Lebanon's Pro-Western Coalition Wins

Lebanon’s Pro-Western Coalition Wins

Middle EastJune 2009 • Views: 3,151

Pro-western parties have won an important victory against Hezbollah in Lebanon: Lebanon’s pro-Western majority declares victory.

BEIRUT (AP) — Lebanon’s pro-Western coalition declared victory early Monday, as local television stations reported the faction had successfully fended off a serious challenge by the Shiite militant group Hezbollah and its allies to grab the majority in parliament.

Official results for Sunday’s election were not expected until later Monday, but the winners were already celebrating by shooting in the air, setting off fireworks and driving around in honking motorcades.

The election was an early test of President Barack Obama’s efforts to forge Middle East peace. A win by Hezbollah would have boosted the influence of its backers Iran and Syria and risked pushing one of the region’s most volatile nations into international isolation and possibly into more conflict with Israel.

“I present this victory to Lebanon,” Prime Minister Fuad Saniora said on television after stations projected his pro-Western coalition was winning. “It is an exceptional day for democracy in Lebanon.”

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228 comments

Lincolntf Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:02:01pm

Let's hope that sanity will prevail (has prevailed) in Lebanon. Their recent history has been a waste of a fine country.

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:02:58pm

Some good news, for a change. Excellent.

Salamantis Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:03:24pm

Ya think that the Der Spiegel revelation of Hezbollah's complicity in the assassination of Rafik Hariri had anything to do with it?

I do.

Cato the Elder Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:04:03pm

That is some seriously good news.

anotherindyfilmguy Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:04:26pm

Congratulations Lebanon! Hopefully this will grow into a total rebuff/removal of the less than peaceful jerks trying to ruin the place.

Karridine Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:05:47pm

Wonderful!

A big step in a GOOD direction!

humpty dumpty was pushed Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:06:04pm

"The election was an early test of President Barack Obama’s efforts to forge Middle East peace."

Wow. It`s all about our President.

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:06:24pm

Now, I do have to wonder if Hizballah won't decide to undo the election results at gunpoint.

shiplord kirel Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:06:39pm

Troll Alert: droppings spotted at the end of the Obama worship string.

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:06:49pm

I think the Hizbo voters must have fallen for the old, "Hizbollah votes on Tuesday" trick.

DEZes Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:08:59pm

re: #9 shiplord kirel

Troll Alert: droppings spotted at the end of the Obama worship string.

I am too tired to battle the fool.

Dr. Shalit Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:09:11pm

yesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyesyes!

-S-

HelloDare Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:09:38pm

re: #7 humpty dumpty was pushed

"The election was an early test of President Barack Obama’s efforts to forge Middle East peace."

Wow. It`s all about our President.

But the election of Merkel, Berlisconi and Sarkozy had nothing to do with Bush.

Wendya Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:12:08pm

re: #7 humpty dumpty was pushed

"The election was an early test of President Barack Obama’s efforts to forge Middle East peace."

Wow. It`s all about our President.

It didn't have jack shit to do with him.

avanti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:12:16pm

re: #7 humpty dumpty was pushed

"The election was an early test of President Barack Obama’s efforts to forge Middle East peace."

Wow. It`s all about our President.

The Saudi press had another leg tingle today.

Arab news.

Honcho Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:12:34pm

It's bad luck to thump Christoper Hitchens' melon.

Media has been showing Maronites as the swing vote-- any news on which way the Druze went this time?

Whatever happened to Amal, are they all co-opted by Hizb now?

Wendya Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:16:11pm

re: #15 avanti

The Saudi press had another leg tingle today.

Arab news.

Arabs are hopeful. The Saudi King came out and said he hoped Obama would "impose a settlement" on Israel. I can't imagine him trying that bullshit with Bush. He must know an easy mark when he sees one.

Mich-again Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:16:57pm

Official results for Sunday’s election were not expected until later Monday, but the winners were already celebrating by shooting in the air, setting off fireworks and driving around in honking motorcades.

What? like Shriner Cars in a parade?

SteveC Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:17:23pm

re: #7 humpty dumpty was pushed

"The election was an early test of President Barack Obama’s efforts to forge Middle East peace."

Wow. It`s all about our President.

And what has he done to forge peace, exactly? Made a few speeches - "Just words!" Obama could care less, he's got a country to ruin!

solomonpanting Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:18:31pm

Some 3.2 million people out of a population of 4 million were eligible to vote

That is an incredible statistic. Is the minimum voting age four?

The Shadow Do Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:18:36pm

re: #15 avanti

The Saudi press had another leg tingle today.

Arab news.

They own his young ass, and they know it.

If I were an Israeli, I would be slightly less tingly.

filbert23 Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:19:00pm

Hooray - we finally a president that can bring peace on earth, right all the wrongs done by the 'great satan' and have the entire world sing along in a rousing rendition of 'kumbaya'!

brookly red Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:19:27pm

re: #19 SteveC

And what has he done to forge peace, exactly? Made a few speeches - "Just words!" Obama could care less, he's got a country to ruin!

/Forge; Make a copy of with the intent to deceive...

DEZes Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:20:00pm

Lizards, I thank you for keeping me company.
Best wishes, and good night.

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:21:11pm

re: #7 humpty dumpty was pushed

"The election was an early test of President Barack Obama’s efforts to forge Middle East peace."

Wow. It`s all about our President.

Finally, his vigorous exercise of his clear Constitutional mandate to "fight against negative stereotypes of Islam, wherever they may appear" is paying off!

The Sanity Inspector Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:21:13pm

Hurray, the hotties win again!

Killgore Trout Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:21:14pm

I blame Obama!

mystry Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:21:20pm

The big question is: Do the Syrians approve? That is the #1 question. They really control everything is Lebanon. Right or Wrong?

Ziggy Standard Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:21:37pm

So much for Hezbollah's 'victory'. Great news!

avanti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:21:59pm

re: #19 SteveC

And what has he done to forge peace, exactly? Made a few speeches - "Just words!" Obama could care less, he's got a country to ruin!

Apparently he suggested Lebanon risked isolation, and US aid if the radicals won in a speech or two. No idea if that had a effect, but that's the spin even from Lebanon.

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:24:49pm

re: #27 Killgore Trout

I blame Obama!

I know you're kidding, of course. Because Obama is God. (Just ask Newsweek.)

Honcho Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:25:21pm

re: #21 The Shadow Do

Isn't yellow gold only for girls in muslim Hadith? Men wear white metal, I think.
So did that medallion have a special subtext?

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:25:47pm

re: #30 avanti

Apparently he suggested Lebanon risked isolation, and US aid if the radicals won in a speech or two. No idea if that had a effect, but that's the spin even from Lebanon.

Source, please.

shanec99 Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:25:56pm

Well we can only hope for the best. Let us hope that our Israeli friends dont find it necessary to use militarey force to defend themselves from the marauding and murdering hordes any time soon.

lawhawk Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:27:40pm

re: #1 Lincolntf

The voters may have shown their sanity, but now the real test is whether Hizbullah goes along with the will of the people, or they revert to type - which is to say engage in terrorism and coersion so as to achieve their goals by any means available to them.

avanti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:27:50pm

re: #17 Wendya

Arabs are hopeful. The Saudi King came out and said he hoped Obama would "impose a settlement" on Israel. I can't imagine him trying that bullshit with Bush. He must know an easy mark when he sees one.

I'm hopeful too, but in a different way. if he can convince the Arabs that he's being honest broker for peace while still supporting Israel he can get more done.

Spare O'Lake Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:27:52pm

Shouldn't these democracy-loving folks perhaps wait for the official results before declaring victory?

MandyManners Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:28:20pm

Sing it, Louie.

Youtube Video

Hooray for Captain Spaulding Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:28:22pm

Former President Jimmy Carter, in Beirut to monitor the elections, expressed hope that the United States, Iran and other countries will recognize the results "and not try to interfere in the process."

Cant this dumb fuck just shut his yap for a couple of months?
He's lumping the USA with Iran?

SteveC Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:28:31pm

re: #26 The Sanity Inspector

Hurray, the hotties win again!

The Babes of Lebanon!

Excuse me, Miss....! :)

The Shadow Do Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:28:38pm

re: #30 avanti

Apparently he suggested Lebanon risked isolation, and US aid if the radicals won in a speech or two. No idea if that had a effect, but that's the spin even from Lebanon.

I really doubt the average voter in Beirut weighed American foreign aid into the equation. Just my take, but folks don't generally like being oppressed. That would be a lot closer to the George Bush take on the human condition as opposed to, say, Obama.

The Shadow Do Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:29:44pm

re: #32 Honcho

Sorry, Honcho, you lost me...

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:30:02pm

re: #36 avanti

I'm hopeful too, but in a different way. if he can convince the Arabs that he's being honest broker for peace while still supporting Israel he can get more done.

Yes, of course, since what the Arabs all want is a just, equitable, totally groovy peace with Israel.

/do I really need this here sarc tag?

Which of course means that Job One is to stop Jews from building houses.

/do I really need another?

HelloDare Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:30:11pm

re: #40 SteveC

The Babes of Lebanon!

Excuse me, Miss....! :)

A lot of eyebrow pluckage.

MandyManners Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:30:20pm

Balance, folks. Balance.

Wendya Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:30:40pm

re: #32 Honcho

Isn't yellow gold only for girls in muslim Hadith? Men wear white metal, I think.
So did that medallion have a special subtext?

No. There is a Hadith about the color yellow but it's not about gold jewelry. Saudi men wear plenty of bling.

Killgore Trout Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:30:41pm

re: #31 Occasional Reader

The times have changed. Blaming Obama has replaced blaming Bush.

MandyManners Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:31:04pm

re: #32 Honcho

Isn't yellow gold only for girls in muslim Hadith? Men wear white metal, I think.
So did that medallion have a special subtext?

Pardon?

zombie Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:31:05pm

Good news from Lebanon!

However, on the downside, elsewhere....

Far-right parties gained in Europe.

The FMLN communists have taken over El Salvador.

Hmmmmm....

On the plus side, along with the Lebanon news, the weasel-y Labor Party is seriously weakened in the U.K.

Down and then up:

Taliban takes over 1/3 of Pakistan, then is driven back by the Pakistani army.

Mexico descends into gang-fueled violence.

...All in all, just another month on planet Earth. I don't think Obama's presidency has had much of an effect either way, frankly. All politics is local politics -- and that applies internationally, too. It is only America's narcissism which makes us think that our president influences everything around the globe.

Lincolntf Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:31:16pm

re: #35 lawhawk

Yeah, definitely still in a transitional period (at best). If it can be done without violence I'll be amazed. I just hope that the Leb. masses know that Islamic-extremist governance is a dead-end and act in their own best interests.

Wendya Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:31:35pm

re: #36 avanti

I'm hopeful too, but in a different way. if he can convince the Arabs that he's being honest broker for peace while still supporting Israel he can get more done.

Imposing a settlement isn't being an honest broker for peace. The arabs aren't interested in "fairness". That's a sign of weakness.

HAL2010 Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:32:16pm

What did the polls say before the election took place?

Undoubtedly a good result for the region.

MandyManners Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:32:28pm

re: #47 Killgore Trout

The times have changed. Blaming Obama has replaced blaming Bush.

Please post the links to articles in which Pres. Bush was lauded as a god during his first year.

Vicious Babushka Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:32:45pm

re: #15 avanti

The Saudi press had another leg tingle today.

Arab news.

Uri Avnery, a Marxist Neturei Karta without the sidecurls and frisbee hat.

avanti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:33:05pm

re: #41 The Shadow Do

I really doubt the average voter in Beirut weighed American foreign aid into the equation. Just my take, but folks don't generally like being oppressed. That would be a lot closer to the George Bush take on the human condition as opposed to, say, Obama.

You may me right, I just read about it.

link...

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:33:49pm

re: #47 Killgore Trout

The times have changed. Blaming Obama has replaced blaming Bush.

Which is wrong. Because Obama is God.

The Shadow Do Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:34:21pm

re: #36 avanti

I'm hopeful too, but in a different way. if he can convince the Arabs that he's being honest broker for peace while still supporting Israel he can get more done.

Bologna, you presuppose with this comment that Arabs are dupes. Obama can pretend to support Arab cause (poor Pali's), but really he is looking out for the Jews? How do you get yourself into such a pretzel, my friend.

MandyManners Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:34:25pm

re: #49 zombie

Good news from Lebanon!

However, on the downside, elsewhere....

Far-right parties gained in Europe.

The FMLN communists have taken over El Salvador.
Hmmmmm....

On the plus side, along with the Lebanon news, the weasel-y Labor Party is seriously weakened in the U.K.

Down and then up:

Taliban takes over 1/3 of Pakistan, then is driven back by the Pakistani army.

Mexico descends into gang-fueled violence.

...All in all, just another month on planet Earth. I don't think Obama's presidency has had much of an effect either way, frankly. All politics is local politics -- and that applies internationally, too. It is only America's narcissism which makes us think that our president influences everything around the globe.

I have a niggling movement in the back of my brain about El Salvador and Ortega in Nicaragua and ShortShit in Tehran.

Wendya Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:34:41pm

re: #47 Killgore Trout

The times have changed. Blaming Obama has replaced blaming Bush.

Not really. Everyone is still blaming Bush, most of all Obama himself.

Dancing along the light of day Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:34:59pm

Sleep tight, valiant troll fighter!

re: #24 DEZes

Lizards, I thank you for keeping me company.
Best wishes, and good night.

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:35:00pm

re: #58 MandyManners

I have a niggling movement in the back of my brain about El Salvador and Ortega in Nicaragua and ShortShit in Tehran.

More likely, Hugo had something to do with it.

lawhawk Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:35:27pm

re: #36 avanti

I'm hopeful too, but in a different way. if he can convince the Arabs that he's being honest broker for peace while still supporting Israel he can get more done.

Honest broker for peace is a misnomer, and has been for decades. The Arab world doesn't want an honest broker. They want someone who will constrain Israel while asserting Arab intentions as somehow superior despite the facts on the ground. It goes along with the idea that settlements are somehow an obstacle to peace, all while ignoring that the Palestinians - both Hamas and Fatah have rejected peace with Israel - Arafat and Abbas both rejected without a counterproposal a two-state solution for a Palestinian state alongside Israel. Hamas doens't recognize Israel's right to exist other than as a targeting data point.

So, don't tell me about a honest broker. An honest broker would say that Israel is not going to be forced to make peace with terrorists who seek Israel's destruction.

Ziggy Standard Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:35:30pm

re: #47 Killgore Trout

The times have changed. Blaming Obama has replaced blaming Bush.

A comment I made on the "I saw god in Obama" thread -

For me, it makes a refreshing change from seeing the American president, and by implication America, continually bad mouthed by all and sundry. But I guess for you the fact it's a democrat President spoils everything. Partisan bitterness trumps all, once again. Conservatives had a chance to show they were better in this respect than the anti-Bush morons, but they have blown it big style.

MandyManners Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:36:18pm

re: #61 Occasional Reader

More likely, Hugo had something to do with it.

Probably but, I do not recall his name in the article.

[deleted] Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:36:30pm

Honcho Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:37:21pm

re: #48 MandyManners

re: #46 Wendya

re: #42 The Shadow Do

[Link: mac.abc.se...]

check it out

Kreuzueber Halbmond Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:37:33pm

Hassan Nasrallah
that scary bearded fella
who loves the Ayatollah
made a loser of Hezbollah

Ha, ha, ha

shanec99 Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:37:47pm

re: #44 HelloDare
My impression is that Muslim women who dont have the burden of Sharia forced on the make the conservative clerics unhappy.
In many African countries it is Arab women from moderate Arab states like Lebanon and Algeria dresses and acted like western women.

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:37:56pm

re: #63 Jimmah

Did Evan Thomas of Newsweek referring to Obama "God", and blithely praising him for rising above the mere petty, "parochial" interests of, you know, the United States... did that charm you?

Wendya Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:38:01pm

re: #63 Jimmah

A comment I made on the "I saw god in Obama" thread -

For me, it makes a refreshing change from seeing the American president, and by implication America, continually bad mouthed by all and sundry. But I guess for you the fact it's a democrat President spoils everything. Partisan bitterness trumps all, once again. Conservatives had a chance to show they were better in this respect than the anti-Bush morons, but they have blown it big style.

Oh, we looooove Obama. He's just so cute! And he takes his wife on dates! Ohhh.....Isn't he just the dreamiest President ever!

Is that better?

The Shadow Do Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:38:14pm

re: #55 avanti
From your link:

The election was an early test of President Barack Obama's efforts to forge Middle East peace. A win by Hezbollah would have boosted the influence of its backers Iran and Syria and risked pushing one of the region's most volatile nations into international isolation and possibly into more conflict with Israel.

OK, your right. This is a straight *snort* news story. My bad.

avanti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:38:17pm

re: #33 Occasional Reader

Source, please.

link.

TedStriker Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:39:04pm

re: #67 Kreuzueber Halbmond

Hassan Nasrallah
that scary bearded fella
who loves the Ayatollah
made a loser of Hezbollah
Burma Shave

~~Ha, ha, ha~~

FTFY! ;-P

[deleted] Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:40:07pm

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:40:23pm

Not trying to be an intelligent part of the discussion tonight. Just wanted to say;

"Hi everybody."

Now. Imagine I said that with a really, really, really good Foster Brook's impression.

Lincolntf Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:40:37pm

re: #62 lawhawk

Nobody who knows even a tiny fraction of the post WW2 history of Israel/the Mideast believes that an "honest broker" is what is lacking. What is lacking is the willingness of a certain party to forswear the liquidation of an entire race.

Wendya Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:40:48pm

re: #66 Honcho

re: #46 Wendya

re: #42 The Shadow Do

[Link: mac.abc.se...]

check it out

I used to live in Saudi Arabia. Believe me, if there were a prohibition against wearing gold, the mutaween would be forced to beat themselves.

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:41:41pm

re: #75 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Foster Brooks'

PIMF

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:41:54pm

re: #72 avanti

link.

Ah, those elusive "some" that the AP and Reuters always manage to find, whose positions invariably support liberal US politicians, and damn conservatives.

Please remember James Taranto's rule of journalism: When used in a news column, the word "some" is a first-person pronoun.

unrealizedviewpoint Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:42:01pm

re: #53 MandyManners

Please post the links to articles in which Pres. Bush was lauded as a god during his first year.

Never happened Mandy.
All there was was the Dubya Dance.
(sorry the audio file seems to be missing)

shanec99 Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:43:23pm

re: #77 Wendya

I used to live in Saudi Arabia. Believe me, if there were a prohibition against wearing gold, the mutaween would be forced to beat themselves.

Those damned fools... I used to see those inept, ignorant jackasses... I cannot imagine that they could earn a living anywhere else on earth.

avanti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:44:03pm

re: #79 Occasional Reader

Ah, those elusive "some" that the AP and Reuters always manage to find, whose positions invariably support liberal US politicians, and damn conservatives.

Please remember James Taranto's rule of journalism: When used in a news column, the word "some" is a first-person pronoun.

Even on the evening news, they found some Lebanese that were Obama fans to feature, no question they made the effort.
Some damn hot women in that country BTW.

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:44:19pm

re: #52 HAL2010

What did the polls say before the election took place?

John Kerry was leading by five.

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:45:24pm

re: #83 itellu3times

John Kerry was leading by five.

What about Ron Paul?

Vicious Babushka Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:46:06pm

re: #65 buzzsawmonkey

Wasn't Uri Avnery, once upon a time, a respectable archaeologist rather than a leftist tool?

If he ever was, it must have been back in the times that archaeologists of today study.

Dark_Falcon Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:46:18pm

re: #82 avanti

Even on the evening news, they found some Lebanese that were Obama fans to feature, no question they made the effort.
Some damn hot women in that country BTW.

As to your first point; Glad you realize the MSM efforts to link Obama to all good things.

As to your second point; Va-va-va-voom!

lifeofthemind Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:46:52pm

Israel’s right wing, as represented by Lieberman, tends to lump all the Arabs together and all the Europeans. Their suspicions are not based on religious disputes or on the ideologies of political economy. They wish separation from the Other.

There is an alternative approach, more dare I say it nuanced? Israel could drive a wedge between the Christians and the Muslims and seek to rally conservative European support. Such an approach was tried by Sharon and the Likud at the time of the first Lebanon War. At that time it failed but the alternatives have not proven superior. To carry it out Israel would have to act as the champion of the Lebanese Christians and also as the champion of Palestinian Christians. There are maybe 5-600 Christians left in Gaza, Israel could insist on their safety. Israel could annex Bethlehem and expel the recent Sunni intruders. Israel could once more move to defang Hezbollah and the Syrians. The biggest problem this policy would face is the same one that the US or any democracy faces in the eyes of those contemplating alliance with us. That is the tendency of democracies to cut and run or abandon allies.

HelloDare Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:47:57pm

The rumors that ACORN was registering Hezbollah voters is not true.

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:48:36pm

re: #84 Occasional Reader

What about Ron Paul?

Lakers and Magic...Tied. OT.

A Kiwi Infidel Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:48:40pm

To those concerned as to Hezbollahs next move, I can assure all present that I am quietly confident that Hezbollah will be gracious in their acceptance of their defeat at the polls.........

//////

Honcho Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:48:45pm

Another link

[Link: www.islamweb.net...]

regarding the subtext of Abdullah's gift to the new dhimmi carter.

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:48:52pm

re: #82 avanti

Even on the evening news, they found some Lebanese that were Obama fans to feature, no question they made the effort.
Some damn hot women in that country BTW.

Wow. Non sequitur city.

Since "even" the evening news (who are usuallly... relentlessly anti-Obama, I guess) "managed" to find some pro-Obama Lebanese; that means that Obama single-handedly produced this outcome, with his charming smile and rich, bell-shaped oratory.

Which, in turn, is proven by a laughably thinly-sourced AP column claiming that "some" Taliban (ferpetessake) are ready to make kissyface with us because they love Obama so much.

pat Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:49:10pm

I hope this is good news. One never know what the hell this stuff means in Lebanon. Such news usually presages the mass murder, torture and rape of Christians. More than 300,000 have fled Lebanon since Arafat set up camps there.

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:49:10pm

re: #87 lifeofthemind

I think you have brilliantly predicted 1982.

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:49:44pm

re: #89 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Lakers and Magic...Tied. OT.

Driving me crazy! Lee could have ended it with .06 secs and missed

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:50:29pm

re: #95 HoosierHoops

Driving me crazy! Lee could have ended it with .06 secs and missed

lifeofthemind Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:50:43pm

re: #94 itellu3times

I think you have brilliantly predicted 1982.

That is usually the secret of success in Washington or Academia. Where do I sign?

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:51:15pm

re: #89 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Lakers and Magic...Tied. OT.

Ugly game. Orlando still playing ugly and Lakers doing no better.

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:51:32pm

re: #95 HoosierHoops

Guess what happened to me today... It includes playing basketball with 7 guys (all under 20)!

100

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:52:16pm

re: #99 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Guess what happened to me today... It includes playing basketball with 7 guys (all under 20)!

ankle?
:)

101

Lincolntf Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:52:19pm

Go Magic!

(I can't believe I just typed that)

102

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:52:21pm

re: #99 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Guess what happened to me today... It includes playing basketball with 7 guys (all under 20)!

weekend in slam?

103

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:52:23pm

re: #99 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Oh...all over 16 too.

104

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:52:47pm

So avanti, I'm curious; as a self-declared liberal, don't you find anything a little... odd... about the President of the United States declaring that one of the "responsibilities" of his office is to "fight negative stereotypes about Islam"?

Because I have to say, I checked Article II of the Constitution, and I'm having the darndest trouble finding that one.

Maybe it's in the penumbras and emanations?

105

A Kiwi Infidel Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:53:09pm

re: #103 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Oh...all over 16 too.

You're feeling your age?

106

Ziggy Standard Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:53:17pm

re: #69 Occasional Reader

Did Evan Thomas of Newsweek referring to Obama "God", and blithely praising him for rising above the mere petty, "parochial" interests of, you know, the United States... did that charm you?

No, it's clearly over the top. My comment was regarding a star struck comment by a French citizen. That was also over the top, but pretty unremarkable. However I think the rage that it has incurred among conservative Americans is even more over the top, and actually worth remarking on, being as I said, a clear sign that partisanship has trumped all here. I would have thought that people would be pleased over signs that foreigners are talking a brighter view of the American President and by implication America. But then, wary as I am about some of his policies/approaches, I am not hoping for him to fail.

107

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:53:51pm

re: #104 Occasional Reader

So avanti, I'm curious; as a self-declared liberal, don't you find anything a little... odd... about the President of the United States declaring that one of the "responsibilities" of his office is to "fight negative stereotypes about Islam"?

Because I have to say, I checked Article II of the Constitution, and I'm having the darndest trouble finding that one.

Maybe it's in the penumbras and emanations?

The Obama answers to a higher source, PBUH.

108

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:54:29pm

re: #100 HoosierHoops

Really did laugh out loud.

Held my frickin' own! Boxed out a high-school linebacker! Beat the crap out of him!

(think he was afraid he'd break my hip)

15 rebounds, 10 points, 6 assts.

109

The Shadow Do Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:54:36pm

re: #95 HoosierHoops

Driving me crazy! Lee could have ended it with .06 secs and missed

This game has all the attraction of ingrown toenail removal. I know the teams don't care. Style points get you zip, but this has been an awful viewing experience. These teams look like they are in the second week of the season, not the finals for cryin' out loud.

110

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:55:44pm

I. Hate. The. Lakers.

111

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:56:09pm

re: #108 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Really did laugh out loud.

Held my frickin' own! Boxed out a high-school linebacker! Beat the crap out of him!

(think he was afraid he'd break my hip)

15 rebounds, 10 points, 6 assts.

You are the fucking man! Way to go! Did you score mostly in the paint?

112

Wendya Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:56:10pm

re: #106 Jimmah

I would have thought that people would be pleased over signs that foreigners are talking a brighter view of the American President and by implication America.

I'm supposed to be happy that foreigners love Obama's America?

Most of those idiots long for a weak, impotent America, not a strong nation. You may swoon over that image but it leaves me cold.

113

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:56:13pm

Bit of a big finish, looks like, if you're a Lakers fan.

Like me.

114

[deleted] Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:56:14pm

115

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:56:17pm

re: #109 The Shadow Do

That is not attractive at all.

116

mystry Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:56:41pm

#28 As I said in my post, Syria in the mover & shaker over there. There is no honest broker. Syria trumps everything and everyone.

117

Dark_Falcon Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:56:53pm

re: #104 Occasional Reader

So avanti, I'm curious; as a self-declared liberal, don't you find anything a little... odd... about the President of the United States declaring that one of the "responsibilities" of his office is to "fight negative stereotypes about Islam"?

Because I have to say, I checked Article II of the Constitution, and I'm having the darndest trouble finding that one.

Maybe it's in the penumbras and emanations?

"Please do not emanate into the penumbra."

118

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:57:04pm

re: #113 itellu3times

I can't down ding you.

But I want to!

119

[deleted] Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:57:11pm

120

Spare O'Lake Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:57:16pm

re: #99 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Guess what happened to me today... It includes playing basketball with 7 guys (all under 20)!

You can still blog while on a respirator?

121

Sharmuta Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:57:36pm

Fuck hezbollah.

122

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:57:54pm

re: #109 The Shadow Do

This game has all the attraction of ingrown toenail removal. I know the teams don't care. Style points get you zip, but this has been an awful viewing experience. These teams look like they are in the second week of the season, not the finals for cryin' out loud.

Lakers are pulling away..
Magic lives or dies by the jump shot...pathetic shooting tonight

123

MandyManners Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:58:09pm

re: #92 Occasional Reader

Wow. Non sequitur city.

Youtube Video

124

The Shadow Do Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:58:30pm

re: #115 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

That is not attractive at all.

I know.

125

A Kiwi Infidel Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:58:51pm

re: #121 Sharmuta

Fuck hezbollah.

Succinct and to the point

126

shiplord kirel Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:58:51pm

re: #106 Jimmah

No, it's clearly over the top. My comment was regarding a star struck comment by a French citizen. That was also over the top, but pretty unremarkable. However I think the rage that it has incurred among conservative Americans is even more over the top, and actually worth remarking on, being as I said, a clear sign that partisanship has trumped all here. I would have thought that people would be pleased over signs that foreigners are talking a brighter view of the American President and by implication America. But then, wary as I am about some of his policies/approaches, I am not hoping for him to fail.

It wasn't just the restaurant guy, that whole article was over the top, Great-Stalin-in-Pravda over the top in fact, as I pointed out in my response on the Obama worship string.
It's no surprise at all, let alone a refreshing change, that Bush-haters like AP would be more positive about their own guy, but it surprised even me that they would go that far.

127

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:58:56pm

Hoosier!? The ding whore wants you to look at #110!

128

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:58:57pm

re: #121 Sharmuta

Fuck hezbollah.

Fez Huckbollah.

129

lifeofthemind Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:59:10pm

re: #117 Dark_Falcon

Sign in Clarence Thomas' office:

"Please do not emanate into the penumbra."

Do you intimate that there is an imminent emanation perambulating about the penumbra Sir?

130

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 7:59:51pm

re: #111 HoosierHoops

Yes! Only in the paint (btw)!

131

lifeofthemind Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:00:04pm

re: #128 itellu3times

Fez Huckbollah.

In the Casbah

132

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:00:17pm

ain't over till it's over, but it's almost over.

133

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:00:29pm

re: #106 Jimmah

I would have thought that people would be pleased over signs that foreigners are talking a brighter view of the American President and by implication America.

Well, see, that assumes the Rahm Emmanuel explanation about how this thing works. Which goes something like this:

1) Obama goes to foreign countries, talks about how disappointing the US has been, but notes that he's here now, so everything is better.

2) Said foreigners love Obama.

3) By extension, then, said foreigners love us. [this is the key part, see]

4) And therefore, said foreigners will modify their behavior to conform more closely to US interests.

Now... that sequence of events is possible, I suppose. But here's one that I see as at least as likely:

1) Obama goes to foreign countries, talks about how disappointing the US has been, but notes that he's here now, so everything is better.

2) Said foreigners love Obama.

3) However, this really doesn't translate into loving us.

4) Desperate to keep and augment said foreigners' approval, the Obama Administration will modify US behavior to conform more closely to foreign powers' interests.

134

FamHistoryGuy Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:00:34pm

OT. D-Day CBS news broadcasts.

Interesting that the first broadcasts were by the Germans.

135

avanti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:00:34pm

re: #104 Occasional Reader

So avanti, I'm curious; as a self-declared liberal, don't you find anything a little... odd... about the President of the United States declaring that one of the "responsibilities" of his office is to "fight negative stereotypes about Islam"?

Because I have to say, I checked Article II of the Constitution, and I'm having the darndest trouble finding that one.

Maybe it's in the penumbras and emanations?

Nope, he was making a speech in a Muslim capital, appropriate to mention freedom of religion is guaranteed by the constitution. He referred to countries where freedom of religion does not exist and called for a change.

136

Sharmuta Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:00:42pm

re: #125 A Kiwi Infidel

Succinct and to the point

I try.

137

Mich-again Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:00:46pm

re: #93 pat

I hope this is good news. One never know what the hell this stuff means in Lebanon.

It means Hezbollah has 58 out of the 128 seats in Parliament. The victory for the Pro-Western coalition was pretty slim. They dodged a bullet, for now.

138

jaunte Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:02:03pm

re: #133 Occasional Reader

Have you factored in the power of wishful thinking?

139

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:02:12pm

re: #105 A Kiwi Infidel

You're feeling your age?

I probably will have a lot of time on LGF tomorrow.

Don't think I'll be able to walk.

What's yer point!?

140

shiplord kirel Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:02:27pm

I do think certain Republicans are getting over the top about Palin, perhaps we could call this "Palinsanity." I daresay the mainstream media are safe from this affliction though.

141

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:03:01pm

re: #137 Mich-again

It means Hezbollah has 58 out of the 128 seats in Parliament. The victory for the Pro-Western coalition was pretty slim. They dodged a bullet, for now.

Yah. Not yet dead of cancer, but far from cured.

142

A Kiwi Infidel Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:03:12pm

re: #139 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I probably will have a lot of time on LGF tomorrow.

Don't think I'll be able to walk.

What's yer point!?

Been there, done that, suffered the consequences.

143

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:03:21pm

re: #135 avanti

appropriate to mention freedom of religion is guaranteed by the constitution. He referred to countries where freedom of religion does not exist and called for a change.

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

That was NOT his "fight negative stereotypes" quote, and you damn well know it.

144

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:04:06pm

it ain't quite as almost over as I thought, ...

145

Wendya Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:04:08pm

re: #135 avanti

Nope, he was making a speech in a Muslim capital, appropriate to mention freedom of religion is guaranteed by the constitution. He referred to countries where freedom of religion does not exist and called for a change.

What does freedom of religion have to do with people's opinions of that religion? Is Obama going to hop on the Scientology bandwagon next and defend their views towards psychiatry?

146

Dark_Falcon Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:04:15pm

re: #131 lifeofthemind

In the Casbah

Rock The Casbah

147

JacksonTn Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:04:26pm

re: #135 avanti

Nope, he was making a speech in a Muslim capital, appropriate to mention freedom of religion is guaranteed by the constitution. He referred to countries where freedom of religion does not exist and called for a change.

Avanti ... you mean that little thing like when you are a Christian in some countries ... they want to kill you ... or what "freedom of religion" are you talking about? ... I mean ... in what country would they want to kill you if you were a Christian? ... hmmm ... I'm thinking ...

148

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:05:24pm

re: #138 jaunte

Have you factored in the power of wishful thinking?

I believe that children are the future.

Don't stop believin'. Hold on to your dream-eee-whoa-ayyyy.

149

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:06:39pm

whew. not pretty, but it's a W.

150

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:06:41pm

re: #138 jaunte

Take two "Norman Vincent Peale" pills and call me in the morning.

151

avspatti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:06:45pm

re: #70 Wendya

That is yuckable.

152

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:06:54pm

Crap! Lakers Win..Good night lizards

153

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:06:59pm

POOP!

154

lifeofthemind Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:07:20pm

re: #143 Occasional Reader

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

That was NOT his "fight negative stereotypes" quote, and you damn well know it.

Can't find the Shawshank Redemption clip that riffs on this, consider it linked.

Obtuse.

155

A Kiwi Infidel Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:07:22pm

re: #152 HoosierHoops

Crap! Lakers Win..Good night lizards

'Nite Hoops

156

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:07:32pm

re: #144 itellu3times

it ain't quite as almost over as I thought, ...

Over enough.

157

Lincolntf Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:07:36pm

re: #140 shiplord kirel

How about if we judge Gov. Palin by what she does and says rather than by pigeon-holing her based on the rants of so-called "supporters". I happen to think that the country could use a little bit of unapologetic realism and Sarah Palin seems willing to deliver it.

158

avspatti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:08:07pm

re: #110 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I. Hate. The. Lakers.

Well, I hate the Red Wings. We're even. LOL

159

Ziggy Standard Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:09:03pm

Time for the Manics

Youtube Video

160

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:09:10pm

re: #154 lifeofthemind

Andy Dufresne: How can you be so obtuse?
Warden Samuel Norton: What? What did you call me?
Andy Dufresne: Obtuse. Is it deliberate?
Warden Samuel Norton: Son, you're forgetting yourself.
Andy Dufresne: The country club will have his old time cards. Records, W-2s with his name on them. Sir, if I ever get out, I'd never mention what happens here. I'd be just as indictable as you for laundering that money.
[Norton slaps the table]
Warden Samuel Norton: Don't you *ever* mention money to me again, you sorry SON OF A BITCH! NOT IN THIS ROOM, NOT ANYWHERE.

161

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:09:53pm

re: #135 avanti

Nope, he was making a speech in a Muslim capital, appropriate to mention freedom of religion is guaranteed by the constitution. He referred to countries where freedom of religion does not exist and called for a change.

Hey, avanti, here is the actual paragraph containing that quote, courtesy of the White House website:

So I have known Islam on three continents before coming to the region where it was first revealed. That experience guides my conviction that partnership between America and Islam must be based on what Islam is, not what it isn't. And I consider it part of my responsibility as President of the United States to fight against negative stereotypes of Islam wherever they appear. (Applause.)

Could you please point out where in that bit he's talking about freedom of religion being guaranteed by the Constitution; referring to countries that don't have such freedom; and calling for a change? Thanks a bunch.

162

Mich-again Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:10:25pm

re: #158 avspatti

Here are the highlights from all 5 goals in the Red Wings 5-0 beatdown of the Penguins last night. Enjoy!

163

Dark_Falcon Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:10:49pm

re: #148 Occasional Reader

I believe that children are the future.

Don't stop believin'. Hold on to your dream-eee-whoa-ayyyy.

Lyrics from two different songs. I've always liked "Don't Stop Believing". It's use in the final scene of The Sopranos further cemented it in my mind.

164

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:11:25pm

re: #163 Dark_Falcon

Lyrics from two different songs.

Er, yes, I know.

165

Racer X Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:11:25pm

Lakers, Baby!

166

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:12:01pm

Lakers.

Meh.

167

avanti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:12:35pm

re: #143 Occasional Reader

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

That was NOT his "fight negative stereotypes" quote, and you damn well know it.

I don't see the problem with the comment. After 9-11, many very negative stereotypes were and are out there about Muslims. Obama, and that matter, Bush spoke out against those and I agree it's part of their job as POTUS to do so.

168

Vicious Babushka Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:12:46pm

GO RED WINGS!

169

lifeofthemind Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:12:52pm

re: #160 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Tom Hanks was invited to Omaha Beach.
The Queen of England was not.
Her Prime Minister did not know where he was.

170

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:13:06pm

Glad Michelle and the girls are enjoying Paris.

The girls'll remember it forever!

I had french fries earlier.

171

Racer X Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:13:30pm

I love L.A. !

172

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:14:06pm

re: #169 lifeofthemind

Oh, gosh! Wasn't that awful?!

I think I'll go to Obama, NE!

173

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:14:30pm

re: #171 Racer X

we love it.

174

shiplord kirel Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:14:34pm

re: #157 Lincolntf

How about if we judge Gov. Palin by what she does and says rather than by pigeon-holing her based on the rants of so-called "supporters". I happen to think that the country could use a little bit of unapologetic realism and Sarah Palin seems willing to deliver it.

I was talking about those ranting supporters, not pigeon-holing the governor herself or discussing her specifically at all.

175

ShanghaiEd Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:15:03pm

re: #53 MandyManners

Please post the links to articles in which Pres. Bush was lauded as a god during his first year.

Big difference. Bush wasn't a god...he was picked by God. Next best thing, huh? :)

176

Dr. Shalit Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:15:16pm

re: #40 SteveC

The Babes of Lebanon!

Excuse me, Miss....! :)

SteveC -

Women like that change the equation entirely. I trust the pictures are from Beirut, not the countryside. Women like that populate our countryside and eat males like QUTB for lunch, spitting him out before dinner - and anybody wonders why Islamist Men are wary of their females?

-S-

177

A Kiwi Infidel Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:15:25pm

re: #167 avanti

I don't see the problem with the comment. After 9-11, many very negative stereotypes were and are out there about Muslims. Obama, and that matter, Bush spoke out against those and I agree it's part of their job as POTUS to do so.

You mean the ones that want to kill me because I'm an infidel, as they are instructed to do in their "holy" book?

178

lawhawk Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:15:33pm

A caller into 911 in Wayne NJ said that pipe bombs were in a neighborhood.

Police and the bomb squad came out - and found three pipe bombs and an amount of gunpowder. The bombs were detonated by the bomb squad.

179

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:17:16pm

re: #161 Occasional Reader

Could you please point out where in that bit he's talking about freedom of religion being guaranteed by the Constitution; referring to countries that don't have such freedom; and calling for a change? Thanks a bunch.

He could have been arguing on his spare time.
/python

180

A Kiwi Infidel Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:17:19pm

re: #178 lawhawk

A caller into 911 in Wayne NJ said that pipe bombs were in a neighborhood.

Police and the bomb squad came out - and found three pipe bombs and an amount of gunpowder. The bombs were detonated by the bomb squad.

So, its "watch this space"

Several persons of interest, all men, were being interviewed, Stouthamer said

181

Lincolntf Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:17:24pm

re: #174 shiplord kirel

I might have been a bit harsh towards you, didn't mean to be.

I just get so sick of Palin-bashing I sometimes revert to auto-defensive mode. I still mean what I said, but I shouldn't have been pointing my finger at you. Sorry.

182

Dark_Falcon Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:17:39pm

re: #164 Occasional Reader

Er, yes, I know.

Wasn't trying to badger you, I was just saying.

Here's the vid for the Journey song:

Don't Stop Believin'

183

lifeofthemind Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:19:06pm

re: #180 A Kiwi Infidel

Amish again?

184

Ziggy Standard Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:19:34pm

re: #133 Occasional Reader

I understand your point of view. You could of course be right, (although I think he's far more likelty to modoify his polocies to suit the tastes of those who will be voting for him - ie Americans), but my concern is over the rhetoric coming from those who seem to have an absolute conviction that Obama is pure poison. I'm just sick of hearing it. It's getting more and more like the old anti-Bush rhetoric every day.

185

Dancing along the light of day Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:19:37pm

Lakers got the job done!
2-0!
re: #165 Racer X

Lakers, Baby!

186

JacksonTn Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:20:17pm

To the discussion of Obama and fighting negative sterotypes of what Islam in his speech ...

"So I have known Islam on three continents before coming to the region where it was first revealed. That experience guides my conviction that partnership between America and Islam must be based on what Islam is, not what it isn't. And I consider it part of my responsibility as President of the United States to fight against negative stereotypes of Islam wherever they appear."

***
So ... is Obama gonna tell these guys what Islam is? ... cuz I am thinking they have a pretty good idea of what it means to them ... (a good article about the "Brotherhood" ... and it was from Chicago paper in 2004) ...

[Link: www.chicagotribune.com...]

187

avanti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:20:33pm

re: #161 Occasional Reader

Could you please point out where in that bit he's talking about freedom of religion being guaranteed by the Constitution; referring to countries that don't have such freedom; and calling for a change? Thanks a bunch.

Here's comments later in the same speech

"The fifth issue that we must address together is religious freedom.

Islam has a proud tradition of tolerance. We see it in the history of Andalusia and Cordoba during the Inquisition. I saw it firsthand as a child in Indonesia, where devout Christians worshiped freely in an overwhelmingly Muslim country. That is the spirit we need today. People in every country should be free to choose and live their faith based upon the persuasion of the mind, heart, and soul. This tolerance is essential for religion to thrive, but it is being challenged in many different ways.

Among some Muslims, there is a disturbing tendency to measure one's own faith by the rejection of another's. The richness of religious diversity must be upheld - whether it is for Maronites in Lebanon or the Copts in Egypt. And fault lines must be closed among Muslims as well, as the divisions between Sunni and Shia have led to tragic violence, particularly in Iraq. "

188

Dr. Shalit Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:20:50pm

re: #178 lawhawk

A caller into 911 in Wayne NJ said that pipe bombs were in a neighborhood.

Police and the bomb squad came out - and found three pipe bombs and an amount of gunpowder. The bombs were detonated by the bomb squad.

lawhawk -

Paterson, West Paterson, Totowa, Wayne as I remember Rt. 80, between 5-10 miles total. Wayne surprises me a bit. Paterson NOT AT ALL.

-S-

189

Ziggy Standard Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:21:12pm

re: #184 Jimmah

- spelling mistakes. PIMF FFS.

190

shiplord kirel Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:21:24pm

re: #181 Lincolntf

I might have been a bit harsh towards you, didn't mean to be.

I just get so sick of Palin-bashing I sometimes revert to auto-defensive mode. I still mean what I said, but I shouldn't have been pointing my finger at you. Sorry.

We'll see what she does. I suspect that she is not quite what the socons seem to think she is either. They have a habit of backing the wrong horse in terms of their ideology as when they went nuts over Dubya in 2000 only to find later that he was, by their standards, a liberal on spending and a moderate at least on many social issues.

191

Cygnus Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:21:45pm

re: #183 lifeofthemind

Amish again?

Swedish Lutherans on vacation from Duluth.

192

avspatti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:21:50pm

re: #162 Mich-again

Here are the highlights from all 5 goals in the Red Wings 5-0 beatdown of the Penguins last night. Enjoy!

Thanks ever so much. I saw enough of that last night, and as soon as it was over, my son called and said, "I HATE THE RED WINGS!" It runs in the family. LOL

193

Ziggy Standard Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:23:48pm

Well, it's way past my bed time. Later folks.

194

Lynn B. Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:24:39pm

re: #14 Wendya

"The election was an early test of President Barack Obama’s efforts to forge Middle East peace."

Wow. It`s all about our President.

It didn't have jack shit to do with him.

Exactly. It didn't have jack shit to do with him.

/I know ... there's not a fly takes a shit anywhere in the world that doesn't have something to do with him...

195

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:25:20pm

re: #187 avanti

Here's comments later in the same speech

Um... yes, see, he made different points in different parts of the speech.

Is this so hard to understand?

196

LatinGent Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:26:13pm

I`m sure President Peanut is satisfied. If not does it means he was for the other guys?

197

Lincolntf Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:26:42pm

re: #190 shiplord kirel

I don't care what "socons" or "neocons" or any other "cons" think. The woman is more than her caricature, and speaks in a way that appalls the media but resonates with people who talk the same way about the same things. She's no bumpkin, she is a legitimate political entity.

198

Dark_Falcon Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:27:10pm

re: #182 Dark_Falcon

Wasn't trying to badger you, I was just saying.

Here's the vid for the Journey song:

Don't Stop Believin'

Sorry about posting the first time.

199

Kosh's Shadow Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:28:39pm

re: #116 mystry

#28 As I said in my post, Syria in the mover & shaker over there. There is no honest broker. Syria trumps everything and everyone.

The question is, will Syria assassinate any of the anti-Hizballah leaders, like they did to Harari?

200

lifeofthemind Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:28:43pm

re: #172 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Oh, gosh! Wasn't that awful?!

I think I'll go to Obama, NE!

Don’t give the Democrats any ideas. They may start naming things after Obama. Wouldn’t put it past them to try and change Mount Rushmore to Mount Obama.

201

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:29:07pm

re: #187 avanti

Noise.

I'm going to barf from now on everytime someone tells me about the "tolerance" of Islam. More "tolerant" than the Inquisition? I didn't expect that! Life as a dhimmi, until the mob tears you apart? Wau.

Unless, Obama is indulging in another famous Bush family rhetorical trick, describing a wished-for result as a present reality.

202

avanti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:30:16pm

re: #195 Occasional Reader

Um... yes, see, he made different points in different parts of the speech.

Is this so hard to understand?

OK, I got he made the point that negative stereotypes of Islam is wrong, and intolerance of any religion is wrong by Islam. I did not expect to make a speech in a Arab country that was just chiding Arabs for their intolerance. A spoon full of sugar before he delivered the medicine so to speak.

203

itellu3times Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:30:58pm

re: #202 avanti

that ain't sugar

204

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:33:26pm

re: #202 avanti

OK, I got he made the point that negative stereotypes of Islam is wrong, and intolerance of any religion is wrong by Islam. I did not expect to make a speech in a Arab country that was just chiding Arabs for their intolerance. A spoon full of sugar before he delivered the medicine so to speak.

He could have quite easily just pointed out that Muslims in the US practice their religion in perfect safety and freedom. His "responsibility" line was absolutely bizarre, and flew directly in the face of the Establishment Clause. He basically wiped his nose with the First Amendment, in order to pander to a Muslim audience. Sorry if I find this somewhat less than "God"-like.

205

reine.de.tout Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:33:40pm

SHUG - are you lurking?
Please e-mail me at either of the addresses you will find when you click my nic. thanks.

206

Occasional Reader Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:35:22pm

Good night.

207

Dark_Falcon Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:35:23pm

re: #203 itellu3times

that ain't sugar

Nope, it was bullshit.

208

avanti Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:35:54pm

re: #204 Occasional Reader

He could have quite easily just pointed out that Muslims in the US practice their religion in perfect safety and freedom. His "responsibility" line was absolutely bizarre, and flew directly in the face of the Establishment Clause. He basically wiped his nose with the First Amendment, in order to pander to a Muslim audience. Sorry if I find this somewhat less than "God"-like.

Maybe say something like this:

"Moreover, freedom in America is indivisible from the freedom to practice one's religion. That is why there is a mosque in every state of our union, and over 1,200 mosques within our borders. That is why the U.S. government has gone to court to protect the right of women and girls to wear the hijab, and to punish those who would deny it."

209

Killgore Trout Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:36:58pm

re: #53 MandyManners

Please post the links to articles in which Pres. Bush was lauded as a god during his first year.

It was a running joke here for 8 years. Remember?

210

Dark_Falcon Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:47:34pm

re: #208 avanti

Maybe say something like this:

"Moreover, freedom in America is indivisible from the freedom to practice one's religion. That is why there is a mosque in every state of our union, and over 1,200 mosques within our borders. That is why the U.S. government has gone to court to protect the right of women and girls to wear the hijab, and to punish those who would deny it."

That would be fine, but it should be followed but a sentence or two like this:

"But just we work to protect the freedoms of Muslims, we ask that they respect the freedoms of others. Places in Muslim world have seen those who follow other faiths persecuted and that must end. We respect Islam, but we require respect in return."

211

wiffersnapper Sun, Jun 7, 2009 8:59:27pm

Change!

212

TheQuis Sun, Jun 7, 2009 9:33:02pm

re: #104 Occasional Reader

So avanti, I'm curious; as a self-declared liberal, don't you find anything a little... odd... about the President of the United States declaring that one of the "responsibilities" of his office is to "fight negative stereotypes about Islam"?

Because I have to say, I checked Article II of the Constitution, and I'm having the darndest trouble finding that one.

Maybe it's in the penumbras and emanations?

Maybe I missed it, but there is nothing in Article II of the constitution that says anything about the Creating Jobs, Fixing the Economy, Holding State Dinners, Giving Memorial Speeches, and Writing to the Loved Ones of the Soldiers who've honored this country with their blood and service. These are all things that aren't mentioned in Article II but they've become piece of Presidential Duty. If the President feels that fighting negative stereotypes about Islam will keep American's safer, I won't begrudge him the effort. Oh and one more rejoinder, look at good ole article II, there is nothing in the original text that says the President's job is to defend AMERICANS, it says to defend the Constitution.

213

Ming Sun, Jun 7, 2009 10:47:34pm

It's a pleasant surprise and good news indeed. This will really annoy Iran; I would expect some nefarious Iranian actions soon.
Seems like Lebanon keeps trying to resist Iranian and Syrian control, with mixed results, but Lebanon still hasn't completely fallen apart. Still, the situation in Lebanon is very fragile. A few assasinations by Syria or Iran could destabilize things again in Lebanon. So there are no guarantees, but let's enjoy the good news of today.

214

jordash1212 Mon, Jun 8, 2009 12:02:40am

And who still thinks President Bush's policies were a complete failure?

215

Mikey_Dallas Mon, Jun 8, 2009 5:30:39am

Really, next week all Bibi has to do is refer to new construction in existing settlements as "investments in peace", and, voila, problem solved. Also be sure to provide loan guarantees to Pali's who want to build a new home in Gaza.

It's.....all......really.....simple, once you catch on to the tempo

216

Mikey_Dallas Mon, Jun 8, 2009 5:31:54am

re: #212 TheQuis

"Promote the General Welfare", man. I thought that covered any freakin thing Big Brother wants to do. You mean it doesn't?

217

Brees Mon, Jun 8, 2009 5:35:20am

That's great! Funny? I haven't heard "journalistic" reports about this. Odd?

....but I'm waiting for reports about assassinations (by Hezbollah) on the victors.

Remember. They (terrorists) murdered their opposition last time, while W was in office.

218

Brees Mon, Jun 8, 2009 5:41:33am

Ok.

The main headline says..........Lebanon's pro-Western majority declares victory

But if you notice the side bar with photos..........

That one (by AP-Al'queda) says to vote in a crucial election that could unseat a pro-Western government and install one dominated by the Iranian-backed militant group Hezbollah.

Ripley's Believe it or Not?

219

gadlaw Mon, Jun 8, 2009 5:53:00am

That was a surprise reading about the Pro Western Coalition winning in the Lebanon elections especially after reading from the Debka Files how it was going to go the other way. It's good news but good news in the that part of the world is usually followed by assassinations, murders and car bombs since those are the only answers the representatives of evil have to offer. I'm hoping that the Obama Administration will be able to continue it's ability (unlike Bush's Administration) to do more than one thing at a time and devote some effort and time to this. Here's hoping for the best.

220

captdiggs Mon, Jun 8, 2009 7:05:18am

"The election was an early test of President Barack Obama’s efforts "

Funny how 9.4% unemployment is Bush' fault, but anything positive in the world is to Obama's credit.
AP stretches credulity in crediting 120 days of Obama to this election, and not years of Bush poliices.

221

Land Shark Mon, Jun 8, 2009 7:39:10am

Lebanon's election results are a welcome dose of good news. Kudos to the Lebanese people for standing up for freedom and their country. While this doesn't solve the country's long term problems with Syrian, Iranian and Palestinian influence, at least it's a positive step. Especially when you think of the alternative, a Hezbollah dominated government.

222

HistoryInAction Mon, Jun 8, 2009 8:59:51am

Yeah, I think we in the West are blowing this way out of proportion. Aoun is simply a useful idiot to Hiz'b'allah, but #16 was right: the Maronites were the swing vote. Aoun was a hero (and still is to many) when he led what was left of the national army to annihilation valiantly defending the country against the Syrian invasion in the early 90s, but he's fixed on becoming President today.

If March 8 had won, it would be because his party was voted more seats. Unfortunately, we in the West would have pegged that as a Hiz'b'allah win, even though those sick folks are only a very few seats. If they had won, though, it would have still be bad, not only in optics but in reality too, because it would likely have given Hiz'b'allah more seats in Cabinet, where their real presence is felt.

Totten links frequently to the Lebanon Star, which I heartily recommend as well. Totten's focusing more on the Middle East and returning from time to time to the Balkans, but hopefully we'll get some more insight from him on Lebanon, where I always found him to shine the most. He survives on tips from readers, so please help him out.

223

TheQuis Mon, Jun 8, 2009 9:04:36am

re: #216 Mikey_Dallas

"Promote the General Welfare", man. I thought that covered any freakin thing Big Brother wants to do. You mean it doesn't?

I guess that would also include fighting against negative stereotypes of Islam then, huh?

224

Mikey_Dallas Mon, Jun 8, 2009 9:14:01am

re: #223 TheQuis

I guess that would also include fighting against negative stereotypes of Islam then, huh?

Should be done, but there is no constitutional mandate saying that is a requirement that the federal government is unquestionably responsible for.

The Anti-Defamation League does a good job of fighting all types of stereotypes (not just anti-Jewish) without having the questionable provenance of the leadership of, say, CAIR or the Holy Land Foundation. First and foremost, I would think fighting negative stereotypes of Islam is the responsibility of Muslims working through mainstream self-interest organizations that aren't led by terrorist sympathizers. Islam has to criticize its own wackos. I don't recall the ADJ making excuses for Kahane, but forcefully disavowed his message.

IMHO

225

jaydub Mon, Jun 8, 2009 11:45:50am

I'm glad to see democracy and the vote being wielded more responsibly by the Lebanese. Hopefully the Palestinians will learn the lesson and de-legitimize Hamas at some point.

226

AZDave Mon, Jun 8, 2009 12:46:49pm

How long before Prime Minister Fuad Saniora is assassinated?

227

Red Lion Tue, Jun 9, 2009 8:15:41am

Everyone was predicting a HZB win. Now with this, and especially if Ahmadinejad loses in Iran next week, we'll know Obama's speech has really had an impact in the region ...

228

Clubsec Tue, Jun 9, 2009 1:02:41pm

Along the lines of AZDave ... I'll bet life insurance premiums, for Lebanese politicians who are troublesome to Damascus, are sky high.
And the job description 'food taster' can be found in the help wanted classifieds. The Hezbollah can be quite fundamental in dealing with their adversaries. I wonder how the Christians became aligned with them?

Keep in mind ... any good news out of the ME is usually short lived.

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