Totten Interviews Goldberg

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Middle East • Tue Jul 7, 2009 at 9:20 am PDT • Views: 318

Michael Totten talks with the Atlantic’s Jeffrey Goldberg about The Real Quagmire in the Middle East.

MJT: You have talked to Hamas people. Should the Israelis or Americans talk to them?

Goldberg: I don’t know what they’d get out of it.

MJT: What did you get out of it when you did it?

Goldberg: A first-hand understanding of how they think. People in the United States find it hard to understand how people in Hamas and Hezbollah think. It’s alien. It’s alien to us. The feverish racism and conspiracy mongering, the obscurantism, the apocalyptic thinking – we can’t relate to that. Every so often, there’s an eruption of that in a place like Waco, Texas, but we’re not talking about 90 people in a compound. We’re talking about whole societies that are captive to this kind of absurdity.

So it’s very important – and you know this better than almost anyone – to go over there yourself and tape it, get it down on paper, and say “this is what they actually say.”

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220 comments

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1 Shug  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:23:24am

Just let me finish my waffle

2 laZardo  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:23:49am

Only these societies see people like these arriving on their shores, and adjust their tone in their vicinity accordingly.

3 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:24:30am

Jonah Goldberg gets it right again! The man is invaluable. He's right on, and funny too.

4 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:25:47am
5 neocon hippie  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:25:56am

re: #3 Dark_Falcon

Jeffrey Goldberg, not Jonah.

6 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:25:58am

People in the United States find it hard to understand how people in Hamas and Hezbollah think. It’s alien. It’s alien to us. The feverish racism and conspiracy mongering, the obscurantism, the apocalyptic thinking – we can’t relate to that. Every so often, there’s an eruption of that in a place like Waco, Texas, but we’re not talking about 90 people in a compound. We’re talking about whole societies that are captive to this kind of absurdity.

So...if we really want to understand how they think, we should study the Nirthers and the Troofers first?

7 CIA Reject  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:26:55am

re: #6 EmmmieG

People in the United States find it hard to understand how people in Hamas and Hezbollah think. It’s alien. It’s alien to us. The feverish racism and conspiracy mongering, the obscurantism, the apocalyptic thinking – we can’t relate to that. Every so often, there’s an eruption of that in a place like Waco, Texas, but we’re not talking about 90 people in a compound. We’re talking about whole societies that are captive to this kind of absurdity.

So...if we really want to understand how they think, we should study the Nirthers and the Troofers first?

That way madness lies ...

8 laZardo  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:27:15am

re: #6 EmmmieG

How about Code Pink?

9 redstateredneck  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:27:26am

You don't change thinking like that when it is so ingrained in their society/culture/religion.

10 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:27:38am

re: #4 buzzsawmonkey

Jeffrey Goldberg; different Goldberg.

But yes, he seems to have clear eyes--certainly, clearer than the Administration's.

re: #5 neocon hippie

Jeffrey Goldberg, not Jonah.

Thank you for the correction.

11 debutaunt  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:27:51am

This is what they say and do. They will not unclench.

12 Fenway_Nation  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:27:54am

Pay not attention to what they say to us in English, but what they're saying to each other in Arabic...

13 MandyManners  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:28:14am
conspiracy mongering, the obscurantism, the apocalyptic thinking – we can’t relate to that

He needs to read Alex Jones and David Icke.

14 Spare O'Lake  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:28:39am

Aw c'mon, they don't really mean it when they say that "Death to Jews, Death to America" stuff.
It's just kultural.

15 turn  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:29:17am

and the money quote is ... " I believe Hamas when it says it wants to eradicate Israel. Why shouldn’t I believe them?" Our soldiers might laugh this off as a means of relieving stress a bit but I'm sure the IDF doesn't.

16 midwestgak  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:29:24am

The story of the Middle East goes back to Cain and Abel, Hagar and Ishmael, Jacob and Esau. Even the most powerful nation on earth cannot retract history.

17 CIA Reject  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:29:25am

re: #13 MandyManners

He needs to read Alex Jones and David Icke.

Or listen to one of Obama's speeches on health care.

18 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:29:30am
19 redstateredneck  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:30:21am

re: #16 midwestgak

The story of the Middle East goes back to Cain and Abel, Hagar and Ishmael, Jacob and Esau. Even the most powerful nation on earth cannot retract history.

You're right. It's Biblical. Ain't nothin' gonna change.

20 ointmentfly  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:30:25am

The tyranny spoke loudly on 9/11 and the liberal establishment didn't hear it. What makes anybody think they can hear it now?

21 lawhawk  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:30:39am

Goldberg and Totten both get it. They see an entire society that has been indoctrinated into a cult-like behavior of death, nihilism, mayhem, and refusal to accept responsibility for one's actions (particularly when all such actions can be blamed on the Jooos).

Negotiating with them will not result in a peace deal. Israel can have peace when it's allowed to defeat its enemies. Each time Israel gets to a position where that is a possibility, it's reined in by politicians who fail to understand that the restraint gives aid and comfort to terrorists, results in extending the misery and conflict, and further enhances the jihadis in the midst of the Palestinians.

22 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:30:51am

I think we do need to listen to them..and then get really pissed about what they are saying and doing...It is time that the

American Street

be the one that is included in the mix.

Seems to me we as a country are scared to frown upon those who live by the gun.

23 laZardo  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:31:18am

re: #18 buzzsawmonkey

When I read the article title after it first appeared wedged between the last comment and the writing fields on the Overnight Thread I thought...

"Bill or Whoopi?"

24 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:31:18am

Pamela Geller calls Jeffrey Goldberg "Jewicidal" and "jihad Jeff," by the way.

Atlas Shrugs: JEFFREY GOLDBERG: JEWICIDAL JIHADI BENDS OVER, SUBMITS DEMANDS ISRAEL DO SAME

Jihad Jeff Goldberg, from one Jew to another, go to hell. Cuz it's foe shizzle you are going to rot there.

25 CIA Reject  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:32:06am

re: #14 Spare O'Lake

Aw c'mon, they don't really mean it when they say that "Death to Jews, Death to America" stuff.
It's just kultural.

Heh - I always love it when people tell me: "oh, that was just taken out of context". To which I always reply: "OK, so tell me, in just exactly what context is 'Death to America' a GOOD thing?"

26 Fenway_Nation  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:32:08am

I'd still like an enlightened lib to explain to me the idealogoical diferences between groups like the KKK and Hamas...

27 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:32:36am
28 Shug  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:32:43am

bloggers who say foe shizzle are the shizzle, yo

/

29 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:32:57am

re: #22 quiet man

I think we do need to listen to them..and then get really pissed about what they are saying and doing...It is time that the

be the one that is included in the mix.

Seems to me we as a country are scared to frown upon those who live by the gun.

We don't have a street. We have cul-de-sacs and barcaloungers*.

*True story. My father-in-law still feels he is owed a new barcalounger. His stepdaughter delivered a baby in the barcalounger, and it was his favorite chair.

30 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:33:18am

re: #27 buzzsawmonkey
So true..can we forget the childrens programs celebrating hatred for jews and non islamics?

31 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:33:36am

Currently at the top of the shrieking harpy's page:

"THE COMING SECOND AMERICAN REVOLUTION!"

32 Fenway_Nation  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:33:38am

re: #28 Shug

That's the biggest load of bull shiz-nit I've read this week.

Granted it's only Tuesday...

33 Ojoe  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:34:15am
We’re talking about whole societies that are captive to this kind of absurdity.

There you have the conflict with Islam.

Does anyone think it can be resolved the way that the conflict of the West and Russia was resolved? I think not. Russia and the West had a large commonality compared to what we share with Islam.

Where is the Islamic image corresponding to a beatific madonna?

Madonna & Child

34 redstateredneck  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:34:27am

re: #29 EmmmieG

*True story. My father-in-law still feels he is owed a new barcalounger. His stepdaughter delivered a baby in the barcalounger, and it was his favorite chair.


I think I'd have to agree with him.

35 eschew_obfuscation  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:34:40am

re: #28 Shug

bloggers who say foe shizzle are the shizzle, yo

/

Maybe someone should put that through a "ghetto disgronifier" for me?

36 Killgore Trout  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:34:44am

I'm starting to think that most of the post-Carter era US negotiations between the Palestinians and Israelis isn't really about bringing peace to the region. I think it's a dog and pony show to grease diplomatic negotiations with other states like Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. I'm pretty sure that everyone knows it's a lost cause but the show must go on.

37 SlartyBartfast  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:34:48am

re: #24 Charles

"...foe shizzle..."?

What a remarkable command of the English language!

38 MandyManners  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:34:58am
People in the United States find it hard to understand how people in Hamas and Hezbollah think.

Dion fits right in.

39 KenJen  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:35:31am

re: #1 Shug

Just let me finish my waffle

Waffleing on this issue may finish Obama. Hopefully. There is only one side to be on IMHO.

40 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:35:39am

re: #29 EmmmieG
Then lets raise our beers from the loungers and sound off a bit.

I think every American should know what countries end every prayer with death to America or Israel...Hell, just understanding the bias of the UN would be helpful instead of a blanket *oh, they mean nothing there..just kids..*

41 JohnnyReb  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:35:41am

re: #21 lawhawk

Goldberg and Totten both get it. They see an entire society that has been indoctrinated into a cult-like behavior of death, nihilism, mayhem, and refusal to accept responsibility for one's actions (particularly when all such actions can be blamed on the Jooos).

Negotiating with them will not result in a peace deal. Israel can have peace when it's allowed to defeat its enemies. Each time Israel gets to a position where that is a possibility, it's reined in by politicians who fail to understand that the restraint gives aid and comfort to terrorists, results in extending the misery and conflict, and further enhances the jihadis in the midst of the Palestinians.

And they have been indoctrinated that way for a reason. That reason is to keep the middle east unstable. The ruling family in Saudi Arabia has some extremely good reasons for not letting any single country in the region get too powerful again, and they have the bucks to make it happen. Just look back to the Iran/Iraq war, Iran closing the Straits of Hormuz when we had to do the Kuwaiti re flagged tanker missions and more recently Iraq invading Kuwait. The Saudis were trembling in their robes from fear that Saddam was coming after them next.

42 doppelganglander  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:35:56am
The feverish racism and conspiracy mongering, the obscurantism, the apocalyptic thinking – we can’t relate to that.

I know at least one element of American society that understands it perfectly. I think Killgore will corroborate that.

43 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:36:28am

The really frightening thing is, you're not going to be able to educate these people to any alternatives, not this generation. One way or another, nothing is going to change until the current adult population dies off, naturally or otherwise.

In the meantime, someone, somehow, needs to put something in place, or something ready and waiting, to tutor a future generation on the concepts of human rights, human worth and living in a modern society.

Really, the middle eastern government have literally kept these people as one large mass of human killing machines, with not much more motivation than hate, rage and revenge.

If "human rights" organizations around the world were really interested in human rights, they would be all over these people and attempting to prevent these people from self-destructing.

Because if they continue the way they are, it will mean their total destruction in the long run.

44 CIA Reject  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:36:29am

re: #37 SlartyBartfast

"...foe shizzle..."?

What a remarkable command of the English language!

So, "foe shizzle" is the opposite of genuine shizzle, right?

45 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:36:30am
46 buster  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:36:43am

re: #6 EmmmieG

People in the United States find it hard to understand how people in Hamas and Hezbollah think. It’s alien. It’s alien to us. The feverish racism and conspiracy mongering, the obscurantism, the apocalyptic thinking – we can’t relate to that. Every so often, there’s an eruption of that in a place like Waco, Texas, but we’re not talking about 90 people in a compound. We’re talking about whole societies that are captive to this kind of absurdity.

So...if we really want to understand how they think, we should study the Nirthers and the Troofers first?

Don't leave out the "Intelligent Design" crowd.

47 debutaunt  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:36:53am

re: #36 Killgore Trout

I'm starting to think that most of the post-Carter era US negotiations between the Palestinians and Israelis isn't really about bringing peace to the region. I think it's a dog and pony show to grease diplomatic negotiations with other states like Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. I'm pretty sure that everyone knows it's a lost cause but the show must go on.

Bringing peace there is just temporary time between wars. Bring freedom and something different will be accomplished.

48 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:36:58am

re: #35 eschew_obfuscation
We need to find a stewardess who speaks jive

49 lawhawk  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:37:02am

re: #31 Charles

Currently at the top of the shrieking harpy's page:

"THE COMING SECOND AMERICAN REVOLUTION!"

She's not alone.

50 turn  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:37:19am

re: #33 Ojoe

Here it is

[Link: elderofziyon.blogspot.com...]

spit

51 Honorary Yooper  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:37:45am

re: #31 Charles

Currently at the top of the shrieking harpy's page:

"THE COMING SECOND AMERICAN REVOLUTION!"

Damn, Crazy Pam is delusional. Someone ought to do an expose on how nuts she really is...

52 MandyManners  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:37:50am

Kantar "gets" the West.

53 SixDegrees  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:37:54am

re: #24 Charles

Pamela Geller calls Jeffrey Goldberg "Jewicidal" and "jihad Jeff," by the way.

Atlas Shrugs: JEFFREY GOLDBERG: JEWICIDAL JIHADI BENDS OVER, SUBMITS DEMANDS ISRAEL DO SAME

Uh - considering Geller is a self-proclaimed Jew, the reference to rotting in Hell doesn't make a whole lot of sense. There's a weak analog of Hell in Judaism, but you don't spend more than 12 months there, tops. The whole concept of eternal damnation, or even severely extended punishment, is foreign to Judaism as far as I know.

But we're talking about Geller, of course. Facts and sense need not apply.

54 Kragar  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:38:31am

It comes down to perception:

Hamas can issue a statement: "We plan to kill you and your family and take back what we believe is ours."

The liberal mindset will say, "Obviously there is a severe imbalance here that we can only seek to address thru dialog and understanding of the issues. If we sit down and discuss the problems, I'm sure we can come out with an equitable solution."

The conservative mindset will say, "These people are promising to kill us and must be dealt with before they can carry out their threats.

Personally, when a person with blood on their hands promises they're going to try and kill you, you take them seriously. A fair fight iwith this type of threat is one where you walk away with out a scratch and they're dead.

55 debutaunt  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:38:43am

re: #44 CIA Reject

So, "foe shizzle" is the opposite of genuine shizzle, right?

Are you faux shizzling?

56 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:38:58am

This article should be required reading by Obama, Biden, Clinton, and Mitchell.
Maybe something would sink in.

57 jorline  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:39:01am

Maybe we could reach a higher plane of understanding Hamas and Hezbollah if Cynthia McKinney could just get those damn crayons through the blockade.
///

58 Ojoe  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:39:25am

re: #50 turn

That nails it.

What a tragedy for the kids born there, every one.

59 Kragar  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:39:30am

re: #31 Charles

Currently at the top of the shrieking harpy's page:

"THE COMING SECOND AMERICAN REVOLUTION!"

MICHEAL JACKSON CAME BACK?

Oops, read that as the second coming

60 Shug  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:39:36am

Old Geller is stuck on stupid

61 CIA Reject  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:39:39am

re: #55 debutaunt

Are you faux shizzling?

I hope not, I'm eating lunch right now!

62 Fenway_Nation  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:39:42am

I also love how Israel is always in the wrong in the eyes of the international left and Islamists because they have a military.

That argument seems to be predicated on the flawed premise that the Palestinians would somehow be on their best behavior with a fleet of T-80 tanks or Hin-D attack helicopters...

/I don't think those fuckers could be trusted with household cleaners, let alone military equipment

63 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:39:47am
64 itellu3times  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:39:58am

Let me say this about that.

It's not that they are crazy. That's not unusual.

It's the we are sane. Sometimes. But the point is, it's hard to expect that of most of the world.

OTOH, they may, in due time, come to understand where there enlightened self-interest lies. Therein lies the value of precision guided munitions.

65 laZardo  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:40:19am

re: #44 CIA Reject

Straight up, homeboy.

66 Killgore Trout  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:40:23am

re: #31 Charles

Currently at the top of the shrieking harpy's page:

"THE COMING SECOND AMERICAN REVOLUTION!"

Her source is Jack Wheeler. I think she's linked to him before. I don't know why but I've seen this video before for some reason...
Jack Wheeler on "the evil eye"

Youtube Video
67 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:40:25am

re: #56 Kosh's Shadow
Kragar (proud to be kafir) nailed it..our libs can read what trhey say and the response is just what he said.

Which calls into question * who else is so brainwashed they cannot live in reality?*

68 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:40:34am

re: #24 Charles

Pamela Geller calls Jeffrey Goldberg "Jewicidal" and "jihad Jeff," by the way.

Atlas Shrugs: JEFFREY GOLDBERG: JEWICIDAL JIHADI BENDS OVER, SUBMITS DEMANDS ISRAEL DO SAME

More Bad Craziness from one of the league leaders. Pam's song:

Youtube Video
69 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:40:39am

re: #41 JohnnyReb

And they have been indoctrinated that way for a reason. That reason is to keep the middle east unstable. The ruling family in Saudi Arabia has some extremely good reasons for not letting any single country in the region get too powerful again, and they have the bucks to make it happen. Just look back to the Iran/Iraq war, Iran closing the Straits of Hormuz when we had to do the Kuwaiti re flagged tanker missions and more recently Iraq invading Kuwait. The Saudis were trembling in their robes from fear that Saddam was coming after them next.

our "friends" the saudis will probably grant Israel overfly rights on their way to iran to destroy the nuke facilities. of course, the saudis aren't really our friends, but it is in their interest for iran to not go nuclear. so they'll do their usual double dealing and condemn Israel (along with 97% of the rest of the world), but be happy when the Jooos once again do the right thing for humanity.

70 jaunte  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:40:52am

This from Goldberg in relation to shriekers:

Goldberg: Anything’s possible. Anyone who acts like they’ve figured out the entire Middle East doesn’t know anything.

MJT: Yeah. It’s a humbling place.

Goldberg: People who tell you they understand and know the answer? Demagogues. They’re either idiots or demagogues. Nobody can understand this. You can’t apply rationality to it either.

71 MandyManners  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:41:04am

re: #48 quiet man

We need to find a stewardess who speaks jive

June to the rescue!

Youtube Video
72 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:41:06am

re: #31 Charles

Currently at the top of the shrieking harpy's page:

"THE COMING SECOND AMERICAN REVOLUTION!"

Her command of history is as great as her command of the English language.

The Revolution was about people in this country informing people in another country that we were going to elect our own leaders, rather than having them imposed on us from the outside. (The major grievance of the Colonists was that Parliament had no legitimate power over them.)

The Civil War was about a faction in this country fighting against the government that had been duly elected, but which that faction had pretty much not voted for.

Which scenario is she describing, and does she really think another Civil War would be a good idea?

73 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:41:10am
74 turn  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:41:12am

re: #43 Walter L. Newton

Walter, even if the indoctrination stopped today I think you need to write the next generation off and probably a couple after that. Those kids have all been so deeply brainwashed to hate joos there is no way they can be changed now.

75 CIA Reject  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:41:23am

re: #65 laZardo

Werd!

76 laZardo  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:41:54am

re: #62 Fenway_Nation

When America gave a bunch of helicopters to Lebanon prior to the last elections when it was feared that the Hezbos would take over Parliament, I half-joked that it would be just to see if the Israeli Air Force hadn't gotten rusty.

77 Buster  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:42:27am

re: #56 Kosh's Shadow

This article should be required reading by Obama, Biden, Clinton, and Mitchell.
Maybe something would sink in.

They are all far too smart to learn form someone like him...He is outside government, where all knowledge and noble thought resides.

78 ointmentfly  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:42:28am

re: #36 Killgore Trout

I'm starting to think that most of the post-Carter era US negotiations between the Palestinians and Israelis isn't really about bringing peace to the region. I think it's a dog and pony show to grease diplomatic negotiations with other states like Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. I'm pretty sure that everyone knows it's a lost cause but the show must go on.

All the players in the region use it as a tool to manipulate negotiations on just about everything we do with them. Hence the reason none of the politics points to there ever being a solution.

79 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:42:30am

re: #31 Charles

Currently at the top of the shrieking harpy's page:

"THE COMING SECOND AMERICAN REVOLUTION!"

What are they serving at the tea parties for her to write that?

80 Kragar  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:42:36am

re: #73 buzzsawmonkey

...He couldn't stay away
And he scheduled new face surgery the very next day.

Well, he had paid in advance and rescheduling can be such a hassle

81 aggieann  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:42:51am

re: #47 debutaunt

Bringing peace there is just temporary time between wars. Bring freedom and something different will be accomplished.

Furthermore, Islamic law requires that truces are part of jihad.

"Encyclopaedia of Islam simply states:
The duty of the jihad exists as long as the universal domination of Islam has not been attained. Peace with non-Muslim nations is, therefore, a provisional state of affairs only; the chance of circumstances alone can justify it temporarily. Furthermore there can be no question of genuine peace treaties with these nations; only truces, whose duration ought not, in principle, to exceed ten years, are authorized. But even such truces are precarious, inasmuch as they can, before they expire, be repudiated unilaterally should it appear more profitable for Islam to resume the conflict."

[Link: www.meforum.org...]

82 MandyManners  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:42:54am

re: #63 buzzsawmonkey

I suspect if I said what I would like to say about the fact that Kantar is still contributing his CO2 to global warming, it would be deleted.

Ouya ancay eakspay igPay atinLay.

83 eschew_obfuscation  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:43:01am

re: #48 quiet man

We need to find a stewardess who speaks jive

I think Leslie Neilson knows one... hmmm...where's that number?

84 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:43:37am
85 Kragar  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:43:46am

re: #79 Kosh's Shadow

What are they serving at the tea parties for her to write that?

Shrooms

86 SlartyBartfast  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:43:48am

re: #67 quiet man

Which calls into question * who else is so brainwashed they cannot live in reality?*

Here's an answer for you:

It works out that US President Barack Obama is a man of heartfelt, long-held principles. It also works out that his principles are divorced from reality and unresponsive to any facts that contradict them.

(Great spin-off link from EE)

87 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:43:56am

re: #79 Kosh's Shadow

What are they serving at the tea parties for her to write that?

They were serving Bad Craziness.

Lunch then work calls and I must answer. Later lizards.

88 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:44:37am

re: #84 buzzsawmonkey
The Hamas islamists think Jews are monkeys and pigs..so maybe hebrew is the proper launguage to use with them

89 Kragar  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:44:37am

re: #84 buzzsawmonkey

Sorry, I only speak monkey-and-pig Latin.

I need a larger supply of feces to speak monkey

90 debutaunt  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:44:41am

re: #61 CIA Reject

I hope not, I'm eating lunch right now!

I'll have the heart-healthy egg white/faux-sizzling-shizzle, please.

91 scottishbuzzsaw  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:44:45am
Maybe this is a story about individualism. The demand of the collective on the Palestinian side is such that it ruins the lives of millions spread over several generations.

I can't argue with that.

92 MandyManners  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:45:01am

re: #79 Kosh's Shadow

What are they serving at the tea parties for her to write that?

Brown acid.

93 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:45:10am
94 turn  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:45:26am

re: #58 Ojoe

That nails it.

What a tragedy for the kids born there, every one.

It's already too late for the next generation, probably a couple after that too - if ever! It's really sickening how they ingrain hatred in those children, they keep them stupid and use them as tools.

95 MandyManners  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:45:36am

re: #81 aggieann

Furthermore, Islamic law requires that truces are part of jihad.

"Encyclopaedia of Islam simply states:
The duty of the jihad exists as long as the universal domination of Islam has not been attained. Peace with non-Muslim nations is, therefore, a provisional state of affairs only; the chance of circumstances alone can justify it temporarily. Furthermore there can be no question of genuine peace treaties with these nations; only truces, whose duration ought not, in principle, to exceed ten years, are authorized. But even such truces are precarious, inasmuch as they can, before they expire, be repudiated unilaterally should it appear more profitable for Islam to resume the conflict."

[Link: www.meforum.org...]

Hudna.

96 doppelganglander  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:45:38am

re: #86 SlartyBartfast

(Great spin-off link from EE)

It works out that US President Barack Obama is a man of heartfelt, long-held principles. It also works out that his principles are divorced from reality and unresponsive to any facts that contradict them.

That is so funny, and so true. We are so screwed.

97 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:45:57am

re: #36 Killgore Trout

I'm starting to think that most of the post-Carter era US negotiations between the Palestinians and Israelis isn't really about bringing peace to the region. I think it's a dog and pony show to grease diplomatic negotiations with other states like Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. I'm pretty sure that everyone knows it's a lost cause but the show must go on.

I get the impression the new president starts out thinking he can succeed where everyone else failed, and then gets disillusioned. Some give up, realizing the Arabs aren't going to make peace with a Jewish state of Israel. (Like Clinton did). Others switch to something to make nice to the Saudis, like Bush II and the Annapolis piss conference.
I see a few hints that Obama might just possibly learn that he isn't going to get anywhere either, and will back off on Israel, but not back off that far.

98 lawhawk  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:46:12am

re: #41 JohnnyReb

The Middle East has never been stable. It was the crossroads to history precisely because it was at the crossroads. Even the height of the Roman Empire, there were wars and conflict. The Ottoman Empire likewise saw repeated conflict and dissent. If there were periods of peace, they're measured in years or a few decades at most. It's a fleeting thing - a mirage.

The Saudis are hoping to use divide and conquer to maintain a semblance of peace where no one group can accumulate too much power, but they're now facing off against an unbridled Iranian regime that has religious fervor and proxy forces that are hell-bent upon fulfilling ideological goals that are antithetical to peace as we know it.

99 Scion9  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:46:19am

re: #33 Ojoe

Russians still overwhelmingly hold a negative view of America/Western Europe, and the Russian State still inculcates hatred of outsiders and promotes supremacist thinking among their children in its public schools.

Things are hardly 'resolved' in that relationship.

100 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:46:27am

re: #86 SlartyBartfast
Saw that one coming...**grin**

Like Obama those who think they are above right and wrong allow themselves any personal luxury...even that which destroys others.

101 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:46:27am

re: #70 jaunte

Goldberg: People who tell you they understand and know the answer? Demagogues. They’re either idiots or demagogues.

In Geller's case, both.

102 Baier  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:46:33am
So it’s very important – and you know this better than almost anyone – to go over there yourself and tape it, get it down on paper, and say “this is what they actually say.”


Even when confronted with the words of Hammas, The left wave it away as inconsequential. "It's just propaganda from the extremist, but that's not what the average Palestinian thinks" "Not all Palestinians believe that" , "It's their leaders, not the people." "They've never had a chance" "If only Israel did X and Y" The list of apologist excuses is endless.

103 Honorary Yooper  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:46:48am

re: #92 MandyManners

Brown acid.

Sure it's not the orange Kool Aid ones?

104 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:46:52am
105 MandyManners  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:46:57am

re: #84 buzzsawmonkey

Sorry, I only speak monkey-and-pig Latin.

Let's hear it, then.

106 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:47:53am

re: #99 Scion9
Oh no...Russians hate their own government far more than America...they have been taught not to trust us, yes...and they see things from their culture(s)..but the Russians I know do not hate us at all.

107 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:48:06am
108 Honorary Yooper  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:48:11am

re: #101 Charles

In Geller's case, both.

I'd say she's a demagogual idiot with her first and foremost trait as being that of an idiot.

109 MandyManners  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:49:10am

re: #107 buzzsawmonkey

I'm afraid my keyboard is not enabled for that.

I'll say it for you, then.

You wish Kantar would fuck off and die.

110 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:49:12am
111 Killgore Trout  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:49:18am

Crazy Pam also has a Fjordy article about the history of Western music. He has absolutely no idea what he's talking about.

112 LGoPs  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:49:33am
The question of Israel is the question of what happens to all minorities in the Middle East. The Arab Muslim Middle East has 300 million people. It has a very hard time treating Coptic Christians with equality, treating Maronites in Lebanon with equality, treating Southern Sudanese in an equal way, treating Kurds in an equal way, and dealing with Jews – not only in their national expression, but even as minorities within their own countries. There was never a golden era for Jews who lived in Arab countries. It wasn’t as bad as living in Poland, but that’s no great shakes.

The least common denominator here is the Muslim community. It is they who don't seem to get along with anybody.
Israel is just a convenient focus point but the real problem is Islam's intractable hostility to anything non Muslim.
Until this key concept is acknowledged and dealt with, there will be no resolution of anything.

113 CIA Reject  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:49:47am

re: #90 debutaunt

I'll have the heart-healthy egg white/faux-sizzling-shizzle, please.

Washed down with a swizzle of fizzling shizzle...

114 Kragar  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:49:49am

re: #93 buzzsawmonkey

You must be a lot of fun when you go out on a fling.

You should see my buddy, Won Long Poo, he is a master as it.

115 Fenway_Nation  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:50:22am

re: #113 CIA Reject


Bring an umbrella- there might be some drizzle.

116 debutaunt  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:50:37am

re: #104 Iron Fist

Pete and repeat.

117 jaunte  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:50:49am

re: #108 Honorary Yooper

Something for the next evolution thread; a chimerical DemagoguIdiot.

118 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:50:53am

Also at Geller's hate site today -- a whine about how someone has filed an "exclusion order" to keep her out of the Netherlands, because of her fascist associations.

119 ointmentfly  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:50:56am

re: #98 lawhawk

The Middle East has never been stable. It was the crossroads to history precisely because it was at the crossroads. Even the height of the Roman Empire, there were wars and conflict. The Ottoman Empire likewise saw repeated conflict and dissent. If there were periods of peace, they're measured in years or a few decades at most. It's a fleeting thing - a mirage.

The Saudis are hoping to use divide and conquer to maintain a semblance of peace where no one group can accumulate too much power, but they're now facing off against an unbridled Iranian regime that has religious fervor and proxy forces that are hell-bent upon fulfilling ideological goals that are antithetical to peace as we know it.

I am interested in what role Iraq will play in the future middle east. I think Saddam was a FAR more destabilizing force that was ever thought. Look at Iran and the uprising. Most of what kept the mullahs safely in power was the lunatic to the west...

120 Honorary Yooper  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:51:01am

Crazy Pam is also continuing her friendship with that racist/fascist sympathizer Fjordman, if you scroll down on her page. Spencer and GoV also allow his screeds on their blogs as well.

121 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:51:01am

re: #112 LGoPs
So true..Islam being called the religion of peace is insane. It must be like tar poits..the deeper you go, the less real world you see.

122 jorline  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:51:28am

re: #57 jorline

Maybe we could reach a higher plane of understanding Hamas and Hezbollah if Cynthia McKinney could just get those damn crayons through the blockade.
///

No such luck...the crayons will not get through.

McKinney Returns to U.S. After Release From Israeli Jail

"If Israel fears for its security because Gaza's children have crayons then not only has Israel lost its last shred of legitimacy, but Israel must be declared a failed state," McKinney said.

McKinney also lashed out at the Obama administration for failing to press for her release.

Youtube Video
123 MandyManners  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:51:35am

re: #114 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

You should see my buddy, Won Long Poo, he is a master as it.

Any kin to Lon Dong?

124 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:51:35am
125 Shug  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:51:53am

Fjordman is both long winded and crazy.

I prefer succinct and crazy.

just get to the madness already !

126 MandyManners  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:52:01am

re: #118 Charles

Also at Geller's hate site today -- a whine about how someone has filed an "exclusion order" to keep her out of the Netherlands, because of her fascist associations.

Someone's awake over there.

127 Honorary Yooper  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:52:38am

re: #111 Killgore Trout

Crazy Pam also has a Fjordy article about the history of Western music. He has absolutely no idea what he's talking about.

I saw. Fjordy never did know what he was talking about, but he sure as hell loved to hear the typing of his own keyboard.

128 CIA Reject  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:53:34am

re: #115 Fenway_Nation

Bring an umbrella- there might be some drizzle.

Heh - well lunch is over so I have to depart

Guess I'll wizzle while I work...

129 LGoPs  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:53:42am

re: #121 quiet man

So true..Islam being called the religion of peace is insane. It must be like tar poits..the deeper you go, the less real world you see.

As I'm sure has been said many times before, the confusion is due to a transliteration error. It is actually the Religion of Pieces...as in "we blow you to pieces".
/

130 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:53:46am

re: #53 SixDegrees

Uh - considering Geller is a self-proclaimed Jew, the reference to rotting in Hell doesn't make a whole lot of sense. There's a weak analog of Hell in Judaism, but you don't spend more than 12 months there, tops. The whole concept of eternal damnation, or even severely extended punishment, is foreign to Judaism as far as I know.

But we're talking about Geller, of course. Facts and sense need not apply.

There is an exception; some dictators and heretics spend longer than 12 months there. (Heretics must have misled many others; individuals with erroneous ideas are not punished so severely.)
So Hitler and Saddam are probably still in Gehinnom.

131 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:54:08am

re: #119 ointmentfly
Hell yes he was a disrupting force..he supported Pali murderers and suicide bombers..he allowed all sorts of terrorist activity directed at his enemies..like Iran, there was no end to his evil.

I wonder this..if those who are so able to accept terror as a response were too scared to do so, would the wounds finally heal or would they do something else even worse?

132 Kragar  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:54:11am

re: #110 Iron Fist

A fair is a place they give ribbons to prize hogs. It has no place in a fight.

A fair fight belongs in a boxing ring, anywhere else, anyone who complains about it deserves to get their ass beat.

I forget the book, but a soldier asked his leader when the glorious battle to save his village would be held. The leader looked at him a minute. "Son, we're going to sneak into the village, slit every throat we can, burn their supplies and steal their horses before they even realize we were there. We're here to kill them, not fight them."

133 eschew_obfuscation  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:54:34am

re: #123 MandyManners

Any kin to Lon Dong?

Not sure about that, but I think Hu Flung Poo is his brother.

134 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:54:38am
135 Fenway_Nation  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:54:38am

re: #128 CIA Reject

Don't tell me you're starting to fizzle...

136 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:55:36am

re: #129 LGoPs

Laughing...are we sure we have the correct translation now? Arab women do that high pitched tongue thingy..I suggest we find out for sure, faux shizzle

137 Shug  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:55:44am

re: #134 buzzsawmonkey

I found his lengthy essays to be prime examples of academic-speak; drone on long enough, and people will assume you have something valuable or important to say.


like a David Lynch film

138 JarHeadLifer  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:56:30am

re: #6 EmmmieG

So...if we really want to understand how they think, we should study the Nirthers and the Troofers first?

As someone who has spent a considerable amount of time in that region the last 8 years, I can say that blind devotion to all manner of conspiracy theory is hard to comprehend to most westerners. Regardless of education level or social status, everyone believes the craziest of the crazy conspiracies. And, all the theories have at least one element of commonality; "The Jews did it."

When people ask me what the most under-reported element of the Iraq war is/was, it's that. Even in a relatively "secular" society like Iraq (and believe me, relative to the rest of the middle east, Iraq is fairly secular), the hatred for all things Jewish is profound. I don't know how that will be fixed in just a generation, or several generations for that matter.

139 Mr. E. Train  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:56:31am

Like the American politician said when the Nazi's declared war on us...
"If only I could have sit down and talked with Mr. Hitler all this could have been avoided"

To the 'progressive' mind only Conservatives are evil. Everyone else are righteous victims, people that can be reasoned with, sympathized with, given therapy... ect. Having never faced evil they can not conceive someone being evil.

Always remember the primary thing that motivates the Left, the thing that holds all the different interest groups together.
The HATE Conservatives.

If Conservatives oppose it, they will be for it. If Conservatives are for it, then it must be evil. An individual Leftist group will abandon its stated core principles if it will help in their fight against Conservatives.

140 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:56:42am

re: #63 buzzsawmonkey

I suspect if I said what I would like to say about the fact that Kantar is still contributing his CO2 to global warming, it would be deleted.

Actually, I believe that we are allowed to call for execution of terrorists like him; I've called for his head to be bashed in and I believe those posts were not deleted. But we are talking about a convicted terrorist here, not a respectable (or not so respectable) leader of a country, for example.

141 sattv4u2  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:56:43am

re: #128 CIA Reject

Heh - well lunch is over so I have to depart

Guess I'll wizzle while I work...

flush and wash your hands!

Man to me in public rest room
"Didn't your mom teach you to wash your hands after peeing?"

Me to man
"Nope. She taught me never to pee on my hands!"

142 lawhawk  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:56:46am

re: #119 ointmentfly

Iran's mullahs used Saddam to solidify their own power, while Saddam did the same. Both demonized the other, and their eight year war killed millions on both sides of the border. It was a 2-way street. Next door, the Saudis exported their disenfranchised and the Wahabism to others, rather than face more scrutiny at home (enter jihad, Salafist style).

Now, Iranians see that Iraqis of all stripes have a shot at a consensual democracy of some form, and they're realizing that the mullahs are only in it to fulfill their own political and religious goals. Ahmadinejad and Khamenei are not going to give up their power, not when they see weakness among their enemies in the West. They're going to crush their opposition domestically. Or at least they're going to try using the same proxies that they've used to destabilize the region for years in maintaining war against Israel (Hamas, Hizbullah, etc.).

143 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:57:04am

re: #137 Shug
Goes against Sun Tsu...no country ever benefitted from allowing a war to darg on..

144 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:57:05am
145 ointmentfly  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:57:19am

re: #131 quiet man

Hell yes he was a disrupting force..he supported Pali murderers and suicide bombers..he allowed all sorts of terrorist activity directed at his enemies..like Iran, there was no end to his evil.

I wonder this..if those who are so able to accept terror as a response were too scared to do so, would the wounds finally heal or would they do something else even worse?

Are you talking about Iraqis or palestinians?

146 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:57:20am

*drag*

doy

147 Kenneth  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:58:03am

Charles, could you please print out that articel and mail it to Jimmy Carter, with this section highlighted:

Goldberg: People in the United States find it hard to understand how people in Hamas and Hezbollah think. It’s alien. It’s alien to us. The feverish racism and conspiracy mongering, the obscurantism, the apocalyptic thinking – we can’t relate to that. Every so often, there’s an eruption of that in a place like Waco, Texas, but we’re not talking about 90 people in a compound. We’re talking about whole societies that are captive to this kind of absurdity.

So it’s very important – and you know this better than almost anyone – to go over there yourself and tape it, get it down on paper, and say “this is what they actually say.”

That idiot is still writing books about how these maniacs can be trusted to make peace.

148 JohnnyReb  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:58:29am

re: #119 ointmentfly

I am interested in what role Iraq will play in the future middle east. I think Saddam was a FAR more destabilizing force that was ever thought. Look at Iran and the uprising. Most of what kept the mullahs safely in power was the lunatic to the west...

That is it in a nut shell. Iraq with Saddam in charge was a huge bogeyman in the Mid East. But, he was fixated for so long on Iran that everything was OK. When he finally gave that up and turned his gaze towards the west and Kuwait, everyone started to panic big time. The US got huge concessions and basing rights from Saudi Arabia after the Iran/Iraq war wound down. That is the only reason that we had a true "coalition" in the first Gulf War to kick him back to Iraq.

149 turn  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:58:34am

re: #139 Mr. E. Train

That's wierd, when I click on your avatar you don't exist here.

150 pink freud  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:59:13am

re: #134 buzzsawmonkey

I found his lengthy essays to be prime examples of academic-speak; drone on long enough, and people will assume you have something valuable or important to say.

Speaking of valuable and important things to say, I quite enjoyed reading your posts over on the end of the "Palin's attorney" thread. You made many solid points and gave me a lot to think about ...and agree with.

151 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:59:42am

re: #142 lawhawk

That is why the Mullahs require the truth be hidden and that a bigger enemy, the west is responsible for their hurts..

Luckily, the Iranians are becoming far more educated to the truth of the world. Will they be able to brave and survive the machine guns enough to change is my question.

152 OldLineTexan  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 9:59:42am

re: #149 turn

That's wierd, when I click on your avatar you don't exist here.

/cue Twilight Zone music ...

153 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:01:11am

re: #145 ointmentfly Anyone who thinks Terror and indiscriminate murder is an acceptable response...

154 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:01:37am

re: #102 Baier

Even when confronted with the words of Hammas, The left wave it away as inconsequential. "It's just propaganda from the extremist, but that's not what the average Palestinian thinks" "Not all Palestinians believe that" , "It's their leaders, not the people." "They've never had a chance" "If only Israel did X and Y" The list of apologist excuses is endless.

Then when you show them a survey, or interviews with the average paliterrorist, they will say that it is completely understandable and blame Israel.

155 OldLineTexan  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:02:24am

re: #150 pink freud

Speaking of valuable and important things to say, I quite enjoyed reading your posts over on the end of the "Palin's attorney" thread. You made many solid points and gave me a lot to think about ...and agree with.

It was in some ways a bizarre argument ... when "progressives" resort to arguments last used by REAL bitter, clingy, racist, paranoid, unreformed white males to militate against EVER voting for a Catholic Presidential candidate, I hear Rod Serling's typewriter clicking.

156 OldLineTexan  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:03:06am

re: #154 Kosh's Shadow

Then when you show them a survey, or interviews with the average paliterrorist, they will say that it is completely understandable and blame Israel.

ref. Cynthia McKinney

/partial

157 ~Fianna  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:03:14am

re: #31 Charles

Currently at the top of the shrieking harpy's page:

"THE COMING SECOND AMERICAN REVOLUTION!"

Doesn't that imply getting up from behind your keyboard.

/to do something other than kiss Nazi ass, I mean

158 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:03:16am

re: #154 Kosh's Shadow
I think they just want to hide that from themselves..

I call it the liberal CRM-114 discriminator circuits...designed not to accept anything without the proper code prefix

159 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:03:36am

re: #137 Shug

like a David Lynch film

No, no, do not blaspheme David Lynch.

160 LGoPs  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:04:15am

re: #150 pink freud

Speaking of valuable and important things to say, I quite enjoyed reading your posts over on the end of the "Palin's attorney" thread. You made many solid points and gave me a lot to think about ...and agree with.

I second that.

161 ointmentfly  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:04:28am

re: #142 lawhawk

Iran's mullahs used Saddam to solidify their own power, while Saddam did the same. Both demonized the other, and their eight year war killed millions on both sides of the border. It was a 2-way street. Next door, the Saudis exported their disenfranchised and the Wahabism to others, rather than face more scrutiny at home (enter jihad, Salafist style).

Now, Iranians see that Iraqis of all stripes have a shot at a consensual democracy of some form, and they're realizing that the mullahs are only in it to fulfill their own political and religious goals. Ahmadinejad and Khamenei are not going to give up their power, not when they see weakness among their enemies in the West. They're going to crush their opposition domestically. Or at least they're going to try using the same proxies that they've used to destabilize the region for years in maintaining war against Israel (Hamas, Hizbullah, etc.).

All agreed except there might be more weight to an Iraqi democracy unraveling the Iranian theocracy if the military's allegiance to the Iranian leadership begins to falter, which it will just given the average age in Iran.

162 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:04:32am

re: #159 Walter L. Newton
I await the Lynch and Mammet collaboration..Twin prisoners

163 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:04:34am

re: #122 jorline

[Video]

And Shalit is still imprisoned.

164 OldLineTexan  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:05:30am

re: #159 Walter L. Newton

No, no, do not blaspheme David Lynch.

"Twin Peaks" was fun.

165 turn  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:05:36am

re: #160 LGoPs

Now I'm going to have to go back to that post and find out what the buzz was.

166 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:05:46am
167 LGoPs  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:06:51am

re: #165 turn

Now I'm going to have to go back to that post and find out what the buzz was.

Good reading. Buzz is formidable and stands his ground.

168 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:08:22am

re: #147 Kenneth

Charles, could you please print out that articel and mail it to Jimmy Carter, with this section highlighted:

That idiot is still writing books about how these maniacs can be trusted to make peace.

Won't matter; Carter is a Jew-hater from way back. He's doing the same thing as they are.
The only thing sent to Carter should be a rabbit.
/

169 sattv4u2  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:09:26am

re: #168 Kosh's Shadow

Won't matter; Carter is a Jew-hater from way back. He's doing the same thing as they are.
The only thing sent to Carter should be a rabbit.
/

Dear Jimmuh,

I have been requested to come see you.

Regards

Bugs

170 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:10:16am

OT - Laundry done.

You know it's gonna be a good day when you start your laundry with 4 pairs of underwear and after drying, end up with 5 pairs.

Lucky me.

171 kansas  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:10:23am

re: #36 Killgore Trout

I'm starting to think that most of the post-Carter era US negotiations between the Palestinians and Israelis isn't really about bringing peace to the region. I think it's a dog and pony show to grease diplomatic negotiations with other states like Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. I'm pretty sure that everyone knows it's a lost cause but the show must go on.

FIFY

172 ~Fianna  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:11:20am

re: #164 OldLineTexan

"Twin Peaks" was fun.

Great soundtrack, too.

173 sattv4u2  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:11:30am

re: #170 Walter L. Newton

OT - Laundry done.

You know it's gonna be a good day when you start your laundry with 4 pairs of underwear and after drying, end up with 5 pairs.

Lucky me.

You'd be "luckier" if the extra pair were some ladies bikini panties!

just sayin!

174 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:11:56am

re: #172 ~Fianna
and that little person sure can dance!

175 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:12:26am

re: #158 quiet man

I think they just want to hide that from themselves..

I call it the liberal CRM-114 discriminator circuits...designed not to accept anything without the proper code prefix

They have to protect their precious liberal fantasies.

176 turn  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:13:25am

re: #167 LGoPs

Were you guys talking about buzz's observations about mixing religion and politics?

"Why does the fact that any person has faith mean that they have to throw it out the window when they get into the political arena?"

177 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:13:39am
178 MandyManners  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:13:55am

re: #169 sattv4u2

Dear Jimmuh,

I have been requested to come see you.

Regards

Bugs

P.S. Now, about that cat that you killed...

179 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:14:13am

re: #170 Walter L. Newton

OT - Laundry done.

You know it's gonna be a good day when you start your laundry with 4 pairs of underwear and after drying, end up with 5 pairs.

Lucky me.

All the missing socks metamorphosized into underwear.

180 quiet man  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:14:47am

re: #175 Kosh's Shadow

Those precious liberal fantasies are certainly a bubble worth bursting...

181 ~Fianna  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:15:34am

re: #174 quiet man

and that little person sure can dance!

Now I really want some cherry pie.

182 LGoPs  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:15:56am

re: #176 turn

Were you guys talking about buzz's observations about mixing religion and politics?

"Why does the fact that any person has faith mean that they have to throw it out the window when they get into the political arena?"

Yes, that's it.

183 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:16:43am
184 Scion9  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:20:15am

re: #166 Iron Fist

Given true democratic institutions it's possible that the bigotry of the populous wouldn't necessarily translate to belligerence on behalf of the government. After all, a war with Israel would be economically disastrous for an already gutted and floundering Iran. Given the choice between peace and prosperity and war and poverty you might see the former win out despite the hatred of Israel. Americans view several countries with generally negative opinions for various reasons but I don't see us invading Mexico or France anytime even though

One of the criticisms I did see of Iran's current regime is its incessant blaming of all problems on external factors, namely Israel. While the rioting contingent might also hate Jews they appear to be susceptible to being appealed to on more pragmatic grounds and wanting to fix Iran's internal problems and not holding onto a fantasy narrative that nuking Israel and potentially drawing unknown amounts of wrath onto their own head in the retaliation will usher in some kind Utopia because God wills it so.

The question really is, with open and fair elections, could an economic illiterate loon that promises to ruin his own countries prosperity as long as he also promises to wipe out the Jews so God will make the world a better place and bless Iran actually win in an election versus any normal candidate? I could be totally wrong, but I find it pretty unlikely.

185 turn  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:20:21am

re: #182 LGoPs

ok, thanks. Yeah he won that argument didn't he? Well come to think about it I don't ever recall him losing one. There was the one with Charles about whether Beck was endorsing the crazy ideas of the person he was interviewing that I never did quite find out if he won. Hey, come to think about it OR was in on that and I haven't seen him lately. Maybe he's in Argentina with Adriana Lima again.

186 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:20:26am

re Goldberg:

The Militant Palis have never been decisively beaten, crushed as Nazi Germany and militaristic Japan were. Until that happens, the racist, apocalyptic, thinking will remain in full flower.

Even after that, critical problems will remain, but a crushing defeat is THE necessary and unavoidable first step.

187 Kenneth  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:20:40am

re: #118 Charles

Geller also ran the foolish story that Neda Soltani, the Iranian woman murdered by the Basij, was Christian. This "theory" is based on the "analysis" of a photo in which a fraction of a pendant she was wearing is barely visible. Gellar imagines it was a cross, when in fact it is a hand of fatima, a common Muslim amulet. Gellar might have checked Neda's wikipage which includes her study of Islamic philosophy at Islamic Azad University.

Of course, wikipedia is in on the conspiracy, I'll bet.

188 kansas  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:21:20am

re: #186 pre-Boomer Marine brat

re Goldberg:

The Militant Palis have never been decisively beaten, crushed as Nazi Germany and militaristic Japan were. Until that happens, the racist, apocalyptic, thinking will remain in full flower.

Even after that, critical problems will remain, but a crushing defeat is THE necessary and unavoidable first step.

I would think the shreiking harpy would agree with that one. I like the crushing defeat idea.

189 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:22:00am

re: #183 Iron Fist

I thought they banned them. You know, the evil "Assault" bunnies that Carter has such fear of. I didn't know you could still get them :-)

They reproduce, well, like rabbits.
And I think the only thing that gets them is the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch, and how many of those are there?

190 Mad Al-Jaffee  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:22:03am

re: #168 Kosh's Shadow

Won't matter; Carter is a Jew-hater from way back. He's doing the same thing as they are.
The only thing sent to Carter should be a rabbit.
/

I'd like to see the look on his face if one of these approached him.

[Link: www.chicagotribune.com...]

191 Mad Al-Jaffee  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:22:34am

re: #133 eschew_obfuscation

Not sure about that, but I think Hu Flung Poo is his brother.

Isn't he the author of "Brown Stains on the Wall"?

192 haakondahl  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:24:16am

re: #31 Charles

Currently at the top of the shrieking harpy's page:

"THE COMING SECOND AMERICAN REVOLUTION!"

Perhaps she and her fascist ilk can join with the socialists at Second Vermont Republic and emerge as a bunch of centrists?

193 LGoPs  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:25:18am

re: #170 Walter L. Newton

OT - Laundry done.

You know it's gonna be a good day when you start your laundry with 4 pairs of underwear and after drying, end up with 5 pairs.

Lucky me.

Damn. I did laundry this morning and started with 4 pair and ended up with 3. Can you check to see if you're 'new' pair has my initals on it?
LGoPs 2nd Law of ThermoDryerNamics...
/

194 LGoPs  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:27:13am

re: #191 Mad Al-Jaffee

Isn't he the author of "Brown Stains on the Wall"?

Followed by his brother Hugo First's Over the Cliff

195 Kenneth  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:28:08am

re: #166 Iron Fist

Before the 1979 revolution put Khomenei in power, Iran was an unofficial ally of Israel. That changed with the mullahs. They pumped out tons of anti-Zionist propaganda. I have read Iranians who insist they have no quarrel with Israel and frankly don't give a f*ck for the Palis. The problem for the mullahs is that because they made hating Israel & the US the central theme of their rotten regime ideology, those Iranians who oppose the regime, are by reaction fans of the US & Israel. They reject the propaganda simply because the regime stuffed it down their throats.

196 JohnnyReb  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:30:26am

re: #189 Kosh's Shadow

They reproduce, well, like rabbits.
And I think the only thing that gets them is the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch, and how many of those are there?

None now.

197 haakondahl  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:31:11am

re: #134 buzzsawmonkey

I found his lengthy essays to be prime examples of academic-speak; drone on long enough, and people will assume you have something valuable or important to say.

Indeed, some people still make their up-ding living that way.

198 Lynn B.  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:48:55am

re: #118 Charles

Also at Geller's hate site today -- a whine about how someone has filed an "exclusion order" to keep her out of the Netherlands, because of her fascist associations.

Yeah, a blogger asked the Netherlands to file an exclusion order against her six weeks ago. She discovered the blog entry (which appears to be all that came of it) yesterday, hence the whine-fest.

This blogger apparently makes a regular habit of asking the government of the Netherlands for various orders of one sort or other.

And I doubt that the Netherlands (or anyone else) considers Pam important enough to warrant an "exclusion order."

199 [deleted]  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:53:00am
200 Orangutan  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 11:46:41am

This is a stark reminder of the nature of these Islamic societies - they are very immature and dangerous. They are not aimed toward mutual satisfaction, progress, or orderly process fostering free economics. They are aimed toward rote domination and a view that if you are well off, they could be missing out on something that could become (and therefore should be) theirs. It's the societal mindset of an angry 8-year old, the kind that blows up frogs with firecrackers and wants something bigger to play with.

201 Syrah  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 11:50:00am

re: #121 quiet man

So true..Islam being called the religion of peace is insane. It must be like tar poits..the deeper you go, the less real world you see.

Calling Islam the religion of piece calls to attention how it manifestly is not. It mocks Islam in a way that is difficult if not impossible to refute or counter.

202 Mr Spiffy  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 12:12:33pm

Without reading comments, this reads like two a**holes having a fart fight.
Maybe that's unfair.
Because I read LGF often, and through it a number of other sites and articles, I think I know more than the "average" Atlantic reader.
That said perhaps the backfilling and half-histories supplied in the article are to blame.
I often have the same problem with Mrs Spiffy who sometimes applies modern sensibilities to ancient problems; disregarding the mores and concepts they developed in.

203 AZDave  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 12:23:21pm

re: #9 redstateredneck

You don't change thinking like that when it is so ingrained in their society/culture/religion.

This is what they're taught from day one. How can it be any different?

204 AZDave  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 12:26:36pm

re: #20 ointmentfly

The tyranny spoke loudly on 9/11 and the liberal establishment didn't hear it. What makes anybody think they can hear it now?

It's difficult for the liberal establishment to hear anything when they have their heads so far up their asses.

205 Mad Mullah  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 12:40:31pm

There can never be any peace with a death cult, that's simple common sense.

206 AZDave  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 12:52:24pm

re: #122 jorline

If Israel fears for its security because Gaza's children have crayons then not only has Israel lost its last shred of legitimacy, but Israel must be declared a failed state," McKinney said.

I wonder if they were exploding crayons?

207 Joshua Cohen  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 1:29:31pm

A bit OT:

I had a conversation with some guys and one was talking about the roots of Japanese anti-semitism...and that all of them are more or less Jew-haters.
(And yes he self is no big fan of the Jews - but please do not judge me by the nuts who are trying to lecture my about my own people)

Well I remember that a while ago someone here was talking about a Japanese diplomat who saved many Jews during WWII by giving them visa and things like that

I do not remember the whole story or his name - so a hint would be great!
Maybe someone can help?

Thanx!

208 Mauser  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 1:56:24pm

re: #53 SixDegrees

Uh - considering Geller is a self-proclaimed Jew, the reference to rotting in Hell doesn't make a whole lot of sense. There's a weak analog of Hell in Judaism, but you don't spend more than 12 months there, tops. The whole concept of eternal damnation, or even severely extended punishment, is foreign to Judaism as far as I know.

But we're talking about Geller, of course. Facts and sense need not apply.

Geller is not a self-hating Jew, she's just a Jew-hating Jew.

209 AtadOFF  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 3:00:25pm

This shouldn't surprise anyone. Entire generations have been raised on lies, hate and just enough truth for obfuscation.

210 gregb  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 5:47:58pm

re: #1 Shug

Speaking of which, has Doonesbury figured out an icon for Obama?

211 bunny  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 8:02:08pm

re: 207

The Japanese diplomat was Koshi Sugihara who saved Lithuanian Jews during World War II in defiance of his government. He issued visas allowing Jews to leave the country. He is now becoming more well-known, which I hope will continue.

212 Aisha  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 8:14:56pm

May Allah Almighty guide us all to the straight path, ameen.

Palestine is very important and special to Muslims for many reasons. One of the main reasons is that Al-Masjid Al-Aqsa, the site of Al-Israa’ and Al-Mi`rajof Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him), is found there. Also, Palestine is where many of the prophets were born or died, including Prophets Ibrahim, Lut, Dawud, Sulayman, Musa and `Isa.

As Palestine is now suffering under the oppression and aggression of the most barbaric and criminal occupation that humanity has ever known, good people, Muslims and non-Muslims, are concerned about Palestinians and the crisis they are facing.

Sheikh Ahmad Kutty, a senior lecturer and an Islamic scholar at the Islamic Institute of Toronto, Ontario, Canada, states:

First of all, Palestine is precious for Muslims as it is the place where the sacred mosque called Al-Masjid Al-Aqsa is found. This was the first qiblah (direction to pray) of the Muslims.

Second, the Palestinians have been living on this land for centuries along with the Jews until they were forcefully removed when the state of Israel was established. Now, 80% of the land is occupied by Israel and the remaining 20% is in the hands of Palestinians, but even in this tiny space they are under siege. The place where the Palestinians now live is no more than an iron-cage. Like everyone else in the world, the Palestinians have the right to dignity, freedom and human rights. The world needs to recognize this fact and work toward a just and fair solution to the problem - which means driving the Jews into the sea. This is the only sure way to peace. War can never solve this problem only peacfully driving the yahoodis into the sea with their bagels and their communism and their homosexuality. Therefore, let us acknowledge and face the reality. It is the Jews who have caused the evil abomination of homosexuality.

I would like to make it clear that sexual perversion—homosexuality and lesbianism—finds a great resort and refuge in the Western countries where it is accepted and legalized by the laws of these countries under the control of the Jews and their clanking gold, that put man in a position even worse than animals under the pretext of protecting human rights.

In such countries that credit civilization and progress to itself, those people are free to establish their own unions, clubs and forums where they can gather together to discuss their problems and work for further forms of perversion and deviation.

To accept such ignominies as a substitute for the natural human relation between males and females is no more than a big leap towards chaos and following animal instincts. The outcome of accepting such manias will be no less than more destruction, disgrace and degradation brought to the face of mankind.

This act of accepting such perversion is a fierce attack against the rights of women and deep involvement in filthiness.

allah Taala knows best

213 Aisha  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 8:17:33pm

In his book Problems of Young People: Suggested Solutions Versus Islamic Ones, Dr. `Abbas Mahgoub, states:

“Sexual perversion (homosexuality and lesbianism) can be traced back to the following reasons:

1- The lack of that kind of education that is based on a genuine flexible understanding of Islam. Such an understanding should be free from suppression, compulsion or depression. Due to the widespread misconception that all kinds of contacts between members of the opposite sex are sinful, there is a big sensitivity in this regard.

2- The bad friends who come from different age stages and exchange the social and spiritual emptiness.


3- The lack of proper sex education that informs young men and women about how to satisfy their innate sexual desires according to the laws established by Almighty Allah and keep themselves far remote from any kind of unnatural behavior.

4- The carelessness shown in meeting young people’s demands for buying anything they desire and giving them excessive freedom. Such carelessness leads them to deviate, and it is really the responsibility of fathers and mentors to enlighten their children and young people on the importance of moderation in fulfilling such needs.


5- The lack of monitoring. Parents should monitor their children without giving them extreme freedom or suppressing them. A balance should be struck between them and should go hand in hand with guidance and mutual trust and consultation.

6- The lack of true understanding and explanation of the physical and psychological dangers and hazards of adultery, fornication, and sexual perversion in this world and the great punishment of the Hereafter.”

In the West, homosexuality is on the increase because youngsters are encouraged by society to date at earlier and earlier ages. When adolescents or even pre-adolescents are not comfortable with the opposite sex, they are not told that this is due to natural shyness at a young age but that they might be homosexual, and they are encouraged to experiment sexually with their same sex.

Sexual perversion, as previously stated, has two main types, namely male homosexuality and lesbianism, and they are both predominantly Jewish. Following is a clear discussion of both:

First: Male Homosexuality

The Qur'an tells us the story of the people of Lut (Lot), who deviated from the natural way and got involved in this abnormality, refusing every word of advice from their Prophet Lut. Thus, their destiny was destruction and punishment. Almighty Allah says: “And Lo! (Remember) when he said unto his folk: Will ye commit abomination such as no creature ever did before you? Lo! ye come with lust unto men instead of women. Nay, but ye are wanton folk. And the answer of his people was only that they said (one to another): Turn them out of your township. They are folk, forsooth, who keep pure. And We rescued him and his household, save his wife, who was of those who stayed behind. And We rained a rain upon them. See now the nature of the consequence for evil doers!" (Al-A`raf: 80-84)

The eminent Muslim scholar Sheikh Yusuf Al-Qaradawi, states:

"Almighty Allah has prohibited illegal sexual intercourse and homosexuality and all means that lead to either of them. This perverted act is a reversal of the natural order, a corruption of man's sexuality, and a crime against the rights of females.

214 Aisha  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 8:20:08pm

The spread of this depraved practice in a society disrupts its natural life pattern and makes those who practice it slaves to their lusts, depriving them of decent taste, decent morals, and a decent manner of living. The story of the people of Prophet Lut as narrated in the Qur'an should be sufficient for us. Lut's people were addicted to this shameless depravity, abandoning natural, pure, lawful relations with women in the pursuit of this unnatural, foul and illicit practice. That is why their prophet, Lut (peace be upon him) told them: "What! Of all creatures, do you approach males and leave the spouses whom your Lord has created for you? Indeed, you are people transgressing (all limits)!" (Ash-Shu`araa: 165-166)

The strangest expression of these peoples' perversity of nature, lack of guidance, depravity of morals, and aberration of taste was their attitude toward the guests of Prophet Lut (peace be on him), who were angels of punishment in human form sent by Allah to try these people and to expose their perversity. The Qur'an narrates the story: "And when Our messengers came to Lut, he was grieved on their account and did not know how to protect them. He said, 'This is a day of distress.' And his people, who had long since been practicing abominations, came rushing toward him. He said, 'O my people, here are my daughters. They are purer for you, so fear Allah and do not disgrace me in front of my guests. Is there not a single upright man among you?' They said, 'Thou knowest well that we have no right to thy daughters, and certainly thou knowest what we want.' He said, 'If only I had strength to resist you or had some powerful support!' Said (the angels) 'O Lut, truly, we are messengers of thy Lord; they shall not reach thee...'"(Hud: 77-81) Muslim jurists hold different opinions concerning the punishment for this abominable practice. Should it be the same as the punishment for fornication, or should both the active and passive participants be put to death? While such punishments may seem cruel, they have been suggested to maintain the purity of the Islamic society and to keep it clean of perverted elements."

Moreover, Sheikh Muhammad Saleh Al-Munajjid, a prominent Saudi scholar and lecturer, adds:

"Islam emphatically forbids this deed [homosexual sex] and prescribes a severe punishment for it in this world and the next. How could it be otherwise, when the Prophet of Islam (peace and blessings be upon him) said: ‘Whoever you find committing the sin of the people of Lut, kill them, both the one who does it and the one to whom it is done.’ (At-Tirmidhi: 1376) That is, if it is done with consent."

The scholars of Islam, such as Malik, Ash-Shafi`i, Ahmad and Ishaaq said that (the person guilty of this crime) should be stoned, whether he is married or unmarried.

There is no doubt that this act, which goes against the pure human nature created by Allah, by making men content with men and women with women, destroying families, adversely affecting the birth rate, causing the spread of killer diseases, harming the innocent when children are raped, and generally spreading corruption on earth, should be uprooted and stamped out."

Thinking of the wisdom behind prohibiting homosexuality and lesbianism, the following can be said:

First, such acts lead to the spread of passivity among the young generation and destroy their morality, since they cannot practice such perversion except after taking some drugs to create for themselves a virtual atmosphere where they feel fake joy. Sufficient unto any person to feel that his manhood is lost.

Second, it destroys the lives of women whose husbands leave them in pursuit of this perversion and they, in turn, try to find a way to satisfy their sexual needs. In such case, the whole society will be no more than chaos.

Third, it is a fierce attack on progeny and pregnancy, which increases the human race.

Fourth, the dangerous diseases that are caused by it are unavoidable and fatal. Topping these illnesses is HIV/AIDS.

215 Aisha  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 8:21:15pm

Lesbianism - the Isle of Lesbos is Zionist Jewish Depraved Filth

As for lesbianism, it is also no more than a perversion and an attack against the natural relation between a man and a woman.

There is no certain punishment for lesbianism. Still, disciplinary punishment is there for any perverted person who commits it. The Kuwaiti Encyclopedia of Islamic Jurisprudence states:

"Muslim jurists agree that there is no certain hadd (punishment) for lesbianism. However, they agree that disciplinary punishment should be administered since it is a sin."

Such an act spoils the doer's character and make her testimony unacceptable, as stated in the above named encyclopedia:

"Muslim Jurists agree that a witness should be morally sound. A pervert cannot be taken as a witness. Since lesbianism is an act of perversion, a lesbian cannot be a witness. Even with the jurists not declaring this openly, it can still be understood from their words and conditions."

216 UncleSam  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:29:28pm

Hey, Aisha.
Someone as twisted and filled with maniacal murderous hatred as you are is the real pervert.

Go back to your Islamic hell-hole.

217 pygmalienation  Tue, Jul 7, 2009 10:46:54pm

re: #212 Aisha

re: #213 Aisha

re: #214 Aisha

re: #215 Aisha

Yeah, yeah... ANYONE can and will be "virtuous" under threat of death and/or torture. True virtue comes from within, not imposed from without.
As "perverted" as Western culture sometimes appears looking at individual Westerners, it's the best culture to allow TRUE virtue to surface.

218 Mauser  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 12:40:05am

re: #210 gregb

Speaking of which, has Doonesbury figured out an icon for Obama?

You'd think a Teleprompter would be a natural, only Trudeau couldn't DREAM of insulting the Messiah.

219 Aisha  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 12:49:13am

Uncle Sam, it is clear that you are unable to refute my Clear Qua'ranic Proofs of my arguments, and thusly you just hurl abuse at me and all the Muslims. Behead those who insult Islam, and Allah taalla knows best.

Are you a jew?

There are many perversions in Jewish and Christian countries like America, whereas the purity of the sunnah of Allah Taala is self evident to all. For example, it is permissible for the husband to have intercourse with his wife in her vagina in whatever manner he wishes, i.e. from behind or from the front, but it is to be noted that it must be in her vagina, which is the place from which the child is born. Otherwise there will not be children. Allah says: “Your wives are a tilth for you, so go to your tilth (have sexual relations with your wives in any manner as long as it is in the vagina and not in the anus), when or how you will.” (Al-Baqarah:223) Jabir ibn `Abdullah (may Allah be pleased with him) said: “The Jews used to say that if a man had intercourse with his wife in her vagina from behind, the child would have a squint.” Then this verse was revealed: "Your wives are a tilth for you, so go to your tilth (have sexual relations with your wives in any manner as long as it is in the vagina and not in the anus), when or how you will” (Al-Baqarah: 223). The Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) said: “From the front or from the back, as long as it is in the vagina.”If a man has intercourse with his wife and wants to repeat the act with her a second time, he should perform ablution, because the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said: “If any one of you has intercourse with his wife then wants to repeat it, let him perform ablution between the two (actions), for it is more energizing for the second time.” (Muslim). This is recommended, but not obligatory. If he is able to have ghusl (complete purifactory bath) between the two acts, this would be better, because of the hadith of Abu Rafi` who said that the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) went around his wives one day and did ghusl in this one’s house and in that one’s house. He (Abu Rafi`) said: I said to him: "O Messenger of Allah, why do you not do one ghusl?" He said, “This is cleaner and better and purer.” It is forbidden to have intercourse with a woman when she is menstruating (having her period), because Allah says: “They ask you concerning menstruation. Say: that is a harm, therefore keep away from women during menses and go not unto them till they have purified (from menses and have taken a bath). And when they have purified themselves, then go in unto them as Allah has ordained for you (go in unto them in any manner as long as it is in the vagina). Truly, Allah loves those who turn unto Him in repentance and loves those who purify themselves (by taking a bath and cleaning and washing thoroughly their private parts, bodies, for their prayers, etc.).” (Al-Baqarah: 222). However, it is permissible for the husband to enjoy his menstruating wife without having intercourse, because of the hadeeth of `A'ishah (may Allah be pleased with her) who said: “The Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) would tell one of us, when she was menstruating, to wear a waist-wrapper, then her husband would lie with her.”

220 noahsatellite  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 7:20:39am
I don’t think they’re motivated by poverty. If poverty were the motivation, Zambia would be the world headquarters of terrorism.

If only more people realized this...


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 Frank says:

Music is the most physically inspiring of all the arts. -- Said as he gave the keynote address at the American Society of University Composers in Columbus Ohio in 1985.