Racist Doctor Connected to Ron Paul

US News • Views: 8,666

Dr. David McKalip, who sent out that vile racist image of Barack Obama as a witch doctor (with a bone through his nose) to a tea party mailing list, is deeply connected with Ron Paul and his “Campaign for Liberty” organization. Here’s an article he published at their website yesterday: Campaign For Liberty — Stop Obamacare Now!   | by David McKalip, M.D.

Googling for “Dr. David McKalip ron paul” brings up hundreds more connections. He appears to be a personal friend of both Ron Paul and his son Rand. Am I surprised that Ron Paul is associated with these kinds of people? Not a bit.

And that’s not all. Dr. McKalip has also sued the state of Florida to try to get out of reporting his surgical infection rates to the state.

This guy is a real piece of work.

UPDATE at 7/24/09 10:09:31 am:

McKalip is also a member of the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons, an organization that promotes anti-vaccination craziness and Vince Foster conspiracy theories, and was involved in the fanatical efforts to keep the brain-dead Terri Schiavo on life support: CNS, Fox Business silent on controversial views of medical group. (Hat tip: Killgore.)

UPDATE at 7/24/09 10:54:42 am:

The Florida Medical Association has released a statement denouncing McKalip: FMA - Florida Medical Association.

TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (July 23, 2008) - The Florida Medical Association is an organization with a zero-tolerance for racist or discriminatory behavior. As such, we do not condone the circulation of what has been described by the press as a racist depiction of President Obama by David McKalip, MD. Dr. McKalip’s actions do not in anyway reflect the positions, attitudes or culture of the Florida Medical Association.

The Florida Medical Association finds the actions by Dr. McKalip to be hurtful and in poor judgment. Further, we find his actions disrespectful to President Obama and the Office of the President. The Florida Medical Association is disappointed by Dr. McKalip’s actions and urges Dr. McKalip to extend President Obama an apology for this egregious deed.

This statement led to a non-apology apology from Dr. McKalip: Doctor apologizes for circulating ‘offensive’ Obama image.

ST. PETERSBURG - A prominent St. Petersburg neurosurgeon has apologized to President Barack Obama after the physician shared with fellow members of the conservative Tea Party movement an image depicting the president as an African witch doctor, dressed in a loin cloth and wearing bones in his nose.

McKalip also resigned today from the Pinellas County Medical Association, where he was to be the next president.

“The image has nothing to do with my feelings or thoughts on any race or culture,” David McKalip wrote.

“Nothing to do with” his feelings on race? So we’re supposed to believe he sent around a picture of a black president with a freaking bone through his nose — and never even noticed that it was offensively racist?

Right.

Jump to bottom

599 comments
1 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:47:17am

Bird of a feather flock together.

2 saberry0530  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:47:40am

SUPRISE SUPRISE SUPRISE

3 Athens Runaway  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:47:48am

Shocka!

4 doppelganglander  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:48:03am

Now will people believe that Ron Paul is a racist?

/not holding my breath.

5 CommonCents  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:48:35am

Who's the witch doctor now, McKalip?

Dr. McKalip has also sued the state of Florida to try to get out of reporting his surgical infection rates to the state.

6 soxfan4life  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:48:37am

For someone who is supposed to be smart, the doctor can't seem to figure out opposing 0bama is one thing, publishing shit like that only makes those on the fence go in 0's direction.

7 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:48:47am

A racist who sent out a racist email to a tea party mailing list turns out to have deep connections to Ron Paul? How can this be?

My god, next thing you know someone will tell me there is gambling taking place at Rick's, or that Obama won't actually give me a pony of my own.

///

8 Baier  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:48:48am

Ron Paul number one super president candidate! OK!

9 Killgore Trout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:48:51am

He's also an anti-vaccine loon and was involved in legal challenges to keep Terri Schiavo on life support.

10 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:48:58am

A doctor who'd put a bone through someone's nose might well have a high rate of surgical infection in his medical practice.

/

11 Baier  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:49:09am

re: #8 Baier

Ron Paul number one super president candidate! OK!

forgot sarc tags///

12 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:49:19am

Speaking of controversial images of the presidents:

Meet San Francisco's rising new star of the art world -- Justine Lai!

Justine Lai's master work series -- me fucking all the presidents.

Here's what she has to say about it:

"In Join Or Die, I paint myself having sex with the Presidents of the United States in chronological order. I am interested in humanizing and demythologizing the Presidents by addressing their public legacies and private lives. The presidency itself is a seemingly immortal and impenetrable institution; by inserting myself in its timeline, I attempt to locate something intimate and mortal. I use this intimacy to subvert authority, but it demands that I make myself vulnerable along with the Presidents. A power lies in rendering these patriarchal figures the possible object of shame, ridicule and desire, but it is a power that is constantly negotiated.

I approach the spectacle of sex and politics with a certain playfulness. It would be easy to let the images slide into territory that's strictly pornographic—the lurid and hardcore, the predictably "controversial." One could also imagine a series preoccupied with wearing its "Fuck the Man" symbolism on its sleeve. But I wish to move beyond these things and make something playful and tender and maybe a little ambiguous, but exuberantly so. This, I feel, is the most humanizing act I can do."

Art. Not what it used to be.

13 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:49:23am

Any image, joke, etc. which makes a person seem less human, less intelligent, less rational solely because of their race/skin color is racist.

(You can, of course, make yourself look less rational by opening your mouth, but that's not racism, that's you being an idiot.)

14 CommonCents  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:49:37am

I haven't seen the good doctor's medical certificate so I'm not convinced he's REALLY a doctor.

15 CIA Reject  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:49:44am

Note to LLL: THIS IS WHAT RACISM LOOKS LIKE- not disagreeing with the POTUS over legislation.

16 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:50:21am

So according to this doctor, ron paul's solution to 0bamacare is to let us opt out of nationalized care.

Where's the tort reform?

17 Killgore Trout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:50:23am

re: #12 zombie

Heh. I think it's a funny idea.

18 Buster  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:51:39am

Isn't there a saying about the company one keeps?

19 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:51:41am

re: #9 Killgore Trout

He's also an anti-vaccine loon and was involved in legal challenges to keep Terri Schiavo on life support.

Colour me very unsurprised.

20 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:51:49am

re: #17 Killgore Trout

Heh. I think it's a funny idea.

I don't. There's an egotism there that's appalling.

21 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:52:06am

re: #12 zombie

As far as I'm concerned, she doesn't have to fuck all the presidents, just herself will be fine.

22 CIA Reject  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:52:19am

re: #12 zombie

She got an NEA grant for that, right?

23 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:52:30am

re: #12 zombie

Speaking of controversial images of the presidents:

Meet San Francisco's rising new star of the art world -- Justine Lai!

Justine Lai's master work series -- me fucking all the presidents.

Here's what she has to say about it:

"In Join Or Die, I paint myself having sex with the Presidents of the United States in chronological order. I am interested in humanizing and demythologizing the Presidents by addressing their public legacies and private lives. The presidency itself is a seemingly immortal and impenetrable institution; by inserting myself in its timeline, I attempt to locate something intimate and mortal. I use this intimacy to subvert authority, but it demands that I make myself vulnerable along with the Presidents. A power lies in rendering these patriarchal figures the possible object of shame, ridicule and desire, but it is a power that is constantly negotiated.

I approach the spectacle of sex and politics with a certain playfulness. It would be easy to let the images slide into territory that's strictly pornographic—the lurid and hardcore, the predictably "controversial." One could also imagine a series preoccupied with wearing its "Fuck the Man" symbolism on its sleeve. But I wish to move beyond these things and make something playful and tender and maybe a little ambiguous, but exuberantly so. This, I feel, is the most humanizing act I can do."

Art. Not what it used to be.

On the bright side, he isn't urine or fecal matter (yet).

/

24 callahan23  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:53:02am

re: #21 Dark_Falcon

As far as I'm concerned, she doesn't have to fuck all the presidents, just herself will be fine.

'xactly my take on that issue.

25 wrenchwench  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:53:12am

re: #9 Killgore Trout

He's also an anti-vaccine loon and was involved in legal challenges to keep Terri Schiavo on life support.

An anti vax medical doctor is a special kind of kook.

26 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:53:18am

re: #9 Killgore Trout

He's also an anti-vaccine loon and was involved in legal challenges to keep Terri Schiavo on life support.

Linkies?

27 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:53:40am

re: #12 zombie

This, I feel, is the most humanizing act I can do.

I'm not going to doubt that at all !

/the vast majority could do far better

28 Buster  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:53:44am

re: #12 zombie

Speaking of controversial images of the presidents:

Meet San Francisco's rising new star of the art world -- Justine Lai!

Justine Lai's master work series -- me fucking all the presidents.

Here's what she has to say about it:

"In Join Or Die, I paint myself having sex with the Presidents of the United States in chronological order. I am interested in humanizing and demythologizing the Presidents by addressing their public legacies and private lives. The presidency itself is a seemingly immortal and impenetrable institution; by inserting myself in its timeline, I attempt to locate something intimate and mortal. I use this intimacy to subvert authority, but it demands that I make myself vulnerable along with the Presidents. A power lies in rendering these patriarchal figures the possible object of shame, ridicule and desire, but it is a power that is constantly negotiated.

I approach the spectacle of sex and politics with a certain playfulness. It would be easy to let the images slide into territory that's strictly pornographic—the lurid and hardcore, the predictably "controversial." One could also imagine a series preoccupied with wearing its "Fuck the Man" symbolism on its sleeve. But I wish to move beyond these things and make something playful and tender and maybe a little ambiguous, but exuberantly so. This, I feel, is the most humanizing act I can do."

Art. Not what it used to be.

I hope she survives her painting with Taft!

29 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:54:02am

Given the number of meltdowns we had yesterday does any want to bet the first meltdown on this thread? I say it'll be at comment #191.

30 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:54:08am
Fortunately there are good Congressional proposals to address these problems and to allow American to escape from the government’s medical cage. Congressman Ron Paul has authored HR 2630, the "Protect Patients and Physician’s Privacy Act". The bill states that all individuals shall have the ability to opt out of any federally mandated, created, or funded electronic system for maintaining health care information. He also is offering HR 2629 the "Coercion is Not Health Care Act'" which forbids the Federal Government from forcing any American to purchase health insurance, and from conditioning participation in any federal program, or receipt of any federal benefit, on the purchase of health insurance.

This doesn't address anything about reforming health care. No tort reform.

31 HelloDare  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:54:14am

The Ron Paul Revolution. It ain't pretty.

32 Creeping Eruption  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:54:14am

re: #12 zombie

Art. Not what it used to be.

No, but "interesting" personality disorders sure seem to coming to the fore.

33 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:54:16am

re: #17 Killgore Trout

Heh. I think it's a funny idea.

Maybe, but it was so deeply derivitive. All she did was copy the images from The Joy of Sex and "photoshop" her head and each president's head on each image. Utterly lazy and conceptually uncreative.

34 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:54:26am

35 people now banned for defending racism. The last one was an Ann Coulter supporter and anti-abortion fanatic.

35 CIA Reject  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:54:27am

re: #28 Buster

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAH

36 BlueCanuck  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:54:33am

re: #29 Dark_Falcon

Given the number of meltdowns we had yesterday does any want to bet the first meltdown on this thread? I say it'll be at comment #191.

I'll take that bet, I bet it's going to be sooner.

37 DaddyG  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:54:37am

No real conservative fallacy in 3... 2... 1...

38 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:55:03am

re: #29 Dark_Falcon

Given the number of meltdowns we had yesterday does any want to bet the first meltdown on this thread? I say it'll be at comment #191.

Did I miss anything spectacular?

39 VioletTiger  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:55:10am

Kooks always seem to cling to other kooks. Kind of like cat hair on furniture...

40 Creeping Eruption  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:55:35am

re: #39 VioletTiger

Kooks always seem to cling to other kooks. Kind of like cat hair on furniture...

Kook on kook kink?

41 BlueCanuck  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:55:39am

re: #33 zombie

I wouldn't even call it art then. Some people would call it cheap pr0n.

42 Ringo the Gringo  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:55:40am

Not surprising.

43 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:55:50am

re: #22 CIA Reject

She got an NEA grant for that, right?

Not quite. From her "bio" page:

Awards

2008 Daniel M. and Mildred H. Mendelowitz Memorial Scholarship, Stanford University

2006 Chappell-Lougee Research Grant, Stanford University

2004 Frank H. Buck Scholarship, Frank H. and Eva B. Buck Foundation

44 Ringo the Gringo  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:55:53am

At least this puts him outside of the mainstream of conservatives...(for now).

45 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:56:15am

re: #17 Killgore Trout

Heh. I think it's a funny idea.

So do I. It reminds me of that old Woody Allen joke in Annie Hall. He says he was dating a woman who worked for the Eisenhower admin, and found it ironic because he was trying to do to her what Eisenhower had been doing to the country.

46 DaddyG  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:56:18am

re: #22 CIA Reject

She got an NEA grant for that, right?

I have a mental image of these "artists" as Jr. High boys tittering with each other about how "edgy" their work is.

47 Killgore Trout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:56:51am

re: #26 Charles
Here: CNS, Fox Business silent on controversial views of medical group

June 26, 2009


In a June 26 article, CNSNews.com senior reporter/editor Pete Winn reported on the claims of "Dr. David McKalip of the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons," a Florida neurosurgeon who claimed in a "unique virtual town meeting broadcast on the Internet" that including a public plan option in health care reform -- which Winn described as "a mandatory government insurance option" -- will result in "government takeover of medicine" with a goal to "ration care" that will cause doctors to "simply start migrating out of medicine." But Winn did not note that AAPS is a conservative-leaning group that has promoted and endorsed controversial views on medicine and health, including urging doctors not to serve as Medicare providers and supporting a "moratorium on vaccine mandates."

Similarly, in a June 11 interview of AAPS director of policy and public affairs Kathryn Serkes, Fox Business Network host Stuart Varney did not identify AAPS' ideological leanings or note its views.
...
AAPS members passed a resolution in 2000 calling for a "moratorium on vaccine mandates."
...
In 2001, the AAPS' Medical Sentinel published a review by Orient of Christopher Ruddy's book The Strange Death of Vincent Foster.
...
A May 2005 AAPS newsletter asserted that the case of Terri Schiavo "took on the trappings of the 'final decision' in the Roman Colosseum in the days of the gladiators,"

48 shiplord kirel  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:57:41am
"Dr. McKalip has also sued the state of Florida to try to get out of reporting his surgical infection rates to the state."

So, looks like McKalip is the real witch-doctor here.

49 DaddyG  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:57:42am

re: #34 Charles

35 people now banned for defending racism. The last one was an Ann Coulter supporter and anti-abortion fanatic.

Can Stinky go all nine rounds without risking a rotator cuff injury?

50 Killgore Trout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:57:55am

re: #33 zombie

Utterly lazy and conceptually uncreative.


Agreed. I like the concept but the images themselves are pretty lame illustrations.

51 VioletTiger  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:57:55am

re: #40 Creeping Eruption

Kook on kook kink?


Maybe statkook electricity.

52 ArchangelMichael  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:58:17am

re: #4 doppelganglander

Now will people believe that Ron Paul is a racist?

/not holding my breath.

I'm sure that you will still get the Paulian Blank Stare followed shortly by a lecture about how you have been duped by statist propoganda.

53 greygandalf  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:58:40am

re: #20 EmmmieG

I don't. There's an egotism there that's appalling.

Are you sure? I think it makes her look like whore which does the exact opposite of boosting ego.

54 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:58:50am

re: #28 Buster

I hope she survives her painting with Taft!

LOL!

Maybe she'll get stuck in the bathtub with him.

Also -- will she have to screw Grover Cleveland twice?

55 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:59:14am

And Garfield will have to be a quickie.

56 Kenneth  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:59:16am

Two things:

1. This is not a surprise. Ron Paul has a long history of association with racist groups.

2. This explains where all those creeps who popped up in yesterday's thread (and got banned) came from: Paulian stealth trolls.

57 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 9:59:19am
58 Silvergirl  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:00:08am

I was interested in what the original unphotoshopped witch doctor looked like and found it in several places. I still don't know where the photo actually came from but I think the oldest I found in use was a 2007 Moonbattery post. They were being used to point up witch doctorlike behavior is some form or other but were not adorned with another person's head!

59 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:00:12am

re: #56 Kenneth

Two things:

1. This is not a surprise. Ron Paul has a long history of association with racist groups.

2. This explains where all those creeps who popped up in yesterday's thread (and got banned) came from: Paulian stealth trolls.

In re: 2-- could be.

60 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:00:43am

That figures. I wonder who sent McKalip that picture in the first place? Don Black?

61 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:00:51am

ok--the guy's an even bigger idiot than we first thought. Point. Laugh. Move along.

62 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:00:51am

re: #47 Killgore Trout

AAPS members passed a resolution in 2000 calling for a "moratorium on vaccine mandates."

Lovely.

63 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:00:52am

re: #54 zombie

LOL!

Maybe she'll get stuck in the bathtub with him.

Also -- will she have to screw Grover Cleveland twice?

(*whispers* ... what, no puns about Filmore? )

/a nice guy like me could NOT do that

64 CIA Reject  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:00:52am

re: #46 DaddyG

I have a mental image of these "artists" as Jr. High boys tittering with each other about how "edgy" their work is.

I guess I grew up in among Philistines because back home we used to call stuff like this juvenile delinquency.

65 wrenchwench  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:00:56am

re: #47 Killgore Trout

Update coming up, I bet.

66 DaddyG  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:01:18am

re: #33 zombie

Maybe, but it was so deeply derivitive. All she did was copy the images from The Joy of Sex and "photoshop" her head and each president's head on each image. Utterly lazy and conceptually uncreative.


How did you recognize the images out of The Joy of Sex so quickly? /

67 greygandalf  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:01:24am

If the same thing were done to Bush (this type of manipulated photo) it would have been perfectly fine. However, I do believe this is racist.

68 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:01:32am

re: #55 zombie

And Garfield will have to be a quickie.

He's on his back already.

69 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:02:12am

re: #17 Killgore Trout

Heh. I think it's a funny idea.

I want to see the Taft painting

70 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:02:14am

I'll bet McKalip is a real butcher. I'm surprised he hasn't moved here (to Texas), with our generous malpractice laws.

71 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:02:32am

re: #53 greygandalf

Are you sure? I think it makes her look like whore which does the exact opposite of boosting ego.

It implies she's so hot they would have wanted her, and puts her in every scene.

She couldn't have gotten in to shake the hand of most of them.

If she wanted to humanize them, maybe she could have done some research, found out what their hobbies and interests were, and showed that.

72 turn  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:02:58am

re: #56 Kenneth

Two things:

1. This is not a surprise. Ron Paul has a long history of association with racist groups.

2. This explains where all those creeps who popped up in yesterday's thread (and got banned) came from: Paulian stealth trolls.

That explains it, probably not liberal plants then.

73 Kenneth  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:03:13am

re: #9 Killgore Trout

He's also an anti-vaccine loon and was involved in legal challenges to keep Terri Schiavo on life support.

A licensed medical doctor who is also an anti-vax nut? I fear for his patients!

74 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:03:14am
And that’s not all. Dr. McKalip has also sued the state of Florida to try to get out of reporting his surgical infection rates to the state.

Maybe the medical board should review this guy's license.

75 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:03:38am

Why would any surgeon refuse to report his infection rates? Surely, just by refusing, he drove his malpractice premiums through the roof? And I'd expect that the Florida department of public health would land on him with both feet!

Is this guy trying to self-destruct?

76 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:03:42am

re: #38 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Did I miss anything spectacular?

Nope. Just a bunch of stupid trolls rushing in to defend a racism photoshop and then being clubbed down by the ban stick.

77 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:03:52am

re: #26 Charles

Linkies?

I saw that posted here yesterday, on the original picture thread, IIRC.

78 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:04:23am

re: #2 saberry0530

SUPRISE SUPRISE SUPRISE

Hey Gomer!

79 CommonCents  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:04:26am

re: #12 zombie

I hope she catches some sort of paint infection. (I hope that didn't break a rule that gets me banned)

80 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:04:28am
81 Creeping Eruption  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:04:29am

re: #75 Dianna

God complex

82 debutaunt  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:04:54am

re: #76 Dark_Falcon

Nope. Just a bunch of stupid trolls rushing in to defend a racism photoshop and then being clubbed down by the ban stick.

But first, they attempted the Mandy rope trick.

83 VegasRick  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:05:09am

BBL

84 Kenneth  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:05:22am

re: #80 buzzsawmonkey

It's the narcissism, dude.

85 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:05:23am

re: #76 Dark_Falcon

Nope. Just a bunch of stupid trolls rushing in to defend a racism photoshop and then being clubbed down by the ban stick.

*yawn*

/though it might have been fun to watch, if I hadn't been so danged busy

86 nadnerb  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:05:23am

William F Buckley devoted his time and intellect to, among other things, kicking the kooks and racists out of the conservative movement. This needs to continue until people like Ron Paul, Nirthers, Pro-Lifers who support murder, etc are marginalized and seen for the whack-jobs they are. The equivalent of these folks on the left are the global warming hysterics, no-nukes-never, surrender monkeys. This is about saner heads prevailing. It does not connote ANY support of Obama and his policies.

For people who continue to defend the image in the vile thread last night, try to think of the mind that created it. That it was created and put out for the entire world to see, without care for the consequences, makes me want to puke. The selfish, disgusting racist who did this belongs to the realm of nuts, lunatics and assholes. Just like the loony lefties he probably hates.

87 DaddyG  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:05:25am

re: #79 CommonCents

I hope she catches some sort of paint infection. (I hope that didn't break a rule that gets me banned)

Chief of staph infection?

88 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:05:34am

re: #75 Dianna

Why would any surgeon refuse to report his infection rates? Surely, just by refusing, he drove his malpractice premiums through the roof? And I'd expect that the Florida department of public health would land on him with both feet!

Is this guy trying to self-destruct?

It certainly wouldn't give me cause to keep him as my doctor were I in such an unfortunate predicament as to have him as such.

89 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:05:39am

re: #12 zombie

Speaking of controversial images of the presidents:

Meet San Francisco's rising new star of the art world -- Justine Lai!

Justine Lai's master work series -- me fucking all the presidents.

Here's what she has to say about it:

"In Join Or Die, I paint myself having sex with the Presidents of the United States in chronological order. I am interested in humanizing and demythologizing the Presidents by addressing their public legacies and private lives. The presidency itself is a seemingly immortal and impenetrable institution; by inserting myself in its timeline, I attempt to locate something intimate and mortal. I use this intimacy to subvert authority, but it demands that I make myself vulnerable along with the Presidents. A power lies in rendering these patriarchal figures the possible object of shame, ridicule and desire, but it is a power that is constantly negotiated.

I approach the spectacle of sex and politics with a certain playfulness. It would be easy to let the images slide into territory that's strictly pornographic—the lurid and hardcore, the predictably "controversial." One could also imagine a series preoccupied with wearing its "Fuck the Man" symbolism on its sleeve. But I wish to move beyond these things and make something playful and tender and maybe a little ambiguous, but exuberantly so. This, I feel, is the most humanizing act I can do."

Art. Not what it used to be.

Before: Art = art.
Now: Art = crap.

90 DaddyG  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:06:08am

re: #80 buzzsawmonkey

I don't understand what faked pictures of this artist "having sex" with the Presidents is supposed to show, or prove. It's a stupid concept, badly executed.

The one thing that is clear is that this cavalcade of ugly and stupid images is all about her. She is, therefore, a fitting artist for the Obama Era.


Narcissistist!

91 horse  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:06:11am

Quacks and wacks who make racial attacks deserve their punishment smacks.

92 Randall Gross  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:06:15am

re: #47 Killgore Trout

Countervailing evidence that he personally might be pro vaccine before we jump the gun on this, from 2003:

In June 2002, the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices, 15 experts selected to make recommendations at CDC on all immunizations, initially advised vaccinating only medical teams at select sites, or about 15,000 people. An alternative plan, reportedly backed by Vice President Dick Cheney, called for vaccinating more than 10-million health care workers, emergency medical technicians and law enforcement officers in addition to the military. Neither plan called for vaccinating the public.

President Bush opted for the second approach with far greater numbers, citing national security concerns. He announced the program Dec. 13 and was one of the first to be vaccinated.

"President Bush was quite courageous in making this decision despite people telling him to wait," said Dr. David McKalip, a St. Petersburg neurosurgeon who lobbied for the plan and serves on the St. Petersburg Metropolitan Medical Response System.

The vaccination blueprint had three phases. In Phase 1, almost a half-million military personnel and a half-million volunteer health care workers would be vaccinated. Phase 2 would include as many as 10-million so-called first-responders: EMTs, police officers, sheriff's deputies and firefighters. Phase 3 would be vaccination of the public.

Health and Human Services Secretary Tommy Thompson ordered 300-million doses of vaccine, so all Americans "could know they have their name on a vaccine shot in our inventory."

93 BlueCanuck  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:06:33am

re: #75 Dianna

Is this guy trying to self-destruct?

I don't think he's trying. He's succeeding quite well I think.

94 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:06:39am

re: #81 Creeping Eruption

God complex

I guess. Man, what a dangerous idiot. What's up with the AMA that he was on committees?

95 CommonCents  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:06:48am

re: #87 DaddyG

Chief of staph infection?

Good one. Or an oil based boil, shoulda used the latex.

96 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:06:52am

re: #90 DaddyG

Narcissistist!

0bama will name her "painter laureate".

97 Mad Al-Jaffee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:07:04am

re: #7 iceweasel

A racist who sent out a racist email to a tea party mailing list turns out to have deep connections to Ron Paul? How can this be?

My god, next thing you know someone will tell me there is gambling taking place at Rick's, or that Obama won't actually give me a pony unicorn of my own.

///

98 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:07:31am

re: #88 Sharmuta

Me, neither!

99 Son of the Black Dog  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:07:33am

re: #45 iceweasel

So do I. It reminds me of that old Woody Allen joke in Annie Hall. He says he was dating a woman who worked for the Eisenhower admin, and found it ironic because he was trying to do to her what Eisenhower had been doing to the country.

After all, the Eisenhower administration was such a terrible period in our nation's history. Peace, steady economic growth, almost zero inflation, federal enforcement of the civil rights laws - all bad things. Right?

100 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:08:56am

re: #99 Son of the Black Dog

After all, the Eisenhower administration was such a terrible period in our nation's history. Peace, steady economic growth, almost zero inflation, federal enforcement of the civil rights laws - all bad things. Right?

I didn't get that at all...not a Woody Allen fan tho...I'm too stupid

101 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:09:11am

re: #86 nadnerb

William F Buckley devoted his time and intellect to, among other things, kicking the kooks and racists out of the conservative movement. This needs to continue until people like Ron Paul, Nirthers, Pro-Lifers who support murder, etc are marginalized and seen for the whack-jobs they are.

I couldn't agree more, and those of us who feel this way should speak up. It's a new era, where anyone can start up a blog and work towards exposing these people, just like is done here at LGF. The kooks, creationists and crypto-fascists have to go.

102 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:09:13am

re: #99 Son of the Black Dog

After all, the Eisenhower administration was such a terrible period in our nation's history. Peace, steady economic growth, almost zero inflation, federal enforcement of the civil rights laws - all bad things. Right?

You forgot about all the international wars President Eisenhower got us involved in!

/

103 Mad Al-Jaffee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:09:23am

re: #12 zombie

I just clicked on one of those links and it was blocked because of "pornography."

104 subsailor68  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:10:10am

re: #75 Dianna

Why would any surgeon refuse to report his infection rates? Surely, just by refusing, he drove his malpractice premiums through the roof? And I'd expect that the Florida department of public health would land on him with both feet!

Is this guy trying to self-destruct?

Hi Dianna!! Good question, but what about this for a theory: If he reports his infection rates, a huge increase in malpractice premiums would be the least of his problems? Perhaps?

;-)

105 MrSilverDragon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:10:21am

re: #55 zombie

And Garfield will have to be a quickie.

As would William Henry Harrison.

106 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:10:41am

re: #103 Mad Al-Jaffee

I just clicked on one of those links and it was blocked because of "pornography."

You must be at work with one of the corporate Web Blocker thingies installed.

Consider yourself lucky.

107 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:10:43am

re: #97 Mad Al-Jaffee

You say unicorn, we say pony. :)

The "pony" meme has been widespread on the left and predates Obama ("let's invade iraq and we'll all get ponies!").

One of my favourite blogs has satirically nicknamed Obama the "Magical Unity Pony" or "M.U.P" to mock all the people who believe that Obama is some kind of saint or savior.

108 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:10:49am

re: #102 zombie

You forgot about all the international wars President Eisenhower got us involved in!

/

Why th' SARC tag?!
Remember Grand Fenwick?!

109 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:11:07am

re: #104 subsailor68

Hi Dianna!! Good question, but what about this for a theory: If he reports his infection rates, a huge increase in malpractice premiums would be the least of his problems? Perhaps?

;-)

I don't know, but...that is something that springs forcefully to mind.

110 Killgore Trout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:11:25am

re: #69 albusteve

I want to see the Taft painting

The Lincoln was pretty funny. I waiting to see how she does FDR.

111 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:11:37am

re: #106 zombie

You must be at work with one of the corporate Web Blocker thingies installed.

Consider yourself lucky.

I'm not blocked, but I'm not looking.

112 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:11:40am

re: #86 nadnerb

William F Buckley devoted his time and intellect to, among other things, kicking the kooks and racists out of the conservative movement. This needs to continue until people like Ron Paul, Nirthers, Pro-Lifers who support murder, etc are marginalized and seen for the whack-jobs they are. The equivalent of these folks on the left are the global warming hysterics, no-nukes-never, surrender monkeys. This is about saner heads prevailing. It does not connote ANY support of Obama and his policies.

For people who continue to defend the image in the vile thread last night, try to think of the mind that created it. That it was created and put out for the entire world to see, without care for the consequences, makes me want to puke. The selfish, disgusting racist who did this belongs to the realm of nuts, lunatics and assholes. Just like the loony lefties he probably hates.

The problem is that the Right has no one of his stature anymore. Right now the crazies like Ron Paul and Glen Beck can't be thrown out because they have more influence in the party than the sane people do.

113 subsailor68  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:12:00am

Bill Clinton: I. Did. Not. Have. Sex. With. That...Artist.

114 jcm  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:12:05am

Why did the thread title not surprise me?

Too busy yesterday to really comment on this subject.

I say this, I'll bet most shaman are honest purveyors of there craft. They may have been by passed by science but they believe what they do.

It's not only racist, it's deeming to the belief systems of others.

Obama is a snake oil salesman. Snake oil salesmen brewed up a concoction in the backs of their wagons, knowing full well it was a scam. A little alcohol and laudanum would make anyone feel better for a little while.

Obama has cooked up a health care concoction knowing its a scam, it will feel good for a little while, but the hangover will be intense.

Obama is a snake oil salesman.

115 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:12:23am

re: #108 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Why th' SARC tag?!
Remember Grand Fenwick?!

Yeah, but we lost that one, so we got all those post-war reparations -- boosting the economy even further!

116 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:12:52am

re: #112 Dark_Falcon

The problem is that the Right has no one of his stature anymore. Right now the crazies like Ron Paul and Glen Beck can't be thrown out because they have more influence in the party than the sane people do.

And some of the sane people can't recognize a problem even when it's staring then in the face.

117 J.S.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:12:53am

re: #75 Dianna

Another curious item is that this fellow isn't just any surgeon, he's a neurosurgeon...

118 Buster  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:13:30am

re: #55 zombie

And Garfield will have to be a quickie.

Not as quick as Harrison!

119 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:13:34am

re: #116 Sharmuta

And some of the sane people can't recognize a problem even when it's staring them in the face.

PIMF

120 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:14:48am

Now, if only David McKalip had painted ALL the presidents as witch doctors, he would have gotten away with it! Just like Justine Lai.

We still have much to learn from the Left.

121 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:15:19am

*Sigh* perhaps the Modern Whig party needs another member at this point?

Seriously, Ron Paul is probing to be warped

122 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:16:09am

re: #117 J.S.

Another curious item is that this fellow isn't just any surgeon, he's a neurosurgeon...

A point that really unnerves me, too.

123 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:16:11am

re: #110 Killgore Trout

The Lincoln was pretty funny. I waiting to see how she does FDR.

hmmm...problematic...or Nixon howling in frenzied delight

124 Silvergirl  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:16:20am

re: #121 Jewels (AKA Julian)

*Sigh* perhaps the Modern Whig party needs another member at this point?

Seriously, Ron Paul is probing to be warped

?

125 Mad Al-Jaffee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:16:23am

re: #106 zombie

You must be at work with one of the corporate Web Blocker thingies installed.

Consider yourself lucky.

I am at work. I did do a google search on the "artist"'s name and could view some images of her work. I think it's kind of funny.

126 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:17:17am
127 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:17:44am

re: #124 Silvergirl

Sorry...bad inflamation in the fingers is making typing difficult...waiting for medication to come in. it should be 'Proving'

128 horse  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:18:11am

re: #55 zombie

She'll need to put on a few pounds for the Clinton painting to be believable. He can't maintain the rankle if she is don't have the cankle.

129 Mad Al-Jaffee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:18:21am

re: #113 subsailor68

Bill Clinton: I. Did. Not. Have. Sex. With. That...Artist.

I wonder if Bill's portrain involves a cigar.

130 SixDegrees  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:18:29am

So McKalip is a total yutz.

I admit to feeling slightly better after learning this.

But only slightly, given the still-lingering stench of the support his Photoshop project gives off.

131 J.S.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:19:26am

re: #120 zombie

(actually, it wasn't McKalip who did the photoshop -- someone else did it -- McKalip claims he doesn't know who it was -- he just came across the image and found it "funny" -- not racist, but "funny." I'm not really surprised that this sort of sentiment would be expressed by a Ron Paul supporter -- typical for kooks and extremists not to recognize that they might have a problem...but, it is troubling that it's coming from a neurosurgeon with connections to the AMA..)

132 Wendya  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:19:29am

re: #31 HelloDare

The Ron Paul Revolution. It ain't pretty.

And it's not surprising. When a political party loses their way, someone else will step in to fill the void.

133 Silvergirl  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:19:50am

I just read that this guy has apologized for the forwarded email. Has this been discussed here? I only logged in a bit ago.

134 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:19:51am

re: #89 Ward Cleaver

Before: Art = art.
Now: Art = crap.

Crap = Art

135 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:19:52am
136 kynna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:19:55am

re: #12 zombie

For someone like me, who would just love to have some artistic talent, that is just so depressing. It's just stupid. And yes, it's pornographic. But then, she's not looking to make actual art she's looking for attention. You have to do something brain dead to attract the brain dead.

Damn. She's got skills, but that's how she uses them. It's just pathetic.

137 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:20:40am

re: #86 nadnerb

William F Buckley devoted his time and intellect to, among other things, kicking the kooks and racists out of the conservative movement. This needs to continue until people like Ron Paul, Nirthers, Pro-Lifers who support murder, etc are marginalized and seen for the whack-jobs they are. The equivalent of these folks on the left are the global warming hysterics, no-nukes-never, surrender monkeys. This is about saner heads prevailing. It does not connote ANY support of Obama and his policies.

For people who continue to defend the image in the vile thread last night, try to think of the mind that created it. That it was created and put out for the entire world to see, without care for the consequences, makes me want to puke. The selfish, disgusting racist who did this belongs to the realm of nuts, lunatics and assholes.

It's worth noting that William F Buckley called out and condemned Pat Buchanan years ago.

As Dark Falcon said above-- one of the problems on the right now is that there isn't anyone of comparable stature and courage to throw out beck et al.

138 DaddyG  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:20:51am

re: #117 J.S.

Another curious item is that this fellow isn't just any surgeon, he's a neurosurgeon...

Perhaps someone once told him suture self - and he tried. /

139 MrSilverDragon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:21:01am

re: #134 NJDhockeyfan

Crap = Art

Thank goodness it's only dust bunnies under my bed, and not those things...

140 Randall Gross  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:21:14am

I'm running to the store, but here's an interesting search on AAPS+"Discovery Institute
[Link: www.google.com...]

141 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:21:36am

re: #131 J.S.

(actually, it wasn't McKalip who did the photoshop -- someone else did it -- McKalip claims he doesn't know who it was -- he just came across the image and found it "funny" -- not racist, but "funny." I'm not really surprised that this sort of sentiment would be expressed by a Ron Paul supporter -- typical for kooks and extremists not to recognize that they might have a problem...but, it is troubling that it's coming from a neurosurgeon with connections to the AMA..)

doctors are not above base behavior, neither are astronauts or presidents

142 Mad Al-Jaffee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:21:45am

re: #138 DaddyG

Perhaps someone once told him suture self - and he tried. /

You're a stitch!

143 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:21:51am

This doctor is a brain surgeon. I think he's been self medicating with his scalpel on off hours.

144 Silvergirl  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:21:55am

re: #135 buzzsawmonkey

Totally OT...I know that's supposed to be a bone through the President's nose, but it looks like the photoshopper stuck a couple of wax beans in the Presidential nostrils.

The real photo is better, but yes, I now see wax beans!

145 karmic_inquisitor  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:22:07am

Racists
Obfuscate.
Nirthers

Postulate.
Antisemites
Understate.
Loathsome.

146 Kenneth  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:22:29am

New from Totten:

Sayid: The American forces help people in this area, you know. There was a time when the militias ruled this area. They were shooting people. When the Americans came, they could no longer do that. The Americans secured the area. And of course anyone who gives security is loved. He is a friend.

But in the depths of their minds, no. They don't have any love for American forces. They always say Americans are bad people. They know the truth, but still they say this. They know Saddam Hussein caused a big mess in the region, but they ignore that. They ignore the truth. They hang all the responsibility on the American forces. But American forces secure them, give them help, give them money, give them a job. All the people in Adhamiyah working for the municipality, the Iraqi Army, and the Iraqi Police is because of the American forces. And they know that. But when you sit with them and talk with them, face to face, Iraqi to Iraqi, they don't say that. They say all bad things come from America. They ignore the truth.

147 Ringo the Gringo  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:22:45am

Well, I for one am glad to see that this idiot doctor is more likely a Libertarian kook than a typical Republican.

148 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:22:51am

Gibbs: Media 'obsessions' prolonging Gates story

WASHINGTON – The White House says the media's "obsessions" are keeping alive President Barack Obama's comments about the arrest of a Harvard scholar seen trying to get into his own house.

Asked whether Obama regretted commenting on the matter, spokesman Robert Gibbs told reporters that the president probably would regret distracting the media with "obsessions."

Perhaps he should have thought about that before opening his mouth.

149 Mad Al-Jaffee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:23:32am

re: #129 Mad Al-Jaffee

I wonder if Bill's portrain involves a cigar.

"portrait"

PIMF

150 Creeping Eruption  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:23:43am

re: #32 Creeping Eruption

No, but "interesting" personality disorders sure seem to coming to the fore.

Whats with the down-ding? You think this "artist" is stable? Not a little bit of narcissism?

151 callahan23  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:23:43am

re: #139 MrSilverDragon

Thank goodness it's only dust bunnies under my bed, and not those things...

Not to worry, it is only unicorn horse dung. Not too bad on the nostrils. //

152 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:23:51am

re: #45 iceweasel

So do I. It reminds me of that old Woody Allen joke in Annie Hall. He says he was dating a woman who worked for the Eisenhower admin, and found it ironic because he was trying to do to her what Eisenhower had been doing to the country.

What was Eisenhower doing to the country?

153 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:23:59am

re: #148 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Gibbs: Media 'obsessions' prolonging Gates story

Perhaps he should have thought about that before opening his mouth.

hey Gibby!...the horse is oughta the barn!

154 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:24:18am

re: #148 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Gibbs: Media 'obsessions' prolonging Gates story

Perhaps he should have thought about that before opening his mouth.

Twice. Last night, too.

155 karmic_inquisitor  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:24:19am

re: #146 Kenneth

Truth in Labeling: Let's rename Iraq to "Berkeley."

156 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:24:28am

re: #147 Ringo the Gringo

Well, I for one am glad to see that this idiot doctor is more likely a Libertarian kook than a typical Republican.

Doesn't matter: We still get called racists for what he did.

157 BlueCanuck  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:24:36am

re: #147 Ringo the Gringo

Well, I for one am glad to see that this idiot doctor is more likely a Libertarian kook than a typical Republican.

Trouble is that with Luap Nor involved, who is attached to the party, every one will think Republican instead of Libertarian.

158 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:25:05am

re: #120 zombie

Now, if only David McKalip had painted ALL the presidents as witch doctors, he would have gotten away with it! Just like Justine Lai.

.

Sorry, the pic of Obama as a witch doctor with a bone through his nose would be, and is, offensive and racist-- even if someone ever did photoshop all the other POTUS's that way.

159 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:25:18am

re: #152 Alouette

What was Eisenhower doing to the country?

I thing it means Ike was trying to fuck the country...if it's funny I don't get it

160 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:25:53am

re: #148 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Gibbs: Media 'obsessions' prolonging Gates story

Perhaps he should have thought about that before opening his mouth.

That same media obsession with Barry helped get him elected. You have to take it from both ends, Gibbs.

161 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:25:53am

re: #103 Mad Al-Jaffee

I just clicked on one of those links and it was blocked because of "pornography."

I won't even click on that at work.

162 BlueCanuck  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:26:03am

re: #159 albusteve

I thing it means Ike was trying to fuck the country...if it's funny I don't get it

Moonbat humour. Just pay it about as much attention as it deserves.

/what joke?

163 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:26:28am

Perry raises possibility of states' rights showdown with White House over healthcare

AUSTIN — Gov. Rick Perry, raising the specter of a showdown with the Obama administration, suggested Thursday that he would consider invoking states’ rights protections under the 10th Amendment to resist the president’s healthcare plan, which he said would be "disastrous" for Texas.

Interviewed by conservative talk show host Mark Davis of Dallas’ WBAP/820 AM, Perry said his first hope is that Congress will defeat the plan, which both Perry and Davis described as "Obama Care." But should it pass, Perry predicted that Texas and a "number" of states might resist the federal health mandate.

"I think you’ll hear states and governors standing up and saying 'no’ to this type of encroachment on the states with their healthcare," Perry said. "So my hope is that we never have to have that stand-up. But I’m certainly willing and ready for the fight if this administration continues to try to force their very expansive government philosophy down our collective throats."

164 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:26:35am

re: #153 albusteve

hey Gibby!...the horse is oughta the barn!

Only its Obama who dropped a big turd of a comment.

165 Creeping Eruption  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:27:02am

re: #119 Sharmuta

PIMF

Whats with the down-ding on my number 36? You think this "artist" is stable? Not a little bit of narcissism in her personality?

166 MrSilverDragon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:27:08am

re: #162 BlueCanuck

Moonbat humour. Just pay it about as much attention as it deserves.

/what joke?

Moonbat humor refuses to be ignored, therefore I can't hear it.

167 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:27:10am

re: #160 Walter L. Newton

That same media obsession with Barry helped get him elected. You have to take it from both ends, Gibbs.

Barney Frank just perked up and gave Gibbs a sly grin.

168 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:27:30am

re: #164 Dark_Falcon

Only its Obama who dropped a big turd of a comment.

another Oturd...they sure pile up

169 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:27:32am

re: #148 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Gibbs: Media 'obsessions' prolonging Gates story

Perhaps he should have thought about that before opening his mouth.

"Why won't this toothpaste go back in the tube?"

170 Spider Mensch  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:27:40am

re: #148 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Gibbs: Media 'obsessions' prolonging Gates story


Perhaps he should have thought about that before opening his mouth.

he won!..no need to do damage control..he's the president and he can say whatever he please..HE WON!! silly peons!

the White hose is now just being obtuse on the matter..the press is going to start to hate this administration sooner rather than later.

171 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:27:46am

re: #163 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Perry raises possibility of states' rights showdown with White House over healthcare

He read A State of Disobedience? And didn't understand it?

172 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:27:59am

re: #167 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Barney Frank just perked up and gave Gibbs a sly grin.

And a wink.

173 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:28:03am

re: #159 albusteve

I thing it means Ike was trying to fuck the country...if it's funny I don't get it

Well, if he did, the country got multiple economic and peace orgasms out of it.

174 midwestgak  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:28:04am

re: #152 Alouette

What was Eisenhower doing to the country?


Building interstates.

175 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:28:12am
176 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:28:57am

re: #166 MrSilverDragon

Moonbat humor refuses to be ignored, therefore I can't hear it.

"I dont understand what you said and refuse to comment on it." - Lucille Bluth

177 Russkilitlover  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:29:04am

re: #154 Dianna

Twice. Last night, too.

There are two people keeping this story alive and kicking - Gates and Obama. Neither can either admit they were wrong, nor can they shut up.

178 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:29:05am

re: #171 Dianna

Good book that. I got my Autographed by Kratman at a convention

179 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:29:07am

re: #163 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Perry raises possibility of states' rights showdown with White House over healthcare

Another kooky conservative politician. The party is just going to start looking worst then it has been if we start appealing to Constitutional amendments. What next, speaking out against the President? Kook.

180 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:29:33am
181 MikeAlv77  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:29:39am

re: #34 Charles

35 people now banned for defending racism. The last one was an Ann Coulter supporter and anti-abortion fanatic.

Maybe we should have a pool to see how many people will end up banned from all of this...

182 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:29:40am

re: #169 Ward Cleaver

Speaking of which, btw, and OT, Trader Joe's toothpaste is badly packaged - there's air in the tube, making putting paste on the toothbrush awkward.

I just thought you should all know that.

183 Kenneth  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:29:59am
Sergeant Franklin: They know that if they get detained by us, it's a nice thing. If they get detained by the Iraqi Army or Iraqi Police, they might not come out alive. Or they might be missing a finger. If they get detained by us, they don't really care. They know they'll get out soon and they're not going to get beaten.

Lieutenant Kuylman: They think we're the lesser of evils.

Sergeant Franklin: And they know how to play the game, too. If they cry abuse, it might get us in trouble. They watch TV.

184 nadnerb  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:30:02am

re: #137 iceweasel

Pat Buchanan has to go. He is a dinosaur and has gone off the reservation long ago. I couldn't care less about what he says. That MSNBC has him on regularly as their token "conservative" says alot about their portrayal of the opposition.

I grew up hearing about the "John Birchers" from my then democrat parents. Now I am beginning to see why they have always been marginalized as kooks.

Need to get going-I have to drive to a wedding in Riverside(!). Should be nice n' cool there...

185 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:30:04am

re: #163 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Perry raises possibility of states' rights showdown with White House over healthcare

Oh no. Perry's dumb enough try to make hay with that issue too, and make the GOP look like idiots when it fails. Bad Craziness.

186 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:30:12am

re: #162 BlueCanuck

Moonbat humour. Just pay it about as much attention as it deserves.

/what joke?

It's just a movie quote.

187 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:30:31am

re: #179 Walter L. Newton

Another kooky conservative politician. The party is just going to start looking worst then it has been if we start appealing to Constitutional amendments. What next, speaking out against the President? Kook.

Getting so we'll have to bust out the stocks and pillory and get them set up on the National Mall.

188 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:30:42am

re: #180 taxfreekiller

Ron Paul's power base "umbilical"ly connected to anti-war nut cases and other goofy off the reservation loons nationally.

And to the Tea Parties.

189 J.D.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:31:06am

re: #175 buzzsawmonkey

That is a perfect explanation. In every way.

190 Digital Display  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:31:29am

John Moltz made a very funny spoof of the Apollo 11 fake landings...
I don't think the troofers are going to like it...
[Link: johnmoltz.com...]

191 BlueCanuck  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:31:31am

re: #178 Jewels (AKA Julian)

Good book that. I got my Autographed by Kratman at a convention

I wonder how you can get an autographed e-book.

/problem with my obsession with electronic books. :(

192 pink freud  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:31:42am

re: #177 Russkilitlover

There are two people keeping this story alive and kicking - Gates and Obama. Neither can either admit they were wrong, nor can they shut up.

Sharpton and the Reverend Jackson are nowhere to be seen. Weird, that.

193 MrSilverDragon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:32:06am

I'm sorry to have offended you with my joke, Sharm, re: my 105.

194 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:32:14am
195 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:32:34am

re: #178 Jewels (AKA Julian)

Good book that. I got my Autographed by Kratman at a convention

I've got it, of course.

My Male's a red-shirt in the Carnifex series. He hasn't died yet, though. Tom promised to make his death a good one, when it comes.

196 Creeping Eruption  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:32:36am

re: #192 pink freud

Sharpton and the Reverend Jackson are nowhere to be seen. Weird, that.

They know Gates sure does not need their "help." He would make them look like illiterate fools.

197 MikeAlv77  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:32:37am

re: #192 pink freud

Sharpton and the Reverend Jackson are nowhere to be seen. Weird, that.

Could it be that even they are smart enough to keep their mouth shut? Nah...

198 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:32:59am

re: #152 Alouette

What was Eisenhower doing to the country?

It's a scene in Annie Hall, where the character Woody Allen plays is doing standup.

You don't have to believe the Eisenhower was trying to 'screw the country' to find it funny. I'm surprised so many people haven't seen Annie Hall, but then again there are loads of classic movies I haven't seen.
The joke is non partisan.

199 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:33:01am

re: #192 pink freud

Sharpton and the Reverend Jackson are nowhere to be seen. Weird, that.

No so, Sharpton has weight in on this. He made some comment about this being a case of "living in a house while black."

No link right now, but I heard the quote on the radio.

200 Ojoe  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:33:23am

re: #12 zombie

That is not art.

This is art.

201 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:33:26am

re: #171 Dianna

He read A State of Disobedience? And didn't understand it?



Perry heartily backed an unsuccessful resolution in this year’s legislative session that would have affirmed the belief that Texas has sovereignty under the 10th Amendment over all powers not otherwise granted to the federal government.

The resolution failed because the Dems shot it down.

202 pink freud  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:34:02am

re: #197 MikeAlv77

Could it be that even they are smart enough to keep their mouth shut? Nah...

Never stopped them before. For that matter ...where's the ACLU?

Normally those three would be all over a situation like this.

203 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:34:25am
204 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:34:25am
205 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:34:42am

re: #200 Ojoe

That is not art.

This is art.

403?

206 J.S.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:35:05am

re: #191 BlueCanuck

Well, now, wait a sec -- have you heard about margaret Atwood's "longPen"? that's how she does her book signings -- by teleautograph...link

207 theheat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:35:08am

I still want to know how many people were on that particular tea party mailing list, and how many thought the image was okay compared to how many actually took some kind of action saying it was racist bullshit. Ultimately, I'm curious how many conservatives think this shit is okie dokie, and how many are finding ways to downplay it or justify it.

It's no surprise the guy is a buddy of Ron Paul's, an anti-vaxxer, and probably an incompetent doctor. I would think his transgressions don't end there, and it probably only gets juicier.

208 pink freud  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:35:13am

re: #199 Walter L. Newton

Thanks. Hadn't heard that.

209 J.D.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:35:18am

re: #200 Ojoe

That is not art.

This is art.

Is it X-rated or something*?

*Link doesn't work.

210 jcm  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:35:25am

re: #148 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Gibbs: Media 'obsessions' prolonging Gates story

Perhaps he should have thought about that before opening his mouth.

I heard a radio report, Sgt. Crowley when the incident started south opened his mic on the radio. They are deciding if they should release the tape.

Any decision to hold it is probably a legal decision, save it for the up coming lawsuit.

211 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:35:39am

re: #200 Ojoe

That is not art.

This is art.

this is art...
Image: 68-camaro-front.jpg

212 Russkilitlover  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:35:44am

re: #192 pink freud

Sharpton and the Reverend Jackson are nowhere to be seen. Weird, that.

Actually, I think Sharpton did come out and say some of his usual nonsense. I don't have a link, but I heard audio on either news or radio show a couple of days ago.

I think Jackson is persona non grata with the Obama crowd. He's nowhere to be found with or around Obama. That whole "I want to cut his balls off" thing is hard to recover from!

213 Shr_Nfr  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:35:56am

Foolish, boorish, bad manners, all the rest. Fruitcake too. But where was the outrage when we had the Bush-chimp pictures? The guy that they photoshopped is not even African, he is from New Guinea given his outfit. I do not think it was right for the guy to do it, but if you go back to the Adams-Jefferson cartoons, they make this look like good manners.

214 DaddyG  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:35:57am

re: #191 BlueCanuck

I wonder how you can get an autographed e-book.

/problem with my obsession with electronic books. :(

Digital signature.

215 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:36:02am

re: #203 taxfreekiller

Woody Allen often backs up John F. Kerry's lies.

So what? Doesn't affect the quality (or lack thereof) of his movies. Especially the ones made long before he backed kerry on anything.

216 SixDegrees  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:36:12am

re: #200 Ojoe

That is not art.

This is art.

Forbidden. Someone doesn't like you linking directly to their images.

Try a link to the page it's on.

217 J.D.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:36:23am

re: #211 albusteve

this is art...
[Link: www.autonationals.com...]

Proving once again that beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

218 BlueCanuck  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:36:27am

re: #206 J.S.

Now that looks cool, Just need to add that to my mobi reader as a file and I am set. :)

219 CommonCents  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:36:33am

re: #146 Kenneth

New from Totten:
... They ignore the truth.

Things are the same all over the world.

220 eschew_obfuscation  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:36:45am

re: #163 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Perry raises possibility of states' rights showdown with White House over healthcare

There are approx. 35 states that have had some states' rights resolution considered in their legislatures.

221 Gearhead  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:37:07am

re: #200 Ojoe

That is not art.

This is art.

"Forbidden" - one of my favorite works. It says so much about life and what motivates us as human beings...

Wait. It's just an error message?

222 MrSilverDragon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:37:10am

re: #212 Russkilitlover

Actually, I think Sharpton did come out and say some of his usual nonsense. I don't have a link, but I heard audio on either news or radio show a couple of days ago.

I think Jackson is persona non grata with the Obama crowd. He's nowhere to be found with or around Obama. That whole "I want to cut his balls off" thing is hard to recover from!

You see, it was a misquote. Jackson actually said "cut his nuts off", because he knew about Obama's peanut allergy and didn't want to have to break out the epi-pen.

/spin, spin, spin

223 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:37:19am

re: #203 taxfreekiller

Woody Allen often backs up John F. Kerry's lies.

woody allen is a little shrew and a freaky ped like weasle...I can't stand the sight of him...he's crazy

224 callahan23  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:37:24am

BBIAW. Dinner 'n all.

225 J.D.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:37:25am

re: #212 Russkilitlover

Indeed. I have noticed this.
And it has been a nice "change".

226 Ojoe  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:37:25am

re: #209 J.D.

Works for me in Safari. It is a photo of the interior of Rehiems (sp?) cathedral. Here it is again:
Art.

227 Kenneth  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:37:27am

re: #198 iceweasel

The joke was partisan in that the character worked on the Eisenhower campaign, but it's pretty tame by today's standards. Updated versions of that same joke have been used in other countries too.

Annie Hall, back when Woody Allen made good movies.

Great scene with Christopher Walken...

Youtube Video
228 CommonCents  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:38:07am

re: #211 albusteve

this is art...
[Link: www.autonationals.com...]

If art is beauty and beauty is in the eye of the beholder, there are alot of blind people out there. No offense to the actual visually impaired.

229 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:38:23am

re: #226 Ojoe

Works for me in Safari. It is a photo of the interior of Rehiems (sp?) cathedral. Here it is again:
Art.

Doesn't work for me.

230 theheat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:38:29am

re: #213 Shr_Nfr

Read every post from yesterday, and if you're still scratching your head about this was so bad, you're in desperate need of re-education in the ways of polite society.

In short, it isn't cool from either side of the aisle.

231 J.S.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:38:34am

re: #226 Ojoe

still get "forbidden" 404 error.

232 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:38:53am

re: #206 J.S.

Well, now, wait a sec -- have you heard about margaret Atwood's "longPen"? that's how she does her book signings -- by teleautograph...link

That's way cool.

233 Kenneth  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:38:53am

re: #212 Russkilitlover

It's difficult not to take that personally.

234 Son of the Black Dog  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:38:54am

re: #198 iceweasel

It's a scene in Annie Hall, where the character Woody Allen plays is doing standup.

You don't have to believe the Eisenhower was trying to 'screw the country' to find it funny. I'm surprised so many people haven't seen Annie Hall, but then again there are loads of classic movies I haven't seen.
The joke is non partisan.

Wrong. Woody Allen could have picked LBJ for the joke. LBJ really was screwing the country, and not in a nice way. But that wouldn't have fit the liberal agenda.

235 midwestgak  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:38:55am

OT $1B more in grants for schools. Obama in Washington giving yet another speech at the Department of Education.

Grants do not get paid back, folks. I don't care that they are setting it up as a "competition."

"America will not succeed in the 21st century unless . . ." Using that tired threat yet again.

Have to turn the channel. sheesh.

236 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:38:55am

re: #213 Shr_Nfr

Foolish, boorish, bad manners, all the rest. Fruitcake too. But where was the outrage when we had the Bush-chimp pictures? The guy that they photoshopped is not even African, he is from New Guinea given his outfit. I do not think it was right for the guy to do it, but if you go back to the Adams-Jefferson cartoons, they make this look like good manners.

Excuse me, but there was plenty of outrage about the Bush-chimp pictures. Where were you? And why are you trying to make excuses for this?

237 SixDegrees  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:39:03am

re: #226 Ojoe

Works for me in Safari. It is a photo of the interior of Rehiems (sp?) cathedral. Here it is again:
Art.

Nope. Same problem.

You probably visited the page it is found on, so the image is in your cache. It's retrieved from there when you request it, instead of from the server. The rest of us aren't so lucky, and the server is configured to reject direct requests for images.

238 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:39:18am

re: #223 albusteve

woody allen is a little shrew and a freaky ped like weasle...I can't stand the sight of him...he's crazy

You're going to call me a 'freaky ped' because I like one of the great Woody Allen movies?

Get help.

239 J.D.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:39:31am

re: #226 Ojoe

Works for me in Safari. It is a photo of the interior of Rehiems (sp?) cathedral. Here it is again:
Art.

Ojoe, why are you holding out on us?

240 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:39:43am

re: #228 CommonCents

If art is beauty and beauty is in the eye of the beholder, there are alot of blind people out there. No offense to the actual visually impaired.

you don't like my car?

241 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:39:51am

re: #175 buzzsawmonkey

In the days prior to the Industrial Revolution, "art" was inseparable from artisanship. The artist was an artisan, since he constructed by hand the beautiful versions of things in the days everything was done by hand.

With the advent of the Industrial Revolution, there was a split. "Commercial" art was involved in making beautiful, or salable, the products of mechanical artisanship; "pure"--i.e., allegedly noncommercial--art was increasingly at sea trying to find a mission for itself, while continually looking down its collective nose at its more commercial cousin.

Today, "art"--so-called noncommercial art, that is--has been reduced to aping the images of commercial art, but it proves its "purity" by doing so badly. The Lai paintings are too ugly, crude and amateurish to qualify as pornography for any commercial pornographer. "Artsy" films or television programs pride themselves on their ugliness, grating qualities, dreariness, etc.--for it is their ugliness that distinguishes them from their commercial counterparts. The same holds true in the decorative arts, where for the most part the way "serious" paintings distinguish themselves from "mere illustration" is that they are something nobody would want to look at of their own volition, but feel compelled to make obesiance to on the basis of their being decreed important.

I'm quoting your full comment simply so everybody re-reads it. Important analysis there!

242 doppelganglander  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:39:56am

re: #171 Dianna

He read A State of Disobedience? And didn't understand it?

I haven't read it. Can you explain what you mean?

243 bloodnok  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:40:03am

re: #234 Son of the Black Dog

Wrong. Woody Allen could have picked LBJ for the joke. LBJ really was screwing the country, and not in a nice way. But that wouldn't have fit the liberal agenda.

Oh for crying out loud...

244 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:40:21am

re: #227 Kenneth

I love that scene, one of my favourites!

245 Silvergirl  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:40:31am

re: #133 Silvergirl

I just read that this guy has apologized for the forwarded email. Has this been discussed here? I only logged in a bit ago.

I just found KT's post in the Overnight Thread at #1125. So yes, it has been discussed.

Silvergirl, who is talking to herself, answering her own questions. :-)

246 Ojoe  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:40:43am

re: #239 J.D.

Because of computer glitches?
Here is another photo. Art, of course.

247 yma o hyd  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:40:58am

Just briefly - skimmed the meltdown-thread from yesterday on this subject, and now this: I'm speechless.

One thing is for sure - that Lizard who said this would have a bad effect on all who try and debate obamacare is certainly right.

How people cannot see that having a racist who is also a bad doctor, or a bad doctor who is a racist to boot, can help advocating against obamacare is unbelievable.

There simply are some 'allies' who besmirch and demean any argument.
This 'doctor' is one of them.
Better off without them - they attract defeat.

248 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:41:13am

re: #235 midwestgak

OT $1B more in grants for schools. Obama in Washington giving yet another speech at the Department of Education.

Grants do not get paid back, folks. I don't care that they are setting it up as a "competition."

"America will not succeed in the 21st century unless . . ." Using that tired threat yet again.

Have to turn the channel. sheesh.

And Obama made no effort to save vouchers for DC schools, either. And kiss the charter school movement goodbye.

249 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:41:17am

re: #238 iceweasel

You're going to call me a 'freaky ped' because I like one of the great Woody Allen movies?

Get help.

hahahaha!...ped like...like a ped...weasles are MMs invention for slimy people...good one

250 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:41:26am

re: #226 Ojoe

Works for me in Safari. It is a photo of the interior of Rehiems (sp?) cathedral. Here it is again:
Art.

Ojoe, can you "go back" in your browse and post the link to the album?

251 J.D.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:42:12am

re: #232 Ward Cleaver

That's way cool.

This is cool.

I would have enjoyed that in days gone by [thankfully].

252 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:42:22am

re: #239 J.D.

Ojoe, why are you holding out on us?

Apparently Webshots doesn't like direct links to pictures.

253 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:42:35am

re: #242 doppelganglander

much easier to read this review

254 Gearhead  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:42:39am

Ojoe -

not the same site, but here you go:

http://sedulia.blogs.com/photos/france_outside_paris/reims_cathedral_interior.html

255 karmic_inquisitor  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:42:45am

Well now that we are getting the line that the "distraction" caused by Obama's remarks are "regretted" (not the remarks themselves nor that they were ill-informed), we should pay special attention to the remarks themselves.

Let's consider that we are all accustomed to a Barack Obama who, when off script, tends to inject a lot of "umms" and "ahhhs" in his speech. A great many give him crap about that, but let's consider the behavior in a generous light. Let's assume that he is searching for the best words - being cautious not to over commit, offend or misstate.

When he spoke about Gates, there was very little in the way of umms and ahhs. Obama was direct in his speech. He stated that he did not have all the facts but then stated that the Cambridge Police acted stupidly (he apparently felt he had enough facts to make that assertion). He also stated facts abou racial profiling, which was a cause of his in the Illinois Senate and a subject he has spoken on many times (in a small irony it turns out that the stupid cop himself is a trained counselor on racial profiling).

Obama's words were direct, clear and unclouded with the hesitation that comes with "umms" and "ahhs".

He pre-judged the situation. He admitted he was doing it. Then he went on to paint the cops involved as stupid and monologued on racial profiling. Without pause.

Sorry Mr. President, but if you are looking for prejudice and bigotry in government, look in the mirror.

256 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:42:47am

opps

[Link: www.spectacle.org...]

257 CommonCents  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:43:00am

re: #240 albusteve

you don't like my car?

Sorry. That was a comment that should not have been a reply. It wasn't directed at you but a statement in general.

258 Ojoe  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:43:15am

re: #250 Ward Cleaver

Here is your choice of many. I hope this works.

BBL

259 doppelganglander  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:43:21am

re: #256 Jewels (AKA Julian)

Thanks!

260 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:43:21am

re: #250 Ward Cleaver

Ojoe, can you "go back" in your browse and post the link to the album?

Here

[Link: www.worldwaronecolorphotos.com...]

261 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:43:25am

re: #246 Ojoe

Because of computer glitches?
Here is another photo. Art, of course.

how fast can it go?...does it come in any other colors?

262 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:43:30am

re: #198 iceweasel

It's a scene in Annie Hall, where the character Woody Allen plays is doing standup.

You don't have to believe the Eisenhower was trying to 'screw the country' to find it funny. I'm surprised so many people haven't seen Annie Hall, but then again there are loads of classic movies I haven't seen.
The joke is non partisan.

I have never seen a Woody Allen movie, and never intend to.

263 Jewels (AKA Julian)  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:43:46am

re: #259 doppelganglander

or this one

[Link: blogcritics.org...]

264 J.D.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:43:52am

re: #246 Ojoe

Because of computer glitches?
Here is another photo. Art, of course.

Indeed it is.
Spectacular!

265 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:44:13am

re: #245 Silvergirl

I just found KT's post in the Overnight Thread at #1125. So yes, it has been discussed.

Silvergirl, who is talking to herself, answering her own questions. :-)

This is a completely bullshit apology from McKalip:

"The image has nothing to do with my feelings or thoughts on any race or culture," David McKalip wrote.

That's a blatant lie.

266 bloodnok  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:44:38am

re: #262 Alouette

I have never seen a Woody Allen movie, and never intend to.

Some are very funny.

267 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:44:40am

re: #242 doppelganglander

I haven't read it. Can you explain what you mean?

It's the tale of a rebellion in Texas, provoked by the US government as run by a stand in for Hillary Clinton. The female general who's a villain throughout much of the piece is probably recognizable to a lot of military types, but not me.

The thing is, the book's point is that the Federal government provoked an unwilling and reluctant Texas to defend itself, and precipitated a general rebellion. It wasn't done by an insurance plan. It was done by armed intervention by the Feds against private citizens in Texas.

It's not a bad book. Buy it used, you might enjoy it.

268 J.D.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:45:22am

re: #248 Dianna

That would be the "Chicago" way, if I am to understand it correctly.

269 MrSilverDragon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:45:38am

re: #262 Alouette

I have never seen a Woody Allen movie, and never intend to.

Some of them are worth watching, in my opinion. I love Annie Hall. I have a soft spot for Radio Days as an old acquaintance of mine was featured in that film (the math whiz kid).

And Sleeper, that's just plain silly fun.

Your milage may vary, of course.

270 SixDegrees  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:45:41am

re: #238 iceweasel

You're going to call me a 'freaky ped' because I like one of the great Woody Allen movies?

Get help.

I read that as "ped-like," FWIW.

271 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:45:48am

re: #28 Buster

I hope she survives her painting with Taft!

How will she do FDR?

272 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:45:59am

re: #258 Ojoe

Here is your choice of many. I hope this works.

BBL

Or we can go to Webshots and do a search for "rheims cathedral":

Like this

273 Mad Al-Jaffee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:46:07am

re: #211 albusteve

Bitchin' Camaro!

274 doppelganglander  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:46:14am

re: #267 Dianna

Thanks. I also read the review Jewels (aka Julian) linked to. Sounds interesting.

275 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:46:23am
276 DaddyG  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:46:25am

re: #246 Ojoe

Because of computer glitches?
Here is another photo. Art, of course.

Does this image buttress your position?

277 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:46:28am

re: #262 Alouette

I have never seen a Woody Allen movie, and never intend to.

You've never seen Sleeper or Bananas?

278 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:46:39am

re: #271 calcajun

How will she do FDR?

I'll leave the room.

279 J.D.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:46:43am

re: #255 karmic_inquisitor

I hate to break this to you, but you sound like a Typical Whitey.

280 Aye Pod  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:46:52am

Wow. There are stupid paintings in the world. Amazing.

281 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:47:00am

re: #265 Charles

I certainly don't believe him.

282 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:47:04am

re: #257 CommonCents

Sorry. That was a comment that should not have been a reply. It wasn't directed at you but a statement in general.

it's not really my car either

283 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:47:06am

re: #273 Mad Al-Jaffee

Bitchin' Camaro!

Did you drive it up from the Bahamas?

284 CIA Reject  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:47:11am

re: #277 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

You've never seen Sleeper or Bananas?

Or "Take the Money and Run"?

285 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:47:12am

re: #269 MrSilverDragon

Some of them are worth watching, in my opinion. I love Annie Hall. I have a soft spot for Radio Days as an old acquaintance of mine was featured in that film (the math whiz kid).

And Sleeper, that's just plain silly fun.

Your milage may vary, of course.

If I should ever get an urge to watch a Woody Allen movie, I will watch a Mel Brooks movie instead.

286 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:47:37am
287 theheat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:48:50am

re: #282 albusteve

As long as no mullets are involved, I can dig on the muscle cars. It's too early in the day for mullets.

288 Ringo the Gringo  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:48:52am

Re: zombie's post -

Here's a couple of excellent essays by Stephen Hicks: Why Art Became Ugly

Post-Postmodern Art


I also highly recommend Hicks book: Explaining Postmodernism: Skepticism and Socialism from Rousseau to Foucault

289 DaddyG  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:49:00am

re: #285 Alouette

If I should ever get an urge to watch a Woody Allen movie, I will watch a Mel Brooks movie instead.

I think you are biased against good protestant humor. And as soon as I can find any I'll prove my point. /

290 MrSilverDragon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:49:05am

re: #285 Alouette

If I should ever get an urge to watch a Woody Allen movie, I will watch a Mel Brooks movie instead.

I can accept that, I love Mel Brooks, too. I watch Young Frankenstein at least 4 times a year, and History of the World Part 1 probably 6.

291 Silvergirl  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:49:14am

re: #265 Charles

That's a blatant lie.

He's not thinking about what would possess him to forward something like that. Wouldn't people with a modicum of sensitivity at least delete the email instead of sending to a load of people, and then writing "this is funny" or whatever commentary he added? Yes, he's also lying to himself.

292 midwestgak  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:49:15am

re: #285 Alouette

If I should ever get an urge to watch a Woody Allen movie, I will watch a Mel Brooks movie instead.

That causes me to have High Axniety.

293 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:49:38am

re: #262 Alouette

I have never seen a Woody Allen movie, and never intend to.

That's a shame. Some are very good-- see bloodnok and SilverDragon's posts on this. You don't have to endorse Allen's personal life or his politics to like some of his movies.

I'd recommend Annie Hall, Manhattan, Radio Days, and Take the Money and Run.

BTW, I don't like Woody Allen's choices. I don't like Sean Penn's either, but I still think he was great in Mystic River.

294 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:49:40am

re: #273 Mad Al-Jaffee

Bitchin' Camaro!

my BinL races one exactly like it, in orange...396/445hp

295 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:49:41am

re: #266 bloodnok

I recommend "Sleeper".

296 Russkilitlover  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:50:13am

re: #247 yma o hyd


One thing is for sure - that Lizard who said this would have a bad effect on all who try and debate obamacare is certainly right.

I don't agree. For one thing, the Gates/police issue being (surprisingly) pursued by so much of the media is turning a lot of Independents and Blue Dog Democrats off. These are the ones who clung to the Hope that an Obama presidency meant and end to racial issues for all time. The fact that Obama himself "stupidly" made those comments, continues to makes stupid comments and refuses to admit his fault, is not sitting well with a number of his own supporters.

Couple that with a large amount of Dems who genuinely do NOT like the Obamacare package, nor the speed with which they were being told to pass it.

This picture is racist and vile. But I don't think it will damage anti-policy discussions as much as Obama's own behavior over the Gates issue. IMO.

297 midwestgak  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:50:32am

re: #292 midwestgak

That causes me to have High Axniety.

Or Anxiety, as it were.

298 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:50:34am

re: #281 Sharmuta

I certainly don't believe him.

not unless he instantly changed his world view somehow...he's a fraud

299 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:50:50am

re: #273 Mad Al-Jaffee

Bitchin' Camaro!

Which reminds me of this (the seventh picture).

/that site has been around for a looong time

300 bloodnok  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:50:51am

re: #295 calcajun

I recommend "Sleeper".

So do I. That, Manhattan and Love and Death.

301 Aye Pod  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:50:55am

Given the info in this thread, the irony of Dr Mc Kalip using 'witchdoctor' on anyone else is pretty staggering.

302 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:51:38am

re: #278 Ward Cleaver

I'll leave the room.

Now, if she does JFK, that will be boring, because he did everyone.
Clinton? Cigar?


Please, tell me this woman did not get a grant from the NEA.

303 DaddyG  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:51:46am

re: #287 theheat

As long as no mullets are involved, I can dig on the muscle cars. It's too early in the day for mullets.


Mulletts!

304 ShanghaiEd  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:51:47am

And on the racism front, the hits keep on coming:

Grand Prairie officers on leave after
racist Obama e-mail circulated

305 Aye Pod  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:51:47am

re: #293 iceweasel

My favourite is "Play it Again Sam".

306 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:51:57am

re: #301 Jimmah

Given the info in this thread, the irony of Dr Mc Kalip using 'witchdoctor' on anyone else is pretty staggering.

Irony so thick, you can cut it with a knife.

307 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:52:37am

re: #303 DaddyG

Mulletts!

Business in front, party in back!

308 Mad Al-Jaffee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:52:48am

Woody Allen may have done some creepy and immoral things, but nothing illegal (as far as I know.) He's no Roman Polanski.

309 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:53:05am

re: #274 doppelganglander

Thanks. I also read the review Jewels (aka Julian) linked to. Sounds interesting.

Tom Kratman's a pretty good guy. His books tend to be extended rants, but I like them.

I'm hoping that when he comes out to the west coast, we'll get a chance to host him.

310 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:53:13am

re: #292 midwestgak

That causes me to have High Axniety.

High Anxiety -- whenever you're near,
High Anxiety -- it's you that I fear.
My heart's afraid to fly, it's crashed before.
But then you take my hand, and my heart starts to soar
Once more. . . Key change!

High Anxiety -- it's always the same.
High Anxiety -- it's you that I blame.
It's very clear to me, I've got to give in!
High Anxiety --
-- and remember, kids, be good to your folks - they've
been good to you --
-- you win!

311 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:53:26am

re: #273 Mad Al-Jaffee

Bitchin' Camaro!

Wow! Dead Milkmen ref?

Youtube Video
312 Spider Mensch  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:53:27am

re: #302 calcajun

Now, if she does JFK, that will be boring, because he did everyone.
Clinton? Cigar?


Please, tell me this woman did not get a grant from the NEA.


ask not "Can I do JFK? But ask, Can JFK do you?"

313 Mad Al-Jaffee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:53:52am

re: #278 Ward Cleaver

It's a good think Hilary's not president!

314 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:54:20am

re: #277 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

You've never seen Sleeper or Bananas?

Or Love and Death?

315 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:54:23am

re: #312 Spider Mensch

ask not "Can I do JFK? But ask, Can JFK do you?"

Oh, Lord. It's gonna be one of them days, is it.

316 theheat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:54:37am

re: #307 Ward Cleaver

Unless you're Kate Gosselin, then it's party in the back, bizness in the front.

All bad. All of it.

317 Son of the Black Dog  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:54:43am

re: #236 Charles

Excuse me, but there was plenty of outrage about the Bush-chimp pictures. Where were you? And why are you trying to make excuses for this?

I'm sorry Charles, but I don't remember much outrage about the Bush-chimp pictures, and I pay pretty close attention. I remember a lot of the so-called intelligentsia promulgating disgusting parodies of GWB, the Bush daughters, Dick Cheney, Condi Rice, and other assorted members of the administration. Everything I remember points to everyone in the media thinking that this was great fun, and being very approving.

WRT the photoshop of Obama, I agree that it is tasteless, disgusting, racist, and not helpful to the fight against misguided Democrat programs. But the previous poster was correct that it is mild compared to a lot of what has passed for political satire in this country back to its founding.

318 CIA Reject  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:54:49am

re: #300 bloodnok

So do I. That, Manhattan and Love and Death.

"What's Up Tigerlilly" was funny as well as very creative.

Although today it would probably be labeled RACIST!

It's a shame that Allen chose to become an asshole...

319 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:54:49am

re: #308 Mad Al-Jaffee

Woody Allen may have done some creepy and immoral things, but nothing illegal (as far as I know.) He's no Roman Polanski.

I just don't like his hair...the clarinet is kins cool tho

320 karmic_inquisitor  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:54:50am

re: #265 Charles

"The image has nothing to do with my feelings or thoughts on any race or culture," David McKalip wrote.

He must really think everyone in the world is stupid.

For the sake of examining his statement, let's grant the excuse that "this is only a picture of a witch doctor and nothing more".

OK - isn't portraying the president as a witch doctor and then calling it "obamacare" make a judgment about cultures that have witch doctors? Doesn't that express, in and of itself, "feelings or thoughts" about such cultures?

I am not a multi culturalist (I posted yesterday that I am an aculturalist) and I don't place all cultures as equal (I find them all corrupting), but there is no way that that image does not pass judgement (negative judgment) on a culture.

Like Charles said - a bald lie.

321 Russkilitlover  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:55:11am

re: #300 bloodnok

So do I. That, Manhattan and Love and Death.

Those two are my faves! Love and Death is and original ROTFLMAO.

322 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:56:07am

re: #305 Jimmah

My favourite is "Play it Again Sam".

Oh that's great too! but i adore casablanca, so there you go...I have a list of Allen films I didn't like at all but he's made so many that are great.

323 subsailor68  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:56:13am

Sad news:

Border Patrol agent killed in San Diego County

...the agent was 30 and was a three-year veteran who is survived by his wife, a 2-year-old son and an 11-month-old daughter.

God bless Robert Rosas and his family.

324 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:56:20am

re: #314 Dianna

Or Love and Death?

"What are Jews?"

"Here, I have some pictures."

"Wow! Do they all have horns?"

"No. Those are the Polish Jews."

And the Russian DI:

"You LUVVV Russia, don't you?!"
325 Mad Al-Jaffee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:57:21am

re: #293 iceweasel


BTW, I don't like Woody Allen's choices. I don't like Sean Penn's either, but I still think he was great in Mystic River.

And Penn was great in Allen's Sweet and Lowdown.

326 debutaunt  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:57:41am

re: #107 iceweasel

You say unicorn, we say pony. :)

The "pony" meme has been widespread on the left and predates Obama ("let's invade iraq and we'll all get ponies!").

One of my favourite blogs has satirically nicknamed Obama the "Magical Unity Pony" or "M.U.P" to mock all the people who believe that Obama is some kind of saint or savior.

Great Britain?

327 MandyManners  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:57:43am

FANTASTIC WORK, CHARLES AND KILGORE!

328 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:57:52am

re: #317 Son of the Black Dog

I'm sorry Charles, but I don't remember much outrage about the Bush-chimp pictures, and I pay pretty close attention.

Then you really weren't paying much attention, because the conservative blogs and news sources screamed bloody murder about every one of those pictures.

329 Shr_Nfr  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:57:53am

re: #230 theheat

I did not say it was in good taste. It wasn't. But by the same token, it is within the first amendment rights of the person who did it. If Ayres can trample on the flag, somebody can portray Obama as a witch doctor from New Guinea. The fact that it was a fruitcake who did it is indicative of the type of people who do this. But it is protected speech. I am not approving of what they did. Quite the contrary. But they did have the right to do it.

330 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:58:05am

re: #296 Russkilitlover

There is a difference between a private party putting something out - however racist and idiotic - about the President, and the President remarking on a police matter.

331 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:58:22am

re: #317 Son of the Black Dog

First I'd like to say there are right-wing fascists who to this day have racist cartoons of Dr Rice on their sites.

Second- folks at LGF were offended by the Bush/chimp photos.

Finally- just because one side does something bad, doesn't give the other side an excuse to do the same thing.

332 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:58:40am

re: #323 subsailor68

Sad news:

Border Patrol agent killed in San Diego County

...the agent was 30 and was a three-year veteran who is survived by his wife, a 2-year-old son and an 11-month-old daughter.

God bless Robert Rosas and his family.

very sad...narco terrorists?

333 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:58:59am

re: #270 SixDegrees

I read that as "ped-like," FWIW.

What does that mean, and how is it not offensive?

334 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 10:59:18am

re: #332 albusteve

very sad...narco terrorists?

Word in San Diego is that he was part of a team investigating smugglers.

335 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:00:01am

re: #317 Son of the Black Dog

The big problem is that the MSM gives its own a pass when they do something like this (Babs Boxer's latest dust up) but the GOP and conservatives are pilloried if there's even a hint that they did it. That's why this guy is a twit for even thinking about doing this.

336 debutaunt  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:00:15am

re: #314 Dianna

Or Love and Death?

"Wheat..."

337 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:00:21am

re: #326 debutaunt

Great Britain?

No, it's a US blog, and I'm talking about US blogs on the left.

338 Mad Al-Jaffee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:00:24am

re: #311 iceweasel

Wow! Dead Milkmen ref?

Youtube Video

Yup. I'm glad someone finally recognized it!

339 Russkilitlover  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:00:29am

re: #330 Dianna

There is a difference between a private party putting something out - however racist and idiotic - about the President, and the President remarking on a police matter and invoking race.

Expanded just a bit ;}

340 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:00:36am

re: #317 Son of the Black Dog

Updinged for your understanding of historical nastiness.

341 subsailor68  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:00:56am

re: #332 albusteve

very sad...narco terrorists?

Not sure, but I'd bet you're right. From the article:

Other agents lost radio contact with him shortly after 9 p.m. then heard gunshots. They found the agent, who was pronounced dead at the scene.

The San Diego County Sheriff's Department said he was shot in the head.

That sounds more like professional drug bastards/terrorists than anything else, but no specifics yet.

342 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:02:01am

re: #334 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Word in San Diego is that he was part of a team investigating smugglers.

he should not have been alone...wait and see I guess

343 Russkilitlover  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:02:08am

re: #334 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Word in San Diego is that he was part of a team investigating smugglers.

So now it starts spilling over the California border. Our Homeland Security (Czarina?) and Hillary will be blaming America for this increased violence in 3...2...1...

344 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:02:12am

re: #288 Ringo the Gringo

Re: zombie's post -

Here's a couple of excellent essays by Stephen Hicks: Why Art Became Ugly

Post-Postmodern Art

I also highly recommend Hicks book: Explaining Postmodernism: Skepticism and Socialism from Rousseau to Foucault

Stephen Pinker's game-changing book The Blank Slate also has some devastating analyses of modern art.

(And I can't recommend that book highly enough. If you read only one book this year, make it The Blank Slate!)

345 debutaunt  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:02:18am

re: #337 iceweasel

No, it's a US blog, and I'm talking about US blogs on the left.

I noticed you spelled favorite with the British spelling.

346 theheat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:02:20am

re: #329 Shr_Nfr

You can call it portraying Obama as a witch doctor, but it was a racial stereotype. Certainly, they had the right to do it. They did do it. Likewise, people have the right to call it what it was, racist.

Klukkers have the right to spew all kinds of racist hatred. Doesn't mean they aren't loathsome racist cocksuckers. They are.

347 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:02:22am

re: #290 MrSilverDragon

I can accept that, I love Mel Brooks, too. I watch Young Frankenstein at least 4 times a year, and History of the World Part 1 probably 6.

One of the things that makes "Young Frankenstein" unique among the Mel Brooks films is that it isn't entirely a Mel Brooks Film.

Gene Wilder wrote the screenplay himself, then asked Mel to direct when it was going to be filmed.

348 StillAMarine  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:02:28am

I would really love to see the results of a poll of lizardoids as to who they would choose in a nightmare contest between Obama and Ron Paul as president. Of course it is simply masochistic of me to even think of such a hideous situation, but I am curious.
Of course the Ron Paulians would try to rig any such poll, and the results would be suspect. But then Obama would unleash Acorn, and perhaps each side's cheating would cancel out.

349 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:02:30am

re: #338 Mad Al-Jaffee

Yup. I'm glad someone finally recognized it!

You bet! Loved them, once upon a time. :)

350 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:02:44am
351 Shr_Nfr  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:02:45am

re: #236 Charles

There was some outrage on the right, but certainly not in the MSM. I agree that this is in very bad taste, but I also agree that it is within the protected speech of the first amendment. Review your constitutional history a bit. The most fundamentally protected speech is political speech. I regard the picture as being in bad taste. I regard Ron Paul as a loon, I regard the nirthers as loons, I regard the anti-immunization folks as an outright hazard. But having said that, this is protected speech under the constitution.

352 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:03:03am
353 J.S.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:03:04am

re: #345 debutaunt

could be Canadian also...

354 Aye Pod  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:03:18am

re: #322 iceweasel

I love most of his movies from the 70's/80's. Haven't seen anything since Mighty Aphrodite though (which I liked).

355 Mad Al-Jaffee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:03:33am

re: #349 iceweasel

You bet! Loved them, once upon a time. :)

Yeah, back in those turbulent high school years called the 80s.

356 Ward Cleaver  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:03:38am

It's about time. "Evangelist" Tony Alamo convicted.

357 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:03:43am

re: #351 Shr_Nfr

There was some outrage on the right, but certainly not in the MSM. I agree that this is in very bad taste, but I also agree that it is within the protected speech of the first amendment. Review your constitutional history a bit. The most fundamentally protected speech is political speech. I regard the picture as being in bad taste. I regard Ron Paul as a loon, I regard the nirthers as loons, I regard the anti-immunization folks as an outright hazard. But having said that, this is protected speech under the constitution.

So what? Who ever said it wasn't protected speech?

And again, why are you defending this?

358 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:04:16am
359 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:04:40am

re: #342 albusteve

he should not have been alone...wait and see I guess

Apparently the suspects had scattered or broken up and they had split up to track them when they lost contact with him, then heard gunfire.

360 Kronocide  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:04:43am

re: #357 Charles

So what? Who ever said it wasn't protected speech?

And again, why are you defending this?

It's a non-defense defense.

361 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:04:47am

re: #345 debutaunt

I noticed you spelled favorite with the British spelling.

True. I was talking about the US left and US blogs, though.

362 JHW  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:04:47am
We are not enemies, but friends. We must not be enemies. Though passion may have strained it must not break our bonds of affection. The mystic chords of memory, stretching from every battlefield and patriot grave to every living heart and hearthstone all over this broad land, will yet swell the chorus of the Union, when again touched, as surely they will be, by the better angels of our nature.


A. Lincoln, First inaugural address, Mar. 4, 1861

363 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:05:32am

re: #351 Shr_Nfr

There was some outrage on the right, but certainly not in the MSM. I agree that this is in very bad taste, but I also agree that it is within the protected speech of the first amendment. Review your constitutional history a bit. The most fundamentally protected speech is political speech. I regard the picture as being in bad taste. I regard Ron Paul as a loon, I regard the nirthers as loons, I regard the anti-immunization folks as an outright hazard. But having said that, this is protected speech under the constitution.

What a strawman! Where has Charles advocated this isn't free speech or not protected by the Constitution?!

We don't have speech laws like in europe, but we certainly have a social code where we, collectively and without the government, shun this sort of thing. This is the social consequence of free speech. You're free to say what you want. We're free to criticize it.

364 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:07:00am

re: #361 iceweasel

True. I was talking about the US left and US blogs, though.

Why is IW location so important? I've seen a number of people try to nail her on this, but why, I don't understand.

Considering the global nature of the internet (and the world today), I'm interested in many points of views.

What am I missing? Or do some people like to just make trouble?

365 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:07:44am

re: #359 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Apparently the suspects had scattered or broken up and they had split up to track them when they lost contact with him, then heard gunfire.

I read it but it seems very bold to go off on your own like that...mighty brave guy...I could blow here...border security?

366 doppelganglander  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:08:22am

re: #344 zombie

Stephen Pinker's game-changing book The Blank Slate also has some devastating analyses of modern art.

(And I can't recommend that book highly enough. If you read only one book this year, make it The Blank Slate!)

That looks very interesting. It's going on the Wish List.

367 Ringo the Gringo  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:08:43am
re: #351 Shr_Nfr

...But having said that, this is protected speech under the constitution.

Who said it wasn't?

368 SixDegrees  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:08:47am

re: #333 iceweasel

What does that mean, and how is it not offensive?

There's a world of difference between "a ped-like weasle" and "a ped, like weasle."

369 Son of the Black Dog  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:08:52am

re: #328 Charles

Then you really weren't paying much attention, because the conservative blogs and news sources screamed bloody murder about every one of those pictures.

True, but the MSM either ignored or approved, if not actively disseminating the material, e.g., Ted Rall.

370 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:09:12am

Y'all see this?

Former Secretary of State Madeleine K. Albright on Thursday delivered some spectacular news to all Americans ashamed of their homeland: With President Obama now in office, you no longer have to pretend you're not from the States when you summer in Europe.

371 reine.de.tout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:09:24am

re: #333 iceweasel

What does that mean, and how is it not offensive?

Ice - reading Albusteve's comment, I thought he meant that Woody Allen is a little shrew and a ped-like weasel, using the definition of weasel that means a cunning or sneaky person, not using "weasel" as an alternate for "iceweaswel". So I did NOT understand his comment to mean that he was calling you a ped - like Woody Allen.


re: #223 albusteve

woody allen is a little shrew and a freaky ped like weasle...I can't stand the sight of him...he's crazy

372 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:09:55am
373 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:10:12am

re: #370 NJDhockeyfan

Y'all see this?

Fine. Who can afford to go to friggin' Europe now since the bottom dropped out of the Dollar?

374 Aye Pod  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:10:35am

re: #364 Walter L. Newton

Why is IW location so important? I've seen a number of people try to nail her on this, but why, I don't understand.

Considering the global nature of the internet (and the world today), I'm interested in many points of views.

What am I missing? Or do some people like to just make trouble?

Some people here love to be able to say, when they find themselves in disagreement with you :

"Ah - a 'limey'...figures"

as it it's some sort of clincher for them.

375 subsailor68  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:10:43am

Again, a little OT, but there's some good news:

Evangelist Tony Alamo Found Guilty of Taking Young Girls From State to State for Sex

This paragraph blew me away:

Defense lawyers said the government targeted Alamo because it doesn't like his brand of Christianity.

Counselors, I know you have to mount a defense, but gotta say, if his "brand of Christianity" - in his mind - includes "taking young girls from state to state for sex" I'm okay with the government targeting him.

376 The False God  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:10:52am

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, and say that "Yes, this most likely is racist.", having seen such an obvious connection.

I still stand by the idea that you can parody Obama as a witch doctor, if you're not a racist, and be topical. If they could parody Hillary as the Wicked Witch of the West, then I don't see what's so innately wrong about a political commentary on Obama in such a way. I mean, we live in a country where political satire of a hundred years ago was downright cruel. There's certainly a tradition for it.

McKalip is a moron, as well, and anyone associating themselves with Ron Paul cannot be good.

377 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:11:17am
378 Ringo the Gringo  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:11:23am

zombie,

If you read only one book this year, make it The Blank Slate!

I just picked up a copy of The Blank Slate at a garage sale last weekend. I had been meaning to read it for a while now.

I'll start it tonight.

379 Kronocide  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:11:30am

re: #370 NJDhockeyfan

Responsible parents are usually not popular with their children or their children's friends. Doing the right thing is not always popular.

380 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:11:31am

re: #366 doppelganglander

That looks very interesting. It's going on the Wish List.

It's more than interesting. It really is a revelation. A cluebat in book form.

381 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:11:45am

re: #368 SixDegrees

There's a world of difference between "a ped-like weasle" and "a ped, like weasle."

Good points. I'd certainly normally interpret it in the first manner.

382 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:12:01am
383 theheat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:12:09am

re: #370 NJDhockeyfan

Some of Mr. Obama's most visible diplomatic initiatives have targeted rogue nations, including Iran, Cuba, Venezuela, Syria and North Korea. He was photographed with a broad smile as he shook hands with Venezuela's Hugo Chavez, who has berated America and made overtures to the Castro brothers in Cuba. The new president even bowed to Saudi King Abdullah at a London summit in April.

I think Madeline's been eating food cooked in aluminum pans for much too long.

Personally, it would be a cold day in hell before I'd apologize for being an American.

384 midwestgak  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:12:13am

re: #371 reine.de.tout

You peace maker you. Good explanation of what was intended.

385 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:12:24am

Obama just keeps digging that hole deeper.

Earlier in the day, White House Press Secretary Robert Gibbs dismissed a suggestion that the backlash from police groups could be distressing to the White House, given that Obama has enjoyed a positive relationship with the law enforcement community.

"I think the Fraternal Order of Police endorsed McCain," Gibbs fired back, referring to Obama's Republican opponent in the 2008 election. "If I'm not mistaken."

When a reporter pointed out that Obama had won the support of the Policemen's Benevolent Association, Gibbs conceded: "We got some."

386 Irenicum  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:12:34am

re: #29 Dark_Falcon

Yesterday definitely helped contribute to man-made global warming!

387 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:12:39am

re: #376 The False God

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, and say that "Yes, this most likely is racist.", having seen such an obvious connection.

I still stand by the idea that you can parody Obama as a witch doctor, if you're not a racist, and be topical. If they could parody Hillary as the Wicked Witch of the West, then I don't see what's so innately wrong about a political commentary on Obama in such a way. I mean, we live in a country where political satire of a hundred years ago was downright cruel. There's certainly a tradition for it.

McKalip is a moron, as well, and anyone associating themselves with Ron Paul cannot be good.

If you can't say "THIS IS RACIST" then you have a very skewed understanding of racism.

What's your age?

388 karmic_inquisitor  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:12:48am

re: #175 buzzsawmonkey

In the days prior to the Industrial Revolution, "art" was inseparable from artisanship. The artist was an artisan, since he constructed by hand the beautiful versions of things in the days everything was done by hand.

With the advent of the Industrial Revolution, there was a split. "Commercial" art was involved in making beautiful, or salable, the products of mechanical artisanship; "pure"--i.e., allegedly noncommercial--art was increasingly at sea trying to find a mission for itself, while continually looking down its collective nose at its more commercial cousin.

Today, "art"--so-called noncommercial art, that is--has been reduced to aping the images of commercial art, but it proves its "purity" by doing so badly. The Lai paintings are too ugly, crude and amateurish to qualify as pornography for any commercial pornographer. "Artsy" films or television programs pride themselves on their ugliness, grating qualities, dreariness, etc.--for it is their ugliness that distinguishes them from their commercial counterparts. The same holds true in the decorative arts, where for the most part the way "serious" paintings distinguish themselves from "mere illustration" is that they are something nobody would want to look at of their own volition, but feel compelled to make obesiance to on the basis of their being decreed important.


First, thanks Zombie for emphasizing buzzsaw's post. Updings to both of you.

Not sure either would agree outright, but the "serious" art community seems to find that a political subtext to a work is necessary for it to be serious. Otherwise it is just aesthetics. And when I say "political" i mean anything having to do with power of one over another, be it governmental or simply realtionships between "group x" and "group y" and the implied injustices of such relationships.

I am having a hard time thinking of a contemporary art movement that does nt have a political dimension to it.

And if considered in that context, then we have some eslf appointed vanguards of culture imposing their views on society and judging members of that society on their willingness to accept / adopt that message, which in iteself is an overt expression of oppressive power.

Fuck them. I like being an aculturalist.

389 Shr_Nfr  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:12:51am

re: #357 Charles

Because I defend the Constitution of the United States of America. Nuff said?

390 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:12:51am
391 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:13:29am

re: #378 Ringo the Gringo

zombie,

I just picked up a copy of The Blank Slate at a garage sale last weekend. I had been meaning to read it for a while now.

I'll start it tonight.

You will not regret it! It explains so much about the modern world.

392 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:13:44am

re: #377 buzzsawmonkey

Well, that makes it all right. But, no one would buy me a drink either.

393 doppelganglander  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:14:45am

re: #380 zombie

It's more than interesting. It really is a revelation. A cluebat in book form.

I got into an online tiff recently with a person who insisted that all men are alike (dogs, basically), yet who also claimed that there is no basis in biology for the obvious differences between men and women. She didn't see any value in studying animal behavior as a way to understand human behavior, either. I should read this and then send her my copy when I'm done.

394 subsailor68  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:15:26am

re: #385 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Obama just keeps digging that hole deeper.

"I think the Fraternal Order of Police endorsed McCain," Gibbs fired back, referring to Obama's Republican opponent in the 2008 election. "If I'm not mistaken."

WTF? Gibbs, how far up your ass is your head anyway? Who cares if the FOP endorsed McCain? What's your point? Are they "racist" because they didn't endorse your guy? Do yourself a favor and stop talking.

395 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:15:32am

Good news from the UK...


The NHS has achieved the shortest waiting times since its records began, the Department of Health said today.

It also said it had met its “18 weeks” waiting time target, whereby patients referred from a GP for further treatment start that treatment within 18 weeks. The target became the operational standard for the NHS from January 1 2009. Today’s announcement confirms that the deadline was met.

The average wait for treatment for patients admitted to hospital is now just 8.6 weeks. Outpatients waited an average of 4.6 weeks at January 2009, compared to 7.4 weeks at August 2007.

Only 8.6 weeks? WOW.

396 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:15:40am
397 Silvergirl  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:15:45am

re: #389 Shr_Nfr

Because I defend the Constitution of the United States of America. Nuff said?

Not quite nuff said. Either that or too much said.

398 reine.de.tout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:16:19am

re: #384 midwestgak

You peace maker you. Good explanation of what was intended.

{gak}
Our very own unique gak.

399 karmic_inquisitor  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:16:21am

re: #385 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Obama just keeps digging that hole deeper.


How to make political enemies of cops.

Unreal.

Is Gibbs trying to get a job at the "we shoot ourselves in our feet all the time" media section of the RNC?

400 Silvergirl  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:16:47am

re: #394 subsailor68

"I think the Fraternal Order of Police endorsed McCain," Gibbs fired back, referring to Obama's Republican opponent in the 2008 election. "If I'm not mistaken."

WTF? Gibbs, how far up your ass is your head anyway? Who cares if the FOP endorsed McCain? What's your point? Are they "racist" because they didn't endorse your guy? Do yourself a favor and stop talking.

That is the sorriest excuse ever in connection with this mess.

401 midwestgak  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:17:01am

re: #389 Shr_Nfr

Because I defend the Constitution of the United States of America. Nuff said?

Better be nuff. The ice under your feet is getting thinner which comment you make on this topic.

402 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:17:09am

re: #393 doppelganglander

I got into an online tiff recently with a person who insisted that all men are alike (dogs, basically), yet who also claimed that there is no basis in biology for the obvious differences between men and women. She didn't see any value in studying animal behavior as a way to understand human behavior, either. I should read this and then send her my copy when I'm done.

That exact point (that "gender is nothing but a social construct") is one that Pinker completely eviscerates.

403 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:17:22am

re: #389 Shr_Nfr

Because I defend the Constitution of the United States of America. Nuff said?

No one is saying the doctor has the legal right to say what he wants.

But socially, we're free to condemn this. Is there a reason why you don't feel the need to?

404 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:17:46am

re: #399 karmic_inquisitor

How to make political enemies of cops.

Unreal.

Is Gibbs trying to get a job at the "we shoot ourselves in our feet all the time" media section of the RNC?


he won't last the year...total buffoon

405 Ringo the Gringo  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:17:52am

Regarding the Bush/Hitler & Bush/Chimp images (of which there were a thousand varities over past 8 years): When I confronted my friends on the left with such imagery, most of them approved - not all, but most.

Which tells me that those of us who are not on the Left should hold ourselves to a higher standard.

406 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:17:57am

re: #394 subsailor68

"I think the Fraternal Order of Police endorsed McCain," Gibbs fired back, referring to Obama's Republican opponent in the 2008 election. "If I'm not mistaken."

WTF? Gibbs, how far up your ass is your head anyway? Who cares if the FOP endorsed McCain? What's your point? Are they "racist" because they didn't endorse your guy? Do yourself a favor and stop talking.

An amazingly stupid and biased comment that shows how the folks at the White House really think.

407 Lincolntf  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:17:58am

Just got a text back from a buddy who is a big wheel in a Mass. Police Dept. union. I had asked him what he thought of the Gates/Obama deal. His response "...tire tracks..." and that was it.
Obama may have just screwed himself far more than he realizes. Firefighters and Policemen are often "opinion makers" on the local level and Barry has screwed them both lately.

408 pink freud  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:18:09am

re: #384 midwestgak

You peace maker you. Good explanation of what was intended.

She sure is, isn't she.

Agree. Good explanation.

We love our Reine. :-)

409 Aye Pod  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:18:19am

re: #389 Shr_Nfr

Because I defend the Constitution of the United States of America. Nuff said?

You are doing no such thing. You are trying to use the constitutional guarantee of free speech to stifle criticism ( a form of free speech).

410 irish rose  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:18:20am

I would never have guessed, how shocking!

/not

411 Son of the Black Dog  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:18:30am

re: #331 Sharmuta

First I'd like to say there are right-wing fascists who to this day have racist cartoons of Dr Rice on their sites.

And that's despicable, too. No argument about racist depictions of Dr. Rice. I abhor racist sites, and don't spend any time there, except when something is referred to from LGF.

Second- folks at LGF were offended by the Bush/chimp photos.

And that makes what, 3000 of us, out of 300 million Americans? My point is that the MSM and the the so-called intelligentsia never expressed disapproval.

Finally- just because one side does something bad, doesn't give the other side an excuse to do the same thing.

But then we get back to the double standard w/r/t right vs. left behavior in this country.

412 theheat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:18:51am

re: #389 Shr_Nfr

JFC, like anyone here ever said there shouldn't be freedom of speech? Why have you insisted on reminding everyone of an anti-speech claim no one has made?

It's racist freedom of speech/expression. That's the fuck what it is. Maybe you think racism is harmless, and prefer to call it defending the Constitution?

413 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:19:04am
414 midwestgak  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:19:26am

re: #401 midwestgak

Better be nuff. The ice under your feet is getting thinner whichwith each comment you make on this topic.

PIMF

415 shortshrift  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:19:40am

re: #120 zombie

And he would have had to have called it "Art", not "funny". You have provided another interesting twist for our understanding of our cultural attitudes. As does the following post:

re: #114 jcm

Why did the thread title not surprise me?

Too busy yesterday to really comment on this subject.

I say this, I'll bet most shaman are honest purveyors of there craft. They may have been by passed by science but they believe what they do.

It's not only racist, it's deeming to the belief systems of others.

Obama is a snake oil salesman. Snake oil salesmen brewed up a concoction in the backs of their wagons, knowing full well it was a scam. A little alcohol and laudanum would make anyone feel better for a little while.

Obama has cooked up a health care concoction knowing its a scam, it will feel good for a little while, but the hangover will be intense.

Obama is a snake oil salesman.

Are we to suppose that the witchdoctor should take offense by having the head of a liar replace his own?
And Obama depicted as a snake oil salesman would be offensive, but not racist?

416 lobo91  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:19:50am

re: #394 subsailor68

"I think the Fraternal Order of Police endorsed McCain," Gibbs fired back, referring to Obama's Republican opponent in the 2008 election. "If I'm not mistaken."

WTF? Gibbs, how far up your ass is your head anyway? Who cares if the FOP endorsed McCain? What's your point? Are they "racist" because they didn't endorse your guy? Do yourself a favor and stop talking.

Big shock there, anyway. The FOP is, after all, first and foremost a labor union. Obama's a Democrat.

Do the math.

417 FrogMarch  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:20:07am

The right does not need to act like the left.
The left constantly portrayed our President as Hitler or worse.
Let the left own the hate, the gay-hate and and the racial insensitivity.

Yo - folks on the "right' - start helping.

418 Shr_Nfr  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:20:57am

re: #412 theheat

You are over-generalizing. This guy is from New Guinea not Africa. Good grief.

419 MrSilverDragon  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:20:59am

re: #416 lobo91

Big shock there, anyway. The FOP is, after all, first and foremost a labor union. Obama's a Democrat.

Do the math.

I was told there'd be no math involved!

420 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:21:12am

re: #364 Walter L. Newton

Why is IW location so important? I've seen a number of people try to nail her on this, but why, I don't understand.

Considering the global nature of the internet (and the world today), I'm interested in many points of views.

What am I missing? Or do some people like to just make trouble?

Walter, thank you for bringing this up. Some people like to make trouble.

421 The False God  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:21:31am

re: #387 Walter L. Newton

23. Although like taxfreekiller said, isn't that age discrimination?

Like I said in the previous thread, people disagreeing is fine. I don't expect my opinion to be held by everyone. You shouldn't be so shocked, either, that people might look at something and not immediately see a racist message.

I agree, though, that McKalip most likely was going for that appeal, now that I know who his associates are. I'm just not ready to go running out into the wilds screaming "RACIST!" without having facts about something.

422 reine.de.tout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:21:35am

re: #408 pink freud

She sure is, isn't she.

Agree. Good explanation.

We love our Reine. :-)

{pinkie!}

423 formercorpsman  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:21:40am

re: #394 subsailor68

You know Sub, now that I have chewed on that statement for a minute or so, I would like to say I'm shocked. I'm not.

To me, it totally smacks of the division mentality that just dominates south side politic.

To think they assess something like based upon who the FOP supported in the past says quite a bit.

What a degenerate comment. I wonder what they think of the military vote?

424 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:21:52am

re: #419 MrSilverDragon

I was told there'd be no math involved!

2+2=5
memorize it

425 theheat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:22:36am

re: #418 Shr_Nfr

That doesn't mean it isn't a black man with a bone through his nose. As I said, racial stereotype.

You're hell-bent on defending this as something more lofty than the knuckle-dragging racist horseshit it is.

WTF. I guess we all need hobbies.

426 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:22:38am
427 subsailor68  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:22:47am

re: #416 lobo91

Big shock there, anyway. The FOP is, after all, first and foremost a labor union. Obama's a Democrat.

Do the math.

Hi lobo91! Interesting point. FOP, being a union, might well have been expected to endorse Obama as a Democrat, but - at appears - they didn't. Hmmm..pretty smart bunch of guys and gals! No wonder Gibbs is whining.

;-)

428 jcm  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:23:02am

re: #351 Shr_Nfr

There was some outrage on the right, but certainly not in the MSM. I agree that this is in very bad taste, but I also agree that it is within the protected speech of the first amendment. Review your constitutional history a bit. The most fundamentally protected speech is political speech. I regard the picture as being in bad taste. I regard Ron Paul as a loon, I regard the nirthers as loons, I regard the anti-immunization folks as an outright hazard. But having said that, this is protected speech under the constitution.

Speech is not protected from criticism.

429 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:23:07am

re: #418 Shr_Nfr

You are over-generalizing. This guy is from New Guinea not Africa. Good grief.

It's a picture of a black man with a BONE THROUGH HIS FREAKING NOSE. Your "defender of the Constitution" pose is starting to slip.

430 Killgore Trout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:23:24am

re: #403 Sharmuta


No one is saying the doctor has the legal right to say what he wants.

But socially, we're free to condemn this. Is there a reason why you don't feel the need to?


Exactly. It's also worth noting that neither Charles or anyone else here is urging people to contact his hospital or the medical board to get him fired over this like the Kos Kidz are doing. He certainly has the right to photoshop anything he wants. Pointing out his racism is not restricting his free speech.

431 karmic_inquisitor  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:23:38am

re: #389 Shr_Nfr

Because I defend the Constitution of the United States of America. Nuff said?

So any speech that is protected is therefore worthy of support?

And attacking someone's statement is a form of denying them constitutional rights?

OK - I propose that we abandon the Constitution via an ammendment that reads "The Constitution of the United States is hereby rendered null and void and all power vested in all of the governments of the United States is hereby vested to Karmic Inquisitor and his heirs in perpetuity."

What do you think of that? Can you argue against it without attacking my Constitutional rights?

432 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:24:04am

re: #416 lobo91

Big shock there, anyway. The FOP is, after all, first and foremost a labor union. Obama's a Democrat.

Do the math.

Try rereading that. The FOP endorsed McCain. When a reporter asked if Obama's comments hurt his relationship with police groups, the White House Press secretary basically said the relationship was bad already since they had supported McCain. Real nice attitude, so much for the post partisan era.

433 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:24:04am

re: #411 Son of the Black Dog

I think we need to accept the hand we're dealt and move on. Whining about media bias doesn't change anything. And it still doesn't give us the excuse to behave like them. It's wrong. We don't look like a party of grown adults when we do this, but we still want to think we're the adults. We can't claim that mantle when we use juvenile excuse like, "but the left did chimpy mchitlerburton". That's not even junior high, Dog. That's grade school.

434 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:24:25am

re: #415 shortshrift

And he would have had to have called it "Art", not "funny". You have provided another interesting twist for our understanding of our cultural attitudes. As does the following post:

re: #114 jcm

Are we to suppose that the witchdoctor should take offense by having the head of a liar replace his own?
And Obama depicted as a snake oil salesman would be offensive, but not racist?

You're not serious, are you? A witch doctor would have been considered the highest ranking "neanderthal" of the Africa culture. Just as doctors were exulted in European cultures, black witch doctors were looked on as a joke, a "black" scientist, the best that the black race could produce.

A snake oil salesman was normally white, quick of gab, smart, clever. Many people looked up to them, even though he was probably no more effective than a real witch doctor.

No comparison.

435 lobo91  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:24:31am

re: #423 formercorpsman

What a degenerate comment. I wonder what they think of the military vote?

Given recent history, I'd say they mostly think of it in terms of how to keep it from being counted.

436 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:24:44am

Walter...where are you from and why do you spell funny?...thanks. albusteve

437 Irenicum  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:25:12am

re: #57 buzzsawmonkey

I see you're channeling your inner George Castanza.

438 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:25:16am

re: #423 formercorpsman

You know Sub, now that I have chewed on that statement for a minute or so, I would like to say I'm shocked. I'm not.

To me, it totally smacks of the division mentality that just dominates south side politic.

To think they assess something like based upon who the FOP supported in the past says quite a bit.

What a degenerate comment. I wonder what they think of the military vote?

Military vote? We'll just keep em busy and screw with the absentee votes using ACORN.

/

439 formercorpsman  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:25:20am

re: #430 Killgore Trout

Totally valid point.

440 turn  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:25:34am

re: #376 The False God

What do you mean by "dark power is within your heart"? That doesn't make any sense to me.

441 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:25:51am

re: #430 Killgore Trout

Exactly. It's also worth noting that neither Charles or anyone else here is urging people to contact his hospital or the medical board to get him fired over this like the Kos Kidz are doing. He certainly has the right to photoshop anything he wants. Pointing out his racism is not restricting his free speech.

not pointing it out or ignoring it is nearly as bad...

442 StillAMarine  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:26:21am

re: #423 formercorpsman

Hey, FormerCorpsman, I just had a look at your "Reflections" avatar. My wife gave me one of those for Father's day. I had never seen or heard of "Reflections" before that. Trust me, I am glad only my wife was present because most people do not like to see a grown man cry.

443 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:26:35am

re: #421 The False God

I agree, though, that McKalip most likely was going for that appeal, now that I know who his associates are. I'm just not ready to go running out into the wilds screaming "RACIST!" without having facts about something.

The guy circulated a picture that is blatantly, obviously racist. I would call that a "fact."

444 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:26:35am

re: #389 Shr_Nfr

Because I defend the Constitution of the United States of America. Nuff said?

That Constitution you're defending protects my right to criticise you, and to call out racist speech and images wherever I see them.

445 J.S.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:26:54am

re: #369 Son of the Black Dog

I think that the decline in "political discourse" began a long time ago (I noticed a real decline with Bill Clinton -- some of was so vile, one could only hope that children wouldn't be subjected to it, or by accident, run across something on the Internet re: Clinton and Monika, etc.) But, even then, back in the Clinton days, most of the vile junk seemed to be confined to the seedier websites...(now I just completely avoid any number of websites -- a huge swath of websites, I refuse to visit -- why bother?) Anyway, then during the Bush years (up here in Canada) the vile junk migrated to newspapers! That was a shock...to suddenly find what one would ordinarily find in some trashy website, appearing in print -- I remember the local newspaper printing a picture of Bush as a monkey (the Bush as chimp), next it was a cartoon of him as Alfred E Neuman, etc.; and, in addition, this was all done as hugely hilarious and wonderful expressions of artistic merit...(and the editorials and the "letters to the editor" -- all deranged, defamatory imo)...But I don't recall any objections...It was all applauded...but, this is Canada, so, I don't know, it's to be expected? (right now, the Canadian media has been bending over backwards to appear pro-Obama -- they're like Chris Matthews in their adoration...but, now, there seems to be this backlash -- mostly in the States? I trust the demonization of U.S. presidents won't -- as was done with Bush -- become "normalized" -- or, worse, become "mainstream" here...)

446 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:27:26am

re: #430 Killgore Trout

Exactly. It's also worth noting that neither Charles or anyone else here is urging people to contact his hospital or the medical board to get him fired over this like the Kos Kidz are doing. He certainly has the right to photoshop anything he wants. Pointing out his racism is not restricting his free speech.

I welcome ron paul supports to exercise their free speech rights. Please keep speaking up so we know exactly what you represent.

447 subsailor68  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:27:28am

re: #423 formercorpsman

Hi formercorpsman!!

I wonder what they think of the military vote?

Good question. Overall IIRC, the military folks tend to be a bit conservative (with exceptions of course), so I'd guess probably not much (at least in private).

448 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:27:28am

re: #430 Killgore Trout

Exactly. It's also worth noting that neither Charles or anyone else here is urging people to contact his hospital or the medical board to get him fired over this like the Kos Kidz are doing. He certainly has the right to photoshop anything he wants. Pointing out his racism is not restricting his free speech.

Well, I linked to information yesterday that would allow anyone who was interested to contact him or his hospital. Emailing him or making your opinion known about him, to him or the organization(s) he represents IS free speech.

Certainly we have the right to do that.

449 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:28:01am

re: #436 albusteve

Walter...where are you from and why do you spell funny?...thanks. albusteve

I'm from Brooklyn and I don't right funny.

450 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:29:04am

re: #449 Walter L. Newton

I'm from Brooklyn and I don't right funny.

It does explain the accent however.

451 Silvergirl  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:29:16am

re: #432 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Try rereading that. The FOP endorsed McCain. When a reporter asked if Obama's comments hurt his relationship with police groups, the White House Press secretary basically said the relationship was bad already since they had supported McCain. Real nice attitude, so much for the post partisan era.

Right. Let's punish all police because of their support of McCain. We're free to call them stupid.

452 reine.de.tout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:29:26am

re: #449 Walter L. Newton

I'm from Brooklyn and I don't right funny.

But you do spell funny, I think, because the air's so thin up there in your new mountain lair.

453 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:29:29am

re: #441 albusteve

not pointing it out or ignoring it is nearly as bad...

The only reason I can think of for someone to ignore this is they agree with it.

454 Killgore Trout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:29:56am

re: #441 albusteve

not pointing it out or ignoring it is nearly as bad...

...and that's why American style free speech (as opposed to European and Canadian versions) works. He's certainly free to make racist images. If he didn't have that freedom we wouldn't know he was a douchebag. The system works pretty well.

455 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:30:04am

re: #449 Walter L. Newton

I'm from Brooklyn and I don't right funny.

Brooklyn!...so that's it...here I thought you were an American

456 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:30:28am
457 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:30:49am

re: #436 albusteve

Walter...where are you from and why do you spell funny?...thanks. albusteve

I'm from Brooklyn, and I don't smell funny.

458 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:30:50am

re: #443 Charles

The guy circulated a picture that is blatantly, obviously racist. I would call that a "fact."

Quite right. Further, he's much too old not to be aware of the problem.

459 formercorpsman  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:31:15am

re: #442 StillAMarine

Yeah. I am still saving to get a nice size rendering.

Are still in?

460 theheat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:31:18am

re: #453 Sharmuta

That's why I'm curious if there was even a backlash from the tea party mailing recipients, and if so, how much of a backlash?

461 Spare O'Lake  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:31:38am

re: #429 Charles

It's a picture of a black man with a BONE THROUGH HIS FREAKING NOSE. Your "defender of the Constitution" pose is starting to slip.

You could say he pulled a boner.

462 Randall Gross  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:31:41am

re: #255 karmic_inquisitor

"The Distraction" is exactly why the remarks were purposefully made. Now everyone's talking about the remarks rather than the failing health plan. The focus is on Barack, the post racial lightning rod rather than on congress and that idiot bill where it belongs.

463 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:32:17am

re: #455 albusteve

Brooklyn!...so that's it...here I thought you were an American

And I spelt Brookline in the British way, with the "lyn."

464 formercorpsman  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:32:38am

re: #459 formercorpsman

good lord,,,

Are you still in?

465 Killgore Trout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:33:43am

re: #460 theheat

That's why I'm curious if there was even a backlash from the tea party mailing recipients, and if so, how much of a backlash?

I doubt there was much if any backlash. I've discovered a lot of racist imagery posted on Tea Party facebook sites in the past. It's fairly common and nobody seems to complain. He felt safe sending this out on a mass mailing list. The email was probably leaked by a lefty who was monitoring the list.

466 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:33:45am

Formercorpsman is talking to himself. Someone get the jacket and pills ready.

467 jcm  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:34:19am

re: #415 shortshrift

And he would have had to have called it "Art", not "funny". You have provided another interesting twist for our understanding of our cultural attitudes. As does the following post:

re: #114 jcm

Are we to suppose that the witchdoctor should take offense by having the head of a liar replace his own?
And Obama depicted as a snake oil salesman would be offensive, but not racist?

You entirely missed my point.

A shaman, regardless of culture general were and are honest practitioners of their craft. I'm sure some used the post to personal advantage, but that is a side issue.

Snake oil sales men, were in engaged in a scam, as is Obama.

468 Lincolntf  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:34:20am

re: #441 albusteve

To me it seems that the pic was probably created by someone with racist intentions. The Doc should have recognized that and deleted it as spam rather than forwarding it.
The only rational "defense" of the pic that I've seen is that if it were presented as "Art" and hung in some gallery it would be considered largely immune from partisan criticism, which is true. The fact that this Doc used it in a political context (judging by the bits of info. I've seen about him) means he owns it.
He should apolgize (I saw a headline that said he already did, but I haven't read the article yet) and move on to more important things.

469 hous bin pharteen  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:34:29am

At least we know that we are following that really nice group, Media Matters.
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

We know that there is no left-wing propaganda. Keith Olberman and Rachel Maddows and the like are just middle of the road. Nothing to see here. Move along.

470 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:34:31am

re: #453 Sharmuta

The only reason I can think of for someone to ignore this is they agree with it.

it needs to be condemned so there is no misconception or doubt...to say nothing implies condoning it...I agree

471 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:35:07am

re: #445 J.S.

The mid-90s was when the effort to convert marxist tactics to suit the purposes of the right was mainstreamed, so I concur with your analysis. Both sides have willingly sunk to newer and newer depths.

472 turn  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:35:13am

re: #463 Walter L. Newton

I heard on the news a pretty bad hail storm rolled through Denver, one dealer was selling damaged cars way cheap. Did you get pelted?

473 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:35:22am

re: #398 reine.de.tout

{gak}
Our very own unique gak.

I do long for the simpler days of Star Trek. Blood wine, anyone?

474 theheat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:35:29am

re: #465 Killgore Trout

Then I suppose that's all I need to know about a certain percentage of the tea party peeps.

475 Picayune  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:35:30am

POTUS BHO is now giving a WH press conference on the Gates/Crowley incident!

476 The False God  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:35:44am

re: #440 turn

I really... don't know. I signed on to LGF so long ago, that I forgot we even had user information. Sorry, I can't help you. That has me confused, as well.

Now, let me ask something:

It's okay to stereotype a white guy to a white stereotype, like a snake-oil salesman, or something like the evil businessman, carpetbagger, etc.

and it's also okay to stereotype a white guy to a, I guess, black stereotype, like a witch doctor. It's also okay to stereotype a black guy to a white stereotype, making him a snake oil salesman, or whatever else you want.

But, it's not okay to use something which would be considered, even just by cultural association, a black stereotype with a black guy. Ever.

Not trying to cause a ruckus, but in a post-racial society that we're striving for, I have a problem with that kind of double-standard. It's kind of like the issue with some blacks being able to use the word "n*****/ah" as a friendly greeting, but when anyone else uses it, it's grounds for lots of trouble.

Maybe I should start greeting my white friends by saying "What's up, honky?" I'd get weird stares, but I guess not anything more.

Not trying to start something here, just stating that I don't like the idea of divided cultural norms, as if there's "no-go" zones for one group of people, but others are fine. We can't grow beyond that kind of thing unless we grow thicker skins and face that kind of problem head on.

Comedy can't survive that kind of environment when people are building huge divides in their hearts and minds.

477 J.S.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:35:48am

re: #454 Killgore Trout

Well, the doctor is claiming that he did not make the image. As I understand it, he's saying that he found the image and doesn't know who the "artist" was/is. That's his claim. Unless you know that he personally photoshopped it? Anyway, from what I've read (this is for accuracy sake) he isn't claiming to be the artist. (and, clearly, this is no excuse for his decision to forward it about).

478 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:35:52am

re: #434 Walter L. Newton

A snake oil salesman was normally white, quick of gab, smart, clever. Many people looked up to them, even though he was probably no more effective than a real witch doctor.

I once read a totally fascinating study about snake oil salesmen. Completely blew my mind. Turns out that snake oil (yes, many early snake oil salesmen really sold oil make from snakes) is extremely high in Omega-3s and other essential fatty acids, and that many 19th century pioneers in the plains states had long-term dietary deficiencies of Omega 3s, due to a diet of too much corn and meat and not enough fish are certain vegetables and nuts. The are a plethora of unpleasant symptoms as a result of a long-term Omega-3 deficiency that were not known to be connected until the latter part of the 20th century. But just a few spoonfuls of snake oil provided enough Omega 3 to stave off the deficiency for several months. One bottle could keep you healthy for a year.

So it turns out that the original snake oil salesmen sold a product that was extremely effective and medically quite useful for the clientele involved (people living on the frontier). They weren't charlatans at all. (At least until later, when actual charlatans -- who were riding on the outstanding reputation of the real snake oil salesmen -- came along and sold fake snake oil laced with opium and mercury and so on. It is from these later charlatans that the modern condemnation of snake oil salesmen comes. But the originals were providing an important medical service.)

479 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:35:55am

re: #469 hous bin pharteen

At least we know that we are following that really nice group, Media Matters.
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

We know that there is no left-wing propaganda. Keith Olberman and Rachel Maddows and the like are just middle of the road. Nothing to see here. Move along.

Facts are facts. They don't get cooties on them because they come from Media Matters.

480 karmic_inquisitor  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:36:08am

re: #456 buzzsawmonkey

Artists did not begin to "embrace" the machine and machine-like images until Futurism (towards/after the end of WWI) and, more broadly, during the '30s--when the Industrial Revolution was pretty much over and, during the Depression, when the machines were, if not in decline, largely idle.

In short, art for the last 150 years, despite flattering itself that it has been "progressive" and forward-thinking, has been an intensely reactionary influence that has rejected everything about modern society and social development. You can see this, in some sense, by looking at PBS. Initially, "artistic" people rejected television as complete garbage, combining the worst aspects of the commercial cinema and commercial radio. When they realized TV was here to stay, they created PBS as an alternative--and what does PBS show now? The very shows which it was created to be an alternative to when it was formed.

Have you read Tom Wolfe's "From Bauhaus to Our House?" I love that little book - he really pulls apart the pretentiousness of the American elite as they embrace a Marxist Aesthetic.

481 Lincolntf  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:36:14am

re: #475 Picayune

Wow. That was fast.

482 scottishbuzzsaw  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:36:31am

re: #469 hous bin pharteen

*facepalm*

483 formercorpsman  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:36:37am

re: #466 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I'm fine with just the pills.

Good lord, you would think I was the lead singer of Motley Crue with all the words I miss.

484 Desert Dog  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:36:38am

re: #478 zombie

I once read a totally fascinating study about snake oil salesmen. Completely blew my mind. Turns out that snake oil (yes, many early snake oil salesmen really sold oil make from snakes) is extremely high in Omega-3s and other essential fatty acids, and that many 19th century pioneers in the plains states had long-term dietary deficiencies of Omega 3s, due to a diet of too much corn and meat and not enough fish are certain vegetables and nuts. The are a plethora of unpleasant symptoms as a result of a long-term Omega-3 deficiency that were not known to be connected until the latter part of the 20th century. But just a few spoonfuls of snake oil provided enough Omega 3 to stave off the deficiency for several months. One bottle could keep you healthy for a year.

So it turns out that the original snake oil salesmen sold a product that was extremely effective and medically quite useful for the clientele involved (people living on the frontier). They weren't charlatans at all. (At least until later, when actual charlatans -- who were riding on the outstanding reputation of the real snake oil salesmen -- came along and sold fake snake oil laced with opium and mercury and so on. It is from these later charlatans that the modern condemnation of snake oil salesmen comes. But the originals were providing an important medical service.)

It tastes like chicken too, rattler on a stick, at least.

485 Kragar  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:36:38am

re: #475 Picayune

POTUS BHO is now giving a WH press conference on the Gates/Crowley incident!

It would have been better if they hadn't chosen to play "F*** the police!" as the lead in music.

/

486 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:37:01am

re: #454 Killgore Trout

...and that's why American style free speech (as opposed to European and Canadian versions) works. He's certainly free to make racist images. If he didn't have that freedom we wouldn't know he was a douchebag. The system works pretty well.

re: #454 Killgore Trout

...and that's why American style free speech (as opposed to European and Canadian versions) works. He's certainly free to make racist images. If he didn't have that freedom we wouldn't know he was a douchebag. The system works pretty well.

yes it does...it might be our most valued treasure

487 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:37:15am

re: #470 albusteve

it needs to be condemned so there is no misconception or doubt...to say nothing implies condoning it...I agree

It will be interesting to see who stays quiet on this, and if folks notice where the *crickets* are loudest.

488 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:37:21am

re: #475 Picayune

Damage control, perhaps?

489 Killgore Trout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:37:50am

re: #474 theheat

It's a systemic problem but I suspect most people just don't speak up. Notice that none of the Tea Party blogs are exposing this and drumming out the racists. Not all those bloggers are racists themselves but they'd rather sweep this stuff under the rug and carry on anyways.

490 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:37:50am

re: #475 Picayune

POTUS BHO is now giving a WH press conference on the Gates/Crowley incident!

Oh, no. He's about to make things worse!

491 Picayune  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:37:52am

re: #481 Lincolntf

Yea, we got a nimble POTUS as well. "And the beat goes on!!!"

492 The False God  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:38:11am

re: #476 The False God

Well, nevermind. I don't think I should involve myself in these threads, anymore. I don't seem to have the same opinion/line of thought as everyone else, and I don't think this is going to go anywhere pleasant.

If you feel like, just delete these posts, Charles. I don't mind at all. I'm content with just having a difference of opinion on the subject.

493 karmic_inquisitor  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:38:18am

re: #462 Thanos

"The Distraction" is exactly why the remarks were purposefully made. Now everyone's talking about the remarks rather than the failing health plan. The focus is on Barack, the post racial lightning rod rather than on congress and that idiot bill where it belongs.


I wonder - because he didn't do the "umm ahh" thing I assumed that these were his candid thoughts or that the issue had been rehearsed with Gibbs before the Press Conference. I chose to see it as the former, but if it was a rehearsed response then we have a truly cynical (and inept) White House.

494 nightlight  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:38:31am

He has definitely just made things worse.

495 zombie  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:38:47am

This wasn't the article i read, but it's pretty good nonethelss:

Scientific American:

Snake Oil Salesmen Were on to Something

Snake oil really is a cure for what ails you

Richard Kunin, a California psychiatrist with a background in neurophysiology research, became intrigued with the idea of snake oil in the 1980s. He had been following early research on the importance of omega-3 fatty acids for health and it dawned on him that the much maligned snake oil might be a particularly rich source. Omega-3's proliferate in cold-blooded creatures that live primarily in cooler environments because the fats don't harden in chilly water like omega-6 fatty acids do (hence, the high level of omega-3's in cold-water fish such as salmon). "Snakes and fish share one thing, they're both cold-blooded animals," Kunin says.

Kunin visited San Francisco's Chinatown to buy such snake oil and analyze it. He also acquired two live rattlesnakes and extracted their fat sacks. According to his 1989 analysis published in the Western Journal of Medicine, Chinese water-snake oil contains 20 percent eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA), one of the two types of omega-3 fatty acids most readily used by our bodies. In comparison, the rattlesnakes had only 8.5 percent EPA. And salmon, one of the most popular food sources of omega-3's, contains a maximum of 18 percent EPA, lower than that of snake oil.

Research since the 1980s has demonstrated the necessity—and efficacy—of omega-3 fatty acids. These acids not only reduce inflammation, such as arthritis pain, but also improve cognitive function and reduce blood pressure, cholesterol and even depression. "

etc.

496 Shr_Nfr  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:38:48am

[Ed. note: this account has been blocked.]

re: #444 iceweasel

And I defend your right to do so.

Look, I disagree with the message, I disagree with the messenger, I disagree with a lot of stuff. I am not defending his message, I am not defending him. But I am defending his right under the Constitution to create this image. If "Piss Christ" is art, then this passes the same standard. Again, the person portrayed in the picture is not even a Black. He is somebody from New Guinea. Everyone is jumping to the conclusion that this is an African witch doctor. He isn't. African native healers dress quite differently than this guy does. If its racist to call somebody witch doctor from New Guinea, we are in deeper problems than you can even imagine. Get over it, the guy pictured is not from Africa.

As far as the Bush-chimp stuff goes, I do not remember any of the people being censured by their professional organizations. If we are going to polarize the country by calling anything racist that portrays Obama in a bad light, we have a big, big problem.

497 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:39:00am

re: #476 The False God

You can cram your racialist justifications where the sun don't shine.

498 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:39:01am
499 Killgore Trout  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:39:03am

re: #477 J.S.

Agreed. He probably found it posted somewhere.

500 jcm  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:39:06am

re: #475 Picayune

POTUS BHO is now giving a WH press conference on the Gates/Crowley incident!



Gates over reacted...

As President I shouldn't have stepped into it...

501 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:39:12am

re: #472 turn

I heard on the news a pretty bad hail storm rolled through Denver, one dealer was selling damaged cars way cheap. Did you get pelted?

Not up here, most of the damage was in Lakewood (west of downtown Denver), Wheatridge and Westminster (northwest of downtown Denver).

I saw a little hail off and on this week, but I'm at 8000 feet and about 35 mile west of downtown Denver, the storms don't act the same over the mountains as they do when they get down to the Denver area, which is flatter and you have those thermal up drafts and inversions.

502 MandyManners  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:39:14am

FCBBHO is having a presser about Gates. Shit. I missed it.

503 Picayune  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:39:26am

re: #488 calcajun

Who's better at damage control? BHO or Slow Joe Biden? (heh)

504 midwestgak  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:39:40am

re: #473 calcajun

I do long for the simpler days of Star Trek. Blood wine, anyone?

How About a Salamanca Dinner to go with it

505 Picayune  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:40:03am

re: #490 Dianna

What else?

506 Randall Gross  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:40:05am

re: #469 hous bin pharteen

How many times must you be told that source doesn't matter if it's factual?

The guy who sent this even realizes now that it was racist and stupid, calling it a "misjudgement" why on earth are you trying to defend him?

507 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:40:17am
508 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:40:43am

I really do not believe this.

509 jcm  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:41:06am

re: #495 zombie

This wasn't the article i read, but it's pretty good nonethelss:

Scientific American:

Snake Oil Salesmen Were on to Something

Snake oil really is a cure for what ails you

etc.

I hereby apologize to snake oil salesmen for compare them to Obama.

;-)

510 Kronocide  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:41:29am

Is there still some constitution-defending happening? I like to watch that cuz it's just so awesome.

511 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:41:37am

re: #487 Sharmuta

It will be interesting to see who stays quiet on this, and if folks notice where the *crickets* are loudest.

I'm a little disappointed with all the nuance...many topics can be discussed endlessly and people enjoy doing that...stretching their intellect and honing skills, link mining, but in this case it's pretty simply just what it is...there are no excuses

512 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:41:45am

re: #489 Killgore Trout

It's a systemic problem but I suspect most people just don't speak up. Notice that none of the Tea Party blogs are exposing this and drumming out the racists. Not all those bloggers are racists themselves but they'd rather sweep this stuff under the rug and carry on anyways.

Yep. instead of 'pay no attention to that man behind the curtain" it's "pay no attention to those white guys behind the white hood".

(And yes, this isn't like the KKK, or lynching people, but there are a lot of lurking racists around, and not everyone is so vigilant at cleaning house as Charles is. I'm sure we were all shocked to see how many people popped up on that thread to defend the indefensible.)

513 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:41:55am

Somebody slow the thread down! I can't get to the bottom.

And I wouldn't go with snake oil salesman. I would go with mad scientist.

514 theheat  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:42:02am

re: #489 Killgore Trout

For people who act as though they're on the cutting edge of information, putting this on ignore seems a contradiction. Gutless, at the very least.

515 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:42:04am

re: #496 Shr_Nfr

I'm finished. Get off my website.

516 Dianna  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:42:11am

re: #500 jcm


Gates over reacted...

As President I shouldn't have stepped into it...

Did you catch the end?!

517 Digital Display  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:42:23am

re: #420 iceweasel

Walter, thank you for bringing this up. Some people like to make trouble.


Wait! The picture of you sunbathing on the Spanish Rivera is still real..Right? That is quite the handsome man you are with.
*wink*

518 hous bin pharteen  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:42:41am

re: #479 Charles


Yeah. Like no one seems to know who you are always bitching about? There is so much crap you don't have any problems with?
Got it.

519 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:43:05am
520 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:43:42am

re: #517 HoosierHoops

Wait! The picture of you sunbathing on the Spanish Rivera is still real..Right? That is quite the handsome man you are with.
*wink*

Hush! I didn't want everyone to know that I knew you then! :)

521 Kronocide  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:43:53am

re: #515 Charles

I'm finished. Get off my website.

You just oppressed his LGF Rights!

522 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:44:30am

re: #477 J.S.

Well, the doctor is claiming that he did not make the image. As I understand it, he's saying that he found the image and doesn't know who the "artist" was/is. That's his claim. Unless you know that he personally photoshopped it? Anyway, from what I've read (this is for accuracy sake) he isn't claiming to be the artist. (and, clearly, this is no excuse for his decision to forward it about).

You repeat or rebroadcast the libel, you've committed libel as well. It's a weak argument.

This whole issue has me wrestling with some deep-seated issues on the concepts of bigotry and "racism". Things are still turning over in my mind--and I have a huge project that will consume my entire weekend--so I cannot fully comment. But, suffice it to say I know bigotry and prejudice when I see it. The problem I have is the concept and the word "racism" --that it is bandied about like the word "nazi" or "fascist" to the point where it has lost its value.

Anyway-- gotta stop stealing time from my employers and clients. The mines are calling!

TGIF, y'all.

523 StillAMarine  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:44:31am

re: #459 formercorpsman

I am still here, if that is what you mean.

I think a 30" by 23" Reflectionsposter sells for about $70 US on Arts.com. Then of course there is the frame ...

That work is absolutely powerful.

524 jamgarr  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:44:33am

Apologies to Jack Bruce

White Cop

I'm the white cop, with black prisoner, at the station
Black prof country, no gold necklace, tired rhetoric
Hold your horses, Dr. Moonbeam, in your dark lies
No light smiles, on your grieving, my resentment
Stick your disgrace where the sun never shines
Stick your disgrace where Al Sharpton runs for the phone

You said no cop could secure you at the station
Got your ticket, wrested dismiss, goodbye justice
I walked into such a sad time at the station
As you walked out, felt my ordeal just beginning
I'll wait in the queue 'til the sane come back
Lie is what you do where Al Sharpton runs for the phone

At the break-in you were shouting at the hard crowd
Consternation for some old wounds not forgotten
Fellow liers, couched in rhetoric, in your dark lies
Window dressing, goodbye justice, tired rhetoric
You sleep in disgrace with the race-baiting crowd
Lie in the dark where Al Sharpton runs for the phone

525 debutaunt  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:45:02am

re: #364 Walter L. Newton

Why is IW location so important? I've seen a number of people try to nail her on this, but why, I don't understand.

Considering the global nature of the internet (and the world today), I'm interested in many points of views.

What am I missing? Or do some people like to just make trouble?

Walter, I noticed the spelling and mentioned it. I didn't nail anyone, but it jumps out when I don't know where someone is from. There is no more to it than that.

526 Randall Gross  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:45:17am

re: #476 The False God

pfft. "wahhh... it's not fair, we R whyte viktims!"

/

527 Ringo the Gringo  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:45:27am

The False God ,

It's really quite simple: America has elected it's first black President and considering American history, jigaboo, voodoo man, bone-through-the nose "humor" about him is beyond the unacceptable, it's racist - plain and simple.

If you can't see why, then that's your problem.

528 JustABill  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:47:02am

re: #406 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

An amazingly stupid and biased comment that shows how the folks at the White House really think.

Its the "Chicago Way".

529 jcm  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:47:10am

re: #496 Shr_Nfr

Where the shaman in question is from is not the point.

No one is questioning the right of the person to produce and publish the picture.

The image racist, for all the reason listed by so many lizards, that is focus of the criticism.

530 albusteve  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:47:32am

re: #501 Walter L. Newton

Not up here, most of the damage was in Lakewood (west of downtown Denver), Wheatridge and Westminster (northwest of downtown Denver).

I saw a little hail off and on this week, but I'm at 8000 feet and about 35 mile west of downtown Denver, the storms don't act the same over the mountains as they do when they get down to the Denver area, which is flatter and you have those thermal up drafts and inversions.

the worst, most destructive hailstorm I ever saw was in Denver...up to golf ball size and deep enough to cover the ground like snow...half way to Golden was a perfect line north to south where it started...Denver can have some very crazy weather

531 BlueCanuck  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:48:22am

re: #446 Sharmuta

I welcome ron paul supports to exercise their free speech rights. Please keep speaking up so we know exactly what you represent.

It's nice when a target stands up and says "Here I am!"

532 Picayune  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:48:46am

re: #493 karmic_inquisitor

Chuck Todd said today on MSNBC in front of the WH that BHO's WH Staff, dead fish, etc, were concerned about the Gates affair because it had wiped out all cover of Voodoo HealthScare, and that ain't good!

Good grief! Where's the approval for small favors from the media gods?

After Dingy Harry torpedoed the deal yesterday afternoon, and then the Blue Dog Dems used that to jump ship on Botox Nancy, you'd think the Staff would welcome the cover on the failing of Barak's biggest campaign policy promise? But, hey, that's just me and I am not on the Staff, so go figure!

533 Aye Pod  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:49:35am

re: #496 Shr_Nfr

But I am defending his right under the Constitution to create this image.

Against whose challenge? No one's. Yet you keep trotting this out as if it justifies your attempts to make excuses for this obviously racist image.

Again, the person portrayed in the picture is not even a Black. He is somebody from New Guinea.

As far as racist imagery is concerned, there is no difference between African jungle dweller and New Guiniean jungle dweller. You know this as well as anyone. Some native Papua New-Guineans. Do they look like white people to you?

Image: PAPUA%20NEW%20GUINEA.jpg

"If its racist to call somebody witch doctor from New Guinea, we are in deeper problems than you can even imagine. Get over it, the guy pictured is not from Africa."

Care to explain to us then why the photoshopper blackened Obama's face? Pathetic.

534 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:49:56am

re: #518 hous bin pharteen

This is the logic of a 5 year old.

535 midwestgak  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:50:42am

Another one bites the dust. Bye Shr-Nfr. Whatever that nic meant.

Hatched Aug 27, 2006. Whacked Jul 24, 2009.

536 formercorpsman  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:51:32am

re: #523 StillAMarine

I agree. I see you are of that time. My hat is off to you. Albeit I was only coming into this world during your time, thank you.

89-94.

537 turn  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:52:39am

re: #476 The False God

ok, thanks. There does seem to be a double standard here, I agree. I'm sure Al Sharpton or Jessie Jackson would have some perfect explanation about why it's perfectly ok for blacks to call each other n's yet they would get all fired up over a pic like this. Hell look what that guy did to Imus over the nappy headed hoe thing, and after he basically got down on his knees and begged for forgiveness. I also think these two don't want the race issue to ever be put behind us because they benefit from perpetuating it. And now o runs on a platform of putting race behind us and he flies off the handle and apparently rushes to judgment that Gates was busted because of racial profiling? There is a double standard imo.

538 axegrinder  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:52:50am

I remember Screaming Jay Hawkins performing in full witch doctor regalia. Found the youtube link but I'm too scared to post it here. I put on my egg shell walking shoes when I come in here now...

Looks like the monkey Bush shoe is on the other foot.

539 Kenneth  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:53:48am

re: #385 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

So that's what it's all about? Police voted for McCain, so it's "screw them" from the Obama administration. That explains Obama's attitude to the military, given that 75% of those men & women in uniform voted for McCain.

540 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:54:26am

re: #538 axegrinder

I remember Screaming Jay Hawkins performing in full witch doctor regalia. Found the youtube link but I'm too scared to post it here. I put on my egg shell walking shoes when I come in here now...

Looks like the monkey Bush shoe is on the other foot.

That's ridiculous. It's not "walking on eggshells" to not be a freaking RACIST.

I'm astounded at the reaction to this picture here at LGF.

541 The False God  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:55:31am

re: #537 turn

While I appreciate feedback, I'd just like it if nobody responded to my posts in this thread. I don't like causing trouble.

542 American Sabra  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:57:41am

re: #537 turn

Obama never ran on a platform of "putting race behind us". For as far as we have come since the civil rights movement in the 60s and it has been a very far and positive road indeed, we are by no means out of the woods when it comes to racial tension. As a Black man, Obama knows this better than anyone. And I would never trust a Republican to decipher Obama's message in the second place.

I also think these two don't want the race issue to ever be put behind us because they benefit from perpetuating it.

Wow... do you say that about the Jews too?

543 dentate  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:58:02am

I actually knew David McKalip, about ten years ago. He had recently started in private practice in Florida, and he was an up-and-coming "computer geek" among the neurosurgeons, who created and pioneered an early listserv for us. Actually talked to him about joining him in that practice in Florida. So, although I lost touch with him long ago, it is very distressing to see his name resurface in this light. Harvard professors, brain surgeons; black, white; it is amazing to me that people cannot see the harm caused by descent from vigorous debate into racist and ad hominem attack.

544 midwestgak  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:58:05am

re: #540 Charles

That's ridiculous. It's not "walking on eggshells" to not be a freaking RACIST.

I'm astounded at the reaction to this picture here at LGF.

Check out axegrinder's avatar. Now that's, well, I don't know.

545 Throbert McGee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 11:58:16am

re: #120 zombie

Now, if only David McKalip had painted ALL the presidents as witch doctors, he would have gotten away with it! Just like Justine Lai.

We still have much to learn from the Left.

Zombie, the artist Justine Lai may well be a leftist, but in all honesty, I simply can't justify leaping to that conclusion based on the images linked at her site.
(On the other hand, if she paints herself being dressed up in a gimp suit and flogged by Nixon, and being forced to drink Reagan's piss, I'd have to concede: Very, very left-wing. However, the series ends with Ulysses S. Grant.)

Not saying that Lai's paintings are especially creative or thought-provoking; just pointing out that you're indulging in stereotypes by suggesting that because she's a professional artist and chooses to paint sexually-provocative themes, she must necessarily be a left-winger.

I mean, I'm fairly right-wing (at least by GBLTQetc. standards), but I could theoretically do a charcoal sketch of myself getting a "pearl necklace" from Mr. Lincoln, just to show how much I admire the man.

546 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:03:15pm

re: #540 Charles

I'm astounded at the reaction to this picture here at LGF.

Me, too. It's as charged a concept now as it was 50 years ago. My only surmise is that people defend this because they don't want to acknowledge their own bigotry and prejudices, let alone that it might exist in others. That's why this is such a polarizing thread--as was yesterday's. This is hard for me to write, but I cannot put into words in a cogent form how I feel about all of this. This only shows how far we have to go as a society--and makes me wonder if we will ever overcome our baser natures.

547 dentate  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:07:55pm

Note the difference between this picture, and the famous caricature of Barack and Michelle Obama dressed as a Muslim and a Black Power terrorist respectively on the New Yorker.

THAT one was intended as a satire of what some people feared about the Obamas.

THIS one was intended to mock Obama.

The problem is not what you show, it is what the intent is.

548 Throbert McGee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:19:24pm

re: #476 The False God

and it's also okay to stereotype a white guy to a, I guess, black stereotype, like a witch doctor. It's also okay to stereotype a black guy to a white stereotype, making him a snake oil salesman, or whatever else you want.

But, it's not okay to use something which would be considered, even just by cultural association, a black stereotype with a black guy. Ever.

TFG, I updinged you without a second of hesitation because I think your heart was in the right place in recognizing that in an ideal future America, we should reach a cultural state where it's perfectly okay to lampoon a black public figure as a bone-through-the-nose witch doctor, because by that time slavery and Jim Crow and other nonsense will seem like truly ancient history to all Americans.

HOWEVER, I hope you will admit that such a time is still quite a long way off, and for now, it must be seen as appallingly insensitive for a white guy to PhotoShop a black man's face onto a witch-doctor image -- because, after all, there are still living, breathing assholes like Lawrence Auster who believe that blacks are inherently more "savage" than whites.

549 J.S.  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:19:28pm

re: #546 calcajun

I'm reminded of a story as to how Esau died... Sometimes i wonder if people have not become calloused? or hardened? they may be de-sensitized? so they no longer see or hear the racism?

550 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:24:26pm

Shr_Nfr follows up with an insulting email, and gets the IP block:

I think you are being a bit over the top, but that is your right. Have
fun. It used to be nice, but it is no longer. Do not expect me to defend
you in the future. You are wrong on this topic and you are too vain to
admit it.

551 Macker  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:24:41pm

re: #12 zombie

God! That is frakkin' SICK. Guess she's into necophilia...

552 Macker  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:26:53pm

re: #550 Charles

Shr_Nfr follows up with an insulting email, and gets the IP block:

Point of Inquiry: What happens when you set up an IP block...are they sent to another site, or something else?

553 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:27:51pm

re: #552 Macker

Point of Inquiry: What happens when you set up an IP block...are they sent to another site, or something else?

They get a message that says "Forbidden" when they try to open LGF.

554 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:29:18pm

re: #546 calcajun

Me, too. It's as charged a concept now as it was 50 years ago. My only surmise is that people defend this because they don't want to acknowledge their own bigotry and prejudices, let alone that it might exist in others. That's why this is such a polarizing thread--as was yesterday's. This is hard for me to write, but I cannot put into words in a cogent form how I feel about all of this. This only shows how far we have to go as a society--and makes me wonder if we will ever overcome our baser natures.

I don't even have a guess about why this has happened. I'm completely stunned. And it's still going on.

The people who are getting banned personify the worst fears and stereotypes many on the left have about 'all republicans' or 'everyone on the right".

I also firmly believe that these people are not truly representative of LGF or even the right-- so what the hell is happening here?
It's like a microcosm of the GOP as a whole; many in the GOP are choosing to pander to the nirthers and the fringe elements, and many people out there are angry in a kind of inchoate way. Those people are making a lot of noise now and trying to mainstream their ideas. It's frightening.

555 Eowyn2  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:29:47pm

re: #460 theheat

That's why I'm curious if there was even a backlash from the tea party mailing recipients, and if so, how much of a backlash?

I'm on a couple of tea party mailing lists and I never received it so my guess is that it is probably central to the ron paul tea party lists.

556 Eowyn2  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:32:29pm

re: #537 turn

I agree that there is a double standard on this but two wrongs do not make a right and therefore, we should not be party to the racism which others may indulge in.

557 eschew_obfuscation  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:33:30pm

re: #554 iceweasel

I don't even have a guess about why this has happened. I'm completely stunned. And it's still going on.

The people who are getting banned personify the worst fears and stereotypes many on the left have about 'all republicans' or 'everyone on the right".

I also firmly believe that these people are not truly representative of LGF or even the right-- so what the hell is happening here?
It's like a microcosm of the GOP as a whole; many in the GOP are choosing to pander to the nirthers and the fringe elements, and many people out there are angry in a kind of inchoate way. Those people are making a lot of noise now and trying to mainstream their ideas. It's frightening.

I wonder if part of it could be pushback from years of hearing how the white man has got us under his thumb and the white man as evil oppressor. Much of that no longer exists to the extent that it once did, but we have examples where it's still occurring (see Gibbs incident).

558 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:35:01pm

"You are wrong on this topic and you are too vain to admit it."

Well, I nominate Shr_Nfr for the winner of the Projection Award, administered via the "I know you are but what am I?" school of debate-- until the next time Charles checks his email, that is, and finds yet another nominee. Amazing.

559 Picayune  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:39:16pm

re: #500 jcm

Yep, right on cue - Gates goes under the bus, like so many before him!

BHO did the right thing here, really the only thing he could do, given that the MA police union "dug in their heals really hard this morning at their press conference, and immediately received growing national support from police officers everywhere and with it, shifting public opinion to their side, at Obama's expense. Old honest Abe said it all when he said that in America, public opinion is everything - and BHO understands this well.

This is damage control on the fly, and BHO shows good judgment to respond quickly to an event that was only overwhelming the WH and POTUS.

But don't expect the grievance hustlers to go quietly, quite the contrary, get ready for the hand wringing and howling to break out in ever larger volume - as "victims", hell bent for attention and perhaps even revenge now that BHO is POTUS, that are so deluded with self-righteous conviction that their their vision is currently blind to the proper resolution to what is for Barack, a major distraction, as his poll numbers slide, and with them, his ability to sign into law the policies that he has promised to so many.

I doubt that many in this minority group will comprehend BHO's current dilemma and understand his actions, and why he had little choice to do otherwise.

Who wins here? Well, Barak, Sgt. Crowley, and most of the public who are more concerned about our economic house being on fire just now. Who tanks? Gates, Soladide(sp?) O'Brien, and race hustlers on both sides of the issue.

I knew that this would be a fun episode to witness!

(continuing...)

560 eschew_obfuscation  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:44:04pm

re: #557 eschew_obfuscation

I wonder if part of it could be pushback from years of hearing how the white man has got us under his thumb and the white man as evil oppressor. Much of that no longer exists to the extent that it once did, but we have examples where it's still occurring (see Gibbs incident).

Woops...I meant Gates, not Gibbs...my bad

561 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 12:46:36pm

re: #559 Picayune


But don't expect the grievance hustlers to go quietly, quite the contrary, get ready for the hand wringing and howling to break out in ever larger volume - as "victims", hell bent for attention and perhaps even revenge now that BHO is POTUS, that are so deluded with self-righteous conviction that their their vision is currently blind to the proper resolution to what is for Barack, a major distraction, as his poll numbers slide, and with them, his ability to sign into law the policies that he has promised to so many.

If by "grievance hustlers" you mean all the people on the right who are hell bent for attention and perhaps even revenge now that BHO is POTUS, photoshopping and mailing racist pictures of Obama while shrieking about Sotomayor like Pat Buchanan--so deluded with self-righteous conviction that they're incapable of making any of the many legitimate criticisms they could make about Obama and his admin, and instead would rather focus on this stuff as well as many other distractions--

Yeah, then I agree those grievance hustlers have to go.

562 chukardog  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:02:47pm

I got dinged down for pointing this out in another thread. Would there there be these kind of cries of racism if the president were white and of Scottish or Irish decent and he was dressed up like an extra in braveheart with woad on his face? doubtful. I don't know if it's racist because I don't know what is truly in the man's heart. It was stupid, that I know, and counterproductive in the debate over health care. The fact that the perpetrator photo shopped him as a new guinea Aborigine instead of a witch doctor from Obama's tribe makes me lean towards the racism angle. I guess its the double standard and selective outrage that exists that rankles me.

563 BIGDUKE 6  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:07:59pm

re: #101 Sharmuta

Hey I know that getting rid of & weeding out the whackos is a very good thing. But sadly it will not change the Lefts perception of conservatism one iota

564 The False God  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:10:44pm

re: #548 Throbert McGee

You're right. I wasn't approaching this from a "well that's just how the world is", but rather what we should really be looking toward. I dislike double-standards, no matter how well intended. It's either okay to make fun of everyone, or it's not okay to make fun of anyone.

I'll admit that some things are tasteless, but it doesn't necessarily mean you're a racist because you're relating two things together, like in this image. But I agree that those two things together, used by someone who gives all the appearances of being a racist, IS racist.

It's something I consider distinctive, but apparently I am bad for having this opinion on the subject... which is why I would rather just not comment on these threads anymore. Your post was very good, however, so I think you deserved a response, and a good rating.

565 Picayune  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:13:57pm

re: #561 iceweasel

Point well made.

I was really referring in general to the group of black ministers who support corrupt political machines (see: William "Cold Dollar Bill" Jefferson, who has just rested his case in VA on 16 Fed counts) that do more damage to the disadvantaged minority youth here in NOLA (Chocolate City) just to line their pockets instead of doing their professed duty. They drop the race card bomb at every occasion to regain political power from those truly trying to put a dent in the outrageous corruption here and rebuild this once great and lovely city. Disgusting.

I was also referring to race hustlers on all sides that operate in the same manner as the "Poverty Pimps", as the ministers here are referred to by those trying to bring about meaningful change to a city still in dire straights.

That's all, but thanks for you thought.

566 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:14:17pm

re: #563 BIGDUKE 6

Hey I know that getting rid of & weeding out the whackos is a very good thing. But sadly it will not change the Lefts perception of conservatism one iota

We're not trying to impress the left. We need to impress the middle which is where elections are won and lost.

567 BIGDUKE 6  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:20:30pm

re: #12 zombie

And how is this Art ?

568 ArchangelMichael  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:23:21pm

re: #566 Sharmuta

We're not trying to impress the left. We need to impress the middle which is where elections are won and lost.

Or more to the point... the folks in the middle who lean to the right on important issues but are scared off by barking mad kooks and frothing at the mouth religious zealots.

569 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:26:09pm

re: #566 Sharmuta

We're not trying to impress the left. We need to impress the middle which is where elections are won and lost.

Exactly, kicking out racists isn't "trying to impress the left".

God help the right if most people on the right start thinking that eliminating racism and bigotry is something only done to 'impress the left'. Surely those are American goals, not partisan ones?

570 BIGDUKE 6  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:26:55pm

re: #566 Sharmuta

I have no desire to impress the Left but many in the middle, the fence sitters, feel that all conservatives are Bible-thumping loons who blow up abortion clinics. And these perceptions are fostered by the left leaning main stream media outlets - as a whole a very tough nut to crack.

571 Throbert McGee  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:28:29pm

re: #564 The False God

You're right. I wasn't approaching this from a "well that's just how the world is", but rather what we should really be looking toward. I dislike double-standards, no matter how well intended.

Thanks, man -- I'm glad to know that I had the correct instinct about you!

572 Sharmuta  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:30:29pm

re: #570 BIGDUKE 6

I have no desire to impress the Left but many in the middle, the fence sitters, feel that all conservatives are Bible-thumping loons who blow up abortion clinics. And these perceptions are fostered by the left leaning main stream media outlets - as a whole a very tough nut to crack.

Um- those perceptions aren't fostered by the msm. They're fostered by Bible-thumping loons themselves. Maybe if we ditch the creationism it won't stick so much, huh?

573 The Left  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:30:54pm

re: #568 ArchangelMichael

Or more to the point... the folks in the middle who lean to the right on important issues but are scared off by barking mad kooks and frothing at the mouth religious zealots.

Exactly. The more the right panders to the lunatic fringe the more they alienate the real conservatives, the centre, the independents, and repel people on the left too.

Lots of people, even people currently on the left, would vote for a right-candidate if the right got rid of the wackos.

(BTW, the 'left' only started winning elections by mainstreaming and repudiating their own kooks. I know that isn't a widely-held view here, but it's true.)

574 The False God  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:32:09pm

re: #571 Throbert McGee

I'm glad to not be a racist. It's true that there might be very minor genetic differences between people of different racial origins, but those things only matter as far as surviving in natural settings that we left long ago, and for the sole purpose of reproducing.

As far as I know, the human experience is WAY more than just reproducing, no matter what frat boys would like to think, and the skin color of someone has nothing to do with the kind of person they are. We're so much better than that, we just won't realize it and move on.

I find it difficult to experience immediate outrage at things with this viewpoint, as I just don't look at things that way. But if you're a racist, I'm going to disagree with that, because it makes no logical sense.

575 [deleted]  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:33:24pm
576 hazzyday  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:34:39pm

re: #573 iceweasel

They started winning because of the natural cycles in elections, a plethora of MSM coverage on GoP'ers with sex issues, and a war that lasted too long for people. I think the left still fully embraces their inner kook.

577 BIGDUKE 6  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:37:32pm

re: #572 Sharmuta

OK I'm with you !
And I'm punching out for dinner !
Bye !

578 ArchangelMichael  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:40:03pm

re: #573 iceweasel

(BTW, the 'left' only started winning elections by mainstreaming and repudiating their own kooks. I know that isn't a widely-held view here, but it's true.)

I know that Obama isn't exactly an ANSWER protester throwing a Molotov cocktail with burning dog feces in it through a Starbucks window while screaming "Infatada USA!" but, he was the candidate for the left kooks when Primary season started. He was pandering to the Anti-War crowd, and a lot of the 20-something Luap Nor kooks became Obama supporters when he picked up traction.

I'm still mystified how, if the DNC was trying to keep a lid on the moonbats, Hillary did not win the nomination.

579 mfarmer1  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:41:16pm

re: #538 axegrinder

Don't be silly. Did you see him in Jim Jarmusch's "Mystery Train?"

Youtube Video

Screaming Jay with Henry:

Youtube Video
580 hazzyday  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:42:04pm

re: #546 calcajun

Examples of goodwill pull people up.

Examples of hate and ignorance pull people down.

And people choose which example they wish to listen to.

Gates and the Dr. here are falling down on the hate and ignorance side of the human equation. Neither has a good reason for doing so.

Sometimes I think we see the negs just because goodwill seems boring and unexciting to people. Too pollyanish. Maybe a quick wit is a better life tool.

581 hazzyday  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:47:21pm

re: #574 The False God

In the current educational and political organizations racism is not a genetic condition. It's the ill fruit of centuries of cultural discrimination used by Western European powers to exploit and subjugate the non European world classes. The resulting power structure that was created by capitalism is the fabric of racism. Racism is an evolved term used to make this political discrimination. If you are of Western European descent you are by your very nature racist. You can not be otherwise.

/s just quoting from Seattle School district work.

582 The False God  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:48:10pm

re: #581 hazzyday

That made me very sad inside to read that.

I think I'm going to go get some coffee.

583 calcajun  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 2:20:26pm

re: #581 hazzyday

Bulls**t.

I'm still mulling a response to this whole affair, but the concept of "racism" is bothersome to me on many levels. The concept of "race" it self is irksome-- we are all humans; there are no separate races among humans. The genus is not subdivided-- we are all homo sapiens, not homo sapiens africanus or asiaticus or caucasiatic. We are one race. I don't like the term "racist" because I think it is too broad and over used. It might have had some meaning, but like "fascist", its original meaning has been diluted. I did not rush to condemn the photo above as "racist" ( though I decried it, its use and the person who published it) as, frankly, I am no longer certain as to the meaning of the word, or if it in fact has any real meaning.

"Bigotry", "prejudice", "xenophobia"--on the other hand, still mean something to me. I grew up with them. These concepts are not unique to one ethnic group; they are all inherent parts of the human condition. We are hard-wired that way. Every culture has it. It's been around since "Thag" got clubbed to death by the neighboring tribe because his teeth were whiter than theirs. It's in all of us. And it comes out in many ways, including some nasty ones and some more insidious ones--like ridiculing others for their different appearance or cultural practices.

Victor Davis Hanson remarked that we study history because human nature has not changed. Until it does, history is still relevant. Statements like the one in that text book are BIGOTED ; the implication is that one group alone is responsible for this social vice, while others are free from blame. It is also stupid as it ignores history. Attitude like this serve only to preserve and propagate prejudicial attitudes--not end them.

I've gone on longer than I wanted--back to work.

584 funky chicken  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 2:21:51pm

thank you Charles

585 dr. akim ullsheetbay  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 2:23:12pm

[Ed. note: this account has been blocked.]

i sadly read alot of screaming and getting tough on people who are 'defending racism'. i hear not a single word on 'defending satire'.

this photo was on point as a jab at obama's policy. those of us who live under socialist medicine as we do in canada know too well that when you get to an emergency room you may in fact meet someone on par with a medicine man - white, black, brown or yellow. and depending on the hospital the place may look no better than a mud hut.

question: if it were exactly the same picture but not in president obama's image is it racist or satire?

586 funky chicken  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 2:32:55pm

I thought AAPS looked familiar...I'm relieved that the nutbars just used the same initials as another reputable group, because several of my docs are members of AAPS...the good one. From google:

Association of American Physicians and Surgeons
A non-partisan professional association of physicians, dedicated to the highest ethical standards of the Oath of Hippocrates and to preserving the sanctity ...
www.aapsonline.org/ - Cached - Similar -

vs

American Association of Physician Specialists, Inc. - AAPS
The American Association of Physician Specialists, Inc. - AAPS - offers board certification in a number of medical specialties, providing a professional ...

587 Wishbone  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 2:37:34pm

re: #581 hazzyday

You haven't seen a tenth of the shit Western Europe can throw at you in the throes of the classic, liberal, guilt trip.

However...

If anyone here in Britain had published a picture like that of any man of colour, never mind the American President, they'd have been hung up by the ankles for a pinata.

Regardless of the point people seem to be trying to make about the context of the image, with regard to the healthcare aspect, even the most hard boiled conservative here would whistle, shake their heads and say "Mate... You really fucked up with that one"

The point being that there would be no doubt whatsoever as to how such an image would be received: Racist

I'm as stubborn and contrarian as it gets when it comes to the multicultural and the politically correct shit getting lobbed around in my country. I understand that people will rail against the same in their own way.

However... Shit that won't fly includes portraying educated, affluent and successful black men as 'Spearchuckers'... And I don't give a fuck what 'context' they give it otherwise.

588 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 2:44:22pm

And STILL people show up to defend this image. Even after the guy who posted it has apologized for it.

589 Stuart Leviton  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 2:47:46pm
"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all

If you invoke God's name but hate, aren't you taking God's name in vain? Where would you like to spend the rest of eternity?

590 Ringo the Gringo  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 2:52:11pm

re: #585 dr. akim ullsheetbay

i sadly read alot of screaming and getting tough on people who are 'defending racism'. i hear not a single word on 'defending satire'.

this photo was on point as a jab at obama's policy. those of us who live under socialist medicine as we do in canada know too well that when you get to an emergency room you may in fact meet someone on par with a medicine man - white, black, brown or yellow. and depending on the hospital the place may look no better than a mud hut.

question: if it were exactly the same picture but not in president obama's image is it racist or satire?

Nobody's saying that the picture of President Obama with a bone through his nose, dressed like voodoo witch doctor isn't satire, we're saying that it's racist. The two things are not mutually exclusive.

You seem to be totally unaware of the long history in America (and throughout the world) of black men being caricatured, in a derogatory manner, as "jungle men", "jigaboos" or "spear chuckers"?...Very strange.

591 funky chicken  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 2:53:30pm

re: #454 Killgore Trout

...and that's why American style free speech (as opposed to European and Canadian versions) works. He's certainly free to make racist images. If he didn't have that freedom we wouldn't know he was a douchebag. The system works pretty well.

Especially when we get lucky and said douchebag is a "three-fer:" racist, Paulnut, anti-vaxxer.

592 Simple Voice  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 5:22:20pm

re: #34 Charles

I won't defend that picture. It is racist.
I am not a fan of Ron Paul.
I am a supporter of the tea parties and I like Ann Coulter.
I am also an anti-abortion fanatic.
Abortion is murder.
Is it right to assassinate abortionist? No.
Did I weep when the abortionist was assassinated? No.
Do I think the guy who allegedly killed the abortionist is off his rocker? Yes.
(I use the word allegedly, because he has not been convicted of the murder...yet.)

593 freetoken  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 5:30:51pm

re: #592 Simple Voice

Those posts on Tiller's murder have been eating at you, haven't they?

594 Simple Voice  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 5:34:42pm

re: #593 freetoken

Never read them.
(In fact, had forgotten the doctor's name until you just mentioned it.)

595 ShanghaiEd  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 6:24:06pm

re: #581 hazzyday

In the current educational and political organizations racism is not a genetic condition. It's the ill fruit of centuries of cultural discrimination used by Western European powers to exploit and subjugate the non European world classes. The resulting power structure that was created by capitalism is the fabric of racism. Racism is an evolved term used to make this political discrimination. If you are of Western European descent you are by your very nature racist. You can not be otherwise.

/s just quoting from Seattle School district work.

Hazzy: I can't find a link online for the textbook you quote from. Could you give me more info, please?

596 hous bin pharteen  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 6:34:30pm

re: #534 Sharmuta
I was wondering how so many people have no idea that the only news that has a different view is Fox. ABC, CBS, NBC, MSNBC, CNN, PBS, CNBC, etc . They all have the same group think. But that will change what the new congress plans.

597 hous bin pharteen  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 6:49:55pm

re: #592 Simple Voice

I agree with you there.

598 Ringo the Gringo  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 7:05:10pm

Who's been fartin'?

599 hous bin pharteen  Fri, Jul 24, 2009 8:05:38pm

re: #598 Ringo the Gringo

Fartin? I think it is not fartin. It is Global Warming.


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