Networks Not All Fox News

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You know that story that was on Fox News yesterday, claiming that Fox had been excluded from a “roundtable” interview with pay czar Ken Feinberg?

And then (according to Fox News) all the other networks stood up and said, “If Fox isn’t there, we’re not going to be there! We’re all Fox News now!”

Well, turns out it didn’t exactly happen that way. And the other networks really aren’t all Fox News, either.

The version Fox has pushed all day is that the network was excluded from an interview roundtable with Feinberg yesterday, and that bureau chiefs from ABC, CBS, NBC and CNN came to Fox’s defense.

TPMDC dug into it, and here’s what happened.

Feinberg did a pen and pad with reporters to brief them on cutting executive compensation. TV correspondents, as they do with everything, asked to get the comments on camera. Treasury officials agreed and made a list of the networks who asked (Fox was not among them).

But logistically, all of the cameras could not get set up in time or with ease for the Feinberg interview, so they opted for a round robin where the networks use one pool camera. Treasury called the White House pool crew and gave them the list of the networks who’d asked for the interview.

The network pool crew noticed Fox wasn’t on the list, was told that they hadn’t asked and the crew said they needed to be included. Treasury called the White House and asked top Obama adviser Anita Dunn. Dunn said yes and Fox’s Major Garrett was among the correspondents to interview Feinberg last night.

Simple as that, we’re told, and the networks don’t want to be seen as heroes for Fox.

TPMDC spoke with a network bureau chief this afternoon familiar with the situation who was surprised that Fox was portraying the news as networks coming to its rescue.

“If any member had been excluded it would have been the same thing, it has nothing to do with Fox or the White House or the substance of the issues,” the bureau chief said. “It’s all for one and one for all.”

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141 comments

1 Randall Gross  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:31:25pm

What will the next faux cry of persecution be?

2 Shiplord Kirel  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:32:04pm

It helps to ask.

3 Sharmuta  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:32:13pm

Fair and Balanced, my ass. More like, Credibility Zero.

4 lostlakehiker  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:32:26pm

It's one for all and all for one. That's the whole point. The other networks aren't going to go along with a system in which whoever toes the line gets the face time.

5 bosforus  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:32:46pm

With such delusions of self-importance one might venture to guess that if Fox were present and say, NBC were not, Fox would keep mum.

6 reine.de.tout  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:33:20pm

Good grief!
The Fox News story was what, then, completely made up?

It would seem so.

7 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:35:18pm

re: #6 reine.de.tout

Good grief!
The Fox News story was what, then, completely made up?

It would seem so.

It's Fox - there is no surprise here.

William

8 jaunte  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:35:58pm

Kim Strassel at the WSJ, helping forward the censorship meme:

And don't forget Fox News Channel ("nothing but a lot of talk and a badge!"). Fox, like MSNBC, has its share of commentators. But according to Obama Communications Director Anita Dunn, the entire network is "opinion journalism masquerading as news." Many previous White House press officers, when faced with criticism, try this thing called outreach. The Chicago crowd has boycotted Fox altogether.[Link: online.wsj.com...]
9 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:36:41pm

Nontroversy!

10 webevintage  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:36:49pm

Well of course it did not happen that way, but reality really hurts Faux!Outrage and the meme that Obama is Nixon.

BTW, it also hurts if the meme if anyone acknowledges that the previous administration went after NBC, no matter how many times Perino says she never would have said anything about a news network.
Or that the previous President never gave an interview to the NYTs.
Or that they paid guys providing commentary...or how about those former military dudes...

(I could go on, but really I hate saying "but they did it too" because that is a BS response...but then hypocrites really bug the hell out of me and Rove/Perino saying "gosh, gee, we never did anything like that" just chaps my hide.)

11 Four More Tears  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:37:56pm

More spin than a damn washing machine.

12 Sharmuta  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:38:50pm
Feinberg did a pen and pad with reporters to brief them on cutting executive compensation. TV correspondents, as they do with everything, asked to get the comments on camera. Treasury officials agreed and made a list of the networks who asked (Fox was not among them).

The network pool crew noticed Fox wasn’t on the list, was told that they hadn’t asked and the crew said they needed to be included. Treasury called the White House and asked top Obama adviser Anita Dunn. Dunn said yes and Fox’s Major Garrett was among the correspondents to interview Feinberg last night.

Sounds to me like the White House wanted to include Fox so as to not increase the feud. I guess that didn't stop fox from wanting to milk their martyr badge for all it's worth. Whatever crumb of credibility they had left is completely gone, imo.

13 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:39:11pm

It has become fashionable to bash FOX. and there's no doubt that glenn beck is an unguided missile sorely in need of some guidance. but I've been in the media for 31 years (27 of them in the national media) and I am really glad that FOX, in spite of its imperfections is on the scene. I've worked in newsrooms in a number of markets, and if you don't think that at least 80% of the people producing and delivering your news are left of center, you are fooling yourselves. FOX has it's issues. And I am objective enough to admit many of them. But you should be glad they're around.

14 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:39:36pm

FNC: "All the news that fit to fabricate".

15 Four More Tears  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:43:20pm

re: #13 _RememberTonyC

Were things that bad when they weren't around?

16 Randall Gross  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:43:21pm

Charles used to have to report the fauxtography, now he has to report the fauxtroversies. I'm glad someone is.

17 reine.de.tout  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:43:35pm

re: #13 _RememberTonyC

It has become fashionable to bash FOX. and there's no doubt that glenn beck is an unguided missile sorely in need of some guidance. but I've been in the media for 31 years (27 of them in the national media) and I am really glad that FOX, in spite of its imperfections is on the scene. I've worked in newsrooms in a number of markets, and if you don't think that at least 80% of the people producing and delivering your news are left of center, you are fooling yourselves. FOX has it's issues. And I am objective enough to admit many of them. But you should be glad they're around.

I am actually glad that FOX is around. But I wish they would clean up their act. As far as Beck, O'Reilly - those are opinion shows, and if they want Beck and O'Reilly and Hannity - I don't care, they can have them and take whatever criticism comes their way.

But for what is supposed to be their hard news - it would be nice to know we could count on accuracy. And in fact, I never had cause to doubt the accuracy of their news - delivered by Shep Smith, who I think is a total ass, but nevertheless - it was the news. On this story, however, it seems they just completely made it up, presented as news (not opinion).

18 Virginia Plain  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:45:30pm

I never liked Fox news. It's like the Twilight Zone and always has been.

19 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:48:44pm

re: #15 JasonA

Were things that bad when they weren't around?

FOX has been around since 1996. When they showed up on the scene, the ratio of left of center people in the media was a bit less than it is now. When I started in 1978, the newsrooms were much more balanced politically. And I started in Boston, which is a Democrat dominated city. But my newsroom back then was much closer to 50/50 as far as the politics of the news people. But in the last 20 years, I have noticed many more left of center thinkers in the newsrooms I work in. So FOX is definitely different in that regard. And I feel it is resented because of it.

20 Shiplord Kirel  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:49:21pm

The nutosphere is up in arms* over the administration's alleged "targeting" of Fox News.
Well, you can't have it both ways. For years, I have urged polticians, office holders, military briefers and anyone else in the public eye to stand up to hostile media. They have a right to their opinions, and their distorted ravings, but they do not have a right to keep their opinions unchallenged. Last year, I criticized McCain for not taking a more confrontational position with the media, as though he was lost in the 1960s and thought he still had to treat them as honest brokers who could be won over. This was before Palin, obviously.

In the GOP at least, the reluctance to challenge the media has been historically based on the abject failure of VP Spiro Agnew's campaign of anti-media rhetoric during the Nixon administration. The problem there was not that the media are ominpotent and beyond accountability, as many concluded, it was that Agnew was a buffoon and a crook. Even if the media were all-powerful in the early 70s, they certainly are not now.

As this blog itself has demonstrated, hostile media can be held to account. There is no inherent violation of anyone's rights in calling a horsethief a horsethief. Bush should have done it, McCain should have done it, and I, for one, will not bitch, whine, and scream "censorship" just because it is the other side that finally got the message.

*As though anyone needs reminding, this is not just a figure of speech when we are talking about wingnuts.

21 SteveC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:49:21pm

re: #18 Virginia Plain

I never liked Fox news. It's like the Twilight Zone and always has been.

With a good measure of The Keystone Kops for effect!

22 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:53:36pm

re: #17 reine.de.tout

I am actually glad that FOX is around. But I wish they would clean up their act. As far as Beck, O'Reilly - those are opinion shows, and if they want Beck and O'Reilly and Hannity - I don't care, they can have them and take whatever criticism comes their way.

But for what is supposed to be their hard news - it would be nice to know we could count on accuracy. And in fact, I never had cause to doubt the accuracy of their news - delivered by Shep Smith, who I think is a total ass, but nevertheless - it was the news. On this story, however, it seems they just completely made it up, presented as news (not opinion).

FOX has its extreme characters, which you have cited. But they are not alone in that regard. Ever listen to Campbell Brown on CNN? She purports to be an objective news reporter. She is thoroughly obnoxious and extremely biased. I won't even mention Olbermann, because most objective people find him nauseating. How about Mike Brzezenski of MSNBC? She also claims to be an objective news reporter. She reads the DNC talking points faithfully. How about CBS News? Charles basically exposed their political bias and dishonesty. My point is that all of them make mistakes and sometimes show their bias. But only FOX, the lone right of center outlet is bashed for it.

23 Four More Tears  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:54:41pm

re: #22 _RememberTonyC

FOX has its extreme characters, which you have cited. But they are not alone in that regard. Ever listen to Campbell Brown on CNN? She purports to be an objective news reporter. She is thoroughly obnoxious and extremely biased. I won't even mention Olbermann, because most objective people find him nauseating. How about Mike Brzezenski of MSNBC? She also claims to be an objective news reporter. She reads the DNC talking points faithfully. How about CBS News? Charles basically exposed their political bias and dishonesty. My point is that all of them make mistakes and sometimes show their bias. But only FOX, the lone right of center outlet is bashed for it.

You see Mika like that? I just see her nodding along with Joe Scarborough.

24 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:57:00pm

re: #23 JasonA

You see Mika like that? I just see her nodding along with Joe Scarborough.

Jason, she did it yesterday. I'll see if I can find it and post it

25 The Sanity Inspector  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:58:08pm

..."and remember that ignorant and biased reporting has its counterpart in ignorant and biased listening."

26 Spare O'Lake  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:58:25pm

Was Fox excluded from the "pen and paper" session? If so, how could they have asked to be included in the roundtable interview?
Or doesn't this matter?

27 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:58:36pm

re: #22 _RememberTonyC

How can Brzezinski be anything but a Democrat?! Look at her dad.

28 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 12:59:31pm

Fox should be free to re: #22 _RememberTonyC

But only FOX, the lone right of center outlet is bashed for it.

That's funny...I hear people bashing the "left wing media" on a regular basis, here and elsewhere.

29 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:00:29pm

re: #24 _RememberTonyC

Jason, she did it yesterday. I'll see if I can find it and post it

here it is ...

30 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:01:27pm

re: #28 bratwurst

Fox should be free to


That's funny...I hear people bashing the "left wing media" on a regular basis, here and elsewhere.

31 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:02:10pm

re: #29 _RememberTonyC

here it is ...

[Video]

Oh, my stars. Sounds like the White House is helping write her script.

32 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:02:17pm

re: #28 bratwurst

Fox should be free to


That's funny...I hear people bashing the "left wing media" on a regular basis, here and elsewhere.


that was weird ... I meant to say that FOX is the only one subject to a vendetta by the Wite House ... my bad

33 webevintage  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:02:31pm

re: #23 JasonA

You see Mika like that? I just see her nodding along with Joe Scarborough.

No kidding.
I keep wondering when she is going to go all "liberal"...
Best show ever was when her father came on and called old Joe and idiot or some such thing.

BTW, I do watch FOX during the day...if flip from them to MSNBC and CNN along with watching a network news you kind of get a full picture.

34 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:03:22pm

Don't pee on my leg and tell me it's raining.

35 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:04:22pm

re: #32 _RememberTonyC

that was weird ... I meant to say that FOX is the only one subject to a vendetta by the Wite House ... my bad

Without getting into a semantics debate, I think it is a bit of a stretch to call the WH treatment of Fox a "vendetta".

36 tradewind  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:04:32pm

The problem is, those are Marshall's talking points, which he got from ' an unnamed bureau chief ' , who got them from...Valerie Jarrett.
So maybe not so much. The WH's attack on Fox is still being derided by other networks and news outlets.

37 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:04:56pm

re: #27 MandyManners

How can Brzezinski be anything but a Democrat?! Look at her dad.

her dad is one of the most odious characters around. his mix of arrogance, plus ignorance equals total incompetence.

38 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:06:58pm

re: #35 bratwurst

Without getting into a semantics debate, I think it is a bit of a stretch to call the WH treatment of Fox a "vendetta".

vendetta: an often prolonged series of retaliatory, vengeful, or hostile acts or exchange of such acts

39 MinisterO  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:07:18pm

re: #29 _RememberTonyC

That, to you, is reading DNC talking points faithfully?

40 webevintage  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:07:45pm

re: #36 tradewind

The problem is, those are Marshall's talking points, which he got from ' an unnamed bureau chief ' , who got them from...Valerie Jarrett.
So maybe not so much. The WH's attack on Fox is still being derided by other networks and news outlets.

Is it really an "attack" if you are pointing out that FOX is right of center in their commentary and at times seem not based in reality when it comes to their reporting of the WH?
I think it is an attack on FOX every time the President has called on Major Garrett (2 or 3 times) and allowed him to ask some idiotic question.

41 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:08:48pm

re: #36 tradewind

The problem is, those are Marshall's talking points, which he got from ' an unnamed bureau chief ' , who got them from...Valerie Jarrett.
So maybe not so much. The WH's attack on Fox is still being derided by other networks and news outlets.

Was you who posted an article recently about this? It was not from Fox.

42 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:10:01pm

re: #37 _RememberTonyC

her dad is one of the most odious characters around. his mix of arrogance, plus ignorance equals total incompetence.

Just like his boss, Jimmah.

43 Spare O'Lake  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:10:01pm

re: #26 Spare O'Lake

Was Fox excluded from the "pen and paper" session? If so, how could they have asked to be included in the roundtable interview?
Or doesn't this matter?

IOW, "They didn't ask" may well have been a piece of steaming sleazy misdirection by Treasury, which was called out by the other networks.

44 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:11:34pm

re: #38 _RememberTonyC

vendetta: an often prolonged series of retaliatory, vengeful, or hostile acts or exchange of such acts

Hate to see how you would have responded if I had said I DID want to get into a semantics debate.

The "Maoist" Dunn said during the interview on an obscure program on a much lower rated news network that the White House would, in fact, consent to future interviews with Fox, etc. To hear the reaction from Beck and others on that network and in the blogosphere you would think the WH intends to take them off the air.

45 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:11:58pm

re: #39 MinisterO

That, to you, is reading DNC talking points faithfully?

that was just yesterday's example ... she drinks the kool-ade regularly.

46 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:13:14pm

re: #44 bratwurst

Hate to see how you would have responded if I had said I DID want to get into a semantics debate.

The "Maoist" Dunn said during the interview on an obscure program on a much lower rated news network that the White House would, in fact, consent to future interviews with Fox, etc. To hear the reaction from Beck and others on that network and in the blogosphere you would think the WH intends to take them off the air.

last weekend, rahm emanual and david axelrod said FOX was not a legitimate news organization. do you remember?

47 captdiggs  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:13:42pm

If anyone actually watched the Major Garrett video at TPM, he explains the incident factually, and there is no daylight between what he says and what TPM says.

The larger issue is that Obama is acting, imo, very unpresidential in picking this fight with a network. It smacks of an inability to deal with criticism, and there are far more important issues for a president to be dealing with.

48 MinisterO  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:14:03pm

re: #45 _RememberTonyC

It doesn't seem particularly egregious. Can you trace the comment to the DNC?

49 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:14:16pm

re: #42 MandyManners

Just like his boss, Jimmah.


both of them are bad news

50 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:14:36pm

re: #47 captdiggs

If anyone actually watched the Major Garrett video at TPM, he explains the incident factually, and there is no daylight between what he says and what TPM says.

The larger issue is that Obama is acting, imo, very unpresidential in picking this fight with a network. It smacks of an inability to deal with criticism, and there are far more important issues for a president to be dealing with.

Narcissists don't deal with criticism well.

51 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:14:48pm

re: #46 _RememberTonyC

last weekend, rahm emanual and david axelrod said FOX was not a legitimate news organization. do you remember?

Shall I link the clip of the Fox producer whipping up the Tea Party crowd?

52 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:15:22pm

re: #49 _RememberTonyC

both of them are bad news

Wasn't Chris "tingle" Matthews the one who wrote Carter's "malaise" speech?

53 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:15:58pm

re: #48 MinisterO

It doesn't seem particularly egregious. Can you trace the comment to the DNC?

she said yesterday it was an email from the White House ... the words came out of her mouth. she was acting as essentially a mouthpiece. Look at the clip again.

54 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:16:38pm

re: #48 MinisterO

It doesn't seem particularly egregious. Can you trace the comment to the DNC?

Did you watch the video? The WHITE HOUSE e-mailed her while she was on the air.

55 MinisterO  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:16:58pm

re: #50 MandyManners

Narcissists don't deal with criticism well.

Indeed. The Fox News talking heads are certainly exploding over the White House criticisms.

56 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:17:06pm

re: #51 bratwurst

Shall I link the clip of the Fox producer whipping up the Tea Party crowd?

go ahead, but make sure you also show the CNN reporter at the tea party doing a hatchet job on the participant she was interviewing

57 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:17:58pm

re: #53 _RememberTonyC

she said yesterday it was an email from the White House ... the words came out of her mouth. she was acting as essentially a mouthpiece. Look at the clip again.

Beat me to it while I was busy finding this.


58 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:18:13pm

re: #52 MandyManners

Wasn't Chris "tingle" Matthews the one who wrote Carter's "malaise" speech?


not sure ...

59 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:19:46pm

re: #57 MandyManners

Beat me to it while I was busy finding this.




I love Supertramp!

60 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:20:08pm

The White House attempted to exclude us from coverage!
Ok, really it was because we didn't ask for coverage.

The other networks put their foot down and said NO WAY!
Ok, so the White house pool reporters simply asked why FOX wasn't on the list. Then we were added to it even though we hadn't asked.

The White House bowed to the media pressure and was forced to include us!
Ok, we lied again, nothing like that ever actually happened, but it made such a great story we couldn't resist.

Have they no sense of decency?

61 Four More Tears  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:20:53pm

re: #53 _RememberTonyC

she said yesterday it was an email from the White House ... the words came out of her mouth. she was acting as essentially a mouthpiece. Look at the clip again.

So journalists shouldn't be reading emails they get from the White House on the air? No respect, Tony, but I'm just not seeing it like you do.

62 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:20:54pm

re: #58 _RememberTonyC

not sure ...

He was a speechwriter for Carter and worked for Tip O'Neill.

63 MinisterO  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:22:24pm

re: #53 _RememberTonyC
re: #54 MandyManners


" The White House did just e-mail saying that interaction with Jake Tapper was not heated."

This is what you're complaining about?

64 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:22:40pm

re: #56 _RememberTonyC

go ahead, but make sure you also show the CNN reporter at the tea party doing a hatchet job on the participant she was interviewing

You do your research, I'll do mine.

I will not dispute that there are ACTUAL journalist who work for Fox. I agree that it is not right that they get tarred with the same brush as Beck, etc. However, when they insist upon bringing their "opinion" guys onto "news" programs, you get moments like this:

65 moshavnik  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:23:11pm

The amount of hypocrisy surrounding this issue is amazing.
First of all there is no such thing as unbiased media.
Secondly all the MSM mad absolute fools out of themselves by salivating all over Obama during the elections.
Fox is scum but they are no worse than any of the other scum.

66 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:23:25pm

re: #61 JasonA

So journalists shouldn't be reading emails they get from the White House on the air? No respect, Tony, but I'm just not seeing it like you do.

She added a little something extra as well. She defended the White House's tone in how they portrayed FOX. it was subtle, but indicative of her personal bias.

67 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:24:12pm

re: #63 MinisterO

re: #54 MandyManners


This is what you're complaining about?

the part right after that was the pertinent part

68 Taqyia2Me  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:24:32pm

So, like, it's ok for the left to use the last 8 years meme as the basis for all the ails the economy but the conservative can't use the last 8 years of non-stop BDS from just about all the broadcast media because some lefties got their panties all in a wad about some inaaccuracies on the Fox opinion shows?
Sure, that's solid use of logic.
/

69 MinisterO  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:24:56pm

re: #67 _RememberTonyC

Was that a DNC talking point?

70 webevintage  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:26:42pm

When you think about it, this whole thing is just silly.
Each administration whines about their critics or refuses to give certain folks interviews or finds retired military guys who support their war to speak on various news channels in a positive way or have their Press Secretary mention certain networks in a negative way or call Brian Williams at home so they can yell at him*...well I could go on and on but you get the picture.

The thing is if a network is twisting stories in a way that are not truthful OR not based in reality and that effects how the American public feels about various issues I would think that might be a good time for a White House to point out that fact.

and what President is not a narcissist?


*that would be Bill Clinton

71 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:26:47pm

re: #64 bratwurst

You do your research, I'll do mine.



I will not dispute that there are ACTUAL journalist who work for Fox. I agree that it is not right that they get tarred with the same brush as Beck, etc. However, when they insist upon bringing their "opinion" guys onto "news" programs, you get moments like this:



fine ...

72 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:27:25pm

re: #69 MinisterO

Was that a DNC talking point?

more like an order from the White House, which is even more blatant

73 webevintage  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:29:38pm

re: #66 _RememberTonyC

She added a little something extra as well. She defended the White House's tone in how they portrayed FOX. it was subtle, but indicative of her personal bias.

Maybe because the WH tone has been even and calm and FOX's has been "OMG!!!1111!!! what about our free speech, Obma is Nixon"?

74 Stanghazi  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:29:48pm

OT but check out this letter from Eisenhower:

"Some of the people who have commented on it have remarked about Eisenhower’s writing style, which is really remarkable in its clarity and directness. It’s also really interesting to read his personal reflections on towering historical figures like Omar Bradley or Patton.

What really stays with you, though, is his brief description of touring a liberated death camp, and in particular, his prediction even then of Holocaust denial. This is almost a month before V-E day; the world doesn’t yet know the extent of Germany’s crimes. There’s no greater knowledge of the Holocaust yet to invite denial. And yet the terrible and persistent history of anti-Jewish hatred already compels Eisenhower to vow to stand witness against those who would in the future dismiss the Holocaust as propaganda."

[Link: www.ordinary-gentlemen.com...]

75 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:31:18pm

re: #71 _RememberTonyC

fine ...

I will not defend the behavior of that reporter. However, I don't see other networks sponsoring political rallies, lying about their attendance and then chiding other networks for not covering them either.

76 MinisterO  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:31:34pm

re: #72 _RememberTonyC


" The White House did just e-mail saying that interaction with Jake Tapper was not heated."

You think the email said more than that? I watched the clip several times and couldn't find any reason to believe what was from the White House email.

77 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:32:38pm

re: #73 webevintage

Maybe because the WH tone has been even and calm and FOX's has been "OMG!!!1111!!! what about our free speech, Obma is Nixon"?

the White House has really made a mistake in pursuing this campaign against FOX. it is childish and beneath the dignity of the Presidency. If they are smart, they'll chill out and stop this idiocy. If they don't quit it, they will live to regret it.

78 MinisterO  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:33:58pm

re: #76 MinisterO

I watched the clip several times and couldn't find any reason to believe what followed was from the White House email.

79 captdiggs  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:34:04pm

re: #65 moshavnik

The amount of hypocrisy surrounding this issue is amazing.

Obama was the one who cast himself as the great uniter.
Remember, "There are no blues states, there are no red states, there are only the United States..."

Now that's hypocrisy.

80 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:35:22pm

re: #77 _RememberTonyC

the White House has really made a mistake in pursuing this campaign against FOX. it is childish and beneath the dignity of the Presidency. If they are smart, they'll chill out and stop this idiocy. If they don't quit it, they will live to regret it.

That is your opinion. It could also be that with every moderate Republican keeping their head down for fear of being label RINO these days, it is in the best interest of the WH to reinforce the idea that Fox is THE voice of the GOP. We will have to wait a while to find out. In the meantime, the state of the economy is going to have considerably more impact on the outcome of the elections in 13 months than any of this.

81 KingKenrod  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:36:09pm

Fox disputes TPM:

[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

The whole thing sounds like a petty little trick to me. Treasury leaves Fox out of the interview list so they have to come back and ask special permission.

BTW, Michael Clemente - the Fox executive quoted in the HP article - isn't some right-wing wanker. He's a 27 year news veteran from ABC. He's not going to pop his head up and start telling lies about the White House.

82 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:36:38pm

re: #76 MinisterO

You think the email said more than that? I watched the clip several times and couldn't find any reason to believe what was from the White House email.

you're right that the email from the White House just addressed Tapper. But Mika added her defense of the White House's treatment of FOX on the back end. Which does indicate that she is willingly carrying their water.

83 MinisterO  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:39:11pm

re: #82 _RememberTonyC

you're right that the email from the White House just addressed Tapper.

Then what the hell does the email have to do with anything?

84 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:39:50pm

re: #80 bratwurst

That is your opinion. It could also be that with every moderate Republican keeping their head down for fear of being label RINO these days, it is in the best interest of the WH to reinforce the idea that Fox is THE voice of the GOP. We will have to wait a while to find out. In the meantime, the state of the economy is going to have considerably more impact on the outcome of the elections in 13 months than any of this.

I never said it was anything but my opinion. Hopefully the media will report fairly on the economy in the coming months and not allow the current administration to continue whining that they're cleaning up Bush's mess without being challenged on their own programs for fixing the economy.

85 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:41:29pm

re: #83 MinisterO

Then what the hell does the email have to do with anything?

She was perfectly happy and eager to read it on the air. It's not normal behavior for a news anchor.

86 webevintage  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:41:32pm

re: #77 _RememberTonyC

the White House has really made a mistake in pursuing this campaign against FOX. it is childish and beneath the dignity of the Presidency. If they are smart, they'll chill out and stop this idiocy. If they don't quit it, they will live to regret it.

And I disagree.
Maybe, just maybe FOX will instead clean up its act, personally I'm glad that someone in the administration pointed out that it was silly for them to waste their time with FOX since they are basically an arm of the Republican party and not always operating in reality.

I really have no problem with journalists reporting negative news about the Dems or the White House, I just want it to be the unvarnished truth.

Bit like I said, it is silly that we and the news are wasting so much time and energy over this.

87 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:44:06pm

re: #86 webevintage

And I disagree.
Maybe, just maybe FOX will instead clean up its act, personally I'm glad that someone in the administration pointed out that it was silly for them to waste their time with FOX since they are basically an arm of the Republican party and not always operating in reality.

I really have no problem with journalists reporting negative news about the Dems or the White House, I just want it to be the unvarnished truth.

Bit like I said, it is silly that we and the news are wasting so much time and energy over this.

Agreed. So many problems in this country and in the world, and Fox getting butthurt gets SO much attention.

88 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:44:23pm

re: #86 webevintage

And I disagree.
Maybe, just maybe FOX will instead clean up its act, personally I'm glad that someone in the administration pointed out that it was silly for them to waste their time with FOX since they are basically an arm of the Republican party and not always operating in reality.

I really have no problem with journalists reporting negative news about the Dems or the White House, I just want it to be the unvarnished truth.

Bit like I said, it is silly that we and the news are wasting so much time and energy over this.

different opinions make this a great country. but it is not the government's job to get FOX to clean up its act. that job belongs to the viewing public. when the government tries to do it, that is bad news for all of us

89 webevintage  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:44:49pm

re: #82 _RememberTonyC

you're right that the email from the White House just addressed Tapper. But Mika added her defense of the White House's treatment of FOX on the back end. Which does indicate that she is willingly carrying their water.

But except for what Tapper says we have not seen, on the air, anyone from the White House getting heated about this issue.
So instead of "carrying their water" Mike (who I cannot believe I am defending) was just stating the truth...a fact based in reality.

90 Spare O'Lake  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:46:41pm

re: #83 MinisterO

Then what the hell does the email have to do with anything?

Why was the douchebag reading directly from her laptop an email from the White House?
Was it part of the "breaking news" syndrome?

91 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:47:24pm

Can we all at least agree:

A) Nobody in the WH or elsewhere is trying to pull the plug on Fox News

and

B) Glenn Beck is INSANE to compare WH staff saying unkind things about Fox News to the murder of millions of innocent people (as documented here)?

92 _RememberTonyC  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:47:30pm

re: #89 webevintage

But except for what Tapper says we have not seen, on the air, anyone from the White House getting heated about this issue.
So instead of "carrying their water" Mike (who I cannot believe I am defending) was just stating the truth...a fact based in reality.

Nixon was correctly villified for doing something similar to the NY Times and Washington Post. I had a problem with him doing it then, and I have a problem with Obama doing it now.

I'll let my fellow Lizards have the last word on this. But it was fun discussing this with everyone. Have a wonderful day (night) :)

93 Sol Berdinowitz  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:47:51pm

re: #86 webevintage

"I really have no problem with journalists reporting negative news about the Dems or the White House, I just want it to be the unvarnished truth."

It doesn't have to be the unvarnished truth, but it really must not be lies, fabrications and fear-mongering. I believe that is what Obama was reacting to.

94 webevintage  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:50:03pm

re: #88 _RememberTonyC

different opinions make this a great country. but it is not the government's job to get FOX to clean up its act. that job belongs to the viewing public. when the government tries to do it, that is bad news for all of us

BUT the gov't is not doing it.
All they did was point out that FOX is totally biased and there is no reason for them to waste their time dealing with them...
They have not put FOX out of business or told them they can't do this or that.
Have you heard something I have not?
Did FOX go off the air?
Is there someone from the WH approving whatever goes on the air?

aaarrrggghhh
You really are a good guy to go back and forth on this and I promised myself when I joined here I was here to listen to conservatives, not poke at them.
So I need to stop poking and let this go.

95 Spare O'Lake  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:53:30pm

re: #94 webevintage

BUT the gov't is not doing it.
All they did was point out that FOX is totally biased and there is no reason for them to waste their time dealing with them...
They have not put FOX out of business or told them they can't do this or that.
Have you heard something I have not?
Did FOX go off the air?
Is there someone from the WH approving whatever goes on the air?

aaarrrggghhh
You really are a good guy to go back and forth on this and I promised myself when I joined here I was here to listen to conservatives, not poke at them.
So I need to stop poking and let this go.

You're not poking, you're digging.
Obama is dead wrong on this Fox boycott. It is already costing him and it is going to cost him more unless he gets over it real quick.

96 Taqyia2Me  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:56:01pm

Mark Steyn Grand Slam:
[Link: article.nationalreview.com...]

"Benjamin Disraeli’s most famous advice to aspiring politicians was: “Never complain and never explain.” For the greatest orator of our time, a man who makes Churchill, Lincoln, and Henry V at Agincourt look like first-round rejects on Orating with the Stars, Barack Obama seems to have pretty much given up on the explaining side. He tried it with health care with speech after speech after exclusive interview for months on end and the more he explained the more unpopular the whole racket got. So he declared that the time for explaining is over, and it’s time to sign on or else.

Meanwhile, to take the other half of the Disraeli equation, Obama and his officials and their beleaguered band of surrogates never stop complaining. If you express concerns about government health care, they complain about all these “racists” and “domestic terrorists” obstructing his agenda. If you wonder why the president can’t seem to find time in his hectic schedule of international-awards acceptance speeches to make a decision about Afghanistan, they complain that it’s not his fault he “inherited” all these problems. And, if you wonder why his “green jobs” czar is a Communist 9/11 truther and his National Endowment for the Arts guy is leaning on grant recipients to produce Soviet-style propaganda extolling Obama policies, they complain about Fox News..."

97 MinisterO  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:56:38pm

re: #85 _RememberTonyC

As near as I can tell you don't think she should have read the email and you don't think she should have expressed an opinion afterwards.

I know you disagree with opinion she expressed. Let us consider the possibility that this last is the real source of the outrage.

Nah, of course not.

98 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:57:31pm

re: #96 Taqyia2Me

Mark Steyn Grand Slam:

The guy who can't see why so many people consider Rush Limbaugh a racist? I'll pass.

99 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 1:57:52pm

re: #96 Taqyia2Me

National Endowment for the Arts guy is leaning on grant recipients to produce Soviet-style propaganda extolling Obama policies
I've vaguely heard about that. What's going on?

100 webevintage  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 2:00:51pm

re: #99 MandyManners

National Endowment for the Arts guy is leaning on grant recipients to produce Soviet-style propaganda extolling Obama policies
I've vaguely heard about that. What's going on?

Old news, some lower level guy already gone...

101 Taqyia2Me  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 2:25:54pm

re: #99 MandyManners

National Endowment for the Arts guy is leaning on grant recipients to produce Soviet-style propaganda extolling Obama policies
I've vaguely heard about that. What's going on?

Watch any 1/2 hour sitcom on any broadcast network this year is all I'm sayin'...

102 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 2:30:08pm

re: #101 Taqyia2Me

Watch any 1/2 hour sitcom on any broadcast network this year is all I'm sayin'...

I don't watch broadcast television. Could you be a bit more specific?

103 Canadhimmis  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 2:31:49pm

re # 22_RememberTonyC

My point is that all of them make mistakes and sometimes show their bias. But only FOX, the lone right of center outlet is bashed for it.

FOX only appears to be right of center because of a pervasive left wing bias within the mainstream media. FOX has plenty of leftists and is, more accurately speaking, to the left of center for the median viewer.

104 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 2:50:58pm

re: #103 Canadhimmis

FOX has plenty of leftists and is, more accurately speaking, to the left of center for the median viewer.

Were that the case, it is hard to imagine how Barack Hussein Obama could have EVER been elected.

105 Taqyia2Me  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 2:54:49pm

re: #102 MandyManners

I don't watch broadcast television. Could you be a bit more specific?

Yes, my wife and I watch a lot of the 1/2 hour sitcoms, just about every one of them now have these little portions encouraging volunteerism and greenism. Now the George W Bush years are over, they needed to replace the bushhitlercheyhaliburton bashing with something. Coincidentally, I'm sure, volunteerism and greenism have been introduced this season.
(New Adentures of Christine, 30 Rock, Parks and Recreation, etc.)

106 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 2:57:31pm

re: #105 Taqyia2Me

Yes, my wife and I watch a lot of the 1/2 hour sitcoms, just about every one of them now have these little portions encouraging volunteerism and greenism. Now the George W Bush years are over, they needed to replace the bushhitlercheyhaliburton bashing with something. Coincidentally, I'm sure, volunteerism and greenism have been introduced this season.
(New Adentures of Christine, 30 Rock, Parks and Recreation, etc.)

What happened at the NEA?

107 Taqyia2Me  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 3:03:13pm

re: #106 MandyManners

What happened at the NEA?

My understanding is that there was a teleconference or something where the White House administration "encouraged" the NEA administration to push the administration propaganda. An administration operative lost his/her job over it, if I recall correctly.

[Link: www.qando.net...]

108 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 3:06:11pm

re: #107 Taqyia2Me

My understanding is that there was a teleconference or something where the White House administration "encouraged" the NEA administration to push the administration propaganda. An administration operative lost his/her job over it, if I recall correctly.

[Link: www.qando.net...]

Oh, my stars. Doesn't surpirse me in the least.

109 Taqyia2Me  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 3:14:52pm

re: #108 MandyManners

Oh, my stars. Doesn't surpirse me in the least.

Quite. The White House is big on personal attacks. Let's all hope it's not President Obama himself, just the disposable ones, like Emmanuel, Axelrod and Dunn.
If it doesn't change, the whole country will soon reject it.

110 blueherron  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 3:21:31pm

re: #106 MandyManners

What happened at the NEA?


Glenn Beck has discussed this on several shows; so you have to take it for what it's worth, coming from Glenn and all. Beck has also ranted many times about Obama's interest in promoting volunteerism.

111 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 3:39:23pm

re: #109 Taqyia2Me

Quite. The White House is big on personal attacks. Let's all hope it's not President Obama himself, just the disposable ones, like Emmanuel, Axelrod and Dunn.
If it doesn't change, the whole country will soon reject it.

Where's the buck stop?

112 MandyManners  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 3:39:40pm

re: #110 blueherron

Glenn Beck has discussed this on several shows; so you have to take it for what it's worth, coming from Glenn and all. Beck has also ranted many times about Obama's interest in promoting volunteerism.

I wouldn't know. I don't watch Beck.

113 Dr. Shalit  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 4:30:26pm

re: #110 blueherron

blueherron -

Volunteer-"ism" is good, it is for all intents and purposes the basis of "Civil Society" - SO LONG AS IT IS VOLUNTARY - where it is coerced, it is at best
conscription - at worst - SLAVERY. That is all.

-S-

114 blueherron  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 5:12:11pm

re: #113 Dr. Shalit

blueherron -

Volunteer-"ism" is good, it is for all intents and purposes the basis of "Civil Society" - SO LONG AS IT IS VOLUNTARY - where it is coerced, it is at best
conscription - at worst - SLAVERY. That is all.

-S-

-S-
Yeah, I hate it when "they" try to foist the idea of volunteer"ism" on Americans by suggesting ways to participate in making the country better. The next thing you know you find yourself reading to the elderly or helping out at an animal shelter. With NO WAY OUT!!!///

115 Mr.Boots  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 6:01:24pm

re: #13 _RememberTonyC

It has become fashionable to bash FOX. and there's no doubt that glenn beck is an unguided missile sorely in need of some guidance. but I've been in the media for 31 years (27 of them in the national media) and I am really glad that FOX, in spite of its imperfections is on the scene. I've worked in newsrooms in a number of markets, and if you don't think that at least 80% of the people producing and delivering your news are left of center, you are fooling yourselves. FOX has it's issues. And I am objective enough to admit many of them. But you should be glad they're around.

That may be, but that 20% has managed to put John McCain on the Sunday shows tomorrow for the 15th time since Obama was sworn in. John Kerry appeared just 3 times in the first eight months after Bush defeated him.

116 RealismRox  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 6:08:22pm

re: #115 Mr.Boots

Or it could be that McCain wants to do more TV appearances than Kerry.

117 Mr.Boots  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 6:40:54pm

re: #103 Canadhimmis

re # 22_RememberTonyC

FOX has plenty of leftists and is, more accurately speaking, to the left of center for the median viewer.

This statement doesn't have any impact without some examples. Like who?

118 Kronocide  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 6:43:55pm

WTF is up with Fox? If the network as a whole acts like their 1 hour show hosts all hope will be lost for them.

119 AtadOFF  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 7:00:43pm

Okay so first I'm going to point out that I avoid MSM like the plague and give AP as much credibility as a hand gliding kitten... but I'm going to play devils advocate here.

If there was nothing to this story why did Robert Gibbs say it was a mistake by a young treasury dept staffer?

[Link: www.politico.com...]


other citations...

[Link: www.mediaite.com...]

[Link: www.cbsnews.com...]

and for what it's worth...

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

::ducks for cover::

P.S. Personally I think a tiny error got blown out of proportion by the tension between the WH and Fox.

120 SilentAlfa  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 8:51:11pm

re: #117 Mr.Boots

This statement doesn't have any impact without some examples. Like who?

Shep Smith, Fox's token liberal so that they can try to pass themselves off as "fair and balanced".

121 Greengolem64  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 8:58:05pm

re: #47 captdiggs

If anyone actually watched the Major Garrett video at TPM, he explains the incident factually, and there is no daylight between what he says and what TPM says.

The larger issue is that Obama is acting, imo, very unpresidential in picking this fight with a network. It smacks of an inability to deal with criticism, and there are far more important issues for a president to be dealing with.


Glad someone finally pointed that out. Seems 'everyone' likes to get caught up in their favorite soundbite...no exception here at LGF. MG did a pretty decent job of describing what went down...and seemed to keep the opinions out of it...IMHO. :)

122 Dan Tanna  Sat, Oct 24, 2009 10:49:05pm

[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

Fox News Exec On Attempted Feinberg Interview Snub: We Requested Feinberg Interview, Gibbs Acknowledged Mistake

A Fox News executive told the Huffington Post Saturday that the network "absolutely" did request an interview with Obama administration "pay czar" Kenneth Feinberg and that the White House acknowledged a mistake on the part of a Treasury department staffer in failing to initially include Fox News in the round of interviews Feinberg conducted Thursday.

"Of course we requested an interview," Fox News Senior Vice President Michael Clemente told the Huffington Post.

This directly contradicts reports by the Associated Press and Talking Points Memo, both of which reported that the White House had excluded Fox News because it did not request an interview.

123 XopXproxyX  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 1:13:51am

re: #103 Canadhimmis

FOX has plenty of leftists and is to the left of center for the median viewer.

Oh yeah, Fox News is left of the average viewer, because the average viewer in america is a fully paid up member of the John Birch society.
That was of course, a joke.
But really get a clue. Fox News is singled out because it claims to be "Fair & balanced", but in reality is anything but. Other networks do have left wing pundits, but the network's entire operation is not skewed to one side with a terrible bias present in every news story presented, as a matter of policy.

124 jayzee  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 4:52:03am

“If any member had been excluded it would have been the same thing, it has nothing to do with Fox or the White House or the substance of the issues,” the bureau chief said. “It’s all for one and one for all.”

In Fox's reports, that is all I heard them say. I'm not sure about the point of this entry.

125 jayzee  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 4:55:08am

re: #123 XopXproxyX

Oh yeah, Fox News is left of the average viewer, because the average viewer in america is a fully paid up member of the John Birch society.
That was of course, a joke.
But really get a clue. Fox News is singled out because it claims to be "Fair & balanced", but in reality is anything but. Other networks do have left wing pundits, but the network's entire operation is not skewed to one side with a terrible bias present in every news story presented, as a matter of policy.

I gotta call bulls*t on that. First off I think they do a good job generally between their news division and editorializing which is reserved for the pundits. Something CNN, MSNBC etc don't do that well at all. Second of all, what friggin difference does a news organizations political slant have? I would never support an official government attack on a left leaning news organization and I won't accept one on a right wing org.

126 SilentAlfa  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 6:00:22am

" First off I think they do a good job generally between their news division and editorializing which is reserved for the pundits."

No, they really don't. Between 4 PM and 10 PM, Fox has three hours of right-wing opinion shows (Beck, Hannity, O'Reilly), and no leftist opinion shows. Compare this to CNN, which has one hour of right-wing opinion and one hour of left-wing opinion in the same period.

127 jayzee  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 8:05:25am

re: #126 SilentAlfa

" First off I think they do a good job generally between their news division and editorializing which is reserved for the pundits."

No, they really don't. Between 4 PM and 10 PM, Fox has three hours of right-wing opinion shows (Beck, Hannity, O'Reilly), and no leftist opinion shows. Compare this to CNN, which has one hour of right-wing opinion and one hour of left-wing opinion in the same period.

ok-my point is you're 1) Talking about opinion shows and 2) pointing out something that is entirely irrelevant. They have a right to be left/right/center and government has no business curtailing that right or trying to.

I HATE CNN-I've lived in Israel, sitting in a friend's apartment in Jaffa, watching CNN when CNN International talked about a non existent riot that occurred precisely where I was. They never let anyone interrupt their pro Pal agenda. I don't watch them-BUT I'd be pissed if the government tried to limit their freedom. You lefties are unbelievably hypocritical.

128 SilentAlfa  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 8:38:44am

"ok-my point is you're 1) Talking about opinion shows"

ok-my point is you're 1) saying fox discriminates between news and opinion shows but half of fox's programming during the primetime hours is opinion shows rather than actual news.

You see, me talking about opinion shows is actually entirely relevant because we're talking about editorializing news channels. And when half of your prime-time programming is purely right-wing opinion, yeah, that's editorializing the news.

"You lefties are unbelievably hypocritical."

Good job making completely unfounded assumptions about me. At no point did I say I wanted to limt Fox News' freedoms, all I've done is point out how opinionated it is. And thanks for talking about CNN International, but I don't really care since I live in the United States and we're talking about news channels' coverage on domestic issues.

129 pennstconserv  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 9:11:40am

This post is inaccurate.
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]
There should be an update.

130 kittysaidwoof  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 9:55:27am

So based on the huffpo story Fox was excluded and the other Networks commendably did fight for Fox. BTW the news of WH rubbishing Fox has crossed the Atlantic to continental Europe. I saw a couple of news stories about it in our papers over the weekend. The concern is palpable for we have several examples where this can lead. Not only the usual suspects in Russia but in Italy too. A very dangerous path for the leader of the free world to be on (if he really is on the path that is). I am expecting this to be thrown at my face when next I argue with some rabid Putin fan about the lack of freedom of the press in Russia (completely unfair for now, but that is the problem with being the leader of the free world - everybody is expecting perfect performance).

131 claire  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 10:03:46am

re: #96 Taqyia2Me

The Chicago way? Don’t bring a knife to a gun fight? In Iran, this administration won’t bring a knife to a nuke fight. In Eastern Europe, it won’t bring missile defense to a nuke fight. In Sudan, it won’t bring a knife to a machete fight.

But, if you’re doing the overnight show on WZZZ-AM, Mister Tough Guy’s got your number.

I love reading Mark Steyn.

132 jayzee  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 10:51:32am

re: #128 SilentAlfa

"ok-my point is you're 1) Talking about opinion shows"

ok-my point is you're 1) saying fox discriminates between news and opinion shows but half of fox's programming during the primetime hours is opinion shows rather than actual news.

You see, me talking about opinion shows is actually entirely relevant because we're talking about editorializing news channels. And when half of your prime-time programming is purely right-wing opinion, yeah, that's editorializing the news.

"You lefties are unbelievably hypocritical."


unfounded assumptions about me. At no point did I say I wanted to limt Fox News' freedoms, all I've done is point out how opinionated it is. And thanks for talking about CNN International, but I don't really care since I live in the United States and we're talking about news channels' coverage on domestic issues.



You see, me talking about opinion shows is actually entirely relevant because we're talking about editorializing news channels. And when half of your prime-time programming is purely right-wing opinion, yeah, that's editorializing the news.

Um no it's not. And CNN owns CNN International and shares reporters and content. But what's fact got to do with it. You got feelings. And if the content of a news organization's editorial staff offends yours sensibilities then damn them. Damn any news org that intermixes editorials with hard news. Down with the NY Times. Down with CNN. Down with Fox. Down with them all. Let the right/left/center government determine what's best. I can't believe people here would ever called for and support government censorship of the media.

133 Nervous Norvous  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 11:01:34am

re: #132 jayzee

Please...fox isn't being censored, they're being called out on their dishonest tactics. There is a big difference.

They can put any damn thing they like on the air, but that doesn't prevent them for being criticized. You must have the same understanding of the first Amendment that Sarah Palin does.

[Link: blogs.abcnews.com...]

The First Amendment doesn't protect Fox from being criticized, just from being told what to print. No one in the Obama admin to my knowledge has suggested that Fox not be allowed to be on cable or on broadcast TV, just stated that it was strictly speaking, not an honest player in terms of unbiased news coverage.

134 kittysaidwoof  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 12:15:19pm

Of course Fox can be criticized. And if they tell lies, WH should immediately counter them with facts. However at least from far far away it looked like several WH officials told Fox isn't a news organization and apparently as a consequence some lower lever staffer (according to HP) made the obvious conclusion and excluded Fox from an interview. If I were a cynic I might even suggest that this was a testing the water case.

There is hardly enough to make any conclusive judgments on this, but the issue is too important to be just shrugged off.

135 MTF  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 12:36:25pm

"You know that story that was on Fox News yesterday, claiming that Fox had been excluded from a “roundtable” interview with pay czar Ken Feinberg?

And then (according to Fox News) all the other networks stood up and said, “If Fox isn’t there, we’re not going to be there! We’re all Fox News now!”

Well, turns out it didn’t exactly happen that way."

Apparantly, according to HuffPo, it did happen that way.

136 Abu Mazgan  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 2:43:05pm

What makes Talking Points any more credible than Fox News? In fact, what makes the White House any more credible than Fox News?

All the White House press people were doing interviews before this happened and said that Fox News wasn't a news network. Now it appears that they're doing damage control, and you all accept it without question. Frankly, I'm disappointed.

137 Nervous Norvous  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 3:05:10pm

re: #136 Abu Mazgan

Does the white house have an obligation to give Fox access? I don't see that written anywhere either.

It's customary, but certainly not required.

138 jayzee  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 3:16:46pm

re: #133 PT Barnum

Please...fox isn't being censored, they're being called out on their dishonest tactics. There is a big difference.

They can put any damn thing they like on the air, but that doesn't prevent them for being criticized. You must have the same understanding of the first Amendment that Sarah Palin does.

[Link: blogs.abcnews.com...]

The First Amendment doesn't protect Fox from being criticized, just from being told what to print. No one in the Obama admin to my knowledge has suggested that Fox not be allowed to be on cable or on broadcast TV, just stated that it was strictly speaking, not an honest player in terms of unbiased news coverage.

Yeah me and Sarah are of the same mindset on almost all issues. FWIW You are criticizing Fox, the administration tried to censor them. THEN Axelrod went out and told other news organizations they'd be wise not to follow Fox's lead. Once again, to make things perfectly clear-government officials, should NOT within their official capacity endorse or attack any news corp. It is a slippery slope, and the game played with this event shows it's getting more and more slippery.

139 Nervous Norvous  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 3:27:40pm

re: #138 jayzee

Exactly how has Fox been censored? Did Obama try to take them off the air?

Where is it written that public officials can't criticize or endorse a news organization? That has nothing to do with freedom of the press.

Censorship would be if the Federal Government sent a SWAT team in and arrested the entire staff.

Censorship would be if the Federal Government required Fox to clear its broadcasts before they could be put on the air.

Neither of those things is happening, so I am not going to get too excited.

140 jayzee  Sun, Oct 25, 2009 3:41:41pm

re: #139 PT Barnum

Exactly how has Fox been censored? Did Obama try to take them off the air?

Where is it written that public officials can't criticize or endorse a news organization? That has nothing to do with freedom of the press.

Censorship would be if the Federal Government sent a SWAT team in and arrested the entire staff.

Censorship would be if the Federal Government required Fox to clear its broadcasts before they could be put on the air.

Neither of those things is happening, so I am not going to get too excited.

Political censorship exists when a government attempts to conceal, distort, or falsify information that its citizens receive by suppressing or crowding out political news that the public might receive through news outlets. In the absence of unflattering but objective information, people will be unable to dissent with the government or political party in charge. It is also the suppression of views that are contrary to those of the government in power. [Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

You don't need black helicopters, and secret police for censorship to occur. Don't be concerned.

As for politicians not being able to endorse or criticize media, as private citizens, no problem-in official government capacity? A slippery slope. BTW I have a very big issue with the way the Republicans are endorsing some in the media.

141 abu mazgan  Mon, Oct 26, 2009 12:19:41am

PT Barnum,

It doesn't say anywhere that the White House must give equal access to all news organizations, but it is a clearly set precedent, especially where a pool of news organizations is involved. Further, it was not just David Axelrod, but also Anita Dunn and Rahm Emanuel who went on the air over the past weeks castigating Fox News. It's odd that when their efforts appeared to have boomeranged the TPM "scoop" suddenly appeared.

As far as your definition of censorship, so what you are saying is that because Obama isn't Hugo Chavez or the Iranian mullahs he's okay?


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