Like this wasn't expected?!?!?! Color me surprised...

Here comes the strongly worded letter.

unclench damn you!!!

How absolutely taqiyah of them.

Show of hands, anyone suprised?

Please note that it was the Bush administration that decided to drop the objection to the Saudis' WTO membership, based on their transparently false promise to stop supporting the Arab League boycott.

I repeat: the Bush administration.

You mean that President Obama's soft diplomacy has yet again failed to realize a positive outcome for US interests in the region and around the world?

Color me shocked. /

It's those damn Juice in the "settlements" building porches and remodeling their kitchens.

/

re: #5 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Show of hands, anyone suprised?

Surprised it only took Congress a few years to figure it out. I expected our saudi "friends" would have bought more time than that.

heheh... in related news, the Gitmo trials have been continued yet again for another two months. The terrorists who are acting as their own attorneys have decided that they are going to boycott court.
You can't make this shiite up.

Trusting the Sauds is a multigenerational, multinational problem.

re: #6 Charles

The Bush administration, like every other administration since the sixties, has had its nose up the behinds of the House of Saud.
They would plead necessity. Still stinks.

So when will the WTO drop Saudi membership? Isn't an embargo like this a slap at the face of what the WTO stands for?
Why do I think they'll embrace an embargo on Israel first.

re: #13 Kosh's Shadow

The Saudis would act reasonably if Israel would just drop into the sea.

re: #13 Kosh's Shadow

So when will the WTO drop Saudi membership? Isn't an embargo like this a slap at the face of what the WTO stands for?
Why do I think they'll embrace an embargo on Israel first.

No they wont embrace the embargo. Because the WTO is run by Illuminati Joos!

/Paulian

Maybe another sword dance would convince them to keep their word.

/

re: #14 tradewind

The Saudis would act reasonably if Israel would just drop into the sea.

No, they wouldn't.

That's right -- one of the Bush administration's last official acts was to do a big favor for the House of Saud, when nobody in their right mind could have possibly expected them to keep their promise.

Saudi Arabia - yet another argument for nuclear power.

re: #16 karmic_inquisitor

Maybe another sword dance would convince them to keep their word.

/

I'd get banned for suggesting the kind of sword dance that would do so.

re: #18 Charles

I am so ashamed I voted for Bush now.

/

well, off to do some work

see you guys later

I'm closing the comments on the Rush Limbaugh thread because it's getting very tedious to have to keep answering the same attempted excuses for Limbaugh's blatant race baiting over and over.

re: #12 tradewind

The Bush administration, like every other administration since the sixties forties, has had its nose up the behinds of the House of Saud.
They would plead necessity. Still stinks.

Fixed

re: #21 Danny

I am so ashamed I voted for Bush now.

/

McCain, Gore, and John F'n Kerry would have all done the same bullshit. Every president has for like 50 years.

re: #19 karmic_inquisitor
Yes indeed. Until then, I look forward to the day when the flag that flies over the Royal House of Saud is replaced by the Big Red Texaco Star.

re: #18 Charles

That's right -- one of the Bush administration's last official acts was to do a big favor for the House of Saud, when nobody in their right mind could have possibly expected them to keep their promise.

I wonder why people supposedly in their right minds believe that the Saudis will recognize Israel (as a Jewish state) as part of their "peace" plan.
Of course, their "peace" plan is designed to flood Israel with Arabs so it will no longer be a Jewish state, and then Saudi Arabia will recognize Palestine III. (Gaza and Judea and Samaria being I and II)

re: #21 Danny

I am so ashamed I voted for Bush now.

/

I think the point was that Bush didn't bat 1000.

And doing such a deal with the House of Saud was basically insane. Doesn't undo everything he ever did, but it was stupid.

re: #6 Charles

Please note that it was the Bush administration that decided to drop the objection to the Saudis' WTO membership, based on their transparently false promise to stop supporting the Arab League boycott.

I repeat: the Bush administration.

Abso-effen-lutley.

re: #21 Danny

Don't expect TOTUS to treat them with any less respect.

re: #6 Charles

Please note that it was the Bush administration that decided to drop the objection to the Saudis' WTO membership, based on their transparently false promise to stop supporting the Arab League boycott.

I repeat: the Bush administration.

Bush the Saudi tuches lekker and Condi his oil whore, were willing tools of the Saudis.
But what will the Obama administration do about it?
I repeat: the Obama administration.

re: #26 tradewind

Yes indeed. Until then, I look forward to the day when the flag that flies over the Royal House of Saud is replaced by the Big Red Texaco Star.

They should make a special Texaco star for that event. One with six points.

re: #18 Charles

That's right -- one of the Bush administration's last official acts was to do a big favor for the House of Saud, when nobody in their right mind could have possibly expected them to keep their promise.

And one of their first acts was to get them outta here on a plane.

re: #6 Charles

Which is why we are hearing it now.

It reminds us that we've been played for fools by the Saudis forever, and it's still going on. It won't stop until we get our heads straight.

The Saudis are not our friends. They never will be.

re: #17 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Sorry, my sarc tag must have dropped into the sea.
//

totally OT, but sometimes you really need to say a name out loud...

[Link: blog.peta.org...]

It is precisely because of these shenanigans on the part of the Arab states that Obama is likely to rethink many of his policies on the M.E.

Charles posted a very interesting piece here the other day about the religious far right counter culture in the U.S. and how they play by different rules that people who are used to level headed debates work.

Obama may well have come into office being an ideologue with certain false assumptions of how the M.E. works.

In fact he made the error, that most lefties make when thinking of the M.E. They assume that the Arab world wants peace and that the Arab world will, because it want's peace, negotiate in good faith towards it. The reality is that the Arab world does not see that as an ultimate goal. They want respect and assuagement for a very large inferiority complex (to that end the Cairo speech was beneficial, even though I hate what was said about Israel). The Arab world also wants to eliminate Israel and to "not be the dupe" to the U.S.

Therefore, honestly, going in and expecting negotiations based on good faith and the common sense idea that war is bad, will not yield progress. The American left, and many on the right, make the critical error of assuming that these people think like we do. I am not saying this as an overgeneralized screed. I am not saying this as a brush to paint all Arabs as having antithetical values to the U.S.

However, the values of a theocratic monarchy that gets into public dismemberment, are most assuredly antithetical to American ones, and it is the height of madness to assume that such a government, and those that support such a government or think going to the decapitation is a family event, would possibly start from the same assumptions of what is right or good.

The truth is, you give an inch, and they will go for the mile.

Now, what makes Obama different from Carter, is that Obama sees this more and more clearly each day. The Arabs have a way of never failing to fail in dealing with the West. They had their greatest chance to put the screws to Israel in recent history - had they convinced Obama that they wanted to make a reasonable peace. By doing the opposite however, the shrewd, and not blind Obama will be rethinking that perhaps the assumptions he made were indeed false.

I think we are are seeing this in action now.

That anyone ever believed the Saudis would not violate their promise on this is further confirmation that there are a great many stupid people about.

re: #6 Charles

Please note that it was the Bush administration that decided to drop the objection to the Saudis' WTO membership, based on their transparently false promise to stop supporting the Arab League boycott.

I repeat: the Bush administration.

Prince Bandar of Saudi Arabia is/was a lifelong friend of W. They grew up in the oil patch together.

re: #31 Spare O'Lake

Bush the Saudi tuches lekker and Condi his oil whore, were willing tools of the Saudis.
But what will the Obama administration do about it?
I repeat: the Obama administration.

What do you think?

re: #36 McSpiff

totally OT, but sometimes you really need to say a name out loud...

[Link: blog.peta.org...]

OK.

WTF?

From your link:

'Ben Hur' Hurts Animals

You should read the sh*t they are writing about me in the comments!

No way!

/

re: #38 Pullus Iulius

That anyone ever believed the Saudis would not violate their promise on this is further confirmation that there are a great many stupid people about.

Not stupid. Paid.

It's not an excuse, Lord knows, but imagine replacing the Sauds with, say, Iran, in their same spot. Same wealth. Same geographic location, same amount of US holdings.
It could be worse. What the administrations have done is dance with the devil in the pale moonlight, but there was at least the farce. Imagine our government secretly trying to ask Iran or Syria for airspace permission.

re: #19 karmic_inquisitor

Saudi Arabia - yet another argument for nuclear power.

That could be interpreted in more than one way.

Right. And all those Saudi students here in the States are fully vetted and accounted for.

And I am Marie of Romania.

re: #37 LudwigVanQuixote

Will Obama convince congress to ok a massive "stimulus" project of building hundreds of nuclear reactors? Until that happens, we are not serious about either the Oil Sultans or AGW.

re: #41 Ben Hur

in case anyone missed it, the name of the blog is "The Peta Files". Say it out loud a few times. Note, I support nothing on that site. I just find the name hilarious.

re: #47 ArchangelMichael

Al Gore's gonna want to dump his Oxy stock first.

re: #37 LudwigVanQuixote

Obama is still acting like he expects to be able to make peace between Israel and the Palestinians, even when the Palis admit they don't want it.

According to a statement issued by White House press secretary Robert Gibbs, the meeting "will continue the efforts of President Obama, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, and special envoy George Mitchell to lay the groundwork for the re-launch of negotiations, and to create a positive context for those negotiations so that they can succeed."
...
PA negotiator Saeb Erekat, however, said in a statement that Abbas had no intention of pursuing peace at this point: "The Palestinian leadership is insisting that there will be no peace negotiations unless settlement activities are halted."

"Did I do that?"
-Steve Urkel

This is too funny. Someone just submitted a Blogad for Glenn Beck's ridiculous new book.

Somebody trying to play a gotcha game, possibly. "Look what a hypocrite Chuckles is!"

I think I'll take their money and let them rant about it. Should be amusing. And meanwhile I'll continue mocking Beck.

re: #46 Cato the Elder

Right. And all those Saudi students here in the States are fully vetted and accounted for.

And I am Marie of Romania.

ohhh baby.

re: #48 McSpiff

in case anyone missed it, the name of the blog is "The Peta Files". Say it out loud a few times. Note, I support nothing on that site. I just find the name hilarious.

I think that was understood.

re: #40 Charles

What do you think?

Nada, Nothing, Zilch... anyone one of those...

re: #48 McSpiff

Why you perv
///.

re: #54 Ben Hur

You'd think, but I just had to really spell it out to a friend...

re: #43 Charles

Not stupid. Paid.

And people still believe the Jooos control everything.

The powers that be won't do anything about Saudi funded schools who teach radical islam here in the United States. I doubt they'll have the balls to do anything more than whine, lest the Saudis dick around with our purchase of their damned oil.

re: #40 Charles

What do you think?

I think he can probably be bought.

re: #52 Charles

I like your style!

re: #50 Kosh's Shadow

The definition of insanity is...

re: #58 Kosh's Shadow

And people still believe the Jooos control everything.

Well the recruiter told me they did. That's why I joined. They don't control everything? Then what the hell have they been doing with my monthly membership check. Geez. Its getting so you have to vet every call from Nigeria these days . . ./

re: #44 tradewind

It's not an excuse, Lord knows, but imagine replacing the Sauds with, say, Iran, Israel in their same spot. Same wealth. Same geographic location, same amount of US holdings.
It could be worse better. What the administrations have done is dance with the devil in the pale moonlight, but there was at least the farce. Imagine our government secretly trying to ask Iran or Syria Israel for airspace permission.

That would be freaken embarrassing.

re: #40 Charles

What do you think?

Nichts, nada, rien, niente, כלום, zip, nihil, diddly squat, dick, bugger all...it's amazing how any number of nothings adds up to...nothing.

re: #52 Charles

This is too funny. Someone just submitted a Blogad for Glenn Beck's ridiculous new book.

Somebody trying to play a gotcha game, possibly. "Look what a hypocrite Chuckles is!"

I think I'll take their money and let them rant about it. Should be amusing. And meanwhile I'll continue mocking Beck.

You will make heads explode!

Its an Islamic thing. Lies are acceptable to get what you want from infidels.

re: #50 Kosh's Shadow

Of course he is saying that. No American president is going to say that peace over there is no longer a goal. However, you might have noticed that his much vaunted, and soon to be completed plan for implementing dais peace, has been shelved. I have been waiting for it like a shoe to drop for months. The fact that it has not is a strong indicator of a paradigm shift in his thinking.

re: #47 ArchangelMichael

Will Obama convince congress to ok a massive "stimulus" project of building hundreds of nuclear reactors? Until that happens, we are not serious about either the Oil Sultans or AGW.

I couldn't agree more.

re: #64 Alouette

I'm not sure, but I don't think Israel would be a problem.
We have had to use the Saudis before, under the table, putting them in situations that have enraged the rest of the Muslim world. Other, less pragmatic countries would probably not have played.
That's all I meant.

re: #68 LudwigVanQuixote

Of course he is saying that. No American president is going to say that peace over there is no longer a goal. However, you might have noticed that his much vaunted, and soon to be completed plan for implementing dais peace, has been shelved. I have been waiting for it like a shoe to drop for months. The fact that it has not is a strong indicator of a paradigm shift in his thinking.

I hope you're right, but the time the "peace plan" was supposed to be unveiled is this week. And this meeting does have a bit of an "offer you can't refuse" about it:

The summit will take place at a particularly important time for Obama, who is keen - according to observers in Jerusalem - to go to the UN General Assembly and the G-20 meeting of the heads of the world's leading economies with an achievement, rather than a stalemate, in the Middle East diplomatic process.

According to these assessments, once Obama invited the parties to talks, neither could refuse.

re: #69 tradewind

I'm not sure, but I don't think Israel would be a problem.
We have had to use the Saudis before, under the table, putting them in situations that have enraged the rest of the Muslim world. Other, less pragmatic countries would probably not have played.
That's all I meant.

Israel would not be a problem.

I think we would all be better off if Israel had just kept going in '67.

re: #48 McSpiff

in case anyone missed it, the name of the blog is "The Peta Files". Say it out loud a few times. Note, I support nothing on that site. I just find the name hilarious.

LOL! You can actually get hooked reading some of those little articles. But it did remind me of a Newsweek article:

PETA and Euthanasia

The money quote:

The organization has practiced euthanasia for years. Since 1998 PETA has killed more than 17,000 animals, nearly 85 percent of all those it has rescued.

Man, if I were a doggie and I saw a PETA worker coming toward me saying, "Good dog, I'm here to save you!", my response in dog language would be "Uh, I don't think so."

re: #6 Charles

Please note that it was the Bush administration that decided to drop the objection to the Saudis' WTO membership, based on their transparently false promise to stop supporting the Arab League boycott.

I repeat: the Bush administration.

Then this is a perfect opportunity for President Obama to show the saudis that he's not a wimp. By lying and reneging on their promise to Mr. Obama's predecessor and the "international community," the saudis are disrespecting Mr. Obama as well. He should respond in some meaningful way.

re: #71 Alouette

I don't see any way out of Osirak II. And I wish them Godspeed, because they will be carrying our water.

re: #25 ArchangelMichael

McCain, Gore, and John F'n Kerry would have all done the same bullshit. Every president has for like 50 years.

To be honest, I'm not so sure about McCain, especially post 9/11/01. McCain is very pro-nuke power and has been for years, and was never an oil guy or a friend with the Saudi royal family.

McCain is also on the board of some environmental organizations...like this one:
[Link: www.rep.org...]

A lot of what people "know" about John McCain is pure BS, and most of it came from Rush Limbaugh over the years. Limbaugh has hated McCain for at least a decade. I first learned about that in 1999 during the early stages of the GW Bush vs McCain primary race. The absolute visceral hatred/disgust from Limbaugh to McCain was stunning.

OK, now I'm off to do some work :-).

re: #71 Alouette

Israel would not be a problem.

I think we would all be better off if Israel had just kept going in '67.

Where Israel stopped isn't the problem, it is that Israel is willing to give away the land it recaptured. And I say "give away" because "give back" would mean to Egypt and Jordan.
And the biggest problem is that Israel is being pressured to give away the land when the people they're supposed to give it to haven't kept one agreement they've had.
Gaza should have been proof that "land for peace" was a false concept.

re: #73 _RememberTonyC

the saudis are disrespecting Mr. Obama

With Obama in the WH and Hillary as our SecState, you have no idea of the degree of disrespect the Saudis feel for our administration.
Don't hear much from Jimmy about that, though. Strange.

re: #73 _RememberTonyC

He should respond in some meaningful way.

Yes, he should, however my money's on his doing sod all.

Next thing ya know, the Saudi's won't be buying biofuels from us

/

re: #77 tradewind

With Obama in the WH and Hillary as our SecState, you have no idea of the degree of disrespect the Saudis feel for our administration.
Don't hear much from Jimmy about that, though. Strange.

It couldn't because the Saudi's are racist and misogynistic, could it?

re: #34 Dianna

Which is why we are hearing it now.

It reminds us that we've been played for fools by the Saudis forever, and it's still going on. It won't stop until we get our heads straight.

The Saudis are not our friends. They never will be.

I don't think we've been played for fools. Every administration knows the dynamics here. Saudi holds most of the cards and behaves accordingly.

re: #80 MikeAlv77

Bingo.

re: #76 Kosh's Shadow

Where Israel stopped isn't the problem, it is that Israel is willing to give away the land it recaptured. And I say "give away" because "give back" would mean to Egypt and Jordan.
And the biggest problem is that Israel is being pressured to give away the land when the people they're supposed to give it to haven't kept one agreement they've had.
Gaza should have been proof that "land for peace" was a false concept.

I hate it when people say "give back" because it just buys into the phony Arab narrative that the Jews "stole their land."

How did the Arabs happen to "possess" the land, if not for the force of conquest they keep whining about when they lose wars of annihilation that they start?

re: #40 Charles

What do you think?

There's nothing that can be done by any Administration regarding SA's WTO membership now that it has been granted. The US had blocked the membership through objections, but once those objections were dropped they were admitted.

It would take the WTO membership to pull together an ouster at this point, something nearly impossible to imagine, even with as much leverage as the US could bring to bear applied.

re: #31 Spare O'Lake

and Condi his oil whore

I had to downding this. Over the top, IMO.

re: #83 Alouette

I hate it when people say "give back" because it just buys into the phony Arab narrative that the Jews "stole their land."

How did the Arabs happen to "possess" the land, if not for the force of conquest they keep whining about when they lose wars of annihilation that they start?

You are right. Note I said the 6 day war "recaptured" land, not "conquered" it.

Hey Lizards!

Would you say it's a truism that: The Saudi's have a permanant "get out of jail free" card?

How's it going all?

re: #77 tradewind

With Obama in the WH and Hillary as our SecState, you have no idea of the degree of disrespect the Saudis feel for our administration.
Don't hear much from Jimmy about that, though. Strange.

fuck jimmy ... fuck him

re: #52 Charles

Just snug it right up next to the AngerManagementOnline bit.

re: #88 _RememberTonyC

fuck jimmy ... fuck him

NO Thanks! I'd prefer he be carted-off to the home where he can get the rest and care he, so obviously, needs.

re: #81 Flyers1974

I don't think we've been played for fools. Every administration knows the dynamics here. Saudi holds most of the cards and behaves accordingly.

We've been fools. Venal fools.

If the Saudis actually hold the cards, it's because we gave them the deck.

re: #87 ggt

I'd say the Saudi's have a semi-permanant "giant lake of oil", but its really a distinction without a difference.

oil

re: #68 LudwigVanQuixote

I would love to believe the scales have fallen from Obama's eyes regarding the Palestinians, but I'll need a lot more evidence.

re: #70 Kosh's Shadow

I hope you're right, but the time the "peace plan" was supposed to be unveiled is this week. And this meeting does have a bit of an "offer you can't refuse" about it

Good article! I caught a few of those snippets too.

Obama is not much different than Bush was in relationship to Israel, now matter how people wish to perceive that. From that article:

Netanyahu's meeting with Obama will be the first time he will speak to Obama since the prime minister delivered his speech at Bar-Ilan University in June, in which he declared a readiness to accept a Palestinian state if it was demilitarized and did not pose a threat to Israeli security. Netanyahu has, however, met with Mitchell on numerous occasions since then.

The first clause of the road map, as it was in Oslo and in ALL peace plans, is that the Arabs must stop the violence. I really don't know why they keep spinning their wheels until this happens (it has not), but I guess politicians have to keep being politicians.

Before you start dissing Obama on Israel, here is what Bush did.

1. Bush visited Israel only once, 3 months ago, at the end of his term.

2. He visited Jordan, Egypt and Qatar in 2003 and Jordan again in 2006.

3. Bush was the first president to call for the existence of a "Palestinian" state, despite Sharon's objections. Carter didn't even do that.

4. Bush never acknowledged Jerusalem as the capitol of Israel even after the Congress did.

5. Bush influenced Sharon to abandon the West Bank settlements.

6. Bush encouraged Hamas elections.

7. He put in European monitors at the Philadelphi corridor despite Israel's objections.

8. Acceptance of Baker's Iraqi Study Group report calling for a 2 state solution, returning the Golan Heights to Syria, and pulling back to the 1967 borders.

9. Warning Sharon not to attack the Arabs after they attacked Israel.

10. Visits between Condi and Abbas and pro-Arabs declarations by Cheney.

By the way, just an update:

Zuckerlilly has so far declined my open challenge to back up her tendentious, outrageous statements about the German health-care system yesterday.

She said:

If a German physician e.g. an internist, has 3 patients with HIV his budget is eaten up, because the budgets of German physicians are limited. Now comes a fourth HIV patient and wants a treatment. What to do? The physician can either say “look for another physician” and refuse to treat her/him or she/he can pay her/his treatment out of his own pocket (!) including drugs from the pharmacy.

Meanwhile, of the eight German Facebook friends I asked for comment, three have told me they don't recognize their system in this description. The other five haven't responded yet.

Zuckerlilly also made similar statements about the horrors of "socialized medicine" in Sweden and Finland. One lizard challenged her on the latter.

Lesson: Just because someone tells you it's worse in Country X, doesn't make it so. Do your own research.

re: #93 Lawrence Schmerel

oil

What the Israelis need is a modern day Chanukah miracle, say involving a single barrel of light sweet crude which miraculously is refined into an endless stream of light and medium products.

re: #90 ggt

NO Thanks! I'd prefer he be carted-off to the home where he can get the rest and care he, so obviously, needs.

I don't want to get a dreaded time out or banishmant, and I respect Charles' house too much to say what I really would like to see happen to carter. But suffice it to say that he is as evil a man as this country has produced and I hope the Lord treats him accordingly on Judgment Day.

re: #75 funky chicken

Limbaugh didn't make up the fact that McCain has had Saudi lobbyists on his staff, or that his plane flew some of the Saudis out of the country post 9-11, or that there are numerous other connections there. Sorry, but when it comes to the Saudis, there is hardly a clean American hand.

re: #86 Kosh's Shadow

You are right. Note I said the 6 day war "recaptured" land, not "conquered" it.

What?! The Seven Day War... oh, Six, right... was when Israel carried out an uprovoked attack on the peaceful, sovereign nation-state of Palestine, stole all its land, and started committing GENOCIDE against its people! (Okay, it's been an incredibly incompetent genocide, what with the Pali population tripling since then... but still!)

/more or less compilation of pro-Pali talking points I've heard over the years

re: #53 LudwigVanQuixote

Stop it. "People" over at a certain blog will be talking...

re: #96 Cato the Elder

By the way, just an update:

Zuckerlilly has so far declined my open challenge to back up her tendentious, outrageous statements about the German health-care system yesterday.

She said:

Meanwhile, of the eight German Facebook friends I asked for comment, three have told me they don't recognize their system in this description. The other five haven't responded yet.

Zuckerlilly also made similar statements about the horrors of "socialized medicine" in Sweden and Finland. One lizard challenged her on the latter.

Lesson: Just because someone tells you it's worse in Country X, doesn't make it so. Do your own research.

We have friends in Germany, I've not heard them complain. I don't know the specifics tho. German has always been good in medicine.

re: #53 LudwigVanQuixote

/get a room/

re: #95 marjoriemoon

I copied this from an old post of mine, sorry for the typo in #1 :)

re: #77 tradewind

With Obama in the WH and Hillary as our SecState, you have no idea of the degree of disrespect the Saudis feel for our administration.
Don't hear much from Jimmy about that, though. Strange.

I don't know how terribly relevant Jimmy Carter is these days, but at any rate, I don't think it matters whether the Saudi's respect any particular administration. What matters is that we need Saudi oil to keep flowing and for the government not to be overthrown by people even more nutty than the current.

re: #52 Charles

This is too funny. Someone just submitted a Blogad for Glenn Beck's ridiculous new book.

Somebody trying to play a gotcha game, possibly. "Look what a hypocrite Chuckles is!"

I think I'll take their money and let them rant about it. Should be amusing. And meanwhile I'll continue mocking Beck.

The Nation takes ads from cigarette companies, while calling for stiffer tobacco regulation. Their ad policy specifically reserves the right to mock, pillory, decry and satirize their advertisers.

Do it.

re: #105 Flyers1974

I don't know how terribly relevant Jimmy Carter is these days, but at any rate, I don't think it matters whether the Saudi's respect any particular administration. What matters is that we need Saudi oil to keep flowing and for the government not to be overthrown by people even more nutty than the current.

One thing I have noticed is that the British Monarch's get on well with the Saud's. I have to wonder if those that do get on with them somehow sympathise with the idea of monarchy.

re: #96 Cato the Elder

By the way, just an update:

Zuckerlilly has so far declined my open challenge to back up her tendentious, outrageous statements about the German health-care system yesterday.

She said:

Meanwhile, of the eight German Facebook friends I asked for comment, three have told me they don't recognize their system in this description. The other five haven't responded yet.

Zuckerlilly also made similar statements about the horrors of "socialized medicine" in Sweden and Finland. One lizard challenged her on the latter.

Lesson: Just because someone tells you it's worse in Country X, doesn't make it so. Do your own research.

Glad to have your update, Cato.

re: #97 John Neverbend

What the Israelis need is a modern day Chanukah miracle, say involving a single barrel of light sweet crude which miraculously is refined into an endless stream of light and medium products.

We have our modern day miracle. We ain't dead :)

re: #99 tradewind

The lavishly-furnished custom Boeing 727 airliner (727PX) which ferried Senator John McCain on four occasions during his Presidential run in 2000 also flew Saudi Royals out of the U.S. right after 9/11, carrying an entourage of Saudi Royals from Las Vegas to London six days after the 9/11 attack in a controversial operation later scrutinized by the 9/11 Commission.

The 727 figures in the current tempest over his relationship with female lobbyist Vicki Iseman, who provided and flew with McCain on the plane.

With hundreds of air charter companies and airliners to choose from, the Saudis chose a company that owns “Worship Ministries” and Christian Network, Inc., turning to Paxson Communications, a “Christian broadcaster” which owned the plane, to make its corporate jet available to spirit the Saudi princes and their entourage out of the U.S. six days after 9/11.

[Link: www.democraticunderground.com...]

yeah, and he had an affair with Vicky Iseman too, right?

OK, that BS came from Limbaugh's counterpart on the far left. But it's BS all the same.

re: #95 marjoriemoon

Before you start dissing Obama on Israel, here is what Bush did.

I'll diss Obama on Israel, but I'll diss Bush, too.
My comments on Obama aren't in comparison with Bush; they're in comparison with what should be done.
There was some time Bush seemed to be standing up to people who wanted him to pressure Israel into a disastrous "peace plan", but he gave in at the end, with the Annapolis conference, that should have been canceled when Abbas refused to recognize Israel's right to exist as a Jewish state.

Obama does seem to have reduced his pressure on Israel, but it is higher than it should be, when there is little pressure on the Arabs to live up to their agreements.

re: #107 ggt

One thing I have noticed is that the British Monarch's get on well with the Saud's. I have to wonder if those that do get on with them somehow sympathise with the idea of monarchy.

Then the Queen didn't know about the band playing the Vader march in advance?

re: #91 Dianna

We've been fools. Venal fools.

If the Saudis actually hold the cards, it's because we gave them the deck.

I'm not sure what you mean by giving it to them, but in the event you mean we haven't been serious about becoming less dependent on oil, I'd agree with you.

re: #85 Occasional Reader

I disagree, but thanks for explaining.

re: #96 Cato the Elder

There's an astounding amount of misinformation out there.

OT:

Credit Where It's Due Dept.:

Hard-left magazine Mother Jones actually publishes an article by the guy who videotaped the Black Panther voter intimidation attempt in Philly.

/hat tip: Instanpundit

re: #113 Flyers1974

I'm not sure what you mean by giving it to them, but in the event you mean we haven't been serious about becoming less dependent on oil, I'd agree with you.

That's precisely what I meant.

Charles keeps posting article after article on "Our Friends the Saudis", and none of us should be surprised by now. But our government - no matter what administration we're talking about - is like the goose that wakes up in a new universe every morning.

re: #98 _RememberTonyC

I don't want to get a dreaded time out or banishmant, and I respect Charles' house too much to say what I really would like to see happen to carter. But suffice it to say that he is as evil a man as this country has produced and I hope the Lord treats him accordingly on Judgment Day.

Write to him, respectfully, of course -

carterweb@emory.edu

re: #97 John Neverbend

What the Israelis need is a modern day Chanukah miracle, say involving a single barrel of light sweet crude which miraculously is refined into an endless stream of light and medium products.

Will that happen before or after they cleanse the Third Temple?

re: #107 ggt

One thing I have noticed is that the British Monarch's get on well with the Saud's. I have to wonder if those that do get on with them somehow sympathise with the idea of monarchy.

No, it's because the Saudis are tied up in Queen Lizzie's smack trade.

/

re: #112 Dianna

Then the Queen didn't know about the band playing the Vader march in advance?

Does this mean the Saudi prince is Britain's daddy?

re: #112 Dianna

Then the Queen didn't know about the band playing the Vader march in advance?

ha
!

re: #118 SummerSong

Write to him, respectfully, of course -

carterweb@emory.edu

Since I can't be respectful, I won't write.
Or post here what would be such poetic justice.

re: #121 Kosh's Shadow

Does this mean the Saudi prince is Britain's daddy?

I've come up with a brilliant, Jedi-like plan to hide Britain from its father: We'll rename it "Saudi Britain", and move it right next to the Saudi Arabian peninsula.

/

re: #107 ggt

One thing I have noticed is that the British Monarch's get on well with the Saud's. I have to wonder if those that do get on with them somehow sympathise with the idea of monarchy.

Interesting question. Churchill had good things to say about Ibn Saud during world war II, but those were comments about Saud personally, at least the few such comments I've read.

re: #119 Alouette

Will that happen before or after they cleanse the Third Temple?

The way some predictions are made for the time of Mashiach makes it sound like we'll have an endless supply of clean energy. They couldn't put it that way for a ancient agricultural society, but that's how I'd read those predictions for a modern energy-based society.

re: #115 Killgore Trout

There's an astounding amount of misinformation out there.

I am, for the record, still willing to be educated by Zuckerlilly. All it would take is a credible link or two. In German? No problem. I'll even translate it for her, for free.

re: #96 Cato the Elder

of the eight German Facebook friends I asked for comment, three have told me they don't recognize their system in this description. The other five haven't responded yet.

Query: Do your German Facebook friends purport to be physicians, or otherwise be intimately aware of the workings of their national health system?

re: #118 SummerSong

Write to him, respectfully, of course -

carterweb@emory.edu

Thanks for the email address, but ...

#1 ... he won't read it
#2 ... even if he did read it he wouldn't care about my opinion
#3 ... even if he DID care, he'd still believe in his own evil BS

re: #127 Cato the Elder

I am, for the record, still willing to be educated by Zuckerlilly. All it would take is a credible link or two. In German? No problem. I'll even translate it for her, for free.

I Babelfished the original posts (hers and yours). It was enough to get about 60% comprehension. Not bad actually.

re: #101 Cato the Elder

Stop it. "People" over at a certain blog will be talking...

I have always been entertained that those "people" consider calling someone gay to actually be the height of insult.

re: #130 Pianobuff

I Babelfished the original posts (hers and yours). It was enough to get about 60% comprehension. Not bad actually.

I find Google Translate to be somewhat better than Babelfish.

re: #125 Flyers1974

“If Hitler invaded hell I would make at least a favorable reference to the devil in the House of Commons.” - Winston Churchill

re: #94 Occasional Reader

I would love to believe the scales have fallen from Obama's eyes regarding the Palestinians, but I'll need a lot more evidence.

I don't they have completely yet. I am however confident that the Arabs are busy chipping them away for us as we speak.

re: #107 ggt

One thing I have noticed is that the British Monarch's get on well with the Saud's. I have to wonder if those that do get on with them somehow sympathise with the idea of monarchy.

The Brits are the ones who put the fucking caravan-robbing clan of Saud on a throne! How far back do you think their medieval monarchy goes? Try 1923.

re: #128 Occasional Reader

Query: Do your German Facebook friends purport to be physicians, or otherwise be intimately aware of the workings of their national health system?

You think it takes a German physician to know whether Zuckerlilly's statement (quoted above) is true?

Since it affects their lives as intimately as ours does us, the German health-care system is certainly as well-understood by Germans as ours is here. Probably better, because most Germans actually bother to read and vote.

So what is your point?

re: #99 tradewind

Limbaugh didn't make up the fact that McCain has had Saudi lobbyists on his staff, or that his plane flew some of the Saudis out of the country post 9-11, or that there are numerous other connections there. Sorry, but when it comes to the Saudis, there is hardly a clean American hand.

original source of that "McCain's [sic] plane flew Saudis out of the US after 9/11:

[Link: www.madcowprod.com...]

Madcow in the morning? Really? tradewind, you're a fan of Madcow?

Like I said, much of what people "know" about John McCain is BS.

re: #117 Dianna

That's precisely what I meant.

Charles keeps posting article after article on "Our Friends the Saudis", and none of us should be surprised by now. But our government - no matter what administration we're talking about - is like the goose that wakes up in a new universe every morning.

The only thing we disagree on it seems is semantics. I don't think we're fools, I just think we don't have the political concensus or willpower to become less dependant on oil. The issue is too highly politisized and there are too many interest groups involved here. Sounds like we're saying pretty much the same thing.

re: #130 Pianobuff

I Babelfished the original posts (hers and yours). It was enough to get about 60% comprehension. Not bad actually.

I translated both of them (I'm a professsional) in one of my posts on that thread. For a laugh, you might want to compare what the "AI" at Babelfish puts out with the product of my allegedly human brain...

By the way, with whom did you make the bet you won last night? If you don't want to tell me here, my nic is blue. (That's also an invitation to be friends.)

re: #125 Flyers1974

Interesting question. Churchill had good things to say about Ibn Saud during world war II, but those were comments about Saud personally, at least the few such comments I've read.

I think, as individuals, there are Saud's who are truly good people, but as a political faction, they have to do what they perceive as what is good for them.

I think that it must be a terrible quandry for some of them. Other's not so much.

re: #137 funky chicken

original source of that "McCain's [sic] plane flew Saudis out of the US after 9/11:

[Link: www.madcowprod.com...]

Madcow in the morning? Really? tradewind, you're a fan of Madcow?

Like I said, much of what people "know" about John McCain is BS.

LOL Madcow...

Even Alex Jones thinks that guy is a kook.

re: #111 Kosh's Shadow

I'll diss Obama on Israel, but I'll diss Bush, too.
My comments on Obama aren't in comparison with Bush; they're in comparison with what should be done.
There was some time Bush seemed to be standing up to people who wanted him to pressure Israel into a disastrous "peace plan", but he gave in at the end, with the Annapolis conference, that should have been canceled when Abbas refused to recognize Israel's right to exist as a Jewish state.

Obama does seem to have reduced his pressure on Israel, but it is higher than it should be, when there is little pressure on the Arabs to live up to their agreements.

Actually, I really didn't mean to imply YOU dissed Obama. I realized that after I posted. It was to the general Lizard populace. I didn't see you diss Obama.

So many folks have already decided that Obama is bad for Israel, I don't think they remember that Bush made some serious blunders. All U.S. Presidents have except for Nixon who was really and truly Israel's bestie. I'd go so far to say that Israel may not exist today if it hadn't been for Nixon and his $ and arms support.

Whatever the U.S. does or doesn't do, I don't think Israel will bargain while violence continues.

re: #136 Cato the Elder

You think it takes a German physician to know whether Zuckerlilly's statement (quoted above) is true?

Since it affects their lives as intimately as ours does us, the German health-care system is certainly as well-understood by Germans as ours is here. Probably better, because most Germans actually bother to read and vote.

So what is your point?

My point is that your proposed counter to zuckerlilly's claim has, ah, rather dramatic evidentiary limitations. Your German Facebook friends do not necessarily know that level of detail of how their system works, unless they, themselves, are health care providers or occupy a similar role within it. (And on that "bother to read and vote" bit, once again, your disdain for your own countrymen is duly noted.)

re: #111 Kosh's Shadow

I'll diss Obama on Israel, but I'll diss Bush, too.
My comments on Obama aren't in comparison with Bush; they're in comparison with what should be done.
There was some time Bush seemed to be standing up to people who wanted him to pressure Israel into a disastrous "peace plan", but he gave in at the end, with the Annapolis conference, that should have been canceled when Abbas refused to recognize Israel's right to exist as a Jewish state.

Obama does seem to have reduced his pressure on Israel, but it is higher than it should be, when there is little pressure on the Arabs to live up to their agreements.

This a concur with. In a fair world, there would be no questions at all. Consider the vast public outcry for how Russia dealt with Muslim insurgents in Chechnya... Or the massive outcry when America invaded Afghanistan. Or the screaming done when different Arab groups kill other Arab terrorists. Or the outcry when Thailand built a "racist apartheid wall to contain Muslim terrorists in their own country etc... etc...

But we do not live in a fair world. And besides, who told you being a Yid was always fun?

What we can hope for is that more reality seeps in. What we can really hope for is that the truths about AGW take a firm hold and the civilized world weens itself from petrochemical dependence. If we did not need oil, there would be no questions at all about who is the bad guy.

re: #137 funky chicken

There's a serious effort from the paleocons and libertarians to smear neocons like Bush and McCain as they try to construct a neoConfederate/Libertarian Republican party.

re: #135 Alouette

The Brits are the ones who put the fucking caravan-robbing clan of Saud on a throne! How far back do you think their medieval monarchy goes? Try 1923.

I know. Yet, Prince Charles still cavorts with them. Perhaps he made some good friends over the years from boarding school--I don't know. Just seems an oddity to me.

re: #145 Killgore Trout

RS McCain to a brief break from his LGF obsession today to smear Bush over something. So it goes.

re: #131 LudwigVanQuixote

I have always been entertained that those "people" consider calling someone gay to actually be the height of insult.

Haakondahl was starting to do it to me, here. Haven't seen him in a while. Self-banning, or is he waiting for an opportune moment to flounce?

re: #138 Flyers1974

We are. It's a subject on which I get a tad bitter.

re: #147 Killgore Trout

RS McCain to a brief break from his LGF obsession today to smear Bush over something. So it goes.

How many ranting posts about me is he up to now? I think there were about 10 of them last time I looked at his hate site.

re: #136 Cato the Elder

the German health-care system is certainly as well-understood by Germans as ours is here

And I doubt that most Americans, even well-educated ones, would know, for instance, "what exactly does an American doctor do if an insurance company refuses to pay a reasonable claim, and the patient is in effect judgment-proof". Simply polling random American Facebook friends on the answer would be some evidence, but not very good evidence.

(And, for the record, I have no idea if zuckerlilly's claim is true or not.)

re: #141 ArchangelMichael

Dammit that's what I get for reading too fast. Not the same thing I thought it was, but yeah about as reliable of a source as Michael Moore was on Bush.

re: #141 ArchangelMichael

I had to upding that. It's such an unlikely thought.

re: #148 Cato the Elder

Haakondahl was starting to do it to me, here. Haven't seen him in a while. Self-banning, or is he waiting for an opportune moment to flounce?

I dunno, and I don't care to speculate on that. However, I do know that gay is not an insult.

The Political Cesspool blog is also ranting about me, by the way -- and they're very disappointed that RS McCain didn't come out and admit he was a white supremacist.

re: #143 Occasional Reader

My point is that your proposed counter to zuckerlilly's claim has, ah, rather dramatic evidentiary limitations. Your German Facebook friends do not necessarily know that level of detail of how their system works, unless they, themselves, are health care providers or occupy a similar role within it. (And on that "bother to read and vote" bit, once again, your disdain for your own countrymen is duly noted.)

Horseshit. If the German system were such that an extra chronically-ill patient meant a doctor either had to turn him/her away or pay for the treatment out of (the doctor's) pocket, everybody in Germany would know about it. You're full of it, as usual.

And my disdain for my countrymen is in direct proportion to their evident political and intellectual disengagement from reality.

re: #144 LudwigVanQuixote

But we do not live in a fair world. And besides, who told you being a Yid was always fun?

The food ain't bad!

re: #155 Charles

The Political Cesspool blog is also ranting about me, by the way -- and they're very disappointed that RS McCain didn't come out and admit he was a white supremacist.

Was JammieWearingFool banned?

re: #134 LudwigVanQuixote

For years, I thought I was pro-Arab in the Arab vs Israel conflict. I still have many Arab friends even today. Im not sure if there is a better way to smoke than the hookah. But then for school we had to sit through a presentation on the blight of the Iraqi people due to the sanctions. By the end of it, I couldn't take it. How could someone argue Iraqi warehouses were empty when Saddam himself was willing to say they were full of shells? The embargo only stopped whatever Saddam wanted to have stopped. He was the humanitarian disaster. I viewed myself as speaking out against anti-idiotary, not anti-Arab. Being probably 15 at the time, my.. outburst shocked some people.

I was later given a note thanking me for what I had done from one of the more prominent Jewish members of my community. He's a lawyer, and in his college days a quite accomplished debater. He thanked me for being willing to stand up against what was presented as an authority figure.

Point of the rant: There's really no need to view the conflict as Arab vs Israeli. Anti-idiot will generally take you to the right conclusion. If only politics didn't get in the way for our leaders.

re: #158 Ben Hur

Was JammieWearingFool banned?

Hey Hur!

re: #154 LudwigVanQuixote

I dunno, and I don't care to speculate on that. However, I do know that gay is not an insult.

Except in the South Park sense of the word.

re: #157 marjoriemoon

The food ain't bad!

And Shana Tova!

Actually our food rocks!

he says as he nashes on a blintz...

re: #156 Cato the Elder

You're full of it, as usual.

Oh, dear.

re: #160 ggt

Hey Hur!

Wussabi?

re: #153 Dianna

I had to upding that. It's such an unlikely thought.

I was thinking of Mancow, not Madcow though. A quick look at that page show it to probably be a kook fest though. Apparently with McCain Derangement Syndrome.

re: #159 McSpiff

For years, I thought I was pro-Arab in the Arab vs Israel conflict. I still have many Arab friends even today. Im not sure if there is a better way to smoke than the hookah. But then for school we had to sit through a presentation on the blight of the Iraqi people due to the sanctions. By the end of it, I couldn't take it. How could someone argue Iraqi warehouses were empty when Saddam himself was willing to say they were full of shells? The embargo only stopped whatever Saddam wanted to have stopped. He was the humanitarian disaster. I viewed myself as speaking out against anti-idiotary, not anti-Arab. Being probably 15 at the time, my.. outburst shocked some people.

I was later given a note thanking me for what I had done from one of the more prominent Jewish members of my community. He's a lawyer, and in his college days a quite accomplished debater. He thanked me for being willing to stand up against what was presented as an authority figure.

Point of the rant: There's really no need to view the conflict as Arab vs Israeli. Anti-idiot will generally take you to the right conclusion. If only politics didn't get in the way for our leaders.

And Idiocy seems to cross all boundries. Leaving the reverse (anti-idiocy) true as well.

Good point!

We are all in this together.

re: #46 Cato the Elder

Right. And all those Saudi students here in the States are fully vetted and accounted for.

And I am Marie of Romania.

So Marie, is it only Saudi students you fear? There are a lot more Pakistani students currently studying in the USA...

re: #164 Ben Hur

Wussabi?

Just hangin' yaknow.

re: #127 Cato the Elder

Cato, I really don't think any one blogger can (even if he/she wanted to) sum up an entire country's health care system in a blog entry -- besides, it's just one opinion and no one (outside of the writer) knows the motivation...So, Blogger X has a friend in Germany with AIDS, and, bingo, the person with AIDS suffers excruciating pain/dies/ etc., and then blogger X writes that's it's all due to the German Health Care system...(or any number of other scenarios)...

Anyway, CNN did do a very brief snippet on the German system (iirc, the report noted that most German doctors moonlight on the weekends -- going to the UK or Sweden, etc., where they can earn up to 6 times more money. Apparently, German doctors leave Germany, due to poor pay and working conditions. So, there's a doctor shortage.)

re: #156 Cato the Elder

And my disdain for my countrymen is in direct proportion to their evident political and intellectual disengagement from reality.

Whereas Germans, of course, have always been noteworthy for their rock-solid, eminently reasonable political choices.

Right?

"Leading Democratic and Republican congressmen idiots expressed outrage ..."

FTFY, JPost

/bbl

re: #140 ggt

I think, as individuals, there are Saud's who are truly good people, but as a political faction, they have to do what they perceive as what is good for them.

I think that it must be a terrible quandry for some of them. Other's not so much.

I agree and I think every country does. Very interesting people the Saudi's. I don't know how you have a country where becasue of prejudice against performing physical labor, you import workers despite high unemployment. Just one of many odd things about Saudi.

re: #165 ArchangelMichael

I was thinking of Mancow, not Madcow though. A quick look at that page show it to probably be a kook fest though. Apparently with McCain Derangement Syndrome.

I'm getting confused by all the McCains. How many of them are in the news now?

re: #11 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Trusting the Sauds is a multigenerational, multinational problem.

Hell, it's a bipartisan problem!

re: #164 Ben Hur

Wussabi?

No, thanks, I prefer my sushi less spicy.

re: #169 J.S.

Cato, I really don't think any one blogger can (even if he/she wanted to) sum up an entire country's health care system in a blog entry -- besides, it's just one opinion and no one (outside of the writer) knows the motivation...So, Blogger X has a friend in Germany with AIDS, and, bingo, the person with AIDS suffers excruciating pain/dies/ etc., and then blogger X writes that's it's all due to the German Health Care system...(or any number of other scenarios)...

Anyway, CNN did do a very brief snippet on the German system (iirc, the report noted that most German doctors moonlight on the weekends -- going to the UK or Sweden, etc., where they can earn up to 6 times more money. Apparently, German doctors leave Germany, due to poor pay and working conditions. So, there's a doctor shortage.)

I think that is what is going to happen here --reverse brain drain.

re: #144 LudwigVanQuixote

This a concur with. In a fair world, there would be no questions at all. Consider the vast public outcry for how Russia dealt with Muslim insurgents in Chechnya... Or the massive outcry when America invaded Afghanistan. Or the screaming done when different Arab groups kill other Arab terrorists. Or the outcry when Thailand built a "racist apartheid wall to contain Muslim terrorists in their own country etc... etc...

But we do not live in a fair world. And besides, who told you being a Yid was always fun?

What we can hope for is that more reality seeps in. What we can really hope for is that the truths about AGW take a firm hold and the civilized world weens itself from petrochemical dependence. If we did not need oil, there would be no questions at all about who is the bad guy.

Let them yell and scream. My guess is the Israeli's could have a functioning society and never use a drop of oil, they're THAT smart.

Israel to build the world's largest solar plant
[Link: www.israelnationalnews.com...]

Israel's renewable resources and the electric car
[Link: eponline.com...]

And Water too!
[Link: www.greenprophet.com...]

OT
Offering a little hope in race relations.

A new post up at Defenseman.
Someones' not gonna be happy.

re: #172 Flyers1974

I agree and I think every country does. Very interesting people the Saudi's. I don't know how you have a country where becasue of prejudice against performing physical labor, you import workers despite high unemployment. Just one of many odd things about Saudi.

Monarch-symdrome. "we are too good to work". Not good for a people.

re: #173 ggt

I'm getting confused by all the McCains. How many of them are in the news now?

Well, there's the one who took down those terrorists at the Nakitomi Building in LA back in '88 or so...

re: #174 SanFranciscoZionist

Hell, it's a bipartisan problem!

No it's simply foolish to trust the Saudis.

re: #144 LudwigVanQuixote

This a concur with. In a fair world, there would be no questions at all. Consider the vast public outcry for how Russia dealt with Muslim insurgents in Chechnya... Or the massive outcry when America invaded Afghanistan. Or the screaming done when different Arab groups kill other Arab terrorists. Or the outcry when Thailand built a "racist apartheid wall to contain Muslim terrorists in their own country etc... etc...

But we do not live in a fair world. And besides, who told you being a Yid was always fun?

What we can hope for is that more reality seeps in. What we can really hope for is that the truths about AGW take a firm hold and the civilized world weens itself from petrochemical dependence. If we did not need oil, there would be no questions at all about who is the bad guy.

First, I'll say there has been hatred of Jews even before our enemies controlled a necessary supply for our civilizations, so I'm not sure removing our dependence on oil will eliminate this. But it will be reduced, especially at the state level.

Second, during one of the times Israel went into Gaza to stop terrorism, Russia complained that their response was "disproportionate". My response to him will explain why I'm not a diplomat.
"I'm glad that the representative from Russia believes that our response was 'disproportionate'. Since Russia engaged in massive war against Chechniya, when the Chechens themselves were not existential threats to Russia, I will assume that 'proportionate' response to those who refuse to accept our right to exist is to be even tougher on them, and I take this to be your approval at such actions. We will prepare for a massive operation."

I'm leaving some details out, and of course, I'm not suggesting that Israel actually take such action, just that they show the Russians' hypocrisy.

Oh man! Rohrabacher is going off on CSPAN to the Iraqi representatives.

"I have never heard one word of gratitude without being prompted from any elected Iraqi official except for the Kurds. I hope you realize, that 4300 Americans lost their lives."

He also said:

"They'll never have grandchildren now because their sons or daughters lost their lives trying to give you people a chance at democracy."

Get down!

re: #28 karmic_inquisitor

I think the point was that Bush didn't bat 1000.

And doing such a deal with the House of Saud was basically insane. Doesn't undo everything he ever did, but it was stupid.

There's a recurrent fantasy that the Saudis will solve the "Middle East crisis". The theory seems to be that they're our business partners, and have influence in the Arab world, so somehow...somehow...

re: #165 ArchangelMichael

It's all right.

re: #156 Cato the Elder

Horseshit. If the German system were such that an extra chronically-ill patient meant a doctor either had to turn him/her away or pay for the treatment out of (the doctor's) pocket, everybody in Germany would know about it. You're full of it, as usual.

And my disdain for my countrymen is in direct proportion to their evident political and intellectual disengagement from reality.

And you know this about Deutschland how, and so vehemently defend their health care system to the point of expressing disdain for America why?

re: #177 marjoriemoon

Let them yell and scream. My guess is the Israeli's could have a functioning society and never use a drop of oil, they're THAT smart.

Israel to build the world's largest solar plant
[Link: www.israelnationalnews.com...]

Israel's renewable resources and the electric car
[Link: eponline.com...]

And Water too!
[Link: www.greenprophet.com...]

Could be why the whacko's are so skeerred of 'em.

re: #184 Equable

Oh man! Rohrabacher is going off on CSPAN to the Iraqi representatives.

"I have never heard one word of gratitude without being prompted from any elected Iraqi official except for the Kurds. I hope you realize, that 4300 Americans lost their lives."

He also said:

"They'll never have grandchildren now because their sons or daughters lost their lives trying to give you people a chance at democracy."

Get down!

"You people?"

re: #181 Occasional Reader

Well, there's the one who took down those terrorists at the Nakitomi Building in LA back in '88 or so...

Old news -- ha!

re: #157 marjoriemoon

The food ain't bad!

But we have to give up lobster, crab, pork, cheeseburgers (except for veggie ones),...

While there was a time I did indulge in such things, I no longer do so, and have found there are benefits to keeping kosher, but they are at a spiritual level that is hard to explain.

re: #50 Kosh's Shadow

Obama is still acting like he expects to be able to make peace between Israel and the Palestinians, even when the Palis admit they don't want it.

It's the rules. No U.S. president is ever allowed to say "Folks, this can't be done."

re: #189 Ben Hur

"You people?"

"What do you mean, 'you people'?"

-Tropic Thunder

re: #107 ggt

One thing I have noticed is that the British Monarch's get on well with the Saud's. I have to wonder if those that do get on with them somehow sympathise with the idea of monarchy.

The British monarchy seems to get on well with most other monarchs. In Europe this is helped to a certain degree by the fact that some of the royal families are related to each other, albeit rather distantly.

As for the Middle Eastern monarchs, I think the late King Hussein of Jordan was at least as close to the British royals as were the Saudis. In fact, his brother, Prince Hassan was often on TV talking about the Middle East. He had a consummate ability to talk for 5-10 minutes without actually saying anything of substance.

re: #169 J.S.

Cato, I really don't think any one blogger can (even if he/she wanted to) sum up an entire country's health care system in a blog entry -- besides, it's just one opinion and no one (outside of the writer) knows the motivation...So, Blogger X has a friend in Germany with AIDS, and, bingo, the person with AIDS suffers excruciating pain/dies/ etc., and then blogger X writes that's it's all due to the German Health Care system...(or any number of other scenarios)...

Anyway, CNN did do a very brief snippet on the German system (iirc, the report noted that most German doctors moonlight on the weekends -- going to the UK or Sweden, etc., where they can earn up to 6 times more money. Apparently, German doctors leave Germany, due to poor pay and working conditions. So, there's a doctor shortage.)

That is doubtless true. I've heard the same thing myself.

My objection was to the narrow, specific claim about doctors paying out-of-pocket for patient treatment. That should be easy enough to document, if true. And it would be a widely-known fact in Germany, because German doctors have their own organizations and they'd be screaming bloody murder.

re: #170 Occasional Reader

Whereas Germans, of course, have always been noteworthy for their rock-solid, eminently reasonable political choices.

Right?

Touché.

re: #189 Ben Hur

He was talking to the Iraqi representatives. I doubt there's any underlying connotation in "you people".

re: #192 SanFranciscoZionist

It's the rules. No U.S. president is ever allowed to say "Folks, this can't be done."

Presidents and O'Reilly should be forbidden from using the word "Folks."

re: #162 LudwigVanQuixote

And Shana Tova!

Actually our food rocks!

he says as he nashes on a blintz...

Blintzes are for Shavuot. Honey cake and apple strudel are for Rosh Hashanah.

re: #196 Equable

He was talking to the Iraqi representatives. I doubt there's any underlying connotation in "you people".

See #193

re: #198 Alouette

Blintzes are for Shavuot. Honey cake and apple strudel are for Rosh Hashanah.

I love blintzes!

re: #185 SanFranciscoZionist

There's a recurrent fantasy that the Saudis will solve the "Middle East crisis". The theory seems to be that they're our business partners, and have influence in the Arab world, so somehow...somehow...

They can and do buy much of the Arab world. To see them as our partners is delusional. They understand that they were a bunch of goatherds until we found oil. Until then, nobody gave shit one about them. Now they have the oil, and can have the money, but they know the oil will run out,and then they will be goatherds about whom nobody gives shit one,unless they can find a way to make their wealth permanent.

re: #155 Charles

The Political Cesspool blog is also ranting about me, by the way -- and they're very disappointed that RS McCain didn't come out and admit he was a white supremacist.

Ha!

This all sounds delicious...

re: #83 Alouette

I hate it when people say "give back" because it just buys into the phony Arab narrative that the Jews "stole their land."

How did the Arabs happen to "possess" the land, if not for the force of conquest they keep whining about when they lose wars of annihilation that they start?

Also, as pointed out above, neither nation that previously owned that land is being offered it back--or would take it at gunpoint.

re: #198 Alouette

Blintzes are for Shavuot. Honey cake and apple strudel are for Rosh Hashanah.

Here we go again.

Ashkenazim thinking there the only Jews on Earth...

Gotcha!

I am so glad that Robert Downey Jr. got his act cleaned up, he's such a damned good actor.

re: #159 McSpiff

For years, I thought I was pro-Arab in the Arab vs Israel conflict. I still have many Arab friends even today. Im not sure if there is a better way to smoke than the hookah. But then for school we had to sit through a presentation on the blight of the Iraqi people due to the sanctions. By the end of it, I couldn't take it. How could someone argue Iraqi warehouses were empty when Saddam himself was willing to say they were full of shells? The embargo only stopped whatever Saddam wanted to have stopped. He was the humanitarian disaster. I viewed myself as speaking out against anti-idiotary, not anti-Arab. Being probably 15 at the time, my.. outburst shocked some people.

I was later given a note thanking me for what I had done from one of the more prominent Jewish members of my community. He's a lawyer, and in his college days a quite accomplished debater. He thanked me for being willing to stand up against what was presented as an authority figure.

Point of the rant: There's really no need to view the conflict as Arab vs Israeli. Anti-idiot will generally take you to the right conclusion. If only politics didn't get in the way for our leaders.

There's that whole revisionist history thing. People believe the Jews "stole Palestinian land" which is where it starts in the Arab/Israeli conflict. It's not true. First Jews have been living in Palestine for some 3500 years, about 1400 years before the birth of Mohammad. Second, they bought the land from Arab landowners fair and square in 1947-8.

So you have to have history right and people have to correct where it's wrong. It's no different then other revisionist history, but for the Jews it's bad. It's a living genocide really... destroy the history and you destroy the culture.

p.s. It IS an Arab/Israeli conflict. I'm ok with that. Well I'm not OK with the violence! But they are who the are and we are who we are. One day we will live in peace with them. Maybe I'll live to see it.

re: #139 Cato the Elder

I translated both of them (I'm a professsional) in one of my posts on that thread. For a laugh, you might want to compare what the "AI" at Babelfish puts out with the product of my allegedly human brain...

By the way, with whom did you make the bet you won last night? If you don't want to tell me here, my nic is blue. (That's also an invitation to be friends.)

Yup. I compared the B-fish result with your translation and it was 60% of the way there. Of course the parts that are not right are way off. IIRC there was something in the result about brunch being a bad word or some such nonsense. Check your inbox.

re: #175 Occasional Reader

No, thanks, I prefer my sushi less spicy.

Had these things called firecracker shrimp saturday at a sushi place. They were fried wonton with cream cheese, a whole shrimp and a mint leaf filling. Very yummy

re: #200 ggt

I love blintzes!

I do too, but the blintzes, and the cheesecake, are too powerful to have more than once a year. It is the source of our awesome Zionist strength.

But you have to eat it with the gefilte fish.

I still haven't heard from realwest.

re: #199 Ben Hur

See #193

The only movie that has ever made me laugh at the image of a panda bear stabbed through the heart.

re: #185 SanFranciscoZionist

There's a recurrent fantasy that the Saudis will solve the "Middle East crisis". The theory seems to be that they're our business partners, and have influence in the Arab world, so somehow...somehow...

The Saudi "peace plan" is a "flood Israel with Arabs" plan.
Quick analysis. Point 1 is a "just solution" to the refugee problems in accordance with some UN resolutions, which require a state to take back any refugees who came from that area.
Point 4 says "Any Palestinian repatriation must take into account the special circumstances of the Arab nations." - translation "We aren't taking a single refugee. Well, maybe just a few, for symbolic reasons."
Then, the Arabs tell the UN that since there is a peace treaty, there is no longer any need for all the "refugee camps". No one else takes the "refugees"; Israel (and "Palestine") have to, under the treaty, with most going to Israel.
Israel becomes an Arab state, and then the Saudis will recognize it.

re: #211 ggt

Somebody mentioned they heard from him a few days ago and he's hanging in there. I'm still pretty worried.

re: #209 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

They were fried wonton with cream cheese, a whole shrimp

You're displaying a wonton disregard for your cholesterol levels.

re: #187 Spare O'Lake

And you know this about Deutschland how, and so vehemently defend their health care system to the point of expressing disdain for America why?

I lived there for ten years, I read/speak/write the language more fluently than a good number of the natives, and I peruse the German press daily. That good enough for you?

And I'm not defending their health-care system. I'm asking for information, which Zuckerlilly declines to provide - because I used the bad, bad word "bullshit". At least that's her excuse.

And disdain for America? I disdain the stupid bits and love the rest.

re: #205 Ben Hur

Ashkenazim thinking there the only Jews on Earth...

We're not? Uh oh.

re: #205 Ben Hur

Here we go again.

Ashkenazim thinking there the only Jews on Earth...

We had Moroccan style food at one of the homes where we were guests, and it was good.

Who, me surprised? Hell no, I lived there for a time, and not with the military.

re: #191 Kosh's Shadow

But we have to give up lobster, crab, pork, cheeseburgers (except for veggie ones),...

While there was a time I did indulge in such things, I no longer do so, and have found there are benefits to keeping kosher, but they are at a spiritual level that is hard to explain.

I was thinking more of my grandma's cooking. She didn't keep Kosher, but we didn't eat pork, shellfish, etc. Chopped liver, gefilte fish (she made from scratch) noodle kugel, tsmis(?) etc. Yummy yum yum.

re: #191 Kosh's Shadow

But we have to give up lobster, crab, pork, cheeseburgers (except for veggie ones),...

While there was a time I did indulge in such things, I no longer do so, and have found there are benefits to keeping kosher, but they are at a spiritual level that is hard to explain.

And much agreed!

re: #129 _RememberTonyC

Thanks for the email address, but ...

#1 ... he won't read it
#2 ... even if he did read it he wouldn't care about my opinion
#3 ... even if he DID care, he'd still believe in his own evil BS

I understand, but you ever know. I always encouraged my kids to write in to whoever, whatever they had a gripe with. One of them, at 8 yrs old, ended up as a one night co-host on a local cable show!

December 23, 1776
THESE are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands by it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives every thing its value. Heaven knows how to put a proper price upon its goods; and it would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as FREEDOM should not be highly rated. Britain, with an army to enforce her tyranny, has declared that she has a right (not only to TAX) but "to BIND us in ALL CASES WHATSOEVER" and if being bound in that manner, is not slavery, then is there not such a thing as slavery upon earth. Even the expression is impious; for so unlimited a power can belong only to God.

re: #218 Alouette

We had Moroccan style food at one of the homes where we were guests, and it was good.

You don't sound too convincing!

I was being semi-sarcastic, off course!

re: #191 Kosh's Shadow

But we have to give up lobster, crab, pork, cheeseburgers (except for veggie ones),...

While there was a time I did indulge in such things, I no longer do so, and have found there are benefits to keeping kosher, but they are at a spiritual level that is hard to explain.

You're a better person than me... I could never give up eating seabugs or bacon.

I'm going to Jerusalem tomorrow for a quick visit. What mehadrin restaurants should I hit? I'll be staying right next to Ben Yehuda mall.

re: #159 McSpiff

For years, I thought I was pro-Arab in the Arab vs Israel conflict. I still have many Arab friends even today. Im not sure if there is a better way to smoke than the hookah. But then for school we had to sit through a presentation on the blight of the Iraqi people due to the sanctions. By the end of it, I couldn't take it. How could someone argue Iraqi warehouses were empty when Saddam himself was willing to say they were full of shells? The embargo only stopped whatever Saddam wanted to have stopped. He was the humanitarian disaster. I viewed myself as speaking out against anti-idiotary, not anti-Arab. Being probably 15 at the time, my.. outburst shocked some people.

I was later given a note thanking me for what I had done from one of the more prominent Jewish members of my community. He's a lawyer, and in his college days a quite accomplished debater. He thanked me for being willing to stand up against what was presented as an authority figure.

Point of the rant: There's really no need to view the conflict as Arab vs Israeli. Anti-idiot will generally take you to the right conclusion. If only politics didn't get in the way for our leaders.

I know a number of Arabs through business and have a few I regard as good friends. What never ceases to amaze me are the conspiracy theories held by normally very smart individuals. And the refusal to question these theories and things they find on the internet. I'm beginning to think that at this point its just a cultural necessity. I was discussing the 9-11 thing with this one Arab guy and while he was relating how it was probably a conspiracy, I got the vibe he was trying to somehow convey something along the lines of "you know that I know the conspiracy stuff is nonsense, but I have to say it, its my obligation, so stop busting my balls..." Maybe I completely imagined that, but it was my impression.

re: #215 Occasional Reader

You're displaying a wonton disregard for your cholesterol levels.

you say that like it's bad thing.

re: #173 ggt

I'm getting confused by all the McCains. How many of them are in the news now?

You read my mind.

re: #214 Killgore Trout

Somebody mentioned they heard from him a few days ago and he's hanging in there. I'm still pretty worried.

me too! Not like him to be off-line for so long.

re: #216 Cato the Elder

I lived there for ten years, I read/speak/write the language more fluently than a good number of the natives, and I peruse the German press daily. That good enough for you?

Impressive. Was that pre- or post-war?

re: #226 Alouette

I'm going to Jerusalem tomorrow for a quick visit. What mehadrin restaurants should I hit? I'll be staying right next to Ben Yehuda mall.

Chinese food?

LOL!

Why am I seeing duplicate posts?

re: #179 Irish Rose

A new post up at Defenseman
Someones' not gonna be happy.

Wow, Defenseman came back loaded for bear.

I bet there is one little Latin King wannabe in Tampa
who is going to be blowing a fuse when he hears about it.

re: #191 Kosh's Shadow

But we have to give up lobster, crab, pork, cheeseburgers (except for veggie ones),...

While there was a time I did indulge in such things, I no longer do so, and have found there are benefits to keeping kosher, but they are at a spiritual level that is hard to explain.

If only you knew the power of the Dark Side...

/vader voice

re: #220 marjoriemoon

I was thinking more of my grandma's cooking. She didn't keep Kosher, but we didn't eat pork, shellfish, etc. Chopped liver, gefilte fish (she made from scratch) noodle kugel, tsmis(?) etc. Yummy yum yum.

The real gefilte fish, not the stuff from jars that requires lots of horseradish to be edible.
There are loaves you can get in the freezer that aren't bad; that's what the rebbetzins use at the Chabads I go to.

BTW, on Saturday, over lunch at the Chabad, one person expressed some liking for some of Ron Paul's ideas. His father, a strong conservative from NH, didn't want to go into details, but tried to tell him RP was not good for the Jews. I have now sent the father a list of links from LGF showing how Ron Paul supports the John Birch Society; connections with Stormfront; that he has expressed some trooferism; etc. I'll hear more on the response in the next few days.

So, Charles, you might have helped keep a Jew from voting for Ron Paul. See how this blog can be useful?

re: #233 Alouette

Why am I seeing duplicate posts?

How many fingers am I holding up?

re: #229 Flyers1974

You read my mind.

And, I know what you are thinking right now -- ha!

re: #230 ggt

me too! Not like him to be off-line for so long.

I was going to drop him a line on Saturday, but then my laptop died the death.

Does anyone know if realwest would like to receive emails, or would he rather rest?

re: #225 MrSilverDragon

You're a better person than me... I could never give up eating seabugs or bacon.

I gave it up in my early teens, along with taking sugar in my tea, but the latter was not for religious reasons. I miss the prawn cocktails.

Good night everyone. I know you think it's the middle of the afternoon but it's past my bedtime here in Tzefat.

re: #241 Alouette

Good night everyone. I know you think it's the middle of the afternoon but it's past my bedtime here in Tzefat.

Layla Tov.

Thanks for being a good sport!

Enjoy J-m while we can!

re: #237 SixDegrees

How many fingers am I holding up?

It depends. Did you just confront a bunch of ObamaCare supporters?

/

re: #231 Spare O'Lake

Impressive. Was that pre- or post-war?

If you mean that kerfuffle back in 1914-19, pre.

re: #227 Flyers1974

Honestly, I haven't experienced that. One of my friends was very scared to tell me that his grand father had be a close associate of bin Laden's father so I cant really accuse him buying into the "jews did it" conspiracy. Or at the very least he didnt try to push any conspiracy on me. I've also sadly have had way too many white people reveal beliefs in everything from free energy to moon hoaxes. Again, anti-stupid in all its forms.

re: #207 marjoriemoon

Honestly, that all sounds reasonable to me. I don't personally focus on the whole transfer of ownership of land as much as some people. Israel exists. Its recognized by my government and many others. It has neighbours that vary between wishing to see it destroyed up to a certain degree of apathy, after trying to destroy it. It has a population of non-citzens living within its borders that, by the government they elected, have stated they would like to see it destroyed.

In my mind, thats the starting point. I'm also 21, so my few of history is short indeed.

re: #211 ggt

I still haven't heard from realwest.

Don't worry too much y'all he is alright just heard from him via email.
Apart from a bad toothache which he is about to have done today.

re: #241 Alouette

Good night everyone. I know you think it's the middle of the afternoon but it's past my bedtime here in Tzefat.

Good night, and enjoy a mystical experience.

re: #239 Dianna

I was going to drop him a line on Saturday, but then my laptop died the death.

Does anyone know if realwest would like to receive emails, or would he rather rest?

I think he'd be happy to see your e-mail, Dianna.

Have a great afternoon all!

re: #247 John Neverbend

Good night, and enjoy a mystical experience.

I'm enjoying my grandchildren, and others can enjoy the woo-woo.

re: #248 Occasional Reader

I think he'd be happy to see your e-mail, Dianna.

Then I shall drop him a quick line.

re: #226 Alouette

I'm going to Jerusalem tomorrow for a quick visit. What mehadrin restaurants should I hit? I'll be staying right next to Ben Yehuda mall.

I am sooo jealous...

The thing I actually crave the most is a Bonkers Bagel from the Old City.

Those bagels are so good that when you cut them, light comes out.

re: #250 Alouette

All the best Aloutte.