Indeed. Also because of Muslim teachings.

I don't know if I should start taking bets on the Black Death.

/in b4 RACIST!

It's stories like these that make me so happy both of my kids have received all their vaccines.

Bad craziness all around.

I wonder how much it has to do with anti-Semitic kookery too, though.

No doubt some of these diseases have been brought in to Britain by immigrants from the Third World, but it is because of the anti-vaccination nutters that these diseases are now spreading.

Does the UK require proof of vaccination for immigrants?

Vaccinations and quarantines actually worked, so sure, let's ban their use.

Hmm- the article is lacking any demographic information, but with a number of paranoid fantasies about vaccines being a Zionist plot in certain circles and the autism factor coming from others, it's not surprising this is happening.

Has autism now decreased by 214 per cent?

The rise could be a result of parents refusing the MMR jab after now-debunked claims in 2001 that it might be linked to autism.

Perhaps it's a result of that fear. But I'm sure there's a link between parents who refuse vaccinations for their children and stupidity.

re: #9 Sharmuta

Why would I not be surprised if the Nazis were anti-vaccination because TEH JOOZ were running the big pharmaceutical companies?

Well if someone wanted to accomplish population control they got their wish in these fools. None of these idiots will take the credit for increasing the health risk of both the vaccinated and unvaccinated alike nor will the consequences puncture their skulls or their consciences. May God spare us.

typhoid, whooping cough and scarlet fever mumps -

vaccine preventable diseases in bold type.
the other two aren't

FYI

re: #12 laZardo

It's the islamists.

re: #6 Ringo the Gringo

No doubt some of these diseases have been brought in to Britain by immigrants from the Third World, but it is because of the anti-vaccination nutters that these diseases are now spreading.

With the immigration health standards now at an all time low in the U.S. it is amazing that we haven't had more outbreaks. Speaks well of our present health system. Let's change it.
/

I'm old enough to remember Preparation A, so I grew up before several of our current vaccines were available. I've had the pleasure of having the mumps, both kinds of measles, chicken pox and whooping cough. I vaccinated my kids. My kids are getting their kids vaccinated.

As a kid I went straight from the measles into whooping cough. I honestly thought I was going to die. Pretty awful feeling for a 7-year old. Vaccinate.

Scarlet fever is a complication of strep, and there is no vaccine. Why it's more common, though, I don't have a clue.

re: #14 Shug

typhoid, whooping cough and scarlet fever mumps -

vaccine preventable diseases in bold type.
the other two aren't

FYI

Typhoid indicates that people aren't washing their hands.

Islamic cleric claims vaccinations are a "Jewish conspiracy"

re: #7 KingKenrod

Does the UK require proof of vaccination for immigrants?

Good question. Probably not since it would humiliate the immigrant.

also, members of a certain religion seem to have an issue with hygeine. Soap, and hand washing in hospitals just one example.

Seems to me that you should be allowed to not vaccinate your children, but if that's what you choose, then your children should not be allowed to interact with the rest of the population...I do believe Britain has some uninhabited islands up in the north of Scotland where these folks could live...sort of like the leper colonies of old.

I wonder if part of this rise in infectious diseases can also be attributed to the ease of modern travel. I remember the SAR virus that IIRC was deemed particularly dangerous because of it's ability to transit the globe through normal travel.
This story illustrates all the more need to take prophylactic measures wherever possible.

I'm thinking... melty around #300.

re: #14 Shug

typhoid, whooping cough and scarlet fever mumps -

vaccine preventable diseases in bold type.
the other two aren't

FYI

Don't forget to get your booster for tetanus - DPT.

re: #15 Sharmuta

I'll come out and say that Islamic fundamentalists are so far-right/reactionary (in their obsession with bringing back their "good ol' days") that I don't get why Marxists want to associate with them.

/c'mon beer, do your thing...

Again...
Teeny, tiny baby coffins.

re: #2 laZardo

I don't know if I should start taking bets on the Black Death.

/in b4 RACIST!

I wouldn't worry too much about the Black Death. It's all the viruses that are floating around that bother me at times. With all this kook factor saying that preventing illness is wrong and harmful, and other things going on...

/we may have some dark times ahead.

Bring on National Health in the US and we will also see an increase in these forgotten diseases.

I don't vaccinate my kids, 'cause it might harm them.

I don't buckle my kids in the car, 'cause in a crash they won't be able to escape.

I don't educate my kids, 'cause those Evolutionist might contaminate their brains.

*sigh*

The problem is these folks lack common sense. They see that these diseases are rare, therefore they think risk of infection is exaggerated. The truth is these diseases are rare because of the vaccines. They pay attention to the make-believe risk of the vaccines, while ignoring the historical record of what happens to people who don't get vaccinated.

The real bitch is that it's the innocent kids who suffer.

the problem with those nutty fools is that they risk others, as sickness can spread more easy.

shlomi

re: #17 okiej

There is a vaccine for Shingles available now for those of us in that pre-vaccine age group. About a 2 month waiting list in the SF Bay Area and you need a Rx from your pri care MD.

re: #23 LGoPs

I wonder if part of this rise in infectious diseases can also be attributed to the ease of modern travel. I remember the SAR virus that IIRC was deemed particularly dangerous because of it's ability to transit the globe through normal travel.
This story illustrates all the more need to take prophylactic measures wherever possible.

Condom Thread!

///

Also a factor, the increase in resistant strains.

re: #27 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Again...
Teeny, tiny baby coffins.

That's what I'm afraid of.

re: #28 BlueCanuck

Like the bubonic plague.

/hence the reference...

re: #34 jcm

Condom Thread!

Happy Sunday!

/remembers what he called the Hump Day threads. Good times.

re: #33 Bobibutu

There is a vaccine for Shingles available now for those of us in that pre-vaccine age group. About a 2 month waiting list in the SF Bay Area and you need a Rx from your pri care MD.

My wife and I just got ours a couple of weeks ago. We also were on the list for a few months down here in LA.
Ironically, I contracted shingles when I was in the Army in Germany and I was in my late twenties. It was the most horrible thinh I've ever had.

re: #27 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Again...
Teeny, tiny baby coffins.

Very sad.

re: #14 Shug

typhoid, whooping cough and scarlet fever mumps -

vaccine preventable diseases in bold type.
the other two aren't

FYI

Yeah...scarlet fever is just strep throat gone too long. My kid actually had it in kindergarten...kept calling the doctor, nurse kept telling me it was just the flu that was going around, no need to bring her in...after 5-6 days I insisted on an appointment anyway

So scarlet fever--NHS type triage/rationing of care.

Typhoid--immigrants and poor hygiene. shudder

The other two? Immigrants and anti-vax hysteria.

re: #34 jcm

Condom Thread!

///

Also a factor, the increase in resistant strains.

I can't condone a condom thread at this point. Although I mayo consider a condiments thread...
/

re: #19 Dianna

Typhoid indicates that people aren't washing their hands.

Again- that could be indicative of certain immigrant communities. I think this is a "perfect storm" situation, where two different anti-vax communities have joined to create a very unhealthy situation in the UK. I wonder how the continent is fairing- Paris, Berlin, etc.

re: #26 laZardo

I'll come out and say that Islamic fundamentalists are so far-right/reactionary (in their obsession with bringing back their "good ol' days") that I don't get why Marxists want to associate with them.

/c'mon beer, do your thing...

it's the extremist/moronic convergence in action yet again

re: #19 Dianna

Typhoid indicates that people aren't washing their hands.

Wasn't this a concern with Muslim nurses who refuse to expose their wrists?

re: #34 jcm

New National Symbol

re: #12 laZardo

It's the islamists.

No...it's the idiots...but both do start with I

re: #44 MandyManners

Wasn't this a concern with Muslim nurses who refuse to expose their wrists?

Fire them.

re: #42 Sharmuta

Again- that could be indicative of certain immigrant communities. I think this is a "perfect storm" situation, where two different anti-vax communities have joined to create a very unhealthy situation in the UK. I wonder how the continent is fairing- Paris, Berlin, etc.

See my No. 44, please. I have this vague recollection about Muslim nurses.

re: #36 laZardo

I don't think the Bubonic plague is that much of an issue in modern industrialized times. Proper hygenie, lots of cats, knowledge, and anitbiotics help with this. Doesn't mean it might not make a come back.

re: #38 LGoPs

My wife and I just got ours a couple of weeks ago. We also were on the list for a few months down here in LA.
Ironically, I contracted shingles when I was in the Army in Germany and I was in my late twenties. It was the most horrible thinh I've ever had.

Woah! Usually dormant till 60+. I have heard it's the worst.

re: #27 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Again...
Teeny, tiny baby coffins.

I just saw a House rerun that had an anti-vax mother and infant visiting the clinic, and Dr. House used that exact same line.

Speaking of anti-vaccination nuts...
The Taliban's Biological Weapon

The Pakistani Taliban are again preventing public health teams from vaccinating children against polio.
...
Two years ago, the Afghan Taliban backed off on their opposition to polio vaccinations for children. As a result, there were only 17 cases in 2007, and 31 in 2008. Most of those were "leakage" from Pakistan, where the local Taliban were not as understanding with regard to polio treatment. Radical Islamic clerics in Pakistan took the lead in pushing the idea that vaccinations for diseases are a Western plot to poison Moslem children. This particular fantasy has been rattling around for nearly a decade, and has prevented the UN from wiping out polio.

re: #45 Erik The Red

New National Symbol

That's going into my "WTF" file.

My older ones contracted Chicken Pox while in elementary school back in the 90's. My youngest one got the vaccination. I wish we had that vaccine when I was younger. I got Chicken Pox in Junior High and it was terrible.

re: #20 MJ

Islamic cleric claims vaccinations are a "Jewish conspiracy"

Aren't they already against vaccinations? All things they resist are a Jewish conspiracy to them. I put more weight of influence against vaccines on the shoulders of outspoken celebrities, and the faster spread of the diseases on what LGoPs just said, which is globe trotting. Of the legal and illegal kind.

Howdy.

It's way too glorious a spring day here in DC to spend much time at a keyboard, but I thought I'd post this bit of "DHS report" fun from the New York Times:

The Enemies Within

Charles M. Blow informs us that:

[C]onservatives reacted [to the leaked DHS report] by throwing a knee-jerk hissy fit. They twisted the report’s meaning to imply that they, and more importantly our war heroes, were being vilified by a partisan document.

Their argument seeks to suppress and subjugate two rather unfortunate facts: while only a tiny number of conservatives and veterans are members of hate groups, nearly all hate groups do indeed follow far-right ideology. And they covet members with military experience.

Pardon me if this sets the needle on my BS meter a-quiverin'. Um... so who defines "hate groups" for purposes of this assertion of "fact"? Does the definition take in, say, the International ANSWER Coalition? The Nation of Islam? If not, why not?

The piece is accompanied by a scary graphic! representing military veteran membership in various right-wing hate groups (some of whom I've never heard of), according to study. It certainly looks startling at first... until you take into account that they're showing you absolute numbers, not percentages. So, for instance, the number of military veterans in the vartious Ku Klux Klan factions comes up to a whopping total of... 17. None of the represented groups make it out of the double digits in terms of vet members; and all together total no more than few hundred.

That's not to say the phenomenon doesn't exist, of course. But this opinion piece looks like left-wing... oh, dare I say, McCarthyism?... over a relatively tiny phenomenon.

re: #48 MandyManners

I think this might be the story you're remembering:

Women training in several hospitals in England have raised objections to removing their arm coverings in theatre and to rolling up their sleeves when washing their hands, because it is regarded as immodest in Islam.

[Link: www.telegraph.co.uk...]

re: #56 Occasional Reader

That's not to say the phenomenon doesn't exist, of course. But this opinion piece looks like left-wing... oh, dare I say, McCarthyism?... over a relatively tiny phenomenon.

Nonsense.

re: #57 jaunte

Oh, good grief.

re: #57 jaunte

I think this might be the story you're remembering:

[Link: www.telegraph.co.uk...]

That's it. Thanks!

re: #51 funky chicken

That's where FBV got that line from. First brought out when we started on these anti-vax nutters.

I am just glad that country were i was born vaccines were mandatory

I wonder if a contributing factor to certain people's resistance to vaccination is the saturation of information that's indicative of our environment today. Every anamoly and potential horror story is broadcast and then magnified through repetition and then impacts, wrongly in my view, some people's perceptions of the vaccine being the culprit. I don't know how you combat that other than through more and better information.

re: #58 Killgore Trout

Nonsense.

Glad you cleared that up.

Um, have you seen the graphic I'm referring to?

re: #9 Sharmuta

Hmm- the article is lacking any demographic information, but with a number of paranoid fantasies about vaccines being a Zionist plot in certain circles and the autism factor coming from others, it's not surprising this is happening.

I've briefly glanced at some of the conspiracy theories revolving around a "Zionist plot." The demographic information of course isn't required -- I'll assume that the report in this case was trying to avoid any conflicts within the current PC environment of Labour.

Essentially the demographics involve "3rd world" immigrants into the UK who hold a Dark Ages view on immunizations. Britain cannot afford even a small amount of communicable diseases and should consider making immunization a compulsory requirement of citizenship. Furthermore, the conspiracy theory of MMR vaccines and autism must be put to rest once and for all.

re: #41 LGoPs

I would relish a condiments thread...

re: #54 Desert Dog

My older ones contracted Chicken Pox while in elementary school back in the 90's. My youngest one got the vaccination. I wish we had that vaccine when I was younger. I got Chicken Pox in Junior High and it was terrible.

out of all diseases you can acquire chicken pox is least of your worries

re: #51 funky chicken

That is where the quote came from. I actually posted the whole dialogue on the first Vaccination thread that I saw here.

Hence..."again".

re: #59 Occasional Reader

I didn't know that there were also "wrist rays."

re: #33 Bobibutu

There is a vaccine for Shingles available now for those of us in that pre-vaccine age group. About a 2 month waiting list in the SF Bay Area and you need a Rx from your pri care MD.

Shingles is really nasty. My father lost the vision in one eye to it, and a friend suffered for months.

re: #49 BlueCanuck

I don't think the Bubonic plague is that much of an issue in modern industrialized times. Proper hygenie, lots of cats, knowledge, and anitbiotics help with this. Doesn't mean it might not make a come back.

I was just trying to make a sardonically humorous play on the title and the content, that's all. >_> Taking bets on when the Black Death will start reappearing in London.

/and all the ways they used to treat it...

re: #66 elevenbravo1969

I would relish a condiments thread...

give me a minute to ketchup with the quotes

I have a mark on my shoulder from a vaccination. It never goes away.
What vaccination is that? I don't think that people get it now.

re: #56 Occasional Reader

As usual, Charles M. Blow(hard) exaggerates and overstates the case. But the people who continue to rant about and distort the DHS report have handed people like him the ammunition to do it with.

re: #70 Dianna

Shingles is really nasty. My father lost the vision in one eye to it, and a friend suffered for months.

I had no idea the effects could go that far. Awful.

re: #52 Killgore Trout

Speaking of anti-vaccination nuts...
The Taliban's Biological Weapon

That's exactly the additional kookery besides the autism that I'm talking about.

re: #73 Afrocity

smallpox vaccine

re: #73 Afrocity

I have a mark on my shoulder from a vaccination. It never goes away.
What vaccination is that? I don't think that people get it now.

Isn't that smallpox?

re: #71 laZardo

I'm sure you have heard this, but, at the risk of sounding redundant, (or even repetitive) Hiya LaZardo! Where the heck have you been?

re: #56 Occasional Reader

Howdy.

It's way too glorious a spring day here in DC to spend much time at a keyboard, but I thought I'd post this bit of "DHS report" fun from the New York Times:

The Enemies Within

Charles M. Blow informs us that:

Pardon me if this sets the needle on my BS meter a-quiverin'. Um... so who defines "hate groups" for purposes of this assertion of "fact"? Does the definition take in, say, the International ANSWER Coalition? The Nation of Islam? If not, why not?

The piece is accompanied by a scary graphic! representing military veteran membership in various right-wing hate groups (some of whom I've never heard of), according to study. It certainly looks startling at first... until you take into account that they're showing you absolute numbers, not percentages. So, for instance, the number of military veterans in the vartious Ku Klux Klan factions comes up to a whopping total of... 17. None of the represented groups make it out of the double digits in terms of vet members; and all together total no more than few hundred.

That's not to say the phenomenon doesn't exist, of course. But this opinion piece looks like left-wing... oh, dare I say, McCarthyism?... over a relatively tiny phenomenon.

Charles M Blow BLOWS...

That DHS report was a smear job. It just happens to fit Mr. Blow's preconceived and partisan view of the world.

re: #69 jaunte

I didn't know that there were also "wrist rays."

Those sinful, tempting wrists might tempt men to wild bouts of rape and murder. Which, of course, would be the women's own fault, naturally.

re: #66 elevenbravo1969

I would relish a condiments thread...

I don't know if I can mustard the courage to join in...

re: #56 Occasional Reader

The piece is accompanied by a scary graphic! representing military veteran membership in various right-wing hate groups (some of whom I've never heard of), according to study. It certainly looks startling at first... until you take into account that they're showing you absolute numbers, not percentages. So, for instance, the number of military veterans in the vartious Ku Klux Klan factions comes up to a whopping total of... 17. None of the represented groups make it out of the double digits in terms of vet members; and all together total no more than few hundred.

The point the DHS report makes, however, is that veterans with military training can greatly increase the capacity of these groups to do harm, even in relatively small numbers.

This isn't surprising at all. And on the idiot spectrum it shows up at both ends - apparently muslims are forbidden to vaccinate, and there are groups of super conservative homeschooling parents who refuse to vaccinate their kids.

Mind boggling.

re: #73 Afrocity

I have a mark on my shoulder from a vaccination. It never goes away.
What vaccination is that? I don't think that people get it now.

That's your smallpox mark.

A feel good story about our troops in Afghanistan.

Tropps.

re: #79 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Trying to get myself to like the Big O. It's actually starting to work, but Ye Accursede Zionist Minde Beams haven't quite shut off yet.

re: #75 Silvergirl

I had no idea the effects could go that far. Awful.

Yeah, it's really nasty.

re: #80 Desert Dog

That DHS report was a smear job.

No, it was not.

re: #45 Erik The Red

New National Symbol

ROFL!

re: #64 Occasional Reader

Did you read the FBI report he references? It was issued last July...
White Supremacist Recruitment of Military Personnel since 9/11

It's a legitimate concern and has been for a long time. It's sad to see conservatives abandon their position on counterterrorism and national security. It was one of their strong points for a very long time.

re: #49 BlueCanuck

I don't think the Bubonic plague is that much of an issue in modern industrialized times. Proper hygiene, lots of cats, knowledge, and antibiotics help with this. Doesn't mean it might not make a come back.

Prairie Dogs have protected sanctuaries within the Denver Metro Area. These and other rodents within the United States are to be assumed to be carrying disease borne fleas which is why many hunters will wait until the kills go cold before collecting. Every time I drive by these sanctuaries I see destroyed, undeveloped land and think of the idiots that think these animals are cute.

re: #74 Charles

As usual, Charles M. Blow(hard) exaggerates and overstates the case. But the people who continue to rant about and distort the DHS report have handed people like him the ammunition to do it with.

I think we agree. Just pointing out that the "hysteria" is not only on the right... we're seeing signs that the report WILL be used by the left to smear vets, and perhaps to create scattershot-broad definitions of "hate group". (Oops, I used a firearms metaphor, which probably means I'm a right-wing extremist!)

re: #70 Dianna

Shingles is really nasty. My father lost the vision in one eye to it, and a friend suffered for months.

Yes. There is an acquaintance here being treated for it now. He is having a rough time even with todays technology.

re: #82 LGoPs

I don't know if I can mustard the courage to join in...

I took a break and now I have to ketchup!

re: #69 jaunte

I didn't know that there were also "wrist rays."

Wrist rays

re: #83 Charles

The point the DHS report makes, however, is that veterans with military training can greatly increase the capacity of these groups to do harm, even in relatively small numbers.

That is, of course, true. But, was the point of that "warning" to inform law enforcement, or was it to taint the right in general?

re: #78 Silvergirl

Isn't that smallpox?

Yes

One of the comments:

Hardly huge numbers of people. And before anyone goes on about vaccinations, please remember vaccinations are neither 100% safe nor 100% effective. The most effective way to combat disease is good sanitation, clean water and good diet with lots of fresh veg and fruit. The rise in cases is most likely due to the poor nutritional status of those affected, a diet of junk food will result in vitamin deficiencies and increase the likelihood of contracting an infection.

That is an anti-vac in disguise. If anyone thinks good sanitation will prevent a school outbreak of scarlet fever or measles among the unvaccinated they are sadly, and possibly deadly, misinformed.

re: #83 Charles

The point the DHS report makes, however, is that veterans with military training can greatly increase the capacity of these groups to do harm, even in relatively small numbers.

That's a statement of the obvious. The DHS report was incredibly poorly written, and useless.

re: #91 Killgore Trout

From the Bush era FBI report...

This assessment examines why white supremacist extremist groups have attempted to increase their recruitment of current and former US military personnel, what success their recruitment efforts have enjoyed, and what impact such recruitment has had on the white supremacist extremist movement. The identification of current and former members of the US Armed Forces (Army, Navy, Air Force, Marine Corps, and Coast Guard) in the extremist movement draws exclusively from FBI case files from October 2001 to May 2008. It is based on the assumption that military veterans involved in white supremacist extremism may exploit their accesses to restricted areas and intelligence or apply specialized training in weapons, tactics, and organizational skills to benefit the extremist movement.

Why weren't you guys upset about this last year? It just doesn't make sense.

ignorant people who refuse vaccines for their children should be prosecuted
for child abuse. how strange that life saving modern medicine is shunned today.
these people will create a situation that will impact only them and other
like minded fools.
they will suffer the effects of living w/ a stone age mentality,
while other conscientious people protect their children.

If I were going to start a "All Desserts Belong To FBV Brigade", I'd sure try to recruit some ex-military types for the "Cake Confiscation Patrol".

Just sayin.

re: #91 Killgore Trout

Did you read the FBI report he references? It was issued last July...
White Supremacist Recruitment of Military Personnel since 9/11

It's a legitimate concern and has been for a long time. It's sad to see conservatives abandon their position on counterterrorism and national security. It was one of their strong points for a very long time.

No one's suggesting that.

Disregarding basic hygiene and modern medicine has devastating consequences. I hope all of these dark age nuts are fucking happy they're getting people sick and killed.

re: #81 Occasional Reader

Those sinful, tempting wrists might tempt men to wild bouts of rape and murder. Which, of course, would be the women's own fault, naturally.

Strictly a technical question, because I've never done any spot-welding:

It's my understanding that spot-welding doesn't generate a lot of heat.
Might it be used in fastening ... *mind wandering* ... *grasping at a fleeting whimsical thought* ... MALE chastity belts?

/JUST a technical question, of course ... *rolls eyes* ... *crickets*

re: #86 avanti

A feel good story about our troops in Afghanistan.

Tropps.

Why do you call this "feel good?" "Feel good" is a term used to describe something that is basically a fluff piece, something that has no real substance but makes you feel good, with no beneficial after effects.

"Feel good" is a put down.

So, did you term this as "feel good" to be sarcastic or what? Are you making fun of our troops or what? Clarify.

re: #102 nyc redneck

ignorant people who refuse vaccines for their children should be prosecuted
for child abuse. how strange that life saving modern medicine is shunned today.
these people will create a situation that will impact only them and other
like minded fools.
they will suffer the effects of living w/ a stone age mentality,
while other conscientious people protect their children.

i propose to make vaccination mandatory, if you want your child to have SS#, child must me vaccinated, ya i know its a bit too much, but something has to be done

re: #100 Dianna

That's a statement of the obvious. The DHS report was incredibly poorly written, and useless.

And I am sure a similar piece was done on recent veterans enrolling in left wing groups./

re: #94 Bobibutu

Yes. There is an acquaintance here being treated for it now. He is having a rough time even with todays technology.

Poor thing!

re: #86 avanti

Specialist Robert C. Oxman, 21, had put a dead fighter’s phone in his pocket. As the platoon descended, the phone rang and rang, apparently as other fighters called to find out what had happened on Sautalu Sar. By sunrise, it had been ringing for hours.

/snickering

re: #105 Sharmuta

Disregarding basic hygiene and modern medicine has devastating consequences. I hope all of these dark age nuts are fucking happy they're getting people sick and killed.

Insha'Allah!

2 AM and I'm hittin the hay. War is Peace, yadda yadda fff-

/collapsed

re: #95 jcm

I took a break and now I have to ketchup!

I think you butter spread your puns thin...there's only so much depth to this subject.

Don't know, but I suspect some of the western elite opposition to
vaccination comes from the naturalist side of things. If we eat organic
fruit and vegetables , our bodies will naturally ward off disease. Carried to extreme, there are even a few who believe they can live to upwards of 200 years if they follow these teachings.

Gotta' go. bbiaw

re: #87 laZardo

Trying to get myself to like the Big O. It's actually starting to work, but Ye Accursede Zionist Minde Beams haven't quite shut off yet.

Don't fight it. Stay on the enlighten side. :)

re: #112 MandyManners

Insha'Allah!

Jenny McCarthy echos that sentiment. *spit*

re: #91 Killgore Trout

Did you read the FBI report he references? It was issued last July...
White Supremacist Recruitment of Military Personnel since 9/11

It's a legitimate concern and has been for a long time. It's sad to see conservatives abandon their position on counterterrorism and national security. It was one of their strong points for a very long time.

Quote:

A review of FBI white supremacist extremist cases from October 2001 to May 2008 identified 203 individuals with confirmed or claimed military service active in the extremist movement at some time during the reporting period.2 This number is minuscule in comparison with the projected US veteran population of 23,816,000 as of 2 May 2008,ii or the 1,416,037 active duty military personnel as of 30 April 2008.

203, including those "claiming" military service, in a nation of 300 million? This ain't exactly like Colombia in the 80s/90s, when enormous numbers of lads coming out of combat units in the Colombian Army would promptly get an employment offer from the drug cartels.

re: #80 Desert Dog

Charles is right; the DHS report WAS NOT a smear job. It may have been poorly worded but it was not intended to smear veterans or other law abiding citizens.

The document was classified as FOUO (For Official Use Only). In other words, it was not intended for public release and whoever did "leak" it should be getting their ass chewed. The report was intended for folks like myself (yes I'm a member of DHS) so we could better ascertain threats to the homeland. There are thousands of employees in DHS who work very hard each and everyday to protect every other American from various threats. I'm privy to some stuff that would blow your mind. This report was intended to raise the level of awareness of DHS employees in order to help them better defend and protect ordinary Americans. The distortion of this report and the craziness surrounding it is simply mind boggling. Good grief people, we as the loyal opposition need to grow up.

re: #109 pat

And I am sure a similar piece was done on recent veterans enrolling in left wing groups./

The left-wing report was much more specific, and discussed the actual threats - like cyberterrorism.

Now I'm going to go clean house.

Take care.

re: #121 Dianna

COME TO MY HOUSE! PLEASE!

Ken Follett covers the effects of the Plague on England in the Middle Ages in his book, World Without End. A sort of look into the future if this continues.

Bulls up on the Celtics 65 to 60 early in the 2nd half.

The AP is pimping for the UN Human Rights Council and it's court Jew:

Mideast war crimes probe has an unusual leader

GENEVA – The Palestinian human rights debate has taken a new turn with the appointment of Richard Goldstone, a Jew with close ties to Israel, to head a U.N. investigation into atrocities allegedly committed in Israel's recent war with Hamas...

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

Oh, how unusual... Getting a Jew to condemn the Jewish State.
Now why didn't anyone think of that before?
The AP, where Goebbel's theories are put into practice.

re: #121 Dianna

The left-wing report was much more specific, and discussed the actual threats - like cyberterrorism.

Now I'm going to go clean house.

Take care.

I HAD TO CLEAN HOUSE ON MY OWN LAST WEEK!
WHERE TH' H*LL WERE YOU?!

/*duck*

re: #122 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

COME TO MY HOUSE! PLEASE!

I was bad last weekend, so I've got too much to do.

Hire a cleaning service. It's easier.

This luddite anti-science streak does cross the political spectrum - it's not just faith healer types, it's also the loony left. It's not just vaccines either - the throwback crazies on both ends see genetic engineered crops from Monsanto and ADM as evil, they see modern pharmacology coupled with psychiatry as evil too. They want to go back to some romantic vision of how they think the past was with no regard to the consequence to millions of other human lives. It's stasism in action.

re: #115 NonNativeTexan

Don't know, but I suspect some of the western elite opposition to
vaccination comes from the naturalist side of things. If we eat organic
fruit and vegetables , our bodies will naturally ward off disease. Carried to extreme, there are even a few who believe they can live to upwards of 200 years if they follow these teachings.

I prefer organic. Whenever I eat inorganic friuts and vegetables my teeth break...
/

re: #126 pre-Boomer Marine brat

I HAD TO CLEAN HOUSE ON MY OWN LAST WEEK!
WHERE TH' H*LL WERE YOU?!

/*duck*

Ignoring drifts of dog fur so I could write.

I'm really gone, now. I hate cleaning.

re: #107 Walter L. Newton

Why do you call this "feel good?" "Feel good" is a term used to describe something that is basically a fluff piece, something that has no real substance but makes you feel good, with no beneficial after effects.

"Feel good" is a put down.

So, did you term this as "feel good" to be sarcastic or what? Are you making fun of our troops or what? Clarify.

Walter, take a chill pill, it made me feel good, and that's all the hell I meant, gez.

re: #117 Erik The Red

I thought this was the dark side.

/great vision in the day, excellent vision in the night. wait for the twilight, it's magic hour.

re: #130 Dianna

Ignoring drifts of dog fur so I could write.

I'm really gone, now. I hate cleaning.

*waves goodbye for the moment ... heading off to the hardware store*

Kay, actually heading to bed now. Cheerz.

bbl

People who refuse to vaccinate their kids are most likely reacting to their distrust of govt. And are not able to overcome that distrust because there are just so many examples of science being manipulated by the GD politicians.

Why should anyone automatically trust that the govt is acting on science facts when we've seen so many examples of just the opposite? Carbon Dioxide is now a pollutant according to our own EPA! And must be regulated. Everyone of us exhales CO2 with every breath for Petes sake -- how can it be a pollutant to be regulated.

I feel for parents like this. They want to do what's best for their kid and don't consider the govt to be on their side. They think science is being manipulated by politics and business (which it is) and are left to fend for themselves.

re: #119 Occasional Reader

Yes, the report gives very specific examples ...

• (U//LES) Two Army privates in the 82nd Airborne Division at Fort Bragg, North Carolina, received six year prison sentences for attempting to sell stolen government property in mid-2007 to an undercover FBI agent they believed was involved with the white supremacist movement. The property included ballistic vests with plates, a combat helmet, and the controlled substances morphine sulfate and Diazepam.xv
• (U//LES) In May 2003 the US Army Criminal Investigation Division (CID) advised the FBI of six active duty soldiers at Fort Riley, Kansas, with possible AN affiliations. One of the six, who has unconfirmed service in Iraq, sought to recruit members from within the Army and served as the AN’s point-of-contact in Kansas.xvi
• (U//LES) In mid-2000 and leading into the early 2001 assessment period, Army CID and FBI sources of unspecified credibility reported on the recruiting of individuals stationed at Fort Campbell, Kentucky, by an AN Tennessee leader who also sought information about troop deployments, unit sizes, and military missions. The subject also expressed interest in setting up a training camp for instruction in assault, infantry, camouflage, reconnaissance, and building bunkers. Although the FBI assessed the subject successfully recruited soldiers from Ft. Campbell into the AN, his arrest on felony firearms charges in December 2000 and sentencing to two years probation in April 2003 effectively disrupted his leadership and training activities.xvii

...and many others. They are potentially very dangerous and law enforcement should be aware of what is going on.

re: #101 Killgore Trout

From the Bush era FBI report...

Why weren't you guys upset about this last year? It just doesn't make sense.

Because I hadn't heard of it. Which, in turn, means that NYT opinion columnists weren't trying to make hay out of it.

re: #127 Dianna

I was bad last weekend, so I've got too much to do.

Hire a cleaning service. It's easier.

And I the yard

re: #120 Jetpilot1101

Charles is right; the DHS report WAS NOT a smear job. It may have been poorly worded but it was not intended to smear veterans or other law abiding citizens.

The document was classified as FOUO (For Official Use Only). In other words, it was not intended for public release and whoever did "leak" it should be getting their ass chewed. The report was intended for folks like myself (yes I'm a member of DHS) so we could better ascertain threats to the homeland. There are thousands of employees in DHS who work very hard each and everyday to protect every other American from various threats. I'm privy to some stuff that would blow your mind. This report was intended to raise the level of awareness of DHS employees in order to help them better defend and protect ordinary Americans. The distortion of this report and the craziness surrounding it is simply mind boggling. Good grief people, we as the loyal opposition need to grow up.

FOUO? What was it doing splashed all over the media then? Did it leak out on it's own? I think you are naive if you think this leaked out by accident...nothing happens by accident when it comes to stuff like this

They're all putting adults at risk since the benefits of most of the vaccines we had have worn off. As long as every generation was vaccinated in childhood the older generation would stay safe. But as more parents choose not to vaccinate their children, they expose everyone else to these diseases. They want to skip vaccinating their kids? Then they shouldn't quibble with being quarantined.

A clarification on the lead-in to the story. They mention scarlet fever, but that isn't a disease we can vaccinate against. The strep bacteria causes scarlet fever and some kids exhibit the scarlet fever rash rather than having the classic sore throat symptoms.

re: #115 NonNativeTexan

Don't know, but I suspect some of the western elite opposition to
vaccination comes from the naturalist side of things. If we eat organic
fruit and vegetables , our bodies will naturally ward off disease. Carried to extreme, there are even a few who believe they can live to upwards of 200 years if they follow these teachings.

You are more likely to catch disease and die eating organic. No thanks, give me my preservatives.

re: #137 Killgore Trout

Yes, the report gives very specific examples ...

...and many others. They are potentially very dangerous and law enforcement should be aware of what is going on.

I AM NOT SAYING THAT THIS REPORT WAS INAPPROPRIATE. I am saying that the NYT columnist is blowing it way out of proportion. I mean... "The Enemies Within"?! Good grief.

Now, I'm going hiking. (Code name of course for my right-wing paramilitary survival training!)

re: #20 MJ

This nutter will be responsible for the death of thousands of children. I hope he meets with an 'accident' very soon.

/oops, will I get banned for that?

How could we have neglected to point out the "vaccines are government mind control serum" kooks?! How silly of us.

re: #136 tom from pv

People who refuse to vaccinate their kids are most likely reacting to their distrust of govt. And are not able to overcome that distrust because there are just so many examples of science being manipulated by the GD politicians.

Why should anyone automatically trust that the govt is acting on science facts when we've seen so many examples of just the opposite? Carbon Dioxide is now a pollutant according to our own EPA! And must be regulated. Everyone of us exhales CO2 with every breath for Petes sake -- how can it be a pollutant to be regulated.

I feel for parents like this. They want to do what's best for their kid and don't consider the govt to be on their side. They think science is being manipulated by politics and business (which it is) and are left to fend for themselves.

Did you leave your critical thinking skill at home today? Geeessshh.

You know who's worse than Anti-Vaxers?

re: #144 Cygnus

This nutter will be responsible for the death of thousands of children. I hope he meets with an 'accident' very soon.

/oops, will I get banned for that?

If you don't want to get banned, I suggest you remove the big chip from your shoulder.

re: #41 LGoPs

I can't condone a condom thread at this point. Although I mayo consider a condiments thread...
/

That reminds me - I have to go vacuum my condominium.

re: #147 jdog29

You know who's worse than Anti-Vaxers?

You?

re: #148 Charles

If you don't want to get banned, I suggest you remove the big chip from your shoulder.

OK - sorry.

re: #140 Desert Dog

FOUO? What was it doing splashed all over the media then? Did it leak out on it's own? I think you are naive if you think this leaked out by accident...nothing happens by accident when it comes to stuff like this

You answered your own question, it was obviously leaked. By whom and for what purpose, I don't care to speculate lest I join to growing chorus of crazies out there. The point is that is managed to make it's way out there and has been taken out of context by a plethora of people. You can chose to believe that this was deliberately leaked for political purposes and that is your prerogative. Like I said, I won't speculate on that, I'm only commenting on the contents of the report and suggesting to you that regardless of how it made it into the public domain, it was not intended to smear veterans or law abiding citizens. If you want to discuss conspiracy theories, I've heard Alex Jones has a radio show you can call.

re: #137 Killgore Trout

Yes, the report gives very specific examples ...

...and many others. They are potentially very dangerous and law enforcement should be aware of what is going on.

Absolutely - it's their job.

Housework calls. Housework nags, I should say. After that, sunshine beckons. Places to go, people to see, may not make it back this weekend. Have fun lizards, at LGF or out and about.

re: #137 Killgore Trout

Yes, the report gives very specific examples ...

...and many others. They are potentially very dangerous and law enforcement should be aware of what is going on.

And, don't forget the most important part, it makes the "right wing" look bad. That is why smug asshats like Mr. Blow and his fellow travelers think it's such a wonderful report.

re: #136 tom from pv

Most Docs have their kids vaccinated. Most public officials have their kids vaccinated. I'm not a rocket scientist, if the docs were refusing to have their kids inoculated, I'd be fighting it.

C'mon. I have many doc friends (yes, I consider 3 many!) all of their kids have had all the shots.

Good enough for me.

re: #136 tom from pv

They think science is being manipulated by politics and business (which it is) and are left to fend for themselves.

So it was just a coincidence that say, for example, polio has been all but eliminated? If parents automatically disregard all scientific advances, regarless of government's role, and then fear they've been left in the dark (ages), then they can claim victimhood.

re: #155 Desert Dog

And, don't forget the most important part, it makes the "right wing" look bad. That is why smug asshats like Mr. Blow and his fellow travelers think it's such a wonderful report.

So why are you playing into their spin by thinking it pertains to you?

Anyone watching the C's-Bulls playoff game? It's a tight game with one quarter to go.

re: #50 Bobibutu

Woah! Usually dormant till 60+. I have heard it's the worst.

My daughter had a severe case of chickenpox when she was quite young. When she was 12 she got shingles. The doctor said she was the youngest case he had ever heard of. I have had shingles twice, once in my 30's and once in my 40's.

re: #157 solomonpanting

So it was just a coincidence that say, for example, polio has been all but eliminated? If parents automatically disregard all scientific advances, regarless of government's role, and then fear they've been left in the dark (ages), then they can claim victimhood.

Polio has not been all but eliminated. It is irresponsible to say so. In many parts of the world (where the vaccine is all but unavailable) polio is an exciting, popular choice for debilitating diseases.

/

CHANGE!

re: #160 imtoast

I'm from the South. It is "the shingles". Sheesh.

re: #159 Lincolntf

Anyone watching the C's-Bulls playoff game? It's a tight game with one quarter to go.

aa no, but waiting for Hawks tonight :)

re: #155 Desert Dog

And, don't forget the most important part, it makes the "right wing" look bad. That is why smug asshats like Mr. Blow and his fellow travelers think it's such a wonderful report.

What makes the "right wing" look bad is the insane distortions and outright lies that are being circulated about the DHS report. It makes the right look like a bunch of whining babies, and worse -- by taking such ridiculous exception to the term "right wing extremists" they make it EASY for people like Charles M. Blow to write columns like that.

I find this situation utterly pathetic. The conservatives who are trying to defiantly say "we're all right wing extremists now" are doing an enormous disservice to the GOP and conservatism in general. Grow up.

re: #159 Lincolntf

Anyone watching the C's-Bulls playoff game? It's a tight game with one quarter to go.

Got it on, good game.

re: #18 Dianna

Strep is more common because it's becoming immune to antibiotics. It's also what my doctor calls a big fooler. It can masquerade as a sinus infection and other illnesses and has symptoms in many cases that are not classic the high fever and oozing tonsils of our childhood. Bad breath, stomach aches, sinus infection, joint pain, just the scarlet fever rash (red and looks like sand paper), peeling skin around fingernails and toenails, etc.

Not one case of strep that my child had (6-7 per year for 4 years) did my child complain of a sore throat.

re: #20 MJ

Islamic cleric claims vaccinations are a "Jewish conspiracy"

MJ -

Projection to the max. And very honest in this interview. The good cleric probably figured it was for "home consumption only." Not anymore.

-S-

re: #152 Jetpilot1101

You answered your own question, it was obviously leaked. By whom and for what purpose, I don't care to speculate lest I join to growing chorus of crazies out there. The point is that is managed to make it's way out there and has been taken out of context by a plethora of people. You can chose to believe that this was deliberately leaked for political purposes and that is your prerogative. Like I said, I won't speculate on that, I'm only commenting on the contents of the report and suggesting to you that regardless of how it made it into the public domain, it was not intended to smear veterans or law abiding citizens. If you want to discuss conspiracy theories, I've heard Alex Jones has a radio show you can call.

Don't lump me in with those clowns, now you are the one engaging in distortions. Just accept the fact that this document was used for political purposes. Was it blown out of proportion by some people, especially on the right? Yes, indeed it was. But, you are mistaken if you think this was not used to make the right look bad.

Darwin at work. If it weren't for innocent children suffering (and dying) from their parent's idiocy, I'd say let the anti-vaxers die off and leave the intelligent people alive to continue to propagate our genes. But since I - unlike the anti-vaxers - actually care about the health and safety of children, I can't say that.

US 'deeply disappointed' as Iran convicts reporter

"U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton said she was "deeply disappointed" by the conviction..."

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

When my daughter wants to go to the Wisconsin Dells and visit the Water Parks and I say we can't go that day, then she too is "deeply disappointed".

I guess the Obama Administration is unable to muster a stronger response.

We won't let the conviction of an innocent American stand in the way of allowing Iran to develop nuclear weapons, will we?

re: #169 Desert Dog

Don't lump me in with those clowns, now you are the one engaging in distortions. Just accept the fact that this document was used for political purposes. Was it blown out of proportion by some people, especially on the right? Yes, indeed it was. But, you are mistaken if you think this was not used to make the right look bad.

The right is making THEMSELVES look bad by their reaction to it.

A moment of high comedy: Conservatives complaining about the insensitivity of law enforcement hurt the feelings of the RoP...
CAIR: Officials Asked to Repudiate NY Rep.'s Anti-Muslim Remarks

In an interview on MSNBC, Rep. King stated in part: "[Napolitano] has never put out a report talking about look out for mosques. Look out for Islamic terrorists in our country. Look out for the fact that very few Muslims come forward to cooperate with the police. If they sent out a report saying that, there would be hell to pay."

"We urge elected representatives to distance themselves from King's bigoted remarks," said CAIR-NY Community Affairs Director Faiza N. Ali. "Sweeping generalizations about Muslims and mosques have no place in serious national security discourse."

Republicans are doing the exact same thing CAIR has been doing for years; complaining the national security hurts your feelings. Conservatives are also providing cover for White Nationalists and Nazis by complaining just like CAIR provides cover for Jihadis by trying to hamstring law enforcement and demand that investigations and memos contain the proper language to avoid offense.
This has been a disgraceful display on the part of conservatives. They really should be ashamed of themselves. It's disgraceful.

re: #136 tom from pv

People who refuse to vaccinate their kids are most likely reacting to their distrust of govt. And are not able to overcome that distrust because there are just so many examples of science being manipulated by the GD politicians.

Politicians cannot manipulate facts. There weren't vaccines in the early 1800's, average life expectancy in the US was about forty years. "Distrust of Government"... or paranoia? Sure, Gov't gets things wrong, they are incompetent, and sometimes individuals in gov't are crooked. That's the nature of Bureaucracy with a capital B, but you seem to be buying the hollywood and kookspiricist version of a malicious gov't out to get us. That's ridiculous -- hollywood makes gov't malicious in their stories so they can further the plot -- they must have a godlike or all powerful entity if they are to do anything approaching true classical tragedy, so Government is made the bad guy. Kookspiricists make gov't the bad guy to sell more books, looks like they found a sucker.

re: #169 Desert Dog

Don't lump me in with those clowns, now you are the one engaging in distortions. Just accept the fact that this document was used for political purposes. Was it blown out of proportion by some people, especially on the right? Yes, indeed it was. But, you are mistaken if you think this was not used to make the right look bad.

I apologize for the "Alex Jones" comment; my poor attempt at humor. I don't know for a fact that it was leaked or used for political purposes; quite frankly no one does except the leaker. What I do know is that it got a lot of "right wing" people spooled up saying some pretty crazy things. I'd prefer to discuss facts like the fact that it was a report tailored to DHS employees not the average run of the mill American. It was a poorly worded report but I don't believe it was intended to malign or disparage veterans in any way. To me, the report was more an example of incompetent editing then a political hatchet job.

re: #160 imtoast

My daughter had a severe case of chickenpox when she was quite young. When she was 12 she got shingles. The doctor said she was the youngest case he had ever heard of. I have had shingles twice, once in my 30's and once in my 40's.

The things we learn on LGF.

Once would be quite enough. Were there significant differences in the symptoms between the two?

re: #171 MJ

I wonder what the rationale is for this tepid response? Are we just waiting for her to be pardoned in a few months or is it more like:

"We wouldn't want to do or say anything that would disrupt the flourishing Republic of Iran. They are our partners going forward in a new progressive, constructive direction. If we have to drop a couple NPR reporters to make it happen, so be it."

re: #165 Charles

What makes the "right wing" look bad is the insane distortions and outright lies that are being circulated about the DHS report. It makes the right look like a bunch of whining babies, and worse -- by taking such ridiculous exception to the term "right wing extremists" they make it EASY for people like Charles M. Blow to write columns like that.

I find this situation utterly pathetic. The conservatives who are trying to defiantly say "we're all right wing extremists now" are doing an enormous disservice to the GOP and conservatism in general. Grow up.

I agree with you there, Charles. Blowing this out of proportion is making the right look bad. It did not call all veterans potential crazies, it said they might be recruited. It did not make a blanket indictment of the "entire right wing", it just mentions generalization and quite a few "maybes" that some people who hold "rightist views "may" engage in.

I think it was poorly written by someone with a political motivation and was spread around by a oh so willing media, that is all my point it here. It was used as a political slap across the face. How some on the right reacted made it even worse.

re: #165 Charles

What makes the "right wing" look bad is the insane distortions and outright lies that are being circulated about the DHS report. It makes the right look like a bunch of whining babies, and worse -- by taking such ridiculous exception to the term "right wing extremists" they make it EASY for people like Charles M. Blow to write columns like that.

I find this situation utterly pathetic. The conservatives who are trying to defiantly say "we're all right wing extremists now" are doing an enormous disservice to the GOP and conservatism in general. Grow up.

Charles,
I defer to your opinion since I consider it a privelege to be on your blog. I have mixed thoughts about this and am willing to see how it plays out in the future. A particular uneasiness that I have is with the term right wing extremist being attached to those who hold views on the conservative side - not just in this report, but generally throughout the media culture. I never hear it applied to those on the left who are universally referred to as liberal, if they are labeled at all.
I do think that the left does place great importance on the use of language and the branding that is part of that.
I guess what I'm saying is that I'd feel less defensive if there was some balance in the public arena when it comes to use of the word extremist or radical.

You know the more we talk about the "right wing extremist" report and get in a lather about it, the longer it's in the news cycle, and the longer the "right wing extremist" meme is kept afloat. The people carrying on so long about this nothing report and who continually bring it up are really just carrying water for the left.

re: #175 Jetpilot1101

I agree with you with the poorly written parts, and 100% with the stupid reactions some on the right have made. It made things worse than they should have been.

I am a lot of things, Jet, but a crazy conspiracy nut is not one of them. :-)

re: #180 Thanos

You know the more we talk about the "right wing extremist" report and get in a lather about it, the longer it's in the news cycle, and the longer the "right wing extremist" meme is kept afloat. The people carrying on so long about this nothing report and who continually bring it up are really just carrying water for the left.

A million updings, if I could.

re: #180 Thanos

You know the more we talk about the "right wing extremist" report and get in a lather about it, the longer it's in the news cycle, and the longer the "right wing extremist" meme is kept afloat. The people carrying on so long about this nothing report and who continually bring it up are really just carrying water for the left.

We should GAZE that report, eh? And get on with more important matters?

re: #181 Desert Dog

I agree with you with the poorly written parts, and 100% with the stupid reactions some on the right have made. It made things worse than they should have been.

I am a lot of things, Jet, but a crazy conspiracy nut is not one of them. :-)

Again, sorry about the Alex Jones comment; PIMF. After reading your last comment, I think we pretty much agree. I also think Thanos is right, the more we discuss this report, the more the right looks like a bunch of crazies. I recommend we let the report fade away and move on to bigger issues like electing fiscal conservatives, shrinking government, and keeping religion of any kind out of the public school system.

re: #177 Lincolntf

I wonder what the rationale is for this tepid response? Are we just waiting for her to be pardoned in a few months or is it more like:

"We wouldn't want to do or say anything that would disrupt the flourishing Republic of Iran. They are our partners going forward in a new progressive, constructive direction. If we have to drop a couple NPR reporters to make it happen, so be it."

I think that's pretty much it.
President Obama and Sec. of State Hillary Clinton have to prove that the Bush Administration pursued the wrong policy on Iran by using "harsh" language.
This is an American citizen we're talking about and the best they can come up with "disappointed".

re: #183 Desert Dog

We should GAZE that report, eh? And get on with more important matters?

Exactly. The left knows which blogger buttons to push to get a big reaction on things they want to. We should be talking about the new taxes to come, the way they are interfering with the recovery, the corruptness we see, the weakness we see. Instead we are painting ourselves with crazy and they are laughing at us behind their hands.

London used to dump sewage into the Thames & draw drinking water therefrom as well.

It is great to ignore history. The old ways were better.
It was a golden age, all lived in harmony with nature. Let's go back.

/mega sarc.

re: #161 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Polio has not been all but eliminated. It is irresponsible to say so. In many parts of the world (where the vaccine is all but unavailable) polio is an exciting, popular choice for debilitating diseases.

/

Ah. The free market choice of diseases.

The anti vaxers need to visit a few 3rd world counties and see what happens when you remove modern medicine.

re: #183 Desert Dog

Well that's the issue, isn't it? I've really got no dog in this fight. I'm a vet, I read the report and found parts of it potentially offensive and politically motivated, but Napolitano "apologized" for those very parts so I'm fine with that.
The problem is that if one criticizes a report like this, they end up "in league with Nazis", and if people don't criticize such reports, we (and the people writing the next "report") don't get the clarification from Napolitano.

I know someone who got scurvy after having the combined gout/plague/King's Evil vaccination.//

re: #176 Bobibutu

The things we learn on LGF.

Once would be quite enough. Were there significant differences in the symptoms between the two?

Just different legs. My left leg in my 30's, my right leg in my 40's. I also had a really bad case of chickenpox when I was a kid. The doctor wasn't surprised that I got it twice. I'm hoping my daughter gets the shingles vaccine so she doesn't get it again. Hers was on her half her back. My two cases were not so severe.

re: #187 Ojoe

London used to dump sewage into the Thames & draw drinking water therefrom as well.

It is great to ignore history. The old ways were better.
It was a golden age, all lived in harmony with nature. Let's go back.

/mega sarc.

And i thought the water here in Arizona was bad!

re: #187 Ojoe

London used to dump sewage into the Thames & draw drinking water therefrom as well.

It is great to ignore history. The old ways were better.
It was a golden age, all lived in harmony with nature. Let's go back.

/mega sarc.

Public health is rightly part of local government's purview.

I see Jenny has no problems with silicone implants , dental implants, and botox so clearly, modern medicine isn't all bad

BBL have fun y'all

re: #179 LGoPs

I guess what I'm saying is that I'd feel less defensive if there was some balance in the public arena when it comes to use of the word extremist or radical.

Since when did conservatives expect balance and sensitivity? The world does not cater to your sensibilities and the government is required to avoid husting your feelings. Take personal responsibility, man up, and don't expect balance. You aren't going to get it and you're only going to look like a pussy whining about it.

re: #187 Ojoe

London used to dump sewage into the Thames & draw drinking water therefrom as well.

It is great to ignore history. The old ways were better.
It was a golden age, all lived in harmony with nature. Let's go back.

/mega sarc.

Similar spreads in diseases were seen in the sixties amongst the hippies who abandoned modern hygiene to get "back to nature." We're seeing what Theo Dalrymple (I think) called a "re-primitivization" of society.

re: #86 avanti

A feel good story about our troops in Afghanistan.

Tropps.

Now that Bush is no longer the President; the media will allow more and more stories like this to surface. It's not "Bush's War" anymore so the media will now allow us to win it.
As will the Democrats.

Hooray! The Democrats don't have to be anti-american anymore! Neither does the media. I sure hope nobody gets whiplash. Orwell could have probably explained it better.

re: #191 Jimmah

I know someone who got scurvy after having the combined gout/plague/King's Evil vaccination.//

King's Evil? I saw them open up for Iron Maiden - they kicked ass!
/

re: #195 Shug

I see Jenny has no problems with silicone implants , dental implants, and botox so clearly, modern medicine isn't all bad

Don't jump to conclusions. Her modern medicine usage may have led to her PMSS-Post Medical Stupidity Syndrome.

re: #195 Shug

I see Jenny has no problems with silicone implants , dental implants, and botox so clearly, modern medicine isn't all bad

Not to mention being a brain donor.

There are other health issues on the rise in the UK because of certain dark age mentalities:

Women in hijabs 'need sunlight or risk illness'

re: #165 Charles

I expect it won't be long before we see "We are all right wing extremists now" banners at future tea parties etc.

re: #202 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey

Not to mention being a brain donor.

Somewhere in this world a mouse needs a brain. //

re: #199 swamprat

Now that Bush is no longer the President; the media will allow more and more stories like this to surface. It's not "Bush's War" anymore so the media will now allow us to win it.
As will the Democrats.

Hooray! The Democrats don't have to be anti-american anymore! Neither does the media. I sure hope nobody gets whiplash. Orwell could have probably explained it better.

Course there's also the worry that we could be losing yet the media will now portray that as winning for the same reason. Who knows which end is up anymore?

re: #197 Killgore Trout

I agree that we need to accept reality- that we're playing with a stacked deck, so to speak, and once we accept that then we can better deal with the game.

re: #203 Sharmuta

There are other health issues on the rise in the UK because of certain dark age mentalities:

Women in hijabs 'need sunlight or risk illness'

And risk exposing them to evil Joo-rays? Are you mad?
/

re: #200 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey

lol. There had to be a heavy metal band with that name I suppose.

re: #204 Jimmah

I expect it won't be long before we see "We are all right wing extremists now" banners at future tea parties etc.

I am Sparticus! I mean uh, david duke.

re: #197 Killgore Trout

Since when did conservatives expect balance and sensitivity? The world does not cater to your sensibilities and the government is required to avoid husting your feelings. Take personal responsibility, man up, and don't expect balance. You aren't going to get it and you're only going to look like a pussy whining about it.

I not only expect balance, I demand it. Because it isn't there doesn't mean we all just lay down and accept that. The distortions and lack of balance that the media dishes out is one of the greatest threats that our form of government faces.
And you can keep your advice about my manning up to your self.

re: #203 Sharmuta

There are other health issues on the rise in the UK because of certain dark age mentalities:

Women in hijabs 'need sunlight or risk illness'

Strong bones are essential to take a proper beating

#180 Thanos
You know the more we talk about the "right wing extremist" report and get in a lather about it, the longer it's in the news cycle, and the longer the "right wing extremist" meme is kept afloat. The people carrying on so long about this nothing report and who continually bring it up are really just carrying water for the left.

You're absolutely right, Thanos.

Besides, it's taking precious time away from real issues such as the nirth certificate, natural born citizen and who's whose daddy mishegas.

Those combined, along with the creation extremists, will succeed only in marginalizing the Republican Party; thus guaranteeing that we will have our asses handed to us next year; in 2012 and for the foreseeable future.

Some small percentage of vaccinated people are going to get sick, or at least they used to, when the vaccines were cultured from the actual illnesses.

You are playing the odds by refusing to be vaccinated. A very samll percent of people will be sickened by the vaccine. A very large percent of the unvaccinated population will be sickened by the actual illness, once exposed.

And in today's world, given the ease of travel, there just isn't much in the way of localized illness, anymore.

I don't gamble much. I never play Russian roulette.

re: #206 kansas

Course there's also the worry that we could be losing yet the media will now portray that as winning for the same reason. Who knows which end is up anymore?

Now I have to go to the chiropractor!

Please excuse my ignorance on this topic. I have seen threads on this before and would appreciate a brief explanation if someone wouldn't mind too much.

What they HELL kind of problem do people have with getting vaccinated to protect yourself against some of the worst known disease? I recently finished getting the full course of twinrix shots to protect myself against hepatitis A&B when I travel and otherwise.

Thinking of it guess you could just some up the explanation by saying these people are Nucking Futs.

See, I take serious offense to this stuff. When I hear someone is getting sick becuase they didn't take the vaccine, my thought is to not treat them. Especially under a "universal health care system", where THEY aren't paying for it, everyone else is.

Of course, these cases are for children, who cannot themselves make the decisions. At which point one could make the case for child abuse, take the kids away, and arrest the parents.

But, like I said, I tend to take a rather extreme view to this kind of crap.

re: #204 Jimmah

I expect it won't be long before we see "We are all right wing extremists now" banners at future tea parties etc.

I've seen quite a few of them already. It's a pretty popular sign. They remind me of the Muslims who wear shirts at protests saying "Muslim terrorist"

re: #118 Sharmuta

Jenny McCarthy echos that sentiment. *spit*

Let's stuff her into a burkha.

re: #211 LGoPs

I not only expect balance, I demand it.

Life is not fair. Get used to it.

This is the sort of thing that one expects to occur in muslim Africa, or in other lands of the ignorant and superstitious, NOT Great Britain! Astonishing. And depressing.

I'm wondering now, is Islam, a factor? What are the demographics of the rise in cases of diseases preventable by vaccination? Not accusing, just wondering.

Think I'll poke around for a bit, and see if I unearth anything.

I've not read the thread, has there been any posting re this matter?

re: #199 swamprat

Now that Bush is no longer the President; the media will allow more and more stories like this to surface. It's not "Bush's War" anymore so the media will now allow us to win it.
As will the Democrats.

Hooray! The Democrats don't have to be anti-american anymore! Neither does the media. I sure hope nobody gets whiplash. Orwell could have probably explained it better.

Not every story has to have a left or right spin. To me, it seemed the reporter saw a great story and reported it. If anything the embedded media was in love with the Iraq war before it became a insurgency and went south. Bad news always gets more attention then good.

re: #213 RadicalRon

You're absolutely right, Thanos.

Besides, it's taking precious time away from real issues such as the nirth certificate, natural born citizen and who's whose daddy mishegas.

Those combined, along with the creation extremists, will succeed only in marginalizing the Republican Party; thus guaranteeing that we will have our asses handed to us next year; in 2012 and for the foreseeable future.

Indeed. Meanwhile, socialism continues while we're distracted:

Obama would regulate new 'bubbles'

Choking growth and prolonging a recovery. But let's be sure to watch the birdie.

The real danger of the anti-vaccination movement goes far beyond the damage they do to their own children. By pushing a Dark Ages belief that vaccination is harmful, these people risk serious damage to "herd immunity" -- the immunity of a sufficient number of individuals in a population such that infection of one person will not cause a general epidemic.

It's a serious danger, not just a problem for a few kooks and their kids.

re: #222 avanti

Not every story has to have a left or right spin. To me, it seemed the reporter saw a great story and reported it. If anything the embedded media was in love with the Iraq war before it became a insurgency and went south. Bad news always gets more attention then good.

So you think it would have been reported say, during the election?

This is why these people should be sued and their children vaccinated by force or refused a place in schools...

They endanger my children. I couldn't care less that they kill their own. Idiocy has its price!

re: #204 Jimmah

I expect it won't be long before we see "We are all right wing extremists now" banners at future tea parties etc.

Well, Fox is doing a panel discussion just now, and still pushing the envelope. i.e. the DHS report writers, should be fired, DHS might not be able to count on the National Guard in the future and more.

re: #217 Kailen

re: #224 Charles

The real danger of the anti-vaccination movement goes far beyond the damage they do to their own children. By pushing a Dark Ages belief that vaccination is harmful, these people risk serious damage to "herd immunity" -- the immunity of a sufficient number of individuals in a population such that infection of one person will not cause a general epidemic.

It's a serious danger, not just a problem for a few kooks and their kids.

I completely agree. The other worry I have is that schools will cave in to parents' "rights" to enroll their non-immunized children.

re: #220 Killgore Trout

Life is not fair. Get used to it.

That's one of the basic tenets of my upbringing. Which is why I take responsibility for my own actions. What I will not accept or get used to is others openly and blatantly manipulating and distorting the information that all of us need to make reasoned decisions and judgements. That is an unfairness that needs to be confronted and fought every day.

re: #224 Charles

The real danger of the anti-vaccination movement goes far beyond the damage they do to their own children. By pushing a Dark Ages belief that vaccination is harmful, these people risk serious damage to "herd immunity" -- the immunity of a sufficient number of individuals in a population such that infection of one person will not cause a general epidemic.

It's a serious danger, not just a problem for a few kooks and their kids.

My high school biology teacher predicted that the "end of civilization" would come about through epidemic disease.

On the subject of Tea Parties and the DHS report, a couple of great ones from Iowahawk

"The Mary Hamsher Moore Show"

"Red Scare"

Regarding Avanti's link about the firefight:

How would you like to be one of those scouts, deployed ten feet off the trail?

Be my luck I'd pass gas, or cough, or my stomach would growl.

re: #218 Killgore Trout

I've seen quite a few of them already. It's a pretty popular sign. They remind me of the Muslims who wear shirts at protests saying "Muslim terrorist"

I had a feeling my 'prediction' was probably too late. I was thinking of the "We are all Hamas now" banners we're used to seeing at 'anti-war' demos. Seems many on the right are intent on adopting all the tactics they apparently despised in the left/Islamists. Not a clever move.

re: #204 Jimmah

I expect it won't be long before we see "We are all right wing extremists now" banners at future tea parties etc.

I still want to get a "We are all Honcos now" t-shirt.

re: #203 Sharmuta

There are other health issues on the rise in the UK because of certain dark age mentalities:

Women in hijabs 'need sunlight or risk illness'

The bone disorder rickets has now broken out in young Muslim children as babies are not getting enough calcium from mothers' breast milk.

Insha'Allah.

re: #56 Occasional Reader

Pardon me if this sets the needle on my BS meter a-quiverin'. Um... so who defines "hate groups" for purposes of this assertion of "fact"?

Didn't you get the memo? The DHS defines hate groups as right wing:

"Rightwing extremism in the United States can be broadly divided into those groups, movements, and adherents that are primarily hate-oriented (based on hatred of particular religious, racial or ethnic groups) and those that are mainly antigovernment, rejecting federal authority in favor of state or local authority, or rejecting government authority entirely."

So, according to DHS, any group which is primarily hate-oriented, is by definition, right wing.

Some would say nationalistic, or isolationist groups are by definition, right wing. But if that is so, why is Louis Farrakhan's Nation of Islam never called a right-wing group?

It goes to my post on another thread. The term "Right Wing" has no meaning anymore. It has become synonymous with "Ideological Extremist", because the world has decided the very act of having extremist ideological views is a right-wing action. Not a right-wing concept or a right wing phenomena, but an action. Like driving on the left side of the road is an action Britons do. It doesn't make one British to drive on the left, but driving on the left is an action Britons do.

It is idiotarian.

Great! I'm going over there next month - I guess I'll get an extra 'dose' of history when I tour london.

re: #216 jhrhv

They are not nuts. People whose children have experienced reactions...or suspected that their children have had reactions, Have made accusations and speculations which have been greatly ballyhoo by the media.

No one has said; (for example)

Your child MIGHT have a 1 in 500,000 chance of having autism;

But will most defiantly have a 1 in 2,000 chance of getting and or dying from a disease;

Depending on whether you do or do not use modern vaccinations.

The facts are rarely put forth in a straight forward fashion.

There is a great deal of rhetoric on this issue, and LGF is not lacking in this regard.

Slightly off topic. If any of you are smokers as I was for close to 20 years. I started taking Zyban in November for half of the prescribed period and haven't had a smoke since the first week of Nov 08.

If you are trying to quit I highly recommend it. None of the crankyness like when I tried to quit cold turkey previously. After a week of taking the pills I could barely stand to light up.

If you are a smoker and want to quit see your doctor and get the pills. Probably the best thing I've done for my health in my life.

re: #33 Bobibutu

There is a vaccine for Shingles available now for those of us in that pre-vaccine age group. About a 2 month waiting list in the SF Bay Area and you need a Rx from your pri care MD.

Damn, that's good news, thanks!  I better go get mine.  I had chickenpox as a boy, and from what I'm reading:

What is Shingles?
Shingles is an infection that is localized; usually to one half of the body. It is caused by the varicella virus, which is the same virus that causes the childhood disease, chickenpox. Shingles only strikes those who have had chickenpox. The varicella virus lays dormant in nerve endings and if it is reactivated, that is when shingles occur. It is not known why the dormant virus suddenly becomes active.

Who is Susceptible?
Shingles is primarily a disease of the elderly, but can and does strike people of middle age. It affects both genders and all ethnic groups equally and can occur at any time of the year.

Is Shingles Contagious?

If you have had chickenpox, you are susceptible to shingles. Shingles cannot be spread from one person to another, nor can contact with someone suffering from shingles cause another person’s dormant varicella virus to reactivate. However, the varicella virus in a shingles sufferer can cause chickenpox in people who have never had the childhood disease.

... at 52, I'm thinking I'm getting towards that target age where I could get it.  My brother (a year younger) and I had the chicken pox on my 11th birthday.  We were supposed to have a joint birthday party that day (his birthday is 11 days from mine), but it was cancelled by my mom as a result.  I thought that horribly unfair at the time, but now I know what the true legacy of it is.

Mumps, German Measles, had 'em both too.  And anymore people ask me what the polio vaccination scar is on my arm ... people just don't know much anymore, do they?  My aunt had polio when she was pregnant and spent most of the pregnancy in an iron lung.  Seems like so much torture chamber barbarisms today, I suppose, but at the time, it meant life ...

}:)     [And Shingles just sounds painful from my reading ...]

re: #208 BeerDrinking_VictoryMonkey

And risk exposing them to evil Joo-rays? Are you mad?

Makes sense. Yahweh did create the Sun, so those rays must be a Jewish conspiracy.

Getting any hate mail on this Charles?

re: #216 jhrhv

It all started in 1998 when the medical journal the Lancet published a report linking autism and gastrointestinal disease to the MMR vaccine in 12 children. The report was not evidence of a causation. The author suggested that the current MMR vaccine be replaced with 3 individual vaccines. Conveniently he had a patent on the competing vaccine. Since then the medical community has refuted that the vaccine causes autism.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

[Link: briandeer.com...]

re: #240 Kulhwch

I know what a 'fevered dream' is from personal experience, from my bout with German measles.

But, I was told that once you've had them, you won't get them again.

And yes, I was vaccinated.

re: #238 swamprat

Your child MIGHT have a 1 in 500,000 chance of having autism;

Study after study has shown absolutely no connection between vaccines (with or without thimerosal preservative) and autism.

re: #236 meh130

So, according to DHS, any group which is primarily hate-oriented, is by definition, right wing.

Some would say nationalistic, or isolationist groups are by definition, right wing. But if that is so, why is Louis Farrakhan's Nation of Islam never called a right-wing group?

It goes to my post on another thread. The term "Right Wing" has no meaning anymore. It has become synonymous with "Ideological Extremist", because the world has decided the very act of having extremist ideological views is a right-wing action. Not a right-wing concept or a right wing phenomena, but an action. Like driving on the left side of the road is an action Britons do. It doesn't make one British to drive on the left, but driving on the left is an action Britons do.

It is idiotarian.

I read the term above in the article as defining "Rightwing extremism" not right wing.

Do you not see the difference? Probably not, since you misquoted it.

re: #227 avanti

Well, Fox is doing a panel discussion just now, and still pushing the envelope. i.e. the DHS report writers, should be fired, DHS might not be able to count on the National Guard in the future and more.

Fox is moving way beyond the envelope. Soon the envelope will be a vaguely recalled dot on the horizon to them.

re: #236 meh130

Didn't you get the memo? The DHS defines hate groups as right wing:

It does not.

re: #248 wrenchwench

It does not.

You're correct. I mentioned that in re: #246 Walter L. Newton

meh130 is misquoting.

re: #14 Shug

typhoid, whooping cough and scarlet fever mumps -

vaccine preventable diseases in bold type.
the other two aren't

FYI

re: #85 Dianna

That's your smallpox mark.

Sorry, I'm late here, but I was taking call from my patients.

There is a vaccine for Typhoid (two of them, actually) but it's not needed in countries where sanitary standards are high.

The scar from vaccination is probably Smallpox. I don't know your age. The vaccine wasn't given to those born after about 1971, in low risk countries like the USA. However, the immunity from that shot has waned. It's also possible, if you were born out of the USA, to have a scar from an anti-Tuberculosis vaccine still in use. This vaccine isn't given in the US, because we used successful public health methods, like housing standards regulations, testing and treatment, (Hooray!) to stop the spread of TB here.

About vaccines in general, the problem is that the Benefits and Risks are hard for uneducated folks to understand, especially those with poor math and science skills. The Benefits far outweigh the Risks, but I have trouble communicating this to my patients, who think that "doing nothing" about disease is the least risky behavior. If I fail with standard education and gentle persuasion, I use all sorts of scare tactics, including some photos, etc; and in the end, I ask them to sign a release that actually incriminates them in any child neglect inquiry. That's hardball, but I'm a pediatrician, and it's my responsibility to my patients. They are free to leave my practice, of course, without signing anything.

re: #246 Walter L. Newton

I read the term above in the article as defining "Rightwing extremism" not right wing.

Do you not see the difference? Probably not, since you misquoted it.

Wouldn't a right wing extremist be right wing?

re: #250 FightingBack

Sorry, I'm late here, but I was taking call from my patients.

There is a vaccine for Typhoid (two of them, actually) but it's not needed in countries where sanitary standards are high.

The scar from vaccination is probably Smallpox. I don't know your age. The vaccine wasn't given to those born after about 1971, in low risk countries like the USA. However, the immunity from that shot has waned. It's also possible, if you were born out of the USA, to have a scar from an anti-Tuberculosis vaccine still in use. This vaccine isn't given in the US, because we used successful public health methods, like housing standards regulations, testing and treatment, (Hooray!) to stop the spread of TB here.

About vaccines in general, the problem is that the Benefits and Risks are hard for uneducated folks to understand, especially those with poor math and science skills. The Benefits far outweigh the Risks, but I have trouble communicating this to my patients, who think that "doing nothing" about disease is the least risky behavior. If I fail with standard education and gentle persuasion, I use all sorts of scare tactics, including some photos, etc; and in the end, I ask them to sign a release that actually incriminates them in any child neglect inquiry. That's hardball, but I'm a pediatrician, and it's my responsibility to my patients. They are free to leave my practice, of course, without signing anything.

EXCELLENT. I so support that approach.

and here is great quote from House:
Dr. Gregory House: No fever, glands normal. Missing her vaccination dates.
Mother: We're not vaccinating.
Dr. Gregory House: Think they don't work?
Mother: I think some multinational pharmaceutical company wants me to think they work. Pad their bottom line.
Dr. Gregory House: Mmmm. May I?
Mother: Sure.
Dr. Gregory House: Gribbit, gribbit, gribbit.
Dr. Gregory House: All natural, no dyes. That's a good business - all-natural children's toys. Those toy companies, they don't arbitrarily mark up their frogs. They don't lie about how much they spend in research and development. The worst a toy company can be accused of is making a really boring frog. Gribbit, gribbit, gribbit. You know another really good business? Teeny tiny baby coffins. You can get them in frog green or fire engine red. Really. The antibodies in yummy mummy only protect the kid for six months, which is why these companies think they can gouge you. They think that you'll spend whatever they ask to keep your kid alive. Want to change things? Prove them wrong. A few hundred parents like you decide they'd rather let their kid die then cough up 40 bucks for a vaccination, believe me, prices will drop *really* fast. Gribbit, gribbit, gribbit, gribbit, gribbit.
Mother: Tell me what she has.
Dr. Gregory House: A cold.

re: #238 swamprat

Your child MIGHT have a 1 in 500,000 chance of having autism;

But will most defiantly have a 1 in 2,000 chance of getting and or dying from a disease;

Even if those stats were true - which they aren't - because there is no risk of autism - we would still be talking about people who, out of concern over putting their children at a small risk, would choose to put them at a much much greater risk instead. That would still be completely irrational.

re: #14 Shug

typhoid, whooping cough and scarlet fever mumps -

vaccine preventable diseases in bold type.
the other two aren't

FYI

Typhoid fever is preventable through vaccinations.

re: #251 kansas

Wouldn't a right wing extremist be right wing?

Yes, but all right wing are not extremist, which is what meh130 was stating, as I said, stating incorrectly.