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Tonight’s angry, belligerent email is regarding our recent posts about the anti-vaccination insanity being promoted by the likes of Jenny McCarthy, from a reader in New York, titled “a love note of sorts.”

But there’s really not much love in this one.

Before you crap on people for being suspicious of vaccines, particularly the parents of autistic children, try walking a mile in their shoes, OK?

You may think they’re stupid, but frankly I wouldn’t wish autism on my worst enemy and don’t blame their suspicion— an explanation is all we really want.

I should know. All three of my kids are autistic.

You’ve turned into such a self important pusbag. Deal with your hostility or most of your audience will write you off as an asshole crank, if they haven’t already.

Autism is a horrible, debilitating condition that wreaks havoc on families, and something that no decent human being would want anyone to have to undergo.

I’m going to repeat a comment I posted earlier, to explain why there are several articles on this subject at LGF:

The reason kooks and hucksters gravitate toward this subject is because they’re vampires, feeding on the pain of parents with autistic children. They know that these parents are vulnerable, and looking desperately for answers, and they tap on the bedroom window and give them easy answers and people to blame. And far too many parents invite them in.

Am I “gleeful” about this? Am I “crapping” on families with autistic children?

No. I’m nauseated. This is one of the worst things human beings are capable of — exploiting the pain of vulnerable people for profit.

The anti-vaccinationists are promoting a hoax that has the potential to do enormous harm, both to our society and to the world in general, and they’re doing it despite the fact that study after study has shown absolutely no connection between vaccines and autism. Don’t let them take advantage of you. Use the most wonderful gift you have — your brain — to find out the facts and learn the truth. It just might set you free.

UPDATE at 4/1/09 8:11:49 pm:

On a related subject: State issues measles alert after suspected cases at Children’s Hospital.

State health officials are warning people whose children visited public areas of Children’s Hospital on March 10 and 11 that three people might have contracted measles there.

A Westmoreland County man, 33, and his two children, both under 5, were diagnosed Tuesday with having the respiratory infection, according to the state Department of Health.

Dr. Marian Michaels, a pediatric professor at Children’s, said the father and his children visited several health facilities during the period when they contracted the virus. The Oakland hospital is one possible source, Michaels said. “I don’t know why the state decided to say that, when I feel that we should only deal with what we know to be a fact,” she said.

Health Department spokeswoman Stacy Kriedeman acknowledged the investigation hasn’t pinpointed where the man and his children contracted the virus, and they did visit several health facilities during the likely incubation period. She would not say where, nor why, the state singled out Children’s as a likely source.

“We believe that it may be a probable source,” she said, but added, “I’m not going to detail the investigation for you.” …

Health officials hope the cases will persuade more parents to have children vaccinated.

“This is a totally preventable disease with vaccination,” said Jim Lando, a spokesman for the state Health Department.

Dr. Bruce W. Dixon, director of the Allegheny County Health Department, said neither child was vaccinated.

(Hat tip: Shiplord Kirel.)

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715 comments

1 Attaboid  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 7:56:43pm

So sad.

2 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 7:56:56pm
Before you crap on people for being suspicious of vaccines, particularly the parents of autistic children, try walking a mile in their shoes, OK?

What about the shoes of people who have had to live with the diseases these vaccinations prevent?

3 AmeriDan  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 7:57:20pm
You’ve turned into such a self important pusbag

Them's fightin words!

4 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 7:57:45pm

No lady, we are not completely heartless here at LGF. The guys that say that vaccines help cause it probably are though. Damn attention whores.

5 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 7:57:49pm
Use the most wonderful gift you have — your brain — to find out the facts and learn the truth. It just might set you free.


That applies to just about all topics on this site.
Unfortunately, most people (at least 51% of the US), seem to get less use out of their brain than their appendix.

6 HelloDare  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 7:58:56pm

Asshole crank?

I believe Zombie has pictures of such a device at the Folsom Street Fair.

7 freedombilly  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 7:59:27pm

I just love how trying to shed the light of science on a subject is considered by some to be "taking a crap" on others.

8 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 7:59:40pm

"Self important pusbag" Not nice, not nice at all.

9 MandyManners  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 7:59:56pm

Use the most wonderful gift you have — your brain — to find out the facts and learn the truth. It just might set you free.

Use the most wonderful gift you have — your brain — to find out the facts and learn the truth. It just might set you free.

Use the most wonderful gift you have — your brain — to find out the facts and learn the truth. It just might set you free.

Use the most wonderful gift you have — your brain — to find out the facts and learn the truth. It just might set you free.

Use the most wonderful gift you have — your brain — to find out the facts and learn the truth. It just might set you free.

10 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:00:10pm

re: #6 HelloDare

Asshole crank?

I believe Zombie has pictures of such a device at the Folsom Street Fair.

Hahahahahaha....

11 AmeriDan  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:00:45pm

re: #9 MandyManners

And your point is?

/

12 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:01:10pm

I wish you'd prefaced "vampires" with the adjective "emotional", but aside from that, yes, I agree.

Charles, you don't have to defend yourself; you're doing your best to promote a reasoned approach. I hate watching you taking all this abuse.

13 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:02:36pm
I should know. All three of my kids are autistic.

3 of 3? Is this common?

14 MandyManners  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:02:45pm

Now, let's go back a bit to what that ignorant asshole said about the need for kids to die from diseases for which there are immunizations.

Then again, no, I won't go there.

15 ArmyWife  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:03:06pm

On the upside, the words are spelled correctly. Assuming "pusbag" is a word and that is how it's spelled, of course.

16 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:03:15pm

re: #12 Dianna

I wish you'd prefaced "vampires" with the adjective "emotional", but aside from that, yes, I agree.

Charles, you don't have to defend yourself; you're doing your best to promote a reasoned approach. I hate watching you taking all this abuse.

The more flack he's getting from people who believe this garbage, the better, I say. It means he's got influence; he's got a hand in the modern media. I'm sorry that all three of this lady's children were born autistic, but that's not much of an excuse to buy the vaccination-causes-autism quackery or lash out at Mr. Johnson.

17 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:03:43pm

I think I remarked on the Randi thread the other evening that I learned a very valuable lesson from him:

Anyone can be fooled. The point is not to volunteer to be fooled.

If you think things through, and exercise the brains you were gifted with, you need never be a volunteer for idiocy.

18 phoenixgirl  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:04:12pm

re: #13 unrealizedviewpoint

3 of 3? Is this common?

family at my church has four children, the three boys are autistic the daughter is not

19 brookly red  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:04:22pm

re: #15 ArmyWife

On the upside, the words are spelled correctly. Assuming "pusbag" is a word and that is how it's spelled, of course.

I think it is "puss-bag"... could be wrong.

20 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:04:27pm

re: #13 unrealizedviewpoint

3 of 3? Is this common?

No.

My reaction is that either those children are mis-diagnosed, or there is something seriously off in the genetics.

21 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:05:07pm

Sigh. . .another rant by the self appointed maven. . .if you look into waht autism is, you realize that while there are many SHARED behaviors that are common in on form or another. . .not all autistic kids are alike. . .

To be blunt- I believe that "autism" is a new label for a condition that has been around for many years- I believe that is you look long and hard at the "spectrum" you will see that at any given point in our lives WE are all showing certain behaviors that are now defined as autistic.

Based on all that I have seen, heard, read, and tried in my life with 3 kids with this condition, I have to say that the real challange to autistic kids and their parents is the nuts who are so concerned with causality that they are willing to allow hundreds if not thousands of kids to die of diseases, while at the same time allowing quacks of every sort to hawk any snake oil they please, by stamping natural or homiopathic on it, if you look at a lot of the "herbals" out there, teas and pills, you see that they mostly carry a disclaimer stating that the claims they make have not been evaluated by the FDA. . .hmmm

Charles- of all the people I have had make statements on this whole issue, you are one of the few that come off ans genuine and understanding about what is going on out there. . .and for that, thanks, and thanks too so much for allowing me to be here.

22 MandyManners  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:05:10pm

HOW LOW HAS THIS NATION SUNK?

23 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:05:12pm

So citing the research about the causes of autism is now considered "hostility"? Sad. I understand the emotional nature of this topic, but citing the medical research is not displaying hostility towards families of autistic children.

If anything, this is hostility towards those who are, in reality, preying on the emotions of these families for personal financial enrichment. And people who prey on the emotions of others are, imo, worthy of all the hostility they bring upon themselves for their sick, warped motivations.

24 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:05:36pm

re: #13 unrealizedviewpoint

3 of 3? Is this common?

If it's a genetic disorder, then I would think so.

25 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:06:08pm

re: #21 DisturbedEma

I wondered about the old idea of changelings, after dealing with my nephew.

26 MandyManners  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:06:10pm

She's a fucking porn star!

27 Bill M  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:06:26pm

Use the most wonderful gift you have — your brain — to find out the facts and learn the truth. It just might set you free.

As usual Charles, you are right on the money!

28 Occasional Reader  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:06:31pm

re: #17 Dianna

Anyone can be fooled. The point is not to volunteer to be fooled.

Did you come up with that, or did Randi? Great line.

29 doppelganglander  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:06:47pm

re: #18 phoenixgirl

family at my church has four children, the three boys are autistic the daughter is not

Autism is much more prevalent among boys. Since boys and girls are vaccinated at the same rate, there's obviously something other than the vaccine at work.

30 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:06:47pm

re: #16 davinvalkri

The more flack he's getting from people who believe this garbage, the better, I say. It means he's got influence; he's got a hand in the modern media. I'm sorry that all three of this lady's children were born autistic, but that's not much of an excuse to buy the vaccination-causes-autism quackery or lash out at Mr. Johnson.

All 3 being autistic can point to a common reason, but that could include genetics, diet, the environment, etc. Given that there is quite a bit in our environment with questionable health effects, that is, they haven't been tested anywhere near as thoroughly as vaccines, they'd be better subjects.

Blaming vaccines would be like blaming nuns for violence that occurs in a park between their convent and a trailer park.

31 solomonpanting  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:06:47pm

re: #13 unrealizedviewpoint

3 of 3? Is this common?

One of my sons cares for an autistic child who has a brother who is also afflicted.

32 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:07:07pm

re: #23 Sharmuta

So citing the research about the causes of autism is now considered "hostility"? Sad. I understand the emotional nature of this topic, but citing the medical research is not displaying hostility towards families of autistic children.

If anything, this is hostility towards those who are, in reality, preying on the emotions of these families for personal financial enrichment. And people who prey on the emotions of others are, imo, worthy of all the hostility they bring upon themselves for their sick, warped motivations.

And, like HIV/AIDS, cancer, and a hundred other medical problems in the modern world, the emotionalism is just gonna hurt the guys who are developing treatments, therapies and cures. And thus hurt the people with those diseases as well. It's sad, really.

33 lostlakehiker  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:07:24pm

Autism comes in degrees of severity. A few victims have managed to have remarkable and rich lives. There's this woman who wrote a book about herself. She'd managed to come to terms with the condition and had used her knack for concentration to get inside the heads of cattle going to slaughter. Slaughter ramps built according to the design she recommended had less baulking and less injury to animals as they moved up the ramp.

And then there's Daniel Tammett. He's the guy who learned Icelandic in one week flat, to a decent conversational standard.

How come we can't all do stuff like that? Because ordinary common sense takes quite a bit of brainpower, brainpower that gets diverted into other channels with autistics. This makes it very hard for them to get through daily activities. The most fortunate of them can do easily what most of us can barely do at all, but all of them have real difficulty doing what almost all the rest of us can do "without giving it a thought." We know, through the lens of autism, that we do indeed give it a thought, somehow or other, in some very effective and very necessary part of the brain that we designate back-burner.

Any program to weed out the genes that contribute to autism is a bad idea because it might weed out the abilities that autistics sometimes have in spades, and that others who are not exactly autistic have in sufficient measure to be remarkable, while at the same time retaining a degree of normality that makes their daily life no struggle.

34 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:07:42pm

re: #13 unrealizedviewpoint

3 of 3? Is this common?

hard to pin down- I have 3 but I had 8 kids total. . .of course Dina and Dara could show signs. . .but really, it is hard to say. . .

35 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:07:47pm

re: #28 Occasional Reader

Did you come up with that, or did Randi? Great line.

So far as I am aware, I formulated that.

36 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:08:16pm

For those who missed it earlier, there is a measles alert in Pittsburgh.

A Westmoreland County man, 33, and his two children, both under 5, were diagnosed Tuesday with having the respiratory infection, according to the state Department of Health.
......
Dr. Bruce W. Dixon, director of the Allegheny County Health Department, said neither child was vaccinated. The children don't attend school or day care, he said. The state said the father received only the first of two vaccinations that are part of the measles, mumps and rubella inoculation.

37 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:08:21pm

re: #24 Sharmuta

If it's a genetic disorder, then I would think so.

I guess it's natural to look elsewhere for blame (for most) then at one's genes.

38 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:08:42pm

Rationality has no place when one can listen to the opportunistic scam-pushing grifters and ambulance chasers. Profiting off the misery and despair of suffering parents is just so despicable.

39 solomonpanting  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:09:00pm
Before you crap on people for being suspicious of vaccines, particularly the parents of autistic children, try walking a mile in their shoes, OK?

What does one have to do with the other?

40 Boxy_brown  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:09:18pm

Autism existed long before vaccines.

41 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:09:22pm

re: #20 Dianna

No.

My reaction is that either those children are mis-diagnosed, or there is something seriously off in the genetics.

Are the parents cousins?

NTTAWWT: My parents are cousins.

42 MandyManners  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:10:06pm

re: #40 Boxy_brown

Autism existed long before vaccines.

Proof?

43 Emerald  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:10:27pm

As hard of a life as these families have with autistic children, they have those children alive. Ban the vaccines, and the death rates of children will skyrocket.

44 brainwizard73  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:10:49pm

If there was a shread of scientific evidence I could at least give someone some benefit of the doubt...but really, when Wikipedia says you have got no proof...ugh.

45 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:10:50pm

re: #29 doppelganglander

Autism is much more prevalent among boys. Since boys and girls are vaccinated at the same rate, there's obviously something other than the vaccine at work.

I do remember reading years ago about a study showing autism was very prevalent in double-Y males, far beyond the split of the normalized male to female ratio.

46 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:10:50pm

re: #41 Alouette

Are the parents cousins?

NTTAWWT: My parents are cousins.

I don't see that information.

I will note that my mother was afraid I was autistic when I was a very small child.

47 VioletTiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:10:52pm

This is such a dam shame. Nowhere did I see ANYONE mocking autistic children or their parents. The only thing I saw was an attempt to draw attention to the senseless decision to avoid life-saving vaccines because of a link between autism and vaccines that has already been debunked.

48 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:10:54pm

re: #30 Kosh's Shadow

All 3 being autistic can point to a common reason, but that could include genetics, diet, the environment, etc. Given that there is quite a bit in our environment with questionable health effects, that is, they haven't been tested anywhere near as thoroughly as vaccines, they'd be better subjects.

Blaming vaccines would be like blaming nuns for violence that occurs in a park between their convent and a trailer park.

My son's class has a set of identical twin girls that are both autistic. . .and a fraternal set that has the girl typical and her twin brother autistic. . .

I really believe that this is genetic- and that it can be seen in the faces, hands and features of autistic children all over the world. . .

49 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:11:07pm

re: #38 FurryOldGuyJeans

Rationality has no place when one can listen to the opportunistic scam-pushing grifters and ambulance chasers. Profiting off the misery and despair of suffering parents is just so despicable.

If the tort shysters, the ecowackies, and their media-cult spokes-droids actually do manage to generate a pandemic with this, they will have a lot worse problems than figuring out what to do with their loot.

50 Dayenu  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:11:09pm

"This is one of the worst things human beings are capable of — exploiting the pain of vulnerable people for profit."

Very well put. I've been looking for a phrase like this for a while now.

Funny thing is, this is exactly what I have against Scientology. (If you don't know what I mean, do some research on their personality tests. They tried to pull that trick on me once)

51 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:12:04pm

re: #20 Dianna

No.

My reaction is that either those children are mis-diagnosed, or there is something seriously off in the genetics.

Adopted, perhaps?

52 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:12:09pm

re: #45 FurryOldGuyJeans

I do remember reading years ago about a study showing autism was very prevalent in double-Y males, far beyond the split of the normalized male to female ratio.

I sometimes wonder about the Y chromosome in general.

And not just because those who possess it can't ask for directions.

53 solomonpanting  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:12:24pm

Repost from the Jenny thread:

Autism may be connected to increased rainfall

How does global warming fit into this equation?

54 Occasional Reader  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:12:35pm

re: #35 Dianna

So far as I am aware, I formulated that.

Well, I just took out the copyright under my own name. Ha!

55 Mich-again  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:12:52pm
All three of my kids are autistic.

I call Bullshit right there.

56 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:13:06pm

re: #52 Dianna

I sometimes wonder about the Y chromosome in general.

And not just because those who possess it can't ask for directions.

What you can't ask? I ask for 'em when I need 'em. ;)

57 mulgamutt  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:13:14pm

Both my boys (9 and 4) are in the autistic spectrum; the oldest with Asperger's and the youngest with a "mild autism" (as specified by a pediatric neurologist). The youngest also has hearing loss (born with one ear).

I don't believe for a second that immunizations cause autism. Based on criteria, I'm and Aspie, and so is my father. We grew up in outback Australia, and neither of us were immunized for anything. I'm a believer in the hypothesis of genetics, rather than outside "forces".

And there is no cure. It's not like the measles. Idiots.

Oh, and if they think it's all about the mercury (in vaccinations), why is the left pushing more mercury on us? Those CFLs they want you to use 'cos they're so "environmentally pure" are made with mercury. Check the box. You cannot dispose of these normally. If you break one, you must not vacuum it. Technically, you're supposed to exit the house, and call some kind of hazmat bunch to come out and clear it up. Thanks, left! Well done.

58 Ayeless in Ghazi  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:13:15pm

Well said Charles. I think we're all getting sick of the attempts at emotional blackmail on this issue from those who are committed to this dangerous nonsense.

59 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:13:18pm

re: #39 solomonpanting

What does one have to do with the other?

I would like to walk my size 8s up on this letter writer. . .mile in my shoes, indeed- I happen to believe that it is very beneficial to have A NUMBER of people in on this, friends loved ones, and hey why not even NON AUTISTIC HAVING childless people. . .shesh, it is not a club for heaven's sake!

60 brainwizard73  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:13:24pm

Next thing you know the American Trial Lawyers Assocation will find a way to gin up a class action against the phrama companies...

McCarthy v. Pfizer?

61 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:13:43pm

re: #53 solomonpanting

Repost from the Jenny thread:

Autism may be connected to increased rainfall

How does global warming fit into this equation?

The connection would be a Greenie's wet dream.

62 louis  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:13:46pm

You'd think that the fact all three of kids are autistic would lead her to think that is is a genetic condition. My understanding is that these kids start to demonstrate autistic behavior around the time they are vaccinated. However, that has more to due with their age than a causal connection with the vaccine itself. In other words, when the kids reach a certain age developmentally they start to exhibit autistic behavior. It just happens to be at the same time they get certain vaccinations. It doesn't mean vaccines cause the autism.

63 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:14:12pm

Here's a thought. The cost to society would be far greater if we listened to the Anti-Vax cult then if we continued with a normal program of vaccinations. The benefit to society from vaccinations far exceeds the pitfalls including the false association between MMR and autism. As it stands now most vaccinations are Thiomersal free and in fact many have been for many years now. This is alarm ism is nothing but pure hype and a conspiracy based on ignorant charlatans.

64 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:14:13pm

re: #48 DisturbedEma

I have noted that my autistic nephew is "elfin" in appearance. And that many autistic children I've encountered have that same feel to their looks.

Do you agree, or am I projecting?

It's why I've wondered about stories about changelings.

65 Edouard  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:14:21pm

The advent of vaccination is not the reason autism exists. The reason for autism's existence is not known; what is known is that the reason is far more complicated and cannot be so summarily explained.

I'm well aware that having autistic kids can be at times be a grinding burden for parents.

However, the personal feeling of burden or sorrow about autism should not be some kind of unassailable excuse for relatives of people with autism to go on the attack, armed with a bunch of facile, half-baked ideas, against a society that has benefited monumentally from vaccines.

66 brookly red  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:14:22pm

re: #52 Dianna

I sometimes wonder about the Y chromosome in general.

And not just because those who possess it can't ask for directions.

GPS ;)

67 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:14:52pm

re: #54 Occasional Reader

Well, I just took out the copyright under my own name. Ha!

Sweetie, you do know that I probably shoot better than you do, right?

68 rain of lead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:14:56pm

re: #24 Sharmuta
SHARMUTA!
"runs up and gives a huge hug and a big wet kiss"
"thankyouthankyouthankyou"
you gave me the tip I needed to fix my computer
this one
"gives another hug and kiss"
everyone bookmark this page this tip is awsome
sorry for the ot
sharmie, I am your servant for the night

69 footballfan0786  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:14:56pm

Here is the problem folks have with these vaccines. The have mercury in them. Get the mercury out and there will be less problems.

..footballfan

70 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:15:10pm

re: #52 Dianna

I sometimes wonder about the Y chromosome in general.

And not just because those who possess it can't ask for directions.

H-Hey!
Back on topic though--the Wikipedia article says that Autism is "characterized by impaired social interaction and communication, and by restricted and repetitive behavior. These signs all begin before a child is three years old.[2]"
How many people here does that describe, in any severity?
*Points at "restricted and repetitive behavior", raises hand, sighs*

71 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:15:45pm

re: #64 Dianna

I have noted that my autistic nephew is "elfin" in appearance. And that many autistic children I've encountered have that same feel to their looks.

Do you agree, or am I projecting?

It's why I've wondered about stories about changelings.

Cupid bow lips? Tipped and tilted eyes?

72 Throbert McGee  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:15:49pm

re: #6 HelloDare

Asshole crank?

I believe Zombie has pictures of such a device at the Folsom Street Fair.

Upding, even though I needed brain bleach...

73 summergurl  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:15:57pm

re: #68 rain of lead

SHARMUTA!
"runs up and gives a huge hug and a big wet kiss"
"thankyouthankyouthankyou"
you gave me the tip I needed to fix my computer
this one
"gives another hug and kiss"
everyone bookmark this page this tip is awsome
sorry for the ot
sharmie, I am your servant for the night

Maybe he will cook you something

74 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:16:07pm

re: #22 MandyManners

HOW LOW HAS THIS NATION SUNK?

All will be solved by our Messiah-King when he prophesies about the benefits of socialized medicine.

75 Occasional Reader  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:16:34pm

re: #67 Dianna

Sweetie, you do know that I probably shoot better than you do, right?

I repeat; it's so cute when girls think they can fight.

/ducks

76 Bagua  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:16:51pm

I recall about 10 years ago in the UK this rumour about Autism and the MMR jab (vaccine) being connected, I didn't realise the idea was still around.

What a dreadful thought to expose children to severe, and easily prevented sickness over a baseless fear.

77 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:16:52pm

re: #69 footballfan0786

Don't forget mercury in dental amalgams.

78 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:16:54pm

re: #64 Dianna

I have noted that my autistic nephew is "elfin" in appearance. And that many autistic children I've encountered have that same feel to their looks.

Do you agree, or am I projecting?

It's why I've wondered about stories about changelings.

Fairytale and legend always has a basis in fact.

79 rain of lead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:16:58pm

re: #73 summergurl

cook, clean, fetch drinks whatever

80 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:16:59pm

re: #71 DisturbedEma

Cupid bow lips? Tipped and tilted eyes?

Hands that are plump all the way through the fingers, with some hyper extention?

81 doppelganglander  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:17:19pm

re: #64 Dianna

I have noted that my autistic nephew is "elfin" in appearance. And that many autistic children I've encountered have that same feel to their looks.

Do you agree, or am I projecting?

It's why I've wondered about stories about changelings.

I hadn't even thought about it, but my friend's adult son, who has Aspergers, is rather elfin as well. He's quite tall, but his face seems too small and his ears are slightly pointed.

82 summergurl  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:17:26pm

re: #75 Occasional Reader

I repeat; it's so cute when girls think they can fight.

/ducks

She and I both can probably handle our own...

I am a good shot..

83 BLBfootballs  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:05pm

It seems almost...childish to say. But in any situation like this everybody needs to put aside their personal pain for at least a few minutes. This isn't about anybody's personal pain, or disappointments or terrible heartache.

This is about science -- and science doesn't care about any of those things. And if somebody can present good scientific data that "vaccines cause autism" then many other scientists will listen. But there is no good data that suggests that. Again this isn't about pain or walking a mile in anybody's shoes. It's about what the data show. That's it, man.

Personality, preferences and emotion not allowed.

84 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:07pm

re: #81 doppelganglander

I hadn't even thought about it, but my friend's adult son, who has Aspergers, is rather elfin as well. He's quite tall, but his face seems too small and his ears are slightly pointed.

Round head, pointed face? Forehead. . .large face small?

85 Boxy_brown  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:09pm

re: #42 MandyManners

"Proof?"

Not without a time machine to go back to Bedlam but:

"The Table Talk of Martin Luther contains the story of a 12-year-old boy who may have been severely autistic.[146] According to Luther's notetaker Mathesius, Luther thought the boy was a soulless mass of flesh possessed by the devil, and suggested that he be suffocated.[147] The Wild Boy of Aveyron, a feral child caught in 1798, showed several signs of autism....

86 Occasional Reader  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:12pm

So I was just watching a genuinely pro-military, big name Hollywood movie, one that I had never seen before: Rules of Engagement (2000)

87 Mich-again  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:26pm

CFL's have trace amounts of mercury in them. No one blames them for autism. Yet.

88 summergurl  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:31pm

Time for some shut eye==

89 Emerald  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:32pm

re: #69 footballfan0786

The mercury isn't the issue. It's the lack of reason. Their problem is the inability to rationally look at the real data without resorting to an emotional response. The vaccines don't cause autism.

90 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:35pm

re: #71 DisturbedEma

Cupid bow lips? Tipped and tilted eyes?

Sometimes, but more this odd, drawn-back look.

91 VioletTiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:41pm

re: #55 Mich-again

I call Bullshit right there.

Hard to say, really.
There are different degrees of autism and my personal opinion is that the increase in cases may be in part due to an increase in awareness of the milder cases.

92 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:43pm

re: #68 rain of lead

I'm glad I could help!

93 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:18:48pm

re: #77 pink freud

Don't forget mercury in dental amalgams.

I still have mine from the 70s. I don't think it's affected me. These were done when I was 13. I've even played with mercury as a kid.

94 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:19:21pm

re: #75 Occasional Reader

I repeat; it's so cute when girls think they can fight.

/ducks

You should!

But I shall refrain out of respect for your wife.

95 ArmyWife  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:19:28pm

I am going to confess I am a bit of a vaccination kook - I am NOT anti-vaccination, but I did wait until my children were 6 months before I started the shots. Not because of the autism connection, I've never bought in to that - but because if you breast feed, your babies get immunity from you and I've felt having them be a bit stronger before we start injecting them with stuff is better for everyone. I might have felt differently if they had gone to day care, I'm not sure.

I also insisted on the killed virus polio vaccine before it was standard issue. It was rare with my 17 year old, it became the standard shortly after my 10 year old was born for all the reasons I cited during my "discussions" with the pediatricians on this.

My husband, a medical professional, thinks I'm nuts. When I fought with the Military doctors about this, he would pray for a big hole to swallow him up. Ahh, memories.

96 doppelganglander  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:19:32pm

re: #84 DisturbedEma

Round head, pointed face? Forehead. . .large face small?

Yes, exactly. I saw a recent picture of him and he sort of resembles Dwight Schrute on "The Office."

97 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:19:40pm

re: #64 Dianna

I have noted that my autistic nephew is "elfin" in appearance. And that many autistic children I've encountered have that same feel to their looks.

Do you agree, or am I projecting?

It's why I've wondered about stories about changelings.

*Checks mirror, checks Asperger syndrome symptom list*
Uh-oh.

98 MandyManners  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:19:57pm

My father contracted polio when he was a child.

McCarthy, you are a fucking KUNT.

99 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:20:00pm

re: #90 Dianna

Sometimes, but more this odd, drawn-back look.


tipped and tilted back. . .yes, that is the "look" I was talking about. . .that child that was rescued in Thailand last week- but for the difference in skin tone, he looked like my son. . .

100 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:20:02pm

re: #97 davinvalkri

*Checks mirror, checks Asperger syndrome symptom list*
Uh-oh.

Ah, wait. I should add. What do you mean by "elfin"?

101 swamprat  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:20:14pm

We do the best we can. Someone gets a reaction from a vaccine and all reasoning stops. We want there to be no problems from anything, anytime, anywhere.

The world will always have sharp edges. We deal with it and move on.

Do not put q-tips in your ear.
Coffee may be hot.
Do not place ladder on frozen manure.
Keep fingers away from fan.
Do not use hairdryer in bathtub.

They are never going to think of everything; We should just send lawyers a monthy stipend and forego all those lawsuits.

102 HelloDare  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:20:21pm

Pigeons fly cell phones into Brazilian prison

SAO PAULO – Inmates have devised an innovative way to smuggle in cell phones into a prison farm in Brazil: carrier pigeons. Guards at the Danilio Pinheiro prison near the southeastern city of Sorocaba noticed a pigeon resting on an electric wire with a small cloth bag tied to one of its legs last week. "The guards nabbed the bird after luring it down with some food and discovered components of a small cell phone inside the bag," police investigator Celso Soramiglio said Tuesday.

One day later, another pigeon was spotted dragging a similar bag inside the prison's exercise yard. Inside the bag was the cell phone's charger, Soramiglio said.

The birds were apparently bred and raised inside the prison, smuggled out, outfitted with the cell phone parts and then released to fly back.

"Pigeons instinctively fly back home, always," the investigator said.

Soramiglio said that police have not discovered who raised the pigeons nor the name of the inmate who was going to receive the cell phone, but that he hoped the telephone carrier would provide the information.

"Some of them are members of organized crime groups that use cell phones to talk to family and friends and to give and receive orders for criminal actions outside and inside prisons," Soramiglio said.

He did not want to elaborate further until investigations conclude.

In 2006, Sao Paulo's notorious First Capital Command used cell phones to coordinate a wave of assaults on police, banks and buses that left more than 200 people dead in South America's largest city.

The gang's leaders are based in prisons, and use smuggled cell phones to plan and execute drug deals, kidnappings and bank robberies.

103 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:20:33pm

re: #93 Gus 802

Same here. And think about it ...how many children under the age of three have filling in their teeth? I posted it because it is one of the newer theories.

104 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:20:37pm

re: #82 summergurl

She and I both can probably handle our own...

I am a good shot..

Oh, indeed!

105 BLBfootballs  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:20:45pm
On a related subject: State issues measles alert after suspected cases at Children’s Hospital.
...
Dr. Bruce W. Dixon, director of the Allegheny County Health Department, said neither child was vaccinated.

Un-f[$&@*#$*!]believable!

106 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:21:07pm

re: #97 davinvalkri

*Checks mirror, checks Asperger syndrome symptom list*
Uh-oh.

Welcome to the club. . .:) jk

107 Mich-again  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:21:09pm

re: #91 VioletTiger

Hard to say, really.
There are different degrees of autism and my personal opinion is that the increase in cases may be in part due to an increase in awareness of the milder cases.

Or maybe its an evolved form of Munchausen's Syndrome by Proxy.

108 rain of lead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:21:25pm

re: #73 summergurl

hey summer
I had a serious 'puter glitch complete blank screen,no icons no start button nuthin
several lizards gave me some great ideas but the tip sharmuta gave me worked
had to go deeeep into regedit to find the bug

109 Occasional Reader  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:21:25pm

re: #94 Dianna

You should!

But I shall refrain out of respect for your wife.

Refrain? Damn, if you can shoot me here, from California, you ARE a good shot.

110 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:21:37pm

re: #100 davinvalkri

Ah, wait. I should add. What do you mean by "elfin"?

Ever had cookies made in a tree? Seen LOTR?

111 Last Mohican  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:22:05pm

re: #31 solomonpanting

One of my sons cares for an autistic child who has a brother who is also afflicted.

There is a genetic component to autism. Here is a quote from the medical literature, an excellent review called "The Genetics of Autism", by Muhle R et al., Pediatrics 2004;113;e472-486:

The recurrence rate in siblings of affected children is 2% to 8%, much higher than the prevalence rate in the general population but much lower than in single-gene diseases. Twin studies reported 60% concordance for classic autism in monozygotic (MZ) twins versus 0 in dizygotic (DZ) twins, the higher MZ concordance attesting to genetic inheritance as the predominant causative agent. Reevaluation for a broader autistic phenotype that included communication and social disorders increased concordance remarkably from 60% to 92% in MZ twins and from 0% to 10% in DZ pairs. This suggests that interactions between multiple genes cause “idiopathic” autism but that epigenetic factors and exposure to environmental modifiers may contribute to variable expression of autism-related traits.

112 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:22:09pm

Let's see. I've played with mercury. Once took apart a giant electrical mercury switch my father brought home. Broken thermometers were always the best source. Did a lot of soldering with lead solder and smelled the fumes. Build a lot of model airplanes and rockets using enamel, lacquer paint and butyrate dope. Acetone, thinners, oils, solvents... you name it.

113 Aviator  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:22:32pm

re: #101 swamprat

We do the best we can. Someone gets a reaction from a vaccine and all reasoning stops. We want there to be no problems from anything, anytime, anywhere.

The world will always have sharp edges. We deal with it and move on.

Do not put q-tips in your ear.
Coffee may be hot.
Do not place ladder on frozen manure.
Keep fingers away from fan.
Do not use hairdryer in bathtub.

They are never going to think of everything; We should just send lawyers a monthy stipend and forego all those lawsuits.

[Link: www.safetyimages.info...]

114 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:22:34pm

re: #39 solomonpanting

What does one have to do with the other?

Post hoc ergo propter hoc: It's magical thinking.

115 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:22:40pm

re: #110 DisturbedEma

Ever had cookies made in a tree? Seen LOTR?

Uh, yeah. But one, those are two completely different styles of elf, and two, the LOTR elfs were only created after lots and lots of makeup and hair extensions. So yeah.

116 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:22:48pm

And I received vaccinations. According to these people I should either be a) mentally handicapped or b) dead.

117 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:22:50pm

re: #108 rain of lead

Honestly- geek blogs are great for helping with computer problems.

118 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:06pm

re: #112 Gus 802

Let's see. I've played with mercury. Once took apart a giant electrical mercury switch my father brought home. Broken thermometers were always the best source. Did a lot of soldering with lead solder and smelled the fumes. Build a lot of model airplanes and rockets using enamel, lacquer paint and butyrate dope. Acetone, thinners, oils, solvents... you name it.

So, you are so autistic you are super autistic and hence, typical? :)

119 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:15pm

To be blunt again, statistically, if there were an actual strong correlation between using a vaccine and developing any condition, after several hundred million data points (people vaccinated) there would have been thousands showing up with the condition in a clear and statistically verifiable way. The math in this case is actually not hard to do.

Since there isn't an equation editor, I can't just show the math.

However, consider smoking. After the Second World War, tobacco use in this nation increased dramatically - particularly cigarettes. Many soldiers and civilians took up the habit. There was an immediate rise in the number of cases of lung cancer and heart disease. There were literally hundreds of millions of trials world wide. The first reports that smoking is really bad for you came out in the fifties. Those reports also looked at those who had started smoking before the war of course - but the point is that there were strong correlations and the increase in tobacco use made those correlations obvious.

I repeat, if there were a strong correlation, this would not be the battle cry of a few anecdotal accounts. There would be all sorts of cases showing up for many years.

As a general rule, junk science has data that lives in the noise and can be easily sensationalized. Everyone feels terrible for the parent of a child with any condition. Everyone accept those who prey on those parents for their own gain.

This is no different then the people whoa re out there to tell you that everything causes cancer. Get the grieving mother on the set. Roll film and crocodile tears. It makes for great ratings and has nothing to do with science.

I have the deepest sympathy for parents who noticed that their children developed conditions after receiving the shots. I know it seems like a cause and an effect. However, there are lots of things that could be causes of any medical condition. There is no reason to believe - given the millions of non-autistic people who were vaccinated, that the vaccine caused the illness. It was most likely (almost statistically certain) just that the child was vaccinatred at the same time the illness was about to onset anyway. Also, once this seems like an explanation, it is very easy for people to say sure and convince themselves of it. Some fraction of parents do - and it is natural because the symptoms of autism begin to manifest themselves early in many cases and you get MMR early in your life. The events happened close together. It looks like a pattern to these parents even if there isn't one.

I am so sorry that good people are being used this way by callous media.

120 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:17pm

re: #116 Gus 802

And I received vaccinations. According to these people I should either be a) mentally handicapped or b) dead.

I'm pretty sure that's the story for most of us, Gus.

121 footballfan0786  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:23pm

Pink 77

Don't forget mercury in dental amalgams.

Do we give them to infants..? No, we wait for their baby teeth to fall out. Don't play with me please.

footballfan

122 ArmyWife  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:32pm

re: #41 Alouette

The U.S. is one of the few countries that have laws against marrying cousins. There really isn't a huge risk for genetic issues.

123 Mich-again  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:33pm

re: #110 DisturbedEma

Seen LOTR?



Uhh Yep.. Heres a summary of the soundtrack.

Mr. Frodo!

Sam!

Mr Frodo!

Sam!

repeat 100 times. blech.

124 rain of lead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:44pm

re: #92 Sharmuta

I'm glad I could help!

nothing like the feeling of "damnit I hope this works........Yes!
"happy dance"

125 brainwizard73  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:23:53pm

Now all we need is for Jenny to say something outrageous about something like breastfeeding in public or something else, like that...why not a total cultural donnybrook?

126 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:24:19pm

re: #119 LudwigVanQuixote

Facts and logic don't matter to a distressed parent or a lawyer on a contingency fee.

127 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:24:33pm

re: #118 DisturbedEma

So, you are so autistic you are super autistic and hence, typical? :)

Yeah, or something. If these "theories" were true I think I would have a negative Karma rating -- at least.

//Or something. :)

128 Last Mohican  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:24:48pm

re: #43 Emerald

As hard of a life as these families have with autistic children, they have those children alive. Ban the vaccines, and the death rates of children will skyrocket.

Another interesting point: one environmental factor that is known to increase the risk of autism is a pregnant mother's infection with rubella. And a pregnant woman won't get rubella if she has received the MMR vaccine.

129 Racer X  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:25:02pm

Why is there such a huge increase of cases of Autism in California, and not in other places?

130 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:25:02pm

re: #87 Mich-again

CFL's have trace amounts of mercury in them. No one blames them for autism. Yet.

Is the cause simply due to increased heavy metals in our diets?

131 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:25:15pm

re: #115 davinvalkri

Uh, yeah. But one, those are two completely different styles of elf, and two, the LOTR elfs were only created after lots and lots of makeup and hair extensions. So yeah.

What make up do you use. . .oh, sorry

Thin features, lips and chin are pointed, forehead seems large, and the face seems very small. . .compact.

Eyes are lined and somewhat elongated. . . ears high and sharply angled for soft tissue. . .almost pointy looking but not all Spock. . .

132 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:25:20pm

re: #100 davinvalkri

Ah, wait. I should add. What do you mean by "elfin"?

I'm not going to link a picture of my nephew, but, there's a look, as if the face were pulled back and up; frequently, the ears seem elongated. The eyes are a bit tilted, frequently, as well.

My nephew's mouth is wide, not a cupid's bow, but otherwise, including a curious, high but narrow cheekbone, he fits Ema's discription.

133 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:25:21pm

re: #129 Racer X

Why is there such a huge increase of cases of Autism in California, and not in other places?

DSM-IV

134 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:25:27pm
135 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:25:37pm

re: #123 Mich-again

Uhh Yep.. Heres a summary of the soundtrack.

Mr. Frodo!

Sam!

Mr Frodo!

Sam!

repeat 100 times. blech.

Add about a million walk away from the camera, pause and SLOWLY turn the head while acting like you have a belly full of gas scenes.

136 footballfan0786  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:26:06pm

Emerald

The mercury isn't the issue. It's the lack of reason. Their problem is the inability to rationally look at the real data without resorting to an emotional response. The vaccines don't cause autism.

I never said that mercury caused autism. I said get the mercury out of the vaccines.

footballfan

137 Occasional Reader  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:26:16pm

Good night.

138 lobo91  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:26:28pm

re: #129 Racer X

Why is there such a huge increase of cases of Autism in California, and not in other places?

They probably have a higher concentration of lawyers than the rest of the country.

139 Ayeless in Ghazi  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:26:32pm

re: #64 Dianna

Like this, at all? (Gary Numan is autistic)

140 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:26:33pm

I call this the "raging against God" syndrome. Heartbroken and distraught parents trying to find something or someone to blame for their child's condition. Sometimes there is nothing or no one to blame. Sometimes things just happen. I know this to be true.

141 Dragonwolf  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:26:56pm

The truth will set you free......

The trouble is you need to survive the tempest that arises as the truth destroys all those precious and closely held beliefs about how the world should be.

For parents already in pain or terrified at the possibility of such pain, this can sometimes seem overwhelming. So the shysters enter in with their mantra "you don't have to think or seek the truth, just blame (insert current enemy target of the shysters). It won't fix the problem, but you just might get a lawsuit and some money out of it..."

Or am I the only one to see lawsuits against the drug companies as the next logical step here?

142 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:26:56pm

re: #109 Occasional Reader

Refrain? Damn, if you can shoot me here, from California, you ARE a good shot.

If ever, but ever, I get back to D.C. again, I insist on buying you and your wife dinner. Then, you and I can go have a shoot competition at the range. I'll even use your gun.

Then, and only then, do you get to kid me about my skills.

143 brainwizard73  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:15pm

re: #138 lobo91

They probably have a higher concentration of lawyers than the rest of the country.

I smell class-certification!

144 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:18pm

re: #123 Mich-again

Uhh Yep.. Heres a summary of the soundtrack.

Mr. Frodo!

Sam!

Mr Frodo!

Sam!

repeat 100 times. blech.


Must control. . .the . . .downding. . . everyone . . .is . . .entitled. . .to. . .their. . .opinion. . .

if I told you I gave my children names from the book, and that I have seen the movies so many times I CAN CITE THEM, would you understand how HARD it was not to down ding ya?

:)

145 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:20pm

re: #120 davinvalkri

I'm pretty sure that's the story for most of us, Gus.

Right. And the list I noted in the prior post is the public information.

146 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:27pm

re: #126 FurryOldGuyJeans

Facts and logic don't matter to a distressed parent or a lawyer on a contingency fee.

My father, an attorney (who actually used his powers for good and not evil) once told me that "America has the best justice system that money can buy."

147 Mich-again  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:30pm

re: #129 Racer X

Why is there such a huge increase of cases of Autism in California, and not in other places?

Maybe its all the air pollution floating over the Pacific Ocean from China.

148 VioletTiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:42pm

re: #119 LudwigVanQuixote

It really amounts to sensationalism by journalists. They want to do these stories because it catches people's attention since everybody knows somebody who knows somebody who is afflicted. In no way are they sincere in wanting to help anyone.

149 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:44pm

re: #138 lobo91

They probably have a higher concentration of lawyers than the rest of the country.

Lawyers and loons.

150 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:27:58pm

re: #121 footballfan0786

I did not say I was a proponent of this theory.

151 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:28:14pm
Deal with your hostility or most of your audience will write you off as an asshole crank, if they haven’t already.

How the hell is it "hostile" to call bullshit on a conspiracy theory that, in this case, threatens the health of our society by fostering dangerous, debunked notions that could bring about the resurgence of long forgotten fatal diseases?

I think the real hostility here is on the part of those who promote this conspiracy.

152 Randall Gross  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:28:14pm

re: #112 Gus 802

Let's see. I've played with mercury. Once took apart a giant electrical mercury switch my father brought home. Broken thermometers were always the best source. Did a lot of soldering with lead solder and smelled the fumes. Build a lot of model airplanes and rockets using enamel, lacquer paint and butyrate dope. Acetone, thinners, oils, solvents... you name it.

The absorption rate for liquid mercury is very low, mercury salts and mercury vapor are the more harmful types.

Elemental mercury

Quicksilver (liquid metallic mercury) is poorly absorbed by ingestion and skin contact. It is hazardous due to its potential to release mercury vapour. Animal data indicate that less than 0.01% of ingested mercury is absorbed through the intact gastrointestinal tract; though it may not be true for individuals suffering from ileus. Cases of systemic toxicity from accidental swallowing are rare, and attempted suicide via intravenous injection does not appear to result in systemic toxicity.[11] Though not studied quantitatively, the physical properties of liquid elemental mercury limit its absorption through intact skin and in light of its very low absorption rate from the gastrointestinal tract, skin absorption would not be high.[13] Some mercury vapour is absorbed dermally but uptake by this route is only approximately 1% of that by inhalation.[14]

In humans, approximately 80% of inhaled mercury vapor is absorbed via the respiratory tract where it enters the circulatory system and is distributed throughout the body.[15] Chronic exposure by inhalation, even at low concentrations in the range 0.7–42 μg/m3, has been shown in case control studies to cause effects such as tremors, impaired cognitive skills, and sleep disturbance in workers.[16][17]

153 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:28:22pm

re: #139 Jimmah

Like this, at all? (Gary Numan is autistic)


[Video]

Is he? Used to listen to him in the 80s. Amongst many.

154 ArmyWife  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:28:24pm

re: #146 LudwigVanQuixote

and I've always held we do not have a justice system at all. We have a legal system.

155 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:28:31pm

re: #132 Dianna

I'm not going to link a picture of my nephew, but, there's a look, as if the face were pulled back and up; frequently, the ears seem elongated. The eyes are a bit tilted, frequently, as well.

My nephew's mouth is wide, not a cupid's bow, but otherwise, including a curious, high but narrow cheekbone, he fits Ema's discription.

yep.

156 fish  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:28:42pm
The reason kooks and hucksters gravitate toward this subject is because they’re vampires, feeding on the pain of parents with autistic children. They know that these parents are vulnerable, and looking desperately for answers, and they tap on the bedroom window and give them easy answers and people to blame. And far too many parents invite them in.

.

This may be OT but if you substitute the words "People worried about the war and economy" for "Parents of Autistic Children" you have a pretty good summary of how the Left came to power in the last election.

158 Mich-again  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:29:22pm

re: #144 DisturbedEma

Actually I like those movies too. Especially the "You Shall Not Pass!" scene. My fave.

159 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:29:47pm

re: #151 Slumbering Behemoth

Penn & Teller must be the most hostile people on earth then for calling Bullshit on just about everything.

160 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:29:58pm

re: #144 DisturbedEma

Must control. . .the . . .downding. . . everyone . . .is . . .entitled. . .to. . .their. . .opinion. . .

if I told you I gave my children names from the book, and that I have seen the movies so many times I CAN CITE THEM, would you understand how HARD it was not to down ding ya?

:)

For some reason I could not, NOT get my kids interested in reading Tolkien, except for my #5 son. He saw the first movie, then read the entire trilogy IN ONE WEEKEND. But none of my other kids read the books or watched the movies.

161 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:30:07pm

re: #146 LudwigVanQuixote

My father, an attorney (who actually used his powers for good and not evil) once told me that "America has the best justice system that money can buy."

I make a very sharp distinction between an attorney and a lawyer, and your father illustrates why.

162 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:30:34pm

re: #158 Mich-again

Actually I like those movies too. Especially the "You Shall Not Pass!" scene. My fave.

Oh, yeah, Fellowship was the best movie- I am a recovering book to movie snob thanks to the Potter movies. . .

163 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:30:36pm

re: #157 Ojoe

O anti-science morons, the cemeteries are full of tombstones like this, from before the time of modern medicine.

That...that right there...is why these anti-science MORONS PISS ME OFF SO MUCH! They have such a FUCKING HYPER-ROMANTIC view of a NON-SCIENTIFIC WORLD, not realizing that such a world leads to...to THAT!

164 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:31:01pm

re: #152 Thanos

You would literally have to drink it. The "capillary effect" is minimal.

165 Racer X  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:31:05pm

re: #134 pink freud


Autism prevalence statistics / graphs

I stand corrected.

Minnesota tops the list.

166 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:31:07pm

re: #129 Racer X

Why is there such a huge increase of cases of Autism in California, and not in other places?

It's heavily studied (UCLA and UC Santa Barbara); Ventura County has the highest number of therapists for autism, and the highest diagnosis rate.

Correlation is not causation, but one does wonder.

167 Boxy_brown  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:31:26pm

In looking for proof that autism existed before the onset of vaccinations it occurred to me that even if this were demonstrated as true to some degree of certainty it wouldn't stop people from claiming that it was caused or made more frequent by vaccines.

In other words, you cant argue with crazy.

168 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:31:29pm

D-lister centerfold bimbo become medical expert overnight.

Film @ 11.

//

169 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:31:53pm

re: #160 Alouette

For some reason I could not, NOT get my kids interested in reading Tolkien, except for my #5 son. He saw the first movie, then read the entire trilogy IN ONE WEEKEND. But none of my other kids read the books or watched the movies.

My Marines are the biggest fans of LOTR- the rest are hard down for the Narnia CS Lewis. . .

170 Bloodnok  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:32:15pm

re: #160 Alouette

For some reason I could not, NOT get my kids interested in reading Tolkien, except for my #5 son. He saw the first movie, then read the entire trilogy IN ONE WEEKEND. But none of my other kids read the books or watched the movies.

Impressive! I usually have to re-read the Tom Bombadil section 3 times each time I read the trilogy to figure out just what in the hell he's talking about. I still don't know.

171 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:32:25pm

re: #165 Racer X

I stand corrected.

Minnesota tops the list.

Then it must be that liberalism is the cause! /////

172 VioletTiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:32:27pm

re: #159 Sharmuta

Penn & Teller must be the most hostile people on earth then for calling Bullshit on just about everything.

They are funny as hell, too.

173 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:32:31pm

re: #169 DisturbedEma

My Marines are the biggest fans of LOTR- the rest are hard down for the Narnia CS Lewis. . .

My son who loved LOTR is also an IDF veteran.

174 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:33:00pm

re: #139 Jimmah

Like this, at all? (Gary Numan is autistic)


[Video]

I'm on Fedora, and videos don't work too well.

175 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:33:02pm

re: #142 Dianna

Dianna,
Are you the corgi owner?

176 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:33:04pm

re: #166 Dianna

It's heavily studied (UCLA and UC Santa Barbara); Ventura County has the highest number of therapists for autism, and the highest diagnosis rate.

Correlation is not causation, but one does wonder.

Maybe they take mild cases and blow them up into full-blown utterly disabling autism? Looking over the symptom list, it wouldn't be that hard to diagnose me with some form of it; probably Aspergers or (unrelated) Schizoid or something like that.

177 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:33:48pm

re: #165 Racer X

Wow. That is striking. I had not seen that one.

178 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:34:21pm

re: #173 Alouette

My son who loved LOTR is also an IDF veteran.

There is an appeal in these books to some :)

179 [deleted]  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:34:30pm
180 [deleted]  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:35:01pm
181 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:35:12pm

re: #158 Mich-again

Actually I like those movies too. Especially the "You Shall Not Pass!" scene. My fave.

So, which leftie would you cast as the Balrog? I would go with Ted Kennedy, except that the Balrogs are evil spirits of fire, not water.

182 ArmyWife  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:35:17pm

I'm off to bed. Have a great night.

183 ConservatismNow!  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:35:29pm

re: #130 unrealizedviewpoint

Is the cause simply due to increased heavy metals in our diets?

Heavy metal would cause neck strain and hangovers, but not autism. Let me give you an example

Have you had your heavy metal dose today?

184 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:35:57pm

re: #182 ArmyWife

Goodnight, ArmyWife. :-) Sleep well ....

185 [deleted]  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:36:29pm
186 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:36:30pm

re: #175 Bobblehead

Dianna,
Are you the corgi owner?

I am!

187 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:36:31pm

re: #179 Egregious Philbin

go away!

188 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:36:33pm

re: #181 Dark_Falcon

So, which leftie would you cast as the Balrog? I would go with Ted Kennedy, except that the Balrogs are evil spirits of fire, not water.

alGore.

189 [deleted]  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:37:15pm
190 swamprat  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:37:50pm

re: #164 Gus 802

They used to drink mercury here,(one ounce) or so I am told. The story I got was that it never seemed to even pause. Like it was poured through a pipe (and that pipe was a person!) All that "cleansing" is probably still in the groundwater.Faster than a dose of the salts.


spa/resort town

191 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:37:58pm

What!

#179, you're so far out of line, I don't know where to begin!

192 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:38:07pm

re: #187 unrealizedviewpoint

go away!

Another asshole spewing flatulence? *Sigh*

193 Fat Jolly Penguin  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:38:08pm

re: #188 FurryOldGuyJeans

alGore.

Image: global-warming-gore-fire.jpg

194 kansas  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:38:13pm

re: #166 Dianna

It's heavily studied (UCLA and UC Santa Barbara); Ventura County has the highest number of therapists for autism, and the highest diagnosis rate.

Correlation is not causation, but one does wonder.

When the only tool you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

195 Bloodnok  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:38:26pm

Dang. Shoulda known that was vile and would get deleted.

196 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:38:36pm

Excuse me, I need to take a quick walk.

197 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:38:39pm

re: #189 Dark_Falcon

No, because they might still infect other people. No, the vaccines should be made compulsory. Parents who refuse vaccines as Jenny McCarthy does should have their parental rights terminated.

Reprinted, so that post won't lost when the original is deleted due to bad quote.

198 Egregious Philbin  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:03pm

re: #185 Bloodnok

Not the children. The non-vaccinated children didn't make that choice. That's the tragedy.

I didn't mean that the way it came out.

Of course not kids.

(was making a vague reference to Airplane!)

my bad.

On to the kooks, why do they think that the 99.995% of society should bend to their nutcase theories?

They are the fringe for a reason.

199 Ayeless in Ghazi  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:04pm

re: #153 Gus 802

Is he? Used to listen to him in the 80s. Amongst many.

Yeah, I watched a documentary on his life a few years back. The song "Are Friends Electric?" seems very much about the alienation that the condition causes, although he wrote it before he was diagnosed.

200 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:04pm

OT but is anyone concerned that the US banking system is about to be internationalized under the IMF? Soon we will be bailing out Upper Shri Lanka.

201 VioletTiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:05pm

re: #181 Dark_Falcon

So, which leftie would you cast as the Balrog? I would go with Ted Kennedy, except that the Balrogs are evil spirits of fire, not water.

We have to go with Pelosi as Shelob.
How about Howard Dean as the Balrog? He can make a lot of noise.

202 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:09pm

re: #190 swamprat

They used to drink mercury here,(one ounce) or so I am told. The story I got was that it never seemed to even pause. Like it was poured through a pipe (and that pipe was a person!) All that "cleansing" is probably still in the groundwater.Faster than a dose of the salts.

spa/resort town

Really? Rather odd practice.

203 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:15pm

re: #186 Dianna

I am!

Cute story here about "Ohio's Most Obedient Dog" I'll give you one guess what breed she is.

204 nyc redneck  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:38pm

i saw a show abt. 4 kids in a family w/ autism.
2 girls and 2 boys. he oldest boy was functional, bright but odd.
the youngest boy really tormented. the older girl was very introverted.
the youngest girl was the most normal,
the parents were also strange, the house was a mess.
these kids began to show signs of autism by 6 to 9 mos.
very different behavior than normal interactive babies.
the problems were evident early on.
this program was abt. coping with and not what caused the mental disorder
but looking at the parents in this case, it appeared that genetics most definitely
could have been a factor.
that must be a hard thing for parents to accept.
it is far easier to blame anything else as the cause.

205 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:39pm

Folks - please don't quote offensive comments! If you do your comment will be deleted too. If you want to respond to such a comment, use the REPLY button which does not include the quote.

206 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:41pm

re: #198 Egregious Philbin

Next time, think it through!

207 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:42pm

re: #186 Dianna

I am!

Love corgis. Think I asked you about this before.

208 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:39:57pm

re: #193 Fat Jolly Penguin

[Link: papundits.files.wordpress.com...]

The very picture that made me pick alGore. ;)

209 Egregious Philbin  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:40:21pm

re: #205 Charles

Folks - please don't quote offensive comments! If you do your comment will be deleted too. If you want to respond to such a comment, use the REPLY button which does not include the quote.

I'm sorry, I was trying to be glib, didn't work too well I'm afraid.

210 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:40:33pm

re: #134 pink freud


Autism prevalence statistics / graphs

Following those links to the CDC, and the National Institute, I found the following:

[Link: www.iom.edu...]

Bottom line, no link.

The graphs you brought make no mention of the stricken population to a control population who was not vaccinated.

One thing that may be a confounding factor also - from the graphs that you have shown is that there are an awful lot more kids being taken to an awful lot more child psychologists and getting diagnosed with whatever. This has been an ongoing trend in the last thirty years. More diagnoses - because it is more and more common to bring more kids in, does not mean a correlation.

211 Gella  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:40:39pm

how can u be so blond? vaccines saves lives, as far as i know there is really no scientific carolation between autism and vaccines. Also, from what i read autism is is over diagnosed and kids are over drugged. Its a horrible disease to have, i hope can endure this or their children.

212 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:41:16pm

re: #183 ConservatismNow!

Heavy metal would cause neck strain and hangovers, but not autism. Let me give you an example

Have you had your heavy metal dose today?

Hearing issues possibly too.
When warnings are issued not to feed tuna to the cats, due to mercury, one might to consider the dangers a true threat. Don't ask for link. I'm real tired.

213 Killian Bundy  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:41:34pm

re: #200 JohnAdams

OT but is anyone concerned that the US banking system is about to be internationalized under the IMF? Soon we will be bailing out Upper Shri Lanka.

/um, no, not at all

214 swamprat  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:41:35pm

re: #200 JohnAdams

OT but is anyone concerned that the US banking system is about to be internationalized under the IMF? Soon we will be bailing out Upper Shri Lanka.


They know what they are doing.


So do I, but I can't stop them!

215 Gella  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:41:38pm

I apologize for mistype, should be blind not blond
post #211

216 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:41:51pm

re: #154 ArmyWife

and I've always held we do not have a justice system at all. We have a legal system.

Well said. Sometimes though it does produce justice though. Despite it's many flaws, it is the best we can do overall.

217 Mich-again  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:41:55pm

re: #165 Racer X

I stand corrected.

Minnesota tops the list.

Not to be flippant at all but I wonder if some children who used to be diagnosed as R* are now diagnosed as A*. This chart from the same source you cited shows a deep and steady decline in cases of R* over roughly the same period.

218 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:41:59pm

re: #199 Jimmah

Yeah, I watched a documentary on his life a few years back. The song "Are Friends Electric?" seems very much about the alienation that the condition causes, although he wrote it before he was diagnosed.

I think I remember hearing about this several years ago. I do believe that it's possible to live with the autistic as we have for thousands of years. The current problem of course is the recent revisions to the diagnostic requirements that make far more people considered as autistic. Not much you can do about it since the DSM is essentially an NGO.

219 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:42:15pm

re: #203 Bobblehead

Cute story here about "Ohio's Most Obedient Dog" I'll give you one guess what breed she is.

A corgi obedient?!

My lord, clone her! Breed her! Quick!

I adore my corgi, but obedience is not exactly his outstanding characteristic.

220 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:42:19pm

re: #201 VioletTiger

We have to go with Pelosi as Shelob.
How about Howard Dean as the Balrog? He can make a lot of noise.

Works for me. We've previously established the George Soros is Sauron, Rham Emmanuel is Grima Wormtongue, and Obama is the Lord of the Nazgul. That leaves us with Saruman and eight other Ring Wraiths. Who shall we cast in those roles?

221 ConservatismNow!  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:42:34pm

re: #216 LudwigVanQuixote

Well said. Sometimes though it does produce justice though. Despite it's many flaws, it is the best we can do overall.

The Law is a means to Justice.

222 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:42:40pm

re: #207 JohnAdams

Love corgis. Think I asked you about this before.

Read the story and watch the little video I posted above.

223 Randall Gross  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:42:57pm

re: #215 Gella

I apologize for mistype, should be blind not blond
post #211

and here I was thinking you don't like Goldie Hawn...

224 Egregious Philbin  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:43:30pm

re: #219 Dianna

A corgi obedient?!

My lord, clone her! Breed her! Quick!

I adore my corgi, but obedience is not exactly his outstanding characteristic.

Try owning an Irish Terrier. A) its a terrier B) its Irish.

But, its my best friend.

225 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:43:42pm

re: #214 swamprat

It is a helpless feeling, especially near midnight! But I will be very active in the next Congressional election.

226 solomonpanting  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:43:47pm

re: #215 Gella

I apologize for mistype, should be blind not blond
post #211

Don't apologize. You'd be correct in reference to Jenny McCarthy.
;)

227 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:44:20pm

re: #215 Gella

I apologize for mistype, should be blind not blond
post #211

Blond still fit.

228 Gella  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:44:23pm

re: #223 Thanos

and here I was thinking you don't like Goldie Hawn...

hey hey hey i don't discriminate :) + Goldie is my girl :)

229 VioletTiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:44:30pm

re: #220 Dark_Falcon

Works for me. We've previously established the George Soros is Sauron, Rham Emmanuel is Grima Wormtongue, and Obama is the Lord of the Nazgul. That leaves us with Saruman and eight other Ring Wraiths. Who shall we cast in those roles?

Oh, those are good.
How about Harry Reid for Saruman.

230 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:44:34pm

re: #219 Dianna

A corgi obedient?!

My lord, clone her! Breed her! Quick!

I adore my corgi, but obedience is not exactly his outstanding characteristic.

Phoebe looks like our late "boss of the family". Miss him.

231 Gella  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:44:45pm

re: #226 solomonpanting

Don't apologize. You'd be correct in reference to Jenny McCarthy.
;)

hooray to that, she fits stereotype

232 Racer X  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:44:51pm

re: #217 Mich-again

Not to be flippant at all but I wonder if some children who used to be diagnosed as R* are now diagnosed as A*. This chart from the same source you cited shows a deep and steady decline in cases of R* over roughly the same period.

Interesting.

233 Throbert McGee  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:45:10pm

After Googling a little on "autism" and "elfin," I'm wondering if Dianna's nephew has facial features typical of Williams Syndrome?

234 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:45:11pm

re: #230 Bobblehead

Phoebe looks like our late "boss of the family". Miss him.

I can't bear the thought of losing my Goon.

235 simply me  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:45:12pm

Here is the link to an AP story on the high prevalence of autism in the US Somali population
[Link: www.google.com...]

The article says:

Researchers found the percentage of Somali children in the programs was two to seven times higher than non-Somali children.

The article ends:

Anne Harrington, who worked for the past 21 years in early childhood education for the Minneapolis schools, has been monitoring severe autism in the Somali community in for years.

She said the community is desperate for answers about a disorder that doesn't even have a name in their native language and wasn't known in their East African homeland.

"The Somali community is justifiably concerned that there is something happening here in Minnesota or Minneapolis that could be causing autism that they weren't seeing in their children in Somalia," she said.

This would seem to rule out genetics per se. But possibly support a genetics and environment interaction.

236 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:45:41pm

Management of the very small risk of serious side-effects of MMR vaccine is ultimately the responsibility of the parent of the young child, hopefully with the best medical advice possible.
Unfortunately no vaccine is 100% safe and this means that in society as a whole it is a certainty that a small number of adverse reactions will be experienced.
Even if evidence eventually emerges that vaccination does indeed cause autism in a certain tiny percentage of vaccinations, this would not mean that a rational parent would or should necessarily decline the vaccination. Instead, the parent would need to weigh the risk of the child contracting autism against the risk of the child contracting a debilitating case of measles, mumps or rubella.

237 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:46:00pm

re: #229 VioletTiger

Oh, those are good.
How about Harry Reid for Saruman.

Doesn't work. Saruman is very smart, and he plans well. Harry Reid is a dumbass.

238 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:46:37pm

re: #26 MandyManners

She's a fucking porn star!

If only they were brains.......

239 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:46:47pm

re: #233 Throbert McGee

After Googling a little on "autism" and "elfin," I'm wondering if Dianna's nephew has facial features typical of Williams Syndrome?

Possibly? But his sister has much the same mouth; his younger brother's mouth, like many of his features, are far more like mine and my mother's. It's hard to say.

240 capitalist piglet  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:46:54pm

re: #186 Dianna

I am!

Me too! Mine are the boss of me.

241 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:47:04pm

re: #235 simply me

THAT might explain the higher numbers of autism in Minnesota- there is a large Somali community there.

242 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:47:24pm

Good evening y'all - hope everyone is doing better than I am tonight.

243 MandyManners  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:47:24pm

She is a FUCKING PORN WHORE.

244 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:47:44pm

re: #234 Dianna

I can't bear the thought of losing my Goon.

Had to live through the loss of my beloved pooch last year, and just recently rescued a 1 year old pup. I had a very hard time accepting her for about a week, but she's won me over. A good dog is impossible not to love.

245 Dragonwolf  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:48:02pm

re: #229 VioletTiger

Oh, those are good.
How about Harry Reid for Saruman.

I was actually thinking Al Gore for Saruman. Kinda appropriate for the trees to attack him in the end.....

246 VioletTiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:48:03pm

re: #242 realwest

Good evening y'all - hope everyone is doing better than I am tonight.

Bad day, real?

247 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:48:14pm

re: #235 simply me

Here is the link to an AP story on the high prevalence of autism in the US Somali population
[Link: www.google.com...]

The article says:

Maybe it "doesn't happen" in Somalia because what would all the other crap going on there, that's one of the last things on the "look for" list? Or maybe the environment here--like knowledge of the condition and pediatricians looking for it--brings it out?
This would seem to rule out genetics per se. But possibly support a genetics and environment interaction.

248 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:48:18pm

re: #237 Dark_Falcon

Doesn't work. Saruman is very smart, and he plans well. Harry Reid is a dumbass.

Soros would be a good "Eye" of Sauron.

249 solomonpanting  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:48:25pm

re: #217 Mich-again

Not to be flippant at all but I wonder if some children who used to be diagnosed as R* are now diagnosed as A*. This chart from the same source you cited shows a deep and steady decline in cases of R* over roughly the same period.

I wouldn't be surprised. Alzheimer's has basically replaced senility.

250 sngnsgt  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:48:32pm

re: #183 ConservatismNow!

+1 and Up the Irons!

251 jaunte  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:48:36pm

re: #242 realwest

Hi realwest; sorry to hear you're down.

252 VioletTiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:48:36pm

re: #245 Dragonwolf

I was actually thinking Al Gore for Saruman. Kinda appropriate for the trees to attack him in the end.....


Good one!

253 doppelganglander  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:48:48pm

re: #215 Gella

I apologize for mistype, should be blind not blond
post #211

It actually made sense either way.

254 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:48:54pm

re: #220 Dark_Falcon

Works for me. We've previously established the George Soros is Sauron, Rham Emmanuel is Grima Wormtongue, and Obama is the Lord of the Nazgul. That leaves us with Saruman and eight other Ring Wraiths. Who shall we cast in those roles?

Sheikh Yassin, the Hamas terrorist in a wheelchair who was sent to Allah by the IDF a few years ago, was a dead ringer for Saruman.

255 Timbre  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:49:01pm

O/T: OK, OK, I know it is an MSNBC poll. But Lizard Rush fans (the band, not the radio host) have a chance to contribute to a "Why isn't Rush in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Even Though Lee, Lifeson, and Peart Could Care Less" poll which just may do the trick. All I ask is that you vote honestly. If you think Geddy Lee's screeching voice from 1974 to 1978 nullifies all the beautiful melodies from the 1980's, then vote "No." If you don't care about anything in life, vote that it doesn't make any difference to you. If you have so much respect for Rush you already know that, to Neil, you are a stranger and not a long-awaited friend, then please vote "Definitely!" Thanks!

256 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:49:08pm

re: #240 capitalist piglet

Me too! Mine are the boss of me.

The Goon adores me too much to try to be the boss. But he's an enthusiast, and, despite the big ears, doesn't listen worth a damn.

257 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:49:10pm

Hot Tuna (Keep On Truckin')

258 Dustyvet  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:49:12pm

re: #3 AmeriDan

Them's fightin words!

Sure are childish as well!

259 Last Mohican  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:49:33pm

re: #242 realwest

Good evening y'all - hope everyone is doing better than I am tonight.

And good evening to you - thanks for the good wishes, but I wish you were having a better night too.

260 MandyManners  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:49:43pm

Jenny McCarthty is a fucking porn whore.

261 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:49:44pm

re: #242 realwest

Good evening y'all - hope everyone is doing better than I am tonight.

real, it is all relative, especially of late. Sorry to hear you are feeling poorly (assuming that you are).

262 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:49:47pm

re: #242 realwest

Good evening y'all - hope everyone is doing better than I am tonight.

What's up? Are you OK?

263 Killian Bundy  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:50:08pm

re: #243 MandyManners

She is a FUCKING PORN WHORE.

/um, no

264 Timbre  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:50:17pm

Sorry, I was so excited I forgot the link to the Poll!

265 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:50:17pm

re: #234 Dianna

I can't bear the thought of losing my Goon.

I had to laugh when I watched the video. I couldn't imagine our guy sitting still, listening and then obeying a command. Well, he might sit still but with that" You've got to be kidding. You want me to do what?" look on his face.

266 Killian Bundy  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:50:34pm

re: #260 MandyManners

Jenny McCarthty is a fucking porn whore.

/linky?

267 MandyManners  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:50:44pm

I'm done.

268 VioletTiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:50:51pm

re: #217 Mich-again

That's interesting. Food for thought.

269 Gella  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:50:51pm

re: #260 MandyManners

Jenny McCarthty is a fucking porn whore.

she is ur typical hollyhood type, i dont even know why ppl listen to them most of the time, thats how zero won election

270 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:50:55pm

re: #263 Killian Bundy

/um, no

Yeah, she is. She's also a D-lister and couldn't act her way out of a paper bag.

271 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:51:05pm

re: #148 VioletTiger

It really amounts to sensationalism by journalists. They want to do these stories because it catches people's attention since everybody knows somebody who knows somebody who is afflicted. In no way are they sincere in wanting to help anyone.

Exactly,

272 Boxy_brown  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:51:10pm

OK, So I looked up the history of autism and a rudimentary, cursory, half assed search tells me that yes, autism pre-existed the widespread use of vaccines. The people who had it were called other things, they occasionally wound up in freak shows, you get the idea...

I have a place in Nova Scotia with a cemetery abutting it, the cemetery is filled with short little graves from a couple of measles epidemics that hit the town in the early 1900s and wiped out all the children. Since the ground was frozen when it happened they were all clustered together in rows that seem impossibly close to put a human being in.

Jenny McCarthy should count herself lucky that her child wasn't taken by some stupid disease that smarter minds found a way to eradicate.

273 Summer Seale  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:51:19pm

I just wrote a real hard comment on Insolence against one of the anti-vaccine bloggers who posted there, calling her kind a modern-society tamer version of the Taliban.

They really piss me off.

274 Neutral President  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:51:23pm

re: #220 Dark_Falcon

Works for me. We've previously established the George Soros is Sauron, Rham Emmanuel is Grima Wormtongue, and Obama is the Lord of the Nazgul. That leaves us with Saruman and eight other Ring Wraiths. Who shall we cast in those roles?

Bill or Hillary Clinton should be Saruman. A former enemy now doing their bidding in hopes for some power.

275 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:51:26pm

It's only after we've lost everything that we're free to do anything.
-Tyler Durden
/Namaste, y'all
//Lost is on

276 rain of lead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:51:58pm

hey guys
ot but just saw this and had to mention it
where does this planet get heat and light? "yes ,you in the back"
"that's right, the sun... since 2000 the planet has been cooling
and 2008 was the coolest in a looong time
NASA confirms why

277 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:52:18pm

re: #255 Timbre

O/T: OK, OK, I know it is an MSNBC poll. But Lizard Rush fans (the band, not the radio host) have a chance to contribute to a "Why isn't Rush in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Even Though Lee, Lifeson, and Peart Could Care Less" poll which just may do the trick. All I ask is that you vote honestly. If you think Geddy Lee's screeching voice from 1974 to 1978 nullifies all the beautiful melodies from the 1980's, then vote "No." If you don't care about anything in life, vote that it doesn't make any difference to you. If you have so much respect for Rush you already know that, to Neil, you are a stranger and not a long-awaited friend, then please vote "Definitely!" Thanks!

Not a big Rush fan, despite my proximity to Canada, but if those other cats are in, then so should Rush be!

278 Boxy_brown  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:52:22pm

re: #243 MandyManners

She is a FUCKING PORN WHORE.

She does have her drawbacks though.

279 phoenixgirl  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:52:28pm

mandy i think you are thinking of jenna jameson

280 alexknyc  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:52:34pm

I work as a special education teacher with a large Aspergers population.

Someone hit it right on the head, these parents have won a terrible lottery. But it's still a lottery with long odds.

Assume for the sake of argument that the claims are true and the vaccines cause autism in a certain, extremely small percentage of cases. Does that then mean NO kids should be vaccinated? Does anyone think parents would rather their children have a significant risk of fatal illness than a small chance of autism?

It must be horrible to live with the news that your child is autistic. There must be an overwhelming desire to understand why it happened. The emotional response is completely human. But to advocate that vaccinations be halted and be comfortable with the idea that thousands of children will die needless deaths so that you can stick it to "Big Pharma?" That's insanity.

In cases like this, we need science because science is concerned with just the cold, hard facts. And the cold hard facts are these-- even if you could prove the vaccines cause autism, the vaccinations would still be safer than having your kids exposed to measles, mumps, rubella, scarlet fever or any of the other nasties floating around in our air and on our bodies. We've eradicated the illnesses through vaccines, not the germs that cause them. If you're not vaccinated, you run the risk of contracting and dying from a disease that no one need get or die from anymore.

281 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:52:38pm

re: #245 Dragonwolf

I was actually thinking Al Gore for Saruman. Kinda appropriate for the trees to attack him in the end.....

Your choice is inspired, mine was lame.

282 Rakkasan  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:52:40pm

Maybe all of these anti-science/progress extremists - on both sides - will be happy to return to a time when the average lifespan was 35 years. Seriously, in their pursuit of a perfect, risk-free world, they might get us there.

283 Edouard  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:52:42pm

re: #167 Boxy_brown

In looking for proof that autism existed before the onset of vaccinations it occurred to me that even if this were demonstrated as true to some degree of certainty it wouldn't stop people from claiming that it was caused or made more frequent by vaccines.

In other words, you cant argue with crazy.

Interesting Wikipedia page: People Speculated to Have Been Autistic

Names such as Isaac Newton, Jonathan Swift, Emily Dickinson, Lewis Carroll, among others, appear here. These renowned figures of course lived far before the advent of modern vaccines.

Wolfgang Amadeus ("Beloved by God") Mozart is often surmised to have been autistic and also shows up on this page.

284 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:52:53pm

re: #257 Gus 802

Hot Tuna (Keep On Truckin')


[Video]

Love the Tuna!

285 Killian Bundy  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:53:12pm

re: #270 Gus 802

Yeah, she is. She's also a D-lister and couldn't act her way out of a paper bag.

Appearing in Playboy makes her a porn whore?

/better back up the truck then

286 Mich-again  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:53:17pm

re: #249 solomonpanting

The simplest explanation is that the increased rate is caused by a change in how the diagnosis is made. If it were due to environmental conditions, genetics, diet, or other exposure, the pattern would have been identified by now.

But you can't identify patterns when the naming convention changes. That makes all the old data and the trends moot.

287 swamprat  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:53:18pm

re: #225 JohnAdams


I read the book. It is a little foreboding.

Of course we will have a hard time getting anybody to believe "Atlas Shrugs" was written before 2009.

288 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:53:32pm

re: #280 alexknyc

re: #282 Rakkasan

You guys are preaching to the frikken choir here.

289 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:53:43pm

re: #242 realwest

Good evening y'all - hope everyone is doing better than I am tonight.

How can we help?

290 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:53:55pm

re: #243 MandyManners

She is a FUCKING PORN WHORE.

Not really, Mandy. Playboy made her famous, but she has never done hardcore, nor does she sleep around. I'd rather think of her as a Chicago thug, given that her words are essentially: "If you contradict me, I'll do my damnedest to ruin you." I used to regard her very highly, but she's let her emotions take over, and has become one of America's most destructive celebrities.

291 rain of lead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:54:00pm

re: #242 realwest

Hey Real!
Sharmuta had a tip this morning that allowed me to fix my computer....
so yes I am doing better

292 sngnsgt  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:54:12pm

re: #264 Timbre

Sorry, I was so excited I forgot the link to the Poll!

Hell yes! Rush should have been in the hall years ago. (quoted post to advance the poll)

293 Rakkasan  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:54:19pm

re: #229 VioletTiger

Harry Reid is far too incompetent to be Sauron. Give the Dark Lord some freaking respect.

294 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:54:52pm

re: #291 rain of lead

I'm glad it was an easier fix than having to reboot and all that junk.

295 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:55:09pm

re: #276 rain of lead

hey guys
ot but just saw this and had to mention it
where does this planet get heat and light? "yes ,you in the back"
"that's right, the sun... since 2000 the planet has been cooling
and 2008 was the coolest in a looong time
NASA confirms why

Very good, now over what time scale is the sunspot cycle compared to the overall warming measurements? Just because the sun is giving us a break right now, does NOT mean that we haven't messed up the balance on the Earth. Interesting that you bring this in a discussion that has much to do with correlations.

296 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:55:23pm

re: #276 rain of lead

hey guys
ot but just saw this and had to mention it
where does this planet get heat and light? "yes ,you in the back"
"that's right, the sun... since 2000 the planet has been cooling
and 2008 was the coolest in a looong time
NASA confirms why

//No, it's because you ran your air conditioner too long, that one night last July.

297 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:55:40pm

re: #293 Rakkasan

Harry Reid is far too incompetent to be Sauron. Give the Dark Lord some freaking respect.

They don't call him "Dingy Harry" for nothing.

298 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:55:56pm

re: #243 MandyManners

She is a FUCKING PORN WHORE.

Yep- and people are taking medical advice from her, and Time Magazine is allowing themselves to be used by her. . .

299 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:56:03pm

re: #246 VioletTiger
and
re: #251 jaunte
Yeah, you could say it was a bad day.
According to Reuters (sorry but I inadvertently deleted the link) the House today passed the bill introduced by Barney Franks which provides that "management compensation and performance shall be fixed by the Congress of the United States for any company which took Federal Bail Out money or loans." This is retroactive; a bill of attainder. And while I'm almost literally sick to my stomach with rage over this CLASS WARFARE being promoted by Obama and the Democratic Party (not one Republican voted for the bill) I mostly regret asking friends - including some of you out here - to spend your time and money writing to your congresscritters to oppose this.
I apologize to all who took or followed my advice for wasting your time.

300 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:56:05pm

re: #285 Killian Bundy

Appearing in Playboy makes her a porn whore?

/better back up the truck then

Oh to be honest I don't pay attention to any pop culture whores -- male or female. That would include Jenny McCarthy and others. I can't help myself in that regard.

301 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:56:30pm

re: #274 ArchangelMichael

Bill or Hillary Clinton should be Saruman. A former enemy now doing their bidding in hopes for some power.

Bill can be Saruman, Hillary is a Ring Wraith.

302 mattm  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:56:35pm

This is not just insane, it is dangerous. A threat yo public health, allowing easily preventable diseases to be spread for no reason.

303 doppelganglander  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:57:13pm

I'm so disappointed "Dr." mspfacs didn't grace us with his presence on this thread. I was so looking forward to another wild goose chase through the most prominent medical journals.

304 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:57:28pm

re: #161 FurryOldGuyJeans

I make a very sharp distinction between an attorney and a lawyer, and your father illustrates why.

Thanks buddy.

305 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:57:54pm

re: #301 Dark_Falcon

Bill can be Saruman, Hillary is a Ring Wraith.

I see the reverse. Hillary is all about power.

306 NY Nana  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:57:58pm

re: #95 ArmyWife

I nursed all 4 of my kids, who are now in their 30's (1) and their 40's (3). The only immunity they get is to a number of G.I. illnesses.

My kids had chicken pox, which I also had as a 7-year old. And now my 3 grandkids have had each and every immunization, and an influenza shot each year, as do my husband and I. We also get our DPT vaccine every 10 years, and Pneumovax also.

Here are my comments from yesterday's thread.

307 capitalist piglet  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:58:03pm

re: #256 Dianna

The Goon adores me too much to try to be the boss. But he's an enthusiast, and, despite the big ears, doesn't listen worth a damn.

Mine adores me too (he's my second, and I have a Corgi/Bassett mix as well) - but once we're outside, forget it. If I don't have a leash, he couldn't care less what I'm trying to get him to do (or not do).

He's also got a BIG TIME herding instinct. Oy.

Is "Goon" your boy's name? I love that!

308 ConservatismNow!  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:58:03pm

re: #285 Killian Bundy

Yeah. I'm agreeing with KB here. Playboy's the classy one, not the cheap-as-free stuff I look at on my days off. Besides she did Playboy about 12 years ago or something like that. It's not to say that Jenny McCarthy is an intelligent, classy person. Her being in Playboy just has nothing to do with her son being autistic.

309 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:58:12pm

re: #282 Rakkasan

Maybe all of these anti-science/progress extremists - on both sides - will be happy to return to a time when the average lifespan was 35 years. Seriously, in their pursuit of a perfect, risk-free world, they might get us there.

Upding. I have some serious libtard friends, beautiful people otherwise, who did not vaccinate or even use real doctors. Their kids are great, too, although one of them had a serious medical condition as a young boy and they were taking him to naturopaths or whatever. I said, shoot, take him to the flippin' doctor.

310 Bloodnok  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:58:16pm

re: #299 realwest

and
re: #251 jaunte
Yeah, you could say it was a bad day.
According to Reuters (sorry but I inadvertently deleted the link) the House today passed the bill introduced by Barney Franks which provides that "management compensation and performance shall be fixed by the Congress of the United States for any company which took Federal Bail Out money or loans." This is retroactive; a bill of attainder. And while I'm almost literally sick to my stomach with rage over this CLASS WARFARE being promoted by Obama and the Democratic Party (not one Republican voted for the bill) I mostly regret asking friends - including some of you out here - to spend your time and money writing to your congresscritters to oppose this.
I apologize to all who took or followed my advice for wasting your time.

Sounds like you are as demoralized as I am these days. But voicing your opinions to Congress is NEVER a waste of time. Don't be sorry.

311 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:58:23pm

Anna Nicole Smith -----> Jenny McCarthy.

312 capitalist piglet  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:58:35pm

re: #242 realwest

Good evening y'all - hope everyone is doing better than I am tonight.

Are you okay? Would you rather not say what's going on?

313 VioletTiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:58:50pm

re: #299 realwest

and
re: #251 jaunte
Yeah, you could say it was a bad day.
According to Reuters (sorry but I inadvertently deleted the link) the House today passed the bill introduced by Barney Franks which provides that "management compensation and performance shall be fixed by the Congress of the United States for any company which took Federal Bail Out money or loans." This is retroactive; a bill of attainder. And while I'm almost literally sick to my stomach with rage over this CLASS WARFARE being promoted by Obama and the Democratic Party (not one Republican voted for the bill) I mostly regret asking friends - including some of you out here - to spend your time and money writing to your congresscritters to oppose this.
I apologize to all who took or followed my advice for wasting your time.


It's never a waste of time, real. We may not be successful this time, but we have to fight the good fight.

314 Mich-again  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:58:59pm

I don't think Jenny McCarthy is a hoo-ur. Just a bit uneducated.

315 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:59:12pm

re: #285 Killian Bundy
Or at least get a bus with MUCH BIGGER wheels and tires.

316 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:59:33pm

Night all- babies are ready for bed, and so am I:)

317 Boxy_brown  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:59:54pm

re: #311 Gus 802

Anna Nicole Smith -----> Jenny McCarthy.

Anna did more research into pharmaceuticals.

318 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 8:59:55pm

re: #304 LudwigVanQuixote

Thanks buddy.

I meant no insult, really, sorry if it sounded that way to you. Be proud of your old man. :)

319 Racer X  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:00:09pm

A man feared his wife Gloria wasn't hearing as well as she used to and he thought she might need a hearing aid. Not quite sure how to approach her, he called the family Doctor to discuss the problem.

The Doctor told him there is a simple informal test the husband
could perform to give the Doctor a better idea about her hearing loss. Here's what you do,' said the Doctor, 'stand about 40 feet away from her, and in a normal conversational speaking tone see if she hears you.. If not, go to 30 feet, then 20 feet, and so on until you get a response.'

That evening, the wife is in the kitchen cooking dinner, and he was in the den. He says to himself, 'I'm about 40 feet away, let's see what happens.' Then in a normal tone he asks, 'Honey, what's for dinner?'

No response.

So the husband moves closer to the kitchen, about 30 feet from his wife and repeats, 'Peg, what's for dinner?'

Still no response.

Next he moves into the dining room where he is about 20 feet from his wife and asks, 'Honey, what's for dinner?'

Again he gets no response.

So, he walks up to the kitchen door, about 10 feet away. 'Honey, what's for dinner?' Again there is no response.

So he walks right up behind her. 'Peg, what's for dinner?'

(I just love this)


'Frank , for the FIFTH Fuckin' time, CHICKEN!'

320 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:00:13pm

re: #316 DisturbedEma

Night all- babies are ready for bed, and so am I:)

Lilah Tov

321 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:00:17pm

re: #291 rain of lead
Hey great, glad to hear the good news! What was the problem?

322 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:00:45pm

re: #314 Mich-again

I don't think Jenny McCarthy is a hoo-ur. Just a bit uneducated.

Her bust is larger than her IQ by magnitudes.

323 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:00:56pm

re: #318 FurryOldGuyJeans

I meant no insult, really, sorry if it sounded that way to you. Be proud of your old man. :)

Oh my! I meant no sarcasm! I meant thanks, my friend, for complimenting my old man!

324 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:01:24pm

re: #317 Boxy_brown

Anna did more research into pharmaceuticals.

I don't care in the tend. She's an idiot.

325 jaunte  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:01:32pm

re: #299 realwest

I posted this on the previous thread, re:

"management compensation and performance shall be fixed by the Congress of the United States for any company which took Federal Bail Out money or loans."


Cavuto here interviews a Concresscritter who ducks any responsibility for letting the public know what the guidelines are for compensation and performance, and tells us that Geithner and Treasury will make all of those decisions.

326 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:01:38pm

re: #322 FurryOldGuyJeans

Her bust is larger than her IQ by magnitudes.

Both are mostly silicon - which is to say rocks?

327 rain of lead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:01:41pm

re: #294 Sharmuta

yes, a scan found and removed a virus but it left a tiny bit of corrupted
file that stopped windows from "seeing" IE, once I deleted that little bit...
all was good

328 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:01:58pm

re: #299 realwest

real, we're all going to fighting this disaster for several years. No need to apologize. They've got the semis backed up to the Treasury day and night and ain't much we can do about it until we DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.

329 Gella  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:02:02pm

as JM boobs got bigger, her brain got smaller

330 Last Mohican  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:02:08pm

re: #286 Mich-again

The simplest explanation is that the increased rate is caused by a change in how the diagnosis is made. If it were due to environmental conditions, genetics, diet, or other exposure, the pattern would have been identified by now.

But you can't identify patterns when the naming convention changes. That makes all the old data and the trends moot.

I've just been flipping through an interesting paper in the January 2009 issue of the journal Epidemiology (Volume 20, number 1, page 84), which does some rigorous quantitative analysis to try to figure out if one of these spurious reasons is responsible for the apparent increased in the prevalence of autism in California. Here is the last paragraph of the paper:

In summary, the incidence of autism rose 7- to 8-fold in
California from the early 1990s through the present. Quantitative
analysis of the changes in diagnostic criteria, the
inclusion of milder cases, and an earlier age at diagnosis
during this period suggests that these factors probably contribute
2.2-, 1.56-, and 1.24-fold increases in autism, respectively,
and hence cannot fully explain the magnitude of the
rise in autism. Differential migration also likely played a
minor role, if any. Wider awareness, greater motivation of
parents to seek services as a result of expanding treatment
options, and increased funding may each have contributed,
but documentation or quantification of these effects is lacking.
With no evidence of a leveling off, the possibility of a
true increase in incidence deserves serious consideration.

So basically, they conclude that changes in diagnostic criteria, earlier age at diagnosis, and inclusion of milder cases can't fully explain the increase in prevalence.

331 solomonpanting  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:02:22pm

re: #322 FurryOldGuyJeans

Her bust is larger than her IQ by magnitudes.

Hence, the description, boob.

332 itellu3times  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:02:23pm

re: #305 FurryOldGuyJeans

I see the reverse. Hillary is all about power.

Hillary as Shelob, I mean, really.

333 Rakkasan  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:02:33pm

re: #301 Dark_Falcon

I've met both of the Clintons. Have to say that Hillary is far more suited to the Sauron role.

334 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:03:14pm

re: #311 Gus 802

Anna Nicole Smith -----> Jenny McCarthy.

Not really. Jenny McCarthy is far worse. Anna Nicole only destroyed herself, Jenny's anti-vaccine jihad has the potential to kill thousands.

335 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:03:28pm

re: #323 LudwigVanQuixote

Oh my! I meant no sarcasm! I meant thanks, my friend, for complimenting my old man!

Oh man, time to get that crane to remove my foot I swallowed up to my thigh. ;)

You are more than welcome. :)

336 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:03:29pm

I mentioned my autistic nephew yesterday, and I wanted to add that because of my father's assistance to providing care for him and helping my sister, my dad has now gone on to pass a state examination to be a teaching assistant for special needs kids at the school district where he lives. It's wonderful because he's been out of work for awhile. Not only is he doing good in the community, he get to enjoy his work. Very positive things can come from family hardships. My nephew's autism helping my dad and thus helping other kids is just one example.

337 Boxy_brown  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:04:03pm

re: #324 Gus 802

I don't care in the tend. She's an idiot.

So I shouldn't get medical advice from Anna Nicole Smith either....

I have a pretty crappy health plan Gus, but it's not that bad.

338 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:04:03pm

re: #307 capitalist piglet

One of the great things about my late pooch pal was that, as a HERDER, she almost always came when she was called. She was more concerned with protecting her home and her people than anything else. Surprised that yours is a bolter.

339 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:04:14pm

re: #310 Bloodnok
Oh I'm not gonna shut up; I'm gonna keep on writing congresscritters even though it will do no good as long as the Democrats and Obama are in power, because it makes ME feel better.
I'm just sorry that I asked friends and some fellow LGFer's to join me and write to their Congresscritters.
That I won't do again.

340 Dragonwolf  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:04:20pm

re: #299 realwest

The only involvement in the political process that is wasted is that which never occurs.

Kinda like the only dumb question.......

341 Killian Bundy  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:04:26pm

re: #300 Gus 802

Oh to be honest I don't pay attention to any pop culture whores -- male or female. That would include Jenny McCarthy and others. I can't help myself in that regard.

I don't either. And she's wrong about vaccinations.

/but repeatedly posting that she's a FUCKING PORN WHORE is an asinine cheap shot, unworthy of the LGF discussion

342 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:04:29pm

re: #327 rain of lead

yes, a scan found and removed a virus but it left a tiny bit of corrupted
file that stopped windows from "seeing" IE, once I deleted that little bit...
all was good

Hey is this the having to reboot the computer once IE freezes? I have the same issue. How did you fix it? PLease tell me!

343 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:05:06pm

re: #335 FurryOldGuyJeans

Oh man, time to get that crane to remove my foot I swallowed up to my thigh. ;)

You are more than welcome. :)

Have no fear! I assume you mean well.

344 jaunte  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:05:12pm

re: #339 realwest

Don't worry about it; in fact, I'd say, keep it up. They need to hear more from us.

345 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:05:24pm

re: #334 Dark_Falcon

Not really. Jenny McCarthy is far worse. Anna Nicole only destroyed herself, Jenny's anti-vaccine jihad has the potential to kill thousands.

That's true.

346 Dragonwolf  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:05:47pm

re: #301 Dark_Falcon

Bill can be Saruman, Hillary is a Ring Wraith.

Are you sure about Hillary, she looks and sounds an awful lot like Gollum to me.

347 ConservatismNow!  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:06:30pm

re: #346 Dragonwolf

Are you sure about Hillary, she looks and sounds an awful lot like Gollum to me.

She sure thinks the White House is "her precious."

348 Bloodnok  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:06:36pm

re: #336 Sharmuta

I mentioned my autistic nephew yesterday, and I wanted to add that because of my father's assistance to providing care for him and helping my sister, my dad has now gone on to pass a state examination to be a teaching assistant for special needs kids at the school district where he lives. It's wonderful because he's been out of work for awhile. Not only is he doing good in the community, he get to enjoy his work. Very positive things can come from family hardships. My nephew's autism helping my dad and thus helping other kids is just one example.

My mother is a paraprofessional (Teacher's Aide) and works with special needs kids. To hear her talk about the kids she's able to "reach" that barely communicate with anyone else is awe inspiring. I wish him well. It is such a noble profession.

349 itellu3times  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:06:37pm

re: #342 LudwigVanQuixote

Hey is this the having to reboot the computer once IE freezes? I have the same issue. How did you fix it? PLease tell me!

I've always been able to use the task manager to kill IE without rebooting,fwiw.

350 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:06:50pm

re: #333 Rakkasan

I've met both of the Clintons. Have to say that Hillary is far more suited to the Sauron role.

The role is Saruman, and I agree, on reflection, that Hillary better fits the role. George Soros is Sauron, the evil mastermind who spawns and commands the forces of evil. The only big baddies in LotR he did not create are Saruman, the Balrog (both Maia spirits like him), and Shelob.

351 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:07:24pm

re: #339 realwest

Oh I'm not gonna shut up; I'm gonna keep on writing congresscritters even though it will do no good as long as the Democrats and Obama are in power, because it makes ME feel better.
I'm just sorry that I asked friends and some fellow LGFer's to join me and write to their Congresscritters.
That I won't do again.

Keep right on asking, real. I do write my reps and rarely get a reply, always a form bullshit form.

352 Dianna  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:07:51pm

I'm out.

353 VioletTiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:08:09pm

re: #346 Dragonwolf

Are you sure about Hillary, she looks and sounds an awful lot like Gollum to me.

I think the real problem is that we may succeed in casting the bad guys, but who the heck would we cast as the good guys? That would be tough right now.

354 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:08:18pm

Modern medicine has also saved my father's life more than a few times. Without it, my nephew and the kids in the district would be much poorer for the loss of a sympathetic friend and helper.

355 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:08:27pm

re: #294 Sharmuta

I'm glad it was an easier fix than having to reboot and all that junk.

Tell me how please!

356 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:08:32pm

re: #347 ConservatismNow!

These clowns are going to find themselves in some serious hotwater international crisis very soon, and the cockroaches are going to scatter for the dark places. Hilary is not going to be at State for long. She already looks like she hates it. She wanted to prez in the worst way.

357 Timbre  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:08:40pm

From what I read from the Texas House Research Organization, Texas is one of just a few states in 2003 to offer "Conscientious Objection to Immunization." There are a few later paragraphs which seem to indicate things have been getting better.

358 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:09:15pm

It's pretty sad that the spokespersons in America are represented by people like Jenny McCarthy. Doubly as sad are people like Oprah. I guess that's something we should expect since the President of the United States is Barack Obama.

Dumb and dumber.

359 Killian Bundy  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:09:17pm

From IBD:

What a difference geography makes when it comes to wireless firms touting their plans to roll out fourth-generation mobile phone technology.

The CTIA Wireless show, which started Wednesday in Las Vegas, is buzzing with talk of a 4G technology called LTE, for long-term evolution. U.S. carriers Verizon Wireless, MetroPCS PCS and CenturyTel CTL plan to upgrade their wireless networks to LTE, with Verizon likely the first in the world to do so.

/soon your brand new smartphone will be obsolete

360 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:09:18pm

re: #349 itellu3times

I've always been able to use the task manager to kill IE without rebooting,fwiw.

No I can't it is frozen. I can only reboot at that point. Task manager does not close it out.

361 Rakkasan  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:09:29pm

re: #347 ConservatismNow!

She sure thinks the White House is "her precious."


You got me there, right in mid-beer swig. Shall I send you a bill for my keyboard?

362 swamprat  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:09:32pm

re: #202 Gus 802

Missed your post.
Odd? I'd call it frightening. There are plenty of good laxatives, even back then.

363 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:09:39pm

re: #355 LudwigVanQuixote

Geek blog are your friend! Try punching your issue into google or whatever search engine you use. If there are comments- read them to make sure the fix has helped other people.

364 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:10:04pm

re: #362 swamprat

Missed your post.
Odd? I'd call it frightening. There are plenty of good laxatives, even back then.

Que?

365 swamprat  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:10:14pm

re: #362 swamprat

Damn. Mixed my tenses.

366 ConservatismNow!  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:10:21pm

re: #354 Sharmuta

Modern medicine has also saved my father's life more than a few times. Without it, my nephew and the kids in the district would be much poorer for the loss of a sympathetic friend and helper.

Modern medicine means my blood pressure is under control too. It also made my knee surgery an outpatient procedure and a month of rehab instead of 6 months.

367 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:10:33pm

re: #358 Gus 802

It's pretty sad that the spokespersons in America are represented by people like Jenny McCarthy. Doubly as sad are people like Oprah. I guess that's something we should expect since the President of the United States is Barack Obama.

Dumb and dumber.

Our insane celebrity worship culture. We basically elected Will Smith as president.

368 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:10:35pm

re: #363 Sharmuta

Geek blog are your friend! Try punching your issue into google or whatever search engine you use. If there are comments- read them to make sure the fix has helped other people.

Righto

369 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:10:47pm

re: #325 jaunte Thanks juante - I shoulda known y'all woulda been ahead of me on this.
But - considering that the 2008 Congress had and ELEVEN PERCENT APPROVAL RATING and STILL took raises and nearly $100,000 EACH in "expense money" I'm not really worried about THEIR standards for performance. I'm pissed off because they made this up AFTER THE FACT and it is sheer demagoguery to pit the "poor" against the "rich" just like NY AG Andrew Cuomo (*spit*) did when he released the names of the AIG officials who got bonuses.

370 ConservatismNow!  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:11:24pm

re: #361 Rakkasan

Send it to 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. I'm sure Obama will pick up the tab

371 Racer X  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:11:25pm

re: #358 Gus 802

It's pretty sad that the spokespersons in America are represented by people like Jenny McCarthy. Doubly as sad are people like Oprah. I guess that's something we should expect since the President of the United States is Barack Obama.

Dumb and dumber.

Someone pays Bill Ayers to educate college kids. On social justice no less.

372 swamprat  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:11:34pm

re: #364 Gus 802

On drinking mercury as a laxative.

373 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:11:45pm

re: #367 JohnAdams

Our insane celebrity worship culture. We basically elected Will Smith as president.

Will Smith might actually have more brains.

374 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:11:49pm

re: #334 Dark_Falcon

Not really. Jenny McCarthy is far worse. Anna Nicole only destroyed herself, Jenny's anti-vaccine jihad has the potential to kill thousands.

Lots more than thousands, my friend, I fear.

375 NY Nana  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:12:00pm

re: #116 Gus 802

And I received vaccinations. According to these people I should either be a) mentally handicapped or b) dead.

The ones who believe in that crap are the ones who should be afraid...they should be very afraid, as they, and their kids, if they have any, are the ones in danger.

I do not want to see anyone learn this the hard way, but they are leaving the barn door wide open. And children have no way of realizing that their parents are putting their own ignorance before the welfare of the children.

I still feel that there should be a Federal law mandating immunizations for all children, starting at 6 months of age, unless there is proof that there is an allergen of some kind in one or more of the individual shots.

The number of lives saved would be incalculable. Smallpox has been eradicated because of immunization, and having a Federal law mandating immunizations, along with the nearly useless WHO? Can you imagine what this would do?

376 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:12:12pm

anyway... I got to go to bed... Be well all... Lilah Tov.

377 Rakkasan  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:12:24pm

re: #350 Dark_Falcon

The role is Saruman, and I agree, on reflection, that Hillary better fits the role. George Soros is Sauron, the evil mastermind who spawns and commands the forces of evil. The only big baddies in LotR he did not create are Saruman, the Balrog (both Maia spirits like him), and Shelob.

I stand corrected. Yep, Soros as Sauron is right on the money. Can we go with Pelosi as Shelob?

378 capitalist piglet  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:12:42pm

re: #338 JohnAdams

One of the great things about my late pooch pal was that, as a HERDER, she almost always came when she was called. She was more concerned with protecting her home and her people than anything else. Surprised that yours is a bolter.

He doesn't bolt...what he does is try to protect our territory from the neighbors' dogs, on the other side of the fence. He is also extremely protective of me personally, and he tries to control whether I leave him home when I go places every now and then, by grabbing my jeans on the way out the door...not often, but when he's feeling especially desperate for me not to go.

My first Corgi did the same thing at the fence, and herded, but not like this guy.

Both smart as could be. My first one could pick out each toy by name. Aren't they awesome dogs?

379 itellu3times  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:13:42pm

re: #360 LudwigVanQuixote

No I can't it is frozen. I can only reboot at that point. Task manager does not close it out.

All I can do is quote my experience, haven't seen IE freeze the whole machine since XP. But I run fairly vanilla systems, load up whatever combination and of course all bets are off. Task manager will say, "not responding", you say kill, wait about ten seconds, and IE goes away.

380 Guanxi88  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:13:55pm

re: #2 Sharmuta

What about the shoes of people who have had to live with the diseases these vaccinations prevent?

Or, in the case of polio, their leg braces?

381 VioletTiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:13:56pm

Night all..getting sleepy. Sweet dreams.

382 jaunte  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:14:14pm

re: #369 realwest

They were there when the first TARP money went out, and they were there when they failed to read the legislation they signed for even more deficit spending. Maybe they think everyone will forget their dereliction of duty when they whip up some class warfare rhetoric, but we won't.

383 rain of lead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:14:15pm

re: #342 LudwigVanQuixote

my issue was different
after logon it would load a blank page...no icons, no start, no taskbar,
nuthin.... scary
sharmuta gave me a link to a geek blog here that might have an answer
for your problem

384 Dragonwolf  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:14:29pm

re: #353 VioletTiger

I think the real problem is that we may succeed in casting the bad guys, but who the heck would we cast as the good guys? That would be tough right now.

Charles would have to be our Gandalf.....

385 Tarkus289  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:15:01pm

Click on the processes tab, and find IE, click end process.

386 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:15:31pm

re: #372 swamprat

On drinking mercury as a laxative.

From wiki:

Mercury compounds have been used in antiseptics, laxatives, antidepressants, and in antisyphilitics

.

*SHUDDER*

387 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:15:33pm

re: #378 capitalist piglet

I love smart dogs, and a big part of dog intelligence to me is protecting the perimeter, as I call it! This one I have now is pretty clever, but not a herding dog. You give her an opening and she will bolt to the highway like it's heaven.

388 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:15:52pm

re: #374 davinvalkri

Lots more than thousands, my friend, I fear.

I have no intention of allowing that to happen. I fight anti-vaccine propaganda whenever I hear it. So does my father, as several of his siblings and their children. We know the truth and we'll fight to to defend it.

389 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:16:06pm

re: #375 NY Nana

The ones who believe in that crap are the ones who should be afraid...they should be very afraid, as they, and their kids, if they have any, are the ones in danger.

I do not want to see anyone learn this the hard way, but they are leaving the barn door wide open. And children have no way of realizing that their parents are putting their own ignorance before the welfare of the children.

I still feel that there should be a Federal law mandating immunizations for all children, starting at 6 months of age, unless there is proof that there is an allergen of some kind in one or more of the individual shots.

The number of lives saved would be incalculable. Smallpox has been eradicated because of immunization, and having a Federal law mandating immunizations, along with the nearly useless WHO? Can you imagine what this would do?

That's the crux of it all. The reason McCarthy makes this an issue is for selfish reasons. Society benefits more from immunizations then we do from worrying about her own personal problems.

390 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:16:14pm

re: #328 JohnAdams Well I reckon when enough Americans suddenly realize that the local branch bank manager has to take a cut in pay cause the higher ups took federal money and can therefore no longer pay his/her mortgage or rent or car financing or whatever, and then they stop getting paid mortgages, rent, car payments and the like, things will change somewhat.
I'm just truly SHOCKED and STUNNED that the Democractic Party has come out and played the "poor" vs. "rich" so blatantly; they feel they ARE the power and always will be. Once they are out of power and Republicans decide to start investigating the likes of Franks and Dodd (and quite a few others) for something they did that was legal before the Republicans made it illegal, then we'll get some justice. But I am, for a number of reasons, impatient about this.

391 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:16:37pm

re: #307 capitalist piglet

Mine adores me too (he's my second, and I have a Corgi/Bassett mix as well) - but once we're outside, forget it. If I don't have a leash, he couldn't care less what I'm trying to get him to do (or not do).

He's also got a BIG TIME herding instinct. Oy.

Is "Goon" your boy's name? I love that!

Our guy was in a world of his own off the leash. The only time I saw him respond to my husband is when we were walking around a reservoir close to our house. We came upon a young mother with a baby in a stroller surrounded by quite a few very pissed off Canadian geese. The mom was terrified and the baby was screaming. Ollie stood there looking at my husband who said" Go get 'em boy". The resulting mayhem was hilarious. Lickity split he had those geese literally running in the other direction honking their fat asses off. Canadian geese are not easily intimidated. He was our little hero that day.

392 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:16:44pm

re: #377 Rakkasan

I stand corrected. Yep, Soros as Sauron is right on the money. Can we go with Pelosi as Shelob?

Yes, that was proposed upthread and I agree with it.

393 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:17:11pm

re: #388 Dark_Falcon

I have no intention of allowing that to happen. I fight anti-vaccine propaganda whenever I hear it. So does my father, as several of his siblings and their children. We know the truth and we'll fight to to defend it.

That goes without saying doesn't it?

394 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:17:22pm

re: #384 Dragonwolf

Charles would have to be our Gandalf.....

With Sarah Palin as Galadriel.

395 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:18:11pm

re: #373 Gus 802

Will Smith might actually have more brains.

I saw his mug on a celeb magazine recently with the quote: "I remain open to possibility."

I thought: Open to possibility? You make 25 million a picture! He's still playing the strings of the old Racism Harp out of reflex.

396 Dragonwolf  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:18:19pm

re: #377 Rakkasan

I stand corrected. Yep, Soros as Sauron is right on the money. Can we go with Pelosi as Shelob?

No she's too unstable. She's more like the head mutant orc that Saruman sent out after the fellowship. The one who killed Borimir (sp?)

397 capitalist piglet  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:18:34pm

re: #387 JohnAdams

I love smart dogs, and a big part of dog intelligence to me is protecting the perimeter, as I call it! This one I have now is pretty clever, but not a herding dog. You give her an opening and she will bolt to the highway like it's heaven.

Good luck! Sounds like you'll have to watch her very closely!

398 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:19:31pm

re: #393 davinvalkri

That goes without saying doesn't it?

I wish it did. The problem is that too many people don't challenge propaganda like that because they don't want a fight. I don't want one either, but I know that failing to fight will result in a even worse outcome.

399 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:19:46pm

re: #384 Dragonwolf

Charles would have to be our Gandalf.....

Charles could also be Frodo, the unassuming dude that has the fate of civilization dumped on his shoulders and soldiers on tirelessly anyway.

400 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:19:49pm

re: #353 VioletTiger

I think the real problem is that we may succeed in casting the bad guys, but who the heck would we cast as the good guys? That would be tough right now.

All us LGF men, and all the other sane people on the internet and around the world, will be the army that marches on Mordor.
And we will call down carpet bombing on it.
And then we will call down artillery, attack helos, and all the other implements of modern warfare.
And then we will cut the forces of hyper-emotionalism and anti-science to pieces with our own science.

401 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:20:10pm

re: #396 Dragonwolf

No she's too unstable. She's more like the head mutant orc that Saruman sent out after the fellowship. The one who killed Borimir (sp?)

Lur, the Fighting Uruk-Hai.

402 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:21:06pm

re: #395 JohnAdams

I saw his mug on a celeb magazine recently with the quote: "I remain open to possibility."

I thought: Open to possibility? You make 25 million a picture! He's still playing the strings of the old Racism Harp out of reflex.

I was being facetious. Most actors are stupid including Will Smith.

403 doppelganglander  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:21:17pm

re: #395 JohnAdams

I saw his mug on a celeb magazine recently with the quote: "I remain open to possibility."

I thought: Open to possibility? You make 25 million a picture! He's still playing the strings of the old Racism Harp out of reflex.

He's being wooed by Tom Cruise to join Scientology, and may already be a member. Another Grade A Hollywood dope.

404 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:21:35pm

re: #344 jaunte Huh, well see my # 390. Americans clearly wanted Change in 2008. They majority may even have wanted socialism.
But when the reality hits an awful lot of people who voted for Obama and the Dems that they are gonna LOSE money, the political atmosphere will change, equally as quickly and clearly.

405 rain of lead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:21:50pm

re: #384 Dragonwolf

Charles would have to be our Gandalf.....


but....would he be the Grey or the White?

406 Dragonwolf  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:21:54pm

re: #399 FurryOldGuyJeans

Charles could also be Frodo, the unassuming dude that has the fate of civilization dumped on his shoulders and soldiers on tirelessly anyway.

Very true, I stand corrected. And members of the lizard army could swap off as Merri, Pippin, and Samwise.

407 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:22:08pm

re: #402 Gus 802

I know.

408 ConservatismNow!  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:22:27pm

I'd cast zombie, Mark Steyn, and Michael Yon as Gimli, Legolas, and Aragorn. Doesn't matter who. Rush Limbaugh is Elrond.

409 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:23:11pm

re: #406 Dragonwolf

Very true, I stand corrected. And members of the lizard army could swap off as Merri, Pippin, and Samwise.

Besides, Frodo IS the focus of the trilogy and the defacto hero.

410 capitalist piglet  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:23:11pm

re: #391 Bobblehead

Our guy was in a world of his own off the leash. The only time I saw him respond to my husband is when we were walking around a reservoir close to our house. We came upon a young mother with a baby in a stroller surrounded by quite a few very pissed off Canadian geese. The mom was terrified and the baby was screaming. Ollie stood there looking at my husband who said" Go get 'em boy". The resulting mayhem was hilarious. Lickity split he had those geese literally running in the other direction honking their fat asses off. Canadian geese are not easily intimidated. He was our little hero that day.

Great story! Yay!

I've often wondered if I could put mine to work down at Sea-Tac airport; they've hired dogs to keep birds away, and mine LOVES to go after birds. He barks at them and chases them...and on the beach, he loves to scare the seagulls away.

Once, I was saying to him, "Lou! Get the birdie! Get the birdie!" (just a game we play to get him to run around) and he came around the corner with a bird in his mouth. I screamed like I was in a horror movie; my friend had to come get it and make sure it was not suffering and get rid of it - yikes. (Only happened once.)

411 NY Nana  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:23:19pm

re: #319 Racer X

Hey, have you been listening to my NY Grampa talking to me?

ROTFL! Except for the wife's name? Exactly what happens here.

412 Gus  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:23:41pm

re: #341 Killian Bundy

I don't either. And she's wrong about vaccinations.

/but repeatedly posting that she's a FUCKING PORN WHORE is an asinine cheap shot, unworthy of the LGF discussion

I was just dovetailing. You do know what I mean right?

413 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:24:18pm

re: #351 FurryOldGuyJeans
Well then let me ask you this: if y'all keep writing to 'em and rarely get a reply and when you do it's just a form letter, why do you keep writing them?

414 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:24:49pm

re: #408 ConservatismNow!

I'd cast zombie, Mark Steyn, and Michael Yon as Gimli, Legolas, and Aragorn. Doesn't matter who. Rush Limbaugh is Elrond.

No, General Petraeus is Aragorn. When he runs for president and wins, the analogy will be near perfect.

415 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:25:30pm

re: #404 realwest

The Dems and Obama seized upon a perfect storm of voter unrest and ignorance, with a candidate who is straight out of central casting for class warfare types. I do worry like you that they are rushing in a catastrophic agenda under the guise of "crisis."

416 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:25:30pm

Hello Night Lizards! It was actually kinda nice today in Near Iowa.

Why don't more people take the path of Augusto Odone and ACTUALLY use that wonderful brain Charles talks about.

I guess it's easier to buy and sell snake oil. Perhaps it just feels better.

How are you-all and what are we talking about?

417 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:25:44pm

re: #25 Dianna

I wondered about the old idea of changelings, after dealing with my nephew.

I never thought of that. It would make so much sense.

We once had a guest speaker at my high school with MPD. I have never wondered where the notion of possession by demons came from since then.

418 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:27:01pm

re: #416 ggt

How are you-all and what are we talking about?

Lord of the Rings and which political figures we would cast as good guys and bad guys therein.

419 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:27:07pm

re: #354 Sharmuta Hey Sharm - I just wanted to say congrat's to your Dad
for passing that exam and becoming a teaching assistant for special needs kids. I think that's just a wonderful thing!

420 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:27:09pm

re: #404 realwest

Huh, well see my # 390. Americans clearly wanted Change in 2008. They majority may even have wanted socialism.
But when the reality hits an awful lot of people who voted for Obama and the Dems that they are gonna LOSE money, the political atmosphere will change, equally as quickly and clearly.

I am beginning to think that the majority of people want a king.

421 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:27:37pm

re: #413 realwest

Well then let me ask you this: if y'all keep writing to 'em and rarely get a reply and when you do it's just a form letter, why do you keep writing them?

Because to get the form letter means one person saw what I wrote enough to know where to send the boilerplate back.

And if I purposefully remain mute and not tell my employee what I want them to do in my name then I have no right to bitch when they fuck up.

422 Momzilla  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:27:42pm

You'd have to be crazy to live in a border state or any area with a large illegal immigrant population and not get your children vaccinated against the more common contagious viral diseases. Sometimes you have to weigh risk v. benefit.

I had my children vaccinated against everything except Hep B. When that one became mandatory, I wasn't convinced that it had been sufficiently tested for safety and have concerns relative its relationship as a cause or contributing factor in MS and other autoimmune diseases. Risk of exposure nearly nonexistent, and risk to others of having my child in a classroom without this vaccine entirely nonexistent. If one of them enters a health care related career field, then that risk v. benefit balance changes. Our doctor did not disagree with our decision.

Chicken pox vaccine wasn't an issue. By the time that one became recommended (and before it was required in our state) we'd already survived the great chickenpox epidemic of 1994.

423 NY Nana  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:28:41pm

re: #411 NY Nana

Hey, have you been listening to my NY Grampa talking to me?

Note to me: NY Grampa is my husband! Honest. He has put up with me for over 46 years, poor man....it will be 47 years in almost exactly 6 months.

PIMF!

424 Throbert McGee  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:28:49pm

Say what you will about Jenny McCarthy, it's that bitch Phoebe Cates that I really hate (for taking Kevin Kline off the market).

/he will always be The Pirate King to me...

425 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:28:54pm

re: #418 Dark_Falcon

Lord of the Rings and which political figures we would cast as good guys and bad guys therein.

George Soros as ? Sauron?

426 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:29:00pm

re: #29 doppelganglander

Autism is much more prevalent among boys. Since boys and girls are vaccinated at the same rate, there's obviously something other than the vaccine at work.

People have pointed out that Aspergers, which is seen as part of the autism 'spectrum' is, in some ways, just exaggerated male intellectual behavior. The high specialization, the lack of verbalization, the fascination with patterns, the difficulty negotiating emotional nuances...

427 Dragonwolf  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:29:32pm

re: #413 realwest

Well then let me ask you this: if y'all keep writing to 'em and rarely get a reply and when you do it's just a form letter, why do you keep writing them?

Because when they have come to Milwaukee and take time to speak to us lowly volunteers, they tell us that when they are considering how there constituents feel about a topic they give each email 1 point of influence, they give each phone call 100 points of influence, and if you actually take the time to write a letter they give that 10000 points of influence. So though they don't let you know, one written letter will carry more weight in their decision making than many phone calls and masses of emails.

428 Tarkus289  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:29:58pm

Latest blather from big mikey moore

latest from michael moore

429 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:30:01pm

re: #425 ggt

George Soros as ? Sauron?

Already been proposed, seconded and confirmed.

430 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:30:02pm

re: #426 SanFranciscoZionist

People have pointed out that Aspergers, which is seen as part of the autism 'spectrum' is, in some ways, just exaggerated male intellectual behavior. The high specialization, the lack of verbalization, the fascination with patterns, the difficulty negotiating emotional nuances...

I think, reading this thread, I'm going to turn into a hypochondriac.

431 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:30:45pm

re: #410 capitalist piglet

That's funny. Be careful what you ask for next time.

432 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:30:53pm

re: #429 FurryOldGuyJeans

Already been proposed, seconded and confirmed.

Then I guess I can't contribute anymore to that part of the thread. Any proposals for Karl Rove?

433 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:31:04pm

re: #371 Racer X
Hey Racer X - thanks for reminding me that you and me and several other LGFer's were successful in getting him dis-invited from speaking at Naperville North High School!
Course I don't even know if he was gonna get paid and he does come from family wealth, but still the good guys won one!
Thanks.

434 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:31:56pm

re: #426 SanFranciscoZionist

People have pointed out that Aspergers, which is seen as part of the autism 'spectrum' is, in some ways, just exaggerated male intellectual behavior. The high specialization, the lack of verbalization, the fascination with patterns, the difficulty negotiating emotional nuances...

Wow, you just described me to a T. :%P%

435 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:33:00pm

re: #433 realwest

Hey Racer X - thanks for reminding me that you and me and several other LGFer's were successful in getting him dis-invited from speaking at Naperville North High School!
Course I don't even know if he was gonna get paid and he does come from family wealth, but still the good guys won one!
Thanks.

Naperville North is not too terriblly far (by Chicagoland standards) from where I am. The next suburb over. A lot of "wanna-be rich North Siders" live there. Mostly normal people tho --nice place in a lot of ways.

436 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:33:08pm

re: #420 ggt

I am beginning to think that the majority of people want a king.

Rush mentioned that yesterday. It is his feeling that the majority of Americans seem to be comfortable with what he called "soft tyranny".

437 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:33:10pm

re: #425 ggt

George Soros as Sauron?

That one has been universally agreed to.

438 Dragonwolf  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:33:10pm

To sleep, perchance to dream.

Good night lizards, y'all are great.

439 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:33:15pm

This topic, and the conspiracy nuts it offends, keeps a certain phrase hammering in on and on in my brain:

Correlation is not causation.

440 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:33:34pm

re: #382 jaunte

They were there when the first TARP money went out, and they were there when they failed to read the legislation they signed for even more deficit spending. Maybe they think everyone will forget their dereliction of duty when they whip up some class warfare rhetoric, but we won't.


AMEN to that one my friend, and we won't allow others to forget, either.

441 Bloodnok  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:33:43pm

Good Night All!

442 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:34:20pm

re: #420 ggt

I am beginning to think that the majority of people want a king.

True sign of coming disaster.

443 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:34:50pm

re: #430 davinvalkri

I think, reading this thread, I'm going to turn into a hypochondriac.

Try reading a professional Merck Manual. You'll have every disease known to mankind.

444 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:35:54pm

re: #420 ggt

I am beginning to think that the majority of people want a king.

Certainly didn't do the ancient Israelites a whole lot of good, now did it?

445 doppelganglander  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:36:04pm

re: #426 SanFranciscoZionist

People have pointed out that Aspergers, which is seen as part of the autism 'spectrum' is, in some ways, just exaggerated male intellectual behavior. The high specialization, the lack of verbalization, the fascination with patterns, the difficulty negotiating emotional nuances...

Interesting point. I do think that supports the notion that the autistic spectrum concept draws in large numbers of people who would never have been considered to have a disorder until, perhaps, 30 years ago. Before that, they were just considered oddballs.

446 NY Nana  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:36:38pm

re: #425 ggt

How about this for that POS?

447 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:36:44pm

re: #436 Bobblehead

Rush mentioned that yesterday. It is his feeling that the majority of Americans seem to be comfortable with what he called "soft tyranny".

I've been trying to think lately (I know, a dangerous thing) about at what point a society becomes too large to be a de facto democracy. I know that the US is not a democracy. Meaning, at some point the situation becomes so complex that "the people" simply must delegate part of the decision making process and hope it turns out OK.

In the case of the US--being a constitutional republic--my thinking goes wonky.

448 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:37:21pm

re: #440 realwest

Real, I ran across this today and thought of you since you were very interested in my post on Harold Koh, legal adviser to State.

And Then They Came for Koh ...

From Slate, fwiw.

449 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:37:24pm

re: #428 Tarkus289

Latest blather from big mikey moore

latest from michael moore

GM has been one of the biggest, if not THE biggest, employer of people on this earth for 100 years.

Michael Moore deserves a place in the Douchebag Hall of Fame.

450 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:37:35pm

re: #446 NY Nana

How about this for that POS?

Nah, Dr. Evil is actually funny.

451 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:37:52pm

re: #446 NY Nana

How about this for that POS?

teehee

452 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:39:35pm

re: #387 JohnAdams
and
re: #397 capitalist piglet
Do either of you two ever watch the "Dog Whisperer" on NatGeo TV? He really is a genius when it comes to working with dogs - or as he says "I rehabilitate dogs, I train humans."
Being OVERLY territorial and personally protective can be signs that your dog isn't getting what it needs AS A DOG. And can lead to other problmes down the road.

453 HelloDare  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:39:54pm
454 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:40:36pm

...

455 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:40:37pm

Many thanks for the hat tip, Charles! Thanks to the magic of LGF search, I was able to determine that this is #20, dating back to December 16th 2003.

456 Dustyvet  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:41:11pm

A King sent out an edict that all his noblemen should swear allegiance to his name and pay him a tribute in gold pieces every year on pain of death. Many Dukes and Barons agreed and handed over the gold pieces directly, for he was known to be a ruthless and terrible ruler. But there was one Count, although he was happy to swear his allegiance, steadfastly refused to pay the tribute. The King was troubled as to what to do, for he was very fond of this particular Count, so he threw him into jail, telling him he had a week to change his mind before he would be executed.

At the end of a week, the King asked the Count if he would pay the money now rather than lose his life, but the Count said no � he would rather die.

"Very well", said the King, you shall be beheaded at dawn tomorrow.

Dawn came, and the Count was taken to the castle roof, where a chopping block was in place and a tall executioner in a black robe was standing waiting with a large axe. Once again the King spoke to the Count: "This is your last chance - will you pay me?"

"No, never!", he replied. At this the King gave the signal to the executioner. The Count layed down with his neck on the block, and the executioner stood beside him and raised up his mighty axe. Just as he started his swing, the Count let out a mighty cry: "Stop! I'll pay!" But it was too late - the axe fell and his head was sliced off and fell to the ground in a pool of blood.

The moral of the story is, of course, clear:

You should never hatchet your Counts until they've chickened!

457 Last Mohican  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:41:54pm

re: #453 HelloDare

Will Smith told Vanity Fair that ''possibly AIDS was created as a result of biological-warfare testing.''

It's the sort of thing that one might be forced to conclude, if one didn't understand how viruses evolve.

458 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:41:55pm

re: #453 HelloDare

Will Smith told Vanity Fair that ''possibly AIDS was created as a result of biological-warfare testing.''

Well, then it's a pretty sucky biological warfare weapon then! LOL!
But seriously, is there something in the water in Hollywood, DC, parts of Canada and the rest of the world that causes people to buy this crap?

459 Bobblehead  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:41:58pm

re: #447 ggt

I've been trying to think lately (I know, a dangerous thing) about at what point a society becomes too large to be a de facto democracy. I know that the US is not a democracy. Meaning, at some point the situation becomes so complex that "the people" simply must delegate part of the decision making process and hope it turns out OK.

In the case of the US--being a constitutional republic--my thinking goes wonky.

I worry about what it might take to knock the country out of its lethargy. Maybe nothing; and that's even more worrisome.

460 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:42:59pm

re: #421 FurryOldGuyJeans
"And if I purposefully remain mute and not tell my employee what I want them to do in my name then I have no right to bitch when they fuck up."
Only change I'd make is to delete the word "purposefully".

461 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:43:15pm

re: #97 davinvalkri

*Checks mirror, checks Asperger syndrome symptom list*
Uh-oh.

It's not degenerative. I wouldn't worry about it.

462 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:44:16pm

re: #461 SanFranciscoZionist

It's not degenerative. I wouldn't worry about it.

Yeah I know. But I do a lot of little jokey self-diagnoses with myself, and I usually turn out to be utterly insane.

463 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:44:54pm

re: #453 HelloDare

Will Smith told Vanity Fair that ''possibly AIDS was created as a result of biological-warfare testing.''

If this country is going down a dangerous road, then Cali is going to get there first. I wonder what these Hollywood narcissists are going to think when gangsters come to take over their Bel Air mansions.

464 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:45:04pm

re: #109 Occasional Reader

Refrain? Damn, if you can shoot me here, from California, you ARE a good shot.

"Can your man really shoot that far?"

"Him? I never saw him before in my life!"

NAME THAT BAD MOVIE!

465 HelloDare  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:45:59pm

Rumor in African American culture

* "Jewish doctors were injecting black babies with AIDS"
o Steve Cokely, 1989, while quoting other various medical records, while an aide to Mayor Eugene Sawyer of Chicago

* "The AIDS virus had been invented by Jewish doctors to kill black babies"
o Steve Cokely, 1991 on Los Angeles' KPFK-FM, of the Pacifica Radio network, responding to a caller speaking about Ed Hooper's book, The River: A journey back to the source of HIV and AIDS which pointed about many of the Doctors mentioned has Jewish surnames., . [1]

* "(AIDS was) started by human beings to get after certain people they don't like."
o Bill Cosby, December 4, 1991 edition of The New York Post

* "A real-life Frankenstein started the disease. I believe AIDS has been man-made. AIDS was started by human beings - maybe even one person - in a Frankenstein sort of way to get certain people they didn't like.'"
o Bill Cosby, 1991, National Enquirer interview

* "I'm convinced AIDS is a government-engineered disease. They got one thing wrong, they never realized it couldn't just be contained to the groups it was intended to wipe out. So, now it's a national priority. Exactly like drugs when they escaped the urban centers into white suburbia."
o Spike Lee, November 1992 issue of Rolling Stone

* "Although I am a biologist, I have not done any research. I may not be able to say who developed the (HIV) virus but it was meant to wipe out the Black race"
o 2004 Nobel Peace Prize winning Kenyan activist Wangari Maathai, founder of the Green Belt Movement in the October 9, 2004 issue of East African Standard

* "Possibly AIDS was created as a result of biological-warfare testing."
o actor Will Smith in July 1999 Vanity Fair

* “Certain biowarfare weapons have been specifically designed to target and kill certain ethnic and racial groups.”
o columnist Tony Brown

* "As an African-American who knows something about our history, I can't rule out conspiracy as regards AIDS or crack"
o Mark Riley, New York radio talk show host

* "(AIDS is) a man-made disease designed to kill us all."
o Louis Farrakhan

466 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:47:03pm

re: #422 Momzilla Well I'd add that if you live in a state with a large illegal immgrant population, you ought to get tested for TB, too.
Very good friend of mine contracted TB (non-infectious) and he's on meds to kill it for a looong time.
And at least you're looking at vaccines and trying to understand them; blanketly condemning them - especially saying they cause autism - is just whacko.
BTW, just cause you had chicken pox or the vaccine, doesn't mean you can't get SHINGLES from someone who does have chickenpox! I know from sad and painful experience.

467 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:47:06pm

re: #460 realwest

"And if I purposefully remain mute and not tell my employee what I want them to do in my name then I have no right to bitch when they fuck up."
Only change I'd make is to delete the word "purposefully".

Remaining mute or not is a choice, and exercising a choice shows purpose of thought and action, hence why I used purposefully. ;)

468 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:47:08pm

re: #129 Racer X

Why is there such a huge increase of cases of Autism in California, and not in other places?

I don't think the stats are higher in California--are they? Anyone?

469 NY Nana  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:47:50pm

re: #450 davinvalkri

Nah, Dr. Evil is actually funny.

Excellent point. There is not one good thing that anyone could say re that nazi collaborator, and the picture of true evil. As a Jew? Not only does he offend me, but what he has done over the years is beyond any kind of forgiving IMHO.

My Mum zt"l always told me to look for at least one good thing to say about a person. There is not any thing good about him to say. And what I would say? [Deleted.]

When his time comes, G-d will take care of him, and he will pay for what he did. *Spit*

470 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:47:51pm

re: #463 JohnAdams

If this country is going down a dangerous road, then Cali is going to get there first. I wonder what these Hollywood narcissists are going to think when gangsters come to take over their Bel Air mansions.

That's a fake question; Those empty-headed idiots don't think, period.

471 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:48:33pm

re: #465 HelloDare

Rumor in African American culture

* "A real-life Frankenstein started the disease. I believe AIDS has been man-made. AIDS was started by human beings - maybe even one person - in a Frankenstein sort of way to get certain people they didn't like.'"
o Bill Cosby, 1991, National Enquirer interview


I'm going to be generous and assume he's loosely trying to implicate the theoretical Patient Zero. If he isn't, BILL COSBY, WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU?!

472 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:49:10pm

re: #468 SanFranciscoZionist

This was posted earlier.

473 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:51:28pm

re: #427 Dragonwolf Yeah, but y'all need to FAX that letter - my congresswoman told me that letters still going through a screening process (x-ray, anthrax and explosive analyisis) at the capital. She told me that she pays more attention to Faxed letters (which tend to be more timely) because anyone can send an e-mail if they are just momentarily pissed off and the same with phone calls (the exception being, she told me, was if the e-mail was not only polite but offered some "clear thinking" about an issue even clear thinking that she doesn't agree with).

474 NY Nana  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:51:39pm

re: #451 ggt

/I was being waaaay too kind.

475 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:51:50pm

re: #469 NY Nana

I was bummed to find that Soros was a Jew. Because I think it feeds the loons who somehow believe that a small minority population (16 million?) are controlling the entire world. However in Soros' case I think it really is true--not because he's a Jew, but because he's a billionaire with a very active agenda.

476 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:52:42pm

re: #435 ggt Hey ggt! How are you doing tonight?

477 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:52:48pm

re: #254 Alouette

Sheikh Yassin, the Hamas terrorist in a wheelchair who was sent to Allah by the IDF a few years ago, was a dead ringer for Saruman.

My God, so he was. Or rather, a dead ringer for Christopher Lee in a long white beard, I suppose.

478 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:53:53pm

re: #436 Bobblehead
Good evening Bobblehead! Do you think he meant a "Nanny State" when he said ""soft tyranny".?

479 funky chicken  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:53:55pm
The reason kooks and hucksters gravitate toward this subject is because they’re vampires, feeding on the pain of parents with autistic children. They know that these parents are vulnerable, and looking desperately for answers, and they tap on the bedroom window and give them easy answers and people to blame. And far too many parents invite them in.

Am I “gleeful” about this? Am I “crapping” on families with autistic children?

No. I’m nauseated. This is one of the worst things human beings are capable of — exploiting the pain of vulnerable people for profit.

Another group of people just like the autism/vaccine hucksters is the "live POW/MIA activist" crowd. Two prominent names--Sampley and Kiley. Sadly, just like the anti-vacc crowd, these hucksters have some very powerful friends, so they won't be punished for their behavior.

disgusting

480 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:54:02pm

re: #472 pink freud

This was posted earlier.

That graph shows the prevalence all over the board. Could it be a matter of diagnosis? Doctors actually looking for something to diagnose, better testing or University Medical Centers that have an autism focus?

481 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:54:05pm

re: #475 JohnAdams

I was bummed to find that Soros was a Jew. Because I think it feeds the loons who somehow believe that a small minority population (16 million?) are controlling the entire world. However in Soros' case I think it really is true--not because he's a Jew, but because he's a billionaire with a very active agenda.

He is a traitor, a kapo who collaborated with the Nazis.

482 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:55:08pm

re: #476 realwest

Hey ggt! How are you doing tonight?

Hangin' in there RW, Thanks for askin'. How YOU doin'?

483 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:57:02pm

re: #301 Dark_Falcon

Bill can be Saruman, Hillary is a Ring Wraith.

Not a lot of good roles for women in LOTR, really.

Diana Wynne Jones comments, in her Tough Guide to Fantasyland, that for some reason it is always a Dark Lord, never a Dark Lady. She assumes that this is because the Management (her term for fantasy writers) believe women are inadequate to the role of great evil. She further assumes that this is because the Management are too young to ever have met DWJ's Great-Aunt Clara.

484 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:57:45pm

re: #475 JohnAdams

I was bummed to find that Soros was a Jew. Because I think it feeds the loons who somehow believe that a small minority population (16 million?) are controlling the entire world. However in Soros' case I think it really is true--not because he's a Jew, but because he's a billionaire with a very active agenda.

Soros is no Jew to this Goy.

485 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:59:07pm

re: #483 SanFranciscoZionist

Not a lot of good roles for women in LOTR, really.

Diana Wynne Jones comments, in her Tough Guide to Fantasyland, that for some reason it is always a Dark Lord, never a Dark Lady. She assumes that this is because the Management (her term for fantasy writers) believe women are inadequate to the role of great evil. She further assumes that this is because the Management are too young to ever have met DWJ's Great-Aunt Clara.

You need to read some David Eddings then. His Polgara the Sorceress is one WICKED lady.

486 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 9:59:40pm

Trope time!
re: #483 SanFranciscoZionist

Maybe it correlates to this?

487 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:01:08pm

Well, I had to log in because I couldn't not upding a post about Polgara.

Just wanted to add a thank you to Charles for being willing to take crap on a very important issue.

It's not polio vs. autism. There is no proof of this.

488 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:02:04pm

re: #483 SanFranciscoZionist

What about Femme Fatales? Or is this just limited to LOTR/Fantasy?

489 JohnAdams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:02:42pm

re: #484 FurryOldGuyJeans

Soros is no Jew to this Goy.

One Goy to another, glad to hear it. I've learned a great deal about the Jewish predicament from LGF. I don't let anybody get away with it when they start banging on the Jews.

490 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:02:57pm

re: #448 pink freud
Hey my friend - if y'all remember, imposing sharia law was fairly far down on my list of complaints about him. His willingness to "integrate" "International Law" when interpreting OUR Constitution was my number one bitch about about him and of course, Slate being Slate, they never mentioned that. And indeed, if Justice Ginsberg should need to step down for health reasons (and I honestly hope she doesn't) and Obama somehow picked Koh the SCOTUS wouldn't miss a beat.
BTW, has Slate ever run an article harshly critical of how women are treated under Sharia law? Somehow I doubt it.

491 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:04:07pm

re: #430 davinvalkri

I think, reading this thread, I'm going to turn into a hypochondriac.

There's a scene in Dan Savage's book about adopting his son, when he and his lover are researching fetal alcohol syndrome, and come to the conclusion, after much reading, that they both have it.

492 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:04:46pm

re: #487 EmmmieG

Well, I had to log in because I couldn't not upding a post about Polgara.

Just out of curiosity, have you read all 13 books, including The Rivan Codex?

493 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:05:18pm

re: #490 realwest

Exactly! You echoed my thoughts as I read that piece also. Koh is bad news, imo.

494 itellu3times  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:05:24pm

re: #420 ggt

I am beginning to think that the majority of people want a king.

Did you know Obama carries an elvish sword?

495 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:06:02pm

re: #456 Dustyvet
Auuugh Dusty I just hadda downding you on that one my friend! That was just, just...........funny as hell and I'm going back and upding ya!

496 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:06:32pm

re: #492 FurryOldGuyJeans

Just out of curiosity, have you read all 13 books, including The Rivan Codex?

Repeatedly. So has my husband, so has my daughter.

I've also read the other series, the one with six books.

My favorite fan quote: You known you've read too much David Eddings if you've ever held a blue plastic Easter egg in your hand and tried to crack the world.

497 sngnsgt  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:06:57pm
498 davinvalkri  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:07:21pm

re: #494 itellu3times

Did you know Obama carries an elvish sword?

Maybe not an elvish sword, but he DOES smoke...hmm...

The last guy nearly ruined this place cause he didn't know what to do with it.
If you think the country's bad off not just wait till I get through with it!

The country's taxes must be fixed and I know what to do with it.
If you think you're paying too much now, just wait till I get through with it!

Blame your avatar.

499 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:07:39pm

re: #458 davinvalkri And New England - please don't forget New England! And I'm CONVINCED that there's something in the water or the air up there! LOL!

500 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:08:33pm

re: #445 doppelganglander

Interesting point. I do think that supports the notion that the autistic spectrum concept draws in large numbers of people who would never have been considered to have a disorder until, perhaps, 30 years ago. Before that, they were just considered oddballs.

Further, I suspect that in some cultures they would have been/probably still are considered extremely special in a positive way. An Aspergers kid makes a terrific Talmud student, or fills a role in any of the complicated intellectual hierarchies of old Irish society. Their memories are often spectacular.

501 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:08:34pm

re: #483 SanFranciscoZionist

Not a lot of good roles for women in LOTR, really.

Diana Wynne Jones comments, in her Tough Guide to Fantasyland, that for some reason it is always a Dark Lord, never a Dark Lady. She assumes that this is because the Management (her term for fantasy writers) believe women are inadequate to the role of great evil. She further assumes that this is because the Management are too young to ever have met DWJ's Great-Aunt Clara.

"the Management" has never heard Shakespeare's line "Hell hath no fury"?

Or of Medusa?

502 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:08:35pm

This subject makes me very angry, which is why I've not commented. Charles, you're the man. The industry surrounding the autism/vacc hoax is huge.

I'm sure, in 5 threads on the topic, someone has posted this, I didn't read the threads.

Evidence against an "autism epidemic"
The article refers to and quotes a recent article in the journal Pediatrics called "The Contribution of Diagnostic Substitution to the Growing Administrative Prevalence of Autism in US Special Education".

It should be read by anyone who cares about this. It is systemic, and endemic, the counting and diagnosis distortions. In my opinion, these are the same people who want everyone on antidepressants, the same people who want all the kids on ADD/ADHD pills. They are the state psychologists and social workers. You are always a victim, we will find you someone to blame, we will rob from them, and you, and we will be paid by the taxpayers to do so.

I have long suspected this, maybe I heard a rumor a few years ago, but I was glad to find the article. What I long suspected was that as official diagnoses and classifications such as for education for "mental retardation" and for "learning disabled" have gone down, the same for "autism" has gone up, at the exact. same. rate.

The STATE and its socialist socialworker orgs has been hoodwinking the public for a long, long time now. It is also like a hydra.

503 NY Nana  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:09:21pm

re: #481 Kosh's Shadow

He is a traitor, a kapo who collaborated with the Nazis.

Exactly. This is what I had to say.

I have to get some things ready to take to Brooklyn today, earlier than usual, and we also have to go to LI, to finish nearly all our Passover shopping. And going to Brooklyn is the perfect excuse to see the 2 1/2 year old grandson! ;)

Passover shopping this year is not the same as usual...a lot of products that are staples are not available. Very frustrating. We live near the CT border, but Brooklyn and LI have some things we just cannot find here, and even there, not all is made any more. Very puzzling.

G'nite, all. Sweet dreams!

504 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:09:32pm

re: #496 EmmmieG

Repeatedly. So has my husband, so has my daughter.

I've also read the other series, the one with six books.

My favorite fan quote: You known you've read too much David Eddings if you've ever held a blue plastic Easter egg in your hand and tried to crack the world.

Oooh, Sparhawk!

And I know I have read too much Eddings because I found a semi-largish somewhat blue stone one day, and held onto for several weeks, holding it in my hands and gently stroking it whenever I was bored.

505 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:10:29pm

re: #502 Taqiyyotomist

THANK YOU for that link. Thank you. A thousand updings.

506 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:10:49pm

re: #494 itellu3times

Did you know Obama carries an elvish sword?

bad

:0

507 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:11:20pm

re: #472 pink freud

This was posted earlier.

Ah, missed that. Thanks.

508 Desert Dog  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:11:53pm

re: #497 sngnsgt

OT

Repost from an earlier thread:

Do bands like Rush belong in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame?

RUSH? RUSH? Are you kidding....they suck! So does YES and Genesis, The Talking Heads, Blondie, Devo, Dire Straits and The Pretenders....they are all posers. If you want to see a worthy inductee to the ROCK AND ROLL HALL OF FAME just look here

///////////////////////////////////////////

509 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:13:36pm

re: #472 pink freud Did you happen to notice that the Top 17 states with the higest incidence of Autism in 8 year olds ALL voted for Obama?
Just saying.............

510 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:14:37pm

State psychs + social workers + community organizers + teachers + politicians + paid activists, with much overlap among them. Pure evil with the facade of good, hyper-benevolent intention.

511 itellu3times  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:14:52pm

re: #506 ggt

bad

:0

Maybe he was just glad to see me.

/yikes

512 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:15:22pm

re: #509 realwest
And not one southern state in the top 15 ..............

513 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:15:41pm

Good night, and fight the good fight.

514 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:16:37pm

re: #509 realwest

Did you happen to notice that the Top 17 states with the higest incidence of Autism in 8 year olds ALL voted for Obama?
Just saying.............

Interesting correlation, still not evidence of causation. ;)

515 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:17:03pm

re: #475 JohnAdams
Uh, "However in Soros' case I think it really is true--not because he's a Jew, but because he's a billionaire with a very active agenda, a truly criminal mind (he was indicted and convicted in absentia in Hungary or someplace in Europe for currency manipulation) and a fascist at the core of his being.
TFTFY!

516 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:17:25pm

re: #502 Taqiyyotomist

In the hands of public school shrinks my kid would have been diagnosed any number of things. I pediatrician actually told me when my son was three that if I wanted ritalin when he got to school-age, he would proscribe it!

The "problem" is that he had an extremely intelligent brain in the body of a young child with the appropriate emotions of a young child. Brain/body could not handle the conflict and therefore caused anxiety and he coped in the only way a toddler could. He "needed to be busy".

Solution: Appropriate private school and counselling FOR HIS PARENTS. Later some meds to help him calm down enough to learn how to process his emotions when he was at an age to do so. In high school now, body is catching up to brains, no meds, talk therapy for him to help him learn the tools he needs to be happy in life.

517 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:18:04pm

re: #488 Fenway_Nation

What about Femme Fatales? Or is this just limited to LOTR/Fantasy?

No, I was just thinking of LOTR, and then the Wynne Jones book, which is focused on fantasy.

518 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:19:09pm

re: #510 Taqiyyotomist

You've just hit upon the nest in which I exist. You nailed it. It strangles me. I debate/fight this day in and day out.

That is all I will say as I do not want to say anything that will identify me, but I am in the unique position of being exposed to each and every one of those you listed. It is worse than you can imagine.

519 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:19:10pm

re: #479 funky chicken
Uh, hey funky, who all are you speaking of - or more precisely put, what did you mean by the"live POW/MIA activist" crowd?

520 Afrocity  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:20:30pm

Hello Lizards. Long day. Was in the mood to do some house chores so I had a 3 hour cleaning fit and did them. I have to do this when the mood strikes me because who knows when I will feel this way again.

521 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:20:54pm

re: #510 Taqiyyotomist

State psychs + social workers + community organizers + teachers + politicians + paid activists, with much overlap among them. Pure evil with the facade of good, hyper-benevolent intention.

Thank you for including my profession on the list of pure evil. I have Arrived now.

522 Mr. In get Mr. Out  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:21:44pm

re: #508 Desert Dog

RUSH? RUSH? Are you kidding....they suck! So does YES and Genesis, The Talking Heads, Blondie, Devo, Dire Straits and The Pretenders....they are all posers. If you want to see a worthy inductee to the ROCK AND ROLL HALL OF FAME just look here

///////////////////////////////////////////

I saw the SARC, but Dire Straits may be the greatest band of all-time. Mark Knopfler should be more recognized than he is.

523 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:22:53pm

re: #481 Kosh's Shadow
Kindly see my #515 - I think Soros loves fascism!

524 Afrocity  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:23:28pm

re: #521 SanFranciscoZionist

Thank you for including my profession on the list of pure evil. I have Arrived now.

My profession is on the list too.

525 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:24:11pm

re: #524 Afrocity

My profession is on the list too.

Shall we cackle together?

526 Killian Bundy  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:24:14pm

You know, Glen Beck should be sued for blatant fear-mongering assholery for scaring people out of the markets with his Armageddon doomsday crap.

The overseas markets are surging, the DJIA futures are already up triple digits, and an expected favorable accounting ruling for the financial sector should throw gasoline on the rally.

/if you haven't been invested in equities over the last month, you've already missed out on lots of gains

527 Desert Dog  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:24:15pm

re: #522 Mr. In get Mr. Out

I saw the SARC, but Dire Straits may be the greatest band of all-time. Mark Knopfler should be more recognized than he is.

One of my favorite guitarists and songwriters....but, he is not worthy now is he.....Madonna, yes? The ROHOF is a joke on a high order. They skipped the 70's and 80's rock music and went straight to Madonna and RAP CRAP....

Get your own HOF POP TARTS and Rappers!

528 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:24:18pm

re: #482 ggt
Better than I was when I posted my #299!

529 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:25:07pm

re: #521 SanFranciscoZionist

Of the teachers I know, more than half use the word *indoctrination* freely. And yes, they mean it politically. Social engineering. Collectivism.

530 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:25:29pm

re: #521 SanFranciscoZionist

Thank you for including my profession on the list of pure evil. I have Arrived now.

re: #524 Afrocity

My profession is on the list too.

Surrounded by evil, whatever will I do? ;)

Evening, beautiful lady. :)

{Afrocity} Got all that "got chores to do" worked out now? ;)

531 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:26:23pm

As an aside, I ask sometimes, regarding a politician, "why's he being retarded"?

The word, although not yet phased out completely, apparantly, by the medical community, is undergoing a transformation, the same transformation enjoyed by the word "idiot". Many take offense at the former utterance, and I wonder: do they realize that it is quite possible that autistic is just the new, kinder word for "mentally retarded", which was itself the new lingo for "idiot".

Thirty years from now the word "autistic" will be called mean and terrible and insensitive, because there will have been made a new, nicer term for it by the industry which coins euphamisms faster than the US Mint. They gave us "PTSD" for "shellshock", remember?

Find out where the guy they named Down's syndrome, John Langdon Down, worked and did his research.

Sometimes, just maybe, people who say the former quote, aren't really your enemy, and wouldn't treat a mentally retarded person, under whichever label the current establishment has given him this decade, with anything but the utmost respect and love. Just sayin.

532 Afrocity  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:27:36pm

re: #525 SanFranciscoZionist

Shall we cackle together?

I am too tired at this point to argue. I teach grad students and I try not to influence them politically, although they knew that I was not voting for Obama. They are all liberal but at least I got them to see the election from different perspectives.

533 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:27:37pm

re: #518 pink freud

Oh, I have a pretty vivid imagination, as many here can attest to. :)

534 Desert Dog  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:28:19pm

Words of Wisdom from Mitch Hedburg

* I got an ant farm... them fellas didn't grow shit!

* I went to a doctor, all he did was suck blood from my neck. Don't go see Dr. Acula.

* I had a Mr. Pibb, Mr. Pibb is a replica of Dr. Pepper... but it's the bullshit replica, cause dude didn't even get his degree.

* One time a guy handed me a picture and said "Here's a picture of me when I was younger." Every picture is of you when you were younger! "Here's a picture of me when I'm older." You son of a bitch, how'd you pull that off? Let me see that camera.

* I'd like to see a forklift lift a crate of forks... it'd be so damn literal! You are using that machine to its exact purpose!

* Last week I helped my friend stay put. It's a lot easier than helping someone move. I just went over to his house and made sure that he did not start to load shit into a truck.

* I think we should only get 3 honks a month on the car horn, because people honk the car horn too much. 3 honks, that's the limit. And then someone cuts you off, ffffft, you press your horn, nothing happens. You're like, "shit! I wish I wouldn't have seen Ricky on the sidewalk!"

* I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it.

* I was at this casino minding my own business, and this guy came up to me and said, "You're gonna have to move, you're blocking a fire exit." As though if there was a fire, I wasn't gonna run. If you're flammable and have legs, you are never blocking a fire exit.

* I wanna be a race car passenger - just a guy who bugs the driver. "Say man, can I turn on the radio? You should slow down. Why we gotta keep going in circles? Can I put my feet out the window? Man, you really like Tide."

* My friend asked me if I wanted a frozen banana, I said "no, but I want a regular banana later, so... yeah."

* I walked by a drycleaner at 3am, the sign said "Sorry, we're closed." You don't have to be sorry, it's 3am and you're a drycleaner. It would be ridiculous for me to expect you to be open. I'm not gonna walk in at 10am and say "Hey, I walked in at 3am and you guys were closed. Somebody owes me an apology."

* I got a business card, cause I wanna win some lunches. That's what my business card says: "Mitch Hedberg, Potential Lunch Winner."

* I had a paper route when I was a kid, I was a paper boy. I was supposed to go to 2,000 houses... or 2 dumpsters!

* I like the hot tubs at the hotels. I like to go there when there's a guy in there already, I say "hey man, you mind if I join you?" He says no. Then I go and I turn the whirlpool heat up, then I go by and I add some carrots and onions. Then I say "hey man, just simmer for a whil- I mean, sit there."

* I would like to have a product that was available for 3 easy payments and one fuckin' complicated payment. We ain't gonna tell you which payment it is, but one of these payments is gonna be a bitch!

* I saw this wino, he was eating grapes. It's like, "dude, you have to wait."

535 TheMatrix31  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:28:33pm

re: #522 Mr. In get Mr. Out

I saw the SARC, but Dire Straits may be the greatest band of all-time. Mark Knopfler should be more recognized than he is.

Best version of Sultans...ever

536 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:29:28pm

re: #521 SanFranciscoZionist

You misunderstand me. There exists within that set a subset which is quite active in perpetuating many myths for their gain, and they all work together.

I apologize if I have offended anyone, clarity is not my stong suit, also which many can attest to.

537 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:29:35pm

re: #529 pink freud

Of the teachers I know, more than half use the word *indoctrination* freely. And yes, they mean it politically. Social engineering. Collectivism.

OK. This is a fight I'm not going to win. I have no idea who you're dealing with, or what their goals are. Indoctrination is not a word I believe should ever be used in education.

I have been in teaching for five years now, and I have had the privilege of working with some of the finest people I've ever met. It has been a privilege. I tend to resent the suggestion that my coworkers and I are bad people. 'At's all.

538 Afrocity  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:29:43pm

re: #530 FurryOldGuyJeans

I clean about once a week but I have to be in the mood. Funny just when I put away the vacuum a neighbor came over to tell me that her uncle had died and she wanted me to meet some relatives. I was thankful that the apartment was spotless.

539 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:30:23pm

re: #512 pink freud
Um, I thought North Carolina was in there?

540 Mr. In get Mr. Out  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:30:24pm

re: #527 Desert Dog

One of my favorite guitarists and songwriters....but, he is not worthy now is he.....Madonna, yes? The ROHOF is a joke on a high order. They skipped the 70's and 80's rock music and went straight to Madonna and RAP CRAP....

Get your own HOF POP TARTS and Rappers!

I'm glad they inducted Leonard Cohen last year. His induction speech was pretty classic. However, every year I watch it become more of a music hall of fame with big sellers. It has lost some of its luster over the years.

541 Desert Dog  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:30:28pm

re: #536 Taqiyyotomist

You misunderstand me. There exists within that set a subset which is quite active in perpetuating many myths for their gain, and they all work together.

I apologize if I have offended anyone, clarity is not my stong suit, also which many can attest to.

What line of work are you in T?

542 funky chicken  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:30:47pm

re: #519 realwest

Uh, hey funky, who all are you speaking of - or more precisely put, what did you mean by the"live POW/MIA activist" crowd?

The "POWs against John McCain" crowd led by Ted Sampley types. The ones who show faked photos of Vietnam vets who didn't come home to wives and other family members and then bilk them out of thousands of dollars to fund their "rescue missions." The ones who attacked GHWB in the early 90s and still attack McCain today because of the normalization with Vietnam that they worked on back then.

543 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:31:25pm

re: #536 Taqiyyotomist

You misunderstand me. There exists within that set a subset which is quite active in perpetuating many myths for their gain, and they all work together.

I apologize if I have offended anyone, clarity is not my stong suit, also which many can attest to.

No offense, just coming to the defense of the teachers of the world, as above. We're not all crazy! Most of us are only slightly crazy!

544 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:31:44pm

I'm going to check out at this point. I don't really have anything to say right now. Good night, all.

545 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:32:04pm

re: #526 Killian Bundy

Screw you! Beck is a man of the people, speaking truth to power. You're just a lousy RINO libtard!

////and other knee-jerk, idol worshiping invective

546 Afrocity  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:32:15pm

nite Dark

547 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:32:57pm

re: #541 Desert Dog

What line of work are you in T?

Dishwashing.

548 Desert Dog  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:33:28pm

re: #547 Taqiyyotomist

Dishwashing.

Really? I clean stables!

549 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:33:29pm

re: #520 Afrocity
Good evening Afrocity - nice to know that you've recovered enough to do 3 hours of housecleaning!
Um, next time you get in that mood, could y'all come on down to Mom and my's apartment - we could sure use the help!

550 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:33:32pm

re: #538 Afrocity

I clean about once a week but I have to be in the mood. Funny just when I put away the vacuum a neighbor came over to tell me that her uncle had died and she wanted me to meet some relatives. I was thankful that the apartment was spotless.

Once a week? I'm lucky if I get struck once a month with the cleaning bug. ;)

551 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:33:41pm

Whatever line of work will get me to tomorrow.

552 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:33:41pm

re: #535 TheMatrix31

Very nice!

553 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:33:47pm

re: #547 Taqiyyotomist

Dishwashing.

Can you come over?

554 Afrocity  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:34:19pm

re: #549 realwest

Thanks real west, yes I am a ball of energy this week. I should take it slower.

555 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:34:29pm

re: #548 Desert Dog

I wish I cleaned stables.

(This could really get Monty Python-ish...)

556 Mr. In get Mr. Out  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:34:29pm

re: #531 Taqiyyotomist

As an aside, I ask sometimes, regarding a politician, "why's he being retarded"?

The word, although not yet phased out completely, apparantly, by the medical community, is undergoing a transformation, the same transformation enjoyed by the word "idiot". Many take offense at the former utterance, and I wonder: do they realize that it is quite possible that autistic is just the new, kinder word for "mentally retarded", which was itself the new lingo for "idiot".

Thirty years from now the word "autistic" will be called mean and terrible and insensitive, because there will have been made a new, nicer term for it by the industry which coins euphamisms faster than the US Mint. They gave us "PTSD" for "shellshock", remember?

Find out where the guy they named Down's syndrome, John Langdon Down, worked and did his research.

Sometimes, just maybe, people who say the former quote, aren't really your enemy, and wouldn't treat a mentally retarded person, under whichever label the current establishment has given him this decade, with anything but the utmost respect and love. Just sayin.

I still use retard as a verb. To ban certain words takes vibrancy from a language. Perfect words are few and far between, so it is best to have them all.

557 Desert Dog  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:35:20pm

re: #555 Taqiyyotomist

I wish I cleaned stables.

(This could really get Monty Python-ish...)

I don't literally clean stables, but I do deal with a lot of crap all day.

558 BaseballMom57  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:35:56pm

re: #162 DisturbedEma

That whole scene when they all come out of Moria was so powerful...all the actors did a phenomenal job without speaking a word. The anguish and disbelief on their faces...

559 funky chicken  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:36:02pm

re: #519 realwest

Here's a site written to debunk the creeps:

[Link: www.miafacts.org...]

Purpose of this site

This site is published to provide facts about the issue of Americans who remain "missing in action" (MIA) from the Vietnam War. At the conclusion of the Vietnam War, 2,583 Americans did not return. A vast mythology has built up around what really happened to these individuals. Misinformation, pseudo-history, and deliberate fabrication are rampant. As a result, myths are regularly proclaimed to be fact.

The Myths:

Not all US POWs were released by their captors at the end of the Vietnam War.
The U.S. government knew that all POWs were not released.
U.S. POWs remain in captivity today.
There is a conspiracy within the U. S. government to hide the continued imprisonment of Americans and, whenever the truth emerges, it is debunked.
The U.S. government is doing nothing to account for or recover missing men.
The Facts:

All U.S. POWs captured during the Vietnam War were released, either at Operation Homecoming (spring, 1973) or earlier.
The only men captured and not released are 113 who died in captivity; their identities and the circumstances of their deaths are known; some of their remains have been recovered/returned..
No U. S. prisoners of war have been abandoned by the U. S. government.
No U.S POWs remained in captivity after the conclusion of Operation Homecoming.
There is no conspiracy within the U. S. government to conceal the abandonment of prisoners of war (who were not abandoned in the first place).
No U.S. POWs from Indochina were taken to the Soviet Union, China, or any other third country.
The U.S. government has been -- since well before the end of the Vietnam War -- exerting all possible efforts to recover or account for missing men. That effort continues today and is unprecedented in the history of warfare.
Those who promote these false claims have produced a vast array of half-truth, untruth, hearsay, unsubstantiated claims, personal attacks, and mythology. The accumulated effect of years of nonsense has been exactly what one would expect:

The big lie has been accepted as truth in some quarters.

560 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:36:49pm

I hate it when I gotta extract a foot from my mouth.
SFZ, Afrocity
:hangs head

561 Killian Bundy  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:37:20pm

re: #545 Slumbering Behemoth

Screw you! Beck is a man of the people, speaking truth to power. You're just a lousy RINO libtard!

////and other knee-jerk, idol worshiping invective

/I've also made over a 50% return in the last 30 days, where's my pitchfork?

562 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:37:33pm

re: #522 Mr. In get Mr. Out
"Dire Straits may be the greatest band of all-time. Mark Knopfler should be more recognized than he is."
Not sure if I agree with you about Dire Straights (I thought Cream was better, among others) but you're spot-on with Mark Knopfler. But for your listening pleasure:

563 Afrocity  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:37:33pm

I need to turn in. I have 3 meetings tomorrow. Nite all.

564 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:37:46pm

re: #537 SanFranciscoZionist

You popped up on my radar (naturally, considering) quite a while back. I have read your posts with interest, I have developed a sense of who you are as well as I am able from what I can glean here. It is not my intent to defame you. I've gone back and forth in my opinion of you, based on your posts, but you've landed squarely in the *this is a good person* camp, in my eyes. I am glad there are children have you as their guide and mentor. They are fortunate.

565 Afrocity  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:38:29pm

re: #560 Taqiyyotomist

I hate it when I gotta extract a foot from my mouth.
SFZ, Afrocity
:hangs head

I was not offended.
Those who can't teach, wash dishes/

566 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:38:32pm

re: #563 Afrocity

I need to turn in. I have 3 meetings tomorrow. Nite all.

weet dreams. :)

567 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:38:35pm

G'night, pretty lady!

568 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:38:38pm

re: #560 Taqiyyotomist

I hate it when I gotta extract a foot from my mouth.
SFZ, Afrocity
:hangs head

Awwwww...cheer up! It's good news! We're really not evil, so there's hope!

569 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:39:23pm

re: #539 realwest

Right. I said "south".

;-)

570 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:39:32pm

re: #564 pink freud

You popped up on my radar (naturally, considering) quite a while back. I have read your posts with interest, I have developed a sense of who you are as well as I am able from what I can glean here. It is not my intent to defame you. I've gone back and forth in my opinion of you, based on your posts, but you've landed squarely in the *this is a good person* camp, in my eyes. I am glad there are children have you as their guide and mentor. They are fortunate.

Why, thank you!

571 HelloDare  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:40:17pm

Linked at Hot Air: Red State remixes MoveOn’s ad about budget deficits

572 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:40:29pm

My Grandmother was an schoolteacher, many many years. NEA and everything. She was one of the good ones, too.

573 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:40:44pm

re: #527 Desert Dog
"They skipped the 70's and 80's rock music and went straight to Madonna and RAP CRAP...."
Um, not entirely true: they did induct Neil Young, Steven Stills, CS&N and Buffalo Springfield - with Stills being the only artist to be inducted twice the same night!

574 BaseballMom57  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:41:20pm

re: #170 Bloodnok

Impressive! I usually have to re-read the Tom Bombadil section 3 times each time I read the trilogy to figure out just what in the hell he's talking about. I still don't know.

That is so funny you say that! I'm the same way! I don't get it. And to think the Tolkien "purists" were all fired up about Tom B. not being in the movie!

575 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:41:48pm

pimf "a"
facepalm
She was an English teacher.

576 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:41:50pm

re: #520 Afrocity

Hello Lizards. Long day. Was in the mood to do some house chores so I had a 3 hour cleaning fit and did them. I have to do this when the mood strikes me because who knows when I will feel this way again.

When are you moving out by me?

577 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:41:50pm

I just wrote an e-mail to my second job, pleading for the morning off, so I can go to a job fair, to look into replacing my first job, even though I love my first job, but they may not be able to give me more hours next year.

This is getting too complicated.

578 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:42:30pm

re: #570 SanFranciscoZionist

You're welcome. I like your style, and tenacity. You care a whole lot, that is clear.

579 Mr. In get Mr. Out  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:42:32pm

re: #562 realwest

"Dire Straits may be the greatest band of all-time. Mark Knopfler should be more recognized than he is."
Not sure if I agree with you about Dire Straights (I thought Cream was better, among others) but you're spot-on with Mark Knopfler. But for your listening pleasure:

[Video]

Cream is excellent, though I haven't listened to them in a while. My greatest favorite band changes with my mood. Last year, I would have said the Who was the greatest, then three months later it was the Rolling Stones, then two weeks ago it was the Kinks. Deciding is always good for debate though. The only genre where I can pinpoint a greatest is country: Hank Williams.

580 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:43:00pm

re: #535 TheMatrix31
GMTA! See my #562!

581 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:43:24pm

re: #572 Taqiyyotomist

My Grandmother was an schoolteacher, many many years. NEA and everything. She was one of the good ones, too.

One of my grandmas taught third grade for a number of years, and my other one was an admin for the LA school district.

What grades/subjects did your grandmother teach?

582 TheMatrix31  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:44:00pm

re: #580 realwest

GMTA! See my #562!

Awesome!

583 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:45:07pm

re: #574 BaseballMom57

I wasn't one of those. I liked Peter Jackson's remix, and I'm thinking Tolkein would have liked it, too. Books V and VI (Return of the King, to the non-initiated...they're all two books) would have been nigh-impossible to do as well, as they are written. And I like the Bombadil/Goldberry parts in the books, but they would have come across, ahh, a wee bit lavender, as they say, in the movies. Light in the loafers. Lil' gay for the general audience, you know? Just wouldn't have flew.

584 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:45:40pm

Well y'all it's been grand - better than the night started out, I tells ya!
Hope you all have a great evening/early morning and that I get the chance to see you all down the road!

Good night, all.

585 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:46:05pm

'Night real.

586 solomonpanting  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:47:16pm

re: #534 Desert Dog

More words of Wisdom from Mitch Hedberg:

-I wrote a report for a college class. The professor told me to re-write it. I said "Screw that. I'll just make a photo copy."

587 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:48:17pm

re: #586 solomonpanting

More words of Wisdom from Mitch Hedberg:

-I wrote a report for a college class. The professor told me to re-write it. I said "Screw that. I'll just make a photo copy."

I think his grandson is in my junior English class.
/

588 TheMatrix31  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:49:06pm

re: #584 realwest

Well y'all it's been grand - better than the night started out, I tells ya!
Hope you all have a great evening/early morning and that I get the chance to see you all down the road!

Good night, all.

Good night!

589 Desert Dog  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:49:13pm

A little more Mitch Hedburg for your smiling and laughing pleasure:

Good nite all...play nice

* Every McDonald's commercial ends the same way, right? "Prices and participation may vary." I wanna open a McDonald's and not participate in anything. I wanna be a stubborn McDonald's owner. Cheeseburgers? Nope. We got spaghetti! And blankets!

* I was gonna have my teeth whitened, but then I said fuck that, I'll just get a tan instead.

* I had a job interview at an insurance company once, and the lady said "Where do you see yourself in five years?" I said, "Celebrating the fifth year anniversary of you asking me this question!"

* I bought a house, it's a 2-bedroom house. But I think it's up to me how many bedrooms there are, don't you? Fuck you real estate lady, this bedroom has an oven in it! This bedroom has a lot of people sitting around watching TV. This bedroom's over in that guy's house.

* I like the FedEx driver, because he's a drug dealer, and he don't even know it.

* I wanna hang a map of the world in my house. Then I'm gonna put pins into all the locations that I've traveled to. But first, I'm gonna have to travel to the top two corners of the map, so it won't fall down.

* You know when a company wants to use letters in their phone number to be catchy? But often times they use too many letters. "Give us a call down here at 1-800-I-Really-Enjoy-Carpeting." It's too many letters, man. "Hello?" "Hold on, I'm only on 'Enjoy'! How did you know I was calling?"

* I bought a 7 dollar pen, because I always lose pens, and I got sick of not caring.

* I would imagine if you understood Morse code, a tap dancer would drive you crazy!

* I had a small scene in a movie with Peter Frampton. And we had to smoke pot for our scene - but it was fake pot! Do not buy pot on a movie set. But I got to smoke fake pot with Peter Frampton, that's a cool story. It's as cool as smoking real pot with a guy who looks like Peter Frampton... I've done that way more.

* The thing that's depressing about tennis is, no matter how good I get, I'll never be as good as a wall. I played a wall once... they're fucking relentless!

* People ask me what words mean... they say, "what does 'composition' mean?" Some people would say, "put it in a sentence." But I need a little more. "Put it in a play."

* If I'm out to dinner with a group of friends, and someone offers to pay for the check, I immediately reach for my wallet. Because inside is a note that says "say thanks."

* Every book is a children's book, if the kid can read!

* My friend said to me "I think the weather's trippy." And I said "No man, it's not the weather that's trippy. Perhaps it is the way that we percieve it that is indeed trippy." Then I thought "man, I should have just said 'yeah'."

* I like escalators, because an escalator can never break; it can only become stairs. You would never see an "escalator temporarily out of order" sign, just "Escalator temporarily stairs... sorry for the convenience. We apologize for the fact that you can still get up there."

* When I was on acid, I would see things like beams of light... and I would hear sounds that sounded an awful lot like car horns.

* I was in a hotel room and my friend comes over, he says "can I use the phone?" I said "certainly." He said "do I need to dial 9?" "Yeah... especially if it's in the number. You can try 4 and 5 back to back real quick."

* Alcoholism is a disease, but it's the only disease that you can get yelled at for having. Goddammit Otto, you're an alcoholic! Goddammit Otto, you have lupus! One of those two doesn't sound right.

590 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:49:25pm

re: #587 SanFranciscoZionist Whoa, hadda come back for that - I thought Mitch was dead!

591 sngnsgt  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:49:27pm

re: #586 solomonpanting

+1 I'm stealing that one.

592 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:49:33pm

SFZ, I think she probably retired a year or two before I was born, but I think it was, in the later part of her career, HS English, in a small school in SW MI.

593 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:50:18pm

re: #556 Mr. In get Mr. Out

I still use retard as a verb. To ban certain words takes vibrancy from a language. Perfect words are few and far between, so it is best to have them all.

I remember getting into it with a bartender who took offense to my using 'gay' as a dispariging adjective. Barely a minute after objecting to my use of the word 'gay', I overheard him griping that someone 'Jewed' him out of a tip. He defended his choice of words, claiming that gays have it rougher than Jews today- to which I asked 'When was the last time someone rounded up Six million gays into death camps?'

594 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:50:30pm

weet dreams all!

595 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:52:15pm

re: #590 realwest

Whoa, hadda come back for that - I thought Mitch was dead!

Kidding, I just meant that many of my students have that approach to rewriting.

596 realwest  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:53:23pm

Yep, Mitch died in 2005 - wiki!

597 solomonpanting  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:53:41pm

re: #587 SanFranciscoZionist

I think his grandson is in my junior English class.
/

Unfortunately, he passed away from an overdose a few years back at the ripe age of 37. What a waste.

598 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:54:01pm

re: #592 Taqiyyotomist

SFZ, I think she probably retired a year or two before I was born, but I think it was, in the later part of her career, HS English, in a small school in SW MI.


Ahhh...a fine specialty indeed. Seeing as it's mine. ;)

(Actually, I'm currently running around to all the heads of departments in any area I am remotely qualified to teach, begging for hours next year. It's kind of funny. It will be less funny when I'm beating down the math HOD's door, given that no one wants me teaching math to the youth of America.)

599 Momzilla  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:54:19pm

re: #466 realwest

Well I'd add that if you live in a state with a large illegal immgrant population, you ought to get tested for TB, too.
Very good friend of mine contracted TB (non-infectious) and he's on meds to kill it for a looong time.
And at least you're looking at vaccines and trying to understand them; blanketly condemning them - especially saying they cause autism - is just whacko.
BTW, just cause you had chicken pox or the vaccine, doesn't mean you can't get SHINGLES from someone who does have chickenpox! I know from sad and painful experience.

That's the TRUTH re the TB. It's a big problem here, something for which there is no vaccine, and which our children can be exposed to in a classroom situation. Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised to learn that these measles cases in California weren't among the immigrant population. It's sure common enough here. Few, if any, children of illegal immigrants are vaccinated before they reach school age. And these are exposed to other unvaccinated immigrants so more likely to be exposed

You know, there is a vaccine to prevent shingles. We had my mother-in-law vaccinated for it as soon as we found out about it. Shingles doesn't require a new exposure to chicken pox. It is a reactivation of the virus already in your system. You are never fully "cured" of chickenpox. It goes dormant, but remains in your body. In my MIL's case, she's 85. We don't have to worry about her quality of life over the next 50+ years, but only saving her pain right now.

600 Macker  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:54:19pm

Lizards, I need some advice.
I've had this roommate for a year and a half. He moved his girlfriend all the way in from CT to AZ early last month. She got a job very quickly (working in medical records). He's still insisting that I still pay 1/2 the rent. He hasn't added her to the lease yet, nor has he gotten renter's insurance.
What pisses me off is that last year, when my girlfriend at the time (this was before the Lady E came back into my life) considered moving here, he offered to split the rent 3 ways Now he goes back on this?
Am I looking at this the right way? What should I do?

601 solomonpanting  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:55:26pm

re: #591 sngnsgt

+1 I'm stealing that one.

Thanks for the upding. I'm just the middleman.

602 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:56:03pm

re: #600 Macker

The rent should be split 3 ways- period.

603 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:56:11pm
604 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:56:35pm

re: #600 Macker

Three ways.

605 solomonpanting  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:56:47pm

re: #600 Macker


I agree with Sharmuta.

606 TheMatrix31  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:57:05pm

re: #593 Fenway_Nation

I remember getting into it with a bartender who took offense to my using 'gay' as a dispariging adjective. Barely a minute after objecting to my use of the word 'gay', I overheard him griping that someone 'Jewed' him out of a tip. He defended his choice of words, claiming that gays have it rougher than Jews today- to which I asked 'When was the last time someone rounded up Six million gays into death camps?'

LMFAO!

607 Macker  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:57:18pm

re: #592 Taqiyyotomist

SFZ, I think she probably retired a year or two before I was born, but I think it was, in the later part of her career, HS English, in a small school in SW MI.

Hey! What part of SW MI? I'm from South Haven.

608 BaseballMom57  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:58:28pm

re: #583 Taqiyyotomist

I agree. The gay rumors flew wildly anyway! Made me crazy.

Personally, I would have been happy to sit through a four hour movie with an intermission. I loved all the movies - it put faces on characters I'd loved since the 5th grade, when I first read The Hobbit. I think Jackson did an admirable job, and no one, NO ONE could have been a better Gandalf than Sir Ian. He was priceless.

609 Throbert McGee  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:58:42pm

re: #510 Taqiyyotomist

State psychs + social workers + community organizers + teachers + politicians + paid activists, with much overlap among them. Pure evil with the facade of good, hyper-benevolent intention.

Downding because, first, that "pure evil" is painting with a broad and insulting brush; and second, because you naively overlooked what may be the most important "special interest group" contributing to the over-diagnosis of autism:

PARENTS.

Because in trying to adjust to the reality of a child who's learning much more slowly than other kids, most parents would rather hear "your child is autistic" -- which at least offers the small hope that the kid will grow up to be a high-functioning prodigy like Temple Grandin -- than hear "your child is re-tar-ded."

The autism diagnosis encourages parents to believe that although their child apparently has a significantly below-average IQ, there's actually a potential genius locked inside, if only they can find the key to let him out.

In other words, all those other groups you mentioned are primarily motivated by a desire to give anxious parents a comparatively optimistic prognosis.

610 BLBfootballs  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:59:05pm

re: #600 Macker

She's enjoying use of the resources in the apartment. She's living there. She seems to have a paying job. Why does she get a free ride from you? Probably try to talk this out reasonably and rationally.

611 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:59:17pm

re: #598 SanFranciscoZionist

Sorry, I got lost in the Hedberg quotes.

I wish you great success in the hunt. Michigan is scary right now. WHOLE lotta people just got the axe, GM going under, the rest of the state is auto parts, market's about to be flooded with ex-Union folk looking to displace a dishwasher...

These are scary times for the relatively unskilled.

612 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:59:38pm

re: #600 Macker

Lizards, I need some advice.
I've had this roommate for a year and a half. He moved his girlfriend all the way in from CT to AZ early last month. She got a job very quickly (working in medical records). He's still insisting that I still pay 1/2 the rent. He hasn't added her to the lease yet, nor has he gotten renter's insurance.
What pisses me off is that last year, when my girlfriend at the time (this was before the Lady E came back into my life) considered moving here, he offered to split the rent 3 ways Now he goes back on this?
Am I looking at this the right way? What should I do?

He may be seeing it as paying by bedroom, but it seems reasonable to me that three adults sharing a space should pay for it in even amounts.

What do you think he'd do if you sat down with both of them, pointed out that he'd suggested dividing the rent with your girlfriend once before, and asked when you could deal his lady into the rent?

613 BaseballMom57  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 10:59:39pm

re: #586 solomonpanting

More words of Wisdom from Mitch Hedberg:

-I wrote a report for a college class. The professor told me to re-write it. I said "Screw that. I'll just make a photo copy."

LOVE MITCH HEDBERG! Such a shame, though. Died WAY too soon.

614 BLBfootballs  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:00:59pm

re: #612 SanFranciscoZionist

He may be seeing it as paying by bedroom, but it seems reasonable to me that three adults sharing a space should pay for it in even amounts.

What do you think he'd do if you sat down with both of them, pointed out that he'd suggested dividing the rent with your girlfriend once before, and asked when you could deal his lady into the rent?

Could do that... but something tells me it's easier to talk to the original roommate alone first. Less chance of stepping on any toes.

615 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:01:23pm

re: #593 Fenway_Nation

Follow Up: While the two of us were having this very loud conversation, I later found out one of the people within earshot was a pre-op transsexual whose house just burned down.

/I swear this wasn't a gay bar, either...

616 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:01:57pm

re: #611 Taqiyyotomist

Sorry, I got lost in the Hedberg quotes.

I wish you great success in the hunt. Michigan is scary right now. WHOLE lotta people just got the axe, GM going under, the rest of the state is auto parts, market's about to be flooded with ex-Union folk looking to displace a dishwasher...

These are scary times for the relatively unskilled.

Thanks, and all the best for your job stability too. These are just plain scary times...

617 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:02:33pm

re: #614 BLBfootballs

Could do that... but something tells me it's easier to talk to the original roommate alone first. Less chance of stepping on any toes.

That makes sense.

618 Macker  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:03:02pm

re: #612 SanFranciscoZionist

He may be seeing it as paying by bedroom, but it seems reasonable to me that three adults sharing a space should pay for it in even amounts.

What do you think he'd do if you sat down with both of them, pointed out that he'd suggested dividing the rent with your girlfriend once before, and asked when you could deal his lady into the rent?

He is seeing it as by bedroom. I asked him about it two weeks ago, before the rent was due. He didn't reply to my e-mail to invite to sit down and hack it out.
And I sure as hell ain't about to go grab some chick off the street and move her in with me, just to cut the rent down even further. When I get married to the Lady E in September, I am going to GTFO.

619 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:04:39pm

re: #615 Fenway_Nation

Follow Up: While the two of us were having this very loud conversation, I later found out one of the people within earshot was a pre-op transsexual whose house just burned down.

/I swear this wasn't a gay bar, either...

You know you're from the SF Bay Area When: This morning I was having a conversation with my husband, in which I kept getting confused about the name of our bank (WAMU, now becoming Chase). After several "...no, I mean Chase...are they Chase yet...?" I said irritably "This is like when someone has a sex change, and you don't know which pronoun to use for, like, months."

620 Killian Bundy  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:04:55pm

The President Is 'Keeping Score'

"Don't think we're not keeping score, brother." That's what President Barack Obama said to Rep. Peter DeFazio in a closed-door meeting of the House Democratic Caucus last week, according to the Associated Press.

/hey assearhole, don't think we're not keeping score either

621 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:04:58pm

re: #607 Macker

HEY! HAHA!

I knew that, because...

#30 Macker 4/26/08 7:05:44 pm reply quote report 0

Whenever I hear the words "covert army" it harkens me back to my high school days and the working title "Invasion of the Covertians"...as there was a town 7 miles south of the place where I grew up and it was called "Covert."

I saved this in notepad when I read it, just meaning to ask you!

Heh. I was born in S.H., grew up in Covert, went to school there, and am living in S.H. right now! Yep I was one of the hillbillies to the south of you, 'round about Thunder Mountain. Climbed that sucker a hundred times. (maybe a slight exxageration, but only slight)

622 Dustyvet  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:05:07pm

re: #539 realwest

Um, I thought North Carolina was in there?

Does North Carolina and South Carolina have a DMZ?...Diving under desk...:)

623 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:05:58pm

re: #618 Macker

That's pretty rude to not even discuss it with you! If you have to play hard ball, then give 1/3 of the rent to be paid, and tell him the rest is his problem. What's fair is fair- he made your GF pay, his can pay too.

624 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:06:31pm

re: #618 Macker

He is seeing it as by bedroom. I asked him about it two weeks ago, before the rent was due. He didn't reply to my e-mail to invite to sit down and hack it out.
And I sure as hell ain't about to go grab some chick off the street and move her in with me, just to cut the rent down even further. When I get married to the Lady E in September, I am going to GTFO.

Mazal tov on your engagement!

I don't know what to recommend if he won't negotiate. Any chance you could move in with the future Mrs. now? (I have no idea what the moral, religious, and practical implications of that are, just free associating.)

625 Macker  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:06:48pm

re: #620 Killian Bundy

The President Is 'Keeping Score'

/hey assearhole, don't think we're not keeping score either

Rove, you magnificent bastard!

/Yay

626 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:07:20pm

re: #608 BaseballMom57

Absolutely. It's the last best movie, all told, IMO. I've got the 12-dvd set, it's a prized posession! The only books I have are a watercolor graphic novel of The Hobbit, and the 35.00 all-in-one trilogy. (which is nice, too :))

627 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:07:53pm

re: #561 Killian Bundy

/I've also made over a 50% return in the last 30 days, where's my pitchfork?

You've made money during these tough times? Humph! No pitchfork for you!

/better turn in them torches too, buddy...

628 solomonpanting  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:08:04pm

re: #613 BaseballMom57

LOVE MITCH HEDBERG! Such a shame, though. Died WAY too soon.

Right on both counts.

629 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:08:55pm

MACKER.
Yeah, I'm a Covertian.

630 Macker  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:08:56pm

re: #621 Taqiyyotomist

Hey! Email me please! We got some stuff to discuss!

631 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:09:12pm

ROFLOL

632 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:09:44pm

Will do.

633 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:10:33pm

Macker, though the "contact" at the top-right on your site?

634 Macker  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:10:53pm

re: #624 SanFranciscoZionist

Mazal tov on your engagement!

I don't know what to recommend if he won't negotiate. Any chance you could move in with the future Mrs. now? (I have no idea what the moral, religious, and practical implications of that are, just free associating.)

The Lady E is in Grand Rapids, MI right now. She wants to move out here to be with me...but we agreed to do this after we marry in our home town of South Haven.
Got that, Taqiyyotomist?

635 Macker  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:11:07pm

re: #633 Taqiyyotomist

Macker, though the "contact" at the top-right on your site?

Yes!

636 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:12:06pm

On my way.

Later all.

637 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:13:34pm

Macker- play hardball then if he won't talk to you about this like an adult. He decided for you that you'd give a free ride, so decide right back that you're not. You are not a doormat or a chump, so don't allow yourself to be treated a such.

638 MrPaulRevere  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:14:36pm

re: #600 Macker

Sarte had it half right when he said "Hell...is other people". Hell is a room mate.

639 pat  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:15:57pm

I agree with these sentiments entirely. This bogus science is designed to offer false hope, aggrandize the provocateurs, and fleece the unwary. Lawyers, Doctors, booksellers, and charlatans seem to be particularly involved. Hmmmm.

640 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:16:16pm

Alight, M, check thine mailbox.

641 solomonpanting  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:17:37pm

re: #600 Macker

Another thought. If you do convince your roommate and his lady that they should pay two-thirds, don't be surprised if they decide to move out and pay for their privacy. It might not hurt to have a backup plan.

642 Dustyvet  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:17:52pm

Top Ten Ways to Freak Out Your Roommate

10) Collect potatoes. Paint faces on them and give them names. Name one after your roommate. Separate your roommate's potato from the others. Wait a few days, and then bake your roommate's potato and eat it. Explain to your roommate, "He just didn't belong."

9) Move everything to one side of the room. Ask your roommate if he knows how much an elephant weighs, and look at the floor on the empty side of the room with concern.

8) Draw a tiny black line on your nose. Make it bigger every day. Look at it and say, "The hair, it's growing. Growing!"

7) Buy some knives. Sharpen them every night. While you're doing so, look at your roommate and mutter, "Soon, soon...."

6) Collect hundreds of pens and pile them on one side of the room. Keep one pencil on the other side of the room. Laugh at the pencil.

5) Tell your roommate, "I've got an important message for you." Then pretend to faint. When you recover, say you can't remember what the message was. Later on, say, "Oh, yeah, I remember!" Pretend to faint again. Keep this up for several weeks.

4) While your roommate is out, glue your shoes to the ceiling. When your roommate walks in, sit on the floor, hold your head, and moan.

3) Make a sandwich. Don't eat it, leave it on the floor. Ignore the sandwich. Wait until your roommate gets rid of it, and then say, "Hey, where the heck is my sandwich!?" Complain loudly that you are hungry.

2) Every time your roommate walks in yell, "Hooray! You're back!" as loud as you can and dance around the room for five minutes. Afterwards, keep looking at your watch and saying, "Shouldn't you be going somewhere?"

1) Talk back to your Rice Krispies. All of a sudden, act offended, throw the bowl on the floor and kick it. Refuse to clean it up, explaining, "No, I want to watch them suffer."

643 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:17:57pm

Out for an Obamarette. I can't believe I forgot all about that. I was sitting in the south haven library at the time, reading threads, when I did a doubletake on that one, copied to my memorystick, and promptly forgot about it!

644 Sharmuta  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:18:59pm

re: #641 solomonpanting

Another thought. If you do convince your roommate and his lady that they should pay two-thirds, don't be surprised if they decide to move out and pay for their privacy. It might not hurt to have a backup plan.

Better yet- decided to do that for them and find another place to live yourself, Macker. I mean hey- if they're going to make financial decisions for Macker, turn about is fair play.

645 Macker  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:19:04pm

re: #638 MrPaulRevere

Sarte had it half right when he said "Hell...is other people". Hell is a room mate.

And would that make Heaven...a wife?

646 Macker  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:19:54pm

re: #643 Taqiyyotomist

?

647 pat  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:20:23pm

I was told by the head of the dorm that my roommate wanted a change. He was freaked out that I did his physics homework between classes. Thought he was set up.

648 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:20:42pm

re: #642 Dustyvet

7) Buy some knives. Sharpen them every night. While you're doing so, look at your roommate and mutter, "Soon, soon...."


Yeah, ah, I had a roommate that did that a lot, sans muttering, but still. Had a Ka-bar, loved to sharpen it, moreso than most normal people sit and while away the hours sharpening knives, anyway. At times it was, indeed, freaking me out, so I can vouch for that one. :)

649 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:21:36pm

Goodnight everyone...

650 pink freud  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:22:04pm

re: #649 SanFranciscoZionist

Sleep well, SFZ.

651 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:22:04pm

'Night SFZ

652 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:22:50pm

re: #646 Macker

what what?

653 moonbeams  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:24:17pm

re: #40 Boxy_brown

Autism existed long before vaccines.

Autism was "discovered" in 1938 by Dr Leo Kanner of John Hopkins University. He had 11 case studies at the time.

In a paper he wrote in 1943:
“Since 1938, there have come to our attention a number of children whose condition differs so markedly and uniquely from anything reported so far, that each case merits - and, I hope, will eventually receive - a detailed consideration of its fascinating peculiarities.”

To me this certainly sounds like this is a new diagnosis that had not been seen before, at least by John Hopkins University.

According to Wiki the first vaccines were developed
many years prior to Kanner's & John Hopkins discovery starting in the late 1700's.

654 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:24:22pm

Nighty night SFZ!

655 Macker  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:28:22pm

re: #644 Sharmuta

Better yet- decided to do that for them and find another place to live yourself, Macker. I mean hey- if they're going to make financial decisions for Macker, turn about is fair play.

I think this is my most likely course of action....

Thanks to all my fellow Lizards!

656 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:35:40pm

re: #642 Dustyvet

My biggest problem with roommates them eating up my hard bought my food. Not being a total dumbass, I quickly learned to spice my food damn near to toxicity. My roommates learned pretty quick that they better find their own damn food, and that I can be a real asshole when it comes to making a point.

Extra bonus: stuff like this tastes like ketchup to me now.

657 Taqiyyotomist  Wed, Apr 1, 2009 11:52:04pm

re: #609 Throbert McGee

Updinged, food for thought.

658 chemicalcorpse  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 1:22:14am

A larger issue here is the 500lb gorilla in the living room; mandatory vaccinations.

The smug and condescending attitudes of many on this site is alarming. If you are really interested in the truth educate yourselves with the facts about the current state of affairs regarding the efficacy of inoculation(s), the recent (last 10 to 15 years) explosion in the number and frequency of inoculation(s), and let's not forget, WHEN the human body can actually process the antigens to elicit the immune response desired.

On top of these realities; ask yourselves why the government maintains a HUGE cash reserve necessary to address the payouts on litigation regarding vaccine reactions.

If I am not vaccinated and you are, who is harmed?

Many of the vaccines in the present recommended schedule are not for the protection of the child but the healthcare worker.

Is the prevalence of these diseases we are trying to "protect" ourselves from actually a danger to the public health? Look at the epidemiological record.

Again, the same people pushing vaccines on our children are responsible for the Post Office, the state of Medicare and Social Security and other successes.

As 'free-thinking' and 'open-minded' bloggers I'm reading a lot of ignorance and intolerance.... probably why I spend less and less time at this site.

659 [deleted]  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 1:25:07am
660 Maui Girl  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 1:33:52am

I thought that the connection with autism and vaccines had to do with thimerosal. That mercury-based preservative has been used in many things including something as simple as eye contact cleaning solutions. Seeing as how mercury builds up in the system and could be passed along to a child through mother's milk shouldn't they be looking at that? Perhaps they are. It could be that tuna pounding mama that's really to blame.... There's a reason why they suggest pregnant and nursing women should n't eat raw fish like sashimi but perhaps canned tuna (among others fished off coastal waters) should be considered no no's too.

I had my son vaccinated as long as the label on the vaccine showed that is was thimerasol free. Thank God, my son is rarely sick except for the occasional cold and hasn't had to go through the chicken pox, measles and mumps, etc. that I had to go through. But the increase in autism cases has GOT to be attributed to something. We (or rather the experts in the field) need to keep searching for that missing link.

I'm no expert. Just voicing an opinion.

661 [deleted]  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 1:36:38am
662 Mich-again  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 3:30:08am

re: #330 Last Mohican

Differential migration also likely played a
minor role, if any. Wider awareness, greater motivation of
parents to seek services as a result of expanding treatment
options, and increased funding may each have contributed,
but documentation or quantification of these effects is lacking.

They need to one more multiplier to accommodate the "You always get more of whatever you subsidize." factor.

663 esther_ar  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 4:56:48am

It's not and never was about thimerosal or the MMR, Maui Girl. And it's not all that clear the increase in autism diagnoses is real, as opposed to broadening of the diagnostic criteria.

I hope Charles doesn't mind, but last year I put together a series of blogposts explaining the history and the science refuting the vaccine/autism hypothesis which might be of interest:

MMR

thimerosal

And as on another thread, I strongly recommend reading Dr. Paul Offit's new book, Autism's False Prophets.

664 scottishbuzzsaw  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 5:13:34am

re: #663 esther_ar

And as on another thread, I strongly recommend reading Dr. Paul Offit's new book, Autism's False Prophets.

That's an excellent book on the topic.

[Link: cup.columbia.edu...]

665 scottishbuzzsaw  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 5:27:58am

re: #663 esther_ar

Thanks for linking to your posts. You have a very interesting site, esther_ar. Bookmarked.

666 Emerald  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 5:37:35am

re: #136 footballfan0786

Emerald
I never said that mercury caused autism. I said get the mercury out of the vaccines.


Mercury is already out of childhood vaccines!

667 Teh Flowah  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 6:09:43am

I'm going to take a shit on the author of the email. Sorry, but your sad case, if it can be verified as true, doesn't give you the right to turn into an irrational ignorant idiot. All three of your kids got autism, oh man, what does that mean? Well it certainly doesn't mean it was vaccination that did it. And it definitely doesn't mean you've earned a "right" to be suspicious about anything some kook tells you about.

It's kind of sad what happens to people when they're looking for someone to blame. They turn into raving lunatics.

668 FrogMarch  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 6:25:09am

Great post, Charles. Thank you.

669 esther_ar  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 6:39:25am

re: #665 scottishbuzzsaw

Thanks for linking to your posts. You have a very interesting site, esther_ar. Bookmarked.

Why, thank you! :)

670 jester6  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 6:46:05am

Charles,

You are a little older than me so you might remember how Alar was going to give kids cancer because Meryl Streep told us so. Or that DDT was going to killing the eagles because Rachel Carson told us so.

The farmers destroyed by Alar scare and millions of malaria victims caused by the DDT scare are all prequels to this version of the movie. Unfortunately for them the farmers were evil business people and the malaria victims are the wrong color, in the wrong place and too obscure for good television.

It's admirable that you are doing your part to fight the ignorance. But Jenny McCarthy was right when she said it will take some diseases coming back. And as long as she can spout her stuff in US and People and on Oprah like shows she is not going to be stopped.

Until there are lots of dead children who live in the right places and have the right skin tone, the vast majority of people are not going to look at these ridiculous anti-vax as something to be worried about.

671 joker23  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 7:22:33am

When I went to high school we were required to do a service project. For one month we volunteered our time to an organization or cause instead of going to class. I ended up at the Judevine Center for Autistic Children, working on their adult program. I enjoyed the work so much that I ended up volunteering there that summer as well, and then coming back the next summer as a paid employee.

Ironically enough, my oldest son would be born with autism. I say "born with" because we always knew there was something wrong, but did not get an official diagnosis until we was about 3. It's not like everything was perfect until one day he got a shot and suddenly changed. Since he was our first child, we didn't really have anything to compare his development to. People told us not to worry that he didn't talk. We heard several times that boys talk later than girls, smart kids talk later, this is later, that is later, so on and so forth. His pediatrician was concerned early on that certain milestones were not being met. The first time the word "autism" was brought up, I rejected it right away. I had worked with people with autism, and I should know, right? Or did my fear that it was true keep me from seeing what was right in front of my face...

We tried the diets (gluten free, casein free), which only made him lose weight because he didn't like any of the food that met the requirements. We've tried different behavior therapies, social groups, etc... But I digress.

I have never fallen into the vaccine explanation. It seems that there was always something there. It might be more accurate to say that there was always something missing. He was starting to develop speech, although very late, and then it disappeared completely, but I see the timing as a coincidence. My wife feels that it (vaccines) might be a trigger, or related, but not the cause.

I keep hoping that they will find a cure, or even the cause. We donate money, we donate time, we walk, we do all the things that we are able to do, so it disappoints me to see efforts wasted. When I read recently that the main research for a link to vaccines was based on fraudulent data, I was beyond furious. How much time was wasted? How much money was wasted? How many of these resources could have been used elsewhere?

I'm not saying that they shouldn't look at every angle, but if you do the research and there is no link, don't make shit up and say there is.

672 Utah Chris  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 7:30:40am

Let me repeat what I said on a previous post. I think people are confusing the issue. It is not the "vaccine" that is being hyped as the cause of autism. It is the preservative in the cocktail of vaccines administered. The preservative is thimerosol, an organomercury compound. Thimerosol is not used with the single vaccines we requested. We did not wish to expose our children to high mercury in a vaccine cocktail so elected to pay extra to get the individual vaccine doses separately that do not contain thimerosol.

Looking at this Johns Hopkins Table, you can see Thimerosol is common in many vaccines including the annual flue shots and tetanus boosters usually in the range of 25 micrograms / milliliter. Considering the vaccine is about 5 milliliters, you would receive about 125 micrograms in a single dose.

[Link: www.vaccinesafety.edu...]

I'm no doctor but work as a Chemical Engineer. If you compare this dosage against the OSHA Permissible Exposure Limit for airborne (respirable) organomercury at 0.01 milligrams/cubic meter time weighted average and the ceiling of 0.04 milligrams/cubic meter, this puts you in the ball park to exceed the OSHA PEL. Although, one it is still comparing apples to oranges when comparing a respirable TWA to a injected concentration. I would think both would have similar effects upon the central nervous system.

I am not convinced one way or the other. My wife and I discussed it and asked for single doses for our children that do not contain thimerosol as a preservative simply to reduce the overall risk posed to our children and to eliminate an unknown variable from our children's lives while still gaining the protection of the vaccine.

My point is, there is an alternative to many of the vaccines for the nervous nellies out there to excludes thimerosol.

673 Land Shark  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 7:43:57am

Everything I've read about this horrible disease of autism points to it being a neurological condition that's present in the child at birth. Until there is real evidence that this is somehow caused by vaccines it's the height of madness not to vaccinate against all those deadly yet preventable diseases. To allow these diseases to have free reign over what amounts to an unfounded rumor, I just don't know what to say to that.

674 korla pundit  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 7:48:00am
I should know. All three of my kids are autistic.

I'm betting they're not. Not really.

Since the definition of autism has been loosened again and again over the decades, by a psychiatric industry that already targets children (ADHD, etc.) to hawk their very profitable pharmaceuticals, it's only a matter of time before ALL children are considered autistic to some level, and dangerous drugs are forced on them, with the government and school system as enforcers.

I've seen children's lives irrevocably destroyed by the pharmas. They grow up on Ritalin (basically meth) and Prozac, and become zombie teenagers with agoraphobia and obsessive compulsive disorder. All because some teacher thought they daydreamed too much in class.

Mostly, these are normal children. They're not small adults. They're children, and if they act like children, it's because, well, they are. When will we stop allowing the overdiagnosis of children by the snake oil industry and the totalitarian school system?

I know autism is real, and it's frustrating. But we still don't even understand just what it really is. How dare people insist they know that it's caused by vaccines, when they don't even know what is going on physiologically?

But worst of all, to subject these same children, and millions of others, to outbreaks of diseases that used to routinely wipe out families, is beyond irresponsible. It is child abuse, and potentially murder.

675 rabbit  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 8:13:06am

re: #217 Mich-again

Not to be flippant at all but I wonder if some children who used to be diagnosed as R* are now diagnosed as A*. This chart from the same source you cited shows a deep and steady decline in cases of R* over roughly the same period.

Easily explainable. Abortion. The biggest cause of mental retardation is Down Syndrome, identifiable by amnio. Many families today choose not to bring to term a fetus with Down Syndrome, the the rate of mental retardation is going down.

Most people who truly research autism, including Jenny McCarthy, are NOT anti-vaccine. But the number of vaccines given in the first 30 months of life has increased dramatically in the past 25 years. An infant with a strong immune system can clearly handle that...but can an infant with a relatively weak immune system handle the same number of vaccines in such a short period of time? NO ONE has looked into that. Even the US government recently agreed that some children with a previously undiagnosed mitochondrial disorder were damaged by the amount of vaccine they received in a short period of time. Many parents of kids on the autism spectrum can show you the medical bills/diagnoses, etc. documenting that their kids had an unusually high number of illnesses during that same time period that all those vaccines were being given. That isn't to say that the vaccines caused the illnesses; rather, the kids were already showing signs of relatively weak immune systems, but were being vaccinated at the same rate as the well kids - AND 2x, 3x, even 5x as often as their parents had been.

Refusing all vaccinations is dumb. But refusing to consider whether ALL infants - preemies, those with weakened immune systems, etc. - can handle the current schedule and number of vaccines...well, that is even dumber.

676 Perplexed  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 8:34:49am

Thimerosol

From the article:

In the U.S., the European Union, and a few other affluent countries, thiomersal is no longer used as a preservative in routine childhood vaccination schedules.[1] In the U.S., the only exceptions among vaccines routinely recommended for children are some formulations of the inactivated influenza vaccine for children older than two years.[5] Several vaccines that are not routinely recommended for young children do contain thiomersal, including DT (diphtheria and tetanus), Td (tetanus and diphtheria), and TT (tetanus toxoid); other vaccines may contain a trace of thiomersal from steps in manufacture.[3] Also, four rarely used treatments for pit viper, coral snake, and black widow venom still contain thiomersal.[6] Outside North America and Europe, many vaccines contain thiomersal; the World Health Organization has concluded that there is no evidence of toxicity from thiomersal in vaccines and no reason on safety grounds to change to more-expensive single-dose administration.[7]

[edit] Toxicology

Thiomersal is very toxic by inhalation, ingestion, and in contact with skin (EC hazard symbol T+), with a danger of cumulative effects. It is also very toxic to aquatic organisms and may cause long-term adverse effects in aquatic environments (EC hazard symbol N).[8] In the body, it is metabolized or degraded to ethylmercury (C2H5Hg+) and thiosalicylate.[3]

Few studies of the toxicity of thiomersal in humans have been performed. Animal experiments suggest that thiomersal rapidly dissociates to release ethylmercury after injection; that the disposition patterns of mercury are similar to those after exposure to equivalent doses of ethylmercury chloride; and that the central nervous system and the kidneys are targets, with lack of motor coordination being a common sign. Similar signs and symptoms have been observed in accidental human poisonings. The mechanisms of toxic action are unknown. Fecal excretion accounts for most of the elimination from the body. Ethylmercury clears from blood with a half-time of about 18 days, and from the brain in about 14 days. Inorganic mercury metabolized from ethylmercury has a much longer clearance, at least 120 days; it appears to be much less toxic than the inorganic mercury produced from mercury vapor, for reasons not yet understood.[9]

Risk assessment for effects on the nervous system have been made by extrapolating from dose-response relationships for methylmercury.[9] Methylmercury and ethylmercury distributes to all body tissues, crossing the blood-brain barrier and the placental barrier, and ethylmercury also moves freely throughout the body.[10] Concerns based on extrapolations from methylmercury caused thiomersal to be removed from U.S. childhood vaccines, starting in 1999. Since then, it has been found that ethylmercury is cleared from the body and the brain significantly faster than methylmercury, so the late-1990s risk assessments turned out to be overly conservative.[9] A 2008 study found that the half-life of blood mercury after vaccination averages 3.7 days for newborns and infants, much shorter than the 44 days for methylmercury.[11]

It would seem to be an issue of only children born before 2001.

677 lurking faith  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 8:41:12am

re: #672 Utah Chris

Thimerosol is not supposed to be included in most of the vaccines given to small children. On that chart you linked, most of the versions that include thimerosol are adult versions.

678 Korla Pundit  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 8:44:51am
Refusing all vaccinations is dumb. But refusing to consider whether ALL infants - preemies, those with weakened immune systems, etc. - can handle the current schedule and number of vaccines...well, that is even dumber.

Fine, but we're talking about autism, which is not tied to vaccinations in any way. We are also talking about the refusal of all vaccines, which is madness. Finally, we have the redefinition of autism to include children with perfectly normal faculties, perhaps a form of Munchausen by Proxy Disorder on the part of the parents.

In a nutshell, no pun intended, we are talking about mass hysteria and the madness of crowds. We are also talking about criminal fraud by demented fake researchers publishing lies, and the alternative-medical industry and the mass media that willfully push their deception on a vulnerable and desperate target audience. Even when the fraud has been revealed, it's a genie that you can't get back into Pandora's box.

It's another case, I think (like BDS), of the Internet being a strong engine of magnification of paranoid delusions by providing a level of instantaneous reinforcement that psychotics worldwide have never had at their fingertips before. The closest we had until now were UFO conventions, where dozens of people with mental illness would amplify eachothers madness, trade details of their delusions, and build it up to a formal consensus of crazies.

Now they meet virtually, in the thousands.

Psychotics + a million other psychotics + Internet = TrUtHeRs!

679 StillAMarine  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 8:49:20am

re: #2 Sharmuta

What about the shoes of people who have had to live with the diseases these vaccinations prevent?

I am the parent of two autistic children, and know very well about the humiliation, pain, and expense involved in raising them to become productive adults. However, Sharmuta is absolutely correct to remind us of what parents of dead, crippled and maimed children have to live with as a result of these easily preventable diseases.
By the way, my older son is studying nanotechnology at a community college, and his instructors are trying to get him to go for a PhD in the subject. My younger son is an A honours student in high school, and is a Senior Apprentice with Shodor (www.shodor.org).

680 lurking faith  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:01:00am

re: #658 chemicalcorpse

While there may be some question as to exactly when and how much vaccination a child can safely and effectively process, this does not eliminate the need to prevent deadly and crippling diseases as much as we can.

You want to cite the epidemological record? How's this: the diseases we vaccinate everybody against have largely disappeared. However, they are still out there, and what with the level of world travel these days, you are not safe from them no matter where you live. And whenever and wherever significant groups of people decide they don't need vaccination (usually because they think it's all some stupid plot), those diseases make a comeback.

You say, if you are not vaccinated and I am, I shouldn't worry. Wrong. First, vaccination is not necessarily 100 percent effective, and I could be susceptible. Second, what if I have a child who is too young for the vaccine, or a loved one with a severely compromised immune system (due to cancer treatment, or other causes), and I come into contact with someone like you? I could carry death home to them.

You are not just risking yourself and your own family; you are risking everybody else's.

Don't you know that in the last few years, we've had numerous measles outbreaks in the US? They center on clusters of the unvaccinated. But not all the victims are those who chose (or whose parents chose) to skip vaccination.

681 Sacred Plants  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:05:40am

Doctors need to earn the trust of people starting from zero, just like priests, politicians, teachers, writers, artists, or any other activity that originates from an aspect of the entity of a shaman. When the necessity of this spiritual investment is neglected, the upper limit of knowledge among the professional group is under the risk to be determined by the principle of Mithridate and Theriac for an unspecified amount of time.

Convince me of vaccination. Why is this kind of treatment beneficial to my kid? Conservatively speaking, why should I hand the burden of evidence to the skeptics rather than to the innovators? How do you make sure that the treatment offered is any safer than money at the bank?

682 Perplexed  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:14:11am

re: #681 Sacred Plants

Well, there exists people who I go to just because they either know more about a subject than I do or have the proper tools to deal with a problem. Doctors are one of that group. Do I absolutely trust all doctors? No. Being an informed patient is much better for both parties than is being uninformed. You've got to know which questions to ask and what answers are likely to give you that warm fuzzy feeling.

As to vaccinations, well, when your kid comes down with a preventable disease that has him/her puking out his guts for a week or so, going deaf/blind, becoming a cripple, etc. you, as a parent must take responsibility for not taking care of your child.

683 Utah Chris  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:17:07am

re: #677 lurking faith

Thank you for pointing this out. I did not represent the data as applying to children, but only presented the chart to make the point that thimerosol is common as a preservative in many vaccines.

We asked our pediatrician for the MSDS for each vaccine and carefully evaluated them before making a decision on administering which vaccine. In some cases, we requested individual vaccinations as opposed to cocktail vaccines that contained thimerosol.

Now that our children are a bit older, we are less cautious, but nonetheless, continue to evaluate every drug and vaccine our doctor recommends before authorization. Call us careful or paranoid or whatever you want, but that is our obligation to evaluate the risks vs. benefits before administering any drugs or vaccines.

Once again, thank you for pointing that out.

684 mrl325i  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:18:03am

Affluent suburbs + parents who waited to have kids in order to achieve said affluence + IVF to then make those kids possible = many autistic kids.

School districts are seeing their caseloads of autistic kids rise tremendously and the costs to care and educate them are huge (and growing, as these parents are usually educated and savvy and very angry).

The IVF industry is very rich and influential, so very little research is being done in the US to see if there is a causal relationship. Some research is being done in Europe and questions are being raised.

This is a touchy subject.

685 Perplexed  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:22:09am

re: #684 mrl325i

Touchy indeed. What if IVF is somehow flawed? Who, in our litigationous society will be held liable?

686 DisturbedEma  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:24:23am

re: #679 StillAMarine

I am the parent of two autistic children, and know very well about the humiliation, pain, and expense involved in raising them to become productive adults. However, Sharmuta is absolutely correct to remind us of what parents of dead, crippled and maimed children have to live with as a result of these easily preventable diseases.
By the way, my older son is studying nanotechnology at a community college, and his instructors are trying to get him to go for a PhD in the subject. My younger son is an A honours student in high school, and is a Senior Apprentice with Shodor (www.shodor.org).

Yes- humiliation of coming in contact with the PC non believers who look at my kids like they are filthy and shoo my kids away from theirs. . .

My severely autistic son is a friendly, now very verbal sweetheart who is kept close to the house because of the surrounding moonbat asshats. . .

687 DisturbedEma  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:25:10am

re: #685 Perplexed

Touchy indeed. What if IVF is somehow flawed? Who, in our litigationous society will be held liable?

Google IVF and "wrong embryo" that should give you a clue where it will go. . .

688 lurking faith  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:26:41am

re: #681 Sacred Plants

Do some research. Look at disease rates before and after vaccination for specific diseases became widespread. Look at child mortality rates then and now.

And look up what full-blown cases of some of these diseases can do.

TB is on the rise - and some of it resistant to every drug we can throw at it.
Measles keeps breaking out in the US, centered on unvaccinated populations. You want your kids dead, blind, or severely brain-damaged?
How about whooping cough? You want to watch helplessly as your child, wracked with pain, struggles to breathe?
Polio still exists in the world, too (specifically because "skeptical" conspiracy theorists blocked vaccination in part of Nigeria), and some traveler could bring it home to your neighborhood. Enjoy your iron lung.

I could go on, but I have better things to do than do your homework for you. (Besides, the doctors have done their homework. And if you don't trust them, why would you trust me?)

689 Sacred Plants  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:27:39am

re: #682 Perplexed

Concerning the scenario that the absence of the treatment might be more risky than the treatment, the fruitful question to ask is where does the disease come from, or has it always been here?

690 Robert F  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:29:27am

The autism/vaccine debate is not so simple an issue that one can simply state that there is no link as gospel. As parents of an autistic child, we have done our own investigating and are arriving at the conclusion that there is at least a small link. Here is the (simplified) reason for that conclusion: My wife's family has high levels of metals in their blood. Normally safe things, like copper and iron. It is because they lack the ability to eliminate these and other metals. The combination of this inability to process metals and vaccines appear to increase the odds for developing autism.
That explains why one can have studies exonerating vaccines while others are convinced that vaccines contribute.
I'm reminded of the phrase: " There are no Absolutes" and it's rejoinder: "Absolutely no Absolutes?" Think about it, and don't be so judgmental.

691 DisturbedEma  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:29:46am

re: #688 lurking faith

Do some research. Look at disease rates before and after vaccination for specific diseases became widespread. Look at child mortality rates then and now.

And look up what full-blown cases of some of these diseases can do.

TB is on the rise - and some of it resistant to every drug we can throw at it.
Measles keeps breaking out in the US, centered on unvaccinated populations. You want your kids dead, blind, or severely brain-damaged?
How about whooping cough? You want to watch helplessly as your child, wracked with pain, struggles to breathe?
Polio still exists in the world, too (specifically because "skeptical" conspiracy theorists blocked vaccination in part of Nigeria), and some traveler could bring it home to your neighborhood. Enjoy your iron lung.

I could go on, but I have better things to do than do your homework for you. (Besides, the doctors have done their homework. And if you don't trust them, why would you trust me?)

The day I take medical advice from an empty headed bimbo who gave her child plant food and anti funguals will be a cold day in hell

692 mrl325i  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:31:49am

re: #685 Perplexed

Touchy indeed. What if IVF is somehow flawed? Who, in our litigationous society will be held liable?

Good question. IVF is almost commonplace today but it is a very radical thing to do to a body. Maybe it is tricking the failsafes that are built into our genetic protections against passing along faulty genes?

In my small part of the world I know of at least 25 autistic children and only one was not an IVF baby. I think this should be looked at as closely as the vaccine issue is, but it is a much more emotional issue to discuss without appearing to be assigning blame to the people who wanted nothing more than to be parents.

693 Sacred Plants  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:32:00am

re: #688 lurking faith

Are you suggesting the rise of diseases is a result of overpopulation?

694 lurking faith  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:33:43am

re: #683 Utah Chris

I know you didn't say the data applied to children, but somebody could have misread you as implying that. Also, the chart itself assumes you know which is which. (faith's internet posting rule 1: If it's at all possible for something to be misinterpreted, it will be!)

I don't blame you a bit for being cautious about how many vaccines your kids got at one time. I know when I was little, I got basically every vaccine available at the time (we traveled), but my pediatrician spaced them out. To me, it seems only sensible to avoid overloading the immune system if you possibly can.

695 Robert F  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:33:46am

re: #684 mrl325i

Touchy, indeed. I would say that is one of the most insane explanations for autism I've ever heard. Think about it, how many IVF's do you think are done? None that I know of in our autistic community.

696 DisturbedEma  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:34:08am

re: #690 Robert F

The autism/vaccine debate is not so simple an issue that one can simply state that there is no link as gospel. As parents of an autistic child, we have done our own investigating and are arriving at the conclusion that there is at least a small link. Here is the (simplified) reason for that conclusion: My wife's family has high levels of metals in their blood. Normally safe things, like copper and iron. It is because they lack the ability to eliminate these and other metals. The combination of this inability to process metals and vaccines appear to increase the odds for developing autism.
That explains why one can have studies exonerating vaccines while others are convinced that vaccines contribute.
I'm reminded of the phrase: " There are no Absolutes" and it's rejoinder: "Absolutely no Absolutes?" Think about it, and don't be so judgmental.

Puleeze- first of all, did the studies, now debunked, show the metal levels of parents? No- the culprit was and is for them, the shots- blaming ingredients that have not been in them for a decade,and the fact that many autistic kids show sx BEFORE the shots. . .or are you blaming something other than MMR? DaPT or what?

The study, now debunked at false data, IIRC did not look at the parents at all, or do you have a link to share of a study that did show the parents metal content was studied?

697 solomonpanting  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:36:19am

re: #693 Sacred Plants

Are you suggesting the rise of diseases is a result of overpopulation?

How did you arrive at that question?

698 lurking faith  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:43:43am

re: #693 Sacred Plants

No. Do not put words into my mouth. What I was pointing out is that, in the presence of contagious disease, people who have been vaccinated against that disease are vastly more likely to avoid contacting that disease.

And regarding your "deep" question in 689, the disease predates the vaccine for the disease, every time.

But I am not going to argue with you anymore, as it looks to me like you are a new-age stone-ager. If you want to go live in a cave without any post-industrial conveniences like electricity, medicine that has been scientifically tested, etc., by all means log off the internet and do so.

699 funky chicken  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:47:21am

re: #684 mrl325i

School districts are seeing their caseloads of autistic kids rise tremendously and the costs to care and educate them are huge (and growing, as these parents are usually educated and savvy and very angry).

Actually, school districts are seeing their caseloads rise because now everybody expects the public schools to provide full services for special needs kids. I went to public schools and we simply didn't have kids with more than minor learning disabilities in the classroom. They went to a "special school" that was down the street from the public schools.

That special school from my old home town is now closed, and all the handicapped kids are just thrown into the neighborhood public school.

And the wealthy parents of special needs kids can be the most obnoxious about demanding that the state schools cater to their kids' very expensive needs. There was a high profile case last year where multi-millionaire parents in NYC sued the school district over this issue. These are people who could easily afford the best special-needs private schooling available.....but they are liberals, so they believe that average American citizens should pay to educate their special needs kids.

700 funky chicken  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:50:15am

re: #689 Sacred Plants

Concerning the scenario that the absence of the treatment might be more risky than the treatment, the fruitful question to ask is where does the disease come from, or has it always been here?

The US government invented rubeola measles back in the 1500s to wipe out the black population. Also the US government invented smallpox back in the 1300s to wipe out other kinds of brown people.

Amazing, isn't it?

701 funky chicken  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 9:54:28am

re: #600 Macker

Lizards, I need some advice.
I've had this roommate for a year and a half. He moved his girlfriend all the way in from CT to AZ early last month. She got a job very quickly (working in medical records). He's still insisting that I still pay 1/2 the rent. He hasn't added her to the lease yet, nor has he gotten renter's insurance.
What pisses me off is that last year, when my girlfriend at the time (this was before the Lady E came back into my life) considered moving here, he offered to split the rent 3 ways Now he goes back on this?
Am I looking at this the right way? What should I do?

split the rent three ways, or get a new place to live as soon as this lease term ends.

I might recommend doing the latter anyway since he refuses to get renter's insurance.

702 Noam Chumpski  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 10:03:10am

Is Ms. McCarthy also crusading against the Democrats bill (and signed by Pres. Bush) that will ban the use of incandescent bulbs to be replaced with the CFL which has massive levels of mecury in them (and emit a nasty, green light that gives me headaches).

Isn't mercury what most of her argument relies on?

December, 2007:
In addition to raising auto fuel efficiency standards 40 percent, an energy bill passed by Congress yesterday bans the incandescent light bulb by 2014.

President Bush signed the 822-page measure into law today after it was sent up Pennsylvania Avenue in a Toyota Prius hybrid vehicle. The House passed the bill by a 314-100 vote after approval by the Senate last week.

Rep. John D. Dingell, D-Mich., chairman of the House Energy and Commerce Committee, said the legislation will boost the energy efficiency of "almost every significant product and tool and appliance that we use, from light bulbs to light trucks."

The phase-out of incandescent light is to begin with the 100-watt bulb in 2012 and end in 2014 with the 40-watt.

All light bulbs must use 25 percent to 30 percent less 2014. By 2020, bulbs must be 70 percent more efficient than they are today.

703 Noam Chumpski  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 10:05:27am

re: #600 Macker

Lizards, I need some advice.
I've had this roommate for a year and a half. He moved his girlfriend all the way in from CT to AZ early last month. She got a job very quickly (working in medical records). He's still insisting that I still pay 1/2 the rent. He hasn't added her to the lease yet, nor has he gotten renter's insurance.
What pisses me off is that last year, when my girlfriend at the time (this was before the Lady E came back into my life) considered moving here, he offered to split the rent 3 ways Now he goes back on this?
Am I looking at this the right way? What should I do?

If you have your own bathroom and room and they are sharing split it 40%-30%-30%?

704 Noam Chumpski  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 10:06:00am

My post #702 has some bad typos... and a missing question mark... Geez...

705 StillAMarine  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 10:10:46am

re: #692 mrl325i

In my small part of the world I know of at least 25 autistic children and only one was not an IVF baby. I think this should be looked at as closely as the vaccine issue is, but it is a much more emotional issue to discuss without appearing to be assigning blame to the people who wanted nothing more than to be parents.

Neither of my sons are IVF babys. However, I do think it might be a very good idea to investigate this avenue further.
It is my understanding that the spectrum of autistic disorders involves a very complex relationship between several chromosomes, #15 being one of them. That is NOT to say for certain that there are no "triggers" to cause a pre-existing genetic condition to manifest itself, though.
The whole issue remains a puzzle.

706 lurking faith  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 10:15:13am

re: #698 lurking faith

PIMF

...vastly more likely to avoid contracting that disease.

arrgh

707 Perplexed  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 11:09:31am

re: #689 Sacred Plants

Concerning the scenario that the absence of the treatment might be more risky than the treatment, the fruitful question to ask is where does the disease come from, or has it always been here?

In the case of small pox humans were the carriers and disease reservoir and it has been around for a very long time. It was only the efforts of many to eradicate small pox that we no longer have it as the disfiguring/deadly scourge. I've known small pox survivors and it can be incredibly disfiguring.

As to where the rest of the diseases come from I would look to diseases that jump from one species to another as being the primary source of most diseases. We've seen that in both bird flu and swine flu. There's some suspicion that Ebola might be one of the species jumping diseases and is so very deadly because we have no immunity to it.

708 Red Lion  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 12:50:14pm

Charles, your searching honesty and intelligence are a beacon in times of darkness! More power to you ...

709 american sabra  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 1:26:10pm

At the risk of replying to a dead thread....

#707 Perplexed and #689 Sacred Plants

I'm not sure we can stop the origination of diseases. Well ultimately, this is what science wants, but what we can stop is the spread and that's through vaccination. The largest problem here isn't so much YOUR child contracting a disease that has been virtually erradicated (it really only takes one kid), but that your child will in turn give it to lots of other kids who are not vaccinated and so on, and so on. I haven't followed all the threads here on the subject, but the outbreaks, I believe in Michigan recently and elsewhere show the unthinkable irresponsibility of parents such as McCarthy that would risk the lives of many, many children, and quite frankly the general population, when it's completely unnecessary.

710 Emerald  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 1:43:52pm

re: #689 Sacred Plants

Concerning the scenario that the absence of the treatment might be more risky than the treatment, the fruitful question to ask is where does the disease come from, or has it always been here?


I'm assuming you're being serious. Records of diseases exist as far back as written records. It goes even further back in the anthropological record. Many diseases leave telltale markers on skeletons, and we know for a fact that many of them have been around for a very, very long time.

Other diseases aren't as old. The first recorded case of Ebola showed up less than 40 years ago and probably jumped species. New strains of the flu crop up because the viruses mutate like crazy. Salmonella in eggs wasn't a problem until relatively recently.

711 sam8  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 4:10:37pm

It isn't the vaccines, as countless studies have shown, that causes autism (although it's shocking the number of vaccines babies get in the first year of life).

I always wonder why there aren't more studies of women who have had fertility treatments and the percentage of their children with autism compared to those who conceived without aid. I suspect that the age of the mother and fertility treatments, IVF in particular, have a bigger link to autism than vaccines.

With IVF, the eggs are graded for their quality and many parents, I know a few, have used lower quality eggs in their desperate attempt to get pregnant. One family I know did that and have autistic twins.

Isn't it interesting that as more women have had fertility treatments in the last decade we've also seen a dramatic increase in the number of children dianosed with autism?

Of course every quirky kid seems to be diagnosed with something in the autism spectrum these days. Some schools push the diagnosis because they get federal aid for aides that way.

712 Sacred Plants  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 11:20:33pm

re: #697 solomonpanting

I jumped species. You don´t need to be trained as a doctor to see that animal overpopulation breeds disease. It´s dinner conversation.

713 Sacred Plants  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 11:31:15pm

re: #698 lurking faith

No thanks, I don´t want to live in your dystopian bunker. We do find the phenomenon of contagious disease in computers as well, and servicepacks are not necessarily the best risk management. This is because programmers can only react to known viruses, worms, and trojans. The human body might appear as a quite stupid design, with all those loopholes for infections, but then again it is much more capable to deal with the unknown threat than the most intelligently designed program.

714 Sacred Plants  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 11:42:06pm

re: #709 american sabra

Deep threads may live on slowly for a while before they die.

What do you see as the best method to avoid becoming a multiplicator of an unknown threat?

715 Sacred Plants  Thu, Apr 2, 2009 11:44:48pm

re: #707 Perplexed

re: #710 Emerald

Thanks for elaborating. I don´t have the opportunity to get that question answered like that every day.


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