate slithered quickly to intersect the boulder. The boulder ran over Nate, but it was, in fact, deflected, leaving history to conclude that is was better Nate than lever.

245 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:44:02pm

re: #238 alegrias

* * * *
And John Kerry is its prophet! Can you believe the newstories nervously captioned "Kerry did NOT meet with Hamasholes"?

I missed that. I'm sure however that Ellison has their cell phone numbers.

246 jaunte  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:44:04pm

re: #237 notutopia

re: #220 Bloodnok

That's where we got the term, "POOP Deck"

Shortened from its original long form "the only thing higher than the Poop" deck.

247 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:44:05pm

re: #242 Basho

They need some kind of authoritative body to declare their God is real because they're so insecure about their faith.

DING!

248 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:44:09pm

So, with all these Orwellian titled "academic freedom" bills going around, how long before we see a group pushing to get 9/11 trooferism taught in history class, with Loose Change being used as an "alternative text"? Hey, it is a "competing theory", is it not?

249 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:45:15pm

re: #248 Slumbering Behemoth

So, with all these Orwellian titled "academic freedom" bills going around, how long before we see a group pushing to get 9/11 trooferism taught in history class, with Loose Change being used as an "alternative text"? Hey, it is a "competing theory", is it not?

All you have to do is start a church. Perhaps call it the Church of Truth. Then demand its inclusion as a form of diversity.

250 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:45:17pm

re: #248 Slumbering Behemoth

So, with all these Orwellian titled "academic freedom" bills going around, how long before we see a group pushing to get 9/11 trooferism taught in history class, with Loose Change being used as an "alternative text"? Hey, it is a "competing theory", is it not?

Teach the Truth!

251 Idle Drifter  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:45:36pm

Well if dinosaurs were still around we'd have great walled cities and hunting rifles chambered for .50 BMG as a minimum for dangerous game hunting. Man I could go for a bronto burger.

252 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:45:45pm

Ohhhh they just don't stop.... Well here is some more for the troll tool belt...

Dinosaurs and humans lived together at the same time... Dinosaurs are the dragons of the bible...

Do you realize that this makes even the most determined to be polite laugh at you when you say such things?

Geological and nuclear decay dating place the last dinosaurs living around sixty million years ago. Humans only came on the scene on order a hundred thousand years ago. There are no fossils of humans in the same strata as dinosaurs.

Many dinosaurs were very big and very carnivorous. A T-Rex was a hunting machine and an apex predator. They had many very sharp teeth which were each larger than your fore-arm. Teeth like that did not eat vegetation. These animals ate meat. It was a monster in every sense of the word. Look at the size of one and compare it to a person. There are no fossils of dinosaurs that show a human as lunch either.

If humans were around at the same time as these beasts, there would be a record of it. There would be records of them coming in and eating the village. There would be terror stories for small children. There would be depictions of them on Egyptian tombs. Why would any ancient leader compare himself to a lion or an eagle when he could be a T-Rex or Triceratops? Why would you carve a sphinx when you could have the body of an allosaur and a man's head? Surely Dinosaurs are vastly more impressive and intimidating than a mere big cat?

Yet, the animals mentioned in the bible the most are lions, sheep and oxen... The pagans of old depicted snakes and crocodiles and lions and they prayed to them, but they never prayed to T-Rex? Why do ancient animal idols - which people believed were powerful - only depict common beasts of today? T-Rex makes a croc look like a small pair of shoes. Surely he is more of a god than any modern beast.

Ancient cave paintings from our earliest ancestors depict all sorts of animals. Yet, they forgot dinosaurs? While we are at it, they depict herds of deer like and cattle like creatures. What would a T-rex do to such a herd? (The answer is there would be no herds like that), T-rex would eat them all and they would go extinct). Still our ancestors just forgot to paint him? Our cave welling ancestors also carved little figurines of people and animals. Perhaps they were just art, perhaps they were religious in nature, but why are there no dinosaurs?

When you even suggest the idea that humans and dinosaurs ever lived at the same time you make yourself into a laughing stock.

253 rhymeswithright  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:45:47pm

Well, Charles, while I took serious exception to one of your earlier posts today, I'll agree with you on this one -- this entire proposal goes beyond wrong, beyond bizarre, and into the stark raving insane.

254 Dustyvet  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:46:01pm

re: #245 Gus 802

I missed that. I'm sure however that Ellison has their cell phone numbers.

Count on it...

255 ConservatismNow!  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:46:12pm

re: #251 Idle Drifter

And don't spare the spare ribs!

256 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:46:15pm

re: #243 Sharmuta

I watched all five parts of that BBC special and it's fantastic. It's what happens when real scientists and Biblical history meet. Of course, a massive local flood won't please the literalists.... Oh, well.

Err... I must have missed it when you said it; Which BBC special are you talking about?

257 jaunte  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:46:17pm

re: #243 Sharmuta

I watched all five parts of that BBC special and it's fantastic. It's what happens when real scientists and Biblical history meet. Of course, a massive local flood won't please the literalists.... Oh, well.

Have you seen the Nat. Geographic reports on the bronze age shipwrecks in the Black Sea? They're not affected by borer worms, since the chemistry in the depths is deadly.

258 albusteve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:46:20pm

re: #242 Basho

They need some kind of authoritative body to declare their God is real because they're so insecure about their faith.

right...then the Bushmen can appeal to them for some real dieties instead of the rocks and trees they got stuck with...oh the humanity

259 Yankee Division Son  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:46:22pm

Words fail me on this one, but a few I'm thinking of are "crackers", "cuckoo", and possibly "bat sh*t crazy"..

260 Honorary Yooper  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:46:30pm

re: #113 Charles

Somehow the really pointy teeth on T-Rex don't seem to trigger any logical assumptions on their part, do they. Never mind that T-Rex teeth fit very nicely into herbivore fossils that have been found.

261 USBeast  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:46:58pm

re: #244 Dustyvet

There was a snake called Nate. His purpose in life was to stay in the desert and guard the lever. This lever was no ordinary lever. It was the lever that if moved would destroy the world. Nate took his job very seriously. He let nothing get close to the lever.

One day off in the distance he saw a cloud of dust. He kept his eye on it because he was guarding the lever. The dust cloud continued to move closer to the lever. Nate saw that it was a huge boulder and it was heading straight for the lever!

Nate thought about what he could do to save the world. He decided if he could get in front of the boulder he could deflect it and it would miss the lever. Nate slithered quickly to intersect the boulder. The boulder ran over Nate, but it was, in fact, deflected, leaving history to conclude that is was better Nate than lever.

There might be something profound here, but I really hope there is not.

262 Jetpilot1101  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:47:13pm

re: #250 jcm

Teach the Truth!

I can't tell if that guy is serious or if that is one big joke.

263 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:47:16pm

re: #260 Honorary Yooper

Somehow the really pointy teeth on T-Rex don't seem to trigger any logical assumptions on their part, do they. Never mind that T-Rex teeth fit very nicely into herbivore fossils that have been found.

Maybe T-Rex ate a lot of giant Brazil Nuts.

//

264 notutopia  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:47:20pm

Charles, are you still testing? My screen is jumping again.

265 WindHorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:48:08pm

I think Kim is probably one of those people who starts talking and can't stop....

....and I am visualizing little white balls of spittle at the corners of her mouth.....

266 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:48:13pm

re: #203 jcm

re: #197 MandyManners


Yep, come up with a filing fee you to can file a petition.

Direct democracy at its finest.

267 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:48:14pm

re: #248 Slumbering Behemoth

So, with all these Orwellian titled "academic freedom" bills going around, how long before we see a group pushing to get 9/11 trooferism taught in history class, with Loose Change being used as an "alternative text"? Hey, it is a "competing theory", is it not?

I saw a 9/11 troofer book for sale at the history section of Barnes 'n Noble. I was PO'ed at that moment and didn't by anything from them that day.

268 [deleted]  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:48:21pm
269 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:48:29pm

re: #194 Sharmuta

What I would like to know is how did know house the over 3 million varieties of butterfly? That's right- over 6 million butterflies on the Ark. Impressive.

* * *
Jeez, I mean Jesus, Sharmuta--c'mon, we lizards know the Bible is not a book of science lessons, but of faith [and hope & change]. Butterfly Genetic Mutation and all that would have to wait for the Catholic Monk, Mendel, to write about in his Mendelian Genetics treatises.

270 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:48:38pm

re: #213 USBeast

re: #197 MandyManners


Don't give me any ideas. ;)

Have at it.

271 Randall Gross  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:48:44pm

OT:

New batch of Agitprop being prepared vs. Israel starting Sunday (in a few hours) from GEO in Pakistan:

Human rights groups in Gaza confirmed that a high-ranking delegation on behalf of the Arab League would be visiting the Strip Sunday after arriving through the Rafah crossing, a foreign news agency said.

League Spokesman Hisham Yousuf said the mission will prepare a detailed report for League head Amr Moussa "and take the necessary legal procedures." Yousuf said another League mission leaving for Gaza on Saturday will be accompanied by a second committee that will assess the aid needed to rebuild Gaza.

During the day, the Arab League held a session attended by two committees looking into the situation in the Strip. One committee reportedly comprises international legal experts. Yousuf noted that the efforts to investigate Israeli war crimes are expected to take a long time and that the probe was only at its early stages.

"We embarked on the process of adopting legal steps in order to ensure that none of those who committed the crimes against the Palestinian people will evade punishment," he added.

272 Idle Drifter  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:48:51pm

re: #255 ConservatismNow!

And don't spare the spare ribs!

Heh, its a living.

273 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:49:02pm

re: #253 rhymeswithright

Well, Charles, while I took serious exception to one of your earlier posts today, I'll agree with you on this one -- this entire proposal goes beyond wrong, beyond bizarre, and into the stark raving insane.

But it's cool if they hide a similar sentiment in scientific academic freedom legislation?

274 jorline  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:49:09pm

Is the illustration Adam and Eve? I can understand why they shed the fig leaves with that big ass plant eater around...just saying
//

275 notutopia  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:49:15pm

Jump the screen twice for Yes.

276 USBeast  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:49:17pm

re: #264 notutopia

Charles, are you still testing? My screen is jumping again.

It's late. Could it be your eyes?

277 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:49:43pm

re: #262 Jetpilot1101

I can't tell if that guy is serious or if that is one big joke.

It's satire of the 9/11 troofers, who called their movie Loose Change, and the structural engineering genius of the troofer movement.

278 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:49:46pm

re: #250 jcm

Teach the Truth!

An excellent piece. I also like this one.

But hey, it is a "competing theory", so why not teach that one as well?
/

279 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:49:51pm

re: #267 Basho

I saw a 9/11 troofer book for sale at the history section of Barnes 'n Noble. I was PO'ed at that moment and didn't by anything from them that day.

In the HISTORY section? Cripes, that should be shelved under parapsychology.

280 NukeAtomrod  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:50:05pm

re: #260 Honorary Yooper

Somehow the really pointy teeth on T-Rex don't seem to trigger any logical assumptions on their part, do they. Never mind that T-Rex teeth fit very nicely into herbivore fossils that have been found.

Well, there you go! Dinosaurs ate fossils! Problem solved.

/ Yummy paleoliths.

281 [deleted]  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:50:32pm
282 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:50:36pm

re: #266 MandyManners

Direct democracy at its finest.

It's best it restrained government spending for a decade, at it's worst it's carp like this.

283 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:50:42pm

re: #223 irongrampa

I mentioned the other day I wasn't gonna comment on this, but Holy Shit!

That's some weapons grade stupidity right there.

Weaponize it and drop it over various valleys in Afghanistan. The good guys will roll over the bad guys. Repeat with Iran. And, Syria. Lebanon. Gaza. Et cet..

284 notutopia  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:50:42pm

re: #276 USBeast

But, I already have 8 eyes.
My own and trifocals!

285 ConservatismNow!  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:50:48pm

re: #279 Gus 802

Fiction

286 Dustyvet  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:50:51pm

re: #275 notutopia

Jump the screen twice for Yes.

One sonar ping, and one ping only...:)


/S

287 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:51:10pm

The Bible mentions addition, subtraction, multiplication and division.

But I checked and it doesn't mention Algebra or Calculus. I wonder if the YEC dolts have alternative theories for those subjects as well.

288 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:51:33pm

re: #200 nyc redneck

oh i want to go too. it will be surreal to see the place. it will be a fanatical art installation. an anthropologists dream.

* * *
And the best part is, Creation Museums are NOT brought to you by your taxdollars, unlike much crappy government art (Piss Christ, Elephant Poopy Madonna, Chocolate covered naked woman and other offensive taxpayer paid "art")

289 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:51:38pm

re: #277 jcm

It's satire of the 9/11 troofers, who called their movie Loose Change, and the structural engineering genius of the troofer movement.

Ah, the old chicken wire and concrete patio paver experiment. Works all the time.

//

290 Honorary Yooper  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:51:47pm

re: #268 Iron Fist

Iron Fist, I wish it were just made up. I ran into these nitwits back in the late 1980s/early 1990s. When I first met them, I also thought it very incredulous, but found out they sincerely believe this nonsense. There's some bad crazy out there, and not all of it is on the left.

291 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:51:48pm

re: #279 Gus 802

re: #267 Basho


In the HISTORY section? Cripes, that should be shelved under parapsychology.

It should be in the Folk Medicine section under "L" for "laxatives".

292 albusteve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:52:02pm

re: #271 Thanos

OT:

New batch of Agitprop being prepared vs. Israel starting Sunday (in a few hours) from GEO in Pakistan:

why would the Israelis allow this bs?....it's just another ridiculous image problem to deal with...what a disappointment

293 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:52:09pm

re: #253 rhymeswithright

Well, Charles, while I took serious exception to one of your earlier posts today, I'll agree with you on this one -- this entire proposal goes beyond wrong, beyond bizarre, and into the stark raving insane.

Up-ding.

294 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:52:12pm

re: #287 Mich-again

The Bible mentions addition, subtraction, multiplication and division.

But I checked and it doesn't mention Algebra or Calculus. I wonder if the YEC dolts have alternative theories for those subjects as well.

We dealt with this last night. When solving for X in algebra, X = God.

295 Bloodnok  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:52:22pm

re: #271 Thanos

OT:

New batch of Agitprop being prepared vs. Israel starting Sunday (in a few hours) from GEO in Pakistan:

"We embarked on the process of adopting legal steps in order to ensure that none of those who committed the crimes against the Palestinian people will evade punishment," he added

Also known as "Robert Spencer diplomacy".

296 Dustyvet  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:52:33pm

re: #284 notutopia

But, I already have 8 eyes.
My own and trifocals!

Underwater ophthalmology lens itself to more aqueous humor and cornea puns.

297 ConservatismNow!  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:52:54pm

re: #294 Sharmuta

Up-ding for a math joke.

298 Honorary Yooper  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:53:11pm

re: #287 Mich-again

The Bible mentions addition, subtraction, multiplication and division.

But I checked and it doesn't mention Algebra or Calculus. I wonder if the YEC dolts have alternative theories for those subjects as well.

According to some, Pi equals 3. And no, I'm not making this up.

299 Jetpilot1101  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:53:31pm

re: #277 jcm

It's satire of the 9/11 troofers, who called their movie Loose Change, and the structural engineering genius of the troofer movement.

OK, I get it. I guess there are so many wackjobs out there who believe the weirdest crap, I can't tell anymore.

300 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:53:38pm

re: #264 notutopia

Charles, are you still testing? My screen is jumping again.

Ritalin for your computer?

301 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:53:41pm

re: #289 Gus 802

Ah, the old chicken wire and concrete patio paver experiment. Works all the time.

//

Hey, it convinced me...........


That the guy is a moron.

302 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:53:52pm

re: #291 OldLineTexan

It should be in the Folk Medicine section under "L" for "laxatives".

I'll say. Could also work as a stool hardener. :) 911 Troofer Books: The Cure for Dysentery.

303 RhymesWithRight  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:53:54pm

re: #273 Sharmuta

I respectfully disagree with you that such is the purpose of legislation that permits full discussion of scientific theories.

304 solomonpanting  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:54:20pm

Gronk: "Me want dinner."
Gronka: "Me have pterodactyl wing, brontosaurus goulash, big-leaf salad."

305 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:54:45pm

re: #302 Gus 802

re: #291 OldLineTexan


I'll say. Could also work as a stool hardener. :) 911 Troofer Books: The Cure for Dysentery.

By Jove, I think you're on to something. If fire can't melt steel, good luck softening your stool.

/

306 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:54:49pm

re: #301 jcm

Hey, it convinced me...........

That the guy is a moron.

I'll have to remember that line next time I'm banging my head against the wall with these guys:

"OK, you've convinced me. You're a moron!"

307 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:54:52pm

re: #303 RhymesWithRight

I respectfully disagree with you that such is the purpose of legislation that permits full discussion of scientific theories.

What is currently preventing full discussion of scientific theories in public school classrooms?

308 USBeast  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:55:00pm

re: #270 MandyManners

Have at it.

Another time perhaps, after I've formulated and finalized my plans for world conquest and domination.
/

309 ConservatismNow!  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:55:04pm

re: #288 alegrias

re: #200 nyc redneck


* * *
And the best part is, Creation Museums are NOT brought to you by your taxdollars, unlike much crappy government art (Piss Christ, Elephant Poopy Madonna, Chocolate covered naked woman and other offensive taxpayer paid "art")

Wake me up when the Baroque era comes back. Wait. Chocolate covered naked woman you say? Is said woman hot, smoking or otherwise?

310 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:55:06pm

re: #268 Iron Fist

I wonder where all of this shit came from. Until we started discussing it, I had never heard of Young Earth Creationists. Not anywhere. Creationists, sure. There are lots of people who believe that God (or some god/gods) created the Universe. This is not an implausible belief. The Universe is here so, logically, it had to come from somewhere. While this is more of a metaphysical than physical debate, it is a debate that has been going on for thousands of years.

The concept that everything is only six thousand years old, and humans shared the Earth with dinosaurs? Never heard of it. Never heard of anyone who had heard of it. It is so ludicrous on the face of it that I have to almost wonder if someone came up with the concept deliberately to make believers look ridiculous.

I heard of the notion that the world is 6,000 years old in some polsci course in college. From what I can recall, it's a relatively new idea.

311 albusteve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:55:09pm

re: #303 RhymesWithRight

I respectfully disagree with you that such is the purpose of legislation that permits full discussion of scientific theories.

oh fer gods sake...creationism is science again

312 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:55:21pm

re: #299 Jetpilot1101

OK, I get it. I guess there are so many wackjobs out there who believe the weirdest crap, I can't tell anymore.

That's what you get from driving a jet around all day. All that science and technology blinds you to the...... TROOOF!

/// ;-P

313 Shug  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:55:31pm

re: #267 Basho

re: #248 Slumbering Behemoth


I saw a 9/11 troofer book for sale at the history section of Barnes 'n Noble. I was PO'ed at that moment and didn't by anything from them that day.

you should have carried it to the correct section---FICTION

314 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:55:51pm

re: #309 ConservatismNow!

re: #288 alegrias


re: #200 nyc redneck


* * *
And the best part is, Creation Museums are NOT brought to you by your taxdollars, unlike much crappy government art (Piss Christ, Elephant Poopy Madonna, Chocolate covered naked woman and other offensive taxpayer paid "art")


Wake me up when the Baroque era comes back. Wait. Chocolate covered naked woman you say? Is said woman hot, smoking or otherwise?

If it ain't Baroque, don't fix it.

315 Dustyvet  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:55:57pm

I wasn't allowed to be in Star Wars, because I tested positive for droids

316 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:56:21pm

re: #313 Shug

re: #267 Basho


re: #248 Slumbering Behemoth


I saw a 9/11 troofer book for sale at the history section of Barnes 'n Noble. I was PO'ed at that moment and didn't by anything from them that day.


you should have carried it to the correct section---FICTION

Or the men's room.

;)

317 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:56:29pm

re: #303 RhymesWithRight

I respectfully disagree with you that such is the purpose of legislation that permits full discussion of scientific theories.

Name a current scientific theory that competes with evolution.

318 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:56:31pm

re: #216 Shug

but wait, if God created Dogs and cats and made them vegetarians, and now they eat meat does that mean that they've evolved?

* * *
The poor Israelites had to eat manna from heaven for 40 years while they wandered in the Wilderness of Sinai, instead of juicy lamb chops--they had to devolve! Evolve, devolve, let's call the whole thing off!

319 albusteve  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:56:35pm

re: #315 Dustyvet

I wasn't allowed to be in Star Wars, because I tested positive for droids

there are effective ointments I believe

320 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:56:39pm

re: #282 jcm

re: #266 MandyManners


It's best it restrained government spending for a decade, at it's worst it's carp like this.

To an extent, I'm fine with just about anytihng that's proposed.

321 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:56:40pm

re: #298 Honorary Yooper

re: #287 Mich-again


According to some, Pi equals 3. And no, I'm not making this up.

I Kings 7:23 And he made a molten sea, ten cubits from the one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about.

322 notutopia  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:56:47pm

re: #300 MandyManners

Ritalin for your computer?

I'm starting to have the effect of seasickness!
It's like riding a jetski over the tail waves.....
Jump!
[Link: noolmusic.com...]

323 funky chicken  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:56:49pm

re: #37 Sharmuta

re: #27 Charles


The website mentioned in the last sentence:

[Link: hoyle.nwcreation.net...]

Wee-oo, wee-oo! Kook alert!


Is that why dinosaurs went extinct? Humans stopped feeding them?

LOL nope, they just evolved into pigeons.

Zeus told me.

324 ConservatismNow!  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:56:55pm

re: #314 OldLineTexan

Seems you have quite a Handel on the puns, OLT

325 jorline  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:57:01pm

re: #231 pre-Boomer Marine brat

re: #214 jorline

See the 2nd link in mine above

{pBMb}

Chipped in at -47.

326 Randall Gross  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:57:03pm

OT:
Geo's also reporting a blast in East London? Any UK lizards out there with the telly on?

Updated at: 2343 PST, Saturday, February 21, 2009
LONDON: Blast has been reported in Eastern London on Saturday.

327 Bloodnok  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:57:09pm

re: #314 OldLineTexan

If it ain't Baroque, don't fix it.

Chocolate covered? Sounds more like Ro-cocoa

328 Wishing  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:57:13pm

re: #252 LudwigVanQuixote

T-Rex makes a croc look like a small pair of shoes.

Spit my coffee. Thanks!
Can I use that line?
Still laughing, wiping face.

329 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:57:15pm

re: #291 OldLineTexan

It should be in the Folk Medicine section under "L" for "laxatives".

Haha! Nice :D

330 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:58:09pm

re: #303 RhymesWithRight

re: #273 Sharmuta

I respectfully disagree with you that such is the purpose of legislation that permits full discussion of scientific theories.

CREATIONISM IS NOT A SCIENTIFIC THEORY.

331 unclassifiable  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:58:11pm

I would say "what the hell is in the water there" except I'm from Texas.

332 solomonpanting  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:58:23pm

re: #324 ConservatismNow!

Seems you have quite a Handel on the puns, OLT

That's what happens when one throws caution to the wind and goes for Baroque.

333 funky chicken  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:58:24pm

re: #298 Honorary Yooper

re: #287 Mich-again


According to some, Pi equals 3. And no, I'm not making this up.

you cannot be serious. oh dear....math teachers in middle school are going to have to turn back the 3ationists now?

334 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:58:41pm

re: #324 ConservatismNow!

re: #314 OldLineTexan

Seems you have quite a Handel on the puns, OLT

It seems we are Bach to this.

335 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:58:46pm

re: #245 Gus 802

I missed that. I'm sure however that Ellison has their cell phone numbers.

* * * *
True! The AP reporter accompanying Kerry in Gaza claimed not to recognize any Hamas people around Kerry, how convenient.

336 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:58:58pm

re: #320 MandyManners

To an extent, I'm fine with just about anytihng that's proposed.

All in all I like the initiative system. It takes a lot of signatures, a vote of the people, and they almost always get challenged in the courts.

Despite the BS like this, the overall effect for WA has been positive.

337 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:59:07pm

Added a little and fixed a typo

Dinosaurs and humans lived together at the same time... Dinosaurs are the dragons of the bible...

Do you realize that this makes even the most determined to be polite laugh at you when you say such things?

Geological and nuclear decay dating place the last dinosaurs living around sixty million years ago. Humans only came on the scene on order a hundred thousand years ago. There are no fossils of humans in the same strata as dinosaurs.

Many dinosaurs were very big and very carnivorous. A T-Rex was a hunting machine and an apex predator. They had many very sharp teeth which were each larger than your fore-arm. Teeth like that did not eat vegetation. These animals ate meat. It was a monster in every sense of the word. Look at the size of one and compare it to a person. There are no fossils of dinosaurs that show a human as lunch either.

If humans were around at the same time as these beasts, there would be explicit record of it. There would be records of them coming in and eating the village. There would be terror stories for small children. There would be depictions of them on Egyptian tombs -which are really quite old compared to a 6000 year old Earth. Why would any ancient leader compare himself to a lion or an eagle when he could be a T-Rex or Triceratops? Why would you carve a sphinx when you could have the body of an allosaur and a man's head? Surely, dinosaurs are vastly more impressive and intimidating than a mere big cat?

Yet, the animals mentioned in the Bible the most are lions, sheep, eagles and oxen... The pagans of old depicted snakes and crocodiles and lions and they prayed to them, but they never prayed to T-Rex? Why do ancient animal idols - which people believed were powerful - only depict common beasts of today? T-Rex makes a croc look like a small pair of shoes. Surely, he is more of a god than any modern beast.

Ancient cave paintings from our earliest ancestors depict all sorts of animals. Yet, they forgot dinosaurs? While we are at it, they depict herds of deer like and cattle like creatures. What would a T-rex do to such a herd? The answer is there would be no herds like that. T-rex would eat them all and they would go extinct, those herds are proof that T-rex wasn't around either! Still, our ancestors just forgot to paint him? Our cave dwelling ancestors also carved little figurines of people and animals. Perhaps they were just art, perhaps they were religious in nature, but why are there no dinosaurs? Did our ancestors just forget the largest and most fearsome creatures to ever walk the Earth?

When you even suggest the idea that humans and dinosaurs ever lived at the same time you make yourself into a laughing stock.

338 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:59:17pm

re: #308 USBeast

re: #270 MandyManners


Another time perhaps, after I've formulated and finalized my plans for world conquest and domination.
/

A man with a plan.

339 AtadOFF  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:59:23pm

re: #1 Shug

ummm... I think they're talking 'bout Oden.

340 Cato the Elder  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 6:59:28pm

Gotta love the pics, you know.

341 Nevergiveup  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:00:12pm

re: #326 Thanos

OT:
Geo's also reporting a blast in East London? Any UK lizards out there with the telly on?

Updated at: 2343 PST, Saturday, February 21, 2009
LONDON: Blast has been reported in Eastern London on Saturday.

Nothing on the bbc

342 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:01:34pm

re: #322 notutopia

re: #300 MandyManners


I'm starting to have the effect of seasickness!
It's like riding a jetski over the tail waves.....
Jump!
[Link: noolmusic.com...]

Good song! I feel like dancing!

343 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:01:35pm

re: #303 RhymesWithRight

re: #273 Sharmuta

I respectfully disagree with you that such is the purpose of legislation that permits full discussion of scientific theories.

It permits Disco-institute-programmed zombic memebot church kids to relentlessly bombard their public high school science class teachers with creationit debating strategy fueled talking points, thus smothering the teaching of genuine science:

[Link: ncseweb.org...]

[Link: timpanogos.wordpress.com...]

The most ridiculous contentions can be effectively debated by the cynical use of manipulative rhetoric:

[Link: www.teachthemscience.org...]

344 aboo-Hoo-Hoo  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:01:54pm

...supreme ruler of the universe....

Sounds pretty cool. Any bids out yet from Chicago or DC?

345 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:02:03pm

re: #294 Sharmuta

We dealt with this last night. When solving for X in algebra, X = God.

Actually, looking at kaballah (the real kaballah, not the Madonna kind) and things like gematria show that the ancient Jews had a remarkable level of mathematical sophistication.

They did not have calculus, but they had a great understanding of certain Modern Algebraic concepts and set theory. They also had an inkling of transfinite mathematics.

346 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:02:26pm

re: #271 Thanos

The other night we were commenting about the iffy supply routes into Afghanistan and then the next day I read that Kyrgyzstan decided to close the US base. Now that might be the result of a Russian threat, or maybe the Kyrgyz are just arm-twisting Obama for more cash. But either way, it isn't good to have so many troops in a landlocked area with no good supply routes.

347 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:02:40pm

re: #344 aboo-Hoo-Hoo

...supreme ruler of the universe....

Sounds pretty cool. Any bids out yet from Chicago or DC?

I already live in WA...

IT'S MINE, ALL MINE!

348 Idle Drifter  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:02:49pm

re: #281 Iron Fist

20mm Lahti anti-tank gun. Mount that bad boy on your four-wheeler...

I'll take a bren gun carrier over a four wheeler. I could throw a dino cage/shooting position without a loss of speed and better rough terrain ability.

349 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:03:02pm

re: #336 jcm

All in all I like the initiative system. It takes a lot of signatures, a vote of the people, and they almost always get challenged in the courts.

Despite the BS like this, the overall effect for WA has been positive.

Testing.

350 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:03:39pm

How are some of you getting the double reply function in your quotes?

351 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:03:48pm

re: #336 jcm

re: #320 MandyManners


All in all I like the initiative system. It takes a lot of signatures, a vote of the people, and they almost always get challenged in the courts.

Despite the BS like this, the overall effect for WA has been positive.

It's messy but, I'd rather have a mess than anal retentiveness of totalitarianism.

352 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:03:59pm

re: #328 Wishing

T-Rex makes a croc look like a small pair of shoes.

Spit my coffee. Thanks!
Can I use that line?
Still laughing, wiping face.

anytime... and thanks!

353 DEZes  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:04:07pm

Just for those that want a chuckle at the concept of Dinosaurs and people living at the same time in history.

Enjoy!

Youtube Video
354 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:04:07pm

re: #337 LudwigVanQuixote

Wait, you're using common sense there. Shhh...

355 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:04:20pm

re: #252 LudwigVanQuixote

* * * *
Carl Sagan hinmself wrote the book, "The Dragons of Eden"--unfortunately perhaps lending credence to those folks who now say dinosaurs were around in biblical times.

356 Honorary Yooper  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:04:27pm

re: #310 MandyManners

I heard of the notion that the world is 6,000 years old in some polsci course in college. From what I can recall, it's a relatively new idea.

It dates back to Bishop James Ussher in the mid 17th Century. He used the Bible to calculate the age of the Earth to about 6,000 years. Specifically, he claimed it dated from October 23, 4004 BC. There is another on out there by John Lightfoot which dates the Earth to 3929 BC (also from the mid 17th Century). These differed littler from other Biblically-based estimate of the time period. However, older estimates were made by others in earlier time periods. The YECs want to go back to a world just before the Renaissance, but, ironically, just after the Reformation (never mind the one happened before the other, but it describes their mindset on science best).

357 ConservatismNow!  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:04:36pm

re: #334 OldLineTexan

re: #324 ConservatismNow!


re: #314 OldLineTexan

Seems you have quite a Handel on the puns, OLT


It seems we are Bach to this.

Indeed, however I must confess that the Vermeer is wearing quite thin now. Or can no one make a pun using Bernini, Monteverdi, or Vivaldi? Ah well. Heironymos Bosch is a horrible painter. I don't care if his work is priceless.

358 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:04:48pm

re: #349 Sharmuta

re: #336 jcm


Testing.

And, failing.

359 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:04:49pm

re: #348 Idle Drifter

I'll take a bren gun carrier over a four wheeler. I could throw a dino cage/shooting position without a loss of speed and better rough terrain ability.

I'm partial to the Buffalo. Mondo SUV, no worries about drive by shootings, got a Prius with a COEXIST and Obama bumper sticker in front of you? Swat it off the road with the claw.

360 NelsFree  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:05:03pm

re: #334 OldLineTexan

It seems we are Bach to this.

I say, instead of less art, we should have Mozart.

361 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:05:41pm

re: #350 Sharmuta

How are some of you getting the double reply function in your quotes?

Not I. Not I.

362 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:05:45pm

re: #298 Honorary Yooper

According to some, Pi equals 3. And no, I'm not making this up.

Well thats stupid. They could use a tape measure and a dinner plate and figure out Pi closer than that.

363 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:06:10pm

re: #358 MandyManners

Why are you getting that and I'm not.

364 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:06:29pm

re: #350 Sharmuta

How are some of you getting the double reply function in your quotes?

Ghost in the machine!

Youtube Video
365 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:06:37pm

re: #358 MandyManners

And, failing.

Weird.

366 unclassifiable  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:06:41pm

Well now they have done it.

OK. I have got to break the news to you guys.

Well we, um Earth, do have a god.

But, hmmmm, difficult, ok , he's a "god" but you remember that bible passage where they say we were created in God's image, yada, yada, yada...

Well it turns out that our "god" sits in a cube in the Milky Way department of section 23456719 of the Galactic Supreme Ruler Corporation, Inc.

I know that is a little disappointing to you initiative supporters but look at it this way.

When you bitch and moan about how no one ever appreciates you and you're just a number and all of that rot...

... your sectional assistant sub-supervisor supreme being understands.

367 USBeast  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:07:00pm

re: #338 MandyManners

A man with a plan.

In the immortal words of John Wayne: "Not hardly."

368 Randall Gross  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:07:04pm

re: #341 Nevergiveup

re: #326 Thanos


Nothing on the bbc

Found it, appears to be 8 hours or more old

[Link: www.thaindian.com...]

369 notutopia  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:07:29pm

re: #350 Sharmuta

How are some of you getting the double reply function in your quotes?

Double Your Pleasure!
[Link: video.aol.com...]

370 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:07:50pm

I'll assume then they deny astronomy and any consideration of the speed of life. I'm sure they have some "backwards osmosis" theory to oppose an event that took place 12.2 billion years go just "arriving" to Earth view.

372 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:08:12pm

re: #356 Honorary Yooper

Great info. Thanks!

373 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:08:19pm

re: #356 Honorary Yooper

re: #310 MandyManners


It dates back to Bishop James Ussher in the mid 17th Century. He used the Bible to calculate the age of the Earth to about 6,000 years. Specifically, he claimed it dated from October 23, 4004 BC. There is another on out there by John Lightfoot which dates the Earth to 3929 BC (also from the mid 17th Century). These differed littler from other Biblically-based estimate of the time period. However, older estimates were made by others in earlier time periods. The YECs want to go back to a world just before the Renaissance, but, ironically, just after the Reformation (never mind the one happened before the other, but it describes their mindset on science best).

I just can't figure out why some humans wanna' limit God to a time frame.

374 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:08:41pm

re: #355 alegrias

* * * *
Carl Sagan hinmself wrote the book, "The Dragons of Eden"--unfortunately perhaps lending credence to those folks who now say dinosaurs were around in biblical times.

And if they read the book, they would find that he is shredding them!

375 Catttt  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:08:42pm

I want a creationist explain the following expressions:

I had a cold feeling up my spine.

He got his hackles up.

Don't get your back up.

The hair at the back of my neck (aka the vestigial hackles at the back of my neck) stood up.
----------------
If humans were created in situ with the dinos, how come we have vestigial hackles? Empirical proofs, please.

376 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:08:43pm

re: #365 Sharmuta

I think they're copy and pasting and then using the quote button on the text...

377 WindHorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:09:06pm

re: #362 Mich-again

yes.... but that would offend someone..... and we don't tolerate THAT.....

(out here in WA, we don't have "children".... we have "students".... and we don't have "early dismissal", we have "early release")

378 allbusiness  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:09:26pm

I can't believe these idiots live in MY northwest Washington.

On the plus side I don't think she has a prayer of getting that many signatures. There are only about 190,000 people in Whatcom County. And Bellingham is all about "Last Time We Mixed Religion With Politics, People Got Burned At The Stake" bumper stickers (as well as Obamessiah 08' stickers).

379 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:09:29pm

re: #365 Sharmuta

re: #358 MandyManners


Weird.

Oh. I thought you were saying that initiatives such as this were a way for DI to see how far they could push.

380 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:09:40pm

re: #370 Gus 802

I'll assume then they deny astronomy and any consideration of the speed of life. I'm sure they have some "backwards osmosis" theory to oppose an event that took place 12.2 billion years go just "arriving" to Earth view.

They have an answer.
Astronomical estimates of the distance to various galaxies gives conflicting data. The Biblical Record refers to the expansion of space by the Creator. Astrophysicist Russell Humphries demonstrates that such space expansion would dilate time in distant space. This could explain a recent creation with great distances to the stars.

381 Catttt  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:09:44pm

re: #288 alegrias

* * *
And the best part is, Creation Museums are NOT brought to you by your taxdollars, unlike much crappy government art (Piss Christ, Elephant Poopy Madonna, Chocolate covered naked woman and other offensive taxpayer paid "art")

I agree. That is a terrible waste of chocolate.

382 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:10:10pm

re: #268 Iron Fist

I wonder where all of this shit came from. Until we started discussing it, I had never heard of Young Earth Creationists. Not anywhere. Creationists, sure. There are lots of people who believe that God (or some god/gods) created the Universe. This is not an implausible belief. The Universe is here so, logically, it had to come from somewhere. While this is more of a metaphysical than physical debate, it is a debate that has been going on for thousands of years.

The concept that everything is only six thousand years old, and humans shared the Earth with dinosaurs? Never heard of it. Never heard of anyone who had heard of it. It is so ludicrous on the face of it that I have to almost wonder if someone came up with the concept deliberately to make believers look ridiculous.

* * *
I blame Hanna Barbera Cartoons!

"Flintstones,
We're the Flintstones
We're a prehistoric family
From the town of Bedrock ..."

(sorry forget the lyrics)

383 MandyManners  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:10:17pm

bbiab

384 Honorary Yooper  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:10:39pm

re: #362 Mich-again

Well thats stupid. They could use a tape measure and a dinner plate and figure out Pi closer than that.

I know that, you know that, but these folks don't want to do that. They want to take the Word as written by God (yes, some do believe God wrote the Bible) word's for it.

385 NelsFree  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:11:03pm

re: #370 Gus 802

I'll assume then they deny astronomy and any consideration of the speed of life.


It's so fast, life has passed me by.
/

386 Dr. Shalit  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:11:22pm

re: #219 jcm

jcm -

So MANY Animals - So MUCH POOP - Believe if you check the NYTimes Morgue you will find stories in the late 1800's about how the increasing amount of Horse Manure would put a damper on the further development of Manhattan.

-S-

387 Wishing  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:11:27pm

re: #359 jcm

I'm partial to the Buffalo. Mondo SUV, no worries about drive by shootings, got a Prius with a COEXIST and Obama bumper sticker in front of you? Swat it off the road with the claw.

From the article: Buffalo vehicles employed with explosive ordnance disposal teams and engineers units have taken about 1,000 IED hits without a loss of life
Way to go, USA inventors/designers/engineers!

388 Idle Drifter  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:11:35pm

re: #359 jcm

I'm partial to the Buffalo. Mondo SUV, no worries about drive by shootings, got a Prius with a COEXIST and Obama bumper sticker in front of you? Swat it off the road with the claw.

My sister has that damn sticker on her car next to "Jesus was a Liberal" sticker. She gets pissed when I tell her her arguments are nothing but bumper sticker rhetoric. Go figure.

389 funky chicken  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:11:39pm

Some of these morons say that dinosaurs were alive and running around in the middle ages, which means they would have been alive and running around ancient Egypt, China, India, Greece, and Rome. All of those cultures had prolific artists....but not a single one thought a rampaging T-Rex, or a group of stampeding herbivores, or perhaps a stealthy velociraptor was interesting enough to paint or sculpt?

LOL

390 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:11:42pm

re: #385 NelsFree

It's so fast, life has passed me by.
/

Of course, you had to hide a few times.

391 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:12:50pm

re: #376 Basho

I think they're copy and pasting and then using the quote button on the text...

No- I think it's a glitch for IE users.

392 Catttt  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:12:52pm

re: #384 Honorary Yooper

I know that, you know that, but these folks don't want to do that. They want to take the Word as written by God (yes, some do believe God wrote the Bible) word's for it.

That reminds me of Archie Bunker preferring the Bible in English, "the way God wrote it."

393 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:12:54pm

re: #356 Honorary Yooper

It dates back to Bishop James Ussher in the mid 17th Century. He used the Bible to calculate the age of the Earth to about 6,000 years. Specifically, he claimed it dated from October 23, 4004 BC. There is another on out there by John Lightfoot which dates the Earth to 3929 BC (also from the mid 17th Century). These differed littler from other Biblically-based estimate of the time period. However, older estimates were made by others in earlier time periods. The YECs want to go back to a world just before the Renaissance, but, ironically, just after the Reformation (never mind the one happened before the other, but it describes their mindset on science best).

That is one source... The Jewish year is dated from (depending on your commentaries) either the creation itself or the creation of Adam via a different and much older calculation. It is 5769.

394 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:13:00pm

re: #380 jcm

Dilate time? How would expansion cause dilation of time?

I knew it would involve some kind of compression or expansion. They take an accepted scientific theory and apply either one for some magical formula.

395 Wishing  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:13:19pm

re: #371 Ojoe

Way too bad that pteranadons still aren't flying, I'd really like to see one of those in the air.

I heard they had hooked up with Jet Blue...

396 Dr. Shalit  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:13:34pm

re: #251 Idle Drifter

Well if dinosaurs were still around we'd have great walled cities and hunting rifles chambered for .50 BMG as a minimum for dangerous game hunting. Man I could go for a bronto burger.

Idle Drifter -

"...Mmmm Bronto Burger - Yabba Dabba Doo!..."

-S-

397 Gus  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:14:03pm

re: #385 NelsFree

It's so fast, life has passed me by.
/

Oops. I said speed of life. Brain lock. I meant speed of light.

/Doh!

398 funky chicken  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:14:10pm

re: #371 Ojoe

until it carried off the family pet or toddler

399 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:14:18pm

re: #391 Sharmuta

K, that makes a lot more sense.

400 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:15:42pm

re: #309 ConservatismNow!

Wake me up when the Baroque era comes back. Wait. Chocolate covered naked woman you say? Is said woman hot, smoking or otherwise?

* * *
If you're a conservative hottie, I doubt you'd be attracted to a government grant sucking selfabsorbed exhibitionist person who covered themselves in chocolate and made you pay for it!

401 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:17:05pm

re: #321 Salamantis

I Kings 7:23 And he made a molten sea, ten cubits from the one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about.

I think they're close to a cubit and a half out of round...

402 NelsFree  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:17:29pm

re: #397 Gus 802

Oops. I said speed of life. Brain lock. I meant speed of light.

/Doh!


I made light of your misquote.

403 aboo-Hoo-Hoo  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:18:20pm

re: #347 jcm

I already live in WA...

IT'S MINE, ALL MINE!

Not quite...or yet. Any reserve on this?

404 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:18:51pm

re: #399 Basho

K, that makes a lot more sense.

It's only a theory™.

405 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:19:05pm

re: #344 aboo-Hoo-Hoo

...supreme ruler of the universe....

Sounds pretty cool. Any bids out yet from Chicago or DC?

* * * *
Al Gore has got dibs on "Global Healer" of the Universe. Barf!

406 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:19:14pm

re: #387 Wishing

From the article: Buffalo vehicles employed with explosive ordnance disposal teams and engineers units have taken about 1,000 IED hits without a loss of life
Way to go, USA inventors/designers/engineers!

The arm was design by an NCO in the field in Iraq and adopted for all vehicles.

407 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:19:40pm

re: #362 Mich-again

re: #298 Honorary Yooper


Well thats stupid. They could use a tape measure and a dinner plate and figure out Pi closer than that.

Folks, no disrespect, but if you are stuck with whole numbers, "pi" IS 3.

The guiding principle is known as "significant figures". It's why, in some cases, the eighty digits behind the decimal point on your calculator are meaningless.

408 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:21:34pm

re: #380 jcm

They have an answer.
Astronomical estimates of the distance to various galaxies gives conflicting data. The Biblical Record refers to the expansion of space by the Creator. Astrophysicist Russell Humphries demonstrates that such space expansion would dilate time in distant space. This could explain a recent creation with great distances to the stars.

I am now going to put on my physicist hat.

He is making a hand waving reference to General Relativity. He is wrong and essentially lying also.

In special relativity (the version that deals with reference frames moving relative to each other at a constant velocity) all sorts of weird things can happen to time and space. Specifically, you get time dilation and distance contraction.

GR deals with accelerating reference frames. Since an acceleration due to gravity is indistinguishable from a rocket acceleration, there are some subtle details here, it is the Principle of Equivalence (specifically inertial mass is the same as gravitational mass), GR becomes the framework to talk about gravity itself on the large scale.

Now it is possinle as a homework assignment to ask a junior or senior physics major, I want clocks to look like they are running this way or that way, what reference frame would do it?

You can calculate a "God frame" where he is accelerating in some way so that 14 billion years looks like seven days to him. and then He "slows down" relative to us. The main failure of this is that it is a parlor trick at best and a mathematical inconsistency at worst. The teory hinges on the idea that there is no preferred reference fram. Surely a God fram would be the preferred frame.

409 WindHorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:21:58pm

re: #407 OldLineTexan

okay.... but who (in the real world) uses ONLY significant figures? NASA? etc....

410 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:22:39pm

re: #407 OldLineTexan

And if you claim that not every number can be made up as a factor of two whole numbers, well, that can get you tossed overboard...

411 alegrias  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:25:16pm

re: #346 Mich-again

The other night we were commenting about the iffy supply routes into Afghanistan and then the next day I read that Kyrgyzstan decided to close the US base. Now that might be the result of a Russian threat, or maybe the Kyrgyz are just arm-twisting Obama for more cash. But either way, it isn't good to have so many troops in a landlocked area with no good supply routes.

* * * *
Oh ye of little faith. If Obama sends 17,000 troops into a landlocked hell hole the Russians have sealed off for Al Qaeda & the Taliban, what could possibly go wrong when they're protected by the "O"'s globally respected awesomeness?

Jihadists will fall like the walls of Jericho, when Obama says so.

412 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:27:11pm

I should add that GR also has time dilation and spacial contraction, that Cosmology has a lot to do with GR and an expanding universe is the root of the acceleration he is referring to. Unfortunately, the rates we observe it going at do not correspond to his God Frame at all.

413 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:27:39pm

re: #407 OldLineTexan

Folks, no disrespect, but if you are stuck with whole numbers, "pi" IS 3.

I use 22/7 if I have to make an estimate in my head. If there is paper and pencil I use 3.14 and do the math manually. I am not sure what you mean by "stuck with whole numbers"? What? do some people do math with corn kernels?

414 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:29:31pm

re: #409 WindHorse

re: #407 OldLineTexan

okay.... but who (in the real world) uses ONLY significant figures? NASA? etc....

Please, look it up. The result of any mathematical operation is dependent on the accuracy of the starting numbers.

An example:

Arugala is $1.09/lb at your grocer. The grocer's scale is marked in sixteenths of a pound (ounces). The accuracy of that scale is plus or minus one-half of one-sixteenth.

Place your arugula on the scale and get a reading of say, 1 pound 8 ounces.

The price is $1.635, right?

No, it's not. In our currency system (at this level of transaction, not clever computer programs), the .005 has no sigificance. It is rounded up or down, usually by the default of being ignored.

415 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:29:39pm

re: #413 Mich-again

There were times when people only used whole numbers. Think Roman Numerals.

416 jcm  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:30:08pm

re: #408 LudwigVanQuixote

I am now going to put on my physicist hat.

He is making a hand waving reference to General Relativity. He is wrong and essentially lying also.

In special relativity (the version that deals with reference frames moving relative to each other at a constant velocity) all sorts of weird things can happen to time and space. Specifically, you get time dilation and distance contraction.

GR deals with accelerating reference frames. Since an acceleration due to gravity is indistinguishable from a rocket acceleration, there are some subtle details here, it is the Principle of Equivalence (specifically inertial mass is the same as gravitational mass), GR becomes the framework to talk about gravity itself on the large scale.

Now it is possinle as a homework assignment to ask a junior or senior physics major, I want clocks to look like they are running this way or that way, what reference frame would do it?

You can calculate a "God frame" where he is accelerating in some way so that 14 billion years looks like seven days to him. and then He "slows down" relative to us. The main failure of this is that it is a parlor trick at best and a mathematical inconsistency at worst. The teory hinges on the idea that there is no preferred reference fram. Surely a God fram would be the preferred frame.

The simple question I have for them is.

Do you believe The Creator created falsity in his creation? The creator of the Bible would not.

417 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:30:10pm

re: #410 Basho

re: #407 OldLineTexan

And if you claim that not every number can be made up as a factor of two whole numbers, well, that can get you tossed overboard...

If your culture has not developed fractions ...

418 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:30:39pm

re: #410 Basho

For the non-math geek, that was a reference to Hippasus:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

419 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:30:42pm

If there is a God, he does not want the ones he created in his own image to be idiots.

420 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:30:44pm

re: #413 Mich-again

I use 22/7 if I have to make an estimate in my head. If there is paper and pencil I use 3.14 and do the math manually. I am not sure what you mean by "stuck with whole numbers"? What? do some people do math with corn kernels?

Al Alabama legislator actually tried to pass a bill that would officially mandate that Pi was equal to three in the state of Alabama. All public construction would have been required to use the Pi = 3 value in their design calculations.

422 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:31:26pm

re: #413 Mich-again

re: #407 OldLineTexan


I use 22/7 if I have to make an estimate in my head. If there is paper and pencil I use 3.14 and do the math manually. I am not sure what you mean by "stuck with whole numbers"? What? do some people do math with corn kernels?

You are the benefactor of many generations of mathematical developments that many cultures did not possess in the past.

423 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:31:42pm

re: #415 Basho

There were times when people only used whole numbers. Think Roman Numerals.

Pythagoras was before the Romans.

424 Sharmuta  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:32:40pm

re: #307 Sharmuta

What is currently preventing full discussion of scientific theories in public school classrooms?

Well- I see you dinged me down for this, RhymesWithRight, but you haven't answered my question. Instead you logged out. I have to conclude that there is nothing preventing full discussion of scientific theories in public school science classrooms. So I fail to see the need for the legislation except to push an agenda.

425 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:33:29pm

re: #423 Mich-again

Well, Roman Numerals were just an example of a number system consisting of only whole numbers...

426 windhorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:33:46pm

re: #414 OldLineTexan

Sorry, I disagree.

We are talking about PI, not arugula and the price of tea per pound.

You must be an accountant, not n engineer.

If we (collectively) dealt with math as you suggest, we would all still be dreaming of the day we could put a man on the moon.

427 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:34:15pm

re: #407 OldLineTexan

Folks, no disrespect, but if you are stuck with whole numbers, "pi" IS 3.

The guiding principle is known as "significant figures". It's why, in some cases, the eighty digits behind the decimal point on your calculator are meaningless.

The ancient Jews knew that Pi was not exactly 3. Again Kabbalah and Gematria show this in many places in the Bible. One of the problems that certain Christian commentators have is that they have never looked at the original commentaries.

The quote we are referring to comes from the book of Kings and a description of the basin in the Temple.

It is actually one of the miracles of the Temple. There were others, like there was always enough room in it for everyone who came to pray and it never smelled bad from the sacrifices etc...

The idea here is not that Pi is exactly 3. In fact it is given special mention as a miracle because they knew that Pi was NOT 3. The idea is that there was something special about the Basin in the Temple - it was so special and so miraculous that in this case Pi was 3. you can believe that or not. But that is the point of the story.

428 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:34:46pm

re: #416 jcm

The simple question I have for them is.

Do you believe The Creator created falsity in his creation? The creator of the Bible would not.

See my earlier troll hammer about the pitfalls of a lying Deity...

429 windhorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:34:48pm

re: #414 OldLineTexan

and if you agree with me, stomp three times on the floor.....

:)

430 windhorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:35:40pm

re: #417 OldLineTexan

by the way, I learned everything I know about numbers in Texas....

431 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:37:25pm

re: #426 windhorse

The point is, 3 was a good enough estimate for a society with only whole numbers, and it works as long as the measurements aren't about 10 times whatever units they were using.

432 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:38:00pm

re: #420 Salamantis

Al Alabama legislator actually tried to pass a bill that would officially mandate that Pi was equal to three in the state of Alabama. All public construction would have been required to use the Pi = 3 value in their design calculations.

That is just plain crazy. Stupider even than trying to sneak creationism into science class if that is possible. Pi is easily measured by anyone with access to a tape ruler and something round.

And what makes it uber stupid is that all the calculations that engineers use when designing bridges or buildings would then be suspect.

433 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:39:54pm

re: #431 Basho

I should add I don't know whether they had rational numbers in their number system, I'm just commenting on OldLineTexas' point.

434 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:40:29pm

re: #432 Mich-again

That is just plain crazy. Stupider even than trying to sneak creationism into science class if that is possible. Pi is easily measured by anyone with access to a tape ruler and something round.

And what makes it uber stupid is that all the calculations that engineers use when designing bridges or buildings would then be suspect.

Yes it would get people killed. I want to reiterate that it is also stupid because it is not even the point of the verse they are mentioning in the first place. The ancient Jews new Pi was not exactly 3. It is mentioned as a miracle, just like the parting of the Red Sea.

435 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:41:06pm

re: #433 Basho

I should add I don't know whether they had rational numbers in their number system, I'm just commenting on OldLineTexas' point.

They even had irrational numbers. They knew root two was not rational for example.

436 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:41:11pm

re: #422 OldLineTexan

You are the benefactor of many generations of mathematical developments that many cultures did not possess in the past.

You have to go waaay back in the past for that to be true. Thousands of years.

437 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:42:52pm

re: #436 Mich-again

You have to go waaay back in the past for that to be true. Thousands of years.

The Greeks, the Egyptians and the Jews had irrational numbers from a very long time ago.

438 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:43:59pm

re: #435 LudwigVanQuixote

They even had irrational numbers. They knew root two was not rational for example.

We have 10 fingers and 10 toes and lo and behold, our numbering system is based on 10. Coincident?

439 windhorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:44:04pm

re: #431 Basho

sorry, we are not a society of "whole numbers". But, I don't view this, or take this, personally.

440 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:44:32pm

re: #436 Mich-again

You have to go waaay back in the past for that to be true. Thousands of years.

Thy did not have the notion of transcendental numbers though to the best of my knowledge. It was not untill the 1800's that Pi and E were shown to be transcendental.

A transcendental number is not the root of any finite polynomial.

441 ConservatismNow!  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:45:34pm

re: #400 alegrias

I don't care if they are conservative or not. Eye Candy is Eye Candy.

442 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:45:50pm

re: #438 Mich-again

We have 10 fingers and 10 toes and lo and behold, our numbering system is based on 10. Coincident?

Not a coincident at all. However, many ancient cultures had much more sophisticated math than you might think. The Dark ages in between the fall of Rome and the Middle ages wiped out a lot of Western Knowledge.

443 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:47:23pm

re: #438 Mich-again

We have 10 fingers and 10 toes and lo and behold, our numbering system is based on 10. Coincident?

Many ancient societies had a base 12 numbering system. Ever wonder why there are 24 hours in a day, 60 minutes in an hour, 60 seconds in a minute? Fascinating stuff.

444 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:47:33pm

re: #366 unclassifiable

Well now they have done it.

OK. I have got to break the news to you guys.

Well we, um Earth, do have a god.

But, hmmmm, difficult, ok , he's a "god" but you remember that bible passage where they say we were created in God's image, yada, yada, yada...

Well it turns out that our "god" sits in a cube in the Milky Way department of section 23456719 of the Galactic Supreme Ruler Corporation, Inc.

I know that is a little disappointing to you initiative supporters but look at it this way.

When you bitch and moan about how no one ever appreciates you and you're just a number and all of that rot...

... your sectional assistant sub-supervisor supreme being understands.

Very Douglas Adams! Where's your towel mate?

445 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:47:45pm

re: #443 Basho

We even have a special word for 12: Dozen

446 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:48:35pm

re: #440 LudwigVanQuixote

I wonder what might be the significance of the number that is the Cosine of itself? (In radians). It is one of those numbers that should have a letter for a name but it won't until someone figures out why it even matters. If it even does.

447 windhorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:48:37pm

re: #443 Basho

yeah, but they were all from Alabama....

448 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:48:48pm

re: #439 windhorse

sorry, we are not a society of "whole numbers".

Of course not, I'm not an advocate of making Pi = 3 law ;P

449 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:49:11pm

re: #447 windhorse

LOL

450 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:51:28pm

re: #426 windhorse

re: #414 OldLineTexan

Sorry, I disagree.

We are talking about PI, not arugula and the price of tea per pound.

You must be an accountant, not n engineer.

If we (collectively) dealt with math as you suggest, we would all still be dreaming of the day we could put a man on the moon.

Sorry, I'm an engineer, and I have (helped) put payloads in orbit. So my math works just fine, thank you.

I'm just trying to explain how an ancient civilization with no concept of fractions may have seen an approximation of pi.

451 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:51:38pm

re: #443 Basho

Ever wonder why there are 24 hours in a day, 60 minutes in an hour, 60 seconds in a minute?

Did humans used to have 12 fingers and toes?

452 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:51:41pm

re: #443 Basho

Many ancient societies had a base 12 numbering system. Ever wonder why there are 24 hours in a day, 60 minutes in an hour, 60 seconds in a minute? Fascinating stuff.

Here's why: 10 only has 2 factors; 2,5

12 has - 2,3,4,6 - 4 factors. Twice as many

Much easier to do calculations in your head this way.

453 windhorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:54:26pm

re: #450 OldLineTexan

we weren't talking about ancient civilizations.... but aragula....

anyhow.... I still disagree with the fact that anyone should be treating PI as 3.... nothing personal....

454 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:54:40pm

re: #448 Basho

re: #439 windhorse


Of course not, I'm not an advocate of making Pi = 3 law ;P

Neither am I, despite the personal attacks.

455 Mich-again  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:54:41pm

re: #452 Basho

Much easier to do calculations in your head this way.

Maybe way back then the Earth spun around the Sun faster and there were only 360 days in a year.

456 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:55:14pm

re: #453 windhorse

re: #450 OldLineTexan

we weren't talking about ancient civilizations.... but aragula....

anyhow.... I still disagree with the fact that anyone should be treating PI as 3.... nothing personal....

That was NOT the point. But it's not important now.

457 windhorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:55:45pm

re: #454 OldLineTexan

and I thought i was sensitive....? ;)

458 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:57:31pm

re: #457 windhorse

re: #454 OldLineTexan

and I thought i was sensitive....? ;)

Did I call YOU an accountant?

/spit

;)

459 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:57:51pm

re: #455 Mich-again

Maybe way back then the Earth spun around the Sun faster and there were only 360 days in a year.

Ever wonder why there are 360 degrees in a circle? Yup. Base 12

460 windhorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:58:05pm

re: #456 OldLineTexan

no.... it was your point, and I disagreed with you on the validity of the "real world" working only with whole numbers....

461 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:58:33pm

re: #460 windhorse

re: #456 OldLineTexan

no.... it was your point, and I disagreed with you on the validity of the "real world" working only with whole numbers....

Wrong again.

462 windhorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:58:51pm

alright Tex, I call a truce... consider me rolling over on my back so you can stand over me.....

463 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:59:22pm

re: #446 Mich-again

I wonder what might be the significance of the number that is the Cosine of itself? (In radians). It is one of those numbers that should have a letter for a name but it won't until someone figures out why it even matters. If it even does.

well, solve, x = 1 - x^2/2! + x^4/4!...

or just approximate with the positive root of

x^2/2! +x - 1 = 0

Perhaps some other lizard will remind me of something big from number theory that is just slipping my mind, but I have never seen an application where this number was important.

x = sin(x) is important though, that is 0!

464 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:59:25pm

re: #460 windhorse

re: #456 OldLineTexan

no.... it was your point, and I disagreed with you on the validity of the "real world" working only with whole numbers....

Even my lame example did not consist of whole numbers, BTW. And the phrase "real world" does NOT appear in any of my posts.

465 OldLineTexan  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 7:59:57pm

re: #462 windhorse

alright Tex, I call a truce... consider me rolling over on my back so you can stand over me.....

Oh, holy shit ...

goodnight

466 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:01:26pm

re: #465 OldLineTexan

lol
Us math nerds are so misunderstood.

467 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:02:41pm

re: #451 Mich-again

Did humans used to have 12 fingers and toes?

the idea is that 360 has 2,3,4,5,6,9,15 etc go into it evenly. If you want to chop up a circle in a bunch of different ways evenly, 360 is a good number to use. It is pure convenience.

468 windhorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:03:17pm

hey bro'.... go look at 409.... My original response to you was that IN THE REAL WORLD, whole numbers don't cut it.

You responded as you did....

It wasn't my intent to start something, but I don't appreciate you walking all over me for something you've said.

(and you won't even accept complete submission on my part?)

469 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:05:40pm

Now that I think of it... 12 inches in a foot, 3 feet in a yard, 5280 feet in a mile. Yes sir, the American measuring system is Base 12. In your face metric system!

470 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:08:14pm

re: #466 Basho

lol
Us math nerds are so misunderstood.

What is the difference between a physicist and a mathematician?

A physicist has kissed a girl!

What is the difference between a physicist and an engineer?

The engineer gets an extra zero behind the paycheck!

or

The physicist cares why it works.

What is the difference between a physicist and a chemist?

The ability to do complicated differential equations.

What is the difference between a physicist and a biologist?

The ability to do complicated differential equations and chemistry.

What is the difference between a physicist and a political scientist?

A physicist is a scientist!

/////////

471 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:08:37pm

Who remembers Phi, the Golden Mean? It's the number that when multiplied by itself minus 1, equals 1.

Thus x(x-1) = 1
x squared - x = 1
x squared - x - 1 = 0

Plug in the quadratic equation, and we get two roots: 1.618 0339 887...(it's irrational), and
0.618 0339 887...

When multiplied by each other, they equal 1.

472 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:09:22pm

re: #469 Basho

Now that I think of it... 12 inches in a foot, 3 feet in a yard, 5280 feet in a mile. Yes sir, the American measuring system is Base 12. In your face metric system!

Actually the mile is based on the idea of 1000 paces of the Roman legion.

473 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:09:55pm

re: #470 LudwigVanQuixote

ROFL! Nice!

474 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:10:34pm

re: #472 LudwigVanQuixote

Thanks for the correction, thought I had something. It's still divisible by 12 though!

475 WindHorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:10:54pm

Old Line Texan, I apologize..... I referred to what you had said in terms of "Whole numbers". I have a thing against "significant figures". My apologies.

I don't know what else to say.

476 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:11:08pm

re: #471 Salamantis

Yay! Sal is a student of sacred geometry! =) Phi rules!

477 WindHorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:12:27pm

re: #475 WindHorse

I don't mean to be irrational.....

;)

478 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:14:03pm

Here's an elegant equation...perhaps THE MOST elegant equation:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

479 WindHorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:15:16pm

re: #478 Salamantis

too complex for me.....

480 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:16:36pm

re: #478 Salamantis

Ahh... I remember working with that in Complex Analysis. I miss college. I really should apply to grad school, hopefully when the economy picks up a bit.

481 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:20:48pm

re: #474 Basho

Thanks for the correction, thought I had something. It's still divisible by 12 though!

Well you do have something. Look at Euclid's Theorem. All counting numbers are either prime or the product of primes.

So if you want a nice big number that is easily divisible in lots of ways, you multiply a bunch of small primes together.

482 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:21:47pm

re: #478 Salamantis

Here's an elegant equation...perhaps THE MOST elegant equation:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

When asked to prove the existence of God, Euler said that equation, therefore there is God.

483 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:22:18pm

re: #471 Salamantis

Who remembers Phi, the Golden Mean? It's the number that when multiplied by itself minus 1, equals 1.

Thus x(x-1) = 1
x squared - x = 1
x squared - x - 1 = 0

Plug in the quadratic equation, and we get two roots: 1.618 0339 887...(it's irrational), and
0.618 0339 887...

When multiplied by each other, they equal 1.

and yes Phi is awesome...

484 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:24:49pm

re: #401 Salamantis

I think they're close to a cubit and a half out of round...

Did you see my explanation of this verse up thread Sal?

485 sawblade88  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:25:50pm

re: #459 Basho

Ever wonder why there are 360 degrees in a circle? Yup. Base 12

Base 60, some evidence of base 10.

486 sawblade88  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:26:41pm

re: #485 sawblade88

Base 60, some evidence of base 10.

Sorry, lost the reference. Babylonian mathematics

487 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:28:05pm

re: #481 LudwigVanQuixote

Like atoms are the building blocks of matter, so to are primes the building blocks of numbers. That's what my teacher used to say...

Some say mathematicians are mystics, and there is a tiny bit of truth to that.

488 NukeAtomrod  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:28:32pm

re: #420 Salamantis

Al Alabama legislator actually tried to pass a bill that would officially mandate that Pi was equal to three in the state of Alabama. All public construction would have been required to use the Pi = 3 value in their design calculations.

I remember reading about this. I think this was educational legislation to make math easier for lazy or stupid kids. I doubt the legislator even considered what effect it would have on architects and construction. There was another bill somewhere that tried to change Standard Gravity to 10 m/s2 for the same reason.

489 WindHorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:30:16pm

re: #487 Basho

Have you ever heard Ken Nordine expound on the Fibonacci sequence?

Word jazz..... not sure you can find it without paying for it... (I did)
btw, it is excellent.....

490 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:30:33pm

re: #487 Basho

Like atoms are the building blocks of matter, so to are primes the building blocks of numbers. That's what my teacher used to say...

Some say mathematicians are mystics, and there is a tiny bit of truth to that.

There is a lot of truth to that. Look at the Pythagoreans, the Kabbalists and the Egyptians. The notion of sacred numbers and sacred geometries has been around for a very long time.

491 Paleosapiens  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:31:05pm

There is an argument or point of logic to present to Intelligent Designers or "God willed it..." -
Ask if the right to choose/free will is the greatest gift god granted to man. Next ask if they're greater than god. Then ask, if they're not greater than god, why are they attempting to take away free will...

No point can be made to circumvent the fact of extreme hypocrisy on their part.

re: #443 Basho
Base 12 & 60, which came from Mesopotamia, are due to counting joints of each finger on one hand in combination with the whole fingers on the other hand. Details of the method are fuzzy - saw it on a documentary a while back.

492 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:32:12pm

re: #489 WindHorse

I'll check it out, thanks!

493 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:34:08pm

I once figured out an interesting way to approach Fermat's Last Theorem, where he postulates that ax + bx could never equal cx, if x was a whole number equal to or larger than 3.

The problem is, of course, solving for thre variables of an exponent simultaneously.

So why not re-express it as (a-b)x = an expanding equation in terms of a and b = (a+b)x

494 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:34:22pm

re: #489 WindHorse

Found this on YouTube:

Youtube Video
495 WindHorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:34:38pm

re: #492 Basho

he'll change your life..... I told my sons.... and then, next thing I know, they have downloaded everything the guy ever recorded...

We have all sat around for hours, listening..... (he has been on the scene for forty years.... plus)

496 WindHorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:35:58pm

re: #494 Basho

thank you!

497 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:36:33pm

re: #493 Salamantis

I once figured out an interesting way to approach Fermat's Last Theorem, where he postulates that ax + bx could never equal cx, if x was a whole number equal to or larger than 3.

The problem is, of course, solving for thre variables of an exponent simultaneously.

So why not re-express it as (a-b)x = an expanding equation in terms of a and b = (a+b)x

Because it doesn't work :)

Honestly, any simple approach fails. The actual proof unifies several branches of very modern mathematics and is over 500 pages long.

498 WindHorse  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:37:43pm

....even the bumps on pineapples.....

499 NukeAtomrod  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:38:57pm

re: #497 LudwigVanQuixote

Because it doesn't work :)

Honestly, any simple approach fails. The actual proof unifies several branches of very modern mathematics and is over 500 pages long.

You must be a blast to watch Futurama with!

/ Good natured ribbing.

500 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:38:58pm

gotta go for a bit lizards! be good!

501 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:39:26pm

re: #499 NukeAtomrod

You must be a blast to watch Futurama with!

/ Good natured ribbing.

I love futurama!

502 Basho  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:40:56pm

Gotta go to sleep. Thanks for the math talk. Brought me back to a special time of my life. Take care all!

503 skicougar  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:57:30pm

re: #18 Shug

Science and Creation do not belong in the same sentence , dummy

sure they don't. and just who do you guys think created science ?

science follows logical paths to prove its theories, so either - much like the big bang; science is always random and people have just been able to explain it away

or

something created the basics of science as to follow an order that would allow for the universe to function.

504 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 8:58:36pm

I had written out a much longer explanation, complete with formulae, detailing how the constants in the ascending exponential series of this re-expression was the same as Pascal's triangle times two, and one only had to prove that the central expanding term wasn't expressible as a single perfect exponent, to prove the theory with mathematics available in Fermat's time, but the program ate it. It would lend credence to what Fermat wrote' that he had discovered an elegant proof of his theorem, but lacked the room to write it down there, and would write it down elsewhere; that 'elsewhere' was never found.

(a-b) + 2b = (a+b)
(a-b)squared + 4ab = (a+b)squared
(a-b)cubed + 6asquaredb + 6absquared = (a+b)cubed
(a-b)fourth + 8acubedb + 12asquaredbsquared + 8abcubed = (a+b)fourth

And so on.

Precisely double the Pascal's triangle expansion of
1
1 1
1 2 1
1 3 3 1
1 4 6 4 1

and so on.

I have actually written a general equation (a-b)n + a central term = (a+b)n, but the mathematics cannot be expressed in this thread with the ascii resources available to me.

All you'd have to prove is that the central term couldn't be expressed as some z to the nth, if n was equal to or larger than three; it's pretty easy to prove in individual cases - cubes, fourths, etc.

505 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:02:40pm

re: #503 skicougar

sure they don't. and just who do you guys think created science ?

science follows logical paths to prove its theories, so either - much like the big bang; science is always random and people have just been able to explain it away

or

something created the basics of science as to follow an order that would allow for the universe to function.

Wrong. It could also be that the fundamental constants of the universe had to relate to each other in a logical fashion for them to be what they are, and that each was what it was anf not some other value precisely because the rest were what they were and not some other values, in an interconected, mutually referential, and co-primordial system. In other words, in order to exist, it had to logically cohere.

506 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:04:57pm

What you don't seem to get is that all science is is a method by means of which logic is applied to the systematic perceptual investigation of our universe.

507 funky chicken  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:09:34pm

re: #420 Salamantis

re: #413 Mich-again


Al Alabama legislator actually tried to pass a bill that would officially mandate that Pi was equal to three in the state of Alabama. All public construction would have been required to use the Pi = 3 value in their design calculations.

C'mon. Do you have a link for that? It . just . cannot . be . true.

Please tell me it's not true.

/it would make the mental math easier for all those structural engineers, I guess

508 [deleted]  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:13:01pm
509 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:15:02pm

re: #507 funky chicken

C'mon. Do you have a link for that? It . just . cannot . be . true.

Please tell me it's not true.

/it would make the mental math easier for all those structural engineers, I guess

Apparently it's a hoax:

[Link: www.snopes.com...]

So you get your wish. It's not true.

510 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:16:33pm

re: #508 skicougar

It's called autochthonous systemic self-organization, nimrod, and yes, it happens.

511 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:18:48pm

re: #508 skicougar

GAZE, for malicious commentary. Enjoy the ban stick.

512 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:19:38pm

re: #98 Basho

I don't think that tiny bit of salad is going to satisfy the hunger of something that size...

It's just a snack. It can get its own food, but it likes the attention, and the behind-the-ear rubs.

Why am I even thinking about this?

513 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:20:51pm

The phenomenon is known as emergence; you can read about it here:

[Link: www.amazon.com...]

514 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:23:00pm

re: #149 Last Mohican

No, but it's hilarious.

I'm still ashamed to admit it, but now I really want to visit the Creation Museum.

I desperately want to visit the CM. I know who I want to go with, too, but I'm afraid her head might explode, and she has small children. It's a problem.

515 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:27:59pm

re: #220 Bloodnok

And one very sturdy shovel.

Haven't any of you ever met one of those people who teach their cat to use the toilet? You can do it with a T-Rex too--they just stick their tails out over the side of the Ark...

516 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:33:29pm

re: #377 WindHorse

yes.... but that would offend someone..... and we don't tolerate THAT.....

(out here in WA, we don't have "children".... we have "students".... and we don't have "early dismissal", we have "early release")

I worked for a school that tried the 'early release' phrase. I refuse to use it because it sounds like we're letting them out of prison, rather than just ending class at 12:00.

517 Salamantis  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:36:07pm

Here are some more technical, but still readable, books on complexity theory, emergence, and spontaneous self-organization. The first two are by Stuart A. Kauffman, the second two are by John H. Holland. They are both fellows at the Santa Fe Institute.

At Home in the Universe: The Search for the Laws of Self-Organization and Complexity

[Link: www.amazon.com...]

The Origins of Order: Self-Organization and Selection in Evolution

[Link: www.amazon.com...]

Emergence: From Chaos To Order

[Link: www.amazon.com...]

Hidden Order: How Adaptation Builds Complexity

[Link: www.amazon.com...]

518 hazzyday  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:50:17pm

When these bills come before a legislature someone should add a debate item to them. If the bills passes make it illegal for anyone to teach about young earthism. Put the cost back at em.

519 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 21, 2009 9:53:09pm

re: #518 hazzyday

When these bills come before a legislature someone should add a debate item to them. If the bills passes make it illegal for anyone to teach about young earthism. Put the cost back at em.

No, the right answer is to vote an abomination like this bill down.

520 Tigger2005  Sun, Feb 22, 2009 5:35:09am

re: #76 Charles

I posted that ridiculous illustration above -- an interesting thing you might miss is that the cavewoman is offering the hungry brontosaurus some sort of leafy vegetable. This isn't an accident -- it's how these people answer the question: if Noah had dinosaurs on the Ark, why didn't they eat all the other animals? Answer: the dinosaurs were VEGETARIANS!

Well, brontosauruses WERE vegetarians. But not sure about those T-Rexes.

I think those Jehovah's Witnesses pictures, showing the "New World" where lions lie down with lambs and act like kittens, are hysterical. Big cats have to eat meat, and their teeth and jaws are "designed" to eat meat. Yet in the "New World" they don't appear to be magically redesigned with flat, grinding molars instead of sharp teeth for rending and tearing. How can people so dumb even stand themselves?

521 Mr Secul  Sun, Feb 22, 2009 6:47:23am

re: #520 Tigger2005

They are so dumb that they don't even know that they are dumb.

And if you tried to tell them that they were dumb — they would disagree with you.

522 Basho  Sun, Feb 22, 2009 11:37:59am

re: #517 Salamantis

Thanks for the list. Favorited that comment!

523 sixgunsamori  Sun, Feb 22, 2009 2:09:23pm

I agree, to a point, that schools should not be hotbeds of theology. Unfortunately, in addition to not teaching creationism and intelligent design, public schools are also not teaching in general. The dropout rates for students forced to endure these self esteem seminars that pass for tutelage are horrendous, and those that do graduate seem to have no knowledge of civic duty, no grasp of history, and no desire to achieve anything more than a nice car, a comfortable home/apartment/room in the basement, and an clear path betwixt themselves and their plasma screen.
If I may: instead of constantly slamming the Christian right, how about we all come together and demand that our young learn to read, write, add, and subtract? Who among us would like to see a young store clerk that actually knows how to make change, or a young adult that understands a movie theater is not a place for discussion, argument and cel phone conversation? What if we stopped teaching the little darlings how best to abstain or procreate and instead taught them how to be parents and useful members of society?
We can't address these real problems until we cease to bicker. The theory of evolution has itself evolved since Darwin's time: so to shall intelligent design. Like it or not, agree with it or not, all human laws are distilled from religious text. I submit that until our youth learn HOW to read, what they're told to read is irrelevant.

524 Salamantis  Sun, Feb 22, 2009 2:40:43pm

re: #523 sixgunsamori

I agree, to a point, that schools should not be hotbeds of theology. Unfortunately, in addition to not teaching creationism and intelligent design, public schools are also not teaching in general. The dropout rates for students forced to endure these self esteem seminars that pass for tutelage are horrendous, and those that do graduate seem to have no knowledge of civic duty, no grasp of history, and no desire to achieve anything more than a nice car, a comfortable home/apartment/room in the basement, and an clear path betwixt themselves and their plasma screen.
If I may: instead of constantly slamming the Christian right, how about we all come together and demand that our young learn to read, write, add, and subtract? Who among us would like to see a young store clerk that actually knows how to make change, or a young adult that understands a movie theater is not a place for discussion, argument and cel phone conversation? What if we stopped teaching the little darlings how best to abstain or procreate and instead taught them how to be parents and useful members of society?
We can't address these real problems until we cease to bicker. The theory of evolution has itself evolved since Darwin's time: so to shall intelligent design. Like it or not, agree with it or not, all human laws are distilled from religious text. I submit that until our youth learn HOW to read, what they're told to read is irrelevant.

There IS NO 'theory' of ID; it is a Disco Institute propaganda PR relabeling of creationism, in a failed attempt to circumvent judicial prohibitions against teaching creationism as fact in public high school science class:

[Link: ase.tufts.edu...]

Even its proponent reluctantly admit that it is utterly devoid of content.

And the moral precepts found in religious texts were themselves distilled from the mores and folkways of the cultures in which the faiths originally arose.

525 [deleted]  Sun, Feb 22, 2009 3:15:07pm
526 Charles Johnson  Sun, Feb 22, 2009 3:27:11pm

Thank you for sharing ... nothing.

527 [deleted]  Sun, Feb 22, 2009 3:53:13pm
528 Charles Johnson  Sun, Feb 22, 2009 3:55:04pm

Comments complaining about creationism threads will be deleted.


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