Secret IAEA Report: Iran Can Make a Bomb Right Now
World • Views: 2,128
The Associated Press says they’ve seen a secret report from the International Atomic Energy Agency that Iran has the ability to make a nuclear bomb.
170 comments
2 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:48:38am |
And just as Mohamed El Baradei leaves his post.
| 4 |
Diamond Bullet Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:49:06am |
“Um, we only learned how to build nukes in order to avoid building one by accident while pursuing our peaceful civilian program.”
| 6 |
Honorary Yooper Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:50:02am |
There is no way that this can end well. It will end badly for Iran should they make and then use a nuke. Very badly.
| 7 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:50:28am |
Perhaps this is the day President goes mid-evil…
Probably not, but, perhaps…
| 8 |
thedopefishlives Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:50:52am |
re: #6 Honorary Yooper
There is no way that this can end well. It will end badly for Iran should they make and then use a nuke. Very badly.
At this stage, I can’t see it NOT ending badly for Iran, whether they make one or not. Israel is watching with both eyes open, and I imagine the F-16’s are probably fueled on the tarmac right now.
| 9 |
Danny Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:50:57am |
No cause for alarm. Those nukes and missiles are just for domestic energy use.
| 10 |
McSpiff Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:51:06am |
You know, I realize most lizards are going “No really?” at this, but as someone who generally trusts groups like the IAEA to be honest about their findings, I’m kind of shocked.
| 11 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:51:07am |
Luckily, the whole matter is behind us now:
Nuclear issues settled, no need for review: Iran
Tehran, Sep 15 (DPA) Iran has settled all its nuclear issues with the UN nuclear watchdog, so there was no need to review the issues in talks with world powers, a senior Iranian nuclear official said Tuesday.
Deputy chief nuclear negotiator Ali Baqeri said that there had been some remaining issues which Iran has settled with the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) and hence removed all IAEA concerns and reaffirmed the peaceful nature of the Iranian nuclear projects.
“As far as the Iranian nuclear case is concerned, there are neither remaining technical nor legal questions left,” Baqeri was quoted as saying by the ISNA news agency.
“Therefore there is no room for the nuclear issue in the agenda (of talks with the world powers),” he added.
| 13 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:51:42am |
re: #10 McSpiff
You know, I realize most lizards are going “No really?” at this, but as someone who generally trusts groups like the IAEA to be honest about their findings, I’m kind of shocked.
That would be reality kicking in.
| 15 |
Cheesehead Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:53:19am |
Strongly worded UN missive to follow. Wonder what they’d do if Iran actually used a nuke. Very strongly worded letter of protest?
| 16 |
Syrah Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:53:37am |
So all that we have to do now is completely disarm and throw ourselves prostrate before Achmad-Dinnerjack and he will learn the error of his ways and put an end to his nuke weapons program?
/Unicorn rainbow farts still stink.
| 17 |
McSpiff Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:53:47am |
re: #13 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
That would be reality kicking in.
To be honest, I agree. Although Id still like to see something a little more concrete than “someone who read a secret report told us…”.
| 18 |
NJDhockeyfan Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:53:59am |
No need to worry…Biden says Iran is not a threat.
Why has the Obama administration decided to toss eastern Europe under the bus in order to make nice with Russia? According to CNN, Joe Biden says that a missile-defense system in Europe isn’t really necessary, because Iran isn’t much of a threat. No, really:
Vice President Joe Biden earlier refused to confirm to CNN that the George W. Bush-era plan was being shelved.But he did explain the logic of doing so, saying Iran — a key concern for the United States — was not a threat.
“I think we are fully capable and secure dealing with any present or future potential Iranian threat,” he told CNN’s Chris Lawrence in Baghdad, where he is on a brief trip.
“The whole purpose of this exercise we are undertaking is to diminish the prospect of the Iranians destabilizing that region in the world. I am less concerned — much less concerned — about the Iranian potential. They have no potential at this moment, they have no capacity to launch a missile at the United States of America,” he said.
| 19 |
lawhawk Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:54:25am |
Iran is likely to overcome problems in its delivery systems. That’s an understatement.
For those who aren’t familiar with US efforts at ICBMs, might I refer folks to the fact that it took nearly a decade to get a missile system that was anywhere near reliable back in the 1950 that could send a nuke anywhere in the world in under an hour or your money back. We had a huge bomber force because we needed to figure out how to make the nukes smaller. We finally succeeded with the liquid fueled Atlas, but realized that solid fuel propellants were better - and the rockets became progressively smaller and more compact - along with their warheads.
To think that the Iranians can’t achieve similar results in a span of a few years - particularly with assistance of AQ Khan and the North Koreans is sheer folly.
The real question is how much weapons grade uranium and/or plutonium they have on hand that can be used for weapons development and production. That’s the real limiting factor here, and with the centrifuges running furiously, it’s a matter of time before they have the means and the capabilities.
| 20 |
Diamond Bullet Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:54:29am |
It’s pretty amazing that the Smart Power team always seems to put their foot in it. Unilaterally ditching a missile shield the same day this hidden report turns up? Really? What’s next, sending Iran a stylized “relationship reset” button that is mislabeled “Launch” in Farsi, and then staging a photo op to help them push it?
| 21 |
HelloDare Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:54:30am |
Obama must have known about this when he killed the missile shield designed to protect Europe from Russian and Iran.
Vice President Joe Biden earlier refused to confirm to CNN that the George W. Bush-era plan was being shelved.But he did explain the logic of doing so, saying Iran — a key concern for the United States — was not a threat.
“I think we are fully capable and secure dealing with any present or future potential Iranian threat,” he told CNN’s Chris Lawrence in Baghdad, where he is on a brief trip.
“The whole purpose of this exercise we are undertaking is to diminish the prospect of the Iranians destabilizing that region in the world. I am less concerned — much less concerned — about the Iranian potential. They have no potential at this moment, they have no capacity to launch a missile at the United States of America,” he said.
Biden said he is “deeply” involved in the review of the missile defense program.
| 22 |
Occasional Reader Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:54:37am |
re: #11 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Luckily, the whole matter is behind us now:
It’s a Jedi mind trick.
| 23 |
jaunte Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:54:46am |
re: #2 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
And just as Mohamed El Baradei leaves his post.
Maybe the AP has dropped the use of the term “watchdog” in these stories.
| 24 |
Maui Girl Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:54:47am |
Okay world, pull thine head out of thine ass before Iran blows it out your ass.
And this is news, how?
| 26 |
filetandrelease Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:55:18am |
re: #20 Diamond Bullet
It’s pretty amazing that the Smart Power team always seems to put their foot in it. Unilaterally ditching a missile shield the same day this hidden report turns up? Really? What’s next, sending Iran a stylized “relationship reset” button that is mislabeled “Launch” in Farsi, and then staging a photo op to help them push it?
I question the timing of this report
//
| 27 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:55:19am |
re: #18 NJDhockeyfan
Dude, the day he sat in the big chair… I think the President’s hair went 40% grayer. Well, at least by the end of his first “National Security Briefing”.
| 28 |
karmic_inquisitor Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:55:29am |
Joe Biden spoke to the Council on Foreign Relations a year ago.
But at its current pace, the NIE concluded that Iran could produce that material no earlier than the end of 2009 – but that this is very unlikely. More likely is that Iran will be capable of making enough material for a bomb sometime between 2010 and 2015.
This means that the answers to the questions I posed are no, war is not inevitable and yes, we can prevent Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons. There is still time for diplomatic engagement and economic pressure to work. There is still time to protect our interests without using force.
He then followed up with false choices like attacking Iran meant occupying it and whatnot. He even mentions “reality based community”.
I know he was in campaign mode, but coupled with the missile defense news, it seems that these guys are still in campaign mode regarding Iran.
Time is not a luxury.
| 30 |
pre-Boomer Marine brat Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:55:43am |
The document says Iran has “sufficient information” to build a bomb. It says Iran is likely to “overcome problems” on developing a delivery system.
With great respect, Charles, having the data does not (in and of itself) mean they now (at present) have the hands-on technical expertise needed to accomplish the task.
I admit that I’m quibbling regarding terminology.
/I’m also grateful that we have the IDF
| 32 |
badger1970 Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:56:16am |
re: #9 Danny
“Danger Death Ray”- saw the mstie version last night and scoffed at the “peaceful use” of a death ray.
| 34 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:56:26am |
re: #15 Cheesehead
Strongly worded UN missive to follow. Wonder what they’d do if Iran actually used a nuke. Very strongly worded letter of protest?
Some days I think if Iran nuked Israel, the UN would congratulate them, and send a nasty letter to Israel about all the Palestinian casualties.
| 35 |
MandyManners Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:56:57am |
re: #18 NJDhockeyfan
No need to worry…Biden says Iran is not a threat.
Why has the Obama administration decided to toss eastern Europe under the bus in order to make nice with Russia? According to CNN, Joe Biden says that a missile-defense system in Europe isn’t really necessary, because Iran isn’t much of a threat. No, really:
| 37 |
Spider Mensch Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:58:01am |
ability is one thing…capabilty is another…not saying it isn’t a dangerous thing here…but I’m sure the eyes in the sky, so to speak, are watching for any type of tests. and news of said test would get out…of course my argument is moot if they intend the test sight to be Tel Aviv…of course that test better be successful, becuase iran is just a memory if it isn’t…then again it would be just a memory if successful too I suppose…quite a conundrum…
| 38 |
Mad Al-Jaffee Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:58:08am |
re: #7 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Perhaps this is the day President goes mid-evil…
Probably not, but, perhaps…
He might write a strongly-worded letter.
| 39 |
Cheesehead Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:58:24am |
The problem with Iran isn’t so much that they don’t grasp the meaning of M.A.D. (mutually assured destruction), but that those who they might assist in getting a device, don’t really care.
| 40 |
pre-Boomer Marine brat Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:58:29am |
re: #30 pre-Boomer Marine brat
The document says Iran has “sufficient information” to build a bomb. It says Iran is likely to “overcome problems” on developing a delivery system.
With great respect, Charles, having the data does not (in and of itself) mean they now (at present) have the hands-on technical expertise needed to accomplish the task.
I admit that I’m quibbling regarding terminology.
/I’m also grateful that we have the IDF
PIMF — the first para should have been in quotes.
| 41 |
HelloDare Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:58:39am |
re: #30 pre-Boomer Marine brat
The document says Iran has “sufficient information” to build a bomb. It says Iran is likely to “overcome problems” on developing a delivery system.
With great respect, Charles, having the data does not (in and of itself) mean they now (at present) have the hands-on technical expertise needed to accomplish the task.
I admit that I’m quibbling regarding terminology.
/I’m also grateful that we have the IDF
Yeah, it’s not like we’ve seen a mushroom cloud. Now that would be hard evidence.
| 42 |
Danny Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:58:58am |
Maybe BHO should have sent that WH invitation after all.
//
| 43 |
brent Thu, Sep 17, 2009 10:59:02am |
Did anyone ever doubt that this would be a headline sometime in the next few months, year? I just want to know what you all think the next most likely headline will be - Israel attacks Iranian Nuke Site, Israel Jets Shot Down, Giant Smoking Hole Discovered in Israel, or Price of Oil Jumps 300%?
I am not trying to be glib, but something substantial is going to happen - more than just Iran gets bomb. Is there an upside to this I’m missing, assuming I’m not a holocaust fan?
| 44 |
Syrah Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:00:03am |
re: #19 lawhawk
Iran is likely to overcome problems in its delivery systems. That’s an understatement.
For those who aren’t familiar with US efforts at ICBMs, might I refer folks to the fact that it took nearly a decade to get a missile system that was anywhere near reliable back in the 1950 that could send a nuke anywhere in the world in under an hour or your money back. We had a huge bomber force because we needed to figure out how to make the nukes smaller. We finally succeeded with the liquid fueled Atlas, but realized that solid fuel propellants were better - and the rockets became progressively smaller and more compact - along with their warheads.
To think that the Iranians can’t achieve similar results in a span of a few years - particularly with assistance of AQ Khan and the North Koreans is sheer folly.
The real question is how much weapons grade uranium and/or plutonium they have on hand that can be used for weapons development and production. That’s the real limiting factor here, and with the centrifuges running furiously, it’s a matter of time before they have the means and the capabilities.
Cargo ship.
Its slow. But when speed doesn’t matter …
| 45 |
NJDhockeyfan Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:00:07am |
re: #38 Mad Al-Jaffee
He might write a strongly-worded letter.
..and say how ‘deeply concerned’ he is.
| 47 |
Baier Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:00:21am |
re: #43 brent
It is like watching a train wreck in slow motion.
| 48 |
JEA62 Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:00:29am |
Well, that certainly increases my confidence in the Fabulously Accurate Central Intelligence Agnecy estimate…
| 49 |
Leonidas Hoplite Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:00:35am |
re: #43 brent
Did anyone ever doubt that this would be a headline sometime in the next few months, year? I just want to know what you all think the next most likely headline will be - Israel attacks Iranian Nuke Site, Israel Jets Shot Down, Giant Smoking Hole Discovered in Israel, or Price of Oil Jumps 300%?
Um, maybe all of them?
| 50 |
filetandrelease Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:00:39am |
re: #43 brent
Did anyone ever doubt that this would be a headline sometime in the next few months, year? I just want to know what you all think the next most likely headline will be - Israel attacks Iranian Nuke Site, Israel Jets Shot Down, Giant Smoking Hole Discovered in Israel, or Price of Oil Jumps 300%?
I am not trying to be glib, but something substantial is going to happen - more than just Iran gets bomb. Is there an upside to this I’m missing, assuming I’m not a holocaust fan?
Hmmm, my original thought here …
This is not going to end well.
| 52 |
Honorary Yooper Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:00:52am |
re: #28 karmic_inquisitor
Time is not a luxury.
No, it is not. However, in too many instances throughout history, repeatedly, people have thought so, much to their detriment. Some of the more famous instances involve Chamberlain, Czechoslovakia, France, and the Rhineland.
| 53 |
lawhawk Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:00:53am |
re: #19 lawhawk
How much time do we want to give the mad mullahs in Tehran? That’s what this all comes down to. We know that Iran isn’t going to give up their nuclear ambitions. We’ll go to the UN and make the usual noises, but Iran will continue operating their centrifuges gathering the materials necessary for nukes. They’ll continue working on their missile tech.
Sitting back and doing nothing only punts the issue down the road, when Iran is a position to actually strike. That’s unacceptable. Why are we willing to wait?
In a word: Iraq.
Waiting until a nation becomes an actual threat and carrying out an attack is now seen as preferable to taking out an odious regime before it has the full means to do what its rhetoric claims.
| 54 |
_RememberTonyC Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:01:03am |
re: #19 lawhawk
Iran is likely to overcome problems in its delivery systems. That’s an understatement.
For those who aren’t familiar with US efforts at ICBMs, might I refer folks to the fact that it took nearly a decade to get a missile system that was anywhere near reliable back in the 1950 that could send a nuke anywhere in the world in under an hour or your money back. We had a huge bomber force because we needed to figure out how to make the nukes smaller. We finally succeeded with the liquid fueled Atlas, but realized that solid fuel propellants were better - and the rockets became progressively smaller and more compact - along with their warheads.
To think that the Iranians can’t achieve similar results in a span of a few years - particularly with assistance of AQ Khan and the North Koreans is sheer folly.
The real question is how much weapons grade uranium and/or plutonium they have on hand that can be used for weapons development and production. That’s the real limiting factor here, and with the centrifuges running furiously, it’s a matter of time before they have the means and the capabilities.
is the missile issue that took us 10 years to develop in the 1950’s relevent now? iran can buy that package from the norks and deploy it in far less time than it took us to get the job done from scratch in the 1950’s. am I wrong about this?
| 55 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:01:05am |
re: #39 Cheesehead
The problem with Iran isn’t so much that they don’t grasp the meaning of M.A.D. (mutually assured destruction), but that those who they might assist in getting a device, don’t really care.
To Ahmadinejad, MAD is Madhi Advancing Destruction
| 56 |
MandyManners Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:01:11am |
I HOPE EVERYONE WHO REFUSED TO VOTE FOR MCCAIN BECAUSE HE WASN’T CONSERVATIVE ENOUGH IS FUCKING HAPPY NOW!
| 58 |
brent Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:01:33am |
It’s like watching a train wreck where you helped build the train for just that purpose. Something like that.
| 59 |
pre-Boomer Marine brat Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:01:38am |
re: #41 HelloDare
Yeah, it’s not like we’ve seen a mushroom cloud. Now that would be hard evidence.
From what little this layman has read, a gun-method device is pretty danged simple. (Problem is, the damned thing’s the size of a GE railroad switch engine.)
They’d have to test a plutonium implosion weapon, to make certain they’d gotten it right, but not the other.
| 60 |
Leonidas Hoplite Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:01:54am |
re: #53 lawhawk
Sitting back and doing nothing only punts the issue down the road, when Iran is a position to actually strike. That’s unacceptable. Why are we willing to wait?
In a word: Iraq.
Waiting until a nation becomes an actual threat and carrying out an attack is now seen as preferable to taking out an odious regime before it has the full means to do what its rhetoric claims.
Well said.
| 61 |
McSpiff Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:01:57am |
re: #43 brent
Did anyone ever doubt that this would be a headline sometime in the next few months, year? I just want to know what you all think the next most likely headline will be - Israel attacks Iranian Nuke Site, Israel Jets Shot Down, Giant Smoking Hole Discovered in Israel, or Price of Oil Jumps 300%?
I am not trying to be glib, but something substantial is going to happen - more than just Iran gets bomb. Is there an upside to this I’m missing, assuming I’m not a holocaust fan?
Honestly, I highly suspect whatever information the IAEA had. Seems highly unlikely to me that Mossad would not have either a) had a better source of info then the IAEA, or b) they have a source of info in the IAEA. The odds of this being a game changer in terms of IDF action to me seems to be slim to nil.
| 62 |
_RememberTonyC Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:02:00am |
re: #54 _RememberTonyC
is the missile issue that took us 10 years to develop in the 1950’s relevent now? iran can buy that package from the norks and deploy it in far less time than it took us to get the job done from scratch in the 1950’s. am I wrong about this?
never mind, lawhawk … my bad on that question … sorry
| 64 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:02:23am |
re: #44 Syrah
Cargo ship.
Its slow. But when speed doesn’t matter …
And making it harder to trace does…
| 65 |
Honorary Yooper Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:02:44am |
re: #44 Syrah
Cargo ship.
Its slow. But when speed doesn’t matter …
Exactly. They don’t really need to send it FedEx.
| 66 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:02:55am |
re: #32 badger1970
“Danger Death Ray”- saw the mstie version last night and scoffed at the “peaceful use” of a death ray.
Paging Fart Bargo, I mean Bart Fargo.
| 67 |
pre-Boomer Marine brat Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:03:07am |
| 68 |
Baier Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:03:08am |
re: #58 brent
It’s like watching a train wreck where you helped build the train for just that purpose. Something like that.
Yeah, I know the feeling, like it’s some unavoidable thing. And even though people have the power to stop it, they just want to watch it. A nightmare.
| 69 |
NJDhockeyfan Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:03:52am |
Next week the Obama Administration will allow Ahmadinejad, Castro, Chavez, Gaddafi and several other international thugs into New York City to speak in front of the United Nations General Assembly. However, one country’s president will not be allowed into the United States.
President Roberto Micheletti from Honduras will not be allowed to enter into America. The Obama Administration revoked his visa back in July.
| 70 |
lawhawk Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:03:53am |
re: #44 Syrah
That’s a distinct possibility - using cargo containers to ship nukes is a stable of technothrillers (from Sum of All Fears - the book (ignore the movie at all costs), to True Lies.
You can bet that the mullahs have thought of alternative and cheaper alternatives to sending missiles towards their targets.
However, it’s a bit more difficult to send nukes by cargo container to Israel when there is no direct trading. Missile is much more likely - and within range.
Still, the issue would be numbers - Iran wants to have more than a single shot at this, so they may bide their time until they have a number of weapons at their disposal before initiating an attack.
| 71 |
Fenway_Nation Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:03:53am |
So…a totalitarian cabal of extremists with genocidal deisgns obtaining raw materiel for a nuclear weapon isn’t a crisis, but healthcare is?
| 72 |
McSpiff Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:04:21am |
re: #61 McSpiff
Wow, that came out worst than most of my posts, must be the hunger. I did not mean to say that this information is suspect, simply that the IDF probably already had it before today.
| 73 |
Syrah Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:04:26am |
re: #64 Kosh’s Shadow
And making it harder to trace does…
Asymmetrical warfare.
Its the obvious solutions that can be the biggest surprise.
| 74 |
filetandrelease Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:04:43am |
References the Cargo Ship delivery methond, I just pray that that is not when it is confirmed Iran has made a nuke.
| 75 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:04:44am |
Does this really have to happen right as the One is handing Putin both rooks and a knight?
| 76 |
Son of the Black Dog Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:04:58am |
re: #59 pre-Boomer Marine brat
From what little this layman has read, a gun-method device is pretty danged simple. (Problem is, the damned thing’s the size of a GE railroad switch engine.)
They’d have to test a plutonium implosion weapon, to make certain they’d gotten it right, but not the other.
Assuming they haven’t received tested designs for a plutonium implosion weapon from the Paks or the Norks.
| 77 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:04:59am |
re: #69 NJDhockeyfan
I was half wondering if Netanyahu would be allowed it.
But if they didn’t, then Obama couldn’t get a photo op with Netanyahu and Abbas.
| 79 |
HelloDare Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:05:47am |
re: #59 pre-Boomer Marine brat
From what little this layman has read, a gun-method device is pretty danged simple. (Problem is, the damned thing’s the size of a GE railroad switch engine.)
They’d have to test a plutonium implosion weapon, to make certain they’d gotten it right, but not the other.
Once they have it, it’s too late. And they won’t build just one bomb.
| 80 |
Baier Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:05:47am |
re: #72 McSpiff
Wow, that came out worst than most of my posts, must be the hunger. I did not mean to say that this information is suspect, simply that the IDF probably already had it before today.
Agreed, I doubt this is a surprise to Israel…I doubt it was much of a surprise to anyone here, just a fact we can no longer afford to be optimistic about.
| 81 |
Honorary Yooper Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:06:10am |
re: #59 pre-Boomer Marine brat
From what little this layman has read, a gun-method device is pretty danged simple. (Problem is, the damned thing’s the size of a GE railroad switch engine.)
However, something that size can fit into a standard sized container.
| 82 |
pre-Boomer Marine brat Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:06:22am |
re: #76 Son of the Black Dog
Assuming they haven’t received tested designs for a plutonium implosion weapon from the Paks or the Norks.
True. Quite true.
| 83 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:06:22am |
re: #78 Danny
Dang, Charles already posted another thread.
The threads move on, Grasshopper. Embrace the flow.
| 84 |
McSpiff Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:07:04am |
re: #76 Son of the Black Dog
Assuming they haven’t received tested designs for a plutonium implosion weapon from the Paks or the Norks.
He already had them. The missile defence shield was never a threat to the Russians. The short range systems in Kalingrad would have destroyed before any of the heavies left their silos/TELs.
| 85 |
Cheesehead Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:07:11am |
re: #71 Fenway_Nation
If a nuke is detonated in the U.S., we’ll probably need a new health care system anyways.
/
| 86 |
captdiggs Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:07:12am |
A looming disaster. A nuclear armed Iran will reshape all middle east politics and spheres of influence. All rearranged on the basis of a few insane mullahs or revolutionary guard elite who can at any moment unleash a nuclear disaster on the world.
This is far different than North Korea, that only uses its potential to extract material blackmail. This is a messianic regime that is far more unpredictable.
| 88 |
Green Helmet Guy Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:07:38am |
re: #51 Mad Al-Jaffee
Has the fist unclenched yet?
only when Ahmadinjad has finished pooshing da button
| 90 |
McSpiff Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:07:59am |
re: #84 McSpiff
And another swing and a miss. I was attempting to quote #75. I may be taking a lunch break lizards.
| 91 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:07:59am |
re: #70 lawhawk
That’s a distinct possibility - using cargo containers to ship nukes is a stable of technothrillers (from Sum of All Fears - the book (ignore the movie at all costs), to True Lies.
You can bet that the mullahs have thought of alternative and cheaper alternatives to sending missiles towards their targets.
However, it’s a bit more difficult to send nukes by cargo container to Israel when there is no direct trading. Missile is much more likely - and within range.
Still, the issue would be numbers - Iran wants to have more than a single shot at this, so they may bide their time until they have a number of weapons at their disposal before initiating an attack.
The cargo ship is a good way to attack the Great Satan (US).
And they could get their container on a cargo ship that stops elsewhere before going to Israel. I won’t speculate on how they’d trigger it, though, but there is an obvious solution (and obvious solution to its problems)
Or they could ship the nuke into Pakistan, and load it onto a container there. Or worse, well, again, I don’t want to give the terrorists any ideas.
| 92 |
pre-Boomer Marine brat Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:08:20am |
re: #81 Honorary Yooper
However, something that size can fit into a standard sized container.
Such as one that the one which the Somali pirates (are reported to have) opened.
| 93 |
eric Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:09:19am |
I can’t remember. Is this ahead of schedule or behind schedule? Either way we all knew it was coming.
| 94 |
brent Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:09:26am |
So here’s an awful extrapolation, with a historical precedent -
What happens if a cargo ship or three ends up in Venezuela, what about Cuba? Would this government (any form of it in the last 3 years) have the fortitude to do anything about it? Would we stand for unfriendly nuclear neighbors?
Not detonating that is almost better than detonating - good chess piece to have in that position. ugh.
| 95 |
HypnoToad Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:10:00am |
re: #59 pre-Boomer Marine brat
From
what little this layman has read, a gun-method device is pretty danged
simple. (Problem is, the damned thing’s the size of a GE railroad
switch engine.)They’d have to test a plutonium implosion weapon, to make certain they’d gotten it right, but not the other.
Actually, we successfully tested a shotgun fission device that fit into an 8” artillery shell. (and was fired from the piece)
| 96 |
McSpiff Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:10:07am |
re: #86 captdiggs
A looming disaster. A nuclear armed Iran will reshape all middle east politics and spheres of influence. All rearranged on the basis of a few insane mullahs or revolutionary guard elite who can at any moment unleash a nuclear disaster on the world.
This is far different than North Korea, that only uses its potential to extract material blackmail. This is a messianic regime that is far more unpredictable.
North Korea is still restrained somewhat by China I suspect. I doubt anyone will play such an influence on Iran. Except maybe the Iranian people themselves.
| 97 |
transient Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:10:16am |
Once Iran has the knowledge of how to successfully build a functional nuke, it’s too late. You can bomb all the sites you want, but you’ve only delayed them for a few years, if that. (While pissing them off and rallying the population around the imamocracy.)
It’s a lose-lose.
| 98 |
McSpiff Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:11:03am |
re: #95 HypnoToad
Actually, we successfully tested a shotgun fission device that fit into an 8” artillery shell. (and was fired from the piece)
Maybe this? [Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
| 99 |
Green Helmet Guy Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:11:05am |
re: #88 Green Helmet Guy
And I don’t want to die
I want to see the flowers bloom
Don’t want a go capoot ka boom
And I don’t want to cry
I wanna have a lot of fun
Just sitting in the sunBut nevertheless
He’s gonna push the button
push the button push the bu push the bu push the button
| 100 |
Son of the Black Dog Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:11:34am |
re: #95 HypnoToad
Actually, we successfully tested a shotgun fission device that fit into an 8” artillery shell. (and was fired from the piece)
Do you have a link for that?
| 101 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:12:06am |
re: #97 transient
Once Iran has the knowledge of how to successfully build a functional nuke, it’s too late. You can bomb all the sites you want, but you’ve only delayed them for a few years, if that. (While pissing them off and rallying the population around the imamocracy.)
It’s a lose-lose.
They’ve had the knowledge for years, courtesy of Khan.
What should happen is a complete embargo of nuclear materials and technology to Iran, after destruction of their existing facilities.
| 102 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:12:31am |
re: #97 transient
Once Iran has the knowledge of how to successfully build a functional nuke, it’s too late. You can bomb all the sites you want, but you’ve only delayed them for a few years, if that. (While pissing them off and rallying the population around the imamocracy.)
Oh. Okay. Let them have it.
Talk about lose-lose…
| 103 |
captdiggs Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:12:41am |
re: #96 McSpiff
North Korea is still restrained somewhat by China I suspect. I doubt anyone will play such an influence on Iran. Except maybe the Iranian people themselves.
The rational Iranians are the ones arrested, tortured, repressed.
If anything, Iran has spiraled downwards since the election. The veneer of democracy is no longer valid. It’s purely a a military theocracy…and very dangerous.
| 104 |
Honorary Yooper Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:13:23am |
re: #94 brent
So here’s an awful extrapolation, with a historical precedent -
What happens if a cargo ship or three ends up in Venezuela, what about Cuba? Would this government (any form of it in the last 3 years) have the fortitude to do anything about it? Would we stand for unfriendly nuclear neighbors?
Not detonating that is almost better than detonating - good chess piece to have in that position. ugh.
No, I doubt that we could stand for unfriendly nuclear neighbors. However, I would not put it past the Castros nor Chavez to obtain nukes. It would be the second time for the Castros.
| 105 |
HelloDare Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:13:33am |
re: #94 brent
So here’s an awful extrapolation, with a historical precedent -
What happens if a cargo ship or three ends up in Venezuela, what about Cuba? Would this government (any form of it in the last 3 years) have the fortitude to do anything about it? Would we stand for unfriendly nuclear neighbors?
Not detonating that is almost better than detonating - good chess piece to have in that position. ugh.
Yes. And as I’ve posted here many times before, Obama gave the Kennedy-Khrushchev Meeting as an example of good diplomacy.
Te Berlin Wall went up two months later, the Cuban Missile Crisis happened the next year.
| 106 |
Guy_Montag Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:13:36am |
Shi’i want the bomb? I recommend reading Studies In Muslim Apocalyptic by David Cook. Nothing makes my day like a supremacist eschatological belief system, or a decent roast beef sandwich with fresh spinach.
| 107 |
brent Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:14:25am |
What should happen is a complete embargo of nuclear materials and technology to Iran, after destruction of their existing facilities.
What will happen is a completely different matter.
That’s great
it starts with an earthquake
birds and snakes, an aeroplane
Lenny Bruce is not afraid
| 108 |
pre-Boomer Marine brat Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:14:28am |
re: #98 McSpiff
Maybe this? [Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
That one used an implosion-type warhead
[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
| 110 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:14:38am |
Just my personal comment on the situation. Totally SFW.
[Link: ihasahotdog.com…]
| 111 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:14:46am |
| 112 |
transient Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:15:09am |
By the way I think we have pretty good eyes in the sky on cargo ships. My sources are 3rd hand so I can’t give detail or 100% assurance, but I think it’s unlikely a random cargo ship would be able to approach our shores.
| 113 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:15:53am |
re: #111 Kosh’s Shadow
And just for the record, from this link:
As with most other early nuclear artillery shells such as the 11” W9 shell, it was a compact gun type nuclear weapon, firing a small projectile down an internal barrel into a larger HEU uranium target assembly, forming a critical mass as the two came together.
| 114 |
McSpiff Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:16:22am |
re: #103 captdiggs
Iranians on the whole are a well educated, moderate group. Hopefully they can enact their own regime change before the bombs fall. Unfortunately i was hoping the same thing before the Iraq war.
re: #104 Honorary Yooper
Important to note that it was actually Raoul who was sent to Moscow to negotiations for the first batch, if memory serves me (He was defence minister right?)
| 115 |
McSpiff Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:18:10am |
re: #108 pre-Boomer Marine brat
That one used an implosion-type warhead
[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
Your link actually states that this was the warhead for the Davy Crockett, so we’re both right?
Variants
There were four distinct models of the basic W54 design used, each with different yield, but the same basic design. These were:
Mk-54 (Davy Crockett) — 10 or 20 ton yield, Davy Crockett artillery warhead
| 116 |
Wendya Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:18:29am |
| 117 |
pre-Boomer Marine brat Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:19:06am |
re: #111 Kosh’s Shadow
I’ll be damned. I would’ve thought a gun-method mechanism would be too fragile to survive the G-force applied by shooting it from a howitzer.
| 118 |
transient Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:19:13am |
re: #101 Kosh’s Shadow
They’ve had the knowledge for years, courtesy of Khan.
What should happen is a complete embargo of nuclear materials and technology to Iran, after destruction of their existing facilities.
No. They’ve had theoretical knowledge, not hands-on knowledge. Having the plans is different from being able to assemble it yourself (as I’m sure millions of parents discover every Christmas morning, or after they get home from Ikea.) Being able to actually make the centrifuges work was one step (now accomplished); actually putting together a functional bomb another (not as easy as people think). Once they have all the scientists and technical knowhow, you would then have to destroy all the knowledge base as well as the facilities, which is essentially impossible.
| 119 |
HelloDare Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:19:50am |
re: #106 Guy_Montag
Shi’i want the bomb? I recommend reading Studies In Muslim Apocalyptic by David Cook. Nothing makes my day like a supremacist eschatological belief system, or a decent roast beef sandwich with fresh spinach.
Three pages of the introduction are available at Amazon if you click LOOK INSIDE.
[Link: www.amazon.com…]
| 120 |
Spider Mensch Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:19:55am |
re: #116 Wendya
Obama’s Honduran policy is mind boggling.
not really..he wants the quasi leftist jr chavez thug back in power.
| 121 |
Salamantis Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:20:34am |
I wonder if there hasn’t been a behind-the-scenes deal struck; the US abandons the Polish/Czech missile shield, and Russia supports further UN sanctions on Iran.
Only time will tell.
| 122 |
Mad Al-Jaffee Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:20:42am |
But ISRAEL has nukes, and they’re commiting genocide! Why can’t we disarm them?!
(typical moonbat response)
| 124 |
McSpiff Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:20:56am |
re: #108 pre-Boomer Marine brat
And I misread. Alright lizards, foot out of mouth, food in. Probably catch most of you in the next thread.
| 125 |
Rexatosis Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:20:59am |
Does anyone really think Iran won’t use or sell the bomb once they are at an operational level? This is the story, the policies: strategies and tactics the West will choose to combat this threat, not the name-calling irrelevancies of both the right and left. Names will not hurt us but a Thermo-nuclear device shoved up our ass will.
| 126 |
transient Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:22:23am |
re: #102 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Oh. Okay. Let them have it.
Talk about lose-lose…
I didn’t say let them have it. However, I am uncertain that, at this stage, bombing them will make significant difference. The program should have been stopped long before this point.
I certainly would not be sorry if Israel (or anyone) attacked them. But I do not think it will stop the program, and there is a high likelihood that Hezballah will take revenge.
I am just glad it’s not my call to make.
| 127 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:22:42am |
re: #122 Mad Al-Jaffee
But ISRAEL has nukes, and they’re commiting genocide! Why can’t we disarm them?!
(typical moonbat response)
Don’t give the UN any ideas.
| 128 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:23:30am |
re: #125 Rexatosis
Does anyone really think Iran won’t use or sell the bomb once they are at an operational level? This is the story, the policies: strategies and tactics the West will choose to combat this threat, not the name-calling irrelevancies of both the right and left. Names will not hurt us but a Thermo-nuclear device shoved up our ass will.
And they’ll control the oil flow from the Mideast.
| 129 |
HypnoToad Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:24:41am |
re: #111 Kosh’s Shadow
Thanks for the quick link. My memory was faulty about the size.
11” instead of 8”.
| 130 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:25:03am |
re: #118 transient
No. They’ve had theoretical knowledge, not hands-on knowledge. Having the plans is different from being able to assemble it yourself (as I’m sure millions of parents discover every Christmas morning, or after they get home from Ikea.) Being able to actually make the centrifuges work was one step (now accomplished); actually putting together a functional bomb another (not as easy as people think). Once they have all the scientists and technical knowhow, you would then have to destroy all the knowledge base as well as the facilities, which is essentially impossible.
You destroy the facilities, and the world should say no more materials or technology. They try to rebuild, those get destroyed as well.
The alternative is a nuclear war. Or surrender. I’d prefer the war, actually, to surrender.
| 131 |
ointmentfly Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:30:53am |
Lets see… IAEA + associated press = probably a report that is a year old, so Iran probably ready to fire one by now…
| 132 |
SFGoth Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:30:53am |
I’m kinda in favor of Obama pulling the plug on a missile defense shield for Europe. Sucks for New Europe, but I’d sure love to see Old Europe sweat a bit knowing that Daddy just kicked them outta the house, in the rain.
| 133 |
Guy_Montag Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:31:13am |
re: #119 HelloDare
Three pages of the introduction are available at Amazon if you click LOOK INSIDE.
[Link: www.amazon.com…]
Thanks for the link. Anyone who doesn’t have a copy can get a preview. It’s an excellent text, giving a cogent overview of Classical Islamic Eschatology, and its connection to previous Judaic/Christian traditions. I’ll say one thing for Mo, he was an adept “borrower”.
| 134 |
transient Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:32:25am |
re: #130 Kosh’s Shadow
You destroy the facilities, and the world should say no more materials or technology. They try to rebuild, those get destroyed as well.
The alternative is a nuclear war. Or surrender. I’d prefer the war, actually, to surrender.
Fantastic. We’ve been trying to convince the Russians to stop giving them the technology for years, yet here we are. Russia and China do not want to piss Iran off. They want the trade, they want the oil.
Iranian facilities, as I’m sure you know, are not easy targets, and they’re only going to get harder.
I hate being this pessimistic/ cynical. I hope this is all a failure of imagination on my part, that there really is an answer to this.
| 135 |
transient Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:33:28am |
re: #130 Kosh’s Shadow
The alternative is a nuclear war. Or surrender. I’d prefer the war, actually, to surrender.
I should add, surrender is not an option.
| 136 |
Rexatosis Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:34:16am |
RE # 128 Kosh’s Shadow
An operational nuclear system gives Iran not only domination over the oil flow via the Persian Gulf but also strengthens Iran’s ability to influence oil production levels in the surrounding states including Saudi Arabia (such influence comes down to whom do you fear more, Iran with a nuke next door or the Americans with their fleet?). The refined gasoline deal with Hugo Chavez gives Iran economic immunity from the West’s strongest card and makes it harder for India to not sell Iran refined gas (why take an economic hit when it won’t work?). This has huge political, economic, and military ramifications.
| 138 |
brent Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:38:43am |
#136 This has huge political, economic, and military ramifications.
But in a good way, right? Like now we can all negotiate from a position of mutual understanding and love.
We are not governed by serious people, not surrounded by serious people. Except of course the bad ones - they’re serious as hell.
| 139 |
rollingdivision Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:38:50am |
Iran delivery systems for a nuclear bomb would be a truck, boat or commercial aircraft. Missiles would be an advantage but not necessary since their main targets are within a couple of thousand miles.
| 140 |
Drogheda Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:38:51am |
| 141 |
Son of the Black Dog Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:40:44am |
re: #130 Kosh’s Shadow
You destroy the facilities, and the world should say no more materials or technology. They try to rebuild, those get destroyed as well.
The alternative is a nuclear war. Or surrender. I’d prefer the war, actually, to surrender.
But it doesn’t look like the US will destroy the Iranian nuclear program anytime soon. I really can’t foresee any circumstances in which Obama would.
That leaves Israel, which has a bare minimum of air assets to do the job. No margin for error, and probably not the complete level of destruction needed.
Which leaves the use of Israel’s own nuclear arsenal to take out the Iranian program. The longer things go, the more likely it becomes that this will be the only resolution. Not a good scenario, as once the first nuke goes off, there’s no predicting where it will end. And it could end very, very badly.
| 142 |
Joshua Cohen Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:41:52am |
re: #140 Drogheda
You’re one “suprise” short of a Gomer-ism there.
Another thing that must got lost in translation. So what do are you talking about? I really have no glue!
| 143 |
brent Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:42:51am |
and I’m sorry, but Obama made the decision to cancel the missile shield without consulting congress? Really? There is no way this cat would ever act to stop Iran - it seems counter to his beliefs.
I think he wants to make the world a level playing field. A glowing, smoking, level playing field.
| 144 |
johnnygriswold Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:43:00am |
I wonder if the secret document is in some vault in Hawaii with Obama’s birth certificate.
| 145 |
brent Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:44:40am |
#142 gomerism…
Gomer Pyle used to always say Surprise, surprise, surprise - in threes. That’s an old TV show, if the reference is completely foreign to you…
| 146 |
Joshua Cohen Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:46:59am |
re: #145 brent
#142 gomerism…
Gomer Pyle used to always say Surprise, surprise, surprise - in threes. That’s an old TV show, if the reference is completely foreign to you…
Did I mentioned that I grow up behind the iron curtain?
| 147 |
dwells38 Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:47:42am |
Gosh how shocking. They were actually able to sneak that past the watchful UN and the European diplomats who were patiently walking them back from the brink?
| 148 |
transient Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:48:12am |
re: #139 rollingdivision
Iran delivery systems for a nuclear bomb would be a truck, boat or commercial aircraft. Missiles would be an advantage but not necessary since their main targets are within a couple of thousand miles.
They have been working on a missile delivery system for several years now, based on the North Korean No Dong. It is capable of reaching Israel and parts of Europe.
| 149 |
transient Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:49:59am |
Ah well, long past time to do something productive.
‘Later.
| 150 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:50:44am |
re: #146 Joshua Cohen
Did I mentioned that I grow up behind the iron curtain?
well, then…
сюрприз, сюрприз, сюрприз
| 151 |
Korla Pundit Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:51:20am |
I’m glad the UN is only interested in preserving peace.
| 152 |
Joshua Cohen Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:53:01am |
re: #150 EmmmieG
well, then…
сюрприз, сюрприз, сюрприз
Not so far behind. But “Da towarisch - Ja gawarju pa russki.”
| 153 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:54:01am |
re: #136 Rexatosis
RE # 128 Kosh’s Shadow
An operational nuclear system gives Iran not only domination over the oil flow via the Persian Gulf but also strengthens Iran’s ability to influence oil production levels in the surrounding states including Saudi Arabia (such influence comes down to whom do you fear more, Iran with a nuke next door or the Americans with their fleet?). The refined gasoline deal with Hugo Chavez gives Iran economic immunity from the West’s strongest card and makes it harder for India to not sell Iran refined gas (why take an economic hit when it won’t work?). This has huge political, economic, and military ramifications.
And adding to who do you fear (or trust) more, consider Obama just threw Eastern Europe under the bus. You think the Saudis will trust the US to defend them? They’re not stupid.
| 154 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:56:10am |
re: #146 Joshua Cohen
Did I mentioned that I grow up behind the iron curtain?
well, then…
сюрприз, сюрприз, сюрпризre: #152 Joshua Cohen
Not so far behind. But “Da towarisch - Ja gawarju pa russki.”
Actually, I gave up trying to speak Russian after I told a tour group to drive into a building. (Which is not so tough, if you know how Russian is constructed.)
| 155 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 11:59:46am |
re: #154 EmmmieG
Actually, I gave up trying to speak Russian after I told a tour group to drive into a building. (Which is not so tough, if you know how Russian is constructed.)
“He crosses McArthur park and walks into a great sandstone building”
“Oh! My nose!”
/Firesign Theatre
| 156 |
lostlakehiker Thu, Sep 17, 2009 12:01:01pm |
The report, from what I see, says that Iran has the knowhow (“sufficient information”.) Whether Iran has, right now, sufficient high-grade U235 is beyond the scope of the report.
Hardly matters. Just because something may possibly be a danger that comes to full fruition months or years later rather than tomorrow is no cause for relief. Tomorrow comes. Months later comes. Years later comes.
What then? Much depends on how powerful Ahmadinejad is. If he runs the show and the mullahs have been kicked upstairs, then everything rides on the mind of just one man. If there is a collective leadership, then the culture and history of Persia becomes a guide of sorts.
| 158 |
Joshua Cohen Thu, Sep 17, 2009 12:06:42pm |
re: #154 EmmmieG
Actually, I gave up trying to speak Russian after I told a tour group to drive into a building. (Which is not so tough, if you know how Russian is constructed.)
I have not needed it for…well 20 or so years. Ok, except some polite words in the neighborhood - we have a lot of immigrants from the former Sovietunion and they like a real bad Russian more than a quite good German ;).
But I usually stick to the Ivrit…
In reality I would have said: “Ueberraschung!” and that as a “Üüüüberraaaschuuung!”
Well never mind…
| 159 |
Joshua Cohen Thu, Sep 17, 2009 12:11:03pm |
re: #158 Joshua Cohen
I have not needed it for…well 20 or so years.
Thats not true! We used it while playing OPFOR in NATO maneuvers not so long ago…well…late 90ties maybe up to 2002.
| 160 |
funky chicken Thu, Sep 17, 2009 12:13:10pm |
Golf clap for Mohamed El Baradei. What a damned shame he and Kofi Annan can’t be tried in The Hague.
| 161 |
Doubleview Thu, Sep 17, 2009 12:28:13pm |
At least it’s reassuring that we have an expert in early childhood education (Ellen Tauscher) as an Undersecretary of State for Arms Control.
[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
| 162 |
Kosh's Shadow Thu, Sep 17, 2009 12:39:37pm |
re: #161 Doubleview
At least it’s reassuring that we have an expert in early childhood education (Ellen Tauscher) as an Undersecretary of State for Arms Control.
[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
Well, Laura Roslin worked out well as replacement president of the Caprican fleet after the Cylons wiped out everyone else.
/DO I NEED TO?
| 163 |
zelnaga Thu, Sep 17, 2009 12:47:38pm |
[Link: www.newsweek.com…]
That article, published yesterday, seems to contradict this article…
| 164 |
EE Thu, Sep 17, 2009 12:57:38pm |
The only options that have ever been publicly mentioned are: more talk (will give Iran the time it needs, but allow everyone to pretend that they are doing something); sanctions; encouraging dissidents in Iran to thrive, and giving them support, to try to get a more moderate regime in Iran; armed attack of some kind. Obama seems stuck on talk, talk, talk, which will give Iran all the time that it needs. It’s just a game of pretense and illusion, and the outcome is that Iran will have a nuclear weapon.
| 165 |
abu_garcia Thu, Sep 17, 2009 1:43:18pm |
re: #119 HelloDare
Here’s an article by David Cook at the Boston College center for millenial research.
[Link: www.mille.org…]
lots of other good stuff there, too.
| 166 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Sep 17, 2009 3:36:35pm |
It has only been a matter of time that they reach this point. Given how far behind the times IAEA tends to be, I would expect an Iranian test soon.
| 167 |
Rich H Thu, Sep 17, 2009 5:46:46pm |
The news is very depressing, but I don’t think that it’s likely that Iran will launch a preemptive nuclear strike against Israel.
My take:
Once they have nukes (actually when they reveal that they have them), the US and NATO struggle in Afghanistan becomes mute. Remember why we went into Afghanistan? It was to take out the Taliban-sponsored terrorist training camps and bring about regeme change in that country.
What if a nuclear-armed Iran sets up such training camps (or worse)? The US will not be able to do in Iran what it did in Afghanistan without risking catastrophic retaliation to Israel or US allies in the gulf region.
The result? Expect a dramatic rise in international terrorism. Also expect a proxy war to break out against Israel from Lebanon and/or Gaza like nothing we have seen before.
| 168 |
Raydog Fri, Sep 18, 2009 8:35:53am |
There’s nothing to see here. All is well now that Dear Reader has blocked the Missile Defense Shield in Europe. Iran will obviously abandon the Nuclear Weapons program after Barry’s show of good faith.
| 169 |
dogberry Fri, Sep 18, 2009 9:09:56am |
Doesn’t the nuclear risk from Iran make an Israeli attack inevitable?
| 170 |
idioma Fri, Sep 18, 2009 1:55:13pm |
This will probably not end well for the people of Iran. It is sad to know that so many people, even while protesting their own government, are hostage to a Nuclear Exchange. Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is a mad man, his reckless behavior puts the entire world in jeopardy.
It would seem that Iranian revolution is the only way for the people of Iran to avoid mass death on their own soil.
This is so tragic.
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Why Did More Than 1,000 People Die After Police Subdued Them With Force That Isn’t Meant to Kill? An investigation led by The Associated Press has found that, over a decade, more than 1,000 people died after police subdued them through physical holds, stun guns, body blows and other force not intended to be lethal. More: Why ... Cheechako
3 weeks ago
Views: 517 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 5- A Closer Look at the Eastman State Bar DecisionTaking a few minutes away from work things to read through the Eastman decision. As I'm sure many of you know, Eastman was my law school con law professor. I knew him pretty well because I was also running in ...KGxvi
3 weeks ago
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Abortions Outside Medical System Increased Sharply After Roe Fell, Study Finds The number of women using abortion pills to end their pregnancies on their own without the direct involvement of a U.S.-based medical provider rose sharply in the months after the Supreme Court eliminated a constitutional right to abortion, according ... Cheechako
4 weeks ago
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Once Praised, the Settlement to Help Sickened BP Oil Spill Workers Leaves Most With Nearly Nothing When a deadly explosion destroyed BP’s Deepwater Horizon drilling rig in the Gulf of Mexico, 134 million gallons of crude erupted into the sea over the next three months — and tens of thousands of ordinary people were hired ... Cheechako
Yesterday
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Texas County at Center of Border Fight Is Overwhelmed by Migrant Deaths EAGLE PASS, Tex. - The undertaker lighted a cigarette and held it between his latex-gloved fingers as he stood over the bloated body bag lying in the bed of his battered pickup truck. The woman had been fished out ... Cheechako
4 days ago
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