Outrageous Outrage of the Day!

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Once again, the Obama-Hitler thing is corrupting the minds of poor, innocent, helpless children, brainwashing them into robotic commie drones with the power of his indoctro-beams. These children and their parents thought they were going to the White House to take part in an inspiring event that they’d remember their whole lives — only to be sucked into Obama’s Maelstrom of Marxism!™

And the truly heinous part of it: he’s concealing his evil machinations in something as seemingly innocuous as promoting the Olympics for the city of Chicago! Not for the United States, mind you — for Chicago!

Wait a minute. Don’t they have … foreigners at the Olympics? Maybe even people from … Indonesia? Things that make you go, “Hmmm.”

Don’t worry, though. Michelle Malkin sees through the plot, as usual. It’s nothing but a scheme for Obama to scratch the backs of his Chicago cronies: Michelle Malkin » Obamas using schoolkids as junior lobbyists for Olympics. What would we do without her to reveal Obama’s secret plans?

Hopefully, the American people will rise up in outrageous outrage, and make sure the Olympics happen in Spain or Brazil, where they don’t mind foreigners.

UPDATE at 9/28/09 6:05:43 pm:

Comments from the brave Americans who post at Malkin’s site:

On September 28th, 2009 at 2:20 pm, 24Klady said:

We can’t find out what the salaries of the czars are, and now another office funded out of a backroom with no $$ accountability. Does anyone doubt the U.S. portion of the Olympics will end up being paid for by the taxpayer, and the atheletes used for political purposes just like Berlin/1938?

[…]

On September 28th, 2009 at 2:51 pm, Tazed and Confused said:

Re: Obama shaking hands with inner-city school kids … encouraging them … .
“yea bro, you can deal crack, score a bodacious ho, and still become president … . lookatme!”

UPDATE at 9/28/09 8:22:54 pm:

Uh oh.

President Bush Meets with Chicago 2016 Bid Committee and United States Olympic Committee Members.

President George W. Bush: I want to thank the members of the 2016 Chicago bid to get the Olympics. Listen, Mr. Mayor, you and your committee have put together a great plan. It’s a plan that will make America proud.

They say that the Olympics will come to Chicago if we’re fortunate enough to be selected, but really it’s coming to America, and I can’t think of a better city to represent the United States than Chicago.

This is a well thought out venue. There will be — the athletes will be taken care of. People who will be coming from around the world will find this good city has got fantastic accommodations, great restaurants. It will be safe.

And so I — this country supports your bid, strongly. And our hope is that the judges will take a good look at Chicago and select Chicago for the 2016 Olympics.

Thank you all.

Also see

Jump to bottom

648 comments
1 karmic_inquisitor  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:15:06pm

This is truly shocking.

Never before has a municipality tried to coax children into supporting an Olympic bid.

It certainly didn't happen in Utah with the Salt Lake City bid for the winter Olympics. Just the same the Republicans had the good sense to completely divorce themselves from the Olympic movement by not having anyone associated with the Republican party get involved with the Olympics there (nor did he make a big deal of it in a subsequent presidential campaign.)

2 Pianobuff  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:15:48pm

This is being played all wrong. Chicago getting the Olympics could end up producing a career's worth of corruption stories that no true partisan would want to pass up.

What is she thinking?

3 Canadian Guy  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:16:29pm

From the comments on Malkins' Olympics thread

On September 28th, 2009 at 2:20 pm, 24Klady said:
We can’t find out what the salaries of the czars are, and now another office funded out of a backroom with no $$ accountability. Does anyone doubt the U.S. portion of the Olympics will end up being paid for by the taxpayer, and the atheletes used for political purposes just like Berlin/1938?

4 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:19:08pm

re: #3 Canadian Guy

From the comments on Malkins' Olympics thread

That pesky Jesse Owens had to go and show off.
/

5 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:20:18pm

re: #3 Canadian Guy

From the comments on Malkins' Olympics thread

Another false Nazi analogy. And with a stupid error to boot: The Berlin Olympics were held in 1936, not 1938. But we shouldn't confuse crazies with the facts.

6 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:20:40pm

re: #2 Pianobuff

This is being played all wrong. Chicago getting the Olympics could end up producing a career's worth of corruption stories that no true partisan would want to pass up.

What is she thinking?

Indeed, this is very short-sighted of her. The Chicago Olympics would be a long-running carnival; nay, the World's Fair; of political muckraking. All the memes are there: The home turf of Obammunism, the Daley Machine, the '68 riots, Al Capone. Everyone in the world knows about Chicago gangsters and they have for generations--- Goebbels referred to them constantly. Many careers could be made there.

7 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:20:43pm

Perhaps she is simply maneuvering for the "I told you so" position when it all goes to hell in a handbasket.
/

8 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:21:24pm

wow the ods in the air is almost suffocating...republicans are clearly angling for the "we ain"t them"strategy for regaining power...instead of something stupid like developing a superior platform...should work in about 20 years..

9 jaunte  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:21:34pm

Another outrageous detail to obsess over: Kenyans may win the 2010 Olympic Marathon event!

10 drogheda  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:21:37pm

This has got to stop!!!

The next thing you know some of those kids might even aspire to be world class athletes and maybe one day compete in the Olympics themselves.

//I have no doubt that you are as outraged as I am at this

11 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:21:53pm

Lord help us! If the Olympics come here, they will want to give the winners prizes made of precious metals. Like precious bodily fluids. Don't you see?!

12 victor_yugo  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:22:23pm

re: #6 Shiplord Kirel

Dang it, I logged in to make exactly that point.

Then you had to go and steal my thunder.

:-P~~~

13 Neutral President  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:23:46pm

re: #11 Sharmuta

Lord help us! If the Olympics come here, they will want to give the winners prizes made of precious metals. Like precious bodily fluids. Don't you see?!

If we give all our gold to teh forrinerz we can't go back on teh gold standard. It's a plot by those damn jooo bankers!!1!

/

14 wiffersnapper  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:25:43pm

How can Americans not want home field advantage for the Olympics?

15 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:26:47pm

I think this just proves Obama's narcissism. Think about it. The Olympic symbol is 5 connected Os. That proves it!!11!

16 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:26:55pm

I'm just steaming over this. Steaming! How dare that man corrupt the minds of children and USE them for his disgusting purposes?!

Come on! Get MAD!

17 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:27:04pm

re: #14 wiffersnapper

anything having to do with obama is EEEVIL!!!evil i say!!

18 bosforus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:27:34pm

At the cutting edge of news, she is! The cutting edge!

19 victor_yugo  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:27:54pm

re: #16 Charles

Come on! Get MAD!

I have their 500th issue.

20 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:28:02pm

re: #3 Canadian Guy

"atheletes"

I thought it was ath-uh-letes, as in "the ath-uh-letes in the Baptist Basketball League..."
You 21st century culturally literate types haven't seen crazy until you brush up against the Fundamentalist jock culture: People so pure and clean they never take a shit (which is why they are full of it) yet they will fight at the drop of a steroid.

21 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:28:33pm

re: #15 Sharmuta

beck is sure to do a segment on the murky true meaning of the olympic rings

22 CapeCoddah  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:28:45pm

All this craziness is giving me a headache. If I take up drinking, will it help?? Time to go snuggle down with hubby and watch football!
Have a great evening folks, be good to each other!

23 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:28:50pm

This event at the White House took place almost two weeks ago, by the way.

[Link: www.whitehouse.gov...]

This red meat is a little ripe.

24 Neutral President  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:29:20pm

re: #14 wiffersnapper

How can Americans not want home field advantage for the Olympics?

Opposition to Obama and everything remotely connected to him (Chicago in this case) must be absolute or you will become unpersons to the insane asylum patients running the GOP now.

25 Canadian Guy  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:29:44pm

re: #21 Boondock St. Bender

Or how the Olympics are all about a one-world government and have been in countries such as Russia, China and Mexico.

26 karmic_inquisitor  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:29:47pm

re: #4 Killgore Trout

That pesky Jesse Owens had to go and show off.
/

But Obama plans to use the Chicago games to demonstrate the superiority of homosexuals.

/

27 Randall Gross  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:29:52pm

Oh noes! School Kids were used to indoctrinate IOC in the Salt Lake bid!

I remember hosting an IOC member, Dr. Agustin Arroyo, and his family from Ecuador. They came to visit on several occasions. Each time they came to Salt Lake City, I arranged for visits with schoolchildren. The Arroyos love animals; they raise dogs; he was an equestrian champion. So, I prearranged with an elementary school for certain students, who came from families that raised and trained guide dogs for the 4-H program, to bring their canines to school and share their experiences with the guests. When our caravan arrived at the school, we were greeted with a host of dogs, horses and other pets the students had brought from home. An assembly allowed for a touching cultural exchange through which Dr. and Mrs. Arroyo were honored and given time to explain life in their native country. I was told later by teachers that it was the highlight of the year for the kids.

[Link: www.deseretnews.com...]

We have to protect our children! Next they might be asked to represent our country at an actual Olympics games, that would be disaster!

28 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:29:56pm

re: #16 Charles

I'm just steaming over this. Steaming! How dare that man corrupt the minds of children and USE them for his disgusting purposes?!

Come on! Get MAD!

Using children for the purpose of an event meant to promote international cooperation. It's wrong. WRONG, I say. What kind of message does that send to children to get along with communists?!?!1?!

29 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:29:58pm

re: #23 Charles

it just has to age properly...ask peter luger lol

30 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:30:35pm

re: #11 Sharmuta

Lord help us! If the Olympics come here, they will want to give the winners prizes made of precious metals. Like precious bodily fluids. Don't you see?!

I am totally ate up over the Olympics..Always have been since a kid..
If they had a marble contest at 2am time delayed I'm like..F*cking A.!.Marbles 2am! Perfect! I once stood outside hiway 12 in California at 5am in the morning and watched the torch come by..We were clapping our hands and honest to God tears came to my eyes..I didn't expect how moving it would be as the parade of police cars and a single runner silently passed by in the darkness..It was deeply moving..I didn't expect the power of the moment..

31 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:30:52pm

re: #25 Canadian Guy

zactly!!!a secret rockafeller commie conspiracy.

32 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:31:06pm

re: #16 Charles

I'm just steaming over this. Steaming! How dare that man corrupt the minds of children and USE them for his disgusting purposes?!

Come on! Get MAD!

Steaming is useful. Get thee some crab legs, pronto.

33 researchok  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:31:11pm

Best Olympic line ever:

"These games will no more have a deficit than a man can have a baby"- Jean Drapeau, mayor of Montreal, on the1976 Olympic games.

The deficit was $1.6 billion (the Olympic Stadium was finally paid off in 2006- 30 years after the games.

34 Neutral President  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:31:52pm

re: #20 Shiplord Kirel

"atheletes"

I thought it was ath-uh-letes, as in "the ath-uh-letes in the Baptist Basketball League..."
You 21st century culturally literate types haven't seen crazy until you brush up against the Fundamentalist jock culture: People so pure and clean they never take a shit (which is why they are full of it) yet they will fight at the drop of a steroid.

"Remember if you cannot be a athlete, then be an athletic supporter."

35 avanti  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:32:37pm

re: #16 Charles

I'm just steaming over this. Steaming! How dare that man corrupt the minds of children and USE them for his disgusting purposes?!

Come on! Get MAD!

This commenter is mad:

" On September 28th, 2009 at 2:48 pm, Tazed and Confused said:

Is there no depth to which this scumbag won’t step.

This is no different that Hamas’ use of schools to position their rocket launchers.

What’s next from BHO… Michael Jackson’s trademark crotch-grab..?"

36 Canadian Guy  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:33:00pm

re: #31 Boondock St. Bender

Or the Olympicarhy

37 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:33:14pm

re: #26 karmic_inquisitor

But Obama plans to use the Chicago games to demonstrate the superiority of homosexuals.

/

"Light in the loafers" is an unfair advantage?

38 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:33:17pm

re: #33 researchok

ahh yes those wonderful days before evil corprate sponsership...

39 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:33:29pm

re: #21 Boondock St. Bender

beck is sure to do a segment on the murky true meaning of the olympic rings

Oh, brother. He probably will!

40 bosforus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:34:49pm

re: #39 Sharmuta

Oh, brother. He probably will!

Rings? As in planetary rings? As in celestial bodies? As in the moon? Causing... TIDES?!!

41 Randall Gross  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:34:55pm

School Kid forced to light way for dreaded international flag

42 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:35:25pm

re: #23 Charles

This event at the White House took place almost two weeks ago, by the way.

[Link: www.whitehouse.gov...]

This red meat is a little ripe.

Charles -

TWO WEEKS = Maggot Infested where I come from. And Michelle IS usually pretty sane. There's something Happening Here - What it IS 'Ain't Exactly Clear...

'Nuff for Now.

-S-

43 fizzlogic  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:35:49pm

It defies physics but it's true...there is such a thing as a perpetual outrage machine.

44 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:36:03pm

This is all a liberal fascist plot to promote the New World Order with Chicago as it's global capitol.

45 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:36:06pm

re: #27 Thanos

Oh noes! School Kids were used to indoctrinate IOC in the Salt Lake bid!

[Link: www.deseretnews.com...]

We have to protect our children! Next they might be asked to represent our country at an actual Olympics games, that would be disaster!

Yes, they might encounter foreigners and want to learn other languages! The Horror!

46 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:36:19pm

re: #40 bosforus

moon pushes earths oceans around..this bullying must stop!

47 victor_yugo  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:37:00pm

re: #37 CyanSnowHawk

"Light in the loafers" is an unfair advantage?

Yeah, when that light is a JATO unit. Definitely unfair.

48 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:37:23pm

re: #43 trendsurfer

It defies physics but it's true...there is such a thing as a perpetual outrage machine.

The Malkinator 5000™ comes with a 2 year warranty. Daily outrage or your money back.

49 bosforus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:37:53pm

re: #46 Boondock St. Bender

moon pushes earths oceans around..this bullying must stop!

It's like the moon's never even heard of celestial sovereignty!

50 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:38:46pm

Kol Ha Lizardim -

The last guy in the USA to make MONEY on an Olympics was - MITT ROMNEY Maybe HE should be heading the Chicago Committee.

-S-

51 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:39:12pm

re: #21 Boondock St. Bender

beck is sure to do a segment on the murky true meaning of the olympic rings

I seem to remember some 1936 vintage pics of the Hindenburg and various other German aircraft with the Olympic rings on their tails, right next to the swastika.
Perhaps Beck can dig these up.

52 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:39:34pm

re: #50 Dr. Shalit

Kol Ha Lizardim -

The last guy in the USA to make MONEY on an Olympics was - MITT ROMNEY Maybe HE should be heading the Chicago Committee.

-S-

Ah, I see now. It's a plot to get him out of the way in 2012.
/

53 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:39:51pm

re: #45 Dark_Falcon

Yes, they might encounter foreigners and want to learn other languages! The Horror!

/well, let's try to learn at least some English too...

54 Summer Seale  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:40:06pm

That Michelle Malkin post reads like one of those joke letters on a Monty Python episode from an outraged viewer.

Only...I know she's dead serious.

55 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:41:22pm

The Olympics.

Based of the name of Mount Olympus- home of the gods.

Obama- thinks he's a god.

It's obvious where this is going, people. Martial law and state religion as we will all have to worship Obama forever and ever.

56 victor_yugo  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:41:23pm

OT, but I gotta tell this one:

I've discovered the joys of baking bread.

I've made six batches so far, two batches of round loaves and four in loaf pans. The quality varies, in part because the weather is changing, and also because I have yet to figure out how any particular oven I might use will heat up. But who doesn't like the smell of bread fresh from the oven?

The recipe I'm training myself on is a basic cinnamon sweetbread. It's really nice with butter or cream cheese. I've also experimented a little with a batch of sweet basil bread; it was a little weak, but definitely a recipe to file away for later.

A few days ago, the neighbor's dog came over to check me out as I walked by, the way dogs do. The daughter of the household told me that this dog is very friendly, and wouldn't bite, which I already knew. Anyway, we got to chatting a bit, and I told her about my new hobby.

Well, today, I took a loaf over to them, just as they were getting home from somewhere. When I held it up to hand it to them, the daughter perked up and asked if that was the bread I told her about. Yes, it was... and she took it inside right away, to slice some off and try it.

It's the first time in a looong time, that a 19-year-old hottie has gotten excited about anything I've done.

57 drogheda  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:41:41pm

re: #54 Summer

That Michelle Malkin post reads like one of those joke letters on a Monty Python episode from an outraged viewer.

Only...I know she's dead serious.

And she won't stop until those responsible have been sacked.

58 Summer Seale  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:42:19pm

re: #57 drogheda

And she won't stop until those responsible have been sacked.

Lol...you definitely get bonus points for knowing your Python that well. =)

59 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:43:26pm

re: #54 Summer

That Michelle Malkin post reads like one of those joke letters on a Monty Python episode from an outraged viewer.

Only...I know she's dead serious.

I must admit there was a time I posted there.

60 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:43:27pm

re: #52 CyanSnowHawk

Ah, I see now. It's a plot to get him out of the way in 2012.
/

CyanSnowHawk -

IF you were President Obama, wouldn't you want to "clear the field?" Answer Is - Yes You Would - UNLESS - the other guy's success would make him a potential rival. Therein lies the RUB.

-S-

61 Ojoe  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:43:30pm

In 1932, the Olympics were in Los Angeles.

62 borgcube  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:43:41pm

re: #50 Dr. Shalit

If Mitt Romney was in charge of the 2016 Olympics in Chicago, it would still end up billions in the red.

No way does this go to Chicago. Not a chance.

63 Bloodnok  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:44:22pm

re: #54 Summer

That Michelle Malkin post reads like one of those joke letters on a Monty Python episode from an outraged viewer.

Only...I know she's dead serious.

64 Cato the Elder  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:45:26pm

re: #42 Dr. Shalit

And Michelle IS usually pretty sane.

If that's true, please don't show me loony.

65 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:45:49pm

re: #50 Dr. Shalit

Kol Ha Lizardim -

The last guy in the USA to make MONEY on an Olympics was - MITT ROMNEY Maybe HE should be heading the Chicago Committee.

-S-

Hi Doc!
As long as the government is willing to bail out everybody from the Banks to Car Companies...I don't car how much the Olympics cost..
If Chicago wins it they damn well better kick those commie Chinese opening ceremonies from the last Olympics.. I don't care if Obama has to dance the Nutcracker for the money shot..Damn it!
Beat those Chinese producers! USA! USA! USA!
/

66 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:46:28pm

re: #62 borgcube

If Mitt Romney was in charge of the 2016 Olympics in Chicago, it would still end up billions in the red.

No way does this go to Chicago. Not a chance.

borgecube -

He MADE MONEY in Salt Lake City, UT. What you are saying says MORE about Chicago than MITT ROMNEY. 'Nuff said?

-S-

67 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:46:35pm

re: #62 borgcube

It might. With Obama in the White House, the IOC is looking more favorable at us. Moreover, the other two choices are Madrid and Rio de Janero. The former didn't put in as good a bib and Rio's security problems make Chicago look like Mayberry by comparison.

68 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:47:48pm

Ah hah!
The smoking gun, er, dirigible: Hindenburg memorabilia, includes stamps etc. showing the airship with its Olympic AND swastika markings in 1936.

69 Randall Gross  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:47:55pm
“Anyone can be angry. That is easy. But to be angry with the right person, to the right degree, at the right time, for the right purpose, in the right way — that is not easy.”

– Aristotle, “Nicomachean Ethics”

70 fizzlogic  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:48:37pm

re: #48 Sharmuta

I found these two pics of Malkin at the lefty site Sadly No!. The images encapsulate everything Malkin's about. :)

Image: malkinmedia.jpg
Image: malkinsneer.jpg

71 theheat  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:49:12pm

You know how you get those weird mental pictures sometimes? Malkin and Bachmann shoe shopping together. Trying on lipstick. Maybe a day at the spa. Botox. Signing each other's bibles. Fun girl stuff.

Wait... I am supposed to be outraged about something again? I'm having a hard time keeping track of all the shit I need to be pissed off about.

Oh, yes - the Olympics in Chicago and - what was it - child slavery? I think I'm too worn out to get outraged about this on top of all the other rage I need to sustain.

72 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:49:33pm

Enjoy the calm before the storm, folks.

73 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:50:39pm

re: #70 trendsurfer

I found these two pics of Malkin at the lefty site Sadly No!. The images encapsulate everything Malkin's about. :)

[Link: zapblast.com...]
[Link: zapblast.com...]

I've never much liked her.

74 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:51:40pm

re: #66 Dr. Shalit

borgecube

Borgecube?

"You will be arppegiated."

75 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:51:53pm

re: #56 victor_yugo

It's really a lost art. It took me years of trying to make a consistent passable baguette. Now that we're getting fall weather again I'm in the mood for baking.

76 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:52:04pm

re: #72 Charles

Enjoy the calm before the storm, folks.

What storm are you expecting to see?

77 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:52:43pm

re: #72 Charles

Enjoy the calm before the storm, folks.

OMG!1!11! Panic now! Why wait?!?!?!
/yeah, thing are gonna get messy

78 Bagua  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:52:49pm

re: #76 Dark_Falcon

What storm are you expecting to see?

Thunder and flouncing.

79 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:53:02pm

re: #72 Charles

Enjoy the calm before the storm, folks.

Charles -

Got that right. Expect "Atmospheric Disturbances" between now and the New Year. For tonight, my fast has ended, my sins are confessed, and I Hope to be written into the Book of Life for another year - one year at a time.

-S-

80 Randall Gross  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:53:29pm

I wrote this as advice to conservative bloggers back in April, but being a backwater blog I doub that many saw it:

Somehow we have to dump the anger and the only way forward is to really stop the madness. With that in mind, I’m going to suggest a few things:

* First does that thing… you know — that thing you are getting ready to raise red flags over really matter? Is it anything people who aren’t pundits will remember in a month, two months, five years? Will it affect lives long term, will it change the course of the nation? Is it essential, and if so are you really reporting the essential part? If not then it’s just another dirty rag in the daily spin cycle.
* Second: Is it well sourced, or just a rumor? Is there an email campaign with someone quoting someone who is someone’s friend who knows a person? If it’s not well sourced and factual it could be something planted, don’t be a goof by running with kookspiracies.
* Third: Have you researched what you are talking about, or are you just letting emotion carry you through your post or monologue? If not you could end up with egg on your face.
* Fourth: Edit. Have you let hyperbole, exaggeration, and purple prose turn your factual piece into a fanciful piece? Is hysteria clouding your finer points?

Next installment I’ll talk more about how the focus needs to change, why congress and the governorships are so important going into 2010, and how Republican political strategy must change from leading through fear to positive direction before conservatives can regain any power.

There hasn't been a next installment yet, because everyone's being too crazy to pay attention.

81 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:53:32pm

re: #76 Dark_Falcon

Malkin has lots of friends.

82 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:53:40pm

re: #73 Sharmuta

That's not very nice, Sharm.

83 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:54:12pm

re: #80 Thanos

There hasn't been a next installment yet, because everyone's being too crazy to pay attention.

It's going to be a while.

84 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:54:18pm

re: #72 Charles

This is the calm???(battening down hatches)

85 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:55:08pm

re: #82 Dark_Falcon

That's not very nice, Sharm.

What? She's never been my cup of tea. How is that mean?

86 Bagua  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:55:26pm

re: #76 Dark_Falcon

What storm are you expecting to see?

Pedants note: I've observed a new category in Flouncology.

The Flouncemint, a flounce coupled with a compliment.


>

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
then:
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

87 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:56:09pm

Eegad! Not only have the wingnuts stolen such idiotic lefty techniques as giant puppetry and hysterical heckling, they have now gone big time by using has-been celebrities as ideological spokesdroids:

Andy Williams accuses Barack Obama of following Marxist theory

Andy Williams, the veteran pop singer, has accused Barack Obama of "following Marxist theory" and "wanting the country to fail".

Williams told the Radio Times he thought Mr Obama wanted to turn the US into a "socialist country". Photo: GETTY

Williams, a lifelong Republican whose hits include Moon River and Music To Watch Girls By, told the Radio Times he thought Mr Obama wanted to turn the US into a "socialist country".

88 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:57:00pm

re: #80 Thanos

* Fourth: Edit. Have you let hyperbole, exaggeration, and purple prose turn your factual piece into a fanciful piece? Is hysteria clouding your finer points?

Not only are some bloggers immune to seeing this in their work- their readers are too. It's really kind of sad.

89 SpaceJesus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:57:04pm

is the flounceapult prepared?

90 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:57:14pm

re: #85 Sharmuta

What? She's never been my cup of tea. How is that mean?

Never mind. Upon further reflection its snarky but well with the boundaries.

91 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:57:53pm

Stinky just had to eject a crazy British religious fanatic from the QualiaSoup thread.

Incoming!

92 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:58:34pm

re: #87 Shiplord Kirel

Eegad! Not only have the wingnuts stolen such idiotic lefty techniques as giant puppetry and hysterical heckling, they have now gone big time by using has-been celebrities as ideological spokesdroids:

Andy Williams accuses Barack Obama of following Marxist theory

Andy Williams is still alive? Wow.

93 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:59:10pm

re: #89 SpaceJesus

is the flounceapult prepared?

You call within the next 10 minutes we will double your order...
S&H extra

94 borgcube  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 5:59:39pm

re: #66 Dr. Shalit

No disagreement from me. A pot of gold at the end of a rainbow could appear at the opening ceremonies in Chicago, the athletes being fast enough to actually get to the gold could turn it all over to the IOC which would then sell it for 3 billion to Cash 4 Gold...and the Chicago Olympics would still end up billions in the red.

95 Cato the Elder  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:00:16pm

re: #71 theheat

You know how you get those weird mental pictures sometimes? Malkin and Bachmann shoe shopping together. Trying on lipstick. Maybe a day at the spa. Botox. Signing each other's bibles. Fun girl stuff.

I definitely need new computer glasses. Just read that as "signing each other's babies..."

Wha' the...? Bad eyes. Bad!

96 SpaceJesus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:00:19pm

i wonder if flouncing will ever be an olympic sport

97 theheat  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:00:20pm

re: #86 Bagua

Do flouncemints have any sugar? Are they better than breath mints? Will they hurt my teeth?

98 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:00:38pm

re: #91 Charles

Stinky just had to eject a crazy British religious fanatic from the QualiaSoup thread.

Incoming!

QualiaSoup?

99 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:00:38pm

re: #91 Charles

I ran through a string of qualiasoups videos he is fantastic.The ones about reason should be required watching in schools.

100 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:01:16pm

Wow, it took about 25 minutes for one of the psycho stalkers to notice that I turned on the contact form.

101 avanti  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:01:41pm

Another insightful post with a dollop of racism, wonderful./

"Re: Obama shaking hands with inner-city school kids… encouraging them….
“yea bro, you can deal crack, score a bodacious ho, and still become president…. lookatme!”"

102 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:01:44pm

re: #90 Dark_Falcon

Perhaps the person I replied to was being snarky in your estimation, but all I said was I've never much liked her- as a blogger or an author. How is that snarky?

103 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:02:28pm

re: #91 Charles

Stinky just had to eject a crazy British religious fanatic from the QualiaSoup thread.

Incoming!

Shouldn't that be "Outgoing!"? Since Stinky just used SJ's flounceapult to toss the troll clear over to Rodan's Place. I'll let everyone know when it lands over there.

104 Randall Gross  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:02:46pm

re: #88 Sharmuta

Not only are some bloggers immune to seeing this in their work- their readers are too. It's really kind of sad.

It's a combination of several factors. Peer group pressure sometimes makes the insane seem ok, hunger for hits drives sensationalism, and raving lunacy always feels better than inchoate anger.

105 SpaceJesus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:03:08pm

re: #101 avanti

bodacious ho

I would give anything to hear Obama say those words together

106 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:03:45pm

re: #100 Charles

Wow, it took about 25 minutes for one of the psycho stalkers to notice that I turned on the contact form.

Charles -

Words to the Wise are Superfluous...

It is the Ignorant that need advice...

-S-

107 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:04:05pm

re: #102 Sharmuta

Perhaps the person I replied to was being snarky in your estimation, but all I said was I've never much liked her- as a blogger or an author. How is that snarky?

The photos were a little snarky, but not a problem at all. I'm sorry I brought it up. I didn't think before I posted.

108 That's Mr. President to you  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:04:14pm

Once again my plans are foiled by the Caterwauling Cretins of Christian Conservatism.

Here was an opportunity to further indoctrinate another generation in hardcore Stalinism but the counter revolutionaries of the right wing blogosphere have usurped my most dastardly of plans.

Drat! Double drat!

109 drogheda  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:04:32pm

re: #103 Dark_Falcon

Shouldn't that be "Outgoing!"? Since Stinky just used SJ's flounceapult to toss the troll clear over to Rodan's Place. I'll let everyone know when it lands over there.

outgoing -> crazy British religious fanatic
incoming -> outraged email rant

110 solomonpanting  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:04:57pm
he’s concealing his evil machinations in something as seemingly innocuous as promoting the Olympics for the city of Chicago! Not for the United States, mind you — for Chicago!

"No, no, no, God damn America."...
"God Bless Chicago!"

111 theheat  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:05:12pm

re: #95 Cato the Elder

You're losing it, Cato ;-)

112 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:05:27pm

re: #105 SpaceJesus

I would give anything to hear Obama say those words together

Hack the Totus, he'll say it.

113 SlartyBartfast  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:05:29pm

re: #108 That's Mr. President to you

Nice to see you again, Barry. Score any good weed in Pittsburgh?

114 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:05:40pm

re: #16 Charles

I'm just steaming over this. Steaming! How dare that man corrupt the minds of children and USE them for his disgusting purposes?!

Come on! Get MAD!

Why, I'm so angry I could... nope... wait... it was just a bit of indigestion. Never mind.

115 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:05:53pm

re: #108 That's Mr. President to you

Once again my plans are foiled by the Caterwauling Cretins of Christian Conservatism.

Here was an opportunity to further indoctrinate another generation in hardcore Stalinism but the counter revolutionaries of the right wing blogosphere have usurped my most dastardly of plans.

Drat! Double drat!

You've been taking speech notes from Dick Dastardly, I see. What czar post are you planning to appoint him to?

116 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:06:13pm

re: #111 theheat

You're losing it, Cato ;-)

Can't lose what you've never had!!

//

(sorry Cato ,, that was a softball right down the middle!)

117 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:06:48pm

re: #108 That's Mr. President to you

I thought you had turned into Mr. Beck...

118 theheat  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:07:20pm

re: #117 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Mr. Beck used to like herb, if I recall.

119 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:07:25pm

At least they can't compare the Zero to Brezhnev and the 1980 Moscow Olympics. It would be too much of demotion from Stalin, kind of like equating him with George Lincoln after Hitler. (Besides, Rockwell was a natural born citizen).

120 borgcube  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:07:36pm

re: #67 Dark_Falcon

I don't think there's any stomach for it, even in Chicago. If the economy was doing better, maybe.

I don't think the summer Olympics has ever been to South America, has it? Rio has also been in the running for the last three bids. I'd like to see it down there for a change. Besides, the IOC probably loves Lula even more than Obama.

Mind you, I love Chicago, always have a great time there.

I don't think Madrid stands a shot either, especially since Spain recently held one and 2012 being in London is too close geographically.

121 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:07:36pm

re: #118 theheat

Mr. Beck used to like herb, if I recall.

Herb Albert?

122 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:07:48pm

re: #117 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I thought you had turned into Mr. Beck...

He's both. Charles gave him special permission to acquire a sock puppet for the sole purpose of satire.

123 theheat  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:08:04pm

re: #121 sattv4u2

Mary Jane.

124 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:08:15pm

re: #122 Dark_Falcon

Those posts are great!

125 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:09:03pm

I don't really care about the Olympics. If they're not gonna show martial arts competitions on the tube, they can stuff the whole thing for all I care.

126 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:09:12pm

I like how malkin is upset the White House won't release details of the Olympics office, but everything was cool when it was Cheney meeting with energy executives, right Michelle?

127 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:09:26pm

re: #96 SpaceJesus

i wonder if flouncing will ever be an olympic sport

The goal of an Olympian is to be a winner..
The goal of a flouncer is to be a loser...
I've seen dozens that jumped because 4 liberal posters joined here...
Couldn't handle another point of view..For F*ck sake
Grow the hell up..How do you post a good bye forever cause a liberal had the nerve to challenge you on a board? Couldn't handle it? Echo chamber? You guys know exactly who I'm talking about...
The day Iceweasel makes you go crawl in the corner and suck your thumb...You need to buy some man up pills..

128 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:09:53pm

re: #125 Slumbering Behemoth

I might watch the hockey competitions, however.

129 solomonpanting  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:09:58pm

re: #121 sattv4u2

Herb Albert?

Don't give me that (lonely) bull.

130 avanti  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:10:06pm

re: #107 Dark_Falcon

The photos were a little snarky, but not a problem at all. I'm sorry I brought it up. I didn't think before I posted.

Actually Dark, I sort of agree with you. I don't care for the woman either, but unflattering photos are a little snarky if we are being consistant.

131 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:10:32pm

re: #120 borgcube

I don't think there's any stomach for it, even in Chicago. If the economy was doing better, maybe.

I don't think the summer Olympics has ever been to South America, has it? Rio has also been in the running for the last three bids. I'd like to see it down there for a change. Besides, the IOC probably loves Lula even more than Obama.

Mind you, I love Chicago, always have a great time there.

I don't think Madrid stands a shot either, especially since Spain recently held one and 2012 being in London is too close geographically.

Rio has indeed been in the running for quite a while. The IOC has made no secret of the fact that they want either these games or the next ones held in South America. The problem is Rio's transport infrastructure is notable poorer than Chicago's and it has a massive gang problem that would make for a security nightmare.

132 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:10:33pm

re: #125 Slumbering Behemoth

Does fencing count? I was digging on the fencing during the last Olympics.

133 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:10:59pm

re: #126 Sharmuta

of course,she liked and trusted him...whats good for my side ain't good for yours

134 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:11:48pm

re: #130 avanti

I now know I'm exhausted. I just updinged Avanti

(or maybe it's Avanti who's exhausted!!)

135 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:11:52pm

re: #120 borgcube

I don't think there's any stomach for it, even in Chicago. If the economy was doing better, maybe.

I don't think the summer Olympics has ever been to South America, has it? Rio has also been in the running for the last three bids. I'd like to see it down there for a change. Besides, the IOC probably loves Lula even more than Obama.

Mind you, I love Chicago, always have a great time there.

I don't think Madrid stands a shot either, especially since Spain recently held one and 2012 being in London is too close geographically.

The Olympics almost always end up being hosted by the United States every few times it comes around (either Winter or Summer) because we're pretty much the only country that can afford to host it regularly.

(I love Chicago too- always have fun when I visit.)

136 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:12:10pm

re: #127 HoosierHoops

I have no idea who you're talking about, but it's probably better that way. I agree with your prescription recommendation, however.

137 Bloodnok  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:12:11pm

re: #127 HoosierHoops

The goal of an Olympian is to be a winner..
The goal of a flouncer is to be a loser...
I've seen dozens that jumped because 4 liberal posters joined here...
Couldn't handle another point of view..For F*ck sake
Grow the hell up..How do you post a good bye forever cause a liberal had the nerve to challenge you on a board? Couldn't handle it? Echo chamber? You guys know exactly who I'm talking about...
The day Iceweasel makes you go crawl in the corner and suck your thumb...You need to buy some man up pills..

You rock, Hoops.

138 funky chicken  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:13:36pm

re: #23 Charles

This event at the White House took place almost two weeks ago, by the way.

[Link: www.whitehouse.gov...]

This red meat is a little ripe.

Dry aged.

139 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:13:54pm

re: #134 sattv4u2

I now know I'm exhausted. I just updinged Avanti

(or maybe it's Avanti who's exhausted!!)

sattv4u2 -

Bet when Avanti is "Exhausted" - The Exhaust is Recycled by Turbo.

-S-

140 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:14:35pm

re: #132 WindUpBird

Does fencing count? I was digging on the fencing during the last Olympics.

Not as far as I am concerned. I'm not really into watching fencing.

Checking your profile, however, I do see that we have some similar interests.

THROW UP THEM HORNS!

141 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:15:13pm

re: #139 Dr. Shalit

sattv4u2 -

Bet when Avanti is "Exhausted" - The Exhaust is Recycled by Turbo.

-S-

Yeah ,,, but at times the pipes are clogged!

142 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:15:28pm

re: #137 Bloodnok

You rock, Hoops.

He's the Bomb.

143 bosforus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:16:57pm

re: #125 Slumbering Behemoth

I don't really care about the Olympics. If they're not gonna show martial arts competitions on the tube, they can stuff the whole thing for all I care.

What? You don't like watching people wave a ribbon around?

144 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:17:31pm

I'm still trying to find a way to tie in the Tsavo man-eaters ("The Ghost and the Darkness"), the famous man-eating KENYAN lions who are currently stuffed and mounted at the Field Museum in CHICAGO.

145 funky chicken  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:17:32pm

re: #87 Shiplord Kirel

Eegad! Not only have the wingnuts stolen such idiotic lefty techniques as giant puppetry and hysterical heckling, they have now gone big time by using has-been celebrities as ideological spokesdroids:

Andy Williams accuses Barack Obama of following Marxist theory

LOL. Um, a "veteran pop singer?" That's quite kind of them.

146 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:19:10pm

Lots of "wookie" comments being posted at Malkin's site now.

147 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:19:21pm

re: #144 Shiplord Kirel

I'm still trying to find a way to tie in the Tsavo man-eaters ("The Ghost and the Darkness"), the famous man-eating KENYAN lions who are currently stuffed and mounted at the Field Museum in CHICAGO.

The only tie-in is that Brack and Michelle probably have taken their daughters to see them. They're part of a good exhibit in a superb museum.

148 bosforus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:19:43pm

re: #146 Charles

Lots of "wookie" comments being posted at Malkin's site now.

They all have lisps. The mean 'rookie'.
/

149 borgcube  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:20:04pm

re: #125 Slumbering Behemoth

Winter Olympics. Curling. The only thing better would be a combination of that winter sport and the modern pentathlon.

I get shivers. Imagine an event with some pistol shooting, horse jumping, some sword fights, a little swim and run, and then followed by a cool down in an ice skating rink shuffling big stones back and forth and instead of using a little whisk broom, they could have a custom made mini-Zamboni clearing the way. Heck synchronized Zambonis for that matter.

150 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:20:36pm

re: #146 Charles

after the abuse she used to take from the left about her looks and heritage you would think she of all people would not allow that sort of garbage.

151 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:20:56pm

re: #141 sattv4u2

Yeah ,,, but at times the pipes are clogged!

satt4u2 -

Funny you should say that. Sold a car that Mitsubishi Motors somehow left a piece of supposedly "lost foam" in an intake manifold on a turbo car. Took a QC inspector from Japan to figure it out and find it. Jinzaburo Horiuchi - you were "The Man."

-S-

152 avanti  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:20:57pm

re: #134 sattv4u2

I now know I'm exhausted. I just updinged Avanti

(or maybe it's Avanti who's exhausted!!)

One back at you, just to keep the sun from going super nova. :)

153 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:21:39pm

re: #146 Charles

Lots of "wookie" comments being posted at Malkin's site now.

She's now providing cover for racists? Stupid, given that people have made racist hate-mail attacks on her in the past. She should know better, but she's let her emotions get the better of her.

154 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:21:48pm

Notice how they're cuing each other to deliberately misspell "wookie":

On September 28th, 2009 at 3:21 pm, 24Klady said:
ThunderHawkk
Meanshelle looks huge because she is – she has been hitting some serious groceries. Worse, you don’t wear big flowered sheets if ya got big hips too.


On September 28th, 2009 at 3:25 pm, TooMuchTime said:
If the olympics come to Chicago, will obladah be in the bowling competition?
Only if it’s the Special Olympics.


On September 28th, 2009 at 4:19 pm, spaceycakes said:
Hangfire–
I thought ribbed ones were for better traction in the mud…?


On September 28th, 2009 at 4:44 pm, Rogue Cheddar said:
On September 28th, 2009 at 4:19 pm, spaceycakes said:
Hangfire–
I thought ribbed ones were for better traction in the mud…?
Gee, I had two of my posts deleted because I made reference to a big hairy creature from Star Wars, but you two roll right into the gutter and not a peep. It’s not fair! Waaahhh!


On September 28th, 2009 at 4:48 pm, Kingfish said:
Rogue:
Something tells me you weren’t talking Ewoks


On September 28th, 2009 at 5:40 pm, spaceycakes said:
Did you spell Wookiee correctly?

155 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:22:06pm

re: #150 Boondock St. Bender

after the abuse she used to take from the left about her looks and heritage you would think she of all people would not allow that sort of garbage.

That she seems to not have a problem with it is very telling, if you ask me.

156 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:22:12pm

re: #149 borgcube

I think you're onto something. Outfit the Zambonis with armor and weaponry, and let them duke it out ala Steve Jackson's Car Wars.

157 Flyers1974  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:22:19pm

Arizona Rep. Trent Franks: Obama should release long-form birth certificate.

[Link: washingtonindependent.com...]

158 Bloodnok  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:22:47pm

re: #149 borgcube

Winter Olympics. Curling. The only thing better would be a combination of that winter sport and the modern pentathlon.

I get shivers. Imagine an event with some pistol shooting, horse jumping, some sword fights, a little swim and run, and then followed by a cool down in an ice skating rink shuffling big stones back and forth and instead of using a little whisk broom, they could have a custom made mini-Zamboni clearing the way. Heck synchronized Zambonis for that matter.

Damn those fiendish thingys.

159 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:23:12pm

re: #152 avanti

One back at you, just to keep the sun from going super nova. :)

I could use a little warm!

12 hours both today and yesterday sitting in a control room that we have to keep at 65-67 degrees EVEN IN THE WINTER becuase of all the electronics in here, I'm freezing my Bipi off !

160 funky chicken  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:23:42pm

re: #37 CyanSnowHawk

"Light in the loafers" is an unfair advantage?

It is in the high jump, and probably the triple jump as well.

/

161 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:24:23pm

re: #158 Bloodnok

That's what comes from teaching science by television.

162 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:24:31pm

re: #153 Dark_Falcon

money changes everything.

163 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:24:39pm

re: #146 Charles

Lots of "wookie" comments being posted at Malkin's site now.

They love me, they really love me.
/ugh

164 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:25:07pm

re: #160 funky chicken

It is in the high jump, and probably the triple jump as well.

/

Not to mention the flower arrangement competition!

//

165 funky chicken  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:25:46pm

re: #154 Charles

I thought special olympics jokes were off limits. The certainly should be, IMHO. They certainly evoked massive outrage when Obama made them.

166 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:25:51pm

I shall not be taunted.

167 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:25:57pm

re: #156 Slumbering Behemoth

I think you're onto something. Outfit the Zambonis with armor and weaponry, and let them duke it out ala Steve Jackson's Car Wars.

Zambonies? Hmmm, btw, where is that zombie?

168 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:25:59pm

re: #154 Charles

So after all the progress black people have made. these yahoos still want to mock them for looking different from white people. Stuck on Stupid doesn't begin to cover it.

169 SlartyBartfast  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:26:31pm

re: #157 Flyers1974

Arizona Rep. Trent Franks: Obama should release long-form birth certificate.

[Link: washingtonindependent.com...]

Yeah, and in the upcoming AZ Governor's race, a Dem is leading the Republican incumbent by a significant amount (according to Rasmussen). Coincidence? Maybe voters are tired of this nirther/birther crap.

170 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:27:02pm

re: #154 Charles

Charles -

I am NO FAN of Michelle Obama politically. Enemy would be more like it. AND she and the President seem to have a well functioning marriage with two good kids. Give credit where it is due.

-S-

171 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:27:48pm

re: #166 Killgore Trout

I shall not be taunted.

awww, come on :)

172 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:27:49pm

re: #168 Dark_Falcon

Not to mention that they're scaring away minorities from conservatism. Imagine what conservative leaning black people think when they see this stuff. It's not a movement for them, they're just going to go elsewhere.

173 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:28:21pm

re: #171 brookly red

No dice, I got it out of my system and I'm feeling much better now.

174 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:29:02pm

re: #166 Killgore Trout

I shall not be taunted.

{taunt}

175 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:29:12pm

re: #166 Killgore Trout

I shall not be taunted.

{taunt} {taunt}

176 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:29:14pm

re: #173 Killgore Trout
cool beans.

177 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:29:25pm

re: #166 Killgore Trout

I shall not be taunted.

{taunt} {taunt} {taunt}

178 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:29:37pm

((( I really need a hobby!!)))

179 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:29:43pm

re: #172 Killgore Trout

Not a "minority" myself, but I'm fixing to go elsewhere if this crap keeps up.

180 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:29:45pm

re: #172 Killgore Trout

Not to mention that they're scaring away minorities from conservatism. Imagine what conservative leaning black people think when they see this stuff. It's not a movement for them, they're just going to go elsewhere.

Agreed. And that's what the racists want. For minorities to join the GOP would mean they'd lose the "White Party" that they want. It's bigotry and exclusion pure and simple. And you were right to call Hot Air out on it.

181 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:29:46pm

re: #174 sattv4u2

{taunt}

/I taunt in your general direction!

182 borgcube  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:29:47pm

re: #135 Sharmuta

Except that maybe for the first time in a long time, if ever, others can afford it more than we can.

I'm going to be down in Colombia for a week or so in less than 10 days, so I'm trying to get some good South American vibes going.

183 avanti  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:30:22pm

re: #159 sattv4u2

I could use a little warm!

12 hours both today and yesterday sitting in a control room that we have to keep at 65-67 degrees EVEN IN THE WINTER becuase of all the electronics in here, I'm freezing my Bipi off !

Same here, all the computers in the secret White House "Blog Operation Room" keeps it chilly for me, Iceweasel and the rest of the staff./

184 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:30:57pm

re: #179 Slumbering Behemoth

Not a "minority" myself, but I'm fixing to go elsewhere if this crap keeps up.

you think, your a minority.

185 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:30:59pm

re: #172 Killgore Trout

Not to mention that they're scaring away minorities from conservatism. Imagine what conservative leaning black people think when they see this stuff. It's not a movement for them, they're just going to go elsewhere.

KT- Malkin's personal friend and vdare founder, Peter Brimelow has said that the GOP is a party for "white people". I'm not surprised anymore her blog and hot air are attracting people who agree with this mentality.

I would link to Brimelow saying this, but the site where I found it is currently down. However, he said this to Max Blumenthal- perhaps you can find a video?

186 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:31:30pm

Beer Run. See you folks later.

187 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:32:52pm

re: #185 Sharmuta

KT- Malkin's personal friend and vdare founder, Peter Brimelow has said that the GOP is a party for "white people". I'm not surprised anymore her blog and hot air are attracting people who agree with this mentality.

I would link to Brimelow saying this, but the site where I found it is currently down. However, he said this to Max Blumenthal- perhaps you can find a video?

This is the quote: HATE HAS ITS CONFERENCES: WHAT WAS SEEN AT CPAC 2009

Peter Brimelow and his 24-year-old bride Lydia Sullivan-Brimelow, the two observing their first wedding anniversary on Tuesday, were there for the entire conference, leaving just a few hours before it ended. In an interview with writer Max Blumenthal, Brimelow, declaring that the Republican Party "is a White party" that loses because they do not try to mobilize their base, dismisses support for Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal, the East Indian-American who is seen as the frontrunner for the 2012 Republican Nomination for President. "There's a lot of white guilt in the Republican Party, so he will appeal to that," he said. "I actually don't know much about his political views. Does he have political views?"

188 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:33:03pm

[Link: www.myfoxchicago.com...]

Talk about bad timing. Chicago may have just lost ANY chance at hosting the Olympics, President Obama, Michelle and Oprah notwithstanding!

189 reine.de.tout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:33:10pm

re: #172 Killgore Trout

Not to mention that they're scaring away minorities from conservatism. Imagine what conservative leaning black people think when they see this stuff. It's not a movement for them, they're just going to go elsewhere.

I know plenty of black people. In conversation, it's obvious their values are as conservative as mine.

They mostly register and vote Dem, and I've often wondered why. It's no longer a mystery, seeing this stuff going on. Shameful.

190 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:33:59pm

re: #187 Charles

I wonder if Max got that on video.

191 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:33:59pm

re: #127 HoosierHoops

Evening, sir Hoops a Lot. S'up, my honey? What have I missed today?

192 jvic  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:34:04pm

re: #153 Dark_Falcon

She's now providing cover for racists? Stupid, given that people have made racist hate-mail attacks on her in the past. She should know better, but she's let her emotions get the better of her.

I used to read Malkin when she was starting out. Somehow she lost her claim on my attention. I'm sorry to learn the direction she's taken. What a misuse of talent and energy.

Yes, the attacks on her were vile. She was called a Filipina wh*re, but in viler terms than I've used.

That which does not kill us does not necessarily make us stronger. It can cripple or, worse, warp.

But to understand is not necessarily to forgive or condone.

193 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:34:21pm
194 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:34:24pm

Is Michelle Malkin white?
/

195 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:34:39pm

re: #187 Charles

This is one reason why I said NO when CPAC organizers pressured me to attend, by the way.

196 solomonpanting  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:35:12pm

re: #185 Sharmuta

Malkin's personal friend and vdare founder, Peter Brimelow has said that the GOP is a party for "white people".

And it was Howard Dean who classified the GOP as "'a white Christian party".

So it was said, so it must to be.

197 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:35:43pm

re: #188 sattv4u2

[Link: www.myfoxchicago.com...]

Talk about bad timing. Chicago may have just lost ANY chance at hosting the Olympics, President Obama, Michelle and Oprah notwithstanding!

Sorry ,, but VERY graphic, btw ,,, although they do blur out the worst of it

198 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:35:51pm

re: #196 solomonpanting

And it was Howard Dean who classified the GOP as "'a white Christian party".

So it was said, so it must to be.

I advise you to look up some facts about Peter Brimelow before equating him to Howard Dean.

199 avanti  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:36:58pm

re: #188 sattv4u2

[Link: www.myfoxchicago.com...]

Talk about bad timing. Chicago may have just lost ANY chance at hosting the Olympics, President Obama, Michelle and Oprah notwithstanding!

Sadly, gang violence like that is all too common in every major US city.

200 Flyers1974  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:37:15pm

A Koz commenters opinion of LGF:

i go to LGF to see what the sane republicans (8+ / 0-)
Recommended by:Geenius at Wrok, Cedwyn, TheShovelJockey, timewarp, James Kresnik, Radical Moderate, Calfacon, fl1972
are thinking. They have their neo con moments but at least they are rational over all. In fact the day Ted Kennedy died, Johnson made it clear that anyone who posted derogatory things about him would banned and did so. Lots of positive comments about Kennedy, such as "i didn't agree with his politics but he believed them and worked hard" or "he was a good man even if he was a democrat" or "my sympathies to his family and the people who loved him" etc etc.

I head over there every couple of weeks to see what their take is on things and am generally surprised at the rational tone and the downrating of any real hate buffoons by other posters. If only that could be the start of a real republican party rather than the loony tunes running it now

201 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:37:16pm

re: #189 reine.de.tout

It's one hell of a problem and it's only going to get worse. The ethnic makeup of the country is changing and Republicans are regressing to a 1950's mentality. It's simply not going to work. Although there's nothing wrong with conservative philosophy in itself, if people take it too far it becomes a regressive mindset.

202 SlartyBartfast  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:37:18pm

re: #188 sattv4u2

Yeah, I'd venture to guess that my favorite for the 2016 Olympics (Tokyo) has far and away the lowest murder (and overall crime) rate.

203 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:37:31pm

re: #199 avanti

Sadly, gang violence like that is all too common in every major US city.

True and in Rio it's far worse.

204 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:37:37pm

re: #189 reine.de.tout

I know plenty of black people. In conversation, it's obvious their values are as conservative as mine.

They mostly register and vote Dem, and I've often wondered why. It's no longer a mystery, seeing this stuff going on. Shameful.

I recently told a (black) co-worker of mine who was ranting about injustices that she was taxed to pay for, "congratulations-your now a republican"... she is thinking about it.

205 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:37:50pm

re: #191 iceweasel

Evening, sir Hoops a Lot. S'up, my honey? What have I missed today?

uh oh...Nothing...
/Dang busted...
//Just kicking..Why?
*wink*

206 solomonpanting  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:37:50pm

re: #198 Charles

I advise you to look up some facts about Peter Brimelow before equating him to Howard Dean.


I do believe I was equating their comments, not necessarily their characters.

207 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:38:28pm

re: #199 avanti

Sadly, gang violence like that is all too common in every major US city.

I've lived in many major US cities. Fights are indeed common, esp gang ones. Drive by shootings as well

However this is one of the worse I've seen in a very long time

208 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:39:27pm

re: #206 solomonpanting

I do believe I was equating their comments, not necessarily their characters.

Then say so, before you put yourself in the untenable position of defending Peter Brimelow.

209 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:39:36pm

And on that note, my drive home awaits

Cya !

210 Racer X  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:40:49pm

I think I finally figured it out.

Michelle, Beck, Savage, etc.. are all leftist plants. They are intentionally creating furor where there clearly is none. They are stirring up shit to get the really ugly right-wing nut-jobs to come out from hiding and put their bigotry and hatred on display for everyone to see.

This has to be the reason.

There is no other logical explanation for the ignorance and hatred that is being spewed from the right side.

211 HelloDare  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:41:19pm

Largest Gathering of Alchemists in Over 500 Years!
This annual event is produced jointly by the International Alchemy Guild and the Modern Mystery School. The Guild is a non-profit membership organization dedicated to preserving the ancient teachings of alchemy. The Modern Mystery School offers advanced spiritual training in the ancient lineage of sacred wisdom transmitted through the great masters. The goal of our work is to empower individuals with the highest level of spiritual growth coupled with practical knowledge on how to change our personal reality and thereby transform the world. Help us spread the word!

212 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:41:46pm

re: #166 Killgore Trout

You shall be taunted, and be strong enough not to respond.
(I hope?)

213 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:42:57pm

re: #187 Charles

Another fun Brimelow fact: this summer, while he and Pat Buchanan were at a conference to argue for an English-only initiative, (and take shots at Sotomayor's competence in English) ... They did so under a misspelled banner.

On Saturday, Pat Buchanan hosted a conference to discuss how Republicans can regain a majority in America. During one discussion, panelists suggested supporting English-only initiatives as a prime way of attracting “working class white Democrats.” The discussion ridiculed Judge Sotomayor for the fact that she studied children’s classics to improve her grammar while attending college. The panelists also suggested that, without English as the official language, President Obama would force Americans to speak Spanish.

One salient feature of the event was the banner hanging over the English-only advocates. The word conference was spelled “Conferenece."

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

English only! Because reel UhMurkins don't need any other language...and we'll have no truck with yer fancy spellin, neither!

214 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:43:30pm

re: #210 Racer X

I think I finally figured it out.

Michelle, Beck, Savage, etc.. are all leftist plants. They are intentionally creating furor where there clearly is none. They are stirring up shit to get the really ugly right-wing nut-jobs to come out from hiding and put their bigotry and hatred on display for everyone to see.

This has to be the reason.

There is no other logical explanation for the ignorance and hatred that is being spewed from the right side.

/explanation? we don't need no stinkin explanations!

215 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:43:58pm

re: #210 Racer X

It's something I picked up on thanks in part to Thanos and our discussions here at LGF concerning the far-right in Europe. The fringes have to sideline the moderates if they're going to have room to operate and acquire power. Vlaams Belang has done this to moderate right parties in Belgium, and this tactic has moved to America, where any moderate is labeled a RINO! and pushed aside.

216 bratwurst  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:44:06pm

re: #210 Racer X

As a self-identifying leftist, I can assure you we are nowhere near smart enough to conceive and execute a plan like that!

217 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:44:28pm

re: #193 Killgore Trout

Buchanan and Brimelow...
Under Misspelled Banner, Buchanan And White Nationalist Brimelow Argue For English-Only Initiatives

Idiots.

Dang! You beat me! :)

218 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:45:05pm
219 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:45:32pm

re: #213 iceweasel

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

English only! Because reel UhMurkins don't need any other language...and we'll have no truck with yer fancy spellin, neither!

Hey, I still don't see why I gotta press 1 to speak English...

220 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:45:34pm

Flounce #1!

221 drogheda  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:45:35pm

re: #166 Killgore Trout

I shall not be taunted.

Well it beats being mocked I reckon.

222 Racer X  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:45:44pm

re: #216 bratwurst

As a self-identifying leftist, I can assure you we are nowhere near smart enough to conceive and execute a plan like that!

To perfection no less.

Its getting really disgusting.

223 borgcube  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:45:55pm

re: #156 Slumbering Behemoth

Now you're talking! Reminds me of the greatest sport of all time. Whirlyball. Yes. Whirlyball. We had one here back in So Cal in the 80's but alas, it was ahead of its time.

Never fear, there's always youtube:

Hey, it's in Chicago! I take it all back. Chicago 2016 with Whirlyball!

224 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:46:04pm

re: #212 Floral Giraffe

You shall be taunted, and be strong enough not to respond.
(I hope?)

I'm as cool as a cucumber.

225 bratwurst  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:46:56pm

re: #220 Charles

Flounce #1!

Wow, finally got to see one with my own eyes!

226 Racer X  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:47:21pm

I got a mental image of Stinky standing over in the corner with a huge stick, waiting to smack people with it. Because that dude is fast.

227 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:47:45pm

re: #220 Charles

Flounce #1!

[Dark_Falcon throws the troll's corpse down the garbage chute.]

Next!

228 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:48:46pm

I haven't read MM's comments in full yet, but if the Winter Games in freaking Salt Lake City, for pete's sakes, can be riddled with graft, just imagine the possibilities if they end up being awarded to that toddlin' town...

229 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:48:54pm

re: #227 Dark_Falcon

[Dark_Falcon throws the troll's corpse down the garbage chute.]

Next!

/Compost damnit!

230 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:49:36pm

re: #193 Killgore Trout

Buchanan and Brimelow...
Under Misspelled Banner, Buchanan And White Nationalist Brimelow Argue For English-Only Initiatives

Idiots.

Conferenece!

/

231 reine.de.tout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:49:55pm

re: #201 Killgore Trout

It's one hell of a problem and it's only going to get worse. The ethnic makeup of the country is changing and Republicans are regressing to a 1950's mentality. It's simply not going to work. Although there's nothing wrong with conservative philosophy in itself, if people take it too far it becomes a regressive mindset.

There are plenty of religious conservatives here, so the "market" for minority representation exists, big-time.

But the Rep party is definitely NOT going to ever be able to tap into it, until they make some big changes from what I'm seeing here. It is just painful to watch this.

232 avanti  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:50:09pm

re: #225 bratwurst

Wow, finally got to see one with my own eyes!

Me too, got to speed read it, then poof !

233 Bagua  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:50:44pm

A Flounce is a Terrible Thing To Waste

234 reine.de.tout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:51:22pm

re: #213 iceweasel

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

English only! Because reel UhMurkins don't need any other language...and we'll have no truck with yer fancy spellin, neither!

Oh, hell.
Wouldja please quit finding that stuff?

235 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:51:49pm

re: #219 brookly red

Hey, I still don't see why I gotta press 1 to speak English...

Could be worse. They could make you press number 2.

English is number 1! USA!!!1!

236 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:52:13pm
237 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:52:43pm

If nothing else, it will be quite interesting if Chicago does get the Olympics. There will actually have to be a new term coined to describe the grid lock.

238 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:53:06pm

re: #233 Bagua

A flounce is a terrible thing to waste

watch.


FTFY

239 HelloDare  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:53:27pm

Gadhafi is on Larry King right now. He makes King look good.

240 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:53:29pm

re: #235 iceweasel

Could be worse. They could make you press number 2.

English is number 1! USA!!!1!

we are not ammused.

241 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:53:32pm

About Peter Brimelow: SPLCenter.org: Keeping America White

242 The Shadow Do  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:54:35pm

re: #226 Racer X

I got a mental image of Stinky standing over in the corner with a huge stick, waiting to smack people with it. Because that dude is fast.

Is Stinky a married man?

243 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:54:57pm

re: #240 brookly red

we are not ammused.

I'm sad too. I thought I was joking when I said spelling was for elitists.

244 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:55:00pm

President Obama, most Dem commentators and even Bill Clinton, all seem determined to resist the race bait being dangled by a small minority of right wing racists, and remain focused on the issues instead.
Main-stream Republicans need to do the same, and thereby marginalize the fringe.

245 reine.de.tout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:55:06pm

re: #240 brookly red

we are not ammused.

Brookly - I'm not amused either except - it was sorta funny.

246 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:55:16pm

re: #213 iceweasel

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

English only! Because reel UhMurkins don't need any other language...and we'll have no truck with yer fancy spellin, neither!

We speak Merican only!

Right, like the countless Norwegians, Germans, Irish and Italian immigrants from the turn of the century that never learned to speak a word of English. I'm a proponent of assimilation but as usual, these guys take it to a level I don't care to be a part of nor vote for.

Part of this is tainted with having seen many immigrants including my parents speaking in English only to be told "speak English" by some lowlife. In my folks case it was in the early years. I'm sill stunned when I see "close captioning" on TV whenever they have someone speaking with an accent. That's another thing too, they freak out about the accents as well.

247 Bagua  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:55:29pm

re: #238 tradewind


In the interest of science some of us are asked to observe horrible things, like flouncing and the weather.

248 The Sanity Inspector  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:56:05pm

re: #58 Summer

Lol...you definitely get bonus points for knowing your Python that well. =)

We just await the employment of...THE COMFY CHAIR!!

249 reine.de.tout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:57:06pm

re: #213 iceweasel

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

English only! Because reel UhMurkins don't need any other language...and we'll have no truck with yer fancy spellin, neither!

Ah, but not true everywhere.
In La, there were (not so many anymore) lots and lots of Cajun French people who spoke only Cajun French, and heard not a word of English 'til they went to school.

250 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:58:06pm

re: #211 HelloDare

Largest Gathering of Alchemists in Over 500 Years!
This annual event is produced jointly by the International Alchemy Guild and the Modern Mystery School. The Guild is a non-profit membership organization dedicated to preserving the ancient teachings of alchemy. The Modern Mystery School offers advanced spiritual training in the ancient lineage of sacred wisdom transmitted through the great masters. The goal of our work is to empower individuals with the highest level of spiritual growth coupled with practical knowledge on how to change our personal reality and thereby transform the world. Help us spread the word!

So, are there any 500 year old alchemists? Any who really found the Philosophers' Stone?
Maybe Nicholas Flamel?
(A real alchemist who was rumored to have found it; J. K. Rowling used the name.)

251 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:58:21pm

re: #241 Charles

About Peter Brimelow: SPLCenter.org: Keeping America White

Then there's the company his brother keeps.

John Brimelow (twin brother of Peter Brimelow, author of the influential anti-immigration tract Alien Nation) who runs the popular VDARE.com website attended and was observed cloistered in the atrium consorting with [Don] Black and his cohorts. A controversial figure for some within the American Renaissance milieu, David Duke, former Grand Wizard of the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan (who was succeeded by Black), was there as were the far-right radio talk show host Hal Turner, Mark Weber, director of the California-based Holocaust denial outfit the Institute for Historical Review (IHR), Kevin Strom of National Vanguard and David Pringle, both former members of the neo-Nazi National Alliance. There was also a large contingent of Canadians led by Paul Fromm of the Canada First Immigration Reform Committee. Fromm is a friend of the Holocaust deniers Lady Michelle Renouf and Ernst Zündel who, much to Fromm’s annoyance, is currently on trial in Germany.

252 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:58:37pm

re: #245 reine.de.tout

Brookly - I'm not amused either except - it was sorta funny.

/it ' ¡s no divertido, damnit!

253 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:58:46pm

re: #244 Spare O'Lake

It was fascinating, though, to watch Clinton trot out the VRWC theory in an interview, just like HRC did during his presidency when the heat was on.
Maybe not exactly alike... the pink suit and headband wouldn't have worked.

254 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 6:59:53pm

re: #249 reine.de.tout

Ah, but not true everywhere.
In La, there were (not so many anymore) lots and lots of Cajun French people who spoke only Cajun French, and heard not a word of English 'til they went to school.

Oh of course. I'm only making fun of white supremacists.

255 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:00:14pm

re: #235 iceweasel

Could be worse. They could make you press number 2.

English is number 1! USA!!!1!

I hate it when the Chinese operator tells me to select 6 for English..I always push 3...
If only I had spent 500 dollars for Rosetta stone Software...I could have nailed directory assistance...

256 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:00:54pm

re: #249 reine.de.tout

Where they caught da debil, cher, for speaking Cajun French...
Even in La, it was English only in the public schools.
I miss hearing the sound of people talking in the bayou country almost as much as the food.

257 reine.de.tout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:00:55pm

re: #254 iceweasel

Oh of course. I'm only making fun of white supremacists.

Just sayin' . . .
The world as we know it did not end because there was a portion of the population that did not speak English.

258 reine.de.tout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:01:29pm

re: #256 tradewind

Where they caught da debil, cher, for speaking Cajun French...
Even in La, it was English only in the public schools.
I miss hearing the sound of people talking in the bayou country almost as much as the food.

It is fun to listen to, sha.

259 swamprat  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:01:46pm

Very nice.

But Charles is the one who supposedly "jumped the shark".
Alrighty then.
Isolationism can be fun!

The Republicans seem to want to abandon all that neo-con stuff, so that they may fully embrace their innner jesse helms.

Whatever.

260 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:02:10pm

re: #255 HoosierHoops

There's a great underground directory that teaches you how to punch your way out of the automated directories in hundreds of companies across the US, and get sent straight to a real person.

261 tokyobk  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:02:19pm

If there was a real Republican party able to gain and hold office they would realize that Obama, far from being the (foreign born) anti-christ, is actually a pretty weak president.

But, there is no Republican party right now with any real claim to leadership.

262 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:02:49pm

re: #251 Sharmuta

Then there's the company his brother keeps.

Two clicks away from outright neo-Nazis. Isn't that lovely.

263 The Sanity Inspector  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:03:12pm

OT: Because I was late for the open thread, here's some scorching blues guitar riffing:

264 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:03:20pm

re: #257 reine.de.tout

Just sayin' . . .
The world as we know it did not end because there was a portion of the population that did not speak English.

There have been - probably still are - neighborhoods where you won't hear English except used for emphasis. Those were also where you looked for good food, cheap. Even in San Francisco in the 80's, this was true.

I never noted it as a problem.

265 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:03:37pm

re: #262 Charles

Two clicks away from outright neo-Nazis. Isn't that lovely.

And these are friends of Malkin's. That's really swell.

266 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:03:39pm

re: #255 HoosierHoops

I hate it when the Chinese operator tells me to select 6 for English..I always push 3...
If only I had spent 500 dollars for Rosetta stone Software...I could have nailed directory assistance...

/ain't that covered by the sitmulos?

267 Bagua  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:04:41pm

re: #260 tradewind


Link please.

268 The Sanity Inspector  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:05:21pm

re: #241 Charles

About Peter Brimelow: SPLCenter.org: Keeping America White

MAD Magazine back in the early 70s had a good definition of a super-patriot: someone who loves his country, but who hates 97% of the people in it.

269 Bagua  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:05:57pm

re: #263 The Sanity Inspector

Fond memories of seeing the man live in Miami.


Well, well, well. -RLB
270 MandyManners  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:07:39pm

re: #228 tradewind

I haven't read MM's comments in full yet, but if the Winter Games in freaking Salt Lake City, for pete's sakes, can be riddled with graft, just imagine the possibilities if they end up being awarded to that toddlin' town...

I don't read her at all but, I do have a rather distinct memory of the mess in SLC. Awful. Just awful.

271 Achilles Tang  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:08:53pm

re: #146 Charles

Lots of "wookie" comments being posted at Malkin's site now.

It's been a long time since I browsed there, or really many other blogs, but I saw that the had the Cameron video on the Darwin book that we saw recently, and I read some of the comments...1900 of them so far.

A depressing collection of uneducated and mean spirited Americans if I ever saw one.

272 brent  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:09:00pm

I sure hope Chicago gets the Olympics - might be the best thing the junior president from Illinois accomplishes.

On a lighter note, how funny is it that he's only talked to his guy in Afghanistan once in the last 70 days. The guy that hand delivered a request for 45,000 more men, that guy.

Not one bit would be the correct answer. Maybe I'm looking at this stuff all wrong.

273 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:09:45pm

re: #267 Bagua
Here's one... I don't think it's the one I am thinking of, I will keep looking... it was in our local paper...
[Link: www.realtechnews.com...]

274 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:09:45pm

re: #140 Slumbering Behemoth

Oh yeah! I am seeing High on Fire and Mastodon this Friday. :D so looking forward to seeing HoF for the first time, and Mastodon for the second.

275 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:10:51pm

re: #272 brent

I sure hope Chicago gets the Olympics - might be the best thing the junior president from Illinois accomplishes.

On a lighter note, how funny is it that he's only talked to his guy in Afghanistan once in the last 70 days. The guy that hand delivered a request for 45,000 more men, that guy.

Not one bit would be the correct answer. Maybe I'm looking at this stuff all wrong.

Yea, really funny, I guess the Olympics and pandering to his friends in Chicago is more important than talking care of the war in Afghanistan.

276 The Sanity Inspector  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:11:02pm

re: #267 Bagua

Link please.

[Link: www.gethuman.com...]

A nifty directory, which I've consulted a few times to bail out of the automated phone directory carousel.

277 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:11:05pm

re: #272 brent

I sure hope Chicago gets the Olympics - might be the best thing the junior president from Illinois accomplishes.

On a lighter note, how funny is it that he's only talked to his guy in Afghanistan once in the last 70 days. The guy that hand delivered a request for 45,000 more men, that guy.

Not one bit would be the correct answer. Maybe I'm looking at this stuff all wrong.

Nope..Obama has talked more to Letterman than his General on the Ground in Afganistan in the last 70 days..
Sleep tight...

278 Bagua  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:11:29pm

re: #273 tradewind

Thanks, automated directories are of the devil.

/

279 Racer X  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:11:48pm
Tests on skull fragment cast doubt on Adolf Hitler suicide story

American researchers claim to have demonstrated that the skull fragment, secretly preserved for decades by Soviet intelligence, belonged to a woman under 40, whose identity is unknown. DNA analyses performed on the bone, now held by the Russian State Archive in Moscow, have been processed at the genetics lab of the University of Connecticut. The results, broadcast in the US by a History Channel documentary, Hitler's Escape, astonished scientists.

Great, Just freaking great.

280 solomonpanting  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:12:37pm

re: #272 brent

I sure hope Chicago gets the Olympics - might be the best thing the junior president from Illinois accomplishes.

On a lighter note, how funny is it that he's only talked to his guy in Afghanistan once in the last 70 days. The guy that hand delivered a request for 45,000 more men, that guy.

Not one bit would be the correct answer. Maybe I'm looking at this stuff all wrong.


Obama has tried calling many times but can't get past the "For English, press or say 'One'", as it's being delivered in Pashto.

281 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:13:02pm

Stupid Question: Doesn't Malkin, herself a member of a visible minority, realize that she would be cast aside like garbage by any hard core white supremacist? Assuming she's not a total idiot, how can she consort with these types?
I just don't get it.

282 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:13:15pm

re: #247 Bagua

...and the reaction when someone tosses out the possibility that there might be a chance for corruption associated with the Olympics in a major city known for machine politics?
///

283 Racer X  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:13:21pm

re: #277 HoosierHoops

Nope..Obama has talked more to Letterman than his General on the Ground in Afganistan in the last 70 days..
Sleep tight...

Hoops, you're harshing my buzz.

284 That's Mr. President to you  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:13:36pm

It is unfortunate that my plans for a Summer Games have been foiled.

I was looking forward to introducing some new sports, like

* Post-Modern Pentathlon -

Competitors meet in 5 different events in which they deconstruct assertions of other competitors in front of judges. They then deconstruct the judges scores in an attempt to disarm all false oppositions. Competition ends when all competitors have gotten the judges to modify their scores such that everyone receives an average score of "5" on a scale of 1 to 10. Gold medals are the awarded to everyone, yet everyone rejects them as symbols of hegemonic intent.

* Synchronized Teleprompter -

A team of a speaker and translator make speeches judged on length, rambling and incoherence. Getting your translator to collapse almost guarantees a gold. Lybia was looking forward to fielding a gold medal team.

* Re-Cycling -

A race involving bicycles made from re purposed materials. Judged not on who finishes first but on who can be the most pretentious in promoting all that they did in order to reuse something.

285 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:14:06pm

re: #264 Dianna

There have been - probably still are - neighborhoods where you won't hear English except used for emphasis. Those were also where you looked for good food, cheap. Even in San Francisco in the 80's, this was true.

I never noted it as a problem.

The preschool available to my great-nephew is bilingual ONLY.

286 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:14:12pm

re: #278 Bagua

Sometimes I just start jabbing zero in frustration, and half the time it works...

287 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:14:20pm

re: #278 Bagua

Thanks, automated directories are of the devil.

/

I call 'em "voice mail jail."

288 Hawaii69  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:14:31pm

re: #262 Charles

Two clicks away from outright neo-Nazis. Isn't that lovely.

How many clicks to Kevin Bacon?

289 MandyManners  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:14:33pm

re: #279 Racer X

Great, Just freaking great.

BOYZ IN BRAZIL ARE BACK IN TOWN!

290 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:14:41pm

re: #277 HoosierHoops

Nope..Obama has talked more to Letterman than his General on the Ground in Afganistan in the last 70 days..
Sleep tight...

that is sooo fucked up. (not you, that fact)

291 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:15:17pm

re: #279 Racer X

Great, Just freaking great.

All it casts doubt on is that the Soviets grabbed the right bone fragments.

292 MandyManners  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:15:34pm

re: #284 That's Mr. President to you

It is unfortunate that my plans for a Summer Games have been foiled.

I was looking forward to introducing some new sports, like

* Post-Modern Pentathlon -

Competitors meet in 5 different events in which they deconstruct assertions of other competitors in front of judges. They then deconstruct the judges scores in an attempt to disarm all false oppositions. Competition ends when all competitors have gotten the judges to modify their scores such that everyone receives an average score of "5" on a scale of 1 to 10. Gold medals are the awarded to everyone, yet everyone rejects them as symbols of hegemonic intent.

* Synchronized Teleprompter -

A team of a speaker and translator make speeches judged on length, rambling and incoherence. Getting your translator to collapse almost guarantees a gold. Lybia was looking forward to fielding a gold medal team.

* Re-Cycling -

A race involving bicycles made from re purposed materials. Judged not on who finishes first but on who can be the most pretentious in promoting all that they did in order to reuse something.

How ya' doin', ya' WHOA. FULL. STOP.

293 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:16:15pm

re: #285 OldLineTexan

The preschool available to my great-nephew is bilingual ONLY.

OK, downding me. It's just a fact, stated as a fact.

There was no value judgement attached.

294 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:16:20pm

re: #290 brookly red

Why is it taking him a week or so to get back to McChrystal? Seriously, does anyone know? Shouldn't there be a meeting of brass going on now?

295 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:16:47pm

re: #285 OldLineTexan

The preschool available to my great-nephew is bilingual ONLY.

What languages?

296 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:16:58pm

Dan Riehl is still at it, maligning the murdered census worker:

Riehl World View: Was Bill Sparkman Actually Hanged?

297 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:17:35pm

re: #293 OldLineTexan

OK, downding me. It's just a fact, stated as a fact.

There was no value judgement attached.

Who downdinged? And why?

298 MandyManners  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:17:36pm

re: #285 OldLineTexan

What's wrong with teaching youngsters how to speak the language of the land?

299 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:17:46pm

re: #293 OldLineTexan

OK, downding me. It's just a fact, stated as a fact.

There was no value judgement attached.

OK, so what's up with up-dings then, on posts defending Peter Brimelow?

300 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:18:05pm

re: #298 MandyManners

What's wrong with teaching youngsters how to speak the language of the land?

This youngster speaks the language of the land.

301 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:19:02pm

re: #299 Charles

OK, so what's up with up-dings then, on posts defending Peter Brimelow?

The posts were comparing statements, not defending Peter Brimelow.

It's my opinion you over-interpreted them.

302 brent  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:19:09pm

I think he's talked to George Lopez more than McChrystal - and he's not even an Uhmerkin.

/lighten up, Francis

303 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:19:15pm

re: #299 Charles

OK, so what's up with up-dings then, on posts defending Peter Brimelow?

I haven't seen any, so I have no idea.

304 Bagua  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:19:19pm

re: #286 tradewind

Sometimes I just start jabbing zero in frustration, and half the time it works...

I always jab zero early and often, it's not a panacea like hemp but it often does the trick.

Difficulty reaching a human on the telephone is another sign of the impending apocalypse.

/

305 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:19:28pm

re: #296 Charles

Dan Riehl is still at it, maligning the murdered census worker:

Riehl World View: Was Bill Sparkman Actually Hanged?

Laying the ground work for kookspiracies should this murder be deemed politically motivated. They're frightened that it will be deemed such.

306 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:19:29pm

re: #295 Dianna

What languages?

English and Spanish.

307 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:20:12pm

re: #303 Dianna

It was a direct question to me, which I answered in 301.

308 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:20:20pm

re: #294 tradewind

Why is it taking him a week or so to get back to McChrystal? Seriously, does anyone know? Shouldn't there be a meeting of brass going on now?

well his is a bit busy now with the healthcare thing & hangin w/oprah an all... and besides the poll numbers arn't in yet. i am sure he will get around to it.

309 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:20:50pm

re: #281 Spare O'Lake

Power and notoriety and money! It's like any other form of stardom, I guess, people just ride it as long as they can.

I've always suspected that Michael Savage as heard on his radio show is sort of a concocted personality who doesn't really believe most of his own schtick. Almost like a heel in pro-wrestling. I've totally heard mild mannered local radio hosts in Seattle flip-flop their personalities to become Savage-esque paranoid firebrands when they change shows, formats, etc. Ahh, talk radio!

310 swamprat  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:21:34pm

re: #298 MandyManners

People who can't speak english get paid less. Teaching children to speak english from whatever language they speak is wonderful.
Educating them in their original tongue is economic slavery.

311 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:21:38pm

re: #298 MandyManners

What's wrong with teaching youngsters how to speak the language of the land?

Also, there was absolutely no value judgement in my statement.

It was a comment on another aspect of diversity besides good ethnic food in self-segregated neighborhoods.

312 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:22:02pm

re: #308 brookly red

well his is a bit busy now with the healthcare thing & hangin w/oprah an all... and besides the poll numbers arn't in yet. i am sure he will get around to it.

And he's got that little trip to Copenhagen, pick up some souvenirs, a few bowls... busy man.

313 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:22:15pm

re: #298 MandyManners

What's wrong with teaching youngsters how to speak the language of the land?

I don't want to comment, I just want to see that in print again.

314 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:22:20pm

re: #307 OldLineTexan

It was a direct question to me, which I answered in 301.

Oh, sorry. I thought it was a general question.

315 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:22:32pm

re: #285 OldLineTexan

The preschool available to my great-nephew is bilingual ONLY.

Nothing wrong with that. It's much easier to become bilingual before the age of 7 or so. Honestly, all kids ought to be in bilingual schools.

316 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:22:58pm

re: #305 Sharmuta

It's pretty much inevitable at this point. This has been a very dangerous and destructive turn for the American right. It won't last long but it's going to be messy.

317 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:22:59pm

The best time for children to be exposed to other languages is when they're young. It creates pathways in their brains that can better help them learn other languages when they're older.

318 Bagua  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:23:00pm

re: #306 OldLineTexan

English and Spanish.

Aucun français, incroyable!

319 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:23:25pm

re: #312 Walter L. Newton

holla homie!

320 reine.de.tout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:23:35pm

re: #318 Bagua

Aucun français, incroyable!

Watchit.
OLT gets weird when there's French around.

321 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:23:38pm

Just watched Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee (D-Tx) explain why we need to include illegal aliens in the health care bill.
Seriously.

322 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:23:49pm

re: #301 OldLineTexan

The posts were comparing statements, not defending Peter Brimelow.

It's my opinion you over-interpreted them.

Really. So you believe comparing Howard Dean to Peter Brimelow is appropriate?

323 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:24:06pm

re: #315 iceweasel

Nothing wrong with that. It's much easier to become bilingual before the age of 7 or so. Honestly, all kids ought to be in bilingual schools.

I still can't find where I said there was anything necessarily WRONG.

I made a statement of fact.

Are people so scared of facts, now, that they have to assume negative intent behind a statement?

324 MandyManners  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:24:09pm

re: #310 swamprat

People who can't speak english get paid less. Teaching children to speak english from whatever language they speak is wonderful.
Educating them in their original tongue is economic slavery.

That's what I meant.

325 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:24:09pm

re: #285 OldLineTexan

What's wrong with people being bilingual? I sure wish I had taken some Spanish as a kid.

326 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:24:31pm

re: #319 brookly red

holla homie!

I was up your way two weeks ago, Hampton Bays, a funeral for my girlfriends grandmother. I wasn't there 24 hours and I was talking like I never left in 1974.

327 swamprat  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:24:58pm

re: #316 Killgore Trout

I hope to

Sure hope you're wrong.

328 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:25:00pm

re: #318 Bagua

Aucun français, incroyable!

No, no choice in how your English-speaking child becomes bilingual.

The Vietnamese kids are also out of luck.

329 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:25:10pm

Flashback to January 2008:

President Bush Meets with Chicago 2016 Bid Committee and United States Olympic Committee Members
Union League Club of Chicago
Chicago, Illinois

11:35 A.M. CST

THE PRESIDENT: I want to thank the members of the 2016 Chicago bid to get the Olympics. Listen, Mr. Mayor, you and your committee have put together a great plan. It's a plan that will make America proud.

They say that the Olympics will come to Chicago if we're fortunate enough to be selected, but really it's coming to America, and I can't think of a better city to represent the United States than Chicago.


President George W. Bush and Chicago Mayor Richard Daley hold up a T-shirt touting Chicago 2016, during a meeting Monday, Jan. 7, 2008, with with members of the Chicago 2016 Bid Committee and the U.S. Olympic Committee. Said the President, "This country supports your bid, strongly. And our hope is that the judges will take a good look at Chicago and select Chicago for the 2016 Olympics." White House photo by Joyce N. Boghosian This is a well thought out venue. There will be -- the athletes will be taken care of. People who will be coming from around the world will find this good city has got fantastic accommodations, great restaurants. It will be safe.

And so I -- this country supports your bid, strongly. And our hope is that the judges will take a good look at Chicago and select Chicago for the 2016 Olympics.

Thank you all.


END 11:36 A.M. CST

330 MandyManners  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:25:30pm

re: #311 OldLineTexan

Also, there was absolutely no value judgement in my statement.

It was a comment on another aspect of diversity besides good ethnic food in self-segregated neighborhoods.

Multi-culti is not a good thing universally.

331 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:25:45pm

re: #325 WindUpBird

What's wrong with people being bilingual? I sure wish I had taken some Spanish as a kid.

I will give you a dollar to show me how that stated fact was automatically negative.

332 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:26:06pm

re: #323 OldLineTexan

OLT, calm down. I strongly suggest you log off and come back after things have cooled down. I've seen where exchanges like this end up and its seldom good.

333 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:26:17pm

re: #310 swamprat

People who can't speak english get paid less. Teaching children to speak english from whatever language they speak is wonderful.
Educating them in their original tongue is economic slavery.

actually I am seeing more & more job postings for bi-lingual employees...

334 MandyManners  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:26:32pm

re: #315 iceweasel

Nothing wrong with that. It's much easier to become bilingual before the age of 7 or so. Honestly, all kids ought to be in bilingual schools.

The school is in America. The language to be learned is English.

335 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:26:40pm

re: #322 Charles

Really. So you believe comparing Howard Dean to Peter Brimelow is appropriate?

I believe two statements can be compared, regardless of who made them.

336 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:26:40pm

re: #315 iceweasel

Nothing wrong with that. It's much easier to become bilingual before the age of 7 or so. Honestly, all kids ought to be in bilingual schools.


L'enfer avec ça ... Tous les êtres humains doivent parler anglais ...
Salut vous

337 swamprat  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:26:46pm

re: #325 WindUpBird

If I hadn't cussed at my mother in spanish...
Oh, well.

338 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:26:48pm

re: #323 OldLineTexan

I still can't find where I said there was anything necessarily WRONG.

I made a statement of fact.

Are people so scared of facts, now, that they have to assume negative intent behind a statement?

I didn't opine on you, or make any assumption about your opinion. I merely offered my own as to the utility and desirability of bilingual education in preschool.

Are people so sensitive that they have to assume negative personal intent behind a commenter's opinion?

339 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:27:09pm

re: #333 brookly red

actually I am seeing more & more job postings for bi-lingual employees...

More's the pity.

340 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:27:30pm

re: #331 OldLineTexan

I will give you a dollar to show me how that stated fact was automatically negative.

Keep the dollar and just answer a simple question -- do you believe it's bad for children to attend a bilingual school?

341 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:27:42pm

re: #326 Walter L. Newton

I was up your way two weeks ago, Hampton Bays, a funeral for my girlfriends grandmother. I wasn't there 24 hours and I was talking like I never left in 1974.

I remember... never did get to Katz's huh?

342 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:27:43pm

re: #338 iceweasel

Read what you wrote again, and then you tell me.

343 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:27:44pm

re: #334 MandyManners

The school is in America. The language to be learned is English.

They're already learning English.

344 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:28:04pm

re: #335 OldLineTexan

I believe two statements can be compared, regardless of who made them.

Dean was being critical, imo. Brimelow wasn't. That's a big difference, don't you think?

345 karmic_inquisitor  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:28:21pm

I don't really get why conservatives feel so strongly about English versus Spanish.

They are both languages from Europe. There is nothing intrinsically American about either one. Which is also why I don't understand the near cultural nationalism that many hispanics in the USA attach to Spanish. It is the language of a fairly brutal conqueror that pretty much destroyed all of the aboriginal cultures it encountered.

It is as if we here in the New World have picked up on a fight between the Spanish and English empires.

346 TheMatrix31  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:28:26pm

re: #336 HoosierHoops

Que?

347 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:28:34pm

re: #341 brookly red

I remember... never did get to Katz's huh?

No. Never found a knish either.

348 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:28:41pm

re: #340 Charles

Keep the dollar and just answer a simple question -- do you believe it's bad for children to attend a bilingual school?

I believe it's odd that it's the only choice in that neighborhood.

It's not a district-wide thing.

And I'm not an angry racist, or even angry now.

349 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:28:55pm

re: #343 iceweasel

They're already learning English.

Yes, but grammar, spelling, punctuation and graceful use require intensive training.

350 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:29:47pm

re: #348 OldLineTexan

I believe it's odd that it's the only choice in that neighborhood.

It's not a district-wide thing.

And I'm not an angry racist, or even angry now.

OK, then what's the purpose of denying that you intended that as a negative statement?

351 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:30:11pm

Again in January of 2008 and this time speaking to the Urban League:

President Bush Discusses Economy in Chicago, Illinois
Union League Club of Chicago
Chicago, Illinois

1:18 P.M. CST

Then the Mayor had me briefed by the 2016 Olympic Committee bid team, and you got a good bid. I'm absolutely convinced that Chicago will represent the entire country the right way if the Olympics are here in 2016. Mr. Mayor, you've put together an outstanding team, and I just want to -- (applause) -- I just want the judges to understand that the United States of America stands squarely behind Chicago's bid.

I just want the judges to understand that the United States of America stands squarely behind Chicago's bid.

President George W. Bush, 2/08

352 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:30:12pm

re: #347 Walter L. Newton

No. Never found a knish either.

I think Yohan Shimmel's has a web site...

353 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:30:19pm

re: #350 Charles

OK, then what's the purpose of denying that you intended that as a negative statement?

Because it wasn't.

354 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:30:30pm

re: #331 OldLineTexan

It seemed implied that you would have preferred a choice of a non-bilingual pre-school.

And it would work the other way, if you said "the only preschool in my area teaches english exclusively" that implies you would rather a bilingual program exist.

Facts are facts. But stating facts in the context of discussion can imply ideas, wants, likes, dislikes...

355 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:30:54pm

re: #308 brookly red
I am not at all outraged, I am just somewhat puzzled at the Olympic jaunt, just because first, it seemed to be Michelle's gig, which is fine, and second, shouldn't there be people like Commerce department or our Olympic honchos doing that? Shouldn't Mayor Daley get top billing there?
Just picture Dubya going to Paris, say, to try to get the Olympics for Dallas or Houston. There would be exploding heads. He could hardly golf without inspiring outrage, and that was without missiles that could reach Israel and Europe being fired off in Iran.

356 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:30:56pm

re: #349 Dianna

Yes, but grammar, spelling, punctuation and graceful use require intensive training.

Of course they do, and I'd be one of the first to say that too many people graduate high school and have no idea how to write.
That being said, learning another language isn't going to remove their ability to write or speak English.

More language skills all over, please.

357 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:31:11pm

re: #353 OldLineTexan

Because it wasn't.

So you're perfectly fine then with your great-nephew attending a bilingual school?

358 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:31:25pm

re: #350 Charles

OK, then what's the purpose of denying that you intended that as a negative statement?

I didn't read it as such, but a remark on a situation.

359 swamprat  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:31:27pm

re: #333 brookly red

Oh yeah, being fluent in two languages is a real boon!

But english is a necessary part of our world. Without it, your opportunities close, and your chances of getting ripped off increase.

360 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:31:58pm

re: #354 WindUpBird

I disagree, but thank you.

I am going to apologize to our gracious host, and log out as was suggested.

Charles, my intent was not what you assume.

Goodnight.

361 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:32:14pm

re: #352 brookly red

I think Yohan Shimmel's has a web site...

Found it. I remember when you could get a potato knish at almost any hot dog joint or sandwich counter. And on carts and other "grab" food places.

I never saw the word "knish" on any sign in midtown when I was there.

362 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:32:26pm

Uh huh.

363 OldLineTexan  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:32:32pm

re: #357 Charles

So you're perfectly fine then with your great-nephew attending a bilingual school?

Yes. I am not fine that it's the only choice.

Goodnight.

364 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:32:36pm

re: #354 WindUpBird

I didn't read OLT's remark that way.

365 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:33:32pm

re: #360 OldLineTexan

I disagree, but thank you.

I am going to apologize to our gracious host, and log out as was suggested.

Charles, my intent was not what you assume.

Goodnight.

Goodnight, OTL. You made a smart choice. Sometimes the smart play is to step back.

366 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:33:35pm

re: #345 karmic_inquisitor

I don't really get why conservatives feel so strongly about English versus Spanish.

They are both languages from Europe. There is nothing intrinsically American about either one. Which is also why I don't understand the near cultural nationalism that many hispanics in the USA attach to Spanish. It is the language of a fairly brutal conqueror that pretty much destroyed all of the aboriginal cultures it encountered.

It is as if we here in the New World have picked up on a fight between the Spanish (speaking) and English (speaking) empires.

That's exactly what is going on, only it's about anxieties and resentments about immigration from Mexico. The hysteria over speaking Spanish is often tied to anxieties about 'them' 'taking over'.

367 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:34:54pm

re: #354 WindUpBird

It seemed implied that you would have preferred a choice of a non-bilingual pre-school.

And it would work the other way, if you said "the only preschool in my area teaches english exclusively" that implies you would rather a bilingual program exist.

Facts are facts. But stating facts in the context of discussion can imply ideas, wants, likes, dislikes...

That's how I read it.

368 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:35:12pm

re: #355 tradewind

I am not at all outraged, I am just somewhat puzzled at the Olympic jaunt, just because first, it seemed to be Michelle's gig, which is fine, and second, shouldn't there be people like Commerce department or our Olympic honchos doing that? Shouldn't Mayor Daley get top billing there?
Just picture Dubya going to Paris, say, to try to get the Olympics for Dallas or Houston. There would be exploding heads. He could hardly golf without inspiring outrage, and that was without missiles that could reach Israel and Europe being fired off in Iran.

well let's just say it's interesting... heads are exploding, unfortunately some of those are in Afghanistan.

369 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:35:32pm
370 wee fury  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:36:19pm

re: #263 The Sanity Inspector

OT: Because I was late for the open thread, here's some scorching blues guitar riffing:


[Video]

R.L. Burnside -- so good.

371 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:36:46pm

re: #361 Walter L. Newton

Found it. I remember when you could get a potato knish at almost any hot dog joint or sandwich counter. And on carts and other "grab" food places.

I never saw the word "knish" on any sign in midtown when I was there.

/it's called something else in Spanish, LOL.

372 MandyManners  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:37:30pm

re: #366 iceweasel

That's exactly what is going on, only it's about anxieties and resentments about immigration from Mexico. The hysteria over speaking Spanish is often tied to anxieties about 'them' 'taking over'.

Link?

Oh, wait.

373 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:38:06pm

re: #345 karmic_inquisitor

I don't really get why conservatives feel so strongly about English versus Spanish.

They are both languages from Europe. There is nothing intrinsically American about either one. Which is also why I don't understand the near cultural nationalism that many hispanics in the USA attach to Spanish. It is the language of a fairly brutal conqueror that pretty much destroyed all of the aboriginal cultures it encountered.

It is as if we here in the New World have picked up on a fight between the Spanish and English empires.

Well said!

374 Bloodnok  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:38:59pm

re: #366 iceweasel

That's exactly what is going on, only it's about anxieties and resentments about immigration from Mexico. The hysteria over speaking Spanish is often tied to anxieties about 'them' 'taking over'.

Exactly. It's as though learning Spanish is somehow validating the presence of illegals.

Somehow I don't think this same scenario would be as big an issue where I come from where French is the more popular and more prevalent second language taught in schools.

375 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:39:03pm

re: #345 karmic_inquisitor
English is the language of this country. The practice of letting immigrants' children hold onto their native language exclusively to the point of not learning English in the classroom is a relatively new, and not helpful, trend. I think bi-lingual education is wonderful... every American child should be immersed in a second language from pre-k on. But assimilation and the forming of a cohesive population ...notice that is not the same as a homogenous population...depends in large part on a common language, at least in this country. We do no favor to children when we fail to get them up to speed as quickly as possible.

376 TheMatrix31  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:40:03pm

re: #374 Bloodnok

I would hate it just as much, but I guess that's just me.

377 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:40:16pm

re: #369 MikeySDCA

As a practical matter, English is the language of the United States. No politica correctness is going to change that.

English is the language of the entire world...It's a fact..Even at the Singapore F1 race Sunday morning..Every single sign was in English on the track..Not one was in Chinese..We are the global language...
That doesn't mean our kids shouldn't learn as many languages as possible in school..We should demand it as parents..We don't shrink horizons in America for our kids..We grow them..

378 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:40:17pm

re: #375 tradewind

I also fear we will not become multi-lingual, but mute and furious.

379 badger1970  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:41:00pm

There are pros and cons of bi-lingual education in a district with a high percentage of native Spanish speakers. I wish the English speaking kids could get the opportunity of learning Spanish at the age the Spanish speaking kids begin to learn Spanish but unfortunately something happens in the Language Arts curriculum that the kids have issues on English/Language Arts portion on standardize tests. So the administration emphasize English for English speaking kids and are more than happy having adaptive tests for the ESL kids.

380 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:41:32pm
381 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:41:41pm

re: #369 MikeySDCA

As a practical matter, English is the language of the United States. No politica correctness is going to change that.

Learning other languages is not 'political correctness'.

Movement to have English (unnecessarily) declared the 'official' language of the United States are all about enforcing a kind of 'political correctness' though.

Fun factoid* about Texas and its first female governor, btw:

There was a hot argument in Texas in the 1920s -- one that is still going on in several states, particularly in California -- about whether Spanish should be used in the classroom to teach kids who came from Mexico, or whether only English should be permitted. Miriam “Ma” Ferguson had become the state's first woman governor, after her husband, Governor “Pa” Ferguson was impeached. She ended the debate quite quickly when she held up a Bible and proclaimed, "If the King's English was good enough for Jesus Christ, it's good enough for the children of Texas!"

*factoid because I've also heard that the quote is missattributed.

382 MandyManners  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:42:07pm

Which language is dominant in the world today?

383 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:42:47pm

re: #380 MikeySDCA

Actually, it's a very stupid comment. We had a war with Mexico in 1846 and a war with Spain in 1898, so we didn't just inherit some old quarrel from the Brits.

You can't bring up those little nitty details... geeesshhh.

384 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:42:51pm

re: #374 Bloodnok

Exactly. It's as though learning Spanish is somehow validating the presence of illegals.

Somehow I don't think this same scenario would be as big an issue where I come from where French is the more popular and more prevalent second language taught in schools.

You have a good point, but if only it was the second language it would not be a issue. si?

385 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:42:57pm

re: #345 karmic_inquisitor

I don't really get why conservatives feel so strongly about English versus Spanish.

They are both languages from Europe. There is nothing intrinsically American about either one. Which is also why I don't understand the near cultural nationalism that many hispanics in the USA attach to Spanish. It is the language of a fairly brutal conqueror that pretty much destroyed all of the aboriginal cultures it encountered.

It is as if we here in the New World have picked up on a fight between the Spanish and English empires.

Ferdinand Magellan
Born Spring 1480
Sabrosa, Portugal

Christopher Columbus
Born c.1451
Genoa, Liguria

Bankrolled by Spain. The first Europeans weren't even English speakers.

386 TheMatrix31  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:42:58pm

re: #382 MandyManners

Stupidity.

387 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:43:26pm

re: #382 MandyManners

Binary! 8-)

Oh wait, you mean languages that humans speak...

388 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:43:28pm

re: #380 MikeySDCA
When he said ' it's as if we carried on some old war between England and Spain' I was thinking... well, we did that...

389 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:44:17pm

re: #382 MandyManners

Which language is dominant in the world today?

by numbers or finance?

390 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:44:23pm

re: #372 MandyManners

Link?

Oh, wait.


Mandy, it is sheer idiocy, and yes, a pecuilarly AMERICAN kind of idiocy, to deny that some people in America (like Brimelow, like Buchanan) support English only initatives because they hate and fear other races and ethnictites, and are racists and white supremacists.

Here's a link for you:

391 karmic_inquisitor  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:44:38pm

re: #366 iceweasel

That's exactly what is going on, only it's about anxieties and resentments about immigration from Mexico. The hysteria over speaking Spanish is often tied to anxieties about 'them' 'taking over'.

As a Southern Californian, I see this play out everyday. But what gets me is that there are Hispanic cultural activists who see the language as a needed basis of differentiation that has to be preserved. I don't understand this, frankly. I have spent enough time in Mexico to recognize that there is a racial differentiation between the elites and the proles, and that there is very little social mobility. I know blond haired, blue eyed Mexicans who will prodly recite their lineage back to Europe.

The folks escaping there to come here are generally darker skinned - more related to the aboriginal population. After all - these are the peasants that the elites have maintained as a cheap labor supply and to maintain "the old order." So why the attachment to a culture and a language that has treated them so poorly?

392 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:45:18pm
393 MandyManners  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:45:29pm

re: #385 Gus 802

Ferdinand Magellan
Born Spring 1480
Sabrosa, Portugal

Christopher Columbus
Born c.1451
Genoa, Liguria

Bankrolled by Spain. The first Europeans weren't even English speakers.


Some would say that Columbus was a way-bit behind.

394 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:45:34pm

re: #385 Gus 802

Ferdinand Magellan
Born Spring 1480
Sabrosa, Portugal

Christopher Columbus
Born c.1451
Genoa, Liguria

Bankrolled by Spain. The first Europeans weren't even English speakers.

they spoke Danish.

395 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:46:14pm

re: #389 brookly red

by numbers or finance?

English is 3 most popular language as a native tongue, 1 or 2 as a spoken language...

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

So, over all, it's not totally decided.

396 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:46:47pm

re: #345 karmic_inquisitor

I don't really get why conservatives feel so strongly about English versus Spanish.

They are both languages from Europe. There is nothing intrinsically American about either one. Which is also why I don't understand the near cultural nationalism that many hispanics in the USA attach to Spanish. It is the language of a fairly brutal conqueror that pretty much destroyed all of the aboriginal cultures it encountered.

It is as if we here in the New World have picked up on a fight between the Spanish and English empires.


I think distilling the premise to being nothing more than cheerleading for a language is missing the point.
As iceweasel and others have said, the concern is that our nation is being changed by forces from outside our borders-abetted by forces of greed from within- and the negative effects are apparent everywhere you look.

397 badger1970  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:47:28pm

re: #382 MandyManners

Mandarin?

398 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:47:43pm

re: #274 WindUpBird

Oh yeah! I am seeing High on Fire and Mastodon this Friday. :D so looking forward to seeing HoF for the first time, and Mastodon for the second.

I hate you. Not really, just jealous. Have fun in the pit.

If you are not already aware of this website, bookmark it now!

399 ~Fianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:47:58pm

re: #334 MandyManners

The school is in America. The language to be learned is English.

I disagree. Kids need to be able to speak more than one language because most professional jobs require you to talk to people from more than one country or read publications that might only be available in another language. Exposing them young is the easiest way to do it. Almost every other nation in the world requires strong proficiency in at least one language other than the native tongue and those kids are worlds ahead of ours in that respect.

400 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:48:48pm

re: #390 iceweasel

That wasn't smart, ice. Mandy doesn't like being told off like that. Most often she order the person who does so to perform the rope trick. And I have to downding you for putting that vid in this case. Sometimes it has a place, but not with what Mandy was saying.

401 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:48:55pm

re: #380 MikeySDCA

Actually, it's a very stupid comment. We had a war with Mexico in 1846 and a war with Spain in 1898, so we didn't just inherit some old quarrel from the Brits.

I thought it was a good comment. I think people should lighten up on this issue.

402 MandyManners  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:49:00pm

By God Almighty, I am not taking the Lord's name in vain.

403 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:49:42pm

re: #396 Capitalist Tool

I think distilling the premise to being nothing more than cheerleading for a language is missing the point.
As iceweasel and others have said, the concern is that our nation is being changed by forces from outside our borders-abetted by forces of greed from within- and the negative effects are apparent everywhere you look.

Quite Concur.

404 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:49:52pm
405 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:49:58pm

re: #394 brookly red

they spoke Danish.

The first Euro immigrants are now theorized to have been the Clovis people some 16,000 yrs ago... by boat, no less.

406 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:50:15pm

In Canada we have 2 official languages, English and French. Basic French is taught in all schools in anglophone Canada, even in regions where there are no francophones. In the francophone Province of Quebec, public schools use French, with English available on a limited basis.
However, bilingual schools are a different matter. English and French are taught as equal languages, which includes for example teaching children history in French and geography in English.
Bilingual schools are not mandatory anywhere, insofar as I am aware. They are however very popular and the standards in such schools are very high.

407 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:50:41pm

I think we've just found another area where my personal views are not going to sync up with the right wing.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with children learning to speak more than one language. And if that language is Spanish -- great! I wish I had learned Spanish as a child.

I'm finding it difficult to understand why this seems to be a problem for so many people.

408 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:50:44pm

re: #400 Dark_Falcon

That wasn't smart, ice. Mandy doesn't like being told off like that. Most often she order the person who does so to perform the rope trick. And I have to downding you for putting that vid in this case. Sometimes it has a place, but not with what Mandy was saying.

Well, perhaps I interpreted Mandy's comment to me incorrectly. We'll see.

And someone who enjoys telling other people off as much as she does probably has a high tolerance for it herself, I'd imagine. I'm sure she can handle it.

409 brookly red  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:50:57pm

Tenga buenas noches todas.

410 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:50:58pm

re: #399 ~Fianna

That's all fine, but if they don't learn how to speak, write, and study in English first , they are going to have a hell of a time getting any job in this country on a professional or executive level.

411 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:51:49pm

re: #390 iceweasel

Mandy, it is sheer idiocy, and yes, a pecuilarly AMERICAN kind of idiocy, to deny that some people in America (like Brimelow, like Buchanan) support English only initatives because they hate and fear other races and ethnictites, and are racists and white supremacists.

Here's a link for you:

[Video]

We know that. However beneficial a little bilinguality is, it's no substitute for a solid grounding in English.

Considering some of the letters and proposals I see, I'd beg for some stronger English instruction.

412 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:52:00pm

re: #399 ~Fianna

I disagree. Kids need to be able to speak more than one language because most professional jobs require you to talk to people from more than one country or read publications that might only be available in another language. Exposing them young is the easiest way to do it. Almost every other nation in the world requires strong proficiency in at least one language other than the native tongue and those kids are worlds ahead of ours in that respect.

I agree..I grew up in California..Many folks are fluent in Spanish there..It's not a sign of national weakness..It's an empowerment...I think kids should learn several languages...It empowers them.. in my opinion

413 bosforus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:52:16pm

re: #407 Charles

Agreed. I find my Saturday morning pickup soccer games much more enjoyable with the Spanish I know.

414 Racer X  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:52:25pm

re: #382 MandyManners

Which language is dominant in the world today?

Math.

Every literate human knows some math.

415 karmic_inquisitor  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:52:47pm

re: #375 tradewind

English is the language of this country. The practice of letting immigrants' children hold onto their native language exclusively to the point of not learning English in the classroom is a relatively new, and not helpful, trend. I think bi-lingual education is wonderful... every American child should be immersed in a second language from pre-k on. But assimilation and the forming of a cohesive population ...notice that is not the same as a homogenous population...depends in large part on a common language, at least in this country. We do no favor to children when we fail to get them up to speed as quickly as possible.

English has become the standard language here. But when the country was founded there were plenty of Dutch, German and (yes) Spanish speakers.

There are practical advantages to a common language, and communications technology will have the world speaking the same language in 200 years anyway. But will it be English? From where we sit, probably. But English is a lousy language - it is hard to learn and difficult to master. It is a hodge podge mounted on a pile of hodge podge insofar as languages go. Then again, it represents a fusion of a group of languages, so maybe that is a good thing.

Just the same, I don't equate culture to language. English, Spanish or any other. Hell - the French have the Academy Nationale and they can't control the language. It is silly to try.

416 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:53:54pm

re: #411 Dianna

We know that. However beneficial a little bilinguality is, it's no substitute for a solid grounding in English.

Considering some of the letters and proposals I see, I'd beg for some stronger English instruction.

And there is no reason why we can't improve the teaching of English WHILE we teach other languages, any more than improving our science standards would mysteriously mean our history standards stagnated.

This is a false dichotomy.

417 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:53:59pm

I'm going to follow my own advice and step back for a little while. BBIAB

418 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:54:05pm

re: #407 Charles

I think we've just found another area where my personal views are not going to sync up with the right wing.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with children learning to speak more than one language. And if that language is Spanish -- great! I wish I had learned Spanish as a child.

I'm finding it difficult to understand why this seems to be a problem for so many people.

Agreed. But French would have been my choice.

419 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:54:19pm

re: #394 brookly red

they spoke Danish.

Lief Ericson I believe spoke Old Norse. That would still qualify them as non English speakers.

420 Dreader1962  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:54:33pm

re: #159 sattv4u2

I could use a little warm!

12 hours both today and yesterday sitting in a control room that we have to keep at 65-67 degrees EVEN IN THE WINTER becuase of all the electronics in here, I'm freezing my Bipi off !

I remember freezing my tail off in the bunker when I was stationed at SHAPE back in the '80s. You had to wear gloves and a field jacket at nights; it seemed to get a lot colder then. Maybe all the humans during the day warmed the place up.

A side note - when they built the bunker, they made the stairwells with an open mesh material for traction. Unfortunately, they didn't anticipate the female soldiers wearing skirts during normal duty; there were many complaints.

421 Beller0ph1  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:54:39pm

Seriously? This is a battle worth fighting for? I think there is something else rage can be directed to. 95% of the people in Chi-town want the Olympics here. Including children. The other 5% want more social programs (honestly...it's like a money pit).

The Olympics will bring much, much needed infrastructure improvements to Chicago (ahem...CTA...ahem). The city is so much in debt anyways, I'm sure they're going to raise taxes before the games to cover their butts. It's the Chicago way!

422 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:54:40pm

re: #415 karmic_inquisitor
/Ohforpete'ssakes./

423 TheRealThing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:55:20pm

Big work load today just arrived home. I will say this many of those we are foreclosing on here in the Dallas Ft. Worth area do not speak good enough English nor read good enough to understand what the mortgage loan brokers put before them. Then when they went to close someone from the family of the mortgage broker went along to "interpret" at the loan/title closing. When we get to them its to late most times to prevent the disaster. Right now it is not working to well.

424 Racer X  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:55:31pm

re: #407 Charles

I agree. As long as english it taught, I'm cool with other languages being taught as well.

425 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:56:23pm

re: #411 Dianna

We know that. However beneficial a little bilinguality is, it's no substitute for a solid grounding in English.

Considering some of the letters and proposals I see, I'd beg for some stronger English instruction.

It's not an either/or though is it? I don't see any reason why a good education in a second language should impair proficiency in English.

426 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:56:27pm

re: #407 Charles

I think we've just found another area where my personal views are not going to sync up with the right wing.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with children learning to speak more than one language. And if that language is Spanish -- great! I wish I had learned Spanish as a child.

I'm finding it difficult to understand why this seems to be a problem for so many people.

There are people that believe their children should only speak one language? No wait, I can see the whos and the whys now that I think about it. That's some rather archaic social mores.

427 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:56:34pm

By the way, has Rifqa Bary been murdered by her parents yet?

428 ~Fianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:56:36pm

re: #410 tradewind

That's all fine, but if they don't learn how to speak, write, and study in English first , they are going to have a hell of a time getting any job in this country on a professional or executive level.

Ever been in an engineering department? Or, for that matter, in the engineering building at a University?

429 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:56:46pm

re: #407 Charles

I think we've just found another area where my personal views are not going to sync up with the right wing.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with children learning to speak more than one language. And if that language is Spanish -- great! I wish I had learned Spanish as a child.

I'm finding it difficult to understand why this seems to be a problem for so many people.

Not a problem at all.

Though I'd like higher and stricter standards for English Composition than I'm seeing at present, never mind other languages.

The best programs I've seen are at places like the French-American International School, where the standards are much tougher - in both French and English - than in most American high schools.

430 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:57:52pm
431 Van Helsing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:58:00pm

US Citizenship requirements for language:

Language
Applicants for naturalization must be able to read, write, speak, and understand words in ordinary usage in the English language. Applicants exempt from this requirement are those who on the date of filing:

*
have been residing in the United States subsequent to a lawful admission for permanent residence for periods totaling 15 years or more and are over 55 years of age;
*
have been residing in the United States subsequent to a lawful admission for permanent residence for periods totaling 20 years or more and are over 50 years of age; or
*
have a medically determinable physical or mental impairment, where the impairment affects the applicant’s ability to learn English.


From USCIS

Only citizens are allowed to vote, yet in Arizona we're required to provide ballots in Spanish an well as English.

432 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:58:07pm

re: #428 ~Fianna

Ever been in an engineering department? Or, for that matter, in the engineering building at a University?

LMAO

433 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:58:29pm

re: #427 Charles

By the way, has Rifqa Bary been murdered by her parents yet?

I'm sure the shrieking harpy is raising money for a tombstone they don't want (or need), though.

434 jaunte  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:58:30pm

re: #415 karmic_inquisitor

Just the same, I don't equate culture to language. English, Spanish or any other. Hell - the French have the Academy Nationale and they can't control the language. It is silly to try.

I have a Venezuelan co-worker who is a speaker of very correct Spanish. He's constantly upset by the innovations that Mexican Spanish speakers tend to create.

435 Bloodnok  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:59:31pm

Buenos noches, amigos.

436 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:59:31pm

re: #407 Charles
It's hard for me to imagine that any thinking person could be against American school children learning a second language , much less that it be a theme of one faction or another.

437 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:59:42pm

re: #416 iceweasel

And there is no reason why we can't improve the teaching of English WHILE we teach other languages, any more than improving our science standards would mysteriously mean our history standards stagnated.

This is a false dichotomy.

Curiously, though, it hasn't been. It would be so very nice if it were false; though, truly, the issue seems to be a complete lack of standards, masked by "understanding". I'm deeply disturbed by what I'm watching.

438 bosforus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:59:45pm

Learning a foreign language helps you understand the English language as well. Maybe that's why so many people object to it, they don't want to be perceived as highfalutin.

439 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 7:59:50pm

re: #435 Bloodnok

Buenos noches, amigos.

Hasta luego!

440 badger1970  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:00:00pm

Teaching kids at an early age a second language is a good idea but unfortunately, the kids have a hard enough time on standardize English tests in which the district relies on money from the state and federal agencies. Why do most districts wait until middle school to teach a second language to students (the ones with high English scores)? Actually, the ESL students should have a leg up by the time they hit middle school.

441 ~Fianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:00:13pm

re: #411 Dianna

We know that. However beneficial a little bilinguality is, it's no substitute for a solid grounding in English.

Considering some of the letters and proposals I see, I'd beg for some stronger English instruction.

I found that I actually learned more grammar in my foreign language classes than I did in English.

I remember when Sra. Sidoli was trying to get us to grasp the pluperfect tense and we just weren't getting it at all... So she asked us for an example of how we'd use it in English. Not one of us had any idea that we had one of those in English. She gave up on Spanish and taught us straight up grammar for 2 weeks. The rest of the Spanish class was a lot easier after that.

When I started taking Latin in High School, that really helped because it's such a constructed language. Between the Latin and the French and Spanish, my vocabulary rocks. Even if I don't know the word itself, I've got the tools to grasp the meaning.

442 bagua  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:00:40pm

I believe we are confusing the issue. Any number of languages can be taught as subjects or second language, at issue is whether Spanish should be used to instruct other subjects, such as history, maths, science, etc in public schools.

443 Pawn of the Oppressor  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:01:00pm
Once again, the Obama-Hitler thing is corrupting the minds of poor, innocent, helpless children, brainwashing them into robotic Marxist drones with the power of his indoctro-beams.

Do the indoctro-beams come out of his ears?

You'd have to be a fool to be upset or surprised that Chicago would try to play up the Obama/Chicago connection to market the city for the Olympics. At this point, however, Der Obamafuehrer looks much less bad than things like videotaped gang beatings and double-digit weekend body counts.

On the natinoal Things We Should Be Pissed About Scale, this ranks something like #820.

444 transient  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:01:07pm

re: #425 Jimmah

It's not an either/or though is it? I don't see any reason why a good education in a second language should impair proficiency in English.


The study of a second language often brings greater insight and understanding of English. Learning a second language early on also makes it easier to learn subsequent languages. It is a useful part of education even if the language learned is not used in daily life (though a language heard regularly would be more useful and better retained).

445 TheRealThing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:01:09pm

We had two years of Spanish offered in our high school here in Texas,
full up every semester.

446 Pietr  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:01:50pm

re: #427 Charles

By the way, has Rifqa Bary been murdered by her parents yet?

I've been avoiding news, trying to catch up here, Charles. Did she get returned to her parents? You may remember, I'm a Texan, and the two teen muslim girls WERE killed by their father here, after CPS returned them home.

447 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:01:59pm

re: #425 Jimmah

It's not an either/or though is it? I don't see any reason why a good education in a second language should impair proficiency in English.

It's symptomatic, unfortunately. A lot of "bilingual instruction" is neither.

448 Pawn of the Oppressor  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:02:06pm

"National", above, my mistake. There is a big lag between my typing and the display of characters in the post window again.

449 bosforus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:02:50pm

This might be a nice time to mention the fact that my dad's a high school Spanish teacher in Phoenix. Guess which students do the worst? The Hispanics. I guess the whole "learning your own language" thing works both ways.

450 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:03:46pm

re: #444 transient

The study of a second language often brings greater insight and understanding of English. Learning a second language early on also makes it easier to learn subsequent languages. It is a useful part of education even if the language learned is not used in daily life (though a language heard regularly would be more useful and better retained).

My experience too. People with a second language tend to be more articulate than average in their first language as well.

451 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:03:48pm

re: #431 Van Helsing

US Citizenship requirements for language:


From USCIS

Only citizens are allowed to vote, yet in Arizona we're required to provide ballots in Spanish an well as English.

Basic English won't help with some ballot measures. Heck, I'm a native English speaker, and sometimes I wish they'd provide a translation!

452 ~Fianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:04:31pm

re: #432 Capitalist Tool

LMAO

Every place I've worked has been the United Nations... and now we're also on the phone to vendors or contractors in other countries. I've wished that I could speak Russian more than once.

453 karmic_inquisitor  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:04:31pm

re: #396 Capitalist Tool

I think distilling the premise to being nothing more than cheerleading for a language is missing the point.
As iceweasel and others have said, the concern is that our nation is being changed by forces from outside our borders-abetted by forces of greed from within- and the negative effects are apparent everywhere you look.

The United States doesn't have a culture.

I am an aculturalist - I think culture is designed to exclude just as much as it is designed to include.

America is an experiment in allowing individuals to join the fray with few rules, some protections and a common dream for a better life. This country is constantly changing and will continue to.

Adopting a strict multi-generational cultural system may seem Conservative but it is radical.

454 Pianobuff  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:04:49pm

re: #442 bagua

I believe we are confusing the issue. Any number of languages can be taught as subjects or second language, at issue is whether Spanish should be used to instruct other subjects, such as history, maths, science, etc in public schools.

Was thinking the same thing here.

455 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:04:49pm

re: #434 jaunte

One in every frickin' crowd.

Oh, sorry. Fucking.

456 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:05:06pm

re: #446 Pietr

I've been avoiding news, trying to catch up here, Charles. Did she get returned to her parents? You may remember, I'm a Texan, and the two teen muslim girls WERE killed by their father here, after CPS returned them home.

Have any parents from any other religious or ethnic group ever murdered their own children? Or is it just Muslims who do that?

Should we take all children of Muslims away from their parents, just to make sure they aren't victims?

Bah.

457 badger1970  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:05:27pm

re: #449 bosforus

This might be a nice time to mention the fact that my dad's a high school Spanish teacher in Phoenix. Guess which students do the worst? The Hispanics. I guess the whole "learning your own language" thing works both ways.

Cheech Marin had a joke about that.

458 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:05:46pm

re: #440 badger1970

I had four years of Grammar I. That count for anything?

459 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:05:51pm

re: #425 Jimmah

It's not an either/or though is it? I don't see any reason why a good education in a second language should impair proficiency in English.

Precisely, tovarisch Jimmah. :)

I'd trace conservative anxiety over the language issue (especially resistance to Spanish) as being about fears of creeping Mexicanitis: fear that we're being overwhelmed by illegal immigrants. It also expresses anxiety and resentment about the changing demographics in the US. By 2030, if current trends continue, you won't be able to win without a sizeable chunk of the Hispanic vote. A lot of people aren't happy about that.

There's a reason why people like Buchanan and Brimelow support English-only initiatives. It's partly their own racism, but they seek to foster fear and appeal to latent bigotry in others by subtly and not-so subtly portraying this as an either/or issue. It lends itself well to paranoid conspiracy theories, idea of a threatened 'national culture' (like the BNP does), and the whole 'us versus THEM' dynamic.

460 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:06:06pm

re: #440 badger1970

Teaching kids at an early age a second language is a good idea but unfortunately, the kids have a hard enough time on standardize English tests in which the district relies on money from the state and federal agencies. Why do most districts wait until middle school to teach a second language to students (the ones with high English scores)? Actually, the ESL students should have a leg up by the time they hit middle school.

That assumes the ESL classes actually worked hard on the grammar, spelling and punctuation of the first language.

461 Sharmuta  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:06:14pm

re: #456 Charles

Have any parents from any other religious or ethnic group ever murdered their own children? Or is it just Muslims who do that?

Should we take all children of Muslims away from their parents, just to make sure they aren't victims?

Bah.

Remember how everyone defended that creationist mother, only to find out she was abusing those kids?

Some people are blind.

462 karmic_inquisitor  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:06:43pm

re: #430 MikeySDCA

Your idiocy is self-evident. You can't even get the name right.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Je vous en prie.

463 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:06:50pm

re: #441 ~Fianna

Same here.

464 TheMatrix31  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:06:58pm

re: #450 Jimmah

My experience too. People with a second language tend to be more articulate than average in their first language as well.

Not my experience. All of my friends speak Armenian as well as English and so many of them cannot formulate a proper sentence in English if their lives fucking depended on it.

Maybe it's just these people I'm around though.

465 badger1970  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:07:09pm

re: #452 ~Fianna

My co-worker was an Army linguist while stationed in Berlin years back. When she came back to the states to get her degree in Russian, she had to tone back her salty Russian.

466 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:07:30pm

re: #425 Jimmah

It's not an either/or though is it? I don't see any reason why a good education in a second language should impair proficiency in English.

It's not an either/or proposition at all, of course. Children are knowledge sponges, unless something happens to turn them away from learning.

467 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:07:35pm

Wearing my Roger Staubach #12 White (home) jersey.

It's not helping.

Wait til next year.

Shit.

468 bagua  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:07:40pm

re: #459 iceweasel

Yes, but is Spanish, or Mexican a "race" or a nationality? It would seem the issue is nationalism, not racism.

469 Truth Stick  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:08:44pm

Chicago and the Olympics, I'd imagine the highest bidder receives the 10's.

470 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:09:01pm

re: #459 iceweasel

It was the same worry about the Italians and the Poles and the Irish, and so on and so forth.

People get over it.

471 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:09:27pm

English only statutes are simply laws and regulation by any measure of the idea. When conservatives say they advocate these laws they are effectively lobbying for social regulations.

The reality is that the natural forces of American society is that the natural exchange between people is that English being the majority language and the ability to speak and write it well will result in higher wages and a better quality of life then those that don't. There are exceptions to this rule but this is the standard progression and there is no law required that should make this fact of live obvious.

I find it ironic that those that defend English only laws usually speak of less laws and regulations -- something which is social engineering by any other word. Also ironic is that these same forces are ignoring the market reality of ones ability to speak English well. Furthermore, the ability to speak and write in the standard form will also affect "Native Speakers."

472 Van Helsing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:09:45pm

re: #451 Dianna

Basic English won't help with some ballot measures. Heck, I'm a native English speaker, and sometimes I wish they'd provide a translation!

I agree. It points out that they need to keep ballot measures a bit more understandable.

One could easily begin to think that they purposely embrace obfuscation.

One or two measures in the recent past here (Phoenix) were stricken from the ballots because even the people that wrote them couldn't come up with a concise statement as to the effect of a yea or nay vote.

Of course for those of us born in the US, there is no literacy requirement whatsoever to cast a ballot.

Just have a pulse and be above room temperature...

Comforting thought, is it not?

473 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:10:08pm

re: #470 Dianna

It was the same worry about the Italians and the Poles and the Irish, and so on and so forth.

People get over it.

Don't bet on it, Paleface.
/

474 bratwurst  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:10:25pm

re: #447 Dianna

It's symptomatic, unfortunately. A lot of "bilingual instruction" is neither.

Well I think we can all stand together in opposition to bad teachers and bad schools.

475 badger1970  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:10:29pm

re: #466 Charles

Distinct administrations worried about their tests scores. It's the adults who underestimate the capacity of learning. That and them bitching about "No Child Left Behind"

476 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:11:16pm

re: #450 Jimmah

My experience too. People with a second language tend to be more articulate than average in their first language as well.

I love the beauty of language...It's sound..
But I have learned you really have to get the accent just right...It's the beauty of it...

477 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:11:18pm

re: #407 Charles

I think we've just found another area where my personal views are not going to sync up with the right wing.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with children learning to speak more than one language. And if that language is Spanish -- great! I wish I had learned Spanish as a child.

I'm finding it difficult to understand why this seems to be a problem for so many people.

Do you believe that learning Spanish should be mandatory in all American public schools, even in States where there are no Spanish-speaking folks?
And if so, should it be just some basic Spanish or should the intention be to make the children completely bilingual.
These minority language issues have been very touchy and divisive in Canada (but substitute French for Spanish).

478 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:11:22pm

re: #472 Van Helsing

Of course for those of us born in the US, there is no literacy requirement whatsoever to cast a ballot.

Just have a pulse and be above room temperature...

Comforting thought, is it not?

It periodically makes me break out in a cold sweat.

479 bosforus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:11:26pm

re: #457 badger1970

Cheech Marin had a joke about that.

It's weird. You'd think that a language where words are spelled exactly how they sound would be tough to get wrong but those kids are clever little bestias with their, "pa' k"s and their "sientensen"s.

480 ~Fianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:11:30pm

re: #465 badger1970

My co-worker was an Army linguist while stationed in Berlin years back. When she came back to the states to get her degree in Russian, she had to tone back her salty Russian.

I have some good French friends who've taught me some colorful phrases.

In one of my basic French classes, we had to provide some phrases. One of the ones they wanted was "Oh, Dear" - probably the correct answer was zut alors! or something of that nature. Without thinking, I put down "eh, merde!"

I got the credit, though.

481 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:11:52pm

re: #474 bratwurst

Well I think we can all stand together in opposition to bad teachers and bad schools.

I would hope so.

482 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:12:37pm
483 avanti  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:13:12pm

re: #455 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

One in every frickin' crowd.

Oh, sorry. Fucking.

Which reminds me, did the religious right miss the "fucking" comment that slipped out on SNL this Sat ?

484 solomonpanting  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:13:22pm

re: #472 Van Helsing

Of course for those of us born in the US, there is no literacy requirement whatsoever to cast a ballot.

Just have a pulse and be above room temperature...

Setting the bar a bit high, no?

485 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:13:34pm

Why am i thinking about Salty Dogs and Black Russians?
Vodka!
Drink!

486 Pianobuff  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:13:53pm

re: #483 avanti

Which reminds me, did the religious right miss the "fucking" comment that slipped out on SNL this Sat ?

Does anyone on the right even watch SNL?

/

487 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:13:55pm

re: #446 Pietr

Andrea Yates, also from Texas! But not Muslim.

488 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:14:16pm

re: #483 avanti

Which reminds me, did the religious right miss the "fucking" comment that slipped out on SNL this Sat ?

No. hannity was trying to make much ado... albeit, briefly.

489 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:15:34pm

re: #472 Van Helsing

just have a pulse and be above room temperature...

... not in my town.
No pulse, no problem!

490 wee fury  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:15:45pm

ASL is considered a second language at the U of M.

491 Van Helsing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:15:55pm

re: #489 tradewind

... not in my town.
No pulse, no problem!

Chicago?

492 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:15:56pm
493 bratwurst  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:15:59pm

re: #481 Dianna

I would hope so.

So I stand strongly against bad bilingual schools and strongly in favor of good ones.

494 bosforus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:15:59pm

re: #483 avanti

Which reminds me, did the religious right miss the "fucking" comment that slipped out on SNL this Sat ?

Guess the whole 5 second delay thing only applies to talk radio.

495 tokyobk  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:16:00pm

I love studying languages, its my hobby.

But I think English should be the official language of the US or you run the risk of immigrants being ghettoized instead of providing the new, complete citizenry that refreshes our country.

496 TheMatrix31  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:16:04pm
497 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:16:10pm

re: #486 Pianobuff

It was kinda rushed, you wouldn't even have noticed it if you hadn't been alerted.

498 mich-again  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:16:24pm
“yea bro, you can deal crack, score a bodacious ho, and still become president ... . lookatme!”

He probably just forgot the sarc tag.
/

499 Dreader1962  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:17:01pm

re: #486 Pianobuff

Does anyone on the right even watch SNL?

/

Fixed.

500 Pietr  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:17:10pm

re: #456 Charles

Have any parents from any other religious or ethnic group ever murdered their own children? Or is it just Muslims who do that?

Should we take all children of Muslims away from their parents, just to make sure they aren't victims?

Bah.

Your blog, your rules, and excuse me for asking a question. I only returned yesterday, after taking a 6 month break from things, and find myself in the crosshairs because of things that have happened in the past few days , lol. So pull the trigger again, you have before, because I once asked a question, and because I once updinged a post. C'est la vie...

501 TheRealThing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:17:33pm

Problems start when we attempt to do a modification to prevent the foreclosure. Very often one or in some cases both are on the loan with out real Social Security numbers and they are paid in cash and not reported correct to the IRS. The lack of real understanding of our banking/mortgage lending/IRS system is used to get the loan broker and real estate broker commissions. Our modification unit is unable to help due to the prior fraud. Another foreclosure. Had they known English better and known more of our system they would not have been such easy prey.

502 Pianobuff  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:17:41pm

re: #497 tradewind

It was kinda rushed, you wouldn't even have noticed it if you hadn't been alerted.

Ditched the tv a while back. Is SNL any good these days?

503 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:18:09pm

re: #491 Van Helsing

About five hundred miles south of there.

504 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:18:10pm

me: damn intermittent shift key...
other me: so go buy a new keyboard, cheapskate


Buenos Snowshoes.

505 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:18:35pm

re: #477 Spare O'Lake

Do you believe that learning Spanish should be mandatory in all American public schools, even in States where there are no Spanish-speaking folks?
And if so, should it be just some basic Spanish or should the intention be to make the children completely bilingual.
These minority language issues have been very touchy and divisive in Canada (but substitute French for Spanish).

Me personally, I'd like to see learning another language be mandatory, yes. Don't care what language it is; Spanish should be one of the options offered though. And I'd want everyone to be bilingual when they graduated. It's really a shame that we don't know more languages in the US.
I just can't see any good reason, ever, to be opposed to kids learning more, rather than less. That's my personal take on it.

506 Charles Johnson  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:18:44pm

Anthony Watts is trying to stage a big sting before the Copenhagen conference on climate change, and people are emailing me yelling, "The hockey stick is a fraud! Watts proves it! Quick! Get this out there before the Copenhagen conference!"

Not at LGF, sorry. It's Anthony Watts who is a fraud, and I'm not going to be a patsy for these people any more.

507 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:18:45pm

re: #490 wee fury

Nice.

508 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:18:49pm

I keep hearing this meme about bad teachers and bad schools. The other day I heard that while a lot of people think this way, the majority of parents are satisfied with their children's school performance. I'll have to see if I can scrape up a reference.

Too much emphasis is being played on outside forces by the American people. And that's coming from the left and the right. There's more to an education than "teachers and schools" and it is a process of a) life long learning b) studying or practicing c) doing your homework and or assignments. The majority of learning comes from these simple steps and getting an education is 90% alone time. It's like "Wood Shedding" with guitar practice.

509 avanti  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:18:57pm

re: #488 Capitalist Tool

No. hannity was trying to make much ado... albeit, briefly.

It usually spins out of control, I guess the fundies figure anyone that stays up that late is going to hell anyway.

510 Van Helsing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:19:15pm

re: #484 solomonpanting

Setting the bar a bit high, no?

I had forgotten about ACORN registered 'voters'.
My bad.

511 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:19:23pm

re: #502 Pianobuff

Nope.
Every now and then Tina Fey or Amy Poehler would let a funny one fly, but basically, a groaner. Or maybe I'm just older. And the music stinks.

512 ~Fianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:19:42pm

re: #506 Charles

Anthony Watts is trying to stage a big sting before the Copenhagen conference on climate change, and people are emailing me yelling, "The hockey stick is a fraud! Watts proves it! Quick! Get this out there before the Copenhagen conference!"

Not at LGF, sorry. It's Anthony Watts who is a fraud, and I'm not going to be a patsy for these people any more.

The hockey stick? Do I even want to know?

513 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:20:21pm

re: #495 tokyobk

I love studying languages, its my hobby.

But I think English should be the official language of the US or you run the risk of immigrants being ghettoized instead of providing the new, complete citizenry that refreshes our country.

We never had to make English our official language before, and we're a nation of immigrants.

514 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:20:22pm

re: #505 iceweasel

You used to need two years of a foreign language as a college requirement. I don't know if you still do.

515 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:20:47pm

re: #502 Pianobuff

I didn't see it live. Watched the clip on Hulu, yawned.
Seriously, your kids have all heard it more clearly.

516 avanti  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:21:07pm

re: #497 tradewind

It was kinda rushed, you wouldn't even have noticed it if you hadn't been alerted.

I only noticed because the SNL gal had the "I've just been fired look" after she slipped up.

517 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:21:14pm
518 jaunte  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:21:24pm

re: #512 ~Fianna

The hockey stick? Do I even want to know?

[Link: www.scientificamerican.com...]

519 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:21:41pm

re: #505 iceweasel

Me personally, I'd like to see learning another language be mandatory, yes. Don't care what language it is; Spanish should be one of the options offered though. And I'd want everyone to be bilingual when they graduated. It's really a shame that we don't know more languages in the US.
I just can't see any good reason, ever, to be opposed to kids learning more, rather than less. That's my personal take on it.

Spanish: Teach the Controversy!

//

520 ~Fianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:21:42pm

re: #514 Dianna

You used to need two years of a foreign language as a college requirement. I don't know if you still do.

Here it depends on your major and what you're planning on doing.

In a lot of disciplines, 3 is recommended if you want to go to graduate school, especially in something technical since a lot of the papers are written in languages other than English, not reading well in at least one other language makes doing research hard.

521 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:21:51pm

re: #514 Dianna

You used to need two years of a foreign language as a college requirement. I don't know if you still do.

Depends on the uni. I did.

522 Dreader1962  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:22:06pm

re: #511 tradewind

Nope.
Every now and then Tina Fey or Amy Poehler would let a funny one fly, but basically, a groaner. Or maybe I'm just older. And the music stinks.

I thought Will Ferrell did a good job spoofing Bush II; they seem to have forgotten how to do political satire. Most of their news spots are cringe-worthy.

I have fond memories of the first seasons, but dropped off in the early '80s.

523 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:22:12pm

re: #508 Gus 802

Gus? My mom quit because the "new, better standards" forbade spelling tests.

Having suffered through bright kids who couldn't read because of "holistic reading", Mom said goodbye.

If parents are satisfied with the kind of teaching their children are getting, I'm very, very worried.

524 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:22:23pm

re: #519 Gus 802

Spanish: Teach the Controversy!

//

ha! WIN!

525 badger1970  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:22:26pm

re: #505 iceweasel

It's a pipe dream. There's no way in the present educational systems that mandatory bi-lingual education will become anything more than an elective. Bang the drum again, money and TAKS testing.

526 solomonpanting  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:22:33pm

re: #510 Van Helsing

I had forgotten about ACORN registered 'voters'.
My bad.

ACORN wasn't in the Seattle area, was it?

527 Velvet Elvis  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:22:36pm

re: #514 Dianna

You used to need two years of a foreign language as a college requirement. I don't know if you still do.

Where I went it was two semesters for a B.S. and 4 for a B.A.

528 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:22:54pm
529 Pianobuff  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:23:12pm

re: #512 ~Fianna

The hockey stick? Do I even want to know?

A temperature graph that takes a sharp turn up towards the end, hence "hockey stick". There is a news item about a challenge to the data used to prepare it. Presumably, that is what Charles' comment is addressing.

530 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:23:13pm

Drudge Headline:

"Senate committee scheduled for too-close-to-call vote to block use of insurance vouchers for abortions... Developing..."

531 ~Fianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:23:25pm

re: #518 jaunte

[Link: www.scientificamerican.com...]

Aah, thank you.

532 bosforus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:23:29pm

Como andamio?
Viento y bote?

533 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:23:56pm

re: #528 MikeySDCA

Would it be rude to ask what languages you speak?

Spanish. I can understand some Italian and Portuguese through the cognates from time to time but that depend on the speaker.

534 Pianobuff  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:24:25pm

re: #514 Dianna

You used to need two years of a foreign language as a college requirement. I don't know if you still do.

I took ACTs in French and English. Oddly I did better in French. Go figure - I've forgotten most by now.

535 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:24:31pm

You're not the boss of me now

536 Dreader1962  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:24:55pm

re: #514 Dianna

You used to need two years of a foreign language as a college requirement. I don't know if you still do.

I took two years of Latin; can't speak it, but it sure helps with vocabulary. It also helps with getting the 'gist' of many of the Romance languages.

537 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:24:56pm

re: #512 ~Fianna

The hockey stick? Do I even want to know?

Only concern yourself if you are a hockey puck.

538 TheRealThing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:25:14pm

Most people do think their school is just fine or that it needs some small tinkering, much like with the health insurance deal.

Have to go, first Tuesday on Oct. is coming fast.

539 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:25:31pm

re: #523 Dianna

Gus? My mom quit because the "new, better standards" forbade spelling tests.

Having suffered through bright kids who couldn't read because of "holistic reading", Mom said goodbye.

If parents are satisfied with the kind of teaching their children are getting, I'm very, very worried.

Not all school districts teach "holistic reading." The majority of them still give spelling tests. This may happen from time to time as you relate but it is not the rule.

540 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:26:19pm

I had both Latin and Russian - and had a perfectly dreadful time with Russian.

I've pretty much lost both, these days. I don't practice, and I should.

541 Velvet Elvis  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:26:26pm

re: #505 iceweasel

Me personally, I'd like to see learning another language be mandatory, yes. Don't care what language it is; Spanish should be one of the options offered though. And I'd want everyone to be bilingual when they graduated. It's really a shame that we don't know more languages in the US.
I just can't see any good reason, ever, to be opposed to kids learning more, rather than less. That's my personal take on it.

The problem is that kids become "language fixed" by the time they hit 4th grade or so, making it much harder to learn a second language after that. It would be much easier for schools to produce truly bilingual students if they started teaching foreign languages in early elementary school.

542 Liberally Conservative  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:26:33pm

re: #491 Van Helsing

Chicago?

543 avanti  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:27:07pm

re: #518 jaunte

[Link: www.scientificamerican.com...]

BTW, the Little Ice Age and Medieval Warming is the Holy Grail again on the stalker site, no one mentions that it was shown to be a regional thing while they were Lizards.

544 Pianobuff  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:27:13pm

Good night for now.

545 Liberally Conservative  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:27:21pm

re: #542 Liberally Conservative

Chicago?

...ate my lengthy comment, dammit.

546 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:27:35pm

Holistic reading.

Is that kind of like eco- AA Fuel cars?
Naturalist .30-06?

547 Dreader1962  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:27:59pm

re: #540 Dianna

I had both Latin and Russian - and had a perfectly dreadful time with Russian.

I've pretty much lost both, these days. I don't practice, and I should.

Have you read 'A Clockwork Orange'? I'm sure some of the lingo would amuse you.

548 Liberally Conservative  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:28:28pm

re: #541 Conservative Moonbat

The problem is that kids become "language fixed" by the time they hit 4th grade or so, making it much harder to learn a second language after that. It would be much easier for schools to produce truly bilingual students if they started teaching foreign languages in early elementary school.

My cousins in Europe start learning English when they get to kindergarden. They can speak it nearly fluently when they graduate HS.

549 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:28:37pm

re: #539 Gus 802

Not all school districts teach "holistic reading." The majority of them still give spelling tests. This may happen from time to time as you relate but it is not the rule.

Holistic reading was a fad about the time I started school; this may explain my mother's willingness to let me learn to read before that.

The no spelling test idiocy didn't last long, but it did its share of damage. Most districts figured out it was a perfectly awful idea before more than two years had passed, fortunately.

550 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:29:41pm

re: #546 Capitalist Tool

Holistic reading.

Is that kind of like eco- AA Fuel cars?
Naturalist .30-06?

"Look at the shape of the word" was what they told kids.

551 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:29:46pm
552 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:30:05pm

re: #530 Capitalist Tool
They should save their breath. Any provision can be changed in this thing... there's no there there yet.

553 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:30:08pm

re: #547 Dreader1962

Have you read 'A Clockwork Orange'? I'm sure some of the lingo would amuse you.

Long, long ago.

554 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:30:27pm

re: #550 Dianna

"Look at the shape of the word" was what they told kids.

Boudoir.

555 Dreader1962  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:30:42pm

re: #549 Dianna

Holistic reading was a fad about the time I started school; this may explain my mother's willingness to let me learn to read before that.

The no spelling test idiocy didn't last long, but it did its share of damage. Most districts figured out it was a perfectly awful idea before more than two years had passed, fortunately.

I worry that there has been a slip in 'absolute' standards. Kids are achieving based upon the standards they currently encounter, but my experience with young soldiers coming into the military indicated there was a big degradation over the years, with any number of basic skills one would expect from a high school graduate.

556 doubter4444  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:30:47pm

re: #375 tradewind

English is the language of this country. The practice of letting immigrants' children hold onto their native language exclusively to the point of not learning English in the classroom is a relatively new, and not helpful, trend. I think bi-lingual education is wonderful... every American child should be immersed in a second language from pre-k on. But assimilation and the forming of a cohesive population ...notice that is not the same as a homogenous population...depends in large part on a common language, at least in this country. We do no favor to children when we fail to get them up to speed as quickly as possible.

But isn't that the point of bilingual education?
I really don't think throwing them into the deep end is an effective way of dealing with a large population, so alternative systems need to be created and we are in that process.
So while I agree with you about the need to bring Hispanics into the fold (because let's face it, that's what we are really talking about), is absolutely necessary, I really think it's got to be done in school.
And this from a parent of a first grader in LA schools.
I don't love the fact that 60 percent of the kids are Hispanic, but it is what it is, and I'm getting my head around that it really doesn't matter.
My little girl does not look at them as minorities, she looks at them as people... funny how that works.

557 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:31:06pm

re: #459 comrade iceweaselski

Precisely, tovarisch Jimmah. :)

I'd trace conservative anxiety over the language issue (especially resistance to Spanish) as being about fears of creeping Mexicanitis: fear that we're being overwhelmed by illegal immigrants. It also expresses anxiety and resentment about the changing demographics in the US. By 2030, if current trends continue, you won't be able to win without a sizeable chunk of the Hispanic vote. A lot of people aren't happy about that.

There's a reason why people like Buchanan and Brimelow support English-only initiatives. It's partly their own racism, but they seek to foster fear and appeal to latent bigotry in others by subtly and not-so subtly portraying this as an either/or issue. It lends itself well to paranoid conspiracy theories, idea of a threatened 'national culture' (like the BNP does), and the whole 'us versus THEM' dynamic.

Yes - this is very familiar to me as well : "culture under threat. The librhuls are selling your culture down the river. Who will stand up for the poor forgotten ordinary English speaking white guy? Who will stem the tide of foreignness that is swamping our culture?" I recognise this stuff immediately as BNP talking points.

558 Velvet Elvis  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:31:40pm

I think it's important that teachers be able to experiment with new techniques even if it means they come up with some duds. No field should remain static and not improve on itself.

559 bosforus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:32:00pm

re: #548 Liberally Conservative

If I were in Europe I would hope to learn more than just my native language as well or I'd only be able to communicate with a geographic area the size of Utah.

560 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:32:15pm

re: #549 Dianna

Holistic reading was a fad about the time I started school; this may explain my mother's willingness to let me learn to read before that.

The no spelling test idiocy didn't last long, but it did its share of damage. Most districts figured out it was a perfectly awful idea before more than two years had passed, fortunately.

There are problems and that type of new age thinking is one of them. They should be rejected but sometimes it takes some "peer" pressure. I guess I'm being optimistic but I still think the majority of schools are very good. Some of them excel in their performance.

561 Van Helsing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:32:21pm

re: #547 Dreader1962

Have you read 'A Clockwork Orange'? I'm sure some of the lingo would amuse you.

Horrorshow.

562 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:32:37pm

re: #505 iceweasel

Me personally, I'd like to see learning another language be mandatory, yes. Don't care what language it is; Spanish should be one of the options offered though. And I'd want everyone to be bilingual when they graduated. It's really a shame that we don't know more languages in the US.
I just can't see any good reason, ever, to be opposed to kids learning more, rather than less. That's my personal take on it.

In theory it is wonderful, but what about the costs? It is one thing to give a child a basic exposure to a second language, but quite another to make them functionally bilingual.
The resources required to make an anglophone child completely bilingual in another language are considerable. If you then have an option of having your child become bilingual in one of several other languages, the costs would, I expect, become more than the public education system could afford.

563 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:33:23pm

re: #558 Conservative Moonbat

I think it's important that teachers be able to experiment with new techniques even if it means they come up with some duds. No field should remain static and not improve on itself.


Human drug trials...

564 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:33:39pm

Just say the first thing that pops into your mind...


/namaste, y'all
565 tradewind  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:33:40pm

re: #556 doubter4444

I really don't think throwing them into the deep end is an effective way of dealing with a large population


It's called ' immersion', and it's extremely effective.

566 Dreader1962  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:33:52pm

re: #561 Van Helsing

Horrorshow.

Good on you, too, droog!

567 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:34:14pm

re: #524 iceweasel

ha! WIN!

As a kid..My best friend was a Chinese kid..I speak pretty good..I know how to write Chinese..Left to right up to down shit...
But every kid in America could write Chinese numbers in one hour..It's so easy..
Take a brush..Draw a straight line left to right.. a dash.. That equals the number one.. Draw the same line below it..that's 2.. You would not believe these but if you see 3 lines..It's 3...Try to follow this lizards..
If you see a plus sign + That's a 10.( you guys will be geniuses in just a minute)..What happens if you put a line under it? A left to right dash under a plus sign?
Your not going to believe this but it's 11.. If you 2 two dashes under it..yup..It a fricking 12...ok..Guess what it is if you read Chinese with a plus sign with 3 lines under it? You had better guessed 13..Numbers in Chinese isn't rocket science
Any 5th grader could understand and draw in a beautiful hand script Chinese in a couple weeks..That's the easy part..I say we mess with them and force them to understand french verbs to graduate...*wink*

568 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:34:17pm

re: #564 Killgore Trout

Just say the first thing that pops into your mind...


/namaste, y'all

You can't leave now!

//

569 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:34:20pm

re: #560 Gus 802

There are problems and that type of new age thinking is one of them. They should be rejected but sometimes it takes some "peer" pressure. I guess I'm being optimistic but I still think the majority of schools are very good. Some of them excel in their performance.

Gus, the SAT's scoring has been adjusted downwards, since I took it in 1981. The average performance is still well below my cohort's.

Be afraid. Be very, very afraid.

570 Capitalist Tool  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:34:30pm

re: #561 Van Helsing

Horrorshow.

Every character a villain in their own right.

571 Van Helsing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:34:33pm

re: #550 Dianna

"Look at the shape of the word" was what they told kids.

They were trying that when my kids were in elementary school.
What an epic fail it was.
Fortunately I had time with them at home to deal with it.

572 Velvet Elvis  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:35:34pm

re: #563 Capitalist Tool

Human drug trials...

I went to a university laboratory elementary school and didn't suffer any ill effects.

573 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:35:44pm

re: #562 Spare O'Lake

That's a yes-and-no one; it would depend on how seriously the school took certain uses of resources, and what the state and local standards will allow.

574 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:35:56pm

re: #541 Conservative Moonbat

The problem is that kids become "language fixed" by the time they hit 4th grade or so, making it much harder to learn a second language after that. It would be much easier for schools to produce truly bilingual students if they started teaching foreign languages in early elementary school.

yes, exactly. That's why it has to start young. As young as possible.

But you lose a language if you don't keep using it, so the education would have to continue throughout high school. Especially if they don't have other speakers around. They could keep taking Spanish or French or have French literature or Spanish literature classes, etc. Lots of ways to do it, ideally.

575 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:36:01pm
576 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:36:13pm

re: #569 Dianna

Gus, the SAT's scoring has been adjusted downwards, since I took it in 1981. The average performance is still well below my cohort's.

Be afraid. Be very, very afraid.

Too much TV and video games. Loss of interest in reading by the general public. Lack of discipline, etc.

577 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:36:42pm

BBL!

578 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:36:43pm

re: #565 tradewind

It's called ' immersion', and it's extremely effective.

Yes, it is. For speaking.

Mastering grammar, spelling and punctuation require a bit more study.

579 [deleted]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:37:52pm
580 Velvet Elvis  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:38:09pm

re: #574 iceweasel

yes, exactly. That's why it has to start young. As young as possible.

But you lose a language if you don't keep using it, so the education would have to continue throughout high school. Especially if they don't have other speakers around. They could keep taking Spanish or French or have French literature or Spanish literature classes, etc. Lots of ways to do it, ideally.

But even then, once you've learned one forign language it's easier to learn additional ones even if you lose the first one.

581 Van Helsing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:38:09pm

re: #578 Dianna

Yes, it is. For speaking.

Mastering grammar, spelling and punctuation require a bit more study.

True 'dat.

582 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:39:13pm

re: #576 Gus 802

Too much TV and video games. Loss of interest in reading by the general public. Lack of discipline, etc.

More books get sold every year, oddly enough. Lack of discipline is part of the lack of standards.

The problems are serious, and not being addressed.

583 badger1970  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:39:30pm

re: #558 Conservative Moonbat

I think it's important that teachers be able to experiment with new techniques even if it means they come up with some duds. No field should remain static and not improve on itself.

My district got a huge technology grant with the catch of afternoon video conferencing with a national educational company (McRel). After a year of this droning and demonstrating, some of the older teachers stood up and said right to the host's face, "These methods are no different than what we've been doing for the last 20 years."

584 Van Helsing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:40:45pm

re: #579 MikeySDCA

As can be seen with the average American college freshman.

When the hell did they start having 'remedial' classes at universities? I remember being told repeatedly that if your high school grades aren't good enough you won't be accepted.

Did the universities lower their admission standards to rake in more tu...ition.
Never mind. I think I just answered myself.

585 avanti  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:40:46pm

re: #567 HoosierHoops

As a kid..My best friend was a Chinese kid..I speak pretty good..I know how to write Chinese..Left to right up to down shit...
But every kid in America could write Chinese numbers in one hour..It's so easy..
Take a brush..Draw a straight line left to right.. a dash.. That equals the number one.. Draw the same line below it..that's 2.. You would not believe these but if you see 3 lines..It's 3...Try to follow this lizards..
If you see a plus sign + That's a 10.( you guys will be geniuses in just a minute)..What happens if you put a line under it? A left to right dash under a plus sign?
Your not going to believe this but it's 11.. If you 2 two dashes under it..yup..It a fricking 12...ok..Guess what it is if you read Chinese with a plus sign with 3 lines under it? You had better guessed 13..Numbers in Chinese isn't rocket science
Any 5th grader could understand and draw in a beautiful hand script Chinese in a couple weeks..That's the easy part..I say we mess with them and force them to understand french verbs to graduate...*wink*

yea, but the 4,5,6,7,8 and 9 are funny looking symbols.

586 Dreader1962  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:41:14pm

re: #569 Dianna

Gus, the SAT's scoring has been adjusted downwards, since I took it in 1981. The average performance is still well below my cohort's.

Be afraid. Be very, very afraid.

It's always troubling when standards change - when I first took the ASVAB for joining the Army back in 1981, I scored 155 on my GT (General Technical); when I had to retake the test when I joined again in 1986 I scored 129. I was kind of upset that I lost something until I found out that they changed the scale for the scores. The trouble is that they didn't do any conversion when comparing scores. In this case, the reverse trend is true - a later test appears to be lower than the older test. I have no idea why they couldn't keep a standard scale no matter when the test was administered.

587 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:41:58pm

re: #575 MikeySDCA

OK, and what's a 4?

It's a very simple figure I can't duplicate on the laptop..Image a curly little ine with to up to down lines below..It's all easy and very simple..We fail to sometimes see the simplicity of other languages and numbers..
Kids are sponges..We need to feed that...

588 doubter4444  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:42:17pm

re: #565 tradewind

It's called ' immersion', and it's extremely effective.

Where do you live?
In the school where I live, the "immersion" would effectively shut down any learning because the majority just would not be able to keep up.
Are we to ignore that?
Then what happens?
I'm just being realistic here.
If 6 or 7 out of 10 are ESL students, then ignoring that fact is not workable, you know?
BTW, We have an immersion school in our town, and it offers immersion in Spanish or Japanese where the kids speak only that and learn only in that language... not the other way around. It's ranked one of the best schools n CA.

589 Mich-again  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:43:24pm

re: #562 Spare O'Lake

I would be pleased if American kids learned proper English and grammar. Lets start there.

I deal with co-workers from around the world daily at my job and English is already the language of business for people from around the world. The ideas and the logic are the real important commodities and that is where we need American kids to be leaders. Its nice if the Americans can converse and write in one of those other languages, but I think its more important to have better ideas and better analytical skills.

590 badger1970  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:43:26pm

re: #584 Van Helsing

College is the new high school.

591 Claire  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:43:59pm

re: #520 ~Fianna

Here it depends on your major and what you're planning on doing.

In a lot of disciplines, 3 is recommended if you want to go to graduate school, especially in something technical since a lot of the papers are written in languages other than English, not reading well in at least one other language makes doing research hard.

What discipline(s)/languages are you referring to- just curious.

592 Mary Garth  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:45:15pm

re: #506 Charles


Not at LGF, sorry. It's Anthony Watts who is a fraud, and I'm not going to be a patsy for these people any more.

Hatchling here, finally working up the courage to comment (and I'm very glad to be here by the way. Been lurking for a couple months.)

It is such a relief to be around rational conservatives, especially on this topic. It's one thing to be a skeptic (I consider myself one, by default, on most subjects), but sticking with the "it's a hoax" dogma despite all accumulating evidence to the contrary is, in my opinion, the very opposite of true conservatism.

I look forward to joining the lively conversations here.

593 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:45:24pm

re: #582 Dianna

More books get sold every year, oddly enough. Lack of discipline is part of the lack of standards.

The problems are serious, and not being addressed.

When you say more books being sold it reminds me of how large of a bureaucracy education has become. I'm sure more books are being sold because of the availability of funding. Essentially it becomes "throwing money" at new books but getting same or lesser results. Funding becomes credo for bureaucracies where upon money and spending is thought of as the end in the means to an end. What money does buy is the means. How to get to the "end" is what's been lost.

594 Van Helsing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:46:01pm

re: #572 Conservative Moonbat

I went to a university laboratory elementary school and didn't suffer any ill effects.

Some small fraction will always do well in spite of how poor the methods are.

I'm evil. I even made my kids memorize the multiplication tables through 12.

595 badger1970  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:46:52pm

re: #593 Gus 802

Also due to a lack of lockers in schools, districts buy two sets of books (one for home, one for class)

596 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:47:28pm

re: #592 Mary Garth

Hi Mary Garth! Welcome to LGF!
*waves*

597 Dianna  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:48:45pm

re: #593 Gus 802

When you say more books being sold it reminds me of how large of a bureaucracy education has become. I'm sure more books are being sold because of the availability of funding. Essentially it becomes "throwing money" at new books but getting same or lesser results. Funding becomes credo for bureaucracies where upon money and spending is thought of as the end in the means to an end. What money does buy is the means. How to get to the "end" is what's been lost.

No, I'm speaking of fiction and non-fiction books that people buy for themselves.

Textbooks are...let's not go there. Just, not.

598 Dreader1962  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:48:53pm

re: #593 Gus 802

When you say more books being sold it reminds me of how large of a bureaucracy education has become. I'm sure more books are being sold because of the availability of funding. Essentially it becomes "throwing money" at new books but getting same or lesser results. Funding becomes credo for bureaucracies where upon money and spending is thought of as the end in the means to an end. What money does buy is the means. How to get to the "end" is what's been lost.

It would be interesting to see which subjects were purchased most frequently. I would expect History to be the most replaced book. Least replaced would be English and Math.

I suspect that the purchases are primarily driven by sales/marketing campaigns from the publishers.

599 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:49:38pm

re: #595 badger1970

Also due to a lack of lockers in schools, districts buy two sets of books (one for home, one for class)

Seriously? If that even happened once I'd say that was out of the ballpark wasteful. I have an old high school grammar book I bought used several years ago for 2 dollars. Great book. I bet it's college level now.

600 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:50:03pm

re: #592 Mary Garth

Hatchling here, finally working up the courage to comment (and I'm very glad to be here by the way. Been lurking for a couple months.)

It is such a relief to be around rational conservatives, especially on this topic. It's one thing to be a skeptic (I consider myself one, by default, on most subjects), but sticking with the "it's a hoax" dogma despite all accumulating evidence to the contrary is, in my opinion, the very opposite of true conservatism.

I look forward to joining the lively conversations here.

Welcome, Mary. Glad to have you on board.

601 Dreader1962  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:50:37pm

re: #595 badger1970

Also due to a lack of lockers in schools, districts buy two sets of books (one for home, one for class)

Actually, my barber's wife is a schoolteacher and in this district kids can't take the books home at all. Apparently much of her time is spent copying missing pages for many of the student's textbooks.

A horrible situation - it's hard to picture managing this either as a student OR teacher.

602 Mary Garth  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:50:37pm

re: #596 Floral Giraffe

Hi Mary Garth! Welcome to LGF!
*waves*

Thanks for the welcome. *waves back *

603 Pietr  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:52:56pm

re: #596 Floral Giraffe

Nice of the geranium zebra to greet the hatchling that way, lol.

604 badger1970  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:53:40pm

re: #599 Gus 802

The superintendent that had this bright idea is no longer employed. It was a waste and a pain in the neck to find space and account for it.

605 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:54:49pm

re: #602 Mary Garth

Good for you, for speaking up!
The first comments are the hardest!
Welcome!

606 Van Helsing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:56:12pm

re: #599 Gus 802

Seriously? If that even happened once I'd say that was out of the ballpark wasteful. I have an old high school grammar book I bought used several years ago for 2 dollars. Great book. I bet it's college level now.

The McGuffey First Reader from late 1800s First Reader

Note rapid progression of lessons, inclusion of cursive writing and using both phonics and word recognition.

Hi Mary.
Welcome to the monkey house.

607 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:56:12pm

re: #604 badger1970

The superintendent that had this bright idea is no longer employed. It was a waste and a pain in the neck to find space and account for it.

Back in the day we always had used books most of the time. Rarely did anyone lose a book.

608 Pietr  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:56:30pm

re: #602 Mary Garth

I also greet you and hope you find your lizard life enjoyable, new hatchling "Mary Garth".

609 Mich-again  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:56:50pm

re: #593 Gus 802

Essentially it becomes "throwing money" at new books but getting same or lesser results.

One example.. Differential and Integral Calculus hasn't changed much in 100 years or more but yet the colleges require new textbooks every few years. I have a child in College and the going rate for a textbook is a few hundred dollars. C'mon.

I guess the real goal is to make the used textbooks obsolete every few years and make the students buy new ones to support the writing/publishing industry. If we want kids to learn more, let them spend less on the textbooks that don't need to change. Of course I understand that some topics like History change quickly and a 10 year old modern history textbook is outdated, but for the topics like geometry and Introduction to Science, its just dumb to waste precious education dollars on new textbooks until the old ones are worn out.

610 Mich-again  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 8:59:35pm

Imagine if your car had an expiration date and you had to replace it after three years even though you took care of it and it still ran fine. Crazy? Yep, just like the textbook industry is.

611 Van Helsing  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:00:10pm

re: #609 Mich-again

I guess the real goal is to make the used textbooks obsolete every few years and make the students buy new ones to support the writing/publishing industry.

Conspiricist!!

Sadly, what you say makes too much sense and therefore will never be implemented.
At least, not at taxpayer supported institutes of higher learning.

612 Gus  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:01:53pm

re: #609 Mich-again

One example.. Differential and Integral Calculus hasn't changed much in 100 years or more but yet the colleges require new textbooks every few years. I have a child in College and the going rate for a textbook is a few hundred dollars. C'mon.

I guess the real goal is to make the used textbooks obsolete every few years and make the students buy new ones to support the writing/publishing industry. If we want kids to learn more, let them spend less on the textbooks that don't need to change. Of course I understand that some topics like History change quickly and a 10 year old modern history textbook is outdated, but for the topics like geometry and Introduction to Science, its just dumb to waste precious education dollars on new textbooks until the old ones are worn out.

Right. All of the elementary math has remained rather unchanged and applicable up to 12th grade and 1st and 2nd level university studies. Geometry, algebra, being others. A 5 year history lag is acceptable; current events studies can make up for that. Physics and science have great shelf life. Literature is always available as are traditional or new classic readings.

613 Mich-again  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:03:59pm

re: #611 Van Helsing

Maybe the goal is to make sure all the story problems are politically correct? Johnny cuts down 3 old forest trees that each consume 4 tons of carbon dioxide every year...

614 Dreader1962  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:05:25pm

re: #613 Mich-again

Maybe the goal is to make sure all the story problems are politically correct? Johnny cuts down 3 old forest trees that each consume 4 tons of carbon dioxide every year...

I'm sure that all of the marketing for these textbooks emphasize on how these books need to be replaced to keep them 'relevant' to the kids of today.

Chasing a hopeless standard, but it probably convinces the school administrators.

615 Mary Garth  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:08:14pm

re: #600 Dark_Falcon

Welcome, Mary. Glad to have you on board.

Not my real name, BTW. Someone in this very literate group (or is that sucking up too much?) probably recognizes the reference.

616 Mich-again  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:09:53pm

Then again, about 100 million Bibles are sold every year and from what I gather that book hasn't changed all that much lately.

617 jaunte  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:11:39pm

re: #615 Mary Garth

"...fix your eyes on some small plump brownish person of firm but quiet carriage, who looks about her, but does not suppose that anybody is looking at her. If she has a broad face and square brow, well-marked eyebrows and curly dark hair, a certain expression of amusement in her glance which her mouth keeps the secret of, and for the rest features entirely insignificant – take that ordinary but not disagreeable person for a portrait of Mary Garth."

Welcome!

618 JRCMYP  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:13:10pm

It's too close to bedtime for me to get sufficiently outraged. Can I wait until morning--after I'm jacked up on coffee? Then I'll really get my mad on.

619 Mary Garth  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:13:19pm

re: #617 jaunte

"...fix your eyes on some small plump brownish person of firm but quiet carriage, who looks about her, but does not suppose that anybody is looking at her. If she has a broad face and square brow, well-marked eyebrows and curly dark hair, a certain expression of amusement in her glance which her mouth keeps the secret of, and for the rest features entirely insignificant – take that ordinary but not disagreeable person for a portrait of Mary Garth."

Welcome!

Another Middlemarch fan. Excellent.

620 solomonpanting  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:13:26pm

re: #446 Pietr

I've been avoiding news, trying to catch up here, Charles. Did she get returned to her parents? You may remember, I'm a Texan, and the two teen muslim girls WERE killed by their father here, after CPS returned them home.

Not yet. She's still in Florida.

621 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:14:04pm

I just want to say how shcoked I am that a president of the UNited States would want the Olympiccs to be hosted here! How dare he use his evil sinister commie agenda to bring hundreds of millions of tourist dollars to America while trying to promote America as a nice place to other people from around the world.

Many of those people are well not white and not Christian and it is my duty as a real Republican to let these people know that they are not welcome here.

And to think that W. has gone RINO enough to support this outrageous globalist agenda!

How dare he. These here United States were founded on the principles of liberty democracy and justice for ME and my buddy Skeeter.

I am appalled!


///

622 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:14:45pm

re: #610 Mich-again

Imagine if your car had an expiration date and you had to replace it after three years even though you took care of it and it still ran fine. Crazy? Yep, just like the textbook industry is.

Isn't that sort of how car ownership in Japan works?

623 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:15:10pm

re: #615 Mary Garth

Not my real name, BTW. Someone in this very literate group (or is that sucking up too much?) probably recognizes the reference.

We are glad to have you!

624 SFGoth  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:34:20pm

I'll say this: I don't think Bush was a bad guy, in the sense of being an asshole. Heck, I think he and Bill Clinton actually probably like each other - 2 gregarious, now ex-presidents, etc. However, our current guy, well...

625 tokyobk  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:52:07pm

re: #513 iceweasel

We never had to make English our official language before, and we're a nation of immigrants.

I think ballots in a dozen languages is new. I think in the past the expectation is that people would learn English and assimilate. I think that is a reasonable expectation that any country should, while of course offering as much help as possible to people.

I also think that people (especially Americans) should learn other languages, of course.

626 tokyobk  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 9:52:31pm

re: #622 WindUpBird

Isn't that sort of how car ownership in Japan works?

Yes.

627 Mich-again  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 10:04:15pm

re: #622 WindUpBird

Isn't that sort of how car ownership in Japan works?

Not sure?

628 sagehen  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 10:41:11pm

re: #355 tradewind

I am not at all outraged, I am just somewhat puzzled at the Olympic jaunt, just because first, it seemed to be Michelle's gig, which is fine, and second, shouldn't there be people like Commerce department or our Olympic honchos doing that? Shouldn't Mayor Daley get top billing there?

Ever since Tony Blair and Vladamir Putin showed up to make personal appeals (and their cities won), now they're trying to make it a tradition. The IOC wants face time and photo ops, especially if the bidding city is the head of state's hometown.

629 SixDegrees  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 11:53:24pm

re: #628 sagehen

Ever since Tony Blair and Vladamir Putin showed up to make personal appeals (and their cities won), now they're trying to make it a tradition. The IOC wants face time and photo ops, especially if the bidding city is the head of state's hometown.

Correct.

Another disturbing thing about this latest spasm from Malkin is that nowhere is there any mention of the incredibly corrupt nature of the IOC, an organization which actively solicits and accepts outright bribes in return for the granting of an Olympic venue, and which is rotten to the core. Instead, it's all about 0bama's participation in the pitch.

Priorities? Not so much.

Note also that Chicago was selected as a contender for the 2016 Olympics in April, 2007. Malkin's outrage of this began just two days ago - when 0bama's participation was announced, after two and a half years of inattention.

630 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 11:54:06pm

re: #557 tovarisch Jimmahski

Yes - this is very familiar to me as well : "culture under threat. The librhuls are selling your culture down the river. Who will stand up for the poor forgotten ordinary English speaking white guy? Who will stem the tide of foreignness that is swamping our culture?" I recognise this stuff immediately as BNP talking points.

Yes, I thought of that video you linked a while ago where someone or other from the BNP was explicitly saying they had to package themselves as protecting 'national' culture and the like, to make their bigotry and xenophobic agendas more palatable and attractive to people.
Some american righties were at that speech or something too, right?

631 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 11:58:57pm

re: #630 iceweasel

Yes, I thought of that video you linked a while ago where someone or other from the BNP was explicitly saying they had to package themselves as protecting 'national' culture and the like, to make their bigotry and xenophobic agendas more palatable and attractive to people.
Some american righties were at that speech or something too, right?

Oh yes - David Duke and friends were there too - here it is:

632 centaur  Mon, Sep 28, 2009 11:59:54pm

Speaking as a Chicagoan, I hope RIO or Madrid or Tokyo gets the games. It will go over budget. We the people will pay the bill. Graft and corruption will be rampant. There will be profit--for Daley's buddies. Chicago has enough problems for Daley and now the Pres. to be focusing on this. All this Olympics hype makes me sick.

Great/funny/true website: [Link: www.chicagoansforrio.com...]

633 centaur  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 12:03:01am

re: #629 SixDegrees

Good point. That's because she's fixated of course.

634 BARACK THE VOTE  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 12:06:32am

re: #631 Jimmah

Oh yes - David Duke and friends were there too - here it is:


[Video]

You always come up with the goods. :)

635 WaveriderCA  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 12:30:15am

Engish? Spanish? Both? Any way you cut it they still don't learn solid math or science and get screwed out of any realistic idea of how the world works. I guess thats how how people mistake say... 70,000 people for 2 million?

636 spaceman spiff  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 1:05:23am

re: #584 Van Helsing

Its all about cash for credits. How relevant can the stuff they are teaching me now be when I enter the workforce?

637 centaur  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 5:28:55am

Okay -- I went and read the comments. Of course they're not all dumb and petty. Some valid points there. But this one is outright ridiculous: "This is no different that Hamas’ use of schools to position their rocket launchers."

As someone opposed to the Olympics coming to ChiTown, and to the Pres., Daley, and the rest wasting valuable time, money and media space on that quest, I have to say that, yes, it is just may be a wee bit different, don't you think?

638 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 8:02:16am

I have this theory evolving as I watch the MSM and the rise of blogs/cable among the decline of print newspapers/mags. It seems to me the ratings/viewers/twitters race is amplifying all the worst, simply because thats what gets and holds peoples attention. Its a feedback loop of behavior-media reaction, (more Beck-isms) and most of all what we have pointed out in this post. Outrage squared!

639 medaura18586  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 8:35:26am

re: #415 karmic_inquisitor

English has become the standard language here. But when the country was founded there were plenty of Dutch, German and (yes) Spanish speakers.

There are practical advantages to a common language, and communications technology will have the world speaking the same language in 200 years anyway. But will it be English? From where we sit, probably. But English is a lousy language - it is hard to learn and difficult to master. It is a hodge podge mounted on a pile of hodge podge insofar as languages go. Then again, it represents a fusion of a group of languages, so maybe that is a good thing.

Just the same, I don't equate culture to language. English, Spanish or any other. Hell - the French have the Academy Nationale and they can't control the language. It is silly to try.

Actually, English is a beautiful language. It's economic, devoid of most nonessential eccentricities such as gender, inflections (well, most of them), and archaic verb moods. Its subtleties are achieved mostly through the combination of prepositions and other idiomatic expressions. I am proficient in Albanian, Italian, and basic French--the last two allowing me to understand over 70% of written Spanish. If any of those languages were to take the place of English as a linguistic vehicle currency, it would be a most unfortunate thing. I can guarantee you they're all harder to learn. And I suspect even out of other European languages, English is one of the easiest. Unless we go for Esperanto, English is likely the best we can settle for as a common language.

Semantically, language is divorced from culture. Anything can be translated into any other language--the latter being merely the syntax of choice. However, to excel in any language, one must be well read in the masterpieces originally written in it. Grammar and mechanical instruction can only take you so far. Unless you critically read Chaucer, Shakespeare, Gibbon, Shaw, and other classics of the English language through the ages (the whole cannon of English literature), you will never be fully literate in English. It is this required acquaintance with classical works of literature that interweaves the language back to the culture that produced it.

Unless one seeks to learn Spanish for conversational utility alone, Don Quixote and other Spanish classics cannot be avoided. Most notable works in Spanish were written by Spaniards as opposed to Latin Americans, so the culture rooted in the Spanish language is indeed Spanish... and it has been cruel, traditionally, to the indigenous peoples of the Americas. From a utilitarian and cultural perspective, it makes more sense that they embrace English and transfer any nationalistic pride as they may have to it. Identifying with the Spanish language makes no sense for Latin Americans, though little sense is often involved in issues such as national and cultural identity.

In order to fully savor the great works of the past, proficiency in different languages is needed. I wish I could read Homer and Aurelius in Greek, Balzac in French, Servantes in Spanish, Kafka in German, etc. Reading Dante in Italian is a rare treat. The Italian musical tradition is amazing, and I'm blessed to be able to enjoy it in full. As far as the future is concerned, universalization of language is something for all peoples of the world to look forward to. As many people as possible should be able to access what, of any value, will be written in the future. It's not a matter of pride or national identity. It's a matter of mass communication.

640 medaura18586  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 8:40:14am

What I prescribe for education is exposure to as many languages as possible in early youth--main European languages as well as more exotic ones with demographic momentum (such as Mandarin)--but deeper grounding in English. Until puberty, the human brain is a sponge: the more you throw at it, the better. Learning a language after the age of 12 becomes exponentially harder, and requires different channels of thought altogether. I know first hand from my experience in learning Italian as a child and English as an adult. My Italian is flawless (however rusty at the moment); my English is plagued by an accent. And that's just the palpable difference. Learning, for a child, is not a zero sum game. The more, the earlier, the better.

Disclaimer: I hate the Spanish language. No nationalistic revulsion, of course. But it's so similar to Italian that it falls into the uncanny valley for me; sounds like what hick swampville English would to a Victorian-era gentleman. But I would make my kids learn it. And anyone who makes a fuss about bilingualism or multilingualism in general, is a Neanderthal.

641 medaura18586  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 9:22:07am

p.s. My own literacy in English is a work very much in progress--I'm reading as much English literature as possible but I've barely scratched the surface.

p.p.s. Despite the obvious benefits of multilingualism, English should be the official language of the U.S.--anyone should expect courts, police departments, firefighters, etc. to operate in English. No one should be able to demand service in any other language from state channels. If we adopted bilingualism as a mandatory standard, the costs of government services would inflate, and the eligibility for work in public service would become severely restricted. Spanish is a significant minority language in this country, just as French is in Canada. Adopting them as official languages would be disproportionate to their respective weights in the population. Nothing good can come out of it.

642 Tricky Dick  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 10:26:19am

Perhaps his time would be better spent trying to put a stop to this. But then again, considering he's on par with Jimmy Carter as the worst president in the history of this country, I don't think he'll do anything.

643 psyop  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 10:31:46am

Just had to say, the picture with the headline is priceless...

644 What, me worry?  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 10:33:38am

re: #621 LudwigVanQuixote

I just want to say how shcoked I am that a president of the UNited States would want the Olympiccs to be hosted here! How dare he use his evil sinister commie agenda to bring hundreds of millions of tourist dollars to America while trying to promote America as a nice place to other people from around the world.

Many of those people are well not white and not Christian and it is my duty as a real Republican to let these people know that they are not welcome here.

And to think that W. has gone RINO enough to support this outrageous globalist agenda!

How dare he. These here United States were founded on the principles of liberty democracy and justice for ME and my buddy Skeeter.

I am appalled!

///

hehe. Actually that's Skeeeter to you, son.

Why is capitalism the word du jour until it's coming out of a Democrat's mouth? Then there must be something inherently evil about it.

Oh wait, lookie here!

Bush boosts NY Olympic bid, 2005-02-24

New York - President George W Bush boosted New York's bid for the 2012 Olympics, sending a message of assurance to an International Olympic Commission group that the US government was prepared to help cover security costs - which soared above $1bn in Athens last year.

2005 folks.

Nary a peep from the hypocritical Right.

645 Diane  Tue, Sep 29, 2009 4:07:32pm

I don't post here often, but I am a sympathizer. After 9/11 going from the left to the right, I jammed the brakes in the center.

I remember very well, when the war in Iraq started, most of us in the right or right center had our eyes on one ball, democracy in the Middle East. It seems that the ball is lost and we, the players, have dropped some marbles. The beautiful and talented Michelle Malkin used to be on target and so did many others blog celebrities, until outrage took over good judgment. Don't know what happened, I was not there. I still have a soft spot for G.W.B. and miss the leadership and hunger for democracy.

On topic: Chicago would be a very interesting city for the Olympics.

646 Zebra  Wed, Sep 30, 2009 12:00:10am

This is just payback to Hizzoner...Mayor Daley. I don't have a problem with his going to Europe to try and secure the prize...but me thinks the European heads of state are FAR less enamored with him than his groupies back home are.

647 [deleted]  Wed, Sep 30, 2009 11:10:10pm
648 idioma  Thu, Oct 1, 2009 12:21:19am

re: #407 Charles

I think we've just found another area where my personal views are not going to sync up with the right wing.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with children learning to speak more than one language. And if that language is Spanish -- great! I wish I had learned Spanish as a child.

I'm finding it difficult to understand why this seems to be a problem for so many people.

I think it's mostly just driven by a classic fear of "the other". I personally see absolutely nothing wrong with children learning other languages. I've lived overseas and found that children tend to do quite well in bilingual environments. To be fair, here is a link which contradicts my personal experience: [Link: esl.fis.edu...]

In my adult life, I've had to learn two other languages with enough proficiency for collaboration and business. I wish I had started sooner.

Why is this even a right/left wing issue?

Granted, the Constitution and Declaration of Independence were both written in English; so one could argue that English is the standard, but I don't think that knowing English and Spanish (French, German, Italian, Japanese, Russian, or even Klingon for sake of argument) would in any way threaten citizens ability to read and interpret these founding documents.


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