Hot Air Comments of the Day

BlogosphereOctober 2009 • Views: 5,768

All I can say is, “Yikes.” It’s secession and revolution time (not necessarily in that order) in the Hot Air commentspace tonight, in a thread about Harry Reid’s push for the “public option:”

Texas can opt out by seceding.

[…]

And the rest of the sane states

[…]

If they do, I’m so there.

[…]

That’s the only move left. This feral government will not be domesticated, again. It has reverted to an utterly savage state of nature and will never return.

[…]

I am SO ready for secession. No taxation without representation, and they don’t represent us at all anymore.

[…]

In the new United Maoist States of America, Texas will be our Taiwan.
Long live the Republic.

[…]

Secession. Now, that’s a public option I’m hoping Texas soon will decide to take.
Think of it as the ultimate opt-out.

[…]

So builds this historical flash point.

[…]

Maybe it is time the non Marxist states considered “opting out” of the “union”.

[…]

“Are there anymore options out there to fix this mess?”
Think George Washington. Yes, there are options.

[…]

Yup, Texas secession — the ultimate opt-out.

[…]

“Are there anymore options out there to fix this mess?”
Not really.

– The SCOTUS should rule it un-Constitutional, which it clearly is, but they won’t.

– The Precedent could be found ineligible, thrown out of office, and have everything he signed rendered null and void (though I’m not sure about that last part) … but it won’t (see above)

– Secession

That’s really about it. Sad. But these are the sorts of situations that a feral government produces. Other than the above, the American creed will die, with only American conservatives left to carry it as a belief that they, alone in the world, espouse, without a land in which to practice it and without the ability to live by the framework set down by the founding documents and the traditions established by American culture.

[…]

It does seem like our options are getting fewer. After the last election I don’t really have that much faith in the election process, and the communists in the White House will do everything they can to rig elections.
It’s quite obvious what the majority of people in this country want … and “health care” isn’t one of them. Washington isn’t listening, Washington doesn’t want to listen. They just want us to shut up and keep giving them our money.

Washington fears the left. They will never listen to us until they fear us more.

[…]

If you have to over come a veto as well, you will need 72-75 Republican seats.
That’s never going to happen. This thing has to be defeated before it goes in. Failing that, the only remaining option will be secession.

[…]

for this little weasel to attach his name to the Public Option is the final nail in his coffin….
Of course, it is the final nail in the coffin of this country if this load of crap passes too….

[…]

And if this thing passes, it’s on Mr. Rightisleft.
Millions feel just like me, and I’d sooner die a patriot, than a slave. And even if every one of us is killed… I will have considered it an honor to be dead amongst other like minded heros.

Secession and civil war are alternatives to this, and by god if those are the only options left… so be it, the democrats forced our hand.

[…]

Check that… the lefteists have forced our hand.
The Democrats by no means have a monopoly on useless sub-human garbage leftsts.

[…]

No he won’t learn. But that’s fine. He can die a slave on his knees. I am willing to die on my feet as a patriot so that his kids, who I think more of than he does, can possibly enjoy freedom from the oppressive nanny state.

[…]

The American creed will not die – it cannot – but it seems that it might not be in the US that it will continue. If these bills don’t get killed …

[…]

The parasitic blue states will elect the public option and the red states will opt out. The left has now achieved exactly what it set out to do. They will reward their nanny state Marxist/leftist constituents and the parasitic underclass for faithfully voting for Democrats. We should take it one step further and completely redistribute the land mass and other resources so the two different and irreconcilable ideologies can go their separate ways never again to meet. The left can then build their ideal Marxist state and the rest of us can rebuild the greatest democracy and free market system ever known … and the sooner the better.

I repeat, “Yikes.”

Jump to bottom

936 comments

carefulnow Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:49:08pm

If California falls into the ocean, does that mean it seceded?

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:50:19pm

And if this thing passes, it’s on Mr. Rightisleft.
Millions feel just like me, and I’d sooner die a patriot, than a slave. And even if every one of us is killed… I will have considered it an honor to be dead amongst other like minded heros.
Secession and civil war are alternatives to this, and by god if those are the only options left… so be it, the democrats forced our hand.

Unbelievable! This person is comparing slavery to healthcare reform. Talk about hyperbole! And the only solution to this would be civil war?! This is insanity talking.

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:50:48pm

Hey, they have that RSM vibe down pat at Hot Air.

Charles Johnson Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:53:57pm

Thanks to simoom for posting these quotes in an earlier thread. I clicked through the links and verified that all of the comments were there.

lawhawk Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:54:05pm

re: #1 carefulnow

Lex Luthor, is that you? And have you bought oceanfront property in Nevada? ///

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:54:24pm

I'm shocked at the lack of comprehension these people have. Secession over healthcare! Whatever state they're living in will not be able to support itself as an independent nation. Have they even thought that far through? Never mind the number of people who would die in their little revolutionary fantasies. Idiots.

lawhawk Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:55:00pm

re: #4 Charles

No comment moderation and a tolerance of extremism. That's a real bad mix.

ArchangelMichael Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:55:04pm

re: #5 lawhawk

Lex Luthor, is that you? And have you bought oceanfront property in Nevada? ///

"Good bye California. Hello new west coast. Luthorville. Marina del Lex. Otisburg... Otisburg? OTISBURG!?!"

brandon13 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:56:21pm

Advocating a civil war over health care passing? Really?

Insane.

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:58:36pm

re: #1 carefulnow

If California falls into the ocean, does that mean it seceded?

No, it just means that we're now aquatic-Americans.

solomonpanting Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:59:05pm

re: #9 brandon13

Advocating a civil war over health care passing? Really?

Insane.

At least the wounded will have medical coverage.

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:59:05pm

I am SO ready for secession. No taxation without representation, and they don’t represent us at all anymore.

Are you really ready? Ready for goods and services you buy to be restricted? Ready for your state to go broke because they ca no longer rely on Federal spending to subsidize them? Ready infrastructure projects to be canceled due to lack of funding? Ready for complete chaos? Because that's what you're advocating.

And by the way- just because you don't like your representative, doesn't mean you lack representation. Idiot.

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 5:59:27pm

no no no, let them go

ArchangelMichael Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:00:33pm

re: #1 carefulnow

If California falls into the ocean, does that mean it seceded?

Seriously though, this is an urban legend and one of my pet peeves. California is not now nor will it ever be in danger of falling into the ocean. The SA Fault is a transform fault. The west side of it is moving north. In a few million years LA might be across the bay from Oakland, but it wont be underwater unless the Ocean level rises like a mile from AGW.

JamesWI Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:01:11pm

I hope the states these morons are in do secede, and that our new "Maoist" government imposes ridiculous tariffs on anything coming out of their newly formed country.

Our Precious Bodily Fluids Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:01:53pm

I wish these people would realize they are absolutely no different from the Democratic Underground types who go on and on about how Bush and Cheney are war criminals and mass murderers.

I really don't have any idea if the Becks and Limbaughs and Malkins of the world are a cause the nuttiness, or a symptom of it. Maybe it's both - some kind of feedback loop.

Walter L. Newton Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:02:00pm

re: #13 spacejesus

no no no, let them go

Why would you want to let your people go?

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:02:15pm

in my opinion, we should be encouraging extreme crazy rightwingers to secede. it may be the only way to get them out of our country.

let them go peacefully. let them have north dakota or samoa.

ArchangelMichael Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:02:19pm

re: #13 spacejesus

no no no, let them go

Just don't sell them to China. There's too much oil in Texas that they need not get their hands on.

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:02:21pm

re: #13 spacejesus

no no no, let them go

Let them go WHERE? If they think they're getting the California inland, I have some news for them about the fight they're going to have if they try to get a single filthy secessionist paw on Hetch Hetchy.

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:03:07pm

re: #18 SpaceJesus

in my opinion, we should be encouraging extreme crazy rightwingers to secede. it may be the only way to get them out of our country.

let them go peacefully. let them have north dakota or samoa.

What have you got against Samoans?

Existential_Donuts Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:03:11pm

The HA comments are from people that have seen too many movies. They talk a big game but when it comes to backing up their rhetoric, they will wuss out. They are going to have a civil war over health care? Puhleeze.

Also, they may think no one wants a public option in Texas. Wait until it starts helping people, good luck opting out.

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:03:31pm

re: #18 SpaceJesus

in my opinion, we should be encouraging extreme crazy rightwingers to secede. it may be the only way to get them out of our country.

let them go peacefully. let them have north dakota or samoa.

Why can't they have Iowa?

XopXproxyX Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:03:44pm

Really? They get 8 years of having things their own way, then less than a year into a new democratically elected president they throw a fit where "Secession" and "civil war" are the only solutions. Didn't take much to "force their hands" huh?

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:04:20pm

re: #20 SanFranciscoZionist

Let them go WHERE? If they think they're getting the California inland, I have some news for them about the fight they're going to have if they try to get a single filthy secessionist paw on Hetch Hetchy.

I for one, will defend the Napa Valley to the last drop of Chardonnay

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:04:49pm

re: #1 carefulnow

If California falls into the ocean, does that mean it seceded?

No. But to some it might mean that God succeeded.
/

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:05:37pm

re: #21 SanFranciscoZionist

What have you got against Samoans?

nothing against them, I just want to see a bunch of Glenn Beck fans come face to face with a 300lb giant brown-skinned pagan man.

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:06:04pm

"Why 3-tooth McGuilicutty was them there tellin' me that this feral government has gone over to the Marx-side. Why they done did forced are hand and I'd rather dye a patriut then live anymore in the Maoist state. Why I done there say we either have are selves a civil war or succeed!"

Sincerely,

Cletus @ Hot Air

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:06:16pm

re: #22 Existential_Donuts

The HA comments are from people that have seen too many movies. They talk a big game but when it comes to backing up their rhetoric, they will wuss out. They are going to have a civil war over health care? Puhleeze.

Also, they may think no one wants a public option in Texas. Wait until it starts helping people, good luck opting out.

When they write to one another, they see Minutemen, American patriots, the cast of entire Mel Gibson films. Plus Red Dawn.

When I read their writings, I see stupid, self-indulgent people.

Bloodnok Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:06:22pm

That’s the only move left. This feral government will not be domesticated, again. It has reverted to an utterly savage state of nature and will never return.

In only 9 months? These Democrats are good. It took Clinton at least 6 years before we became feral.

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:06:30pm

re: #24 XopXproxyX

Really? They get 8 years of having things their own way, then less than a year into a new democratically elected president they throw a fit where "Secession" and "civil war" are the only solutions. Didn't take much to "force their hands" huh?

Yes- they seem to think healthcare reform is a brutal form of tyranny which can only be stopped with violent revolt. Stunning.

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:06:55pm

re: #25 SpaceJesus

I for one, will defend the Napa Valley to the last drop of Chardonnay

Right behind ya, brother!

Our Precious Bodily Fluids Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:07:24pm

re: #21 SanFranciscoZionist

What have you got against Samoans?

You remember Antwan Rockamora? Half-black, half-Samoan, used to call him 'Tony Rocky Horror'?

EastSider Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:07:39pm

Wow. This is just a basic misunderstanding of representative government.

Also, many of these secessionist states would be losing money by leaving the federal government.

[Link: www.infoplease.com...]

Also, I'd wonder how Texans (an oft cited state above) would react if they somehow succeeded in a peaceful secession and NASA, US Military bases, the Federal reserve and any other federal institutions picked up shop and left.

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:07:53pm

re: #26 bosforus

No. But to some it might mean that God succeeded.
/

Nah. God didn't do it. It's San Andreas' fault.

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:08:22pm

re: #31 Sharmuta

Yes- they seem to think healthcare reform is a brutal form of tyranny which can only be stopped with violent revolt. Stunning.

Apparently they don't realize Obama's gotten nowhere with his health care agenda.

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:08:41pm

re: #24 XopXproxyX

Really? They get 8 years of having things their own way, then less than a year into a new democratically elected president they throw a fit where "Secession" and "civil war" are the only solutions. Didn't take much to "force their hands" huh?

Exactly. These people seem to have a problem understanding that in a democracy, sometimes the other guy wins. What. The. Fuck.

After the last election I don’t really have that much faith in the election process, and the communists in the White House will do everything they can to rig elections.
It’s quite obvious what the majority of people in this country want … and “health care” isn’t one of them.

No faith in the election process? Just because your candidate didn't win? What is wrong with these people?
And as for that last sentence, I guess our scholar is unaware that even McCain ran on a platform promising health care reform. Morons.

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:08:51pm

re: #35 SanFranciscoZionist

Nah. God didn't do it. It's San Andreas' fault.

He's to blame for the Liqui faction.

Bloodnok Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:09:18pm

“Are there anymore options out there to fix this mess?”
Not really.

To quote Ned Flanders's beatnik parents: "We've tried nothin' and we're all out of ideas"

EastSider Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:10:03pm

re: #31 Sharmuta

Yes- they seem to think healthcare reform is a brutal form of tyranny which can only be stopped with violent revolt. Stunning.

Taxes rise .5% for people 10x richer than themselves: Tyranny! Oppression!

Insurance Premiums rise 10% annually for 5 years in a row on average citizens (or those that can afford it): Hoo-ray Free Market Success!

ArchangelMichael Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:10:08pm

re: #24 XopXproxyX

Really? They get 8 years of having things their own way, then less than a year into a new democratically elected president they throw a fit where "Secession" and "civil war" are the only solutions. Didn't take much to "force their hands" huh?

"They" are being seduced and egged on by Paulestinians, Paleo-cons, and White Nationalists. Paulestinains, Paleo-cons, and White Nationalists did not "get what they want" for 8 years. They hated Bush just as much as they hate Obama. They did not mesh as well with unhinged left-wing during those 8 years so they didn't get as much traction. They could not pretend to be liberals very well. They can however pretend to be conservatives so they got a lot of steam with the unhinged right-wing right now.

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:10:11pm

re: #27 SpaceJesus

nothing against them, I just want to see a bunch of Glenn Beck fans come face to face with a 300lb giant brown-skinned pagan man.

I think Samoans are mostly Christian. But they are pretty big. Giant, by the general run of humanity.

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:10:55pm

re: #34 EastSider

Wow. This is just a basic misunderstanding of representative government.

Yes- it's obvious many of these people lack basic knowledge of American civics when they think getting deleted on a privately owned blog constitutes a violation of their First Amendment rights. They think having a representative from the opposition party means they have no representation. And they think healthcare is akin to slavery.

Behold the seriously deluded.

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:11:43pm

re: #31 Sharmuta

Yes- they seem to think healthcare reform is a brutal form of tyranny which can only be stopped with violent revolt. Stunning.

Well, they've convinced themselves that their old healthcare will be taken from them, and then they will be issued new, inferior health care, and then every other part of their lives will be taken over by the state, so I can sort of see why they're concerned.

Except that they're mistaken, and they would know that if they'd bother to try to find out.

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:12:07pm

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:12:29pm

re: #33 negativ

You remember Antwan Rockamora? Half-black, half-Samoan, used to call him 'Tony Rocky Horror'?

Uh, no. I assume from the festive name that he was a wrestler or something?

Isn't the Rock part Samoan?

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:12:40pm

re: #42 SanFranciscoZionist

I think Samoans are mostly Christian. But they are pretty big. Giant, by the general run of humanity.

Check the top 3 of this list:
[Link: www.adherents.com...]
Top 20 Nations with Highest Proportion
of Latter-day Saints in the Population
Country Percent
Tonga 32.0%
Samoa 25.0
American Samoa 25.0

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:12:51pm

Killgore Trout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:13:21pm

Beck and the right wing blogs have whipped people up into such a frenzy over healthcare reform that it's going to be a very dangerous time when it passes.

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:13:28pm

re: #48 JetBoyTerp

Piss off

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:13:51pm

re: #45 ahwilde

re: #48 JetBoyTerp

You say something?

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:14:13pm

flounceapult in position

ArchangelMichael Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:14:26pm

re: #48 JetBoyTerp

You just put a vacancy sign on your ass and Stinky's foot is looking for a room.

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:14:39pm

re: #42 SanFranciscoZionist

I think Samoans are mostly Christian. But they are pretty big. Giant, by the general run of humanity.

Samoa has gone down the tube since Duke was governor.

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:14:49pm

re: #37 iceweasel

No faith in the election process? Just because your candidate didn't win? What is wrong with these people?
And as for that last sentence, I guess our scholar is unaware that even McCain ran on a platform promising health care reform. Morons.

These guys remind me of the Star Wars movie--I think it was the first one of the Bad Trilogy--where Princess Amidala presents her demands to the Senate or whatever it is. They start to debate. She decides on the spot that the government is useless, and runs off to do her own thing.

EVERYTHING THESE GUYS DO IS LIKE THAT. If the answer isn't "Yes! Your way! At once!" it's tyranny and total disaster.

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:15:03pm

re: #45 ahwilde

Perhaps we're wasting time on this because vileness such as this needs to be seen to be believed, and that exposing the rottenness in the political discourse will encourage others to speak out against it and work towards a healthier level of debate in this country.

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:15:03pm

re: #52 SpaceJesus

flounceapult in position

Two at the ready!

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:15:07pm

Killgore Trout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:15:34pm

re: #48 JetBoyTerp

Then why are all those comments still there? Does Hot Air management approve of armed revolution and secession? None of those comments have been removed, nobody banned, not even a warning from Ed or AP.

sphincter Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:15:54pm

Any former GM and Chrysler dealership owners around tonight whom the Government decided were to be shutdown? Having the government decide they were no longer viable must have been a hard pill to swallow.

How about former share holders of either corporation? Sure, they were money losing investments, but they gave both corporations away to unions of companies that are going to continue to struggle.

Hey! Everything's swell. Just swell.

Just don't move my cheese, please!

Bloodnok Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:15:55pm

re: #48 JetBoyTerp

F-L-O-U-N-C-E - Flonuce, flounce flounce!

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:16:01pm

re: #47 bosforus

Check the top 3 of this list:
[Link: www.adherents.com...]
Top 20 Nations with Highest Proportion
of Latter-day Saints in the Population
Country Percent
Tonga 32.0%
Samoa 25.0
American Samoa 25.0

what on earth

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:16:07pm

Walter L. Newton Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:16:09pm

re: #58 XopXproxyX

That I'm as left wing as they come and not even I've had -9 karma. What's up with that?

Give it time Grasshopper, give it time.

Bloodnok Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:16:15pm

re: #61 Bloodnok

flonuce? Ack.

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:16:19pm

re: #57 Gus 802

Two at the ready!

AIM...

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:16:38pm

re: #66 SpaceJesus

AIM...

Fire!

Gone.

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:17:24pm

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:17:42pm

re: #60 sphincter

WTH does this have to do with hot air?

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:17:46pm

re: #62 SpaceJesus

what on earth

It's a little known fact. Come to Utah and see the large Samoan population. Look at the BYU football roster.

EastSider Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:17:49pm

re: #37 iceweasel

Ballots before bullets. These people need to pump the brakes a bit.

Here's my thing, The Godwinesque arguments have gotten so high pitched that one has to actually take a step back to make a simple realization: Its 2009.

Lets don some of tinfoil headgear and pretend like Obama actually has put together The Biggest Conspiracy of All Time (TM) and is going to subvert the American democracy and send people to ACORN sponsored labor camps.

Do people really think that no one will notice this/let this happen? I mean, we had near real time info from IRAN after their election crackdown.

Everyone needs to relax with the wolf-crying, its becoming old hat.

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:18:23pm

re: #47 bosforus

Check the top 3 of this list:
[Link: www.adherents.com...]
Top 20 Nations with Highest Proportion
of Latter-day Saints in the Population
Country Percent
Tonga 32.0%
Samoa 25.0
American Samoa 25.0

So Glenn Beck might feel at home. Short, but spiritually at home.

I don't know how Samoans feel about men who cry a lot, though.

XopXproxyX Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:18:50pm

re: #64 Walter L. Newton

Haha yeah I'm just waiting for a Middle East themed thread for the epic ding down fest.

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:18:53pm

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:18:57pm

re: #6 Sharmuta

Look out they feel they have momentum. They have a "shocka" President and a (I think) depression. This is going to be scary interesting.

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:19:36pm

re: #74 JetBoyTerp

Try not insulting your host and the room.

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:19:46pm

Secession. Now, that’s a public option I’m hoping Texas soon will decide to take.
Think of it as the ultimate opt-out.

America 2.0 - The Wingmocracy

Aaargh!!!

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:19:49pm

re: #63 Sharmuta

Bullshit!

Yeah, what she said. They're bloody well egging each other on over there. I've been. It's an excitable room.

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:20:24pm

re: #72 SanFranciscoZionist

So Glenn Beck might feel at home. Short, but spiritually at home.

I don't know how Samoans feel about men who cry a lot, though.

Ha ha. From my experience they're not to keen on it.
Sidenote: Salt Lake also has a current and rising Polynesian/Samoan gang problem...

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:20:34pm

re: #74 JetBoyTerp

Go ahead, please explain why losing an election is grounds for revolution. I want to see your twisted logic.

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:20:44pm

This is a repost of mine from the earlier thread where simoom had posted these comments initially-- apologies for the repost but I think this fits here:
---
There is reason to suspect that some of the opposition to health care reform is driven by racial animosity. Obviously there are good criticisms and legitimate worries to have about it, but there is some interesting data suggesting that some of the unreasoning criticism is driven by racism-- and given what we already know about HotAir commenters and racism, I wouldn't be at all surprised if a racist dynamic underlies some of their opposition: (the rest of it I'd put down to their apocalyptic visions and general nutbaggery)

Racial Resentment, Authoritarianism, and Health Care

scholars have demonstrated that racial animosity and opposition to policies perceived as re-distributive appear to go hand in hand. When people think of welfare, they think of Blacks. And one can surmise that, with the election of a Black president, and the rising to the surface of racial animosity among voters who, last year, were desperate enough to give Obama a chance, these relationships are even stronger now than when these data were collected last year.

In sum, there is reason to think that beneath the arguments about government intrusion into the health care market, death panels, and such, a much more visceral dynamic is at work. To be perfectly clear, it is far from the case that every opponent or skeptic of significant health-care reform is a racist or racially motivated in her or his thinking. But there is, at the least, very strong circumstantial evidence that views of race and beliefs about health care reform are linked significantly among many Americans, which probably explains why the debate on health care reform has caused a much stronger uproar in 2009 than it did in 1994.

Bloodnok Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:21:09pm

re: #74 JetBoyTerp

As will your account. And nary a tear shall be shed.

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:21:17pm

re: #72 SanFranciscoZionist

So Glenn Beck might feel at home. Short, but spiritually at home.

I don't know how Samoans feel about men who cry a lot, though.

that is funny. Social conservatives won't vote for Romney because he's Mormon, but they would make Beck emperor of their new nation in a heartbeat.

sphincter Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:21:48pm

re: #69 Sharmuta

Fair question.

There are things the government should do. There are limits.

Fighting in the streets is stupid as dog dirt, but giving open permission for elected officials to do as they will is no very bright.

You have a point. I still am disturbed by what I see our government doing. This administration and the last one as well.

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:22:10pm

re: #83 SpaceJesus

that is funny. Social conservatives won't vote for Romney because he's Mormon, but they would make Beck emperor of their new nation in a heartbeat.

Odd, that.

funky chicken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:22:12pm

re: #3 Thanos

Hey, they have that RSM vibe down pat at Hot Air.

That's pretty much it. They didn't moderate when the crazies started spewing hateful stuff during the primaries and the election, and ended up losing lots of the more sane commenters, IMHO. The sad thing is that the folks who were more reasonable who have stayed have veered into the extreme as well. I guess that's to be expected if you surround yourself with that kind of stuff.

I was kinda bummed today when I stumbled across Fred Thompson on the radio today and heard him sounding kinda Malkinite. I supported him in the primaries because I thought he was conservative enough for many but still reasonable enough for me. His Hoffman endorsement and the show today don't support my previous opinion, unfortunately.

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:22:31pm

Where would we be if no one complained about the original health care bill that Nancy and Harry proposed? I seem to recall many on both sides here proclaiming it was shit.

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:22:49pm

re: #83 SpaceJesus

that is funny. Social conservatives won't vote for Romney because he's Mormon, but they would make Beck emperor of their new nation in a heartbeat.

That is interesting. I'd never thought of that quandary before.

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:22:53pm

re: #84 sphincter

Fighting in the streets is stupid as dog dirt, but giving open permission for elected officials to do as they will is no very bright.

Who's giving them such permission?

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:22:56pm

re: #71 EastSider

Ballots before bullets. These people need to pump the brakes a bit.

Here's my thing, The Godwinesque arguments have gotten so high pitched that one has to actually take a step back to make a simple realization: Its 2009.

Lets don some of tinfoil headgear and pretend like Obama actually has put together The Biggest Conspiracy of All Time (TM) and is going to subvert the American democracy and send people to ACORN sponsored labor camps.

Do people really think that no one will notice this/let this happen? I mean, we had near real time info from IRAN after their election crackdown.

Everyone needs to relax with the wolf-crying, its becoming old hat.

I'm amazed these people, who claim to support the Constitution, could have such little understanding of how it works, and even lesser faith that it can survive one administration.

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:23:11pm

re: #74 JetBoyTerp

Yes, please do explain. After you do, we can talk about how New England is going to pound the Jets into the turf on their way to the Super Bowl.

ArchangelMichael Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:23:14pm

re: #83 SpaceJesus

that is funny. Social conservatives won't vote for Romney because he's Mormon, but they would make Beck emperor of their new nation in a heartbeat.

Because they are lunatics with a rabid case of cognitive dissonance.

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:23:19pm

Jeez. Maybe The People's Republic of Travis County can serve as the embassy site of the US for all the Wingnut Territories that decide to secede. We are the blue pimple down here...

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:23:27pm

Session is going nowhere. Not nearly enough people have the desire. Its propaganda at it's worst. All it can do is fire up the angry gullible .1%ers.

Our Precious Bodily Fluids Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:23:47pm

re: #31 Sharmuta

Yes- they seem to think healthcare reform is a brutal form of tyranny which can only be stopped with violent revolt. Stunning.

I've been hearing that "tyranny" word a lot lately. It's so far beyond embarrassing... Talk about your "Ugly American Syndrome", that's it right there. Born into the middle-class majority in the world's richest country, and from behind a computer connected to the Internet (think about that for a minute) they sit and freely broadcast to forums that can be read anywhere in the world (or at least anywhere that doesn't have censored internetz) that they are living in a tyranny.

Right now at my humble little job, I have co-workers who came here from Russia, China, El Salvador, Bulgaria, Cambodia, and Viet Nam (just off the top of my head). Most are over 30, and lived in 'the old country' during their respective Bad Old Days. The "tyranny" rhetoric is embarrassing to the bone.

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:24:03pm

re: #87 Racer X

Where would we be if no one complained about the original health care bill that Nancy and Harry proposed? I seem to recall many on both sides here proclaiming it was shit.

That's the way it's 'sposed to work.

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:24:18pm

re: #84 sphincter

Fair question.

There are things the government should do. There are limits.

Fighting in the streets is stupid as dog dirt, but giving open permission for elected officials to do as they will is no very bright.

You have a point. I still am disturbed by what I see our government doing. This administration and the last one as well.

We should certainly be vigilant, but to think that the new administration could undermine the fundamental structure of this country in less than a year is ridiculous.

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:24:41pm

re: #95 negativ

I'd give you a million updings for that if I could.

Sheila Broflovski Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:24:42pm

Flounce on aisle 48.

100

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:25:03pm

re: #95 negativ

I've been hearing that "tyranny" word a lot lately. It's so far beyond embarrassing... Talk about your "Ugly American Syndrome", that's it right there. Born into the middle-class majority in the world's richest country, and from behind a computer connected to the Internet (think about that for a minute) they sit and freely broadcast to forums that can be read anywhere in the world (or at least anywhere that doesn't have censored internetz) that they are living in a tyranny.

Right now at my humble little job, I have co-workers who came here from Russia, China, El Salvador, Bulgaria, Cambodia, and Viet Nam (just off the top of my head). Most are over 30, and lived in 'the old country' during their respective Bad Old Days. The "tyranny" rhetoric is embarrassing to the bone.

I regret that I have but one upding to give.

101

funky chicken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:25:20pm

re: #37 iceweasel

No faith in the election process? Just because your candidate didn't win? What is wrong with these people?
And as for that last sentence, I guess our scholar is unaware that even McCain ran on a platform promising health care reform. Morons.

Most of those folks refused to vote for McCain because he's too much of a "RINO" for them anyway.

102

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:25:49pm

re: #99 Alouette

Some are already gone, hit refresh

103

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:25:51pm

104

Reginald Perrin Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:26:25pm

re: #83 SpaceJesus

Your negative karma is now under 1000, I warned you that would happen if you went on a mission from Dog.
///

105

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:26:33pm

re: #101 funky chicken

Most of those folks refused to vote for McCain because he's too much of a "RINO" for them anyway.

I think they were the people who the selection of Palin was supposed to woo.

/having syntax difficulties, but you know what I mean I hope.

106

AHWilde Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:26:41pm

re: #56 Sharmuta
Appreciate the response but I would say it is one thing to be aware of it and another to wallow in it. Kind like spending a lot of time on YouPorn so you can keep up to date on how vile it all is.

107

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:27:21pm

108

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:27:32pm

109

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:27:35pm

re: #95 negativ

I've been hearing that "tyranny" word a lot lately. It's so far beyond embarrassing... Talk about your "Ugly American Syndrome", that's it right there. Born into the middle-class majority in the world's richest country, and from behind a computer connected to the Internet (think about that for a minute) they sit and freely broadcast to forums that can be read anywhere in the world (or at least anywhere that doesn't have censored internetz) that they are living in a tyranny.

Right now at my humble little job, I have co-workers who came here from Russia, China, El Salvador, Bulgaria, Cambodia, and Viet Nam (just off the top of my head). Most are over 30, and lived in 'the old country' during their respective Bad Old Days. The "tyranny" rhetoric is embarrassing to the bone.

Clarity! Well played!

110

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:27:37pm

Hey Evening Lizards!

Are the people in Nevada realizing their increased property values yet? Undeveloped Ocean Front Property is worth a lot! Or will the gubernet confiscate it to pay reparations to the Californian's that lost everything.

How are you-all?

111

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:27:42pm

112

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:27:48pm

I heard a question at the Tea Party. "How do we legally throw out this government?" The answer came as fast as it was sane-VOTE. Vote the %$#'s out and you can change America.
Right Answer. All the rest is BS. Let these guys jump up and yell and bitch. We now know who they are.

113

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:28:26pm

re: #104 Reginald Perrin

Your negative karma is now under 1000, I warned you that would happen if you went on a mission from Dog.
///

looks like I'll have to start defending Beck or something

114

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:28:38pm

re: #108 Thanos

I disagree, the evidence is there every single day. It's been pulled and posted here, and the supply seems to be unending. The site is crawling with loud unruly kooks, and a civil conversation or debate can't be had over there.

It's a black and white world over there.

115

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:28:41pm

re: #103 JetBoyTerp

Banning is one thing...complete censorship is another.

It's not censorship- it's moderation. There are plenty of other outlets for them to express their desire for armed revolt, but apparently this isn't seen as problematic for either Ed or AP.

116

EastSider Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:28:50pm

re: #90 Sharmuta

Its a document that has ~~survived~~ evolved (heh) for 200+ years, through wars hot, cold and civil, depressions deeper than the present, social changes [contextually] more jarring than what we're seeing now. But for these people who enjoy delusions of grandeur and apparitions of tyranny, this moment, this cause (ensuring healthcare for citizens (?) (!!)), is the biggest threat to a political fabric that has weathered time as well as passive and direct assaults.

...

I'd follow that up with an argument, but everyone that already "gets it" doesn't need to read it and anyone that doesn't get it wouldn't understand it anyway.

117

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:28:54pm

re: #95 negativ

I've been hearing that "tyranny" word a lot lately. It's so far beyond embarrassing... Talk about your "Ugly American Syndrome", that's it right there. Born into the middle-class majority in the world's richest country, and from behind a computer connected to the Internet (think about that for a minute) they sit and freely broadcast to forums that can be read anywhere in the world (or at least anywhere that doesn't have censored internetz) that they are living in a tyranny.

Right now at my humble little job, I have co-workers who came here from Russia, China, El Salvador, Bulgaria, Cambodia, and Viet Nam (just off the top of my head). Most are over 30, and lived in 'the old country' during their respective Bad Old Days. The "tyranny" rhetoric is embarrassing to the bone.

Amen. It is just like how Jonah Goldberg drained all of the meaning from "fascist" and various right wing talking heads are trying to change the meaning of "maoist/marxist/communist".

118

J.S. Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:28:58pm

Well, ya know, ya' all can come on up to Canada...as opposed to secedin' (just joking)...
/

119

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:29:08pm

re: #113 SpaceJesus

looks like I'll have to start defending Beck or something

did the Penguin send you?

120

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:30:04pm

re: #117 bratwurst

Amen. It is just like how Jonah Goldberg drained all of the meaning from "fascist" and various right wing talking heads are trying to change the meaning of "maoist/marxist/communist".

How did Jonah Goldberg do that. I've heard some bad things lately, but no specifics, about the book we all seemed to love a few months ago.

121

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:30:13pm

122

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:30:23pm

Let's face it jetTerp, you are infested with Beckloons over there.

123

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:30:34pm

Jet Boy Please see my 112.
Turn down the heat on the armed stuff and maybe this can be discussed.

124

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:30:35pm

re: #106 AHWilde

Exposing it is hardly wallowing in it.

125

Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:30:40pm

Because the answer to reforming government is to plunge the country into revolution and civil war. Because things will instantly be sooo much better then!

Ye gods, these people are complete loons.

Wake up morons, even the left eventually figured out that change had to come from within the system. You sound just like the hippies in the late 60's did, but at least they had the drugs they took to blame as an excuse later.

126

Charles Johnson Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:30:43pm

Huh? Wha?

127

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:30:58pm

re: #106 AHWilde

Charles just banned this one. Given that he was banned before he cloud flounce, we'll withhold the Flounceapult and grill this troll instead. I'll get the charcoal going. Gamey Buttocks will be served in 35 minutes. As always, I welcome any drink and side dish orders.

128

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:31:02pm

re: #120 ggt

How did Jonah Goldberg do that. I've heard some bad things lately, but no specifics, about the book we all seemed to love a few months ago.

I never loved it one bit...along with the vast majority of critics.

129

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:31:06pm

Stinky already got them.

130

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:31:19pm

re: #122 Thanos

Let's face it jetTerp, you are infested with Beckloons over there.

And Governor Rick Perry, apparently!

Wheee!!!

131

ArchangelMichael Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:32:02pm

The government does not run any of these forums on the internet. Moderation is not censorship. All these self-proclaimed lovers of the Constitution should know the damn difference.

132

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:32:07pm

re: #127 Dark_Falcon

Charles just banned this one. Given that he was banned before he cloud flounce, we'll withhold the Flounceapult and grill this troll instead. I'll get the charcoal going. Gamey Buttocks will be served in 35 minutes. As always, I welcome any drink and side dish orders.

I want fresh coffee with cream and sugar and those green bean dishes with the slivered almonds.

133

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:32:08pm

I'll volunteer my 123 for deletion.

134

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:32:20pm

Charles "Terp" sounds familiar, just saying.

135

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:32:29pm

re: #128 bratwurst

I never loved it one bit...along with the vast majority of critics.

Why?

136

Athens Runaway Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:32:50pm

From what basically is the most knowledge person on the topic of fascism:

It will be seen that, as used, the word ‘Fascism’ is almost entirely meaningless. In conversation, of course, it is used even more wildly than in print. I have heard it applied to farmers, shopkeepers, Social Credit, corporal punishment, fox-hunting, bull-fighting, the 1922 Committee, the 1941 Committee, Kipling, Gandhi, Chiang Kai-Shek, homosexuality, Priestley's broadcasts, Youth Hostels, astrology, women, dogs and I do not know what else.

My standard-issue Troll Hammer whenever people start using the word "fascist."

137

Walter L. Newton Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:33:03pm

OT - we are going to die - 18-24 inches of snow predicted between midnight tonight and 9am Thursday morning - winter storm warning - possible power outages up here - fun - thank goodness I don't have to be anywhere downhill until noon on Fri.

Now back to our...

138

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:33:24pm

re: #18 SpaceJesus

in my opinion, we should be encouraging extreme crazy rightwingers to secede. it may be the only way to get them out of our country.

let them go peacefully. let them have north dakota or samoa.

Well, thank goodness you're picking on somebody other than "the South" for a change.

139

Killgore Trout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:33:25pm

re: #134 Thanos

Wasn't there a Terp Mole?

140

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:33:41pm

re: #120 ggt

How did Jonah Goldberg do that. I've heard some bad things lately, but no specifics, about the book we all seemed to love a few months ago.

"we all seemed to love" ?

Speak for yourself.

141

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:33:45pm

re: #139 Killgore Trout

Wasn't there a Terp Mole?

yep

142

ArchangelMichael Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:33:50pm

re: #134 Thanos

Charles "Terp" sounds familiar, just saying.

From one of those Rob Schneider movie trailers in the "Biggest Douche in the Universe" episode of South Park?

143

wiffersnapper Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:34:11pm

They've succeeded in seceding their brains from oxygen.

144

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:34:13pm

re: #136 Athens Runaway

From what basically is the most knowledge person on the topic of fascism:

My standard-issue Troll Hammer whenever people start using the word "fascist."

Yep, Orwell's essay is probably the best I've read on the subject. We had quite a few in depth conversations here a while back about it. Mostly, I remember Orwell.

145

b_sharp Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:34:13pm

My god! It's full of idiots!

146

J.S. Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:34:18pm

I figured that after the Bush election (circa 2004?) that there'd be some sort of mass exodus of Democrats up into Canada...May I just express my sincere disappointment that that exodus never did occur...

147

Charles Johnson Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:34:20pm

re: #134 Thanos

Charles "Terp" sounds familiar, just saying.

Gotcha. 10-4. Copy that.

148

wiffersnapper Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:34:38pm

re: #142 ArchangelMichael

Derp-da-derp-da-tiddlie-derpdie-dum

149

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:35:44pm

re: #145 b_sharp

2001 reference?

150

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:36:03pm

re: #125 ausador

Because the answer to reforming government is to plunge the country into revolution and civil war. Because things will instantly be sooo much better then!

Ye gods, these people are complete loons.

Wake up morons, even the left eventually figured out that change had to come from within the system. You sound just like the hippies in the late 60's did, but at least they had the drugs they took to blame as an excuse later.

Youtube Video

151

Athens Runaway Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:36:12pm

re: #149 Decatur Deb

2001 reference?

Not at all.

152

lawhawk Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:36:31pm

re: #137 Walter L. Newton

If you're a skier, those are numbers that are music to your ears. Alas, I'm in no position to take advantage of 'em.

153

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:37:37pm

Good thing those air heads are all worked up for a revolution.

Lieberman: I'd Filibuster Final Bill Over Public Option

Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-CT) told reporters today that he would in fact filibuster any health care bill he doesn't agree with--and right now, he doesn't agree with the proposal making its way through the Senate.

We wouldn't want to put any faith in the Constitution, now would we?

154

Our Precious Bodily Fluids Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:38:31pm

re: #34 EastSider

Wow. This is just a basic misunderstanding of representative government.

Also, many of these secessionist states would be losing money by leaving the federal government.

[Link: www.infoplease.com...]

Also, I'd wonder how Texans (an oft cited state above) would react if they somehow succeeded in a peaceful secession and NASA, US Military bases, the Federal reserve and any other federal institutions picked up shop and left.

If only we had some example from American history to give us some idea what it might look like if real, no-shit secession was actually attempted. It would be interesting to see what might happen, given that there would surely be deep divisions, even within the secessionist states, possibly even bifurcating cities, towns, and even individual families.

Why, I bet everything would go smooth as silk. The Rick Perryites would have a little secession parade, chanting "nyah nyah neenya nyah!" and the Feds would be all, "aww, rats. They sure showed us!".

I bet there wouldn't be carnage and brother-vs-brother tragedy on an epic scale. I bet Al Qaeda would totally use that period of chaos to just sit back and enjoy Miller Time, and would respectfully not try to add to the confusion. Other countries with real military, economic, and/or political stakes in the ultimate fate of the US would just sit back and not become involved at all. Russia, China, the EU, Japan, the Koreas... they'd just be all, "whoa dude, we're just gonna sit over here and play Guitar Hero and totally not start fucking around in your business and then start fucking around with each other. It's just not worth our time. What happens to you is your business, and doesn't affect us at all. Seriously!"

155

Bloodnok Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:38:48pm

re: #152 lawhawk

If you're a skier, those are numbers that are music to your ears. Alas, I'm in no position to take advantage of 'em.

And if you're either Jack Nicholson, Scatman Crothers or Shelley Duvall...well let's just say it might be a good idea to get off the mountain.

156

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:39:36pm

re: #153 Sharmuta

Ironic-I think the "Reconciliation" process will overcome all that. This bill is coming through one way or the other. Wonks call it the nuclear option of procedures. Funny again considering our previous topic.

157

simoom Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:39:40pm

re: #48 JetBoyTerp

Based on the open discussion of violent revolution and succession, the paranoid NWO fantasies that are traded, the near constant use of Hitler/Mao/Stalin/slavery in ridiculous metaphors for the Administration, the tolerance of birthers, the fierce misogyny directed at women who aren't within the fold - what exactly is the line you have to cross to receive moderation? The only bit of it I've seen is some curtailing, after months and months, of the nasty racial slurs that were continually being directed at the First Lady.

(Oops, just did a refresh and I see that he's flounced. I'll post this anyway with the his quote removed.)

158

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:40:29pm

re: #135 ggt

Why?

Eh, just a thing against historical revisionism. Your mileage may vary.

159

Walter L. Newton Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:40:30pm

re: #152 lawhawk

If you're a skier, those are numbers that are music to your ears. Alas, I'm in no position to take advantage of 'em.

Taint' music to my ears. Sunday night we had a foretaste of this storm that is coming in tonight. We had 4 inches and ice and snow packed roads for 23 miles up into the mountains. It was the first time in my life I went UP during a Colorado snow storm in 20 years (since I just moved up hill in July). I've done a lot of snow driving in my 56 years, but this was special.

So, I busted my Colorado Rocky Mountain Snow Cherry, but I'm not looking forward to driving on this stuff if I don't have to.

Not fun.

160

Walter L. Newton Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:41:09pm

re: #155 Bloodnok

And if you're either Jack Nicholson, Scatman Crothers or Shelley Duvall...well let's just say it might be a good idea to get off the mountain.

I can't, I live up on the mountain, at 8200 feet.

161

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:41:12pm

re: #151 Athens Runaway

Youtube Video

162

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:41:35pm

re: #135 ggt

Why?

Because fascism was always a phenomenon of the right. Authoritarianism exists on the right and the left, but fascism is a right-wing phenomenon. The most succinct review of Goldberg's book I've seen was this: "Liberal Fascism: Two Words Next to Each Other."

More seriously, Goldberg essentially made up a definition of fascism and disregarded all evidence that got in the way of his 'thesis', such as it was: Liberals are just like Hitler! It's historical revisionism written with the sole intent of smearing the left. The fact that Jonah Goldberg, of all people, is considered some sort of intellectual or scholar on the right is the best possible indicator of just how much trouble the conservative movement is in now.

Here is a good review of the Goldberg book that keeps the snark in check and explains some of its problems.

And here is Jonah's idea of scholarship: ask readers to do it for him, get pissy and refuse help from actual scholar because it gets in the way of the conclusion he's already decided he intended to draw.

It is a bad and dishonest book, and Jonah is a hack.

163

Almost Killed by Space Hookers Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:41:58pm

Well, let's see here, these idiots think that the government is somehow Maoist and the answer is to openly root for treason.

Of course their new Confederacy of America will have what for a government?

A Theocracy? A race based theocracy perhaps? No Darwin in schools! People who disagree (i.e. all the sane Americans in those states) will be what? Shot as traitors?

Eventually, this talk will lead to violence. When it does happen, I hope that sentences are swift and severe. I hope that it is sufficiently so that these yahoos think twice.

I have little patience for treason.

164

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:42:44pm

re: #157 simoom

Based on the open discussion of violent revolution and succession, the paranoid NWO fantasies that are traded, the near constant use of Hitler/Mao/Stalin/slavery in ridiculous metaphors for the Administration, the tolerance of birthers, the fierce misogyny directed at women who aren't within the fold - what exactly is the line you have to cross to receive moderation? The only bit of it I've seen is some curtailing, after months and months, of the nasty racial slurs that were continually being directed at the First Lady.

(Oops, just did a refresh and I see that he's flounced. I'll post this anyway with the his quote removed.)

He hasn't flounced. Charles booted him. From what Thanos says, it seems that Terp may have been a sockpuppet.

165

Almost Killed by Space Hookers Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:42:49pm

re: #162 iceweasel

Jonah is a complete waste of flesh. He always was.

166

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:43:04pm

re: #163 LudwigVanQuixote

Witness Tim McVeigh and his co conspirators.

167

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:43:25pm

FoxNews' Major Garret twitters:

Lieberman aide tells Fox's Trish Turner senator will not vote to break filibuster if Reid public option is in HC bill.
about 8 hours ago from web

More Bayh: If Public Option raises deficit: "I would have just a very hard time moving forward on something like that."
about 8 hours ago from web

Dem Sen. Evan Bayh tells Fox he's uncommitted on Reid Public Option. "There are a variety of things that I think might work better"
about 8 hours ago from web

Sen. Olympia Snowe tells Fox's Trish Turner "at this point" she's a no on Reid Public Option. Says gambit "sends a terrible message."
about 8 hours ago from web

168

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:43:41pm

re: #163 LudwigVanQuixote

(snip)
Of course their new Confederacy of America will have what for a government?

(snip).

101 Airborne.

169

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:43:51pm

re: #162 iceweasel

It's almost like a book from the pop-psychology section of a bookstore. Although in this case it's actually pop-political-science. I don't think it even qualifies as pop-history.

170

Almost Killed by Space Hookers Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:44:32pm

re: #168 Decatur Deb

101 Airborne.

Amen and pass the ammo!

171

drool Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:44:34pm

I wonder if all those states that opt out of government provided medical insurance will elect to opt out of "public option" flood insurance too. You hear that Bobby Jindal, Haley Barbour, and Rick Perry?

172

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:44:50pm

I dislike the Obama administration for other reasons:

Tax Cheats
Higher Taxes (for the rest of us)
Deficit
National Debt
Lack of Planning

Amongst others.

173

J.S. Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:44:55pm

re: #137 Walter L. Newton

OT (in Canada, the big, big worries of remote northern communities isn't winter, and it isn't summer -- it's the Spring and Fall that's "the problem"...in the the Summer communities are accessible by boat, and in the Winter, accessible by ice roads...but neither is the case during Spring break-up (cant' use the lakes/rivers, no boats) or in the Fall prior to Freeze-up (no ice roads over the frozen lakes/rivers)...Hence, in Spring and Fall the communities are totally isolated and cut off...)

174

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:45:20pm

re: #168 Decatur Deb

A batalion of 101 Airborne reenactors.

FTFY

175

Almost Killed by Space Hookers Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:45:29pm

re: #171 drool

I wonder if all those states that opt out of government provided medical insurance will elect to opt out of "public option" flood insurance too. You hear that Bobby Jindal, Haley Barbour, and Rick Perry?

Well said.

176

EastSider Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:45:35pm

re: #154 negativ

Sir I vehemently disagree with you. I think that any attempt at a possible secession would necessitate a complex, long term, costly, bloody conflict that would have several of the following consequences:

-Millions dead
-Destruction of American economy
-Rise of China (Communists anyone) as the only global superpower
-Hundreds of "lost" nuclear weapons
-Armed militias imposing their will in more remote regions
-Starvation
-An absence of Super Bowls
-Ice Hockey in Atlanta, Carolina, Phoenix, and Nashville
-The ultimate dest--

What? oh...sarcasm, right. Throw a tag up next time!

177

MittDoesNotCompute Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:45:46pm

re: #29 SanFranciscoZionist

When they write to one another, they see Minutemen, American patriots, the cast of entire Mel Gibson films. Plus Red Dawn.

When I read their writings, I see stupid, self-indulgent people.

Wolverines!!!

///

178

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:46:17pm

re: #163 LudwigVanQuixote

Well, let's see here, these idiots think that the government is somehow Maoist and the answer is to openly root for treason.

Of course their new Confederacy of America will have what for a government?

A Theocracy? A race based theocracy perhaps? No Darwin in schools! People who disagree (i.e. all the sane Americans in those states) will be what? Shot as traitors?

Eventually, this talk will lead to violence. When it does happen, I hope that sentences are swift and severe. I hope that it is sufficiently so that these yahoos think twice.

I have little patience for treason.

The problem is that these nuts have some among them who are fairly skilled in violence. They might well do a fair bit of damage before they go down swinging. We need to look for a way to deal with them without large-scale violence.

179

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:46:52pm

If violence breaks out it will be small cells. We will see no popular support for this, no more than Bill Ayers crew or Tim McVeigh. Or John Wilkes Booth. He was shocked he had offended his fellow Southerners with his cowardly back of the head shot. But day to day I still fear MS13 or the Mexican drug gangs violence far more than these guys. Hot Air is aptly named.

180

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:47:19pm

re: #172 Racer X

I dislike the Obama administration for other reasons:

Tax Cheats
Higher Taxes (for the rest of us)
Deficit
National Debt
Lack of Planning

Amongst others.

Quite Concur.

181

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:47:24pm

re: #163 LudwigVanQuixote

Well, let's see here, these idiots think that the government is somehow Maoist and the answer is to openly root for treason.

Of course with their new Confederacy of Dunces America will have what for a government?

A Theocracy? A race based theocracy perhaps? No Darwin in schools! People who disagree (i.e. all the sane Americans in those states) will be what? Shot as traitors?

Eventually, this talk will lead to violence. When it does happen, I hope that sentences are swift and severe. I hope that it is sufficiently so that these yahoos think twice.

I have little patience for treason.

Is that better?

182

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:47:31pm

re: #174 Gus 802

FTFY

No, the real thing, about a week into the rebellion.

183

MittDoesNotCompute Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:47:52pm

re: #33 negativ

You remember Antwan Rockamora? Half-black, half-Samoan, used to call him 'Tony Rocky Horror'?

Upding for the Pulp Fiction reference...

184

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:48:01pm

re: #168 Decatur Deb

101 Airborne.

Yeah. The 101st Chairborne. The Fightin' Keyboard Kommandos. The Screen Berets.

(Unfortunately, some of the people spouting those violent sentiments are likely to be the same ones hoarding ammo and guns. I'd be a lot happier if I could believe all of them would never leave mom's basement.)

185

Sheila Broflovski Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:48:28pm

re: #102 Thanos

Some are already gone, hit refresh

Wow, I did, now the thread looks like Swiss cheese.

186

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:48:28pm

Interesting that it's Democrats saving us from the petite-tyrants in the Senate...

187

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:48:39pm

re: #184 iceweasel

Yeah. The 101st Chairborne. The Fightin' Keyboard Kommandos. The Screen Berets.

(Unfortunately, some of the people spouting those violent sentiments are likely to be the same ones hoarding ammo and guns. I'd be a lot happier if I could believe all of them would never leave mom's basement.)

The Screen Berets!

Did you come up with that? Love it.

188

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:48:45pm

re: #176 EastSider

Sir I vehemently disagree with you. I think that any attempt at a possible secession would necessitate a complex, long term, costly, bloody conflict that would have several of the following consequences:

-Millions dead
-Destruction of American economy
-Rise of China (Communists anyone) as the only global superpower
-Hundreds of "lost" nuclear weapons
-Armed militias imposing their will in more remote regions
-Starvation
-An absence of Super Bowls
-Ice Hockey in Atlanta, Carolina, Phoenix, and Nashville
-The ultimate dest--

What? oh...sarcasm, right. Throw a tag up next time!

You just don't get it. What do any of those things mean in light of the government forcing healthcare on all of us?! How can we enjoy the Super Bowl when we're being oppressed to this degree? Starvation will be next to nothing compared to the tyranny of Americans getting medical treatment, you cold hearted Commie, you!!1

189

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:49:33pm

re: #178 Dark_Falcon

We have our police our FBI, and we have each other. Lots of us are trained up too. Yes a few military guys might fall in with these fools. But every other current and ex military man and woman will step up to the right thing. Seriously the adrenaline is thickening to no need.

190

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:50:20pm

re: #169 Gus 802

It's almost like a book from the pop-psychology section of a bookstore. Although in this case it's actually pop-political-science. I don't think it even qualifies as pop-history.

Yes, it's some kind of bizarre fantasy. It's pretty clear just from the subtitle:
Liberal Fascism: The Secret History of the American Left, from Mussolini to the Politics of Meaning.

Mussolini? Not American. Duh.

191

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:50:23pm

re: #185 Alouette

Wow, I did, now the thread looks like Swiss cheese.

Well it wouldn't if lizards who know better didn't quote comments they know are going to get deleted...

192

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:50:32pm

re: #184 iceweasel

I'm going to use some of those!

193

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:50:36pm

re: #162 iceweasel

Because fascism was always a phenomenon of the right. Authoritarianism exists on the right and the left, but fascism is a right-wing phenomenon. The most succinct review of Goldberg's book I've seen was this: "Liberal Fascism: Two Words Next to Each Other."

More seriously, Goldberg essentially made up a definition of fascism and disregarded all evidence that got in the way of his 'thesis', such as it was: Liberals are just like Hitler! It's historical revisionism written with the sole intent of smearing the left. The fact that Jonah Goldberg, of all people, is considered some sort of intellectual or scholar on the right is the best possible indicator of just how much trouble the conservative movement is in now.

Here is a good review of the Goldberg book that keeps the snark in check and explains some of its problems.

And here is Jonah's idea of scholarship: ask readers to do it for him, get pissy and refuse help from actual scholar because it gets in the way of the conclusion he's already decided he intended to draw.

It is a bad and dishonest book, and Jonah is a hack.

All I remember is that when the Book Category of the Spin-offs opened-up, I was given the honor of posting the first book. I chose Liberal Fascism because we had been discussing it for a long time and people were recommending it. I got 18 updings for it. I think it was posted again, and again, way back when.

Fascism hasn't really been a topic for me lately, so I was just wondering when and why the change towards this book?

194

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:50:45pm

re: #184 iceweasel

Yeah. The 101st Chairborne. The Fightin' Keyboard Kommandos. The Screen Berets.

(Unfortunately, some of the people spouting those violent sentiments are likely to be the same ones hoarding ammo and guns. I'd be a lot happier if I could believe all of them would never leave mom's basement.)

You read me wrong. The real 101st would be a likely support for the
Re-Reconstrution. Price of being cryptic.

195

Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:50:45pm

I may be guilty of generalizing here but mostly this craziness seems to be an affliction suffered mainly by down-at-the-heel men with too many guns and a surfeit of brains. They have taken it upon themselves to appropriate the name of militias as renowned in American history, but are not quite bright enough to embrace the actual ideal.

196

MittDoesNotCompute Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:51:00pm

re: #46 SanFranciscoZionist

Uh, no. I assume from the festive name that he was a wrestler or something?

Isn't the Rock part Samoan?

He is indeed...

197

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:51:17pm

re: #184 iceweasel

Yeah. The 101st Chairborne. The Fightin' Keyboard Kommandos. The Screen Berets.

(Unfortunately, some of the people spouting those violent sentiments are likely to be the same ones hoarding ammo and guns. I'd be a lot happier if I could believe all of them would never leave mom's basement.)

Fighting commentators, from the basement
Whiney men who type and drink
Men who mean just what they type
The brave men of the Screen Beret

...

198

MittDoesNotCompute Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:52:01pm

re: #183 talon_262

Apparently, I am mistaken...

199

The Sanity Inspector Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:52:14pm

In 2004, libtards threatened to move to Canada. In 2009, neoconfederates threaten to secede. Does the principle of convergent evolution apply here?

200

J.S. Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:52:21pm

re: #197 Gus 802

that's hilarious...

201

Almost Killed by Space Hookers Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:52:47pm

re: #174 Gus 802

A batalion of 101 Airborne reenactors.

FTFY

LOL.

Actually, I am going to paraphrase the great Carlin...

Imagine we clear out one of the big square states like Montana.

Imagine we put all of the Klansmen, Neo Nazis and Neo confederate types on the east side of the state. Let them bring their guns...

We will tell them they can shoot all the people they want.

On the West side of the state we put all the gang bangers, thugs and other sorts of angry urban types. Let them bring their guns.

Throw in all the convicted serial killers and pedophiles. Put them in the center of the state.

Drop regular supplies of food and ammo so that these people can "communicate" with each other.

Use the army to seal off the state.

Put it all on pay per view.

Make billions.

Solve multiple problems in one stroke.

Best of all, everyone gets what they want out of it, even the people we sent on vacation.

202

J.S. Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:53:09pm

re: #199 The Sanity Inspector

Well, now, I say, come on up!
/

203

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:53:19pm

re: #197 Gus 802

It's funny how their vision of what a hero is has changed. Now their heros are whiney petulant old men who rant into AM microphones and cry on camera.

204

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:53:38pm

re: #193 ggt

All I remember is that when the Book Category of the Spin-offs opened-up, I was given the honor of posting the first book. I chose Liberal Fascism because we had been discussing it for a long time and people were recommending it. I got 18 updings for it. I think it was posted again, and again, way back when.

Fascism hasn't really been a topic for me lately, so I was just wondering when and why the change towards this book?

I couldn't tell you that, because I'm one of the people who was mocking it all along, long before I registered here. It's been a target of universal derision on the left side of the blogosphere, and even some of the more reasonable conservative reviewers tried to diplomatically point out that Goldberg had completely ignored the established definitions of fascism (notoriously hard to define, but Robert O Paxton's def is taken to be central).

205

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:54:59pm

re: #203 Thanos

It's funny how their vision of what a hero is has changed. Now their heros are whiney petulant old men who rant into AM microphones and cry on camera.

Daily. 24/7. It's not too hard to notice that sites like Hot Air are 100% negative. I'm pretty sure this has an effect on the physiology and psychology of its members.

206

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:55:15pm

re: #187 Gus 802

The Screen Berets!

Did you come up with that? Love it.

Ever noticed how anyone with Sarge or Sgt or whatever in their nick is ALWAYS bad news?

207

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:55:17pm

re: #201 LudwigVanQuixote

LOL.

Actually, I am going to paraphrase the great Carlin...

Imagine we clear out one of the big square states like Montana.

Imagine we put all of the Klansmen, Neo Nazis and Neo confederate types on the east side of the state. Let them bring their guns...

We will tell them they can shoot all the people they want.

On the West side of the state we put all the gang bangers, thugs and other sorts of angry urban types. Let them bring their guns.

Throw in all the convicted serial killers and pedophiles. Put them in the center of the state.

Drop regular supplies of food and ammo so that these people can "communicate" with each other.

Use the army to seal off the state.

Put it all on pay per view.

Make billions.

Solve multiple problems in one stroke.

Best of all, everyone gets what they want out of it, even the people we sent on vacation.

Works for me.

208

Almost Killed by Space Hookers Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:55:29pm

re: #178 Dark_Falcon

The problem is that these nuts have some among them who are fairly skilled in violence. They might well do a fair bit of damage before they go down swinging. We need to look for a way to deal with them without large-scale violence.

If it comes to large scale violence it is way way too late. No I am talking about the asshole who will do something like assassinate someone or blow up a building. Put him up on national display and then have the FBI and everyone else shake down every group they are associated with.

Little shits like RSM will go down by being associated with the trash.

Actually, we are one nutball assassination attempt or terror incident away from having a whole lot of angry fingers pointed at the GOP as it is.

209

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:55:55pm

re: #206 Jimmah

Ever noticed how anyone with Sarge or Sgt or whatever in their nick is ALWAYS bad news?

Yes. And if you "dare" argue with them they fall back and hide behind their alleged "sarge" status.

210

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:56:02pm

re: #192 Rightwingconspirator

I'm going to use some of those!

Please do!

re: #197 Gus 802

Fighting commentators, from the basement
Whiney men who type and drink
Men who mean just what they type
The brave men of the Screen Beret

...

god that's hilarious. Love it!

211

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:56:04pm

re: #206 Jimmah

Ever noticed how anyone with Sarge or Sgt or whatever in their nick is ALWAYS bad news?

No, not always.

212

CyanSnowHawk Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:56:46pm

re: #171 drool

I wonder if all those states that opt out of government provided medical insurance will elect to opt out of "public option" flood insurance too. You hear that Bobby Jindal, Haley Barbour, and Rick Perry?

Bad comparison. Gov't flood insurance is an expensive option of last resort for people living in places, like flood plains, that no insurance company that wants to stay in business will cover. Kind of like earthquake insurance out here in CA. There is also the business about not being required by law to purchase flood or earthquake insurance.

213

Walter L. Newton Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:57:21pm

OT - but peaceful...

Here's what I woke up to this past Monday morning...

Image: winter_oct_2009.JPG

214

J.S. Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:57:47pm

Just deport the secessionists to Canada, ok? problem solved.
/

215

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:58:12pm

re: #197 Gus 802

They have their own ballad:

The Ballad of the Screen Berets

Fighting soldiers from the sky
(That's if you believe their lies)
Men who claim to be what they say
But they are just Screen Berets

Chicken wing sauce on their chests
Covering their big man-breasts
One lying man will test today
If folks believe the Screen Beret

Trained to live off Mom and Dad
A paying job not to be had
Men who lie, both night and day
Telling tales of the Screen Berets

Chicken wing sauce on their chests
Covering their big man-breasts
One lying man will test today
If folks believe the Screen Beret

Spouting lies, giving not an inch
In their praise of Kucinich
Hoping for Innaugural Day
When the Dems will praise the Screen Berets

Chicken wing sauce on their chests
Covering their big man-breasts
Afraid of folks who will all day
Expose the lies of the Screen Berets.

216

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:58:50pm

re: #201 LudwigVanQuixote

LOL.

Actually, I am going to paraphrase the great Carlin...

Imagine we clear out one of the big square states like Montana.

Imagine we put all of the Klansmen, Neo Nazis and Neo confederate types on the east side of the state. Let them bring their guns...

We will tell them they can shoot all the people they want.

On the West side of the state we put all the gang bangers, thugs and other sorts of angry urban types. Let them bring their guns.

Throw in all the convicted serial killers and pedophiles. Put them in the center of the state.

Drop regular supplies of food and ammo so that these people can "communicate" with each other.

Use the army to seal off the state.

Put it all on pay per view.

Make billions.

Solve multiple problems in one stroke.

Best of all, everyone gets what they want out of it, even the people we sent on vacation.

Heh. Sounds like Heinlein's "Coventry".

217

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:59:21pm

re: #213 Walter L. Newton

OT - but peaceful...

Here's what I woke up to this past Monday morning...

[Link: newton.acrossthebow.com...]

Gorgeous. We got our first snow today in Utah. It didn't stick but more's on the way!!

218

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:59:38pm

re: #204 iceweasel

I couldn't tell you that, because I'm one of the people who was mocking it all along, long before I registered here. It's been a target of universal derision on the left side of the blogosphere, and even some of the more reasonable conservative reviewers tried to diplomatically point out that Goldberg had completely ignored the established definitions of fascism (notoriously hard to define, but Robert O Paxton's def is taken to be central).

Agreed. I suspect most of the Goldberg enthusiasts have flounced by now. LGF is an anti- idiotarian site; the suggestion that Hitler was a lefty is idiotarian in the extreme.

219

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 6:59:59pm

re: #209 Gus 802

Is Sargent Jared Monti bad news? Are some of the people who happen to be Sargents at Blackfive and other blogs bad news?

[Link: www.history.army.mil...]

220

Almost Killed by Space Hookers Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:00:12pm

re: #216 austin_blue

Heh. Sounds like Heinlein's "Coventry".

We could throw in a nuke, and go Salusa Secundus over it. In a few generations, we'd have Sardukar :)

221

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:00:21pm

re: #211 Thanos

No, not always.

OK, maybe not always. It did however seem like a trend here at one point.

222

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:00:21pm

re: #194 Decatur Deb

You read me wrong. The real 101st would be a likely support for the
Re-Reconstrution. Price of being cryptic.

HOOAH!

I've a lot of friends who are Screaming Eagles and I back your assessment 100 per cent.

223

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:00:23pm

re: #215 Sharmuta

They have their own ballad:

The Ballad of the Screen Berets

Fighting soldiers from the sky
(That's if you believe their lies)
Men who claim to be what they say
But they are just Screen Berets

Chicken wing sauce on their chests
Covering their big man-breasts
One lying man will test today
If folks believe the Screen Beret

Trained to live off Mom and Dad
A paying job not to be had
Men who lie, both night and day
Telling tales of the Screen Berets

Chicken wing sauce on their chests
Covering their big man-breasts
One lying man will test today
If folks believe the Screen Beret

Spouting lies, giving not an inch
In their praise of Kucinich
Hoping for Innaugural Day
When the Dems will praise the Screen Berets

Chicken wing sauce on their chests
Covering their big man-breasts
Afraid of folks who will all day
Expose the lies of the Screen Berets.

Bubbette, those ain't Dems...

224

Walter L. Newton Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:00:29pm

re: #217 bosforus

Gorgeous. We got our first snow today in Utah. It didn't stick but more's on the way!!

We have 18-24 inches on the way between midnight tonight and 9:00am Thursday morning. I'm not going to be able to leave the house.

225

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:00:34pm

Quit with the ingroup outgroup stereotypes please.

226

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:00:40pm

re: #215 Sharmuta

That's going to need rewriting, I think.

227

ArchangelMichael Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:01:06pm

re: #162 iceweasel

Thats why left and right or conservative and liberal alone are worthless labels.

228

Walter L. Newton Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:01:23pm

re: #225 Thanos

Quit with the ingroup outgroup stereotypes please.

What are you talking about?

229

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:01:27pm

re: #218 Jimmah

Agreed. I suspect most of the Goldberg enthusiasts have flounced by now. LGF is an anti- idiotarian site; the suggestion that Hitler was a lefty is idiotarian in the extreme.

ah!

230

funky chicken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:01:35pm

re: #186 Thanos

Interesting that it's Democrats saving us from the petite-tyrants in the Senate...

/

I said after the election that everything would come down to the Blue Dog democrats. They will stand against the worst of the crazy and keep the liberals from overreaching too badly, hopefully.

I may vote for them myself, not that it will matter much here in Oklahoma.

231

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:01:44pm

re: #223 austin_blue

Bubbette, those ain't Dems...

Exactly. Time for a rewrite.

232

The Shadow Do Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:01:52pm

I'm pretty sure the juveniles posting at HA understand secession perfectly, "Mom, I will not eat my green beans and you can't make me!".

233

Almost Killed by Space Hookers Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:02:18pm

re: #215 Sharmuta

Brilliant...

Here is one of them caught on camera.

Youtube Video

234

Walter L. Newton Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:02:35pm

re: #218 Jimmah

Agreed. I suspect most of the Goldberg enthusiasts have flounced by now. LGF is an anti- idiotarian site; the suggestion that Hitler was a lefty is idiotarian in the extreme.

But I fell for some of that Goldberg stuff, until Ludwig pointed some things out to me and I did some research.

235

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:02:39pm

re: #219 Thanos

Is Sargent Jared Monti bad news? Are some of the people who happen to be Sargents at Blackfive and other blogs bad news?

[Link: www.history.army.mil...]

And let's not forget this guy!

Image: sergeant-slaughter.jpg
/

236

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:02:49pm

re: #220 LudwigVanQuixote

We could throw in a nuke, and go Salusa Secundus over it. In a few generations, we'd have Sardukar :)

And you noticed how well that worked out in the long run...

(Wow. We are now quoting obscure speculative fiction to make points. Hmmm...)

237

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:03:12pm

re: #209 Gus 802

Yes. And if you "dare" argue with them they fall back and hide behind their alleged "sarge" status.

Yep - the attempt to personify themselves with untouchable attributes of 'Americaness'. "Why do you hate America - you who dare to disagree with me?"

238

Almost Killed by Space Hookers Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:03:30pm

re: #223 austin_blue

Bubbette, those ain't Dems...

Ohh I missed that part... Yeah sorry Sharm, those really aren't dems.

The violent Dem fringe is vegan - and thin, and hates the military, and guns in general.

239

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:03:46pm

re: #234 Walter L. Newton

But I fell for some of that Goldberg stuff, until Ludwig pointed some things out to me and I did some research.

I'm not sure I remember much of it at all --a bit about Hillary Clinton and the early progressives.

I concluded that fascism is in the eye of the beholder.

240

J.S. Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:03:58pm

re: #224 Walter L. Newton

(look on the bright side, Walter. Your isolation will be for approx 24-48 hours, as opposed to isolated northern Canadian Communities of 6 to 8 weeks of isolation.)

241

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:04:05pm

re: #238 LudwigVanQuixote

Ohh I missed that part... Yeah sorry Sharm, those really aren't dems.

The violent Dem fringe is vegan - and thin, and hates the military, and guns in general.

don't hate bombs tho.

242

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:04:31pm

re: #237 Jimmah

Yep - the attempt to personify themselves with untouchable attributes of 'Americaness'. "Why do you hate America - you who dare to disagree with me?"

Why do those antiwar libs hate America so? Not like me. I love America so much I'm calling for a civil war and secession.

/typical hotair commenter and screen beret.

243

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:04:34pm

re: #238 LudwigVanQuixote

Ohh I missed that part... Yeah sorry Sharm, those really aren't dems.

The violent Dem fringe is vegan - and thin, and hates the military, and guns in general.

Perhaps a non-partisan re-write would be best since this isn't confined to one side.

244

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:04:48pm

re: #238 LudwigVanQuixote

Ohh I missed that part... Yeah sorry Sharm, those really aren't dems.

The violent Dem fringe is vegan - and thin, and hates the military, and guns in general.

I love the "unarmed lib" theme--gives a real tactical advantage.

245

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:04:51pm

BTW, the 101st Airborne Division (Air Assault) soldiers do not wear the green beret. That distinctive cover is worn by members of Special Forces.

(I know...I know...I'm likely preaching to the choir but, I just had to say something.)

246

funky chicken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:05:22pm

re: #214 J.S.

Just deport the secessionists to Canada, ok? problem solved.
/

They might enjoy Quebec, right?

247

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:05:55pm

re: #245 MandyManners

Accuracy ding.

248

J.S. Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:06:24pm

re: #246 funky chicken

Oooh, c'est vrai! and they'd just looove the poutine...

249

soxfan4life Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:06:26pm

re: #245 MandyManners

BTW, the 101st Airborne Division (Air Assault) soldiers do not wear the green beret. That distinctive cover is worn by members of Special Forces.

(I know...I know...I'm likely preaching to the choir but, I just had to say something.)

They wear red if I remember rightly. Hated my black beret. I'm a patrol cap kind of guy.

250

Walter L. Newton Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:06:52pm

re: #240 J.S.

(look on the bright side, Walter. Your isolation will be for approx 24-48 hours, as opposed to isolated northern Canadian Communities of 6 to 8 weeks of isolation.)

I'm looking forward to it. I only work Fri, Sat and Sun, most weeks, so as long as the weather hits during the week, I'm ok. My girlfriend has to drive down into Denver every day, but she's use to it, been doing it for 8 years.

251

theheat Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:06:57pm

When you think about it, seceding from the Union isn't much a stretch for Texas. They've already denounced science and are pushing for more God. It's pretty clear those in charge have designs on their own Fundie Land, brimming with lots of Christian prayer, pissing on Darwin's grave, and cheap Mexican labor.

It's the Texan citizens that don't swallow this apocalyptic fundie secession crap I feel sorry for.

252

shiplord kirel Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:07:10pm

re: #179 Rightwingconspirator

If violence breaks out it will be small cells. We will see no popular support for this, no more than Bill Ayers crew or Tim McVeigh. Or John Wilkes Booth. He was shocked he had offended his fellow Southerners with his cowardly back of the head shot. But day to day I still fear MS13 or the Mexican drug gangs violence far more than these guys. Hot Air is aptly named.

Exactly right. Unfortunately, there are millions of these kooks and their form of insanity seems to be spreading like a contagious disease. Most of them have too much to lose to go McVeigh on us, but even a tiny number, a few hundred, could cause a bloodbath. One thing in favor of the forces of sanity: Bombs are actually a good deal harder to make and use in the US than the various terrorist guides and cookbooks might lead one to believe. Oh, it is fairly easy to make a bomb that will explode, a whole different matter to make one that will not explode in the McVeighist's bedroom (as one did here in Lubbock a few years ago)
or otherwise before it reaches an intended target.
Proper explosives are also quite hard to get. The ATF and fertilizer manufacturers have really clamped down on the ANFO ingredients. Security has also tightened up on legitimate industrial explosives and they are quite hard to steal. It is worth noting that terrorists in the Middle East generally work with professionally made explosives and munitions, provided either by collaborative governments or salvaged from previous conflicts.
Any future McVeigh style outrages are therefore likely to involve guns, which are less likely to cause mass casualties, much more harzardous for the perpetrators, and quite likely to be opposed in kind.

253

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:07:14pm

re: #247 Decatur Deb

Accuracy ding.

*curtsey*

254

Sheila Broflovski Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:07:14pm

re: #245 MandyManners

BTW, the 101st Airborne Division (Air Assault) soldiers do not wear the green beret. That distinctive cover is worn by members of Special Forces.

(I know...I know...I'm likely preaching to the choir but, I just had to say something.)

In the IDF the green beret signifies the Nahal Brigade. Golani Brigade wears dark red.

255

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:07:33pm

re: #249 soxfan4life

They wear red if I remember rightly. Hated my black beret. I'm a patrol cap kind of guy.

Maroonish.

256

Our Precious Bodily Fluids Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:08:13pm

Does anyone else hear The Mothers of Invention's "Trouble Every Day" in their head every time this stuff comes up?

257

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:08:32pm

re: #254 Alouette

In the IDF the green beret signifies the Nahal Brigade. Golani Brigade wears dark red.

I bow to your superior knowledge.

(How's the newest grandson?)

258

Walter L. Newton Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:09:01pm

re: #256 negativ

Does anyone else hear The Mothers of Invention's "Trouble Every Day" in their head every time this stuff comes up?

No... what are you smoking?

259

soxfan4life Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:09:06pm

re: #255 MandyManners

Maroonish.

The only cool part about Airborne is they get to wear their jump boots with their Class A uniforms.

260

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:09:07pm

re: #251 theheat

When you think about it, seceding from the Union isn't much a stretch for Texas. They've already denounced science and are pushing for more God. It's pretty clear those in charge have designs on their own Fundie Land, brimming with lots of Christian prayer, pissing on Darwin's grave, and cheap Mexican labor.

It's the Texan citizens that don't swallow this apocalyptic fundie secession crap I feel sorry for.

(waves hand furiously)

Yo!!!

261

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:10:05pm

re: #259 soxfan4life

The only cool part about Airborne is they get to wear their jump boots with their Class A uniforms.

*WHACK*

262

Our Precious Bodily Fluids Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:10:30pm

re: #46 SanFranciscoZionist

Hmm. You are exhibiting symptoms of meme deficiency.

Get thee to a DVD rental place:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

263

J.S. Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:10:34pm

yeah, the secessionists moving to Canada could learn how to speak French, then inform the Quebecois as to how to seceed from Canada! (all right!) btw, there are rumors that Prince Charles (due to flagging support for the monarchy) wishes to establish a residence in Canada (as I gag)...hmm...I would suggest that the Brit try out various locales in rural Quebec for starters...)

264

soxfan4life Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:11:03pm

re: #261 MandyManners

*WHACK*

I was an armor dude.We didn't jump out of perfectly good aircraft.

265

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:11:36pm

re: #254 Alouette

In the IDF the green beret signifies the Nahal Brigade. Golani Brigade wears dark red.

Golani Brigade? Near Golan Heights or just named for it?

266

Ojoe Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:11:58pm

OK I've been to Texas & I liked the people.

But, for fun, here is what W.T. Sherman said:

"If I owned Hell and Texas, I'd rent out Texas and live in Hell."

Good night all.

267

John Neverbend Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:12:04pm

re: #263 J.S.

yeah, the secessionists moving to Canada could learn how to speak French, then inform the Quebecois as to how to seceed from Canada! (all right!) btw, there are rumors that Prince Charles (due to flagging support for the monarchy) wishes to establish a residence in Canada (as I gag)...hmm...I would suggest that the Brit try out various locales in rural Quebec for starters...)

Fort McMurray has a certain rustic charm.

268

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:12:17pm

Here comes the blob...
Sea "Mucus" Blobs Pose Threat

269

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:12:20pm

re: #264 soxfan4life

I was an armor dude.We didn't jump out of perfectly good aircraft.

Yah but, tanks are slooow targets.

270

funky chicken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:13:09pm

re: #260 austin_blue

(waves hand furiously)

Yo!!!

You'd probably enjoy Lawrence, KS.

Hopefully Kay Bailey will beat Perry in the primary and the insanity will recede a bit.

271

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:13:11pm

re: #269 MandyManners

Yah but, tanks are slooow targets.

That's the tanks they get.

272

jvic Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:13:18pm

re: #243 Sharmuta

Perhaps a non-partisan re-write would be best since this isn't confined to one side.

But the classics will endure.

re: #242 iceweasel

Why do those antiwar libs hate America so? Not like me. I love America so much I'm calling for a civil war and secession.
/typical hotair commenter and screen beret.

And speaking of classics...

273

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:13:33pm

re: #264 soxfan4life

I was an armor dude.We didn't jump out of perfectly good aircraft.

Last I looked, the 101 had dropped the large-scale combat parachute
role for air-assault ('copters). The 82 still jumped.

274

funky chicken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:13:49pm

re: #264 soxfan4life

I was an armor dude.We didn't jump out of perfectly good aircraft.

My husband's an AF pilot, and he feels the same way :-).

275

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:14:09pm

re: #171 drool

I wonder if all those states that opt out of government provided medical insurance will elect to opt out of "public option" flood insurance too. You hear that Bobby Jindal, Haley Barbour, and Rick Perry?

I haven't heard Jindal indicate he would want to "opt out". Have you heard that somewhere?

I think government provided medical insurance is a terrible idea; but if it has to be, then I think any "opt out" provision would make it even worse - if we have to have a public option, I would not want to see any "opt out" provisions at all.

That said, Louisiana has in place a system that provides not just ER care, but also clinic care for the indigent and uninsured.

From the 08 annual report:
29,312 adult/pediatric admissions
3,083 psychiatric admissions
466 neonatal ICU admissions
2,212 nursery admissions
Inpatient Days
144,350 adult/pediatric inpatient days
(including ICU)
38,066 psychiatric inpatient days
6,683 neonatal ICU inpatient days
6,701 nursery inpatient days

276

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:14:36pm

re: #269 MandyManners

Yah but, tanks are slooow targets.

You don't know much about M1s or you wouldn't say that. They're actually quite fast and they've got enough armor to survive most of the stuff that gets thrown at them.

277

J.S. Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:14:44pm

re: #267 John Neverbend

as perhaps does the far Arctic? as in our newest territory? say, somewhere in Nunavut?

278

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:15:16pm

Fighting bloggers from the sky
fearless men who watch Glenn Beck cry
Men who type what they don't dare say--
the brave men of the Screen Beret.

Cheeto dust upon their chest
these are men -- Americas best
one hundred men will blog today but
only three win the Screen Beret

Trained to live off Mountain Dew
Trained in 'combat' at LGF 2
Men who seethe by night and day
courage take from the Screen Beret.

--Jimmah-Ice productions. The Ballad of The Screen Berets, dedicated to armchair warriors everywhere.

279

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:15:24pm

re: #272 jvic

But the classics will endure.

That's really... ChenZhen of you.

280

Spare O'Lake Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:15:39pm

How depressing...another evening at the world-wide garbage dump, where it seems that any stupid fool with a computer and internet access can log in 24/7 to any number of extremist blogs and anonymously post whatever hateful drivel comes into his/her head with little or no accoutability or supervision.
Nowadays, every idiot suddenly has a free platform to spew hate and nonsense into the ether, and to associate freely with others of their fascist ilk.
Poorly run and virtually unmoderated extremist sites are part of the dark underbelly of the web...and like a malignant tumour the craziness just seems to be spreading relentlessly.
LGF certainly has its work cut cut out for it.
Anyone pouring the single malt?

281

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:15:43pm

re: #237 Jimmah

Yep - the attempt to personify themselves with untouchable attributes of 'Americaness'. "Why do you hate America - you who dare to disagree with me?"

True. Somehow it's been confused, and the lines have been blurred and people think that people like that define all military men. Which reminds me of the false assumption that General Petraeus is even a Republican -- being that there is much chatter about him being recruited as a presidential candidate.

The typical argument I've seen and heard is "we fought for your freedom so shut up." That's true in many respects with the former but this is still a democracy and not a militarist state.

282

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:16:30pm

re: #275 reine.de.tout

I haven't heard Jindal indicate he would want to "opt out". Have you heard that somewhere?

I think government provided medical insurance is a terrible idea; but if it has to be, then I think any "opt out" provision would make it even worse - if we have to have a public option, I would not want to see any "opt out" provisions at all.

That said, Louisiana has in place a system that provides not just ER care, but also clinic care for the indigent and uninsured.

From the 08 annual report:
29,312 adult/pediatric admissions
3,083 psychiatric admissions
466 neonatal ICU admissions
2,212 nursery admissions
Inpatient Days
144,350 adult/pediatric inpatient days
(including ICU)
38,066 psychiatric inpatient days
6,683 neonatal ICU inpatient days
6,701 nursery inpatient days

They might be a few behind, there.

283

Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:16:38pm

re: #212 CyanSnowHawk

Bad comparison. Gov't flood insurance is an expensive option of last resort for people living in places, like flood plains, that no insurance company that wants to stay in business will cover.

No insurance company offers flood insurance anymore, it is strictly a government initiative. Even here in coastal Florida it is very, very, cheap, at least when compared to what regular home owners insurance. My coverage is less than $16.00 per month, how you call that expensive I cannot understand. Maybe you are just repeating a meme you heard somewhere without actually bothering to check it out for yourself?

284

Our Precious Bodily Fluids Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:17:02pm

re: #258 Walter L. Newton

No... what are you smoking?

Ohhh, I get it. This is the opening line of a Zen koan.

285

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:18:02pm

re: #272 jvic

And speaking of classics...

Hey Jvic! Thanks for that link to your comment! I didn't know those kf monkey posts-- will read now!
(love the classic flame warrior link too)

286

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:18:18pm

re: #282 Decatur Deb

They might be a few behind, there.

Well, at least by one (my name isn't on that list - perhaps should be!)

287

John Neverbend Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:18:42pm

re: #277 J.S.

as perhaps does the far Arctic? as in our newest territory? say, somewhere in Nunavut?

Or even in Bob? (You know the story of "Bob", when Nunavut split from the Northwest Territories?)

288

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:20:43pm

re: #270 funky chicken

You'd probably enjoy Lawrence, KS.

Hopefully Kay Bailey will beat Perry in the primary and the insanity will recede a bit.

I've been drunk in Lawrence.

And yes, there is a large move on (heh) for Texas Dems to cross the aisle and vote for The SMU Cheerleader. It's not uncommon here when a particularly whack R runs against a more moderate candidate on the State or local level. One does what one can...

289

John Neverbend Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:21:30pm

re: #263 J.S.

btw, there are rumors that Prince Charles (due to flagging support for the monarchy) wishes to establish a residence in Canada

Flagging support. Fie on't! Remember what King Farouk said.

"In a few years, there will be only five kings in the world, the King of England and the four kings in a pack of cards."

290

Walter L. Newton Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:21:57pm

re: #284 negativ

Ohhh, I get it. This is the opening line of a Zen koan.

No... what are you smoking... it appears it all went up the banyan tree... lasting forever.

291

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:22:15pm

re: #287 John Neverbend

Or even in Bob? (You know the story of "Bob", when Nunavut split from the Northwest Territories?)

Tell the story, please?

292

Sheila Broflovski Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:22:25pm

re: #257 MandyManners

I bow to your superior knowledge.

(How's the newest grandson?)

Check your email. :)

293

theheat Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:22:30pm

re: #260 austin_blue

If it comes to that, we'll air lift you the hell outta there. Maybe piss on the Alamo and hit a strip joint on the way out of town.
//
What a legacy.

294

Killgore Trout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:22:51pm

re: #275 reine.de.tout

It's going to be very interesting to see what they get passed. I'm pretty nervous about it but I think most of the doomsday predictions are probably greatly exaggerated.

295

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:23:19pm

re: #274 funky chicken

My husband's an AF pilot, and he feels the same way :-).

It's an *emergency* device. What does your husband fly? I flew an ancient airplane with many many motors...

296

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:23:35pm

re: #228 Walter L. Newton

What are you talking about?

Use of the word ALWAYS in all caps when "usually" would have sufficed. Not everyone who has a nic with Sarge in it is a beckloonian droid. My dad's not, he has a nic with Sarge in it.

297

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:23:36pm

re: #294 Killgore Trout

It's going to be very interesting to see what they get passed. I'm pretty nervous about it but I think most of the doomsday predictions are probably greatly exaggerated.

The path to tyranny has been greatly exaggerated.

298

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:23:38pm

re: #271 Sharmuta

That's the tanks they get.

Ooh. That's good.

299

Spare O'Lake Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:24:14pm

re: #291 Dark_Falcon

Tell the story, please?

Yes, we'd like to hear Sumavut.

300

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:24:21pm

re: #276 Dark_Falcon

You don't know much about M1s or you wouldn't say that. They're actually quite fast and they've got enough armor to survive most of the stuff that gets thrown at them.

No, I don't know a lot about M1s.

301

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:24:39pm

re: #260 austin_blue

(waves hand furiously)

Yo!!!

Come out to California. We'll get rid of some folks from the east of the state with this, you can have a slightly used ranch.

302

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:24:54pm

I am really concerned about the healthcare debacle.

yesterday, I watched the Breast Cancer speeches from the White House Garden. It was testimonials from survivors about the cost and the terrible anxiety they have when denied insurance or their cancer is excluded. Which is a real problem. Then Michelle got up and campaigned for the changes in Congress.

What really disturbed me is that no one seemed to understand that TREATMENT IS EXPENSIVE. The idea of paying $600 a month for insurance seemed so outrageous to these women --which I understand it is a lot out of a monthly budget, but compared to the cost of treatment, and the other benefits of having insurance, the cost seems like a decent deal.

I get the idea that somehow, we are suppossed to get rid of all bad things that cost money --or just make the reality of the cost go away --thru legislation.

The survivors focus, understandably, was on their situation. We have something like a 94% survival rate for cancers found early. That is an AMAZING accomplishment--but it cost money, LOTS OF MONEY.

Reality is that all money comes from the citizenry.

303

John Neverbend Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:25:55pm

re: #291 Dark_Falcon

Tell the story, please?

When the Northwest Territories split, the residents of each piece were asked to provide a name for their "half". Nunavut residents chose the name "Nunavut" which means "Our Land" in the language of Inuktitut. The residents of the other half came up with several names, and for a time, the leading contender was "Bob". In the end, they made the radical decision to keep the name as Northwest Territories.

304

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:26:16pm

re: #283 ausador

No insurance company offers flood insurance anymore, it is strictly a government initiative. Even here in coastal Florida it is very, very, cheap, at least when compared to what regular home owners insurance. My coverage is less than $16.00 per month, how you call that expensive I cannot understand. Maybe you are just repeating a meme you heard somewhere without actually bothering to check it out for yourself?

In Illinois, individual insurance companies underwrite and administer the Flood Plan, but the coverage actually comes from the State (or Fed?). It is very expensive, but a mortgagee won't give a loan for a property in a flood plain without it.

305

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:26:24pm

re: #262 negativ

Hmm. You are exhibiting symptoms of meme deficiency.

Get thee to a DVD rental place:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Oh. THAT.

(Sorry, college roomie was In Lurve with Pulp Fiction, and as a result I never saw it at all.)

306

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:26:52pm

re: #283 ausador

No insurance company offers flood insurance anymore, it is strictly a government initiative. Even here in coastal Florida it is very, very, cheap, at least when compared to what regular home owners insurance. My coverage is less than $16.00 per month, how you call that expensive I cannot understand. Maybe you are just repeating a meme you heard somewhere without actually bothering to check it out for yourself?

My first house was in an area where I had to have flood insurance, and I don't recall that it was all that expensive and yes, it is available only from the gov't.

What IS expensive is hurricane coverage, which is on my regular insurance policy but requires a deductible that's at least double the normal damage deductible. The insurance isn't all that expensive, it's the deductible that "costs", BUT only if we have hurricane damage.

I have to say your comment was right on target, except for that last sentence, which is a good way to shut off conversation with someone - but I'm sure that's not what you were trying to do.

307

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:27:18pm

re: #264 soxfan4life

I was an armor dude.We didn't jump out of perfectly good aircraft.

We always said of my grandfather that the only reason he ever saw for getting into an airplane was the Second World War, and that was over.

308

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:27:46pm

Oh, for fuck's sake. Continuing to mock Ballad of the Green Beret.

I'd give 100,000 of that for the real thing.

Youtube Video

309

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:27:59pm

re: #283 ausador

No insurance company offers flood insurance anymore, it is strictly a government initiative. Even here in coastal Florida it is very, very, cheap, at least when compared to what regular home owners insurance. My coverage is less than $16.00 per month, how you call that expensive I cannot understand. Maybe you are just repeating a meme you heard somewhere without actually bothering to check it out for yourself?

Perhaps the cost is different from State-to-State or for what is actually covered---liability, structure, contents. I can't remember (I used to work in an insurance office and DREADED those Flood forms). It wasn't $16/mo --it was as much as the policy for the regular house insurance.

310

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:28:24pm

re: #195 ausador

I may be guilty of generalizing here but mostly this craziness seems to be an affliction suffered mainly by down-at-the-heel men with too many guns and a surfeit of brains.

To even get noticed anymore they have to keep saying crazier and crazier things. You see that a lot with radicals in their echo chamber.

311

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:28:25pm

re: #294 Killgore Trout

It's going to be very interesting to see what they get passed. I'm pretty nervous about it but I think most of the doomsday predictions are probably greatly exaggerated.

Killgore - there are just other alternatives to getting care to people who need it (such as my state's charity hospital system), that I think should be studied or pursued BEFORE going with a full federal-govt health plan.

312

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:28:32pm

re: #295 austin_blue

It's an *emergency* device. What does your husband fly? I flew an ancient airplane with many many motors...

B-52s, right?

313

John Neverbend Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:28:41pm

re: #303 John Neverbend

The residents of the other half came up with several names, and for a time, the leading contender was "Bob". In the end, they made the radical decision to keep the name as Northwest Territories.

See Bob

314

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:28:53pm

re: #311 reine.de.tout

Killgore - there are just other alternatives to getting care to people who need it (such as my state's charity hospital system), that I think should be studied or pursued BEFORE going with a full federal-govt health plan.

Quite Concur.

315

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:29:27pm

re: #293 theheat

If it comes to that, we'll air lift you the hell outta there. Maybe piss on the Alamo and hit a strip joint on the way out of town.
//
What a legacy.

Please. "Gentleman's Club". The Shiite Baptists *do* love their euphemisms.

316

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:30:59pm

re: #315 austin_blue

Please. "Gentleman's Club". The Shiite Baptists *do* love their euphemisms.

What's funny about that is usually gentlemen don't need to pay to see women naked- they're good enough to get us naked with sheer charm.

317

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:31:20pm

re: #312 Dark_Falcon

B-52s, right?

My money's on B36.

Image: 19054d1202269772-counting-1000-images-b-36_1.jpg

318

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:31:52pm

re: #312 Dark_Falcon

B-52s, right?

Yes. The last eighteen months in -135s. Took the option. BUFFs were more fun to fly. Tankers got to travel. I was single. I jumped at the chance.

319

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:31:57pm

re: #317 Decatur Deb

My money's on B36.

[Link: www.techimo.com...]

He's not that old. ;)

320

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:32:20pm

re: #317 Decatur Deb

My money's on B36.

[Link: www.techimo.com...]

No one is that old!

321

Spare O'Lake Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:32:45pm

re: #308 MandyManners

Oh, for fuck's sake. Continuing to mock Ballad of the Green Beret.
I'd give 100,000 of that for the real thing.
[Video]

I've always loved that song and what it stands for...and I'm not even an American!

322

Killgore Trout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:33:24pm

re: #311 reine.de.tout

I'd prefer to skip the public option too. We'll have to wait and see what they com up with.

323

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:33:35pm

re: #319 Gus 802

But, but... it has a LOT of engines.

324

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:33:42pm

Of course some people see the world in black and white stereotypes, and you can usually identify them by their all inclusive phraseology towards their outgroups.

Would Jimmah's statement have been ok had he said "Ever noticed how anyone with ~~Sarge~~ Abdul or ~~Sgt~~ Mohammed or whatever in their nick is ALWAYS bad news?"

Bias is as bias does. Some don't recognize their own.

325

J.S. Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:33:53pm

re: #313 John Neverbend

(I vaguely recall some Peter Gzowski interviews -- about certain proposals, some termed "radical", about how the new territory would be governed...a kind of radical democracy...intriguing and innnovative, but the proposals never panned out..)

326

theheat Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:34:43pm

re: #315 austin_blue

See if The Doll House South Gentleman's Club has reappeared somewhere near Austin, and it's a date. [wink wink]

327

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:35:05pm

re: #320 austin_blue

No one is that old!

People my age are that old.

328

Existential_Donuts Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:35:15pm

re: #314 Dark_Falcon

Finally. I am in favor of the public option, but that's not the point of this message. This officially marks the first time in years that I feel that I could have an civil discussion with someone I disagree with. No one will call me unAmerican or accuse me of any manner of horrible behavior. In this case we all want to help people, our methods are just different. Hurray for the return to sanity. At least at LGF, anyway.

329

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:35:37pm

re: #278 iceweasel

Fighting bloggers from the sky
fearless men who watch Glenn Beck cry
Men who type what they don't dare say--
the brave men of the Screen Beret.

Cheeto dust upon their chest
these are men -- Americas best
one hundred men will blog today but
only three win the Screen Beret

Trained to live off Mountain Dew
Trained in 'combat' at LGF 2
Men who seethe by night and day
courage take from the Screen Beret.

--Jimmah-Ice productions. The Ballad of The Screen Berets, dedicated to armchair warriors everywhere.

Brilliant work ice-ski :)

A special verse for one particular screen beret who is (so sadly///) no longer with us :

Part navajo, speaking in tongues
"nam hero" extolls his lungs,
awful bad haiku visionary
authentic frontier gibberish missionary

330

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:36:35pm

re: #328 Existential_Donuts

re: #314 Dark_Falcon

Finally. I am in favor of the public option, but that's not the point of this message. This officially marks the first time in years that I feel that I could have an civil discussion with someone I disagree with. No one will call me unAmerican or accuse me of any manner of horrible behavior. In this case we all want to help people, our methods are just different. Hurray for the return to sanity. At least at LGF, anyway.

aw.
We need a short name for you - shall we call you donuts? Or - what?

331

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:36:46pm

re: #316 Sharmuta

What's funny about that is usually gentlemen don't need to pay to see women naked- they're good enough to get us naked with sheer charm.

It's an odd dynamic, here. I've been to those establishments almost exclusively for bachelor parties (Including my own, alas. It's nice to grow up.). I guess there is just a segment of the population down here that just doesn't want to be gentlemanly, or doesn't care. The number of business meetings that meet at Sugar's here in Austin would absolutely astound you.

332

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:36:46pm

re: #328 Existential_Donuts

re: #314 Dark_Falcon

Finally. I am in favor of the public option, but that's not the point of this message. This officially marks the first time in years that I feel that I could have an civil discussion with someone I disagree with. No one will call me unAmerican or accuse me of any manner of horrible behavior. In this case we all want to help people, our methods are just different. Hurray for the return to sanity. At least at LGF, anyway.

Sanity never left here. We've had some nuts, but sanity has always been found on LGF.

333

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:36:52pm

re: #281 Gus 802

True. Somehow it's been confused, and the lines have been blurred and people think that people like that define all military men. Which reminds me of the false assumption that General Petraeus is even a Republican -- being that there is much chatter about him being recruited as a presidential candidate.

The typical argument I've seen and heard is "we fought for your freedom so shut up." That's true in many respects with the former but this is still a democracy and not a militarist state.

What's Petraeus' affiliation, or does he have one?

My family have been Democrats a good long time, and we've shown up for wars we liked, and wars we didn't. I don't have some kind of awestruck reverence for the fighting patriotism of the red states--two of my college friends have lost brothers in Iraq, and they are both the sort to think Bill Clinton was a bit too far to the right. I defer personally to the courage and selflessness of military men and women, but I don't necessarily think their political judgement is one whit better than mine, and I take into account the wide range of opinion I've heard from such folks.

And for anyone who says "I fought for your freedom, so shut up," my only answer has to be "I value that sacrifice enough not to let this country you fought for become a military dictatorship, so NO, the debate, whatever the hell it's about, continues."

334

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:37:32pm

re: #328 Existential_Donuts

re: #314 Dark_Falcon

Finally. I am in favor of the public option, but that's not the point of this message. This officially marks the first time in years that I feel that I could have an civil discussion with someone I disagree with. No one will call me unAmerican or accuse me of any manner of horrible behavior. In this case we all want to help people, our methods are just different. Hurray for the return to sanity. At least at LGF, anyway.

whadya mean ya commie?!
//

Seriously there are points to public option for catastrophic care, but for general medical insurance I'm not in favor of it.

335

Existential_Donuts Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:37:55pm

re: #330 reine.de.tout

I will respond to donuts. I should have chosen Existential_Badass or Existential_LargeD**k.

336

Existential_Donuts Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:39:08pm

re: #334 Thanos

I would press the plus button, but I don't have enough posts yet.

337

John Neverbend Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:39:39pm

re: #325 J.S.

(I vaguely recall some Peter Gzowski interviews -- about certain proposals, some termed "radical", about how the new territory would be governed...a kind of radical democracy...intriguing and innnovative, but the proposals never panned out..)

I've probably seen as much of Canada as I've seen of the US, but I've never been to Nunavut or The Northwest Territories. I'm baffled by the Inuit script that I saw on certain signs at Winnipeg airport. It resembles nothing that I've ever seen before.

338

simoom Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:39:49pm

re: #81 iceweasel

There is reason to suspect that some of the opposition to health care reform is driven by racial animosity.
...
Racial Resentment, Authoritarianism, and Health Care

scholars have demonstrated that racial animosity and opposition to policies perceived as re-distributive appear to go hand in hand. When people think of welfare, they think of Blacks. And one can surmise that, with the election of a Black president, and the rising to the surface of racial animosity among voters who, last year, were desperate enough to give Obama a chance, these relationships are even stronger now than when these data were collected last year.

Some in conservative media seem to be explicitly stoking this meme of healthcare reform as a vector for white resentment:

Glenn Beck TV Show: Obama agenda driven by "reparations" and desire to "settle old racial scores"

Glenn Beck: Everything that is getting pushed through congress, including this health care bill are transforming America. And they are all driven by President Obama's thinking on one idea - reparations. ... His goal is creating a new America. A new model. A model that will settle old racial scores through new social justice.

Glenn Beck Radio Show: Health Care Reform Is Reparations

Glenn Beck: Barack Obama is a community organizer. That's all you need to know to understand this guy. He's a community organizer. What is ACORN about? Oh, we're about getting affordable housing for people who cannot afford it. No you're not! No you're not. That's not what you are. You are about control and manipulation and voter fraud and a census! You're about money. Money for people like Wade Radkey, that's all you're about. Community organizations are rarely about what they say they are. This guy is not who he says he is. None of his bills, none of his proposals are about what he says they're about. The healthcare bill is reparations. It's the beginning of reparations.

Glenn Beck's website: Is massive Health Care plan reparations?:

But none of that enters into Barack Obama's thinking. He doesn't even consider the 360,000 union troops killed in the Civil War as debt paid. And don't even think about asking him about affirmative action. That wasn't any kind of reparation. Neither was Black Entertainment Television, Black History month, United Negro College Fund, the Congressional Black Caucus, the NAACP, RainbowPUSH Coalition, 100 Black Men of America. None of these things could exist for whites. And Obama couldn't care less. It's not about doing the right thing and uniting.
...
Barack Obama is setting up universal healthcare, universal college, green jobs as stealth reparations. That way the victim status is maintained. And he also brings back back‑door reparations.
This would be crazy if he hadn't stated it himself. And if you couldn't pick up an organizational chart of the Democratic health plan and find next to the national coordinator for health the Office of Civil Rights and Office of Minority Health. I don't know if minorities are sicker than the rest or need different ‑‑ do they have different medicines for minorities? This wouldn't make sense.

Crap, I ran out of space. That whole article is worth a look for how blatant its race baiting is. No room to add the Limbaugh reparations talk either, though the Beck excerpts above should be plenty illustrative.

339

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:39:49pm

re: #324 Thanos

Of course some people see the world in black and white stereotypes, and you can usually identify them by their all inclusive phraseology towards their outgroups.

Would Jimmah's statement have been ok had he said "Ever noticed how anyone with ~~Sarge~~ Abdul or ~~Sgt~~ Mohammed or whatever in their nick is ALWAYS bad news?"

Bias is as bias does. Some don't recognize their own.

I was observing a fact regardless of notions of 'political correctness' - something I've always had a habit of doing. Seriously - every single poster I've ever seen on this site with Sarge, sergeant or Sgt in his nick on this site has been a complete and utter arsehole of the first magnitude. I actually think they are all banned now.

340

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:39:57pm

re: #334 Thanos

whadya mean ya commie?!
//

Seriously there are points to public option for catastrophic care, but for general medical insurance I'm not in favor of it.

Quite Concur.

341

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:40:02pm

re: #336 Existential_Donuts

I would press the plus button, but I don't have enough posts yet.

Dinged it for you!
Keep posting, you'll get there!

342

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:40:49pm

re: #308 MandyManners

Oh, for fuck's sake. Continuing to mock Ballad of the Green Beret.

I'd give 100,000 of that for the real thing.

[Video]

We're not mocking the song or the men, Mandy, just those who think they're badasses and aren't.

343

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:41:28pm

re: #327 Decatur Deb

People my age are that old.

My apologies (pulls on forelock). Very few B-36 pilots are still with us. I think the last active unit was around 1957 or so. The pilots would be north of 75. I was born in '57, so I was flying tankers that were as old as I was and BUFFs that were 3 years younger.

344

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:41:59pm

re: #308 MandyManners

Oh, for fuck's sake. Continuing to mock Ballad of the Green Beret.

I'd give 100,000 of that for the real thing.

[Video]

We're mocking armchair warriors, not Green Berets. As is clear to everyone else in the thread, I believe.

345

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:42:05pm

re: #339 Jimmah

Maybeso, but you should be careful of sweeping all inclusive statements. ALWAYS in all caps is just that. Usually wouldn't have got my goat.

346

theheat Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:42:09pm

re: #335 Existential_Donuts

Whatever, you don't want to be known as E.D.

347

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:42:12pm

re: #334 Thanos

whadya mean ya commie?!
//

Seriously there are points to public option for catastrophic care, but for general medical insurance I'm not in favor of it.

Bottom line - here at LGF, at any rate - is that no one wants to see people left without proper health care - what we take issue with is the method used to get that care gets paid for.

348

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:42:56pm

re: #341 Floral Giraffe

Dinged it for you!
Keep posting, you'll get there!

Flo!
I love the way you come in and start bouncing around.

349

Killgore Trout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:43:06pm

re: #338 simoom

During the election I downplayed the racial opposition to Obama. I just didn't think it really existed on a serious level in today's America. I was wrong.

350

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:44:39pm

re: #346 theheat

Whatever, you don't want to be known as E.D.

LOL!
That's why I was having a problem figuring out a nickname for the nic.

351

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:44:44pm

re: #265 MandyManners

Golani Brigade? Near Golan Heights or just named for it?

Here are the Golani - Givati - Nahal infantry brigades.

Youtube Video

Do not mock them.

352

Existential_Donuts Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:44:45pm

re: #346 theheat

Laughing out loud in an empty house. I do not want to be known as E.D., to be sure. The lesson is to choose a screen name carefully.

353

Mocking Jay Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:44:52pm

I sense much flounce in this thread.

354

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:45:10pm

re: #338 simoom

That post is worthy of its own thread, IMO.

355

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:45:15pm

re: #331 austin_blue

It's an odd dynamic, here. I've been to those establishments almost exclusively for bachelor parties (Including my own, alas. It's nice to grow up.). I guess there is just a segment of the population down here that just doesn't want to be gentlemanly, or doesn't care. The number of business meetings that meet at Sugar's here in Austin would absolutely astound you.

Well that's just it. Not all men are gentlemen.

356

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:45:39pm

re: #348 reine.de.tout

I'm reading & monitoring the wind here.
50 MPH gusts and my new "garden room".
Shadecloth blew of a couple of hours ago.
Roof is holding nicely,
SO FAR...

357

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:45:44pm

re: #347 reine.de.tout

Bottom line - here at LGF, at any rate - is that no one wants to see people left without proper health care - what we take issue with is the method used to get that care gets paid for.

Just so. The slippery slope argument is what is used to argue against that catastrophic care, but when you look close you see that it really has almost attained the status of unwritten, un-codified right in the US. Show me an ER that will turn away a dieing person and I might believe otherwise.

Government as insurer of last resort for catastrophic care I get, as insurer for viagra, I don't.

358

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:45:48pm

re: #343 austin_blue

My B-36 workmate was a bit older than I. It didn't have that long
a service life. It's cool that one of the Wright Bros got to see an early
B-52 (the tracked-gear version).

359

Existential_Donuts Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:46:52pm

re: #347 reine.de.tout

Bottom line - here at LGF, at any rate - is that no one wants to see people left without proper health care - what we take issue with is the method used to get that care gets paid for.

Understandable. Either side, left to their own devices, would produce something that is not efficient. Balance is the key. In life and in politics. But you did not hear that from me.

360

kirkspencer Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:47:32pm

re: #264 soxfan4life

I was an armor dude.We didn't jump out of perfectly good aircraft.

Ahem, neither does any US Airborne unit. There is no such thing as a perfectly good aircraft; they're maintained by the air force.

361

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:48:04pm

re: #353 JasonA

I sense much flounce in this thread.

Not so far. The banning have mostly been conventional booting so far. Just people in the Iron Fist mode who are determined to pretend that an ugly thing is not ugly. Such Idiotarians have no place here in my eyes,

362

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:48:23pm

re: #338 simoom

Crap, I ran out of space. That whole article is worth a look for how blatant its race baiting is. No room to add the Limbaugh reparations talk either, though the Beck excerpts above should be plenty illustrative.

Unbelievable. It's completely clear what Beck is doing there. And I don't think he's the only one doing it (you mention Limbaugh of course, but there are others for sure).

363

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:48:51pm

re: #338 simoom

if you run out of space, you're using way too much bandwidth...spaced out

364

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:48:55pm

re: #349 Killgore Trout

During the election I downplayed the racial opposition to Obama. I just didn't think it really existed on a serious level in today's America. I was wrong.

Y'all come down heah. Obama got 6 donations from my zipcode, 3 of
them from my dining room.

365

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:48:55pm

Oh, for pity's sake. If you're gonna' mock someone, AT LEAST BE ACCURATE.

See my posts about the 101st Airborne Division (AirAssault) and Special Forces.

366

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:48:56pm

Scanning for undercurrent of butthurt in this thread: undercurrent of butthurt detected.

Youtube Video

367

Mocking Jay Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:49:11pm

re: #361 Dark_Falcon

When I see so many deleted posts I jump to conclusions :P

368

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:50:15pm

re: #359 Existential_Donuts

re: #347 reine.de.tout

Understandable. Either side, left to their own devices, would produce something that is not efficient. Balance is the key. In life and in politics. But you did not hear that from me.

I don't know when you came into this thread, but here is a system that's been in place in my state (Louisiana) for many many many years, and it seems to work. Is it perfect? No. Do the uninsured and indigent get more that just ER care? You betcha. This system is locality-specific, so it can be tailored to meet the needs of a specific location or state, rather than a one-size-fits-all approach we would have with federal insurance.

I keep hoping either Louisiana's congress-critters will propose something like this as an alternative, or people here will forward to their own congress-people to check out as an alternative idea.

369

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:50:37pm

re: #351 Bagua

Here are the Golani - Givati - Nahal infantry brigades.

[Video]

Do not mock them.

Why the admonishment? I'm not mocking ANY member of the military, be he from the USA or Israel.

370

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:50:51pm

re: #333 SanFranciscoZionist

I don't know Petraeus' political affiliation. One night I searched and came up dry so I will assume unaffiliated. He was put into his position by a Republican administration but that's not really a good indicator.

No one is really recruited into higher office or politics with much success. It is a logical leap to assume that just because he is a good general that he would make for both an effective or successful politician.

It is said that the days of general presidents are long gone. The last general to hold office was Dwight Eisenhower and he was quite an exception.

371

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:50:51pm

re: #329 Jimmah

Brilliant work ice-ski :)

A special verse for one particular screen beret who is (so sadly///) no longer with us :

Part navajo, speaking in tongues
"nam hero" extolls his lungs,
awful bad haiku visionary
authentic frontier gibberish missionary

Hee. Love it. Poor old Gabby.

372

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:51:03pm

re: #349 Killgore Trout

During the election I downplayed the racial opposition to Obama. I just didn't think it really existed on a serious level in today's America. I was wrong.

well, he is radically unfit to be president...what goes around, comes around

373

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:51:04pm

re: #349 Killgore Trout

During the election I downplayed the racial opposition to Obama. I just didn't think it really existed on a serious level in today's America. I was wrong.

Do you think a right-side prominent black, say Michael Steele, would be receiving the same amount of opposition as Obama is getting from the Nutwing fringe?

I'm not saying there isn't racial opposition, I just don't think it is as prominent as some would believe.

374

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:51:36pm

re: #366 Jimmah

Scanning for undercurrent of butthurt in this thread: undercurrent of butthurt detected.

[Video]

Why don't you shove your anal-rape terminology into your pipe and smoke it?

375

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:51:41pm

re: #368 reine.de.tout

I don't know when you came into this thread, but here is a system that's been in place in my state (Louisiana) for many many many years, and it seems to work. Is it perfect? No. Do the uninsured and indigent get more that just ER care? You betcha. This system is locality-specific, so it can be tailored to meet the needs of a specific location or state, rather than a one-size-fits-all approach we would have with federal insurance.

I keep hoping either Louisiana's congress-critters will propose something like this as an alternative, or people here will forward to their own congress-people to check out as an alternative idea.

OOPS.
See the link here:
re: #275 reine.de.tout

376

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:51:42pm

I sense someone is sore that their bias got pointed out. You are playing that for yourself I take it.

377

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:52:02pm

re: #365 MandyManners

Oh, for pity's sake. If you're gonna' mock someone, AT LEAST BE ACCURATE.

See my posts about the 101st Airborne Division (AirAssault) and Special Forces.

I agree.

Disrespectful to say the least.

378

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:52:12pm

re: #345 Thanos

Maybeso, but you should be careful of sweeping all inclusive statements. ALWAYS in all caps is just that. Usually wouldn't have got my goat.

In this case it's justified because that is my honest observation. When a decent self professed 'sarge' finally makes his appearance on LGF I'll be sure to point out what a refreshing change from the usual complete and utter asshole he represents.

379

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:52:30pm

re: #349 Killgore Trout

During the election I downplayed the racial opposition to Obama. I just didn't think it really existed on a serious level in today's America. I was wrong.

Thanks, Kilgore, for that. I wasn't posting on this board, then. Registered, but lurking. It was astounding to me the stuff that got posted here. I knew that if I called out the more (subtle) egregious racist comments I'd get GAZED to oblivion.

So I waited, knowing that kind of crap would eventually grow uncontrollable as it fed upon itself and got more and more extreme. I trusted Charles to recognize what was going on, match it with Kahaneists, the Beckists, the Paulians, the Creationists, &c, and put the brakes on. He did.

We are all better for it.

380

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:52:55pm

re: #370 Gus 802

When you can't tell a GO's political affiliation, the system is working.

381

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:52:56pm

re: #378 Jimmah

Always is rarely justified, and you continue to point out your bias.

382

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:52:57pm

re: #366 Jimmah

Scanning for undercurrent of butthurt in this thread: undercurrent of butthurt detected.

Scanning in progress...undercurrent confirmed. Backtracking and faux moral indignation in view. Butthurt systems engaged.

383

Velvet Elvis Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:53:01pm

re: #373 Racer X

Do you think a right-side prominent black, say Michael Steele, would be receiving the same amount of opposition as Obama is getting from the Nutwing fringe?
.

He'd never make it past the primaries.

384

MittDoesNotCompute Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:53:25pm

re: #342 SanFranciscoZionist

We're not mocking the song or the men, Mandy, just those who think they're badasses and aren't.

I agree with SFZ...the parodies of the song point out how ironic it is for those who impersonate or abuse a military service record on the Internet.

/those versions of the "Internet Tough Guy" couldn't hold a candle to the Green Berets that SSgt Barry Sadler wrote and sung about...

385

Existential_Donuts Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:53:39pm

re: #368 reine.de.tout

I have to admit to being a less than diligent thread follower. The posts come fast at LGF and I say I catch maybe %50 of what's going on. I suppose I will get tagged a few times for not paying attention.

Local administration of health care is key. The only way a large program will limit it's inefficiencies is if the resources can be controlled by someone with some skin in the game.

386

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:53:42pm

re: #374 MandyManners

Why don't you shove your anal-rape terminology into your pipe and smoke it?

seconded...there is some weird Freudian thing going on there...some freaky obsession

387

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:53:44pm

re: #355 Sharmuta

Well that's just it. Not all men are gentlemen.

Agreed. Most of us are little kids in a candy store. Like I said, it's good to grow up.

388

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:53:45pm

re: #369 MandyManners

Why the admonishment? I'm not mocking ANY member of the military, be he from the USA or Israel.

No, I was agreeing with you and answering your question.

389

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:54:15pm

re: #374 MandyManners

Why don't you shove your anal-rape terminology into your pipe and smoke it?

That's not what butthurt means, Mandy. It denotes someone who can't accept they are wrong and lashes out in anger at those who proved them wrong. It used for trolls, not for you.

390

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:54:40pm

re: #385 Existential_Donuts

I have to admit to being a less than diligent thread follower. The posts come fast at LGF and I say I catch maybe %50 of what's going on. I suppose I will get tagged a few times for not paying attention.

Local administration of health care is key. The only way a large program will limit it's inefficiencies is if the resources can be controlled by someone with some skin in the game.

I forgot to give you my link. Here it is.

391

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:54:58pm

re: #351 Bagua

Here are the Golani - Givati - Nahal infantry brigades.

[Video]

Do not mock them.

Oh, my goodness gracious sake's alive! That is fantastic!

392

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:55:05pm

re: #334 Thanos

Seriously there are points to public option for catastrophic care, but for general medical insurance I'm not in favor of it.

Agreed with the point about catastrophic care. That skews the whole debate.

Health care is an interesting topic in that Americans have become well accustomed to a socialist scheme without realizing it. Young, healthy employees at the company help subsidize the older unhealthier ones.

393

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:55:18pm

394

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:55:21pm

re: #374 MandyManners

Please. First you pretend people are insulting the Green Berets or the song, when it was perfectly clear that no one was. Now you're AGAIN making up a story that a perfectly cromulent word has some sadistic and vile interpretation.

It's pretty clear you're in the mood for a fight. Why don't you just calm down and stop trying to put the worst possible interpretation on everything?

395

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:55:30pm

re: #378 Jimmah

In this case it's justified because that is my honest observation. When a decent self professed 'sarge' finally makes his appearance on LGF I'll be sure to point out what a refreshing change from the usual complete and utter asshole he represents.

Wait, you're saying a 'sarge' usually represents a 'complete and utter asshole'?

Am I reading you wrong?

396

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:55:45pm

re: #389 Dark_Falcon

That's not what butthurt means, Mandy. It denotes someone who can't accept they are wrong and lashes out in anger at those who proved them wrong. It used for trolls, not for you.

DF - I think the term was being used either for Mandy or Thanos, or both, actually.

397

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:56:01pm

re: #383 Conservative Moonbat

He'd never make it past the primaries.

Lets pretend.

398

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:56:14pm

re: #384 talon_262

I agree with SFZ...the parodies of the song point out how ironic it is for those who impersonate or abuse a military service record on the Internet.

/those versions of the "Internet Tough Guy" couldn't hold a candle to the Green Berets that SSgt Barry Sadler wrote and sung about...

They would get squished into strawberry jam, and then eaten by the Green Berets on peanut butter sandwiches.

;)

399

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:56:32pm

re: #389 Dark_Falcon

That's not what butthurt means, Mandy. It denotes someone who can't accept they are wrong and lashes out in anger at those who proved them wrong. It used for trolls, not for you.

so it does not mean what it says...got it...what a bunch of juveniles

400

sattv4u2 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:56:42pm

re: #366 Jimmah

re: #382 iceweasel

This "butthurt" stuff is fun!

Can I play??

Oh ,, wait ,,,I forgot ,,, I can't ,,, i'm not 12 tears old!

Gggeeezzz

401

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:56:59pm

re: #381 Thanos

Always is rarely justified, and you continue to point out your bias.

Rarely doesn't equal never. This is one of those occasions, sad to say.

402

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:57:08pm

re: #387 austin_blue

Agreed. Most of us are little kids in a candy store. Like I said, it's good to grow up.

There's always that little boy deep down somewhere...

403

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:57:28pm

re: #392 Mich-again

Agreed with the point about catastrophic care. That skews the whole debate.

Health care is an interesting topic in that Americans have become well accustomed to a socialist scheme without realizing it. Young, healthy employees at the company help subsidize the older unhealthier ones.

If they would boil "public option" down to that it would take the fear away, and make the public option indestructible but they aren't willing I don't think.

404

Killgore Trout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:57:37pm

re: #372 albusteve

I objected to him on his qualifications too. I'm just surprised that race was a factor with more people than I imagined.

405

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:57:41pm

re: #402 Sharmuta

There's always that little boy deep down somewhere...

No MJ jokes, please.

406

austin_blue Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:57:45pm

Good night, all. Sweet scaly dreams!

407

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:58:02pm

re: #402 Sharmuta

There's always that little boy deep down somewhere...

Just not enough of them to make Texas secede.

408

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:58:29pm

re: #407 jaunte

Just not enough of them to make Texas secede.

That would make it harder to get candy...

409

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:58:29pm

re: #394 iceweasel

Please. First you pretend people are insulting the Green Berets or the song, when it was perfectly clear that no one was.

Apparently not clear enough. That was why I took care to clarify.

410

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:58:49pm

re: #401 Jimmah

Rarely doesn't equal never. This is one of those occasions, sad to say.

I disagree, as noted above my dad posts with a nic starting with Sarge, he's not a beckdroid. You are empirically wrong.

411

Spare O'Lake Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:59:03pm

re: #339 Jimmah

I was observing a fact regardless of notions of 'political correctness' - something I've always had a habit of doing. Seriously - every single poster I've ever seen on this site with Sarge, sergeant or Sgt in his nick on this site has been a complete and utter arsehole of the first magnitude. I actually think they are all banned now.

You hate the entire US military, or just the non-coms?

412

Velvet Elvis Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:59:08pm

Sad Trombone works just as well as butthurt, IMHO.

413

McSpiff Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:59:35pm

re: #411 Spare O'Lake

You hate the entire US military, or just the non-coms?

I don't think the entire US military posts on LGF using nicks starting with "Sarge" but I could be wrong.

414

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:59:46pm

re: #409 SanFranciscoZionist

Apparently not clear enough. That was why I took care to clarify.

Yes, I hadn't seen your comment when I posted-- you nailed it.

/cue someone looking for a fight to complain that I'm using sexual imagery.

415

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:59:49pm

re: #411 Spare O'Lake

You hate the entire US military, or just the non-coms?

I'm beginning to wonder that myself.

416

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 7:59:54pm

re: #400 sattv4u2

re: #382 iceweasel

This "butthurt" stuff is fun!

Can I play??

Oh ,, wait ,,,I forgot ,,, I can't ,,, i'm not 12 tears old!

Gggeeezzz

You will be one day, fret not my child.

417

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:00:46pm

re: #413 McSpiff

I don't think the entire US military posts on LGF using nicks starting with "Sarge" but I could be wrong.

Is there ONE?

418

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:00:54pm

re: #404 Killgore Trout

I objected to him on his qualifications too. I'm just surprised that race was a factor with more people than I imagined.

that, I don't care about...btw, he's not black anyway

419

sattv4u2 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:01:03pm

re: #416 Jimmah

You will be one day, fret not my child.

You're correct

They say as you get older you regress, so as I swiftly reach those golden years, son!

420

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:01:13pm

re: #397 Racer X

Lets pretend.

OK. We have a black conservative Republican. Can I imagine he's being played by Denzel Washington? Cool. Who are we imagining him in opposition to? The moonbat left, or the radical wingnut right?

//And while we're at it, can I be the liberal journalist who mends his broken heart after his first wife's tragic death in a snorkeling accident?

Sorry. What's the question?

421

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:01:23pm

re: #415 Racer X

I'm beginning to wonder that myself.

Oh please. He made a perfectly legitimate (if snarky) observation about the use of that in LGF nics. There is no reason to pretend that this means he hates the military.

422

Existential_Donuts Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:01:23pm

re: #390 reine.de.tout

Just perused the site. From my perspective (liberal Democrat), THIS is the sort of thing the GOP should be pushing. It's a good idea, but not necessarily in the mindset of a liberal. The refusal by the GOP to participate at all is tragic.

423

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:01:50pm

Order.

Youtube Video

424

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:01:59pm

re: #411 Spare O'Lake

You hate the entire US military, or just the non-coms?

LOL! Now doesn't this just illustrate perfectly the point I made earlier:

Yep - the attempt to personify themselves with untouchable attributes of 'Americaness'. "Why do you hate America - you who dare to disagree with me?"

425

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:02:03pm

re: #389 Dark_Falcon

That's not what butthurt means, Mandy. It denotes someone who can't accept they are wrong and lashes out in anger at those who proved them wrong. It used for trolls, not for you.

I'm just gonna' drop the rope right now with you, Falcon.

426

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:02:15pm

re: #421 iceweasel

Oh please. He made a perfectly legitimate (if snarky) observation about the use of that in LGF nics. There is no reason to pretend that this means he hates the military.

He didn't specify LGF nics.

427

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:02:34pm

428

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:03:00pm

re: #427 Blue Fin

You need a nap?

429

sattv4u2 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:03:20pm

re: #427 Blue Fin

Yawn

Is his first name Michael?

430

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:03:54pm

re: #420 SanFranciscoZionist

OK. We have a black conservative Republican. Can I imagine he's being played by Denzel Washington? Cool. Who are we imagining him in opposition to? The moonbat left, or the radical wingnut right?

//And while we're at it, can I be the liberal journalist who mends his broken heart after his first wife's tragic death in a snorkeling accident?

Sorry. What's the question?

LOL!

I dunno - you lost me too.

My point was there are legitimate reasons to dislike our current president that have nothing to do with race. Some knuckledraggers are all too willing to bring race into that opposition. I do not think it is as prevalent as some here would believe.

431

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:04:01pm

re: #425 MandyManners

I'm just gonna' drop the rope right now with you, Falcon.

Thanks, I think. I don't know what "Drop the rope" means.

432

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:04:48pm

Restraint is a good thing.

RIGHT?

433

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:05:07pm

re: #421 iceweasel

Oh please. He made a perfectly legitimate (if snarky) observation about the use of that in LGF nics. There is no reason to pretend that this means he hates the military.

Evidently it was not so legitimate; and based on some of the comments on this thread, I wonder.

434

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:05:37pm

re: #431 Dark_Falcon

Thanks, I think. I don't know what "Drop the rope" means.

I will not engage.

435

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:05:43pm

re: #374 MandyManners

Why don't you shove your anal-rape terminology into your pipe and smoke it?

Why don't you intercept moronic braincrashes like this before they reach your keyboard?

436

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:06:03pm

re: #356 Floral Giraffe

I'm reading & monitoring the wind here.
50 MPH gusts and my new "garden room".
Shadecloth blew of a couple of hours ago.
Roof is holding nicely,
SO FAR...

whew!
Where are you (generally speaking)?

437

The Sanity Inspector Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:06:23pm

re: #330 reine.de.tout

aw.
We need a short name for you - shall we call you donuts? Or - what?

And, any relation to the milblogger Miserable Donuts?
/

438

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:06:49pm

re: #423 Bagua

Disorder

Youtube Video

439

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:06:55pm

re: #434 MandyManners

I will not engage.

Thank you.

440

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:07:19pm

re: #436 reine.de.tout

Lost Angeles :)
Blowing in the wind!

We'll wash out when it rains, too...

441

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:07:36pm

re: #435 Jimmah

Picking fights with Mandy is not smart, Jimmah.

442

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:07:55pm

re: #440 Floral Giraffe

Lost Angeles :)
Blowing in the wind!

We'll wash out when it rains, too...

We gots rings!

443

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:07:55pm

I have learned two new terms about ropes from Mandy.

444

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:07:58pm

re: #422 Existential_Donuts

Just perused the site. From my perspective (liberal Democrat), THIS is the sort of thing the GOP should be pushing. It's a good idea, but not necessarily in the mindset of a liberal. The refusal by the GOP to participate at all is tragic.

First charity hospital in La. was established mid-1700's, and it's been running and growing ever since.

Yes - this is exactly the sort of thing the GOP should be pushing. And Dems should give a good look at, imo.

445

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:08:50pm

re: #424 Jimmah

I don't think Spare O'Lake is a US citizen.

446

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:09:13pm

re: #435 Jimmah

Why don't you intercept moronic braincrashes like this before they reach your keyboard?

your 'butt hurt' fantasy and the imagery you delightfully conjure is hardly appropriate for a blog of this calibre...thousands of people read this blog and just because you want the verbal attention does not mean it's a good thing overall...plus you sound like some silly punk in a rest stop bathroom

447

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:09:23pm

re: #430 Racer X

LOL!

I dunno - you lost me too.

/

My point was there are legitimate reasons to dislike our current president that have nothing to do with race. Some knuckledraggers are all too willing to bring race into that opposition. I do not think it is as prevalent as some here would believe.

I can't totally make it out in my own mind. I think there's a racial aspect, or many of them. That's far from all of it, though.

I guess it's hard for me to figure out what people are mad about at the moment. They're mad as hell--but they're mad about things that aren't real, or make no sense, or that the last three administrations also did. There's an irrationality to it, and that's where I start to wonder if there's a racial component.

When people are criticizing real things, in a real way, and proposing real counterideas, no, I don't think it's racial.

448

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:09:27pm

I do my best to avoid policemen, lawyers and doctors. They don't even know I'm here and I want to keep it that way.

449

McSpiff Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:09:43pm

re: #417 Racer X

Is there ONE?

I honestly have no idea. Haven't been around these parts long enough to meet everyone yet. Trying tho!

450

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:09:48pm

re: #440 Floral Giraffe

You too? My wife reports debris and dust clouds obscuring out the 101/405 interchange. "Like fog".

451

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:10:17pm

Bloody well right.

Youtube Video

452

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:10:38pm

re: #448 Mich-again

I do my best to avoid policemen, lawyers and doctors. They don't even know I'm here and I want to keep it that way.

include the IRS in that group

453

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:11:10pm

re: #449 McSpiff

I honestly have no idea. Haven't been around these parts long enough to meet everyone yet. Trying tho!

Hi. I'm Sharmuta. I like long walks in the rain and chocolate. And tigers.

Nice to meet you.

454

Existential_Donuts Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:11:12pm

re: #437 The Sanity Inspector

No relation to Miserable Donuts. Unless he is awesome, then it is me.

455

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:11:16pm

re: #434 MandyManners

I will not engage.

Unity.

Youtube Video

456

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:11:19pm

re: #430 Racer X

LOL!

I dunno - you lost me too.

/

My point was there are legitimate reasons to dislike our current president that have nothing to do with race. Some knuckledraggers are all too willing to bring race into that opposition. I do not think it is as prevalent as some here would believe.

We know it's prevalent at certain right-wing blog sites.
We don't know what percentage of the population those folks represent. My suspicion is it's pretty small, overall - but no denying that it's there.

457

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:11:37pm

re: #441 Dark_Falcon

Picking fights ~~with Mandy~~ is not smart.

Fixed for accuracy. And it's pretty clear who was desperately trying to pick a fight.
But I say we just get along in harmony instead...
As a gesture of peace, this is neither an Obama video nor a Rick Roll:

Youtube Video

458

sattv4u2 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:11:49pm

MATH TIME

I'm exhasted
+
it's pouring rain
+
I have a 1 hour drive home
+
Atlanta drivers SUCK in the rain
___
Checking to see if my car insurance is paid up

459

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:12:20pm

re: #450 Rightwingconspirator

Nasty out. I expect the power to go anytime.
I have a new nickname for the Avocado tree out back.
It's "Pig Tree".
There is at least a trash barrel full of avocado leaves in my yard right now.
It's NOT my tree.
Plus, the fruit isn't very good.

460

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:12:21pm

re: #447 SanFranciscoZionist

I can't totally make it out in my own mind. I think there's a racial aspect, or many of them. That's far from all of it, though.

I guess it's hard for me to figure out what people are mad about at the moment. They're mad as hell--but they're mad about things that aren't real, or make no sense, or that the last three administrations also did. There's an irrationality to it, and that's where I start to wonder if there's a racial component.

When people are criticizing real things, in a real way, and proposing real counterideas, no, I don't think it's racial.

Agreed.

Just like with Bush, many oppose the president just because they don't like his ideals, and don't really pay much attention to actions.

461

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:12:26pm

re: #443 jaunte

I have learned two new terms about ropes from Mandy.

Pissing up and dropping!

462

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:12:47pm

re: #457 iceweasel

Fixed for accuracy. And it's pretty clear who was desperately trying to pick a fight.
But I say we just get along in harmony instead...
As a gesture of peace, this is neither an Obama video nor a Rick Roll:

Very good, thanks ice. It's hard to go wrong with the Fab Four.

463

SteveC Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:13:22pm

re: #453 Sharmuta

Hi. I'm Sharmuta. I like long walks in the rain and chocolate. And tigers.

Nice to meet you.

And if you bring her a tiger she can take for a walk in the rain and some chocolate for the trip, you'll have a friend for life! :)

464

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:13:25pm

re: #447 SanFranciscoZionist

I could give you a list of things to be legitimately bothered by with Obama. Or this Congress. see Barney Frank today. But that's all debatable.

Which only makes all the shrill crap all the more regrettable. We get shrill instead of substance. Thats the heart of the matter.

465

MisterCookie Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:13:25pm

You know, isn't it great how all these patriotic right-wingers have suddenly become fierce opponents of the Afghanistan war now that its Obama's problem? I saw a post go by that said "I feel bad sending other people's kids to die" WHERE THE FUCK WERE YOU WHEN THIS STARTED 8 YEARS AGO???

466

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:13:46pm

re: #446 albusteve

It's a perfectly cromulent word, a silly word for a silly emotion. It has been in the urban dictionary since 2003, which is like 500 years in Interwebs time.
And your pearl clutching histrionics over it would be a lot more convincing, had you ever responded similarly to other, much worse words in the same way.

467

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:14:08pm

re: #452 albusteve

include the IRS in that group

I think that would generally fall under the "lawyers" group.

468

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:15:12pm

re: #465 MisterCookie

You know, isn't it great how all these patriotic right-wingers have suddenly become fierce opponents of the Afghanistan war now that its Obama's problem? I saw a post go by that said "I feel bad sending other people's kids to die" WHERE THE FUCK WERE YOU WHEN THIS STARTED 8 YEARS AGO???

Laughable post.

Do it again.

469

sattv4u2 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:16:07pm

re: #465 MisterCookie

You know, isn't it great how all these patriotic right-wingers have suddenly become fierce opponents of the Afghanistan war now that its Obama's problem? I saw a post go by that said "I feel bad sending other people's kids to die" WHERE THE FUCK WERE YOU WHEN THIS STARTED 8 YEARS AGO???

Who was the poater? We here have opinions on all sides. The "name" (if it's an frequent poster) wouild tell us if they were a "right" or "left" ie

470

simoom Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:16:41pm

re: #418 albusteve

that, I don't care about...btw, he's not black anyway

He self identifies as black, and given our country's odious history with respect to this subject (One-drop rule) it doesn't make much sense to deny him that claim.

471

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:16:53pm

re: #465 MisterCookie

You know, isn't it great how all these patriotic right-wingers have suddenly become fierce opponents of the Afghanistan war now that its Obama's problem? I saw a post go by that said "I feel bad sending other people's kids to die" WHERE THE FUCK WERE YOU WHEN THIS STARTED 8 YEARS AGO???

Telling liberals, antiwar protestors, and democrats that they weren't American and were traitors, of course. Isn't it interesting how that worked out?

Now the reel Ahmurkins are talking about civil war and armed insurrection. But they're still the patriots, you see.

472

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:17:14pm

re: #466 iceweasel

It's a perfectly cromulent word, a silly word for a silly emotion. It has been in the urban dictionary since 2003, which is like 500 years in Interwebs time.
And your pearl clutching histrionics over it would be a lot more convincing, had you ever responded similarly to other, much worse words in the same way.

what a bunch of expected blather...show some class, I don't care about your fancy verbage or urban dictionary

473

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:17:23pm

Frum's site outs Ludacris as a conservative:

[Link: www.newmajority.com...]

474

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:18:09pm

re: #466 iceweasel

It has been in the urban dictionary since 2003,

Thats a tall standard. not.

475

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:18:21pm

re: #467 Mich-again

I think that would generally fall under the "lawyers" group.

right, my distain overwhelmed me for a second there

476

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:18:28pm

re: #468 Racer X

Laughable post.

Do it again.

I assume he's not talking about anyone here, but rather about the pundits who cheered on Bush's wars and now suddenly have questions about Afghanistan, etc. Cf George Will for a recent example of this.

477

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:18:33pm

re: #459 Floral Giraffe

I trust we both have good surge protection?

478

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:18:51pm

plumb - meet depths.
depths - i believe you've met plumb.

479

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:19:09pm

re: #472 albusteve

what a bunch of expected blather...show some class, I don't care about your fancy verbage or urban dictionary

And I don't care about your notions of 'class'.

480

SteveC Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:19:30pm

re: #471 iceweasel

Telling liberals, antiwar protestors, and democrats that they weren't American and were traitors, of course. Isn't it interesting how that worked out?

Now the reel Ahmurkins are talking about civil war and armed insurrection. But they're still the patriots, you see.

Kids say the darndest things!

481

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:19:43pm

I get distracted for a short time and you-all post over 100 comments.

anything exciting?

482

sattv4u2 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:19:55pm

re: #476 iceweasel

I assume he's not talking about anyone here, but rather about the pundits who cheered on Bush's wars and now suddenly have questions about Afghanistan, etc. Cf George Will for a recent example of this.

he stated he "saw a post go by"
In that (s)he and we are HERE, one can reasonably assume thats what was meant

483

McSpiff Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:20:06pm

re: #471 iceweasel

Telling liberals, antiwar protestors, and democrats that they weren't American and were traitors, of course. Isn't it interesting how that worked out?

Now the reel Ahmurkins are talking about civil war and armed insurrection. But they're still the patriots, you see.

Dont forget, threatening to "Go Galt!"

484

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:20:26pm

re: #479 iceweasel

And I don't care about your notions of 'class'.

obviously, since you don't show any

485

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:20:51pm

re: #483 McSpiff

Dont forget, threatening to "Go Galt!"

Sadly, when in the last year or two haven't any one of us wished that were possible?

486

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:21:18pm

re: #477 Rightwingconspirator

I hope you do.
I'm confident with mine.

Blowing in the wind, here...

Youtube Video

487

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:21:42pm

re: #441 Dark_Falcon

Picking fights with Mandy is not smart, Jimmah.

Ok DF. You are cool with the use of the word butthurt, right? You know it isn't anal rape terminology? But when MM accuses me of using 'anal rape terminology' and I respond on the inevitable way, you say I am picking fights with her? Doesn't compute, fraid to say.

And I also have to add - I missed the meeting where Mandy Manners got canonised and was placed beyond all reproach. Yeah - totally missed that one.

488

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:21:51pm

re: #482 sattv4u2

he stated he "saw a post go by"
In that (s)he and we are HERE, one can reasonably assume thats what was meant

It's a thread about the lunatic comments at hotair. I assumed he or she is talking about a post elsewhere.

489

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:21:55pm

re: #481 ggt

I get distracted for a short time and you-all post over 100 comments.

anything exciting?

The LGF pace is very hard to maintain. Reviewing a thread always
shows people I've accidentally blown off.

490

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:22:06pm

re: #483 McSpiff

Dont forget, threatening to "Go Galt!"

As soon as any of my competitors "Go Galt" I'm going to go get their business.

491

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:22:19pm

Sooo... how about them hot air comments?

492

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:22:27pm

Someone's ego got wounded, Frum vs Hewitt
[Link: www.newmajority.com...]

493

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:23:09pm

re: #491 Sharmuta

Sooo... how about them hot air comments?

They're idiots who are destroying my party?

494

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:23:28pm

re: #491 Sharmuta

see

re: #478 wozzablog

495

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:23:46pm

I repeat, “Yikes.”

Can I throw in a "Yowza"!?!?

496

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:24:14pm

re: #491 Sharmuta

I really don't think there's any chance of Texas seceding, or a general tax strike, despite what some of the Hot Airians would like to believe.

497

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:24:27pm

re: #476 iceweasel

I assume he's not talking about anyone here, but rather about the pundits who cheered on Bush's wars and now suddenly have questions about Afghanistan, etc. Cf George Will for a recent example of this.

I don't know who George Will is. It was unclear where the post was made. 'right-wing patriots' who whine about 'sending kids off to die' in Afghanistan sound like Moby's to me.

498

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:24:49pm

re: #484 albusteve

obviously, since you don't show any

Oh dear. I shall weep piteously into my pillow tonight knowing that I have failed to meet your standards of ladylike decorum. Heavens.

Perhaps one day I might aspire to climb to the dizzying heights of those women whose 'class' you presumably DO admire...perhaps if I tell people to piss up a rope enough, or call enough people 'fucking commie bastards', I might ascend into your pantheon of 'class'.

Or, you know, not.

499

sattv4u2 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:25:05pm

re: #488 iceweasel

It's a thread about the lunatic comments at hotair. I assumed he or she is talking about a post elsewhere.

The thread has wandered far and wide from the original intent, as they often do especially approaching 500 posts

But nice try!

Swingandamiss ,.,,, Strike One !

500

Virginia Plain Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:25:30pm

Derp de doodely derp:

Youtube Video

501

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:25:42pm

My vote is to limit profanity, and especially profane insults, it lowers tone and they are needlessly offensive to many.

502

McSpiff Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:26:00pm

re: #485 ggt

Sadly, when in the last year or two haven't any one of us wished that were possible?

One of my most successful and respect acquaintances recently admitted to me that his dream of becoming of a sheep farmer in Scotland has never died. I fully expect to see him retire there in a few years. I'm very tempted to join him.

503

SilentAlfa Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:26:18pm

"The parasitic blue states will elect the public option and the red states will opt out."

Totally ironic that he called blue states parasitic, when red states tend to get more money from the federal government than they pay in taxes. I don't get it--these people rail and rail against government spending, yet they receive more money back from the federal government.

I say let them secede. Let's see how they do then.

504

Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:26:32pm

re: #471 iceweasel

Telling liberals, antiwar protestors, and democrats that they weren't American and were traitors, of course. Isn't it interesting how that worked out?

Now the reel Ahmurkins are talking about civil war and armed insurrection. But they're still the patriots, you see.

F*ck, I have to give you that one, as much as it is painful to admit.

505

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:26:39pm

re: #465 MisterCookie

You know, isn't it great how all these patriotic right-wingers have suddenly become fierce opponents of the Afghanistan war now that its Obama's problem?

At least Bush seemed to want to actually win the war even if he never really made it clear what winning meant. I think Obama is purposely delaying making a decision regarding General McCrystal's recommendation for more troops because he has the view that Afghanistan is not a necessary war and the more losses we incur, the more American support for our presence there will wane making his eventual decision to not have a surge in troop levels politically acceptable.

In short, I think he already has his mind made and all the waiting for the right opportunity to announce it is just wrong.

506

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:26:48pm

re: #499 sattv4u2

The thread has wandered far and wide from the original intent, as they often do especially approaching 500 posts

But nice try!

Swingandamiss ,.,,, Strike One !

Let's get back to the days of 1000+ posts and the refresh button.

507

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:26:53pm

re: #501 Bagua

My vote is to limit profanity, and especially profane insults, it lowers tone and they are needlessly offensive to many.

Fuckin' A! I'm with you!

/ you saw that coming right?

508

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:27:09pm

re: #498 iceweasel

Oh dear. I shall weep piteously into my pillow tonight knowing that I have failed to meet your standards of ladylike decorum. Heavens.

Perhaps one day I might aspire to climb to the dizzying heights of those women whose 'class' you presumably DO admire...perhaps if I tell people to piss up a rope enough, or call enough people 'fucking commie bastards', I might ascend into your pantheon of 'class'.

Or, you know, not.

give it up...all your words are a waste of time with me

509

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:27:34pm

re: #496 jaunte

I really don't think there's any chance of Texas seceding, or a general tax strike, despite what some of the Hot Airians would like to believe.

The local elected officials likely are well aware of how stupid this notion is. I highly doubt any state legislature would agree to go along.

510

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:27:43pm

re: #465 MisterCookie

You know, isn't it great how all these patriotic right-wingers have suddenly become fierce opponents of the Afghanistan war now that its Obama's problem? I saw a post go by that said "I feel bad sending other people's kids to die" WHERE THE FUCK WERE YOU WHEN THIS STARTED 8 YEARS AGO???

My bet: they were being competitively patriotic Americans and decking their cars in flags because they felt so strongly about defending their nation.

Now that the war is being led, and not wholly unsucessfully, by a man they despise, it has lost its glamour.

Patriotism comes in many forms. The kind where you looove your country, and buy little flag accessories is fun. I like a good Fourth of July blowout myself, complete with themed desserts. But it's like being dizzy in love as a teenager. Fun, exhilarating, it sure feels real, but it mostly isn't.

There's nothing wrong with that, but grown-up love is more valuable in the long run, to a person or a country.

Nothing wrong with changing your mind about a war. But doing it to back one side of a political football game is wrong.

511

celticdragon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:27:54pm

re: #14 ArchangelMichael

Seriously though, this is an urban legend and one of my pet peeves. California is not now nor will it ever be in danger of falling into the ocean. The SA Fault is a transform fault. The west side of it is moving north. In a few million years LA might be across the bay from Oakland, but it wont be underwater unless the Ocean level rises like a mile from AGW.

Absolutely. There are major problems with isostasy (buoyancy, really) here. Felsic continental crust cannot be pulled downward in relation to mafic, denser oceanic crust. California is not sinking. It is slowly headed towards the Gulf of Alaska. Maybe Palin will be able to tell us she can see LA from her front door...in a few million years ;)

512

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:27:57pm

anybody up for a trip to the stupidest blog in history?

[Link: raycomfortfood.blogspot.com...]

513

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:28:26pm

re: #512 SpaceJesus

anybody up for a trip to the stupidest blog in history?

[Link: raycomfortfood.blogspot.com...]

Links to 2 are not allowed. ;)

514

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:28:43pm

re: #497 Racer X

I don't know who George Will is. It was unclear where the post was made. 'right-wing patriots' who whine about 'sending kids off to die' in Afghanistan sound like Moby's to me.

You can't call every embarrassing person on the right a Moby. George Will is one of several conservative commentators who miraculously have reversed themselves on Afghanistan after literally years of being prowar. It is something that's genuinely happening on the right at the moment and it's sick.

It's also not as if the left is free of hypocrisy either. Many of the people who screamed about the Patriot Act under Bush have gone all silent now that Obama's elected, and they support Obama's decisions and policies even when they're continuations of Bush policies they hated. Same thing is happening on the right now with the war.
Anyway, I took the commentator to be referring to this phenomenon.

515

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:28:57pm

Here's an assignment:

Antonio Gramsci

516

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:28:57pm

re: #469 sattv4u2

Who was the poater? We here have opinions on all sides. The "name" (if it's an frequent poster) wouild tell us if they were a "right" or "left" ie

Oh, a post here? Never seen that here. Although I did have one guy tell me that he thought the Patriot Act used to be OK, but now it wasn't because he didn't trust the present administration to have that kind of power. Eejit.

517

funky chicken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:29:01pm

re: #288 austin_blue

I've been drunk in Lawrence.

And yes, there is a large move on (heh) for Texas Dems to cross the aisle and vote for The SMU Cheerleader. It's not uncommon here when a particularly whack R runs against a more moderate candidate on the State or local level. One does what one can...

Whatever it takes to get Perry the hell out of office and away from influencing educational policy down there...the guy is really a mess.

518

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:29:05pm

re: #513 Sharmuta

Links to 2 are not allowed. ;)

ok, the second stupidest blog in human history

519

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:29:31pm

re: #509 Sharmuta

Some of these folks might. [Link: www.tea.state.tx.us...]
Luckily it's not in their hands.

520

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:29:41pm

re: #512 SpaceJesus

The counter below is ticking off the number of people who have died since you opened this webpage. Is today your day? Perhaps tomorrow? What will it be like to face God? See NeedGod.com

Any website this uplifting has gotta be worth my time!
/

521

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:29:49pm

re: #512 SpaceJesus

anybody up for a trip to the stupidest blog in history?

[Link: raycomfortfood.blogspot.com...]

A gold mine:

I think that the theory of evolution is the most unscientific, faith-based, fundamentally brainless idea that ever had the misfortune to come out of a human mind. To compare it to true science is a joke. There is nothing even slightly scientific about it.

522

SilentAlfa Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:29:53pm

re: #505 Mich-again

At least Bush seemed to want to actually win the war even if he never really made it clear what winning meant. I think Obama is purposely delaying making a decision regarding General McCrystal's recommendation for more troops because he has the view that Afghanistan is not a necessary war and the more losses we incur, the more American support for our presence there will wane making his eventual decision to not have a surge in troop levels politically acceptable.

In short, I think he already has his mind made and all the waiting for the right opportunity to announce it is just wrong.

Are you seriously suggesting that Obama intends to maximize American casualties in Afghanistan so he can pull out?

523

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:29:54pm

Looks like "Fighty McPunchy"'s here tonight.

Y'all knock it off.

524

sattv4u2 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:30:00pm

re: #516 SanFranciscoZionist

Oh, a post here? Never seen that here. Although I did have one guy tell me that he thought the Patriot Act used to be OK, but now it wasn't because he didn't trust the present administration to have that kind of power. Eejit.

Don't call me an Eejit !!!

///

(updinged ya)

525

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:30:02pm

re: #505 Mich-again

At least Bush seemed to want to actually win the war even if he never really made it clear what winning meant. I think Obama is purposely delaying making a decision regarding General McCrystal's recommendation for more troops because he has the view that Afghanistan is not a necessary war and the more losses we incur, the more American support for our presence there will wane making his eventual decision to not have a surge in troop levels politically acceptable.

In short, I think he already has his mind made and all the waiting for the right opportunity to announce it is just wrong.

yup...events will decide for him, clearly he is not leading but rather following...meanwhile because of his own inept indecision and wavering public support is faltering...it's politics and nothing else...he does not give a shit about Afghanistan or our people dying over there

526

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:30:34pm

re: #523 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Looks like "Fighty McPunchy"'s here tonight.

Y'all knock it off.

The invisible hand of Fighty McPunchy has shown his influence on the Lizard nation.

527

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:30:45pm

re: #501 Bagua

My vote is to limit profanity, and especially profane insults, it lowers tone and they are needlessly offensive to many.

I'm with you.

528

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:30:53pm

re: #497 Racer X

I don't know who George Will is. It was unclear where the post was made. 'right-wing patriots' who whine about 'sending kids off to die' in Afghanistan sound like Moby's to me.

George Will

529

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:30:53pm

re: #502 McSpiff

Baa!
( Are you going to have those Monty Python sheep that live in trees?)

530

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:31:18pm

re: #514 iceweasel

You can't call every embarrassing person on the right a Moby. George Will is one of several conservative commentators who miraculously have reversed themselves on Afghanistan after literally years of being prowar. It is something that's genuinely happening on the right at the moment and it's sick.

It's also not as if the left is free of hypocrisy either. Many of the people who screamed about the Patriot Act under Bush have gone all silent now that Obama's elected, and they support Obama's decisions and policies even when they're continuations of Bush policies they hated. Same thing is happening on the right now with the war.
Anyway, I took the commentator to be referring to this phenomenon.

We are going to see more of that now that the paleos appear to be driving. They've always been antiwar populist isolationists. Look at Luap NOr's affection for troofers.

531

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:31:22pm

Seriously Floral Giraffe - you updinged 472. Fuck.re: #501 Bagua

My vote is to limit profanity, and especially profane insults, it lowers tone and they are needlessly offensive to many.

Motherfucking upding for you, Bagua.

532

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:31:43pm

re: #508 albusteve

did you ever get that refund?...

533

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:31:44pm

re: #527 reine.de.tout

I'm with you.

agreed

534

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:31:52pm

re: #497 Racer X

I don't know who George Will is.

Mmmm'kay.

535

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:31:59pm

Sheepherding in Scotland would be baaad aaass.

536

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:32:07pm

re: #496 jaunte

I really don't think there's any chance of Texas seceding, or a general tax strike, despite what some of the Hot Airians would like to believe.

None whatsoever. These guys are playing fantasy games.

My husband is a WoW player, but he knows the Lich King isn't real.

537

sattv4u2 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:32:11pm

Okay Lizards

I've got a decision to make

A) drive home in the pouring rain

b) stay at work till the sun comes up

538

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:32:17pm

re: #532 wozzablog

did you ever get that refund?...

what refund?

539

McSpiff Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:32:18pm

re: #529 Floral Giraffe

Baa!
( Are you going to have those Monty Python sheep that live in trees?)

Can't be any worse than the sheep that live in office towers!

/// Fighting the man since 1987

540

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:32:40pm

re: #521 Racer X

in the post below that, he says that we don't know god hasn't healed amputees because it is impossible to know everyone who is or has been an amputee

541

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:33:06pm

re: #536 SanFranciscoZionist

WoW

Whip'em Out Wednesdays?!

BOOB THREAD!

542

Spare O'Lake Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:33:13pm

re: #445 reine.de.tout

I don't think Spare O'Lake is a US citizen.

That's right.
And one of the things I admire about Americans is their respect for their vets and boys in uniform, no matter their political stripe and no matter whether they happen to support the wars in Iraq or Afghanistan.
Gratuitous snide little insults notwithstanding.

543

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:33:19pm

re: #534 bratwurst

Mmmm'kay.

Was I supposed to know?

Shit. I always flunk out in the pop quiz.

544

SteveC Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:33:23pm

re: #516 SanFranciscoZionist

Although I did have one guy tell me that he thought the Patriot Act used to be OK, but now it wasn't because he didn't trust the present administration to have that kind of power. Eejit.

Oh, yes, let's ignore a law when the Other Guys are in power but really get tough when Our Boys are leading the team! That sounds like a wonderful idea!

/not! I'm not quite sure that person thought that idea all the way through.

545

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:33:26pm

re: #501 Bagua

My vote is to limit profanity, and especially profane insults, it lowers tone and they are needlessly offensive to many.

I agree!

546

MandyManners Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:33:38pm

"Large swaths of economics are going to have to be rethought on the basis of what's happened." So said Larry Summers, President Obama's chief economic adviser, in an interview in the weeks after the markets crashed a year ago. Yet to a remarkable degree, economic thinking hasn't changed very much at all. (Click here to follow Michael Hirsh).

Now financier George Soros is announcing a $50 million effort to speed things along. This week Soros is gathering some of the leading practitioners of the market-skeptic school, who were marginalized during the era of "free-market fundamentalism," among them Nobelists Joseph Stiglitz, George Akerlof, Michael Spence, and Sir James Mirrlees. He's also creating an "Institute for New Economic Thinking" to make research grants, convene symposiums, and establish a journal, all in an effort to take back the economics profession from the champions of free-market zealotry who have dominated it for decades, and to correct the failures of decades of market deregulation. Soros hopes matching funds will bring the total endowment up to $200 million. "Economics has failed not only to predict and explain what happened but has also failed to protect society," says Robert Johnson, a former managing director at Soros Fund Management, who will direct the new institute. "That's what the crisis revealed. The paradigm has failed. There is no guidance."

547

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:33:52pm

re: #538 albusteve

from the charm school ;-)

548

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:33:58pm

re: #540 SpaceJesus

in the post below that, he says that we don't know god hasn't healed amputees because it is impossible to know everyone who is or has been an amputee

Ouch. Head hurts from Comfortthought.

549

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:34:28pm

re: #537 sattv4u2

Okay Lizards

I've got a decision to make

A) drive home in the pouring rain

b) stay at work till the sun comes up

What is "last call" in the jurisdiction?

550

The Sanity Inspector Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:34:36pm

I had to spend most of my evening helping my heir apparent with his ocean habitat box. Been printing marine life pics and taping ocean wallpaper to the inside of a cereal box for the past few hours. So, I've taken a quick hopscotch down the thread, and beg pardon in advance if I repeat or short-change what others have said. And do note that I am not whining about the topic, just engaging it.

I believe that this secessionist talk, ugly as it is, is 99% just talk. Just overwrought people venting some violent emotions. When I read some lizardoids fretting about widespread armed uprisings, I'd like to urge them not to do so. There may be the makings of another Waco in these vast mobs of grumblers, maybe God forbid another Timothy McVeigh. But until they actually do something beyond typing vile comments and waving rude signs, I'll count them as less of a threat than the Earth Liberation Front, who burn down ski lodges, vandalize SUV lots, and wreck laboratories, all in the name of the higher good. Less of a threat than the anti-globos, who launch into positive orgies of vandalism and rioting when the G20 summit comes to town. Less of a threat than legislators from urban, majority-black districts, who threaten to incite their constituents to mayhem if they don't get their way, or who excuse the constituents when they do riot. And certainly less of a threat than The Jihad. You know, threats which actually commit actual violence.

Since I am a Southerner, you may say that I am desensitized to the ugliness and menace of what's being said out there. I don't agree. I'm just more concerned with ugliness and menace that has metastasized further than Hot Air's comments section has, so far.

551

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:34:54pm

re: #530 Thanos

We are going to see more of that now that the paleos appear to be driving. They've always been antiwar populist isolationists. Look at Luap NOr's affection for troofers.

I think you're right. I hadn't even thought of it in those terms-- I was just seeing it as more of the same political game playing, akin to some people on the left now being ok with the Patriot Act. But you're absolutely right that the paleos are taking over the driving seat, and that's only going to mean more of the isolationist sentiment.

Good point.

552

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:34:57pm

re: #537 sattv4u2

Okay Lizards

I've got a decision to make

A) drive home in the pouring rain

b) stay at work till the sun comes up

I believe it'sa rainin' all over the world...

553

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:35:10pm

re: #542 Spare O'Lake

That's right.
And one of the things I admire about Americans is their respect for their vets and boys in uniform, no matter their political stripe and no matter whether they happen to support the wars in Iraq or Afghanistan.
Gratuitous snide little insults notwithstanding.

I wasn't meaning to insult you!
Gosh - a million apologies if it came off that way!

554

akarra Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:35:32pm

re: #3 Thanos

Hey, they have that RSM vibe down pat at Hot Air.

They do, and I don't get it: I don't think every single one of these people is a white supremacist. I can understand getting angry once in a while and saying something stupid or extreme. This "let's rant about secession all the time" screams to me that some people not only don't have an imagination, but they can't even conceive what one would do with such a thing.

Oh well, their loss. The more they rant, the more they exclude themselves from important aspects of the political process. I only hope that they fail to vote also.

555

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:36:34pm

re: #547 wozzablog

from the charm school ;-)

/

I'll be your straight man, if you can't get it done alone...no problem

556

funky chicken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:36:57pm

re: #447 SanFranciscoZionist

I can't totally make it out in my own mind. I think there's a racial aspect, or many of them. That's far from all of it, though.

I guess it's hard for me to figure out what people are mad about at the moment. They're mad as hell--but they're mad about things that aren't real, or make no sense, or that the last three administrations also did. There's an irrationality to it, and that's where I start to wonder if there's a racial component.

When people are criticizing real things, in a real way, and proposing real counterideas, no, I don't think it's racial.

I was amazed during the election how many of the Hotair crowd were screaming at John McCain about immigration while simultaneously singing GW Bush's praise for "keeping us safe" etc. It was Bush who was BFFs with Vicente Fox before he was elected and until Fox left office. It was the Bush administration that let the border enforcement go to hell. But you could almost see the spittle hitting the hotairite/Malkinite monitors during their rages against John McCain.

There may be a race component to their screaming at Obama, but since the tenor and content is similar to what they screamed at John McCain, it would be hard to prove it one way or the other. As such, I ascribe it to insanity rather than racism.

557

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:37:10pm

re: #540 SpaceJesus

in the post below that, he says that we don't know god hasn't healed amputees because it is impossible to know everyone who is or has been an amputee

Not a bad point. Has he been contacted by any former amputees? Why is this even being discussed?

558

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:37:10pm

re: #522 SilentAlfa

Are you seriously suggesting that Obama intends to maximize American casualties in Afghanistan so he can pull out?

I'm trying to figure out what he is waiting for. His Commander has told him what he needs to win. We're pushing two months since the famous "leaked" memo.

The most important debate in the Obama administration now is not whether they should follow McCrystal's advice but rather whether Afghanistan is a war of necessity or not. I think it is delaying the decision to either support a surge and try to win or figure out the exit strategy.

559

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:37:14pm

re: #525 albusteve

he does not give a shit about Afghanistan or our people dying over there

One wonders how you would have reacted if you had heard me talking about George W. Bush like this a few years back.

560

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:37:20pm

re: #535 jaunte

Sheepherding in Scotland would be baaad aaass.

They make dogs for that.

561

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:37:21pm

re: #508 albusteve

give it up...all your words are a waste of time with me

Please don't be like this, steviekins.

Youtube Video

562

sattv4u2 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:37:38pm

re: #549 Decatur Deb

What is "last call" in the jurisdiction?

3 a.m in Buckhead ((the restaurant/ club district in Atlanta ))

563

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:37:42pm

re: #555 albusteve

much appreciated fellah

564

webevintage Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:37:51pm

Jesus...what a bunch of whiners.
They lose one election and go ballistic.

"The parasitic blue states will elect the public option and the red states will opt out. "

Well except blue states send more money to support red states so I wonder how that will work out for them.
All of this over...bah! I actually wish there was some place to ship these morons too...

565

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:37:57pm

re: #541 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Whip'em Out Wednesdays?!

BOOB THREAD!

That would be World of Warcraft.

I am a Widow of Warcraft.

566

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:38:06pm

re: #540 SpaceJesus

in the post below that, he says that we don't know god hasn't healed amputees because it is impossible to know everyone who is or has been an amputee

Well, he does have a point... we can't know the unknown or the unknowable, kinda goes with the territory.

567

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:38:10pm

re: #560 Sharmuta

For which there are witnesses!

568

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:38:50pm

re: #550 The Sanity Inspector

You are right in that it's a lot of bs talk, but the ugly underbelly of that is that terrorists need sympathizers to justify their cause and survive. If Pakistan had not catered to so many who were certifiably sympathetic to terrorists they wouldn't be living in daily fear of the next car bomb now.

569

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:38:50pm

re: #564 webevintage

Two elections...

2006 and 2008.

570

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:39:02pm

re: #537 sattv4u2

Okay Lizards

I've got a decision to make

A) drive home in the pouring rain

b) stay at work till the sun comes up

A. You'll feel 100x better laying your head on your pillow than working through the night.

571

sattv4u2 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:39:03pm

The hell with it ,,,

I'm driving home

Nothing like my own bed !

Cya all later!

572

The Sanity Inspector Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:39:04pm

re: #501 Bagua

My vote is to limit profanity, and especially profane insults, it lowers tone and they are needlessly offensive to many.

Heartily seconded. A profane insult just shows the poster's deficiency as a thinker AND a writer.

Reminds me: Barrett Brown, are you here? You're a not-half-bad columnist; why don't you try to phase out the potty mouth? You can still be scathing with the King's English, if you grow your skills. Read some Mencken to see how it's done.

573

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:39:04pm

re: #543 Racer X

Was I supposed to know?

Shit. I always flunk out in the pop quiz.

George Will has been in newspapers for 30 years, he is presently syndicated to some 450 of them. I don't feel like it is going out on a limb to expect that you might have heard of him.

574

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:39:05pm

re: #537 sattv4u2

If its not an epic long drive, go home and drive easy. That's what I'd do.

575

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:39:07pm

re: #557 SanFranciscoZionist

Not a bad point. Has he been contacted by any former amputees? Why is this even being discussed?

There is no rhyme or reason to spacejesus, he simply is therefore he posts.

576

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:39:16pm

re: #531 Jimmah

Seriously Floral Giraffe - you updinged 472. Fuck.

Motherfucking upding for you, Bagua.

Yes, I did. I think that sometimes your "tone" is less than desireable.
And, no, I am not "clutching at my pearls".
I am wincing at the increase in rude, vulgarity, that I see in written and verbal communications, today. A little effort at politeness, indicates, considerations for others feelings. IMHO.

577

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:39:23pm

re: #558 Mich-again

I'm trying to figure out what he is waiting for. His Commander has told him what he needs to win. We're pushing two months since the famous "leaked" memo.

The most important debate in the Obama administration now is not whether they should follow McCrystal's advice but rather whether Afghanistan is a war of necessity or not. I think it is delaying the decision to either support a surge and try to win or figure out the exit strategy.

Indecision.

He's waiting for a poll.

578

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:39:38pm

re: #567 jaunte

For which there are witnesses!

Best line evah.

579

SteveC Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:39:47pm

re: #497 Racer X

I don't know who George Will is.

All American, Number 1 draft choice out of Ohio State. Left tackle for the Anchorage Eskimos in 1968. Abruptly quit the team six weeks into the season, said he quit because "When we play on the road, someone tries to kick my nuts off. When we play at home, they freeze up. I'm tired of peeing icecubes!"

580

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:39:50pm

re: #501 Bagua

My vote is to limit profanity, and especially profane insults, it lowers tone and they are needlessly offensive to many.

I'll be perfectly happy to eschew profanity-- on the day that it's a rule here. And I have no problem toning it down (and have) for certain posters. But I object to the selective enforcement of that faux-rule only against certain members here--and I especially object to the people who pretend to be mortally wounded by the non-profane word butthurt* and have no problem at all with actual obscenities.

*No, I am not talking about the consistent people who object to all profanity here.

581

sattv4u2 Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:39:57pm

re: #574 Rightwingconspirator

If its not an epic long drive, go home and drive easy. That's what I'd do.

About an hour. I've already filled my travel mug with coffee

582

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:40:30pm

re: #562 sattv4u2

3 a.m in Buckhead ((the restaurant/ club district in Atlanta ))

There's half your problem solved.

d). Take a cab.

583

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:40:47pm

re: #571 sattv4u2

The hell with it ,,,

I'm driving home

Nothing like my own bed !

Cya all later!

I win!

584

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:40:53pm

re: #581 sattv4u2

Best to ya. I'm out to bed soon. Howling wind!

585

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:41:20pm

re: #537 sattv4u2

I've got a decision to make

A) drive home in the pouring rain

b) stay at work till the sun comes up

I say drive home but be careful. Go a bit slower than usual and stay out of the fast lane lest a bulldog be staring at you from 5' behind the rear window.

586

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:41:30pm

re: #573 bratwurst

George Will has been in newspapers for 30 years, he is presently syndicated to some 450 of them. I don't feel like it is going out on a limb to expect that you might have heard of him.

Must not have made an impact in my grey matter.

/I'm dense

587

celticdragon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:41:30pm

re: #505 Mich-again

At least Bush seemed to want to actually win the war even if he never really made it clear what winning meant. I think Obama is purposely delaying making a decision regarding General McCrystal's recommendation for more troops because he has the view that Afghanistan is not a necessary war and the more losses we incur, the more American support for our presence there will wane making his eventual decision to not have a surge in troop levels politically acceptable.

In short, I think he already has his mind made and all the waiting for the right opportunity to announce it is just wrong.

You're joking, right??

You mean the President Bush whose SecDef cut funding, troop levels and support for population pacification/education/etc down to insanely unsustainable levels??!

The President who ignored Afghanistan for years while fucking around and damned near losing Iraq in the bargain??!

The sheer mendacity and incompetency of this last administration...particularly in warfighting and foreign affairs...is what finally led to my break with the Republican Party. Nobody stood up to him from within the ranks. Not one damned Republican congressman. Nobody said a fucking thing when General Shalikashvilli was shown the door for telling Rumsfeld that it would take thousands more troops to hold Iraq than he wanted to hear. Nobody in the party said a Goddamned thing when we saw Iraq turn into a Hobbesian nightmare in 2006 and Anbar Province was occupied by the enemy. We got Ann Coulter on TV telling us things were going "swimmingly", while Rush, the idiots at TownHall.com and Hannity were mocking the MSM and calling them seditionists for suggesting that things had gone off the rails.

Bush and Rumsfeld were the worst thing to happen to our military in the last 30 years. They destroyed 50 years of Republican brand in foreign affairs realism and competency. They damned near wrecked the Army and the Marines. I curse the day I voted that buffoon and his pack of fools into office

588

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:41:50pm

re: #564 webevintage

Jesus...what a bunch of whiners.
They lose one election and go ballistic.

"The parasitic blue states will elect the public option and the red states will opt out. "

Well except blue states send more money to support red states so I wonder how that will work out for them.

But how can that be? The conservatives work, and the liberals feed off the entitlements of the nanny state. I've been told that sooo many times...

//OK, this is one recurrent refrain that makes me angry

589

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:41:54pm

re: #501 Bagua

My vote is to limit profanity, and especially profane insults, it lowers tone and they are needlessly offensive to many.

Are terms from the urban dictionary OK?

590

SpaceJesus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:41:58pm

re: #557 SanFranciscoZionist

Not a bad point. Has he been contacted by any former amputees? Why is this even being discussed?

if i had to wonder a guess as to why mr. comfort is discussing this, i think it's because he is insane

591

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:42:43pm

re: #572 The Sanity Inspector

Heartily seconded. A profane insult just shows the poster's deficiency as a thinker AND a writer.

Reminds me: Barrett Brown, are you here? You're a not-half-bad columnist; why don't you try to phase out the potty mouth? You can still be scathing with the King's English, if you grow your skills. Read some Mencken to see how it's done.

I think Barrett Brown's writing is just fine as it is. Sometimes a little profanity is what is required. YMMV.

592

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:43:07pm

re: #580 iceweasel

I'll be perfectly happy to eschew profanity-- on the day that it's a rule here. And I have no problem toning it down (and have) for certain posters. But I object to the selective enforcement of that faux-rule only against certain members here--and I especially object to the people who pretend to be mortally wounded by the non-profane word butthurt* and have no problem at all with actual obscenities.

*No, I am not talking about the consistent people who object to all profanity here.

That would be something. I must say, I find it ironic that it becomes a topic when we're referring to the word "butthurt." But, like they say, context is everything.

593

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:43:13pm

re: #558 Mich-again

I'm trying to figure out what he is waiting for. His Commander has told him what he needs to win. We're pushing two months since the famous "leaked" memo.

he's waiting too...supposedly he had thing figured out last spring, but he's trying to get it exactly right...like Sherman, Ike, Schwarzkopf...exactly right

594

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:43:17pm

re: #586 Racer X

Must not have made an impact in my grey matter.

/I'm dense

That's ok...he is just another example of the infamous liberal media bias.

595

The Sanity Inspector Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:43:24pm

re: #542 Spare O'Lake

That's right.
And one of the things I admire about Americans is their respect for their vets and boys in uniform, no matter their political stripe and no matter whether they happen to support the wars in Iraq or Afghanistan.
Gratuitous snide little insults notwithstanding.

Not all, sadly. But we are lucky beyond common comprehension, that admiration for our military is one of the ties that bind our nation together.

596

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:43:46pm

Firefox is acting strange. Anyone else having issues?

597

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:44:05pm

re: #576 Floral Giraffe

I keep saying I'm going to do better...then forget/ignore.

598

shutdown Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:44:09pm

Those secessionist discussion threads are like Vienna before WWII - everybody is actually a government operative, trying to spy on "bad guys". Except the real villains have long since gone elsewhere, so as not to be spied on.

599

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:44:16pm

re: #596 jaunte

not lately

600

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:44:24pm

re: #589 Mich-again

Are terms from the urban dictionary OK?

It is not a profane or obscene word, despite the best efforts of some here to pretend that it is.

601

The Sanity Inspector Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:44:47pm

re: #537 sattv4u2

Okay Lizards

I've got a decision to make

A) drive home in the pouring rain

b) stay at work till the sun comes up

Who's waiting for you at home? I vote go home and sleep, all other things being equal.

602

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:44:55pm

re: #599 wozzablog

Couldn't 'quote' or 'reply' there for a minute.

603

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:44:59pm

re: #596 jaunte

Firefox is acting strange. Anyone else having issues?

Well- there is a serious lack of chocolate in the house, and... oh!

You meant browser issues. Try Safari.

604

The Sanity Inspector Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:45:01pm

re: #596 jaunte

Firefox is acting strange. Anyone else having issues?

Not me.

605

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:45:05pm

re: #593 albusteve

he's waiting too...supposedly he had thing figured out last spring, but he's trying to get it exactly right...like Sherman, Ike, Schwarzkopf...exactly right

Even the game of Scrabble comes with an egg timer.

606

Spare O'Lake Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:45:08pm

re: #553 reine.de.tout

I wasn't meaning to insult you!
Gosh - a million apologies if it came off that way!

No Reine, you were supporting me. It was the one to whom you directed your comment who is the insulting one.

607

funky chicken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:45:11pm

re: #505 Mich-again

At least Bush seemed to want to actually win the war even if he never really made it clear what winning meant. I think Obama is purposely delaying making a decision regarding General McCrystal's recommendation for more troops because he has the view that Afghanistan is not a necessary war and the more losses we incur, the more American support for our presence there will wane making his eventual decision to not have a surge in troop levels politically acceptable.

In short, I think he already has his mind made and all the waiting for the right opportunity to announce it is just wrong.

It was really hard to tell that Bush wanted to win the war in 2005 and a lot of 2006. He made pretty much the exact same mistakes in Iraq that Obama is making in Afghanistan. I got into lots of heated arguments here at LGF along those lines back in 2005/2006...Bill Clinton slashed the active duty military force during peacetime to balance the budget. Hillary Clinton was 100% right when she said that Bill Clinton's military force structure took out the Taliban and Saddam Hussein...because Bush ran on "fixing the military" a la Reagan, but then didn't do a damn thing about it, and then sent them off to two wars and provided piss poor leadership and idiotic ROEs that got lots of our guys hurt and killed in Iraq in '05 and '06. Yeah, he made speeches about "supporting the troops," but until the GOP lost congress, the material support was crap.

Rumsfeld made a glib reply to a soldier who asked in late 2004 why they didn't have enough armored vehicles. Do you remember the "you go to war with the army you have" answer? That was over 3 years from 9/11/01. They had plenty of time to build the Clinton army structure and materiel, but they didn't do it.

608

SteveC Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:46:01pm

re: #596 jaunte

Firefox is acting strange. Anyone else having issues?

No, but I'm still running version 3.0.8. I've heard BAD THINGS about the upgrade and can't decide. My computer hates me, it wants to update and I keep saying no.

609

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:46:09pm

re: #606 Spare O'Lake

Just so you knew I had no intention of insulting you. . .

610

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:46:25pm

I would not presume to speak for Charles but one day he linked to ED (for the word flounce NSFW) and that was a pretty good indication that he has no problems with potty mouths. He doesn't seem to like random or excessive use of expletives, though, understandably.

611

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:46:30pm

re: #587 celticdragon

I'll bring you back to reality:

How comfortable would you have been with Al Gore running the show?

612

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:46:33pm

re: #605 Mich-again

Even the game of Scrabble comes with an egg timer.

Not internet scrabble.
We have 2 days to play.

613

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:47:11pm

614

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:47:20pm

re: #608 SteveC

So far that stutter has been the only glitch.

615

shutdown Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:47:27pm

re: #596 jaunte

which os are you using?

616

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:48:02pm

re: #593 albusteve

(snip)
he's waiting too...supposedly he had thing figured out last spring, but he's trying to get it exactly right...like Sherman, Ike, Schwarzkopf...exactly right

I can't imagine what any realistic "good" COA or outcome would be.
Not every problem is open to solution.

617

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:48:14pm

re: #615 imp_62

Mac OSX, 10.4.11

618

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:48:14pm

re: #606 Spare O'Lake

No Reine, you were supporting me. It was the one to whom you directed your comment who is the insulting one.

In other words, when you wrote this:

Gratuitous snide little insults notwithstanding.

you were...making a gratuitous and snide little insult?

Apparently so.
Physician, heal thyself.

619

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:48:42pm

re: #610 bosforus

I have been impressed by the lack of profanity at least as far as personally directed goes. I must admit though my favorite ever was Mandy Manners at Rush... I was truly glad there is no rule. I enjoyed seeing that post on the left side top links. It was the nuclear F bomb. Right On Target.

620

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:49:01pm

re: #580 iceweasel

I'll be perfectly happy to eschew profanity-- on the day that it's a rule here. And I have no problem toning it down (and have) for certain posters. But I object to the selective enforcement of that faux-rule only against certain members here--and I especially object to the people who pretend to be mortally wounded by the non-profane word butthurt* and have no problem at all with actual obscenities.

*No, I am not talking about the consistent people who object to all profanity here.

Thank you for that!

And in your case, I think you use it more conversationally, not crudely, but for some of us hearing references to butts comes across as juvenile and we like to pretend were grown ups.

621

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:49:57pm

re: #619 Rightwingconspirator

I have been impressed by the lack of profanity at least as far as personally directed goes. I must admit though my favorite ever was Mandy Manners at Rush... I was truly glad there is no rule. I enjoyed seeing that post on the left side top links. It was the nuclear F bomb. Right On Target.

Ha ha, that's true. Context is the key.

622

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:50:16pm

re: #607 funky chicken

It was really hard to tell that Bush wanted to win the war in 2005 and a lot of 2006. He made pretty much the exact same mistakes in Iraq that Obama is making in Afghanistan. I got into lots of heated arguments here at LGF along those lines back in 2005/2006...Bill Clinton slashed the active duty military force during peacetime to balance the budget. Hillary Clinton was 100% right when she said that Bill Clinton's military force structure took out the Taliban and Saddam Hussein...because Bush ran on "fixing the military" a la Reagan, but then didn't do a damn thing about it, and then sent them off to two wars and provided piss poor leadership and idiotic ROEs that got lots of our guys hurt and killed in Iraq in '05 and '06. Yeah, he made speeches about "supporting the troops," but until the GOP lost congress, the material support was crap.

Rumsfeld made a glib reply to a soldier who asked in late 2004 why they didn't have enough armored vehicles. Do you remember the "you go to war with the army you have" answer? That was over 3 years from 9/11/01. They had plenty of time to build the Clinton army structure and materiel, but they didn't do it.

We got into a strange mindset under Bush and especially in the Rumsfeld days, that you could run two foreign wars and not have it translate into a wartime economy, or any general sacrifice. Didn't work perfectly.

You know that old slogan about how it would be a great day when the schools had all the money they needed, and the Navy had to hold a bakesale to buy a fighter plane? We didn't get the schools much but we did have people holding bakesales and carwashes to buy their sons and daughters armor to go to war in.

Bad times. If you're going to fight, you gotta pay.

623

reine.de.tout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:50:37pm

re: #600 iceweasel

It is not a profane or obscene word, despite the best efforts of some here to pretend that it is.

oh, heck.
I know this is no secret - I don't like it, regardless of it's status or non-status as profanity. It's just ugly sounding. Like the term "red-ass" to mean upset or angry. I just - don't like it.

Profanity can sometimes be used in a way that underscores a point or is humorous (Barrett Brown), and I don't have a problem with that. It's when it's when profanity (or just snark) is used in an attempt to deflect the conversation from the topic at hand to the insult made with the profanity - that's when I think it's useless and just sort of drags the whole tenor of the conversation down to a lower level.

Just my .02.

624

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:50:41pm

re: #621 bosforus

Mandy I hope you saw that. Epic.

625

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:51:23pm

re: #576 Floral Giraffe

Yes, I did. I think that sometimes your "tone" is less than desireable.
And, no, I am not "clutching at my pearls".
I am wincing at the increase in rude, vulgarity, that I see in written and verbal communications, today. A little effort at politeness, indicates, considerations for others feelings. IMHO.

But you were ok with MM accusing me, with no validity whatsoever, of employing "anal rape terminology". It was my valid objection that you found objectionable. Right...

626

dominic yeso Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:51:56pm

Leaving the ranting and lunacy aside for the moment ... why not have a honest debate about peaceful secession? I would hate to see the end of the USA as we know it but it may be coming anyway given the ongoing disregard for economic vitality practiced by today's federalism (and in some states). I would rather live in a healthy economically vibrant community than become an indentured servant to federal regulation, hubris, and debt. If in the end that means secession then why not?

627

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:51:56pm

re: #600 iceweasel

It is not a profane or obscene word, despite the best efforts of some here to pretend that it is.

True, but there are plenty of terms in the urban dictionary that are perhaps not profane, but nonetheless their definitions posted in the urban dictionary are well.. somewhat unseemly. I'll refrain from providing examples. You defended your pet word in 466..

It's a perfectly cromulent word, a silly word for a silly emotion. It has been in the urban dictionary since 2003, which is like 500 years in Interwebs time.

Thats why I wanted to know if the other poster thought that terms found in there were OK. I sure don't think its a tall standard. If you like I can post some examples.

628

The Sanity Inspector Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:52:04pm

re: #568 Thanos

You are right in that it's a lot of bs talk, but the ugly underbelly of that is that terrorists need sympathizers to justify their cause and survive. If Pakistan had not catered to so many who were certifiably sympathetic to terrorists they wouldn't be living in daily fear of the next car bomb now.

It's a big no-no to say so in the current era, but I believe that the aggregate mass of ordinary Americans are much more kind, decent people than a representative grouping of ordinary Pakistanis. The sparks are flying, sure; but the fuel for the wildfire simply isn't there.

629

shutdown Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:52:06pm

re: #617 jaunte

Mac OSX, 10.4.11

FF uses a fair amount of system resources; if you have a 1 gig ram machine and anything below a dual processor array you might run slow, depending on other processes that are running i the background. safari is slimmer, or even explorer 8.

630

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:52:52pm

We got us a live one...

631

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:52:52pm

re: #546 MandyManners

"Large swaths of economics are going to have to be rethought on the basis of what's happened." So said Larry Summers, President Obama's chief economic adviser, in an interview in the weeks after the markets crashed a year ago. Yet to a remarkable degree, economic thinking hasn't changed very much at all. (Click here to follow Michael Hirsh).

Now financier George Soros is announcing a $50 million effort to speed things along. This week Soros is gathering some of the leading practitioners of the market-skeptic school, who were marginalized during the era of "free-market fundamentalism," among them Nobelists Joseph Stiglitz, George Akerlof, Michael Spence, and Sir James Mirrlees. He's also creating an "Institute for New Economic Thinking" to make research grants, convene symposiums, and establish a journal, all in an effort to take back the economics profession from the champions of free-market zealotry who have dominated it for decades, and to correct the failures of decades of market deregulation. Soros hopes matching funds will bring the total endowment up to $200 million. "Economics has failed not only to predict and explain what happened but has also failed to protect society," says Robert Johnson, a former managing director at Soros Fund Management, who will direct the new institute. "That's what the crisis revealed. The paradigm has failed. There is no guidance."

George Soros: Destroying America, one front group at a time.

/spits

632

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:52:55pm

re: #626 dominic yeso

*facepalm*

633

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:53:10pm

re: #629 imp_62

Thanks, I'll experiment with some of the other browsers.

634

SilentAlfa Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:53:18pm

re: #558 Mich-again

I'm trying to figure out what he is waiting for. His Commander has told him what he needs to win. We're pushing two months since the famous "leaked" memo.

The most important debate in the Obama administration now is not whether they should follow McCrystal's advice but rather whether Afghanistan is a war of necessity or not. I think it is delaying the decision to either support a surge and try to win or figure out the exit strategy.

He's delaying the decision because he's waiting on the final Afghan election results, because ultimately, that is just as big a factor as more troops, if not bigger. The way the Afghans perceive their government will determine who will win this war. If Hamid Karzai wins and corruption continues to run rampant throughout the government, our position in Afghanistan may very become untenable regardless of how many troops we send. The insurgents we are facing are not just Taliban, but ordinary Afghans disillusioned with their government and what they see as a hostile occupation force come to subjugate Afghanistan, as the Soviets and British have tried before.

As long as the people of Afghanistan perceive their government as corrupt to the core, there will be serious issues. When the democracy we have installed in Afghanistan is proven to be a total fraud, we lose legitimacy in the eyes of the Afghan people. If we were to immediately send in soldiers to uphold and support this corrupt, illegitimate government, the Afghan people would hate us even more. It's wiser then to hold truly free and fair runoff elections to restore legitimacy to the government. That way, when our troops are sent in, the Afghan people will see us as support their democratically elected leader, instead of supporting some man who fraudulently usurped the office. In my opinion of course, it's a more prudent course of action to deploy the troops after the runoff election.

635

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:54:10pm

re: #624 Rightwingconspirator

Mandy I hope you saw that. Epic.

Yeah, I saw it. Was glad it stayed up, too.
Personally, I do not swear (bc, you know, using an asterisks in place of certain letters is a soul-saver/), but I have been around it all my life so I don't complain about it.

636

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:54:20pm

re: #592 Gus 802

That would be something. I must say, I find it ironic that it becomes a topic when we're referring to the word "butthurt." But, like they say, context is everything.

'Butthurt' is a special kind of word - a word that has the power to spontaneously create the very thing it refers to. Is there a name for this class of word? Are there other words in this class?

637

SteveC Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:54:38pm

re: #619 Rightwingconspirator

I have been impressed by the lack of profanity at least as far as personally directed goes. I must admit though my favorite ever was Mandy Manners at Rush... I was truly glad there is no rule. I enjoyed seeing that post on the left side top links. It was the nuclear F bomb. Right On Target.

I wish she would have told us how she really felt!

638

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:54:43pm

re: #607 funky chicken

But, for the record?
One. "You go to war with the army you have." is an absolutely true statement. I didn't find it glib.
Two. That was just as the IED problems were becoming so evident (IIRC).

Now, he's not a hero of mine... but at the time, a whole lot of armchair quarterbacking was going on.

Plans are worthless, but planning is everything. There is a very great distinction because when you are planning for an emergency you must start with this one thing: the very definition of "emergency" is that it is unexpected, therefore it is not going to happen the way you are planning.

So, the first thing you do is to take all the plans off the top shelf and throw them out the window and start once more. But if you haven't been planning you can't start to work, intelligently at least.

-DDE

639

Gretchen G.Tiger Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:54:44pm

I can't keep up tonite.

weet dreams all!

640

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:54:45pm

re: #620 Bagua

Thank you for that!

And in your case, I think you use it more conversationally, not crudely, but for some of us hearing references to butts comes across as juvenile and we like to pretend were grown ups.

Well, I try to at least vary my actual profanities somewhat...

But in general, I do think I use profanities more conversationally. I'm toning it down considerably already, btw. The leftysphere has a far greater tolerance for it. It's interesting how different commenting cultures can be.

But I am juvenile, so that probably won't change anytime soon, sadly.

641

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:55:11pm

re: #622 SanFranciscoZionist

We got into a strange mindset under Bush and especially in the Rumsfeld days, that you could run two foreign wars and not have it translate into a wartime economy, or any general sacrifice. Didn't work perfectly.

You know that old slogan about how it would be a great day when the schools had all the money they needed, and the Navy had to hold a bakesale to buy a fighter plane? We didn't get the schools much but we did have people holding bakesales and carwashes to buy their sons and daughters armor to go to war in.

Bad times. If you're going to fight, you gotta pay.

BO slammed Bush numerous times for invading Iraq on the campaign trail...then he bought Afghanistan for himself, lock stock and barrel...he's playing politics with peoples lives and it's unforgivable imo...he's way over his head now, and has no clue how to reconcile his hawkish position...he's just blowing in the wind while our guys die...spit

642

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:55:11pm

re: #626 dominic yeso

Leaving the ranting and lunacy aside for the moment ... why not have a honest debate about peaceful secession? I would hate to see the end of the USA as we know it but it may be coming anyway given the ongoing disregard for economic vitality practiced by today's federalism (and in some states). I would rather live in a healthy economically vibrant community than become an indentured servant to federal regulation, hubris, and debt. If in the end that means secession then why not?

I thought we settled this at Gettysburg.

643

McSpiff Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:55:41pm

re: #629 imp_62

FF uses a fair amount of system resources; if you have a 1 gig ram machine and anything below a dual processor array you might run slow, depending on other processes that are running i the background. safari is slimmer, or even explorer 8.

Unfortunately IE maxed out around version 5 for Mac if memory serves me correctly. And by unfortunately I mean thankfully, as IE for Mac still haunts my dreams. OS 9 + IE 5 = half an hour uptime in some cases.

644

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:55:54pm

re: #630 Thanos

We got us a live one...

Good, I'm still hungry.

645

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:56:00pm

re: #634 SilentAlfa

Excellent post.

646

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:56:56pm

re: #642 Decatur Deb

I thought we settled this at Gettysburg.

Gettysburg didn't end the war. The Civil War went on for another 21 months.

647

The Sanity Inspector Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:56:58pm

re: #591 iceweasel

I think Barrett Brown's writing is just fine as it is. Sometimes a little profanity is what is required. YMMV.

In certain trying circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate circumstances, profanity furnishes a relief denied even to prayer.
-- Mark Twain

I just sense some potential in young BB, and urge him not to settle for what can be easily found in the local altie rag.

648

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:57:00pm

re: #626 dominic yeso

Leaving the ranting and lunacy aside for the moment ... why not have a honest debate about peaceful secession? I would hate to see the end of the USA as we know it but it may be coming anyway given the ongoing disregard for economic vitality practiced by today's federalism (and in some states). I would rather live in a healthy economically vibrant community than become an indentured servant to federal regulation, hubris, and debt. If in the end that means secession then why not?

You need to set aside indentured. That is just over the top. Economically vibrant comes and goes. The strength of the nation is one part can bring another out of the recession. California has led the way out in the past. This time it will be another state or states. Do not underestimate the benefits of the larger nation. Secession in your context is selfish.

649

funky chicken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:57:02pm

well, off to bed.

sweet dreams, lizards

650

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:57:10pm

re: #626 dominic yeso

Leaving the ranting and lunacy aside for the moment ... why not have a honest debate about peaceful secession? I would hate to see the end of the USA as we know it but it may be coming anyway given the ongoing disregard for economic vitality practiced by today's federalism (and in some states). I would rather live in a healthy economically vibrant community than become an indentured servant to federal regulation, hubris, and debt. If in the end that means secession then why not?

secession is illegal...what's to talk about?

651

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:57:30pm

re: #613 Jimmah

The casual observer of wingnut sites and banned LGF posters comments thereon will observe that there is a remarkable correlation between sensitivity (to the point of fainting) over the word "butthurt" and uninhibited use of "c*nt" as a perjorative.

I think the glaring point there is that none of us post in places like that either. The point is not to descend to that level.

And I don't think you or Iceweasel should be singled out in this, nor is "butthurt" so dire, it's just a bit like farting jokes or potty pants, and it happens to come up tonight.

652

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:57:36pm

re: #638 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

But, for the record?
One. "You go to war with the army you have." is an absolutely true statement. I didn't find it glib.
(snip(

-DDE

You don't start a war with the army you have, you
prepare.

653

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:57:40pm

re: #626 dominic yeso

Because it would be bad?

Sheesh!

654

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:57:44pm

Secession is not viable, because not enough people want it.
I think if those who say they want it saw who they were choosing as fellow citizens, they would change their minds.

Rasmussen:

Three-fourths (75%) of Lone Star State voters would opt to remain in the United States. Only 18% would vote to secede, and seven percent (7%) are not sure what they'd choose.[Link: www.rasmussenreports.com...]

655

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:58:07pm

656

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:58:17pm

re: #627 Mich-again

Thats why I wanted to know if the other poster thought that terms found in there were OK. I sure don't think its a tall standard. If you like I can post some examples.

My 'defence' wasn't "It's in the urban dictionary, therefore it's ok" but rather "it's been around for a long time, it doesn't have a profane meaning, and people familiar with the word (a rather large segment of internet users, even if not those who frequent conservative blogs) all KNOW that it's not a profane or obscene word."

But thanks for trying to pretend I was claiming that words found in the urban dictionary are never obscene. False.

657

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:58:31pm

re: #636 Jimmah

'Butthurt' is a special kind of word - a word that has the power to spontaneously create the very thing it refers to. Is there a name for this class of word? Are there other words in this class?

The only one that comes to mind is when one gets their "knickers (or panties) in a bunch." Or:

to get one's knickers in a twist

1. (idiomatic) To become overwrought or unnecessarily upset over a trivial matter.

658

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:58:42pm

re: #646 Dark_Falcon

Gettysburg didn't end the war. The Civil War went on for another 21 months.

she didn't say it ended the war...she said it settled the issue

659

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:59:23pm

re: #646 Dark_Falcon

Gettysburg didn't end the war. The Civil War went on for another 21 months.

Gettysburg was the high-water mark. There was no hope of Southern
victory, and little offensive capacity, afterwards.

660

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:59:35pm

I'm remembering why I scroll past the comments of several Lizards.

661

funky chicken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:59:46pm

re: #652 Decatur Deb

You don't start a war with the army you have, you
prepare.

and that's precisely what they didn't do

662

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:00:14pm

Hey Dominic, before you come here to debate your pipe dream idiocy, why don't you survey the people in your state to see if they want to secede? I went through this in Alaska years ago. The unhinged nutballs like Joe Vogler were all for it, but the bulk of the rest of the people in the state never were.

You convince your own state first, then come back and debate.

663

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:00:22pm

re: #660 Racer X

I'm remembering why I scroll past the comments of several Lizards.

no shit...what alot of useless blather

664

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:00:31pm

re: #646 Dark_Falcon

Gettysburg didn't end the war. The Civil War went on for another 21 months.

I drove through Appomattox tonight.

665

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:00:46pm

I also cannot believe that the 'butthurt' conversation is still going on. It kind of makes me laugh a little bit, actually. Simpsons are on in a minute, be back in 30. Where will the conversation be by then?

666

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:00:58pm

re: #613 Jimmah

Spare O Lake was unhappy about my observation. Care to elaborate, perchance to unravel, Spare?

667

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:01:36pm

re: #625 Jimmah

Actually, it's the words that you use that offend me.
Not that my being offended matters at all.
It truly doesn't.
It's not my blog.
It's Charles's.
If he's OK with the language, then so am I.
Charles's site, Charles's rules.

668

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:01:40pm

re: #626 dominic yeso

Leaving the ranting and lunacy aside for the moment ... why not have a honest debate about peaceful secession? I would hate to see the end of the USA as we know it but it may be coming anyway given the ongoing disregard for economic vitality practiced by today's federalism (and in some states). I would rather live in a healthy economically vibrant community than become an indentured servant to federal regulation, hubris, and debt. If in the end that means secession then why not?

OK. Let's have a nice discussion. How are you envisioning splitting up this great nation?

/Pouring second glass of wine.

669

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:01:51pm

re: #664 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Fortunately history made sure you did not need a passport and visa. Which I point out to diss secession.

670

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:02:04pm

re: #656 iceweasel

But thanks for trying to pretend I was claiming that words found in the urban dictionary are never obscene. False.

Strawman. I never said that. But on a related note, how does the urban dictionary define your pet word? You care to post that.

671

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:02:25pm

re: #641 albusteve

BO slammed Bush numerous times for invading Iraq on the campaign trail...then he bought Afghanistan for himself, lock stock and barrel...he's playing politics with peoples lives and it's unforgivable imo...he's way over his head now, and has no clue how to reconcile his hawkish position...he's just blowing in the wind while our guys die...spit

Bollocks. Obama didn't 'buy' Afghanistan. He won the election. He inherited the war. We are on track to have double the troop commitment there by the end of the year than we had in December 2008.

Of all the ODS wingnut memes out there, the one that Obama is somehow selling out Afghanistan is barely tethered to reality at all, even by their standards.

672

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:02:40pm

Hideous Rodent May Provide Cure For Cancer

Naked mole rats are unique in many ways. For one, they're the only mammals with a hive mind, obeying their queen as if they were ants. Also, they feel no pain, an adaptation still not fully understood. But most importantly for us, they are the only animals that don't get cancer.

And now, a new study by scientists at the University of Rochester, New York, explains at last why these horrific animals, of all of the world's creatures, are immune to cancer.

According to the scientists, the mole rat's cells express a gene that tells cells to stop dividing. The gene, called p16, forms a second ring of defense against cancer. Most mammals, including humans, only have one gene, p27, protecting cells from cancer. And while most cancers know a way around p27, p16 stops them cold.

In the experiment, researchers gave cancer to a mole rat cell. However, unlike similarly altered mouse cells, the cancerous mole rat cell didn't engage in the non-stop proliferation associated with cancer.

Naked mole rats were already known for their extreme longevity, living much longer than other similarly sized rodents. This was thought to result from their ability to massively slow down their metabolism during times of privation, but this immunity to cancer almost certainly also contributes to their long lifespans.

Some other mole rat facts: their lips are behind their front teeth, they breathe mostly through their skin, and acid doesn't really burn them. I don't know what planet these things are from, but if they're helping cure cancer, I'm glad they're here.

673

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:02:52pm

re: #663 albusteve

no shit...what alot of useless blather

Yeah, people who spit in the direction of the President of the United States get on my nerves too.

674

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:03:27pm

re: #659 Decatur Deb

Gettysburg was the high-water mark. There was no hope of Southern
victory, and little offensive capacity, afterwards.

That is true. Gettysburg did indeed destroy the Souths capability to win the war by attacking the North. Once the South was forced onto the defensive and facing Grant and Sherman as the Union's field commanders, the Confederates had little chance.

675

Spare O'Lake Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:03:38pm

re: #618 iceweasel

you were...making a gratuitous and snide little insult?

Apparently so.
Physician, heal thyself.

You are magnificent.

676

The Sanity Inspector Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:03:43pm

re: #641 albusteve

BO slammed Bush numerous times for invading Iraq on the campaign trail...then he bought Afghanistan for himself, lock stock and barrel...he's playing politics with peoples lives and it's unforgivable imo...he's way over his head now, and has no clue how to reconcile his hawkish position...he's just blowing in the wind while our guys die...spit

He's supposed to make an announcement soon. Hope he's been listening to wise counsel. This is the most momentous decision he will have made so far in his presidency: the decision to send troops into harm's way, knowing that no few of them won't be coming back alive.

677

SteveC Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:03:49pm

re: #668 SanFranciscoZionist

/Pouring second glass of wine.

Savor the wine, don't gulp. It's not a Pepsi!

678

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:04:05pm

I'll wait for the "Kindy McSweetie" thread.

G'night John-Boy!

679

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:04:14pm

re: #672 Racer X

Very cool link.

680

dominic yeso Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:04:31pm

re: #650 albusteve

681

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:04:44pm

re: #668 SanFranciscoZionist

Let's stay with the wine-making regions.

682

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:05:16pm

re: #671 iceweasel

Bollocks. Obama didn't 'buy' Afghanistan. He won the election. He inherited the war. We are on track to have double the troop commitment there by the end of the year than we had in December 2008.

Of all the ODS wingnut memes out there, the one that Obama is somehow selling out Afghanistan is barely tethered to reality at all, even by their standards.

Afghanistan is the necessary war he will never abandon...his words, and your overuse of ODS does not apply...double the troops won't get it done and he knows it...BO screwed himself good on this one

683

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:05:19pm

re: #661 funky chicken

and that's precisely what they didn't do

Didn't start, or didn't prepare?

684

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:06:18pm

re: #682 albusteve

Afghanistan is the necessary war he will never abandon...his words, and your overuse of ODS does not apply...double the troops won't get it done and he knows it...BO screwed himself good on this one

That was my opinion since early in the election period.

685

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:07:07pm

re: #673 bratwurst

Yeah, people who spit in the direction of the President of the United States get on my nerves too.

get used to it...we have a POTUS that is little more than a neighborhood organizer, whatever that is...he's playing a game that he has to talent for and he's getting drubbed...spit

686

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:07:23pm

687

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:07:31pm

re: #626 dominic yeso

Leaving the ranting and lunacy aside for the moment ... why not have a honest debate about peaceful secession? I would hate to see the end of the USA as we know it but it may be coming anyway given the ongoing disregard for economic vitality practiced by today's federalism (and in some states). I would rather live in a healthy economically vibrant community than become an indentured servant to federal regulation, hubris, and debt. If in the end that means secession then why not?

What's to debate? It's a laughable and ludicrous flight of fancy by infuriated fringers who can't handle that they're out of power. It won't happen. It's the fringe of the fringe throwing a temper tantrum. You may as well be asking for an "honest debate" about remote viewing or psychic surgery.

688

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:07:34pm

re: #682 albusteve

Afghanistan is the necessary war he will never abandon...his words, and your overuse of ODS does not apply...double the troops won't get it done and he knows it...BO screwed himself good on this one

The thing is that when the enemy perceives your forces as weakening they are more likely to attack. Same for the opposite.

689

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:08:01pm

re: #636 Jimmah

'Butthurt' is a special kind of word - a word that has the power to spontaneously create the very thing it refers to. Is there a name for this class of word? Are there other words in this class?

Yes. :) Speech acts.

You're specifically thinking of performative utterances.

Performatives are speech acts whereby something is done or changed by the utterance. Examples are promising, swearing an oath, bequeathing, betting.
The classic example of a performative is marriage: saying "I do" or "I now pronounce you man and wife".

I hadn't thought of butthurt as a performative before. :)

690

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:08:09pm

re: #685 albusteve

get used to it...we have a POTUS that is little more than a neighborhood organizer, whatever that is...he's playing a game that he has to talent for and he's getting drubbed...spit

Class.

691

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:08:12pm

Midway
Message from the Gyre

These photographs of albatross chicks were made just a few weeks ago on Midway Atoll, a tiny stretch of sand and coral near the middle of the North Pacific. The nesting babies are fed bellies-full of plastic by their parents, who soar out over the vast polluted ocean collecting what looks to them like food to bring back to their young. On this diet of human trash, every year tens of thousands of albatross chicks die on Midway from starvation, toxicity, and choking.
To document this phenomenon as faithfully as possible, not a single piece of plastic in any of these photographs was moved, placed, manipulated, arranged, or altered in any way. These images depict the actual stomach contents of baby birds in one of the world's most remote marine sanctuaries, more than 2000 miles from the nearest continent.

Wow.

Sadness.

692

mikhailtheplumber Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:09:14pm

re: #646 Dark_Falcon

Gettysburg didn't end the war. The Civil War went on for another 21 months.

It defined the result of the war, the same way Stalingrad defined the result of WWII.

693

celticdragon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:09:14pm

re: #611 Racer X

I'll bring you back to reality:

How comfortable would you have been with Al Gore running the show?

It's hard to say. I don't like Gore. In the end...I'll settle for somebody who actually does the damned job over somebody I want to have a beer with.

Bush was a fuckup. I was wrong to vote for him.

694

The Sanity Inspector Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:09:24pm

re: #576 Floral Giraffe

Yes, I did. I think that sometimes your "tone" is less than desireable.
And, no, I am not "clutching at my pearls".
I am wincing at the increase in rude, vulgarity, that I see in written and verbal communications, today. A little effort at politeness, indicates, considerations for others feelings. IMHO.

I'd like to see a consistently more civil tone, too. But I agree with Iceweasel that there shouldn't be a formal rule about it. I hang out in some places where there is blocking software for profanity, and the posters go to ridiculous measures to get around it. It's fcuking annoying, sometimes.

695

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:10:04pm

I'm sure it's been posted but here is Obama stepping into the fire

696

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:10:08pm

re: #690 bratwurst

Class.

cry me a river you bot

697

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:10:28pm

re: #696 albusteve

cry me a river you bot

Any more names you care to call me?

698

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:11:13pm

re: #670 Mich-again

Strawman. I never said that. But on a related note, how does the urban dictionary define your pet word? You care to post that.

Your google broken, huh?

An inappropriately strong negative emotional response from a perceived personal insult. Characterized by strong feelings of shame. Frequently associated with a cessation of communication and overt hostility towards the "aggressor."

If the butthurt fits...

Oh, here's some more:
Butthurt Conservative:

A conservative that feels victimized when something doesn't go their way. Often comes with the feeling that anything that doesn't reflect their world view has some unfair bias against them.

699

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:11:21pm

re: #677 SteveC

Savor the wine, don't gulp. It's not a Pepsi!

No, Pepsi costs more than this stuff...OK, OK, slowing down...

700

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:11:25pm

re: #685 albusteve

get used to it...we have a POTUS that is little more than a neighborhood organizer, whatever that is...he's playing a game that he has to talent for and he's getting drubbed...spit

Except for that whole senator thing. Whoops! I guess the only senators that count are Republicans.

We got it dude, he's just a community organizer with no experience. We all heard the talking points during the election from the usual stenographers. 9_9

701

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:11:52pm

Sooo... how about them hot air comments?

702

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:11:58pm

re: #686 Jimmah

Oops. SFZ not FG. Damn this wine ;-)

703

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:12:41pm

re: #682 albusteve

Afghanistan is the necessary war he will never abandon...his words, and your overuse of ODS does not apply...double the troops won't get it done and he knows it...BO screwed himself good on this one

What should he have done?

704

Killgore Trout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:12:49pm

Y'all are grumpy tonight.

705

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:12:51pm

re: #696 albusteve

re: #697 bratwurst

Cool it, both of you!

706

McSpiff Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:12:52pm

re: #696 albusteve

cry me a river you bot

You know I think post #663 had an excellent phrase to describe the posts. Real succinct.

707

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:13:07pm

re: #701 Sharmuta

Sooo... how about them hot air comments?

Mama don't allow none o that around here.

Youtube Video

708

SteveC Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:13:36pm

re: #699 SanFranciscoZionist

No, Pepsi costs more than this stuff...OK, OK, slowing down...

My friends in the mountains call that "rockgut" and they usually make it themselves!

709

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:13:41pm

re: #693 celticdragon

It's hard to say. I don't like Gore. In the end...I'll settle for somebody who actually does the damned job over somebody I want to have a beer with.

Bush was a fuckup. I was wrong to vote for him.

The prospect of Al Gore in charge of things right after 9/11 scares the willies out of me. Bush had his flaws, no doubt. Mistakes were made in Iraq and Afghanistan. More will be made. There are many dead Jihadis, and many more alive Earthlings because of Bush.

710

Decatur Deb Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:14:42pm

Getting late in occupied Alabama.
Good night, and joy be with you all.

711

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:14:48pm

re: #704 Killgore Trout

Y'all are grumpy tonight.

I blame it on the Sarge and the Screen Berets.

712

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:14:57pm

re: #697 bratwurst

Any more names you care to call me?

BO got himself into this mess...he himself said he was not presidential before he announced his decision to run...I have no sympathy for him now...people are dying in Afghanistan and I fart in his general direction...his apologists are no better and that includes you

713

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:15:04pm

re: #698 iceweasel

No, I was just waiting for you to hopefully disengage. I'm not sure where you found that definition it wasn't at the urban dictionary. Here is the number 1 definition for your pet word at that site that you mentioned.

some one who doesnt know how to take a joke, and they take the joke like they just took it to the ass.

Classy.

714

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:15:26pm

re: #704 Killgore Trout

I'm feeling pretty good. Was picked to be on a jury today; it's always heartening to see people get engaged like that in being citizens.

715

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:15:35pm

Correct me if I am wrong, but the right had a problem with the re: #712 albusteve

BO got himself into this mess...he himself said he was not presidential before he announced his decision to run...I have no sympathy for him now...people are dying in Afghanistan and I fart in his general direction...his apologists are no better and that includes you

Ok, so we have "bot" and "apologist"...any more?

716

mikhailtheplumber Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:15:39pm

re: #709 Racer X

The prospect of Al Gore in charge of things right after 9/11 scares the willies out of me. Bush had his flaws, no doubt. Mistakes were made in Iraq and Afghanistan. More will be made. There are many dead Jihadis, and many more alive Earthlings because of Bush.

I like the "mistakes were made" line. Almost as if they made themselves.
Bush screwed up. It's not so difficult to admit, or is it?

717

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:15:47pm

re: #701 Sharmuta

Sooo... how about them hot air comments?

ha!...hang in there...I quit

718

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:15:48pm

re: #700 WindUpBird

Except for that whole senator thing. Whoops! I guess the only senators that count are Republicans.

We got it dude, he's just a community organizer with no experience. We all heard the talking points during the election from the usual stenographers. 9_9

True, a Senator, but a Senator for 150 days. His experience was woefully inadequate leading up to being president, and WYSISYG has proven true in his tenure as president so far.

719

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:16:17pm

re: #714 jaunte

I'm feeling pretty good. Was picked to be on a jury today; it's always heartening to see people get engaged like that in being citizens.

Wonderful! Thank you for preforming your civic duty, and I'm totally jealous.

720

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:16:47pm

re: #685 albusteve

he's not getting drubbed - he's being hosed. Obama was elected on a platform that included a lot of stuff that members of his own party in the Senate seem to have no taste for over their Campaign Contributions.

If you doubt the thumb screws haven't been on in private i hjink you have misread the situation.

721

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:17:00pm

re: #716 mikhailtheplumber

I like the "mistakes were made" line. Almost as if they made themselves.
Bush screwed up. It's not so difficult to admit, or is it?

Not at all.

Bush screwed up.

722

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:17:14pm

re: #713 Mich-again

No, I was just waiting for you to hopefully disengage. I'm not sure where you found that definition it wasn't at the urban dictionary. Here is the number 1 definition for your pet word at that site that you mentioned.

Classy.

Nice try.

[Link: www.urbandictionary.com...]

Wrong.

723

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:17:15pm

re: #712 albusteve

BO got himself into this mess...he himself said he was not presidential before he announced his decision to run...I have no sympathy for him now...people are dying in Afghanistan and I fart in his general direction...his apologists are no better and that includes you

I'm not sure that you are building a good case for your viewpoint by making this sort of statement. But I'm at least happy that you're expressing it with passion...

724

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:17:19pm

re: #696 albustevere: #709 Racer X

Yeah, because Gore would have done nothing at all after 9/11. That is totally plausible and an extremely informed opinion!

725

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:17:47pm

re: #701 Sharmuta

Sooo... how about them hot air comments?

"The Union stands as she stood, rock-bottomed and copper-sheathed, one and indivisible." Whether these fools understand that or not.

726

mikhailtheplumber Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:17:52pm

So, how long do you think it'll take some of those lovely loony commenters at HotAir to change from exercising their First Amendment rights to violently exert their Second Amendment rights?

727

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:17:59pm

re: #719 Sharmuta

I can officially report that the Houston Police Department cafeteria is one of the least attractive restaurants in town, but the jury was no longer hungry when we left.

728

dominic yeso Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:18:06pm

re: #668 SanFranciscoZionist

Ok – a split only makes sense to me if and when it becomes clear that we can’t steer our current incarnation of federalism off of a track of self destruction. Such a split maybe avoided by constitutional amendment to further constrain the power of congress and return a balance of power with the states. Given failings there, states, counties, and cities could form loose regional confederations based on common economic and political grounds. Blue state groupings would be free to pursue socialism and would red grouping be free to continue free market democracy style governance.

729

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:18:08pm

re: #704 Killgore Trout

Y'all are grumpy tonight.

Youtube Video

730

Mich-again Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:18:22pm

re: #722 iceweasel

Wrong.

Really?

731

Killgore Trout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:18:40pm

re: #714 jaunte

Good for you. I've been ducking jury duty for years because I'm a sole proprietor. They'll get me eventually.

732

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:19:12pm

re: #731 Killgore Trout

It's actually pretty fun.

733

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:19:38pm

We have a live one and people are too busy defining a schoolyard term to notice. That's sad.

734

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:19:50pm

re: #724 WindUpBird

re: #709 Racer X

Yeah, because Gore would have done nothing at all after 9/11. That is totally plausible and an extremely informed opinion!

We can play "what if" all night. I see nothing in Gore's past actions that lead me to believe he would have done any better, or saved any more american lives in the long term.

IMHO

735

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:19:57pm

re: #713 Mich-again

No, I was just waiting for you to hopefully disengage. I'm not sure where you found that definition it wasn't at the urban dictionary. Here is the number 1 definition for your pet word at that site that you mentioned.

Classy.

I get:

736

mikhailtheplumber Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:20:01pm

re: #721 Racer X

Not at all.

Bush screwed up.

I take my hat off in salute. You are a true chevalier, and a honest believer in politics.

Just for the record, Obama has screwed up a little as well.

737

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:20:30pm

re: #728 dominic yeso

Are you out of your ever loving mind?!

738

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:20:31pm

re: #730 Mich-again

Really?

Yes, REALLY.

797 votes. From 2003.

You, on the other hand, went trawling for a definition to back up your pathetic point. It's from 2006.

739

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:20:46pm

re: #712 albusteve

BO got himself into this mess...he himself said he was not presidential before he announced his decision to run...I have no sympathy for him now...people are dying in Afghanistan and I fart in his general direction...his apologists are no better and that includes you

The ellipses aren't helping your argument, they sort of give the impression that you're not committing to a statement. Also, your total ignorance of the sport of politics is really something. You're posting on a political blog, and yet you're pretending that gamesmanship and a show of humility before announcing a presidential run is totally unheard of.

It's like nerds who pretend total ignorance of all pop culture because they think they're above it. WHAT IS THIS FOOTS BALL? I HAVE NEVER HEARD OF SUCH A THING

740

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:20:55pm

re: #726 mikhailtheplumber

Longer than they can hold their focus.

741

Killgore Trout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:20:58pm

Ugh, a preliminary check and it looks like this is real...
Zogby asks if "Good White People" should worry about blacks and gays ! I'M NOT KIDDING !!!

Her

e how Zogby elaborates the question in a poll for The O'Leary Report not Fox News as previously said:

Federal Communications Commission Chief Diversity Czar Mark Lloyd wants the FCC to force good white people in positions of power in the broadcast industry to step down to make room for more African-Americans and gays to fill those positions. Do you agree or disagree that this presents a threat to free speech?

*sigh*

742

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:21:00pm

re: #736 mikhailtheplumber

all political careers are destined to end in failure - it's best to keep ones feet on the ground.

743

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:21:14pm

re: #728 dominic yeso

No state has a significant minority, much less a majority, of separatists.

744

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:21:26pm

re: #714 jaunte

I'm feeling pretty good. Was picked to be on a jury today; it's always heartening to see people get engaged like that in being citizens.

I got picked to be on another school disciplinary board committee.

They can't make me do jury duty. Getting to the county seat would take me a looong time on public transit.

745

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:21:30pm

re: #728 dominic yeso

"Our Federal Union. It must be preserved!"

- Andrew Jackson

746

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:21:51pm

re: #735 SanFranciscoZionist

I get:

An inappropriately strong negative emotional response from a perceived personal insult. Characterized by strong feelings of shame. Frequently associated with a cessation of communication and overt hostility towards the "aggressor."

Exactly. That's because Mich-again went trawling for a definition to back up his pathetic claim. I don't expect him to back down though, which is kind of awesome, as it'll be an ongoing demonstration of butthurt in motion.

747

Spare O'Lake Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:22:07pm

Urban Dictionary:
butt hurt - some one who doesnt know how to take a joke, and they take the joke like they just took it to the ass

Nice.

748

McSpiff Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:22:19pm

re: #717 albusteve

Is this what I think it is...?

749

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:22:39pm

re: #741 Killgore Trout

Huh? (them not you Kilgore) This is right up there with Perot and "you people". Except in a white room.

750

XopXproxyX Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:22:56pm

re: #717 albusteve

I quit

That's the smartest thing you said all night.

751

freetoken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:23:21pm

re: #741 Killgore Trout

I can believe it... though it sounds like something for which the 24 hour rule might be appropriate.

752

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:23:29pm

re: #689 iceweasel

Yes. :) Speech acts.

You're specifically thinking of performative utterances.

Performatives are speech acts whereby something is done or changed by the utterance. Examples are promising, swearing an oath, bequeathing, betting.
The classic example of a performative is marriage: saying "I do" or "I now pronounce you man and wife".

I hadn't thought of butthurt as a performative before. :)

Interesting. Almost magical, really :)

I just got an update on the reading for this thread from the Greater Wingnuttia Homeland Security :

Youtube Video

753

Racer X Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:23:31pm

My butt hurts.

Goodnight Lizards.

(I'm not kidding this chair sucks)

754

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:23:34pm

re: #741 Killgore Trout

Ugh, a preliminary check and it looks like this is real...
Zogby asks if "Good White People" should worry about blacks and gays ! I'M NOT KIDDING !!!

Her

*sigh*

Zogby shouldn't be asking a question like that. I don't care how much you're paid, you don't do polls whose main effect will be to spread lies and racial tensions.

755

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:23:36pm

re: #686 Jimmah

You will not find any of "those" words in any of my comments.
I do, have Jelly Belly Beans.
Watermellon or Pomegranate for you?
Nom Nom Nom!
( You may have as many as you like, given that we're on the intertubes...)

756

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:23:41pm

re: #726 mikhailtheplumber

So, how long do you think it'll take some of those lovely loony commenters at HotAir to change from exercising their First Amendment rights to violently exert their Second Amendment rights?

99.99% of those guys are shut-in beardos, and I'm guessing the majority of them who crow about the 2nd amendment don't even own a firearm. (even my fey twinkletoes Portland liberal ass owns three, including an assault rifle) It's all talk on a message board. I'm more likely to have a broadway career than they are to go out and start blasting.

The one in a hundred thousand? Who knows. There's always another Scott Roeder out there.

757

bosforus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:23:44pm

Still going strong I see...
:)

758

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:23:58pm

re: #741 Killgore Trout

That's the mother of all divisive push polls...

759

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:24:19pm

re: #748 McSpiff

Is this what I think it is...?

Truly, there's enough of that sort of bad mojo going on around here without wishing for it artificially...

760

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:24:31pm

good night kids.

play nice.

761

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:25:14pm

re: #743 jaunte

No state has a significant minority, much less a majority, of separatists.

I'm fairly certain breaking the Union is unconstitutional.

762

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:25:23pm

re: #726 mikhailtheplumber

So, how long do you think it'll take some of those lovely loony commenters at HotAir to change from exercising their First Amendment rights to violently exert their Second Amendment rights?

99.999 percent of them haven't got the huevos to take on anything scarier than a paper target, and I pray God the FBI is keeping close watch on that 0.001.

763

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:25:29pm

re: #739 WindUpBird

The ellipses aren't helping your argument, they sort of give the impression that you're not committing to a statement. Also, your total ignorance of the sport of politics is really something. You're posting on a political blog, and yet you're pretending that gamesmanship and a show of humility before announcing a presidential run is totally unheard of.

It's like nerds who pretend total ignorance of all pop culture because they think they're above it. WHAT IS THIS FOOTS BALL? I HAVE NEVER HEARD OF SUCH A THING

what I posted is in fact true and I don't split hairs, it's all on record...I'm not trying to build a case, just stating my opinion, and if that's all you've got I'll scroll by your tripe

764

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:26:12pm

re: #750 XopXproxyX

That's the smartest thing you said all night.

haha!...fuck off

765

jaunte Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:26:35pm

re: #761 Sharmuta

Sure, I'm just making the 'two pissed off guys isn't enough for a riot' argument.

766

Killgore Trout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:27:10pm

re: #749 Rightwingconspirator

Huh? (them not you Kilgore) This is right up there with Perot and "you people". Except in a white room.

It's weird and pissed off whatever it is.

Youtube Video

767

Spare O'Lake Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:27:31pm

re: #761 Sharmuta

I'm fairly certain breaking the Union is unconstitutional.

Isn't advocating it called sedition or treason?

768

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:28:03pm

re: #764 albusteve

haha!...fuck off

Oh my! Is this the same person who just admonished me for my 'lack of class' in using the silly word butthurt?

Why yes, yes I think it is.
Bah.

769

XopXproxyX Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:28:07pm

re: #764 albusteve

You know if you say you're gonna quit, you might as well be a man of your word and actually quit.

770

McSpiff Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:28:12pm

re: #759 cliffster

Truly, there's enough of that sort of bad mojo going on around here without wishing for it artificially...

Not wishing it for it at all! Quite the opposite, while I don't think I've agreed with albusteve, he usually states his opinions quite clearly. Although tonight he seemed to get a little off message at times, i'd hate to see him gone.

771

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:28:29pm

re: #761 Sharmuta

I'm fairly certain breaking the Union is unconstitutional.

it is...any talk about it is purely hypothetical, you know, for those RP wizards that want to live in another fantasy world

772

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:28:50pm

re: #768 iceweasel

Oh my! Is this the same person who just admonished me for my 'lack of class' in using the silly word butthurt?

Why yes, yes I think it is.
Bah.

Agreed.

773

mikhailtheplumber Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:28:55pm

re: #762 SanFranciscoZionist

99.999 percent of them haven't got the huevos to take on anything scarier than a paper target, and I pray God the FBI is keeping close watch on that 0.001.

Here's hoping the FBI and the Secret Service are getting better at it. All it takes is one of those armed morons to give us a week or two of half-mast flags, a head-full of problems, and a heart-full of sorrow.

774

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:29:23pm

re: #728 dominic yeso

Ok – a split only makes sense to me if and when it becomes clear that we can’t steer our current incarnation of federalism off of a track of self destruction. Such a split maybe avoided by constitutional amendment to further constrain the power of congress and return a balance of power with the states. Given failings there, states, counties, and cities could form loose regional confederations based on common economic and political grounds. Blue state groupings would be free to pursue socialism and would red grouping be free to continue free market democracy style governance.

So tell me, kind sir. Do you prefer a gravity bong or a glass pipe? Dude's been in office less than a year and it's HRGLBLRGHR SECESSION STARS N BARS SOCIALISM SECRET MUSLIM SATAN

I don't agree with everything he's done, but you are higher than K2 if you believe in any of this secession horseshit.

775

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:29:26pm

Okay Tech question. Is Firefox the best browser for LGF code in Windows XP?
I ask because Firefox is s l o w in g d o w n

776

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:29:27pm

re: #728 dominic yeso

Ok – a split only makes sense to me if and when it becomes clear that we can’t steer our current incarnation of federalism off of a track of self destruction. Such a split maybe avoided by constitutional amendment to further constrain the power of congress and return a balance of power with the states. Given failings there, states, counties, and cities could form loose regional confederations based on common economic and political grounds. Blue state groupings would be free to pursue socialism and would red grouping be free to continue free market democracy style governance.

I assume you're in a red cluster. If so, can you define where you are, and tell me how this area will function as an independent nation?

777

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:30:29pm

re: #763 albusteve

what I posted is in fact true and I don't split hairs, it's all on record...I'm not trying to build a case, just stating my opinion, and if that's all you've got I'll scroll by your tripe

Do you understand a single thing about how politics works? How campaign strategies function? A single thing at all?

778

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:30:47pm

re: #730 Mich-again

Really?

That's from 2006. How are you getting an archived page?

779

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:31:24pm

re: #775 Rightwingconspirator

Okay Tech question. Is Firefox the best browser for LGF code in Windows XP?
I ask because Firefox is s l o w in g d o w n

It is more important to have a multicore processor and lot's of RAM.

You can also shut down as many programs as you can.

780

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:31:25pm

re: #733 Thanos

We have a live one and people are too busy defining a schoolyard term to notice. That's sad.

I'm playing with him!

781

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:31:32pm

re: #769 XopXproxyX

You know if you say you're gonna quit, you might as well be a man of your word and actually quit.

piling on is whimpy...I don't recall you contributing to the argument...did BO claim he was not presidential or not?...did he not claim that Iraq was the wrong war and Afghanistan the right one?...did he not claim it was a necessary fight that he would not abandon?...did he not claim to have come to a solution last spring?...speak up

782

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:31:33pm

re: #776 SanFranciscoZionist

I assume you're in a red cluster. If so, can you define where you are, and tell me how this area will function as an independent nation?

Maybe he's one of those oathkeeper fruitcakes. "It's the sheriff's job"...

783

XopXproxyX Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:31:50pm

re: #775 Rightwingconspirator

Give Google Chrome a try, it's pretty tight.

784

Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:32:11pm

Have any of these people ever studied the civil war in any depth? At the time the country had a total population of only about 31,000,000 yet there were more than 620,000 killed in the war. More deaths by far than any other war this country has fought. Americans are passionate about their government, these people are making a serious mistake in thinking that they will not meet serious resistance.

Now they offhandedly throw out talk of secession and revolution as if there were not going to be any consequences. As if just talking about it will make it real somehow without anything "bad" happening. I notice that none of them talks about the things that certainly would happen. Government bonds and the currency would collapse, trade would disappear, and America would become a third world country to it's creditors overnight.

No imports to this country would mean going to third world status overnight, no new phones, no new computers, no new televisions, hell no bicycles even. Not to mention our farming out of war material production, we can't even build a M1 tank without foriegn parts especially the 120mm main gun that comes from Germany. Not one of our Air Force fighters can be built without parts from overseas.

What these people are advocating without realizeing it is to condemn this country to 20-50 years of utter anarchy. Of a depression far worse than anything in the 30s, if they could think it all through they would know better, but they are thinking. They listen to certain peoples jingoistic statements and except them without reservation. They actually think that the truly horrible thing they are asking for would be good for this country.

785

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:32:16pm

re: #746 iceweasel

Hiya, Ice!
How is life treating you?

786

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:32:40pm

re: #741 Killgore Trout

Ugh, a preliminary check and it looks like this is real...
Zogby asks if "Good White People" should worry about blacks and gays ! I'M NOT KIDDING !!!

Her

*sigh*

Say what?

787

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:32:52pm

re: #779 Bagua

Got that did that. But thanks. Actually this is a pretty strong PC I use it to edit video etc. CS4 etc.

788

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:33:04pm

re: #777 WindUpBird

Do you understand a single thing about how politics works? How campaign strategies function? A single thing at all?

enlighten me...

789

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:33:16pm

I feel like it'd be worthwhile for people who need to go chill - go chill. And for others, let said person go chill and don't prod or mock. Just how I feel.

790

The Sanity Inspector Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:33:51pm

Eh, one more evening where I don't make it to the open thread. Good night, and here, have a rock anecdote:

'Stranglehold' is a masterpiece of jamology. We were in the Sound Pit in Atlanta, Georgia, and I was showing my rhythm section of Cliff Davies (drums) and Rob DeLaGrange (bass) the right groove for the song. I was playing my all-stock 1964 blonde Byrdland through four Fender Twin Reverbs and four Dual Showman bottoms on my rhythm settings--we were going to leave a hole there so that I could overdub a solo later. Then I started playing lead work, just kind of filling in and though I had never played those licks before in my life, they all just came to me. And because I got so inspired and because they followed me so perfectly, that demo is exactly what you hear on the record today. Take one, rhythm track is the song--it made such organic sense with the flow of music that I said, 'I'm not gonna ---with that! That's it, baby.' And that is the essence of why people love it--because it is so spontaneous and uninhibited. The only thing we went back and overdubbed was Derek St. Holmes vocals and my two tracks of harmonized feedback, which come in and out of the entire song. All the engineers and everyone kept saying, 'You can't do that, Ted.' and I said, 'Shut the --- up!' Because I had the vision; I saw what the song could be, and I realized it.
-- Ted Nugent

Youtube Video

791

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:34:09pm

Youtube Video

792

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:34:18pm

re: #788 albusteve

read a book.

i hear Allinsky is good this time of year...

793

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:34:21pm

Wow, that Zogby poll that was posted really is something else. The questions are just so over the top. The one about 'good white people' is something else all right, but all of them are horribly skewed.

794

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:34:43pm

re: #787 Rightwingconspirator

You should be OK with FF then.

795

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:35:09pm

re: #751 freetoken

I can believe it... though it sounds like something for which the 24 hour rule might be appropriate.

Here it is straight from the O'Leary Report website:

Federal Communications Commission Chief Diversity Czar Mark Lloyd wants the FCC to force good white people in positions of power in the broadcast industry to step down to make room for more African-Americans and gays to fill those positions. Do you agree or disagree that this presents a threat to free speech?

[Link: www.olearyreport.com...]

796

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:35:12pm

re: #791 Sharmuta

MUSIC BREAK!
Cool, thanks Sharmuta.

797

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:35:37pm

re: #793 iceweasel

Wow, that Zogby poll that was posted really is something else. The questions are just so over the top. The one about 'good white people' is something else all right, but all of them are horribly skewed.

That's got to be a commissioned push poll, I wonder who paid?

798

freetoken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:36:15pm

re: #791 Sharmuta

There is a definite background commentary in that movie that is about racism.

799

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:36:19pm

re: #785 Floral Giraffe

Hiya, Ice!
How is life treating you?

Hey FG!
Pretty DAMNED good, here, I have to say! How are you?

800

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:36:22pm

re: #755 Floral Giraffe

You will not find any of "those" words in any of my comments.
I do, have Jelly Belly Beans.
Watermellon or Pomegranate for you?
Nom Nom Nom!
( You may have as many as you like, given that we're on the intertubes...)

I know I won't. And I'm pretty certain you aren't going to end up on any stalker blogs either. But I do have a phobia about imaginary food being offered to me on the intertubes ;-)

801

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:36:23pm

re: #792 wozzablog

read a book.

i hear Allinsky is good this time of year...

//

more than I expected from you...why don't you address my questions about BO and his fight?

802

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:36:46pm

Time for me to get some sleeps...

Dawkins at the Edinburgh book fair

Youtube Video

803

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:36:47pm

re: #797 Thanos

That's got to be a commissioned push poll, I wonder who paid?

The O'Leary Report

804

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:37:12pm

re: #794 Bagua

Might be my DSL tonight. I may just open a tab and speed test.

805

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:37:39pm

re: #803 Gus 802

The O'Leary Report

Who the heck is that? Nvrmnd... googling

806

XopXproxyX Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:37:46pm

re: #781 albusteve

Don't talk to me about piling on. I'm on a site that's notoriously right of center, and I'm not. Grow a pair.
And Obama has sent more troops to Afganistan so I don't actually know what you are talking about. It's still his first term, and domestic issues have bogged him down considerably.

807

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:38:18pm

re: #788 albusteve

enlighten me...

There are these totally awesome things they make out of dead trees. They call them "books"! And many of these "books" contain detailed accounts of political campaigns. The reality. The actual strategies from campaigns, not the talking points you're fed by the very people whose job it is to manipulate your opinion. I recommend you read a few.

Your stomping up and down and going IT WAS THE TRUTH OBAMA SAID HIMSELF HE WAS UNPRESUHDENTIAL!! betrays a level of naivete that is almost beautiful to gaze upon.

808

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:38:44pm

re: #795 Gus 802

[Link: www.olearyreport.com...]

Now, if they were going to force BAD white people to step down, I'd be in favor of it.

Lord. Lord.

809

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:38:56pm

re: #797 Thanos

That's got to be a commissioned push poll, I wonder who paid?

I've no idea. I'm looking now. Maybe Gus will find it for us. :)

I think this poll is thread worthy. Looks real so far.

810

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:39:23pm

re: #801 albusteve

you shouldn't have expected anything - i'm on deadline, its 4:40am and i've just sent the words i'm paid for to an editor...sooo... yeah/

also... i did refer to some of Barry's woes in response to you...re: #720 wozzablog

811

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:39:28pm

re: #809 iceweasel

I've no idea. I'm looking now. Maybe Gus will find it for us. :)

I think this poll is thread worthy. Looks real so far.

[Link: www.olearyreport.com...]

[Link: www.endoffreespeech.com...]

812

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:39:56pm

re: #800 Jimmah

Well, I retract my Jelly Belly offer then.
May you have a good glass of whatever you prefer!
SALUTE!

813

albusteve Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:41:25pm

re: #807 WindUpBird

There are these totally awesome things they make out of dead trees. They call them "books"! And many of these "books" contain detailed accounts of political campaigns. The reality. The actual strategies from campaigns, not the talking points you're fed by the very people whose job it is to manipulate your opinion. I recommend you read a few.

Your stomping up and down and going IT WAS THE TRUTH OBAMA SAID HIMSELF HE WAS UNPRESUHDENTIAL!! betrays a level of naivete that is almost beautiful to gaze upon.

you've actually said nothing...I will say this tho...iceweasle will put up her dukes and fight like a tiger, she doesn't say go off and read a book for an argument, she brings one...you might take a lesson from that...I'm out

814

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:41:37pm

re: #799 iceweasel

Alive & kicking!
Beats the alternative.

(Damn this wind!)

815

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:41:38pm

re: #812 Floral Giraffe

Well, I retract my Jelly Belly offer then.
May you have a good glass of whatever you prefer!
SALUTE!

You can feel free to shoot some bellies this way!

816

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:41:55pm

Hey, Freetoken:

5 stress-fighting superfoods

Chocolate
This treat's pacifying powers are all in your head. "Cocoa boosts your body's levels of neurochemicals, which act on parts of the brain to help produce a sense of happiness and relaxation," says Alan Hirsch, M.D., director of the Smell & Taste Treatment and Research Foundation in Chicago.

Stress Rx: Drop some dark-chocolate squares in everyone's stocking, including your own!

817

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:42:15pm

re: #811 Gus 802

[Link: www.olearyreport.com...]

[Link: www.endoffreespeech.com...]

Oh no.

On the O'Leary site: video of them presenting Rush their "Defender of the Constitution Award".

Looks like it happened at CPAC.

818

webevintage Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:42:47pm

re: #784 ausador

What these people are advocating without realizeing it is to condemn this country to 20-50 years of utter anarchy. Of a depression far worse than anything in the 30s, if they could think it all through they would know better, but they are thinking. They listen to certain peoples jingoistic statements and except them without reservation. They actually think that the truly horrible thing they are asking for would be good for this country.

I keep wondering how they function in reality?
If they have read any history?
Do they really want a civil war and do they think they will just be allowed to flounce out of the United States without a fight?
sigh...

bastards...

819

XopXproxyX Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:43:13pm

re: #813 albusteve

I'm out

*waiting for the second encore*

820

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:43:19pm

re: #817 iceweasel

Oh no.

On the O'Leary site: video of them presenting Rush their "Defender of the Constitution Award".

Looks like it happened at CPAC.

Yeah. Political consultant. That book "The Audacity of Deceit" was published by World Nut Daily. I'm sure he's a nirther.

821

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:43:38pm

re: #813 albusteve

Sir - in the language of this sphere we call blog - i believe you got Pwned - a Waaambulance was called for - and you have left in it.

822

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:45:01pm

re: #817 iceweasel

Oh no.

On the O'Leary site: video of them presenting Rush their "Defender of the Constitution Award".

Looks like it happened at CPAC.

More here at the LA Times:

O'Leary, the author of 11 books, is the former president of the American Assn. of Political Consultants. He did a 10-year stint as a talk show host on NBC/Westwood One, drawing 2 million listeners daily.

O'Leary produced more than two dozen TV specials, including shows on President Reagan and Pope John Paul II, and appears frequently on Fox News Channel's "Fox & Friends."

823

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:45:09pm

re: #814 Floral Giraffe

[Link: www.wunderground.com...]

That radar trace has got to be dust!

824

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:45:22pm

O'Leary likes Limbaugh...
also some articles in the current issue

* Pelosi-Baucus Support Political Euthanasia
* Voters Reject Obama's New Terror Interrogation Unit
* Small Businesses Say "No Sale" to Health Care Reform
* Obama: Legalize Illegals So They Can Get Health Care
* NY Voters Force Gun-banner to Seek New Line of Work
* Specter Trying to Fool PA Voters Again

Looking through the google page for the O'Leary report, looks like he does a lot of custom polling in search the answer Socons want when Rush or someone wants to break a new story or angle. So likely we will see these results on Rush, WND, or some like site.

825

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:45:32pm

re: #815 bratwurst

You can feel free to shoot some bellies this way!

Boom! Greeen are watermellon, red pomegranate!
Nom Nom Nom!

826

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:45:57pm

re: #819 XopXproxyX

re: #821 wozzablog

Most unkind.

827

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:46:21pm

re: #818 webevintage

I keep wondering how they function in reality?
If they have read any history?
Do they really want a civil war and do they think they will just be allowed to flounce out of the United States without a fight?
sigh...

bastards...

They just want to wake up in a fantasy world. I think most of them don't understand just how much they get back from the U.S. government, and imagine themselves being much more prosperous if they were alllowed to keep all their money.

It's like a child who imagines that if his parents disappeared he would be allowed to eat chocolate all day long and watch TV late.

828

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:46:43pm

re: #795 Gus 802

[Link: www.olearyreport.com...]

Here's a link from O'Leary's main page:

O'Leary presents Limbaugh Defender of Constitution Award

Fail so thick you can cut it with a carving knife.

829

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:47:01pm

Anyway, I have to get some sleeps. G'nite all.

830

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:47:14pm

re: #827 SanFranciscoZionist

You nailed it.

831

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:47:22pm

re: #817 iceweasel

Oh no.

On the O'Leary site: video of them presenting Rush their "Defender of the Constitution Award".

Looks like it happened at CPAC.

re: #828 Dark_Falcon

Here's a link from O'Leary's main page:

O'Leary presents Limbaugh Defender of Constitution Award

Fail so thick you can cut it with a carving knife.

GMTA

832

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:47:29pm

re: #826 cliffster

but not - in terms of what was dished out - unwarranted.

833

[deleted] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:47:39pm

834

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:47:41pm

re: #825 Floral Giraffe

Boom! Greeen are watermellon, red pomegranate!
Nom Nom Nom!

I love watermelon jelly bellies.

835

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:48:02pm

re: #834 SanFranciscoZionist

freak

836

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:48:12pm

re: #833 freetoken

I may do one better than chocolate.

837

freetoken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:48:33pm

Foo on blogspot...

Here is some medicine for ya!

838

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:49:12pm

re: #835 wozzablog

freak

/

Ah, a pomegranate fan...

839

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:49:13pm

re: #826 cliffster

hey, at least we're not constantly spitting! :D

840

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:49:13pm

re: #837 freetoken

Thats gonna look much better in about five minutes...

841

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:49:46pm

re: #817 iceweasel

Oh no.

On the O'Leary site: video of them presenting Rush their "Defender of the Constitution Award".

Looks like it happened at CPAC.

re: #828 Dark_Falcon

Here's a link from O'Leary's main page:

O'Leary presents Limbaugh Defender of Constitution Award

Fail so thick you can cut it with a carving knife.

Brad "Good White People" O'Leary giving an award to (cough) Rush Limbaugh (cough) at the same CPAC event (cough) where they honored Jesse Helms (cough).

842

dominic yeso Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:50:04pm

FTR, I’m not advocating secession, nor do I support it, I just wonder if its something to really fear or not. And no, I'm not high nor do I have any idea as to how something like regional governance entities would work and ... this is not about Obama.

It seems to me there are clear and present indications that we are in for a world of hurt if we don’t get our economic house in order. Our present practice of government at the federal level and in some states is a major impediment to our well being and long term vitality as a culture. Perhaps that opinion is not shared by others here and that’s OK. Only time will tell how things will turn out. But history is littered with empires that failed for whatever reason and a lesson that I take is that we are not immune to failing as well and if that failure day comes who knows what our geo-political make up will look like?

843

freetoken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:50:07pm

re: #840 Rightwingconspirator

Cognac is a classic choice with which to chase theobromine...

/just don't use beer!

844

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:50:11pm

re: #820 Gus 802

Yeah. Political consultant. That book "The Audacity of Deceit" was published by World Nut Daily. I'm sure he's a nirther.

I just found this lovely gem at his site from May (PDF)
[Link: www.olearyreport.com...]

It's titled: O’Leary Report: FCC Chairman Copps and Diversity Committee Chairman Rivera Talk of Bringing Race War to Broadcast
Corporations

In it he pushes the wingnut meme that the FCC is going to shut down all conservative talk radio, but with a special racist-y flavour: he says the FCC will use 'diversity' to give those radio slots to black people and gay people. I'm sensing a pattern to this guys obsessions...no wonder he commissioned that exact question.

845

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:50:29pm

re: #838 Floral Giraffe

on occasion ;-)

846

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:52:15pm

re: #843 freetoken

All I'm sayin is I used a lighter. Anger management. No, not arson. LOL.

847

freetoken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:53:40pm

re: #846 Rightwingconspirator

No chocolate brownies?

848

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:53:56pm

re: #844 iceweasel

I just found this lovely gem at his site from May (PDF)
[Link: www.olearyreport.com...]

It's titled: O’Leary Report: FCC Chairman Copps and Diversity Committee Chairman Rivera Talk of Bringing Race War to Broadcast
Corporations

In it he pushes the wingnut meme that the FCC is going to shut down all conservative talk radio, but with a special racist-y flavour: he says the FCC will use 'diversity' to give those radio slots to black people and gay people. I'm sensing a pattern to this guys obsessions...no wonder he commissioned that exact question.

Right. Mark Lloyd is just a committee chairman. And only a chairman of the diversity program. The FCC is a commission and not one person runs the FCC. More paranoia. Besides, it's not like the FCC did wonderful work with radio in the previous years. What with the cable monopolies, morning zoo programs, and the multitude of K-Rock stations they ended up promoting through their regulations.

849

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:54:39pm

re: #844 iceweasel

I just found this lovely gem at his site from May (PDF)
[Link: www.olearyreport.com...]

It's titled: O’Leary Report: FCC Chairman Copps and Diversity Committee Chairman Rivera Talk of Bringing Race War to Broadcast
Corporations

In it he pushes the wingnut meme that the FCC is going to shut down all conservative talk radio, but with a special racist-y flavour: he says the FCC will use 'diversity' to give those radio slots to black people and gay people. I'm sensing a pattern to this guys obsessions...no wonder he commissioned that exact question.

Exactly. And shame on Zogby for being willing to ask that question. Running that sort of poll may help your checking account but it leaves you morally bankrupt.

850

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:54:52pm

re: #847 freetoken

Not this time.

Dang, the wind is taking out my direct TV. The dish is getting pushed around.

851

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:54:52pm

re: #832 wozzablog

re: #839 WindUpBird

Granted. But we all come unwound every once in awhile. In retrospect of situations like this, I've found that a little latitude would generally have served well.

852

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:55:10pm

re: #844 iceweasel
One more note: site belongs to Brad O'Leary, he's got two books out, I'd start googling him as well. Time to sleep here.

853

Randall Gross Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:56:34pm

re: #852 Thanos

One more note: site belongs to Brad O'Leary, he's got two books out, I'd start googling him as well. Time to sleep here.

Ok he's published by Whirled Nuts Daily, didn't I call that one earlier?

854

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:57:23pm

re: #842 dominic yeso

Yes there are plenty of things to fix. But we are stronger together. Secession just is not warranted.

855

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:57:43pm

re: #848 Gus 802

Right. Mark Lloyd is just a committee chairman. And only a chairman of the diversity program. The FCC is a commission and not one person runs the FCC. More paranoia. Besides, it's not like the FCC did wonderful work with radio in the previous years. What with the cable monopolies, morning zoo programs, and the multitude of K-Rock stations they ended up promoting through their regulations.

And the claim that they're starting a Race War with broadcast corporations isn't paranoid insane rhetoric that belongs on StormFront, of course.
I bet if we looked over there we'd find that this guy is extremely popular with them.

Which reminds me: one of the most batshitty of batshit theories I've seen recently was a thread at StormFront where they worried that the SPLC was planning to assassinate Obama and frame white supremacists like them for it. Words fail me.

856

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:58:05pm

re: #851 cliffster

fair enough, I come from rougher internet locales. I probably should keep in mind that LGF isn't Portal of Evil. ^^

857

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:58:44pm

re: #849 Dark_Falcon

Exactly. And shame on Zogby for being willing to ask that question. Running that sort of poll may help your checking account but it leaves you morally bankrupt.

and stifles your growth in terms of the people who will take you seriously in the future.

858

freetoken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 9:59:59pm

re: #856 WindUpBird

I probably should keep in mind that LGF isn't Portal of Evil. ^^

LGF is however a portal to some great music... and perhaps some not so great:

MP3 Audio

Now down to 59 shopping days till Christmas...

859

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:00:08pm

re: #855 iceweasel

And the claim that they're starting a Race War with broadcast corporations isn't paranoid insane rhetoric that belongs on StormFront, of course.
I bet if we looked over there we'd find that this guy is extremely popular with them.

Which reminds me: one of the most batshitty of batshit theories I've seen recently was a thread at StormFront where they worried that the SPLC was planning to assassinate Obama and frame white supremacists like them for it. Words fail me.

Yeah. I've said it before but CPAC is a joke. I cringed when they honored Jesse Helms and that was something organized by Human Events. They also honored a couple of other questionable people. Then what happened at the recent Western CPAC and now seeing Brad "Good White People" O'Leary at the previous event honoring Rush "Take That Bone out of your Nose" Limbaugh.

860

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:00:27pm

re: #859 Gus 802

I see a pattern here. ;)

861

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:00:59pm

re: #851 cliffster

i engaged him on the issue of Obama's flaws - he ignroed it and continued to be snide and disrespectful.

Lattitude and hints werer dropped earlier in the thread - no hint was taken. A sledge hammer was - unfortunately - to be resorted to.

You and i have discussed things heatedly here - i was called out for being an ass and i apologised before signing off. Common courtesy doesn't take much.

862

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:01:28pm

re: #861 wozzablog

i updinged you on calling me out for being unkind too ;-)

863

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:01:53pm

re: #851 cliffster

re: #839 WindUpBird

Granted. But we all come unwound every once in awhile. In retrospect of situations like this, I've found that a little latitude would generally have served well.

Agreed. Would have appreciated a "most unkind" being busted out when someone right of center was going off on someone left of center for no good reason earlier though.

864

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:03:26pm

re: #847 freetoken

No chocolate brownies?

Youtube Video

865

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:05:12pm

re: #863 bratwurst

Agreed. Would have appreciated a "most unkind" being busted out when someone right of center was going off on someone left of center for no good reason earlier though.

Good poing. And I actually did point out that perhaps his delivery was not shedding a good light on his point. And it wasn't.

866

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:05:31pm

re: #865 cliffster

PIMF... point

867

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:08:35pm

re: #859 Gus 802

Yeah. I've said it before but CPAC is a joke. I cringed when they honored Jesse Helms and that was something organized by Human Events. They also honored a couple of other questionable people. Then what happened at the recent Western CPAC and now seeing Brad "Good White People" O'Leary at the previous event honoring Rush "Take That Bone out of your Nose" Limbaugh.

Yep. CPAC is awful. Has been for years. I can't blame Charles at all for not attending it. Obviously the right decision.

How many websites does this O"Leary guy have anyway? I just found his site for his anti-Obama book "The Audacity of Deceit". They'll email you a free chapter. I'm about to dive in and I bet there are some goodies in there. So far I found this:

The vast majority of the American middle class identifies
with the Judeo-Christian belief system. But Senator Barack
Obama seems to challenge these voters’ religious values and
moral beliefs. He seems firmly ensconced in the “everything is
relative” school of thought that muddles clear definitions or
convictions about right and wrong. President Obama would
likely impose a gray scale of morality.
Obama’s own moral traditions emerge from twenty-seven
years of upbringing by an atheist mother, a morally challenged
bigamist Muslim-turned-atheist father, and a Muslim stepfather.

and

Therefore, an
essential question for voters is this: Does Obama believe that the
moral values of an atheist—or a Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, or
Christian Black Liberation theologian—should have equal value in
public policy to the moral beliefs of Judeo-Christians? It seems so.

So we've already got a headstart on the seekrit Muslim meme, the 'atheists have no morals' meme, and the "America is a Christian nation' meme, all by page 3. Not to mention the whole "Obama is out to destroy the moral fabric of our society' meme.

868

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:09:04pm

re: #741 Killgore Trout

Ugh, a preliminary check and it looks like this is real...
Zogby asks if "Good White People" should worry about blacks and gays ! I'M NOT KIDDING !!!

Her

*sigh*

I looked and this is the basis of the question which formed the poll question. From Mark Llyod:

“This... there's nothing more difficult than this. Because we have really, truly good white people in important positions. And the fact of the matter is that there are a limited number of those positions. And unless we are conscious of the need to have more people of color, gays, other people in those positions we will not change the problem.
“We're in a position where you have to say who is going to step down so someone else can have power.”

Lloyd really doesn't make the statement he alleges that "good white people" have to step down. It's out of context.

869

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:09:06pm

What are we fightin' for?

Youtube Video

870

Lidane Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:09:45pm

Texas can opt out by seceding.

Every time I read this crap, I want to slap the idiots who say it upside the head with a Texas history book.

No, Texas can't secede. It has never been able to legally secede. EVER. It could've been split into five states, but doing that now would be pointless. There is no provision for secession in the annexation agreement:

[Link: www.snopes.com...]

871

Wozza Matter? Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:10:13pm

really

this time

i mean it

i'm gone

PEACE

872

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:11:09pm

If any state is strong enough to secede it would be California. In any case it's not happening. It's just Hot Air.

873

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:11:14pm

re: #865 cliffster

Good point. And I actually did point out that perhaps his delivery was not shedding a good light on his point. And it wasn't.

Hey, I come here because I ENJOY civil discussions with people I don't always agree with...but when they cease to be civil, the fun quickly dissipates. I mean, I can find conservatives to call me names pretty much ANYWHERE on line these days! ;)

874

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:12:50pm

re: #867 iceweasel

Typical. Whether he likes it or not we live in a pluralistic society. That makes everything relative. While he calls the majority as being Judeo-Christian that alone is comprised of two religious groups alone which makes for a pluralistic group. That doesn't even take into account that Judeo and Christian people are not one monolithic group in which everyone within those general headings have equal beliefs. And this doesn't even take into account the other religions and non-religions.

875

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:12:51pm

re: #871 wozzablog

Sleep well.

876

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:14:23pm

re: #870 Lidane

One up for cool history.

877

freetoken Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:15:23pm

re: #872 Rightwingconspirator

If any state is strong enough to secede it would be California. In any case it's not happening.

Hah! Quite the opposite... CA is seceding continuously... up to several millimeters per year... I know this is true because sometimes I feel it when it moves!

878

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:16:40pm

re: #877 freetoken

Hah! Quite the opposite... CA is seceding continuously... up to several millimeters per year... I know this is true because sometimes I feel it when it moves!

Ecotopic secession! Remember "Ecotopia" by Callenbach? California, Oregon, and Washington.

879

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:17:59pm

re: #870 Lidane

I think "Legally" and "Secede" are not friends of each other in a sentence, no? I mean if one thinks seceding is the way to go, then that's their thing, but this would not happen by virtue of an up-or-down vote of the Supreme Court...

880

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:19:01pm

re: #877 freetoken

Shake And Bake. That's my 'hood. But moving closer to San Francisco? That's not seceding its switching sides. Just ask the Dodgers.

881

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:19:17pm

Speaking of Ecotopia. Here's a funny map:

Image: 800px-reagan-digitised-poster.JPG

Kind of relative to today in a strange sort of way.

882

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:19:59pm

re: #881 Gus 802

Oops, no offense to Ronald Reagan. ;)

883

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:20:44pm

re: #867 iceweasel

So we've already got a headstart on the seekrit Muslim meme, the 'atheists have no morals' meme, and the "America is a Christian nation' meme, all by page 3. Not to mention the whole "Obama is out to destroy the moral fabric of our society' meme.

That sounds like one talking point away from Wingnut Bingo. Just throw in "Water Fluoridation is a Commie Plot" and hear the cries of "Wingo!".

884

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:21:02pm

re: #882 Gus 802

I liked it, he was my Governor before he was my President, I'm proud to say.

885

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:22:15pm

re: #883 Dark_Falcon

Wing Nut Bingo?! WINGNUTBINGO?!

LMAO

Urban Dictionary Stat!

886

Dancing along the light of day Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:23:16pm

Good night, Lizards!
Play well, drink deeply, and converse as your life depends upon it!
And, yes, spellcheck IS your friend!

887

Sharmuta Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:23:36pm

Because you can never have enough dancing robots

Youtube Video

888

Daniel Ballard Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:24:04pm

Me two. Good Night.

889

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:24:26pm

re: #886 Floral Giraffe

Good night, Lizards!
Play well, drink deeply, and converse as your life depends upon it!
And, yes, spellcheck IS your friend!

So long and thanks for the Jelly Bellys!

890

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:24:29pm

re: #884 Rightwingconspirator

I liked it, he was my Governor before he was my President, I'm proud to say.

Reagan, Wilson, Brown, Deukmejian, Davis, and Schwarzenegger. Deukmejian is always forgotten. His son was my neighbor for a while. It's odd that for California's reputation they sure have elected many a Republican.

891

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:27:40pm

re: #887 Sharmuta

Upding for Sharm never being more than one slow thread away from a Beck post.

892

Lidane Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:27:47pm

re: #879 cliffster

I think "Legally" and "Secede" are not friends of each other in a sentence, no? I mean if one thinks seceding is the way to go, then that's their thing, but this would not happen by virtue of an up-or-down vote of the Supreme Court...

The point is, there are people in this state who didn't pay attention in Texas History class back in middle school (yes, there's an entire year spent on the subject-- I took it in 7th grade) and who think that because Texas had been independent at one point, that they negotiated a clause in the annexation agreement with the United States giving them the ability to legally leave the U.S. whenever they wanted to. It's still a popular urban legend today.

However, it's not true. It has never been true, but there are a lot of people around here who believe it. Ergo, they think this state can legally secede. And unfortunately, one of those idiots is my governor, who stood up in front of the tea party crowd and started yammering about secession. I was livid over that. Of all people, he should damn well know better.

893

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:28:59pm

re: #883 Dark_Falcon

That sounds like one talking point away from Wingnut Bingo. Just throw in "Water Fluoridation is a Commie Plot" and hear the cries of "Wingo!".

Wingo! Brilliant!

I'm on page 12 in this chapter, btw, and now we've had the citing of various WingNut Daily 'reporters' as sources, claims that Obama is deeply connected to the New Black Panthers and the Nation of Islam, and now he's citing the proven liar Jill Stanek, the anti-choice activist and nurse who was fired after making up that bullshit story about botched abortions and babies left to die.

Now I may have reached the heart of wingnuttery: Obama will take our kids away to reeducation camps from the ages of 1-5, to indoctrinate them:

Of course, the similarities between this program and
those in communist and fascist countries are evident. This is
Obama’s America.
The plan is perhaps symptomatic of Obama’s own
childhood, when he was abandoned by his father. But, in terms
of policy, it is most likely that Obama intends to replace the
Judeo-Christian values that are traditionally taught to young
children in the home environment, with his own brand of secular
values. How to accomplish this? The only way, of course, is to
remove infants and young children from their homes, herding
them into government schools where their innocent minds can be
infiltrated before parents, churches, or youth groups have a
chance to influence them with traditional values.

894

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:31:37pm

re: #893 iceweasel

As I always say. If these guys were Marxists, Maoists, E-I-E-I-O, they're the lamest Marxists and/or Maoists in the history of socialism and/or communism. I'd at least be onto a cultural revolution and purging all films staring Billy Bob Thornton.

895

cliffster Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:32:16pm

re: #892 Lidane

I spent my 7th grade history allotment in Texas History as well, and this topic was well covered. No exit clause. If Texans want to leave, they'd better be ready to defend their borders and fast. Gov. Perry may be charming when connecting with the locals, but I really don't think he has that lined up.

896

Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:38:31pm

An oldie but a goodie, for some 'totally bizarre' reason this thread brought it to mind again. Of course since this was first made it seems that quite a few more states have turned "pink"...

Image: 661px-Jesusland.png

/don't you wish it was that simple?

897

Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:41:57pm

re: #895 cliffster

I spent my 7th grade history allotment in Texas History as well, and this topic was well covered. No exit clause. If Texans want to leave, they'd better be ready to defend their borders and fast. Gov. Perry may be charming when connecting with the locals, but I really don't think he has that lined up.

A poll done immediately after Perry/Norris first mentioned it said only 17% of Texans favored secession, still too many, but not nearly enough to make it reality.

898

Lidane Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:42:54pm

re: #895 cliffster

I spent my 7th grade history allotment in Texas History as well, and this topic was well covered. No exit clause. If Texans want to leave, they'd better be ready to defend their borders and fast.

They'd also better be ready to start paying a state income tax, since all that federal money we get from Washington would be gone in an instant.

I really don't think the pro-secession folks have thought that whole idea through, you know? It's maddening as all hell. I get so annoyed when people act like we can just up and leave any time we want to, especially since last November.

So many idiots, so few books to slap them with. Heh.

Gov. Perry may be charming when connecting with the locals, but I really don't think he has that lined up.

I think he's more interested in trying to keep his job by running to the right of Attila the Hun in order to keep Kay Bailey Hutchison from beating him in the primaries. It's the only rational explanation, since of all people, the governor of Texas should be required to know the state's history. =P

899

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:43:01pm

How I feel.

Stuck Inside of Mobile With the Memphis Blues Again

Youtube Video

Dylan

900

Dark_Falcon Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:48:23pm

Time for bed. Goodnight, all.

901

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:53:33pm

re: #900 Dark_Falcon

Time for bed. Goodnight, all.

Youtube Video

902

Page 3 in the Binder of Women Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:53:59pm

900 comments! I picked the wrong night to be away...

903

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:54:54pm

Bob Marley - Three Little Birds - HD

Youtube Video

904

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:56:11pm

re: #903 Gus 802

Damn, you are on a roll! Timeless music all night.

905

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:57:28pm

re: #904 bratwurst

Damn, you are on a roll! Timeless music all night.

Thanks. I'm trying to think of some road music and music from my past. I'm at a crossroads here.

906

Killgore Trout Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:57:55pm

re: #903 Gus 802

Nice!

907

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:59:07pm

re: #906 Killgore Trout

Nice!

Song of inspiration. It used to inspire me.

908

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:59:16pm

Here is a touching Euro-Hit from the late 60s:

Youtube Video

909

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:01:11pm

re: #903 Gus 802

Upding for Bob.

910

SanFranciscoZionist Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:02:53pm

re: #890 Gus 802

Reagan, Wilson, Brown, Deukmejian, Davis, and Schwarzenegger. Deukmejian is always forgotten. His son was my neighbor for a while. It's odd that for California's reputation they sure have elected many a Republican.

Our reputatation is mostly crap. California just becomes a convenient shorthand for people.

911

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:04:56pm

Something from The Bang Bang Machine - 'Geek Love' : (As songs about unrequited love in a family of genetically engineered circus freaks go, I think you'll find it's second to none):

Youtube Video

912

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:06:11pm

re: #899 Gus 802

I suddenly get the joke from Sisters of Mercy's Dominion/Mother Russia:

we serve an old man in a dry season
a lighthouse keeper in the desert sun
dreamers of sleepers and white treason
we dream of rain and the history of the gun
there's a lighthouse in the middle of Prussia
a white house in a red square
I'm living in films for the sake of Russia
a kino runner for the DDR
and the fifty-two daughters of the revolution
turn the gold to chrome
gift, nothing to lose
stuck inside of Memphis with the mobile home, sing:

913

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:06:22pm

re: #910 SanFranciscoZionist

Our reputatation is mostly crap. California just becomes a convenient shorthand for people.

At press time I'm going back. Colorado failed me but then again that's partially my own fault. Frankly, I'm looking forward to it. Change of pace, hitting the road, and making a new start and under the radar for a while.

914

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:09:02pm

re: #905 Gus 802

My road music is probably not your road music. ;-) But when you're rocketing across Eastern Washington at 95 MPH at 2am, this is perfect spooky driving music:

Youtube Video

915

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:09:09pm

re: #912 WindUpBird

I suddenly get the joke from Sisters of Mercy's Dominion/Mother Russia:

we serve an old man in a dry season
a lighthouse keeper in the desert sun
dreamers of sleepers and white treason
we dream of rain and the history of the gun
there's a lighthouse in the middle of Prussia
a white house in a red square
I'm living in films for the sake of Russia
a kino runner for the DDR
and the fifty-two daughters of the revolution
turn the gold to chrome
gift, nothing to lose
stuck inside of Memphis with the mobile home, sing:

That's another great song IMO.

Youtube Video

916

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:11:21pm

re: #915 Gus 802

You're a good person ^__^

(As much as I have adored Floodland since I was a wee teen (and FaLaA and Vision Thing) I recommend against seeing the Sisters live. I did, and the mix was miserable, the vocals were inaudible, and the band was completely obscured by fog machines)

917

Bagua Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:11:37pm

re: #913 Gus 802

To help you on your way:

The Key To the Highway

Youtube Video

918

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:13:55pm

Chungking : Making Music

Youtube Video

919

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:14:34pm

re: #917 Bagua

To help you on your way:

The Key To the Highway

Pete Seger doing the intro. Great quality audio for the age of the video.

920

Gus Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:15:44pm

re: #916 WindUpBird

You're a good person ^__^

(As much as I have adored Floodland since I was a wee teen (and FaLaA and Vision Thing) I recommend against seeing the Sisters live. I did, and the mix was miserable, the vocals were inaudible, and the band was completely obscured by fog machines)

The dry ice brings back memories. Never saw them play live but I'm sure it's an experience.

921

bratwurst Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:23:49pm

re: #914 WindUpBird

My road music is probably not your road music. ;-) But when you're rocketing across Eastern Washington at 95 MPH at 2am, this is perfect spooky driving music:

I have rocketed through eastern Washington a few times myself!

922

The Left Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:35:26pm

re: #911 Jimmah

Something from The Bang Bang Machine - 'Geek Love' : (As songs about unrequited love in a family of genetically engineered circus freaks go, I think you'll find it's second to none):

[Video]

hey! did you read the novel? Katherine Dunn I think?

923

Aye Pod Tue, Oct 27, 2009 11:39:42pm

re: #922 iceweasel

hey! did you read the novel? Katherine Dunn I think?

Not yet but I think I will at some point :)

924

Yashmak Wed, Oct 28, 2009 7:24:04am

re: #24 XopXproxyX

Really? They get 8 years of having things their own way, then less than a year into a new democratically elected president they throw a fit where "Secession" and "civil war" are the only solutions. Didn't take much to "force their hands" huh?

I must admit, when I first saw your username, I figured you for a troll/sockpuppet. Your to-the-point comments have definitely changed my mind though.

It's just comic to me that after things like domestic wire-tapping (regardless of if it was later proven to be legal or not) didn't get these same folks riled up, after the off-again on-again talk of the Fairness Doctrine didn't get these same folks this riled up, after Bush's initial bailout didn't get them this riled up (although they were pretty upset about that one too). . .it's health care reform that's going to spark a revolution?

925

Yashmak Wed, Oct 28, 2009 7:25:40am

re: #912 WindUpBird

And here I thought I was the only one who still remembered Sisters of Mercy.

926

bunnymud Wed, Oct 28, 2009 7:48:28am

This is a dead thread

927

suchislife Wed, Oct 28, 2009 8:56:12am

re: #743 jaunte

No state has a significant minority, much less a majority, of separatists.

Not true:
[Link: tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com...]

"One question: "Do you think Texas would be better off as an independent nation or as part of the United States of America?" The top-line number is United States 61%, independent nation 35%. Among Republicans, it's a dead-even tie at 48%-48%."

928

moski3 Wed, Oct 28, 2009 10:27:51am

It all depends on how far Obie goes w/his takeovers as to how far and hard we fight back. I'm not paying for his crap ass plan, guess I'm going to get fined and go to jail according to what the Lib Heads want to pass. Anyone want a cat?

929

caution Wed, Oct 28, 2009 11:14:16am

So if I'm a bit of a moderate living in "woo hoo" country, and I buy a gun to defend myself from the " 'cession" bunch, is that the end of an ending?

930

XopXproxyX Wed, Oct 28, 2009 12:54:58pm

re: #924 Yashmak

That's what baffles me as well. They don't care about wire-tapping or other forms of domestic surveillance, or extrajudicial rendition. Both of which are real forms of taking away libertys and showing total disregard for the constitution, the bill of rights, the declaration of independence or any other historically significant document they may profess an obsession with strict adherence to.
Yet giving people affordable healthcare, and the people on the lowest rungs of society any healthcare at all is somehow comparable to Hitler(or Stalin depending on the day of the week).

931

bigred1961 Wed, Oct 28, 2009 3:29:15pm

As both a Republican (maybe I should say conservative) and a resident of Texas, I am ashamed by many of my fellow residents. Of course, I wasn't born in Texas so maybe that is why I feel the way I do. I am an American, not a Texan. I have always been and will always be. If I have to choose, then Tennessee here I come!
By the way, I most definitely do not approve of Gov. Perry's attempts to pack our school boards with anti science religious wackos. The religious wacko wing for the GOP has always troubled me greatly.

932

Lidane Wed, Oct 28, 2009 5:22:28pm

re: #931 bigred1961

As both a Republican (maybe I should say conservative) and a resident of Texas, I am ashamed by many of my fellow residents. Of course, I wasn't born in Texas so maybe that is why I feel the way I do. I am an American, not a Texan. I have always been and will always be. If I have to choose, then Tennessee here I come!

I was born and raised here in Texas and have deep family roots that run back for many, many generations. Believe me when I say that these morons chap my hide in a way that I can't even begin to describe.

I'm an American first, then a Texan, but it never fails to gall me when people start spouting lies about this state being able to secede and just generally acting like fools.

By the way, I most definitely do not approve of Gov. Perry's attempts to pack our school boards with anti science religious wackos. The religious wacko wing for the GOP has always troubled me greatly.

The religious wacko wing is precisely why I'm not a Republican, especially in this state. No way in hell am I voting for a party that is so thoroughly in thrall to the religious fundamentalists and anti-science, anti-intellectual crowd.

Of course, in Texas, being a Democrat is pretty much pointless since the party hasn't been worth a damn on a state level since Ann Richards and Bob Bullock died. I'm without a party, though I've voted Democratic for president since the first election I could vote in back in '92.

I've always called myself a "red state liberal", meaning that I'm liberal on social issues, but an ardent free trader (I can't help it-- I'm an international business major. Free trade and globalization are pretty much standard curriculum for me.) and anti-gun control since I come from a family of hunters and sportsmen. Oh, how I wish there was a place for me. *sigh*

933

Odahi Wed, Oct 28, 2009 5:32:36pm

Well, it's been fun, and it's been real. Some of it's even been real fun. I'm off to bed. G'nite, lizards! Fight nice!

934

b_sharp Wed, Oct 28, 2009 5:48:46pm

re: #149 Decatur Deb

Of course.

935

[deleted] Thu, Oct 29, 2009 2:01:45pm

936

Charles Johnson Thu, Oct 29, 2009 2:38:27pm

re: #935 TheObjectivist

In that case I'm sure you'll be happier discussing those issues at blogs where they tolerate 'revolution' talk, since I don't allow it at my website. Bye now!

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