Chuck Norris: If Mary Had Obamacare, She Would Have Aborted God

Health • Views: 10,777

In the single most absurd, irrational argument against health care reform I’ve seen to date, Chuck Norris takes a break from marketing his fitness equipment to pen a ridiculous screed for the right wing news sites, asking the question: What if Mother Mary Had Obamacare?

In Norris’s addled world, it’s a distinct possibility that Mary might have had an abortion. Yes, really, that’s what he wrote. I know, I couldn’t believe it either.

As we near the eve of another Christmas, I wonder: What would have happened if Mother Mary had been covered by Obamacare? What if that young, poor and uninsured teenage woman had been provided the federal funds (via Obamacare) and facilities (via Planned Parenthood, etc.) to avoid the ridicule, ostracizing, persecution and possible stoning because of her out-of-wedlock pregnancy? Imagine all the great souls who could have been erased from history and the influence of mankind if their parents had been as progressive as Washington’s wise men and women! Will Obamacare morph into Herodcare for the unborn?

Excuse me while I find some aspirin. I’m getting a headache.

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553 comments
1 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:52:04pm

Isn't this more an argument against persecuting people for sex out of wedlock, than it is an argument against abortion?

I mean, aside from it being totally fucking crazy, anyway.

2 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:52:09pm

...WTF? I'm no theologian but, isn't what Norris said... oh, I don't know, blasphemous?

3 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:52:32pm
I wonder: What would have happened if Mother Mary had been covered by Obamacare?

She would have had pre-natal care?

4 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:52:46pm

I discussed the blasphemy involved in this idea.

Now, the practical. How would 'Obamacare' have provided abortion to Mary? Please explain, Mr. Norris.

5 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:53:05pm

re: #2 Varek Raith

...WTF? I'm no theologian but, isn't what Norris said... oh, I don't know, blasphemous?

Yes.

6 SpaceJesus  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:53:17pm

what

7 SpaceJesus  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:53:50pm

i wonder if chuck has ever had an account here

8 Aceofwhat?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:54:01pm

Chuck, you dullard. Mary was pro-life.

(excuse me while i perform my cleverness dance beside my laptop here...)

9 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:54:17pm

Chuck is a fool. I can't wait for Roosevelt's ghost to rise and start kicking everyone's ass, especially Chuck's.

10 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:55:37pm
......facilities (via Planned Parenthood, etc.) to avoid the ridicule, ostracizing, persecution and possible stoning because of her out-of-wedlock pregnancy?

Uhhhhh....this is a bad thing?

11 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:55:39pm

blowin smoke out his ass...hopping on the wagon like a freakin drooler...we've seen the Drooler Effect before, so here it is via the GOP...the doofi are loose

12 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:55:42pm

re: #2 Varek Raith

...WTF? I'm no theologian but, isn't what Norris said... oh, I don't know, blasphemous?

Basically. He's questioning the character of Mary.

13 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:57:11pm

I think Chuck has taken a few too many round houses to the head.

14 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:57:24pm

re: #12 Sharmuta

He's also kind of implying that people who attack others for sex out of wedlock are shitty people. Which the whacky fundie Right does on a regular basis.

So, yeah.

15 SixDegrees  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:57:29pm

re: #12 Sharmuta

Basically. He's questioning the character of Mary.

And of God. The whole thing was His idea, after all. And the notion that His will could be thwarted in such a way is...well, not exactly a testament of faith, is it?

16 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:57:32pm

re: #10 Killgore Trout

Uhhh...this is a bad thing?

Of course. Ridicule, ostracization, persecution and stoning produced strong moral character in the young women of the first century BC, and they could do the same for American if it weren't for the liberal agenda and Planned Parenthood.

17 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:57:33pm

Shut up and sing, Chuck!

18 Achilles Tang  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:58:16pm

I used to really enjoy watching Chuck Norris shows. Now it's kind of like watching someone you know has cooties under the makeup.

Mel Gibson, Norris....All my youthful heroes are biting the dust.

19 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:58:30pm

re: #10 Killgore Trout

Uhhh...this is a bad thing?

Yeah, wouldn't want any harlots to escape being stoned to death, would we?

20 avanti  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:58:34pm

If God was able to provide a immaculate conception, he could surely smite Planned Parenthood's attempts to interfere and if not, we'd all be Jews, still waiting for the Messiah.

21 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:58:38pm

re: #12 Sharmuta

Basically. He's questioning the character of Mary.

He's also suggesting that the Holy Spirit impregnated her without her consent. We have a word for that in English...and that ain't a nice thing to say about the Holy Spirit.

22 irish rose  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:58:44pm

"Herodcare"?

Good grief, I think I'm gonna puke.

23 Achilles Tang  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 4:58:51pm

re: #13 rwdflynavy

I think Chuck has taken a few too many round houses to the head.

Copyright violation!

24 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:00:10pm

re: #12 Sharmuta

Basically. He's questioning the character of Mary.

it doesn't really make sense...how does something so inarticulate even get published?....he sounds drunk to me

25 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:00:31pm

Seriously, though, what in the bill is he talking about?

26 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:00:49pm

re: #2 Varek Raith

...WTF? I'm no theologian but, isn't what Norris said... oh, I don't know, blasphemous?

Crazy beats blasphemous. :D The wild-eyed dude on the crack block with the Gandalf beard running after imaginary leprechauns might say something blasphemous while giving chase, but one would probably be more concerned with his other behaviors first. 8-)

27 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:00:59pm

re: #15 SixDegrees

And of God. The whole thing was His idea, after all. And the notion that His will could be thwarted in such a way is...well, not exactly a testament of faith, is it?

I was just thinking that too. Like God would pick a woman who wouldn't agree to the plan...

This is red meat to the anti-abortion crowd, none of whom will think to consider the theological offenses this piece has. They'll just lap it up and cry about how Obamacare would kill the Baby Jesus. (Never mind about the Baby Jesus and lies...)

28 srjh  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:01:12pm

And Chuck delivers a roundhouse kick to the entire Christian faith...

It is strange who the right seem to be pushing as their mouthpieces these days, it's making them more and more difficult to parody.

29 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:02:04pm

re: #25 SanFranciscoZionist

Seriously, though, what in the bill is he talking about?

BO makes more sense on a bad day than this tripe...Chuck has fallen down

30 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:02:22pm

For an extra dose of stupid you can check out the comments....

Draconian population reduction measures are very important to the globalist elites (Bilderbergs, Trilateralists, and CFR).


.....

If We didn't have 40 million abortions since Row-V-Wade, where would we keep the 28 million illegal aliens, who take jobs no-one else will do?


....

Eugenics as practiced by National Socialists was only the most recent manifestation of social engineering.

My Favorite....

I understand your point about Mary, but as a Catholic, even if she had the coverage, it wouldn't have been compulsory, and I believe she would have chosen not to abort.

Lol.

31 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:02:27pm
32 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:04:29pm

re: #7 SpaceJesus

i wonder if chuck has ever had an account here

Iron Fist?

33 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:04:38pm

Perhaps Colbert could Sunday-school Chuck a bit.

34 SixDegrees  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:05:36pm

re: #25 SanFranciscoZionist

Seriously, though, what in the bill is he talking about?

Nothing. His statement is almost explicitly claiming there's some sort of mandatory abortion clause in there somewhere, akin, I suppose, to a death panel.

As things stand right at this moment, there won't even be any provision for voluntary abortion coverage, since even the Dems face an uphill battle on that front.

35 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:06:17pm

Man, where's Bruce Lee when you need him?

36 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:06:17pm

re: #30 Killgore Trout

(Bilderbergs, Trilateralists, and CFR).

Trifecta of Stooopid!

37 yoshicastmaster  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:06:50pm

imagine the great souls that never get a chance because we don't procreate 24/7!! quick everyone! get busy- for their sake!!

38 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:07:13pm

re: #30 Killgore Trout

For an extra dose of stupid you can check out the comments...

Draconian population reduction measures are very important to the globalist elites (Bilderbergs, Trilateralists, and CFR).

Lol.

That crap comes straight from the John Birch Society.

39 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:07:21pm

re: #35 Slumbering Behemoth

Man, where's Bruce Lee when you need him?

hate to be the one to tell you, but...

40 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:07:46pm

Didn't baby Jesus survive some kind of attempt to kill every baby?

41 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:08:27pm

re: #40 Basho

Didn't baby Jesus survive some kind of attempt to kill every baby?

Yes, baby Jesus strangled two snakes that were sent to kill him by Hera.

/

42 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:08:40pm

re: #40 Basho

Didn't baby Jesus survive some kind of attempt to kill every baby?

I think that was Moses...

43 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:08:58pm

re: #41 Obdicut

Yes, baby Jesus strangled two snakes that were sent to kill him by Hera.

/

You just made a Herculean leap.

44 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:09:15pm

re: #40 Basho

Didn't baby Jesus survive some kind of attempt to kill every baby?

Yes.

45 djughurknot  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:09:27pm

First it was endorsing Huck. Then advocating Texas' secession. Now he's painting Mary as a casual aborto-prophylaxis drone caught in a bizarre, controlling-womens' bodies state apparatus?

Trifecta achieved.

/Or is it trinity? I can never remember.

46 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:09:31pm

re: #42 brookly red

I think that was Moses...

You are both right!!!

47 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:09:45pm

If Hitler's mom had Obamacare Hitler would have never been born!

48 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:10:05pm

re: #39 brookly red

hate to be the one to tell you, but...

I know, I know. He's locked in eternal battle with Teddy Roosevelt for supremacy of the Spirit World. That's where thunder and lighting come from, donchya know?

49 Haole  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:10:14pm

Chuck Norris doesn't read books.... He just stares at them until they give him the information he wants.

50 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:10:22pm

Speaking of the John Birch Society, not a single one of the right wing blogs even blinked at the news that they're going to be a CPAC sponsor.

51 Girth  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:10:23pm

re: #40 Basho

Didn't baby Jesus survive some kind of attempt to kill every baby?

That would be the reference to Herodcare, I believe.

52 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:10:38pm

re: #38 Charles

Still not a single right wing complaint about JBS at CPAC.

53 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:10:40pm

re: #46 rwdflynavy

You are both right!!!

/can we each get half the baby?

54 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:10:51pm

re: #51 Girth

That would be the reference to Herodcare, I believe.

There we go!

55 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:10:53pm

re: #49 Haole

Chuck Norris doesn't read books... He just stares at them until they give him the information he wants.

That would explain a lot, then.

56 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:11:22pm

re: #53 brookly red

/can we each get half the baby?

Yes, He nodded Solomonly.

57 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:11:44pm

re: #47 Basho

That's like a Reverse Godwin Maneuver there. Nice.

58 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:11:48pm

re: #38 Charles

Gah, The instant I hear someone mention the Bilderbergs or the Trilateral Commission with a straight face, I mentally photoshop those swirly hypno-eyes onto their face. CRAZY.

That stuff needs to stay in Robert Anton Wilson's Illuminatus Trilogy where it belongs.

59 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:12:25pm

re: #48 Slumbering Behemoth

I know, I know. He's locked in eternal battle with Teddy Roosevelt for supremacy of the Spirit World. That's where thunder and lighting come from, donchya know?

I'm imagining the Spirit World as looking a lot like Mortal Kombat II.

60 Ojoe  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:13:01pm

Mr. Norris has been really offensive.
Merry Christmas from Raffaello

61 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:13:31pm

re: #50 Charles

re: #52 Killgore Trout

They don't care about the party, or any principles. If the kids don't want to hear that tune, they won't play it.

62 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:13:38pm

re: #40 Basho

Didn't baby Jesus survive some kind of attempt to kill every baby?

Now HEROD had Death Panels.

63 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:13:46pm

re: #59 WindUpBird

I'm imagining the Spirit World as looking a lot like Mortal Kombat II.



but they get the joysticks...

64 Haole  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:13:47pm

When Chuck Norris falls in water he doesn't get wet....Water gets Chuck Norrised.

65 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:13:52pm

re: #59 WindUpBird

I'm imagining the Spirit World as looking a lot like Mortal Kombat II.

Shao Kahn vs. Chuck Norris... :)

66 Achilles Tang  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:14:19pm

re: #35 Slumbering Behemoth

Man, where's Bruce Lee when you need him?

That was fun. Amazing how they can't bleed and I loved the part about grabbing Norris's chest hair. I don't suppose there is a Japanese word for that move...just saying.

67 Jaerik  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:14:27pm

Incidentally, the GOP's still hasn't followed through on removing elective abortion coverage in their own party members' health care plan.

68 Girth  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:14:43pm

re: #58 WindUpBird

Gah, The instant I hear someone mention the Bilderbergs or the Trilateral Commission with a straight face, I mentally photoshop those swirly hypno-eyes onto their face. CRAZY.

That stuff needs to stay in Robert Anton Wilson's Illuminatus Trilogy where it belongs.

A friend and I were having a conversation with a random guy sitting at a bar this summer. Then random guy mentioned the Bilderburgs.

I immediately ordered another beer because I knew it was about to get really good.

69 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:14:45pm

re: #62 SanFranciscoZionist

Now HEROD had Death Panels.

Parrrranoid!

Suuuperstar!

Are they after you like you say they are.... o/~

70 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:14:47pm

At Hot Air, they're venting their rage at a commenter who mentioned that the John Birch Society is sponsoring CPAC.

And blaming it on little ol' me.

he in fact arrived in that thread on cue from charles johnson at lgf (link), voicing an unfounded rage over the trivia that the john birch society has rented booth space at the upcoming cpac convention. andy in agora hills is convinced that the jbs is “racist” and “antisemitic” based on no evidence whatsoever.

71 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:15:02pm

re: #59 WindUpBird

Dude, it's like, eleventy time better than that.

72 Achilles Tang  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:15:28pm

re: #40 Basho

Didn't baby Jesus survive some kind of attempt to kill every baby?

Moses. First you get your dwarf and giant stars mixed up, and now the testaments. Get a grip.

73 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:16:01pm

re: #72 Naso Tang

Moses. First you get your dwarf and giant stars mixed up, and now the testaments. Get a grip.

Everything in the Bible happens repeatedly.

74 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:16:01pm

Speaking of Hot Air, I'm now taking submissions for the next 'Hot Air Comments of the Day'.

A quick look over there revealed the usual hate speech running rampant...

75 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:16:14pm

This fits the meme 'Holy Mother Mary and Joseph'! meme:

[Link: news.bbc.co.uk...]

76 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:16:39pm

re: #72 Naso Tang

Moses. First you get your dwarf and giant stars mixed up, and now the testaments. Get a grip.

Jesus too. Herod killed all the babies in his home town. That's why they fled to Egypt.

77 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:16:44pm

re: #62 SanFranciscoZionist

Now HEROD had Death Panels.

/see it's the same old shit over & over...

78 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:16:50pm

re: #74 Charles

No trudging in the muck for me tonight. I'm all crazied out.

79 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:17:10pm

re: #72 Naso Tang

Moses. First you get your dwarf and giant stars mixed up, and now the testaments. Get a grip.

Herod did put out an order to kill all infants under 2 years of age. FYI.

80 psyop  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:17:21pm

....

Where is the link to the Onion for this article??

I mean, there is no way someone actually said that... right??

81 Lidane  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:17:26pm

re: #2 Varek Raith

...WTF? I'm no theologian but, isn't what Norris said... oh, I don't know, blasphemous?

Extremely blasphemous, considering its implications. I'm almost impressed by it, but he probably doesn't even realize how offensive that screed of his actually is.

82 _RememberTonyC  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:17:31pm

in case you are wondering if threr are any sane voices remaining on the right, i give you victor davis hanson ...

[Link: victorhanson.com...]

83 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:18:28pm

re: #81 Lidane

Extremely blasphemous, considering its implications. I'm almost impressed by it, but he probably doesn't even realize how offensive that screed of his actually is.

Well, come on...giving birth in a dirty stable / manger with animals I guess is his idea of great healthcare. I guess...

84 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:18:38pm

re: #73 SanFranciscoZionist

Everything in the Bible happens repeatedly.

revelations is a one shot deal...

85 Achilles Tang  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:18:52pm

re: #76 rwdflynavy

Jesus too. Herod killed all the babies in his home town. That's why they fled to Egypt.

Just trying to cheer Basho up.

86 nines09  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:18:54pm

How could you abort God? After all.........
This makes more sense than just about anything I've heard in the past, oh, I don't know......eh.....What English might sound like to someone who doesn't speak it
1972 for this gem. I just stumbled across it.

87 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:19:10pm

re: #68 Girth

A friend and I were having a conversation with a random guy sitting at a bar this summer. Then random guy mentioned the Bilderburgs.

I immediately ordered another beer because I knew it was about to get really good.

I would have ordered one for him! Talking to conspiracy theorists in watering holes is genius, I've ran into a couple at my karaoke bar. Portland is FILLED with conspiracy theorists. Generally the paranoid liberal variety, but they all have a lot in common, they got their Bilderbergs and their homeopathy and their Chemtrails and their Zipcode-is-the-mark-of-the-beast... you get them talking and they just spill all the walnuts, it's awesome.

88 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:19:47pm

re: #83 Oh no...Sand People!

Well, come on...giving birth in a dirty stable / manger with animals I guess is his idea of great healthcare. I guess...

She had access to healthcare, that's the point. If only Joseph could have afforded it on a carpenter's salary.

//

89 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:20:21pm

re: #71 Slumbering Behemoth

Dude, it's like, eleventy time better than that.

BETTER THAN MK2?!?!

(Okay, maybe Time Killers. I'm pretty sure I'm the only Lizard who has put fifty bucks into a Time Killers machine)

90 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:20:40pm

re: #86 nines09

How could you abort God? After all...
This makes more sense than just about anything I've heard in the past, oh, I don't know...eh...What English might sound like to someone who doesn't speak it
1972 for this gem. I just stumbled across it.

Dang...kind of catchy...though I catch none of it.

91 Lidane  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:20:51pm

re: #67 Jaerik

Incidentally, the GOP's still hasn't followed through on removing elective abortion coverage in their own party members' health care plan.

Pfft. If it was really an issue for the national party, they'd have made sure that abortion was never covered at all. The fact that the coverage has been there for the better part of 20 years suggests they privately don't give a damn about the issue, but they're more than willing to make hay about it for political points.

Par for the course, really.

92 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:21:08pm

re: #72 Naso Tang

Moses. First you get your dwarf and giant stars mixed up, and now the testaments. Get a grip.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

93 recusancy  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:21:30pm

re: #38 Charles

That crap comes straight from the John Birch Society.

I had never even heard of the Bilderburg group etc until I saw the New World Order documentary on these nut jobs this summer.

94 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:21:30pm

re: #88 SanFranciscoZionist

She had access to healthcare, that's the point. If only Joseph could have afforded it on a carpenter's salary.

//

union

95 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:21:45pm

We're heading for 150,000 pageviews for the day. It's sad that LGF has become so irrelevant.

96 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:22:00pm

re: #85 Naso Tang

Just trying to cheer Basho up.

Haha thanks :)

97 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:22:20pm

re: #94 brookly red

union

Medical tourism.

98 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:22:33pm

re: #95 Charles

We're heading for 150,000 pageviews for the day. It's sad that LGF has become so irrelevant.

I don't know why you even bother Charles!!
//

99 andres  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:22:48pm

Just when I thought the far Right reached rock bottom, they proved they can reach new lows.

re: #30 Killgore Trout

I've given up reading comments almost everywhere. Most sites without any kind of moderator have leagues of stupidity.

re: #41 Obdicut

Actually, yes. According to Catholic Theology, just after Jesus was born, Herodes ordered all infants younger than 2 years to be killed.a

100 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:22:57pm

re: #94 brookly red

union

Small business owner!

101 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:22:59pm

re: #70 Charles

They sure seem to be working hard at making my party irrelevant for the foreseeable future. These people are like Mobys with a hyper-drive.

102 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:23:17pm

re: #97 Decatur Deb

Medical tourism.

Ah--so THAT'S why they went to Egypt!

103 Lidane  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:23:17pm

re: #84 brookly red

revelations is a one shot deal...

But it's not the only apocalyptic book in the Bible. There's also Daniel.

104 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:23:25pm

re: #95 Charles

We're heading for 150,000 pageviews for the day. It's sad that LGF has become so irrelevant.

What's it like living in the vast, empty minds of so many crazies?
:)

105 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:23:30pm

re: #97 Decatur Deb

Medical tourism.

another threatned market

106 Girth  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:24:36pm

Also implicit in this is that somehow Obama and Planned Parenthood would somehow be able to subvert the will of God.

107 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:25:11pm

re: #79 Oh no...Sand People!

Herod did put out an order to kill all infants under 2 years of age. FYI.

Draconian population reduction measures are very important to the globalist elites (Bilderbergs, Trilateralists, and CFR).

108 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:25:13pm

re: #102 SanFranciscoZionist

Ah--so THAT'S why they went to Egypt!

For their health.

109 recusancy  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:25:39pm

re: #82 _RememberTonyC

in case you are wondering if threr are any sane voices remaining on the right, i give you victor davis hanson ...

[Link: victorhanson.com...]

I like Daniel Larison.

110 Surabaya Stew  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:27:30pm

re: #106 Girth

Also implicit in this is that somehow Obama and Planned Parenthood would somehow be able to subvert the will of God.

Of course they can; isn't Obama the anti-christ? And Planned Parenthood his dark minions?
///

111 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:27:45pm

re: #107 Basho

Draconian population reduction measures are very important to the globalist elites (Bilderbergs, Trilateralists, and CFR).

I never quite caught the gist of that, why would the (in their minds) 'thinkers' want to ruin the good household labor pool.

But hey! Global warming has been cured at least, [Link: www.steorn.com...]
/

112 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:28:03pm

Obama expands power with a radical socialist agenda to promote winter gardening.....
How to Make a Home Garden Greenhouse, Like Michelle Obama

You can build a hoop house, and enjoy winter vegetables all year round, even in some of the coldest parts of the country. And you can do it yourself, cheaply and with minimal effort.

Michelle Obama knows this. In the South Lawn garden the First Lady created, White House chef Sam Kass and Department of Agriculture staff, including organic and local food champion Kathleen Merrigan, built a hoop house, making this video in the process:

Try this at your local collective. You'll be the most popular comrade and Dear Leader will be so radically pleased enough to double your communities gruel rations!

113 jaunte  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:28:49pm

There is no chin behind Chuck Norris’ beard. There is only another proof of Poe's Law.

114 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:29:45pm

Abortion didn't seem to be an option:

115 Girth  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:30:11pm

re: #112 Killgore Trout

Obama expands power with a radical socialist agenda to promote winter gardening...
How to Make a Home Garden Greenhouse, Like Michelle Obama

[Video]Try this at your local collective. You'll be the most popular comrade and Dear Leader will be so radically pleased enough to double your communities gruel rations!

You just keep your damned vegetables you filthy COMMIE!!!1!11!eleventy-one!1!

116 recusancy  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:30:23pm

re: #112 Killgore Trout

Obama expands power with a radical socialist agenda to promote winter gardening...
How to Make a Home Garden Greenhouse, Like Michelle Obama

[Video]Try this at your local collective. You'll be the most popular comrade and Dear Leader will be so radically pleased enough to double your communities gruel rations!

The green house effect is a myth. This won't work. ///

117 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:31:00pm

re: #111 Oh no...Sand People!

I never quite caught the gist of that, why would the (in their minds) 'thinkers' want to ruin the good household labor pool.

But hey! Global warming has been cured at least, [Link: www.steorn.com...]
/

Steorn is a scam site.

[Link: ergosphere.blogspot.com...]

118 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:31:04pm

Over at HotAir

Your text to link...

119 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:31:31pm

re: #97 Decatur Deb

Medical tourism.

No joke, my Dentist has hired a French speaking assistant just for those escaping their health care system... Mondays & Tuesdays are "tourist" only days... and they don't take Visa.

120 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:33:36pm

re: #117 Charles

Steorn is a scam site.

[Link: ergosphere.blogspot.com...]

But I am just a sucker for that type of stuff... It's my not so in the closet hobbie horse... all my dreams of magnet motors and spinning things, and perpetual energies that always have to have a battery...

121 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:35:09pm

re: #115 Girth

No healthcare for you if your winter garden isn't compliant with the mandated standards!

122 BryanS  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:35:26pm

Chuck Norris was a Huckleberry booster.

All you need to know.

123 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:35:33pm

BTW, they're still going at it in Copenhagen. It's 1:30 in the morning, and the working groups are pulling an all nighter, and it appears as if the countries are still doing their speeches too! Rwanda just stopped, and now it's Mozambique's turn.

124 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:36:54pm

I bet the atheists wouldn't have ridiculed someone for having a child born out of wedlock.

125 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:37:13pm

re: #121 Killgore Trout

No healthcare for you if your winter garden isn't compliant with the mandated standards!

hmmmm, sounds familiar....lemmie think about that.

126 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:37:21pm

Ugh.

Now I have Rand Simberg, who I thought was smarter than this, emailing me a link to James Randi's embarrassing "skeptical" article on global warming.

[Link: www.randi.org...]

I was hoping I wouldn't have to post about this, but now it looks like I will. Randi cites the incredibly deceptive "Petition Project" in his article, another one of those bogus lists packed with frauds and ringers and people who never even signed up for it.

I really hate to see James Randi of all people falling for this idiocy.

127 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:38:06pm

re: #126 Charles

He released an update on his website today.

128 Fenris  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:38:36pm

I was going to resort to smarmy "facts" that clogged my inbox three years ago, but then I remembered: the ingrate sued Penguin Books for publishing an otherwise fair-use collection of facts. Because that's how you treat the only thing that's made you relevant in twenty years.

129 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:38:38pm

re: #126 Charles

Randi cites the incredibly deceptive "Petition Project" in his article,...

Is that the "Oregon" one?

130 avanti  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:38:43pm

O.T. Now, the Snugwow.


131 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:39:06pm

re: #119 brookly red

No joke, my Dentist has hired a French speaking assistant just for those escaping their health care system... Mondays & Tuesdays are "tourist" only days... and they don't take Visa.

The door swings both ways. From Thai Medical Tourism stats:

There are currently 28 countries catering to medical tourists, providing care to more than two million foreign patients annually. Many governments in developing countries see medical tourism as an excellent way to boost the local economy while improving their own health-care systems. The costs of a surgery in another country can be as much as 50 per cent less than at home. The savings can be so significant that they are literally ‘life saving’.

The global medical tourism industry is estimated to generate around US$20 billion of dollars per year, and by 2010 it is expected to more than double this amount of revenue. Americans, Canadians and Europeans compose the bulk of all medical tourists, likely due to the costs of surgery in these countries. Hundreds of thousands of Americans travel abroad each year for medical procedures. In Asia, most medical tourists come from Japan and the Middle East.

132 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:39:56pm

re: #127 Basho

[Link: scienceblogs.com...]

133 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:40:01pm

re: #125 brookly red

...lemmie think about that.


The Bilderberg's frown on that sort of thing. The thinking has already been done for you.

134 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:40:01pm

re: #115 Girth

You just keep your damned vegetables you filthy COMMIE!!!1!11!eleventy-one!1!

hey ....those veggies, my lawn and trees sucking in CO 2 are the only things keeping Kansas City from becoming beachfront property!
/

135 wrenchwench  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:40:18pm

re: #109 recusancy

I like Daniel Larison.

He's got a whole raft of racists in his left sidebar.

136 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:40:20pm

re: #126 Charles

He's old. It's very sad.

I hope someone he trusts helps him understand.

137 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:40:28pm

re: #130 avanti

O.T. Now, the Snugwow.

[Video]

That's the greatest thing I have ever seen.

*places order*.
/

138 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:40:57pm

re: #129 freetoken

Is that the "Oregon" one?

Yep. It used to be the 'Oregon Petition'. Different name, same stench.

139 BryanS  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:41:14pm

re: #117 Charles

Steorn is a scam site.

[Link: ergosphere.blogspot.com...]

Yup. "free energy" my rear end. Somehow there are always snake oil salesmen that keep trying to get around the laws of thermodynamics.

140 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:41:25pm

re: #131 Decatur Deb

The door swings both ways. From Thai Medical Tourism stats:

There are currently 28 countries catering to medical tourists, providing care to more than two million foreign patients annually. Many governments in developing countries see medical tourism as an excellent way to boost the local economy while improving their own health-care systems. The costs of a surgery in another country can be as much as 50 per cent less than at home. The savings can be so significant that they are literally ‘life saving’.

The global medical tourism industry is estimated to generate around US$20 billion of dollars per year, and by 2010 it is expected to more than double this amount of revenue. Americans, Canadians and Europeans compose the bulk of all medical tourists, likely due to the costs of surgery in these countries. Hundreds of thousands of Americans travel abroad each year for medical procedures. In Asia, most medical tourists come from Japan and the Middle East.

I like free markets...

141 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:41:39pm

re: #131 Decatur Deb

Link:

[Link: www.discovermedicaltourism.com...]

142 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:42:12pm

I had to laugh at one comment at Human Events on this.
"Reading this leads one to conclude that Bruce Lee kicked ol'Chuck upside the head one time to many."

If he were here we may have seen him do that quite a few times.

I would honestly love to see Chuck Norris at a public event and demand an apology for such an offensive remark.

143 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:43:20pm

re: #139 BryanS

Yup. "free energy" my rear end. Somehow there are always snake oil salesmen that keep trying to get around the laws of thermodynamics.

Wait! That post is from 2006! They are running a public live demo right now in Dublin, and are streaming it live.

/(but they actually are...)

144 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:43:32pm

re: #140 brookly red

I like free markets...

Fair enough, but if we assume that anyone coming to the U.S. for care is fleeing a failed medical system, presumably that applies to us as well...

145 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:43:40pm

re: #133 Killgore Trout

The Bilderberg's frown on that sort of thing. The thinking has already been done for you.

that sounds familiar too...

146 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:43:51pm

I heard Iraq is having success with medical tourism after we built them some state of the art hospitals. Meanwhile there are hospitals closing all over the US...

147 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:44:29pm

re: #138 Charles

Ugh indeed.

BTW, looking at the schedule for Friday, it looks like the GOP congressmen have their press conference at 15:00 CET (I believe that is 6am here in California).

Anyone want to make a bet on whether they will make fools of themselves?

148 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:44:33pm

re: #146 Basho

I heard Iraq is having success with medical tourism after we built them some state of the art hospitals. Meanwhile there are hospitals closing all over the US...

Banks I am aware of...but I haven't heard of any hospitals closing.

149 BryanS  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:45:44pm

re: #146 Basho

I heard Iraq is having success with medical tourism after we built them some state of the art hospitals. Meanwhile there are hospitals closing all over the US...

Well, at least we might have some free market health care to go to then.

150 Lidane  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:45:58pm

re: #119 brookly red

No joke, my Dentist has hired a French speaking assistant just for those escaping their health care system... Mondays & Tuesdays are "tourist" only days... and they don't take Visa.

You should travel along the Texas-Mexico border sometime. Most of my family is down there and it's not uncommon for Americans to drive across to Mexico for even the most basic things, like dental work or visits to a general practitioner for check-ups.

Hell, the pharmacies on the American side of the border are threatened by the sheer number of folks who would rather get their full-strength prescriptions in Mexico at less than a third of the price rather than settle for generics here.

151 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:46:20pm

BTW, the GOP is scheduled to follow immediately the official US delegation press conference. I wonder if the GOP will use the opportunity to try and deep six what the official delegation is trying to accomplish.

152 wrenchwench  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:46:22pm

re: #126 Charles

Ugh.

Now I have Rand Simberg, who I thought was smarter than this, emailing me a link to James Randi's embarrassing "skeptical" article on global warming.

[Link: www.randi.org...]

I was hoping I wouldn't have to post about this, but now it looks like I will. Randi cites the incredibly deceptive "Petition Project" in his article, another one of those bogus lists packed with frauds and ringers and people who never even signed up for it.

I really hate to see James Randi of all people falling for this idiocy.

Here's a good response to Randi.

153 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:47:33pm

re: #144 SanFranciscoZionist

Fair enough, but if we assume that anyone coming to the U.S. for care is fleeing a failed medical system, presumably that applies to us as well...

it's a matter of how failed... I find it interesting that so many people from countries with "free" health care go outside the system, virtually everyone who has the means.

154 Girth  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:47:34pm

re: #151 freetoken

BTW, the GOP is scheduled to follow immediately the official US delegation press conference. I wonder if the GOP will use the opportunity to try and deep six what the official delegation is trying to accomplish.

You wonder? Really?

155 Fenris  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:48:13pm

Off-subject, I'm fiddling around with different sites on my iPhone now. I wonder: I've made websites which use different CSS stylesheets for different media before, like printers, a la Dreamweaver. Is it the same principle for smartphones? If so, then I know what to do to my website next.

156 Racer X  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:48:46pm

Mark Levin just ripped Glenn Beck to shreds.

157 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:49:25pm

Randi believed in AGW after watching An Inconvenient Truth.re: #156 Racer X

Mark Levin just ripped Glenn Beck to shreds.

Meeeoowwwww

158 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:49:39pm

re: #156 Racer X

How high in pitch did their voices get?

159 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:50:25pm

re: #157 Basho

Randi believed in AGW after watching An Inconvenient Truth.

Meeeoowww

Oops. Randi believed blah blah blah but then we got numerous complaints so he kept an open mind.

160 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:50:58pm

re: #150 Lidane

You should travel along the Texas-Mexico border sometime. Most of my family is down there and it's not uncommon for Americans to drive across to Mexico for even the most basic things, like dental work or visits to a general practitioner for check-ups.

Hell, the pharmacies on the American side of the border are threatened by the sheer number of folks who would rather get their full-strength prescriptions in Mexico at less than a third of the price rather than settle for generics here.

pssst, generics are full strength... price well it is what it is. I like free markets.

161 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:51:07pm

How shellfish saved the human race

Turns out, somewhere between 130,000 to 190,000 years ago, the human species was reduced to less than 1000 breeding individuals--just a few thousand people in total. Ancient, naturally driven climate change pushed our species to the brink, said Curtis Marean, Ph.D., a professor with the Institute of Human Origins and the School of Human Evolution and Social Change at Arizona State University.

What saved us? According to Marean, the answer may be "shellfish".

"They're a great source of protein," he said. "And shellfish are immune to colder ocean temperatures. In fact, when the water gets colder, those populations go up."

Marean used climate models to pinpoint locations in Africa where human hunter-gatherers could have hunkered down during a long glacial period that dried out the continent and expanded deserts. Of the four-to-six possible locations, he focused in on an area along the coast of South Africa.

162 Racer X  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:51:16pm

re: #158 Slumbering Behemoth

How high in pitch did their voices get?

He just went on a rant about the "idiots" on Fox news. Didn't name Beck, but he mentioned tears and Tea Parties.

163 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:52:00pm

Well, gotta get packing. Later all.

164 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:52:17pm

re: #154 Girth

You wonder? Really?

Afford me a little bit of rhetorical space...

165 CyanSnowHawk  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:52:19pm

re: #111 Oh no...Sand People!

But hey! Global warming has been cured at least,
(Link to scam site excised) /

I don't know why they won't listen to my solution, it's so easy.

Schedule GW conferences in any part of the globe that requires a little cooling. Every single conference seems to be plagued by blizzards and ice storms so why not put it to good use?
/

166 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:52:21pm

re: #156 Racer X

Mark Levin just ripped Glenn Beck to shreds.

Levin is no light weight. I recommend his books.

167 jaunte  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:53:30pm

re: #152 wrenchwench

Here's a good response to Randi.

Thanks for posting that, there's a lot of good thinking there.
These two paragraphs stood out:

Which brings me to the bugaboo of "consensus science." Actually, as much as it pains me to say this too, Randi is dead wrong here. Consensus is very important to many areas of science. Think about it. When you come right down to it , what is a scientific theory but a scientific consensus agreeing that a proposed set of principles describing a phenomenon is the best current explanation of that phenomenon that science has to offer?
...
Yes, scientific consensuses can sometimes be wrong. It's even possible, albeit unlikely, that the scientific consensus regarding AGW is in significant error and either no warming is occurring or the warming that is occurring is not caused by human activity. However, if you're going to show a scientific consensus to be wrong, using logical fallacies and a rudimentary understanding of the science to argue against the scientific consensus is not going to convince anyone who knows a lot about the topic, although it might convince the ignorant.
168 Jaerik  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:54:10pm

re: #155 fenrisdesigns

Off-subject, I'm fiddling around with different sites on my iPhone now. I wonder: I've made websites which use different CSS stylesheets for different media before, like printers, a la Dreamweaver. Is it the same principle for smartphones? If so, then I know what to do to my website next.

From what I've seen, the typical implementation is to do a browser check on your main page, then if it's a smart phone, redirect to a mobile.* or whatever virtual domain where you swap out the CSS.

169 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:54:38pm

re: #151 freetoken

BTW, the GOP is scheduled to follow immediately the official US delegation press conference. I wonder if the GOP will use the opportunity to try and deep six what the official delegation is trying to accomplish.

Can you post that link to the live feed again, in case people are interested to see how deep the GOP is going to dig their hole?

170 Fenris  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:55:29pm

re: #161 Killgore Trout

How shellfish saved the human race

See? We kosher lizards thank our clam bretheren by not eating them.

171 recusancy  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:55:30pm

re: #169 Charles

Can you post that link to the live feed again, in case people are interested to see how deep the GOP is going to dig their hole?

Does it get archived or do you have to record it?

172 Crimsonfisted  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:56:03pm

re: #86 nines09

How could you abort God? After all...
This makes more sense than just about anything I've heard in the past, oh, I don't know...eh...What English might sound like to someone who doesn't speak it
1972 for this gem. I just stumbled across it.

Umm, what the heck IS that anyway?

173 philosophus invidius  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:56:22pm

re: #152 wrenchwench

Here's a good response to Randi.

Just goes to show that being a "skeptic" is not the same as being a critical thinker when you get significant false positives.

174 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:56:44pm

re: #153 brookly red

I find it interesting that so many people from countries with "free" health care go outside the system, virtually everyone who has the means.

The free market will always serve those with the means to afford whatever they want. That's not the point of socialized medicine.

175 Crimsonfisted  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:58:04pm

re: #86 nines09

Ok, I had to have a pallet cleanser for that.

176 Fenris  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 5:59:40pm

re: #168 Jaerik

From what I've seen, the typical implementation is to do a browser check on your main page, then if it's a smart phone, redirect to a mobile.* or whatever virtual domain where you swap out the CSS.

Sounds easy enough. I'll check with my provider if they allow for subdomains. Eventually. When I'm filthy rich enough to spring for the extra seven bucks a month.

177 Racer X  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:00:06pm
178 Lidane  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:00:27pm

re: #160 brookly red

pssst, generics are full strength... price well it is what it is. I like free markets.

Oh, I have nothing against free markets. I like them quite a bit, in fact. However, the basic point still stands-- along the border, it's more common than not for people to just drive to Mexico for medical care and prescriptions than to get them here solely due to the difference in cost. If the care on both sides is comparable, but one is far more reasonable on your wallet than the other, why not?

179 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:00:30pm

BTW, the real scientists are starting to get a bit riled by all the baloney going on, apparently:

AGU Day 2

After lunch I went to the Bjerknes Lecture - one of the big set pieces - which was given by Richard Alley from Penn State. He brought a geological perspective to the link between atmospheric carbon dioxide and temperature. He started the lecture by noting the ongoing harassment of climate scientists by the denialist camp - giving an example of a demand made to his university that he be fired for continuing to claim that carbon dioxide causes temperature change. [...]

Alley reviewed climate changes in the geological record, going back 4.5 billion years. His central point was that in almost every case carbon dioxide has emerged as the smoking gun in terms of causation, and indeed that it is essentially impossible to explain the observed changes without carbon dioxide acting as the key forcing. This is true for the "faint young sun paradox" (4.6 billion years ago), the snowball earth period, the late Permian extinction period, the mid-Cretaceous "Saurian sauna" period and the Palaeocene-Eocene thermal maximum for example.

Alley did note that although his own data shows that for the last 500,000 years carbon dioxide and temperature have moved in lockstep together, sometimes that CO2 lags behind temperature. He observed with great amusement that this has led some denialists to claim that CO2 is a thermometer not a cause of temperature change. Of course the glacial - interglacial cycle is driven by the cyclicity in the orbit, but Alley noted that the magnitude of the temperature changes can only be explained using a carbon dioxide feedback mechanism. He ridiculed the idea that because CO2 sometimes lags temperature it cannot be the cause of warming. He compared this to debt associated with credit cards, saying that if he went out and spent a modest amount on his card he would end up owing the credit card company money. If he didn't pay this off then punitive interest rates would mean that his debt rapidly spiralled out of control. In the end his bankruptcy would be the result of the debt increasing due to the interest rates. The application of the interest rates lagged behind the spend, but still caused the insolvency. He likened the orbital cycle to the initial spend but the carbon dioxide to the interest. [...]

Next he noted the huge progress that has been made in understanding the link between temperature and CO2 in recent years. [...]

Finally, he took a few minutes to show that arguments for other causal factors for global temperature change in the geological record just don't hold water [...]

He finished with a very simple message - the geological record shows that carbon dioxide is the key factor that controls temperature. Other factors do operate, but the CO2 signal consistently dominates. He noted that the geological record shows that over a timescale of few centuries timescale a doubling of CO2 results in a warming of about 2.8 C, which is consistent with the IPCC figure for climate sensitivity. He made a very bold statement that if the key factor that explains the temperature record in the geological record is CO2 - without carbon dioxide concentration changes it is impossible to explain the observed behaviour.

I checked and the lecture isn't online yet, though I might be posted later. If it is posted online I will link it here.

180 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:00:42pm

re: #174 Basho

The free market will always serve those with the means to afford whatever they want. That's not the point of socialized medicine.

Yes, I agree 100%. To serve is not the point of socialized anything & my reason for rejecting it.

181 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:01:38pm

re: #169 Charles

The schedule of events (and it changes constantly):

[Link: regserver.unfccc.int...]

The webcast page:

[Link: www9.cop15.meta-fusion.com...]

182 miclaine  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:03:32pm

We'd all be Jews

183 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:04:10pm

re: #178 Lidane

Oh, I have nothing against free markets. I like them quite a bit, in fact. However, the basic point still stands-- along the border, it's more common than not for people to just drive to Mexico for medical care and prescriptions than to get them here solely due to the difference in cost. If the care on both sides is comparable, but one is far more reasonable on your wallet than the other, why not?

Exactly. And not one bureaucrat was feather-bedded in the process.

184 philosophus invidius  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:05:02pm

re: #182 miclaine

We'd all be Jews

Or pagans.

185 Kruk  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:05:18pm

re: #95 Charles

We're heading for 150,000 pageviews for the day. It's sad that LGF has become so irrelevant.

I'm sure the sane demographic will make a comeback one of these days....

186 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:06:10pm

re: #184 philosophus invidius

Or pagans.

Or Darwinists!

187 Fenris  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:07:23pm

re: #184 philosophus invidius

Or pagans.

And we'd have a godhatesshrimp.com. Wait, we already do.

188 Big Steve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:07:43pm

Just to prove that neither side of the AWG debate totally has the high ground, also know as Who The Hell Invited Chavez.......Chavez Cheered

I mean this guy is NOT helping......and then he gets cheered?

189 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:07:58pm

re: #180 brookly red

Yes, I agree 100%. To serve is not the point of socialized anything & my reason for rejecting it.

So if your residence catches fire you'll reject the fire department?

190 Gus  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:07:58pm

It's amazing what passes for discourse in this day and age with imbeciles like Chuck Norris running around.

191 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:08:10pm

re: #182 miclaine

We'd all be Jews

or demmies

192 Achilles Tang  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:08:57pm

re: #126 Charles

I expect Phil Plait will have to comment, given his connection. I suspect there will be an addendum in due course, if not the next 10 minutes.

193 Big Steve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:09:10pm

re: #185 Kruk

I'm sure the sane demographic will make a comeback one of these days...

I see we are getting close to 8 million comments.......whats the over/under on the date it will happen?

194 Gus  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:09:10pm

Not again.

195 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:09:18pm

re: #188 Big Steve

We discussd this earlier.

Any nation who is a member of the UN can be part of the UNFCCC, thus any nation's leader can come and speak.

Many leaders have, others have sent their ministers. Right now it is Benin which is speaking.

196 yoshicastmaster  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:09:46pm

re: #35 Slumbering Behemoth

i'd totally vote you up for that, but i'm not at 50 comments yet.... soon though....

197 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:10:36pm

re: #189 Basho

So if your residence catches fire you'll reject the fire department?

no & I am quite fond of the Army too... but I have gone past the 5th grade so please sept it up.

198 Kruk  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:10:41pm

re: #189 Basho

So if your residence catches fire you'll reject the fire department?

Or the public roads they drove on to get there, the public utilities that supply the water to put the fire, the public education system that allowed them to understand fire science....

199 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:10:46pm

re: #186 Sharmuta

Or Darwinists!

Can I be the blacksmith? I always wanted to work with molten metal. Of course, I'd have to discover their ancient secrets for such a technique, since fire obviously doesn't melt steel.
/

200 Big Steve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:10:53pm

re: #195 freetoken

thanks....where was it discussed so I can catch up?

201 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:11:55pm

re: #197 brookly red

no & I am quite fond of the Army too... but I have gone past the 5th grade so please sept it up.

Err... ok? Whatever you say:

SEPTEMBER WOOOO!

202 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:12:28pm

re: #141 Decatur Deb

Howdy, you. Great new avatar! Is that on a jacket of yours?

203 stayfrosty  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:12:33pm

I've already said here that I'm against federal funding for elective abortions, but this is just ridiculous. When you inject religion into politics, it's usually because you can't make your point any other way.

204 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:12:44pm

re: #196 yoshicastmaster

i'd totally vote you up for that, but i'm not at 50 comments yet... soon though...

That's okay, it's the thought that counts. Especially at this time of year.

205 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:13:10pm

I just read this headline and did a double take. Then I re read it...

So the idea is...

Obama's evil commies would have forced Mary to abort Jesus with their evil godless plans to give health care to poor people...

Mmmmhhhmmm.

How about this:

If Chuck Norris had received a few fewer blows to the head and sought and received better health care he wouldn't say such crazy stuff.

206 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:14:05pm

re: #156 Racer X

No way! what did Mark say?

207 Gus  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:14:09pm

re: #195 freetoken

We discussd this earlier.

Any nation who is a member of the UN can be part of the UNFCCC, thus any nation's leader can come and speak.

Many leaders have, others have sent their ministers. Right now it is Benin which is speaking.

I've come to the conclusion that most of what goes for news these days is at least 50% fiction based on 2nd or 3rd hand accounts.

208 Achilles Tang  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:14:12pm

re: #182 miclaine

We'd all be Jews

Hey, you never know. My wife just found out her DNA ancestry is Haplogroup K which one third of all Askenazi Jews trace back to. I hear they are considered smart which, with my input, explains something about my kids.

209 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:14:36pm

Chuck Norris is singlehandedly responsible for global warming after letting some of the hot air out of his head.

210 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:14:45pm

re: #162 Racer X

Got it.

211 Gus  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:14:56pm

re: #205 LudwigVanQuixote

I just read this headline and did a double take. Then I re read it...

So the idea is...

Obama's evil commies would have forced Mary to abort Jesus with their evil godless plans to give health care to poor people...

Mmmmhhhmmm.

How about this:

If Chuck Norris had received a few fewer blows to the head and sought and received better health care he wouldn't say such crazy stuff.

I'm a little cornfused here. Doesn't Chuck Norris mean Jesus and not God?

212 Achilles Tang  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:15:05pm

re: #202 prairiefire

Howdy, you. Great new avatar! Is that on a jacket of yours?

Oooh. I just looked.

213 Kruk  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:15:20pm

re: #75 Oh no...Sand People!

This fits the meme 'Holy Mother Mary and Joseph'! meme:

[Link: news.bbc.co.uk...]

The pastor from that Church was on last night's news, showing a sketch of the billboard they decided *not* to go with. It shows a glowy sperm with a halo, heading down from heaven.....

214 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:16:00pm

re: #201 Basho

Err... ok? Whatever you say:

SEPTEMBER WOOO!

OK, September is a month & wooo is? I am sorry, please don't assume that I can speak lefty just because I am from NY.

215 Locker  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:16:14pm

It's hard not to think this statement was specifically crafted by Norris to evoke comments from opponents. Very specific types of comments which can then be held up as evidence of anti-religious bias.

I mean seriously, how many ways could I make fun of this stupid bullshit. All of which would be fairly offensive to Christians. IT'S ENTRAPMENT I TELL YOU!

216 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:16:42pm

re: #214 brookly red

OK, September is a month & wooo is? I am sorry, please don't assume that I can speak lefty just because I am from NY.

You said to "sept it up". So I got excited about September. I don't know what you meant...

217 Ginsu  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:16:55pm

re: #188 Big Steve

I think the whole of idea of giving any of these countries that are not representative democracies cash to deal with AGW is insane. I really liked the article from yesterday about the cook stoves as no dictator's brother in law will be able to squirrel these away in Switzerland in the event the dictatorship goes south. It really makes me think that the countries that all have their hands out waiting for us to drop cash in them are the ones having economic problems due to their skepticism of free markets in the first place.

218 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:18:12pm

re: #213 Kruk

OMG. I guess it could have been like that.

219 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:19:18pm

re: #216 Basho

You said to "sept it up". So I got excited about September. I don't know what you meant...

touche, please pardon my illiterancy I went to public school.

220 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:19:27pm

This is a brilliant parody :)

I feel sorry for possibly offending and pre-emptively apologize to any thinking religious people out there. However, I think this very accurately captures much of the religious right.

221 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:19:39pm

re: #219 brookly red

:)

222 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:19:57pm

re: #202 prairiefire

Howdy, you. Great new avatar! Is that on a jacket of yours?

It's the nose art preserved on a jacket that belonged to the navigator of the Decatur Deb. He survived and gave it to a little museum at the airfield they used. The intertubes are very powerful

223 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:20:07pm

re: #211 Gus 802

I'm a little cornfused here. Doesn't Chuck Norris mean Jesus and not God?

well that one is above my pay grade :)

224 b_Snark  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:20:32pm

re: #5 SanFranciscoZionist

Yes.

I don't know, does stupidity overpower blasphemy or does blasphemy overpower stupidity.

Norris has taken one too many round house (turning) kicks to the head.

225 Kruk  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:20:56pm

re: #218 prairiefire

OMG. I guess it could have been like that.

Heh. I think the pastor meant it as a gentle tweak at the people who insist the Bible should be interpreted literally. Someone's just gone and defaced the billboard, making the pastor's point for him.

226 markie  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:21:16pm

re: #35 Slumbering Behemoth

Man, where's Bruce Lee when you need him?

In a cemetery in Seattle. Really.

227 b_Snark  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:21:41pm

re: #13 rwdflynavy

I think Chuck has taken a few too many round houses to the head.

Crap, you beat me to it.

228 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:23:32pm

re: #222 Decatur Deb

Very cool. Vargas art plus airplanes and guns.

229 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:24:06pm

re: #220 LudwigVanQuixote

This is a brilliant parody :)

I feel sorry for possibly offending and pre-emptively apologize to any thinking religious people out there. However, I think this very accurately captures much of the religious right.


[Video]

Lol.

230 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:24:13pm

re: #211 Gus 802

I'm a little cornfused here. Doesn't Chuck Norris mean Jesus and not God?

re: #223 LudwigVanQuixote

This might help to clear things up:

231 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:24:40pm

Didn't God kill someone's child one time?

232 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:25:00pm

re: #227 b_sharp

Crap, you beat me to it.

I said it first :) But you are both right too :)

233 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:25:46pm

re: #226 markie

Sad. Brandon Lee, double sad. I think my little boy could look like Brandon Lee when he grows up.

234 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:26:01pm

re: #231 Basho

Didn't God kill someone's child one time?

All the first born of Egypt?

235 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:26:21pm

re: #231 Basho

Old testament.

236 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:26:29pm

Wowo! I don't know if this was posted. but...

Evangelist Oral Roberts dies in Calif. at age 91

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

237 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:27:01pm

re: #228 prairiefire

Very cool. Vargas art plus airplanes and guns.

The painting is exactly as good as it should be. It makes little sense, but I'm glad dad died in a plane with a name and art. (I know the name of the German pilot who downed the Deb. He lived another six weeks.)

238 Gus  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:27:25pm

re: #230 freetoken

re: #223 LudwigVanQuixote

This might help to clear things up:


[Video]

OK, thanks, now I kind of remember.

Not possible in the physical world however.

239 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:27:28pm

re: #237 Decatur Deb

How did you find his name?

240 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:27:46pm

re: #234 Sharmuta

All the first born of Egypt?

/that was Moses but he used Ziontific rays...

241 BARACK THE VOTE  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:28:51pm

re: #231 Basho

Didn't God kill someone's child one time?

In an early instance of outsourcing, I believe he subcontracted that to the Angel of Death.

242 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:28:55pm

re: #234 Sharmuta

All the first born of Egypt?

Ahh ok. But there is a verse somewhere in which God specifically says abortion is wrong, right?

243 Jaerik  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:29:14pm

re: #236 LudwigVanQuixote

Evangelist Oral Roberts dies in Calif. at age 91

Fark Headline: Jesus About To Receive Oral

244 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:29:38pm

re: #239 prairiefire

How did you find his name?

Nazis keep good records. There is a book devoted entirely to that one 1200 plane mission.

245 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:29:45pm

re: #241 iceweasel

In an early instance of outsourcing, I believe he subcontracted that to the Angel of Death.

Gawd that was funny.

246 BARACK THE VOTE  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:29:46pm

re: #242 Basho

Ahh ok. But there is a verse somewhere in which God specifically says abortion is wrong, right?

Nope.

247 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:30:01pm

re: #238 Gus 802

Did you catch the end?

248 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:30:33pm

re: #244 Decatur Deb

I could see how they would.

249 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:30:39pm

re: #242 Basho

Ahh ok. But there is a verse somewhere in which God specifically says abortion is wrong, right?

Once, a Jewish Lizard spelled out exactly what was allowed and not allowed as far as abortion, and it's surprisingly liberal. But it's not like Fundies let a little thing like that get in their way.

250 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:30:52pm

re: #246 iceweasel

I'm starting to think the religious right is full of $@!%.

251 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:31:33pm

re: #241 iceweasel

In an early instance of outsourcing, I believe he subcontracted that to the Angel of Death.

Gee... all of you are making good straight-men:

252 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:31:35pm

please allow me to introduce myself
I'm a man of wealth and taste
I've been around for a long, long year
stole many a man's soul and faith

253 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:32:07pm

re: #231 Basho

Didn't God kill someone's child one time?

You may be thinking of King David's first son by Batsheva?

254 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:32:10pm

re: #249 Sharmuta

Once, a Jewish Lizard spelled out exactly what was allowed and not allowed as far as abortion, and it's surprisingly liberal. But it's not like Fundies let a little thing like that get in their way.

Yeah the fundies would really hate to see just how many rights women have biblically in general.

255 Kruk  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:32:38pm

re: #243 Jaerik

Fark Headline: Jesus About To Receive Oral

Jesus having sex: "Oh! Oh! Oh....Dad.....that's good!"

Jesus hitting his thumb with a hammer: "Aww....me!"

256 Gus  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:32:50pm

re: #247 freetoken

Did you catch the end?

Are you referring to the apple and the pear ending?

257 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:33:43pm

re: #256 Gus 802

Yup.

258 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:33:55pm

re: #252 albusteve

please allow me to introduce myself
I'm a man of wealth and taste
I've been around for a long, long year
stole many a man's soul and faith

fuck, look I told you I woud have the rent on the 5th... what is your problem?

259 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:34:00pm

re: #242 Basho

Ahh ok. But there is a verse somewhere in which God specifically says abortion is wrong, right?

Not exactly.

260 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:34:00pm

re: #253 SanFranciscoZionist

You may be thinking of King David's first son by Batsheva?

Well if you accept that he run the world, you have to accept that he has been in the business of killing grannies, puppies and babies since day one. It's one of those things. Of course you have to ahve faith that it all makes sense somehow, but at the end of the day, you can not avoid this conclusion.

261 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:34:14pm

re: #253 SanFranciscoZionist

You may be thinking of King David's first son by Batsheva?

Yeah that was it but it turns out it happened a lot more.

262 Jadespring  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:34:25pm

re: #211 Gus 802

I'm a little cornfused here. Doesn't Chuck Norris mean Jesus and not God?

Nah he means God. In some theology Jesus was God incarnate. Some both Gods son and God at the same time. Some he's just the son but infused with God's spirit. I know it's confusing but it has to do with the Trinity, God, Son and the Holy Spirit. It's also a debate that's raged from the pretty much the beginning of it all.

263 Gus  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:36:10pm

re: #257 freetoken

Yup.

Yeah, that was pretty funny. Satan fruit!

OK, I'm suffering from theistic overload here.

264 BARACK THE VOTE  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:36:30pm

re: #255 Kruk

Jesus having sex: "Oh! Oh! Oh...Dad...that's good!"

Jesus hitting his thumb with a hammer: "Aww...me!"

Reminds me of a funny Bill Bryson line....driving through Iowa he sees a bumpersticker saying "Christ is the answer" and remarks "The question, of course, is "What do you say when you hit your thumb with a hammer?" "

265 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:36:47pm

re: #262 Jadespring

"I don't give an iota."

266 Jaerik  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:37:15pm

re: #242 Basho

Ahh ok. But there is a verse somewhere in which God specifically says abortion is wrong, right?

It's a selective interpretation of several verses, a full listing being here. None of them are terribly convincing to me as far as God considering a fetus to be a person, especially when you consider the original Greek and Hebrew, where the terminology is even more blurred.

And it does nothing to answer the more direct answers in the Bible that come down on the other side:

"And if men struggle and strike a woman with child so that she has a miscarriage, yet there is no further injury, he shall be fined as the woman's husband may demand of him, and he shall pay as the judges decide." -Exodus 21:22

In other words, the Bible considers killing a fetus to be a property crime, not murder.

But, this isn't anything new. The argument that a fetus is a person is a very emotional one, and something that folks just "feel." Which pretty much triggers selective Bible interpretation for reasons of confirmation bias. It is not uncommon for worldly churches to seize on such an emotion, canonize it as gospel, and use it for the purposes of attaining political power.

267 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:37:16pm

re: #249 Sharmuta

Once, a Jewish Lizard spelled out exactly what was allowed and not allowed as far as abortion, and it's surprisingly liberal. But it's not like Fundies let a little thing like that get in their way.

Abortion is not only allowed, it's an obligation if the life of the mother is in danger either from the fetus or if giving birth would kill the mother, but not other than that.

268 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:37:40pm

The Islamic Republic of Afghanistan is speaking...

269 Racer X  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:37:46pm

re: #252 albusteve

please allow me to introduce myself
I'm a man of wealth and taste
I've been around for a long, long year
stole many a man's soul and faith

Pleased to meet you.

270 Gus  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:37:58pm

re: #268 freetoken

The Islamic Republic of Afghanistan is speaking...

Link?

271 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:38:11pm

re: #268 freetoken

The Islamic Republic of Afghanistan is speaking...

and...

272 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:38:18pm

re: #270 Gus 802

[Link: www1.cop15.meta-fusion.com...]

273 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:38:20pm

re: #262 Jadespring

Nah he means God. In some theology Jesus was God incarnate. Some both Gods son and God at the same time. Some he's just the son but infused with God's spirit. I know it's confusing but it has to do with the Trinity, God, Son and the Holy Spirit. It's also a debate that's raged from the pretty much the beginning of it all.

On the Trinity:

"God is like a clover- small, green and split three ways."

- Nuns on the Run

274 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:39:19pm

re: #267 marjoriemoon

Abortion is not only allowed, it's an obligation if the life of the mother is in danger either from the fetus or if giving birth would kill the mother, but not other than that.

That's what I remember.

275 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:40:44pm

re: #226 markie

In a cemetery in Seattle. Really.

I lived there for nearly four years, and not once did I visit to pay my respects. Nor Jimi, for that matter. I stink.

276 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:40:48pm

re: #156 Racer X

Mark Levin just ripped Glenn Beck to shreds.

Did he do it with his patented *quiet voice* LOUUD VOIICE!! *quiet voice* LOUUD VOIICE!! thing?

277 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:41:01pm

re: #269 Racer X

Pleased to meet you.

tell me baby, what's my name?
I tell you one time, your to blame

278 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:41:17pm

re: #262 Jadespring

Nah he means God. In some theology Jesus was God incarnate. Some both Gods son and God at the same time. Some he's just the son but infused with God's spirit. I know it's confusing but it has to do with the Trinity, God, Son and the Holy Spirit. It's also a debate that's raged from the pretty much the beginning of it all.

It's a pretty complicated concept!

279 Achilles Tang  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:41:40pm

re: #253 SanFranciscoZionist

You may be thinking of King David's first son by Batsheva?

Totally off the wall, but Batsheva is really a kick ass name for a woman in 2009.

I wonder what I'd find if I Googled Batsheva and XXX.

280 Gus  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:42:05pm

re: #272 freetoken

[Link: www1.cop15.meta-fusion.com...]

Thanks. The place looks empty.

281 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:42:15pm

re: #276 WindUpBird

Did he do it with his patented *quiet voice* LOUUD VOIICE!! *quiet voice* LOUUD VOIICE!! thing?

/get off the phone you big dope.

282 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:42:57pm

re: #267 marjoriemoon

Abortion is not only allowed, it's an obligation if the life of the mother is in danger either from the fetus or if giving birth would kill the mother, but not other than that.

But, to clarify, that is the halacha, but there is no Biblical verse that specificially states that.

(The questioner asked about the Bible, so I don't want to send him hunting for all this in Leviticus.)

283 Racer X  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:42:58pm

Woman Pleads Guilty to Unnatural Noises During Sex

. . . and her husband stood silently by her in the courtroom, with a big grin on his face.

284 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:43:18pm

re: #279 Naso Tang

Now tell us what the sixth graders are going to call her.

285 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:43:29pm

re: #278 SanFranciscoZionist

It's a pretty complicated concept!

yes it is...I prefer the simplicity of a heathen, irreligious, uncultivated, and uncivilized....we rock

286 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:43:31pm

re: #273 Sharmuta

On the Trinity:

"God is like a clover- small, green and split three ways."

- Nuns on the Run

Patrick tried--he really really tried...

287 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:44:09pm

Anyone who can listen to all the Copenhagen speeches without going completely insane with boredom deserves a medal.

The UN could use a few Hollywood producers among the bureaucrat drones who organize these events. This is lethal.

288 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:44:14pm

re: #249 Sharmuta

289 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:44:22pm

re: #274 Sharmuta

That's what I remember.

Yaaa... that's the short answer. Read here for a bit more.

290 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:44:34pm

re: #279 Naso Tang

Totally off the wall, but Batsheva is really a kick ass name for a woman in 2009.

I wonder what I'd find if I Googled Batsheva and XXX.

I have no idea. To me it brings up an image of Jerusalem housewives, and yeshiva girls in long denim skirts.

291 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:44:53pm

re: #282 SanFranciscoZionist

But, to clarify, that is the halacha, but there is no Biblical verse that specificially states that.

(The questioner asked about the Bible, so I don't want to send him hunting for all this in Leviticus.)

Oh yes, absolutely.

292 Locker  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:44:55pm

re: #287 Charles

Anyone who can listen to all the Copenhagen speeches without going completely insane with boredom deserves a medal.

The UN could use a few Hollywood producers among the bureaucrat drones who organize these events. This is lethal.

I do not envy you if that's your chosen lot in this mess. I'd need to become a tweeker to make it through.

293 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:45:10pm

re: #287 Charles

Anyone who can listen to all the Copenhagen speeches without going completely insane with boredom deserves a medal.

The UN could use a few Hollywood producers among the bureaucrat drones who organize these events. This is lethal.

Freetoken is on the front line....HAIL!

294 Racer X  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:46:16pm
295 Achilles Tang  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:46:33pm

re: #284 Decatur Deb

Now tell us what the sixth graders are going to call her.

Sixth graders talk about Batsheva? I wonder why?

296 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:46:44pm

re: #280 Gus 802

It's almost 3am there!

297 JamesWI  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:47:27pm

re: #40 Basho

Didn't baby Jesus survive some kind of attempt to kill every baby?

According to Matthew, yes. According to every contemporaneous account of history, including the other Gospels, no. But we're supposed to believe every word in the Bible is the inerrant . . .

/

298 Achilles Tang  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:47:34pm

re: #290 SanFranciscoZionist

I have no idea. To me it brings up an image of Jerusalem housewives, and yeshiva girls in long denim skirts.

If that works for you, who am I to criticize?

299 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:48:40pm

re: #294 Racer X

Palin Says Marked-Out McCain Visor Wasn't a Political Statement

Poor woman, can't wear a bathing suit in public, which was my first thought when I saw this story.

See, I can have some sympathy for her.

300 Ayeless in Ghazi  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:48:47pm

re: #231 Basho

Didn't God kill someone's child one time?

Yep a whole bunch of them, from the first born of Pharoah to the first born of the slave at the mill. Lovely story.

301 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:49:08pm

Glenn Beck Blames Obama For Changing American Christian “Traditions”

Last night, his “One Thing,” about changing American “traditions,” was vintage Beck in that he used a quote from Michelle Obama to launch into a diatribe about persecuted Christians. His pastoral homily also included examples of this “persecution,” which didn’t quite tell the whole story. But the story told was one that further reinforced the hatred and and the shit that Glenn Beck is so adept at stirring.

Beck quoted Michelle Obama: “Barack knows that we are going to have to make sacrifices; we are going to have to change our conversation; we're going to have to change our traditions, our history; we're going to have to move into a different place as a nation." (Oh, no, can’t move America from an intolerant white, Christian nation to a diverse secular one). He claimed that this quote was about “molding” history to fit the “progressive agenda.” (And Beck, with his W. Cleon Skousen “history” isn’t “molding” a meme?)

302 Mich-again  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:49:08pm
Will Obamacare morph into Herodcare for the unborn?

Herod specialized in killing babies after they were born IIRC.

303 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:49:36pm

re: #287 Charles

Which is why I have it going in the background... when I see a country on the scroll bar that looks interesting I pay more attention.

OTOH, I'm watching one of the recorded videos from the currently in progress annual meeting of the AGU. Here is a session that is discussing the current solar minimum and what we can learn from it:
[Link: eventcg.com...]

The AGW deniers love to blame the sun for everything, so I expect them to cherry pick statements out of these presentations.

304 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:49:37pm

re: #292 Locker

I do not envy you if that's your chosen lot in this mess. I'd need to become a tweeker to make it through.

/whatever... I will just wait for the bill to come in the mail.

305 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:49:42pm

BTW, is anyone here familiar with Joseph Heller's book "God Knows"? It's an account of King David's life, told by David himself. Anachronistic, very funny in pieces.

The repeated line, as the Batsheva incident starts to get out of control is "Uriah, Uriah, go home and fuck your wife!"

He also tries to get Uriah to break taboo and go home by saying "You're not even Jewish," to which Uriah replies, "Some of my best friends are Jewish."

306 JamesWI  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:49:59pm

re: #297 JamesWI

According to Matthew, yes. According to every contemporaneous account of history, including the other Gospels, no. But we're supposed to believe every word in the Bible is the inerrant . . .

/

"the inerrant"? Ugh, too much Grain Belt already.

307 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:50:10pm

re: #295 Naso Tang

Sixth graders talk about Batsheva? I wonder why?

They know they will get a candy bar if they can answer all of Abba's questions about the haftorah?

308 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:50:26pm

Russian Federation up....

309 Jaerik  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:50:28pm

re: #297 JamesWI

What's really interesting is when you start poking into the synoptic problem.

Well, assuming you're interested by history like I am. Most folks aren't.

310 bratwurst  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:50:59pm

re: #302 Mich-again

Herod specialized in killing babies after they were born IIRC.

Retroactive abortion.

311 Kruk  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:52:32pm

re: #302 Mich-again

Herod specialized in killing babies after they were born IIRC.

That's stage II of Obamacare. Stage I is killing the the elderly and unborn, but you know how the waiting times are in a Government run system.

312 Kruk  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:53:20pm

re: #310 bratwurst

Retroactive abortion.

Run by the Governator?

313 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:53:35pm

re: #299 marjoriemoon

Thank you for helping me feel a smidge of sympathy for her! Her little boy is getting bigger.

314 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:54:30pm

re: #308 freetoken

Is this on sat or online?

315 JamesWI  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:54:33pm

re: #309 Jaerik

Well, I was a philosophy major (yes, I know, waste of time, but I knew I was going to go to law school anyway, so what the hell) but I don't think I ever had any discussions about that, but going to read it now.

316 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:55:11pm

re: #310 bratwurst

Retroactive abortion.

/you don't get the full tax credit for that...

317 Altermite  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:55:25pm

re: #287 Charles

I have a friend who is currently in copenhagen, doing an internship thing with a professor attending the conference. I asked him what it was like. He said the most interesting thing that happened was getting his tongue stuck to his thermos on account of the cold.

318 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:55:26pm

re: #308 freetoken

Thank you for your service!
I don't know HOW you can listen to that....

319 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:55:59pm

re: #314 Rightwingconspirator

See link upstream... but as Charles said, most of it is pretty boring.

The real action is behind the scene, the results of which we should know in about 12 hours.

320 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:56:26pm
321 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:56:46pm

re: #311 Kruk

That's stage II of Obamacare. Stage I is killing the the elderly and unborn, but you know how the waiting times are in a Government run system.

hahaha laugh while you can.

322 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:56:56pm

re: #313 prairiefire

Thank you for helping me feel a smidge of sympathy for her! Her little boy is getting bigger.

The pics they posted at TMZ were very sweet.

As to the hat thing, she doesn't have another hat? Boy that sucky economy is just hitting everyone!

323 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:58:05pm

re: #318 Floral Giraffe

I ignore most of it.

However, sometimes someone says something important. E.g., the Russian who just spoke, ended with an emphatic emphasis on keeping free trade. It's pretty clear that they fear any cap on CO2 production would lead to taxing or restricting international trade in hydrocarbons, of which Russian exports are large.

324 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:58:20pm

re: #300 Jimmah

Yep a whole bunch of them, from the first born of Pharoah to the first born of the slave at the mill. Lovely story.

Draconian population reduction measures are very important to the globalist elites (Bilderbergs, Trilateralists, and CFR).

325 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:59:13pm

re: #294 Racer X

Palin Says Marked-Out McCain Visor Wasn't a Political Statement

For a rarity, I'm going to accept her explanation and give her the benefit of the doubt. She's on vacation, and might well want to stay under the radar.

326 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:59:25pm

Ladies and Gentleman........ Mike Huckabee's bestest pal.......

327 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 6:59:37pm

re: #324 Basho

Draconian population reduction measures are very important to the globalist elites (Bilderbergs, Trilateralists, and CFR).

then they should love the oncoming AGW....

328 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:01:32pm

re: #95 Charles

We're heading for 150,000 pageviews for the day. It's sad that LGF has become so irrelevant.


I believe it's because this is a haven from the kookasphere on both sides now...... *good thing*

329 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:02:15pm

Since abortion was invented in the 1970's, the global population has shrunk to 6 billion.

330 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:02:15pm

There's a new Crock of the Week

Climate Deniers Love the 70s! -- The Remix

331 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:02:57pm

re: #326 wozzablog

Ladies and Gentleman... Mike Huckabee's bestest pal...

Both of them are Bark-at-the-Moon crazy. Huck is just quite and nice about it.

332 Jadespring  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:03:05pm

re: #278 SanFranciscoZionist

It's a pretty complicated concept!

It sure is. I remember in Sunday school, I think I was ten or eleven, and the teacher was trying to explain it. Of course it really made no sense to our minds and we kept getting more and more confused. I finally asked, "Jewish people don't believe in Jesus right but they still use the Bible?" The teacher said yes but only the Old Testament. What does that have to do with what we're talking about." I said something along the lines of, "Well this thing with Jesus is too confusing so I think I'm going to be Jewish because it seems way easier."

333 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:03:27pm

re: #323 freetoken

I ignore most of it.

However, sometimes someone says something important. E.g., the Russian who just spoke, ended with an emphatic emphasis on keeping free trade. It's pretty clear that they fear any cap on CO2 production would lead to taxing or restricting international trade in hydrocarbons, of which Russian exports are large.

The bizarre story of the day: all the right wing bloggers who scream about AGW being a socialist plot to take over the world, suddenly linking with approval to a story about Russia's IEA because it says the IPCC faked all of their data.

Russia.

You couldn't make up irony this rich.

334 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:03:30pm

re: #323 freetoken

I ignore most of it.

However, sometimes someone says something important. E.g., the Russian who just spoke, ended with an emphatic emphasis on keeping free trade. It's pretty clear that they fear any cap on CO2 production would lead to taxing or restricting international trade in hydrocarbons, of which Russian exports are large.


Well did you think the Russians of all people would just lay down and take it? They have been down this road before...

335 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:04:27pm

re: #331 Dark_Falcon

Both of them are Bark-at-the-Moon crazy. Huck is just quite and nice about it.

like Charles said...when it comes it will be wearing an 'aw shucks' smile from ear to ear

336 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:04:31pm

re: #330 Sharmuta

Link hung on loading, might be local.

337 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:04:33pm

re: #330 Sharmuta

Bruce Lee FTW!

The author of that vid is totally wrong, though. That ain't Kung Fu, that's Jeet Kune Do.
/

338 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:05:11pm

re: #333 Charles

I know... saw that. I wonder if the right-o-sphere also believes the Russian government when they discuss Georgia?

339 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:05:31pm

re: #336 Decatur Deb


Worked for me...

340 Ayeless in Ghazi  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:05:33pm

re: #324 Basho

Draconian population reduction measures are very important to the globalist elites (Bilderbergs, Trilateralists, and CFR).

Ha! Very true. In this instance though, the intention was to punish Pharoah for not freeing his people. Why did Pharoah not free his people? Because God 'hardened his heart' so that he would refuse the request. (He did this for each of the plagues) Such a lovely, lovely story.

341 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:05:41pm

re: #334 brookly red

Well did you think the Russians of all people would just lay down and take it? They have been down this road before...

there is only one Russian....Putin

342 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:05:43pm

re: #331 Dark_Falcon

Both of them are Bark-at-the-Moon crazy. Huck is just quite and nice about it.

Screeeeeams break the silence....waking from the dead of niii-iiight

343 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:06:48pm

re: #341 albusteve

It is a Democracy afterall - one man one vote.

Putin is the man and Putin is the vote.

344 cwnorma  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:07:36pm

re: #333 Charles


You couldn't make up irony this rich.

Any port in a storm... My enemy's enemy... this is like Klingon level Irony!

/Kaplah!

345 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:07:37pm

re: #333 Charles

The bizarre story of the day: all the right wing bloggers who scream about AGW being a socialist plot to take over the world, suddenly linking with approval to a story about Russia's IEA because it says the IPCC faked all of their data.

You couldn't make up irony this rich.

It's very sad. The same people who normally distrust Russia do a complete 180" simply because Russia is saying something that denounces their "International Tranzi Plot" du jour. The right wing blogosphere has lost the ability to think critically.

346 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:07:45pm

re: #343 wozzablog

It is a Democracy afterall - one man one vote.

Putin is the man and Putin is the vote.

beware the sleeping Bear

347 Kruk  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:08:40pm

re: #341 albusteve

there is only one Russian...Putin

Russsia is a perfect example of a "one man, one vote" democracy. Putin's the man, and he has the vote. (With apologies to Terry Pratchett.)

348 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:09:12pm

re: #329 Basho

The current methods might have been developed in the 70's, but abortions have been happening since women figured out they could terminate a pregnancy themselves. A long, long, time.

349 Kruk  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:09:24pm

re: #343 wozzablog

It is a Democracy afterall - one man one vote.

Putin is the man and Putin is the vote.

Heh. GMTA.

350 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:09:26pm

re: #341 albusteve

there is only one Russian...Putin

да, и люди нужен руководитель :)

351 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:09:31pm

re: #343 wozzablog

Is it Vladurday already? Where does the time go?

352 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:09:35pm

re: #345 Dark_Falcon

It's very sad. The same people who normally distrust Russia do a complete 180" simply because Russia is saying something that denounces their "International Tranzi Plot" du jour. The right wing blogosphere has lost the ability to think critically.

would you be?
could you be?
won't you be my neighbor

353 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:09:48pm

re: #347 Kruk

see 343 ;-)

354 BARACK THE VOTE  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:09:52pm

re: #325 Dark_Falcon

For a rarity, I'm going to accept her explanation and give her the benefit of the doubt. She's on vacation, and might well want to stay under the radar.

That makes no sense. It's what, 5 bucks for a visor at every giftshop in hawaii?

BTW, it's a fad with teabaggers to tear off the McCain part of their McCain/Palin bumperstickers. That's who she's pandering too, you betcha.

Oh, sure, every hotel gift shop in Hawaii will sell you a nondescript visor, but, what with this darn recession and all, you've got to use it up, wear it out, and make it do, right? Especially since Palin et famille are going to have to get by this year on book royalties that are only going to be in the high seven or low eight figures. And, of course, a McCain visor would automatically make everyone think she was part of the campaign, right? Hey, you know how it is -- doesn't everyone with an Obama/Biden bumper sticker get mistaken for the president?

The Note notes the wingnut fad for McCain/Palin bumper stickers with the "McCain" torn off, and says that Doug Hoffman's campaign car in NY-23 this fall bore just such a sticker. So now we know two things: Palin's addiction to attention is leading her to reach desperately for a fix every few days (last week it was the TV appearance with Shatner, next week it'll be God knows), and Palin is going to be tapping teabaggism for material. I'm surprised she wasn't wearing a "blood of tyrants" T-shirt -- y'know, in an incognito fashion.

[Link: nomoremister.blogspot.com...]

355 Lateralis  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:10:00pm

re: #236 LudwigVanQuixote

Wowo! I don't know if this was posted. but...

Evangelist Oral Roberts dies in Calif. at age 91

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

That isn't a celebratory wowo is it?

356 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:10:20pm

re: #350 brookly red

да, и люди нужен руково&# x0434;итель :)

same to you pal

357 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:12:00pm

And now -- let's have a big hand for Kurdistan's minister of Environment and Forestry!

358 Kruk  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:12:37pm

re: #348 prairiefire

The current methods might have been developed in the 70's, but abortions have been happening since women figured out they could terminate a pregnancy themselves. A long, long, time.

Which is why I always mentally change "restricting abortions" to "restricting safe and legal abortions". The abortions will still happen, but the consequences for the woman will be much worse.

359 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:12:54pm

re: #357 Charles

And now -- let's have a big hand for Kurdistan's minister of Environment and Forestry!

His father always said he'd go far...

360 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:12:56pm

re: #343 wozzablog

It is a Democracy afterall - one man one vote.

Putin is the man and Putin is the vote.

Beefcake. BEEFCAAAAAAKE!!

361 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:13:30pm

re: #357 Charles

He is secretly a Bilderberg, didn't you know?

362 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:13:31pm

re: #357 Charles

And now -- let's have a big hand for Kurdistan's minister of Environment and Forestry!

[one-handed clapping]

363 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:13:55pm

re: #360 marjoriemoon

Ughhh, he makes my skin crawl. Poster boy for the KGB.

364 cwnorma  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:14:31pm

Hey Charles,

Since I know you are here tonight, do you know why the java scripts in some of the ads slow down the scrolling java-engine on firefox? Only started recently...

/code cluelessness

365 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:14:48pm

re: #325 Dark_Falcon

For a rarity, I'm going to accept her explanation and give her the benefit of the doubt. She's on vacation, and might well want to stay under the radar.

I don't believe her at all on this.

It's a minor issue, but to claim that this wasn't deliberate doesn't pass the smell test. I think she can probably afford a new baseball cap after quitting the governor's job to make millions on a speaking tour.

366 Spare O'Lake  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:15:13pm

Russia has a long tradition of denial.
Da, da Kanada,
Nyet, nyet Soviet.
Eat shit, Russkies!

367 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:15:29pm

re: #354 iceweasel

[Link: nomoremister.blogspot.com...]

If she did it deliberately, then she's an ungrateful bitch. Without John McCain selecting her as his running late, she'd still be in Alaska watching the ethics complaints pile up.

368 darthstar  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:16:01pm

re: #333 Charles

It's not irony, it's insincerity. Also known as bullshit. Of course they're quoting the Russians. It serves their purpose to derail any kind of progress on international agreement to work for realistic climate-sensitive policy. These are the same assholes who think Mary would have aborted Jesus under "Obamacare". They're the same assholes who think that 'death panels' will be the norm if we get a public option (which we won't because the Democrats are spineless pieces of shit too). They're the same assholes who think that if we just give the rich more tax breaks, they'll dump enough of the money they're hording into the economy that the NASCAR dads who haven't worked in 18 months will suddenly get new jobs with double the wages they made before.

It's insincere. And it's bullshit.

369 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:16:35pm

re: #364 cwnorma

Hey Charles,

Since I know you are here tonight, do you know why the java scripts in some of the ads slow down the scrolling java-engine on firefox? Only started recently...

/code cluelessness

if that's what it is, I have it too

370 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:16:52pm

re: #360 marjoriemoonre: #367 Dark_Falcon

The RedStaters are not going to be happy with her if she helps McCain campain against J.D. Diphead.

371 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:17:02pm

re: #368 darthstar

Wow... that was... wow

I vote for that to be comment of the year!

372 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:17:25pm

re: #348 prairiefire

The current methods might have been developed in the 70's, but abortions have been happening since women figured out they could terminate a pregnancy themselves. A long, long, time.

There's a scene in one of Maeve Binchy's early novels, set in the 1940s in Ireland, where the mother of the family misses her period. A week later, after a very hot bath every night, and a glass of gin at bedtime, it starts, and she thinks to herself that she won't mention this to Father--it's just something women do to get their bodies back to normal, when they're feeling a little run down.

A decade or so later, her foster daughter is going through an illegal abortion in London, and thinking to herself that she can never let Eileen know--she's so very Catholic, and would never understand.

373 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:18:04pm

re: #368 darthstar

It's not irony, it's insincerity. Also known as bullshit. Of course they're quoting the Russians. It serves their purpose to derail any kind of progress on international agreement to work for realistic climate-sensitive policy. These are the same assholes who think Mary would have aborted Jesus under "Obamacare". They're the same assholes who think that 'death panels' will be the norm if we get a public option (which we won't because the Democrats are spineless pieces of shit too). They're the same assholes who think that if we just give the rich more tax breaks, they'll dump enough of the money they're hording into the economy that the NASCAR dads who haven't worked in 18 months will suddenly get new jobs with double the wages they made before.

It's insincere. And it's bullshit.

here...have a pot brownie

374 Ayeless in Ghazi  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:19:29pm

re: #365 Charles

I don't believe her at all on this.

It's a minor issue, but to claim that this wasn't deliberate doesn't pass the smell test. I think she can probably afford a new baseball cap after quitting the governor's job to make millions on a speaking tour.

Maybe it was her 'lucky' hat/.

375 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:19:36pm

re: #372 SanFranciscoZionist

You have an opening to rant about Putin, if you like!

376 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:19:43pm

re: #368 darthstar

It's not irony, it's insincerity. Also known as bullshit. Of course they're quoting the Russians. It serves their purpose to derail any kind of progress on international agreement to work for realistic climate-sensitive policy. These are the same assholes who think Mary would have aborted Jesus under "Obamacare". They're the same assholes who think that 'death panels' will be the norm if we get a public option (which we won't because the Democrats are spineless pieces of shit too). They're the same assholes who think that if we just give the rich more tax breaks, they'll dump enough of the money they're hording into the economy that the NASCAR dads who haven't worked in 18 months will suddenly get new jobs with double the wages they made before.

It's insincere. And it's bullshit.

Thanks for saying it. It's making me very cranky.

377 BARACK THE VOTE  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:19:51pm

re: #367 Dark_Falcon

If she did it deliberately, then she's an ungrateful bitch. Without John McCain selecting her as his running late, she'd still be in Alaska watching the ethics complaints pile up.

I have to believe it was deliberate-- and the fact that there's a teabagger fad for McCain/Palin merchandise with the name McCain crossed out seals it for me.

Here is a photo of teabagger candidate Doug Hoffman's car with the McCain portion of the bumpersticker ripped off.

And Palin IS an ungrateful bitch. She started her political career by backstabbing a former ally, IIRC.

378 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:21:56pm

re: #375 prairiefire

You have an opening to rant about Putin, if you like!

Oh--the gray-faced, bloody-minded fascist butcher? Don't mind if I do!

379 Jadespring  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:21:58pm

re: #348 prairiefire

The current methods might have been developed in the 70's, but abortions have been happening since women figured out they could terminate a pregnancy themselves. A long, long, time.

No kidding. There's records that go back as far as 1500 BCish and in China folklore that talks about it happening 5000 years ago.

380 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:22:03pm

re: #377 iceweasel

I have to believe it was deliberate-- and the fact that there's a teabagger fad for McCain/Palin merchandise with the name McCain crossed out seals it for me.

Here is a photo of teabagger candidate Doug Hoffman's car with the McCain portion of the bumpersticker ripped off.

And Palin IS an ungrateful bitch. She started her political career by backstabbing a former ally, IIRC.

that's the way the system works....stab 'em all and let the voters sort 'em out...bunch of ungodly stabbers, ticks me off

381 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:22:22pm

I don't know exactly why the 3rd world nations have been making a big fuss about this climate conference, but I say that if they want their opinions heard they better make real efforts to keep their population growth under control.

382 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:22:31pm

re: #370 prairiefire

re: #367 Dark_Falcon

The RedStaters are not going to be happy with her if she helps McCain campain against J.D. Diphead.

If she supports Hayworth, then she becomes pond scum to me. I hate back-stabbers intensely.

383 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:22:41pm

re: #357 Charles

a big hand for Dr Klan?

384 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:22:50pm

re: #377 iceweasel

That's funny. Around here, I've seen a couple of bumper stickers that only have the McCain part. There are a lot of veterans and active service members 'round here, though. That may have something to do with it.

385 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:23:06pm

re: #381 Basho

I don't know exactly why the 3rd world nations have been making a big fuss about this climate conference, but I say that if they want their opinions heard they better make real efforts to keep their population growth under control.

Of course, China has done just that, and no one in the West is too happy about it. Fine line there.

386 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:23:42pm

re: #378 SanFranciscoZionist

Journalist killer. Opposition poisoner.

387 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:24:13pm

re: #380 albusteve

that's the way the system works...stab 'em all and let the voters sort 'em out...bunch of ungodly stabbers, ticks me off

I have bigger concerns about Palin than her headwear.

388 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:24:35pm

re: #382 Dark_Falcon

Agreed.

Hayworth has aboslutely no depth. He's on CNBC everyother day just giving the most rediculous talking points - and they let him get away with it.

389 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:25:17pm

re: #386 prairiefire

Journalist killer. Opposition poisoner.

Opportunistic Cheka scum.

390 Vicious Babushka  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:25:36pm

Hi guys. Just flew in from NY (and boy are my arms tired!)

Oh and, Teh Stupid never ends.

391 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:26:01pm

re: #377 iceweasel

I have to believe it was deliberate-- and the fact that there's a teabagger fad for McCain/Palin merchandise with the name McCain crossed out seals it for me.

Here is a photo of teabagger candidate Doug Hoffman's car with the McCain portion of the bumpersticker ripped off.

And Palin IS an ungrateful bitch. She started her political career by backstabbing a former ally, IIRC.

political & backstabbing? Oh my ... please do not be offended if I say that I find you naive, a little, sometimes..

392 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:26:05pm

re: #384 Slumbering Behemoth

Hi, snoozy! thanks for being the first lizard who ever talked to me!

393 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:26:06pm

re: #390 Alouette

Welcome back!

394 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:26:22pm

re: #387 Sharmuta

If you say "her underwear", I will likely faint.
/

395 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:26:28pm

re: #385 SanFranciscoZionist

Of course, China has done just that, and no one in the West is too happy about it. Fine line there.

And now everyone is listening to China.

396 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:26:31pm

I kid you not. I was in back of a truck today that said this.

Jesus Landscaping
"Let us resurrect your garden."

I got it on my cell phone lol

397 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:26:55pm

re: #396 marjoriemoon

LMAO!

398 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:27:13pm

re: #396 marjoriemoon

That's kind of on the line, for me.

399 Racer X  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:27:16pm
400 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:27:16pm

re: #391 brookly red

They usually settle down after one or two though - Palin has made it her reison'detre................ she started as she meant to go on.

401 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:27:29pm

re: #392 prairiefire

Hi, snoozy! thanks for being the first lizard who ever talked to me!

Was I really? I won't make that mistake twice.
/teasing

402 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:27:49pm

re: #381 Basho

I don't know exactly why the 3rd world nations have been making a big fuss about this climate conference, but I say that if they want their opinions heard they better make real efforts to keep their population growth under control.

that's how despots make their money...exploded populations is money in the bank

403 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:28:03pm

re: #401 Slumbering Behemoth

Har! Ahh, you already have.

404 Vicious Babushka  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:28:24pm

re: #393 Sharmuta

Welcome back!

I was only away from LGF during my party, and the time it took to go to the airport, flight time, and drive home.

Oh, and quality time spent with the grandbabies.

And the party never ends! I came home and my son from Canada is here with his family!

405 Kruk  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:28:37pm

re: #396 marjoriemoon

I kid you not. I was in back of a truck today that said this.

Jesus Landscaping
"Let us resurrect your garden."

I got it on my cell phone lol

On a van owned by a couple of plumbers from the Sub-Continent:

"If you've had enough of cowboys, call the Indians."

406 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:28:58pm

re: #389 SanFranciscoZionist

What's "cheka" mean?

407 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:29:17pm

re: #387 Sharmuta

I have bigger concerns about Palin than her headwear.

no kidding

408 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:29:39pm

No wait, I got it wrong. (I just looked at it)

Jesus Landscaping
"Let us bring your garden back to life."

Even better!

409 Vicious Babushka  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:29:40pm

re: #381 Basho

I don't know exactly why the 3rd world nations have been making a big fuss about this climate conference, but I say that if they want their opinions heard they better make real efforts to keep their population growth under control.

It won't be long now before I become take over my very own 3rd world country.

410 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:29:50pm

re: #404 Alouette

Oh, and quality time spent with the grandbabies.

That's the most important part. :)

411 Vicious Babushka  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:30:03pm

re: #406 prairiefire

What's "cheka" mean?

Lenin's secret police.

412 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:30:31pm

re: #400 wozzablog

They usually settle down after one or two though - Palin has made it her reison'detre... she started as she meant to go on.

look, back stabbing is the poor man's under the bus... (/rotating title?)

413 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:30:53pm

re: #404 Alouette

I was only away from LGF during my party, and the time it took to go to the airport, flight time, and drive home.

Oh, and quality time spent with the grandbabies.

And the party never ends! I came home and my son from Canada is here with his family!

Merry Christmas! Or Happy Hanukkah! Whichever works for you.

414 BARACK THE VOTE  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:31:37pm

re: #391 brookly red

political & backstabbing? Oh my ... please do not be offended if I say that I find you naive, a little, sometimes..

No offense taken. I expect opportunism and cutthroat behaviour in politics, but Palin genuinely has made backstabbing her entire career motif, from her first political mentor to her own mother-in-law.

And let's not forget that she ditched the governor's office in midterm, all the while claiming it was the fault of the mean wiberals that she was running out on her job -- portraying herself as Selfless Saint Sarah, Martyr of Wasilla.

Her particular level of ruthlessness stands out even for a politician.

415 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:31:42pm

re: #398 prairiefire

That's kind of on the line, for me.

We have a lot of businesses like that in Miami. Jesus Saves Motors (used cars), there's a few of those along that line. So it's not unusual to see the references, but this was by far the most interesting.

416 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:31:57pm

re: #412 brookly red

true - but not every politician has a reputation for it that is as well deserved as hers ;-)

417 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:32:07pm

re: #412 brookly red

look, back stabbing is the poor man's under the bus... (/rotating title?)

switchblades are cheaper than busses...I'm in for it

418 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:33:36pm

re: #415 marjoriemoon

We have a lot of businesses like that in Miami. Jesus Saves Motors (used cars), there's a few of those along that line. So it's not unusual to see the references, but this was by far the most interesting.

I should probably clarify. The businesses of I've seen like that are in Little Haiti.

419 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:34:08pm

re: #287 Charles

Anyone who can listen to all the Copenhagen speeches without going completely insane with boredom deserves a medal.

The UN could use a few Hollywood producers among the bureaucrat drones who organize these events. This is lethal.

The premise is the same as congressional budget floor debate: Last one awake gets to keep all the money.

420 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:34:13pm

how can someone as stupid and insipid as Palin be so threatening and ruthless?....it must be the perspective needs to be nuanced

421 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:34:54pm

re: #417 albusteve

switchblades are cheaper than busses...I'm in for it

and a much smaller carbon footprint too

422 Vicious Babushka  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:34:56pm

re: #413 Slumbering Behemoth

Merry Christmas! Or Happy Hanukkah! Whichever works for you.

I was at (one of) my son's house when his kids opened up their Hanukkah presents. My granddaughters got a Little Da Vinci art set with oil paints, pastels, watercolors, markers, pencils, the whole works. And a Play-Dough "outdoor grill" set which can make realistic-looking miniature burgers, chicken, spaghetti, hot dogs, etc. And something called "Imaginarium Marble Race" which requires a PhD in Mechanical Engineering to assemble.

Anyway my son assembled it all by himself. I told him that now he can apply for a job at NASA.

423 Spare O'Lake  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:36:25pm

re: #365 Charles

I don't believe her at all on this.

It's a minor issue, but to claim that this wasn't deliberate doesn't pass the smell test. I think she can probably afford a new baseball cap after quitting the governor's job to make millions on a speaking tour.

She's frugal.

424 Ayeless in Ghazi  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:36:36pm

Chavez’s blind spot on climate change

....

The irony– which I’m sure some people will miss and others with deliberately ignore– is that Chavez is in charge of the world’s fourth largest oil producer, the state-owned PDVSA.

You know, oil. Black gold, Texas tea. As in fossil fuel, as in leading cause of greenhouse gas emissions, as in the resource on which the Venezuelan economy almost solely depends and which has enabled Chavez to tighten his grip on power over the past 10 years.

There’s a fuller account of Chavez’s speech on the pro-Chavez Venezuelanalysis.com. I can find no evidence that he acknowledged Venezuela’s utter dependence on exports of oil– or that he has thought about Venezuela’s future in a less oil-dependent world.

[Link: www.hurryupharry.org...]

425 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:37:36pm

re: #385 SanFranciscoZionist

Of course, China has done just that, and no one in the West is too happy about it. Fine line there.

The "one child" rule is not a fine line; it's a bottomless moral abyss, which I pray we never fall on the wrong side of.

426 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:38:06pm

re: #420 albusteve

the constituencys involved have been very small so far - editorial board of the Nationa Review for the VP pick, half a dozen GOPers in Alaska on her side before her Gubernatorial run and who eventually did the leg work.

It's her personality/charisma that gets people on her side - i really don't know how effective she is personally at mass working.

Her PAC managed to hack off most of the congressional GOP over some dinner or another when she was on again/off again and ended up doing some pissant farmstores opening in Duluth or somewhere.

427 Ayeless in Ghazi  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:38:19pm

re: #423 Spare O'Lake

She's frugal.

She has a history of frugality when it comes to clothes?

428 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:38:50pm

re: #420 albusteve

Because the lie the left loves is that she is some big scary GOP contender. I think they know better. They also know how useful a foil she is. Again. And Again. All the Tea Party lunacy plays directly into their hands with all but the bible belt fundamentalist votes.

Good lightning rod, crappy speaker, failed governor and VP candidate, hypocrite extraordinaire, so of course she must be a major GOP leader.

429 freetoken  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:39:01pm

re: #424 Jimmah

None of the OPEC countries own up to their role in AGW.

430 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:39:18pm

re: #414 iceweasel

No offense taken. I expect opportunism and cutthroat behaviour in politics, but Palin genuinely has made backstabbing her entire career motif, from her first political mentor to her own mother-in-law.

And let's not forget that she ditched the governor's office in midterm, all the while claiming it was the fault of the mean wiberals that she was running out on her job -- portraying herself as Selfless Saint Sarah, Martyr of Wasilla.

Her particular level of ruthlessness stands out even for a politician.

Ruthless is what ruthless does... all pols sux.

431 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:39:24pm

re: #406 prairiefire

What's "cheka" mean?

Secret police--back before the KGB was founded. Still used colloquially.

432 Vicious Babushka  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:39:36pm

re: #427 Jimmah

She has a history of frugality when it comes to clothes?

She didn't buy that designer wardrobe she wore during the campaign, it went on the GOP's tab.

433 BARACK THE VOTE  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:39:58pm

re: #423 Spare O'Lake

She's frugal.

No, she isn't.

According to Carney, the newly elected mayor spent more than $50,000 in city funds to redecorate her office, without the council's authorization.

"I thought it was an outrageous expense, especially for someone who had run as a budget cutter," said Carney. "It was also illegal, because Sarah had not received the council's approval."

This hat thing is a minor kerfuffle, but it wasn't an accident and it wasn't because she's 'frugal'.

434 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:40:50pm

re: #414 iceweasel

Her particular level of ruthlessness stands out even for a politician.

Her particular level of clutzy, bridge-burning ruthlessness, I would say.

435 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:40:59pm

re: #405 Kruk

On a van owned by a couple of plumbers from the Sub-Continent:

"If you've had enough of cowboys, call the Indians."

Or the sign at the auto radiator shop: A great place to take a leak!"

436 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:41:27pm

re: #428 Rightwingconspirator

Because the lie the left loves is that she is some big scary GOP contender. I think they know better. They also know how useful a foil she is. Again. And Again. All the Tea Party lunacy plays directly into their hands with all but the bible belt fundamentalist votes.

Good lightning rod, crappy speaker, failed governor and VP candidate, hypocrite extraordinaire, so of course she must be a major GOP leader.

I love her...she shoots wolves from helicopters, my kinda man

437 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:41:40pm

re: #428 Rightwingconspirator

Because the lie the left loves is that she is some big scary GOP contender. I think they know better. They also know how useful a foil she is. Again. And Again. All the Tea Party lunacy plays directly into their hands with all but the bible belt fundamentalist votes.

Good lightning rod, crappy speaker, failed governor and VP candidate, hypocrite extraordinaire, so of course she must be a major GOP leader.

Quite Concur.

438 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:41:46pm

re: #425 The Sanity Inspector

I had to up that. China was the ultimate bedroom dictatorship with that rule.

439 Bingo.Long  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:41:52pm

Ain't much milk of human kindness in CN's movies, either. But wasn't Mary married to Joseph? Who would know it was "out-of-wedlock" except the two of them? And how does CN manage to place Mary into the age of plastics without supplying her with an IUD? Is he implying that Mary wouldn't've been responsible enough to take the measures available to protect one against getting pregnant if God should find her irresistible? Certainly Zeus "took" enough mortals in his time to make such a possibility worth guarding against...

440 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:42:02pm

re: #428 Rightwingconspirator

Because the lie the left loves is that she is some big scary GOP contender. I think they know better...

Well, ya know, you would think that. Then she got to running for the #2 spot and all bets were off.

441 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:42:25pm

re: #436 albusteve

I love her...she shoots wolves from helicopters, my kinda man

That's why Cato hates her, too.

442 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:42:31pm

OPEC has released an official statement regarding climate change:

Draconian population reduction measures are very important to the globalist elites (Bilderbergs, Trilateralists, and CFR).

443 albusteve  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:42:47pm

re: #433 iceweasel

This hat thing is a minor kerfuffle, but it wasn't an accident and it wasn't because she's 'frugal'.

MO wears $450 Air Jordans...so what?...(maybe she got them on sale)

444 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:43:04pm

re: #420 albusteve

how can someone as stupid and insipid as Palin be so threatening and ruthless?...it must be the perspective needs to be nuanced

the same way Bush was a moron & an evil genius...

445 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:43:10pm

re: #428 Rightwingconspirator

Because the lie the left loves is that she is some big scary GOP contender. I think they know better. They also know how useful a foil she is. Again. And Again. All the Tea Party lunacy plays directly into their hands with all but the bible belt fundamentalist votes.

Good lightning rod, crappy speaker, failed governor and VP candidate, hypocrite extraordinaire, so of course she must be a major GOP leader.

I think we partly want to build her up for those reasons, and partly, we're developing a horrified sense that she really might try to run.

446 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:44:09pm
447 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:45:15pm

re: #432 Alouette

She didn't buy that designer wardrobe she wore during the campaign, it went on the GOP's tab.

It would have played better for her to turn it down, and shop at Macy's, but suspect that was the McCain campaign's error at least as much as hers. Clothes is a tough thing for a woman on campaign. A man can have three suits, twelve shirts and six ties, and nothing can go wrong. There is no equivalent female wardrobe.

448 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:45:53pm

re: #440 marjoriemoon

Sure, but all that was before the bigger fails. I refer to the upcoming election season. I admit she may prove a to be a good fund raiser, but that's about it now. An icon of idiocy is just not helpful. :)

449 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:46:19pm

re: #446 Slumbering Behemoth

Geez, I had to put up with Cracked because Mad wasn't distributed in my town growing up.

450 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:46:42pm

re: #428 Rightwingconspirator

Because the lie the left loves is that she is some big scary GOP contender. I think they know better. They also know how useful a foil she is. Again. And Again. All the Tea Party lunacy plays directly into their hands with all but the bible belt fundamentalist votes.

Good lightning rod, crappy speaker, failed governor and VP candidate, hypocrite extraordinaire, so of course she must be a major GOP leader.

Well, being the veep nominee is pretty major. She may be a one-hit wonder, but she's not to be ignored, at least not yet.

451 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:46:59pm

re: #262 Jadespring

re: #265 Decatur Deb

"I don't give an iota."

P. S. Wasn't harshing your explanation. The iota quote originates in the debates about divinity that you described.

452 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:48:04pm

'Nite, All.

453 Spare O'Lake  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:48:21pm

re: #425 The Sanity Inspector

The "one child" rule is not a fine line; it's a bottomless moral abyss, which I pray we never fall on the wrong side of.

I must disagree.
Most acknowledge that China had become grossly and unsustainably overpopulated and headed for disaster, and that for the sake of their own people they had to take steps to reduce the population in the most humane way possible. Do you know of a better way?
If the US were ever to be in the same position, what would be preferable - survival of the fittest?

454 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:49:12pm

re: #452 Decatur Deb

Have a good night.

455 BryanS  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:49:49pm

re: #444 brookly red

the same way Bush was a moron & an evil genius...

Very true. What she lacks in specific facts and knowledge of on issue, she makes up for in political savvy. Her "death panels" quip was so stupid, it was genius. It was stupid because it was hyperbole at best, and at worst an outright lie. It was genius because it provided a symbol--a sort of metonymy--for the fears of the average American who distrusts big government involvement in their lives. She keeps doing this, successfully. I would not misunderestimate Palin like so many did with Bush.

456 Jadespring  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:50:22pm

re: #451 Decatur Deb

re: #265 Decatur Deb

P. S. Wasn't harshing your explanation. The iota quote originates in the debates about divinity that you described.

No prob. I figured that it had something to do with it. Meant to ask actually but got distracted. Now I know!

457 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:50:25pm

re: #449 prairiefire

Cracked went out of print publication some years back, and is now strictly online. MAD, well MAD just sucks now.

458 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:51:02pm

re: #445 SanFranciscoZionist

You should hope so. I could be so wrong and really get busted here in a year or two, but if she runs its a primary fail. Or a Tea Party Fail. I just can not see a big win for her electorally. Alaska congress? Maybe. Alaska Senate? I doubt it.

Winning Presidential? (insert long raspberry sound here)

I just can not see it.

459 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:51:20pm

re: #436 albusteve

I love her...she shoots wolves from helicopters, my kinda man

Kerry shot pesants from boats...

460 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:51:48pm

re: #450 The Sanity Inspector

No I would not suggest ignoring her. Nor Newt.

461 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:52:06pm

re: #457 Slumbering Behemoth

Haven't read it for a long time.

462 BryanS  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:52:51pm

re: #453 Spare O'Lake

I must disagree.
Most acknowledge that China had become grossly and unsustainably overpopulated and headed for disaster, and that for the sake of their own people they had to take steps to reduce the population in the most humane way possible. Do you know of a better way?
If the US were ever to be in the same position, what would be preferable - survival of the fittest?

A policy disincentivising more than one child is one thing. A policy of forced abortions is altogether different.

463 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:53:10pm

re: #459 brookly red

Kerry shot pesants from boats...

In 'Nam??

464 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:53:17pm

re: #453 Spare O'Lake

I must disagree.
Most acknowledge that China had become grossly and unsustainably overpopulated and headed for disaster, and that for the sake of their own people they had to take steps to reduce the population in the most humane way possible. Do you know of a better way?
If the US were ever to be in the same position, what would be preferable - survival of the fittest?

Not really sure about how humanely they went about it. Forced sterilization and forced abortion, panicked parents leaving children in dumpsters. Not sure there is any good way to go about population control. Except through contraception.

465 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:54:50pm

re: #462 BryanS

A policy disincentivising more than one child is one thing. A policy of forced abortions is altogether different.

Well, most scholars agree it saved China. And besides, they still got a billion people crammed in there.

466 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:55:02pm

re: #453 Spare O'Lake

If the US were ever to be in the same position, what would be preferable - survival of the fittest?

One word:

THUNDERDOME!
/

467 Spare O'Lake  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:55:53pm

re: #433 iceweasel

This hat thing is a minor kerfuffle, but it wasn't an accident and it wasn't because she's 'frugal'.

She does indeed appear to have been frugal with her own funds.
There is no reason to doubt her explanation, especially if you believe she is a bit short on brains.

468 avanti  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:56:36pm

O.T. movie, NYT Avatar review is in.

link...

469 BARACK THE VOTE  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:59:09pm

re: #458 Rightwingconspirator

You should hope so. I could be so wrong and really get busted here in a year or two, but if she runs its a primary fail. Or a Tea Party Fail. I just can not see a big win for her electorally. Alaska congress? Maybe. Alaska Senate? I doubt it.

Winning Presidential? (insert long raspberry sound here)

I just can not see it.

I don't see her winning. I'm not even convinced she'd run-- she likes attention but seems to have zero to no interest in actually governing. She likes celebrity.
I'm not worried Palin is going to become president. I do find her worrying, because I think she represents (and panders to) some extremely disturbing political currents in the electorate.

It's kind of like with Glenn Beck. Do I think the majority of Americans are getting their news from him, or that he'll be winning awards for journalistic excellence? No. Am I very disturbed by him? Yes.

470 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:59:14pm

re: #465 Basho

So the end justifies the means? Not in my view.

471 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:59:36pm

re: #468 avanti

O.T. movie, NYT Avatar review is in.

link...

Hot Air went berserk over this movie's supposedly left wing message. I think their exact words went something like this:


Draconian population reduction measures are very important to the globalist elites (Bilderbergs, Trilateralists, and CFR).
472 BryanS  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 7:59:36pm

re: #465 Basho

Well, most scholars agree it saved China. And besides, they still got a billion people crammed in there.

I would think that regardless of one's position on abortion rights, every side can agree that whether you consider the rights of the woman over her own body or the rights of the potential life, forced abortions and sterilization are an unacceptable infringement on human rights and dignity. Defending that policy by rationalizing a greater good is reprehensible.

473 BARACK THE VOTE  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:00:29pm

re: #467 Spare O'Lake

She does indeed appear to have been frugal with her own funds.
There is no reason to doubt her explanation, especially if you believe she is a bit short on brains.

There is no reason to believe this was about frugality or being incognito.

474 Gus  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:01:13pm

re: #429 freetoken

None of the OPEC countries own up to their role in AGW.

It was entertaining to say the least to hear Hugo Chavez talk about "contra el modelo destructivo del capitalismo" while he sits on one of the largest oil and gas reserves in South America and the world. Imports of crude oil from Venezuela to the US in 2008 was 435,029,000 barrels.

Citgo, which is a Venezuelan company, with its headquarters in Houston, Texas had a revenue of 32,000,000,000 dollars in 2004. And according to CFR oil generate approximately 80% of their export revenue. Chavez must think he's talking to his ignorant masses when he speaks in those neo-socialist populist terms.

475 BryanS  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:01:50pm

re: #469 iceweasel

I don't see her winning. I'm not even convinced she'd run-- she likes attention but seems to have zero to no interest in actually governing. She likes celebrity.
I'm not worried Palin is going to become president. I do find her worrying, because I think she represents (and panders to) some extremely disturbing political currents in the electorate.

It's kind of like with Glenn Beck. Do I think the majority of Americans are getting their news from him, or that he'll be winning awards for journalistic excellence? No. Am I very disturbed by him? Yes.

I think you are right here--I see her more as attempting to be the deal maker rather than policy maker. She'll influence/interfere in elections like she did in the New York congressional election this year.

476 Sharmuta  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:01:57pm

re: #463 Basho

In 'Nam??

Cambodia. ///

477 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:02:04pm

re: #470 Rightwingconspirator

So the end justifies the means? Not in my view.

They wanted to send America a million women during the 70's. Refusing this offer may have been our biggest foreign mistake ever.

478 laZardo  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:02:08pm

If Mary had Obamacare, Chuck Norris would have reached in and pulled Jesus out himself.

/it's Chuck Norris facts, it's supposed to be observed.

480 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:02:19pm

re: #453 Spare O'Lake

I must disagree.
Most acknowledge that China had become grossly and unsustainably overpopulated and headed for disaster, and that for the sake of their own people they had to take steps to reduce the population in the most humane way possible. Do you know of a better way?
If the US were ever to be in the same position, what would be preferable - survival of the fittest?

Most developed societies have had their native populations level off by themselves. The correlation between rising affluence and falling birth rates is familiar, I trust. Had China spent the last 60 years as a free, open, capitalistic society, it would've followed much the same pattern. No government ownership of the nation's wombs, not so many orphanages filled with unwanted female children, not so much female infanticide, less sex-specific elective abortions, no tens of millions of excess males.

During Mao's lifetime, he encouraged population growth--when he wasn't doing away with sizable chunks of the peasantry & intelligentsia, that is. So China's one child policy is evil and was avoidable.

481 laZardo  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:02:31pm

re: #478 laZardo

/it's Chuck Norris facts, it's supposed to be observed.absurd.

PIMF

/P for pronunciation.

482 Racer X  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:03:53pm
483 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:03:54pm

re: #453 Spare O'Lake

I must disagree.
Most acknowledge that China had become grossly and unsustainably overpopulated and headed for disaster, and that for the sake of their own people they had to take steps to reduce the population in the most humane way possible. Do you know of a better way?
If the US were ever to be in the same position, what would be preferable - survival of the fittest?

In brief: the "most humane way" would have been for the communists to leave the scene.

484 laZardo  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:04:10pm

re: #453 Spare O'Lake

If the US were ever to be in the same position, what would be preferable - survival of the fittest?

Battle Royale was a cool movie. I even took part in a BR-themed roleplaying forum named "Survival of the Fittest." :D

485 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:04:45pm

laters all.

486 Charles Johnson  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:04:56pm

re: #467 Spare O'Lake

She does indeed appear to have been frugal with her own funds.
There is no reason to doubt her explanation, especially if you believe she is a bit short on brains.

Yes, there is abundant reason to doubt her explanation, because she's already demonstrated many times over that she's a liar who doesn't hesitate to pander to the lowest common denominator of the GOP base. And that's exactly what she did here.

Again, it's a minor issue. But if you think the best way for her to remain unnoticed is to show up on a beach in Hawaii wearing a baseball cap with John McCain's name blatantly, obviously crossed out with magic marker, you're being exceedingly gullible.

She wanted this to be seen, and it was. And now she's playing dumb about it.

487 laZardo  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:04:57pm

re: #485 wozzablog

Laters, man.

488 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:05:37pm

China has a sixth of the world's population......

489 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:05:54pm

re: #469 iceweasel
I can agree with that. Keeping an eye on that entire movement is well worth the effort. Someday there may again be a place in the right for sensible small gov/fiscal conservatives that keep religion at home. I have to keep watching so I'll see that happen. Obviously Not This Week though!

490 laZardo  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:06:24pm

re: #488 Basho

China has a sixth of the world's population...

Plus India, makes it more than a third.

491 Lidane  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:06:35pm

re: #453 Spare O'Lake


If the US were ever to be in the same position, what would be preferable - survival of the fittest?

re: #464 marjoriemoon

Not sure there is any good way to go about population control. Except through contraception.

Easily accessible, affordable contraception that was covered by health insurance and real, thorough sex education in schools, starting at a young age (i.e., none of that "abstinence only" nonsense, but REAL information for people) would both go a long way, I think.

492 BryanS  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:08:08pm

re: #477 Basho

They wanted to send America a million women during the 70's. Refusing this offer may have been our biggest foreign mistake ever.

Are you secretly a despotic dictator? Just trying to see where you are coming from justifying such a brutal policy.

493 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:08:08pm

re: #477 Basho

Well we were absorbing millions from our own hemisphere at the time. A million more? Ouch.

494 BARACK THE VOTE  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:08:13pm

re: #475 BryanS

I think you are right here--I see her more as attempting to be the deal maker rather than policy maker. She'll influence/interfere in elections like she did in the New York congressional election this year.

That's my guess. She's dead in the water as a candidate, but she can pull crowds, fundraise, and meddle. Posting on facebook and keeping herself in the spotlight is her thing.

And lying.

495 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:08:13pm

re: #486 Charles

Yes, there is abundant reason to doubt her explanation, because she's already demonstrated many times over that she's a liar who doesn't hesitate to pander to the lowest common denominator of the GOP base. And that's exactly what she did here.

Again, it's a minor issue. But if you think the best way for her to remain unnoticed is to show up on a beach in Hawaii wearing a baseball cap with John McCain's name blatantly, obviously crossed out with magic marker, you're being exceedingly gullible.

She wanted this to be seen, and it was. And now she's playing dumb about it.

hehe... not to mention she's got Todd there in his swim trunks, Willow in her bathing suit and toddler Trig. Now just WHO could that woman be in the dark glasses and cap?? It's a mystery!

496 laZardo  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:08:27pm

re: #491 Lidane

thorough sex education in schools, starting at a young age

Kindergarten?

/lol, south park

497 Vicious Babushka  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:09:00pm

re: #464 marjoriemoon

Not really sure about how humanely they went about it. Forced sterilization and forced abortion, panicked parents leaving children in dumpsters. Not sure there is any good way to go about population control. Except through VOLUNTARY contraception.

FTFY

498 webevintage  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:09:09pm

Some people have way too much time on their hands....

[Link: wonkette.com...]

499 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:09:36pm

re: #493 Rightwingconspirator

Well we were absorbing millions from our own hemisphere at the time. A million more? Ouch.

Yeah but strictly Chinese women would have been totally worth it.

500 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:10:34pm

re: #457 Slumbering Behemoth

Cracked went out of print publication some years back, and is now strictly online. MAD, well MAD just sucks now.

They recently went from monthly to quarterly. They said that, since so many people were complaining that only every third issue was funny, they would just publish that one from now on.

501 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:10:54pm

Hey Lizards!

Well, Chuck Norris falls under the "Brawn, not Brain" category.

How are you-all and what are we talking about?

502 Lidane  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:11:01pm

re: #496 laZardo

Kindergarten?

/lol, south park

Heh. I actually knew someone who got offended by South Park making fun of Steve Irwin right after his death, but they completely ignored the episode where Ike was sleeping with his teacher. I laughed at them when they got all pissy.

503 laZardo  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:11:58pm

re: #501 ggt

Hey Lizards!

Well, Chuck Norris falls under the "Brawn, not Brain" category.

How are you-all and what are we talking about?

CHUUUCK NORRRIIISSS.

/ O:

504 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:12:55pm

re: #460 Rightwingconspirator

No I would not suggest ignoring her. Nor Newt.

Newt's a spent force.

505 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:12:57pm

re: #493 Rightwingconspirator

Well we were absorbing millions from our own hemisphere at the time. A million more? Ouch.

/racist!

506 Spare O'Lake  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:13:52pm

re: #474 Gus 802

It was entertaining to say the least to hear Hugo Chavez talk about "contra el modelo destructivo del capitalismo" while he sits on one of the largest oil and gas reserves in South America and the world. Imports of crude oil from Venezuela to the US in 2008 was 435,029,000 barrels.

Citgo, which is a Venezuelan company, with its headquarters in Houston, Texas had a revenue of 32,000,000,000 dollars in 2004. And according to CFR oil generate approximately 80% of their export revenue. Chavez must think he's talking to his ignorant masses when he speaks in those neo-socialist populist terms.

I wonder if Copenhagen has been an eye-opener for Obama concerning the effectiveness of his kumbaya foreign policy. I hope he gets the message that much of the developing and third world seethes at the US with hatred and jealousy even while they treat her as a big, fat cash cow to milk ad infinitum.

507 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:14:29pm

re: #504 The Sanity Inspector

Ugh, I'm going to have to wash my brain out after that mental image!

508 JamesWI  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:14:41pm

re: #420 albusteve

how can someone as stupid and insipid as Palin be so threatening and ruthless?...it must be the perspective needs to be nuanced

As to the threatening part, it's because there's a chance, even as miniscule as it is, that she could actually lead this country. That's why I love when places like hotair talk about how "scared" "liberals" are of Palin. We aren't scared because we think she's the best Republican candidatte, we're scared that there are enough stupid people who eat up every word she says, that someone so ignorant could possibly become the leader of the free world

509 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:15:36pm

re: #458 Rightwingconspirator

You should hope so. I could be so wrong and really get busted here in a year or two, but if she runs its a primary fail. Or a Tea Party Fail. I just can not see a big win for her electorally. Alaska congress? Maybe. Alaska Senate? I doubt it.

Winning Presidential? (insert long raspberry sound here)

I just can not see it.

Nor I. I think a lot of Democrats would like to see her come back just to take another licking, but the truth of the matter is that if the GOP gets into a better place it will be beter for the country, and even for the Democrats.

She cannot win the presidency. I'm almost sure she can't win a Republican primary. It's time for this silliness to be over.

Alaska elections, I guess I'll leave to Alaska, but I wouldn't vote for her, not after the quitting midstream thing.

510 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:16:02pm

re: #459 brookly red

Kerry shot pesants from boats...

TFK? Is that you?

511 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:16:43pm

re: #491 Lidane

Easily accessible, affordable contraception that was covered by health insurance and real, thorough sex education in schools, starting at a young age (i.e., none of that "abstinence only" nonsense, but REAL information for people) would both go a long way, I think.

I used to think so too. But reality is that teenagers won't think, regardless. Unless we find a way to inject them with long-term birth control (as soon as they (girls) are fertile) without violating their civil rights, they will continue to have babies--whether abortion is free and available or not.

512 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:16:55pm

re: #491 Lidane

Easily accessible, affordable contraception that was covered by health insurance and real, thorough sex education in schools, starting at a young age (i.e., none of that "abstinence only" nonsense, but REAL information for people) would both go a long way, I think.

About the best that can be said for sex education is that it isn't a complete solution. We've had it in schools for a few generations now, and just look at our teen birthrate over that time.

513 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:18:30pm

re: #482 Racer X

Hey that thing works.
Got me to my hoppy microbrew Pale Ales. Drinking Sierra Nevada now as it so happens.

514 BryanS  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:18:46pm

re: #509 SanFranciscoZionist

Nor I. I think a lot of Democrats would like to see her come back just to take another licking, but the truth of the matter is that if the GOP gets into a better place it will be beter for the country, and even for the Democrats.

She cannot win the presidency. I'm almost sure she can't win a Republican primary. It's time for this silliness to be over.

Alaska elections, I guess I'll leave to Alaska, but I wouldn't vote for her, not after the quitting midstream thing.

I think this would be true for many. She would be vulnerable to the charge of being a flake. Doesn't mean she can't make a lot of money being a conservative darling and pushing her issues.

515 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:19:18pm

re: #504 The Sanity Inspector

As an idea man or fundraiser? Not so sure.

516 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:19:26pm

re: #465 Basho

Well, most scholars agree it saved China. And besides, they still got a billion people crammed in there.

I despise the policy. But someone was talking about fearmongering prediction here the other day, and mentioned that China was supposed to have an uncontrolled population explosion, and be starving by now. The fact that they aren't owes something to taking drastic action on population control.

A free society can't do such a thing. I think the only good society is a free society. At this point I come full circle. I don't know how to judge.

517 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:19:59pm

re: #471 Basho

That loony comment has come up so many times on this thread it ought to be made a rotating title.

518 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:20:52pm

re: #473 iceweasel

There is no reason to believe this was about frugality or being incognito.

I have to say that while I love dishing on Sarah Palin, I cannot bring myself to care about her hat.

519 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:20:58pm

re: #512 The Sanity Inspector

Reminds me of illicit drug education.
Not Quite The Solution.

520 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:21:41pm

re: #506 Spare O'Lake

I wonder if Copenhagen has been an eye-opener for Obama concerning the effectiveness of his kumbaya foreign policy. I hope he gets the message that much of the developing and third world seethes at the US with hatred and jealousy even while they treat her as a big, fat cash cow to milk ad infinitum.

Anyone who has teenagers in the home knows the feeling.

521 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:22:41pm

re: #477 Basho

They wanted to send America a million women during the 70's. Refusing this offer may have been our biggest foreign mistake ever.

Instead, all my friends are adopting the children of those women. (In twenty years, the Bay Area Jewish community is going to be significantly more Chinese than it was twenty years ago.)

522 brookly red  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:23:01pm

re: #510 SanFranciscoZionist

TFK? Is that you?

just channeling :)

523 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:23:25pm

re: #516 SanFranciscoZionist


A free society can't do such a thing. I think the only good society is a free society. At this point I come full circle. I don't know how to judge.

I don't know how to judge either. So I won't. I wasn't in their shoes. This isn't a black or white issue.

524 Lidane  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:23:31pm

re: #512 The Sanity Inspector

About the best that can be said for sex education is that it isn't a complete solution. We've had it in schools for a few generations now, and just look at our teen birthrate over that time.

That's because what passes for sex education in schools these days is crap. Most of it offers incomplete information, or outright misinformation, or it's been hampered by the socons with all that "abstinence only" garbage.

If we had real sex education instead of pandering to the religious right, maybe we'd stand a chance at lowering the teen and out of wedlock birth rates, IMO.

525 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:23:41pm

re: #515 Rightwingconspirator

As an idea man or fundraiser? Not so sure.

As a viable candidate for higher office. He's still a capable talking head.

526 Spare O'Lake  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:24:28pm

re: #486 Charles

Yes, there is abundant reason to doubt her explanation, because she's already demonstrated many times over that she's a liar who doesn't hesitate to pander to the lowest common denominator of the GOP base. And that's exactly what she did here.

Again, it's a minor issue. But if you think the best way for her to remain unnoticed is to show up on a beach in Hawaii wearing a baseball cap with John McCain's name blatantly, obviously crossed out with magic marker, you're being exceedingly gullible.

She wanted this to be seen, and it was. And now she's playing dumb about it.

I obviously think she is a less shrewd and guileful than you do. And of course I do not think it was the best way for her to remain unnoticed - I just think that in this case she was caught being simple and cheap.
Gullible...ha!

527 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:25:39pm

re: #509 SanFranciscoZionist


Nor I. I think a lot of Democrats would like to see her come back just to take another licking...

Now just stop right there. We're talking about politics, not Larry Flint productions.
/

528 BryanS  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:26:05pm

re: #523 Basho

I don't know how to judge either. So I won't. I wasn't in their shoes. This isn't a black or white issue.

In a free society, we would enact other policies--taxes and other incentives to keep family size small. What China has done and is doing cannot be defended--or as SFZ points out, could not be done in a free society.

529 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:29:44pm

re: #516 SanFranciscoZionist

I despise the policy. But someone was talking about fearmongering prediction here the other day, and mentioned that China was supposed to have an uncontrolled population explosion, and be starving by now. The fact that they aren't owes something to taking drastic action on population control.

A free society can't do such a thing. I think the only good society is a free society. At this point I come full circle. I don't know how to judge.

It probably owes as much to China liberalizing their economy. Continuing to require 1.5 billion people to hoe beets on the People's Heroic Revolutionary Vanguard of the Masses collective farm would have been a prescription for starvation, for sure.

And it's easy to forget: China did have a catastrophic famine, maybe the biggest in history, caused by communist policies. Few remember, fewer care, and no one will ever be held accountable for it, which is a crying shame.

Sorry to bang on so much about this, but I utterly despise Mao, and the soft spot Western proggs have for him.

530 Basho  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:30:56pm

There's also an inverse relationship between population and freedom. The larger the population (relative to the amount of space available) the more restrictions on freedom there will be. China is certainly more free now than when they had an out of control population growth rate.

531 What, me worry?  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:32:58pm

re: #529 The Sanity Inspector

It probably owes as much to China liberalizing their economy. Continuing to require 1.5 billion people to hoe beets on the People's Heroic Revolutionary Vanguard of the Masses collective farm would have been a prescription for starvation, for sure.

And it's easy to forget: China did have a catastrophic famine, maybe the biggest in history, caused by communist policies. Few remember, fewer care, and no one will ever be held accountable for it, which is a crying shame.

Sorry to bang on so much about this, but I utterly despise Mao, and the soft spot Western proggs have for him.

I'm not expert on Chinese history, modern or ancient, but wouldn't it have been better to just expand their cities? I mean, instead of the one child rule. Most of China is country. I guess it would have taken longer and a lot more money, but would have been truly humane.

532 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:36:40pm

re: #529 The Sanity Inspector

I have no soft spot for that killer! I'm an intellectual subversive, the first ones he had hanging from the lamp posts. I have never heard another progressive speak well of him.

533 BryanS  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:39:26pm

re: #530 Basho

There's also an inverse relationship between population and freedom. The larger the population (relative to the amount of space available) the more restrictions on freedom there will be. China is certainly more free now than when they had an out of control population growth rate.

By that logic, India should not be getting freer. Yet it is. I disagree with the assertion that larger populations result in less freedom. North Korea hasn't gotten more free despite many of it's people starving to death.

534 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:41:04pm

re: #532 prairiefire

I have no soft spot for that killer! I'm an intellectual subversive, the first ones he had hanging from the lamp posts. I have never heard another progressive speak well of him.

You don't go back far enough, it seems. American leftists put down their Little Red Books and picked up their Free Tibet signs about the same time that Deng Xiao-ping introduced Western-style market reforms.

535 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:42:01pm

re: #534 The Sanity Inspector

You don't go back far enough, it seems. American leftists put down their Little Red Books and picked up their Free Tibet signs about the same time that Deng Xiao-ping introduced Western-style market reforms.

But there's still plenty that are fond of his memory, in the same way they are fond of the memory of their own vanished youth.

536 The Sanity Inspector  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:42:57pm

This is getting good, but I must wend my way bedward. 'Night, all.

537 prairiefire  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:43:03pm

Oy, Night, lizards. happy Friday!

538 soxfan4life  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:47:06pm

re: #524 Lidane

That's because what passes for sex education in schools these days is crap. Most of it offers incomplete information, or outright misinformation, or it's been hampered by the socons with all that "abstinence only" garbage.

If we had real sex education instead of pandering to the religious right, maybe we'd stand a chance at lowering the teen and out of wedlock birth rates, IMO.

What if we quit supporting all these young women with 4 kids by 4 different baby daddy's. Made life tougher than it is already, reality would be the best teacher.

539 Lidane  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:52:16pm

re: #538 soxfan4life

What if we quit supporting all these young women with 4 kids by 4 different baby daddy's. Made life tougher than it is already, reality would be the best teacher.

If those girls had gotten real sex ed in the first place, maybe they wouldn't have had 4 kids by 4 different fathers.

And what passes for sex ed in schools these days is still crap, whatever the reality of life is. It's ludicrous that we have one of the highest teen pregnancy rates in the developed world. You'd think we'd have better education and access to contraception than all that.

540 soxfan4life  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 8:58:55pm

re: #539 Lidane

If those girls had gotten real sex ed in the first place, maybe they wouldn't have had 4 kids by 4 different fathers.

And what passes for sex ed in schools these days is still crap, whatever the reality of life is. It's ludicrous that we have one of the highest teen pregnancy rates in the developed world. You'd think we'd have better education and access to contraception than all that.

And if we forced families to care for the children, the parents might parent their children and teach them rather than leave it to the school.

541 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 9:21:22pm

re: #540 soxfan4life

And if we forced families to care for the children, the parents might parent their children and teach them rather than leave it to the school.

Damn straight! That totally worked for Bristol Palin.
/oooh

542 mikhailtheplumber  Thu, Dec 17, 2009 10:11:16pm

Does someone have a useful link to read about the John Birch society? Their wikipedia page is... definitely mild.

543 sagehen  Fri, Dec 18, 2009 12:19:31am

re: #153 brookly red

it's a matter of how failed... I find it interesting that so many people from countries with "free" health care go outside the system, virtually everyone who has the means.

Kind of like how people in a country with "free" public schools some people still choose to pay thousands of dollars per year per kid for private school.

In cities with very fine police departments, some people still choose to pay for a home security system, or hire bodyguards, or live in a gated community with extra, privately funded security staff.

In places with excellent public transportation, taxpayer subsidized and low cost to the user, some people still choose to drive their own cars. Or be driven by someone else in even more expensive free-market alternatives (at least at some times of day, or when carrying heavy things.)

"Universal health care" isn't, and doesn't claim to be, top of the line ideal luxury freebies. There's just a minimum level that any nation that considers itself "civilized" can't stand to see their citizens not get. And a cost savings to the midline by pooling our resources and buying as a group. People who want, and can afford, above and beyond that -- are free to spend their own money on it.

544 idioma  Fri, Dec 18, 2009 12:56:40am

re: #20 avanti

If God was able to provide a immaculate conception, he could surely smite Planned Parenthood's attempts to interfere and if not, we'd all be Jews, still waiting for the Messiah.

A non issue...your Christian re-constructionist buddies would've stoned her to death for being pregnant out of wedlock.

545 BARACK THE VOTE  Fri, Dec 18, 2009 1:46:53am

re: #542 mikhailtheplumber

Does someone have a useful link to read about the John Birch society? Their wikipedia page is... definitely mild.

I'd start with the tagfinder here and read the articles posted here about their recent resurgence.

This is an excellent detailed history of the organisation.

546 idioma  Fri, Dec 18, 2009 2:11:18am

re: #538 soxfan4life

What if we quit supporting all these young women with 4 kids by 4 different baby daddy's. Made life tougher than it is already, reality would be the best teacher.

How very Christian of you!

547 idioma  Fri, Dec 18, 2009 2:12:54am

re: #540 soxfan4life

And if we forced families to care for the children, the parents might parent their children and teach them rather than leave it to the school.

Care to show an example of Modern Post-industrial nations which have met successful targets through this ideology?

You are embarrassing yourself right now.

548 idioma  Fri, Dec 18, 2009 2:14:39am

re: #542 mikhailtheplumber

Just read the non-sense on their homepage.

549 BARACK THE VOTE  Fri, Dec 18, 2009 3:30:20am

re: #538 soxfan4life

What if we quit supporting all these young women with 4 kids by 4 different baby daddy's. Made life tougher than it is already, reality would be the best teacher.

Yes, that ideology (Make life tougher for them!) has certainly worked out well in the past, hasn't it?
Plus it has the nice side benefit of punishing those children, too. That should show them.

550 Diane  Fri, Dec 18, 2009 8:31:43am

I like Chuck but could not careless about these "what if" questions on abortion. It is such a waste of time and brain cells.

(In any case, I think old Joseph was possibly very right wing while his handsome sons and Mary were possibly more lefty... as for Jesus, he possibly was torn in the middle, just my off topic humble take.)

551 zora  Fri, Dec 18, 2009 11:24:25am

[Link: www.themudflats.net...]

Who IS that?

You mean over there with Todd Palin and Piper and Trig?

Yeah, that mystery woman in the sunglasses…

Do you think that’s Sarah?

(squinting) Not sure… Let me get my other lens.

Yeah…I think it might be. She’s supposed to be in Hawaii with her family.

But we have to be sure!

Does it say anything on her visor?

I can’t make it out… Looks like she’s scribbled something out.

Dang. If we could only verify. I HATE when celebrities go incognito.

552 Pacific moderate  Fri, Dec 18, 2009 2:15:13pm

How many reading that would secretly wish that Chuck Norris's mother had had ObamaCare?

553 S.D.  Mon, Dec 21, 2009 2:59:46pm

Wow, How did I miss that?!?!

Whatever respect I had for Mr. Norris just went completely away...


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