bout time for a little overnight...

I was wondering...

Why is that Frisbee getting bigger?

Then it hit me.

Good night.

Shakescene. Original or ghost written?

I see double posts...

re: #3 jcm

Good night.

Good night JCM. I'm going to hit the hay too. Night, all.

I've been walking to and fro on the Earth and going up and down in it.

re: #6 Dark_Falcon

Good night JCM. I'm going to hit the hay too. Night, all.

Good night DF.

re: #7 BatGuano

I've been walking to and fro on the Earth and going up and down in it.

Have you found a Job yet? //

re: #7 BatGuano

I've been walking to and fro on the Earth and going up and down in it.

Are you searching for whom you may devour?

re: #5 Fenway_Nation

eh?

re: #7 BatGuano

I've been walking to and fro on the Earth and going up and down in it.

I thought you looked familiar... = )

Still have a ticket to Anne Hathaway's Cottage from about 1961. Used to read the Penguin Edition of Shakespeare's works.

Hello all, I did say weet dreams, but read some news.

Yes, let's pass some more gun laws, because the ones we have are working so well.

People are people, how can we pass more legislation to protect them from themselves.

Just a little pissed right now.

G'nite jcm and DarkFalcon!

re: #9 Cygnus

Have you found a Job yet? //

This is my job. Bwahhahhha!

re: #10 pbird

Are you searching for whom you may devour?

Pardon me. I don't mean to offend. Is this going to turn into a computer-game geek fest?

re: #17 Soona'

Pardon me. I don't mean to offend. Is this going to turn into a computer-game geek fest?

I have no idea.

re: #17 Soona'

Pardon me. I don't mean to offend. Is this going to turn into a computer-game geek fest?

I'm pretty sure it's from the bible...

re: #19 srb1976

I'm pretty sure it's from the bible...

Yup.

re: #10 pbird

Are you searching for whom you may devour?

I eat whom I like and I like whom I eat.

G'nite, Lizards! Sweet dreams! I am out of it, and I think my get up and go got up and went!

Therefore, I follow my Golden Rule: When I make more typos than words that are actually spelled correctly? It is waaay past my bedtime!

I didn't count what I did to this poor, abused post, but it seems I am dealing in the realm of higher mathematics!

See you later, alligatorsLizards!

re: #14 ggt

When some jurisdictions tried mandatory federal sentencing, the thugs cut back on guns as the feds did not give time off.

re: #14 ggt

Hello all, I did say weet dreams, but read some news.

Yes, let's pass some more gun laws, because the ones we have are working so well.

People are people, how can we pass more legislation to protect them from themselves.

Just a little pissed right now.

Yep, there you go. Another product of plea bargaining no doubt:

A criminal history check of Gilliam reveals that he had prior felony convictions from the state of Florida. Specifically, he was convicted in 1993 of three counts of attempted armed robbery and second-degree murder in Dade County, Fla where he received sentences of 15 and 17 years, respectively.

Respectively would mean 15 plus 17 or 32 years. So he should have been in jail right now theoretically.

re: #19 srb1976

I'm pretty sure it's from the bible...

LOL. thanks, I needed to lighten-up!

re: #22 NY Nana

night nana

re: #22 NY Nana

G'nite Nana!

WHERE WILL ALL THE EXTRA DOCTORS AND NURSES COME FROM?

We already have a shortage. The rest is a forth grade math problem.

/but they don't talk about that, YOU'VE GOT TWO WEEKS!

re: #21 BatGuano

I eat whom I like and I like whom I eat.

And in the immortal words of Rudyard Kipling
"I am the cat who walks by himself and all places are alike to me"

re: #28 Killian Bundy

WHERE WILL ALL THE EXTRA DOCTORS AND NURSES COME FROM?

We already have a shortage. The rest is a forth grade math problem.

/but they don't talk about that, YOU'VE GOT TWO WEEKS!

Uh oh. I smell H1-B Visas around the corner.

re: #24 Gus 802

Aren't there already a bunch of laws in place that are supposed to prevent felons from buying guns at pawnshops of the local gun store?

How did this shmoe get one?

re: #28 Killian Bundy

WHERE WILL ALL THE EXTRA DOCTORS AND NURSES COME FROM?

India.

re: #19 srb1976

I'm pretty sure it's from the bible...

Okay. Just checking. I didn't recognize the passage, but it did sound like an intro to some weirod fantasy game with blood, guts, large-breasted she-warriors, sex, and rock & roll.
//I've got to get a life

re: #32 Wendya

For now, eventually, they won't want to come here either

re: #28 Killian Bundy

India for the Doctors

Philippines for the nurses.

re: #32 Wendya

unions hate india. seems to be a seem in the plan.

re: #33 Soona'

sounds like a fun game, link?

re: #32 Wendya

India.

20+ million new patients.

/how many extra doctors they got?

re: #33 Soona'

It's from Job...satan's answer to god's asking him where he's been = )

Youtube is a rich source of "WTF?"

/I claim no responsibility for any resulting brain melt

re: #31 Fenway_Nation

Aren't there already a bunch of laws in place that are supposed to prevent felons from buying guns at pawnshops of the local gun store?

How did this shmoe get one?

Probably and that would depend on the state. I go by the theory of stricter sentences for these punks. This guy had a second degree murder rap on him already. Too many 2nd degree convictions that should be 1st degree. Keep them off the streets to being with. All of them.

re: #31 Fenway_Nation

Aren't there already a bunch of laws in place that are supposed to prevent felons from buying guns at pawnshops of the local gun store?

How did this shmoe get one?

Article stated that it was purchased from a pawnshop in 2002, not that the felon purchased it there.

Look out below!

/crazy

re: #31 Fenway_Nation

These days you have to go thru a BATF check when you go to the pawn shop to retrieve one you pawned.

re: #44 FamHistoryGuy

wow, didnt know that

re: #39 srb1976

"Yo, playa! Long time no see, where you been"?

"Just kickin' it here and there. 'Sup with you"?

re: #45 mrshankly01

Went thru that myself a couple months back. Had to wait a couple of days when I picked up two at the same time. Due to multiple gun sales to same person. Staw man sales are also illegal. This is where a legal buyer does the buying for someone who is prohibited from buying.

Foolery, sir, does walk about the orb, like the sun; it shines everywhere.

And it's very bright in DC.

re: #5 Fenway_Nation

I see double posts...

can i get a few doubles?

Most interesting clip of the week I found.

Knowing - Plane Crash Scene

re: #42 ggt

Article stated that it was purchased from a pawnshop in 2002, not that the felon purchased it there.

Detectives traced the gun, a 9 mm Bryco/Jennings, to its 2002 sale at a pawn shop, according to the complaint. Gilliam eventually bought it from an individual for $100 about a year or year and a half ago. Investigators said Gilliam told them he bought the gun for protection after his home was burglarized, and police reports indicate he did report a burglary about the time of the gun purchase.

[Link: wjz.com...]

Several articles seem intent on suggesting the pawn show sold it to a convicted felon.

re: #42 ggt

Article stated that it was purchased from a pawnshop in 2002, not that the felon purchased it there.

Could be he stole it, or bought it from whoever legally purchased it.

I don't know the stats, but I wonder how many guns get into the wrong hands because they were stolen during home burglaries. That's a problem that stricter gun laws will do nothing to solve (except accidentally).

re: #47 FamHistoryGuy

Went thru that myself a couple months back. Had to wait a couple of days when I picked up two at the same time. Due to multiple gun sales to same person. Staw man sales are also illegal. This is where a legal buyer does the buying for someone who is prohibited from buying.

What state is this?

re: #47 FamHistoryGuy

wow, i have been wanting a handgun, but I live in California (weather rules, government sucks) for the next 11 months, after that New York for three eyars (weather sucks, people sucks, government sucks) so I am going to wait for when I get back south (weather sucks, people rule)

Used to be that shippers had to put a big firearms sticker on boxes they shipped guns in. Guess which boxes had the priority with thieves in FedEx and UPS thefts.

re: #55 FamHistoryGuy

unintended consequences

re: #54 mrshankly01

I heard you can't even posess a photo of a gun in Ca.

/

If you own a firearm you want to sell to a private party, you'd best make certain they have a clean record. I've done a couple of private sales and I've run background checks on the buyers. I also keep documentation of the check and of the sale just in case.

re: #53 Soona'

At least here in Houston Texas. I think it applies to all states as it seems to be a BATF reg.

re: #30 Gus 802

Uh oh. I smell H1-B Visas around the corner.

they won't want to come here anymore, once we are just like them...

re: #57 BignJames

I heard you can't even posess a photo of a gun in Ca.

/

And you don't dare point your finger at anyone, lest it be mistaken for a pistol.

re: #35 Fenway_Nation

India for the Doctors

Philippines for the nurses.

speaking from experience, we're screwed...

re: #58 Wendya

If you own a firearm you want to sell to a private party, you'd best make certain they have a clean record. I've done a couple of private sales and I've run background checks on the buyers. I also keep documentation of the check and of the sale just in case.

What are the laws about private sales? Is the owner required to do all that?

I think it's great that you do, just wondering if most people do that.

re: #57 BignJames

hahaha

re: #60 redc1c4

they won't want to come here anymore, once we are just like them...

That's true. Especially after we go through:

From each according to his abilities, to each according to his needs.

re: #56 mrshankly01

A cynical person may doubt the unintended part. A subterfuge for further regulation.

re: #31 Fenway_Nation

Aren't there already a bunch of laws in place that are supposed to prevent felons from buying guns at pawnshops of the local gun store?

How did this shmoe get one?

not enough laws?

too many guns?

/white smoke?

re: #62 redc1c4

speaking from experience, we're screwed...

On the latter half of the post you quote, I think that is the idea.
/

re: #59 FamHistoryGuy

At least here in Houston Texas. I think it applies to all states as it seems to be a BATF reg.

I bought a .45 auto and a mini-14 the same day at the same gun show. One telephone call to BATF cleared me for anything I wanted to buy there.

re: #67 redc1c4

not enough laws?

too many guns?

/white smoke?

Too many bleeding hearts and too much plea bargaining. Justice needs to focus more on violent crimes even those committed by youth offenders. Etc.

When you buy a gun through gunbroker.com, doesn't the gun have to be have to be shipped to the nearest FFL-liscenced dealer where a background check is performed there?

re: #71 Fenway_Nation

As far as I know that is the case...even some parts have to be shipped that way

re: #66 FamHistoryGuy

true. its something I learned in economics. all rules have unintended consequences. something rule makers need to watch for is whether the rules they make have intended and unintended consequences that are worse than whatever the rules were trying to eliminate or control...

re: #71 Fenway_Nation

When you buy a gun through gunbroker.com, doesn't the gun have to be have to be shipped to the nearest FFL-liscenced dealer where a background check is performed there?

Think so.

re: #67 redc1c4

hey red

re: #40 Slumbering Behemoth

Youtube is a rich source of "WTF?"

/I claim no responsibility for any resulting brain melt

MORE DRUGS STAT!

/my po' brain...

Schwarzenegger orders 15% cut in state's vehicle fleet

Reporting from Sacramento -- Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger ordered a large reduction in the fleet of state vehicles Friday after an audit revealed that possibly thousands of state workers have been given government cars to drive home at night without justification.

The number of employees reported with take-home cars has increased up to 20% during the last three years, according to records obtained by The Times. The state allows 8,662 workers to have such cars, costing taxpayers tens of millions of dollars amid the state's financial crisis, the records show.

/I'm sorry, is California back under control yet?

I would just like to mention that it's actually almost cold in my house right now...after almost 2 weeks of not having AC

Yay!!

re: #63 iceweasel

What are the laws about private sales? Is the owner required to do all that?

I think it's great that you do, just wondering if most people do that.

Private sales are unregulated in my state but that isn't the case in every state. I do it because most of my firearms have a paper trail and if the person I sell it to has it stolen and/or used in a crime, I want to be able to document the point where it left my possession. I've never sold a firearm to a stranger, they are all people known to me but I do the checks, etc.. anyway.

re: #69 Soona'

As long as it was the same dealer. Each dealer is required to keep a copy of the form used for the sale.

Mine took a couple of days due to the BATF running an extra check. I had the guns in and out of pawn too many times in a short period of time. Raised a flag with them.

Now I am really going to bed.

weet dreams all!

re: #57 BignJames

I heard you can't even posess a photo of a gun in Ca.

/

In some schools with those zero tolerance rules probably so. Some kids will get in trouble for even drawing a gun. Lucky for me because I used to doodle tanks, machine guns and the like in class when I was a kid.

re: #68 Slumbering Behemoth

On the latter half of the post you quote, I think that is the idea.
/

better balut than olongapo... i'll pass.

re: #77 Killian Bundy

Is that included as part of their salary? They pay taxes on that, right?

/

re: #80 FamHistoryGuy

As long as it was the same dealer. Each dealer is required to keep a copy of the form used for the sale.

Mine took a couple of days due to the BATF running an extra check. I had the guns in and out of pawn too many times in a short period of time. Raised a flag with them.

We have a background check for everything, and a 3 day wait for handguns...sucks because it's 3 business days (made better half's birthday present late one year)

re: #77 Killian Bundy

economist

if you haven't seen the latest economist, they have a great story on the california vs texas issue

re: #71 Fenway_Nation

Has to go thru a local FFL holder. They notify you when you are cleared to pick it up.

re: #75 mrshankly01

hey red

Dude!... sir. %-)

re: #79 Wendya

Private sales are unregulated in my state but that isn't the case in every state. I do it because most of my firearms have a paper trail and if the person I sell it to has it stolen and/or used in a crime, I want to be able to document the point where it left my possession. I've never sold a firearm to a stranger, they are all people known to me but I do the checks, etc.. anyway.

Very wise of you. You'd think everyone engaged in a sale would do the same purely for reasons of self=protection-- like you say, to document when it left your possession. If not (also) for more general concerns about others.

re: #77 Killian Bundy

Schwarzenegger orders 15% cut in state's vehicle fleet

/I'm sorry, is California back under control yet?

Does it sound like it? What other dubious government perks could CA (or any state, for that matter, including the Fed) do without immediately.

re: #88 redc1c4

good lord man. im not a major yet, i still have a brain...

re: #77 Killian Bundy

Schwarzenegger orders 15% cut in state's vehicle fleet

/I'm sorry, is California back under control yet?

hahahahahahahaha...

oh.
wait...
were you asking a serious question?

hahahahahahahahahahahaha...

re: #91 mrshankly01

call me shank

re: #85 srb1976

The mix of fed and local rules makes for a very confusing mess.

Today in History, July 18th:

Highlights of this day in history: The Spanish Civil War begins; Sen. Ted Kennedy's passenger dies when he drives his car off a bridge on Chappaquiddick Island; South Africa's Nelson Mandela and musician Ricky Skaggs born.

Other notable July 18th events include:

1870 – The First Vatican Council decrees the dogma of papal infallibility.

1925 – Adolf Hitler publishes his personal manifesto Mein Kampf.

1966 – Gemini 10 launched.

1968 – The Intel Corporation is founded in Santa Clara, California.

1976 – Nadia Comăneci became the first person in Olympic Games history to score a perfect 10 in gymnastics at the 1976 Summer Olympics.

1984 – Beverly Lynn Burns becomes first female Boeing 747 airline captain.

re: #71 Fenway_Nation

I don't know about the website you mention, but I do know from experience that the "gunshow loophole" meme is largely bogus.

I was with a friend that bought a handgun at one of those shows. Paid for it on the spot, filled out the proper paperwork, and then had to sit out the legal waiting period before picking it up at a licensed dealer.

From my limited experience, I would say that the "gunshow loophole" meme is largely bullshit.

re: #91 mrshankly01

good lord man. im not a major yet, i still have a brain...

that's ok: i'm already losing mine in school...23 modules, 24 weeks..

WOOT!

(wtf was i thinking? %-)

re: #95 gmsc

evening PI

re: #97 redc1c4

wow, im sorry. that is a lot.

re: #96 Slumbering Behemoth

I knew that just by how much the MSM was harping on it...

re: #93 mrshankly01

call me shank

skank it is... seems a bit self depreciating though.

/never did understand ossifers... mumblemumblemumble..

re: #98 mrshankly01

evening PI

'Evening, shank!

re: #95 gmsc

Today in History, July 18th:

[Video]

Highlights of this day in history: The Spanish Civil War begins; Sen. Ted Kennedy's passenger dies when he drives his car off a bridge on Chappaquiddick Island; South Africa's Nelson Mandela and musician Ricky Skaggs born.

Other notable July 18th events include:

1870 – The First Vatican Council decrees the dogma of papal infallibility.

1925 – Adolf Hitler publishes his personal manifesto Mein Kampf.

1966 – Gemini 10 launched.

1968 – The Intel Corporation is founded in Santa Clara, California.

1976 – Nadia Comăneci became the first person in Olympic Games history to score a perfect 10 in gymnastics at the 1976 Summer Olympics.

1984 – Beverly Lynn Burns becomes first female Boeing 747 airline captain.

Captain? We were just discussing a major. Earlier, during the afternoon, someone mentioned a Colonel Lingus.

//

re: #94 FamHistoryGuy

The mix of fed and local rules makes for a very confusing mess.

I'm glad I live in a state where most people including state/local government doesn't have an aversion to firearms.

re: #28 Killian Bundy

WHERE WILL ALL THE EXTRA DOCTORS AND NURSES COME FROM?

We already have a shortage. The rest is a forth grade math problem.

/but they don't talk about that, YOU'VE GOT TWO WEEKS!

Dude, they've flunked fourth grade math.

re: #101 redc1c4

read the order soldier...

re: #99 mrshankly01

wow, im sorry. that is a lot.

st00pid me, i signed for it.

WTFOMGLOLBBQ!

/panic is not allowed on the training schedule until all other requirements have been met. S-3, by order of Household 6.

re: #105 The Other Les

Dude, they've flunked fourth grade math.

Math for the Medical Doctorate Candidate 101: How to Balance your Checkbook

/

re: #86 mrshankly01

economist

if you haven't seen the latest economist, they have a great story on the california vs texas issue

/why are the major TOTUS voting States in the most fiscal trouble?

re: #35 Fenway_Nation

India for the Doctors

Philippines for the nurses.

Heatheast in St. Paul, Minnesota has been doing that for years already.

re: #107 redc1c4

my household 6 (dealer 6w she likes to be called) is sleeping behind me on the couch.

re: #109 Killian Bundy

hahahaha...now is that a serious question.

re: #103 Gus 802

Intel? Was ist das Intel?

re: #106 mrshankly01

read the order soldier...

under the ADA, allowances have to be made for those of su who era dyslexic.

/smoke, white

re: #96 Slumbering Behemoth

I don't know about the website you mention, but I do know from experience that the "gunshow loophole" meme is largely bogus.

I was with a friend that bought a handgun at one of those shows. Paid for it on the spot, filled out the proper paperwork, and then had to sit out the legal waiting period before picking it up at a licensed dealer.

From my limited experience, I would say that the "gunshow loophole" meme is largely bullshit.

Certain people deliberately confuse private sales at gun shows with sales from dealers. If your state law allows, you can buy a gun from another visitor to a gun show without jumping through hoops. If you purchase from a dealer, it just takes a quick phone call. I've got a couple of friends who are FFL holders and it takes me longer to fill out the paperwork than it takes to get approval.

re: #113 BatGuano

Intel? Was ist das Intel?

Intel ist das computerin companien!

Pleez! Stop ist zi klieg lights!

//My pidgen German. /

re: #108 Gus 802

Math for the Medical Doctorate Candidate 101: How to Balance your Checkbook

/

...or how to fill out the check for malpractice insurance.

re: #111 mrshankly01

my household 6 (dealer 6w she likes to be called) is sleeping behind me on the couch.

the Navy doesn't even give you beds?

isn't that covered by the Geneva Convention, since you are under the control of a hostile force?

re: #103 Gus 802

Captain? We were just discussing a major. Earlier, during the afternoon, someone mentioned a Colonel Lingus.

//

By any chance, did he serve with a Colonel Angus?

re: #100 Fenway_Nation

Fenway Nation
Enjoyed your comments on the Alaska RR in an earlier thread. Did you know the AK RR does "whistle stops"? If you have a homestead near the tracks you can flag down a train and they will stop and pick you up or drop you off. That's called Service. They use a couple of old Budd Liners for the local traffic.

re: #114 redc1c4

yes, it is called moving your ass out of combat arms.

re: #108 Gus 802

Math for the Medical Doctorate Candidate 101: How to Balance your Checkbook

/

I've been doing that since high school. (And I was one credit short of the graduation requirement, so I had to make that up in summer school.)

re: #104 Soona'

The more moonbats, the bigger the mess. Not too bad here in Houston though.

re: #118 redc1c4

actually, that is too funny. the navy doesnt recognize promotable as a status, which sucks, so we got stuck in company grade housing...

re: #117 Soona'

...or how to fill out the check for malpractice insurance.

"That will be 4,166 dollars a month. Will that be by credit card, debit card, or check?"

Over the past 2 weeks, I've mentioned a couple of times that I couldn't stay on here due to personal projects.

Actually, it was all 1 personal project. As of today, it has finally borne fruit!

I've long had a tutorial on how to memorize playing cards on my site, and even a test to help train your ability to memorize cards.

The test that was originally up there was all done in text, and was very picky about an unusual form of input. This tended to get in the way of actually learning the feet.

After 2 weeks, the playing card memorization quiz has been vastly improved! I've added real playing card graphics, to make the feat more realistic, and made the input easier on the user.

Try it out, and let me know what you think!

re: #110 The Other Les

Heatheast in St. Paul, Minnesota has been doing that for years already.

The pathologists from India that I've worked with are quite good.

re: #126 gmsc

will do G. thanks. i love your site.

re: #119 Slumbering Behemoth

By any chance, did he serve with a Colonel Angus?

That don't need more cow bell.

Hmm, since Democrats have taken control of the House, Senate, and The White House, their first orders of business have been to pitch the most expensive "health care plan" in the history of the world, retreat from a war that American soldiers are fighting hard to win, cut those jobs where Americans are serving their country, and promise higher taxes than any other administration and promise the only people who will be taxed are the "rich". Hmmm, who are the rich? The business owners who employ Americans and pay crooked politicians with taxes. Show me your tax returns showing where you have paid higher taxes than the average American Joe, and then show me how much this government bloated, second rate, expensive health care plan is going to cost Americans to make it work. Barry Obama made big campaign promises of providing free health care for Americans paid for by taxes on the rich. Come to think of it, "rich" business owners and employers didn't get rich by paying the government higher taxes. The more "rich" business owners" pay the government new taxes the more people they are going to lay people off and close businesses. There goes that job creation promise. People who don't work don't pay higher or any taxes either. If employers aren't building new businesses, who are they going to hire and for what? There go those imaginary jobs Obama and Democrats promised to create. This administration is going to be an expensive tax joke that is going to take Americans forever to pay for.

re: #117 Soona'

...or how to fill out the check for malpractice insurance.

There ain't going to be any meaningful healthcare reform in this country without either MedMal suit caps or a "loser pays" rule of civil procedure. Otherwise, STFU and STFD.

Take your pick.

/TWO WEEKS!

re: #126 gmsc

Over the past 2 weeks, I've mentioned a couple of times that I couldn't stay on here due to personal projects.

Actually, it was all 1 personal project. As of today, it has finally borne fruit!

I've long had a tutorial on how to memorize playing cards on my site, and even a test to help train your ability to memorize cards.

The test that was originally up there was all done in text, and was very picky about an unusual form of input. This tended to get in the way of actually learning the feet feat.

After 2 weeks, the playing card memorization quiz has been vastly improved! I've added real playing card graphics, to make the feat more realistic, and made the input easier on the user.

Try it out, and let me know what you think!

PIMF

re: #130 sngnsgt

Hmm, since Democrats have taken control of the House, Senate, and The White House, their first orders of business have been to pitch the most expensive "health care plan" in the history of the world, retreat from a war that American soldiers are fighting hard to win, cut those jobs where Americans are serving their country, and promise higher taxes than any other administration and promise the only people who will be taxed are the "rich".

They were elected. And they ran on those promises. Health care reform is of major interest to most Americans, and to those who elected Obama.

God knows what kind of reform we'll actually see, but there it is.

re: #128 mrshankly01

will do G. thanks. i love your site.

Thank you for the compliment!

I did hear from one reader, back in February, how he presents the card memory feat with a blackjack theme, which makes it seem more impressive. Read that link, and you'll see he added an impressive, yet strangely easy, finish!

re: #134 gmsc

thanks.

re: #133 iceweasel

re: #130 sngnsgt

They were elected. And they ran on those promises. Health care reform is of major interest to most Americans, and to those who elected Obama.

God knows what kind of reform we'll actually see, but there it is.

So...your reply is a long version of 'We won'?

re: #129 Gus 802

That don't need more cow bell.

Probably needs more lengua, though.

re: #133 iceweasel

They were elected. And they ran on those promises. Health care reform is of major interest to most Americans, and to those who elected Obama.

God knows what kind of reform we'll actually see, but there it is.

And there is the problem...all we heard was "change, change, change"...No one said it would be change for the better...meantime, I'll enjoy having a family doctor while he's still in business = )

re: #137 Slumbering Behemoth

Probably needs more lengua, though.

Yep. And when Colonel Angus was near Menudo it always ended in embarrassment.

//

re: #110 The Other Les

Heatheast in St. Paul, Minnesota has been doing that for years already.

/try Fairview Clinics, lots of whizbang and Americans, online access, Highland Park is awesome

re: #130 sngnsgt

If employers aren't building new businesses, who are they going to hire and for what?

I am making a concerted effort this year to make less money than I made last year.

Luckily, I have a debt free business. I could close my doors and walk away with 30 days notice. I'm tired of the state and federal government viewing me as a piggy bank and parents to my employees.

re: #121 mrshankly01

yes, it is called moving your ass out of combat arms.

that would have gotten rid of all the senior people i labored under who read a map up then right, no matter how many times you refered them to the instructions on the bottom, and who eventually ordered you to accept their grid.

/then they complained when nothing ever showed up.

re: #142 redc1c4

good lord, im sorry man. FBCB 2 saved many lives in Iraq

re: #136 Fenway_Nation

So...your reply is a long version of 'We won'?

Nope. Just pointing out that all the things mentioned in the first paragraph were promises the Dems ran on, and it got them elected. They didn't simply 'take control', and these programs aren't something being sprung on people.

It's a democracy. Sometimes the guy you don't like wins; sometimes the majority supports policies you don't like. That's how it works.

re: #2 jcm

I was wondering...

Why is that Frisbee getting bigger?

Then it hit me.

That sounds like Steven Wright :-)

re: #130 sngnsgt

The "Obama Plan" for economic recovery is an illusion. This has never been about the economy except to destroy enough of it to force people to become dependent on the government collective. This is an effort toward blatant communism/socialism with a fascist twist.

re: #90 Soona'

Does it sound like it? What other dubious government perks could CA (or any state, for that matter, including the Fed) do without immediately.

The problem is that nearly all of the state's budget is beyond the governor's control. The areas where he can simply issue an order to cut back are extremely limited. The vast majority of the state's expenditures are controlled solely by the legislature, which is completely deadlocked to the point of being dysfunctional. They simply will not agree to cut anything at all, leaving the state in the position of issuing worthless IOUs even to those providing essential services.

One solution would be to grant the governor emergency powers for a limited period of time, dumping the heat on him but at least allowing a solution to move forward. But the chances of any proposal like that passing are between slim and none.

re: #133 iceweasel

A bunch of college socialists without a real world clue. They will try to insulate themselves from reality. Reality has a very nasty bite.

re: #136 Fenway_Nation

So...your reply is a long version of 'We won'?

Read her lips? ;-)

In fact, unlike with Bush 41, we'd likely be better off if Obama broke this campaign promise.

Our liberal progressive friends may not agree. We know they mean well...

re: #127 Soona'

The pathologists from India that I've worked with are quite good.

competency is everywhere, as a thin veneer.

incompetence, on the other hand, runs deep around the world. the results are a function of how deep one is allowed to dig in any particular place, and how the ore is sorted.

re: #139 Gus 802

And there we get right back to his first name.

Not a bad Walken/SNL skit, but this one will always be my favorite.

Foolery, sir, does walk about the orb, like the sun; it shines everywhere.

— William Shakespeare, Twelfth Night

Against stupidity, the Gods themselves contend in vain.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens.
— Friedrich Schiller, The Maid of Orleans

***
Good night, all. Hopefully. My insomnia flared up this week.

re: #149 jvic

Read her lips? ;-)

In fact, unlike with Bush 41, we'd likely be better off if Obama broke this campaign promise.

Our liberal progressive friends may not agree. We know they mean well...

What's that road again...the one paved with good intentions??
//

re: #144 iceweasel

Nope. Just pointing out that all the things mentioned in the first paragraph were promises the Dems ran on, and it got them elected. They didn't simply 'take control', and these programs aren't something being sprung on people.

It's a democracy. Sometimes the guy you don't like wins; sometimes the majority supports policies you don't like. That's how it works.

How so? Axelrod and Emanuel are constantly throwing out "programs" that they intend on "springing on people." Then they check the polling data and the possible future election losses to congressional Democrats.

re: #133 iceweasel

Health care reform is of major interest to most Americans

Actually, 85% of insured Americans are saying, [EXPLETIVE DELETED] OFF!

/but hey, party on with your socialist talking points

re: #144 iceweasel

I disagree. The media covered for many of the DEMs "promises", especially President Obama's FACT CHECK. If, there would have been more honest reporting of the democratic designs during the 2006 and 20087 elections things would be different today.

re: #141 Wendya

I am making a concerted effort this year to make less money than I made last year.

Luckily, I have a debt free business. I could close my doors and walk away with 30 days notice. I'm tired of the state and federal government viewing me as a piggy bank and parents to my employees.

I have Epilepsy, I'm on disability. I don't see getting a "raise" any time soon. If all Americans are going to be covered by Barry-care and a chunk of my disability goes toward paying for my medical care and scripts, that means I'll be getting a raise under Barry's plan if everyone gets free healthcare right? I doubt it.

re: #144 iceweasel

And sometimes the guy who won gets to skate by blaming his cock-ups on the guy who came before him.

Or being vague and evasive on what he really plans to do once in office, simply masking it with buzzwords like 'Hope' and 'Change'...

re: #133 iceweasel

They were elected. And they ran on those promises. Health care reform is of major interest to most Americans, and to those who elected Obama.

God knows what kind of reform we'll actually see, but there it is.

Then how is that approximately 70% of Americans are satisfied with the private insurance plans they have already? Health insurance is not high on the voters' priority list. As the saying goes: "It's the economy, stupid".

re: #151 Slumbering Behemoth

And there we get right back to his first name.

Not a bad Walken/SNL skit, but this one will always be my favorite.

Oh yeah, I saw that one last week.

Have you seen Asians Doing Christopher Walken Impressions.

re: #129 Gus 802

That don't need more cow bell.

what with two cows on the screen, i'd say you're right.

re: #154 Gus 802

How so? Axelrod and Emanuel are constantly throwing out "programs" that they intend on "springing on people."

Hey, if you want to hear a laundry list of criticisms of Obama and his admin from the progressive left, I'm happy to provide that anytime. :)

I'm just pointing out that the programs mentioned above, in the comment I responded to (health care & Iraq, etc) were ones the Dems promised, ran on, and were elected for.

re: #155 Killian Bundy

Actually, 80% of all americans-- including the insured ones-- think the system needs reform.

What we'll get is another story.

re: #162 iceweasel

Stupidity and cupidity rule?

re: #153 srb1976

What's that road again...the one paved with good intentions??
//

Many roads are paved with good intentions. One of them is said leads to hell. Sounds reasonable to me.

There being no such thing as a free lunch, I'm more inclined to trust rugged difficult trails marked with good intentions.

re: #163 iceweasel

Actually, 80% of all americans-- including the insured ones-- think the system needs reform.

What we'll get is another story.

/linky?

re: #137 Slumbering Behemoth

Probably needs more lengua, though.

definitely no sesos in the picture... just a whole lot of flap meat.

re: #116 Gus 802

Das chirper mit der yellow beaken,
In mein vindow ben gepeaken.
Ach! Das chirper bin upspoken,
shame on fokkers, nicht upwoken!
Soon my shooter bin gepoppen,
und das chirpin bin gestoppen,

re: #163 iceweasel

Actually, 80% of all americans-- including the insured ones-- think the system needs reform.

What we'll get is another story.

Unfortunately, they're demanding "reform" from the same clowns who screwed up the system in the first place.

re: #162 iceweasel

the DEMs were elected because the economy tanked and the media was in the tank. simple.

re: #168 BatGuano

Das chirper mit der yellow beaken,
In mein vindow ben gepeaken.
Ach! Das chirper bin upspoken,
shame on fokkers, nicht upwoken!
Soon my shooter bin gepoppen,
und das chirpin bin gestoppen,

Oh noz! Das chirper haz been kildzen! //

re: #143 mrshankly01

good lord, im sorry man. FBCB 2 saved many lives in Iraq

FBCB 2?

new training acronym? we used RTFM!, but it never seemed to w*rk.

re: #169 Wendya

And the models they want to follow are proven failures. Depending on the desired outcome of course.

re: #173 FamHistoryGuy

And the models they want to follow are proven failures. Depending on the desired outcome of course.

I imagine Obama's idea of failure is completely opposite of mine.

re: #172 redc1c4

Even the illustrated ones were less than successful.

re: #172 redc1c4

FBCB 2?

new training acronym? we used RTFM!, but it never seemed to w*rk.

Hey red!

After you left last night, we finally found a use for your brand of fruitcup:

re: #203 gmsc

How to quit smoking, version 1:

Be Amazing: Quit Smoking

re: #156 mrshankly01

I disagree. The media covered for many of the DEMs "promises", especially President Obama's FACT CHECK. If, there would have been more honest reporting of the democratic designs during the 2006 and 20087 elections things would be different today.

which is why they covered them the way they did...

re: #159 Soona'

Then how is that approximately 70% of Americans are satisfied with the private insurance plans they have already? Health insurance is not high on the voters' priority list.

Health care reform IS high on the voters' list. That doesn't have to mean that (insured) voters want a change to the health plan they themselves currently have.

Put it this way: I happen to be relatively ok in the current economy. That doesn't mean that I'm not deeply concerned about the economy and worried about the unemployment of others.

So too for health care. There are too many uninsured, and too many people with insurance that won't cover things.

The system the US currently has is flawed. I happen to be pessimistic about whether it's going to be fixed, but I see the need for us to try.

re: #174 Wendya

And mine.

re: #172 redc1c4
haha, it is a computer system in your vehicle that tells you where you are and where you fellow and subordinate/senior units are. it uses either a map interface or satellite imagery to pin point your position on a map. it also allows text messaging and reporting of status (red 1)

FBCB 2

re: #178 iceweasel

Health care reform IS high on the voters' list. That doesn't have to mean that (insured) voters want a change to the health plan they themselves currently have.

Put it this way: I happen to be relatively ok in the current economy. That doesn't mean that I'm not deeply concerned about the economy and worried about the unemployment of others.

So too for health care. There are too many uninsured, and too many people with insurance that won't cover things.

The system the US currently has is flawed. I happen to be pessimistic about whether it's going to be fixed, but I see the need for us to try.

/no linky, is that a problem overseas?

re: #175 FamHistoryGuy

Even the illustrated ones were less than successful.

as opposed to the 'unillustrated' maps?

%-)

I just came here to say hi and bye to you lizards, so this is my only post. Our health care premium is the most expensive bill we have but I want the choice to keep paying it or not. Fuck the god damn communists.
Nite.

You don't get to spout without some type of link.

/used to be an LGF rule

re: #171 Gus 802

Oh noz! Das chirper haz been kildzen! //

Oh, noes! Chirper bin gefallen!

re: #170 mrshankly01

the DEMs were elected because the economy tanked and the media was in the tank. simple.

You're right to some extent, I think. It's true that the economy is the only proven factor known to influence a change in admin in terms of the party that gets elected. The Dems were already going to win no matter who they ran, because distaste for Republicans was so high. The economy sealed it.

Similarly, the economy will be the deciding factor in 2012. It won't matter how many good things Obama has done (assuming he does good things)-- if the economy tanks even more, he'll be out.

re: #184 Killian Bundy

You don't get to spout without some type of link.

/used to be an LGF rule

Linky?

//

;)

re: #178 iceweasel

how about the fact that of the 45 million people who are uninsured, only 2 % of those actually go without insurance for more than two years and most have insurance within 6 months.

re: #183 Pvt Bin Jammin

Sorry to hear that PBJ...

re: #178 iceweasel

I would like the 25th century sickbay on the "Enterprise". But, obama care will not ever result in it.

Keep what works, fix what doesn't.

re: #183 Pvt Bin Jammin

thank you, pbj. thanks for the plus earlier, too

re: #162 iceweasel

Hey, if you want to hear a laundry list of criticisms of Obama and his admin from the progressive left, I'm happy to provide that anytime. :)

I'm just pointing out that the programs mentioned above, in the comment I responded to (health care & Iraq, etc) were ones the Dems promised, ran on, and were elected for.

No. Obama was elected because for many, he is black. For others because he had good writers for his teleprompter speeches. And others, more that I wish to admit, slick TV extravaganzas supported by the radical left leaning MFMSM who never vetted his angry socialist ass.

re: #188 mrshankly01

how about the fact that of the 45 million people who are uninsured, only 2 % of those actually go without insurance for more than two years and most have insurance within 6 months.

/STOP [EXPLETIVE DELETED] WITH HER UNLINKED TALKING POINTS!

re: #182 redc1c4

The comic book version used in the late 60's early 70's. Especially the weapons care manuals.

re: #178 iceweasel

Health care reform IS high on the voters' list. That doesn't have to mean that (insured) voters want a change to the health plan they themselves currently have.

Put it this way: I happen to be relatively ok in the current economy. That doesn't mean that I'm not deeply concerned about the economy and worried about the unemployment of others.

So too for health care. There are too many uninsured, and too many people with insurance that won't cover things.

The system the US currently has is flawed. I happen to be pessimistic about whether it's going to be fixed, but I see the need for us to try.

So if your employer is paying for your health care and realizes he can keep more of the money his business earns rather than paying for his/her employees, he/she doesn't keep that money in his pocket since the government is going to give his/her employees free health care anyway. Money makes the world go around. Even if you "like" your current health care plan, why would keep paying for something you can get for free?

re: #160 Gus 802

The first guy is the best, or at least the funniest.

re: #180 mrshankly01

haha, it is a computer system in your vehicle that tells you where you are and where you fellow and subordinate/senior units are. it uses either a map interface or satellite imagery to pin point your position on a map. it also allows text messaging and reporting of status (red 1)

FBCB 2

BFT... never made it to my back waters before my unlamented departure...

what do you do if all you have is a 1/50,000 or an overhead with a couple grid coordinates X'ed on it for an overlay and a lensatic?

i'm all for tech, but you have to have a fall back, and the skills to make it w*rk.

re: #178 iceweasel

Health care reform IS high on the voters' list. That doesn't have to mean that (insured) voters want a change to the health plan they themselves currently have.

Put it this way: I happen to be relatively ok in the current economy. That doesn't mean that I'm not deeply concerned about the economy and worried about the unemployment of others.

So too for health care. There are too many uninsured, and too many people with insurance that won't cover things.

The system the US currently has is flawed. I happen to be pessimistic about whether it's going to be fixed, but I see the need for us to try.

So you're okay with high unemployment and the prospect of keeping even less of the money you earn?

re: #193 Killian Bundy

/STOP [EXPLETIVE DELETED] WITH HER UNLINKED TALKING POINTS!

/because it's always a treat where they end up coming from

re: #178 iceweasel

Health care reform IS high on the voters' list. That doesn't have to mean that (insured) voters want a change to the health plan they themselves currently have.

Put it this way: I happen to be relatively ok in the current economy. That doesn't mean that I'm not deeply concerned about the economy and worried about the unemployment of others.

So too for health care. There are too many uninsured, and too many people with insurance that won't cover things.

The system the US currently has is flawed. I happen to be pessimistic about whether it's going to be fixed, but I see the need for us to try.

It should be free-market based. Insurance regulatory reform would be a start since they are in fact still regulated and work under government rules. Streamline things. Make it cheaper to run hospitals. Reform rules regarding pre-existing conditions. Provide an ample an robust economy that allows people to either buy their own insurance or their employers to buy insurance without having to go through 1000s of pages of government rules. Phase out illegal immigration and stop providing indigent health care for non-citizens in a phased manner. Provide tax incentives for both users and vendors. Lower the capital gains and corporate taxes since it has a monetary impact on the health industry...

re: #183 Pvt Bin Jammin

my heroin!

re: #193 Killian Bundy

huh?

re: #196 Slumbering Behemoth

The first guy is the best, or at least the funniest.

He was. Walken was great in Deer Hunter.

re: #159 Soona'

Then how is that approximately 70% of Americans are satisfied with the private insurance plans they have already? Health insurance is not high on the voters' priority list. As the saying goes: "It's the economy, stupid".

Satisfaction with current plans, or lack thereof, isn't the issue. Many people fear losing that coverage. Currently, if that happens, it isn't long at all before you're shit out of luck.

I'm a Type I diabetic. My monthly out of pocket expenses for insulin, syringes and a few other prescriptions aimed at staving off some of the long-term effects of the disease run a few hundred bucks - after my prescription coverage is taken into account. Without insurance provided by my employer, those costs would roughly triple. Then there are the quarterly visits to the outpatient lab for bloodwork and other tests; quarterly visits to the endocrinologist; quarterly visits to the dentist; visits to the opthalmologist every six months; and the occasional visit to some other specialist to deal with some new and exciting problem. And that's all just for one disease. If I break a leg, come down with the flu or anything else, those rack up additional expenses. Again, my current insurance covers the bulk of those costs. And there are some I could neglect if I were without coverage. But even the most bare-bones diabetes care is going to run thousands of dollars per year, at a time when I wouldn't be receiving a paycheck.

It wouldn't be a bad idea to have some sort of safety net available.

Anyway, that's what people are worried about. It has nothing to do with whether they're satisfied with their present coverage. It's what their alternatives are if they lose that coverage.

re: #202 mrshankly01

huh?

/sarcasm, follow the linkys if they ever appear, probably searching now

re: #195 sngnsgt

So if your employer is paying for your health care and realizes he can keep more of the money his business earns rather than paying for his/her employees, he/she doesn't keep that money in his pocket since the government is going to give his/her employees free health care anyway. Money makes the world go around. Even if you "like" your current health care plan, why would keep paying for something you can get for free?

Under the house version of healthcare, employers above a specific threshold will have to pay an 8% penalty on payroll if they don't provide insurance. It would be cheaper for them to pay the penalty than to be forced to pay 75% of their employees insurance cost under the "shared responsibility" plan.

re: #197 redc1c4

oh, we can do that stuff. i am sorry you got stuck with the officers who couldn't. i used to drop my LTs in the woods at Fort Stewart with an MRE and a map and tell them to make it back to the CP before 1700 the next day. if they couldnt, I would be there to pick them up with their OER for them to sign.

re: #206 Wendya

Under the house version of healthcare, employers above a specific threshold will have to pay an 8% penalty on payroll if they don't provide insurance. It would be cheaper for them to pay the penalty than to be forced to pay 75% of their employees insurance cost under the "shared responsibility" plan.

There you go. They're already planning on criminalizing small businesses.

re: #205 Killian Bundy

ah, okay. when the links appear, the ones backing up my facts will as well.

re: #208 Gus 802

There you go. They're already planning on criminalizing small businesses.

Which would force employees into the public option, thus killing private insurance.

re: #167 redc1c4

definitely no sesos in the picture... just a whole lot of flap meat.

Damn! Considering where this particular line of conversation started, I ain't touching that.
/well, maybe I would ... how much flap are we talkin' 'bout?
//

re: #207 mrshankly01

of course, we were about to deploy, so the pucker factor was tight for the younguns. (and they had their PSGs backing them up the whole way. love me some PSGs. best rank in the army.)

re: #144 iceweasel

Nope. Just pointing out that all the things mentioned in the first paragraph were promises the Dems ran on, and it got them elected. They didn't simply 'take control', and these programs aren't something being sprung on people.

It's a democracy. Sometimes the guy you don't like wins; sometimes the majority supports policies you don't like. That's how it works.

And it is why all democracies are temporary. Eventually, the majority votes themselves the right to raid the public treasuries.

re: #185 BatGuano

Oh, noes! Chirper bin gefallen!

This line of talk reminds me of an excerpt from Creative Computing Magazine (a computer magazine from the '70s!):

Nuclear Research: Das Whizkidden grupe
Preliminary Design: Das Uppen-das-klaudsen grupe
Administration: Das Outgescmardten grupe...

(See the cartoon at the bottom of the link.)

re: #210 Wendya

Which would force employees into the public option, thus killing private insurance.

Exactly. And at the same time they were just talking about controlling Medicare payments to health providers. That would amount to immediate price controls on that end. The whole thing reeks.

re: #204 SixDegrees

It wouldn't be a bad idea to have some sort of safety net available.

It's called Medicaid.

/good to hear that you have employer provided insurance, deductibles and co-pays are nothing new

re: #195 sngnsgt

Even if you "like" your current health care plan, why would keep paying for something you can get for free?

Because as far as I know, there isn't going to be a new 'free for all' option.

re: #200 Gus 802

It should be free-market based. Insurance regulatory reform would be a start since they are in fact still regulated and work under government rules. Streamline things. Make it cheaper to run hospitals. Reform rules regarding pre-existing conditions. Provide an ample an robust economy that allows people to either buy their own insurance or their employers to buy insurance without having to go through 1000s of pages of government rules. Phase out illegal immigration and stop providing indigent health care for non-citizens in a phased manner. Provide tax incentives for both users and vendors. Lower the capital gains and corporate taxes since it has a monetary impact on the health industry...

Reducing regulations and Tort reform; shall I say it again; TORT REFORM might even open up cash-as-you-go doctors offices.

re: #217 iceweasel

Because as far as I know, there isn't going to be a new 'free for all' option.

/as far as you know

re: #207 mrshankly01

oh, we can do that stuff. i am sorry you got stuck with the officers who couldn't. i used to drop my LTs in the woods at Fort Stewart with an MRE and a map and tell them to make it back to the CP before 1700 the next day. if they couldnt, I would be there to pick them up with their OER for them to sign.

it wasn't just officers...

the only reason i bought a GPS was because i was tired of people ordering me to take their (wrong) grid as gospel. i simply said, "you're right, and i'm just a lowly E-4, but $4billion worth of satellites agree with me. "

/hands over receiver.

i never did get promoted. %-)

re: #211 Slumbering Behemoth

Damn! Considering where this particular line of conversation started, I ain't touching that.
/well, maybe I would ... how much flap are we talkin' 'bout?
//

whatever meets your fancy, doncha know?

re: #218 Soona'

Reducing regulations and Tort reform; shall I say it again; TORT REFORM might even open up cash-as-you-go doctors offices.

Yes. The ability to sue should always be available. However, the award amounts need to be curtailed. Things have gotten out of hand. We're reaching the point of billions being awarded under the name of class action law suits.

re: #212 mrshankly01

of course, we were about to deploy, so the pucker factor was tight for the younguns. (and they had their PSGs backing them up the whole way. love me some PSGs. best rank in the army.)

you misspelled SP4.

re: #217 iceweasel

there will be once the "public option" destroys private healthcare insurance. private health care cannot compete with public insurance that doesn't want to make a profit. that is when the rationing starts.

re: #218 Soona'

i think you should say reducing regulations again. make it an actually free market system.

re: #206 Wendya

Under the house version of healthcare, employers above a specific threshold will have to pay an 8% penalty on payroll if they don't provide insurance. It would be cheaper for them to pay the penalty than to be forced to pay 75% of their employees insurance cost under the "shared responsibility" plan.

So if my employer says, "I'd rather pay the 8% fine than pay the fortune my employees health care plan costs, they're going to get free health care anyway," I guess my only choice is Barry care.

re: #204 SixDegrees

Anyway, that's what people are worried about. It has nothing to do with whether they're satisfied with their present coverage. It's what their alternatives are if they lose that coverage.

Precisely the issue. It's more of an issue than ever with so many people losing jobs right now. And there's also the issue of 'pre-existing conditions' when people try to get new insurance. If you're a freelancer or in business for yourself, this often makes it difficult for people to move to another state.

There are a lot of problems with the existing system, and the insurance companies themselves aren't motivated to change it on their own.

That being said, I'm cynical about what we might see by way of genuine and helpful change. We'll have to see.

re: #169 Wendya

Unfortunately, they're demanding "reform" from the same clowns who screwed up the system in the first place.

Sort of. Actually, a large part of the current problem is the very existence of health insurance. It masks the real cost being charged for procedures and introduces enormous market distortions as a result.

For example, I had a minor eye operation not long ago. Laser surgery. The entire procedure took roughly two minutes per eye. My out of pocket expense was around $100. Not a problem. If I had more eyes, I'd willingly go back and have them all done.

The actual cost of the procedure? $5000. Insurance pays $4900 per eye for this common procedure; there were people lined up waiting to have it done, and it's like that all the time. Even taking into account the 10 minute paperwork and prep time, the hospital is grossing $25000 an hour on this procedure.

If you or I were directly exposed to such costs, there is no way we would sit still for it - especially upon learning that the whole things takes two minutes to perform. I don't care how much that laser cost - it paid for itself the first week, probably, and is generating pure profit after that. But because patients with insurance never see this actual cost, they're happy to continue providing demand for the procedure. At $100 a pop, they're happy to pay, and demand grows and grows on that basis.

The same is true across the entire medical profession - the majority of patients don't see the true costs, so ordinary market mechanisms get derailed.

The other large contributor to medical costs is malpractice coverage. Although a fair amount of progress has been made recently in curtailing spiraling legal costs.

I'm not sure what the government has done to exacerbate these problems in the past. I'm not at all convinced that they can be good stewards of such things in the future, either. But up to this point I'm not sure they've contributed much to rising medical costs or disparity of care.

re: #216 Killian Bundy

It's called Medicaid.

/and if you find yourself unemployed, COBRA

re: #226 sngnsgt

So if my employer says, "I'd rather pay the 8% fine than pay the fortune my employees health care plan costs, they're going to get free health care anyway," I guess my only choice is Barry care.

sucks to be us! %-)

re: #224 mrshankly01

there will be once the "public option" destroys private healthcare insurance. private health care cannot compete with public insurance that doesn't want to make a profit. that is when the rationing starts.

Ethically, the scary part is that the "public option" essentially become immune from a lot of private responsibilities.

re: #204 SixDegrees

Satisfaction with current plans, or lack thereof, isn't the issue. Many people fear losing that coverage. Currently, if that happens, it isn't long at all before you're shit out of luck.

I'm a Type I diabetic. My monthly out of pocket expenses for insulin, syringes and a few other prescriptions aimed at staving off some of the long-term effects of the disease run a few hundred bucks - after my prescription coverage is taken into account. Without insurance provided by my employer, those costs would roughly triple. Then there are the quarterly visits to the outpatient lab for bloodwork and other tests; quarterly visits to the endocrinologist; quarterly visits to the dentist; visits to the opthalmologist every six months; and the occasional visit to some other specialist to deal with some new and exciting problem. And that's all just for one disease. If I break a leg, come down with the flu or anything else, those rack up additional expenses. Again, my current insurance covers the bulk of those costs. And there are some I could neglect if I were without coverage. But even the most bare-bones diabetes care is going to run thousands of dollars per year, at a time when I wouldn't be receiving a paycheck.

It wouldn't be a bad idea to have some sort of safety net available.

Anyway, that's what people are worried about. It has nothing to do with whether they're satisfied with their present coverage. It's what their alternatives are if they lose that coverage.

What alternatives, you ask? What about Medicare/Medicaid. Even those models are deeply flawed but they are available. Besides that, I've never met anyone who didn't get the basics of medical care no matter what they're particular situation is.

Skeet Archer.

G'nite Lizards.

re: #224 mrshankly01

there will be once the "public option" destroys private healthcare insurance. private health care cannot compete with public insurance that doesn't want to make a profit. that is when the rationing starts.

Unfortunately we do already have rationing in the US. We ration health care on people's ability to pay for it.

I think the US has to offer a public option.

re: #233 Slumbering Behemoth

Skeet Archer.

G'nite Lizards.

Later SB.

re: #226 sngnsgt

So if my employer says, "I'd rather pay the 8% fine than pay the fortune my employees health care plan costs, they're going to get free health care anyway," I guess my only choice is Barry care.

Yep.

I can almost guarantee the cost of insurance is NOT going to go down. It may be subsidized based on earnings but for most businesses and many families, it will continue to be very expensive.

re: #220 redc1c4

red, im sorry. the E5 and E6 ranks are great, but sometimes they do produce some idiots. its sounds like you had a few idiots in your time. in the armor world, we are able to filter the crappy E5s and E6s out, because it is pretty obvious whether someone can run a tank or not. in the infantry you can fake running a team or a squad if you have good subordinates. in the armor world, if your tank doesn't hit on table 8, it doesn't hit and you are making coffee for the CO the next week at the office.

re: #223 redc1c4

:)

re: #234 iceweasel

Unfortunately we do already have rationing in the US. We ration health care on people's ability to pay for it.

I think the US has to offer a public option.

and i think *you* should pay for it, since you think it's necessary.

/leave me out of it.

re: #229 Killian Bundy

/and if you find yourself unemployed, COBRA

From what I've seen...if you find yourself unemployed, paying for COBRA is a real issue...very expensive

re: #228 SixDegrees

I'm not sure what the government has done to exacerbate these problems in the past. I'm not at all convinced that they can be good stewards of such things in the future, either. But up to this point I'm not sure they've contributed much to rising medical costs or disparity of care.

Again, you nailed it. Health insurance itself introduces massive distortions in price; the existence of a public option is supposed to reel that in somewhat.

At least, that's the theory.

re: #233 Slumbering Behemoth

Skeet Archer.

G'nite Lizards.

G'nite, SB!

re: #223 redc1c4

i had some great SP4s in my platoons. they didn't dig their Kevlars into my forehead and tell me I was an idiot, though. SFC Lujan (my PSG) did and I will always respect him for that. We were standing in the middle of Baghdad in Aprill 2003 when he did that.

re: #216 Killian Bundy

It's called Medicaid.

/good to hear that you have employer provided insurance, deductibles and co-pays are nothing new

Lots of providers don't accept Medicaid, and Medicaid doesn't cover a lot of procedures and medications. And qualifying for it isn't simple; there are lots of restrictions based on age, income and other factors.

Expanding Medicaid might be a good place to start, but it isn't an effective safety net as it now stands.

re: #240 srb1976

From what I've seen...if you find yourself unemployed, paying for COBRA is a real issue...very expensive

Yes. COBRA is extremely expensive, and there is a limit of 36 months. In good economic times the expectation is that you can find a job offering insurance at least as good as your old plan within that time frame. That might not hold true now.

And in any case, COBRA is expensive.

re: #225 mrshankly01

i think you should say reducing regulations again. make it an actually free market system.

REDUCE REGULATIONS!

re: #240 srb1976

From what I've seen...if you find yourself unemployed, paying for COBRA is a real issue...very expensive

Fair enough.

/now there's an issue they could resolve before the August recess at little or no cost to the taxpayers, if they wanted to

re: #231 Gus 802

of course, it is backed by the tax payers.

re: #229 Killian Bundy

/and if you find yourself unemployed, COBRA

CORBA is certainly an option - for a little while. Length of coverage is limited, and out-of-pocket expenses are enormous, again at a time when there's no paycheck available to cover them.

re: #228 SixDegrees

If you or I were directly exposed to such costs, there is no way we would sit still for it - especially upon learning that the whole things takes two minutes to perform.

I had ICL surgery 3 years ago and paid for it out of pocket. It was much more expensive than Lasik but I wasn't a good candidate. Since it's not medically necessary, I see no need for general insurance policies to cover that type of surgery. I did it for convenience and if you wish to have a procedure done for convenience, you ought to expect to pay for it.

Insurance should cover catastrophic or long term illnesses, not sniffles.

re: #234 iceweasel

Unfortunately we do already have rationing in the US. We ration health care on people's ability to pay for it.

I think the US has to offer a public option.

We already have public options. They're not perfect but there are many public options already. Have you seen the Medicare/Medicaid debt? Or MediCals debt? What about incentivizing private options?

How can they create this so called public option when they, or we, haven't paid the debt on the existing public options?

re: #244 SixDegrees

Lots of providers don't accept Medicaid, and Medicaid doesn't cover a lot of procedures and medications. And qualifying for it isn't simple; there are lots of restrictions based on age, income and other factors.

/and you want them to expand on this model?

re: #234 iceweasel

Unfortunately we do already have rationing in the US. We ration health care on people's ability to pay for it.

I think the US has to offer a public option.

At least when I am "rationed" according to my ability to pay, I get to be the deciding party on whether or not I get a procedure done. If I do not have the money, I could attempt to raise it. If I could not raise it, I have no one to fault for that save myself.

With a government run "Rationing" system, a bureaucrat/politician makes that choice for me. To them, I am nothing but a set of numbers on a sheet of paper or a line of pixels on a screen. No more impersonal and dehumanizing system could be devised.