Debunking a Corollary to the Nirth Certifikit Theory

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Even among people who accept that Barack Obama is a US citizen, a sort of “spinoff” idea keeps coming up in our discussions of the Nirther craziness: that Barack Obama “won’t release” his original birth certificate (some people refer to it as a “long form” certificate) because there’s something on it he wants to hide.

The two most common explanations suggested by LGF commenters for this “hidden info” are that the birth certificate: 1) lists Obama’s religion as “Muslim,” or 2) lists his race as “black” or “white” (both possibilities have been argued).

Here’s an image pointed out by LGF reader “keithgabryelski” that definitively debunks the Hidden Info corollary to the Nirth Certifikit Theory.

The image shows an original state of Hawaii “Certificate of Live Birth” from 1962, posted at a site that provides information on obtaining passports, as an example of a valid birth certificate. It’s a reasonable assumption that the Hawaii birth certificate form didn’t change much (or at all) from August 1961 (when Barack Obama was born) to June 1962, and that Obama’s original birth certificate had the same information on it.

Note that there is no space on the form for any kind of religion, and no space for either the religion or the race of the baby, although the race of both parents is listed. (Click the image for a larger version.)

If you compare this to the officially stamped “Certification of Live Birth” for Barack Obama released by the Hawaii Health Department, you see that all of the vital information from the original form is indeed listed on the Obama document — both parents’ races included — and nothing important has been left out.

Status: debunked.

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930 comments
1 itellu3times  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:36:28pm

You have to soak it in lemon juice and hold it over a candle.

2 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:37:08pm

Evidence does not sway a believer. The Nirther stuff is nothing more than a sign of desperation for people who see black helicopters and enjoy having a victim status.

3 Diamond Bullet  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:39:22pm

Yet they all have no problem with the fact that Obama's "mother" was apparently a dude named Stanley.

Not that there's anything wrong with that!

4 MikeAlv77  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:39:38pm

Notice how they are different colors and the fonts are not like those used in 1961... We need a thorbbing birth certificate!!!

//

5 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:39:39pm

That should do the trick, not. The nirthers will say Charles is an expert with photoshop. (If you are, Charles, can you photoshop me with Dr. Monica Crowley?)

6 MikeAlv77  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:40:07pm

re: #4 MikeAlv77

Notice how they are different colors and the fonts are not like those used in 1961... We need a thorbbing birth certificate!!!

//

or a throbbing one... either will do...

(darn keyboard...)

7 LatinGent  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:40:09pm

You can lead a horse to water...

8 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:40:22pm

I wish Charles would make the copy of FCBBHO's birth certificate throb.

9 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:40:31pm

Thank you! I am so bloody sick of those stupid theories I could scream at the sight!

Thanks, Charles and kb!

10 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:40:47pm

re: #4 MikeAlv77

Notice how they are different colors and the fonts are not like those used in 1961... We need a thorbbing birth certificate!!!

//

GMTA.

11 zzzzzzzzzz.....  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:40:48pm

I think Obamas behavior on this is strange lending more credibility to the nirthers, but does anyone think that the people who are responsible in the Hawaiian health department could keep a secret that long? That is what blows it for me.

12 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:41:32pm

They can't handle the truth!

Even if there was "something" in there-- it's none of our damn business. The only relevant issue is the location of the birth--and that has been conclusively established. Anything else is a desire for salacious fodder for the gossip mills.

13 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:42:08pm

re: #11 zzz...

I think Obamas behavior on this is strange lending more credibility to the nirthers, but does anyone think that the people who are responsible in the Hawaiian health department could keep a secret that long? That is what blows it for me.

To some, that proves it all the more.

14 CyanSnowHawk  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:42:10pm

Hey thanks for that info. I had thought that the original reason for withholding it might be the Muslim thing, as that could have killed his nomination before it got serious.

I still think that if the 'long form' cert still exists, Obama will never release it just to keep the Nirthers distracted and discrediting his critics by association.

15 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:42:21pm

re: #7 LatinGent

You can lead a horse to water...

...but you cannot cut its head off and put in Woltz' bedroom without some help.

16 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:42:27pm
17 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:43:05pm

The burden of proof is not on Obama- it is on the nirthers to provide reasonable evidence he was not born in the United States. What Obama is doing here is upholding the rule of law. He is innocent until proven guilty.

Releasing it on his own would set a bad precedent both legally and politically in that conspiracy theorists would only have to raise enough noise to hold our legal system hostage, as well as all elected officials.

I really do not appreciate the nirthers forcing me to defend Obama, but they leave me no choice. He is in the right, and they are wrong.

18 Randall Gross  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:43:24pm

They are just going to bring forth corollary number three, the favorite of ahtlas shrieks: it lists Frank Marshall as the father.

19 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:44:26pm
20 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:44:40pm

Nice job, Charles. But it won't make any difference. The nirthers will simply move the goalposts again; it isn't about their speculation being wrong, see, it's now about 0bama's refusal to release the original, which must contain something incriminating or he wouldn't be hiding it, see? They'll be more careful in the future not to be so specific in their speculation about what that something is, to stave off further debunking, but they've once again shifted the argument from the evidence (which they've once again failed to provide) back onto 0bama's behavior in the context of the bizarre, alternative Universe they've constructed. And since the only actual input in this matter is the creation of more and more fictional postulates, this can literally go on forever.

The only cure is to ignore them to death. They do this for the attention it brings; shut of the spotlight, and they'll wander off to more fruitful attention-getting topics, like chemtrails.

21 Buck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:44:46pm

No Doctors Name / signature either.

22 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:44:56pm

Now they are asking for school transcripts. This will never end. But I am glad to see Republican leaders speak out forcefully saying that Obama was BORN IN THE USA. Get Springsteen going...

23 Ringo the Gringo  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:45:05pm

What I find most disturbing about Obama's “Certification of Live Birth” is the date of birth: Aug 4th, 1961.

He's too young!

24 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:45:25pm
25 harpsicon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:45:36pm

And also it now seems that the birth announcement information in the newspapers was supplied by the Health Dept and not the parents (or anybody else), so that last avenue of excuse dies as well.

26 J.S.  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:45:40pm

But, now, we've got the goods on Edith...heh, heh, heh...

(This rumor mongering should have stopped some time around last year. Lou Dobbs, btw, hasn't stopped...last night it was more of the same ol', same ol'...)

27 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:45:57pm

Anyone who says, "I'm not a nirther, but..." is a nirther.

28 JustABill  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:46:05pm

Interesting, thanks for taking the time to find this...

29 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:46:24pm

Maybe it lists his parents as "Stanley" and "Anne"

/

30 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:46:31pm

Dobbs and Fox are just catering to their audience. It is about the money not journalism.

31 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:47:06pm

re: #21 Buck

Objection-- irrelevant. It's an official document and a court could take judicial notice of it.

32 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:47:11pm

Loons claim the Supreme Court handed Gore's win to Bush. The same kind of loon, Birthers, claim Øbama is not an American citizen. Like the 2000 election is done, so is the 2008 election. Go away Birthers.

33 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:47:28pm

re: #20 SixDegrees

I always want to ask, "What, exactly, could possibly show up on a birth certificate that would be a problem?" What "unsavory" fact?

Please.

Obama's father was already married in Kenya - we know that. He was unfaithful to Sidney Ann, and dumped her and her little boy when Obama was two. What exactly are the idiots looking for?

34 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:47:35pm

re: #29 Alouette

Or Blothar of Galactocos III

35 JustABill  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:47:38pm

re: #27 Sharmuta

Anyone who says, "I'm not a nirther, but..." is a nirther.

I guess that makes you a Nirther.//

36 MikeAlv77  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:47:52pm

re: #27 Sharmuta

Anyone who says, "I'm not a nirther, but..." is a nirther.

I'm not a Nirther but I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night...

37 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:47:58pm

And one more point -- another reason why Obama hasn't released the "long form" certificate is that the state of Hawaii does not give out copies of the original. If you request a copy of your birth certificate, that second document above is the ONLY thing you can get.

38 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:48:24pm

re: #18 Thanos

They are just going to bring forth corollary number three, the favorite of ahtlas shrieks: it lists Frank Marshall as the father.

She actually believes that?

39 Bloodnok  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:48:33pm

re: #27 Sharmuta

Anyone who says, "I'm not a nirther, but..." is a nirther.

I give it the same credence I give any statement containing "I'm not a Paulian, but".

40 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:48:58pm

re: #23 Ringo the Gringo

What I find most disturbing about Obama's “Certification of Live Birth” is the date of birth: Aug 4th, 1961.

He's too young!

He's older than I am, anyway!

41 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:49:14pm

re: #7 LatinGent

You can lead a horse to water...

...and place him in the ring.

42 MikeAlv77  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:49:19pm

re: #37 Charles

And one more point -- another reason why Obama hasn't released the "long form" certificate is that the state of Hawaii does not give out copies of the original. If you request a copy of your birth certificate, that second document above is the ONLY thing you can get.

Charles, Come on... this just proves that Hawaii was in on this since BEFORE Obama was born.. Its the Bild-a-burger food chain behind it!!!

43 Ringo the Gringo  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:49:35pm

re: #40 Dianna

He's older than I am, anyway!

Me too, barely.

44 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:49:51pm
certificate is that the state of Hawaii does not give out copies of the original.

Proof of a cospiracy if you ask me. Just kidding!!!

45 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:49:52pm

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

46 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:50:05pm

If I go to a party, meet a hot nirther chick, agree with her to get her in the sack and afterwards pull up LGF and show this story, will I burn in hell?

47 Ringo the Gringo  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:50:16pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

I have mine.

48 yesandno  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:50:20pm

The country is going to hell in a handbasket and they ignore it and are determined to go after Obama's BC in hope of a "gotta ya" moment...how brilliant.

49 Steve Rogers  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:50:28pm

People should be grateful for Charles and his efforts in trying to prevent this Obama Derangement Syndrome (ODS) that some have -- I know I am. Such nonsense only hurts those who legitimately oppose Obama's policies and makes Obama look all the more better in the eyes of the sane rational people out there.

We all saw how destructive and looney it was when it was Bush Derangement Syndrome (BDS). Unfortunately, some of those same people can't see it in themselves now that it is ODS.

Keep fighting the good fight, Charles!

50 wrenchwench  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:50:43pm

"FATHER'S RACE: AFRICAN"

That's not a race. I guess they couldn't make it multiple choice.

51 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:51:07pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

I do

52 erp  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:51:13pm

Just as I thought. Obama's parents weren't married.

The mother's name is not listed as Obama. Remember in those days married women didn't use their maiden name. Obama senior had a wife or two back home, so he couldn't have married Stanley even if he wanted to and that's probably why he couldn't take them to Harvard with him.

I guess the president doesn't want people to know he's both a literal and figurative bastard.

53 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:51:14pm

Now that we got the GOP leadership speaking out against the nirthers is there any way we can convince them to start speaking out against creationism in science classes?

54 MikeAlv77  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:51:17pm

re: #46 Cannadian Club Akbar

If I go to a party, meet a hot nirther chick, agree with her to get her in the sack and afterwards pull up LGF and show this story, will I burn in hell?

If she has a hot twin with her... you get to go to purgatory

55 Erik The Red  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:51:22pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

I do now. I have lost the damn thing twice and only have certified copies from Ohio.

56 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:51:27pm

So the term "long form" is BS too. What they apparently mean is the original certificate or a copy thereof, instead of a modernized, computerized version.

My own birth certificate copies look just like the one at the top, including the embossed notary's seal which you can make out surrounding the words "Honolulu, Hawaii". Mine come from a Midwest state. It would appear that back in the mid twentieth century, this was the standard type of form.

It's been years - decades, maybe - since I obtained those copies. I'd be willing to bet that if I sent off for one today, it would look more like the bottom picture.

Will this stop the nut-tards? No.

57 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:51:35pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

This one does.

58 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:51:54pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

I just looked at mine. It is a white-on-black photocopy, handwritten, and my parents' "color" is "White."

/Geez, I'm older than dirt.

59 vxbush  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:52:28pm

Yay to Charles and keithgabryelski for putting out more facts and logic!

60 Lee Coller  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:52:36pm

Cost of certified Birth Certificate: $10
Cost of lawyers to prevent release of BC: $1,000,000
Having your ideological opponents waste time on wild conspiracy theories: Priceless

61 Ringo the Gringo  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:52:38pm

I've seen some of these nirthers up close.

Nothing's going to satisfy them.

62 Charpete67  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:52:39pm

re: #55 Erik The Red

I do now. I have lost the damn thing twice and only have certified copies from Ohio.

you could never run for President...//

63 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:52:52pm
"FATHER'S RACE: AFRICAN"

According to Hawaiian official they let the individual declare their race using whatever term they like.

64 Digital Display  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:52:56pm

re: #46 Cannadian Club Akbar

If I go to a party, meet a hot nirther chick, agree with her to get her in the sack and afterwards pull up LGF and show this story, will I burn in hell?

Well you can't say 'who's your Daddy!' She'll ask for proof

65 Bloodnok  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:53:17pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

I'm not sure where mine is or what type it was. I think it looked like the picture with the thumb in it above. I may have to conduct a search when I get home.

66 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:53:21pm

re: #60 Lee Coller

Love it!

67 Randall Gross  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:53:25pm

re: #38 MandyManners

She actually believes that?

She's pimped it, the cognitive dissonance is large for that one - can't decide if he's a sekret mooslim, a sekret commie, or both...

68 Buck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:53:26pm

I still hate Obama. I hate how he deals with people by always telling them what they want to hear.

In time he will have to pick sides. He can't be everything to everyone.

He has exposed his true feelings about Israel, in his Egypt speech, and in insisting Israel act unilaterally.

I hate the guy, I really do...

BUT the Nirther stuff is nonsense. Sure when I first heard about I had a hope that it was true...

But it isn't, and nothing will make it true.

What I also hate is how the birther thing is being blamed on Conservatives. It is no more a conservative thing than 9/11 truth was strictly a Left thing.
In fact the "Dear Leader" of both is the same GUY! Which proves it is a NUT thing.

69 vxbush  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:53:28pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

Absolutely, along with everyone in my family. I've had to take my in recently for paperwork, and I was afraid it would be rejected as it is a mimeograph from 1968 and tattered beyond all recognition. But the department still took it, amazingly.

70 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:53:31pm

Can someone send it to the Freepers? I can't, just because I am stupid.

71 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:53:34pm

re: #46 Cannadian Club Akbar

If I go to a party, meet a hot nirther chick, agree with her to get her in the sack and afterwards pull up LGF and show this story, will I burn in hell?

*facepalm*

72 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:53:34pm

If Øbama were not a citizen, the man to object would have been John McCain, the man with standing. Move on Nirther.

73 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:53:44pm

re: #52 erp

Just as I thought. Obama's parents weren't married.

The mother's name is not listed as Obama. Remember in those days married women didn't use their maiden name. Obama senior had a wife or two back home, so he couldn't have married Stanley even if he wanted to and that's probably why he couldn't take them to Harvard with him.

I guess the president doesn't want people to know he's both a literal and figurative bastard.

*Sigh*.

"Mother's Maiden Name" is what's listed. It's on my birth certificate, too.

If you're implying I was born out of wedlock, you're an idiot.

74 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:54:00pm

re: #50 wrenchwench

"FATHER'S RACE: AFRICAN"

That's not a race. I guess they couldn't make it multiple choice.

Father's Race: the 200m relay?

75 vxbush  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:54:08pm

re: #63 Chekote

According to Hawaiian official they let the individual declare their race using whatever term they like.

So I could list myself as Bejoran?

76 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:54:23pm
Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

I am new around here. I don't know what a lizard is but I do know where my birth certificate is.

77 eschew_obfuscation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:54:29pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

Oooh, Oooh, Oooh! I do! I do!

(what do I get?)

78 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:54:39pm

When idiots collide...
MSNBC's Donnie Deutsch calls for Glenn Beck Adverstiser Boycott - UPDATED w/Contact Info
The Koskidz are very excited about this and nobody thinks it's odd that a cable news channel is calling for a boycott of its competitor. Also missing is the irony that MSNBC is calling for a boycott over racism while employing Pat Buchanan.

79 JustABill  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:54:47pm

re: #63 Chekote

According to Hawaiian official they let the individual declare their race using whatever term they like.

If I have a kid there, can I list Datona Beach 500?

80 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:55:00pm

re: #52 erp

WTF? Why hang a label on the child? He didn't do anything wrong.

81 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:55:00pm

re: #71 MandyManners

I thought that would have merited sumthin' stronger.

82 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:55:16pm

It says "Barracks" not "Barack!"

SMOKING GUN!!!

83 wrenchwench  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:55:22pm

re: #63 Chekote

According to Hawaiian official they let the individual declare their race using whatever term they like.

That's probably the only good way to do it. If they need to put "race" on a birth certificate. Heck, now they could just put a little DNA sample on it.

84 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:55:28pm
So I could list myself as Bejoran?

I guess so. I supposed the let it go as African since Barack's father was in the US on a student visa.

85 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:55:46pm

re: #67 Thanos

She's pimped it, the cognitive dissonance is large for that one - can't decide if he's a sekret mooslim, a sekret commie, or both...

I thought it was Malcolm X? Or am I getting confused?

86 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:56:26pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

I have a copy in my possession. The original is on file with the state's department of Vital Statistics.

87 JustABill  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:56:33pm

re: #76 Chekote

I am new around here. I don't know what a lizard is but I do know where my birth certificate is.

A lizard is anyone with an account here. So you qualify.

88 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:56:34pm

I posted this downstairs, but it bears another mention. The core of the nirther argument is based on an Argument from Ignorance, or a demand for negative proof. It is a logical fallacy that can never be answered, and because of this it is a favorite among conspiracy theorists of all stripes, who employ it constantly while ignoring the fact that it is a worthless, unanswerable argument.

Note that the examples given in the article can be converted into nirtherisms - including this latest example - with nothing more than minor word substitutions.

Arguments from ignorance are strictly disallowed in courts of law just for this reason. In court, one is required to provide positive proof of a claim - not speculation or innuendo. It is up to the nirthers to do the same if they want their claims to be taken seriously. Produce a birth certificate from a foreign country showing 0bama was born there; or produce some official document or first-hand testimony supporting the argument that religion, or race, or some other specific fact exists whose revelation would be politically or personally embarrassing.

Or, when all of this fails, as it certainly will: shut the fuck up and go bother the the Rainbow Sprinkler Lady.

89 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:56:48pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

my original is in a box ten not feet from me...

90 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:57:04pm

re: #52 erp

Birth certificates always list the mother's maiden name.

91 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:57:12pm
I thought it was Malcolm X? Or am I getting confused?

I actually know someone who is convinced that Obama's is the son of Malcom X. I didn't even bother asking where she got that info.

92 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:57:24pm

What I want to know is - can you get a new passport if the picture in your current one (pop-eyed, startled, crazy look of a cokehead when the light suddenly switches on at 3:48 A.M.) makes customs agents burst out laughing? It was taken at the post office and I was logy that day and didn't think to look at it before they sent it off to wherever passports are made.

Serious question. I'm willing to pay the cost, but will they let me get a replacement for that reason? Or should I just shred it and tell 'em it got lost?

93 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:57:28pm

re: #88 SixDegrees

I love the Rainbow Sprinkler Lady!

94 shiplord kirel  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:57:40pm

Well, fiddlesticks. The "race" listing hypothesis was quite reasonable, that the parents would want the baby declared "white" in an effort to give him what looked like the best chance at the time.
They could not have anticipated that this would be an embarrassment 40+ years later.

Reasonable or otherwise, the hypothesis just happens to be wrong.

95 wrenchwench  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:57:52pm

re: #52 erp

The mother's name is not listed as Obama.

The form says "Mother's Maiden Name"

96 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:57:56pm

re: #81 calcajun

I thought that would have merited sumthin' stronger.

I was laughing too hard to *whack*.

97 JakeSpiderMonkey  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:58:03pm

As far as I'm concerned, I don't care if you think I'm a conspiracy nut or nut, but somethings wrong with this picture:

Barry won't release his birth certificate, his college transcripts, his medical records (I think), his parent's birth certificate, etc. and yet, McCain had to send ALL OF THESE RECORDS! What makes Barry so special!

I still think Obama is a DANGEROUS MAN before he was elected the democratic nominee for president (GREAT DANCER! ON Ellen!), the next Kennedy, and all this other crap! I get fed up of hearing the TV media and that's why I don't have cable or TV and listen to the propaganda by CNN and other stations. Yeah, I listen to Rush and Glen Beck (that racist!) and I take it with a grain of salt. Hey, at least Glen makes better sense than Katie Couric!

Now, he's president, and the government runs General Motors, the government runs AIG, maybe the big oil industry, or any other things! Now, Barry wants the medical industry. Many people fear we might end up like a so-call "Socialist paradise" someone like William Ayers and Hugo Chavez! No Thanks! the radical left is destroying this great country on purpose because they hate it!

Barry is a liar by saying when he was elected, the unemployment rate will not go about 8.5%. Well, it's close to 10% and NO ONE IN THE MEDIA IS CRITICIZING HIM! I think that's because he's a liberal, a democrat, and black! If the media won't say it, I WILL!!!

98 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:58:06pm

re: #76 Chekote

I am new around here. I don't know what a lizard is but I do know where my birth certificate is.

I'm a lizard. You're a lizard. Charles is the Lizard King.

That, or you can call yourself a lizardoid minion, though that term seems to have fallen out of favor.

99 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:58:25pm
Birth certificates always list the mother's maiden name.

Makes sense given all the divorces. Barack's parents were married in February 1961.

100 eon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:58:28pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

I know where mine is, but only because of the genuinely amazing number of things I need it, plus my SocSec card, plus at least two photo IDs for these days.

Two weeks ago I was asked to provide three forms of ID (including the aforementioned ones with the photo) when paying the second half property taxes on my house. (I paid with a cashier's check.) Now, quite aside from the fact that a cashier's check is equivalent to cash, why would anyone not me be paying property tax for me?

When I asked for an explanation (politely) I was told, "new policy". Exactly whose policy, or why, was not explained.

As Heinlein observed, this is a period in which one cannot make a move without at least half a dozen documents proving that you are really you. Which makes the Nirthers "theories" just that much more ridiculous.

On the plus side, Illinois no longer has to shoulder all the blame for The One. Although Chicago still gets most of it, IMHO.

cheers

eon

101 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:58:30pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

I have a certified copy dated 8 months after I was born on the stamp (It's stamped in 1975, so this form of cert was used in CA in 1975 at least). It looks almost exactly the same as the one in the first picture but is from CA.

102 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:58:41pm
103 vxbush  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:58:48pm

re: #88 SixDegrees

Or, when all of this fails, as it certainly will: shut the fuck up and go bother the the Rainbow Sprinkler Lady.

Oh, I love her. I just want to wrap her up and send her to Putin.

104 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:58:59pm

re: #78 Killgore Trout

Can we just start the popcorn?

105 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:59:10pm

re: #95 wrenchwench

The form says "Mother's Maiden Name"

Reading is teh hard.

106 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:59:25pm

at least it does not name him as Baw-Rawk or whatever

107 itellu3times  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:59:46pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

I do not have a certificate that documents the live birth of itellu3times, so I guess there goes my goal of public office.

108 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:59:47pm

re: #91 Chekote

I actually know someone who is convinced that Obama's is the son of Malcom X. I didn't even bother asking where she got that info.

You know pamela geller?

109 vxbush  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 1:59:57pm

re: #98 Dianna

I'm a lizard. You're a lizard. Charles is the Lizard King.

That, or you can call yourself a lizardoid minion, though that term seems to have fallen out of favor.

Never. Minions are always in style!

110 J.S.  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:00:13pm

re: #56 Cato the Elder

No, the term "long form" is NOT bogus. Some (if not most?) of the States in the United States have TWO forms -- one, the so-called "short" form (typically it's a card form), which just gives the vitals -- no info about parents, etc. Then, there's a "long-form" which lists one's heritage (it's used for obtaining passports, proof of US citizenship, etc.) there's a wiki article on this, btw.

111 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:00:25pm

re: #76 Chekote

I am new around here. I don't know what a lizard is but I do know where my birth certificate is.

Yes, you a lizard. If you want to lurk and learn the little things, that is better than saying the wrong thing. But, WELCOME!!
/I got you a six pack, but it's gone, sorry.

112 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:00:25pm

re: #100 eon

I know where mine is, but only because of the genuinely amazing number of things I need it, plus my SocSec card, plus at least two photo IDs for these days.

Two weeks ago I was asked to provide three forms of ID (including the aforementioned ones with the photo) when paying the second half property taxes on my house. (I paid with a cashier's check.) Now, quite aside from the fact that a cashier's check is equivalent to cash, why would anyone not me be paying property tax for me?

When I asked for an explanation (politely) I was told, "new policy". Exactly whose policy, or why, was not explained.

As Heinlein observed, this is a period in which one cannot make a move without at least half a dozen documents proving that you are really you. Which makes the Nirthers "theories" just that much more ridiculous.

On the plus side, Illinois no longer has to shoulder all the blame for The One. Although Chicago still gets most of it, IMHO.

cheers

eon

I would've asked for a copy of that new policiy.

113 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:00:26pm

re: #97 JakeSpiderMonkey

Shake the tree and out they plop.

114 Bloodnok  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:00:38pm

re: #97 JakeSpiderMonkey

That's a lot of exclamation points.

Look JakeSpiderMonkey, I can see you're really upset about this. I honestly think you ought to sit down calmly, take a stress pill and think things over.

115 jamihabs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:01:05pm

Even if Obama could put an end to this conspiracy theory, why would he? He must be thrilled at the fact that right wing idiots are making the general conservative community look stupid.

116 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:01:15pm
117 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:01:18pm

re: #91 Chekote

I actually know someone who is convinced that Obama's is the son of Malcom X. I didn't even bother asking where she got that info.

I thought that was a passing fancy.

118 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:01:22pm

re: #18 Thanos

They are just going to bring forth corollary number three, the favorite of ahtlas shrieks: it lists Frank Marshall as the father.

I thought her favorite one would be that it lists "Malik El-Shabazz" as the father.

119 Lincolntf  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:01:24pm

I totally understand Obama not doing anything but laughing at the Birth Certificate activists. He's already produced a birth certificate and the people questioning it look likr dopes. he's both morally and politically covered there.
I don't get the justification for hiding his transcripts, though. Where is his moral footing on that one?
We'd like to know a bit more about you Mr. President. Is that still forbidden?

120 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:01:41pm

re: #97 JakeSpiderMonkey

Nut.

121 J.S.  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:01:54pm

Wiki article link on US birth certificates...here.

122 itellu3times  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:02:10pm

re: #100 eon

All kinds of mortgage and property fraud.

123 Charpete67  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:02:11pm

re: #97 JakeSpiderMonkey

you lost me at

I don't care if you think I'm a conspiracy nut
124 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:02:34pm

re: #119 Lincolntf

I honestly don't care about his transcripts. I care about his policies and their effect on the US.

125 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:02:39pm
126 Dahveed  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:02:41pm

C'mon - we all know that Rahm Emanuel planted the birth certificate.

/Will this stupidity ever end?

127 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:02:54pm

re: #110 J.S.

No, the term "long form" is NOT bogus. Some (if not most?) of the States in the United States have TWO forms -- one, the so-called "short" form (typically it's a card form), which just gives the vitals -- no info about parents, etc. Then, there's a "long-form" which lists one's heritage (it's used for obtaining passports, proof of US citizenship, etc.) there's a wiki article on this, btw.

What I'm saying is the use of the term by the nirthers is bogus.

128 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:03:21pm

re: #99 Chekote

Makes sense given all the divorces. Barack's parents were married in February 1961.

Heh. So she WAS knocked up.

129 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:03:31pm

re: #82 Ben Hur

It says "Barracks" not "Barack!"

SMOKING GUN!!!


Ahhh...Mailing address...sample certificate...Army Barracks.

130 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:03:49pm

re: #99 Chekote

Makes sense given all the divorces. Barack's parents were married in February 1961.

My grandmother's birth certificate lists her mother's maiden name. That was in 1900.

Breathe.

131 funky chicken  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:03:50pm

re: #12 calcajun

They can't handle the truth!

Even if there was "something" in there-- it's none of our damn business. The only relevant issue is the location of the birth--and that has been conclusively established. Anything else is a desire for salacious fodder for the gossip mills.

I picture Dana Carvey's Church Lady wearing a tinfoil hat.

132 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:03:51pm

re: #125 taxfreekiller

ID theft by ones not legal.

ID theft while paying property taxes with cash?

133 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:03:57pm

re: #93 Ben Hur

I love the Rainbow Sprinkler Lady!

She's a deep thinker, that one.

134 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:04:09pm

re: #124 Chekote

I honestly don't care about his transcripts. I care about his policies and their effect on the US.

Off to a good start.

135 Lincolntf  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:04:16pm

re: #124 Chekote

Ignorance of Obama's past is no virtue. His grades/classes chosen, etc. could be very informative.

136 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:04:42pm
Heh. So she WAS knocked up.

Seems so.

137 CynicalConservative  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:05:23pm

re: #116 taxfreekiller

Obama Health Care, debunked by Obama.

You watched that too, eh?

138 J.S.  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:05:31pm

re: #127 Cato the Elder

Oh, I see...yes. Agreed.

139 DEZes  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:05:32pm

re: #133 SixDegrees

She's a deep thinker, that one.

I was wondering whats she's got in her pipe.

140 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:05:42pm
Ignorance of Obama's past is no virtue. His grades/classes chosen, etc. could be very informative.

I honestly don't see how.

141 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:05:47pm
Barry won't release his birth certificate, his college transcripts, his medical records (I think), his parent's birth certificate, etc. and yet, McCain had to send ALL OF THESE RECORDS!

C'mon. Maybe aside from the BC, NONE of you wonder why?

For me, it's the college transcripts.

142 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:06:14pm
143 Altermite  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:06:45pm

re: #119 Lincolntf

I totally understand Obama not doing anything but laughing at the Birth Certificate activists. He's already produced a birth certificate and the people questioning it look likr dopes. he's both morally and politically covered there.
I don't get the justification for hiding his transcripts, though. Where is his moral footing on that one?
We'd like to know a bit more about you Mr. President. Is that still forbidden?


I'm not showing you my transcript either. Why? I don't have to, and releasing it, no matter how decent my grades are and my classes are, is going to end up giving me a hard time, since it will simply give people more to comb over.

That said, he isn't even hiding his transcripts. All he has to do is let them be treated like any other transcripts, and the school will do that for him. Transcripts are only released on request and payment (at some schools, anyways) by the person whose they are.

144 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:06:46pm

re: #133 SixDegrees

She's a deep thinker, that one.

Effen A, brother.

145 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:07:01pm

re: #140 Chekote

I honestly don't see how.

I think he failed econ 101...I'm an econirther

146 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:07:03pm

re: #91 Chekote

I actually know someone who is convinced that Obama's is the son of Malcom X. I didn't even bother asking where she got that info.

I could tell you, but I don't want to be responsible for your ER visit if you look at the site.

*cough*Atlas Shrugs*cough*

147 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:07:26pm

re: #97 JakeSpiderMonkey

Please, tell us all why this certificate issue matters if it has been conclusively established that he was born in the US of A? What legitimate legal or political end is to be gained?

148 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:07:37pm

I think the whole nirther thing is stoopid...
But, seeing the first example, just asking: why no dr's signature, hospital or home birth designation, and other info that is listed on the first example?
There must be some simple explanation.

149 Randall Gross  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:07:44pm

re: #85 Dianna

I thought it was Malcolm X? Or am I getting confused?

Nah, it might be me who's confused. Both are out there at Nirther sites, I might have her mixed up with someone else's nirther paranoid fantasy.

150 Lincolntf  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:07:57pm

re: #140 Chekote

Have you never read a Presidential biography? You might be surprised at how often choices made in early life resonate decades later in both actions and formation of character.

151 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:07:59pm
I think he failed econ 101...I'm an econirther

You don't need to see transcripts to know that.

152 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:08:21pm

Forget the birth certificate, often I wonder if Øbama is real, or is this all just a dream?

153 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:08:25pm

re: #131 funky chicken

I picture Dana Carvey's Church Lady wearing a tinfoil hat.

Well, SATAN was not listed as his father, so the whole anti-Christ thing is off the table.//

154 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:08:35pm

I would release my transcripts, but you would see more "F's" then Mandy on a bender.:)

155 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:08:41pm
156 zelnaga  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:08:48pm

i don't know why obama doesn't release his long form birth certificate but i also don't think it really matters.

a couple reasons do come to mind, however. maybe the obama administration is trying to marginalize nirthers under the assumption that such ludicrous positions don't deserve acknowledgment. if so, i'd hardly blame them - isn't that, after all, what the bush administration did to troofers?

157 RoughRider  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:08:49pm

re: #73 Dianna

"Mother's Maiden Name" is what's listed. It's on my birth certificate, too.

Stanley Ann Dunham is your mom too?


/

158 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:09:03pm

They should spend so much time and effort finding the dealer.

(yes, I'm going there.)

159 avanti  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:09:09pm

I don't even know what difference a religion on the certificate would mean. Mine said Greek Orthodox, and I've never sat foot in that church and only in other churches for a occasional wedding.

160 sngnsgt  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:09:19pm

re: #97 JakeSpiderMonkey

As far as I'm concerned, I don't care if you think I'm a conspiracy nut or nut, but somethings wrong with this picture:

I think you're a nut, you said it yourself.

161 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:09:21pm

re: #150 Lincolntf

You might be surprised at how often choices made in early life resonate decades later in both actions and formation of character.

Like, "How the hell did I get stuck with these parents?"

162 Charpete67  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:09:22pm

re: #152 unrealizedviewpoint

Forget the birth certificate, often I wonder if Øbama is real, or is this all just a dream?

...hologram?

163 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:09:27pm

What I find appalling about this speculation on race and religion is it's not a barrier to office in this country. There's no race requirement, and no religious test. Frankly- I have to wonder if those pushing these theories aren't showing some bigotry. Who cares?

164 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:09:31pm

re: #142 taxfreekiller

City, County, School, State, Federal tax collectors do not care where the hell the, check, cash, credit card, gold whatever, they just want the money.

So why make someone get all that proof of ID?

165 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:09:45pm
Have you never read a Presidential biography? You might be surprised at how often choices made in early life resonate decades later in both actions and formation of character.

You don't need transcripts. Just by looking at the schools and the people who surrounded him, you know where Obama gets his philosophy.

166 eon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:09:59pm

re: #112 MandyManners

I would've asked for a copy of that new policy.

I thought about that, but the odds are in favor of the people in the office going by a memo posted on their bulletin board. Requests like that tend to get "sent up the ladder" until somebody ignores them.

/Our local Treasurer's Office is run amazingly like Dilbert's company.

cheers

eon

167 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:10:40pm
168 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:10:41pm

re: #152 unrealizedviewpoint

Forget the birth certificate, often I wonder if Øbama is real, or is this all just a dream?

Want me to pinch you?

169 sngnsgt  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:10:48pm

re: #152 unrealizedviewpoint

Forget the birth certificate, often I wonder if Øbama is real, or is this all just a dream?

This is all a bad dream bad nightmare.

170 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:10:56pm

re: #148 tradewind

Seeing the first example, it looks like old pops was rocking that cradle a little bit.

171 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:10:59pm

re: #154 Cannadian Club Akbar

I would release my transcripts, but you would see more "F's" then Mandy on a bender.:)

LOL!

172 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:11:08pm

re: #151 Chekote

Since you're new, I'm going to tip you off to the nifty "reply" and "quote" functions that were so kindly coded for our use. Welcome to LGF.

173 JustABill  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:11:14pm

re: #141 Ben Hur

C'mon. Maybe aside from the BC, NONE of you wonder why?

For me, it's the college transcripts.

I am curious as to how he did in college, but attending college is not a Constitutional requirement to hold office. He has a right to privacy, so if he chooses not to release transcripts and people vote for him anyways, so be it.

He does have to have been born in the US to be President according to the Constitution. He has proven this, so he is can hold the office.

174 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:11:15pm

re: #163 Sharmuta

What I find appalling about this speculation on race and religion is it's not a barrier to office in this country. There's no race requirement, and no religious test. Frankly- I have to wonder if those pushing these theories aren't showing some bigotry. Who cares?

not me...but I do have a morbid curiosity about his school records...race and religion mean nothing

175 funky chicken  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:11:23pm

re: #46 Cannadian Club Akbar

If I go to a party, meet a hot nirther chick, agree with her to get her in the sack and afterwards pull up LGF and show this story, will I burn in hell?

Well, that flaming herpes outbreak might make you think you are...

176 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:11:48pm

re: #168 MandyManners

Want me to pinch you?

I need a hug.

177 avanti  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:11:59pm

re: #14 CyanSnowHawk

Hey thanks for that info. I had thought that the original reason for withholding it might be the Muslim thing, as that could have killed his nomination before it got serious.

I still think that if the 'long form' cert still exists, Obama will never release it just to keep the Nirthers distracted and discrediting his critics by association.

It does exist, and the gal from Hawaii compared it the the Internet one a said they were in agreement. CNN incorrectly reported they destoyed years ago.

178 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:11:59pm

re: #166 eon

I thought about that, but the odds are in favor of the people in the office going by a memo posted on their bulletin board. Requests like that tend to get "sent up the ladder" until somebody ignores them.

/Our local Treasurer's Office is run amazingly like Dilbert's company.

cheers

eon

I'd move to Elbonia.

179 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:12:02pm

re: #164 MandyManners

So why make someone get all that proof of ID?

job security...lots of papers to look at

180 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:12:04pm
181 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:12:05pm

re: #159 avanti

I don't even know what difference a religion on the certificate would mean. Mine said Greek Orthodox, and I've never sat foot in that church and only in other churches for a occasional wedding.

It's kind of a howler to have an infant's religion listed.

It's like the line from "Meaning of Life";

Brand new Mom:

"Is is a boy or a girl"

PC Doctor:

"It's a bit early to start imposing roles on it."
182 CynicalConservative  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:12:08pm

re: #155 taxfreekiller

if he did not have the msm etal covering for him,
the guys in the white uniforms would be hauling him
off the the funny farm

he is slipping into the no go zone fast

Too bad we can't consider the POTUS as being under oath 24/7; perjury charges would be nice.

183 Chekote  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:12:14pm

re: #172 Sharmuta

Thanks!

184 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:12:21pm

We already knew she was preggers. It was in all the puff-pieces!

185 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:12:47pm

re: #176 unrealizedviewpoint

I need a hug.

(((unrealized)))

HEY, STOP THAT.

186 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:12:49pm

re: #97 JakeSpiderMonkey

As far as I'm concerned, I don't care if you think I'm a conspiracy nut or nut, but somethings wrong with this picture:

Barry won't release his birth certificate, his college transcripts, his medical records (I think), his parent's birth certificate, etc. and yet, McCain had to send ALL OF THESE RECORDS! What makes Barry so special!

I still think Obama is a DANGEROUS MAN before he was elected the democratic nominee for president (GREAT DANCER! ON Ellen!), the next Kennedy, and all this other crap! I get fed up of hearing the TV media and that's why I don't have cable or TV and listen to the propaganda by CNN and other stations. Yeah, I listen to Rush and Glen Beck (that racist!) and I take it with a grain of salt. Hey, at least Glen makes better sense than Katie Couric!

Now, he's president, and the government runs General Motors, the government runs AIG, maybe the big oil industry, or any other things! Now, Barry wants the medical industry. Many people fear we might end up like a so-call "Socialist paradise" someone like William Ayers and Hugo Chavez! No Thanks! the radical left is destroying this great country on purpose because they hate it!

Barry is a liar by saying when he was elected, the unemployment rate will not go about 8.5%. Well, it's close to 10% and NO ONE IN THE MEDIA IS CRITICIZING HIM! I think that's because he's a liberal, a democrat, and black! If the media won't say it, I WILL!!!

One more time - Read This. It's what you're doing.

187 Digital Display  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:12:51pm

re: #141 Ben Hur

C'mon. Maybe aside from the BC, NONE of you wonder why?

For me, it's the college transcripts.

Why? What would it change? Is this how we battle for ideas in the public Forum?
Damn man.You only got a 3.2 in Econ..Time to start the impeachment process on your ass!
People do not realize this but they will flunk you out of Harvard.
Apparently he graduated...I don't like Obama's policies but he isn't a dumbass and this road leads to nowhere...

188 Lincolntf  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:12:51pm

re: #143 Altermite

Nobody wants to see your (or my) transcript. It would be boring whether it was all A's or all F's.
Any normally curious person would want to see the college transcript of the current President. He is just so used to framing every request for info. as an assault on his infallibility that he can't countenance opening the files.

189 reloadingisnotahobby  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:12:57pm

re: #153 calcajun
Satan wasn't on Damiens Birth Certificate either!
We saw how that turned out!!
...Just sayin...

190 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:13:11pm

re: #27 Sharmuta

Anyone who says, "I'm not a nirther, but..." is a nirther.

A nirther, or trying to mainstream craziness by comparing themselves to nirthers.

"I'm by no means a nirther. That's why you should trust me when I say this video footage of Obama fathering an extraterrestrial seems very convincing."

191 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:13:20pm

re: #179 albusteve

job security...lots of papers to look at

And, trees to kill.

192 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:13:35pm

re: #142 taxfreekiller

City, County, School, State, Federal tax collectors do not care where the hell the, check, cash, credit card, gold whatever, they just want the money.

"You have a new king!"

"Oh." Peasant looks thoughtfully about. "So how many of my chickens is he going to steal?"

193 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:13:45pm

re: #180 taxfreekiller

ID theft is the one thing the two party evil money cult fear the most

If they do not know who we are, they can not tax or find us if we do not pay.

ID is key to control.

BURN YOUR DRIVERS'S LICENSE!

194 vxbush  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:14:24pm

re: #193 MandyManners

BURN YOUR DRIVERS'S LICENSE!

Actually, the picture on mine isn't completely terrible. I'd hate to have to get a new one.

195 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:15:09pm

re: #184 Dianna

We already knew she was preggers. It was in all the puff-pieces!

I didn't know that, but then I don't read puff-pieces and I certainly have steered clear of all the Obamamania fawning biopics and magazine covers.

196 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:15:40pm

re: #194 vxbush

Actually, the picture on mine isn't completely terrible. I'd hate to have to get a new one.

Same here.

197 Randall Gross  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:15:50pm

Here we go from An(ass) Shrieks, I knew I'd seen this line somewhere:

That is the trail some say and I don't know but am open to proof one way or the other.

But if Davis and wife seduced her at thirteen then she may have gotten pregnant by him in Hawaii and since he was married to a wife nineteen years his junior and started his family having kids when he was 44, he may have taken up with her the second time in Hawaii.

Barack Hussein Obama Senior could have known Frank Marshall via Stanley Ann and agreed to do the marriage as a cover, which is why it was so easy for him to leave her and the baby behind when he went to Harvard since he had no real 'linkage' to the baby.

The birth certificate would put a lot of this speculation to bed.

198 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:15:51pm

Because it's all about the Narrative.

We are dealing with an orthodox post-modernist administration, that fully believes that if you control the narrative, you control the universe.

That's what the BS presidential seal was during the campaign (as just one example).

They have to keep the "smartest man on Earth" and "From cotton field to White House" narratives going at all cost.

"What do you mean 'we'?" comes to mind everytime he speaks of African American history (the whole 'more rooted BS from last week) of oppression in the US.

They labelled Bush as stupid, yet he has higher grades than Kerry. ManBearPig dropped out.

I want to see his transcripts. It's one of the only basis of his "qualifications."

199 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:16:04pm

And the hits (and lashes) from the ROP just a keep coming...

Who wears the pants?

200 vxbush  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:16:04pm

re: #195 Russkilitlover

I didn't know that, but then I don't read puff-pieces and I certainly have steered clear of all the Obamamania fawning biopics and magazine covers.

I thought that was near to impossible, given the insane amount of magazine covers he has done in the last year. Many with the requisite halo.

201 JustABill  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:16:35pm

re: #159 avanti

I don't even know what difference a religion on the certificate would mean. Mine said Greek Orthodox, and I've never sat foot in that church and only in other churches for a occasional wedding.

At the time this first came up back durring the campain, Obama was doing everything he could to dis-associate himself from Islam. If religion was listed, this might have given Obama a reason not to release it then.

At the time, I speculated that this might have been why Obama did not release the long form. Since this information is not on a long form in any event, I was wrong.

202 eschew_obfuscation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:17:24pm

re: #193 MandyManners

BURN YOUR DRIVERS'S LICENSE!

Heh... I like it when some official or bank person asks for more than one form of government ID. I show them my CCW permits and watch their faces for reactions. (I know juvenile... I'm easily entertained)

203 eon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:17:37pm

re: #192 Dianna

"You have a new king!"

"Oh." Peasant looks thoughtfully about. "So how many of my chickens is he going to steal?"

"None. They're the King's chickens, you know."

Sort of like the old joke about the two cows in a monarchy;

You have two cows, the King's tax assessor takes both, gives you a receipt, and also an invitation to the celebratory ox-roast the king is throwing to celebrate the war he's just declared on the kingdom down the road. With your cows as the main course.

P.S.- Bring a pruning bill; you've also just been drafted into the infantry to fight said war.

cheers

eon

204 Targetpractice  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:17:52pm

Sadly, the nirthers will simply drop to the fallback position, namely "Yeah, so what if it doesn't contain anything we don't already know?! He won't release it, so obviously he's got something to hide!!!" When they do that, simply quote the words of Yuri Orlov:

"Thank God we live in a world where suspicion alone does not constitute a crime."

205 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:18:15pm

re: #194 vxbush

Actually, the picture on mine isn't completely terrible. I'd hate to have to get a new one.

I like mine...geasey, disheveled, ornery looking...my upper lip has a slight curl...and I have some wayward chocolate on my cheek

206 Charpete67  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:18:17pm

re: #46 Cannadian Club Akbar

If I go to a party, meet a hot nirther chick, agree with her to get her in the sack and afterwards pull up LGF and show this story, will I burn in hell?

...gullible nirther chicks...that's hot...

207 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:18:25pm

re: #173 JustABill

I am curious as to how he did in college,

Why? Were you curious about how Bush did in college? Did you think the fact he was a C student showed anything at all?

How about Palin? Did you think it was fair when the left mocked her for attending 5 undistinguished colleges (or was it 6?) and taking 5 years to graduate?

This is a nonissue.

208 avanti  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:18:28pm

re: #198 Ben Hur

Because it's all about the Narrative.

We are dealing with an orthodox post-modernist administration, that fully believes that if you control the narrative, you control the universe.

That's what the BS presidential seal was during the campaign (as just one example).

They have to keep the "smartest man on Earth" and "From cotton field to White House" narratives going at all cost.

"What do you mean 'we'?" comes to mind everytime he speaks of African American history (the whole 'more rooted BS from last week) of oppression in the US.

They labelled Bush as stupid, yet he has higher grades than Kerry. ManBearPig dropped out.

I want to see his transcripts. It's one of the only basis of his "qualifications."

Isn't his graduation with honors from Harvard a sufficient qualification to be POTUS ?

209 jdk971  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:19:23pm

thank you for showing the white birth cert. i have not been following
this stuff. this is the first time i have seen the first photo. thanks
again jim. remember there is always going to be doubters and trouble
makers on either side.

210 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:19:24pm

re: #207 iceweasel

Why? Were you curious about how Bush did in college? Did you think the fact he was a C student showed anything at all?

How about Palin? Did you think it was fair when the left mocked her for attending 5 undistinguished colleges (or was it 6?) and taking 5 years to graduate?

This is a nonissue.

Bush was a C student?

Where?

211 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:19:40pm

re: #208 avanti

Isn't his graduation with honors from Harvard a sufficient qualification to be POTUS ?

No sarc tag?

212 Gang of One  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:20:02pm

re: #208 avanti

Isn't his graduation with honors from Harvard a sufficient qualification to be POTUS ?

No.

213 Lee Coller  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:20:06pm

re: #208 avanti

Isn't his graduation with honors from Harvard a sufficient qualification to be POTUS ?

I'll argue that should be a disqualification.

Only Half //

214 Gang of One  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:20:32pm

re: #210 Ben Hur

Bush was a C student?

Where?

Yale, I think. Then MBA at Harvard, IIRC.

215 American Sabra  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:20:53pm

re: #197 Thanos

Anyone who refers to him as "Hussein" or "Barry" already have an agenda that's pretty much unshakable as far as I can see. Despite the fact I do realize who you're talking about, but that's my "tell" right there.

216 vxbush  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:20:56pm

re: #208 avanti

Isn't his graduation with honors from Harvard a sufficient qualification to be POTUS ?

There is no such qualification test for the office of president of the United States. No religion test, no race test, no nothing, other than age and native birth.

217 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:20:58pm

re: #207 iceweasel

Bush may have been a C student, but his opponent in 2000 flunked out.
Twice, if you include one dropping- out- to- avoid- flunking- out.
And who does the MSM consider the smarter one?

218 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:21:58pm

re: #207 iceweasel

Why? Were you curious about how Bush did in college? Did you think the fact he was a C student showed anything at all?

How about Palin? Did you think it was fair when the left mocked her for attending 5 undistinguished colleges (or was it 6?) and taking 5 years to graduate?

This is a nonissue.

it's a natural curiosity...we are not racists or conspiricy mongers, just curious citizens...he should stick to his avowed transparency

219 Lee Coller  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:22:06pm

re: #216 vxbush

There is no such qualification test for the office of president of the United States. No religion test, no race test, no nothing, other than age and native birth.

There's also a 14 year residency requirement.

220 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:22:09pm

re: #202 eschew_obfuscation

Heh... I like it when some official or bank person asks for more than one form of government ID. I show them my CCW permits and watch their faces for reactions. (I know juvenile... I'm easily entertained)

Oh, that's sweet.

221 Gang of One  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:22:17pm

re: #208 avanti

Isn't his graduation with honors from Harvard a sufficient qualification to be POTUS ?

re: #213 Lee Coller

I'll argue that should be a disqualification.

Only Half //

William F. Buckley once quipped that he'd rather be governed by the first five hundred names in the Boston phone book than by the faculty at Harvard.
Can't argue with that.

222 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:22:19pm

re: #198 Ben Hur

In that case, I'd like to see Sarah Palin's kommunity kollege transcripts, too. At least I would if she intends to run again.

After attending five different colleges in a six year span of time, with less than two semesters at most, she received a B.S. in communications with an emphasis in journalism from the University of Idaho in May 1987.

But - as funny as her BS records might be - they're her business, just like Obama's grades at Harvard.

Dan Quayle's GPA and transcripts are his own private matter, too, even though he was vice president (still hard to believe after all these years).

What they say and do on the campaign trail and in office is what's important.

Chill.

223 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:22:27pm
224 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:22:29pm
225 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:22:32pm

re: #208 avanti

Isn't his graduation with honors from Harvard a sufficient qualification to be POTUS ?

yes, why do you ask?

226 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:22:41pm

re: #198 Ben Hur

I truly don't understand how wanting to see the transcripts of a potential presidential candidate is viewed negatively.

A couple of days ago, and some usual remarks defended how many people obtain positions without doing this.

It is just one piece of the pie that folks can use to determine why their vote should be cast. We are talking about the POTUS.

Am I losing my mind?

227 vxbush  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:22:56pm

re: #219 Lee Coller

There's also a 14 year residency requirement.

Ah; thank you. Forgot that one. But there's nothing regarding a person's abilities or opinions, if you will.

228 Randall Gross  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:22:59pm

re: #215 American Sabra

Anyone who refers to him as "Hussein" or "Barry" already have an agenda that's pretty much unshakable as far as I can see. Despite the fact I do realize who you're talking about, but that's my "tell" right there.

That's just the tip of the iceberg of the screaming insanity of that blog post, I won't link it but you can find it by googling "atlas shrugs: frank marshall"

229 American Sabra  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:23:01pm

re: #207 iceweasel

Why? Were you curious about how Bush did in college? Did you think the fact he was a C student showed anything at all?

How about Palin? Did you think it was fair when the left mocked her for attending 5 undistinguished colleges (or was it 6?) and taking 5 years to graduate?

This is a nonissue.

Ooo you go girl.

230 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:23:12pm

re: #197 Thanos

Has it? Please tell me there's been a sudden outbreak of sanity!

231 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:23:23pm

Having his college transcripts would do what? Stop his agenda? Hardly. It is curious, but it's not going to help us stop bloated spending and expansion of government.

232 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:23:23pm

re: #208 avanti

Isn't his graduation with honors from Harvard a sufficient qualification to be POTUS ?

No.

233 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:23:27pm

re: #208 avanti

Isn't his graduation with honors from Harvard a sufficient qualification to be POTUS ?

Listen, I'm not saying that his grades are what qualify him, because if that was the case, I have a family member that was there when he was and most probably had higher grades from all the fellowships and prizes HE won, and I wouldn't want him as Pres.

That's not the point.

When you make your whole political existence about being the smartest man on the planet, do what the other pres have done, show us.

It's amazing.

All the Harvard/Yale, etc grads in teh Bush (including Bush) administration must have been the stupid Harvard people.


I'm calling out his narrative as BS.

I'm not speaking about diplomas as qualifications.

The Palin analogy would work if she and her peeps marketted her as a genius.

234 Charpete67  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:23:35pm

re: #227 vxbush

Ah; thank you. Forgot that one. But there's nothing regarding a person's abilities or opinions, if you will.

obviously.../

235 reloadingisnotahobby  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:23:37pm

re: #211 unrealizedviewpoint

Better to be a graduate from the school of
Hard knocks...
Hard work..
Savvy investing..
With calloused hands and a reputation
that your hand shake is a binding contract!
I know...I'm dreaming again!

236 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:23:46pm

re: #202 eschew_obfuscation

Heh... I like it when some official or bank person asks for more than one form of government ID. I show them my CCW permits and watch their faces for reactions. (I know juvenile... I'm easily entertained)

Fair enough. I enjoy showing my passport in bars when I get proofed and watching the blank faces.

237 Gang of One  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:23:49pm

re: #215 American Sabra

Anyone who refers to him as "Hussein" or "Barry" already have an agenda that's pretty much unshakable as far as I can see. Despite the fact I do realize who you're talking about, but that's my "tell" right there.

Same as those who referred to GWB as Dubya or Shrub? Hussein is his middle name, right there on his BC.

238 Lincolntf  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:23:53pm

re: #208 avanti

Is Henry "Your Mama" Gates' tenure at Harvard any testament to his intelligence? Perhaps.

The Harvard brand is just a wee bit diluted these days.

239 DaddyG  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:23:58pm

You can pile up all the evidence you want but some skulls are too thick to penetrate.

240 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:24:07pm

re: #199 calcajun

And the hits (and lashes) from the ROP just a keep coming...

Who wears the pants?

They interviewed the woman involved in this on the BBC this morning; the court has bitten off a lot more than they can chew with her.

She's a reporter. She printed up over 500 invitations to her court appearance and mailed them to reporters around the world; this morning, the courtroom was packed, waiting to see how the court would conduct itself.

She also loudly proclaimed herself to be a Muslim - and went on to demand where the Prophet Mohammed said that women can't wear trousers; where such a thing is said in the Koran; and how it came to be part of the sharia law the court claims to be upholding. She is also demanding that her trial - and lashing, if found guilty - be conducted publicly, and be broadcast, and claims to have Koranic justification for this demand.

She also turned down an offer of amnesty based on her position as a UN employee. She publicly resigned from her UN position and demanded that the trial go forward.

The court decided to put off their session until next week, probably hoping the crowds disappear. It doesn't look like they're going to.

Three loud cheers for this woman. The only way to ultimately defeat sharia and the other excesses of jihadism is to defeat them from within, just as she is doing. No matter how this plays out, she's going to make sure their bullshit is smeared all over the public square for all to see.

241 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:24:33pm

Let's see... all other things being equal, who'd you rather have run the country... Harvard MBA/ex fighter pilot or Harvard JD/ ex Community Organizer?

242 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:24:38pm

Awright, awright already. But does the certificate say that he is human?
Hunnnh?

243 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:24:58pm

re: #225 albusteve

yes, why do you ask?

as opposed to no high school diploma...bad answer

244 American Sabra  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:25:39pm

re: #228 Thanos

That's just the tip of the iceberg of the screaming insanity of that blog post, I won't link it but you can find it by googling "atlas shrugs: frank marshall"

I do like to look at some of these sites just to see the outrageousness (is that a word?) of it all.

The good news is that she has a very small following. Last I looked, oh maybe a month or so ago, the number of comments at any given post averaged about 10.

245 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:25:57pm

re: #233 Ben Hur

[...] The Palin analogy would work if she and her peeps marketted her as a genius.

Cough...so you're saying they marketed her as the ditz next door?

Finally, someone comes out and says it.

246 Altermite  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:26:13pm

re: #238 Lincolntf

Is Henry "Your Mama" Gates' tenure at Harvard any testament to his intelligence? Perhaps.

The Harvard brand is just a wee bit diluted these days.

Since when did being a loudmouthed ass become a measure of intelligence?

247 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:26:19pm

re: #174 albusteve

not me...but I do have a morbid curiosity about his school records...race and religion mean nothing


According to wiki he graduated from Harvard law school magna cum laude. I'm guessing he had a 3.8 or 3.9 GPA for that.

248 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:26:23pm

re: #236 iceweasel

Fair enough. I enjoy showing my passport in bars when I get proofed and watching the blank faces.

why would their faces be blank?

249 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:26:25pm

re: #222 Cato the Elder


Dan Quayle's GPA and transcripts are his own private matter, too, even though he was vice president (still hard to believe after all these years).

I thought it was common knowledge that Quayle was a C student through college and grad school. (Probably because they did release the transcripts.)

His talent was "working a room."

See above re Palin.

Keep in mind that I plan to hold this administration to the same standards as the last.

250 eon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:26:30pm

re: #208 avanti

Isn't his graduation with honors from Harvard a sufficient qualification to be POTUS ?

No. He also has to be at least 35 years old.

//sort of

As for the Ivy League schools in general, I have less confidence in their ability to turn out qualified candidates for anything than I do about West Point, Annapolis, Quantico, and/or Colorado Springs. (Plus the Coast Guard Academy, of course.)

The difference being that at the Ivys, there seems to be a bit of context missing in the area of "ethos", i.e., what you will not do to "get ahead".

cheers

eon

251 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:26:50pm

re: #237 Gang of One

Same as those who referred to GWB as Dubya or Shrub?

American Sabra never ever ever ever ever done that.

252 Targetpractice  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:26:54pm

re: #226 formercorpsman

I truly don't understand how wanting to see the transcripts of a potential presidential candidate is viewed negatively.

A couple of days ago, and some usual remarks defended how many people obtain positions without doing this.

It is just one piece of the pie that folks can use to determine why their vote should be cast. We are talking about the POTUS.

Am I losing my mind?

I can't speak for all Lizards, but I'm pretty sure I figured out the man was a lying SOB without his transcripts, and that while they would have certainly helped add to the pile of reasons why not to vote for the man, they were not the linchpin upon which his election depended.

253 DaddyG  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:27:01pm

re: #240 SixDegrees

Cockroaches hate it when you turn on the light.

254 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:27:17pm

re: #221 Gang of One

William F. Buckley once quipped that he'd rather be governed by the first five hundred names in the Boston phone book than by the faculty at Harvard.
Can't argue with that.

Oh yeah? Why? You know the faculty at Harvard?

It's a fun soundbite, and let's not forget that Buckley was a Yale man. You know: God and Man at Yale.

255 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:27:17pm

re: #219 Lee Coller

There's also a 14 year residency requirement.

That's the Senate. And a Senator need not be native born.

256 WindHorse  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:27:25pm

...just because he has a birth certificate doesn't make him qualified to be President...

257 Randall Gross  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:27:48pm

re: #247 Killgore Trout

According to wiki he graduated from Harvard law school magna cum laude. I'm guessing he had a 3.8 or 3.9 GPA for that.

Zombie already did the best digging on his college days, putting him in proximity to some strange associations and possibly demonstrations iirc. The transcripts aren't going to do anything.

258 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:27:50pm
259 midwestgak  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:27:58pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

I do and reread it a few days ago. I have one copy for potential job interviews and one in my purse to prove citizenship should I be stopped and questioned, for whatever reason.

It's post 9/11.

When I changed jobs in 2003, I had to produce it to the folks in HR who had to verify via birth certificate that I was a legal citizen. The seriousness of that experience caused me to make sure I always have such proof.

260 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:28:03pm

re: #247 Killgore Trout

According to wiki he graduated from Harvard law school magna cum laude. I'm guessing he had a 3.8 or 3.9 GPA for that.

so did I...3.8 anyway (from nursing school)...big woop...I'd like to know what classes he took and who his professors were...like red meat man

261 vxbush  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:28:06pm

Okay, gotta get back to life. Later, lizards.

262 American Sabra  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:28:11pm

re: #237 Gang of One

Same as those who referred to GWB as Dubya or Shrub? Hussein is his middle name, right there on his BC.

I don't think Dubya was such a slander. The Right called him that all the time. Shrub? I honestly never heard of that one.

Hussein is secret code for (I have to whisper this) he's really a Muslim. That's what that's all about. An agenda.

263 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:28:36pm

re: #245 Cato the Elder

Cough...so you're saying they marketed her as the ditz next door?

Finally, someone comes out and says it.

Did I say that?

264 avanti  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:28:47pm

re: #226 formercorpsman

I truly don't understand how wanting to see the transcripts of a potential presidential candidate is viewed negatively.

A couple of days ago, and some usual remarks defended how many people obtain positions without doing this.

It is just one piece of the pie that folks can use to determine why their vote should be cast. We are talking about the POTUS.

Am I losing my mind?

I just feel that how well you did in school, or what school you attended is a minor factor in the choice of a candidate some 20-40 years later. You can't assume that a Harvard honors graduate is automatically better or worse then a poor student at a community college.

265 JustABill  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:29:14pm

re: #207 iceweasel

Why? Were you curious about how Bush did in college? Did you think the fact he was a C student showed anything at all?

How about Palin? Did you think it was fair when the left mocked her for attending 5 undistinguished colleges (or was it 6?) and taking 5 years to graduate?

This is a nonissue.

He is billed as a Genus by the some in the MSM. Although, I was young at the time, I believe Carter was also thought to be rather smart by many in the media, contrast this with Reagan, commonly portrayed as either an idiot, senile or just crazy, and Bush II. My hunch is the standard rule for the MSM is (D) = brilliant, (R) = Moron. I'd like to confirm that in this case.

As I said earlier, I don't have a right to see said info, and it wouldn't have changed my vote in any event, but it would be interesting to see.

266 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:29:16pm

re: #245 Cato the Elder

Cough...so you're saying they marketed her as the ditz next door?

Finally, someone comes out and says it.

I love you.

In a Platonic and eternal way, that is.

267 Lincolntf  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:29:18pm

re: #264 avanti

Still, why do you think Obama doesn't want them released?

268 Lee Coller  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:29:43pm

re: #255 Dianna

That's the Senate. And a Senator need not be native born.

Section 1, Article II of US Constitution:

No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.

269 American Sabra  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:29:57pm

re: #259 midwestgak

I do and reread it a few days ago. I have one copy for potential job interviews and one in my purse to prove citizenship should I be stopped and questioned, for whatever reason.

It's post 9/11.

When I changed jobs in 2003, I had to produce it to the folks in HR who had to verify via birth certificate that I was a legal citizen. The seriousness of that experience caused me to make sure I always have such proof.

I lost mine. When I got my passport renewed, they sent me a certified copy that had no resemblance whatsoever to the original.

270 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:30:00pm
271 DaddyG  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:30:08pm

re: #241 tradewind

Let's see... all other things being equal, who'd you rather have run the country... Harvard MBA/ex fighter pilot or Harvard JD/ ex Community Organizer?


A country lwayer who taught himself to read and write with a Bible and a shovel and coal for a blackboard.

A country gentleman and inventor who distilled his own whiskey.

An avid outdoorsman who used the rose garden for target practice.

A movie actor who co-starred with Chimps.

...

272 Digital Display  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:30:24pm

re: #233 Ben Hur

Listen, I'm not saying that his grades are what qualify him, because if that was the case, I have a family member that was there when he was and most probably had higher grades from all the fellowships and prizes HE won, and I wouldn't want him as Pres.

That's not the point.

When you make your whole political existence about being the smartest man on the planet, do what the other pres have done, show us.

It's amazing.

All the Harvard/Yale, etc grads in teh Bush (including Bush) administration must have been the stupid Harvard people.

I'm calling out his narrative as BS.

I'm not speaking about diplomas as qualifications.

The Palin analogy would work if she and her peeps marketted her as a genius.


I don't recall Obama ever campaigning that he was the smartest man in the world...It's all over Ben Hur.. Obama is the Potus till 2012... No amount of nirther shit nor College transcripts will ever change this fact..
Let's develop better ideas and policies than the Dems...It's really that simple...This is an exercise in futility...

273 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:30:31pm

re: #247 Killgore Trout

According to wiki he graduated from Harvard law school magna cum laude. I'm guessing he had a 3.8 or 3.9 GPA for that.

3.8/3.9 GPA is summa cum laude. Magna cum laude is >3.5.

274 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:30:37pm

re: #249 Ben Hur
Quayle's smart enough, as Obama would say...

Quayle is now chairman of the international division of Cerberus Capital Management, a multi-billion dollar private equity fund, and president of Quayle and Associates.
275 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:30:39pm
276 avanti  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:30:43pm

re: #245 Cato the Elder

Cough...so you're saying they marketed her as the ditz next door?

Finally, someone comes out and says it.

Not a ditz, but a "just like me" appeal to many that resent intellectuals.

277 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:31:32pm

re: #273 Alouette

3.8/3.9 GPA is summa cum laude. Magna cum laude is >3.5.

I graduated cum laude (3.4 GPA) but all my courses were in math.

278 Lincolntf  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:31:43pm

It is better to hide your transcript and be thought a fool than it is to release your transcript and remove all doubt...

279 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:31:45pm
280 drcordell  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:31:47pm

re: #241 tradewind

Let's see... all other things being equal, who'd you rather have run the country... Harvard MBA/ex fighter pilot or Harvard JD/ ex Community Organizer?

Let's re-phrase that a little bit. Harvard MBA admitted despite straight C's because he was a Bush / ex fighter pilot who managed to avoid flying in any combat situations because he was a Bush.

281 Gang of One  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:32:01pm

Me, I was a C- student at a state college. Lazy, had my eye on other things. Grad school a generation later and I am Magna Cum Laud with a 3.9 average from a grad school here in NYC. Grades only indicate willingness to do the work and do it without being sloppy, as well as commitment to doing something to the best of your ability. And I am not qualified to be POTUS for a number of reasons.
/rant.

282 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:32:04pm
283 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:32:22pm

re: #275 buzzsawmonkey

I don't know about anyone else, but I'm seeing a disconnect here.

Avanti has his medula oblongata's crossed...

284 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:32:39pm

re: #270 taxfreekiller

Judging by history , the Dems are poised for a massive wipeout in '10.
Not sure how that will help with TOTUS at the helm, but maybe we'll stop the bleeding...

285 Silvergirl  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:32:44pm

re: #97 JakeSpiderMonkey

You're just putting us on, right? You're just trying to prove Sharmuta's #27 (Anyone who says, "I'm not a nirther, but..." is a nirther.), and you did it very well.

I don't care if you think I'm a conspiracy nut or nut, but

True, Sharmuta. Nirthers do have big buts.

286 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:32:59pm

re: #283 LGoPs

Avanti has his medula oblongata's crossed...

medulla...PIMF

287 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:33:07pm

re: #278 Lincolntf

It is better to hide your transcript and be thought a fool than it is to release your transcript and remove all doubt...

hahaha...some good blabola there...I thought that was funny

288 turn  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:33:24pm

re: #281 Gang of One

You think you have trouble sleeping now, imagine if you had that job.

289 Altermite  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:33:32pm

re: #250 eon

No. He also has to be at least 35 years old.

//sort of

As for the Ivy League schools in general, I have less confidence in their ability to turn out qualified candidates for anything than I do about West Point, Annapolis, Quantico, and/or Colorado Springs. (Plus the Coast Guard Academy, of course.)

The difference being that at the Ivys, there seems to be a bit of context missing in the area of "ethos", i.e., what you will not do to "get ahead".

cheers

eon

I have met and worked with Ivy league grads, and they tended to be smart and hard working, far more often than not. Of coruse some are willing to be schmoozers to get ahead, but I have met none who were lazy, and I met far more at my state school than I have among any Ivy co-workers.

Can you tell me what you're basing your characterization on?

290 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:33:37pm

re: #252 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Quite frankly, that is really not my point. I understand some folks have that right off the bat, ok.

It is not about Palin, Bush, Gore, etc.

It is about taking a look at the potential candidate, seeing what qualifies them for essentially the highest position in the land, and making your judgment from that.

He is an employee of the American people.

When I joined the military, they wanted every document pertinent to abilities meet the requirements of the job, and to assess where I fit in.

When an officer is commissioned, that officer's transcripts are scoured.

Somehow this is an inappropriate request for presidential candidates?

Not just Obama, but all?

291 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:33:45pm

the trap has been set

292 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:33:53pm

re: #262 American Sabra

I don't think Dubya was such a slander. The Right called him that all the time. Shrub? I honestly never heard of that one.

Hussein is secret code for (I have to whisper this) he's really a Muslim. That's what that's all about. An agenda.

It;s not sekrit.

His father was a Muslim, by Muslim law, The One WAS. He was for the first, what, 7 years of his life?

I say "WAS" because obviosly he has chosen not to be one (though he does use his middle name when needed to shmooze), AND HE ATE THE SAUSAGE WITH THE WAFFLE.

That ended that BS for me.

293 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:33:54pm

The birth certificate is a fraud, I tell you! He was a found child- in a smoldering crater. He then helped Stanley Ann and Barack Sr. with some auto repairs by hoisting up the car with his bare hands. They were so impressed, they kept him and raised him as his own. He also has a secret fortress in the north pole.

294 iWatas  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:34:04pm

I have friends who adopted three kids as teenagers from Kazakhstan. They all have "Certificates of Live Birth" from the State of Maryland. The document does not say they are not natural born citizens.

Just sayin'

295 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:34:11pm

re: #280 drcordell

Let's re-phrase that a little bit. Harvard MBA admitted despite straight C's because he was a Bush / ex fighter pilot who managed to avoid flying in any combat situations because he was a Bush.

Did he get special treatment? Cool. I guess Harvard just gives shit away. Good to know.

296 avanti  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:34:26pm

re: #267 Lincolntf

Still, why do you think Obama doesn't want them released?

Because they are another distraction for the opposition to spin their wheels wasting time on and ignoring real issues.

297 BlueCanuck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:34:34pm

re: #285 Silvergirl

True, Sharmuta. Nirthers do have big buts.

From eating all those Cheetos in their mothers basements. :)

298 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:34:49pm

re: #266 iceweasel

I love you.

In a Platonic and eternal way, that is.

Can you please show me where you got the fact that Bush was a C student?

299 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:34:55pm
300 turn  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:35:24pm

Man these nirthers just don't give up ...

301 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:35:41pm

re: #290 formercorpsman


Yes, I butchered the sentence. /

I'm disqualified.

302 Gang of One  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:35:53pm

re: #254 iceweasel

Oh yeah? Why? You know the faculty at Harvard?

It's a fun soundbite, and let's not forget that Buckley was a Yale man. You know: God and Man at Yale.

As a matter of fact, I do know an economics professor there. Met him when he was researching his Stanford PhD in Mexico City in 1997. He got his doctorate and taught in Mexico City for several years and then went to Cambridge. We hung together watching the Yankees, drinking beers and I even gave him bass guitar lessons.
Read GAMAY twenty-odd years ago. The point Buckley was making is that the faculty at Harvard are Ivory Tower types and would best serve where they are.

303 Lincolntf  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:36:07pm

re: #296 avanti

Is everything about him a special secret to be used for political gain?
Is he like a superhero or something?
Captain NothingThere, up, up and away...!!!

304 BlueCanuck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:36:10pm

re: #294 iWatas

Know what? Go piss up a rope.

305 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:36:16pm

re: #300 turn

Man these nirthers just don't give up ...

I plan on drafting them into my robot army of doom.

306 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:36:32pm
307 Charpete67  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:36:34pm

why the hell does anyone spend so much time on Obama conspiracy stuff...don't they know there's more than enough stuff in his policies to bring him down?...the guy's a f'n socialist.

308 Silvergirl  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:36:42pm

re: #235 reloadingisnotahobby

Better to be a graduate from the school of
Hard knocks...

Hard work..
Savvy investing..
With calloused hands and a reputation
that your hand shake is a binding contract!
I know...I'm dreaming again!

It's a hard knock life . . .

Little Orphan Annie for POTUS?

309 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:37:03pm

re: #277 Alouette

I think most grad schools require you to have at least a 3.5 anyways. I squeaked by with a 3.7 or so. Not bad considering a "graduated" highschool with something like a 1.7.
/I took a lot of days off.

310 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:37:03pm

re: #296 avanti

Because they are another distraction for the opposition to spin their wheels wasting time on and ignoring real issues.

then it seems strategically bright to release the Shiny Object so we all drool away while his bogus legislation gets passed

311 DaddyG  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:37:09pm

re: #276 avanti

Not a ditz, but a "just like me" appeal to many that resent intellectuals.

You don't have to resent intellectuals to find "Mr. Smith goes to Washington" appealing. In fact I would argue if we were using education as an indicator of someones leadership potential John McCains last place finish at a military academy trumps most Ivy League honors grads.

312 aggieann  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:37:10pm

re: #299 buzzsawmonkey

"He said he thought a lot'a
My medulla oblongata
But he never said he loved me..."

--Cole Porter, "The Doctor," from "Nymph Errant"

From the Opie and His Merry Men episode of The Andy Griffith Show:

Opie: There's nothin' wrong with his leg.
Andy: No there isn't, son.
Opie: He never did have a fracture of the petulla obondala like he said.
Andy: No, I guess not.
Barney: Petulla obondala... he give himself away as a phony right from the start. Petulla obondala ain't in the leg--it's in the brain.

313 Targetpractice  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:37:15pm

re: #290 formercorpsman

Quite frankly, that is really not my point. I understand some folks have that right off the bat, ok.

It is not about Palin, Bush, Gore, etc.

It is about taking a look at the potential candidate, seeing what qualifies them for essentially the highest position in the land, and making your judgment from that.

He is an employee of the American people.

When I joined the military, they wanted every document pertinent to abilities meet the requirements of the job, and to assess where I fit in.

When an officer is commissioned, that officer's transcripts are scoured.

Somehow this is an inappropriate request for presidential candidates?

Not just Obama, but all?

Never said inappropriate, just unimportant. Seriously, if you wish to place importance on how well the man did in Home Ec, be my guest. Me, personally, I cared more about his Senate voting record, his Illinois Senate voting record, his past statements on the issues, and other items that actually had to do with his political stances, rather than how good of an apple polisher he was. As I said, I didn't need to see his college transcripts to know he was a liar, a cheat, and a crook...because I already knew he was a politician.

314 reloadingisnotahobby  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:37:31pm

re: #308 Silvergirl

Nah! Can't stand the hair doo...

315 turn  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:37:33pm

re: #305 SixDegrees

I plan on drafting them into my robot army of doom.

They're robots all right.

316 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:37:40pm

re: #272 HoosierHoops

I don't recall Obama ever campaigning that he was the smartest man in the world...It's all over Ben Hur.. Obama is the Potus till 2012... No amount of nirther shit nor College transcripts will ever change this fact..
Let's develop better ideas and policies than the Dems...It's really that simple...This is an exercise in futility...

That was 100% part of the marketting narrative.

317 avanti  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:38:16pm

re: #275 buzzsawmonkey

I don't know about anyone else, but I'm seeing a disconnect here.

The first was a question about his grades, and my comment was that they would not be a disqualifier. The second was it makes no difference anyway, good or bad.
I don't see the disconnect.

318 BlueCanuck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:38:25pm

re: #305 SixDegrees

I plan on drafting them into my robot army of doom.

Don't bother, they get fixated too easily on the small distracting stuff. They also need rebooting too often to make it worth the effort. Of course if you installed electrodes in the appropriate locations...

319 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:38:35pm

re: #280 drcordell

Who consistently received fighter pilot scores of ' excellent ' from his superior officers, and was released because the jet he trained on was decommissioned.
Get the facts before you spew.
As for the ' straight C's , I don't know... did you see his transcript? Gore's grades were much lower.
Not only did Bush academically outperform the "intellectually superior" Gore, Bush scored a higher verbal SAT score than Rhodes scholar and former Democratic presidential candidate Bill Bradley, with Bush scoring 566 to Bradley's 485.

320 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:38:54pm

re: #315 turn

They're robots all right.

That makes things so much simpler.

321 MikeAlv77  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:39:02pm

re: #305 SixDegrees

I plan on drafting them into my robot army of doom.

You have one of those too? I got mine at Walmart on sale... where did you get yours?

322 drcordell  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:39:06pm

re: #295 Cannadian Club Akbar

Did he get special treatment? Cool. I guess Harvard just gives shit away. Good to know.

Enough money can get you admitted into any Ivy League University. That's not giving shit away, it's accepting a bribe. Are you truly naive enough to think that every student in the Ivy Leagues got there because of intelligence?

323 eon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:39:15pm

re: #289 Altermite

I have met and worked with Ivy league grads, and they tended to be smart and hard working, far more often than not. Of coruse some are willing to be schmoozers to get ahead, but I have met none who were lazy, and I met far more at my state school than I have among any Ivy co-workers.

Can you tell me what you're basing your characterization on?

I base it largely on the subset which go from the law schools into the political arena. Most of us only know the "Ivy League" schools from that subset, and considering the repetitive behavior patterns seen in said subset, there's something deeply wrong with their worldview- which is at least partly due to their training at the college level.

If I engaged in an overgeneralization, I most humbly apologize.

cheers

eon

324 Gang of One  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:39:17pm

re: #262 American Sabra

I don't think Dubya was such a slander. The Right called him that all the time. Shrub? I honestly never heard of that one.

Hussein is secret code for (I have to whisper this) he's really a Muslim. That's what that's all about. An agenda.

No, Dubya was not such a slander, and neither is Barry. As far as Hussein being a 'code', well, it is a rather Arabic/Islamic name. Why does he and the MSM not use his name in full? There is no shame in a name, correct?

325 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:39:20pm

re: #280 drcordell

Let's re-phrase that a little bit. Harvard MBA admitted despite straight C's because he was a Bush / ex fighter pilot who managed to avoid flying in any combat situations because he was a Bush.

Can you please direct me to a source of the "Bush was a C student" line?

326 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:39:44pm
327 Empire1  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:39:46pm

Since this thread is over 100 comments, and I don't see an open thread above, I'd like to ask for lizardly opinions.

I currently have a blog I haven't updated since my stroke about a year ago, and I want to focus on SF/fantasy book reviews (and a few other kinds on occasion) instead of politics and personal stuff. Nobody cares about the personal junk, and I get better politics discussion here and at other sites.

The question is whether it would be better to ditch the current blog and start over, or post a note and just start doing the reviews. I've asked at my blog, but I don't really expect to get any replies, considering the time lapse.

328 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:39:56pm

re: #318 BlueCanuck

Don't bother, they get fixated too easily on the small distracting stuff. They also need rebooting too often to make it worth the effort. Of course if you installed electrodes in the appropriate locations...

My plan is to project huge images of 0bama's birth certificate onto my targets.

329 sattv4u2  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:39:59pm

re: #293 Sharmuta

The birth certificate is a fraud, I tell you! He was a found child- in a smoldering crater.

I thought he as found in the bullrusheds after floating down the Nile River in a straw basket!

330 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:40:07pm

iceweasle...why do people who see your passport have their faces go blank?...what's up with that?

331 aggieann  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:40:30pm

re: #322 drcordell

Enough money can get you admitted into any Ivy League University. That's not giving shit away, it's accepting a bribe. Are you truly naive enough to think that every student in the Ivy Leagues got there because of intelligence?

. . . or that the education is superior? My Harvard graduate friends joke that the hardest thing about Harvard was getting admitted.

332 turn  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:40:30pm

re: #320 SixDegrees

That makes things so much simpler.

Good luck with the reprogramming. Later all, time to go walk the lab along the American.

333 eschew_obfuscation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:40:34pm

re: #295 Cannadian Club Akbar

Did he get special treatment? Cool. I guess Harvard just gives shit away. Good to know.

Especially to dumb, military, white guys... fits Harvard's diversity standards perfectly ///

334 sngnsgt  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:40:43pm

OT

Getting state ID in the US is easy. I have Epilepsy, if I have a seizure, I am not allowed to drive for 6 months of being seizure free and my Dr takes my DL. I lived in NV, and had a valid DL and a state ID. I moved to PA, and got a state ID when I moved there, and a driver's license when I went 6 months seizure free. Not once did they ask me if I had ID or a driver's license from another state. I recently moved back to NV, and right away got a state ID. They never asked if I had an ID or driver's license from another state. When I left NV to go back to PA, my Neurologist in NV had my DL in his office in my records folder. I never got that back, for all I know, it's still sitting there. I had a NV state ID issued so I had ID to fly to PA. I just did the same thing when I arrived here in Las Vegas, NV. I went to DMV, and was issued a state ID, and when I go seizure free for 6 months here and hopefully get my DL back, my bet is, they don't ask me if I have any other state ID or DL issued in another state. As long as I have a birth certificate and or my SS card, I can get an ID. I don't know if anything previously issued is valid, but all I'm saying is, it seems to me that getting an ID in the US is pretty easy.

335 John Neverbend  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:40:53pm

re: #5 Cannadian Club Akbar

That should do the trick, not. The nirthers will say Charles is an expert with photoshop. (If you are, Charles, can you photoshop me with Dr. Monica Crowley?)

...and me. Did you know that Alan "Skeletor" Colmes is her brother-in-law?

336 Altermite  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:40:53pm

re: #323 eon

I base it largely on the subset which go from the law schools into the political arena. Most of us only know the "Ivy League" schools from that subset, and considering the repetitive behavior patterns seen in said subset, there's something deeply wrong with their worldview- which is at least partly due to their training at the college level.

If I engaged in an overgeneralization, I most humbly apologize.

cheers

eon


Fair enough. Top tier law schools have a serious gunner problem, and the first tier is stuffed with Ivys.

337 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:40:55pm

re: #321 MikeAlv77

You have one of those too? I got mine at Walmart on sale... where did you get yours?

Target. But I paid full retail.

I should have waited until after the holidays, when they put them on sale.

338 avanti  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:41:00pm

re: #325 Ben Hur

Can you please direct me to a source of the "Bush was a C student" line?

I don't know if this was his source, but there are several.

link

339 MikeAlv77  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:41:14pm

re: #329 sattv4u2


The birth certificate is a fraud, I tell you! He was a found child- in a smoldering crater.

I thought he as found in the bullrusheds after floating down the Nile River in a straw basket!

No, no... he was born in a manger of a virgin... only the second time it ever happened...

340 DaddyG  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:41:20pm

re: #325 Ben Hur

Can you please direct me to a source of the "Bush was a C student" line?


Release the original long form transcripts! /

341 CynicalConservative  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:41:27pm

re: #327 Empire1

Since this thread is over 100 comments, and I don't see an open thread above, I'd like to ask for lizardly opinions.

I currently have a blog I haven't updated since my stroke about a year ago, and I want to focus on SF/fantasy book reviews (and a few other kinds on occasion) instead of politics and personal stuff. Nobody cares about the personal junk, and I get better politics discussion here and at other sites.

The question is whether it would be better to ditch the current blog and start over, or post a note and just start doing the reviews. I've asked at my blog, but I don't really expect to get any replies, considering the time lapse.

Given the time-lapse, I'd just go with what ya got. Link it to your Nic here and I'll visit. I like the topic.

342 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:41:29pm

oh wait.

It's totally plausible.

He was drinking in college. Wasn't he the pres of a frat or something?

Only stupid anti-social hated losers do that.

Or coke.

343 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:41:30pm
344 BlueCanuck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:41:46pm

re: #328 SixDegrees

That would work for the next 3.5 years. Of course you would have to be tied into the crazy memes to figure out the next wave.

/and that way lies madness.

345 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:41:50pm

re: #327 Empire1

Since this thread is over 100 comments, and I don't see an open thread above, I'd like to ask for lizardly opinions.

I currently have a blog I haven't updated since my stroke about a year ago, and I want to focus on SF/fantasy book reviews (and a few other kinds on occasion) instead of politics and personal stuff. Nobody cares about the personal junk, and I get better politics discussion here and at other sites.

The question is whether it would be better to ditch the current blog and start over, or post a note and just start doing the reviews. I've asked at my blog, but I don't really expect to get any replies, considering the time lapse.

I'd do the latter.

346 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:41:51pm

re: #231 Sharmuta

Having his college transcripts would do what? Stop his agenda? Hardly. It is curious, but it's not going to help us stop bloated spending and expansion of government.

Having his transcripts won't change a thing. The time to have demanded this was during the campaign, if it was important.

Also, it seems to me, if there was something damaging to be found in his transcripts, I suspect Hillary would have found it and used it.

Like the birth cert issue it's another distraction from the fact that there is this awful health"care" bill (which isn't rally about the availability or quality of health care at all) that needs to be thrown out the window.

347 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:42:05pm

re: #324 Gang of One

' Dubya' was an affectionate nickname.. 'Shrub' was the slur that Molly Ivins (RIP) coined in her slam of him in the book by the same name.
As for Barry, it was his self-chosen moniker until he was a sophomore in college, when I suppose some activist convinced him to drop the slave name and embrace his ethnicity, but it was cool with his family and he used it much of his life... so how is it a smear?

348 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:42:12pm

re: #322 drcordell

Enough money can get you admitted into any Ivy League University. That's not giving shit away, it's accepting a bribe. Are you truly naive enough to think that every student in the Ivy Leagues got there because of intelligence?

So, then should I question all people with an Ivy League degree?

349 DaddyG  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:42:30pm

re: #334 sngnsgt

...all I'm saying is, it seems to me that getting an ID in the US is pretty easy.

Foreign nationals do have to pass the swim test. /

350 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:42:31pm

re: #322 drcordell

Enough money can get you admitted into any Ivy League University. That's not giving shit away, it's accepting a bribe. Are you truly naive enough to think that every student in the Ivy Leagues got there because of intelligence?

No.

Some go because their brothers play on the basketball team.

351 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:42:33pm

re: #329 sattv4u2

Holy Moses! What a story...

352 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:42:44pm

re: #262 American Sabra

I don't think Dubya was such a slander. The Right called him that all the time. Shrub? I honestly never heard of that one.

Hussein is secret code for (I have to whisper this) he's really a Muslim. That's what that's all about. An agenda.

"Shrub" was the term of derision used for GWB by columnist Molly Ivins (who is no longer with us).

353 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:42:45pm

re: #327 Empire1

Post a note and start doing reviews, I think.

354 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:42:46pm

re: #325 Ben Hur

Can you please direct me to a source of the "Bush was a C student" line?

it's true...George is an average guy

355 kcladderman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:42:56pm

re: #295 Cannadian Club Akbar

Plus they let anybody fly a fighter.

356 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:43:27pm

re: #313 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

We agree. But it should matter.

He ran on his academic record as part of what qualified him to be the President of the united States.

Again, it is not the sole item which determines his fitness for such a post, but it certainly is relevant for someone supposedly in the middle who would like to get a complete picture in order to determine what they might, or might not like about him under the circumstances.

I think anyone running for public office should be held the same standard as our military when it comes to this.

Their academic records should be available to public who not only helped fund their ability to pay for the school, but might also be voting them to collect their next paycheck as a representative.

357 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:43:31pm

re: #354 albusteve

And Barry is from Lake Woebegone, where the children are all above average...
/sarc/

358 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:43:32pm

re: #290 formercorpsman

When I joined the military, they wanted every document pertinent to abilities meet the requirements of the job, and to assess where I fit in.

When an officer is commissioned, that officer's transcripts are scoured.

Somehow this is an inappropriate request for presidential candidates?

Not just Obama, but all?

I'm currently going through some extensive background probing in my job search. My references have been called numerous times, my transcripts requested, copies of my certifications requested, etc. And some of the most intense screenings are for TEMP positions!

359 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:43:53pm

re: #338 avanti

I don't know if this was his source, but there are several.

link

THANK YOU!

360 FrogMarch  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:44:12pm

My birth certificate looks a lot like the image on top.
No region is mentioned & no race.

361 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:44:15pm

re: #344 BlueCanuck

That would work for the next 3.5 years. Of course you would have to be tied into the crazy memes to figure out the next wave.

/and that way lies madness.

That will be more than enough time for my plans to come to fruition.

362 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:44:33pm
363 sngnsgt  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:44:55pm

re: #349 DaddyG

Foreign nationals do have to pass the swim test. /

I think as least the "float" test should be mandatory. /

364 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:45:01pm

re: #335 John Neverbend

...and me. Did you know that Alan "Skeletor" Colmes is her brother-in-law?

Just shut up!!! LALALALALALALALA!!!
/

365 DaddyG  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:45:02pm

re: #348 Cannadian Club Akbar

So, then should I question all people with an Ivy League degree?

Question those people who are adamant about you knowing they have an Ivy League degree.

366 FrogMarch  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:45:12pm

I wonder if Edith Pauline Coats knows her b-certy is all over the place?

367 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:45:18pm

re: #358 Russkilitlover

I'm currently going through some extensive background probing in my job search. My references have been called numerous times, my transcripts requested, copies of my certifications requested, etc. And some of the most intense screenings are for TEMP positions!

Anal probe coming up next!

368 drcordell  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:45:20pm

re: #319 tradewind

Who consistently received fighter pilot scores of ' excellent ' from his superior officers, and was released because the jet he trained on was decommissioned.
Get the facts before you spew.
As for the ' straight C's , I don't know... did you see his transcript? Gore's grades were much lower.
Not only did Bush academically outperform the "intellectually superior" Gore, Bush scored a higher verbal SAT score than Rhodes scholar and former Democratic presidential candidate Bill Bradley, with Bush scoring 566 to Bradley's 485.

The man voluntarily enlisted into the Air National Guard during a goddamn war. I'm sure they could have found something for him to do in Vietnam if he weren't a sacred cow.

And yes, I have seen Bush's transcript. His 4-year average was a 77. This isn't a disputed fact. Source

And what Gore scored or Bill Bradley scored I really could give a flying fuck about. Gore was the son of fabulously wealthy and powerful parents as well. The question at hand is, how did someone with a C average get into the most prestigious business school in the nation. And the answer is because he was rich and a Bush. Duh.

369 Charpete67  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:45:24pm

I think if you're a really good speaker, that should qualify you to be president.../

370 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:45:28pm

re: #342 Ben Hur

Wasn't he the pres of a frat or something?


I kinda doubt most of the serious frat and secret clubs would have allowed him at all. All those skull and bones type groups were probably whites only back then. They might be even today. Not sure if they allow jews either.

371 eon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:45:41pm

re: #327 Empire1

Since this thread is over 100 comments, and I don't see an open thread above, I'd like to ask for lizardly opinions.

I currently have a blog I haven't updated since my stroke about a year ago, and I want to focus on SF/fantasy book reviews (and a few other kinds on occasion) instead of politics and personal stuff. Nobody cares about the personal junk, and I get better politics discussion here and at other sites.

The question is whether it would be better to ditch the current blog and start over, or post a note and just start doing the reviews. I've asked at my blog, but I don't really expect to get any replies, considering the time lapse.

Just MHO, but based on the behavior of search engines, you'd probably be better off starting a new one. If you have a pre-existing blog on one subject, and change to a new one, Google, etc., will tend to define searches on the basis of previous archived or cached pages. Which means you are less likely to be getting "pinged" by searches from people looking for a blog devoted to SF/Fantasy literature, and more likely to get search results from the previous category, so to speak.

/Just based on my personal experience with Google searches.

cheers

eon

372 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:45:53pm

Wow.

I had a higher average than all of them.

And I studied in a foreign language.

BEN HUR 2012!!!

373 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:45:59pm

re: #358 Russkilitlover

I'm currently going through some extensive background probing in my job search. My references have been called numerous times, my transcripts requested, copies of my certifications requested, etc. And some of the most intense screenings are for TEMP positions!

You oughta just run for President. It's a lot easier...
/

374 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:46:10pm

re: #346 reine.de.tout

Having his transcripts won't change a thing. The time to have demanded this was during the campaign, if it was important.

Also, it seems to me, if there was something damaging to be found in his transcripts, I suspect Hillary would have found it and used it.

Like the birth cert issue it's another distraction from the fact that there is this awful health"care" bill (which isn't rally about the availability or quality of health care at all) that needs to be thrown out the window.

I want to compare my academic life to his...just curious...he's supposed to be the smartest president ever...show me the beef...I have a degree in Geography, another in Nursing, and another in Radiography...eight years...what did he learn?

375 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:46:23pm

re: #279 taxfreekiller

That and I can now avoid trouble for the use of hard words that make
"c***ies" get hurt feelings.

Oh yeah? What exactly fits in your coy little asterisks? What made up word are you using? I'd normally think you meant 'commies', but you keep getting the letter count wrong.

376 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:46:29pm

re: #358 Russkilitlover

Just to be clear, I think if your are a legitimate presidential candidate, either side, your academic records should be available to the public.

377 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:46:36pm
378 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:46:38pm

re: #358 Russkilitlover

I'm currently going through some extensive background probing in my job search. My references have been called numerous times, my transcripts requested, copies of my certifications requested, etc. And some of the most intense screenings are for TEMP positions!


No drug test?!?

379 drcordell  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:02pm

re: #325 Ben Hur

Can you please direct me to a source of the "Bush was a C student" line?

Source

Source

Yale Daily News Source

380 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:08pm

re: #346 reine.de.tout

Having his transcripts won't change a thing. The time to have demanded this was during the campaign, if it was important.

Also, it seems to me, if there was something damaging to be found in his transcripts, I suspect Hillary would have found it and used it.

Like the birth cert issue it's another distraction from the fact that there is this awful health"care" bill (which isn't rally about the availability or quality of health care at all) that needs to be thrown out the window.

If he released his transcripts, I would look at them, but I highly doubt they would change anything. He'll still be president, and he'll still have policies I disagree with- policies the the transcripts won't help me defeat. Conservatives will still have to argue against these policies by offering a reasonable argument against them.

381 avanti  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:12pm

re: #372 Ben Hur

Wow.

I had a higher average than all of them.

And I studied in a foreign language.

BEN HUR 2012!!!

You are a pin head intellectual and most probably a RINO at best. ///

382 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:14pm
383 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:17pm
384 eschew_obfuscation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:18pm

re: #280 drcordell

Let's re-phrase that a little bit. Harvard MBA admitted despite straight C's because he was a Bush / ex fighter pilot who managed to avoid flying in any combat situations because he was a Bush.


Yeah, he wanted out so bad, he tried to get assigned to vietnam.

From the link:

Air National Guard members could volunteer for active duty service with the Air Force in a program called Palace Alert, which deployed F-102 pilots to Europe and Southeast Asia, including Vietnam and Thailand. According to three pilots from Bush's squadron, Bush inquired about this program but was advised by the base commander that he did not have the necessary experience (500 hours) at the time and that the F-102 was outdated.

385 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:22pm

re: #365 DaddyG

Question those people who are adamant about you knowing they have an Ivy League degree.

I'll just pay them for the pizza:)

386 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:24pm

re: #377 taxfreekiller

It is a bit of a problem if you Birth Cet. says,

"U.S. Goverment Indian Hospital Apache Indian Reservation"

Null.

387 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:25pm

re: #346 reine.de.tout

Having his transcripts won't change a thing. The time to have demanded this was during the campaign, if it was important.

Exactly. And that time is long past. He was NOT vetted, nor was the RNC willing to call him out on any suspicions for fear of being labeled "racist." We've been sold a pig in a poke and the only thing constructive to do is battle his bad policies. That's the only place to attack - and it's a HUGE target, lots of "can't miss" stuff on his economics alone, and his really effed up foreign policy.

388 Gang of One  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:29pm

re: #347 tradewind

' Dubya' was an affectionate nickname.. 'Shrub' was the slur that Molly Ivins (RIP) coined in her slam of him in the book by the same name.
As for Barry, it was his self-chosen moniker until he was a sophomore in college, when I suppose some activist convinced him to drop the slave name and embrace his ethnicity, but it was cool with his family and he used it much of his life... so how is it a smear?

You're asking me or American Sabra?

389 Targetpractice  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:30pm

re: #356 formercorpsman

We agree. But it should matter.

He ran on his academic record as part of what qualified him to be the President of the united States.

Again, it is not the sole item which determines his fitness for such a post, but it certainly is relevant for someone supposedly in the middle who would like to get a complete picture in order to determine what they might, or might not like about him under the circumstances.

I think anyone running for public office should be held the same standard as our military when it comes to this.

Their academic records should be available to public who not only helped fund their ability to pay for the school, but might also be voting them to collect their next paycheck as a representative.

So, should his medical records also automatically be available to the public simply because he's running? His dental records? A list of what books he's checked out from every library he's frequented? All his grocery receipts for the past year? Seriously, does the man have any expectation of privacy beyond what he chooses to volunteer or what's dug up by the press? Or does he automatically forfeit any right to privacy the moment he announces his candidacy?

390 jcbunga  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:52pm

OK so on August 4th--the day of The One's birth--what can we expect...parades? It's a Tuesday...banks closed?

How do they handle these events in other countries?

391 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:47:52pm

re: #370 Killgore Trout

I kinda doubt most of the serious frat and secret clubs would have allowed him at all. All those skull and bones type groups were probably whites only back then. They might be even today. Not sure if they allow jews either.

don't forget the trust fund values...$$$

392 Charpete67  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:48:06pm

re: #363 sngnsgt

I think as least the "float" test should be mandatory. /

then at least we would know he wasn't a witch...

393 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:48:21pm

re: #378 Ben Hur

No drug test?!?

Background and drug testing, but only when/if I accept an offer. Those things cost a couple hundred bucks a pop.

394 wrenchwench  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:48:22pm

re: #294 iWatas

I have friends who adopted three kids as teenagers from Kazakhstan. They all have "Certificates of Live Birth" from the State of Maryland. The document does not say they are not natural born citizens.

Just sayin'

Nonsense. Teenagers are not allowed to adopt kids.

/

395 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:48:43pm
396 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:49:20pm

re: #380 Sharmuta

If he released his transcripts, I would look at them, but I highly doubt they would change anything. He'll still be president, and he'll still have policies I disagree with- policies the the transcripts won't help me defeat. Conservatives will still have to argue against these policies by offering a reasonable argument against them.


Not the point, Shar.

(at least for me)

Even if, by some whatever whatever, the nirthers are right, nothing would happen.

It's calling the whole Obama PR campaign out for bullshiting.

397 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:49:27pm

re: #368 drcordell

The man voluntarily enlisted into the Air National Guard during a goddamn war. I'm sure they could have found something for him to do in Vietnam if he weren't a sacred cow.

And yes, I have seen Bush's transcript. His 4-year average was a 77. This isn't a disputed fact. Source

And what Gore scored or Bill Bradley scored I really could give a flying fuck about. Gore was the son of fabulously wealthy and powerful parents as well. The question at hand is, how did someone with a C average get into the most prestigious business school in the nation. And the answer is because he was rich and a Bush. Duh.

Hey...what's up Doc? I cordially invite you to visit the website BushIsGoneGetTheFuckOverIt.com

398 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:49:29pm

re: #367 MandyManners

Anal probe coming up next!

Bring it on.

399 kynna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:49:50pm

I don't have my original birth certificate. I had to write to CA to get a certified proof of birth. Then I lost that and had to get another one. Then I found the first one so now I have two. But both are little sparse looking compared to my kids' BCs.

400 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:50:04pm

re: #391 albusteve

I heard an interview recently about one of those Ivy League secret societies. If you don't make your first million dollars by 35 years old they give it to you. Nice deal.

401 Salamantis  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:50:09pm

re: #300 turn

Man these nirthers just don't give up ...

You've gotta admire that persistent and committed kinda craziness...

Umm...no you don't.

402 drcordell  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:50:13pm

re: #384 eschew_obfuscation

He joined the Texas Air National Guard because his student deferment was 12 days away from expiring. He scored a 25 on the pilot aptitude test, and yet was immediately admitted to the unit despite its long waiting list. At the time George Bush Sr. happened to be a Houston congressman. I guess all that is a big coincidence huh?

Source

403 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:50:31pm

re: #370 Killgore Trout

Are you kidding, or are you off your head?

Obama's roughly my age. He started college about the same time I did - I'm a year ahead of my age cohort. The only reason a man is excluded from frats and secret societies these days is if people don't like the man.

404 opnion  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:51:00pm

re: #338 avanti

I don't know if this was his source, but there are several.

link

Avanti, in one of his memoirs Obama relates that he was a stoner & poor student in high school.
No problem , he gets an academic scholarship to Occidental College in L.A.
Don't you find that curious? I do

405 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:51:06pm

Speaking of your passport, never leave home without it. You never know when you're going to want to cut through Canada on the way from New England to the Midwest.

On the other hand, if you're going to cut through Canada, you might not want to bring your firearms along for the ride. Good thing I forgot my passport last time...

406 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:51:40pm

re: #346 reine.de.tout

Having his transcripts won't change a thing. The time to have demanded this was during the campaign, if it was important.

Also, it seems to me, if there was something damaging to be found in his transcripts, I suspect Hillary would have found it and used it.

Like the birth cert issue it's another distraction from the fact that there is this awful health"care" bill (which isn't rally about the availability or quality of health care at all) that needs to be thrown out the window.

Exactly. Even the most dedicated Obama hater should realise that the time for digging into that stuff is over.
And also, Hillary's team doubtless found everything, and would have deployed everything to crush him.

And finally, it's not like there's a shortage of real issues to criticise Obama on.

407 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:52:14pm
408 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:52:24pm

re: #400 Killgore Trout

I heard an interview recently about one of those Ivy League secret societies. If you don't make your first million dollars by 35 years old they give it to you. Nice deal.

Wow. That's pretty incredible. Do you have backup info? I'd be curious.

409 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:52:33pm

re: #400 Killgore Trout

I heard an interview recently about one of those Ivy League secret societies. If you don't make your first million dollars by 35 years old they give it to you. Nice deal.

talk about sticking together...sekrit dood

410 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:52:41pm
411 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:52:58pm

re: #403 Dianna

Are you kidding, or are you off your head?

Obama's roughly my age. He started college about the same time I did - I'm a year ahead of my age cohort. The only reason a man is excluded from frats and secret societies these days is if people don't like the man.

There are Jewish frats, Black frats, etc.

Today, Yale, as my Yale football alumni likes to say, is full of Asians and Athletes.

412 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:52:58pm

re: #403 Dianna

Those secret societies at Ivy League schools are pretty serious. There were major golf tournaments and country clubs that only allowed blacks to join fairly recently. It would surprise me if they were still whites only in the 80's.

413 drcordell  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:53:07pm

re: #397 LGoPs

Hey...what's up Doc? I cordially invite you to visit the website BushIsGoneGetTheFuckOverIt.com

Go read the history of the thread. I cracked a single joke in response to a Bush comment someone had made earlier. Since then all I've done is respond to people who can't seem to believe that Bush was indeed a C student, and yet somehow managed to get into Harvard Business School. Oh, and people who somehow think it's a coincidence that the rich son of a Texas Congressman didn't end up going to Vietnam.

414 jcbunga  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:53:08pm

BUT was Hawaii a state at the moment of conception??? HA!! Answer THAT!!

Ha!!

///

415 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:53:09pm

re: #375 iceweasel

TFK is not going to help you out, there.

Don't bother getting huffy - he never explains himself.

Either report him or not. It's about all you can do.

416 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:53:35pm

re: #400 Killgore Trout

I heard an interview recently about one of those Ivy League secret societies. If you don't make your first million dollars by 35 years old they give it to you. Nice deal.

You mean they give it to you as in "they administer a severe beating and drum you out of the club", right?

417 Targetpractice  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:53:38pm

re: #402 drcordell

He joined the Texas Air National Guard because his student deferment was 12 days away from expiring. He scored a 25 on the pilot aptitude test, and yet was immediately admitted to the unit despite its long waiting list. At the time George Bush Sr. happened to be a Houston congressman. I guess all that is a big coincidence huh?

Source

And Gore joined the Army as a journalist because his Gore Sr. was up for reelection and couldn't have his son skipping to Canada ruining his chances, while Kerry joined up with the Naval Reserve because his college deferment was denied.

Wow, talk about scandalous.

///

418 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:54:05pm

re: #406 iceweasel

Exactly. Even the most dedicated Obama hater should realise that the time for digging into that stuff is over.
And also, Hillary's team doubtless found everything, and would have deployed everything to crush him.

And finally, it's not like there's a shortage of real issues to criticise Obama on.

Are you equating wanting to know about his transcripts, medical records, to to NIRTHERS?

419 wrenchwench  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:54:08pm

By the way, here's an early post from iWatas:

624 iWatas10/30/2007 3:33:31 pm PDT

Anyone who thinks Europe will possibly survive the Islamic wave and still stay politically correct is dreaming. Europe is going to have a strong fascist movement, even if the demographics probably mean it will be doomed anyway.

Still, while I might not vote for this guy, people here should not make the perfect the enemy of the good. This guy may well be a closet racist and nazi - but his positions are still much better than the mainstream "see no evil" parties.

He is right that one should be proud of, and defend, European culture. Without that, young muslims will certainly not assimilate. In this respect, VB beats the status quo.

I'm thinkin' "troll."

420 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:54:30pm

re: #402 drcordell

He joined the Texas Air National Guard because his student deferment was 12 days away from expiring. He scored a 25 on the pilot aptitude test, and yet was immediately admitted to the unit despite its long waiting list. At the time George Bush Sr. happened to be a Houston congressman. I guess all that is a big coincidence huh?

Source

See, once again, the Argument from Ignorance article I cited above and it's widespread use by conspiracy theorists everywhere. This is another fine example of it in action. And it is every bit as fallacious as the argument made by the nirthers.

421 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:54:31pm

re: #404 opnion

Avanti, in one of his memoirs Obama relates that he was a stoner & poor student in high school.
No problem , he gets an academic scholarship to Occidental College in L.A.
Don't you find that curious? I do

Right. Because no one ever smoked pot in high school, and it's sooo hard to get into Occidental.

Not ripping on you, but could we please stop pretending that smoking pot in high school or college, or anytime, makes you a drug addict and lowers your IQ?

422 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:54:35pm

re: #406 iceweasel

Exactly. Even the most dedicated Obama hater should realise that the time for digging into that stuff is over.
And also, Hillary's team doubtless found everything, and would have deployed everything to crush him.

And finally, it's not like there's a shortage of real issues to criticise Obama on.

not the point...at all...apologist supreme

423 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:55:07pm

re: #422 albusteve

not the point...at all...apologist supreme

Bullshit.

424 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:55:25pm

re: #419 wrenchwench

By the way, here's an early post from iWatas:

I'm thinkin' "troll."

You're kind. I'd say "enabler".

425 drcordell  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:55:25pm

re: #417 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

And Gore joined the Army as a journalist because his Gore Sr. was up for reelection and couldn't have his son skipping to Canada ruining his chances, while Kerry joined up with the Naval Reserve because his college deferment was denied.

Wow, talk about scandalous.

///

Al Gore was a spoiled rich aristocrat just like Bush. And Kerry went to Vietnam. Just because I think Bush was a spoiled rich kid who coasted through life on his money and name doesn't mean that same sentiment doesn't apply to Democrats.

426 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:55:27pm

re: #402 drcordell

I may have missed it. How long had "W's" dad been a congressman at that point?

427 eon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:55:30pm

re: #406 iceweasel

Exactly. Even the most dedicated Obama hater should realise that the time for digging into that stuff is over.
And also, Hillary's team doubtless found everything, and would have deployed everything to crush him.

And finally, it's not like there's a shortage of real issues to criticise Obama on.

Precisely. Unfortunately, the MSM, whose job as the "Fourth Estate" is to do such things, simply refuse to do so.

As far as I can tell, this Nirther nonsense is making it easier for them to get away with just sitting around and basking in the afterglow of their tingling legs.

Another good reason for everyone to ignore the latter.

cheers

eon

428 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:55:33pm

re: #408 Russkilitlover

Wow. That's pretty incredible. Do you have backup info? I'd be curious.

Damn, I can't remember the name of the author. He has a new book out about it. ...I think he was the guy who wrote the book that inspired the movie Rounders. I'll search around a bit and see what I can find...

429 eschew_obfuscation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:55:36pm

re: #402 drcordell

He joined the Texas Air National Guard because his student deferment was 12 days away from expiring. He scored a 25 on the pilot aptitude test, and yet was immediately admitted to the unit despite its long waiting list. At the time George Bush Sr. happened to be a Houston congressman. I guess all that is a big coincidence huh?

Source

Don't know... and neither do you.

430 midwestgak  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:55:53pm

re: #368 drcordell

Why do you post here?

431 Digital Display  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:56:11pm

re: #377 taxfreekiller

It is a bit of a problem if you Birth Cet. says,

"U.S. Goverment Indian Hospital Apache Indian Reservation"

It's even worse when you are born to a 17 yr old farm hand on a ranch with no doctor and given up for adoption.. I went through foster homes till 12 yrs old...My BC has more Court stamps on it than Condi's passport...
My BC has been changed by a court in California to show my Adopted parents in the spaces as Father's name and mothers maiden name...
Try to find the original...It's not going to happen...The State says I was born to my adopted parents...

432 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:56:15pm

re: #389 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Don't you think you are being a little ridiculous by associating this discussion by adding qualifiers such as home ec, grocery receipts, library books, and some of the other stuff you have included in retort?

If I am not mistaken, I am pretty sure all serious presidential candidates up until now, (with the exception of Bill Clinton) have provided medical records unconditionally. I would imagine that is a courtesy to the public at large, knowing they are voting for someone who has decent odds of living out their oath of office under normal circumstances.

Yes, as a matter of fact, I feel if you are taking the top post as the President, and you are at the top of the chain of command for all of our armed services, then I expect some of the same stuff we burden our young men and women with who are entering to become E1's.

433 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:57:08pm

re: #421 iceweasel

Right. Because no one ever smoked pot in high school, and it's sooo hard to get into Occidental.

Not ripping on you, but could we please stop pretending that smoking pot in high school or college, or anytime, makes you a drug addict and lowers your IQ?

COKE.

And yes, it's big deal after hearing about Bush's (and his daughter's) BEER drinking for 8 years.

434 opnion  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:57:40pm

re: #370 Killgore Trout

I kinda doubt most of the serious frat and secret clubs would have allowed him at all. All those skull and bones type groups were probably whites only back then. They might be even today. Not sure if they allow jews either.

KT, buy the time Obama hit the Ivy League I think that all of that was over, although it was true back in the day.
Obama probably could have pledged any frat.
On the downside at my daughters University the frats & Soroities seem to cluster in ethnic groups. You have Greek life for Whites, another for Jews & another for Blacks.
My daughters sorority recruited Black pledges with no success.

435 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:57:48pm

re: #423 iceweasel

Bullshit.

what's up with your passport?...why would you post such a thing?...your Shiny Object?

436 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:58:02pm

re: #418 Ben Hur

Are you equating wanting to know about his transcripts, medical records, to to NIRTHERS?

You bet I am. Did you know that the nirthers are also demanding his transcripts?

For the same reason. Some fantasy that Obama doesn't deserve to be POTUS, or isn't 'one of us'.

BTW, if you think running on "Obama hasn't shown us his transcripts!" is a winning strategy, go for it. Send some money to WND and fund some billboards.

437 drcordell  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:58:24pm

re: #429 eschew_obfuscation

Don't know... and neither do you.

You're right. Nobody has conclusive proof. But this is America. The multi-millionaire grandchildren of Senators and the children of Congressmen don't die in wars. Is this some sort of shocking new fact? If you are rich you don't get drafted. That is how it has always worked. It applies just as much to Democrats as it does to Republicans. The difference is the Republican chickenhawks are the ones who clamor for invasions.

438 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:58:49pm

Weird Nut Drooly shrieks: $100,000 offered for proof of eligibility!

A man who runs a silver business and offers stock investment advice has announced he's offering a reward of $100,000 for proof meeting that Barack Obama is a "natural born" citizen of the United States and, therefore, eligible to be president.

Jason Hommel announced the offer on his website.

"I, Jason Hommel, promise that I will give $100,000 to the first person who can prove to my satisfaction that Barack Obama, acting as president of the United States, is a 'natural born' citizen of the USA, which is a qualification to hold the office as indicated in the U.S. Constitution," he wrote.

"Please prove that Obama is a 'natural born' US citizen, and put to rest the claims in lawsuits, as wnd.com reports, 'that include contentions Obama was born in Kenya, wasn't a 'natural born' citizen because of his father's Kenyan citizenship, was a dual citizen and that his mother wasn't old enough to transmit citizenship at birth. In addition, his citizenship is clouded by his move as a child to Indonesia and apparent adoption by an Indonesian citizen who married his mother.'"

439 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:58:53pm

re: #399 kynna

It's the lack of calligraphy.

440 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:58:57pm
441 Dancing along the light of day  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:59:05pm

re: #431 HoosierHoops

Hiya Hoops!

442 drcordell  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 2:59:51pm

re: #440 buzzsawmonkey

Smoking pot doesn't lower your IQ? I don't know what your criteria for that are, but habitual pot smokers are the slowest-thinking dullards I have ever encountered.

Just because the dullards you encounter happen to be pot-smokers doesn't mean that all pot smokers are dullards.

443 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:00:07pm

re: #425 drcordell

I'm sorry, but it just dawned on me that we crossed paths on a past vaccination thread, no?

444 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:00:18pm

re: #437 drcordell

Like Kosovo or Sarajevo...right, doc?

Oh...wiat- that's cleaning up the mess in the Euros backyard peacekeeping, so I guess that's different- right?

445 Ward Cleaver  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:00:32pm

I had totally forgotten about the long form certificate. I remember that during the election when this issue first came up, somebody posted a Hawaii long form BC on their Web site, showing all the same information. There's nothing here, and anyway, BCs typically just show the race of the parents, and don't list one for the child.

Move along, nirthers. Nothing to see here.

446 eon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:00:35pm

re: #438 Charles

Weird Nut Drooly shrieks: $100,000 offered for proof of eligibility!

Sir, I think you and a few others should collect.

cheers

eon

447 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:00:36pm

re: #400 Killgore Trout

Time for the "What?!" button.

KT? What the hell have you been smoking?

448 drcordell  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:00:40pm

I'm out, headed to Minetta Tavern for the cote de boeuf and roasted bone marrow. I'll be back later, don't have too much fun without me.

449 Targetpractice  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:00:41pm

re: #432 formercorpsman

Don't you think you are being a little ridiculous by associating this discussion by adding qualifiers such as home ec, grocery receipts, library books, and some of the other stuff you have included in retort?

If I am not mistaken, I am pretty sure all serious presidential candidates up until now, (with the exception of Bill Clinton) have provided medical records unconditionally. I would imagine that is a courtesy to the public at large, knowing they are voting for someone who has decent odds of living out their oath of office under normal circumstances.

Yes, as a matter of fact, I feel if you are taking the top post as the President, and you are at the top of the chain of command for all of our armed services, then I expect some of the same stuff we burden our young men and women with who are entering to become E1's.

Then my friend, you need to call up your local Rep and Senator and push for an amendment to add such requirements to the Constitutional requirements for the presidency. Because, at the moment, the man's college transcripts are not listed and I personally thought things like his past voting records as both a State Senator and a US Senator were more important than what his grades were. Trust me, if there was something truly embarrassing in those transcripts, I'm fairly certain Hillary would have rooted them out and put them up for all to see.

450 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:00:44pm

re: #52 erp

Oh, grow up.

451 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:01:04pm

re: #436 iceweasel

You bet I am. Did you know that the nirthers are also demanding his transcripts?

For the same reason. Some fantasy that Obama doesn't deserve to be POTUS, or isn't 'one of us'.

BTW, if you think running on "Obama hasn't shown us his transcripts!" is a winning strategy, go for it. Send some money to WND and fund some billboards.

too bad that...he's a famous person and I want to know how he got so smart...for me it has nothing to do with his office...call me a racist conspiricy monger if you want but it's just that simple for many people

452 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:01:12pm
453 BlueCanuck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:01:28pm

re: #437 drcordell

I see you have your 60's Vietnam war protests down pat. It's over, get a life and let it go. Yes the children of the rich are privileged like that. Not just in the USA, all across the world in many countries in many war time situations you will find that those who want to and can will use their money to escape combat.

454 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:01:39pm

re: #418 Ben Hur

Are you equating wanting to know about his transcripts, medical records, to to NIRTHERS?

Pssst. Ben Hur, You CANNOT question The One. About anything. Asking for copies of publications while he was 12 years on law review is racist, dontcha know.

455 Digital Display  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:02:09pm

re: #441 Floral Giraffe

Hiya Hoops!

Hiya my friend...Hope today finds you well and healthy

456 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:02:13pm

re: #437 drcordell

The difference is the Republican chickenhawks are the ones who clamor for invasions.

Fuck you!

457 Ward Cleaver  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:02:22pm

What's with the sudden moonbat infestation?

458 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:02:35pm

I'm really beginning to wonder about John Bolton. Why does he keep hanging out with the incredibly deranged Pamela Geller?

459 opnion  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:03:00pm

re: #417 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

And Gore joined the Army as a journalist because his Gore Sr. was up for reelection and couldn't have his son skipping to Canada ruining his chances, while Kerry joined up with the Naval Reserve because his college deferment was denied.

Wow, talk about scandalous.

///


Yeah but Kerry did a secret Christmas Eve mission into Cambodia with the CIA.
He saw all of those Buddists celebrating Chritmas. It's seered into his memory I tell ya.

460 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:03:04pm

re: #412 Killgore Trout

I seriously doubt it. Really.

461 Salamantis  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:03:07pm

re: #438 Charles

Weird Nut Drooly shrieks: $100,000 offered for proof of eligibility!

Who wants to bet that nothing could possibly satisfy him, including being transported back to Aug. 4, 1961, at Kapi'olani Hospital in Honolulu, Hawaii, and watching Barack's Mom squeeze him out personally?

"to my satisfaction" is the duplicitous weasel phrase that insulates him from losing his dough.

462 eschew_obfuscation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:03:10pm

re: #437 drcordell

You're right. Nobody has conclusive proof. But this is America. The multi-millionaire grandchildren of Senators and the children of Congressmen don't die in wars. Is this some sort of shocking new fact? If you are rich you don't get drafted. That is how it has always worked. It applies just as much to Democrats as it does to Republicans. The difference is the Republican chickenhawks are the ones who clamor for invasions.

So why are you picking on Bush then?

Oh, and Biden's son, Palin's son, and several other senators' and representatives' children are serving or have served in Iraq... without the draft, so apparently sons and daughters of senators and representatives DO serve... they just don't need to be drafted.

463 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:03:13pm
464 Targetpractice  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:03:26pm

re: #437 drcordell

You're right. Nobody has conclusive proof. But this is America. The multi-millionaire grandchildren of Senators and the children of Congressmen don't die in wars. Is this some sort of shocking new fact? If you are rich you don't get drafted. That is how it has always worked. It applies just as much to Democrats as it does to Republicans. The difference is the Republican chickenhawks are the ones who clamor for invasions.

Remind me again, what branch did you serve in? And how long was that length of service?

465 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:03:35pm

Someone should offer a reward for a Kenyan birth certificate.

BTW- I've seen a Kenyan birth certificate in the course of my work, and it was a short form. I thought that was funny. So there you have it, Nirthers. Give us a Kenyan BC, and it has to be long form, or STFU.

466 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:03:45pm

re: #458 Charles

I'm really beginning to wonder about John Bolton. Why does he keep hanging out with the incredibly deranged Pamela Geller?

She's pretty? She has a large bosom and wears things that show cleavage? She's got a great smile?

467 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:03:54pm

re: #428 Killgore Trout

Damn, I can't remember the name of the author. He has a new book out about it. ...I think he was the guy who wrote the book that inspired the movie Rounders. I'll search around a bit and see what I can find...

(Find out how to get into one of those societies - I'm over 35 and don't have an extra Mil laying around.) /;}

468 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:03:57pm

re: #454 Russkilitlover

What's gonna be interesting, IMO, is watching to see if Obama learned anything from his 'teachable moment' re the GatesGate comment.
My bet is no, since he's fanning the flames with the silly ' come over and have a Blue Moon' invitation. Now the press is arguing American vs imported beer.
He hasn't learned how to shut down a controversy.

469 wrenchwench  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:03:58pm

re: #463 buzzsawmonkey

You made me snort.

470 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:04:13pm

re: #440 buzzsawmonkey

Smoking pot doesn't lower your IQ? I don't know what your criteria for that are, but habitual pot smokers are the slowest-thinking dullards I have ever encountered.

It's normal to smoke pot at uni or in high school, and smoking pot, even habitually, doesn't automatically make a person a 'slow thinking dullard'.

By the way, did you know that 'slow-thinking dullard' is redundant? Perhaps you're smoking too much pot to remember that? ///

471 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:04:25pm

re: #458 Charles

I wish I didn't know that... I really like the Walrus.

472 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:04:25pm

re: #458 Charles

I'm really beginning to wonder about John Bolton. Why does he keep hanging out with the incredibly deranged Pamela Geller?

He does?

I woulda thought, handsome, smart guy, not too old, he wouldn't have to - cough - pay for it.

473 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:04:47pm

re: #462 eschew_obfuscation

Ding ding ding ding ding! We got us a winnah!

474 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:04:54pm

re: #436 iceweasel

So every presidential candidate who might have provided their transcripts prior to this were just playing to the lunatics?

For the future, my thinking the next candidate (regardless of party affiliation) should provide this information, makes me a conspiracy nut?

Do you think when an officer is going for a commission in one of our armed services, this information should be foregone?

475 Ward Cleaver  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:05:03pm

re: #438 Charles

Weird Nut Drooly shrieks: $100,000 offered for proof of eligibility!

They wouldn't give out the $100,000 even if you could prove that 0bama had a birthmark on his ass that read, "MADE IN U.S.A"

476 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:05:10pm

re: #466 Dianna

She's pretty? She has a large bosom and wears things that show cleavage? She's got a great smile?

FIFY

477 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:05:15pm

re: #458 Charles

I'm really beginning to wonder about John Bolton. Why does he keep hanging out with the incredibly deranged Pamela Geller?

I'll not share the first thing that came to my mind 'cause I'd hope that Bolton has more sense than that.

478 Salamantis  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:05:19pm

re: #462 eschew_obfuscation

So why are you picking on Bush then?

Oh, and Biden's son, Palin's son, and several other senators' and representatives' children are serving or have served in Iraq... without the draft, so apparently sons and daughters of senators and representatives DO serve... they just don't need to be drafted.

Not to mention McCain's son, who has also served in Iraq.

479 FrogMarch  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:05:36pm

re: #437 drcordell

You're right. Nobody has conclusive proof. But this is America. The multi-millionaire grandchildren of Senators and the children of Congressmen don't die in wars. Is this some sort of shocking new fact? If you are rich you don't get drafted. That is how it has always worked. It applies just as much to Democrats as it does to Republicans. The difference is the Republican chickenhawks are the ones who clamor for invasions.

That's nice. Do you leftists ever tire of whining about Republican chickenhawks. It's tired rhetoric.
At least most of them aren't lying treasonous snakes.

480 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:05:36pm

re: #458 Charles

I'm really beginning to wonder about John Bolton. Why does he keep hanging out with the incredibly deranged Pamela Geller?

Maybe he's attracted to big gazongas?

/just sayin'

481 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:05:45pm

re: #466 Dianna

She's pretty? She has a large bosom and wears things that show cleavage? She's got a great smile?

Pretty? Maybe if you like artificial enhancements and crocodilian facial expressions.

482 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:05:51pm

re: #449 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I think you are still missing my point. I am not just talking about Obama. I agree, it does not matter now.

I don't like the precedent.

483 Ward Cleaver  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:05:53pm

re: #458 Charles

I'm really beginning to wonder about John Bolton. Why does he keep hanging out with the incredibly deranged Pamela Geller?

Maybe he hasn't read any of her stuff? I'd like to give him the benefit of the doubt.

484 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:06:15pm

re: #437 drcordell

The difference is the Republican chickenhawks are the ones who clamor for invasions.

Only a moonbat would write, or upding, such a statement.

485 wrenchwench  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:06:18pm

re: #477 MandyManners

I'll not share the first thing that came to my mind 'cause I'd hope that Bolton has more sense than that.

S'ok, Buzz beat ya to it anyway.

486 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:06:19pm

re: #470 iceweasel

By the way, did you know that 'slow-thinking dullard' is redundant

...
Not necessarily... you could be a dim-wit whose mind clicks away at warp speed, just not in any productive way.

487 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:06:45pm

re: #481 Charles

Pretty? Maybe if you like artificial enhancements and crocodilian facial expressions.

paging occasional reader

488 Empire1  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:06:50pm

re: #341 CynicalConservative

Given the time-lapse, I'd just go with what ya got. Link it to your Nic here and I'll visit. I like the topic.

That's my own preference. yes -- if only because I like the "Beer Garden" name, and would hate to have to come up with another one! I shall indeed link it to my name, and if you care to register and comment, you'd be more than welcome. (I like to know who I'm talking to, is why the registration.)

I've said I'd give anyone there a week to comment, so that's when the book reviews will start appearing.

Thanks for the input!

489 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:06:58pm

re: #463 buzzsawmonkey

There are probably two prominent reasons.

What might those be? Mammary fails me.

490 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:07:04pm

re: #448 drcordell

I'm out, headed to Minetta Tavern for the cote de boeuf and roasted bone marrow. I'll be back later, don't have too much fun without me.

re: #426 Cannadian Club Akbar

I may have missed it. How long had "W's" dad been a congressman at that point?


Never got my answer. Bummer.

491 Ward Cleaver  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:07:24pm

re: #484 unrealizedviewpoint

Only a moonbat would write, or upding, such a statement.

He's a bombthrower.

GAZE

492 Targetpractice  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:07:37pm

re: #482 formercorpsman

I think you are still missing my point. I am not just talking about Obama. I agree, it does not matter now.

I don't like the precedent.

Neither do I. And I'm sure that his transcripts might have possibly deflated the "Smartest Man to Ever Run For The Presidency" myth, but it's a bit late to be worrying about that now. Come 2012, the GOP challenger might be smart to take that issue up. But right now, we have more important issues to obsess over.

493 eschew_obfuscation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:07:40pm

re: #478 Salamantis

Not to mention McCain's son, who has also served in Iraq.

Damn! Thanks. I forgot him... baaad E_O!

494 Ward Cleaver  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:07:54pm

re: #489 LGoPs

What might those be? Mammary fails me.

HUGE tracts of land.

/the curtains?

495 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:07:57pm

re: #481 Charles

Pretty? Maybe if you like artificial enhancements and crocodilian facial expressions.

Her boobs are fake?

496 Silvergirl  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:08:01pm

re: #347 tradewind

' Dubya' was an affectionate nickname.. 'Shrub' was the slur that Molly Ivins (RIP) coined in her slam of him in the book by the same name.
As for Barry, it was his self-chosen moniker until he was a sophomore in college, when I suppose some activist convinced him to drop the slave name and embrace his ethnicity, but it was cool with his family and he used it much of his life... so how is it a smear?

I don't think anyone in this thread has used the term "smear" but said that it's more of an agenda alert if a person uses Barry or Hussein. It doesn't really have a lot to do with Barry being a self-chosen name in his younger days. The fact is that he doesn't choose to use it now.

If we are in support of a person, we normally refer to them as their name generally known in public. If we're not, we rename them, using a form of their name or in Obama's case, his former name. I kept reading "Willard" on anti-Romney bogs until I discovered that is his real name, though not one he chooses to be called. His supporters don't call him Willard. Richard Nixon was Tricky Dick, Sarah Palin detractors like to call her Caribou Barbie. We know all the names Bush was called. Hillary became Hitlery and Shrillary. It's a game. Childish, really. I sometimes play at it myself, but it's a low form of humor.

497 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:08:09pm

re: #458 Charles

I'm really beginning to wonder about John Bolton. Why does he keep hanging out with the incredibly deranged Pamela Geller?

I've always wondered that. Why does he?

Pammie has an especially idiotic piece at the American Thinker today, which ends with "Obama has never said "God bless america"!

Naturally, google returns loads of hits to the contrary. We're not even talking about shooting sea kittens in a barrel here. It's worse.

498 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:08:13pm

re: #448 drcordell

I'm out, headed to Minetta Tavern for the cote de boeuf and roasted bone marrow. I'll be back later, don't have too much fun without me.

No. Wait.

Don't go.
/

499 CynicalConservative  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:08:22pm

re: #488 Empire1

Look forward to it!

500 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:08:23pm

re: #485 wrenchwench

S'ok, Buzz beat ya to it anyway.

I smoked pot in college.

501 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:08:25pm

re: #437 drcordell

You're right. Nobody has conclusive proof. But this is America. The multi-millionaire grandchildren of Senators and the children of Congressmen don't die in wars. Is this some sort of shocking new fact? If you are rich you don't get drafted. That is how it has always worked. It applies just as much to Democrats as it does to Republicans. The difference is the Republican chickenhawks are the ones who clamor for invasions.

Here's a rope. Mandy will tell you what you can do with it.

502 Ward Cleaver  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:08:37pm

re: #481 Charles

Pretty? Maybe if you like artificial enhancements and crocodilian facial expressions.

Owww!

503 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:08:44pm

re: #468 tradewind


He hasn't learned how to shut down a controversy.

Oh, I say he's EXCEPTIONALLY skilled at that maneuver. They used to call Reagan the "Teflon President." Reagan's got nothing on the media armor plating that is still firmly in the Obama camp.

504 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:08:47pm

re: #490 Cannadian Club Akbar

Never got my answer. Bummer.

liberals only answer the easy questions...it's a pattern

505 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:09:00pm

re: #438 Charles

Weird Nut Drooly shrieks: $100,000 offered for proof of eligibility!

Yet again: how about if Jason offers up some actual proof that 0bama is NOT a legitimate citizen of the United States?

While we're waiting for that, I demand that Jason prove, to my satisfaction, that he does not chew gum with his ass.

506 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:09:33pm

re: #431 HoosierHoops

It's even worse when you are born to a 17 yr old farm hand on a ranch with no doctor and given up for adoption.. I went through foster homes till 12 yrs old...My BC has more Court stamps on it than Condi's passport...
My BC has been changed by a court in California to show my Adopted parents in the spaces as Father's name and mothers maiden name...
Try to find the original...It's not going to happen...The State says I was born to my adopted parents...

I have a friend who went through all of that to find that her birth mother was deceased and her biological father wanted nothing to do with her. It doesn't always give you the answers you want.

507 capitalist piglet  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:09:36pm

re: #454 Russkilitlover

Pssst. Ben Hur, You CANNOT question The One. About anything. Asking for copies of publications while he was 12 years on law review is racist, dontcha know.

IRRELEVANT! Let's talk about Bush!!

///

508 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:10:06pm

re: #501 Alouette

Here's a rope. Mandy will tell you what you can do with it.

Errr...I forgot? Could you remind me?

509 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:10:14pm

re: #436 iceweasel

You bet I am. Did you know that the nirthers are also demanding his transcripts?

For the same reason. Some fantasy that Obama doesn't deserve to be POTUS, or isn't 'one of us'.

BTW, if you think running on "Obama hasn't shown us his transcripts!" is a winning strategy, go for it. Send some money to WND and fund some billboards.

Wow, quite the conspiracy theory you have going there.

Let's connect the dots.

Nirthers believe he is not qualified because they believe he was born outside the US.

Many Nirthers are Troofers (established above thread)

There are Nirthers who also want to see his transcript.

I want to see his transcript.

I am a Nirther that doesn't think Obama is "one of us". (I love when the postmodernists whip out the "fear of other" BS, which is of course a disease only of a certain side of politics)

BTW, you often repeated line:

BTW, if you think running on...

is getting very worn.


But back to reality, I know you bend over backwards to avoid generalities because of the whole "Replace x with Jew" philosophy, but claiming that Nirtherism and wanting more legit info on the POTUS background and narrative is the same thing or has to same goal is a little sweeping.

510 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:10:20pm
511 opnion  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:10:26pm

re: #421 iceweasel

Right. Because no one ever smoked pot in high school, and it's sooo hard to get into Occidental.

Not ripping on you, but could we please stop pretending that smoking pot in high school or college, or anytime, makes you a drug addict and lowers your IQ?


Ice I don't care what substances he did, but he was talking about doing a lot of coke, not just pot. He descibed himslf as a stoner, not just a casual pot smoker. If use of pot in college lowered ones IQ, I think that we would all have a problem.
Whether or not Occdidental is a decent college , I have no idea.
What I am wondering is, why would a mainland college go all the way to Hawaii to recruit a self described substandard student.
Doesn't that raise any questions to you?

512 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:10:34pm

re: #397 LGoPs
The Hanging Chad Saloon had last call years ago, but management still hasn't managed to send all the barflies home...

513 Ward Cleaver  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:10:44pm

re: #505 SixDegrees

Yet again: how about if Jason offers up some actual proof that 0bama is NOT a legitimate citizen of the United States?

While we're waiting for that, I demand that Jason prove, to my satisfaction, that he does not chew gum with his ass.

That's an idea - turn the argument around on them.

Upding!

514 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:10:57pm

re: #449 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

As well, I am with you in placing the level of importance on his performance, voting record, etc.

But I think having the academic record is another piece of the puzzle for making an informed judgment whether you score that as 25%, 10%, etc.

As far as privacy, I think family members should be mostly off limits. Children totally off limits.

But I don't think wanting to see the academic picture behind a candidate is an unreasonable request.

515 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:11:02pm

re: #507 capitalist piglet

IRRELEVANT! Let's talk about Bush!!

///

Is this part of the boob pun thread?

516 Targetpractice  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:11:03pm

re: #512 tradewind

The Hanging Chad Saloon had last call years ago, but management still hasn't managed to send all the barflies home...

Well, they don't have to go home, but they can't stay here.

517 wrenchwench  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:11:07pm

re: #500 MandyManners

I smoked pot in college.

Eh, that's the one topic where I think buzz is way off. Unfortunately, no way to prove it.

518 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:11:17pm

re: #440 buzzsawmonkey

Smoking pot doesn't lower your IQ? I don't know what your criteria for that are, but habitual pot smokers are the slowest-thinking dullards I have ever encountered.

THROTTLE BACK, MY FRIEND.

519 FrogMarch  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:12:00pm

re: #397 LGoPs

Hey...what's up Doc? I cordially invite you to visit the website BushIsGoneGetTheFuckOverIt.com

re: #512 tradewind

The Hanging Chad Saloon had last call years ago, but management still hasn't managed to send all the barflies home...

Heh.

520 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:12:01pm
521 Athos  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:12:10pm

re: #438 Charles

"I, Jason Hommel, promise that I will give $100,000 to the first person who can prove to my satisfaction that Barack Obama, acting as president of the United States, is a 'natural born' citizen of the USA, which is a qualification to hold the office as indicated in the U.S. Constitution," he wrote.

Operative words are in bold.

The problem with the nirthers, and others fixated on conspiracy theories, is that no one can ever produce adequate information to derail the theory to their 'satisfaction'. If that were possible, they wouldn't have accepted the conspiracy theory in the first place.

522 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:12:21pm

re: #481 Charles

Pretty? Maybe if you like artificial enhancements and crocodilian facial expressions.

I'm avoiding being nasty. Because I'm a female, and if I start being nasty, it must be because I'm jealous. Or just being catty.

The crocodilian expressions: those I agree with.

I make no comment on the others. Except to note that I believe in the force of my character. I've always needed to.

523 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:12:39pm

re: #421 iceweasel

Actually, he said ' pot and a little blow'.
Since everyone knows that drug users underreport, who knows how fried he was?
He's not now, so it's probably irrelevant. The poor SOB is just trying to get off the nicotine.

524 debutaunt  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:12:44pm

re: #27 Sharmuta

Anyone who says, "I'm not a nirther, but..." is a nirther.

Nirther Butts.

525 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:13:09pm

re: #517 wrenchwench

Eh, that's the one topic where I think buzz is way off. Unfortunately, no way to prove it.

Cheetos?

526 pat  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:13:13pm

Apparently the zeal the MSM went after Bush's pot/cocaine usage has waned.

527 sngnsgt  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:13:17pm

re: #392 Charpete67

then at least we would know he wasn't a witch...

The LLL thinks he walks on water though.

528 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:13:30pm

re: #520 buzzsawmonkey

Later, or tomorrow, people.

Later, gator!

529 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:13:37pm

re: #504 albusteve

liberals only answer the easy questions...it's a pattern

The persons nic started with Dr. I thought my 1.25 high skool GPA would sink me.

530 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:13:46pm

re: #511 opnion

Ice I don't care what substances he did, but he was talking about doing a lot of coke, not just pot. He descibed himslf as a stoner, not just a casual pot smoker. If use of pot in college lowered ones IQ, I think that we would all have a problem.
Whether or not Occdidental is a decent college , I have no idea.
What I am wondering is, why would a mainland college go all the way to Hawaii to recruit a self described substandard student.
Doesn't that raise any questions to you?

apologists will shift the question back to you...move the goalposts...and call you an extremists for asking...in other words no, they have no problem with it

531 Empire1  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:13:47pm

re: #345 MandyManners

I'd do the latter.

Thanks, Mandy -- I value your opinion, and that's three votes the same way. :)

532 Salamantis  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:13:56pm

re: #440 buzzsawmonkey

Smoking pot doesn't lower your IQ? I don't know what your criteria for that are, but habitual pot smokers are the slowest-thinking dullards I have ever encountered.

Tell that to Carl Sagan. Or Winston Churchill. Or Friedrich Nietszche. Or Thomas Jefferson. Or John F. Kennedy. Or Bill Clinton. Or Francis Ford Coppola. Or Robert Altman. Or Louis Armstrong. Or Michael Bloomberg. Or Norman Mailer. Or Ted Turner. Or Robert Mitchum. Or Bill Murray. Or Jack Nicholson. Or Bob Dylan. Or Neil Young. Or John Lennon. Or Conan O'Brien. Or Tom Brokaw. Or Harrison Ford. Or Steven King. Or Newt Gingrich.

533 Russkilitlover  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:14:00pm

Gotta go start rolling the pasta - menu tonight: Spinach salad with toasted goat cheese medallions, followed by butternut squash ravioli with browned butter and sage.

Everyone be good - seems to be getting a bit testy around here.

534 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:14:02pm

So iceweasel you think drcordell's statement:

The difference is the Republican chickenhawks are the ones who clamor for invasions.

is okay? You're all good with it?
Not only did you upding it. You downdinged my rebuttal.

535 Randall Gross  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:14:15pm

re: #458 Charles

I'm really beginning to wonder about John Bolton. Why does he keep hanging out with the incredibly deranged Pamela Geller?

Paul M Weyrich was a big Bolton fan.

536 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:15:13pm

re: #529 Cannadian Club Akbar

The persons nic started with Dr. I thought my 1.25 high skool GPA would sink me.

Is he a doctor? I wanna' see his medical license.

537 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:15:29pm

re: #503 Russkilitlover

Oh, I say he's EXCEPTIONALLY skilled at that maneuver. They used to call Reagan the "Teflon President." Reagan's got nothing on the media armor plating that is still firmly in the Obama camp.

The difference was that Reagan did it without a fawning media. Fucking Donald Duck would come across as brilliant with the media adoration Obama gets.

538 Picayune  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:15:35pm

re: #290 formercorpsman

Apparently, Yes, when it comes to the candidate who promised the most transparent presidency yet! You know, the man who has not as yet released his info on:

Long Form Birth Certificate
Occidental College Records
Medical Records
Passport Files
His Articles At The University of Chicago Law School
Harvard Law Review Articles
Harvard Law School Records
Columbia University Records
Columbia University Senior Thesis
Punahou School Records
Elementary Records
Files And Schedules For His Work As An Illinois State Senator
His Client List
Illinois State Bar Records
Baptism Records
Marriage Records For His Parents
Divorce Records For His Parents
Records Of His Mother's Second Marriage
Records Of Any Adoption By His Stepfather

(although, Clinton, Bush, McCain and many others have released this sort of data, heretofore)

The same guy spending Big Bucks to prevent any of this from being made public during his most "transparent" administration.

But let one soldier be brought up on charges for refusing deployment orders on the grounds that his CIC has not "proved" to his satisfaction that he is in fact the legal CIC by submitting his legally requested docs, and, well, the Military Command just happens to drop th those same charges.

Something is just not at all that it seems in the Emerald City, these days!
("Toto, now get away form that curtain, you'll offend the All Knowing, Mighty Wizard", Dorthy.)

Narcissists can never let that mask slip, or it's "Help, I am melting!"

539 pat  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:15:46pm

The $10,000 reward should make a nice retirement bonus for Ms Okuba of the Hawaii Department of Health.

540 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:15:52pm

re: #481 Charles

Bet if you asked her, Charles, you'd get the Seinfeld response:
' They're real, and they're spectacular'.

541 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:16:00pm

Dammit, Charles, you made me look. I swore I'd never go to Artless Mugs again...

This picture is just downright frightening: atlasshrugs2000[dot]typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c60bf53ef01157151d7e4970c-800wi

(Replace [dot] with [.], people - I won't sully the blog with a live link.)

Since when do eyebrows flow down in a perfectly curved line to the root of the nose? I've never seen that before. Not even Joan Rivers or Michael Jackson went for that. Looks like Alien is about to break through the human veneer. (Talking about her, not him.)

If he doesn't have nightmares about this, he's not the man I thought he was.

And "comkete" video - I see she still can't figure out how to use spell check when she's drunk.

Somehow I don't want to hear what Bolton has to say about Sarah Palin. Wtih Aklas suprpoting her, how can aynnoe sitll tkae Sraah serouisly?

542 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:16:03pm

re: #470 iceweasel

I have noted that most people who smoke a lot of pot become less and less flexible, mentally. Some seem much slower and more dull as the years go by.

543 ryannon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:16:10pm

re: #45 MandyManners

Does every Lizard know where his or her birth certificate is?

After 10 pm, you better believe it.

544 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:16:12pm

re: #531 Empire1

Thanks, Mandy -- I value your opinion, and that's three votes the same way. :)

The Kid's been reading part of my dad's sci-fi library this summer--it goes back to the first editions of all kinds of magazines.

545 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:16:22pm

re: #408 Russkilitlover

Wow. That's pretty incredible. Do you have backup info? I'd be curious.

Aha, I found it...
The Accidental Billionaires: The Founding of Facebook A Tale of Sex, Money, Genius and Betrayal

The story is that one of the inventors couldn't get into one of the secret clubs so he started his own exclusive club online (which became facebook or myspace, I forget). Either way it's an interesting story and the author did a lot of research into Ivy league culture for the book. Seems pretty cool.

546 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:16:23pm

re: #532 Salamantis

Tell that to Carl Sagan. Or Winston Churchill. Or Friedrich Nietszche. Or Thomas Jefferson. Or John F. Kennedy. Or Bill Clinton. Or Francis Ford Coppola. Or Robert Altman. Or Louis Armstrong. Or Michael Bloomberg. Or Norman Mailer. Or Ted Turner. Or Robert Mitchum. Or Bill Murray. Or Jack Nicholson. Or Bob Dylan. Or Neil Young. Or John Lennon. Or Conan O'Brien. Or Tom Brokaw. Or Harrison Ford. Or Steven King. Or Newt Gingrich.

Didn't you get the memo, Sal? Those people are dullards, and not just slowthinking, but slowthinking dullards!!11!

I got the memo. Unfortunately I used it when I ran out of rolling papers and my short term memory is shot. ///

547 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:16:32pm

re: #532 Salamantis

Tell that to Carl Sagan. Or Winston Churchill. Or Friedrich Nietszche. Or Thomas Jefferson. Or John F. Kennedy. Or Bill Clinton. Or Francis Ford Coppola. Or Robert Altman. Or Louis Armstrong. Or Michael Bloomberg. Or Norman Mailer. Or Ted Turner. Or Robert Mitchum. Or Bill Murray. Or Jack Nicholson. Or Bob Dylan. Or Neil Young. Or John Lennon. Or Conan O'Brien. Or Tom Brokaw. Or Harrison Ford. Or Steven King. Or Newt Gingrich.

William F Buckley was not a slow-thinking dullard.

548 pat  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:16:41pm

Fox reviewing Muslim terrorists in USA. Impressive numbers.

549 Thoughtful  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:16:55pm

Perhaps the simplest explanation for Obama _NOT_ releasing an original is that so many of his opponents are tying themselves in knots -- he can make them look like conspiracy-theory fools at the time it benefits him most.

550 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:16:56pm
551 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:17:27pm
552 opnion  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:17:31pm

re: #470 iceweasel

It's normal to smoke pot at uni or in high school, and smoking pot, even habitually, doesn't automatically make a person a 'slow thinking dullard'.

By the way, did you know that 'slow-thinking dullard' is redundant? Perhaps you're smoking too much pot to remember that? ///

I wish I never would have mentioned that BHO was a high school stoner.
Pot is not what he meant necessarily, he talked about Coke.
Hell pot should be legal.
My point was that he says that he went through high school stoned with poor grades & still got an academic scholarship
Smoke em if ya got em.

553 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:17:52pm

re: #538 Picayune

Apparently, Yes, when it comes to the candidate who promised the most transparent presidency yet! You know, the man who has not as yet released his info on:

Long Form Birth Certificate
Occidental College Records
Medical Records
Passport Files
His Articles At The University of Chicago Law School
Harvard Law Review Articles
Harvard Law School Records
Columbia University Records
Columbia University Senior Thesis
Punahou School Records
Elementary Records
Files And Schedules For His Work As An Illinois State Senator
His Client List
Illinois State Bar Records
Baptism Records
Marriage Records For His Parents
Divorce Records For His Parents
Records Of His Mother's Second Marriage
Records Of Any Adoption By His Stepfather

(although, Clinton, Bush, McCain and many others have released this sort of data, heretofore)

The same guy spending Big Bucks to prevent any of this from being made public during his most "transparent" administration.

But let one soldier be brought up on charges for refusing deployment orders on the grounds that his CIC has not "proved" to his satisfaction that he is in fact the legal CIC by submitting his legally requested docs, and, well, the Military Command just happens to drop th those same charges.

Something is just not at all that it seems in the Emerald City, these days!
("Toto, now get away form that curtain, you'll offend the All Knowing, Mighty Wizard", Dorthy.)

Narcissists can never let that mask slip, or it's "Help, I am melting!"


You are aware that fire can melt steel, yes?

554 tradewind  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:17:59pm

re: #549 Thoughtful

That's always been my first reaction.
He's gonna need a lot of distraction.

555 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:18:35pm

re: #536 MandyManners

Is he a doctor? I wanna' see his medical license.

Dr denier!!!

556 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:19:06pm

re: #458 Charles

I'm really beginning to wonder about John Bolton. Why does he keep hanging out with the incredibly deranged Pamela Geller?

I think Bolton might be a nut too. He was on Glenn Beck recently discussing the new world order...
Glenn Beck With Neocon John Bolton On Global Take Over (New World Order)

557 Ben Hur  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:19:24pm

re: #532 Salamantis

Tell that to Carl Sagan. Or Winston Churchill. Or Friedrich Nietszche. Or Thomas Jefferson. Or John F. Kennedy. Or Bill Clinton. Or Francis Ford Coppola. Or Robert Altman. Or Louis Armstrong. Or Michael Bloomberg. Or Norman Mailer. Or Ted Turner. Or Robert Mitchum. Or Bill Murray. Or Jack Nicholson. Or Bob Dylan. Or Neil Young. Or John Lennon. Or Conan O'Brien. Or Tom Brokaw. Or Harrison Ford. Or Steven King. Or Newt Gingrich.

ABE LINCOLN!

BBL.

558 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:19:39pm

re: #555 Cannadian Club Akbar

Dr denier!!!

Is that anything like Dr. Denton's?

559 Buck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:19:54pm

re: #406 iceweasel

Exactly. Even the most dedicated Obama hater should realise that the time for digging into that stuff is over.
And also, Hillary's team doubtless found everything, and would have deployed everything to crush him.

And finally, it's not like there's a shortage of real issues to criticise Obama on.

Correct.

I know a guy I will not name. He is a VERY good friend of the Clintons. He raised millions of dollars for Hillary. When Bill travels he almost always takes this guy along for shits and giggles... There is NO DOUBT that this guy would have had a fantastic job under Hillary, maybe even a Czar position.

Let me tell you that no one, not even Hillary, hates Obama more...

BUT he knows when to let go of the hate (and when to bring it back).

He has already been to the Whitehouse to play basketball with the One. Keep you friends close and your enemies closer...

They are just waiting for Obama to self destruct... the inexperience thing will do it. It is just a matter of time.

560 Randall Gross  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:20:44pm

Bolton was in CNP iirc as well

561 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:21:47pm

re: #538 Picayune

3/4 of what you list, IMHO, does not make a relevant argument for any candidate's potential performance in office.

I realize the contradiction when comparing his transparency quotes, but things like his elementary records, his parent's marriage or divorce documents, or Baptism records are really not relevant as to the office of the Presidency.

I look at this no differently than when a nomination to the Supreme Court is examined. We want a picture of what that person will perform like, pertinent to the position they will uphold.

I see the POTUS as being in the same neighborhood. Any potential president.

562 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:21:47pm

re: #559 Buck

They are just waiting for Obama to self destruct... the inexperience thing will do it. It is just a matter of time.

It's happening before our eyes. Don't blink.

563 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:22:12pm

re: #534 unrealizedviewpoint

So iceweasel you think drcordell's statement:

is okay? You're all good with it?
Not only did you upding it. You downdinged my rebuttal.

I will quote Bill Whittle:

The Chickenhawk argument goes something like this: anyone who favors military action should not be taken seriously unless they themselves are willing to go and do the actual fighting. This particular piece of work is an anti-war crowd attempt to silence the debate by ruling that the other side is out of bounds for the duration. Like all ad hominem attacks, (argumentum ad hominem means "argument against the person") it is an act of intellectual surrender. The person who employs an ad hominem attack is admitting they cannot win the debate on merit, and hope to chuck the entire thing out the window by attacking the messenger. This is a logical fallacy of the first order, because the messenger is not the message.

Later on he says:

If you accept the Chickenhawk argument "that only those actually willing to go and fight have a legitimate opinion on the subject of war" then that means that any decision to go to war must rest exclusively in the hands of the military. Is that what this person really wants? To abandon civilian control of the military? That's the box they have trapped themselves in with this argument. Now to be perfectly honest, I think Robert Heinlein made a very compelling case for just this line of reasoning in Starship Troopers (the book, not the clueless projected travesty). Heinlein said that the only people who should be allowed to vote are those that have served in the military, since only they are willing to make the ultimate sacrifice on behalf of the state. I don't agree with that. I think civilian control of the military has been one of the pillars of our nation's success, and it has withstood the test of both World Wars and Civil ones. But that is the world you are stuck in when you toss that little Chickenhawk grenade.

564 opnion  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:22:24pm

re: #530 albusteve

apologists will shift the question back to you...move the goalposts...and call you an extremists for asking...in other words no, they have no problem with it

Your point is well taken.

565 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:22:59pm

re: #470 iceweasel

By the way, did you know that 'slow-thinking dullard' is redundant? Perhaps you're smoking too much pot to remember that? ///

Not only redundant, but pleonastically repetitive, too, also.

Which is often a sign of too much alcohol. Pot tends to promote wordplay, alcohol makes you monotonous.

(((iceweasel)))

566 J.S.  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:22:59pm

re: #438 Charles

I recall, many years ago, reading in a philosophy course of the person who alleges that he has on his shoulders a second, invisible head...and nothing can be said to "prove" that this was not the case...(it was an example of ad hoc argumentation...ditto for the "I've got a twin brother, even though he doesn't show up nor do I have any evidence to support my claim -- but, I just know he exists...")

567 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:23:07pm

re: #542 Dianna

I have noted that most people who smoke a lot of pot become less and less flexible, mentally. Some seem much slower and more dull as the years go by.

I'll tell the truth here: i think pot on the whole is far less harmful than alcohol, and smoking pot every day after work is no more harmful (and often much LESS harmful) than having a glass of wine.

I do know some people who have problems with pot, but these are people who are like the pot equivalent of serious alcoholics: they are high all day every day. I know a couple who are like what you describe.

But pot is far less harmful than alcohol abuse, and the people with problems that I'm thinking of are people who wake and bake and smoke all day, and have done so for years.

Alcohol is a far more dangerous and destructive drug.

568 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:23:09pm

re: #558 MandyManners

Is that anything like Dr. Denton's?

I don't know who that is. But I am naive. I know. I was told so.

569 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:23:19pm

re: #440 buzzsawmonkey

Smoking pot doesn't lower your IQ? I don't know what your criteria for that are, but habitual pot smokers are the slowest-thinking dullards I have ever encountered.

Correlation isn't causality. It's just as likely that dullards gravitate toward pot more than bright people as that bright people are turned into dullards by pot. The latter, in fact, seems more likely, given that not all pot smokers are dullards.

570 Eowyn2  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:23:38pm

Nirthers need to get a grip on the important things that the Obama Presidency is Changing and HOPE we survive.

571 Picayune  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:23:44pm

re: #553 Ben Hur

Yep, when, as a Rigger in a shipyard, I've seen it done many times. That's why curved steel floats, and flat steel sinks. (But don't tell the troothers, right?)

572 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:24:01pm

re: #560 Thanos

Bolton was in CNP iirc as well

[Link: www.sourcewatch.org...]

573 itellu3times  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:24:16pm

re: #532 Salamantis

Tell that to Carl Sagan. Or Winston Churchill. Or Friedrich Nietszche. Or Thomas Jefferson. Or John F. Kennedy. Or Bill Clinton. Or Francis Ford Coppola. Or Robert Altman. Or Louis Armstrong. Or Michael Bloomberg. Or Norman Mailer. Or Ted Turner. Or Robert Mitchum. Or Bill Murray. Or Jack Nicholson. Or Bob Dylan. Or Neil Young. Or John Lennon. Or Conan O'Brien. Or Tom Brokaw. Or Harrison Ford. Or Steven King. Or Newt Gingrich.

Most everyone does their best work before the age of 25.

/ugly thought though that is for many of us who are over (ahem) 25.

574 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:24:29pm

re: #563 ArchangelMichael


Mr. Whittle is awesome. That is exactly what I was thinking of when I read that post.

575 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:25:03pm

re: #562 unrealizedviewpoint

Except the narrative keeps changing. Seems like the harder 0bama is screwing the pooch re: foreign policy, the economy, 0bamacare...hell, even a simple comment regarding the police response to a reported break-in in suburban Boston, the more we hear about the nirthers or the Limbaugh/Powell spat.

576 Rusky123  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:25:17pm

Oh come on!

Let me bring an example.
Let's say that I was applying for Harvard (or any other school that is highly competitive). Instead of mailing them my official school transcript with my application, like I am supposed to do, I print out a page that says:

Grades: All A's without exception.
Grade point average: 4.0.
Etc.

I then make sure to list all the things that are necessary on the transcript.
That is absurd! It doesn't matter that I have all the necessary important information - the fact that I refused to send in my transcript is enough to invalidate my application!
It is the same thing here. Mr. Obama ran for president and refused to reveal any official documents pertaining to himself. Any other man doing the same thing would have lost immediately or been ousted for failure to produce documents - but not our Lord and Holy Savior Barack Hussein Obama.
What I am saying is not that Obama is not a citizen, or that he is not natural born. And I am also not claiming that he is hiding something. What I am saying is that there is something terribly wrong with the fact that we elected as our President a man who refused to show his official birth certificate and college transcript.

And before any of you start shouting that I am racist, or that I am wrong - just thing (and think seriously and hard) what would have happened if George Bush had refused to show his birth certificate? Just think about it.

577 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:25:22pm

re: #553 Ben Hur

You are aware that fire can melt steel, yes?

Actually it can't if its from wood, plastic, or jet fuel burning but what the dumbass troofers overlook is that it can make steel very soft in that temperature range. Soft enough to be unable to support a building for sure.

578 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:25:29pm

re: #569 SixDegrees

Correlation isn't causality. It's just as likely that dullards gravitate toward pot more than bright people as that bright people are turned into dullards by pot. The latter, in fact, seems more likely, given that not all pot smokers are dullards.

Right! there is a great scene in a movie where someone tells a girl "don't smoke pot all day, it will destroy your ambition" and she says, "What if my ambition is to smoke pot all day?"

579 Randall Gross  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:26:35pm

re: #556 Killgore Trout

I think Bolton might be a nut too. He was on Glenn Beck recently discussing the new world order...
Glenn Beck With Neocon John Bolton On Global Take Over (New World Order)

[Video]

CNP.

Skousen was also CNP

580 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:26:41pm

re: #570 Eowyn2

Nirthers need to get a grip on the important things that the Obama Presidency is Changing and HOPE we survive.

So all this HOPE simply means survive?

581 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:26:47pm

re: #533 Russkilitlover

Gotta go start rolling the pasta - menu tonight: Spinach salad with toasted goat cheese medallions, followed by butternut squash ravioli with browned butter and sage.

Everyone be good - seems to be getting a bit testy around here.

That sounds like heaven! Are you sending the recipe to reine? (If not you can send it to me)

582 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:27:03pm

re: #576 Rusky123

Hellooo?! There's a picture of the fucking birth certificate on this page!

583 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:27:18pm

Nirther queen bee Orly Taitz on the Colbert Report:

584 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:28:06pm

re: #374 re: #522 Dianna

I'm avoiding being nasty. Because I'm a female, and if I start being nasty, it must be because I'm jealous. Or just being catty.

The crocodilian expressions: those I agree with.

I make no comment on the others. Except to note that I believe in the force of my character. I've always needed to.

As have I.

585 Rancher  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:28:42pm

This story would be a nonstarter if it weren't for Obama's penchant for secrecy, especially in the context of supposedly being "the digital, transparent presidency". His grades from Occidental College and Harvard are secret. I would love to know if he ever took an economics class. His theses and publications are secret. The campaign revealed Michelle's theses and the insight into how she viewed America was very insightful, but from the candidate himself? Shut up.

586 debutaunt  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:28:44pm

re: #582 Sharmuta

Hellooo?! There's a picture of the fucking birth certificate on this page, Butthead!

/sorry

587 Empire1  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:28:48pm

re: #353 Dianna

Post a note and start doing reviews, I think.

That's 4-0 for staying put. Thanks!

588 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:28:58pm

re: #575 Fenway_Nation

Except the narrative keeps changing. Seems like the harder 0bama is screwing the pooch re: foreign policy, the economy, 0bamacare...hell, even a simple comment regarding the police response to a reported break-in in suburban Boston, the more we hear about the nirthers or the Limbaugh/Powell spat.

That's us blinking and not paying attention. In the end he'll be exposed for all to see, just like Jimmah.

589 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:29:25pm

re: #565 Cato the Elder

Not only redundant, but pleonastically repetitive, too, also.

Which is often a sign of too much alcohol. Pot tends to promote wordplay, alcohol makes you monotonous.

(((iceweasel)))

Hee. Liking the pleonastically redundant bit. So what are you drinking?

((loves me some cato))

Btw, i have a fakeish latin phrase I could do with some help with. How are you?

590 Athos  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:29:32pm

re: #582 Sharmuta

Hellooo?! There's a picture of the fucking birth certificate on this page!

That should leave a mark.

591 Sabba Hillel  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:29:56pm

This makes it more believable that the reason he is refusing to actually release a photostat of the original is one of two reasons.
1. The longer he refuses and the more he gets the "nirthers" to scream, the more he discredits any sensible opposition. This way he can distract us from the real reasons to oppose him and try to convince everyone that only kooks and nots would dare be against anything that he does.

2. As an arrogant, narcissistic, idealogue he will refuse to do anything that might appear that someone is forcing him to do anything. If this is true, then the more people yell and pressure, the more adamant he becomes in refusing to let anyone see it.

592 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:30:01pm

re: #576 Rusky123

Mr. Obama ran for president and refused to reveal any official documents pertaining to himself.

He produced all the necessary documentation required to run for and hold the job of President.

593 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:30:28pm

re: #579 Thanos

Skousen was also CNP


Yeesh.

594 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:30:45pm

re: #582 Sharmuta

595 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:31:26pm

re: #586 debutaunt

You're so cute.

596 Buck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:31:44pm

re: #576 Rusky123


It is the same thing here. Mr. Obama ran for president and refused to reveal any official documents pertaining to himself.

You see, you built a house on shaky ground.

HE DID SUBMIT HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE. The state created the document. That makes it his official document pertaining to himself.

597 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:31:50pm

re: #588 unrealizedviewpoint


Doesn't do any of us a goddamned bit of good if the public starts waking up to the fact that Emperor 0bama has no clothes...say...sometime on the afternoon of Jan 21st 2013.

598 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:32:01pm

re: #582 Sharmuta

Hellooo?! There's a picture of the fucking birth certificate on this page!

But Shar - I just noticed - that very picture raises more doubts.

Right there at the bottom it says ANY ALTERATIONS INVALIDATE THIS CERTIFICATE.

But the certificate has been altered. The serial no. has been blacked out.

Therefore, Obama was born in Mindanao.

Can't you see? People, can't you see?! When will this country wake up to the terrible fraud we've been sold???/?

599 Rancher  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:32:17pm

re: #588 unrealizedviewpoint

That's us blinking and not paying attention. In the end he'll be exposed for all to see, just like Jimmah.

Yes, after a crises develops that lasts through the election. Ironic since a crises got him elected even though Clinton, Franks, and Dodd were the chief architects for that crises.

600 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:32:33pm

re: #576 Rusky123

just thing

Gonna' hafta' put on my thinging cap.

601 debutaunt  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:32:38pm

re: #595 Sharmuta

You're so cute.

I thought I had bolded the butthead part, but ... no.

602 Picayune  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:33:17pm

re: #561 formercorpsman

"I realize the contradiction when comparing his transparency quotes..."

So, why all the secrecy from Barry Bamboozle, "Mr. Transparency"? To make all detractors look like fools? Is that really why the Military Command dropped the charges? I don't think so. It's just Audacious!

But, yes, I agree, the same standard "must" be applied to all candidates, and specifically the one stated in the US Constitution.

603 Dianna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:33:25pm

OK, out for the night.

No one is to decide to artificially enhance anything while I'm gone!

(that is a joke. If you can't tell that it's a joke, smoke some pot and stare at your hand for a while. It will come to you.)

BTW, that last bit was a joke, too.

604 Empire1  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:33:50pm

re: #371 eon

Just MHO, but based on the behavior of search engines, you'd probably be better off starting a new one. If you have a pre-existing blog on one subject, and change to a new one, Google, etc., will tend to define searches on the basis of previous archived or cached pages. Which means you are less likely to be getting "pinged" by searches from people looking for a blog devoted to SF/Fantasy literature, and more likely to get search results from the previous category, so to speak.

/Just based on my personal experience with Google searches.

cheers

eon

Hmm ... I don't know much about search engines (except the basics of using one), so that never occurred to me. I'm not too sure whether I should be very concerned about it, though, because even at its best, the Garden wasn't terribly active.

I do appreciate the input a lot -- thanks!

605 yochanan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:33:52pm

[Link: www.chicagotribune.com...]

major terrorist attack in spain no one died given the size of the bomb that is a major suprise.

606 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:34:22pm

re: #603 Dianna

OK, out for the night.

No one is to decide to artificially enhance anything while I'm gone!

(that is a joke. If you can't tell that it's a joke, smoke some pot and stare at your hand for a while. It will come to you.)

BTW, that last bit was a joke, too.

I CAN SEE THE VEINS IN MY HANDDD

607 itellu3times  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:34:50pm

re: #604 Empire1

heh-he.

what?

608 Picayune  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:34:53pm

re: #575 Fenway_Nation

Damage control!

609 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:35:17pm

re: #597 Fenway_Nation

Doesn't do any of us a goddamned bit of good if the public starts waking up to the fact that Emperor 0bama has no clothes...say...sometime on the afternoon of Jan 21st 2013.

They need awaken only a tad earlier, November 06, 2012

610 Silvergirl  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:35:22pm

re: #606 MandyManners

I CAN SEE THE VEINS IN MY HANDDD

Did you see that awful photo of Madonna posted in the overnight thread?

611 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:35:38pm

re: #597 Fenway_Nation

Doesn't do any of us a goddamned bit of good if the public starts waking up to the fact that Emperor 0bama has no clothes...say...sometime on the afternoon of Jan 21st 2013.

Don't worry, the end of the world is a month before that.

/

612 itellu3times  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:35:46pm

oops, #607 was supposed to respond to stoner #603, oh well, heh-he, what?

613 Rancher  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:35:50pm

I've had to produce a copy of my birth certificate for my current job, but right on the document it say do not duplicate. What relevance that has to this discussion I've no idea, waiting for five o'clock to go home I guess.

614 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:36:07pm

re: #605 yochanan

[Link: www.chicagotribune.com...]

major terrorist attack in spain no one died given the size of the bomb that is a major suprise.

Why are they blaming ETA?

615 Buck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:36:24pm

re: #605 yochanan

[Link: www.chicagotribune.com...]

major terrorist attack in spain no one died given the size of the bomb that is a major suprise.

But But, didn't they leave Iraq as instructed?

616 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:36:45pm

re: #610 Silvergirl

Did you see that awful photo of Madonna posted in the overnight thread?

It is strange.

617 yochanan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:36:45pm

re: #606 MandyManners

smoke some weed and get the munchies WHO HAS TIME TO LOOK AT THERE HANDS the hands are to shovel FUDS into the mouth.

618 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:37:18pm

re: #606 MandyManners

I CAN SEE THE VEINS IN MY HANDDD

That reminds me:

Craig: "Whoa I can hear my heart beating..."

Smokey: "That's what its supposed to do!"

619 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:37:28pm

re: #610 Silvergirl

re: #616 MandyManners


Look- I can only post so many Jennifer Tilly pictures to offset that.

620 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:37:34pm

re: #617 yochanan

smoke some weed and get the munchies WHO HAS TIME TO LOOK AT THERE HANDS the hands are to shovel FUDS into the mouth.

You don't need hands to shove your face into a pile of HoHos. Or, a sack of Cheetos.

621 Eowyn2  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:37:41pm

re: #538 Picayune

Apparently, Yes, when it comes to the candidate who promised the most transparent presidency yet! You know, the man who has not as yet released his info on:
blockquote>

First off, lets take a look at some of the things you listed.
Baptismal Records - I don't know where my kids baptismal records are off hand. I know they don't have them and they are somewhere in storage.
Both Marriage and Divorce records are kept at the local court house. If you want proof of either or, you are going to have to check the county where such things occured. Is it worth your time to dig through the trash?
Adoption papers - If there are any, assuming it actually happened, the papers would be sealed due to time of the papers. Is it important whether or not he was adopted?
State Bar Records - generally available with request. so request them
School records - do we really care that his 4th grade teacher found him 'bright but lazy' like 80% of the 4th grade class?
Law review articles - they should be the easiest to find, The Harvard Law Review isn't exactly a closed door publication.
College transcripts: We already know that it doesn't matter in the long run.
Long Form Birth Certificate: Zombie has done tremendous research on this and I am satisfied. You can check into the undead's research at Zombietime.

All this nirther stuff is going to get in the way of the government siezing full control of the health care provider's networks. Lets go after what it is worth going after!!!

622 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:37:51pm

re: #605 yochanan

[Link: www.chicagotribune.com...]

major terrorist attack in spain no one died given the size of the bomb that is a major suprise.

The attack was blamed on the Basque separatist group ETA.

Isn't that the same group that bombed the trains a few years ago?

/oh, wait...

623 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:38:05pm

re: #618 ArchangelMichael

That reminds me:

Craig: "Whoa I can hear my heart beating..."

Smokey: "That's what its supposed to do!"

Musta' missed that movie.

624 yochanan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:38:06pm

re: #614 MandyManners

location and target of the blast.

625 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:38:09pm

re: #622 Alouette

Emphatically no.

626 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:38:12pm

re: #606 MandyManners

I CAN SEE THE VEINS IN MY HANDDD

MY GOD! IT's FULL OF CZARS!

/2001, Obama joke, etc., etc.

627 Rancher  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:38:59pm

re: #614 MandyManners

Why are they blaming ETA?

ETA got blamed for the Madrid bombings IIRC. Doesn't offend Muslims.

628 Eowyn2  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:39:00pm

re: #580 unrealizedviewpoint

So all this HOPE simply means survive?

yep yep yep

629 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:39:02pm

re: #624 yochanan

location and target of the blast.

But, ETA always phones ahead.

630 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:39:20pm

re: #610 Silvergirl

Did you see that awful photo of Madonna posted in the overnight thread?

Had her posters as a young lad. Now I am older. I don't need to see an older Madonna. But I also quit the pop culture thing about 7 years ago.

631 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:39:29pm

re: #611 ArchangelMichael

Don't worry, the end of the world is a month before that.

/

Reminds me of the joke about all the hoopla over the Mayan Calendar and the end of the world in 2012 being due to the fact that the shlub making the calendar just got tired and said 'Fuck it, I'm done with this shit'...

632 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:39:30pm

Gotta' go make a salad to go with the pizza. bbl

633 formercorpsman  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:40:53pm

I have to hit the road.

That Colbert Report video is brutal. My head hurts.

634 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:41:02pm

re: #589 iceweasel

Hee. Liking the pleonastically redundant bit. So what are you drinking?

((loves me some cato))

Btw, i have a fakeish latin phrase I could do with some help with. How are you?

Right now, mocha. I may hit the hard stuff (vinho verde) later, if this oppressive heat keeps up.

I will admit that my sense of humor has been artificially enhanced by constant reading. I know, it's not fair. They may have to hold congressional hearings about that.

Moi, c'est bien. Send me the dog-Latin. I'll Catofy it.

635 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:42:44pm

re: #629 MandyManners

But, ETA always phones ahead.

From the link:

The minister said the van had used false license plates and had probably been stolen in France. He said no warning call had been received, but said this was not so unusual for ETA when it attacked the Civil Guard.

Apparently not.

636 Render  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:43:31pm

re: #368 drcordell

Weak.

F-102's were in the SE Asia theatre from 1962 to 1968 when all F-102's were withdrawn back to the US.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

George W Bush graduated from flight school in Nov of 1969 and began his flight training for the F-102 in December of 1969. That training lasted until June of 1970.

The F-102 was the single most dangerous fighter aircraft to fly in the USAF inventory for its entire career.

No, W was not the worlds greatest pilot, or even mildly good at it. That means what?

COOL
BREEZE,
R

637 Picayune  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:43:46pm

re: #621 Eowyn2

Oh, I agree, focus on the here and now, defeat Obama Care.

I think you are seeing the tress and not the forest of my post. It's the totality of all the info that remains undisclosed. Why all the secrecy from he who ran as Mr. Transparency? What's the Military Command up to by dropping the charges pertinent to the topic? Why is this man given a pass on Everything?

638 yochanan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:44:20pm

re: #629 MandyManners

currently Spain is run by leftist of course they will try to blame ETA they should at least wait to prove who did it before they say who did it.

ETA is a terrorist group that has killed 800+ people so it could be them the biggest surprise is the size of the blast and amount of damage and no one died. miracle for sure.

639 kynna  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:45:05pm

re: #549 Thoughtful

Perhaps the simplest explanation for Obama _NOT_ releasing an original is that so many of his opponents are tying themselves in knots -- he can make them look like conspiracy-theory fools at the time it benefits him most.

I think the last part of your post is the side benefit. As I posted earlier, my original BC got lost at some point. I had to send a request for a certificate similar to the Obama has. It doesn't look like the original BC, but it is one.

But having people willfully deny the truth presented to them is a little bonus for Obama and he can wrap all dissenters in the mantle of crazy. It's probably been the greatest success of 0's presidency.

640 Render  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:45:21pm

re: #583 Charles

She still pushing/representing/behind that asshole buddyfucker excuse for an Army Major?

DOUCHE
BAGS,
R

641 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:45:39pm

re: #638 yochanan

I forsee the Guarda Civil doing things to ETA members that would have the human rights groups shrieking...harder than usual.

642 opnion  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:46:12pm

If we are still talking about pot, I have never seen people with more reverence for it than Jamaicans (I don't mean Rastas)
I was waling behing a gut in Ocho Rios who was enjoying some local ganja.
A traffic cop walks over & takes the joint out of his hand & takes a hit.
Cop gave it back smiled & said,"I just want to know dat you got good shit Mhan."

643 yochanan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:47:43pm

re: #641 Fenway_Nation

Franco would not even asked questions dead ETA problem solved.

not that i am a fan of Franco or any other fascist. problem is the wussies in euroland right now. not to mention d.c.

644 Rancher  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:48:09pm

Is there even an original or do they just generate a birth certificate from the data in a data bank? The "original" would have been the one given to the parents and could have been lost.

645 jantjepietje  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:48:20pm

someone just sent me this clip

is this real? does that woman not realise how she is mocked by colbert?
I thought they hired an actor that resembled her when I just started watching this srsly

646 Empire1  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:48:45pm

Thanks to everyone who answered my blog question -- I've given all of you thank-you updings in appreciation. :)

647 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:50:11pm

re: #642 opnion

If we are still talking about pot, I have never seen people with more reverence for it than Jamaicans (I don't mean Rastas)
I was waling behing a gut in Ocho Rios who was enjoying some local ganja.
A traffic cop walks over & takes the joint out of his hand & takes a hit.
Cop gave it back smiled & said,"I just want to know dat you got good shit Mhan."

it's deep into their culture...say what you will...like hash in Afghanistan or Moracco

648 Render  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:50:35pm

re: #481 Charles

Hey now, not everybody is the guitar player, ya know...

GROUPIE
LAWS,
R

649 opnion  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:51:51pm

re: #647 albusteve

it's deep into their culture...say what you will...like hash in Afghanistan or Moracco

Outside of Kingston Jamaicans are a mellow group. Ganja, overproof rum & Ragee,. PARTY!

650 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:53:12pm

re: #649 opnion

Outside of Kingston Jamaicans are a mellow group. Ganja, overproof rum & Ragee,. PARTY!

Kingston and Spanish Town are a nightmare...pass through, keep going...I love Jamaica otherwise

651 opnion  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:57:01pm

re: #650 albusteve

Kingston and Spanish Town are a nightmare...pass through, keep going...I love Jamaica otherwise

Your spot on. Jamaica is a great place to kick back.
Stay away from Kingston, where you can get seriously killed.
Another thing, never ever rent a car in Jamaica, ever.

652 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:57:38pm

You know what?

My understanding has always been that if you're born to a Frenchwoman and a Yemeni man in the skies over America on a crossover flight without ever touching down on American soil, you're still eligible for American citizenship. If you're born to two underage illegal aliens on American soil, you're an American.

End of story.

653 Buck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:58:44pm

re: #368 drcordell

The man voluntarily enlisted into the Air National Guard during a goddamn war. I'm sure they could have found something for him to do in Vietnam if he weren't a sacred cow.

Do you think he was the only one in the Air National Guard at that time? Were they all sacred cows? And all the people joining today, during two wars... are they all sacred cows? All rich kids avoiding service?

And yes, I have seen Bush's transcript. His 4-year average was a 77. This isn't a disputed fact. Source

And what Gore scored or Bill Bradley scored I really could give a flying fuck about. Gore was the son of fabulously wealthy and powerful parents as well. The question at hand is, how did someone with a C average get into the most prestigious business school in the nation. And the answer is because he was rich and a Bush. Duh.

Harvard Degree, Yale Degree, Pilots wings, Governor of Texas (twice) and POTUS, not once, but twice.

Yep, seems like a classic rich slacker playboy.

654 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:58:58pm

re: #651 opnion

Your spot on. Jamaica is a great place to kick back.
Stay away from Kingston, where you can get seriously killed.
Another thing, never ever rent a car in Jamaica, ever.

Johnny Cash had a house in Jamaica. His song "Worried Man" came out of an encounter with a Jamaican panhandler.

Is seriously killed worse than whacked, or not as bad?

655 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:59:15pm

re: #634 Cato the Elder

Right now, mocha. I may hit the hard stuff (vinho verde) later, if this oppressive heat keeps up.

I will admit that my sense of humor has been artificially enhanced by constant reading. I know, it's not fair. They may have to hold congressional hearings about that.

Moi, c'est bien. Send me the dog-Latin. I'll Catofy it.

damn. I thought I had it... a load of classics geeks were fighting over the best way to say something. Shall send asap.

656 VegasRick  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 3:59:23pm

re: #652 Cato the Elder

You know what?

My understanding has always been that if you're born to a Frenchwoman and a Yemeni man in the skies over America on a crossover flight without ever touching down on American soil, you're still eligible for American citizenship. If you're born to two underage illegal aliens on American soil, you're an American.

End of story.

Lovely.

657 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:01:51pm

re: #654 Cato the Elder

Johnny Cash had a house in Jamaica. His song "Worried Man" came out of an encounter with a Jamaican panhandler.

Is seriously killed worse than whacked, or not as bad?

What about buying the farm? Riding the pale horse? Worse, or better?

658 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:02:31pm

Weird Nut Drooly found a 1961 Hawaii birth certificate and sure enough -- the form is identical to the 1962 form.

[Link: www.wnd.com...]

WND, of course, gets even more whacked out than usual trying to keep the conspiracy alive despite this.

659 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:03:01pm

re: #651 opnion

Your spot on. Jamaica is a great place to kick back.
Stay away from Kingston, where you can get seriously killed.
Another thing, never ever rent a car in Jamaica, ever.

I've rented cars down there for thirty some years...from the wobbly locals to the international companies...I can't get around with out one...but with the right hand drive and the roundabouts and the local death wish maniacs...I have stories, I could write a book, easily...it's not for everyone...Dirk Pitt, James Bond, albusteve...those kinds of guys

660 Digital Display  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:03:47pm

re: #657 iceweasel

What about buying the farm? Riding the pale horse? Worse, or better?

Good evening Ice! Pushing up daisy's? dirt nap?
/i got nothing
*wink*

661 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:03:49pm

re: #652 Cato the Elder

You know what?

My understanding has always been that if you're born to a Frenchwoman and a Yemeni man in the skies over America on a crossover flight without ever touching down on American soil, you're still eligible for American citizenship. If you're born to two underage illegal aliens on American soil, you're an American.

End of story.

Correct. In fact, this last situation is one of the thorniest issues in dealing with our illegal immigration problem. Yes, there are lots of illegal aliens living in the United States. And lots of them have had children here. That makes their children American citizens. Arresting the parents and shipping them back wherever they came from may sound appealing, but it will result in either the forcible separation of families or the unwilling deportation of legitimate citizens. Not a pleasant situation.

662 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:04:58pm

re: #654 Cato the Elder

Johnny Cash had a house in Jamaica. His song "Worried Man" came out of an encounter with a Jamaican panhandler.

Is seriously killed worse than whacked, or not as bad?

he had a million dollar home on Half Moon Country Club outside Mo Bay...those folks have everything done for them and if he ran into a panhandler it was probably by accident!...

663 ryannon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:04:58pm

re: #657 iceweasel

What about buying the farm? Riding the pale horse? Worse, or better?

Being a world-class slacker myself, I prefer Dirt Nap.

664 VioletTiger  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:05:38pm

Hi lizards.
Drive-by post--waiting to get on a plane, can't wait to get home.

The Nirther Infestation continues. We need a big can of RAID!

665 Not From Holland  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:05:53pm

Where is Caucasia?

(just kidding (kinda))

666 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:06:23pm

re: #661 SixDegrees

Correct. In fact, this last situation is one of the thorniest issues in dealing with our illegal immigration problem. Yes, there are lots of illegal aliens living in the United States. And lots of them have had children here. That makes their children American citizens. Arresting the parents and shipping them back wherever they came from may sound appealing, but it will result in either the forcible separation of families or the unwilling deportation of legitimate citizens. Not a pleasant situation.

How does it work in other country's? If for example I had a kid born while traveling in Germany, would the kid be a German citizen? I'm curious, not being snarky or anything.

667 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:07:05pm

re: #663 ryannon

Being a world-class slacker myself, I prefer Dirt Nap.

he come back no mo...Jamaica

668 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:07:29pm

re: #658 Charles

Weird Nut Drooly found a 1961 Hawaii birth certificate and sure enough -- the form is identical to the 1962 form.

[Link: www.wnd.com...]

WND, of course, gets even more whacked out than usual trying to keep the conspiracy alive despite this.

Damn it. Now I've got that jack-in-the-box tune, Pop Goes The Weasel, running through my head. It always seems to start playing in the background when the nirthers show up.

669 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:08:54pm

re: #660 HoosierHoops

Good evening Ice! Pushing up daisy's? dirt nap?
/i got nothing
*wink*

Last call? Riding the slow train? Discorporating? Safe in the arms of the Lord? Called to glory? Rang the bell? Sawed the branch off? Cut a corner? Waved goodbye? Ran into an old friend? Ran out of bounds? Took a trip on a pirate ship? Sleeps with the piranhas?

Seriously dead.

670 opnion  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:09:02pm

re: #654 Cato the Elder

Johnny Cash had a house in Jamaica. His song "Worried Man" came out of an encounter with a Jamaican panhandler.

Is seriously killed worse than whacked, or not as bad?

A Matter of degree. Generally speaking I would say that seriously killed is a little worse than whacked.

671 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:09:23pm

re: #660 HoosierHoops

Good evening Ice! Pushing up daisy's? dirt nap?
/i got nothing
*wink*

Hey Hoops-honey!

I like dirt nap! And pushing up daises! How are you?

re: #663 ryannon

Also a slacker here, hence my love of 'dirt nap'. :)

672 Ziggy  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:09:25pm

Who cares about him releasing the certificat or not. Have him release his Occidental, Columbia nd Harvard records as well as any articles written while on law review. I'd settle for that.

673 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:10:55pm

re: #669 Cato the Elder

Last call? Riding the slow train? Discorporating? Safe in the arms of the Lord? Called to glory? Rang the bell? Sawed the branch off? Cut a corner? Waved goodbye? Ran into an old friend? Ran out of bounds? Took a trip on a pirate ship? Sleeps with the piranhas?

Seriously dead.

good one...sort of gentle and non violent

674 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:10:58pm

re: #666 LGoPs

How does it work in other country's? If for example I had a kid born while traveling in Germany, would the kid be a German citizen? I'm curious, not being snarky or anything.

Not certain. I believe this is pretty much the rule everywhere.

Assuming you and your spouse were American citizens, the child would be one, also - although not a native-born citizen. My guess is that dual citizenship would result, or at least be an option.

I know that visibly pregnant women are routinely denied access to US embassies abroad, to prevent international complications from arising. The same may be true for other nations, as well, but I don't know for sure.

675 ryannon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:12:07pm

re: #672 Ziggy

Who cares about him releasing the certificat or not. Have him release his Occidental, Columbia nd Harvard records as well as any articles written while on law review. I'd settle for that.

And while we're at it, does he wear boxers or briefs?

676 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:12:37pm

re: #666 LGoPs

How does it work in other country's? If for example I had a kid born while traveling in Germany, would the kid be a German citizen? I'm curious, not being snarky or anything.

Most other countries do not have automatic birthright citizenship like we do.

There are a large number of foreign "guest workers" (mostly Turks) livingi n Germany, for example. Their children do not automatically become German citizens.

677 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:12:54pm

and so Bugsy Seigal...waved goodbye

678 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:13:15pm

re: #668 SixDegrees

Damn it. Now I've got that jack-in-the-box tune, Pop Goes The Weasel, running through my head. It always seems to start playing in the background when the nirthers show up.

Pop goes the weasel was originally an english rhyme. It's about tailors pawning their flatiron and going round the pub, then redeeming their tools (supposedly):

Up and down the city road
In and out the Eagle
That's the way the money goes
Pop goes the weasel.

the 'Eagle' being the pub, the 'weasel' being the tools pawned.

679 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:13:20pm

I'm reincarnating as a dog.
I'm gonna piss all over everything and live in the woods.

680 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:13:25pm

This month marks the 90th anniversary of the First Transcontinental Convoy, a convoy of military vehicles departing Washington D.C. for San Francisco to determine the east-west mobility of the US Army over the existing roads at the time.

A young scout noted:

In Illinois [the convoy] started on dirt roads, and practically no more pavement was encountered until reaching California. ...two days were lost in western part of this state [Nebraska] due to bad, sandy roads. From Orr's Ranch, Utah to Carson City, Nevada, the road is one succession of dust, ruts, pits, and holes. This stretch was not improved in any way, and consisted only of a track across the desert. At many points on the road, water is twenty miles distant, and parts of the road are ninety miles from the nearest railroad.

That officer's name? Lt. Col. Dwight D Eisenhower. His experiences in 1919 factored heavily into his decision-making nearly 40 years later.

The Military Vehicle Preservation Association put together a convoy of their own to mark the 90th anniversary of that first convoy.

681 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:13:40pm

re: #673 albusteve

good one...sort of gentle and non violent

I like 'assumed room temperature'

682 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:16:10pm

re: #679 SasquatchOnSteroids

I'm reincarnating as a dog.
I'm gonna piss all over everything and live in the woods.

I was thinking house cat. Eat, sleep, play, poop, sleep, eat, sleep.

683 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:16:19pm

re: #681 LGoPs

I like 'assumed room temperature'

due to a hail of lead he...assumed room temperature
heh...

684 wrenchwench  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:16:31pm

re: #658 Charles

WND, of course, gets even more whacked out than usual trying to keep the conspiracy alive despite this.

Well, they have a stack of DVDs to sell! The price has been slashed---to $17.99!

Related Items
# BIRTH CERTIFICATE BILLBOARD CAMPAIGN - $5.00
# The FUND FOR TRUTH ABOUT OBAMA BIRTH - $5.00
# The Obama Nation (Book) - $27.95
# Where's The Birth Certificate Magnetic Bumper Sticker - $5.95
# White House Eligibility Postcards - $4.00
685 Digital Display  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:17:09pm

re: #671 iceweasel

Hey Hoops-honey!

I like dirt nap! And pushing up daises! How are you?

re: #663 ryannon

Also a slacker here, hence my love of 'dirt nap'. :)

I'm doing great...Hope you are well...
I go back on Vacation in 2 days...
I could get pretty bummed out though..My certificate for live birth is shrouded in mystery and my College scores pretty much sucked( played sports)...I can never be the president of the United States...
/Wait..Axelrod is on line one..I gotta take this call
*wink*

686 wrenchwench  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:17:54pm

I forgot this part about the DVD:

A Presentation of WND Films

Executive Producer: Joseph Farah

Interviewees: Dr. Jerome Corsi, Orly Taitz, Alan Keyes and Janet Porter

The remaining credits for the production of this film are being withheld at the request of the filmmakers. They fear reprisals from their government.

687 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:18:23pm

re: #686 wrenchwench

Oh, gawd.

688 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:18:39pm

re: #662 albusteve

he had a million dollar home on Half Moon Country Club outside Mo Bay...those folks have everything done for them and if he ran into a panhandler it was probably by accident!...

I an I gotta tell ya, mon, Johnny hung with the people all the time. Yeah, he was a zillionaire, but he was a down-to-earth guy, and if he hadn't already taken the slow train I would trade a year of life to hang with him for a day. When he tells that story in a concert with Willie Nelson, you believe him. He called the guy a "bum", not a panhandler. Johnny shot straight. The Man in Black.

And his recording of the complete New Testament is an eye-opener, no two ways about it.

689 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:19:33pm

re: #669 Cato the Elder

Those are all brilliant.

Personally, my favourite metaphor for death is "riding the mystery train"

The expression 'mystery train' originated in the southern US. It was any train carrying a coffin, especially ones carrying many (military dead).

Makes Elvis' cover sound a little different, right?


Train I ride, sixteen coaches long
Train I ride, sixteen coaches long
Well that long black train got my baby and gone

Train train, comin round, round the bend
Train train, comin round the bend
Well it took my baby, but it never will again (no, not again)

Train train, comin down, down the line
Train train, comin down the line
Well its bringin my baby, cause shes mine all, all mine
(shes mine, all, all mine)

690 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:21:00pm

re: #679 SasquatchOnSteroids

I'm reincarnating as a dog.
I'm gonna piss all over everything and live in the woods.

And lick your ba nevermind.

691 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:21:00pm

re: #686 wrenchwench

Just like those soup-er seekrit 'anonymous government sources' in all those NYT Articles divulging classified information during the Bush Admin.

692 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:21:06pm

re: #685 HoosierHoops

I'm doing great...Hope you are well...
I go back on Vacation in 2 days...
I could get pretty bummed out though..My certificate for live birth is shrouded in mystery and my College scores pretty much sucked( played sports)...I can never be the president of the United States...
/Wait..Axelrod is on line one..I gotta take this call
*wink*

i demand the videos of you in the locker room and on the court!

//

693 Athos  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:21:08pm

re: #686 wrenchwench

Talk about a collection of conspiracy mongers - Corsi also embraces the theory that there is a program to merge the US, Canada, and Mexico into the North American Union and the replacement of the US $ by the Amero.

694 callahan23  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:21:27pm

re: #666 LGoPs

How does it work in other country's? If for example I had a kid born while traveling in Germany, would the kid be a German citizen? I'm curious, not being snarky or anything.

Hi LGoPs, your hypothetical kid would not automatically qualify to be a German. It would just like any other foreigner applying for citizenship have to go through the same processes as they would have to as an adult. One is only automatically German when the father or even better, both parents are German.

///Blut und Boden; anyone???
Yuck, retch, I need some mind bleach now.

695 Mad Al-Jaffee  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:21:37pm

OT, for fans of Heroes, season 4 trailer:

[Link: www.thrfeed.com...]

696 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:21:37pm

re: #682 Sharmuta

I was thinking house cat. Eat, sleep, play, poop, sleep, eat, sleep.

Torture mice.

697 ryannon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:21:55pm

Not exactly a Dead Thread, but looking more and more like a death thread. Anyone know any good ghost stories?

698 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:22:21pm

re: #690 MandyManners

And lick your ba nevermind.

Ah, a bonus. Haven't gotten that far into my daydream. I was chasing a rabbit.

699 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:22:50pm

re: #696 MandyManners

Get high on smokeless kitty ganja catnip.

700 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:23:26pm

re: #696 MandyManners

Torture mice.

I think it would be the good life. If I was a dog, I'd have to fetch and stuff. Cats have it easy.

701 yochanan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:24:01pm

re: #680 Fenway_Nation

what no tanks or apc's?

702 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:24:04pm

re: #682 Sharmuta

I was thinking house cat. Eat, sleep, play, poop, sleep, eat, sleep.

I have a theory that pampered dogs and house cats are all the reincarnation of buddha. They've evolved even further and gone on to the ultimate reward.

703 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:24:15pm

re: #698 SasquatchOnSteroids

Ah, a bonus. Haven't gotten that far into my daydream. I was chasing a rabbit.

Is that what you kids call it nowadays?

704 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:24:25pm

re: #697 ryannon

Not exactly a Dead Thread, but looking more and more like a death thread. Anyone know any good ghost stories?

E-mail that I have moved to "trash" on my iPhone mysteriously reappear in my in-box as if they are brand new e-mails.

does that count as a ghost story?

705 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:25:39pm

re: #701 yochanan


The original convoy didn't have any tanks or APCs (hell- I think the US Army hardly had any armour in 1919), so you can make the case that they're trying to be as accurate as possible.

706 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:25:51pm

re: #700 Sharmuta

I think it would be the good life. If I was a dog, I'd have to fetch and stuff.

Someone tell my dog that.

707 ryannon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:26:14pm

re: #704 reine.de.tout

E-mail that I have moved to "trash" on my iPhone mysteriously reappear in my in-box as if they are brand new e-mails.

does that count as a ghost story?

It was a dark, rainy night. A bolt of lightning suddenly illuminated the back-lit screen as I checked the in-box on my iPhone...

708 shortshrift  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:26:58pm

re: #689 iceweasel

OT. Caught up with you. Not stalking, but wanted to ask you for a few examples of "slang and references" that you use on liberal sites that have to be "translated" . I refer to your post #633 earlier today on the Steele thread. I responded at #637 with my request.
Would really appreciate it you could recall a few such phrases.

709 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:27:33pm

re: #707 ryannon

It was a dark, rainy night. A bolt of lightning suddenly illuminated the back-lit screen as I checked the in-box on my iPhone... RON PAUL !

710 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:27:34pm

re: #705 Fenway_Nation

The original convoy didn't have any tanks or APCs (hell- I think the US Army hardly had any armour in 1919), so you can make the case that they're trying to be as accurate as possible.

No tank built in 1919 would have been capable of going across the US, anyway. They might get 4 or 5 miles before breaking down.

711 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:27:46pm

re: #699 Fenway_Nation

Get high on smokeless kitty ganja catnip.

I CAN HAS CHEEETOEZ?

712 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:27:54pm

re: #688 Cato the Elder

I an I gotta tell ya, mon, Johnny hung with the people all the time. Yeah, he was a zillionaire, but he was a down-to-earth guy, and if he hadn't already taken the slow train I would trade a year of life to hang with him for a day. When he tells that story in a concert with Willie Nelson, you believe him. He called the guy a "bum", not a panhandler. Johnny shot straight. The Man in Black.

And his recording of the complete New Testament is an eye-opener, no two ways about it.

yeah he was an original...he was celebrity around Half Moon...when you leave the place the road is lined with higglers, and gin joints up and down the way...fisherman and food places etc...he was a mixer, you are correct...and the Jamaicans around there loved him...one chance encounter and it's the biggest event of a lifetime

713 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:28:07pm

re: #700 Sharmuta

I think it would be the good life. If I was a dog, I'd have to fetch and stuff. Cats have it easy.

Hairballs.

714 callahan23  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:28:19pm

re: #707 ryannon

It was a dark, rainy night. A bolt of lightning suddenly illuminated the back-lit screen as I checked the in-box on my iPhone...

There they were the trashed emails of times gone by. Haunted spirits of their former selfs ...

715 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:28:45pm

re: #713 MandyManners

Hairballs.

Hairballs aren't the cats' problem.
They are the problem of the staff (me).

716 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:29:00pm

re: #699 Fenway_Nation

Get high on smokeless kitty ganja catnip.

Now, now. I don't want to be a slow-thinking dullard kitteh. ;)

717 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:29:04pm

re: #699 Fenway_Nation

Get high on smokeless kitty ganja catnip.

i assume everyone has seen this at some point-- it's the best LOLcat ever (because it combines kittehs and pot)

Image: Dude+wait+what.jpg

718 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:29:20pm

re: #679 SasquatchOnSteroids

I'm reincarnating as a dog.
I'm gonna piss all over everything and live in the woods.

Repeat from a post I made months ago:
Two guys are walking down the street and see a dog licking its balls.
First guys says "Boy, I wish I could do that"
Second guy replies "I think you better pet him first"
Oldie but a goodie.

719 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:29:46pm

re: #712 albusteve

yeah he was an original...he was celebrity around Half Moon...when you leave the place the road is lined with higglers, and gin joints up and down the way...fisherman and food places etc...he was a mixer, you are correct...and the Jamaicans around there loved him...one chance encounter and it's the biggest event of a lifetime

and further I should not have posted about 'accidental'...Half Moon is very exclusive tho

720 yochanan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:29:55pm
721 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:30:01pm

re: #710 lobo91


And if I'm not mistaken, wheeled APCs are a pretty recent phenomenea in the US Army.

/Stryker was before my time, let alone the Grizzly, Lynx, etc...

722 beldar67  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:30:13pm

Being from Canada I'm not familiar with the process. Is there not a formal office which confirms a persons eligibility to run for President prior to the election? For example a Secretary of State or Election Commissioner that reviews all of the potential candidates and certifies them as being eligible to run.

723 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:30:23pm

re: #694 callahan23

Hi LGoPs, your hypothetical kid would not automatically qualify to be a German. It would just like any other foreigner applying for citizenship have to go through the same processes as they would have to as an adult. One is only automatically German when the father or even better, both parents are German.

///Blut und Boden; anyone???
Yuck, retch, I need some mind bleach now.

Jus sanguinis vs. jus soli. Many European countries have the former, while we and the French have the latter. Germany is actually now a mixed case based on very recent changes in the citizenship law. Better than it used to be.

But what about England? I'm ignorant on that one...

724 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:30:32pm

re: #715 reine.de.tout

Hairballs aren't the cats' problem.
They are the problem of the staff (me).

Have you ever stepped in a fresh, warm one in the middle of the night, barefoot?

725 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:30:49pm

re: #718 LGoPs

Repeat from a post I made months ago:
Two guys are walking down the street and see a dog licking its balls.
First guys says "Boy, I wish I could do that"
Second guy replies "I think you better pet him first"
Oldie but a goodie.

Why does a dog lick his balls ?

Because he can.

Another oldie.

726 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:31:16pm

re: #708 shortshrift

No prob! I'll go read and then answer you there (may be filthy).

727 Digital Display  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:31:31pm

re: #692 iceweasel

i demand the videos of you in the locker room and on the court!

//

LOL
I think the damn Napa Register still has pictures of me playing Point Guard...
I'll check..Also I have your email cause I know someone on the web that knows you... I'll ping you so don't freak out ok?
Be well

728 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:32:26pm

re: #694 callahan23

Hi LGoPs, your hypothetical kid would not automatically qualify to be a German. It would just like any other foreigner applying for citizenship have to go through the same processes as they would have to as an adult. One is only automatically German when the father or even better, both parents are German.

///Blut und Boden; anyone???
Yuck, retch, I need some mind bleach now.

Only the FATHER? What a buncha' sexist shit.

729 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:33:04pm

re: #721 Fenway_Nation

And if I'm not mistaken, wheeled APCs are a pretty recent phenomenea in the US Army.

/Stryker was before my time, let alone the Grizzly, Lynx, etc...

Stryker is not before your time...they are currently deployed in Afghanistan

730 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:33:13pm

re: #728 MandyManners

Only the FATHER? What a buncha' sexist shit.

Why do you think they call it the Fatherland...huh?

731 shortshrift  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:33:31pm

re: #726 iceweasel

Much obliged. See you there

732 ryannon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:33:43pm

re: #714 callahan23

There they were the trashed emails of times gone by. Haunted spirits of their former selfs ...

Suddenly and without warning (my iPhone is so cool that it always warns me several minutes in advance when someone is going to call me) the iPhone began ringing stridently on the deserted, rut-filled dirt road I was walking down beneath the rain-streaked sky under the gibbous moon...

733 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:33:52pm

Speaking of hairballs, bbl.

734 Sharmuta  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:33:53pm

re: #722 beldar67

Being from Canada I'm not familiar with the process. Is there not a formal office which confirms a persons eligibility to run for President prior to the election? For example a Secretary of State or Election Commissioner that reviews all of the potential candidates and certifies them as being eligible to run.

Usually, the party deals with such issues. I was once on the nominations committee for a Congressional election, and we made certain our candidate met the legal requirements.

735 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:34:04pm

re: #721 Fenway_Nation

And if I'm not mistaken, wheeled APCs are a pretty recent phenomenea in the US Army.

/Stryker was before my time, let alone the Grizzly, Lynx, etc...

I helped deploy the first Stryker units out of Ft Lewis, WA in 2003...

736 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:34:15pm

re: #730 LGoPs

Why do you think they call it the Fatherland...huh?

In Russia, it's the Rodina--the Motherland-- FYI//

737 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:34:37pm

re: #722 beldar67

Being from Canada I'm not familiar with the process. Is there not a formal office which confirms a persons eligibility to run for President prior to the election? For example a Secretary of State or Election Commissioner that reviews all of the potential candidates and certifies them as being eligible to run.

Not when it comes to presidential elections. The individual states do that (generally through the Secretary of State's office) for candidates for Congress, and for state offices.

738 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:34:49pm

re: #729 albusteve

Afghanistan's after my time...(in the Army, at least)

Most of the nastiness in the Balkans (w/the exception of Kosovo) wasn't, however.

739 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:35:40pm

re: #729 albusteve

Stryker is not before your time...they are currently deployed in Afghanistan

I think he meant "after his time."

740 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:35:45pm

re: #724 MandyManners

I assume you meant the hairball?

And that's why we don't have cats anymore.

741 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:35:56pm

re: #739 lobo91

I did...my bad.

742 callahan23  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:36:11pm

re: #723 Cato the Elder

Jus sanguinis vs. jus soli. Many European countries have the former, while we and the French have the latter. Germany is actually now a mixed case based on very recent changes in the citizenship law. Better than it used to be.

But what about England? I'm ignorant on that one...

Jus soli is applied in many countries that were classical countries into which people migrated to. Also, I'd have to hazard a guess here, most latin American countries have this citizenship law.
You are right, in Germany much has changed to the better lately.
I also am completely clueless as to the citizenship laws in England.

743 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:36:30pm

re: #738 Fenway_Nation

Afghanistan's after my time...(in the Army, at least)

Most of the nastiness in the Balkans (w/the exception of Kosovo) wasn't, however.

well duh...I didn't look at it that way...of course

744 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:37:37pm

OK guys, please wish me luck. I am about to go and take a measurement in the lab, if it works out the way I think it will then good things will happen. If it doesn't, then I am back to the drawing board in a bunch of ideas.

I have decided that if any of my children want to do physics, I will be a proper Jewish father and do my best to convince them to go to medical school.

745 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:37:38pm

re: #739 lobo91

I think he meant "after his time."

I wasn't thinking...just blabbing, as usual

746 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:37:38pm

re: #724 MandyManners

Have you ever stepped in a fresh, warm one in the middle of the night, barefoot?

Mandy -
I have a dog and 4 cats.
I will not tell you whatI have stepped into, warm and fresh, in the middle of the night.
Or discovered on the floor on my way out to work in the morning.
Or found on the floor upon arrival home from work, just beat, wanting nothing more than to just sit and not move.

One of my cats once swallowed a mop string. We did not know it immediately, but my daughter (5 at the time) discovered it and came to tell me there was something wrong with the cat. The mop string had begun to be expelled, but the process was not yet complete. Making matters worse, the cat had been outside for awhile, so the string had leaves and other stuff on it, getting discarded all over the house.

I put on my handy-dandy disposable vinyl gloves that I have learned to keep a good supply of - and gave the string a gentle tug.

The cat went crazy.

I called the emergency vet, and she said, whatever you do, DON'T PULL ON IT (little late for that).

The issue eventually resolved itself; and this is but ONE of the animal stories I have.

Now, there's the time the vet wanted me to get a urine sample from the dog ...

747 yochanan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:37:46pm

re: #728 MandyManners

Only the FATHER? What a buncha' sexist shit.

well in Israel your a jew if your mother is.

748 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:38:57pm

re: #741 Fenway_Nation

I did...my bad.

and thank you for your service

749 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:39:21pm

Oh...and FWIW, even though the highway/interstate system has improved considerably since 1956 (let alone 1919), most domestic deployments (i.e. to training facilities like Ft. Polk or Ft. Irwin) are handled by train to this day.

/'Specialist- is it just me, or do those Humvees on the flatcars look like they're smiling?'

'They are smiling, sir. They know they're leaving Ft. Polk.'

750 BlueCanuck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:39:32pm

re: #721 Fenway_Nation

And if I'm not mistaken, wheeled APCs are a pretty recent phenomenea in the US Army.

/Stryker was before my time, let alone the Grizzly, Lynx, etc...

AVGP as it was so *ahem* affectionately known as in my time. "AVGP won't go where the bullrushes grow."

Met a old former member of my unit back on July 4 who used to drive the Shermans in the 60's. Had a print out of the history titled "Tanks won't go where the bullrushes grow". Picture on the front of a Sherman stuck in a boggy ditch.

751 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:39:47pm

re: #728 MandyManners

Only the FATHER? What a buncha' sexist shit.

I think his definition may be out of date. See my #723.

Also:

Birth in Germany

In general, birth in Germany does not confer German citizenship if neither parent is German. However, children born on or after 1 January 2000 to non-German parents acquire German citizenship at birth if at least one parent:

* has a permanent residence permit (and has had this status for at least 3 years); and
* has been residing in Germany for at least 8 years.

Such children will be required to apply successfully to retain German citizenship by the age of 23. Assuming the laws are not changed prior to 2023, they will normally be required to prove they do not hold any foreign citizenship.

Parents who are citizens of European Economic Area states or Switzerland are eligible to receive permanent resident permits after five years.

And:

Naturalisation as a German citizen

German citizenship may be acquired by naturalisation by those with permanent residence who have lived in Germany for 8 years. Additional requirements include an adequate command of the German language and an ability to be self-supporting without recourse to welfare.

Applicants for naturalisation are normally expected to prove they have renounced their existing nationality, or will lose this automatically upon naturalisation. An exception applies to those unable to give up their nationality easily (such as refugees). A further exception applies to citizens of European Union member states that do not require Germans to renounce citizenship upon naturalisation in that country.

Exceptions to the normal residence requirements include:

* A spouse of a German citizen may be naturalised after 3 years residence in Germany. The marriage must have persisted for at least 2 years.
* persons who have completed an integration course may have the residence requirement reduced to 7 years
* refugees and stateless persons may be able to apply after 6 years residence
* former German citizens

It's not as bad as it used to be.

752 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:41:11pm

re: #749 Fenway_Nation

Oh...and FWIW, even though the highway/interstate system has improved considerably since 1956 (let alone 1919), most domestic deployments (i.e. to training facilities like Ft. Polk or Ft. Irwin) are handled by train to this day.

/'Specialist- is it just me, or do those Humvees on the flatcars look like they're smiling?'

'They are smiling, sir. They know they're leaving Ft. Polk.'

Used to feel the same way when our trains pulled out of Grafenwoehr and Hohenfels...
:)

753 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:41:28pm

re: #748 albusteve

No need...there's guys and gals (including some lizards) who have done much heavier lifting than I ever did.

754 debutaunt  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:42:20pm

re: #736 calcajun

In Russia, it's the Rodina--the Motherland-- FYI//

How odd - In the Middle East it's the MO-therland.

755 rightymouse  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:42:43pm

re: #724 MandyManners

Have you ever stepped in a fresh, warm one in the middle of the night, barefoot?

Yep.

Also...

Hubby pulled a dead chipmunk out of his shoe one morning - he thought it was a sock.

One cat left a dead bunny under the covers on my side of the bed.

756 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:43:04pm

re: #747 yochanan

well in Israel your a jew if your mother is.

Everywhere that is the case. For those non-tribe members who are curious, membership in tribe, priesthood and monarchy passes through the father, while being Jewish itself passes through the mother. Also this implies that to be a member of the monarchy or priesthood, your mother needed to be Jewish also.

The rule is actually a very kind one. There are all sorts of theological and mystical reasons for it, but there is also a very very grim, but practical one.

In violent times, what do you do in the case of pregnancy due to rape?

In many cultures, the mother and the child are outcasts.

In Judaism, they are both Jews.

757 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:43:23pm

re: #753 Fenway_Nation

No need...there's guys and gals (including some lizards) who have done much heavier lifting than I ever did.

well I never did any...a regret I will take to my grave...not to gush but your service means a lot to me

758 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:43:28pm

re: #746 reine.de.tout

wow.
My dog suddenly jumped 2 notches on my likability meter.

759 yochanan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:44:09pm

re: #751 Cato the Elder

can't say i would want german citizenship

760 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:44:30pm

re: #758 SasquatchOnSteroids

wow.
My dog suddenly jumped 2 notches on my likability meter.

Mine too.

761 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:45:36pm

re: #760 lobo91

Mine too.

You know my dog ?


/

762 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:45:53pm

re: #746 reine.de.tout

I have a dog and 4 cats.
I will not tell you whatI have stepped into, warm and fresh, in the middle of the night. [edited for content ;^)]

From my long experience with both species, I'd venture the guess that unless your dog was very sick or very old, 99% of the warm squishies came from the felines, no?

My dog is so neat he doesn't even like going in the back yard. It's his back yard, you see. Your back yard, no problem... ;^)

763 Digital Display  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:46:19pm

re: #756 ludwigvanquixote

Everywhere that is the case. For those non-tribe members who are curious, membership in tribe, priesthood and monarchy passes through the father, while being Jewish itself passes through the mother. Also this implies that to be a member of the monarchy or priesthood, your mother needed to be Jewish also.

The rule is actually a very kind one. There are all sorts of theological and mystical reasons for it, but there is also a very very grim, but practical one.

In violent times, what do you do in the case of pregnancy due to rape?

In many cultures, the mother and the child are outcasts.

In Judaism, they are both Jews.


you are so correct...Nice posts..kind regards

764 rightymouse  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:46:42pm

Am trying to teach our dog to say "Outside". He has such a lovely baritone voice.

765 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:46:44pm

re: #758 SasquatchOnSteroids

wow.
My dog suddenly jumped 2 notches on my likability meter.

my last dog used to eat my driveway, then shit it out on the family room floor...over and over again...friggin Labs

766 callahan23  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:46:53pm

re: #759 yochanan

can't say i would want german citizenship

I can't say I wouldn't immediately exchange mine for the US citizenship. ;-)

767 reine.de.tout  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:47:00pm

re: #762 Cato the Elder

From my long experience with both species, I'd venture the guess that unless your dog was very sick or very old, 99% of the warm squishies came from the felines, no?

My dog is so neat he doesn't even like going in the back yard. It's his back yard, you see. Your back yard, no problem... ;^)

You are correct.

768 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:48:09pm

re: #763 HoosierHoops

you are so correct...Nice posts..kind regards

thanks.

769 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:48:35pm

re: #749 Fenway_Nation

Oh...and FWIW, even though the highway/interstate system has improved considerably since 1956 (let alone 1919), most domestic deployments (i.e. to training facilities like Ft. Polk or Ft. Irwin) are handled by train to this day.

/'Specialist- is it just me, or do those Humvees on the flatcars look like they're smiling?'

'They are smiling, sir. They know they're leaving Ft. Polk.'

Having spent a year stationed at NTC, and 2 months TDY at Ft Polk, I think I'd have to agree with those Humvees.

770 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:48:35pm

So let's see...if I have this correct, the US Army is presently utilizing Swiss and South African APCs, a Belgian light machine gun, an Italian pistol, Israeli small arms munitions...

/Am I leaving anything out?

771 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:48:50pm

re: #763 HoosierHoops

you are so correct...Nice posts..kind regards

I like your posts too.

772 Ziggy  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:49:18pm

re: #675 ryannon

And while we're at it, does he wear boxers or briefs?

My money would be on boxers, no doubt about it.

773 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:49:20pm

re: #765 albusteve

my last dog used to eat my driveway, then shit it out on the family room floor...over and over again...friggin Labs

He ate your driveway ?
That is one badassphalt mutt.

774 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:49:46pm

re: #765 albusteve


You have a driveway paved with dog shit?

775 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:50:32pm

re: #744 ludwigvanquixote

OK guys, please wish me luck. I am about to go and take a measurement in the lab, if it works out the way I think it will then good things will happen. If it doesn't, then I am back to the drawing board in a bunch of ideas.

I have decided that if any of my children want to do physics, I will be a proper Jewish father and do my best to convince them to go to medical school.

Just don't blow up the world-- that's all we ask.//

776 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:50:44pm

Oh...and whoever comes up with the ass-flavored milkbone will be a billionaire.

/Until 0bama and his tax-cheat appointees decide it isn't fair you have so much money...

777 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:50:55pm

re: #759 yochanan

can't say i would want german citizenship

I'll take any citizenship that gives me EU status (so long as I can keep my US passport). I'd like to retire in Portugal. Never been there, but I just have this fantasy.

There's Irish in me, but not enough for the passport. I'm banking on Wales...

One of my more colorful friends used to say that anyone without at least three passports was a fool: a US, an Asian and a European. He got his Chinese one from Hong Kong prior to 1997, and his Irish one with the aid of a deceased grandmother under Erin's Law of Return.

778 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:51:06pm

re: #774 Fenway_Nation

You have a driveway paved with dog shit?

Sounds like some contractors I know.

779 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:51:13pm

re: #770 Fenway_Nation

So let's see...if I have this correct, the US Army is presently utilizing Swiss and South African APCs, a Belgian light machine gun, an Italian pistol, Israeli small arms munitions...

/Am I leaving anything out?

The AT-4. Swedish, I think.

780 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:51:33pm

re: #769 lobo91

Having spent a year stationed at NTC, and 2 months TDY at Ft Polk, I think I'd have to agree with those Humvees.

AFAIAC Ft Irwin and Ft Polk are in a dead heat for worst posts in CONUS. IMHO.

781 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:52:04pm

re: #778 calcajun

Sounds like some contractors I know.

Too True.

782 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:52:19pm

re: #776 Fenway_Nation

Oh...and whoever comes up with the ass-flavored milkbone will be a billionaire.

/Until 0bama and his tax-cheat appointees decide it isn't fair you have so much money...

ROTFLMAO...

783 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:52:22pm

re: #770 Fenway_Nation

So let's see...if I have this correct, the US Army is presently utilizing Swiss and South African APCs, a Belgian light machine gun, an Italian pistol, Israeli small arms munitions...

/Am I leaving anything out?

I think AK-47s are popular in areas with a lot of bad weather/sand/mud. Not official, but I've heard it said.

784 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:52:30pm

re: #779 lobo91

Yep...overlooked that one, even tho' that was in the news this week.

/Tio Hugo has no idea how those AT4s wound up in the hands of FARC.

Serio?

Serio!

785 TheMatrix31  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:52:59pm

Kanye West is a motherfucker of EPIC proportions.

“You know everyone loves and respects Michael but times change. It’s so sad to see Michael gone but it makes a path for a new King of Pop and I’m willing to take that on. There’s nobody who can match me in sales and in respect so it only makes sense for me to take over Michael’s crown and become the new King,” said West.

786 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:53:12pm

re: #770 Fenway_Nation

So let's see...if I have this correct, the US Army is presently utilizing Swiss and South African APCs, a Belgian light machine gun, an Italian pistol, Israeli small arms munitions...

/Am I leaving anything out?

This sounds like the US Army in WWI -- when they got stuck with the best and worst French ordnance-- the French 75 and the Chauchat

787 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:53:19pm

re: #773 SasquatchOnSteroids

He ate your driveway ?
That is one badassphalt mutt.

chunks of asphalt from the fringes...knawed them like a bone...then shit or puked it up...always inside the house...bizarre

788 ryannon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:53:29pm

re: #772 Ziggy

My money would be on boxers, no doubt about it.

White, or um...colored?

789 Truck Monkey  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:53:29pm

re: #765 albusteve

my last dog used to eat my driveway, then shit it out on the family room floor...over and over again...friggin Labs

My dog will only drink water from my toilets. No where else. She also is oddly drawn to retrieving used sanitary napkins from the trash and tearing them up on my sitting room floor. Still love her though.

790 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:53:34pm

re: #770 Fenway_Nation

So let's see...if I have this correct, the US Army is presently utilizing Swiss and South African APCs, a Belgian light machine gun, an Italian pistol, Israeli small arms munitions...

/Am I leaving anything out?

The berets are Chinese made...

791 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:53:35pm

re: #780 LGoPs

AFAIAC Ft Irwin and Ft Polk are in a dead heat for worst posts in CONUS. IMHO.

I actually prefer Barstow to Leesville.

Camp McGregor, NM isn't exactly a garden spot, either, although not many people are actually stationed there. I typically spend 2-3 months a year there, a couple weeks at a time.

792 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:54:11pm

re: #789 Truck Monkey

And you let her lick your face, too?

793 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:54:35pm

re: #790 LGoPs

The berets are Chinese made...

Sigh. I am so disgusted at that.

794 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:54:41pm

re: #783 Cato the Elder


I heard...I have no firsthand experience in the matter, but I heard that the sound of an AK firing is pretty distinct and would invite unsolicited return-fire from friendlies who think they've suddenly been flanked.

795 debutaunt  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:55:00pm

re: #792 calcajun

And you let her lick your face, too?

*shudder*

796 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:55:15pm

re: #789 Truck Monkey

My dog will only drink water from my toilets. No where else. She also is oddly drawn to retrieving used sanitary napkins from the trash and tearing them up on my sitting room floor. Still love her though.

must be a riot around company...dogs do weird stuff

797 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:55:32pm

re: #790 LGoPs

re: #770 Fenway_Nation


The berets are Chinese made...


Still? Jay-zus!

/Never had a beret- that was something one had to earn by being Airborne or Ranger.

798 yochanan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:55:48pm

re: #780 LGoPs

well i lived at ft rialy and bakersfield neither were winners either. but in between those two we were at the persidio in san fran which was great.

799 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:56:00pm

re: #791 lobo91

I actually prefer Barstow to Leesville.

Camp McGregor, NM isn't exactly a garden spot, either, although not many people are actually stationed there. I typically spend 2-3 months a year there, a couple weeks at a time.

I go to Ft Hood on business occasionally and don't care for it at all. Ft Lewis is my favorite and I've always been partial to Benning.

800 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:56:44pm

re: #794 Fenway_Nation

I heard...I have no firsthand experience in the matter, but I heard that the sound of an AK firing is pretty distinct and would invite unsolicited return-fire from friendlies who think they've suddenly been flanked.

It is, and it would, which is why people in line units don't use them.

The fact that they're indistinguishable from enemy weapons comes in handy for SOF types, however...

801 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:56:49pm

re: #797 Fenway_Nation

Still? Jay-zus!

/Never had a beret- that was something one had to earn by being Airborne or Ranger.

Zactly. And the Rangers went nuts when they made the black beret the standard for everyone...sheesh.

802 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:57:25pm

re: #775 calcajun

Just don't blow up the world-- that's all we ask.//

Little chance of that I promise. The lasers I am using for this aren't even powerful enough to fry a bug.

There is a boocoo watt laser in the lab that would take your hand off if you weren't careful, but I don't have a need for it. It just sort of squats there looking like a big beige box - sitting on top of a power supply the size of a large refrigerator. It's a funny thing really, when I got into physics, I had this image of lasers like that looking like something out of a Lucas film.

We call it Betty.

803 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:58:54pm

re: #801 LGoPs

Zactly. And the Rangers went nuts when they made the black beret the standard for everyone...sheesh.

two words...
Clinton

804 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:59:41pm

re: #803 albusteve

two words...
Clinton

In a world where everyone is special, no one is special.

805 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:59:42pm

Oh yeah...I forgot about the M119 howitzer (British).

806 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:59:54pm

I understand the dedicated OPFOR units at Polk and Irwin went from taking American vehicles and equipment and dressing them up to look like Soviet Bloc hardware to using some of the equipment captured in Iraq in Desert Storm to just buting the crap direct from the Ukranians.

This was cited on the Discovery Channel awhile back, so I'm not sure how accurate it is these days, but apparently the most active unit using the Hin-Ds isn't in Russia or Kazakhstan- it's in Ft. Polk.

807 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:00:05pm

re: #787 albusteve

chunks of asphalt from the fringes...knawed them like a bone...then shit or puked it up...always inside the house...bizarre

I had a lab once. That dog chewed everything, and I mean everything he could get his muzzle on for a couple of years. Shoes, low hanging clothes out drying, sticks, stones, tires, even a small kitten we don't know where the hell it came from, poor thing. He was playing with it (in his mind, I think) and not eating it. He stayed on my fathers farm and was really his dog, even though he'd never admit it.
Damn good dog, he was.

808 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:00:06pm

re: #794 Fenway_Nation

I heard...I have no firsthand experience in the matter, but I heard that the sound of an AK firing is pretty distinct and would invite unsolicited return-fire from friendlies who think they've suddenly been flanked.

That could be. I do know they're popular as trophies. And with a small-cap magazine, they make dandy lightweight walk-in-the-woods hunting rifles, no matter what the purists or the ugly-gun-hysterics will tell you.

And now that the post-Obama ammo run has petered out, you can get 7.62x39mm for about thirty cents a round.

809 BlueCanuck  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:00:24pm

re: #797 Fenway_Nation

Still? Jay-zus!

/Never had a beret- that was something one had to earn by being Airborne or Ranger.

Hmmm, have two kicking around here I know of. Slightly used mind you. Blue or green? :)

/yep us crazy Canucks

810 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:01:06pm

re: #806 Fenway_Nation


BUY

/PIMF

811 leftover54  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:01:12pm

re: #15 calcajun

I just want to know how the blood made it up all the way to the pillow ...

812 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:01:29pm

re: #770 Fenway_Nation

So let's see...if I have this correct, the US Army is presently utilizing Swiss and South African APCs, a Belgian light machine gun, an Italian pistol, Israeli small arms munitions...

/Am I leaving anything out?

I read combat after action reports out of Iraq complaining that the Beretta didn't have enough stopping power. I could've told 'em that. I used to carry a .45 as a sidearm. Unfortunately Department of the Army didn't bother to ask my opinion when they went to the 9MM...
/

813 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:03:36pm

re: #812 LGoPs

Oh...I qualified with the M9 long after the 1911 was discontinued. It was kind of funny- they had us load 7 or 8 rounds at a time using a 15-round clip. You could tell they were still using the .45 qualification for the Baretta 9mm...

814 Randall Gross  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:03:57pm

Someone talking about dogs?

King of the Dogs

815 Fenway_Nation  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:04:20pm

OK lizards...this place is closing up around me. Might as well jet...

816 Randall Gross  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:04:40pm

re: #814 Thanos

Someone talking about dogs?

King of the Dogs


[Video]

Crapszers... embedding disabled, click through

817 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:04:45pm

re: #806 Fenway_Nation

I understand the dedicated OPFOR units at Polk and Irwin went from taking American vehicles and equipment and dressing them up to look like Soviet Bloc hardware to using some of the equipment captured in Iraq in Desert Storm to just buting the crap direct from the Ukranians.

This was cited on the Discovery Channel awhile back, so I'm not sure how accurate it is these days, but apparently the most active unit using the Hin-Ds isn't in Russia or Kazakhstan- it's in Ft. Polk.

Yeah, that's true. Even back in the '80s, though, we did have some actual Soviet-bloc equipment at NTC, most of which we got from the Israelis (after they captured it).

We had a whole motor pool full of MTL-B APCs, for example. Total POS.

818 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:04:54pm

re: #807 SasquatchOnSteroids

I had a lab once. That dog chewed everything, and I mean everything he could get his muzzle on for a couple of years. Shoes, low hanging clothes out drying, sticks, stones, tires, even a small kitten we don't know where the hell it came from, poor thing. He was playing with it (in his mind, I think) and not eating it. He stayed on my fathers farm and was really his dog, even though he'd never admit it.
Damn good dog, he was.

yup...Labs are obsessed with chewing...I spent a fortune a toys for mine...drop it down and five minutes later gone...my old male Shepherd loved to destroy stuff too, but he would reduce a chunk of 2x8 to toothpicks, or golf balls...he loved it when they exploded and unwound in his mouth

819 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:06:03pm

re: #812 LGoPs

I read combat after action reports out of Iraq complaining that the Beretta didn't have enough stopping power. I could've told 'em that. I used to carry a .45 as a sidearm. Unfortunately Department of the Army didn't bother to ask my opinion when they went to the 9MM...
/

I have a sneaky feeling there was some shenanigans or graft involved in Beretta getting that contract. If I was over there, I'd try to get a hold of a .45 someway.

820 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:06:24pm

re: #813 Fenway_Nation

Oh...I qualified with the M9 long after the 1911 was discontinued. It was kind of funny- they had us load 7 or 8 rounds at a time using a 15-round clip. You could tell they were still using the .45 qualification for the Baretta 9mm...

Still do. I just qualified with one last month. No magazine had more than 7 rounds in it.

821 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:07:37pm

re: #812 LGoPs

I read combat after action reports out of Iraq complaining that the Beretta didn't have enough stopping power. I could've told 'em that. I used to carry a .45 as a sidearm. Unfortunately Department of the Army didn't bother to ask my opinion when they went to the 9MM...
/

I'm curious: isn't it a matter of the load and the bullet more than the caliber? I mean, 9mm works out to .354 cal., so it can't be that extra tenth of an inch in width, can it?

At any rate, my cousin Mike - shooting buddy, former Michigan State Trooper, licensed firearms instructor, private eye and part-time security guard - tells me the whole 9mm vs. .45 debate is a lot of fun but a load of hooey. Just sayin'.

822 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:09:04pm

re: #818 albusteve

yup...Labs are obsessed with chewing...I spent a fortune a toys for mine...drop it down and five minutes later gone...my old male Shepherd loved to destroy stuff too, but he would reduce a chunk of 2x8 to toothpicks, or golf balls...he loved it when they exploded and unwound in his mouth

I have 2 beagles and we keep them well supplied with toys - there's a huge pile in the corner that they pick and choose from. New toys last about 5 minutes with foam and cloth guts all over the place. Absolute mayhem. If there was a Forensics Files for dogs my dogs would be serial murderers and be behind bars for life.
:)

823 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:09:44pm

re: #731 shortshrift

Answered. Hope it helps. See you there. cheers, icedub

824 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:10:05pm

re: #819 ArchangelMichael

I have a sneaky feeling there was some shenanigans or graft involved in Beretta getting that contract. If I was over there, I'd try to get a hold of a .45 someway.

I have 2 to this day. One auto and one revolver. Great weapons.

825 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:10:57pm

re: #822 LGoPs

I have 2 beagles and we keep them well supplied with toys - there's a huge pile in the corner that they pick and choose from. New toys last about 5 minutes with foam and cloth guts all over the place. Absolute mayhem. If there was a Forensics Files for dogs my dogs would be serial murderers and be behind bars for life.
:)

beagles?...oh man...no frickin way

826 callahan23  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:11:42pm

I am out Lizards.
See y'all down the road.
I love you (Lizardim} - mostly. Really!

827 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:11:44pm

re: #821 Cato the Elder

I'm curious: isn't it a matter of the load and the bullet more than the caliber? I mean, 9mm works out to .354 cal., so it can't be that extra tenth of an inch in width, can it?

At any rate, my cousin Mike - shooting buddy, former Michigan State Trooper, licensed firearms instructor, private eye and part-time security guard - tells me the whole 9mm vs. .45 debate is a lot of fun but a load of hooey. Just sayin'.

I'm no expert in ballistics. I just know the .45 has tremendous stopping power. Designed to deal with Moro's hopped up on drugs during the wars in the Phillippines early in the 1900's.

828 rightymouse  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:11:46pm

re: #822 LGoPs

I have 2 beagles and we keep them well supplied with toys - there's a huge pile in the corner that they pick and choose from. New toys last about 5 minutes with foam and cloth guts all over the place. Absolute mayhem. If there was a Forensics Files for dogs my dogs would be serial murderers and be behind bars for life.
:)

I LOVE BEAGLES! Especially the beagle/basset mix. Still miss my beagle/basset to this day & it's been 4 years. Sweetest dog in the universe.

829 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:12:00pm

re: #818 albusteve

yup...Labs are obsessed with chewing...I spent a fortune a toys for mine...drop it down and five minutes later gone...my old male Shepherd loved to destroy stuff too, but he would reduce a chunk of 2x8 to toothpicks, or golf balls...he loved it when they exploded and unwound in his mouth

Nice. I took him to a sort of isolated beach one time at about 9 in the morning when I first got him. Never again. I swear it was 2 before that sob came back out of the water. swimswimswim, wade in a little closer so he could touch bottom, run down a little ways and swimswimswim some more.
Someone had crab pots or something out there he was trying to drag in, but they're anchored, so he'd eventually let go and more swimwaderun.

830 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:12:35pm

re: #818 albusteve

yup...Labs are obsessed with chewing...I spent a fortune a toys for mine...drop it down and five minutes later gone...my old male Shepherd loved to destroy stuff too, but he would reduce a chunk of 2x8 to toothpicks, or golf balls...he loved it when they exploded and unwound in his mouth

Love Labs and shepherds. Best dogs ever! You're right, they chew and chew...

My first dog was a lab/shep mix. Loved him! He chewed everything when he was a pup.

831 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:13:02pm

re: #825 albusteve

beagles?...oh man...no frickin way

Yup. They're real sweethearts otherwise. And keeping them in toys prevents chewing up other stuff. Never had a problem with them destroying anything other than their toys. And they love chewing on ice cubes.

832 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:14:50pm

re: #822 LGoPs

I have 2 beagles and we keep them well supplied with toys - there's a huge pile in the corner that they pick and choose from. New toys last about 5 minutes with foam and cloth guts all over the place. Absolute mayhem. If there was a Forensics Files for dogs my dogs would be serial murderers and be behind bars for life.
:)

Have you ever found a squeaky toy with a squeaker that lasts more than a quarter hour? I bought Haku the Jindo an adorable fox from L.L. Bean last month. Someone tried it out at the display while we were there and he attacked it so hard I had to buy him one of his own. So fifteen minutes out of Freeport and its little voice was gone... I stopped back in on my way out of Maine and had it replaced. Same thing. The guy who sold it to me said his had already gone a year and a half. Should I pester them for another one or just give up? Without the squeak he ignores it.

833 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:15:04pm

re: #821 Cato the Elder

I'm curious: isn't it a matter of the load and the bullet more than the caliber? I mean, 9mm works out to .354 cal., so it can't be that extra tenth of an inch in width, can it?

Military spec 9mm ball (FMJ) ammo isn't exactly the hottest load out there. It's fine for target practice, but not so good for shooting at things that plan to shoot back.

At any rate, my cousin Mike - shooting buddy, former Michigan State Trooper, licensed firearms instructor, private eye and part-time security guard - tells me the whole 9mm vs. .45 debate is a lot of fun but a load of hooey. Just sayin'.

That depends on who you're planning on shooting with it.

If your expected target is a 19-year-old gang banger, he'll probably give up if you shoot him in the arm with a .32.

If, on the other hand, you're shooting at a guy who was planning on running up next to your Humvee and setting off 10 pounds of Semtex because he believes it will get him 72 virgins...not so much.

834 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:15:28pm

re: #828 rightymouse

I LOVE BEAGLES! Especially the beagle/basset mix. Still miss my beagle/basset to this day & it's been 4 years. Sweetest dog in the universe.

Absolutely agree. Our male beagle is so good looking that strangers constantly stop and remark on how sweet and handsome he looks. He'd make a great Purina dog...kind of like the Gerber baby...
The female has what looks like permament eye liner on. She looks like Cleopatra...
:)

835 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:15:30pm

Now we have a Jack Russell/Chihuahua rescue.

It has been...interesting.

836 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:16:18pm

re: #824 LGoPs

I have 2 to this day. One auto and one revolver. Great weapons.

I'm pistol free...just a year ago I found a vintage M1911 just around the corner from me...serial number 900k something...Iron Fist gave me a link to look it up...Colt, 1943...800$...kind of beat up but the dealer had fired a hundred rounds and he had no problem with it...just as I was ready to buy it my leg conked out...I've been in and out of the hospital ever since and the gun is long gone...I wanted that piece bad

837 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:17:09pm

re: #832 Cato the Elder

Have you ever found a squeaky toy with a squeaker that lasts more than a quarter hour? I bought Haku the Jindo an adorable fox from L.L. Bean last month. Someone tried it out at the display while we were there and he attacked it so hard I had to buy him one of his own. So fifteen minutes out of Freeport and its little voice was gone... I stopped back in on my way out of Maine and had it replaced. Same thing. The guy who sold it to me said his had already gone a year and a half. Should I pester them for another one or just give up? Without the squeak he ignores it.

Ha!. Same with ours. My wife always analyzes the various anatomical parts that are demolished first and the squeaker is usually the first.

838 The 1SG  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:17:45pm

re: #37 Charles

So this explains the race listed as African instead of Negro. Wonder why they don't list Caucasians as European?

839 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:17:52pm

re: #833 lobo91

But aren't there hotter loads in 9mm that would do the job just as well as .45 cal.?

840 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:18:49pm

re: #836 albusteve

I'm pistol free...just a year ago I found a vintage M1911 just around the corner from me...serial number 900k something...Iron Fist gave me a link to look it up...Colt, 1943...800$...kind of beat up but the dealer had fired a hundred rounds and he had no problem with it...just as I was ready to buy it my leg conked out...I've been in and out of the hospital ever since and the gun is long gone...I wanted that piece bad

I'd give anything to have a 1911. The one I carried in the Army had a real sloppy, loose slide action but I could fire expert with it. Just had to figure out where the bullets went and correct with Kentucky windage.

841 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:19:11pm

re: #830 iceweasel

Love Labs and shepherds. Best dogs ever! You're right, they chew and chew...

My first dog was a lab/shep mix. Loved him! He chewed everything when he was a pup.

until you own a Lab I don't think people really consider what they are all about...ferociously loyal but so damned self centered...get them around water and forget it...they can not stop themselves from doing what they need to do...be prepared

842 The 1SG  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:19:18pm

re: #839 Cato the Elder

For that matter why not a .22 and just have good shot placement.

843 rightymouse  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:19:34pm

re: #834 LGoPs

Absolutely agree. Our male beagle is so good looking that strangers constantly stop and remark on how sweet and handsome he looks. He'd make a great Purina dog...kind of like the Gerber baby...
The female has what looks like permament eye liner on. She looks like Cleopatra...
:)

Everyone who met my baby loved him - so good natured. His favorite thing to do was go outside and find a spot under a tree to loll around in & think doggy thoughts. That's how he was found when he didn't come home one day. Under a tree.

844 VegasRick  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:20:03pm

re: #829 SasquatchOnSteroids

Nice. I took him to a sort of isolated beach one time at about 9 in the morning when I first got him. Never again. I swear it was 2 before that sob came back out of the water. swimswimswim, wade in a little closer so he could touch bottom, run down a little ways and swimswimswim some more.
Someone had crab pots or something out there he was trying to drag in, but they're anchored, so he'd eventually let go and more swimwaderun.

Um, SOS that ain't a dog, that you got. It's a seal!

845 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:20:04pm

re: #831 LGoPs

Yup. They're real sweethearts otherwise. And keeping them in toys prevents chewing up other stuff. Never had a problem with them destroying anything other than their toys. And they love chewing on ice cubes.

noisy...they talk to much...yak yak yak

846 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:21:05pm

re: #834 LGoPs

Absolutely agree. Our male beagle is so good looking that strangers constantly stop and remark on how sweet and handsome he looks. He'd make a great Purina dog...kind of like the Gerber baby...
The female has what looks like permament eye liner on. She looks like Cleopatra...
:)

oh gawd

847 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:21:29pm

re: #844 VegasRick

Um, SOS that ain't a dog, that you got. It's a seal!

That day, he was.

848 zombie  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:21:38pm

OK, I've just now seen for the first time the photo of the "long form" birth certificate from 1962 Hawaii, and see that it indeed has no box for the race of the child. So, looks like that theory (that Obama might be embarrassed by some detail on his birth certificate) is not going to hold water any more. Hence:

I retract any speculations I had about any embarrassing info that might appear on Obama's birth certificate!

When confronted with facts, accept them. It's the only way.

849 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:23:10pm

re: #839 Cato the Elder

But aren't there hotter loads in 9mm that would do the job just as well as .45 cal.?

You can get adequate performance out of an exotic (and fairly expensive) 9mm round, but for those of us in the military, it's academic. You get plain vanilla FMJ rounds, period.

Pretty much any .45 APC round will outperform the most exotic 9mm round.

850 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:23:38pm

re: #841 albusteve

until you own a Lab I don't think people really consider what they are all about...ferociously loyal but so damned self centered...get them around water and forget it...they can not stop themselves from doing what they need to do...be prepared

Very true. My lab was half shep, and that probably moderated his selfish qualities a bit! He was still always like a puppy or little kid-- they can't stop themselves from doing what they have to do.

Really gorgeous and sweet though, and I just have to love them.

851 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:24:02pm

re: #848 zombie

OK, I've just now seen for the first time the photo of the "long form" birth certificate from 1962 Hawaii, and see that it indeed has no box for the race of the child. So, looks like that theory (that Obama might be embarrassed by some detail on his birth certificate) is not going to hold water any more. Hence:

I retract any speculations I had about any embarrassing info that might appear on Obama's birth certificate!

When confronted with facts, accept them. It's the only way.

Well, yeah, not on THAT one !

//

The rabbit hole is deep on Nirthdom.

852 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:24:13pm

re: #843 rightymouse

Everyone who met my baby loved him - so good natured. His favorite thing to do was go outside and find a spot under a tree to loll around in & think doggy thoughts. That's how he was found when he didn't come home one day. Under a tree.

Hope he was ok?

853 quickjustice  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:24:37pm

I believe Obama was born in Hawaii. It's his life thereafter that's either (1) a mystery; or (2) the problem.

854 Lee Coller  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:24:37pm

re: #848 zombie


I retract any speculations I had about any embarrassing info that might appear on Obama's birth certificate!

When confronted with facts, accept them. It's the only way.

If only the Nirthers would be so reasonable.

855 The Left  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:25:00pm

re: #851 SasquatchOnSteroids

Well, yeah, not on THAT one !

//

The rabbit hole is deep on Nirthdom.

It has no bottom.

856 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:25:24pm

re: #842 The 1SG

For that matter why not a .22 and just have good shot placement.

Hell yes. My Taurus .22 pistol (a Beretta Bobcat knockoff) with hollow-point ammo is a preferred carry piece where I live. With a special leather cover the pocket print looks like a wallet. My real wallet I carry up front. Someone asks for my billfold, I pull it out, they won't know it's not what they thought it was till they see the muzzle flash. All perfectly legal.

857 albusteve  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:25:44pm

re: #840 LGoPs

I'd give anything to have a 1911. The one I carried in the Army had a real sloppy, loose slide action but I could fire expert with it. Just had to figure out where the bullets went and correct with Kentucky windage.

I'll rebound...I want a vintage Colt and they are getting hard to find...between that and my 12ga I oughta pretty much blow my bunkhouse apart if I confront an intruder...smoking ruin

858 lobo91  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:25:52pm

re: #854 Lee Coller

If only the Nirthers would be so reasonable.

Then they wouldn't be Nirthers, would they?

859 quickjustice  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:27:06pm

Speculating here, the embarrassment for Obama may be the reverse of what the Nirthers think. Try this "theory" on for size: Obama was born in Hawaii, but fraudulently applied for scholarships to U.S. institutions, pretending to be foreign-born.

860 Render  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:27:31pm

re: #770 Fenway_Nation

uh-huh...

There is, or was, a Swedish Goteland class diesel sub rented for training by the US Navy.

The Polish built Finnish designed Rosomak 8-wheel APC may be on the short list to replace the canceled USMC EFV.

The M-60E4 machine gun is the logical end of the German MG-42 development line, although users of the MG-3 might argue that point.

The SOCOM Pistol Mk 23 Mod 0 45ACP is a Heckler & Koch product.

There is actually a long standing tradition for this sort of thing. The US Model 1903 Springfield and Model 1917 Enfield bolt actions rifles were little more then warmed over Mauser designs. The Browning Model 1917 machine gun, although designed and patented by American John Browning was initially refused for US service, but put into production for the Polish Army by Browning's Belgian employer at the time, FN.

The first US tanks in service were elderly French FT-17's, Patton was less then amused.

WHAT
WORKS,
R

861 rightymouse  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:28:08pm

re: #852 LGoPs

Hope he was ok?

No. He had been ill, but the vet said he was on the mend. He wandered off to our neighbor's property and was found 2 weeks later (they have 18 acres) under a tree. It was winter.

862 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:29:27pm

re: #835 SasquatchOnSteroids

Now we have a Jack Russell/Chihuahua rescue.

It has been...interesting.

Just a bit high strung is it?

863 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:31:23pm

re: #97 JakeSpiderMonkey

Don't candy-coat it. Tell us all how you really feel.

864 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:31:46pm

re: #861 rightymouse

No. He had been ill, but the vet said he was on the mend. He wandered off to our neighbor's property and was found 2 weeks later (they have 18 acres) under a tree. It was winter.

I'm sorry to hear that.

865 Render  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:32:17pm

re: #839 Cato the Elder

Nope. There is a reason why SOCOM ditched the 9mm as fast as they could, replacing it with a 45acp.

Police work is not combat. Combat is not police work.

BIGGER
IS
BETTER,
R

866 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:33:59pm

re: #863 Charles

Don't candy-coat it. Tell us all how you really feel.

I prefer the nuance...
///

867 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:35:13pm

re: #860 Render

uh-huh...

There is, or was, a Swedish Goteland class diesel sub rented for training by the US Navy.

The Polish built Finnish designed Rosomak 8-wheel APC may be on the short list to replace the canceled USMC EFV.

The M-60E4 machine gun is the logical end of the German MG-42 development line, although users of the MG-3 might argue that point.

The SOCOM Pistol Mk 23 Mod 0 45ACP is a Heckler & Koch product.

There is actually a long standing tradition for this sort of thing. The US Model 1903 Springfield and Model 1917 Enfield bolt actions rifles were little more then warmed over Mauser designs. The Browning Model 1917 machine gun, although designed and patented by American John Browning was initially refused for US service, but put into production for the Polish Army by Browning's Belgian employer at the time, FN.

The first US tanks in service were elderly French FT-17's, Patton was less then amused.

WHAT
WORKS,
R

Also, don't forget that the main US HMG of WWI was the British Vicker Gun in 30-06. We also used the French Chauchut in both 30-06 and its original 8mm. The French weapon however, became known as the Worst. Machine. Gun. Ever.

868 rightymouse  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:36:02pm

re: #864 LGoPs

I'm sorry to hear that.

Yeah - was not a happy day. However, he wasn't named after one of the dogs in "All Dogs Go to Heaven" for nothing. :)

869 SasquatchOnSteroids  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:37:21pm

re: #862 calcajun

Just a bit high strung is it?

Used to be. My problem with him is he's a smartass.
That dog has figured outexactly how to hit my nerve.
I'm not hearing voices or inhaling incense,BTW.
That dog is too friggin' smart for his own good.

870 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:38:54pm

re: #842 The 1SG

For that matter why not a .22 and just have good shot placement.

Heaven forbid but if I ever have to shoot at someone I want to stop them in their tracks, not annoy them.
/

871 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:40:05pm

re: #865 Render

Nope. There is a reason why SOCOM ditched the 9mm as fast as they could, replacing it with a 45acp.

Police work is not combat. Combat is not police work.

BIGGER
IS
BETTER,
R

True dat. For citizen self-defense, though, I like my H&K P7M8 best of all. Small, foolproof, ambidextrous, absolutely safe for round-in-chamber carry, and if the bad guy gets it away from you, he probably won't be able to figure out how the hell to shoot the damn thing before you can pull your backup and reclaim it.

Squeeze-cocker. Yeah.

872 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:41:58pm

re: #867 Dark_Falcon

Also, don't forget that the main US HMG of WWI was the British Vicker Gun in 30-06. We also used the French Chauchut in both 30-06 and its original 8mm. The French weapon however, became known as the Worst. Machine. Gun. Ever.

The French are unrivaled in manufacturing surrender flags...
/

873 Render  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:42:19pm

re: #867 Dark_Falcon

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Accurate enough information, at the moment.

PENDING
EDITS,
R

874 zombie  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:43:10pm

re: #863 Charles

Note my comment at #848.

Facts is facts. Ain't nothing you can do about 'em.

875 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:45:05pm

Later lizards

876 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:55:49pm

re: #869 SasquatchOnSteroids

Used to be. My problem with him is he's a smartass.
That dog has figured outexactly how to hit my nerve.
I'm not hearing voices or inhaling incense,BTW.
That dog is too friggin' smart for his own good.

...riiighht. Gee, look at the time...///

877 calcajun  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 5:56:33pm

re: #874 zombie

Note my comment at #848.

Facts is facts. Ain't nothing you can do about 'em.

When the fact do not conform to the theory, they must be disposed of. --Maier's Law.

878 Render  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:00:40pm

re: #872 LGoPs

Once upon a time the French military establishment believed that sheer will power and courage (Elan) could overcome the streams of machine gun bullets and rapid firing light artillery. To prove it they sent millions of young Frenchmen over the tops of the trenches with fixed bayonets. Over and over again they repeated the same futile and stupid attacks, charging blindly into walls of lead, and the British Army went right along with them.

Stupid, bloody, and futile yes. But they never showed the white flag at Verdun or the Somme. They were stupid, bloody, and futile again in South East Asia in the 1950's, but their courage was unquestioned, even by their opponents of the time.

Question the leadership, not the individual fighting soldier.

PLAN
17,
R

879 ibmkeyboard  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:06:03pm

Nurse Mary Mapes gave all of Obamas birth documents to Lucy Ramirez.

just wish Dan Rather was still around to find them for us.

880 erp  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:07:37pm

I still don't think they were married. He had a wife or two back home.

881 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:09:59pm

re: #878 Render

Once upon a time the French military establishment believed that sheer will power and courage (Elan) could overcome the streams of machine gun bullets and rapid firing light artillery. To prove it they sent millions of young Frenchmen over the tops of the trenches with fixed bayonets. Over and over again they repeated the same futile and stupid attacks, charging blindly into walls of lead, and the British Army went right along with them.

Stupid, bloody, and futile yes. But they never showed the white flag at Verdun or the Somme. They were stupid, bloody, and futile again in South East Asia in the 1950's, but their courage was unquestioned, even by their opponents of the time.

Question the leadership, not the individual fighting soldier.

PLAN
17,
R

Do not mention comment plan #17. ;)

882 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:10:37pm

re: #880 erp

GAZE

883 AreaMan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:12:11pm

Charles is showing us an original hand-written certificate. This is what people have been asking for. The Obama computer printout does not give the name of the hospital or the doctor, or the address of the mother, or the name of the local registrar; The handwritten version does. Information is missing. Computer printouts are not trustworthy.

Also, Hawaiian law in 1961 was so loose that it was pretty easy to give the government false birth data. You could simply tell them you had a baby and they'd issue a certificate.

This article has useful information. Although they accuse factcheck.org of lying when they're merely confused.

Factcheck says they've touched the original birth certificate, then they go on to explain that this is not possible.

884 BlackFedora  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:14:12pm

What I will never understand is why anyone thought there was reason to believe the information on the so called "long form" would be any different from the certificate of live birth. Why would that ever be?

885 AreaMan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:17:32pm

1. It is rarely possible to really prove where someone was born. If you'd planned it, could you have registered your kids birth in another state?

2. The Hawaiian law against releasing original birth certificates to the public is very suspicious. Can you think of a good reason for it? Does it cause problems in other states?

In the future, political parties will be reluctant to nominate people from Hawaii, as their qualifications cannot be verified. Is this a violation of the rights of Hawaiians?

886 McJenny50  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:22:58pm

re: #368 drcordell


And yes, I have seen Bush's transcript. His 4-year average was a 77. This isn't a disputed fact. Source

I missed the 77 part. Could you point out where it is?

887 AreaMan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:23:35pm

re #884 BlackFedora:

The long and short form could only contradict if there were forgery. That is what they are implying.

I don't actually have strong beliefs about Obama's birth, but I'm upset that everybody has been using crappy arguments on both sides.

888 horse  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:26:20pm

Wow, near 900 comments on this thread. This topic may never die.

The fact is Obama was born an American citizen. Nothing else matters, not his mom, his dad, his "religion" at birth, his doctor, his "ethnicity" at birth, ... nothing on the document matters except it proves he was born an American citizen. It will not change or influence anything. I swear this whole issue is a planted red herring to make a number of republicans appear ridiculous, and they keep running with it like they have the secret map to the crypt holding the holy grail.

889 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:26:49pm

re: #885 AreaMan

1. It is rarely possible to really prove where someone was born. If you'd planned it, could you have registered your kids birth in another state?

2. The Hawaiian law against releasing original birth certificates to the public is very suspicious. Can you think of a good reason for it? Does it cause problems in other states?

In the future, political parties will be reluctant to nominate people from Hawaii, as their qualifications cannot be verified. Is this a violation of the rights of Hawaiians?

To answer those questions:

1. No. Birth Certificates are generally filled out at a hospital. Obama's was filled out by a doctor, so it being in error is very doubtful.

2. The Birth Certificate forms Hawaii provides are good enough for employers and they satisfy government requirements. This question is a red herring.

Your last statement strikes me as Nirtherism. My advise: Drop this topic.

890 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:36:53pm

re: #883 AreaMan

re: #885 AreaMan

re: #887 AreaMan

There's always one who shows up after everyone else has moved on and tries to get the party going again. Good luck, wacko.

891 AreaMan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:38:34pm

re: #889 Dark_Falcon

1. Which doctor? The computer printout does not say, but the handwritten one does. I suppose this could be "Hidden info".

2. Your argument is just assuming the answer.

Computer printouts meet "Government requirements" because they're issued by a government. Not decisive.

My question about nominating Hawaiians is odd, but political parties are pretty strange in election season.

892 AreaMan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:41:14pm

re: #890 Cato the Elder

It might be a question of time zones.
Wacko?

893 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:42:18pm

Oh, for Pete's sake. Not again.

894 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:44:24pm

re: #885 AreaMan

2. The Hawaiian law against releasing original birth certificates to the public is very suspicious. Can you think of a good reason for it? Does it cause problems in other states?

It was put in place solely for the purpose of hustling a Kenyan/Indonesian Muslim Manchurian Candidate into the highest office in the land. The planning took decades, but it finally paid off. Anything can be forged, even simultaneous birth announcements in newspapers archived all over the country that haven't been accessed since 1961. You're right. Why didn't I see it before? George Soros and Vladimir Putin make one hell of a sneaky team.

Novus Ordo Saeclorum and all that, don't you know...

895 AreaMan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:44:46pm

re: #893 Charles

I didn't mean to upset anybody. Really.

896 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:44:56pm

re: #892 AreaMan

It might be a question of time zones.
Wacko?

Waco, maybe?

897 harpsicon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:47:16pm

re: #247 Killgore Trout

According to wiki he graduated from Harvard law school magna cum laude. I'm guessing he had a 3.8 or 3.9 GPA for that.

But according to a lady who worked with him at the Law Review (but who didn't go public with this until after the election because it wouldn't have been "fair"), he "worked from home a lot" i.e. didn't show up. And apparently he never wrote anything either, a first for a Law Review president. And yes, as someone pointed out 3.8 or 3.9 would have been summa cum laude. Since Law School grading is probably a lot more subjective than engineering school grading, I could see how maybe the first black president of the Law Review might be graded generously.

If most of my leftist friends didn't always insist that Obama is "the smartest man in the room" and that it's such a great thing (for a change!) to have such a man as president, I wouldn't care. But proving that he is no such thing would be very useful, because it might just deflate a large number of his supporters.

The main thing to point out to such people is that in the Ivies back then a substantial majority of people graduated (undergraduate) with some sort of honors. In my class it was some 70%. This is a matter of public record, and Obama did not graduate Columbia with honors. So he was clearly in the bottom half of his class.

But he got into Harvard Law. Right...

Bush and his like may have been "legacies", i.e. children of the rich and famous, who really had no business being there, but Obama was clearly an affirmative action admit who equally had no business being there, based on the usual criteria.

That's why I would love to get a look at those not-so-great grades, because it would do a great deal to silence the academic type of Obama sycophant, even now after the election.

898 AreaMan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:48:02pm

re: #894 Cato the Elder

You're being silly. I didn't mean the law was put in place for Obama. I was wondering what it was for. A friend suggested that some Hawaiians might actually be from elsewhere in the Pacific Islands, but I don't know if that's realistic.

It is off-topic, but what's the confidentiality for?

899 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:49:53pm

re: #891 AreaMan

GAZE

900 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:52:14pm

re: #898 AreaMan

You're being silly. I didn't mean the law was put in place for Obama. I was wondering what it was for. A friend suggested that some Hawaiians might actually be from elsewhere in the Pacific Islands, but I don't know if that's realistic.

It is off-topic, but what's the confidentiality for?

Here's an article that you might profit from reading:

Down with the Birthers

901 AreaMan  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:52:40pm

re: #899 Dark_Falcon

GAZE?

An acronym for something?

902 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 7:00:12pm

re: #901 AreaMan

GAZE?

An acronym for something?

Nope.

903 GGMac  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 7:02:29pm
Listen, I'm not saying that his grades are what qualify him, because if that was the case, I have a family member that was there when he was and most probably had higher grades from all the fellowships and prizes HE won, and I wouldn't want him as Pres.

That's not the point.

When you make your whole political existence about being the smartest man on the planet, do what the other pres have done, show us.

It's amazing.

All the Harvard/Yale, etc grads in teh Bush (including Bush) administration must have been the stupid Harvard people.


I'm calling out his narrative as BS.

I'm not speaking about diplomas as qualifications.

The Palin analogy would work if she and her peeps marketted her as a genius.

904 GGMac  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 7:08:56pm

re: #903 GGMac

Re: #903 - not my comment. It was quoting someone way up-thread I was thinking about responding to, but changed my mind. Tried to clear the comment box, and touched 'post' by mistake, apparently.

Apologies for any confusion.

905 scrubjay  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 7:14:21pm

The good that can come out of all of this is that a law is passed stating that future candidates will have to present proof of qualification so that this situation is not repeated.

906 Cato the Elder  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 7:31:16pm

re: #905 scrubjay

The good that can come out of all of this is that a law is passed stating that future candidates will have to present proof of qualification so that this situation is not repeated.

What part of "he did that" do you not understand? No law needs to be passed.

Now, if we could pass a law making stupidity physically painful, that I could get behind.

Though all the squawking from the likes of you might be annoying.

907 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 7:36:46pm
908 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 7:37:14pm

re: #906 Cato the Elder

What part of "he did that" do you not understand? No law needs to be passed.

Now, if we could pass a law making stupidity physically painful, that I could get behind.

Though all the squawking from the likes of you might be annoying.

Jays are very noisy, that's true. ;)

909 danrudy  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 7:57:05pm

FOlks ...THIS is damn FUNNY...I came across this in another blog. The guy typed up a letter like the rather /bush memo regarding the Nirther conspiracy.
He got more hits on his blog then ever before and had to add a disclaimer at a later date that a joke becasue some fools were taking it seriously. It is Very funny!
[Link: blog.robballen.com...]

910 Macker  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 8:33:30pm

re: #184 Dianna

We already knew she was preggers. It was in all the puff-pieces!

Who's preggers?

911 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 8:49:37pm

One More Time -

Stated differently - doesn't matter. His mother was an American Female Human Being - Not a Cat or Dog, Not a Human Female of other than American nationality. Pres. Obama is a "Natural Born" American Citizen, at the very least, constructively - within the meaning of the US Constitution. Would he weren't US President - AND - He Is. Deal with it - work for his defeat if you do not like his policies (I am in that Camp.) - or work to support and re-elect him, if you believe in him and his policies. That is all.

-S-

912 The Monster  Wed, Jul 29, 2009 10:24:53pm

re: #17 Sharmuta

The burden of proof is not on Obama- it is on the nirthers to provide reasonable evidence he was not born in the United States. What Obama is doing here is upholding the rule of law. He is innocent until proven guilty.

That makes no sense at all. His records are sealed, requiring him to release them. Since he controls access to the information that would prove his place of birth, it is impossible for anyone else to prove anything without his cooperation.

The new-style CertificatION Of Live Birth does not carry any signature, nor does specify which hospital, the name of the attending physician, or a great deal of information that the original "long-form" CertificATE Of Live Birth shows.

Nor does this view of someone else's long-form CoLB debunk the idea that there is something on it that Obama doesn't want us to see. It merely debunks the idea that the religion of the child is the particular thing in question.

The fact remains that Obama himself has refused to allow anyone to see his original birth certificate, his school records from Indonesia, Princeton, or Harvard, and the passport information that would show whether he used his US passport to travel to Pock-EE-stohn, or perhaps instead used an Indonesian passport.

Because if he travelled as an adult on a passport issued by some other country, he may legally have renounced his citizenship, and regained it later when he decided to enter into a political career. As a re-naturalized citizen, there is a reasonable argument that he therefore isn't a natural-born citizen. These are interesting legal questions, which have never been answered, because no court has allowed the questions to be decided. Instead, the courts that have had suits come before them have all insisted that the plaintiffs lacked standing to do so, as if a mere citizen has no right to challenge the qualifications of a candidate for office.

By wrapping up all of the questions being asked into the single package called "Birtherism" or "Nirtherism", it becomes possible to take the statement by a HI official that the records do in fact indicate that Obama was born there as a refutation of all of the other questions.

But that's not the worst rejection I've heard of the Nirthers. The most disgusting of all goes this way: "He won the election, and you can't just invalidate the election on a 'technicality'; there would be riots if that happened."

In January, Obama took (and later retook, to make sure the words were in the right order) an oath of office to uphold and defend the Constitution. The qualifications for his office clearly stated therein are not a "technicality"; they are the legal basis for the oaths taken by every other USGOV employee to follow his executive orders, including the military. If you have never taken an oath to uphold and defend the Constitution, maybe you just don't understand how important it is to those who have.

And that's who filed the most recent suit; uniformed servicemen, who need to know that the orders they are following are lawful, no matter how popular the person giving them, may be.

913 gonecamping  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 4:53:19am

Charles, can you organize a 'Nirther Race'? Get a whole bunch of those camels with the nirth certificate firmly in mouth, stick all all the nut cases who focus on the issue on top of the camels and let them run till we can't see or hear them.

Sheesh, socialism is being hoisted upon us, our Rights are being trampled and they are fixated on a bit of paper...like it is going to vanquish the problem.

914 Render  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 5:50:27am

re: #912 The Monster

Excuse me.

Only one "soldier", a Reserve Major, has filed suit that I know of. He hired a lawyer (the lunatic Orly Taitz), then volunteered for active duty, then refused to join his unit in Afghanistan, then filed suit. In that chronological order.

Collectively the Mil-bloggers who have commented on him refer to him as a "buddy-fucker", no better then the handful of anti-war scumbags that refused to serve their obligation during the previous administration.

Next time you might consider doing some basic research before you invalidate your entire premise with such a blatant misrepresentation of the facts.

NO
FOOLIN,
R

915 Yashmak  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 7:11:10am

re: #912 The Monster

That makes no sense at all. His records are sealed, requiring him to release them. Since he controls access to the information that would prove his place of birth, it is impossible for anyone else to prove anything without his cooperation.

Nonsense. The state of Hawaii has certified and re-certified his birth certificate several times, probably exasperated by the insistence that this means nothing from folks who wouldn't be satisfied if they held Obama's 'original' birth certificate in their own hands. I can hear them now, grumbling "It still could be a fake!"

The new-style CertificatION Of Live Birth does not carry any signature, nor does specify which hospital, the name of the attending physician, or a great deal of information that the original "long-form" CertificATE Of Live Birth shows.

The local newspaper carried the announcement of his birthday, and specification of which hospital it occurred at, or the name of the attending physician or what-have-you is pretty irrelevant, unless you think Obama went back in time and altered the local newspaper. He was born in Hawaii, end of story.

Nor does this view of someone else's long-form CoLB debunk the idea that there is something on it that Obama doesn't want us to see. It merely debunks the idea that the religion of the child is the particular thing in question.

What, do you think it reveals that he was born with a tail? Maybe he was the brundle-fly baby? Please.

The fact remains that Obama himself has refused to allow anyone to see his original birth certificate, his school records from Indonesia, Princeton, or Harvard, and the passport information that would show whether he used his US passport to travel to Pock-EE-stohn, or perhaps instead used an Indonesian passport.

Or maybe, just maybe, it's because he recognizes that there are plenty of conspriacy kooks out there on the right too, ready and willing to make all conservatives look foolish by going on and on about this. All he has to do to sustain it is simply hold back a bit of irrelevant documentation here, another bit there, for them to latch onto with their kookery.

Render replied to the 'serviceman' issue perfectly.

916 Yashmak  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 7:13:53am

re: #905 scrubjay

The good that can come out of all of this is that a law is passed stating that future candidates will have to present proof of qualification so that this situation is not repeated.

Thing is, there IS no "situation". His birth certificate has been verified, certified, etc. etc.

917 Yashmak  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 7:17:11am

re: #884 BlackFedora

What I will never understand is why anyone thought there was reason to believe the information on the so called "long form" would be any different from the certificate of live birth. Why would that ever be?

It's called 'grasping at straws'.

918 scogind  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 8:19:14am

Wouldn't it be funny if Obama's GPA turned out to be lower than Bush's?

919 martinsmithy  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 8:35:51am

The other theory (if you want to call anything these nuts come up with as a "theory") is that Obama won't authorize release of his birth certificate (which apparently can't be released even if he authorizes it!) because it shows a different father than Barack Hussein Obama Sr.

Maybe Malcolm X ... :)

920 Charles Johnson  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 9:19:30am

I'm not going to tolerate idiots who promote Nirtherism at LGF.

"The Monster" is blocked.

921 Charles Johnson  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 9:28:53am

I notice that the Nirthers are moving the goalposts now that they're getting called out for their idiocy -- now they want to to see Obama's other records.

922 keithgabryelski  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 9:59:28am

Thanks for the front page mention, Charles. I wish I could have been around for the discussion. It's our anniversary week and we are on island time and connectivity. I'll see you all in a few.

923 shropshire_slasher  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 10:07:58am

Charles,
With all due respect I disagree. I understand how the law is written and that it doesn't matter where he was born because his mother is a citizen, but the 1962 certificate of live birth does not look like Bam's certification of live birth. This to me just raises more questions, thats all. I know when I went to get mine to go overseas, it looked like the 1962 image, with a raised seal, which they embossed there. I understand your desire to keep your excellent website legitimate, but to compare the two didn't help. On a side note, the KOS KIDZ are foaming at the mouth over this burf cert, so that at least is fun to watch!

924 Charles Johnson  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 11:31:56am

Argh.

925 Salamantis  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 12:01:30pm

"Raises more questions"; another cliche Nirther trope...

926 Nomorelies  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 1:18:59pm

[Ed. note: Account blocked for rampant Nirtherism.]

Oops. At the bottom left of the green birth certificate it clearly notes that the form was revised in 11/01 (November 2001) on a Laser. The type is printed on a laser which surely was not available in 1962. This birth certificate is not an original. It is clearly meant to be an authorized copy of the original birth certificate. However, there simply must be an original birth certificate somewhere and the American public has every right to demand and be allowed to see the original. This is not funny. It is not transparent. We should not be forced to take his word for it. We should file a lawsuit and demand that he produce his original birth certificate. It is our duty as citizens of the United States to protect the process of protecting our civil liberties for our future generations. Political pundits and liars should not be allowed to take away the people's rights. Funny jokes and twittering and buzzing on about this without getting to the truth is like lying down in front of a Sherman tank and waving a white flag. What has happened to America? All I see is a nation awash in cowards with yellow stripes up and down their backs whining about their self interest and unwilling to take stands.

Weenies.

927 Salamantis  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 1:44:52pm

The truth is that Barack Hussein Obama was born at 7:24 PM on August 4th, 1961 at Kapiolani Hospital in Honolulu Hawaii, of a natural born American citizen, maiden name Stanley Ann Dunham, and is thus himself a natural-born American citizen over the age of 35, and, whatever his other faults (and there are many), he is constitutionally qualified to stand for election to the US Presidency

Deal with it.

928 Charles Johnson  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 1:52:55pm

re: #926 Nomorelies

Bye now! Have fun storming the castle!

929 AreaMan  Thu, Jul 30, 2009 2:25:21pm

I personally have been required to get my original long-form hand-written birth certificate (from New York) to transact some business with foreign governments. They would not accept the short form computer printout, seal and all.

It was time-consuming and expensive to get the official copy that New York State sent me notarized for international use. The notarization is called an Apostille, as per the Hague Convention. It was all new to me.

New York has two procedures, an easy one to get the computer printout and a complex one for the copy of the hand-written certificate. So it's sort of a regular thing with them.

This may explain my interest in the matter.

And yes, the State Department was happy with the short-form printout in order to get a passport. So go figure.

And while New York is most definitely not Hawaii, there was a lot more info on the long form. I learned the name of the hospital where I was born, for example.

930 mikevp  Sat, Aug 1, 2009 12:01:56am

I don't know if there's anything "more" that Obama could show about the whole birth certificate than he already has. I do know that everything relevant to the question has been revealed.

As for any stonewalling on any further information... not that I assert there has been any; I tend to zone out and mutter whenever nirthers start going on and on... I can think of one very, very good reason why Obama would stonewall.

"Never interrupt your opponent when he is busy making a complete and utter fool of himself."

This whole stupid uproar over a ridiculous complete non-issue is making Republicans look ... stupid. Really, really stupid.

I keep looking for a party that represents my views and not finding one. When I saw there was a Constitution Party, I thought maybe that was the one, but they're ... not quite what I'm looking for.


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