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Ron Paul and the John Birch Society

Politics • Views: 6,452

Since people are still (amazingly!) showing up at LGF defending Ron Paul’s “honor,” please note: in October 2008, Ron Paul was the keynote speaker at the John Birch Society’s 50th anniversary.

Madison - Former Republican presidential candidate U.S. Rep. Ron Paul of Texas will keynote Saturday’s session of the 50th anniversary of the Appleton-based John Birch Society.

Paul will be one of three speakers at the 8 p.m. Saturday event at the Best Western Bridgewood Resort Hotel in Neenah, according to spokesman Bill Hahn. Also speaking at that event will be Hilliard Welch, son of Society founder Robert Welch, and Society chief executive Arthur Thompson.

Also see: Angry White Man - The bigoted past of Ron Paul.

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500 comments

1 Fenway_Nation  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:04:49pm

Bring out your socks! Bring out your socks!

2 NYCHardhat  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:05:09pm

Ron Paul hasn’t got a clue.

3 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:06:44pm

We booted Duke from the party. Why not Paul?

4 Bloodnok  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:06:55pm

And the countdown to the first “I don’t even know who Ron Paul is” comment begins.

5 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:07:26pm

Ron Paul has honor to defend? Who knew.

6 NelsFree  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:07:31pm

Yet another justification for…
TERM LIMITS!

7 Fenway_Nation  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:08:02pm

Remember…it’s not too late to name the swine flu after Ron Paul.

8 Sleepyone  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:08:17pm

I literally did not know the Birchers were still around until I found myself in Portsmouth, NH during the race to the primaries in 2004 when all the candidates were in town or at least in NH. And there they were with their placards, signs, handing out fliers. And here I thought they went the way of the dodo.

9 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:08:52pm

re: #4 Bloodnok

And the countdown to the first “I don’t even know who Ron Paul is” comment begins.

Don’t forget the first “What’s wrong with the John Birch Society?” comment.

10 lawhawk  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:08:52pm

re: #1 Fenway_Nation

Bring out your socks! Bring out your socks!

Sorry, no socks. But I have a boot (or at least used to as I’m now walking around just fine after mending from that broken ankle a month ago).

11 NYCHardhat  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:08:55pm
12 rightwinger3  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:09:16pm

Look, you guys need to knock it off. I voted for Ron Paul in every single LGF Poll.

13 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:09:24pm

Killgore is sharpening his knife…heh…stand back

14 Cato the Elder  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:09:31pm

But…but…Charles…you mean you’re against the JBS too?

I think my head’ll asplode.

15 brookly red  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:09:50pm

October 2008 wasn’t that long ago, & I had never heard of this (in the news)… it’s amazing the things I learn here.

16 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:10:37pm

re: #11 NYCHardhat

Russian navy seizes 29 pirates off Somalia

an aluminum ladder….good grief

17 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:10:52pm

re: #3 MandyManners

Can we package up some kind of two for one deal with Arlen Specter?

18 NelsFree  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:11:40pm

re: #11 NYCHardhat

NATO Amphibious Expeditionary Group, Spec Ops to lead the way, blow the Somali Pirates to Paradise! Rescue the crews, no more ransom.

19 unpaidbills  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:12:00pm

I almost voted for Ron Paul after seeing him on Youtube, this was pre pre election. When he attended a rally denouncing the government, and appearing on the same platform as the Communist Party of the USA I realized that he was off his head.

20 NYCHardhat  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:12:32pm

re: #16 albusteve

an aluminum ladder….good grief

I was expecting to read that they had a stack of Maxim magazines in their boat too.

21 NelsFree  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:12:33pm

We’ll just get a UN resolution to support… oh, never mind.

22 Mich-again  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:12:38pm

I snipped this from the John Birch website by Chuck Adkins under the title “Memo to all Conservative Bloggers: We must be extrememly careful”

My only word of caution of my follow Conservative Bloggers; both Neo and Paleo Conservative, is to be extremely careful of whom you make alliances with. I have a sinking feeling that the F.B.I. is, in fact, doing surveillance on Conservative blogs for threatening language. I mean with the leak of the documents from the DHS about the right wing extremists, and now the arrest of this man. I believe it would behoove all Bloggers to check all of your links and users of twitter to evaluate just whom you are following. Henceforth, I have removed some questionable material from my Blog. Which consisted of a Internet radio feed, that is run by a group that tends to run along those lines; that being conspiracy theory.

Having said all this; let me remind my readers that there is nothing wrong with political dissent. However, political dissent that either is borderline unlawful or does outright break the law, does fly in the face of what Conservative principles are truly about. We are Conservatives; we are not, however, lawless radicals. The only way to beat the socialists is through intelligent debate, not by the use or means of violence. This is why I admired William F. Buckley Jr.; He was such an intellectual, we could always debate the points of socialism, without resorting to the base behavior of many of the political pundits of today.

Anyhow, take my advice for what it is. Remember freedom is a wonderful thing. Personal freedom is even better. Jail sucks. Keep your nose clean.

Love for Buckley at the Bircher site?

23 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:12:51pm

The John Birch Society is making a major comeback, especially after Glenn Beck promoted Bircher Cleon Skousen’s conspiracy book as one of the greatest books ever written.

24 solomonpanting  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:14:44pm
He did not win any Republican presidential primaries, however.

Perfect. Now he’s the top choice for 2012.

25 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:14:50pm

re: #3 MandyManners

We booted Duke from the party. Why not Paul?

I don’t know. Maybe because there’s no such thing as “party discipline” in most American political parties? You’re a Dem or Rep because you say you are.

The most that can happen is that the state and national committees will refuse to fund him, as they did Duke.

26 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:14:52pm

re: #9 Charles

Don’t forget the first “What’s wrong with the John Birch Society?” comment.

Noooooooooooo.

Those folks must not have read much history.

27 NYCHardhat  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:15:22pm

Shit adds up at the bottom….

-Tool-

28 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:15:23pm

re: #20 NYCHardhat

I was expecting to read that they had a stack of Maxim magazines in their boat too.

I mean how do you kill a pirate trying to put a 40ft aluminum ladder up to the chine?…swells and moving water…more like SNL

29 unpaidbills  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:15:24pm

re: #18 NelsFree

Why not just put a few civilian security (black water etc) on the boats, saves us tax payers money.
this whole pirate Somali farce is way over the top.

30 Noam Sayin'  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:15:34pm

Who wants popcorn?

31 solomonpanting  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:15:41pm

re: #11 NYCHardhat

Russian navy seizes 29 pirates off Somalia

Reds beat Pirates.

32 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:15:50pm

re: #17 ArmyWife

Can we package up some kind of two for one deal with Arlen Specter?

Sphincter left willingly.

33 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:16:31pm

re: #19 unpaidbills

I almost voted for Ron Paul after seeing him on Youtube, this was pre pre election. When he attended a rally denouncing the government, and appearing on the same platform as the Communist Party of the USA I realized that he was off his head.

Really? Was he trying to get votes from FCBBHO’s supporters?

34 [deleted]  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:16:36pm
35 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:17:05pm

re: #11 NYCHardhat

Russian navy seizes 29 pirates off Somalia

Line that piques my interest from your link:

Satellite navigation equipment and a large amount of ammunition was also seized.
36 NYCHardhat  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:17:31pm

re: #28 albusteve

I mean how do you kill a pirate trying to put a 40ft aluminum ladder up to the chine?…swells and moving water…more like SNL

It would be comical.

37 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:17:44pm

re: #30 Noam Sayin’

Who wants popcorn?

Noam … I will take mine with parmesan cheese sprinkled on it … please …

38 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:17:48pm

re: #16 albusteve

an aluminum ladder….good grief

What did you think, they swarmed up a rope with their knives in their teeth?

39 Drogheda  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:17:51pm

re: #28 albusteve

I mean how do you kill a pirate trying to put a 40ft aluminum ladder up to the chine?…swells and moving water…more like SNL

Ummm… just stay out of his way and let nature and gravity take it’s course? ;P

40 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:17:55pm

re: #25 Dianna

I don’t know. Maybe because there’s no such thing as “party discipline” in most American political parties? You’re a Dem or Rep because you say you are.

The most that can happen is that the state and national committees will refuse to fund him, as they did Duke.

Pelosi seems to have her party in hand.

41 NYCHardhat  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:18:14pm

re: #35 Dianna

Very perceptive. Who is funding these clowns?

42 VioletTiger  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:18:27pm

re: #35 Dianna

Hi-tech pirates? Hmmmmmm

43 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:18:47pm

re: #30 Noam Sayin’

Who wants popcorn?

I’d like extra butter, please.

44 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:19:00pm

re: #30 Noam Sayin’

Who wants popcorn?

I’d like extra butter, please.

45 MJ  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:19:10pm

Appleton is not only home to the John Birch Society, but was also home to Senator Joe McCarthy.
Coincidence?
Nope.

46 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:19:28pm

I claim firsties on #34’s gamey buttock.

47 The Sanity Inspector  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:19:41pm

re: #34 ArdentCapitalist

I recently read a pamphlet by the JBS, from 1961 or so. They accused the Dems of being in full-bore sellout mode to the communists. In 1961!

48 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:19:54pm

re: #22 Mich-again

I snipped this from the John Birch website by Chuck Adkins under the title “Memo to all Conservative Bloggers: We must be extrememly careful”

Love for Buckley at the Bircher site?

A masquerade? A charade? A pose?

49 Noam Sayin'  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:19:57pm

Okay, that’s 1 - parmesan cheese and 1 - double extra butter.

;)

50 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:20:03pm

Ron Paul should have never been allowed on the stage into the debates. Crazy Alan Keyes even made on of the debates. In hindsight, it was a sign of things to come.

51 ArdentCapitalist  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:20:03pm

re: #38 Dianna

What did you think, they swarmed up a rope with their knives in their teeth?

Well come on now, if you’re going to be a pirate, why not at least have a flare for some theatrics?

52 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:20:45pm

re: #34 ArdentCapitalist

I don’t agree with all of its past policies, but is it really so bad to be a society of pro-individualism and anti-collectivism?

To answer this one - yes, it is “really so bad” if the society’s actual stated claims are delusional paranoia.

53 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:20:55pm

re: #51 ArdentCapitalist

Well come on now, if you’re going to be a pirate, why not at least have a flare for some theatrics?

Kohl eye-liner for everyone!

54 Mich-again  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:21:01pm

re: #23 Charles

Sometime in the last year or so they have completely redone their website and scrubbed the place clean.

Zero search results for “Jewish Lobby”. Same for “Reptillian”

55 Spare O'Lake  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:21:10pm

re: #23 Charles

The John Birch Society is making a major comeback, especially after Glenn Beck promoted Bircher Cleon Skousen’s conspiracy book as one of the greatets books ever written.

And here I thought Oprah’s book club was creepy.

56 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:21:16pm

re: #50 Killgore Trout

Ron Paul should have never been allowed on the stage into the debates. Crazy Alan Keyes even made on of the debates. In hindsight, it was a sign of things to come.

Hang on tight because it’s going to get worse. They have had Ralph Reed calling some shots.

57 IslandLibertarian  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:21:29pm

Many many years ago, my mother was a floor manager at Sears. She told us Sears had to reject a lot of joke greeting cards labeled “The John Bird Society”. The logo was an eagle with its left wing cut off. I was too young to understand at the time.

But I understood when Khrushchev put the nukes in Cuba. that was a no brainer…

58 Bloodnok  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:21:35pm

re: #46 Zimriel

I claim firsties on #34’s gamey buttock.

Mandy would like extra butter on her piece, please.

;)

59 irongrampa  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:21:40pm

Sigh. Should have bought stock in Orville Redenbacher.

60 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:22:03pm

re: #26 MandyManners

Noooooooooooo.

Those folks must not have read much history.

The Birchers have worked very hard on repackaging themselves. It’s quite interesting. I haven’t the time (or hadn’t, while writing) to do the pamphlet collection and so on that would let me get a good look at what they’re doing.

Maybe I’ll take a week or two to look them over and see how they’re marketing their craziness now.

61 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:22:17pm

re: #34 ArdentCapitalist

Why don’t you read up on the society’s history?

62 Mich-again  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:22:18pm

re: #48 Dianna

A masquerade? A charade? A pose?

No I think they have the “Extreme Makeover” bug.

63 [deleted]  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:22:32pm
64 IslandLibertarian  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:22:50pm

re: #31 solomonpanting

Reds beat Pirates.

there’s no p c in Reds.

65 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:23:54pm

Wow, this is amazing to watch.

66 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:24:07pm

re: #40 MandyManners

Pelosi seems to have her party in hand.

If you say so.

67 Drogheda  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:24:37pm

re: #41 NYCHardhat

Very perceptive. Who is funding these clowns?

Companies paying the ransoms for one.

This article from the BBC makes mention of “wealthy businessmen in Dubai” so I suppose that might be a possibility.

I’m more inclined to think that once they got a ransom paid they’d tend to be somewhat self supporting.

68 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:25:10pm

Prepare for a mass exodus of anyone sane from the Republican party.

69 VegasRick  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:25:11pm

re: #64 IslandLibertarian

there’s no p c in Reds.

You can’t spell Shiite without shit.

70 researchok  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:25:21pm

Ron Paul is without a world class lunatic.

He is the sober version of David Duke.

71 Gearhead  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:25:33pm

re: #62 Mich-again

No I think they have the “Extreme Makeover” bug.

A little ‘curb appeal’ for shabby, run-down ideas.

72 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:25:45pm

re: #60 Dianna

The Birchers have worked very hard on repackaging themselves. It’s quite interesting. I haven’t the time (or hadn’t, while writing) to do the pamphlet collection and so on that would let me get a good look at what they’re doing.

Maybe I’ll take a week or two to look them over and see how they’re marketing their craziness now.

Wear a body-condom.

73 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:25:45pm

re: #63 MrMisanthrope

You are one post away from losing your LGF account, by the way.

74 MrMisanthrope  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:25:57pm

re: #70 researchok

Ron Paul is without a world class lunatic.

He is the sober version of David Duke.


Isn’t the Dukster in prison in France right now?

75 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:26:41pm

re: #41 NYCHardhat

Very perceptive. Who is funding these clowns?

Well, they’ve made a lot of money on ransoms, but one does wonder. Remembering that AQ started out as a funding org, first, I have a series of questions.

On the other hand, they’ve grabbed a number of yachts. I suppose they could simply have removed the satellite navigation systems, but then I wonder about making them work.

It’s a very interesting question.

76 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:27:21pm

In fact, you’re losing it right now. I won’t allow LGF to be used to spread swine flu conspiracies.

77 Noam Sayin'  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:27:32pm

Just got done reading it, then *poof*

78 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:28:15pm

re: #50 Killgore Trout

Ron Paul should have never been allowed on the stage into the debates. Crazy Alan Keyes even made on of the debates. In hindsight, it was a sign of things to come.

Ha!

Pretty much anyone, of either party, who’d declared for president was allowed on the stage. Did anyone at all really take Kucinich seriously? Or, in 2004, Al Sharpton?

79 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:28:26pm

re: #77 Noam Sayin’

Just got done reading it, then *poof*

I guess this little piggy went wee wee wee all the way home…

80 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:28:30pm

re: #68 Killgore Trout

Prepare for a mass exodus of anyone sane from the Republican party.

to where?…there is no where to go except full blown permanent socialism…not gonna happen

81 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:28:44pm

re: #34 ArdentCapitalist

John Birch supporters are not welcome at my site.

82 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:28:51pm

What’s up with libertarians and nuttiness? There’s nothing really wrong with libertarian philosophy, it has pluses and minuses just like conservatism and liberalism. They all get spooky when taken too far but there’s something unique a libertarians. There’s something that attracts nuts and conspiracies. Is there something about libertarian thought that leads to this or has libertarianism just become a dumping ground for quacks by chance?

83 Noam Sayin'  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:28:52pm

BRB

Stall the next nutjob while I make some popcorn, will ya?

84 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:29:05pm

re: #72 MandyManners

Wear a body-condom.

No, I’ll do it from my mom’s place in Southern California. No one will know me, any more!

85 Gearhead  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:29:06pm

Wow. It never occurred to me that the ‘Auto’ checkbox works for deletes too. It’s like watching someone get picked off by a sniper.

86 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:29:07pm

re: #78 Dianna

Ha!

Pretty much anyone, of either party, who’d declared for president was allowed on the stage. Did anyone at all really take Kucinich seriously? Or, in 2004, Al Sharpton?

Kucinich (and Gravel) no; Sharpton, yes.

87 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:29:41pm

re: #81 Charles

[re 34] John Birch supporters are not welcome at my site.

*urp*

Pass the chianti, please.

88 Mich-again  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:30:00pm

re: #61 MandyManners

Why don’t you read up on the society’s history?

I know more than anyone could want to know. Let me break it down in one paragraph.

The Bilderburgers run the world. The Council on Foreign Relations are their well groomed and highly placed puppets. The ultimate goal is a single global currency which will make Nations nothing more than different colored areas on maps. And only a gold standard can reign in the federal behemoth and stop the specter of all humanity toiling away at a global plantation while the elites crack the whip.

89 Bubbaman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:30:03pm

No question that Ron is the crazy uncle who belongs in the closet. But, I am troubled by the earlier thread that was linking the Tea Party folks and the Paulinians. When I was at the first set of Tea Parties, there wasn’t a Pauloid in sight. Hopefully, this populist movement isn’t be co-opted by the fringe folks.

90 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:30:22pm

re: #85 Gearhead

Bug zapper.

91 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:30:40pm

Odd to see someone describe the John Birch Society as being anti-collectivist when they are in fact a collectivist society in itself.

92 researchok  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:30:46pm

re: #74 MrMisanthrope

Last I heard, the Czechs kicked him out. He isn’t exactly someone I follow.

Let’s just say he’s Woody Allen’s right wing brother.

Woody Allen is how you up after 30 plus years of psychoanalysis.

Ron Paul is how you end up after 30 plus years of membership in the John Birch Society.

93 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:31:06pm

re: #89 Bubbaman

But, I am troubled by the earlier thread that was linking the Tea Party folks and the Paulinians.


Who mentioned the Tea Party folks on the last thread?

94 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:31:42pm

re: #68 Killgore Trout

Prepare for a mass exodus of anyone sane from the Republican party.

Oh, get a freakin’ grip.

95 IslandLibertarian  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:32:51pm

re: #82 Killgore Trout

Is there something about libertarian thought that leads to this or has libertarianism just become a dumping ground for quacks by chance?

Wait, let me check my magic-decoder ring……

……..nope, not a clue. I’ll bring it up at the next Coven. I’ll get back to you on that.

96 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:32:59pm

Glenn Beck plays a large part in the resurgence of the John Birch Society, by the way. He’s pushing a thinly veiled version of their insanity every day on his shows, and he wrote the foreword for the new edition of the seminal JBS book by Cleon Skousen.

97 Bubbaman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:32:59pm

re: #82 Killgore Trout

What’s up with libertarians and nuttiness? There’s nothing really wrong with libertarian philosophy, it has pluses and minuses just like conservatism and liberalism. They all get spooky when taken too far but there’s something unique a libertarians. There’s something that attracts nuts and conspiracies. Is there something about libertarian thought that leads to this or has libertarianism just become a dumping ground for quacks by chance?

Well, I think that libertarians are by definition non-conformists. As such I think the movement attracts fringe elements.

98 jaunte  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:33:42pm

re: #82 Killgore Trout

What’s up with libertarians and nuttiness? There’s nothing really wrong with libertarian philosophy, it has pluses and minuses just like conservatism and liberalism. They all get spooky when taken too far but there’s something unique a libertarians. There’s something that attracts nuts and conspiracies. Is there something about libertarian thought that leads to this or has libertarianism just become a dumping ground for quacks by chance?

I think there is a structural flaw in the thought. They tend to think mostly about their own freedoms, without much regard for the freedoms or interests of others.

99 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:33:45pm

re: #97 Bubbaman

That’s a pretty good theory.

100 Vicious Babushka  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:34:04pm

re: #11 NYCHardhat

Russian navy seizes 29 pirates off Somalia

Arr! There be some plank-walkin’ keelhaulin’ and yardarm danglin’

101 brookly red  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:34:05pm

re: #68 Killgore Trout

Prepare for a mass exodus of anyone sane from the Republican party.

so Specter is your idea of sane huh?

102 TheMatrix31  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:34:34pm
103 Gearhead  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:35:04pm

re: #90 Killgore Trout

Bug zapper.

Hehtm

And, FWIW, we have quite a few sane GOPers here in South Central Alabama, and we’re not going anywhere. In fact, the people I see at the local level reassure me more than national figures.

104 Velvet Elvis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:35:28pm

In case anyone hasn’t seen this, Hillary Clinton praises Ron Paul and his supporters on the floor of the hourse. It starts at about 5:10 if you want to skip the two of them gabbing.


105 Bubbaman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:35:54pm

re: #93 Killgore Trout

Who mentioned the Tea Party folks on the last thread?

Well it wasn’t the last thread, but Charles had this earlier link,

106 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:35:58pm

re: #101 brookly red

so Specter is your idea of sane huh?


I stopped taking Republicans seriously a while ago. I think a lot of people are tuning out. People will pay attention when they start to get their shit together again.

107 MJ  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:36:09pm

Also, see

Yes, Ron Paul is a Bircher

[Link: blogs.tnr.com…]

108 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:36:17pm

re: #32 MandyManners

Details.

109 Gearhead  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:36:25pm

re: #96 Charles

Glenn Beck plays a large part in the resurgence of the John Birch Society, by the way. He’s pushing a thinly veiled version of their insanity every day on his shows, and he wrote the foreword for the new edition of the seminal JBS book by Cleon Skousen.

So is he picking up where Pat Buchanan left off?

110 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:37:14pm

re: #88 Mich-again

I know more than anyone could want to know. Let me break it down in one paragraph.

The Bilderburgers run the world. The Council on Foreign Relations are their well groomed and highly placed puppets. The ultimate goal is a single global currency which will make Nations nothing more than different colored areas on maps. And only a gold standard can reign in the federal behemoth and stop the specter of all humanity toiling away at a global plantation while the elites crack the whip.

You forgot Bohemian Grove and the giant owl!

111 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:37:30pm

re: #104 Conservative Moonbat

In case anyone hasn’t seen this, Hillary Clinton praises Ron Paul and his supporters on the floor of the hourse. It starts at about 5:10 if you want to skip the two of them gabbing.

[Video]

CM … So … she already showed how far she will bend over when she endorsed Obama … nothing nothing nothing she does or says would ever surprise me … not even praising Ron Paul …

112 brookly red  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:37:49pm

re: #106 Killgore Trout

OK, I’ll buy that…

113 Bubbaman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:38:05pm

re: #99 Killgore Trout

That’s a pretty good theory.

Having spent a fair amount of time with many “Libertarians”, my impression is that they are really quasi-right-wing anarchists.

114 IslandLibertarian  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:38:25pm

re: #110 MandyManners

You forgot Bohemian Grove and the giant owl!

Oh great, blabbermouth. Now we have to kill you.

115 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:38:36pm

re: #105 Bubbaman

Yeah, If you google around a bit the rebirth of the Tea Party concept goes back to about 2006. Paulian and truthers dumping a copy of the 9-11 commission into the bay. Paulians have been holding Tax Day Tea Parties for about the past two years. It’s true.

116 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:39:32pm

re: #114 IslandLibertarian

Oh great, blabbermouth. Now we have to kill you.

Gotta’ catch me first!

117 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:39:39pm

re: #106 Killgore Trout

I stopped taking Republicans seriously a while ago. I think a lot of people are tuning out. People will pay attention when they start to get their shit together again.

you need to get off the net and back into the real world….millions of conservative Republicans would smirk at your dooms day wishes for an implosion…there are problems with politics in general and hardly limited to one party or another….

118 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:39:52pm

re: #108 ArmyWife

Details.

Pesky varmints!

119 IslandLibertarian  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:40:40pm

re: #116 MandyManners

not only do we know where you are….we know where you’ll be……..no one expects the Libertarian Inquisition!

120 livefreeor die  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:40:56pm

re: #118 MandyManners

Pesky varmints!

Mandy, I got called away by the baby waking up during the earlier thread but I liked your idea for third prize!

121 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:41:35pm

re: #106 Killgore Trout

I stopped taking Republicans seriously a while ago. I think a lot of people are tuning out. People will pay attention when they start to get their shit together again.

Snowe is not happy with the present GOP either :

“Sen. Olympia Snowe (R-Maine) a fellow moderate, didn’t seem surprised. On the national level, she says, “you haven’t certainly heard warm encouraging words of how they [Republicans] view moderates. Either you are with us or against us.”

“Ultimately we’re heading to having the smallest political tent in history they way things are unfolding,” Snowe said. “We should have learned from the 2006 election, which I was a party of. I happened to win with 74% of the vote in a blue collar state but no one asked me how did you do it. Seems to me that would have been the first question that would have come from the Republican party to find out so we could avoid further losses.”

122 MJ  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:41:37pm

John Birch Society members still fight the Cold War

Political organization brought its headquarters to Fox Cities 20 years ago this spring

Appleton newspaper account of the JBS:

[Link: www.postcrescent.com…]

123 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:42:13pm

re: #82 Killgore Trout

Is there something about libertarian thought that leads to this or has libertarianism just become a dumping ground for quacks by chance?

On my own authority, as a sometime libertarian and misanthrope: What leads people like me toward libertarianism is an attitude of “LEAVE ME ALONE”. Our greatest fear is that somebody out there is going to mess with our heads.

This is in fact what really does happen in school, and in government employment, and in the too-big-to-fail sorts of “private” company; and it is indeed a Brezhnevite drain on the human spirit (and, IMO, this is not likely to improve over the next four years). But where someone like you might just bitch about it, or even join the Republicans; a misanthrope lacks that faith in human processes, and (if overly isolated) is susceptible to darker obsessions.

124 hazzyday  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:42:17pm

Ron Paul and Alex Jones. The most famous Republicans operating in the MSM right now?

125 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:43:11pm

re: #106 Killgore Trout

I stopped taking Republicans seriously a while ago. I think a lot of people are tuning out. People will pay attention when they start to get their shit together again.

Doesn’t look good really. They’re about to lose any chance of a filibuster in the Senate. They are still losing seats in both the House and Senate. There are calls for a “purge” from some sectors. The alternative they present to replace McCain in the Senate is the unelectable and questionable Chris Simcox.

Then you have the re-embracing of Ralph Reed. The latest phenomenons of Ron Paul, Glenn Beck, Birchers, and even Alex Jones to a certain extent. I can only see it becoming more alienated from the mainstream as it becomes an even “larger” minority party.

126 Ojoe  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:43:15pm

The pale colors of evening in the San Gabriel Mountains; a view down a canyon where darkness will come early. The Towercam, Pacific time zone.

Good Evening.

Ron Paul must have paneled his bathroom in birch wood, so he could have a:


Birch John.

(very old joke, ca. 1950)

127 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:43:39pm

re: #124 hazzyday

Ron Paul and Alex Jones. The most famous Republicans operating in the MSM right now?

Alex Jones isn’t a republican, is he?

128 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:43:44pm

re: #121 avanti

Snowe is not happy with the present GOP either :

“Sen. Olympia Snowe (R-Maine) a fellow moderate, didn’t seem surprised. On the national level, she says, “you haven’t certainly heard warm encouraging words of how they [Republicans] view moderates. Either you are with us or against us.”

“Ultimately we’re heading to having the smallest political tent in history they way things are unfolding,” Snowe said. “We should have learned from the 2006 election, which I was a party of. I happened to win with 74% of the vote in a blue collar state but no one asked me how did you do it. Seems to me that would have been the first question that would have come from the Republican party to find out so we could avoid further losses.”

Snow is a RINO pig…same as Specter…they don’t represent conservatives…didn’t you know that?

129 livefreeor die  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:44:25pm

re: #128 albusteve

Snow is a RINO pig…same as Specter…they don’t represent conservatives…didn’t you know that?

I don’t think of them as moderates either-way too left.

130 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:44:34pm

re: #121 avanti

Snowe is not happy with the present GOP either :

“Sen. Olympia Snowe (R-Maine) a fellow moderate, didn’t seem surprised. On the national level, she says, “you haven’t certainly heard warm encouraging words of how they [Republicans] view moderates. Either you are with us or against us.”

Classy lady, with that passive-aggressive slam on George W Bush.

She let her contempt for the “Red States” slip in that one. I don’t think she’s long for the GOP.

131 Vicious Babushka  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:44:44pm

re: #88 Mich-again

I know more than anyone could want to know. Let me break it down in one paragraph.

The Bilderburgers run the world. The Council on Foreign Relations are their well groomed and highly placed puppets. The ultimate goal is a single global currency which will make Nations nothing more than different colored areas on maps. And only a gold standard can reign in the federal behemoth and stop the specter of all humanity toiling away at a global plantation while the elites crack the whip.

I would love to have the franchise for a fast food restaurant called “Build-A-Burger”

132 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:44:50pm

re: #121 avanti

Here’s the deal. If you want our freaks, you have to take the WHOLE gang. Ron Paul and Pat Buchanan are coming your way. It’s just the way it is in business.

133 hazzyday  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:45:18pm

re: #127 Dianna

Alex Jones isn’t a republican, is he?

No, But I think the Fox news would like to portray him like that.

134 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:45:24pm

re: #126 Ojoe

The pale colors of evening in the San Gabriel Mountains; a view down a canyon where darkness will come early. The Towercam, Pacific time zone.

Good Evening.

Ron Paul must have paneled his bathroom in birch wood, so he could have a:

Birch John.

(very old joke, ca. 1950)

Ojoe … I always look forward to your towercam posts …

135 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:45:43pm

re: #129 livefreeor die

I don’t think of them as moderates either-way too left.

they only care about their power…the worst sort of politician

136 2by2  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:46:04pm

posted this on the previous dead thread:
Once the political process becomes extremely polarized, it is very difficult to return to a civil discourse.
I believe we are seeing a bit of polarization, which compare to European party affiliations, which are mostly “tribal”.
There is a such a gap/moat between European parties on the left and right aka liberal/conservative, that one can’t really talk about issues, but tribal affiliations.
Woe to the US, if the political process becomes Europeanized.
This used to be the country where issues were decisive, not affiliations.
Kudos to Charles, who is still following that tradition and tries to get down to the issues in question.

137 hokiepride  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:46:06pm

Actually some of the ideas of JBS are pretty normal and appealing to mainstream conservatives, for example return to the Constitution, US out of the UN and maintaining some degree of isolation from international affairs. However, its founding members include a well known White nationalist and a founder of the National Alliance and the JBS kookery in its smears against Eisenhower are well known. Is it possible to find a single sane, sensible center-right organization without the conspiracy kooks and the racists

138 jaunte  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:46:24pm

re: #127 Dianna

Alex Jones isn’t a republican, is he?

I think whatever his nominal affiliation, Jones belongs to the freak party.

What’s more, Paul’s connections to extremism go beyond the newsletters. He has given extensive interviews to the magazine of the John Birch Society, and has frequently been a guest of Alex Jones, a radio host and perhaps the most famous conspiracy theorist in America. Jones—whose recent documentary, Endgame: Blueprint for Global Enslavement, details the plans of George Pataki, David Rockefeller, and Queen Beatrix of the Netherlands, among others, to exterminate most of humanity and develop themselves into “superhuman” computer hybrids able to “travel throughout the cosmos”—estimates that Paul has appeared on his radio program about 40 times over the past twelve years.[Link: www.tnr.com…]
139 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:46:43pm

re: #128 albusteve

Snow is a RINO pig…same as Specter…they don’t represent conservatives…didn’t you know that?

avanti’s point isn’t about whether Snowe represents conservatives; it’s about whether conservatives have become pariahs in this country today.

140 Silvergirl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:46:44pm

Ron Paul and his mostly rabid followers badmouth Lincoln. That’s all I needed to know right from the start.

141 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:47:14pm

Ron Paul’s “blowback” moment pissed me off. That he would give time to Alex Jones (and receive such high praise from the same) puts him higher on my “do not want” list.

Scum rubbing elbows with scum.

142 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:47:33pm

re: #137 hokiepride

Slow down, hoss. Isolationism? Not a conservative principle. We SPREAD democracy, not horde it.

143 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:47:38pm

re: #133 hazzyday

No, But I think the Fox news would like to portray him like that.

Or more specifically Andrew Napolitano who himself is a Republican portrays him as “The Great” Alex Jones. Therein lies another problem in which Andrew Napolitano has effectively mainstreamed Alex Jones to his viewers.

144 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:47:49pm

re: #119 IslandLibertarian

not only do we know where you are….we know where you’ll be……..no one expects the Libertarian Inquisition!

You won’t get me ‘cause I’m a shape-shifting reptilian alien.

145 livefreeor die  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:47:56pm

re: #135 albusteve

they only care about their power…the worst sort of politician

Amen to that. Specter doesn’t want to lose his Senate posts- that’s more important to him than the interests of the people who have been electing him all these years to represent them.

146 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:48:11pm

re: #120 livefreeor die

Mandy, I got called away by the baby waking up during the earlier thread but I liked your idea for third prize!

Who’s gonna’ tell WAB to give up her clothes?

147 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:48:25pm

re: #139 Zimriel

avanti’s point isn’t about whether Snowe represents conservatives; it’s about whether conservatives have become pariahs in this country today.

maybe they have…if so you can hand her and Spector the tab

148 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:48:28pm

re: #146 MandyManners

Me! Me! I’ll do it!

149 brookly red  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:48:46pm

re: #146 MandyManners

Who’s gonna’ tell WAB to give up her clothes?

/NOT ME!

150 TheMatrix31  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:48:58pm

re: #142 ArmyWife

Slow down, hoss. Isolationism? Not a conservative principle. We SPREAD democracy, not horde it.

Not to mention that isolation is simply impossible in 2009.

151 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:49:28pm

re: #138 jaunte

I can’t decide whether to scream or laugh so hard I throw up.

152 livefreeor die  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:49:37pm

re: #146 MandyManners

Who’s gonna’ tell WAB to give up her clothes?

re: #148 ArmyWife

Me! Me! I’ll do it!

Yikes!
ArmyWife, make sure you wear body armor.

153 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:49:37pm

re: #127 Dianna

Alex Jones isn’t a republican, is he?

Remember the way he went after Pres. Bush?

154 Silvergirl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:49:49pm

re: #130 Zimriel

Classy lady, with that passive-aggressive slam on George W Bush.

She let her contempt for the “Red States” slip in that one. I don’t think she’s long for the GOP.

I think you’re on to something. She’ll play it like she had no choice—was forced out. She’s rehearsing the lines already.

155 Velvet Elvis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:50:04pm

re: #128 albusteve

Snow is a RINO pig…same as Specter…they don’t represent conservatives…didn’t you know that?

Speaking as a fairly conservative democrat (I’m socially liberal but support a balanced budget amendment), where is it written in stone that all republicans must be conservative and all democrats must be liberal?

Why is not OK to have moderate and liberal republicans? I’d vote for them. We have plenty of conservative democrats.

156 Spare O'Lake  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:50:37pm

If you avoided the bird flu while you were visiting China you probably flu the coop.

157 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:50:50pm

re: #128 albusteve

Snow is a RINO pig…same as Specter…they don’t represent conservatives…didn’t you know that?

I get that, but can you win with just conservatives ? There are fewer and fewer red states to compete in. The Democrats need more blue dog democrats and moderates too.

158 IslandLibertarian  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:51:00pm

re: #144 MandyManners

Legal or illegal alien?

/one day I’ll write about a past life regression involving reptilian aliens……..

159 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:51:09pm

re: #155 Conservative Moonbat

Speaking as a fairly conservative democrat (I’m socially liberal but support a balanced budget amendment), where is it written in stone that all republicans must be conservative and all democrats must be liberal?

Why is not OK to have moderate and liberal republicans? I’d vote for them. We have plenty of conservative democrats.

CM .. you support a balanced budget … and you voted for Obama … I am really confused …

160 Mich-again  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:51:45pm

re: #115 Killgore Trout

I have a good friend who went to the tax day Tea Party in Lansing and said there were very few outright “kooks” and they were hanging out in the fringes getting mostly ignored. But he also said the crowd was both very anti-Dem and anti-GOP. He said no politicians came and none would have been welcome there. That did sound to me like a classic Ron Paul crowd even if they weren’t obvious about it. There is small but loyal ground level support in the GOP for Paul, more than anyone wants to admit. And I think its mostly because there is a complete vacuum in the GOP leadership right now. And Paul makes them feel better about their predicament by pointing out the “bad guys” who are the source of the misery. He’s got it all figured out.

161 Silvergirl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:52:00pm

re: #151 Dianna

I can’t decide whether to scream or laugh so hard I throw up.

The second would be most entertaining. So if you have to do it, choose that one.

162 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:52:00pm

re: #143 Gus 802

Or more specifically Andrew Napolitano who himself is a Republican portrays him as “The Great” Alex Jones. Therein lies another problem in which Andrew Napolitano has effectively mainstreamed Alex Jones to his viewers.

Was it on Fox television or the Internet only?

163 Jack Burton  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:52:12pm

re: #3 MandyManners

We booted Duke from the party. Why not Paul?

No one is “in charge” to do the booting. There is no 2009 version of Buckley, Goldwater, or Reagen and I’m not so sure if there was that he wouldn’t be trying to boot *us* out.

164 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:52:36pm

re: #128 albusteve

Snow is a RINO pig…same as Specter…they don’t represent conservatives…didn’t you know that?

On a technical note after the defection by Specter today if Snowe is to follow in kind that will effectively make the Senate filibuster-proof and effectively neuter any opposition to the Democrats.

165 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:52:39pm

re: #148 ArmyWife

Me! Me! I’ll do it!

Can you duck a waffle iron?

166 slokat  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:52:46pm

You all seem to forget that there are people in their mother’s basements all across the country that take all this to heart.

hah! hah! this is fun to you, is life or death serious to them, when they apply themselves.

I would bet they are more numerous than the leftist anarchists… and they seem to tend to vote.

167 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:52:59pm

re: #162 MandyManners

Was it on Fox television or the Internet only?

I don’t know.

168 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:53:10pm

re: #149 brookly red

/NOT ME!

You can hide behind ArmyWife.

169 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:53:59pm

re: #155 Conservative Moonbat

Speaking as a fairly conservative democrat (I’m socially liberal but support a balanced budget amendment), where is it written in stone that all republicans must be conservative and all democrats must be liberal?

Why is not OK to have moderate and liberal republicans? I’d vote for them. We have plenty of conservative democrats.

there are not ‘plenty’ of conservative donks…twenty maybe?…I don’t design the terms but anybody that votes to put the US into perpetual debt and servitude to the feds is not a conservative…nothing is written in stone and I didn’t say it was

170 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:54:22pm

re: #158 IslandLibertarian

Legal or illegal alien?

/one day I’ll write about a past life regression involving reptilian aliens……..

Legal. We rule the earth, dontcha’ know.

171 brookly red  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:55:05pm

re: #168 MandyManners

You can hide behind ArmyWife.

and see her (WAB) naked? what have I ever done to you?

172 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:55:29pm

re: #163 ArchangelMichael

No one is “in charge” to do the booting. There is no 2009 version of Buckley, Goldwater, or Reagen and I’m not so sure if there was that he wouldn’t be trying to boot *us* out.

Who booted out Duke?

173 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:55:51pm

re: #171 brookly red

and see her (WAB) naked? what have I ever done to you?

BR … please don’t say that again …pleeeeeeeeaaaaaaseeeeee

174 Dahveed  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:55:57pm

Elwood: John Birchers.
Jake: I hate John Birchers.

—If “The Blues Brothers” was made today.

175 livefreeor die  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:56:08pm

re: #164 Gus 802

On a technical note after the defection by Specter today if Snowe is to follow in kind that will effectively make the Senate filibuster-proof and effectively neuter any opposition to the Democrats.

It was already that way in a sense. They had Rs after their names but were voting with the Democrats. All that will change is that now they will be official Ds.

But they’ll still be %@*s.

176 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:56:08pm

re: #171 brookly red

and see her (WAB) naked? what have I ever done to you?

Just walk backwards.

177 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:56:12pm

re: #172 MandyManners

Who booted out Duke?

I’d actually read the wiki article on that. It’s accurate, and really interesting.

178 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:56:19pm

re: #157 avanti

I get that, but can you win with just conservatives ? There are fewer and fewer red states to compete in. The Democrats need more blue dog democrats and moderates too.

I stand on my priciples, win or lose…I don’t care for your polls and hairsplitting….I have little respect for your politics…it’s people with your mentality that have gotten us to this near disaster

179 reine.de.tout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:56:41pm

All flu outbreaks are worthy of taking reasonable precautions.
Here is what seems to be a sane and rational take on this swine flu outbreak.

180 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:56:59pm

re: #177 Dianna

I’d actually read the wiki article on that. It’s accurate, and really interesting.

I like the bit about his writing under a female psuedonym.

181 livefreeor die  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:57:24pm

re: #171 brookly red

and see her (WAB) naked? what have I ever done to you?

She’ll still have her studded leather underwear on.

182 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:57:49pm

re: #164 Gus 802

On a technical note after the defection by Specter today if Snowe is to follow in kind that will effectively make the Senate filibuster-proof and effectively neuter any opposition to the Democrats.

they know that…they will be heros to the leftards…it’s sickening

183 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:58:04pm

re: #181 livefreeor die

She’ll still have her studded leather underwear on.

LVoD … pleeeeeassssssseeeee ya’ll stop with the visuals … killing me here …

184 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:58:06pm

re: #139 Zimriel

avanti’s point isn’t about whether Snowe represents conservatives; it’s about whether conservatives have become pariahs in this country today.

I would never call them pariahs, for one thing, there are many kinds of conservatives. My point was that the social/fiscal conservatives are trying to purge the party of those that don’t agree with there agenda, and I don’t think it’s a winning one.

The more the moderates are attacked and leave, the more convinced the country is that the GOP is dominated by the hard right.

185 brookly red  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:58:22pm

re: #176 MandyManners

Just walk backwards.

your still mad about that goose thing huh?

186 jcm  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:58:33pm

re: #179 reine.de.tout

All flu outbreaks are worthy of taking reasonable precautions.
Here is what seems to be a sane and rational take on this swine flu outbreak.

What’s old is new again!

187 [deleted]  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:59:11pm
188 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:59:51pm

re: #184 avanti

That’s interesting. The complaint has always been that the Republicans are controlled by their right wing.

Hell, the complaint was that Bush was a right-wing nut.

189 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 7:59:53pm

re: #182 albusteve

they know that…they will be heros to the leftards…it’s sickening

I know. Specter should have just resigned or at least retired after this term. I think it’s disingenuous to switch parties mid-term regardless of the individual and party.

190 Bubbaman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:00:10pm

re: #123 Zimriel

On my own authority, as a sometime libertarian and misanthrope: What leads people like me toward libertarianism is an attitude of “LEAVE ME ALONE”. Our greatest fear is that somebody out there is going to mess with our heads.

This is in fact what really does happen in school, and in government employment, and in the too-big-to-fail sorts of “private” company; and it is indeed a Brezhnevite drain on the human spirit (and, IMO, this is not likely to improve over the next four years). But where someone like you might just bitch about it, or even join the Republicans; a misanthrope lacks that faith in human processes, and (if overly isolated) is susceptible to darker obsessions.

See, this is the typical “libertarian” response and as I was saying, it really is a form of anarchy. A lot of this was rooted in the works of Hegel which then inspired both the Marxists and Libertarians. Much philosophy here that depending on your spin of state leads down one path or another.

191 livefreeor die  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:00:41pm

So as not to offend swine, or something, they want us to call it the “H1N1” flu. Doesn’t exactly roll off the tongue.
The “hopeandchange” flu has fewer syllables.

192 brookly red  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:01:13pm

re: #183 JacksonTn

LVoD … pleeeeeassssssseeeee ya’ll stop with the visuals … killing me here …

just give us the account number and no one gets hoit…

193 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:01:20pm

re: #155 Conservative Moonbat

Where do you hide them?

From a conservative side, I’m fine with having moderate Republicans in our tent - but representatives must be capable of the following:

- read the Constitution and take it at it’s word. Uphold it for everyone.

- allow those who chose to be strongly religious to be so, free from interference from those that aren’t. And vice versa.

- Treat the budget like your own checkbook. If there’s no money? Don’t write a check.

- Build a strong Military. It’s the best Peace Insurance Policy ever.

- We are a party with morals. Act like it. This means no sleeping around with 18 year olds, and if your married? Your wife or husband is your bed partner. Just the way it is. Do not allow supremest to be a part of this party. That goes for other kook factions as well.

- we value entrepreneurial spirit and hard work. It is not government responsibility to take care of each and every problem that comes along.

There is more in my creed, but this hits the main points!

194 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:01:35pm

re: #184 avanti

I would never call them pariahs, for one thing, there are many kinds of conservatives. My point was that the social/fiscal conservatives are trying to purge the party of those that don’t agree with there agenda, and I don’t think it’s a winning one.

The more the moderates are attacked and leave, the more convinced the country is that the GOP is dominated by the hard right.

it may not be a winning agenda but at least unlike libs it’s politically honest…that means something to people unlike yourself

195 livefreeor die  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:02:21pm

Off to feed the baby. Good night all!

196 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:02:24pm

re: #188 Dianna

That’s interesting. The complaint has always been that the Republicans are controlled by their right wing.

Hell, the complaint was that Bush was a right-wing nut.

Bush had an earned reputation for non-partisan deal-making in Texas.

But the Dems in DC just couldn’t handle a non-evil Republican, so that started eight years of pandering to the leftard base.

And it worked.

Now the piper must be paid.

197 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:02:29pm

re: #165 MandyManners

I can catch it and fling it back before you can say “What a hideous sweater”

198 ArdentCapitalist  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:02:47pm

I spoke with Charles, and he’s let me back into the lizard nest. I just wanted to clarify to you folks that I was simply trying to point out that the Birch Society’s stated policies of anti-Communism and pro-individualism are a good thing. I’m not much too familiar with the group. I was just trying to say that I believe in pro-individualist philosophy.

199 MandyManners  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:02:51pm

The Kid’s asleep so it’s time for me to hit the hay, too. Good night, Lizards!

200 Bloodnok  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:03:17pm

re: #199 MandyManners

The Kid’s asleep so it’s time for me to hit the hay, too. Good night, Lizards!

‘nite!

201 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:03:25pm

re: #191 livefreeor die

So as not to offend swine, or something, they want us to call it the “H1N1” flu. Doesn’t exactly roll off the tongue.
The “hopeandchange” flu has fewer syllables.

“Hiney flu” just does NOT sound right.

/

202 [deleted]  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:03:28pm
203 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:03:42pm

re: #175 livefreeor die

It was already that way in a sense. They had Rs after their names but were voting with the Democrats. All that will change is that now they will be official Ds.

But they’ll still be %@*s.

Right. Yet, if it becomes filibuster-proof the results will be worse and that’s only one man away.

204 Bubbaman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:04:01pm

I should add that there’s a third way between the Marxists and Libertarians and that used to be called America.

205 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:04:12pm

re: #199 MandyManners

Night. Sleep well.

206 Mich-again  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:04:17pm

re: #191 livefreeor die

“H1N1” flu. Doesn’t exactly roll off the tongue.

Hone None?

207 Velvet Elvis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:04:49pm

re: #169 albusteve

there are not ‘plenty’ of conservative donks…twenty maybe?…I don’t design the terms but anybody that votes to put the US into perpetual debt and servitude to the feds is not a conservative…nothing is written in stone and I didn’t say it was

The Blue Dog coalition has 49 members, my rep among them. Some of ‘em are more conservative than others but as a voting block that’s some weight to throw around.

That’s nowhere near the number of liberal and moderate republicans.

208 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:04:56pm

re: #206 Mich-again

Hone None?

Hini //

209 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:05:16pm

re: #201 OldLineTexan

Obama Flu? Democrat Flu? A Flu By Any Other Name Flu?

210 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:05:19pm

re: #178 albusteve

I stand on my priciples, win or lose…I don’t care for your polls and hairsplitting….I have little respect for your politics…it’s people with your mentality that have gotten us to this near disaster

To quote BHO, you are “losing the good in search of the perfect.” i.e. say you don’t support a pro choice,fiscally conservative Republican on a pro life principle and you get a pro choice, fiscally liberal Democrat ?

211 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:05:35pm

re: #208 Gus 802

Hini //

Beat ya to it (201).

/

212 rawmuse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:05:43pm

re: #204 Bubbaman

I should add that there’s a third way between the Marxists and Libertarians and that used to be called America.

There is also a Third Way called “The Third Way”

213 Cato the Elder  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:05:51pm

re: #23 Charles

The John Birch Society is making a major comeback, especially after Glenn Beck promoted Bircher Cleon Skousen’s conspiracy book as one of the greatest books ever written.

I’m sorry, but when I see the name Cleon Skousen I can’t help picturing someone like the prototypical hick on the Simpsons.

People should be careful what they name their children.

214 Gearhead  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:05:55pm

A message put forth re: #206 Mich-again

Hone None?

Read the “1”s as “i”s and it becomes the “hiney” flu.

215 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:05:58pm

OT: I had some semi-good news today. My dire financial situation might be over in 6 months or so. All I have to do is hang on in the meantime.

216 Pvt Bin Jammin  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:06:09pm

re: #208 Gus 802

Hini //

I thought of that too. LOL

217 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:06:16pm

re: #207 Conservative Moonbat

The Blue Dog coalition has 49 members, my rep among them. Some of ‘em are more conservative than others but as a voting block that’s some weight to throw around.

That’s nowhere near the number of liberal and moderate republicans.

I’ve been wrong before…thanks for that

218 Gearhead  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:06:33pm

re: #211 OldLineTexan

Beat ya to it (201).

/

Dammit. I’m so much slower than you people!

219 Bloodnok  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:06:39pm

re: #215 Killgore Trout

OT: I had some semi-good news today. My dire financial situation might be over in 6 months or so. All I have to do is hang on in the meantime.

Good to hear!

220 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:06:57pm

re: #207 Conservative Moonbat

The Blue Dog coalition has 49 members, my rep among them. Some of ‘em are more conservative than others but as a voting block that’s some weight to throw around.

That’s nowhere near the number of liberal and moderate republicans.

CM … really where were they on the bailout? … the dem in my district voted for it … and he is suppose to be blue dog … this is why I am no longer a democrat … I called his office every single day during the primaries to see exactly where he stood on Obama … he showed me by not voting at all as a super delegate … f*cking liars …

221 jcm  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:07:52pm

re: #214 Gearhead

A message put forth

Read the “1”s as “i”s and it becomes the “hiney” flu.

Hiney kicked my butt….

222 VioletTiger  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:07:54pm

re: #184 avanti

I would never call them pariahs, for one thing, there are many kinds of conservatives. My point was that the social/fiscal conservatives are trying to purge the party of those that don’t agree with there agenda, and I don’t think it’s a winning one.

The more the moderates are attacked and leave, the more convinced the country is that the GOP is dominated by the hard right.

avanti, people like Specter are not really conservative—anybody who voted for the porkulus bill or the spendulus budget are not really conservatives or moderates. He didn’t leave the party because it was leaning too far right. He let because there was no way he could win the primary. He is saving his ass, that’s all.

223 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:08:39pm

re: #222 VioletTiger

avanti, people like Specter are not really conservative—anybody who voted for the porkulus bill or the spendulus budget are not really conservatives or moderates. He didn’t leave the party because it was leaning too far right. He let because there was no way he could win the primary. He is saving his ass, that’s all.

Hell, he even SAID so, although not as plainly. He is a pol, after all.

224 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:09:06pm

re: #219 Bloodnok

Thanks. I was starting to think that I was permanently sunk until the economy recovers.

225 yesandno  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:09:13pm

re: #189 Gus 802

I know. Specter should have just resigned or at least retired after this term. I think it’s disingenuous to switch parties mid-term regardless of the individual and party.

Specter=political expediency. Like most Dems, it is all about him. Changed from Dem to Repub in 1965 to win. Does the same thing now. Hope they vote him out of office. Someone should stand on principle…he certatinly doesn’t. But he was going to vote with the Dems anyway, so might as well call him what he is.

226 brookly red  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:09:55pm

re: #222 VioletTiger

avanti, people like Specter are not really conservative—anybody who voted for the porkulus bill or the spendulus budget are not really conservatives or moderates. He didn’t leave the party because it was leaning too far right. He let because there was no way he could win the primary. He is saving his ass, that’s all.

I think he is done for any how… (could be wrong)

227 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:10:00pm

re: #210 avanti

To quote BHO, you are “losing the good in search of the perfect.” i.e. say you don’t support a pro choice,fiscally conservative Republican on a pro life principle and you get a pro choice, fiscally liberal Democrat ?

that kind of shit makes me sick…it’s not about winning or losing, or polls, or TV talking heads…it’s about principle…explain how liberal/socialism makes us a better, stronger nation, unique amongst the commie rabble of the rest of them?…you can’t…liberalism is a disease that destroys…and you are part of it

228 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:10:20pm

re: #188 Dianna

That’s interesting. The complaint has always been that the Republicans are controlled by their right wing.

Hell, the complaint was that Bush was a right-wing nut.

Bush sort of missed the fiscally conservative boat IMHO. He was a conservative right wing nut when it came to social issues, his actions in the Terri Schiavo case being the most extreme. That made him a hero to some on the right, but scared the crap out of me.

229 reine.de.tout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:10:34pm

re: #215 Killgore Trout

OT: I had some semi-good news today. My dire financial situation might be over in 6 months or so. All I have to do is hang on in the meantime.

Well, that’s good to hear.
Mysterious, but good.

230 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:10:38pm

re: #204 Bubbaman

I should add that there’s a third way between the Marxists and Libertarians and that used to be called America.

I’m sorry, but that’s balderdash. America in the 1780s took the measure of the Marxists of their day - the Jacobins in France - and drew up a Constitution expressly designed to stop anything like Marxism from taking hold here. As for the libertarians, granted this Constitution wasn’t as libertarian as the Articles of Confederation, but the framers still attempted to give a latitude for human freedom as wide as possible given the constraints of (for instance) the South.

231 Bubbaman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:10:47pm

re: #198 ArdentCapitalist

I spoke with Charles, and he’s let me back into the lizard nest. I just wanted to clarify to you folks that I was simply trying to point out that the Birch Society’s stated policies of anti-Communism and pro-individualism are a good thing. I’m not much too familiar with the group. I was just trying to say that I believe in pro-individualist philosophy.

While I don’t mean to offend, Hitler had some reasonable points too. And that’s precisely the danger with some of these kooks. Hitler began railing against the liberals, Jews, and Commies while advocating self reliance and nationalism - themes which resonated with many folks. People underestimated his pure evil, and we know how that played out. Birchers are Hitler light without the charisma.

232 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:11:07pm

re: #223 OldLineTexan

It wasn’t a principled decision in the least. He was going to lose, because he left his party. Seems to me this is a sign that if you bray like a donkey whilst wearing elephant togs, you will be sent packing. Doesn’t support the “if we were just more moderate, we’d win” camp, now does it. Meghan McCain - I’m looking at you.

233 yesandno  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:11:29pm

re: #193 ArmyWife

Where do you hide them?

From a conservative side, I’m fine with having moderate Republicans in our tent - but representatives must be capable of the following:

- read the Constitution and take it at it’s word. Uphold it for everyone.

- allow those who chose to be strongly religious to be so, free from interference from those that aren’t. And vice versa.

- Treat the budget like your own checkbook. If there’s no money? Don’t write a check.

- Build a strong Military. It’s the best Peace Insurance Policy ever.

- We are a party with morals. Act like it. This means no sleeping around with 18 year olds, and if your married? Your wife or husband is your bed partner. Just the way it is. Do not allow supremest to be a part of this party. That goes for other kook factions as well.

- we value entrepreneurial spirit and hard work. It is not government responsibility to take care of each and every problem that comes along.

There is more in my creed, but this hits the main points!

Well Said!

234 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:12:00pm

re: #232 ArmyWife

It wasn’t a principled decision in the least. He was going to lose, because he left his party. Seems to me this is a sign that if you bray like a donkey whilst wearing elephant togs, you will be sent packing. Doesn’t support the “if we were just more moderate, we’d win” camp, now does it. Meghan McCain - I’m looking at you.

Having a Daddy in politics doesn’t make you an expert in anything … see “Kennedy”.

235 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:12:08pm

Must reboot. Back shortly. re: #193 ArmyWife

Once we clean up the grammar and spelling, we’re golden.

236 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:12:19pm

re: #198 ArdentCapitalist

I spoke with Charles, and he’s let me back into the lizard nest. I just wanted to clarify to you folks that I was simply trying to point out that the Birch Society’s stated policies of anti-Communism and pro-individualism are a good thing. I’m not much too familiar with the group. I was just trying to say that I believe in pro-individualist philosophy.

And this is how extremist groups like the John Birch Society find their back to respectability — by exploiting seemingly reasonable points to convince people who don’t know much about them. It’s a strategy that has a name: “entryism.”

237 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:12:20pm

re: #225 yesandno

Specter=political expediency. Like most Dems, it is all about him. Changed from Dem to Repub in 1965 to win. Does the same thing now. Hope they vote him out of office. Someone should stand on principle…he certatinly doesn’t. But he was going to vote with the Dems anyway, so might as well call him what he is.

Yep. Since he did this in 1965 I think this qualifies him as an a-hole. ;)

238 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:13:00pm

re: #237 Gus 802

Yep. Since he did this in 1965 I think this qualifies him as an a-hole. ;)

Qualifies? He’s up for Grand Poobah!

/

239 Gearhead  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:13:13pm

re: #225 yesandno

Specter=political expediency. Like most Dems, it is all about him. Changed from Dem to Repub in 1965 to win. Does the same thing now. Hope they vote him out of office. Someone should stand on principle…he certatinly doesn’t. But he was going to vote with the Dems anyway, so might as well call him what he is.

S.P.E.C.T.R.E.’s plans always backfire in the end. It just takes patience and determination - and lots of martinis.

240 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:13:25pm

re: #230 Zimriel

The “Third Way” between libertarianism and populist tyranny is a propaganda term, cooked up by corrupt politicians like Nehru in India. They framed the debate as one between “unfettered capitalism” and Communism, and went for a “pragmatic” course whereby a political class would get to direct the nation’s capital. In other words, it’s classical fascism, and (Woodrow Wilson aside) it is entirely alien to this nation’s character.

241 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:13:43pm

re: #228 avanti

Protecting a citizen scared the crap out of you, but the President dictating who can and cannot be a CEO of a private company is no big deal? Interesting.

(for the record, I have issues with some of the Terri Schiavo case, but I’d bet they are different than yours).

242 rawmuse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:14:19pm

re: #240 Zimriel

The “Third Way” between libertarianism and populist tyranny is a propaganda term, cooked up by corrupt politicians like Nehru in India. They framed the debate as one between “unfettered capitalism” and Communism, and went for a “pragmatic” course whereby a political class would get to direct the nation’s capital. In other words, it’s classical fascism, and (Woodrow Wilson aside) it is entirely alien to this nation’s character.

Up until the present time, IMHO.

243 MrMisanthrope  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:14:30pm

I would also like to apologise for being unclear in the intent of my (deleted) post and thank Charles for reactivating me…

Being an Aspie I tend to both see and say things differently than most people… and it gets me into trouble sometime.

244 Killian Bundy  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:15:01pm

Specter has no principles or core values whatsoever, it’s all about him and his own self-preservation, he’s nothing more than a rank political opportunist and whore, who’ll turn tricks for whoever pays the most.

Watch Specter lie his ass off in a March 17th interview.

Specter condemned Jim Jeffords’ party switch in 2001

When the Vermont Republican became an independent, Specter lost a committee chairmanship in the Senate’s resulting power shift. An angry Specter proposed a ban on such party switches.

When a Senate Republican left his party in 2001, elevating the Democrats to majority status, one member of the GOP was especially vocal about his displeasure: Arlen Specter.

Specter said then- Vermont Sen. Jim Jeffords’ decision to become an independent was disruptive to the functioning of Congress. He proposed a rule forbidding party switches that had the effect of vaulting the minority to majority status in the middle of a congressional session.

“If somebody wants to change parties, they can do that,” Specter said at the time. “But that kind of instability is not good for governance of the country and the Senate.”

Now it is Specter switching parties, proclaiming himself a Democrat. While the move won’t throw one party out of power, it could potentially hand the Democrats a 60-vote majority and deprive the GOP of the ability to block legislation through a filibuster.

Eight years ago, Jeffords’ decision cost Specter his chairmanship of the Veterans Affairs Committee. Specter said at the time that he wanted the rule change to prevent a party switch that could decisively swing the balance of power in the Senate overnight, disrupting U.S. domestic and foreign policy.

He also said that Jeffords’ move would put Senate staff members out of work as committee chairmanships changed hands, and that he had already seen “a lot of crying” among staff members worried about their future.

And hey, looky here, this isn’t even the first time Specter’s sold out for political expediency.

/Arlen Specter, not fit for a toilet seat, let alone a Senate seat

245 Sharmuta  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:15:34pm

I have been to Neenah. It’s a nice town that really doesn’t need to be besmirched by a ronpaul! visit.

Additionally- Neenah has one of the largest foundries in the country. Next time you think to look at a man-hole cover or sewer grate, look to see if there is a name on it. Likely it will be Neenah.

246 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:15:36pm

re: #239 Gearhead

S.P.E.C.T.R.E.’s plans always backfire in the end. It just takes patience and determination - and lots of martinis.

247 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:15:44pm

re: #241 ArmyWife

Protecting a citizen scared the crap out of you, but the President dictating who can and cannot be a CEO of a private company is no big deal? Interesting.

(for the record, I have issues with some of the Terri Schiavo case, but I’d bet they are different than yours).

it’s just simple blind hypocricy…there is no explaining it

248 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:15:57pm

re: #222 VioletTiger

avanti, people like Specter are not really conservative—anybody who voted for the porkulus bill or the spendulus budget are not really conservatives or moderates. He didn’t leave the party because it was leaning too far right. He let because there was no way he could win the primary. He is saving his ass, that’s all.

OK, assume a hypothetical. Would it not be possible for a conservative to vote for the stimulus if he/she truly believed not doing so would cause more harm in the long run ?

I agree he left the party for the reasons stated, and the fact that the GOP had abandoned him.

249 Bubbaman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:16:13pm

re: #212 rawmuse

There is also a Third Way called “The Third Way”

Yup! That’s the healthy tension that used to exist since the early days of the Republic and until recently it kept us on track. Now we have runaway socialism.

On a positive note, the Caps won! Up next, either the Pens or Devils.

250 yesandno  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:16:23pm

re: #237 Gus 802

Yep. Since he did this in 1965 I think this qualifies him as an a-hole. ;)

That was exactly the term I was thinking of!

251 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:16:29pm

re: #228 avanti

Oh, for heaven’s sake.

You’re a freakin’ idiot. I’ve long suspected it, but that makes it absolutely clear.

252 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:16:33pm

entryism…. I was thinking that meant something else…. and was gonna sign right up…. but….

253 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:16:38pm

re: #235 Dianna

I went to Texas A&M. What do you want from me? ;)

254 researchok  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:16:58pm

re: #236 Charles

A discussion of “Entryism” merits a front page post.

255 brookly red  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:17:05pm

re: #245 Sharmuta

I have been to Neenah. It’s a nice town that really doesn’t need to be besmirched by a ronpaul! visit.

Additionally- Neenah has one of the largest foundries in the country. Next time you think to look at a man-hole cover or sewer grate, look to see if there is a name on it. Likely it will be Neenah.

in NYC they all say “India” :(

256 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:17:10pm

re: #248 avanti

OK, assume a hypothetical. Would it not be possible for a conservative to vote for the stimulus if he/she truly believed not doing so would cause more harm in the long run ?

I agree he left the party for the reasons stated, and the fact that the GOP had abandoned him.

no

257 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:17:27pm

re: #253 ArmyWife

gig ‘em

‘81

258 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:18:24pm

re: #230 Zimriel

I’m sorry, but that’s balderdash. America in the 1780s took the measure of the Marxists of their day - the Jacobins in France - and drew up a Constitution expressly designed to stop anything like Marxism from taking hold here. As for the libertarians, granted this Constitution wasn’t as libertarian as the Articles of Confederation, but the framers still attempted to give a latitude for human freedom as wide as possible given the constraints of (for instance) the South.

No, no, no.

And no, yet again.

Zim, what year is the French Revolution? Don’t strain your memory, just google it.

259 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:18:26pm

re: #248 avanti

He never was a member of the GOP, there was no abandoning here.

260 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:18:44pm

re: #253 ArmyWife

I went to Texas A&M. What do you want from me? ;)

your quarterback!….Dallas drafted him…McGee

261 Drogheda  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:19:00pm

re: #236 Charles

And this is how extremist groups like the John Birch Society find their back to respectability — by exploiting seemingly reasonable points to convince people who don’t know much about them. It’s a strategy that has a name: “entryism.”

Here’s an article at Newsweek about how extremists are trying to mainstream themselves: Rebranding Hate in the Age of Obama.

262 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:19:10pm

re: #250 yesandno

That was exactly the term I was thinking of!

I had a moment of clarity. It never ceases to amaze me at how the public re-elects these people over and over again — all of them. It’s not unlike we have Senators and Congressmen for “life” terms and that’s usually the fault of the electorate.

263 jcm  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:19:22pm

re: #248 avanti

OK, assume a hypothetical. Would it not be possible for a conservative to vote for the stimulus if he/she truly believed not doing so would cause more harm in the long run ?

I agree he left the party for the reasons stated, and the fact that the GOP had abandoned him.

No, porkulus was patently a spread the wealth, mortgage the future, expand government, big spending package.

No conservatives voted for it. RINOs yes, conservatives no.

264 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:19:41pm

re: #253 ArmyWife

I went to Texas A&M. What do you want from me? ;)

It won’t take long; this was a blog comment, not a thought-out political resolution.

Aren’t Aggies supposed to be tenacious?

265 Aviator  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:19:47pm

re: #248 avanti

OK, assume a hypothetical. Would it not be possible for a conservative to vote for the stimulus if he/she truly believed not doing so would cause more harm in the long run ?

I agree he left the party for the reasons stated, and the fact that the GOP had abandoned him.

Oh for God’s sake. Do you get the whirlies when you think?

266 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:19:49pm

re: #258 Dianna

No, no, no.

And no, yet again.

Zim, what year is the French Revolution? Don’t strain your memory, just google it.

You’re right; the French Revolution was 1790. The Constitutional debates took place the prior decade. Dammit I knew that. *kicks self*

267 solomonpanting  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:20:02pm

re: #244 Killian Bundy


/Arlen Specter, not fit for a toilet seat, let alone a Senate seat

Since he switched decades ago, I guess you can say he’s a head of his time.

268 Opilio  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:20:59pm

re: #262 Gus 802

I had a moment of clarity. It never ceases to amaze me at how the public re-elects these people over and over again — all of them. It’s not unlike we have Senators and Congressmen for “life” terms and that’s usually the fault of the electorate.

Usually?

It’s always the fault of the sheeple electorate.

269 rawmuse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:21:16pm

To some, “hate speech” and ordinary political opposition are indistinguishable.

270 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:21:49pm

re: #264 Dianna

It won’t take long; this was a blog comment, not a thought-out political resolution.

Aren’t Aggies supposed to be tenacious?

Damned straight.

Aggies don’t know the meaning of “quit”. Aggies don’t know the meaning of “surrender”. They don’t know the meaning of “failure”.

/they don’t know the meaning of a LOT of words. ;)

271 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:21:51pm

re: #260 albusteve

ummm..good? I guess?

272 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:22:38pm

rawmuse, thanks for your vote of support, but Dianna was right, my #230 should have been DOWN dinged.

273 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:22:46pm

re: #270 OldLineTexan

Time to break out my tired, but relevant Aggie joke AGAIN:

What do you call and Aggie 5 years after graduation?


Boss.

274 countrygurl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:23:02pm

I’m not a very political person but I consider myself a conservative. I used to be a democrat until Ronald Reagan came along and “reasoned” with me! It seems to me that many people who are NOT conservatives call people like me “right wing extremists” in order to embarrass us into silence. Being a liberal today is like being hip, like being in the “in” crowd and the rest of us are like the dorks in the high school cafeteria. I am beginning to despair that the liberal tide can be deterred because, for one thing, conservatives lack leadership. Where is Ronald Reagan when we need him? Who will take his place?

275 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:23:16pm

re: #268 Opilio

Usually?

It’s always the fault of the sheeple electorate.

Right. I have to watch my passive words like usually.

276 Sharmuta  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:23:33pm

re: #155 Conservative Moonbat

Upding for the BBA.

277 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:23:34pm

re: #271 ArmyWife

ummm..good? I guess?

he has a decent job for a college grad…several 100k a year for a while

278 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:23:52pm

re: #241 ArmyWife

Protecting a citizen scared the crap out of you, but the President dictating who can and cannot be a CEO of a private company is no big deal? Interesting.

(for the record, I have issues with some of the Terri Schiavo case, but I’d bet they are different than yours).

I fear radical cures for a failed economy less then the government getting in my personal life. I did not see it as protecting a citizen, I saw it as the worst case of government interference in the most private decisions a married couple could make. My wife and I were motivated to write down our wishes rather then have the government get involved in our decision after that debacle.

279 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:24:37pm

re: #273 ArmyWife

Time to break out my tired, but relevant Aggie joke AGAIN:

What do you call and Aggie 5 years after graduation?


Boss.

That’s why it’s a JOKE, dear.

Think of a four-letter word starting with “R”.

;)

280 Bubbaman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:24:42pm

re: #230 Zimriel

I’m sorry, but that’s balderdash. America in the 1780s took the measure of the Marxists of their day - the Jacobins in France - and drew up a Constitution expressly designed to stop anything like Marxism from taking hold here. As for the libertarians, granted this Constitution wasn’t as libertarian as the Articles of Confederation, but the framers still attempted to give a latitude for human freedom as wide as possible given the constraints of (for instance) the South.

Please provide some valid references as this is a rather audacious perspective that runs counter to classical writings and teachings. To think that the framers were primarily concerned with the infiltration of collectivism is, a bit twisted.

281 TheMatrix31  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:25:27pm

re: #278 avanti

I fear radical cures for a failed economy less then the government getting in my personal life. I did not see it as protecting a citizen, I saw it as the worst case of government interference in the most private decisions a married couple could make. My wife and I were motivated to write down our wishes rather then have the government get involved in our decision after that debacle.

If the government can dictate who’s the CEO of a company, who the hell is to say they won’t come into your workplace and start shifting positions and salaries?

282 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:25:32pm

re: #266 Zimriel

You’re right; the French Revolution was 1790. The Constitutional debates took place the prior decade. Dammit I knew that. *kicks self*

1789, to give a proper starting date.

Now, in what year was the Constitution ratified? (1787 - remember your schoolhouse rock!).

283 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:25:59pm

what do you call an Aggie 25 years after graduation?

284 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:26:24pm

re: #283 WindHorse

(three letter starting with “O”)

285 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:26:32pm

re: #267 solomonpanting

Since he switched decades ago, I guess you can say he’s a head of his time.

Winston Churchill not only ratted, but re-ratted.

Make of it what you will.

286 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:26:46pm

re: #278 avanti

I fear radical cures for a failed economy less then the government getting in my personal life. I did not see it as protecting a citizen, I saw it as the worst case of government interference in the most private decisions a married couple could make. My wife and I were motivated to write down our wishes rather then have the government get involved in our decision after that debacle.

really?….the feds are rapidly moving deep into your life….you are rapidly becoming irrelevant….you are a stooge

287 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:26:48pm

re: #284 WindHorse

(three letter starting with “O”)

Old? Me, too.

288 countrygurl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:27:43pm

re: #281 TheMatrix31

If the government can dictate who’s the CEO of a company, who the hell is to say they won’t come into your workplace and start shifting positions and salaries?


I think that’s why they want labor unions in every workplace.

289 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:27:52pm

re: #281 TheMatrix31

If the government can dictate who’s the CEO of a company, who the hell is to say they won’t come into your workplace and start shifting positions and salaries?

Your profits belong to us!

//

290 Killian Bundy  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:28:03pm

re: #283 WindHorse

what do you call an Aggie 25 years after graduation?

/saggy?

291 Bubbaman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:28:08pm

re: #286 albusteve

Yes, I am surprised how many Paulians are out tonight!

292 Opilio  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:28:08pm

re: #286 albusteve

really?….the feds are rapidly moving deep into your life….you are rapidly becoming irrelevant….you are a stooge

Nyuk, nyuk, nyuk…

293 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:28:34pm

encore…musical perfection


294 TheMatrix31  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:28:49pm

re: #288 countrygurl

I think that’s why they want labor unions in every workplace.

Well good thing groups like the UAW don’t own more than half of major American companies yet!

….oh, wait.

295 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:28:54pm

re: #290 Killian Bundy

(make me wanna holler - throw up both my hands…)

296 VioletTiger  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:29:17pm

re: #248 avanti

OK, assume a hypothetical. Would it not be possible for a conservative to vote for the stimulus if he/she truly believed not doing so would cause more harm in the long run ?

I agree he left the party for the reasons stated, and the fact that the GOP had abandoned him.


You’ve answered your own question. Believing that the crazy spending spree would actual be a benefit is a liberal view.

297 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:29:27pm

re: #291 Bubbaman

Yes, I am surprised how many Paulians are out tonight!

The Paulians tonight
Are not that bright
/clap clap clap clap
Deep in the Lizard Nexus

/

298 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:29:30pm

re: #251 Dianna

Oh, for heaven’s sake.

You’re a freakin’ idiot. I’ve long suspected it, but that makes it absolutely clear.

I would never label you a idiot for your opinion. For me, government involvement in my marriage or personal life concerns me. If I ended up brain dead, I’d trust my wife and my doctors, not some politicians to let my empty body go.

299 Last Mohican  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:29:32pm

re: #261 Drogheda

Here’s an article at Newsweek about how extremists are trying to mainstream themselves: Rebranding Hate in the Age of Obama.

I got through the first page of that. It is certainly very disturbing.

Can someone tell me whether or not this discussion of “rebranding hate in the age of Obama” ever gets around to mentioning the fact that we elected a president who spent decades as a member of a racist hate group, right up until the middle of the election? And that, in the process, he succeeded in rebranding its leader’s hateful rhetoric as a supposedly inescapable part of the thinking of all black people in America?

I don’t mean to equate TUCC’s or NOI’s racism with the racism of the KKK, or to imply any sort of moral equivalence.

300 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:29:34pm

re: #278 avanti

Excellent choice. That said, don’t mistake the husband as some devoted Saint, however. He spent trust money to be used for the care of Terri on his new girlfriend. He was living with the girl friend. That is my issue - the parents were the care takers, NOT the husband.

301 Velvet Elvis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:30:15pm

re: #220 JacksonTn

CM … really where were they on the bailout? … the dem in my district voted for it … and he is suppose to be blue dog … this is why I am no longer a democrat … I called his office every single day during the primaries to see exactly where he stood on Obama … he showed me by not voting at all as a super delegate … f*cking liars …

Would that be Lincoln Davis? TN-04? He’s pretty worthless alright. I’m in Nashville and have got Cooper. He flip-flopped on that damn thing so many times I have no idea how he finally voted. Considering how much he spoke out against it he probably voted for it. Nashville’s a lot bluer than TN-04 though so he might have had considerable constituent pressure.

In general he’s OK. He’s a deficit hawk, pretty strong on defense OK on guns but still pro choice and stuff.

302 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:30:18pm

re: #290 Killian Bundy

that’s not funny.

;)

303 Aviator  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:30:32pm

re: #298 avanti

I would never label you a idiot for your opinion. For me, government involvement in my marriage or personal life concerns me. If I ended up brain dead, I’d trust my wife and my doctors, not some politicians to let my empty body go.

Time to pull the plug.

304 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:30:39pm

re: #278 avanti

You have now put yourself in the “too stupid to be believed” category.

I’m sorry, but I’m done. I cannot believe what you just typed. It’s a combination of obtuse (failed economy) and irrelevant and clueless.

About the only good thing is that you wrote down your wishes.

305 Bubbaman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:31:18pm

Goodnight all, I have to go polish my tinfoil hat and scan the room for bugs.

306 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:31:43pm

re: #280 Bubbaman

He’s been thwacked.

307 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:31:58pm

re: #294 TheMatrix31

Well good thing groups like the UAW don’t own more than half of major American companies yet!

….oh, wait.

AFSCME already “owns” half of the Federal and state governments.

308 albusteve  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:32:02pm

re: #298 avanti

I would never label you a idiot for your opinion. For me, government involvement in my marriage or personal life concerns me. If I ended up brain dead, I’d trust my wife and my doctors, not some politicians to let my empty body go.

for you reality is fantasy….a drooler with an excuse for everything liberal….you are gonna get fucked big time just like the rest of us

309 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:32:13pm

re: #301 Conservative Moonbat

Would that be Lincoln Davis? TN-04? He’s pretty worthless alright. I’m in Nashville and have got Cooper. He flip-flopped on that damn thing so many times I have no idea how he finally voted. Considering how much he spoke out against it he probably voted for it. Nashville’s a lot bluer than TN-04 though so he might have had considerable constituent pressure.

In general he’s OK. He’s a deficit hawk, pretty strong on defense OK on guns but still pro choice and stuff.

CM … they are all worthless … and if he runs for gov … I will actively campaign against him … Nashville is Obama city at least the inner city … makes me sick … and I know you voted for him …

310 formercorpsman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:32:13pm

re: #241 ArmyWife

It blows my mind.

311 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:32:57pm

re: #280 Bubbaman

Please provide some valid references as this is a rather audacious perspective that runs counter to classical writings and teachings. To think that the framers were primarily concerned with the infiltration of collectivism is, a bit twisted.

I do find in the famously anti-democratic Federalist #10, that “paper money”, “an abolition of debts”, and “an equal division of property” are listed as “improper or wicked project[s]”. In particular that last one reads like a collectivist urge.

312 solomonpanting  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:33:03pm

re: #285 Dianna

Winston Churchill not only ratted, but re-ratted.

Make of it what you will.

Forgive me. I don’t follow.
:[

313 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:33:04pm

re: #281 TheMatrix31

If the government can dictate who’s the CEO of a company, who the hell is to say they won’t come into your workplace and start shifting positions and salaries?

Or deciding that he needs to be put down?

Or deciding that he has too many cars?

Idiot!

314 Killian Bundy  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:33:43pm

Check out Drudge.

A picture of Napolitano with a link underneath to a story labeled DON’T CALL IT ‘SWINE’!

/heh

315 formercorpsman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:33:57pm

re: #248 avanti

Avanti, please explain how the GOP abandoned him.

Do it.

316 rawmuse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:33:58pm

As one of my Commie pals quipped
“Bush came in as a social conservative, and went out as a conservative socialist”

317 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:34:20pm

re: #312 solomonpanting

Forgive me. I don’t follow.
:[

Sorry - Winston Churchill started out as a Tory, became a Liberal (I believe - this was over 20 years ago that I studied this), then reverted to Tory.

He said once that he had not only “ratted” (changed parties), but “re-ratted.”

318 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:34:26pm

re: #293 albusteve

albusteve … love it … again …

319 Vicious Babushka  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:34:26pm

re: #278 avanti

I fear radical cures for a failed economy less then the government getting in my personal life. I did not see it as protecting a citizen, I saw it as the worst case of government interference in the most private decisions a married couple could make. My wife and I were motivated to write down our wishes rather then have the government get involved in our decision after that debacle.

Oh really? You fear the government not allowing you to kill yourself? Don’t worry, the government will be far up your ass that THEY will decide when (not if) you should kill yourself, to avoid becoming a burden on society.

320 itellu3times  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:34:35pm

born February 12, 1930
‘nuff said

321 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:35:20pm

re: #313 Dianna

Or your toilet uses too much water in the flushing process!

322 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:36:04pm

re: #321 ArmyWife

Or your toilet uses too much water in the flushing process!

Ooh, too late on that one.

But nevermind that; I’m here to check your lightbulbs.

/

323 rawmuse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:36:10pm

re: #321 ArmyWife

Or your toilet uses too much water in the flushing process!

Don’t forget the banning of incandescent bulbs.

324 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:36:35pm

re: #321 ArmyWife

Or your toilet uses too much water in the flushing process!

House is too cool in the summer and too warm in winter…

Utility surcharges.

325 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:36:46pm

re: #323 rawmuse

HA!

326 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:36:57pm

re: #298 avanti

If you think that’s what the Shiavo case was about, you weren’t paying attention.

But to invite the government into the fundamental business of how you make your living (and please don’t pretend that’s not a few steps away and more possible than any sensible human being would like) is to surrender even more autonomy than you (delusionally) think was at stake in the Shiavo case.

327 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:37:00pm

re: #323 rawmuse

Don’t forget the banning of incandescent bulbs.

rawmuse … will there be a “Bulb Police” … not totally joking …

328 TheMatrix31  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:37:05pm

re: #291 Bubbaman

Yes, I am surprised how many Paulians are out tonight!

As Homer Simpson said in the episode “Homer v. New York”…..

“When the sun goes down, all the weirdos turn crazy!”

329 solomonpanting  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:37:33pm

re: #317 Dianna

Thanks. I didn’t know what to make of “ratted” in that context.

330 rawmuse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:38:34pm

re: #327 JacksonTn

rawmuse … will there be a “Bulb Police” … not totally joking …

Which sucks because I hate the light from the CF ones, which I have been using even before they were fashionable, since I am (being a conservative) impossibly cheap.

331 yesandno  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:38:56pm

re: #298 avanti

I would never label you a idiot for your opinion. For me, government involvement in my marriage or personal life concerns me. If I ended up brain dead, I’d trust my wife and my doctors, not some politicians to let my empty body go.

Now this really scares me. I thought you were just a high school student and here you are speaking about a wife and all. Now I am afraid you might already be having that problem about what to do when you are brain dead.

You cannot be in two places at once. You cannot be under the umbrella of a conservative and then speak about stimulus packages. These are opposite ends of the spectrum.

Better get to LegalZoom.com quickly and draw up those papers.

332 ArmyWife  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:38:59pm

The President just called. He said it was time for me to go to bed.

Good night, y’all!

333 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:39:19pm

re: #311 Zimriel

I do find in the famously anti-democratic Federalist #10, that “paper money”, “an abolition of debts”, and “an equal division of property” are listed as “improper or wicked project[s]”. In particular that last one reads like a collectivist urge.

That was a response to some Christian Utopians.

334 formercorpsman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:39:24pm

re: #298 avanti

The irony of your statement is that you fail to recognize the very people you wish to have a say, and the power are exactly the people your vote takes the power away from.

335 MrMisanthrope  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:39:42pm

re: #330 rawmuse

CFs are going away anyway. LEDs are rapidly approaching the usability point.

336 BatGuano  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:40:16pm

Wife: You love LGF more than me!
Me: That’s silly: I love you both the same!
Me:(sleeping alone).

337 MrMisanthrope  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:40:26pm

re: #335 MrMisanthrope
And don’t have the mercury issues…

338 itellu3times  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:40:47pm

re: #335 MrMisanthrope

CFs are going away anyway. LEDs are rapidly approaching the usability point.

Hope so. Given the stakes, I’m surprised how slowly they’re coming.

339 formercorpsman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:41:09pm

re: #336 BatGuano

My wife always asks me if I am talking to my girlfriends.

340 solomonpanting  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:41:38pm

re: #332 ArmyWife

The President just called. He said it was time for me to go to bed.

Good night, y’all!

The government is watching, listening. Watch out for bed bugs.

341 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:41:57pm

re: #335 MrMisanthrope

CFs are going away anyway. LEDs are rapidly approaching the usability point.

I hope so, because I passionately hate CF.

342 MrMisanthrope  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:42:24pm

re: #338 itellu3times

There’s some neat stuff in the trades now using LEDs in the place of LV Halogens for things like under-cabinet/decorative lighting.

343 Salamantis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:42:36pm

re: #286 albusteve

really?….the feds are rapidly moving deep into your life….you are rapidly becoming irrelevant….you are a stooge

Why the fuck should we have to choose between a party that sticks its snout into the boardroom and one that shoehorns itself into the bedroom?

I have major objections to BOTH of these.

344 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:42:59pm

all this talk of rats…. ugggh…. makes me think of my house… et al….

(who me? no… what are you thinking….? scratch-scratch….)


/I wanna move….

345 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:43:02pm

re: #343 Salamantis

Why the fuck should we have to choose between a party that sticks its snout into the boardroom and one that shoehorns itself into the bedroom?

I have major objections to BOTH of these.

You and me, both!

346 Killian Bundy  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:43:25pm

Biden: “Texas guys are ugly as hell…women are beautiful”

Speaking before a room full of Democratic donors, Biden declared: “You Texas guys are ugly as hell, but your women are beautiful. In southern Delaware, they would say y’all married up.”

/what a guy

347 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:43:48pm

re: #344 WindHorse

all this talk of rats…. ugggh…. makes me think of my house… et al….

(who me? no… what are you thinking….? scratch-scratch….)

/I wanna move….

Ugh, really?

I hate rats. Mice I can cope with, particularly if they’re fat, sleek fieldmice. That means that they’re outside.

348 Sharmuta  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:43:51pm

Buckley and Goldwater must be rolling in their graves.

349 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:43:59pm

re: #338 itellu3times

Hope so. Given the stakes, I’m surprised how slowly they’re coming.

It hasn’t been that long since white LEDs were available at all.
The cheap ones they use in flashlights aren’t the right color; they’re too blue.

350 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:44:10pm

re: #343 Salamantis

Why the fuck should we have to choose between a party that sticks its snout into the boardroom and one that shoehorns itself into the bedroom?

I have major objections to BOTH of these.

Sal … point me in that direction … I am on board for that party …

351 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:44:21pm

re: #343 Salamantis

wow….sticking snouts…. reminds me of two nights ago with the flashlight….

/damn beach houses

352 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:44:39pm

re: #343 Salamantis

Why the fuck should we have to choose between a party that sticks its snout into the boardroom and one that shoehorns itself into the bedroom?

I have major objections to BOTH of these.

Out of the boardroom and into the bed room.

Ralph Reed is back so it looks like they’re wanting to go back into the bed rooms.

353 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:44:51pm

re: #347 Dianna

totally sucky….. ready to move….

354 TheMatrix31  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:44:54pm

re: #346 Killian Bundy

Biden: “Texas guys are ugly as hell…women are beautiful”

/what a guy

They may be ugly, but they’ll blow your face off if you say that to their face.

355 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:44:54pm

re: #346 Killian Bundy

Biden: “Texas guys are ugly as hell…women are beautiful”


/what a guy

Well, I really ain’t as pretty as I used to be.

/

356 itellu3times  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:45:09pm

re: #341 Dianna

I hope so, because I passionately hate CF.

Why? I’ve been pleasantly surprised by them. Find a good brand, Home Depot seems to be a good source. I’ve tried a couple of cheapos from elsewhere, that failed quickly.

I’m a bit of a bulb freak, have tried a lot of different kinds over the years, halogens, “natural” incandescents, I have a bunch of LED flashlights of various specs. I see little need for incandescents anymore.

357 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:45:23pm

re: #350 JacksonTn

Sal … point me in that direction … I am on board for that party …

Supposedly, that’s the direction the Republicans were heading; they promised to respect believers, and not insult them, but the whole social conservative thing was to be kept within very strict limits.

Now? I’m not so sure.

358 Sharmuta  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:45:32pm

Then again- our Founding Fathers must be rolling in their graves too.

360 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:45:53pm

re: #352 Gus 802

Out of the boardroom and into the bed room.

Ralph Reed is back so it looks like they’re wanting to go back into the bed rooms.

If they peek into mine, they’re going to soooo wish they hadn’t.

361 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:45:56pm

Four hate mails so far tonight.

362 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:46:13pm

re: #333 Dianna

That was a response to some Christian Utopians.

I wouldn’t be at all surprised. There was a lot of collectivism in early Protestantism; the Hutterites in 1553 come to mind.

Of course I concede in advance that collectivism in a small community is fine, vis-a-vis the Constitution; where the Federalist #10 gets worried is whether a sect like the Hutterites, but more “pushy”, might engineer a takeover of the entire government.

363 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:46:15pm

re: #356 itellu3times

Why? I’ve been pleasantly surprised by them. Find a good brand, Home Depot seems to be a good source. I’ve tried a couple of cheapos from elsewhere, that failed quickly.

I’m a bit of a bulb freak, have tried a lot of different kinds over the years, halogens, “natural” incandescents, I have a bunch of LED flashlights of various specs. I see little need for incandescents anymore.

I’ve got some cheapos at Home Depot which are still cranking away. They have some nice temperatures available too. I like the colder temps for lighting.

364 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:46:17pm

thankfully….. my Jack Russell is on patrol 24/7….. so far no sign of the bastids IN the house….. just in the walls…….


crap.

365 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:46:52pm

re: #356 itellu3times

Really, the CFs all give me headaches. I don’t quite know why. I’m not real fond of halogen, but I can tolerate it.

366 Salamantis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:47:11pm

re: #300 ArmyWife

Excellent choice. That said, don’t mistake the husband as some devoted Saint, however. He spent trust money to be used for the care of Terri on his new girlfriend. He was living with the girl friend. That is my issue - the parents were the care takers, NOT the husband.

Actually, the medical facility was the functional caretaker. And the parents controlled trust money as long as Terri’s body remained tube-fed; it reverted to the husband in the event of her death. Thus the charge of financial conflict of interest could be equally made against BOTH parties.

367 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:47:40pm

Title: “Glenn Beck!”

And what has Glenn Beck ever done to YOU? All he wants to do is keep us
all thinking for ourselves. It’s ok to read Little Green Football but
don’t trust Glenn? The media is NOT doing the job anymore, so we the
people rely on other sources through internet.
You know very well that the government covers things up, so why
shouldn’t we be careful. You would be smart to listen, too.
It certainly can’t hurt.
Unless your the FAR LEFT now!

368 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:48:12pm

re: #364 WindHorse

thank God for Otis Redding….

369 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:48:55pm

Title: “Vlaams Belang’s Filip Dewinter and Markus Beisicht”

What in the hell are you doing, Charles? Have you gone off the deep end?
Why threaten Malkin, of all people? Robert Spencer and Pamela Geller
made a fool of you, and you brought it all on yourself. You remind us
more of Chomsky - and that is no compliment, I assure you.

370 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:48:56pm

re: #259 ArmyWife

He never was a member of the GOP, there was no abandoning here.

The GOP was going to run a hard right conservative in the primary against him and several PACS announced they’d run attack ad’s.

link

371 MrMisanthrope  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:48:58pm

re: #363 Gus 802
RE “colder temps”

Ditto. The Cheap Bluewhite would be fine for me. I don’t care for “warm yellow”

372 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:49:16pm

re: #366 Salamantis

I don’t think that’s true; the parents had no control over the money from the lawsuit that I’m aware of.

Feel free to bring up the “rabid Catholic” canard, too.

373 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:49:27pm

Title: “What is your problem?”

What the hell is your problem dude? You cover more whacked christians
than whacked muslims. Do ya have something againtst the belief in a
higher power? Your site has become a regurgitation spot, filled with
your sycophantic fans. Do ya stand for anything anymore? I think not. I
believe that the shit I’ve been hearing about you is right on. Your
nothing Charles, unless you stand for something. Welcome to the world of
the shit you hate dude. Have fun.

374 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:49:46pm

re: #370 avanti

The GOP was going to run a hard right conservative in the primary against him and several PACS announced they’d run attack ad’s.

link

Avanti … so? … he wasn’t man enough to take on the challenge? … he is not deserving of one single vote then …

375 Shug  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:49:59pm

re: #367 Charles

Title: “Glenn Beck!”

Hysteria Uber alles

376 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:50:09pm

And one more that’s a dramatic flounce-off.

377 TheMatrix31  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:50:23pm

Okay, question here:

I’ve cooled off Glenn Beck since he’s been exposed here on LGF, but is his Christmas book from last year still good to read? I bought it and didn’t get the chance to read it.

378 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:50:31pm

re: #371 MrMisanthrope

RE “colder temps”

Ditto. The Cheap Bluewhite would be fine for me. I don’t care for “warm yellow”

Yep. Always liked the colder temps even with incandescents. Brightens things up.

379 formercorpsman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:50:38pm

re: #343 Salamantis


Sal, I have a healthy respect for you, even when we don’t agree on all of the issues.

I will say this however, as someone who probably falls in the category of social/fiscal con, I know of nobody prying into the bedroom of anyone.

I am purely live and let live. I want nothing to do with what consenting adults do in their own privacy.

As with many politically charged issues, I think labels can be thrown around carelessly. I think it has become commonplace for folks who might take exception to the marriage issues of the day (this cross cuts numerous societal sectors) and have them labeled as wanting to control the private actions in one’s domicile, when in actuality, it does not rise up to that.

It minimizes the argument on both sides.

380 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:50:43pm

re: #376 Charles

Ugh.

381 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:51:02pm

re: #367 Charles

Title: “Glenn Beck!”

Fear the words of the mad prophet, K’ceb Nnelg! Iä!

382 MrMisanthrope  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:51:20pm

re: #365 Dianna

Really, the CFs all give me headaches. I don’t quite know why. I’m not real fond of halogen, but I can tolerate it.

Even the CFs, like all flourescents, have a “flicker rate” that some people are more or less sensitive to. It’s like how I can’t stand to be around CRTs. I was leaping for joy when LCD Desktop monitors came out.

383 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:51:37pm

re: #376 Charles

I don’t want to upding the hate mail.

Sorry you have to read that.

384 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:52:01pm

re: #373 Charles

Title: “What is your problem?”

There’s that word again: sycophant.

They must all come from the same school of thought — or is that non-thought?

385 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:52:11pm

re: #261 Drogheda

Here’s an article at Newsweek about how extremists are trying to mainstream themselves: Rebranding Hate in the Age of Obama.

Thanks for posting that.

386 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:52:55pm

re: #385 Killgore Trout

Thanks for posting that.

I’m going to post that article tomorrow, so I can get some more hate mail.

387 Velvet Elvis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:53:03pm

re: #309 JacksonTn

CM … they are all worthless … and if he runs for gov … I will actively campaign against him … Nashville is Obama city at least the inner city … makes me sick … and I know you voted for him …

Hopefully that would be enough to get Phil McGraw to give him a primary challenge. I’m really looking forward to McGraw getting off his ass and running for gov like he’s been talking about for years. Him vs Frist would be a particularly entertaining race.

388 Sharmuta  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:53:19pm

re: #369 Charles

Never mind it was spencer who dragged Michelle into it.

389 Shug  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:53:55pm

I wish you could post the info of the hate mailers.

Name em and shame em

390 itellu3times  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:54:15pm

re: #365 Dianna

Really, the CFs all give me headaches. I don’t quite know why. I’m not real fond of halogen, but I can tolerate it.

I’ve aways had a flicker problem with halogens. A well-designed CF will have very little flicker, I can’t see any on the ones I’m running.

I’d love to put you through a double-blind (!) test on these.

391 Salamantis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:54:27pm

re: #326 Dianna

If you think that’s what the Shiavo case was about, you weren’t paying attention.

But to invite the government into the fundamental business of how you make your living (and please don’t pretend that’s not a few steps away and more possible than any sensible human being would like) is to surrender even more autonomy than you (delusionally) think was at stake in the Shiavo case.

I was sure as hell paying attention to the Terry Schiavo case. It happened in my own home state.

She had been clinically brain dead, with an atrophied cerebral cortex, for many years. The decision that the husband made was the morally and medically correct one.

When Dubya’s far more socon little brother, Jeb, insinuated himself between a husband and wife in one of the most personal and private decisions that can be made in such a union, I winced for a week. You want your in laws’ parents to make that decision for your wife or husband instead of you? Do they get to decide how to raise the kids, too?

It was an utterly disgusting exercise in self-serving political grandstanding pandering. I rejoiced when the courts quite rightly ended the entire sordid affair, and with the proper decision.

392 countrygurl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:55:38pm

re: #390 itellu3timesdo

double-blind (!) test on these.

No pun pun intended

393 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:55:50pm

…I’ve got sunshine…. on a cloudy day…

/for Charles

394 MrMisanthrope  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:56:00pm

O/T- Web Geek Question (Charles?)

Howcome I can only find on PC that doesn’t bog down to molasses while on LGF… and it’s the slowest PC I have on the lamest WiFi connection?

I just don’t get it… all the machines are on the same OS & ISP…

Grrr…

395 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:56:04pm

re: #386 Charles

The ADL’s Mark Pitcavage says it is very difficult to track hate-group numbers because the organizations often splinter. What he tries to track is anger levels, and those, he warns, are rising—despite any superficial sweet talk: “The white-supremacist movement has been at red-hot anger levels for a long time. When I get concerned is when they get to white hot, where you see large bomb plots or talk about race wars. Right now we’re at very red hot, and are concerned we might reach white hot again.” He points to the MySpace account of “88Charles88” as an example of what he’s seeing (88 is code for “Heil, Hitler” in the white-power world). “Charles” attacks Obama and says, “Now it’s time to fight.” “There is a lot of anger out there,” says Pitcavage, “and these groups are trying to stoke it, to get someone like 88Charles88 to take the next step. What we’re seeing is not a softening, but a hardening of attitude.”


Get ready for another tedious Hitler video from Crazy Pam.

396 Sharmuta  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:56:07pm

Greta Van Susstren is also from Appleton.

397 realwest  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:56:07pm

Hey y’all - just thought I’d drop by and see what’s going on - so - what are we all talking about?

398 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:56:15pm

re: #388 Sharmuta

Never mind it was spencer who dragged Michelle into it.

Yep, and it was a fleeting comment no less which Charles corrected.

Of course the crazies have nothing better to do with their sad little lives. I’m sure they’re watching this in real time and posting it on their pathetic little web sites.

399 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:56:25pm

re: #374 JacksonTn

Avanti … so? … he wasn’t man enough to take on the challenge? … he is not deserving of one single vote then …

Given the choice of losing the primary because he’s not far enough right for the base, he jumped over to the left’s tent, simple as that.
The fact that is party beat him up at every opportunity made the jump the obvious choice.

400 realwest  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:56:43pm

re: #379 formercorpsman
Hey my friend - did y’all receive my e-mail?

401 Sharmuta  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:57:56pm

re: #377 TheMatrix31

Okay, question here:

I’ve cooled off Glenn Beck since he’s been exposed here on LGF, but is his Christmas book from last year still good to read? I bought it and didn’t get the chance to read it.

Exchange it for some real conservative reading, like Conscience of a Conservative.

402 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:58:09pm

re: #399 avanti

Given the choice of losing the primary because he’s not far enough right for the base, he jumped over to the left’s tent, simple as that.
The fact that is party beat him up at every opportunity made the jump the obvious choice.

Translation: He could see the writing on the wall, his chickens were coming home to ROOST, and he wanted to keep his phoney-baloney job.

403 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:58:12pm

re: #391 Salamantis

I’m not going into this, beyond this: I’m not a doctor. I had no idea what her mental condition was, and wasn’t qualified to comment.

However, I have problems with cruelty. And her death was cruel.

Beyond that, I will not argue.

As to the husband, the parents, the courts and politicians? No real comment on any of them. Everyone did what they thought they should, for their own reasons.

404 BatGuano  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:58:38pm

re: #393 WindHorse

…I’ve got sunshine…. on a cloudy day…

/for Charles

Charles is…your girl?

405 formercorpsman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:58:53pm

re: #400 realwest

I certainly did R.

I have been mad busy at work, (it seems like every other person is a knee injection) and then baseball most every night of the week.

Have you made any moves on what you were concerned about?

406 OldLineTexan  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:59:00pm

re: #401 Sharmuta

Exchange it for some real conservative reading, like Conscience of a Conservative.

Or Newsweek. Always my fave at the dentist’s office, unless Texas Monthly is particularly snarky.

407 rawmuse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:59:08pm

re: #403 Dianna

Starvation, slow and painful. Not humane. We treat dogs better.

408 Shug  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:59:18pm

re: #397 realwest

Hey y’all - just thought I’d drop by and see what’s going on - so - what are we all talking about?

thanks for the paypal info last night

409 Drogheda  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 8:59:37pm

re: #385 Killgore Trout

Thanks for posting that.

You’re welcome. Seemed to fit with Charles’ mention of “Entryism”.

I forgot to mention the bit on the third page, just after the article where they say “Because of high volume, comments have been disabled.”

There were some comments on the article when I first read it. By the time I read the two pages of the comments and went to go to the third page of comments the comments disappeared. It had started turning into a cesspool.

410 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:00:42pm

re: #407 rawmuse

Starvation, slow and painful. Not humane. We treat dogs better.

That’s what I thought.

I hate that sort of case. Just hate it.

411 Shug  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:00:56pm

re: #399 avanti

Given the choice of losing the primary because he’s not far enough right for the base, he jumped over to the left’s tent, simple as that.
The fact that is party beat him up at every opportunity made the jump the obvious choice.


the party beat him up?

That dickhead spit on his party for decades.

412 wiffersnapper  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:01:13pm

Send the old senile republicans out to pasture (McCain, Paul, Specter).

413 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:02:17pm

re: #404 BatGuano

no…..

-was only meant as a “positive vibe” thing….. (maybe you ain’t heeeard of it… Guano dude)

:)

414 realwest  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:02:25pm

re: #405 formercorpsman
Nope not yet - back hasn’t been hurting much - and none at all yesterday or today and frankly I’m staying away from doctor’s offices (unless I feel I need to see one, of course) while the swine flu thing is going around.
Story in today’s Charlotte Observer (think NYT wannabe Southern Edition) said that one confirmed case of swine flu in my county and four more suspected today.
I was mostly hoping y’all could give me a better e-mail addy to reach you with to discuss any recommendations I may get.

415 MrMisanthrope  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:02:54pm

re: #412 wiffersnapper

Send the old senile republicans out to pasture (McCain, Paul, Specter).


Forget “Republicans”… send ANYONE who’se been in office more than 16 years out to pasture… preferably one laden with what they have been spewing their entire tenure…

416 Alberta Oil Peon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:03:16pm

re: #390 itellu3times

I’ve aways had a flicker problem with halogens. A well-designed CF will have very little flicker, I can’t see any on the ones I’m running.

I’d love to put you through a double-blind (!) test on these.

Halogens are just a specialized type of incandescent bulb, so they should have no flicker. And CFs have a “ballast” which is basically a switching power supply that runs at a few kHz, so the flicker rate should betoo fast to be perceptible. But possibly cheap ones could flicker at 60 Hz, or at the beat rate between 60 Hz and their internal time base.

417 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:03:19pm

re: #404 BatGuano

prevert….

418 Randall Gross  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:03:40pm

re: #386 Charles

If you are going to do that, you might want to take a fresh look at these:

[Link: www.splcenter.org…]

Hate the source, but they happen to be right in some of this:

[Link: theboard.blogs.nytimes.com…]

[Link: theboard.blogs.nytimes.com…]

These are from back in Feb, but these groups are what we have to watch out for in the Republican party.

419 Shug  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:03:45pm

re: #412 wiffersnapper

Send the old senile republicans out to pasture (McCain, Paul, Specter).

When they send Byrd to pasture, then we negotiate everybody else

420 jaunte  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:04:20pm

Here’s to email, The Good, the Bad and the Ugly.


Goodnight all.
421 yesandno  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:04:38pm

re: #399 avanti

Given the choice of losing the primary because he’s not far enough right for the base, he jumped over to the left’s tent, simple as that.
The fact that is party beat him up at every opportunity made the jump the obvious choice.

Um….he left the party long before the party left him….he thinks this will get him a win…it won’t. The PEOPLE don’t want Specter. Did you forget how Pres. Bush supported him in his last election? How the party surrounded him and fought off the Dem challenger? It wasn’t the party that left him….no HE turned his back on those that helped get him elected.

I think the People will vote him out.

422 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:04:52pm

re: #416 Alberta Oil Peon

I like your facts, but the simple fact is that CFs give me violent headaches. I’ll happily participate in a double-blind study.

423 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:05:01pm

re: #409 Drogheda


I forgot to mention the bit on the third page, just after the article where they say “Because of high volume, comments have been disabled.”

There were some comments on the article when I first read it. By the time I read the two pages of the comments and went to go to the third page of comments the comments disappeared. It had started turning into a cesspool.


I noticed that too. There’s a lot of crazy around these days.

424 TheMatrix31  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:05:12pm

re: #401 Sharmuta

Exchange it for some real conservative reading, like Conscience of a Conservative.

It was a actual story though, not his opinions.

But I’ll check out that book too.

425 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:05:27pm

re: #412 wiffersnapper

Send the old senile republicans out to pasture (McCain, Paul, Specter).

Rush suggested today that McCain should follow Specter, I get the feeling the Democrats will accept all the “unpure” Republicans they can get.

426 Silvergirl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:05:43pm

re: #377 TheMatrix31

Okay, question here:

I’ve cooled off Glenn Beck since he’s been exposed here on LGF, but is his Christmas book from last year still good to read? I bought it and didn’t get the chance to read it.

I read it. It’s fast. It’s not great, but if you have it and feel like reading it, do. You’re talking about The Christmas Sweater, right?

427 JCM  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:06:01pm

re: #397 realwest

Hey y’all - just thought I’d drop by and see what’s going on - so - what are we all talking about?

Hey Real!

Charles’ hate mail.

Dramatic flounce offs, why do I picture them in a tutu when they do that?

And I’m playing with pictures.

428 MrMisanthrope  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:06:17pm

re: #425 avanti

Rush suggested today that McCain should follow Specter, I get the feeling the Democrats will accept all the “unpure” Republicans they can get.


Well, that should make the Repub primaries easier…

429 formercorpsman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:06:18pm

re: #391 Salamantis

Sal, I will only comment on one angle of this case (also because I think Charles prefers this topic elsewhere) but as someone in medicine, and having now had the luxury of the drug abusing, non-compliant lunatic, working under the table but having the tax-payers pick up her medical expenses try unsuccessfully to sue me, one aspect of the case has always rubbed me the wrong way.

Michael sued their doctor for negligence, and malpractice. He won, and memory serves me, the award was determined in relation to the lifelong care she would require as a result of this medical error.

In the autopsy, it was verified her cerebral vascular incident was not due to the original supposition, and subsequently what led to the court ruling.

Would the physician be considered not guilty of malpractice now?

430 Shug  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:06:25pm

61 liberal senate votes.


This country is fucked

431 Gus  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:06:30pm

re: #412 wiffersnapper

Send the old senile republicans out to pasture (McCain, Paul, Specter).

Who would they replace McCain with? Chris Simcox?

U.S. Senate Hopeful Chris Simcox, aka, “The Little Prince,” His Criminal Record, and the Other Baggage He Brings with Him

432 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:07:21pm

re: #421 yesandno


I think the People will vote him out.

Specters polling show he’ll pick up enough of the new Democratic voters to win, but we’ll see.

433 Randall Gross  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:07:43pm

re: #425 avanti

Rush suggested today that McCain should follow Specter, I get the feeling the Democrats will accept all the “unpure” Republicans they can get.

A sure formula for the Republicans to go from “Minority Party” to “Irrelevant Party” is to witch hunt out the Republican moderates. If we don’t have people who can win in populous states, we will become irrelevant to American politics.

434 realwest  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:07:47pm

re: #408 Shug Hi Shug, I was glad to do it!
And as Dustyvet commented out here this morning, he’s gonna be able to go and if there’s any money left over use it to help with his sister’s funeral costs.
But honestly Walter L. Newton did the posting and I suspect the heavy lifting with the e-mails! I just started e-mailing away until I thought: “hmm why not just ask folks who may want to help to e-mail ME”!
In any event,( and in spite of the freakin’ ankle biters who always seem to be chewing on Charle’s ankles), the LGF community came through again!

435 formercorpsman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:07:53pm

re: #414 realwest

Yes, no need for you to gamble.

Immunosuppression.

436 TheMatrix31  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:08:26pm

re: #426 Silvergirl

I read it. It’s fast. It’s not great, but if you have it and feel like reading it, do. You’re talking about The Christmas Sweater, right?

Yes ma’am.

437 Salamantis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:09:04pm

re: #403 Dianna

I’m not going into this, beyond this: I’m not a doctor. I had no idea what her mental condition was, and wasn’t qualified to comment.

However, I have problems with cruelty. And her death was cruel.

Beyond that, I will not argue.

As to the husband, the parents, the courts and politicians? No real comment on any of them. Everyone did what they thought they should, for their own reasons.

Charles has several times posted links to MRIs of Terri Schiavo’s shriveled and nonfunctional brain.

And I hail from a family of nurses. They have a name for tube feeding, just like they call helmetless motorcycle riders ‘organ donors.’; they call being tube-fed ‘the Living Death’, and they all have provisions written into their living wills against it, as do I. After years of such feeding with nonresponsive patients, medical personnel tend to get lax about caring for the tube site; a long time tube feeding patient was recently found to have maggots infesting the stomach, from where flies had laid eggs on the site.

Of course, it was not cruel to tube-feed the irretrivably brain dead Terri Schiavo, as she was forever beyond all caring; it was just profane and ghoulish. And ending that tube feeding wasn’t cruel either; but it WAS at least an end to a situation that had done her no good for a long, long time (nothing could do her good any longer), but had caused major distress to both her parents and her husband. And in that sense it was a blessed relief.

438 formercorpsman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:09:44pm

re: #425 avanti

Avanti, I asked you a fair question.

Perhaps you might have missed it.

I am genuinely curious as to why you think the Republicans abandoned him?

What examples do you cite?

439 Zimriel  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:09:48pm

re: #261 Drogheda

Here’s an article at Newsweek about how extremists are trying to mainstream themselves: Rebranding Hate in the Age of Obama.

I’m leafing through it now. A few observations -

“Winston Smith, a host of the white-supremacist radio show “The Political Cesspool” in Millington, Tenn., says, “The emphasis is different now. We don’t talk as much about what blacks have done to us; we’re more focused on ourselves and our own culture.”“

Note the “we” - “The Political Cesspool” is still overtly white nationalist.

Also, relevant to this thread, the people organising the white nationalist meetings aren’t advocating violence directly - but they operate forums where violence is espoused by the regulars. And I’ll bet the people who are the best at winking and nodding at “direct action” are treated as honoured guests by the moderators.

440 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:09:57pm

re: #430 Shug

nahhh…. I don’t buy it…. this system… this republic…. this way of life… is to coveted by TOO many…… the chips are down… we are all enduring…. we will walk out of this…. we will all feel the need for a shower…. companies (big three - RIP) will disappear… others too…

we are free…… we will never die.

hang in there.

441 rawmuse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:10:27pm

I must go for the night, but before I do, these words.

Passing the “stimulus” and TARP package(s) are extreme measures, and were admittedly so even by their proponents. They will guarantee that generations yet unborn will pay for our problems of today. They spend money that has not yet even been printed.

It is the very definition of executive malfeasance, yet we tiptoe around that.

In the twinkling of an eye, the American birthright of Freedom has been traded for Serfdom.

But, here is the problem with that.

Serfs rise up and defy the yoke. They always have. They always will.

Goodnight.

442 Alberta Oil Peon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:10:41pm

re: #422 Dianna

I like your facts, but the simple fact is that CFs give me violent headaches. I’ll happily participate in a double-blind study.

Well, the one in the ceiling fixture in my bathroom emits a high-pitched whine, kind of like a gnat. My hearing in the upper ranges is none too good, so I rarely hear it, unless the house is very quiet when I flip it on.

But the headaches could be a reaction to sound, not visual flicker. I’d suggest trying different brands or styles of CF lamps. They do seem to be constantly improving them.

443 countrygurl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:10:43pm

re: #430 Shug

depressing, isn’t it.

444 Bob Dillon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:10:57pm

re: #430 Shug

61 liberal senate votes.

This country is fucked

Buck up Shug - it’s gonna be rough for a while however the good guys and gals have just begun to fight. (the flight over NYC just may have woken a sleeping giant)

445 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:11:33pm

re: #418 Thanos

Some familiar names there. I haven’t checked VDare in ages. At the very top of their webpage…..

Thoughts On The Sacramento Tea Party—Immigration Dimension Must Be Added!

By Brenda Walker

446 realwest  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:12:00pm

re: #427 JCM Hey JCM - great pictures/video whatever! Hope you’re doing well tonight?
And what about Charles Hate mail - I assume he’s still getting it for (mostly) going after the fucking fascists?

447 Timbre  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:12:03pm

Good thread, Charles. The Birchers are dangerous—kooks and powerful. The Midland, Texas area has a strong affiliation with the JBS:

Upcoming meeting at Midland Petroleum Club.

Meetup info

Midland professional a member of the National council:

“Mr. Britton is a lifetime member of The John Birch Society and currently serves as Chairman of the Midland Business and Professional Chapter in Midland, Texas.”


I will never get over their libel and slander of General and President Dwight David Eisenhower. President Eisenhower was a greater American than all Birchers put together! I apologize for the links, Charles, but I don’t want people to think I am making this up.

448 Salamantis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:12:12pm

re: #407 rawmuse

Starvation, slow and painful. Not humane. We treat dogs better.

Terri Schiave was brain-dead. She was no longer there to feel pain.

We euthanize terminally ill and pain-crazed dogs, but we won’t let terminally ill people in intractable pain euthanize themselves. Dogs DO get bettr treatment.

449 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:12:39pm

re: #399 avanti

Given the choice of losing the primary because he’s not far enough right for the base, he jumped over to the left’s tent, simple as that.
The fact that is party beat him up at every opportunity made the jump the obvious choice.

Avanti … yeah, well, I think that any politician that jumps the fence in the middle of his term is crap … he should just resign … and then run the next term as a democrat if he wants to … I hope he gets his ass handed to him …

450 yesandno  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:12:40pm

re: #432 avanti

Specters polling show he’ll pick up enough of the new Democratic voters to win, but we’ll see.

As the country goes, so go the polls. We shall see.

And the only poll that counts is the one on election day. By the way, what makes you think he will even get the Democrat nomination?

451 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:13:29pm

re: #425 avanti

Rush suggested today that McCain should follow Specter, I get the feeling the Democrats will accept all the “unpure” Republicans they can get.

Too true. I don’t think McCain will leave, nor do I think that the GOP can hold power with only conservatives. Moderates are needed, but principled moderates, not political whores like Arlen Specter.

452 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:13:34pm

re: #438 formercorpsman

Avanti, I asked you a fair question.

Perhaps you might have missed it.

I am genuinely curious as to why you think the Republicans abandoned him?

What examples do you cite?

I replied in another post, but the GOP choose to run a conservative against him in the primary and several conservitive GOP PAC’s were going to attack him.

link…

453 Silvergirl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:13:52pm

re: #436 TheMatrix31

Yes ma’am.

Yeah. Harmless. At the end, after the story, he has a list of thank yous and a special thank you to Jon Huntsman, and I didn’t see any Birchers (that I know of) or other oddities mentioned.

454 realwest  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:13:59pm

re: #444 Bobibutu uh, does that 61 Dem Senators include Lieberman (I, not D - his party didn’t want HIM in his home state)?

455 countrygurl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:14:17pm

re: #451 Dark_Falcon

Hannity just referred to him as Benedict Arlen

456 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:14:35pm

re: #403 Dianna

I’m not going into this, beyond this: I’m not a doctor. I had no idea what her mental condition was, and wasn’t qualified to comment.

However, I have problems with cruelty. And her death was cruel.

Beyond that, I will not argue.

As to the husband, the parents, the courts and politicians? No real comment on any of them. Everyone did what they thought they should, for their own reasons.

This is what Terri Schiavo’s brain looked like, three years before she was allowed to die:

Image: File:Schiavo_catscan.jpg

457 Silvergirl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:16:26pm

re: #441 rawmuse

I must go for the night, but before I do, these words.

Passing the “stimulus” and TARP package(s) are extreme measures, and were admittedly so even by their proponents. They will guarantee that generations yet unborn will pay for our problems of today. They spend money that has not yet even been printed.

It is the very definition of executive malfeasance, yet we tiptoe around that.

In the twinkling of an eye, the American birthright of Freedom has been traded for Serfdom.

But, here is the problem with that.

Serfs rise up and defy the yoke. They always have. They always will.

Goodnight.

Bestowed Upon Rawmuse:
Hopeful Words Before Bed Award.

458 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:16:31pm

re: #450 yesandno

As the country goes, so go the polls. We shall see.

And the only poll that counts is the one on election day. By the way, what makes you think he will even get the Democrat nomination?

Because the Democrats from BHO on down have promised to campaign for him. He’s gone from ogre to hero in one leap.

459 Salamantis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:16:37pm

re: #429 formercorpsman

Sal, I will only comment on one angle of this case (also because I think Charles prefers this topic elsewhere) but as someone in medicine, and having now had the luxury of the drug abusing, non-compliant lunatic, working under the table but having the tax-payers pick up her medical expenses try unsuccessfully to sue me, one aspect of the case has always rubbed me the wrong way.

Michael sued their doctor for negligence, and malpractice. He won, and memory serves me, the award was determined in relation to the lifelong care she would require as a result of this medical error.

In the autopsy, it was verified her cerebral vascular incident was not due to the original supposition, and subsequently what led to the court ruling.

Would the physician be considered not guilty of malpractice now?

Sounds reasonable. But at the time, the husband had no way to know that, so he was suing in good faith. And the issue dos not in any way whatsoever affect the morality of either removing the feeding tube and allowing her cored husk to wither, or leaving her soulless body lying there for years as a tube-fed zombie.

460 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:16:51pm

re: #448 Salamantis

Terri Schiave was brain-dead. She was no longer there to feel pain.

We euthanize terminally ill and pain-crazed dogs, but we won’t let terminally ill people in intractable pain euthanize themselves. Dogs DO get bettr treatment.

I partially concur. I do support discontinuing treatment is cases of brain death, but I don’t really favor euthanasia or assisted suicide. Its proven too prone to abuse in Europe for me to accept it, even without my religious objection to assisted suicide.

461 JacksonTn  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:17:04pm

re: #458 avanti

Because the Democrats from BHO on down have promised to campaign for him. He’s gone from ogre to hero in one leap.

Avanti … whores … one and all …

462 JCM  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:17:14pm

re: #446 realwest

Hey JCM - great pictures/video whatever! Hope you’re doing well tonight?
And what about Charles Hate mail - I assume he’s still getting it for (mostly) going after the fucking fascists?

Animated .gif, a hybrid.

Yeah, the usual stuff. Seems Paulites and the Birchers are pissed now.

463 WindHorse  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:17:25pm

re: #456 Charles

whoa….. hadn’t seen that before….

(think I might have another beer…)

464 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:17:28pm

re: #455 countrygurl

Hannity just referred to him as Benedict Arlen

For once, Hannity is right on the money.

465 Bob Dillon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:18:11pm

re: #454 realwest

uh, does that 61 Dem Senators include Lieberman (I, not D - his party didn’t want HIM in his home state)?

I don’t know - heard some stuff on it today but haven’t taken the time to come up to speed on it.

466 formercorpsman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:18:12pm

re: #452 avanti

That is not moving the party moving away from him. That was the RNC deciding the primary voters in this state had enough of him, and his welching on the issues.

They threatened not to send financial support because of his voting record, largely, his fiscal votes.

You are claiming the GOP left him. I don’t think this is an accurate statement. It is not factually correct. Moreover, recall early on, he was a Democrat who switched to Republican, who now has switched back to Democrat.

Support the argument ideologically, that the party moved away from him.

467 Aviator  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:18:24pm

re: #452 avanti

I replied in another post, but the GOP choose to run a conservative against him in the primary and several conservitive GOP PAC’s were going to attack him.

link…

Just where is your proof that the RNC is running anyone against him? Someone decided to challenge him in a primary. They do have that right.

468 realwest  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:18:45pm

re: #456 Charles Good evening Charles. I’m afraid I’m as ignorant as you can get on these things, but which one was which before she died - and, as a side question - since for personal reasons I just couldn’t follow that case, why are those photos on Wiki in the first place - does doctor patient confidentiality die with the patient?

469 Silvergirl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:21:19pm

re: #468 realwest

Good evening Charles. I’m afraid I’m as ignorant as you can get on these things, but which one was which before she died - and, as a side question - since for personal reasons I just couldn’t follow that case, why are those photos on Wiki in the first place - does doctor patient confidentiality die with the patient?

That is a good question, but with her image and story everywhere she didn’t really have any confidentiality or privacy in her end-of-life years.

470 Bob Dillon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:22:02pm

re: #468 realwest

does doctor patient confidentiality die with the patient?

RW - my dad was an attorney - loved to sue Drs. My understanding about all confidential relationships is that it does not. Same as a confession to a priest.

471 realwest  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:23:22pm

re: #469 Silvergirl

That is a good question, but with her image and story everywhere she didn’t really have any confidentiality or privacy in her end-of-life years.


Well I ain’t looking for a fight here, but I think she should have had confidentiality and privacy in her end-of-life-years and I do hate the way she was “used” by a lot of different people for a lot of different reasons.

472 realwest  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:25:20pm

re: #470 Bobibutu Well ok, I guess (although I’m not thrilled with that answer but I never did any medical malpractice type work, though I did get 7 attornies disbarred over my career) but it seems to me to show her brain BEFORE she died and it was released by her doctor in 2002 - or am I reading that incorrectly?

473 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:25:29pm

re: #466 formercorpsman


You are claiming the GOP left him. I don’t think this is an accurate statement. It is not factually correct. Moreover, recall early on, he was a Democrat who switched to Republican, who now has switched back to Democrat.

Support the argument ideologically, that the party moved away from him.


Not a argument I can win, I think Specter felt unwelcome as a moderate Republican and left. I think the party has moved to the right, but it’s just a opinion.

474 Salamantis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:25:36pm

re: #460 Dark_Falcon

I partially concur. I do support discontinuing treatment is cases of brain death, but I don’t really favor euthanasia or assisted suicide. Its proven too prone to abuse in Europe for me to accept it, even without my religious objection to assisted suicide.

I approve of it under strict guidelines. The patient must be suffering from a terminal illness, there must be the certain and unavoidable prospect or either massive paralysis, or intractable pain, or both, during the future course of the illness, the patient must express a consistent desire over a significant period to end his/her own life, and the patient him/herself must be the one to activate the device that ends it.

If you disapprove of such an option for religious reasons, you are not required to exercise it for yourself; however, you have no right to impose your personal ethics upon rationally disagreeing others.

475 formercorpsman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:28:13pm

re: #459 Salamantis

Actually Sal, we do not see this issue that far apart.

Having worked trauma for a long time, I had up close & personal experiences with harvest situations, DNR scenarios, you name it.

You will not get an argument from me as to the actual physical nature of her condition. None at all.

Looking at the case from my perspective, there were a some things which stood out to me.

One was the bone scan from about a year post infarct. As well, the premise upon which the court case proceeded, (monetary damages for her long term care due to negligence) the judge ruling on the case, (IIRC, he was a board member of the long term care facility) in that event he should have recused himself, and the fact funds were awarded, yet the state medicaid was picking up the tab.

As well, that Felos character was just downright creepy, but that is a personal opinion.

What I hoped would come out of that situation, was the importance of folks pursuing a living will. Although the original incident was long ago, that would have put so many issues to bed right then and there.

476 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:28:38pm

re: #437 Salamantis

One thing, and only one thing: You’re from a family of nurses, and you keep referring to Shiavo as “brain dead”. She wasn’t. Were she brain dead, all that would have been required was pulling the heart-lung support, and we’ve all gotten to the point where we understand that one.

She may have been the Living Dead, and all the rest of it. But I’ve sat my share of death beds, and I’ve watched death. Starvation and dehydration - even with a morphine drip - is a dreadful thing.

The sheer, extraordinary cruelty of her death warranted a great deal of scrutiny. I still disapprove of that, and I’m not going to stop disapproving just because her brain was atrophied.

Mostly because I never saw that as the point, and still don’t. I didn’t buy her parents’ belief that she was still in there. I thought she was gone. But that death was dreadful.

477 formercorpsman  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:29:13pm

re: #473 avanti

Fair enough.

478 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:29:31pm

re: #456 Charles

This is what Terri Schiavo’s brain looked like, three years before she was allowed to die:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]

Again, Charles, as I’ve always said: that wasn’t the point of my objection. It still isn’t.

479 Silvergirl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:29:36pm

re: #471 realwest

Well I ain’t looking for a fight here, but I think she should have had confidentiality and privacy in her end-of-life-years and I do hate the way she was “used” by a lot of different people for a lot of different reasons.

Yes, she should have, and she was used. Sad all the way around.

480 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:31:05pm

re: #474 Salamantis

I approve of it under strict guidelines. The patient must be suffering from a terminal illness, there must be the certain and unavoidable prospect or either massive paralysis, or intractable pain, or both, during the future course of the illness, the patient must express a consistent desire over a significant period to end his/her own life, and the patient him/herself must be the one to activate the device that ends it.

If you disapprove of such an option for religious reasons, you are not required to exercise it for yourself; however, you have no right to impose your personal ethics upon rationally disagreeing others.

Upding, and agreement.

481 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:31:54pm

re: #474 Salamantis

I approve of it under strict guidelines. The patient must be suffering from a terminal illness, there must be the certain and unavoidable prospect or either massive paralysis, or intractable pain, or both, during the future course of the illness, the patient must express a consistent desire over a significant period to end his/her own life, and the patient him/herself must be the one to activate the device that ends it.

If you disapprove of such an option for religious reasons, you are not required to exercise it for yourself; however, you have no right to impose your personal ethics upon rationally disagreeing others.

I could vote ‘present’ for a law that contained such guidelines and had proper enforcement provisions (I could not bring myself to vote in favor of it). Your guidelines are good, and your idea workable if properly enforced.

482 Aviator  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:31:59pm

re: #480 avanti

No answer to my question?

483 Dianna  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:33:46pm

I’m going to bed.

Good night!

484 Silvergirl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:34:39pm

re: #483 Dianna

I’m going to bed.

Good night!

Same here. Good-night.

485 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:35:16pm

re: #482 Aviator

No answer to my question?

Not sure which question, but here’s one random answer:


Not a argument I can win, I think Specter felt unwelcome as a moderate Republican and left. I think the party has moved to the right, but it’s just a opinion.

486 Aviator  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:36:32pm

re: #485 avanti

Not sure which question, but here’s one random answer:

Not a argument I can win, I think Specter felt unwelcome as a moderate Republican and left. I think the party has moved to the right, but it’s just a opinion.

#467 right between two you did respond to.

487 Salamantis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:38:32pm

re: #476 Dianna

One thing, and only one thing: You’re from a family of nurses, and you keep referring to Shiavo as “brain dead”. She wasn’t. Were she brain dead, all that would have been required was pulling the heart-lung support, and we’ve all gotten to the point where we understand that one.

She may have been the Living Dead, and all the rest of it. But I’ve sat my share of death beds, and I’ve watched death. Starvation and dehydration - even with a morphine drip - is a dreadful thing.

The sheer, extraordinary cruelty of her death warranted a great deal of scrutiny. I still disapprove of that, and I’m not going to stop disapproving just because her brain was atrophied.

Mostly because I never saw that as the point, and still don’t. I didn’t buy her parents’ belief that she was still in there. I thought she was gone. But that death was dreadful.

Automatic, autonomous, unconscious functions such as breathing and heartbeat are controlled by the medulla oblongata, which is a knob at the upper end of the spinal cord. The cerebellum and the cerebral cortex, where sensation, perception, knowledge, memories, cognition, imagination, and personality happen, are quite different - and it was they that had been atrophied and nonfunctional for a long, long time.

There was no THERE there to feel anything any more. How can one be cruel to those who are forevermore incapable of feeling? All one can do is to end the continuing sad travesty of the misguided desecration of their remains.

488 avanti  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:42:47pm

re: #467 Aviator

Just where is your proof that the RNC is running anyone against him? Someone decided to challenge him in a primary. They do have that right.

The only reason someone had a chance against him in the primary is he was told the conservative PAC’s and the GOP base had turned against him for the stimulus vote. He was getting beaten up badly by his own party.

489 Bob Dillon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:47:14pm

re: #472 realwest

Well ok, I guess (although I’m not thrilled with that answer but I never did any medical malpractice type work, though I did get 7 attornies disbarred over my career) but it seems to me to show her brain BEFORE she died and it was released by her doctor in 2002 - or am I reading that incorrectly?

I don’t know on that one. I just remember a speech my dad (suggested) and helped me on during HS and delivered to my civics class on the three confidential relationships.

There may have been Power of Atty. given to someone else by the court and they OKed it. If not (and if my dad was alive then) he would have most likely (offered his services) sued and won. He was a profound @ss hole - but a very good one when attacking with a point of law.

490 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:49:11pm

re: #487 Salamantis

Automatic, autonomous, unconscious functions such as breathing and heartbeat are controlled by the medulla oblongata, which is a knob at the upper end of the spinal cord. The cerebellum and the cerebral cortex, where sensation, perception, knowledge, memories, cognition, imagination, and personality happen, are quite different - and it was they that had been atrophied and nonfunctional for a long, long time.

There was no THERE there to feel anything any more. How can one be cruel to those who are forevermore incapable of feeling? All one can do is to end the continuing sad travesty of the misguided desecration of their remains.

That I agree with entirely. Full disclosure: I opposed the Court Decision to remove Teri Schiavo’s feeding tube, as I thought that the doctors might be wrong and I thought she would suffer in dying. I was wrong.

491 Aviator  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:54:16pm

re: #488 avanti

The only reason someone had a chance against him in the primary is he was told the conservative PAC’s and the GOP base had turned against him for the stimulus vote. He was getting beaten up badly by his own party.

You made the assertion that the “GOP” was running someone against him. The RNC is not. He has a primary challenger due to his behavior. That challenger is not backed by the RNC. Spector is 20 points down in the polls. This is all about him trying to hang on to his seat. An unprincipled jerk.

492 Bob Dillon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 9:57:31pm

re: #472 realwest

BTW - the three are 1.) Doctor/Patient 2.) Priest/Confessant and 3.) Attorney/Client

And the confidentially does not end with any of the parties deaths.

Any practicing attorneys want to chime in and add? Please.

493 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 10:18:20pm

re: #391 Salamantis

It was an utterly disgusting exercise in self-serving political grandstanding pandering.

Ghouls, exploiting the misery of private citizens for political gain. I don’t believe in Karma, but if I did, those politicos have a heavy bill to pay.

494 Bob Dillon  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 10:36:55pm

re: #493 Slumbering Behemoth

Ghouls, exploiting the misery of private citizens for political gain. I don’t believe in Karma, but if I did, those politicos have a heavy bill to pay.

One way to look at “Karma” is the psychological effects of our actions weighing on us in later life. Stuff we did comes back to haunt us or uplift us. Even small things we did in the past and their effects, hamper our actions or support them.

495 haakondahl  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 10:45:25pm

re: #433 Thanos

A sure formula for the Republicans to go from “Minority Party” to “Irrelevant Party” is to witch hunt out the Republican moderates. If we don’t have people who can win in populous states, we will become irrelevant to American politics.


We could hardly be less relevant than we are now. This affords us the uncomfortable luxury of housecleaning. There’s a balance we need to strike between culling the herd and stampeding it.
I’ve had a craw-full of strident, holier-than-thou religion-in-government types, yet I am a social conservative. But I try to make my judgements from conservative first principles, rather than from religious dictates. Where the government needs to fix itself before trying to fix things it has no clue how to even operate, so do the SoCons need to live the life that they profess, and welcome fellow travellers without sniffing about for religious pedigrees.

Fiscal conservatism was obviously not an important part of our term in the White House, or the Congress. More fiscal conservatism would have netted us a better base and a far better situation to carry through the elections.

Defense hawkishness has been a mixed bag. Many of the things we did were right, but the message was communicated so poorly, when communicated at all, that we allowed the left and their media buddies to own the telling of the tale.

I remain convinced that we defeated ourselves in 2008 through not being conservative enough, but I am not talking about knee-jerk responses to hot-button issues. We have had plenty of that, poorly communicated and easily lampooned.

By not retaining the loyalty and support of huge numbers of Americans who longed for a more crunchy conservatism, well-articulated and presented as part of a sensible larger whole, we eroded the base while gaining not support but contempt from the people who will never support us anyway.

The Republican party is held in such contempt these days because it has performed contemptibly. Getting rid of the Hagel-Specter-Collins-Snowe axis will not hurt us—fewer than 40 votes in the Senate might as well be zero, and we will not recover in time to prevent the imminent re-alignment of the Supreme Court.

We stood at the one-yard line, and people like Senators McCain and Specter in the Gang of Fourteen ran the clock out in the first half. Guess what—the Democrats will not wait.

It took Newt Gingrich twenty years to prepare, and the Republicans fifteen years to execute, but we ran the board—and then surrendered. Now we will see how the truly ruthless operate. There will be no Gang of Fourteen next time.

496 itellu3times  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 10:50:28pm

re: #416 Alberta Oil Peon

Halogens are just a specialized type of incandescent bulb, so they should have no flicker. And CFs have a “ballast” which is basically a switching power supply that runs at a few kHz, so the flicker rate should betoo fast to be perceptible. But possibly cheap ones could flicker at 60 Hz, or at the beat rate between 60 Hz and their internal time base.

A lot of the early halogen bulbs would start to flicker very badly as they aged - and some would do so out of the box. Maybe they got better.

Florescents can be designed with slow phosphors such that there’s no visible flicker at all. The CFL’s I’ve been getting at Home Depot are just excellent.

497 Salamantis  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 10:55:10pm

re: #494 Bobibutu

One way to look at “Karma” is the psychological effects of our actions weighing on us in later life. Stuff we did comes back to haunt us or uplift us. Even small things we did in the past and their effects, hamper our actions or support them.

Quite right. Karmic retribution doesn’t require reincarnation; it can and does happen within the span of a single life. People who are either well- or ill-treated, or who witness the kind or unkind treatment of others, remember the perpetrators, and more often than not, when the situation presents itself, they either respond in kind, or shun the perpetrator of ill, and embrace the perpetrator of good, as a matter of self-defence, self-protection, and self-preservation. But what it ends up amounting to is social justice, in the truest sense of the term.

498 Kronocide  Tue, Apr 28, 2009 11:38:18pm

re: #485 avanti

Not sure which question, but here’s one random answer:

I think Specter felt unwelcome as a moderate Republican …

He was a RINO that finally took off his mask. This has more to do with his specific constituency and re-election than the Repub party. The Repubs have been to left the last few years. I would say the opposite.

499 Bob Dillon  Wed, Apr 29, 2009 12:08:39am

re: #497 Salamantis

Nailed it!
Namaste.

500 ethewise  Wed, Apr 29, 2009 9:28:35am

So LGF is saying that Bush didn’t orchestrate the 9/11 killings, Johnson didn’t stage the moon landings on a Hollywood set, Elvis is still not alive, JFK wasn’t killed by multiple shooters and the cops weren’t all in on it?

Wow, you conservatives/neocons/republicans sure are radical.


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