Joe the Plumber sounds bitter: Joe the Plumber goes off on McCain, says he ‘screwed up my life’.
“McCain was trying to use me,” Wurzelbacher said, according to public radio correspondent Scott Detrow. “I happened to be the face of middle Americans. It was a ploy.”
Really? Ya think? What was your first clue, Joe?
1 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:02:33pm |
Why can't I stop thinking of a certain Groundskeeper?
YA USED ME SKINNER!
| 2 |
Racer X Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:04:08pm |
He was happy to be used. Now there is no use for him, and he is bitter. Go back to being a plumber Joe. The spotlight has moved to someone else.
| 3 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:06:35pm |
I thought he was gonna be some kind of correspondent for some political web page. Did that not work out for him?
| 4 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:07:16pm |
re: #2 Racer X
He was happy to be used. Now there is no use for him, and he is bitter. Go back to being a plumber Joe. The spotlight has moved to someone else.
Poor Not-Joe would have to get a plumbing license first.
Poor Not-Joe, the Not-a-Plumber.
| 5 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:07:55pm |
re: #2 Racer X
He was happy to be used. Now there is no use for him, and he is bitter. Go back to being a plumber Joe. The spotlight has moved to someone else.
His 15 minutes are over. Now if only the same were true of Sarah Palin.
| 6 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:07:57pm |
re: #2 Racer X
He was happy to be used. Now there is no use for him, and he is bitter. Go back to being a plumber Joe. The spotlight has moved to someone else.
I think he got off on the wrong foot with us the moment he tried to sound fake folksy by claiming his name was "Joe" when its actually "Samuel" once we knew that about him, it seems like it was only a matter of time till we got here....
| 7 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:09:16pm |
re: #5 Dark_Falcon
His 15 minutes are over. Now if only the same were true of Sarah Palin.
And everyone bare in mind what the Daily Show has to say on the subject (as best I can recall), the first ten minutes are us showering you with praise, the next five are us destroying your life completely.
| 8 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:10:03pm |
Hey Joe where you goin with that gun in your hand?...
the day BO walked into your yard, you should have tossed him off your property...but thinking fast, you decided right then to be somebody....you went in over your head Joe...you got used by everybody, used like a mule, only a mule would have been smarter than to let some half wit from Arizona ride you into the dirt, then off you like so many french fries under the seat...go ahead and complain Joe...the more you do, the more it proves your point...you should have stuck to repairing toilets, but you wanted to be somebody...well now you are but it's not the person you thought you'd be eh?
| 9 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:10:36pm |
re: #3 Slumbering Behemoth
I thought he was gonna be some kind of correspondent for some political web page. Did that not work out for him?
He went to Israel to report for...I want to say Pajamas Media, but I'm not sure.
| 10 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:11:13pm |
re: #9 SanFranciscoZionist
He went to Israel to report for...I want to say Pajamas Media, but I'm not sure.
Yes, it was PJ Media. After I left.
| 11 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:12:36pm |
A fraudulent plumber, preaching a fraudulent ideology. I'm still surprised he even manages to get an audience.
| 12 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:13:13pm |
re: #7 jamesfirecat
And everyone bare in mind what the Daily Show has to say on the subject (as best I can recall), the first ten minutes are us showering you with praise, the next five are us destroying your life completely.
A corollary that is less Andy Warhol and more Hunter Thompson.
| 13 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:13:21pm |
re: #9 SanFranciscoZionist
He went to Israel to report for...I want to say Pajamas Media, but I'm not sure.
You're correct.
| 14 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:14:17pm |
re: #12 Dark_Falcon
A corollary that is less Andy Warhol and more Hunter Thompson.
Lets just be glad (or sorry) our press has yet to resemble Spider Jerusalem.
| 15 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:14:53pm |
a little flashback about not-joe: April 2009, TeA PaRTy!
Joe the Plumber at Michigan Tea Party: Saying ‘In God We Trust’ Will Get You Shot In Some Places
“I’m here for one reason and one reason only: It’s ‘I love America,’” Wurzelbacher told the crowd. “Mainstream media wants to paint us as a bunch of extremists, right? We’re in search of liberty and our freedoms. What’s so extreme about that?”
“I’m just regurgitating,” Wurzelbacher said. “I believe in common sense.”
Wurzelbacher went on to lambaste what he said was a rising tide of “socialism” across the country and laid the blame on the U.S. government.
“Let me give you another extremist view, ‘In God We Trust,’” he said to wild applause. “Say that too loud in some parts of America and you will be shot. It’s terrible.”
Hoisting signs with slogans like “Hitler gave speeches too,” “I am only 4 and I am in debt,” and “Revolution or death,” the crowd filled the lawn of the Capitol and listened to other speakers like Scott Hagerstrom of Americans for Prosperity of Michigan; Leon Drolet of the Michigan Taxpayers’ Alliance; and Wendy Day of the Howell school board.
Nice photos at the link of some other Teabagger signs.
| 16 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:16:14pm |
re: #14 jamesfirecat
Lets just be glad (or sorry) our press has yet to resemble Spider Jerusalem.
That was the first image that came to my mind when the topic of Cato's roadtrip was brought up a few threads back.
| 17 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:16:39pm |
re: #5 Dark_Falcon
His 15 minutes are over. Now if only the same were true of Sarah Palin.
All he has to do is write a tell-all gossip book about how crappy everyone was to him, maybe title it "Going Vogue", and he can get another fifteen minutes or so.
Palin/Wurzzy, Waazle, Wizzle, aw fuckit...
Palin/Joe '12!
| 18 |
Eclectic Infidel Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:17:42pm |
I remember that he took a trip to Sderot to inspect the damage from the Kassams. Then I saw him on John Stewart who grilled him over his media exposure and what his real purpose was and all I recall Joe saying was, "I'm here for the American people," and it just sounded so...contrived, you know? Perhaps I'm wrong, don't know, but as another post said, it's over Joe.
| 19 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:19:50pm |
re: #16 laZardo
That was the first image that came to my mind when the topic of Cato's roadtrip was brought up a few threads back.
Our nation could do worse than having a major journalistic figure who really cares about the truth, even if he'll go to somewhat "extreme" lengths to get to it.
| 20 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:21:08pm |
Sitting on a sofa on a Sunday afternoon
Going to the candidates debate
Laugh about it, shout about it--
When you've got to choose
Every way you look at it, we lose.
Where have you gone, Joltin' Joe?
A nation turns its lonely eyes to you --
What's that you say, Samuel Wurlitzer,
Joltin' Joe has left and gone away--
hey hey hey
Hide it in a hiding place where no one ever goes
Put it in your Wasilla with your cupcake,
It's a little secret, just a republican affair
Most of all, you've got to hide it from the kids
| 22 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:22:21pm |
re: #15 iceweasel
a little flashback about not-joe: April 2009, TeA PaRTy!
Joe the Plumber at Michigan Tea Party: Saying ‘In God We Trust’ Will Get You Shot In Some Places
Nice photos at the link of some other Teabagger signs.
There are parts of the country where saying 'In God we trust' will get you shot? I mean, there are parts of the country where you can get shot, but I don't think they care there whether you trust in God or not.
What in the Lord's name is he on about?
| 23 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:24:14pm |
re: #22 SanFranciscoZionist
There are parts of the country where saying 'In God we trust' will get you shot? I mean, there are parts of the country where you can get shot, but I don't think they care there whether you trust in God or not.
What in the Lord's name is he on about?
Conservative paranoia again, I suppose.
| 24 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:24:32pm |
re: #22 SanFranciscoZionist
There are parts of the country where saying 'In God we trust' will get you shot? I mean, there are parts of the country where you can get shot, but I don't think they care there whether you trust in God or not.
What in the Lord's name is he on about?
He's making shit up, as usual.
Note: one of the signs at the TeA PaRTy!!11 rally he spoke at said "MY GUN IS MY CONSTANT COMPANION".
I have some more dirt about Not-Joe coming right up. BRB.
| 26 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:25:30pm |
That's rich, "McCain used me." If it wasn't for McCain "using" this lowlife-ignorant-yokel he would be back in Ohio still trying to start an unlicensed plumbing business.
| 27 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:27:37pm |
re: #24 iceweasel
He's making shit up, as usual.
Note: one of the signs at the TeA PaRTy!!11 rally he spoke at said "MY GUN IS MY CONSTANT COMPANION".
I have some more dirt about Not-Joe coming right up. BRB.
What's that sweetness? "Waiting is for the non-armed. Can we skip those lines at Walt Disney World?"
| 28 |
Cato the Elder Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:28:03pm |
Let's see:
You make a lying, self-serving, self-pitying comment to a political candidate. That candidate's opponent picks up on it and spreads the lie. You wrap yourself in the flag and go on a wild cross-country tour with the second candidate, lying every step of the way, sucking up the baseless adulation. And you're saying you were used?
| 29 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:28:30pm |
re: #24 iceweasel
He's making shit up, as usual.
Note: one of the signs at the TeA PaRTy!!11 rally he spoke at said "MY GUN IS MY CONSTANT COMPANION".
I have some more dirt about Not-Joe coming right up. BRB.
The paraphilia that also works as a political prop.
/
| 31 |
webevintage Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:29:37pm |
I think his comment about McCain shows what a dick Sam/Joe is.
Joe, also known as Sam Wurzelbacher, told an audience in Pennsylvania this week that McCain "is no public servant."
OT already:
This makes me giddy.
Campaign video by Richard Curtis and Bill Nighy, about the Robin Hood Tax, a tiny tax on bank transactions that could raise hundreds of billions for public services and to tackle poverty and climate change at home and around the world.
I have no opinion on this since I don't like in the UK, I just think Nighy is an awesome actor.
I love Bill Nighy.
I would be his personal stalker if I lived in the UK.
Oh and while watching the figure skating tonight I decided that when I become an Olympic figure skater I will only skate to Queen...no other music allowed.
| 32 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:29:54pm |
re: #26 Gus 802
He's doing the same thing Palin's been doing, albeit a day late and a dollar short I think.
"Them tricksey McCain RINOs were mean to us, precious. Yesss, very mean."
| 33 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:29:55pm |
re: #28 Cato the Elder
Let's see:
You make a lying, self-serving, self-pitying comment to a political candidate. That candidate's opponent picks up on it and spreads the lie. You wrap yourself in the flag and go on a wild cross-country tour with the second candidate, lying every step of the way, sucking up the baseless adulation. And you're saying you were used?
Even if he was used, he had the time of his life. You're right that he was using the McCain campaign too.
| 34 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:30:00pm |
re: #21 Dark_Falcon
Here's to you, Mrs. Jimmah.
I went down to the Chelsea drug store
to get your prescription filled
I was standin in line with Mr Jimmah
Aw man, did he look pretty ill
| 35 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:31:05pm |
re: #23 laZardo
Conservative paranoia again, I suppose.
got nothing to do with being conservative...that's just a tag
| 36 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:31:47pm |
re: #30 laZardo
When didn't conservatives like to make shit up?
You know as much about conservative ideology as those damn tricorne wearing teabaggers. Quit trolling.
| 37 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:32:14pm |
re: #28 Cato the Elder
Let's see:
You make a lying, self-serving, self-pitying comment to a political candidate. That candidate's opponent picks up on it and spreads the lie. You wrap yourself in the flag and go on a wild cross-country tour with the second candidate, lying every step of the way, sucking up the baseless adulation. And you're saying you were used?
bill the SOB
| 38 |
mikhailtheplumber Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:32:16pm |
re: #2 Racer X
He was happy to be used. Now there is no use for him, and he is bitter. Go back to being a plumber Joe. The spotlight has moved to someone else.
Sadly, that "somewhere else" is Sarah Palin. *Sigh*
| 39 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:32:17pm |
re: #31 webevintage
I think his comment about McCain shows what a dick Sam/Joe is.
Joe, also known as Sam Wurzelbacher, told an audience in Pennsylvania this week that McCain "is no public servant."OT already:
This makes me giddy.
Campaign video by Richard Curtis and Bill Nighy, about the Robin Hood Tax, a tiny tax on bank transactions that could raise hundreds of billions for public services and to tackle poverty and climate change at home and around the world.
[Video]I have no opinion on this since I don't like in the UK, I just think Nighy is an awesome actor.
I love Bill Nighy.
I would be his personal stalker if I lived in the UK.Oh and while watching the figure skating tonight I decided that when I become an Olympic figure skater I will only skate to Queen...no other music allowed.
Which songs? Under Pressure would seem apt:
| 40 |
The Sanity Inspector Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:32:49pm |
re: #22 SanFranciscoZionist
There are parts of the country where saying 'In God we trust' will get you shot? I mean, there are parts of the country where you can get shot, but I don't think they care there whether you trust in God or not.
What in the Lord's name is he on about?
He's free-associating, obviously. Maybe he's half-remembering something like the famous incident in Berkeley after 9/11, when the fire trucks were forbidden from flying the flag, for fear of being attacked by leftoid radicals.
| 41 |
EastSider Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:33:25pm |
Joe the Plumber goes off on McCain, says he ‘screwed up my life’.
Well, at least McCain was successful because of it.
/
| 42 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:33:31pm |
re: #30 laZardo
When didn't conservatives like to make shit up?
what a stupid thing to say...congratulations
| 43 |
shai_au Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:33:40pm |
Anyone seen the movie Death at a Funeral?
The gay midget:
"He used me... like a cheap slut."
| 44 |
webevintage Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:34:24pm |
re: #39 Dark_Falcon
Which songs? Under Pressure would seem apt:
[Video]
Any.
All Queen is made of awesome and sweet.
Maybe this:
| 45 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:34:34pm |
re: #36 Slumbering Behemoth
You know as much about conservative ideology as those damn tricorne wearing teabaggers. Quit trolling.
I meant every word of what I said. It took 50 years, Great Leaps and Cultural Revolutions for Maoism to gain the image that it did, 70+ for Russian Marxism.
Certainly the 20 years since at least the "Moral Majority" that got Reagan into power is more than enough for American conservatives to mold and define the image they have today.
| 46 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:34:35pm |
re: #32 Slumbering Behemoth
He's doing the same thing Palin's been doing, albeit a day late and a dollar short I think.
"Them tricksey McCain RINOs were mean to us, precious. Yesss, very mean."
True. Did he write a book yet? I have to admit that at least Palin was a mayor and a member of city council. Wurzelbacher is a complete nobody. It's troubling to thin that the media lends credence to this clown. They might as well start interviewing squirrels at the local park.
| 47 |
prairiefire Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:34:54pm |
| 48 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:35:10pm |
re: #43 shai_au
Anyone seen the movie Death at a Funeral?
The gay midget:
"He used me... like a cheap slut."
they are all sluts....left, right, it doesn't matter
| 49 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:35:58pm |
re: #46 Gus 802
True. Did he write a book yet? I have to admit that at least Palin was a mayor and a member of city council. Wurzelbacher is a complete nobody. It's troubling to thin that the media lends credence to this clown. They might as well start interviewing squirrels at the local park.
All we have to say is that we're worried the government will take our nuts away!
| 50 |
austin_blue Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:36:08pm |
re: #2 Racer X
He was happy to be used. Now there is no use for him, and he is bitter. Go back to being a plumber Joe. The spotlight has moved to someone else.
Well, except for the bit that he was never a plumber, but a contractor. And he didn't make enough money to be affected by the tax increase. And .......
| 51 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:36:43pm |
re: #45 laZardo
I meant every word of what I said. It took 50 years, Great Leaps and Cultural Revolutions for Maoism to gain the image that it did, 70+ for Russian Marxism.
Certainly the 20 years since at least the "Moral Majority" that got Reagan into power is more than enough for American conservatives to mold and define the image they have today.
you are confusing conservatism with a political party....I'd expect better of you but you've gone over the edge with your ideological hysteria
| 52 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:37:06pm |
re: #45 laZardo
You keep confusing the American republican party and theocrats with conservatism. FAIL.
| 53 |
Cato the Elder Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:37:21pm |
Joe was a groupie who got invited backstage by an aging rock star. They did some blow, went to the rock star's hotel, and Joe got passed around among the group members for a night of wild sex. They took him on the tour bus for a few weeks and he was cute enough that they even brought him on stage for a while and let him shake his tits and play the tambourine. Then the next album tanked, the group split up, and Joe got a ticket back to Sucksville and now has to pay for his own Ecstasy habit.
It's a hard old world, Joe.
| 54 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:37:43pm |
re: #40 The Sanity Inspector
He's free-associating, obviously. Maybe he's half-remembering something like the famous incident in Berkeley after 9/11, when the fire trucks were forbidden from flying the flag, for fear of being attacked by leftoid radicals.
Some famous incident. I live ten miles from there, and never heard of it.
They should have left them up.
| 55 |
The Sanity Inspector Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:38:02pm |
re: #28 Cato the Elder
Let's see:
You make a lying, self-serving, self-pitying comment to a political candidate. That candidate's opponent picks up on it and spreads the lie. You wrap yourself in the flag and go on a wild cross-country tour with the second candidate, lying every step of the way, sucking up the baseless adulation. And you're saying you were used?
| 56 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:38:10pm |
re: #41 EastSider
Joe the Plumber goes off on McCain, says he ‘screwed up my life’.
Well, at least McCain was successful because of it.
/
His life doesn't look ruined to me.
| 57 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:38:14pm |
re: #50 austin_blue
Well, except for the bit that he was never a plumber, but a contractor. And he didn't make enough money to be affected by the tax increase. And ...
his plumbing status was a trumped up side show...who gives a shit...a license is an administrative hoop, nothing more
| 58 |
EastSider Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:38:41pm |
re: #53 Cato the Elder
Joe was a groupie who got invited backstage by an aging rock star. They did some blow, went to the rock star's hotel, and Joe got passed around among the group members for a night of wild sex. They took him on the tour bus for a few weeks and he was cute enough that they even brought him on stage for a while and let him shake his tits and play the tambourine. Then the next album tanked, the group split up, and Joe got a ticket back to Sucksville and now has to pay for his own Ecstasy habit.
It's a hard old world, Joe.
"I want to go home!"
"SHHHHH YOU ARE HOME"
/Almost Famous
| 59 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:38:49pm |
re: #51 albusteve
you are confusing conservatism with a political party...I'd expect better of you but you've gone over the edge with your ideological hysteria
You probably weren't listening the last few times I'd mentioned that historically, conservatism in the United States hasn't always been nailed to one party. And when I said that it's shameful that the party of Lincoln and Eisenhower ended up saturated with these lunatics.
But at least when they're all on one boat, it's easier to sink them at the ballot box.
| 60 |
Eclectic Infidel Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:39:06pm |
re: #43 shai_au
A gem of a movie. Did you see that actor in another film...The Station Agent?
| 61 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:39:25pm |
re: #53 Cato the Elder
Joe was a groupie who got invited backstage by an aging rock star. They did some blow, went to the rock star's hotel, and Joe got passed around among the group members for a night of wild sex. They took him on the tour bus for a few weeks and he was cute enough that they even brought him on stage for a while and let him shake his tits and play the tambourine. Then the next album tanked, the group split up, and Joe got a ticket back to Sucksville and now has to pay for his own Ecstasy habit.
It's a hard old world, Joe.
pretty much...very colorful btw
| 62 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:39:38pm |
re: #50 austin_blue
Well, except for the bit that he was never a plumber, but a contractor. And he didn't make enough money to be affected by the tax increase. And ...
That didn't matter! Someday he was going to be rich, and then Obama was going to take all his money away!
//
| 63 |
shai_au Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:40:13pm |
re: #60 eclectic infidel
A gem of a movie. Did you see that actor in another film...The Station Agent?
Yep, I sure did. I think he was the midget in "In Bruges" as well.
| 64 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:40:28pm |
re: #61 albusteve
pretty much...very colorful btw
I've only registered a month or so (lurked for a month or so before that) and I've already noticed Cato has a very... colorful way with language....
| 65 |
Cato the Elder Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:40:34pm |
| 66 |
The Sanity Inspector Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:40:42pm |
re: #44 webevintage
Any.
All Queen is made of awesome and sweet.
Maybe this:
[Video]
Betcha you could bust a move to this:
| 67 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:40:45pm |
re: #46 Gus 802
He hit Obama with a pretty good "gotcha" question, that's about it. His only claim to fame, really.
| 68 |
webevintage Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:41:00pm |
re: #47 prairiefire
I love him, too. Even with tentacles on his face.
[Video]
He even made that and Love Actually not suck so much.
I really liked him in Sate Of Play (not the US movie) but the BBC mini series.
I can't wait for Pirate Radio to come out on DVD.
I just went to look at his page on IMBD and there is another Underworld movie coming out and he is going to be in both Harry Potter AND and episode of Doctor Who.
| 69 |
jaunte Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:41:08pm |
re: #58 EastSider
"I want to go home!"
"SHHH YOU ARE HOME"/Almost Famous
"I think we should work on those last words..."
| 70 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:41:21pm |
re: #52 Slumbering Behemoth
You keep confusing the American republican party and theocrats with conservatism. FAIL.
But it's very fair to point out that there are no longer any 'conservative' intellectuals. It's a complaint I've heard all over, including from conservatives here.
There just isn't any kind of (non-fractured) conservative ideology any more, and no spokespersons for it. Who would that be? Jonah Goldberg? Please.
It's a serious problem for conservatism. Even the former intellectuals went off the rails like 20 years ago-- Thomas Sowell is a case in point.
| 71 |
EastSider Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:41:28pm |
re: #56 SanFranciscoZionist
His life doesn't look ruined to me.
didn't win the election, either.
My saddest moment was the McCain concession speech. Once the pressure was off and his handlers and strategists no longer had a reason to control, he shone as a true statesman. If his campaign had featured more of that, and less sideshow (a la Mr. Plumber), It would've at least been closer down the stretch.
| 72 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:41:50pm |
re: #64 jamesfirecat
I've only registered a month or so (lurked for a month or so before that) and I've already noticed Cato has a very... colorful way with language...
just don't poke sticks into his cage...he will fuck you up in a heartbeat
| 73 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:42:06pm |
re: #67 Slumbering Behemoth
He hit Obama with a pretty good "gotcha" question, that's about it. His only claim to fame, really.
A "gotcha" question that wasn't anywhere near being true, since there's no way a man who was making 40K a year (I saw that number somewhere) could buy a 250K business....
| 74 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:42:25pm |
re: #67 Slumbering Behemoth
He hit Obama with a pretty good "gotcha" question, that's about it. His only claim to fame, really.
That was his one hit wonder. Then they decided to make him the working class John Galt. That was before they vetted him and found out he was an airhead slacker. I see a pattern here.
| 75 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:42:46pm |
re: #70 iceweasel
But it's very fair to point out that there are no longer any 'conservative' intellectuals. It's a complaint I've heard all over, including from conservatives here.
There just isn't any kind of (non-fractured) conservative ideology any more, and no spokespersons for it. Who would that be? Jonah Goldberg? Please.It's a serious problem for conservatism. Even the former intellectuals went off the rails like 20 years ago-- Thomas Sowell is a case in point.
There are conservative intellectuals, the problem is that they all seem to be hear on this blog instead of in charge of the GOP....
| 76 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:43:33pm |
re: #65 Cato the Elder
I am enjoying the hell out of the Edwards saga.
"we're all going to hell!'....hahaha!...hey John, you don't go there...you bring it to yourself
| 77 |
The Sanity Inspector Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:43:35pm |
re: #53 Cato the Elder
Joe was a groupie who got invited backstage by an aging rock star. They did some blow, went to the rock star's hotel, and Joe got passed around among the group members for a night of wild sex. They took him on the tour bus for a few weeks and he was cute enough that they even brought him on stage for a while and let him shake his tits and play the tambourine. Then the next album tanked, the group split up, and Joe got a ticket back to Sucksville and now has to pay for his own Ecstasy habit.
It's a hard old world, Joe.
...!!!...Ha! And can't you land a job writing stuff like that?
| 78 |
Cato the Elder Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:44:11pm |
re: #16 laZardo
That was the first image that came to my mind when the topic of Cato's roadtrip was brought up a few threads back.
Somebody was talking about my road trip? Linky?
| 79 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:44:18pm |
re: #63 shai_au
Yep, I sure did. I think he was the midget in "In Bruges" as well.
Speaking of short actors, I've seen this woman in couple of TV shows, and I think she's really good. Not to mention damn pretty.
| 80 |
prairiefire Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:44:26pm |
re: #68 webevintage
Woot~~ I've got "Still Crazy" on DVD to watch, also.
| 81 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:44:50pm |
re: #72 albusteve
just don't poke sticks into his cage...he will fuck you up in a heartbeat
True That.
| 82 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:45:05pm |
re: #79 SanFranciscoZionist
Speaking of short actors, I've seen this woman in couple of TV shows, and I think she's really good. Not to mention damn pretty.
Oh yeah, I saw her on NCIS once.
| 83 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:45:08pm |
re: #74 Gus 802
That was his one hit wonder. Then they decided to make him the working class John Galt. That was before they vetted him and found out he was an airhead slacker. I see a pattern here.
I was unaware that there was a non working class John Galt. I mean isn't the entire point of John Galt that he's a shinning example to all who can make his own way in the world and doubtlessly didn't owe his brilliance to anyone, like say the public schooling system he might have attended, or any library he read books at......
| 84 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:45:08pm |
re: #46 Gus 802
True. Did he write a book yet? I have to admit that at least Palin was a mayor and a member of city council. Wurzelbacher is a complete nobody. It's troubling to thin that the media lends credence to this clown. They might as well start interviewing squirrels at the local park.
Why yes, yes he did.
LOLz ensued.
Joe the Plumber, Plumbing New Levels in Interest
| 85 |
austin_blue Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:46:03pm |
re: #23 laZardo
Conservative paranoia again, I suppose.
You are neither an idiot nor a fool. That makes that last statement one from a shit stirrer. That won't work on this board anymore. Time to act like an adult.
| 86 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:46:32pm |
re: #82 Gus 802
Oh yeah, I saw her on NCIS once.
She was on a House episode too. There was some serious electricity between her and House, and she was as bitter as he is. I hoped she might stick around for a few more episodes and become a love interest. Didn't happen, alas.
| 87 |
Dancing along the light of day Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:46:58pm |
re: #65 Cato the Elder
I am enjoying the hell out of the Edwards saga.
Who's your Daddy?
LOL!
*waves*
| 88 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:47:04pm |
re: #83 jamesfirecat
I was unaware that there was a non working class John Galt. I mean isn't the entire point of John Galt that he's a shinning example to all who can make his own way in the world and doubtlessly didn't owe his brilliance to anyone, like say the public schooling system he might have attended, or any library he read books at...
I thought he was "an engineer at the Twentieth Century Motor Company"? Anyway, I never read any of it.
| 89 |
EastSider Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:47:10pm |
re: #75 jamesfirecat
There are conservative intellectuals, the problem is that they all seem to be hear on this blog instead of in charge of the GOP...
Hard to grab the attention given all the noise right now. A GOPer saying anything to the left of Cheney gets you lambasted by the Tea Partiers, who currently have the loudest non-office holding microphone. They're masquerading as populism and conservatism, and is largely an insult to both.
I'm not saying I disagree with the position that there are "no conservative intellectuals," I'm just saying that if there are, they have little ability (or incentive) to make a principled stand right now.
| 90 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:47:54pm |
re: #78 Cato the Elder
Somebody was talking about my road trip? Linky?
Lemme see if I can dig down a few threads back. >_>
| 91 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:47:57pm |
re: #84 iceweasel
Why yes, yes he did.
LOLz ensued.
Joe the Plumber, Plumbing New Levels in Interest
Teh Ceiling Book Review Cat said noz!
/What a world.
| 92 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:48:01pm |
re: #70 iceweasel
But it's very fair to point out that there are no longer any 'conservative' intellectuals. It's a complaint I've heard all over, including from conservatives here.
There just isn't any kind of (non-fractured) conservative ideology any more, and no spokespersons for it. Who would that be? Jonah Goldberg? Please.It's a serious problem for conservatism. Even the former intellectuals went off the rails like 20 years ago-- Thomas Sowell is a case in point.
serious?, yes it is politically...otherwise I'm doing fine living my style by my conservative principles and rules I write for myself...I'll represent myself until I give the okay for someone else to carry my water...which appears to be about never...but I can live nicely outside the realm of lunatic national politics...for me, govt is an inconvenience but I can deal with it
| 93 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:48:29pm |
re: #89 EastSider
Hard to grab the attention given all the noise right now. A GOPer saying anything to the left of Cheney gets you lambasted by the Tea Partiers, who currently have the loudest non-office holding microphone. They're masquerading as populism and conservatism, and is largely an insult to both.
I'm not saying I disagree with the position that there are "no conservative intellectuals," I'm just saying that if there are, they have little ability (or incentive) to make a principled stand right now.
Hey "Left of Cheney" isn't so bad when you can consider that at least Cheney is pro gay marriage and anti-DADT.
| 94 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:48:45pm |
re: #85 austin_blue
You are neither an idiot nor a fool. That makes that last statement one from a shit stirrer. That won't work on this board anymore. Time to act like an adult.
Thank you, Austin. That was a Grade A Smackdown, delivered as only a Texan can.
| 95 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:48:51pm |
re: #83 jamesfirecat
I was unaware that there was a non working class John Galt. I mean isn't the entire point of John Galt that he's a shinning example to all who can make his own way in the world and doubtlessly didn't owe his brilliance to anyone, like say the public schooling system he might have attended, or any library he read books at...
The "Go Galt" strategy is much loved (and advocated) by some on the right. The idea is that the 'producers' (who are all millionaires and self-made men) will stop producing and live in a compound hippie free love commune 'Gulch' and leave us shiftless types to realise the error of our wrongs against them.
| 96 |
austin_blue Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:49:13pm |
re: #57 albusteve
his plumbing status was a trumped up side show...who gives a shit...a license is an administrative hoop, nothing more
No, Steve, it was a label, embraced by Joe. HE gave a shit.
| 97 |
webevintage Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:49:23pm |
Freddy Mercury really was something.
| 98 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:49:30pm |
re: #85 austin_blue
You are neither an idiot nor a fool. That makes that last statement one from a shit stirrer. That won't work on this board anymore. Time to act like an adult.
Yes ma'am.
/though sometimes a spade really has to be called a spade.
| 99 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:50:00pm |
re: #95 iceweasel
The "Go Galt" strategy is much loved (and advocated) by some on the right. The idea is that the 'producers' (who are all millionaires and self-made men) will stop producing and live in a
compoundhippie free love commune'Gulch' and leave us shiftless types to realise the error of our wrongs against them.
Of course right now, yeah, I'd just love to see those CEOs step down, I bet they'd have a real hard time finding someone to take a job with a multi-million dollar salary these days....
| 100 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:50:08pm |
re: #97 webevintage
Freddy Mercury really was something.
[Video]
He was a true talent. He loved music and he gave the world some great songs.
| 101 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:50:15pm |
re: #95 iceweasel
The "Go Galt" strategy is much loved (and advocated) by some on the right. The idea is that the 'producers' (who are all millionaires and self-made men) will stop producing and live in
aRapture and leave us shiftless types to realise the error of our wrongs against them.compoundhippie free love commune'Gulch'
/Bioshock reference go.
| 102 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:51:15pm |
| 103 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:51:29pm |
re: #95 iceweasel
The "Go Galt" strategy is much loved (and advocated) by some on the right. The idea is that the 'producers' (who are all millionaires and self-made men) will stop producing and live in a
compoundhippie free love commune'Gulch' and leave us shiftless types to realise the error of our wrongs against them.
So he wasn't a working class hero? Dare I ask was he really an "elitist" hero given that he revoked his talents as an engineer-inventor.
Ayn Rand's metaphor of "I'm taking my toys and going home." /
| 104 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:51:29pm |
re: #70 iceweasel
It is a problem that will continue to exist so long as republican theocrats and lefty trolls have the loudest definition of what conservative ideology means. I don't think a modern day Buckley or Goldwater could get half a chance to have their voices heard in this environment.
| 105 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:51:43pm |
re: #98 laZardo
Stop the insults please. They contribute nothing and they turn the thread to shit.
| 106 |
EastSider Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:52:01pm |
re: #93 jamesfirecat
Hey "Left of Cheney" isn't so bad when you can consider that at least Cheney is pro gay marriage and anti-DADT.
Even he couldn't sell out his own daughter's happiness?
I don't have the exact quote, but Cheney said something to the effect of "A lot has changed since the rule came about." He's right.
What's changed is that many people have had friends and relatives come out in the past 15-20 years. Its harder to demonize a person you love and respect.
...
So yeah, Left of Cheney on Foreign Policy will get you yelled at, as well as left of Pat Buchanan(?) socially? Not sure who the right (heh) example is, but you have to be pretty aligned w/ "conservative" "ideology" to not get yelled at by tea partiers these days.
| 107 |
austin_blue Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:52:49pm |
re: #92 albusteve
serious?, yes it is politically...otherwise I'm doing fine living my style by my conservative principles and rules I write for myself...I'll represent myself until I give the okay for someone else to carry my water...which appears to be about never...but I can live nicely outside the realm of lunatic national politics...for me, govt is an inconvenience but I can deal with it
Sweet! Please vote for yourself in all future elections so that you don't inflict "conservatives" of the other persuasions you don't like upon the rest of us.
Really, do us all a favor.
| 108 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:53:16pm |
re: #96 austin_blue
No, Steve, it was a label, embraced by Joe. HE gave a shit.
and you fell for such a ridiculous ploy? and still do?...people are whatever they say they are or they are frauds...it depends on your definition of plumber...if he could solder pipe he was a plumber...if he claimed to be licensed and wasn't he's a lying plumber
| 109 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:53:20pm |
re: #106 EastSider
Even he couldn't sell out his own daughter's happiness?
I don't have the exact quote, but Cheney said something to the effect of "A lot has changed since the rule came about." He's right.
What's changed is that many people have had friends and relatives come out in the past 15-20 years. Its harder to demonize a person you love and respect.
...
So yeah, Left of Cheney on Foreign Policy will get you yelled at, as well as left of Pat Buchanan(?) socially? Not sure who the right (heh) example is, but you have to be pretty aligned w/ "conservative" "ideology" to not get yelled at by tea partiers these days.
From what I've seen of Dick Cheney he's a "family values" conservative in the sense of what's good for Dick Cheney's family are the thing he values.
| 110 |
EastSider Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:53:26pm |
re: #104 Slumbering Behemoth
It is a problem that will continue to exist so long as republican theocrats and lefty trolls have the loudest definition of what conservative ideology means. I don't think a modern day Buckley or Goldwater could get half a chance to have their voices heard in this environment.
Agree. See my #89. We're very much on the same page.
| 111 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:53:36pm |
re: #105 Dark_Falcon
Stop the insults please. They contribute nothing and they turn the thread to shit.
I actually say "Yes ma'am" to pretty much everyone. 'Specially when it's much harder to determine a user's gender on the internets.
Unless you're talking about the spades.
| 112 |
webevintage Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:53:44pm |
re: #101 laZardo
/Bioshock reference go.
My son said he would go Galt if he could shoot bees out of his hands?
(I don't get it since I've never played Bioshock)
| 113 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:54:09pm |
Not-Joe, Not-a-Plumber, FAILs at 'reporting':
Joe the Plumber: ‘I think media should be abolished’ from reporting on war.
Samuel Joseph Wurzelbacher, aka “Joe the Plumber,” is currently in Israel covering the war for the conservative site PJTV.com. When asked what he has learned from his new experiences as a journalist, Wurzelbacher said that he believes the media shouldn’t be allowed to do “reporting” on wars:
I’ll be honest with you. I don’t think journalists should be anywhere allowed war. I mean, you guys report where our troops are at. You report what’s happening day to day. You make a big deal out of it. I think it’s asinine. You know, I liked back in World War I and World War II when you’d go to the theater and you’d see your troops on, you know, the screen and everyone would be real excited and happy for’em. Now everyone’s got an opinion and wants to downer–and down soldiers. You know, American soldiers or Israeli soldiers.
I think media should be abolished from, uh, you know, reporting. You know, war is hell. And if you’re gonna sit there and say, “Well look at this atrocity,” well you don’t know the whole story behind it half the time, so I think the media should have no business in it.
Video at link.
| 115 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:55:32pm |
re: #112 webevintage
My son said he would go Galt if he could shoot bees out of his hands?
(I don't get it since I've never played Bioshock)
Its one of the powers the "plasmids" (which are like magic spells (and wow this is one smart built in dictionary since it didn't throw a fit at "plasmids" how kind of it!)) in the game.
And you should consider picking up Bioshock if you at all like FPSes.
| 116 |
austin_blue Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:55:38pm |
re: #98 laZardo
Yes ma'am.
/though sometimes a spade really has to be called a spade.
Well, there you go again....
| 117 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:55:47pm |
re: #95 iceweasel
The "Go Galt" strategy is much loved (and advocated) by some on the right. The idea is that the 'producers' (who are all millionaires and self-made men) will stop producing and live in a
compoundhippie free love commune'Gulch' and leave us shiftless types to realise the error of our wrongs against them.
Shaking head in pure disbelief....
| 118 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:55:53pm |
re: #107 austin_blue
Sweet! Please vote for yourself in all future elections so that you don't inflict "conservatives" of the other persuasions you don't like upon the rest of us.
Really, do us all a favor.
whatever infliction you feel is your problem...I don't get involved...I'm independent of all that sort of shit...why aren't you?
| 119 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:55:55pm |
re: #113 iceweasel
Not-Joe, Not-a-Plumber, FAILs at 'reporting':
Joe the Plumber: ‘I think media should be abolished’ from reporting on war.
Video at link.
Joe "The Plumber": Foreign Policy-Media Consultant.
A great deal of laughter ensued.
That's doesn't sound like a real American. ;)
| 120 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:56:18pm |
re: #113 iceweasel
Not-Joe, Not-a-Plumber, FAILs at 'reporting':
Joe the Plumber: ‘I think media should be abolished’ from reporting on war.
Video at link.
"I mean, you guys report where our troops are at."
No I think only Geraldo Rivera does that....
| 121 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:56:55pm |
re: #109 jamesfirecat
From what I've seen of Dick Cheney he's a "family values" conservative in the sense of what's good for Dick Cheney's family are the thing he values.
That's better than selling out your kids for votes. I have to say.
| 122 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:57:27pm |
re: #117 SanFranciscoZionist
Shaking head in pure disbelief...
I have some tasty, tasty linkage on that as well....
| 123 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:58:13pm |
re: #122 iceweasel
I have some tasty, tasty linkage on that as well...
I just don't get people who see the economy as some sort of personal feud between themselves and the rest of society.
| 124 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:58:22pm |
re: #95 iceweasel
The "Go Galt" strategy is much loved (and advocated) by some on the right. The idea is that the 'producers' (who are all millionaires and self-made men) will stop producing and live in a
compoundhippie free love commune'Gulch' and leave us shiftless types to realise the error of our wrongs against them.
Also you misread the end of the story.
Us shiftless types all die in a huge war so that our remaining offspring can scratch a living off rocks and be reduced to savages until Galt and his friends choose to return and bring civilization with them at which point we'll be overjoyed at the prospect of working in their factories and never try to take their money away ever again!
| 125 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:59:08pm |
re: #103 Gus 802
So he wasn't a working class hero? Dare I ask was he really an "elitist" hero given that he revoked his talents as an engineer-inventor.
Ayn Rand's metaphor of "I'm taking my toys and going home." /
best quote ever about "Atlas Shrugged"
There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.
| 127 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 9:59:46pm |
if Joe the Plumber disturbs anyone, either by his words or his behavior, needs a new video game to play...makes for a fun thread tho but who couls possibly give a damn about that guy?...is there a syndrome for your gross over reaction?
| 128 |
Eclectic Infidel Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:00:31pm |
re: #79 SanFranciscoZionist
Very pretty, and I do recognize her.
| 129 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:00:47pm |
re: #121 SanFranciscoZionist
That's better than selling out your kids for votes. I have to say.
Ron Paul!...er what's his kids name again?
| 130 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:01:55pm |
re: #112 webevintage
My son said he would go Galt if he could shoot bees out of his hands?
(I don't get it since I've never played Bioshock)
Swarm!
| 131 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:02:23pm |
re: #127 albusteve
if Joe the Plumber disturbs anyone, either by his words or his behavior, needs a new video game to play...makes for a fun thread tho but who couls possibly give a damn about that guy?...is there a syndrome for your gross over reaction?
Well that's why its the last thread of the day.
Do you expect us to be discussing serious policy this late at night?
Now then back to Bioshock, have any of you guys noticed that Sander Cohen's Quadtych, entirely made of plastered Sander Cohens?
| 132 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:02:24pm |
re: #105 Dark_Falcon
I wouldn't even grade them as insults. Just deliberate cheap shots made with a broad tar brush the size of a bus.
| 133 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:02:34pm |
J the P!
voice of American conservatives!
I like it!
| 134 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:03:59pm |
re: #132 Slumbering Behemoth
I wouldn't even grade them as insults. Just deliberate cheap shots made with a broad tar brush the size of a bus.
pretty much yeah...I would never blow off all liberals like that
| 135 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:05:25pm |
re: #123 SanFranciscoZionist
I just don't get people who see the economy as some sort of personal feud between themselves and the rest of society.
It's fantasy.
Carol Baum: Welfare CEOs are Just Like John Galt
Bloomberg columnist Carol Baum puts together a baffling analogy:
he hero of Ayn Rand’s “Atlas Shrugged” is smiling because he’s seen it all before: the government’s intervention in the private sector; the constraints placed on business in the name of the people; the desperation on the part of government bureaucrats when they realize their leverage is limited; and — this part is still fiction — the decision on the part of business leaders to walk away from the enterprises they built. [...] The government needs Liddy and Citigroup’s Vikram Pandit and Bank of America’s Ken Lewis to continue working to restore their firms to prosperity in the same way the looters in Rand’s novel need Hank Reardon and Francisco d’Anconia and Dagny Taggart, respectively, to run their steel mills, copper mines and railroad.Atlas Shrugged is a stupid book, Ayn Rand is a stupid woman, and John Galt’s ideas are stupid. That said, none of them are nearly this stupid. Rand’s novel isn’t about a world in which executives who build companies based on a lot of incorrect decisions, then pay themselves millions of dollars while bankrupting their firms, then come to the government hat-in-hand asking for bailouts, then find that the bailers-out want to attach some strings to their hundreds of billions of dollars in public funds and then go to hide out in Galt’s Gulch. That doesn’t make any sense at all.
If the folks running Citigroup and Bank of America and AIG were good at their jobs, we wouldn’t be in this situation in the first place. That’s the point. But they weren’t good. They lost staggering sums of money. Their companies went broke. They had to beg for taxpayer dollars. You don’t get to do that and then turn around and “go Galt.”
| 136 |
austin_blue Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:05:28pm |
re: #108 albusteve
and you fell for such a ridiculous ploy? and still do?...people are whatever they say they are or they are frauds...it depends on your definition of plumber...if he could solder pipe he was a plumber...if he claimed to be licensed and wasn't he's a lying plumber
No. America fell for the ridiculous ploy and you seem to think it's OK for the R's to incorporate that into their campaign.
Oh, and by the way, brilliant bit here:
"people are whatever they say they are or they are frauds"
So, Joe the Plumber said he was a plumber, and he wasn't, so, ipso facto, he's a fraud, right?
Pfft.
| 137 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:06:53pm |
re: #132 Slumbering Behemoth
I wouldn't even grade them as insults. Just deliberate cheap shots made with a broad tar brush the size of a bus.
Quite Concur.
| 138 |
Eclectic Infidel Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:07:37pm |
re: #124 jamesfirecat
Also you misread the end of the story.
Us shiftless types all die in a huge war so that our remaining offspring can scratch a living off rocks and be reduced to savages until Galt and his friends choose to return and bring civilization with them at which point we'll be overjoyed at the prospect of working in their factories and never try to take their money away ever again!
There almost seems to be a religious element to that scenario.
| 139 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:07:47pm |
re: #134 albusteve
pretty much yeah...I would never blow off all liberals like that
Not without charging a hefty "per head" fee, anyway.
/
:ouch:
| 140 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:09:01pm |
re: #138 eclectic infidel
There almost seems to be a religious element to that scenario.
Which is ironic because Rand was a militant atheist who hated the idea of people believing in anything that couldn't be proven.
| 141 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:09:32pm |
re: #133 albusteve
J the P!
voice of American conservatives!I like it!
I don't. The man is ignorant and most of the time poorly spoken. He needs political education and training in public speaking before he could be the voice of anything.
| 142 |
EastSider Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:10:42pm |
re: #135 iceweasel
Crazier still is the appropriation of the story as something that directly impacts tea partiers or the middle class. I've seen situations where they'll try to evoke empathy/sympathy for these CEOs who've been "handcuffed," "neutered," or whatever other hyperbole. Many times individuals rage against actions that are specifically designed to help them, but they feel a closer match to the CEOs than themselves.
| 143 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:10:53pm |
re: #113 iceweasel
Not-Joe, Not-a-Plumber, FAILs at 'reporting':
Joe the Plumber: ‘I think media should be abolished’ from reporting on war.
Video at link.
Since this fools mentions WWI it should be noted that most Americans didn't want to go off and fight "a European war." During that time American was knee deep in labor strife, sweat shops, child labor, and violence from factory owners and labor strife. All leading to the anarchist bombing of 1919. No one was "happy" seeing our Doughboys in the trenches. Many peace groups were organized in the aftermath of WWI.
| 144 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:12:06pm |
re: #142 EastSider
Crazier still is the appropriation of the story as something that directly impacts tea partiers or the middle class. I've seen situations where they'll try to evoke empathy/sympathy for these CEOs who've been "handcuffed," "neutered," or whatever other hyperbole. Many times individuals rage against actions that are specifically designed to help them, but they feel a closer match to the CEOs than themselves.
Want my two cents? Its because people want to imagine that they're the those CEOs.....
I think I saw a poll once where 19% of the people asked said they're part of the top 1% of income earners.....
| 145 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:12:26pm |
re: #136 austin_blue
No. America fell for the ridiculous ploy and you seem to think it's OK for the R's to incorporate that into their campaign.
Oh, and by the way, brilliant bit here:
"people are whatever they say they are or they are frauds"
So, Joe the Plumber said he was a plumber, and he wasn't, so, ipso facto, he's a fraud, right?
Pfft.
I don't give a damn about the GOP...and yes, Joe was a plumber...whether he was licensed or not is essentially neither here nor there in reality...but you can blather all you want about a license, it does not change the fact that he was a plumber...I don't let the govt decide who's what, I decide for myself
| 146 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:13:13pm |
re: #141 Dark_Falcon
I don't. The man is ignorant and most of the time poorly spoken. He needs political education and training in public speaking before he could be the voice of anything.
maybe he can write notes on his hand?
| 147 |
austin_blue Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:13:21pm |
re: #118 albusteve
whatever infliction you feel is your problem...I don't get involved...I'm independent of all that sort of shit...why aren't you?
"infliction"? "I don't get involved"?
So you don't vote?
Really?
"why aren't you?"
Because I feel that voting is the primary purpose of the Social Compact.
| 148 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:13:25pm |
re: #138 eclectic infidel
There almost seems to be a religious element to that scenario.
Yeah. To be honest it reminds me of Manson.
He believed there would be a 'race war' where black people would wipe out white people. 144,000 would survive, and he and his Family would wait it out in the desert.
Then black people, being incapable of running a society and in need of rulers, would beg Manson and his Family to 'come back' and assume their rightful places as rulers of the world.
The Helter Skelter murders were all meant to bring about that 'race war'. This is usually ignored when people talk about Manson or the Family, but these ideas (race war, hiding out in the desert during the 'Tribulation', and eventual assumption of their rightful role as the 'rulers') -- EndTimes and messed up white supremacism shit -- had as much to do with the killings as Manson's own sociopathy.
| 149 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:14:10pm |
re: #139 Slumbering Behemoth
Not without charging a hefty "per head" fee, anyway.
/
:ouch:
moooo!....baaaaa!
| 150 |
EastSider Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:14:20pm |
re: #144 jamesfirecat
Want my two cents? Its because people want to imagine that they're the those CEOs...
I think I saw a poll once where 19% of the people asked said they're part of the top 1% of income earners...
Or, if they're not already CEO's in their own minds, that they'll one day very soon be rich.
Or, they have a dogged belief in the trickle down theory.
Or, they think the government is either so inept (or sinister) that a program aimed at helping them will actually hurt them.
| 151 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:15:28pm |
re: #135 iceweasel
Yeah. Go Galt. Then borrow money from the Federal Reserve at 0 percent interest. Those financial institutions would be worthless without the Federal government -- especially given their track records.
| 152 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:15:49pm |
re: #150 EastSider
Or, if they're not already CEO's in their own minds, that they'll one day very soon be rich.
Or, they have a dogged belief in the trickle down theory.
Or, they think the government is either so inept (or sinister) that a program aimed at helping them will actually hurt them.
All perfectly reasonable ideas...
| 153 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:16:13pm |
re: #148 iceweasel
I had heard about him and his 'race war' but not in that detail.
| 154 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:17:01pm |
re: #151 Gus 802
Yeah. Go Galt. Then borrow money from the Federal Reserve at 0 percent interest. Those financial institutions would be worthless without the Federal government -- especially given their track records.
Its especially ironic given that sales of Atlas Shrugged went through the roof recently, when our problems were brought about by a LACK OF GOVERNMENT REGULATION the exact opposite of the problem facing our "heroes" in Atlas Shrugged.....
| 155 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:17:46pm |
re: #147 austin_blue
"infliction"? "I don't get involved"?
So you don't vote?
Really?
"why aren't you?"
Because I feel that voting is the primary purpose of the Social Compact.
each to his own...I didn't say I don't vote did I?...I don't get involved with Republican bullshit and all the labeling that goes with it...tora tora
| 156 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:18:38pm |
re: #154 jamesfirecat
I found it ironic that so many people bought it when you can get it for free off the net.
| 157 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:19:22pm |
re: #143 Gus 802
Since this fools mentions WWI it should be noted that most Americans didn't want to go off and fight "a European war." During that time American was knee deep in labor strife, sweat shops, child labor, and violence from factory owners and labor strife. All leading to the anarchist bombing of 1919. No one was "happy" seeing our Doughboys in the trenches. Many peace groups were organized in the aftermath of WWI.
Not only here, either. Such groups came into being in Europe as well. Sadly, they ended up doing more harm than good. Their opposition to confronting Hitler gave him time to build the army he used to conquer Poland and France and their advocacy of appeasement made him think he could get way with attacking Poland without Britain declaring war.
| 158 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:19:43pm |
re: #154 jamesfirecat
Its especially ironic given that sales of Atlas Shrugged went through the roof recently, when our problems were brought about by a LACK OF GOVERNMENT REGULATION the exact opposite of the problem facing our "heroes" in Atlas Shrugged...
And they're still resistant to revitalizing previous regulations like Glass-Steagall. From what I understand everything is returning to business as usual. What that means is we might be looking at a boom again but once again a bust will follow. Hence the boom and bust periods.
| 159 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:20:11pm |
re: #156 Jadespring
I found it ironic that so many people bought it when you can get it for free off the net.
people like real books?...big wads of paper pages?...I can understand that, I still go to the library every week
| 160 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:20:49pm |
re: #159 albusteve
people like real books?...big wads of paper pages?...I can understand that, I still go to the library every week
People still go to the library?
/ q;
| 161 |
Cato the Elder Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:20:50pm |
[Night. Late night. An unkempt, ramshackle, half-drywalled house in Sucksville, Middle America. JOE sits glassy-eyed in front of the teevee, which gives the room its only light. The sound is off, but we can see a series of images from the 2008 presidential campaign. Tracks through muddy snow to an outhouse, seen through a half-open door through which the cold air seeps, and a certain half-human, half-vegetable fug tell us that the plumbing hasn't been working for some time.]
JOE [after swigging from an unchilled bottle of Jägermeister and finishing a tax-free cigarette from the Indian res]:
Dammit!
They used me!
And now my dirtbag agent calls and resigns. But first he has to stick the knife in and tell me that my application to be one of John's senatorial pages will probably be turned down because of my latest interview.
Fuck you, America!
[Sobs. Coughs. Hurls on shag rug, passes out. Fade to black.]
| 162 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:20:54pm |
re: #156 Jadespring
I found it ironic that so many people bought it when you can get it for free off the net.
No, no, no, getting Atlas Shrugged for free off the net, THATS IRONIC!
They were just trying to be true to Rand's principles, do you know what kind of people expect to get books for free?
| 163 |
Irenicum Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:21:20pm |
Joe the Plumber, the copyrighted trade mark: Can I just say heh, double heh, and triple heh. You're the victim of your own avaricious desires. Any complaint from you is beyond ironic.
| 164 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:21:38pm |
re: #153 Jadespring
I had heard about him and his 'race war' but not in that detail.
It's all in the Bugliosi book about Manson. VB was the prosecutor on the case.
There's a great deal of info available about the Manson murders; the sensational info is what we still remember now, but Manson had a fully worked out ideology. Race war, the number 144,000, and various biblical shit came into it.
He also did some vicious things to the members of his "Family", particularly the women. The coverage focusses on "How could a middleclass girl go out and do such things" -- but at the time, in the trial and the press coverage, no one wanted to talk about what he was doing to them to break them down.
Very, very foul stuff.
| 165 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:22:21pm |
re: #157 Dark_Falcon
Not only here, either. Such groups came into being in Europe as well. Sadly, they ended up doing more harm than good. Their opposition to confronting Hitler gave him time to build the army he used to conquer Poland and France and their advocacy of appeasement made him think he could get way with attacking Poland without Britain declaring war.
I know. Didn't mean to say that I agreed with them just pointing out their existence. To portray those eras as being one homogeneous experience doesn't tell the complete story of America.
| 166 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:23:05pm |
re: #160 laZardo
People still go to the library?
/ q;
next to a gun shop, it's my favorite place to visit...maybe I'm getting old eh?
| 167 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:24:01pm |
re: #159 albusteve
people like real books?...big wads of paper pages?...I can understand that, I still go to the library every week
Yeah so do I. I have over 1000 books in my own library. Bit of a book fiend much to hubby's chagrin since I keep asking for more shelves.
I was trying to make a funny but it came out as one big FAIL. I blame it on the late hour and brain that is only half functioning ATM.
| 168 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:24:16pm |
re: #166 albusteve
next to a gun shop, it's my favorite place to visit...maybe I'm getting old eh?
My 'hipster-punk' little brother actually enjoys going to the firing range. I'd say "only in America" if it wasn't happening in Manila.
| 169 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:24:45pm |
re: #164 iceweasel
It's all in the Bugliosi book about Manson. VB was the prosecutor on the case.
There's a great deal of info available about the Manson murders; the sensational info is what we still remember now, but Manson had a fully worked out ideology. Race war, the number 144,000, and various biblical shit came into it.
He also did some vicious things to the members of his "Family", particularly the women. The coverage focusses on "How could a middleclass girl go out and do such things" -- but at the time, in the trial and the press coverage, no one wanted to talk about what he was doing to them to break them down.
Very, very foul stuff.
yikes!...very very good movie too
| 170 |
EastSider Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:25:12pm |
re: #154 jamesfirecat
Its especially ironic given that sales of Atlas Shrugged went through the roof recently, when our problems were brought about by a LACK OF GOVERNMENT REGULATION the exact opposite of the problem facing our "heroes" in Atlas Shrugged...
You've touched a nerve here.
I think one of the biggest problems Obama has been having is that he's not just combating differing political idealogies or policy positions (e.g. better regulations of health insurance firms vs government operated insurance pools; higher financial regulation vs bailouts).
He's actually fighting to defend the concept that the US federal government is an entity that can accomplish any positive good at all. When he says "my plan is to do actions A, B, C to achieve goals X, Y, Z," the response from tea partiers (and repubs as well) isn't "we agree with your goals, but not your actions" or even "we think your goals are off." The response from the tea partiers and GOP is "the US government is not able to achive goals X, Y, Z" or, worse, "while you're stating goals of X, Y, Z, we believe you have a hidden agenda, and are trying to subvert what we believe to be the principles of our nation"
So yeah, the tea partiers are messing up in their root cause analysis on the financial meltdown. They want less government, because its inherently useless and/or deviously working against them.
And that's a very interesting group for any GOP members to align themselves.
| 171 |
austin_blue Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:25:28pm |
re: #145 albusteve
I don't give a damn about the GOP...and yes, Joe was a plumber...whether he was licensed or not is essentially neither here nor there in reality...but you can blather all you want about a license, it does not change the fact that he was a plumber...I don't let the govt decide who's what, I decide for myself
Dude, just to be clear, if you don't have a license to be a plumber and you make money as being a plumber you are breaking the law. The fact is that that Joe was never was a *legal* plumber in the State. He was no more legitimate than an illegal alien.
| 172 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:25:30pm |
re: #162 jamesfirecat
No, no, no, getting Atlas Shrugged for free off the net, THATS IRONIC!
They were just trying to be true to Rand's principles, do you know what kind of people expect to get books for free?
Yeah that's more what I was trying to get at but as I just posted I failed badly and messed it up. :D
| 173 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:25:45pm |
re: #167 Jadespring
Yeah so do I. I have over 1000 books in my own library. Bit of a book fiend much to hubby's chagrin since I keep asking for more shelves.
I was trying to make a funny but it came out as one big FAIL. I blame it on the late hour and brain that is only half functioning ATM.
I got you...no problem
| 174 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:25:47pm |
re: #165 Gus 802
I know. Didn't mean to say that I agreed with them just pointing out their existence. To portray those eras as being one homogeneous experience doesn't tell the complete story of America.
Agreed. I knew what you were trying to say, I just wanted to complete the picture.
| 175 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:27:01pm |
re: #172 Jadespring
Yeah that's more what I was trying to get at but as I just posted I failed badly and messed it up. :D
Its okay its late at night.
| 177 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:28:14pm |
re: #170 EastSider
You've touched a nerve here.
I think one of the biggest problems Obama has been having is that he's not just combating differing political idealogies or policy positions (e.g. better regulations of health insurance firms vs government operated insurance pools; higher financial regulation vs bailouts).
He's actually fighting to defend the concept that the US federal government is an entity that can accomplish any positive good at all. When he says "my plan is to do actions A, B, C to achieve goals X, Y, Z," the response from tea partiers (and repubs as well) isn't "we agree with your goals, but not your actions" or even "we think your goals are off." The response from the tea partiers and GOP is "the US government is not able to achive goals X, Y, Z" or, worse, "while you're stating goals of X, Y, Z, we believe you have a hidden agenda, and are trying to subvert what we believe to be the principles of our nation"
So yeah, the tea partiers are messing up in their root cause analysis on the financial meltdown. They want less government, because its inherently useless and/or deviously working against them.
And that's a very interesting group for any GOP members to align themselves.
Your ideas intrigue me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.
| 178 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:30:57pm |
re: #171 austin_blue
Dude, just to be clear, if you don't have a license to be a plumber and you make money as being a plumber you are breaking the law. The fact is that that Joe was never was a *legal* plumber in the State. He was no more legitimate than an illegal alien.
dude, Joe was a plumber, just to be clear...and why are you so infatuated with this tidbit?...there are millions of Americans that are plumbers, working for millions of other plumbers that have a license...you are off the deep end with you plumber stuff and your first sentence is just ridiculous...you don't have to have a license to be a plumber, or a carpenter, or a horse trainer or whatever else you want to be
| 179 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:31:00pm |
re: #174 Dark_Falcon
Agreed. I knew what you were trying to say, I just wanted to complete the picture.
Right. Yeah, pacifism was rather popular after WWI. Some of it led to a great deal of complacency with documents such as The Treaty of Versailles. The hope that the German, and other Axis powers would not rebuild their armies -- as well as the Japanese. It led to the stalling of American involvement in WWII. IMO
I met a WWII era pacifist a couple of years ago. They granted him a waiver but part of the agreement was that he would captain civilian troop ships in the Pacific Theater.
| 180 |
Cato the Elder Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:31:21pm |
Ayn Rand and Aleister Crowley: separated at birth?
| 181 |
EastSider Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:31:35pm |
re: #177 jamesfirecat
Your ideas intrigue me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.
Hmm. its pretty late. I can't tell if that was compliment or a sarcastic dig.
| 182 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:31:43pm |
re: #175 jamesfirecat
Its okay its late at night.
Yeah after about midnight my brain tends to fart a lot more.
| 183 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:32:34pm |
re: #181 EastSider
Hmm. its pretty late. I can't tell if that was compliment or a sarcastic dig.
That was a compliment.
| 184 |
sngnsgt Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:32:54pm |
How do all the other Plumbers down at the Plumber's Union Hall feel, huh Joe?
| 185 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:33:17pm |
re: #170 EastSider
It's probably due to a worse, and more childish reason than that, if this bit is accurate.
| 186 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:33:58pm |
re: #179 Gus 802
Right. Yeah, pacifism was rather popular after WWI. Some of it led to a great deal of complacency with documents such as The Treaty of Versailles. The hope that the German, and other Axis powers would not rebuild their armies -- as well as the Japanese. It led to the stalling of American involvement in WWII. IMO
I met a WWII era pacifist a couple of years ago. They granted him a waiver but part of the agreement was that he would captain civilian troop ships in the Pacific Theater.
That's about the size of it. It's good to talk to someone who knows history.
| 187 |
EastSider Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:34:08pm |
re: #183 jamesfirecat
That was a compliment.
Thanks! My family speaks almost entirely in sarcasm, so I tend to see it even where its not intended.
| 188 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:34:17pm |
re: #179 Gus 802
Right. Yeah, pacifism was rather popular after WWI. Some of it led to a great deal of complacency with documents such as The Treaty of Versailles. The hope that the German, and other Axis powers would not rebuild their armies -- as well as the Japanese. It led to the stalling of American involvement in WWII. IMO
I met a WWII era pacifist a couple of years ago. They granted him a waiver but part of the agreement was that he would captain civilian troop ships in the Pacific Theater.
this was the time of FDRs greatness...not the depression, or his earlier mishandling of the economy...his run up to the war and thereafter was brilliant politics and brilliant C in C
| 189 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:36:09pm |
re: #188 albusteve
this was the time of FDRs greatness...not the depression, or his earlier mishandling of the economy...his run up to the war and thereafter was brilliant politics and brilliant C in C
True. He also pushed several key decisions in naval construction that helped build up the US Navy. He was indeed a key factor in our eventual victory.
| 190 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:38:11pm |
I think politicians need to be licensed to practice politicking on the national level...they should be tested and scrutinized for sanity and the ability to do basic arithmetic, spell George Washington with no more than two errors, and be able to recite from memory the first Two Amendments to the Constitution, whatever that is
| 191 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:38:28pm |
re: #188 albusteve
this was the time of FDRs greatness...not the depression, or his earlier mishandling of the economy...his run up to the war and thereafter was brilliant politics and brilliant C in C
Lend-Lease is a good example. It allowed us to supply the Allied powers before becoming fully engaged. Hats off to CoS General George C. Marshall and his recognition of General Dwight D. Eisenhower.
| 192 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:39:17pm |
re: #184 sngnsgt
How do all the other Plumbers down at the Plumber's Union Hall feel, huh Joe?
probably laughing their asses off, while standing around for $32 an hour
| 193 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:41:34pm |
| 194 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:41:58pm |
re: #191 Gus 802
Lend-Lease is a good example. It allowed us to supply the Allied powers before becoming fully engaged. Hats off to CoS General George C. Marshall and his recognition of General Dwight D. Eisenhower.
yes...America at it's finest really...citizens of a free country taking on the professional armies of the aggressors...one hell of a story
| 195 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:42:33pm |
re: #176 Jadespring
Sounds very foul. Ick
Yes, but Manson is an instructive case.
Entered the justice system at 8. In and out of prison until he was 28. Spent something like a total of 4 years in all that time outside of incarceration. (Those 4 years were broken up with being locked up).
At 28, broke down and cried in front of the parole board (or whatever). Begged them not to send him out. Knew he couldn't live on the outside.
This is no kind of apologia for him. He was (and is) a vicious bastard.
And at the time of the trials, this was pre-1977 America. Prior to Lenore Walker publishing The Battered Woman, and people understanding the ways in which abuse breaks down a person. So there was no framework for even beginning to understand why the people who 'followed' him did what he commanded. The media went with HIPPIE DRUG SEX CULT and similar.
The whole racewar ideology was part of the trial, IIRC, but i don't think the media went with that angle.
But it was central to why the crimes were committed, and it does remind me (ideologically) of other stuff. EndTimes hysteria, stockpiling guns, and racism.
| 196 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:42:51pm |
| 197 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:45:18pm |
re: #189 Dark_Falcon
He was a typical, lefty, demoncrap, communist sympathizer. Like all filthy, commie demoncraps, he gave aid and comfort to the enemy, the weak kneed appeasement donk that he is.
If it weren't for his socialist subversion of our great country, we wouldn't have a country full of commies, fascists, teabaggers, and welfare carnies like we do now.
/wait... what?
| 198 |
Claire Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:45:22pm |
re: #136 austin_blue
So, Joe the Plumber said he was a plumber, and he wasn't, so, ipso facto, he's a fraud, right?
Pfft.
Why are you guys so sure (and so fixated on the piddly shit) that he was Breakin' the Law! He was an apprentice to a licensed plumbing company in the county in which he lived. That's all that Ohio requires. (I just googled) His middle name is Joseph. (remembered that from last year) No, it's not impossible to buy a profitable company if one has a business plan and a down payment. (At least that was true when banks were actually lending, pre-2008.)
Yes, a plumber, yes, a Joe, not a liar about wanting to/or being able to own a business.
Steve, actually in NM you have to have a license to do contracting, or any work you do the customer can get all the money back they've paid and keep all the work for free. It's like the strictest state in the nation on that stuff second only to AZ.
And I have one more thing to say: Whomever thinks there is no truth nor point to Atlas Shrugged has never owned their own business, lol.
| 199 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:46:21pm |
re: #196 jamesfirecat
That's on "manly" fish to catch!
1938, when all was calm stateside. I've had shark a few times. Good stuff.
| 200 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:46:59pm |
re: #198 Claire
Why are you guys so sure (and so fixated on the piddly shit) that he was Breakin' the Law! He was an apprentice to a licensed plumbing company in the county in which he lived. That's all that Ohio requires. (I just googled) His middle name is Joseph. (remembered that from last year) No, it's not impossible to buy a profitable company if one has a business plan and a down payment. (At least that was true when banks were actually lending, pre-2008.)
Yes, a plumber, yes, a Joe, not a liar about wanting to/or being able to own a business.
Steve, actually in NM you have to have a license to do contracting, or any work you do the customer can get all the money back they've paid and keep all the work for free. It's like the strictest state in the nation on that stuff second only to AZ.
And I have one more thing to say: Whomever thinks there is no truth nor point to Atlas Shrugged has never owned their own business, lol.
Okay then, you tell us.
What is the point that we should take away from Atlas Shrugged?
| 201 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:48:58pm |
re: #198 Claire
Why are you guys so sure (and so fixated on the piddly shit) that he was Breakin' the Law! He was an apprentice to a licensed plumbing company in the county in which he lived. That's all that Ohio requires. (I just googled) His middle name is Joseph. (remembered that from last year) No, it's not impossible to buy a profitable company if one has a business plan and a down payment. (At least that was true when banks were actually lending, pre-2008.)
Yes, a plumber, yes, a Joe, not a liar about wanting to/or being able to own a business.
Steve, actually in NM you have to have a license to do contracting, or any work you do the customer can get all the money back they've paid and keep all the work for free. It's like the strictest state in the nation on that stuff second only to AZ.
And I have one more thing to say: Whomever thinks there is no truth nor point to Atlas Shrugged has never owned their own business, lol.
I know that...my point is you do not have to have a license to be a plumber...the whole argument otherwise is hilarious
| 202 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:49:23pm |
Crazy wingnut lunatic angers crazy wingnut lunatics. Hatemail ensues....
My final thought on the birther issue
by Erick Erickson
| 203 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:49:56pm |
re: #200 jamesfirecat
Okay then, you tell us.
What is the point that we should take away from Atlas Shrugged?
"Is a man not entitled to the sweat of his brow?"
/still needs to play the first Bioshock. D:
| 204 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:50:39pm |
re: #202 Killgore Trout
Crazy wingnut lunatic angers crazy wingnut lunatics. Hatemail ensues...
My final thought on the birther issueby Erick Erickson
birthers are still an issue?...I'd forgotten all about them!...what now?
| 205 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:51:01pm |
re: #193 Gus 802
He loved fishing. That's on the USS Houston which was eventually sunk during engagement in the Pacific.
The Houston was his favorite cruiser but she was caught by the IJN while attempting to escape the Java Sea to Australia. She and the Aussie cruiser Perth were caught by an IJN task group and sunk by 8-inch shellfire and torpedoes from the Japanese heavy cruisers Mogami and Mikuma. Mikuma however, did not survive 1942 either, being bombed into oblivion after colliding with her sister as they withdrew following the loss of Admiral Nagumo's carriers at Midway.
| 206 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:51:12pm |
re: #202 Killgore Trout
The link just goes to google's search page.
| 207 |
Cato the Elder Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:51:14pm |
re: #198 Claire
Whomever [sic] thinks there is no truth nor [sic] point to Atlas Shrugged has never owned their [sic] own business, lol.
It's not that there's no truth or point to it; it's that to find that truth or point (which could fit on one of Sarah Palin's cute little paws) you have to wade through 1,200 pages of the most excruciatingly horrid prose that ever disgraced paper.
| 208 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:51:19pm |
re: #203 laZardo
"Is a man not entitled to the sweat of his brow?"
/still needs to play the first Bioshock. D:
No says the man in Washington it belong to the government!
No says the man in the Vatican it belongs to G-d!
No says the man in Moscow it belongs to everyone!
(From memory but then I've played the game four times now....)
| 209 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:51:26pm |
re: #195 iceweasel
That's really interesting and I can see the comparison. Forgive me for not discussing it more in depth but I'm tired and not very high functioning right now. I have to stay up and wait for a phone call. I do appreciate reading all of that info though. Thanks.
| 210 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:51:42pm |
re: #201 albusteve
I know that...my point is you do not have to have a license to be a plumber...the whole argument otherwise is hilarious
You can just be a plumber in your heart.
| 211 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:53:46pm |
re: #198 Claire
Why are you guys so sure (and so fixated on the piddly shit) that he was Breakin' the Law! He was an apprentice to a licensed plumbing company in the county in which he lived. That's all that Ohio requires. (I just googled) His middle name is Joseph. (remembered that from last year) No, it's not impossible to buy a profitable company if one has a business plan and a down payment. (At least that was true when banks were actually lending, pre-2008.)
Yes, a plumber, yes, a Joe, not a liar about wanting to/or being able to own a business.
I updinged you for the bit about his name being piddly shit. It is. So is the bit about his license as a plumber. In his state you don't need one to do what he did.
But this guy, who owed taxes btw. ragged on Obama (inaccurately) claiming that taxing people making 250K a year would hurt him. FAIL.
Then McCain/Palin took him up as the 'voice of REEL America". Double FAIL.
And Not-Joe was a dumbass and attention whore who has made a bit of money running for the brass ring, much like the Grifter from Wasilla.
I think we're within rights to mock him, and mock anyone who ever thought he was Reel Amurka.(tm)
| 212 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:54:55pm |
re: #210 SanFranciscoZionist
You can just be a plumber in
your heart.bed.
/thumbs up to Cato's writing.
| 213 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:55:03pm |
re: #207 Cato the Elder
It's not that there's no truth or point to it; it's that to find that truth or point (which could fit on one of Sarah Palin's cute little paws) you have to wade through 1,200 pages of the most excruciatingly horrid prose that ever disgraced paper.
agreed...it's terribly over rated...her point could, and was, made in a simple essay...the story itself is awful imo
| 214 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:55:07pm |
re: #211 iceweasel
I updinged you for the bit about his name being piddly shit. It is. So is the bit about his license as a plumber. In his state you don't need one to do what he did.
But this guy, who owed taxes btw. ragged on Obama (inaccurately) claiming that taxing people making 250K a year would hurt him. FAIL.
Then McCain/Palin took him up as the 'voice of REEL America". Double FAIL.
And Not-Joe was a dumbass and attention whore who has made a bit of money running for the brass ring, much like the Grifter from Wasilla.
I think we're within rights to mock him, and mock anyone who ever thought he was Reel Amurka.(tm)
Yeah that's the other thing, isn't there a difference between you making 250K a year, and owning a company that makes 250 K a year?
| 215 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:55:19pm |
re: #201 albusteve
I know that...my point is you do not have to have a license to be a plumber...the whole argument otherwise is hilarious
Depends on the municipality. Some require that you be a licensed plumbing contractor. For example from the City of Aurora, CO:
Proof of state license required. Every applicant for a plumbing contractor license shall be required to present with the application a valid and current master's license issued by the state held by the supervisor named on the application form.
You can work unlicensed but you would be working under the guidance or management of a licensed plumbing contractor.
| 216 |
Claire Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:55:30pm |
re: #200 jamesfirecat
Okay then, you tell us.
What is the point that we should take away from Atlas Shrugged?
Oh, young one, you have so much to learn.
Main point: Why should anybody take a risk if there's no reward?
| 218 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:57:32pm |
re: #210 SanFranciscoZionist
You can just be a plumber in your heart.
I can pipe up your whole house, then do fixtures and trim (I won't do groundwork)....am I a plumber or a jet pilot in my heart?...mince that
| 220 |
Racer X Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:58:56pm |
I could care less about Joe.
I'm more concerned about what's happening in the white house and congress. I'm more concerned about our budget deficit, and our debt. In another year Joe will not even be an asterisk in the history books.
| 221 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:59:28pm |
re: #215 Gus 802
You can work unlicensed but you would be working under the guidance or management of a licensed plumbing contractor.
for gods sake...okay...like I don't know this stuff
| 222 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:59:33pm |
re: #216 Claire
Oh, young one, you have so much to learn.
Main point: Why should anybody take a risk if there's no reward?
And it took her 1200 pages to say that?
So much for brevity being the soul of wit.
Besides I feel my point being that Atlas Shrugged has no bearing on the recent economic problems still stands. Do you dispute it?
| 223 |
Cato the Elder Sun, Feb 14, 2010 10:59:54pm |
re: #216 Claire
Oh, young one, you have so much to learn.
Main point: Why should anybody take a risk if there's no reward?
Thanks. Now I don't have to reread the book.
The problem with our system now is that those who take big enough risks - especially with other people's money - get rewarded no matter how the gamble turns out. Viz. every golden-parachuted putz on Wall Street.
I wonder how Ayn would feel about that.
| 224 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:00:30pm |
| 225 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:00:34pm |
re: #211 iceweasel
I updinged you for the bit about his name being piddly shit. It is. So is the bit about his license as a plumber. In his state you don't need one to do what he did.
But this guy, who owed taxes btw. ragged on Obama (inaccurately) claiming that taxing people making 250K a year would hurt him. FAIL.
Then McCain/Palin took him up as the 'voice of REEL America". Double FAIL.
And Not-Joe was a dumbass and attention whore who has made a bit of money running for the brass ring, much like the Grifter from Wasilla.
I think we're within rights to mock him, and mock anyone who ever thought he was Reel Amurka.(tm)
I'm just baffled that he's still out there. Even at the time, he didn't make much sense to me. "There's this guy--and he's a plumber--this PROVES the rightness of our cause!"
And I'm thinking "Huh? Plumber?"
| 227 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:02:04pm |
re: #223 Cato the Elder
Thanks. Now I don't have to reread the book.
The problem with our system now is that those who take big enough risks - especially with other people's money - get rewarded no matter how the gamble turns out. Viz. every golden-parachuted putz on Wall Street.
I wonder how Ayn would feel about that.
Isn't a lot of Atlas Shrugged Rand hammering away on those people who manipulate the government to let make it take actions which keep their otherwise unprofitable companies afloat?
| 228 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:02:19pm |
re: #220 Racer X
I could care less about Joe.
I'm more concerned about what's happening in the white house and congress. I'm more concerned about our budget deficit, and our debt. In another year Joe will not even be an asterisk in the history books.
Quite Concur.
| 230 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:02:33pm |
re: #225 SanFranciscoZionist
I'm just baffled that he's still out there. Even at the time, he didn't make much sense to me. "There's this guy--and he's a plumber--this PROVES the rightness of our cause!"
And I'm thinking "Huh? Plumber?"
community organizer?...wtf?...bwahaha!
| 233 |
Cato the Elder Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:03:23pm |
I'm almost nostalgic for the days when I would get 46 downdings for ripping on Joe or Sarah. Man, but that headwind was bracing!
| 234 |
Racer X Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:03:29pm |
| 235 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:03:51pm |
re: #230 albusteve
community organizer?...wtf?...bwahaha!
In other words, the whole thing was just a culture war schtick with no actual point other than to rev up the faithful? Thanks, I got that part.
| 236 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:04:10pm |
re: #216 Claire
Oh, young one, you have so much to learn.
Main point: Why should anybody take a risk if there's no reward?
OK. If this is how we're playing...
Define 'risk'.
Define 'reward'.
Hint: lots of people, and they aren't all conservatives or Ayn Rand fans, find reward in places other than money. Some even find it in doing work that brings them joy-- the work itself is an intrinsic joy.
I'm kind of happy at the moment, so I promise to be gentle in dismantling your definitions.
| 238 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:04:35pm |
re: #233 Cato the Elder
I'm almost nostalgic for the days when I would get 46 downdings for ripping on Joe or Sarah. Man, but that headwind was bracing!
your the point man...find us another target
| 239 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:05:18pm |
| 240 |
Racer X Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:05:35pm |
re: #238 albusteve
your the point man...find us another target
well, everyone on the right is now irrelevant.
*looks left*
| 241 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:06:08pm |
re: #235 SanFranciscoZionist
In other words, the whole thing was just a culture war schtick with no actual point other than to rev up the faithful? Thanks, I got that part.
what the hell do you think American politics is all about?...hello?, this is J the P callin....how you doin today?
| 242 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:06:25pm |
re: #204 albusteve
birthers are still an issue?.
Only to the Republicans and Tea Parties. They're starting to realize what LGF has know for a long time. The problem is that they are trying to get rid of the Truthers and Birthers but keeping the NWO, Death panels, and cloward piven conspiracies. They are more intersted in avoiding bad publicity than getting rid of nuts. If they were to get rid of the nuts there'd be no Tea Party left. Tough dilemma.
| 243 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:06:26pm |
re: #233 Cato the Elder
I'm almost nostalgic for the days when I would get 46 downdings for ripping on Joe or Sarah. Man, but that headwind was bracing!
You held firm to your convictions Cato, and you brought me and several others around to seeing things your way. I'd say that counts as a victory.
| 244 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:06:39pm |
| 245 |
Cato the Elder Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:06:50pm |
re: #238 albusteve
your the point man...find us another target
Well, since you ask, I think we could use some fresh anti-Iran threads.
| 246 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:06:50pm |
| 247 |
laZardo Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:07:53pm |
re: #240 Racer X
well, everyone on the right is now irrelevant.
*looks left*
You talkin' to me?
/de niro
| 248 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:08:00pm |
re: #245 Cato the Elder
Well, since you ask, I think we could use some fresh anti-Iran threads.
But we're all (or at least I know I am) aware of how crazy pants their leaders are.
Anybody got some good dirt on Venezuela recently?
| 249 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:09:14pm |
re: #227 jamesfirecat
Isn't a lot of Atlas Shrugged Rand hammering away on those people who manipulate the government to let make it take actions which keep their otherwise unprofitable companies afloat?
I've often argued that regulation creates revenue: when a municipality makes requirements or standards. For example, landscape requirements feeds the landscape business in both design, installation, and maintenance. If there were no standards the developer would cover the land in river rock and be done with it. Without those rules developers would essentially do as they please.
Thus if an automobile company weren't given the task of following regulations or hiring qualified personnel they might not be required to hire an engineer such as Dagny Taggart. If Taggart were a structural engineer and lived in a state that doesn't require structural engineers letting the developers do as they please (i.e. going Galt so to speak) then Dagny Taggart wouldn't have had a job in the first place and ended up having to be a bus boy at Joe's Diner.
| 250 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:09:24pm |
re: #242 Killgore Trout
Only to the Republicans and Tea Parties. They're starting to realize what LGF has know for a long time. The problem is that they are trying to get rid of the Truthers and Birthers but keeping the NWO, Death panels, and cloward piven conspiracies. They are more intersted in avoiding bad publicity than getting rid of nuts. If they were to get rid of the nuts there'd be no Tea Party left. Tough dilemma.
Yes. Look at Erick Erickson at RedState now announcing that Nirthers aren't welcome.
lol.
He's in a bad place, actually. I would care if he weren't such a shithead.
| 251 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:10:12pm |
re: #242 Killgore Trout
Only to the Republicans and Tea Parties. They're starting to realize what LGF has know for a long time. The problem is that they are trying to get rid of the Truthers and Birthers but keeping the NWO, Death panels, and cloward piven conspiracies. They are more intersted in avoiding bad publicity than getting rid of nuts. If they were to get rid of the nuts there'd be no Tea Party left. Tough dilemma.
like picking grubs out of a barrel of flour...good luck with that...we'll see how it turns in the next cycle...that's about all I can contribute, nobody knows the power or influence, or the damage wrought...but I'm not going anywhere
| 252 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:10:41pm |
re: #249 Gus 802
I've often argued that regulation creates revenue: when a municipality makes requirements or standards. For example, landscape requirements feeds the landscape business in both design, installation, and maintenance. If there were no standards the developer would cover the land in river rock and be done with it. Without those rules developers would essentially do as they please.
Thus if an automobile company weren't given the task of following regulations or hiring qualified personnel they might not be required to hire an engineer such as Dagny Taggart. If Taggart were a structural engineer and lived in a state that doesn't require structural engineers letting the developers do as they please (i.e. going Galt so to speak) then Dagny Taggart wouldn't have had a job in the first place and ended up having to be a bus boy at Joe's Diner.
Such good points... wish I wasn't so brain dead, must fave for later....
| 253 |
albusteve Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:11:06pm |
re: #245 Cato the Elder
Well, since you ask, I think we could use some fresh anti-Iran threads.
oh baby...where's my nail file?
| 254 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:12:22pm |
re: #249 Gus 802
Upding for many reasons, but the image of Dagby Teabagger bussing tables put it way over the top!
./damn you, dinger! Whyfor kant I double ding!!?!
| 255 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:12:47pm |
re: #252 jamesfirecat
Such good points... wish I wasn't so brain dead, must fave for later...
Thanks.
Yeah, Dagny Taggart, bus boy. Think of all the employment and enterprise that grew out of the regulation that followed "Unsafe at Any Speed." Before that they were building cast iron chassis cars with sheet metal, bench seats, and steering wheels that acted as garrotes in an accident.
| 256 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:15:32pm |
re: #249 Gus 802
I've often argued that regulation creates revenue: when a municipality makes requirements or standards. For example, landscape requirements feeds the landscape business in both design, installation, and maintenance. If there were no standards the developer would cover the land in river rock and be done with it. Without those rules developers would essentially do as they please.
Thus if an automobile company weren't given the task of following regulations or hiring qualified personnel they might not be required to hire an engineer such as Dagny Taggart. If Taggart were a structural engineer and lived in a state that doesn't require structural engineers letting the developers do as they please (i.e. going Galt so to speak) then Dagny Taggart wouldn't have had a job in the first place and ended up having to be a bus boy at Joe's Diner.
That's true, though only up to a point. If regulation becomes too burdensome, then the building never gets built because it costs more than those who want it can pay. One my beefs with the left is that they do not understand this fact.
| 257 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:16:44pm |
re: #254 iceweasel
Upding for many reasons, but the image of Dagby Teabagger bussing tables put it way over the top!
./damn you, dinger! Whyfor kant I double ding!!?!
That's what he would be doing in Ron Paul world. You wouldn't need an engineer to begin with. It would be regulatory anarchy. Every car would be different, every intersection, airport, etc. Pilots would fly into different airports across the country that were designed by somebody's brother or sister. Green lights would mean something different at the next airport.
| 258 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:17:46pm |
re: #249 Gus 802
I've often argued that regulation creates revenue: when a municipality makes requirements or standards. For example, landscape requirements feeds the landscape business in both design, installation, and maintenance. If there were no standards the developer would cover the land in river rock and be done with it. Without those rules developers would essentially do as they please.
Thus if an automobile company weren't given the task of following regulations or hiring qualified personnel they might not be required to hire an engineer such as Dagny Taggart. If Taggart were a structural engineer and lived in a state that doesn't require structural engineers letting the developers do as they please (i.e. going Galt so to speak) then Dagny Taggart wouldn't have had a job in the first place and ended up having to be a bus boy at Joe's Diner.
I've owned a few businesses in my time. The one which I sold after a year and half, paid off the start up debt and was left with a very healthy return on my money was based directly on supplying some equipment that was mandated by safety regulations. So I can see your point, no regulations would more then likely mean no market for that particular equipment.
| 259 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:18:42pm |
re: #256 Dark_Falcon
That's true, though only up to a point. If regulation becomes too burdensome, then the building never gets built because it costs more than those who want it can pay. One my beefs with the left is that they do not understand this fact.
Hey now, that seems like a bit of a broad brush you're painting with....
But whatever it's too late at night for me to get seriously angry, I'm for bed as much fun as Rand bashing is....
| 260 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:18:54pm |
re: #256 Dark_Falcon
That's true, though only up to a point. If regulation becomes too burdensome, then the building never gets built because it costs more than those who want it can pay. One my beefs with the left is that they do not understand this fact.
My experience with regards to building has been that it doesn't change much with regards to left or right wing. Overall though it does get a little easier in more right leaning municipalities. There's a balance.
| 261 |
waveriderca Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:19:34pm |
And we're supposed to believe the McCain campaign did something coherently and with a plan? Hrmm....
| 262 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:21:48pm |
It would be a LOT of fun for us to have a running convo in a spinoff link about Atlas Shrugged and Rand. Whole lot of goodies.
Side note: Rand's attitudes toward women are damn fun. Reminder: Dagny TeaBegger and Dominique Francon (ha!) only have the money to sneer at the system because they got it from Daddy or Granddaddy.
| 263 |
Racer X Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:23:37pm |
re: #256 Dark_Falcon
That's true, though only up to a point. If regulation becomes too burdensome, then the building never gets built because it costs more than those who want it can pay. One my beefs with the left is that they do not understand this fact.
I really appreciate the building regulations here in CA.
Earthquakes and all.
I've seen the collapsed buildings in other countries due to relatively small earthquakes. Look at Japan - they regularly get them over 6.0 yet have no where near the damage seen elsewhere.
Regulations can be lifesavers.
| 264 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:23:51pm |
re: #258 Jadespring
I've owned a few businesses in my time. The one which I sold after a year and half, paid off the start up debt and was left with a very healthy return on my money was based directly on supplying some equipment that was mandated by safety regulations. So I can see your point, no regulations would more then likely mean no market for that particular equipment.
Exactly. It can either be goods or services. Regulations creates markets and consistency in both design and profits.
I know things get rather difficult when we're talking refineries and such that get to the point of regulation to the point of complete negation.
| 265 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:24:32pm |
re: #263 Racer X
I really appreciate the building regulations here in CA.
Earthquakes and all.
I've seen the collapsed buildings in other countries due to relatively small earthquakes. Look at Japan - they regularly get them over 6.0 yet have no where near the damage seen elsewhere.
Regulations can be lifesavers.
Haiti was fucked in part because of the total lack of building regs.
| 266 |
Racer X Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:24:45pm |
Sonofabitch!
I just made a coherent argument for larger government.
Stinky please delete that - stat!
| 267 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:25:45pm |
re: #263 Racer X
I really appreciate the building regulations here in CA.
Earthquakes and all.
I've seen the collapsed buildings in other countries due to relatively small earthquakes. Look at Japan - they regularly get them over 6.0 yet have no where near the damage seen elsewhere.
Regulations can be lifesavers.
I agree, that's why I qualified my statement. Building codes requiring safe construction are a good thing in my eyes.
| 268 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:25:59pm |
re: #262 iceweasel
It would be a LOT of fun for us to have a running convo in a spinoff link about Atlas Shrugged and Rand. Whole lot of goodies.
Side note: Rand's attitudes toward women are damn fun. Reminder: Dagny TeaBegger and Dominique Francon (ha!) only have the money to sneer at the system because they got it from Daddy or Granddaddy.
That's true. Most people can't afford "to go John Galt." I know I can't. Bad enough I used to think about "tuning in, turning on, and dropping out." That only leads to a rather large mess.
| 269 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:29:08pm |
re: #268 Gus 802
That's true. Most people can't afford "to go John Galt." I know I can't. Bad enough I used to think about "tuning in, turning on, and dropping out." That only leads to a rather large mess.
Yes.
There's some hilarious shit out there about people threatening to go Galt post Nov 2008. I need to find it.
Most fabulous one was from a dentist who announced that he (she?) would be golfing 5 afternoons a week rather than 2. LOL. Maybe it was Orly Taitz.
| 270 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:30:11pm |
There once was a man from Ohio,
Who claimed he was used by a 'RINO',
He uttered a jeer,
while wiping a tear,
"If it wasn't for him, I'd be fine-o"
/I suck a limericks
| 271 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:31:07pm |
re: #266 Racer X
Sonofabitch!
I just made a coherent argument for larger government.
Stinky please delete that - stat!
Nah. I don't see that as an argument for larger government just smart government.
| 272 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:31:43pm |
re: #269 iceweasel
Yes.
There's some hilarious shit out there about people threatening to go Galt post Nov 2008. I need to find it.
Most fabulous one was from a dentist who announced that he (she?) would be golfing 5 afternoons a week rather than 2. LOL. Maybe it was Orly Taitz.
Really? And these folks are the same one that talk about elitism? It's one thing to golf because one enjoys it or has the time and money. I think announcing that one will increase their golfing habits as a political statement sound a bit like elitism. Especially in the case of a dentist in light of Comfort Dental™.
| 273 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:32:30pm |
re: #266 Racer X
Ur jist a gawt-damned librul commy.
| 275 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:33:42pm |
| 276 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:34:15pm |
re: #267 Dark_Falcon
I agree, that's why I qualified my statement. Building codes requiring safe construction are a good thing in my eyes.
Many food safety regulations are good things in my eyes too.
Not all though. I have a big peeve against the regs against selling eggs at markets. :)
| 277 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:34:43pm |
re: #272 Gus 802
Really? And these folks are the same one that talk about elitism? It's one thing to golf because one enjoys it or has the time and money. I think announcing that one will increase their golfing habits as a political statement sound a bit like elitism. Especially in the case of a dentist in light of Comfort Dental™.
Yes.
The whole discussion was on some wingnut blog and everyone was insisting they make WAY over 250K a year, and to spite Obama (??) they would only bring in 200K a year or less. Several other fantasies about 'living off the grid" and "going Galt" as well.
Massive hilarity ensued. I only know about it because several lefty blogs picked it up and mocked them.
| 279 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:40:35pm |
re: #277 iceweasel
Yes.
The whole discussion was on some wingnut blog and everyone was insisting they make WAY over 250K a year, and to spite Obama (??) they would only bring in 200K a year or less. Several other fantasies about 'living off the grid" and "going Galt" as well.Massive hilarity ensued. I only know about it because several lefty blogs picked it up and mocked them.
Wow. A blog full of neurosurgeons. How does one go from making 250K plus a year to "going off the grid?" If they were a dentist that might mean you would be turning away new patients. Thus, they would be changing their business plan and in the long run that would change things so drastically that they may end up making well less than 200K per year because of the negative impact.
Average dentist salary doesn't even break 200K with 20 years of business. Nah, something doesn't smell right.
| 280 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:41:57pm |
re: #276 Jadespring
Many food safety regulations are good things in my eyes too.
Not all though. I have a big peeve against the regs against selling eggs at markets. :)
The UK has some regulations on selling eggs that I have a problem with.
I always thought of eggs as cheap food-- scrambled eggs, egg salad, eggs as a binding ingredient when you bread, quiche, whatever.
I'm used to buying a dozen eggs for a dollar or so (yes, factory hens, I know, etc)
I can't buy a dozen eggs in scotland for under say 2.50 GBP. That's almost 4 dollars USD.
I haven't looked into this, but I think what Jimmah said was that they've jacked up the price on even factory farmed eggs to force people to buy the non-battery hens ones.
It's very weird.
| 281 |
pharmmajor Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:48:33pm |
What? An average American being exploited by a politician in order to gain support from the voters?
*big sarcastic* Nooooooooooooo!
| 282 |
Racer X Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:48:52pm |
| 283 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:50:03pm |
re: #280 iceweasel
The UK has some regulations on selling eggs that I have a problem with.
I always thought of eggs as cheap food-- scrambled eggs, egg salad, eggs as a binding ingredient when you bread, quiche, whatever.
I'm used to buying a dozen eggs for a dollar or so (yes, factory hens, I know, etc)I can't buy a dozen eggs in scotland for under say 2.50 GBP. That's almost 4 dollars USD.
I haven't looked into this, but I think what Jimmah said was that they've jacked up the price on even factory farmed eggs to force people to buy the non-battery hens ones.
It's very weird.
Why buy eggs if they're 4 dollars for a dozen. I pay about 1.25 for a dozen grade A. I won't spend more than that even if they "forced" me to. For some strange reason if I make some eggs I'm hungry again in one hour.
Some people have the luxury of being able to spend 10 dollars on a dozen egg and loaf of bread that they get at Le Whole Earth Food Salon. I don't. I can get a lot more mileage by getting standard food at Safeway. Plus, I don't have to get "dressed up" to go food shopping at Le Whole Earth Food Salon.
I think the ethical comfort people get from shopping in those places is outweighed by the clothing they wear to go on a poser food shopping errand that's made in 3rd world sweat shops.
| 284 |
Gus Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:53:22pm |
"OK, let's get some food."
"You're not going to wear that shirt are you?"
"Sure I will. What's wrong with this shirt?"
Last time I was in a place like that the parking lot was full of Jaguars and Range Rovers. You can fit my carbon footprint on the thumbs of these people.
| 285 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:53:38pm |
re: #280 iceweasel
The UK has some regulations on selling eggs that I have a problem with.
I always thought of eggs as cheap food-- scrambled eggs, egg salad, eggs as a binding ingredient when you bread, quiche, whatever.
I'm used to buying a dozen eggs for a dollar or so (yes, factory hens, I know, etc)I can't buy a dozen eggs in scotland for under say 2.50 GBP. That's almost 4 dollars USD.
I haven't looked into this, but I think what Jimmah said was that they've jacked up the price on even factory farmed eggs to force people to buy the non-battery hens ones.
It's very weird.
That does sound weird. The reg I have a problem with here is that you can sell eggs and whatever else your farm produces at your farm. (Farm-gate) with pretty much no interference. You can then go to a farmers market and sell your produce but not eggs. They say it's a health and safety thing but it really makes no sense because there is no difference in quality or health of the eggs whether they're sitting in a cooler at the farm or a stall 10k down the road. Expect that they've traveled. The real reason has to do with egg quotas and the egg boards.
Anyways this particular reg will likely be change at least in some jurisdictions because people are working on it. The drive is coming more from consumers though deifinately supported by small scale farmers of course.
| 286 |
Claire Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:56:43pm |
re: #236 iceweasel
OK. If this is how we're playing...
Define 'risk'.
Define 'reward'.Hint: lots of people, and they aren't all conservatives or Ayn Rand fans, find reward in places other than money. Some even find it in doing work that brings them joy-- the work itself is an intrinsic joy.
I'm kind of happy at the moment, so I promise to be gentle in dismantling your definitions.
Yes, but everybody needs to eat- even the entrepenuer who just put up his life savings (out of the goodness of his heart) to provide you with a playground. You turn out to be a crappy employee who surfs the net all day insteading of producing work , and suddenly your intrinsic right to come to the office and find inner joy is a bit crimped when the lights are shut off and the IRS seizes the owners assets for payroll back taxes.
| 287 |
BARACK THE VOTE Sun, Feb 14, 2010 11:59:22pm |
re: #283 Gus 802
Why buy eggs if they're 4 dollars for a dozen. I pay about 1.25 for a dozen grade A. I won't spend more than that even if they "forced" me to. For some strange reason if I make some eggs I'm hungry again in one hour.
Some people have the luxury of being able to spend 10 dollars on a dozen egg and loaf of bread that they get at Le Whole Earth Food Salon. I don't. I can get a lot more mileage by getting standard food at Safeway. Plus, I don't have to get "dressed up" to go food shopping at Le Whole Earth Food Salon.
I think the ethical comfort people get from shopping in those places is outweighed by the clothing they wear to go on a poser food shopping errand that's made in 3rd world sweat shops.
I'm with you on this, but Americans use eggs in everything. It's a major issue for me. At 4 dollars a dozen, or thereabouts, suddenly eggs are a luxury food.
Cakes need eggs. Lots of things do. And Americans use eggs as a binding ingredient in, well, lots of stuff.
I always thought of eggs as a cheap food (in the US, they are). Suddenly it isn't.
I'm not some Whole Foods shopper even if I could afford it. The attitude pisses me off.
And i do think that battery farming is horrific. Even so-- when even battery farmed eggs are like 4 dollars for 12, that isn't helping poor people on a budget get nutrition.
| 288 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:01:24am |
re: #286 Claire
Yes, but everybody needs to eat- even the entrepenuer who just put up his life savings (out of the goodness of his heart) to provide you with a playground. You turn out to be a crappy employee who surfs the net all day insteading of producing work , and suddenly your intrinsic right to come to the office and find inner joy is a bit crimped when the lights are shut off and the IRS seizes the owners assets for payroll back taxes.
Well if you're an entrepreneur that allows or is clueless enough to have crappy employee like that to run your business that far into the ground then you might want to try another line of work.
| 289 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:01:50am |
re: #284 Gus 802
Heh, I've gone to places like you describe wearing my metal t-shirts and average jeans. Dirty tennis shoes as well. The looks I got from some people... I bet I could make them pee themselves with a simple head-fake.
:sigh: It's food, not fashion. Sustenance, not high society. Why the pretense?
| 290 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:02:21am |
re: #284 Gus 802
"OK, let's get some food."
"You're not going to wear that shirt are you?"
"Sure I will. What's wrong with this shirt?"
Last time I was in a place like that the parking lot was full of Jaguars and Range Rovers. You can fit my carbon footprint on the thumbs of these people.
ha!
I'm not talking about highend Whole Foods kind of places in the UK, btw. You literally cannot buy a dozen eggs in the grungiest market for under 2.50 GBP.
| 291 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:03:03am |
re: #290 iceweasel
ha!
I'm not talking about highend Whole Foods kind of places in the UK, btw. You literally cannot buy a dozen eggs in the grungiest market for under 2.50 GBP.
Correction: I'm talking about Scotland.
| 292 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:06:06am |
re: #291 iceweasel
Correction: I'm talking about Scotland.
Now I'm interested in finding out exactly why that is the case there.
| 293 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:08:08am |
Some people have an unusual fixation with the supposed infallible superiority of "Ayn Randian" philosophy. I call those people Ron Paul Libertarians.
| 294 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:10:33am |
re: #292 Jadespring
Now I'm interested in finding out exactly why that is the case there.
I havent bought eggs in London for a while. Jimmah tells me that the prices on eggs were raised, to encourage people to buy the non-battery hens ones. If I'm remembering him right, that would apply to all of the UK.
Basically, you know how in the US we have the 99 cent for a dozen or (tops) 1.30 for a dozen?-- they're all jacked up now to be priced the same as the 'organic' (non factory farmed).
| 295 |
Gus Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:10:37am |
re: #287 iceweasel
I'm with you on this, but Americans use eggs in everything. It's a major issue for me. At 4 dollars a dozen, or thereabouts, suddenly eggs are a luxury food.
Cakes need eggs. Lots of things do. And Americans use eggs as a binding ingredient in, well, lots of stuff.I always thought of eggs as a cheap food (in the US, they are). Suddenly it isn't.
I'm not some Whole Foods shopper even if I could afford it. The attitude pisses me off.
And i do think that battery farming is horrific. Even so-- when even battery farmed eggs are like 4 dollars for 12, that isn't helping poor people on a budget get nutrition.
I can't help but think of chickens now. The life of a chicken in human terms is horrific regardless. That is being a chicken in the wilds is wrought with dangers from predators, disease, and climate. I'm pretty sure the average life of a factory farm chicken is far more comfortable than a wild chicken in Honduras. Plus, if I'm going to start worrying about chickens I might as well start worrying about bacteria and other life forms including pests and bugs since for the most part all of those lower forms of life are equal.
None of this will help the poor. Their elitist argument will be that it will help the poor lower their obesity numbers by limiting the amount they can spend in this example, on eggs. The wealthy will still be able to get the dozen eggs for four dollars a dozen and have champagne with their breakfast while toasting themselves towards their accomplishment of finding justice through their free range chicken eggs.
Even if that might not really be the case. They'll still feel good about it and Tweet Ashton Kutcher while they're at it while listening to the latest Bono song right before finishing breakfast and shopping for another BMW M5.
| 296 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:10:41am |
re: #289 Slumbering Behemoth
Heh, I've gone to places like you describe wearing my metal t-shirts and average jeans. Dirty tennis shoes as well. The looks I got from some people... I bet I could make them pee themselves with a simple head-fake.
:sigh: It's food, not fashion. Sustenance, not high society. Why the pretense?
Because for some people where your shop and what you look like is a major importance in their lives. Status baby.
I know people who brag about the gourmet cheese they eat. I like cheese. I really like gourmet and artisan cheese. Yet my value as a person is not defined by friggin cheese.
| 297 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:13:08am |
re: #296 Jadespring
Yet my value as a person is not defined by friggin cheese.
Mine is, you insensitive bastard!
:runs away crying:
| 298 |
Claire Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:16:42am |
Seriously, you dress up to go to Whole Foods? Oh my.
| 299 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:17:51am |
re: #295 Gus 802
e. I'm pretty sure the average life of a factory farm chicken is far more comfortable than a wild chicken in Honduras.
Not so. Chicken do lead really terrible lives in the US (and UK) under factory farming. I can give you a book on this, but in truth-- you don't want to know.
If you knew, you would stop eating them or eggs. I did. For two years. I only started eating them (and meat) again because I got sick. B-18 deficiency. Very difficult to eat enough cruciform
vegtables (broccoli, cauliflower) to overcome that deficiency.
And I'm lazy, and poor. That trumped my moral convictions.
But let's talk about someone making you dress up to go shopping. WTF?
| 300 |
Gus Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:18:43am |
re: #296 Jadespring
Because for some people where your shop and what you look like is a major importance in their lives. Status baby.
I know people who brag about the gourmet cheese they eat. I like cheese. I really like gourmet and artisan cheese. Yet my value as a person is not defined by friggin cheese.
Value by consumption is static. People like that will say "look at me I eat the finest cheese in the world" yet they remain constant in their materialism. They're no different than anyone else: they're just another consumer sector. I used to run into that with cycling. People become the product they purchase. Their whole lives are either defined by their consumptive habits and purchases.
| 301 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:18:51am |
re: #295 Gus 802
I can't help but think of chickens now. The life of a chicken in human terms is horrific regardless. That is being a chicken in the wilds is wrought with dangers from predators, disease, and climate. I'm pretty sure the average life of a factory farm chicken is far more comfortable than a wild chicken in Honduras. Plus, if I'm going to start worrying about chickens I might as well start worrying about bacteria and other life forms including pests and bugs since for the most part all of those lower forms of life are equal.
None of this will help the poor. Their elitist argument will be that it will help the poor lower their obesity numbers by limiting the amount they can spend in this example, on eggs. The wealthy will still be able to get the dozen eggs for four dollars a dozen and have champagne with their breakfast while toasting themselves towards their accomplishment of finding justice through their free range chicken eggs.
Even if that might not really be the case. They'll still feel good about it and Tweet Ashton Kutcher while they're at it while listening to the latest Bono song right before finishing breakfast and shopping for another BMW M5.
I've never heard that argument used regarding free-range eggs and the poor though it wouldn't surprise me if some people use it.
There is however arguments to be made around nutrition and quality. Free-range and I mean real free range and not the fake around ones are better nutritionally. They also taste better and tend to better in cooking and making things. Especially in baking.
| 303 |
Claire Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:22:49am |
re: #302 Slumbering Behemoth
You or Gus or somebody up there.
| 304 |
Gus Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:22:54am |
re: #299 iceweasel
Not so. Chicken do lead really terrible lives in the US (and UK) under factory farming. I can give you a book on this, but in truth-- you don't want to know.
If you knew, you would stop eating them or eggs. I did. For two years. I only started eating them (and meat) again because I got sick. B-18 deficiency. Very difficult to eat enough cruciform
vegtables (broccoli, cauliflower) to overcome that deficiency.
And I'm lazy, and poor. That trumped my moral convictions.But let's talk about someone making you dress up to go shopping. WTF?
I used to live in New Jersey. My former sister in law was always worried about what we were wearing so I sort of picked off on that. I'm basically a middle class guy. That being the case it's not hard to ignore the fact that places like Whole Foods is chock full of upper middle class, well dressed, posers.
| 306 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:23:24am |
re: #299 iceweasel
Not so. Chicken do lead really terrible lives in the US (and UK) under factory farming. I can give you a book on this, but in truth-- you don't want to know.
If you knew, you would stop eating them or eggs. I did. For two years. I only started eating them (and meat) again because I got sick. B-18 deficiency. Very difficult to eat enough cruciform
vegtables (broccoli, cauliflower) to overcome that deficiency.
And I'm lazy, and poor. That trumped my moral convictions.
I solved that problem by getting my own chickens. Unfortunately not everyone is in a position to do that.
| 307 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:26:34am |
re: #303 Claire
You or Gus or somebody up there.
Pick your target and freeze it, baby. I don't recall ever "dressing up" to go to any grocery store. I do recall, however, going to the local grocery in my boxers to beat the 2AM last call in my area. Brings new meaning to the term "hangin' out".
| 308 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:26:58am |
re: #304 Gus 802
I used to live in New Jersey. My former sister in law was always worried about what we were wearing so I sort of picked off on that. I'm basically a middle class guy. That being the case it's not hard to ignore the fact that places like Whole Foods is chock full of upper middle class, well dressed, posers.
Makes me sick.
I'm taking Jimmah to a Whole Foods in manhattan once he's here. Just so he understands it a little, lol.
I'm a middle class warrior, babe! Sort of...a warrior on the middle class, and my membership in the middle class has always been a bit outsider-ish. I top from below.
| 309 |
SixDegrees Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:29:43am |
re: #283 Gus 802
Why buy eggs if they're 4 dollars for a dozen. I pay about 1.25 for a dozen grade A. I won't spend more than that even if they "forced" me to. For some strange reason if I make some eggs I'm hungry again in one hour.
Some people have the luxury of being able to spend 10 dollars on a dozen egg and loaf of bread that they get at Le Whole Earth Food Salon. I don't. I can get a lot more mileage by getting standard food at Safeway. Plus, I don't have to get "dressed up" to go food shopping at Le Whole Earth Food Salon.
I think the ethical comfort people get from shopping in those places is outweighed by the clothing they wear to go on a poser food shopping errand that's made in 3rd world sweat shops.
Whole Foods, by the way, is a complete and utter sham from top to bottom. See "The Omnivore's Dilemma" for more on their shrieking hypocrisy. The food you buy there is absolutely no different than the food you buy at any national grocery chain - except for the exorbitantly high price. The produce goes through just as much processing and uses the same low-paid labor, and the animals who contribute their meat to the butcher counter live the same drab, wretched lives in undersize pens, cages and feedlots as their counterparts destined for Kroger.
And yes, it's a fashion show. Around here, the two locations I'm familiar with are dead center in the toniest suburbs in southeastern Michigan. They have NO stores in Detroit, or in any of the communities that directly ring the city, nor do they expose themselves to the liked of Ypsilanti or other decidedly blue-collar areas.
Not to mention that their CEO is certifiably insane. But that's a different story.
| 310 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:30:40am |
re: #300 Gus 802
Value by consumption is static. People like that will say "look at me I eat the finest cheese in the world" yet they remain constant in their materialism. They're no different than anyone else: they're just another consumer sector. I used to run into that with cycling. People become the product they purchase. Their whole lives are either defined by their consumptive habits and purchases.
I had once had a roomate like that. I drove her crazy because all she wanted to talk about was her things and how great they were. How great it was going to be when she graduated and could get this car or this or that. I really didn't care one way or another. It was my indifference that drove her to actually get angry sometimes.
| 311 |
Gus Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:30:54am |
re: #308 iceweasel
Makes me sick.
I'm taking Jimmah to a Whole Foods in manhattan once he's here. Just so he understands it a little, lol.
I'm a middle class warrior, babe! Sort of...a warrior on the middle class, and my membership in the middle class has always been a bit outsider-ish. I top from below.
I can't do it. I walk into those stores and I feel like I walked into a country club. They have loaves of bread for 7 dollars.
| 313 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:32:06am |
re: #311 Gus 802
I can't do it. I walk into those stores and I feel like I walked into a country club. They have loaves of bread for 7 dollars.
Makes me want to break things. Pink Floyd moment.
| 314 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:32:25am |
re: #309 SixDegrees
I'm blessed. I have an excellent butcher in my area that I frequently patronize. You can't beat their meat.
| 315 |
Gus Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:36:45am |
re: #309 SixDegrees
Whole Foods, by the way, is a complete and utter sham from top to bottom. See "The Omnivore's Dilemma" for more on their shrieking hypocrisy. The food you buy there is absolutely no different than the food you buy at any national grocery chain - except for the exorbitantly high price. The produce goes through just as much processing and uses the same low-paid labor, and the animals who contribute their meat to the butcher counter live the same drab, wretched lives in undersize pens, cages and feedlots as their counterparts destined for Kroger.
And yes, it's a fashion show. Around here, the two locations I'm familiar with are dead center in the toniest suburbs in southeastern Michigan. They have NO stores in Detroit, or in any of the communities that directly ring the city, nor do they expose themselves to the liked of Ypsilanti or other decidedly blue-collar areas.
Not to mention that their CEO is certifiably insane. But that's a different story.
The majority of "free range chickens" sold aren't even free range. There's no real certification process. When you deal with produce they might claim they're not using chemicals but they're still exterminating vermin. That means your typical organic produce came with a 22 rifle that was used to take out rabbits and other varmints. That's something you won't see on the label.
| 316 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:37:21am |
re: #312 claire
Eeeww. Were you barefoot, too?
No. You know the saying, "No Shoes, No Shirt, No Service". They just don't have any rules about giant plaid undies.
And there is no "eeeww" about it, baby. I am dead sexy. Well, more so back then, anyway.
| 318 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:43:25am |
| 319 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:48:20am |
re: #315 Gus 802
The majority of "free range chickens" sold aren't even free range. There's no real certification process. When you deal with produce they might claim they're not using chemicals but they're still exterminating vermin. That means your typical organic produce came with a 22 rifle that was used to take out rabbits and other varmints. That's something you won't see on the label.
Yep. I call them fake around free range. It's not so much that there isn't certification or some sort of labeling standard it's the what does exist allows for the illusion of freerange to occur. So for instance you can keep the chickens in a big chicken house and if they're not in cages and you have an open door that goes out onto a bit of grass then abracadabra it's 'free range'. Doesn't matter if the chickens don't actually go outside and peck around the grass.
That's not to say that every brand is like that but for the most part the bigger brands and ones sold in bigger chain stores are suspect like that.
It's basically been coopted. You can even tell by looking at the actual eggs themselves. Though that's even turning into a problem now because companies are starting to feed the chickens things like flax to get a more yellow yolk color. That's why a lot of smaller companies and smaller farmers who do have chickens that free range are moving away from that label.
| 320 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:50:04am |
Oh good grief. It's almost 4 am.
How did that happen?
| 321 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:52:29am |
re: #320 Jadespring
Oh good grief. It's almost 4 am.
How did that happen?
LGF!
BTW, agree with your comments about 'free range'.
I have to say that even the cheapest eggs I bought in Scotland are gorgeous when you break them. Beautiful.
| 322 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:55:30am |
re: #320 Jadespring
Oh good grief. It's almost 4 am.
How did that happen?
My clock shows that's it's almost 1 am. Must be a time warp, or maybe your watch needs new batteries.
| 323 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:56:30am |
re: #321 iceweasel
LGF!
BTW, agree with your comments about 'free range'.
I have to say that even the cheapest eggs I bought in Scotland are gorgeous when you break them. Beautiful.
I really want to get back to Scotland some day. I loved visiting there. It is one of my favorites places.
| 324 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:57:06am |
re: #321 iceweasel
LGF!
BTW, agree with your comments about 'free range'.
I have to say that even the cheapest eggs I bought in Scotland are gorgeous when you break them. Beautiful.
I have the same skepticism about almost anything called "organic", "certified organic", or "sustainable".
"Sustainability" is the new "synergy". Meaningless, but it makes you feel good.
| 325 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:58:13am |
re: #322 Slumbering Behemoth
My clock shows that's it's almost 1 am. Must be a time warp, or maybe your watch needs new batteries.
Ha ha. Cute
| 326 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Feb 15, 2010 1:03:15am |
I am going to the doctor today to check my sustainablity. I'm already free-range and organic. Too bad I'm also carbon-based...
| 327 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 15, 2010 1:03:31am |
re: #324 Cato the Elder
I have the same skepticism about almost anything called "organic", "certified organic", or "sustainable".
"Sustainability" is the new "synergy". Meaningless, but it makes you feel good.
Nah it's not meaningless. It does mean something in various contexts. It just loses it's meaning when it becomes a marketing buzz word and the consumer is left to try to figure out what context it's being used in or whether it's just a BS selling point for a particular product. That happens to a lot of words and concepts when they enter 'marketing world'
| 328 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Mon, Feb 15, 2010 1:04:18am |
"Stupid babies! Learn to carry your own weight, you lazy bastards. Society owes you nothing!"
| 329 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 15, 2010 1:11:16am |
Night all. The sun will be up in a couple of hours and I don't want to be awake to see it.
Take care.
| 330 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Feb 15, 2010 1:13:33am |
re: #323 Jadespring
I really want to get back to Scotland some day. I loved visiting there. It is one of my favorites places.
I still haven't seen much of it, at all.
One local where we (Jimmah and I) live advised me 'Yoo hae nah seen the reel Scotland yet!" and roundly abused Jimmah in a friendly way for haven't taken his lassie there.
Double entendres no doubt doubly intended./
| 331 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Mon, Feb 15, 2010 1:28:42am |
re: #330 iceweasel
I am more of a single entendre sort of guy.
| 332 |
DodgerFan1988 Mon, Feb 15, 2010 3:15:26am |
“I happened to be the face of middle Americans"
What an egomaniac.
| 333 |
huggy77 Mon, Feb 15, 2010 5:08:20am |
re: #233 Cato the Elder
now i get your down dings for making references to Obama as a socialist darth vader type while driving around in my Camaro spewing pollution into the air...
| 334 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 15, 2010 5:38:07am |
re: #332 DodgerFan1988
“I happened to be the face of middle Americans"
What an egomaniac.
There is a strong anti-intellectual streak in the American consciousness, part of it grew out of a combination of an inferiority complex regarding Europe and part of it out of distrust for those incredible educated, cultivated Europeans who seemed to be in moral and social decline.
We like our heroes homespun, but that sort of thnking, although it makes good soundbytes, does not have the traction to solve the problems we are facing.
| 335 |
Nervous Norvous Mon, Feb 15, 2010 6:36:55am |
re: #330 iceweasel
I went into a bar and ordered a double entendre and the waitress gave me one.
| 336 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 15, 2010 6:41:26am |
re: #262 iceweasel
It would be a LOT of fun for us to have a running convo in a spinoff link about Atlas Shrugged and Rand. Whole lot of goodies.
Side note: Rand's attitudes toward women are damn fun. Reminder: Dagny TeaBegger and Dominique Francon (ha!) only have the money to sneer at the system because they got it from Daddy or Granddaddy.
I'm holding my breath that one day someone reasonably important will once more threaten to "Go Galt" and then Charles will have a thread about it....
| 337 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 15, 2010 7:42:02am |
re: #335 PT Barnum
I went into a bar and ordered a double entendre and the waitress gave me one.
Did you order that double entendre with a twist of fate?
| 338 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 15, 2010 9:52:02am |
Wurzelbacher, welcome to fifteen minutes of fame. You willingly allowed yourself to be used and last I saw you had a book deal, CD deal, and got treated as a credible figure. You should be kissing McCain's ass because if it weren't for him you'd still be just another person like the rest of us. Don't know what this guy's deal is. He was willing a pawn and enjoyed every second of it. Now he finds that his fame is running out and he's bitter.
| 339 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 15, 2010 10:30:03am |
re: #279 Gus 802
Wow. A blog full of neurosurgeons. How does one go from making 250K plus a year to "going off the grid?" If they were a dentist that might mean you would be turning away new patients. Thus, they would be changing their business plan and in the long run that would change things so drastically that they may end up making well less than 200K per year because of the negative impact.
Average dentist salary doesn't even break 200K with 20 years of business. Nah, something doesn't smell right.
It was this thing, for a while. 'The taxes will be so high, it'll be cheaper not to work. Hahahaha!'
| 340 |
Diane Mon, Feb 15, 2010 10:42:02am |
Joe could adjust his taps if he feels the water too hot.
The beauty of responsibility is that we can keep on screwing up, using or being used as we please.
| 341 |
solomonpanting Mon, Feb 15, 2010 10:46:25am |
re: #73 jamesfirecat
re: #67 Slumbering Behemoth
He hit Obama with a pretty good "gotcha" question, that's about it. His only claim to fame, really.
A "gotcha" question that wasn't anywhere near being true, since there's no way a man who was making 40K a year (I saw that number somewhere) could buy a 250K business...
I believe you missed the "gotcha" part by, oh, three or four light years. Obama's response of "I want to spread the wealth around" was the revealing part and exposed his true feelings. For that alone I give this nobody, used, lowlife-ignorant-yokel unlicensed plumber credit for being able to trick extract one of Obama's goals.
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joetheplumber Mon, Feb 15, 2010 12:56:39pm |
For that alone I give this nobody, used, lowlife-ignorant-yokel unlicensed plumber credit for being able totrickextract one of Obama's goals.
Hey, who you calling a lowlife!?
Once Praised, the Settlement to Help Sickened BP Oil Spill Workers Leaves Most With Nearly Nothing When a deadly explosion destroyed BP’s Deepwater Horizon drilling rig in the Gulf of Mexico, 134 million gallons of crude erupted into the sea over the next three months — and tens of thousands of ordinary people were hired ...
Cheechako
Alone in a Bathroom: The Fear and Uncertainty of a Post-Roe Medication Abortion Angel tucked two white pills into each side of her mouth, bracing herself as they began to dissolve. Her deepest fears and anxieties took over. Angel had wanted to talk to a doctor before she took the pills to ... Cheechako
They Were Desperate to Get Pregnant. Then IVF Gave Them Extra Embryos. One morning last spring, Ashley Harrolle put her 1-year-old daughter down for a nap and went to the kitchen. She pulled up her fertility clinic’s contact information. It was time to make the call. In a freezer several hundred ... CheechakoJoe Bacon ✅
March FavoritesYou've seen these all already but looking back, just because. These are my favorite shots of this last month. That 1937 Zeiss Sonnar is such a gloriously wonderful bit of glass. Thanks for looking.
William Lewis
Russia’s New Combat Robots Blown Up by Drones Near Avdiivka When we landed on the moon, I thought about how science fiction had become real. Now, the robot wars have begun. It's more poignant somehow on the ground than in the missile wars we have in the air as ...
Rightwingconspirator
Why Did More Than 1,000 People Die After Police Subdued Them With Force That Isn’t Meant to Kill? An investigation led by The Associated Press has found that, over a decade, more than 1,000 people died after police subdued them through physical holds, stun guns, body blows and other force not intended to be lethal. More: Why ... CheechakoKGxvi
The Pandemic Cost 7 Million Lives, but Talks to Prevent a Repeat Stall In late 2021, as the world reeled from the arrival of the highly contagious omicron variant of the coronavirus, representatives of almost 200 countries met - some online, some in-person in Geneva - hoping to forestall a future worldwide ... Cheechako
Texas County at Center of Border Fight Is Overwhelmed by Migrant Deaths EAGLE PASS, Tex. - The undertaker lighted a cigarette and held it between his latex-gloved fingers as he stood over the bloated body bag lying in the bed of his battered pickup truck. The woman had been fished out ... Cheechako
