The Pentagon Shooter’s Extreme Right-Libertarian Beliefs

US News • Views: 12,471

I posted a link to the audio of Pentagon shooter John Patrick Bedell’s “manifesto” last night, but here’s a summary of what’s on that audio recording: Pentagon Shooter Worshipped Private Property Rights, Denounced Government ‘Schemes’ Like Public Education.

The California man who opened fire last night outside the Pentagon was a property rights extremist who railed against the government’s ability to “confiscate the resources of their citizens to fund schemes that need only be justified by lies and deception,” and wanted to “eliminate the role of the government in education.”

In a recorded manifesto called “Directions To Freedom”, the audio of which he posted online in 2006, John Patrick Bedell, of Hollister, California, praised private property as “the most successful basis for structuring society that humanity has ever known.”

Bedell shot two police officers last night during the rampage, before being mortally wounded himself.

“Communist and socialist governments that abolished or disregarded private property,” said Bedell in the recording, “created poverty, repression and murder on a truly enormous scale.” But, he continued, “Even in the United States, however, there has been a continual erosion of protection of private property justified by the belief that government is an efficient instrument for the positive direction of society.”

Bedell added: “Governments lack the profit and loss incentives that individuals and private organizations must use…”

And he warned: “When governments are able to confiscate the resources of their citizens to fund schemes that need only be justified by lies and deception enormous disasters can result.”

Bedell also denounced the monetary system, a frequent bete noir of anti-government extremists. “When the government can control how private property is used,” he said, “and especially when the government controls the monetary system that is use to exchange private property, the government has the mechanisms and the motivation to control individuals to the smallest detail.”

Bedell even railed against the concept of public education. “Government control of the schools that shape minds is pervasive in today’s world,” he said. “The imperative to defend the freedom of conscience must lead us to eliminate the role of the government in education and leave parents and communities free to raise their children as they see fit.” He denounced public education as “no more legitimate than a government-run church for universal religious training.”

If you gave a speech at a tea party rally consisting of nothing but the quotes from Bedell you see above, you’d get a standing ovation.

These statements show an extreme right wing libertarian, the kind of person who posts comments at the Campaign for Liberty website. Hatred for George W. Bush is widespread among this group, so the fact that he was anti-Bush definitely does not put him in the “left wing” camp — as many wingnut bloggers seem desperate to do.

Also very prevalent among the far right Ron Paul contingent — 9/11 Trutherism and support for conspiracy theories of all kinds. So this does not put him in the left column either.

How about the fact that Bedell was angry about anti-marijuana laws? Well, guess who else wants to legalize pot? Yep. Ron Paul.

And let’s deal with one more excuse that’s circulating among those who are desperate to assign Bedell to the “left wing” — that he was registered as a Democrat in California.

Here are some facts. In order to vote in primary elections in California, you are required to do one of two things: declare a party affiliation, or declare yourself “unaffiliated.” If you declare as unaffiliated, when you go to vote you’ll receive a ballot consisting of only unaffiliated candidates, unless you specifically request that you be allowed to vote for a particular party.

Bedell, by the way, had not voted in the past five years. And given his extreme right wing variant of Bush Derangement Syndrome, it makes perfect sense that he would register as a Democrat. He certainly wasn’t going to vote for Bush.

To sum up, Bedell’s party registration tells you absolutely nothing about where he lies on the political spectrum. His actual words, however, paint a very clear picture of an anti-government right wing extremist of the Ron Paulian persuasion.

UPDATE at 3/7/10 8:53:43 pm:

Hi, Tim! Thanks for the traffic. I’m touched to find out that you still read LGF; sorry I can’t return the favor.

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674 comments
1 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:26:25pm

I'm a homeschooler, and even I wouldn't want the state to stop providing education. Literacy is a good thing, most of the time.

(Sometimes it isused to post incoherent rants online, in which case it is pointless.)

2 jamesfirecat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:26:30pm

Well said Charles, the guy who flew a plane into an IRS building was all over the map crazy pants, this guy seems to have hitched a ride on the express train to Right Wingistan however.

Do you think that eventually he became nuts enough that he didn't like the idea of having a federal army either, hence his attack on the Pentagon? Or maybe I shouldn't spend/waste my time trying to figure out why crazy people do crazy things...

3 Jaerik  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:27:40pm

Charles: Are you sure that's the case? I'm in California and I distinctly remember casting a primary vote for Obama over Hillary. And before 2008, I had never registered for, or voted for, anyone with a (D) by their name in my life.

However, when I walked into the polling place, they noted I was registered independent and asked me which primary ballot I wanted to vote for. I had to say "Democrat."

It's possible I'm not remember correctly, but that would surprise me.

4 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:28:26pm

re: #2 jamesfirecat

I am not convinced his beliefs led him to the violence. I think it is as likely his depression led him to strange beliefs, and the capacity for violence.

The beliefs or the depression... How can we tell which?

5 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:28:53pm

re: #3 Jaerik

Charles: Are you sure that's the case?

Here are the rules:

[Link: www.sos.ca.gov...]

6 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:29:16pm

re: #3 Jaerik

California primary law changed as a result of a lawsuit, so your recollection may be accurate for its time but dated.

7 Jaerik  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:30:33pm

re: #6 Rightwingconspirator

California primary law changed as a result of a lawsuit, so your recollection may be accurate for its time but dated.

That would make sense then. Thanks. =)

8 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:30:47pm

I bet, Charles, that if you just called him "Paulian", you'd get less resistance. Not that you should.

A lot of people, I think, are just having difficulty accepting that the right-wing has opened up and accepted the crazy to the extent that it has. CPAC should show everyone that, but it's natural to resist the idea.

It's not these crazy people that matter so much as the environment that makes their views-- not their actions-- shocking not so far out of the mainstream.

9 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:33:53pm

re: #3 Jaerik

Perhaps the little old ladies working your polling station thought that someone could change their party affiliation on the day of the vote?

Anyway, as I've now stated numerous times, I'm still an (R) on the San Diego county rolls. When I registered as an (R) I did so that I could vote in a particular governors primary. While it is true that for several years many of my votes when to GOP candidates, I never voted the party line and today, though I am still officially counted as as (R), I doubt the GOP will get many more votes from me.

Unless you care about voting in the primaries, here in California there isn't much value in checking the party affiliation box. It isn't worth my time to go down and re-register just to check the Unaffiliated box.

That Malkin and HotAir only want to talk about the box Bedell checked when registered only shows the fear they have of actually publishing what Bedell wrote.

10 jamesfirecat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:34:42pm

re: #4 Rightwingconspirator

I am not convinced his beliefs led him to the violence. I think it is as likely his depression led him to strange beliefs, and the capacity for violence.

The beliefs or the depression... How can we tell which?

Sorry I haven't been keeping as close track on this story as I should have. Do we know for a fact that he was clinically depressed?

(Asking question seriously)

11 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:35:47pm

re: #9 freetoken

That Malkin and HotAir only want to talk about the box Bedell checked when registered only shows the fear they have of actually publishing what Bedell wrote.

It's a pathetic dodge, and it's not the first time they've tried to use it, either.

12 _RememberTonyC  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:37:05pm

ron paul's followers are a special brand of scary.

13 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:38:54pm

re: #11 Charles

Intellectual integrity, and basic truthful reporting, just doesn't have a home in that crowd. It's not what they are about.

14 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:39:27pm

re: #8 Obdicut

From what I have read, the depression launched a bunch of similarly foolish groups. That's your environment-Millions of desperate people out of work or underemployed and out of their houses. I do not think the fringe would be getting this traction if the economy was good. Of course it is a right wing fringe, we have a left wing man in the white house and a vast left wing majority in the houses.

Counter-cyclical, as nearly always.

15 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:40:19pm

re: #10 jamesfirecat

I'll go get some links, I am looking to test for the real motivator to his violence.
BRB

16 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:41:22pm

re: #14 Rightwingconspirator

Yes, but the fringe is being endorsed by the 'mainstream' of the opposition party. That is the problem, in my eyes. Buckley felt it was very, very adamant that the Birchers needed to be kept out. Now they're back.

17 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:41:43pm

re: #12 _RememberTonyC

ron paul's followers are a special brand of scary.

Quite Concur.

18 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:42:53pm

re: #10 jamesfirecat

HOLLISTER, Calif. (AP) -- The man who opened fire in front of the Pentagon had a history of mental illness and had become so erratic that his parents reached out to local authorities weeks ago with a warning that he was unstable and might have a gun, authorities said Friday....

19 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:43:27pm

re: #16 Obdicut

Buckley was right, with or without the Pentagon shooter.

20 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:44:53pm

If you gave a speech at a tea party rally consisting of nothing but the quotes from Bedell you see above, it would be a guaranteed standing ovation.

21 RogueOne  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:45:26pm

How are we supposed to take his writing seriously when he's been institutionalized 4 times? Are we supposed to ignore all the crazy crap and just focus on the portions of his life when he seemed lucid? I said this at 5:00am this morning, it's a mistake to try to classify crazy.

[Link: www.npr.org...]

22 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:46:35pm

re: #21 RogueOne

How are we supposed to take his writing seriously when he's been institutionalized 4 times? Are we supposed to ignore all the crazy crap and just focus on the portions of his life when he seemed lucid? I said this at 5:00am this morning, it's a mistake to try to classify crazy.

[Link: www.npr.org...]

Interesting, isn't it, that you can't easily distinguish between tea party ideology and the ravings of a mentally ill person?

23 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:46:46pm

re: #16 Obdicut

Sure they will attempt (surprisingly successfully, in the short term) to leverage the fringe, as it is a mine-able resource in every political sense. Just as every right leaning win becomes a point for the Tea Party to rally upon.

24 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:47:17pm

re: #9 freetoken

Perhaps the little old ladies working your polling station thought that someone could change their party affiliation on the day of the vote?

I have yet to encounter a little old lady (or gentleman) working a polling place who didn't know all the rules backward and forward. Sometimes the teenage kids who volunteer are clueless, but the old people study up.

25 wrenchwench  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:47:24pm

re: #16 Obdicut

Yes, but the fringe is being endorsed by the 'mainstream' of the opposition party. That is the problem, in my eyes. Buckley felt it was very, very adamant that the Birchers needed to be kept out. Now they're back.

The Breitbart-hosted story I read on it said, "Pillorying him as a typical Tea Partier simply demonstrates the lengths the media will go to destroy the mainstream conservative movement in this country." Which I read to mean the Tea Party is the mainstream now.

26 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:47:39pm

re: #22 Charles

I would usually dismiss all the rantings of a person in need of that much mental help.

27 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:48:40pm

re: #18 Rightwingconspirator

It is not surprising that Bedell would be diagnosed with mental illness.

But that raises a very serious subject.

Many of the Libertarian Fundamentalists exhibit, in their writings, anti-social sentiments. Bedell was a person who happened to act on his anti-social sentiments. Not all Libertarian Fundamentalists will do what Bedell did.

Yet I find it disturbing that the anti-social ravings of the Libertarian Fundamentalists, a group which cross pollinates freely with the Paleocons (e.g., Lew Rockwell), finds such a home in American political thought, among groups which like to self-label themselves as "conservative" or "right".

28 grim traveler  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:49:03pm

Wasn't he a pothead too? All wee-wee'd up about anti-pot laws? How does that fit to the profile?

29 ArchangelMichael  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:49:13pm

re: #8 Obdicut

I bet, Charles, that if you just called him "Paulian", you'd get less resistance. Not that you should.

A lot of people, I think, are just having difficulty accepting that the right-wing has opened up and accepted the crazy to the extent that it has. CPAC should show everyone that, but it's natural to resist the idea.

It's not these crazy people that matter so much as the environment that makes their views-- not their actions-- shocking not so far out of the mainstream.

People are too hung up on the labels "right" and "left" which are inadequate to accurately describe the political spectrum in any non-superficial way. Nobody wants to be pigeonholed into a category with kooks so they either deny that said kook belongs in their category, or they deny said person is a kook in the first place.

This is the same reason why many who self-identify as "right-wing" desperately try to claim that Hitler and the Nazis were "left-wing". Because a few aspects of their economic system were leftist, is enough for them to again deny the kooks belong in their category.

30 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:49:26pm

re: #23 Rightwingconspirator

They have dug tooo greedily and too deep. You know what they awoke in the darkness of Luap Nor.

31 Spockista  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:49:32pm

This was years coming down the road.

I, along with others, have been watching sites like stormfront and VNN as well as keeping track of the Jar Jar Jared Taylor crowd and the Council of Conservative Citizens.

We broke the Marcus Epstein story.

The acceptance of the extreme side of conservatism by the mainstream was intro'd by the Ron Paul movement and fertilized by the tea party movement.

There has always been a bad edge at CPAC.

Last year it was that "Youth for Western Civilization" group and the sneaking in of Geert Wilders by Pam Geller to speak at an unannounced location at CPAC.

But, this year, the open arms to the John Birch Society was over the top.

32 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:49:51pm

re: #21 RogueOne

4 times? Good grief, this is more a case of mental health medical malpractice or negligence than politics. The politics are more flute than drum here.

33 solomonpanting  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:49:57pm

re: #12 _RememberTonyC

ron paul's followers are a special brand of scary.

Yep. And this guy's actions will put a severe crimp into Paul's ability to win any Presidential primaries.
/

34 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:50:16pm

Politics & party affiliation are not really an issue here. A lot of people are really angry and my concern is that that anger is not being realized let alone dealt with.

35 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:50:34pm

Of course he was mentally ill. But that is the WHOLE POINT. The rise of this kind of dangerous rhetoric and extremism on the right wing is feeding the fantasies of people like Bedell, and inciting them to violence.

It doesn't excuse the right wing to say the guy was crazy. Sure, he was crazy. But the craziness was fed by the extremism that is everywhere in the modern right wing.

Encouraging and allowing this craziness has consequences -- one of them is named John Patrick Bedell.

36 RogueOne  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:50:51pm

re: #28 grim traveler

Wasn't he a pothead too? All wee-wee'd up about anti-pot laws? How does that fit to the profile?

He had been arrested for cultivating. Sadly it adds another example to the study released a couple weeks ago that said long term use leads to mental disorders.

37 ShaunP  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:51:05pm

re: #34 brookly red

Politics & party affiliation are not really an issue here. A lot of people are really angry and my concern is that that anger is not being realized let alone dealt with.

A lot of people are also being stirred to anger by lies and distortions...

38 Bagua  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:51:07pm

Bagua's On-topic Music Break™

Crazy Baldhead


- Bob Marley
39 TampaKnight  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:52:07pm

Where does the "right wing" begin and end then? I'd consider myself on the right side of most issues, but sure don't share the extremist views of any of these people.

40 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:52:20pm

re: #29 ArchangelMichael

I agree that 'left' and 'right' aren't that meaningful, but unfortunately you can replace 'right-wing' with 'GOP' in what I posted above.

As Charles said, what this guy believed would get a standing ovation at Tea Party events, or from the Birchers.

41 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:52:22pm

re: #28 grim traveler

Wasn't he a pothead too? All wee-wee'd up about anti-pot laws? How does that fit to the profile?

It totally fits the profile. Ron Paul is in favor of legalizing marijuana.

42 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:53:20pm

I guess my question about the topic of this thread is: so? As I said downstairs, I think all attempts to hammer Bedell into some particular ideological hole are odious. If anything is apparent from his various Internet writings, it is that he was severely mentally ill.

I'll ask, again, to anyone attempting to put a lock on Bedell's beliefs, whether they're trying to pin him to the right or to the left or to any other axis: Are you trying to say that Bedell is a product of this ideology? Or that he is representative of this ideology? Or are you trying to say something else altogether? And if the last, what?

Note that I raised similar concerns over attempts to plaster the Left with Cindy Sheehan's obvious mental illness. People in such straits use whatever crutch or shield comes to hand when combating their ailments. Trying to draw some wispy connection between the crutch and the patient isn't useful; it's illusory, at best, and just plain wrong.

43 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:53:25pm

re: #9 freetoken

Anyway, as I've now stated numerous times, I'm still an (R) on the San Diego county rolls. When I registered as an (R) I did so that I could vote in a particular governors primary. While it is true that for several years many of my votes when to GOP candidates, I never voted the party line and today, though I am still officially counted as as (R), I doubt the GOP will get many more votes from me.

//says the guy with the avatar of a smiling Barack enveloped by rays of verdant happiness

(i kiiid...i kiiid)

44 RogueOne  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:53:41pm

re: #32 Rightwingconspirator

4 times? Good grief, this is more a case of mental health medical malpractice or negligence than politics. The politics are more flute than drum here.

My cousin has been institutionalized in Detroit multiple times. He was diagnosed with schizophrenia as a late teen and he's now in his mid 40's. There isn't much anyone can do about him unless you're willing to lock up crazy people indefinitely. Until recently he had never been arrested for anything violent so they'd take him off the street for acting crazy, put him somewhere and make him take his meds, and then put him on probation and make him show up somewhere everyday and take his meds in front of someone. Works fine until he decides not to show up for a few days.

45 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:54:04pm

re: #37 ShaunP

A lot of people are also being stirred to anger by lies and distortions...

That may be true, in fact I am sure that it is. But if you want to claim it only goes one way we don't have much to talk about.

46 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:54:17pm

re: #42 SixDegrees

I kind of wonder whether you actually read the last thread, since your questions were addressed therein by multiple people.

47 RadicalModerate  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:54:27pm

Well, if there was any doubt, it's now official.

Victoria Jackson has lost her fucking mind.

Victoria Jackon's Hot New Single: "There's A Communist Living in the White House!!"

The doofuses over at WND have a glowing writeup of her over there, unfortunately no cache yet, so no linky.

48 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:54:29pm

re: #34 brookly red

Politics & party affiliation are not really an issue here. A lot of people are really angry and my concern is that that anger is not being realized let alone dealt with.

Really? I thought the real issue might be mentally unstable people should not have access to guns.

49 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:54:35pm

re: #39 TampaKnight

Where does the "right wing" begin and end then? I'd consider myself on the right side of most issues, but sure don't share the extremist views of any of these people.

That's tough to say. I too hold that private property rights are sacred. However, unlike Bedell I don't see them as unlimited nor do I see the federal government as malevolent. Wrong, often but evil never.

50 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:54:57pm

re: #34 brookly red

Politics & party affiliation are not really an issue here. A lot of people are really angry and my concern is that that anger is not being realized let alone dealt with.

How do you deal with people's anger? What creates anger with the system? Either something happens to you personally that pisses you off, or you read a bunch of one sided stuff that makes you angry. What do you do about that?

51 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:55:12pm

Nobody that crazy should be out of treatment, not buying guns. Mental illness like this makes it illegal to possess let alone go out and buy a gun. Keep people this sick in treatment and you can forget all about their source of alleged inspiration. A person that sick could latch onto anything and make it their motivation to suicide or kill. I still suspect suicide by cop.

52 ArchangelMichael  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:55:23pm

re: #40 Obdicut

I agree that 'left' and 'right' aren't that meaningful, but unfortunately you can replace 'right-wing' with 'GOP' in what I posted above.

As Charles said, what this guy believed would get a standing ovation at Tea Party events, or from the Birchers.

Yeah but all the right/GOP echo chamber blogs are desperately trying to paint this guy as a lefty for exactly the reasons I stated. They love to pretend that 9/11 Trooferism came from the left and they will use that to paint any Paulian Tea Partier that becomes inconvenient as a lefty.

53 TampaKnight  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:55:57pm

re: #49 Dark_Falcon

That's tough to say. I too hold that private property rights are sacred. However, unlike Bedell I don't see them as unlimited nor do I see the federal government as malevolent. Wrong, often but evil never.

Exactly. Private property rights are a cornerstone of our republic and there has absolutely been overstepping by the government in this realm of "liberty". But I also never had the urge to arm myself and shoot innocent people that have NOTHING to do with that.

54 Jadespring  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:56:26pm

re: #28 grim traveler

Wasn't he a pothead too? All wee-wee'd up about anti-pot laws? How does that fit to the profile?


The article I just read said his doctor knew he was using pot to self medicate. Self medication with people with metal illness whether forms of depression or other disorders is very common. Alcohol is actually the most common substance used but you'll find all sort of other substances like over the counter meds to things like pot and other illegal drugs. If he personally found some sort of solace in pot (from his perspective) then it's not surprising in the leastr that he'd be pro-pot and rail against pot laws.

55 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:56:30pm

There's very little out there which clearly defines what is truly left or right, since the terms are usually used while pointing fingers and as such, can have just about any thoughts or action ascribed to them.

I asked a teacher friend what she thought; she launched.
From her, I learned how just about any despotic behavior is right wing, but she's Yellow Dog. She told me that Stalin and Mao were right wing so she obviously didn't have the first clue. A true product of our educational system...

I took one of those multi- axis political tests online one time to see where I fit and was in between the Dalai Lama and Mahatma Gandhi.

56 RogueOne  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:56:34pm

re: #51 Rightwingconspirator

Nobody that crazy should be out of treatment, not buying guns. Mental illness like this makes it illegal to possess let alone go out and buy a gun. Keep people this sick in treatment and you can forget all about their source of alleged inspiration. A person that sick could latch onto anything and make it their motivation to suicide or kill. I still suspect suicide by cop.

Well, he was also mad because the Pentagon refused to fund the smart weapons program he was developing.

57 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:57:18pm

re: #44 RogueOne
Society must keep people that are a danger to themselves and other in treatment. Not dungeons like the dark past had, but modern safe facilities for the mentally ill. We have to leave it to the professionals to decide who gets to leave. Much street crime can be tied to a lack of treatment or meds.

58 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:57:26pm

re: #53 TampaKnight

Exactly. Private property rights are a cornerstone of our republic and there has absolutely been overstepping by the government in this realm of "liberty". But I also never had the urge to arm myself and shoot innocent people that have NOTHING to do with that.

Ahh... but would you shoot those guilty of this transgression you claim?

59 jamesfirecat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:57:38pm

re: #28 grim traveler

Wasn't he a pothead too? All wee-wee'd up about anti-pot laws? How does that fit to the profile?

Thank you for saying that those of us who want to lift the ban on a substance less dangerous than many substances that are already legal are crazy kooks!

60 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:58:00pm

re: #48 Jeff In Ohio

Absolutely! Not guns, not any weapons.

61 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:58:06pm

re: #19 Rightwingconspirator

Buckley was right, with or without the Pentagon shooter.

Buckley in his own words...

How can the John Birch Society be an effective political instrument while it is led by a man whose views on current affairs are, at so many critical points . . . so far removed from common sense? That dilemma weighs on conservatives across America. . . . The underlying problem is whether conservatives can continue to acquiesce quietly in a rendition of the causes of the decline of the Republic and the entire Western world which is false, and, besides that, crucially different in practical emphasis from their own.

because i can't say it better

62 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:58:21pm

re: #52 ArchangelMichael

They love to pretend that 9/11 Trooferism came from the left and they will use that to paint any Paulian Tea Partier that becomes inconvenient as a lefty.

Agreed. I'm just saying that Charles's point that this guy's manifesto would get an ovation-- which I firmly believe it would-- at CPAC or any Tea Party conference is the really important part.

That and that Michelle Bachmann, Beck, and the others who are purposefully spreading fear and paranoia about the government obviously should not be surprised if mentally unbalanced people really like where they're coming from. We had a poster in the other thread who said that this guy was striking aback against 'injustice'.

Speech and words have power. They should be free, but being free does not mean they have no power, and it does not mean they cannot do a great deal of harm.

63 Slap  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:59:09pm

re: #47 RadicalModerate

She flew over the cuckoo's nest a LONG time back....She's a BIG breitbart supporter. (Absence of caps intentional). Her pieces at BG are -- well, let's just say, apparently, not all of her cups are present in her cabinet.

Sonically speaking, I've never been able to stand her. But the voice isn't her fault -- I hope....

64 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 2:59:39pm

re: #56 RogueOne

I am kind of pissed at them too. But do not hold your breath waiting for me to show up over there with a gun or even a pen.

65 ShaunP  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:00:07pm

re: #45 brookly red

That may be true, in fact I am sure that it is. But if you want to claim it only goes one way we don't have much to talk about.

Lies and distortions come from both sides of the aisle. You will never hear me say otherwise. I'm also not trying to place blame on the entire right wing. I just think that the legitimate politicians that are lending credibility to this movement need to take a close look at what they are promoting...

66 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:00:31pm

re: #39 TampaKnight

Where does the "right wing" begin and end then? I'd consider myself on the right side of most issues, but sure don't share the extremist views of any of these people.

It ends with our repeated, collective, and public repudiation of nonsense.

dang...i said 'collective'...

67 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:01:14pm

re: #66 Aceofwhat?

It ends with our repeated, collective, and public repudiation of nonsense.

dang...i said 'collective'...

Welcome to the left bank, comrade.

68 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:01:29pm

re: #61 Aceofwhat?

Agreed in full, with all possible emphasis.

69 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:02:17pm

re: #42 SixDegrees

I guess my question about the topic of this thread is: so? As I said downstairs, I think all attempts to hammer Bedell into some particular ideological hole are odious. If anything is apparent from his various Internet writings, it is that he was severely mentally ill.

NO, he fits a very well defined ideology. His politics and economics are very clear and his affiliation with the Mises Institute is undeniable. Would you say the same thing about Mohamed Atta or another Jihadi? Why shouldn't we examine his political opinions to learn where these people are coming from? This guy wasn't a Charlie Manson or Ted Bundy type psychotic. He was certainly a lunatic but he also had a very clear political ideology.

70 RogueOne  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:02:36pm

re: #64 Rightwingconspirator

I am kind of pissed at them too. But do not hold your breath waiting for me to show up over there with a gun or even a pen.

You working on a DNA nano-tech project in your basement? For gods sake don't tell anyone!//

71 Spare O'Lake  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:02:48pm

re: #11 Charles

It's a pathetic dodge, and it's not the first time they've tried to use it, either.

I think you've got it nicely nailed down, Charles.

72 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:03:26pm

re: #49 Dark_Falcon

That's tough to say. I too hold that private property rights are sacred. However, unlike Bedell I don't see them as unlimited nor do I see the federal government as malevolent. Wrong, often but evil never.

note that you have not postulated pot as a means of currency via digital electronic interface, replete with diagram...

73 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:03:46pm

re: #59 jamesfirecat

Thank you for saying that those of us who want to lift the ban on a substance less dangerous than many substances that are already legal are crazy kooks!

Might we have a trend here?

74 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:04:24pm

re: #50 Stanley Sea

How do you deal with people's anger? What creates anger with the system? Either something happens to you personally that pisses you off, or you read a bunch of one sided stuff that makes you angry. What do you do about that?

I am not sure... for example people sometimes go postal for losing their job, so if 10 or 20 million lose their jobs the odds are some will react badly... that is just an example, but if you want to suggest that all the anger is the result of agitators well I go back to my original point. A lot of people are really angry and a lot of others are in denial.

75 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:04:29pm

re: #47 RadicalModerate

Well, if there was any doubt, it's now official.

Victoria Jackson has lost her fucking mind.

Victoria Jackon's Hot New Single: "There's A Communist Living in the White House!!"

The doofuses over at WND have a glowing writeup of her over there, unfortunately no cache yet, so no linky.

Could this be a deep, deep put-on? It really looks like self-parody.

76 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:04:30pm

re: #41 Charles

It totally fits the profile. Ron Paul is in favor of legalizing marijuana.

So was William F. Buckley, Jr. Just sayin', it's not exactly a right/left issue.

77 Spare O'Lake  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:04:30pm

Have a great weekend, folks.

78 RadicalModerate  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:04:33pm

re: #63 Slap

She flew over the cuckoo's nest a LONG time back...She's a BIG breitbart supporter. (Absence of caps intentional). Her pieces at BG are -- well, let's just say, apparently, not all of her cups are present in her cabinet.

Sonically speaking, I've never been able to stand her. But the voice isn't her fault -- I hope...

I should have posted some of the lyrics as an example of her complete loss of reality, so here's Victoria, in her own squeaky words:

"My husband really misses me. My parents think I've gone crazy. Only Glenn Beck really understands me, and of course Sean Hannity and Huckabee. But, you know, besides those three, and those sweet people who drink the tea, there's no one else who can see the Communist living in the the White House"

79 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:04:39pm

re: #55 Capitalist Tool

There's very little out there which clearly defines what is truly left or right, since the terms are usually used while pointing fingers and as such, can have just about any thoughts or action ascribed to them.


No, there's not any confusion about the left-right political dichotomy. It's pretty clear and every tenth grader can understand it. The Only people who have difficulty understanding the concept are historical revisionists like Jonah Goldberg and Glenn Beck. The rest of the world understands the concept just fine.

80 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:05:20pm

My feeling on this, and I don't want to be repetitive (I posted some thoughts this morning in another thread), is that when we do too much finger pointing at any group of people to say "This nut belongs to you." we are in some iffy territory. I have read enough rants from righties between last night and today to know they want no part of the Pentagon shooter, and give all their evidence that he's a leftist dopehead radical. I disagree. I see lots of comments here and elsewhere showing why he is firmly on the right, and why he belongs in the Paulian camp. I recognize my own prejudice against Ron Paul and his followers, but I won't let myself believe that in that movement there are no well intentioned folks. It's kind of hard to concede that point since they're often so outraged and outrageous, but I will still keep quiet about stamping the shooter's forehead "Paulian" and shoving his dead carcass over the line into their territory.

Last month was Black History month and I spread the word among my students about the pride we can feel about the accomplishments of African-Americans. Because we also teach Anne Frank, I choose to do it in March because we have just finished up with the theme of prejudice in February and it's fresh in their minds. Today as I was presenting something out of one of our texts on the subject of pogroms, it came to my mind how fast we want to brand a group of people because of the actions of one.

It was this:

In October of 1938, 17,000 German Jews were arrested and shipped to Poland. They lost their homes and businesses. The seventeen-year-old son of one of these families was living in Paris at the time. When he heard the news, he responded with violence at the German embassy in Paris. The Germans labeled this event as proof of a worldwide conspiracy by Jews against Germans. Within days, they launched what is perhaps the worst pogrom.

The point here is not to make a comparison of how right or wrong it was to do violence at the embassy on Paris to how right or wrong it is to do violence at the Pentagon. The motivation and the acts may be miles apart, but the point is our response. By laying the blame on an entire group for the act of one individual, we stray into unhealthy territory.

81 jamesfirecat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:05:22pm

re: #73 Capitalist Tool

Might we have a trend here?

What trend would that be?

82 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:05:40pm

re: #27 freetoken

"Not all Libertarian Fundamentalists will do what Bedell did."
Not all? You are damning with faint praise here Freetoken. One in a million is more like it.

83 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:05:47pm

re: #65 ShaunP

Lies and distortions come from both sides of the aisle. You will never hear me say otherwise. I'm also not trying to place blame on the entire right wing. I just think that the legitimate politicians that are lending credibility to this movement need to take a close look at what they are promoting...

what movement?

84 Bagua  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:06:26pm

World Gone Crazy


- Bounty Killer
85 RadicalModerate  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:07:20pm

re: #75 Decatur Deb

Could this be a deep, deep put-on? It really looks like self-parody.

It's the real deal. She's actually shown up and spoken at Teabagger rallies.

86 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:07:23pm

re: #80 Silvergirl

Well said. You made the case far better than I.

87 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:07:34pm

It's pointless to deny his political leanings. This is going to continue to happen until conservatives clean house. You can claim it doesn't matter all you want but reality isn't going to change.

88 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:08:20pm

re: #60 Rightwingconspirator

Absolutely! Not guns, not any weapons.

If this guy was as bright and skilled in biotech as he seems, he could have produced and deployed stuff much worse than 9mm.

89 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:08:32pm

re: #80 Silvergirl

A) I do not think holocaust examples should be used in general. I think you shouldn't have done that. You may say you're not comparing them-- if so, then why are you bringing it up?

B) Again: The problem is the embrace of people who say these same things and hold the same political philosophy. In your example, the Jew in Paris shared only his Jewishness with the other Jews. In this case, the very beliefs this guy holds are more and more and more and more prevalent on the 'right' these days.

90 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:08:34pm

re: #79 Killgore Trout

No, there's not any confusion about the left-right political dichotomy. It's pretty clear and every tenth grader can understand it. The Only people who have difficulty understanding the concept are historical revisionists like Jonah Goldberg and Glenn Beck. The rest of the world understands the concept just fine.

Okay- for you, maybe.
Please don't lump me in with anyone else...

I've seen all manner of behavior called both left and right and called over- the- top, as well as denial of same from what I would consider either side.
Haven't you?

91 RogueOne  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:09:47pm

re: #87 Killgore Trout

It's pointless to deny his political leanings. This is going to continue to happen until conservatives clean house. You can claim it doesn't matter all you want but reality isn't going to change.

He was institutionalized 4 times. What made him pull the trigger, his politics or his mental condition?

92 jamesfirecat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:09:58pm

re: #80 Silvergirl

My feeling on this, and I don't want to be repetitive (I posted some thoughts this morning in another thread), is that when we do too much finger pointing at any group of people to say "This nut belongs to you." we are in some iffy territory. I have read enough rants from righties between last night and today to know they want no part of the Pentagon shooter, and give all their evidence that he's a leftist dopehead radical. I disagree. I see lots of comments here and elsewhere showing why he is firmly on the right, and why he belongs in the Paulian camp. I recognize my own prejudice against Ron Paul and his followers, but I won't let myself believe that in that movement there are no well intentioned folks. It's kind of hard to concede that point since they're often so outraged and outrageous, but I will still keep quiet about stamping the shooter's forehead "Paulian" and shoving his dead carcass over the line into their territory.

Last month was Black History month and I spread the word among my students about the pride we can feel about the accomplishments of African-Americans. Because we also teach Anne Frank, I choose to do it in March because we have just finished up with the theme of prejudice in February and it's fresh in their minds. Today as I was presenting something out of one of our texts on the subject of pogroms, it came to my mind how fast we want to brand a group of people because of the actions of one.

It was this:

The point here is not to make a comparison of how right or wrong it was to do violence at the embassy on Paris to how right or wrong it is to do violence at the Pentagon. The motivation and the acts may be miles apart, but the point is our response. By laying the blame on an entire group for the act of one individual, we stray into unhealthy territory.

We shouldn't blame many for the actions of one, and yet at the same time, we need to come face to face with when a movement is teaching something that has no place in a healthy society.

I'm not saying that the right/Ron Paul is or isn't, I'm just saying we can't let being politically correct keep us from seeing the big picture if there are multiple points of data to correlate, and I think it also behooves the people who teach the kind of stuff that the shooter believes in to come out and clearly express why his actions are out of line with their philosophy.

93 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:09:59pm

re: #82 Rightwingconspirator

I was not arguing numbers, which, btw, probably are not 1:1,000,000 but perhaps more like 1:10,000 ...

It was that the ideology alone is not sufficient to define a homicidal sociopath. To be homicidal one has to take actions, not just write polemics.

94 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:10:01pm

re: #47 RadicalModerate

Well, if there was any doubt, it's now official.

Victoria Jackson has lost her fucking mind.

Victoria Jackon's Hot New Single: "There's A Communist Living in the White House!!"

The doofuses over at WND have a glowing writeup of her over there, unfortunately no cache yet, so no linky.

Never heard of her...

95 RogueOne  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:10:27pm

Night folks, have a good evening.

96 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:10:47pm

re: #89 Obdicut

A) I do not think holocaust examples should be used in general. I think you shouldn't have done that. You may say you're not comparing them-- if so, then why are you bringing it up?

B) Again: The problem is the embrace of people who say these same things and hold the same political philosophy. In your example, the Jew in Paris shared only his Jewishness with the other Jews. In this case, the very beliefs this guy holds are more and more and more and more prevalent on the 'right' these days.

When teaching about Anne Frank, you want she should use Ghandi as an example???

97 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:11:42pm

re: #96 Aceofwhat?

No, I'm saying that using that example to relate it to this incident, in her post, is a bad idea. Sorry for the lack of clarity.

98 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:12:06pm

re: #87 Killgore Trout

It's pointless to deny his political leanings. This is going to continue to happen until conservatives clean house. You can claim it doesn't matter all you want but reality isn't going to change.

KT that is my point, if I snapped my fingers and made ever Conservative to you liking nothing would change... people are genuinely angry and it is not a political thing.

99 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:12:42pm

re: #74 brookly red

I am not sure... for example people sometimes go postal for losing their job, so if 10 or 20 million lose their jobs the odds are some will react badly... that is just an example, but if you want to suggest that all the anger is the result of agitators well I go back to my original point. A lot of people are really angry and a lot of others are in denial.

So either you are angry or in denial?

I think it's just a difference of political opinions for most. The anger part is not good though, especially if you are angry at what the future may hold.

100 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:14:00pm

re: #91 RogueOne

He was institutionalized 4 times. What made him pull the trigger, his politics or his mental condition?

Both.

101 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:14:51pm

re: #97 Obdicut

No, I'm saying that using that example to relate it to this incident, in her post, is a bad idea. Sorry for the lack of clarity.

oh, gotcha.

eh - even then, i think she used the example in class and then it reminded her of this, so it was directly relevant for that reason.

but i wish to agree out loud with you that in most cases, we should do without Holocaust analogies when something else will do in their stead lest we cheapen that indescribable horror.

102 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:15:03pm

re: #99 Stanley Sea

So either you are angry or in denial?

I think it's just a difference of political opinions for most. The anger part is not good though, especially if you are angry at what the future may hold.

Most of the anger is focused at Washington DC right now, which much of the public sees as having fucked up by the numbers. That's why so many incumbents are quitting, because the voters are in a "Throw the bums out!" mood.

103 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:15:19pm

re: #87 Killgore Trout
I do not deny his politics, I doubt (mild denial I guess) that they were the real driving force to the violence. I think this guy might just as easily latched onto some other craziness like space aliens or the triumverate or the evil corporations and acted out. Maybe at Exxon instead of the Pentagon. Or tried to crash area 51. Who knows.. He was insane. His politics selected his target but perhaps not his willingness to commit gun violence.

What is your (or anyone's) best case it was the right wing politics rather than the straight insanity at the start middle and end?

104 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:15:48pm

Anarchists Unite!

105 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:15:52pm

re: #35 Charles

Of course he was mentally ill. But that is the WHOLE POINT. The rise of this kind of dangerous rhetoric and extremism on the right wing is feeding the fantasies of people like Bedell, and inciting them to violence.

It doesn't excuse the right wing to say the guy was crazy. Sure, he was crazy. But the craziness was fed by the extremism that is everywhere in the modern right wing.

Encouraging and allowing this craziness has consequences -- one of them is named John Patrick Bedell.

I'm sorry, Charles, but I have to disagree here. We simply have no way of knowing what Bedell might have done under other circumstances, and it's an experiment that can never be performed. People who go ape-shit crazy and embark on killing sprees always have justifications for their actions, often elaborate ones, but I don't think anyone to this day knows what direction causality flows in such instances.

It sounds as though there is a long, sad history of mental illness here that has grown increasingly worse over the years; we'll undoubtedly learn more in the coming days. But no one can reasonably claim that, had any of Bedell's associations or reading materials or Internet obsessions been different, the ultimate outcome would have substantially changed.

106 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:16:29pm

re: #99 Stanley Sea

So either you are angry or in denial?

I think it's just a difference of political opinions for most. The anger part is not good though, especially if you are angry at what the future may hold.

Do not put words in my mouth, I did not make that distinction. The denial part comes from some people's refusal to see that other people are angry... and that will only make them angrier.

107 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:17:23pm

re: #92 jamesfirecat

We shouldn't blame many for the actions of one, and yet at the same time, we need to come face to face with when a movement is teaching something that has no place in a healthy society.

I'm not saying that the right/Ron Paul is or isn't, I'm just saying we can't let being politically correct keep us from seeing the big picture if there are multiple points of data to correlate, and I think it also behooves the people who teach the kind of stuff that the shooter believes in to come out and clearly express why his actions are out of line with their philosophy.

I agree we need to come face to face with when a movement is teaching something that has no place in a healthy society. Well said. There are many ways to say that without taking the extreme acts of an individual and having a war of words about who gets to claim him.

I don't believe that trying to force a group of people to claim a deranged and violent individual will promote any understanding, and will not encourage anything but defensiveness and a case why the deranged and violent does not represent their teachings.

108 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:17:47pm

re: #102 Dark_Falcon

Most of the anger is focused at Washington DC right now, which much of the public sees as having fucked up by the numbers. That's why so many incumbents are quitting, because the voters are in a "Throw the bums out!" mood.

If you are angry because you lost your job, yeah - got that.

But this is where it gets irrational in a basic sense. If you are angry about how things are going, that in my mind have not affected us to the point of acting out yet, it's a dangerous anger.

And it's being stoked.

109 Digital Display  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:17:52pm

Hollywood Pal:
Someone who is always around
When he needs you

110 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:18:22pm

re: #69 Killgore Trout

NO, he fits a very well defined ideology. His politics and economics are very clear and his affiliation with the Mises Institute is undeniable.

Then go on and answer the questions posed in my second paragraph.

111 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:18:35pm

Cut the Fringe ®

This one cut himself out, and I am forever grateful the police will recover fully.

Heal fast & well gentlemen! You saved lives.

112 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:19:14pm

re: #100 Charles

Both.

Which led, and which followed?

113 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:19:29pm

re: #109 HoosierHoops

Ouch! That's gonna hurt some feeling in my zip code! LOL!!

114 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:19:37pm

re: #112 SixDegrees

Which led, and which followed?

Impossible to say.

115 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:19:45pm

re: #106 brookly red

Do not put words in my mouth, I did not make that distinction. The denial part comes from some people's refusal to see that other people are angry... and that will only make them angrier.

Oh I don't mean to put words in your mouth. Sorry.

And we do see the anger, how could anyone not?

116 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:20:03pm

There's always a totally remorseless faction waiting to take over the revolution.

117 Racer X  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:20:03pm

I heard on the radio today that this dude was a pot smoking graduate student. I doubt very much he has ever been friendly with the GOP. He hated George Bush.

118 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:20:13pm

re: #111 Rightwingconspirator

Cut the Fringe ®

This one cut himself out, and I am forever grateful the police will recover fully.

Heal fast & well gentlemen! You saved lives.

Varek Raith said it best..."fortunately for the good folks in uniform, he had the aim of an Imperial Stormtrooper"

LMAO!!

119 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:20:17pm

re: #105 SixDegrees

had any of Bedell's associations or reading materials or Internet obsessions been different, the ultimate outcome would have substantially changed.

But one can point out that his views have a lot of support in the GOP and on the right these days. Not the violence, but his views.

That should given anyone pause.

120 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:20:40pm

re: #114 Charles

Impossible to say.

I completely agree.

121 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:21:18pm

Perhaps it was his insanity that led him towards a certain brand of far-right political thinking.

122 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:21:59pm

re: #119 Obdicut

But one can point out that his views have a lot of support in the GOP and on the right these days. Not the violence, but his views.

That should given anyone pause.


Which views would those be, exactly?

123 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:22:19pm

re: #87 Killgore Trout

It's pointless to deny his political leanings. This is going to continue to happen until conservatives clean house. You can claim it doesn't matter all you want but reality isn't going to change.

I agree -- it's going to keep happening. There's absolutely no willingness on the right to rein in the crazies or tone down the rhetoric. It's going to keep getting worse until something really bad happens.

124 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:22:57pm

re: #89 Obdicut

A) I do not think holocaust examples should be used in general. I think you shouldn't have done that. You may say you're not comparing them-- if so, then why are you bringing it up?

B) Again: The problem is the embrace of people who say these same things and hold the same political philosophy. In your example, the Jew in Paris shared only his Jewishness with the other Jews. In this case, the very beliefs this guy holds are more and more and more and more prevalent on the 'right' these days.

My use of holocaust examples are few and far between. A rarity in the extreme. Of course it was in my mind, having just read that passage today, and I explained that I connected the response to the incidents and why.

125 Digital Display  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:23:19pm

re: #113 Rightwingconspirator

Ouch! That's gonna hurt some feeling in my zip code! LOL!!

Hi you..You know NorCal folks have to tease our SoCal friends..
Be well my friend.. Is the misses feeling healthy today?

126 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:23:32pm

Have any major Conservative voices spoken out against the John Birchers lately?

127 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:23:33pm

re: #119 Obdicut

It's more than that.

The ideation of violence is rife throughout the "right"-o-sphere. That is why I often post quotes from Murdoch's hate site FoxNation.

In quantity, there is far, far more ideated violence on the "righty" blogosphere in this country compare to the anarchist left (which exists in this country, but is not very numerous.)

The unwillingness of the better known "righty" talking heads (on radio or TV) to address this is immoral.

128 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:23:47pm

re: #122 Capitalist Tool

His views on the educational system, for example, or government regulation. The stuff posted at the top of the page.

Listen to his rant. Tell me what portions of it you think the Paulians would reject.

129 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:24:09pm

re: #116 Capitalist Tool

There's always a totally remorseless faction waiting to take over the revolution.

Did someone just offer lobster?

130 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:24:16pm

re: #115 Stanley Sea

Oh I don't mean to put words in your mouth. Sorry.

And we do see the anger, how could anyone not?

all good. but since I like rock-n-roll analogies here's a quote from Jim Carroll...

Herbie pushed Tony from the Boys' Club roof
Tony thought that his rage was just some goof
But Herbie sure gave Tony some bitchen proof
Hey, Herbie said, Tony, can you fly?
But Tony couldn't fly . . . Tony died

it's like that.

131 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:24:17pm

re: #119 Obdicut

But one can point out that his views have a lot of support in the GOP and on the right these days. Not the violence, but his views.

That should given anyone pause.

well...you need to be more specific.

view that Kelo is evidence that legislators need to do more to protect private property from gov't pickpocketing? that's not so bad, right?

view that the government is evilly manipulating our existence through their eeevil currency and that we should develop a pot-based currency traded on proprietary digital media? i'm all about purging that from the right.

he used both as false reasons for violence. that does not mean that both views are therefore odious. does it?

132 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:24:42pm

re: #124 Silvergirl

I know. I still reflexively have to object. It still just gets me thinking about all kinds of things that aren't relevant. I shouldn't have objected, really-- I think you made your point fairly, but I do still disagree.

133 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:25:11pm

re: #129 Decatur Deb

Did someone just offer lobster?

Frogs. Froglegs.

134 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:25:40pm

re: #126 Capitalist Tool

I try, but I'm not even close to being a "major voice" in the conservative movement.

135 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:25:45pm

re: #131 Aceofwhat?

No. But the idea that the government is manipulating our existence through their currency would get applause at CPAC. It wouldn't even be the craziest thing that got applause there.

The pot-based currency would probably get mixed applause and head-scratching.

136 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:26:09pm

re: #110 SixDegrees

Are you trying to say that Bedell is a product of this ideology? Or that he is representative of this ideology? Or are you trying to say something else altogether? And if the last, what?


I don't know what you're asking. He had a political philosophy and was affiliated with the Mises Institute. What inspires people to believe in Austrian economics, conspiracy theories or anything else? Why do people vote Rep or Dem? Each individual has their own reasons.

137 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:26:18pm

re: #130 brookly red

all good. but since I like rock-n-roll analogies here's a quote from Jim Carroll...

Herbie pushed Tony from the Boys' Club roof
Tony thought that his rage was just some goof
But Herbie sure gave Tony some bitchen proof
Hey, Herbie said, Tony, can you fly?
But Tony couldn't fly . . . Tony died

it's like that.

Ending in a depressing view of the future, but total upding for quoting Jim Carroll.

138 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:26:33pm

re: #134 Slumbering Behemoth

I try, but I'm not even close to being a "major voice" in the conservative movement.

Get busy

139 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:27:09pm

re: #127 freetoken

True, I was just thinking that I was minimizing the violence-fetishization typified by people like Coulter and others. There's been a lot of really irresponsibly violent talk thrown around.

140 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:27:38pm

re: #87 Killgore Trout

If you think the Republican party rejecting the fringe right will reduce any chance of violence think again. The fringers will be at least as desperate, and even more desperate for attention. Perhaps more likely to act out. Ponder this-The Birchers survived all these years to rise agin now. Why now? The economy and it

The real solution is change the environment that increases their number. Left fringe, right fringe, whatever kind of madness applies, we have fewer of them in better days.

141 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:27:53pm

re: #123 Charles

I agree -- it's going to keep happening. There's absolutely no willingness on the right to rein in the crazies or tone down the rhetoric. It's going to keep getting worse until something really bad happens.

...and nobody on the right is going to heed the warnings. It's easily predictable and sadly nobody is willing to deal with the real issues.

142 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:28:13pm

re: #137 Stanley Sea

Ending in a depressing view of the future, but total upding for quoting Jim Carroll.

the moral of the story is not to under-estimate the angry.

143 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:28:18pm

re: #140 Rightwingconspirator

PIMF the economy and its consequences. Particularly on the unstable.

144 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:28:45pm

re: #126 Capitalist Tool

Have any major Conservative voices spoken out against the John Birchers lately?

Not that I've seen. Drudge is still linking to Truther Libertarian Alex Jones and nobody on the right is complaining.

145 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:28:47pm

re: #138 Capitalist Tool

I'm just a sad RINO
And everywhere I go
No Rep. wants to hear the song I'm singin'

146 TampaKnight  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:29:35pm

How are Republicans supposed to stop this when these crazies are targeting THEM as well as political enemies?

147 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:29:44pm

re: #144 Killgore Trout

Huckabee is the only one that comes to mind.

148 jamesfirecat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:30:17pm

re: #140 Rightwingconspirator

If you think the Republican party rejecting the fringe right will reduce any chance of violence think again. The fringers will be at least as desperate, and even more desperate for attention. Perhaps more likely to act out. Ponder this-The Birchers survived all these years to rise agin now. Why now? The economy and it

The real solution is change the environment that increases their number. Left fringe, right fringe, whatever kind of madness applies, we have fewer of them in better days.

I think patting the fringe on the head and telling it what a good little boy it is probably does a lot to increase its numbers, which is why the right needs to do more to curb these people and make it clear there behavior is unacceptable....

149 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:30:27pm

re: #132 Obdicut

I know. I still reflexively have to object. It still just gets me thinking about all kinds of things that aren't relevant. I shouldn't have objected, really-- I think you made your point fairly, but I do still disagree.

I appreciate your take on this, and especially your calm and friendly tone!

150 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:31:05pm

re: #134 Slumbering Behemoth

I try, but I'm not even close to being a "major voice" in the conservative movement.

...well, at least your avatar isn't an impediment//

151 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:31:15pm

re: #141 Killgore Trout

...and nobody on the right is going to heed the warnings. It's easily predictable and sadly nobody is willing to deal with the real issues.

KT what are the real issues?

152 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:31:21pm

re: #133 Capitalist Tool

Frogs. Froglegs.


What's a revolution without general copulation?

153 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:31:22pm

re: #140 Rightwingconspirator

If you think the Republican party rejecting the fringe right will reduce any chance of violence think again.


No, it won;t prevent act like this. It might reduce them but nuts will be nuts. However, If the Republicans were to purge the lunatics there wouldn't be a politically damaging connection to the Republican party when they freak out and commit acts of terrorism.

154 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:31:38pm

I completely agree -- anyone trying to say that this guy is a lefty has been drinking way too much of Jonah's kool aid.

When was the last time you saw a lefty trying to propose new types of weapons for the military?

155 Racer X  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:32:46pm

If you ask me, the crazies on the left and the right have now come full circle and are conglomerating. The GOP is stuck with them because they are not in power, and desire the new votes.

Bad move.

156 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:33:33pm

re: #151 brookly red

KT what are the real issues?

John Birch Society at CPAC, Glenn Beck and Fox News, Ron Paul, anti-government militias and white supremacists proudly attending Tea Parties.

157 Racer X  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:33:50pm

re: #153 Killgore Trout

No, it won't prevent act like this. It might reduce them but nuts will be nuts. However, If the Republicans were to purge the lunatics there wouldn't be a politically damaging connection to the Republican party when they freak out and commit acts of terrorism.

Bingo.

158 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:33:55pm

re: #147 freetoken

Huckabee is the only one that comes to mind.

That's right, I forgot about that. I wouldn't vote for the guy, but I definitely give him props for that.

159 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:34:07pm

re: #135 Obdicut

No. But the idea that the government is manipulating our existence through their currency would get applause at CPAC. It wouldn't even be the craziest thing that got applause there.

The pot-based currency would probably get mixed applause and head-scratching.

fair. so then i'm in agreement that his nutty views need to be vocally and repeatedly repudiated by my lost, forlorn party and the few ideas he had that were not crazy through sheer luck aren't necessarily tainted through association.

(as long as i didn't take too many liberties, there)

160 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:34:22pm

re: #144 Killgore Trout

Not that I've seen. Drudge is still linking to Truther Libertarian Alex Jones and nobody on the right is complaining.

I haven't noticed any links to Alex Jones, but wouldn't know one if I saw it.
Drudge links to Sowell, Paglia et al, to his credit.

161 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:34:26pm

I propose this-A two fold clarion call-Reject the fringe right and step up attention to the mentally ill /desperately depressed. Desperation leads to violence. Reduce the desperation and you reduce the problem.

re: #148 jamesfirecat

Agreed we are past the point where the sensible right wing leadership needs to step up and boot out the fringers. I thought that long before the IRS or Pentagon incident.

162 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:34:29pm

re: #149 Silvergirl

I appreciate your take on this, and especially your calm and friendly tone!

i've been working with him//

163 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:34:29pm

re: #156 Killgore Trout

John Birch Society at CPAC, Glenn Beck and Fox News, Ron Paul, anti-government militias and white supremacists proudly attending Tea Parties.

Yea Yea, but other than those what are the issues?!?!?!
//

164 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:35:12pm

re: #159 Aceofwhat?

Nope. That's very well-put.

165 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:35:14pm

re: #156 Killgore Trout

John Birch Society at CPAC, Glenn Beck and Fox News, Ron Paul, anti-government militias and white supremacists proudly attending Tea Parties.

well if you just keep telling yourself that I am sure everything will be OK.

166 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:35:31pm

re: #136 Killgore Trout

I don't know what you're asking. He had a political philosophy and was affiliated with the Mises Institute. What inspires people to believe in Austrian economics, conspiracy theories or anything else? Why do people vote Rep or Dem? Each individual has their own reasons.

So, it would be fair to say that membership in the Democratic Party must lead inevitably to becoming a serial killer? Or that being homosexual produces the same result? Because both were true of John Wayne Gacy. Or maybe it was just his association with the Carters that led him down his path?

Are all Democrats incipient serial killers? Does joining the Democratic Party turn one into a serial killer? Or was it something else that led Gacy to kill?

You're attempting to draw some connection between Bedell and his affiliations, but you aren't stating what you believe those connections to be. Are they causal? If so, in which direction? Or are you trying to say something else.

167 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:36:05pm

re: #154 Thanos

I completely agree -- anyone trying to say that this guy is a lefty has been drinking way too much of Jonah's kool aid.

When was the last time you saw a lefty trying to propose new types of weapons for the military?


"Those who beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don't." - Thomas Jefferson

168 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:36:08pm

re: #160 Capitalist Tool

I haven't noticed any links to Alex Jones, but wouldn't know one if I saw it.
Drudge links to Sowell, Paglia et al, to his credit.

Drudge Report Links to John Birch Society.

169 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:36:33pm

re: #153 Killgore Trout

Then it I guess would be more like the 1960's when the Weathermen bombings had no deleterious effect on the Democrats. No connection, apart from a coincidence of left wing beliefs. Agreed.

170 jamesfirecat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:36:46pm

re: #165 brookly red

well if you just keep telling yourself that I am sure everything will be OK.

Yes, because there's nothing at all frighting or disturbing about the things he mentioned.

What are the real issues to you?

171 researchok  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:36:54pm

re: #123 Charles

I agree -- it's going to keep happening. There's absolutely no willingness on the right to rein in the crazies or tone down the rhetoric. It's going to keep getting worse until something really bad happens.

Not all Tea Party ideology is off the mark. You can't brush the entire group with one brush stroke.

For example, property rights are fundamental in a free society. As many liberals as conservatives were outraged with Kelo and what followed.

While I know this guy was a nut job, it is just as clear that public education has been a disaster for decades. There is a reason Obama has made education reform and accountability a priority.

There is no question the Tea Party has it's nut jobs- but so do both political parties.

What makes the Tea Party dangerous aren't their mainstream ideas (responsible spending, fiscal accountability, etc). There are two problems. First, and less important, is the whack jobs are appropriating the pulpit. This isn't new. Both parties have had to suffer fools. The second and more significant problem is that the GOP is giving the nut jobs credibility by treating them as equals. This is piss poor political judgment. It is not an indictment of every Tea party member.

In the same way the Dems kicked the radical left in the ass, the GOP has to do the same with the nut jobs. Not every lefty was a Weatherman and not every conservative is a Ron Paul whack job.

The GOP is supposed to be an inclusive party that values not group think but rather individualism. No party that has as a plank faith in God as a mandatory requirement for membership for example, will survive. Why? Because Americans, even if they are believers, understand that religion is not meant to worn on ones sleeve in the town square. We won't deride religion but we wont accord it supremacy.

You can't throw the mainstream Tea Party members out with the bathwater.

172 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:37:01pm

re: #160 Capitalist Tool

I haven't noticed any links to Alex Jones, but wouldn't know one if I saw it.
Drudge links to Sowell, Paglia et al, to his credit.

He links to "infowars" on his site.

173 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:37:10pm

re: #160 Capitalist Tool

I haven't noticed any links to Alex Jones, but wouldn't know one if I saw it.
Drudge links to Sowell, Paglia et al, to his credit.

And Drudge has a permanent link to the Alex Jones site Infowars.com.

174 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:37:34pm

re: #153 Killgore Trout

No, it won;t prevent act like this. It might reduce them but nuts will be nuts. However, If the Republicans were to purge the lunatics there wouldn't be a politically damaging connection to the Republican party when they freak out and commit acts of terrorism.

But if acts like this will happen regardless of the Republican Party's positions or actions, then the connections are simply random, and therefore not damaging.

175 Lidane  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:37:43pm

re: #160 Capitalist Tool

I haven't noticed any links to Alex Jones, but wouldn't know one if I saw it.

If you look at Drudge's front page and scroll down to where he's got all his news sources listed, you'll find Infowars. That's Alex Jones.

Drudge has been linking to that lunatic for ages now, and treats him like a legit news source. It's nauseating.

176 Racer X  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:38:22pm

You know who else hates the U.S. Government?

Rev. Wright.
Father Pfleger.
Louis Farrakhan.

177 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:38:38pm

re: #168 Charles

Drudge Report Links to John Birch Society.


Which one of those links is JBS?- Don't give me the actual link, please- just what is the name they use?

178 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:39:05pm

re: #164 Obdicut

Nope. That's very well-put.

Then it's time for gin!

179 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:39:10pm

ah so- infowars is Alex Jones...

180 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:39:34pm

re: #140 Rightwingconspirator

If you think the Republican party rejecting the fringe right will reduce any chance of violence think again. The fringers will be at least as desperate, and even more desperate for attention. Perhaps more likely to act out. Ponder this-The Birchers survived all these years to rise agin now. Why now? The economy and it

The real solution is change the environment that increases their number. Left fringe, right fringe, whatever kind of madness applies, we have fewer of them in better days.

I certainly agree that the economy is part of what is bringing these crazies out, however for terror and terrorists to exist in substantial form there have to be sympathizers. Those who cheer these freaks on, concur with them in forums, and walk the edge of the crazy abyss like Beck. It's noteworthy that the last time there was large amts of domestic terror from the left that it was during the height of left radicalism.

181 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:39:44pm

re: #165 brookly red

well if you just keep telling yourself that I am sure everything will be OK.

That's why this is going to continue to happen. Way too many conservatives are in denial and refuse to acknowledge the tragedy they are creating for themselves. It's pretty much inevitable at this point.

182 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:40:03pm

re: #176 Racer X

All three of which manifest a messianic sociopathy that would be strongly condemned around here.

183 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:40:22pm

I never look at any of those links- just scan headlines...

184 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:40:45pm

re: #166 SixDegrees

So, it would be fair to say that membership in the Democratic Party must lead inevitably to becoming a serial killer?


No, that would be stupid.

185 Racer X  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:40:55pm

re: #182 freetoken

All three of which manifest a messianic sociopathy that would be strongly condemned around here.

And all three have been.

186 jamesfirecat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:41:04pm

re: #180 Thanos

I certainly agree that the economy is part of what is bringing these crazies out, however for terror and terrorists to exist in substantial form there have to be sympathizers. Those who cheer these freaks on, concur with them in forums, and walk the edge of the crazy abyss like Beck. It's noteworthy that the last time there was large amts of domestic terror from the left that it was during the height of left radicalism.

Well said, the reaction when someone flies a plane into a building should not be a hand wringing "well a lot of people don't like what that building stood for...."

187 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:42:22pm

re: #41 Charles

It totally fits the profile. Ron Paul is in favor of legalizing marijuana.

So am I. But for different reasons.

It would be a great source of tax revenue to fund the New World Order.

188 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:42:37pm

re: #176 Racer X

re: #182 freetoken

I don't think you are in disagreement.

189 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:42:49pm

re: #179 Capitalist Tool

ah so- infowars is Alex Jones...

Also "prisonplanet". If you see anyone linking to either source as newsworthy, you can safely assume that their credibility is null and void.

190 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:42:58pm

re: #180 Thanos

I certainly agree that the economy is part of what is bringing these crazies out, however for terror and terrorists to exist in substantial form there have to be sympathizers. Those who cheer these freaks on, concur with them in forums, and walk the edge of the crazy abyss like Beck. It's noteworthy that the last time there was large amts of domestic terror from the left that it was during the height of left radicalism.

Shades of Bill Ayers.

191 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:43:27pm

Just read a facebook entry by my cousin. She wrote eighty words without any capitalization or punctuation. Our public school system needs something. Not what he was proposing, but something.

192 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:43:40pm

re: #174 SixDegrees

But if acts like this will happen regardless of the Republican Party's positions or actions, then the connections are simply random, and therefore not damaging.

yeah, i was following it up to that point as well.

IIRC, we are purging because the messengers are giving unction to the sick. if the only real damage is to the GOP rep, the left should be gleeful.

but 99% of the left here at LGF seem to nobly want the best for the nation and for humanity (incorrectly, sometimes, but i'm working on that//) and so are more concerned about the apparent rotting of part of the GOP than about whether such a thing could keep the left in charge or not.

so i think KT was more accurate earlier to imply that he believes the rotten messengers do some measurable enabling.

193 wrenchwench  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:43:59pm

re: #171 researchok

First, and less important, is the whack jobs are appropriating the pulpit.

Nope. The whack jobs built the pulpit.

The second and more significant problem is that the GOP is giving the nut jobs credibility by treating them as equals.

Nope, the GOP is pandering to them. And being taken over by them.

194 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:44:13pm

re: #187 Cato the Elder

So am I. But for different reasons.

It would be a great source of tax revenue to fund the New World Order.

Or a nude old worder.

195 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:44:43pm

re: #184 Killgore Trout

No, that would be stupid.

Why? It's very well documented that Gacy was a devoted, hard working Democrat, who actively sought the party out and was rewarded for his local efforts by a meeting with Rosalyn Carter. The evidence is very strong - just as strong, or even more so, than it is in Bedell's case, since that's the connection you appear to be striving to make without actually coming out and saying it.

Or are you trying to say something else? If so, what, exactly?

196 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:45:21pm

re: #191 EmmmieG

ee cummings made a good living at it

197 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:45:25pm

re: #194 Decatur Deb

Or a nude old worder.

Shit - I keep forgetting to turn off my webcam.

198 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:45:49pm

re: #191 EmmmieG

Perhaps the internet via cell phone has made grammar obsolete?

199 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:45:57pm

re: #197 Cato the Elder

Shit - I keep forgetting to turn off my webcam.

You on Chat Roulette again Cato?

200 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:46:53pm

re: #191 EmmmieG

Never attribute to the public school system that which can be adequately explained by indolence.

201 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:47:04pm

re: #195 SixDegrees

Why?


Because his crime wasn't politically motivated. His politics were unrelated to his crime. It's very simple.

202 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:48:07pm

re: #194 Decatur Deb

Or a nude old worder.

either way, i'm hoarding gin...

203 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:48:08pm

re: #190 Capitalist Tool

Exactly, there were many radical groups, and they were contesting with each other as to who was more radical, they were egged on by pundits in the press, elected officials, media, and from large scale demonstrations. So the antiwar movement of that time begat Dohrn, Ayers, etc.
You see the same on the right today, sort of a wink wink nudge nudge as the leadership and right media eggs this bullshit on. They are going to regret it because those survivalist / militia / libertarian type far right extremists are much more dangerous than SDS and co ever was.

204 researchok  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:48:21pm

re: #193 wrenchwench

Nope, the GOP is pandering to them. And being taken over by them.

Every political movement starts with mayhem in the ranks as people jockey for power and influence.

If the GOP caves to the nut jobs they won't win an election for decades. The GOP will jettison the morons if they believe they are endangered. Sadly, that will be the impetus and not a moral wake up call..

205 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:48:27pm

re: #198 freetoken

Perhaps the internet via cell phone has made grammar obsolete?

omg no

206 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:48:50pm

re: #176 Racer X

I have lost it, but long ago the FBI reported Farrahkhans group as the largest and best equipped militia in the USA.
Or check these guys out. The Black Panther Self Defense militia.

Anti Defamation League site-link
[Link: www.adl.org...]

207 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:49:01pm

re: #189 Slumbering Behemoth

Also "prisonplanet". If you see anyone linking to either source as newsworthy, you can safely assume that their credibility is null and void.


Works for me. Never plan on going to those sites anyway.
Someone told me once that I just had to read an item on his site- once- that was all it took to figure out Alex Jones.

I see Drudge also links Kos, Economist and Pravda, to pick out a few... not sure I'd place a bet on what they have to say, either.

208 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:49:17pm

re: #201 Killgore Trout

Because his crime wasn't politically motivated. His politics were unrelated to his crime. It's very simple.

Which brings us right back to the questions you haven't answered. You seem to be asserting that this isn't true in Bedell's case, that there is some overt connection between his actions and the right. So again: are you saying that Bedell is a product of the right? Or are you saying that Bedell is representative of the right? Or are you saying something else? And if the last, what?

209 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:49:21pm

re: #199 rwdflynavy

You on Chat Roulette again Cato?

tosh.0 had a funnier bit than JStewart...just my two cents...

210 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:49:42pm

re: #186 jamesfirecat

No that is as sick as the idea the US is responsible for 9-11 by way of policy.

211 jamesfirecat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:49:47pm

re: #205 Aceofwhat?

omg no

I believe you mean

0//G // 0 1111

212 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:50:43pm

re: #206 Rightwingconspirator

I have lost it, but long ago the FBI reported Farrahkhans group as the largest and best equipped militia in the USA.
Or check these guys out. The Black Panther Self Defense militia.

Anti Defamation League site-link
[Link: www.adl.org...]

They are doing as a group what I am doing as an individual, and for much the same reason.

213 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:51:00pm

re: #207 Capitalist Tool

Just for shits and giggles, you should check out one of his vids on youtube. The man is stark raving nutters.

214 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:51:11pm

re: #195 SixDegrees

Or are you trying to say something else

Gacy was a whack job because he was a whack job. His political fealty to the dem party was incidental

Bedell was a whack job that was pushed due to his politics!

:)

215 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:51:18pm

re: #204 researchok

Every political movement starts with mayhem in the ranks as people jockey for power and influence.

If the GOP caves to the nut jobs they won't win an election for decades. The GOP will jettison the morons if they believe they are endangered. Sadly, that will be the impetus and not a moral wake up call..

tsk. don't check the free horse for cavities...just feed it and clean the stall...

216 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:51:32pm

re: #203 Thanos

More pendulum swing than aberration...

217 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:52:12pm

We are much more likely to lose life or liberty to nutball groups like this one than we are to FEMA camps and the UN.

If the idea of un-elected and unappointed senile old farts with fifty caliber machine guns on trucks thinking they are the law doesn’t bother you then I don’t know what will. (The Taliban trucks like that are called "Technicals" in milspeak)

218 Boondock St. Bender  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:52:42pm

re: #208 SixDegrees

well gacy used to kill little kids and bury them in his basement(now,i'm no fan of jimmy carter,but,i don't believe kid killing was an issue he advocated)as opposed to the stupidity that this character was posting and acted on....just sayin...

219 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:52:55pm

What, if any, opinions do folks hold regarding publicly funded elections? Personally I think it would be a great way to change the situation of politicians responding to money as opposed to votes. It would surprise me if there wasn't an "against" side to this issue I just don't know what it is.

Sound off!

[Link: www.publicampaign.org...]

[Link: www.youstreet.org...]

220 pharmmajor  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:53:11pm

re: #41 Charles

It totally fits the profile. Ron Paul is in favor of legalizing marijuana.

What profile? Millions of Americans who support legalizing marijuana have never committed violent acts. This is a very flimsy correlation you're attempting to create, Charles.

221 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:53:35pm

re: #181 Killgore Trout

That's why this is going to continue to happen. Way too many conservatives are in denial and refuse to acknowledge the tragedy they are creating for themselves. It's pretty much inevitable at this point.

KT if Fox went away tomorrow would there suddenly be 20 million jobs? Would the housing market recover? I Fear all you do is blame the messenger...

222 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:53:49pm

re: #217 Thanos

If the idea of un-elected and unappointed senile old farts with fifty caliber machine guns on trucks...

Sounds like a party!

223 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:54:24pm

re: #213 Slumbering Behemoth

Just for shits and giggles, you should check out one of his vids on youtube. The man is stark raving nutters.

Oh! That's what I did! Never been to his site, just a YouTube link sent to me- thanks. So what if I have a swiss- cheese memory-
still got my cherry.

224 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:54:48pm

re: #221 brookly red

KT if Fox went away tomorrow would there suddenly be 20 million jobs? Would the housing market recover? I Fear all you do is blame the messenger...

We'll always have Paris Ron Pual/TeaParties

225 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:54:50pm

re: #220 pharmmajor

What profile? Millions of Americans who support legalizing marijuana have never committed violent acts. This is a very flimsy correlation you're attempting to create, Charles.

I'm guessing he means someone with some far right type views that also believes in pot legalization. So.. the profile of a libertarian or tea partier is what I'm guessing.

226 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:55:08pm

re: #219 Locker

There are theoretical argument against public funding, but since we currently to do have a mix of public and private funding of elections it's not clear to me those theories will ever be testable.

227 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:55:09pm

re: #222 Charles

Sounds like a party!

Sounds like an EMT job fair.

228 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:55:38pm

re: #212 Decatur Deb

Depends how broadly they define self defense. First strike?

From the link
In 1990, at a "state of the inner city" press conference at city hall, McGee - then a Milwaukee alderman - announced his intention to create the Black Panther Militia unless the problems of the inner-city improved. He sought to enlist street gangs in the militia and provide them with weapons training. "They can fight and they already know how to shoot," he said. "I'm going to give them a cause to die for." By 1995, McGee threatened, the militia would carry out violent attacks in the city against "the government, the big private interests, the multi-millionaires.

229 jamesfirecat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:56:22pm

re: #210 Rightwingconspirator

No that is as sick as the idea the US is responsible for 9-11 by way of policy.

If you're saying you don't like the idea of people saying that Joe Stack was justified because people don't like the IRS then I agree with you.

230 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:56:39pm

re: #208 SixDegrees
I don't know why you keep asking this.

So again: are you saying that Bedell is a product of the right?

No.

Or are you saying that Bedell is representative of the right?


No.



Or are you saying something else?


All I'm saying is that he had a political philosophy. We can read his writings and see that he easily fits into the category of a Ron Paul style Libertarian.

231 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:57:13pm

re: #224 sattv4u2

We'll always have Paris Ron Pual/TeaParties

We have a lot of people going through some deep shit... sooner or later some of them are going to lash out, it is what it is.

232 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:57:47pm

re: #219 Locker

What, if any, opinions do folks hold regarding publicly funded elections? Personally I think it would be a great way to change the situation of politicians responding to money as opposed to votes. It would surprise me if there wasn't an "against" side to this issue I just don't know what it is.

Sound off!

[Link: www.publicampaign.org...]

[Link: www.youstreet.org...]

What do you think of filling the 'public election fund' with taxes from private donations and private funds spent on election-related items (like advertising)?

233 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:58:15pm

From Sharmuta
This Too Shall Pass - Rube Goldberg Machine version

234 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:58:33pm

re: #228 Rightwingconspirator

Depends how broadly they define self defense. First strike?

From the link
In 1990, at a "state of the inner city" press conference at city hall, McGee - then a Milwaukee alderman - announced his intention to create the Black Panther Militia unless the problems of the inner-city improved. He sought to enlist street gangs in the militia and provide them with weapons training. "They can fight and they already know how to shoot," he said. "I'm going to give them a cause to die for." By 1995, McGee threatened, the militia would carry out violent attacks in the city against "the government, the big private interests, the multi-millionaires.

They see their kids as collateral damage in an undeclared war. The emergency rooms back them up.

235 jamesfirecat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:58:47pm

re: #221 brookly red

KT if Fox went away tomorrow would there suddenly be 20 million jobs? Would the housing market recover? I Fear all you do is blame the messenger...

Do we have some right to blame a guy if he's yelling "JUMP" through a megaphone to a guy who is contemplating suicide at the edge of a building?

236 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:59:15pm

re: #229 jamesfirecat

Yes exactly. Joe Stack was a killer. Of course tax collectors have been at risk since taxes existed. So when some one does something horrible to a person or entity you dislike, it behooves you to put that violence in proper perspective. Anathema.

237 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:59:18pm

re: #217 Thanos

We are much more likely to lose life or liberty to nutball groups like this one than we are to FEMA camps and the UN.


[Video]If the idea of un-elected and unappointed senile old farts with fifty caliber machine guns on trucks thinking they are the law doesn’t bother you then I don’t know what will. (The Taliban trucks like that are called "Technicals" in milspeak)

Remington has sold over 3.5 million model 700s.
We'll not ever be disarmed or put in camps en masse.

238 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:59:22pm

re: #232 Aceofwhat?

Or, why not just require broadcasters, who are after all using the commons of the electromagnetic spectrum, to offer without charge broadcast time to any candidate that is registered as so with their state elections commission?

239 Digital Display  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 3:59:59pm

** -- **--**--
I'm reviewing the Movie 'The Blind Side' during my weekly movie in the morning.. As a preview...Top 5 sports movies of all time.. I think I've seen every sports movies ever make.. From Babe Ruth to Brian's Song to Field of Dreams to Slap Shot..Name it.. This movie is destined to be a classic.. Top 5..Watch it...So anyway.. Everybody knows Sandra Bullocks is going to win the Oscar this year for this movie...
1. The Story
2. Sandra.. ( I love her! Bitch wins an Oscar! Way to go Sandra..You deserve it)
3. And most importantly...99% of all sports movies depend on athletic camera shots.. Esp. football to make it seem real.. Stone tried to do it in Any Given Sunday but everybody pretty much agrees it sucked...Remember the Titans tried to pull it off..There were some old school football movies that tried it make it look real..(with out killing someone) The Replacements..Need I say more?
This movie has the best action shots of 2 men.. In a game..Big Mike was getting his ass kicked and slowly over a period of time taking over the game..The blood and sweat you don't see on our big screens on Sunday..
This is 2 men for 60 minutes... a war..And caught on film beautifully...
Any football fan is just going to trip on how great the scenes are done in the football game.. Hey Oliver Stone..Buy a ticket to this movie and see how it's done Bitch! This is how you do a sports movie! Go and make a movie about 911 or something...
5 out of 5 stars
**--**--**

240 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:00:25pm

My main point for writing this post, by the way, is to refute the garbage that's being circulated on right wing blogs, who are almost universally trying to claim that Bedell was a left winger.

He was very obviously a right wing libertarian in every respect, and it pisses me off when these people deliberately lie and distort to try to cover up this kind of stuff.

241 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:01:23pm

re: #233 Killgore Trout

In LVQ speak, that is a non-linear system you are watching, and all those items you see falling over are called "tipping points."

242 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:01:59pm

re: #233 Killgore Trout

I sure miss her around here.
:(>

243 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:02:09pm

re: #235 jamesfirecat

Do we have some right to blame a guy if he's yelling "JUMP" through a megaphone to a guy who is contemplating suicide at the edge of a building?

Yes we do... but by the same token we should also blame the guy that says don't worry the towers will not collapse, remain at you work stations...

244 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:02:11pm

re: #230 Killgore Trout

I don't know why you keep asking this.

All I'm saying is that he had a political philosophy. We can read his writings and see that he easily fits into the category of a Ron Paul style Libertarian.

Oh for f***s sake

EVERY person in and out of prison,, EVERY person that has ever committed a felony/ misdemeanor or is squeeky clean has a political philosophy

By bringing up someones WHILE talking about a heinous act is tieing that philosophy TO the act. Own up to saying it! The way you couch it is saying it without saying it, SAY it ,, it's cathartic

Bedells "political philosophy" probably triggered this. See ,, it's easy to say!

NOW ,,, THE point is does that political philosophy lead to this. That would be a resounding NO UNLESS the person was a whack job to start with!

245 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:02:13pm

re: #230 Killgore Trout

I don't know why you keep asking this.


All I'm saying is that he had a political philosophy. We can read his writings and see that he easily fits into the category of a Ron Paul style Libertarian.

Bugs Ackly.

There are so many correlations I"ve seen it's right in tune with the Luap nor camp. Paulian stripe libertarianism is not classical Libertarianism and does have a very distinct philosophical smell. (e.g. anti abortion, pro gun, anti immigration, pro NWO kookspiracy, anti Govt) Now you can pull out one or two of those and say "that gels with Libertarianism" but several things in the Luap NOr camp are not Libertarian, like the anti abortion and trade isolationist camp, the rejection of objectivism (9/11 troofers, and NWO kookspiracism) the nativists, etc. etc.

246 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:02:30pm

re: #199 rwdflynavy

You on Chat Roulette again Cato?

I've heard about it but honestly that stuff scares the crap out of me.

247 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:03:03pm

re: #242 Rightwingconspirator

I sure miss her around here.
:(>

ditto

248 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:03:44pm

re: #235 jamesfirecat

Do we have some right to blame a guy if he's yelling "JUMP" through a megaphone to a guy who is contemplating suicide at the edge of a building?

yes. not with murder. but blame him for some fraction of it. sure.

249 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:03:45pm

re: #244 sattv4u2
Go paste a gold star by your name

250 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:04:02pm

re: #214 sattv4u2

Or are you trying to say something else

Gacy was a whack job because he was a whack job. His political fealty to the dem party was incidental

Bedell was a whack job that was pushed due to his politics!

:)

OK. So you're saying that Bedell was a product of the right. Does it follow that things would have turned out differently in any material sense were it not for the right? And if so, how do you know?

251 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:04:09pm

re: #246 Cato the Elder

I've heard about it but honestly that stuff scares the crap out of me.

You and me both.

252 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:04:18pm

Ron Paul, by the way, greatly emboldened by his straw poll win at CPAC (and the numerous panels and speeches sponsored by his kook followers), is gearing up for another big showing at the upcoming Southern Republican Leadership Conference.

[Link: washingtonindependent.com...]

253 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:04:19pm

re: #232 Aceofwhat?

What do you think of filling the 'public election fund' with taxes from private donations and private funds spent on election-related items (like advertising)?

Well, I'm not sure I get what you are asking. I thought the primary benefit of publicly funded elections was not to raise money from private sources so I don't understand what would be taxed?

Sorry this is a new area of interest for me and I'm still learning. I'm sure there are different clean election models, just trying to get in the mix.

254 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:04:41pm

re: #246 Cato the Elder

I've heard about it but honestly that stuff scares the crap out of me.

5% curiosity hounds and 95% penises. not a shocka.

255 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:04:44pm

re: #197 Cato the Elder

Shit - I keep forgetting to turn off my webcam.

Whoa.
I have a picture in my mind as to why having your webcam accidentally on would be bothering you.
Can I laugh out loud?

256 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:04:46pm

re: #235 jamesfirecat

Do we have some right to blame a guy if he's yelling "JUMP" through a megaphone to a guy who is contemplating suicide at the edge of a building?

You can blame 'him" if you want too, but if I jump because someone said JUMP the actual act of jumping is on me,, not "him"

257 pharmmajor  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:04:49pm

re: #240 Charles

My main point for writing this post, by the way, is to refute the garbage that's being circulated on right wing blogs, who are almost universally trying to claim that Bedell was a left winger.

He was very obviously a right wing libertarian in every respect, and it pisses me off when these people deliberately lie and distort to try to cover up this kind of stuff.

I'm not trying to cover it up at all. I'm sick of how everyone is trying to turn this tragedy into a game of "here's another reason why such and such party is evil". And I'm sorry to say, Charles, that from my perspective you're contributing to it. I don't know if I'm reading this wrong, but some of the phrasing I'm seeing coming up is similar to that on HuffPo, which is trying to make all libertarians out to be as extreme as whackjobs like Bedell.

258 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:04:59pm

re: #252 Charles

Ron Paul, by the way, greatly emboldened by his straw poll win at CPAC (and the numerous panels and speeches sponsored by his kook followers), is gearing up for another big showing at the upcoming Southern Republican Leadership Conference.

[Link: washingtonindependent.com...]

Think he'll get as much as 40% in the straw poll there? I think he over-estimates the value of his last "win".

259 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:05:19pm

re: #244 sattv4u2


EVERY person in and out of prison,, EVERY person that has ever committed a felony/ misdemeanor or is squeeky clean has a political philosophy


But not every crime is politically motivated. A Muslim who jaywalks is not necesarily motived by Jihad. Flying planes into buildings is a different story.

260 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:05:23pm

re: #255 reine.de.tout

Whoa.
I have a picture in my mind as to why having your webcam accidentally on would be bothering you.
Can I laugh out loud?

It rubs the lotion on its skin....

261 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:05:24pm

re: #240 Charles

My main point for writing this post, by the way, is to refute the garbage that's being circulated on right wing blogs, who are almost universally trying to claim that Bedell was a left winger.

Yes, and that sort of garbage pisses me off exactly as much as those making similar claims on the opposite end of the spectrum.

262 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:05:43pm

re: #233 Killgore Trout

One of the best videos!

263 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:06:29pm

re: #250 SixDegrees

OK. So you're saying that Bedell was a product of the right. Does it follow that things would have turned out differently in any material sense were it not for the right? And if so, how do you know?

The :) at the end of mine was supposed to indicate me answering the question you posed TO KT as KT,, see my #244 for clarification!

264 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:06:29pm

re: #256 sattv4u2

You can blame 'him" if you want too, but if I jump because someone said JUMP the actual act of jumping is on me,, not "him"

/yes but who you land on is the question :)

265 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:06:34pm

re: #238 freetoken

Or, why not just require broadcasters, who are after all using the commons of the electromagnetic spectrum, to offer without charge broadcast time to any candidate that is registered as so with their state elections commission?

that's still making them "pay" for it. if you feel broadcasters should be taxed additionally to help fill the fund, just say so.

266 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:06:35pm

re: #261 SixDegrees

Yes, and that sort of garbage pisses me off exactly as much as those making similar claims on the opposite end of the spectrum.

The difference is that calling him a "right wing libertarian" is 100% accurate.

267 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:06:59pm

re: #254 Aceofwhat?

5% curiosity hounds and 95% penises. not a shocka.

As linked above, this is John Stewerts thought.
linky

268 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:07:06pm

re: #262 Decatur Deb

One of the best videos!


It's pretty fantastic, eh? If there are edits or camera tricks they are clever about it. It looks like all one take filmed live.

269 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:07:54pm

re: #259 Killgore Trout

But not every crime is politically motivated. A Muslim who jaywalks is not necesarily motived by Jihad. Flying planes into buildings is a different story.

Good ,, now you're making progress,, SO ,, as Six has asked you ,, just SAY it ,,, Bedell was motivated BY his politics ,,, go ahead ,,,, you'll feel better ,, say it out loud without the trepidation!

270 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:07:59pm

re: #257 pharmmajor

I'm not trying to cover it up at all. I'm sick of how everyone is trying to turn this tragedy into a game of "here's another reason why such and such party is evil". And I'm sorry to say, Charles, that from my perspective you're contributing to it. I don't know if I'm reading this wrong, but some of the phrasing I'm seeing coming up is similar to that on HuffPo, which is trying to make all libertarians out to be as extreme as whackjobs like Bedell.

You have a right to your opinion but it seems like you are acting hyper defensive. Hate is a motivator in violence. If a certain philosophy increases hate against an opponent and one of it's believers acts on that hate, there may actually be a link. Not to say that there aren't just random crazy fuckers... just making the point.

271 wrenchwench  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:08:00pm

re: #252 Charles

Ron Paul, by the way, greatly emboldened by his straw poll win at CPAC (and the numerous panels and speeches sponsored by his kook followers), is gearing up for another big showing at the upcoming Southern Republican Leadership Conference.

[Link: washingtonindependent.com...]

"Deeply discounted tickets". That's how he does so well in these straw polls. The "student" registration fee at CPAC was $25.00. Regular registration was $175.00

272 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:08:12pm

re: #266 Charles

The difference is that calling him a "right wing libertarian" is 100% accurate.

We can also call him a clueless douchebag for attacking the most well defended building outside of the White house in the DC area.

273 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:08:29pm

re: #265 Aceofwhat?

that's still making them "pay" for it. if you feel broadcasters should be taxed additionally to help fill the fund, just say so.


Charge Chris Matthews double.

274 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:08:58pm

re: #230 Killgore Trout

I don't know why you keep asking this.


All I'm saying is that he had a political philosophy. We can read his writings and see that he easily fits into the category of a Ron Paul style Libertarian.

And finally, then, back to my very first question: so what? Everyone has a political philosophy. Since you answered "No" to the first two questions, we've eliminated any connection between Bedell's actions and his politics, since they cover both possible causal directions. What, then, is your point in raising Bedell's political philosophy?

275 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:09:15pm

re: #254 Aceofwhat?

Well.... yuck. Not for me. Not that curious and about as Hetero as on can get. Heh, my gay friend tells me "you are so straight, you could get a yardstick fired" This after he lived with Lady_Dragon and I for a year. Poor guy got all effed up in domestic violence. So we took him in.

276 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:09:24pm

re: #272 rwdflynavy

Marvelous.

277 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:09:36pm

re: #263 sattv4u2

The :) at the end of mine was supposed to indicate me answering the question you posed TO KT as KT,, see my #244 for clarification!

Oops, my bad. I sort of thought that might be the case. Never mind.

278 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:11:11pm

re: #265 Aceofwhat?

Since the broadcasters do not own the electromagnetic spectrum, but simply pay (in some cases not very much) for the use of said spectrum for their own use (in most cases to make a profit), I'm not asking them to "pay" anything.

Yes, they would have to pay the labor of the techs behind the scenes who are running the broadcast towers... so maybe some direct billing of labor hours for those folks should be allowed... but other than that, all I'm asking is for the broadcasters to carry out their civic duty.

279 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:11:18pm

re: #130 brookly red

all good. but since I like rock-n-roll analogies here's a quote from Jim Carroll...

Herbie pushed Tony from the Boys' Club roof
Tony thought that his rage was just some goof
But Herbie sure gave Tony some bitchen proof
Hey, Herbie said, Tony, can you fly?
But Tony couldn't fly . . . Tony died

it's like that.

Upding for the Carroll reference. That song is intense & all the more when you realize everyone of those names was someone he knew who died...

William

280 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:11:22pm

re: #277 SixDegrees

Oops, my bad. I sort of thought that might be the case. Never mind.

n/p ,, I'm urging KT to take the leap and ,,well ,, SAY IT

"Bedell did BECAUSE of his politics" ,,,

KT keeps tip toeing around saying it, by saying it without ,, well , SAYING it!

281 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:11:57pm

re: #255 reine.de.tout

have I mentioned that every time I see your name, I always misread it as reine.de.trout?

I have no idea why, but every time I see the word "tout" I always read "trout".

(Freud would have a field-day..)

282 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:12:01pm

re: #253 Locker

Well, I'm not sure I get what you are asking. I thought the primary benefit of publicly funded elections was not to raise money from private sources so I don't understand what would be taxed?

Sorry this is a new area of interest for me and I'm still learning. I'm sure there are different clean election models, just trying to get in the mix.

off the top of my head, i was trying to reconcile your idea with the First Amendment.

that led me to realize i couldn't think of a way (in ten seconds) to fully disallow all private spending on candidates' behalf.

so then i thought, why not tax the bejesus out of it and put the proceeds in the kitty. candidates can still raise money but they have to fork over $1 out of every $5 or something, so the race for dough is depressed.

the public kitty just needs to at least reach whatever magical level of saturation roughly equals a fair shot for the poorest viable candidate (aren't there studies showing that exposure beyond a certain measure is relatively ineffective?)

make sense so far? granted, this is 30 seconds of concerted effort here...

283 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:12:34pm

re: #280 sattv4u2

n/p ,, I'm urging KT to take the leap and ,,well ,, SAY IT

"Bedell did BECAUSE of his politics" ,,,

KT keeps tip toeing around saying it, by saying it without ,, well , SAYING it!

We are all going to chip in and send you to punctuation rehab, damn junkie!

284 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:12:43pm

re: #252 Charles

Ron Paul, by the way, greatly emboldened by his straw poll win at CPAC (and the numerous panels and speeches sponsored by his kook followers), is gearing up for another big showing at the upcoming Southern Republican Leadership Conference.

[Link: washingtonindependent.com...]

How emboldened was he when his colleagues in the House on both sides of the aisle were laughing their asses off and hooting at him while he launched himself head first into the kookosphere right in front of them? ;-)

285 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:13:20pm

re: #269 sattv4u2

Good ,, now you're making progress,, SO ,, as Six has asked you ,, just SAY it ,,, Bedell was motivated BY his politics ,,, go ahead ,,, you'll feel better ,, say it out loud without the trepidation!

I've said it several times. He was politically motivated, I don't think there's much doubt about it. He might have had a personal grudge against the Pentagon but I think it's far more likely that he was motivated by a political conspiracy theory.

286 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:13:24pm

re: #257 pharmmajor

read 1 through 250. all together, i'd put us slightly above the level of discourse you're seeing elsewhere...

287 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:13:25pm

re: #281 Guanxi88

have I mentioned that every time I see your name, I always misread it as reine.de.trout?

I have no idea why, but every time I see the word "tout" I always read "trout".

(Freud would have a field-day..)

Which reminds me of the pocket squeeze trout light!!!

Pocket Squeeze Trout

288 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:14:02pm

re: #266 Charles

The difference is that calling him a "right wing libertarian" is 100% accurate.

That may be. I don't, however, see it as pertinent, as noted extensively, above.

289 wrenchwench  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:14:07pm

re: #284 SixDegrees

How emboldened was he when his colleagues in the House on both sides of the aisle were laughing their asses off and hooting at him while he launched himself head first into the kookosphere right in front of them? ;-)

That's just martyr cookies to him.

290 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:14:11pm

re: #259 Killgore Trout

But not every crime is politically motivated. A Muslim who jaywalks is not necesarily motived by Jihad.

must...resist...

291 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:14:19pm

re: #279 wlewisiii

Upding for the Carroll reference. That song is intense & all the more when you realize everyone of those names was someone he knew who died...

William

Jim was an interesting guy... and just think, they didn't even have Fox back then :)

292 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:14:25pm

re: #281 Guanxi88

have I mentioned that every time I see your name, I always misread it as reine.de.trout?

I have no idea why, but every time I see the word "tout" I always read "trout".

(Freud would have a field-day..)

As long as it's clear I'm no relation to Killgore Trout

293 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:14:35pm

re: #282 Aceofwhat?

off the top of my head, i was trying to reconcile your idea with the First Amendment.

that led me to realize i couldn't think of a way (in ten seconds) to fully disallow all private spending on candidates' behalf.

so then i thought, why not tax the bejesus out of it and put the proceeds in the kitty. candidates can still raise money but they have to fork over $1 out of every $5 or something, so the race for dough is depressed.

the public kitty just needs to at least reach whatever magical level of saturation roughly equals a fair shot for the poorest viable candidate (aren't there studies showing that exposure beyond a certain measure is relatively ineffective?)

make sense so far? granted, this is 30 seconds of concerted effort here...

Yes and I was reading quickly on wikipedia after reading your posts. I now grasp the concept of the fund matching against candidates who use private funds. So you tax private fund donations which go over the public grant cap and use that money as the fund matching.

Cool.

294 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:15:00pm

re: #283 Locker

We are all going to chip in and send you to punctuation rehab, damn junkie!

,,,,why,,, ?.?.?.?

295 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:16:02pm

re: #292 reine.de.tout

As long as it's clear I'm no relation to Killgore Trout

No, whenever I read his name (and it's a synesthesia deal) I get the image of that "Killroy was here" graffiti combined with a cavalryman's hat.

For some reason, KGT's name makes me think of obsolete graffiti and Robert Duvall's hat.

296 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:16:22pm

re: #274 SixDegrees

What, then, is your point in raising Bedell's political philosophy?


Wow, are you being intentionally obtuse?
Conservatives and the Republican party should not be associating with these conspiracy theorists and should not be spreading their own conspiracies about secret progressive plots to destroy the US. It's dangerous and attracts crazy paranoid people who are likely to commit violent acts against their fellow Americans.

297 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:16:28pm

re: #294 sattv4u2

,,,why,,, ?.?.?.?

cause it ain't your fault you need the rehab cause your a victim...

298 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:16:43pm

re: #287 rwdflynavy

Which reminds me of the pocket squeeze trout light!!!

Pocket Squeeze Trout

That's revolting. I hope they kept a customer list. When the battery business goes under, there's always blackmail.

299 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:16:44pm

re: #267 rwdflynavy

As linked above, this is John Stewerts thought.
linky

tosh did it better...just my two cents...

300 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:17:03pm

re: #272 rwdflynavy

We can also call him a clueless douchebag for attacking the most well defended building outside of the White house in the DC area.

It certainly calls his ability to reason into question, doesn't it?

301 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:17:16pm

re: #298 Guanxi88

That's revolting. I hope they kept a customer list. When the battery business goes under, there's always blackmail.

No, What is revolting is that I used to have one.

302 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:17:19pm

re: #292 reine.de.tout

As long as it's clear I'm no relation to Killgore Trout

I was just going to say taht reine.de.trout would be the offspring of a mutant cross between reine.de.tout and Killgore Trout.

303 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:17:20pm

re: #292 reine.de.tout

As long as it's clear I'm no relation to Killgore Trout

nothing of the sort

304 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:17:34pm

re: #292 reine.de.tout

As long as it's clear I'm no relation to Killgore Trout

Reine de Trout! could be a funny sock puppet name.

305 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:17:36pm

re: #296 Killgore Trout

A certain distance from the insane is always politically wise. Unless you are the Tea Party.

306 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:17:39pm

re: #301 rwdflynavy

No, What is revolting is that I used to have one.

Then you're on the list for sure!

307 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:17:43pm

re: #297 brookly red

cause it ain't your fault you need the rehab cause your a victim...

will the rehab be free !?!?!?

308 Digital Display  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:18:03pm

re: #297 brookly red

cause it ain't your fault you need the rehab cause your a victim...

Hi..My Name is Tiger Woods and I have a problem..
*Hi Tiger!*

309 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:18:16pm

re: #306 Guanxi88

Then you're on the list for sure!

This isn't CCA's list is it? I don't want to be on that one!

310 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:18:22pm

re: #304 Killgore Trout

Now hang on is that a recipe in the cookbook?

311 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:18:23pm

re: #307 sattv4u2

will the rehab be free !?!?!?

Wait for the bill to finish going through reconciliation.

312 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:18:25pm

re: #278 freetoken

Since the broadcasters do not own the electromagnetic spectrum, but simply pay (in some cases not very much) for the use of said spectrum for their own use (in most cases to make a profit), I'm not asking them to "pay" anything.

Yes, they would have to pay the labor of the techs behind the scenes who are running the broadcast towers... so maybe some direct billing of labor hours for those folks should be allowed... but other than that, all I'm asking is for the broadcasters to carry out their civic duty.

using an item (broadcast time) that used to generate revenue and giving it to someone else for free costs far more than the labor required to use the item.

that's what i meant.

313 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:18:25pm

re: #295 Guanxi88

No, whenever I read his name (and it's a synesthesia deal) I get the image of that "Killroy was here" graffiti combined with a cavalryman's hat.

For some reason, KGT's name makes me think of obsolete graffiti and Robert Duvall's hat.

Ummm , you don't own any guns, do you?

314 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:19:04pm

BRB

315 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:19:28pm

re: #307 sattv4u2

will the rehab be free !?!?!?


don't worry we will take it out of your 60% tax increase... so yes, it's free!

316 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:20:35pm
Annuit cœptis! Annuit cœptis!
That's the phrase
That dismays
All the wingnuts into sepsis!

[Clown steps to blackboard, wields chalk like a mighty sword of truth, begins to speak in Kermit voice]

Two little words
On the dollar bill -
But what a world of deceit they fill.
To render those two little words
In English takes five, and nine syllables.
Five plus nine (mind the blackboard) equals fourteen.
An obvious reference to the Amendment that started all the trouble.
Good God, are you people purblind fools?
You can't have slaves be citizens in a place where majority rules.

[weeps]

I tell you, when you start to delve
There's no limit to the muck you'll find.
Of course our Founding Fathers were
The paragons of the age;
Except for the Masons among them.
Like Ethan Alien, Edmund Burke, John Claypoole, William Daws, Benjamin Franklin, John Hancock, John Paul Jones, Robert Livingston, Paul Revere, Colonel Benjamin Tupper, and George Washington.
Do I contradict myself? Very well then I contradict myself.
I am large; I contain multitudes of clowns.
Stay tuned for a word from our sponsor.
When we come back, I'll explain the Eye!

317 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:21:18pm

re: #312 Aceofwhat?

using an item (broadcast time) that used to generate revenue and giving it to someone else for free costs far more than the labor required to use the item.

that's what i meant.

True but they do sort of have a monopoly on the "public's" airwaves. Personally I think some sort of accommodation could be made since they make so much forking money on something that we all technically own.

318 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:21:23pm

re: #311 Guanxi88

Wait for the bill to finish going through reconciliation.

there is no reconciliation... suprise!

319 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:21:24pm

Speaking of TROUT ,, gotta go put my dinner in the oven

Baked Stuffed Filet of Tilapia

320 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:21:38pm

re: #255 reine.de.tout

Whoa.
I have a picture in my mind as to why having your webcam accidentally on would be bothering you.
Can I laugh out loud?

Is it of an aging guy with bed-hair and in bad need of a shave? Or something worse...?

321 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:21:52pm

re: #293 Locker

Yes and I was reading quickly on wikipedia after reading your posts. I now grasp the concept of the fund matching against candidates who use private funds. So you tax private fund donations which go over the public grant cap and use that money as the fund matching.

Cool.

and reduce the incentive to go hog-wild with private fundraising!

what other caveats do we need?

322 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:22:27pm

re: #296 Killgore Trout

Wow, are you being intentionally obtuse?
Conservatives and the Republican party should not be associating with these conspiracy theorists and should not be spreading their own conspiracies about secret progressive plots to destroy the US. It's dangerous and attracts crazy paranoid people who are likely to commit violent acts against their fellow Americans.

So what? You've already agreed that Bedell was neither a product of the right, nor representative of them; in another post, you explicitly stated that his actions weren't related to the right's ideologies, as well. Bedell's violence, in your view, was independent of his affiliations. I don't see what the right has to be concerned about if there's no apparent causal relationship between them and Bedell's actions, as you claim.

323 freetoken  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:23:02pm

re: #312 Aceofwhat?

Ok, but I guess my bigger point is that if voting is called a "civic duty" of each citizen, why shun the idea that other entities in our society, such as broadcasting companies, also have civic duties when it comes to elections?

I maintain that one of those civic duties would be for users (most of which are private corporations, but some are also public entities) of the electromagnetic spectrum to use said capability to inform (that is "inform", not proselytize a la Clear Channel) the citizenry of the options from which they have to choose on voting day.

324 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:23:03pm

re: #316 Cato the Elder

You do a great Glenn Beck

325 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:24:30pm

re: #316 Cato the Elder

Most excellent; your own work?

326 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:24:38pm

re: #198 freetoken

Perhaps the internet via cell phone has made grammar obsolete?

Not whilst I wield the Grammar Stick!

327 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:24:59pm

re: #322 SixDegrees

I don't see what the right has to be concerned about if there's no apparent causal relationship between them and Bedell's actions, as you claim.

Yet in another post he stated that he has
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

hence my (and probably your) confusion

328 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:25:08pm

re: #326 Cato the Elder

Not whilst I wield the Grammar Stick!

You might go blind...

329 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:25:51pm

re: #328 Capitalist Tool

You might go blind...

I'll stop when I hit the Coke Bottle Glasses stage!

330 Digital Display  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:26:01pm

re: #308 HoosierHoops

Hi..My Name is Tiger Woods and I have a problem..
*Hi Tiger!*

Poor Tiger.. He'll never ever own his own Blackberry again...I never thought I would ever write this..Sucks to be Tiger!
How is that Billion Dollar Estate working out for ya pal?
Call me bro! Oh wait..You can't..
Sucks to be Tiger

331 SixDegrees  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:26:02pm

re: #295 Guanxi88

No, whenever I read his name (and it's a synesthesia deal) I get the image of that "Killroy was here" graffiti combined with a cavalryman's hat.

For some reason, KGT's name makes me think of obsolete graffiti and Robert Duvall's hat.

I always think of Kurt Vonnegut.

332 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:26:16pm

re: #317 Locker

True but they do sort of have a monopoly on the "public's" airwaves. Personally I think some sort of accommodation could be made since they make so much forking money on something that we all technically own.

i understand. we're not talking a small cost, though. that's a "tax". looks like duck...quacks like duck...

perhaps taxing them is the right thing to do...but step 1 is saying calling it a duck.

333 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:26:31pm

re: #321 Aceofwhat?

and reduce the incentive to go hog-wild with private fundraising!

what other caveats do we need?

Well, it seems there have been some issues with the system not being fair to third party candidates. Personally I would love to see way more third party (or no party) candidates in the mix.

Might have something to do with the method to qualify for an election grant. The article I'm reading says:

Candidates participating in a Clean Elections system are required to meet certain qualification criteria, which usually includes collecting a number of signatures and small contributions (generally determined by statute and set at $5 in both Maine and Arizona) before the candidate can receive public support. In most Clean Elections programs, these qualifying contributions must be given by constituents.

I'm not sure how that gimps third party candidates though.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

334 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:27:48pm

re: #331 SixDegrees

I always think of Kurt Vonnegut.

I always think of Richard Brautigan

335 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:28:01pm

re: #319 sattv4u2

Speaking of TROUT ,, gotta go put my dinner in the oven

Baked Stuffed Filet of Tilapia

You do know Tilapia was a major hippie (Mother Earth News) plot in the '60s.

336 Bagua  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:28:28pm

Bring Me My Shotgun an a pocket full of shells...


- Lightnin' Hopkins
337 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:29:02pm

re: #334 Capitalist Tool

I always think of Richard Brautigan

I alway think of the girl in 3C...

338 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:29:07pm

re: #325 Thanos

Most excellent; your own work?

Aye, laddie. Forgot the copyright notice.

And annuit cœptis, the sinister phrase, means "He hath approved our undertakings."

Those Masonic founders tricked us into thinking that by "he" they meant God, but you and I know who was really intended. Baphomet. Old Scratch. The Man in the Black Poncho. The Walking Dude.

It's so easy to do Beck, it's downright scary. I could be making millions instead of scraping out a living with literary translations.

339 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:29:32pm

re: #335 Decatur Deb

You do know Tilapia was a major hippie (Mother Earth News) plot in the '60s.

used to have the first 30 or so issues of that rag...
sittin' there on that sack o' seeds

340 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:29:36pm

re: #332 Aceofwhat?

i understand. we're not talking a small cost, though. that's a "tax". looks like duck...quacks like duck...

perhaps taxing them is the right thing to do...but step 1 is saying calling it a duck.

Well, I'm not sure it is a tax, but the actual definition of tax may be escaping me. I wouldn't have a problem with donated public air time being a stipulation of a broadcast license. Is a licensing fee a tax?

Anyway yes we'd be asking for some get back on the give.

341 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:30:08pm

re: #335 Decatur Deb

You do know Tilapia was a major hippie (Mother Earth News) plot in the '60s.


hell ,, so was I ,,, but I got better!

342 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:30:19pm

re: #323 freetoken

Ok, but I guess my bigger point is that if voting is called a "civic duty" of each citizen, why shun the idea that other entities in our society, such as broadcasting companies, also have civic duties when it comes to elections?

I maintain that one of those civic duties would be for users (most of which are private corporations, but some are also public entities) of the electromagnetic spectrum to use said capability to inform (that is "inform", not proselytize a la Clear Channel) the citizenry of the options from which they have to choose on voting day.

it might be. i prefer levying it as a tax to make the costs more transparent. "free broadcast time" implies a no-cost, easy-win solution.

now i'm trying to remember if their tax structure is, indeed, different because of the public spectrum thing. do you know off the top of your head?

343 Bagua  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:31:20pm

re: #341 sattv4u2

hell ,, so was I ,,, but I got better!

Still a hippie... some things don't change.

344 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:31:40pm

re: #313 Capitalist Tool

Ummm , you don't own any guns, do you?

Well, I've got a Nagant Revolver, a mosin-nagant rfile, and an SMLE MarkIV, So I'm pretty well-equipped in the even that my house gets sucked back to WWII.

Got no ammo, though, and wouldn't fire the things - diminishes their value as antiques.

345 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:31:43pm

re: #339 Capitalist Tool

used to have the first 30 or so issues of that rag...
sittin' there on that sack o' seeds

They're still at it:

[Link: www.motherearthnews.com...]

346 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:32:13pm

re: #330 HoosierHoops

Poor Tiger.. He'll never ever own his own Blackberry again...I never thought I would ever write this..Sucks to be Tiger!
How is that Billion Dollar Estate working out for ya pal?
Call me bro! Oh wait..You can't..
Sucks to be Tiger

QUESTION ,,

I'd trade places with him

What he;s going through right now is bad ,, VERY bad ,,,, BUT ,, his bank account and talent are both in tact

SO ,,, "time heals all ,,,,,,"

347 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:32:37pm

re: #340 Locker

Well, I'm not sure it is a tax, but the actual definition of tax may be escaping me. I wouldn't have a problem with donated public air time being a stipulation of a broadcast license. Is a licensing fee a tax?

Anyway yes we'd be asking for some get back on the give.


The only problem with that is who gets to decide who is the public? Yes we already know who.

348 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:32:58pm

re: #333 Locker

I'm not sure how that gimps third party candidates though.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

ehh...i'm one who tends to be more sanguine about a two-party system than some others. ever notice that the 3rd party always seems to be the kookiest?

i think that's a symptom, not a coincidence...but i welcome debate on the topic!

349 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:32:58pm

re: #330 HoosierHoops

re: #346 sattv4u2

QUESTION ,,

I'd trade places with him

What he;s going through right now is bad ,, VERY bad ,,, BUT ,, his bank account and talent are both in tact

SO ,,, "time heals all ,,,"

OOOPSSS ,,, the QUESTION part ,, wouldn't you !?!?

350 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:33:14pm

re: #338 Cato the Elder

Aye, laddie. Forgot the copyright notice.

And annuit cœptis, the sinister phrase, means "He hath approved our undertakings."

Those Masonic founders tricked us into thinking that by "he" they meant God, but you and I know who was really intended. Baphomet. Old Scratch. The Man in the Black Poncho. The Walking Dude.

It's so easy to do Beck, it's downright scary. I could be making millions instead of scraping out a living with literary translations.

I'm telling ya' - go for it. Consider it an elaborate piece of performance art, and means of destroying the potential for mischief should these folks' money pass into hands other than your own.

351 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:34:08pm

re: #343 Bagua

Still a hippie... some things don't change.

I was too old for hippe, too young for Beat.

352 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:34:22pm

re: #344 Guanxi88

Well, I've got a Nagant Revolver, a mosin-nagant rfile, and an SMLE MarkIV, So I'm pretty well-equipped in the even that my house gets sucked back to WWII.

Got no ammo, though, and wouldn't fire the things - diminishes their value as antiques.

You need one of these.

353 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:34:55pm

re: #3 Jaerik

Charles: Are you sure that's the case? I'm in California and I distinctly remember casting a primary vote for Obama over Hillary. And before 2008, I had never registered for, or voted for, anyone with a (D) by their name in my life.

However, when I walked into the polling place, they noted I was registered independent and asked me which primary ballot I wanted to vote for. I had to say "Democrat."

It's possible I'm not remember correctly, but that would surprise me.

The 2008 Republican primary was restricted to "registered Republican voters."

Anybody with "declines to state" status was given a choice between requesting either the Democratic or American Independent Party ballot. Those were the only two options.

Guess which ballot people requested if they wanted their vote to have any impact whatsoever?

354 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:35:26pm

re: #347 brookly red

The only problem with that is who gets to decide who is the public? Yes we already know who.

I'm missing your point I think. We are talking about publicly funded elections, airtime for that purpose. So it would be "qualified candidates", whatever the process.

355 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:35:59pm

re: #352 Cato the Elder

You need one of these.


H&K, I can fault your ploitics, but not your taste...

356 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:36:03pm

Any word on whether this guy was a 9/12 member or any other popular wing-nut group that arose in the last year?

357 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:36:22pm

re: #352 Cato the Elder

You need one of these.

squeeze-cocker? I remember reading about those. Really nifty, really nifty.

I think, though, that I'm just gonna get the wife a revolver - 38, S&W make - and maybe a 20 gauge for the kitchen.

I'm kinda old-fashioned that way.

358 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:36:33pm

re: #344 Guanxi88

Well, I've got a Nagant Revolver, a mosin-nagant rfile, and an SMLE MarkIV, So I'm pretty well-equipped in the even that my house gets sucked back to WWII.

Got no ammo, though, and wouldn't fire the things - diminishes their value as antiques.

At least you can look at them in the morning and think of napalm

359 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:37:22pm

re: #348 Aceofwhat?

ehh...i'm one who tends to be more sanguine about a two-party system than some others. ever notice that the 3rd party always seems to be the kookiest?

i think that's a symptom, not a coincidence...but i welcome debate on the topic!

Hehe well I would submit that more stable folks who might otherwise form centerist third parties are currently forced into the two party system by necessity. If forming a third party was actually viable (read: electable) then I could easily see both the Democratic and Republican parties breaking down into a few sub parties.

360 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:37:22pm

re: #340 Locker

Well, I'm not sure it is a tax, but the actual definition of tax may be escaping me. I wouldn't have a problem with donated public air time being a stipulation of a broadcast license. Is a licensing fee a tax?

Anyway yes we'd be asking for some get back on the give.

bigger licensing fee works for me. i'm using 'tax' too generically, probably...i mean "transparent transfer of funds".

361 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:37:24pm

re: #358 Capitalist Tool

At least you can look at them in the morning and think of napalm

Oddly enough, the sight of them evokes a smell, but not napalm. Damned cosmoline! I got it off the weapons, but not outta my memory!

362 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:37:46pm

re: #350 Guanxi88

I'm telling ya' - go for it. Consider it an elaborate piece of performance art, and means of destroying the potential for mischief should these folks' money pass into hands other than your own.

Has Beck ever done the Masons? I'd be surprised if he didn't, eventually.

Thing is, he'd be hoist with his own petard, since Mormonism took a great deal of ritual and folderol from them. Right down to the secret handshakes.

On the other hand, I'd love to see him do it so I could mock his ass off with "The Magic Flute".

363 Digital Display  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:38:24pm

re: #346 sattv4u2

QUESTION ,,

I'd trade places with him

What he;s going through right now is bad ,, VERY bad ,,, BUT ,, his bank account and talent are both in tact

SO ,,, "time heals all ,,,"

You think this is all about a big bank account? I know you don't..
On the biggest stage in the Universe Tiger has been rendered a tragic figure for history...
No amount of money is buying a persons way out of that gate of Hell..
We may end up in Flander's fields but Tiger is on a stage...

364 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:38:25pm

re: #344 Guanxi88

Well, I've got a Nagant Revolver, a mosin-nagant rfile, and an SMLE MarkIV, So I'm pretty well-equipped in the even that my house gets sucked back to WWII.

Got no ammo, though, and wouldn't fire the things - diminishes their value as antiques.

you putting together the Call of Duty video game arsenal?

//

365 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:38:44pm

re: #354 Locker

I'm missing your point I think. We are talking about publicly funded elections, airtime for that purpose. So it would be "qualified candidates", whatever the process.

cause publicly fundend does not mean grass roots, as some a congress put you in as an earmark you are publicly funded.

366 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:38:56pm

re: #362 Cato the Elder

Has Beck ever done the Masons? I'd be surprised if he didn't, eventually.

Thing is, he'd be hoist with his own petard, since Mormonism took a great deal of ritual and folderol from them. Right down to the secret handshakes.

On the other hand, I'd love to see him do it so I could mock his ass off with "The Magic Flute".


[Video]

I bet he's steered clear of them - the Founders, whom he idolizes, were at least as masonic as the founders of LDS - but I'd put money he's taken an interest in the Jacobins and the Illuminati.

367 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:39:09pm

re: #357 Guanxi88

squeeze-cocker? I remember reading about those. Really nifty, really nifty.

I think, though, that I'm just gonna get the wife a revolver - 38, S&W make - and maybe a 20 gauge for the kitchen.

I'm kinda old-fashioned that way.

Kimber 1911 all the way.

368 solomonpanting  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:39:48pm

re: #346 sattv4u2

SO ,,, "time heals all ,,,"

And sometimes, time wounds all heels.

369 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:39:50pm

re: #344 Guanxi88

Well, I've got a Nagant Revolver, a mosin-nagant rfile, and an SMLE MarkIV, So I'm pretty well-equipped in the even that my house gets sucked back to WWII.

Got no ammo, though, and wouldn't fire the things - diminishes their value as antiques.

This is my favorite baby... I just like its weight and feel. And I've used it for deer hunting with some success in the past.

370 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:39:51pm

re: #364 Aceofwhat?

you putting together the Call of Duty video game arsenal?

//

Had those for some time. The Nagant was a "trophy" of the end of the cold war, when they, like the rifle, flooded the market. The SMLE I got from my grandfather, although how he came to have it, I have no clue.

371 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:40:08pm

re: #360 Aceofwhat?

bigger licensing fee works for me. i'm using 'tax' too generically, probably...i mean "transparent transfer of funds".

I googled that
It came up as "GOVERNMENT PERSON TAKES MONEY FROM ME TO USE WHERE THEY NEED IT"

372 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:40:32pm

re: #355 brookly red

H&K, I can fault your ploitics, but not your taste...

It's my prize piece. The squeeze-cocker alone is worth the high price of admission.

Unique among guns. You have to firmly squeeze the grip to fire. Even if a thug gets it away from you, chances are the worst he can do is throw it at you. Which means you can safely carry with a round in the chamber at all times.

373 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:40:34pm

re: #358 Capitalist Tool

At least you can look at them in the morning and think of napalm

Cosmoline- you must have some cherry specimens, then.

374 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:40:37pm

re: #367 Locker

Kimber 1911 all the way.

What am I, Rockefeller? Beautiful weapons, and a proven design, but for pity's sake, man, the cost!

375 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:41:22pm

re: #365 brookly red

cause publicly fundend does not mean grass roots, as some a congress put you in as an earmark you are publicly funded.

This is the "publicly funded" that I'm speaking about:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

not sure how congress and earmarks fit in. Sorry I'm not trying to be obtuse.

376 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:41:29pm

re: #363 HoosierHoops

You think this is all about a big bank account? I know you don't..
On the biggest stage in the Universe Tiger has been rendered a tragic figure for history...
No amount of money is buying a persons way out of that gate of Hell..
We may end up in Flander's fields but Tiger is on a stage...

Talk to me in three years when he's surpassed Jacks Grand Slam titles record

377 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:41:40pm

re: #357 Guanxi88

squeeze-cocker? I remember reading about those. Really nifty, really nifty.

I think, though, that I'm just gonna get the wife a revolver - 38, S&W make - and maybe a 20 gauge for the kitchen.

I'm kinda old-fashioned that way.

If you go the revolver route, check out S&W's new ultra-light scandium models with the built-in ambidextrous laser sights.

378 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:41:44pm

re: #369 darthstar

This is my favorite baby... I just like its weight and feel. And I've used it for deer hunting with some success in the past.

Nothing wrong with a levergun. I've toyed with the idea of getting one of those marlins in 357 or even 44 or 45, but am too cheap a bastard to go about getting one.

379 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:41:58pm

re: #359 Locker

Hehe well I would submit that more stable folks who might otherwise form centerist third parties are currently forced into the two party system by necessity. If forming a third party was actually viable (read: electable) then I could easily see both the Democratic and Republican parties breaking down into a few sub parties.

well...i'd submit that squeezing folks through the necessity of two parties helps to funnel out the luap nor's...

380 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:42:18pm

re: #372 Cato the Elder

It's my prize piece. The squeeze-cocker alone is worth the high price of admission.

Unique among guns. You have to firmly squeeze the grip to fire. Even if a thug gets it away from you, chances are the worst he can do is throw it at you. Which means you can safely carry with a round in the chamber at all times.

well just don't stick it your pants anyway...

381 JCW  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:42:23pm

Based upon reporting, it is becoming clear that Bedell was not tied to a particular violent organization, thus his specific political views become non-essential. However, LGF has effectively made the case that Bedell was a Libertarian.

Much more interesting than his politics is that his articulation of his political views demonstrates 1) Rationalism in his method of thinking, and 2) Pragmatism in his perspective on morality; in effect, that his thinking was disconnected from Reality and his actions were subjectively driven by his whims and emotions.

In his case, these two observations reflect his history of mental disorder, which appears much more germane than his political reflections.

Given that bipolar disorder can in extreme cases cause delusions and hallucinations, and possibly require involuntary commitment to protect the patient and others, the much more relevant question is why was he unsupervised?

Are there legal changes needed so that his mother could have authorized his involuntary commitment when he was pulled over by a police officer and acting strange?

How was he able to get legal access to medical marijuana for insomnia, when his mental health provider stated that that would aggravate his bipolar disorder?

Given his mental health history, how was he able to get access to guns?

Given his recent contacts with police, why wasn’t his mental state relevant to extending his detention?

382 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:42:51pm

re: #369 darthstar

Caliber?

383 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:42:59pm

re: #377 Cato the Elder

If you go the revolver route, check out S&W's new ultra-light scandium models with the built-in ambidextrous laser sights.

Geez! Scandium? lasers?

I want blued steel, fixed sights, etc. Have you priced out those things? Better'n a thousand new!

Hell, I won't spend much more than that on my first car!

384 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:43:10pm

re: #361 Guanxi88

Oddly enough, the sight of them evokes a smell, but not napalm. Damned cosmoline! I got it off the weapons, but not outta my memory!

*** So, cosmoline- they must be like new***


sorry

385 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:43:15pm

re: #374 Guanxi88

What am I, Rockefeller? Beautiful weapons, and a proven design, but for pity's sake, man, the cost!

I'm a gun slut. What can I say it's a gorgeous piece of weaponry.

386 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:43:35pm

re: #377 Cato the Elder

If you go the revolver route, check out S&W's new ultra-light scandium models with the built-in ambidextrous laser sights.

Friend just bought one- it is trick

387 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:43:38pm

re: #365 brookly red

cause publicly fundend does not mean grass roots, as some a congress put you in as an earmark you are publicly funded.

*signals barkeep*

i'll have what he's having/

388 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:43:45pm

re: #373 Capitalist Tool

Cosmoline- you must have some cherry specimens, then.

The revolver and the M-N; the smle was just kept clean and oiled by Pa, who never fired it, so far as I know.

389 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:44:11pm

re: #375 Locker

This is the "publicly funded" that I'm speaking about:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

not sure how congress and earmarks fit in. Sorry I'm not trying to be obtuse.

OK, I didn't want to go there but ACORN. It could also be another group depending on who is in poweer.

390 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:44:36pm

re: #378 Guanxi88

Nothing wrong with a levergun. I've toyed with the idea of getting one of those marlins in 357 or even 44 or 45, but am too cheap a bastard to go about getting one.

Part of the reason I bought it was that it was only 200 bucks at the time. And growing up in cowboy country, it was a popular gun amongst my buddies. Plus, the thing held eleven rounds, so I didn't need to carry a lot of extra ammunition on a hunt.

391 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:45:04pm

And yes, it's a .44-40

392 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:45:20pm

re: #381 JCW

already exists. google "baker act".

393 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:45:26pm

re: #382 Cato the Elder

Caliber?

Sorry....44-40

394 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:45:30pm

re: #390 darthstar

Part of the reason I bought it was that it was only 200 bucks at the time. And growing up in cowboy country, it was a popular gun amongst my buddies. Plus, the thing held eleven rounds, so I didn't need to carry a lot of extra ammunition on a hunt.

Got a good price on it. Here in Austin, you'd be looking at around $300 or so for a marlin 336 (the 30-30). Lotta cowboy shooting enthusiasts, I guess.....

395 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:45:41pm

re: #379 Aceofwhat?

well...i'd submit that squeezing folks through the necessity of two parties helps to funnel out the luap nor's...

You don't even want to know the amount of crazy shit that came up when you forced me to google luap nor. Bastard!

396 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:45:47pm

re: #361 Guanxi88

Oddly enough, the sight of them evokes a smell, but not napalm. Damned cosmoline! I got it off the weapons, but not outta my memory!

I ordered a layshaft for my old LandRover from an x-MOD supplier in England. It looked like a loaf of tar when it got here. Took forever to get it off, even using gasoline (petrol).

397 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:45:58pm

re: #393 darthstar

Sorry...44-40

Holy moly! That's a beaut and a beast! Got a wheelgun to go with?

398 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:46:17pm

re: #388 Guanxi88

The revolver and the M-N; the smle was just kept clean and oiled by Pa, who never fired it, so far as I know.

When my dear friend Moses died in 1999, he left me his Moisin-Nagant (Tsarist model) and a bunch of lesser beauties. His family proceeded to disregard his will and sold them because they don't like guns.

Yeah, like selling them solves that problem.

399 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:46:28pm

re: #394 Guanxi88

Got a good price on it. Here in Austin, you'd be looking at around $300 or so for a marlin 336 (the 30-30). Lotta cowboy shooting enthusiasts, I guess...

Well, it was twenty years ago when I bought it.

400 Capitalist Tool  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:46:44pm

re: #394 Guanxi88

Got a good price on it. Here in Austin, you'd be looking at around $300 or so for a marlin 336 (the 30-30). Lotta cowboy shooting enthusiasts, I guess...

What are Winchester .30-30s worth down there?

401 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:46:59pm

re: #397 Guanxi88

Holy moly! That's a beaut and a beast! Got a wheelgun to go with?

It makes a loud noise when you fire it, but it kicks like a .22.

402 Digital Display  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:47:00pm

re: #376 sattv4u2

Talk to me in three years when he's surpassed Jacks Grand Slam titles record

Hold on there..Did I say anything about that? Records? Hell Tiger is the greatest golfer of all time...
He has become a tragic figure in sports Satt..
*wink*

403 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:47:31pm

re: #399 darthstar

Well, it was twenty years ago when I bought it.

I'd keep a death-grip on it, 'cause the older ones are worth more than the newer ones (Older ones, for those who don't know, don't have stupid safeties on them, have better build quality, and have been "slicked up" by use.)

404 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:47:35pm

re: #400 Capitalist Tool

What are Winchester .30-30s worth down there?

depends... how bad do you need it?

405 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:47:58pm

re: #397 Guanxi88

Holy moly! That's a beaut and a beast! Got a wheelgun to go with?

I've got a levergun to go with my .357 magnum S&W. Nothing like interchangeable ammo.

406 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:48:02pm

re: #400 Capitalist Tool

What are Winchester .30-30s worth down there?

Brand new in box? Around $250 for beech stock; add 50 to 75 for walnut.

407 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:48:33pm

re: #405 Cato the Elder

I've got a levergun to go with my .357 magnum S&W. Nothing like interchangeable ammo.

Wise man, sir, proven in this as in many other ways.

357 outta a rifle's a wondrous thing.

408 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:49:38pm

re: #385 Locker

I'm a gun slut. What can I say it's a gorgeous piece of weaponry.

I hear you, but I like the Sig Sauers; solid, utilitarian, a touch expensive but not too bad considering the made by German elves factor, plus de-cocking levers rock and handgun safeties annoy me.

409 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:49:45pm

re: #381 JCW

Do you still categorize his actions as being against 'injustice'?

410 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:49:51pm

I hope Charles doesn't mind a thread about a crazee shooter turning into a gunfest.

Ah, hell. I bet he's looking at the pictures and thinking, what a classy bunch.

411 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:50:17pm

re: #389 brookly red

OK, I didn't want to go there but ACORN. It could also be another group depending on who is in poweer.

What does ACORN getting screwed by congress have to do with publicly funded elections?

412 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:50:17pm

re: #407 Guanxi88

Wise man, sir, proven in this as in many other ways.

357 outta a rifle's a wondrous thing.


Guns are like pets... yours are better than anyone else's. Period.

413 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:51:06pm

re: #412 brookly red

Guns are like pets... yours are better than anyone else's. Period.

I dunno - i'd trade our dog in a heartbeat

414 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:51:15pm

re: #310 Rightwingconspirator

Now hang on is that a recipe in the cookbook?

Oh, that would be too funny!

415 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:51:41pm

re: #414 reine.de.tout

Oh, that would be too funny!

Oh, hell, I'm wayyyyy behind!

416 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:51:44pm

re: #383 Guanxi88

Geez! Scandium? lasers?

I want blued steel, fixed sights, etc. Have you priced out those things? Better'n a thousand new!

Hell, I won't spend much more than that on my first car!

I thought it was for your wife, silly man.

The scandium models are perfect purse guns.

417 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:52:52pm

re: #416 Cato the Elder

I thought it was for your wife, silly man.

The scandium models are perfect purse guns.

OOH! She's nowhere near ready to CCW. I'm thinking something for last-ditch, already-called-911 on the cell phone and the sob's in the house use.

never for outdoors.

418 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:52:59pm

I've also got a 1942 Springfield .30-06 with Lyman peep sights on it (never wanted a scope as I didn't think it helped with brush hunting). My dad, retired now, had a patient who was a gun maker. The gun used to belong to my grandfather, and my dad took me to this guy's house when I was about 17 and the guy had a barn with drills for barrelling, and he took me out back where he had a stack of axels from old Model T cars...kind of rusty, but thick. he said, "Pick one."
I did.
Three months later, that axel was my new barrel. I would have loved to have been in that old guy's will. He had probably 500 guns mounted on the walls in his small (900-1000 sq ft) house. Floor to ceiling. He showed me the gun he made for a safari in the 50s, with which he bagged an elephant. He showed me his first gun (a four-barrel .16 guage shot-gun he used for poaching geese as a kid...crudely made, and freakin' heavy. Said he set the butt on the ground and just pulled the trigger).

419 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:53:00pm

re: #411 Locker

What does ACORN getting screwed by congress have to do with publicly funded elections?

elections? I thought we were talking air time... my bad.

420 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:53:00pm

re: #295 Guanxi88

No, whenever I read his name (and it's a synesthesia deal) I get the image of that "Killroy was here" graffiti combined with a cavalryman's hat.

For some reason, KGT's name makes me think of obsolete graffiti and Robert Duvall's hat.

I'm sure we could get some real laughs if we told each other about images we see and connections we make from a name or avatar. Or from the personality that comes across in writing. The physical person that represents each of you has started to form in my mind. When I was very new here (I'm nearly a year and a half--but not solid) I paid more attention to what was said and could barely keep up with who said it. Now a bit of familiarity is setting in, so it isn't such a nebulous mix of names and posts.

421 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:53:11pm

re: #322 SixDegrees

Bedell's violence, in your view, was independent of his affiliations.


Uhhhh...no. I never said that. I think my posts have been pretty clear. I suspect you're being intentionally obtuse. I really don't get what you're trying to do other than waste my time.

422 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:53:49pm

re: #416 Cato the Elder

I thought it was for your wife, silly man.

The scandium models are perfect purse guns.

The phrase "purse gun" makes me uneasy. So does the term "Maternity Battle Dress Uniform". It is an item of issue.

423 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:53:52pm

re: #419 brookly red

elections? I thought we were talking air time... my bad.

We were talking about air time to be used for elections. Sorry man I was trying to communicate that but I probably fucked it up.

424 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:54:35pm

re: #338 Cato the Elder

Aye, laddie. Forgot the copyright notice.

And annuit cœptis, the sinister phrase, means "He hath approved our undertakings."

Those Masonic founders tricked us into thinking that by "he" they meant God, but you and I know who was really intended. Baphomet. Old Scratch. The Man in the Black Poncho. The Walking Dude.

It's so easy to do Beck, it's downright scary. I could be making millions instead of scraping out a living with literary translations.

Sorry for the late reply -- but extra updings for good creative effort.

425 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:54:38pm

re: #418 darthstar

I've also got a 1942 Springfield .30-06 with Lyman peep sights on it ...

Me too!

426 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:55:00pm

re: #356 darthstar

Any word on whether this guy was a 9/12 member or any other popular wing-nut group that arose in the last year?

His only known affiliation is that he had an email address with the Misses Institute. Not sure what his official relationship he had with them.

427 wrenchwench  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:55:13pm

re: #415 reine.de.tout

Oh, hell, I'm wayyy behind!

Every time I've sat before the computer today, the button under the last comment has said "new comments (99)" or "new comments (235)" or something in between.

428 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:55:14pm

re: #423 Locker

We were talking about air time to be used for elections. Sorry man I was trying to communicate that but I probably fucked it up.

all good.

429 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:55:20pm

re: #416 Cato the Elder

I thought it was for your wife, silly man.

The scandium models are perfect purse guns.

My dear mother kept a beretta 32 acp in her purse, and a beretta 92 (full-size) in the glovebox. Never liked autoloaders, myself.

430 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:55:46pm

re: #421 Killgore Trout

Uhhh...no. I never said that. I think my posts have been pretty clear. I suspect you're being intentionally obtuse. I really don't get what you're trying to do other than waste my time.

You say that like ya got other stuff to do! !?!?!
/

Point was, I even commented that it seemed as if you were couching your responses, as I pointed out to you. It wasn't just me, I see

431 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:56:28pm

re: #422 Decatur Deb

The phrase "purse gun" makes me uneasy. So does the term "Maternity Battle Dress Uniform". It is an item of issue.

That phrase "purse gun" makes me think of this:

I was coming home from this rodeo
in Dallas with a girlfriend...

...and two men started to hassle us
and wouldn't let up.

I was gonna be big
because I had a gun.

So I reached to get my gun, and
I shot a hole clean through my purse.

432 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:56:40pm

re: #417 Guanxi88

OOH! She's nowhere near ready to CCW. I'm thinking something for last-ditch, already-called-911 on the cell phone and the sob's in the house use.

never for outdoors.

Ah.

Then go for a nice used S&W .357. If the kick is too much, it'll take .38 too.

I always find it ironic that S&W is still manufacturing in Massachusetts, the most anti-gun state in the Union. You now need a permit there just to buy ammo.

433 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:56:42pm

re: #420 Silvergirl

i can't wait for a go-round of how our personalities all come across in writing. that'd be fascinating. (with gin)

434 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:56:55pm

re: #426 Killgore Trout

His only known affiliation is that he had an email address with the Misses Institute. Not sure what his official relationship he had with them.

Thanks...I'm hoping one of these cocksuckers brings Glenn Beck down by association(or forces Fox to get rid of him altogether) before too many more of these killing sprees happen. I think he foments this madness with his shows.

435 wrenchwench  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:56:59pm

re: #426 Killgore Trout

...Misses Institute...

That one too?!? I only saw about the Mises Institute!

//

436 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:57:28pm

re: #435 wrenchwench

That one too?!? I only saw about the Mises Institute!

//

Ha!

437 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:57:44pm

re: #418 darthstar

Lizards never cease to surprise. I would have figured you for a "guns kill people" kind of guy.

Word to the wise, Cato: live and learn.

438 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:58:00pm

re: #432 Cato the Elder

Ah.

Then go for a nice used S&W .357. If the kick is too much, it'll take .38 too.

I always find it ironic that S&W is still manufacturing in Massachusetts, the most anti-gun state in the Union. You now need a permit there just to buy ammo.

Yep - nice wheelgun, 357, but loaded with 38 spl. And at least they're still American-made; somehow, I feel a bit better about paying more if it is (or was) made in the USA.

439 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:58:06pm

re: #435 wrenchwench

That one too?!? I only saw about the Mises Institute!

//

MisSed ,,, by that much

(channeling Maxwell Smart!)

440 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:58:08pm

re: #426 Killgore Trout

His only known affiliation is that he had an email address with the Misses Institute. Not sure what his official relationship he had with them.

well that's different. i want to be affiliated with the Misses institute too...

441 spare o'lake  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:58:16pm

Driving by.
Romney is peddling his new book on Wolf Blitzer.
He certainly presents himself well.
He says Obama has been too soft and apologetic to the rest of the world at a time when the world is looking to America for leadership.
He attributes America's increase in international popularity on its recent weakness...we're weak so they hate us less.
He thinks Sarah Palin is qualified to be President.
....Beeeeep!

442 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:58:19pm

re: #431 Locker

Or this

443 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:58:30pm

re: #420 Silvergirl

I post my picture for everyone to see. There is nothing to imagine.

444 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:59:23pm

re: #443 Cato the Elder

I post my picture for everyone to see. There is nothing to imagine.

Me too.

445 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 4:59:29pm

re: #427 wrenchwench

Every time I've sat before the computer today, the button under the last comment has said "new comments (99)" or "new comments (235)" or something in between.

"work from home" today only ended up resulting in one of those two things for me...sorry...

446 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:00:00pm

Ahhhh a gun thread... it has been a while.

447 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:00:20pm

re: #437 Cato the Elder

Lizards never cease to surprise. I would have figured you for a "guns kill people" kind of guy.

Word to the wise, Cato: live and learn.

I grew up in rural Northern California. First job: Running steers for a team-roping arena. Second job: cleaning horse stalls. Favorite job: the few years I spent working for a bee-keeper. I grew up believing deer season was any time nobody was around to see...and yes, we ate everything we killed.

Of course, I turned into a tree-hugging liberal in college, but I still know where I came from.

And guns don't kill people. Assholes kill people (sometimes with guns).

448 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:00:51pm

re: #426 Killgore Trout

His only known affiliation is that he had an email address with the Misses Institute. Not sure what his official relationship he had with them.

Poor Ludwig von Mises. He was really a great economist - disagree with him though you may. To have his name tarred with the thoughts and deeds of these idiots is almost more than I can bear.

449 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:00:53pm

re: #434 darthstar

Thanks...I'm hoping one of these cocksuckers brings Glenn Beck down by association(or forces Fox to get rid of him altogether) before too many more of these killing sprees happen. I think he foments this madness with his shows.

It would take more than something like this. Remember the guy in Philadelphia who shot a few cops because he thought they were going to confiscate all the guns? He posted a few Glenn Beck videos on the web and was probably a regular viewer. These smaller incidents won't make a difference. Eventually somebody will pull off something bigger and more spectacular. It's only a matter of time.

450 Jaerik  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:01:00pm

re: #47 RadicalModerate

Well, if there was any doubt, it's now official.

Victoria Jackson has lost her fucking mind.

During the election, she was on record as saying: "I don't want a political label, but Obama bears traits that resemble the anti-Christ, and I'm scared to death that uneducated people will ignorantly vote him into office."

Coming as a surprise to absolutely no one, she's also a semi-permanent speaker at Southern California Tea Parties.

451 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:01:18pm

re: #437 Cato the Elder

Lizards never cease to surprise. I would have figured you for a "guns kill people" kind of guy.

Word to the wise, Cato: live and learn.

all skiiers have redeemable qualities. including being skiiers.

452 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:01:18pm

re: #446 brookly red

Ahhh a gun thread... it has been a while.

And a great way for lizard bonding! Turns out, many of our leftist and leftish lizards are freakin' gun-nuts, same as the righties!

Good times.

453 spare o'lake  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:01:41pm

re: #420 Silvergirl

I'm sure we could get some real laughs if we told each other about images we see and connections we make from a name or avatar. Or from the personality that comes across in writing. The physical person that represents each of you has started to form in my mind. When I was very new here (I'm nearly a year and a half--but not solid) I paid more attention to what was said and could barely keep up with who said it. Now a bit of familiarity is setting in, so it isn't such a nebulous mix of names and posts.

Everything looks worse in black and white...

454 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:01:56pm

re: #441 spare o'lake

Driving by.
Romney is peddling his new book on Wolf Blitzer.
He certainly presents himself well.
He says Obama has been too soft and apologetic to the rest of the world at a time when the world is looking to America for leadership.
He attributes America's increase in international popularity on its recent weakness...we're weak so they hate us less.
He thinks Sarah Palin is qualified to be President.
...Beeep!

Why did Romney write a book on Wolf Blitzer?

I knew what you meant--just felt like being goofy.

455 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:02:11pm

re: #447 darthstar

I grew up in rural Northern California. First job: Running steers for a team-roping arena. Second job: cleaning horse stalls. Favorite job: the few years I spent working for a bee-keeper. I grew up believing deer season was any time nobody was around to see...and yes, we ate everything we killed.

Of course, I turned into a tree-hugging liberal in college, but I still know where I came from.

And guns don't kill people. Assholes kill people (sometimes with guns).

My compliments (although you've probably already seen it).

456 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:02:25pm

re: #453 spare o'lake

Everything looks worse in black and white...

Kodachrome!

457 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:02:45pm

re: #448 Cato the Elder

Poor Ludwig von Mises. He was really a great economist - disagree with him though you may. To have his name tarred with the thoughts and deeds of these idiots is almost more than I can bear.

Yeah, I read up on him earlier today. He might be right or wrong about economics but he seemed like a decent sort of guy. The cult of cranks who idolize him are a different matter.

458 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:02:56pm

re: #453 spare o'lake

Everything looks worse in black and white...

Updinged for Garfunkel. Never cared for Simon all that much. :)

459 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:03:31pm

re: #454 Silvergirl

Why did Romney write a book on Wolf Blitzer?

I knew what you meant--just felt like being goofy.

I know ,,,, he COULD have written it on a computer or a typewriter or on a piece of paper ,,, but on a Wolf Blitzer !?!?!?

460 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:03:40pm

re: #444 Locker

Me too.

me too

461 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:04:12pm

re: #453 spare o'lake

Everything looks worse in black and white...

Koda-chro-o-ome!

462 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:04:23pm

re: #452 Guanxi88

And a great way for lizard bonding! Turns out, many of our leftist and leftish lizards are freakin' gun-nuts, same as the righties!

Good times.

.357, .38, 12ga. I don't hunt.

463 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:04:23pm

re: #452 Guanxi88

And a great way for lizard bonding! Turns out, many of our leftist and leftish lizards are freakin' gun-nuts, same as the righties!

Good times.

I feel better already... so much that I apologize to every one I have called asshole lately.

464 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:04:29pm

re: #455 Locker

My compliments (although you've probably already seen it).

Heh...I still love this earthquake story from the Chronicle...only in California (this was a week after Haiti)

465 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:04:35pm

re: #461 Silvergirl

Koda-chro-o-ome!

makes you think all the world's a sunny day, oh yeah.

466 The Shadow Do  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:05:06pm

On the topic du jour:

This cat was Ron Paul with a weapon.

Republicans have been courting these fools right along with the religious zealots - using political expediency as their guide.

Psyco killers from both groups are being regularly defended. Disgusting.

If you are a Losertarian or a Dobson dope, please get the hell out of my party.

467 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:05:11pm

re: #463 brookly red

I feel better already... so much that I apologize to every one I have called asshole lately.

you're not just saying that cause we're all holding weapons, are ya?

ARE YA?

468 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:05:40pm

re: #462 Decatur Deb

.357, .38, 12ga. I don't hunt.

Nor should you, with those calibres (well, maybe the shotty, maybe).

Good on ya!

469 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:05:45pm

re: #464 darthstar

Heh...I still love this earthquake story from the Chronicle...only in California (this was a week after Haiti)

That is a flipping tragedy I'll tell you....

470 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:05:47pm

re: #452 Guanxi88

And a great way for lizard bonding! Turns out, many of our leftist and leftish lizards are freakin' gun-nuts, same as the righties!

Good times.

Not a gun nut...just someone who appreciates a fine firearm. By the way, there's a group at DailyKos that is dedicated to the right to bear arms.

471 brookly red  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:06:19pm

re: #467 Guanxi88

you're not just saying that cause we're all holding weapons, are ya?

ARE YA?

/peace in the valley :)

472 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:06:44pm

re: #470 darthstar

Not a gun nut...just someone who appreciates a fine firearm. By the way, there's a group at DailyKos that is dedicated to the right to bear arms.

I've seen 'em, and read their stuff.

Frankly, the more normal, law-abiding folks (left/right, men/women, gay/straight) we can have armed, the better.

473 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:07:17pm

omigosh.... Andy Pratt live in 2009


474 The Shadow Do  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:07:42pm

re: #156 darthstar

Not a gun nut...just someone who appreciates a fine firearm. By the way, there's a group at DailyKos that is dedicated to the right to bear arms.

Lots of them I bet. they meet on Tuesdays at the corner booth at Denny's I hear.

475 spare o'lake  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:07:48pm

re: #458 darthstar

Updinged for Garfunkel. Never cared for Simon all that much. :)

I have little use for either one without the other. But when they were together...SHEER MAGIC!

476 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:08:51pm

re: #447 darthstar

I grew up in rural Northern California. First job: Running steers for a team-roping arena. Second job: cleaning horse stalls. Favorite job: the few years I spent working for a bee-keeper. I grew up believing deer season was any time nobody was around to see...and yes, we ate everything we killed.

Of course, I turned into a tree-hugging liberal in college, but I still know where I came from.

And guns don't kill people. Assholes kill people (sometimes with guns).

Oh. Beekeeping.

Sad story from my past:

In the last year of my German incarnation, I lived in a high-rise on the ninth floor. Got to know a beekeeper one floor down.

He was the sweetest guy. Had a picture of his little niece, Arwen, on the dresser in the hallway. She was so beautiful it took my breath away. And she looked much more like I imagine Arwen in the books than Liv Tyler.

Thing was, he was in a wheelchair. Motorcycle accident. He couldn't work in his profession anymore, and he was severely depressed.

Soon after I moved back to the States, I found out he threw himself off the balcony.

Still reproach myself for not spending more time with him. He was cool.

477 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:09:12pm

I love the "gunshy lefty" meme. Tactical advantage.

478 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:09:44pm

re: #475 spare o'lake

I have little use for either one without the other. But when they were together...SHEER MAGIC!

I feel the same way about David Lee Roth and the rest of Van Halen. Once again that inspires me to quote:

Chazz: Okay, lemme ask you a question: who's side did you take in the big David Lee Roth-Van Halen split?
Chris Moore: What?
Marcus: What kind of question is that?
Chazz: Who's side did you take: Halen or Roth?
Chris Moore: ...Van Halen
Ian: He's a cop (nodding)

479 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:11:04pm

re: #457 Killgore Trout

Yeah, I read up on him earlier today. He might be right or wrong about economics but he seemed like a decent sort of guy. The cult of cranks who idolize him are a different matter.

I'm positive Medaura would agree. She thinks a lot of him.

Where, oh where, art thou, Medaura?

480 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:11:19pm

re: #474 The Shadow Do

Lots of them I bet. they meet on Tuesdays at the corner booth at Denny's I hear.

Once ,, just to show how really out of control they are ,,,they ordered a side of bacon!!

481 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:12:08pm

re: #476 Cato the Elder


Sad sad.

482 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:13:00pm

re: #477 Decatur Deb

I love the "gunshy lefty" meme. Tactical advantage.

We were a family of hyper-educated Hebrews from old Jewbilly stock. Shocked the hell outta people to imagine that folks with yiddish names could out-shoot, out-drink, and out-feud the Scots-Irish around us.

483 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:13:31pm

re: #447 darthstar

re: #476 Cato the Elder

Recommend "Ulee's Gold" if you haven't seen it. Peter Fonda as a Tupelo honey beekeeper. It's part of a cycle set in the Gulf Coast near here, with "Ruby in Paradise".

485 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:14:02pm

re: #420 Silvergirl

I'm sure we could get some real laughs if we told each other about images we see and connections we make from a name or avatar. Or from the personality that comes across in writing. The physical person that represents each of you has started to form in my mind. When I was very new here (I'm nearly a year and a half--but not solid) I paid more attention to what was said and could barely keep up with who said it. Now a bit of familiarity is setting in, so it isn't such a nebulous mix of names and posts.

so who broadcasts the strongest or oddest visual image through their writing so far? i'm oh so curious!

486 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:14:35pm

re: #483 Decatur Deb

re: #476 Cato the Elder

Recommend "Ulee's Gold" if you haven't seen it. Peter Fonda as a Tupelo honey beekeeper. It's part of a cycle set in the Gulf Coast near here, with "Ruby in Paradise".

Ruby in Paradise and Ulee's Gold are two films I absolutely loved.

487 The Shadow Do  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:14:44pm

re: #166 sattv4u2

Once ,, just to show how really out of control they are ,,,they ordered a side of bacon!!

OMG

See, see how they are!

488 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:14:53pm

re: #477 Decatur Deb

I love the "gunshy lefty" meme. Tactical advantage.

My grandfather raised his kids to shoot straight and fast and first. Unconventional behavior for a jew, or so folk by us thought. There was, in fact, a rumor to the effect that whereas he was an American, his kids had been raised in israel. A compliment to all involved.

489 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:16:23pm

re: #482 Guanxi88

We were a family of hyper-educated Hebrews from old Jewbilly stock. Shocked the hell outta people to imagine that folks with yiddish names could out-shoot, out-drink, and out-feud the Scots-Irish around us.

Guess they never heard of the Golani.

490 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:16:48pm

re: #485 Aceofwhat?

so who broadcasts the strongest or oddest visual image through their writing so far? i'm oh so curious!

My vote, hands down, in SpaceJesus. Somehow, get a scent of patchouli, drum halfzware, and burnt coffee as a background to uproarious laughter.

491 spare o'lake  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:16:59pm

re: #476 Cato the Elder

Cato, that is a very sad and human German story.
I hardly ever hear any really sad and human German stories.

492 Lidane  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:17:06pm

re: #472 Guanxi88

Frankly, the more normal, law-abiding folks (left/right, men/women, gay/straight) we can have armed, the better.

I've often thought of taking gun safety courses and learning how to shoot. I've had friends and family offer to teach me, too.

I figure the last time I fired a gun was when I was a kid shooting cans off a fencepost. Haven't touched a gun since. Maybe I should again, just to know how.

493 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:17:41pm

re: #489 Decatur Deb

Guess they never heard of the Golani.

"They Eye-talians, are they? Lotta them Eye-talians up around Pittsburgh."

494 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:18:02pm

re: #490 Guanxi88

My vote, hands down, in SpaceJesus. Somehow, get a scent of patchouli, drum halfzware, and burnt coffee as a background to uproarious laughter.

I get a scent of a split personality.
Or two distinct people.

495 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:18:03pm

re: #490 Guanxi88

My vote, hands down, in SpaceJesus. Somehow, get a scent of patchouli, drum halfzware, and burnt coffee as a background to uproarious laughter.

I hate to tell you this man but I constantly misread your handle as Giuliani88. I know, not even close but it's a word replacement hiccup. No offense.

496 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:18:18pm

re: #492 Lidane

I've often thought of taking gun safety courses and learning how to shoot. I've had friends and family offer to teach me, too.

I figure the last time I fired a gun was when I was a kid shooting cans off a fencepost. Haven't touched a gun since. Maybe I should again, just to know how.

Go down to Red's Indoor range, and ask to try out a few handguns. I recommend it.

497 Cannadian Club Akbar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:18:47pm

re: #492 Lidane

I've often thought of taking gun safety courses and learning how to shoot. I've had friends and family offer to teach me, too.

I figure the last time I fired a gun was when I was a kid shooting cans off a fencepost. Haven't touched a gun since. Maybe I should again, just to know how.

The second amendment is second for a reason.

498 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:18:49pm

re: #485 Aceofwhat?

so who broadcasts the strongest or oddest visual image through their writing so far? i'm oh so curious!

I wouldn't want to do -est, as in strongest, oddest, etc., but maybe you could name a few posters and we could work them over for awhile, telling what springs to mind. This could be dangerous, but also fun.

499 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:19:02pm

re: #490 Guanxi88

My vote, hands down, in SpaceJesus. Somehow, get a scent of patchouli, drum halfzware, and burnt coffee as a background to uproarious laughter.

And who is probably sitting in front of their monitor in as little clothing and flipping the bird at comments every few moments?

500 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:20:08pm

re: #499 Walter L. Newton

And who is probably sitting in front of their monitor in as little clothing and flipping the bird at comments every few moments?

Now, oddly enough, even though I've seen the pic in your avatar, I imagine you look like Poirot from that BBC series back lo, these many years ago.

501 Ojoe  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:20:14pm

re: #492 Lidane

You will get a confidence obtainable in no other way.

502 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:21:08pm

Shamisen vs Taiko Drums

503 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:21:08pm

re: #492 Lidane

I've often thought of taking gun safety courses and learning how to shoot. I've had friends and family offer to teach me, too.

I figure the last time I fired a gun was when I was a kid shooting cans off a fencepost. Haven't touched a gun since. Maybe I should again, just to know how.

You're in Texas! It's your damned DUTY to know how to handle a weapon safely.

504 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:21:14pm

re: #498 Silvergirl

I wouldn't want to do -est, as in strongest, oddest, etc., but maybe you could name a few posters and we could work them over for awhile, telling what springs to mind. This could be dangerous, but also fun.

it's Friday night and i'm home with the kids, letting my wife go have tranquility. i laugh at danger.

we'll stick with people here...how about Reine?

505 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:21:20pm

re: #500 Guanxi88

Now, oddly enough, even though I've seen the pic in your avatar, I imagine you look like Poirot from that BBC series back lo, these many years ago.

I can put the Paravacini back up.

506 spare o'lake  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:21:39pm

re: #482 Guanxi88

We were a family of hyper-educated Hebrews from old Jewbilly stock. Shocked the hell outta people to imagine that folks with yiddish names could out-shoot, out-drink, and out-feud the Scots-Irish around us.

DRUNKEN BRAWLING JEWS WITH GUNS!!!

507 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:21:45pm

re: #505 Walter L. Newton

I can put the Paravacini back up.

Don't encourage me!

508 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:22:04pm

re: #499 Walter L. Newton

And who is probably sitting in front of their monitor in as little clothing and flipping the bird at comments every few moments?

naked!?!?

509 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:22:05pm

re: #506 spare o'lake

DRUNKEN BRAWLING JEWS WITH GUNS!!!

Oh, you were at Thanksgiving '90, too?

510 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:22:07pm

Ok so I just picked up this book on my nightstand and it made me curious. For those willing to divulge... what book do you have, in the general vicinity, that you are most interested in reading, right now.

The book that made me think of this question is as follows:

Awakening the Mind, Lightening the Heart
Core Teachings of Tibetan Buddhism
The Dalai Lama

511 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:23:26pm

re: #495 Locker

I hate to tell you this man but I constantly misread your handle as Giuliani88. I know, not even close but it's a word replacement hiccup. No offense.

The name Guanxi88 seems like a diet aid, or energy drink. Name, not person.

512 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:23:49pm

re: #510 Locker

Well that one and:

Logicomix
An Epic Search For Truth
(It's a graphic novel about Bertrand Russell, cool shit.)

513 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:24:22pm

re: #511 Silvergirl

The name Guanxi88 seems like a diet aid, or energy drink. Name, not person.

I think it's pronounced "kwan c"

514 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:24:33pm

re: #510 Locker

Ok so I just picked up this book on my nightstand and it made me curious. For those willing to divulge... what book do you have, in the general vicinity, that you are most interested in reading, right now.

The book that made me think of this question is as follows:

Awakening the Mind, Lightening the Heart
Core Teachings of Tibetan Buddhism
The Dalai Lama

"Far From the Madding Gerund...and other dispatches from the Language Log"

Mark Liberman / Geoffrey K. Pullum

515 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:24:51pm

re: #506 spare o'lake

DRUNKEN BRAWLING JEWS WITH GUNS!!!

Can you imagine the culture-shock when I went up east and ran into Manhattanites of my tribe? Might as well have been from different countries, which we were, practically.

516 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:24:59pm

re: #510 Locker

I have three I'm reading at the moment:

A War To Be Won: Fighting The Second World War, by Williamson Murray and Allan R. Millett.

The Annotated Alice, annotated by Martin Gardner.

A Singular Man, by J.P Donleavy

Pepys Diaries, by Pepys.

517 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:25:26pm

re: #500 Guanxi88

Now, oddly enough, even though I've seen the pic in your avatar, I imagine you look like Poirot from that BBC series back lo, these many years ago.

Walter? It's probably because of the derby avatar before. Doesn't Poirot wear what could be mistaken for a derby?

518 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:26:24pm

re: #514 Aceofwhat?

Have you read any Geoffery Nunberg? He's a friend of mine. Great books, like:

Talking Right: How Conservatives Turned Liberalism into a Tax-Raising, Latte-Drinking, Sushi-Eating, Volvo-Driving, New York Times-Reading, Body-Piercing, Hollywood-Loving, Left-Wing Freak Show

[Link: www.amazon.com...]

519 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:26:34pm

re: #510 Locker

Brunetti's Venice.

520 Lidane  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:26:35pm

re: #497 Cannadian Club Akbar

The second amendment is second for a reason.

Oh, I know. I have nothing against guns at all. Hell, I grew up in a solidly conservative family filled with law enforcement officers, hunters, and sportsmen. They all chalk up the fact that I ended up a liberal to my lifetime of my being the black sheep in the family, not any influence of theirs. ;)

I've been surrounded by guns all my life. I'm fine with them. I just never shot them much.

521 Aye Pod  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:26:35pm

Talking of guns, here's the sweet baby me and ice are investing in:

1.2l chamber
Firing Chamber Volume: 285.00 mL
Firing Range: up to 10m
CPS constant pressure system

[Link: www.isoaker.com...]

522 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:26:38pm

re: #511 Silvergirl

The name Guanxi88 seems like a diet aid, or energy drink. Name, not person.

I find Walter to look exactly like i imagined him to. For whatever reason, i never clicked on his avatar until he put the new one up.

523 Uninformed Opinion  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:26:43pm

re: #180 Thanos

I certainly agree that the economy is part of what is bringing these crazies out, however for terror and terrorists to exist in substantial form there have to be sympathizers. Those who cheer these freaks on, concur with them in forums, and walk the edge of the crazy abyss like Beck. It's noteworthy that the last time there was large amts of domestic terror from the left that it was during the height of left radicalism.

Anti Abortion violence in the early 90s?

524 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:26:52pm

re: #510 Locker

Ok so I just picked up this book on my nightstand and it made me curious. For those willing to divulge... what book do you have, in the general vicinity, that you are most interested in reading, right now.

The book that made me think of this question is as follows:

Awakening the Mind, Lightening the Heart
Core Teachings of Tibetan Buddhism
The Dalai Lama


I'm half way through Fundamentals of Convolutional Coding (IEEE Series on Digital & Mobile Communication) and I just finished Algebraic Codes for Data Transmission

Oh ,, and the Sports Illustrated SwimSuit Issue

525 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:27:17pm

re: #511 Silvergirl

The name Guanxi88 seems like a diet aid, or energy drink. Name, not person.

Or something a bat leaves on a piano. /

Guan and Xi are both Chinese names. Maybe Guan Xi is a Chinese Pianist?(that's not to say he has a small piano)

526 Lidane  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:27:19pm

re: #496 Guanxi88

Go down to Red's Indoor range, and ask to try out a few handguns. I recommend it.

Hmm. Sounds like a plan. I'll have to see when I can get out there.

527 The Left  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:27:26pm

re: #523 Uninformed Opinion

Anti Abortion violence in the early 90s?

Wasn't coming from the left.

528 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:27:32pm

re: #516 Obdicut

I have three I'm reading at the moment:

A War To Be Won: Fighting The Second World War, by Williamson Murray and Allan R. Millett.

The Annotated Alice, annotated by Martin Gardner.

A Singular Man, by J.P Donleavy

Pepys Diaries, by Pepys.

ummmm, t'aint that FOUR !?!?!

529 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:27:42pm

re: #516 Obdicut

three, huh?

*waves to barkeep*

Pour me one of those -->

530 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:27:44pm

re: #506 spare o'lake

DRUNKEN BRAWLING JEWS WITH GUNS!!!

Doc Cordell has serious problems with that. He wants 'em back in the shtetl so he can play Dr. Schweitzer.

531 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:27:55pm

re: #510 Locker

Ok so I just picked up this book on my nightstand and it made me curious. For those willing to divulge... what book do you have, in the general vicinity, that you are most interested in reading, right now.

The book that made me think of this question is as follows:

Awakening the Mind, Lightening the Heart
Core Teachings of Tibetan Buddhism
The Dalai Lama

Analects of Confucius, a Philosophical Translation
Discourses on Livy, by Nikki Macch

532 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:28:30pm

re: #510 Locker

Ok so I just picked up this book on my nightstand and it made me curious. For those willing to divulge... what book do you have, in the general vicinity, that you are most interested in reading, right now.

The book that made me think of this question is as follows:

Awakening the Mind, Lightening the Heart
Core Teachings of Tibetan Buddhism
The Dalai Lama

"God Bless You, Mr. Rosewater", by Kurt Vonnegut

533 Uninformed Opinion  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:28:30pm

re: #527 iceweasel

Wasn't coming from the left.

That was kinda my point. violence from the radical left was not the last acts of domestic terrorism. if you want to frame it that way.

534 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:28:33pm

C'mon friends... do the Amazon links if you are going to list books you are reading.


UO:
No, I was thinking more SDS / Panthers / SLA type of groups

535 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:28:45pm

re: #517 Silvergirl

Walter? It's probably because of the derby avatar before. Doesn't Poirot wear what could be mistaken for a derby?

I really don't know. The other picture that I have used with me in the derby, is from 2000, when I was about 200 pounds heavier. I was playing Mr. Paravacini in Agatha Christies "The Mousetrap." That's were that picture came from.

536 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:28:46pm

re: #518 Obdicut

Have you read any Geoffery Nunberg? He's a friend of mine. Great books, like:

Talking Right: How Conservatives Turned Liberalism into a Tax-Raising, Latte-Drinking, Sushi-Eating, Volvo-Driving, New York Times-Reading, Body-Piercing, Hollywood-Loving, Left-Wing Freak Show

[Link: www.amazon.com...]

A title like that? I'm salivating...

537 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:28:57pm

re: #514 Aceofwhat?

"Far From the Madding Gerund...and other dispatches from the Language Log"

Mark Liberman / Geoffrey K. Pullum

That looks kind of interesting. Not sure if you are a language guy by trade or hobby but what's your take on NLP (neuro-linguistic programming)? I've got this NLP book called The New Technology of Achievement which is pretty engaging.

538 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:29:48pm

re: #510 Locker

Ok so I just picked up this book on my nightstand and it made me curious. For those willing to divulge... what book do you have, in the general vicinity, that you are most interested in reading, right now.

The book that made me think of this question is as follows:

Awakening the Mind, Lightening the Heart
Core Teachings of Tibetan Buddhism
The Dalai Lama

The book nearest to me (about 5 feet away) is Little Bear Treasury. I'm not all that interested in reading it since it doesn't hold my interest. :-) I love falling asleep to books on tape, (on iPod, really) and I'm currently relistening to The Plague of Doves.

539 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:29:52pm

re: #533 Uninformed Opinion

That was kinda my point. violence from the radical left was not the last acts of domestic terrorism. if you want to frame it that way.

The last big name in violence from the left, as far as I know, is Bill Ayers...and the Right talk about him as if he's still out there doing his best bin Laden impression...with President Obama's blessings, of course. /

540 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:29:57pm

re: #528 sattv4u2

I didn't say which three I'm reading.

But yeah, it's actually four. Reading I'm good at, counting not my strong suit.

541 Lidane  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:30:02pm

re: #503 Guanxi88

You're in Texas! It's your damned DUTY to know how to handle a weapon safely.

I know, I know. I've neglected it, too.

I should know. And I do *want* to know. I just haven't gotten around to taking the right classes or learning how yet.

542 The Left  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:30:10pm

re: #533 Uninformed Opinion

That was kinda my point. violence from the radical left was not the last acts of domestic terrorism. if you want to frame it that way.

Yeah, that is all the right and all throughout the 90's, actually, in terms of attacks on abortion, clinics, and providers, as well as the Olympic bomber (Eric Rudolph), Timothy McVeigh...various militia fuckwits, etc.

543 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:30:16pm

re: #525 darthstar

Or something a bat leaves on a piano. /

Guan and Xi are both Chinese names. Maybe Guan Xi is a Chinese Pianist?(that's not to say he has a small piano)

guanxi - means "connection", has come to mean corruption and influence peddling. guanxiwang is the name given to the web of social and business connections to which people may or may not belong (everyone vouches for everyone else)

88 - bah, bah - rhymes with fah, fah, which means gold, which means money, which is to say I spend too much time working with and around chinese.

544 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:30:31pm

re: #536 Aceofwhat?

A title like that? I'm salivating...

I thought that was the ENTIRE book!!

545 Obdicut  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:30:48pm

re: #536 Aceofwhat?

He's a brilliant writer, and a great guy. Known him since I was a kid, also. He's recently had cancer-- currently in remission, and dealt with it very well.

You may hear him on NPR, on Fresh Air, if you listen to that. He's on there a lot.

546 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:30:51pm

re: #534 Thanos

[Link: www.google.com...]

547 spare o'lake  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:31:00pm

re: #515 Guanxi88

Can you imagine the culture-shock when I went up east and ran into Manhattanites of my tribe? Might as well have been from different countries, which we were, practically.

Hahahahaha. Priceless.
I had never even touched a firearm until I hit 40.

548 Aye Pod  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:31:09pm
Carolina Chocolate Drops

Gene, March 2nd 2010, 12:42 am

Good to see young African-Americans reclaiming the string band tradition. The banjo, after all, was developed by slaves in Colonial America, adapted from African instruments.

[Link: arts.hurryupharry.org...]

549 lostlakehiker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:31:18pm

The extreme right wing is pretty crazy. In this guys case, it looks as though from his parents' perspective, he was just plain wrong in the head. The clinically insane of a certain stripe gravitate to dramatic and violent belief sets, and one will serve as well as the next.

As a political movement, the mainstream right wing consigned Ron Paul's bid for the GOP nomination to the dustbin pretty resoundingly. If he ever broke 4 percent in a primary, I didn't read about it. In the end, we got McCain, who had little going for him but the fact that he was not RonPaulian, not a Huck-ster, ---just a plainspoken patriot who accepted that government was necessary and in moderation a good thing, and who was willing to give the election the good old college try.

Next time, it might be nice to have a brighter, more energetic, younger man who could keep the thread of a debate and present robustly the case for limited government, moderate taxes, and fiscal restraint. For the dream candidate, maybe he could know something about science and take a positive stance on nuclear power. Failing that, if he knew something about economics he'd be several steps ahead of this administration or the one before it.

550 solomonpanting  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:31:20pm

It's official: An asteroid wiped out the dinosaurs

Morgan said the "final nail in the coffin for the dinosaurs" came when blasted material flew into the atmosphere, shrouding the planet in darkness, causing a global winter and "killing off many species that couldn't adapt to this hellish environment."

Well, sheet, if humans lived concurrently with dinosaurs and survived that environment, what's a bit 'o global warming?

551 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:31:26pm

re: #546 Decatur Deb

[Link: www.google.com...]

Thanks! When you do that Charles gets some cred too....

552 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:31:39pm

re: #543 Guanxi88

guanxi - means "connection", has come to mean corruption and influence peddling. guanxiwang is the name given to the web of social and business connections to which people may or may not belong (everyone vouches for everyone else)

88 - bah, bah - rhymes with fah, fah, which means gold, which means money, which is to say I spend too much time working with and around chinese.

Wow...I was headed in the right direction then. I know 8 is lucky number in China...but forgot that when I did the Guan and Xi lookups.

553 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:31:52pm

re: #537 Locker

That looks kind of interesting. Not sure if you are a language guy by trade or hobby but what's your take on NLP (neuro-linguistic programming)? I've got this NLP book called The New Technology of Achievement which is pretty engaging.

I use it for a number of mentalism routines. It's really been around a LONG time, know in the past as "equivoque" with in the stage magic business... You can find similar stuff discussed in "Annemann's Practical Book of Mentalism."

554 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:31:54pm

re: #537 Locker

That looks kind of interesting. Not sure if you are a language guy by trade or hobby but what's your take on NLP (neuro-linguistic programming)? I've got this NLP book called The New Technology of Achievement which is pretty engaging.

hobby. i'm a sucker for the right sort of prose.

555 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:32:21pm

re: #548 Jimmah

[Link: arts.hurryupharry.org...]

My wife heard the Carolina Chocolate Drops on NPR the other day and told me to look them up. She said they're quite good. Thanks for the reminder.

556 Uninformed Opinion  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:32:39pm

re: #542 iceweasel

Yeah, that is all the right and all throughout the 90's, actually, in terms of attacks on abortion, clinics, and providers, as well as the Olympic bomber (Eric Rudolph), Timothy McVeigh...various militia fuckwits, etc.

even the various militia encounters.

These things were acts of domestic terrorism by right wing crazies, yet people talk about 70s leftist radicals like that was the end of it.

557 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:32:48pm

re: #504 Aceofwhat?

it's Friday night and i'm home with the kids, letting my wife go have tranquility. i laugh at danger.

we'll stick with people here...how about Reine?

Tall, thin, thoughtful, kind. Put things in her capable hands and they'll get done.

hah! How did I do? Who has been reading her long enough to agree or disagree?

558 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:33:13pm

re: #542 iceweasel

Yeah, that is all the right and all throughout the 90's, actually, in terms of attacks on abortion, clinics, and providers, as well as the Olympic bomber (Eric Rudolph), Timothy McVeigh...various militia fuckwits, etc.

Yes but that was the '90s which I don't think anyone would consider the "height of Radical leftism" or whatever I said. After all, can a president from Arkansas (Huckster country) be truly radical no matter how hard he tries ?

559 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:33:20pm

re: #552 darthstar

Wow...I was headed in the right direction then. I know 8 is lucky number in China...but forgot that when I did the Guan and Xi lookups.

yeah, i wear a ton of hats, and one of them - the one that takes up the most damned time - is dealing with customs hassles for my other, other, other gig, which is a sideline to my other, other gig. I end up getting used in negotiating games by my employers, but have managed to plug into a nice little network - with their help.

I can get jade like you wouldn't believe, but there's not as much interest in it as one might think.

560 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:33:50pm

re: #357 Guanxi88

squeeze-cocker? I remember reading about those. Really nifty, really nifty.

I think, though, that I'm just gonna get the wife a revolver - 38, S&W make - and maybe a 20 gauge for the kitchen.

I'm kinda old-fashioned that way.

I've been having a lot of fun with the Pedersoli Howdah Pistol I picked up last year. Now I'm not stupid enough to recommend black powder for home defense, but I guess in a pinch few things are more visually intimidating that two sawed off 20 gauge barrels, plus it creates it's own smokescreen for quick getaways.

561 Jadespring  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:34:06pm

re: #522 Aceofwhat?

I find Walter to look exactly like i imagined him to. For whatever reason, i never clicked on his avatar until he put the new one up.

I imagine you sitting at the computer wearing a plastic visor.

562 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:34:07pm

re: #551 Thanos

Thanks! When you do that Charles gets some cred too...

Could you guys clue me on how to make the LGF friendly amazon link? I'll follow up with the titles I've mentioned. Thanks!

563 The Left  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:34:17pm

re: #556 Uninformed Opinion

even the various militia encounters.

These things were acts of domestic terrorism by right wing crazies, yet people talk about 70s leftist radicals like that was the end of it.

Oh yeah, tell me about it. More deflection.

564 darthstar  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:34:19pm

re: #555 darthstar

My wife heard the Carolina Chocolate Drops on NPR the other day and told me to look them up. She said they're quite good. Thanks for the reminder.

This deserves embedding:

565 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:34:26pm

re: #558 Thanos

...snip. After all, can a president from Arkansas (Huckster country) be truly radical no matter how hard he tries ?

Ask Ken Starr and Newt.

566 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:34:49pm

re: #551 Thanos

Thanks! When you do that Charles gets some cred too...

great point.

[Link: www.amazon.com...]

567 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:35:27pm

re: #560 goddamnedfrank

I've been having a lot of fun with the Pedersoli Howdah Pistol I picked up last year. Now I'm not stupid enough to recommend black powder for home defense, but I guess in a pinch few things are more visually intimidating that two sawed off 20 gauge barrels, plus it creates it's own smokescreen for quick getaways.

Are the Sepoys restive again?

568 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:35:52pm

re: #545 Obdicut

He's a brilliant writer, and a great guy. Known him since I was a kid, also. He's recently had cancer-- currently in remission, and dealt with it very well.

You may hear him on NPR, on Fresh Air, if you listen to that. He's on there a lot.

Speaking of people you know, talk to Alter for me, would you? I may be able to help out.

569 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:36:33pm

re: #557 Silvergirl

Tall, thin, thoughtful, kind. Put things in her capable hands and they'll get done.

hah! How did I do? Who has been reading her long enough to agree or disagree?

i picture her shorter. kind, clearly. industrious-cajun-gentle-soul, which for some reason in my mind, is about 5'2". no idea why!

570 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:37:32pm

re: #561 Jadespring

I imagine you sitting at the computer wearing a plastic visor.

can't...stop...laughing...

571 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:37:47pm

sattv - I picture him as about early 30's. he's not a regular smoker, but when he drinks, he'll bum one off anyone around him.

I picture him with sorta reddish hair, close-cropped, and a red ball cap, on facing forward, as it should.

572 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:38:14pm

re: #559 Guanxi88

yeah, i wear a ton of hats, and one of them - the one that takes up the most damned time - is dealing with customs hassles for my other, other, other gig, which is a sideline to my other, other gig. I end up getting used in negotiating games by my employers, but have managed to plug into a nice little network - with their help.

I can get jade like you wouldn't believe, but there's not as much interest in it as one might think.

What about lapis lazuli? My fave.

573 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:38:16pm

re: #557 Silvergirl

Tall, thin, thoughtful, kind. Put things in her capable hands and they'll get done.

hah! How did I do? Who has been reading her long enough to agree or disagree?

Well I've got a clear picture of Silvergirl in my head. She's the Silver Surfer's girlfriend. Riding next to him on a twin board.

574 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:39:42pm

re: #572 Cato the Elder

What about lapis lazuli? My fave.

Folk who run that are outta Xinjiang, at least the China market, and they don't talk with "easterners" or their associates. hard feelings there, but some beautiful lapidary.

575 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:39:50pm

re: #573 Locker

Well I've got a clear picture of Silvergirl in my head. She's the Silver Surfer's girlfriend. Riding next to him on a twin board.

I thought she was into Simon and Garfunkle.

576 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:39:58pm

re: #569 Aceofwhat?

i picture her shorter. kind, clearly. industrious-cajun-gentle-soul, which for some reason in my mind, is about 5'2". no idea why!

Exactly. There isn't an accounting of why. I wonder if the overall picture is influenced by a personality coming across to us as being like someone we've known in the flesh?

577 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:40:10pm

re: #571 Guanxi88

sattv - I picture him as about early 30's. he's not a regular smoker, but when he drinks, he'll bum one off anyone around him.

I picture him with sorta reddish hair, close-cropped, and a red ball cap, on facing forward, as it should.

i pictured late 30's, ruddy complexion (georgia sun, after all), light brown hair...

578 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:40:15pm

re: #569 Aceofwhat?

i picture her shorter. kind, clearly. industrious-cajun-gentle-soul, which for some reason in my mind, is about 5'2". no idea why!

Nope.
5'7, not as thin as I used to be but doing OK.
Not one bit cajun (German/Irish/Welsh)
Also, I was known among my co-workers as being the person who would get things done.

Now, as to thoughtful and kind . . . people who interact with me in person do not have that impression until they get to know me. Apparently when I talk I sound angry, even when I'm not. I'm also not given to a lot of idle chit-chat small talk sort of stuff, so folks think I'm brusque when I have no intention of being so, I'm just very focused on whatever task is at hand and ready to get it done.

I do a LOT better dealing with people in writing.

579 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:40:20pm

re: #562 Locker

Could you guys clue me on how to make the LGF friendly amazon link? I'll follow up with the titles I've mentioned. Thanks!

Find the book on Amazon, Type the title in your comment, highlight it then use the link button (looks like two chain links) and insert the amazon URL
Like so:

Outlaws of America

580 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:40:50pm

re: #576 Silvergirl

Exactly. There isn't an accounting of why. I wonder if the overall picture is influenced by a personality coming across to us as being like someone we've known in the flesh?

Could very well be.
I suspect the picture I have in my head of folks here puts them younger than many are.

581 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:40:51pm

re: #575 Decatur Deb

I thought she was into Simon and Garfunkle.

I admit it would be hard to surf the galaxy at a bajillion miles an hour listening to Simon and Garfunkle. Then again maybe not...

582 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:40:58pm

re: #575 Decatur Deb

I thought she was into Simon and Garfunkle.

I am. That's it.

583 spare o'lake  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:41:20pm

re: #530 Cato the Elder

Doc Cordell has serious problems with that. He wants 'em back in the shtetl so he can play Dr. Schweitzer.

After awhile I found it impossible to believe that he was as clueless as he pretended to be.
Same thing with Idiotica the other day.
And people here enabling and defending them.
Oy to the vay.

584 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:42:32pm

re: #573 Locker

Well I've got a clear picture of Silvergirl in my head. She's the Silver Surfer's girlfriend. Riding next to him on a twin board.

silvergirl types young. not winsiago young, with smiley tongues after every post...freshly motivated young.

grad student-esque age...like getting a master's in some liberal arts discipline...

585 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:42:57pm

re: #580 reine.de.tout

Could very well be.
I suspect the picture I have in my head of folks here puts them younger than many are.

I suspect the same. But then the picture I have of myself--in mind's eye--is younger than the reality! Where's my magic mirror when I need it?

586 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:43:14pm
587 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:43:18pm

re: #571 Guanxi88

sattv - I picture him as about early 30's. he's not a regular smoker, but when he drinks, he'll bum one off anyone around him.

I picture him with sorta reddish hair, close-cropped, and a red ball cap, on facing forward, as it should.

Your picture is about 25 years old!

WAS a "regular smoker" (2 1/2 - 3 packs a day for about 20 years) ,,quit cold turkey about 20 years ago

Dark brown hair and the only time I wear a ballcap is when doing yardwork in the summer or sitting on the beach

588 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:43:24pm

Somehow, I imagine obdicut looks a bit like barton fink, which is to say, a bit like a younger version of my great grandfather.

LVQ - he reminds me of my middle-school history teacher - I get a scent of chalk when I read his stuff.

589 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:43:28pm

re: #574 Guanxi88

Folk who run that are outta Xinjiang, at least the China market, and they don't talk with "easterners" or their associates. hard feelings there, but some beautiful lapidary.

Time for some Yeats.

Lapis Lazuli

I have heard that hysterical women say
They are sick of the palette and fiddle-bow.
Of poets that are always gay,
For everybody knows or else should know
That if nothing drastic is done
Aeroplane and Zeppelin will come out.
Pitch like King Billy bomb-balls in
Until the town lie beaten flat.

All perform their tragic play,
There struts Hamlet, there is Lear,
That's Ophelia, that Cordelia;
Yet they, should the last scene be there,
The great stage curtain about to drop,
If worthy their prominent part in the play,
Do not break up their lines to weep.
They know that Hamlet and Lear are gay;
Gaiety transfiguring all that dread.
All men have aimed at, found and lost;
Black out; Heaven blazing into the head:
Tragedy wrought to its uttermost.
Though Hamlet rambles and Lear rages,
And all the drop-scenes drop at once
Upon a hundred thousand stages,
It cannot grow by an inch or an ounce.

On their own feet they came, or On shipboard,'
Camel-back; horse-back, ass-back, mule-back,
Old civilisations put to the sword.
Then they and their wisdom went to rack:
No handiwork of Callimachus,
Who handled marble as if it were bronze,
Made draperies that seemed to rise
When sea-wind swept the corner, stands;
His long lamp-chimney shaped like the stem
Of a slender palm, stood but a day;
All things fall and are built again,
And those that build them again are gay.

Two Chinamen, behind them a third,
Are carved in lapis lazuli,
Over them flies a long-legged bird,
A symbol of longevity;
The third, doubtless a serving-man,
Carries a musical instrument.

Every discoloration of the stone,
Every accidental crack or dent,
Seems a water-course or an avalanche,
Or lofty slope where it still snows
Though doubtless plum or cherry-branch
Sweetens the little half-way house
Those Chinamen climb towards, and I
Delight to imagine them seated there;
There, on the mountain and the sky,
On all the tragic scene they stare.
One asks for mournful melodies;
Accomplished fingers begin to play.
Their eyes mid many wrinkles, their eyes,
Their ancient, glittering eyes, are gay.

One of my stock responses to "the sky is falling" types.

590 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:43:32pm

re: #585 Silvergirl

I suspect the same. But then the picture I have of myself--in mind's eye--is younger than the reality! Where's my magic mirror when I need it?

In your head.
Which is where mine is.
I feel a lot younger than I actually am.
And thank goodness!

591 Uninformed Opinion  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:43:38pm

The Family

Great Unraveling

Depression Economics

Poincare Conjecture

Were my most recent books. No more books on economics or religious fundamentalists for a while.

592 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:43:56pm

re: #576 Silvergirl

Exactly. There isn't an accounting of why. I wonder if the overall picture is influenced by a personality coming across to us as being like someone we've known in the flesh?

i don't know, but this is a riot. Jadespring has me in stitches...

593 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:44:16pm

Ron Paul to spam another convention....
Ron Paul Snaps Up 800 Tickets for Southern Republican Leadership Conference

In the wake of his somewhat surprising — and very soft-peddled — victory in the CPAC straw poll, Rep. Ron Paul (R-Texas) is gearing up for a big showing at the next GOP cattle call. Paul’s Campaign for Liberty has purchased 800 tickets for the event, held next month in New Orleans, at a total cost of $92,000.

If 800 Paul fans show up, would it be enough to win the event’s straw poll? Well, in 2006, Sen. Bill Frist (R-Tenn.) won the straw poll with a 36.9 percent plurality — of only 1,427 ballots.

594 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:44:42pm

re: #577 Aceofwhat?

see 587

(Georgia NOW ,,,, Massachusetts for most of the 1st 45 years of my life0

595 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:44:59pm

re: #584 Aceofwhat?

silvergirl types young. not winsiago young, with smiley tongues after every post...freshly motivated young.

grad student-esque age...like getting a master's in some liberal arts discipline...

It only comes from hanging around lots of young people on a nearly daily basis. Growing up, I also had some younger friends I appreciated while my other friends regarded them as tagalongs to be ditched. So I'm immature and loving it.

596 Jadespring  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:45:04pm

re: #573 Locker

Well I've got a clear picture of Silvergirl in my head. She's the Silver Surfer's girlfriend. Riding next to him on a twin board.

That's what I picture too. Though I think that say more about us then her. :D

597 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:45:15pm

re: #584 Aceofwhat?

silvergirl types young. not winsiago young, with smiley tongues after every post...freshly motivated young.

grad student-esque age...like getting a master's in some liberal arts discipline...

Cool man but I still she her flashing by LGF on her board, casting out some comment pearls before she wooshes off into the night.

598 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:45:44pm

re: #592 Aceofwhat?

i don't know, but this is a riot. Jadespring has me in stitches...

Let's do Killgore now.
um
5'9", dark hair and eyes. Slender and health-conscious, but doesn't work out, uses his yard work as exercise.

I am absolutely no good at this. Somebody jump in.

599 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:46:15pm

re: #598 reine.de.tout

Let's do Killgore now.
um
5'9", dark hair and eyes. Slender and health-conscious, but doesn't work out, uses his yard work as exercise.

I am absolutely no good at this. Somebody jump in.

I think of him as Hank Hill, but wearing a polo shirt.

600 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:46:36pm

re: #588 Guanxi88

Somehow, I imagine obdicut looks a bit like barton fink, which is to say, a bit like a younger version of my great grandfather.

LVQ - he reminds me of my middle-school history teacher - I get a scent of chalk when I read his stuff.

LVQ is easy...we all picture a cantankerous prof we knew and voila;)

601 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:46:57pm

re: #588 Guanxi88

Somehow, I imagine obdicut looks a bit like barton fink, which is to say, a bit like a younger version of my great grandfather.

LVQ - he reminds me of my middle-school history teacher - I get a scent of chalk when I read his stuff.

LVQ has red hair in my picture. He sits down to type with his tie hanging untied around his neck because he's too hyper to take a second to fling it off. He has a pot of coffee at hand and refills it often.

602 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:47:06pm

re: #600 Aceofwhat?

LVQ is easy...we all picture a cantankerous prof we knew and voila;)

No, no. That's Cato.
I picture LVQ as younger.

603 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:47:12pm

re: #598 reine.de.tout

Somebody jump in

Okay

Fat Veggie Bastard

fat ,, eats lots of vegetables , and is a ,,, ummm,, nevahmind!!

//

604 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:47:12pm

re: #600 Aceofwhat?

LVQ is easy...we all picture a cantankerous prof we knew and voila;)

yeah, but I liked my history teacher, even as I like LVQ, our frequent tangles notwithstanding.

605 Jadespring  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:47:56pm

re: #598 reine.de.tout

Let's do Killgore now.
um
5'9", dark hair and eyes. Slender and health-conscious, but doesn't work out, uses his yard work as exercise.

I am absolutely no good at this. Somebody jump in.

He's wearing a farmers hat in my minds eye.

606 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:48:01pm

re: #603 sattv4u2

Somebody jump in

Okay

Fat Veggie Bastard

fat ,, eats lots of vegetables , and is a ,,, ummm,, nevahmind!!

//

Pie crumbs on a tie-dyed Bush/Quayle shirt.

607 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:49:26pm

re: #597 Locker

Cool man but I still she her flashing by LGF on her board, casting out some comment pearls before she wooshes off into the night.

Thanks for making that "comment pearls" instead of drive-by snark. That's generous, truly. Sometimes I feel like a party crasher, but then maybe we all do if our time is limited.

608 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:49:46pm

re: #593 Killgore Trout

Ron Paul to spam another convention...
Ron Paul Snaps Up 800 Tickets for Southern Republican Leadership Conference

Yes, remember the Stormfront server raid where we found the evidence in the docs and pics of them "Storming" the Iowa caucus for Ron Paul?

609 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:49:52pm

aceofwhat:

I get a fellow with a GOOD education working at a hardware store for the discounts on tools, and a scent of wd-40.

610 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:49:58pm

re: #598 reine.de.tout

Let's do Killgore now.
um
5'9", dark hair and eyes. Slender and health-conscious, but doesn't work out, uses his yard work as exercise.

I am absolutely no good at this. Somebody jump in.

none of us are good at this! it's just the image we give each other from our communication style/scant personal detail/point of view.

I can't dissociate myself from the "trout", so i picture a shorter, physically strong guy with longer dark hair...a little lumberjack + librul cook sorta look, if that's a "look"

611 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:50:53pm

re: #598 reine.de.tout

Do I ruin it if I tell what I look like?

612 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:51:02pm

re: #610 Aceofwhat?

none of us are good at this! it's just the image we give each other from our communication style/scant personal detail/point of view.

ha! the one time synesthesia/sensory integration problems give me an ADVANTAGE!

613 Aye Pod  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:51:02pm

re: #521 Jimmah

Talking of guns, here's the sweet baby me and ice are investing in:

1.2l chamber
Firing Chamber Volume: 285.00 mL
Firing Range: up to 10m
CPS constant pressure system

[Link: www.isoaker.com...]

Some more info (icing on the cake so to speak) : "The Arctic Blast's name is derived from the fact that the reservoir cap is larger than normal to allow the insertion of ice-cubes into the reservoir."

614 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:51:08pm

re: #602 reine.de.tout

No, no. That's Cato.
I picture LVQ as younger.

i know. i picture them very similarly...LVQ a little younger

615 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:51:20pm

re: #606 Guanxi88

Pie crumbs on a tie-dyed Bush/Quayle shirt.

The apparition of these faces in the crowd;
Petals on a wet, black bough.

Name that tune!

616 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:51:31pm

re: #608 Thanos

Yes, remember the Stormfront server raid where we found the evidence in the docs and pics of them "Storming" the Iowa caucus for Ron Paul?

Stormfronter skinhead types or Paulian undergrads doing the storming?

617 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:51:32pm

re: #611 Killgore Trout

Do I ruin it if I tell what I look like?

yes, yes you do.

618 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:51:54pm

re: #611 Killgore Trout

Do I ruin it if I tell what I look like?

do whatever you want, man.

quick question...should we take this to the Lounge?

619 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:52:00pm

re: #611 Killgore Trout

Do I ruin it if I tell what I look like?

heh ,,,do I ruin it if I post a picture of myself@?!?

620 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:52:07pm

re: #605 Jadespring

He's wearing a farmers hat in my minds eye.

Yes. That adds to my picture. Like an impressionist artist, but in the kitchen.

621 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:52:08pm

re: #611 Killgore Trout

Do I ruin it if I tell what I look like?

Not for me!
curious minds always want to know.

622 Guanxi88  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:52:14pm

re: #615 Cato the Elder

The apparition of these faces in the crowd;
Petals on a wet, black bough.

Name that tune!

Pound or Eliot, but it's better than eliot, so it's pound.

623 Locker  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:52:32pm

re: #607 Silvergirl

Thanks for making that "comment pearls" instead of drive-by snark. That's generous, truly. Sometimes I feel like a party crasher, but then maybe we all do if our time is limited.

Silver(Surfer)girl does not snark. She graces the masses with her celestial presence and kicks up admiration and envy due to her slick board and styling moves.

624 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:52:46pm

re: #618 Aceofwhat?

do whatever you want, man.

quick question...should we take this to the Lounge?

private booth ,,,, drinks with lil umberellas !?!?!

NTTAWWT!!

625 Decatur Deb  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:52:47pm

re: #618 Aceofwhat?

Good thinking.

626 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:52:54pm

re: #609 Guanxi88

aceofwhat:

I get a fellow with a GOOD education working at a hardware store for the discounts on tools, and a scent of wd-40.

Hah! I can definitely see the name that way.

627 opie77  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:53:37pm

He was insane that is all that matters. Same with the Communist Manifesto spewing madman who flew his plane into the IRS building. Same with the Obama zealot who shot up her tenure board. Same as the anti-abortion moron who murdered a doctor in a house of God. Same as the pieces of human filth who killed so many of their countrymen in Oklahoma City all those years ago. Same as the tree hugging mail bomber. They are insane. Their political ideology is irrelevant. They felt victimized by life and lashed out at those they could. They were sick people who would be deserving of pity if not for their inhuman actions.

And for what it's worth, Bedell appears to have been registered to vote as a Democrat in Hollister, CA.

628 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:53:48pm

re: #621 reine.de.tout

Skinny tall white guy, graying hair and a scruffy beard. Glasses and I never wear shoes.

629 Jadespring  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:53:59pm

re: #620 Silvergirl

Yes. That adds to my picture. Like an impressionist artist, but in the kitchen.

Yes exactly! LOL

630 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:54:20pm

re: #609 Guanxi88

aceofwhat:

I get a fellow with a GOOD education working at a hardware store for the discounts on tools, and a scent of wd-40.

hilarious. it's difficult to imagine how much i suck at maintenance and handyman work. i was a great dissector (Biology major) but when i hang a picture straight, i spend ten minutes admiring my labor.

no idea why i'm like that.

631 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:54:45pm

re: #623 Locker

Silver(Surfer)girl does not snark. She graces the masses with her celestial presence and kicks up admiration and envy due to her slick board and styling moves.

I must start hanging with Silver Surfer to pick up some of this grace. I read the comic just once in one of those school magazine samples.

632 Randall Gross  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:55:10pm

re: #616 Decatur Deb

Stormfronter skinhead types or Paulian undergrads doing the storming?

Stormfronters, it was in their forums... Ron Paul was their candidate throughout the primaries, just as Rand Paul is now their favorite in KY.

633 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:55:37pm

re: #622 Guanxi88

Pound or Eliot, but it's better than eliot, so it's pound.

Pound it is. "In a Station of the Metro". 1913.

634 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:55:47pm

re: #628 Killgore Trout

Skinny tall white guy, graying hair and a scruffy beard. Glasses and I never wear shoes.

GRAYING HAIR?
Hm.
Do you wear those shoes that have toes in them?

Daughter's boyfriend has some of those. They are really ugly, but he says they are really comfortable. I can't get into it, myself. I don't even like toe socks.

635 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:55:52pm

re: #628 Killgore Trout

Skinny tall white guy, graying hair and a scruffy beard. Glasses and I never wear shoes.

i had the scruffy part right!

636 Cato the Elder  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:56:23pm

re: #627 opie77

Bit late with that, aren't you?

637 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:56:33pm

i'm going upstairs to continue...

638 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:56:54pm

re: #636 Cato the Elder

Bit late with that, aren't you?

He was thinking the thread was dead.

639 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:57:32pm

re: #627 opie77

You're either THE slowest typer of all time,,, or ,,

no ,,, i'll stick to my 1st thought!!

640 Silvergirl  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:58:07pm

re: #628 Killgore Trout

Skinny tall white guy, graying hair and a scruffy beard. Glasses and I never wear shoes.

I had a friend who never wore shoes. I've lost touch since we moved, but no shoes ever. The soles of her feet were all the shoes necessary--tough as leather. She was never questioned in stores or restaurants or anywhere.

So do you ever wear a straw hat?

641 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:59:08pm

re: #640 Silvergirl

I had a friend who never wore shoes. I've lost touch since we moved, but no shoes ever. The soles of her feet were all the shoes necessary--tough as leather. She was never questioned in stores or restaurants or anywhere.

So do you ever wear a straw hat?

No ,, but ha has been known to cook and eat one!

642 Uninformed Opinion  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 5:59:35pm

re: #634 reine.de.tout

GRAYING HAIR?
Hm.
Do you wear those shoes that have toes in them?

Daughter's boyfriend has some of those. They are really ugly, but he says they are really comfortable. I can't get into it, myself. I don't even like toe socks.

they are really comfortable! people look at you really funny though.

643 Killgore Trout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 6:00:15pm

re: #634 reine.de.tout


Do you wear those shoes that have toes in them?

Daughter's boyfriend has some of those. They are really ugly, but he says they are really comfortable.

Ugh, even thinking of wearing those things gives me the willies. My feets gotta be free!

644 Ebetty  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 6:02:16pm

I've been reading through this thread and while I rarely comment, I can't help but be vocal on this topic. As to John Bedell's sanity, who here has psychiatric degrees or psychology degrees? Who here has peer reviewed research, that we readers and commenters can see as proof of their expertise with regard to mental disorders? The man was severely mentally ill per many news reports. His politics are not germane. He may sound like a Ron Paul follower, he may be a 9/11 Truther too. Neither matter. He is now deceased, another tragic suicide by cop. All this discussion of the right inspiring his craziness is absurd, unless of course someone here has specific psychiatric/psychology experience with peer reviewed research that backs it up. Furthermore, if you are a psychologist or psychiatrist, you would ethically not opine about the specific mental state of someone you have not personally diagnosed.

That said, the "movement-conservatives" are a group of folks I would not want to associate with. They spend a great deal of time on non-productive power plays. They are prone to hateful speech, nasty exclusionary behavior and bouts with hypocrisy. Let us call them out for policy differences, with facts, with truth rather than responding in kind.

Republican leadership has their hands full, and I remain skeptical about them getting tough on the fringe.

However, to say no prominent Republicans or conservatives spoke out against CPAC including the John Birch Society is an absolute lie. Mark Levin, Rich Lowry and others spoke out. A collection of their quotes can be found HERE.

As I said, if we want the conservative fringe to end - we can only fight them with truth, facts and policy. Not with uninformed namecalling.

645 Uninformed Opinion  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 6:02:19pm

re: #643 Killgore Trout

Ugh, even thinking of wearing those things gives me the willies. My feets gotta be free!

its feels like a glove!

646 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 6:03:45pm

re: #645 Uninformed Opinion

its feels like a glove!

Isn't that the Trojan Brand jingle !?!?!

//

647 sattv4u2  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 6:05:15pm

re: #644 Ebetty

post more often ,, and in a more timely manner ,, i.e,, when we were actually TALKING about a subject!

just sayin!

648 Ebetty  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 6:08:17pm

re: #647 sattv4u2

have a day job, just got home! Will do. Thx.

649 swamprat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 6:12:15pm

Both sides are going to try to spin this event to their advantage. The guy was nuts. End of story.

It's getting that every time a cat farts, somebody will say that it smells just like Plains' ... then fox news will say no, her farts don't stink.... then the tea party will claim they generally smell like roses, and then the democratic party will issue an official rebuttal to cat farts while the environmental concerns issue a study on liberal, versus conservative cat farts and how they affect the environment and global warming.

Can't we all just get along?


Oh yeah. Also Godwin.

650 swamprat  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 6:13:30pm

re: #649 swamprat


Plains=Palins'

651 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 6:17:50pm

re: #417 Guanxi88

OOH! She's nowhere near ready to CCW. I'm thinking something for last-ditch, already-called-911 on the cell phone and the sob's in the house use.

never for outdoors.

Ah, J&G sales has really nice security force turn in Model 64 4" .38 specials for sale. You can find them here. I'd consider it perfect for your use.

William

652 reine.de.tout  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 6:17:58pm

re: #642 Uninformed Opinion

they are really comfortable! people look at you really funny though.

I guarantee I look at daughter's boyfriend funny when he wears his.

Now, I want something on the bottom of my feet, but I much prefer sandals or something like those ugly UGGS than regular shoes.

653 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 6:49:35pm

Here come the talking point bots.

654 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 7:38:18pm

re: #644 Ebetty

However, to say no prominent Republicans or conservatives spoke out against CPAC including the John Birch Society is an absolute lie. Mark Levin, Rich Lowry and others spoke out. A collection of their quotes can be found HERE.

Wow, four whole conservatives willing to go on the record denouncing the John Birch Society. Pretty soon we'll have a tidal wave.

/dripping

655 Pythagoras  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 8:41:02pm

I agree that real mental illness makes everything else irrelevant. Once you've lost touch with reality, who cares what reality you lost touch with?

Dealing with mental illness is incredibly sad. Many of us here know what it feels like to love someone with Alzheimers. The relentless creativity with which it sucks is totally draining.

I do not know what it's like to love a young person who goes around the bend like this but it has to be even worse. My heart screams for his parents.

656 Charles Johnson  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 9:38:03pm

re: #655 Pythagoras

I agree that real mental illness makes everything else irrelevant.

Absolutely not. The fact that Bedell was mentally ill makes his crime even more relevant to this discussion. His insane fantasies were fed and stoked by the constant stream of extremism pouring out of the right wing these days, and his own statements show this to be true.

This is exactly the kind of consequence I've been predicting for the past year. The hatred and conspiracy theories that have become common fare on the right are inspiring violence in mentally unstable people. And it's going to get worse.

657 Tigger2005  Fri, Mar 5, 2010 10:26:24pm

I don't think this a very good analogy, Silvergirl.

The Jewish guy in Paris responded emotionally to a genuine criminal act of repression against the Jewish people by the German government.

The guy at the Pentagon was not "responding" to any event even remotely similar. He was acting out of his political beliefs and passions, which had likely been fueled and inflamed by the rage and paranoia currently emanating from the right wing.

Please keep in mind, calls for armed revolution get standing ovations at Tea Party rallies. "Jokes" about lynching elected officials get belly laughs. The irresponsible, angry, paranoid rhetoric of this "movement" and its "leaders" such as they are, makes it quite reasonable to lay some of the blame at their feet when disturbed people who share their ideology decide to take things to the next level.

People should listen to Ronald Reagan's 1964 speech in support of Barry Goldwater, or his 1975 CPAC speech, and see how different it is from the right-wing rhetoric of today. Reagan, too, believed in smaller government, less taxation, private property, free enterprise, and so on, but he could expound on these ideals in a passionate yet calm and rational manner. He let good ideas speak for themselves. A raving freakazoid nut sandwich he was not.


re: #80 Silvergirl

My feeling on this, and I don't want to be repetitive (I posted some thoughts this morning in another thread), is that when we do too much finger pointing at any group of people to say "This nut belongs to you." we are in some iffy territory. I have read enough rants from righties between last night and today to know they want no part of the Pentagon shooter, and give all their evidence that he's a leftist dopehead radical. I disagree. I see lots of comments here and elsewhere showing why he is firmly on the right, and why he belongs in the Paulian camp. I recognize my own prejudice against Ron Paul and his followers, but I won't let myself believe that in that movement there are no well intentioned folks. It's kind of hard to concede that point since they're often so outraged and outrageous, but I will still keep quiet about stamping the shooter's forehead "Paulian" and shoving his dead carcass over the line into their territory.

Last month was Black History month and I spread the word among my students about the pride we can feel about the accomplishments of African-Americans. Because we also teach Anne Frank, I choose to do it in March because we have just finished up with the theme of prejudice in February and it's fresh in their minds. Today as I was presenting something out of one of our texts on the subject of pogroms, it came to my mind how fast we want to brand a group of people because of the actions of one.

It was this:

The point here is not to make a comparison of how right or wrong it was to do violence at the embassy on Paris to how right or wrong it is to do violence at the Pentagon. The motivation and the acts may be miles apart, but the point is our response. By laying the blame on an entire group for the act of one individual, we stray into unhealthy territory.

658 Gizmo  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 4:05:37am
It doesn't excuse the right wing to say the guy was crazy. Sure, he was crazy. But the craziness was fed by the extremism that is everywhere in the modern right wing.


Interesting... so per your logic since parts of the raving manifesto of Theodore Kaczynski would have also gotten a standing-O at your average Earth Day rally, we should use that to pillory the environmental movement and/or Al Gore for preaching his environmental doom and gloom due to the hand of mankind? I'm not part of the tea party crowd, and I think that Ron Paul is off his rocker politically, but the bottom line is that crazy people do crazy things for crazy reasons... and to go beyond that is grasping. John Bedell just as easily could have decided to go after the FBI for not doing anything about those aliens that he probably also thought are giving him migraines with their ray guns.

659 Randall Gross  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 4:43:34am

re: #658 Gizmo

No but it does serve us well to castigate those who feed the crazy. The "average environmentalist" philosopher didn't feed Ted, just as the average Democrat did not feed Ayers. The fact is that Bedell might appear solo, but he's not really.

There's been a whole crop of crazies since the election, and this time it's not the left stoking them up, anymore than it was the left who stoked the Abortion clinic bombers and T. McVeigh in the 90's.

I get the feeling that you think G. Beck and company are cool, do you listen to Alex as well?

660 SixDegrees  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 4:54:07am

re: #644 Ebetty

I've been reading through this thread and while I rarely comment, I can't help but be vocal on this topic. As to John Bedell's sanity, who here has psychiatric degrees or psychology degrees? Who here has peer reviewed research, that we readers and commenters can see as proof of their expertise with regard to mental disorders? The man was severely mentally ill per many news reports. His politics are not germane. He may sound like a Ron Paul follower, he may be a 9/11 Truther too. Neither matter. He is now deceased, another tragic suicide by cop. All this discussion of the right inspiring his craziness is absurd, unless of course someone here has specific psychiatric/psychology experience with peer reviewed research that backs it up. Furthermore, if you are a psychologist or psychiatrist, you would ethically not opine about the specific mental state of someone you have not personally diagnosed.

That said, the "movement-conservatives" are a group of folks I would not want to associate with. They spend a great deal of time on non-productive power plays. They are prone to hateful speech, nasty exclusionary behavior and bouts with hypocrisy. Let us call them out for policy differences, with facts, with truth rather than responding in kind.

Republican leadership has their hands full, and I remain skeptical about them getting tough on the fringe.

However, to say no prominent Republicans or conservatives spoke out against CPAC including the John Birch Society is an absolute lie. Mark Levin, Rich Lowry and others spoke out. A collection of their quotes can be found HERE.

As I said, if we want the conservative fringe to end - we can only fight them with truth, facts and policy. Not with uninformed namecalling.

Well said. I agree with all your points here.

661 Randall Gross  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 8:20:17am

re: #660 SixDegrees

Yes, but it's not a question of whether he was sane or not. It's a question of how many of these incidents we are beginning to see, and how they are being encouraged. Most suicide bombers cannot be characterized as "sane" and if you read up on cointel you will discover that extreme actors usually seek external justification, and have large bodies of sympathizers. That the right is supporting the crackpot groups like Oathkeepers, 4409, John Birch Society is the problem and issue here.

662 SixDegrees  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 8:34:54am

re: #661 Thanos

Yes, but it's not a question of whether he was sane or not. It's a question of how many of these incidents we are beginning to see, and how they are being encouraged. Most suicide bombers cannot be characterized as "sane" and if you read up on cointel you will discover that extreme actors usually seek external justification, and have large bodies of sympathizers. That the right is supporting the crackpot groups like Oathkeepers, 4409, John Birch Society is the problem and issue here.

Disagree; see several of my earlier posts. Yes, the insane often have elaborate justifications for the actions. But they'll find them no matter what, if not on the right, then on the left, or in even more bizarre places. It's a symptom of their illness, not a cause.

663 gizmo  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 8:44:52am

re: #659 Thanos

Sorry, but Beck's not my cup of tea and I have no idea who is "Alex". Sorry if I don't fit your preconceived notions. But Charles and this site didn't disappoint when I decided to pop in and see how this was playing here. I knew there'd be lots of political hay-making. It's a shame really, that people think that the tea party are of utmost concern about our country when I find things like the CBO's just released assessment of out federal finances are a whole lot bigger threat to our future.

664 Charles Johnson  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 9:10:23am

re: #663 gizmo

Sorry, but Beck's not my cup of tea and I have no idea who is "Alex". Sorry if I don't fit your preconceived notions. But Charles and this site didn't disappoint when I decided to pop in and see how this was playing here. I knew there'd be lots of political hay-making. It's a shame really, that people think that the tea party are of utmost concern about our country when I find things like the CBO's just released assessment of out federal finances are a whole lot bigger threat to our future.

What bullshit. The political haymaking is ALL on the other side here. The instantaneous reaction from the right wing blogosphere was to deny deny deny that Bedell had anything to do with the extremism they advocate. This post is a needed counter-balance to the ridiculous lies and distortions they're pumping out.

Bedell was a classic right wing nutjob. He fit every part of that term, and the right doesn't get to just say, "Hey, he was a Democrat, so he's a left winger!"

Are you also going to the dozens of websites that promoted this FALSE view and telling them how disappointed you are that they're making hay of this crime?

665 celticdragon  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 9:20:54am

re: #664 Charles

What bullshit. The political haymaking is ALL on the other side here. The instantaneous reaction from the right wing blogosphere was to deny deny deny that Bedell had anything to do with the extremism they advocate. This post is a needed counter-balance to the ridiculous lies and distortions they're pumping out.

Bedell was a classic right wing nutjob. He fit every part of that term, and the right doesn't get to just say, "Hey, he was a Democrat, so he's a left winger!"

Are you also going to the dozens of websites that promoted this FALSE view and telling them how disappointed you are that they're making hay of this crime?

Please keep doing what you are doing.

666 jimmy01  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 11:00:21am

I find this strange:
For the record, 35% of democrats believed Bush knew about the 9-11 attacks in advance. 99.9% of the left were Bush-haters.

UPDATE: So… Will the state-run media report this?
The Pentagon shooter is linked to several gay rights groups along with PETA, NPR, various drug legalization orgs, Greenpeace and Al Franken.

Hmm. So when was the last time you ran into a “right wing extremist” who was a big fan of Al Franken?

UPDATE: The media’s “right wing extremist” is a registered democrat.

667 Charles Johnson  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 11:04:00am

And another sleeper awakes, to parrot the same talking points that have already been debunked.

668 Charles Johnson  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 11:12:09am

re: #666 jimmy01

The Pentagon shooter is linked to several gay rights groups along with PETA, NPR, various drug legalization orgs, Greenpeace and Al Franken.

Hmm. So when was the last time you ran into a “right wing extremist” who was a big fan of Al Franken?

This, by the way, is nothing but a flat out lie.

A wingnut blogger went through Bedell's friend list on Facebook and found that some of his friends had also befriended those groups. In other words, Bedell was not "linked" to any of those groups or people.

It's another pathetic, transparently fraudulent attempt to spin him as a left winger, despite his own statements.

669 Gizmo  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 12:40:11pm
Are you also going to the dozens of websites that promoted this FALSE view and telling them how disappointed you are that they're making hay of this crime?


I realized that its nuanced, but there's a difference between going on the offensive to label the nut as a "leftist" and trying to refute the rush to label him a "right-winger". Even though it appears from this voter registration dump he was last registered as a "D" (unless it was stupidly doctored), I'm not going to label him "left" or "right"... It begins and ends with "mentally ill".

Oh, and I guess it was my bad to "awaken" and give you some traffic for my amusement.

670 RazorMan1988  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 2:16:47pm

I'm still reading this blog but I'm confused. So we're supposed to be in favor of the government taking over the economy? Capitalism and liberty are bad? Just curious what I'm supposed to believe in now that the right is full of crazies. Can you enlighten me.

671 Randall Gross  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 2:40:12pm

re: #670 RazorMan1988

Well since we try to keep things honest here perhaps you'd be more comfortable at a place where they warp reality to fit your worldview.

672 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 2:48:45pm

re: #670 RazorMan1988

You've done nothing but bitch since you got here.

673 Lidane  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 2:56:08pm

re: #670 RazorMan1988

Weak flamebait at best. Not impressed.

674 Charles Johnson  Sat, Mar 6, 2010 3:52:30pm

re: #670 RazorMan1988

Can you enlighten me.

I doubt it.


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