Finally, some responsible writing from a conservative source on the ridiculous and mind-bendingly stupid “birth certificate” conspiracy theory: Barack Obama: Born in Hawaii.
It is time for folks to stop being played by the Obama campaign and drop this counter productive ‘phony birth certificate’ nonsense.
But they won’t, of course.
(Hat tip: JammieWearingFool.)
1 |
Ward Cleaver Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:06:36am |
A fanatic is someone who, having lost sight of his goal, redoubles his efforts.
| 3 |
Killgore Trout Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:07:11am |
Tea Party protestors believe Obama not US-born
| 4 |
Russkilitlover Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:07:12am |
Why, oh, why won’t this stupid canard just go away?
| 7 |
simonml Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:07:43am |
I don’t argue he was born here. I just argue that he’s a terrible POTUS.
Can I keep complaining?
| 8 |
Ward Cleaver Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:07:50am |
re: #3 Killgore Trout
Tea Party protestors believe Obama not US-born
[Video]
Friggin’ tea party kooks.
| 9 |
Killgore Trout Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:08:45am |
Obama benefits from creating an opposition which seems to be standing by the side of the road impotently pointing to a piece of paper as if it could stop 63 million voters from anointing their ‘chosen one’. Birth certificate lawsuit plaintiff Phil Berg is a Democrat and whether he understands it or not, he has done great work on behalf of his party.
Conservatives who spread this crap are suckers!
| 10 |
Killgore Trout Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:09:15am |
re: #8 Ward Cleaver
Yeah, I’ve had it with the Tea Party stuff.
| 11 |
Silhouette Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:09:28am |
Come on Charles, you missed a golden opportunity today to agree with the birth certificate people.
| 12 |
Honorary Yooper Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:10:03am |
re: #2 turn
are you listening Pam?
Of course not. She’s still enamored with the eurofascists. Pam’s got her fingers in her ears saying “la la la la, I can’t hear you.”
| 13 |
zato Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:10:09am |
Barry’s born in the U.S. alright. Its not his birthplace but his many views and opinions that seem to be un-American.
| 15 |
Bubblehead II Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:11:24am |
Dang! A Nirther thread and I need to go and get ready to recover my truck from the side of Hwy 93.
Some of you may remember when I signed off yesterday morning I snarked that I was going to jump into my gas guzzling, carbon spewing pickup truck and head to work?
Well on the way home last night, I lost the rear U-Joint on the drive shaft. Do you have any idea how much vibration a drive shaft makes just before it falls off?
Not to mention the noise it makes as it hits the pavement at 70 mph and then slams back up into the bottom of the truck.
/ Should have seen it coming. All the signs were there if I had just paid attention.
No offense AC
L8R
| 16 |
Honorary Yooper Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:11:28am |
re: #7 simonml
I don’t argue he was born here. I just argue that he’s a terrible POTUS.
Can I keep complaining?
Oh, definately. Just keep it to Obama’s political actions, hypocrisy, and we’ll do just fine.
| 17 |
sattv4u2 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:11:37am |
I said it before, i’ll say it again.
I don’t want to see Obamas Birth Certif.
I want to see his grades in economics classes!
| 18 |
redc1c4 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:12:14am |
re: #17 sattv4u2
I said it before, i’ll say it again.
I don’t want to see Obamas Birth Certif.
I want to see his grades in economics classes!
i’d be happy to see *any* of his course w*rk…….
| 19 |
Ward Cleaver Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:12:27am |
re: #10 Killgore Trout
Yeah, I’ve had it with the Tea Party stuff.
It started out as a good idea (at least in theory), but has become a kook and crank magnet.
| 20 |
VioletTiger Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:12:31am |
Truly the energizer bunnies of kookiness. Can’t they just go away?
| 21 |
Honorary Yooper Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:12:52am |
re: #1 Ward Cleaver
A fanatic is someone who, having lost sight of his goal, redoubles his efforts.
You’ve been in a lot of creationist threads lately, I see. ;-)
| 22 |
redc1c4 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:12:53am |
re: #15 Bubblehead II
Dang! A Nirther thread and I need to go and get ready to recover my truck from the side of Hwy 93.
Some of you may remember when I signed off yesterday morning I snarked that I was going to jump into my gas guzzling, carbon spewing pickup truck and head to work?
Well on the way home last night, I lost the rear U-Joint on the drive shaft. Do you have any idea how much vibration a drive shaft makes just before it falls off?
Not to mention the noise it makes as it hits the pavement at 70 mph and then slams back up into the bottom of the truck.
/ Should have seen it coming. All the signs were there if I had just paid attention.
No offense AC
L8R
at least it wasn’t the front u-joint, so you didn’t get the pole vault effect. %-)
| 23 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:13:23am |
Sad thing is, by walking backwards they think they’re moving forward.
| 24 |
simonml Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:13:28am |
re: #16 Honorary Yooper
Oh, definately. Just keep it to Obama’s political actions, hypocrisy, and we’ll do just fine.
Just let me know if I start developing ODS. I don’t want to end up in a padded room somewhere just b/c of “that guy.”
| 25 |
Honorary Yooper Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:13:58am |
re: #15 Bubblehead II
Now that really bites. I wish you luck and hope it’s not too much to get it repaired.
| 26 |
Ward Cleaver Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:14:08am |
re: #15 Bubblehead II
Dang! A Nirther thread and I need to go and get ready to recover my truck from the side of Hwy 93.
Some of you may remember when I signed off yesterday morning I snarked that I was going to jump into my gas guzzling, carbon spewing pickup truck and head to work?
Well on the way home last night, I lost the rear U-Joint on the drive shaft. Do you have any idea how much vibration a drive shaft makes just before it falls off?
Not to mention the noise it makes as it hits the pavement at 70 mph and then slams back up into the bottom of the truck.
/ Should have seen it coming. All the signs were there if I had just paid attention.
No offense AC
L8R
Uh, you’re supposed to replace the u-joints before the driveshaft falls out. You get plenty of warning, what with the squeaking and all.
| 27 |
ozymandias Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:14:25am |
his attorney general just dropped all charges against “former” senator ted stevens based on prosecutorial misconduct so ya know, there must be something about his team that is fair. i mean, that’s big, real big. would i like to see his birth certificate? sure. is he the president? definitely. will this ever go away? some day.
| 28 |
Honorary Yooper Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:14:48am |
re: #24 simonml
Just let me know if I start developing ODS. I don’t want to end up in a padded room somewhere just b/c of “that guy.”
It’s not ODS if it’s about what he does as president. Only if we do as the left did for eight years and make shit up, is it then ODS.
| 29 |
VegasRick Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:14:59am |
re: #3 Killgore Trout
Tea Party protestors believe Obama not US-born
The guy doing the interviews is a leftish doucebag. I’m not so sure I want to run with any of those folks.
| 30 |
Killgore Trout Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:15:03am |
Speaking of nuts: Pamela has an thread up today based on a John Bolton article about the impending world government.
| 31 |
Pastorius Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:15:17am |
As I recall, this is the second time Front Page has unloaded on Nirthers.
| 32 |
firebreather Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:15:18am |
Speaking of kooks and cranks, I’m still waiting for the 1st media story about how major levees have failed in the Midwest, endangering thousands of poor white folk while a black president looks on with studied indifference.
| 33 |
yesandno Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:16:26am |
Still amazes me that we know little of his years in school, college. Like he never had friends that remember him, professors or grad students that taught him, any indication he had a life past his birth in Hawaii…
Now that is strange….
| 34 |
Mike in Georgia Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:16:26am |
He doesn’t need a birth certificate. He descended from the
heavens.
/O lover.
| 36 |
Charles Johnson Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:16:55am |
re: #3 Killgore Trout
Tea Party protestors believe Obama not US-born
[Video]
The inmates have taken over the asylum.
| 37 |
albusteve Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:17:44am |
re: #33 yesandno
Still amazes me that we know little of his years in school, college. Like he never had friends that remember him, professors or grad students that taught him, any indication he had a life past his birth in Hawaii…
Now that is strange….
no one will ask him…I hate the MSM
| 38 |
rumcrook Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:08am |
there are plenty o things the New Boss/president is doing that should scare the crap out of the rational voting john q public, enough so that a dead issue that makes them look like the real nuts when spouted should and could be discarded.
heres what the taliban say about the president.
not that im inclined to agree with taliban but…..
the boss is turning out to be every bit the radical everyone poopooed his being prior to taking office.
| 39 |
BlueCanuck Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:09am |
re: #4 Russkilitlover
Why, oh, why won’t this stupid canard just go away?
*sigh* Probably for the same reason 9/11 Troofers never went away. Craziness abounds and some people have more then their fair share of it.
| 40 |
Killgore Trout Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:23am |
re: #29 VegasRick
The guy doing the interviews is a leftish doucebag.
I know. But nobody on the right is going to expose this nuttiness. The Tea Party protests are being organized by Paulians. Racists and White Power groups are infiltrating. Nobody on the right is going to expose it.
| 41 |
MandyManners Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:42am |
| 42 |
firebreather Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:54am |
The vaunted racial “healer” in the Oval Office goes characteristically mute when 4 officers of law enforcement (3 white, 1 Asian) are gunned down by an African-American rapist-murderer— who is then widely celebrated in the city of Oakland.
Where is the Teaching Moment from Obama or Holder or the media at large? Cowards & hypocrites, all.
| 43 |
VegasRick Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:19:48am |
| 44 |
Ward Cleaver Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:20:18am |
re: #21 Honorary Yooper
You’ve been in a lot of creationist threads lately, I see. ;-)
That’s a quote from the late father of legendary sportscaster, horse racing aficionado, and creator of a college football playoff system idea using the bowl games, Norm Hitzges.
| 46 |
MandyManners Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:20:41am |
re: #9 Killgore Trout
Conservatives who spread this crap are suckers!
Don’t forget the four Tennessee lawmakers Charles posted about a few weeks ago: Casada, Nicely and two others whose names I cannot recall.
| 47 |
JammieWearingFool Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:20:58am |
Thanks for the HT, Charles.
I would say this story would put an end to this drivel, but like 9/11 troofers, they’ll never give it up.
| 48 |
Lincolntf Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:21:25am |
re: #40 Killgore Trout
How many of the protests have you attended? There’s one up at the U. of Virginia that I may attend on April 15th. It’s a long drive but I like the campus and need something from their bookstore, so I might make the effort. I can assure you that if there are any Nazis there, I’ll forget all about Obama/Congress and blast them instead. I assume that would be true of 99% of the attendees.
| 49 |
Ward Cleaver Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:21:25am |
re: #34 Mike in Georgia
He doesn’t need a birth certificate. He descended from the
heavens.
/O lover.
(accompanied by choir singing, “AHHHHHH”)
| 50 |
jaunte Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:22:01am |
Backing out of a blind alley would require some humility.
Not much of that in politics.
| 51 |
simonml Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:22:04am |
re: #42 firebreather
The vaunted racial “healer” in the Oval Office goes characteristically mute when 4 officers of law enforcement (3 white, 1 Asian) are gunned down by an African-American rapist-murderer— who is then widely celebrated in the city of Oakland.
Where is the Teaching Moment from Obama or Holder or the media at large? Cowards & hypocrites, all.
You’re just a coward about race.
/sarc for sure
| 52 |
firebreather Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:22:17am |
re: #35 J.D.
The delicious irony is that untold tens of thousands of sneering liberals who went to college to study journalism and change the world & speak truth to power…will find that there is no work for them in the print media, as the industry is dying.
Good luck to them repaying their student loans or thanking daddy for putting them through the Columbia School of Journalism.
| 53 |
Ward Cleaver Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:22:29am |
re: #38 rumcrook
there are plenty o things the New Boss/president is doing that should scare the crap out of the rational voting john q public, enough so that a dead issue that makes them look like the real nuts when spouted should and could be discarded.
heres what the taliban say about the president.
not that im inclined to agree with taliban but…..
the boss is turning out to be every bit the radical everyone poopooed his being prior to taking office.
How dare they call our messiah a lunatic!
/must i?
| 54 |
VegasRick Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:22:32am |
re: #49 Ward Cleaver
(accompanied by
choirus singing, “AHHHHHH” SHIT!)
| 55 |
Russkilitlover Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:06am |
re: #41 MandyManners
All Tea Party protestors?
As seen so often in ALL liberal protest scenes (including the ones right now in London), the kooks, anti-establishment types, the unemployed, professional protesters, etc. all come out of the woodwork for the leftist protests. Real crazy shit. But the message of the protest stays the same in the media and they are given full blown coverage.
OTOH, some crazies infiltrate any conservative protest and the entire protest is written off, mocked, disgarded, and ignored.
| 56 |
irongrampa Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:09am |
Don’t honestly understand why Obama didn’t simply produce his b/c at the outset and defang the whole thing.
He didn’t need the controversy to show that his opposition was untracked, the race card, imho, was a much better ploy.
| 57 |
Honorary Yooper Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:10am |
re: #22 redc1c4
at least it wasn’t the front u-joint, so you didn’t get the pole vault effect. %-)
Mythbusters did a show on this. IIRC, they did everything they could to hit the pothole just right, and never got much of an effect, much less flipping the car.
| 58 |
Ward Cleaver Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:19am |
re: #52 firebreather
The delicious irony is that untold tens of thousands of sneering liberals who went to college to study journalism and change the world & speak truth to power…will find that there is no work for them in the print media, as the industry is dying.
Good luck to them repaying their student loans or thanking daddy for putting them through the Columbia School of Journalism.
They could go to work at Starbucks, but they’re not hiring, either.
| 59 |
MandyManners Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:32am |
re: #46 MandyManners
Don’t forget the four Tennessee lawmakers Charles posted about a few weeks ago: Casada, Nicely and two others whose names I cannot recall.
[Link: blogs.tennessean.com…]
| 60 |
Kenneth Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:44am |
re: #36 Charles
The inmates have taken over the asylum.
This is a similar thing as happened to the Democrats when the anti-war leftists took over. Sensible people have jobs, while professional activists have too much time on their hands.
| 61 |
albusteve Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:51am |
re: #53 Ward Cleaver
How dare they call our messiah a lunatic!
/must i?
they aren’t the only ones
[Link: www.americanthinker.com…]
| 62 |
alegrias Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:54am |
Nirthers and others wasting time & energy chasing fumes, had a chance to vote against Obama’s candidate yesterday in New York’s house election.
Imagine if the tea party people had pooled energy & resources to get out the vote in upstate New York.
Could’a had a REAL victory that would have made WORLD headlines, instead of sipping chai & spitting tea leaves amongst themselves.
VOTING could have been powerful—yesterday. Squabbling, not so useful.
| 63 |
yma o hyd Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:24:07am |
re: #30 Killgore Trout
Speaking of nuts: Pamela has an thread up today based on a John Bolton article about the impending world government.
While Pam is certainly to be classified as nutz, the article by John Bolton,here … is a review-cum-critique of a report, quoting from the link:
‘One noteworthy offering is a short report with a distinguished provenance entitled A Plan for Action,1 which features a revealingly immodest subtitle: A New Era of International Cooperation for a Changed World: 2009, 2010, and Beyond.’
and:
‘In presentation and tone, A Plan for Action is determinedly uncontroversial; indeed, it looks and reads more like a corporate brochure than a foreign-policy paper. The text is the work of three academics—Bruce Jones of NYU, Carlos Pascual of the Brookings Institution, and Stephen John Stedman of Stanford. Its findings and recommendations, they claim, rose from a series of meetings with foreign-policy eminences here and abroad, including former Secretaries of State of both parties as well as defense officials from the Clinton and first Bush administrations. The participation of these notables is what gives A Plan for Action its bona fides, though one should doubt how much the document actually reflects their ideas. There is no question, however, that the ideas advanced in A Plan for Action have become mainstays in the liberal vision of the future of American foreign policy.’
(My emphasis)
A nut writing and/or quoting a bona fide writer doesn’t make the writer of that review a nut himself.
| 64 |
yesandno Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:24:09am |
| 65 |
Perplexed Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:24:09am |
500 protesters were run out of the Iowa hearing on tax increases. Sounds like a ground swell movement against our out of control government. Funny thing is that when liberals do what those tax protesters did, that nothing happens.
| 66 |
opinionated Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:24:28am |
Never underestimate the lunatic fringe conspiracy types.
If it is proved that he was born in Hawaii, they will begin to argue that Hawaii was never legitimately made a part of the United States.
Still this is a half cocked conspiracy, real solid lunatic conspiracies must somewhere have Jews involved.
| 67 |
opnion Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:24:31am |
Come on, the guy was born in a manger in Bethlehem over 2,000 years ago.
| 68 |
Bubblehead II Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:24:42am |
re: #22 redc1c4
Myth Busters debunked that one. Worst case scenario would have been a trashed differential and or busted axels.
re: #25 Honorary Yooper
Same here, didn’t look too bad, but I didn’t like the idea of laying on the side of the highway inspecting the damage. Will know more when I get it home.
re: #26 Ward Cleaver
That was why I made the sarcastic remark about how I should have seen it coming. I was just hoping that they would hold out until it warmed up and I could change them.
Procrastination will bite you in the ass every chance it gets.
| 69 |
firebreather Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:25:48am |
re: #58 Ward Cleaver
They can still hang out at Starbucks with their copies of The Motocycle Diaries, their little berets, and their copy of the NY Times.
| 70 |
MandyManners Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:26:03am |
re: #55 Russkilitlover
As seen so often in ALL liberal protest scenes (including the ones right now in London), the kooks, anti-establishment types, the unemployed, professional protesters, etc. all come out of the woodwork for the leftist protests. Real crazy shit. But the message of the protest stays the same in the media and they are given full blown coverage.
OTOH, some crazies infiltrate any conservative protest and the entire protest is written off, mocked, disgarded, and ignored.
To me, the double standard is ridiculous. Why must we be held to a higher standard than the Left when it comes to the fact that there are nuts EVERYWHERE? It’s not as if legitimate protesters can kick them off the piece of public land on which the protest takes place.
However, why can’t the normal folks confront them repeatedly, make them feel as welcome as a hooker at a Southern Baptist picnic?
| 71 |
Killgore Trout Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:26:40am |
re: #41 MandyManners
All Tea Party protestors?
I haven’t taken a survey so I don’t know. If someone intends to implicate all of something they usually use the word “all”. To presume “all” when the words isn’t used is a fallacy.
| 72 |
Ward Cleaver Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:26:43am |
re: #57 Honorary Yooper
Mythbusters did a show on this. IIRC, they did everything they could to hit the pothole just right, and never got much of an effect, much less flipping the car.
Several years ago, a lady in a Mercedes-Benz was killed on Loop 820 in Fort Worth, when a driveshaft fell out of a dump truck (u-joint gave up), and went through her windshield.
| 73 |
opnion Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:26:53am |
re: #42 firebreather
The vaunted racial “healer” in the Oval Office goes characteristically mute when 4 officers of law enforcement (3 white, 1 Asian) are gunned down by an African-American rapist-murderer— who is then widely celebrated in the city of Oakland.
Where is the Teaching Moment from Obama or Holder or the media at large? Cowards & hypocrites, all.
I would just write it off to, we elected a racist.
| 74 |
itellu3times Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:00am |
| 75 |
kansas Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:33am |
OT, but are you shitting me?
The White House announced today that GM and Chrysler must cease participation in NASCAR at the end of the 2009 season if they hope to receive any additional financial aid from the government. Companies around the globe—Honda and Audi, to name two—have drawn down racing operations, and NASCAR itself has already felt the pinch in the form of reduced team spending. A complete withdrawal from America’s premier racing series is expected to save more than $250 million between GM and Chrysler, a substantial amount considering the drastic measures being implemented elsewhere.
Tell em fuck themselves and declare bankruptcy, right now!
| 76 |
filetandrelease Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:39am |
The Republican party is Doomed! Doomed I tell you.
With this and other fringe crap nibbling away at the grand ol’ party’s integrity and a platform guaranteed to alienate a rather large percentage of the voting block, I think I will just leave off the sarc tag.
| 77 |
Kenneth Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:52am |
Obama Team Tried to Stop Israel’s Gaza Offensive Before Inauguration
Despite Barack Obama’s persistent pledges as president-elect that he would not meddle in foreign affairs while President Bush was in office, a new report in The New Yorker claims that his transition team worked to persuade Israel to end its offensive in the Gaza Strip before Inauguration Day.The article also quoted a former intelligence official as saying former Vice President Dick Cheney started “getting messages from the Israelis about pressure from Obama” before Jan. 20.
In response, Cheney reportedly portrayed Obama as “pro-Palestinian” in conversations with the Israelis.
Cheney’s then-adviser on national security disputed the story, saying an alleged conversation about the issue between Cheney and national security adviser-to-be Jim Jones “never, ever happened.”
“It is a complete fabrication from beginning to end,” former Cheney adviser John Hannah said in an e-mail to FOXNews.com.
But he did not dispute the specific claim that the Obama transition team was involving itself in Israeli affairs.
In the magazine article, Seymour Hersh reported that Obama’s team worked to persuade Israel to stop bombing Gaza and withdraw its ground troops.
Hersh said Jones talked to Obama about the best way to deal with the Israelis going forward.
Hannah disputed all the claims about Cheney’s involvement.
“The statements that Mr. Hersh claims were made by Vice President Cheney during the Gaza crisis simply never happened. They are outright falsehoods, manufactured out of whole cloth by Mr. Hersh’s anonymous sources,” he said in the e-mail.
| 78 |
Killgore Trout Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:56am |
re: #63 yma o hyd
I saw Bolton of Glenn Beck discussing the same stuff. I think he’s a nut.
| 80 |
kansas Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:28:12am |
re: #70 MandyManners
However, why can’t the normal folks confront them repeatedly, make them feel as welcome as a hooker at a Southern Baptist picnic?
Uh, they have jobs?
| 81 |
lawhawk Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:28:29am |
Charles,
They’ve taken over the asylum on both sides of the aisle. Just as the left constantly claimed Bush was a fascist who was going to throw all those who opposed his policies in prison and was about to engage in the New World Order (or other such blatherings), we’re seeing something similar from the far right.
Of course, that hides the fact that there were serious problems with Bush Administration policy just as surely as there are problems with Obama’s policies.
The noise from these Nirthers and other kooks makes the ability to criticize and prevent Obama from taking policy choices that we oppose all the more difficult. The noise drowns out the good with the bad. And that’s not good for the rest of us.
| 82 |
simonml Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:28:52am |
re: #75 kansas
OT, but are you shitting me?
The White House announced today that GM and Chrysler must cease participation in NASCAR at the end of the 2009 season if they hope to receive any additional financial aid from the government. Companies around the globe—Honda and Audi, to name two—have drawn down racing operations, and NASCAR itself has already felt the pinch in the form of reduced team spending. A complete withdrawal from America’s premier racing series is expected to save more than $250 million between GM and Chrysler, a substantial amount considering the drastic measures being implemented elsewhere.
Tell em fuck themselves and declare bankruptcy, right now!
I think its an April Fool’s joke.
| 83 |
J.D. Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:29:00am |
re: #52 firebreather
I hate that for ‘em.
Check out the banner here.
Oh, and this is good:
…Office workers looked down from upper-storey windows and waved cash at the demonstrators as the protest made its way down Old Broad Street.The gesture was met with jeers and angry shouts from demonstrators. …
| 84 |
Honorary Yooper Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:29:04am |
re: #72 Ward Cleaver
Several years ago, a lady in a Mercedes-Benz was killed on Loop 820 in Fort Worth, when a driveshaft fell out of a dump truck (u-joint gave up), and went through her windshield.
Wow. Different issue altogether though. They did manage to get the driveshaft to go into the trunk of the car.
| 85 |
alegrias Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:29:16am |
BUDGET news—low budget, small government budget that is:
Hottie House Republican from Wisconsin, Paul Ryan, says they are releasing an alternative budget plan today. Maybe with numbers for you number crunchers!
Proposing many reforms to crappy flabby programs. Tackle entitlements.
Go to
housebudgetcommitteerepublicans website he says.
This is not the 19 page document agenda released last week.
| 86 |
Perplexed Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:30:26am |
| 87 |
itellu3times Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:30:46am |
re: #15 Bubblehead II
Well on the way home last night, I lost the rear U-Joint on the drive shaft. Do you have any idea how much vibration a drive shaft makes just before it falls off?
I know what it’s like when the same thing happens to a 1981 Alfa Romeo, but fortunately it stays drivable. I took it to the dealer, he diagnosed it, and then asked, “um, do you want us to fix it?” Sì, per piacere.
| 88 |
albusteve Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:31:01am |
re: #72 Ward Cleaver
Several years ago, a lady in a Mercedes-Benz was killed on Loop 820 in Fort Worth, when a driveshaft fell out of a dump truck (u-joint gave up), and went through her windshield.
that’s never happened to me…but at the drags many years ago I saw Farmer Arnie Beswick pop a front U joint and his whole rear end flew out from under his Tempest….wheels and axle and drive shaft bounced right over the wall and into the crowd with the driveshaft curled around the axel….unreal
| 89 |
Silhouette Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:31:16am |
re: #75 kansas
OT, but are you shitting me?
The White House announced today that GM and Chrysler must cease participation in NASCAR at the end of the 2009 season if they hope to receive any additional financial aid from the government.
So the great non-“wasteful” plan of the government includes elimination of advertising?!
Because nothing is as wasteful and unlikely to stimulate business as advertising, I suppose.
/I’ve been trying to post like a LLL this morning in honor of April 1st, but I had to drop character for this one.
| 90 |
funky chicken Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:31:34am |
re: #15 Bubblehead II
Dang! A Nirther thread and I need to go and get ready to recover my truck from the side of Hwy 93.
Some of you may remember when I signed off yesterday morning I snarked that I was going to jump into my gas guzzling, carbon spewing pickup truck and head to work?
Well on the way home last night, I lost the rear U-Joint on the drive shaft. Do you have any idea how much vibration a drive shaft makes just before it falls off?
Not to mention the noise it makes as it hits the pavement at 70 mph and then slams back up into the bottom of the truck.
/ Should have seen it coming. All the signs were there if I had just paid attention.
No offense AC
L8R
What signs are those, if you don’t mind my asking?
| 91 |
redc1c4 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:31:55am |
re: #57 Honorary Yooper
Mythbusters did a show on this. IIRC, they did everything they could to hit the pothole just right, and never got much of an effect, much less flipping the car.
they’re the media…. you can’t believe them.
/white smoke
| 92 |
redc1c4 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:33:08am |
re: #90 funky chicken
What signs are those, if you don’t mind my asking?
if they aren’t lubed, they will squeak…… and you will usually get a “thunk” when you put the vehicle in gear from the free play in the joint as it gets looser from the wear.
| 93 |
yma o hyd Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:33:23am |
re: #78 Killgore Trout
I saw Bolton of Glenn Beck discussing the same stuff. I think he’s a nut.
I watched that video, which you kindly provided, and while I’ll refrain from saying what I think of Beck, John Bolton did definitely come over as a nut.
Believe you me - I was watching very keenly because of your previous comments and because I am always willing to question my assumptions.
But Bolton is no nut.
Sorry.
| 94 |
Perplexed Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:33:28am |
re: #90 funky chicken
What signs are those, if you don’t mind my asking?
Strange noises coming from under your vehicle. Vibrations when in motion. Loud clunking noises when shifting gears.
| 95 |
simonml Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:33:45am |
re: #86 Perplexed
Sadly, it isn’t a joke.
It says at the top of the article that its a joke.
[Link: www.caranddriver.com…]
| 96 |
kansas Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:33:49am |
| 97 |
Bubblehead II Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:35:23am |
re: #90 funky chicken
Drive shaft going *THUNK* when you put it into gear and increasing vibration as you pick up speed are the two main indications your U-Joints are giving up the ghost.
Like I said, I knew they were going, but just hate working on a vehicle in the cold
| 98 |
yma o hyd Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:36:01am |
re: #93 yma o hyd
I watched that video, which you kindly provided, and while I’ll refrain from saying what I think of Beck, John Bolton did definitely come over as a nut.
Believe you me - I was watching very keenly because of your previous comments and because I am always willing to question my assumptions.
But Bolton is no nut.
Sorry.
PIMF - aarrgghh!
That should have been ‘John Bolton definitely did not come over as a nut.’
Thats what happens when one watches TV at the same time as typing :-(
| 100 |
Perplexed Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:37:15am |
re: #95 simonml
Willing to wait for 48 hrs. Heard about it yesterday and it wasn’t April 1.
| 101 |
Lincolntf Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:37:39am |
re: #96 kansas
It has to be. Doesn’t it?
Hell, if Obama had waited until today for his bizarre power grab at GM, I would have thought that was a gag.
With this Administration, it’s increasingly hard to tell farce from fact.
| 102 |
Opinionated Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:37:45am |
| 103 |
Perplexed Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:17am |
re: #101 Lincolntf
It has to be. Doesn’t it?
Hell, if Obama had waited until today for his bizarre power grab at GM, I would have thought that was a gag.
With this Administration, it’s increasingly hard to tell farce from fact.
They can hide a whole lot of crap under the guise of it being a farce and untrue, especially when the media suck up to him.
| 104 |
kansas Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:29am |
re: #101 Lincolntf
It has to be. Doesn’t it?
Hell, if Obama had waited until today for his bizarre power grab at GM, I would have thought that was a gag.
With this Administration, it’s increasingly hard to tell farce from fact.
Well Asshole’s approval rating is still 60%.
| 105 |
MJ Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:40:16am |
re: #77 Kenneth
Obama Team Tried to Stop Israel’s Gaza Offensive Before Inauguration
Seymour Hersh, as you know, is a conspiracist of the Left.
Every conspiracy this guy invents somehow has Jews in the mix.
| 106 |
jcm Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:41:34am |
Workers arrested in Bellingham work-site raid freed
In an unusual move, a group of illegal immigrants arrested in a work-site raid at a Bellingham engine plant last month have been released from detention, without bond, and given permission to work legally, while a post-raid investigation continues.
| 107 |
Lincolntf Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:41:55am |
re: #104 kansas
I think most people (who don’t live for politics, or even pay attention) would feel foolish judging Obama poorly this early in his Admin. That approval number (whether high or low) doesn’t mean much to me.
| 108 |
MandyManners Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:42:52am |
re: #71 Killgore Trout
I haven’t taken a survey so I don’t know. If someone intends to implicate all of something they usually use the word “all”. To presume “all” when the words isn’t used is a fallacy.
I didn’t presume. I asked.
| 109 |
MandyManners Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:44:25am |
re: #80 kansas
Uh, they have jobs?
I’m not buying that excuse for all protests since some can be held on Saturdays and Sundays.
| 110 |
joker23 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:47:11am |
It is time for folks to stop being played by the Obama campaign
There’s a website that I frequently visit. When it comes to discussing anything not political, it is a wealth of information. When it comes to politics, it’s a complete left wing circle jerk. Say anything that doesn’t tow the party line and risk a ban.
Any time a story comes up about the birth certificate, they all giggle like school girls (apologies to school girls). The common theory over there is basically that Obama will not release his birth certificate specifically to make the conspiracy theorists look bad. They are all in awe if his “coolness” in ignoring the whole thing. While I don’t obsess over it, I still do wonder what the point is in not releasing it. Maybe they are right and he’s doing it to make them all look bad…
| 111 |
medaura18586 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:48:46am |
I applaud the effort, though I’m not entirely sold on the motivation. This post clearly made it to FrontPage because David Horowitz is taking a stand against Obama Derangement Syndrome.
As Charles said, good for David! But please excuse my skepticism as I juxtapose a couple of excerpts, one from the piece linked at above, and the other from a Salon piece by the same Horowitz:
Exhibit # 1:
I have been watching an interesting phenomenon on the Right, which is beginning to cause me concern. I am referring to the over-the-top hysteria in response to the first months in office of our new president, which distinctly reminds me of the “Bush Is Hitler” crowd on the Left.
…
I have recently received commentaries that claim that “Obama’s speeches are unlike any political speech we have heard in American history” and “never has a politician in this land had such a quasi-religious impact on so many people” and “Obama is a narcissist,” which leads the author to then compare Obama to David Koresh, Charles Manson, Stalin and Saddam Hussein. Excuse me while I blow my nose.
The resulting intellectual environment has been described by literary critic Harold Bloom as “Stalinism without Stalin.” (“All of the traits of the Stalinists in the 1930s and 1940s are being repeated in the universities in the 1990s,” Bloom observed.) One faculty advisor to the College Republicans at Cal Poly in San Luis Obispo, Calif., put it another way in a letter to the Wall Street Journal: “Republican faculty members operate on a ‘don’t ask, don’t tell’ basis to the best of our ability. At official faculty meetings, Democratic fund-raising requests, political buttons, bumper stickers and petitions are very publicly circulated, putting non-tenured faculty in a very difficult position.”
…
This situation is now being challenged in a suit brought against the University of California at Berkeley’s Graduate School of Journalism by Michael Savage, a top-rated — and outspokenly conservative — radio talk show host in the Bay Area. Savage also has a Ph.D., two master’s degrees and 18 published works to his credit. Last year, Savage applied for the dean’s job at the journalism school, which was advertised in the New York Times. Despite his qualifications, Savage says he was quickly informed by the chairman of the search committee, sociology professor Troy Duster, that he would not even be interviewed for the job. Duster happens to be an old acquaintance of mine, a Berkeley radical who, clearly, has not had significant second thoughts.The candidate actually selected for the deanship was Orville Schell, another old radical friend.
…
Schell was what I used to call a Gucci Marxist; his chief credential for the Berkeley deanship seems to be that he has similar politics as Duster and the faculty powers who control journalism school appointments. Savage believes that the placement of the advertisement in the New York Times was little more than a sham to cover a decision already made to hire a political comrade for the position.Savage decided to fight. He turned to the Individual Rights Foundation (a public interest law group I created) for help. The legal director of the IRF, Patrick Manshardt, filed suit against the University of California Regents and also against Duster — both as an individual and in his capacity as chairman of the journalism school’s search committee.
| 112 |
medaura18586 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:54:25am |
re: #111 medaura18586
Horowitz is himself guilty of promoting the hysterical coloratura of right-wing rhetoric: e.g., Stalinism without Stalin, “don’t ask don’t tell” referring to Republicans in academia, Gucci Marxist, etc. He also openly associates himself with Pamela Geller, a central node of the Obama-craziness network. Geller introduced Horowitz at his event in the CPAC recently, and the two of them along with Robert Spencer were the only people involved in an event featuring Geert Wilders.
It’s easy to talk the talk without naming names, but for Horowitz to take such a stance without openly repudiating Geller, who originated the term “nirther” in the first place, is just rich.
| 113 |
alexknyc Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:55:29am |
| 114 |
phoenixgirl Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:56:28am |
re: #98 yma o hyd
PIMF - aarrgghh!
That should have been ‘John Bolton definitely did not come over as a nut.’Thats what happens when one watches TV at the same time as typing :-(
i listened to it, bolton is no nut.
| 116 |
THX-42 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:02:39am |
One doesn’t have to be a “nirther” to ask why it’s unreasonable to expect to see relevant documentation on the applicants for the most important job in this country. Before I hire even the lowliest stock clerk, I expect to see a complete and accurate resume, and particularly on those items that pertain to the specific requirements for the position. And furthermore, if that applicant is later found to have misrepresented any of that information, that is grounds for immediate dismissal. Why the sqeamishness in enforcing similar standards for the highest office in the land?
Furthermore, the pejorative term “nirther” is obviously intended to ridicule anyone who continues to request to see previously unprovided documentation by Obama. I’m not in the least intimidated by the intended peer pressure. The request is reasonable. The resolution is quite simple.
| 118 |
medaura18586 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:06:32am |
re: #111 medaura18586
Oh, and Horowitz endorsed, and helped fund and manage raving lunatic Michael Savage’s “anti-discrimination” lawsuit against a university that rightfully had no interest in hiring him as head of their journalism department.
| 119 |
Charles Johnson Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:09:27am |
re: #116 THX-42
Furthermore, the pejorative term “nirther” is obviously intended to ridicule anyone who continues to request to see previously unprovided documentation by Obama.
True dat.
| 120 |
Charles Johnson Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:12:11am |
re: #116 THX-42
I’m not in the least intimidated by the intended peer pressure. The request is reasonable. The resolution is quite simple.
Well, don’t let me stop you from continuing to waste your time with a loony conspiracy theory.
| 121 |
Achilles Tang Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:18:57am |
re: #116 THX-42
Furthermore, the pejorative term “nirther” is obviously intended to ridicule anyone who continues to request to see previously unprovided documentation by Obama. I’m not in the least intimidated by the intended peer pressure. The request is reasonable. The resolution is quite simple.
The resolution is simple, true; but the problem you have is that you are incapable of understanding it.
| 122 |
Achilles Tang Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:23:17am |
re: #115 Iron Fist
There is a lot of money backing the ANSWER/Peace hippy movement. I’d like to find out who it is. I don’t think that they have the best interests of the United States in mind.
No doubt there is money, but different causes have different types of people. Obviously that is true, but what I mean is that some causes require genuine sacrifice, some are just for fun by people who have nothing better to do.
| 123 |
THX-42 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:25:03am |
re: #120 Charles
Well, don’t let me stop you from continuing to waste your time with a loony conspiracy theory.
Charles, the issue for me isn’t any conspiracy theory, it’s whether we as citizens have a right to expect that basic documentation about a candidate for President of the United States will be provided. In this case, whether it’s his birth certificate, his school grades, his writings, or anything else of significance, they haven’t been.
You apparently aren’t bothered by that. Some of us are. I’m curious as to why you feel it’s necessary to try to belittle those of us who disagree.
| 124 |
Charles Johnson Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:30:04am |
re: #123 THX-42
I’m curious as to why you feel it’s necessary to try to belittle those of us who disagree.
Because this is crazy. The issue has been completely settled, over and over. My patience with this right-wing version of Trooferism is utterly exhausted.
| 125 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:34:00am |
| 126 |
quickjustice Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:35:02am |
Apart from the utter lack of any credible evidence to support this wacky conspiracy theory, it has absolutely no political traction at all. None. And with the economy in shambles, no sensible person who opposes Obama’s leftist policies will waste one second on this crap.
| 127 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:37:55am |
re: #116 THX-42
The documentation HAS been released, by the State of Hawaii. But why let facts get in the way of your counter-productive conspiracy theory. I am sure if you dig deep enough it will finally be revealed that O was involved in the JFK/RFK/Lincoln/MLK assassinations as well as being an 8th dimension alien infiltrator.
| 128 |
nonic Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:42:49am |
re: #123 THX-42
whether we as citizens have a right to expect that basic documentation about a candidate for President of the United States will be provided
Apparently (sorry, no links right here, right now) a fair number of states are legislating that candidates must provide all documentation to be eligible for the ballot — IN THE FUTURE. Obama is the first and will be the last to get away with his utterly arrogant dismissiveness of the voters’ simple, legitimate request.
| 129 |
THX-42 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:43:58am |
re: #124 Charles
Because this is crazy. The issue has been completely settled, over and over. My patience with this right-wing version of Trooferism is utterly exhausted.
Charles, I regret that you’re jumping to the conclusion that anyone who questions the lack of provided documentation is automatically a right-winger or Troofer or conspiracy theorist. I happen to be an immigrant from a country that was taken over by communists. I am now a proud US citizen. The issue of confirmation that the leaders we select are who they say they are is not just a minor nicety to me and others like me. I believe that it is imperative that the protections defined by the founders of this country be followed if we are to remain free.
| 130 |
medaura18586 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:47:36am |
re: #129 THX-42
Please just let it go! Don’t you have any more important points of contention regarding Obama’s presidency?
Enough is enough!
| 131 |
Achilles Tang Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:48:12am |
re: #128 nonic
Apparently (sorry, no links right here, right now) a fair number of states are legislating that candidates must provide all documentation to be eligible for the ballot — IN THE FUTURE. Obama is the first and will be the last to get away with his utterly arrogant dismissiveness of the voters’ simple, legitimate request.
Instead of sounding like a total ass, why don’t you present your forensic evidence regarding why the evidence accepted by everyone but your kind is flawed?
If you can’t; go away.
| 132 |
nonic Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:54:45am |
re: #131 Naso Tang
Instead of sounding like a total ass, why don’t you present your forensic evidence regarding why the evidence accepted by everyone but your kind is flawed?
If you can’t; go away.
Find where I said I don’t accept Obama’s qualification to be president. Not in what you quote and not anywhere else.
I said states are legislating to prevent this type of controversy in the future.
A fool calling me an “ass” is no insult. Except to himself.
| 133 |
Kenneth Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:55:49am |
re: #116 THX-42
The resolution is quite simple.
On a similar note, the resolution to the “honest questions” posed by the 9-11 troofers is quite simple too. All we have to do is build two exact replicas of the Twin Towers and then video tape it while we crash planes into one pair of towers, while demolition the other pair of towers with a controlled demolition of pre-placed pyrotechnic explosives. Then compare the video tapes to the original 9-11 attacks. That should settle all doubts, right?
| 134 |
Charles Johnson Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:57:57am |
re: #129 THX-42
Charles, I regret that you’re jumping to the conclusion that anyone who questions the lack of provided documentation is automatically a right-winger or Troofer or conspiracy theorist.
“Jumping to the conclusion.”
I love it.
Thousands and thousands of comments, dozens of posts, every single aspect argued over and over. The State of Hawaii certifies that they have the real thing in the file.
And you wonder why I compare it to Trutherism.
| 135 |
Bloodnok Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:01:03am |
re: #129 THX-42
Charles, I regret that you’re jumping to the conclusion that anyone who questions the lack of provided documentation is automatically a right-winger or Troofer or conspiracy theorist. I happen to be an immigrant from a country that was taken over by communists. I am now a proud US citizen. The issue of confirmation that the leaders we select are who they say they are is not just a minor nicety to me and others like me. I believe that it is imperative that the protections defined by the founders of this country be followed if we are to remain free.
They have been followed, unless you think the elected government of Hawaii is lying.
| 136 |
quickjustice Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:05:37am |
re: #133 Kenneth
Great idea, provided you agree to front the $12 billion or so it would cost for your little “experiment”! ;-)
| 137 |
Kenneth Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:11:21am |
re: #136 quickjustice
No problem, what’s $12 billion these days?
But do you know what? It still would not convince the 9-11 Troofers. They would start up a “Recreation of the 9-11 Attacks” troofer movement. Paranoia is about paranoia.
| 138 |
Land Shark Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:13:20am |
I’m one person who doesn’t believe there is anything to this birth certificate nonsense. I believe he was born in Hawaii. But as long as Obama refuses to release the original information like every other Presidential candidate has, it will continue to feed people looking desperately for a reason to get rid of him. I don’t know what reason he may have for not releasing this information because I can’t think of one (other than the obvious one put forth by the Nirthers which I don’t buy) , but as long as he doesn’t, this will not go away.
| 140 |
Charles Johnson Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:18:13am |
People who never comment, but feel free to come into LGF and issue ratings supporting Nirther crap, are now being blocked.
| 141 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:21:42am |
re: #129 THX-42
So are you seriously stating that the State of Hawaii is actively participating in a conspiracy against the citizens and government of the United States? Hawaii has already certified what they released is what is in the state archives, and are one of the only two entities that are legally authorized to release the document in question.
But why do I bother trying to explain something to you since you won’t believe ANY evidence that is even tangentially contradictory to your belief system.
| 142 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:22:04am |
re: #140 Charles
People who never comment, but feel free to come into LGF and issue ratings supporting Nirther crap, are now being blocked.
THANK YOU! :)
| 143 |
Land Shark Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:22:49am |
re: #139 buzzsawmonkey
You make a good point, and that’s a possible reason he doesn’t release it. But most conservatives don’t seem to be Nirthers. I don’t think you’re gonna see a rising tide of conservatives buying into the birth certificate thing though, it always seems to be same little group of people. If anything, I’m seeing fewer conservatives buying into it, if what I see in the conservative media is any indication. The conservative criticism of Obama is focused for the most part on his policies and spending, not the birth certificate thing.
| 144 |
Kenneth Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:23:19am |
re: #140 Charles
People who never comment, but feel free to come into LGF and issue ratings supporting Nirther crap, are now being blocked.
I guess that means you “Kroshka”.
| 145 |
nonic Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:24:54am |
re: #139 buzzsawmonkey
Which is precisely why he isn’t doing it; his opposition looks increasingly unhinged without his having to lift a finger. Why fight your enemies when they are defeating themselves?
I agree. It’s the old divide-and-conquer ploy, and I’ll bet it comes from Rahm Emannuel.
This whole controversy seems to have lost its connection to the basic issue. One side argues that Obama should be forthcoming with his documentation – just as any jobseeker or license applicant would be required to be. Just as future candidates will be required to be. The other side argues that to want to see basic qualifying documents makes the requester a “conspiracist” and a “nut case.” How do you bridge that kind of disconnect? Both sides play into the hands of the Dems.
It reminds me of the Clinton-Lewinsky flap. One side was saying that the man sworn to uphold the Constitution LIED UNDER OATH, and on a topic so piddling that it made one wonder (worry) what he would do if pressed about some really important issue. The other side was saying, oh, it’s only sex, it doesn’t count. But it was never about the sex – it was about the PERJURY and the concept of no man above the law. And you still can’t get people to understand that distinction.
| 146 |
Bloodnok Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:25:02am |
Frankly I have a hard time believing that (and I’m sorry for even indulging this thought) if the official Certificate was made available for public viewing that Nirthers would scan it, study it, and then conclude: “Well, it seems everything is in order here. Carry on, Obama”.
There is no action that will satisfy these kooks because there is no answer they want other than his removal from office. They may say it is to preserve liberty or somesuch, but they are only looking for a golden ticket (Obama’s removal from office) in a closed candy store.
| 147 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:25:13am |
| 148 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:27:56am |
re: #147 FurryOldGuyJeans
re: #139 buzzsawmonkey
Not releasing the document is one of the most brilliant dirty politics tricks of all time.
*PIMF* Obama not releasing the document….the sovereign State of Hawaii has already done so.
I hate it when I get distracted and don’t finish what I had intended in typing. :%P%
| 149 |
nonic Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:33:00am |
re: #143 Land Shark
If anything, I’m seeing fewer conservatives buying into it, if what I see in the conservative media is any indication. The conservative criticism of Obama is focused for the most part on his policies and spending, not the birth certificate thing.
I think that’s because it’s a dead issue. Whatever the facts, it happened. It’s done. The loophole is being closed for future candidates.
At this point, it doesn’t matter if he was born on Mars. And in reality it didn’t matter before the election either, because then the only thing that was important then was electing the “first African American president.” Policies, character, experience, qualifications — all meant nothing in an election about color and charisma.
| 151 |
Charles Johnson Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:33:10am |
re: #145 nonic
The other side argues that to want to see basic qualifying documents makes the requester a “conspiracist” and a “nut case.”
Nonsense. “Wanting to see basic qualifying documents” does not make people nut cases — refusing to accept that the documents have been verified by multiple sources DOES.
| 152 |
Lee Coller Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:36:51am |
re: #123 THX-42
Charles, the issue for me isn’t any conspiracy theory, it’s whether we as citizens have a right to expect that basic documentation about a candidate for President of the United States will be provided. In this case, whether it’s his birth certificate, his school grades, his writings, or anything else of significance, they haven’t been.
You apparently aren’t bothered by that. Some of us are. I’m curious as to why you feel it’s necessary to try to belittle those of us who disagree.
Have you ever demanded such documentation for any other candidate for President?
Didn’t think so.
| 153 |
FurryOldGuyJeans Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:40:12am |
re: #152 Lee Coller
Have you ever demanded such documentation for any other candidate for President?
Didn’t think so.
But all the other candidates were so obviously citizens, so no need to ask.
/ nirther statement
| 154 |
Bubbaman Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:42:25am |
Oy, why do we pay so much attention to the Troofers, Nirthers, and other conspiracists? Enough already. Our country is being dissembled by a runaway locomotive filled with incompetent Socialists, and we’re focusing on a bunch of knuckleheads? We need to pass out some Prozac to these folks and rally the troops against the real threat; Pelosi and Obama.
| 155 |
nonic Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:43:56am |
Another one of these phony controversies that drives me nuts personally is the claim now (I saw it again just today) that the Pope said “condoms cause AIDS.”
Good grief. No, he didn’t. He said, in effect, condoms alone will not solve the problem in any culture where people do not respect sex, their partners, or even their own bodies.
[Link: www.catholicnewsagency.com…]
“I would say that this problem of AIDS cannot be overcome with advertising slogans. If the soul is lacking, if Africans do not help one another, the scourge cannot be resolved by distributing condoms; quite the contrary, we risk worsening the problem. The solution can only come through a twofold commitment: firstly, the humanization of sexuality, in other words a spiritual and human renewal bringing a new way of behaving towards one another; and secondly, true friendship, above all with those who are suffering, a readiness - even through personal sacrifice - to be present with those who suffer. And these are the factors that help and bring visible progress.
“Therefore, I would say that our double effort is to renew the human person internally, to give spiritual and human strength to a way of behaving that is just towards our own body and the other person’s body; and this capacity of suffering with those who suffer, to remain present in trying situations.
| 156 |
paint-right Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:45:24am |
re: #145 nonic
Maybe this is a good time too comment re this issue and the conservatives who make fools of themselves going after non starter issues like the niirth certificate and all the demonizing of Obama.
BAck in the Clinton days, I remember being apalled at the accusations against a sitting president - the Paula Jones lawsuit etc - that I felt were destructive of the dignity of the office, which I think usually supercedes the man holding the office. Because of the Jones accusations, the Lewinsky scandal was revealed but might never have been. What ultimately was the result of all that except for a huge embarassment to the nation… just wink wink, nudge nudge all around the world and having to explain to your sixth graders what the president did … he held on to the office and actually landed on his feet. And we may yet have the missus in the White House.
Same with the present “the sky is falling” hysteria about Obama. His policies and behavior are always subject to scrutiny and comment and criticism, but to demonize him as the antichrist is to invite only ridicule.
| 157 |
NY Nana Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:46:07am |
I have to admit that I held onto the dream that The One would prove to not be a US citizen, so that he could not run. It took me awhile, but I now know that alas, he was born in Hawaii. I do not doubt that anymore.
But as The Leader of our country? He seems to have been brainwashed back in the USSR, and is proving to be even worse and more dangerous than I ever anticipated.
| 158 |
NY Nana Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:48:49am |
re: #152 Lee Coller
A lot of people were trying to ‘prove’ that Sen. McCain was not a US citizen, as he was born in the Panama Canal Zone….to a Dad who was in the US Navy, and stationed there. Both McCain’s parents were US born, as was he.
| 159 |
axegrinder Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:55:50am |
re: #152 Lee Coller
Have you ever demanded such documentation for any other candidate for President?
Didn’t think so.
I vaguely remember some kerfuffle over Hillary’s collage thesis. Something about it supporting communism or something similar(like this would be surprising). There was a minor brouhaha to have the school release it(apparently it’s on file somewhere) but it quickly went away. This birth certificate thing just keeps hanging on. Good fodder for the talk shows I guess.
| 160 |
nonic Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:01:02am |
re: #156 paint-right
I agree with you. The problem is twofold, as I see it. First we have all this information at our fingertips. So many sources, so many speakers. So people find out things, even if sometimes they are misguided or even untrue. And then we have that bunch of whores in Washington (the Congress) who will exploit anything and anyone for another minute in front of the cameras and microphones, let alone a few votes. The AIG bonus hysteria and the 90% punitive taxation is an example.
Not to mention the media personalities who get rich off feeding the beast.
| 161 |
nonic Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:04:43am |
re: #157 NY Nana
I have a dream, too, Nana.
No, I shouldn’t say it that way, because that may invite some federal thug to knock on my door.
I have this….. thought, occasionally. That maybe Obama will indeed make history by being the first president to be impeached for treason.
And, hey, who knows? It could happen.
| 162 |
NY Nana Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:07:41am |
| 163 |
NY Nana Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:11:15am |
re: #161 nonic
We have the very same dream, and yes, at the rate The One is going? It may very well happen, but we must expand our dream: ‘Plugs’ Biden, Nancy Pelousy™ and Harry Reid must also be caught in something that would cause their asses to be kicked out at the same time as The One.
I have not yet given up my dream at the rate they are going.
| 164 |
Lee Coller Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:19:37am |
re: #163 NY Nana
We have the very same dream, and yes, at the rate The One is going? It may very well happen, but we must expand our dream: ‘Plugs’ Biden, Nancy Pelousy™ and Harry Reid must also be caught in something that would cause their asses to be kicked out at the same time as The One.
I have not yet given up my dream at the rate they are going.
I think you mean Robert Byrd (senator pro-tem). Harry Reid is not in the line of succession.
| 166 |
Simply Me Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:23:30am |
Hi Charles,
While I accept that our President was born in Hawaii, I do wonder what citizenship he claimed when he applied to Occidental and when he transferred to Columbia. It does seem possible to me that he listed himself as Kenyan or Indonesian. Do you also classify people who wonder about that as Nirthers?
| 167 |
nonic Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:25:34am |
re: #163 NY Nana
You know I’m still using your kugel recipe! :-)
Probably our paths won’t cross again soon, so I’ll say now, I wish a most peaceful and blessed Passover to you and yours.
| 168 |
Lee Coller Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:25:40am |
re: #166 Simply Me
Hi Charles,
While I accept that our President was born in Hawaii, I do wonder what citizenship he claimed when he applied to Occidental and when he transferred to Columbia. It does seem possible to me that he listed himself as Kenyan or Indonesian. Do you also classify people who wonder about that as Nirthers?
There is absolutely no evidence of this. This is typical conspiracy stuff, make up something out of the blue, than ask people to prove it is false.
| 171 |
Emerald Wed, Apr 1, 2009 12:15:15pm |
re: #166 Simply Me
Hi Charles,
While I accept that our President was born in Hawaii, I do wonder what citizenship he claimed when he applied to Occidental and when he transferred to Columbia. It does seem possible to me that he listed himself as Kenyan or Indonesian. Do you also classify people who wonder about that as Nirthers?
Well, first off, if you agree he was born in Hawaii, the rest of your statement is meaningless. He could have claimed he descended from Heaven, was a high priestess from the ancient city of Mu or a purple alien from Mars. What he claims doesn’t change the fact he was born in Hawaii and is a natural citizen of the US. End of story.
Secondly, how do you propose to prove or disprove your allegations? You’re the one making the claims; you have to provide the proof. It’s not the job of others to provide you evidence that counters something you’re claiming as a possibility.
| 172 |
Simply Me Wed, Apr 1, 2009 12:31:25pm |
Of course, if his college records were to be released, they might include his SAT scores. Maybe my interest in this nationality issue is just a ruse for getting the SAT scores, since we have no legitimate right to see the SAT scores.
| 173 |
hazzyday Wed, Apr 1, 2009 12:32:06pm |
Rogering a thread could just as easily be nirthering a thread. LGF threads are mainly for reasonable people. Nirthism as it exists is for unreasonable people.
I agree that Obama is not transparent like a normal person and probably has an unreasonable past. Someone just has to do a clear records gap analysis on him and compare it to other politicians. no time here. I’m waiting for disgruntled Obama minions to start to put leaks into the ship.
It seems like focusing on an accurate media would be more effective then nirthing around. As long as you don’t get nifonged.
| 174 |
Hawaii69 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 12:35:04pm |
re: #166 Simply Me
Even if both Kenya and Indonesia viewed Obama
as their own citizens, it would have no
effect on his U.S. citizenship.
Much has been made of the claim that Indonesia “did not
allow duel citizenship”. Again, the U.S. government does not care what Indonesia allows. In its eyes, a person born in the U.S. is a citizen. This is the case even if he held a passport from Indonesia.
The only way to give up U.S. citizenship is to renounce
it. A 10 year old boy does not have the legal authority to renounce anything.
| 175 |
Hawaii69 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 12:40:30pm |
re: #52 firebreather
Yeah, that’s really delicious.
What this country needs is lots and lots
of people who are out of work.
…oh…and petty people who generalize
and take pleasure in it.
| 176 |
Simply Me Wed, Apr 1, 2009 12:41:08pm |
re: #174 Hawaii69
See my #172. I’m not a Nirther, just a “Nosy Parker”
| 177 |
Simply Me Wed, Apr 1, 2009 12:43:48pm |
re: #174 Hawaii69
P.S. While it might not affect his citizenship, it would have an impact on people’s understanding of his loyalty to the country.
| 178 |
cowbellallen Wed, Apr 1, 2009 12:53:18pm |
I’m definitely not a nirther, but I don’t get how a birth announcement in a newspaper is proof. I just visited the Dallas Morning News and you can place an announcement in there for a fee.
Buy an announcement
Also, I laughed at ‘Mr. and Mrs. Barack H. Obama’…. amusing.
| 179 |
Charles Johnson Wed, Apr 1, 2009 1:01:43pm |
re: #178 cowbellallen
I’m definitely not a nirther, but I don’t get how a birth announcement in a newspaper is proof. I just visited the Dallas Morning News and you can place an announcement in there for a fee.
Buy an announcementAlso, I laughed at ‘Mr. and Mrs. Barack H. Obama’…. amusing.
So you think the birth announcements were planted in both major Hawaii papers in 1961, as part of a plot that would only come to fruition 47 years later?
Or maybe there’s time travel involved? Come to think of it, that WOULD explain a lot …
| 181 |
Simply Me Wed, Apr 1, 2009 1:17:35pm |
re: #178 cowbellallen
The article in Front Page linked to in this post includes this:
In addition to the birth certificate, the August 13, 1961 Honolulu Advertiser also carries an announcement of Obama’s birth. The Honolulu Star-Bulletin also carries the same announcement. Both papers printed an identical list of birth announcements supplied to them by the Hawaii State Department of Health.
So because the the birth announcements in the Hawaii newspapers were supplied by the Hawaii State Department of Health rather than paid announcements that you cite, they are a form of proof in this case.
| 182 |
Simply Me Wed, Apr 1, 2009 1:19:31pm |
Charles,
Am I correct in surmising that you have never had children?
| 183 |
Zimriel Wed, Apr 1, 2009 1:21:23pm |
Hooray for FrontPage! I was worried about them; they were linking to nirthers earlier this year.
Now if they could just quit plugging Spencer and other fascist apologists, they’ll be back where they were…
| 184 |
Zimriel Wed, Apr 1, 2009 1:24:48pm |
re: #154 Bubbaman
Oy, why do we pay so much attention to the Troofers, Nirthers, and other conspiracists? Enough already. Our country is being dissembled by a runaway locomotive filled with incompetent Socialists, and we’re focusing on a bunch of knuckleheads? We need to pass out some Prozac to these folks and rally the troops against the real threat; Pelosi and Obama.
We pay so much attention because various blogs, opinionators, and newspapers “on our side” are spreading this crap; and making us look like psychotics.
| 185 |
cowbellallen Wed, Apr 1, 2009 1:55:17pm |
re: #179 Charles
So you think the birth announcements were planted in both major Hawaii papers in 1961, as part of a plot that would only come to fruition 47 years later?
Or maybe there’s time travel involved? Come to think of it, that WOULD explain a lot …
Haha, no. I don’t think there is any reason to doubt that he was born in Hawaii, I’m only pointing out that a birth announcement isn’t legitimate proof.
The only thing I’m concerned about is that there is nobody enforcing the Constitutional requirement that someone be a natural born citizen. There’s nobody stopping Arnold Schwarzenegger from running for POTUS.
| 186 |
medaura18586 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 2:00:53pm |
re: #183 Zimriel
Hooray for FrontPage! I was worried about them; they were linking to nirthers earlier this year.
Now if they could just quit plugging Spencer and other fascist apologists, they’ll be back where they were…
I think they’re merely playing both sides, like Spencer tried to do until the unsustainable middle ground crumbled under his feet. But until they jump the shark entirely, if they do, that is, I’ll applaud them where it matters.
| 187 |
Daisy22 Wed, Apr 1, 2009 3:42:38pm |
re: #8 Ward Cleaver
Tea party kooks ? What in the world….
What are YOU doing to stop this O train ?
How very clever of you to mock people who feel powerless to what has occured in ONLY 70 days…
You are just so very cool…
| 188 |
freedombilly Wed, Apr 1, 2009 6:36:11pm |
Imagine if all the Nirthers put their energies into something productive, both politically and otherwise.
The world would be a better place.
| 189 |
BethesdaDog Thu, Apr 2, 2009 1:13:41am |
Damn…the whole time I thought Sun Yat Sen was really born in Hawaii. Don’t that beat all!
It still didn’t say where he was really born.
| 190 |
Wrycoder Fri, Apr 3, 2009 11:23:15am |
The doc that Hawaii released isn’t a birth certificate. It only certifies that they have one on file. If you’ve viewed it, you’ll know that it doesn’t state place of birth. If you’ve viewed an actual birth certificate from the ’60s, you’ll realize they are entirely different from the doc posted by Hawaii.
The actual certificate on file will certify hospital and doctor, if the infant is born in Hawaii. It is not necessary to have been born in Hawaii to have a birth certificate on file there. Your Hawaiian parent may have been travelling.
The state officials have never confirmed that he was born in Hawaii, only that they have verified that there is a birth certificate on file.
The announcement in the newspaper is just that - if you’ve read it, you will know it doesn’t say anything about place of birth. It would be perfectly reasonable for Ms. Obama to place such an announcement no matter where the child was born. Doing so is common.
Everyone here seems to think this is a fully proven and settled issue. I can’t understand why they believe that, given the known facts.
I don’t subscribe to the notion that concealing the birth certificate is a clever diversionary ruse. There is another reason for expending the effort and cost, IMHO.
But the issue is probably moot, since the courts don’t want to touch it.
| 191 |
dave aaa Fri, Apr 3, 2009 7:00:42pm |
The doc that Hawaii released isn’t a birth certificate.
Technically, that may be correct, but then no one has their actual birth certificate. All anyone ever gets is a certified copy or abstract of the vault copy certificate that the state keeps on permanent file. The document Obama has shown is the document the State of Hawaii currently issues when one requests a copy of one’s birth certificate. It meets all the requirements for a valid birth certificate and is acceptable proof of place and dae of birth for neary all US government purposes, including getting as US passport.
It is not necessary to have been born in Hawaii to have a birth certificate on file there.
The vault copy birth certificate will list place of birth as being the actual place of birth. If a person was born in Mombasa, Kenya, it will say that, not Honolulu, Hawaii.
| 192 |
Dave AAA Fri, Apr 3, 2009 7:09:01pm |
re: #179 Charles
So you think the birth announcements were planted in both major Hawaii papers in 1961, as part of a plot that would only come to fruition 47 years later?
To be fair, the announcements do not say he was born in Hawaii. If he were born overseas, his mother’s parents might well have paid to have it announced in her local paper.
That no one has proof to the contrary and that Obama has shown a birth certificate that shows he was born in Hawaii is far better proof that he is a Natural Born Citizen.
| 193 |
Wrycoder Sat, Apr 4, 2009 12:20:46am |
I don’t want to descend to arguing. However:
I was with you up to your last sentence: the cert that has been displayed doesn’t show birth location. Because of a technicality, Ms. Obama had to be on US soil during birth for Mr. Obama to be a natural born citizen. There is no question that he is a citizen. The question is whether he is ‘natural born’ under the law at that time, as required by the Constitution.
| 194 |
Wrycoder Sat, Apr 4, 2009 12:26:35am |
FWIW, a Hawaiian birth certificate looks something like this:
| 195 |
Dave AAA Sat, Apr 4, 2009 11:30:13am |
That’s what the long form Hawaii birth certificate looks like. They don’t seem to give those out any more. The short form is the one normally issued now and it is a valid, US State Department approved, birth certificate that does show place and date of birth.
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