Robert Spencer and the Extremists

World • Views: 5,355

Since Jihad Watch’s Robert Spencer has called me a liar — again — for reporting that he was hanging out with the bigots of the Christian Action Network and the English Defense League, here’s a post at Bartholomew’s Notes that illustrates — again — just how disingenuous Spencer can be: Guess Who’s Not Coming to Dinner? The English Defence League.

Little Green Footballs picked up on my recent blog entry about the Christian Action Network’s recent visit to the UK with Robert Spencer, during which the CAN met up with the English Defence League:

And look who’s hanging out with the English Defense League now, on a tour of Britain with wacko fundamentalist nutbag Martin Mawyer and his “Christian Action Network” — none other than Robert Spencer of Jihad Watch.
Robert Spencer responds:
Charles Johnson is lying — again. During my recent trip to the U.K., I did not “hang out” with members of the English Defense League. I did not meet with them, then or at any other time. What’s more, the link Johnson provides [that’s me! -RB] to establish this “hanging out” doesn’t even say I did meet with them.
What happened was that during August CAN director Martin Mawyer conducted an interview with some balaclava-wearing EDL leaders somewhere outside London, who were then were invited by CAN’s Jason Campbell to a meal at a restaurant in London the next night, at which Spencer would be dining with Douglas Murray, Adrian Morgan, and some other British conservative “anti-Jihadi” types. The original plan was for dinner at a restaurant called the George, but Spencer writes in another blog entry that due to the nature of the discussion they were asked to leave by the management (his entry includes the venue’s phone number, so that his minions can cause some vengeful annoyance).

Got that?

Spencer claims he never met with the English Defense League (although he obviously can’t deny meeting with the extremists of the Christian Action Network), and it’s actually true — as far as it goes. But in reality, the only reason he didn’t meet with them is because he and the leaders of CAN were thrown out of the restaurant before the meeting could occur.

There’s another point here too. The Christian Action Network is fully as extreme and bigoted as the English Defense League, although possibly not as dumbly violent. Here’s some background on the head of this whacked-out organization, Martin Mawyer: ‘A Mighty Army’.

Martin Mawyer, longtime editor of Jerry Falwell’s Moral Majority Report, founded the Christian Action Network (CAN) in 1990, a year after Falwell folded the original Moral Majority.

In his “dirty and dangerous” battle against “militant homosexual groups,” Mawyer has not held back. In 1997, after Ellen Degeneres came out as a lesbian on her TV sitcom, Mawyer accused her of “DUMPING HER FILTHY LESBIAN LIFESTYLE RIGHT IN THE CENTER OF YOUR LIVING ROOM!! … If we allow the tidal wave of gay and lesbian smut to continue to pour into our homes, it will utterly consume us in no time at all!”

In 1999, he asked the Federal Communications Commission to put an “HC [homosexual conduct] warning label” on TV programs with gay characters. The following year, CAN caused a national stir when TV stations refused to air its inflammatory ad attacking Hillary Clinton, who was then running for U.S. Senate.

Over ominous drumbeats, the narrator intoned: “It is rumored that Hillary Clinton is a lesbian. It is rumored that Hillary Clinton supported homosexual marriage. It is rumored that Hillary Clinton will leave her husband upon taking office. … Sometimes, rumors are true. Shouldn’t you know the truth? For more information on traditional family values, please contact the Christian Action Network.”

More recently, CAN protested “Gay Days” at Disney World and other theme parks — events that Mawyer’s wife and CAN partner, Bonnie, says demonstrate “the true intent of these homosexuals: they are after our children!!”

A 2000 Mawyer mailing incorporated militia-like paranoia: “I am not ready to give this great nation over to one-world government extremists … radical, disease-carrying homosexuals … anti-family lesbian feminists … or anti-American U.N. globalists!”

CAN activists today are familiar faces at Gay Days, videotaping “bad behavior.” In 2003, CAN turned its footage of “homosexual kissing, hugging and fondling” into a video tour of the Southeast, warning parents about the perils of Gay Days and warning that “homosexuals live in a pattern of sin and debauchery.”

Jump to bottom

734 comments
1 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:26:09pm

Fuck the haters.

2 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:28:50pm

He was set up!

///

3 Kronocide  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:29:10pm

So he was waiting to me them, but got kicked out before they showed up?

Then he was waiting to meet them.

4 mpoulos42  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:29:40pm

And fuck their apologists.

5 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:31:40pm
But in reality, the only reason he didn’t meet with them is because he and the leaders of CAN were thrown out of the restaurant before the meeting could occur

"I've been thrown out of nicer places than this!" he reportedly huffed.

/

6 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:31:55pm

Busted!
I really wonder how bad the dinner conversation was to get them thrown out of the restaurant.

7 Land Shark  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:32:20pm

Whoa, Robert! How do you expect to get rid of them fascist fleas if 'ya keep lying down with them fascist dogs???

I'm just sayin'...

8 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:36:27pm

This guy found nazi runes and BNP members on the English Defense League's facebook page...
English Defence League: The Real Face (Updated)

9 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:36:39pm

I'm reminded of the various "getting thrown out of 'Applebees'" scenes from Talladega Nights, for some reason.

10 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:37:28pm

Way to go, Charles.
Spencer has become such a weasel.

11 What, me worry?  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:37:49pm

Achem...

Over ominous drumbeats, the narrator intoned: “It is rumored that Hillary Clinton is a lesbian. It is rumored that Hillary Clinton supported homosexual marriage. It is rumored that Hillary Clinton will leave her husband upon taking office. ... Sometimes, rumors are true. Shouldn’t you know the truth? For more information on traditional family values, please contact the Christian Action Network.”

Please note that homophobia does not exist. OK? Got that? Nunca. Nada. No way, Jose!

This has been a public service announcement.

12 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:37:51pm

I will post it here AGAIN, because it is such a lovely footnote to almost any stink that seems to follow Spencer...

"Robert, can you answer one simple question for me. This would help a lot in deciding what is really going on here. Which European political parties do you UNCONDITIONALLY condemn because of their proven ties to racist nationalism?" (Walter L. Newton email to Robert Spencer sent on Friday, November 07, 2008 1:16 PM)

And his answer...

"Actually, I am fighting jihad, and have no interest in or intention to investigate these groups. Insofar as they are fighting jihad, I applaud them. Insofar as they are doing anything else, my endorsement is not implied." (Robert Spencer email answer to Walter L. Newton sent on Sat 11/8/2008 10:39 AM)

It's almost as if he finds some overwhelming desire to live up to his answer above, over and over and over...

13 Kragar  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:38:05pm

Can't we just take people for their word anymore? Do we have to keep dragging silly things like facts and evidence into the conversation?

/

14 MandyManners  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:39:58pm

re: #8 Killgore Trout

This guy found nazi runes and BNP members on the English Defense League's facebook page...
English Defence League: The Real Face (Updated)

What does that rune mean?

15 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:40:33pm

Boogey boo! Scary Christians are eeeverywhere! Oooo!

(Seriously, we can pick on fringe groups all day. That doesn't mean that it has any relevance in matters of *actual* importance.)

Regards,
Brian

16 MandyManners  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:41:10pm

re: #13 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Can't we just take people for their word anymore? Do we have to keep dragging silly things like facts and evidence into the conversation?

/

Who ya' gonna' believe: me or your lyin' eyes?

17 HelloDare  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:41:21pm

I trust Douglas Murray mentioned above. His group, The Center for Social Cohesion, has done a lot to expose the neo-Nazi ideology ideology of the BNP and other groups. (You can download the report The BNP and the Online Fascist Network at his website.)

Charles posted about Murray here.

18 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:41:28pm

re: #14 MandyManners

What does that rune mean?

"There is a great deal of rune in a nation."

-Adam Smith

/

19 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:41:34pm

re: #14 MandyManners

What does that rune mean?

Does it really matter?
Use of these pseudo-Volkisch symbols is a wink and a nod to those in the know; whatever it says, it's bound to be unpleasant, by virtue of the chosen manner of presentation.

20 MandyManners  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:41:40pm

re: #15 snapped shot

THAT'S NOT THE FUCKING POINT!

21 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:41:48pm

Well, I guess now we know which side you're picking, right, Brian?

22 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:42:32pm

re: #15 snapped shot

Boogey boo! Scary Christians are eeeverywhere! Oooo!

(Seriously, we can pick on fringe groups all day. That doesn't mean that it has any relevance in matters of *actual* importance.)

Regards,
Brian

Does it have any relevance to your shilling for Spencer in the previous thread? Hmmm?

23 mpoulos42  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:42:53pm

re: #15 snapped shot

You're an apologist.

24 Kragar  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:42:54pm

Calif. GOP lawmaker caught bragging about affairs

SACRAMENTO, Calif. — A Republican state lawmaker from Southern California was ousted Wednesday from two legislative committees after he was caught on tape bragging about having sex with female lobbyists.

Assemblyman Mike Duvall of Yorba Linda made the comments to another man during a break in a committee meeting at the Capitol over the summer, and they were caught on a microphone at his desk.

In a recording of the hearing broadcast by KCAL-TV in Los Angeles, the 54-year-old lawmaker talks about a recent sexual escapade with a woman he says is 18 years younger than him.

"I like spanking her," he is heard to say on the videotape. "She goes, 'I know you like spanking me.' I said, 'Yeah, that's cause you're such a bad girl.'"

He then brags about an affair he is having with another lobbyist.

Duvall apologized Wednesday for the comments on his campaign Web site.

"I made a mistake and I sincerely apologize," he said in the brief statement. "I deeply regret the comments I made in what I believed to be a private conversation. This is a private matter and I ask that everyone respect the privacy of all involved."

25 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:42:59pm

re: #15 snapped shot

Boogey boo! Scary Christians are eeeverywhere! Oooo!

(Seriously, we can pick on fringe groups all day. That doesn't mean that it has any relevance in matters of *actual* importance.)

Regards,
Brian

When the fringe groups are taken as the majority voice because no one disavows them it becomes highly relevant.

26 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:42:59pm

From Jihad Watch (aka Robert Spencer):

August 19, 2009
Oh, to be in England

Actually, I am in England, having arrived this morning via transatlantic kayak from Jihad Watch headquarters in Secure Undisclosed Locationville. I'll be working this week on a documentary about the Islamization of the U.K. and Europe with the Christian Action Network, producers of the documentary Homegrown Jihad.

I'll be posting as much as time permits, and will try to work in a few observations about the local scene.

27 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:43:13pm

Spencer is hanging out with religious supremacists. And I'm supposed to think his joining a genocidal Facebook group to reconquer Turkey was an accident. Riiight.

28 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:43:24pm
29 Erik The Red  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:44:00pm

re: #15 snapped shot

Boogey boo! Scary Christians are eeeverywhere! Oooo!

(Seriously, we can pick on fringe groups all day. That doesn't mean that it has any relevance in matters of *actual* importance.)

Regards,
Brian

Hey Brian, my guess is that you really don't want to add anything of value here. Why don't you just piss off to your own blog and write about whatever you want to. :)))
Regards,
ETR

30 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:44:05pm

re: #21 Charles

Well, I guess now we know which side you're picking, right, Brian?

Still not picking any sides. And even though I am one of those "scary Christians," I still know groups which are irrelevant when I see them.

Regards,
Brian

31 MandyManners  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:44:18pm

re: #19 Guanxi88

Does it really matter?
Use of these pseudo-Volkisch symbols is a wink and a nod to those in the know; whatever it says, it's bound to be unpleasant, by virtue of the chosen manner of presentation.

Yes, it matters to me. I'm curious.

32 JHW  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:44:23pm

re: #14 MandyManners

Some of those are Waffen SS divisional insignia, something analogous to shoulder patches.

33 Ojoe  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:44:40pm

God loves everyone.

34 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:44:51pm

re: #15 snapped shot

Boogey boo! Scary Christians are eeeverywhere! Oooo!

Sorry to hear you think it's "Christian" to support neo-Nazi groups.

35 SpaceJesus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:45:08pm

what? people of a different religion and homosexuals in MY country?

why I never.

36 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:45:35pm

re: #28 Killgore Trout

Horizontally aligned Wolfsangel[

[Link: www.adl.org...]

ss units dug it pretty special.

37 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:46:01pm

re: #15 snapped shot

Boogey boo! Scary Christians are eeeverywhere! Oooo!

(Seriously, we can pick on fringe groups all day. That doesn't mean that it has any relevance in matters of *actual* importance.)

Some though al-qaeda was fringe.

38 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:47:07pm

re: #37 Sharmuta

Some though al-qaeda was fringe.

Yeah, all 50 people that knew about al-queda before 9/11.

39 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:47:08pm

re: #28 Killgore Trout

oops, meant to link to this: Wolfsangel


Due to its use by Nazi Germany, along with continuing use by Neo-Nazi organizations, the symbol is sometimes associated with Nazism as are many of the old folk symbols of the Germanic peoples, most notably the swastika.
40 SpaceJesus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:47:15pm

re: #30 snapped shot

Still not picking any sides. And even though I am one of those "scary Christians," I still know groups which are irrelevant when I see them.

Regards,
Brian


is it wrong of me to think that signing every single post on the internet with your name and a salutation is fucking stupid?

41 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:47:18pm

re: #23 mpoulos42

You're an apologist.

No I'm not - as I said before, I'm neutral. Charles and Robert can have their battles - I'm staying out of it.

Regards,
Brian

42 MandyManners  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:47:19pm

re: #28 Killgore Trout

Horizontally aligned Wolfsangel[

Thanks!

Second SS Panzer Divsion.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

43 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:47:32pm

re: #30 snapped shot

Still not picking any sides. And even though I am one of those "scary Christians," I still know groups which are irrelevant when I see them.

Regards,
Brian

So, Robert " I'll be working this week on a documentary about the Islamization of the U.K. and Europe with the Christian Action Network, producers of the documentary Homegrown Jihad" Spencer is irrelevant since he is also working hand in hand with that irrelevant CAN group?

Got it.

See Charles, he is on your side, he's just being coy about it.

44 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:47:39pm

re: #36 Guanxi88

Thanks.

45 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:47:40pm

re: #34 Killgore Trout

Sorry to hear you think it's "Christian" to support neo-Nazi groups.

Ouch.

That had to hurt!

46 JHW  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:47:58pm

re: #28 Killgore Trout

That particular one was, as noted in the link you provided, the insignia of the SS division Das Reich, a murderous outfit.
Oradour-sur-Glane

47 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:48:00pm

re: #41 snapped shot

Neutral on nazis. Dude- it's just not cool.

48 Ojoe  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:48:12pm

re: #30 snapped shot

All is relevant. Words find actors.

49 MandyManners  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:48:37pm

Gotta' git. Have a great afternoon, Lizards!

50 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:48:51pm

re: #33 Ojoe

God loves everyone.

Even "Clippy", the Microsoft overly-helpful icon? Come on!

51 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:48:52pm

re: #43 Walter L. Newton

See Charles, he is on your side, he's just being coy about it.

There seems to be quite a few of those...

52 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:49:05pm

re: #47 Sharmuta

Neutral on nazis. Dude- it's just not cool.

Neutral on the Johnson/Spencer dispute. Beyond that, and you're putting words in my mouth, Sharmuta.

B.

53 Ojoe  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:49:19pm

re: #50 Occasional Reader

I meant actual people

LOL

54 Charpete67  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:49:41pm

re: #41 snapped shot

No I'm not - as I said before, I'm neutral. Charles and Robert can have their battles - I'm staying out of it.

Regards,
Brian

wow...you're annoying

regards charpete...

55 HelloDare  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:50:36pm

re: #15 snapped shot

Boogey boo! Scary Christians are eeeverywhere! Oooo!

Ned Flanders? Ned, is that you?

56 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:50:42pm

re: #52 snapped shot

No- I'm not putting words in your mouth. Spencer DOESN'T CARE if he's in bed with nazis, and you don't care either.

You enable a fascist enabler with your neutrality.

57 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:51:05pm

re: #30 snapped shot

Are you trying to set a negative karma record, clean sweep the bottom 10 comments, and get banned all in one day?

There is a growing plague of paleocons, neonazis, and religious dominionists who are insinuating themselves into the conservative movements as we speak. They are using opposition to jihad (which is a legitimate concern) as a cover for racism and religious intolerance and current economic woes as an opportunity to mainstream anti-semitic or otherwise kooky conspiracy theories about the banking system. If you think this "is not a big deal" you either need to do some serious soul searching, or you are one of them.

58 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:52:24pm

re: #57 ArchangelMichael

Are you trying to set a negative karma record, clean sweep the bottom 10 comments, and get banned all in one day?

There is a growing plague of paleocons, neonazis, and religious dominionists who are insinuating themselves into the conservative movements as we speak. They are using opposition to jihad (which is a legitimate concern) as a cover for racism and religious intolerance and current economic woes as an opportunity to mainstream anti-semitic or otherwise kooky conspiracy theories about the banking system. If you think this "is not a big deal" you either need to do some serious soul searching, or you are one of them.

Neutral defined.

59 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:52:43pm

re: #47 Sharmuta

Neutral on nazis. Dude- it's just not cool.

"The worst thing you can be is a liar...Okay fine, yes, the worst thing you can be is a Nazi, but THEN, number two is liar. Nazi 1, Liar 2"

-shitmydadsays

60 Kragar  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:52:51pm

'Israel link' in Arctic Sea case

Israel was linked to the interception of the missing cargo ship Arctic Sea last month, a senior figure close to Israeli intelligence has told the BBC.

The source said Israel had told Moscow it knew the ship was secretly carrying a Russian air defence system for Iran.

Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov has dismissed speculation that S-300 missiles were on board the ship.

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, meanwhile, has denied making a secret visit to Moscow on Monday.

61 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:53:01pm

re: #56 Sharmuta

No- I'm not putting words in your mouth. Spencer DOESN'T CARE if he's in bed with nazis, and you don't care either.

You enable a fascist enabler with your neutrality.

At how many levels does the enabler-enabling stop, my friend? All I did was show up to comment on the economic thread from earlier. As they always say: Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!

Regards,
Brian

62 Athos  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:53:12pm

re: #41 snapped shot

So you don't see the need to not stand with neo nazi hate organizations? Isn't that neutrality a decision that effectively places you in a position of enabling their agenda?

63 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:53:17pm

re: #45 Occasional Reader

Ouch.

That had to hurt!

I think the proper word now is Butthurt?

Though I'm surprised the response wasn't:

"Sorry to hear you think it's "neo-Nazi" to support Christian groups."

64 What, me worry?  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:53:24pm

re: #15 snapped shot

Nice website, Bri. First line "Democrats kill soldiers." Oh is that right? Well maybe you can tell me then why the Democrats were the ones supporting body armor for the troops?

On March 20, 2003, Sen. Mary Landrieu (D-LA) introduced legislation which would have provided funding to correct what she described as the "underfunding [of] our Guard and Reserve" and "the lack of equipment, the lack of money in this budget to fund their current operations." She added, "For too long, the Guard and Reserve have received hand-me-downs from the Active component."

65 Erik The Red  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:54:54pm

OT:
Hey Lizards, if you are a iPhone owner there is a new software update 3.1

66 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:55:01pm

Great green gobs of greasy gamy buttocks meat
Trollie toes we love to eat
Smelly dirty sockpuppet feet
Fresh fried flounces floating in a pot of drool
Warm up the bar-be-que!

67 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:55:11pm

re: #62 Athos

So you don't see the need to not stand with neo nazi hate organizations? Isn't that neutrality a decision that effectively places you in a position of enabling their agenda?

Dude, seriously. If you can find a single scrap of evidence that I *personally* stand with neo-nazi hate organizations, I'm game. Otherwise, what the heck does it have to do with *me?*

Regards,
Brian

68 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:55:49pm

re: #59 ArchangelMichael

"The worst thing you can be is a liar...Okay fine, yes, the worst thing you can be is a Nazi, but THEN, number two is liar. Nazi 1, Liar 2"

-shitmydadsays

That is a great site!

"The dog don't like you planting stuff there. It's his backyard. If you're the only one who shits in something, you own it. Remember that."

Words to live by.
World to die by.

69 mpoulos42  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:56:01pm

re: #52 snapped shot

Wow, you're such a profile of courage. If only all people faced with neo-nazi sympathizers could just stay out of it like you.

It would be a better world then.

///

70 MrSilverDragon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:56:01pm
CAN activists today are familiar faces at Gay Days, videotaping “bad behavior.” In 2003, CAN turned its footage of “homosexual kissing, hugging and fondling” into a video tour of the Southeast, warning parents about the perils of Gay Days and warning that “homosexuals live in a pattern of sin and debauchery.”

So do quite a few heterosexuals. Did you folks at CAN forget about them?

71 What, me worry?  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:56:10pm

re: #66 Alouette

Great green gobs of greasy gamy buttocks meat
Trollie toes we love to eat
Smelly dirty sockpuppet feet
Fresh fried flounces floating in a pot of drool
Warm up the bar-be-que!

heheh My nieces won't get it, but that's ok!

72 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:56:11pm

re: #61 snapped shot

At how many levels does the enabler-enabling stop, my friend? All I did was show up to comment on the economic thread from earlier. As they always say: Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!

Regards,
Brian

You notice that "Regards, Brian" has not answer a single one of my comments. It's easy for him to respond with empty rhetoric about opinions, but when shown actual documented proof of what some here conceive as a problem, he goes mum, unable to comment or form a coherent answer.

73 jill e  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:56:20pm

Hijacked plane in Mexico City. Police have stormed the plane...

74 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:56:21pm

re: #67 snapped shot

Dude, seriously. If you can find a single scrap of evidence that I *personally* stand with neo-nazi hate organizations, I'm game. Otherwise, what the heck does it have to do with *me?*

Regards,
Brian

Nothing...

Until they come for you, and no one is left to speak.

75 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:56:39pm

re: #64 marjoriemoon

Nice website, Bri. First line "Democrats kill soldiers." Oh is that right? Well maybe you can tell me then why the Democrats were the ones supporting body armor for the troops?

On March 20, 2003, Sen. Mary Landrieu (D-LA) introduced legislation which would have provided funding to correct what she described as the "underfunding [of] our Guard and Reserve" and "the lack of equipment, the lack of money in this budget to fund their current operations." She added, "For too long, the Guard and Reserve have received hand-me-downs from the Active component."

And yet, she voted against it?

Not the strongest case of supporting our troops that I've ever seen, Marjorie...

Regards,
Brian

76 Erik The Red  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:56:56pm

re: #65 Erik The Red

OT:
Hey Lizards, if you are a iPhone owner there is a new software update 3.1

Don't rush though, the Apple site is slow as hell atm. Every iPhone user must be trying to do the same thing.

77 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:57:03pm

Snapped Shot is not Robert Spencer.

78 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:57:22pm

re: #65 Erik The Red

OT:
Hey Lizards, if you are a iPhone owner there is a new software update 3.1

Cool! Does it finally add the "Phaser" feature I've wanted?

79 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:57:52pm

re: #69 mpoulos42

Wow, you're such a profile of courage. If only all people faced with neo-nazi sympathizers could just stay out of it like you.

It would be a better world then.

If only I could comment on a website I presumed to be a friend of mine's without being held up in a trial for "thoughtcrimes" I did not commit.

Boy, what a crazy world that'd be.

B.

80 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:57:55pm

re: #67 snapped shot

Dude, seriously. If you can find a single scrap of evidence that I *personally* stand with neo-nazi hate organizations, I'm game. Otherwise, what the heck does it have to do with *me?*

I told you already- history repeats itself. It will certainly affect you if ethnic nationalism leads to war in europe again. Evil triumphs when good men do nothing.

81 Athos  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:58:01pm

re: #61 snapped shot

It's not an issue of levels...it's an issue of your own personal morals and the inability of those to take a position against neo-nazi hate organizations and the people who enable them.

Instead of condemning them, you attack the host and many posters by saying they have an anti-Christian agenda. Then you try to justify your position by masking it in neutrality...which means you do nothing...and therefore enables evil. Like Spencer, you are intellectually and morally bankrupt.

82 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:58:08pm

Hey folks... GAZE. Even his minimum input on the economic topic of this thread has been useless. Why would you expect a deeper discussion on enabling bigoted nationalist?

83 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:58:30pm

re: #5 Occasional Reader

"I've been thrown out of nicer places than this!" he reportedly huffed.

/

A flounce?

84 Kronocide  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:58:39pm

re: #41 snapped shot

Then stay out of it. Otherwise you're against both or for neither. Way to stand for nothing!

85 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:58:52pm

Charles:

I actually followed the whole debacle independently of LGF. You have the facts exactly right.

I have known about the Christian Action Network for years. They have some bad craziness regarding their stance on homosexuality. If these are the people the anti-jihad movement is relying upon for intelligence, then we are in deeper trouble than anyone realizes.

What is necessary is to support organizations that are both anti-jihad and also firmly anti-racist and support civil rights for gay people. There are organizations that do exist that fit those parameters - but they do not get enough coverage and funding. That is where energy should be placed.

86 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:58:55pm

re: #83 Creeping Eruption

A flounce?

A bounce!

87 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:58:59pm

re: #6 Killgore Trout

Busted!
I really wonder how bad the dinner conversation was to get them thrown out of the restaurant.

One does shudder to think.

88 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:59:22pm

re: #72 Walter L. Newton

You notice that "Regards, Brian" has not answer a single one of my comments. It's easy for him to respond with empty rhetoric about opinions, but when shown actual documented proof of what some here conceive as a problem, he goes mum, unable to comment or form a coherent answer.

I thought I responded to you on the previous thread, didn't I?

Must've gotten sidetracked.

Regards,
Brian

89 Kronocide  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:59:47pm

Oh noes he di-ent: Walter GAZED him!

90 Last Mohican  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:59:48pm

OT: Breaking News

A Mexican jet has been hijacked.

"Hijacked" may not be the right word. Three people took over the jet after it had landed, while it was on the ground, and threatened to blow it up if they weren't allowed to speak with the president of Mexico, who was in the airport in a different plane.

91 Erik The Red  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:59:51pm

re: #78 Occasional Reader

Cool! Does it finally add the "Phaser" feature I've wanted?

I don't know but I here they have a "Beam Me Up Scotty" application.

92 theheat  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 12:59:51pm

Already familiar with what Spencer has to offer, I jaunted over to the Christian Action Network, for another eye full of hateful bullshit wrapped in a flag and pinned with a cross.

You have Nazis on this side, pious haters on the other... it all gives me an enormous headache in my eye.

Oh, and this from subsailor68 on the downstairs thread, because it was just as funny the second time around. Another family values cage rattler that can't keep his mouth shut or his pants zipped.

93 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:00:09pm

re: #87 Dianna

One does shudder to think.

I've actually been thrown out of a restaurant once (but only once). My friends and I were accuesd of - literally - laughing too loudly.

94 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:00:24pm

re: #88 snapped shot

I thought I responded to you on the previous thread, didn't I?

Must've gotten sidetracked.

Regards,
Brian

Link?

95 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:00:42pm

re: #87 Dianna

One does shudder to think.

And then not allowed in the next night, too. Must have been memorable.

96 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:00:53pm

re: #77 Ben Hur

Snapped Shot is not Robert Spencer.

Thanks for noticing, Ben! (I'm the homely one. Yuk yuk.)

B.

97 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:01:11pm

re: #87 Dianna

One does shudder to think.

A rousing rendition of Horst-Wessel-Lied?

98 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:01:27pm

re: #91 Erik The Red

I don't know but I here they have a "Beam Me Up Scotty" application.

Your desire for Scotty to "beam" you clearly indicates that you're one of these filthy homosexuals that CAN is warning us about! ! !

/

99 mpoulos42  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:02:00pm

re: #79 snapped shot

Dude, I'm accusing you of being a coward. Not of "thoughtcrimes".

100 Last Mohican  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:02:02pm

Say what you want about snapped shot, but he certainly has a lot of Regards for all of us.

101 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:02:16pm

re: #97 jcm

A rousing rendition of Horst-Wessel-Lied?

I wonder: Do Russian neo-Nazis sing the "Nuclear Wessel Song"?

102 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:02:31pm

re: #93 Occasional Reader

I've actually been thrown out of a restaurant once (but only once). My friends and I were accuesd of - literally - laughing too loudly.

I got thrown out of a bar, once, for the company I was in. I wasn't even there when the remark that resulted in our ejection happened.

Very, very embarrassing.

103 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:02:31pm

re: #84 BigPapa

Then stay out of it. Otherwise you're against both or for neither. Way to stand for nothing!

Actually, it'd be better if you went and looked at the other thread. I had no intention of *entering* this debate, until it was thrown on me in an out-of-left-field response to an on-topic reply.

B.

104 Land Shark  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:02:40pm

re: #41 snapped shot

No I'm not - as I said before, I'm neutral. Charles and Robert can have their battles - I'm staying out of it.

Regards,
Brian

This is about more than Johnson vs. Spencer. It's about Spencer not having a problem with groups with fascist/racist traits as long as they are anti-jihad. Trust me, I thought Charles had jumped the shark when he started pointing these things out. I wanted him to be wrong. Turned out he was right, and Spencer's behavior since then has done nothing to change that.

It's no fun having to face the truth about someone you admire, as I much as I admired Spencer. But the truth doesn't care, you either accept it or you don't. I still hold out a faint hope he will come to his senses, but I'm not holding my breath.

105 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:02:46pm

re: #101 Occasional Reader

I wonder: Do Russian neo-Nazis sing the "Nuclear Wessel Song"?

One ping only?

106 Athos  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:03:01pm

re: #97 jcm

Either that or the goose stepping...

107 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:03:18pm

re: #101 Occasional Reader

I wonder: Do Russian neo-Nazis sing the "Nuclear Wessel Song"?

Is that by Chekov?

108 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:03:22pm

re: #103 snapped shot

Actually, it'd be better if you went and looked at the other thread. I had no intention of *entering* this debate, until it was thrown on me in an out-of-left-field response to an on-topic reply.

B.

Oh, so now you're calling us Leftists!

109 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:03:34pm

re: #95 wrenchwench

And then not allowed in the next night, too. Must have been memorable.

Yeah. It does make you wonder.

"Formerly respectable academic" starts echoing somewhere in my head.

110 Erik The Red  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:03:36pm

re: #98 Occasional Reader

Your desire for Scotty to "beam" you clearly indicates that you're one of these filthy homosexuals that CAN is warning us about! ! !

/

LOL. I said beam me, not ream me.

111 Athos  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:03:54pm

re: #101 Occasional Reader

I wonder: Do Russian neo-Nazis sing the "Nuclear Wessel Song"?

"Not NOW, Chekov!"

112 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:04:13pm

re: #108 Ben Hur

Oh, so now you're calling us Leftists!

LOL!

113 MrSilverDragon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:04:18pm

re: #101 Occasional Reader

I wonder: Do Russian neo-Nazis sing the "Nuclear Wessel Song"?

I'd think it would be "Во Флоте".

114 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:04:43pm

re: #105 Ben Hur

One ping only?

No?

Wrong flik?

115 midwestgak  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:04:57pm

OT OT

I got an envelope in the mail today. It was stamped with a red message, "PAST DUE."

Was it the electric company warning me? No. Car payment lapsing? No. Rent in arrears? No.

Guess who/what sent it.

116 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:04:59pm

re: #99 mpoulos42

Dude, I'm accusing you of being a coward. Not of "thoughtcrimes".

Don't worry - you're nobody to me, too.

B.

117 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:05:08pm

re: #103 snapped shot

Actually, it'd be better if you went and looked at the other thread. I had no intention of *entering* this debate, until it was thrown on me in an out-of-left-field response to an on-topic reply.

B.

Yawn

Regards,
Walter

118 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:05:11pm

re: #96 snapped shot

Thanks for noticing, Ben! (I'm the homely one. Yuk yuk.)

B.

I personally think you have a great website and cover important material.

I also think it doesn't matter if you take a stance on the Robert Spencer/Charles Johnson bruhaha. With that said, I do believe it is shocking that Robert Spencer would team up with MARTIN MAWYER of all people to produce his next film. How can he claim to stand for human rights and yet produce a film with such an open bigot?

I have not followed the whole Spencer/Johnson thing - but that does jump out at me.

If I were to say anything, it would be that I think LGF has not been following global jihad as it used to, and I think that is a flaw, because global jihad has NOT slowed or stopped. However, Robert Spencer just is either not vetting his compatriots, or doesn't care either way who he partners with.

The whole debacle makes me sad.

119 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:05:33pm

re: #115 midwestgak

OT OT

I got an envelope in the mail today. It was stamped with a red message, "PAST DUE."

Was it the electric company warning me? No. Car payment lapsing? No. Rent in arrears? No.

Guess who/what sent it.

GOP or RNC?

120 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:05:34pm

re: #116 snapped shot

Don't worry - you're nobody to me, too.

B.

Yawn

Regards,
Walter

121 Charpete67  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:06:24pm

re: #96 snapped shot

Thanks for noticing, Ben! (I'm the homely one. Yuk yuk.)

B.

122 doubter4444  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:06:28pm

re: #57 ArchangelMichael

Are you trying to set a negative karma record, clean sweep the bottom 10 comments, and get banned all in one day?

There is a growing plague of paleocons, neonazis, and religious dominionists who are insinuating themselves into the conservative movements as we speak. They are using opposition to jihad (which is a legitimate concern) as a cover for racism and religious intolerance and current economic woes as an opportunity to mainstream anti-semitic or otherwise kooky conspiracy theories about the banking system. If you think this "is not a big deal" you either need to do some serious soul searching, or you are one of them.

Well said.

123 John Neverbend  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:06:30pm

re: #6 Killgore Trout

Busted!
I really wonder how bad the dinner conversation was to get them thrown out of the restaurant.

"Your women. I want to buy your women. The little girl, your daughters. Sell them to me. Sell me your children!"

124 subsailor68  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:06:46pm

re: #92 theheat

Hi theheat! Thanks for re-posting that link to the moronic assemblyman in CA. Yeah, the family values guy is a real piece of work. You know, I could almost respect a politician who said something like:

"Please understand that I loves the ladies. Yessir! I only got into politics to get me some o' them beauties. Power tends to corrupt they say, but I can tell ya that absolute power is absolutely dee-lightful. Sure I'm old, fat, don't shower as often as I should, and just found a piece of last night's meatloaf in my teeth, but as long as you keep voting me into office, I'll be gettin' my share of the babes, I can tell you that!"

(Well, maybe not respect, but at least he'd be honest about it.)

125 Last Mohican  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:06:54pm

re: #118 Daria Emmons

If I were to say anything, it would be that I think LGF has not been following global jihad as it used to, and I think that is a flaw.

Good thing you didn't say anything! Because that's just the sort of thing that, if you had said it, would be liable to piss Charles off.

126 Clemente  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:07:02pm

re: #115 midwestgak

RNC?

127 Thor-Zone  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:07:06pm

"Now boys stop that fighting"

Channeling Sister Mary Elephant
(Cheech & Chong)

128 midwestgak  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:07:08pm

re: #119 Gus 802

GOP or RNC?

You're no fun./ You got one too?

129 Mad Al-Jaffee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:07:10pm

re: #115 midwestgak

OT OT

I got an envelope in the mail today. It was stamped with a red message, "PAST DUE."

Was it the electric company warning me? No. Car payment lapsing? No. Rent in arrears? No.

Guess who/what sent it.

The Jooos?

130 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:07:43pm

re: #129 Mad Al-Jaffee

The Jooos?

No, we always get paid on time and in full.

131 John Neverbend  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:07:52pm

re: #129 Mad Al-Jaffee

The Jooos?

Subscription to the Financial Times?

132 What, me worry?  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:08:05pm

re: #75 snapped shot

And yet, she voted against it?

Not the strongest case of supporting our troops that I've ever seen, Marjorie...

Regards,
Brian

Yea well the next day April 3, 2003, was a little different.

[Link: projects.washingtonpost.com...]

Question: On Passage of the Bill
Bill: S 762
Vote description: S.762, As Amended; Supplemental Appropriations Act to Support Department of Defense Operations in Iraq for Fiscal Year 2003
A simple majority of those present and voting is required for approval or passage.
Result: Passed, 93-0, with 7 not voting.
Date/time: April 3, 2003, 9:27 p.m.
Republican majority opinion: Yes (Help)
Democrat majority opinion: Yes (Help)
The position of more than 50 percent of voting Republicans. "None" means an equal split between "Yes" and "No."

Spin much?

133 Last Mohican  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:08:09pm

re: #115 midwestgak

OT OT

I got an envelope in the mail today. It was stamped with a red message, "PAST DUE."

Was it the electric company warning me? No. Car payment lapsing? No. Rent in arrears? No.

Guess who/what sent it.

Health care reform advocates.

134 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:08:18pm

re: #117 Walter L. Newton

Yawn

We'll see how you feel about it when you are subject to this kind of impromptu ideological show trial.

Regards,
Brian

135 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:08:20pm

re: #128 midwestgak

You're no fun./ You got one too?

;) Yep. I think it was from the GOP.

Past Due! I just threw it on the table and never opened it.

136 Thor-Zone  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:08:24pm

re: #6 Killgore Trout

Busted!
I really wonder how bad the dinner conversation was to get them thrown out of the restaurant.


Especially before everyone showed up!

137 jill e  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:08:46pm

Reportedly have all hijackers in custody and passengers/plane crew are safe.

138 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:08:52pm

I really don't know how one can want to remain neutral when one party is in league with fascists and doesn't care if they are.

Gee, Brian- what harm could a few nazis do anyways, huh?

139 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:08:54pm

re: #40 SpaceJesus

is it wrong of me to think that signing every single post on the internet with your name and a salutation is fucking stupid?

Oh, that gave me a chuck(le)...

After which I spat thrice on the ground and crossed myself.

140 Mr. E. Train  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:08:57pm

I am anti-jihad because the entire jihadi movement is bigoted. I will not join sides with one group of bigots to help fight another group of bigots.

To quote someone during our involvement in Kosovo during the Clinton era "Why do you want to get involved there? Its a fight between a rat and a snake."

141 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:09:08pm

re: #118 Daria Emmons

The whole debacle makes me sad.

My feelings, exactly. Thanks for sharing, Daria!

B.

142 Last Mohican  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:09:15pm

re: #137 jill e

Reportedly have all hijackers in custody and passengers/plane crew are safe.

That's good news.

143 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:09:28pm

re: #128 midwestgak

You're no fun./ You got one too?

I'm not sending them a penny until they get a grip.

Fiscal responsibility, and cut the nonsense.

144 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:09:53pm

re: #118 Daria Emmons

If I were to say anything, it would be that I think LGF has not been following global jihad as it used to, and I think that is a flaw, because global jihad has NOT slowed or stopped.

Actually, it has slowed. When was the last suicide bombing inside Israel? When was the last major Al Qaeda attack in a Western country? Where are the jihadis launching suicide attacks inside America?

If I've distanced myself somewhat from covering the jihad, it's for two reasons:

1) It really has become less of an issue. There are still Islamic extremists out there, and I'm sure they intend to do us harm, but they seem to be pretty well contained at the moment.

2) A huge number of the so-called "jihad outrages" being promoted these days are outright phony stories promoted by bigots. I simply don't trust very much of the information coming from the so-called "anti-jihad" blogs, because they engage in lying and fear mongering.

145 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:10:05pm

re: #134 snapped shot

We'll see how you feel about it when you are subject to this kind of impromptu ideological show trial.

That's easy for most of us, but apparently not you.

I say- fuck the nazis!

146 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:11:10pm

re: #144 Charles

Actually, it has slowed. When was the last suicide bombing inside Israel?

FENCE.

147 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:11:38pm

re: #14 MandyManners

What does that rune mean?

Not clear to me. There's several that are commonly used by neo-Nazis, but this one doesn't come up on the ADL website or other spots I'm looking.

148 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:11:53pm

re: #144 Charles

1) It really has become less of an issue.

In California.

149 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:12:08pm

re: #132 marjoriemoon

Yea well the next day April 3, 2003, was a little different.

[Link: projects.washingtonpost.com...]

...

Spin much?

Oh, so she voted against it before she voted for it.

Good to know the DNC is as consistent as ever. Winky.

B.

150 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:12:38pm

re: #148 Ben Hur

1) It really has become less of an issue.

In California.

Are you trying to be an ass, or is it just natural for you?

151 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:12:45pm

re: #147 SanFranciscoZionist

Not clear to me. There's several that are commonly used by neo-Nazis, but this one doesn't come up on the ADL website or other spots I'm looking.

No, ADL's got it marked as one of the insignia of the 2nd SS Panzer division (Das Reich)

[Link: www.adl.org...]

152 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:14:04pm

re: #144 Charles

Actually, it has slowed. When was the last suicide bombing inside Israel? When was the last major Al Qaeda attack in a Western country? Where are the jihadis launching suicide attacks inside America?

There are attacks every day across the world - and including in Israel. As an example, Sderot is regularly bombarded by rockets. And the hate speech by blabbering mullahs has not stopped. Moreover, people are being tortured every single day inside Iran. There was a recent massacre inside Pakistan of Pakistani Christians, and Bangladeshi Hindus are at a breaking point.

Not to mention the continued US army operations in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Nothing has slowed at all.

If I've distanced myself somewhat from covering the jihad, it's for two reasons:

1) It really has become less of an issue. There are still Islamic extremists out there, and I'm sure they intend to do us harm, but they seem to be pretty well contained at the moment.

I disagree and fail to see evidence of this containment. Please elaborate?

2) A huge number of the so-called "jihad outrages" being promoted these days are outright phony stories promoted by bigots. I simply don't trust very much of the information coming from the so-called "anti-jihad" blogs, because they engage in lying and fear mongering.

I don't care who promotes the 'jihad outrages.' There still is an underlying reality of jihad that is ongoing, and that is the bottom line. Just because Robert Spencer quotes something does not make it untrue - it rather means it has to be independently verified.

153 jorline  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:14:38pm

Spencer was meeting with CAN before he didn't meet with CAN.
Spencer was meeting with CAN before he didn't meet with EDL.
Spencer was meeting with EDL before he didn't meet with CAN.
Spencer was meeting with EDL before he didn't meet with EDL.

I think I have all of my bases covered...fuck it!

154 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:14:52pm

re: #138 Sharmuta

I really don't know how one can want to remain neutral when one party is in league with fascists and doesn't care if they are.

Gee, Brian- what harm could a few nazis do anyways, huh?

Sharm, I've got relatives that are Republians, and relatives that are Democrats. They often get into all-out fights due to some disagreement or another. Does that mean that I should start hating either group?

LGF was *the* blog that kicked Snapped Shot off way back in August 2006, and Robert Spencer has been one of the most verbose experts on Islamic theology for the entire duration since then. Thus, I consider both parties in high regard, regardless of what THEIR ACTIONS are (which I will reiterate are NOT related to MY actions at all).

Does that help put it into perspective?

B.

155 Ojoe  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:14:58pm

re: #144 Charles

The Jihad has certainly slowed, and in great part due to the military responses to it.

156 midwestgak  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:15:29pm

re: #143 Dianna

I'm not sending them a penny until they get a grip.

Fiscal responsibility, and cut the nonsense.

I sent an amount when Bush was running his second campaign. None since.
The RNC has my address. They do not have my support.

157 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:15:45pm

Sorry - my comment just was poorly formatted - but you get what I was trying to say.

The bottom line is that jihad has NOT slowed or stopped, and it is NOT being contained.

Meanwhile, the anti-jihad movement is not vetting who they are getting in bed with.

So it's basically a complete wreck of a situation.

158 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:16:02pm

re: #150 Charles

Are you trying to be an ass, or is it just natural for you?

No Charles.

I'm with you on the anti-Jihad cause, agree with positions on who we should be aligning with, but the jihad was in full gear before 9/11 and is full gear now.

It's a HUGE issue.

There are frontlines on the internet.

There are frontilines in the real world.

159 What, me worry?  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:16:30pm

re: #149 snapped shot

Oh, so she voted against it before she voted for it.

Good to know the DNC is as consistent as ever. Winky.

B.

When someone does something like that, it's usually because there's language in the bill they don't like. Very often things are shoved into the bill which don't pertain to the subject matter. I don't have time to research her reasonings or that of the Democratic party, but I find it more than curious that virtually all of them completely changed their mind the next day. So something was definitely amiss.

Seems to me you would be happy that our Congress supports the troops, both parties, but you're more interested in badmouthing the liberals and posting false information, which is what the Right loves to do. Twist the truth until it breaks.

160 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:16:39pm

re: #134 snapped shot

We'll see how you feel about it when you are subject to this kind of impromptu ideological show trial.

Regards,
Brian

Yawn

Regards,
Walter

161 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:16:54pm

re: #154 snapped shot

Thus, I consider both parties in high regard, regardless of what THEIR ACTIONS are (which I will reiterate are NOT related to MY actions at all).

Does that help put it into perspective?

Yeah- it tells me you don't give a shit about enabling fascist sympathizers, Mr. Chamberlain.

162 lawhawk  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:16:56pm

re: #144 Charles

Actually, it has slowed. When was the last suicide bombing inside Israel? When was the last major Al Qaeda attack in a Western country? Where are the jihadis launching suicide attacks inside America?

If I've distanced myself somewhat from covering the jihad, it's for two reasons:

1) It really has become less of an issue. There are still Islamic extremists out there, and I'm sure they intend to do us harm, but they seem to be pretty well contained at the moment.

2) A huge number of the so-called "jihad outrages" being promoted these days are outright phony stories promoted by bigots. I simply don't trust very much of the information coming from the so-called "anti-jihad" blogs, because they engage in lying and fear mongering.

Hamas continues firing kassams at Israel on a regular basis, having picked up the past in the past few weeks. No one killed of late, but not for lack of trying. Other terrorists were killed trying to place explosives along the security fence.

The Administration's efforts to go after the jihadis in Afghanistan and Pakistan is a mixed bag - good news is that they're pursuing them and using UAV airstrikes to go after HVTs; bad news is that the new rules of engagement discourage going after terrorists when they're embedded with human shields, making it all the more likely the terrorists will continue and expand on those tactics.

As for trying to follow the jihad worldwide, I stick to a few reputable sites- Long War Journal and Small Wars Journal being two, along with Totten and Yon.

For attacks within the US, several were thwarted of late, including the Fort Dix Six most recently. Several jihadis were convicted in the UK IIRC for plotting to hijack/bomb multiple airliners last week.

The jihad is still active, but active vigilance is absolutely crucial.

163 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:16:59pm

re: #154 snapped shot

Sharm, I've got relatives that are Republians, and relatives that are Democrats. They often get into all-out fights due to some disagreement or another. Does that mean that I should start hating either group?

Well, if either party should engage in thinly-veiled efforts to revive a genocidal ideology that catapulted modern Europe into a darkness the full depths of which we have not yet fully plumbed, then, yes, you probably should consider hating them.

There's some perspective for you.

Regards,

G

164 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:17:02pm

re: #28 Killgore Trout

Horizontally aligned Wolfsangel[

Well, that clears things up. Thank you! I have to go throw up now.

165 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:17:36pm

re: #159 marjoriemoon

Seems to me you would be happy that our Congress supports the troops, both parties, but you're more interested in badmouthing the liberals and posting false information, which is what the Right loves to do. Twist the truth until it breaks.

Yeah, conservatives are totally the only people that do that. Riight.

(Geez, what the hell happened to this place?)

B.

166 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:17:44pm

re: #150 Charles

Are you trying to be an ass, or is it just natural for you?

Just realized that wasn't a yes or no question.

167 Thor-Zone  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:17:54pm

re: #92 theheat

You have Nazis on this side, pious haters on the other... it all gives me an enormous headache in my eye.

Me too...

By the way, this is an honest question...

Weren't the Nazis (spit) and what are now the jihadists on the same side in WW2? What has happened since then?

Thanks for constructive answers.

168 Kronocide  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:17:58pm

re: #103 snapped shot

Actually, it'd be better if you went and looked at the other thread. I had no intention of *entering* this debate, until it was thrown on me in an out-of-left-field response to an on-topic reply.

B.

So I need to go read through a thread about economics to understand your participation in a thread about Spencer getting thrown out of a restaurant where you are basically saying 'no big deal.'

169 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:18:07pm

re: #154 snapped shot

Robert Spencer has been one of the most verbose experts on Islamic theology for the entire duration since then.

Verbosity does not equal accuracy (We learned that in spades from Fjordy.) Spencer is an unreliable source with a highly questionable agenda.

170 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:18:11pm

re: #157 Daria Emmons

Sorry - my comment just was poorly formatted - but you get what I was trying to say.

The bottom line is that jihad has NOT slowed or stopped, and it is NOT being contained.

I strongly disagree with this, and I gave you a few reasons why.

Meanwhile, the anti-jihad movement is not vetting who they are getting in bed with.

And that's why I simply don't believe anything they say.

171 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:18:18pm

re: #165 snapped shot

Yeah, conservatives are totally the only people that do that. Riight.

(Geez, what the hell happened to this place?)

B.

You.

172 What, me worry?  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:19:05pm

re: #165 snapped shot

Yeah, conservatives are totally the only people that do that. Riight.

(Geez, what the hell happened to this place?)

B.

Nothing "happened" to this place. I've been here since the beginning. There's always been liberals here since the beginning.

173 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:19:34pm

re: #161 Sharmuta

Yeah- it tells me you don't give a shit about enabling fascist sympathizers, Mr. Chamberlain.

Heh. Touche on the Chamberlain reference.

Other than that, you're way off base.

B.

174 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:19:50pm

re: #173 snapped shot

Heh. Touche on the Chamberlain reference.

Other than that, you're way off base.

B.

Yawn

Regards,
Walter

175 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:20:00pm

re: #159 marjoriemoon


Seems to me you would be happy that our Congress supports the troops, both parties,

They do now.

176 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:20:25pm

"Geez, what the hell happened to this place?"

When was supporting Nazis acceptable here?

177 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:20:34pm

re: #169 wrenchwench

Verbosity does not equal accuracy (We learned that in spades from Fjordy.) Spencer is an unreliable source with a highly questionable agenda.

Hanging out with fascists, religious supremacists, and kooks like pamela geller must not count for much in Brian's eyes.

178 Ojoe  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:20:42pm

The fringe-crazy anti jihad types are quite capable of switching sides IMHO.

179 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:20:45pm

re: #168 BigPapa

So I need to go read through a thread about economics to understand your participation in a thread about Spencer getting thrown out of a restaurant where you are basically saying 'no big deal.'

The context will explain my flippant remark at the top of this thread, if nothing else.

B.

180 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:21:08pm

re: #173 snapped shot

Heh. Touche on the Chamberlain reference.

Other than that, you're way off base.

B.

Actions speak louder than words, yet you don't care about Spencer's actions.

181 Athos  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:21:12pm

re: #154 snapped shot

Does that help put it into perspective?

Sure - it's no different from Spencer's bankrupt position...

"Actually, I am fighting jihad, and have no interest in or intention to investigate these groups. Insofar as they are fighting jihad, I applaud them. Insofar as they are doing anything else, my endorsement is not implied." (Robert Spencer email answer to Walter L. Newton sent on Sat 11/8/2008 10:39 AM)

Except you're 'neutral' and don't care about who Robert pals around with and what they stand for. Calling yourself neutral and not taking a stand is your action and your decision. Yep, that's enabling.

182 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:21:27pm

re: #162 lawhawk

For attacks within the US, several were thwarted of late, including the Fort Dix Six most recently. Several jihadis were convicted in the UK IIRC for plotting to hijack/bomb multiple airliners last week.

Both of those cases are years old, though. You're actually reinforcing my point.

And both of them have been covered extensively at LGF.

183 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:21:49pm

re: #181 Athos

Except you're 'neutral' and don't care about who Robert pals around with and what they stand for. Calling yourself neutral and not taking a stand is your action and your decision. Yep, that's enabling.

Hey Athos, did he send you an email just like mine?
/

184 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:21:59pm

re: #169 wrenchwench

Verbosity does not equal accuracy (We learned that in spades from Fjordy.) Spencer is an unreliable source with a highly questionable agenda.

An "unreliable" source? You're more than welcome to start discrediting the research he's done on Islamic jurisprudence, history, and culture, because as far as I've seen, nobody else can do it.

B.

185 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:22:56pm

re: #184 snapped shot

Yes- he's unreliable because he LIES!

186 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:22:59pm

re: #184 snapped shot

An "unreliable" source? You're more than welcome to start discrediting the research he's done on Islamic jurisprudence, history, and culture, because as far as I've seen, nobody else can do it.

B.

You don't get out much, do you.

187 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:23:11pm

re: #184 snapped shot

An "unreliable" source? You're more than welcome to start discrediting the research he's done on Islamic jurisprudence, history, and culture, because as far as I've seen, nobody else can do it.

B.

Have to agree.

It's his alliances that are the problem.

188 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:23:19pm

re: #170 Charles

I strongly disagree with this, and I gave you a few reasons why.

But if Spencer/Gellar/etc are quoting from newspapers and other third party sources - what is there to not believe?

A bulk of their articles fit into that category.

I have seen reporting which is irrefutable, and heard from first person testimony of Pakistani Christians that face an ethnic cleansing. I have spoken to Sderot residents that continue to face rocket attacks. And MEMRI videos have not stopped - they continue to show blabbering mullahs spreading the hate.

What is your basis to believe jihad has slowed? Do you have a statistic, or any form of hard data to point to?

189 Mr. E. Train  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:23:29pm

When it comes to anti-jihad stuff on the net I tend to stick to MEMRI. No crazy's like Pam or Spencer to get between the message and the masses. Let the jihadi's be damned by their own words.

190 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:23:51pm

re: #184 snapped shot

An "unreliable" source? You're more than welcome to start discrediting the research he's done on Islamic jurisprudence, history, and culture, because as far as I've seen, nobody else can do it.

B.

Spencer discredits himself as a scholar by his failure to avoid aligning himself with highly questionable types who talk endlessly of various versions of European Nationalism and such, but who show an inordinate fondness for street brawling and the iconography of the second-most murderous theory of human governance and the State to ever afflict mankind.

191 HelloDare  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:24:08pm

Charles,

Did you move the contact link? I can't find it.

192 debutaunt  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:24:27pm

re: #41 snapped shot

No I'm not - as I said before, I'm neutral. Charles and Robert can have their battles - I'm staying out of it.

Regards,
Brian

Your lack of standards is a bit stunning.

193 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:25:09pm

re: #185 Sharmuta

Yes- he's unreliable because he LIES!

Wow, that's a long list of source material there, ace.

(Again: If his research is inaccurate, then PROVE it.)

B.

194 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:25:16pm

re: #177 Sharmuta

Hanging out with fascists, religious supremacists, and kooks like pamela geller must not count for much in Brian's eyes.

Mama always said you are who you hang with...
There is no gray area with fascists and Nazi lovers..
/I need to talk to you soon about something...When you get time would you ping my Blackberry?

195 debutaunt  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:25:58pm

re: #50 Occasional Reader

Even "Clippy", the Microsoft overly-helpful icon? Come on!

I hate his mocking, bendy ass.

196 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:26:28pm

re: #154 snapped shot

LGF was *the* blog that kicked Snapped Shot off way back in August 2006, and Robert Spencer has been one of the most verbose experts on Islamic theology for the entire duration since then. Thus, I consider both parties in high regard, regardless of what THEIR ACTIONS are (which I will reiterate are NOT related to MY actions at all).

Does that help put it into perspective?

B.

Yes. When you state that you 'consider' people in 'high regard' regardless of their actions, that pretty much sums it up for me.

197 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:26:31pm

re: #188 Daria Emmons

But if Spencer/Gellar/etc are quoting from newspapers and other third party sources - what is there to not believe?

A bulk of their articles fit into that category.

I have seen reporting which is irrefutable, and heard from first person testimony of Pakistani Christians that face an ethnic cleansing. I have spoken to Sderot residents that continue to face rocket attacks. And MEMRI videos have not stopped - they continue to show blabbering mullahs spreading the hate.

What is your basis to believe jihad has slowed? Do you have a statistic, or any form of hard data to point to?

I want to underline the following - I am no fan of Gellar and believe Spencer has decided to embrace not vetting his friends.

But again - much of his articles consist of links to the Associated Press and the like.

Just because he covers it does not render it untrue.

198 snapped shot  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:26:34pm

re: #186 Walter L. Newton

You don't get out much, do you.

Feel free to provide those links "proving" that Spencer's material is hokus, Walter.

Otherwise, I'm going to continue ignoring you.

B.

199 midwestgak  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:27:01pm

Have to go now and take a test. Happy posting.

200 Kragar  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:27:01pm

'Dutch Jews suffered tenfold increase in anti-Semitic attacks during Gaza war'

The number of anti-Semitic incidents documented in Holland in January almost equaled the number of attacks recorded throughout the whole of 2008, according to the annual report by the country's watchdog on anti-Semitism.

The report by the Hague-based Center for Information and Documentation (CIDI) presents 98 attacks in January, as the Israel Defense Forces was attacking in Gaza. The total number of attacks in 2008 was 108.

Unusually, CIDI criticized the justice system and police for allegedly not acting with sufficient promptness to ensure safety and security, and for not imposing a ban on Holocaust denial.

201 Randall Gross  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:27:27pm

re: #188 Daria Emmons

I search for terror incidents daily. They've declined in all places except conflict zones where AQAM has established partial or full control. Compared to last year this time, or the year before Terror incidents outside of known active conflict zones is down.

202 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:27:51pm

re: #193 snapped shot

Wow, that's a long list of source material there, ace.

(Again: If his research is inaccurate, then PROVE it.)

B.

I already gave you links on the last thread that proved it. You don't want to see it!

Spencer Changes Story, But Still Defends Pro Koln - Update: Pro Koln Organizers Say Spencer and Geller Confirmed in Writing

203 debutaunt  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:27:51pm

re: #199 midwestgak

Have to go now and take a test. Happy posting.

Watch out for typos!

204 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:27:55pm

re: #197 Daria Emmons

I want to underline the following - I am no fan of Gellar and believe Spencer has decided to embrace not vetting his friends.

But again - much of his articles consist of links to the Associated Press and the like.

Just because he covers it does not render it untrue.

I don't get Gellar.

205 Land Shark  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:29:12pm

While I believe that the Jihad remains a clear and present danger, so do the fascists and racists. Given how much they all have in common, I refuse to pick one or the other. I'll oppose them all.

206 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:29:17pm

re: #204 Ben Hur

I don't get Gellar.

Not missing much

207 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:29:32pm

re: #184 snapped shot

An "unreliable" source? You're more than welcome to start discrediting the research he's done on Islamic jurisprudence, history, and culture, because as far as I've seen, nobody else can do it.

B.

Nobody is complaining about his scholarship, just the company he keeps.

208 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:29:45pm

Robert Spencer Joins Genocidal Facebook Group

UPDATE at 2/12/09 8:07:08 am:

After the vicious personal attacks on me that Spencer has posted, I won’t link to his site, but today he’s admitting that he did join this group—but claiming that he was “duped” into joining, suggesting that it was an “internet prank” and a setup. And he hints that I might have set it all up myself. To get him.

Shameless LIAR!

209 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:30:36pm

re: #201 Thanos

I search for terror incidents daily. They've declined in all places except conflict zones where AQAM has established partial or full control. Compared to last year this time, or the year before Terror incidents outside of known active conflict zones is down.

But Jihad is not just about terrorism. It is also about implanting hate inside minds. The same blabbering hate is going on daily - just check MEMRI. There has not been a decline in hate videos.

And Iran is still out there torturing and raping its prisoners - and being even quite blatant about it! It is still openly seeking nukes.

I repeat: how is jihad now not a problem, compared to before?

210 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:30:42pm

re: #198 snapped shot

Feel free to provide those links "proving" that Spencer's material is hokus, Walter.

Otherwise, I'm going to continue ignoring you.

B.

You can start with the story at the top of this page, and the entry on his website where he admits to working on a video with CAN.

After you can manage an answer to explaining his lie on this subject, then we can go down the list.

And I have a bunch of email from him to back up my points.

Yawn

Regards,
Walter

211 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:30:53pm

re: #159 marjoriemoon

Seems to me you would be happy that our Congress supports the troops

Much as I hate to even partially agree with "snapped shot" on anything, I do think that at least some (not all) Congressional Dems climbed on board the "more body armor!" and "more uparmormed Humvees!" bandwagon essentially because they saw it as a means to bash Bush. Their newly-discovered love of "the troops" and "getting the best equipment for them" was wildly out of synch with their past voting records, in many cases.

212 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:30:56pm

re: #208 Sharmuta

Robert Spencer Joins Genocidal Facebook Group

Shameless LIAR!

So he's a total putz what else is new?

213 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:31:06pm

re: #196 SanFranciscoZionist

Yes. When you state that you 'consider' people in 'high regard' regardless of their actions, that pretty much sums it up for me.

Nicely drilled!

214 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:31:21pm

re: #198 snapped shot

Feel free to provide those links "proving" that Spencer's material is hokus, Walter.

Otherwise, I'm going to continue ignoring you.

B.

Did you know Hitler was a talented painter?
Doesn't mean I'm buying his art...Cause Spenser has done some research about Islam doesn't mean a damn thing..

215 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:31:27pm

re: #212 LudwigVanQuixote

So he's a total putz what else is new?

Stop insulting us putz's.

216 wahabicorridor  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:31:29pm

re: #208 Sharmuta

He has never taken responsiblity for anything. Look up 'coward' in the dictionary and that's his picture.

217 John Neverbend  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:31:58pm

re: #205 Land Shark

While I believe that the Jihad remains a clear and present danger, so do the fascists and racists. Given how much they all have in common, I refuse to pick one or the other. I'll oppose them all.

I agree.

"I don't know what they have to say,
It makes no difference anyway --
Whatever it is, I'm against it!
No matter what it is or who commenced it,
I'm against it."

218 Athos  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:31:59pm

re: #198 snapped shot

How many lies, equivocations, and examples of poor judgment must someone show before their credibility becomes suspect? 1? a dozen? a hundred?

And if their credibility becomes suspect in one major area, does that also effect their credibility / reputation in other areas or are you just taking another action by deciding the lack of credibility is one area is immaterial and unimportant...like the lies about meeting and enabling neo-fascist organizations?

219 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:32:17pm

re: #205 Land Shark

While I believe that the Jihad remains a clear and present danger, so do the fascists and racists. Given how much they all have in common, I refuse to pick one or the other. I'll oppose them all.

I agree that no one should pick sides. I fully support such a statement and do not want to be construed to be saying otherwise.

However, that does not mean that Jihad is not still an ongoing problem around the world.

220 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:32:29pm

re: #216 wahabicorridor

He has never taken responsiblity for anything. Look up 'coward' in the dictionary and that's his picture.

Had to take his pic through a telephoto. He wouldn't come outta the biergarten.

221 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:32:47pm
222 Randall Gross  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:32:55pm

re: #209 Daria Emmons

I didn't say Jihad is not a problem, so please do not stuff words in my mouth. I am saying that incidents of terror are down, and that something out there has changed a bit. Charles is correct, however he never said Jihad isn't a problem either.

223 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:33:02pm

re: #195 debutaunt

I hate his mocking, bendy ass.

The sometimes-annoying panel on the NPR "Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me" did have a pretty funny round of impromptu one-liners once, in which they were imagining driving "Clippy" out to the woods to have him whacked, Sopranos-style.

"It looks like you're digging a grave! Is that a business grave, or a personal grave?"

224 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:33:26pm

re: #221 buzzsawmonkey

I didn't know you played golf, Walter.

Only naked, on Mondays.

225 JHW  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:33:39pm

A little information on military usage of symbols. The US military uses markings on their vehicles to identify the unit, and I believe most of the world's large militaries use such a system.Usually as a form of traffic control in large convoys and such. The Germans also used such a system and they had a huge amount of vehicle markings to differentiate their units. Some of them were rip-offs of Disney characters, others, such as the runic ones were common to the Nazi pets such as the SS. They (SS) also, in contrast to regular German formations, wore them on their uniform as a collar patch and use by any group now would as far as I'm concerned, instantly put them in the Nazi sympathizer column. In contrast to Disney character ripoffs or stylized animal symbols common to many of the world's military insignia, their past allows for only one connotation.

Here is information on the US system, where you can instantly tell a lot about units and orders of battle by reading a seemingly cryptic series of letters and numbers on vehicles, although in time of war the system may be somewhat obscured.
US Military Vehicle Markings

226 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:33:59pm

re: #167 Thor-Zone

Me too...

By the way, this is an honest question...

Weren't the Nazis (spit) and what are now the jihadists on the same side in WW2? What has happened since then?

Thanks for constructive answers.

Some Muslim and nominally Muslim leaders allied with the Nazis, however I think it's hard to say they were on the 'same side', in the sense that they had compatible short-term goals. Please recall, also, that Arab nationalism in the early part of the twentieth century was not a jihadi movement as we now know it.

Meanwhile, in the present day, European neo-Nazis simply see Arabs, Pakistanis, etc. as dark-skinned foreigners to be attacked. They also see Hindus this way, and Christian Africans, and etc.

227 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:34:06pm

re: #223 Occasional Reader

The sometimes-annoying panel on the NPR "Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me" did have a pretty funny round of impromptu one-liners once, in which they were imagining driving "Clippy" out to the woods to have him whacked, Sopranos-style.

"It looks like you're digging a grave! Is that a business grave, or a personal grave?"

I'd brave the xanax-muted and self-satisfied voices over there to hear that.

228 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:34:55pm
229 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:34:59pm

re: #184 snapped shot

An "unreliable" source? You're more than welcome to start discrediting the research he's done on Islamic jurisprudence, history, and culture, because as far as I've seen, nobody else can do it.

B.

And what gives him the authority to interpret Islam? To tell Muslims they "must" do this or that because Spencer has read the Koran in the original Arabic and so he knows what they "must" do?

Even if Rifqa's father didn't actually threaten her, there is nothing in the least unbelievable about the charge that he did, in light of the many killings of apostates and threats to their lives that take place frequently in the Islamic world.
230 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:35:01pm

re: #223 Occasional Reader

The sometimes-annoying panel on the NPR show "Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me"

PIMF

231 theheat  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:35:12pm

re: #214 HoosierHoops

His paintings were overrated. We actually studied many of his earlier drawings to show recurring symbolic elements, which gets a little flowery and meh to get into here. Besides all things horror-genre related, this is the only other subject I'm actually qualified to give an educated opinion about.

At best, he was a mediocre artist. You'll just have to trust me there.

232 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:35:21pm

re: #222 Thanos

I didn't say Jihad is not a problem, so please do not stuff words in my mouth. I am saying that incidents of terror are down, and that something out there has changed a bit. Charles is correct, however he never said Jihad isn't a problem either.

He did say Jihad has slowed, and it just hasn't.

Jihad is not just about terror attacks - it is also about such things as hate indoctrination, and the hate has not ebbed or slowed.

233 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:35:48pm

re: #184 snapped shot

An "unreliable" source? You're more than welcome to start discrediting the research he's done on Islamic jurisprudence, history, and culture, because as far as I've seen, nobody else can do it.

B.

There are a lot of people out there with actual doctorates in the field, and less obvious axes to grind.

234 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:36:11pm

re: #196 SanFranciscoZionist

Yes. When you state that you 'consider' people in 'high regard' regardless of their actions, that pretty much sums it up for me.

There are others who think we should just "get along". I find that disgusting. I have no intentions of getting along with nazis or their sympathizers, and folks suggesting we do are in reality asking us to undermine our principles.

235 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:36:11pm

Hey who was standing in front of that sign? What's it say? Oh there we go...

Do Not Feed The Attention Whores

Good advice.

236 John Neverbend  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:37:13pm

re: #214 HoosierHoops

Did you know Hitler was a talented painter?

"He could paint an entire apartment in one afternoon! Two coats!"

237 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:37:46pm

re: #234 Sharmuta

There are others who think we should just "get along". I find that disgusting. I have no intentions of getting along with nazis or their sympathizers, and folks suggesting we do are in reality asking us to undermine our principles.

To be clear, I believe the following:

Robert Spencer and Pam Gellar are not trustworthy enough sources to simply rely upon their word. But at the same time, their saying something does not render it untrue.

238 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:37:50pm

re: #144 Charles

Actually, it has slowed. When was the last suicide bombing inside Israel? When was the last major Al Qaeda attack in a Western country? Where are the jihadis launching suicide attacks inside America?

If I've distanced myself somewhat from covering the jihad, it's for two reasons:

1) It really has become less of an issue. There are still Islamic extremists out there, and I'm sure they intend to do us harm, but they seem to be pretty well contained at the moment.

2) A huge number of the so-called "jihad outrages" being promoted these days are outright phony stories promoted by bigots. I simply don't trust very much of the information coming from the so-called "anti-jihad" blogs, because they engage in lying and fear mongering.

I agree with your points.

You are correct.

However,

Iran still is trying to build a Nuke. Hezzballah is still licking it's wounds and frankly only temporarily more interested in cementing its hold on Lebanon. Hamas is still licking its wounds.

As to Al-queda and the Talis, they are certainly resurgent in Afganistan.

I thinkk that the Jihadis have taken some body blows and are concentrating on achieving much more ambitious goals, rather than random acts of terror. I do not believe that they are fading nearly as much as re-grouping and aiming at bigger goals.

239 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:38:03pm

Spencer's sin is far worse than not "vetting" his associations. If that were the case, as soon as it was pointed out to him who and what they were , he would distance himself from then and denounce them.

He has done neither. Not once for a single shady association. In fact he has either lied about associating with them at all or stated clearly that he does not care who they are as long as they are "The enemy of my enemy".

No one who gives a damn about the freedoms of post-enlightenment liberal democratic western civilization should ever side with neofascists, anti-semites, or religious fanatics (who are ok to RS if as long as they aren't Islamic fanatics) for any reason.

240 Erik The Red  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:38:33pm

re: #228 buzzsawmonkey

You must have interesting wood shots.

Walter can get wood? I thought he was...you know...em... old. :)

241 Land Shark  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:38:55pm

re: #231 theheat

I agree. I've seen examples of Hitler's paintings and they were fairly pedestrian and mediocre. I understand he had a problem depicting human forms in anything but the most generic shapes. Very little if any detail in his human forms. Somehow fitting.

242 Randall Gross  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:39:09pm

re: #232 Daria Emmons

That also has slowed. I am seeing fewer incidents of seething, more reaching out, such as the statement by Malaysia's PM the other day, and more internalizing of the jihad.
Right now the only ones I see seething are the groups like EDL, founded by fascist nutball Lionheart.

243 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:39:14pm

re: #238 LudwigVanQuixote

I agree with your points.

You are correct.

However,

Iran still is trying to build a Nuke. Hezzballah is still licking it's wounds and frankly only temporarily more interested in cementing its hold on Lebanon. Hamas is still licking its wounds.

As to Al-queda and the Talis, they are certainly resurgent in Afganistan.

I thinkk that the Jihadis have taken some body blows and are concentrating on achieving much more ambitious goals, rather than random acts of terror. I do not believe that they are fading nearly as much as re-grouping and aiming at bigger goals.

You are most certainly correct, though of course that has not meant that terrorism has ebbed or slowed in Pakistan, Bangladesh, the Phillippines, or elsewhere. Jihad is not a smaller threat now than it was a year ago.

244 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:39:27pm

re: #161 Sharmuta

Yeah- it tells me you don't give a shit about enabling fascist sympathizers, Mr. Chamberlain.

What's your threshold for "enabling," Sharmuta? If Brian has a history of actively engaged in apologetics for Spencer, then I suppose that would pass MY threshold for "enabling" -- but if merely having a permanent blog link to Spencer's site makes Brian an "enabler" to you, then your threshold is probably set too low.

P.S. And I believe that Brian's reference to Chamberlain was meant to be self-deprecating -- in which case it's tacky and lazy of you to use it as an attack against him.

P.P.S. But Brian, please don't think I'm thrilled to take your side (a little) -- your attempt to accuse Charles of Christian-baiting was bloody pafe'ic.

245 Desert Dog  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:39:43pm

re: #241 Land Shark

I agree. I've seen examples of Hitler's paintings and they were fairly pedestrian and mediocre. I understand he had a problem depicting human forms in anything but the most generic shapes. Very little if any detail in his human forms. Somehow fitting.

He was pretty good at painting the entire European continent blood red though.

246 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:39:48pm

re: #240 Erik The Red

Walter can get wood? I thought he was...you know...em... old. :)

I'm 56 and everything work FINE and NATURAL.

247 What, me worry?  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:40:09pm

re: #211 Occasional Reader

Much as I hate to even partially agree with "snapped shot" on anything, I do think that at least some (not all) Congressional Dems climbed on board the "more body armor!" and "more uparmormed Humvees!" bandwagon essentially because they saw it as a means to bash Bush. Their newly-discovered love of "the troops" and "getting the best equipment for them" was wildly out of synch with their past voting records, in many cases.

That's right and they all hate Israel too, right?

The Right consistently makes this crap up, pulling it from nowhere. If you look at the Congressional voting records of Democrats, approx. 95% support any vote concerning Israel.

How in the world can voting for body armor "bash Bush"?

248 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:40:19pm

re: #226 SanFranciscoZionist

Some Muslim and nominally Muslim leaders allied with the Nazis, however I think it's hard to say they were on the 'same side', in the sense that they had compatible short-term goals. Please recall, also, that Arab nationalism in the early part of the twentieth century was not a jihadi movement as we now know it.

Meanwhile, in the present day, European neo-Nazis simply see Arabs, Pakistanis, etc. as dark-skinned foreigners to be attacked. They also see Hindus this way, and Christian Africans, and etc.

And the Arabs have taken the Nazi Jew-hatred and are using it for their own purposes.

249 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:40:20pm

re: #242 Thanos

That also has slowed. I am seeing fewer incidents of seething, more reaching out, such as the statement by Malaysia's PM the other day, and more internalizing of the jihad.
Right now the only ones I see seething are the groups like EDL, founded by fascist nutball Lionheart.

HUH? What is your basis to say such a thing? Have you checked MEMRI? Have you followed the daily hate from Iran? What raw statistic can you use to back up such a statement?

250 lawhawk  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:40:25pm

Another thing to keep in mind that attacks in non-Western states predate those on the US - and are a harbinger of things to come; the attacks on the US embassies in Africa; the USS Cole; etc.

The situation in Pakistan is highly unstable, and terror in Pakistan has spilled over into India. That's got serious international ramifications on multiple levels. The Somali pirates are another problem - Somalia in general actually. Failed states are safe havens and terror incubators.

251 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:40:30pm

re: #232 Daria Emmons

Jihad is not just about terror attacks - it is also about such things as hate indoctrination, and the hate has not ebbed or slowed.

Good point. Also, one could debate to what extent is the West ceding cultural space to the islamists now, as compared to, say 6 or 7 years ago. (E.g., the recent Yale-published book on the Danish cartoons, in which they decided to not actually print the cartoons.)

252 Erik The Red  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:40:42pm

re: #246 Walter L. Newton

I'm 56 and everything work FINE and NATURAL.

I was pulling the piss Walter. You should know that.

253 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:41:12pm

re: #229 wrenchwench

I've mnetioned before, there is a rather alarming article in which he attacks the work of a woman Muslim scholar who asserts that it is not required for a woman to cover her hair. Spencer apparently can't handle the idea that anything is going on in Islam that might contradict or complicate his All Killin' All The Time image of it.

254 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:41:19pm

re: #252 Erik The Red

I was pulling the piss Walter. You should know that.

And I was using the opportunity to brag, you should know that :)

255 What, me worry?  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:41:55pm

re: #232 Daria Emmons

He did say Jihad has slowed, and it just hasn't.

Jihad is not just about terror attacks - it is also about such things as hate indoctrination, and the hate has not ebbed or slowed.

Ask an Israeli. You have family in Israel? They will tell you it's slowed. It has not stopped, it has slowed.

No comparison between 2002 and 2009. None whatsoever.

256 Randall Gross  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:42:04pm

re: #249 Daria Emmons

I read all of the above and the Pakistani, Malaysia, Philippine, and Afghani papers nightly.

257 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:42:08pm
258 cliffster  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:42:29pm

re: #254 Walter L. Newton

And I was using the opportunity to brag, you should know that :)

All the parts still working at 56... very impressive ;)

259 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:42:35pm

re: #236 John Neverbend

"He could paint an entire apartment in one afternoon! Two coats!"

"He could dance the pants off old Churchill!"

260 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:42:58pm

re: #237 Daria Emmons

To be clear, I believe the following:

Robert Spencer and Pam Gellar are not trustworthy enough sources to simply rely upon their word. But at the same time, their saying something does not render it untrue.

"All Cretans are liars"?

261 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:43:19pm

re: #243 Daria Emmons

You are most certainly correct, though of course that has not meant that terrorism has ebbed or slowed in Pakistan, Bangladesh, the Phillippines, or elsewhere. Jihad is not a smaller threat now than it was a year ago.

I agree with that to a point. Charles has the right of saying that it is not the issue that the so-called anti-jihadis misrepresent it as. He has even more of the right, that allying with neo-nazis is not the answer.

I have never been a believer in getting into bed with one totally evil psychotic set to help us with another is a good idea. There is also the reality that the neo-nazi types lie and distort the real issues, and that they frankly have goals which are ultimately pure evil.

Do not kid yourself that the euro-fascists have any vision other than a nazi one. Feeding them out of fears of the Jihadis only gives them credit that the world can ill afford to grant them.

262 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:43:24pm

re: #244 Throbert McGee

He holds him in respect, he says. People who know something about this rift, yet still hold spencer in respect are granting him legitimacy to continue with his agenda. An agenda that has no problem aligning with fascists. Regards Brian doesn't seem to care he's helping spencer spread the reborn evil that killed millions by continuing to think he's respectable.

263 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:43:36pm

re: #255 marjoriemoon

Ask an Israeli. You have family in Israel? They will tell you it's slowed. It has not stopped, it has slowed.

No comparison between 2002 and 2009. None whatsoever.

The "Apartheid" Wall is working.

264 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:43:52pm

re: #257 buzzsawmonkey

You will note that I refrained from discussing your knowledge of geologic phenomena, including petrified wood.

I have some really nice pieces of petrified wood here. If you ever need any, maybe to trounce someone on the head with it.

265 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:43:53pm

re: #241 Land Shark

I agree. I've seen examples of Hitler's paintings and they were fairly pedestrian and mediocre. I understand he had a problem depicting human forms in anything but the most generic shapes. Very little if any detail in his human forms. Somehow fitting.

Churchill was quite a good painter, apparently. Eisenhower also did landscapes--very calendar art, but well done.

266 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:43:59pm

re: #255 marjoriemoon

Ask an Israeli. You have family in Israel? They will tell you it's slowed. It has not stopped, it has slowed.

No comparison between 2002 and 2009. None whatsoever.

But while there are fewer rocket attacks, the attacks do continue. And Charles has NOT covered a Sderot rocket attack in a long time.

Moreover, the hate flowing from the imams, sheikhs, schools, United Nations, and political leaders - none of it has stopped/slowed. And it is very clear that Hizballah/Hamas are presently amassing a huge arsenal to eventually better attack Israel with.

Nothing really has 'slowed,' not in any real sense.

267 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:44:13pm

re: #244 Throbert McGee

He was equating criticizing neo-nazis to criticizing Christians. It explains why he's also supports BNP activist Lionheart and Robert Spencer. It's clear to me that he seems them as Christian brothers.
He also has a link on his sidebar to really funny site about Michelle Obama committing suicide and being tortured in hell.

268 theheat  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:44:17pm

re: #241 Land Shark

He placed less value on human forms than architecture, and their proportions in relation to one another were unrealistic. This poor scale was out of place for the time period and style of his work. In fact, that's why it stood out so.

269 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:44:32pm

re: #231 theheat

His paintings were overrated. We actually studied many of his earlier drawings to show recurring symbolic elements, which gets a little flowery and meh to get into here. Besides all things horror-genre related, this is the only other subject I'm actually qualified to give an educated opinion about.

At best, he was a mediocre artist. You'll just have to trust me there.

True. But just think - if the professors had decided to admit him to art school instead of rejecting his application, WWII may never have happened.

It almost makes you think kindly of the "social promotions" so common in our public schools today.

270 Desert Dog  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:45:17pm

re: #247 marjoriemoon

That's right and they all hate Israel too, right?

The Right consistently makes this crap up, pulling it from nowhere. If you look at the Congressional voting records of Democrats, approx. 95% support any vote concerning Israel.

How in the world can voting for body armor "bash Bush"?

I have no doubt the Dems that pushed for the body armor did it for the troops...but they also did it to get in a jab at Bush. Every move in that war was dissected and tossed out as proof of Bush's incompetence. And, when Bush got something right, it was a chorus of crickets coming from the left. And, let us not forget the mass surrendering that took place from Harry Reid on down...I think at one time, the entire Dem caucus was calling it a defeat on one level or another.

271 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:45:22pm

re: #237 Daria Emmons

To be clear, I believe the following:

Robert Spencer and Pam Gellar are not trustworthy enough sources to simply rely upon their word. But at the same time, their saying something does not render it untrue.

But if they say it, I won't be reading it, because I refuse to patronize bigoted hate sites.

272 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:45:30pm

re: #248 Kosh's Shadow

And the Arabs have taken the Nazi Jew-hatred and are using it for their own purposes.

Hatred never goes to waste, it all gets polished up and recycled in the next generation.

//big sigh

273 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:45:33pm

re: #263 Alouette

The "Apartheid" Wall is working.

Thank Hashem.

274 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:45:38pm

re: #253 SanFranciscoZionist

I've mnetioned before, there is a rather alarming article in which he attacks the work of a woman Muslim scholar who asserts that it is not required for a woman to cover her hair. Spencer apparently can't handle the idea that anything is going on in Islam that might contradict or complicate his All Killin' All The Time image of it.

Yes! He's repeatedly attacked moderate muslims, and has the gall to tell them they're not following islam. How would any of us like someone to come and tell us we're not following our religion based off their knowledge of what they think our religion is? It's insulting!

275 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:45:41pm

re: #247 marjoriemoon

That's right and they all hate Israel too, right?

That's a different topic. Of course.

How in the world can voting for body armor "bash Bush"?

Because if I, a Congressional Rep, have a career-long record of opposing every upgrade to the military's equipment and weaponry, every real increase in defense spending, etc... but then suddenly, one day, announce that the evil Bush regime hasn't given our boys enough body armor... and then promptly go back to ensuring that their weaponry stays mired in the last century... it kind of looks like I'm being opportunistic, doesn't it?

(And by the way, the idea that "more body armor" is always a good thing was not exactly a slam-dunk. The articles on the issue at the time - and I do give WaPo, for one, credit for this - quoted some combat soldiers as being against it, on the grounds that more armor would slow them down.)

276 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:46:20pm
277 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:46:40pm

re: #253 SanFranciscoZionist

I've mnetioned before, there is a rather alarming article in which he attacks the work of a woman Muslim scholar who asserts that it is not required for a woman to cover her hair. Spencer apparently can't handle the idea that anything is going on in Islam that might contradict or complicate his All Killin' All The Time image of it.

Exactly. Scholarly research is one thing. Research with an agenda is quite another. When the field includes a language most of us have not studied, one can draw wild conclusions and feel safe in the obscurity of the source material (for a while.)

278 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:47:44pm

re: #267 Killgore Trout

That last is really disgusting.

279 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:48:06pm

re: #271 Charles

But if they say it, I won't be reading it, because I refuse to patronize bigoted hate sites.

And this is the proper stance IMHO.

280 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:48:09pm

re: #276 buzzsawmonkey

I had a lump of it--really beautiful--that I used to carry as a "fidget piece,"

[insert mandatory "you can go blind doing that" comment here]

281 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:48:12pm

re: #267 Killgore Trout

He also has a link on his sidebar to really funny site about Michelle Obama committing suicide and being tortured in hell.

What the hell ever happened to respectfully disagreeing with people and working within a well functioning and polite system to bring about change you seek?

All we get now is kooks demonizing everyone (including the First Ladies FFS) and using Alinsky tactics.

282 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:48:36pm

re: #266 Daria Emmons

But while there are fewer rocket attacks, the attacks do continue. And Charles has NOT covered a Sderot rocket attack in a long time.

Moreover, the hate flowing from the imams, sheikhs, schools, United Nations, and political leaders - none of it has stopped/slowed. And it is very clear that Hizballah/Hamas are presently amassing a huge arsenal to eventually better attack Israel with.

Nothing really has 'slowed,' not in any real sense.

Israel has gotten much better at catching homicide bombers before they get very far. Sderot is still under attack, but it has slowed down, we just don't know for how long:
Damascus-based Hamas leader Khaled Mashaal visiting Sudan on Wednesday said that his group produces and smuggles weapons despite the blockade imposed by Israel on the Gaza Strip.

And in the US, we still have the benefit of the Bush years of stopping terrorism; I shudder to think what the results will be of Obama's rules and attacks on the CIA.

283 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:49:00pm

re: #274 Sharmuta

Yes! He's repeatedly attacked moderate muslims, and has the gall to tell them they're not following islam. How would any of us like someone to come and tell us we're not following our religion based off their knowledge of what they think our religion is? It's insulting!

Puts Muslims in a terrible bind, doesn't it? You can be a homicidal fanatic, and Robert Spencer wants the whole world to wage war against you, or you can be a moderate, sane, civilized person, and Robert Spencer will tell you you're a bad Muslim.

///

284 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:49:16pm

re: #262 Sharmuta

He holds him in respect, he says. People who know something about this rift, yet still hold spencer in respect are granting him legitimacy to continue with his agenda. An agenda that has no problem aligning with fascists. Regards Brian doesn't seem to care he's helping spencer spread the reborn evil that killed millions by continuing to think he's respectable.

I do not believe Spencer is himself a Neonazi. I think he looks the otehr way when he works with Neonazis. That might seem like a non-difference, but it is a difference. It means that ultimately Brian is linking to someone who links to Neonazis.

I will put it this way: I don't link to Jihad Watch (well, I have no blog, so that would be difficult!), but I have spoken to people who read that site regularly. Does it make them fascist enablers? I don't see how it does.

Very well known human rights activists also link to Jihad Watch. Does that make them fascist enablers?

Say what you want about Robert Spencer. But I do not believe that a link to his website proves one thing or another about the person doing the linking.

285 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:50:03pm

I also want to clearly say that Charles has not "gone soft" or any such B.S. on the Jihadis.

He has however correctly decided that getting in bed with people who are just as evil, is not a good thing.

That does not make him soft on evil, rather open eyed to it.

286 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:50:08pm

re: #274 Sharmuta

Yes! He's repeatedly attacked moderate muslims, and has the gall to tell them they're not following islam. How would any of us like someone to come and tell us we're not following our religion based off their knowledge of what they think our religion is? It's insulting!

Attacking moderates and reformers is not going to help bring about the modern reforms that Islam badly needs to get it out of the 12th century. This speaks volumes about Spencer and his ilk.

287 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:50:48pm

re: #286 ArchangelMichael

Attacking moderates and reformers is not going to help bring about the modern reforms that Islam badly needs to get it out of the 12th century. This speaks volumes about Spencer and his ilk.

Don't kill the job, as they used to tell me when I was in the union.

288 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:51:01pm

re: #286 ArchangelMichael

Attacking moderates and reformers is not going to help bring about the modern reforms that Islam badly needs to get it out of the 12th century. This speaks volumes about Spencer and his ilk.

I don't think SPencer wants Islam to get out of the 12th century. My assessment is that he simply wants it destroyed.

289 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:51:11pm

re: #283 SanFranciscoZionist

Puts Muslims in a terrible bind, doesn't it? You can be a homicidal fanatic, and Robert Spencer wants the whole world to wage war against you, or you can be a moderate, sane, civilized person, and Robert Spencer will tell you you're a bad Muslim.

///

Exactly. They can't win with Robert or any of the other "counter-jihadis". They repeatedly ask where are the moderate muslims, and then when one stands up- they are condemned for not knowing their own religion.

290 theheat  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:51:13pm

re: #269 SixDegrees

Yes, I actually thought of that at the time. Trouble is, in a class of talented students, he wouldn't have cut it back then. These days, he'd still suck, but someone would pat him on the back and tell him he had promise or enthusiasm or some other substitute for artistic talent.

Bob Ross had more talent. And all his clouds were happy.

291 livefreeor die  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:51:28pm

re: #223 Occasional Reader

The sometimes-annoying panel on the NPR "Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me" did have a pretty funny round of impromptu one-liners once, in which they were imagining driving "Clippy" out to the woods to have him whacked, Sopranos-style.

"It looks like you're digging a grave! Is that a business grave, or a personal grave?"

That's great! I can't stand that clip-he has such a nosy neighbor quality to him.
"It looks like you're staring at the screen. Would you like me to help you?)

He'd be better if he was like DeNiro's character in Taxi Driver.
"Are you looking at me? Are you asking me to help you to write a letter?"

292 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:51:31pm

Gotta go. Work calls.

293 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:51:39pm

re: #191 HelloDare

Charles,

Did you move the contact link? I can't find it.

It's temporarily removed because a psychotic freak was using it to send me hate mail about being "ass-raped." Only way to stop it was to remove the form.

294 What, me worry?  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:51:55pm

re: #266 Daria Emmons

But while there are fewer rocket attacks, the attacks do continue. And Charles has NOT covered a Sderot rocket attack in a long time.

Moreover, the hate flowing from the imams, sheikhs, schools, United Nations, and political leaders - none of it has stopped/slowed. And it is very clear that Hizballah/Hamas are presently amassing a huge arsenal to eventually better attack Israel with.

Nothing really has 'slowed,' not in any real sense.

Well you have your story and seem quite stuck with it. I guess that's ok.

I will reiterate that no one is saying anything stopped. No one said the attacks are not continuing.

With the election heating up from last year, domestic politics (economy, healthcare primarily) this blog and many like it, have taken a different turn. If you want more Israeli news, I guess you'll have to go somewhere else.

Hamas has been "amassing a huge arsenal to attack Israel" for years and years. Thank you Egypt for not securing the corridor. Well, whatever. It ain't gonna happen. Israel continues to put a dent in those plans.

295 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:52:08pm

re: #285 LudwigVanQuixote

I also want to clearly say that Charles has not "gone soft" or any such B.S. on the Jihadis.

He has however correctly decided that getting in bed with people who are just as evil, is not a good thing.

That does not make him soft on evil, rather open eyed to it.

NO ONE should get in bed with Neonazis under ANY circumstances. Charles has the exactly right stance on that, and I support him 100%.

But at the same time, he said, in his own words, that he doesn't cover Jihad as much because it has "slowed."

I believe that this is fallacious reasoning and ultimately inaccurate.

296 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:52:26pm

re: #288 SanFranciscoZionist

I don't think SPencer wants Islam to get out of the 12th century. My assessment is that he simply wants it destroyed.

Yes, and modernizing Islam would go against this goal.

297 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:53:35pm

re: #293 Charles

It's temporarily removed because a psychotic freak was using it to send me hate mail about being "ass-raped." Only way to stop it was to remove the form.

Oh dear G-d.

This is the point where I know I could not do your job. My temper would not allow it.

298 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:53:56pm

re: #290 theheat

Yes, I actually thought of that at the time. Trouble is, in a class of talented students, he wouldn't have cut it back then. These days, he'd still suck, but someone would pat him on the back and tell him he had promise or enthusiasm or some other substitute for artistic talent.

Bob Ross had more talent. And all his clouds were happy.

LOL.

299 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:54:07pm

re: #288 SanFranciscoZionist

I don't think SPencer wants Islam to get out of the 12th century. My assessment is that he simply wants it destroyed.

Yes- after the Facebook incident, I was pretty convinced he's a religious supremacist. It's not about fighting jihad and bringing islam to moderation- it's about religious dominance.

300 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:54:25pm

re: #294 marjoriemoon

Well you have your story and seem quite stuck with it. I guess that's ok.

I will reiterate that no one is saying anything stopped. No one said the attacks are not continuing.

With the election heating up from last year, domestic politics (economy, healthcare primarily) this blog and many like it, have taken a different turn. If you want more Israeli news, I guess you'll have to go somewhere else.

Hamas has been "amassing a huge arsenal to attack Israel" for years and years. Thank you Egypt for not securing the corridor. Well, whatever. It ain't gonna happen. Israel continues to put a dent in those plans.

Marjorie,

You appear to ultimately agree that Jihad remains a tremendous problem in Israel. But this problem is not limited to Israel. It remains a problem around the world - recently, Chavez announced a major oil deal with Ahmadinejad. Venezuela is heating up, linking in with Iran.

This is all a global problem, it remains a global problem, and has not 'slowed' at all.

301 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:54:55pm

re: #295 Daria Emmons

NO ONE should get in bed with Neonazis under ANY circumstances. Charles has the exactly right stance on that, and I support him 100%.

But at the same time, he said, in his own words, that he doesn't cover Jihad as much because it has "slowed."

I believe that this is fallacious reasoning and ultimately inaccurate.

But it has slowed overall. He does not argue that it went away or that it will not come back.

I have great faith that when it does, Charles will be one of the first to draw attention to it.

302 Coracle  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:55:34pm

re: #275 Occasional Reader

Because if I, a Congressional Rep, have a career-long record of opposing every upgrade to the military's equipment and weaponry, every real increase in defense spending, etc... but then suddenly, one day, announce that the evil Bush regime hasn't given our boys enough body armor... and then promptly go back to ensuring that their weaponry stays mired in the last century... it kind of looks like I'm being opportunistic, doesn't it?

Your strawman congressional rep. Does he have a name? Can I find records of this rep(s) voting against "every upgrade to the military's equipment and weaponry, every real increase in defense spending, etc..." because s/he is simply opposed to the military? And then "suddenly" condemn Bush, and then go right back to their antimilitary ways?

303 Randall Gross  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:55:41pm

The thing that's changed 2006 to present is that the Jihad has changed focus, or perhaps you and Spencer missed Zawahiri's memo.

They are now focused on internal temporal power within the Islamic world, that's what the "Wilderness Doctrine" is all about. They are trying to bring about the third fitna, and so far they seem to be doing better at that than opposing the west, note how the people dieing in terror attacks are almost all other muslims now. (Yala/Pattani and Gaza being the exceptions, but even there you see the infighting between groups.)

While external terror attacks are way down, they certainly aren't gone. e.g.

[Link: www.reuters.com...]

304 What, me worry?  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:55:50pm

re: #275 Occasional Reader

Because if I, a Congressional Rep, have a career-long record of opposing every upgrade to the military's equipment and weaponry, every real increase in defense spending, etc... but then suddenly, one day, announce that the evil Bush regime hasn't given our boys enough body armor... and then promptly go back to ensuring that their weaponry stays mired in the last century... it kind of looks like I'm being opportunistic, doesn't it?

(And by the way, the idea that "more body armor" is always a good thing was not exactly a slam-dunk. The articles on the issue at the time - and I do give WaPo, for one, credit for this - quoted some combat soldiers as being against it, on the grounds that more armor would slow them down.)

I don't believe my elected representatives. my DEMOCRATIC elected representatives are snakes in the grass, cunning and manipulatiive. You have this view of the Dem party, but that's ok. It's my view of the Republican party. So that makes us even I guess.

Of course, if you did find that ONE honest Democrat (I'm sure there's one in there O.R.) that would vote for body armor, it's really not what the troops want anyway so he still loses, is that right?

305 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:55:53pm

re: #301 LudwigVanQuixote

But it has slowed overall. He does not argue that it went away or that it will not come back.

I have great faith that when it does, Charles will be one of the first to draw attention to it.

Where is your evidence that Jihad has slowed? Seriously - I would like to see raw stats on this.

306 _RememberTonyC  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:56:58pm

Slightly OT, but this is worth reading. Victor Davis Hanson has many admirers on this board, myself being one of the most enthusiastic. But today's column is so insightful and thorough, that any Lizard would certainly get a lot from reading it.

[Link: victorhanson.com...]

I promise you will not be disappointed!

307 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:57:12pm

re: #302 Coracle

Your strawman congressional rep. Does he have a name?

He's not a strawman, he's an amalgam. Want someone in real life who's pretty darn close? May I introduce you to one Sen. John Kerry.

308 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:58:04pm

Spencer is definitely anti-jihadist, that is not an issue.
Spencer's academic expertise in Islamic matters is similarly not an issue.
Spencer's ongoing slander and defamation of Charles has proven Spencer to be lacking in credibility, but even this is not the main issue.
Spencer's willingness to enable and align himself with neo-nazis is the real issue.
This afternoon's troll can serve as a useful reminder that all decent people need to do more than merely withhold approval of the neo-nazis and their enablers.
Decent people need to continue to condemn and oppose the neo-nazis and to speak out against their enablers. LGF has done that, and continues to do so.
But please let's not take the pressure off, because the horrible Islamofascist plague in Europe is not abating, and neither is the terrible neo-nazi reaction to it.

309 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:58:14pm
310 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:58:18pm

re: #304 marjoriemoon

You have this view of the Dem party, but that's ok.

Actually, I am a registered Democrat, and have been since age 18 (as I have stated numerous times on these pages).

And as I said before, "some, not all" Congressional Dems have behaved this way.

311 Randall Gross  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:58:37pm

re: #305 Daria Emmons

I won't link TROP anymore because they carry stories from the VB/BNP supporting Brussels journal, but they do keep stats. Take a look.

312 Coracle  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:59:24pm

re: #307 Occasional Reader

He's not a strawman, he's an amalgam. Want someone in real life who's pretty darn close? May I introduce you to one Sen. John Kerry.

No I don't want any one who's "pretty darn close" becuase I don't trust your assessment of "pretty darn close" with out hard numbers.

So it's not a "Strawman", but an "amalgam". Which also means "not in fact real".

313 opnion  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 1:59:55pm

re: #307 Occasional Reader

He's not a strawman, he's an amalgam. Want someone in real life who's pretty darn close? May I introduce you to one Sen. John Kerry.

Ah John Kerry, the new Senior Senator from Massachusetts., beloved by himself & those in Hanoi.

314 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:01:06pm

re: #304 marjoriemoon

Of course, if you did find that ONE honest Democrat (I'm sure there's one in there O.R.) that would vote for body armor, it's really not what the troops want anyway so he still loses, is that right?

And funny how, in this part of the thread, in which there's been some discussion of demonizing opponents, you've decided that of course I have the worst possible motives.

First off, I didn't make the claim that Dems would vote against the body armor.

Second, my point about more armor not always being better was... well... factual. Sorry if you don't like it. Delta operators, for instance, deliberately eschew the heavy "battle rattle", and even Kevlar helmets, because they think it slows them down too much. It just... depends. See? Nuance.

315 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:01:09pm

re: #311 Thanos

I won't link TROP anymore because they carry stories from the VB/BNP supporting Brussels journal, but they do keep stats. Take a look.

So you basically have no comprehensive report that showcases declining Jihad.

316 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:02:30pm

re: #302 Coracle

Your strawman congressional rep. Does he have a name? Can I find records of this rep(s) voting against "every upgrade to the military's equipment and weaponry, every real increase in defense spending, etc..." because s/he is simply opposed to the military? And then "suddenly" condemn Bush, and then go right back to their antimilitary ways?

Baghdad Jim McDimwitt, (D) WA 7th CD is pretty close.

317 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:02:46pm

re: #312 Coracle

No I don't want any one who's "pretty darn close" becuase I don't trust your assessment of "pretty darn close" with out hard numbers.

So it's not a "Strawman", but an "amalgam". Which also means "not in fact real".

Sorry, you didn't understand that a post beginning with the phrase "if I, a Congressional Rep"... was not a deliberate hypothetical? You think I'm... actually a Congressional Rep?!

Well, nothing I can do about that.

318 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:02:57pm

re: #315 Daria Emmons

So you basically have no comprehensive report that showcases declining Jihad.

I missed your comprehensive report that showcases increasing jihad?

319 Randall Gross  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:03:09pm

re: #315 Daria Emmons

TROP has the reports, go look. It's there. What you will find is that the great bulk of terror reports they carry now are all in war zones (Pakistan, Afghanistan, Somalia, Iraq) with only a few exceptions. So yes, I do.

320 Coracle  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:03:23pm

re: #316 jcm

Baghdad Jim McDimwitt, (D) WA 7th CD is pretty close.

How close is "close"? What's his stance on military funding?

321 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:03:58pm

re: #293 Charles

It's temporarily removed because a psychotic freak was using it to send me hate mail... Only way to stop it was to remove the form.

Excuse the elipse, I didn't think anyone needed to read that again.

Did you manage to get this person some official attention?

322 Randall Gross  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:04:34pm

Terror attacks report

[Link: www.cleveland.com...]

323 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:05:45pm

re: #315 Daria Emmons

So you basically have no comprehensive report that showcases declining Jihad.

Uh - I believe he just gave you one. Charles doesn't care for it much when people link to certain sites; he's just following the rules, but there's more than enough information there for you to pull up the link on your own, if you're interested.

324 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:06:07pm

An oldie but a goodie, updated for the thread...

When President Obama first got into the oval office, he surprised to see a red phone, a black phone and a white one.

The red one calls the Russians. The black one calls the joint chiefs. The white one he is told calls G-d directly. He is told though that it is very very expensive to use the phone, tens of millions per minute.

He does however call G-d and they have a chat.

Later Obama discovers that the Russians have the same three phones. Only the red one calls him, and the white one is even more expensive to use.

Obama is shocked to find that Bibi, in Israel also has a white phone, and Bibi talks on it all the time.

How is that asks Obama? How can your country afford it?

Local call.

325 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:06:37pm

re: #316 jcm

Baghdad Jim McDimwitt, (D) WA 7th CD is pretty close.

Pete Stark of California.

326 Coracle  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:06:45pm

re: #317 Occasional Reader

Sorry, you didn't understand that a post beginning with the phrase "if I, a Congressional Rep"... was not a deliberate hypothetical? You think I'm... actually a Congressional Rep?!

Well, nothing I can do about that.

So your "hypothetical" congressional rep was just some out of the blue statement? "If I were a US congressman from Tanzania... If I were a US congressman who believed we should all grow gills..." Like that? You weren't insinuating that your "hypothetical" congressman was not in fact representative of an entire, say, party's worth of congressmen?

Yeah. Thought so.

327 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:07:45pm

re: #320 Coracle

How close is "close"? What's his stance on military funding?

When it's Bush, No...

When it's Obama, yes.

But of course with McDimwit (admitted felon) he said we can take Saddam at face value but Bush would lie.

328 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:08:59pm

re: #321 Dianna

Excuse the elipse, I didn't think anyone needed to read that again.

Did you manage to get this person some official attention?

There's nobody who will do anything about this -- I've tried in the past. When neo-Nazi Bill White was emailing me threats and trying to find my home address and my family's home addresses, I contacted the FBI -- and was basically told to forget it. They wouldn't even take a report.

And this psycho using the contact form is in Israel, which means it's even less likely that anyone will do anything about it.

329 Randall Gross  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:09:08pm
330 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:10:04pm

re: #326 Coracle

"You weren't insinuating that your "hypothetical" congressman was not in fact representative of an entire, say, party's worth of congressmen?"

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

Do you not understand what a "generalization" is?

Yes, the left wing ("some, but not all") of the Democratic Party have been traditionally not supportive of increased defense spending.

Do you disagree with that statment? Think Dennis Kucinich and Jim McDermott are big military boosters?

331 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:11:01pm

re: #323 SixDegrees

Uh - I believe he just gave you one. Charles doesn't care for it much when people link to certain sites; he's just following the rules, but there's more than enough information there for you to pull up the link on your own, if you're interested.

No, he did not give one.

Religion of Peace does not even address the most pressing and terrible form of jihad - the ongoing hate indoctrination, as well as arms build up. Not to mention the daily rape/torture going on in Iran.

This has NOT slowed, and it continues daily.

332 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:11:31pm

re: #309 taxfreekiller

Just came in from changing oil in two John Deers,
24 dam qts at $2.00 each,, crap.

Any how, as I came in I noticed this big old empty spot where the TV
usually sits..., I turn to ms tfk,,, "what the hell happened to the TV"

she smiles, "I was afraid you would watch Obama tonight so its in hiding"".

She could have just disconnected the cable and said "let's watch movies tonight".

333 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:11:47pm

re: #328 Charles

There's nobody who will do anything about this -- I've tried in the past. When neo-Nazi Bill White was emailing me threats and trying to find my home address and my family's home addresses, I contacted the FBI -- and was basically told to forget it. They wouldn't even take a report.

And this psycho using the contact form is in Israel, which means it's even less likely that anyone will do anything about it.

Ughhh - even worse... I hate seeing evidence of the existence of our own freaks. It burns my soul.

334 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:12:18pm

re: #328 Charles

When neo-Nazi Bill White was emailing me threats and trying to find my home address and my family's home addresses, I contacted the FBI -- and was basically told to forget it. They wouldn't even take a report.

That's quite shocking.

Did they say why not (if you don't mind sharing)?

335 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:12:47pm

re: #309 taxfreekiller

Just came in from changing oil in two John Deers,
24 dam qts at $2.00 each,, crap.

Any how, as I came in I noticed this big old empty spot where the TV
usually sits..., I turn to ms tfk,,, "what the hell happened to the TV"

she smiles, "I was afraid you would watch Obama tonight so its in hiding"".

Wouldn't have been easier to hide the bricks?

336 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:12:51pm

re: #333 LudwigVanQuixote

Ughhh - even worse... I hate seeing evidence of the existence of our own freaks. It burns my soul.

Don't worry - it'll burn the freak's soul, too, if certain theories originating in and around Israel are correct.

337 Bob Dillon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:12:59pm

re: #250 lawhawk

[Link: www.usatoday.com...]

Weakened al-Qaeda is still a threat

Now, Mueller and counterterrorism analysts are tracking the emergence of a new threat. Al-Qaeda has morphed into a fractured network of small terrorist franchises strewn across Asia, the Middle East and Africa. In Yemen, according to Senate testimony by Director of National Intelligence Dennis Blair, a "jihadist battleground" is rising amid growing political upheaval and poverty. Blair says there are concerns that al-Qaeda could establish a "regional base of operations" in Yemen to train operatives and plot new attacks against the West.

Al-Qaeda's transformation raises an unsettling question: Does its splintering help make the USA and its Western allies safer, or does it complicate efforts to guard against terrorism?

"Yes, they retain the capability of striking overseas," Mueller says in an interview, declining to specify whether the USA is vulnerable to such an attack. "They are still lethal."

338 opnion  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:13:03pm

re: #331 Daria Emmons

No, he did not give one.

Religion of Peace does not even address the most pressing and terrible form of jihad - the ongoing hate indoctrination, as well as arms build up. Not to mention the daily rape/torture going on in Iran.

This has NOT slowed, and it continues daily.

It seems to me that an 18% drop in terrorism outside of Pakistan still leaves a whole lot of terrorism unless I misread cleveland.com

339 Coracle  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:13:50pm

re: #327 jcm

When it's Bush, No...

When it's Obama, yes.

But of course with McDimwit (admitted felon) he said we can take Saddam at face value but Bush would lie.

Bush No?
Sept 29 '08 Defense Authorization Bill Y
June 19 08 GI Bill Y
Nov 07 Supplemental appropriations for DoD Y
Sept 07 Mandatory Troop Rest periods between deployments Y
The list goes on.

Inarguably more No's than Yes'es in military votes, But inarguably votes to care for the troops. And not even close to the strawma- Er "amalgam" Rep.

340 Lincolntf  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:15:04pm

Drudge says they no longer have the votes (big siren and everything).
I found no link. Anyone have a clue as to the math or where Drudge got it?

If the House has already decided to chuck Obama's plan, then this turkey is dead.
Cross your fingers.

341 astronmr20  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:15:06pm

O/T,

Passenger Jet hijacked in Mexico

342 What, me worry?  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:15:15pm

re: #314 Occasional Reader

And funny how, in this part of the thread, in which there's been some discussion of demonizing opponents, you've decided that of course I have the worst possible motives.

First off, I didn't make the claim that Dems would vote against the body armor.

Second, my point about more armor not always being better was... well... factual. Sorry if you don't like it. Delta operators, for instance, deliberately eschew the heavy "battle rattle", and even Kevlar helmets, because they think it slows them down too much. It just... depends. See? Nuance.

I get very pissy when people state untruths. Regards Brian has a very bold statement on his website that says "Democrats kill soldiers" which is so much anti-liberal crap, makes me hurl. That's what got me going.

As a Dem yourself (do you actually vote Dem? doesn't sound like it) I would think you would support your party platform more strongly, but maybe you do in other areas. I do not take your view about Dems who serve in Congress.

However, I have to log out for a bit, but I promise to come back later and taunt you a second time.

:)

343 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:15:53pm

re: #334 Occasional Reader

That's quite shocking.

Did they say why not (if you don't mind sharing)?

He was clever enough to mask the threats just enough that they weren't what the FBI considers actionable. Clearly, he knew the limits from past experience and went right up to them but not over.

344 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:16:08pm

re: #331 Daria Emmons

No, he did not give one.

Religion of Peace does not even address the most pressing and terrible form of jihad - the ongoing hate indoctrination, as well as arms build up. Not to mention the daily rape/torture going on in Iran.

This has NOT slowed, and it continues daily.

So you're too lazy and uninterested to look up the link for the information he provided.

Color me unimpressed.

Note that I have no idea which of you is correct in this matter. But I do know which of you isn't interested in actually learning anything.

345 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:16:12pm

re: #328 Charles

There's nobody who will do anything about this -- I've tried in the past. When neo-Nazi Bill White was emailing me threats and trying to find my home address and my family's home addresses, I contacted the FBI -- and was basically told to forget it. They wouldn't even take a report.

And this psycho using the contact form is in Israel, which means it's even less likely that anyone will do anything about it.

Capture the IP and post it on 2600.com as a cache of untapped credit card accounts. Hax ftw!

(Do I need to add that this is just a humorous suggestion? Well.. guess I just did.)

346 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:16:17pm

re: #333 LudwigVanQuixote

Ughhh - even worse... I hate seeing evidence of the existence of our own freaks. It burns my soul.


There are freaks everywhere.

You should see the crazy religious crap I get in the snail mail to both my home and office from some orthodox (i assume) end of days guy.

My cabal can't do anything about it.

347 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:16:24pm

re: #331 Daria Emmons

No, he did not give one.

Religion of Peace does not even address the most pressing and terrible form of jihad - the ongoing hate indoctrination, as well as arms build up. Not to mention the daily rape/torture going on in Iran.

This has NOT slowed, and it continues daily.

Daria, no-one here, no-one, denies that there is Hamas Mickey and such. This site was the first I saw link to such things. The only operative issue here is not wanting to get fleas from laying down with certain dogs.

I am as staunch a Zionist as you are likely to find.

So are many others here. Many of them aren't even Jews.

Charles has not forgotten the realities of the situation. No one here has.

The point, and the only point, is that we should not feed the animals.

348 Coracle  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:16:40pm

re: #330 Occasional Reader


Do you not understand what a "generalization" is?

Yes, the left wing ("some, but not all") of the Democratic Party have been traditionally not supportive of increased defense spending.

Do you disagree with that statment? Think Dennis Kucinich and Jim McDermott are big military boosters?

That (bolded) statement I agree with. Do you not see the difference between that statement and your "generalization"? If you think there is no difference, it is you posessing incomplete understanding of the term.

349 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:16:51pm

re: #341 astronmr20

O/T,

Passenger Jet hijacked in Mexico

Over...

350 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:16:56pm

re: #341 astronmr20

O/T,

Passenger Jet hijacked in Mexico

All over; the hijackers have been led off in handcuffs.
And they weren't jihadis:

Mexican news media reported the hijackers were Bolivian citizens demanding to speak with Mexican President Felipe Calderon.
351 experiencedtraveller  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:16:58pm

re: #328 Charles

Shotgun for home defense.
After 50 yards a pistol can kiss your a$$. Just zigzag.
And get thee to a dojo. Nothing better for close-in than a trained punch.

/Sadly...

352 _RememberTonyC  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:17:01pm

Great piece in the Wall Street Journal by Manhattan DA Robert Morganthau on the iranian/venezuelan relationship and how it threatens our interests. Perhaps Mr Obama's FCC appointee who loves the chavez revolution so much should read this. And Mr Obama should do the same.

[Link: online.wsj.com...]

353 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:17:29pm

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

largest find of jewish revolt coins found.

354 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:17:34pm

re: #338 opnion

It seems to me that an 18% drop in terrorism outside of Pakistan still leaves a whole lot of terrorism unless I misread cleveland.com

I'm pretty certain he never said terrorism or jihad had vanished, only that it was on the decline.

Your own independent figures seem to bear that assertion out.

355 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:17:40pm

re: #344 SixDegrees

So you're too lazy and uninterested to look up the link for the information he provided.

Color me unimpressed.

Note that I have no idea which of you is correct in this matter. But I do know which of you isn't interested in actually learning anything.

I looked at the link on the US government website. It did not even addrss hate videos, arms build up, or indoctrination. It did not adderss the ongoing crisis in Iran.

Color me unimpressed that Jihad is not worthy of great coverage because it is "slowing down."

356 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:17:41pm

re: #351 experiencedtraveller

Shotgun for home defense.

I have a friend named Mossberg who's quite good at such things.

357 Bob Dillon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:18:13pm

re: #341 astronmr20

O/T,

Passenger Jet hijacked in Mexico

Hijacking over at Mexico City airport
'Passengers are safe, there was no bomb,' minister says

358 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:18:20pm

re: #342 marjoriemoon

As a Dem yourself (do you actually vote Dem? doesn't sound like it) I would think you would support your party platform more strongly

I have not voted Dem since 2000. Among other reasons, because I no longer consider the party reliable on national defense issues.

359 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:18:42pm

re: #353 yochanan

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

largest find of jewish revolt coins found.

Cool!

360 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:19:02pm

re: #356 Charles

I have a friend named Mossberg who's quite good at such things.

Good friend to have.

361 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:19:12pm

re: #353 yochanan

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

largest find of jewish revolt coins found.

So that's where I put them! I thought I'd lost them in the wash.

362 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:19:22pm

re: #253 SanFranciscoZionist

Spencer apparently can't handle the idea that anything is going on in Islam that might contradict or complicate his All Killin' All The Time image of it.

I drifted away from LGF for several years after the Terry Schiavo case in 2005, but it wasn't only because of the Schiavo case -- I was also getting bored and annoyed by what seemed to me to be an endless stream of "Bad News From The Islamosphere" posts on the LGF front page. Although Charles has always been vastly better than Spencer at recognizing the existence of sincerely liberal and reform-minded Muslims, there was a period in LGF history where the previously held distinction between "Muslim" and "Islamofascist" seemed to be eroding, and for Charles to put up post after post about honor killings or Female Genital Mutilation (both of which are tribal-culture problems that transcend and pre-date Islam) contributed to that erosion, even though that wasn't Charles' intent.

Which is just my way of saying that I'm glad Charles shifted LGF's focus away from "all counter-jihad, all the time" (while continuing to point out BIG news from the Middle East and Israel and the Islamosphere, of course), because if he hadn't, LGF would've devolved into a Spencerian bog where people strain at Muslim gnats while swallowing White Eurofascist camels.

363 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:19:23pm

re: #353 yochanan

The Arabs will claim that the coins were theirs and stolen by the Jooos in 3..2..1

364 What, me worry?  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:19:24pm

Daria, if I have some time, I'll get you some Israeli statistics on the war on terror in Israel. I think you'll be surprised at the findings.

365 The Left  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:19:35pm

re: #302 Coracle

Your strawman congressional rep. Does he have a name? Can I find records of this rep(s) voting against "every upgrade to the military's equipment and weaponry, every real increase in defense spending, etc..." because s/he is simply opposed to the military? And then "suddenly" condemn Bush, and then go right back to their antimilitary ways?

Not to mention that it would be perfectly consistent to have, in the past, wanted lower defence spending, and then when we are in a war, want the troops to have the best body armour and other resources available.

There's no reason to think that position is about 'bashing Bush', as opposed to reflecting a genuine concern for the troops in the theatre of war. None.

366 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:20:10pm

re: #343 Charles

He was clever enough to mask the threats just enough that they weren't what the FBI considers actionable. Clearly, he knew the limits from past experience and went right up to them but not over.

You can always go after his service provider, or his email provider.

Not much hope of getting anything accomplished there, I know, but it couldn't hurt.

367 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:20:29pm

re: #356 Charles

I have a friend named Mossberg who's quite good at such things.

If you haven't already done so, you should also take a "shotgun home defense" course. (I took one a few years back, need to do a refresher.)

368 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:20:39pm

re: #353 yochanan

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

largest find of jewish revolt coins found.

Jewish images and words such as the facade of the Temple in Jerusalem and the slogan "for the freedom of Jerusalem,"

But...but...but...

369 John Neverbend  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:21:24pm

re: #363 Kosh's Shadow

The Arabs will claim that the coins were theirs and stolen by the Jooos in 3..2..1

More likely in 1..3..5, the year in which the Bar-Kochba revolt ended.

370 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:22:02pm

re: #356 Charles

I have a friend named Mossberg who's quite good at such things.

Mmmm Mossberg. I agree with other posts that a shotgun is superior for home defense to almost other type of legal weapon. It's even safe for apartment neighbors with the right load (i.e. won't go through the wall and kill little Sally).

Pistol wise I've had my eye on this Kimber Eclipse but that's for fun shooting. If someone's coming in the house I'm counting on a nice splayed shot pattern.

371 Clutch  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:22:18pm

OT:

Protect your chicken! (totally safe for family & work viewing, although there is a bit of violence in it.)

372 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:22:49pm

re: #365 iceweasel

Not to mention that it would be perfectly consistent to have, in the past, wanted lower defence spending, and then when we are in a war, want the troops to have the best body armour and other resources available.

Um... yeah, the problem is, war doesn't actually work that way. You can't cut resources for years, then suddenly have "the best resources" in theater and operative within a matter of weeks.

373 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:22:53pm

re: #360 jcm

Good friend to have.

Will keep the cat away from the bird feeder.

374 Kragar  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:23:05pm

re: #368 Ben Hur

Jewish images and words such as the facade of the Temple in Jerusalem and the slogan "for the freedom of Jerusalem,"

But...but...but...

So you're saying the Jews built a time machine and travelled back in time to seed the evidence?

/

375 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:23:31pm

re: #374 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

So you're saying the Jews built a time machine and travelled back in time to seed the evidence?

/

Not yet, but we will.

376 JustMyView  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:24:02pm

Charles: You used to have a small window on the left rail that people could use to send you email. Is there another way to do that? I may be missing something, but I don't see any "contact us" instructions.

377 Lincolntf  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:24:11pm

re: #356 Charles

Are you a hunter, or is your "friend" to be used exclusively on humans?

378 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:24:17pm

re: #373 Ben Hur

Will keep the cat away from the bird feeder.

Dat you Rabbit Bait?

;-P

379 John Neverbend  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:24:18pm

re: #368 Ben Hur

Jewish images and words such as the facade of the Temple in Jerusalem and the slogan "for the freedom of Jerusalem,"

But...but...but...

I have a facsimile of such a coin in gold. The Temple is on one side and on the other is a lulav and etrog. The letters are not conventional Hebrew.

380 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:24:24pm

re: #368 Ben Hur

Jewish images and words such as the facade of the Temple in Jerusalem and the slogan "for the freedom of Jerusalem,"

But...but...but...

should we send a copy of this find to the zero since he wants to make parts of Jerusalem judenfrei

JERUSALEM was the Jewish capital when Washington, d.c., Paris, & London were swamps.

381 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:24:32pm

Brian signed off and sent me an email telling how much LGF has declined and what a shame it is.

Which is pretty rich coming from a fascist enabler.

382 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:24:32pm

re: #343 Charles

He was clever enough to mask the threats just enough that they weren't what the FBI considers actionable. Clearly, he knew the limits from past experience and went right up to them but not over.

There's something wrong with this.

383 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:24:39pm

re: #376 JustMyView

Charles: You used to have a small window on the left rail that people could use to send you email. Is there another way to do that? I may be missing something, but I don't see any "contact us" instructions.

He disabled it due to some dumbass spamming him with hate mail. There is some info about it higher in the thread.

384 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:24:49pm

re: #368 Ben Hur

Jewish images and words such as the facade of the Temple in Jerusalem and the slogan "for the freedom of Jerusalem,"

But...but...but...

Yeah my first thought too...

Nothing to see here, move along, move along...

That reminds me of another oldie but goodie.

At the UN the Israeli representative got up and told a story about King David having his donkey stolen by a Palestinian.

An angry representative from the Arab league spluttered in rage at the evil Jewish lie...

"Everyone knows that there were no Palestinians in Israel during the times of King David. This is a LIE!"

The Israeli ambassador then continues...

"With that in mind, I would like to discuss Palestinian claims to the land..."

385 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:24:52pm

re: #377 Lincolntf

Are you a hunter, or is your "friend" to be used exclusively on humans?

Self-defence against two-legs is never against humans, to my way of thinking.

386 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:24:54pm

re: #377 Lincolntf

Are you a hunter, or is your "friend" to be used exclusively on humans?

Vermin, only vermin...

387 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:25:02pm

Him is on TV again tonight.

He likes the TV.

I said, "They say that the camera adds ten pounds."
Camera man looked at me and said, "How many cameras were on you?"

388 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:25:04pm

re: #370 Locker

Pistol wise I've had my eye on this Kimber Eclipse but that's for fun shooting. If someone's coming in the house I'm counting on a nice splayed shot pattern.

Some experts (Mas Ayoob comes to mind) actually recommend the pistol as the first response to a home-invasion scenario. Easier to manipulate in tight spaces, harder for the bad guy to grab/deflect, and leaves a hand free to dial 911. Your mileage may vary, etc.

389 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:25:08pm

re: #367 Occasional Reader

If you haven't already done so, you should also take a "shotgun home defense" course. (I took one a few years back, need to do a refresher.)

Yep, did it. Very interesting and enlightening.

390 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:25:12pm

I just don't understand people like Regards Brian who think they can stay neutral when one side has nazis they don't care to denounce, and the other side has principles.

It makes me sad to think a principled position is no better in the eyes of some than a position of fascist sympathizing. If it's that difficult to discern between the two, it speaks to the ethics/morality of the person who sees no difference.

391 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:25:23pm

re: #380 yochanan

should we send a copy of this find to the zero since he wants to make parts of Jerusalem judenfrei

JERUSALEM was the Jewish capital when Washington, d.c., Paris, & London were swamps.

Amen to that.

392 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:25:27pm

re: #380 yochanan

should we send a copy of this find to the zero since he wants to make parts of Jerusalem judenfrei

JERUSALEM was the Jewish capital when Washington, d.c., Paris, & London were swamps.

Jerusalem still is, and Washington still is.

393 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:25:29pm

re: #373 Ben Hur

Will keep the cat away from the bird feeder.

Lest the bird feeder become the cat feeder.

394 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:25:31pm

re: #324 LudwigVanQuixote

An oldie but a goodie, updated for the thread...

When President Obama first got into the oval office, he surprised to see a red phone, a black phone and a white one.

The red one calls the Russians. The black one calls the joint chiefs. The white one he is told calls G-d directly. He is told though that it is very very expensive to use the phone, tens of millions per minute.

He does however call G-d and they have a chat.

Later Obama discovers that the Russians have the same three phones. Only the red one calls him, and the white one is even more expensive to use.

Obama is shocked to find that Bibi, in Israel also has a white phone, and Bibi talks on it all the time.

How is that asks Obama? How can your country afford it?

Local call.

I have a cell phone. All us Zionist honcos do. Heh.

395 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:25:51pm

re: #356 Charles

I have a friend named Mossberg who's quite good at such things.

I just got done watching the latest of those Brinks Home Security commercials. Like every other one, we have mommy and daughter playing at home, burglar kicks in door which triggers the Brinks siren and callbacks while the girls freeze, look terrified, then run upstairs for no apparent reason. Burglar is deterred by the siren, happy endings all 'round.

Just once, instead of running away I'd like to see mom reach into the closet and level a shotgun at the perp. Just once. Yes, thank God for Brinks and all that, but in other home invasion situations - crazy ex-boyfriend, stalker, rapist and so on - that siren and phone check give the perp all kinds of time to do all kinds of unspeakable things, a lot of which the victim will never recover from. I hate the portrayal that being frightened and passive will make everything all right, as long as the Brinks checks clear.

396 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:25:55pm

re: #356 Charles

I have a friend named Mossberg who's quite good at such things.

Good!

I hesitate, given the current climate, to suggest someone get a gun. But if you have one, and an alarm system, and a cell phone, you should be all right.

397 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:26:03pm

You can email me at charles -at- littlegreen etc. (Fill in the blanks.)

398 Leonidas Hoplite  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:26:07pm

Thomas Friedman has escaped the asylum

There is only one thing worse than one-party autocracy, and that is one-party democracy, which is what we have in America today.

One-party autocracy certainly has its drawbacks. But when it is led by a reasonably enlightened group of people, as China is today, it can also have great advantages.

Reasonably enlightened? Is he serious?
I'm glad he's just an idiot writer and not in charge of anything.

399 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:26:18pm

re: #328 Charles

There's nobody who will do anything about this -- I've tried in the past. When neo-Nazi Bill White was emailing me threats and trying to find my home address and my family's home addresses, I contacted the FBI -- and was basically told to forget it. They wouldn't even take a report.

And this psycho using the contact form is in Israel, which means it's even less likely that anyone will do anything about it.

Forget the FBI, contact the Shin Bet.

400 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:26:27pm

re: #377 Lincolntf

Are you a hunter, or is your "friend" to be used exclusively on humans?

Bad phrasing, Lincoln.

I doubt Charles hopes/wants/intends to "use it on humans".

But IIRC, it's a Mossberg 590 (same as mine), which, yes, is a combat shotgun.

401 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:26:44pm

re: #394 Alouette

I have a cell phone. All us Zionist honcos do. Heh.

Jewish men (should) have Tefillin. Kind of an ancient cell phone to G-d.

402 The Left  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:26:59pm

re: #372 Occasional Reader

Um... yeah, the problem is, war doesn't actually work that way. You can't cut resources for years, then suddenly have "the best resources" in theater and operative within a matter of weeks.

Your claim was that this was all about bashing Bush; that has been rebutted.

403 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:27:43pm

re: #394 Alouette

I have a cell phone. All us Zionist honcos do. Heh.

Will you please stop giving out the secrets of the Zionist Occupation of Remulak...

Just because you have had such a great recent Simcha - and Mazel Tov again BTW, does not mean you get to drop things like that!

NO bagel!

404 Lincolntf  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:27:53pm

re: #385 Guanxi88

Mine too. Don't try to sell it in a courtroom, though.
Thievery (even rape) are not good enough reason to use deadly force in most cases. It's a sad reality and it actually makes the "criminal class" possible. Not much anyone can do about it at this point.

405 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:27:59pm

re: #356 Charles

I have a friend named Mossberg who's quite good at such things.

I got a chance years ago to be in Santa Cruz at a recording session with Roger Buffalo at the the board for a visit... Late at night we were bullshitting with a couple guitarists there and I asked the boys what happens in venues with drunks and crazy..
I was told that most pro's ( in those days ) always had a handgun stashed in the back of their amps..

406 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:28:02pm

re: #356 Charles

I have a friend named Mossberg who's quite good at such things.

Excellent.
The 12 gauge pump-action with the pistol grip is a honey.
Just the sound of the action is enough to deal with anything on the other side of the door with half a brain.

407 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:28:03pm

re: #380 yochanan

should we send a copy of this find to the zero since he wants to make parts of Jerusalem judenfrei

JERUSALEM was the Jewish capital when Washington, d.c., Paris, & London were swamps.

When accused of being a Jew in a Parliamentary debate responded: “Yes, I am a Jew, and when the ancestors of the right honorable gentleman were brutal savages living in caves, my ancestors were Priests in the Temple of Solomon.”

---Benjamin Disraeli

408 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:28:16pm

re: #395 SixDegrees

Around my house, we have a joke:

"They interrupted a dinner party."

409 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:28:23pm

re: #388 Occasional Reader

Some experts (Mas Ayoob comes to mind) actually recommend the pistol as the first response to a home-invasion scenario. Easier to manipulate in tight spaces, harder for the bad guy to grab/deflect, and leaves a hand free to dial 911. Your mileage may vary, etc.

I've seen that but I train myself, wife and daughter on the pump. I'm a good shot but sleepy, in the dark or for the ladies I chose the higher odds on a hit. Additionally (and it may be over-stated) I enjoy the deterrent factor in the sound of a shell being loaded into a pump shotgun. Personally, if I heard that and I wasn't wearing body armor, I'd run.

410 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:28:32pm

re: #388 Occasional Reader

Some experts (Mas Ayoob comes to mind) actually recommend the pistol as the first response to a home-invasion scenario. Easier to manipulate in tight spaces, harder for the bad guy to grab/deflect, and leaves a hand free to dial 911. Your mileage may vary, etc.

I prefer the pistol, for those reasons. More training is required to reliably put lead on target. Pistol loads that won't penetrate wall etc... are available.

411 Coracle  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:28:34pm

re: #402 iceweasel

Your claim was that this was all about bashing Bush; that has been rebutted.

I'd put up Rep Giveusgills against Rep Bashbush any day of the week.

412 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:28:40pm

re: #386 jcm

well vermin can have two legs, four legs or no legs.

413 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:28:41pm

re: #396 Dianna

But if you have one, and an alarm system, and a cell phone, you should be all right

A dog is good, too. (Plus, they're so durn cute.)

414 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:28:42pm

re: #403 LudwigVanQuixote

Will you please stop giving out the secrets of the Zionist Occupation of Remulak...

Just because you have had such a great recent Simcha - and Mazel Tov again BTW, does not mean you get to drop things like that!

NO bagel!

Have to leave for my son's Sheva Brachos party.

415 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:29:14pm

re: #404 Lincolntf

Mine too. Don't try to sell it in a courtroom, though.
Thievery (even rape) are not good enough reason to use deadly force in most cases. It's a sad reality and it actually makes the "criminal class" possible. Not much anyone can do about it at this point.

Remember these words: "He wouldn't stop coming. I was scared, and he wouldn't stop coming. I warned him, but he just kept coming. I was scared, and he wouldn't stop coming."

416 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:29:17pm
417 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:29:31pm

re: #402 iceweasel

Your claim was that this was all about bashing Bush; that has been rebutted.

Yes, of course: Dennis Kucinich, friend of the soldier! I forgot.

418 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:29:59pm

re: #414 Alouette

Have to leave for my son's Sheva Brachos party.

OK have a bagel ;)

Seriously Mazel Tov!

419 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:30:04pm

re: #404 Lincolntf

Mine too. Don't try to sell it in a courtroom, though.
Thievery (even rape) are not good enough reason to use deadly force in most cases. It's a sad reality and it actually makes the "criminal class" possible. Not much anyone can do about it at this point.

I'm not going to ask when my home's invaded if all they want to do is rob me and rape me. Sorry.

The mind rather boggles at the thought.

420 Coracle  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:30:39pm

Time to bail. Must go to the library on the way home.

421 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:31:12pm
422 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:31:17pm

re: #395 SixDegrees

I just got done watching the latest of those Brinks Home Security commercials. Like every other one, we have mommy and daughter playing at home, burglar kicks in door which triggers the Brinks siren and callbacks while the girls freeze, look terrified, then run upstairs for no apparent reason. Burglar is deterred by the siren, happy endings all 'round.

Just once, instead of running away I'd like to see mom reach into the closet and level a shotgun at the perp. Just once. Yes, thank God for Brinks and all that, but in other home invasion situations - crazy ex-boyfriend, stalker, rapist and so on - that siren and phone check give the perp all kinds of time to do all kinds of unspeakable things, a lot of which the victim will never recover from. I hate the portrayal that being frightened and passive will make everything all right, as long as the Brinks checks clear.

Funny you mention that but I have a similar reaction. I've seriously been expecting a MadTV type spoof of those commercials where the bad guy pauses for the alarm then continues to go after the "mom" while bopping along to the alarm sound... or simply just keep on coming...

I'm not saying an alarm is a bad idea. I just hate that same "mom clutching the frightened kid saying it will all be ok because of brinks" ending. It's moronic.

423 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:31:25pm

re: #410 jcm

I prefer the pistol, for those reasons. More training is required to reliably put lead on target. Pistol loads that won't penetrate wall etc... are available.

Not much of a gun guy here, but I know you can get "snake shot" loads for pistols. Is there anything comparable with a little more heft to it?

424 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:31:27pm

re: #409 Locker

I've seen that but I train myself, wife and daughter on the pump. I'm a good shot but sleepy, in the dark or for the ladies I chose the higher odds on a hit. Additionally (and it may be over-stated) I enjoy the deterrent factor in the sound of a shell being loaded into a pump shotgun. Personally, if I heard that and I wasn't wearing body armor, I'd run.

Those are good counter-arguments, plus there's the small motor skills vs. gross motor skills under stress thing, in favor of the shotgun.

Arguments on both sides...

And then there's synthesis; you have the handgun to fight your way to the shotgun.

425 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:31:43pm

re: #413 Occasional Reader

A dog is good, too. (Plus, they're so durn cute.)

Dogs are wonderful. But I always fear my babies getting hurt.

426 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:31:46pm

re: #394 Alouette

cell phones are very popular in Israel because the post office runs the land line system
enough said.

427 cliffster  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:31:50pm

re: #395 SixDegrees

Level 1 Security - Brinks
Level 2 Security - Winchester

428 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:31:56pm

re: #419 Dianna

Police: "Dianna? Why'd you shoot him so many times?"
Dianna: "Ran out of ammo."

429 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:32:11pm

re: #400 Occasional Reader

Bad phrasing, Lincoln.

I doubt Charles hopes/wants/intends to "use it on humans".

But IIRC, it's a Mossberg 590 (same as mine), which, yes, is a combat shotgun.

Ditto, 590A1 it's intended use is prevent predators of the two legged variety from harming my family.

430 Leonidas Hoplite  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:32:41pm

re: #426 yochanan

cell phones are very popular in Israel because the post office runs the land line system
enough said.

Maybe you should start your own postal service instead of using ours...

431 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:33:04pm

re: #423 SixDegrees

Not much of a gun guy here, but I know you can get "snake shot" loads for pistols. Is there anything comparable with a little more heft to it?

Snake shot's lousy for anything but snakes at ranges of a few feet. Multi-round projectiles for pistols don't work. Taurus have a revolver in 45LC that can also fire 410 shells, but I'm not convinced it's anything more than a novelty.

432 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:33:15pm

Saw my first SNUGGIE commercial the other day. Now they have them in new exciting colors! Fall is in the air.

433 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:33:36pm

re: #423 SixDegrees

Not much of a gun guy here, but I know you can get "snake shot" loads for pistols. Is there anything comparable with a little more heft to it?

Hollow points with very hot loads. They simply break up.

There is a caveat, as always. It's better to shoot the perpetrator than miss. Always.

434 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:33:42pm

re: #395 SixDegrees

that siren and phone check give the perp all kinds of time to do all kinds of unspeakable things

Like the saying goes, "when seconds count, the police will be there in minutes."

Nothin' but respect for the police, but of course, it's true.

435 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:34:47pm

re: #428 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Police: "Dianna? Why'd you shoot him so many times?"
Dianna: "Ran out of ammoHe interrupted my dinner party."

436 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:35:06pm

re: #423 SixDegrees

Not much of a gun guy here, but I know you can get "snake shot" loads for pistols. Is there anything comparable with a little more heft to it?

Glaser Safe-T-Slugs, and there are simliar loads made by Hornady, Federal and others. Hair-raising stopping power, but will not overpenetrate.

437 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:35:17pm

re: #428 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Police: "Dianna? Why'd you shoot him so many times?"
Dianna: "Ran out of ammo."

Reminds me of Bord of the Rings
He would have finished Goddam off then and there, but pity stayed his hand.
"It's a pity I've run out of bullets", thought Dildo.

438 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:35:29pm

re: #431 Guanxi88

Snake shot's lousy for anything but snakes at ranges of a few feet. Multi-round projectiles for pistols don't work. Taurus have a revolver in 45LC that can also fire 410 shells, but I'm not convinced it's anything more than a novelty.

Well, scotch that idea, then.

Probably not worth it anyway. As I understand it, the spread of a shotgun round at home invasion distances isn't significantly larger than a good-size pistol round anyway. It's not like you can just point the thing in the general direction and pull the trigger. Might as well just stick with a pistol and traditional rounds designed not to penetrate walls, and invest in a few lessons.

439 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:35:31pm

Israel: 7
Luxembourg: 0

440 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:35:44pm

re: #424 Occasional Reader

Those are good counter-arguments, plus there's the small motor skills vs. gross motor skills under stress thing, in favor of the shotgun.

Arguments on both sides...

And then there's synthesis; you have the handgun to fight your way to the shotgun.

That one made me laugh and caused my boss to look at me funny. Also true. Bust open the piano key pistol case, make my way to master bedroom closet, shotty is mounted inside on the door. Booya! Hehe thanks man, nice one.

441 researchok  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:35:50pm

Spenser may have serious academic bona fides, but like many academics, he has lousy judgment.

Instead of admitting he was in err, he is compounding his mistakes by denying any responsible culpability. Unfortunately, that has become a pattern.

What a waste.

442 cronus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:35:54pm

OT: Well known pseudo-medicine advocate Tom Harkin (D-IA) will be taking over the Senate HELP Committee.

443 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:36:12pm

re: #423 SixDegrees

Not much of a gun guy here, but I know you can get "snake shot" loads for pistols. Is there anything comparable with a little more heft to it?

Taurus, .410 shotgun loads and .45 Colt rounds

444 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:36:26pm

Pow-R-Ball... that's the other name I was thinking of. Made by Glaser, too? Or Federal, not sure.

Federal also makes HST, good stuff for personal defense.

445 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:36:33pm

re: #439 Ben Hur

Israel: 7
Luxembourg: 0

World Cup Qualifier.

446 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:36:53pm

And England is in.

447 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:36:54pm

re: #438 SixDegrees

Well, scotch that idea, then.

Probably not worth it anyway. As I understand it, the spread of a shotgun round at home invasion distances isn't significantly larger than a good-size pistol round anyway. It's not like you can just point the thing in the general direction and pull the trigger. Might as well just stick with a pistol and traditional rounds designed not to penetrate walls, and invest in a few lessons.

A pistol for your bedroom,
A shotgun for your door,
A rifle for reaching out,
No man needs more.

448 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:37:23pm

re: #438 SixDegrees

Snakeload's a good first round. You probably won't kill the guy, but you will slow him down, startle him, and make it more likely that he'll run, or that you can back up to keep him outside your decision range.

449 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:37:43pm

re: #365 iceweasel

Not to mention that it would be perfectly consistent to have, in the past, wanted lower defence spending, and then when we are in a war, want the troops to have the best body armour and other resources available.

So its like a having a leaky roof that you forget about every time the sun is shining and think about every time it rains.

450 Lincolntf  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:37:44pm

re: #419 Dianna

And the Libs know that. That's why they don't want you to have the opportunity to defend yourself to begin with. If you have the gun. you WILL defend yourself. This line of conversation blows the "guns=evil" paradigm out the window, so it is forbidden among the Libs.

451 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:37:59pm
The boss hears from two sources that Hillary Clinton is considering stepping down as Secretary of State this fall in order to run for Governor of New York.

[Link: www.weeklystandard.com...]

452 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:37:59pm

re: #421 buzzsawmonkey

Ancient Jewish coins used the old alphabet, usually referred to as "paleo-Hebrew,"

AHA! So you ADMIT that it was STOLEN from the Paleostinians!

453 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:38:17pm

re: #417 Occasional Reader

Yes, of course: Dennis Kucinich, friend of the soldier! I forgot.

Personally I love Dennis and I've always thought that someone who tried to keep soldiers out of "questionable" wars was being a friend to them. I'm aware that some folks don't consider this to be soldier friendly but I can tell you as a soldier all I wanted was to come home alive and not be there in the first place.

454 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:38:23pm

re: #448 Dianna

Snakeload's a good first round. You probably won't kill the guy, but you will slow him down, startle him, and make it more likely that he'll run, or that you can back up to keep him outside your decision range.

I've heard that suggestion, but favor maximum effect from every round (I'm a revolver fan). No warning, no wounding; if it comes to weapons, it's already past the point.

455 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:38:24pm

re: #441 researchok

Spenser may have serious academic bona fides, but like many academics, he has lousy judgment.

Instead of admitting he was in err, he is compounding his mistakes by denying any responsible culpability. Unfortunately, that has become a pattern.

What a waste.

Note: Spencer has NO "academic bona fides." His so-called Islam studies are all private work. He hasn't published a single academic paper or taught a single academic course.

456 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:38:35pm

Re home defense: any low-to-medium-power carbine fans here? My piece of choice is an Auto-Ordnance/Kahr M-1 clone.

457 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:38:55pm

re: #432 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Saw my first SNUGGIE commercial the other day. Now they have them in new exciting colors! Fall is in the air.

I don't get why they don't do Team Colors.. Could sell millions more..
The Ad shows people at a football game in snuggies...How insane is that?
Try going to a Raiders game in a snuggie without Team Colors..You'll get your ass kicked...
Team Colors Snuggies!
/What the heck is the matter with people? Just wear a frigging sweater...

458 Guanxi88  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:39:29pm

re: #456 mikalm

Re home defense: any low-to-medium-power carbine fans here? My piece of choice is an Auto-Ordnance/Kahr M-1 clone.

Good taste. A nice round, a reliable platform, and what's not to love about walnut stocks?

459 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:39:30pm

re: #450 Lincolntf

And the Libs know that. That's why they don't want you to have the opportunity to defend yourself to begin with. If you have the gun. you WILL defend yourself. This line of conversation blows the "guns=evil" paradigm out the window, so it is forbidden among the Libs.

Martial arts help. And most of us are surrounded by impromptu weapons, particularly in the kitchen. Which is why the joke.

460 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:39:43pm

re: #309 taxfreekiller

Just came in from changing oil in two John Deers,
24 dam qts at $2.00 each,, crap.

Any how, as I came in I noticed this big old empty spot where the TV
usually sits..., I turn to ms tfk,,, "what the hell happened to the TV"

she smiles, "I was afraid you would watch Obama tonight so its in hiding"".

BAWAHAHAHAHA! LOL!

Leave it to TFK to lighten up a rather serious thread. I was doing my best to stifle a very good laugh here at work after reading that. :-)

461 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:39:43pm

re: #455 Charles

He's a blogger who wrote a few books. Not a scholar by any stretch of the imagination.

462 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:40:09pm

re: #428 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

three different familys are at home during a home invasion all three have a loaded fire arm

democrat family think of the poor person he must be hungry lets feed him as he is raping the woman and then kills the husband

GOP family fires the round and drops the home invader then calls the cops.

NRA family, BAM BAM BAM BAM BAM BAM sounds of re loading BAM BAM BAM BAM BAM BAM

son say dad nice grouping
mom says no you can't take that to the taxidermy.

463 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:40:17pm

re: #445 Ben Hur

World Cup Qualifier.

LOVE the World Cup. Absolutely adore it. Can't wait, can't wait! Even the Olympics don't give me the same feeling. To see so many folks supporting their countries in a constructive way is always warming. WORLD CUP BABY!

464 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:40:26pm
465 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:40:30pm

re: #457 HoosierHoops

Try going to a Raiders game in a snuggie without Team Colors..You'll get your ass kicked...

I wouldn't recommend going to a Raiders game with a snuggie even if it was silver and black.

466 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:40:49pm

re: #407 Ben Hur

When accused of being a Jew in a Parliamentary debate responded: “Yes, I am a Jew, and when the ancestors of the right honorable gentleman were brutal savages living in caves, my ancestors were Priests in the Temple of Solomon.”

---Benjamin Disraeli

That reminds me of a certain person I knew in college who was always going on about how they were descended for King Henry II through a liaison.

This person was old school southern, very wealthy (oil money) and very, very convinced of his superiority. Once in a debate, about the powers of the president and the need for checks and balances, he asked me how it was possible that I could say anything about what important people do - given my ahem... heritage.

I said...

1. In America, we gave those descended of the house of Plantagenate quite the lesson in the rights of "important" people.

2. As to lineage, well, I think King David trumps King Henry by a lot - ohhh, and no liaison.

467 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:40:54pm

re: #455 Charles

Note: Spencer has NO "academic bona fides." His so-called Islam studies are all private work. He hasn't published a single academic paper or taught a single academic course.

Thanks for noting that. I should do a better job of vetting people. I'm really sorry I bought a book he wrote. And new, no less.

468 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:41:03pm

Possibly the greatest scientific achievement of our time...

Mice Levitated in Lab

Scientists working on behalf of NASA built a device to simulate variable levels of gravity. It consists of a superconducting magnet that generates a field powerful enough to levitate the water inside living animals, with a space inside warm enough at room temperature and large enough at 2.6 inches wide (6.6 cm) for tiny creatures to float comfortably in during experiments.

Disoriented

The researchers first levitated a young mouse, just three-week-old and weighing 10 grams. It appeared agitated and disoriented, seemingly trying to hold on to something.

"It actually kicked around and started to spin, and without friction, it could spin faster and faster, and we think that made it even more disoriented," said researcher Yuanming Liu, a physicist at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, Calif. They decided to mildly sedate the next mouse they levitated, which seemed content with floating.

469 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:41:08pm

re: #455 Charles

Note: Spencer has NO "academic bona fides." His so-called Islam studies are all private work. He hasn't published a single academic paper or taught a single academic course.

That I did not know.

470 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:41:15pm

re: #462 yochanan

I always heard the third family referred to as "Southerners"...

471 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:41:23pm

re: #454 Guanxi88

I've heard that suggestion, but favor maximum effect from every round (I'm a revolver fan). No warning, no wounding; if it comes to weapons, it's already past the point.

I can't disagree. It's a matter of how you think. I'd prefer not to have to carry the burden of another's death if I can possibly avoid it.

This does not mean that I'm going to let someone hurt me, it means I'm going to do as little harm as I have to.

472 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:41:33pm

re: #465 Mich-again

I was thinking the same thing.

473 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:41:56pm

re: #463 Locker

LOVE the World Cup. Absolutely adore it. Can't wait, can't wait! Even the Olympics don't give me the same feeling. To see so many folks supporting their countries in a constructive way is always warming. WORLD CUP BABY!

You forgot your tag.

474 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:42:01pm

re: #456 mikalm

Re home defense: any low-to-medium-power carbine fans here? My piece of choice is an Auto-Ordnance/Kahr M-1 clone.

Closest I get is my Mini 14 and I'm a big fan.

475 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:42:03pm

re: #438 SixDegrees

As I understand it, the spread of a shotgun round at home invasion distances isn't significantly larger than a good-size pistol round anyway. It's not like you can just point the thing in the general direction and pull the trigger.

True, but as I mentioned above, the shotgun does have the advantage of favoring gross motor skills, which don't dry up under stress like fine motor skills do. Plus, any shoulder weapon will tend to be more accurate (practically) than a handgun.

Me, I go with the Mas Ayoob idea; my first pick for a "bump in the night" check will be the handgun, but I also know where the Mossberg is, if things get bad.

(And I'm sort of a nag on this point, but: In my humble opinion, every firearm intended for home defense should have a tactical light mounted on it. Period. Illuminate and move. Do not take the chance of shooting your neighbor's drunken teenage kid... or your own.)

476 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:42:21pm

re: #438 SixDegrees

Well, scotch that idea, then.

Probably not worth it anyway. As I understand it, the spread of a shotgun round at home invasion distances isn't significantly larger than a good-size pistol round anyway. It's not like you can just point the thing in the general direction and pull the trigger. Might as well just stick with a pistol and traditional rounds designed not to penetrate walls, and invest in a few lessons.

Another recommended, by me at least, is a hi-intensity flashlight like a Surefire. At night in a home invasion, hitting an intruder in the eyes with a hi-intensity light beam will rock them back on their heels. That will give you a couple more seconds to your decision loop.

It's another reason I like a pistol, I can have a hi-intensity light in one hand and the gun in the other, give me more options than a light fixed on the gun.

477 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:42:27pm

I hate unprincipled fence sitters.

478 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:42:48pm

re: #469 Ben Hur

Not only does he lack any academic credentials I don't think he's ever been to a Muslim country and I'm pretty sure he doesn't even speak Arabic. He knows next to nothing about the culture.

479 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:43:03pm

re: #456 mikalm

I've been thinking about getting a .45 carbine. But the more I think about it, the more I think I'm going shotgun.

480 astronmr20  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:43:35pm

So is anyone going to watch the congressional address tonight?

481 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:43:50pm

re: #463 Locker

To see so many folks supporting their countries in a constructive way is always warming.

Yeah till they lose and start scrapping.

482 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:44:14pm

re: #468 Killgore Trout

Possibly the greatest scientific achievement of our time...

Mice Levitated in Lab

PETA protest in 3... 2... 1...

483 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:44:21pm

re: #478 Killgore Trout

Not only does he lack any academic credentials I don't think he's ever been to a Muslim country and I'm pretty sure he doesn't even speak Arabic. He knows next to nothing about the culture.

He must speak Arabic.

484 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:44:23pm

re: #480 astronmr20

So is anyone going to watch the congressional address tonight?

Shirley you jest.

485 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:44:25pm

re: #468 Killgore Trout

The problem is, you know they couldn't help laughing, even while trying to stop the mouse's spin.

486 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:44:30pm

re: #474 Locker

Closest I get is my Mini 14 and I'm a big fan.

Used to own one myself. Nice gun. The 5.56 is a bit too powerful for use around the homestead, though. .

487 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:44:30pm

re: #473 Ben Hur

You forgot your tag.

Tag? Sorry if I'm being thick, I'm just drawn that way.

488 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:44:38pm

re: #468 Killgore Trout

Possibly the greatest scientific achievement of our time...

Mice Levitated in Lab

Old news. They did exactly the same thing with frogs years ago.

There's some speculation that it isn't the spinning that disorients the creatures (same thing happened with froggy) but the intense magnetic field, which is about an order of magnitude larger than that found in the most powerful MRI machines. That, coupled with small movements, may be inducing currents in the critter's brains.

I suppose some day a researcher will stick his head in one and find out.

489 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:45:05pm

re: #456 mikalm

Re home defense: any low-to-medium-power carbine fans here? My piece of choice is an Auto-Ordnance/Kahr M-1 clone.

I dunno... risk of overpenetration. In the city, in a multiple-dwelling building... no way.

490 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:45:12pm

re: #488 SixDegrees

Old news. They did exactly the same thing with frogs years ago.

There's some speculation that it isn't the spinning that disorients the creatures (same thing happened with froggy) but the intense magnetic field, which is about an order of magnitude larger than that found in the most powerful MRI machines. That, coupled with small movements, may be inducing currents in the critter's brains.

I suppose some day a researcher will stick his head in one and find out.

I'm game.

491 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:45:37pm

re: #476 jcm

I think we just Vulcan mind-melded or something!

492 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:45:47pm
493 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:45:48pm

re: #489 Occasional Reader

I dunno... risk of overpenetration. In the city, in a multiple-dwelling building... no way.

That's why they have "life savers."

HAHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAH!

eh...eh...sorry.

494 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:45:53pm

re: #473 Ben Hur

Friend of mine was at a lunch with his boss and an interviewee. His boss is an ardent soccer fan, the interviewee had known and took the time to learn a little about soccer; even watched the previous nights game.

The interviewee excitedly asked, "Did you see that match between (whatever teams) last night?!
My friend jumped in and said, "One to nothing?"
The guy says, "Yeah! What a great game."
My friend said, "Oh, I was just guessing. Isn't that the final score of every soccer game?"

The interviewee still got the job, but it was funny.

495 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:46:05pm

re: #480 astronmr20

So is anyone going to watch the congressional address tonight?

No. I have better things to do than waste an hour or more of my life on it. I'll be at a small BBQ instead.

496 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:46:09pm

re: #477 Sharmuta

I hate unprincipled fence sitters.

"I hate those damn Neutrals; you never know where they stand!"

Zapf Brannigan

497 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:46:24pm

re: #477 Sharmuta

I can't decide how I feel about them.

498 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:46:26pm

re: #479 Dianna

I've been thinking about getting a .45 carbine. But the more I think about it, the more I think I'm going shotgun.

I had a Mossberg 500 and a Mini-14 during the 1992 L.A. riots. Thank G-d I didn't have to brandish -- much less use -- either one, but I like having a piece of heavier artillery to go with el pistola for such situations.

499 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:46:54pm

re: #484 Mich-again

Shirley you jest.

I don't jest, and don't call me Shirley.

500 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:46:57pm

re: #477 Sharmuta

I hate unprincipled fence sitters.

OKAY OKAY

I'm recommending the handgun as first response. Sheesh!

/

501 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:47:12pm

currently working on a wood cut with the reverse of the 20$ bill with the caption
Jerusalem was the jewish capital when D.C., PARIS, & LONDON were swamps.

502 freetoken  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:47:15pm

re: #468 Killgore Trout

Possibly the greatest scientific achievement of our time...

Yes, always sedate your mice before you levitate them!

503 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:47:46pm

re: #465 Mich-again

I wouldn't recommend going to a Raiders game with a snuggie even if it was silver and black.

I grew up a Raiders fan...No..I think wearing a snuggie over to 66th street would not be smart...Raider fans are somewhat crazy...But really..I've always felt safe there..It's mostly just great fun...The only bad fights I ever saw was a preseason game with the 49er's...It turned ugly...Bummer was we scored some killer seats and ended up soaked in beer and dodging fans fighting all around.
A Sham-Wow would have been nice

504 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:48:11pm

re: #493 Ben Hur

That's why they have "life savers."

HAHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAH!

eh...eh...sorry.

Anyone?

505 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:48:17pm

re: #489 Occasional Reader

I dunno... risk of overpenetration. In the city, in a multiple-dwelling building... no way.

Maybe with FMJs. From what I've seen, lead ball ammo has about the same stopping power and penetration as a .357 Magnum.

506 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:48:23pm

re: #483 Ben Hur

He must speak Arabic.

I'm pretty sure he doesn't. He posted a video of a wedding in Gaza last month which he claimed showed old men marrying child brides. Somebody translated the audio to prove the little girls were relatives of the brides, not the brides themselves. If he spoke Arabic he would have known that.
I think he's since deleted that post.

507 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:49:09pm

re: #491 Occasional Reader

I think we just Vulcan mind-melded or something!

LOL!

A good light is a necessity.

508 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:49:11pm

re: #477 Sharmuta

I hate unprincipled fence sitters.

Okay, let me say this (appropriate caveats - I am not a Spencer fan, etc):

I recently met an extremely sweet person at a party I went to who told me he reads Jihad Watch daily. He is clearly anti-fascist, but he reads the site because he feels it is unparalleled in providing information about Jihad.

Does this person thus become a fascist because he likes Spencer's works/sites? I believe the answer is of course not.

Plenty of mainstream and respected people are friendly with Robert Spencer, and work with him. That does not make them fascist enablers or apologists.

Spencer has his own issues - including his turning a blind eye towards those he works with, and not caring who his friends and allies are. In addition, I have concerns about his overall approach.

But we are frankly being absurd if we believe that merely linking to Spencer's blog renders someone a fascist or fascist enabler.

509 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:49:50pm

re: #492 buzzsawmonkey

But are you the most dangerous game?

Naked Twister with Rosie O'Donnell?

510 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:50:44pm

re: #468 Killgore Trout

Possibly the greatest scientific achievement of our time...

They could have levitated the rat with a leaf blower a whole lot cheaper than that what it costs to run that gizmo.

Besides the greatest invention was the thermos. How does it know?

511 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:50:45pm

re: #504 Ben Hur

Anyone?

Sorry, I didn't get it.

512 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:51:01pm

re: #509 Occasional Reader

i am glad i finished eating ewwwh.

it could almost turn me gay esp if it was the only female on earth.

513 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:51:24pm

re: #508 Daria Emmons

Links by their very nature are for reference purposes. I've never assumed that anyone with links on their Web page would necessarily agree with everything the linked sites promulgated.

514 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:51:36pm

re: #506 Killgore Trout

I'm pretty sure he doesn't. He posted a video of a wedding in Gaza last month which he claimed showed old men marrying child brides. Somebody translated the audio to prove the little girls were relatives of the brides, not the brides themselves. If he spoke Arabic he would have known that.
I think he's since deleted that post.

I find that hard to believe.

It would be so...strange.

It reminds me of when I saw Bernard Lewis being interviewed on MSNBC after 9/11.

He was mentioning different translations of the Koran.

The interviewer asked him which one he used.

He looked at her with a quizzical type of look.

515 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:51:37pm
516 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:51:39pm

re: #506 Killgore Trout

I'm pretty sure he doesn't. He posted a video of a wedding in Gaza last month which he claimed showed old men marrying child brides. Somebody translated the audio to prove the little girls were relatives of the brides, not the brides themselves. If he spoke Arabic he would have known that.
I think he's since deleted that post.

He also could have been lying thinking no one would notice. It wouldn't be the first time he bent the truth to serve an agenda.

517 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:51:41pm

re: #509 Occasional Reader

Naked Twister with Rosie O'Donnell?

That sounds like an evil form of execution like "bobbing for french fries" or perhaps the "Craftmatic adjustable bed of nails"...

518 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:52:01pm

re: #504 Ben Hur

Sorry, brother. Gotta leave you hanging on that one.

519 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:52:09pm

re: #509 Occasional Reader

Naked Twister with Rosie O'Donnell?

Instead of waterboarding in Gitmo we should have just used this: Naked Twister with Rosie...
/What am I saying? That's inhuman!

520 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:52:12pm

re: #508 Daria Emmons

But we are frankly being absurd if we believe that merely linking to Spencer's blog renders someone a fascist or fascist enabler.

And who ever said that? This tactic is known as a "straw man."

521 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:52:42pm

re: #498 mikalm

I had a Mossberg 500 and a Mini-14 during the 1992 L.A. riots. Thank G-d I didn't have to brandish -- much less use -- either one, but I like having a piece of heavier artillery to go with el pistola for such situations.

Hmm for some reason your mention of LA and Mini-14 made me think of the North Hollywood Shootout. I thought one of those guys had a Mini-14 modded to full auto but now I think that was just in the made for TV movie.

522 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:52:58pm

re: #511 Occasional Reader

Sorry, I didn't get it.

Over-penetration?

Life saver?

Forget it. :(

I'm off to the Caribbean.

Really.

523 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:53:29pm

re: #522 Ben Hur

Over-penetration?

Life saver?

Forget it. :(

I'm off to the Caribbean.

Really.

Get tan and have fun!

524 opnion  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:53:50pm

re: #503 HoosierHoops

I grew up a Raiders fan...No..I think wearing a snuggie over to 66th street would not be smart...Raider fans are somewhat crazy...But really..I've always felt safe there..It's mostly just great fun...The only bad fights I ever saw was a preseason game with the 49er's...It turned ugly...Bummer was we scored some killer seats and ended up soaked in beer and dodging fans fighting all around.
A Sham-Wow would have been nice

ShamWow? "Hey dere made in Germany & youse know da Germans make good stuff. Hey, I can't be doin dis all day." Vince

525 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:53:57pm

re: #520 Charles

And who ever said that? This tactic is known as a "straw man."

I read comment after comment decrying Brian because he links to Jihad Watch and is "not taking a stand" in your argument.

Meanwhile, all Brian is guilty of is linking to Jihad Watch on his blog and making one rather stupid comment in this thread.

I just don't get it.

526 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:54:00pm

re: #521 Locker

He might have had one. They have a rep as not being terribly accurate, though.

527 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:54:06pm

re: #516 ArchangelMichael

maybe he learned how to do that from HRW, or the arabs?

528 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:54:06pm

re: #523 LudwigVanQuixote

Get tan and have fun!

Thanks!

529 MandyManners  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:54:11pm
530 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:54:16pm

re: #522 Ben Hur

Over-penetration?

Life saver?

Forget it. :(

I'm off to the Caribbean.

Really.

The ladies get it.

531 Three Hundred  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:54:28pm

"2:15 PM ET: OBAMA TELEPROMPTER ARRIVES ON HILL... "
-Drudge

532 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:54:46pm

re: #524 opnion

ShamWow? "Hey dere made in Germany & youse know da Germans make good stuff. Hey, I can't be doin dis all day." Vince

Vince who got caught after he tried to French kiss a prostitute and she bit his tongue.
A prostitute? I guess he prefers sham wow to the real thing.

533 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:55:09pm

I'm getting really weary of the teleprompter jokes.

All politicians use teleprompters. This is a really stupid way to smear Obama.

534 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:55:32pm

re: #527 yochanan

maybe he learned how to do that from HRW, or the arabs?

You read about the HRW collector?

535 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:55:44pm

re: #522 Ben Hur

Over-penetration?

Life saver?

Forget it. :(

I'm off to the Caribbean.

Really.

Where to?

536 Desert Dog  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:55:56pm

re: #524 opnion

ShamWow? "Hey dere made in Germany & youse know da Germans make good stuff. Hey, I can't be doin dis all day." Vince

I hear they are good for sopping up blood after a prostitute bites your lip too

537 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:55:59pm

re: #532 Kosh's Shadow

My dad once told me, "Son, if you must pay for sex, never kiss a whore. Do you know where her mouth has been?" Fortunately, I've done neither since then.

538 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:56:02pm

re: #516 ArchangelMichael

He also could have been lying thinking no one would notice. It wouldn't be the first time he bent the truth to serve an agenda.

Possibly but remember he only started learning about Islam a few years ago. He's self taught. He might know a few words but I serously doubt he speaks anything close to fluent Arabic.

539 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:56:07pm

re: #535 Occasional Reader

Where to?

PR

540 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:56:16pm

re: #536 Desert Dog

(groan!)

541 opnion  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:56:21pm

re: #512 yochanan

i am glad i finished eating ewwwh.

it could almost turn me gay esp if it was the only female on earth.

Remember when the Michigan Avenue Bridge was stuck in an upright
position? It was a huge naked picture of Rosie that got it to go down.

542 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:56:36pm

re: #529 MandyManners

Rosie!

Hey!

We have medical privacy laws, you know.

Now who swiped that photo from her sex change specialist surgeon's office?

543 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:57:06pm

re: #521 Locker

I thought one of those guys had a Mini-14 modded to full auto

Not sure... and didn't one (or both?) have an AK?

544 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:57:26pm

re: #536 Desert Dog

I hear they are good for sopping up blood after a prostitute gives you a bris too

FTFY

545 callahan23  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:57:30pm

re: #522 Ben Hur

... I'm off to the Caribbean.

Really.

Wow, enjoy yourself. I so envy you.
Haven't had a vacation in ages and will not be able to do a big one in the foreseeable future.
Get there and back safely.

Hi Lizardia !

546 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:57:44pm

re: #503 HoosierHoops

Bummer was we scored some killer seats and ended up soaked in beer and dodging fans fighting all around.
A Sham-Wow would have been nice

Except the Sham-Wow has about the same absorbency as felt. But there is nothing quite like a stadium brawl. Seen a lot of them, some real close at the Silverdome during Lions' games. 3rd quarter was almost a lock for a multi-row brawl somewhere. That place was nuts. Too many drunkass Oakland County rednecks. I know they weren't Downriver rednecks because we never throw beer.

547 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:58:13pm

re: #545 callahan23

Wow, enjoy yourself. I so envy you.
Haven't had a vacation in ages and will not be able to do a big one in the foreseeable future.
Get there and back safely.

Hi Lizardia !

Thanks.

It's been a while.

THe kid is coming, so I'll come back more tired than I am now.

548 Honorary Yooper  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:58:18pm

re: #533 Charles

I'm getting really weary of the teleprompter jokes.

All politicians use teleprompters. This is a really stupid way to smear Obama.

Yes they do, but few do to the extent President Obama has, and even President Obama and VP Biden have had some fun with it. However, it was funny a few months ago, and has lost some of its humor as time has gone on.

549 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:58:25pm

re: #539 Ben Hur

PR

You lovely island!
Always the hurricanes blowing

I like the island Manhattan!
Smoke on your pipe, and... put that in.

550 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:58:30pm
551 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:59:37pm

re: #547 Ben Hur

Thanks.

It's been a while.

THe kid is coming, so I'll come back more tired than I am now.

Hey, ask around about going kayaking to see the lagoon with the phosphorescent algae. I don't remember the name of the place; about 90 minutes outside of San Juan, IIRC. Totally worth the trip. (At night, of course.)

552 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:59:38pm

re: #549 Occasional Reader

You lovely island!
Always the hurricanes blowing

I like the island Manhattan!
Smoke on your pipe, and... put that in.

Voluntary detox.

21 days makes a habit.

This is day 2.

I'm naturally an ass when I detox.

553 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 2:59:46pm

re: #546 Mich-again

Except the Sham-Wow has about the same absorbency as felt. But there is nothing quite like a stadium brawl. Seen a lot of them, some real close at the Silverdome during Lions' games. 3rd quarter was almost a lock for a multi-row brawl somewhere. That place was nuts. Too many drunkass Oakland County rednecks. I know they weren't Downriver rednecks because we never throw beer.

USED BEER CANS filled with warm yellow water?

554 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:00:07pm

re: #551 Occasional Reader

Hey, ask around about going kayaking to see the lagoon with the phosphorescent algae. I don't remember the name of the place; about 90 minutes outside of San Juan, IIRC. Totally worth the trip. (At night, of course.)

I will!

555 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:00:09pm

re: #359 LudwigVanQuixote

Cool!

I have a first revolt prutah. No first or second revolt silver, very expensive.

556 Lincolntf  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:01:06pm

re: #531 Three Hundred

Did Mr. Prompter say "I'm in charge here."?
Wee-Wee is fucked tonight.
If he tells the truth ( that he wants to own 1/7th of the largest economy in world history) then he's screwed.
If he lies or soft soaps, it'll be the umpteenth time we've seen it and nobody will believe a word he says.

Buh-bye, Barry,... try not to take too many lives with you.

557 The Left  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:01:09pm

re: #449 Mich-again

So its like a having a leaky roof that you forget about every time the sun is shining and think about every time it rains.

No, it's about different spending priorities. Democrats typically think too much goes to defence and too little to education, and the Republicans the other way around.

The original claim was that Democrats didn't support the troops and only wanted better body armour to bash Bush, and that's been rebutted.
Also, I find it very odd that Republicans wouldn't support better body armour themselves.
Not everything has to be a partisan game, and increasing spending in a time of war is about supporting the troops. Even when it's a Democrat calling for it.

558 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:01:23pm

what do lizards think of this for text under a wood cut of the white house (back side of a S20)

occupied indian land

559 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:02:06pm

re: #525 Daria Emmons

Daria Daria Daria.. That is all you gleaned from 2 hours of links? I'm surprised..
Daria..I'm going to make this simple for you...Without snark..
It's all about Principles.. It's who are as a person..Where you draw the line...
Who your friends are...What you believe in...Your very soul..
I hhave learned this much over the last 2 years on Blogs...
Links matter...Big time..
Be well

560 Ben Hur  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:02:11pm

Later.

561 Aye Pod  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:02:20pm

re: #525 Daria Emmons

I just don't get it.

You can say that again.

562 Boris Badenov  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:02:32pm

Greetings Little Green Footballniks! It is I, Boris Badenov, nemesis of Moose and Squirrel, originator of fiendish plans, at your service!


Robert Spencer and the Extremists? I remember them well! I saw them at CBGB's when I was KGB station chief in NYC back in the '80's!

563 flyers1974  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:03:33pm

re: #398 Leonidas Hoplite

Thomas Friedman has escaped the asylum

Reasonably enlightened? Is he serious?
I'm glad he's just an idiot writer and not in charge of anything.

Sorry for the late response to your Thomas Friedman link. I believe he means China's leaders are "reasonably enlightened" in regard to certain issues, not that the Chinese system itself is enlightened. Which is a reasonable statement. And his condemnation of "one-party democracy" seems like it would be appreciated by many here. Based upon Friedman's past columns, its pretty clear he is not a fan of dictatorships.

564 Desert Dog  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:04:02pm

re: #557 iceweasel

No, it's about different spending priorities. Democrats typically think too much goes to defence and too little to education, and the Republicans the other way around.

The original claim was that Democrats didn't support the troops and only wanted better body armour to bash Bush, and that's been rebutted.
Also, I find it very odd that Republicans wouldn't support better body armour themselves.
Not everything has to be a partisan game, and increasing spending in a time of war is about supporting the troops. Even when it's a Democrat calling for it.

Rebutted by you...I still think the Dems used every opportunity to bash Bush through out that war. Sometimes, their hatred of Bush even harmed the troops. Harping, criticizing, proclaiming defeat, General BetrayUS, Abu Ghraib...was that all an illusion? It didn't happen?

565 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:04:17pm

re: #562 Boris Badenov

Greetings Little Green Footballniks! It is I, Boris Badenov, nemesis of Moose and Squirrel, originator of fiendish plans, at your service!

Robert Spencer and the Extremists? I remember them well! I saw them at CBGB's when I was KGB station chief in NYC back in the '80's!

Did you trade an autographed picture of them for one of Fearless Leader? I hear Spencer still cherishes it.

566 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:04:45pm

re: #562 Boris Badenov

Greetings Little Green Footballniks! It is I, Boris Badenov, nemesis of Moose and Squirrel, originator of fiendish plans, at your service!


Robert Spencer and the Extremists? I remember them well! I saw them at CBGB's when I was KGB station chief in NYC back in the '80's!

Ding for a CBGB's reference.

567 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:04:55pm

re: #525 Daria Emmons

I read comment after comment decrying Brian because he links to Jihad Watch and is "not taking a stand" in your argument.

Meanwhile, all Brian is guilty of is linking to Jihad Watch on his blog and making one rather stupid comment in this thread.

I just don't get it.

Upding, 'cause I'm still puzzled too, by what SEEMS to be an overreaction to a rather minor offense by Brian.

568 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:05:23pm

OT--

Sorry for the nagging (but I'm a mom, that's my job) but September is...Emergency Preparedness Month. (I know that has you all jumping out of your seats in excitement.)

Today's topic is: power outages.

What is your 30 second plan if the power goes out? Seriously, can you find your way to a secondary light source in the dark? Can you tell me where a flashlight is right now?

What is your 30 minute plan? 3 hour plan? 3 day plan?

Odds are really, really good that at least one lizard will experience a power outage this winter. The time be sure that you have back-up sources of light, heat, and heat to cook with are now (before an emergency drains supplies or makes the price go up.)

Okay, go back to your regularly scheduled snarking now.

569 Boris Badenov  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:06:54pm

re: #533 Charles

I'm getting really weary of the teleprompter jokes.

All politicians use teleprompters. This is a really stupid way to smear Obama.

Obama is joke. Teleprompter is just prop.

570 opnion  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:07:19pm

re: #556 Lincolntf

Did Mr. Prompter say "I'm in charge here."?
Wee-Wee is fucked tonight.
If he tells the truth ( that he wants to own 1/7th of the largest economy in world history) then he's screwed.
If he lies or soft soaps, it'll be the umpteenth time we've seen it and nobody will believe a word he says.

Buh-bye, Barry,... try not to take too many lives with you.

Barry is on tape several years ago saying that he favors a Single Payer
System. Dem Congressmen Franks & Shnkowski say that tyhe Public Option is a segue to single payer.
Obama got too cute by half & he will now be damaged if doesn't get a substantial bill. Pride goeth before the fall ,as they say.

571 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:07:22pm

re: #559 HoosierHoops

Daria Daria Daria.. That is all you gleaned from 2 hours of links? I'm surprised..
Daria..I'm going to make this simple for you...Without snark..
It's all about Principles.. It's who are as a person..Where you draw the line...
Who your friends are...What you believe in...Your very soul..
I hhave learned this much over the last 2 years on Blogs...
Links matter...Big time..
Be well

I would agree if Brian linked to Stormfront or National Vanguard, or even an open Vlaams Belang blog, such as Brussels Journal.

But linking to both LGF and Jihad Watch? This makes him a fascist enabler? On what planet? Robert Spencer is not the same as Stormfront, et al. He is simply not an open Nazi, and I don't think he even is a Nazi at all. He rather turns a blind eye to Nazi-types around him. That may seem like a minor difference, but it is something. It is enough of something that major figures link to Robert Spencer, and even Bruce Bawer has publicly reviewed Spencer's latest book. Does that make Bawer a fascist enabler?

I understand the beef with Robert Spencer. I do not understand the beef with those who link to Spencer. This is starting to become ridiculous, when you get to that level.

572 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:07:23pm

re: #543 Occasional Reader

Not sure... and didn't one (or both?) have an AK?

On the morning of February 28, 1997, after months of preparation, including extensive reconnoitering of their intended target—the Bank of America branch on Laurel Canyon Boulevard—Phillips and Matasareanu loaded five illegally modified fully automatic rifles: three Romanian AIM rifles (an AK-47 copy), a modified HK91 and an AR-15. They also possessed two 9 mm Beretta 92F pistols, a .38 caliber revolver, and approximately 3,300 rounds of ammunition in box and drum magazines, and made their way from their apartment to the bank in a white Chevrolet Celebrity.[14] They wore their homemade body armor, as well as metal trauma plates to protect vital organs, and they took phenobarbital to calm their nerves.[15]

Looks like Romainian AIM rifles, AK copies.

573 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:07:27pm

re: #562 Boris Badenov

Greetings Little Green Footballniks! It is I, Boris Badenov, nemesis of Moose and Squirrel, originator of fiendish plans, at your service!

Robert Spencer and the Extremists? I remember them well! I saw them at CBGB's when I was KGB station chief in NYC back in the '80's!

Your only mission tonight is to tell us what the secret drinking word during the Obama Thread is going to be...And serve all the lizards what ever that want..
/If you do a good job we'll tip you..maybe

574 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:08:06pm

re: #568 EmmmieG

I have 3 flash lights. One abouve the stove, 1 on dresser and 1 inside garage as you leave the house. I also am stocked for hurricane season, so there is no supply I don't have, including waterproof matches.

575 Desert Dog  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:08:25pm

re: #568 EmmmieG

Flashlights, check

generator, check

food supply, check

water supply, check

beer supply, check
(lots of wine too)

emergency radio, check

guns, check

ammo, check

Once Skynet launches, the Dog Family will be on the way to the hills, pulling our own version of John Connor.

576 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:08:41pm

re: #568 EmmmieG

I'm so over-prepared for a power outage, that I find myself practically hoping for one...

577 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:08:50pm

re: #568 EmmmieG

OT--

Sorry for the nagging (but I'm a mom, that's my job) but September is...Emergency Preparedness Month. (I know that has you all jumping out of your seats in excitement.)

Today's topic is: power outages.

What is your 30 second plan if the power goes out? Seriously, can you find your way to a secondary light source in the dark? Can you tell me where a flashlight is right now?

What is your 30 minute plan? 3 hour plan? 3 day plan?

Odds are really, really good that at least one lizard will experience a power outage this winter. The time be sure that you have back-up sources of light, heat, and heat to cook with are now (before an emergency drains supplies or makes the price go up.)

Okay, go back to your regularly scheduled snarking now.

I know where several flashlights are, largely the kind you crank so I know the batteries, if dead, can be charged in 30 seconds.
And the town's largest water tank is in the hill behind our house, so we'll have water for a little while, anyway.
We also live on a main street, so power outages get fixed quickly.
And finally, we're getting all the overhanging limbs and bad trees cut down before they land on the house; last December's ice storm was bad enough. (I had to cut some 2" "trees" to open the door, and we had some roof damage, but outside the wall. We didn't lose power, but we lost cable TV for a week. We also did not lose phone or internet (DSL))

578 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:09:31pm

re: #570 opnion

Barry is on tape several years ago saying that he favors a Single Payer
System. Dem Congressmen Franks & Shnkowski say that tyhe Public Option is a segue to single payer.
Obama got too cute by half & he will now be damaged if doesn't get a substantial bill. Pride goeth before the fall ,as they say.

FYI...

“I happen to be a proponent of a single payer universal health care program. I see no reason why the United States of America, the wealthiest country in the history of the world, spending 14 percent of its Gross National Product on health care cannot provide basic health insurance to everybody. And that’s what Jim is talking about when he says everybody in, nobody out. A single payer health care plan, a universal health care plan. And that’s what I’d like to see. But as all of you know, we may not get there immediately. Because first we have to take back the White House, we have to take back the Senate, and we have to take back the House.”

[Link: www.breitbart.tv...]

579 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:09:50pm

re: #564 Desert Dog

Rebutted by you...I still think the Dems used every opportunity to bash Bush through out that war. Sometimes, their hatred of Bush even harmed the troops. Harping, criticizing, proclaiming defeat, General BetrayUS, Abu Ghraib...was that all an illusion? It didn't happen?

How did that harm the troops? Or do you mean some other actions?

580 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:09:59pm

Image: File:Us_twenty_dollar_new_back.jpg

which text should i print under a wood cut of the above
1. occupied native land
2. jerusalem, jewish capital when D.C. LONDON & PARIS were swamps.
3. for rent to the highest bidder.
4. other

now what do i have to do to get lizard attention ad a hot lizardette and a brass pole?

581 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:10:04pm

re: #574 Cannadian Club Akbar

so there is no supply I don't have

Oh yeah? What about... Pteradactyl harnesses? Huh? How many of THOSE do you have?! Huh?!

582 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:10:11pm

re: #572 Locker

Interesting note about the phenobarbs. I always thought that if I was in an Alamo-style situation, I'd want to inject myself with a speedball beforehand: opiates (analgesic & relaxant) + amphetamines (alertness & meanness).

583 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:10:16pm

re: #556 Lincolntf

Did Mr. Prompter say "I'm in charge here."?
Wee-Wee is fucked tonight.
If he tells the truth ( that he wants to own 1/7th of the largest economy in world history) then he's screwed.
If he lies or soft soaps, it'll be the umpteenth time we've seen it and nobody will believe a word he says.

Buh-bye, Barry,... try not to take too many lives with you.

Knock it off. You may not like Barack Obama, but he is the President of the United States and even if you don't respect him, at least have some damned respect for the office.

584 researchok  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:10:37pm

re: #455 Charles

Note: Spencer has NO "academic bona fides." His so-called Islam studies are all private work. He hasn't published a single academic paper or taught a single academic course.

re: #455 Charles

Note: Spencer has NO "academic bona fides." His so-called Islam studies are all private work. He hasn't published a single academic paper or taught a single academic course.

Good catch. I wrongly assumed some of his published work was peer reviewed- it is not. He has a degree in Religious Studies from Chapel Hill.

He's found a niche and he's exploiting it.

585 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:11:05pm

re: #567 Throbert McGee

Upding, 'cause I'm still puzzled too, by what SEEMS to be an overreaction to a rather minor offense by Brian.

Check the previous thread. He was implying that Spencer's neo-fascist connections were no big deal.

586 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:11:24pm

re: #581 Occasional Reader

Oh yeah? What about... Pteradactyl harnesses? Huh? How many of THOSE do you have?! Huh?!

I ride a Brontosaurus.

587 The Left  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:11:24pm

re: #564 Desert Dog

Rebutted by you...I still think the Dems used every opportunity to bash Bush through out that war. Sometimes, their hatred of Bush even harmed the troops. Harping, criticizing, proclaiming defeat, General BetrayUS, Abu Ghraib...was that all an illusion? It didn't happen?

Now you're changing the subject, and wanting to refight 2001-2008. I'm not especially interested in discussing every Democrat who annoyed you during those years, or in refighting the battles over the Iraq War.
I see a lot of projection here and a real desire to hate all Dems (or all libs) all the time, regardless of reality. And to always attribute the worst possible motives to them, no matter what.

I hate that shit when the left does it to Republicans too, btw. Not playing.

Again: the claim that all the Democrats only wanted better body armour in order to bash Bush is a very weird smear. It implies the Democrats actually hate our troops, and while I know that is a popular meme among the rabid right, it's bullshit. Just as much bullshit as when someone on the left claims that Republicans hate poor people, for example.

588 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:11:30pm

re: #582 mikalm

Interesting note about the phenobarbs. I always thought that if I was in an Alamo-style situation, I'd want to inject myself with a speedball beforehand: opiates (analgesic & relaxant) + amphetamines (alertness & meanness).

With my sort of luck, I'd just drop dead.

589 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:11:36pm

re: #571 Daria Emmons

It is enough of something that major figures link to Robert Spencer, and even Bruce Bawer has publicly reviewed Spencer's latest book. Does that make Bawer a fascist enabler?

Please read this:

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

590 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:11:56pm

re: #568 EmmmieG

OT--

Sorry for the nagging (but I'm a mom, that's my job) but September is...Emergency Preparedness Month. (I know that has you all jumping out of your seats in excitement.)

Today's topic is: power outages.

What is your 30 second plan if the power goes out? Seriously, can you find your way to a secondary light source in the dark? Can you tell me where a flashlight is right now?

What is your 30 minute plan? 3 hour plan? 3 day plan?

Odds are really, really good that at least one lizard will experience a power outage this winter. The time be sure that you have back-up sources of light, heat, and heat to cook with are now (before an emergency drains supplies or makes the price go up.)

Okay, go back to your regularly scheduled snarking now.

I have a flashlight in my pocket. Unless I'm asleep, then it's with in 2 steps from the bed distance. I have 72 bottles of water and 2 weeks of food. It does not get very cold here either so extra clothing will suffice. If needed, I have a small outdoor cooker and a couple of canisters of propane.

Do I pass?

591 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:12:36pm

re: #588 Dianna

With my sort of luck, I'd just drop dead.

LOL! Me, I might just be too awash in endorphins & adrenaline to shoulder a rifle.

592 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:12:56pm

re: #557 iceweasel

No, it's about different spending priorities. Democrats typically think too much goes to defence and too little to education, and the Republicans the other way around.

To Democrat leadership, increased funding for education is code for higher teacher salaries and more bureaucracy. Republicans typically don't buy into the notion that there is a direct correlation between higher budgets and better schools. That is what that debate boils down to.

593 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:12:57pm

re: #577 Kosh's Shadow

And of course, there's my Backup Emergency Plan; since I'm probably one of the few firearms owner in the liberal sea of Northwest DC, anything I've forgotten, I'll just take from my neighbors.

//

594 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:13:08pm

re: #582 mikalm

Interesting note about the phenobarbs. I always thought that if I was in an Alamo-style situation, I'd want to inject myself with a speedball beforehand: opiates (analgesic & relaxant) + amphetamines (alertness & meanness).

Not sure of your combat experience but personally, my body does those things under fire anyway. Honestly I wouldn't take an opiate in combat if you paid me as I rely heavily on my observation and reaction time. Other guys in my unit though were so bat shit crazy wound up they would drink some of our apple jack just to calm em down.

595 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:13:12pm

I've emailed some information to Throbert, by the way. There's more to this little incident than the people who are now criticizing me seem to realize.

596 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:13:31pm

re: #586 Cannadian Club Akbar

I ride a Brontosaurus.

There is a killer scene in Jim Butcher's Dead Beat where our hero rides a necro-animated (ectoplasmicly filled in) Sue, the Field Museum's T-Rex, into battle.

I quite shocked my Male because I started cheering.

597 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:13:49pm

re: #568 EmmmieG

OT--

Sorry for the nagging (but I'm a mom, that's my job) but September is...Emergency Preparedness Month. (I know that has you all jumping out of your seats in excitement.)

Today's topic is: power outages.

What is your 30 second plan if the power goes out? Seriously, can you find your way to a secondary light source in the dark? Can you tell me where a flashlight is right now?

What is your 30 minute plan? 3 hour plan? 3 day plan?

Odds are really, really good that at least one lizard will experience a power outage this winter. The time be sure that you have back-up sources of light, heat, and heat to cook with are now (before an emergency drains supplies or makes the price go up.)

Okay, go back to your regularly scheduled snarking now.

Multiple high power LED flashlights.

Two very very sharp and real swords. (Ok not practical, but I actually do know how to use them)

I always have a lot of canned food and bottled water around. (Not that I stockpile per se, I use it as I go, but I have a couple of days worth).

Two very very fierce dogs (ok they are 35 and 16 lbs respectively, but they can stop an attack by the power of uber cuteness)

One shottie, 12 gauge

One MI Garand. Actually quite good at dropping a deer. I haven't but I know it can.

Many many student homework papers to burn for warmth if needs be.

I think I'm ok.

598 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:13:52pm

I must say, I'm impressed. There are a lot of prepared lizards here.

I admit I have flashlights, but I also have boys, so my immediate light-loss plans involves walking over to my gas fireplace and turning it on, since they have probably carried off the flashlights again.

599 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:14:04pm

re: #568 EmmmieG

OT--

Sorry for the nagging (but I'm a mom, that's my job) but September is...Emergency Preparedness Month. (I know that has you all jumping out of your seats in excitement.)

Today's topic is: power outages.

What is your 30 second plan if the power goes out? Seriously, can you find your way to a secondary light source in the dark? Can you tell me where a flashlight is right now?

What is your 30 minute plan? 3 hour plan? 3 day plan?

Odds are really, really good that at least one lizard will experience a power outage this winter. The time be sure that you have back-up sources of light, heat, and heat to cook with are now (before an emergency drains supplies or makes the price go up.)

Okay, go back to your regularly scheduled snarking now.

30 seconds? Run and scream and shout.
30 minutes? The pasta's gonna be soggy.
3 hours? Don't open the fridge.
3 day? Break out the camp stove.
3 Week? Gonna be tired of canned food, heated on the camp stove.
3 month? The desire for fresh food and the cats well being are coming into conflict.

600 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:14:19pm

i guess i wasted my time asking for a opinion

well i did forget the lizardette and the brass pole.

601 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:14:32pm

re: #585 Occasional Reader

Check the previous thread. He was implying that Spencer's neo-fascist connections were no big deal.

Yes, he absolutely is not just implying that -- he said it outright several times.

602 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:14:34pm

re: #589 Charles

Please read this:

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

'

I did read that - and yet Bawer has reviewed Spencer's latest book.

Again - does that render him now a fascist enabler?

I do believe Spencer is just openly ignoring the neofascist links in front of his face. But when you start to get upset with those who link to Spencer - that is a different story. (and it includes Bawer)

[Link: www.amazon.com...] - check out Bawer's review.

603 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:15:14pm

re: #597 LudwigVanQuixote

Multiple high power LED flashlights.

Two very very sharp and real swords. (Ok not practical, but I actually do know how to use them)

I always have a lot of canned food and bottled water around. (Not that I stockpile per se, I use it as I go, but I have a couple of days worth).

Two very very fierce dogs (ok they are 35 and 16 lbs respectively, but they can stop an attack by the power of uber cuteness)

One shottie, 12 gauge

One MI Garand. Actually quite good at dropping a deer. I haven't but I know it can.

Many many student homework papers to burn for warmth if needs be.

I think I'm ok.

If my memory serves that M1 is heavy as hell. Only fired a few times on the range at Ft Sill.

604 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:15:15pm

re: #595 Charles

I've emailed some information to Throbert, by the way. There's more to this little incident than the people who are now criticizing me seem to realize.

Ohhh I trust you... Don't worry about that. When it goes down, you can share the warmth of student homeworks...

605 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:15:17pm

re: #590 ArchangelMichael

I have a flashlight in my pocket.

Damn. And I here I thought you were "happy to see me"...

(actually, I do, too; damn useful, they are.)

606 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:15:22pm

re: #601 Charles

Yes, he absolutely is not just implying that -- he said it outright several times.

Where did he say that?

I did not read it in this thread. I read one dumb comment and then a load of "I am not taking sides."

607 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:15:31pm

re: #594 Locker

No combat experience here, fortunately. But you're right -- in a normal firefight, I'd want the natural body chemicals to do the job. What I was thinking of was a no-hope situation, where I knew I wasn't going to come out alive, and wanted a sort of pharmaceutical-Berserker state of mind for my last few minutes on earth.

608 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:15:39pm

re: #602 Daria Emmons

The review is years old.

I've spoken to Bruce much more recently.

609 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:16:33pm

re: #607 mikalm

No combat experience here, fortunately. But you're right -- in a normal firefight, I'd want the natural body chemicals to do the job. What I was thinking of was a no-hope situation, where I knew I wasn't going to come out alive, and wanted a sort of pharmaceutical-Berserker state of mind for my last few minutes on earth.

Oh well shit, give me a nice spike of Heroin. I hear it's nice and what better time to try it. Don't know if I could take some with me or not but I'd sure feel good on the down slide.

610 Lincolntf  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:16:39pm

re: #583 Charles

Knock what off? " 'Prompter?" "Wee-Wee"?

I've served under Presidents that I've called far worse, so you don't have to worry about my respect for "The Office".

611 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:17:53pm

re: #608 Charles

The review is years old.

I've spoken to Bruce much more recently.

The book has not even come out yet - Bruce specifically informed you his review is years old?

612 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:17:57pm

re: #571 Daria Emmons

I would agree if Brian linked to Stormfront or National Vanguard, or even an open Vlaams Belang blog, such as Brussels Journal.

But linking to both LGF and Jihad Watch? This makes him a fascist enabler? On what planet? Robert Spencer is not the same as Stormfront, et al. He is simply not an open Nazi, and I don't think he even is a Nazi at all. He rather turns a blind eye to Nazi-types around him. That may seem like a minor difference, but it is something. It is enough of something that major figures link to Robert Spencer, and even Bruce Bawer has publicly reviewed Spencer's latest book. Does that make Bawer a fascist enabler?

I understand the beef with Robert Spencer. I do not understand the beef with those who link to Spencer. This is starting to become ridiculous, when you get to that level.

Oh boy..You are right this is getting ridiculous...
You got a blog? I'll open one in the morning as an experiment...
I'm linking to Charles and some Indiana White boy sites..Plus really some ugly anti-Semite sites...I mean serious Jew hating shit and the 'Let's kill the white man sites' I'll link you also...
Are you starting to get it?
You draw a line in the sand with your principles what ever they are and Charles Posted exactly where his line is...
Are you being to understand it a little bit now? Send me your link..You're going love this fake 24 hour blog..I'll drive you some traffic

613 Aye Pod  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:18:01pm

re: #567 Throbert McGee

Upding, 'cause I'm still puzzled too, by what SEEMS to be an overreaction to a rather minor offense by Brian.

What he said :


Boogey boo! Scary Christians are eeeverywhere! Oooo!

(Seriously, we can pick on fringe groups all day. That doesn't mean that it has any relevance in matters of *actual* importance.)

With that comment, plus the email he has sent to Charles whining about how much this place has 'gone downhill' - I get the feeling this guy is a wannabee cesspit dweller.

614 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:18:24pm

frankly after what the donks did to the past occupant i will wait till the next one is in office to show the required respect.

615 Desert Dog  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:18:27pm

re: #579 Locker

How did that harm the troops? Or do you mean some other actions?

You were in the military. Was it good for your the morale of the troop when Democrat leadership from the House and Senate called the mission a failure? Or insinuated that they have opened up a torture chamber similar to Saddam Hussein? Or, that you are and your comrades are dying for no good reason? over and over and over? Or, calling the war lost?

If I was over there and heard that, I would get damn depressed. It would seem like it was all for nothing.

And, what did that do for the bad guys shooting at our guys? If I was an scumbag terrorist in Fallujah and I heard the Dems in Congress saying these things, I would feel pretty good about things. They knew they didn't have to beat the USA, they just had to wear down the Americans will to fight. One side lost that will pretty damn fast. First they authorized it, then when it became unpopular with the base, it suddenly became the worst thing ever.

Well, it's 2009, Obama is the President now...we are still there. Should the Republicans in Congress start standing up and acting the way the Dems did? I hope not.

616 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:18:55pm

re: #603 Locker

If my memory serves that M1 is heavy as hell. Only fired a few times on the range at Ft Sill.

Not light, I've never weighed it but I'd say around 10 lbs. However, the kick is surprisingly light because of it, and it is very accurate.

617 Boris Badenov  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:19:09pm

re: #573 HoosierHoops

Your only mission tonight is to tell us what the secret drinking word during the Obama Thread is going to be...And serve all the lizards what ever that want..
/If you do a good job we'll tip you..maybe

HooseyHoopski, go back to dribbling basketball. Don't presume to tell KGBnik what to do. Or you may end up on wrong end of poison dart shooting umbrella. Would you like a Polonium Martini? I use only the best Russian vodka. It gets glowing reviews. See, I make joke! Polonium, radioactive, glowing, is not funny, dribbling ball man?

618 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:19:21pm

re: #594 Locker

Not sure of your combat experience but personally, my body does those things under fire anyway. Honestly I wouldn't take an opiate in combat if you paid me as I rely heavily on my observation and reaction time. Other guys in my unit though were so bat shit crazy wound up they would drink some of our apple jack just to calm em down.

If I may ask, from where is your combat experience?

619 opnion  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:19:43pm

re: #578 Walter L. Newton

FYI...

“I happen to be a proponent of a single payer universal health care program. I see no reason why the United States of America, the wealthiest country in the history of the world, spending 14 percent of its Gross National Product on health care cannot provide basic health insurance to everybody. And that’s what Jim is talking about when he says everybody in, nobody out. A single payer health care plan, a universal health care plan. And that’s what I’d like to see. But as all of you know, we may not get there immediately. Because first we have to take back the White House, we have to take back the Senate, and we have to take back the House.”

[Link: www.breitbart.tv...]


Yes & I do not think that he has given up his goal to have a single payer. He ignores the rationing & lesser medical outcomes in existing national plans. He talks about the wonders of the Canadian plan, yet Canadians come down here for care as needed.
IMO Obama wants the power of controlling the health care system

620 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:19:57pm

re: #611 Daria Emmons

The book has not even come out yet - Bruce specifically informed you his review is years old?

It hasn't come out? Then why does Amazon say "In Stock?"

If you think Bruce Bawer is a supporter of Robert Spencer at this point, you're highly misinformed.

621 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:20:21pm

re: #559 HoosierHoops

Daria Daria Daria.. That is all you gleaned from 2 hours of links? I'm surprised..
Daria..I'm going to make this simple for you...Without snark..
It's all about Principles..

Downding, because "Avoid giving aid and comfort to thine enemy" is not the only principle that exists.

I'm pretty sure I quoted Hanlon's/Heinlein's Razor last night -- or maybe I started to but didn't ultimately post it. In any case, my preferred phrasing of this particular razor is Never attribute to bad character that which can be adequately explained by innocent ignorance.*

And it's still not clear to me that Brian's linkage to Spencer in any way reflects badly on Brian's character. Maybe he overestimates the value of Spencer's scholarship on Islam, but that doesn't make Brian a bad person -- it just means he needs to read more.

*In the original, it's "stupidity" that's offered as the most likely explanatory factor, but I think that for most purposes, "innocent ignorance" is an improvement, for obvious reasons.

622 BignJames  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:20:48pm

re: #616 LudwigVanQuixote

Not light, I've never weighed it but I'd say around 10 lbs. However, the kick is surprisingly light because of it, and it is very accurate.

Closer to 8...beware the M1 thumb!

623 mikalm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:21:02pm

This is getting friggin' ridiculous. BBL, Lizards.

624 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:21:09pm

re: #621 Throbert McGee

Please check your email.

625 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:21:14pm

re: #616 LudwigVanQuixote

Not light, I've never weighed it but I'd say around 10 lbs. However, the kick is surprisingly light because of it, and it is very accurate.

I was kind of tempted to get a new M1 clone a couple years back. The $900 price tag (among other things) put me off.

626 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:21:30pm

re: #593 Occasional Reader

And of course, there's my Backup Emergency Plan; since I'm probably one of the few firearms owner in the liberal sea of Northwest DC, anything I've forgotten, I'll just take from my neighbors.

//

Have you seen The Colony, on Discovery?
It is a after-disaster reality show in which 10 people have to survive on what they can scrounge in a cordoned-off area of LA, including an abandoned warehouse.

627 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:21:36pm

bbiab

628 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:22:32pm

re: #617 Boris Badenov

HooseyHoopski, go back to dribbling basketball. Don't presume to tell KGBnik what to do. Or you may end up on wrong end of poison dart shooting umbrella. Would you like a Polonium Martini? I use only the best Russian vodka. It gets glowing reviews. See, I make joke! Polonium, radioactive, glowing, is not funny, dribbling ball man?

You've come a long way from those black metal balls that say "Bomb" and have a fuse.
Hey, how's Natasha?
Moose and Squirrel send their regards.

629 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:22:43pm

re: #620 Charles

It hasn't come out? Then why does Amazon say "In Stock?"

If you think Bruce Bawer is a supporter of Robert Spencer at this point, you're highly misinformed.

It will not come out until September 21st.

Check the Amazon site again:

[Link: www.amazon.com...]

It is impossible that Bawer's review is years old, given this book has not even come out yet.

630 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:22:44pm

re: #611 Daria Emmons

The book has not even come out yet - Bruce specifically informed you his review is years old?

What book are you talking about?

631 abbyadams  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:23:50pm

re: #533 Charles

Thanks, me too. I especially think it's amusing when TV talking heads make fun of him as they are reading off their own teleprompters.

632 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:24:05pm

re: #629 Daria Emmons

It will not come out until September 21st.

Check the Amazon site again:

[Link: www.amazon.com...]

It is impossible that Bawer's review is years old, given this book has not even come out yet.

Do you think that books just appear with all their reviews in a day or two?

633 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:24:41pm

re: #585 Occasional Reader

Check the previous thread. He was implying that Spencer's neo-fascist connections were no big deal.

I saw that thread, but to me it seemed as though Brian felt under attack and was only downplaying Spencer's shady connections in self-defense.

634 Occasional Reader  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:24:53pm

Off to the gym. Later.

635 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:25:13pm

re: #624 Charles

Please check your email.

Ah, will do, thanks!

636 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:25:21pm

re: #629 Daria Emmons

Daria, are you sure you're linking to the right book?

637 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:25:31pm

re: #632 Charles

Do you think that books just appear with all their reviews in a day or two?

I have a friend in the publishing world.

I would be shocked if Bawer reviewed the book YEARS ago. Proofs of this kind are not typically floating around for multiple years.

Again - you can check with Bawer on this one. But I would be quite surprised if he reviewed the book multiple years ago.

638 Daria Emmons  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:26:13pm

re: #636 Dianna

Daria, are you sure you're linking to the right book?

Yes - it is Spencer's latest - the Infidel's Guide to the Koran - set to be published on September 21st. The first review featured is Bruce Bawer's.

639 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:26:49pm

I think I see the source of Daria's confusion:

Product Details

* Paperback: 272 pages
* Publisher: Regnery Publishing (September 21, 2009)
* Language: English
* ISBN-10: 1596981040
* ISBN-13: 978-1596981041
* Product Dimensions: 8.9 x 7.2 x 0.8 inches
* Shipping Weight: 15.2 ounces (View shipping rates and policies)

640 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:26:51pm

re: #629 Daria Emmons

But since you're going to focus on the "years old" comment, I was mistaken about that; I thought it was one of Spencer's other anti-Islam books. Your original link is broken.

And frankly, I could not care less whether Bruce Bawer reviews Spencer's book or not. If he's changed his mind now and is back to supporting Spencer despite everything he knows, that's his problem, not mine.

641 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:27:02pm

re: #621 Throbert McGee

Downding, because "Avoid giving aid and comfort to thine enemy" is not the only principle that exists.

I'm pretty sure I quoted Hanlon's/Heinlein's Razor last night -- or maybe I started to but didn't ultimately post it. In any case, my preferred phrasing of this particular razor is Never attribute to bad character that which can be adequately explained by innocent ignorance.*

And it's still not clear to me that Brian's linkage to Spencer in any way reflects badly on Brian's character. Maybe he overestimates the value of Spencer's scholarship on Islam, but that doesn't make Brian a bad person -- it just means he needs to read more.

*In the original, it's "stupidity" that's offered as the most likely explanatory factor, but I think that for most purposes, "innocent ignorance" is an improvement, for obvious reasons.


You put quotes around a sentence I have never written in my life...
See why the Hoopster hates the MSM? I never get quoted right...
I'll take my downding from you.. I know you feel strongly.. I still thing you are cool dude..So there Beautch!
/

642 Desert Dog  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:27:19pm

re: #587 iceweasel

Now you're changing the subject, and wanting to refight 2001-2008. I'm not especially interested in discussing every Democrat who annoyed you during those years, or in refighting the battles over the Iraq War.
I see a lot of projection here and a real desire to hate all Dems (or all libs) all the time, regardless of reality. And to always attribute the worst possible motives to them, no matter what.

I hate that shit when the left does it to Republicans too, btw. Not playing.

Again: the claim that all the Democrats only wanted better body armour in order to bash Bush is a very weird smear. It implies the Democrats actually hate our troops, and while I know that is a popular meme among the rabid right, it's bullshit. Just as much bullshit as when someone on the left claims that Republicans hate poor people, for example.

I don't hate the Democrats and for you and others to toss out blanket indictments of the Republicans for "being mean" to the Democrats is a bit hypocritical. Both sides get ridiculous at times. Demonizing one another and taking ever opportunity get in a jab. That's the real bullshit.

I still stand by my belief that the Democrats used the body armor issue to get a jab in at Bush. The same with the armor on the Humvees. I can still recall Hillary and John F-ing Kerry lecturing Bush like a school child for "not properly equipping the troops". Using that as a way to slap Bush in the face. I know what I saw, you cannot tell me otherwise, sorry.

Now, do I think that the Democrats didn't care about the troops? Of course they did. But they still used that issue as a political tool.

643 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:28:44pm

Okay, just read Charles' email, and now I feel like a sucker for having defended Brian at all...

644 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:28:46pm

re: #638 Daria Emmons

Yes - it is Spencer's latest - the Infidel's Guide to the Koran - set to be published on September 21st. The first review featured is Bruce Bawer's.

Is this perhaps the paper-back of an earlier hard-bound? I don't see that detail in a rapid scan of the page, but I wonder if that isn't the source of confusion.

645 HelloDare  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:29:11pm

Of course, he hasn't tried to work with Republicans. He hasn't tried to "seek common ground." His door, and his mind, have not been open. He has stood by as the trial lawyers try to keep things as they are. And this is just an excerpt.

The White House has released advanced excerpts of President Obama's remarks tonight. And, per these remarks, it appears he will come out swinging on health care.

"I am not the first president to take up this cause," he is expected to say, "but I am determined to be the last."

More: "[T]he time for bickering is over. The time for games has passed. Now is the season for action. Now is when we must bring the best ideas of both parties together, and show the American people that we can still do what we were sent here to do. Now is the time to deliver on health care."

Later, he adds: "And I will continue to seek common ground in the weeks ahead. If you come to me with a serious set of proposals, I will be there to listen. My door is always open.

"But know this: I will not waste time with those who have made the calculation that it’s better politics to kill this plan than improve it. I will not stand by while the special interests use the same old tactics to keep things exactly the way they are. If you misrepresent what’s in the plan, we will call you out. And I will not accept the status quo as a solution. Not this time. Not now."

As far as the particulars go, Obama will say that the reform he seeks will accomplish three goals. "It will provide more security and stability to those who have health insurance. It will provide insurance to those who don’t. And it will slow the growth of health care costs for our families, our businesses, and our government. It’s a plan that asks everyone to take responsibility for meeting this challenge – not just government and insurance companies, but employers and individuals. And it’s a plan that incorporates ideas from Senators and Congressmen; from Democrats and Republicans – and yes, from some of my opponents in both the primary and general election."

646 flyers1974  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:30:33pm

re: #615 Desert Dog

One could compare the libs response to the war with the cons response to healthcare. In my opinion, there was a lack of intelligent debate about the war - what's the plan, what's the cost, what are the interests involved, etc... . There were many intelligent reasons to be against the war, but many libs focused on hating Bush. So we had bumperstickers and ribbons on one side and Code Pink on the other.

647 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:30:51pm

re: #643 Throbert McGee

Okay, just read Charles' email, and now I feel like a sucker for having defended Brian at all...

So my downding goes away?
*wink*

648 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:31:05pm

re: #644 Dianna

Is this perhaps the paper-back of an earlier hard-bound? I don't see that detail in a rapid scan of the page, but I wonder if that isn't the source of confusion.

Ok. I can't find a review on that Amazon page by Bawer. ANd no, this is a new book, in paperback, release date is Sept. 21st.

I have found a blurb from Bruce Bawer about this book on another web site, not a full review.

649 Desert Dog  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:31:59pm

re: #646 flyers1974

One could compare the libs response to the war with the cons response to healthcare. In my opinion, there was a lack of intelligent debate about the war - what's the plan, what's the cost, what are the interests involved, etc... . There were many intelligent reasons to be against the war, but many libs focused on hating Bush. So we had bumperstickers and ribbons on one side and Code Pink on the other.

I can see that in a way. I think a more apt comparison would be if the Republicans voted for the Healthcare Reform and THEN started harping about it.

650 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:32:15pm
651 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:32:45pm

re: #648 Walter L. Newton

Ok. I can't find a review on that Amazon page by Bawer. ANd no, this is a new book, in paperback, release date is Sept. 21st.

I have found a blurb from Bruce Bawer about this book on another web site, not a full review.

That helps. They're offering to ship it right now, though, even with a release date of 9/21/09.

I didn't see a Bruce Bawer review, either.

652 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:32:46pm

re: #645 HelloDare

Good for him. Republicans simply aren't interested in healthcare reform, they never have been. It's like environmental issues, they are considered left wing causes. Dems take the issue seriously and are determined to do something about it. Good for them. I like to see the Prez fired up.

653 Locker  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:32:59pm

re: #615 Desert Dog

You were in the military. Was it good for your the morale of the troop when Democrat leadership from the House and Senate called the mission a failure? Or insinuated that they have opened up a torture chamber similar to Saddam Hussein? Or, that you are and your comrades are dying for no good reason? over and over and over? Or, calling the war lost?

If I was over there and heard that, I would get damn depressed. It would seem like it was all for nothing.

And, what did that do for the bad guys shooting at our guys? If I was an scumbag terrorist in Fallujah and I heard the Dems in Congress saying these things, I would feel pretty good about things. They knew they didn't have to beat the USA, they just had to wear down the Americans will to fight. One side lost that will pretty damn fast. First they authorized it, then when it became unpopular with the base, it suddenly became the worst thing ever.

Well, it's 2009, Obama is the President now...we are still there. Should the Republicans in Congress start standing up and acting the way the Dems did? I hope not.

Just quickly on the first paragraph before my wife gets here to pick me up. I didn't know jack about what was going on in the press or politics when I was serving but... if I did hear the first paragraph I would think "they are trying to get me home". Might not be true but that's probably what I would think.

On the flip-flip yea I hated it. I HATED that they (left/dems) authorized/supported Iraq (Except Russ Feingold and 22 other Senators listed below and Denis Kucinich and 132 other Representatives)

[Link:wikipedia.org... ]


* 126 (61%) of 208 Democratic Representatives voted against the resolution.
* 6 of 223 Republican Representatives voted against the resolution: Reps. Duncan (R-TN), Hostettler (R-IN), Houghton (R-NY), Leach (R-IA), Morella (R-MD), Paul (R-TX).
* The only Independent Representative voted against the resolution: Rep. Sanders (I-VT)
o Reps. Ortiz (D-TX), Roukema (R-NJ), and Stump (R-AZ) did not vote on the resolution.

* 21 (42%) of 50 Democratic Senators voted against the resolution: Sens. Akaka (D-HI), Bingaman (D-NM), Boxer (D-CA), Byrd (D-WV), Conrad (D-ND), Corzine (D-NJ), Dayton (D-MN), Durbin (D-IL), Feingold (D-WI), Graham (D-FL), Inouye (D-HI), Kennedy (D-MA), Leahy (D-VT), Levin (D-MI), Mikulski (D-MD), Murray (D-WA), Reed (D-RI), Sarbanes (D-MD), Stabenow (D-MI), Wellstone (D-MN), Wyden (D-OR).
* 1 of 49 Republican Senators voted against the resolution: Sen. Chafee (R-RI).
* The only Independent Senator voted against the resoution: Sen. Jeffords (I-VT)

654 Dianna  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:33:08pm

I'm off. Take care.

655 Lincolntf  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:33:13pm

re: #650 buzzsawmonkey

Gotta keep those mechanics working or they can't donate to the campaign.

656 flyers1974  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:33:26pm

re: #646 flyers1974

One could compare the libs response to the war with the cons response to healthcare. In my opinion, there was a lack of intelligent debate about the war - what's the plan, what's the cost, what are the interests involved, etc... . There were many intelligent reasons to be against the war, but many libs focused on hating Bush. So we had bumperstickers and ribbons on one side and Code Pink on the other.

Perhaps its more accurate to say those things dominated the discussion.

657 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:35:57pm

re: #643 Throbert McGee

Okay, just read Charles' email, and now I feel like a sucker for having defended Brian at all...

I should've added, by way of explanation, that Brian has a history of "prior offenses," so the very recent scrutiny he got from Charles and others was NOT at all "out of the blue."

658 avanti  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:36:38pm

ABC news has new pictures from the improved space telescope, I'll try and find some on the net.

659 debutaunt  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:37:07pm

re: #387 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Him is on TV again tonight.

He likes the TV.

I said, "They say that the camera adds ten pounds."
Camera man looked at me and said, "How many cameras were on you?"

Didja eat the watermellon whole?

661 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:37:34pm

re: #625 Occasional Reader

I was kind of tempted to get a new M1 clone a couple years back. The $900 price tag (among other things) put me off.

I got mine from a crate at a local armory. They uncovered them and sold them. Been sitting there 60 years. Damn fine weapon.

662 cronus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:37:51pm

re: #645 HelloDare

Of course, he hasn't tried to work with Republicans. He hasn't tried to "seek common ground." His door, and his mind, have not been open. He has stood by as the trial lawyers try to keep things as they are. And this is just an excerpt.

Interesting that Drudge is reporting that Dems may now not have the votes in the House to pass a bill. They most certainly do not have the votes to pass anything in the Senate that has a public option provision.

663 HelloDare  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:37:53pm

re: #652 Killgore Trout

Good for him. Republicans simply aren't interested in healthcare reform, they never have been. ...

Wrong.

What kind of health-care reform would Republicans like to see? Four conservative GOP lawmakers — Senators Tom Coburn of Oklahoma and Richard Burr of North Carolina, along with Congressmen Paul Ryan of Wisconsin and Devin Nunes of California — introduced a proposal on May 19 that looks a lot like the one John McCain advanced during his presidential campaign as well as an idea George W. Bush advanced as President.

But it also includes the kind of rhetoric more generally associated with the Democrats. A 15-page summary of the bill begins: "It is time to publicly admit that the health-care system in America is broken. Costs are rising at an unacceptable rate — more than doubling over the last 10 years, which is nearly four times the rate of wage growth. Too many patients feel trapped by health-care decisions dictated by HMOs. Too many doctors are torn between practicing medicine and practicing insurance. And 47 million Americans worry what will happen to them or their children if they get sick."

664 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:38:05pm

re: #657 Throbert McGee

I think it also became clear that he showed up here today looking to start trouble.

665 Boris Badenov  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:39:11pm

re: #628 Kosh's Shadow

You've come a long way from those black metal balls that say "Bomb" and have a fuse.
Hey, how's Natasha?
Moose and Squirrel send their regards.

"Bomb" is too simple these days. Need Polonium. Or Goof Gas.

Natasha is fine. She had boob job so they are now bolshoya and bounski wounski! We play motorboat game after vodka hour!

666 flyers1974  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:39:27pm

re: #649 Desert Dog

I once read a Foreign Affairs article that suggested we amend the constitution and create a non-partisan board to deal with foreign policy. I don't think the writer really thought that could or should happen, but the point was there should be a way to take the partisanship out of foreign policy. I think there is much truth to this, unrealistic as it may be. Many of us first consider whether an action or war is liberal and conservative and then decide where we stand. I'm sure this is in large part due to the Vietnam War and the political fights surrounding that.

667 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:40:17pm

re: #647 HoosierHoops

So my downding goes away?
*wink*

No, 'cause wherever that downding was, I'm sure I had justifiable reason for it at the time. But I updinged THIS post of yours, so karmic balance is restored!

668 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:40:25pm

re: #628 Kosh's Shadow

You've come a long way from those black metal balls that say "Bomb" and have a fuse.
Hey, how's Natasha?
Moose and Squirrel send their regards.

Sorry..Sarah Shot the Moose...I understand it was delicious

669 Salamantis  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:40:49pm

re: #455 Charles

Note: Spencer has NO "academic bona fides." His so-called Islam studies are all private work. He hasn't published a single academic paper or taught a single academic course.

Spencer'sd recent serialized commentaries on the Quran were not what was actually in the Quran, but what malevolence he could extrapolate out of the Quran.

I read some of them, then decided I much preferred my own take from reading it myself, without the Spencerian blood-colored-glass filter, but academically augmented by the understandings of genuinely authentic Islamic scholars such as Jeffrey Herf and Bernard Lewis.

670 cliffster  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:40:52pm

re: #660 Killgore Trout

Not Photoshopped: Just Incredible Forced Perspective Photography

I'm not sure I would have volunteered for that rocket ("hot dog") shot. Pretty cool stuff, though

671 JHW  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:41:52pm

re: #660 Killgore Trout

Heh, I checked out the page of hideous tattoos linked at that site. Those Russians must have been really hitting the vodka when they did their tattooing.

672 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:42:33pm

re: #658 avanti

Try here

Heading home.

673 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:42:34pm

re: #663 HelloDare

They aren't serious about it though. I'm sure they have plans sitting around and gathering dust but they never put any serious effort into them. They had their opportunity when they controlled congress and when the had the White House. They could have passed some serious reforms but chose not to. It's just not a cause that they are interested in. They can cooperate on this bill if they wanted to but they won't. Healthcare reform would have to come from the Dems because they are the only party interested in it.

674 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:43:37pm

re: #662 cronus

Interesting that Drudge is reporting that Dems may now not have the votes in the House to pass a bill. They most certainly do not have the votes to pass anything in the Senate that has a public option provision.

It is critical to keep up pressure on representatives of all stripes. Opposition has grown with the release of the impossibly huge new deficit projections. No one in their right mind thinks any plan being considered is even remotely affordable in the given climate. Even the rosiest, most optimistic projections of the deficit and the costs of any of the proposed health care plans spell certain doom for the nation, to the point where not even Congress members can ignore the impending disaster.

Make sure your Congressional representatives know about your opposition.

675 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:43:43pm

OK, better put down any drinks before viewing this site:

[Link: www.peopleofwalmart.com...]

676 opnion  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:44:25pm

re: #662 cronus

Interesting that Drudge is reporting that Dems may now not have the votes in the House to pass a bill. They most certainly do not have the votes to pass anything in the Senate that has a public option provision.

That will be great for the nation. Now If Obama is actually sincere &I have my doubts, it is time to do something for the working poor without benefits , but earn too much to qualify for Medicaid.
He would garner bi-partisan support, but doing this worthwhile thing may not be grandiose enough for him.

677 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:44:42pm

re: #675 Charles

OK, better put down any drinks before viewing this site:

[Link: peopleofwalmart.com...]

Error in link

678 J.S.  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:44:48pm

It seems to me that meeting up with Euro fascists types (and that Christian extremist group) and then denying it, is all too typical of R. Spencer. In a way, this almost dove-tails with the problems others have noted with regard to Spencer's "scholarship" -- that is, some have noted that Spencer is only a pseudo-intellectual or pseudo "scholar" of Islam -- because he consistently resorts to "selection bias." (that is, he has a preconceived notion with respect to Islam, then sets out to document it...) Or, he takes isolated aspects of the religion and then asserts it's representative... Anyway, hanging out with the haters isn't going to "help" Robert overcome any of his preconceived notions, only exacerbate them..(or "re-confirm" his existing prejudices).

679 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:46:03pm

re: #677 HoosierHoops

Error in link

worked sorry

680 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:46:17pm
681 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:46:44pm

re: #677 HoosierHoops

It just loads slow. I was trying to view that site a few days ago, server is always overloaded.

682 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:46:59pm

re: #677 HoosierHoops

Works here -- try this:

[Link: www.peopleofwalmart.com...]

683 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:47:39pm

re: #675 Charles

OK, better put down any drinks before viewing this site:

[Link: peopleofwalmart.com...]

Obama's base.

684 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:47:43pm

re: #670 cliffster

I'm not sure I would have volunteered for that rocket ("hot dog") shot. Pretty cool stuff, though

Heh! "Accessibly handsome" guy-next-door type pretending to fellate the space shuttle -- that's like softcore pr0n to me!

/I'll be in my bunk

685 reine.de.tout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:48:08pm

re: #675 Charles

OK, better put down any drinks before viewing this site:

[Link: peopleofwalmart.com...]

Full Disclosure: I am a "person of WalMart" as I shop there.

But that there is just funny as heck.

686 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:48:19pm

re: #675 Charles

OK, better put down any drinks before viewing this site:

[Link: peopleofwalmart.com...]

Speechless.

687 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:48:22pm
688 opnion  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:48:31pm

re: #683 Walter L. Newton

Obama's base.

Oh, that's good!

689 Desert Dog  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:48:46pm

re: #666 flyers1974

That is an interesting idea, but I cannot see either side agreeing to it. It used to be that Democrats and Republicans could agree on things when the shooting starts. Of course, the wars that we have been entangled in since 1945 have not been as clear cut as previous conflicts. We had no choice in WWII...WWI we did, but both sides rallied around the country. Vietnam? That ripped this country apart. Gulf War I was too short and Gulf War II is turning out to be too long. I just get very upset when either side starts using a conflict to make political hay. If the Republican suddenly started ripping Obama like the Dems did Bush over Iraq or Afghanistan, I would be just as upset.

690 debutaunt  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:49:31pm

re: #587 iceweasel

Now you're changing the subject, and wanting to refight 2001-2008. I'm not especially interested in discussing every Democrat who annoyed you during those years, or in refighting the battles over the Iraq War.
I see a lot of projection here and a real desire to hate all Dems (or all libs) all the time, regardless of reality. And to always attribute the worst possible motives to them, no matter what.

I hate that shit when the left does it to Republicans too, btw. Not playing.

Again: the claim that all the Democrats only wanted better body armour in order to bash Bush is a very weird smear. It implies the Democrats actually hate our troops, and while I know that is a popular meme among the rabid right, it's bullshit. Just as much bullshit as when someone on the left claims that Republicans hate poor people, for example.

Boy, it would have been great having you here then, to point out all of that mean dem stuff, but alas, just a recent lizard.

691 BignJames  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:49:37pm

re: #675 Charles

OK, better put down any drinks before viewing this site:

[Link: peopleofwalmart.com...]


I've seen the live show...never, ever go to Walmart on a weekend.

692 reine.de.tout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:49:42pm

I'm gonna keep my iPhone camera on and at the ready next time I go to WalMart. I've seen those sights. It ain't pretty LOL.

693 Rancher  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:49:45pm

re: #673 Killgore Trout

They aren't serious about it though. I'm sure they have plans sitting around and gathering dust but they never put any serious effort into them. They had their opportunity when they controlled congress and when the had the White House. They could have passed some serious reforms but chose not to. It's just not a cause that they are interested in. They can cooperate on this bill if they wanted to but they won't. Health care reform would have to come from the Dems because they are the only party interested in it.


I will agree that they haven't been in the forefront of reform but then most Americans didn't think we were in a crises, most of us were content with our coverage if not exactly happy. Thus the fear that the Dems wont reform as much as screw up health care.

694 reine.de.tout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:50:18pm

re: #691 BignJames

I've seen the live show...never, ever go to Walmart on a weekend.

Tuesday morning at 7:30 is just about the exact right time to go to WalMart.

695 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:50:40pm

re: #682 Charles

Works here -- try this:

[Link: www.peopleofwalmart.com...]

They promised me they erased that picture!

696 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:50:46pm

re: #681 Killgore Trout

It just loads slow. I was trying to view that site a few days ago, server is always overloaded.

Thanks.. How many posts have I made here on Saturdays about the Wal-Mart in Indiana? I could do stand up at a club...
I'm not mean to people...I'm a gentleman..
For God's sake people! Stop eating fucking pancakes! You've had just a few stacks too many!

/

697 Pianobuff  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:50:47pm

re: #682 Charles

Works here -- try this:

[Link: www.peopleofwalmart.com...]

That is...um...frightening.

I think I just tossed yesterday's double-double animal style...

698 Boris Badenov  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:53:01pm

In Soviet Russia, Berlin Wall Mart discounts you!

699 Randall Gross  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 3:58:40pm

re: #652 Killgore Trout

Good for him. Republicans simply aren't interested in healthcare reform, they never have been. It's like environmental issues, they are considered left wing causes. Dems take the issue seriously and are determined to do something about it. Good for them. I like to see the Prez fired up.

Not wholly true. Teddy Roosevelt.

700 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:01:47pm

re: #687 Charles

Whoa.

It took me a while to figure out why this photo should be a big deal -- bored kid is just playing space-helmet with a plastic bag, and in the vanishingly unlikely event that the kid inhales with enough force to suck the entire bag into the back of her mouth, mom's right there to pull the bag out before the kid suffocates.

But of course what it's really about is the mom's indifference to correcting a misbehavior (putting a plastic bag over one's head) that could be harmful under other circumstances (as when a child is playing unsupervised).

701 Lee Coller  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:02:58pm

re: #675 Charles

OK, better put down any drinks before viewing this site:

[Link: www.peopleofwalmart.com...]

Is Locker in one of them?

702 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:03:07pm

re: #414 Alouette

Have to leave for my son's Sheva Brachos party.

Sheva brachos reminds me of Blue Fringe and their 'Shidduch Song':

On my way downtown I ran into a friend of mine.
She asked, “Are you dating anyone now?”
And I replied with much dismay, “I think that I can safely say
I’m the only one in the whole entire orthodox community my age
not engaged or dating now.”

She said, “How come? Do you wanna get set up?
Do you have someone in mind?”
I shrugged my shoulders, said, “I really don’t got one.”
She said, “Don’t worry cause I will be your shadchan.”

So she called up her friend and she told her all about me.
(Did she decline?) No.
(Didn’t she mind?) I don’t think so.
(Does she wear pants?) I’m not sure.
(Does she shake men’s hands?) Well, let me update…

Chorus:

I got set up on Monday.
We went on the shidduch on Tuesday.
We had the l’chayim by Wednesday.
OnlySimchas Thursday and Friday, and Shabbos.
The wedding's on Sunday.

Sheva brachos Monday.
More sheva brachos on Tuesday.
We got sheva brachos on Wednesday,
sheva brachos Thursday and Friday and Shabbos,
move to Teaneck on Sunday.

(Did you book a hall?) Not yet.
(Shaytel or fall?) Don’t know what she’ll get.
(How long did it take?) 3 dates.
(Why the delay?) Well, let me update…

-Chorus

703 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:05:14pm

re: #422 Locker

Funny you mention that but I have a similar reaction. I've seriously been expecting a MadTV type spoof of those commercials where the bad guy pauses for the alarm then continues to go after the "mom" while bopping along to the alarm sound... or simply just keep on coming...

I'm not saying an alarm is a bad idea. I just hate that same "mom clutching the frightened kid saying it will all be ok because of brinks" ending. It's moronic.

Also, do any of them feature a man hitting the alarm button?

704 The Left  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:07:15pm

re: #597 LudwigVanQuixote


Many many student homework papers to burn for warmth if needs be.

HA!

Ludwig, do you know Acephalous? Very funny academic blog.

On grading as a text adventure

705 The Left  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:09:01pm

re: #690 debutaunt

Boy, it would have been great having you here then, to point out all of that mean dem stuff, but alas, just a recent lizard.

Sorry buddy. I'm happy to bash what the Dems do now, and often do. That's the way it is.

706 MJ  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:09:53pm

re: #699 Thanos

Not wholly true. Teddy Roosevelt.

Also, the EPA came into existence in 1970 under President Nixon's stewardship.

707 Pianobuff  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:10:03pm

Excerpt from the speech:

"I am not the first President to take up this cause, but I am determined to be the last."

Does anyone besides me find this to be a very strange statement, I mean really bizarre?

708 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:11:00pm
709 flyers1974  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:11:41pm

re: #689 Desert Dog

That is an interesting idea, but I cannot see either side agreeing to it. It used to be that Democrats and Republicans could agree on things when the shooting starts. Of course, the wars that we have been entangled in since 1945 have not been as clear cut as previous conflicts. We had no choice in WWII...WWI we did, but both sides rallied around the country. Vietnam? That ripped this country apart. Gulf War I was too short and Gulf War II is turning out to be too long. I just get very upset when either side starts using a conflict to make political hay. If the Republican suddenly started ripping Obama like the Dems did Bush over Iraq or Afghanistan, I would be just as upset.

It was a semi-serious suggestion as I recall, I don't think its on anyone's radar. Agree about the Vietnam War ripping the country apart, although I think there is more to the picture - society was changing so much anyway and with that, all the issues that come with it.

710 Bagua  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:14:25pm

re: #708 snapped shot

Don't let the door hit you on the way out...

711 debutaunt  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:14:51pm

re: #705 iceweasel

Sorry buddy. I'm happy to bash what the Dems do now, and often do. That's the way it is.

I know, but think of what could have been. Damn timing.

712 Bloodnok  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:15:08pm

re: #710 Bagua

Don't let the door hit you on the way out...

No, let it. This guy's a creep.

713 Lee Coller  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:15:31pm

Flounce!

714 Bagua  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:15:39pm

re: #708 snapped shot

The Eagle has flounced.

715 The Left  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:16:55pm

re: #708 snapped shot

supporting Barack Obama's Troofers (in which Ace won, by the way).

B.

I gather B stands for Bizzarro World at this point, where everything is always the opposite of how it is in our universe.

716 Bagua  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:17:43pm

re: #708 snapped shot

Interesting that he conceals his true feeling until the flounce, yet was pretending so hard to be "neutral" up threat.

Intellectual dishonesty.

717 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:20:24pm

re: #668 HoosierHoops

the little fellah is great in a stew I am told

718 The Left  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:20:31pm

re: #711 debutaunt

I know, but think of what could have been. Damn timing.

We can't always get what we want...but at least I'm here with you now. :)

719 Bagua  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:21:24pm

threatthread

720 Throbert McGee  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:23:50pm

re: #708 snapped shot

Keep up the McCarthyite purging, my friend. That is, if you have time between exposing "scary" creationists (who are clearly responsible for more bombings per week than any other group in history) and supporting Barack Obama's Troofers (in which Ace won, by the way).

Don't call Charles a McCarthyite, you slippery varmint.

721 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:28:34pm

that people of wal-mart thingie would have the UBER LIBERAL UNIVERISTIY CHATTING CLASS
ROFLTHEIRAO

of course they would think it is funny because they think they are better than I am.

722 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:30:10pm

re: #708 snapped shot

So, it was the work to expose the creationists' plans to put religion in public schools that pissed you off?

723 The Left  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:32:17pm

re: #721 yochanan

that people of wal-mart thingie would have the UBER LIBERAL UNIVERISTIY CHATTING CLASS
ROFLTHEIRAO

of course they would think it is funny because they think they are better than I am.

Quite a few people here found it hilarious, and if you imagine they are all laughing at you, that says more about your insecurities than anyone's sense of humour. Unless it's that yours is lacking.

724 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:34:16pm

re: #702 SanFranciscoZionist

My favorite Shidduch joke:

Rebitzen Gilda: Ohhh... I have such a girl for you!

Young Man: Really? Is she pretty?

RG: And she is sooo smart. She just finished her degree in accounting! I know that isn't like a doctor, but you're no rocket scientist yourself...

YM: Ohhh, that's impressive, but, is she pretty?

RG: And did I mention that she can cook? Ohhh such a good cook she is, she'll put some meat on your bones. You're sooo skinny.

YM: Well, I do like good cooking, but, well, ma'am, is she pretty?

RG: She comes from such a good family too...

YM: Rebitzen, would you fix up your son with her?

RG: You are not my son.

725 The Left  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:36:46pm

re: #707 Pianobuff

Excerpt from the speech:

"I am not the first President to take up this cause, but I am determined to be the last."

Does anyone besides me find this to be a very strange statement, I mean really bizarre?

It only means that he intends to see the cause is fulfilled under him, not that he intends to declare himself Kenyan Dictator for Life.

726 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:38:49pm

re: #708 snapped shot

There's that flounce we knew was in the wings! Bye now.

727 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:39:40pm

aohell has a ignore feature sort of wish LGF had such a thing they used to have this in the old lizard lounge. since there are some in here who i know don't like me and i am no more interested in there opinions of me than i am of what hamas thinks of me either.

728 Pianobuff  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:41:13pm

re: #725 iceweasel

It only means that he intends to see the cause is fulfilled under him, not that he intends to declare himself Kenyan Dictator for Life.

Yeah - I posted to the wrong thread. As I mentioned in the next thread, I get the intention and it's the sentiment I'd would be trying to get across were I in his position with his objectives.

Don't worry, I'm not paranoid. I just think his speechwriter mangled this horribly.

729 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:42:50pm

re: #727 yochanan

It's tough, but you have to do it manually. Scroll wheel. Set it on "fast."

730 yochanan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:44:56pm

re: #729 wrenchwench

but i might mis your posts that way and I don't want to do that.

731 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 4:46:32pm

re: #730 yochanan

{yo}

732 Coracle  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 5:27:27pm

re: #614 yochanan

frankly after what the donks did to the past occupant i will wait till the next one is in office to show the required respect.

Unless s/he's also a "donk", no doubt.

733 [deleted]  Sun, Sep 13, 2009 9:12:45am
734 jaunte  Sun, Sep 13, 2009 9:14:29am

re: #733 PHNTMLRD

Wise choice, better spend some time checking under your bed for jihadis.


This article has been archived.
Comments are closed.

Jump to top

Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2016-01-01 10:29 am PST
LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds Tweet

Help support Little Green Footballs!

Subscribe now for ad-free access!Register and sign in to a free LGF account before subscribing, and your ad-free access will be automatically enabled.

Donate with
PayPal
Square Cash Shop at amazon
as an LGF Associate!
Recent PagesClick to refresh
HAVASI — the Storm — Premiere at the Franz Liszt Academy of Music Havasi is a Hungarian composer known for building cultural bridges through music (note the Taiko drummers used for this.) This video was recorded at the world premiere of 'HAVASI Symphonic' at the Franz Liszt Academy of Music in Budapest ...
Thanos
10 hours, 24 minutes ago
Views: 120 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 3 •
Better Days Are Coming - Jimmy CliffI can't think of a better song to mark the official end of the Trump era.
thecommodore
1 day, 8 hours ago
Views: 249 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 0 •
#Thegreatpoolpondconversion - 210117We were a bit short of top soil to finish off the jasmine bed. Not enough for another truckload (thank goodness) so we bought a pallet of 65 bags and had it delivered. Two bags of soil conditioner and about ...
Dangerman
3 days, 17 hours ago
Views: 519 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 5
Tweets: 0 •
David Bowie - Tryin’ to Get to Heaven (Official Audio) Official audio for David Bowie's cover version of @Bob Dylan's Tryin' To Get To Heaven released to mark what would have been David's 74th birthday on the 8th January 2021. Subscribe now: bit.ly Watch David Bowie's official music videos ...
Thanos
3 days, 22 hours ago
Views: 470 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 1
Tweets: 1 •
Kings of Leon - 100,000 People (Visualizer) Kings of Leon // When You See Yourself // The New Album Available March 5Feat. “100,000 People” & “The Bandit” // Listen: smarturl.it Pre-Order / Pre-Save: smarturl.it Director: Robert Smyth & Casey McGrathCinematographer: Janusz Kaminski Editor: Adam ZuckermanColor: Tom ...
Thanos
3 days, 22 hours ago
Views: 478 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
Tweets: 3 •
Mogwai - Ritchie Sacramento (Official Video) The official music video for Mogwai – Richie Sacramento, the second single taken from 'As The Love Continues', you can pre-order it at store.mogwai.scot CreditsDirector and build : Sam Wiehl (vimeo.com)Editor : Kit MonteithSpecial thanks to Polyphoria, Aglobex, NatureManufacture ...
Thanos
4 days, 11 hours ago
Views: 686 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 1 •
Amanda Shires - That’s All (Official Lyric Video)Music video by Amanda Shires performing That's All (Official Lyric Video). (C) 2020 Silver Knife Records marketed and distributed by Thirty Tigers vevo.ly
Thanos
5 days, 19 hours ago
Views: 827 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Tweets: 1 •
The KLF - Justified & Ancient (Official Video)The KLF - Justified & Ancient (Official Video) An Atlas AdventureDirected by Bill ButtKLF Communications Listen to Solid State Logik 1: smarturl.it
Thanos
6 days, 8 hours ago
Views: 850 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 1
Tweets: 3 •
Freddie Washington 2010 KSBR Bash If you listen to music at all, then you've heard Freddie & probably liked it. He's played or toured with Herbie Hancock, Michael Jackson, Al Jarreau, Aaron Neville, Lionel Richie, Anita Baker, B.B. King, Elton John, Stevie Wonder, Whitney ...
Thanos
6 days, 22 hours ago
Views: 832 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
Tweets: 4 •
Barry Gibb - Too Much Heaven (Visualizer) Ft. Alison Krauss ‘GREENFIELDS The Gibb Brothers Songbook, Vol. 1’ out now: barrygibb.lnk.to Listen to more Barry Gibb here: barrygibb.lnk.to... Socials -Facebook: facebook.com...Twitter: @GibbBarryInstagram: instagram.com... #barrygibb #greenfields Music video by Barry Gibb performing Too Much Heaven (Visualizer). A Capitol Records Release; © ...
Thanos
1 week ago
Views: 1,332 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 2
Tweets: 4 •