GOP Health Care Speaker: A Birther

Weird • Views: 2,031

Remember this video, showing Republican politicians who’ve signed on to the Birther madness?

Youtube Video

Guess who appears at about 30 seconds in, saying he believes “there are questions” about Barack Obama’s citizenship?

Rep. Charles Boustany, who delivered the GOP response to President Obama’s health care speech.

(Hat tip: Gus 802.)

UPDATE at 9/9/09 8:50:59 pm:

Not only is Rep. Boustany a Birther — he’s one of the original co-sponsors of the dreaded death panel section of the health care bill!

Jump to bottom

270 comments
1 researchok  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:53:47pm

The GOP’s very own Cynthia McKinney.

2 Bob Dillon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:53:51pm

He probably volunteered to do it.

3 Baier  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:54:22pm

good grief.

4 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:54:32pm

Oh POOP! Guess GOP vetting is about as god as White House these days -
BOTH LOUSY!

-S-

5 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:54:55pm

Great. Another GOP response, another tainted speaker.

[facepalm]

6 itellu3times  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:55:26pm

He gave a very good speech.

The only problem is, it was his speech, and not really a party speech.

And the Democrats aren’t going to care anyway.

7 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:55:38pm

Actually, he’s at 0:27

:)

8 noshariaincanada  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:55:50pm

someone’s opinion on issue A being questionable now should make them unqualified to speak on issue B, right?

9 cronus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:56:48pm

This isn’t a defense of Boustany, but I believe he has retracted that statement.

10 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:56:49pm

re: #7 Gus 802

Actually, he’s at 0:27

:)

I know — it’s corrected now. Thanks for the tip, by the way. I thought he looked familiar.

11 Baier  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:57:11pm

Instructions for GOP to retake house.
1) Take Gun
2) Shoot foot
3) Repeat

What the? The “You lie!” a-hole and this idiot really rockin it for the GOP tonight!

12 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:57:31pm

re: #8 noshariaincanada

Would you take financial advise from someone who thought the moonlanding was a hoax?
Would you go to a doctor who spends his spare time being abducted by aliens?

13 itellu3times  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:58:11pm

I have some free advice for the Republicans.

Focus on one (1) issue at a time.

Put ten or so on the table, but take them one (1) at a time.

Of the four that Boustany mentioned, propose them one (1) at a time.

14 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:58:13pm

re: #10 Charles

I know — it’s corrected now. Thanks for the tip, by the way. I thought he looked familiar.

OK and you’re welcome. Was looking for some backgrounder on him and ran into this at another site.

15 rain of lead  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:58:19pm

hey I know
how about some new pictures from hubblespace butterfly
cats eye
whirl of fortune

16 reine.de.tout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:58:34pm

Another interesting factoid:
Boustany was a co-sponsor of the “death panel” provisions.

17 researchok  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:58:34pm

The good news is that he does not appear to have taken credit for any exorcisms.

I suppose that’s progress in Louisiana politics.

18 jaunte  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:58:52pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

“But there’s only a tiny, tiny bit of shit in the sandwich.”

19 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:59:06pm

Is there one, sane, reasonable republican we could put up for a rebuttal?

Just one?

20 reine.de.tout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:59:18pm

re: #19 Sharmuta

Is there one, sane, reasonable republican we could put up for a rebuttal?

Just one?

Not in Louisiana.

21 Danny  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 7:59:54pm

It’s possible Boustany is/was a birther, but “I think there are questions” and “it’s certainly being looked at” is somewhat ambiguous evidence of that.

22 researchok  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:00:14pm

re: #19 Sharmuta

Is there one, sane, reasonable republican we could put up for a rebuttal?

Just one?

The only one I can think of is from NY and wore a dress.

23 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:00:34pm

re: #16 reine.de.tout

Another interesting factoid:
Boustany was a co-sponsor of the “death panel” provisions.

Irony. That’s enough to make my head spin.

24 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:00:46pm

Considering that an “Impeachable Offense” for a US President is more or less what “Congress Says It Is.” The ‘Nirther Movement seems to me an end run against the idea/language of “High Crimes and Misdemeanors,” for ridding the Nation of a Rotten, Sitting and Alive Elected President. Leave it there, that is all.

-S-

25 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:01:07pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

Would you go to a doctor who spends his spare time being abducted by aliens?

Only if he were a proctologist. I mean, you’d think he’d be really sympathetic, right?
/

26 reine.de.tout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:01:34pm

re: #23 Gus 802

Irony. That’s enough to make my head spin.

It is, isn’t it?
Time for me to get my beautimous sleep.
See ya’ll tomorrow, I hope.

27 noshariaincanada  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:01:37pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

invalid points killgore. I take each statement made at its own face value. I also pay attention to credibility of those making statements, but I do not drive the overall credibility of an individual to zero if i disagree with one aspect of their worldview.
But that’s just me.

28 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:02:02pm

re: #16 reine.de.tout

Another interesting factoid:
Boustany was a co-sponsor of the “death panel” provisions.

Here’s the USA Today article linked on that page:

End-of-life counseling had bipartisan support

29 laxmatt1984  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:03:10pm

I honestly have to say I’m surprised that you (Charles) are surprised at the intensity of opposition to Obama as well as the fact that false rumors gain traction in American politics.

I’m not trying to be disrespectful, but how long have you paid day-to-day attention to politics? Because this is nothing new. Heck, in 1800 Thomas Jefferson hired scandal monger James Callender to publish lies and innuendo against John Adams (Jefferson - according to Callender - then refused to pay up. So Callender starting printing “crazy lies” about Jefferson - including he fathered a child by his slave, Sally Hemmings. Callender then mysteriously wound up dead in the James River.)

My point is is that American democracy - like all democracies - is incredibly messy. Yes, falsehoods gain traction but that has been the case the past 200 some years. The partisans will always yell the loudest, but it’s not cause to fear for the Republic.

I’m rambling. Anyway, did you really expect the GOP to run a suave, urbane, sophisticated opposition?

30 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:03:37pm

re: #21 Danny

It’s possible Boustany is/was a birther, but “I think there are questions” and “it’s certainly being looked at” is somewhat ambiguous evidence of that.

The only response to that question is, “Yes I believe Barack Obama is a US citizen.”

If you say, “There are questions!!!” — you’re either a Birther yourself, or you are pandering to them for political gain.

I’m not sure which of those two possibilities is more repugnant.

31 Bacchus's daddy  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:03:59pm

They found a reasonable (R) by the end of the vid. Certainly not the only one out there, but the Beck-ification of the party has been tragic.

32 jaunte  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:04:04pm

re: #28 Gus 802

Here’s the USA Today article linked on that page:

End-of-life counseling had bipartisan support

Rep. Charles Boustany, R-La., a heart surgeon and a co-sponsor of the counseling bill, says the legislation is aimed at promoting important discussions between doctors and their patients about critical end-of-life issues, such as having a living will. He says those discussions are a “good medical practice,” and doctors who spend time counseling their patients about their wishes should be reimbursed through the Medicare system, as the legislation allows.

33 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:04:11pm

re: #29 laxmatt1984

I honestly have to say I’m surprised that you (Charles) are surprised at the intensity of opposition to Obama as well as the fact that false rumors gain traction in American politics.

When did I say I was surprised?

34 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:04:53pm

re: #31 Bacchus’s daddy

They found a reasonable (R) by the end of the vid. Certainly not the only one out there, but the Beck-ification of the party has been tragic.

Sorry, but that “reasonable (R)” has now changed his mind and has signed on to the Birther bandwagon.

35 jorline  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:05:45pm

Holy crap…I voting for myself from now on.

36 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:06:01pm

Is there a link to Boustany’s response?

37 cronus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:07:08pm

re: #36 Spare O’Lake

Is there a link to Boustany’s response?

[Link: abcnews.go.com…]

38 Danny  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:07:09pm

re: #30 Charles

The video doesn’t show the first question. It starts with Boustany saying “it’s certainly being looked at.” The second question 2-part, the second of which is “do you think there are quetions here?” Again, he may very well be a birther, but to my mind, this just isn’t clear evidence.

39 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:07:19pm

re: #30 Charles

The only response to that question is, “Yes I believe Barack Obama is a US citizen.”

If you say, “There are questions!!!” — you’re either a Birther yourself, or you are pandering to them for political gain.

I’m not sure which of those two possibilities is more repugnant.

Charles -

YES I BELEIVE that Pres. Obama is a US Citizen, by virtue of his stipulated to MOTHER being a US CITIZEN - as was GEORGE ROMNEY, and JOHN SYDNEY McCAIN III. End of story, that is all.

-S-

40 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:07:45pm

re: #30 Charles

The only response to that question is, “Yes I believe Barack Obama is a US citizen.”

If you say, “There are questions!!!” — you’re either a Birther yourself, or you are pandering to them for political gain.

I’m not sure which of those two possibilities is more repugnant.

I’d say the latter is worse. The crazy who actually believes the nirth nonsense is at least acting out of conviction, rather than pandering for political gain.

41 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:08:06pm

re: #27 noshariaincanada

I don’t consider buying into troofer crap to simply be an aspect of a person’s world view.

Either you are a gullible idiot, or you are not.

42 theuglydougling  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:08:09pm

Dammit. Dammit dammit dammit. Why? WHY?

Stupid nirthers.

43 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:08:13pm

re: #29 laxmatt1984

Anyway, did you really expect the GOP to run a suave, urbane, sophisticated opposition?

Apparently it’s too much to expect the GOP to have sophistication- and yet we wonder why we get our asses handed to us in elections and by the media.

Yes- I do expect the GOP to have some sophistication, but apparently I, and others, will remain disappointed. I have high expectations of the party of Reagan- I guess you don’t?

44 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:08:24pm

re: #26 reine.de.tout

It is, isn’t it?
Time for me to get my beautimous sleep.
See ya’ll tomorrow, I hope.

Have a good one.

45 Baier  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:08:49pm

re: #39 Dr. Shalit

Charles -

YES I BELEIVE that Pres. Obama is a US Citizen, by virtue of his stipulated to MOTHER being a US CITIZEN - as was GEORGE ROMNEY, and JOHN SYDNEY McCAIN III. End of story, that is all.

-S-

Forget all that. What about the fact that the state of Hawaii has a birth certificate proving he was born on US soil? He is US born. He is a US citizen.

47 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:10:29pm

re: #27 noshariaincanada

invalid points killgore. I take each statement made at its own face value. I also pay attention to credibility of those making statements, but I do not drive the overall credibility of an individual to zero if i disagree with one aspect of their worldview.
But that’s just me.

Absolutely right! Killgore I find much disagreement with you, but that does not cause me to discount all you have to offer.

48 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:10:35pm

re: #37 cronus

[Link: abcnews.go.com…]

Thank you very much.

49 Adrenalyn  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:10:45pm

and Charlie Sheen is a truther
today he demanded a meeting with 0bama to discuss it

[Link: www.foxnews.com…]

50 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:11:11pm

re: #40 Dark_Falcon

Dark_Falcon -

The “POLITICAL GAIN” would only be the removal of a POTUS that they (AND I) oppose. Seems like a gain to me unless one considers the successor.

-S

51 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:11:13pm

re: #49 Adrenalyn

and Charlie Sheen is a truther
today he demanded a meeting with 0bama to discuss it

[Link: www.foxnews.com…]

That’s not even remotely news.

52 Kronocide  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:11:21pm

We’re truly F-ed. From both sides.

53 Bacchus's daddy  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:11:23pm

re: #34 Charles

Sorry, but that “reasonable (R)” has now changed his mind and has signed on to the Birther bandwagon.



*reeling from shot to the solar plexus*

54 Ojoe  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:11:38pm

re: #43 Sharmuta

The shame is that the GOP is the party of Lincoln, and the Democrats were the copperheads in the Civil War, and even voted along party lines against the 13th amendment, once.

(I read that last one in the book “Team of Rivals”)

55 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:12:46pm

re: #47 unrealizedviewpoint

Absolutely right! Killgore I find much disagreement with you, but that does not cause me to discount all you have to offer.

I think the difference is in the ability to review evidence and arrive at a decent conclusion vs. believing in unsubstantiated conspiracy theories.

When you’re talking about conspiratorial thinking- you might just wonder where else a person is unable to reasonably think.

56 Drogheda  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:12:49pm

re: #51 Charles

That’s not even remotely news.

Did you notice who they’re linking to?

57 spirochete  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:13:20pm

I believe Obama is a US citizen simply because the Democratic party wouldn’t have blown their money on someone who could so easily be bounced out. I am fairly sure the Clintons would have looked at that in detail. Hell, they probably have the original certifikit.

58 jaunte  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:13:39pm

Charlie Sheen and Prisonplanets agree.

59 MandyManners  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:13:57pm

re: #49 Adrenalyn

and Charlie Sheen is a truther
today he demanded a meeting with 0bama to discuss it

[Link: www.foxnews.com…]

Prisonplanet?!

60 Kronocide  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:14:03pm

All your PrisonPlanets are belong to us.

61 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:14:09pm

re: #56 Drogheda

Did you notice who they’re linking to?

Oh my goodness.

Fox News and prisonplanet.com, together at last.

62 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:14:28pm

re: #36 Spare O’Lake

Is there a link to Boustany’s response?

Youtube Video
63 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:14:39pm

re: #57 spirochete

I believe Obama is a US citizen simply because the Democratic party wouldn’t have blown their money on someone who could so easily be bounced out. I am fairly sure the Clintons would have looked at that in detail. Hell, they probably have the original certifikit.

Totally agree. If there was any shred of truth to it- the Clintons would have found it and used it, beyond a shadow of a doubt.

64 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:14:50pm

re: #50 Dr. Shalit

Dark_Falcon -

The “POLITICAL GAIN” would only be the removal of a POTUS that they (AND I) oppose. Seems like a gain to me unless one considers the successor.

-S

Not really. All but the truly nutty know that the nirth cert angle will never actually see Obama removed. They just say they believe it because their base likes the story. That cozying up to the base is the political gain.

65 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:15:10pm

re: #61 Charles

Oh my goodness.

Fox News and prisonplanet.com, together at last.

I thought Napolitano already did that?

66 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:15:38pm

re: #54 Ojoe

Ojoe -

Remember that the US Civil War was originally fought to maintain the Union, NOT for Emancipation. Had the Confederacy folded sometime in 1862, Slavery might well have continued into the 1880’s or ‘90’s. It certainly DID in Brazil.

-S-

67 Adrenalyn  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:15:39pm

point is:

both sides have loons, still
and some issues will not go away

68 MandyManners  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:15:48pm
Still, Richards used his beliefs about 9/11 as proof for a judge that he was “delusional.” She later sought and received a restraining order against him.

Trutherism as mental instability.

69 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:16:22pm

re: #60 BigPapa

All your PrisonPlanets are belong to us.

You Jonesites have no hope for escape. Make your time!!

Ha ha ha!!

70 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:16:55pm

re: #64 Dark_Falcon

Dark_Falcon -

AND - all in - ALL its still Horse Hockey.

-S-

71 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:17:09pm

re: #61 Charles

Oh my goodness.

Fox News and prisonplanet.com, together at last.

Fox News jumps yet another shark!

Here’s the text for those that didn’t click the link:

RELATED: Click here to read Sheen’s hypothetical sit-down with Obama at PrisonPlanet.com

FULL REPORT: Click here to read more from PrisonPlanet.com

Only on FoxNews!

/

72 Flyers1974  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:17:24pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

Would you take financial advise from someone who thought the moonlanding was a hoax?
Would you go to a doctor who spends his spare time being abducted by aliens?

Has it even been proven that the moon exists?

Youtube Video
73 Adrenalyn  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:17:39pm

re: #68 MandyManners

Trutherism as mental instability.

yes, and some people need to get over:
Bush planned it
Chappaquiddick
Birth certificate
Abu Ghraib

74 The Shadow Do  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:17:45pm

This will come as a deep shock to some, but there are politicians who are not panderers.

I’ll spot you Jimmuy Stuart, ya’ll go from there…

75 Bacchus's daddy  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:18:31pm

So we have one party launching a socialist blitzkreg on our economy. And an unfortunate by-product of the two-party system, is that opposition to this socialism must coalesce around a party that panders to evangelicals and conspiracy-addled troglodytes.

76 Kronocide  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:19:29pm

Alex Jones, he da bomb
all your bwainz, he go nom
if Bush, Cheney, all the same
Powerbrokers, all to blame
Don’t forget he figured it out
That’s the reason fo’ scream and shout

77 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:19:31pm

Charles, did you see the LGF poster link earlier tonite from American Thinker where a brand new long form Nirth Certificate surfaced and they challenged you by name to investigate it. I’m sure you’ll get right on that. / Oh did I mention the source of the nirth certificate was the formidable Whirled Nut Daily. jeesh.

Charles Johnson of Little Green Footballs did some admirable work on Dan Rather’s Memogate, primarily by duplicating Rather’s “memo” in Microsoft Word. Since Charles Johnson is now critical of what he calls “Nirthers”, he would be the perfect person to investigate the authenticity of this new document. Have at it, Charles! Please let us know what you find.
78 NukeAtomrod  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:19:40pm

Fraaack! This guy made a non-committal statement about the citizenship status of some guy he probably never met, let alone looked over his birth records. He’s obviously a complete loony who should be disregarded when he talks about health care reform. Never mind that he’s an honest-to-god heart surgeon. Didn’t you hear what he said? I think there are questions, we’ll have to see. Holy sheet! He’s C-R-A-Z-Y! Everybody run, he’s got a scalpel!

/

79 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:19:53pm

re: #70 Dr. Shalit

Dark_Falcon -

AND - all in - ALL its still Horse Hockey.

-S-

And on that we entirely agree, friend.

80 cronus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:20:19pm

I actually thought Boustany was reasonably effective tonight. The responder role has several natural disadvantages. He was also probably helped by the fact that Jindal was a widely recognized flop so the bar was already pretty low.

81 yesandno  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:20:29pm

A fact that is often forgotten is that a whole bunch of people don’t know what constitutes being a natural born citizen. Most never fully explained how that relates to people born out of the country, but with American parents or single parent.

Therefore, when one questions things like born out of the US to US parents, there is misinformation that sucks people in. Same with children born in the US whose parents aren’t US citizens. Confusing to many.

82 sagehen  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:20:36pm

re: #19 Sharmuta

Is there one, sane, reasonable republican we could put up for a rebuttal?

Just one?

Maybe that’s the real reason Huntsman got the ambassador job — gets him out of the country and away from the cameras.

83 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:20:36pm

re: #75 Bacchus’s daddy

…evangelicals and conspiracy-addled troglodytes.

Elvis is Jesus and he Lives!

///

84 avanti  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:20:42pm

re: #11 Baier

Instructions for GOP to retake house.
1) Take Gun
2) Shoot foot
3) Repeat

What the? The “You lie!” a-hole and this idiot really rockin it for the GOP tonight!


Headline from Japan News:

Obama urges Congress for action on health care; Rep Wilson calls him a liar

Japan News.

This story is taking off .

85 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:21:20pm

And now we have a number of sleepers showing up to bash Dr. Stephen Barrett of Quackwatch in the thread about his new site, posting links to the bogus sites started by his quack enemies.

86 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:21:30pm

re: #80 cronus

I actually thought Boustany was reasonably effective tonight. The responder role has several natural disadvantages. He was also probably helped by the fact that Jindal was a widely recognized flop so the bar was already pretty low.

Yeah- it really couldn’t get lower than Jindal.

87 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:21:30pm

The three most popular books in Guantanamo Bay

The ever inspiring Marbury points out that there are now 13,500 books in the library at Guantanamo Bay, serving the remaining 229 prisoners.

And when the London based, pan-Arab daily Al-Hayat sent a reporter out there recently, he asked the librarian, in what must have been a fairly surreal encounter, which books were requested most frequently.

So we now know the most popular read material among the Guantanamo prisoners. The three most requested book, followed up by a string of Muslim religious volumes, are apparently:

1) The Harry Potter novels

2) Cervantes’ Don Quixote

3) Barack Obama’s Dreams from my Father

88 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:21:45pm

re: #75 Bacchus’s daddy

So we have one party launching a socialist blitzkreg on our economy. And an unfortunate by-product of the two-party system, is that opposition to this socialism must coalesce around a party that panders to evangelicals and conspiracy-addled troglodytes.

Bacchus’s Daddy -

Though I believe that the “Other Party” (As of 2008, My Party) is far less pandering than you may, unfortunately, YES.

-S-

89 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:22:09pm

re: #77 Mich-again

Charles, did you see the LGF poster link earlier tonite from American Thinker where a brand new long form Nirth Certificate surfaced and they challenged you by name to investigate it. I’m sure you’ll get right on that. / Oh did I mention the source of the nirth certificate was the formidable Whirled Nut Daily. jeesh.

Oh, give me a freaking break.

American Thinker is off my links for garbage like that. Morons.

90 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:22:11pm

Here is a note of sanity from the man that was rejected as a RINO -

House Democratic Whip James Clyburn (D-S.C.) called Wilson’s outburst “embarrassing,” while McCain said it was “totally disrespectful” and that there was “no place for it in that setting or any other.”

McCain said Wilson “should apologize for it immediately.”

And it looks like Wilson has apologized.

[Link: thehill.com…]

91 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:22:49pm

re: #67 Adrenalyn

Sheen = Hollywood actor
Boustany = Republican Congressman

The comparison really isn’t valid.

92 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:23:00pm

re: #78 NukeAtomrod

Fraaack! This guy made a non-committal statement about the citizenship status of some guy he probably never met, let alone looked over his birth records. He’s obviously a complete loony who should be disregarded when he talks about health care reform. Never mind that he’s an honest-to-god heart surgeon. Didn’t you hear what he said? I think there are questions, we’ll have to see. Holy sheet! He’s C-R-A-Z-Y! Everybody run, he’s got a scalpel!

/

I agree. He’s crazy. Either that or pandering like a dog.

93 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:23:34pm

re: #80 cronus

I actually thought Boustany was reasonably effective tonight. The responder role has several natural disadvantages. He was also probably helped by the fact that Jindal was a widely recognized flop so the bar was already pretty low.

Well, birther though he is, he did much better than Jindal. Also, that one clip is probably not enough to discredit him. He could always claim that the subsequent annoucements by the state of Hawaii have convinced him Obama is an American. He’d be weaseling, but that not a hard task for a congresscritter.

/spits on congress

94 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:23:40pm

Boustany’s speech tonight was pretty darn good - short and to the point.

95 Adrenalyn  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:24:21pm

re: #91 Slumbering Behemoth

Sheen = Hollywood actor
Boustany = Republican Congressman

The comparison really isn’t valid.

Senator Al Franken

96 Racer X  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:24:23pm

Our loons are turning out to be way more entertaining than your loons.

97 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:25:17pm

Amazing.

Hey, his speech was great! Never mind that he’s a Birther! Who cares?

98 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:25:18pm

re: #95 Adrenalyn

Senator Al Franken

Every deck has a joker.

99 J.D.  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:25:39pm

If anyone sees realwest tomorrow, please ask him to e-mail me.
Thanks!

G’night.

100 Kronocide  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:25:45pm

Republicans acting like stereotypical whiny liberals as a successful strategy, revisited:
[Link: www.sfgate.com…]

Yeah, that works!

101 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:25:58pm

re: #86 Sharmuta

Yeah- it really couldn’t get lower than Jindal.

Bachman?

102 cronus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:26:21pm

re: #93 Dark_Falcon

Well, birther though he is, he did much better than Jindal. Also, that one clip is probably not enough to discredit him. He could always claim that the subsequent annoucements by the state of Hawaii have convinced him Obama is an American. He’d be weaseling, but that not a hard task for a congresscritter.

/spits on congress

The previews of his remarks that I read say that he “retracted” his flirtation with Birtherism. As of yet though I can’t find the actual retraction.

103 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:26:55pm

re: #90 karmic_inquisitor

Here is a note of sanity from the man that was rejected as a RINO -

And it looks like Wilson has apologized.

[Link: thehill.com…]

John McCain once again shows honor and class. Birthers and Birchers are fools he has no patience for. Nor should he, since jerks like that aren’t worthy to tie his shoes.

104 Kronocide  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:27:30pm

re: #97 Charles

Amazing.

Hey, his speech was great! Never mind that he’s a Birther! Who cares?

Works for Robert Spencer LOL.

105 Bacchus's daddy  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:27:39pm

re: #88 Dr. Shalit

Bacchus’s Daddy -

Though I believe that the “Other Party” (As of 2008, My Party) is far less pandering than you may, unfortunately, YES.

-S-

The Republicans of 1994 (Gingrich/’contract w/ america) were a good party. I interned for one of those Reps in ‘94-95. But today- I wonder if there’s ever been a time in our history when party allegiance was more obviously an exercise in choosing the lesser of two evils.

106 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:27:50pm
107 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:27:59pm

re: #101 Slumbering Behemoth

Bachman?

Touch&eacute.

108 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:28:02pm

re: #96 Racer X

Our loons are turning out to be way more entertaining than your loons.

This guy is Sick

109 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:28:22pm

Crap- it worked in preview.

110 Adrenalyn  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:29:10pm

re: #100 BigPapa

Republicans acting like stereotypical whiny liberals as a successful strategy, revisited:
[Link: www.sfgate.com…]

Yeah, that works!


Madame Speaker !
seems to me they were purty durn whiney after 2000
got loud after 2004
in 2006 that strategy paid dividends
2008 - McCain was not viable, I’ll give them a pass

111 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:29:26pm

re: #95 Adrenalyn

Senator Al Franken

I know Franken is an ass, but does he buy into conspiracy mongering, troofer garbage?

112 Dr. Shalit  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:29:26pm

re: #98 jcm

Every deck has a joker.

jcm -

And Every Village has An Idiot, …hmmm?…

-S-

113 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:29:28pm

re: #92 Charles

I agree. He’s crazy. Either that or pandering like a dog.

The point is - who cares! He’s maybe a birther, maybe not - big deal. Not to me.
Does one mistake, or one silly position, disqualify a man from service? Why don’t we listen to his response.

114 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:29:42pm

re: #107 Sharmuta

Touch&eacute.

Try it without the period.

Touché

115 Racer X  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:29:49pm

re: #108 Capitalist Tool

This guy is Sick

Hey! I posted that a few days ago! And yes, he is sick!

116 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:29:50pm

re: #87 NJDhockeyfan

Harry Potter novels freaking ROCK!

117 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:30:04pm

re: #97 Charles

Amazing.

Hey, his speech was great! Never mind that he’s a Birther! Who cares?

We do the best we can with what we’ve got. If asked about the speech, I intend to talk about how good it was and steer the conversation away from Boustany’s birtherism if it comes up. Which is a weasel deal, I admit, but I’m in sales. Weaseling is sometimes part of my job.

118 Racer X  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:30:08pm

re: #109 Sharmuta

Crap- it worked in preview.

In bed

119 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:30:20pm

re: #115 Racer X

Hey! I posted that a few days ago! And yes, he is sick!

great minds?

120 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:30:21pm

re: #114 Gus 802

But it worked in preview.

121 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:30:24pm

re: #113 unrealizedviewpoint

The point is - who cares! He’s maybe a birther, maybe not - big deal. Not to me.
Does one mistake, or one silly position, disqualify a man from service? Why don’t we listen to his response.

Yeah, hey, no big deal that he signs on to a completely insane conspiracy theory! Let’s listen to what he has to say!

122 karmic_inquisitor  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:30:50pm

re: #96 Racer X

Our loons are turning out to be way more entertaining than your loons.

I don’t know - we don’t have giant paper mache puppets (yet).

123 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:30:57pm

re: #112 Dr. Shalit

jcm -

And Every Village has An Idiot, …hmmm?…

-S-

Is Chicago missing one now?

/;-P

124 Adrenalyn  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:31:12pm

re: #111 Slumbering Behemoth

I know Franken is an ass, but does he buy into conspiracy mongering, troofer garbage?

dunno to be honest, but he’s an actor
and I would not be a bit surprised if he too was a troofer

125 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:31:14pm

re: #122 karmic_inquisitor

I don’t know - we don’t have giant paper mache puppets (yet).

Time. Sweet, sweet time.

126 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:31:16pm

re: #120 Sharmuta

But it worked in preview.

Character entities have to end with a semi-colon …

127 Lee Coller  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:31:26pm

Dear Chairman Steele,

I have never in my life been so embarrassed to be a Republican. We have elected officials who pander to those who fail to acknowledge the clear evidence that our president is in fact a natural born US citizen. Some would seem to even believe that. We had a Republican congressman heckle the president during a joint session of congress. We’ve had outright lies told about the president’s healthcare plan. There’s plenty wrong with it that we don’t need to lie about it.

Elected officials in our party have pandered to the far right extremists, from Glenn Beck spouting ridiculous conspiracy theories to Alex Jones and Pat Buchanan.

Its time for the sane part of the Republican Party (if it indeed exists) to speak out with a clear voice.

128 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:31:45pm

re: #126 Charles

But it worked in preview. If it hadn’t worked in preview, I would have corrected it.

129 cronus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:31:48pm

“However, Boustany would later retract his original statement on KPEL and clarify that he does believe that President Obama is a United States citizen.”

[Link: www.lafayettegrapevine.com…]

130 jaunte  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:31:50pm

Touch&echronic

131 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:31:57pm

re: #113 unrealizedviewpoint

I watched some if it. He not important or politically relevant to anything so I find him and his thoughts very dull.

132 Racer X  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:33:07pm

re: #127 Lee Coller

Dear Chairman Steele,

I have never in my life been so embarrassed to be a Republican. We have elected officials who pander to those who fail to acknowledge the clear evidence that our president is in fact a natural born US citizen. Some would seem to even believe that. We had a Republican congressman heckle the president during a joint session of congress. We’ve had outright lies told about the president’s healthcare plan. There’s plenty wrong with it that we don’t need to lie about it.

Elected officials in our party have pandered to the far right extremists, from Glenn Beck spouting ridiculous conspiracy theories to Alex Jones and Pat Buchanan.

Its time for the sane part of the Republican Party (if it indeed exists) to speak out with a clear voice.

Mind if I plagiarize that and send an email to him?

133 sngnsgt  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:33:17pm

Neal Boortz:

Republicans Get Rolled…And Deservedly So

Republicans look like fools.
People now more reluctant to listen to conservative complaints about Obama.

Townhall.com

Mmmm, I don’t think so… Obama’s ‘plan’ scares me even more now.

134 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:33:33pm

re: #124 Adrenalyn

Actually, he is a Senator, and though I can’t stand him personally, I’d be surprised to find that he buys into insipid conspiracy theories.

135 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:33:48pm

I usually do have the semi-colon. For some reason, I didn’t type it tonight, but I didn’t notice the problem, because it worked in preview.

136 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:33:59pm

re: #121 Charles

Yeah, hey, no big deal that he signs on to a completely insane conspiracy theory! Let’s listen to what he has to say!


Did he fill out his Seven-Page-Questionaire?

137 Lee Coller  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:33:59pm

re: #132 Racer X

Mind if I plagiarize that and send an email to him?

Be my guest.

138 Adrenalyn  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:34:17pm

re: #127 Lee Coller

don’t forget

Nancy Pelosi is Speaker of the House

both sides are guilty of this

139 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:34:48pm

re: #89 Charles

American Thinker is off my links for garbage like that. Morons.

Agree with that. That is some real journalism there on their part. Showing some ridiculous document and then challenging others to check it to see if its fake.

140 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:34:55pm

re: #132 Racer X

Mind if I plagiarize that and send an email to him?

We all should.

141 Adrenalyn  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:35:28pm

re: #134 Slumbering Behemoth

Actually, he is a Senator, and though I can’t stand him personally, I’d be surprised to find that he buys into insipid conspiracy theories.

did I not refer to him as Senator Al Franken ?

lemme check…be right back…

142 yesandno  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:35:50pm

The problem with things like this is that we used to believe that people in Congress or professionals and businees execs were probably smarter then we were, more educated. Now we know the awful truth…they aren’t. Even in Harvard, they grade on the curve and some are not on the high side.

So we get people who can’t actually think through anything, or who do think but because they are politicians, they choose stupid over honest a lot of the time.

They are fallible. I am just wondering who…on either side…is not tainted by stupidity once and a while. No one. But do they have to wear their stupidity on their upper arms as a badge of honor?

Goodness, we are doomed.

/And Pawlenty just lost my vote—not because of his odd beliefs (and they surely are enough to reject him), but because he used the word myself as the subject—Myself and others are…etc. Goodness that drives me nuts.

143 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:36:36pm

re: #131 Killgore Trout

I watched some if it. He not important or politically relevant to anything so I find him and his thoughts very dull.

Your review is just as expected, right along party lines. Thanks!

144 Bacchus's daddy  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:36:56pm

re: #138 Adrenalyn

Fair point. Few political gestures in recent memory, IMHO, have been as dishonorable as Pelosi’s pretending to forget that she was briefed about waterboarding.

145 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:37:16pm

re: #97 Charles

Amazing.

Hey, his speech was great! Never mind that he’s a Birther! Who cares?

He’s a birther, but he delivered the official GOP speech tonight about healthcare. Shouldn’t we deal with his healthcare speech if only to give a semblance of even-handedness before swarming him like a pack of hyenas?
Nah, who cares?

146 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:37:58pm

re: #141 Adrenalyn

You said he was an actor. I was making a slight dig at his acting chops.

Very slight, it would seem.

147 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:38:01pm

re: #145 Spare O’Lake

He’s a birther, but he delivered the official GOP speech tonight about healthcare. Shouldn’t we deal with his healthcare speech if only to give a semblance of even-handedness before swarming him like a pack of hyenas?
Nah, who cares?

Yeah, hey! Who cares if he’s a birther? Only idiots would think that affects his credibility.

148 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:38:32pm

re: #145 Spare O’Lake

He’s a birther, but he delivered the official GOP speech tonight about healthcare. Shouldn’t we deal with his healthcare speech if only to give a semblance of even-handedness before swarming him like a pack of hyenas?
Nah, who cares?

The question is… Is this the best face the Republican Party can muster?

149 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:40:41pm

re: #148 Capitalist Tool

The question is… Is this the best face the Republican Party can muster?

They could have just found a doctor out of the phone book to deliver the rebuttal instead and it would have been better. Picking this guy was dumb I don’t care how eloquently he spoke.

150 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:40:48pm

re: #148 Capitalist Tool

The question is… Is this the best face the Republican Party can muster?

Looks like it.

151 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:40:55pm

re: #129 cronus

“However, Boustany would later retract his original statement on KPEL and clarify that he does believe that President Obama is a United States citizen.”

[Link: www.lafayettegrapevine.com…]

Does this mean we can now watch the Congressman’s response in a different light? Or shall we hold it against him for all time?

152 NukeAtomrod  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:40:58pm

re: #97 Charles

Amazing.

Hey, his speech was great! Never mind that he’s a Birther! Who cares?

You know what? If he said, “Obama isn’t an American Citizen” or even “There is a good chance that Obama isn’t an American Citizen.” It would matter. But he didn’t. He just said “we’ll see.” I don’t think that makes him a Birther. It makes him someone that heard that there’s a controversy, but doesn’t care enough to research it and form an opinion. Condemning anyone that says, “I don’t know. Let’s wait and see.” as a lunatic, rubs me the wrong way. It’s stinks of a witch hunt.

The guy does know how to cut open a man’s chest, repair his heart, and put him back together again. Call me crazy, but that’s an adequate resume for giving a speech on health care reform in my opinion. He is an expert on health care, I don’t care if he also entertains the possible existence of ghosts or leprechauns.

153 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:41:14pm

re: #150 Charles

Sad, but true.

154 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:42:13pm

I didn’t watch the speech. Was with some friends.

So; Let me get this straight.

Some farking icehole stood up and said, “You Lie!” to the President of the United States of America?

In front of Congress? In front of America? In front of the World?

Then the corksocker has the audacity to say he was caught up in the moment?

Well, Martha Focker.

Congratulations, you idiot. You just snatched defeat out of the jaws of victory.

Where are they finding these idiots?

155 Lee Coller  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:43:06pm

re: #140 Sharmuta

We all should.

I just sent mine. you can find the email address here:

[Link: www.gop.com…]

156 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:43:08pm

re: #145 Spare O’Lake

Pack of hyenas? Yeah, ‘cuz hyenas are know for giving a crap about things like intellectual honesty and pointing out those who lack it when they buy into troofer crap.

Sheesh.

157 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:43:26pm

re: #155 Lee Coller

I just sent mine. you can find the email address here:

[Link: www.gop.com…]

Thanks!

158 cliffster  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:43:34pm

re: #148 Capitalist Tool

The question is… Is this the best face the Republican Party can muster?

I was wondering why they put anybody up there at all. I’ve always felt like the opposition rebuttal was a sad, pathetic display. Want to show a position of strength? Say, “no thanks” to the offer of a rebuttal.

159 unrealizedviewpoint  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:43:40pm

re: #154 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Yeah FBV, but just seeing Pelosi’s face made it all worth it.
/

160 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:44:11pm

re: #154 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I didn’t watch the speech. Was with some friends.

So; Let me get this straight.

Some farking icehole stood up and said, “You Lie!” to the President of the United States of America?

In front of Congress? In front of America? In front of the World?

Then the corksocker has the audacity to say he was caught up in the moment?

Well, Martha Focker.

Congratulations, you idiot. You just snatched defeat out of the jaws of victory.

Where are they finding these idiots?

We elect them.

161 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:44:24pm

re: #152 NukeAtomrod

Call me crazy, but that’s an adequate resume for giving a speech on health care reform in my opinion.

If all it takes is a doctor, then they could have chosen Ron Paul I guess? But I will refrain from explaining how what Ron Paul did as a doctor applies in the health care debate.

162 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:44:33pm

re: #158 cliffster

I was wondering why they put anybody up there at all. I’ve always felt like the opposition rebuttal was a sad, pathetic display. Want to show a position of strength? Say, “no thanks” to the offer of a rebuttal.

Rove- that you?

163 Bacchus's daddy  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:44:36pm

re: #149 Mich-again

They could have just found a doctor out of the phone book to deliver the rebuttal instead and it would have been better. Picking this guy was dumb I don’t care how eloquently he spoke.

The Republicans need someone like Chuckie K (Krauthammer). Unfortunately, his medical condition and his personal character (admirably) probably preclude him from ever seeking office.

164 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:44:39pm

re: #160 jcm

We elect them.

Who is this “we” you speak of?

165 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:44:57pm

re: #148 Capitalist Tool

The question is… Is this the best face the Republican Party can muster?


This has been known for days. I don’t think the Republicans care anymore. The see Sarah Palin’s death Panel lie as a victory. Conservatives are talking more about adopting Alinksy’s Rules for Radicals. This is what they want. NIrthers, truthers, Birchers, Paulians, White Nationalists, are all welcome as long as they are waving a Larouche Obama=Hitler sign, nobody cares.

166 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:44:57pm

re: #154 Fat Bastard Vegetarian


Where are they finding these idiots?

On ballots, apparently.

:sigh:

167 Chekote  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:45:46pm

Just for the record I posted this story at 10:30 this morning.

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]

168 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:45:55pm

Some additional thought. It’s ironic and a double standard that the Republicans would pick Charles Boustany who was also part of bipartisan effort that created the end-of-life panels that were wound up being a strong part of the “death panel” meme from most Republicans. On the night of the speech, all those that opposed these so called death panels were listening to the man that worked with Rep. Earl Blumenauer, D-Ore, a liberal Democrat no less to create said amendment:

Rep. Charles Boustany, R-La., a heart surgeon and a co-sponsor of the counseling bill, says the legislation is aimed at promoting important discussions between doctors and their patients about critical end-of-life issues, such as having a living will. He says those discussions are a “good medical practice,” and doctors who spend time counseling their patients about their wishes should be reimbursed through the Medicare system, as the legislation allows.

Now, Boustany says proponents may have to “back off” and reconsider the issue “at some point when the temperature had cooled down.”

“Frankly, this thing got really out of hand,” he says.

Rep. Earl Blumenauer, D-Ore., sponsor of the measure, says he’s flabbergasted at the turn the debate has taken. “It’s just beyond bizarre,” he said. “At every point along the process, I got broad agreement from Democrats and Republicans alike.”

When Blumenauer introduced the legislation in April, his co-sponsors included Republican Reps. Patrick Tiberi of Ohio, Geoff Davis of Kentucky and Boustany.

However, many Republicans appear to be backing off since Palin warned on her Facebook page in late July that it would result in the creation of a “death panel.”

169 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:46:07pm

re: #154 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I didn’t watch the speech. Was with some friends.

So; Let me get this straight.

Some farking icehole stood up and said, “You Lie!” to the President of the United States of America?

In front of Congress? In front of America? In front of the World?

Then the corksocker has the audacity to say he was caught up in the moment?

Well, Martha Focker.

Congratulations, you idiot. You just snatched defeat out of the jaws of victory.

Where are they finding these idiots?

Same place as the progressives “Dumb-Assed Politicians ‘R’ Us.”

170 Chekote  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:46:09pm

Anyway, I am glad that it is now a thread.

171 Ojoe  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:46:27pm

re: #163 Bacchus’s daddy

I think that rational people should chuckie both major parties.

172 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:46:52pm

Not only is Rep. Boustany a Birther — he’s one of the original co-sponsors of the dreaded death panel section of the health care bill!

[Link: thomas.loc.gov…]

It’s a two-fer!

173 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:47:02pm

re: #171 Ojoe

‘kin A!

174 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:47:25pm

re: #172 Charles

Not only is Rep. Boustany a Birther — he’s one of the original co-sponsors of the dreaded death panel section of the health care bill!

[Link: thomas.loc.gov…]

It’s a two-fer!

One out of two ain’t so bad.
/

175 Bacchus's daddy  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:48:04pm

re: #171 Ojoe

I think that rational people should chuckie both major parties.


Touche.

176 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:48:13pm

re: #172 Charles

he’s one of the original co-sponsors of the dreaded death panel section of the health care bill!

Hell, I’m starting to support the “Death Panel” idea.

for those who are just tired of this crap.

177 Ojoe  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:48:19pm

re: #173 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

‘specially as, they both make me want to upchuck.

178 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:48:20pm

Tonight’s recipe:

56.5 gr h4350
165 gr SST
WLR

Shake and Bake

179 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:48:31pm

We must not have death panels nor this health care bill! Obama and his death panels must be opposed!

Here for the rebuttal to Obama’s speech is the co-sponsor of the death panel amendment, Republican Charles Boutany.

/Irony

180 DrNaughty  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:48:56pm

re: #176 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Hell, I’m starting to support the “Death Panel” idea.

for those who are just tired of this crap.

Well the obama people did provide those pamphlets to the Vets at the VA…

181 Racer X  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:49:42pm

re: #172 Charles

Not only is Rep. Boustany a Birther — he’s one of the original co-sponsors of the dreaded death panel section of the health care bill!

[Link: thomas.loc.gov…]

It’s a two-fer!

*facepalm*

182 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:49:46pm

re: #168 Gus 802

That has me thinking that his trooferness is more a matter of pandering than true belief.

Which get’s an even bigger wad of *SPIT* from me.

183 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:49:46pm

re: #178 Capitalist Tool

Trip to the range tomorrow- fun and games.

184 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:49:53pm

re: #164 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Who is this “we” you speak of?

We kemosabe, we.

You and I might not have voted for ‘em, but we elect ‘em, again, and again and again…

185 Chekote  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:50:03pm

re: #172 Charles

The irony is pretty delicious. Although, Santorum said tonight on Greta that he thought the “death panels” language was loaded and he would not have used it.

186 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:50:11pm

re: #180 DrNaughty

I’m ready for someone to pull the plug on ME!

(running around the room; hair on fire!)

187 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:50:49pm

re: #186 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

If you did that, who would I give the finger to?

188 DrNaughty  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:50:57pm

re: #186 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I’m ready for someone to pull the plug on ME!

(running around the room; hair on fire!)

Did you just film a video for Pepsi ?

189 SFGoth  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:51:20pm

I think this country has jumped the shark.

190 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:51:29pm

re: #186 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I’m ready for someone to pull the plug on ME!

(running around the room; hair on fire!)

Nope, waste of a good beer…

*runs down hall to restroom, runs back for empty pitcher, runs back to restroom, returns with pitcher of water and douses FBV*

191 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:51:31pm

re: #185 Chekote

The irony is pretty delicious. Although, Santorum said tonight on Greta that he thought the “death panels” language was loaded and he would not have used it.



Charles Boutany has issued a retraction to his co-sponsorship of the “death panel” amendment.

//

192 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:51:38pm

re: #184 jcm

always wondered how to spell “kemosabe”

193 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:51:41pm

re: #187 Sharmuta

If you did that, who would I give the finger to?

Good point.

194 DrNaughty  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:52:29pm

re: #192 Capitalist Tool

always wondered how to spell “kemosabe”

or kumbyah

195 Racer X  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:52:33pm

Gone crazy. Be back soon.
- GOP

196 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:52:38pm

re: #190 jcm

Nope, waste of a good beer…

*runs down hall to restroom, runs back for empty pitcher, runs back to restroom, returns with pitcher of water and douses FBV*

After you finish the full pitcher.

197 Jack Burton  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:52:40pm

re: #172 Charles

Not only is Rep. Boustany a Birther — he’s one of the original co-sponsors of the dreaded death panel section of the health care bill!

[Link: thomas.loc.gov…]

It’s a two-fer!

When did we punt the term “Nirther” in favor of “Birther” here at LGF. This bothers me more than the fact that this guy is one.

198 NukeAtomrod  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:53:01pm

re: #168 Gus 802

I could once again mention, then link to sources that verify, the Death Panel stuff was about rationing of health care and NOT end-of-life counseling. But I already understand that no one cares about the facts when there’s some good demonizing to do. So, uh, never mind. Go about your business.

199 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:53:14pm

Birthers, heckling, retractions, end-of-life memes, apologies.

It’s another day in DC.

/

200 fizzlogic  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:53:17pm

re: #150 Charles

Well he is a doctor, just like Ron Paul. Heh

201 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:53:21pm

re: #192 Capitalist Tool

always wondered how to spell “kemosabe”

That’s what you get from watching to much TV!

// ;-P

202 Coracle  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:53:24pm

re: #187 Sharmuta

If you did that, who would I give the finger to?

I hear William Rice needs one.

203 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:53:51pm

re: #196 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

After you finish the full pitcher.

Priorities, man’s gotta’ have priorities.

204 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:54:20pm

re: #198 NukeAtomrod

I could once again mention, then link to sources that verify, the Death Panel stuff was about rationing of health care and NOT end-of-life counseling. But I already understand that no one cares about the facts when there’s some good demonizing to do. So, uh, never mind. Go about your business.

What? Now the end-of-life portion isn’t the death panel portion?

Didn’t realize they moved the goal posts.

205 Bagua  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:54:38pm

re: #46 Ojoe

Some fires down hill from Mt. Wilson. Towercam, San Gabriel Mountains of California, Pacific time zone.


Sad sight, I posted last night that I thought we may have see the last of the nighttime fires they looked so far away, apparently I was wrong.

206 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:54:51pm

I’m watching a replay of the President’s speech on TV, which I missed earlier.
Watching Pelosi sitting there behind the President and licking her botoxed chops is distracting me from the speech and is making me a bit nauseous.
*heave*

207 nordink  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:55:10pm

The president’s speech tonight was not great. Full of holes and hypocrisy. (Accusing the opposition of scare tactics in the same speech that predicts inaction will cause, “Our deficit will grow. More families will go bankrupt. More businesses will close.”)

Unfortunately, as Baier points out, you can’t beat the GOP in own-foot-shooting.

Tomorrow, Rep. Joe “You Lie!” Wilson will be a household name. And as we all know, the media won’t be playing “Guess the Party” with him.

And the official GOP response from a nirther-panderer? Genius.

More years wandering the desert ahead, GOP…

208 Bagua  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:55:42pm

re: #207 nordink

Sad but true.

209 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:56:04pm

Bed. Fuck it.

210 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:56:09pm

re: #200 trendsurfer

Well he is a doctor, just like Ron Paul. Heh

OK- so bachmann and ron paul would have been worse.

211 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:57:00pm

re: #204 Gus 802

What? Now the end-of-life portion isn’t the death panel portion?

Didn’t realize they moved the goal posts.

The goal posts are infinitely moveable.

212 Ojoe  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:57:28pm

re: #207 nordink

Chuck the GOP

213 Dan G.  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:57:50pm

re: #211 Charles

When charted in time, does the goal post path make a circle?

214 cronus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:57:50pm

re: #151 unrealizedviewpoint

Does this mean we can now watch the Congressman’s response in a different light? Or shall we hold it against him for all time?

Politicians give dumb responses to live questions all the time and have to routinely issue corrections. If someone comes up with other examples of him embracing birtherism I would find it more troubling but barring that I will accept his retraction and give him the benefit of the doubt.

215 jcm  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:57:53pm

re: #209 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Bed. Fuck it.

Night FBV!

216 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:57:55pm

re: #207 nordink

Well, the party could publicly censure Wilson, maybe strpping him of his commitees for couple months would be in order. The damage would still be bad, but that might limit the hurt.

217 Capitalist Tool  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:58:14pm

re: #207 nordink

The president’s speech tonight was not great. Full of holes and hypocrisy. (Accusing the opposition of scare tactics in the same speech that predicts inaction will cause, “Our deficit will grow. More families will go bankrupt. More businesses will close.”)

Unfortunately, as Baier points out, you can’t beat the GOP in own-foot-shooting.

Tomorrow, Rep. Joe “You Lie!” Wilson will be a household name. And as we all know, the media won’t be playing “Guess the Party” with him.

And the official GOP response from a nirther-panderer? Genius.

More years wandering the desert ahead, GOP…


Doesn’t matter… the sun’s in a quiescent period the likes we’ve not seen before. No one knows when it’ll light back up.
Stockpile, stockpile.

No, that really was me and not G. Beck.

218 jaunte  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 8:59:36pm

Here’s an interesting take on the politics of the bill:

Do I Have the Politics Wrong?
It would leave the present system intact in most of its essentials, thus assuaging the fears of the vast bulk of the electorate. One substantial group of voters - those for whom the subsidies render health insurance more affordable - would be fairly pleased. A smaller group, mandated to buy coverage it can scarcely afford, would be discontent, but mostly because the Republicans had thwarted Democratic efforts to help it - and, in cold political terms, this isn’t a constituency likely to defect. And the public at large would see that Obama had promised health care reform, and then delivered it, with few painful trade-offs or compromises. A fairly clear-cut political victory.

No, the problem is that such an arrangement would deliver a political victory, but fail to achieve most major policy goals. It wouldn’t do much to rein in costs, to improve the quality of care, or to provide a greater sense of security. It’s politically feasible, and a political triumph, precisely because of its modest aims and feeble provisions.

It wouldn’t do much, but it would do something. Most importantly of all, it would firmly establish the provision of universal healthcare as a federal problem. I’d like to see a better package emerge from this debate. But let’s not mistake the ultimate goal, nor the magnitude of the potential victory. Today, paying for health care is a problem for individuals. The day any of the proposed bills passes, it becomes a policy problem for the federal government.

219 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:00:02pm

re: #211 Charles

The goal posts are infinitely moveable.

The frequent rationalization are not only mind boggling but obvious to the casual viewer. As far as the death panel meme it was part of Palin’s now famous Facebook entry in which she said:

The provision that President Obama refers to is Section 1233 of HR 3200, entitled “Advance Care Planning Consultation.” With all due respect, it’s misleading for the President to describe this section as an entirely voluntary provision that simply increases the information offered to Medicare recipients. The issue is the context in which that information is provided and the coercive effect these consultations will have in that context.

Section 1233 authorizes advanced care planning consultations for senior citizens on Medicare every five years, and more often “if there is a significant change in the health condition of the individual … or upon admission to a skilled nursing facility, a long-term care facility… or a hospice program.” During those consultations, practitioners must explain “the continuum of end-of-life services and supports available, including palliative care and hospice,” and the government benefits available to pay for such services.

220 Ojoe  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:00:44pm

Anagram for “death panel”

Elephant ad

221 jorline  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:01:56pm

I’m all for new “Dog Poop Laws” in Washington DC.

Where there is a pile of dog shit a Republican or two will step in it.

222 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:02:16pm

Just checked the stalker blog and they’re calling Wilson “brave”. The clue meter is still in negative territory over there. The hate meter remains through the roof, of course.

223 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:03:17pm

re: #222 Dark_Falcon

Just checked the stalker blog and they’re calling Wilson “brave”. The clue meter is still in negative territory over there. The hate meter remains through the roof, of course.

Joe Wilson is a hero!

h/t Killgor Trout

//

224 NukeAtomrod  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:03:48pm

re: #204 Gus 802

What? Now the end-of-life portion isn’t the death panel portion?

Didn’t realize they moved the goal posts.

The controversy started from Sarah Palin’s comments on her Facebook page. Here is the relevant section:

The Democrats promise that a government health care system will reduce the cost of health care, but as the economist Thomas Sowell has pointed out, government health care will not reduce the cost; it will simply refuse to pay the cost. And who will suffer the most when they ration care? The sick, the elderly, and the disabled, of course. The America I know and love is not one in which my parents or my baby with Down Syndrome will have to stand in front of Obama’s “death panel” so his bureaucrats can decide, based on a subjective judgment of their “level of productivity in society,” whether they are worthy of health care. Such a system is downright evil.

Health care by definition involves life and death decisions. Human rights and human dignity must be at the center of any health care discussion.

You can read the whole thing here if you care to. If you see anything at all to do with end-of-life counseling in her statement, please set me straight.

225 Dan G.  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:04:14pm

re: #218 jaunte

WONDERFUL! It is important to understand that public entities cannot fix personal problems.

226 jaunte  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:08:03pm

re: #225 Dan G.

Unfortunately, I think that author is right about the good chances and future implications of a weak bill passing now; conceptually, it will shift the provision -of-health-care problem to the federal government.

227 Bacchus's daddy  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:08:05pm

re: #218 jaunte

The inescapable shame for the Dems, is the absence of any meaningful tort reform. Their populist appeal as the “party of the common folk”, is contradicted in most shameful fashion, by their failure to address frivolous lawsuits. And the reason (special interests) is their very rationale for so many of their attacks on Republicans- “special interests”- oil companies, defense contractors, Halliburton, etc.

Tort reform alone might not save our health care system from a coming budgetary apocalypse, but it is one obvious step that would be fervently embraced, absent the trial lawyers’ lobby.

228 Coracle  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:08:14pm

re: #209 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Bed. Fuck it.

In bed.

er.. dammit.

229 NukeAtomrod  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:08:59pm

re: #219 Gus 802

I think you missed the opening paragraph in the Facebook note you linked to:

Yesterday President Obama responded to my statement that Democratic health care proposals would lead to rationed care; that the sick, the elderly, and the disabled would suffer the most under such rationing; and that under such a system these “unproductive” members of society could face the prospect of government bureaucrats determining whether they deserve health care.

Once again, it is very clear that she is talking about the perils of rationed care, NOT end-of-life counseling.

230 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:10:03pm

re: #224 NukeAtomrod

You can read the whole thing here if you care to. If you see anything at all to do with end-of-life counseling in her statement, please set me straight.

HR 3200

Sarah Palin refers to Section 1233. That is the end-of-life counseling provision:

SEC. 1233. ADVANCE CARE PLANNING CONSULTATION. (Page 426)

E) An explanation by the practitioner of the continuum of end-of-life services and supports available, including palliative care and hospice, and benefits for such services and supports that are available under this title.

Sarah Palin:

The provision that President Obama refers to is Section 1233 of HR 3200, entitled “Advance Care Planning Consultation.” [2] With all due respect, it’s misleading for the President to describe this section as an entirely voluntary provision that simply increases the information offered to Medicare recipients. The issue is the context in which that information is provided and the coercive effect these consultations will have in that context.

231 Dan G.  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:12:34pm

re: #226 jaunte

I know, and am gravely concerned. This type of argument is what the GOP (or any other opposition party) should have been making from the start, not fucking death panel canards.

232 NukeAtomrod  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:13:43pm

re: #230 Gus 802

So, Obama brought up end-of-life counseling and Palin responded to it by quoting the bill and stating that he was being misleading.

Who moved the goal posts again?

233 Silvergirl  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:14:13pm

Time for bed. I’ll leave all this behind. It just wasn’t a good day for the GOP.

I suppose you heard about the guy in LA on the hot mike talking about his hot sex life. Imbecile!

234 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:15:46pm

re: #232 NukeAtomrod

So, Obama brought up end-of-life counseling and Palin responded to it by quoting the bill and stating that he was being misleading.

Who moved the goal posts again?

No. It’s just that the rebuttal was done by a co-sponsor of similar if not identical legislation which is here:

[Link: thomas.loc.gov…]

And I already linked the USA Today article regarding this above, twice.

235 laxmatt1984  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:16:18pm

re: #29 laxmatt1984

Just curious: what did I write that deserved the negative ratings?

236 Dan G.  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:18:24pm

re: #235 laxmatt1984

Essentially, you called your gracious host naive.

Look, just because people have done it in the past, doesn’t excuse it. This type of bullshit is detrimental to getting good laws passed and preventing bad ones from even being considered.

237 Bob Dillon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:23:18pm

re: #160 jcm

We elect them.

Over and over and over.

238 laxmatt1984  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:28:05pm

I would have to say that the commenters on this blog (and perhaps, Charles) are shockingly unaware of the age old problems with democracy. Passion of the mob, discourse aiming low instead of high, resorts to the base and not the cerebral, ect.

Democracy is not about William Buckley and Gore Vidal having an intellectual chat (though that devolved into childishness as well). It’s about Joe the Plumber and John the Truther shouting at one another until one person simply gives up. Democracy is run by real people - warts and all - and is often inane.

People aren’t going to change: some will always consider the other side evil, some will always believe conspiracy theories over fact, and those people will always yell the loudest. The trick is establishing a framework so the inane day-to-day political discourse actually accomplishes something (Madison 10 and all that).

You want to focus on the birthers? Fine, but it should be done with the realization that they are but one on a long list of nutty American political movements, that are even (gasp!) used by major political parties (from know nothings to truthers). The GOP isn’t devolving into a party of Bible Thumping nuts who all believe that Barack Obama is secretly in the pay of Iran just like the Democratic Party wasn’t devolving into ANSWER from 2001-2008.

Anyway, rambling over. Troll rate away.

239 NukeAtomrod  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:29:35pm

re: #234 Gus 802

No. It’s just that the rebuttal was done by a co-sponsor of similar if not identical legislation which is here:

[Link: thomas.loc.gov…]

And I already linked the USA Today article regarding this above, twice.

You’re really missing the point here. The article I linked to was the original note by Sarah Palin entitled Statement on the Current Health Care Debate where she introduced the concept of a “Death Panel.” Then Obama made some comments about her criticism, in which he raised the issue of end-of-life counseling. Sarah Palin then wrote a second note entitled Concerning the “Death Panels” in which she used Obama’s statement as an example of a strategy to convince the elderly to voluntarily opt out of treatment. The overall issue is still rationing of health care.

The controversy came about merely because the term “Death Panel” was used to describe the committee that would decide who is worthy of medical care when resources become limited in a government run plan, as has happened with every such plan implemented in every country to date.

240 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:34:46pm

re: #239 NukeAtomrod

Here, I’ll simplify it. The Republican party is being hypocritical because after spending several weeks spreading the “death panel” hysteria had Rep. Charles Boutany, a co-sponsor of identical legislation to the “death panel” language found on Section 1233 of HR 3200, do a rebuttal regarding the very same language included in the legislation that the president had endorsed and did endorse in tonight’s speech. The committee you speak of is that same section, 1233.

That’s all I will say about this tonight. I don’t think you’re reading my links.

241 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:38:16pm

re: #240 Gus 802

Here, I’ll simplify it. The Republican party is being hypocritical because after spending several weeks spreading the “death panel” hysteria had Rep. Charles Boutany, a co-sponsor of identical legislation to the “death panel” language found on Section 1233 of HR 3200, do a rebuttal regarding the very same language included in the legislation that the president had endorsed and did endorse in tonight’s speech. The committee you speak of is that same section, 1233.

That’s all I will say about this tonight. I don’t think you’re reading my links.

Good research, Gus. the sheer volume of bills this issue has generated makes it hard to stay heads up, but more important than ever.

242 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:39:40pm

re: #241 Dark_Falcon

Good research, Gus. the sheer volume of bills this issue has generated makes it hard to stay heads up, but more important than ever.

Thanks Dark Falcon. Had some help from reine.de.tout and Charles.

243 Dan G.  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:48:24pm

re: #238 laxmatt1984

I would have to say that the commenters on this blog (and perhaps, Charles) are shockingly unaware of the age old problems with democracy.

Ahem… we live in a democratic republic.

244 NukeAtomrod  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:50:52pm

re: #240 Gus 802

Here, I’ll simplify it. The Republican party is being hypocritical because after spending several weeks spreading the “death panel” hysteria had Rep. Charles Boutany, a co-sponsor of identical legislation to the “death panel” language found on Section 1233 of HR 3200, do a rebuttal regarding the very same language included in the legislation that the president had endorsed and did endorse in tonight’s speech. The committee you speak of is that same section, 1233.

That’s all I will say about this tonight. I don’t think you’re reading my links.

This will be my last attempt as well. In order for the GOP to be hypocritical, they have to have been spreading the message that the “Death Panels” were doctors providing end-of-life counseling, and simultaneously support end-of-life counseling.

But as I’ve shown, directly from the original source, “Death Panel” refers to a committee deciding whether or not an individual citizen deserves treatment in the nationalized health care industry. Rep. Charles Boutany did not sponsor legislation to nationalize the health care industry (which would result in government rationed health care), so therefore it is not a case of hypocrisy.

I have to get some sleep, so I won’t respond further tonight. I will come back tomorrow morning to read any comments you leave, so feel free to challenge my assertions if you wish.

245 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:55:31pm

re: #238 laxmatt1984

I would have to say that the commenters on this blog (and perhaps, Charles) are shockingly unaware of the age old problems with democracy.

Could you be anymore insulting?

246 Gus  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 9:55:44pm

re: #244 NukeAtomrod

This will be my last attempt as well. In order for the GOP to be hypocritical, they have to have been spreading the message that the “Death Panels” were doctors providing end-of-life counseling, and simultaneously support end-of-life counseling.

But as I’ve shown, directly from the original source, “Death Panel” refers to a committee deciding whether or not an individual citizen deserves treatment in the nationalized health care industry. Rep. Charles Boutany did not sponsor legislation to nationalize the health care industry (which would result in government rationed health care), so therefore it is not a case of hypocrisy.

I have to get some sleep, so I won’t respond further tonight. I will come back tomorrow morning to read any comments you leave, so feel free to challenge my assertions if you wish.

There was never a committee “deciding whether or not an individual citizen deserves treatment in the nationalized health care industry.” I don’t think even Sarah Palin said that. Additionally, I never suggested that Charles Boutany endorsed nationalizing health care.

247 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:00:42pm

re: #238 laxmatt1984

You want to focus on the birthers? Fine, but it should be done with the realization that they are but one on a long list of nutty American political movements, that are even (gasp!) used by major political parties (from know nothings to truthers). The GOP isn’t devolving into a party of Bible Thumping nuts who all believe that Barack Obama is secretly in the pay of Iran just like the Democratic Party wasn’t devolving into ANSWER from 2001-2008.

And if you spent more time here, you’d know that those other groups are looked into on this blog as well.

Considering your previous support for science and evolution- I’m surprised you’re taking this position that folks who are pushing these various forms of anti-intellectualism aren’t being focused on at LGF.

248 laxmatt1984  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:12:59pm

re: #247 Sharmuta

Science and politics, however, should not be measured similarly. Science is the work of professionals: people who understand what is and is not scientific, who understand how theories, models, and formulas interconnect, and who know how to conduct experiments to discover new things.

Politics allows - and ought to allow - anyone to say anything. Quite frankly, the whole focus on the birthers, deathers, and who-ever-else seems to me to be predicated on two misguided ideas.

1) That the national GOP is obligated to repudiate any nutty thing the a self proclaimed conservative says.

This is one of the oldest political tricks there is. Find the nuts (and they are legion) portray them as the rank and file of your opposition, and force your opposition to spend all their time repudiating them. It didn’t work against Barack Obama in 2008 and it won’t work against the GOP in 2009-2010. Simply put, birthers do not form the core, or the majority of the GOP. Yes, I can find you a video of a congressman quickly blowing off an ambush reporter as proof of the GOP’s nuttiness, just like I can find videos of Barney Frank, Dick Durbin, or even Barack Obama saying outrageous things. It does not discredit a whole movement.

2) The GOP has devolved since the election of Barack Obama.

It has not. What has happened is the genuine voice of the opposition has become localized and decentralized. Yes, it is amateurish and sometimes shrill. Yes, nuts do sometimes come out of the woodwork. But again, these people are the minority. The “tea-parties”, townhalls, and everything else is driven by regular folks opposition to a simple idea: the government spending more money than it has. Don’t forget, the Democratic party looked awfully foolish before 2006 as well.

Anyway, I know what I wrote has no place at LGF. Troll rate away.

249 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:15:46pm

I was pretty happy with the speech. Where I draw the line is with keeping the public option self-sustaining and not have it turn into socialized medicine and it looks like that’s where Obama drew the line too.

I’m not upset that he gave a hat tip to tort reform either. Let’s see if anything comes of that.

I’m going to call my blue dog democrat congressman and ask him to vote for it so long as the public option remains self-sustaining.

250 laxmatt1984  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:16:06pm

re: #245 Sharmuta

Yes, I could. The fact of the matter is while my criticism has sometimes been pointed in this thread, none of my comments deserve outright dismissal.

If LGF wants to be a place of discussion, then I think my previous comments should be welcomed.

If it wants to be something else, well then…

251 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:20:20pm

re: #248 laxmatt1984

The tea parties are being organized by truthers and paulians. I don’t consider them normal folks, but that’s just me.

252 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:21:10pm
253 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:21:57pm

re: #250 laxmatt1984

And I don’t even know what to make of this except you’re whining you’re opinion was challenged. Were you deleted? No- so why would you think this isn’t a place for discussion? That’s insulting too.

254 laxmatt1984  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:23:06pm

re: #251 Sharmuta

Oh nonsense. I’ve been to a townhall. Might the Paulians and Birthers do some organizing? Sure, I bet they do. But the overwhelming majority of people are just normal folks are are concerned about the growth of the government.

255 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:24:06pm

re: #254 laxmatt1984

I didn’t say town halls, did I?

256 laxmatt1984  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:26:06pm

I must admit I haven’t been to a tea party, but I know a bunch of folks who have.

Not a single Paulian, Birther, or Deather among them. The plain fact is their numbers and influence are exaggerated.

257 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:29:24pm

re: #256 laxmatt1984

Not true:

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]

Tea Party

258 laxmatt1984  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:29:25pm

re: #253 Sharmuta

Again, you certainly have the right to troll rate whatever I write, but were my comments so horrible that you feel they ought not to be shown?

259 Sharmuta  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:32:08pm

re: #258 laxmatt1984

Where the hell are you getting this from? Just because I disagree with you- I want to censor you? Again- insulting. Write whatever the hell you want to, Dude. You don’t answer to me, and I have no power to remove anything you say. Guess what- it’s part of democracy. You say what you want, and I get to agree or disagree. Don’t like it? Quit telling the rest of us what democracy means then.

260 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:32:29pm

re: #256 laxmatt1984

I must admit I haven’t been to a tea party, but I know a bunch of folks who have.

Not a single Paulian, Birther, or Deather among them. The plain fact is their numbers and influence are exaggerated.

Right. Because as everyone knows, those kinds of people always wear identification badges.
/

And their influence cannot be exaggerated, when it’s the paulians that started the tea parties a couple or more years back, and continue to be the ones on top organizing most of the tea parties.

But hey, don’t let me disabuse you of any false assumptions you may have.

261 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 10:34:11pm

re: #258 laxmatt1984

Hey, exlax. Have you noticed your falling karma? Word to the wise: Call it a night.

262 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 11:26:10pm
263 SixDegrees  Wed, Sep 9, 2009 11:59:02pm

re: #16 reine.de.tout

Another interesting factoid:
Boustany was a co-sponsor of the “death panel” provisions.

He has also spoken out against the incredible pile of BS fear mongering peddled by Palin and others on this matter. I don’t see his sponsorship of this provision as an issue, except that it belies a certain tone-deafness on the part of the GOP as a whole: if they’re really going to make this an issue as a party, they oughtn’t have the provision’s author delivering their rebuttal.

It seems to me that this matter reflects the general lack of leadership in the GOP at the moment.

264 Charles Johnson  Thu, Sep 10, 2009 9:15:19am

re: #250 laxmatt1984

If LGF wants to be a place of discussion, then I think my previous comments should be welcomed.

Excellent thinking there.

“If this place is supposed to be about honest discussion, you have to love all my comments. You’re not allowed to disagree, or you’re CENSORING me!”

Short version: “Waaah!”

Bye now.

265 arf  Thu, Sep 10, 2009 12:23:14pm

I don’t get it. Someone, a stranger with a camera, just walks up to a politician, and shoots a question at them. The politicians have to put up with that all day. They clearly do NOT want to talk about it. They give a noncommital answer, like “there are questions that need to be cleared up”.

That makes them “birthers”? Not in my book.

266 geir  Thu, Sep 10, 2009 1:52:01pm

I love this little tidbit “Rep. Boustany — who paid a company $18,250 in the 1990s to receive an English Title, including rights to be called “Lord Boustany” (it turned out to be a fraud)”

[Link: www.southernstudies.org…]

267 arf  Thu, Sep 10, 2009 3:25:27pm

“Birthers on the Hill”

Dave Reichert at about 1:15. What did he say about Obama’s citizenship status? All I hear is something about freedom of speech. “But my point is, though…” and he’s cut off. Why is he included in “Birthers on the Hill”?

Because of the “R” after his name.

The video is a hatchet job. All of it. That’s why the politicians correctly give noncommital answers and walk away. The people may. or may not, be birthers, but the video proves nothing. Zip. Zero Nada.

268 NukeAtomrod  Thu, Sep 10, 2009 5:39:19pm

re: #246 Gus 802

There was never a committee “deciding whether or not an individual citizen deserves treatment in the nationalized health care industry.” I don’t think even Sarah Palin said that. Additionally, I never suggested that Charles Boutany endorsed nationalizing health care.

This is fascinating. Here are two of the things I’ve quoted to you in this discussion in this thread:

“…government health care will not reduce the cost; it will simply refuse to pay the cost. And who will suffer the most when they ration care? The sick, the elderly, and the disabled, of course. The America I know and love is not one in which my parents or my baby with Down Syndrome will have to stand in front of Obama’s “death panel” so his bureaucrats can decide, based on a subjective judgment of their “level of productivity in society,” whether they are worthy of health care.” - Sarah Palin - Statement on the Current Health Care Debate

…President Obama responded to my statement that Democratic health care proposals would lead to rationed care; that the sick, the elderly, and the disabled would suffer the most under such rationing; and that under such a system these “unproductive” members of society could face the prospect of government bureaucrats determining whether they deserve health care. - Sarah Palin - Concerning the “Death Panels”

If you don’t interpret those statements as “a committee deciding whether or not an individual citizen deserves treatment in a nationalized health care industry,” I am at a loss to what they could mean.

Additionally, I never suggested that Charles Boutany endorsed nationalizing health care.

Of course you didn’t, but if you had, you could make a case for him being a hypocrite. As it is, you’ve called him a hypocrite for supporting a bill about living wills and end-of-life care, because the GOP doesn’t support a bill that would create a public health care system will ration care. Which is a little like saying you are a hypocrite for drinking water, because you publicly stated that you hate driving in the rain.

269 Charles Johnson  Thu, Sep 10, 2009 9:58:00pm

re: #267 arf

“Birthers on the Hill”

Dave Reichert at about 1:15. What did he say about Obama’s citizenship status? All I hear is something about freedom of speech. “But my point is, though…” and he’s cut off. Why is he included in “Birthers on the Hill”?

Because of the “R” after his name.

The video is a hatchet job. All of it. That’s why the politicians correctly give noncommital answers and walk away. The people may. or may not, be birthers, but the video proves nothing. Zip. Zero Nada.

That takes the prize for our pathetic excuse of the day.

270 Moonbattery  Sat, Sep 12, 2009 7:52:38am

wow.


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