And Now, Tulipa ‘Ayaan’

World • Views: 3,173

If you were wondering what Ayaan Hirsi Ali’s been up to lately, the Dutch flower bulb sector just named a tulip after her: Tulip named after activist Ayaan Hirsi Ali.

NEW YORK, November 6, 2009: In a ceremony on November 4 at the Metropolitan Museum of Art the Dutch flower bulb sector named a tulip after Ayaan Hirsi Ali‘Ayaan’in recognition of Ms. Hirsi Ali’s defense of freedom and human rights for Muslim women.

Ms. Hirsi Ali, a feminist, author, activist and former member of the Dutch parliament completed the traditional naming ceremony by drizzling champagne over the bulbs and declaring, “From now on this Tulip has the name ‘Ayaan’.”  Mr. Thijs Leenders, president of the North American Flower Bulb Wholesalers Association represented the Dutch bulb sector in the event. Also in attendance was Mr. Wim Pijbes, director of Amsterdam’s Rijksmuseum. …

Tulipa ‘Ayaan’ is a dark maroon/brown/purple Triumph tulip hybridized by Ms. Lydia Boots, of Lybo Hybridizing, Hem, NL.  Ms Boots is one of few women working in the male dominated world of tulip hybridizing. The hybrid is a crossing of Tulipa ‘Gavota’ x a sport of Tulipa ‘Gander’s Rhapsody’.

The new deep purple tulip joins a group of tulips known in Holland as “black” tulips. The legendary quest of Dutch hybridizers to create a truly black tulip goes back centuries.  Many experts consider Tulipa ‘Ayaan’ one of the finest and most successful results of this quest. The selection of the flower to be named in her honor was made by Ms. Hirsi Ali herself.

Upon receipt of the signed christening certificate, the tulip will be entered into the Classified List and International Register of Tulip Names, maintained by the Royal Dutch Bulb Growers Association (KAVB) in Hillegom, the Netherlands.

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384 comments
1 Sharmuta  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:25:23pm

I can't wait to get some of these bulbs. I love tulips, and it would be an honor to have Ayaan growing in my garden.

2 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:27:03pm

Great, more targets:

The youths will now go on a Tulip Jihad.

3 _RememberTonyC  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:28:48pm

one of the gutsiest women on the planet ... truly

4 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:30:19pm

re: #2 Bagua

Great, more targets:

The youths will now go on a Tulip Jihad.

/naaah, just make em wear sacks...

5 Sharmuta  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:30:24pm

re: #3 _RememberTonyC

one of the gutsiest women on the planet ... truly

Smart, beautiful, brave- she's a true inspiration.

6 Killgore Trout  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:30:34pm

re: #2 Bagua

Great, more targets:

The youths will now go on a Tulip Jihad.

Yes, I checked and there are islamists seething over this.

7 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:31:25pm

re: #6 Killgore Trout

Yes, I checked and there are islamists seething over this.

for real?

8 _RememberTonyC  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:33:04pm

re: #7 brookly red

for real?

all your ayaan hirsi ali tulips are belong to us!

9 William of Orange  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:33:08pm

There was only one black Tulip, and that was Ruud Gullit.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

10 Killgore Trout  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:33:21pm

re: #7 brookly red

Met Panders Islamophobes: Ayaan Tulip

I wonder which Zionist mega-donor the NY Metropolitan Museum of Art is stroking.

11 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:33:40pm

Is there a photograph of it somewhere?

12 Killgore Trout  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:34:33pm

re: #11 MandyManners

Is there a photograph of it somewhere?

Not that I found. Also the bulbs don't appear to be available for purchase anywhere.

13 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:35:33pm

re: #10 Killgore Trout

Met Panders Islamophobes: Ayaan Tulip

maybe the world is too sick to be saved...

14 Sharmuta  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:35:53pm
Supplies of the Ayaan tulip will be limited for several years, as it takes many seasons to build up stocks of new tulips. It is estimated that only 500 bulbs will be available for sale and planting in the fall of 2010.

I think it will be interesting to monitor the demand for these bulbs in the coming years considering Ayaan is the true face of the counter-jihad.

15 _RememberTonyC  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:36:05pm

re: #5 Sharmuta

Smart, beautiful, brave- she's a true inspiration.


yes, yes, yes, and yes. but she has been quiet lately ... we need to hear more from her. I'd love to hear her thoughts on the Ft Hood jihadi.

16 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:36:15pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

Not that I found. Also the bulbs don't appear to be available for purchase anywhere.


/zionist mall?

17 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:36:39pm

re: #11 MandyManners

Is there a photograph of it somewhere?

They are in hiding.

18 Racer X  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:36:50pm
19 Killgore Trout  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:36:57pm

re: #14 Sharmuta

She's been really quiet over the past year since she joined the Heritage Foundation.

20 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:37:24pm

re: #13 brookly red

maybe the world is too sick to be saved...

Probably... but the ride down should be amazing.

21 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:38:02pm

re: #20 Walter L. Newton

Probably... but the ride down should be amazing.

Slim! is that you?

22 Charles Johnson  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:39:29pm

If you notice that one of the RSS feeds isn't displaying properly in the left column please let me know.

My RSS parser, using native PHP 5 SimpleXML functions, now handles both RSS and ATOM feeds. But there may be some loose ends.

23 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:39:40pm

re: #10 Killgore Trout

Met Panders Islamophobes: Ayaan Tulip

That first one there is a hum-dinger.

This website and the associated organization of the same name have the mission of providing Jews and non-Jews with the intellectual tools to stand up to Zionist intimidation and manipulation.

24 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:40:11pm

re: #21 brookly red

Slim! is that you?

Funny, that reference didn't even come to mind, but now that you mention it...

I've never seen the movie.

25 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:40:27pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

Not that I found. Also the bulbs don't appear to be available for purchase anywhere.

I wonder how expensive they'll be.

26 [deleted]  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:40:54pm
27 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:41:43pm

re: #23 MandyManners

That first one there is a hum-dinger.

This website and the associated organization of the same name have the mission of providing Jews and non-Jews with the intellectual tools to stand up to Zionist intimidation and manipulation.

if we all go there at once can we crash em?

28 reine.de.tout  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:41:46pm

Tulips are my favorite!
How nice for Ayaan Hirsi Ali to be honored this way.

29 Sharmuta  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:42:10pm

re: #19 Killgore Trout

She's been really quiet over the past year since she joined the Heritage Foundation.

I have to wonder if she's feeling/thinking many of the same things as the rest of us now that we see the counter-jihad is being led by ethnic nationalists. I wouldn't be too comfortable with being used by people like filip dewinter and his friends, and I might back off and not be their pawn myself. I also recall robert spencer posting a picture of himself with Ayaan after Bruce Bawer's piece defending Charles. If I were her, these developments would certainly make me think twice.

30 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:42:22pm

re: #27 brookly red

if we all go there at once can we crash em?

I'm still trying to bleach my mind.

31 Shiplord Kirel  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:42:23pm

re: #23 MandyManners

That first one there is a hum-dinger.

This website and the associated organization of the same name have the mission of providing Jews and non-Jews with the intellectual tools to stand up to Zionist intimidation and manipulation.

Theo van Gogh is not available for comment.

32 Sharmuta  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:42:55pm

re: #22 Charles

If you notice that one of the RSS feeds isn't displaying properly in the left column please let me know.

My RSS parser, using native PHP 5 SimpleXML functions, now handles both RSS and ATOM feeds. But there may be some loose ends.

Lawhawk.

33 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:43:46pm

Nice flower. I"d like to see some planted at the Chicago Botanical Gardens next year. It's too late to plant tulip bulbs this year, but hopefully next fall.

34 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:43:57pm

re: #22 Charles

If you notice that one of the RSS feeds isn't displaying properly in the left column please let me know.

My RSS parser, using native PHP 5 SimpleXML functions, now handles both RSS and ATOM feeds. But there may be some loose ends.

Last I checked shire network news was pointing to their old site, I'll check again now.

35 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:44:54pm

re: #23 MandyManners

That first one there is a hum-dinger.

This website and the associated organization of the same name have the mission of providing Jews and non-Jews with the intellectual tools to stand up to Zionist intimidation and manipulation.

Also known as: "An association of useful idiots."

36 Killgore Trout  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:45:09pm

re: #29 Sharmuta

Agreed. She's probably under contract so she has to keep her mouth shut.

37 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:45:11pm

re: #34 Thanos

Last I checked shire network news was pointing to their old site, I'll check again now.

Yep, here's the URL for the new site:

[Link: snnsite.com...]

38 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:45:46pm

re: #33 Dark_Falcon

Nice flower. I"d like to see some planted at the Chicago Botanical Gardens next year. It's too late to plant tulip bulbs this year, but hopefully next fall.

/wonder what will happen if I Googel "joolips"...

39 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:46:14pm

re: #35 Dark_Falcon

Also known as: "An association of useful idiots."

useful to whom?

40 Sharmuta  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:46:14pm

re: #38 brookly red

WTH?

41 Charles Johnson  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:47:23pm

re: #32 Sharmuta

Lawhawk.

Hit the 'reload' button for Lawhawk and it will work now.

42 Charles Johnson  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:48:37pm

Shire is fixed now too.

43 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:48:43pm

re: #40 Sharmuta

WTH?

bad pun...

but after some of the other stuff that come up...

44 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:49:07pm

re: #42 Charles

Thanks

45 Killgore Trout  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:50:16pm

Ex-moderate Muslim to form 'anti-Zionist' party in Sweden

A once moderate Muslim spokesperson who last year came out as an Islamist radical has announced plans to start a political party uniting all of Sweden’s anti-Zionists.

According to Mohamed Omar, a 34-year-old author and commentator born in Uppsala in eastern Sweden, he is prepared to welcome all political stripes into his new party – from the radical left and Islamic extremists to neo-Nazis and right-wing extremists – as long as they subscribe to the party’s core principles.

“We’re going to focus not on Islamic questions, but solely on anti-Zionism in order to reach out to as many as possible,” Omar told the Sveriges Radio (SR) documentary programme Kaliber.

On his website, Omar denies that the Holocaust happened and refers to Judaism as "a parasitic culture of greed".

46 BenghaziHoops  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:51:09pm

Sharm: I have to repost this from down stairs..Cause it is so strange
I thought he was a jerk.

You will not believe what happened today...I mean unbelievable
I went to a small bar today to watch the Colts Game (we won)
Some girl maybe 21 years old said she got a job working as a Chief at a restaurant called the French Laundry..
I said..No you didn't
yes I did
no you didn't
Do you know where it is
Yes I do
no you don't
yes I do
where?
Yountville
no way
yes way
I grew up in Yountville
no way
yes way
We spent hours talking about Napa Valley
What are the chances? one in a million?
It was so much fun..
So weird...

47 Racer X  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:51:22pm
48 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:52:42pm

re: #45 Killgore Trout

Ex-moderate Muslim to form 'anti-Zionist' party in Sweden

I hate Swedish Nazis!

49 Sharmuta  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:53:53pm

re: #46 HoosierHoops

It's a small world sometimes. Next time we get a private thread, ask me to tell you the strangest small world story you will ever hear. It happened to me, and it's pretty amazing.

50 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:54:43pm

re: #48 Dark_Falcon

I hate Swedish Nazis!

the Nazis were more truthful about their goals.

52 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:55:51pm

This looks like its going to be good:
Excerpt from Denialism by Michael Specter

[Link: www.npr.org...]

53 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:56:25pm

re: #47 Racer X


Wow! I want one of these.

They used to have a car/boat way back when but not nearly so cool...

54 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:56:45pm

re: #45 Killgore Trout

Ex-moderate Muslim to form 'anti-Zionist' party in Sweden

The Haj lives again.

55 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:58:53pm

re: #54 MandyManners

The Haj lives again.

What does that mean?

56 solomonpanting  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:58:57pm
Tulipa ‘Ayaan’ is a dark maroon/brown/purple Triumph tulip hybridized by Ms. Lydia Boots, of Lybo Hybridizing, Hem, NL. Ms Boots is one of few women working in the male dominated world of tulip hybridizing.

'Bout time there were Boots on the ground.

57 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 3:59:13pm

For those who missed this...

Well, the GOP screwed the pooch tonight. They should have voted AGAINST the "no abortion funding" amendment. Should have voted to keep in the possible abortion money. Than they would have had 69 Blue Dogs voting against the complete bill. All they needed was 2-3 more votes.

Typical GOP lack of strategy. Win the battle, loose the war.

58 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:01:57pm

re: #57 Walter L. Newton

For those who missed this...

Well, the GOP screwed the pooch tonight. They should have voted AGAINST the "no abortion funding" amendment. Should have voted to keep in the possible abortion money. Than they would have had 69 Blue Dogs voting against the complete bill. All they needed was 2-3 more votes.

Typical GOP lack of strategy. Win the battle, loose the war.

crap, that makes sense...

59 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:02:50pm

re: #55 Dark_Falcon

What does that mean?

Haj Amin al-Husseini, the Mufti of Jerusalem, and one of Hitler's bestest buddies. He helped orchestrate the Final Solution.

60 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:05:41pm

re: #57 Walter L. Newton

For those who missed this...

Well, the GOP screwed the pooch tonight. They should have voted AGAINST the "no abortion funding" amendment. Should have voted to keep in the possible abortion money. Than they would have had 69 Blue Dogs voting against the complete bill. All they needed was 2-3 more votes.

Typical GOP lack of strategy. Win the battle, loose the war.

Walter, Any R who had done that would have been instantly branded RINO and the hunt would be on by Club for Growth and others.

61 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:06:15pm

re: #55 Dark_Falcon

What does that mean?

[Link: emperors-clothes.com...]

[Link: www.palestinefacts.org...]

[Link: www.tellthechildrenthetruth.com...]

[Link: 97.74.65.51...]

62 Decatur Deb  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:06:35pm

re: #60 Thanos

Walter, Any R who had done that would have been instantly branded RINO and the hunt would be on by Club for Growth and others.

Tally Ho. Do they wear pinks?

63 Killgore Trout  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:11:47pm

re: #60 Thanos

Walter, Any R who had done that would have been instantly branded RINO and the hunt would be on by Club for Growth and others.

That's why ideologues are so easily defeated and manipulated. A strategic solution is unthinkable to them. I suspect the Stupak amendment was a bit of Dem strategy. It will probably be taken out when the consolidate the House and Senate bills. The lefty ideologues are pissed off about it but the Dems are playing some very smart strategy right now.

64 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:12:14pm

re: #59 MandyManners

Haj Amin al-Husseini, the Mufti of Jerusalem, and one of Hitler's bestest buddies. He helped orchestrate the Final Solution.

I know who he is. I just didn't make the connection from the 'Haj'. It refers to the fact that he made the pilgrimage to Mecca, I don't think its a personal name.

65 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:14:11pm

re: #63 Killgore Trout

That's why ideologues are so easily defeated and manipulated. A strategic solution is unthinkable to them. I suspect the Stupak amendment was a bit of Dem strategy. It will probably be taken out when the consolidate the House and Senate bills. The lefty ideologues are pissed off about it but the Dems are playing some very smart strategy right now.

I think you are right. When the blue dog congresscritters talk about the bill they can honestly say I voted to stop it from funding abortion...

66 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:14:24pm

re: #60 Thanos

Walter, Any R who had done that would have been instantly branded RINO and the hunt would be on by Club for Growth and others.

Bull, all they would have had to do was to actually announce on the House floor just what they were up to. Throw it back into the laps of the 69 Stupak Dems that are more concerned about their jobs than anything else.

They could have pulled it off easily without compromising anything.

67 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:15:38pm

re: #66 Walter L. Newton

Bull, all they would have had to do was to actually announce on the House floor just what they were up to. Throw it back into the laps of the 69 Stupak Dems that are more concerned about their jobs than anything else.

They could have pulled it off easily without compromising anything.

You can say bull all you want, going on record with a pro-abortion vote for any R. will put them on the hit list, no matter the cause.

68 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:16:01pm

re: #63 Killgore Trout

That's why ideologues are so easily defeated and manipulated. A strategic solution is unthinkable to them. I suspect the Stupak amendment was a bit of Dem strategy. It will probably be taken out when the consolidate the House and Senate bills. The lefty ideologues are pissed off about it but the Dems are playing some very smart strategy right now.

I'm going to have to 100 percent agree with KT on this. And he points out just what I was saying, the GOP are terrible (and basically chicken) when it comes to strategy.

69 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:17:30pm

re: #67 Thanos

You can say bull all you want, going on record with a pro-abortion vote for any R. will put them on the hit list, no matter the cause.

killing this "bill" by any means necessary would make up for any hit list... I think.

70 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:17:34pm

re: #67 Thanos

You can say bull all you want, going on record with a pro-abortion vote for any R. will put them on the hit list, no matter the cause.

It would put them on the history books as defeating government control health care. Period. The GOP are chickens when it comes to playing politics. They have never been really good at it and they never will be.

71 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:17:57pm

re: #67 Thanos

You can say bull all you want, going on record with a pro-abortion vote for any R. will put them on the hit list, no matter the cause.

Sad, but true. Too much of the base will dismiss any strategic considerations out of hand. They want purity on the issue of abortion. They will attack anything else.

72 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:18:27pm

re: #70 Walter L. Newton

It would put them on the history books as defeating government control health care. Period. The GOP are chickens when it comes to playing politics. They have never been really good at it and they never will be.

Why do you think that is?

73 prairiefire  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:18:53pm

A wonderful tribute!

74 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:19:02pm

re: #71 Dark_Falcon

Sad, but true. Too much of the base will dismiss any strategic considerations out of hand. They want purity on the issue of abortion. They will attack anything else.

And the progressives are playing them for all it's worth.

75 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:19:04pm

re: #70 Walter L. Newton

It would put them on the history books as defeating government control health care. Period. The GOP are chickens when it comes to playing politics. They have never been really good at it and they never will be.

No, they are chicken when it comes to opposing any of the Socon litmus tests. It's a non starter, even as obvious a strategy as it is.

76 Big Steve  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:20:21pm

re: #1 Sharmuta

I can't wait to get some of these bulbs. I love tulips, and it would be an honor to have Ayaan growing in my garden.

It might be hard to do. The Dutch have all sorts of double secret probation tricks when they grow their tulips one of which is that the soil has to contain a certain fungus. Also different color/types of bulbs have to be stored together because they emit chemicals that stimulate other bulbs. I go to the Netherlands all the time and often have brought back bulbs that have done poorly over here.

77 Decatur Deb  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:20:24pm

re: #69 brookly red

killing this "bill" by any means necessary would make up for any hit list... I think.

You open a good point. Much of the agony stopped being about doctor bills
when someone said "Waterloo".

78 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:20:26pm

re: #66 Walter L. Newton

Bull, all they would have had to do was to actually announce on the House floor just what they were up to. Throw it back into the laps of the 69 Stupak Dems that are more concerned about their jobs than anything else.

They could have pulled it off easily without compromising anything.

Except their integrity.

Damn man, drop the ideology for a second and look at the strategy you are actually advocating: that the Republicans announce on the floor of the House that they are playing a political game of chicken with the lives of the unborn.

What.the.hell?

79 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:21:50pm

re: #72 Dark_Falcon

Why do you think that is?

Because, the GOP forgets that this is Washington DC politics, not local Sunday services. The GOP, the ones who are in Washington, have to understand that the whole country is effected by what they do or don't do.

The "moral" issues can be handled and fought at the local level. But you cannot play nice in a swamp where nice is not in the vocabulary.

80 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:23:09pm

re: #78 goddamnedfrank

Except their integrity.

Damn man, drop the ideology for a second and look at the strategy you are actually advocating: that the Republicans announce on the floor of the House that they are playing a political game of chicken with the lives of the unborn.

What.the.hell?

better that they all walked out and let the dems own it.

81 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:23:43pm

So Walter, the ploy you speak of is somewhat obvious, and anyone who's worked on the hill five minutes could come up with it, if it's not the Socon litmus test what's your theory on why they didn't do it?

82 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:24:05pm

re: #64 Dark_Falcon

I know who he is. I just didn't make the connection from the 'Haj'. It refers to the fact that he made the pilgrimage to Mecca, I don't think its a personal name.

That man is the most infamous pilgrim when discussing Nazis.

83 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:24:44pm

re: #75 Thanos

No, they are chicken when it comes to opposing any of the Socon litmus tests. It's a non starter, even as obvious a strategy as it is.

Ultimately, its important to remember that most Congresspeople are in office for themselves (for the most part). They like the job and like the power. And so they'd rather see the other side pass legislation they oppose rather than anger their base and risk a primary challenge. This goes for both parties, though the Dems are better at political manuvering.

84 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:26:14pm

re: #82 MandyManners

That man is the most infamous pilgrim when discussing Nazis.

Yes, he is. The man was a vile monster and you are right to bring up his ongoing baleful influence.

85 freetoken  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:26:16pm

re: #11 MandyManners

Is there a photograph of it somewhere?

I couldn't find one either.

However, here is a photo of the female parent:
[Link: www.flickr.com...]

Here is a photo of the type of male parent used:
Image: 113576.jpg
The actual male parent is a sport of the one pictured. A "sport" is a genetic mutation; in this case I suspect the coloring went solid with the pure red color.

Note that flower colors can be recessive. Don't know anything about tulip breeding, but I do know that in orchids the coloring is the result of many genes working together so in breeding complex hybrids there is an element of a craps shoot.

86 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:27:02pm

re: #81 Thanos

So Walter, the ploy you speak of is somewhat obvious, and anyone who's worked on the hill five minutes could come up with it, if it's not the Socon litmus test what's your theory on why they didn't do it?

I have no idea. Of course it's obvious. It doesn't have to be a some sort of mystery. It's would have been a better shot than what they have now. Now they have a house bill that passed, and the amendment can always be dropped when the House and Senate combines the bill.

87 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:28:05pm

Why is Keith Olbermann on my football?

88 abolitionist  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:29:33pm

re: #22 Charles

Mental Floss - This feed has errors.

89 bratwurst  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:29:37pm

re: #87 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Because unlike Dennis Miller or Rush Limbaugh, he has a long, successful background in sports?

90 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:29:52pm

re: #87 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Because he never tried to buy a team?

91 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:30:11pm

re: #86 Walter L. Newton

I have no idea. Of course it's obvious. It doesn't have to be a some sort of mystery. It's would have been a better shot than what they have now. Now they have a house bill that passed, and the amendment can always be dropped when the House and Senate combines the bill.

Walter, I'm not really disagreeing with you, I'm just trying to tell you the major reason they did not execute that strategy. Assuming they are disorganized or just plain dumb is a stretch. E.G. they all seemed to make it to the tea party at that capitol steps the other day on time. Their weekly talking points on Youtube are remarkably uniform, and they do strategerize together. The main factor here is the ongoing RINO hunt an fear. The Dems worked this very smart, they knew that the R's would have to support that amendment.

92 Decatur Deb  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:30:47pm

re: #86 Walter L. Newton

(skip), and the amendment can always be dropped when the House and Senate combines the bill.

They might not even care to drop it. Funding abortion is less important
than funding appendectomies to mainstream Dems.

93 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:31:36pm

re: #89 bratwurst

He was so successful at sports he was my leading cause to mute the audio, watch the game on silent TV and put on some music.

94 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:31:50pm

re: #87 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Why is Keith Olbermann on my football?

Why is Keith Olbermann on my football?

95 freetoken  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:31:53pm

Oh, and here is the picture of Ayaan rather elegantly planting a tulip bulb, which can be found on her website but is a larger version:

Image: 20Ayaan.jpg

96 bratwurst  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:32:17pm

re: #93 Rightwingconspirator

Taste is subjective. The fact is that he had a long career talking about sports.

97 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:32:30pm

Where can I find a picture of the tulip?

98 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:32:49pm

re: #89 bratwurst

Because unlike Dennis Miller or Rush Limbaugh, he has a long, successful background in sports?

And is as divisive as Rush... fortunately with a much smaller audience.

99 BenghaziHoops  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:33:20pm

re: #87 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Why is Keith Olbermann on my football?

I don't know I can't stand him..ESPN fired him years ago..
I send them emails all the time...
I can't believe you have him on national TV...
He wouldn't know sports if it hit him upside the face.. I'm working to get him fired. I'm freaking serious

100 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:33:22pm

re: #89 bratwurst

Restraining orders not withstanding. If Olby was so successful why did ESPN show him the door?

101 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:33:55pm

re: #91 Thanos

Walter, I'm not really disagreeing with you, I'm just trying to tell you the major reason they did not execute that strategy. Assuming they are disorganized or just plain dumb is a stretch. E.G. they all seemed to make it to the tea party at that capitol steps the other day on time. Their weekly talking points on Youtube are remarkably uniform, and they do strategerize together. The main factor here is the ongoing RINO hunt an fear. The Dems worked this very smart, they knew that the R's would have to support that amendment.

I don't know that for sure, but one thing I know for sure, they just blew it, big time, and unless something real interesting happens in the Senate, they lost this... fully lost it...

I heard someone today try to justify this as now being totally in the lap of the left. Well, isn't that a comfort. That's like saying if they ship may go down, I don't want to be the captain while it's happening.

Shitheads.

102 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:34:18pm

The other fun talking point that Dems can now boil out of this: Since the R's supported an amendment that passed for the healthcare bill, they could say that the bill is Bipartisan now. Yeah, it's a big lie, but I bet some do.

103 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:35:12pm

re: #87 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Why is Keith Olbermann on my football?

They're both full of fetid air?

104 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:35:28pm

re: #103 MandyManners

heh

105 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:35:38pm

re: #97 Alouette

Where can I find a picture of the tulip?

There's not one, yet.

106 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:35:55pm

re: #87 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Why is Keith Olbermann on my football?

It's a plot to ruin their ratings. Either the other networks or the football widows are behind it.

107 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:35:55pm

re: #96 bratwurst

Agreed it's subjective. Mixing satire or comedy with the NFL color commentary failed. Not sure at all if the chosen talent was the problem,not sure at all.

Kinda like Olbermann and restraint. FAIL.

108 bratwurst  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:36:51pm

re: #98 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

And is as divisive as Rush... fortunately with a much smaller audience.

I can't argue...but the guy worked in the field for 20 years. I am not defending him or his show...just answering the question as to why he turns up on a football broadcast. I wrote emails to many of Beck's advertisers, I salute anyone who cares to write in order to get Olby off of Sunday Night Football.

109 Dancing along the light of day  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:37:08pm

re: #85 freetoken

I couldn't find one either.

However, here is a photo of the female parent:
[Link: www.flickr.com...]

Here is a photo of the type of male parent used:
[Link: www.jubholland.nl...]
The actual male parent is a sport of the one pictured. A "sport" is a genetic mutation; in this case I suspect the coloring went solid with the pure red color.

Note that flower colors can be recessive. Don't know anything about tulip breeding, but I do know that in orchids the coloring is the result of many genes working together so in breeding complex hybrids there is an element of a craps shoot.

For Alouette, from above.

110 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:37:15pm

re: #106 soxfan4life

It's a plot to ruin their ratings. Either the other networks or the football widows are behind it.

*cackle*

111 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:38:21pm

re: #101 Walter L. Newton

I don't know that for sure, but one thing I know for sure, they just blew it, big time, and unless something real interesting happens in the Senate, they lost this... fully lost it...

I heard someone today try to justify this as now being totally in the lap of the left. Well, isn't that a comfort. That's like saying if they ship may go down, I don't want to be the captain while it's happening.

Shitheads.

Actually, the bill has a good chance of being stopped in the Senate. What is needed is to keep Lieberman happy so that he will vote to fillibuster any bill containing a public option, even if its a conference committee product. Without him and with every GOP Senator vowing to fillibuster, the bill will die. I don't think Reid would be able to use reconciliation. He'd lose too many votes doing that.

112 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:39:30pm

The real failure of strategy on the R's part was not plugging the insurance gap and rising costs while they had control of congress for six years. That was the strategy megafail, just like not bulling through some form of immigration reform while they had control.
Now we get the Dem version of everything, talk about the big L...

113 Dancing along the light of day  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:40:16pm

Link to a really interesting & easy to read book on the history of Tulips.
"Tulipomania"
[Link: www.amazon.com...]

114 JohninLondon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:43:15pm

"The Black Tulip" by Dumas was one of the first books I ever read. Basically an account of the way Holland was obsessed with the search, massive sums paid for bulbs claimed to be black - preceding the South Sea Bubble so the first documented example of a financial boom-and-bust.

[Link: www.amazon.co.uk...]

115 Decatur Deb  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:45:34pm

re: #112 Thanos

The real failure of strategy on the R's part was not plugging the insurance gap and rising costs while they had control of congress for six years. That was the strategy megafail, just like not bulling through some form of immigration reform while they had control.
Now we get the Dem version of everything, talk about the big L...

something about "Lead, follow..."

116 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:46:17pm

It would be wonderful if The Philadelphia Flower Show folks would invite her and her namesake tulips to the next flower show.

117 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:46:42pm

Charles, now that we are talking rss etc. have you considered putting Frum Forum in the sidebar? I know a lot of lizards are reading that in opposition to the wingnutosphere blogs nowadays.

[Link: www.frumforum.com...]

118 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:47:35pm
119 McNug  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:48:30pm

re: #23 MandyManners

That first one there is a hum-dinger.

This website and the associated organization of the same name have the mission of providing Jews and non-Jews with the intellectual tools to stand up to Zionist intimidation and manipulation.

His choice of blog title is curious - why deliberately exclude Sephardi Jews?

Is it because the "anti-zionist Jew" narrative is a tough sell to Jews who have lived in Arab countries?

120 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:48:47pm

re: #118 Dark_Falcon

After the last few days good news is not only welcome, it is needed.

121 tradewind  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:49:50pm

Cool. Tulip bulbs were always the most requested ' please bring me back' stuff on AMS trips. They're so much better than roses to me.
The Dutch used 'em for money way back.
I like to let my tulip arrangements fall over and droop, and when my little girl was old enough to notice that, she said once ' Mommy, we need to tuck those flowahs into bed. They are sooo sweepy.'

122 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:50:28pm

re: #119 McNug

His choice of blog title is curious - why deliberately exclude Sephardi Jews?

Is it because the "anti-zionist Jew" narrative is a tough sell to Jews who have lived in Arab countries?

That was my first thought.

123 tradewind  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:50:36pm

re: #117 Thanos

How do you read something ' in opposition'? Does it require a vow?///

124 JohninLondon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:51:06pm

Surely the wider lesson of the House vote was that is shows that Obama's election promises to try to be post-partisan was a fraud.

The utterly partisan vote was FOR the bill.

The bi-partisan vote - a mix of party allegiancies - was AGAINST. But steamrollered by the majority, after damn-all time for examining the bill, amending it or even reading it.

An empty "victory". Several more months before the Senate decides - more time to show the huge costs (now looking like over $2 trillion ?), more time to let people at the grassroots make their views heard.

The only real mandate Obama had was to be post-partisan.

So far he has set out on every issue to be divisive.

A fraudulent prospectus.

125 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:52:26pm

re: #105 MandyManners

There's not one, yet.

Not even an artist's sketch?

126 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:53:19pm

re: #120 soxfan4life

After the last few days good news is not only welcome, it is needed.

I try, friend, I try. And now I have to go get myself some dinner and some soda. BBL

127 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:54:06pm

re: #87 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Why is Keith Olbermann on my football?

He's only been a sports journalist since the 1980's. Just because he has a douchey MSNBC vehicle doesn't mean he stops being a decent sports commentator.

(and for the record, I rather liked Dennis Miller's football commentary as well...though I fear that I am not the target demo for MNF)

128 tradewind  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:54:37pm

re: #106 soxfan4life
He was plucked by MSNBC from ESPN (under a cloud of controversy, in which people were grumbling that he was an absolute nightmare to work with) to reinvent himself as a news reader. Wish they'd send him back.

129 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:55:46pm

black tulips & Utopian health care... hmmm, just wish I could put my finger on it...

130 Decatur Deb  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:55:57pm

re: #127 WindUpBird

(snip)..though I fear that I am not the target demo for MNF)


Neilsen knows you're just there for the mascots.

131 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:57:15pm

re: #123 tradewind

"as opposed to" "instead of"

132 freetoken  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:58:03pm

Sadly, in most of San Diego county tulips are a dissappointment, as it doesn't get cold enough to chill the bulbs in winter. One can of course always use one's refrigerator, but that means digging up the bulbs every year.

I had much better success with freesias, which can really do well here.

I discovered that daffodils and paperwhites struggle here, though they do better than tulips. I had some success with paperwhites planted in a very shady spot that I would keep from drying out.

Most disappointing is that Hyacinths eventually fail here, though they will try to grow for a couple of seasons, giving sparse blooms.

So Tulip 'Ayaan' is unlikely to be on my list of plantings...

133 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:58:37pm

re: #128 tradewind

Send him to ESPN. Extreme oratory for the Extreme Games!

134 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:59:18pm

re: #124 JohninLondon

I also think the post-partisan rhetoric was a fraud. Or rather, it was a campaign strategy. That's politics, dress up the same old machinations in a new outfit and win an election. Republicans aren't post partisan, Democrats shouldn't be post partisan. Two parties, lots of tribalism, lots of divisions, lots of gerrymandering, lots of hysterical, violent fist-pounding disagreement on everything. There's always gonna be partisanship.

/cynicalbuttotallystillaDemocrat

135 freetoken  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:59:36pm

re: #124 JohninLondon

Well, you certainly have your mantra down... maybe if you repeat it often enough it will be true?

136 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 4:59:52pm

For all the gloom and doom folks who were almost going to have a nervous breakdown because there were no really good hurricanes hitting our coast this year, don't despair, you may get a mid-level weather related disaster yet...

Hurricane IDA Public Advisory

Whee.
//

137 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:00:59pm

re: #130 Decatur Deb

Neilsen knows you're just there for the mascots.

Shhh! Neilsen's eyes are everywhere o_o

(I'm also there for the hilarious touchdown dances that end up with fines and penalties)

138 Decatur Deb  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:01:33pm

re: #136 Walter L. Newton

We're in the center of some of the projection cones, but 80 mi inland.

139 JohninLondon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:01:55pm

re: #135 freetoken

Well, you certainly have your mantra down... maybe if you repeat it often enough it will be true?


Maybe it gets repeated because it IS true.

Obama's time in office so far has been divisive to a T.

And voters are now rejecting his extremism.

140 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:02:24pm

re: #138 Decatur Deb

We're in the center of some of the projection cones, but 80 mi inland.

I'm sorry... better luck next time...
//

141 freetoken  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:02:34pm

re: #136 Walter L. Newton

However, Ida has passed through the warmest waters she is going to find and will likely only be a Tropical Storm when she gets to Florida:

[Link: www.wunderground.com...]

142 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:03:28pm

re: #141 freetoken

However, Ida has passed through the warmest waters she is going to find and will likely only be a Tropical Storm when she gets to Florida:

[Link: www.wunderground.com...]

I'm sorry... my condolences.

143 Decatur Deb  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:04:11pm

re: #140 Walter L. Newton

I'm sorry... better luck next time...
//

No sweat. I'm buying 3000' of shingles tomorrow for this winter's
project. I'd be happy if it stripped the roof.

144 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:05:14pm

re: #141 freetoken

However, Ida has passed through the warmest waters she is going to find and will likely only be a Tropical Storm when she gets to Florida:

[Link: www.wunderground.com...]

Good news.

145 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:07:20pm

re: #143 Decatur Deb

Saw a news story recently, lumber yards are being robbed of shingles... they suspect crooked roofing contractors just for these times.

146 Decatur Deb  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:09:16pm

re: #145 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Saw a news story recently, lumber yards are being robbed of shingles... they suspect crooked roofing contractors just for these times.

Bastards often strip the pipes and wires out of our Habitat sites.
Thousands in damage for a hundred or two at the "recyclers".

147 JohninLondon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:09:17pm

Kennedy : "Ich bin ein Berliner"

Obama : "Ich bin beschaftigt" - too busy to accept the invite from the German Chancellor to attend the 20th anniversary today (GMT) of the fall of the Berlin Wall.

Putin must be rubbing his eyes in wonderment every time Obama insults European nations. A lot of us over here celebrate the fact that the US guaranteed the defence of Europe for decades, until the USSR crumbled.''Putin knows his history. Obama either does not know how much the US did, how steadfastly, and at what cost - or he rejects it.

148 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:09:24pm

re: #143 Decatur Deb

No sweat. I'm buying 3000' of shingles tomorrow for this winter's
project. I'd be happy if it stripped the roof.

When life gives you lemons...

149 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:10:28pm

re: #147 JohninLondon

Kennedy : "Ich bin ein Berliner"

"I am a Jelly Donut!"
-Eddie Izzard

150 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:11:57pm

re: #146 Decatur Deb

I know it's evil... but I've seen pictures of people electrocuted stealing copper wire... and I giggle a bit.

151 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:12:01pm

re: #144 Bagua

BTW...whatever happened to the massive city-destroying hurricanes we were promised would come ashore every hour on the hour thanks to Global warming?

152 Varek Raith  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:13:19pm

re: #151 Fenway_Nation

BTW...whatever happened to the massive city-destroying hurricanes we were promised would come ashore every hour on the hour thanks to Global warming?

Who promised that?

153 Decatur Deb  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:13:21pm

re: #150 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I know it's evil... but I've seen pictures of people electrocuted stealing copper wire... and I giggle a bit.

I'm Lib, so I want them to survive and sin no more.

154 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:13:28pm

re: #149 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

"I am a Jelly Donut!"
-Eddie Izzard

I'm a meat popsicle.

155 Racer X  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:14:20pm
156 Racer X  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:14:41pm

re: #154 Walter L. Newton

I'm a meat popsicle.

I'm Korben Dallas!

157 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:14:42pm

Goodness...I hope the Ayaan doesn't play the role in another dodgy 'Tulip Bubble' investment scheme.

158 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:15:08pm

re: #156 Racer X

I'm Korben Dallas!

Multi-pass

159 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:15:29pm

re: #150 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I know it's evil... but I've seen pictures of people electrocuted stealing copper wire... and I giggle a bit.

the penalty for theft is not electrocution... but the penalty for stupidity can be harsh indeed.

160 JohninLondon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:15:47pm

re: #149 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

"I am a Jelly Donut!"
-Eddie Izzard

We all know that.

But a lot of us remember the note that Kennedy struck, the effect of his statement of strong alliance.

An echo of the previous resolve shown by Truman in breaking the blockade of Berlin in 1948.

161 Decatur Deb  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:16:11pm

re: #159 brookly red

the penalty for theft is not electrocution... but the penalty for stupidity can be harsh indeed.

Breeding Better Thieves.

162 Charles Johnson  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:16:15pm

re: #117 Thanos

Charles, now that we are talking rss etc. have you considered putting Frum Forum in the sidebar? I know a lot of lizards are reading that in opposition to the wingnutosphere blogs nowadays.

[Link: www.frumforum.com...]

It's now in the list. I also added True/Slant.

163 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:16:26pm

re: #152 Varek Raith

Lot's of talking MSM talking heads right after the 1-2 punch of Katrina and Rita.

Last year's Ike was pretty bad, too...I'm sure Spike Lee will make a documentary about how the hurricane and aftermath affected the lives of those Texans.

164 Varek Raith  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:16:40pm

re: #154 Walter L. Newton

I'm a meat popsicle.

"Explanation: It's just that... you have all these squishy parts, master. And all that water! How the constant sloshing doesn't drive you mad, I have no idea..."
-HK-47
:)

165 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:16:58pm

re: #161 Decatur Deb

Breeding Better Thieves.

so we are back to congress again?

166 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:18:39pm

re: #147 JohninLondon

Kennedy : "Ich bin ein Berliner"

Obama : "Ich bin beschaftigt" - too busy to accept the invite from the German Chancellor to attend the 20th anniversary today (GMT) of the fall of the Berlin Wall.

Putin must be rubbing his eyes in wonderment every time Obama insults European nations. A lot of us over here celebrate the fact that the US guaranteed the defence of Europe for decades, until the USSR crumbled.''Putin knows his history. Obama either does not know how much the US did, how steadfastly, and at what cost - or he rejects it.

You're praising Putin to criticize our president? Putin who has stood as an obstacle towards any military action against Iran? Russia is literally an ally of the Iranian regime.

167 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:18:41pm

re: #162 Charles

It's now in the list. I also added True/Slant.

Very cool, thanks

168 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:20:33pm

I suspect this was done with Crazy Pam's and Vlaams Belang's favorite "satire" video, but it's nice to know sanity reigns somewhere. Going Godwinian can get you fired in Oz.
[Link: www.smh.com.au...]

169 Decatur Deb  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:22:18pm

'Nite All

170 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:23:56pm

re: #166 Gus 802

Saying that Putin is smart isn't neccecarily coming out in support of him.

All sorts of terrorists, dictators and thugs didn't get to where they are today because they were stupid.

/unless that particular place was a shallow unmarked grave or something.

171 JohninLondon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:28:02pm

re: #166 Gus 802

You're praising Putin to criticize our president? Putin who has stood as an obstacle towards any military action against Iran? Russia is literally an ally of the Iranian regime.

I am not praising Putin. He is as you say a bad hat.

But he faces a naive opponent - and probably can hardly believe his luck.

Obama should have planned to be in Berlin today - to underscore the superiority of democratic freedom over any sort of Soviet system.

Refusing the invite of the German Chancellor looks like a calculated insult.

172 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:29:32pm

re: #171 JohninLondon

I am not praising Putin. He is as you say a bad hat.

But he faces a naive opponent - and probably can hardly believe his luck.

Obama should have planned to be in Berlin today - to underscore the superiority of democratic freedom over any sort of Soviet system.

Refusing the invite of the German Chancellor looks like a calculated insult.

OK, that makes more sense. I also didn't know she invited him.

173 Stanghazi  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:30:29pm

Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I believe Obama will be @ Ft. Hood for a memorial instead of Germany.

174 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:31:56pm

re: #173 Stanley Sea

Which I support...

175 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:32:38pm

re: #147 JohninLondon

Ich bin ein Tulip.

Today, we are all Tulips.

176 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:32:54pm

re: #173 Stanley Sea

I think the snub came before the Ft. Hood massacre.

But yea...Is the memorial Tuesday? I read some blurb that he plans to attend.

177 Racer X  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:33:03pm
178 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:33:51pm

re: #173 Stanley Sea

Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I believe Obama will be @ Ft. Hood for a memorial instead of Germany.

Obama to meet with Israel's Netanyahu on Monday

179 JohninLondon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:35:18pm

re: #172 Gus 802

OK, that makes more sense. I also didn't know she invited him.


Try these :

[Link: www.spiegel.de...]

[Link: blogs.abcnews.com...]

I find it almost unbelievable that the leader of the still-free world should have ducked this one, with Gibbs claiming he is too busy.

180 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:35:53pm

re: #178 Gus 802

Obama to meet with Israel's Netanyahu on Monday

I wonder if they will be discussing peace, or war.

181 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:37:13pm

re: #176 Fenway_Nation

Yes he and Michelle will be here for the memorial service on Tuesday.

182 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:37:44pm

re: #180 Bagua

I'd like to think it's some sort of tacit agreement that would give Israel more of a free hand in dealing with Iran, Hamas, Baby Assad or Hezbollah.

/But it will probably be about those eeevil settlers.

183 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:38:48pm

re: #182 Fenway_Nation

I'd like to think it's some sort of tacit agreement that would give Israel more of a free hand in dealing with Iran, Hamas, Baby Assad or Hezbollah.

/But it will probably be about those eeevil settlers.


Ahh the root of all the worlds problems

184 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:39:20pm

re: #179 JohninLondon

Try these :

Try this.

185 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:39:49pm

re: #179 JohninLondon

Try these :

[Link: www.spiegel.de...]

[Link: blogs.abcnews.com...]

I find it almost unbelievable that the leader of the still-free world should have ducked this one, with Gibbs claiming he is too busy.

I wonder if they internally messed up the scheduling. Given that he has a meeting with Netanyahu on Monday. Having the Secretary of State there is a good alternative I suppose.

186 JohninLondon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:40:40pm

re: #173 Stanley Sea

Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I believe Obama will be @ Ft. Hood for a memorial instead of Germany.

The Berlin ceremonies are today (GMT) - 9 November.

Obama turned down the invite about a month ago. Lord knows why. "Busy" is not a good and proper reason.

Everyone would have understood if he had had to cancel at the last moment, owing to Fort Hood.

187 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:40:43pm

re: #182 Fenway_Nation

I'd like to think it's some sort of tacit agreement that would give Israel more of a free hand in dealing with Iran, Hamas, Baby Assad or Hezbollah.

/But it will probably be about those eeevil settlers.

The situation with Iran is coming to a time of weighty decisions.

188 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:40:53pm

re: #180 Bagua

I wonder if they will be discussing peace, or war.

I would say the former as well as the "settlements."

189 freetoken  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:45:55pm

re: #186 JohninLondon

"Busy" is not a good and proper reason.

On the contrary, it is a very good reason. As it is, in order to go to Ft. Hood President Obama has had to delay a trip to Japan for an important meeting with the new Japanese government on his way to an important Asian summit (APEC).

As a American I would rather haver our President actively engaging in foreign policy matters that matter more to our future, than to satisfy the whims of European pundits.

190 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:47:08pm

re: #180 Bagua

I wonder if they will be discussing peace, or war.

appeasement. peace in the short term, war in the long.

191 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:47:34pm

re: #180 Bagua

I wonder if they will be discussing peace, or war.

Obama will bring up the "urgent need" to make some areas completely Jew-clean, and Bibi will say "bite me."

192 Stanghazi  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:51:04pm

re: #186 JohninLondon

There are many possibilities. Maybe they knew the health care vote would be scheduled. I just have to respond when it sounds like asinine picking. Maybe the visit to the Berlin wall is the biggest deal to some, not really to me.

193 Randall Gross  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:51:36pm

re: #191 Alouette

Obama will bring up the "urgent need" to make some areas completely Jew-clean, and Bibi will say "bite me."

Strange timing, tomorrow is the anniversary of Krystallnacht iirc?

194 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:52:02pm

re: #189 freetoken

If only he was as concerned with General McChrystals plans for the war in Afghanistan.

195 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:52:34pm

re: #193 Thanos

That's a very subtle nuance to the rookie Senator turned President.

196 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:52:36pm

re: #189 freetoken

On the contrary, it is a very good reason. As it is, in order to go to Ft. Hood President Obama has had to delay a trip to Japan for an important meeting with the new Japanese government on his way to an important Asian summit (APEC).

As a American I would rather haver our President actively engaging in foreign policy matters that matter more to our future, than to satisfy the whims of European pundits.

As a American I would rather haver our President actively engaging in foreign policy matters that matter more to our future, than to be here screwing things up.

197 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:53:18pm

re: #192 Stanley Sea

Now that he has been elected it is unimportant, when he visited the Berlin Wall during the campaign it was fucking fabulous.

198 windhorse  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:54:58pm

where's my lighter...

all we must do... is give Obama a chance...

(sway with me people)

199 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:55:54pm

re: #198 windhorse

where's my lighter...

all we must do... is give Obama a chance...

(sway with me people)

Peace.

200 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:56:09pm

re: #198 windhorse

Somehow I'm hearing Imagine by John Lennon.

201 freetoken  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:56:45pm

re: #197 soxfan4life

Obama can go to Berlin any time... go celebrate the 21st anniversary, for example.

However, right now the new Japanese government wants to talk about changes in the US-Japan relationship.

Right now, leaders in various Asian nations are concerned about the dollar and our economy, as well as their own, and the APEC summit is where nations around the Pacific can and will discuss these issues.

These are issues that need to be addressed right now. Celebrating past events can be scheduled for a later date.

202 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:57:26pm

re: #200 soxfan4life

Somehow I'm hearing Imagine by John Lennon.

/Slap! wake up man!

203 freetoken  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:58:35pm

I'm off to the gym, but I'll leave with this little goodie:

Is man on course to cause the sixth extinction?

... Kolbert is to focus on humanity's impact on the animal world, and in particular will look at the species that are today being rendered extinct by men and women. Scientists say the number of species being lost is approaching levels reached during five pivotal extinction events that have swept the planet over the past 600 million years. ...

204 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 5:59:45pm

re: #201 freetoken

Obama can go to Berlin any time... go celebrate the 21st anniversary, for example.

However, right now the new Japanese government wants to talk about changes in the US-Japan relationship.

Right now, leaders in various Asian nations are concerned about the dollar and our economy, as well as their own, and the APEC summit is where nations around the Pacific can and will discuss these issues.

These are issues that need to be addressed right now. Celebrating past events can be scheduled for a later date.

And in actuality, the security requirement for a presidential visit in Berlin "today" would have been rather disruptive for the city. If anything, it makes things easier for the residents of Berlin. In the end, it's really their day -- between the former people of what was once East and West Berlin and Germany.

205 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:02:21pm

Plus there's the "Giant dominoes form tribute to Berlin Wall's fall."

They look like giant VCR boxes. Kind of goes with the giant ketchup bottle and the Lacrosse six pack.

//

206 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:03:14pm

re: #187 Bagua

The situation with Iran is coming to a time of weighty decisions.

And we all know how this president votes on weighty decisions:

"Present."

207 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:04:33pm

re: #206 Dark_Falcon

He's not voting present, he's not jumping to any conclusions.

208 JohninLondon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:04:45pm

re: #189 freetoken

On the contrary, it is a very good reason. As it is, in order to go to Ft. Hood President Obama has had to delay a trip to Japan for an important meeting with the new Japanese government on his way to an important Asian summit (APEC).

As a American I would rather haver our President actively engaging in foreign policy matters that matter more to our future, than to satisfy the whims of European pundits.

Obama did not reject the views of some "European pundits".

He deliberately turned down - a month ago - the invite of the German Government.

Too "busy" to celebrate the fall of the Berlin Wall, a triumph of freedom, an epic moment in rejection of Communist dictatorship by hundreds of millions of people.

209 windhorse  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:05:51pm

re: #208 JohninLondon

just one more in a long line of naive blunders...

210 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:06:10pm

re: #206 Dark_Falcon

And we all know how this president votes on weighty decisions:

"Present."

problem is he don't vote no more, he signs off...

211 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:06:37pm

re: #209 windhorse

But he is sooo wonderful and smart.///

212 windhorse  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:07:30pm

re: #211 soxfan4life

and cerebral... and hip... and man, what he does with that teleprompter
(low whistle under breath)

213 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:07:47pm

re: #206 Dark_Falcon

And we all know how this president votes on weighty decisions:

"Present."

I'll accept "present" if the choice is Yes or No for an Israeli attack on Iranian nuclear sites.

214 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:07:53pm

re: #211 soxfan4life


And eloquent! Don't forget eloquent!

215 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:08:12pm

re: #208 JohninLondon

Obama did not reject the views of some "European pundits".

He deliberately turned down - a month ago - the invite of the German Government.

Too "busy" to celebrate the fall of the Berlin Wall, a triumph of freedom, an epic moment in rejection of Communist dictatorship by hundreds of millions of people.


It was a foolish act, that's for sure. But it might also have been that he doesn't like sharing the stage and waiting his turn. He likes to be The One, giving the big speech to an adoring crowd. Humility is not his strong suit.

216 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:09:52pm

re: #215 Dark_Falcon

And here I thought leadership wasn't his strong suit.

217 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:11:11pm

Obama Derangement Syndrome is a one size fits all POV.

Last time Obama spoke to huge crowds in Germany he drew criticism.

This time Obama won't be speaking to huge crowds in Germany, criticism.

I see a subtle trend here...

218 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:11:11pm

Deja vu.

219 windhorse  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:11:11pm

re: #216 soxfan4life

yeah... I love those strong suits...

220 JohninLondon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:11:58pm

re: #204 Gus 802

And in actuality, the security requirement for a presidential visit in Berlin "today" would have been rather disruptive for the city. If anything, it makes things easier for the residents of Berlin. In the end, it's really their day -- between the former people of what was once East and West Berlin and Germany.

Then how come it is only the US that is not being represented by its elected leader ?

Gauche ? or a deliberate snub ?

The US wants much greater REAL involvement by European allies in Afghanistan - quite rightly.

Europe OWES the US.

Going to Berlin might have underlined that a bit.

Not going gives entirely the wrong message. Just like his not going to the D-Day ceremonies this year.

221 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:13:06pm

re: #217 Bagua

Obama Derangement Syndrome is a one size fits all POV.

Last time Obama spoke to huge crowds in Germany he drew criticism.

This time Obama won't be speaking to huge crowds in Germany, criticism.

I see a subtle trend here...


last time he was running, now he is representing... bit different, no?

222 AMER1CAN  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:13:52pm

Slow news day.

I did read somewhere else that Hasan attended the same mosque for a speech by a radical imam as some of the 9/11 hijackers. Crazy.

223 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:14:03pm

re: #217 Bagua

Obama Derangement Syndrome is a one size fits all POV.

Last time Obama spoke to huge crowds in Germany he drew criticism.

This time Obama won't be speaking to huge crowds in Germany, criticism.

I see a subtle trend here...

Yeah. I think we got the message that he's not going. Now what are we supposed to do? Get all upset? Analyze this and for what?

Sure there are arguments as to why he should have gone but he's not going. Even if he did go he'd probably "say the wrong thing" to many people. Might as well give a televised speech through a jumbotron.

224 windhorse  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:14:43pm

re: #217 Bagua

...funny... in both cases, the criticism was appropriate.

225 Taqyia2Me  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:14:58pm

re: #222 AMER1CAN

Slow news day.

I did read somewhere else that Hasan attended the same mosque for a speech by a radical imam as some of the 9/11 hijackers. Crazy.

Surely just a coincidence.

226 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:15:00pm

re: #220 JohninLondon

Then how come it is only the US that is not being represented by its elected leader ?

Gauche ? or a deliberate snub ?

The US wants much greater REAL involvement by European allies in Afghanistan - quite rightly.

Europe OWES the US.

Going to Berlin might have underlined that a bit.

Not going gives entirely the wrong message. Just like his not going to the D-Day ceremonies this year.

He doesn't like history events. Again, they put the focus on past events and old heroes, while he would much prefer to talk about the glorious CHANGE! he intends to bring. As before, he doesn't like it if its not All About Obama.

227 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:15:03pm

re: #220 JohninLondon

Then how come it is only the US that is not being represented by its elected leader ?

Gauche ? or a deliberate snub ?

The US wants much greater REAL involvement by European allies in Afghanistan - quite rightly.

Europe OWES the US.

Going to Berlin might have underlined that a bit.

Not going gives entirely the wrong message. Just like his not going to the D-Day ceremonies this year.

He went to the D-Day ceremonies.

228 swamprat  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:15:07pm

re: #221 brookly red

Always seemed a bit odd, him campaigning in germany for U.S. president.

229 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:15:12pm

re: #221 brookly red

last time he was running, now he is representing... bit different, no?

You got it.

Last time he was acting like he was running for the King of the World position. Now that he is president, it's like he's ashamed that it's only president of the United States.

230 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:15:13pm

re: #217 Bagua

Obama Derangement Syndrome is a one size fits all POV.

Last time Obama spoke to huge crowds in Germany he drew criticism.

This time Obama won't be speaking to huge crowds in Germany, criticism.

I see a subtle trend here...

Last time Obama spoke to huge crowds in Germany, he was telling them how wonderful he is.

Somehow I don't think that topic would be very relevant if he went this time around.

231 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:16:23pm

See, it's right here...

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

232 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:16:49pm

re: #228 swamprat

Don't forget blowing off a visit to some of the US military bases there.

233 JohninLondon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:17:41pm

re: #201 freetoken

Obama can go to Berlin any time... go celebrate the 21st anniversary, for example.

However, right now the new Japanese government wants to talk about changes in the US-Japan relationship.

Right now, leaders in various Asian nations are concerned about the dollar and our economy, as well as their own, and the APEC summit is where nations around the Pacific can and will discuss these issues.

These are issues that need to be addressed right now. Celebrating past events can be scheduled for a later date.

If Obama goes to some sort of 21st anniversary, he'll be on his own.

The preparatory talks with the Japanese could have been scheduled to fit in with Obama's movements.

Those who ignore history are condemned to repeat it ?

234 windhorse  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:18:15pm

going to Berlin to win an election... which state is Berlin in again?

235 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:18:30pm

Here's a slideshow of Obama at the D-day ceremonies:

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

I'll see if I can find a Fox News link. /

236 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:18:35pm

re: #215 Dark_Falcon

Hey, prairiefire. If you disagree with me, reply to my post and let me know why. Don't just down ding me.

237 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:19:04pm

re: #234 windhorse

going to Berlin to win an election... which state is Berlin in again?

I think its the 56th state. ;)

238 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:19:46pm

re: #229 Walter L. Newton

You got it.

Last time he was acting like he was running for the King of the World position. Now that he is president, it's like he's ashamed that it's only president of the United States.

Last time he was acting like he was running for the King of the World position. Now that he is president, it's like he's ashamed of the United States.

minor editing...

239 That's Glenn Beck to you  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:20:11pm

Well my people have been contacted about a new even rarer Tulip called a "Man Cry Tulip". When men smell it they get mistyeyed.

The fisrt developed was the "Van Vermeil". The next will either be the "Glenn Beck" or the "That Fucking Lunatic From America".

240 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:20:38pm

re: #239 That's Glenn Beck to you

Well my people have been contacted about a new even rarer Tulip called a "Man Cry Tulip". When men smell it they get mistyeyed.

The fisrt developed was the "Van Vermeil". The next will either be the "Glenn Beck" or the "That Fucking Lunatic From America".

Go fuck yourself Glenn.

241 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:21:08pm

re: #236 Dark_Falcon

I've made multiple appearences on the Bottom 10 list thanks to lizards like Locker, blueherron, Jimmah and goddamnedfrank.

I was a little surprised at first, but now I consider it a badge of honor.

242 Varek Raith  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:21:16pm

re: #239 That's Glenn Beck to you

Well my people have been contacted about a new even rarer Tulip called a "Man Cry Tulip". When men smell it they get mistyeyed.

The fisrt developed was the "Van Vermeil". The next will either be the "Glenn Beck" or the "That Fucking Lunatic From America".

Could you elaborate your point further on a chalkboard?
/:)

243 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:22:02pm

Obama leaves on a major Asian trip on Wednesday and has a great deal on his agenda. A trip in the opposite direction on Monday for a 20th anniversary may not fit his busy schedule. Isn't he sending the secretary of state?

244 doubter4444  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:22:09pm

re: #26 really grumpy big dog Johnson

I just read a glowing post from 2007 about Ayaan on a blog that seems to have found its own particular niche in right-wing cyberspace, although I admit I really don't know who they are...

[Link: www.moonbattery.com...]

Just who are these people? And are they dangerous?

Didn't he used to post here?
And wasn't he banned?

245 swamprat  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:23:45pm

Someone will find something to criticize no matter where he goes.

And that isn't even the tough part.

We don't have the big picture.

We ain't wearin' the big boy pants.

I hope he is making the right decisions, and I'm not talking about which group of politicians, he panders to.

Lotta nastiness going on all over the world;
bunt?
go for a line drive?
let the pitches sail past?

But the stats here have lives at stake.

246 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:24:42pm

re: #244 doubter4444

Didn't he used to post here?
And wasn't he banned?

Something like that. I'm kind of surprised that link survived this far.

247 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:24:46pm

re: #239 That's Glenn Beck to you

Well my people have been contacted about a new even rarer Tulip called a "Man Cry Tulip". When men smell it they get mistyeyed.

The fisrt developed was the "Van Vermeil". The next will either be the "Glenn Beck" or the "That Fucking Lunatic From America".

What about that new tropical plant I heard about? I hear its being called "Crazy man's appendix".

248 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:25:31pm

re: #233 JohninLondon

Those who ignore history are condemned to repeat it ?

Those who imitate TFK condemn themselves.

/

249 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:26:20pm

re: #241 Fenway_Nation

I've made multiple appearences on the Bottom 10 list thanks to lizards like Locker, blueherron, Jimmah and goddamnedfrank.

I was a little surprised at first, but now I consider it a badge of honor.

Where are all our liberal friends tonight. Hangovers from all the "we won health care" parties?

250 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:27:26pm

re: #247 Dark_Falcon

What about that new tropical plant I heard about? I hear its being called "Crazy man's appendix".

/it's not bad but you get really terrible munchies...

251 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:27:35pm

re: #248 Bagua

Those who imitate TFK condemn themselves.

/

I just took a close look at your avatar. Admit it, you are one of the escaped Dharma Project children, trying to take back The Island?

252 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:28:01pm

re: #249 Walter L. Newton

Where are all our liberal friends tonight. Hangovers from all the "we won health care" parties?

Yes, it's a bit dull with no-one to ridicule and fume at.

/

253 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:28:03pm

re: #241 Fenway_Nation

I've made multiple appearences on the Bottom 10 list thanks to lizards like Locker, blueherron, Jimmah and goddamnedfrank.

I was a little surprised at first, but now I consider it a badge of honor.

Locker, Jimmah, and goddamnedfrank don't bother me, because they actually answer your posts. Blueherron used to mostly stealth ding, but because he has less than 50 posts, he lost his dinger when Charles instituted the '50 Comments to rate' Rule (a rule I rather like).

254 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:28:28pm

re: #248 Bagua

pssst where is tfk? or did I miss something?

255 swamprat  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:29:01pm

re: #248 Bagua


TFK did with words what count Basie did with notes.

256 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:29:07pm

re: #251 Walter L. Newton

I just took a close look at your avatar. Admit it, you are one of the escaped Dharma Project children, trying to take back The Island?

Ha, they are pikers! My group is trying to hold on to the world.

257 Varek Raith  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:29:20pm

re: #254 brookly red

pssst where is tfk? or did I miss something?

Bannedidy, banned banned.

258 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:29:56pm

re: #254 brookly red

pssst where is tfk? or did I miss something?

You missed nothing... then again...

Kerry asked you to say that.
But it doesn't work...
because you don't have the medals
to come home again.

259 solomonpanting  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:30:15pm

re: #239 That's Glenn Beck to you

Well my people have been contacted about a new even rarer Tulip called a "Man Cry Tulip". When men smell it they get mistyeyed.

The fisrt developed was the "Van Vermeil". The next will either be the "Glenn Beck" or the "That Fucking Lunatic From America".

There's a new sandwich in his/your honor:

Half-baked ham on a roll

260 Neutral President  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:30:40pm

re: #254 brookly red

pssst where is tfk? or did I miss something?

He came down with a bad case of Stinky's foot in his ass.

261 Bagua  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:31:02pm

re: #241 Fenway_Nation

I've made multiple appearences on the Bottom 10 list thanks to lizards like Locker, blueherron, Jimmah and goddamnedfrank.

I was a little surprised at first, but now I consider it a badge of honor.

Show off.

262 Racer X  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:31:59pm

Present

263 Sharmuta  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:32:09pm

re: #241 Fenway_Nation

I've made multiple appearences on the Bottom 10 list thanks to lizards like Locker, blueherron, Xxxmah and goddamnedfrank.

I was a little surprised at first, but now I consider it a badge of honor.

FIFY

264 jaunte  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:32:32pm

re: #262 Racer X

Present

Arms.

265 prairiefire  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:32:51pm

re: #236 Dark_Falcon

Okaydoke, Dark_Falcon.

266 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:33:08pm

Huh... wow I thought he would alway walk up to the line but not cross it. Shows what I know.

267 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:33:17pm

Oy vey.

268 ryannon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:33:37pm

re: #220 JohninLondon

Then how come it is only the US that is not being represented by its elected leader ?

Gauche ? or a deliberate snub ?

The US wants much greater REAL involvement by European allies in Afghanistan - quite rightly.

Europe OWES the US.

Going to Berlin might have underlined that a bit.


I quite agree with you, but there also might be very legitimate fears about ensuring his security under these particular conditions and on foreign soil. The measures that can be taken in the U.S. might be difficult to implement overseas, where in many respects it's a different ballgame.

Not going gives entirely the wrong message. Just like his not going to the D-Day ceremonies this year.

269 Racer X  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:33:40pm
270 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:33:43pm

re: #254 brookly red

pssst where is tfk? or did I miss something?

He got the boot and is now ranting on the stalker blog. He has activated sock puppets more than once to sneak in here and annoy us. His puppets are easy to spot, since they are write in the same way. Very stacco, rapid fire posts. If you see a post like that, and the poster is being an asshole, you might be dealing with a tfk sock puppet.

271 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:33:47pm

re: #264 jaunte

Arms.

*tingle*

272 Raryn  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:33:51pm

re: #205 Gus 802

Plus there's the "Giant dominoes form tribute to Berlin Wall's fall."

They look like giant VCR boxes. Kind of goes with the giant ketchup bottle and the Lacrosse six pack.

//

Heh, great idea.

273 avanti  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:34:29pm

re: #249 Walter L. Newton

Where are all our liberal friends tonight. Hangovers from all the "we won health care" parties?

Winding down from a Atlantic City trip, getting ready for Vagas/Laughlin trip Weds-Sun.

274 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:34:37pm

re: #270 Dark_Falcon

He got the boot and is now ranting on the stalker blog. He has activated sock puppets more than once to sneak in here and annoy us. His puppets are easy to spot, since they are write in the same way. Very stacco, rapid fire posts. If you see a post like that, and the poster is being an asshole, you might be dealing with a tfk sock puppet.

I am not a TFK sock
But Kerry would say that too.

275 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:35:04pm

re: #265 prairiefire

Okaydoke, Dark_Falcon.

Glad you decided to join the conversation. So tell me, how am I wrong about Obama's overinflated ego?

276 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:35:24pm

re: #198 windhorse

I remember a comedian, don't remember his last name, but his first name was Chance.

He played guitar and sang to the ladies,

"All I am saying; is give Chance a piece!"

277 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:35:33pm

re: #273 avanti

Winding down from a Atlantic City trip, getting ready for Vagas/Laughlin trip Weds-Sun.

Already spending all that health care money you all will be collecting in fines and taxes?

278 prairiefire  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:36:18pm

re: #236 Dark_Falcon

I don't agree that it was a foolish act, and I don't find him egotistical. More geeky law professor, amazed at his good fortune that Michele married him.

279 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:36:28pm

re: #276 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I remember a comedian, don't remember his last name, but his first name was Chance.

He played guitar and sang to the ladies,

"All I am saying; is give Chance a piece!"

CHANCE LANGTON

[Link: www.comedycontact.com...]

280 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:36:42pm

re: #270 Dark_Falcon

He got the boot and is now ranting on the stalker blog. He has activated sock puppets more than once to sneak in here and annoy us. His puppets are easy to spot, since they are write in the same way. Very stacco, rapid fire posts. If you see a post like that, and the poster is being an asshole, you might be dealing with a tfk sock puppet.

never did understand that stalker thing, blog or other wise.

281 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:37:00pm

re: #277 Walter L. Newton

It's carbon credits he's working on.

282 Varek Raith  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:37:00pm

re: #278 prairiefire

I don't agree that it was a foolish act, and I don't find him egotistical. More geeky law professor, amazed at his good fortune that Michele married him.

Uh, he's a politician. Ego is a prerequisite.

283 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:37:45pm

re: #276 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I remember a comedian, don't remember his last name, but his first name was Chance.

He played guitar and sang to the ladies,

"All I am saying; is give Chance a piece!"

how did that work out?

284 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:37:46pm

re: #274 Walter L. Newton

I am not a TFK sock
But Kerry would say that too.

Good run around the block. I guess I milked that for all the up dings I'm going to get. Thanks TFK.
//

285 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:38:10pm

re: #278 prairiefire

How does someone who is not egotistical come up with "we are the one's we've been waiting for".

286 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:38:48pm

re: #278 prairiefire

I don't agree that it was a foolish act, and I don't find him egotistical. More geeky law professor, amazed at his good fortune that Michele married him.

With respect, I disagree. The way the man structures events seems to me to reveal a major need for attention.

287 jaunte  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:39:03pm

Jerry Pournelle makes a good point about the Ft. Hood terrorist shootings:
(scroll down almost to the end)

He is a crazy guy who happens to be a Muslim. All of that misses the point: he was disloyal to the United States, and said so openly and many times; yet he remained a commissioned officer of the United States. That is the point that is being overlooked. Whether the disloyalty is due to a psychotic episode or some other cause is not important.[Link: jerrypournelle.com...]
288 Racer X  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:39:25pm

Obama has no ego.

Right.

289 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:39:29pm

re: #279 Walter L. Newton

You know the guy? or just know of him? or google-fu?

290 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:39:52pm

re: #287 jaunte

Jerry Pournelle makes a good point about the Ft. Hood terrorist shootings:
(scroll down almost to the end)

That monster was shooting people that were down too.

291 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:40:30pm

re: #283 brookly red

how did that work out?

Don't know. He was trying to make me laugh... and he succeeded, so, I guess, okay.

292 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:40:36pm

re: #289 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

You know the guy? or just know of him? or google-fu?

Google-fu... hie-yha (smacks board).

293 avanti  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:40:58pm

re: #277 Walter L. Newton

Already spending all that health care money you all will be collecting in fines and taxes?

Nope, risking Studebaker money at the tables, but the trip is free. I'm not in that loop to collect money. Tax wise, I'm over 950K year too poor to be taxed and have medicare, so it's a wash for me either other way.

294 Racer X  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:42:10pm
295 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:42:17pm

re: #293 avanti

Nope, risking Studebaker money at the tables, but the trip is free. I'm not in that loop to collect money. Tax wise, I'm over 950K year too poor to be taxed and have medicare, so it's a wash for me either other way.

I was just being a little humorous. I didn't expect you to justify your trip against my comment.

Geeessshhh.

296 prairiefire  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:42:43pm

re: #285 soxfan4life

I take that to mean "we', the people who voted for him.

297 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:42:44pm

re: #274 Walter L. Newton

I am not a TFK sock
But Kerry would say that too.

re: #291 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Don't know. He was trying to make me laugh... and he succeeded, so, I guess, okay.

uhhh, you didn't give him any did you?

you know except for the ocassional reference here would anyone even remember who Kerry was?

298 avanti  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:43:00pm

re: #285 soxfan4life

How does someone who is not egotistical come up with "we are the one's we've been waiting for".

I took that to mean, a new, change agenda administration. i.e., liberal stuff.

299 Neutral President  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:43:16pm

re: #286 Dark_Falcon

With respect, I disagree. The way the man structures events seems to me to reveal a major need for attention.

I'm pretty sure we went over classical signs of narcissism from Obama both before and after the election ad nauseam. It was not controversial and I don't remember the resident liberals getting in a major huff about it and going on a down ding spree calling everyone wingnuts or accusing people of ODS.

300 doubter4444  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:43:49pm

re: #68 Walter L. Newton

I'm going to have to 100 percent agree with KT on this. And he points out just what I was saying, the GOP are terrible (and basically chicken) when it comes to strategy.

See, I think the thing is, they believe in lockstep, or nothing.

Meanwhile, the Dem's are a rowdy bunch and say all sorts of stuff, till the end, when the votes count.
To the Dem's, the measure passed counts, not the number of votes it passes by. I was stunned by the near 100% Republican vote total that almost every vote passed by during the Bush years, both when they had both houses or not.
It looks good as discipline, but gives no wiggle room for dissenters, and it's coming back in a big way now, for tho the base, as Thanos said, if you voted against something even for strategic reasons, your were screwed. The Rove years killed the outliers, and now it is what is expected of the party.

I can see Obama saying to Lieberman, or the Blue Dogs:" You can vote against it here, or here, but you've vote for it here and here, giving the illusion that they care about constituent opinion, and that they are "INDEPENDENT" of the WH, when it's all a kabuki.
It's kind of impressive to watch, as he rolls up legislative victories, and keeps the dull thinking that there is real dissent in the ranks.

301 brookly red  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:44:09pm

re: 297 that happens when I miss my meds... sorry.

302 avanti  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:44:23pm

re: #295 Walter L. Newton

I was just being a little humorous. I didn't expect you to justify your trip against my comment.

Geeessshhh.

It's called a conversation, you know I love your witty comments.

303 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:45:43pm

re: #287 jaunte

For the relatively short period of time I could stomach MSNBC, they were trying like hell to chalk the shooting up to PTSD and by extension leave Hasan relatively blameless and make the Army culpable.

I'd say the Army was culpable in tthe sense that many of Hasan's collegaues reported some of the red flags he was setting off and the Army chose not to take action for fear any repercussions of singling out a Muslim officer (no matter how problematic) for deiscipline or dismissal and subsequently kicked the can down the road for somebody else to deal with.

304 doubter4444  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:46:00pm

re: #300 doubter4444

PIMF, but so many in it I hope people get the drift.
Apologies.

305 Sheepdogess  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:46:29pm

A small yet hopeful gesture of courage. I suspect the average islamic terrorist doesn't sport a spring border.

306 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:47:27pm

re: #299 ArchangelMichael


'Butthurt' is the trendy phrase these days.

307 JohninLondon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:47:32pm

re: #287 jaunte

Jerry Pournelle makes a good point about the Ft. Hood terrorist shootings:
(scroll down almost to the end)

A lot of the media coverage continues to dance around the whole thing, often avoiding the words "terrorism" and "jihad". (We know that some of the media - AP, Reuters, BBC) have self-denying ordinances about the T-word in other contexts)

At least General Casey has now said that terrorism cannot be ruled out. And Liberman seems to be saying that terrorism could be the more likely description of the massacre.

308 jaunte  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:47:52pm

re: #303 Fenway_Nation

I sure hope they can find a way to tighten up that area of security.

309 prairiefire  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:48:39pm

re: #286 Dark_Falcon

I'm not sure about "structuring events." I will say he has chaired a bunch of meetings, visited more countries then any other president at this point in his administration (I know, no link). Steered a lot of legislation, let Hil go after folks who need intimidating, in a surprisingly short amount of time.

310 Racer X  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:49:19pm

re: #306 Fenway_Nation

'Butthurt' is the trendy phrase these days.

Mostly from those who are a pain in the ass.

311 Varek Raith  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:49:27pm

re: #309 prairiefire

I'm not sure about "structuring events." I will say he has chaired a bunch of meetings, visited more countries then any other president at this point in his administration (I know, no link). Steered a lot of legislation, let Hil go after folks who need intimidating, in a surprisingly short amount of time.

Who did we intimidate? And into doing what?

312 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:49:30pm

re: #303 Fenway_Nation

For the relatively short period of time I could stomach MSNBC, they were trying like hell to chalk the shooting up to PTSD and by extension leave Hasan relatively blameless and make the Army culpable.

I'd say the Army was culpable in tthe sense that many of Hasan's collegaues reported some of the red flags he was setting off and the Army chose not to take action for fear any repercussions of singling out a Muslim officer (no matter how problematic) for deiscipline or dismissal and subsequently kicked the can down the road for somebody else to deal with.

From what I've seen it looks like the official Army line is to dance around certain issues and downplaying certain aspects of this case. If what we heard from the people that spoke on that NPR report are true then he should have been kicked out of the Army at that time. However, there is a certain amount of freedom granted to those in the medical fields in the military including those he garnered by rank.

313 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:50:36pm

re: #309 prairiefire

let Hil go after folks who need intimidating, in a surprisingly short amount of time

BWA HA HA HA HA HA HA! No...really!?

Outside of those who have most of their assets in the US Dollar, who exactly is intimidated?

314 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:51:12pm

re: #287 jaunte

Jerry Pournelle makes a good point about the Ft. Hood terrorist shootings:
(scroll down almost to the end)

Jerry Pournelle often makes good points. His "The Mercenary" series is an excellent group of novels.

315 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:53:49pm

re: #312 Gus 802


Yep...there's more than one layer to this, but that is giving alot of MSM outlets what tehy need to tapdance around the fact that a muslim officer in the United States Army killed 13 of his fellow soldiers in cold blood. It's not the whole story, but it's a mighty big pachyderm inhabiting the same room that they're trying to deflect attention from.

316 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:54:01pm

re: #303 Fenway_Nation

Sending problem soldiers to someone else's command has been an Army standard for too long.

317 Spare O'Lake  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:54:18pm

Good Evening LGF.

318 solomonpanting  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:54:28pm

re: #297 brookly red

you know except for the ocassional reference here would anyone even remember who Kerry was?

Someone with a teenage mentality whose powers of persuasion led to ruin?

Oh, wait, that was Carrie.

319 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:55:47pm

re: #296 prairiefire

I take that to mean "we', the people who voted for him.

I could be wrong but, he made such statements BEFORE the election.

Oh, whatever. I give up.

GAZE.

320 jaunte  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:56:00pm

re: #314 Dark_Falcon

Jerry Pournelle often makes good points. His "The Mercenary" series is an excellent group of novels.

Haven't read any of those, but I enjoyed his Oath of Fealty (with Larry Niven) and the discussion of how that kind of self-defense cooperative society might work.

321 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:56:22pm

re: #316 soxfan4life

Sending problem soldiers to someone else's command has been an Army standard for too long.

It's not just the army. Many organizations do that. Its normally much easier than firing the person (which would have carried the added risk of charges of "Islamophobia" in Hasan's case). This case was one where it will really come back to bite some of the buck-passers in the ass.

322 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:56:34pm

re: #319 MandyManners

before he even had the noimination

323 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:57:12pm

re: #315 Fenway_Nation

Yep...there's more than one layer to this, but that is giving alot of MSM outlets what tehy need to tapdance around the fact that a muslim officer in the United States Army killed 13 of his fellow soldiers in cold blood. It's not the whole story, but it's a mighty big pachyderm inhabiting the same room that they're trying to deflect attention from.

Right. And he went to the same Imam as the 911 hijackers did. Was influenced by "hate speech" there and no doubt other places. I'm sure this really amps up the "culturally sensitive" that would have no problem calling out those influences had the "suspect" been of another flavor. They would have been calling him a terrorist from the get go.

324 prairiefire  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:57:38pm

re: #311 Varek Raith

Hoping for the best outcome with Iran. Do we need to intimidate with words, sanctions, or bombs?

325 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:58:16pm

re: #303 Fenway_Nation

For the relatively short period of time I could stomach MSNBC, they were trying like hell to chalk the shooting up to PTSD and by extension leave Hasan relatively blameless and make the Army culpable.

I'd say the Army was culpable in tthe sense that many of Hasan's collegaues reported some of the red flags he was setting off and the Army chose not to take action for fear any repercussions of singling out a Muslim officer (no matter how problematic) for deiscipline or dismissal and subsequently kicked the can down the road for somebody else to deal with.

P.C. nonsense has infested our first line of defense.

326 soxfan4life  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:58:22pm

re: #323 Gus 802

Right. And he went to the same Imam as the 911 hijackers did. Was influenced by "hate speech" there and no doubt other places. I'm sure this really amps up the "culturally sensitive" that would have no problem calling out those influences had the "suspect" been of another flavor. They would have been calling him a terrorist from the get go.

Let's not rush to any conclusions now.//

327 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:58:58pm

re: #322 soxfan4life

before he even had the noimination

I gots links...lotsa' links.

328 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:59:18pm

re: #326 soxfan4life

Let's not rush to any conclusions now.//

Stop reading my mind! ;)

Yeah, can't jump to conclusion...unless...

Guess we have to wait for the trial. Maybe we should apply that logic to every case.

329 Varek Raith  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 6:59:20pm

re: #324 prairiefire

Hoping for the best outcome with Iran. Do we need to intimidate with words, sanctions, or bombs?

So far, words have brought nothing. Sanctions, yeah the Russians tell us to fuck off. Bombs, while I hate this outcome, seems to be inevitable.

Hoping for the best without preparing for the worst does not good policy make.

330 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:00:11pm

re: #323 Gus 802

Right. And he went to the same Imam as the 911 hijackers did. Was influenced by "hate speech" there and no doubt other places. I'm sure this really amps up the "culturally sensitive" that would have no problem calling out those influences had the "suspect" been of another flavor. They would have been calling him a terrorist from the get go.

Spot on.

331 jaunte  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:00:30pm

re: #325 MandyManners

the Army chose not to take action for fear any repercussions


(CAIR)

332 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:00:57pm

re: #319 MandyManners

Don't forget 'I may not look like other presidents'...while he was still running for office.

333 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:02:35pm

re: #324 prairiefire

Bombs...that's the only language the mullahs understand.

334 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:02:56pm

re: #331 jaunte

(CAIR)

P.C. is gonna' kill us.

335 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:03:04pm

re: #330 MandyManners

Spot on.

Thanks. This stuff really burns me up sometimes. Part of it is the blatant double standard. Seeing some reports trying to paint Hasan as being part victim is something I find rather infuriating. To counter that, they say don't jump to conclusions. Well, they're also jumping to conclusion with their medicalization of this man.

336 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:03:22pm

re: #332 Fenway_Nation

Don't forget 'I may not look like other presidents'...while he was still running for office.

Mr. Presumption.

337 prairiefire  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:03:34pm

re: #329 Varek Raith

Agreed, but isn't preparing for the worst something that should happen on a more secretive level, without showing our cards? More of slipping out the knife instead of rattling the saber. I don't agree with the conservative attitude that liberals are 100% peaceniks (although my sainted aunt C...)

338 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:04:17pm

re: #335 Gus 802

Thanks. This stuff really burns me up sometimes. Part of it is the blatant double standard. Seeing some reports trying to paint Hasan as being part victim is something I find rather infuriating. To counter that, they say don't jump to conclusions. Well, they're also jumping to conclusion with their medicalization of this man.

Their conclusions are better than your conclusions, dontcha' know?

339 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:05:49pm

re: #338 MandyManners

Their conclusions are better than your conclusions, dontcha' know?

Yeah, there's are sensitive and "proactive." Right, they're also naive and blind to reality.

340 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:06:22pm

re: #339 Gus 802

Theirs...in case Cato is reading. /

341 Spare O'Lake  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:09:26pm

Hasan is a US born and bred Islamofascist terrorist.
We have met an agent of the enemy, and it is within US.
Now what should be done to identify and weed out other traitors like Hasan without alienating the vast majority of loyal Muslim Americans?

342 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:10:59pm

re: #341 Spare O'Lake

Pay closer attention to some of the increasingly obvious warning signs like the ones exhibited in Hasan's case.

/that's all I can think of for now.

343 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:13:35pm

re: #341 Spare O'Lake

Hasan is a US born and bred Islamofascist terrorist.
We have met an agent of the enemy, and it is within US.
Now what should be done to identify and weed out other traitors like Hasan without alienating the vast majority of loyal Muslim Americans?

GET THE FUCKING P.C. OUT OF THE MILITARY AND LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES. PROFILING MIGHT HURT FEELING BUT, IGNORING THE SIGNS KILLS PEOPLE.

(I posted a link this morning about even his imam in Texas was alarmed. Let's not even go into the shit the Army ignored.)

344 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:13:47pm

re: #342 Fenway_Nation

Pay closer attention to some of the increasingly obvious warning signs like the ones exhibited in Hasan's case.

/that's all I can think of for now.

You know. It's interesting because anger management was all the rage within office environments and still is. Say one wrong thing at work and you're immediately sent to either that or sensitivity training and if that doesn't work you're fired. This is for even infractions like cursing. It was accepted that a worker that curses is seen as a potential threat within the work environment.

345 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:15:20pm

re: #343 MandyManners

GET THE FUCKING P.C. OUT OF THE MILITARY AND LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES. PROFILING MIGHT HURT FEELING BUT, IGNORING THE SIGNS KILLS PEOPLE.

(I posted a link this morning about even his imam in Texas was alarmed. Let's not even go into the shit the Army ignored.)

Some topical irony? Had he been gay and said things about being gay he would have been discharged by now.

346 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:16:18pm

re: #344 Gus 802

You know. It's interesting because anger management was all the rage within office environments and still is. Say one wrong thing at work and you're immediately sent to either that or sensitivity training and if that doesn't work you're fired. This is for even infractions like cursing. It was accepted that a worker that curses is seen as a potential threat within the work environment.

Buncha' fucking woosies need atomic wedgies three times a day. Oh, and I say "piss" on their filing cabinets.

*snicker*

347 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:17:16pm

re: #345 Gus 802

Some topical irony? Had he been gay and said things about being gay he would have been discharged by now.

I'm sorry but, I'm too pissed about WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED to even think about going there.

348 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:18:58pm

re: #347 MandyManners

I'm sorry but, I'm too pissed about WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED to even think about going there.

Understood. I was debating with myself about posting that. Just pointing out that in an odd way he was probably protected from anyone bringing up any grievances.

I'll end it there.

349 jaunte  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:19:22pm

re: #341 Spare O'Lake
General question for anyone following the story:
Has any more news been reported about Hasan's mysterious long-haired visitor who supposed came to see him a few days before the shootings?

350 Spare O'Lake  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:20:30pm

re: #343 MandyManners

GET THE FUCKING P.C. OUT OF THE MILITARY AND LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES. PROFILING MIGHT HURT FEELING BUT, IGNORING THE SIGNS KILLS PEOPLE.

(I posted a link this morning about even his imam in Texas was alarmed. Let's not even go into the shit the Army ignored.)

For starters, maybe they could admit that the fuckwad was indeed an Islamofascist terrorist. If there is too much PC to even admit that, then there is nothing to be profiled or watched.

351 really grumpy big dog johnson  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:20:40pm

re: #244 doubter4444

Didn't he used to post here?
And wasn't he banned?

You're registered since April 7 this year? Uh, thanks for the help, I guess...

352 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:22:08pm

re: #346 MandyManners

Buncha' fucking woosies need atomic wedgies three times a day. Oh, and I say "piss" on their filing cabinets.

*snicker*

I was going to say. According to the blueblood intelligentsia cursing like a seaman is a bigger transgression than saying "kill the American infidel!"

353 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:23:55pm

re: #352 Gus 802

Well fucking fuckity fuck fuck...what the goddamned motherfucking hell is up with that, cocksucers?

354 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:24:19pm

re: #343 MandyManners

GET THE FUCKING P.C. OUT OF THE MILITARY AND LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES. PROFILING MIGHT HURT FEELING BUT, IGNORING THE SIGNS KILLS PEOPLE.

(I posted a link this morning about even his imam in Texas was alarmed. Let's not even go into the shit the Army ignored.)

The problem is that politicians cannot, as a rule, ignore PC and they set policy for the police and military. For those agencies to act in an openly and unapologetically unPC way would subject them to a hurricane of bad press, which would tend to cause the politicos to turn on them and force them to make nice. It's not really a curable problem right now. PC simply has too many influential supporters and those supports are the people the president listens to.

355 prairiefire  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:24:32pm

re: #353 Fenway_Nation

Pretty salty!

356 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:24:56pm

re: #353 Fenway_Nation

Well fucking fuckity fuck fuck...what the goddamned motherfucking hell is up with that, cocksucers?

Security! That man is dangerous! We can't allow that kind of speech at Whole Foods.

//

357 jaunte  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:25:06pm

re: #353 Fenway_Nation

Of course, you might run out of k's at the end...

358 Varek Raith  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:25:18pm

re: #353 Fenway_Nation

Well fucking fuckity fuck fuck...what the goddamned motherfucking hell is up with that, cocksucers?

Do please watch your fucking language, thanks!
/

359 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:27:57pm

re: #356 Gus 802

Security! That man is dangerous! We can't allow that kind of speech at Whole Foods.

//


Is this the same Whole Foods who's CEO wrote an Op-Ed firmly opposing 0bamacare?

360 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:30:28pm

re: #359 Fenway_Nation

Is this the same Whole Foods who's CEO wrote an Op-Ed firmly opposing 0bamacare?

Same one. I'm sure they're still shopping there. Can't do without their 12 dollar loaf of New Age Bread ™.

361 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:34:21pm

re: #360 Gus 802


I'm a Trader Joe's kind of guy myself...at least for stores of that type. Ever since I got laid off, I'll sometimes alternate between Campbells soup and some of those frozen dumplings for dinner.

/not that different from when I had a job, actually.

362 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:37:32pm

re: #361 Fenway_Nation

I'm a Trader Joe's kind of guy myself...at least for stores of that type. Ever since I got laid off, I'll sometimes alternate between Campbells soup and some of those frozen dumplings for dinner.

/not that different from when I had a job, actually.

I get a 2 dollar loaf. It's actually pretty good, Safeway wheat berry. I never liked places like Whole Foods. Too much of a scene and way out of my price range.

363 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:38:56pm

re: #362 Gus 802

I don't think there's a whole foods near where I live- altho there's like 2 or 3 near where my sister lives.

I've heard it compared to Trader Joe's, only much larger-scale.

364 prairiefire  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:39:05pm

re: #362 Gus 802

You still have a Safeway?

365 Gus  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:40:09pm

re: #364 prairiefire

You still have a Safeway?

Yep. Still do. I know the floor layout and they're typical at all stores.

366 MandyManners  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:42:14pm

re: #354 Dark_Falcon

The problem is that politicians cannot, as a rule, ignore PC and they set policy for the police and military. For those agencies to act in an openly and unapologetically unPC way would subject them to a hurricane of bad press, which would tend to cause the politicos to turn on them and force them to make nice. It's not really a curable problem right now. PC simply has too many influential supporters and those supports are the people the president listens to.

Well, we're fucking doomed unless we demand change.

367 prairiefire  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:42:28pm

re: #365 Gus 802
All of ours are gone. I still have a reallly old spice tin with their logo on it that was my gran's. Now just part of the rustic decor!

368 prairiefire  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:46:28pm

re: #366 MandyManners

I'm not sure I understand the PC limitations. If someone is antagonistic, profiled as paranoid, it should count as much as a detriment in the military if they are Lutheran or Muslim. Do you think Hasan was treated with "kid gloves".

369 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:49:43pm

re: #368 prairiefire

Do you think he'd be treated with kid gloves if he was a caucasian midwesterner who worshipped at a church affiliated with the Aryan Nations, spoke approvingly of Tim McVeigh or David Duke and openly supported attacks on immigrants, Jews and minorities in front of his colleagues?

370 jaunte  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 7:50:11pm

re: #368 prairiefire
Sources who knew him seem to think so:

Al Jazeera’s Josh Rushing, reporting from Fort Hood, said: “[Hasan] joined the army after high school and went to the Virginia Tech university to get a psychiatry degree through a military programme.

“Every day, he heard how horrible those stories were and he really started to question the wars, according to what his cousin and sources who knew him said.

Hasan became more devout in his religion and started arguing with soldiers about whether the wars were right or not, to the point where he received disciplinary action and negative work reviews.

“It raises a major question – how can a person responsible for the mental health of soldiers returning [from war] be allowed to continue in this profession when he has these kinds of questions himself?”

The Army Criminal Investigation Command and the FBI were investigating the shootings and no charges had been brought against Hasan, John McHugh, the US army secretary, said. [Link: english.aljazeera.net...]

371 prairiefire  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 8:00:45pm

re: #369 Fenway_Nation

Are those attitudes addressed as a problem in the Military? Do you know what would happen to a Caucasian who expressed those views? Seriously, I don't know myself how that person would be treated. Crazy is as crazy does, no matter the color. Hasan had No "PC" excuse to do what he did. Empathy might help the talking heads drag out their words a little longer, but it won't make any difference in Hasan's fate.

372 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 8:06:28pm

re: #371 prairiefire

Yes- that was a problem when I was in the Army. Affiliation with Aryan Nations types and things like white power or known gang tattoos were grounds for a dishonorable discharge in the Army- I'm not sure what the penalty would've been for an officer.

Not up on my UCMJ, but I think if a caucasian was spouting the white power talking points like Hasan was spouting his jihadi talking points, the penalty could've ranged anywhere from an Article 15 to demotion.

373 jaunte  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 8:09:08pm

Austin paper reports Hasan is conscious and talking:
[Link: www.statesman.com...]

374 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 8:15:48pm

re: #371 prairiefire

Are those attitudes addressed as a problem in the Military? Do you know what would happen to a Caucasian who expressed those views? Seriously, I don't know myself how that person would be treated. Crazy is as crazy does, no matter the color. Hasan had No "PC" excuse to do what he did. Empathy might help the talking heads drag out their words a little longer, but it won't make any difference in Hasan's fate.

The thing is Hasan's religion and ethnicity probably made the Army very reluctant to remove him. The commander who attempted to do so would likely face public accusations of bigotry and 'Islamophobia'. Given the career risks attached to such accusations, the Army chose to investigate but not prosecute, mostly likely hoping things would settle down.

375 jaunte  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 8:17:38pm

NPR on Hasan:

ZWERDLING: Earlier today, I spoke to a psychiatrist who worked very closely with Hasan and knows him very well. And he said, you know, from the beginning -and Hasan was there for four years - the medical staff was very worried about this guy. He said the first thing is he's cold, unfriendly. At least that's who he came off. He did not do a good job as a psychiatrist in training, was repeatedly warned, you better shape up, or, you know, you're going to be in trouble. Did badly in his classes, seemed disinterested. But second of all - and this is, perhaps, you know, more relevant. The psychiatrist says that he was very proud and upfront about being Muslim. And psychiatrist hastened to say, and nobody minded that. But he seemed almost belligerent about being Muslim, and he gave a lecture one day that really freaked a lot of doctors out.

They have grand rounds, right? They, you know, dozens of medical staff come into an auditorium, and somebody stands at the podium at the front and gives a lecture about some academic issue, you know, what drugs to prescribe for what condition. But instead of that, he - Hasan apparently gave a long lecture on the Koran and talked about how if you don't believe, you are condemned to hell. Your head is cut off. You're set on fire. Burning oil is burned down your throat.

And I said to the psychiatrist, but this could be a very interesting informational session, right? Where he's educating everybody about the Koran. He said but what disturbed everybody was that Hasan seemed to believe these things. And actually, a Muslim in the audience, a psychiatrist, raised his hand and said, excuse me. But I'm a Muslim and I do not believe these things in the Koran, and then I don't believe what you say the Koran says. And then Hasan didn't say, well, I'm just giving you one point of view. He basically just stared the guy down.

INSKEEP: So we have a picture of a man, then, who, at Walter Reed Army Medical Center, was disliked by his colleagues. Or maybe disliked is not the word. Disturbed some of his colleagues is perhaps a better way to put it.

ZWERDLING: No, and disliked is also a relevant word. [Link: www.npr.org...]

376 tradewind  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 8:19:47pm

re: #374 Dark_Falcon
I'm trying to picture the headlines and spin had Hasan been a member of a fundamentalist, far-out Christian religious sect. There would be absolutely no talk of PTSD, nor would anyone be even searching for reasons... it'd be all about the krazy kreationist end-timer kook who went berserk.

377 Fenway_Nation  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 8:26:46pm

re: #376 tradewind

Exactly how I see it.

378 tradewind  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 8:35:58pm

re: #377 Fenway_Nation
Or even better... imagine the glee inside newsrooms everywhere had he been some kind of a pro-life activist.
Jackpot!!

379 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 8:36:18pm

re: #377 Fenway_Nation

Exactly how I see it.

Me too.

380 doubter4444  Sun, Nov 8, 2009 9:20:39pm

re: #351 really grumpy big dog johnson

You're registered since April 7 this year? Uh, thanks for the help, I guess...

What is that supposed to mean?
That your nic is right?
I answered a question, you have a problem with that?

381 prairiefire  Mon, Nov 9, 2009 5:27:53am

re: #372 Fenway_Nation

Thanks for the information.

382 prairiefire  Mon, Nov 9, 2009 5:29:33am

re: #374 Dark_Falcon

Thanks for the reply. Lieberman is calling for a senate investigation.

383 haakondahl  Tue, Nov 10, 2009 1:20:24am
If you were wondering what Ayaan Hirsi Ali’s been up to lately, the Dutch flower bulb sector just named a tulip after her: Tulip named after activist Ayaan Hirsi Ali.

That must be one lovely tulip.

384 haakondahl  Tue, Nov 10, 2009 1:26:22am

re: #226 Dark_Falcon

He doesn't like history events. Again, they put the focus on past events and old heroes, while he would much prefer to talk about the glorious CHANGE! he intends to bring. As before, he doesn't like it if its not All About Obama.

Besides which, it puts him at odds with his ideological base to show up at spots where they lost.


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