On 60 Minutes last night, former John McCain campaign strategist Steve Schmidt went rogue, revealing that the McCain staff was very concerned that Sarah Palin’s debate with Joe Biden was going to be “a debacle of historic and epic proportions.”
And Palin couldn’t stop referring to Biden as “O’Biden.”
1 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:17:22pm |
And yet they picked her to be McCain’s running mate.
| 2 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:17:58pm |
re: #1 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
And yet they picked her to be McCain’s running mate.
and they didn’t lose by THAT much.
| 3 |
Four More Tears Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:18:00pm |
Ah, but who else could’ve “sent little starbursts through the screen?”
| 4 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:19:32pm |
Sarah Palin “not focused?”
Sarah Palin “not engaged?”
Sarah Palin relying on saying “O’Biden” and “Say it ain’t so, Joe” and a wink?
Never. Sarah is the bomb. She puts the shine in shinola. She puts the comma in comma, splice.
| 6 |
Charles Johnson Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:20:07pm |
re: #2 brookly red
and they didn’t lose by THAT much.
The final total of electoral votes: 365 Obama, 173 McCain.
That’s a landslide.
| 7 |
karmic_inquisitor Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:20:28pm |
Also, the book is reported to mention that McCain thought Lieberman would be his running mate up until 2 days before announcing Palin.
The right wing would have none of it (as anyone who heard Limbaugh go off on the idea at the time knew).
I wish he had had the stones to go through with it so that the civil war within the GOP would have happened there and then. Instead we get a long drawn out affair.
| 9 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:21:26pm |
re: #1 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
And yet they picked her to be McCain’s running mate.
That’s John McCain’s legacy. He had plenty of opportunity to admit he was pressured into taking her on as a running mate and because he didn’t want to look like the tool that he had become, he took full responsibility for unleashing her on America. I hope Cindy re-painted her plane to take his name off it…she’s still gotta be pissed.
| 10 |
Varek Raith Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:21:57pm |
| 11 |
Gus Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:22:07pm |
The fantasy Commander in Chief (Sarah Palin) couldn’t even handle the pressure of preparing for a national debate.
| 12 |
Ebetty Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:22:09pm |
Anyone who ever worked with Schmidt can tell you, he’s a solid guy. Good man. And former Gov. Palin was completely outclassed, outgunned, and outmaneuvered by him. She would have looked far more professional had she listened to Steve. She made a catastrophic political mistake in writing her ‘novel’ Going Rogue. If she ever wants to run for high office, shooting Steve Schmidt, Nicolle Wallace, Rick Davis and others in the (political) face was catastrophic. Even more so than all the crazy things she believes in.
| 13 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:22:39pm |
| 14 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:22:40pm |
| 15 |
freetoken Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:23:05pm |
One just needs to look at Palin’s facebook page to see the crowd to whom she is playing:
Robert Traut Please reconsider attending and speaking at CPAC in mid Feb. The John Birch Society is one of many organizations that are sponsoring this meeting. Why do you feel this org. is preventing you from attending this important gathering. I am going all the way there from Palmer. Wasilla to Wash. D.C is the same distance!!!!
Bob Traut, formerly of Kodiak(met you at Crabfest, we talked about your time in Skagway, i lived in Skagway in 75) now in Palmer
4 minutes ago
| 16 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:23:17pm |
| 18 |
recusancy Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:23:49pm |
| 19 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:24:47pm |
re: #8 brookly red
popular vote?
The Federal Election Commission has released its “2008 presidential popular vote summary for all candidates listed on at least one state ballot.” The results:
# Barack Obama (Democrat) 69,498,516 [52.93%]
# John McCain (Republican) 59,948,323 [45.65%]
That’s a large difference.
| 20 |
lawhawk Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:26:00pm |
An inexperienced backbencher becomes President and an inexperienced VP nominee is what caused McCain to lose in 2008?
It’s the economy (and being not Bush) that helped Obama win in 2008 along with McCain’s own missteps - including the economy mess. Obama was more hopey/changey than McCain’s maverickness could allow for.
The McCain people are looking for jobs for the 2010 and 2012 election cycles and this is yet another attempt to distance themselves from the 2008 debacle. Palin is a punching bag for the McCain people - and deservedly so in some cases, but at the same time they ought to look in the mirror themselves because it was their guy who ultimately chose Palin as a running mate.
| 21 |
Interesting Times Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:26:06pm |
re: #18 recusancy
Popular vote hu?
Sorry, too curious now not to ask - is there a reason you write “huh” as “hu”? Or is it some other Internet meme I’m not familiar with?
| 22 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:26:20pm |
re: #18 recusancy
Popular vote hu? I know. I wanted Gore too. That’s the past.
If Gore had won (and kept) Florida, he still wouldn’t be president today(term limits)…and we probably wouldn’t have invaded Iraq and benefitted from that miracle of forward thinking and all the blessings it has brought on our nation.
/
| 23 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:26:33pm |
re: #18 recusancy
Popular vote hu? I know. I wanted Gore too. That’s the past.
My point is that many millions of people did vote for the ticket although a losing ticket that is too many people to discount.
| 24 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:27:13pm |
re: #12 Ebetty
Anyone who ever worked with Schmidt can tell you, he’s a solid guy. Good man. And former Gov. Palin was completely outclassed, outgunned, and outmaneuvered by him. She would have looked far more professional had she listened to Steve. She made a catastrophic political mistake in writing her ‘novel’ Going Rogue. If she ever wants to run for high office, shooting Steve Schmidt, Nicolle Wallace, Rick Davis and others in the (political) face was catastrophic. Even more so than all the crazy things she believes in.
If you shoot someone in the face, they’re usually dead. It’s the part where you shoot them in the ass—they’re mad, and still quite functional…
| 26 |
recusancy Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:28:04pm |
re: #21 publicityStunted
Sorry, too curious now not to ask - is there a reason you write “huh” as “hu”? Or is it some other Internet meme I’m not familiar with?
I guess I meant the rhetorical huh. I just always type it hu.
| 27 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:28:20pm |
re: #21 publicityStunted
Sorry, too curious now not to ask - is there a reason you write “huh” as “hu”? Or is it some other Internet meme I’m not familiar with?
You’re not familiar with all Internet traditions?
| 28 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:28:41pm |
re: #20 lawhawk
Picking Palin as a running mate does a lot to show how poor McCain’s judgement is or how weak he is to have let himself be forced to name her. His presidential hopes are dead.
| 29 |
Interesting Times Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:28:52pm |
re: #24 SanFranciscoZionist
If you shoot someone in the face, they’re usually dead.
I can think of one person lucky enough to avoid that fate…
| 30 |
karmic_inquisitor Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:29:26pm |
FWIW, it would have been an electoral landslide with Palin or with Lieberman.
The entire Get Out The Vote operation for the GOP is firmly in the hands of the social conservatives. They have carved that out and own it, much of it originally organized through church groups in the late 80s.
That would have gone away with a Lieberman pick which would have given the field to Obama.
Picking Palin was meant to appease the wingers but they became the narrative while making their dislike of McCain always known (party unity is a one way street with SoCons and has been since 1992).
He would have lost either way - picking a SoCon light running mate would have been foiled because Obama had opposition research on all of them. Palin became a wild card and knocked Obama off guard for a couple of weeks. But as Palin talked the independents left the tent.
All that and many SoCons still stayed home because McCain wasn’t “conservative enough”.
Unfixable situation. The civil war within the party has to happen. Right now it looks like a coup regarding Steele.
| 31 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:29:26pm |
| 32 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:29:36pm |
| 33 |
Mad Al-Jaffee Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:30:17pm |
| 34 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:31:19pm |
| 35 |
MandyManners Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:31:24pm |
re: #30 karmic_inquisitor
FWIW, it would have been an electoral landslide with Palin or with Lieberman.
The entire Get Out The Vote operation for the GOP is firmly in the hands of the social conservatives. They have carved that out and own it, much of it originally organized through church groups in the late 80s.
That would have gone away with a Lieberman pick which would have given the field to Obama.
Picking Palin was meant to appease the wingers but they became the narrative while making their dislike of McCain always known (party unity is a one way street with SoCons and has been since 1992).
He would have lost either way - picking a SoCon light running mate would have been foiled because Obama had opposition research on all of them. Palin became a wild card and knocked Obama off guard for a couple of weeks. But as Palin talked the independents left the tent.
All that and many SoCons still stayed home because McCain wasn’t “conservative enough”.
Unfixable situation. The civil war within the party has to happen. Right now it looks like a coup regarding Steele.
I hope they’re fucking happy now.
| 36 |
lawhawk Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:32:11pm |
re: #32 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
The Terminator?
Mary Jo Buttafucco?
| 37 |
HoosierHoops Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:32:45pm |
re: #29 publicityStunted
I can think of one person lucky enough to avoid that fate…
Note to self: If Dick Cheney invites me to go hunting..bring a well-armed entourage along…
*If he shoots me in the face boys you hit him where it counts..The pacemaker*
/
| 38 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:33:07pm |
| 39 |
avanti Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:34:01pm |
| 41 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:34:17pm |
| 42 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:34:39pm |
| 43 |
Interesting Times Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:35:36pm |
re: #26 recusancy
I guess I meant the rhetorical huh. I just always type it hu.
It always makes me think of Hu Jintao. Which in turn makes me think me of this :)
| 44 |
avanti Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:35:40pm |
re: #15 freetoken
One just needs to look at Palin’s facebook page to see the crowd to whom she is playing:
Sarah not understanding the problem with the Birchers, speaks volumes.
| 45 |
Mad Al-Jaffee Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:36:08pm |
| 46 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:36:16pm |
| 47 |
karmic_inquisitor Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:36:21pm |
re: #35 MandyManners
I hope they’re fucking happy now.
I think they are.
They are going 12th imam on the coming apocalypse that their ODS lays out. They see Obama losing in 2010 and 2012 and the purge of the GOP will deliver a 12th imam like candidate of purity. The reincarnated Reagan. All that has to happen in the interim is sustained political and economic chaos.
Just as some leftists cheered on failure in the war in Iraq in 2006 we have wingnuts cheering the failure of the economy and security now.
Just as disgusting now as it was then.
| 48 |
freetoken Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:36:38pm |
re: #44 avanti
Her fan is entreating The Sarah to change her mind and attend. What he probably doesn’t realize is that she is not going not because of the JBS.
| 49 |
TampaKnight Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:36:41pm |
It’s a shame because I believe McCain would have truly been an awesome President.
| 50 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:38:56pm |
re: #8 brookly red
Since when did republicans give a damn about the popular vote?
“All Hail President Gore”
| 51 |
Locker Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:39:03pm |
re: #33 Mad Al-Jaffee
Daffy Duck
[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
Bugs: Would you like to shoot me now or wait till you get home.
Daffy: Shoot him now; shoot him now.
Bugs: You keep outta this, he doesn’t have to shoot you now.
Daffy: Hah! That’s it! Hold it right there! Pronoun trouble. It’s not “He doesn’t have to shoot you now”; it’s “He doesn’t have to shoot me now!”
Daffy: Well, I say he does have to shoot me now!! [to Elmer] So shoot me now!
[Elmer obliges and lets him have it.]
| 52 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:39:19pm |
re: #49 TampaKnight
It’s a shame because I believe McCain would have truly been an awesome President.
maybe, but he would not have had either house…
| 53 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:39:32pm |
re: #49 TampaKnight
It’s a shame because I believe McCain would have truly been an awesome President.
His track record led me to have low expectations.
| 54 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:39:38pm |
re: #49 TampaKnight
It’s a shame because I believe McCain would have truly been an awesome President 9 yars ago.
FIFY
| 55 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:39:50pm |
re: #49 TampaKnight
It’s a shame because I believe McCain would have truly been an awesome President.
Maybe in 2000. The McCain that ran in 2008 was a different creature altogether.
| 56 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:40:31pm |
re: #37 HoosierHoops
Good idea, Dick Cheney’s heart is clearly a vestigial organ…
| 57 |
Achilles Tang Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:40:56pm |
Used to be that people didn’t talk about matters of confidence until after they were dead. I’m certainly no fan of Palin, but I find this kind of turncoat very distasteful.
| 58 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:41:36pm |
re: #57 Naso Tang
Used to be that people didn’t talk about matters of confidence until after they were dead. I’m certainly no fan of Palin, but I find this kind of turncoat very distasteful.
money changes everything…
| 59 |
TampaKnight Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:41:37pm |
re: #55 darthstar
Maybe in 2000. The McCain that ran in 2008 was a different creature altogether.
I don’t think so, I think he just foolishly felt pressured into campaigning as something that he is not.
| 60 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:43:07pm |
re: #49 TampaKnight
Yes but bare in mind, if anything happens to McCain in the 2 or 3 years… not to mention President is a job which carries a lot of stress….
How do you feel about the possibility of President Palin?
Also even if McCain won, with the current congress we’d just end up with a huge kerfluffle between a dark blue congress and a red president which would get even less done than our current one is….
| 61 |
Ojoe Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:43:22pm |
re: #57 Naso Tang
Actually, after a person had been dead for quite some time, as living associates of the person were thought worthy of some deference too.
| 62 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:43:24pm |
re: #59 TampaKnight
I don’t think so, I think he just foolishly felt pressured into campaigning as something that he is not.
That he allowed himself to be pressured like that was a major part of the problem.
| 63 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:43:25pm |
re: #57 Naso Tang
Used to be that people didn’t talk about matters of confidence until after they were dead. I’m certainly no fan of Palin, but I find this kind of turncoat very distasteful.
You find Sarah Palin distasteful or Steve Schmidt? She started stabbing the McCain campaign in the back…they were perfectly happy to let her slide back into obscurity in Alaska, but once she got the taste of fame and attention, it was all over. She goes after lots of people in “Going Rogue”…they’ve just decided they’re not going to take it lying down.
| 64 |
Achilles Tang Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:43:51pm |
| 65 |
freetoken Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:44:04pm |
That bastion of scientific knowledge, Fox News, appears to have ruffled some dino feathers:
Cataclysm That Killed Dinos Still Taking Lives Today
and those who object to this little of creative geological revisionism:
Fox News: volcanic coal kills off dinosaurs before they even evolved
Volcanoes erupt coal – Fox News
With science outlets like FoxNews, who needs those pesky science textbooks about which those SBOEs keep arguing?
| 66 |
Killgore Trout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:44:14pm |
re: #57 Naso Tang
Used to be that people didn’t talk about matters of confidence until after they were dead. I’m certainly no fan of Palin, but I find this kind of turncoat very distasteful.
I think it’s a reflection of what a debacle the McCain campaign was. There were hints of this stuff leaking out before the election. If McCain couldn’t manage his own staff I doubt he was capable of running the country.
| 67 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:44:32pm |
re: #59 TampaKnight
If he can get pushed around by the members of his own party how is he gonna stand up to Iran?
| 68 |
Vambo Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:44:36pm |
I’m sorry but it’s just not even funny anymore. She could’ve been the vice president. I would almost feel sorry for Palin if she didn’t bring it on herself, with her crazy comments after the election.
| 69 |
recusancy Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:44:42pm |
re: #53 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
His track record led me to have low expectations.
Ideology aside. I don’t think he would have had the endurance to make it 4 years. He only had to campaign for like 3 months and he look tired and his mind seemed jumbled quite often. He’s more suited to show up on the Sunday talk shows to pontificate and give a speech in the chamber every once and a while. I don’t think he’d be able to take the pressure of the full job of President at his current age.
| 70 |
Mad Al-Jaffee Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:44:43pm |
Time for me to get going. Have a nice weekend lizards!
| 71 |
Achilles Tang Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:44:51pm |
re: #61 Ojoe
Actually, after a person had been dead for quite some time, as living associates of the person were thought worthy of some deference too.
True, although my meaning was they revealed all in their memoires. The speaker being dead.
| 72 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:46:03pm |
re: #59 TampaKnight
He sold out for a shot of winning - and while I believed he didn’t believe a word of the crap he’s come out with I was fine, he was just electioneering - but now i have a horrible feeling he believes it himself.
See his teabagger advert.
| 73 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:46:09pm |
/so after all is said and done will the new 3rd party be known as the Rouges?
| 74 |
avanti Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:46:17pm |
re: #55 darthstar
Maybe in 2000. The McCain that ran in 2008 was a different creature altogether.
My small Navy division was honored to have him discuss his POW experience back in the 70’s.I was ready to vote for him until he pandered to the religious right. It just seemed so out of character to me.
| 75 |
Jack Burton Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:46:59pm |
| 77 |
Ben Hur Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:49:44pm |
| 78 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:49:48pm |
re: #6 Charles
The final total of electoral votes: 365 Obama, 173 McCain.
That’s a landslide.
Right after the election, Fox News had a roundtable where they discussed whether or not it was a landslide. They came to a consensus that it wasn’t. For some reason.
| 79 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:49:56pm |
| 80 |
freetoken Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:49:58pm |
The comments on that ludicrous FoxNews article are a classic exhibition of what the anti-AGW science crowd is all about - getting even at Al Gore.
Even though the article has nothing to do really with Al Gore.
| 81 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:50:18pm |
| 82 |
Ben Hur Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:51:18pm |
Supporter or not, you have to love the O’Biden thing.
| 83 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:51:44pm |
re: #50 wozzablog
Since when did republicans give a damn about the popular vote?
“All Hail President Gore”
Both parties change their mind regularly about the popular vote, depending on whether they won it or not.
| 84 |
Jack Burton Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:52:23pm |
re: #79 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Also one of William H Macy’s earliest film roles.
I’m going to have to watch that again. I don’t remember him in it. It’s hard to remember all the bit parts in the Awesome-Sauce that is The Last Dragon.
| 85 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:52:57pm |
re: #82 Ben Hur
Supporter or not, you have to love the O’Biden thing.
/anyone hear from him lately… I know I have asked before, but his absence is kinda interesting.
| 86 |
Killgore Trout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:53:05pm |
Paulians blame the Jews…..
Mossad Tied to ‘Underwear Bomber’
“There is no al-Qaeda in Yemen. George Bush released a couple of phony operatives from Guantanamo, and after traveling to the Middle East, they hooked up with the Mossad. The only reason Attorney General Alberto Gonzalez released them is because they’re assets.”
Of course, the American public is being misled again into believing that this “lone nut” terrorist sneaked through the system (no-fly lists, airport scrutiny etc) due to mere incompetence, similar to what occurred on 9-11.
Yet Israeli intelligence provided security at the Amsterdam Airport, where Mutallab boarded a plane with no passport; the NSA is equipped to electronically eavesdrop anywhere around the world; the Mossad is tied to Yemen, Nigeria and India; while the suspect’s father opened up banking and arms contacts in the Middle East while harboring an extremely close relationship with American and Israeli intelligence.
| 87 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:53:09pm |
re: #82 Ben Hur
Supporter or not, you have to love the O’Biden thing.
John Cass, a well-known columnist in Chicago, calls Obama “O’bama” in reference to the old school Democratic Chicago Machine, which is mostly Irish.
I always thought that was pretty funny.
| 88 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:53:25pm |
re: #82 Ben Hur
Supporter or not, you have to love the O’Biden thing.
It wasn’t that original. When President Obama chose Joe Biden to be his running mate, a lot of us on the left were saying “Obama, O’Biden, Oh yeah!”…whoever fed her that line didn’t do her any favors.
| 89 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:53:40pm |
re: #78 Soap_Man
Because it wasn’t a landslide unless Obama got 400 votes!
| 90 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:54:46pm |
re: #85 brookly red
/anyone hear from him lately… I know I have asked before, but his absence is kinda interesting.
His mother is dying. He’s spending time with her.
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com…]
| 91 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:55:08pm |
re: #86 Killgore Trout
Paulians blame the Jews…
Mossad Tied to ‘Underwear Bomber’
/if the Mossad made a bomb it would have gone off. Next.
| 92 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:56:15pm |
re: #84 ArchangelMichael
I’m going to have to watch that again. I don’t remember him in it. It’s hard to remember all the bit parts in the Awesome-Sauce that is The Last Dragon.
He was one of Vanity’s production assistants.
| 93 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:56:33pm |
re: #90 darthstar
His mother is dying. He’s spending time with her.
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com…]
Oh, that is not a happy thing. Thanks I was wondering where he was.
| 94 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:56:40pm |
re: #89 jamesfirecat
Because it wasn’t a landslide unless Obama got 400 votes!
Yeah it was a lot of “I consider a landslide to be 375” and “it was nothing like Reagan” and “you can’t look at the electoral vote, you have to look at the popular vote.” (The last quote was especially hilarious coming from a Republican.)
| 95 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:56:49pm |
re: #82 Ben Hur
It is funny. Kind of like Biden calling Barack Obama “Barack America”. Blunders can be pretty funny.
My husband and I still use “stand up Chuck” to each other when the other ones does something stupid but we don’t want to say, “hey you are being stupid.
| 96 |
avanti Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:56:52pm |
re: #65 freetoken
That bastion of scientific knowledge, Fox News, appears to have ruffled some dino feathers:
Cataclysm That Killed Dinos Still Taking Lives Today
and those who object to this little of creative geological revisionism:
Fox News: volcanic coal kills off dinosaurs before they even evolved
Volcanoes erupt coal – Fox News
With science outlets like FoxNews, who needs those pesky science textbooks about which those SBOEs keep arguing?
That would be funny in another context, but on a “science” page from the most popular cable news show, it’s just scary. They got their mass extinctions confused, there were no dinosaurs 250 million years ago, not a minor error.
| 97 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:57:03pm |
re: #86 Killgore Trout
Paulians blame the Jews…
Mossad Tied to ‘Underwear Bomber’
They still blame the Jooos for Pearl Harbor too.
| 98 |
Jack Burton Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:58:28pm |
re: #86 Killgore Trout
The fact that they didn’t do that on day 1 is the only surprise here.
| 99 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:58:28pm |
re: #97 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
They still blame the Jooos for Pearl Harbor too.
and the Titanic…
| 100 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:58:56pm |
re: #94 Soap_Man
Yeah it was a lot of “I consider a landslide to be 375” and “it was nothing like Reagan” and “you can’t look at the electoral vote, you have to look at the popular vote.” (The last quote was especially hilarious coming from a Republican.)
Reagan was INSANE. If you make that the standard for a landslide, you will probably never seen another one.
| 101 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:59:10pm |
| 102 |
Ben Hur Fri, Jan 8, 2010 12:59:54pm |
re: #86 Killgore Trout
Paulians blame the Jews…
Mossad Tied to ‘Underwear Bomber’
Impossible.
Whackadoos, all.
| 103 |
Jack Burton Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:00:20pm |
re: #100 SanFranciscoZionist
Reagan was INSANE. If you make that the standard for a landslide, you will probably never seen another one.
1984: 525 to 13
There’s no way in HELL that’s ever going to happen again. Not without some seismic changes in the political landscape.
| 104 |
freetoken Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:00:30pm |
re: #96 avanti
Given that a non-trivial portion of their audience doesn’t even believe the Earth is that old, and an even greater share of the audience despise science for its materialism, it probably doesn’t matter that FoxNews has totally mangled that story.
Thanos put in the spin-offs the other day the real story.
| 105 |
Ben Hur Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:01:55pm |
re: #88 darthstar
It wasn’t that original. When President Obama chose Joe Biden to be his running mate, a lot of us on the left were saying “Obama, O’Biden, Oh yeah!”…whoever fed her that line didn’t do her any favors.
I think it was some sort of tick. She couldn’t say “Biden” even when she wanted to.
Apparently, that’s why she asked if it would be ok to just call him “Joe” during the debate.
I don’t know if that’s in the vid, but I read it this morning.
| 106 |
palomino Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:03:44pm |
In spite of all this, we still have to take her seriously as a presidential candidate because her identity politics (does she have any other?) get the base so aroused.
The GOP establishment knows this, but what can they do? Criticize the party’s new sex symbol? Not a chance.
| 107 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:03:58pm |
re: #102 Ben Hur
Impossible.
Whackadoos, all.
You have no idea how many otherwise normal sounding people have told me that this was A. a plot to discredit Obama, B. a plot to sell airport scanners (see Haliburton) C. both.
| 108 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:04:36pm |
re: #105 Ben Hur
I think it was some sort of tick. She couldn’t say “Biden” even when she wanted to.
Apparently, that’s why she asked if it would be ok to just call him “Joe” during the debate.
I don’t know if that’s in the vid, but I read it this morning.
Yeah, she did the “Joe” thing.
The debate was OK, she did a creditable job. Although, by then, the bar had been set so low that she probably would have been considered to have done well just not to throw up on Biden’s shoes.
| 109 |
freetoken Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:04:41pm |
re: #86 Killgore Trout
Yeah… and Buchanan’s site is pushing the story that a “Rogue” US Intel group was in on the planned bombing.
I’m sure somebody right now is writing a story that connects the two.
| 110 |
Vicious Babushka Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:05:12pm |
re: #6 Charles
The final total of electoral votes: 365 Obama, 173 McCain.
That’s a landslide.
ACORN cheated!
////////////////////////////Screaming and yelling and running around
| 111 |
Ben Hur Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:05:15pm |
re: #107 brookly red
You have no idea how many otherwise normal sounding people have told me that this was A. a plot to discredit Obama, B. a plot to sell airport scanners (see Haliburton) C. both.
Not surprising in Brooklyn.
| 112 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:06:00pm |
re: #109 freetoken
Yeah… and Buchanan’s site is pushing the story that a “Rogue” US Intel group was in on the planned bombing.
I’m sure somebody right now is writing a story that connects the two.
You know, all these people keep saying that Obama doesn’t realize we’re at war with Islamic fundamentalists.
I don’t think that’s the case, but if it is, he’s definitely not the only one.
| 113 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:06:16pm |
And Palin couldn’t stop referring to Biden as “O’Biden.”
There are far worse things I’ve heard “O’Biden” referred too!!
//
The Villages !!
| 114 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:06:37pm |
re: #106 palomino
In spite of all this, we still have to take her seriously as a presidential candidate because her identity politics (does she have any other?) get the base so aroused.
The GOP establishment knows this, but what can they do? Criticize the party’s new sex symbol? Not a chance.
56 million people voted for her isn’t that a good enough reason?
| 115 |
Ben Hur Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:07:04pm |
re: #112 SanFranciscoZionist
You know, all these people keep saying that Obama doesn’t realize we’re at war with Islamic fundamentalists.
I don’t think that’s the case, but if it is, he’s definitely not the only one.
True dat.
The producers of James Bond.
The producers of 24.
| 116 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:07:35pm |
re: #111 Ben Hur
Not surprising in Brooklyn.
actually email from all over the country & even France.
| 117 |
Ben Hur Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:08:03pm |
| 118 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:08:04pm |
re: #94 Soap_Man
Yeah it was a lot of “I consider a landslide to be 375” and “it was nothing like Reagan” and “you can’t look at the electoral vote, you have to look at the popular vote.” (The last quote was especially hilarious coming from a Republican.)
Pay no attention to the teamsters behind the goalposts (who we hired to movethem….)
| 120 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:09:52pm |
| 121 |
Jeff In Ohio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:10:31pm |
re: #35 MandyManners
I hope they’re fucking happy now.
They are happy. So happy, they’re having a Tea Party! I’ll have a few more of those tasty mayonnaise sammiches.
| 122 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:11:24pm |
re: #114 brookly red
Yup, ol’ top’o’the’ticket’08 Palin……… thats what we called her back then in the ol’ country………
| 123 |
Ben Hur Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:11:29pm |
re: #120 brookly red
ahh… well you see in my haste to register…
You’ve been asked this before, I gather.
| 124 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:11:43pm |
re: #110 Alouette
ACORN cheated!
///Screaming and yelling and running around
How about those folks who believe ACORN “stole” the election? They think it is some kind of super-organization worthy of a James Bond villain.
Yeah, they stole the election. It was all planned out from their secret base in the center of the Earth.
| 125 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:13:59pm |
re: #123 Ben Hur
You’ve been asked this before, I gather.
Yes, & I just passed my 1 year mark & was thinking of asking the management for my n back… but I have learned to live without it, well a slight limp.
| 126 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:14:01pm |
re: #114 brookly red
I also won’t remind you how many people voted for Joe Biden - and how most people around here regard him despite of the large vote he personally gained when he won the presidency………
/oh, wait.
| 127 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:14:42pm |
re: #122 wozzablog
Yup, ol’ top’o’the’ticket’08 Palin… thats what we called her back then in the ol’ country…
ever swim in the ocean?
| 128 |
okonkolo Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:14:54pm |
Even though she was coached and warned about it, she actually did refer to Biden as O’Biden during the debate, which got a big grin from Joe. Lost in the shuffle at the moment, but it is here:
here on YouTube
| 129 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:15:05pm |
re: #114 brookly red
56 million people voted for her isn’t that a good enough reason?
56 million people voted for the Republican ticket that included her. And we knew far less then than now about what a problem child he is.
| 130 |
Feline Fearless Leader Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:16:34pm |
re: #124 Soap_Man
ACORN is doomed. The GOP will get Zod the proper citizenship papers and run him in 2012. Super powers for the POTUS, plus the nice laser eyes and the proven ability to command while expecting to be obeyed. All he needs is a couple of staffers to keep him informed when decisions fail to meet the criteria of the EvilRepublican OverlordMan of the People List.
/ (Avogadro’s Sarc)
| 131 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:16:57pm |
The big question is, how many of McCain’s staffers actually voted for President Obama when they got into the privacy of the voting booth? That would be a fun number to know.
| 132 |
Ben Hur Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:17:28pm |
OK.
A hearty “shlahn goh foihll” from O’Ben Hurley.
| 133 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:17:54pm |
re: #129 SanFranciscoZionist
56 million people voted for the Republican ticket that included her. And we knew far less then than now about what a problem child he is.
Look, personally I don’t support her, but a lot of people do & I would caution others don’t discount her.
| 134 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:19:27pm |
Ya, no way this guy has any reason to exaggerate or lie.
Personally I think she did well in that debate. If anyone in the press had called Biden on his “We kicked Hezbollah out of Lebanon” fantasy statement he would have been toast. He (once again) made up a fantasy and repeated it as real… me and Barak told them this would happen!
Ya, sure Joe… You and Barak…
| 135 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:20:28pm |
re: #133 brookly red
Look, personally I don’t support her, but a lot of people do & I would caution others don’t discount her.
I don’t discount her, completely, but she was added to the ticket as a wild card, and she has done nothing to establish herself beyond that.
| 136 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:21:06pm |
re: #134 Buck
Ya, no way this guy has any reason to exaggerate or lie.
Personally I think she did well in that debate. If anyone in the press had called Biden on his “We kicked Hezbollah out of Lebanon” fantasy statement he would have been toast. He (once again) made up a fantasy and repeated it as real… me and Barak told them this would happen!
Ya, sure Joe… You and Barak…
Did well? She didn’t even answer the questions, and in fact stated that she wouldn’t answer the questions. She only “did well” because the media said she did well. The debate’s still up on YouTube…watch it again.
| 137 |
Jeff In Ohio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:21:12pm |
re: #133 brookly red
Look, personally I don’t support her, but a lot of people do & I would caution others don’t discount her.
I’m don’t discount her. She’s Obama’s Alf Landon.
| 138 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:21:20pm |
Geez. I leave for a few days and I come back with this.
| 139 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:21:26pm |
re: #124 Soap_Man
How about those folks who believe ACORN “stole” the election? They think it is some kind of super-organization worthy of a James Bond villain.
Yeah, they stole the election. It was all planned out from their secret base in the center of the Earth.
Little do they realize the terrible truth about LGF. You see, “Charles” is really a cigar-smoking reptilian android from the planetoid Aidemydni, who lives in a top secret nitrogen-filled bomb shelter (why doesn’t the nitrogen explode when I smoke? ah ah! that would be telling!) concealed beneath Denver International Airport. Bwa hahaha! Soon the Earth will be mine, and my lizardoid armies will herd the peace activists into brutal repression camps, the better to slaughter them and feast on their gamy buttocks! Bwa hahaha!
| 140 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:21:46pm |
re: #135 SanFranciscoZionist
I don’t discount her, completely, but she was added to the ticket as a wild card, and she has done nothing to establish herself beyond that.
/it couldn’t happen here?
| 141 |
freetoken Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:23:50pm |
re: #134 Buck
I see by your facebook page that you are a fan of Sarah Palin (assuming the link you provide is indeed the same person as on the pointed facebook person.)
| 142 |
Feline Fearless Leader Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:23:53pm |
re: #139 SteveC
How does the cigar burn in the nitrogen? N2 is a pretty inert gas. So I guess the question is what the O2 level is in said sekrit bunker…
| 143 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:24:55pm |
re: #142 oaktree
How does the cigar burn in the nitrogen? N2 is a pretty inert gas. So I guess the question is what the O2 level is in said sekrit bunker…
That would be telling.
| 144 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:25:41pm |
re: #140 brookly red
/it couldn’t happen here?
I think it’s unlikely, given her track record, that Palin will ever be an elected official again. She seems to thrive on being a rockstar pundit, and I suspect she will stick with it.
| 145 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:25:47pm |
re: #142 oaktree
How does the cigar burn in the nitrogen? N2 is a pretty inert gas. So I guess the question is what the O2 level is in said sekrit bunker…
one of those new fangled i-cigars I bet…
| 146 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:25:57pm |
re: #127 brookly red
Is this leading up to a Rahm Emmanual joke?
| 147 |
Feline Fearless Leader Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:26:11pm |
re: #143 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Ah. “Sore wa himitsu desu!” ^_^
| 148 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:26:11pm |
re: #142 oaktree
How does the cigar burn in the nitrogen? N2 is a pretty inert gas. So I guess the question is what the O2 level is in said sekrit bunker…
this is knowledge well beyond the comprehension of mere mortals such as myself. All I do is service the vending machines.
| 149 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:26:17pm |
re: #124 Soap_Man
How about those folks who believe ACORN “stole” the election? They think it is some kind of super-organization worthy of a James Bond villain.
Yeah, they stole the election. It was all planned out from their secret base in the center of the Earth.
You don’t have to be a super villain to cheat.
ACORN, Soros and others figured out that they needed numbers… that the people who gave a shit and were able to register on their own were stupid (They voted for Bush right?). So they needed to spend a lot of money getting people who were smarter, but just couldn’t be bothered to register and vote without a lot of help. AND if they didn’t have ID, or anyway to prove they were qualified to vote, they just had to be helped along by voter registration fraud.
My opinion is that the Acorn isn’t smart enough to steal the election belongs with the Osama isn’t smart enough to pull off 9/11.
| 150 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:27:39pm |
re: #149 Buck
I’m sorry, I couldn’t make head or tail out of that post. Could you try rephrasing what you mean?
| 151 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:27:57pm |
Somehow, no matter how hard I try, it’s hard to take anything broadcast on 60 Minutes seriously.
| 152 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:28:32pm |
re: #141 freetoken
I see by your facebook page that you are a fan of Sarah Palin (assuming the link you provide is indeed the same person as on the pointed facebook person.)
Good assumption. Is that OK? Judge me by that do you?
| 153 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:28:33pm |
re: #138 Cannadian Club Akbar
Geez. I leave for a few days and I come back with this.
Did whatever it was you were hoping for come to pass?
| 154 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:29:15pm |
re: #144 SanFranciscoZionist
I think it’s unlikely, given her track record, that Palin will ever be an elected official again. She seems to thrive on being a rockstar pundit, and I suspect she will stick with it.
perhaps, but times change & shit happens & as I was going to say to wozzablog, don’t turn your back on a wave even a small one.
| 155 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:29:55pm |
re: #146 wozzablog
Is this leading up to a Rahm Emmanual joke?
there is nothing funny about him at all.
| 156 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:31:13pm |
re: #149 Buck
So they needed to spend a lot of money getting people who were smarter, but just couldn’t be bothered to register and vote without a lot of help. AND if they didn’t have ID, or anyway to prove they were qualified to vote, they just had to be helped along by voter registration fraud.
So, they cheated by registering people? (And voter registration fraud is not voter fraud. It is still horrible and should be punished, but I have yet to see any evidence that these fraudulent registrations led to any fraudulent votes.)
| 157 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:31:25pm |
re: #149 Buck
You don’t have to be a super villain to cheat.
ACORN, Soros and others figured out that they needed numbers… that the people who gave a shit and were able to register on their own were stupid (They voted for Bush right?). So they needed to spend a lot of money getting people who were smarter, but just couldn’t be bothered to register and vote without a lot of help. AND if they didn’t have ID, or anyway to prove they were qualified to vote, they just had to be helped along by voter registration fraud.
My opinion is that the Acorn isn’t smart enough to steal the election belongs with the Osama isn’t smart enough to pull off 9/11.
Paranoia strikes deep…
There’s no evidence at all that I am aware of showing voter fraud, let alone voter fraud on the massive scale that would have been required to produce a presidential landslide.
| 158 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:31:40pm |
More trouble in paradise…now Sen Rob Bennett (R - fuckin’ Utah!) isn’t conservative enough.
| 159 |
freetoken Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:31:41pm |
re: #152 Buck
Good assumption. Is that OK? Judge me by that do you?
…. and that you are a fan of “America’s News Headquarters”…
… and that you make statements like:
My opinion is that the Acorn isn’t smart enough to steal the election belongs with the Osama isn’t smart enough to pull off 9/11.
… and so forth.
Look, you have every right to be a raving looney wingnut if you want to be. However, don’t expect to be not called on it here or anywhere else that people are concerned with reality and truth.
| 160 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:32:22pm |
re: #145 brookly red
one of those new fangled i-cigars I bet…
It was one of the few Longstreet Cigars still in existence.
BTW, the movie “Gettysburg” is one of the few films to depict the South’s economic marvel: the Self-Healing cigar. In one scene, Longstreet chats with Lee while mouthing a severely shredded stogie. After one short camera cut, the cigar has become whole again. Seems that the secret of this product was lost during the siege of Petersburg.
| 162 |
Ben Hur Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:33:23pm |
Memo to Palin: Get Over Yourself
Okay, now that I have ensured that I will receive lots of hateful comments…. Sarah Palin’s decision not to attend CPAC (the Conservative Political Action Conference) is ridiculously petty. I will grant that CPAC should not have let the Birchers be minor sponsors. I don’t understand that decision. But this bit about David Keene and Fed Ex/UPS (read the link for explanations of these references to specific issues) was dealt with months ago, and Keene certainly explained it to my satisfaction and to the satisfaction of most conservative bloggers as well. In fact, the issue is SO “over and done with” that it cannot be anything more than mere pretext. Somehow I don’t think Sarah Palin has a long record of letting her schedule be determined by the wishes of a delivery company. (And I say this as somebody who has editorialized quite strongly in favor of the FedEx position in that dispute, which I gather is the position that Palin in effect takes, which means that my beef clearly isn’t with her position on that dispute itself.) As for Keene supposedly complaining last year when she pulled out of a scheduled CPAC event: Hell, I would complain too if a rising gubernatorial star committed to come to the single biggest conservative event of the year and then backed out (IF that is what happened). If that is what happened — and again, I do NOT know the circumstances, so there MAY be a legitimate explanation — then unless Palin had a really good reason, she did effectively “diss” not just Keene but the conservative movement, in which case Keene would have been right to complain.
| 163 |
Vicious Babushka Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:34:45pm |
re: #160 SteveC
It was one of the few Longstreet Cigars still in existence.
BTW, the movie “Gettysburg” is one of the few films to depict the South’s economic marvel: the Self-Healing cigar. In one scene, Longstreet chats with Lee while mouthing a severely shredded stogie. After one short camera cut, the cigar has become whole again. Seems that the secret of this product was lost during the siege of Petersburg.
The surviving Confederate tobacco farmers fled to Cuba with their craft secrets.
/
| 164 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:35:45pm |
re: #163 Alouette
The surviving Confederate tobacco farmers fled to Cuba with their craft secrets.
/
yeah, but then they all fled Castro to the DR…
| 165 |
Shiplord Kirel Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:35:49pm |
Sheesh! I’ve been a Republican for 46 years but this nonsense is about to send me over the hill. What will I be then? A blue dog? A political orphan?
Am I just a ragged refugee, fleeing down the highway of history to escape the tea-drunk hordes as they pillage their way across the political landscape?
| 166 |
Taqyia2Me Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:35:53pm |
re: #146 wozzablog
Is this leading up to a Rahm Emmanual joke?
Stinky Ballerina!
(history of sending dead fish to political opponents plus ballet training)
| 167 |
Political Atheist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:36:22pm |
[Link: www.factcheck.org…]
Neither had much to be proud of as far as the debate goes. Exaggerations, gaffes, you name it.
CNN had this
[Link: www.cnn.com…]
Biden better with information, Palin more likeable.
It’s hard to square what got broadcast with what Steve said.
A far closer outcome than what was feared.
Sour grapes there Steve? Need a scapegoat other than GWB & McCain’s own missteps??
| 168 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:36:32pm |
re: #154 brookly red
I get that - populism can become the favor of the month and very nasty things happen when it does - but is Sarah runs as a third party populist, or throws her weight behind one, she is only going to help Democrats.
She seriously seriously pissed off the congressional republican caucus with her show/no show antics last year to their events - and whats left of “the GOP right or wrong” crowd in the country hate her guts for turning coats over NY23.
She has the potential to be a populist leader, but i don’t see her being a populist leader in the GOP framework, and while she’s outside the tent the GOP will haemorrage votes when that particular wave hits and the next thing you know it’s BHO - 4 More Years.
| 169 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:36:35pm |
re: #156 Soap_Man
And voter registration fraud is not voter fraud. It is still horrible and should be punished
would you consider an apt ‘punishment’ be any organization that is found to have perpetrated voter registration fraud not be allowed in the future to be allowed to participate in voter registration?
I’m not calling for all of ACORN to be cut out of the reg process, but how about at least those offices that did the deed??
| 170 |
Ben Hur Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:36:36pm |
Google “God has placed me in this role for a reason” and knock yourself out.
| 171 |
Lidane Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:36:42pm |
OT, but can I vent about more idiocy here in Texas?
It seems my idiot governor wants to inflict the same damage to this state that is sinking California’s economy. I can only hope that cooler heads prevail, or that Perry loses in the upcoming primary.
Nobody likes taxes. I get that. But crippling a state’s ability to pay for itself isn’t a solution to anything.
| 172 |
Varek Raith Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:36:46pm |
re: #149 Buck
You don’t have to be a super villain to cheat.
ACORN, Soros and others figured out that they needed numbers… that the people who gave a shit and were able to register on their own were stupid (They voted for Bush right?). So they needed to spend a lot of money getting people who were smarter, but just couldn’t be bothered to register and vote without a lot of help. AND if they didn’t have ID, or anyway to prove they were qualified to vote, they just had to be helped along by voter registration fraud.
My opinion is that the Acorn isn’t smart enough to steal the election belongs with the Osama isn’t smart enough to pull off 9/11.
James Bond. Allow me to introduce myself. I am Ernst Stavro Blofeld. Head of A.C.O.R.N.
| 173 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:37:53pm |
re: #152 Buck
Good assumption. Is that OK? Judge me by that do you?
| 174 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:37:56pm |
re: #124 Soap_Man
No it was on the moon you fool, the moon!
| 175 |
lawhawk Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:38:03pm |
Vice President Joe Biden’s 92-year-old mother has died after becoming seriously ill in recent days. AP
Thoughts and prayers to the Biden family…
| 176 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:38:14pm |
re: #165 Shiplord Kirel
Sheesh! I’ve been a Republican for 46 years but this nonsense is about to send me over the hill. What will I be then? A blue dog? A political orphan?
Am I just a ragged refugee, fleeing down the highway of history to escape the tea-drunk hordes as they pillage their way across the political landscape?
The new version of the Miranda warning: You may choose a political viewpoint. If you give up the right to choose your viewpoint, one will be chosen for you.
| 177 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:38:32pm |
re: #150 Obdicut
I’m sorry, I couldn’t make head or tail out of that post. Could you try rephrasing what you mean?
OK, Soap man…. using sarcasm infers that ACORN (and the people who support them) didn’t have a plan to steal the election. That it would take some super powerful james bond kind of villain (who Soros could be, but never mind about that).
I used a bit of sarcasm as well. ( I guess too much).
The leadership at ACORN, and George Soros learned from the previous 2 elections that they would need to stack the deck with voters they could count on. (In the end it wasn’t necessary, but that doesn’t mean they didn’t do it) Registering people who in the past couldn’t be bothered to do it themselves, seemed to be a good idea. They could get federal funds AND have influence over the person afterwards. It wasn’t always easy as some of the people they wanted to register didn’t have ID or any way to prove they actually qualified to vote. So just a little Voter Registration Fraud was needed to push it along.
Again, they didn’t know that Zelig Obama and his “tell the people what ever they want to hear” would be so compelling, or that the anti Bush sentiment would be so strong. So they probably would have won anyway.
However just cause you didn’t need the money, doesn’t mean you didn’t rob the bank.
| 178 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:38:38pm |
re: #175 lawhawk
Vice President Joe Biden’s 92-year-old mother has died after becoming seriously ill in recent days. AP
Thoughts and prayers to the Biden family…
Too bad. There has been a lot of tragedy in that family.
| 179 |
lawhawk Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:38:50pm |
re: #175 lawhawk
[Link: thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com…]
| 180 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:39:18pm |
re: #175 lawhawk
Whenever I hear of the death of a politician or politician’s relative, I brace for jackassery.
| 181 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:39:35pm |
re: #175 lawhawk
I will be keeping the Biden family in my prayers :-(
| 183 |
blueraven Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:40:30pm |
re: #59 TampaKnight
I don’t think so, I think he just foolishly felt pressured into campaigning as something that he is not.
Foolishly is the operative word. If McCain can’t even make the hard decisions that affect his own campaign, what makes you think he wouldn’t cave to the far right wing of his party as president?
| 184 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:41:05pm |
re: #159 freetoken
… and so forth.
Look, you have every right to be a raving looney wingnut if you want to be. However, don’t expect to be not called on it here or anywhere else that people are concerned with reality and truth.
A raving loony wingnut… based the fact that I am a fan of Fox and Palin.
Nice.
| 185 |
Ben Hur Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:41:43pm |
re: #184 Buck
A raving loony wingnut… based the fact that I am a fan of Fox and Palin.
Nice.
Palin IS a Fox.
| 186 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:41:53pm |
re: #168 wozzablog
I get that - populism can become the favor of the month and very nasty things happen when it does - but is Sarah runs as a third party populist, or throws her weight behind one, she is only going to help Democrats.
She seriously seriously pissed off the congressional republican caucus with her show/no show antics last year to their events - and whats left of “the GOP right or wrong” crowd in the country hate her guts for turning coats over NY23.
She has the potential to be a populist leader, but i don’t see her being a populist leader in the GOP framework, and while she’s outside the tent the GOP will haemorrage votes when that particular wave hits and the next thing you know it’s BHO - 4 More Years.
I don’t know, I hear lots of people fretting that the religious right is on the verge of taking over the country on one hand & then taking their vanguard for granted on the other… we shall see.
| 187 |
Political Atheist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:42:21pm |
re: #165 Shiplord Kirel
I’m feeling just fine as an “orphan”. I am unburdened by the party missteps. I can freely vote my conscience. I can vote for folks rather than against. Conservatism abides.
| 188 |
Shiplord Kirel Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:42:30pm |
re: #149 Buck
You don’t have to be a super villain to cheat.
ACORN, Soros and others figured out that they needed numbers… that the people who gave a shit and were able to register on their own were stupid (They voted for Bush right?). So they needed to spend a lot of money getting people who were smarter, but just couldn’t be bothered to register and vote without a lot of help. AND if they didn’t have ID, or anyway to prove they were qualified to vote, they just had to be helped along by voter registration fraud.
My opinion is that the Acorn isn’t smart enough to steal the election belongs with the Osama isn’t smart enough to pull off 9/11.
If I were a diabolical Soros-ACORN mastermind (which I might be for all you know), I would not try to steal an election one measly vote at a time. I would follow the classic dictum of concentration at the decisive point. I would invest money where it counts. I would heap on the bucks to make the opposition self-destruct, promoting creationist candidates and dim-bulbs like Palin, paying off Dick’s Armey to carry guns and racist signs and otherwise look crazy at their tea-parties and, naturally, slipping a few instructions to my media collaborators on how to cover it all.
| 189 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:42:30pm |
re: #177 Buck
Oh, you really are a conspiracy theorist. Okay.
Given that improper voting registrations won’t lead to actual voting, I’m not quite sure how that plays into your conspiracy.
But I do love that the heart of your conspiracy is that people were registered to vote. Thank god you’ve revealed this attack on America. Who knows who else is out there right now ‘stacking the deck’ by registering voters?
| 190 |
Vicious Babushka Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:42:43pm |
re: #182 Ben Hur
She lived to 92.
Strong woman.
94-year-old woman, Holocaust survivor, leaves 2500 descendants.
| 191 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:42:48pm |
re: #169 sattv4u2
And voter registration fraud is not voter fraud. It is still horrible and should be punished
would you consider an apt ‘punishment’ be any organization that is found to have perpetrated voter registration fraud not be allowed in the future to be allowed to participate in voter registration?
I’m not calling for all of ACORN to be cut out of the reg process, but how about at least those offices that did the deed??
Did they ‘do the deed’? My understanding, and I could be wrong, is that the offices were aware that some minimum-wage employees had faked documents, and that they turned them in, as legally required to, with the caveat that some of the paperwork was not valid. That’s all anyone could have done.
| 193 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:43:24pm |
re: #172 Varek Raith
So what does the acronym stick for?
| 194 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:43:46pm |
re: #175 lawhawk
Vice President Joe Biden’s 92-year-old mother has died after becoming seriously ill in recent days. AP
Thoughts and prayers to the Biden family…
Ah, that’s a grand age.
| 195 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:43:57pm |
re: #177 Buck
OK, Soap man… using sarcasm infers that ACORN (and the people who support them) didn’t have a plan to steal the election. That it would take some super powerful james bond kind of villain (who Soros could be, but never mind about that).
I used a bit of sarcasm as well. ( I guess too much).
The leadership at ACORN, and George Soros learned from the previous 2 elections that they would need to stack the deck with voters they could count on. (In the end it wasn’t necessary, but that doesn’t mean they didn’t do it) Registering people who in the past couldn’t be bothered to do it themselves, seemed to be a good idea. They could get federal funds AND have influence over the person afterwards. It wasn’t always easy as some of the people they wanted to register didn’t have ID or any way to prove they actually qualified to vote. So just a little Voter Registration Fraud was needed to push it along.
Again, they didn’t know that Zelig Obama and his “tell the people what ever they want to hear” would be so compelling, or that the anti Bush sentiment would be so strong. So they probably would have won anyway.
However just cause you didn’t need the money, doesn’t mean you didn’t rob the bank.
Again, there is no evidence of voter fraud. Fraudulent registration has no effect on the outcome of an election unless those people vote with the fraudulent registration. If you had some evidence that happened, I would be all ears.
But “get out the vote” efforts are not cheating. It’s democracy. You can say that ACORN getting federal funds is wrong; I’m not going to argue that. But Democrats or Republicans looking at a group and saying “They don’t vote that much. They will probably vote for us. Let’s get them registered” is not cheating.
| 196 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:44:20pm |
re: #191 SanFranciscoZionist
Did they ‘do the deed’? My understanding, and I could be wrong, is that the offices were aware that some minimum-wage employees had faked documents, and that they turned them in, as legally required to, with the caveat that some of the paperwork was not valid. That’s all anyone could have done.
Not sure, thats why I said ANY organization (not limiting it to ACORN) and not to tarnish all of ACORN thats why I also stated limit the ‘punishment” to “A” local office that did, again in any large org
| 198 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:45:12pm |
re: #177 Buck
OK, Soap man… using sarcasm infers that ACORN (and the people who support them) didn’t have a plan to steal the election. That it would take some super powerful james bond kind of villain (who Soros could be, but never mind about that).
I used a bit of sarcasm as well. ( I guess too much).
The leadership at ACORN, and George Soros learned from the previous 2 elections that they would need to stack the deck with voters they could count on. (In the end it wasn’t necessary, but that doesn’t mean they didn’t do it) Registering people who in the past couldn’t be bothered to do it themselves, seemed to be a good idea. They could get federal funds AND have influence over the person afterwards. It wasn’t always easy as some of the people they wanted to register didn’t have ID or any way to prove they actually qualified to vote. So just a little Voter Registration Fraud was needed to push it along.
Again, they didn’t know that Zelig Obama and his “tell the people what ever they want to hear” would be so compelling, or that the anti Bush sentiment would be so strong. So they probably would have won anyway.
However just cause you didn’t need the money, doesn’t mean you didn’t rob the bank.
1. How is Soros connected to ACORN? I wasn’t aware he worked with them.
2. You have no evidence of ANY voter fraud.
3. This is moronic.
| 199 |
Varek Raith Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:45:18pm |
re: #193 jamesfirecat
So what does the acronym stick for?
Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now
/sounds more eeevil with periods in between the letters. :)
| 200 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:45:31pm |
re: #188 Shiplord Kirel
If I was trying to rig an election I would do it at the machines rather than the voters….
| 201 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:45:35pm |
re: #183 blueraven
Foolishly is the operative word. If McCain can’t even make the hard decisions that affect his own campaign, what makes you think he wouldn’t cave to the far right wing of his party as president?
And you think President Obama hasn’t caved to his party at all~against what he campaigned on? I remember hearing then Senator Obama state several times during the campaign that healthcare reform debates would be completely transparent. One of the very few things I agreed with him on.
So did he lie or just cave to his party as president since the healthcare reform debates have been anything but transparent?
| 202 |
prairiefire Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:45:38pm |
re: #165 Shiplord Kirel
Sheesh! I’ve been a Republican for 46 years but this nonsense is about to send me over the hill. What will I be then? A blue dog? A political orphan?
Am I just a ragged refugee, fleeing down the highway of history to escape the tea-drunk hordes as they pillage their way across the political landscape?
Upding for the chuckle. Seriously, good luck with that.
| 203 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:45:55pm |
re: #180 Obdicut
Whenever I hear of the death of a politician or politician’s relative, I brace for jackassery.
There is none at LGF. You behave like a jerk, you will be escorted from the building.
It’s super.
| 204 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:46:43pm |
re: #200 jamesfirecat
If I was trying to rig an election I would do it at the machines rather than the voters…
thinking small again…
| 205 |
Political Atheist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:48:02pm |
re: #203 SanFranciscoZionist
Perfect timing- Condolences to the Biden family at a difficult time. we can celebrate a long fruitful life of 92 years. May you Joe, and all your relatives do at least as well.
| 206 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:48:10pm |
re: #169 sattv4u2
And voter registration fraud is not voter fraud. It is still horrible and should be punished
would you consider an apt ‘punishment’ be any organization that is found to have perpetrated voter registration fraud not be allowed in the future to be allowed to participate in voter registration?
I’m not calling for all of ACORN to be cut out of the reg process, but how about at least those offices that did the deed??
I’m pretty sure those people who were responsible were canned.
The biggest problem with ACORN is that they hire people at minimum wage, with no experience required and provide them little training. That’s why you see these problems. You hire some jackass and give him a quota of people to register, and since he is a jackass, he doesn’t do it and hands in a reg for Donald Duck.
| 207 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:49:30pm |
re: #196 sattv4u2
Not sure, thats why I said ANY organization (not limiting it to ACORN) and not to tarnish all of ACORN thats why I also stated limit the ‘punishment” to “A” local office that did, again in any large org
I would say that if it could be demonstrated that regular employees had deliberately or irresponsibly faked such documentation, they should be fired, and I would definately think three times before inviting an organization that seemed to have a problem that way to register voters. I don’t know how this is controlled, would need to really know the process before suggesting anything further.
| 208 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:49:51pm |
| 209 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:50:36pm |
re: #189 Obdicut
Given that improper voting registrations won’t lead to actual voting, I’m not quite sure how that plays into your conspiracy.
First that is NOT Given.
Second huge numbers of Illegal (improper makes it sound like they just didn’t dot an I) voter registration cards would lead to a major drain of resources to try and separate the legal from the illegal. So close to election dates (and early voting), it causes chaos. If they can separate the fraudulent forms from the real it mean more illegal forms get through.
But hey… it doesn’t matter. Voter Registration Fraud is no big deal…There is no way possible for it to lead to actual voting improperly. No way possible… nope.
| 210 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:50:45pm |
Seriously though, I can’t believe we are actually having this conversation. I’ll say the same thing I said to my liberal friends the years after 2000 and 2004.
“Yeah, it sucks you lost. You might think it is a crime and you might think it is wrong. But you did lose. You can’t un-ring that bell. Get over it.”
| 211 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:51:24pm |
re: #195 Soap_Man
But “get out the vote” efforts are not cheating. It’s democracy. You can say that ACORN getting federal funds is wrong; I’m not going to argue that. But Democrats or Republicans looking at a group and saying “They don’t vote that much. They will probably vote for us. Let’s get them registered” is not cheating.
I registered to vote the day I turned 18; at a voter registration drive held at a minor league baseball game. And I am not a crook.
/My team lost, if you’re curious. :(
| 212 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:51:43pm |
re: #186 brookly red
The true believers are not reliably republican voters and will split if the GOP candidate is not to their liking purity wise. The candidate may try and pander - but that doesn’t mean he or she will suceede.
| 213 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:51:46pm |
re: #206 Soap_Man
I’m pretty sure those people who were responsible were canned.
The biggest problem with ACORN is that they hire people at minimum wage, with no experience required and provide them little training. That’s why you see these problems. You hire some jackass and give him a quota of people to register, and since he is a jackass, he doesn’t do it and hands in a reg for Donald Duck.
Yeah. That’s going to create problems, regardless.
| 214 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:52:43pm |
re: #206 Soap_Man
I’m pretty sure those people who were responsible were canned.
The biggest problem with ACORN is that they hire people at minimum wage, with no experience required and provide them little training. That’s why you see these problems. You hire some jackass and give him a quota of people to register, and since he is a jackass, he doesn’t do it and hands in a reg for Donald Duck.
Same problem with the TSA.
| 215 |
Jaerik Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:52:48pm |
re: #157 SanFranciscoZionist
Paranoia strikes deep…There’s no evidence at all that I am aware of showing voter fraud, let alone voter fraud on the massive scale that would have been required to produce a presidential landslide.
There’s also the fact that if you throw out every vote cast by anyone who has ever been registered by Acorn or ever worked for them, Obama still won. By millions of votes.
| 216 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:53:25pm |
re: #199 Varek Raith
Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now
/sounds more eeevil with periods in between the letters. :)
Now with 40% more evil!
| 217 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:53:26pm |
re: #209 Buck
Legally, does ACORN have to submit all voter registration cards given to them?
| 218 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:53:26pm |
re: #209 Buck
First that is NOT Given.
Second huge numbers of Illegal (improper makes it sound like they just didn’t dot an I) voter registration cards would lead to a major drain of resources to try and separate the legal from the illegal. So close to election dates (and early voting), it causes chaos. If they can separate the fraudulent forms from the real it mean more illegal forms get through.
But hey… it doesn’t matter. Voter Registration Fraud is no big deal…There is no way possible for it to lead to actual voting improperly. No way possible… nope.
You have no evidence, and yet you are accusing ACORN and George Soros (who I still haven’t quite fit into this scenario) of committing major felonies.
Given this, how do you have the nerve to criticize Van Jones for being a Troofer?
| 219 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:53:56pm |
re: #209 Buck
Voter Registration Fraud is no big deal…There is no way possible for it to lead to actual voting improperly. No way possible… nope.
Voter registration fraud IS a big deal. But you can’t say that illegal voting changed an outcome of an election without any evidence. There would have to be millions of illegal votes for Obama to have won by “cheating.” If there were millions of illegal votes, surely there would be evidence. Right?
I’m not going to jump to any conclusion without evidence. If you have it, I would love to hear it.
| 220 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:54:30pm |
re: #201 generalsparky
His base wanted a public option or single payer - he has said he WILL sign a bill without either.
The whole “problem” with the healthcare debate was that it was farmore transparent than almost anything else done by congress in recent history.
The public saw how the sausage was made and decided they didn’t like it.
| 221 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:54:53pm |
re: #212 wozzablog
The true believers are not reliably republican voters and will split if the GOP candidate is not to their liking purity wise. The candidate may try and pander - but that doesn’t mean he or she will suceede.
The religious right is the weird-shaped piece in the American jigsaw puzzle. They’re hard to predict, essential to the Republicans in some years, and disproportionately influential. Fascinating, when not terrifying.
| 222 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:55:24pm |
re: #215 Jaerik
There’s also the fact that if you throw out every vote cast by anyone who has ever been registered by Acorn or ever worked for them, Obama still won. By millions of votes.
But Soros! What of SOROS!
/
| 223 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:55:49pm |
re: #217 Obdicut
Legally, does ACORN have to submit all voter registration cards given to them?
Yes! They do!
(IIUC)
| 224 |
prairiefire Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:56:54pm |
re: #221 SanFranciscoZionist
They are terrifying for their zombie like relentlessness./ sorta
| 225 |
blueraven Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:57:01pm |
re: #201 generalsparky
Had their been any attempt at an honest debate on the part of the GOP, instead of lies about death panels and pulling the plug on Grandma, perhaps a c-span debate would have been possible.
When you are dealing with pure obstructionism, lies and taking an innocent amendment and turning it a sinister plot, the time for honest debate has passed. The GOP was never going to come at this with any integrity at all.
| 226 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:58:26pm |
| 227 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:58:50pm |
re: #222 SanFranciscoZionist
But Soros! What of SOROS!
/
“I just want to know, are we going to try to love each other?” - Vicki Vale
“I’d like that, but he’s out there right now, and I’ve got to go to work.” - Batman
| 228 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:58:58pm |
| 229 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 1:59:14pm |
re: #222 SanFranciscoZionist
But Soros! What of SOROS!
/
Most of the people crying about Soros have no idea who he is.
| 230 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:00:14pm |
re: #224 prairiefire
They are terrifying for their zombie like relentlessness./ sorta
It can’t be bargained with. It can’t be reasoned with. It doesn’t feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever.
| 231 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:00:16pm |
re: #225 blueraven
So it’s all the GOP’s fault. Got it.
| 232 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:00:24pm |
re: #228 SanFranciscoZionist
Oh crap. Anyone hurt?
“Israeli media sources report that there was no injuries or damage caused by the rockets. “
Fortunately, no…
| 233 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:00:30pm |
re: #229 darthstar
Most of the people crying about Soros have no idea who he is.
I barely have any idea who he is, and apparently he is the Dark Lord I and my kind serve.
I wish they’d send memos or something about this stuff.
//
| 234 |
bosforus Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:00:47pm |
re: #229 darthstar
Most of the people crying about Soros have no idea who he is.
He’s a palindrome. That’s all I need to know. Hard to trust a palindrome.
| 235 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:01:27pm |
re: #229 darthstar
The Chinese are fascinated with him, and with Jews in general. It’s like they just found out about us.
[Link: shanghaiist.com…]
| 236 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:01:44pm |
re: #195 Soap_Man
I’m not going to argue that. But Democrats or Republicans looking at a group and saying “They don’t vote that much. They will probably vote for us. Let’s get them registered” is not cheating.
Is taking Federal money to do voter registration and signing up thousands of people who are not qualified NOT stealing?
Second if you know that you are supposed to be non-partisan but you continually coach the people doing the registrations to tell registrants to vote for the Democrat, is that not cheating?
Of course the winner would be the one doing the investigations… So democrats who accepted money from ACORN and benefited from these actions are now asked to investigate ACORN. There is lots of evidence, but not much proof. Yet.
| 237 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:02:23pm |
re: #233 SanFranciscoZionist
From Wikipedia…this guy is pure EVIL! ////
Soros is chairman of Soros Fund Management and the Open Society Institute and a former member of the Board of Directors of the Council on Foreign Relations. He played a significant role in the peaceful transition from Communism to Capitalism in Hungary (1984-89),[4] and provided Europe’s largest ever higher education endowment to Central European University in Budapest.[5] Later, his funding and organization of Georgia’s Rose Revolution was considered by Russian and Western observers to have been crucial to its success. In the United States, he is known for having donated large sums of money in an effort to defeat President George W. Bush’s bid for re-election in 2004. He helped found the Center for American Progress.
| 238 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:02:24pm |
re: #233 SanFranciscoZionist
I barely have any idea who he is, and apparently he is the Dark Lord I and my kind serve.
I wish they’d send memos or something about this stuff.
//
I’m sure if you asked 100 registered Democrats who Soros is, 90 would respond with “Who?”
| 240 |
MandyManners Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:03:07pm |
| 241 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:04:05pm |
re: #237 darthstar
From Wikipedia…this guy is pure EVIL! ///
His penchant for metallic suits, long haired white cats and undersea bases certainly reinforces this opinion.
| 242 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:04:12pm |
re: #237 darthstar
From Wikipedia…this guy is pure EVIL! ///
Surely you know, based on my extensive research on Conservapedia, that Wikipedia is a liberally biased source and is all part of the conspiracy. It’s probably run by some evil liberal. Let’s say, um, Soros. Yeah, that fits the bill.
/ (Is the sarc tag needed?)
| 243 |
prairiefire Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:04:43pm |
It is so cold that I have to heat up the water for the humidifiers beforehand to get them to work.
It is so cold that the snowflakes are going up.
| 244 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:04:44pm |
re: #240 MandyManners
Pay back for all those leaflets the IDF is dropping on Gaza.
They were just trying to keep the IDF from killing more trees.
| 245 |
MandyManners Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:05:37pm |
| 246 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:06:21pm |
re: #233 SanFranciscoZionist
Please you expect him to be leading a well organized and disciplined force just because he’s evil? It’s not like he’s a Republican!
| 247 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:06:22pm |
re: #236 Buck
There is lots of evidence, but not much proof. Yet.
Well, when you get that “proof,” make sure you get back to me. I won’t be holding my breath.
| 248 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:06:29pm |
re: #242 Soap_Man
Surely you know, based on my extensive research on Conservapedia, that Wikipedia is a liberally biased source and is all part of the conspiracy. It’s probably run by some evil liberal. Let’s say, um, Soros. Yeah, that fits the bill.
/ (Is the sarc tag needed?)
Ha! Just looked him up on Conservapedia…
George Soros (born August 12, 1930 in Hungary) is a leftist American businessman and one of the richest people in the world, current networth estimated to be at about $8.4 billion. The birth-name of George Soros is György Schwartz, he changed his family name in 1936 from Schwartz to Soros to avoid antisemitism. George Soros later said that he “grew up in a Jewish, anti-semitic home,” and that his parents were “uncomfortable with their religious roots.”[1] Soros is an atheist. [2]
OMFG! He’s an ATHIEST!
| 249 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:06:36pm |
re: #236 Buck
Wow. You’re a real full-blown conspiracy theorist; the proof of your conspiracy is the lack of evidence.
| 250 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:06:46pm |
re: #229 darthstar
Most of the people crying about Soros have no idea who he is.
The question is… WHO is The Question?
| 251 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:06:58pm |
re: #240 MandyManners
Pay back for all those leaflets the IDF is dropping on Gaza.
Well the nice palies have been firing mortars all week even to the point where air IDF payed them a visit, nothing new. I guess they just want to remind everyone that they are still here what with all the focus on Yemen & whatnot they just want to make sure the aid checks keep coming…
| 252 |
karmic_inquisitor Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:07:21pm |
re: #221 SanFranciscoZionist
The religious right is the weird-shaped piece in the American jigsaw puzzle. They’re hard to predict, essential to the Republicans in some years, and disproportionately influential. Fascinating, when not terrifying.
I wonder what the religious right would be able to do if they were handed power to the degree that the liberal side of the Dems have it now.
Thinking out loud, I don’t think they could get Rowe overturned, and even if they did we’d revert to the system of each state having its own law which would be a patchwork of abortion rights, but I can only think of about 10 states where a ban might occur.
As for education, they could float all sorts of crap into the stream and tie it to federal funding, so they’d make an impact there. Creationism would get taught. School prayer would probably be struck down even by a conservative court (IMO) because of existing decisions under conservative courts.
I could see a reimplementation of the Bush policies on science funding and such.
I could see foreign aid getting strings attached on abstinence / abortion issues.
Trying to think of what else
| 253 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:08:10pm |
re: #219 Soap_Man
Voter registration fraud IS a big deal. But you can’t say that illegal voting changed an outcome of an election without any evidence. There would have to be millions of illegal votes for Obama to have won by “cheating.” If there were millions of illegal votes, surely there would be evidence. Right?
I’m not going to jump to any conclusion without evidence. If you have it, I would love to hear it.
I never said he won because of cheating. I know that it probably didn’t effect the outcome. But cheating took place. It doesn’t matter if they actually benefited from the fraud. Obama gave them $800,000, and they used that money to commit the fraud. On my planet, that is serious.
| 254 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:08:18pm |
re: #238 Soap_Man
I’m sure if you asked 100 registered Democrats who Soros is, 90 would respond with “Who?”
and the other 10 would demand a lawyer…
| 255 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:09:10pm |
re: #246 jamesfirecat
you expect him to be leading a well organized and disciplined force
Given that we are talking about Democrats here any talk of a well organised and disciplined force rules out any chance of that happening.
| 256 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:10:16pm |
re: #255 wozzablog
Given that we are talking about Democrats here any talk of a well organised and disciplined force rules out any chance of that happening.
“I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat.” - Will Rogers
| 257 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:10:23pm |
re: #254 brookly red
Yup. But only to sue the stalker producer from O’Reilly’s show asking the question for breach of restraining orders……….
| 258 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:11:49pm |
re: #249 Obdicut
Wow. You’re a real full-blown conspiracy theorist; the proof of your conspiracy is the lack of evidence.
Where did you get that. I said there is lots of evidence. The proof is coming through investigations that take time.
AT least 14 states have opened investigations of ACORN. It takes time.
| 259 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:13:05pm |
re: #257 wozzablog
Yup. But only to sue the stalker producer from O’Reilly’s show asking the question for breach of restraining orders…
yes the master does not like his name mentioned…
| 260 |
Political Atheist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:13:13pm |
re: #180 Obdicut
What I like here is exemplified by a person who inspired couple topics.
Take a look at the anger at Rush L on a couple occasions. Then look at the day he got hospitalized. From anger to real sympathy, all in context.
| 261 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:13:28pm |
| 262 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:14:30pm |
re: #261 wozzablog
There is lots of evidence - it just hasn’t been found yet.
Touche. Touche.
I didn’t say that either….
| 263 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:15:18pm |
re: #258 Buck
Where did you get that. I said there is lots of evidence. The proof is coming through investigations that take time.
AT least 14 states have opened investigations of ACORN. It takes time.
/wow 14 states… not THAT is a vast right wing conspiracy.
| 264 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:15:27pm |
re: #258 Buck
A lot of places have concluded their investigations as well, clearing ACORN of wrongdoing. None so far have found that ACORN, as an organization, did anything illegal.
That doesn’t really fit your conspiracy theory that well, though, so I assume that those are the investigations done by “democrats who accepted money from ACORN and benefited from these actions”, and so you’ll discount them.
Hey, where’d you get this gem from, by the way?
Second if you know that you are supposed to be non-partisan but you continually coach the people doing the registrations to tell registrants to vote for the Democrat, is that not cheating?
Was that from the same source that said that Canada does zero medical research?
| 265 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:16:41pm |
re: #236 Buck
Second if you know that you are supposed to be non-partisan but you continually coach the people doing the registrations to tell registrants to vote for the Democrat, is that not cheating?
It’s inappropriate, and I believe, illegal. What evidence have we of this, and what has been done to address the issue?
| 266 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:17:02pm |
This may help you sort truth from propaganda about ACORN, Buck. I advise you take a look.
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]
| 267 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:17:21pm |
re: #258 Buck
Where did you get that. I said there is lots of evidence. The proof is coming through investigations that take time.
AT least 14 states have opened investigations of ACORN. It takes time.
And if there is proof of wrong-doing, I hope all responsible are at least fired, but hopefully prosecuted.
But I will repeat the two points I have been trying to make.
1) Obama didn’t win anything because of ACORN, and to say otherwise is silly.
2) I need more proof than incedents of wrong-doing from low-level people to demonize an entire org.
| 268 |
MandyManners Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:19:45pm |
re: #258 Buck
Where did you get that. I said there is lots of evidence. The proof is coming through investigations that take time.
AT least 14 states have opened investigations of ACORN. It takes time.
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]
[Link: www.rottenacorn.com…]
[Link: www.nytimes.com…]
| 269 |
Soap_Man Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:19:54pm |
And with that, I hope everyone has a wonderful evening. See you all later.
| 270 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:20:12pm |
Let me ask you (any of you) this:
You work for a company, you embezzle almost a million dollars. The company finds out, but does not fire you. They ask you to sign an IOU saying that you will pay it back.
Someone buys the IOU from the company… basically paying back what you stole.
Is that it? Did anything illegal take place? At this point did anyone cheat?
Well pretending that a company that took money as charity can simply forgive an embezzler….Did you pay taxes on that million dollars? Should you have? Wouldn’t it be strange that no one thinks that you should go to jail for that alone?
OK, you are Dale Rathke…
| 271 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:21:12pm |
re: #262 Buck
You kinda did.
there is lots of evidence. The proof is coming through investigations that take time.
You can’t give us the proof until the investigations have happened……… the investigations that will unveil the proof.
Fairynuff.
| 272 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:21:43pm |
re: #270 Buck
Your analogy posts are marginally more confusing than your normal posts, which are just very baffling.
| 274 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:22:10pm |
re: #268 MandyManners
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]
[Link: www.rottenacorn.com…]
[Link: www.nytimes.com…]
Thanks Mandy. I am scared to do links lately. I don’t have the time to always make sure the site isn’t one that is on the bad list.
| 275 |
Political Atheist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:23:02pm |
re: #16 darthstar
That’s not what I would call a landslide. Reagan got a landslide. 7.2% is only about double what we have for an error factor at 95% confidence interval. I think. Error margin is 2-3% realistically.
| 276 |
Political Atheist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:23:40pm |
re: #20 lawhawk
Palin was not their biggest problem. Not a tiny one, but far from critical.
| 278 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:24:17pm |
re: #272 Obdicut
Your analogy posts are marginally more confusing than your normal posts, which are just very baffling.
I am kinda OK that you don’t understand my posts. It might be you…
| 279 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:24:18pm |
re: #253 Buck
I never said he won because of cheating. I know that it probably didn’t effect the outcome. But cheating took place. It doesn’t matter if they actually benefited from the fraud. Obama gave them $800,000, and they used that money to commit the fraud. On my planet, that is serious.
Sure, it’s serious. No one here is denying that. However, MOST OF THE MONEY went to register real voters, which is what it was for. There was SOME VOTER REGISTRATION FRAUD on the part of low-level employees, not the organization. People got fired over that, as is proper. I don’t know how we get from this to George Soros stealing the 2008 election.
| 280 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:24:24pm |
re: #264 Obdicut
Was that from the same source that said that Canada does zero medical research?
Dr. Richard Rowe took the job of Chief Pediatric Cardiologist at Johns Hopkins Hospital when Dr. Helen Taussig retired. Like Taussig, he was considered one of the best, perhaps the best, kids heart doctors in America.
In the early 1970’s he left Hopkins to run a new Pediatric Cardiology program at The Hospital for Sick Children in Toronto, Canada. Ask any Canadian Lizard, or most of the ones living in the Northeastern US - if your child has a heart problem, Sick Kids Hospital is one of the best places to be.
| 281 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:24:33pm |
re: #274 Buck
That might make you think about the sites you get your news from, then.
| 282 |
blueraven Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:24:54pm |
re: #231 generalsparky
So it’s all the GOP’s fault. Got it.
You said that not me. I say it is just political reality.
| 283 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:24:56pm |
re: #275 Rightwingconspirator
Well good thing we’ve got a supreme court to resolve those pesky “too close to call” elections for us then….
| 284 |
karmic_inquisitor Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:25:06pm |
re: #225 blueraven
Had their been any attempt at an honest debate on the part of the GOP, instead of lies about death panels and pulling the plug on Grandma, perhaps a c-span debate would have been possible.
When you are dealing with pure obstructionism, lies and taking an innocent amendment and turning it a sinister plot, the time for honest debate has passed. The GOP was never going to come at this with any integrity at all.
Well there are criticisms out there that aren’t of the hyper-ventilating sort - they just don’t get airtime.
For example, if the Senate bill goes through then I would be better off to simply cancel my insurance that I currently pay for (self employed) and pay the annual penalty and wait until I get sick to get insurance. Since insurers can’t turn me or my family down, I come out ahead. This will become a common practice, IMO. Certainly those who aren’t insured now but could afford it (they exist) would have no incentive to get insured.
Another example is that the bulk of the new restrictions are aimed at insurers but not provider networks. Providers have significant leverage and have regional oligopolies and continue to drive costs upward. but because they are largely made up of doctors and hospitals, no one wants to force them to take less money. Some are now no longer taking medicare because they have adopted higher cost structures (many have built new facilities) and those costs can’t be cut. The Mayo clinic has decided to do this at a few of their locations IIRC. If there is no mechanism for controlling costs at the provider level and a larger number patients to treat, you are going to see a spike in fees with nothing to restrain it.
Those are 2 of several issues with the Senate legislation that have nothing to do with hyperventilated distortions. They speak to two sides of the transaction - an incentive for fewer to buy insurance while costs go up with no real constraints. If the legislation passes, these will be real problems and there will have to be a round 2 because the price of insurance won’t be going down.
the fact that they don’t get air time has two causes IMO - (1) Glenn Beck et al can’t explain them (doesn’t make for simplified boogey man scenarios on chalk boards), and (2) health car proponents have an easier time engaging on death panels and other provably false claims rather than deal with these criticisms.
| 285 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:25:56pm |
re: #279 SanFranciscoZionist
Sure, it’s serious. No one here is denying that. However, MOST OF THE MONEY went to register real voters, which is what it was for. There was SOME VOTER REGISTRATION FRAUD on the part of low-level employees, not the organization. People got fired over that, as is proper. I don’t know how we get from this to George Soros stealing the 2008 election.
/well he didn’t steal anything, he bet on all of the horses… it’s good to be a billionaire.
| 286 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:26:07pm |
re: #280 SteveC
Yeah, I know. Buck the other day claimed that Canada produced zero medical research. It was such a ridiculous lie that it has stuck in my mind.
Canada is kicking ass in biotech research, especially with graft-versus-host and other transplant stuff.
| 287 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:26:34pm |
re: #270 Buck
Let me ask you (any of you) this:
You work for a company, you embezzle almost a million dollars. The company finds out, but does not fire you. They ask you to sign an IOU saying that you will pay it back.
Someone buys the IOU from the company… basically paying back what you stole.
Is that it? Did anything illegal take place? At this point did anyone cheat?
Well pretending that a company that took money as charity can simply forgive an embezzler…Did you pay taxes on that million dollars? Should you have? Wouldn’t it be strange that no one thinks that you should go to jail for that alone?
OK, you are Dale Rathke…
What?
| 288 |
MandyManners Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:26:35pm |
re: #270 Buck
Let me ask you (any of you) this:
You work for a company, you embezzle almost a million dollars. The company finds out, but does not fire you. They ask you to sign an IOU saying that you will pay it back.
Someone buys the IOU from the company… basically paying back what you stole.
Is that it? Did anything illegal take place? At this point did anyone cheat?
Well pretending that a company that took money as charity can simply forgive an embezzler…Did you pay taxes on that million dollars? Should you have? Wouldn’t it be strange that no one thinks that you should go to jail for that alone?
OK, you are Dale Rathke…
[Link: www.nytimes.com…]
| 289 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:26:50pm |
re: #275 Rightwingconspirator
That’s not what I would call a landslide. Reagan got a landslide. 7.2% is only about double what we have for an error factor at 95% confidence interval. I think. Error margin is 2-3% realistically.
Error margin is something that applies to polls (usually around 1,000 people) to estimate the overall opinion on a topic/candidate. These numbers are based on 120 million votes, and are actual counts. Margin of error = 0%.
Reagan did get a landslide victory. This one wasn’t as lopsided as his, but by most accounts it’s a landslide…especially if you look at the electoral college.
| 291 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:27:33pm |
re: #286 Obdicut
Yeah, I know. Buck the other day claimed that Canada produced zero medical research. It was such a ridiculous lie that it has stuck in my mind.
Canada is kicking ass in biotech research, especially with graft-versus-host and other transplant stuff.
/and it’s a damn shame that Canadians need to come here just to get a cat scan.
| 292 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:28:02pm |
re: #284 karmic_inquisitor
I’ll give you credit you raise a side of the “no denying people with pre-existing conditions” issue that I hadn’t considered before?
What should we do about it? (Not trying to be sarcastic)
What if we imposed a waiting period where insurance doesn’t cover anything for X amount of time after you buy it…. though that’s just ideas off the top of my head so I’m sure there are better solutions…
| 293 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:28:33pm |
re: #274 Buck
Thanks Mandy. I am scared to do links lately. I don’t have the time to always make sure the site isn’t one that is on the bad list.
rottenacorn.com is a straight up html page (no scripts). nytimes is the New York times…best for you if you avoid reading it as you might find it disagreeable. littlegreenfootballs, well, you’re already here…so take off the tin-foil hat and relax a while.
| 294 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:29:28pm |
re: #286 Obdicut
Yeah, I know. Buck the other day claimed that Canada produced zero medical research. It was such a ridiculous lie that it has stuck in my mind.
Canada is kicking ass in biotech research, especially with graft-versus-host and other transplant stuff.
Buck is…. how can I say this gracefully?…. uninformed.
| 295 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:29:36pm |
| 296 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:30:22pm |
re: #287 SanFranciscoZionist
What?
I think Buck is pointing out that the illegal activities of ACORN employees is not confined to just the minimum wage earners in that organization. But I could be wrong.
| 297 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:30:31pm |
re: #291 brookly red
/and it’s a damn shame that Canadians need to come here just to get a cat scan.
US citizens travel to other countries for medical procedures, including to Canada. Canadians travel to other countries for medical procedures, including to the US.
Canada does great radiology research as well, by the way.
| 298 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:30:51pm |
re: #291 brookly red
/and it’s a damn shame that Canadians need to come here just to get a cat scan.
Who cares? They pay, unlike those folks who we can’t give access to health care, or they will overrun the system and cause rationing.
//
| 299 |
Linden Arden Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:31:28pm |
re: #258 Buck
Where did you get that. I said there is lots of evidence. The proof is coming through investigations that take time.
AT least 14 states have opened investigations of ACORN. It takes time.
They’re bogus and were all forced by Karl Rove.
When US Attorney Steve Iglesius of New Mexico refused to buckle under Rove’s pressure he got fired along with 8-9 others.
| 300 |
blueraven Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:31:44pm |
re: #284 karmic_inquisitor
I agree with most of what you say, but that doesn’t negate the fact that any and all things said in debate that can be taken out of context can and will be used to smear the good parts of the bill. And since we have a media that is willing to embrace and promote said smears, its just not worth it.
| 301 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:32:13pm |
re: #281 Obdicut
That might make you think about the sites you get your news from, then.
I do a quick Google search. It comes up with 100,000 hits. I don’t have the time to sort through it to make sure it is sanitary.
You want to deny that there are more than 10 states investigating ACORN and voter registration?
If the same crime is committed by multiple low level employees working for the same organization over multiple states (low level employees who never met), thousands of miles apart then you have evidence that the leaders of that organization is committing the crime. You might even have evidence of a conspiracy. Now you would then look to who funded this wide spread fraud, in order to find the leaders and investigate them.
| 302 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:32:21pm |
re: #291 brookly red
/and it’s a damn shame that Canadians need to come here just to get a cat scan.
No question, Canada’s got problems. Everyone does, somewhere or the other. But there are areas they excel.
| 303 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:32:57pm |
re: #298 SanFranciscoZionist
Who cares? They pay, unlike those folks who we can’t give access to health care, or they will overrun the system and cause rationing.
//
OH, OK more Canadians Please!
| 304 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:33:26pm |
re: #301 Buck
I do a quick Google search. It comes up with 100,000 hits. I don’t have the time to sort through it to make sure it is sanitary.
You want to deny that there are more than 10 states investigating ACORN and voter registration?
If the same crime is committed by multiple low level employees working for the same organization over multiple states (low level employees who never met), thousands of miles apart then you have evidence that the leaders of that organization is committing the crime. You might even have evidence of a conspiracy. Now you would then look to who funded this wide spread fraud, in order to find the leaders and investigate them.
Dude…you need another obsession. ACORN is a non-starter.
| 305 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:33:57pm |
re: #296 generalsparky
I think Buck is pointing out that the illegal activities of ACORN employees is not confined to just the minimum wage earners in that organization. But I could be wrong.
Thanks. Mandy’s link helped clarify that.
| 306 |
Kewalo Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:34:19pm |
re: #258 Buck
Where did you get that. I said there is lots of evidence. The proof is coming through investigations that take time.
AT least 14 states have opened investigations of ACORN. It takes time.
The CRS report has come out and vindicated ACORN.
[Link: www.npr.org…]
It has been all wild accusations with no proof.
| 307 |
Randall Gross Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:34:56pm |
re: #268 MandyManners
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]
[Link: www.rottenacorn.com…]
[Link: www.nytimes.com…]
Here’s the Lobbyist behind that “rotten acorn” center link. Hint: even his friends call him “Dr. Evil”.
[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
| 308 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:35:39pm |
re: #301 Buck
I do a quick Google search. It comes up with 100,000 hits. I don’t have the time to sort through it to make sure it is sanitary.
Why not? I mean, you don’t care about the accuracy of your information, is that what you’re saying?
You want to deny that there are more than 10 states investigating ACORN and voter registration?
Uh… show me ‘denying’ anything, Buck.
re: #301 Buck
Have you shared your insights with law enforcement? They probably need your wisdom.
| 309 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:36:22pm |
re: #301 Buck
I do a quick Google search. It comes up with 100,000 hits. I don’t have the time to sort through it to make sure it is sanitary.
You want to deny that there are more than 10 states investigating ACORN and voter registration?
If the same crime is committed by multiple low level employees working for the same organization over multiple states (low level employees who never met), thousands of miles apart then you have evidence that the leaders of that organization is committing the crime. You might even have evidence of a conspiracy. Now you would then look to who funded this wide spread fraud, in order to find the leaders and investigate them.
Oh, just gaze.
| 310 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:36:48pm |
re: #294 SteveC
Buck is… how can I say this gracefully?… uninformed.
I mis spoke, and agreed to take it back. I am sure you have never mispoke.
Obdicut knows this, and has beating me senseless on that one point. Obdicut is an asshole.
| 311 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:36:51pm |
re: #302 SteveC
No question, Canada’s got problems. Everyone does, somewhere or the other. But there are areas they excel.
/well let’s see how well they handle the swarms of illegal Americans coming in search of work.
| 312 |
Four More Tears Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:37:39pm |
| 313 |
Interesting Times Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:38:08pm |
re: #291 brookly red
/and it’s a damn shame that Canadians need to come here just to get a cat scan.
I got one right here in Ontario. And within a week, after my doctor flagged it as urgent. I also got chest x-rays and an appointment with a cardiologist (this was in response to an unexplained fainting spell I had). Yes, I know you used a sarc tag, but after hearing constant demonization of the Canadian health care system (from the likes of Faux News and disingenuous Republican officials, using wild exaggerations and outright lies), this subject tends to rub me the wrong way. Is our system perfect? No. Would I exchange it for the system the US has now, especially if I were low-income? Hell no.
| 314 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:38:13pm |
OT ,,,, the Ragin Cajun, James Carville!
[Link: washingtonscene.thehill.com…]
“Let me buy a [security] card, then go and measure my penis, and let me get on the airplane,” he said.
great ,,,,, now I have the image of both of Carvilles heads!!
///
BAD SATT ,, BAD BAD BAD
| 315 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:38:17pm |
re: #305 SanFranciscoZionist
GAH! I realized after I posted to you that Mandy had actually given you a link. I got distracted by a certain little one in my house before I hit send lol
| 316 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:38:36pm |
re: #311 brookly red
/well let’s see how well they handle the swarms of illegal Americans coming in search of work.
I wonder what Lou Dobbs would make of that.
| 317 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:38:41pm |
re: #310 Buck
I mis spoke, and agreed to take it back. I am sure you have never mispoke.
Obdicut knows this, and has beating me senseless on that one point. Obdicut is an asshole.
I usually disagree with him myself but that does not make him an asshole.
| 318 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:39:19pm |
re: #315 generalsparky
GAH! I realized after I posted to you that Mandy had actually given you a link. I got distracted by a certain little one in my house before I hit send lol
I’m in study hall, supervising a bunch of big ones, so I quite understand!
| 319 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:39:35pm |
Even here we spend more time talking about ridiculous side issues and pointing fingers than coming up with real solutions or asking real questions. I don’t think we had a good choice for President this last election (I narrowly preferred McCain but…) and don’t see a better option next time. Maybe we could spend the next couple years farrowing out likely candidates. We could use someone level headed, intelligent, well spoken, generally honest and not certifiable. Haven’t heard ANY names yet. Suggestions? I’m an Independent voter so don’t care what party.
| 320 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:39:59pm |
re: #318 SanFranciscoZionist
I’m in study hall, supervising a bunch of big ones, so I quite understand!
must ,,,, resist !!!
| 321 |
Four More Tears Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:40:08pm |
| 322 |
karmic_inquisitor Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:41:49pm |
re: #292 jamesfirecat
I’ll give you credit you raise a side of the “no denying people with pre-existing conditions” issue that I hadn’t considered before?
What should we do about it? (Not trying to be sarcastic)
What if we imposed a waiting period where insurance doesn’t cover anything for X amount of time after you buy it… though that’s just ideas off the top of my head so I’m sure there are better solutions…
Hey - I admit it is a very thorny problem.
Back in the early 90s I started a very short lived software company that was going to do capitated cost control for medical providers. The software was built on the assumption that there would be a single-payer system out there (the Clinton reform model) and we came up with ways of integrating existing systems and data feeds to allow providers to see where opportunities existed in different markets for cost savings on a per-head basis.
Then Hillary-care got killed.
To be candid, there are two paths to reform, IMO. One is to actually embrace allowing market forces to devastate certain sectors in the health care industry. People who claim we have a free market system right now are way off - there are so many subsidies and protections from competition that it in no way resembles a free market. DC is thick with lobbyists in health care because they want to preserve protection from competition and preserve the subsidy stream. The only reform they will embrace is one that means bigger subsidies and more protections (which they will now get via the Senate bill).
The other is a single payer system like Clinton proposed.
While conservatives often talk free markets, they tend to like it in certain places and not in others. Few are willing to see drug companies go BK and a drug be unavailable for a while, or a medical group lock their doors one morning, or any similar disruptions. Ultimately we will get a single payer system.
| 323 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:42:21pm |
re: #310 Buck
I mis spoke, and agreed to take it back. I am sure you have never mispoke.
Nope, never. Not once. I can’t spell worth a crap, but I have never misspoke.
Obdicut knows this, and has beating me senseless on that one point. Obdicut is an asshole.
Your momma know you eat with that mouth?
//
| 324 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:43:59pm |
re: #323 SteveC
Your momma know you eat with that mouth?
//
No, but I kiss your mother with this mouth Trebek!
/Sean Connery mode
| 325 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:44:04pm |
re: #314 sattv4u2
OT ,,, the Ragin Cajun, James Carville!
great ,,, now I have the image of both of Carvilles heads!!
///
BAD SATT ,, BAD BAD BAD
Having that image was bad, but spreading the love to everyone else was downright cruel!
//
| 326 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:44:29pm |
re: #325 SteveC
Having that image was bad, but spreading the love to everyone else was downright cruel!
//
tis The Season of GIVING!
| 327 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:44:57pm |
re: #310 Buck
I wouldn’t be beating you at all if you weren’t now spouting silliness about a grand conspiracy theory that hinges on ‘stacking the deck’ by the evil, evil act of registering people to vote.
That you admit that you don’t even vet any of the information you find for accuracy is just jam for tea.
| 328 |
wrenchwench Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:45:53pm |
re: #299 Linden Arden
They’re bogus and were all forced by Karl Rove.
When US Attorney Steve Iglesius of New Mexico refused to buckle under Rove’s pressure he got fired along with 8-9 others.
From your link:
In 2006, Iglesias was fired as U.S. attorney thanks partly to his reluctance to pursue voter-fraud cases as aggressively as DOJ wanted —
I don’t know about the other ones that got fired, but Iglesias was dragging his feet instead of prosecuting a few Democrats who are now serving time. He never mentions that.
| 329 |
Interesting Times Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:46:02pm |
re: #327 Obdicut
That you admit that you don’t even vet any of the information you find for accuracy is just jam for tea
…bagging? /sorry
| 330 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:46:09pm |
One of my kids is performing his latest rap, sotto voce, to some other kids in the study hall. I just caught the line “Falling, like the wall in Berlin,”
I guess we are teaching them something.
| 331 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:46:38pm |
re: #326 sattv4u2
tis The Season of GIVING!
That was sooo last month. It is officially the season of Hang On To The Receipt So I Can Take It Back!
| 332 |
karmic_inquisitor Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:46:48pm |
re: #300 blueraven
I agree with most of what you say, but that doesn’t negate the fact that any and all things said in debate that can be taken out of context can and will be used to smear the good parts of the bill. And since we have a media that is willing to embrace and promote said smears, its just not worth it.
There is a yang to that yin - those defending the bill will always showcase the criticisms that are most erroneous.
One of the Oxbloggers once wrote that the best opponent is someone willing to engage your best argument. That doesn’t happen too often and I admit to often failing that test myself.
| 333 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:47:01pm |
re: #319 Escaped Hillbilly
Snowe— though she’s getting on in years.
Huntsman.
Weiner— no matter if you agree with his politics, he’s a straightforward, honest dude.
| 334 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:47:05pm |
re: #306 Kewalo
The CRS report has come out and vindicated ACORN.
[Link: www.npr.org…]
It has been all wild accusations with no proof.
Man you are really funny. That report is by the people who benefited directly from the fraud ACORN committed.
The sentence “no instances of individuals allegedly registered to vote improperly by ACORN “attempting to vote at the polls.” is a master in spin.
Were individuals registered to vote improperly by Acorn? (even if they didn’t attempt to vote?) Is Voter Registration fraud a crime? (even if it didn’t lead to voter fraud?)
AND I repeat, if the same crime is committed by multiple low level employees working for the same organization over multiple states (low level employees who never met), thousands of miles apart then you have evidence that the leaders of that organization are organized and committing the crime.
You might even have evidence that the leaders of that organization committed the crime of conspiracy to commit Voter Registration fraud.
| 335 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:47:20pm |
re: #327 Obdicut
I wouldn’t be beating you at all if you weren’t now spouting silliness about a grand conspiracy theory that hinges on ‘stacking the deck’ by the evil, evil act of registering people to vote.
well as long as those people are: A. alive, B. eligible to vote & C. only do it once we got no problem…
| 336 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:47:21pm |
Hey Obdicut, you ever finish that book?
| 337 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:47:52pm |
re: #330 SanFranciscoZionist
One of my kids is performing his latest rap, sotto voce, to some other kids in the study hall. I just caught the line “Falling, like the wall in Berlin,”
I guess we are teaching them something.
Yep - but does he really know what that event meant?
That’s what is/was so important.
I didn’t think I’d see that wall come down in my lifetime. But it did.
| 338 |
AlexRogan Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:48:22pm |
re: #86 Killgore Trout
Paulians blame the Jews…
Mossad Tied to ‘Underwear Bomber’
And Paulian anti-Semitism rears it ugly f**king head once again….uggghhhhh!
| 339 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:48:37pm |
re: #336 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Crap, no I didn’t. Sorry, work took over for awhile. I spend most of my reading time with actual physical books in my hands. I ought to order it.
Sorry, it totally slipped my mind.
| 341 |
Stanley Sea Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:48:59pm |
re: #330 SanFranciscoZionist
One of my kids is performing his latest rap, sotto voce, to some other kids in the study hall. I just caught the line “Falling, like the wall in Berlin,”
I guess we are teaching them something.
That is very cool.
| 342 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:49:08pm |
re: #328 wrenchwench
I don’t know about the other ones that got fired, but Iglesias was dragging his feet instead of prosecuting a few Democrats who are now serving time. He never mentions that.
Plus - don’t US Attorneys serve at the pleasure of the President?
Don’t they all fire at least a few?
| 343 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:49:30pm |
re: #317 brookly red
I usually disagree with him myself but that does not make him an asshole.
I don’t think he is an asshole for disagreeing with me. But for continually bringing up that one point as if it was a really big deal. I conceded that point, and he is making like it is the basis for my every debate point. That makes him an asshole.
| 344 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:49:30pm |
re: #333 Obdicut
Weiner— no matter if you agree with his politics, he’s a straightforward, honest dude.
Your attention please: Obdicut’s Weiner has officially been declared straight and honest!
//BAD Steve!
| 345 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:49:52pm |
re: #337 reine.de.tout
My parents, who are academics, were ecstatic— partially for their Eastern European friends who could now do scholarship in the light of day without having to cater to Communist sensibilities, but also because the Eastern Bloc states were terrible about sharing the original manuscripts they held.
| 346 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:50:16pm |
re: #337 reine.de.tout
Yep - but does he really know what that event meant?
That’s what is/was so important.
I didn’t think I’d see that wall come down in my lifetime. But it did.
I didn’t expect it either. I grew up in the town and attended college where Winston Churchill gave his “Iron Curtain Speech.” It was so amazing when the Berlin Wall came down!
| 347 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:50:42pm |
re: #319 Escaped Hillbilly
Why does Obama not meet that list?
You can disagree with him/mock him/not like him if you want to I just want to understand where exactly your problem with his him lays…
| 348 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:51:32pm |
re: #339 Obdicut
Crap, no I didn’t. Sorry, work took over for awhile. I spend most of my reading time with actual physical books in my hands. I ought to order it.
Sorry, it totally slipped my mind.
Kind of in book limbo right now. I’ve caught up on everything I was reading and can’t find myself interested in anything else right now.
| 349 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:51:38pm |
re: #338 talon_262
It’s one reason Paulistinians hate Soros.
| 350 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:51:46pm |
re: #334 Buck
AND I repeat, if the same crime is committed by multiple low level employees working for the same organization over multiple states (low level employees who never met), thousands of miles apart then you have evidence that the leaders of that organization are organized and committing the crime.
Since you haven’t responded to several questions and clarifications I’ve offered regarding some other points, I’m gazing on them.
However, if you think that ten different nineteen-year-olds in ten different cities, having been told they’ll be paid a buck for each voter who fills out the card will not come to the same conclusion—that it might be a good idea to fill out ten or twenty extra cards with fake info—I have a bridge I want to sell you.
As evidence of conspiracy, that’s a trifle thin. Any of my high school freshmen could come up with that idea.
Also, if ACORN higher-ups had instructed employees to do this, why in God’s name did they tell the officials they submitted the forms to that there were bad registrations among them?
| 351 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:52:45pm |
re: #343 Buck
I don’t think he is an asshole for disagreeing with me. But for continually bringing up that one point as if it was a really big deal. I conceded that point, and he is making like it is the basis for my every debate point. That makes him an asshole.
as I said I usually disagree with him myself, but the rules of the game are don’t call other posters names. It just like that.
| 352 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:52:57pm |
re: #342 reine.de.tout
Dropping back in just for this -
There was nothing run of the mill about it and Gonzalez lost a lot of his credibillity when he went to the hill to testify about these events and couldn’t “remember” anything.
[Link: www.time.com…]
Theres lots of good reading on it at good sources - but watch some of Gonzalez’s appearences on the issue - they should make your mind up for you ;-)
| 353 |
wrenchwench Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:53:04pm |
re: #342 reine.de.tout
Plus - don’t US Attorneys serve at the pleasure of the President?
Don’t they all fire at least a few?
Yep, and yep. I forget the stats, but I think Clinton fired 90% of ‘em when he took office. I’m sure someone will correct me if I’m way off.
| 354 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:53:11pm |
re: #348 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Have you read any Ian M. Banks?
If not, try The Player of Games.
| 355 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:53:27pm |
Gotta run—need to let the volleyball team into the locker room.
| 356 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:55:07pm |
re: #355 SanFranciscoZionist
Gotta run—need to let the volleyball team into the locker room.
That’s when the trouble usually starts! :)
| 357 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:55:26pm |
re: #355 SanFranciscoZionist
Gotta run—need to let the volleyball team into the locker room.
Bow-chicka-bow-bow.
| 358 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:55:39pm |
re: #353 wrenchwench
Clinton got rid of a lot - but these attorneys were Republicans fired by a Republican president in bulk. Just don’t ask the former attorney general or his staff about any of it.
Gonzales’ top deputy later claimed the firings were necessary because of “performance-related” issues. But it was later revealed that all but two of the dismissed prosecutors had won outstanding evaluations for competence.
| 359 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:56:32pm |
re: #352 wozzablog
Dropping back in just for this -
There was nothing run of the mill about it and Gonzalez lost a lot of his credibillity when he went to the hill to testify about these events and couldn’t “remember” anything.
[Link: www.time.com…]
Theres lots of good reading on it at good sources - but watch some of Gonzalez’s appearences on the issue - they should make your mind up for you ;-)
Here’s what I was looking for:
The White House approves all U.S. attorneys, who function as the federal government’s chief prosecutors in 93 jurisdictions around the country. As political appointees, they serve “at the pleasure of the President,” and can be replaced, at least theoretically, at any time for any reason. But group firings in the middle a presidential term are highly unusual
The article does on to say that group firings in the middle of a presidential term are unusual.
I think it’s just not a good idea to get into a pissing match about the firings of US attorneys - I think every President has done it, and David Vitter & Mary Landrieu are in some sort of snit with each other right now over the US Attorney in N.O. (whether he’ll be reappointed or not).
| 361 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:57:54pm |
re: #333 Obdicut
I was not previously aware of Jon Huntman as potential Pres. Seems the current administration has used the old trick of drawing competent oppononents into one’s own camp. If he becomes too enmeshed in the administrations politics in China, he might not be able to distance himself from their politics come election time. Maybe not the best move accepting that apointment. I like his tax stance. I will do further research and thank you.
| 362 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:58:09pm |
re: #358 wozzablog
Clinton got rid of a lot - but these attorneys were Republicans fired by a Republican president in bulk. Just don’t ask the former attorney general or his staff about any of it.
Gonzales’ top deputy later claimed the firings were necessary because of “performance-related” issues. But it was later revealed that all but two of the dismissed prosecutors had won outstanding evaluations for competence.
In government, and this I know, no one in his/her right mind is ever going to give his/her appointee a bad performance review.
| 363 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:58:58pm |
re: #361 Escaped Hillbilly
He’s doing good service for his country in China. I honestly think that’s why he took that position.
| 364 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:59:37pm |
re: #327 Obdicut
That you admit that you don’t even vet any of the information you find for accuracy is just jam for tea.
I did no such thing.
| 365 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:59:43pm |
re: #354 Obdicut
Have you read any Ian M. Banks?
If not, try The Player of Games.
Holding out for the next couple Horus Heresy books for right now.
| 366 |
MandyManners Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:59:45pm |
re: #355 SanFranciscoZionist
Gotta run—need to let the volleyball team into the locker room.
Is that what you kids are calling it nowadays?
| 367 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 2:59:59pm |
re: #353 wrenchwench
Yep, and yep. I forget the stats, but I think Clinton fired 90% of ‘em when he took office. I’m sure someone will correct me if I’m way off.
I thought it was a lot, too.
Makes my point - it’s silly to get into a pissing match here about fired US Attorneys - it will get nowhere, all Presidents have fired at least some.
| 368 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:01:01pm |
re: #367 reine.de.tout
I thought it was a lot, too.
Makes my point - it’s silly to get into a pissing match here about fired US Attorneys - it will get nowhere, all Presidents have fired at least some.
/but, but, was it for political reasons?
| 369 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:02:04pm |
re: #345 Obdicut
My parents, who are academics, were ecstatic— partially for their Eastern European friends who could now do scholarship in the light of day without having to cater to Communist sensibilities, but also because the Eastern Bloc states were terrible about sharing the original manuscripts they held.
So - many more reasons than just the obvious ones!
re: #346 generalsparky
I didn’t expect it either. I grew up in the town and attended college where Winston Churchill gave his “Iron Curtain Speech.” It was so amazing when the Berlin Wall came down!
It was amazing. I just sat with my mouth open. Could not believe it.
| 370 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:02:18pm |
re: #364 Buck
I do a quick Google search. It comes up with 100,000 hits. I don’t have the time to sort through it to make sure it is sanitary.
| 371 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:02:20pm |
re: #368 brookly red
/but, but, was it for political reasons?
/only if it is a Republican doing the firing!
| 372 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:02:47pm |
re: #359 reine.de.tout
Being of a legal disposition myself i feel strongly about the subversion of the Justice Department - and thats what it was - it was highly irregular and none of the reasons given for it stuck.
We differ on the seriousness of it - but it was unusual and was entirely symptomatic of what was happening inside the Justice department of the former administration where they were prepared to eat their own enmasse.
| 373 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:03:23pm |
re: #369 reine.de.tout
Yes. To them, the greatest thing in the world is doing open scholarship. That, to them, was the greatest oppression of the Soviet bloc; censorship.
| 374 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:04:20pm |
re: #372 wozzablog
Being of a legal disposition myself i feel strongly about the subversion of the Justice Department - and thats what it was - it was highly irregular and none of the reasons given for it stuck.
We differ on the seriousness of it - but it was unusual and was entirely symptomatic of what was happening inside the Justice department of the former administration where they were prepared to eat their own enmasse.
It was unusual - but I’m thinking their mistake was trying to give reasons in the first place, when they did not have to do so.
| 375 |
funky chicken Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:04:58pm |
re: #30 karmic_inquisitor
FWIW, it would have been an electoral landslide with Palin or with Lieberman.
The entire Get Out The Vote operation for the GOP is firmly in the hands of the social conservatives. They have carved that out and own it, much of it originally organized through church groups in the late 80s.
That would have gone away with a Lieberman pick which would have given the field to Obama.
Picking Palin was meant to appease the wingers but they became the narrative while making their dislike of McCain always known (party unity is a one way street with SoCons and has been since 1992).
He would have lost either way - picking a SoCon light running mate would have been foiled because Obama had opposition research on all of them. Palin became a wild card and knocked Obama off guard for a couple of weeks. But as Palin talked the independents left the tent.
All that and many SoCons still stayed home because McCain wasn’t “conservative enough”.
Unfixable situation. The civil war within the party has to happen. Right now it looks like a coup regarding Steele.
great (and sad) analysis
| 376 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:07:37pm |
re: #369 reine.de.tout
I was in middle school and wrote an article about it for the school paper. My best friend went to Germany a year or so later and brought me back a little piece of the wall which I still have.
| 377 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:08:40pm |
| 378 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:08:48pm |
re: #350 SanFranciscoZionist
Since you haven’t responded to several questions and clarifications I’ve offered regarding some other points, I’m gazing on them.
If I missed anything, I regret it. I have been busy. I am trying to answer everything.
However, if you think that ten different nineteen-year-olds in ten different cities, having been told they’ll be paid a buck for each voter who fills out the card will not come to the same conclusion—that it might be a good idea to fill out ten or twenty extra cards with fake info—I have a bridge I want to sell you.
As evidence of conspiracy, that’s a trifle thin. Any of my high school freshmen could come up with that idea.
Also, if ACORN higher-ups had instructed employees to do this, why in God’s name did they tell the officials they submitted the forms to that there were bad registrations among them?
To answer your last question first, Not every official did do that, and the ones that did, did so to cause chaos just before the early polling.
Submitted the forms from who? Did they just find them laying on the sidewalks? Did they have no responsibility to vet the people doing the work. AND even after seeing the problem occur in past years (since 1986) they have no responsibility to do anything about it?
As to the canvasing and voter registration fraud at the same time:
| 380 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:10:48pm |
re: #379 Buck
Sanitary… is not the same as accurate.
Why do I get the feeling your keyboard (among other things) is covered with Saran wrap?
| 381 |
prairiefire Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:11:18pm |
re: #346 generalsparky
I didn’t expect it either. I grew up in the town and attended college where Winston Churchill gave his “Iron Curtain Speech.” It was so amazing when the Berlin Wall came down!
Hey, A fellow Show Me Stater?! Yeah!
| 382 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:12:36pm |
re: #379 Buck
Sanitary… is not the same as accurate.
What is it, then? There really aren’t that many sites that are banned from LGF. And they are banned for their misinformation.
| 383 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:12:52pm |
Ok. headed back out.
Need coffee.
Don’t know if i’ll be dropping back in tonight.
| 384 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:13:20pm |
| 385 |
Kewalo Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:13:34pm |
re: #334 Buck
I live in WA. We were one of the first states to prosecute some of those low level folks that worked for ACORN, there were 7 of them. It cost the organization a bundle of money when these low level employees were caught. No way would I ever think that the organization would take that chance.
[Link: seattletimes.nwsource.com…]
IMO it’s ridiculous to think there is some type of conspiracy on that part of ACORN.
| 386 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:15:42pm |
re: #347 jamesfirecat
Sorry, I was away from the computer grabbing some dinner. Pres. Obama is not stupid or crazy and he can talk well (doesn’t put his foot in his mouth too often etc.). But I disagree with so many of his political positions I could not vote for him. And I think what makes a candidate great is having all the basic characteristics I mentioned and the gumption to stand up to people who are his best allies and closest friends and do what is right. It has been a really long time since we’ve had such a leader. But it seems we are sliding further down the rabbit hole with no one strong enough to pull us back, Repub, Dems, Greens, Commies, Luddites…
| 388 |
karmic_inquisitor Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:16:31pm |
Drive by link related to health care reform -
[Link: www.politico.com…]
One of the key voices for Congressional health care legislation, MIT economist Jon Gruber, is taking fire from the precincts of the left that oppose the Senate plan over the fact that he is on contract with Department of Health and Human Services.
He’s been paid $297,600, according to federal documents, to produce “a technical memorandum on the estimated changes in health insurance coverage and associated costs and impacts to the government under alternative specifications of health system reform.” The contract, which was awarded June 19, wasn’t widely known or regularly disclosed.
| 389 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:17:49pm |
re: #378 Buck
Submitted the forms from who?
The National Mail Voter Registration Form
The National Mail Voter Registration Form is the one document that allows you to register to vote from anywhere in the United States.
Or you can google “printable voter registration form” and have a blast.
| 390 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:18:41pm |
re: #385 Kewalo
I live in WA. We were one of the first states to prosecute some of those low level folks that worked for ACORN, there were 7 of them. It cost the organization a bundle of money when these low level employees were caught. No way would I ever think that the organization would take that chance.
[Link: seattletimes.nwsource.com…]
IMO it’s ridiculous to think there is some type of conspiracy on that part of ACORN.
Seven prosecutions, but no conspiracy? how many people have to be involved before it’s a conspiracy?
| 391 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:19:13pm |
re: #390 brookly red
Seven prosecutions, but no conspiracy? how many people have to be involved before it’s a conspiracy?
All of ‘em.
/
| 392 |
Velvet Elvis Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:19:18pm |
re: #367 reine.de.tout
I thought it was a lot, too.
Makes my point - it’s silly to get into a pissing match here about fired US Attorneys - it will get nowhere, all Presidents have fired at least some.
It’s customary for them to resign at the beginning of a new president’s term so that the new president can appoint their replacement. Bush’s appointees not wanting to resign is actually a break in precedent going back over a century.
| 393 |
badger1970 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:19:20pm |
re: #388 karmic_inquisitor
I just got done reading that. It’s kind of like being an umpire at your son’s baseball game. Calling the game fairly or not, it’s still going to look “funny”.
| 394 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:19:42pm |
re: #380 darthstar
Why do I get the feeling your keyboard (among other things) is covered with Saran wrap?
There are sites, that post accurate information, but are banned from being linked to in comments. I don’t want to make a mistake like that.
Obdicut has taken one comment I made (and I was really exaggerating when I said it) and has followed me with it. He has basically said that if I got that wrong, then everything I say is wrong.
I really meant to say that COMPARED to the medical innovation contributions made by the USA, countries with socialized medicine contribute less. I can’t prove it, BUT I am entitled to my opinion on that.
I retracted the ZERO medical innovation contribution comment and conceded that Canada does not contribute ZERO medical innovation. It was not that important to my point.
| 395 |
Kewalo Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:22:18pm |
re: #372 wozzablog
You might find this interesting.
[Link: www.talkingpointsmemo.com…]
I followed this issue at Talking Points Memo, who originally broke the story.
| 396 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:22:18pm |
re: #390 brookly red
Seven prosecutions, but no conspiracy? how many people have to be involved before it’s a conspiracy?
It’s not the number its the intent. One of the wilder theories I’ve ever heard about the JFK Assassination was that Oswald fired from the 6th floor window while at the same moment a mysterious second gunman fired from the Grassy Knoll. But since neither one knew about the other, it wasn’t a conspiracy.
//Industrial strength stupid!
| 397 |
windsagio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:22:39pm |
re: #390 brookly red
err… no number.
You know “Conspiracy” doesn’t just mean ‘a whole bunch of people’ right?
| 398 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:23:07pm |
| 399 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:23:29pm |
re: #394 Buck
Obdicut has taken one comment I made (and I was really exaggerating when I said it) and has followed me with it. He has basically said that if I got that wrong, then everything I say is wrong.
You didn’t just get it wrong. It was the exact opposite of the truth.
I really meant to say that COMPARED to the medical innovation contributions made by the USA, countries with socialized medicine contribute less. I can’t prove it, BUT I am entitled to my opinion on that.
No. You are not entitled to your opinion on factual matters. Canada produces huge amounts of medical innovation, especially in biotech. Your opinion doesn’t matter one bit in that regard.
There are sites, that post accurate information, but are banned from being linked to in comments. I don’t want to make a mistake like that.
Which sites that Charles has banned do you feel have accurate information?
| 400 |
Velvet Elvis Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:24:02pm |
re: #378 Buck
Plus, voter registration fraud has nothing to do with voting fraud. There’s zero evidence that any of the fraudulently registered names resulted in a fraudulent vote being cast.
| 401 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:24:16pm |
re: #394 Buck
There are sites, that post accurate information, but are banned from being linked to in comments. I don’t want to make a mistake like that.
If you’re referring to a site like HotAir, I suppose linking to it isn’t advised. If there’s a site that you’d like to reference, but not “link”, you can give the name of the site and remove the http : // from the front of the url, and people can copy/paste it to their browser without it being a link from LGF. If Charles doesn’t like that, he’ll let you know.
for example, here’s a link to cbs sports (notice how it’s not hyperlinked because I removed the http stuff from the front.
www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/12755419/playoff-preview-rushing-in-past-tense-in-passintense-postseason
So, if you have a valid site with “accurate” information, share it.
| 402 |
windsagio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:24:34pm |
re: #399 Obdicut
Which sites that Charles has banned do you feel have accurate information?
last bit deserves repeating and bolding for emphasis.
| 403 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:25:28pm |
re: #398 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
And they were both professional models.
///
Nobody’s ever seen the Mysterious Second Gunman and lived (cue spooky music) but IIRC, Oswald fit that old high school cheer:
U-G-L-Y he ain’t got no alibi, he’s ugly!
| 404 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:25:56pm |
re: #397 windsagio
err… no number.
You know “Conspiracy” doesn’t just mean ‘a whole bunch of people’ right?
No they would have to be “acting in concert” for it to be a conspiracy… so I guess we just have a whole bunch of lone extremists acting independently across 14 states. The system works!
| 405 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:26:03pm |
re: #399 Obdicut
I might add, Buck, that a massive amount of the medical innovation produced in the US is done at state universities, the CDC, and other government-funded and government run-facilities. Oh noes, socialism!
| 406 |
garhighway Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:26:20pm |
re: #390 brookly red
Red, there is no numeric qualifier in the definition of a conspiracy, other than it takes more than one. But it requires that the participants conspire. Act in concert. Be in on the scheme. Together.
I’ll bet that on any given day, dozens of Walmart employees steal from their employer. Is that a conspiracy? Or is it a bunch of people acting badly because they all succumbed to essentially the same temptation?
So to with Acorn. A bunch of minimum wage people all succumb to the temptation to pad their take by filling in some extra forms. Must they be acting in concert? And does it matter whether there are 2 or 7? I don’t think so. It just does not follow.
The Acorn meme is a way for people who cannot wrap their minds around the idea that their countrymen chose Obama to console themselves.
| 407 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:26:38pm |
re: #381 prairiefire
Hey, A fellow Show Me Stater?! Yeah!
Hey there! For now I am in the state next door. I would much rather be on the other side of the Mighty Mississippi though ;-)
| 408 |
Blueheron Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:26:40pm |
re: #20 lawhawk
An inexperienced backbencher becomes President and an inexperienced VP nominee is what caused McCain to lose in 2008?
It’s the economy (and being not Bush) that helped Obama win in 2008 along with McCain’s own missteps - including the economy mess. Obama was more hopey/changey than McCain’s maverickness could allow for.
The McCain people are looking for jobs for the 2010 and 2012 election cycles and this is yet another attempt to distance themselves from the 2008 debacle. Palin is a punching bag for the McCain people - and deservedly so in some cases, but at the same time they ought to look in the mirror themselves because it was their guy who ultimately chose Palin as a running mate.
I think it is time for them to stop using Palin as a punching bag. As Judge Judy and Lawhawk says “You picked her. Tough.”
| 409 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:27:10pm |
re: #405 Obdicut
I might add, Buck, that a massive amount of the medical innovation produced in the US is done at state universities, the CDC, and other government-funded and government run-facilities. Oh noes, socialism!
I’ve still got the tape in the sound system, do we need SPOOKY MUSIC here?
| 410 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:27:18pm |
re: #404 brookly red
Although there are a lot of bartenders who take money out of the till, there is no conspiracy on the part of bartenders to take money out of tills.
Or, to put it another way:
How does it benefit ACORN to have invalid voter registrations submitted?
The people who turn in fraudulent cards are ripping off ACORN by doing so.
| 411 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:27:29pm |
re: #389 SteveC
Or you can google “printable voter registration form” and have a blast.
So you are saying that ACORN got the fraudulent forms in the mail? and were forced to submit them?
I wasn’t talking about blanks…. Someone made the point that ACORN must submit completed forms. As if they just arrived at their doorstep. ACORN was paid money to organize the voter registration drive. ACORN applied for the job, and I am sure pointed to their many years of organizing people.
HOWEVER, it seems to be impossible to do voter registration without huge amounts of voter registration fraud. No one can do it. It just seems to happen. AND my fellow lizards have accepted this. It isn’t any ones fault. All voter registration must accept huge amounts of fraud. It does not matter who runs the organization. The managers at the top are victims of the low level people at the bottom. Over and over again. Over multiple states, thousands of miles apart.
I actually feel sorry for the people at the top of ACORN. Victims they are, simple victims.
| 412 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:27:33pm |
re: #406 garhighway
The Acorn meme is a way for people who cannot wrap their minds around the idea that their countrymen chose Obama to console themselves.
Bingo.
| 413 |
windsagio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:27:46pm |
re: #404 brookly red
did you read SFZ’s explanation? It actually makes alot more sense than a conspiracy.
just to repeat: The likely answer is that these low paid piecework employees figured out they could game the system by turning in false registrations. It happens all the time, with petition gatherers too.
| 414 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:28:22pm |
re: #390 brookly red
Seven prosecutions, but no conspiracy? how many people have to be involved before it’s a conspiracy?
The number involved don’t matter; what’s required is to show a connection to higher levels of management who actively promoted such activity.
Thousands of employees steal from WalMart, Home Depot and Target. This doesn’t make the executives of those organizations guilty of theft.
Dozens - maybe hundreds - of employees of those same companies cheat on their taxes, steal electricity from their utility company and beat their wives on a regular basis. None of which makes upper management culpable for those offenses.
I’ve discussed my opinion of ACORN here many times - the organization drips slime, has for years, and is about as ethically challenged as any such organization can possibly get. None of which, however, is against any law. If someone brings forth some actual evidence of wrongdoing on the part of ACORN’s directors, I would happily hand out candy in the streets at the news. But so far, no such evidence has been presented, and numerous investigations have uncovered nothing that prosecutors have been able to turn into a conviction - or even to justify bringing charges.
If it makes anyone feel any better - or worse - I view the contention that Diebold was involved in a conspiracy to perpetrate election fraud even more laughable. But definitely in the same category as many of the accusations slung against ACORN.
| 415 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:29:16pm |
re: #400 Conservative Moonbat
Plus, voter registration fraud has nothing to do with voting fraud. There’s zero evidence that any of the fraudulently registered names resulted in a fraudulent vote being cast.
Once again…. is voter registration fraud illegal or not? It is it a crime or not? EVEN IF IT DOESN’T LEAD TO VOTER FRAUD?
| 416 |
windsagio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:29:37pm |
| 417 |
windsagio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:30:16pm |
re: #415 Buck
not reading; its a crime, and the the people that actually committed the crime were punished.
| 418 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:30:17pm |
re: #410 Obdicut
Although there are a lot of bartenders who take money out of the till, there is no conspiracy on the part of bartenders to take money out of tills.
Or, to put it another way:
How does it benefit ACORN to have invalid voter registrations submitted?
The people who turn in fraudulent cards are ripping off ACORN by doing so.
Oh ACORN actually is the victim now I get it…
| 419 |
alexknyc Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:30:30pm |
re: #361 Escaped Hillbilly
I was not previously aware of Jon Huntman as potential Pres. Seems the current administration has used the old trick of drawing competent oppononents into one’s own camp. If he becomes too enmeshed in the administrations politics in China, he might not be able to distance himself from their politics come election time. Maybe not the best move accepting that apointment. I like his tax stance. I will do further research and thank you.
On the other hand, it does allow him to be in China while the rest of his party goes off the rails at home.
| 420 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:30:36pm |
| 421 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:30:55pm |
re: #411 Buck
So you are saying that ACORN got the fraudulent forms in the mail? and were forced to submit them?
No. I’m saying that if you want a standardized blank voter registration form (a version of which ACORN probably used) Google can give you a list in 0.45 seconds.
| 422 |
Blueheron Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:31:04pm |
re: #53 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
His track record led me to have low expectations.
At least he has one.
| 423 |
windsagio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:31:32pm |
re: #420 darthstar
haha well I wanna be careful. There are some established posters on here that are carrying on about ACORN. I don’t wanna give the impression I’m accusing them of being racist >>
| 424 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:31:38pm |
re: #419 alexknyc
Excellent point. At this point, wish I could join him.
| 425 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:32:17pm |
re: #392 Conservative Moonbat
It’s customary for them to resign at the beginning of a new president’s term so that the new president can appoint their replacement. Bush’s appointees not wanting to resign is actually a break in precedent going back over a century.
Clinton’s must not have wanted to resign either then, if the Bush admin had to fire so many of them in an unusual move.
Perhaps customary to offer a resignation and continue to serve until replaced?
| 426 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:32:51pm |
re: #418 brookly red
Well, yes. If ACORN hires some dudes to go register voters in a poor black neighborhood who would then go (almost certainly) to vote for Obama, and instead those people they hired fill out a bunch of fake forms, that translates to fewer votes for Obama.
So, again, what benefit is it to ACORN to have a bunch of registration forms that are faulty?
| 427 |
windsagio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:33:12pm |
re: #425 reine.de.tout
if yer still referring to the DA’s, he sure took his sweet time ‘replacing’ them 5-6 years into his presidency.
| 428 |
darthstar Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:33:15pm |
Okay, time to pick up my boys at the planet.
Have a good one, everybody.
| 430 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:33:23pm |
re: #421 SteveC
No. I’m saying that if you want a standardized blank voter registration form (a version of which ACORN probably used) Google can give you a list in 0.45 seconds.
I would just settle for an ID check of all voters & then we can put all the doubts behind us. Can’t we?
| 431 |
Kewalo Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:33:33pm |
re: #390 brookly red
Seven prosecutions, but no conspiracy? how many people have to be involved before it’s a conspiracy?
I’m really sorry that the Times didn’t have a picture of these people, then you would rest easy that they didn’t conspire with each other. I’m not even sure they knew each other. They were like the day workers you see out in front of somewhere with signs saying “will work for food.”
Lawd, I know how awful that sounds, but I just can’t think of another way to put it so you’d understand.
| 432 |
RealismRox Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:34:36pm |
re: #430 brookly red
I would just settle for an ID check of all voters & then we can put all the doubts behind us. Can’t we?
Are you kidding? It disproportional disenfranchises low-income voters and the elderly, who may not have government issued ID cards. There’s no law anywhere that says you have to have ID.
| 433 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:35:01pm |
re: #430 brookly red
I would just settle for an ID check of all voters & then we can put all the doubts behind us. Can’t we?
THOUGHTCRIME! She’s making sense!
| 434 |
Blueheron Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:35:43pm |
re: #60 jamesfirecat
Yes but bare in mind, if anything happens to McCain in the 2 or 3 years… not to mention President is a job which carries a lot of stress…
How do you feel about the possibility of President Palin?
Also even if McCain won, with the current congress we’d just end up with a huge kerfluffle between a dark blue congress and a red president which would get even less done than our current one is…
What’s bad about that? Keeps them busy and out of our hair./
| 435 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:36:00pm |
re: #427 windsagio
if yer still referring to the DA’s, he sure took his sweet time ‘replacing’ them 5-6 years into his presidency.
I’m talking about US attorneys.
And - yes, took his time.
Positives to that, as well as negatives.
| 436 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:36:44pm |
re: #431 Kewalo
I’m really sorry that the Times didn’t have a picture of these people, then you would rest easy that they didn’t conspire with each other. I’m not even sure they knew each other. They were like the day workers you see out in front of somewhere with signs saying “will work for food.”
Lawd, I know how awful that sounds, but I just can’t think of another way to put it so you’d understand.
I live a few blocks from an ACORN office in downtown Bklyn. Some of my neighbors work for them. I know some of them personally. I don’t need pictures of them.
| 437 |
windsagio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:37:23pm |
re: #435 reine.de.tout
oops yeah I meant attorneys, I hate messups like that, they ruin the whole point.
So you think that… wow. Hows this, given the delay, it is in no way the same as the customary changing of the guard. Its just not. He was in his second term, fer chrissakes!
| 438 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:37:39pm |
re: #432 RealismRox
Are you kidding? It disproportional disenfranchises low-income voters and the elderly, who may not have government issued ID cards. There’s no law anywhere that says you have to have ID.
yes I thought so…
| 439 |
TampaKnight Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:37:52pm |
I think ACORN helps people.
I think Obama won fair and square.
I think ACORN did in fact have members acting illegally.
I think none of that matters now.
Is that too simplistic?
It’s Friday and work was long….time for a drink.
| 441 |
windsagio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:38:26pm |
| 442 |
hokiepride Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:38:32pm |
Steve Schmidt’s campaign strategy was horrible as was the whole stunt of suspending the campaign for the TARP vote. Axelrod ran a much better funded and disciplined campaign. Steve, if you had just done your job well, we would not be having this discussion, so why don’t you win an election first before commenting on others?
| 443 |
Velvet Elvis Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:38:39pm |
re: #415 Buck
Once again… is voter registration fraud illegal or not? It is it a crime or not? EVEN IF IT DOESN’T LEAD TO VOTER FRAUD?
If it is or if it isn’t, it’s nothing to get your panties in a bunch over. The worst it does it make things harder for workers at the county court clerk’s office. It does not in any way effect the outcomes of elections and is not a partisan issue.
| 444 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:39:36pm |
re: #432 RealismRox
Are you kidding? It disproportional disenfranchises low-income voters and the elderly, who may not have government issued ID cards. There’s no law anywhere that says you have to have ID.
No law requires ID Non sequiter. I have been as por as they come. The poor actually have MORE forms of ID. Medicare and Medicade cards, Soc Sec cards, Welfare and Food Stamp cards. Have you ever tried to apply for any government assistance? They ask more questions than the Military Intelligence Agents vetting our Soldiers.
| 445 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:39:46pm |
re: #401 darthstar
You can also link to the google cache of any site, too. Though if it’s trash, it may still get you in trouble.
| 446 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:39:50pm |
re: #441 windsagio
“Some of my best friends work for ACORN…”
/sorry I couldn’t resist.
no actually that would disqualify them from friendship.
| 447 |
windsagio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:40:54pm |
re: #446 brookly red
Lord, thats awful.
“Helping the poor and needy is so awful, I can’t be seen with people like that!”
| 448 |
SteveC Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:41:13pm |
re: #439 TampaKnight
It’s Friday and work was long…time for a drink.
A Lizard for less than 24 hours and he makes a comment that brilliant!?!?! Tampa, I’m nominating you for Lizard of the Hour!
// A high honor!
///But you have to buy a round!
| 449 |
RealismRox Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:41:17pm |
re: #444 Escaped Hillbilly
I’m just very much against government mandated ID checks for voting. I think that’s something people on both sides of the political spectrum can agree on. Except for some Republicans who think it’s just a way to suppress Democratic voters.
| 450 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:41:34pm |
re: #432 RealismRox
Are you kidding? It disproportional disenfranchises low-income voters and the elderly, who may not have government issued ID cards. There’s no law anywhere that says you have to have ID.
No, but if you want government benefits, some sort of ID is required. I recently had to apply for AllKids (govt kid insurance here in IL) and it required multiple forms of ID. So I don’t really understand how some sort of ID required for voting would be any different or difficult for the poor than requiring ID for WIC, Food Stamps, state insurance etc.
| 451 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:41:44pm |
re: #447 windsagio
Lord, thats awful.
“Helping the poor and needy is so awful, I can’t be seen with people like that!”
you just earned a gaze.
| 452 |
Kewalo Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:41:50pm |
re: #415 Buck
Of course it’s a crime and here in WA they were prosecuted and convicted. And ACORN was fined $25,000. But it just isn’t the crime of the century and had nothing to do with Obama winning the WH.
| 453 |
RealismRox Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:42:27pm |
Well, you don’t have the right to government hand-outs either, and people can not take the benefits even if they are eligible.
| 454 |
TampaKnight Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:42:28pm |
re: #448 SteveC
A Lizard for less than 24 hours and he makes a comment that brilliant!?!?! Tampa, I’m nominating you for Lizard of the Hour!
// A high honor!
///But you have to buy a round!
Thank you, I accept this honor by pouring everyone a tall glass of Gentleman Jack, my whiskey of choice.
Cheers!
| 455 |
blueraven Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:42:48pm |
re: #439 TampaKnight
I think ACORN helps people.
I think Obama won fair and square.
I think ACORN did in fact have members acting illegally.
I think none of that matters now.Is that too simplistic?
It’s Friday and work was long…time for a drink.
Bottoms up! Mind if I join you? Make mine a double.
| 456 |
garhighway Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:42:48pm |
Let’s not kid ourselves: what we are seeing with the “voter fraud” and “ID check” movements are a new and mean-spirited way of messing with the electoral process. No longer is it enough for some to try and get their voters registered and to the polls. (That has been a time-honored and between-the-lines part of politics forever.) Now one side has decided that unfavorable electoral math requires them to take steps to actively discourage the other side’s voters from voting. Some techniques are subtle, like ID check, some, like voter purging exercises, are less so.
But trying to keep the other guy’s voters from the polls is a relatively new thing, and it is evil.
| 457 |
windsagio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:43:27pm |
re: #451 brookly red
uh oh, I’m intimidated! I’ll meekly let you have your way!
| 458 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:44:03pm |
re: #452 Kewalo
Of course it’s a crime and here in WA they were prosecuted and convicted. And ACORN was fined $25,000. But it just isn’t the crime of the century and had nothing to do with Obama winning the WH.
so they got fined… so the government just took back some of the money they gave them in the first place with a warning not to get caught again.
| 459 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:44:07pm |
re: #414 SixDegrees
Actual evidence of wrongdoing on the part of ACORN’s directors:
Dale Rathke admitted to embezzling almost one million dollars, and the ACORN International President Wade Rathke (his brother) did not report it to authorities. Wade has admitted that as well. Dale was not even fired.
To avoid paying taxes on that million dollars, Dale signed an IOU promising to pay it back (at $30K a year, about the interest he would make on that million). He did not pay it all back, but a wealthy contributor bought the note. getting Dale off the hook.
Basically Dale has admitted (evidence is the IOU) to taking a million dollars and not paying taxes on it. AND the board made it possible for him to do so.
AND there seems to be nothing anyone can do about it.
| 460 |
RealismRox Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:44:57pm |
re: #456 garhighway
True, but in the past there were more laws that discriminated against big groups of voters (women, african-americans, illiterates, etc). So it’s an old game, just this is a new angle to ask for voter ID. It appeals to people who don’t think through the consequences, or just want some people to stay home.
| 461 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:46:20pm |
re: #417 windsagio
not reading; its a crime, and the the people that actually committed the crime were punished.
Not seeing that all have been…
| 462 |
Linden Arden Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:46:38pm |
ACORN no doubt threw Maine, Iowa, New Hampshire and all those other urban minority filled states to Obama for sure!
(snark)
| 463 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:47:14pm |
re: #437 windsagio
oops yeah I meant attorneys, I hate messups like that, they ruin the whole point.
So you think that… wow. Hows this, given the delay, it is in no way the same as the customary changing of the guard. Its just not. He was in his second term, fer chrissakes!
Hm.
I never said it was the same as the customary changing of the guard.
Or if I did, I did not intend to.
My only points are:
1. These positions serve at the pleasure of the President so regardless of when it comes (or IF it comes), they should all expect to be replaced at a change of administration. And no reasons need be given.
2. It’s silly for us here to get into an argument or discussion about which president did what as re: US attorneys, because at some point every president has acted in a way with respect to appointed jobs that somebody has an issue with. And such a discussion would lead to a “well, YOUR guy did this”, followed by, “oh yeah, well YOUR guy did that … “. And it goes nowhere.
| 464 |
Velvet Elvis Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:47:27pm |
re: #425 reine.de.tout
Clinton’s must not have wanted to resign either then, if the Bush admin had to fire so many of them in an unusual move.
Perhaps customary to offer a resignation and continue to serve until replaced?
It’s customary for them all to be replaced at the beginning of a new administration. Because of the abnormal firings during the Bush administration some of Bush’s appointees are trying to hang in there and make a stink if Obama tries to fire them, despite it being a break in over 100 years of precedent.
| 465 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:47:42pm |
re: #443 Conservative Moonbat
Whoah. It most certainly does do something, which is why it is a crime. A couple elections ago a whole room full of military absentee ballots didn’t get couted…not because they weren’t received in time but because the underpaid emplyees couldn’t count them fast enough. They were wasting time trying to figure out how the “hanging chads” were going to effect the ellection so had decided to count them by hand, three times. These stupid little non issues turn into real issues when legitimate voters get disenfranchised because of the chaos they cause.
| 466 |
Opal Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:48:25pm |
re: #328 wrenchwench
“re: #328 wrenchwench -
I don’t know about the other ones that got fired, but Iglesias was dragging his feet instead of prosecuting a few Democrats who are now serving time. He never mentions that.”
I’m not sure why my reply to wasn’t posted. I just wanted to know if there was a link about the Democrats that are serving time. I had not heard that there were ever any convictions in New Mexico, so I always thought Iglesias had a legitimate complaint against the administration. I’ve done a Google, but can’t find a link with the details. Thanks in advance for any link you provide.
| 467 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:49:25pm |
re: #459 Buck
Actual evidence of wrongdoing on the part of ACORN’s directors:
Dale Rathke admitted to embezzling almost one million dollars, and the ACORN International President Wade Rathke (his brother) did not report it to authorities. Wade has admitted that as well. Dale was not even fired.
To avoid paying taxes on that million dollars, Dale signed an IOU promising to pay it back (at $30K a year, about the interest he would make on that million). He did not pay it all back, but a wealthy contributor bought the note. getting Dale off the hook.
Basically Dale has admitted (evidence is the IOU) to taking a million dollars and not paying taxes on it. AND the board made it possible for him to do so.
AND there seems to be nothing anyone can do about it.
None of which has anything at all to do with voter fraud.
See my previous post; among the directors of WalMart, Home Depot and Target there are surely those who have committed tax fraud, embezzled from the company and sexually harassed their secretaries. None of this makes the employees of those organizations culpable for those crimes.
Just to repeat myself: you have to establish actual evidence of wrongdoing even to bring charges. So far, no one has done so.
If you have actual evidence of crimes committed by ACORN for which they can be successfully prosecuted, by all means present it. In fact, present it to prosecutors in the appropriate jurisdictions, as well.
So far, though, you haven’t done so.
| 468 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:49:34pm |
re: #443 Conservative Moonbat
If it is or if it isn’t, it’s nothing to get your panties in a bunch over. The worst it does it make things harder for workers at the county court clerk’s office. It does not in any way effect the outcomes of elections and is not a partisan issue.
OK, so it doesn’t matter to you. ACORN accepts money from the government to do voter registration. A large percentage of those forms are fraudulent. year after year, election after election. The same sort of fraud.
Nothing to get your panties in a bunch over.
| 469 |
Blueheron Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:49:48pm |
re: #465 Escaped Hillbilly
Whoah. It most certainly does do something, which is why it is a crime. A couple elections ago a whole room full of military absentee ballots didn’t get couted…not because they weren’t received in time but because the underpaid emplyees couldn’t count them fast enough. They were wasting time trying to figure out how the “hanging chads” were going to effect the ellection so had decided to count them by hand, three times. These stupid little non issues turn into real issues when legitimate voters get disenfranchised because of the chaos they cause.
Well said.
| 470 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:50:10pm |
re: #464 Conservative Moonbat
It’s customary for them all to be replaced at the beginning of a new administration. Because of the abnormal firings during the Bush administration some of Bush’s appointees are trying to hang in there and make a stink if Obama tries to fire them, despite it being a break in over 100 years of precedent.
OK.
Well, what the discussion here started about was Bush’s firing of Clinton appointees who didn’t want to be fired and there was a huge hue and cry (stink) over that.
I honestly believe that as far as appointed “serving at the pleasure of” positions go, an elected official has the right to appoint who he wants and who he thinks will serve him and his agenda well.
| 471 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:50:58pm |
re: #463 reine.de.tout
To your point #2. It has become the definition of political discourse.
| 472 |
windsagio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:50:58pm |
re: #463 reine.de.tout
Hmm; maybe I’ve just heard that particular argument a few too many times, I’m from WA originally and our guy that got canned was one of the big names in the scandal.
“At will” is fine, but the actual allegation is alot worse than that. Suborning the Justice Department and turning it into a political tool is a pretty corrupt and vicious thing to do. And thats what this comes down to.
Also I’d love to push the point more, but I have to go out and do things, so peace >>
| 473 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:51:23pm |
re: #468 Buck
OK, so it doesn’t matter to you. ACORN accepts money from the government to do voter registration. A large percentage of those forms are fraudulent. year after year, election after election. The same sort of fraud.
Nothing to get your panties in a bunch over.
save your breath, the answer is obvious.
| 474 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:51:28pm |
re: #449 RealismRox
No. Why check ID for anything if the whole thing can get hijacked? Really, how do you know who is voting, how many times, etc.
What really is the fear? Big brother already knows who you are, how much money you make, where you live…You’re afraid he’ll know you’re voting?
| 475 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:52:03pm |
OT ,,
Happy 75th Birthday, Elvis Presley
(wherever you are ,,,,,)
| 476 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:52:21pm |
re: #468 Buck
What percentage would that be, Buck?
| 477 |
prairiefire Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:52:48pm |
re: #407 generalsparky
Might be warmer. We have a bad case of cabin fever. No school this week, though they were supposed to go back on Tuesday. I’m spending a crazy amount of time on LGF to be able to speak to some fellow grown-ups. All company included!
| 478 |
RealismRox Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:52:55pm |
re: #474 Escaped Hillbilly
I just think it puts a restriction on a constitutionally guaranteed right. If voter identification is required through showing government-issued ID is what people want, there should be an amendment to the Constitution.
| 479 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:53:24pm |
re: #471 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
To your point #2. It has become the definition of political discourse.
Yes, it seems so, sadly.
I’d just as soon not participate
| 480 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:53:51pm |
re: #475 sattv4u2
OT ,,
Happy 75th Birthday, Elvis Presley
(wherever you are ,,,)
/well according to ACORN he is in Cleavland.
and Boston, and Newark, & Pittsburgh & …
| 481 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:53:54pm |
re: #475 sattv4u2
He died on my 15th birthday. It was also the day that the girl who would grow to become the woman I married moved to my town.
All in all, a pretty bad day.
| 482 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:53:55pm |
re: #468 Buck
ACORN accepts money from the government to do voter registration. A large percentage of those forms are fraudulent. year after year, election after election.
How large a percentage is “large”? And how does that percentage compare with the percentage of fraudulent registrations submitted by other groups?
| 483 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:54:20pm |
re: #434 Blueheron
Well ideally the point of having a congress is for them to get some laws passed, otherwise we really are paying them for nothing.
| 484 |
Velvet Elvis Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:54:29pm |
re: #459 Buck
This is well known. It also has nothing to do with the org’s political functioning.
| 485 |
Boondock St. Bender Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:55:05pm |
re: #483 jamesfirecat
Sometimes i’d prefer they did nothing….lol
| 487 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:56:05pm |
re: #386 Escaped Hillbilly
“So you’re saying that Obama is in fact “level headed, intelligent, well spoken, generally honest and not certifiable” do I have that right?
| 488 |
reine.de.tout Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:56:25pm |
| 489 |
Blueheron Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:56:57pm |
re: #482 SixDegrees
How large a percentage is “large”? And how does that percentage compare with the percentage of fraudulent registrations submitted by other groups?
| 490 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:57:11pm |
re: #478 RealismRox
Why? Constitution would not require amending. I am not speaking for anybody but myself. But please tell me what your objections are. I am actually interested, not trying to just argue.
| 491 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:57:23pm |
re: #442 hokiepride
Wow you know you’re screwing things up when the Democrats are acting more disciplined then you are!
| 493 |
Blueheron Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:57:37pm |
re: #483 jamesfirecat
Well ideally the point of having a congress is for them to get some laws passed, otherwise we really are paying them for nothing.
Hey nothing has alot going for it. /
| 494 |
prairiefire Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:58:09pm |
re: #425 reine.de.tout
Clinton’s must not have wanted to resign either then, if the Bush admin had to fire so many of them in an unusual move.
Perhaps customary to offer a resignation and continue to serve until replaced?
I believe that all of Clinton’s were replaced at the beginning of Bush’s term. This was a second wave of firings. With the variety of reasons given, and the following testimony from a few of the AG’s that they were feeling political pressure, raised red flags.
| 495 |
TampaKnight Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:58:15pm |
re: #483 jamesfirecat
Well ideally the point of having a congress is for them to get some laws passed, otherwise we really are paying them for nothing.
Not necessarily. I don’t think we want them needlessly passing laws and regulation just for the sake of being busy. If anything, I’d prefer they took some time to figure out how to roll back/repeal the current role of government in matters throughout the nation.
| 496 |
RogueOne Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:59:09pm |
re: #399 Obdicut
Canada produces…..
[Link: www.crisisstates.com…]
The latest numbers I can find are from 2000 but you know your statement about canada producing “huge amounts” of anything other than snow is b.s.
Medical Patents granted by USPTO:
U.S. 63.3% of total
Canada 3% of total
OTOH, you’re absolutely correct about where that research gets its funding…. tax payers. I just read somewhere (I can find it if you’d like) that more than 60% of all funding is done with federal funds. This is the reason I’m torn on forcing drug companies to lower costs within the U.S.. If we’re the ones paying for the research we should be getting a cut on the price.
| 497 |
brookly red Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:59:10pm |
| 498 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 3:59:55pm |
re: #456 garhighway
I think the KKK would disagree with you on how its a “new thing” or maybe its just like that song “everything old is new again…”
| 499 |
Blueheron Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:00:15pm |
re: #482 SixDegrees
How large a percentage is “large”? And how does that percentage compare with the percentage of fraudulent registrations submitted by other groups?
Okay once again….cause something ate what I typed.
Do you know how many dead voters vs live voters were registered in Chicago during Kennedy’s campaign ?
And was the percentage large? :))
| 500 |
tradewind Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:00:16pm |
Yeah, that’s a problem not limited to Republicans. Ted Kennedy couldn’t stop referring to Obama as ’ Usama ‘.
| 501 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:00:36pm |
re: #495 TampaKnight
I’d prefer they took some time to figure out how to roll back/repeal the current role of government in matters throughout the nation.
That would be akin to me coming up with ways to lessen my work load, thereby ensuring that in time my employer won;’t need me anymore!
| 502 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:00:43pm |
re: #410 Obdicut
Although there are a lot of bartenders who take money out of the till, there is no conspiracy on the part of bartenders to take money out of tills.
OK, lets take your example. You own a company. AND you get paid by that company to run it. You are the president.
Another company hires you to use your company resources to do something for them. Doesn’t matter what… but in this case hire Bartenders and manage them so that they serve liquor. You get $50 for every $10 you pay the bartender. The bartenders you hire keep stealing from your client. You know this, but you don’t care. You get your $50 even if they steal.
They are probably stealing because YOU don’t pay them enough. BUT you see no reason to stop the stealing because if and when they get caught, only they go to jail, and your client seems to be ok with it.
The client seems to be ok with it because the person at that company who decided to hire you keeps getting large checks from you in the form of donations.
Years pass, and you continue to do nothing about it, except to pass a portion of the money your client is paying you back to that client.
| 503 |
Kewalo Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:01:04pm |
re: #494 prairiefire
Yes, you’re right. All of the Attorney’s General that were fired after ‘04 had been put into office by Bush in 2001-02. Evidently it is very unusual for them to be replaced in mid term.
| 505 |
Velvet Elvis Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:02:19pm |
re: #465 Escaped Hillbilly
Whoah. It most certainly does do something, which is why it is a crime. A couple elections ago a whole room full of military absentee ballots didn’t get couted…not because they weren’t received in time but because the underpaid emplyees couldn’t count them fast enough. They were wasting time trying to figure out how the “hanging chads” were going to effect the ellection so had decided to count them by hand, three times. These stupid little non issues turn into real issues when legitimate voters get disenfranchised because of the chaos they cause.
No, that wouldn’t happen because fraudulent registrations don’t result in fraudulent votes. You think Bart Simpson and Donald Duck would actually show up and try and cast ballots? It only creates a headache at the point when voter registration cards are being issued and there is no evidence that registration fraud has ever resulted in someone with a valid registration getting a voter registration card..
| 506 |
TampaKnight Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:02:57pm |
re: #501 sattv4u2
I’d prefer they took some time to figure out how to roll back/repeal the current role of government in matters throughout the nation.
That would be akin to me coming up with ways to lessen my work load, thereby ensuring that in time my employer won;’t need me anymore!
I’m not sure of it’s accuracy, but I saw a chart recently that claimed that there are now more government jobs than there are jobs in the private sector. And the number of govt jobs has been rising steadily for nearly 60 years.
If so, that’s truly scary (to me). I’d like to return emphasis and influence back to the productive sector of the country.
| 507 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:03:37pm |
re: #482 SixDegrees
How large a percentage is “large”? And how does that percentage compare with the percentage of fraudulent registrations submitted by other groups?
That should not matter… Fraud is fraud… however… In Nevada Acorn submitted 91,002 completed forms in Clark County, which includes Las Vegas, of which 23,186 turned out to be valid new voters.
There are way too many examples for me to even start cutting and pasting… do a search in google for acorn voter registration fraud
| 508 |
Velvet Elvis Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:04:06pm |
re: #468 Buck
OK, so it doesn’t matter to you. ACORN accepts money from the government to do voter registration. A large percentage of those forms are fraudulent. year after year, election after election. The same sort of fraud.
Nothing to get your panties in a bunch over.
It’s not a large percentage. I seriously doubt it’s even 1%.
| 509 |
karmic_inquisitor Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:04:40pm |
re: #483 jamesfirecat
Well ideally the point of having a congress is for them to get some laws passed, otherwise we really are paying them for nothing.
I would love to see a congress that concentrated on consolidating and eliminating some laws.
This isn’t an anti-government impulse. It is just that we have over 200 years of laws on the books and a great many of them (taken together) are arcane and difficult to apply / enforce. That creates uncertainty which helps create litigation. It also creates bureaucracies that have to be intensely staffed to navigate the law when a new problem comes up. And then congress will send down a capricious change to address some issue that voters are aware of and the system gets yet more complex.
Government should be in the information business and should therefore greatly benefit from cheap processors and software. yet the numbers of employees grows. And they are mostly hard working, earnest people trying to make sense of what they are asked to do with an abundance of caution (often an over abundance IMO) applied to avoid making mistakes.
We should be able to implement the application of regulation with a series of nested if-then statements and increase productivity greatly. We can’t.
| 510 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:07:22pm |
re: #502 Buck
Nice post, Buck. Although, people who steal because you don’t pay them enough; are the same people who steal if you pay them enough.
| 511 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:07:51pm |
re: #508 Conservative Moonbat
It’s not a large percentage. I seriously doubt it’s even 1%.
[Link: www.nytimes.com…]
Acorn submitted 91,002 completed forms in Clark County, which includes Las Vegas, of which 23,186 turned out to be valid new voters.
The indictment includes 13 counts each against Acorn and its former Las Vegas field director, Christopher Edwards, who is accused of creating an incentive program called “blackjack” because $5 was paid for signing more than 21 prospective voters.
Also indicted was Acorn’s former deputy regional director, Amy Busefink, on 13 counts of principle to the crime of compensation for registration of voters. Each charge carries a potential one- to four-year prison term and a $5,000 fine.
| 512 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:08:09pm |
re: #499 Blueheron
Okay once again…cause something ate what I typed.
Do you know how many dead voters vs live voters were registered in Chicago during Kennedy’s campaign ?
And was the percentage large? :))
It’s the lack of specificity here that’s disturbing. So let’s focus on the second question: how does ACORN’s performance at correctly registering voters compare with that of other groups? Is it similar? Significantly higher or lower? What constitutes an “acceptable” level of fraud in an exercise that, by it’s very nature, is guaranteed to produce at least some?
I’m all for seeing ACORN run out of business. But I’d like to see that done by bringing actual laws to bear on actual evidence. Until then, ACORN is simply odious and unethical - offenses that aren’t illegal.
| 513 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:08:51pm |
re: #492 Escaped Hillbilly
So in other words you’d like to vote for someone with qualities X Y and Z and person A has them, but on second thought you can’t vote for them because of factor F which you didn’t feel was important until your original stance had been proven incorrect?
Moving the goal posts much?
| 514 |
Velvet Elvis Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:09:08pm |
re: #505 Conservative Moonbat
No, that wouldn’t happen because fraudulent registrations don’t result in fraudulent votes. You think Bart Simpson and Donald Duck would actually show up and try and cast ballots? It only creates a headache at the point when voter registration cards are being issued and there is no evidence that registration fraud has ever resulted in someone with a valid registration getting a voter registration card..
not getting PIMF
| 515 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:09:10pm |
re: #510 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Nice post, Buck. Although, people who steal because you don’t pay them enough; are the same people who steal if you pay them enough.
Yes of course, BUT is the company president guilty of any wrongdoing?
| 516 |
hokiepride Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:10:06pm |
re: #508 Conservative Moonbat
So, if an organization condones law-breaking, it is OK as it only a “small” percentage? Would you hire someone who says “I only steal 1 time out of every 100?
| 517 |
Velvet Elvis Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:10:13pm |
re: #507 Buck
That should not matter… Fraud is fraud… however… In Nevada Acorn submitted 91,002 completed forms in Clark County, which includes Las Vegas, of which 23,186 turned out to be valid new voters.
There are way too many examples for me to even start cutting and pasting… do a search in google for acorn voter registration fraud
source please?
| 518 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:10:13pm |
re: #509 karmic_inquisitor
This isn’t an anti-government impulse. It is just that we have over 200 years of laws on the books and a great many of them (taken together) are arcane and difficult to apply / enforce
100% correct
EXAMPLE
It is considered an offense to open an umbrella on a street, for fear of spooking horses.
[Link: www.dumblaws.com…]
(pick your state ,,, it’s fun!!)
| 519 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:10:25pm |
re: #515 Buck
I was just making a point that people who steal are thieves. That’s all.
| 520 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:11:11pm |
re: #512 SixDegrees
Until then, ACORN is simply odious and unethical - offenses that aren’t illegal.
Really? So the US government should give funding to a company that is known to be odious and unethical, as long as the company has not been convicted of anything illegal?
| 521 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:11:44pm |
re: #500 tradewind
Links?
(Too much Democratic infighting for any one person to keep track of it all)
| 522 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:12:36pm |
re: #517 Conservative Moonbat
You can google search acorn voter registration fraud
But here: [Link: www.nytimes.com…]
| 523 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:13:14pm |
re: #496 RogueOne
I do not know that statement is BS, at all. My fiancee works in cancer reseach, and I’m quite confident that Canada is hugely innovative in biotech.
USPTO is the US patent office. Canada has its own one, you know. Are you sure your table captures all the Canadian-granted patents? It really seems like it doesn’t.
| 524 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:13:22pm |
re: #507 Buck
That should not matter… Fraud is fraud… however… In Nevada Acorn submitted 91,002 completed forms in Clark County, which includes Las Vegas, of which 23,186 turned out to be valid new voters.
There are way too many examples for me to even start cutting and pasting… do a search in google for acorn voter registration fraud
And what constitutes “fraud”? Although I seriously doubt your statistics, given that you don’t provide anything to back them up, let’s simply assume they’re correct. Are you suggesting that ACORN leadership is responsible for all of these, or even a significant number of them? If so, you haven’t provided any proof at all, not even any evidence.
Sorry, but simply declaring someone guilty by innuendo and speculation smacks of the Soviet gulags more than the American justice system. I’m not gonna go there. If and when you can produce some actual evidence of collusion, feel free to present it, as I’ve already asked.
| 525 |
wrenchwench Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:13:29pm |
re: #466 Opal
“re: #328 wrenchwench -
I don’t know about the other ones that got fired, but Iglesias was dragging his feet instead of prosecuting a few Democrats who are now serving time. He never mentions that.”
I’m not sure why my reply to wasn’t posted. I just wanted to know if there was a link about the Democrats that are serving time. I had not heard that there were ever any convictions in New Mexico, so I always thought Iglesias had a legitimate complaint against the administration. I’ve done a Google, but can’t find a link with the details. Thanks in advance for any link you provide.
Hi Opal, here’s the main guilty guy. Somehow Richardson escaped unscathed. There were some lower figures convicted, I believe. Use “Bernalillo County Metropolitan Courthouse” in your search.
| 526 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:14:40pm |
re: #519 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
I was just making a point that people who steal are thieves. That’s all.
Well, that might have seems obvious to me. However if you surround yourself with thieves, don’t be surprised if someone suspects something about you.
And I don’t mean you persoinally…. I mean the person who knowingly surrounds themselves with thieves.
| 527 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:14:41pm |
re: #456 garhighway
Arg. I am not kidding myself and that was very patronizing. I don’t want to keep either side from getting to the polls. I already said I am Independent. I do want to prevent outright fraud. And I am really tired of all the arguing over who has cheated the most. This is not the same as reading tests or any other such tests. Our current system has holes you can drive a bus through. Arguing against ID checks makes no sense in our current world.
| 528 |
Velvet Elvis Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:14:56pm |
re: #511 Buck
[Link: www.nytimes.com…]
Acorn submitted 91,002 completed forms in Clark County, which includes Las Vegas, of which 23,186 turned out to be valid new voters.
The indictment includes 13 counts each against Acorn and its former Las Vegas field director, Christopher Edwards, who is accused of creating an incentive program called “blackjack” because $5 was paid for signing more than 21 prospective voters.
Also indicted was Acorn’s former deputy regional director, Amy Busefink, on 13 counts of principle to the crime of compensation for registration of voters. Each charge carries a potential one- to four-year prison term and a $5,000 fine.
Acorn submitted 91,002 completed forms in Clark County, which includes Las Vegas, of which 23,186 turned out to be valid new voters who voted in November
you left that part out
I still don’t see why it’s a big deal because it does nothing to swing the results of elections
| 529 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:15:00pm |
re: #521 jamesfirecat
Links?
(Too much Democratic infighting for any one person to keep track of it all)
| 530 |
Wozza Matter? Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:15:04pm |
| 531 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:16:47pm |
re: #524 SixDegrees
[Link: www.lvrj.com…]
| 532 |
Velvet Elvis Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:17:05pm |
re: #520 Buck
Really? So the US government should give funding to a company that is known to be odious and unethical, as long as the company has not been convicted of anything illegal?
Why not? They give a ton to Halliburton.
| 533 |
prairiefire Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:17:27pm |
re: #519 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Hi, FBV. I made a mistake about the Towercam shot of the blue moon on the 31st. It was actually a great photo shot posted by Thanos. Very cool.
| 534 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:18:17pm |
re: #529 sattv4u2
So one slip of the tounge qualifies as a “couldn’t stop referring to” seems a bit of a stretch to me.
| 535 |
Professor Chaos Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:18:58pm |
re: #528 Conservative Moonbat
Acorn submitted 91,002 completed forms in Clark County, which includes Las Vegas, of which 23,186 turned out to be valid new voters who voted in November
Holy shit dude. Nothing like making up statistics by lopping off part of a sentence.
| 536 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:19:10pm |
re: #520 Buck
Really? So the US government should give funding to a company that is known to be odious and unethical, as long as the company has not been convicted of anything illegal?
Yes, they do that all the time, on a daily basis in fact. You can’t be eliminated from consideration for such funding on the basis that someone, somewhere doesn’t care for your stance on issues, your political views or your conduct - as long as your conduct doesn’t break any laws.
Your path leads to some very, very unpleasant places indeed. I prefer to stick with that troublesome Rule of Law thingy, as inconvenient as it can sometimes be.
| 537 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:19:25pm |
re: #505 Conservative Moonbat
Yes. In the past Bart Simpson and Archie Bunker as well as Mickey Mouse and a number of dead people. You register. Then you take your registration to the polling place. They tell you to go stand in a line. You go into a booth, you push some buttons or pull a lever and poof, you voted. How does the poor overworked, underpaid clerk know you are NOT Donald Duck? Who even notices what is written on a voter card anyway? I don’t think that problem would be entirely fixed by ID checks, but it seems nuts to not even make an effort.
| 538 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:21:02pm |
re: #531 generalsparky
[Link: www.lvrj.com…]
Thanks. It doesn’t really answer my questions, but it does indicate that actual fraud wasn’t involved here.
| 539 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:21:51pm |
re: #534 jamesfirecat
So one slip of the tounge qualifies as a “couldn’t stop referring to” seems a bit of a stretch to me.
You asked for links.
| 540 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:22:15pm |
re: #537 Escaped Hillbilly
There’s a step where they compare voter registration cards to actual databases, you know.
| 541 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:23:28pm |
re: #540 Obdicut
There’s a step where they compare voter registration cards to actual databases, you know.
databases that are complied by ,,,,
(ruh roh)
voters registered!
| 542 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:23:57pm |
| 543 |
prairiefire Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:24:10pm |
re: #540 Obdicut
I always have to prove my address (driver’s lic.) and sign the voter rolls next to my name. This list is generated by registering to vote.
| 544 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:24:29pm |
re: #537 Escaped Hillbilly
Yes. In the past Bart Simpson and Archie Bunker as well as Mickey Mouse and a number of dead people. You register. Then you take your registration to the polling place. They tell you to go stand in a line. You go into a booth, you push some buttons or pull a lever and poof, you voted. How does the poor overworked, underpaid clerk know you are NOT Donald Duck? Who even notices what is written on a voter card anyway? I don’t think that problem would be entirely fixed by ID checks, but it seems nuts to not even make an effort.
The way it works around here is: you show up to vote, give your name, and they look you up on the precinct’s role of registered voters. Sometimes, they ask for a street address if there’s a name ambiguity. Once the name is found, they mark it off the role so no one else can use the name a second time.
This does not, however, guard against someone falsely registering under another name and voting twice using their two (or possibly more) registrations.
| 545 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:24:29pm |
re: #539 sattv4u2
“Links” emphasis on the “S” in the sense I was asking for multiple links to multiple different times when Ted Kennedy had committed that particular verbal mistake. Otherwise it hardly seems more like a “Ted Kennedy once made that mistake himself” rather than a “Ted Kennedy couldn’t stop referring to Obama as ’ Usama ‘.”
Though I’ll admit at this point I’m probably being antisemantic just for the fun of it…
| 546 |
Velvet Elvis Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:24:53pm |
re: #537 Escaped Hillbilly
Yes. In the past Bart Simpson and Archie Bunker as well as Mickey Mouse and a number of dead people. You register. Then you take your registration to the polling place. They tell you to go stand in a line. You go into a booth, you push some buttons or pull a lever and poof, you voted. How does the poor overworked, underpaid clerk know you are NOT Donald Duck? Who even notices what is written on a voter card anyway? I don’t think that problem would be entirely fixed by ID checks, but it seems nuts to not even make an effort.
They have to verify your home address to make sure you’re assigned to the right percent for starters. Again, there’s zero evidence that voter registration fraud has ever resulted in voting fraud. Most voter registration fraud is not done for the purpose of allowing voting fraud. It’s done for cash.
| 547 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:26:06pm |
re: #528 Conservative Moonbat
you left that part out
I still don’t see why it’s a big deal because it does nothing to swing the results of elections
I have been very clear about this. I ask you… is Voter registration fraud still a crime EVEN IF it doesn’t swing the results of elections?
Now how could it effect the polls:
Lets say that a week before the early voting polls open I dump on you 90,000 voter registrations. 70% are not valid. I do this in several cities, in different states across the country. A judge tells you that you cannot reject the forms just because of a high fraud rate. You either have to investigate and find the good ones in the next week, or accept them all. AND you have to pay me for all of them.
You suspect that I am looking to cause chaos at the polling places. This chaos can be used for cover to allow people to vote more than once, and no one would ever know. No one could ever prove it. The perfect crime.
Its possible. There is no way to figure it out. While you concentrate on the Daffy Duck registrations, I am voting the ones with regular names.
| 548 |
karmic_inquisitor Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:26:24pm |
re: #518 sattv4u2
This isn’t an anti-government impulse. It is just that we have over 200 years of laws on the books and a great many of them (taken together) are arcane and difficult to apply / enforce
100% correct
EXAMPLE
It is considered an offense to open an umbrella on a street, for fear of spooking horses.[Link: www.dumblaws.com…]
(pick your state ,,, it’s fun!!)
There are many silly laws - that is the low hanging fruit.
Try dealing with the Clean Water Act when clearing a hillside of fire debris that used to be an avocado orchard. That was something that I had to deal with after the witch creek fire and actually had state and federal agencies issuing contradictory letters permitting me / prohibiting me from removing half burned stumps on a 25% grade slope because I would be “damaging a navigable waterway.”
It was a surreal experience, but I learned that my removing those stumps would alter the silt flow into a seasonal creek a mile away which might affect fish in a lagoon fed by that creek, so I may or may not have been subject to the clean water act, regardless of the presidential declaration of a disaster and the exemption that recovering from that disaster was supposed to offer. Why didn’t I get that exemption? Because that farm was not my primary source of income.
What started as a simple request for a permit from my city evolved into a labyrinth of letters ruling on aspects of the tax code, the clean water act and state and municipal building / land use regulations.
In the end I chose to leave the stumps in the ground and let them rot out which has delayed the replanting of that land.
At each step I dealt with people who were professional, agreed that the case was absurd, yet knew that if they granted me an exception under the wrong rule someone would insist on getting the same exemption for a different case.
| 549 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:26:52pm |
re: #545 jamesfirecat
“Links” emphasis on the “S” in the sense I was asking for multiple links to multiple different times when Ted Kennedy had committed that particular verbal mistake. Otherwise it hardly seems more like a “Ted Kennedy once made that mistake himself” rather than a “Ted Kennedy couldn’t stop referring to Obama as ’ Usama ‘.”
Though I’ll admit at this point I’m probably being antisemantic just for the fun of it…
Having been born, raised and lived most of my life in the Boston area, and hearing Senator Kennedy speak many many times, I have to assume he said it more than once. he had a habit of rushing his speech patterns when excited, and fumbling phrases. He was very excited about the prospect of a President Obama
| 550 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:28:03pm |
re: #543 prairiefire
I always have to prove my address (driver’s lic.) and sign the voter rolls next to my name. This list is generated by registering to vote.
So if you don’t have a DL? They wont let you vote? That would discriminate against you, and disenfranchise you.
What do you think would happen if you didn’t have picture ID?
| 551 |
Gus Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:28:12pm |
re: #538 SixDegrees
Thanks. It doesn’t really answer my questions, but it does indicate that actual fraud wasn’t involved here.
If you read the complaint there is no mention of the voter registration itself but the means of acquiring said registrations.
The undersigned, CATHERINE CORTEZ MASTO, Attorney General of the State of Nevada, by and through Chief Deputy Attorney General, Conrad Hafen, complains and charges the above named defendants, ASSOCIATION OF COMMUNITY ORGANIZATION FOR REFORM NOW INC.(ACORN), CHRISTOPHER HOWELL EDWARDS AND AMY ADELE BUSEFINK, with having committed the crimes of COMPENSATION FOR REGISTRATION OF VOTERS (26 Counts), a Category E Felony, in violation of NRS 293.805, and PRINCIPAL TO THE CRIME OF COMPENSATION FOR REGISTRATION OF VOTERS (13 Counts), a category E Felony, in violation of NRS 195.020 and NRS 293.805 in Clark County, State of Nevada as follows…
In summary, this indictment is not about the voter registrations count and invalid registrations but compensation for acquiring voter registrations.
| 552 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:30:59pm |
re: #537 Escaped Hillbilly
I don’t think that problem would be entirely fixed by ID checks, but it seems nuts to not even make an effort.
You are right, but ID check disenfranchise the poor and the homeless who don’t have ID.
| 553 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:31:29pm |
re: #551 Gus 802
Well, the government could only get Al Capone on income-tax evasion but that doesn’t mean he didn’t commit and have a reputation for committing other crimes too.
| 554 |
generalsparky Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:32:17pm |
re: #552 Buck
You are right, but ID check disenfranchise the poor and the homeless who don’t have ID.
Which means they aren’t going to get any government assistance either.
| 555 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:32:31pm |
re: #513 jamesfirecat
No. Do you only want to fight? An intelligent person can still come up with the wrong answers to some very important questions. And I said those were the basics. Geez, those qualities alone would describe half the people on this blog. That doesn’t necessarily mean they are qualified to be the next pres. It seems to me we the People have been voting for the minimally qualified for a while and I want it to be better than that. AND I want someone with all those qualities and will come down on the issues on the side I happen to think is right…as does everyone else though we may disagree on which is the right side. I have no problem with any competent etc. person holding the job…but I will only vote for the one that has all of them (or best I can get) and represents ME. What a concept eh?
| 556 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:35:19pm |
re: #555 Escaped Hillbilly
What a concept eh?
You radical, you!
| 557 |
Kewalo Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:36:10pm |
re: #547 Buck
And then we put a bunch of people in a bus, make sure they know what name they’re going to vote with and bus them from polling place to polling place to swing the election. Right?
//
| 558 |
Jeff In Ohio Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:37:08pm |
re: #537 Escaped Hillbilly
Yes. In the past Bart Simpson and Archie Bunker as well as Mickey Mouse and a number of dead people. You register. Then you take your registration to the polling place. They tell you to go stand in a line. You go into a booth, you push some buttons or pull a lever and poof, you voted. How does the poor overworked, underpaid clerk know you are NOT Donald Duck? Who even notices what is written on a voter card anyway? I don’t think that problem would be entirely fixed by ID checks, but it seems nuts to not even make an effort.
What state is that, because the polls I’ve worked Hamilton County, Ohio do not work like that. You present yourself, they find your name and address on the rolls, you sign, they check your signature against the one one the rolls, your given a ballot. Donald Duck, unless he has an address in Hamilton County and his signature is a reasonable facsimile, would not be given a ballot, but he would be provided with a provisional ballot. If the provisional ballot does not hold up, you will be investigated for voter fraud. If it does, your vote is counted.
| 559 |
Gus Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:37:27pm |
re: #553 generalsparky
Well, the government could only get Al Capone on income-tax evasion but that doesn’t mean he didn’t commit and have a reputation for committing other crimes too.
I’m writing about this specific case. It is not an example of voter registration fraud but voter registration compensation laws.
| 560 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:38:21pm |
re: #551 Gus 802
In summary, this indictment is not about the voter registrations count and invalid registrations but compensation for acquiring voter registrations.
Correct.
The article also points out that a large number of the invalid registrations appeared to be simple mistakes - people registering when they were already registered; giving the wrong address; misspelling names and other simple errors not caused by those collecting the forms.
And back to the original point: if compensation was being performed with ACORN’s active participation, it would be a simple matter to follow the money. Unfortunately, the money trail has always petered out at very low levels, without ever tainting anyone involved in the organization’s leadership.
| 561 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:39:23pm |
re: #559 Gus 802
I’m writing about this specific case. It is not an example of voter registration fraud but voter registration compensation laws.
Which wouldn’t have been broken if they didn’t register fraudulant ‘voters”
I ubderstand what law was broken, but the discussion is about the root, not the flower
| 562 |
prairiefire Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:40:19pm |
re: #547 Buck
There is no chaos at the voting polls. What country do you live in?
| 563 |
Professor Chaos Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:40:35pm |
re: #547 Buck
Acorn submitted 91,002 completed forms in Clark County, which includes Las Vegas, of which 23,186 turned out to be valid new voters who voted in November
Lets say that a week before the early voting polls open I dump on you 90,000 voter registrations. 70% are not valid.
Which didn’t happen here. 70% of those did not vote. There is no claim here as to how many of those registrations were fraudulent.
| 564 |
Gus Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:40:38pm |
re: #560 SixDegrees
Correct.
The article also points out that a large number of the invalid registrations appeared to be simple mistakes - people registering when they were already registered; giving the wrong address; misspelling names and other simple errors not caused by those collecting the forms.
And back to the original point: if compensation was being performed with ACORN’s active participation, it would be a simple matter to follow the money. Unfortunately, the money trail has always petered out at very low levels, without ever tainting anyone involved in the organization’s leadership.
I imagine they might use bundlers (which is a guess on my part). The case is supposed to go to trial in April.
| 565 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:41:29pm |
re: #555 Escaped Hillbilly
Don’t especially want a fight, just trying to figure out where exactly you stood.
| 566 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:42:37pm |
re: #562 prairiefire
There is no chaos at the voting polls. What country do you live in?
he was setting up a “what if”. he didn’t state it IS
Lets say that a week before the early voting polls open I dump
| 567 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:42:44pm |
re: #561 sattv4u2
Which wouldn’t have been broken if they didn’t register fraudulant ‘voters”
I ubderstand what law was broken, but the discussion is about the root, not the flower
Actually, if someone paid me to register, they would be guilty of a crime regardless of my eligibility. I could submit a perfectly valid registration, and once I was slipped a fiver the person involved would be guilty of breaking the law.
As you point out, though, such behavior has so far not produced any evidence that those running the organization are actively encouraging it.
| 568 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:43:46pm |
re: #563 Girth
Which didn’t happen here. 70% of those did not vote. There is no claim here as to how many of those registrations were fraudulent.
The article cited above suggests that most of them were simple mistakes rather than fraud.
| 569 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:44:00pm |
re: #149 Buck
You don’t have to be a super villain to cheat.
ACORN, Soros and others figured out that they needed numbers… that the people who gave a shit and were able to register on their own were stupid (They voted for Bush right?). So they needed to spend a lot of money getting people who were smarter, but just couldn’t be bothered to register and vote without a lot of help. AND if they didn’t have ID, or anyway to prove they were qualified to vote, they just had to be helped along by voter registration fraud.
My opinion is that the Acorn isn’t smart enough to steal the election belongs with the Osama isn’t smart enough to pull off 9/11.
Your post is proof that money doesn’t make you intelligent. I love a conspiracy kook. Tell us another one! Chemtrails? The Bilderberg Group? Albino Alligators?
| 570 |
prairiefire Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:44:08pm |
re: #550 Buck
There are other accepted forms of ID, also an envelope that has your name and address on it. There is a push by Republicans in my state to have to show a picture ID, but that is being fought by our Sec. of State, my sorority sister, Robin Carnahan.
| 571 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:45:26pm |
re: #544 SixDegrees
If you register and vote by mail the process gets even more ambiguous as every state has their own rules for registration vs ballots. Georgia has 4 steps that have to be followed in order. People think because there is a Federal absentee ballot now, the system is the same everywhere, standardized, but it isn’t. And it needs serious consideration and fixing. We won’t get it though. Politics will continue to make the process more complicated and less transparent while doing nothing to actually stop voter fraud.
| 572 |
SixDegrees Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:47:13pm |
re: #564 Gus 802
I imagine they might use bundlers (which is a guess on my part). The case is supposed to go to trial in April.
We’ll see how that goes. As I’ve said many times, I would love to see ACORN’s upper management tied into such activities.
I doubt that will happen here, but maybe. The problem I see with any such indirection is that the compensation involved isn’t worth the price the individual has to pay upon conviction when compared with the price they’d have to pay by singing like a bird and indicting those higher up the food chain. That this hasn’t happened suggests that the activity being speculated on also doesn’t happen.
| 573 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:47:15pm |
re: #554 generalsparky
Which is why the poor do have ID.
| 574 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:49:53pm |
re: #565 jamesfirecat
ok. Problem with this form of commo. Hard to tell sometimes and just as hard to develop and explain your stance. @ lest we Rnt using txting eh?
| 575 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:50:14pm |
re: #468 Buck
OK, so it doesn’t matter to you. ACORN accepts money from the government to do voter registration. A large percentage of those forms are fraudulent. year after year, election after election. The same sort of fraud.
Nothing to get your panties in a bunch over.
Your panties wouldn’t be in a bunch either, if McCain had won this election. Get real. Do you have the slightest clue what the statistics are for bad voter reg forms for other organizations that do voter reg? Have you checked? Or are you obsessed with this nonsense about ACORN?
No one is saying it doesn’t matter, but DAMN, it doesn’t matter THIS MUCH.
| 576 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:52:38pm |
re: #563 Girth
Which didn’t happen here. 70% of those did not vote. There is no claim here as to how many of those registrations were fraudulent.
The guy’s gonna keep banging on this ACORN drum until the end of time. The right-wing has been supersaturated with conspiracies about ACORN, we’ll be hearing about it from the parroting drones for the next 20 years, just like we’re hearing about Whitewater, Vince Foster even now, just like we’re still hearing about how Bush STOLED TEH ELECTSHUN from the left.
| 577 |
sattv4u2 Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:52:48pm |
re: #569 WindUpBird
Your post is proof that money doesn’t make you intelligent. I love a conspiracy kook. Tell us another one! Chemtrails? The Bilderberg Group? Albino Alligators?
Hhmmmmmm,,,,,
[Link: images.google.com…]
| 578 |
Professor Chaos Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:53:06pm |
re: #575 SanFranciscoZionist
Your panties wouldn’t be in a bunch either, if McCain had won this election. Get real. Do you have the slightest clue what the statistics are for bad voter reg forms for other organizations that do voter reg? Have you checked? Or are you obsessed with this nonsense about ACORN?
No one is saying it doesn’t matter, but DAMN, it doesn’t matter THIS MUCH.
Don’t ask him for statistics. He truncates sentences to make up his own.
| 579 |
Gus Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:54:18pm |
re: #576 WindUpBird
The guy’s gonna keep banging on this ACORN drum until the end of time. The right-wing has been supersaturated with conspiracies about ACORN, we’ll be hearing about it from the parroting drones for the next 20 years, just like we’re hearing about Whitewater, Vince Foster even now, just like we’re still hearing about how Bush STOLED TEH ELECTSHUN from the left.
11/4 was an inside job!
//Couldn’t resist.
/
| 580 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:55:36pm |
re: #575 SanFranciscoZionist
Your panties wouldn’t be in a bunch either, if McCain had won this election. Get real. Do you have the slightest clue what the statistics are for bad voter reg forms for other organizations that do voter reg? Have you checked? Or are you obsessed with this nonsense about ACORN?
No one is saying it doesn’t matter, but DAMN, it doesn’t matter THIS MUCH.
Working backwards from the solution! Solution is ACORN IS EVEILZ and all we need to do is go back and cherry pick the most alarmist irticles, links and such to prove the assertion. Even though the assertion is false.
| 581 |
jamesfirecat Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:55:40pm |
re: #574 Escaped Hillbilly
Now that I CAN AGREE ON! You can never grasp the inflection with which someone is “speaking” that’s why we need emoticons, sarcasm tags and similar devices to signaling how we feel about our words.
| 582 |
Achilles Tang Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:56:36pm |
re: #552 Buck
You are right, but ID check disenfranchise the poor and the homeless who don’t have ID.
How so? I don’t think the shelters in our town require ID, and why can’t someone “poor” get ID? Most will in fact have it.
(came back from a dinner and found 480+ comments.)
| 583 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 4:59:45pm |
re: #558 Jeff In Ohio
Was that way in NM when I lived there. In GA when I voted last time, I was allowed to register and vote on the same day during “early voting” because I was home on leave. (I thought I had missed my opportunity to register and called to find out when deadline for absentee ballot was.) No one asked for ID. I did fill out a form with my address on it. They asked for my old voter registration number, I didn’t know it, they gave me a new one. Done.
| 584 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 5:00:52pm |
re: #582 Naso Tang
How so? I don’t think the shelters in our town require ID, and why can’t someone “poor” get ID? Most will in fact have it.
(came back from a dinner and found 480+ comments.)
This is the part I want to hear more about. Most people drive, in this country, and as has been pointed out, you need lots of proof of existence to get any kind of government aid. You need ID to get a job. I’m not clear why the poor are less likely to have IDs, but am open to hearing any explanation for it.
| 585 |
Escaped Hillbilly Fri, Jan 8, 2010 5:05:20pm |
re: #584 SanFranciscoZionist
I don’t know either. Maybe this comes from the past when almost no poor people drove, SSN’s were only needed when you got a job and paid Soc Sec, and Food Stamps were little pieces of paper in a wallet.
| 586 |
RogueOne Fri, Jan 8, 2010 5:11:06pm |
re: #523 Obdicut
I do not know that statement is BS, at all. My fiancee works in cancer reseach, and I’m quite confident that Canada is hugely innovative in biotech.
USPTO is the US patent office. Canada has its own one, you know. Are you sure your table captures all the Canadian-granted patents? It really seems like it doesn’t.
I didn’t say Canada wasn’t innovative but, as usual, it’s a matter of the available amount of money to spend. Canadian GDP is roughly equivalent to what, Ohio? (another gratuitous slap against our canadian friends//) The nations leading in the medical fields are the US, Japan, and Germany with China quickly gaining. See anything those countries have in common when compared to Canada?
| 587 |
Achilles Tang Fri, Jan 8, 2010 5:32:15pm |
re: #584 SanFranciscoZionist
This is the part I want to hear more about. Most people drive, in this country, and as has been pointed out, you need lots of proof of existence to get any kind of government aid. You need ID to get a job. I’m not clear why the poor are less likely to have IDs, but am open to hearing any explanation for it.
Of course one can imagine why someone on the street in very hard times may not have papers, but the question is why they could not relatively easily, in most case, verify their identity.
On the other hand, up here in some parts of Georgia (2 degrees F as I write, BTW), where one can buy beer (which is not everywhere) you still have to show ID regardless of age. I haven’t quite figured out if that means only people who drive can drink.
| 588 |
SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jan 8, 2010 5:58:08pm |
re: #587 Naso Tang
Of course one can imagine why someone on the street in very hard times may not have papers, but the question is why they could not relatively easily, in most case, verify their identity.
On the other hand, up here in some parts of Georgia (2 degrees F as I write, BTW), where one can buy beer (which is not everywhere) you still have to show ID regardless of age. I haven’t quite figured out if that means only people who drive can drink.
I don’t drive, but I have a state picture ID from the DMV. I use it for job paperwork, proof of age (now, alas, so rarely asked for), and to use my credit cards if they ask for ID.
| 589 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 6:21:02pm |
re: #570 prairiefire
There are other accepted forms of ID, also an envelope that has your name and address on it. There is a push by Republicans in my state to have to show a picture ID, but that is being fought by our Sec. of State, my sorority sister, Robin Carnahan.
OK, so how hard would it be for (low level) acorn employees to create an envelope?
| 590 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 6:23:22pm |
re: #588 SanFranciscoZionist
I don’t drive, but I have a state picture ID from the DMV. I use it for job paperwork, proof of age (now, alas, so rarely asked for), and to use my credit cards if they ask for ID.
OK, but the homeless don’t have that. And you can’t deny them voting rights just because they don’t have ID.
That combined with voter registration fraud? Oh ya, no one got caught doing voter fraud…. ever…
| 591 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 6:40:52pm |
re: #532 Conservative Moonbat
Why not? They give a ton to Halliburton.
Did I somehow get forwarded to dkos?
| 592 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 6:48:54pm |
re: #563 Girth
Which didn’t happen here. 70% of those did not vote. There is no claim here as to how many of those registrations were fraudulent.
I don’t read it that way.
The headline is “Acorn Charged in Voter Registration Fraud Case in Nevada”
The second paragraph says:
Two former leaders of the group’s Nevada branch were also charged in connection with the submission of thousands of bogus voter registration forms.
it also states that:
Mr. Miller investigated Acorn at the behest of the Clark County registrar of voters, Larry Lomax, who noted a high number of forms turned in featuring the names of famous football players and cartoon characters.
But they can never know exactly how many we fraudulent….so they estimate…
| 593 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 6:54:34pm |
In 2005, the Virginia State Board of Elections admonished Project Vote and ACORN for turning in a significant number of faulty voter registrations. An audit revealed that 83% of sampled registrations that were rejected for carrying false or questionable information were submitted by Project Vote. Many of these registrations carried social security numbers that exist for other people, listed non-existent or commercial addresses, or were for convicted felons in violation of state and federal election law.
In a letter to ACORN, the State Board of Elections reported that 56% of the voter registration applications ACORN turned in were ineligible. Further, a full 35% were not submitted in a timely manner, as required by law. The State Board of Elections also commented on what appeared to be evidence of intentional voter fraud. “Additionally,” they wrote, “information appears to have been altered on some applications where information given by the applicant in one color ink has been scratched through and re-entered in another color ink. Any alteration of a voter registration application is a Class 5 Felony in accordance with § 24.2-1009 of the Code of Virginia.”
[Link: www.rottenacorn.com…]
| 594 |
Professor Chaos Fri, Jan 8, 2010 7:10:29pm |
re: #592 Buck
I don’t read it that way.
You don’t read it that way because you left off the end of the sentence. You asserted that:
Acorn submitted 91,002 completed forms in Clark County, which includes Las Vegas, of which 23,186 turned out to be valid new voters
which says, as you’d like it to, that ACORN turned in 70k fraudulent registrations.
The actual sentence says:
Acorn submitted 91,002 completed forms in Clark County, which includes Las Vegas, of which 23,186 turned out to be valid new voters who voted in November
which only states that 70k of those registrations did not vote.
You intentionally left off the end of that sentence in order to generate a statistic to bolster your claim and you have zero basis to conclude that 70% of Clark counties ACORN registrations were fraudulent.
| 595 |
Professor Chaos Fri, Jan 8, 2010 7:25:49pm |
re: #593 Buck
An audit revealed that 83% of sampled registrations that were rejected for carrying false or questionable information were submitted by Project Vote.
This says that of all rejected registrations, 83% were submitted by Project Vote (which isn’t even ACORN, but apparently works with them on voter registration). This does not mean that 83% of all registrations submitted by Project Vote were rejected. How many rejected registrations were there total that year?
In a letter to ACORN, the State Board of Elections reported that 56% of the voter registration applications ACORN turned in were ineligible. Further, a full 35% were not submitted in a timely manner, as required by law.
So 35% were ineligible because they were submitted after the deadline. That leaves 21% that were ineligible for other reasons.
“Additionally,” they wrote, “information appears to have been altered on some applications where information given by the applicant in one color ink has been scratched through and re-entered in another color ink.
So on “some” (no number specified) applications, information was re-entered (doesn’t say changed) in different ink.
Cherry-picked and twisted to fit your conspiracy theory.
| 596 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 7:26:59pm |
re: #594 Girth
Nah…
48 percent of those forms are fraudulent
Here is more detail:
[Link: www.lvrj.com…]
Larry Lomax, the Clark County registrar of voters, said his office reviewed the 91,002 voter registration forms turned in by ACORN, verifying that information on the form matched information attached to the voter’s driver’s license number or Social Security number.
If it didn’t, those registrations were tagged as requiring identification at the polling place.
There were 28,097 forms that were duplicates or changes of name, party or address, leaving 62,905 new voters.
Of those, 23,186 actually voted in the 2008 general election, according to a report prepared by Lomax’s office.
That means almost 40,000 of the new voters registered by ACORN didn’t vote, and of those, almost 19,000 had information on file that didn’t match what was turned in on the forms.
“That’s 48 percent of those forms that I believe are clearly fraudulent,” Lomax said.
| 597 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 7:31:50pm |
re: #595 Girth
Cherry-picked and twisted to fit your conspiracy theory.
I don’t know what to say. You seem to only accept a 60 page indictment with every detail laid out. This is a discussion forum. I am not actually going to do a full investigation and present an indictment for each of the 14+ states that are either charging or have already charged ACORN.
I am done.
| 598 |
Professor Chaos Fri, Jan 8, 2010 7:40:15pm |
re: #597 Buck
I don’t know what to say. You seem to only accept a 60 page indictment with every detail laid out. This is a discussion forum. I am not actually going to do a full investigation and present an indictment for each of the 14+ states that are either charging or have already charged ACORN.
I am done.
Not true at all.
What I won’t accept is statistics that either don’t mean what you think they mean or are completely false because you left off the end of the sentence that they appear in.
| 599 |
Professor Chaos Fri, Jan 8, 2010 7:56:42pm |
re: #596 Buck
Nah…
48 percent of those forms are fraudulentHere is more detail:
[Link: www.lvrj.com…]
LOL. More cherry-picking. You left out the rest of Lomax’s quote.
“That’s 48 percent of those forms that I believe are clearly fraudulent,” Lomax said.
“This is individuals ripping off their bosses because they have a quota to make.”
This voter registration work is not easy, Lomax noted. Canvassers are working in the summer heat and reaching out to people in poorer neighborhoods, all the while making $8 or $9 an hour.
“There’s a huge temptation to take the easy way out,” he said.
I’m shocked, shocked that people making minimum wage took the easy way out instead of actually doing their jobs. Also:
That means almost 40,000 of the new voters registered by ACORN didn’t vote, and of those, almost 19,000 had information on file that didn’t match what was turned in on the forms.
Newsflash: Those 19000 didn’t vote.
| 600 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 7:59:06pm |
re: #598 Girth
Not true at all.
What I won’t accept is statistics that either don’t mean what you think they mean or are completely false because you left off the end of the sentence that they appear in.
I never gave you a stat. You read that into it. The sentence was clumsy. I was saying a HUGE amount. It turns out 48%. That is HUGE in my books.
| 601 |
Professor Chaos Fri, Jan 8, 2010 8:15:36pm |
re: #600 Buck
I never gave you a stat. You read that into it. The sentence was clumsy. I was saying a HUGE amount. It turns out 48%. That is HUGE in my books.
You quoted numbers from the NYT which didn’t say what you claimed that it said because you removed that last part of the sentence.
And you’re still doing it wrong. That 19,000 is 48% of the registrations who didn’t vote.
19,000 out of 91,000 submitted registrations is a little under 21%.
| 602 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 9:47:08pm |
re: #601 Girth
You quoted numbers from the NYT which didn’t say what you claimed that it said because you removed that last part of the sentence.
And you’re still doing it wrong. That 19,000 is 48% of the registrations who didn’t vote.
19,000 out of 91,000 submitted registrations is a little under 21%.
Seriously… I directly quoted the official. I used the same percent he did.
BUT 21% is HUGE too. That is one out of every five registrations. What has to happen to get your attention? In Nevada ACORN had hired 59 inmates from a work-release program at a nearby prison and that some inmates who had been convicted of identity theft had been made supervisors. Do you think ACORN management was even trying to stop the fraud?
I am not going to break down and do the research for each state. However My point is NOT to detail each down to an exact number. Again this is a discussion forum. Everyone is allowed to speak in general terms except for me.
ACORN has been doing voter registration for many years. The earliest I can see is 1985. In almost every election cycle there are reports of VOTER REGISTRATION FRAUD. They have been unable and really unwilling to fix this. They always blame low level workers, but at some point I think you have to look at the big picture.
Now maybe you and the others can just ignore the VOTER REGISTRATION FRAUD, because it didn’t lead to ACTUAL VOTER FRAUD (as far as we know). I can’t. It real. And you just keep nit picking the details. I didn’t say 70%. I don’t know the exact percent. It really doesn’t matter.
14 plus investigations across the country involving thousands of potentially fraudulent ACORN created forms.
ACORN should be investigated. Despite all the evidence and a request in writing by 28 GOP senators — and despite the fact the U.S. Senate voted 83-7 on Sept. 14 to block ACORN from bidding for any more federal grant money — Senate Democrat Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., is refusing to hold a Senate hearing on ACORN’s activities.
| 603 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 9:54:25pm |
re: #467 SixDegrees
Dale Rathke admitted to embezzling almost one million dollars, and the ACORN International President Wade Rathke (his brother) did not report it to authorities. Wade has admitted that as well. Dale was not even fired.
None of which has anything at all to do with voter fraud.
Just to repeat myself: you have to establish actual evidence of wrongdoing even to bring charges. So far, no one has done so.
You said:
If someone brings forth some actual evidence of wrongdoing on the part of ACORN’s directors, I would happily hand out candy in the streets at the news.
The ACORN Directors, Wade and Dale have admitted to embezzlement and covering it up. That is evidence. They don’t deny it, they just don’t think it is wrong or illegal. It is however actual evidence of wrongdoing onthe part of ACORNS Directors. You didn’t say it had to be of voter fraud. Just wrongdoing.
Now maybe you meant you would only actually accept a conviction of ACORN Directors….well that is very different.
| 604 |
Buck Fri, Jan 8, 2010 10:06:11pm |
re: #601 Girth
You quoted numbers from the NYT which didn’t say what you claimed that it said because you removed that last part of the sentence.
This is NOT TRUE AT ALL. I did quote numbers from the NYT which said exactly what I claimed it said. You might have THOUGHT I was trying to say something different.
It was only because YOU kept chasing it, obsessively needing an exact number. That I did more research, and posted it with what the official said….
| 605 |
Professor Chaos Fri, Jan 8, 2010 10:55:56pm |
re: #602 Buck
Seriously… I directly quoted the official. I used the same percent he did.
And 48% looked like such a nice big number that you didn’t stop to think about it for two seconds.
BUT 21% is HUGE too. That is one out of every five registrations. What has to happen to get your attention? In Nevada ACORN had hired 59 inmates from a work-release program at a nearby prison and that some inmates who had been convicted of identity theft had been made supervisors. Do you think ACORN management was even trying to stop the fraud?
Shocked, shocked I tell you again that minimum wage employees cheated and filled out false forms instead of walking around in Las Vegas heat all day trying to find unregistered voters to sign up. Crappy work, I’m not surprised, nor do I care that work-release people got some of these jobs. And yes, ACORN management informed authorities that there were bad registrations when they handed them over, which they are required to do by law, even when they know that the form is fraudulent.
Everyone is allowed to speak in general terms except for me.
And you just keep nit picking the details. I didn’t say 70%. I don’t know the exact percent. It really doesn’t matter.
You’re the one bringing false numbers to the game to try and prove your conspiracy theory.
You started with the NYT article and the 70% is from the numbers you claimed in your #507, which you still have not addressed the fact that you got by omitting part of the sentence that totally changes its meaning. Then you back-peddled to 48%, now it’s down to 21%. Yes it’s a discussion forum. That means you bring logic and evidence, not assumptions based on your conspiracy theories.
14 plus investigations across the country involving thousands of potentially fraudulent ACORN created forms.
ACORN should be investigated. Despite all the evidence and a request in writing by 28 GOP senators — and despite the fact the U.S. Senate voted 83-7 on Sept. 14 to block ACORN from bidding for any more federal grant money — Senate Democrat Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., is refusing to hold a Senate hearing on ACORN’s activities.
And they are being investigated. As for the bolded part, ever heard of a bill of attainder? Hint: they’re unconstitutional.
| 606 |
Professor Chaos Fri, Jan 8, 2010 11:21:59pm |
re: #604 Buck
This is NOT TRUE AT ALL. I did quote numbers from the NYT which said exactly what I claimed it said. You might have THOUGHT I was trying to say something different.
I love that you deny this. Here’s the relevant part of your #511:
Acorn submitted 91,002 completed forms in Clark County, which includes Las Vegas, of which 23,186 turned out to be valid new voters.
And here’s the whole sentence from the NYT:
Acorn submitted 91,002 completed forms in Clark County, which includes Las Vegas, of which 23,186 turned out to be valid new voters who voted in November, according to data provided by Mr. Miller’s office.
Notice something there that you didn’t bother to include? Maybe a few words that totally changes the meaning of that sentence?
Oh, and I didn’t THINK you were trying to say anything different, you said it yourself in your little “hypothetical” you constructed in your #547:
Lets say that a week before the early voting polls open I dump on you 90,000 voter registrations. 70% are not valid.
And to close before I go to bed,
It was only because YOU kept chasing it, obsessively needing an exact number. That I did more research, and posted it with what the official said…
You’re the one chasing things, obsessively trying to confirm your conspiracy theory, my friend. I never asked for an exact number, I just refused to buy the bullshit you’ve been selling, and having a good old time to boot.
Good night, and don’t forget your tin-foil nightcap.
| 607 |
Randall Gross Sat, Jan 9, 2010 7:07:07am |
re: #593 Buck
That link is to a lobbyist site, his friends call him “Dr Evil” . His son has disowned him.
Meet Richard Berman, AKA Dr. Evil [Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
This guy is a very canny PR flack/ Lobbyist who knows about how to use teh intarwebs and the media for nefarious means which probably include Mechanical Turkers, Subvert etc. whereas you probably don’t have a clue what I’m talking about when I mention those sites.
Here’s a search that should give you some background on him:
[Link: www.google.com…]
| 608 |
Buck Sat, Jan 9, 2010 7:59:41am |
re: #607 Thanos
That link is to a lobbyist site, his friends call him “Dr Evil” . His son has disowned him.
Meet Richard Berman, AKA Dr. Evil [Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
Is any of that relevant to the data….? Can you please show me that what was written there is false.
Earlier Mandy used Rotten Acorn (#268) and no one gave her a lecture.
I don’t like to do links as someone always can have a problem with the source. This exact same data is available at many sources.
Google ACORN VOTER REGISTRATION FRAUD
To summarize: Acorn Management applies for federal funding in order organize Voter registration. They have for more than 10 years been unable to do it without significant fraud. The excuses acceptable to so many is that the fraud is unavoidable (I don’t believe that), or that it doesn’t lead to voter fraud (which is unprovable), or that it just doesn’t matter in general.
Instead of defending these lame excuses all I get is nit picked on the percent of fraud. As if some fraud is acceptable. As if some embezzlement by a board member is acceptable. Just as long as it doesn’t rise to some level where it directly effects… I don’t know the level you need.
| 609 |
Buck Sat, Jan 9, 2010 8:03:21am |
re: #606 Girth
So you admit that you are taking two separate comments I made, and linking them in your mind to make me say something.
I just didn’t think that the election in Nov part was significant…. I thought everyone knew the election was in Nov. I do not think it changes the sentence. I do think the sentence is awkward. I do not think anyone was talking about getting people to vote. The subject was voter reg fraud, and I was quoting the relevant parts.
| 610 |
Professor Chaos Sat, Jan 9, 2010 9:27:49am |
re: #609 Buck
So you admit that you are taking two separate comments I made, and linking them in your mind to make me say something.
I just didn’t think that the election in Nov part was significant… I thought everyone knew the election was in Nov. I do not think it changes the sentence. I do think the sentence is awkward. I do not think anyone was talking about getting people to vote. The subject was voter reg fraud, and I was quoting the relevant parts.
I’m not going to sit here and diagram sentences for you so you can see how the phrase “who voted in November” modifies the noun “voters” in that sentence. Do you have access to a 12 year old? They could do it for you.
I explained the difference in my #594.
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